Untold WWE Royal Rumble 1990 Secrets: Sean Mooney Shares All

Go behind the scenes of the 1990 WWE Royal Rumble as Sean Mooney reveals the untold story of Hulk Hogan and The Ultimate Warrior’s legendary face-to-face moment. This brief encounter helped set the stage for one of the biggest WrestleMania main events of all time!

From backstage reactions and booking intentions to how the moment was received internally, Mooney shares rare insight into what WWE was really thinking in 1990. A must-listen for wrestling history fans, Royal Rumble obsessives, and anyone fascinated by the Hogan vs. Warrior rivalry.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Chester Channel Time by Oh my god, he's he's rocking out, folks.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Caught, I got caught again. I keep telling myself, I'm
not gonna do it. I'm not gonna let that music
get to me. And then I'm hearing and then I'm like,
oh man, oh it's coming.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
Channel.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
Oh yeah, he's he's loving it.

Speaker 4 (00:39):
But today it's Royal Rubble nineteen ninety from Tony Shiavanni
to Holt Cogan wearing the Rumble. We have so many
topics here on the Royal Rumble nineteen ninety. But I
know you said in the past sometimes roy Rumbles are
fun to watch. Sometimes they're not fun to watch. How
do you feel about the nineteen ninety of Royal Rumble?
Where does it land in your heart?

Speaker 3 (01:00):
Boy?

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Yeah, come on, Steve, You if you're familiar with what
happened at this Royal Rumble, when there was really what
was at stake, what was there, what was supposed to happen?

Speaker 3 (01:18):
It kind of you think that the whole thing, that.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Entire event was created just to see two individuals in
the ring and see, Okay, what are they going to
do when they see them face to face?

Speaker 3 (01:32):
Right? I try I'm trying to figure out what the
motivation was. Was there a lot going on?

Speaker 2 (01:42):
Was it something let's just get this one done, we
got to start planning WrestleMania. What's I don't know, But no,
it wasn't. It was the Third Royal Rumble. The format
was was set. Basically we knew what to expect in
a sense of getting these thirty superstars in the ring eventually.

(02:04):
But man, as far as the creative goes and think
about this was nineteen ninety things were still humming along
pretty good. And look at all the superstars that were
involved in this event, and yet it just was you know,
I just were they sitting around in a room and go, Okay,

(02:24):
what you got? I don't know what what if? We No,
that won't work? Well, we got some great names that.

Speaker 3 (02:34):
We can put in there.

Speaker 2 (02:35):
And and what's going on with Valentine and Garvin?

Speaker 3 (02:41):
Oh yeah, we haven't finished that one yet. I mean,
it's just.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
It was just lacking creatively, I think is the best
way to describe it.

Speaker 3 (02:51):
There were moments, no question about it, but you know.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
We'd expect that would have really been let down if
there weren't. But overall, as you lay out an.

Speaker 3 (03:01):
Event, like this. Uh, it's a head scratcher.

Speaker 4 (03:06):
Wow, tell me how you really feel about the nineteen ninety.

Speaker 3 (03:10):
Even Vince wanted to take the day off. That's Tony
got your tucks.

Speaker 4 (03:18):
Yeah, there's a lot about this Royal Rumbull where you
brought up, But Hogan and Warrior is the highlight with it.
Will they won't They they at in the ring and
it's kind of a repeat though. Remember when Macho Man
was dumped over the top rope by accident from Hulk
Cogan a year ago. So they did the same bit
this time, but it was Warrior and Warrior ain't having it.

(03:39):
You know, Savage was upset too, but Warrior wasn't having
it either. And you know, is this really just to
test the waters to see will the audience cheer Warrior
over Hogan?

Speaker 2 (03:50):
Well it's it seems like it because they did create
that moment to happen, and specifically, yeah, you can everybody's
eyes were glued those monitors back there when it happened,
and we're all, you know, okay, you know, that's kind
of the test to see what what what that crowd does.

Speaker 3 (04:09):
But it wasn't. It was a dramatic moment, but it
wasn't the pinnacle.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
If that's the way you're gonna do it, then wouldn't
you have ended it with the two of them in
the ring and then had some kind of weird finished
there where they don't settle the score.

Speaker 3 (04:27):
But it does seem that way.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
That they and they found out what they wanted to
and they went forward with it when they saw those
two in the reaction of the pop as they say.

Speaker 3 (04:40):
From the crowd. But man, that's a long way to go.

Speaker 2 (04:44):
To to find that out.

Speaker 3 (04:48):
But I think that's the huge part of it.

Speaker 2 (04:52):
That was the moment at least for what they wanted
to come away with is that how will this set
up WrestleMania. Can can we get the mileage and get
the revenue out of out of these two guys. It
was in a sense a test for Warrior, and uh,
you know, we saw what happened from there.

Speaker 4 (05:12):
That's interesting topic too, is do you think pay per
views were created because WrestleMania was such a success that
then saw money. But obviously Rumble, SummerSlam some vibrasies never
makes the same amount of money as WrestleMania. Are these
events like Rumble and summerstim svivraseries really just created for
a little bit of revenue, but to really promote WrestleMania.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
Well, that was certainly a part of it, but also,
uh they realized that they didn't have to wait a
year for that gigantic event, and in the meantime you
could have these other I looked at it as kind
of seasonal. You know, we we are Big four when
it eventually became at the time, and so as we

(05:57):
know back then that's you're able to build these storylines.
Now you know, we have every week, but back then
you were able to do it with just WrestleMania. You know,
you can work an entire year for these storylines. And
they didn't really need to. They could do it in
they say quarterly fashion, you know, to do it that

(06:18):
way and and be able to whatever it was number
of months, three months to build things and then have
them happen, have them happen, and then and then be
able to see either you settled it and it was done,
or you built it up to continue on for another quarter.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
So uh yeah, and it was just it was a
money maker.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
We've discussed many times that the WWE was the trailblazer
for pay per view events and prior to that, of course,
it was closed circuit. But Vince saw early on that
that was the future of sports entertainment, way ahead of
his time on that. But the Ottom line when it
was making them money then, and it was a tremendous

(07:04):
promotional tool to set these up as we went along,
So it was a combination of things. Of course, it
would the pinnacle of that year would be WrestleMania basically,
and everything would would culminate there. But in the meantime,
you have another tool here to promote your product, make money,

(07:26):
and also set up your future. That they were each
time they were creating these events and learning as they
went along the way, so that as we saw as
it evolved over the years, they took things along the
way that they would have done at one event said yeah,

(07:46):
that worked really well, carry it over other stuff, Oh.

Speaker 3 (07:49):
Man, that was that was terrible boom that's gone. But
it was this.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
Tremendous promotional tool that set the stage for many years
to come. So Vin saw it as all of that,
you know, Wrestlevania setting it all up, but also you
can do these big events and you're not taking anything
away from the.

Speaker 4 (08:13):
Next one of course, and you know this rumble moment
with Warrior and Hogan going face to face, this is
something you've never seen before in professional wrestling in the
WWF television.

Speaker 1 (08:23):
That is, we're a good.

Speaker 4 (08:24):
Guy and a good guy are now face to face
and they're not just hey, you're a good guy and
I'm a good guy who should help each other? These
two or an each other's faces, challenging each other for
the alpha male role here in the ring. In the WWF,
even Bruce Pritchett said, we want to know will they
cheer Hogan, will they cheer Warrior?

Speaker 1 (08:43):
How will they react?

Speaker 4 (08:44):
And clearly a lot of people and still to this day,
when they bring out top ten roll rumble moments, this
is one of them having your two baby faces face
to face and the crowd is going bananas. As Grila
montsu would say, it is nuts to see the reaction
of fans cheering and booing both men and jessevn Tora
he's going wild too. But Toni Shavanni on commentary, I

(09:07):
love hearing his voice because he adds a whole different
element to this because even after Warr is dumped up
by Hogan by accident, Toni Shavanni is the one challenging,
Like I think Hogan dumped them out on purpose, and
its usually it's Jesse who would do something like that.
So was it ever hard for wrestling fans to accept
that Hogan was doing bad things?

Speaker 1 (09:27):
But we were just like, well, who cares? We love him.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
Well And I hope you can follow me on this.
But I looked at it in a sense it was
kind of like Greek mythology in sense, yeah, I'm getting deeper,
but where you have this, as you mentioned in the
case here is simply saying Babyface is going you know,
head to head here where they're both supposed to be

(09:54):
good individuals. But as we know through mythology of these
gods that there wasn't always room for both of them.
And so you had these two you know, titans that people,
and you.

Speaker 3 (10:11):
Know that you know very well that you were either
a warrior guy or.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
A hulk, a hulkster, and and so in a sense
that you know, it was inevitable that there was going
to be some kind of friction despite how they conducted
themselves in the arena of competition and how they were
around they're mere mortals around them, and so I think

(10:39):
that that's kind of the way they looked at it.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
And you know, and Vince.

Speaker 2 (10:44):
In many ways where they would talk about these characters
on that level. I think that in some ways he
looked at it like that, that it wasn't as simple
as the you know, you can't have two baby faces
not liking each other, Well, why not through history.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
That you have that? So I I kind of looked
at it that way.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
I just thought that, you know that they're on the
mountain and both of them can't stand on top of it,
and and you had to have some kind of you know,
the big you know that maybe the pack in the
sense you got the big bull that he's the one
that's running the the troop, and and at some point, uh,

(11:30):
you know that the young Buck's going to challenge him.
It was all of that, and I know that's I'm
going deep here, but I think we were talking about
developing characters and storylines like that.

Speaker 3 (11:42):
It was I think that it at least reminded me
of that back then, and I and I used to
kind of think about, uh, when they came up with
these storylines, how how deep they were going?

Speaker 2 (11:55):
Where is this, where's this all coming from? And I
think that you could, you know from whatever whatever you
were on that level, you bought in and that's why
I think it worked between the Holkster and Warrior. And
I love the fact that you did have two very
distinct groups of people, whether they were eight years old

(12:16):
or they were fifty, you could ask them who's your guy?
They didn't say both. Do you ever hear anybody say both?

Speaker 3 (12:23):
Maybe there's a view and if you did, your alive
either were in the Warriors camp or you love the Holkster.
And that's pretty much the way it was, and it
was great for business.

Speaker 4 (12:32):
True Again, this leads all to Wrestlemantia six and then
you have the double main event with both men having
different matches at Summerslim nineteen ninety. You go to Survivor Series,
we actually team up with the Grand Finale. So there's
a lot of Warrior Hogan interaction in nineteen ninety and
it's perfect for so many wrestling fans. And I know
a lot of people either love Warrior hate Warrior, but

(12:53):
this moment at Royal Ombul nineteen ninety, you can't deny
that people were going crazy and it was building to WrestleMania.
But I did mention Tony Shavanni. Yeah, Moony Shavanni on commentary.
When I think of the w w F Golden era,
yet Moody yet Monsoon Yet he did Lord Ufford Hayes,
you know me and Geen Bobby Me. How was Tony

(13:16):
Shavanni welcomed into the ranks that you were involved with,
because to me, he doesn't fit.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
It's like a square in a circle.

Speaker 2 (13:25):
Well, I honestly did not look at it that way
at all, and I don't think anybody did. I don't
remember anybody saying why they're bringing.

Speaker 3 (13:33):
That guy in? Course, you know, Tony was a very
established announcer. You know, Vince loved picking people up and
bringing him in and uh.

Speaker 2 (13:45):
You know, it's hard for people because it was a
short lived stint, unfortunately. But you know, Tony was very talented.
He was great at what he did. But a lot
of people don't know what Tony was.

Speaker 3 (14:02):
Capable behind the scenes. Tony was a full blown produce producer.
He did. Uh. He he did a lot of stuff
backstage when.

Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, he did a lot of I worked with him
on a lot of the Coliseum home videos that he
went during the time he was there, that he helped
out in, but he was also.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
You know, helping the guys with interviews and and and
doing all that.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
And I know that he's carried that over with ae
W that you know, he's he's very involved behind the
scenes as well. So, Uh, I'm glad we're talking about
this today because, uh, you know, Tony is one of
my favorite people.

Speaker 3 (14:44):
He's he's a he's a great guy.

Speaker 2 (14:46):
And back then coming in a lot of people don't
really know what went on. Why did after I don't
know if it was barely a year uh that that
he was gone, and there was a number of circum stances.
Talking specifically about this event because we're that's kind of
our starting point that you know, Tony comes to the arena,

(15:10):
and you know, it's kind of a rule. It's it's
everything else. It's like in wrestling, bringing your boots. If
you're an announcer, you always have your tuxedo. You always
have you never know what's going to happen. You could
be and maybe you're not doing anything, but you've got
that tux in case they need you. And you know,
Tony's at the event, and basically, as the story goes,

(15:35):
the lore of it, you got your tuxs now. If
that went down, fine, but I can just tell you
I know he was ready no matter what.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
The circumstances of it were. But still to go in
there and if to be said, Okay, you're doing the event, ah,
that's kind of that's like whoa. But I'm you know,
I'm sure he's like, yeah, let's go. And as you
mentioned his commentary, he slid right in.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
He was very up on all the product, he knew
about all the superstars. He was was, you know, would
say bold statements throughout. And then you got to work
with Jesse, which could not be easy coming in and
not having a chance to really have worked with the guy.
And this is where you're doing it in a pay per view.

(16:26):
So great credit to him for just even sliding in there.
And Vince whatever reason, uh, maybe he thought about it
the whole way and said I'm gonna I want to
see how he handles this, because that wouldn't have been
too crazy for Vince to do.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
But however, the circumstances happened and he huh, maybe maybe
Vince blew out his pipes that day doing the intro
Survivors Shavani.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
Definitely, But but the step in there. I can tell
you it was not an easy thing to do overall.
I know, you know, Tony knew that.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
This was this gigantic opportunity to come and work for
the w w E, the w w F at the time.

Speaker 2 (17:18):
And Uh, he came up to Connecticut and all those
kids were young, and he.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
Has I think he has five children. Uh, and they
were very all young kids at the time.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
So you're moving your whole family up from down south
and and and you come into world, a world like Connecticut. Uh,
that just had to be like moving to another country,
I'm sure, to him and the family, and to try
and get set up and then do everything else by
you know, going into your job. But you hear how

(17:54):
that that Vince was just never really.

Speaker 3 (17:58):
Into having him there. I don't think that was true.
And then I think Brusto said that that he didn't
like his twang. He didn't think it fit into the
w w F.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
Okay, then how do you explain Jim Ross?

Speaker 3 (18:17):
Yeah, I mean, my god, I'm could it be any thicker? Uh?
Maybe that was just something he huged.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
But but the point I wanted to make about that
is that and we saw this through the decades, How
Vince would sour on people for whatever, for whatever reason.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
How many times had Michael Cole was he been on
the outs where you know, you hear in all these
dirt shoots, and Vince has had enough of Michael Cole.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Well they sent him to another show or something, and
then he's back. And I think that for Tony it
was a combination of things. First of all, I think it
was just tough being in and we've I've talked to
him before about it where uh, you know, you go
to this place and you're uproot, you don't have any

(19:01):
real support there or anything, and you're trying to fit
into this new world and they put a lot on
you then and then trying to find your place.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
And I think that really what.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
It comes down to is that if he just would
have given it more time and just let it ride.
Whether or not, Vince was not sure about him announcing
at the time, and you know, I heard rumors that
he wanted him to take voice lessons.

Speaker 3 (19:37):
Come on your entire career, that's your voice, and he's
going to try and change it.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
I don't think so. But my point of it is
is that if it would have sure whatever Vince didn't
put him on pay per views or he wasn't announcing,
but Tony still would have been doing his thing. He
still would have had opportunities to get behind them and
do matches, and then at some point, Uh, Vince would

(20:05):
have for whatever reason said that was that was a
great event, or that you know, I like that.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
And then suddenly you're good.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
As I've mentioned before, and I kind of used this
analogy of flying too close to the sun, and when
you're in a situation where you're around Vince a lot,
you stand a chance of, for whatever reason, falling out
of favor. I was really fortunate because I was at
the studio and I did my thing, and I wasn't

(20:36):
doing play by play where he was listening to everything
I did, So I was I was good. But when
you're in a situation like Tony was in, where you've
got uh, You've got Gorilla, you've got Jesse, you got
to work with Bobby, you know, it's uh that there's
a lot of pressure there.

Speaker 3 (20:58):
Uh And uh Tony's mentioned it many times.

Speaker 2 (21:01):
How he wish he would have stayed. You've heard me
say the same thing. But I was there for five years.
He was there for a year, and I really think
that if he would have just written it out, things
would have settled down with the family. They would have
gotten into, you know, a place in a community and

(21:21):
had neighbors. And of course I've told you how welcoming.
You know, we were a family then. And nobody had
a problem with Tony that I ever saw, and I
got along with him great. I know that everybody else
did too. He was just a good guy who was

(21:42):
trying to make it and so that wasn't the problem.
It wasn't that he felt, oh my god, they don't
want me here. That wasn't true at all. I mean,
he fit right in. So I think that if, like
I said, if he would have just you know, settled in,
you know, gotten into the community, he would have gotten

(22:02):
into the mix, Vince would have the dlang accent would
have been something that went away. And just so, yeah,
this is he this is what he does, and he's
doing a great job. But he got other opportunities. People
got in his ear down South, Hey come back down here,
will take good care of you, and he leaped. And

(22:24):
he's mentioned before in the conversations I've had with him
and other people too, that he had a conversation with
Vince and told him, I think we're gonna go down.
You know, we're gonna go We're gonna leave. And I
don't think he felt that Vince gave him kind of
that feedback of no, I want you to stay, But

(22:46):
that wasn't what Vince did.

Speaker 3 (22:48):
You know, It wasn't going to make it seem like
I'm going to beg you to stay here. So there's
probably a little bit of that too.

Speaker 2 (22:56):
But who knows what Tony could have done there. He
could have been Michael Cole who outlasted them all.

Speaker 3 (23:02):
And I don't know.

Speaker 2 (23:05):
But it's too bad that it was really a short
lived stint because you know, we see now he's still
doing it, and I know it's very popular. Yeah, he's
busier than ever and he's you know, up where I am,
age wise, so.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
He looks great too. So you know, you know, I
found the phont of you somehow.

Speaker 2 (23:27):
Well maybe it's the announcer become a wrestling announcer and
you're gonna.

Speaker 3 (23:34):
I don't know. I don't know about that. I think
that one day it's gonna where it's gonna you know, baseballs,
it falls out, you know, that's the day.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
This show just goes audio.

Speaker 3 (23:45):
But but Tony really I can't say enough about him.
I have come friendly with him.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
Again, I don't talk to him very often, but he
just a great guy from every aspect that I ever
interaction I ever had with him.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
And it's great to see that, you know that he
had kind of this next career.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
With that he's still involved with because he was out
of it for a very long time and he was
just I remember when I interviewed him that he had
a he had for a hoot, had become a barista.

Speaker 3 (24:27):
At a a.

Speaker 2 (24:28):
Starbucks and he would do college football games where you
know some of them. I know he did some announcing,
but he was like the board op guy doing these games.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:44):
I mean, he just was completely out of it as
far as you know, doing any kind of wrestling or anything.

Speaker 3 (24:51):
So you know, they pulled him back in and you know,
his career it's as big, I think, as as it
ever was. So get for tell me.

Speaker 4 (25:03):
It's just one of those interesting things where it's like
the voice of the Monday Night Wars. It's Jim Ross
and Tony Shavanni, you know, with Jerry Loll and other
people by them sides on Nitro and on raw and
then but yet here's Tony Shavanni in the wwfter and
the Golden Era. But I don't think a lot of
people knew that when we got to say, eight years
from now in nineteen ninety eight. It's just crazy that

(25:26):
story of Vince McMahon showing up to the arena and
but like, hey, you ring your tucks, Yeah, all right,
your announce to what Jesse Haha just walks away.

Speaker 1 (25:33):
And this isn't his first pay per view though it
is his last.

Speaker 4 (25:36):
He did announce during SummerSlam nineteen eighty nine, so Vince
did have a indication of what he could pull off here.
But it's one of those like weird scenarios of like
Dusty Rhodes, Rick Flair, Legion of Doom, Texas Tornado, Tony Shavanni,
you know, the Brainbusters aren't in Tony Tully. It's like
these names are there, but they're not there for very long.

(25:58):
Is it because of just they feel more comfortable somewhere else?
I know Conndicut, you lived there, very pricey, very pricey,
And Tony said that's one of the reasons he decided
to leave as well. So is it just more of
a comfort thing to leave and go somewhere everyone knows
your name versus somewhere are you trying to get your footing.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
Yeah, but you're going to be working with the WWF
the WWE. So I think that in a lot of
those cases that it just didn't work for whatever reason.
You know, you have a long list of these guys,
and of course, not taking away from what they did,
they were true blue recognized, did great things in the

(26:41):
WWE back then, but they didn't they weren't over and
it was really it was surprising to me that it
didn't happen that way. I think that the crowds were
just different. The audience that they were used to performing
down South were very different from the crowds you would
see at WWF events of course.

Speaker 3 (27:03):
So uh, and you know Junkyard Dog, Uh, you know
arn and Tully and uh, you know all of these guys.
The list kind of goes on and on. Garvin was big.
Uh you know that I I he did, okay, but
really right, I mean car there yeah. Uh, And these

(27:28):
guys were gigantic down south.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
You know, Hacksaw talks all the time about just how
big and we've had those discussions before.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
So, I I think if it's working, nobody's going anywhere, Steve.
If if you're making money, and and especially with the superstars,
they could have their families, they could live anywhere.

Speaker 3 (27:47):
Uh. There were just people like me who were doing
stuff every single day that I needed to be in Connecticut.
I couldn't live somewhere else. I was in the.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Studio five days a week and then maybe at a
TV taping or whatever, so I had to be there
sort of, you know, Alfred and Gorilla would come up,
Bobby would would fly in and say so with Jeane,
but they had to be there on.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
A regular basis. But uh, and I don't know the circumstances.
Maybe because they did know that Tony had the ability
to be a producer as well, that they brought him
on basically as a full time staff guy because I
don't you know, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
Maybe he could have worked the deal and he could
have done the same kind of thing that Jeane did,
you know where Gene Jane never lived in Connecticut, lived
in Florida. So but for whatever deal they worked out,
Tony brought you know, it was a whole family, whole
fam damily as they say, uh, and up there, and
yes it was pricey, but when things work, I think

(28:55):
that it was mostly just not being comfortable.

Speaker 3 (28:58):
And I'm not not to say that, you know, Tony's
family was so unhappy or whatever.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
It was just you know, it was just very probably
a difficult period trying to fit in.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
When you're from somewhere else.

Speaker 2 (29:15):
But you know, the thing of it is, though, like
when things are working, you make you find a way
to make it work. So it wasn't that that wasn't
the reason really overall that people just say forget it,
I'm not going to stick around. So I think there
was a number.

Speaker 4 (29:33):
Of factors, okay, because yeah, it's just for instance, for
your example, when you came into the w WF, you
didn't have you know, you're wrestling. You didn't you didn't
come from a nothing territory. You came from something else.
So Tony coming in, I'm guessing because ice you were there,
they weren't speaking Carnie around him for a year, they
weren't kind of outsiding him because he already established his

(29:55):
legs in the company, well in wrestling in general.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Right, yeah, oh absolutely, And you know some guys that
he'd worked with were already there, so you kind of
get that pass in. Yeah, but he was a very
established wrestling announcer and somebody who was, you know, part
of the brotherhood there. So I don't think that was
ever an issue of the boys not welcoming him or

(30:19):
making him feel comfortable. I think it was more towards
just fitting into the company. And I also think and
you mentioned this came to my mind when you mentioned
all these guys and they a lot of Southern attachment
or even the way they spoke whoever, And and I
think that, you know, some of it was that Vince.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
Hated Ted Turner so much and what was Ted Turner
you know, wrestling, you know, and that kind of you
know that, and that could have been part of it.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
That you know, there's I just take that whole you know,
drawl and that that problem could have been whatever he
felt against Tony for a period of time. Maybe it
was too close to that that.

Speaker 3 (31:08):
Turner kind of syndrome. No had maybe had Turner derangements.
And I think you call it that that that form
of TDS. That's true, because it was it was, you know,
and he just he hated the way you know, to him.
It was you know, to Turner, it was just business.
He could have cared less about the business. And Vince

(31:29):
was passionate about professional wrestling, and here you got this
guy just you know, hey, we're in the wrestling business.
I'm in the wrestling business now, you know.

Speaker 2 (31:37):
And so that could have been another factor there. But
as far as uh coming to Connecticut, sure is expensive
and everything was, it wasn't insane.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
I mean even I.

Speaker 2 (31:49):
Could afford when I first went up there, and I
wasn't making a lot of money, but you know, I
had a cot of minium right out.

Speaker 3 (31:55):
Of the lake.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
You know, after living in a box in New York
City for six years, I was I was living large.
I had a car for the first time since college,
and my old my old VW dasher.

Speaker 3 (32:11):
I had, you know, I had a burner. So that
was That wasn't a factor. I don't think.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
I I just think overall it was uprooting your family.
You're away from your relatives and you're go. It is
a strange world, it is, and it was as much
as we had that community, but it was a little odd,
you know, fitting into it. But it took a while,
and he would have certainly become part of it as
far as.

Speaker 3 (32:38):
I believe, So, I just think it was a It
was a tough time and if it would have given
more time to it, he would have settled in and
probably would have been there for a long time.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
Yeah. Again, it's so weird.

Speaker 4 (32:52):
His voice is part of the nitro, the whole war
against the w WF, but here he was as a
producer for Colosseum Video and doing commentary. Jess See, Let's
get to some matches though, because this is the end
of the rouge O brothers in the ww AF take
it on the Bushwhackers and they have wrestled. Listen to
this WrestleMania five. They were on opposite teams at Survivor

(33:13):
Series eighty nine and now they're fighting at Throwing Rumbolt's
Three matches in about a year, which is to.

Speaker 1 (33:18):
Me too many matches, But this is the end of
the rugos.

Speaker 4 (33:23):
Raymond retires at the age of thirty four, which again
is shocking.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
But thirty four then was like your grandpa in today's world. Now, no,
not so much.

Speaker 4 (33:33):
But in today's world said you're forty five, and you're like, god, damn,
he's in his prime. Were you shocked to see the
fabulous Rouge's were done here, and then Raymond decides to
step back and then eventually do commentary and do interviews,
and then a year from now we have the Monti gimmick.
So let's talk about a lot of this, like why
do you feel like the Ruge's ended here?

Speaker 2 (33:54):
Well, if you know anything about Raymond Rougeau, he's very
different than Jacques the way by leaps and bounds. Raymond
was the really grounded guy. He's the he was the
manager of their team. And Raymond was really a sharp guy,

(34:16):
tough as fricking nails. He's one of the toughest the
superstars there were. He was feared by a lot of people.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
He was a martial artist and really a tough guy.

Speaker 2 (34:29):
Nobody messed with him. But he was also a shrewd
businessman and he saved his money and invested it wisely.
And I'm not saying he was set it for life
at thirty four, but I think he was well on
his way and he I think that the road life
got to him. He just got sick of being on

(34:51):
the road all the time. And God knows, I love Jacques,
but I can imagine that must have.

Speaker 3 (34:56):
Been trying with Jacques, the and the way he looked
at like, you know, you know, Jacques talks about it.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
You know, Raymond was always telling him save your money,
save your money, you know, do this and and uh
and Jacques was like, ah, yeah, we're gonna it keeps coming,
We're gonna be fine.

Speaker 3 (35:13):
And yeah, and he just blew it on.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
Every whatever and Raymond was, uh, you know, looked at
what expenses.

Speaker 3 (35:22):
On the road and this for that and uh and
this much goes into the bank account and this one
gets invested and uh. So he he.

Speaker 2 (35:31):
Pretty much that point had had enough and at least
wanted to step away for a while. Well the problem
with that is that they'd become a pretty established tag
team and we know how popular they were back then.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
And overall tag team competition was.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
And here's Jacques stepping away from it all, saying I'm
just done.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
I don't want to do this anymore. And okay, now
what is Jaq gonna do? He's not he didn't.

Speaker 2 (35:57):
Put the money away. This is the only life he knows.
He's really good at it. And okay, now it happens.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
So as far as the team goes that that was
all driven by by ray you know, and and uh
and and he had the ability to do it. Now.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
It was great that he wanted to still stay connected
and he came back and we did a lot of
announcing and also had a lot to do with something,
you know, the Canadian shows.

Speaker 3 (36:28):
But as far as the day to day and being
on the road, he didn't want to do that anymore.
And I know he had. He stepped into the ring
occasionally then, but never went back to that to you know,
where where you had where you had that grind, and
he had the ability to do it because he.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
Was smart about what he did with his money. And
to this day, man, he is a really successful businessman.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
And I'm looking for it. I'm going to be at
their show they're having in May. They've invited me up
and I'm really looking forward to seeing Ray again.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
It's amazing.

Speaker 4 (37:01):
Hopefully you don't get the shock stick though from the mountains.

Speaker 3 (37:05):
I might. I might. So I got it with him,
and I love it.

Speaker 2 (37:10):
And Jack, you know, we've talked about Jacques before. Jacques
is also one of my favorite people, I mean, a
true friend that I've remained friends with over the years,
and he stayed in touch and uh so they're two.

Speaker 3 (37:22):
Great you know. I always really had a great time
with them and I and I really I really liked
Ray too. He was always very professional, funny, you know,
and just a great guy, both of them.

Speaker 4 (37:33):
Yeah, one percent. I got to interview both of them.
In Raymond, I interviewed him when I had a deep,
deep case of COVID, not realizing at the time, so
every time I asked him, I.

Speaker 3 (37:43):
Was like, so you did this with Jacques, you know.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
Then he explained, and then I would hit mute and
I'd be off camera.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
Yeah, I'm surprised you got him, because I know Ray
hasn't done a whole bunch.

Speaker 3 (37:57):
So that's that's cool that you got the chance to
interview because.

Speaker 4 (38:00):
He came back though for a second time, though, Mooney,
because I apologized.

Speaker 1 (38:04):
I texted him.

Speaker 4 (38:05):
I was like, I am so sorry that I coughed
for an hour during an interview.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
Can we do it again too? And He's like, yeah,
of course.

Speaker 4 (38:12):
And so yeah, both guys amazing individuals to me personally.
Both have done multiple interviews with me, so I have
nothing about to say. They were all American boys in
my eyes, but this was.

Speaker 3 (38:22):
The end of Uh, We're going to get them back up.
We're doing a lot of these. Uh, I don't know
what do call it? Getting back touch.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
Tour in now that now, that is what we're talking about.
They getting back in touchdown Touch Tour.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
Yeah, so let's get them both. We're going to get
them both back on. We'll do them individually, but we'll
get We're going to get him. Yes, I haven't talked
to Ray.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
In a long time.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
Oh really. Oh, you're going to see him in May.

Speaker 3 (38:52):
Right, Yeah, but I'm going to get him on before
the event. Huh. You're gonna promote the yes, absolutely, that's.

Speaker 4 (39:03):
How you get people on, folks. Little little side story.
Bruce Beefcake, though, took on the Genius. This is the
geniuses first in last ever pay per view match. He
does own a technically a win over Hulk Coger on
an episode of Satury Knight's main event.

Speaker 1 (39:17):
Is not a pinfall win, though.

Speaker 4 (39:21):
Why do you think that the Genius wasn't used more
in the ring Because I liked him as a character.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
I thought he did very well for himself.

Speaker 4 (39:29):
But this match is really to set up the Bruce
Beefcake missed a perfect match coming up at Wrestmania six.
But what do you think the Genius never was in
action as often as he probably should have because he
was over.

Speaker 2 (39:43):
Well you say that, you can say that, but I
think he was that over as far as they were concerned.
Does that make sense that, yes, yeah, he was over,
but I think he was kind of a side attraction
in this with the poems and the you know, the

(40:04):
diplomas and that whole look, with the pomp and circumstance.

Speaker 3 (40:11):
I guess, well, then he did.

Speaker 2 (40:14):
He did get the doctors honor kind of gowns that
he would wear, so he did it, did step up that.
But yeah, he was over, but was put to a
point of putting him higher. I think he only had
one pay per view match. I think that was Yeah,
that was it. So yeah, so that's he was over,

(40:39):
but not enough in Vince's eyes to where they were
going to really and I think, you know, they did
push him, but I think a lot of that had
to do with Randy, let's be honest here, and and
and the thing about it though, was that, you know,
Lanny was pretty good in the ring. I mean, he
did a lot of things. He was very flexible and
could do all these flips and stuff like that. But

(41:03):
as far as as reaching a level where he was
going to be uh, you know, pushed to a point
to where he was going to be doing matches on
a regular basis, Like that never really happened. And and
you know, I think Lanny kind of realized that he
understood what the marquis of his brother did.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
For his career. But he was happy with it, and
uh and and took every every opportunity.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
That he got and uh, you know, certainly very well
remembered was by many fans. They you know, they loved
that whole stick and you could put him with anybody too.
But as far as getting that uh you know, big
card push just never happened.

Speaker 4 (41:45):
Yeah, this ry rumbold the undercard is quite underwhelming because
up next, though, you have Greg the Hammer Valentine versus
Rugged Ronnie Darvin, and the retirement sipulation for this always
makes me laugh, Like it really shows me Jack Tunny
as if he's like a character and he's thinking these
things through. He's a bumbling fool. Because Garvin loses a

(42:05):
retirement match, so he can no longer wrestle to Greg Valentine,
and so Jack Tunney, in the kindness of his heart,
hires back rugged Ronnie Garvin. But now he's gonna do
re announcing and timekeeper and guess commentary, but only during Greg.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
The Hammer Valentine matches.

Speaker 4 (42:24):
Eventually, the Hammer begs Tonny to bring back Garvin, and
that's why we have this match here at the Royal Rumble.
If you if Jack Tony is a real person, what
is he mentally thinking? Because why would he put the
guy that got retired by the other wrestler but only
work during his hours.

Speaker 2 (42:44):
Well, it was a way to try and keep a
rivalry going, but it was pretty lame.

Speaker 3 (42:54):
I think he did, didn't he ref He was a referee,
he was.

Speaker 4 (42:58):
He did all the things only during Greg Valentia and
if Jack Tunnel it.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
Was just that, you know, he just wouldn't go away,
and the whole premise of it. Then I'm always gonna
be I'm haunting you. I'm gonna be where where you know,
when you think I'm I'm I'm gone, I'm gonna be there,
You're gonna turn around and there I am. And at
some point you're you're not gonna be able to stand it.
You're gonna beg to get me in the ring so
you can you can settle the score.

Speaker 3 (43:26):
But yeah, that you know, that's that was another thing.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
I mean they tried with Ronnie and uh, you know,
the whole towel thing and the brush cut and.

Speaker 3 (43:37):
Uh it just didn't didn't go. And he was you
know in these other territories. Man, he was really popular, right,
he was champion. Yeah, I mean so that you know,
he's another one there. You shake your head. I maybe

(43:58):
it was at the time, you know, we had such
strong gimmicks going that you had to have one that
really caught on for people to root for you. You couldn't
just be.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
You know, rugged Ronnie Garvin and expect to really get over.
You needed an undertaker type gimmick or something that was
going to that people could really just latch onto. But
there was as we said earlier that there's a long
list of these guys that.

Speaker 3 (44:25):
Were tremendously successful in other territories. In other words, but
whether it was the type of audience that the WWF had.

Speaker 2 (44:37):
Or the gimmick that they had, or you know, those territories,
you didn't need him.

Speaker 3 (44:44):
It was more based on you.

Speaker 2 (44:47):
Know, tough guy kind of like Hacksaw talks about.

Speaker 3 (44:50):
You know, Hacksaw was you know swinging the hands. That
was just his thing.

Speaker 2 (44:55):
But we look at all the gimmicks that he had
and that's what got him over, you know, the two
by four, the flag, everything else. So I think a
lot of these guys that didn't end up really getting
over it's just because they never really established a gimmick
that made them memorable to that audience.

Speaker 4 (45:15):
I agree with you, Like, honestly, when I think of
Greg Valentine, this is me personally. Maybe you love Greg Valentine,
I consider him boring up until he joined with Honky
as like ye Rhythm sud a gimmick. Suddenly I was like, oh,
he's funny, he's silly, he can't sing. Look at Ronny
Garvin never did that for me. It was like you

(45:36):
have the war Lord, and you got Demolition, you got
Texas Tornado, and then you got like my dad's best friend.
Like that's what I looked at as Ronnie Garvin, what's
jumping out about you?

Speaker 2 (45:47):
You as much as anybody can attest to what it
was that made you like these certain superstars, And when
you break it all down, every one of them had
this strong character about them. It wasn't just that I'm
just this tough guy, uh in the ring and let's
go like, okay, but what else do you do?

Speaker 3 (46:08):
You know? Right?

Speaker 4 (46:10):
I gues agree, I'm sorry. This was like watching people say, oh,
it's such a great match. It was like watching paint
dry for me because these two, to me, don't entertain me.
And again both meant former tag team champions, former Greg Valentine,
Interconinal champion, Bonnie Garvin, world champion, somewhere else but here,
and now you were boring me and someone probably loves

(46:32):
this match, and.

Speaker 3 (46:33):
You well, and I don't talk about it. That there
was you know, it was pretty stiff. Uh.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
These guys loved you know, the whole chess slapping and
all that, you know, which.

Speaker 3 (46:42):
We used to drive me crazy, but you like chess laps?

Speaker 2 (46:48):
Yeah, yeah, where they were you know, excessive. I mean
I always love, you know, Brett Hart talking about Rick
Flair saying, you know, I'm gonna do the you know,
the chess slap, and Brett hated it, and he said, yeah, okay,
go ahead, but then I'm gonna hunt your right in
the mouth, you know, because I mean it didn't make
any sense, you know, except really really hurting. And you

(47:13):
have these welts on your chest.

Speaker 3 (47:15):
But as far as how's that going to take your
opponent out, I mean he's going to break them down
from the slapping, you know, But that's a whole other discussion.
I love it, but but that.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
Is a you know kind of if you're a purist
and you like those kinds of now, you probably really
did enjoy that match, Yeah, because I.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
Did not, but someone I bet did.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
And oh yeah, there were a lot of people that did.

Speaker 2 (47:37):
And you know that that loved to see that, you know,
back and forth and it was old school really was Yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:45):
Yeah, some people. Again, I think that's why.

Speaker 4 (47:48):
Honestly, if you were watching n w A or w
CW around this time, that was what you were watching.
You like that style. The WWF was not that style.
You know, sports entertainment versus wrestling. They're not the same thing.
They might be like how a movie of a comedy
and a horror and a rom com they might be
the same category, but they're not the same thing. And

(48:08):
I think that's what people get confused. But with like
ww ebres as other companies. But the Big boss Man
also took on your former co host Hackstaw Jim Duggan here.
A month later, Big Bossman will turn Babyface, helping out
Drake the Snake Roberts in the Million Dollar Man storyline.
But man, when you think of Golden era, when you
think of you know who's on your bed sheets?

Speaker 1 (48:30):
Hacksaw, Jim Duggan and Big boss Man are there.

Speaker 4 (48:33):
How important do you think they are to like the
lore of this Golden era?

Speaker 3 (48:38):
Absolutely?

Speaker 2 (48:39):
And I think you know, you've got two great examples
right there, ability wise, though, you know, and I have
my own personal preferences. I think boss Man was a
tremendous ring performer and the things he could do being
as large a man as he was, and hacksawd you know,
could go at it too. But you know, so if

(49:00):
you're talking ability in the ring, you know Valentine Garbin,
boss Man, Hacksaw's what match.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
Do you want to see? More?

Speaker 2 (49:11):
I know you don't even have to think about it.
Boss Man Hacksaw well, because you know, good match. But
heads and tails know above. But you love those characters,
and you love what they did in the ring, and
you loved how they react, and you love that boss
Man with the nightstick and oh man, all that, So

(49:33):
that right there, that's a great example of Okay, why
this one and not that one?

Speaker 3 (49:38):
Mm hmm, easy, easy, Yeah, it's strong characters.

Speaker 1 (49:45):
It's so good.

Speaker 4 (49:46):
Like again, this match isn't that great at all. But
if you're just looking for you see your favorites for
each other. This is what this is all about.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
Yeah, you know, facial expressions as the way you know, over
the time op on some of that stuff.

Speaker 3 (50:01):
I mean I would laugh out loud some of his reactions.
And then and then the fierceness of of of Bubba,
you know, a boss man, and uh, you know, I
was always amazed how he wielded that nightstick and what
you know, what he would do.

Speaker 2 (50:19):
But I mean, uh, eighth of an inch from someone's
head and you know, and you bring it, you know,
when he's pounding that in there, you swear to god,
he's like putting that thing through.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
The guy's rip cage.

Speaker 2 (50:33):
So uh yeahs as far as that all went, ate
it up, everybody ate it up.

Speaker 3 (50:40):
They loved it.

Speaker 1 (50:41):
It was delicious.

Speaker 4 (50:43):
This is the age too, of having like foam, like
not figurines, but like, all right, Hacksa has a two
by four, so kids are gonna.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
Buy a foam to the foam finger Yeah, you had
a foam finger that you had.

Speaker 4 (50:54):
You had a foam nightstick later on, like you had
Brett Hard.

Speaker 3 (50:59):
You know.

Speaker 4 (50:59):
It was just it's so funny because you don't see
that being made anymore as merchandise where fans want to
go to the arena and buy these foam items like
they had scissors, they had raw band and thumbs, like
they've had so many things. Like why do you that's
a weird question, But why do you think that suddenly
a piece of merchandise that clearly people would buy no
longer exists in this market.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
Well back then it was new. You know, it wasn't
the first sports merchandise that was out there. But the WWF,
I mean, god, I remember the.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
I remember the catalogs, the hats, the foam fingers, the
I mean everything, the cups, mugs. It was incredible, and
I think that people hadn't really seen that and had
seen had the opportunity to purchase.

Speaker 3 (51:48):
So many different items.

Speaker 2 (51:49):
Okay, I don't know what the you know, the merchandising
deals that they had with some of these companies, they
must have gotten the stuff dirt cheap.

Speaker 3 (51:59):
But you know, the were house was just humming.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
I mean that was a gigantic business and uh, you know,
and people.

Speaker 3 (52:07):
Wanted all of it.

Speaker 2 (52:09):
Remember that, the commercials, the the the w w F rings,
the the action figures. It was just so much of
it and everybody had to have it. The wrestling buddies,
you know. Uh, that was just part of the era.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
Uh you know. Now it's what do you do with it?
You know, the hanging behind the video games.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
You know, they wanted they want to be able to
do it with the the video games and that kind
of thing and maybe a T shirt but not It
wasn't like that.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
Everybody had that.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
You go on the arena and they and they loved
it because that was also promoting not just the product,
but the product, you know that it was uh you know,
people would see that and like on TV, I want
one of those.

Speaker 3 (52:53):
Well, we've got a catalog and you can order that
and it'll be here next week.

Speaker 4 (52:58):
He said the letter to Hoult Coogan, he's sick at home,
and we'll make sure you get a catalog after that.

Speaker 3 (53:05):
That's perfect brilliant marketing as it is.

Speaker 4 (53:08):
But let's break down the rod Rumble participants and one
of the weirdest things that happens in this for a rumble.
So you have the first guy is Million Dollar Man.
The reasoning is because last year he actually purchased his
number A thirty ticket from Slick and a Keem and
the Big boss Man. So they carry that storyline into
the rumble, forcing him to be number one because he
cheated last year.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
Again.

Speaker 4 (53:28):
Jack Tunny doing his job sometimes and sometimes he's just
terrible man.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
Coocoi beware number two ruler.

Speaker 4 (53:35):
Hey, hey, don't disparage our president like that. All right,
we love Jack Tunny. Here Tony for twenty twenty eight.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
That's right. Wait, he's dead.

Speaker 4 (53:45):
So Million Dollar Man and Koco beware, Marty Janetti and
Jake the Snake. Now that's the first four. They all
have music. Usually one and two only get music. Mary,
Jenny and Jake also get music. But once we hit
number five, the music just stops. It doesn't continue. And
I have no idea why not until the nineteen ninety

(54:06):
six were a rumble does it become a consistent thing
where every wrestler gets the music for every entrance to
hear that pop.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
It's just so bizarre and I don't know why, and
maybe you do. Why in the hell would four people
get music and the rest don't.

Speaker 2 (54:23):
That is a great question. Maybe the tape player broke.
I don't know, but I do remember, you know, Coco
coming out with Frankie, you know, even had the mascots
with him, and I really, I mean, he's supposed to
run out there and go in the ring, and he's

(54:44):
coming out with his music and Frankie.

Speaker 4 (54:48):
Is the manager license manager license, Yes, it can be
your ring side.

Speaker 3 (54:52):
And somebody had to take Frankie backstage. You know, they
couldn't keep him at ring side.

Speaker 4 (54:57):
He was cheering on he was cheering on Coco. I
think it was Jake the sneak with number four. So
Coco and Marty get eliminated very quickly. So Millie La
Man is in the ring by himself, and Jake and
the Million Dollar Man have a storyline. I think the
whole point is hit Jake's music. Hear that pop milliona
La Man knows he screwed, and then after that we'll
just not plenty more music because let's just get this

(55:19):
Jake pop in.

Speaker 1 (55:20):
It was very bizarre number five and.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
I kind of, you know, and I like the idea
that they were playing in the music because then it
would give people the idea, you know, because everybody knew
their music and say, oh, it's him instead of you know,
when you're in this big arena and then you're yeah,
you know, if you're in there, you kind of got
of course, the announcer is gonna say.

Speaker 3 (55:39):
Oh, man, it's Jake the Snake, Roberts or you know.

Speaker 2 (55:43):
But but yeah, I don't know why they didn't keep
it going because it was a great way to keep
the audience popping. Uh and then and when because then
you know, it's just the yeah, you still have the
clock and then they.

Speaker 3 (56:00):
Know and they have they come the bibble box.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
But but yeah, I don't know why the decision was
made not to play that music because I liked it.
I loved the idea that it would play and then
people would go, oh, it's that guy.

Speaker 3 (56:12):
You know it's coming in.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
Agreed.

Speaker 3 (56:14):
So and then why the first four and then not
did not make sense?

Speaker 1 (56:20):
It's a Vince was Zeno.

Speaker 4 (56:22):
He was hurt that day, and uh so number five
is the Macho Man. Six, Roddy Piper, Warlord Brett Hart,
Bad News Brown, Dusty Rhodes, Arrange, the Giant, the Red Rooster,
Axe Haku, Smash a chem Snooka, Dino Bravo, The Canadian Earthquake,
Jim Knightheartlim Warrior. That's right, He's not just earthquake yet,

(56:45):
he's only Earthquake in Canada. Jim Hedeheart's twenty twenty one Warrior,
Rick Martel, Tino Santana, Honky tonk Man twenty five.

Speaker 1 (56:54):
Who ends up being the winner?

Speaker 4 (56:55):
Hulk Coogan, Shawn Michaels, the Barbarian, Rick Rude, Hercules, and
Mister Perfect.

Speaker 1 (57:00):
Those are your participants.

Speaker 4 (57:01):
But the biggest rumor still surrounding this event is the
idea that mister Perfect was originally going to win this
Royal Rumble, but Hulk Cogan ends up saying, well I
got a post brother and Hogan wins. Now, honestly that
rumor could make sense, But at the same time, how
many times have you heard someone say, hey, you might

(57:22):
win this match and then you don't, like, do you?
Why would Perfect win but not Hogan for setting up
Hogan versus Warrior.

Speaker 2 (57:28):
Well, as you mentioned that, did Hulk get in their
ears to say you know, you know you're gonna think
you're gonna need me? And then I also think that
there was some doubt that.

Speaker 3 (57:46):
And not taking a lot away from Kurt here, but thinking,
I don't know if he's gonna be able to carry that,
to carry it, And so I think that that's kind
of what it all came down to. That, you know,
as we've in, Hulk had all these other aspirations, all

(58:10):
these other things that he had going on, and wanted
to take those to their limits, but at the same
time did not want to lose his place with the WWE.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
So I think that he played that game, and he
played it very effectively as to you know, and be
careful what you do here, you know, because you're gonna
need me.

Speaker 3 (58:32):
Probably you're gonna need me.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Yeah, And I need to keep my foot here just
to And so I think that that was part of it.
But I also think that when it came down to it,
it probably sounded initially good. And I think that that
also the Warrior had something to do with that too,
that you know, could he help establish that if it

(58:54):
was going to be perfect a warrior, you know, could he.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
Bring it to that level.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
And so I think it was a combination and in
the end they were able to. You know, probably the
way the Hulks are made seen is that well, oh well,
okay if you if you really need me or if
you need it. But I think that it was also
part of it with him, is that, Yeah, I think
I can have both worlds, and he did because that

(59:22):
he could disappear for great stretches to go do stuff
but still be able to have that connection at any
time and they needed him and they did, could come
back and basically, you know, save the company.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
Yeah, he's very good at doing that, but a.

Speaker 3 (59:40):
Lot of are Yeah.

Speaker 4 (59:42):
Yeah, and Michaels, Steve Austin and look, they evolved done
it where they're like, how do I stay on top?
If I leave and business goes down, they'll think it's
because of me leaving. So then they'll call me back
and say, we got you got to fix this problem.
You got to fix the leaks in the boat. You know,
all right, I'll show up brother, okay, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:00:01):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
And I think that you know, Terry over the years
received a lot of criticism and how you know him
putting you know, Holkster must pose and Hogan must pose
and all this, but.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
He never forgot that it was.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
An independent business. You are an independent contractor, and if
you don't sell yourself, nobody is going to, and he
turned out to be a master at it and keeping
himself relevant for a very long time, and even when
it ended with the WWE, made it happen again. And

(01:00:40):
people ever thought there's no way that he could go
down and he could be ever be a heel? How
could who could ever be a heel? Well, look what
he did when he went down South, So a lot
of ways, I don't know if he gets enough credit
for understanding the business and how to keep yourself relevant
and at the top, which he did wherever he went

(01:01:05):
so proved it time and time again and was a
since the franchise for the WWE for a very very
long time.

Speaker 4 (01:01:15):
Of course, he's again still the most notorious professional wrestler
of all time. Maybe in the next ten years that
will disappear and then you'll be replaced by say Rock
John c Anda, something like that, but hul Coogan is
still that.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Hey, what do you think of wrestling? When you think
of wrestling, you think of that guy.

Speaker 3 (01:01:30):
Can never change Steve though, that could never change you.

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
I mean, you know, Rock will certainly his influence what
Steve Austin did, but no one could ever match what Terry.

Speaker 3 (01:01:42):
Bellia did for professional wrestling.

Speaker 2 (01:01:44):
It's just unmatched and never and just because the way
that the business is become and where it came from,
there's nobody else that could even compare Warriors.

Speaker 3 (01:01:57):
Certainly not no, no, I really want.

Speaker 4 (01:02:00):
I would have been nice to see mister Perfect win here.
But I understand that the nineteen ninety of Roy Rumble
offers nothing. It's not like you win and get a
world title match in Russemania. Not until ninety three do
they actually add that stipulation. This is just a big
old match with all your favorite wrestlers interacting, and you
might see them fight when you never see them fight
on television. And we got Warrior and Hogan Rubbin, you know,

(01:02:21):
noses and fighting each other in this moment.

Speaker 1 (01:02:23):
But it would have been nice to see mister Perfect win.

Speaker 4 (01:02:26):
But as you brought up, if Hogan is the master
of taking, you know his opportunities when he can get
him and when he wants them. If you see mister
Perfect who's undefeated, he loses to Roy Rumble, and then
he loses to rus Rustmania to Brutus Beefcake, who is
Hogan's friend, Hogan leaves. Now there's no fresh opponents for
a Warrior who's now champion.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
So there's a lot.

Speaker 4 (01:02:47):
Of like, oh, I think Hogan's much smarter than people
give him credit for for certain people down so him
and his friends can stay on top.

Speaker 3 (01:02:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:57):
No, he was a master at that and even the
situation too. And and uh and why wouldn't they let
perfectly that it. You know, they proved what they wanted
to do that we put you know, warrior and Hogan
is going to work and then let Kurt went. Like
you said, it was nothing was at stake. He wasn't
taking a strap.

Speaker 3 (01:03:16):
Uh, give it to him.

Speaker 2 (01:03:17):
And uh, and you know there's kind of that thing
supposedly that you know, the Hulk was at some point
going to step away, but he just couldn't take the loss.
You know, it's just come on and uh, you know
you hear people talk about the Undertaker and uh, you know,

(01:03:40):
the his understanding the business that of course, we look
at his streak, but Mark had also had a way
of still being able to put these guys over in
the ring too. Not to say that that that the
rub and uh and the Hulkster didn't give that rub

(01:04:04):
to a lot of guys and helped them.

Speaker 3 (01:04:06):
But when it always came down to bottom line it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
He always had to be on top, you know what
I mean, he always had to finish with that. It's
me and uh, that's kind of the difference that there
are the other guys, someone like Mark of finishes on top.
But at the same time he's it comes out like
humble with it.

Speaker 3 (01:04:30):
Uh. You know that he this giving to the other
guy too. I hope that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
But it was always with with the Hulkster, no matter
what happened, even if the other guy won, as we
saw like Rick Flair, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:04:47):
Who ended up.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Who's the last guy in the ring? I guess that's
the best way to put He's the last guy in
the ring.

Speaker 3 (01:04:52):
Okay, yeah, man.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
Like you said, he he did whatever he had to
do and and uh and and took care of his
friends along the way.

Speaker 3 (01:05:01):
He did do that, no questions about it.

Speaker 4 (01:05:03):
Well again, I think we're all thinking too, like how
my favorites mister Perfect, he's being held out by Hogan.
So why I hate Hogan? Well, guess what, Hogan's got
a wife, he's got young kids, he's got friends, he's
got family, and guess what he wants to keep the
life he has. Well, the only way he's probably thinking,
I'm gonna get to keep this is if I have
to put my foot down on people. And wrestling is

(01:05:23):
not a team sport. W is not a team sport.
There might be lots of people on the roster, but
it is not a team sport. And so Hogan smart man,
But he ruined a lot of people's momentum and that's
up to us to discuss. Here on the Golden Era,
there was one more segment here, The Brother Love Show
ended up on a pay per view. I'm sorry, I
am sorry. This should never be on a pay per view.

(01:05:48):
When you're giving this for free on Superstars and Wrestling
Challenges and Sedien's main event, you're paying to watch to
Roy Rumble, not paying to watch a talk segment on
the pay per view. So yes, set up more Dusty
Rhodes and Sweet Sapphire and all that, But how do
you feel about that you're paying, You're asking your audience
to pay money to see this, and it's not just

(01:06:08):
Superstar but Superstar.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
It's a talk show segment with Brother Love. I'm sorry,
I don't I don't like it. I don't like it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:17):
Well I know, but at the same time, too we're not.
There's not some time constraint here.

Speaker 3 (01:06:23):
People will stay on that and for as long as
you'll keep it going, you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Bought it, and yeah, but you know, as far as
the segment goes, yeah, okay. And I've always said that,
you know, Bruce Pritchard is one of the most talented
people I've ever known.

Speaker 3 (01:06:43):
He his wits and it's you And I think.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
Probably the weakest character of his whole repertoire was was
Brother Love.

Speaker 3 (01:06:55):
But you know, that was his ticket to the stage.
So I was never a huge fan of the whole
Brother Love thing. I don't I don't know, just I
know it was an opportunity, it was a great character,
but the red faced all of that. I just thought,

(01:07:15):
you know, Bruce was so much more talented, and I
remember him doing stuff back then. I'm just like, why
don't they take more advantage of all this other stuff
that he does? You know?

Speaker 2 (01:07:26):
But you know, like I said, it was his ticket
to the stage, and he wrote it and he still
remembered this day for it.

Speaker 3 (01:07:34):
There's action figures and all of it. There was merch.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
But in that sense, I just was never a big
fan of that whole segment. But you know this was
just another part of the show, and then it chanced
to put one of the talent over and another storyline.
It didn't bother me that much for what it was
and especially can't pay per view, But it's just another
added segment, another bonus, maybe something.

Speaker 4 (01:08:03):
Yeah, well, it was building to Rustlemania six with the
mixed tag match between Sapphire and Dusty Rhodes versus the
Macho King and Sherry, so it set up that scenario there.

Speaker 1 (01:08:13):
But yeah, this way rumble.

Speaker 4 (01:08:14):
I bet a lot of people this is their favorite
rod rumble, So a lot of people this is probably
the worst for a rumble. But it's really up to
you and how you feel about this event. It's interesting
it just Tony Schavanni leaves after the show, Joqu's done,
It's just warriored Hogan, Like, there's so many things after this.

Speaker 1 (01:08:32):
But as we talked about at the top of the show,
what do.

Speaker 4 (01:08:36):
You think of all the kind of the backstage drama
heading into this Royal Rumble, Because it seems to be
a lot happening with so many different wrestlers, But when you.

Speaker 1 (01:08:44):
Have to put it down, what do you think of
this Royal Rumble?

Speaker 3 (01:08:48):
What I have to let like rate it be let's
say one to ten.

Speaker 2 (01:08:52):
Yeah, probably a six, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was maybe
some moment.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
Yeah, I don't know if I can go any higher.

Speaker 1 (01:09:04):
Than that, that's fine, that's fine.

Speaker 3 (01:09:07):
But yeah, I was just yeah to it. And like
I said, the thing I just remember the most about
it was that was the moment of Hulk Warrior and
do we have we got something here? And I was
disappointed that they didn't to be honest, that you give
it to Kurt, let him win it, I mean, you know,

(01:09:30):
and it was just kind of predictable at the end,
they're okay, Hulk wins, Okay, great, you know, whatever you
must pose.

Speaker 1 (01:09:38):
I guess that's the time.

Speaker 3 (01:09:40):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
I just felt like, come on, just can we just
one And especially because it was kind of a nothing overall,
it was nothing at stake, that we didn't have anything
big moments, and and you know, and people were you know,
Perfect was over, so you know, it was, uh, it
was good.

Speaker 3 (01:09:58):
As you can see. My dogs were very are you
happy about me talking?

Speaker 4 (01:10:01):
They're not upset, They're upset about mister Perfect not winning.
I Perfect could have won, and then Hogan could have
just come right back in the ring and threw up
mister Perfect.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
So Perfect won the match. But Hogan could have.

Speaker 4 (01:10:10):
Sent everybody home happy by showing off his pythons. But
in reality they.

Speaker 3 (01:10:16):
Pause for one. My son is It's like nah, I
told them to wait, but we're gonna have to do
a jump cut.

Speaker 1 (01:10:27):
That's fine, I can do a jump cut. I'm gonna
wrap up in here, anywhere.

Speaker 3 (01:10:32):
To die.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
We'll wrap up right now.

Speaker 4 (01:10:33):
Anyway, It's all right, all right, and three two one,
and then you guys have it the nineteen ninety Royal
Rumble right here on the Golden Era Podcast. Either if
someone love this event, either you hate this event, but
we gave you the historic facts around it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:46):
Again, I'm Steve fall he Shaw Moody.

Speaker 4 (01:10:48):
Have a wonderful day and we'll see you next time,
Bubba Old Time in thirty Ring the Bells, the Wrestling
History reach Out