March 26, 2025 • 53 mins
Ed Greiman is General Manager of Upper Iowa Beef, a mid-sized beef processing plant located in Lime Springs, Iowa.
He was born and raised as a typical farm kid in rural Iowa, went to college at Iowa State University, and has had significant experience in nearly all segments of the beef industry supply chain.
NOTE: This episode was recorded in early February 2025, so some of the references to political landscape and economics may sound a bit dated.
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(00:04):
Thanks for joining us forepisode 72 of Practically
Ranching.
I'm Matt Perrier and we are herethanks to Dalebanks Angus, your
home for practical profitablegenetics since 1904.
This episode rounds out thegroup of conversations that I
recorded while I was at 2025Cattle Industry Convention last
(00:26):
February.
This was actually the first oneI recorded in San Antonio, but
given my guest's perspectives onthe the beef business, I thought
this would make the perfectfinale.
Ed Greiman is general manager ofUpper Iowa Beef, so for the last
few years he's been a packer.
(00:48):
He's also a cattle feeder andowns a commercial cow calf herd
and a row crop farming operationwith his family, and as if these
segments didn't give him enoughbreadth and width of
perspective.
He also has served as both astaff member and a volunteer
leader of the Iowa Cattleman'sAssociation through the years I.
(01:11):
So to say that Ed has a prettybroad perspective of the beef
supply and production chainwould be an understatement, a
huge understatement.
The first time I remembermeeting Ed was probably around
10 years ago at an NCBAconvention.
He was the chair of the LiveCattle Marketing Committee, and
(01:35):
I watched him oversee one of themore contentious discussions
that I may be ever witnessedamongst a Cattleman's group.
He didn't have an easy jobthere.
I.
Because passions were high andconsensus was low, and a lot of
us in that room continued todebate about how the best way to
(01:57):
determine a base price for fedcattle was.
At the time, all I knew about Edwas that he was an Iowa cattle
feeder, and he had a littledifferent perspective on fed
cattle marketing than a lot ofmy peers and I did.
But I was impressed.
I was impressed with hisdedication to the industry, his
(02:18):
passion for the industry.
He was very diplomatic in a timethat he didn't probably have to
be, but was, and the thing thatimpressed me most was his
determination to solve theseproblems and these industry
issues instead of justcomplaining about them.
Now, today, as I mentioned, he.
(02:39):
For the most part is a packer,regardless of whether he's
wearing that hard hat, or hiscowboy hat or a seed corn cap,
I've actually never seen him inone of those before, but I'll
bet he owns a few) ed is a supersmart guy.
He is a super competitive guy,and he is a guy that I am glad
to have in our beef industry.
(03:01):
I learned a bunch from him, andI think you will as well as we
visit with Ed Greiman.
Ed (03:08):
Yeah, my background's kind of unique.
So, uh, Graduated from IowaState University in 1992.
Um, Was your typical Iowa farmthat I grew up on, cattle, pigs
row crops, alfalfa, so lookedvery typical north central Iowa.
Went to Iowa State University,the only reason I went, I was
going to be on the judging team.
I liked to judge I was reallygood at it in 4 H, did not go to
(03:31):
a junior college, went straightthere.
But ended up getting on themeats judging team first.
FC Parish grabbed a hold of me Ihad a cousin who had been on
before me.
And so That was my first eyeopener into the meat business,
is the Meats Judging Team.
None of us had ever been inpacking plants, right?
And that was really new.
Meats Judging Team, live team,left Iowa State, go home to
(03:53):
farm.
Got home to farm, we'd just comeout of the 80s.
The situation at home probablywasn't good enough for me to
come and farm, but I had myheadset on it.
So very quickly I figured thatout financially.
It was clear that my dad was notgoing to continue farming.
So I got a job with the IowaCattlemen's.
Kept farming, got a job with theIowa Cattlemen's.
My wife worked for Monsanto thewhole time.
(04:14):
So she was an Iowa State grad.
A little bit more ag business,but agronomy background.
And so, Of course, there wasalways enough money to put food
on the table, right?
And to have a car.
So, I went to work for the IowaCattlemen's.
And that really opened up myeyes.
They let me do what I needed todo.
I traveled all over Iowa.
Before you know it, my firstproject was Source and Age
(04:35):
Verified Electronic Tags in1998.
Oh, wow.
98.
Yeah.
What concerns me about that is20 some years later, we're still
nowhere.
We're still the same button.
Yeah, I'm amazed.
The same button.
And, you know, I've tried torestart it a couple times at my
feed yard and the packing plant.
And it just seems liketechnology is going nowhere with
(04:57):
that.
It's really frustrating, right?
And, you would just think thatsomewhere we're going to
simplify it.
But anyway, Iowa Cattlemen's,and in that process, which was
unique it was called IowaQuality Beef.
We partnered up with Cargill.
And in that partnership withCargill, We were going to send
2, 000 head a week to Schuyler,Nebraska out of Iowa.
(05:17):
And it was the first cattle thathad ever been on grid marketing.
So it was rib eye area, backfat, full yield grades, quality
grade scores, individual carcassweights with electronic tags.
So my job was to schedule those2, 000 a week and then work with
producers to understand how tointerpret all the data they got
back.
And it was the first time they'dever been paid premiums for
(05:38):
quality grade and yield gradeand cutability, right?
And so So, those guys atCargill, I got into the plant a
lot because we were looking atCarcostata and then, because it
was 2000 a week, some peoplelike you know, Tim Ramey who ran
the north and then I got to knowBill Thoni, Marcine Moldenhauer
(05:58):
I just learned a lot, right?
And I started to get thisappreciation for the packing
plant.
In that process, we were goingto open up a plant, a new plant
with them.
That kind of didn't happen, andso we partnered with American
Foods and opened up Tama Tama,Iowa.
And it ran for a very shorttime.
And so, I was one of the guysthat raised the capital with 800
(06:21):
producers who were going todeliver cattle.
It was really modeled after U.
S.
Premium Beef and National.
And, we had one flaw though.
U.
S.
Premium National was is thatfarmland plant was actually
doing okay.
They just needed a good supplyof cattle.
We were a start up.
American Foods was not reallyknown for a quality side.
(06:45):
So we were bringing qualitycattle, but it was a new venture
for them.
And then BSE came along in 03and that just ended it, right?
But the one thing that botheredme that whole time is I was
there every day scheduling thosecattle is that it didn't work.
And yet the cattle wereeverything they were supposed to
be.
And so I just felt like wemissed out on an opportunity,
(07:06):
but I also saw how hard
Matt (07:07):
it was.
You had a cultural problemwithin that group, AFG, and not
necessarily a cattle problem.
Yes.
National and USP& B may havebeen the opposite.
Ed (07:15):
And the same thing happened to us there that happens to
almost every startup plant.
We had a partner at the time inBuckhead Beef.
Okay.
They were an independent companyat the time.
They got bought by Sysco, and itcame to an end.
Just like that, our partner wasgone for the high quality
middles.
Matt (07:31):
Yeah, and if you don't have that um, I mean obviously
the end cuts and the offal andeverything else, we'll talk
about that a little bit later.
They drive cash flow, but yeah,you've got to have that high
end, middle meat customer that'sgonna really drive value
Ed (07:46):
into it.
You do, and you've got to havethat core that you know is
always going to be gone on somekind of a formula marketing.
And we lost that.
So that was always, I went homefrom there.
I left the Iowa Cattlemen's atthat point.
Went home, farmed.
Did my thing for a while, grewthe operation.
What year was that?
That would have been 2005.
(08:07):
There was no hope.
We tried to get somebody to openup the plant.
It wasn't going to happen.
So then I went back to Garnerfull time.
And grew the operation.
So we're now Cow Calf.
I'm with my brother.
My brother was there the wholetime.
So G.
B.
Cattle.
His wife also worked forMonsanto.
So Greiman Brothers.
Cow Calf.
Commercial Cow Calf.
Which would be fall cabin herdand a spring cabin herd and
(08:29):
really when I say spring I meanJanuary February like we're
wrapping up right now, right?
Yeah, and then Feed lot so we'dbe your typical feed lot in Iowa
with a lot of buildings deepbedded buildings.
I don't have any slats and So Idid that and just grew our
operation And then I becamepresident of the Iowa
Cattlemen's.
(08:50):
Kind of Got back involved as avolunteer, right?
Became president of the IowaCattlemen's.
Then did, chaired live cattlemarketing for National
Cattlemen's Association.
And that's when I was with JoeCavanda, he was my vice chair.
That really opened up my eyes toanother world, right?
Of bigger feed yards and riskmanagement.
And I learned a lot about, Iunderstood risk management.
(09:12):
But I, it opened my eyes to abigger world of it.
And then, did a little projectalong with that called the Fed
Cattle Exchange, right?
And so worked with the fourmajor packers on it, got to know
the heads of procurements.
And it always was in the back ofmy mind that the packing plant
was always drawing me in.
And so did all that, and then anopportunity came up in 2017.
(09:36):
When Jerry Niewohner out ofAlbion, Nebraska called and
said, Ed, we need to open up alittle packing plant in Iowa
that right now has been shutdown.
it was called Upper Iowa Beef orLime Springs Beef at the time.
It's on the Upper Iowa River.
It's in Lime Springs, Iowa.
And there was 50 cattlemen thathad opened it up.
It was a plant that was designedto do 60 to 100 head a day.
(09:57):
so we went in there, tried topartner with those guys.
And it was within a year We hadbought them out and started to
grow.
And I would never have been ableto do that without the backing
of the Niewohners in Nebraska.
So a family with severalgenerations had access to
(10:18):
capital, right?
Because that's what packingplants need, is capital.
But the cattle were there,really good cattle, and and it
started that way, the first dayin 2017, it was November of 2017
was the first day we opened it,did eight head.
Got, we're supposed to do 11head, got shut down at number
eight for a mis knock because itwas a, a heifer that sat up.
(10:41):
And then we were done for theweek until we could get work
through that with USDA.
Wow.
Things that cowboys
Matt (10:47):
don't think about until they have to run that plant.
Ed (10:50):
Oh yeah, humane handling's everything.
Yeah, we talk a lot about foodsafety, it's important, but
humane handling is That one willget you in a lot of trouble in a
hurry.
Matt (10:59):
I think it's fascinating, and we'll keep going from where
we're at, because we're nowherenear the end of your story, but
I think I had met you once ortwice before, but until I was
attending those NationalCattlemen's Beef Association
meetings as president of KLA,while you and Joe were chair and
vice chair of the Live CattleMarketing and working through
(11:19):
the Fed Cattle Exchange, thatwas a big thing on my radar was,
and this is quote unquote clearback in 2016 that I was saying
we've got to figure out if wecan do better at pricing fed
cattle for the base that thengrids and formulas and
everything else can be based offof and You know in a state like
(11:40):
Kansas I didn't necessarily geta ton of traction there, but we
get to these NCBA meetings andYou all were Hip deep in it
already and trying as the NCBAgroup to figure out how do we do
better at this?
A producer led initiativeworking with folks from the feed
yard and the packing and the cowcalf segments, just like NCBA is
(12:02):
supposed to be.
And through that, as frustratedas all of us got, because we
never really could get, at thatpoint, we never could get an
answer.
We thought we could.
You know, We talked to all theexperts and the guy from
Colorado State that did theeconomic study and all these
things.
Dr.
Coons.
Dr.
Coons, thank you.
We heard it all.
(12:23):
And we heard what could be andyet we never could get at what
should be and what will be.
And instead of just getting madand packing your stuff and going
home, you decided, hey, you knowwhat?
I've learned a little bitthrough this process, and here's
an opportunity with these folksat Upper Iowa Beef I'm gonna let
(12:44):
the rubber meet the road,instead of just sitting at home
and bitching.
And that's what I think isinspiring to me, is you said,
hey, I believe that we can dobetter, I believe there's a need
for this type of a structure,now let's figure out how to do
it.
Ed (12:57):
That's exactly right there's a lot of people that got really
frustrated, threw up their arms,and I wasn't one of those, I
just said, All right.
This is the system we're in.
We're not going to completelychange it, right?
Feedlots are going to stayaligned with packers.
And so let's figure out how wecan do that ourselves.
And I did it really trulymyself.
(13:18):
I knew the heads of procurementsvery well.
I became friends with them.
But I'm a small yard.
I'm selling three to fourthousand head a year.
And I kept telling them I, Iwant the premium that this guy's
getting, or I want theopportunity.
And because I couldn't do thenumbers the volume of numbers
that the other feedlots weredoing I wasn't able to achieve
some of the things that I wantedto achieve at my feed yard.
(13:40):
So, I always knew that the bestway to do this, probably in
Iowa, would be to start apacking plant.
But I also knew, when JerryNiewohner called me, And he
said, Ed, let's do this.
I told him, I said, Jerry,you're going to take 10 years of
my life and just, it's going tobe gone.
And I said, the amount ofcapital that you're going to
need to put in this.
(14:00):
If you have a number in mind,you better take it times three.
And I hope that's enough.
Matt (14:06):
Yeah.
That is a critical part that Idon't think any of us can even
wrap our head around, andespecially in times that we've
seen the increase in.
Cattle prices labor, cattleprices, regulations, that's the
tip of the iceberg, I know, butyeah, I mean, this thing has
been fast and furious since youall started, and yet, somehow,
(14:28):
thus far, you've been able tokeep it going.
We have.
And growing.
Ed (14:31):
It's kind of funny so, Jerry and I would talk once a week,
right?
And uh, not every day, he reallylet me do what I needed to do,
but now that we, once we kind ofmade it and started to make some
money I told him one day, Isaid, the only reason I, there
was a lot of days I wanted tojust go home and be done.
And the only reason I kept doingthis is because you kept sending
money and he made me feel so badthat I had to keep working.
(14:54):
And he said I kept sending moneybecause you kept coming to work.
Matt (14:58):
He was afraid you
weren't.
Ed (15:00):
So both of us were miserable, I guess, for a little
while because he had threebrothers that he had to explain
what he's doing and a bank,what's going on here.
What?
Why do we keep subsidizing thisnew venture?
And
Matt (15:13):
all the way through it though, there was light at the
end of the tunnel for those whobelieve that this system could
work.
And I think that anytime we seesomebody enter either a new
business or try to reconstructthe new concept or whatever the
case may be if you don't believethat it can be better and that
there's a purpose in what it isyou're doing.
(15:34):
Yeah, you can't, you're notgoing to keep throwing.
No, No,
Ed (15:36):
you have to believe because it is so hard.
But I got to tell you, Matt I, Iwake up every morning scared to
death still.
And it's, you know, my wife'slike, what are you, what are you
worried about?
I said, failure.
I don't want to be another plantthat didn't make it.
Because you really realize itreally quickly when you start
talking to lenders.
(15:57):
Because, you know, once you getgoing, you know, you need to
start to borrow some operatingmoney.
And.
We were three years into itbefore we could find a lender to
talk to us.
Wow.
And when you get them to just upand up say it, they'd say, look,
the track record's not very goodfor startup packing plants.
And most of them had been burnedbad on it.
And I worry about that, right?
(16:17):
The things that could go wrong.
Matt (16:19):
That's why you do well.
That's why you're still heretoday is because if you don't
wake up hungry and worried andconcerned about.
what's out there.
Yeah, something reaches up andgrabs you.
And, And I think that goesacross regardless of size and
scale and scope of a pack ofprocessor, feed yard, a cow
calf, whatever.
I mean,, Probably the bigger,the bigger we get, the more
(16:40):
worried we have to be of thosethings that can jump up and grab
us.
Okay.
So get us to today and scope andsize of upper Iowa beef.
So you processed eight head outof 11 that you wanted to that
first day.
Or maybe I guess the first weekbecause it was shut down.
Yeah.
Where are you today in terms ofyour size and scope?
(17:01):
And where is this next?
So
Ed (17:03):
yeah, that was 2017 now today the plant Can do uh, 500
head a day is what we're doing.
So to give you, kind of put itin perspective, the harvest
floor, the kill floor, does 58head an hour.
And it was designed to dobasically 60 a day.
Wow.
So we've uh, been in a perpetualstate of growth ever since I
started.
(17:23):
Always been adding somethingnew.
Right now the new addition thatwe're putting on is more freezer
space because we're exportingmore and more.
We export about a load a dayinto the Asian market.
And so a lot of that product isfrozen.
I would like to grow that to twoloads a day.
But that process requiresinspection by USDA, staging
loads, holding more inventory tobuild loads.
(17:46):
And so we're adding on to ourfreezer, which will really help
us a lot.
And we're also adding on to ourcarcass cooler.
So, Yes, we're getting 500 heada day done.
The cattle are too tight.
The cattle are getting bigger,putting more and more weight
into our hot boxes.
So we're going to add on thereto allow me a full 48 hour chill
on these cattle.
We've done our own research interms of what, I mean, 36 hours
(18:09):
is what you got to have, butthat means a double shift plant
and I'm a single shift plant.
So we're going to do, we'll beable to do a full 48 hours on up
to 700 head.
And that will probably stop mefor a little bit.
And.
But the biggest reason iswastewater.
So I'm a direct discharge intothe upper Iowa River, which
means I have an NPDES permit andum, that, that's a whole other
(18:31):
process of building wastewater.
There's some new rules that arecoming our way and with the,
from the EPA under the Bidenadministration, that if they
keep coming are going to bereally hard to meet for packing
plants.
And they, you could tell thatthey were really pointed towards
animal agriculture.
And one of those things that Italk about, death by a thousand
cuts, that always poking at ourside.
(18:53):
So hopefully, under the newadministration, there's a
compromise.
Now I met with Mary Thomas aboutit just yesterday.
And I know that we're not gonnaget more relaxed.
Nobody's gonna get more relaxedon what we dump into a river,
right?
That's not gonna happen.
So there'll be more rulescoming.
But technology is better.
We're always finding ways tostay compliant, and it's been
(19:15):
amazing what we've figured out.
So just in a few
Matt (19:19):
seconds there, you touched on so many different things that
most of us listening to thispodcast go, Oh, I hadn't thought
about that.
Oh my gosh, that too.
Oh, but, so I'm going to drilldown on one of those things.
You mentioned that you'reshipping a load a day, exporting
to Asia.
Yeah.
What cuts are those?
Ed (19:36):
Oh, it's really vast.
Okay.
Um, so, So some, some of theproduct is fresh, which would be
heading over there air freightor we're putting them in smaller
boxes, so the rib, the strip,the pismo, things like that.
And a pismo would be atenderloin.
A tenderloin, yes.
And then, but then there's a lotof items that head over there
that not offal, but they wouldbe items of value that have a
(19:58):
lot of fat on them, like thenavel, the plate, the flank
plate ends.
Naval strips um, we've, there'slike 20 cuts that have been
invented for international tradeand it's because of the way
they, they consume our proteinand it's really built around the
pork belly in my opinion, a lotof fat, cook it really hot
(20:20):
really quick, slice it thin orit's boiled, things like that.
Matt (20:24):
So when you talk about a cut being invented for that.
Trade, export market.
Who is inventing those?
Ed (20:30):
It's, so example, I have some Japanese customers there.
They're wanting navels, butnavels are getting harder and
harder to come by.
Less cattle, therefore, let thenavels.
Their economies aren't doing aswell as ours.
So now they're looking forvalue, and they see that when I
trim the navels, we trim fourcorners off to square them all
up.
And they look like little ribfingers, and they buy rib
(20:51):
fingers for like 5.
50 to 6 a pound.
And he says, what are you doingwith those?
I said they're going to thefifties.
Can we bag them up?
Sure.
Let's bag them up.
Yeah.
And he's how much I said 30cents over the fifties for
bagging them up.
And so then you try to buildvalue and you know, the round
oyster is another funny littlepiece.
Oh, wow.
No one ever heard of, and it'sgoing there and short plate
(21:12):
strips.
I mean, The things, it goes onand on.
And every time they're there,they're standing at the bin
where the fifties are going inand they're grabbing pieces.
And they're like, is this, doesthis piece come all the time?
And then somebody from the fabfour will say, yeah, that's
coming from the Chuck line oryeah, that's coming from the
round.
And so we, we, we make a newcut.
Matt (21:32):
And so that's something, and again, I think most folks
listen to this, fifties would bethe trim that would go into a
grind if it weren't for you alladding value and value adding.
So those quote unquote new cuts,is that something that you all
have done?
Is that something that theprocessing segment in total has
come up with some of these waysto add value?
(21:52):
Or is that something that newproduct initiatives through
checkoff dollars are finding?
I think it's all the above,because I know that there's so
many things, way back, if we go20, 30 years back to flat iron
and a lot of these quote,unquote, new cuts that are not
so new anymore we're done witha, some type of a partnership
between Checkoff initiatives,research community, and then
(22:16):
also the Packer processorpartners and I think that's,
what's cool about this wholethought of a national
cattlemen's beef association,where we have all segments that
are looking at it because yeahIf you can sell that, what did
you call it, naval oyster?
Oh, the round oyster.
The round oyster.
If you can sell that for X centsper pound more than it would
have been in grind, that goesinto The whole value of that
(22:40):
carcass, and hopefully you canpay more for that live steer,
and he can pay more for that 550pounder, or whatever else, and
it does trickle down throughthere, whether we want to admit
that or not.
Ed (22:51):
No, it does.
It does trickle down, and wehave to do that, because we've
got to keep searching out thevalue, and it's just interesting
that it's a combination ofeverything, right?
So it's customers.
Maybe getting something fromanother packer or a version of
it and they'll, they'll send mea spec sheet.
But like for example, I was justat CAB three to four weeks ago,
and they served us what theycalled the pub steak.
(23:13):
And the pub steak comes out ofthe chuck.
And I said, are you kidding me?
It's not the flat iron, it wascoming out of the clod.
Different muscle.
Yeah and that's what'sinteresting about beef is we
break every muscle down.
I tell everybody that whenthey're at the plant.
The difference between us andpork.
is we, every muscle is pulledapart, right?
And we're finding a home for it,and we're figuring out different
(23:34):
ways to utilize it.
And I believe that will continuebecause we harvested a million
less cattle last year, right?
Than the year before.
That means there's two millionless ribeyes last year.
Somebody's gonna have to findsomething else to eat.
In terms of featuring it.
And all of a sudden, there'sgoing to be people who can't
afford the ribeye anymore.
(23:54):
Because it becomes all whitecollar.
Or white tablecloth, I mean.
and, now we've got to look forother options.
And it's crazy, as JC knows,because we're at the plant.
We take new cuts home.
And you'll have something likechuck flap or sirloin flap.
And they're, they're better thananything we've ever had.
Matt (24:12):
And that, that is so fascinating to me because it's
this nuanced thing, okay, whyare we trying to find new cuts?
Because there aren't enoughsteaks to satisfy the demand and
the demand has driven priceshigher and so we can find these
value cuts that are affordableby a bigger audience.
So, Meanwhile, we're pullingthat out of that 50 grind type
(24:32):
trim.
So, What's that mean?
There's less ground beef.
Guess what?
Americans are not going to quiteating hamburgers.
And so, what happens?
We reach out and bring moreexport We do.
Imported to the U.
S.
beef to make hamburgers.
We do.
Then all of a sudden we look atthe numbers.
Oh my gosh, look at this.
We're importing more beef thanwe've ever imported.
(24:52):
Well, Guess what?
We're selling stuff out to otherfolks, either domestically or
exported to other countries, formore money than what we're
bringing that cheap beef inthat's going to turn into a
grind anyways.
That's not to get into the wholepoliticized Trade imports and
exports deal, but that'ssomething that I think we forget
(25:13):
about when we go to gripingabout this imported beef that's
coming into us from Australia orwherever the case may be.
Well, Guess what we traded somethat was worth twice that to
them or to another country.
And so if Americans still wantground beef, we're probably
going to end up importing some.
Ed (25:31):
We're in a world market.
And I say that all the time now,like I was somewhere and
somebody was complaining about.
How much Brazilian product wasmaking it into China.
And I, I remember I said thatmeans there's a hole somewhere.
Yeah.
Because the Brazilian productwas going somewhere and now
there's an opportunity forsomebody else.
And so it's just this big voidthat's created every once in a
(25:54):
while when we move thingsaround.
And you're right.
We're making a big, we'resending a lot of fat over to the
Asian markets.
Therefore.
We got to bring lean in and it'sgoing to come from places like
Australia and Uruguay.
Yeah, that's
Matt (26:07):
that world market is it's got a lot of moving parts and
especially as we look at thedollar fluctuating and its value
and what we can how competitiveor Uncompetitive that we are
with other countries because oftheir currency.
And then you throw in the Trumpeffect.
And um, I mean, most everybodylistening here is going to be in
(26:28):
agreement that, that there aremore good than bad as we look at
this administrative change..
But one of the question marksis, what's going to happen when
we say, okay, we've been relyingon, pick a region, Asia, for
selling a load a day to them.
We go to a some kind of a tariffon some of their products coming
(26:52):
in and what's that happened forours going out?
What do you all see in thecoming weeks months years?
How is that gonna affect upperIowa and some of your business
decisions?
Ed (27:02):
I mean
Matt (27:03):
I
Ed (27:04):
Worry about a little bit, but then I get reminded.
We're in a world market.
So for every action There's areaction which will open up the
door for another customer,right?
And, And I've been over therenow.
I'm going to actually be headedover there in March.
We'll be in Japan, Hong Kong,and Taiwan, customers of ours.
And I've also been in China.
Um, they have to buy proteinfrom somebody.
(27:25):
Those countries have to, fromsomebody.
So, If it's not ours, it'll besomebody else's.
And then, therefore, ours willgo to wherever that hole was
created.
So I'm not that worried aboutit.
What does probably worry me themost when I'm over there is
Their economies aren't doing aswell as ours.
Our dollar's strong.
They don't have the inflationthat we have.
I hope it doesn't trickle intous.
(27:46):
I mean, I saw that a year ago.
Still hasn't happened to us,right?
We're still having good economicgrowth.
Part of it, I think, is just howmature our economy is, too.
We have a really robust, strongeconomy.
And we are self sustaining.
That's the other thing youreally quickly learn when you're
flying into Korea.
And no natural resources, can'traise enough food to take care
(28:08):
of themselves, and have nofossil fuels, can't make their
own energy.
The United States is a veryunique place.
Matt (28:16):
Yeah, and I think we take that for granted.
Especially those of us who havenot gotten the opportunity to
see the parts of the world thatyou have seen.
And we just assume that, yeah,we hear there's differences, and
they're a little less selfsufficient.
But yeah, when you go into aplace like that, that has to
import all their energy andtheir food, my goodness, I take
(28:37):
for granted the level ofbargaining power that we have
here in the United States.
So let's talk about thosePacific Rim, Asian markets.
you know, We'd like to thinkabout that.
Shabu or that, that steak thatthe Japanese are putting on
their flat top griddle orwhatever the case may be, but a
lot of what they buy is stuffthat Not many of us Americans
(28:58):
want to or are willing to eatsometimes wouldn't even be able
to grind that into, to fiftiesin a hamburger market.
What are some of the cuts orsome of those pieces that you're
sending?
wherever, but specifically tothe Pacific ram and Asian market
that we don't think about it andhow important, how much is that
(29:19):
drop credit and some of thatoffal to your profitability
there in the processing segment.
So I really
Ed (29:25):
don't export a lot of offal.
I export some like my tripes.
I do some exporting on, butbecause I'm a smaller packer, I
don't make loads of livers and Idon't make loads of kidneys.
But on the flip side, Thedomestic market has become so
diverse that I don't need to.
So I look at a customer likeQuaker Valley in Philadelphia.
(29:46):
Extremely diverse town,Philadelphia.
So he's buying prime, middles,all the way down to the cheapest
stuff he can find that's aprotein for different customers.
So livers and kidneys all theodd things that you can think
of.
The flexor tendons and thingslike that.
Because he has different pricepoints to meet, for different
(30:07):
people that live in thePhiladelphia community.
And ethnicities.
Yes.
Yeah.
And so he's got his Asiandivision, he's got his Hispanic
groups that are needingdifferent things.
And then he's got his his whitecollar and his blue collar.
and so we are putting loadstogether, when you look at it,
it's like almost every cut is onthere.
And it, it's amazing to me, andthey're distributors that, that
(30:31):
have 50 trucks that go out everyday and deliver 1 to 10 boxes of
something to, to theircustomers.
Matt (30:38):
So has that market grown from, just from your standpoint?
Are they selling more of thosekidneys and livers and things
like that?
And if so, why?
Is that strictly because of adifferent changing in ethnicity
or are there more people?
More Americans that are goingback to eating some of those
organ type meats.
Ed (30:59):
I don't know if it's really a traditional Americans.
I think it is the ethnic groups.
And they, they're always lookingat price points.
It's interesting.
When I talk to Quaker Valley,I'm going to pick on Dan
diamond.
Cause he's a younger guy who'srunning the buy there now.
He'll see stuff on my pricesheet.
And they'll say well, what areyou doing with those Chuck Spare
Ribs?
And I'm like well, I'm at a 1.
50 on them.
(31:19):
Well, I need something with thatdollar something range because
all of a sudden now neck bonesare too high and hind shanks are
too high, but I need somethingthat'll fit into their price
point for soups and they want aprotein of some sort.
And so it's constantly that way,
Matt (31:34):
it's like a guy sitting in the uh, uh, sale barn that had
an order for.
Five weight calves that lookedlike this and they got too high
and he decided okay, I'm gonnado the math I'm yeah, I'm gonna
figure in loss and things likethat But I'm gonna trade down
and it's the same way all theway through the beef chain Yeah,
the whole way and I think that'swhat we have to recognize and
that's something that Uh, yousaid you were too small to be
(31:58):
able to export loads of livers.
Like livers to Egypt.
Yeah.
What about these folks that arestill at or smaller than you
were when you started andprocessing eight head a day or
three head a day?
What are they doing with those?
Because they're probably
Ed (32:15):
paying somebody to dump them.
Are they not?
It was really hard when Istarted.
When I was just getting starteduntil we kind of hit that.
250 head a day.
It was really a struggle.
Those offal items, you'd have tolet them build up in the
freezer.
Um, I wasn't even washing thetripes yet.
And you're not very good at it.
You couldn't build it up.
So that, those stuff, that's thethings that were just, they were
(32:37):
just going to rendering.
And so you're getting anywherefrom six to twenty cents, twenty
cents a pound for them.
Just going right out there torendering when they should be
bringing a dollar fifty.
to 4 a pound.
Matt (32:50):
And so how, as we talk about a more resilient food
chain or supply chain I had Dr.
Temple Grandin on here a year orso ago and, and she was talking
about that big is, is notresilient as we get larger
plants that are not spread outas much and she was saying we
need more plants that are yoursize and lower but the challenge
(33:12):
is how do you capture speciallysome of these really small
butcher plants that are justdoing a few head a week can they
survive as we go forth if theycan't capture that 4 a pound for
some of this off all and dropcredit instead of, you know, a
few cents or even having to paysomebody to haul it off as
(33:33):
waste?
Ed (33:34):
Yeah, so now that I'm at 500 head a day, I believe in terms
of economic efficiencies and mycost to operate, I've gotten
pretty close to some of thebigger plants.
As far as I can tell, thatnumber is really hard to find
out, right?
There's probably four or fivepeople that know what that
number is on a cost per head,and I believe I'm getting down
there.
(33:55):
But what does concern me is Theyall have rendering and they all
have grinds and I'm missingthat.
And they also all have hideprocessing facilities.
And so I look at all those and Isay well, if they can make 10 a
head on each of those threesegments, there's 30 right
there.
And that, that's what worries mebecause that means I've got to
(34:16):
get an extra 30 just to be evenwith them out of the cuts that
they're already making.
So that means.
We need to do everything just alittle bit better and we try to
like when if you're here I havesome customers here and you talk
to them They'll always bragabout how good our cuts look and
how our box looks and I remindthe people that work for me we
(34:37):
have to be a little bit betterall the time because I'm gonna
ask more.
I'm gonna ask a fair amount morefor my ribeye that than anybody
else But we have to make surewe're bringing value to them
too.
So that ribeye better be nice,it better be sorted right.
And that is the hardest part ofwhere I am today.
It's having that vision thatwe're gonna be a little bit
(34:59):
better.
But in the beginning, you'regonna sell it under the market.
And you're gonna be a little bitbetter.
And I'll have a plant managersay to me why are we gonna make
the ribeye nicer than one of themajors?
And yet you're going to get lessfor it.
And I'm like, because we have tobuild up.
Matt (35:16):
Get your foot in the door.
Ed (35:17):
Yeah.
Matt (35:17):
Yeah.
Ed (35:18):
There's no other way to do it.
Matt (35:19):
So of the different requests, and I'm not going to
say complaints, I'm going to sayrequests that your customers
give you, what is it that's atthe absolute top of the list?
Is it consistency of size?
Is it quality and marbling?
What, What is it they want?
It's
Ed (35:37):
really trim specs.
Everybody's after trim specs.
Everything needs to look thesame.
Yeah, they want them to look thesame.
It's, presentation in the box isgetting to be big.
We just started for the firsttime doing a three way sword on
our rib eyes.
We used to always pull theheavies off.
Now I've got a light rib eye, anaverage, and a heavy.
And really, it's I'm not gettingless for either one of them.
(35:58):
Heavy's a little bit at timesare hard to sell, but I have
customers that said, we don'tmind getting that light ribeye.
We just don't want it into thebox with the medium, because we
want to be able to open it upand say, we're cutting the light
rib eyes this way thicker, butthen we're cutting these over
here, or we have customers whoinsists that.
That they want to have an inchand a half thick or an inch
(36:20):
thick steak, but they can't getit out of a 17 pound ribeye.
And so we're sorting things,started doing that with the
briskets.
And what happens over time isyou build a reputation for
having a really nice brisket.
So retailers like a lighterbrisket that's smaller.
Barbecuers want a great big onewith a lot of fat.
(36:42):
Yes, they do.
And when you sort them now, allof a sudden you get pull through
is what I call it.
And this takes forever for acustomer to tell a distributor.
No, I don't want the Tyson box.
I want upper Iowa beef brisketand then you have them.
Then you got it.
Then I can start to add a littlebit on little bits at a time.
So as you
Matt (37:02):
let's go back to those rib eyes.
What?
from a either square inch sizeor, ribeye size or a total
poundage per rib, what are thosebreakouts on your light, middle,
and heavy ribs?
Ed (37:15):
Today we've we're still trying to figure out what that
right break is on the light.
We're using 14 and under for mylight, then 14 to 17 for my
average.
Square inches?
Nope.
Pounds per rib.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
If you were to measure them up,they're going to be bigger.
But yeah, it's pounds.
The gals in packaging areweighing them.
And so they know which box toput them into.
(37:36):
And then 17 pounds and up aregoing into the heavy box.
we're doing the same thing withthe briskets.
So under 12 pounds, we call alight brisket.
They go to retail because theaverage smoker at home, he
doesn't need.
A 14, 15 pound brisket, asmaller one is all they really
need.
Yeah.
Cause we're no longer going tosay
Matt (37:57):
that it doesn't fit the box.
It doesn't fit the Traeger.
Some of these briskets out ofthese 1800 pound live type of
steers, they're so big andsometimes so fat.
Yeah.
They may not even fit on thathome.
Barbecuer's smoker
Ed (38:11):
yeah.
And that is what is reallyinteresting that um, COVID.
taught people a new world rightthat they could have white
tablecloth food at home andreally it's not that expensive
so it may seem high to buy thatwhole brisket but if you do the
math on how many people you fedcompared to going out it's
(38:34):
pretty reasonable
Matt (38:36):
well especially and I always talk about beef as an
experience and if we do it rightAnd we make it right, and it
eats well, it is a replacement,not for a cheap chicken dinner,
it is a replacement for going tothe movie theater, or to the
(38:56):
ball game, or whatever else, andyou make it an event, and if
that event costs you a hundreddollars to feed four people,
instead of 50, and yet they allbragged on ya?
That was well worth theadditional 50 bucks.
And if we can make beef, timeafter time, whether it is that
value cut, or whether it is thatprime strip steak, rib eye,
(39:18):
whatever the case may be, if wecan make that an experience, and
allow that mom or dad to go homeand them look like the hero,
There's no telling what we cancharge for those retail
Ed (39:31):
cats.
And then I watch the nextgeneration coming up who I
believe is very conscientious ofwhat they eat.
And now we talk about cleanlabels.
And what's interesting aboutbeef is it is one of the
proteins that can maintain itsclean label the whole way
through.
So if you buy a ribeye, youdon't have to put anything on it
(39:51):
and it's still going to eatalright.
Same with the brisket.
But everything else, you usuallygot to top it with something,
right?
Matt (39:58):
Yeah, or they already have topped it and the ingredient
list is a mile long.
And when you buy that, slab ofbeef on a tray, there's one
ingredient.
Beef.
Ed (40:07):
Yeah.
And I think that's, I think itis, and I think we also don't
need to worry about how big theportion sizes are.
I don't think they're going toeat as much as I traditionally
would have, right?
But we don't need to worry aboutthat.
There's a lot of people.
you know, when I go to Asia andthey're ordering a few ounces,
don't worry about it.
There's so many
Matt (40:26):
of them.
So we've talked about portionsize here on a lot of past
podcasts.
And I always ask folks that whenwe go down this road, as we see
these 17 and 18 and 20 inch 20square inch ribeyes that people
want cut an inch and a halfthick, like you said, do, in
your opinion, Do consumers havea problem with cutting that
(40:50):
ribeye into three pieces or twopieces or six pieces, whatever
the case may be?
Can we make this portion sizeand thickness of steak work with
a
Ed (41:00):
knife?
Absolutely.
And I have not seen it at theretail level yet, but I've seen
it at white tableclothrestaurants.
And so one of the bestrestaurants where I go to is at
Helen in Birmingham, Alabama.
And I watched it come out acouple orders of porterhouse and
it is a monster.
But it's already sliced up forthem.
So the presentation isbeautiful.
(41:20):
So what these chefs are gettinggood at, instead of bringing it
out and you sharing a plate,they cut it back there.
It's already cut.
Put it back together.
Lay it in between the two ofyou.
And you're grabbing your pieces.
So yeah, you want sometenderloin or you want some
strip.
And I believe they could startto do that for three or four
people.
But the key is presentation.
(41:42):
The chef's got to cut it right.
It's got to do a good job ofcutting it and when they do it
it's, it is unbelievable, Ithink, what we can do with this
stuff.
Matt (41:51):
Yeah I think that is another creative way that we, as
an industry, including our foodservice and chef partners, can
address this problem withoutjust saying well, we're feeding
them too long, or well, you seedstock guys have made them too
big.
Now, We've had plenty ofpodcasts talking about the other
consequences back home andfeeding that cow that's The
(42:13):
sister of that steer that'sgonna be an 1, 800 pound live
weight and so those are thingsthat we have to figure out with
more creativity back home andnutrition and management and
Selection and things like that.
But yeah, the portion size ofthings we've argued about for
years that we've got All theseribeyes are too big well That's
(42:34):
easily remedied with a knife, inmy opinion.
And a little bit of, like yousaid, creativity.
People are getting
Ed (42:39):
used to it.
I mean, My wife and I splitsalads for gosh sake's sake.
We're these places we go,everybody splits the dessert
now.
Yeah.
I think that's a very commonthing.
And I, I don't know why a houseof, a mom and dad and a couple
kids wouldn't do the same thingwith a bone in ribeye.
Presentation, just grab thepieces you want, and um, we're
(42:59):
not going to stop making thembigger.
I mean, Just data shows that.
We're never going to, we'realways going to keep raising
more corn per acre.
Pigs are going to keep gettingbigger, chickens are going to
get bigger.
It's just, that's capitalism,isn't it?
Matt (43:13):
Yeah, it is, and you know, the age old argument is that
there's something in that chainthat won't allow them to
continue to get bigger.
And I remember it used to be.
These carcasses are dragging offthe rails, clear to the floor.
That was in the late nineties.
The first time I heard that, andI've had other people say that
(43:33):
that was even said back in thesixties, you know, when we, when
we had the belt buckle cattle,these cattle, these carcasses
just can't get any bigger.
And yet, like you said, everyyear, it's as linear of a chart
as we look at five pounds peryear per carcass.
After you figure out a few ofthe ups and downs because the
corn market and things likethat.
But yeah, I, I.
(43:54):
As much as I hate to admit it,as a rancher, who's trying to
make cows fit an environment,the economics, until we go to
buying cattle differently, andyou all go to saying, you know
what, there is enough pushbackfrom an animal welfare
standpoint, all these otherthings, until the industry says,
you know what, enough's enough,we're going to send signals to
(44:16):
make an optimum right size, andthat size is going to be
Whatever it is, we're not gonna,we're not gonna quit.
Because the handwriting's on thewall.
It's it makes us more money.
It makes you more money.
It's more efficient.
It's part of the beast.
Ed (44:31):
The pack spec thing at the packing plant, we've seen that.
You know, We try to put threechuck rolls in a box.
That's an industry standard.
I now put two in a box for myheavy chuck roll.
And it, it says right on theside, heavy chuck roll.
Because they were weighing over90 pounds.
And it was a problem for liftingthem.
It was a problem for boxintegrity.
And so, we'll always find a way.
(44:53):
That's the beauty of the U.
S.
Is capitalism always finds a wayto solve a problem, right?
Well, I think as
Matt (45:01):
we kind of wrap up our discussion, that's what you did.
That's all the way through youfound a way when you got done at
Iowa State went back home andsaid, oh my gosh I as much as I
want to farm and run cows Thisisn't gonna work.
Let's find a way went to theIowa cattlemen's and you solved
issues there And you ran upagainst brick wall after brick
(45:23):
wall with ID and all thesediscussions and you said We're
gonna find a way and just allthe way through and even to
today Coming into the processingsegment because you thought you
needed to find a way of doing itbetter.
I mean, inspiring to me that wehave folks like yourself running
these halls and running theroads of U.
(45:46):
S.
and I guess of the world.
That instead of making aFacebook post and being pissed
off because this segment or thatsegment isn't treating me right.
You found a way and continue todo so and I think that's what
all of us need to aspire to do.
Ed (46:02):
Yeah, we really are in unique times.
So I get to travel a lot, right?
I'm in all the big cities and Idress just like Matt does.
I never change the way I dress.
Always a cowboy hat and a pairof boots.
But people really want to talkto us.
And they really do.
I still believe that we are theroyalty of the U.
S., the Cowboy is, and theCattleman.
(46:23):
But what's interesting aboutthat show, Yellowstone, even
though I don't watch it, and Ihear about it everywhere I go,
for the first time, I have a lotof people that see me in an
airport and don't think Cowboy.
They think the boss.
He's Kevin Costner.
You know, Whenever you go wherethey always thought Cowboy hat
means cowboy.
Sure.
When You and I don't do a lot ofcowboying, really, do we?
(46:45):
Well, I still get to,
Matt (46:48):
but you're right, it's not the top of the priorities.
Yeah,
Ed (46:51):
and so now they see a guy who's the boss and he's raising
beef, raising food.
Raising a family.
Yes, now there's some thingsabout that show that we don't
do, right?
Matt (47:04):
I agree, we don't have a train station, you might, but
But I, I agree, and my Montanafriends always just get furious
when I say Yellowstone's notnecessarily a bad thing for the
beef industry because it has, Ithink, and actually Ethan Lane
this morning in that D.
C.
issues update for NCBA jokinglysaid that Taylor Sheridan has
(47:29):
brought all of the issues thathe has to lobby the D.
C.
bureaucracy and The Congress andeverybody else, the
administration, he's brought allof those issues to light and
given just enough of a dramaticperspective on generational
transfer of ownership and thechallenges that they have.
(47:50):
On working together as a familywho may or may not all get
along.
Labor issues and animal health,and disease, and all of these
different things.
Consumer misperceptions aboutbeef, and how it's raised, all
these different things.
Yellowstone's brought that, notjust shed a little bit of light,
but brought it into the culturalnorm.
(48:12):
And I think there's benefit inthat.
Now, again, do we do things likeBeth does?
I hope not, usually.
Um, Usually.
But there is value in it.
And I think that we as beefcattle producers, whether it's
at the top of the supply chainor at the bottom raising
genetics to start the thing, Ithink we have to recognize that
(48:34):
there's value in that and wehave to embrace that and Know
that the consumer craves thatand they crave it for their own
life and their only connectionmay be that opportunity to buy a
cut of beef that we raised, youprocessed and delivered to that
retailer and there's huge valuein that if we do it right.
If we all do our part of it tomake sure that's a good
(48:57):
experience.
Ed (48:58):
100 percent and the consumer is really quite smart.
They're very educated.
Oh man, big time.
So when I talk to them.
I don't have to, you know, wetalk about sustainability and
group that likes to pick on usreally a lot about greenhouse
gases, right?
Cattle have been classified asthe polluter of the world and
greenhouse gases and land usageand water usage.
(49:19):
And yet when I sit and talk tothem and say yeah, the cow does
emit some methane when she eatsforages, but I don't think
that's our real problem.
And I'm sitting in the middle ofan airport or in the middle of a
city.
And I said, you know, when I'mat home, the sky is blue.
I don't see this haze like youguys.
That's and they understand thatthey get it.
(49:43):
They get that.
We don't have to say that we'recarbon neutral.
We just got to talk about whatwe do and why we do it and how
the cow is utilizing land thatcan't be done anything else
with.
We're not going to raise otherfood off of it.
Matt (49:56):
And as we have those conversations, I think the thing
that I have witnessed, whetherit's me talking or watching
someone like yourself do thatcommunicating, the thing that
happens is in that conversation,whether we have the exact facts
or figures or whether we havegotten to that point where we
can Without a shadow of a doubtmeasure how much methane that
(50:18):
we're producing and howsustainable our industry might
be and all these benchmarks thatwe're trying to get at.
Somewhere in that conversationwith that person who is saying
that we're trying to kill theenvironment and them in the
process.
They see just how much passionand how much we care about what
it is we do.
About keeping green spacesgreen.
(50:39):
About keeping ruminants on areasof the country that can't grow
corn, can't grow lettuce orstrawberries or oranges or kale
or whatever it is that theythink we all should be eating.
When we demonstrate how much itmeans to us and to our family
and to our kids and their kidsand sustaining this ranch or
farm or feedlot or processingplant all the way into the
(51:00):
future, That's generally whatdoes more for our cause, if you
will, than any facts or figuresare telling them that we are
carbon neutral or we aren't.
And I, again, I go back to theYellowstone effect.
There's a lot of passion in thatshow.
Sometimes it's X rated, butthere's a lot of passion there.
(51:21):
We have a lot of passion forwhatever it is we do every day
out here on the farms andranches.
And I think that's what we haveto convey.
For too many years, we haveassumed that they know that
we're doing everything we can tofeed them.
We're doing everything we can tomake sure and sustain this
business and this industry andthis culture into the next
(51:41):
generation.
And we haven't felt like we hadto tell them.
It's time that we finally tellthat story.
as often and as loudly as whatwe can.
Ed (51:51):
And don't apologize.
That is the one thing that I'vealways said about cattlemen is
we're truthful.
Yeah.
We're not very good at tellinglies, right?
Yeah, that's for sure.
And so just tell it.
Exactly.
Tell the story.
Don't hide it.
Don't hold back.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Matt (52:02):
And that's, that's, it takes us, it takes all of us.
We can't rely on somebody else.
Well, The beef check off isgoing to do that for us.
Or well, the packer ought to bedoing that because they're,
they've got the connections withthe retailer or whatever.
It takes us all.
It does.
It takes all of us.
And um, we've got a great storyto tell.
And we just need to tell it.
Yeah.
That probably sums it up prettywell.
(52:22):
And, And yeah, I appreciate uh,bringing this whole circle.
Yeah.
It's been great.
And keep up the good work andstay in touch.
And again, thanks for sharingthe story of Upper Iowa Beef and
Ed Griman and everything canstop in any time for a tour.
All right.
Sounds great.
Thanks a bunch.
Ed.
All right.
Thank you.
Thanks for tuning in toPractically Ranching, brought to
you by Dalebanks Angus.
(52:42):
If you liked this show, even ifyou didn't, share it with
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can keep cranking'em out.
We're about sold out of ourprivate treaty bulls, but if you
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If you'd like information on anyof these registered groups,
(53:04):
email me atmattperrier@dalebanks.com.
God bless you all, and I lookforward to visiting again soon.
Thanks for joining us forepisode 72 of Practically
Ranching.
I'm Matt Perrier and we are herethanks to Dalebanks Angus, your
home for practical profitablegenetics since 1904.
This episode rounds out thegroup of conversations that I
recorded while I was at 2025Cattle Industry Convention last
(00:26):
February.
This was actually the first oneI recorded in San Antonio, but
given my guest's perspectives onthe the beef business, I thought
this would make the perfectfinale.
Ed Greiman is general manager ofUpper Iowa Beef, so for the last
few years he's been a packer.
(00:48):
He's also a cattle feeder andowns a commercial cow calf herd
and a row crop farming operationwith his family, and as if these
segments didn't give him enoughbreadth and width of
perspective.
He also has served as both astaff member and a volunteer
leader of the Iowa Cattleman'sAssociation through the years I.
(01:11):
So to say that Ed has a prettybroad perspective of the beef
supply and production chainwould be an understatement, a
huge understatement.
The first time I remembermeeting Ed was probably around
10 years ago at an NCBAconvention.
He was the chair of the LiveCattle Marketing Committee, and
(01:35):
I watched him oversee one of themore contentious discussions
that I may be ever witnessedamongst a Cattleman's group.
He didn't have an easy jobthere.
I.
Because passions were high andconsensus was low, and a lot of
us in that room continued todebate about how the best way to
(01:57):
determine a base price for fedcattle was.
At the time, all I knew about Edwas that he was an Iowa cattle
feeder, and he had a littledifferent perspective on fed
cattle marketing than a lot ofmy peers and I did.
But I was impressed.
I was impressed with hisdedication to the industry, his
(02:18):
passion for the industry.
He was very diplomatic in a timethat he didn't probably have to
be, but was, and the thing thatimpressed me most was his
determination to solve theseproblems and these industry
issues instead of justcomplaining about them.
Now, today, as I mentioned, he.
(02:39):
For the most part is a packer,regardless of whether he's
wearing that hard hat, or hiscowboy hat or a seed corn cap,
I've actually never seen him inone of those before, but I'll
bet he owns a few) ed is a supersmart guy.
He is a super competitive guy,and he is a guy that I am glad
to have in our beef industry.
(03:01):
I learned a bunch from him, andI think you will as well as we
visit with Ed Greiman.
Ed (03:08):
Yeah, my background's kind of unique.
So, uh, Graduated from IowaState University in 1992.
Um, Was your typical Iowa farmthat I grew up on, cattle, pigs
row crops, alfalfa, so lookedvery typical north central Iowa.
Went to Iowa State University,the only reason I went, I was
going to be on the judging team.
I liked to judge I was reallygood at it in 4 H, did not go to
(03:31):
a junior college, went straightthere.
But ended up getting on themeats judging team first.
FC Parish grabbed a hold of me Ihad a cousin who had been on
before me.
And so That was my first eyeopener into the meat business,
is the Meats Judging Team.
None of us had ever been inpacking plants, right?
And that was really new.
Meats Judging Team, live team,left Iowa State, go home to
(03:53):
farm.
Got home to farm, we'd just comeout of the 80s.
The situation at home probablywasn't good enough for me to
come and farm, but I had myheadset on it.
So very quickly I figured thatout financially.
It was clear that my dad was notgoing to continue farming.
So I got a job with the IowaCattlemen's.
Kept farming, got a job with theIowa Cattlemen's.
My wife worked for Monsanto thewhole time.
(04:14):
So she was an Iowa State grad.
A little bit more ag business,but agronomy background.
And so, Of course, there wasalways enough money to put food
on the table, right?
And to have a car.
So, I went to work for the IowaCattlemen's.
And that really opened up myeyes.
They let me do what I needed todo.
I traveled all over Iowa.
Before you know it, my firstproject was Source and Age
(04:35):
Verified Electronic Tags in1998.
Oh, wow.
98.
Yeah.
What concerns me about that is20 some years later, we're still
nowhere.
We're still the same button.
Yeah, I'm amazed.
The same button.
And, you know, I've tried torestart it a couple times at my
feed yard and the packing plant.
And it just seems liketechnology is going nowhere with
(04:57):
that.
It's really frustrating, right?
And, you would just think thatsomewhere we're going to
simplify it.
But anyway, Iowa Cattlemen's,and in that process, which was
unique it was called IowaQuality Beef.
We partnered up with Cargill.
And in that partnership withCargill, We were going to send
2, 000 head a week to Schuyler,Nebraska out of Iowa.
(05:17):
And it was the first cattle thathad ever been on grid marketing.
So it was rib eye area, backfat, full yield grades, quality
grade scores, individual carcassweights with electronic tags.
So my job was to schedule those2, 000 a week and then work with
producers to understand how tointerpret all the data they got
back.
And it was the first time they'dever been paid premiums for
(05:38):
quality grade and yield gradeand cutability, right?
And so So, those guys atCargill, I got into the plant a
lot because we were looking atCarcostata and then, because it
was 2000 a week, some peoplelike you know, Tim Ramey who ran
the north and then I got to knowBill Thoni, Marcine Moldenhauer
(05:58):
I just learned a lot, right?
And I started to get thisappreciation for the packing
plant.
In that process, we were goingto open up a plant, a new plant
with them.
That kind of didn't happen, andso we partnered with American
Foods and opened up Tama Tama,Iowa.
And it ran for a very shorttime.
And so, I was one of the guysthat raised the capital with 800
(06:21):
producers who were going todeliver cattle.
It was really modeled after U.
S.
Premium Beef and National.
And, we had one flaw though.
U.
S.
Premium National was is thatfarmland plant was actually
doing okay.
They just needed a good supplyof cattle.
We were a start up.
American Foods was not reallyknown for a quality side.
(06:45):
So we were bringing qualitycattle, but it was a new venture
for them.
And then BSE came along in 03and that just ended it, right?
But the one thing that botheredme that whole time is I was
there every day scheduling thosecattle is that it didn't work.
And yet the cattle wereeverything they were supposed to
be.
And so I just felt like wemissed out on an opportunity,
(07:06):
but I also saw how hard
Matt (07:07):
it was.
You had a cultural problemwithin that group, AFG, and not
necessarily a cattle problem.
Yes.
National and USP& B may havebeen the opposite.
Ed (07:15):
And the same thing happened to us there that happens to
almost every startup plant.
We had a partner at the time inBuckhead Beef.
Okay.
They were an independent companyat the time.
They got bought by Sysco, and itcame to an end.
Just like that, our partner wasgone for the high quality
middles.
Matt (07:31):
Yeah, and if you don't have that um, I mean obviously
the end cuts and the offal andeverything else, we'll talk
about that a little bit later.
They drive cash flow, but yeah,you've got to have that high
end, middle meat customer that'sgonna really drive value
Ed (07:46):
into it.
You do, and you've got to havethat core that you know is
always going to be gone on somekind of a formula marketing.
And we lost that.
So that was always, I went homefrom there.
I left the Iowa Cattlemen's atthat point.
Went home, farmed.
Did my thing for a while, grewthe operation.
What year was that?
That would have been 2005.
(08:07):
There was no hope.
We tried to get somebody to openup the plant.
It wasn't going to happen.
So then I went back to Garnerfull time.
And grew the operation.
So we're now Cow Calf.
I'm with my brother.
My brother was there the wholetime.
So G.
B.
Cattle.
His wife also worked forMonsanto.
So Greiman Brothers.
Cow Calf.
Commercial Cow Calf.
Which would be fall cabin herdand a spring cabin herd and
(08:29):
really when I say spring I meanJanuary February like we're
wrapping up right now, right?
Yeah, and then Feed lot so we'dbe your typical feed lot in Iowa
with a lot of buildings deepbedded buildings.
I don't have any slats and So Idid that and just grew our
operation And then I becamepresident of the Iowa
Cattlemen's.
(08:50):
Kind of Got back involved as avolunteer, right?
Became president of the IowaCattlemen's.
Then did, chaired live cattlemarketing for National
Cattlemen's Association.
And that's when I was with JoeCavanda, he was my vice chair.
That really opened up my eyes toanother world, right?
Of bigger feed yards and riskmanagement.
And I learned a lot about, Iunderstood risk management.
(09:12):
But I, it opened my eyes to abigger world of it.
And then, did a little projectalong with that called the Fed
Cattle Exchange, right?
And so worked with the fourmajor packers on it, got to know
the heads of procurements.
And it always was in the back ofmy mind that the packing plant
was always drawing me in.
And so did all that, and then anopportunity came up in 2017.
(09:36):
When Jerry Niewohner out ofAlbion, Nebraska called and
said, Ed, we need to open up alittle packing plant in Iowa
that right now has been shutdown.
it was called Upper Iowa Beef orLime Springs Beef at the time.
It's on the Upper Iowa River.
It's in Lime Springs, Iowa.
And there was 50 cattlemen thathad opened it up.
It was a plant that was designedto do 60 to 100 head a day.
(09:57):
so we went in there, tried topartner with those guys.
And it was within a year We hadbought them out and started to
grow.
And I would never have been ableto do that without the backing
of the Niewohners in Nebraska.
So a family with severalgenerations had access to
(10:18):
capital, right?
Because that's what packingplants need, is capital.
But the cattle were there,really good cattle, and and it
started that way, the first dayin 2017, it was November of 2017
was the first day we opened it,did eight head.
Got, we're supposed to do 11head, got shut down at number
eight for a mis knock because itwas a, a heifer that sat up.
(10:41):
And then we were done for theweek until we could get work
through that with USDA.
Wow.
Things that cowboys
Matt (10:47):
don't think about until they have to run that plant.
Ed (10:50):
Oh yeah, humane handling's everything.
Yeah, we talk a lot about foodsafety, it's important, but
humane handling is That one willget you in a lot of trouble in a
hurry.
Matt (10:59):
I think it's fascinating, and we'll keep going from where
we're at, because we're nowherenear the end of your story, but
I think I had met you once ortwice before, but until I was
attending those NationalCattlemen's Beef Association
meetings as president of KLA,while you and Joe were chair and
vice chair of the Live CattleMarketing and working through
(11:19):
the Fed Cattle Exchange, thatwas a big thing on my radar was,
and this is quote unquote clearback in 2016 that I was saying
we've got to figure out if wecan do better at pricing fed
cattle for the base that thengrids and formulas and
everything else can be based offof and You know in a state like
(11:40):
Kansas I didn't necessarily geta ton of traction there, but we
get to these NCBA meetings andYou all were Hip deep in it
already and trying as the NCBAgroup to figure out how do we do
better at this?
A producer led initiativeworking with folks from the feed
yard and the packing and the cowcalf segments, just like NCBA is
(12:02):
supposed to be.
And through that, as frustratedas all of us got, because we
never really could get, at thatpoint, we never could get an
answer.
We thought we could.
You know, We talked to all theexperts and the guy from
Colorado State that did theeconomic study and all these
things.
Dr.
Coons.
Dr.
Coons, thank you.
We heard it all.
(12:23):
And we heard what could be andyet we never could get at what
should be and what will be.
And instead of just getting madand packing your stuff and going
home, you decided, hey, you knowwhat?
I've learned a little bitthrough this process, and here's
an opportunity with these folksat Upper Iowa Beef I'm gonna let
(12:44):
the rubber meet the road,instead of just sitting at home
and bitching.
And that's what I think isinspiring to me, is you said,
hey, I believe that we can dobetter, I believe there's a need
for this type of a structure,now let's figure out how to do
it.
Ed (12:57):
That's exactly right there's a lot of people that got really
frustrated, threw up their arms,and I wasn't one of those, I
just said, All right.
This is the system we're in.
We're not going to completelychange it, right?
Feedlots are going to stayaligned with packers.
And so let's figure out how wecan do that ourselves.
And I did it really trulymyself.
(13:18):
I knew the heads of procurementsvery well.
I became friends with them.
But I'm a small yard.
I'm selling three to fourthousand head a year.
And I kept telling them I, Iwant the premium that this guy's
getting, or I want theopportunity.
And because I couldn't do thenumbers the volume of numbers
that the other feedlots weredoing I wasn't able to achieve
some of the things that I wantedto achieve at my feed yard.
(13:40):
So, I always knew that the bestway to do this, probably in
Iowa, would be to start apacking plant.
But I also knew, when JerryNiewohner called me, And he
said, Ed, let's do this.
I told him, I said, Jerry,you're going to take 10 years of
my life and just, it's going tobe gone.
And I said, the amount ofcapital that you're going to
need to put in this.
(14:00):
If you have a number in mind,you better take it times three.
And I hope that's enough.
Matt (14:06):
Yeah.
That is a critical part that Idon't think any of us can even
wrap our head around, andespecially in times that we've
seen the increase in.
Cattle prices labor, cattleprices, regulations, that's the
tip of the iceberg, I know, butyeah, I mean, this thing has
been fast and furious since youall started, and yet, somehow,
(14:28):
thus far, you've been able tokeep it going.
We have.
And growing.
Ed (14:31):
It's kind of funny so, Jerry and I would talk once a week,
right?
And uh, not every day, he reallylet me do what I needed to do,
but now that we, once we kind ofmade it and started to make some
money I told him one day, Isaid, the only reason I, there
was a lot of days I wanted tojust go home and be done.
And the only reason I kept doingthis is because you kept sending
money and he made me feel so badthat I had to keep working.
(14:54):
And he said I kept sending moneybecause you kept coming to work.
Matt (14:58):
He was afraid you
weren't.
Ed (15:00):
So both of us were miserable, I guess, for a little
while because he had threebrothers that he had to explain
what he's doing and a bank,what's going on here.
What?
Why do we keep subsidizing thisnew venture?
And
Matt (15:13):
all the way through it though, there was light at the
end of the tunnel for those whobelieve that this system could
work.
And I think that anytime we seesomebody enter either a new
business or try to reconstructthe new concept or whatever the
case may be if you don't believethat it can be better and that
there's a purpose in what it isyou're doing.
(15:34):
Yeah, you can't, you're notgoing to keep throwing.
No, No,
Ed (15:36):
you have to believe because it is so hard.
But I got to tell you, Matt I, Iwake up every morning scared to
death still.
And it's, you know, my wife'slike, what are you, what are you
worried about?
I said, failure.
I don't want to be another plantthat didn't make it.
Because you really realize itreally quickly when you start
talking to lenders.
(15:57):
Because, you know, once you getgoing, you know, you need to
start to borrow some operatingmoney.
And.
We were three years into itbefore we could find a lender to
talk to us.
Wow.
And when you get them to just upand up say it, they'd say, look,
the track record's not very goodfor startup packing plants.
And most of them had been burnedbad on it.
And I worry about that, right?
(16:17):
The things that could go wrong.
Matt (16:19):
That's why you do well.
That's why you're still heretoday is because if you don't
wake up hungry and worried andconcerned about.
what's out there.
Yeah, something reaches up andgrabs you.
And, And I think that goesacross regardless of size and
scale and scope of a pack ofprocessor, feed yard, a cow
calf, whatever.
I mean,, Probably the bigger,the bigger we get, the more
(16:40):
worried we have to be of thosethings that can jump up and grab
us.
Okay.
So get us to today and scope andsize of upper Iowa beef.
So you processed eight head outof 11 that you wanted to that
first day.
Or maybe I guess the first weekbecause it was shut down.
Yeah.
Where are you today in terms ofyour size and scope?
(17:01):
And where is this next?
So
Ed (17:03):
yeah, that was 2017 now today the plant Can do uh, 500
head a day is what we're doing.
So to give you, kind of put itin perspective, the harvest
floor, the kill floor, does 58head an hour.
And it was designed to dobasically 60 a day.
Wow.
So we've uh, been in a perpetualstate of growth ever since I
started.
(17:23):
Always been adding somethingnew.
Right now the new addition thatwe're putting on is more freezer
space because we're exportingmore and more.
We export about a load a dayinto the Asian market.
And so a lot of that product isfrozen.
I would like to grow that to twoloads a day.
But that process requiresinspection by USDA, staging
loads, holding more inventory tobuild loads.
(17:46):
And so we're adding on to ourfreezer, which will really help
us a lot.
And we're also adding on to ourcarcass cooler.
So, Yes, we're getting 500 heada day done.
The cattle are too tight.
The cattle are getting bigger,putting more and more weight
into our hot boxes.
So we're going to add on thereto allow me a full 48 hour chill
on these cattle.
We've done our own research interms of what, I mean, 36 hours
(18:09):
is what you got to have, butthat means a double shift plant
and I'm a single shift plant.
So we're going to do, we'll beable to do a full 48 hours on up
to 700 head.
And that will probably stop mefor a little bit.
And.
But the biggest reason iswastewater.
So I'm a direct discharge intothe upper Iowa River, which
means I have an NPDES permit andum, that, that's a whole other
(18:31):
process of building wastewater.
There's some new rules that arecoming our way and with the,
from the EPA under the Bidenadministration, that if they
keep coming are going to bereally hard to meet for packing
plants.
And they, you could tell thatthey were really pointed towards
animal agriculture.
And one of those things that Italk about, death by a thousand
cuts, that always poking at ourside.
(18:53):
So hopefully, under the newadministration, there's a
compromise.
Now I met with Mary Thomas aboutit just yesterday.
And I know that we're not gonnaget more relaxed.
Nobody's gonna get more relaxedon what we dump into a river,
right?
That's not gonna happen.
So there'll be more rulescoming.
But technology is better.
We're always finding ways tostay compliant, and it's been
(19:15):
amazing what we've figured out.
So just in a few
Matt (19:19):
seconds there, you touched on so many different things that
most of us listening to thispodcast go, Oh, I hadn't thought
about that.
Oh my gosh, that too.
Oh, but, so I'm going to drilldown on one of those things.
You mentioned that you'reshipping a load a day, exporting
to Asia.
Yeah.
What cuts are those?
Ed (19:36):
Oh, it's really vast.
Okay.
Um, so, So some, some of theproduct is fresh, which would be
heading over there air freightor we're putting them in smaller
boxes, so the rib, the strip,the pismo, things like that.
And a pismo would be atenderloin.
A tenderloin, yes.
And then, but then there's a lotof items that head over there
that not offal, but they wouldbe items of value that have a
(19:58):
lot of fat on them, like thenavel, the plate, the flank
plate ends.
Naval strips um, we've, there'slike 20 cuts that have been
invented for international tradeand it's because of the way
they, they consume our proteinand it's really built around the
pork belly in my opinion, a lotof fat, cook it really hot
(20:20):
really quick, slice it thin orit's boiled, things like that.
Matt (20:24):
So when you talk about a cut being invented for that.
Trade, export market.
Who is inventing those?
Ed (20:30):
It's, so example, I have some Japanese customers there.
They're wanting navels, butnavels are getting harder and
harder to come by.
Less cattle, therefore, let thenavels.
Their economies aren't doing aswell as ours.
So now they're looking forvalue, and they see that when I
trim the navels, we trim fourcorners off to square them all
up.
And they look like little ribfingers, and they buy rib
(20:51):
fingers for like 5.
50 to 6 a pound.
And he says, what are you doingwith those?
I said they're going to thefifties.
Can we bag them up?
Sure.
Let's bag them up.
Yeah.
And he's how much I said 30cents over the fifties for
bagging them up.
And so then you try to buildvalue and you know, the round
oyster is another funny littlepiece.
Oh, wow.
No one ever heard of, and it'sgoing there and short plate
(21:12):
strips.
I mean, The things, it goes onand on.
And every time they're there,they're standing at the bin
where the fifties are going inand they're grabbing pieces.
And they're like, is this, doesthis piece come all the time?
And then somebody from the fabfour will say, yeah, that's
coming from the Chuck line oryeah, that's coming from the
round.
And so we, we, we make a newcut.
Matt (21:32):
And so that's something, and again, I think most folks
listen to this, fifties would bethe trim that would go into a
grind if it weren't for you alladding value and value adding.
So those quote unquote new cuts,is that something that you all
have done?
Is that something that theprocessing segment in total has
come up with some of these waysto add value?
(21:52):
Or is that something that newproduct initiatives through
checkoff dollars are finding?
I think it's all the above,because I know that there's so
many things, way back, if we go20, 30 years back to flat iron
and a lot of these quote,unquote, new cuts that are not
so new anymore we're done witha, some type of a partnership
between Checkoff initiatives,research community, and then
(22:16):
also the Packer processorpartners and I think that's,
what's cool about this wholethought of a national
cattlemen's beef association,where we have all segments that
are looking at it because yeahIf you can sell that, what did
you call it, naval oyster?
Oh, the round oyster.
The round oyster.
If you can sell that for X centsper pound more than it would
have been in grind, that goesinto The whole value of that
(22:40):
carcass, and hopefully you canpay more for that live steer,
and he can pay more for that 550pounder, or whatever else, and
it does trickle down throughthere, whether we want to admit
that or not.
Ed (22:51):
No, it does.
It does trickle down, and wehave to do that, because we've
got to keep searching out thevalue, and it's just interesting
that it's a combination ofeverything, right?
So it's customers.
Maybe getting something fromanother packer or a version of
it and they'll, they'll send mea spec sheet.
But like for example, I was justat CAB three to four weeks ago,
and they served us what theycalled the pub steak.
(23:13):
And the pub steak comes out ofthe chuck.
And I said, are you kidding me?
It's not the flat iron, it wascoming out of the clod.
Different muscle.
Yeah and that's what'sinteresting about beef is we
break every muscle down.
I tell everybody that whenthey're at the plant.
The difference between us andpork.
is we, every muscle is pulledapart, right?
And we're finding a home for it,and we're figuring out different
(23:34):
ways to utilize it.
And I believe that will continuebecause we harvested a million
less cattle last year, right?
Than the year before.
That means there's two millionless ribeyes last year.
Somebody's gonna have to findsomething else to eat.
In terms of featuring it.
And all of a sudden, there'sgoing to be people who can't
afford the ribeye anymore.
(23:54):
Because it becomes all whitecollar.
Or white tablecloth, I mean.
and, now we've got to look forother options.
And it's crazy, as JC knows,because we're at the plant.
We take new cuts home.
And you'll have something likechuck flap or sirloin flap.
And they're, they're better thananything we've ever had.
Matt (24:12):
And that, that is so fascinating to me because it's
this nuanced thing, okay, whyare we trying to find new cuts?
Because there aren't enoughsteaks to satisfy the demand and
the demand has driven priceshigher and so we can find these
value cuts that are affordableby a bigger audience.
So, Meanwhile, we're pullingthat out of that 50 grind type
(24:32):
trim.
So, What's that mean?
There's less ground beef.
Guess what?
Americans are not going to quiteating hamburgers.
And so, what happens?
We reach out and bring moreexport We do.
Imported to the U.
S.
beef to make hamburgers.
We do.
Then all of a sudden we look atthe numbers.
Oh my gosh, look at this.
We're importing more beef thanwe've ever imported.
(24:52):
Well, Guess what?
We're selling stuff out to otherfolks, either domestically or
exported to other countries, formore money than what we're
bringing that cheap beef inthat's going to turn into a
grind anyways.
That's not to get into the wholepoliticized Trade imports and
exports deal, but that'ssomething that I think we forget
(25:13):
about when we go to gripingabout this imported beef that's
coming into us from Australia orwherever the case may be.
Well, Guess what we traded somethat was worth twice that to
them or to another country.
And so if Americans still wantground beef, we're probably
going to end up importing some.
Ed (25:31):
We're in a world market.
And I say that all the time now,like I was somewhere and
somebody was complaining about.
How much Brazilian product wasmaking it into China.
And I, I remember I said thatmeans there's a hole somewhere.
Yeah.
Because the Brazilian productwas going somewhere and now
there's an opportunity forsomebody else.
And so it's just this big voidthat's created every once in a
(25:54):
while when we move thingsaround.
And you're right.
We're making a big, we'resending a lot of fat over to the
Asian markets.
Therefore.
We got to bring lean in and it'sgoing to come from places like
Australia and Uruguay.
Yeah, that's
Matt (26:07):
that world market is it's got a lot of moving parts and
especially as we look at thedollar fluctuating and its value
and what we can how competitiveor Uncompetitive that we are
with other countries because oftheir currency.
And then you throw in the Trumpeffect.
And um, I mean, most everybodylistening here is going to be in
(26:28):
agreement that, that there aremore good than bad as we look at
this administrative change..
But one of the question marksis, what's going to happen when
we say, okay, we've been relyingon, pick a region, Asia, for
selling a load a day to them.
We go to a some kind of a tariffon some of their products coming
(26:52):
in and what's that happened forours going out?
What do you all see in thecoming weeks months years?
How is that gonna affect upperIowa and some of your business
decisions?
Ed (27:02):
I mean
Matt (27:03):
I
Ed (27:04):
Worry about a little bit, but then I get reminded.
We're in a world market.
So for every action There's areaction which will open up the
door for another customer,right?
And, And I've been over therenow.
I'm going to actually be headedover there in March.
We'll be in Japan, Hong Kong,and Taiwan, customers of ours.
And I've also been in China.
Um, they have to buy proteinfrom somebody.
(27:25):
Those countries have to, fromsomebody.
So, If it's not ours, it'll besomebody else's.
And then, therefore, ours willgo to wherever that hole was
created.
So I'm not that worried aboutit.
What does probably worry me themost when I'm over there is
Their economies aren't doing aswell as ours.
Our dollar's strong.
They don't have the inflationthat we have.
I hope it doesn't trickle intous.
(27:46):
I mean, I saw that a year ago.
Still hasn't happened to us,right?
We're still having good economicgrowth.
Part of it, I think, is just howmature our economy is, too.
We have a really robust, strongeconomy.
And we are self sustaining.
That's the other thing youreally quickly learn when you're
flying into Korea.
And no natural resources, can'traise enough food to take care
(28:08):
of themselves, and have nofossil fuels, can't make their
own energy.
The United States is a veryunique place.
Matt (28:16):
Yeah, and I think we take that for granted.
Especially those of us who havenot gotten the opportunity to
see the parts of the world thatyou have seen.
And we just assume that, yeah,we hear there's differences, and
they're a little less selfsufficient.
But yeah, when you go into aplace like that, that has to
import all their energy andtheir food, my goodness, I take
(28:37):
for granted the level ofbargaining power that we have
here in the United States.
So let's talk about thosePacific Rim, Asian markets.
you know, We'd like to thinkabout that.
Shabu or that, that steak thatthe Japanese are putting on
their flat top griddle orwhatever the case may be, but a
lot of what they buy is stuffthat Not many of us Americans
(28:58):
want to or are willing to eatsometimes wouldn't even be able
to grind that into, to fiftiesin a hamburger market.
What are some of the cuts orsome of those pieces that you're
sending?
wherever, but specifically tothe Pacific ram and Asian market
that we don't think about it andhow important, how much is that
(29:19):
drop credit and some of thatoffal to your profitability
there in the processing segment.
So I really
Ed (29:25):
don't export a lot of offal.
I export some like my tripes.
I do some exporting on, butbecause I'm a smaller packer, I
don't make loads of livers and Idon't make loads of kidneys.
But on the flip side, Thedomestic market has become so
diverse that I don't need to.
So I look at a customer likeQuaker Valley in Philadelphia.
(29:46):
Extremely diverse town,Philadelphia.
So he's buying prime, middles,all the way down to the cheapest
stuff he can find that's aprotein for different customers.
So livers and kidneys all theodd things that you can think
of.
The flexor tendons and thingslike that.
Because he has different pricepoints to meet, for different
(30:07):
people that live in thePhiladelphia community.
And ethnicities.
Yes.
Yeah.
And so he's got his Asiandivision, he's got his Hispanic
groups that are needingdifferent things.
And then he's got his his whitecollar and his blue collar.
and so we are putting loadstogether, when you look at it,
it's like almost every cut is onthere.
And it, it's amazing to me, andthey're distributors that, that
(30:31):
have 50 trucks that go out everyday and deliver 1 to 10 boxes of
something to, to theircustomers.
Matt (30:38):
So has that market grown from, just from your standpoint?
Are they selling more of thosekidneys and livers and things
like that?
And if so, why?
Is that strictly because of adifferent changing in ethnicity
or are there more people?
More Americans that are goingback to eating some of those
organ type meats.
Ed (30:59):
I don't know if it's really a traditional Americans.
I think it is the ethnic groups.
And they, they're always lookingat price points.
It's interesting.
When I talk to Quaker Valley,I'm going to pick on Dan
diamond.
Cause he's a younger guy who'srunning the buy there now.
He'll see stuff on my pricesheet.
And they'll say well, what areyou doing with those Chuck Spare
Ribs?
And I'm like well, I'm at a 1.
50 on them.
(31:19):
Well, I need something with thatdollar something range because
all of a sudden now neck bonesare too high and hind shanks are
too high, but I need somethingthat'll fit into their price
point for soups and they want aprotein of some sort.
And so it's constantly that way,
Matt (31:34):
it's like a guy sitting in the uh, uh, sale barn that had
an order for.
Five weight calves that lookedlike this and they got too high
and he decided okay, I'm gonnado the math I'm yeah, I'm gonna
figure in loss and things likethat But I'm gonna trade down
and it's the same way all theway through the beef chain Yeah,
the whole way and I think that'swhat we have to recognize and
that's something that Uh, yousaid you were too small to be
(31:58):
able to export loads of livers.
Like livers to Egypt.
Yeah.
What about these folks that arestill at or smaller than you
were when you started andprocessing eight head a day or
three head a day?
What are they doing with those?
Because they're probably
Ed (32:15):
paying somebody to dump them.
Are they not?
It was really hard when Istarted.
When I was just getting starteduntil we kind of hit that.
250 head a day.
It was really a struggle.
Those offal items, you'd have tolet them build up in the
freezer.
Um, I wasn't even washing thetripes yet.
And you're not very good at it.
You couldn't build it up.
So that, those stuff, that's thethings that were just, they were
(32:37):
just going to rendering.
And so you're getting anywherefrom six to twenty cents, twenty
cents a pound for them.
Just going right out there torendering when they should be
bringing a dollar fifty.
to 4 a pound.
Matt (32:50):
And so how, as we talk about a more resilient food
chain or supply chain I had Dr.
Temple Grandin on here a year orso ago and, and she was talking
about that big is, is notresilient as we get larger
plants that are not spread outas much and she was saying we
need more plants that are yoursize and lower but the challenge
(33:12):
is how do you capture speciallysome of these really small
butcher plants that are justdoing a few head a week can they
survive as we go forth if theycan't capture that 4 a pound for
some of this off all and dropcredit instead of, you know, a
few cents or even having to paysomebody to haul it off as
(33:33):
waste?
Ed (33:34):
Yeah, so now that I'm at 500 head a day, I believe in terms
of economic efficiencies and mycost to operate, I've gotten
pretty close to some of thebigger plants.
As far as I can tell, thatnumber is really hard to find
out, right?
There's probably four or fivepeople that know what that
number is on a cost per head,and I believe I'm getting down
there.
(33:55):
But what does concern me is Theyall have rendering and they all
have grinds and I'm missingthat.
And they also all have hideprocessing facilities.
And so I look at all those and Isay well, if they can make 10 a
head on each of those threesegments, there's 30 right
there.
And that, that's what worries mebecause that means I've got to
(34:16):
get an extra 30 just to be evenwith them out of the cuts that
they're already making.
So that means.
We need to do everything just alittle bit better and we try to
like when if you're here I havesome customers here and you talk
to them They'll always bragabout how good our cuts look and
how our box looks and I remindthe people that work for me we
(34:37):
have to be a little bit betterall the time because I'm gonna
ask more.
I'm gonna ask a fair amount morefor my ribeye that than anybody
else But we have to make surewe're bringing value to them
too.
So that ribeye better be nice,it better be sorted right.
And that is the hardest part ofwhere I am today.
It's having that vision thatwe're gonna be a little bit
(34:59):
better.
But in the beginning, you'regonna sell it under the market.
And you're gonna be a little bitbetter.
And I'll have a plant managersay to me why are we gonna make
the ribeye nicer than one of themajors?
And yet you're going to get lessfor it.
And I'm like, because we have tobuild up.
Matt (35:16):
Get your foot in the door.
Ed (35:17):
Yeah.
Matt (35:17):
Yeah.
Ed (35:18):
There's no other way to do it.
Matt (35:19):
So of the different requests, and I'm not going to
say complaints, I'm going to sayrequests that your customers
give you, what is it that's atthe absolute top of the list?
Is it consistency of size?
Is it quality and marbling?
What, What is it they want?
It's
Ed (35:37):
really trim specs.
Everybody's after trim specs.
Everything needs to look thesame.
Yeah, they want them to look thesame.
It's, presentation in the box isgetting to be big.
We just started for the firsttime doing a three way sword on
our rib eyes.
We used to always pull theheavies off.
Now I've got a light rib eye, anaverage, and a heavy.
And really, it's I'm not gettingless for either one of them.
(35:58):
Heavy's a little bit at timesare hard to sell, but I have
customers that said, we don'tmind getting that light ribeye.
We just don't want it into thebox with the medium, because we
want to be able to open it upand say, we're cutting the light
rib eyes this way thicker, butthen we're cutting these over
here, or we have customers whoinsists that.
That they want to have an inchand a half thick or an inch
(36:20):
thick steak, but they can't getit out of a 17 pound ribeye.
And so we're sorting things,started doing that with the
briskets.
And what happens over time isyou build a reputation for
having a really nice brisket.
So retailers like a lighterbrisket that's smaller.
Barbecuers want a great big onewith a lot of fat.
(36:42):
Yes, they do.
And when you sort them now, allof a sudden you get pull through
is what I call it.
And this takes forever for acustomer to tell a distributor.
No, I don't want the Tyson box.
I want upper Iowa beef brisketand then you have them.
Then you got it.
Then I can start to add a littlebit on little bits at a time.
So as you
Matt (37:02):
let's go back to those rib eyes.
What?
from a either square inch sizeor, ribeye size or a total
poundage per rib, what are thosebreakouts on your light, middle,
and heavy ribs?
Ed (37:15):
Today we've we're still trying to figure out what that
right break is on the light.
We're using 14 and under for mylight, then 14 to 17 for my
average.
Square inches?
Nope.
Pounds per rib.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
If you were to measure them up,they're going to be bigger.
But yeah, it's pounds.
The gals in packaging areweighing them.
And so they know which box toput them into.
(37:36):
And then 17 pounds and up aregoing into the heavy box.
we're doing the same thing withthe briskets.
So under 12 pounds, we call alight brisket.
They go to retail because theaverage smoker at home, he
doesn't need.
A 14, 15 pound brisket, asmaller one is all they really
need.
Yeah.
Cause we're no longer going tosay
Matt (37:57):
that it doesn't fit the box.
It doesn't fit the Traeger.
Some of these briskets out ofthese 1800 pound live type of
steers, they're so big andsometimes so fat.
Yeah.
They may not even fit on thathome.
Barbecuer's smoker
Ed (38:11):
yeah.
And that is what is reallyinteresting that um, COVID.
taught people a new world rightthat they could have white
tablecloth food at home andreally it's not that expensive
so it may seem high to buy thatwhole brisket but if you do the
math on how many people you fedcompared to going out it's
(38:34):
pretty reasonable
Matt (38:36):
well especially and I always talk about beef as an
experience and if we do it rightAnd we make it right, and it
eats well, it is a replacement,not for a cheap chicken dinner,
it is a replacement for going tothe movie theater, or to the
(38:56):
ball game, or whatever else, andyou make it an event, and if
that event costs you a hundreddollars to feed four people,
instead of 50, and yet they allbragged on ya?
That was well worth theadditional 50 bucks.
And if we can make beef, timeafter time, whether it is that
value cut, or whether it is thatprime strip steak, rib eye,
(39:18):
whatever the case may be, if wecan make that an experience, and
allow that mom or dad to go homeand them look like the hero,
There's no telling what we cancharge for those retail
Ed (39:31):
cats.
And then I watch the nextgeneration coming up who I
believe is very conscientious ofwhat they eat.
And now we talk about cleanlabels.
And what's interesting aboutbeef is it is one of the
proteins that can maintain itsclean label the whole way
through.
So if you buy a ribeye, youdon't have to put anything on it
(39:51):
and it's still going to eatalright.
Same with the brisket.
But everything else, you usuallygot to top it with something,
right?
Matt (39:58):
Yeah, or they already have topped it and the ingredient
list is a mile long.
And when you buy that, slab ofbeef on a tray, there's one
ingredient.
Beef.
Ed (40:07):
Yeah.
And I think that's, I think itis, and I think we also don't
need to worry about how big theportion sizes are.
I don't think they're going toeat as much as I traditionally
would have, right?
But we don't need to worry aboutthat.
There's a lot of people.
you know, when I go to Asia andthey're ordering a few ounces,
don't worry about it.
There's so many
Matt (40:26):
of them.
So we've talked about portionsize here on a lot of past
podcasts.
And I always ask folks that whenwe go down this road, as we see
these 17 and 18 and 20 inch 20square inch ribeyes that people
want cut an inch and a halfthick, like you said, do, in
your opinion, Do consumers havea problem with cutting that
(40:50):
ribeye into three pieces or twopieces or six pieces, whatever
the case may be?
Can we make this portion sizeand thickness of steak work with
a
Ed (41:00):
knife?
Absolutely.
And I have not seen it at theretail level yet, but I've seen
it at white tableclothrestaurants.
And so one of the bestrestaurants where I go to is at
Helen in Birmingham, Alabama.
And I watched it come out acouple orders of porterhouse and
it is a monster.
But it's already sliced up forthem.
So the presentation isbeautiful.
(41:20):
So what these chefs are gettinggood at, instead of bringing it
out and you sharing a plate,they cut it back there.
It's already cut.
Put it back together.
Lay it in between the two ofyou.
And you're grabbing your pieces.
So yeah, you want sometenderloin or you want some
strip.
And I believe they could startto do that for three or four
people.
But the key is presentation.
(41:42):
The chef's got to cut it right.
It's got to do a good job ofcutting it and when they do it
it's, it is unbelievable, Ithink, what we can do with this
stuff.
Matt (41:51):
Yeah I think that is another creative way that we, as
an industry, including our foodservice and chef partners, can
address this problem withoutjust saying well, we're feeding
them too long, or well, you seedstock guys have made them too
big.
Now, We've had plenty ofpodcasts talking about the other
consequences back home andfeeding that cow that's The
(42:13):
sister of that steer that'sgonna be an 1, 800 pound live
weight and so those are thingsthat we have to figure out with
more creativity back home andnutrition and management and
Selection and things like that.
But yeah, the portion size ofthings we've argued about for
years that we've got All theseribeyes are too big well That's
(42:34):
easily remedied with a knife, inmy opinion.
And a little bit of, like yousaid, creativity.
People are getting
Ed (42:39):
used to it.
I mean, My wife and I splitsalads for gosh sake's sake.
We're these places we go,everybody splits the dessert
now.
Yeah.
I think that's a very commonthing.
And I, I don't know why a houseof, a mom and dad and a couple
kids wouldn't do the same thingwith a bone in ribeye.
Presentation, just grab thepieces you want, and um, we're
(42:59):
not going to stop making thembigger.
I mean, Just data shows that.
We're never going to, we'realways going to keep raising
more corn per acre.
Pigs are going to keep gettingbigger, chickens are going to
get bigger.
It's just, that's capitalism,isn't it?
Matt (43:13):
Yeah, it is, and you know, the age old argument is that
there's something in that chainthat won't allow them to
continue to get bigger.
And I remember it used to be.
These carcasses are dragging offthe rails, clear to the floor.
That was in the late nineties.
The first time I heard that, andI've had other people say that
(43:33):
that was even said back in thesixties, you know, when we, when
we had the belt buckle cattle,these cattle, these carcasses
just can't get any bigger.
And yet, like you said, everyyear, it's as linear of a chart
as we look at five pounds peryear per carcass.
After you figure out a few ofthe ups and downs because the
corn market and things likethat.
But yeah, I, I.
(43:54):
As much as I hate to admit it,as a rancher, who's trying to
make cows fit an environment,the economics, until we go to
buying cattle differently, andyou all go to saying, you know
what, there is enough pushbackfrom an animal welfare
standpoint, all these otherthings, until the industry says,
you know what, enough's enough,we're going to send signals to
(44:16):
make an optimum right size, andthat size is going to be
Whatever it is, we're not gonna,we're not gonna quit.
Because the handwriting's on thewall.
It's it makes us more money.
It makes you more money.
It's more efficient.
It's part of the beast.
Ed (44:31):
The pack spec thing at the packing plant, we've seen that.
You know, We try to put threechuck rolls in a box.
That's an industry standard.
I now put two in a box for myheavy chuck roll.
And it, it says right on theside, heavy chuck roll.
Because they were weighing over90 pounds.
And it was a problem for liftingthem.
It was a problem for boxintegrity.
And so, we'll always find a way.
(44:53):
That's the beauty of the U.
S.
Is capitalism always finds a wayto solve a problem, right?
Well, I think as
Matt (45:01):
we kind of wrap up our discussion, that's what you did.
That's all the way through youfound a way when you got done at
Iowa State went back home andsaid, oh my gosh I as much as I
want to farm and run cows Thisisn't gonna work.
Let's find a way went to theIowa cattlemen's and you solved
issues there And you ran upagainst brick wall after brick
(45:23):
wall with ID and all thesediscussions and you said We're
gonna find a way and just allthe way through and even to
today Coming into the processingsegment because you thought you
needed to find a way of doing itbetter.
I mean, inspiring to me that wehave folks like yourself running
these halls and running theroads of U.
(45:46):
S.
and I guess of the world.
That instead of making aFacebook post and being pissed
off because this segment or thatsegment isn't treating me right.
You found a way and continue todo so and I think that's what
all of us need to aspire to do.
Ed (46:02):
Yeah, we really are in unique times.
So I get to travel a lot, right?
I'm in all the big cities and Idress just like Matt does.
I never change the way I dress.
Always a cowboy hat and a pairof boots.
But people really want to talkto us.
And they really do.
I still believe that we are theroyalty of the U.
S., the Cowboy is, and theCattleman.
(46:23):
But what's interesting aboutthat show, Yellowstone, even
though I don't watch it, and Ihear about it everywhere I go,
for the first time, I have a lotof people that see me in an
airport and don't think Cowboy.
They think the boss.
He's Kevin Costner.
You know, Whenever you go wherethey always thought Cowboy hat
means cowboy.
Sure.
When You and I don't do a lot ofcowboying, really, do we?
(46:45):
Well, I still get to,
Matt (46:48):
but you're right, it's not the top of the priorities.
Yeah,
Ed (46:51):
and so now they see a guy who's the boss and he's raising
beef, raising food.
Raising a family.
Yes, now there's some thingsabout that show that we don't
do, right?
Matt (47:04):
I agree, we don't have a train station, you might, but
But I, I agree, and my Montanafriends always just get furious
when I say Yellowstone's notnecessarily a bad thing for the
beef industry because it has, Ithink, and actually Ethan Lane
this morning in that D.
C.
issues update for NCBA jokinglysaid that Taylor Sheridan has
(47:29):
brought all of the issues thathe has to lobby the D.
C.
bureaucracy and The Congress andeverybody else, the
administration, he's brought allof those issues to light and
given just enough of a dramaticperspective on generational
transfer of ownership and thechallenges that they have.
(47:50):
On working together as a familywho may or may not all get
along.
Labor issues and animal health,and disease, and all of these
different things.
Consumer misperceptions aboutbeef, and how it's raised, all
these different things.
Yellowstone's brought that, notjust shed a little bit of light,
but brought it into the culturalnorm.
(48:12):
And I think there's benefit inthat.
Now, again, do we do things likeBeth does?
I hope not, usually.
Um, Usually.
But there is value in it.
And I think that we as beefcattle producers, whether it's
at the top of the supply chainor at the bottom raising
genetics to start the thing, Ithink we have to recognize that
(48:34):
there's value in that and wehave to embrace that and Know
that the consumer craves thatand they crave it for their own
life and their only connectionmay be that opportunity to buy a
cut of beef that we raised, youprocessed and delivered to that
retailer and there's huge valuein that if we do it right.
If we all do our part of it tomake sure that's a good
(48:57):
experience.
Ed (48:58):
100 percent and the consumer is really quite smart.
They're very educated.
Oh man, big time.
So when I talk to them.
I don't have to, you know, wetalk about sustainability and
group that likes to pick on usreally a lot about greenhouse
gases, right?
Cattle have been classified asthe polluter of the world and
greenhouse gases and land usageand water usage.
(49:19):
And yet when I sit and talk tothem and say yeah, the cow does
emit some methane when she eatsforages, but I don't think
that's our real problem.
And I'm sitting in the middle ofan airport or in the middle of a
city.
And I said, you know, when I'mat home, the sky is blue.
I don't see this haze like youguys.
That's and they understand thatthey get it.
(49:43):
They get that.
We don't have to say that we'recarbon neutral.
We just got to talk about whatwe do and why we do it and how
the cow is utilizing land thatcan't be done anything else
with.
We're not going to raise otherfood off of it.
Matt (49:56):
And as we have those conversations, I think the thing
that I have witnessed, whetherit's me talking or watching
someone like yourself do thatcommunicating, the thing that
happens is in that conversation,whether we have the exact facts
or figures or whether we havegotten to that point where we
can Without a shadow of a doubtmeasure how much methane that
(50:18):
we're producing and howsustainable our industry might
be and all these benchmarks thatwe're trying to get at.
Somewhere in that conversationwith that person who is saying
that we're trying to kill theenvironment and them in the
process.
They see just how much passionand how much we care about what
it is we do.
About keeping green spacesgreen.
(50:39):
About keeping ruminants on areasof the country that can't grow
corn, can't grow lettuce orstrawberries or oranges or kale
or whatever it is that theythink we all should be eating.
When we demonstrate how much itmeans to us and to our family
and to our kids and their kidsand sustaining this ranch or
farm or feedlot or processingplant all the way into the
(51:00):
future, That's generally whatdoes more for our cause, if you
will, than any facts or figuresare telling them that we are
carbon neutral or we aren't.
And I, again, I go back to theYellowstone effect.
There's a lot of passion in thatshow.
Sometimes it's X rated, butthere's a lot of passion there.
(51:21):
We have a lot of passion forwhatever it is we do every day
out here on the farms andranches.
And I think that's what we haveto convey.
For too many years, we haveassumed that they know that
we're doing everything we can tofeed them.
We're doing everything we can tomake sure and sustain this
business and this industry andthis culture into the next
(51:41):
generation.
And we haven't felt like we hadto tell them.
It's time that we finally tellthat story.
as often and as loudly as whatwe can.
Ed (51:51):
And don't apologize.
That is the one thing that I'vealways said about cattlemen is
we're truthful.
Yeah.
We're not very good at tellinglies, right?
Yeah, that's for sure.
And so just tell it.
Exactly.
Tell the story.
Don't hide it.
Don't hold back.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Matt (52:02):
And that's, that's, it takes us, it takes all of us.
We can't rely on somebody else.
Well, The beef check off isgoing to do that for us.
Or well, the packer ought to bedoing that because they're,
they've got the connections withthe retailer or whatever.
It takes us all.
It does.
It takes all of us.
And um, we've got a great storyto tell.
And we just need to tell it.
Yeah.
That probably sums it up prettywell.
(52:22):
And, And yeah, I appreciate uh,bringing this whole circle.
Yeah.
It's been great.
And keep up the good work andstay in touch.
And again, thanks for sharingthe story of Upper Iowa Beef and
Ed Griman and everything canstop in any time for a tour.
All right.
Sounds great.
Thanks a bunch.
Ed.
All right.
Thank you.
Thanks for tuning in toPractically Ranching, brought to
you by Dalebanks Angus.
(52:42):
If you liked this show, even ifyou didn't, share it with
somebody else, give us a fivestar review and a comment so we
can keep cranking'em out.
We're about sold out of ourprivate treaty bulls, but if you
need one, be sure to contact ussoon.
We're also going to be selling agroup of young April Calving
Cows here in the near future.
If you'd like information on anyof these registered groups,
(53:04):
email me atmattperrier@dalebanks.com.
God bless you all, and I lookforward to visiting again soon.
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