January 20, 2025 • 37 mins
In this episode of the Practical Spirituality, Gareth and Kim explore how developing self-trust can unlock hidden potential. They discuss how early conditioning often teaches people to doubt their instincts and rely on external validation. Through personal anecdotes, they challenge the idea of a “normal” path, and emphasize that each person’s journey toward self-trust is unique.
The hosts assess the shift from seeking external approval to building an inner compass that is guided by intuition. They introduce the concept of “dating oneself,” suggesting simple steps like journaling to deepen self-awareness and increase focus on self. They emphasize how supportive environments and introspection can help individuals overcome self-criticism and judgment, ultimately leading to a stronger sense of self.
They break down the journey to self-trust into manageable steps, paving the way for significant, lasting change and a more empowered, fulfilling life.
Become a Community Member at https://community.garethmichael.com/ to join our community and get early access to new episodes, answers to your personal questions and so much more.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Welcome back to the Practical Spirituality Podcast.
We are so excited to have youon this journey with us, where
we explore all elements of mind,body, emotions and soul through
the lens of everyday life.
Hello, gareth.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
How are you doing this morning?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I am well this morning.
How are you?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Good, I'm doing good.
I'm looking forward to thisconversation Great.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
I wonder where you're going to take us.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Well, for this week's episode, I want to talk about
the journey of learning to trustself.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Okay, Any experience with that?
Speaker 2 (00:49):
No, completely out of my ballpark but I will give it
my go.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Yes, I've had quite a few years experience learning.
I don't know if I've gotten tothe trust myself part, but I
definitely have done thelearning part I think it's an
interesting topic to dive into,or at least from this angle.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
If you look at anyone's life, you could argue
that from the moment someone'sborn right into adulthood,
they've never really been giventhe opportunity to trust
themselves.
And the spiritual angle thatyou could take for the reason
behind that is because whenyou're not able to trust
yourself in mind, body, emotionsor soul, it then exposes you to
(01:36):
a lot of experiences that endup sculpting you into the person
you're meant to be and leadsyou into the whole life journey
of uncovering what those lessonsare.
That's the spiritual journeywithin itself.
So obviously, that's a veryquick synopsis, right overly
simplifying it here.
I think this is why we all gothrough periods in our lives
(01:56):
doubting ourselves, questioningourselves.
Is that the right thing to do?
Burying our emotions, buryingour mind, you know, hiding under
the covers?
I just think that's somethingthat's so universal for majority
of the 8 billion people on theplanet, and it's interesting for
any of us to look at ourindividual journeys on how we
(02:17):
begin to learn to trustourselves in mind, body,
emotions, as we grow on thispath.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Well, I agree wholeheartedly.
You know like, for most peoplewho listen to us, you know if
they haven't already been wokenup to the fact that we're here
to tell you yep, this is thewhole part of the game.
We get messed up so that youcan un-mess yourself up.
Or try to At least give it a goso you can find out who you're
meant to be.
I do think it's trust.
(02:46):
This is especially that intrust, yeah, I mean, I think by
the time a child is 12 monthsold, how many times have they
already heard no, don't do that.
And been taken away fromcertain things?
You know, because kids justwant to learn and they're just
present and they have no fearand yeah.
So they're told so many timesby the time they're a year old
(03:10):
not to trust themselves.
Just that alone would be enoughfor the rest of your life.
I mean, but oh yeah, we haveschool too, then we have church,
and then we have family andthen we have all that fun stuff.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
It's just loaded on of all the reasons of why we
can't trust ourselves.
But I think that's why when youlay it out like that, in its
simplest form, then it's not amistake.
Right for all of us is thatwe've been exposed to so many
different experiences, yet weall have access to our mind,
body, emotions, so we have a lotof things that are overlapping.
(03:43):
Yet each of us have suchindividual, unique perspectives
and unique journeys along theway that shape us and who we are
.
And yes, when we talk aboutthese kind of topics, there is
overlap in certain humanexperiences, but at the end of
the day, only each individualcan really untangle the
reasoning behind why they're onthe journey that they're on.
(04:04):
And that's what I personallylove about when we do talk about
spirituality is just really howunique it is and how it's not a
cookie cutter approach, it'sjust impossible.
So, therefore, when you begin toexplore what does actually
trust mean for any of us, or howwe distrust ourselves, the
people around us, religion,spirituality, schooling, like
(04:27):
where do you stop in naming?
all the things in this worldthat you can distrust.
I think, when we dive into it,of understanding why it matters,
what are the barriers towardseven trusting ourselves, and
maybe some of the things inwhich how we can start building
a better relationship in thosedifferent areas that you could
argue, as I said earlier, thatwe were shown and taught not to
(04:50):
be able to do or have from avery young age for sometimes the
right reasons, but it takes along time to go to do the full
circle of being able to see thatas an adult exactly, and you
know, I think anybody thatreally is on a spiritual journey
and has at least startedlistening to us, I think, has
already started questioning someof the things that we've
(05:13):
proposed in the past.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Wonder that so many people get lost when they're
doing the mainstream or they'relooking at all the different
spiritual books that are outthere.
Because I know my own personalexperience is oh, this is very
cut and dry.
You just do this, and I waslike, well, if you've been told
(05:40):
for your entire life that theway that you think or the way
that you make decisions, or theway that you react or the way
that you are moving through thejourney of life is wrong, it's
not so simple to go, just dothat, as we've talked about many
times in the past.
And so it is no wonder thatpeople don't necessarily know
(06:02):
how.
Sometimes, what fascinates meare the ones that do trust
themselves completely and I justgo you're like a Martian from
Mars for me, like how does thathappen?
And I'm bringing that point upon purpose, because there are
those out there that, forwhatever reason, have reached
(06:23):
that pinnacle within themselvesat a certain point and they just
keep going forward.
I just didn't happen to be oneof them.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 2 (06:32):
No, it does make sense and I think it's even kind
of continuing from the previousepisode in some ways, when we
did dive in deeply into theconversation of being in the
present moment or living fromthe present moment and even how
both of our experiences evolvedand changed over the years.
When it comes to even justtalking about that topic alone
and I think if you, if you and I, were to talk about learning to
(06:55):
trust self, you woulddefinitely paint interesting
pictures of how that hascontinued to evolve and change
as the years have went by.
So even when we talk about, say,spirituality, all the different
books out there, all thedifferent religions, all the
different approaches as we oftentalk about, it's very hard to
say that any of them are rightor wrong, because it's never
that clean cut.
So when you and I talk aboutour spiritual understandings,
(07:18):
our experiences present day,that's because of our experience
and exposure that has been trueto us, that we have literally
gone through.
So sometimes if you can'trelate to the experiences as far
as experiences that you and Ihave gone through and it's a
theory, then it's much easier toargue with the theory because
you haven't had the overallexperience of how it has
(07:39):
impacted us in mind, body,emotion, soul, exactly so.
That's why I'm never trying toignore you, trying to convince
anyone or try to convert anyoneinto the things that we talk
about, but it's just being openenough to have the conversation
of the evolution, of how all ofthese definitions and
understandings continue toevolve and change, thus through
(08:00):
exploration and exposure andexperience.
That has a huge impact on thisspiritual journey.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
So, having said that, what definition are we basing
trust on today, like what is ourgeneral definition, that we're
saying learning to trust ourself.
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Looking at trust with myself and my journey with it
is that I think from a yearlyage, as we were talking about,
you're taught to trust a lot ofdifferent things externally in
order to understand how tosurvive and how to grow in this
world and how to adapt toexternal events and scenarios.
Whereas, especially when Istarted questioning was on the
(08:43):
spiritual journey and metMichael, it became more of an
inward and internal journey ofbeing able to trust myself that,
no matter what life presentedin front of me, I will always
have the.
It also goes back to thatspiritual understanding that my
(09:06):
energy brought this in front ofme or as a part of my path in
order to grow from it.
So if it was designed by me andfor me, therefore I will have
that strength within to be ableto get through it, because it's
for me, by me, versus whenbeforehand, if it was always
having to trust other people toget through it, and people are
(09:26):
constantly letting you down.
When you're relying on them,that was always a much harder
thing to be able to grasp or forit not to get heavy in mind
body emotions.
So it was the evolution ofyou're still engaging with the
world, but you're actuallyinvesting in yourself and
trusting that there is a reasonbehind it, and the journey is to
(09:46):
explore that present day.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
For me.
I was taught that I'm meant totrust the outside world because
they know better than me, and soin the beginning, all my trust
was put on external experiences,just like you said, an external
input from other people.
And what I understand thisjourney of learning to trust
self means is turning thataround and finding my own inner
(10:11):
compass.
And so, even though we knowthat we have spiritual contracts
and even though we know thatthese things that are coming at
us, if we learn to really relyon the inner compass, then, as
we're navigating whatever isshowing up in our life, then
we're going to have a completelydifferent result than if we're
(10:34):
still externalizing and stilllooking for it in somebody else,
or feedback from somebody elseor something else, or whatever
that might be.
That's what I'm saying Agree100% with what your definition
of trust is.
For me, it's like that innercompass.
100% with what your definitionof trust is For me.
(10:54):
It's like that inner compass.
And then it's having theability to rely on my own inner
compass instead of looking forit externally.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
And I think that is maturing and growing on this
journey, and we still have to,of course, no matter who we are,
engage with the world andengage with people, and there's
always going to be differentsystems and different things out
there.
But I think the difference isbeing able to question it, now
more than ever, and continue toeducate ourselves in the
different ways and using our ownexperience, instead of
(11:22):
constantly doubting ourselves,pushing away our emotions,
pushing away the mind andimmediately saying nope.
As you said, everyone else hasit and I must have it wrong,
especially when the numbers arepiled against us in certain
scenarios.
So I think that's where itbecomes interesting of how do we
continue to trust in ourinstincts, more trust in our
mind, trust in our emotions,trust in our experience as we
(11:45):
continue to grow in this world,because that does have a
positive impact in our abilityto live day to day.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
And I also think it comes down to intuition.
It's intuitively trusting theguidance that we get from
ourselves, even though our mindis screaming and yelling
something different.
It's about knowing.
Oh.
So a little story I'll tellabout.
That is when I first starteddoing some of this work and I
was going to the long-termsubstance abuse center and I
(12:13):
would be working with clientsthat suffered from addiction
there and we would sit down.
There would be twopractitioners together to work
with this particular person andwe'd both be asking questions of
the person so that we could,you know, help them move through
something.
And inevitably, the otherpractitioner would always say
(12:37):
okay, ready to go, I'm ready togo.
What's wrong with you?
Why haven't you got enoughinformation?
And that was one of the firstplaces that I started to realize
oh no, I know I don't have theright information.
I can feel that in my body Ihave to keep asking questions.
And when I get to the rightquestion, there is a definite
(12:57):
change internally for me I don'twant to say it's just
physically, because I think itis mind, body and emotion and
then I go oh, this is where Ineed to go.
I have my direction.
Now I'm ready to move forward.
So that's what I meant when Iwas saying that, which is
exactly what you you're sayingas well, and we've spoken about
when we've talked aboutintuition.
(13:18):
That is our own inner guidepoint, wouldn't you agree?
Speaker 2 (13:23):
it's also there's reasons behind of why at times
we're able to follow ourintuition, why other times we
weren't able to or not allowedto, and that is all part of our
energy guiding us, depending onthe experiences that we were
meant to have or going to have,but that goes back to even the
spiritual contracts, or whycertain events do fold, in which
(13:44):
the way they do, and becausesometimes it isn't a clear cut
formula, I think is why there isdistrust in our intuition at
times, or in within our emotionsor mind, because it's never
just a clean-cut formula.
So therefore, that's why it doesget very confusing of how can I
trust myself if every time I goback to trying to, it changes,
(14:06):
the goalposts move, which I dothink is most people's
experience, because we're usedto everything being very logical
when it's come from otherpeople and that's why it makes
it trustworthy, because it isjust some level of consistency
there.
But when it comes to ourselves,it always just feels a little
bit noisy internally or loud,and often it's hard to place
(14:29):
trust into that to make big orsmall life decisions.
So it makes sense to whylearning to trust self can be a
complicated journey, but yet thejourney keeps pointing us back
to learning how to yes it does,and I find, personally, for many
, many years it was a veryconfusing journey for me.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
You know I have a lot of different things that have
happened in my past and I cantell you from a very, very young
age I was being told that I hadno emotional resilience or that
I had no capacity to deal withmy emotions and so, therefore, I
couldn't trust myself.
Now, sitting here in hindsight,I can see that that was part of
(15:11):
growing and becoming who I amand what I would have considered
in the past as the biggestobstacle for me.
That emotional resilience hasbecome one of my greatest inner
powers, because I know about theemotion inside and out where,
(15:33):
if I hadn't gone through thoseexperiences, I wouldn't.
But having said that, a lot ofpeople think when you have the
emotional resilience, that'swhen you are going to be able to
trust yourself more, when youeither control your emotions or
understand your emotions.
And, like we've said many times, it's not even really that
because they're going to show upand throw us for a loop every
(15:55):
single time.
I can guarantee you, every timeI think, oh, I got a handle on
this.
Smack right back in my face.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Right on cue.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
Thought I had a handle on it right.
Yeah, one of the things thatgets so confusing about this
journey, because when you areout there looking at different
things it sounds so clear cut.
I don't know about you.
That has not been my journey.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
If we are talking about the common barriers a lot
of us face when it comes to selftrust, it is number one.
The voice in our head, like thenegative talk that we often
experience, that when it comesto making a decision it gets
louder.
We feel paralyzed by what thisinner critic is saying to us in
that circumstance and, of course, when that starts, then the
(16:42):
emotions get heavy and we reallydoubt our capabilities to be
able to make a decision.
And that is easier to hand overresponsibility to someone else.
That is what often starts first, but then you have to look at
that's linked back to pastquote-unquote failures or
traumas that we've been throughfrom a very young age right up
until adulthood.
(17:02):
That is all deemed asexperience that is guiding our
ability or inability to make adecision in that moment.
So when you start layering allof these different reasons to
why it's so hard to be able totrust ourselves in those moments
to make a decision, you canunderstand how it's not
clear-cut and why it is a rarity, as you're saying earlier, for
(17:26):
people just to completely trustin themselves and have that
confidence to run with it nomatter what, because more often
than not people don't have areason to trust with it, no
matter what, because more oftenthan not, people don't have a
reason to trust their lives todate Because, as we were talking
about.
It's been too unpredictable andthe formula has not been set to
be that clean cut.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And then we haven't even really talked about, which
we both know is part of theexperiences that we have to have
.
But all the various differentrelationships that we go through
at the early stages of our lifeand how we interact with others
whether that be family members,whether that be our early first
stepping into school, andteachers and friends and
everything our socialinteractions and everything that
comes with that in those veryfirst formula of years, social
(18:12):
interactions and everything thatcomes with that in those very
first formula of years, you knowthose relationships also pay a
very big impact.
You know I will share this withyou that I have found
fascinating on my journey.
So, as per most people, Ithought it was me that was the
problem for many, many, manyyears and I know the experiences
that I had going through schooland the different points that
(18:34):
were the most challenging pointsfor me.
Then I became a parent.
I've moved halfway across theworld, I'm raising kids and I
watch my kids get to thesedifferent stages in their social
interactions and seeing theexact same thing happening and
I'm thinking to myself how canthis be?
We're two generations beyond,we have so much more knowledge,
(18:57):
we have all of these things andwe live in a completely
different culture, country sideof the world, yet these kids are
going through some of the samesocial experiences that I went
through, and that was one of thefirst times I woke up to.
Oh, maybe we all have to gothrough these experiences, but
(19:17):
how much they impact us atdifferent ages of our life and
what it causes us to feel duringthose stages, and even when I'm
working with clients today,it's like clockwork.
I can tell you the years wherekids are going to run into the
issue and I'm not mentioningthem right now because's like
clockwork.
I can tell you the years wherekids are going to run into the
issue and I'm not mentioningthem right now because so many
people don't want to go out andprevent that from happening when
(19:39):
we can't, as you and I bothknow.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
So I just find it interesting that you know people
think that there is a normalout there and that people do
have these.
They don't have to go throughall the experiences, but I think
almost all of us go through itat some level.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Yep, in our own ways and but, as you were saying
there, there is no stopping it,and I think it's that when you
try to, it's that life just getscreative and bringing it up in
new, different ways that youcan't see it.
And then it's kind of like whenour parents say I'm going to
raise my kids completelydifferent to how my parents
raised me, or I'm never going tobecome like my parents, uh-oh,
(20:23):
okay.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
You know that one right I do.
Uh, no, I'm not familiar withthat at all.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Let's take a step back from this week's episode
and share with everyone whatwe've been up to behind the
scenes we're really excited tobe able to finally offer the
gareth michael community to eachof you.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
The community offers a range of benefits, including
access to our live events,weekly podcast episodes,
articles, self-checkingquestions, as well as a
community of individuals you canconnect with and interact with
along the way.
It's designed to offer yousupport, guidance and a safe
space on a day-to-day basis.
(21:12):
We'd love to have you join ourglobal community of like-minded
individuals.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
That website address again is wwwgarethmichaelcom Now
let's get back to that episode,shall we?
So I just think it'sinteresting that when it comes
to these kind of human behaviorsand patterns that you see
basically in everyone, it makesyou question okay, if this is as
(21:41):
common as we say it is, then ithas a reason for its existence.
There's a reason to how we areall exposed to that and there's
a bigger picture or meaninggoing on.
So I think at times it's thatif we're able to explore that
and understand why it is thisway, it's much easier and it
helps a lot with our level ofacceptance towards some of these
(22:02):
events or how these things areunfolding.
Now it doesn't relieve us fromthese experiences, but that's
where the individual journey isof being curious and wanting to
question is a huge part of it.
And exploring that mind, body,emotions, as it appears present
day and it's only when you'reactually willing and able to do
that, depending on where you areon your journey if that's on
(22:23):
your journey at all, everyone'sdifferent then that is the
starting foundations of trustingyourself and building a trust
with yourself, because that'svery hard to do unless you're
willing to educate your mindwith the reasons behind why we
distrust ourselves and where dothose come from.
So I know I'm starting at thevery start, but I'm saying that
is a huge part of it, becauseyou have to do the ground work
(22:47):
in order for it to be able toevolve or change.
A lot of the patterns orbehaviors that we're all running
that continuously impact ourdecision making day in, day out,
on our ability to regulateemotions or not.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
So I agree wholeheartedly, and one of the
things that I would say is a lotof people would ask well, how
do I shortcut this?
And I think, as you've justsaid, said, there is no shortcut
cutting it, and so then my nextstatement would be how do we
know we're ready to startexploring that and and go in
(23:19):
there and I'm saying this for areason, because I go for me.
It was when I started to becomeaware that I was continually
looking for the trust externally, or that external validation,
and how it would rip me apart onthe inside, because I was like,
(23:40):
well, every part of me saying Ineed to do this, but all of
these voices out here are sayingI need to do something
completely different and I don'tknow how to make that judgment,
that internal judgment, andit's not like there was a light
switch that went on to do that.
It's just like you said, I hadto go back to the beginning and
(24:02):
start to understand some of theexperiences that happened to me,
to understand some of theemotional.
You know, it's like there's asaying out there that I keep
thinking about while we'retalking right now, and that is
it's not what happened to us,it's what we do with what
happened to us, and I thinkthat's a very valid point,
because that's that uniqueness,because it's unique to each one
(24:24):
of us, whatever we do internallywith that self-talk, the critic
, the judgments we've made outof ourself, the level of shame
we might've felt, even though wecan't turn around and start to
trust ourself, until we start toexplore some of that, to
understand and my favoriteverbiage for this is you know
(24:49):
what?
These were coping skills thatwe picked up along the way and
while they might have helped usget through it in that moment,
they might not be valid today,and exploring them is what
allows us to start to start thisjourney of trusting ourself.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
So I think that brings us on to the different
ways in which we can startrebuilding and strengthening our
trust with ourselves.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
It's often about taking the very small steps,
like you and I've talked aboutso many times.
You've talked about thejournaling and how you love
journaling and how that openedyour eyes to understanding your
past experiences in a differentway.
Correct, and that is always oneof the key things that I have
heard many people say.
(25:35):
For me, the journaling wasdifficult because all my focus
was always on was the negativeand how I'd failed, and hearing
that voice in my head of all thepeople telling me I couldn't
succeed, until someone asked meto do an exercise of something
completely opposite, and whatthat was was to sit down and
(25:56):
write out a list of all the waysthat I had succeeded in
trusting myself, or I had evensucceeded at anything, starting
from the fact that I learned tocrawl, I learned to walk, I
learned to tie my shoes, Ilearned to read all of the
things that I did or that I wasable to do.
(26:17):
Now, that isn't necessarilyabout trusting yourself, but
because my focus had been sonarrowed in on the failure and
the self-criticism I couldn'tsee anything good.
So I had to start with thistiny little stepstone, and what
that exercise kicked off was thecuriosity that you're often
(26:40):
talking about.
Let me get curious why Ibelieved all these other people.
What were those experiencesthat I experienced and what did
I learn from feeling like thatfailure for so long?
Speaker 2 (26:53):
And I think that's why there's so many interesting
approaches to this, because, asyou mentioned, I do love
journaling and seeing what thesubconscious and conscious mind
likes to bring up, especiallywhen we give it the opportunity
to target a specific area of ourlives.
So, say, if in this instance,we're talking about our, our
ability or inability to trustourselves, I think it's
(27:16):
interesting to see what memoriesof the pros and cons of the
experiences that it wants tobring up and when it does that,
that is our system guiding us toexplore those different
experiences with someone who isqualified and understands, and
how to navigate that withsomeone on their specific needs.
It becomes a very interestingthing to explore and a guide
within itself.
(27:37):
So, but I think, in even how westarted this episode, it's
really important for people tounderstand that we've all never
been given the opportunity totrust ourselves from the start,
and I think that's where theelement of having
self-compassion and, in someways, forgiveness towards
ourselves, that it didn't startwith us before.
(28:02):
We were actually, by design, notallowed to trust ourselves,
because there was a number ofexperiences with other people
and in this life that wererequired in order for us to
become the person we are today,but it is our responsibility to
understand that person.
That is through questioning andthe willingness to explore in a
way that suits you and yourneeds today, because, as we
often talk about, those needschange as we go through life.
How Kim approached herself 20years ago versus 10 years ago,
(28:26):
versus today and even 10 yearsfrom now, it is a forever
changing and evolving journeyand that's where that
self-compassion and having thosesmall steps become very
important when it comes to thisexploration very important when
it comes to this exploration andabsolutely and one of the terms
(28:49):
that comes to mind for me whenit comes to self-compassion and
forgiveness that I use a lot isthis happened to me, not because
of me.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
And again, that was because I was stuck in so much
of the shame and the blame andwhat had happened to me, I
thought, was because of me, not,that these were experiences
that I actually went through.
And I think the other littlenugget is when you can have that
self-compassion and thatforgiveness and start to be
kinder to yourself when you'reexploring these things.
(29:15):
It's easier then to identifysome of the wisdom that you
picked up along the way as youwent through these experiences
and that perhaps that would beone of the things if you could
gather the wisdom from some ofthe experiences and start to
write that down, that alsostarts to give you a whole new
perspective on who you are as aperson and your ability to trust
(29:39):
yourself.
And you know you're not goingto just write it down willy
nilly and say, boom, that's whatyou were talking about.
We have somebody, aprofessional or someone who's
completely objective, that hasthe ability to help us navigate
that particular part of thejourney and then, after a while,
it starts to become natural,and that's when we start to talk
(29:59):
about really then becomenatural, and that's when we
start to talk about really then.
Then, when we understand someof that past stuff, beginning to
listen to our intuition becomesa little bit easier at that
stage.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
There is no silver bullet when it comes to our
ability to trust ourselves,especially if there has been so
many years of distrust.
So it is like dating ourselvesover a period of time where you
don't date someone once and thensuddenly get married the
following date.
It takes time to believe andtrust with another person.
So if we haven't had theability to have that trust with
ourselves, we have to putourselves through the same
(30:31):
pieces of the same process, butwith the curiosity of wanting to
go inwards and to ask thosequestions of why the distrust is
there to start with.
And over a period of time itdoes begin to balance out little
by little, but it does take acommitment to self to want to do
that exploration.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
And I love that you said the dating self, because so
many of us only look at thecritical side, the judgmental
side, the shaming side.
We only look at what we havedone wrong, so how?
Of course we're not building aresilience or a bank of things
that we can trust and very fewpeople actually begin to get to
(31:12):
know themselves.
We're not encouraged in so manydifferent ways to actually get
to know ourselves.
And especially in today'ssociety, there's that new
buzzword that's out thereeverywhere, which is the
narcissistic word.
You know.
And so if we want to get to knowourselves, isn't that being
selfish or narcissistic?
But we're not talking aboutlike that.
(31:33):
We're talking about reallyhaving a much deeper
understanding of what is goingon inside of us and how we're
responding to life, each andevery moment that life is
happening and I love the factthat you said that, because I
did.
It was like I had to first findout who I was, then I had to
(31:54):
become my own friend because,trust me, I wasn't a very good
friend to myself, and then I hadto start courting myself and
nurturing myself in order to getto that place where I could
trust myself.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
And I think that's what's kind of really and as you
do that journey, what you endup discovering can be quite
astounding as time goes on.
Because, especially how a lotof us take ourselves completely
for granted without meaning toor understanding, that's exactly
what we do.
So it's like we might complainthat our partners, our
relationships, our families takeus for granted at times, but
(32:30):
then when you actually look atthe relationship with yourself,
in what ways are you takingyourself for granted?
And mind, body, emotions, andnot even seeing the value or the
reasoning of why you shouldexplore yourself.
So it's often not a veryhealthy relationship or
foundation to start with, andit's often not a very healthy
relationship or foundation tostart with.
And it's only when we begin tounderstand that it's that way
can we begin to create thosechanges that are necessary to
(32:50):
take enough of an interest andbelief in ourselves to want to
invest into ourselves.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Which is a very important word investing into
ourselves, and we're so quick towant to invest in everyone else
.
If we make that commitment, asyou were saying because it is a
commitment to really want toexplore ourself, our journey,
our mind, body and emotions Thenwhen we turn that inward and
(33:16):
start to have compassion withthat, we don't give up on dating
after the second or third round.
If we're really interested insomebody, if we have that
interest, we're going to pursueit, no matter what, even if the
alarm bells are going off.
So why are we not able to turnthat around and pursue that
within ourselves?
(33:36):
And it does take that level ofcommitment, I think, and then it
also takes.
It does take that level ofcommitment.
I think so, and then it alsotakes.
I think the other importantpart about this journey is, if
we have had a past where we havebeen hypercritical or blaming
of ourselves, that we putourselves in a very supportive
environment and surroundourselves with people who are
(33:59):
going to support that journey aswe go through it, because it
has a tendency to get messy fromtime to time.
I'll tell you another thing thatI found very interesting about
this, because people have oftentalked to me how have I managed
to go from where I was to whereI am, and what drove that?
And I don't know if I have theanswer to so much.
(34:20):
What drove it, other than I wasmeant to do that?
But I do know that thatcommitment that you just talked
about became very important tome, and I realized, probably
midway through the journey, thatI didn't have a clear lens that
I was looking at myself and mylife through, and so I had to
(34:43):
find a strategy to be able tounderstand it better, without
all the clouded stuff that I hadfrom the past.
So I coined this little termthat whenever anything happened
to me that I didn't understand,I would do an autopsy and so I'd
sit down and I would lay it outand I'd go step by step through
(35:04):
it and the verbiage I would useand I know this verbiage sounds
a bit outdated, but I would say, okay, what is my part in this,
what is somebody else's part init, what really upset me?
Because if there's something inthis that really upset me or
that I blame me or shame me orjudged me for, then that is
(35:25):
something I need to explore, andit started making it so much
easier because it took it awayfrom me being a failure or not
being able to get it right, orall the stuff that my head would
want to go into, to looking atit as if I was.
I'm just exploring thislogically so that I can find out
.
Okay, so let's look at that andwhat does that mean to me?
(35:48):
So that's just a little tip.
I mean I like doing it.
It's always hindsight, becausehindsight is really great, but
that is how you learn, you know.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
But I think that's why it's actually interesting to
look back and think yeah, Kim,30 years ago didn't enjoy the
idea of that process, didn'teven want to engage in that
process.
But that just goes to show thatit's the little baby steps
along the way that create thebiggest change longer term when
it comes to building thatrelationship with self that we
were designed not to have formany years of our life.
(36:20):
But little by little, little,it does come.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
It does, and it's so worth the journey.
Thanks so much for listening.
If you enjoyed this episode,then you might want to check out
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Thanks again, and I hope youguys are having a lovely week.
Welcome back to the Practical Spirituality Podcast.
We are so excited to have youon this journey with us, where
we explore all elements of mind,body, emotions and soul through
the lens of everyday life.
Hello, gareth.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
How are you doing this morning?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I am well this morning.
How are you?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Good, I'm doing good.
I'm looking forward to thisconversation Great.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
I wonder where you're going to take us.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Well, for this week's episode, I want to talk about
the journey of learning to trustself.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Okay, Any experience with that?
Speaker 2 (00:49):
No, completely out of my ballpark but I will give it
my go.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Yes, I've had quite a few years experience learning.
I don't know if I've gotten tothe trust myself part, but I
definitely have done thelearning part I think it's an
interesting topic to dive into,or at least from this angle.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
If you look at anyone's life, you could argue
that from the moment someone'sborn right into adulthood,
they've never really been giventhe opportunity to trust
themselves.
And the spiritual angle thatyou could take for the reason
behind that is because whenyou're not able to trust
yourself in mind, body, emotionsor soul, it then exposes you to
(01:36):
a lot of experiences that endup sculpting you into the person
you're meant to be and leadsyou into the whole life journey
of uncovering what those lessonsare.
That's the spiritual journeywithin itself.
So obviously, that's a veryquick synopsis, right overly
simplifying it here.
I think this is why we all gothrough periods in our lives
(01:56):
doubting ourselves, questioningourselves.
Is that the right thing to do?
Burying our emotions, buryingour mind, you know, hiding under
the covers?
I just think that's somethingthat's so universal for majority
of the 8 billion people on theplanet, and it's interesting for
any of us to look at ourindividual journeys on how we
(02:17):
begin to learn to trustourselves in mind, body,
emotions, as we grow on thispath.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Well, I agree wholeheartedly.
You know like, for most peoplewho listen to us, you know if
they haven't already been wokenup to the fact that we're here
to tell you yep, this is thewhole part of the game.
We get messed up so that youcan un-mess yourself up.
Or try to At least give it a goso you can find out who you're
meant to be.
I do think it's trust.
(02:46):
This is especially that intrust, yeah, I mean, I think by
the time a child is 12 monthsold, how many times have they
already heard no, don't do that.
And been taken away fromcertain things?
You know, because kids justwant to learn and they're just
present and they have no fearand yeah.
So they're told so many timesby the time they're a year old
(03:10):
not to trust themselves.
Just that alone would be enoughfor the rest of your life.
I mean, but oh yeah, we haveschool too, then we have church,
and then we have family andthen we have all that fun stuff.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
It's just loaded on of all the reasons of why we
can't trust ourselves.
But I think that's why when youlay it out like that, in its
simplest form, then it's not amistake.
Right for all of us is thatwe've been exposed to so many
different experiences, yet weall have access to our mind,
body, emotions, so we have a lotof things that are overlapping.
(03:43):
Yet each of us have suchindividual, unique perspectives
and unique journeys along theway that shape us and who we are
.
And yes, when we talk aboutthese kind of topics, there is
overlap in certain humanexperiences, but at the end of
the day, only each individualcan really untangle the
reasoning behind why they're onthe journey that they're on.
(04:04):
And that's what I personallylove about when we do talk about
spirituality is just really howunique it is and how it's not a
cookie cutter approach, it'sjust impossible.
So, therefore, when you begin toexplore what does actually
trust mean for any of us, or howwe distrust ourselves, the
people around us, religion,spirituality, schooling, like
(04:27):
where do you stop in naming?
all the things in this worldthat you can distrust.
I think, when we dive into it,of understanding why it matters,
what are the barriers towardseven trusting ourselves, and
maybe some of the things inwhich how we can start building
a better relationship in thosedifferent areas that you could
argue, as I said earlier, thatwe were shown and taught not to
(04:50):
be able to do or have from avery young age for sometimes the
right reasons, but it takes along time to go to do the full
circle of being able to see thatas an adult exactly, and you
know, I think anybody thatreally is on a spiritual journey
and has at least startedlistening to us, I think, has
already started questioning someof the things that we've
(05:13):
proposed in the past.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Wonder that so many people get lost when they're
doing the mainstream or they'relooking at all the different
spiritual books that are outthere.
Because I know my own personalexperience is oh, this is very
cut and dry.
You just do this, and I waslike, well, if you've been told
(05:40):
for your entire life that theway that you think or the way
that you make decisions, or theway that you react or the way
that you are moving through thejourney of life is wrong, it's
not so simple to go, just dothat, as we've talked about many
times in the past.
And so it is no wonder thatpeople don't necessarily know
(06:02):
how.
Sometimes, what fascinates meare the ones that do trust
themselves completely and I justgo you're like a Martian from
Mars for me, like how does thathappen?
And I'm bringing that point upon purpose, because there are
those out there that, forwhatever reason, have reached
(06:23):
that pinnacle within themselvesat a certain point and they just
keep going forward.
I just didn't happen to be oneof them.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 2 (06:32):
No, it does make sense and I think it's even kind
of continuing from the previousepisode in some ways, when we
did dive in deeply into theconversation of being in the
present moment or living fromthe present moment and even how
both of our experiences evolvedand changed over the years.
When it comes to even justtalking about that topic alone
and I think if you, if you and I, were to talk about learning to
(06:55):
trust self, you woulddefinitely paint interesting
pictures of how that hascontinued to evolve and change
as the years have went by.
So even when we talk about, say,spirituality, all the different
books out there, all thedifferent religions, all the
different approaches as we oftentalk about, it's very hard to
say that any of them are rightor wrong, because it's never
that clean cut.
So when you and I talk aboutour spiritual understandings,
(07:18):
our experiences present day,that's because of our experience
and exposure that has been trueto us, that we have literally
gone through.
So sometimes if you can'trelate to the experiences as far
as experiences that you and Ihave gone through and it's a
theory, then it's much easier toargue with the theory because
you haven't had the overallexperience of how it has
(07:39):
impacted us in mind, body,emotion, soul, exactly so.
That's why I'm never trying toignore you, trying to convince
anyone or try to convert anyoneinto the things that we talk
about, but it's just being openenough to have the conversation
of the evolution, of how all ofthese definitions and
understandings continue toevolve and change, thus through
(08:00):
exploration and exposure andexperience.
That has a huge impact on thisspiritual journey.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
So, having said that, what definition are we basing
trust on today, like what is ourgeneral definition, that we're
saying learning to trust ourself.
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Looking at trust with myself and my journey with it
is that I think from a yearlyage, as we were talking about,
you're taught to trust a lot ofdifferent things externally in
order to understand how tosurvive and how to grow in this
world and how to adapt toexternal events and scenarios.
Whereas, especially when Istarted questioning was on the
(08:43):
spiritual journey and metMichael, it became more of an
inward and internal journey ofbeing able to trust myself that,
no matter what life presentedin front of me, I will always
have the.
It also goes back to thatspiritual understanding that my
(09:06):
energy brought this in front ofme or as a part of my path in
order to grow from it.
So if it was designed by me andfor me, therefore I will have
that strength within to be ableto get through it, because it's
for me, by me, versus whenbeforehand, if it was always
having to trust other people toget through it, and people are
(09:26):
constantly letting you down.
When you're relying on them,that was always a much harder
thing to be able to grasp or forit not to get heavy in mind
body emotions.
So it was the evolution ofyou're still engaging with the
world, but you're actuallyinvesting in yourself and
trusting that there is a reasonbehind it, and the journey is to
(09:46):
explore that present day.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
For me.
I was taught that I'm meant totrust the outside world because
they know better than me, and soin the beginning, all my trust
was put on external experiences,just like you said, an external
input from other people.
And what I understand thisjourney of learning to trust
self means is turning thataround and finding my own inner
(10:11):
compass.
And so, even though we knowthat we have spiritual contracts
and even though we know thatthese things that are coming at
us, if we learn to really relyon the inner compass, then, as
we're navigating whatever isshowing up in our life, then
we're going to have a completelydifferent result than if we're
(10:34):
still externalizing and stilllooking for it in somebody else,
or feedback from somebody elseor something else, or whatever
that might be.
That's what I'm saying Agree100% with what your definition
of trust is.
For me, it's like that innercompass.
100% with what your definitionof trust is For me.
(10:54):
It's like that inner compass.
And then it's having theability to rely on my own inner
compass instead of looking forit externally.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
And I think that is maturing and growing on this
journey, and we still have to,of course, no matter who we are,
engage with the world andengage with people, and there's
always going to be differentsystems and different things out
there.
But I think the difference isbeing able to question it, now
more than ever, and continue toeducate ourselves in the
different ways and using our ownexperience, instead of
(11:22):
constantly doubting ourselves,pushing away our emotions,
pushing away the mind andimmediately saying nope.
As you said, everyone else hasit and I must have it wrong,
especially when the numbers arepiled against us in certain
scenarios.
So I think that's where itbecomes interesting of how do we
continue to trust in ourinstincts, more trust in our
mind, trust in our emotions,trust in our experience as we
(11:45):
continue to grow in this world,because that does have a
positive impact in our abilityto live day to day.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
And I also think it comes down to intuition.
It's intuitively trusting theguidance that we get from
ourselves, even though our mindis screaming and yelling
something different.
It's about knowing.
Oh.
So a little story I'll tellabout.
That is when I first starteddoing some of this work and I
was going to the long-termsubstance abuse center and I
(12:13):
would be working with clientsthat suffered from addiction
there and we would sit down.
There would be twopractitioners together to work
with this particular person andwe'd both be asking questions of
the person so that we could,you know, help them move through
something.
And inevitably, the otherpractitioner would always say
(12:37):
okay, ready to go, I'm ready togo.
What's wrong with you?
Why haven't you got enoughinformation?
And that was one of the firstplaces that I started to realize
oh no, I know I don't have theright information.
I can feel that in my body Ihave to keep asking questions.
And when I get to the rightquestion, there is a definite
(12:57):
change internally for me I don'twant to say it's just
physically, because I think itis mind, body and emotion and
then I go oh, this is where Ineed to go.
I have my direction.
Now I'm ready to move forward.
So that's what I meant when Iwas saying that, which is
exactly what you you're sayingas well, and we've spoken about
when we've talked aboutintuition.
(13:18):
That is our own inner guidepoint, wouldn't you agree?
Speaker 2 (13:23):
it's also there's reasons behind of why at times
we're able to follow ourintuition, why other times we
weren't able to or not allowedto, and that is all part of our
energy guiding us, depending onthe experiences that we were
meant to have or going to have,but that goes back to even the
spiritual contracts, or whycertain events do fold, in which
(13:44):
the way they do, and becausesometimes it isn't a clear cut
formula, I think is why there isdistrust in our intuition at
times, or in within our emotionsor mind, because it's never
just a clean-cut formula.
So therefore, that's why it doesget very confusing of how can I
trust myself if every time I goback to trying to, it changes,
(14:06):
the goalposts move, which I dothink is most people's
experience, because we're usedto everything being very logical
when it's come from otherpeople and that's why it makes
it trustworthy, because it isjust some level of consistency
there.
But when it comes to ourselves,it always just feels a little
bit noisy internally or loud,and often it's hard to place
(14:29):
trust into that to make big orsmall life decisions.
So it makes sense to whylearning to trust self can be a
complicated journey, but yet thejourney keeps pointing us back
to learning how to yes it does,and I find, personally, for many
, many years it was a veryconfusing journey for me.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
You know I have a lot of different things that have
happened in my past and I cantell you from a very, very young
age I was being told that I hadno emotional resilience or that
I had no capacity to deal withmy emotions and so, therefore, I
couldn't trust myself.
Now, sitting here in hindsight,I can see that that was part of
(15:11):
growing and becoming who I amand what I would have considered
in the past as the biggestobstacle for me.
That emotional resilience hasbecome one of my greatest inner
powers, because I know about theemotion inside and out where,
(15:33):
if I hadn't gone through thoseexperiences, I wouldn't.
But having said that, a lot ofpeople think when you have the
emotional resilience, that'swhen you are going to be able to
trust yourself more, when youeither control your emotions or
understand your emotions.
And, like we've said many times, it's not even really that
because they're going to show upand throw us for a loop every
(15:55):
single time.
I can guarantee you, every timeI think, oh, I got a handle on
this.
Smack right back in my face.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Right on cue.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
Thought I had a handle on it right.
Yeah, one of the things thatgets so confusing about this
journey, because when you areout there looking at different
things it sounds so clear cut.
I don't know about you.
That has not been my journey.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
If we are talking about the common barriers a lot
of us face when it comes to selftrust, it is number one.
The voice in our head, like thenegative talk that we often
experience, that when it comesto making a decision it gets
louder.
We feel paralyzed by what thisinner critic is saying to us in
that circumstance and, of course, when that starts, then the
(16:42):
emotions get heavy and we reallydoubt our capabilities to be
able to make a decision.
And that is easier to hand overresponsibility to someone else.
That is what often starts first, but then you have to look at
that's linked back to pastquote-unquote failures or
traumas that we've been throughfrom a very young age right up
until adulthood.
(17:02):
That is all deemed asexperience that is guiding our
ability or inability to make adecision in that moment.
So when you start layering allof these different reasons to
why it's so hard to be able totrust ourselves in those moments
to make a decision, you canunderstand how it's not
clear-cut and why it is a rarity, as you're saying earlier, for
(17:26):
people just to completely trustin themselves and have that
confidence to run with it nomatter what, because more often
than not people don't have areason to trust with it, no
matter what, because more oftenthan not, people don't have a
reason to trust their lives todate Because, as we were talking
about.
It's been too unpredictable andthe formula has not been set to
be that clean cut.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And then we haven't even really talked about, which
we both know is part of theexperiences that we have to have
.
But all the various differentrelationships that we go through
at the early stages of our lifeand how we interact with others
whether that be family members,whether that be our early first
stepping into school, andteachers and friends and
everything our socialinteractions and everything that
comes with that in those veryfirst formula of years, social
(18:12):
interactions and everything thatcomes with that in those very
first formula of years, you knowthose relationships also pay a
very big impact.
You know I will share this withyou that I have found
fascinating on my journey.
So, as per most people, Ithought it was me that was the
problem for many, many, manyyears and I know the experiences
that I had going through schooland the different points that
(18:34):
were the most challenging pointsfor me.
Then I became a parent.
I've moved halfway across theworld, I'm raising kids and I
watch my kids get to thesedifferent stages in their social
interactions and seeing theexact same thing happening and
I'm thinking to myself how canthis be?
We're two generations beyond,we have so much more knowledge,
(18:57):
we have all of these things andwe live in a completely
different culture, country sideof the world, yet these kids are
going through some of the samesocial experiences that I went
through, and that was one of thefirst times I woke up to.
Oh, maybe we all have to gothrough these experiences, but
(19:17):
how much they impact us atdifferent ages of our life and
what it causes us to feel duringthose stages, and even when I'm
working with clients today,it's like clockwork.
I can tell you the years wherekids are going to run into the
issue and I'm not mentioningthem right now because's like
clockwork.
I can tell you the years wherekids are going to run into the
issue and I'm not mentioningthem right now because so many
people don't want to go out andprevent that from happening when
(19:39):
we can't, as you and I bothknow.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
So I just find it interesting that you know people
think that there is a normalout there and that people do
have these.
They don't have to go throughall the experiences, but I think
almost all of us go through itat some level.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Yep, in our own ways and but, as you were saying
there, there is no stopping it,and I think it's that when you
try to, it's that life just getscreative and bringing it up in
new, different ways that youcan't see it.
And then it's kind of like whenour parents say I'm going to
raise my kids completelydifferent to how my parents
raised me, or I'm never going tobecome like my parents, uh-oh,
(20:23):
okay.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
You know that one right I do.
Uh, no, I'm not familiar withthat at all.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Let's take a step back from this week's episode
and share with everyone whatwe've been up to behind the
scenes we're really excited tobe able to finally offer the
gareth michael community to eachof you.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
The community offers a range of benefits, including
access to our live events,weekly podcast episodes,
articles, self-checkingquestions, as well as a
community of individuals you canconnect with and interact with
along the way.
It's designed to offer yousupport, guidance and a safe
space on a day-to-day basis.
(21:12):
We'd love to have you join ourglobal community of like-minded
individuals.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
That website address again is wwwgarethmichaelcom Now
let's get back to that episode,shall we?
So I just think it'sinteresting that when it comes
to these kind of human behaviorsand patterns that you see
basically in everyone, it makesyou question okay, if this is as
(21:41):
common as we say it is, then ithas a reason for its existence.
There's a reason to how we areall exposed to that and there's
a bigger picture or meaninggoing on.
So I think at times it's thatif we're able to explore that
and understand why it is thisway, it's much easier and it
helps a lot with our level ofacceptance towards some of these
(22:02):
events or how these things areunfolding.
Now it doesn't relieve us fromthese experiences, but that's
where the individual journey isof being curious and wanting to
question is a huge part of it.
And exploring that mind, body,emotions, as it appears present
day and it's only when you'reactually willing and able to do
that, depending on where you areon your journey if that's on
(22:23):
your journey at all, everyone'sdifferent then that is the
starting foundations of trustingyourself and building a trust
with yourself, because that'svery hard to do unless you're
willing to educate your mindwith the reasons behind why we
distrust ourselves and where dothose come from.
So I know I'm starting at thevery start, but I'm saying that
is a huge part of it, becauseyou have to do the ground work
(22:47):
in order for it to be able toevolve or change.
A lot of the patterns orbehaviors that we're all running
that continuously impact ourdecision making day in, day out,
on our ability to regulateemotions or not.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
So I agree wholeheartedly, and one of the
things that I would say is a lotof people would ask well, how
do I shortcut this?
And I think, as you've justsaid, said, there is no shortcut
cutting it, and so then my nextstatement would be how do we
know we're ready to startexploring that and and go in
(23:19):
there and I'm saying this for areason, because I go for me.
It was when I started to becomeaware that I was continually
looking for the trust externally, or that external validation,
and how it would rip me apart onthe inside, because I was like,
(23:40):
well, every part of me saying Ineed to do this, but all of
these voices out here are sayingI need to do something
completely different and I don'tknow how to make that judgment,
that internal judgment, andit's not like there was a light
switch that went on to do that.
It's just like you said, I hadto go back to the beginning and
(24:02):
start to understand some of theexperiences that happened to me,
to understand some of theemotional.
You know, it's like there's asaying out there that I keep
thinking about while we'retalking right now, and that is
it's not what happened to us,it's what we do with what
happened to us, and I thinkthat's a very valid point,
because that's that uniqueness,because it's unique to each one
(24:24):
of us, whatever we do internallywith that self-talk, the critic
, the judgments we've made outof ourself, the level of shame
we might've felt, even though wecan't turn around and start to
trust ourself, until we start toexplore some of that, to
understand and my favoriteverbiage for this is you know
(24:49):
what?
These were coping skills thatwe picked up along the way and
while they might have helped usget through it in that moment,
they might not be valid today,and exploring them is what
allows us to start to start thisjourney of trusting ourself.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
So I think that brings us on to the different
ways in which we can startrebuilding and strengthening our
trust with ourselves.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
It's often about taking the very small steps,
like you and I've talked aboutso many times.
You've talked about thejournaling and how you love
journaling and how that openedyour eyes to understanding your
past experiences in a differentway.
Correct, and that is always oneof the key things that I have
heard many people say.
(25:35):
For me, the journaling wasdifficult because all my focus
was always on was the negativeand how I'd failed, and hearing
that voice in my head of all thepeople telling me I couldn't
succeed, until someone asked meto do an exercise of something
completely opposite, and whatthat was was to sit down and
(25:56):
write out a list of all the waysthat I had succeeded in
trusting myself, or I had evensucceeded at anything, starting
from the fact that I learned tocrawl, I learned to walk, I
learned to tie my shoes, Ilearned to read all of the
things that I did or that I wasable to do.
(26:17):
Now, that isn't necessarilyabout trusting yourself, but
because my focus had been sonarrowed in on the failure and
the self-criticism I couldn'tsee anything good.
So I had to start with thistiny little stepstone, and what
that exercise kicked off was thecuriosity that you're often
(26:40):
talking about.
Let me get curious why Ibelieved all these other people.
What were those experiencesthat I experienced and what did
I learn from feeling like thatfailure for so long?
Speaker 2 (26:53):
And I think that's why there's so many interesting
approaches to this, because, asyou mentioned, I do love
journaling and seeing what thesubconscious and conscious mind
likes to bring up, especiallywhen we give it the opportunity
to target a specific area of ourlives.
So, say, if in this instance,we're talking about our, our
ability or inability to trustourselves, I think it's
(27:16):
interesting to see what memoriesof the pros and cons of the
experiences that it wants tobring up and when it does that,
that is our system guiding us toexplore those different
experiences with someone who isqualified and understands, and
how to navigate that withsomeone on their specific needs.
It becomes a very interestingthing to explore and a guide
within itself.
(27:37):
So, but I think, in even how westarted this episode, it's
really important for people tounderstand that we've all never
been given the opportunity totrust ourselves from the start,
and I think that's where theelement of having
self-compassion and, in someways, forgiveness towards
ourselves, that it didn't startwith us before.
(28:02):
We were actually, by design, notallowed to trust ourselves,
because there was a number ofexperiences with other people
and in this life that wererequired in order for us to
become the person we are today,but it is our responsibility to
understand that person.
That is through questioning andthe willingness to explore in a
way that suits you and yourneeds today, because, as we
often talk about, those needschange as we go through life.
How Kim approached herself 20years ago versus 10 years ago,
(28:26):
versus today and even 10 yearsfrom now, it is a forever
changing and evolving journeyand that's where that
self-compassion and having thosesmall steps become very
important when it comes to thisexploration very important when
it comes to this exploration andabsolutely and one of the terms
(28:49):
that comes to mind for me whenit comes to self-compassion and
forgiveness that I use a lot isthis happened to me, not because
of me.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
And again, that was because I was stuck in so much
of the shame and the blame andwhat had happened to me, I
thought, was because of me, not,that these were experiences
that I actually went through.
And I think the other littlenugget is when you can have that
self-compassion and thatforgiveness and start to be
kinder to yourself when you'reexploring these things.
(29:15):
It's easier then to identifysome of the wisdom that you
picked up along the way as youwent through these experiences
and that perhaps that would beone of the things if you could
gather the wisdom from some ofthe experiences and start to
write that down, that alsostarts to give you a whole new
perspective on who you are as aperson and your ability to trust
(29:39):
yourself.
And you know you're not goingto just write it down willy
nilly and say, boom, that's whatyou were talking about.
We have somebody, aprofessional or someone who's
completely objective, that hasthe ability to help us navigate
that particular part of thejourney and then, after a while,
it starts to become natural,and that's when we start to talk
(29:59):
about really then becomenatural, and that's when we
start to talk about really then.
Then, when we understand someof that past stuff, beginning to
listen to our intuition becomesa little bit easier at that
stage.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
There is no silver bullet when it comes to our
ability to trust ourselves,especially if there has been so
many years of distrust.
So it is like dating ourselvesover a period of time where you
don't date someone once and thensuddenly get married the
following date.
It takes time to believe andtrust with another person.
So if we haven't had theability to have that trust with
ourselves, we have to putourselves through the same
(30:31):
pieces of the same process, butwith the curiosity of wanting to
go inwards and to ask thosequestions of why the distrust is
there to start with.
And over a period of time itdoes begin to balance out little
by little, but it does take acommitment to self to want to do
that exploration.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
And I love that you said the dating self, because so
many of us only look at thecritical side, the judgmental
side, the shaming side.
We only look at what we havedone wrong, so how?
Of course we're not building aresilience or a bank of things
that we can trust and very fewpeople actually begin to get to
(31:12):
know themselves.
We're not encouraged in so manydifferent ways to actually get
to know ourselves.
And especially in today'ssociety, there's that new
buzzword that's out thereeverywhere, which is the
narcissistic word.
You know.
And so if we want to get to knowourselves, isn't that being
selfish or narcissistic?
But we're not talking aboutlike that.
(31:33):
We're talking about reallyhaving a much deeper
understanding of what is goingon inside of us and how we're
responding to life, each andevery moment that life is
happening and I love the factthat you said that, because I
did.
It was like I had to first findout who I was, then I had to
(31:54):
become my own friend because,trust me, I wasn't a very good
friend to myself, and then I hadto start courting myself and
nurturing myself in order to getto that place where I could
trust myself.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
And I think that's what's kind of really and as you
do that journey, what you endup discovering can be quite
astounding as time goes on.
Because, especially how a lotof us take ourselves completely
for granted without meaning toor understanding, that's exactly
what we do.
So it's like we might complainthat our partners, our
relationships, our families takeus for granted at times, but
(32:30):
then when you actually look atthe relationship with yourself,
in what ways are you takingyourself for granted?
And mind, body, emotions, andnot even seeing the value or the
reasoning of why you shouldexplore yourself.
So it's often not a veryhealthy relationship or
foundation to start with, andit's often not a very healthy
relationship or foundation tostart with.
And it's only when we begin tounderstand that it's that way
can we begin to create thosechanges that are necessary to
(32:50):
take enough of an interest andbelief in ourselves to want to
invest into ourselves.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Which is a very important word investing into
ourselves, and we're so quick towant to invest in everyone else
.
If we make that commitment, asyou were saying because it is a
commitment to really want toexplore ourself, our journey,
our mind, body and emotions Thenwhen we turn that inward and
(33:16):
start to have compassion withthat, we don't give up on dating
after the second or third round.
If we're really interested insomebody, if we have that
interest, we're going to pursueit, no matter what, even if the
alarm bells are going off.
So why are we not able to turnthat around and pursue that
within ourselves?
(33:36):
And it does take that level ofcommitment, I think, and then it
also takes.
It does take that level ofcommitment.
I think so, and then it alsotakes.
I think the other importantpart about this journey is, if
we have had a past where we havebeen hypercritical or blaming
of ourselves, that we putourselves in a very supportive
environment and surroundourselves with people who are
(33:59):
going to support that journey aswe go through it, because it
has a tendency to get messy fromtime to time.
I'll tell you another thing thatI found very interesting about
this, because people have oftentalked to me how have I managed
to go from where I was to whereI am, and what drove that?
And I don't know if I have theanswer to so much.
(34:20):
What drove it, other than I wasmeant to do that?
But I do know that thatcommitment that you just talked
about became very important tome, and I realized, probably
midway through the journey, thatI didn't have a clear lens that
I was looking at myself and mylife through, and so I had to
(34:43):
find a strategy to be able tounderstand it better, without
all the clouded stuff that I hadfrom the past.
So I coined this little termthat whenever anything happened
to me that I didn't understand,I would do an autopsy and so I'd
sit down and I would lay it outand I'd go step by step through
(35:04):
it and the verbiage I would useand I know this verbiage sounds
a bit outdated, but I would say, okay, what is my part in this,
what is somebody else's part init, what really upset me?
Because if there's something inthis that really upset me or
that I blame me or shame me orjudged me for, then that is
(35:25):
something I need to explore, andit started making it so much
easier because it took it awayfrom me being a failure or not
being able to get it right, orall the stuff that my head would
want to go into, to looking atit as if I was.
I'm just exploring thislogically so that I can find out
.
Okay, so let's look at that andwhat does that mean to me?
(35:48):
So that's just a little tip.
I mean I like doing it.
It's always hindsight, becausehindsight is really great, but
that is how you learn, you know.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
But I think that's why it's actually interesting to
look back and think yeah, Kim,30 years ago didn't enjoy the
idea of that process, didn'teven want to engage in that
process.
But that just goes to show thatit's the little baby steps
along the way that create thebiggest change longer term when
it comes to building thatrelationship with self that we
were designed not to have formany years of our life.
(36:20):
But little by little, little,it does come.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
It does, and it's so worth the journey.
Thanks so much for listening.
If you enjoyed this episode,then you might want to check out
our online community.
We built it to offer you thecomfort of having a supportive
community by your side, nomatter where life takes you.
Connect with like-mindedindividuals through our app.
(36:46):
Navigate each step of thejourney together with us by
joining our Gareth Michaelcommunity.
Here are a few of the thingsyou're going to get.
You'll get exclusive real-timeaccess to live recording and
events.
Advance access to each newepisode.
The opportunity to askquestions directly of Gareth and
I Input into what topics wecover in the show.
(37:10):
Access to exclusive content notavailable anywhere else.
To learn more about ourcommunity, please go to
wwwgarethmichaelcom.
Thanks again, and I hope youguys are having a lovely week.
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