September 15, 2025 • 59 mins
It was the night that changed professional wrestling forever. On March 29, 1987, over 93,173 fans packed the Pontiac Silverdome for one of the most legendary matches in WWE history — Hulk Hogan vs Andre the Giant at WrestleMania III. But behind the body slams and the deafening crowd, there’s a story few truly know…
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
What is going on wrestling fans. It's ic Well, welcome
back to ten count Media. It's another edition of the
Golden Era Podcast. Was Sean mooney Moonman himself.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I'm doing good. Good to see you, brother. It's spend
a little break we had there, and yes you've been
incredibly busy, but it's nice that we put time aside
to spend some QT time together and talk about the
Golden Era.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Oh hell yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
And today we are talking about I think the peak
of the Golden Era, the thing that started at all
the day that Hulk Kuggin body slam that big stinking
giant Aren't a giant wrestling A three. Today we're talking
about the impact of just that one body slam and
professional wrestling. And before we get into all the details, Yeah,
my question to you is, you know, wrestling your one
(00:56):
huge monumental. But without the success of wrestling at three,
would we be in today's world with a Netflix, in
t KO, in ESPN.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Uh, Well, that that certainly is debatable. If you know that, uh,
this one event was that uh you know, incredible and
was the the peak at least at the beginning to
to really launch things. I totally agree with that would
Hulkamania have reached the heights that it did, probably, but
(01:30):
I think it would have taken longer. This was uh,
this was you know SpaceX launch for the w w
F at the time, and uh, you know it wasn't
you know, the the hul com Mania was already starting
to you know, it's climb and we saw that after
you know, WrestleMania one and all of that. But the
(01:52):
fact that Andre the Giant uh you know, stepped into
that ring with Hulk Cogan, went toe to toe with him,
and uh, you know, they still talk about it. The
body slam heard around the world certainly escalated things much quicker.
I think then, you know what would have taken a
course so to say, to answer that question, you know,
(02:13):
was it the thing and would the wwe have not
reached the peaks that it has. I think it certainly
would have happened. At some point. They still had Hulkogan,
they still had the magic that he had going. They
had a formula going that just kept continuing to build.
I mean, think about it. At that time, even at
these you know house shows, these tapings that they did,
(02:35):
they were still drawing you know, twenty thousand people to
some of these things. And if you think back to
then and all, you know, some of the other wrestling
organizations that were out there. I mean, if they put
two thousand in a building, they were just ecstatic. It
was like, oh my god, we knew new highs, you know,
like with ECW or these other outfits out there. So
(02:56):
to Madge just for a house show that they're putting
twenty thousand people in there shows you that it was
already taking off. But uh, you know, putting ninety three
thousand plus and coursers that was there really, but come on,
take a look at the Pontiac Overton was just packed
to the rafters. That was not a I there was
no uh you know.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
It was a.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Yeah, there weren't cardboard cardboard audience members out there. And
so to pull that off, and you got to think
about what Vince McMahon's vision was. I saw an image
that was online of of of Vince and he's on
one of those uh you know, the things that they used.
(03:41):
They brought everybody out to the ring, the rings on
the road, but the upper yeah, they go up and
down whoever. So he's on one of those and he's
just looking. You can see in this an empty stadium,
and I just had to think what was in his
mind that day, thinking like, oh my god, we could
do this. Yeah, I see it. You know, it's empty,
(04:01):
and to think about what they did, and that just
shows you what a visionary he was at the time.
You know, everybody always has these dreams of things that
they could do. Well, Vince McMann did it, damn it,
you know. And who would have ever thought at that
time that you were going to be putting nearly one
hundred thousand people into a stadium for a wrestling event,
(04:22):
you know, I mean, that's that's super Bowl type of
audience members you're talking about. So it was an incredible,
incredible event and of course a fantastic card. Well I'm
sure we'll talk about what some of the other matches
were on that card, and we'll also talk about what
we thought of this match. But the fact that you
(04:44):
had hul Cogan and Andre the Giant, who was arguably
and now I'll say I'll say it, he was really
one of the first mainstream professional wrestlers. Everybody had heard
of Andre the Giant. He was this massive human and
there's no doubt he wasn't a giant and so he
was you know, Hulk maybe took it to different places obviously,
(05:07):
but to have those two in the ring and they
and it captured the world's attention. Pay per view was
in its infancy, and the numbers I'm sure we'll talk
about those two were phenomenal considering I think the overall
take on that event was over twenty million dollars, which
at the time was gigantic. So answering that question, yes,
(05:31):
it was pivotal. Did it change the history of the
WWE forever? Yes, absolutely, But to say that it wouldn't
have happened, I don't think so. I think eventually they
would have gotten to that point, but it certainly expedited
that process. Shall we say.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
See, I'm happy you said that answer because you easily
could have been like, yes, of course, as Body Slam
changed the world, babies were born, you know, flowers are blooming.
You know, you could have said that, and you know what,
the revised history of this event and this Body Slam,
that is what we're told.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
You know, we're told this event, this Body Slam changes
the wrestling world forever. Without this, there would be no foundation.
You know, we're talked about Austin three sixteen. We're talked,
we're always told these things that change the world. But
when you watch them in real time and see how,
beat by beat, how they actually do affect the.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
World, you know this is a huge event. WrestleMania one itself, Yes,
gigantic event world. Yes, it connected to MTV, which was
like the coolest thing in the world in nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
That created a cartoon.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Then we got into Wrestlmania two where we're so big,
we're so hot, Let's go into three locations to make
three amounts of money.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
I think Vince mc man is known for a man
who takes big swings, and WrestleMania three is going he's going, okay,
Well he did great rest Menu one. We got that
cartoon where whole comedias running the wild. We're all over
the real world. We're on TV shows. People are asking
for wrestlers. But like, if you don't keep delivering big moments,
are you the flash in a pan? Like anything that
(07:02):
has appeared in pulp culture before, in wrestling, Eli's the
w W they have They've they have stayed the course,
staying in your eye, just like Coca Cola, just like Pepsi.
These companies their legacy brands that we all recognize, and
Wrestling the Three help that legacy brand continue. I'm just
so happy that you didn't say yes and changed everything.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Stave moving on.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
You never know what's going to come out of this
coconut up here, do you?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Piper could have hit snuck it with your coach, that's.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
True and then knock me into a wall. But but you,
but also you you really have to think about that.
You you said you mentioned Vince always you know, swung
for the fences. Uh and and uh. It's well documented
that when wrestled Ania one happened that he pretty much
just put everything he put, uh, you know, everything on
(07:53):
black and and rolled the the dice, you know, to
see what was going to happen. And and the company
would have been in serious trouble if that had fallen,
you know, come up short, I mean, it could have
been a disaster. And the same thing here when he
(08:14):
attempts to put over ninety three thousand people into a stadium,
can you ment how bad they can you imagine how
bad that would have been if let's say they put
half that number in there, which would have been a
huge crowd, let's say almost fifty thousand, but in a
stadium like that, it would have looked empty and it
would have been a disaster. And what do you do
at that point, You've already committed your going. You gotta
(08:36):
go do it. So you're thinking, oh, man, you know,
then you're gonna put the black sheets up over seats
and you know, the whole thing. And so Vince gambled again.
He did it again and again. And that's the kind
of person that I think he remained. It's not like
Vince really ever changed. But how many people have the
stones to do something like that, And you know, he
(08:59):
never lost the big of it that not we're going
to do it, and by god, they did it. And
so for a number of reasons, it was a historic event,
and very much so that would, you know, blaze the
trail for all the events beyond that. But everybody remembers
that one as certainly one of the greatest ever because
(09:21):
of all that was involved. You know, the stadium, a
Hulk Andre Randy Savage in that match that they still
which was you know, people say it's somewhat overshadowed the
big main event, and we'll talk about that, but really, overall,
it was one of the biggest events to ever. Let's
it ever take place in the history of professional wrestling,
(09:45):
and there's certainly up there today. Remember it as being
won with all they done.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Oh yeah, And it's funny you bring up the tark
thing on the because I've gone to so many big
events over the years, and the most recent in the
past four years, even ones you know at Metlive Stadium
or all these big arenas, the stage takes up half
of the arena most of the time, so then they
have to put black curtains all around that because it's
(10:12):
all filled with equipment in stage hands and so. But
when you see that picture is very famous from this event,
it's way up top someone like when all the way
up took a picture, it shows you it. There's no
black tarps, there's nothing like we are full to the max.
And again, if you want to argue if there's seventy
three or ninety three, the image is still there, the
(10:34):
pictures are still there, that the atmosphere is still rocking.
So like if you want to argue over sinematics and numbers,
it's still historic.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
It's still crazy.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
But I want to go back to the beginning of
this rivalry because over the years.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
You know, these two and Drey and Hogan on television
had a friendship.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
And it's so funny because under the Giant gets a
trophy given to him and he's like, oh, you know,
all all your hard work and all your dedication, you
get a trophy. It's like the size of a little
bowling trophy, like, oh, here you go, buddy. Yeah, and
here's one for Superstar of the Year for whole Cogan.
(11:11):
It's this giant ass huge trophy and for being a.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Champion for three years or something.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Yeah, it's so funny because wheneveryone thinks of like man
not body slam or this moment, Well, you got to
go back to how it happened. It's because of a
mishap at the trophy store when they ordered Andre's trophy
and they got a drinky one and they ordered Hogan's
and it was gigantic.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
You know.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
That's just to me is one of those funny moments
of like, wow, what happened.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Sure it was a mix up, Bobby Heenen.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Bobby Heenen was working there.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I don't think so, let me plunder, Yeah, I don't
think so. And it you know started the got the
stirrings of of this going on. And as you said,
you know, friendship made in Heaven, really andre And and
the whole Cogan and Andre had for the most part
always been a babyface as far for the the w
(12:06):
W w F and beyond and and so when this tea,
this heel turn was taking place, it was like kind
of whoa, what the hell, what's going on here? And uh,
you know, and and people also have to remember that
the Holster and Andre weren't weren't new to each other. They
had wrestled several times in the past, the whole I
(12:29):
believe even at one show body slammed Andre that was
you know, it was of course it was built. He'd
never been but uh. And also which is also really
interesting Steve too, is that they had uh. And we've
talked about this before when people talk about, you know,
Terry Bellia's skills that he spent a lot of time
in in Japan and they are much more demanding there.
(12:52):
And Terry proved that he could work, you know, he
had to and did was could move in that ring.
But also andre And and the Holkster had wrestled several
times in Japan and to some pretty good matches because
at the time, Andrea was in much better physical condition
(13:13):
and they they had to work over there otherwise the
crowds buried you. So that that part of this history
is really it's a it's a rich part of it.
It's unfortunate that when this all happened in eighty seven
that you know, Andre was already starting his decline, his
(13:33):
physical decline, and it wouldn't be what four years later
that he would that would be his last appearance with
the WWE. So it's unfortunate that when this did happen,
he wasn't more able to move around. And people crap
all over this match because of what actually went on
in the rain, and we'll get into that, but but
(13:56):
at the time, but just the fact that those two
in there together and uh, the enormity of the circumstances
surrounding it made it a memorable match forever and made
it a part of wrestling history that you know, deserves
to be recognized.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I just blame that trophy guy. This is all the
trophy shops fault.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Really, No, I blame Bobby Heenen.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
I bet he was the guy the trophy store.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Yeah, and he was working Andre Andre. You know, you
know that he's he's just taking advantage of you and
he's using he's not your real friend. And so yeah,
there was a lot going on behind.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
The Trophy and Bobby Heenen. Yeah, I'm going there.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
I think the brother of Bobby Heenen, you know, Ray
Heenan worked at a at the Trophy store. But this
all happens on Piper's Pitt, which is even more insane because,
like you go back before that, Hogan and Piper hate
each other on television, probably backstage two. And yet here
we are with Piper on Piper's Pitt being the good guy.
(15:00):
There's Andre, Bobby he walks out now and now Andre
is sweating like crazy in his suits.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
He always did, he always. I don't know what the
hell they were thinking.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Put him in suits, give him the damn black singlet
let him let him breathe damn it. But this is
where Andre rips off the crucifix of Cogan and he's.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Wearing put on him. He was gonna sweat, but him
in nothing.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Get him out there.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
He's naked, folks, and he's still somehow sweaty.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Yeah, no, he because that's that heart's working really hard
to get Yeah, so that's so true too, that a machine.
But because it was, that was a big machine to
take care of. So it was very tough.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Good point, very very good point, very good point.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
And uh, when Andre grabs that crucifix, thought, he scratches
Hogan's chest with his big, long ass goddamn wolverine nails
and makes him bleed. And Andre walks off, and Hogan's
on the ground holding his crucifix. He doesn't know what
to do. He's bleeding. Even Piper. Piper's like, you're you're bleeding,
and he touches his chest and his blood dripping. The
crucifix now's on the ground, like you know, in today's
(16:09):
world religion, it's up and down depending how you feel.
But seeing like the crucifix all on the ground, there's
blood there next to it, like, that's a heavy, heavy
moment in nineteen eighty seven on WWF television, Do you agree?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, And I think that it worked out tremendously better
than they had even hoped, because I uh, you know,
whether or not that Andrea was supposed to rip that
necklace off. I think it was just you know, grab
the shirt and uh, you know, breaking the chain and
then the cross falling to the ground and in the
(16:44):
necklace and then in the meantime there's a scratch and
there's you know, draws blood and also it was out
there that the Hulkster had put you know vapo what
a vapo mixer, remember the vapor rub under his eyes? Uh,
so that he would tear up. So there's you know,
then people have broken it down and who knows, but
(17:05):
they you know the shot where you see just before
andre U goes to grab the shirt, you see Hulk
do one of these on his eyes. And but my
point of it is though that the way they probably
laid that out, He's gonna rip the shirt and then
it goes from there. But then you've got the added
the necklace has gone you know, the cross, the crucifix
(17:27):
and whatever you think that I mean, the cross, you
know falls and that's symbolic because Hulks are who's he
thinking after every victory, He's looking to the skies, thanking
the big guy and uh and so and then he
falls to his knees and the tears are coming and
and then you know, Roddy playing the scene goes and
(17:48):
you're you're bleeding and it just so all of it
all comes together, there's blood, there's tears, uh, you know,
and and so there. It just could not have been
played out better because people felt that and uh, you
know in Hulkster maybe not the greatest thespian in the
world or whatever he was, it was it was awfully genuine.
(18:09):
You look at that whole scene and it worked. And
whether or not it was you know, set up to
do that way, but the way it played out, it
couldn't have been better.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
Yeah, And Hogan obviously looking there, he's like Andre, like,
come on, man, what's going on. He's he's shocked.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
He's not like one of those moments like a bad
guy turns on you and he beat up by your
bad guy, Like Andre clearly could just crush him right there. Instead,
he gave him a warning, you better give me a
title shot, dude, because we've been friends all these years.
You haven't give me a title show. This is what
Bobby Heen is saying, though pretty much out loud.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Never gave me a shot.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
And they walk off, And the best thing about that
is they have this moment later on when they have
to ask Hogan the challenge has been laid down, the
contract is there, Hogan will you fight Andre the Giant
at WrestleMania and Hogan sitting there, He's like, I don't
know what to do.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Yeah, show was the.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Crowd and the crowd standing and they the camera shakes
like clearly someone will all right, all right, I want
you to shake that goddamn camera yoursel.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Yeah, yeah, there Hard.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
It's very it's very intense, like you are in it.
I am all in on this storyline.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
It was. It was great storyteller telling you and.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Hogan didn't get like mad Andre, that's what's crazy about this.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
And he's just disappointed and sad he lost his friend.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Yeah, and that's that's a really good point. Uh. The
psychology in this was, I mean, how could you not
be behind Hulk on this because here he just felt
betrayed and sure, and there's everybody in that crowd had
a friend somewhere along the line that just just betrayed them,
just like, I can't, how could you do this to me?
I thought we were besties. I thought we were you
(19:47):
know that you would do anything for me, that we
would be friends for life, and then this is what
you do. And so who couldn't get behind that? And
and you know the Hulkster played it right up all
the way and you said in that scene there where
he's going, He's just it wasn't overdone, I didn't think
and it was just kind of like you're thinking the
(20:09):
same thing, like, Andrew, how would you do, dude? Listen
to that guy. He's screwed so many people and you're
gonna go with him with Heenan and you're gonna listen
to him and not the Hulkster. So the way they
set this up was was perfect. And you could also
see Andrea's point of it. Now you didn't have to
(20:29):
like it, right, you didn't have to agree with it
or want him to. But you're thinking, Okay, why why
hasn't he gotten a title shot? I mean, why why
he's not just because he's a giant, he doesn't he
doesn't get a chance to be What was the what
was the purpose behind that not getting it? So? Uh,
you could you could understand it. That's why it worked well.
(20:52):
When you get these setups sometimes you know when they
try and they're trying to force that that square peg
in the round hole to make that happen. Well, this
was this was not that at all. It worked both
ways because you didn't have to like what Andre was doing,
but you got it. He understood why he felt that
way and felt like maybe this guy has been you know,
(21:12):
I don't think, I don't believe that that's what Hulp did,
but I can understand while he's thinking that, you know,
like you know, because Sulksure did get pretty much exalted
because of being that on that rub with Andrea, and
so you got it, and that that's why that's set up,
you know that that everybody wanted to see happen.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
I remember those video clips to a show of old
Andre and he when Hogan first won the championship and
they dumped Champagne on Hogan's head, and this is when
Andre has like the afro, like the biro, and.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
It's just like wow, I don't remember him ever having
a fro. Of course I didn't, you know.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
I was just being the boy at that time, so
I didn't really watch a little too young can move
the clicker. But it's just so funny because i'd show
you the video packages over the years, like man, Andre
had a huge fro. And when you see baseball players
now put all the goggles over their eyes when they
get dumped and champion man brilliant because I have had
champagne in my eyes.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Not shit hurts things. Yeah, I don't know if Andre was.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Being a little bitch to Hogan in nineteen eighty five
four he dumped it on his head like he's dumping Uh.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Yeah, he had that fern on his head. It looked
like a brown fern. And yeah, that stuff was just soaking,
you know, so.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
It was very nice.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Now, the myth surrounding this matchup is Andre has never
been defeated in fifteen years.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
And he's also never been body slammed.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Now, in today's world, obviously we have phones, with the Internet, Google, YouTube, everything,
we could figure out who has lost to who, and
who actually hasn't body slam so on and so forth.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
In nineteen eighty seven, Andrea is still kind of It's
kind of like the Carnival world. We have territories.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
It will still go around.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
So for you, is it strange to trick your entire
audience to believing one thing or it's it's fine because
no one.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Has actually seen him be body slammed in the WWF
at least.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah, I think I don't think that that was a problem.
I think it's the same thing. It was just because
of the what was at stake in this one and
that it had never really been documented and this was
going to make it official. Could he do it in
front of this massive crowd with the title on the line.
(23:26):
So yeah, and I'm sure that there were smart marks
out there that knew and they were taught. They got
in the dirt sheets were saying, yeah, they said never
mund body slam. But we know that this happened on
this date. But we remember, we all go along for
this ride. Steve and the WWF WWE universe at the
(23:48):
time was more than willing to get on the ship
and go for the ride. And so it wasn't even
a factor in that. And that was a part of
professional wrestling, you know all the time. You know how
many times if people leave time, leave town, how many
times did they retire and unretire, you know what I mean.
So it was it was just part of it. And uh,
(24:10):
you know, people were all in. So that that was
you know, certainly the the information was out there and
call them what they fueled them as rumors or whatever,
but nobody nobody cared. Uh, they wanted to see this matchup.
And the fact that Andre the giant could become a champion,
the WWF heavyweight champion would have was you know enough
(24:34):
and so uh it was. It was just that the
hype on this could not have been bigger and and
for that reason, it didn't matter what happened in the
square circle that night. And when we get into the
match here there you break it down, It wasn't a
whole lot to it. No, a number of reasons.
Speaker 1 (24:55):
Of course, it's it's more of the moments versus the moves,
at least for me personally. The big myth around this
too is I'm very curious about your opinion is Andre
is suffering. You know his have severe back issues. But
the thing with that is I've read that and heard
that forever. But yet he continuously wrestles even after this.
You know, he he not every house show, not every
(25:17):
a big event, but.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
He is at a lot of these.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Like he doesn't get done as an active wrestler on
pay per views and television until like what nineteen ninety ish,
So this is yeah, this is eighty seven. So to
your knowledge, when I keep hearing he's injured, he's hurt,
he can't continue, but he's going to continue.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
How hurt.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Really is he? Like, obviously he's a big man, so
his back hurts. But every day I wake up, my
back hurts because I suck wrong. So my question is
how hurt is he heading into this? Or is this
myth about injury grown so far over the years that
we don't know the truth anymore.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Now, all you had to see was Andre backstage to
understand really what he was his condition was. That was
all heart I you know, I'm going to get emotional.
I start thinking about what like seeing him backstage and
how he would move, you know, just you could see
it as much as he hit it. And even after
(26:17):
WrestleMania two, there were you know, it was out there
that he was hurting. His back was a mess. His
spine was narrowing and carrying around that kind of weight
on a frame that wasn't designed that way. It breaks
down and the disease just progresses. Andre never wanted to
(26:39):
do anything about it. He had opportunities to take medications
that might have changed that, but he never would and
he knew that it was just going to continue. And
so if you saw his performances as he went in,
you know, he didn't do a whole lot in the ring.
He would still do the thing. He stepped over the
(26:59):
top rope, he would go down. He went down, you
know a couple of times in this match, getting body slammed.
Imagine that. But he was willing to pay the price
for this business because of his love for it, and uh,
it's you know, to him, it was what else was
there in his life. But he paid a steep price
(27:22):
for it. And like I said, all you had to
do was see him backstage, and there were bad you know,
there were there were periods where he was better than
than you know, other times where he moved around a
lot better and you would see him then to the
end there when he was using the crutches, you know,
the aluminum crutches that you would walk around on. But
(27:42):
but it was it was a continuing process. He you know,
he had surgery and h I think that that helped
to an extent, but his body was just going to
continue to break down and then that's what it did.
And uh, even towards the end, like I think his
last match was in ninety one, he didn't want to stop.
(28:06):
And that's what happened with between him and Vince, is
that he felt that Vince, you know kind of used
them up. Well, I happen to think that to an extent. Okay,
you can make that argument. But also at the same time,
Vince couldn't see it, couldn't watch it anymore either. He
didn't want that way that be, that to be the
(28:29):
way that would end for Andre. And you know, you've
seen interviews with Vince afterwards when he talks about it
and he gets emotional just thinking about it. That you know,
people can talk about it one way or the other.
They can they can say with their their hate for
Vince and that he just used him up, and when
he wasn't useful to him anymore, he cast him aside.
(28:50):
I happened to be on the other side of that
in the sense that he saw what Andre was going
through and didn't want to see it end for him
in front of crowds, him being in the shape that
he was in. And but at the Pontiac Silverdome that day,
Andre gave everything he had. Like I said, he went down.
(29:13):
People should go and watch the match. If you were
looking for the two ring tacticians, you're not going to
find them unless you go look at that macho man
ricky steamboat match. But but it. The excitement of that match.
We even watching it again, I still felt like the
(29:34):
same way that and I wasn't there, but I said
when I got to see it that I felt the
same way that. You know, I know, like John Cena
talked about when he was a kid basically watching this
and his house became the Pontiac Silver Dome where you know,
he had fifty relatives come over. That's how exciting it was.
And that match to them carried it. Now the people
(29:56):
that are more a lot of tear things down and
they talk about the match there was. I mean, think
you can go through that and you could say, okay,
they run into each other, they go into the turnbuckle,
they hulked us shops, they hulked us some chops. We
got the ten count of Andrea on the turnbuckle. Okay,
it's all that, but you listen to that crowd and
(30:16):
they popped for everything. And even that at the one
point where Andre falls you know, falls down, he hulk
comes off the rope and collides with him, and Andrea
goes down, It's like whoa. You know, So if you
were in there looking for this, you know, memorable tactician
matchup that wasn't what it was about. It was the
(30:39):
fact you had these two in there for the WWF
Championship and two of the greatest names in professional wrestling.
And big question was was the Hulks are going to
be able to pull this off? Could he body slam
Andre the Giant? It delivered, It delivered, And I know
that the newsletter him Meltzer, and you know he was
(31:02):
I think he gave it minus five stars initially and
then changed it to minus three, Like, come on, you
missed the whole point of what that encounter was, what
it was all about.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
So Jesus Christ, they really give it that.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah, it was something, Yeah, it was something really Really that's.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Pretty strange to think because wrestling also is so subjective,
like you each person, you could love a brawler but
hate high flying, or love to the wrestling, hate you know,
hardcore wrestling, and so I think that's first of all,
that's fucking weird. And also how everyone has been obsessed
with one person's opinion for forty years.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
I think you have to but throw all that out.
That crazy nothing about that. It wasn't about the you know,
there's a story two guys in and who's going to
walk out the champion and so.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Who gouna goddamn bigger trophy, motherfucker.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
That's what.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
That's what. No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
No, it was really about it was such a great story.
And the thing though backstage more I've read Holk Cogan's book.
I've heard these stories, and tell me what you have
heard on the backstage when you work there, because the
story is as worth. They're heading out there, Hogan's not
sure that Andre is going to let him body slim them.
Even the music man is. He's telling Hogan, don't worry,
(32:18):
don't worry, don't worry. But in reality, well, this is
two people are involved with this dance, and if one
person does want to cooperate, who's five hundred plus pounds
he can, you know, pretty much decide not to let
you have your moment. So Hogan handing out there in
this nervous wreck with ninety three thousand people, he says.
Hogan says he didn't know if Andre was going to
(32:38):
let him body Over the years, what have you heard
from other wrestlers, Well.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I think, uh, you know that that certainly adds them
to the mystique of this match, that you know that
the way they want to tell it is that, well,
Cogan had no idea what was was Andre going to
put him over. He gonna you know, just lay out
on him and not let him, you know, do what
(33:05):
he had to do. Uh. You know that the story
goes Holkster had you know, made notes for this match,
this whole thing. He wanted to be very respectful. He
was always very respectful of Andre, and uh, you know,
like initially, I'm sure there was some resentment with Andre,
but I think they that Andre grew to respect Hulk
(33:28):
Hogan and uh and I think the Holkster's respect for
Andre just grew even more. And by the time they
got to this point, you know, the story can go
on as they say that nobody knew, not even Vince knew.
But I think that Andre had way too much respect
for this business that you're gonna you're gonna mess with that,
(33:52):
You're gonna you're gonna let your ego get involved. That
wasn't the way Andre was. And I think all along
he knew that he was gonna do what he is
going to need to do. He may have been, you know,
messed with the Hulkster a bit with this, but I
don't think there was ever a question in his mind.
And as the as Hulk Hogan tells the story that
(34:13):
you know, he realized like once they were in the match,
because he got no feedback supposedly from Andrea from the
notes that he made while all the stuff we're going
to do in this but he said that once we
started the match, Andre was by the letter did everything
that that as they went along, so it gave him
more confidence in it. But I think that and Vince
(34:39):
saying the same thing, I just he's going to do
the right thing was just to add a little more
mystique to this thing. And my feeling overall is that
there was never a question in Andre's mind that that
he was going to put Hulk over. And I love
I love the intrigue of it, and I will help
let help let that live on forever. That there were
(35:01):
questions or whether or not. But knowing Andre and and
the way that he loved this business and had the
respect for the boys once, if he had respect for
you and he then why would he do that. He
didn't have that kind of ego where he was going
to put his his legend in jeopardy of he you know,
(35:23):
at that on that world stage that he decided to
just lay out, I'm not going to do it. I'm
not going to let you put you over that way,
you know. So that's that where I stand, and I
think most of the guys that worked with Andrea and
knew him felt the same way. But I love the
mystique on it. It will live on forever. Here we are,
(35:45):
how many years later, and there's still that question. Was
Andre was he thinking about maybe not letting a hulk
body slam him because you know, you're not doing that
without help. He needed Andrea to help him do that.
As big and strong as Ulkster was, that ain't happening
(36:05):
without Andrea's approval. And uh, and it was. It was.
It was a pretty damn good one. And uh you
got to imagine that it probably didn't feel real good
for Andre on the receiving end of that, the conditioning
he was in, but uh, he did it. And uh,
this this match lives on forever is as uh, you know,
(36:28):
one of the pinnacles, one of the greatest matches, not
because of what you know they did in that ring,
but what it stood for, and uh, what it did
for the professional wrestling world that day in Pontiac, Michigan.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
I also think that the Andre Vince thing where they're like,
we're not gonna tell Hogan if you're gonna let him
buys them, he was kind of a rib. And we've
heard so many ribs in wrestling where it's just one
of those things where well, we're gonna actually let you
boys lammy, but we're gonna let you believe up to
that the last second that you're not going to boyslam
me because this is a boys club. It feels like,
(37:05):
so we are going to do the boys will be
boys and.
Speaker 3 (37:07):
Just screw with you until you snap. Didn't Steve.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
There was way too much at stake in this for everybody, so.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I know the idea of that happening.
Speaker 2 (37:17):
They understay all understood the enormity of this and the
fact that the world was watching, and I remember that
used to be the slogan the world is watching, and
uh yeah it was watching that day, So uh yeah,
a rib come on is there? Everybody understood the enormity
(37:37):
of this, And it was never a question in my
mind that Andrea wasn't gonna do what he did.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Imagine that though you're like my feeling he has to
pick up Andre, and he just lays.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Well, he kicked out, Yeah, I ain't going anywhere. I'm
not going up. You just said, you know, done one
of those and so yeah, and uh uh you know
that story also goes when when it was time that
(38:13):
Andre told Terry okay, let's do it. Whatever it was
that mentioned, but it was okay, let's go, and that's
that's when it happened. So it's uh yeah, unbelievable that
you know, what Andre did that day was was phenomenal
(38:34):
and it did it just launched the Hulkster into the
stratosphere and how could you not uh feel it when
you watch it even to this day, you just feel
that that electricity of what was going on then and
you know, never they never looked back.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
I gotta say also, Bobby Heenen steals the show and
fashion in this matchup because he has a wonderful, very
bright glittery suit with tails. And this is also the
Wrestlmannia where you come on motorized rings because the arena
is so big, they have to put the ring on
a platform so if you were sitting anywhere, you could
(39:12):
see it because ninety three thousand people and Bobby on
that though with his coattails his suit and of course
Jesse and Gorill are on commentary. Like those three players
I want to mention as well because they are involved
with this heavy to the end because Bobby's selling everything
for Andre. Bobby's been the voice for Andre this whole storyline. Now,
Jesse and Grilla have the job to make sure everyone
(39:35):
knows what's happening in the ring, because at one point
they even play on this for the entire year where
Hogan does try to pick up Andre in this matchup
and it's one two hopefully kicks out and Jesse is
convinced that Hogan did not kick out, And from this
point on, even after this matchup, throughout the year, they
can keep playing this like, well, did you really kick out?
(39:59):
Or what the referee uh in on this and that
place was a double referees years wait.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Joey, Joey was two and a half.
Speaker 3 (40:10):
It was, it was. It was very close.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
But one of the big things about this Wrestmatia too
is everyone brings up Hogan.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Body slamming Andre because the visual.
Speaker 1 (40:18):
Even years later in the Attitude aeron Ruthless Aggression, the
opening still had Hogan body slamming Andre. Pardon me, not
the attitude era, because I know someone's gonna be like
he was a ww dickhead. Sorry, sorry, folks. But Macho
Man rius Ricky Steamboat also takes place on this and
every year when people have Wrestlemantia Marathon matches to watch
Macho Man and Steamboat get picked, not Hogan for us
(40:40):
Andre and as years ago on, rumors are there's jealousy
between Macha Men and Hoe Cogan for as long as
both men were alive. Was their jealousy between Hogan and Savage?
And did it start here that you know of?
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Well, I think I wouldn't call it jealousy. I would
say it was like this professional envy in a sense
that uh and you know all the all the guys
when you go out there, uh and you have a
match and it's a great match, you know it, and
it's kind of an unsaid thing. You can be backstage
(41:15):
and you may not be the main event, but everybody
knows that that was the match. And as far as
what as I mentioned, whatever, what you're looking for, that
match with Randy and and and Ricky Steamboat was incredible
really obviously just one of the uh you know, ring tacticians,
(41:38):
both of them tremendous workers, and that match, they did
not let it down. It was absolutely the match of
the night. And uh, you know, I'm sure that both ways, Randy,
being the competitor that he was, felt, you know that
they should have gotten uh maybe you know, more marquee
(42:00):
out of it, more recognition for it. I'm sure that
in a sense that the hulkture was like she's they
put a match like that and and and you know,
all it does is tear this one down. You know
that it takes something away from it? Why why why
do that? Why not let this be it? So sure
there was you know, the professional jealousy or whatever you
(42:21):
want to call it, but that's the healthy part of
this business. That's what makes those guys go out there
and try and show each other up every night. But
I'm I'm I'm sure exactly as you described there was
that there was a sense and both Randy and Ricky
knew that they had the match of the night. But
as I said, that's that match between Andrea and Hulk Cogan.
(42:45):
It wasn't about the skill set, it wasn't about the
high flying, it wasn't about these incredible moves. It wasn't
necessarily about you know, what was going on there. It
was a storytelling, it was the it was the enormity
of what was behind those two in the ring. So yes,
both of them were tremendous, but for their own reasons
(43:08):
and overall the there's no question in my mind that
the Andre and on Oh COVID match overshadowed everything despite
the years that we saw. Yeah, between with Randy and Ricky,
there's no question. You want to talk about a match,
absolutely that's still even to these this day. People you know,
(43:28):
talk talk about matches of the greatest matches of all time.
That's part of the conversation. But that's not what this
event was about. And that so uh, it's you know,
as they say, you know, two things can be right, Uh,
you know two things can be you know, the same.
Uh they were in that sense as far as how
as far as watchability, like what are you watching for?
(43:49):
But it depends what you're looking at. But uh, the
main event was absolutely the main event. There was not
nothing took it away from it. Uh. And and also
the impact. Let's say that that match with Randy and
Rickey was the main event, Well, how would that have unbelievable,
tremendous match, greatest match of all time? Argument, How did
it change professional wrestling? Right?
Speaker 3 (44:12):
It did not. Okay, this made wrestlers want to become wrestlers, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
But I'm saying overall in the industry, this one was
an earthquake, which is we talked about him another time,
but it was. It shook. It shook the professional wrestling world,
and it did. It shook it up, and the trajectory
kept going. It kept happening.
Speaker 1 (44:37):
It's true and interesting though, because towards the end of
eighty seven eventually Savage and Hogan get together and then
you know, lady, the megapower is the whole run. So
I could see now I'm not doing it, but I
could see people put dots together and being like, well,
Hogan was mad at Savage for getting over here. Now people,
the underground fans are interest interested in wrestling, not Hulkamane anymore.
Speaker 3 (45:01):
Well, if Hogan.
Speaker 1 (45:02):
Attaches himself to like the wrestler that people love, maybe
he can keep his love with the wrestlers and then
the kids and the moms and the bringing their grandparents.
I don't know, that's just a weird theory to jump
out right now, because like sometimes you've seen it over years,
where a star is rising, a star is going down,
So start going down connects himself to wrestler going up,
(45:23):
so he continually going up. Not to say that Hogan
was going down at all around this time, but attaching
yourself to a pure wrestler versus you being a sports
entertainer maybe helped Hogan's longevity amongst certain fans.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
Yes, and you can do a real deep dive on this,
Steve and start thinking that, uh, you know this was
this was all in the stars and that the Evince
was that genius and PA think yeah, and then down
then and then we're gonna get Randy into this, and
we're gonna put them in. Like I don't think they
they they were able to dive that deep, but I
(45:59):
think they may have seen the star power of Randy
and what what he could do and say, you know,
he's he's somebody who could definitely part of this future.
Because as we know, Evince was always starting to think
about Okay, we hadn't even seen the peak of Hulka
Mania yet, but he had to be thinking in his mind, well, yeah,
but we're gonna need backup, uh, you know, and and
(46:22):
then and then look where we went from there. Uh,
certainly other upper episodes that we've done and will show
the impact of the union between hul Cogan and Randy
Savage and how they impacted professional wrestling for ver. So
it all, it all, you know, was part of this,
but this one was really at the foundation of you know,
(46:45):
how things would really come to be and uh, you
know the fact that it happened when it did, and
and and move things along much quicker uh has made
made this that event and the match historic forever.
Speaker 3 (47:00):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
And the business side of it too, is like, think about,
we don't really have pay per view. Pay per view
is the thing in nineteen eighty seven, but it's not
the thing. Not everyone is having it. You're still going
to theaters, local arenas to watch pay per views.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
This event itself four hundred thousand buys on pay per view.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
That's gigantic, Folks for nineteen eighty seven, Like, oh my god,
how this happened? Closed circuit estimated ten million dollars. And again,
this is nineteen eighty seven total gross pay per view
plus closed circuit plus live gate that's over twenty million dollars.
This is unprecedented in nineteen eighty seven. This is not
(47:39):
a normal thing we're having in smoke filled arenas. For
business wise, again, this begins this giant movement which we'll
talk about in other episodes, where Vince can use his
WrestleMania brand as bargaining tools to hurt other wrestling companies
because Russeumenia is such a success, especially WrestleMania three.
Speaker 2 (48:01):
Yeah, no question about that. And and that's you're right,
that is a whole other episode. But of the impact
that you know, Vince McMahon had on the pay per
view industry, who knows where that would have ever gone.
And look what we're doing today with the streaming and
everything else. Well, you know, thank the WWE for that growth,
because what else did you see. You know, you had
(48:21):
boxing matches that were going to be you know, started
with closed circuit they could, they were kind of the
first to do that, but at the same time, they
were sporadic that you didn't have regularly necessarily, you know,
every month or something, necessarily having a big, gigantic event.
And the WWE did that and and it just took
(48:44):
off from there and for a very long time, you
really didn't see much else that on that scale. You
had other pay per views, but not on the scale
that you saw with the WWE. And one thing also,
I wanted to mention that I did love about this match,
and I think it was I don't know if it
was a tribute to or let's take advantage of it,
but they wanted this event, especially the main event, to
(49:08):
have that big fight feel with and if you remember
Jesse when he when they do the introductions, is giving
the tail of the tape, the chest size, the biceps,
the forearms, the wrists, the calves, you know, and and
then you got Bob Buker comes in as the special
guest ring announcer to announce them. Mary Hart from Entertainment
(49:32):
Tonight is the brink the timekeeper. Uh So I got
a kick out of that, and it's it's just an aside,
I guess, but I love the fact that they did.
They made it try, you know, give it that big
fight feel, you know, the those kind of introductive introductions,
just like they do did with boxing, or do with boxing,
(49:52):
and and so, uh it was maybe a little bit
of a salute to, uh, you know, the beginnings of
pay per view and that whole thing with boxing and
a little tribute to that and also stealing a little
bit of it as far as the marketing of it go.
But I just thought I really thought that was a
cool thing, a cool part of it, you know, especially
when they're reeling off Andrea's statistics.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
God damn it, tell me how big his legs are?
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Yeah, oh yeah, but and you probably don't know this,
but what is he announced? You know, Andre's got twenty
one inch biceps, Ulkster's got twenty four. So wow, the
pythons are you know, he's got a bigger snake on
those shoulders. But I did I love that and I
just got a I got a kick out of hearing
(50:41):
it again with Jesse doing the announcing. So and those
two worked well together. You know. I've seen comments with
people like saying, well, yeah, no, Jesse and Gorilla were
just great together. Yes they were. But when what I've
been asked, like, personally, what did I would I like?
I I like Gorilla and Bobby together. I like Vince
(51:02):
and Jesse together. That's but that's just personal preference, folks.
Everybody had their preferences, and that.
Speaker 3 (51:10):
Man, you have all these people, Yeah, and this, you know.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
With the irresistible force versus the immovable object, with gorilla
and and all of his God, so many great gorilla
is whatever you want to call them. We got a
lot of them in these in these matchups.
Speaker 3 (51:31):
Yeah them, No that again, the commentary is outstanding.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
The crowd and the slow movements of Andre and Hogan
walking up to each other, and Hogan's just sitting there
shaking his head and Andre and you can.
Speaker 3 (51:45):
Feel like that's the thing too, is there's the.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
Difference now watching television where you're like you're expecting a
reaction from fans and so immediately when a bad show,
people go on online go it's because of Montreal not
being a good crowd, or if this is because Baltimore
was a shitty crowd, this crowd. If you thought this
match was bad, shut the volume off and watch it
with no volume, and you can see visually the audience
(52:10):
standing the entire time, no matter what, no punch, no
kick falling over, whatever your critique of this match is,
watch the audience. The audience is having the time of
their life. And I think that people forget.
Speaker 2 (52:23):
About Yeah, and and like you said, the two of
them toe to toe in the ring. That and again
then that big fight feel and they're just you know,
nose to nose just like you see. And uh and
that intensity and Andre and and and the and the
apprehension and I think is the best way to put it.
(52:43):
Like you said, Hulk is kind of you know, shaken,
and it wasn't like necessarily fear, but apprehension. What's going
to happen here? And uh, yeah, loved it. It was
a big fight. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
As from this then creates the rematch they have They
bill Rustmania four having a rematch in that world titled tournament.
Speaker 3 (53:03):
You have the double refereematch.
Speaker 1 (53:05):
You have the birth of Survivor series based off this match,
which happens in later on in November with Team Hole
universus Team Andre, the birth of Summer Slam with the
Megabox versus the Mega Powers. Honestly, I don't think people
give Andre in the Hogan rivalry enough credit because it.
Speaker 3 (53:23):
Created so many other moments.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Out of this Body Slam, out of this rivalry, out
of bad trophies being delivered, This turned into two years
of storylines and I think another lot of matches do
that a lot of matches? It's we have our match, Okay, boom.
Now you go off fight this guy, and I'll go
fight that guy. This one is they're connected at the
hip for at least another two years, which is.
Speaker 3 (53:46):
Longevity, which really shows you this worked out.
Speaker 2 (53:49):
Yeah, oh know, and then also think about how it
helped everybody else, all the superstars. Yeah, because as you said,
you know, they had their teams and you know, a
rub from Andrea for a Heel and Hulkster, all the
different guys that he ended up putting over. So yeah,
it put them on the scale of that stage up
(54:13):
there that they were kingmakers in a sense that you know,
you got that rub from one of those guys and
it and it helped, uh, you know, spread the marquee
for the rest of these guys and uh you know
Randy certainly one of them with the Hulkster and and
you know all that that took place from then on.
But the list goes on and on, all of those guys,
(54:37):
Ted Dibiassi and you know, we could just name the boy.
Speaker 3 (54:43):
Characters like so like.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
For other organizations where you're not necessary, let's say you
know you've got a champion and he's a you don't
get the same thing. These guys were just beyond the stars,
and they made them stars just by being around them.
They had been put in that position that whoever got
next to them became more known and more popular. So
(55:10):
it was the whole thing was just brilliant as far
as the way it worked from that point point on,
and it was a formula that they rode for decades. Yeah,
you know, and that's where you know, they started to
really realize just the power of that. It was old
school wrestling in a sense, but never had people and
(55:31):
never had wrestlers. They had been put in that kind
of position where they were known the world over, and
you know, these guys happy to ride those coattails because
it meant not only this, you know, the recognition, but money.
These guys were making money like they'd never seen before,
way beyond what they'd ever seen in any other wrestling organization.
(55:55):
And it went on and on.
Speaker 4 (55:57):
They all paid a price, though, yeah, yes, we always
talk about the price is paid before we wrap this
up at kind of a two part question is as
we record this, it's twenty twenty five, the ww inducted
the Brett Hart Versus stonecall c of Aston Match or
Wrestling A thirteen to the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 1 (56:14):
That's the first match ever going Hall of Fame. My
question to you is Hogan body setting Andre not the match,
not the match, the moment. Should that go into the
Hall of Fame for the WWE audience or if you
had a mount rushmore as well? Is this body Slam
a top four WWE moment of all time?
Speaker 2 (56:37):
Well? Yes on both counts, Absolutely no question about it. Yeah,
that that match, and as we said, it wasn't about
the skill set, It wasn't about the moves that happened
in that ring or what went. It was all about
what it represented and how it changed professional wrestling forever.
(56:59):
There's no way without those two ninety three thousand people
wouldn't have been in that stadium that day. And I
know that as you know, Vince saw those numbers just
keep going up. Uh, you know that they sweated it
out in a sense that thinking, because to sell that
many tickets, my god, you know that was an enormous challenge.
(57:21):
But they, you know, once they had this going, and
they you know that, you hear the stories of how
they couldn't even believe it that how fast and how much,
you know, how the tickets were selling for this and
in Pontiac Mission again of all places. Now that that
that's not like they didn't have resting events. But think about,
you know, the population center. It's not exactly one of
(57:43):
the biggest in the world or even the United States
by any stretch, but ninety three thousand people plus showed
up there and whatever it was, but it was a
It was a hell of a lot of people and
an unbelievable, incredible accomplishment all the way route Mountain Rushmore
as far as matches go. And also you know Hall
(58:04):
of Fame.
Speaker 1 (58:05):
Yeah, to Michigan fans, we love you. We love you
out there in Michigan, all right, we love you. Because
we did an episode once and I was in Pittsburgh
and the first the first thing you said to me
was how are you doing today?
Speaker 3 (58:15):
I'm in Pittsburgh. I advised never to come here.
Speaker 1 (58:17):
All the comments were, what's wrong with Pittsburgh?
Speaker 2 (58:21):
What's wrong with Pittsburgh?
Speaker 3 (58:23):
You It was scary that day. I was there, folks
for back last year. It was scary.
Speaker 1 (58:28):
But no, I think this moment again, like all moments
in the Golden Era, this will go down as one
of the top moments because it created a moment, It
created a lifetime. People still talk about Andre, still talk
about Hogan the body heard the round in the world.
You can feel every any which way you want about Hokogan,
but I'm not gonna let you disparage this moment professional
wrestling history. So Hogan Body sing Andre two thumbs up
(58:48):
for me. You say, hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (58:50):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (58:51):
So in reality, Restumeda three. It's a long, long, long event, folks,
and this is you know, the beginning. I feel like
even WRESTLINGI one on consider it's like the Golden Era,
but it's like connected to another era.
Speaker 3 (59:03):
In rsselating three, I feel like is the birth of the.
Speaker 1 (59:05):
Golden Era where we get all of our macho mans
and warriors and demolition and so on and so forth.
But in reality, then, mister Mooney, it is always the
pleasure of talking to you about the Golden Era. I'm
ce fault he Shamuni. Have a wonderful day and we'll
see you next time.
Speaker 3 (59:20):
Bye bye,
What is going on wrestling fans. It's ic Well, welcome
back to ten count Media. It's another edition of the
Golden Era Podcast. Was Sean mooney Moonman himself.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I'm doing good. Good to see you, brother. It's spend
a little break we had there, and yes you've been
incredibly busy, but it's nice that we put time aside
to spend some QT time together and talk about the
Golden Era.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Oh hell yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
And today we are talking about I think the peak
of the Golden Era, the thing that started at all
the day that Hulk Kuggin body slam that big stinking
giant Aren't a giant wrestling A three. Today we're talking
about the impact of just that one body slam and
professional wrestling. And before we get into all the details, Yeah,
my question to you is, you know, wrestling your one
(00:56):
huge monumental. But without the success of wrestling at three,
would we be in today's world with a Netflix, in
t KO, in ESPN.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Uh, Well, that that certainly is debatable. If you know that, uh,
this one event was that uh you know, incredible and
was the the peak at least at the beginning to
to really launch things. I totally agree with that would
Hulkamania have reached the heights that it did, probably, but
(01:30):
I think it would have taken longer. This was uh,
this was you know SpaceX launch for the w w
F at the time, and uh, you know it wasn't
you know, the the hul com Mania was already starting
to you know, it's climb and we saw that after
you know, WrestleMania one and all of that. But the
(01:52):
fact that Andre the Giant uh you know, stepped into
that ring with Hulk Cogan, went toe to toe with him,
and uh, you know, they still talk about it. The
body slam heard around the world certainly escalated things much quicker.
I think then, you know what would have taken a
course so to say, to answer that question, you know,
(02:13):
was it the thing and would the wwe have not
reached the peaks that it has. I think it certainly
would have happened. At some point. They still had Hulkogan,
they still had the magic that he had going. They
had a formula going that just kept continuing to build.
I mean, think about it. At that time, even at
these you know house shows, these tapings that they did,
(02:35):
they were still drawing you know, twenty thousand people to
some of these things. And if you think back to
then and all, you know, some of the other wrestling
organizations that were out there. I mean, if they put
two thousand in a building, they were just ecstatic. It
was like, oh my god, we knew new highs, you know,
like with ECW or these other outfits out there. So
(02:56):
to Madge just for a house show that they're putting
twenty thousand people in there shows you that it was
already taking off. But uh, you know, putting ninety three
thousand plus and coursers that was there really, but come on,
take a look at the Pontiac Overton was just packed
to the rafters. That was not a I there was
no uh you know.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
It was a.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Yeah, there weren't cardboard cardboard audience members out there. And
so to pull that off, and you got to think
about what Vince McMahon's vision was. I saw an image
that was online of of of Vince and he's on
one of those uh you know, the things that they used.
(03:41):
They brought everybody out to the ring, the rings on
the road, but the upper yeah, they go up and
down whoever. So he's on one of those and he's
just looking. You can see in this an empty stadium,
and I just had to think what was in his
mind that day, thinking like, oh my god, we could
do this. Yeah, I see it. You know, it's empty,
(04:01):
and to think about what they did, and that just
shows you what a visionary he was at the time.
You know, everybody always has these dreams of things that
they could do. Well, Vince McMann did it, damn it,
you know. And who would have ever thought at that
time that you were going to be putting nearly one
hundred thousand people into a stadium for a wrestling event,
(04:22):
you know, I mean, that's that's super Bowl type of
audience members you're talking about. So it was an incredible,
incredible event and of course a fantastic card. Well I'm
sure we'll talk about what some of the other matches
were on that card, and we'll also talk about what
we thought of this match. But the fact that you
(04:44):
had hul Cogan and Andre the Giant, who was arguably
and now I'll say I'll say it, he was really
one of the first mainstream professional wrestlers. Everybody had heard
of Andre the Giant. He was this massive human and
there's no doubt he wasn't a giant and so he
was you know, Hulk maybe took it to different places obviously,
(05:07):
but to have those two in the ring and they
and it captured the world's attention. Pay per view was
in its infancy, and the numbers I'm sure we'll talk
about those two were phenomenal considering I think the overall
take on that event was over twenty million dollars, which
at the time was gigantic. So answering that question, yes,
(05:31):
it was pivotal. Did it change the history of the
WWE forever? Yes, absolutely, But to say that it wouldn't
have happened, I don't think so. I think eventually they
would have gotten to that point, but it certainly expedited
that process. Shall we say.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
See, I'm happy you said that answer because you easily
could have been like, yes, of course, as Body Slam
changed the world, babies were born, you know, flowers are blooming.
You know, you could have said that, and you know what,
the revised history of this event and this Body Slam,
that is what we're told.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
You know, we're told this event, this Body Slam changes
the wrestling world forever. Without this, there would be no foundation.
You know, we're talked about Austin three sixteen. We're talked,
we're always told these things that change the world. But
when you watch them in real time and see how,
beat by beat, how they actually do affect the.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
World, you know this is a huge event. WrestleMania one itself, Yes,
gigantic event world. Yes, it connected to MTV, which was
like the coolest thing in the world in nineteen eighty five.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
That created a cartoon.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Then we got into Wrestlmania two where we're so big,
we're so hot, Let's go into three locations to make
three amounts of money.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
I think Vince mc man is known for a man
who takes big swings, and WrestleMania three is going he's going, okay,
Well he did great rest Menu one. We got that
cartoon where whole comedias running the wild. We're all over
the real world. We're on TV shows. People are asking
for wrestlers. But like, if you don't keep delivering big moments,
are you the flash in a pan? Like anything that
(07:02):
has appeared in pulp culture before, in wrestling, Eli's the
w W they have They've they have stayed the course,
staying in your eye, just like Coca Cola, just like Pepsi.
These companies their legacy brands that we all recognize, and
Wrestling the Three help that legacy brand continue. I'm just
so happy that you didn't say yes and changed everything.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
Stave moving on.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
You never know what's going to come out of this
coconut up here, do you?
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Piper could have hit snuck it with your coach, that's.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
True and then knock me into a wall. But but you,
but also you you really have to think about that.
You you said you mentioned Vince always you know, swung
for the fences. Uh and and uh. It's well documented
that when wrestled Ania one happened that he pretty much
just put everything he put, uh, you know, everything on
(07:53):
black and and rolled the the dice, you know, to
see what was going to happen. And and the company
would have been in serious trouble if that had fallen,
you know, come up short, I mean, it could have
been a disaster. And the same thing here when he
(08:14):
attempts to put over ninety three thousand people into a stadium,
can you ment how bad they can you imagine how
bad that would have been if let's say they put
half that number in there, which would have been a
huge crowd, let's say almost fifty thousand, but in a
stadium like that, it would have looked empty and it
would have been a disaster. And what do you do
at that point, You've already committed your going. You gotta
(08:36):
go do it. So you're thinking, oh, man, you know,
then you're gonna put the black sheets up over seats
and you know, the whole thing. And so Vince gambled again.
He did it again and again. And that's the kind
of person that I think he remained. It's not like
Vince really ever changed. But how many people have the
stones to do something like that, And you know, he
(08:59):
never lost the big of it that not we're going
to do it, and by god, they did it. And
so for a number of reasons, it was a historic event,
and very much so that would, you know, blaze the
trail for all the events beyond that. But everybody remembers
that one as certainly one of the greatest ever because
(09:21):
of all that was involved. You know, the stadium, a
Hulk Andre Randy Savage in that match that they still
which was you know, people say it's somewhat overshadowed the
big main event, and we'll talk about that, but really, overall,
it was one of the biggest events to ever. Let's
it ever take place in the history of professional wrestling,
(09:45):
and there's certainly up there today. Remember it as being
won with all they done.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Oh yeah, And it's funny you bring up the tark
thing on the because I've gone to so many big
events over the years, and the most recent in the
past four years, even ones you know at Metlive Stadium
or all these big arenas, the stage takes up half
of the arena most of the time, so then they
have to put black curtains all around that because it's
(10:12):
all filled with equipment in stage hands and so. But
when you see that picture is very famous from this event,
it's way up top someone like when all the way
up took a picture, it shows you it. There's no
black tarps, there's nothing like we are full to the max.
And again, if you want to argue if there's seventy
three or ninety three, the image is still there, the
(10:34):
pictures are still there, that the atmosphere is still rocking.
So like if you want to argue over sinematics and numbers,
it's still historic.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
It's still crazy.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
But I want to go back to the beginning of
this rivalry because over the years.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
You know, these two and Drey and Hogan on television
had a friendship.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
And it's so funny because under the Giant gets a
trophy given to him and he's like, oh, you know,
all all your hard work and all your dedication, you
get a trophy. It's like the size of a little
bowling trophy, like, oh, here you go, buddy. Yeah, and
here's one for Superstar of the Year for whole Cogan.
(11:11):
It's this giant ass huge trophy and for being a.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Champion for three years or something.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Yeah, it's so funny because wheneveryone thinks of like man
not body slam or this moment, Well, you got to
go back to how it happened. It's because of a
mishap at the trophy store when they ordered Andre's trophy
and they got a drinky one and they ordered Hogan's
and it was gigantic.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
You know.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
That's just to me is one of those funny moments
of like, wow, what happened.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Sure it was a mix up, Bobby Heenen.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Bobby Heenen was working there.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
I don't think so, let me plunder, Yeah, I don't
think so. And it you know started the got the
stirrings of of this going on. And as you said,
you know, friendship made in Heaven, really andre And and
the whole Cogan and Andre had for the most part
always been a babyface as far for the the w
(12:06):
W w F and beyond and and so when this tea,
this heel turn was taking place, it was like kind
of whoa, what the hell, what's going on here? And uh,
you know, and and people also have to remember that
the Holster and Andre weren't weren't new to each other. They
had wrestled several times in the past, the whole I
(12:29):
believe even at one show body slammed Andre that was
you know, it was of course it was built. He'd
never been but uh. And also which is also really
interesting Steve too, is that they had uh. And we've
talked about this before when people talk about, you know,
Terry Bellia's skills that he spent a lot of time
in in Japan and they are much more demanding there.
(12:52):
And Terry proved that he could work, you know, he
had to and did was could move in that ring.
But also andre And and the Holkster had wrestled several
times in Japan and to some pretty good matches because
at the time, Andrea was in much better physical condition
(13:13):
and they they had to work over there otherwise the
crowds buried you. So that that part of this history
is really it's a it's a rich part of it.
It's unfortunate that when this all happened in eighty seven
that you know, Andre was already starting his decline, his
(13:33):
physical decline, and it wouldn't be what four years later
that he would that would be his last appearance with
the WWE. So it's unfortunate that when this did happen,
he wasn't more able to move around. And people crap
all over this match because of what actually went on
in the rain, and we'll get into that, but but
(13:56):
at the time, but just the fact that those two
in there together and uh, the enormity of the circumstances
surrounding it made it a memorable match forever and made
it a part of wrestling history that you know, deserves
to be recognized.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I just blame that trophy guy. This is all the
trophy shops fault.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Really, No, I blame Bobby Heenen.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
I bet he was the guy the trophy store.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Yeah, and he was working Andre Andre. You know, you
know that he's he's just taking advantage of you and
he's using he's not your real friend. And so yeah,
there was a lot going on behind.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
The Trophy and Bobby Heenen. Yeah, I'm going there.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
I think the brother of Bobby Heenen, you know, Ray
Heenan worked at a at the Trophy store. But this
all happens on Piper's Pitt, which is even more insane because,
like you go back before that, Hogan and Piper hate
each other on television, probably backstage two. And yet here
we are with Piper on Piper's Pitt being the good guy.
(15:00):
There's Andre, Bobby he walks out now and now Andre
is sweating like crazy in his suits.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
He always did, he always. I don't know what the
hell they were thinking.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Put him in suits, give him the damn black singlet
let him let him breathe damn it. But this is
where Andre rips off the crucifix of Cogan and he's.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Wearing put on him. He was gonna sweat, but him
in nothing.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Get him out there.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
He's naked, folks, and he's still somehow sweaty.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Yeah, no, he because that's that heart's working really hard
to get Yeah, so that's so true too, that a machine.
But because it was, that was a big machine to
take care of. So it was very tough.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Good point, very very good point, very good point.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
And uh, when Andre grabs that crucifix, thought, he scratches
Hogan's chest with his big, long ass goddamn wolverine nails
and makes him bleed. And Andre walks off, and Hogan's
on the ground holding his crucifix. He doesn't know what
to do. He's bleeding. Even Piper. Piper's like, you're you're bleeding,
and he touches his chest and his blood dripping. The
crucifix now's on the ground, like you know, in today's
(16:09):
world religion, it's up and down depending how you feel.
But seeing like the crucifix all on the ground, there's
blood there next to it, like, that's a heavy, heavy
moment in nineteen eighty seven on WWF television, Do you agree?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Yeah, And I think that it worked out tremendously better
than they had even hoped, because I uh, you know,
whether or not that Andrea was supposed to rip that
necklace off. I think it was just you know, grab
the shirt and uh, you know, breaking the chain and
then the cross falling to the ground and in the
(16:44):
necklace and then in the meantime there's a scratch and
there's you know, draws blood and also it was out
there that the Hulkster had put you know vapo what
a vapo mixer, remember the vapor rub under his eyes? Uh,
so that he would tear up. So there's you know,
then people have broken it down and who knows, but
(17:05):
they you know the shot where you see just before
andre U goes to grab the shirt, you see Hulk
do one of these on his eyes. And but my
point of it is though that the way they probably
laid that out, He's gonna rip the shirt and then
it goes from there. But then you've got the added
the necklace has gone you know, the cross, the crucifix
(17:27):
and whatever you think that I mean, the cross, you
know falls and that's symbolic because Hulks are who's he
thinking after every victory, He's looking to the skies, thanking
the big guy and uh and so and then he
falls to his knees and the tears are coming and
and then you know, Roddy playing the scene goes and
(17:48):
you're you're bleeding and it just so all of it
all comes together, there's blood, there's tears, uh, you know,
and and so there. It just could not have been
played out better because people felt that and uh, you
know in Hulkster maybe not the greatest thespian in the
world or whatever he was, it was it was awfully genuine.
(18:09):
You look at that whole scene and it worked. And
whether or not it was you know, set up to
do that way, but the way it played out, it
couldn't have been better.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
Yeah, And Hogan obviously looking there, he's like Andre, like,
come on, man, what's going on. He's he's shocked.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
He's not like one of those moments like a bad
guy turns on you and he beat up by your
bad guy, Like Andre clearly could just crush him right there. Instead,
he gave him a warning, you better give me a
title shot, dude, because we've been friends all these years.
You haven't give me a title show. This is what
Bobby Heen is saying, though pretty much out loud.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Never gave me a shot.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
And they walk off, And the best thing about that
is they have this moment later on when they have
to ask Hogan the challenge has been laid down, the
contract is there, Hogan will you fight Andre the Giant
at WrestleMania and Hogan sitting there, He's like, I don't
know what to do.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Yeah, show was the.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Crowd and the crowd standing and they the camera shakes
like clearly someone will all right, all right, I want
you to shake that goddamn camera yoursel.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Yeah, yeah, there Hard.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
It's very it's very intense, like you are in it.
I am all in on this storyline.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
It was. It was great storyteller telling you and.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Hogan didn't get like mad Andre, that's what's crazy about this.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
And he's just disappointed and sad he lost his friend.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Yeah, and that's that's a really good point. Uh. The
psychology in this was, I mean, how could you not
be behind Hulk on this because here he just felt
betrayed and sure, and there's everybody in that crowd had
a friend somewhere along the line that just just betrayed them,
just like, I can't, how could you do this to me?
I thought we were besties. I thought we were you
(19:47):
know that you would do anything for me, that we
would be friends for life, and then this is what
you do. And so who couldn't get behind that? And
and you know the Hulkster played it right up all
the way and you said in that scene there where
he's going, He's just it wasn't overdone, I didn't think
and it was just kind of like you're thinking the
(20:09):
same thing, like, Andrew, how would you do, dude? Listen
to that guy. He's screwed so many people and you're
gonna go with him with Heenan and you're gonna listen
to him and not the Hulkster. So the way they
set this up was was perfect. And you could also
see Andrea's point of it. Now you didn't have to
(20:29):
like it, right, you didn't have to agree with it
or want him to. But you're thinking, Okay, why why
hasn't he gotten a title shot? I mean, why why
he's not just because he's a giant, he doesn't he
doesn't get a chance to be What was the what
was the purpose behind that not getting it? So? Uh,
you could you could understand it. That's why it worked well.
(20:52):
When you get these setups sometimes you know when they
try and they're trying to force that that square peg
in the round hole to make that happen. Well, this
was this was not that at all. It worked both
ways because you didn't have to like what Andre was doing,
but you got it. He understood why he felt that
way and felt like maybe this guy has been you know,
(21:12):
I don't think, I don't believe that that's what Hulp did,
but I can understand while he's thinking that, you know,
like you know, because Sulksure did get pretty much exalted
because of being that on that rub with Andrea, and
so you got it, and that that's why that's set up,
you know that that everybody wanted to see happen.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
I remember those video clips to a show of old
Andre and he when Hogan first won the championship and
they dumped Champagne on Hogan's head, and this is when
Andre has like the afro, like the biro, and.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
It's just like wow, I don't remember him ever having
a fro. Of course I didn't, you know.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
I was just being the boy at that time, so
I didn't really watch a little too young can move
the clicker. But it's just so funny because i'd show
you the video packages over the years, like man, Andre
had a huge fro. And when you see baseball players
now put all the goggles over their eyes when they
get dumped and champion man brilliant because I have had
champagne in my eyes.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Not shit hurts things. Yeah, I don't know if Andre was.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Being a little bitch to Hogan in nineteen eighty five
four he dumped it on his head like he's dumping Uh.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Yeah, he had that fern on his head. It looked
like a brown fern. And yeah, that stuff was just soaking,
you know, so.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
It was very nice.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Now, the myth surrounding this matchup is Andre has never
been defeated in fifteen years.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
And he's also never been body slammed.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Now, in today's world, obviously we have phones, with the Internet, Google, YouTube, everything,
we could figure out who has lost to who, and
who actually hasn't body slam so on and so forth.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
In nineteen eighty seven, Andrea is still kind of It's
kind of like the Carnival world. We have territories.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
It will still go around.
Speaker 1 (22:55):
So for you, is it strange to trick your entire
audience to believing one thing or it's it's fine because
no one.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Has actually seen him be body slammed in the WWF
at least.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah, I think I don't think that that was a problem.
I think it's the same thing. It was just because
of the what was at stake in this one and
that it had never really been documented and this was
going to make it official. Could he do it in
front of this massive crowd with the title on the line.
(23:26):
So yeah, and I'm sure that there were smart marks
out there that knew and they were taught. They got
in the dirt sheets were saying, yeah, they said never
mund body slam. But we know that this happened on
this date. But we remember, we all go along for
this ride. Steve and the WWF WWE universe at the
(23:48):
time was more than willing to get on the ship
and go for the ride. And so it wasn't even
a factor in that. And that was a part of
professional wrestling, you know all the time. You know how
many times if people leave time, leave town, how many
times did they retire and unretire, you know what I mean.
So it was it was just part of it. And uh,
(24:10):
you know, people were all in. So that that was
you know, certainly the the information was out there and
call them what they fueled them as rumors or whatever,
but nobody nobody cared. Uh, they wanted to see this matchup.
And the fact that Andre the giant could become a champion,
the WWF heavyweight champion would have was you know enough
(24:34):
and so uh it was. It was just that the
hype on this could not have been bigger and and
for that reason, it didn't matter what happened in the
square circle that night. And when we get into the
match here there you break it down, It wasn't a
whole lot to it. No, a number of reasons.
Speaker 1 (24:55):
Of course, it's it's more of the moments versus the moves,
at least for me personally. The big myth around this
too is I'm very curious about your opinion is Andre
is suffering. You know his have severe back issues. But
the thing with that is I've read that and heard
that forever. But yet he continuously wrestles even after this.
You know, he he not every house show, not every
(25:17):
a big event, but.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
He is at a lot of these.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Like he doesn't get done as an active wrestler on
pay per views and television until like what nineteen ninety ish,
So this is yeah, this is eighty seven. So to
your knowledge, when I keep hearing he's injured, he's hurt,
he can't continue, but he's going to continue.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
How hurt.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Really is he? Like, obviously he's a big man, so
his back hurts. But every day I wake up, my
back hurts because I suck wrong. So my question is
how hurt is he heading into this? Or is this
myth about injury grown so far over the years that
we don't know the truth anymore.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Now, all you had to see was Andre backstage to
understand really what he was his condition was. That was
all heart I you know, I'm going to get emotional.
I start thinking about what like seeing him backstage and
how he would move, you know, just you could see
it as much as he hit it. And even after
(26:17):
WrestleMania two, there were you know, it was out there
that he was hurting. His back was a mess. His
spine was narrowing and carrying around that kind of weight
on a frame that wasn't designed that way. It breaks
down and the disease just progresses. Andre never wanted to
(26:39):
do anything about it. He had opportunities to take medications
that might have changed that, but he never would and
he knew that it was just going to continue. And
so if you saw his performances as he went in,
you know, he didn't do a whole lot in the ring.
He would still do the thing. He stepped over the
(26:59):
top rope, he would go down. He went down, you
know a couple of times in this match, getting body slammed.
Imagine that. But he was willing to pay the price
for this business because of his love for it, and uh,
it's you know, to him, it was what else was
there in his life. But he paid a steep price
(27:22):
for it. And like I said, all you had to
do was see him backstage, and there were bad you know,
there were there were periods where he was better than
than you know, other times where he moved around a
lot better and you would see him then to the
end there when he was using the crutches, you know,
the aluminum crutches that you would walk around on. But
(27:42):
but it was it was a continuing process. He you know,
he had surgery and h I think that that helped
to an extent, but his body was just going to
continue to break down and then that's what it did.
And uh, even towards the end, like I think his
last match was in ninety one, he didn't want to stop.
(28:06):
And that's what happened with between him and Vince, is
that he felt that Vince, you know kind of used
them up. Well, I happen to think that to an extent. Okay,
you can make that argument. But also at the same time,
Vince couldn't see it, couldn't watch it anymore either. He
didn't want that way that be, that to be the
(28:29):
way that would end for Andre. And you know, you've
seen interviews with Vince afterwards when he talks about it
and he gets emotional just thinking about it. That you know,
people can talk about it one way or the other.
They can they can say with their their hate for
Vince and that he just used him up, and when
he wasn't useful to him anymore, he cast him aside.
(28:50):
I happened to be on the other side of that
in the sense that he saw what Andre was going
through and didn't want to see it end for him
in front of crowds, him being in the shape that
he was in. And but at the Pontiac Silverdome that day,
Andre gave everything he had. Like I said, he went down.
(29:13):
People should go and watch the match. If you were
looking for the two ring tacticians, you're not going to
find them unless you go look at that macho man
ricky steamboat match. But but it. The excitement of that match.
We even watching it again, I still felt like the
(29:34):
same way that and I wasn't there, but I said
when I got to see it that I felt the
same way that. You know, I know, like John Cena
talked about when he was a kid basically watching this
and his house became the Pontiac Silver Dome where you know,
he had fifty relatives come over. That's how exciting it was.
And that match to them carried it. Now the people
(29:56):
that are more a lot of tear things down and
they talk about the match there was. I mean, think
you can go through that and you could say, okay,
they run into each other, they go into the turnbuckle,
they hulked us shops, they hulked us some chops. We
got the ten count of Andrea on the turnbuckle. Okay,
it's all that, but you listen to that crowd and
(30:16):
they popped for everything. And even that at the one
point where Andre falls you know, falls down, he hulk
comes off the rope and collides with him, and Andrea
goes down, It's like whoa. You know, So if you
were in there looking for this, you know, memorable tactician
matchup that wasn't what it was about. It was the
(30:39):
fact you had these two in there for the WWF
Championship and two of the greatest names in professional wrestling.
And big question was was the Hulks are going to
be able to pull this off? Could he body slam
Andre the Giant? It delivered, It delivered, And I know
that the newsletter him Meltzer, and you know he was
(31:02):
I think he gave it minus five stars initially and
then changed it to minus three, Like, come on, you
missed the whole point of what that encounter was, what
it was all about.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
So Jesus Christ, they really give it that.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Yeah, it was something, Yeah, it was something really Really that's.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Pretty strange to think because wrestling also is so subjective,
like you each person, you could love a brawler but
hate high flying, or love to the wrestling, hate you know,
hardcore wrestling, and so I think that's first of all,
that's fucking weird. And also how everyone has been obsessed
with one person's opinion for forty years.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
I think you have to but throw all that out.
That crazy nothing about that. It wasn't about the you know,
there's a story two guys in and who's going to
walk out the champion and so.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Who gouna goddamn bigger trophy, motherfucker.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
That's what.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
That's what. No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
No, it was really about it was such a great story.
And the thing though backstage more I've read Holk Cogan's book.
I've heard these stories, and tell me what you have
heard on the backstage when you work there, because the
story is as worth. They're heading out there, Hogan's not
sure that Andre is going to let him body slim them.
Even the music man is. He's telling Hogan, don't worry,
(32:18):
don't worry, don't worry. But in reality, well, this is
two people are involved with this dance, and if one
person does want to cooperate, who's five hundred plus pounds
he can, you know, pretty much decide not to let
you have your moment. So Hogan handing out there in
this nervous wreck with ninety three thousand people, he says.
Hogan says he didn't know if Andre was going to
(32:38):
let him body Over the years, what have you heard
from other wrestlers, Well.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
I think, uh, you know that that certainly adds them
to the mystique of this match, that you know that
the way they want to tell it is that, well,
Cogan had no idea what was was Andre going to
put him over. He gonna you know, just lay out
on him and not let him, you know, do what
(33:05):
he had to do. Uh. You know that the story
goes Holkster had you know, made notes for this match,
this whole thing. He wanted to be very respectful. He
was always very respectful of Andre, and uh, you know,
like initially, I'm sure there was some resentment with Andre,
but I think they that Andre grew to respect Hulk
(33:28):
Hogan and uh and I think the Holkster's respect for
Andre just grew even more. And by the time they
got to this point, you know, the story can go
on as they say that nobody knew, not even Vince knew.
But I think that Andre had way too much respect
for this business that you're gonna you're gonna mess with that,
(33:52):
You're gonna you're gonna let your ego get involved. That
wasn't the way Andre was. And I think all along
he knew that he was gonna do what he is
going to need to do. He may have been, you know,
messed with the Hulkster a bit with this, but I
don't think there was ever a question in his mind.
And as the as Hulk Hogan tells the story that
(34:13):
you know, he realized like once they were in the match,
because he got no feedback supposedly from Andrea from the
notes that he made while all the stuff we're going
to do in this but he said that once we
started the match, Andre was by the letter did everything
that that as they went along, so it gave him
more confidence in it. But I think that and Vince
(34:39):
saying the same thing, I just he's going to do
the right thing was just to add a little more
mystique to this thing. And my feeling overall is that
there was never a question in Andre's mind that that
he was going to put Hulk over. And I love
I love the intrigue of it, and I will help
let help let that live on forever. That there were
(35:01):
questions or whether or not. But knowing Andre and and
the way that he loved this business and had the
respect for the boys once, if he had respect for
you and he then why would he do that. He
didn't have that kind of ego where he was going
to put his his legend in jeopardy of he you know,
(35:23):
at that on that world stage that he decided to
just lay out, I'm not going to do it. I'm
not going to let you put you over that way,
you know. So that's that where I stand, and I
think most of the guys that worked with Andrea and
knew him felt the same way. But I love the
mystique on it. It will live on forever. Here we are,
(35:45):
how many years later, and there's still that question. Was
Andre was he thinking about maybe not letting a hulk
body slam him because you know, you're not doing that
without help. He needed Andrea to help him do that.
As big and strong as Ulkster was, that ain't happening
(36:05):
without Andrea's approval. And uh, and it was. It was.
It was a pretty damn good one. And uh you
got to imagine that it probably didn't feel real good
for Andre on the receiving end of that, the conditioning
he was in, but uh, he did it. And uh,
this this match lives on forever is as uh, you know,
(36:28):
one of the pinnacles, one of the greatest matches, not
because of what you know they did in that ring,
but what it stood for, and uh, what it did
for the professional wrestling world that day in Pontiac, Michigan.
Speaker 1 (36:42):
I also think that the Andre Vince thing where they're like,
we're not gonna tell Hogan if you're gonna let him
buys them, he was kind of a rib. And we've
heard so many ribs in wrestling where it's just one
of those things where well, we're gonna actually let you
boys lammy, but we're gonna let you believe up to
that the last second that you're not going to boyslam
me because this is a boys club. It feels like,
(37:05):
so we are going to do the boys will be
boys and.
Speaker 3 (37:07):
Just screw with you until you snap. Didn't Steve.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
There was way too much at stake in this for everybody, so.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I know the idea of that happening.
Speaker 2 (37:17):
They understay all understood the enormity of this and the
fact that the world was watching, and I remember that
used to be the slogan the world is watching, and
uh yeah it was watching that day, So uh yeah,
a rib come on is there? Everybody understood the enormity
(37:37):
of this, And it was never a question in my
mind that Andrea wasn't gonna do what he did.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
Imagine that though you're like my feeling he has to
pick up Andre, and he just lays.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Well, he kicked out, Yeah, I ain't going anywhere. I'm
not going up. You just said, you know, done one
of those and so yeah, and uh uh you know
that story also goes when when it was time that
(38:13):
Andre told Terry okay, let's do it. Whatever it was
that mentioned, but it was okay, let's go, and that's
that's when it happened. So it's uh yeah, unbelievable that
you know, what Andre did that day was was phenomenal
(38:34):
and it did it just launched the Hulkster into the
stratosphere and how could you not uh feel it when
you watch it even to this day, you just feel
that that electricity of what was going on then and
you know, never they never looked back.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
I gotta say also, Bobby Heenen steals the show and
fashion in this matchup because he has a wonderful, very
bright glittery suit with tails. And this is also the
Wrestlmannia where you come on motorized rings because the arena
is so big, they have to put the ring on
a platform so if you were sitting anywhere, you could
(39:12):
see it because ninety three thousand people and Bobby on
that though with his coattails his suit and of course
Jesse and Gorill are on commentary. Like those three players
I want to mention as well because they are involved
with this heavy to the end because Bobby's selling everything
for Andre. Bobby's been the voice for Andre this whole storyline. Now,
Jesse and Grilla have the job to make sure everyone
(39:35):
knows what's happening in the ring, because at one point
they even play on this for the entire year where
Hogan does try to pick up Andre in this matchup
and it's one two hopefully kicks out and Jesse is
convinced that Hogan did not kick out, And from this
point on, even after this matchup, throughout the year, they
can keep playing this like, well, did you really kick out?
(39:59):
Or what the referee uh in on this and that
place was a double referees years wait.
Speaker 2 (40:05):
Joey, Joey was two and a half.
Speaker 3 (40:10):
It was, it was. It was very close.
Speaker 1 (40:11):
But one of the big things about this Wrestmatia too
is everyone brings up Hogan.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Body slamming Andre because the visual.
Speaker 1 (40:18):
Even years later in the Attitude aeron Ruthless Aggression, the
opening still had Hogan body slamming Andre. Pardon me, not
the attitude era, because I know someone's gonna be like
he was a ww dickhead. Sorry, sorry, folks. But Macho
Man rius Ricky Steamboat also takes place on this and
every year when people have Wrestlemantia Marathon matches to watch
Macho Man and Steamboat get picked, not Hogan for us
(40:40):
Andre and as years ago on, rumors are there's jealousy
between Macha Men and Hoe Cogan for as long as
both men were alive. Was their jealousy between Hogan and Savage?
And did it start here that you know of?
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Well, I think I wouldn't call it jealousy. I would
say it was like this professional envy in a sense
that uh and you know all the all the guys
when you go out there, uh and you have a
match and it's a great match, you know it, and
it's kind of an unsaid thing. You can be backstage
(41:15):
and you may not be the main event, but everybody
knows that that was the match. And as far as
what as I mentioned, whatever, what you're looking for, that
match with Randy and and and Ricky Steamboat was incredible
really obviously just one of the uh you know, ring tacticians,
(41:38):
both of them tremendous workers, and that match, they did
not let it down. It was absolutely the match of
the night. And uh, you know, I'm sure that both ways, Randy,
being the competitor that he was, felt, you know that
they should have gotten uh maybe you know, more marquee
(42:00):
out of it, more recognition for it. I'm sure that
in a sense that the hulkture was like she's they
put a match like that and and and you know,
all it does is tear this one down. You know
that it takes something away from it? Why why why
do that? Why not let this be it? So sure
there was you know, the professional jealousy or whatever you
(42:21):
want to call it, but that's the healthy part of
this business. That's what makes those guys go out there
and try and show each other up every night. But
I'm I'm I'm sure exactly as you described there was
that there was a sense and both Randy and Ricky
knew that they had the match of the night. But
as I said, that's that match between Andrea and Hulk Cogan.
(42:45):
It wasn't about the skill set, it wasn't about the
high flying, it wasn't about these incredible moves. It wasn't
necessarily about you know, what was going on there. It
was a storytelling, it was the it was the enormity
of what was behind those two in the ring. So yes,
both of them were tremendous, but for their own reasons
(43:08):
and overall the there's no question in my mind that
the Andre and on Oh COVID match overshadowed everything despite
the years that we saw. Yeah, between with Randy and Ricky,
there's no question. You want to talk about a match,
absolutely that's still even to these this day. People you know,
(43:28):
talk talk about matches of the greatest matches of all time.
That's part of the conversation. But that's not what this
event was about. And that so uh, it's you know,
as they say, you know, two things can be right, Uh,
you know two things can be you know, the same.
Uh they were in that sense as far as how
as far as watchability, like what are you watching for?
(43:49):
But it depends what you're looking at. But uh, the
main event was absolutely the main event. There was not
nothing took it away from it. Uh. And and also
the impact. Let's say that that match with Randy and
Rickey was the main event, Well, how would that have unbelievable,
tremendous match, greatest match of all time? Argument, How did
it change professional wrestling? Right?
Speaker 3 (44:12):
It did not. Okay, this made wrestlers want to become wrestlers, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
But I'm saying overall in the industry, this one was
an earthquake, which is we talked about him another time,
but it was. It shook. It shook the professional wrestling world,
and it did. It shook it up, and the trajectory
kept going. It kept happening.
Speaker 1 (44:37):
It's true and interesting though, because towards the end of
eighty seven eventually Savage and Hogan get together and then
you know, lady, the megapower is the whole run. So
I could see now I'm not doing it, but I
could see people put dots together and being like, well,
Hogan was mad at Savage for getting over here. Now people,
the underground fans are interest interested in wrestling, not Hulkamane anymore.
Speaker 3 (45:01):
Well, if Hogan.
Speaker 1 (45:02):
Attaches himself to like the wrestler that people love, maybe
he can keep his love with the wrestlers and then
the kids and the moms and the bringing their grandparents.
I don't know, that's just a weird theory to jump
out right now, because like sometimes you've seen it over years,
where a star is rising, a star is going down,
So start going down connects himself to wrestler going up,
(45:23):
so he continually going up. Not to say that Hogan
was going down at all around this time, but attaching
yourself to a pure wrestler versus you being a sports
entertainer maybe helped Hogan's longevity amongst certain fans.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
Yes, and you can do a real deep dive on this,
Steve and start thinking that, uh, you know this was
this was all in the stars and that the Evince
was that genius and PA think yeah, and then down
then and then we're gonna get Randy into this, and
we're gonna put them in. Like I don't think they
they they were able to dive that deep, but I
(45:59):
think they may have seen the star power of Randy
and what what he could do and say, you know,
he's he's somebody who could definitely part of this future.
Because as we know, Evince was always starting to think
about Okay, we hadn't even seen the peak of Hulka
Mania yet, but he had to be thinking in his mind, well, yeah,
but we're gonna need backup, uh, you know, and and
(46:22):
then and then look where we went from there. Uh,
certainly other upper episodes that we've done and will show
the impact of the union between hul Cogan and Randy
Savage and how they impacted professional wrestling for ver. So
it all, it all, you know, was part of this,
but this one was really at the foundation of you know,
(46:45):
how things would really come to be and uh, you
know the fact that it happened when it did, and
and and move things along much quicker uh has made
made this that event and the match historic forever.
Speaker 3 (47:00):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
And the business side of it too, is like, think about,
we don't really have pay per view. Pay per view
is the thing in nineteen eighty seven, but it's not
the thing. Not everyone is having it. You're still going
to theaters, local arenas to watch pay per views.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
This event itself four hundred thousand buys on pay per view.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
That's gigantic, Folks for nineteen eighty seven, Like, oh my god,
how this happened? Closed circuit estimated ten million dollars. And again,
this is nineteen eighty seven total gross pay per view
plus closed circuit plus live gate that's over twenty million dollars.
This is unprecedented in nineteen eighty seven. This is not
(47:39):
a normal thing we're having in smoke filled arenas. For
business wise, again, this begins this giant movement which we'll
talk about in other episodes, where Vince can use his
WrestleMania brand as bargaining tools to hurt other wrestling companies
because Russeumenia is such a success, especially WrestleMania three.
Speaker 2 (48:01):
Yeah, no question about that. And and that's you're right,
that is a whole other episode. But of the impact
that you know, Vince McMahon had on the pay per
view industry, who knows where that would have ever gone.
And look what we're doing today with the streaming and
everything else. Well, you know, thank the WWE for that growth,
because what else did you see. You know, you had
(48:21):
boxing matches that were going to be you know, started
with closed circuit they could, they were kind of the
first to do that, but at the same time, they
were sporadic that you didn't have regularly necessarily, you know,
every month or something, necessarily having a big, gigantic event.
And the WWE did that and and it just took
(48:44):
off from there and for a very long time, you
really didn't see much else that on that scale. You
had other pay per views, but not on the scale
that you saw with the WWE. And one thing also,
I wanted to mention that I did love about this match,
and I think it was I don't know if it
was a tribute to or let's take advantage of it,
but they wanted this event, especially the main event, to
(49:08):
have that big fight feel with and if you remember
Jesse when he when they do the introductions, is giving
the tail of the tape, the chest size, the biceps,
the forearms, the wrists, the calves, you know, and and
then you got Bob Buker comes in as the special
guest ring announcer to announce them. Mary Hart from Entertainment
(49:32):
Tonight is the brink the timekeeper. Uh So I got
a kick out of that, and it's it's just an aside,
I guess, but I love the fact that they did.
They made it try, you know, give it that big
fight feel, you know, the those kind of introductive introductions,
just like they do did with boxing, or do with boxing,
(49:52):
and and so, uh it was maybe a little bit
of a salute to, uh, you know, the beginnings of
pay per view and that whole thing with boxing and
a little tribute to that and also stealing a little
bit of it as far as the marketing of it go.
But I just thought I really thought that was a
cool thing, a cool part of it, you know, especially
when they're reeling off Andrea's statistics.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
God damn it, tell me how big his legs are?
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Yeah, oh yeah, but and you probably don't know this,
but what is he announced? You know, Andre's got twenty
one inch biceps, Ulkster's got twenty four. So wow, the
pythons are you know, he's got a bigger snake on
those shoulders. But I did I love that and I
just got a I got a kick out of hearing
(50:41):
it again with Jesse doing the announcing. So and those
two worked well together. You know. I've seen comments with
people like saying, well, yeah, no, Jesse and Gorilla were
just great together. Yes they were. But when what I've
been asked, like, personally, what did I would I like?
I I like Gorilla and Bobby together. I like Vince
(51:02):
and Jesse together. That's but that's just personal preference, folks.
Everybody had their preferences, and that.
Speaker 3 (51:10):
Man, you have all these people, Yeah, and this, you know.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
With the irresistible force versus the immovable object, with gorilla
and and all of his God, so many great gorilla
is whatever you want to call them. We got a
lot of them in these in these matchups.
Speaker 3 (51:31):
Yeah them, No that again, the commentary is outstanding.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
The crowd and the slow movements of Andre and Hogan
walking up to each other, and Hogan's just sitting there
shaking his head and Andre and you can.
Speaker 3 (51:45):
Feel like that's the thing too, is there's the.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
Difference now watching television where you're like you're expecting a
reaction from fans and so immediately when a bad show,
people go on online go it's because of Montreal not
being a good crowd, or if this is because Baltimore
was a shitty crowd, this crowd. If you thought this
match was bad, shut the volume off and watch it
with no volume, and you can see visually the audience
(52:10):
standing the entire time, no matter what, no punch, no
kick falling over, whatever your critique of this match is,
watch the audience. The audience is having the time of
their life. And I think that people forget.
Speaker 2 (52:23):
About Yeah, and and like you said, the two of
them toe to toe in the ring. That and again
then that big fight feel and they're just you know,
nose to nose just like you see. And uh and
that intensity and Andre and and and the and the
apprehension and I think is the best way to put it.
(52:43):
Like you said, Hulk is kind of you know, shaken,
and it wasn't like necessarily fear, but apprehension. What's going
to happen here? And uh, yeah, loved it. It was
a big fight. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
As from this then creates the rematch they have They
bill Rustmania four having a rematch in that world titled tournament.
Speaker 3 (53:03):
You have the double refereematch.
Speaker 1 (53:05):
You have the birth of Survivor series based off this match,
which happens in later on in November with Team Hole
universus Team Andre, the birth of Summer Slam with the
Megabox versus the Mega Powers. Honestly, I don't think people
give Andre in the Hogan rivalry enough credit because it.
Speaker 3 (53:23):
Created so many other moments.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Out of this Body Slam, out of this rivalry, out
of bad trophies being delivered, This turned into two years
of storylines and I think another lot of matches do
that a lot of matches? It's we have our match, Okay, boom.
Now you go off fight this guy, and I'll go
fight that guy. This one is they're connected at the
hip for at least another two years, which is.
Speaker 3 (53:46):
Longevity, which really shows you this worked out.
Speaker 2 (53:49):
Yeah, oh know, and then also think about how it
helped everybody else, all the superstars. Yeah, because as you said,
you know, they had their teams and you know, a
rub from Andrea for a Heel and Hulkster, all the
different guys that he ended up putting over. So yeah,
it put them on the scale of that stage up
(54:13):
there that they were kingmakers in a sense that you know,
you got that rub from one of those guys and
it and it helped, uh, you know, spread the marquee
for the rest of these guys and uh you know
Randy certainly one of them with the Hulkster and and
you know all that that took place from then on.
But the list goes on and on, all of those guys,
(54:37):
Ted Dibiassi and you know, we could just name the boy.
Speaker 3 (54:43):
Characters like so like.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
For other organizations where you're not necessary, let's say you
know you've got a champion and he's a you don't
get the same thing. These guys were just beyond the stars,
and they made them stars just by being around them.
They had been put in that position that whoever got
next to them became more known and more popular. So
(55:10):
it was the whole thing was just brilliant as far
as the way it worked from that point point on,
and it was a formula that they rode for decades. Yeah,
you know, and that's where you know, they started to
really realize just the power of that. It was old
school wrestling in a sense, but never had people and
(55:31):
never had wrestlers. They had been put in that kind
of position where they were known the world over, and
you know, these guys happy to ride those coattails because
it meant not only this, you know, the recognition, but money.
These guys were making money like they'd never seen before,
way beyond what they'd ever seen in any other wrestling organization.
(55:55):
And it went on and on.
Speaker 4 (55:57):
They all paid a price, though, yeah, yes, we always
talk about the price is paid before we wrap this
up at kind of a two part question is as
we record this, it's twenty twenty five, the ww inducted
the Brett Hart Versus stonecall c of Aston Match or
Wrestling A thirteen to the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 1 (56:14):
That's the first match ever going Hall of Fame. My
question to you is Hogan body setting Andre not the match,
not the match, the moment. Should that go into the
Hall of Fame for the WWE audience or if you
had a mount rushmore as well? Is this body Slam
a top four WWE moment of all time?
Speaker 2 (56:37):
Well? Yes on both counts, Absolutely no question about it. Yeah,
that that match, and as we said, it wasn't about
the skill set, It wasn't about the moves that happened
in that ring or what went. It was all about
what it represented and how it changed professional wrestling forever.
(56:59):
There's no way without those two ninety three thousand people
wouldn't have been in that stadium that day. And I
know that as you know, Vince saw those numbers just
keep going up. Uh, you know that they sweated it
out in a sense that thinking, because to sell that
many tickets, my god, you know that was an enormous challenge.
(57:21):
But they, you know, once they had this going, and
they you know that, you hear the stories of how
they couldn't even believe it that how fast and how much,
you know, how the tickets were selling for this and
in Pontiac Mission again of all places. Now that that
that's not like they didn't have resting events. But think about,
you know, the population center. It's not exactly one of
(57:43):
the biggest in the world or even the United States
by any stretch, but ninety three thousand people plus showed
up there and whatever it was, but it was a
It was a hell of a lot of people and
an unbelievable, incredible accomplishment all the way route Mountain Rushmore
as far as matches go. And also you know Hall
(58:04):
of Fame.
Speaker 1 (58:05):
Yeah, to Michigan fans, we love you. We love you
out there in Michigan, all right, we love you. Because
we did an episode once and I was in Pittsburgh
and the first the first thing you said to me
was how are you doing today?
Speaker 3 (58:15):
I'm in Pittsburgh. I advised never to come here.
Speaker 1 (58:17):
All the comments were, what's wrong with Pittsburgh?
Speaker 2 (58:21):
What's wrong with Pittsburgh?
Speaker 3 (58:23):
You It was scary that day. I was there, folks
for back last year. It was scary.
Speaker 1 (58:28):
But no, I think this moment again, like all moments
in the Golden Era, this will go down as one
of the top moments because it created a moment, It
created a lifetime. People still talk about Andre, still talk
about Hogan the body heard the round in the world.
You can feel every any which way you want about Hokogan,
but I'm not gonna let you disparage this moment professional
wrestling history. So Hogan Body sing Andre two thumbs up
(58:48):
for me. You say, hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (58:50):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (58:51):
So in reality, Restumeda three. It's a long, long, long event, folks,
and this is you know, the beginning. I feel like
even WRESTLINGI one on consider it's like the Golden Era,
but it's like connected to another era.
Speaker 3 (59:03):
In rsselating three, I feel like is the birth of the.
Speaker 1 (59:05):
Golden Era where we get all of our macho mans
and warriors and demolition and so on and so forth.
But in reality, then, mister Mooney, it is always the
pleasure of talking to you about the Golden Era. I'm
ce fault he Shamuni. Have a wonderful day and we'll
see you next time.
Speaker 3 (59:20):
Bye bye,
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