WWE Wrestlemania 6: Ultimate Warrior Vs Hulk Hogan Drama - Sean Mooney Shares All

WrestleMania VI was historic — but what was REALLY happening behind the scenes? Former WWF broadcaster Sean Mooney pulls back the curtain on the chaos, drama, and unforgettable moments from Toronto’s SkyDome as Hulk Hogan and The Ultimate Warrior collided in one of the biggest main events in wrestling history.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Your time and thy.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Halco Maniacs to Little Warriors. It's the ultimate challenge. It's
Russelman six right here on the Golden Era Podcast with
Shan Mooney.

Speaker 1 (00:24):
How you doing today?

Speaker 3 (00:26):
I am doing great. Nice to see you, Steve, and
we're gonna be talking about a Wreussellmania today. That remains
one of my favorites for a number of reasons though,
as usual, because there's so many backstage stories, and we
really do have a lot of them. So thank you,
thank you for having me dig back into that deep

(00:49):
chest that I have in my memory. So it's gonna
be fun.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
Well, anytime anyone sees these episodes pop up, they always go, God.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Damn it it Mooney, he looks amazing.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
And so nineteen ninety, Mooney, you had a little bit
of a mullet if you if you go back and
watch the uh the interviews, yea, Dusty and Demolition, you.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
Got a little mullet there.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
What's what's going on?

Speaker 3 (01:09):
It was just a little mullet. Well, it was kind
of the thing to do back then. But I did
have it going on, you know, uh, partying back business
up front, and I was I was getting it done
on both ends.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
Back then, Well, you looked great.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
You looked great when I when you popped up when
I was watching it, and I'm like, wow, he looks amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:30):
I almost like a picture.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
I was like, no, we're gonna wait for this, We're
gonna talk about it, uh the next day. And it's
funny because wrestling is six. Everyone brings it up as
in whose camp were you in? Were you a Wholka maniac?
Were you a little warrior? Am I been questioned for you?
Before we really get into all this was Ultimate Warrior
ready for the pressure to be the face of the
w w F after wrestlming a six.

Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, I really wanted to get in into that today
because as we have discussed many times about the Warrior
and people have, you know, it just rages on this
debate of who was he? What was he all about?
And and and I found an old interview with him

(02:15):
that was done years later after he had left the WWF,
and I just found it fascinating. It's one of the
best I've ever seen of him, because I kind of
had a revelation about him after all of these years.
And and I think, really what it comes down to,
I don't think people could really handle back then somebody

(02:35):
that was just completely honest for whatever his way of thinking,
good or bad. But that guy just told it the
way it was in his in his mind and and
the life that he was living. And you know, of course,
everybody when they get a chance to sit these guys down,
they want to say, you know, what were you thinking

(02:55):
through the match? What was you know, was the pressure on?
Did you notice the out and everything? And he basically says,
you know, please, I'm so tired of these questions in
a sense that people think that you come back to
a memory and do this to anybody about a big
event in their life. And of course everybody says, you know,
oh yeah, it's all fresh. I remember, No, you don't.

(03:17):
And and I think back too of all the events
that I was involved in, and you know, when you're
doing it, you're just doing it. You're not taking it
in and maybe later you can kind of reflect on it.
But I think at the time, Jim Helwig was just
one of those people, and I think you're seeing more

(03:38):
of it today, you know, like this whole thing about
being genuine, he was genuine. There's you know, whatever good
or bad, wather you loved him. Or hated him or whatever.
Jim just said it, and I don't think people were
ready for that. So you say, was you know, was
he ready for this challenge? Was he? I think that
Jim always looked at it that, yeah, absolutely, you feel

(03:58):
the pressure. But I think he felt that every time
he ran out down that runway to the ring, and
so sure this was on a different stage. And he
talks about the match, and I figured we get into
this a little bit later since, but now we're talking
about it that he says, sure, I remember the moment.

(04:21):
I know it was this big thing, but to me,
it was just me doing my job. And he said
in particular, though, he goes, I do remember that it
was magic that day, that everything with Hulk worked, everything
that I did worked, and it was just you know,
a special time. But as far as people thinking that,

(04:43):
you know, he's going to dig deep into those wonderful
memories and say, oh, I just remember being on the
canvas and looking out over into the arena and people
me capturing and seeing their faces. You're not going to
get that from somebody like him. So was he ready? Yeah,
because he was in for the ride, and bottom line

(05:05):
to him, he was doing a job he had. He
wanted to be successful, he wanted to, you know, make money.
Was one of the biggest reasons he was doing what
he was doing. And he was along the same lines
certainly way different personalities, but like Sid, Sid looked at
it in the same way that it wasn't They weren't

(05:28):
passionate about the business. It wasn't their life. They didn't
live it. They didn't just love every bit of it.
As we know, there are many that did, but those
two weren't one of them, and Jim Helwig was certainly
not one of them. He saying he didn't like what
he was doing. I'm just saying he wasn't that guy.
He wasn't in it because of the you know, oh,

(05:50):
I just this is I love this. That wasn't him.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
That's I'm glad you said that because over the years
we have done podcasts so far probably like thirty something
of them where people are always critical of our comments
on Ultimate Warrior, But here it seems like we've changed
our tone a little bit with Warrior because there is
a lot of pressure on someone who's going to work
every day, and again, it's a job.

Speaker 3 (06:12):
You know.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
I like podcasting, I like interviewing wrestlers. But guess what,
when I'm up at three in the morning editing, sometimes
you're like, well, this is not fun, this isn't turning
into fun.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
But I'm also creating. I'm also having a good time.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
Ultimate Warrior is there for a paycheck, but he's also
there to create memories that will gain him more money,
will will gain him more notoriety and more celebrity status.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
So him here. Wrestmania is six.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
The pressure is on, especially because the whole tagline is
it's called the Ultimate Challenge, Ken Holt Coogan defeat Ultimate Warrior.

Speaker 1 (06:43):
That's what the people are buying.

Speaker 2 (06:45):
And people were buying it because Russmania six two good
guys funding each other and the main event. This is
unheard of, this is everyone thinks now it's such a
normal thing to happen.

Speaker 1 (06:55):
This is uncharted territories.

Speaker 2 (06:58):
What were the thoughts going in to this as someone
who worked in the company, where you're thinking, is this
a good idea? Like fans are going to be swaye.
They're not gonna be booing or cheering. They're going to
be cheering both men. It's gonna be hard to decipher
who do you want to win.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
Yeah, And I think it's interesting what you said at
the top of this of saying, you know, were you
a hulkamaniac or were you a warrior? Were you a
little warrior? And you know, in all of wrestling, you've
got to have, you know, some split, however it is
to create this friction in the ring, and this was

(07:34):
a classic example of it. Now you say, you know,
was I thinking like, oh man, two babyfaces, how are
you gonna get? But no I didn't because you I've
seen and talked to people where you didn't have people
that were fans of both. You know, you really did
have you did like one or the other. So that

(07:55):
wasn't tough to you know, figure out that you're gonna
have sides in this and that's pretty much what you
need to create that confrontation. So that wasn't a question
at all. But was it, as you said today, you
kind have used to seeing this stuff back then. No,
it was always those lines. It was, you know, a
good guy bad guy. And even though we started to

(08:15):
blur the line about what exactly was a bad guy
and how could he be over that, you know wasn't
the case here. And so to have this though in
this showdown, And I think that's what people wanted to
see that because they were people that were not big
fans of Hulk Hogan uh and were you know, Ultimate
Warrior all the way, and then you had your Hulk maniacs,

(08:36):
and they wanted to see it settled once and for all.
And so as far as me thinking was this a
good idea, yeah, I thought absolutely it was a great idea.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
I also agree with you because think of the past, and.

Speaker 3 (08:48):
They had things to settle here too, Steve, what was
going on with Hulk at the time, and the belt
and all this stuff and the titles and so it
was it was a I thought was a great storyline
and a way to settle it.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
One hundred percent because the year before that you had
the Megapowers explode. Before that, you had WrestleMania have an
entire tournament to crud a new champion before that, Andre
getting bodieslim before that, free locations for estumanting before that,
the first WrestleMania. Like we are building if we're talking
about seasons or like episodes wrestlemana episodes, we are going
up and up and up and up and up. Because
each year you're trying to achieve something better than you

(09:22):
did the year before, and the also been challenge.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
I feel like delivered one hundred percent.

Speaker 3 (09:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
April first, nineteen ninety, SkyDome, first WrestleMania outside of the US. Now,
I know wrestling is always going to be popular in Canada,
But did Vincent Man think, like, is this a gamble?

Speaker 1 (09:38):
Is this not a gamble?

Speaker 2 (09:39):
Like what do you think he was trying to put
through his brain leaving America for Canada?

Speaker 3 (09:45):
Well, I think that sure. Was it a gamble, absolutely,
especially when you're gonna go to another country and then
try and get a massive crowd there, which, uh, you know,
sixty five thousand plus U was a huge challenge, challenge.
But at the same time, you know, think about where
we were. You know, business wasn't bad, and this is

(10:06):
nineteen ninety we're talking, but they were starting to think okay,
and they were used to things. How you know, it
kind of went cyclical, it was up and down, and
they knew that, you know, we've got to start expanding.
Canada was a great place to do it, because, of
course Canada was huge for professional wrestling across all of

(10:27):
that country from one end to the other, and you
had a lot of territories. So yeah, was it a
bit of a gamble, yes, but it was a great
place to start as far as being international, and it
was it was a you know, it was a great event.
And they did pack that house. Whether or not, I
don't know how many they ended up giving away, but
still you get that many people. It shows that the

(10:51):
ww E at the time was was very very popular.
So was it a gamble, absolutely, but that's what they
reveled in. Vince knew that. But that's what he had
to do. He had to leap every time with these events,
and they just kept paying off.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
Oh yeah, and the arena is so packed that they
elevate the ring just like they did Restumina three. And
then they bring back those motorized wrestling carts to bring
you from the front to the back. And I always
love those, like I don't know why those are something
that they should have sold us toys for so long
and they just didn't like the has bros. Yeah uh,
but Warrior and Hogan they decide we're not going to

(11:28):
get on those carts. We're gonna walk war because Warrior
his bit is he runs really.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
Fast in a ring.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
What the hell is he gonna do you sit there
and do this while he was sitting on a motorized car.
Those are a nice little addition to this WrestleManias, and
it's it's a big, big entrance. But Grill mon Soon
and Jesse body Ventura are on commentary and this is
their sixth WrestleMania together, and we've talked about how Bobby
and Grilla have quite a rapport Jim Ross and Jerry Lawler.

(11:55):
But I don't think Jesse and Gorilla get all this
credit because I Jesse's background as a professional wrestler. I
know Gorilla was too, and so is Bobby, but people
really knew Jesse as a wrestler versus Bobby and Gorilla
as being wrestlers. Depending on your age, I guess what
did you think of the Jesse Gorilla combo.

Speaker 3 (12:14):
Well, you know, at that point, Jesse's history in the
ring had really nothing to do with him getting over
as a credible analyst at the time, and that was that,
you know, I don't even remember, you know, only ever
becoming part of the conversation. And truth be told, he
wasn't great in the ring. His gift was his mouth

(12:37):
and what and all the way along. I mean, he
cut great promos. He knew how to sell, so that
was his big selling point. And as we've discussed before, now,
nothing against Jesse. I always said that Jesse I thought
was great with Vince. I did. I didn't love the
combination of the two of them, but you know they

(12:58):
were they did well together. I mean it was very
you know, back and forth, but nothing like you'd see
with Bobby and Gorilla. That that the magic that was.
But we've gotten used to that team. As far as
for the big events was you know, Gorilla and Jesse
and uh, you know, uh, Jesse was on top of

(13:20):
his game as always. And I always love to hear
about people asking about Jesse's prep for events. Now, if
you watch the openings to these or they do the
little breaks on camera, he would actually you could tell
that he worked those, you know that he would. I
think he'd say, you know, I've been to all this,

(13:40):
I've been to this, I've done this, I've been to fights.
But you know, Wrestle Meania is the greatest event ever
or whatever however he started that and you could tell
that was something you know, that was the actor in him.
But as far as when he sat down to that,
to the to the announced booth there, to the to
the desk to do the event and that was it,

(14:01):
you know. I mean he didn't take notes. He was
you know, neither did Bobby, but that was all just
you know, go and and Gorilla could do that as well.
That's what made him a great play by play guy
is that he knew how to get that stuff going
with other people sitting next to him, which is a
gift a lot of people don't realize. You know, that's
not an easy thing to do, and especially when you're

(14:23):
bouncing in between different personalities. But Gorilla was very good
at that. But you know, Jesse was, you know, great
just at moments, you know, like he didn't have as
if people know about how a person who was a
color analyst prepares for a football game, you know, or
baseball game, they you know, reams of notes. And then

(14:45):
you've got somebody who was what they call like a
spotter or you know, and they they were in your
ear and they're giving you little fun facts here and there,
or they notice things like that, you get a great
guy that he's your your dude. That wasn't the case.
It was just okay, what's happening up there and I'm
really good at doing this, and that was Jesse.

Speaker 2 (15:03):
I love how you brought up Jesse the beginning of
the Somnia six because he does say that he's.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
Like, I've been to the super Bowl, I've been to
the World Series. I've never been to the Rolling Stones.
But nothing like this at Wrestlmania six. But even before that,
you had.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
Vince McMahon doing a voiceover over the of war a
Warrior and Hoke Cogan and are in the stars in
the galaxy far beyond Meetings and he's just going through
it and you see like a crab and you see
a zeus and then you see see warriors.

Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, the constellation of the Sky.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
I always enjoyed vinsic man voiceover, and this is one
of those, uh particular ones. He doesn't scream until the
end because he's like, yeah, he's he's pretty.

Speaker 3 (15:48):
It would just keep going, Oh.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
You gotta go when you lose your voice though.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
The first matchup of this event is Cocob Waere versus
Rick the Model Martell. So the first person everyone sees
at the game is Coco will Beware flapping his arms like.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
A bird, and Frankie was there too.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yes, of course, Well because Jack Tounny didn't enforce, you know,
get rid of animals by ringside. Yet that won't happen
until nineteen ninety one. God damn you, President, Jack Tounny.
I I always will praise you.

Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah no. And Coco sings on that and his theme song.
People know that. I mean Coco had a good voice.
He did a lot of gospel. He was, you know,
very talented guy. And I've told you about Coco. Coco
was one of my favorites just uh, you know, just
a great guy. And I love this. You know when
you tell the stories when he first they hooked him

(16:37):
up with Frankie. That bird was just nasty as it
could be. And you know they're talking about some of
the first events went out there and they got him
there and he's supposed to sit on this perch and
he does and he falls off and you go over
to him and he's like biting you. Ah man. But
h I love Coco and one of the toughest people
I ever met in my life. Uh. And I thought

(17:00):
a great a great performer too. And he was only
or it is only about like about five seven maybe,
so he that guy boy he could do a lot
in that ring. And you know, this matchup I thought
was pretty good too, even though he ends up kind
of getting squashed in this. But I love Coco. Coco

(17:21):
is still to this day one of my favorites.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
Same.

Speaker 2 (17:24):
I think it's funny that people think, oh, he has
got a bird. It's pretty cool. But you're not thinking like,
oh shit, this guy's not a bird trainer. He's a
professional wrestler.

Speaker 1 (17:32):
So here you go. He's a giant parrot. Enjoy yourself.

Speaker 3 (17:34):
Yeah, and it's not like he put the thing in
the truck. You know, you gotta take this thing and
take care of it.

Speaker 1 (17:38):
And do you bring that thing to the hotels with him?

Speaker 3 (17:41):
Well, yeah, a lot of times when he was traveling. Yeah,
sometimes they did have him with him and he'd have
to have that thing in the hotel room.

Speaker 1 (17:48):
And it is rock, you know, like all night long.
Imagine sleeping with Coca. Why don't she roun with me? No, No,
I don't.

Speaker 3 (17:55):
And I'm sure initially it was like yeah, sure, I
you know, he wants to be it's putting him over then,
But then after a while you're like, oh my god,
this bird so.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Well, Yeah, Frankie you had Matilda.

Speaker 3 (18:06):
She didn't have a python, right, Steve. I mean, geez,
imagine somebody having to do that.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
I would rather. I would rather have the bird than
have the snake in the bathroom, got a bag. That's
just me.

Speaker 2 (18:19):
I don't I think the snake can, you know, twist
around you and kill you, Frankie.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
The birds most likely going to be stealing your food
from you. Maybe he'll kill you.

Speaker 3 (18:25):
I wouldn't you be sleeping like this?

Speaker 2 (18:27):
You know, I would close them. I would put the
animals in the bathroom and close the door.

Speaker 3 (18:32):
He did. But you never know, you know, because.

Speaker 2 (18:34):
You hear all these stories about Jake, how there's not
you know, we didn't have just one Damien. We had
multiple Damiens over poor reasons of taking care of a snake.
I wonder, and I hope not, but it probably was
more than one, Frankie, because.

Speaker 3 (18:47):
Yeah, I was gonna say, I think there was on
the road. But you know those birds, you know, they're
very sensitive and uh, you know, they get they get sick.
So yeah, and when you're taking them all over the
place and then then putting them on planes and that
kind of thing, it's ain't good.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
God, Ay, poor Coco, but he did lose, he to
Rick and the Model mar Tell. Everyone kind of thought
that the Model was gonna fight Tito Santana because the
Strike Force broke up right back but a year now,
so everyone's thinking, Okay, we're gonna get Strike Force finally
having a one on one match.

Speaker 1 (19:22):
They don't.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Tito's in a different match in the evening, maybe a
house show. But what's the reasoning you think of not
connecting the dots of this seems pretty obvious to have
Rick beat Tito or Tito beat Rick. Is it just
to keep both of them strong?

Speaker 3 (19:37):
Yeah, somebody would have had to go down, and uh yeah,
And I think they're trying to push both of them,
you know, because the Model a gimmick, wasn't that old,
and you know they're trying to put him over, and
then Tito was starting to get you know, a bit
of a push as well. And as always, I love
when they give these other guys a little shot to

(20:00):
you know, be in that event, and Coco getting on
that stage was awesome as well. A nice little payday
for him too.

Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, these early WrestleManias, you can see every single wrestler
you ever loved is all together on the card, and
I think that's what makes it great about this event.
But up next to the tag team titles, your backstage though,
you're interviewing Demolition, and this is one of those fun
moments where Demolition keeps talking in puns about they're gonna
smash them, but they're gonna ax them, they gonna destroy them.

(20:29):
You know, what was your experience like with Demolition backstage?
What are they like as people?

Speaker 3 (20:34):
Oh? Awesome. You know, it's funny because a lot of
these heel tag teams, you know, they're supposed to be big, mean, nasty,
horrible people, and they were some of the funniest guys
you ever meet. You know that Led was like that too.
You know, Hawk and Animal were just as funny. But
you know, Barry and Bill were great as well, and

(20:56):
they just kept getting better and better, you know, as
a tag team, and you start getting that rhythm. And
I watched that interview and I try and think back,
and it's it's very sketchy to think, you know, try
and pull out those details, but I do remember just

(21:17):
how smooth it was with them. They would tell me,
you know, what kind of what they were going to do,
and I just had to make sure I got the
mic in the right place. But I just remember how
easy they made it. And I thought, you know, Bill
initially had the edge as far as cutting promos, but
I thought, you know, Barry became really good as well.

(21:37):
And and this that interview that they did for that
event was I thought was really good. Like you said,
it was loaded with puns, but you know, it all
worked it, you know. And I even remember afterwards that
Bill saying, well, you know it was there. Did we
have enough in there? Enough puns? And there they walk
it up. I said, I think you got them all.

Speaker 2 (21:56):
Yeah, I think we checked them all off, because you
would say it just sounds like a devil legend Derby
and you're like, now you got them and then they're like
looking at you, like now you get it?

Speaker 1 (22:04):
Like yeah after a minute of.

Speaker 3 (22:05):
Pun yeah, okay, yeah, check got that one too. Uh yeah.
And there was some really funny There was a lot
of funny stuff in those interviews. Uh the one with
with with Jean and Bobby and what did he call them?
The colostomy and it was supposed to be the I
can't yeah, the colossal connection and and Bobby's like, what

(22:32):
what did you say anything, what are you talking about?
And in the end before they go into that, and
they said the interview and then Jean's like, that's the pensive.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
Yes, did I see there?

Speaker 3 (22:45):
You know? And and folks there were there was just
there was a lot of inside stuff. Uh. And Jeane
was was classic and and got away with so much.
But uh, you know, Vince knew what he did and
they let him do it. Uh. And I'm telling you,
I just I love going back and watching these because
to me, that's especially just from where I came from

(23:06):
with them, to watch those and it's just to me,
it's like watching a great match for me when I
see some of the stuff that Jean did with people,
and his timing and what he would say and what
he didn't say was worth a thousand words a lot
of time. And especially you know in on the stage
there with with Bobby as well. I mean, they were

(23:28):
just classic together. So I love going back and watching
this stuff and we and there there was so much
We'll get into it, but there was a lot of
celebrity presence at these At this event, which is kind
of unusual. I was thinking, like, why Toronto. It wasn't
like we're in Los Angeles or Vegas or something. Is
it Toronto and all these partsmania? Yeah, yeah, I guess

(23:51):
I've got some good stories of though we'll get to it.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
There was one celebrity though. They mentioned Jesse on commentary.
You know, jump around for a second, but when Warriors
fighting Hogan and Warrior is getting beat down by Hogan,
girls like, you know, can Hogan sustained this? And Jesse says,
we'll ask Richard Bowser if he can sustain this. And
I was like, holy shit, Like, isn't that the guy
that Hogan choked out before WrestleMania won and then he

(24:17):
the sued him for the twenty million dollar Yeah, Belzer
for twenty million dollars. I was like, why would you
throw that out there on commentary?

Speaker 1 (24:24):
Like damn?

Speaker 2 (24:25):
When I when I heard him say that, I was, oh,
I don't think anyone's ever picked this up before until
like right now.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
It just shocked me to hear that they threw out
a guy.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
Who sued the WWF and Hulk Cogan for millions of dollars. Yeah,
there's Jesse been like, let's just throw in a one
liner and see if anyone notices.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Well, and that's getting back to Jesse, as I said
he was, he was Jesse, and and you know that
Vince's backstage's going, oh, I can't believe he said that.
But Jesse said whatever was on his mind, whatever he
thought might work or or might create a little you know,

(25:04):
tension out there, he would do it. And that was yeah.
I mean I do remember thinking like, oh, you tee,
why would you even say that because such a yeah,
oh and it's such a you know, touchy subject anyway,
But that was Jesse, you know, love to love to
stir it up.

Speaker 1 (25:22):
That's true.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
Unlisten though, do win the Tacitoon titles back from Andre
and Hakku. Andre really can't do much, so Hockky's in
the ring, and this sets up the scenario of Bobby
blaming Andre the Giant for the match. Andre slaps Bobby Heenan,
setting up the Andre is now a babyface, and this
is the end of Andre the Giant's entering career because

(25:43):
he tries to continue on but it's just not the
same anymore, and he's out. In a year from now.
He was on crutches and then in ninety three passes away.
So in reality, did everyone know this was the end
of Andre and this was the great moment of let's
turn on babyface one more time and get him that
audience to cheer him. Sixty five thousand people cheering for him, Like,
is that what this moment was all about?

Speaker 3 (26:04):
Well, I don't think they were actually thinking it was
the end, but I think that they felt it was.
You know, uh, you know, we have this big stage
and we should celebrate him and get him involved. You know,
it wasn't something Andrey wanted to go out there and
just stand at ringside, but you could see for what

(26:25):
he did do in that match, it was it was
hard for him. You know that he was just not
he was really heavy at the time and everything I
think hurt, especially his back was you could just tell
by the way he moved. But they did want to
get him involved, and you could see that meng or
Hakku uh you know, had to take on the vast

(26:49):
majority of the load for that that matchup, but you know,
they still got Andre involved. They'd get him close to
the ropes and he'd get a shot in there. And
then of course all at the end of it and
when it blows up with Bobby and Haku uh as
you know, he knocks Bobby around. He's had enough. And

(27:09):
you know, you watching those and people used to talk about,
you know, when Andre really had to watch how when
he would you know, smack people, because really you don't
understand the you know, the massive strength that he had
until he would do something as simple as slap you.

(27:29):
And you could see he didn't want to hurt Bobby.
And there's a few of them where he made sure
he didn't really even get close, but there were a
couple that connected and you could just see that, like
you know, and Bobby of course sold it tremendously, but
you know, they they had a lot of they had
a great affection for each other. Uh you know, Andre

(27:52):
really liked Bobby and uh it, I think everybody was
feeling the same way. There was a there was a
sadness about it all. We didn't know if it was
going to be next month, if it was going to
be six months or a year, but as you said,
it was there was the feeling that the end was coming,
and not necessarily his life, but that he couldn't do

(28:15):
this anymore. And we've talked before too, as you mentioned
that he was on those metal crutches that and basically
you know, it just was it was almost like he
was crawling around and that was really hard to watch too,
because Andre didn't have anything else as far as what

(28:36):
his life was really focused on. I'm not saying he
didn't have another life. You know, he had that horse ranch.
He used to love to go there, but this was
his life and when it was over, and you know,
Vince had a it was was very much torn in
this in the fact that he didn't know, you know,

(28:58):
how to do it. Uh. I think that you know,
you've heard about there was kind of this rift between
Andrea and Vince at the end there. But Vince didn't
want to see him basically humiliated or him and you
know people seeing him fail. But Andre didn't want to
go away either. He that's what he loved being backstage.

(29:18):
He loved playing cards with the guys, he loved being
around that whole atmosphere. But he just physically couldn't do
it anymore. And so I think it was very hard
for Vince because he knew he owed a lot to Andrea,
especially in the early years and and Andre helping put
over that whole organization. But at the same time, you

(29:41):
sit there and let that happen, you know, and I
don't think Vince wanted to see that happen, and and
you know, what could he say? And so I think
that he endured that that Andre, you know, being upset
with him and feeling he'd been betrayed, but knew, I
just can't let this happen to him, even if he

(30:03):
doesn't realize it.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
Well, Andre the Giant is the first person ever inducted
into the WWEF Hall of Fame, So even if there
was a rift at the end, unfortunately, Andre didn't know
that he was going to be the first name inducted
into this Hall of fame that now has carried the
weight of so many different names, and over the years
people either love the Hall of Fame or hate the
Hall of Fame. But when it was initially created, it

(30:25):
put in the right person first, and that was Andre
the Giant. And he did leave for WCW towards the
end of his life, and that created it even a
bigger rift, and that was the end, you know, he
passes away, and we talked about it on our Demolition
podcast though about how Demolition being given the nod to
work with Andre, because think about the people who did

(30:45):
before Macho Man, Ultimate Warrior, Jake, the Sneak Hulk Cogan.
You don't really hear many other people getting to work
with Andre, especially around this time, and Demolition got the
opportunity to do it. So I think it's pretty awesome
to see that Demolition was so a popular tag team.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
They're like, all right, well, Andre can work with him.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
And I know Andre was friends with them as well,
so it was it was just a nice cap off
at the end of having Andre in.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
The the little ring.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
He's waving to the audience, the audience's crazy form, sixty
five thousand people cheering form. It was a great sendoff
for Wrestmania six for him. Unfortunately, what happened at the
end is you know, life happens. But Hercules versus Earthquake
is up next. Both men are sort of undefeated around
this time, and Earthquake has a record of beating thirty
men in a row, and now he just defeats Hercules.

Speaker 1 (31:34):
Here.

Speaker 2 (31:34):
Now, Hercules, I have a question for you about Hercules,
because he always confused me because sometimes he pretends he's Hercules.
He's you know, lives living on Mount Olympus. Other times
he pretends he's Hercules Hernandez his heritage. I'm so confused
sometimes on who is Hercules? Is he the Zeus is dead?

(31:56):
Is he just a wrestler earl's named Hercules with the chains?

Speaker 1 (32:00):
What were you? What were your thoughts in Hercules?

Speaker 3 (32:02):
Well? I think and to me he was always Hercules,
the god the Yeah, and of course they went back
to when it came down to it, when it came
got down to, you know, being down and dirty, Uh,
he became Hercules Hernandez bunny. And when it came out
to that ring though, with the chains and everything like that,

(32:23):
and and overall, yeah, he was supposed to be the
Greek god and uh, you know, argue one way or
the other if he filled that role, but it was
a good gimmick for him, and uh, you know he
was he was quite the strong man in real life.
There was no question about that. So, uh, you know,

(32:46):
the gimmick fit him. But I think when it came
down to it, he was most comfortable as Hercules Hernandez
and just mixing it up in the ring.

Speaker 2 (32:55):
All right, because sometimes he'd be like, I live on
mont Olympuss you.

Speaker 3 (32:59):
I'm get back to your gimmick, Ray come out.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
I don't know, are you in power and glory?

Speaker 3 (33:03):
Now?

Speaker 1 (33:04):
So when you're in power glory, are you still zeus?

Speaker 2 (33:07):
I never understood sometimes where it was dropped and brought
up again, But that's just me nitpicking, I guess. But
Earthquake defeats Hercules here, which again in the next pay
per view at SummerSlam nineteen ninety would be Earthquake against
Hulk Cogan, and so it's really nice to see that.

Speaker 3 (33:21):
Ear. Yeah, they're putting him over, no question about it.
And you know, Hercules is a great guy to put
in the ring against him for, you know, to make
it happen. And this is that whole thing that he's
an unstoppable force that you know, when Earthquake's in there
and he squashes you, it's over.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
It is over.

Speaker 2 (33:40):
And I'm surprised because he used to be the Canadian earthquake,
so this audience would have been like, yeah, we're in
Canada earthquake. There is some questionable things about patriotism in
this because let's some most celebrities for a minute.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
So we don't have America the Beautiful.

Speaker 2 (33:53):
We have Robert Goulay starting off Restmania six singing.

Speaker 1 (33:56):
Oh so we get that.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
Well, we also have Steve Allen, we have Mary Tyler
Moore here, we have Rona Barrett. So we have all
these celebrities, and let's go through them for a little bit,
because some people who are listening to this may be like, who, So,
Mary Tellimore, you were in the audience asking fans about
Rhythmon Blues about to sing their new song Honka Honk

(34:22):
hunkle Love three Honkers.

Speaker 1 (34:23):
You've been pointed us out to us a couple of times.
And you interview this one kid and you're like, so, kid,
how you doing anything? I don't like it? Like, do
you know those nameless songs?

Speaker 3 (34:32):
Now?

Speaker 1 (34:32):
They stink? All right?

Speaker 2 (34:33):
You move on to another person behind Mary telling Moore,
and you interview her, and I'm gonna tell you she
was sitting in front row, but she also looked like
a deer in headlights.

Speaker 1 (34:45):
Now for you.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
You're supposed to be interviewing her about WrestleMania, about Rhythmond Blues,
about all this stuff. But are some celebrities just clueless
and they're just he here for a paycheck?

Speaker 3 (34:57):
Yeah? I uh, well, it's funny you mentioned that because
Mary Tyler Moore, you know, I grew up watching her shows.
I mean I with the you know, Dick Van Dyke
that show, and then also the Mary Tyler Moore show,
the one that she had where uh and and so

(35:17):
you know, I was thrilled to even meet her, but
there was no chance to get together before and say, Okay,
this is what I want to do, this is what
we're gonna do. Like her people, it just wasn't gonna happen.
And I think she was there with her husband at
the time. I don't know if they stayed married, I
don't know, but he was with her, and it was

(35:39):
just kind of like, okay, you know, we had the
spotters in there and the camera they so you're gonna
go over there and I'm working, you know, like you said,
I talked to a kid, So that was kind of
planted to go. You know, I'm gonna start here and
they're gonna go there. IM gonna get to marry Oh
it's Mary Tyler Moore. Hey. And seriously, I wondered, have
you ever seen anything that we've done? You know, and
why why did you? I don't know. Maybe maybe her

(36:03):
husband was a big wrestling fan. I don't know, but
as he said everything I said, so you know, what
do you think about it. Yeah, they are great, cause
it was you know, I don't know if any of
her answers were more than five seconds long, and I'm
still trying to push it. And then I just remember,
you know, Kerwin in my ear like okay, wrap it,

(36:25):
get out of there, like she's not gonna work with
us here. I did everything I can, but it was
still it was It was cool to interview Mary Tyler
Moore because you know, I just remember watching her as
a kid. So but that was certainly an interesting encounter.

(36:45):
But that goes to show you when they just have
I wish that I would have gotten a chance to
just doing a side with her and say, look, Mary,
I'm going to ask you about this, and she said,
I don't know who he is, and I'll say, well,
I would have given her some points, you know, or
something to say to help. But it is she just
looked like and even like you said, deer in headlights,

(37:06):
because the eyes were even kind of like, oh, well.

Speaker 1 (37:08):
It's great to be here, is it?

Speaker 2 (37:11):
Though?

Speaker 3 (37:12):
Yeah, I don't know. But I wanted to let's talk
about Robert Gulay because Robert Gulays an interesting story too. Now,
him singing the Canadian national anthem is not a big
stretch because he wasn't a Canadian, but was you know,
had lived in Canada for a long time and had
I think his parents were French Canadian, so he had

(37:34):
that connection anyway. But what's interesting here now, I don't
know if people remember, but in nineteen sixty five Robert
Gulay sang the national anthem for the Muhammad Ali Sonny
Listen fight, and he booted the lyrics and you know,
like I said, he was more Canadian than he was American,

(37:55):
and he didn't get the lyrics down. He claimed that,
you know, he he was tired, he didn't have a
chance to learn the lyrics and like how does a ha?
And he voted him. So I think it was like
this stigma with him to ever sing. I don't think
he sung anthems at places ever since then. And so

(38:17):
when they contacted his people and he didn't want to
do whatever, and they and I think what it came
down to it is because he didn't want to have
another experience like that. Well what they told him was, look,
we've got these screens up all over the arena and
we're going to put the words up. Basically, have a
teleprompter up there and I would have you know, I

(38:39):
think he probably knew the Canadian national anthem, but if
anything glitched, they were going to be right there. The
words are going to be right there. So he agrees
to do it and freaking nails it. And I remember
seeing him backstage. He was freaking ecstatic because I think
it was one of those things with him, you know,

(38:59):
that had you know, if you've ever had something that
you totally screwed up and then you get another shot
at it and then you fix it, and then you go, Okay,
now I can finally put this frickin thing out of
my brain. And I think that's what it was for him.
And then to have that, you know, be in front
of that audience, and I'm telling you, man, that guy

(39:19):
was just beaming. He was so happy. And that's what
I remember thinking that, you know, because we'd all had
a dog like that, you know, and I finally get
to let that one go. So that was my Robert
Gulay memory. Steve Allen. Now was another great moment, if

(39:41):
you if everyone remembered that Steve Allen is in the
locker room in the shower for the acoustic they got
a whole grand piano in there, and they got Nikolai
and Boris in the shower and he's going to sing
the Russian national anthem. And of course Steve Allen, if

(40:04):
anybody remembers who he was, he was a very famous
talk show host and comedian and was kind of the
first Johnny Carson, and I don't know, you know, you
think about some of these people together are just so random,
like Allen, where has he been? But he does this
bit with him and I'll tell you right now, nick
Lai and Boris had they didn't have a freaking who.

(40:26):
They don't know who Steve Allen is, and they're just
rolling with it. And I just thought that was the
funniest thing. I remember looking at it again and I
still think it's hilarious because he, you know, he's totally
goofing on them and they don't know what's going on.
And I also remember my other member of Steve Allen

(40:47):
is that the makeup styleist person that the w W
he had, Jill, and I can't remember her last name,
but she was she worked at Hamilton and they brought
her too, you know, the for the event to do
hair and makeup for people and I remember her telling
me that Steve Allen's people had sent her basically this

(41:11):
binder that was pages long on how to put his
two pey on. Just now, that's a fun fact that
I don't know, but I just remember telling me and
looking at this thing of you know, you put the
glue here, and then it's said, and I'm thinking, if
I got a hair piece, man, I'm the one putting

(41:32):
that thing on. Yes, but but they had a whole
thing of how his makeup and how his hair piece
went on for this That still, to me though, was
one of the greatest WrestleMania moments. Is Steve Allen in
the shower with nicola Ion.

Speaker 2 (41:47):
Boris was about to sing too, and finally he's joking
with him the whole time that I know where someone
flushes the toilet right, and then.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
The screaming about someone poop.

Speaker 3 (41:59):
And you know, Vince loved that, he'd love that the
toilet humor. And it did. It worked, it was and
I and I think they did that like in one take.
You know, Steve Allen was very good and of course
Boris and nicol I didn't have to do a whole
hell of a lot except you know, react but uh yeah,
classic classic wrestle Moonia wrestle media moments. And I think

(42:21):
Steve Allen he's in the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
I think, oh, I don't know, maybe possibly, you know,
there's a.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
Few he should be.

Speaker 1 (42:27):
If he's not, there's a few people. Let's get that
going now, you know.

Speaker 3 (42:31):
But it was an interesting that the whole collection of
celebrities you think about it over the years, Uh you know,
just how random. I mean we had Liberachi and uh,
Bob Buker and yeah, but.

Speaker 1 (42:45):
Hey, Mary Hart I think was there. You had Iral.

Speaker 3 (42:48):
Ones, Oh yeah, and Rona Barrett was at this. We
were talking before and you had no idea who Rona
Barrett was. Well, because I'm old, I remember that she
was one of the original uh you know, the gossip
columnists who actually made the transition to television. And she
would she was kind of before Entertainment Tonight and she
would go on and you know, this celebrity gossip. So

(43:11):
that's why she ended up. She was there to interview.

Speaker 2 (43:13):
Elizabeth Okay, okay, yeah, she puts over Liz Hard where
She's like, I've interviewed celebrities and musicians, but you you know,
you are the you're the greatest one interviewed.

Speaker 3 (43:22):
Yeah, Marilyn Monroe, No, do not close.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
Miss Elizabeth, Miss Elizabeth. Yeah, it's pretty funny.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
They did bring Steve Allen on commentary during one match
and he flaught to acknowledge that this is the greatest thing
he's ever seen in his life, and yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:35):
He's probably I don't know what's going on. I'm up
here in the rafters, Jesse.

Speaker 3 (43:38):
He should have been sitting next to Mary Tyler Moore.
They could have both been clueless.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
To the this is a great show I'm having That.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
He did and he appreciated entertainment, So I'm sure that
that was genuine from Steve Allen, and he was classic.
I mean that was that was phenomenal to have somebody
like that who was really an icon in television. He's
you know, was one of the originals and started and
helped shape that whole concept of talk of night talk shows.

Speaker 2 (44:07):
Wow again, people don't give you know in today's world
where you have certain talk shows ending or being not
the once they used to because before you'd have a
celebrity get interviewed by Steve Allen, for instance, Well, the
only way to know what that celebrity was doing was
to watch these interviews or read a magazine article. Now
I can go on social media and figure out what

(44:29):
John Cena ate for breakfast today instead of watching him
on a late night talk show. Because I don't need
to wait until eleven thirty to watch him. I can
figure out what's happening in his life instantly with social media,
with online So it's changed. But yeah, that's a weird
crop of celebrities because you said, over the years, you've
had people who are very topical.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
They've had people who are very bring.

Speaker 2 (44:48):
The youth movement in this group of people, I'm not
sure what celebrities. The combo of it was like, take
a dart, throw the wall. Yeah, some celebrities and see
what we can bring in.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Nothing wrong with them, but.

Speaker 2 (44:59):
It was a little strange. Moving on, though, Mister Perfect
to govern mus Bubber Beefcake. We did Mister Perfect podcast.
We talked about his career, and I flat out suggested
that Beefcake defeated Perfect Tear because of hult Cokeland's political influence.
Maybe I have no facts, These are just opinions and
conspiracy theories with my tinfoil hat on. But yet it

(45:20):
is a good match. But what happens at the end
is a genius gets knocked out. He gets put in
the sleeper hold. Who the genius is, mister a perfect manager. Well,
he's supposed to be knocked out, so he can't just
get up and walk away when things are going the
way he doesn't want them to. Beefcakes gots shaving off
the Genius's hair. Well, if you don't know, the genius,
Lenny Pofo is the brother of the macho man Rainey Savage.

Speaker 1 (45:41):
According to the rumors.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
After this happens, Macha Mango is backstage to confront Bruce
Beefcake about pretty much doing whatever he wanted to do
to his brother in front of sixty five thousand people
because his brother was selling that he got put out
with a sleeperhole.

Speaker 1 (45:55):
Did you hear anything about this?

Speaker 3 (45:58):
Well, you know, it was just everything about that match
to me was kind of strange and forced in a sense.
And uh, it wasn't It wasn't a bad match. You know, Brutus,
Brutus could go. He of course had that connection to
the Holkster and that never that idea And basically you

(46:19):
say nepotism in a sense that gave him a lot
of opportunities. But you know, uh, you know, Brutus was
was h was good in his own right. It's just
that that stigma stayed with him. But overall, I mean
it was it was a good match. But as we
mentioned before, you know, what was the Genius doing with

(46:40):
mister Perfect? I still like what it just doesn't make
any sense. Kurt didn't need anybody with him at all,
and so was it a sense just to keep Lanny working?
And uh, you know part of the mix there maybe,
but you could see at the end of that thing,
and I'm sure Kurt made it very clear up front,

(47:02):
I'll do this, but that that guy is not cutting
my hair. It's just not happening. So as you see
what takes place is, you know, Kurt gets knocked out,
basically hits the ring post and gets knocked out. Brutus
gets the cover and then he's gonna cut mister Perfect's hair.

(47:25):
In the meantime, like the Genius goes over and steals
the shears and it gives mister Perfect the opportunity to
get the scoot out of the ring. And when he
chases down Lanny, Uh, oh, what's gonna happen now. I
thought it was funny. Though, when he gets him back
in the ring, he's gonna start cutting his hair. He's
already got a really bad haircut. Anyway, if you did
you look at that at.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
The Royal Rumboldt Beef Carty did this to Genius a
little bit so.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
But to me it was just shenanigans. That's I used
to say, what what shenanigans are we going to do here?
And that's what that was at the end of it.
And I don't know, I don't want to say it
soiled the match, but it just was shenanigans as far
as I was concerned. Remember that word, their sonigans. That's

(48:19):
what they're doing in there. At the end of it.
You got a good match and then you do your shenanigans.
I don't like it one bit.

Speaker 2 (48:26):
I didn't think you'd get impressions and accents today on
Russelling is six.

Speaker 1 (48:30):
But here we are in Canada. Where's your Canadian?

Speaker 3 (48:32):
Never know what you're gonna get from Mooney.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
That's true, that's true. Uh, it's just funny though.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
Over the years you've heard Savage always pretecting his brother,
even in WCW where Lenny Poffo never had one match,
but over lawsuits, contracts came out and it was revealed
that Lenny Papa was getting over one hundred thousand dollars
a year in WW for two years he didn't wrestle
one match. Eric Bischoff, though, has clarified that macho man

(48:59):
when he savage is such a good brother, he took
the money out of his own contract and gave it
to Lenny. Now, I don't even know how it is
on a lawyer speak, I'm not sure that's even possible,
but somehow, Eric Bershov says so in reality, I don't know,
but if beet Cake took advantage of the genius and
in backstage match him in is in Beefcake's face about this,

(49:19):
It's like, well, buddy, your guy's a crony, Like you're
talking about a totem pole.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
He's in the bottom. Like getting his head shaved is
one thing.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
He's someone else can get their head shaved too, Like
calm yourself.

Speaker 1 (49:29):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (49:30):
Yeah. And you know, look, come on, let's let's give
credit here or just understanding that Lenny was Randy's brother
and they came up together through the family and his
you know, their father had a little territory and they

(49:50):
were close. Uh so, yeah, I appreciated the fact that
he wanted to take care of his brother. And I
felt like a lot of and says, you know, these
guys work their ass off and they do deliver and
bring a lot of money into the company, and if
you can help take care of somebody else that's with
you along for that ride, why not. And it wasn't

(50:13):
as though, you know, Lanny wasn't you know, worthless or
something like that. I mean, he could do a lot
of things in the ring, and so yeah, I didn't
really have a problem with it. And if they go
down WCW and where everybody was getting that cash grab, sure,
then good good for Lanny. I'm glad that that happened.

Speaker 1 (50:33):
That's a good point too.

Speaker 2 (50:35):
Before this matchup, though, you did get to interview Bruce
A Barbara Beefcake backstage and you're holding the you're holding
a piece of paper and Beefcake's like it has these
giant hedge clippers and he's he's sitting there talking about
mister perfect, how he has this perfect record. I've been
looking at his record, Mooney, and he's got a perfect record.
But tonight and he says, cutting it your hand is

(50:57):
I know right there? I just yeah, you seem like sir, sorry, sir,
I like my fingers.

Speaker 3 (51:05):
I could have those things were you know, he had
those things sharp real he wanted to be able to
cut the paper. That would have think if you click,
gotta look at him.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
Like, dude, dude, my mullet don't cut.

Speaker 3 (51:18):
And I don't think. And I don't remember telling me
I'm going to do that. I don't Maybe maybe I'm
sure maybe he did it because uh, you know, I
I if you see, I've got like the paper, I'm
holding it as about as far into the thing of
like before it falls out of my hand. But yeah, yeah,
that was uh uh you know, an uncomfortable moment. I

(51:42):
guess you could say, yeah, I didn't want to lose.
I wanted to keep my digits.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
He still got him, so good for you.

Speaker 2 (51:48):
Next up, we talked about a whole hour about this event,
and this topic has ruined my YouTube channel for a
little bit, and so we'll just say Ronnie.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Piper's back, let's not talk about it.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
Missing from the broadcast on the ww vault YouTube channelist
is where I watched this The other day because you
know Peacock, it's everywhere. But the controversy around this is
the you know, the black face paint.

Speaker 1 (52:11):
And the funny rib though, is how after this.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
Where Piper is going backstage, you get the solution to
get the paint off because he didn't want it to
come off while he was sweating in the ring. Well,
Andre and Arnold Scroland remove the solution, put water in there.

Speaker 1 (52:26):
So it does not work.

Speaker 2 (52:27):
So Piper has to go around with this makeup on
his body for at least a few weeks. And we
did a whole podcast about it and almost got canceled
for it.

Speaker 1 (52:36):
So we're going to.

Speaker 3 (52:37):
Move on, Move on, move on.

Speaker 1 (52:40):
If you want to hear about that, it's up there
and enjoyed that.

Speaker 3 (52:43):
It needs to get paid.

Speaker 2 (52:44):
Yeah, I gotta get paid YouTube. Someone come fun fact
behind the curtain, folks. Someone complained about this and that's
why we got demonetize on YouTube for a little bit.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
So moving on, moving.

Speaker 3 (52:56):
On to ste But it just shows you how even
to this day, it's a very sensitive subject.

Speaker 2 (53:01):
Yes, yeah, agreed, I you know I next when I
was looking for controversy, I found it and it found me.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
So that's what that was my fault. That's my fault.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
Heart Foundation toake on the Bolsheviks and their Steve Allen
segment lasted longer than their actual match.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
I think you're right eighteen seconds.

Speaker 3 (53:22):
This match last well, it did last longer.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
Yeah, Chading heroes. Brett Hart is here, and it's just.

Speaker 2 (53:29):
Funny because years ago one where Brett wore come out
with the Canadian flag and be so pro Canadian. Here
it's like they just it's not really a thing. They're
not really leaning into. Hey he's from Canada, yet why
not promote that he's from Canada, like really like your
hometown heroes.

Speaker 3 (53:46):
Yeah, yeah, that's a very interesting point. You would have
thought they would have sold that thing, you would have
come out there, but yeah, it was like sole focus
on Heart Foundation and what they're doing now. Well it's
interesting though, because you know, you talk about the territories
there and just a lot of people there like separate
countries from where where you're from, and some of them,

(54:09):
you know, are heavily like Montreal like that French Canadian
and you know other places are different. So I don't
know what they're thinking was, but yeah, that was kind
of surprising to me too. But it was like we saw,
this was like a very quick whole segment for the show.

(54:30):
You know, the boom, it's over.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
So and her Foundation haven't had the tag team title
since October of nineteen eighty seven, and they will regain
it at SummerSlam nineteen ninety defeating the Heel Demolition with
Crush along their side and the introduction of Legion of Doom.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
So I think this is really just like, all right,
let's get them out there. It's WrestleMania. We got to
put everybody on this card.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
So you're here beat them in eighteen seconds because I'm
nothing against Nikolai in the Bolsheviks, But did you want to.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
See them to go longer than eighteen seconds?

Speaker 3 (55:02):
Yeah? I was fine.

Speaker 1 (55:04):
I was yeah, I was fine with just moving past that, Tina.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
They're much more entertaining in the shower.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
Yes, yes, yes, I agree.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
No, we talked about earlier how Rick de martl Martell
did not fight Tito Santana at this event strike for
us because we thought each man should level up and
have a win. Well, the model wins is match. The
next tip is Tito Santana versus the Barbarian. Barbarian beats
Tito Santana with a top rope clothesline, which I think
is always perfect because that's really something you didn't see

(55:36):
in the early nineties or even in the eighties. Why
this random up and down with Tito, Because I always
thought Tito was so popular, but yet maybe he was
so popular it didn't matter for you if he won
or lost.

Speaker 3 (55:49):
Yeah, and I love Tito, you know that. But he
was just one of those guys that you could never
get past mid card, you know, he just it's try
and they did. They did big pushes, they tried with
you know, the Matador and everything like that. But people

(56:10):
loved them. They did, you know. I mean, I don't
think you could find anybody in an arena and say,
you know, what do you think of Tito Santana's say
I hate that gar I think he's not you know,
everybody loved them. It's just that they they only loved
him so much, you know, like it wasn't where they
wanted to see him, uh, you know, at the top
for some reason. You know, as as we've talked about

(56:31):
many other superstars that just don't they just don't have
that it thing. And uh so what you do is,
you know, you love them because they're such great workers,
they're so devoted to what they do. They're very entertaining,
they're popular, and so they can help us put other
guys over you and uh yeah, and and barb was another,

(56:57):
you know, uh a guy the time like he you know,
he like you said, coming off top rope doing a
he could do a lot of things in there and
just you know, one of those nasty performers. But he
always had he had to have somebody else with him. Man.
That's why Bobby was, you know, his manager and everything
like that. And so there's only so much you can

(57:20):
do with the guy like that. But you know, this
day they he was the one that went over Yeah.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
And then you know, earlier in this year of nineteen ninety,
Missa Fuji was the manager of the Warlord and the
Barbarian the Powers of Pain. While he sells those contracts individuals.
The Warlord goes with Slick, Barbarian goes with Bobby Heenan. No,
I didn't really ever see a problem with Powers of Pain,
Like why was it Legion and doom is coming in,

(57:48):
so we should break up the team that sort of
looks the most like them.

Speaker 3 (57:52):
Yeah, I don't know. I mean because remember at the time,
there was plenty of room for tag teams and whether
or not they you know, gain big pay or not,
but they were they were, you know, functional tools in
the and the whole tag team operation that was going
on at the time. I just think that they felt
it wasn't really it wasn't getting over, uh, you know,

(58:13):
so let's let's split him up and see if they
can do something in singles competition. And one of the
things with you know, like having Barbarian with with mister Fuji,
you know, uh wasn't a great combination. And mister Fuji
could do what he did, but he still wasn't as

(58:36):
far as an orator, uh as you know with interviews,
he just could only do so much. And Bobby was
beyond that. You know. Bobby could uh go on and
on and put people over and and so that was
a as far as giving him the best tools he
could possibly have to succeed, putting him with Bobby was

(58:56):
was the best option.

Speaker 2 (58:57):
Yeah, I'm next though, your backstage with Dusty Rhodes and
Sweet Sapphire and interviewing.

Speaker 1 (59:03):
Them about about the next coming matchup.

Speaker 2 (59:07):
Now, what was it like we did a whole podcast
about Dusty Roads coming into the WWF, but backstage with
Dusty Rhodes, what's his prep time?

Speaker 1 (59:15):
What's is he coming in blind?

Speaker 3 (59:17):
Like?

Speaker 1 (59:18):
How long does this take to get through?

Speaker 2 (59:19):
Because he seems so comfortable in what he's doing because
he's talking about the crown jewels.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
Lacho king, you know you can't be a king.

Speaker 2 (59:27):
You have a crown, but you're not without royalty, without jewels,
you're not a real king. What was it like working
with Dusty Rose because everyone in today's world always admires him.

Speaker 3 (59:37):
Well, as I said, you know talk about orators, Dusty
was was a master and you know his promos were fantastic.
Put him in any situation here, he was in there
with the polka dots and making it work, putting it over.
So whatever the situation, he's going to go upgainst the
Macho King. And we have this odd tag team match

(01:00:02):
up with with Sapphire actually getting into the ring too
against sensational Sherry, which I which which was really weird
for me to see Sherry kind of in uh, you know,
wrestling gear and where and wrestling boots because you know,
you've gotten so used to her being in the fish
net and the the big spikes and boys. She could
work in those things and imagine what you know, getting

(01:00:25):
into the ring and working in shoes like that. Uh,
just shows you the talent that she had. But this
was this is another this is a real gimmick match
to me.

Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
So it's the first ever mixed tag match at WrestleMania.

Speaker 3 (01:00:42):
Yeah, yeah, and boy it was. It was an interesting
mix for sure. And you know, Sapphire, I didn't have
a clue what she did. I think she'd done some
you know, be in some of these low level shows
or something. She was a huge mostly just a huge fan.
So but you know, Cherry helped her out. And that

(01:01:02):
was one thing that was was awesome about Sensational Sherry
is that she was all about the business. And if
you put her in a situation, whether or not she
liked it or felt that this was what she wanted
to do, whatever she she knew she was, that was
her job. And you see in that match, she did

(01:01:23):
everything she could to help Sapphire in this and uh,
you know, for what it's worth, it it was, you know,
as good as it could be. I'll leave it at that.
But and certainly had to be the biggest moment of
Sapphire's life. Well, yeah, being a part of that. Can
you imagine she was a fan and then you came

(01:01:45):
in and got brought in.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
I think Dusty Roads, like one of the gross of
all time.

Speaker 3 (01:01:50):
And which was one of her favorites of all. I mean,
I think she, you know, loved Dusty, So the opportunity,
the chance, she got the opportunity to work with him.
And then you're in the ring too with Randy Avage
and sensational Sherry. Yeah, talk about achievement at Wresania, No kidding.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Like you're not just in the match on Superstar as
a wrestling challenge, you are in this. So you said
Sherry was comfortable working with Sapphire because I know, as
you would see those years ago on, like Sherry is
very protective of her role because she's one of She'd
always say like, oh, you're just a girl, Like, no,
she's one of like the guys. People would say like
she's don't mess with Sherry. So how do you think
she was comfortable working with someone who wasn't actually a

(01:02:31):
trained wrestler.

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
Well, I think, well, certainly there was no threat that
the staphar would show her up somehow. But she was
a true professional. And and Sherry could work with anyone,
you know, she when she was in that ring or ringside,
didn't matter who it was she was, you know, she

(01:02:55):
could work with anybody and take bumps and deliver bumps,
you know, right back in the mix. And I've mentioned
before that you know, she was in there with a
man or something doing and he was supposed to close
liner and he took it easy. Oh my god, pray
for his soul because she would be, you know, in

(01:03:17):
his face and tell him you deliver that you do it,
and otherwise she would deliver her own receipt. So she
gave as good as she got. And she's she helped
cross that line for a lot of women. As I've
said before that you know, the women in professional wrestling.

(01:03:38):
Oh that woman a lot for being able to make
it very clear that there were and there weren't many
that could do it, but there were women who could
go toe to toe with the best of the best
out there and take it all and really be able
to work. So this was just another example. I can't

(01:03:58):
even imagine, like she thinking, you know, what am I
going to do with this person? You know, how am
I gonna work with her, but you know, they worked
it out.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
And then Miss Elizabeth shows up as the Crown Jewels
with Dustin Rhodes and Sapphire to really set off Macho King.
And so now you have three women in one match
in reality, which is not really a thing you see
in the early eighties and early nineties of multiple women
shares powerful Liz, super powerful Sapphire. You have your thoughts
on her. So Elizabeth coming back? She's been gone for

(01:04:28):
a year since the Megapowers exploded. Now with that interview earlier,
restminus earlier, this night where they're asking where.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Have you been? Why don't you hear what's going on?

Speaker 2 (01:04:36):
Why on not just as a fly on my hat,
not just as a performer. Why do you think she
wasn't on television because easily she could have been inserted
to other things without Macho Mitten. But is it more
like Machi Man just wanted her to be home or
is it more to that.

Speaker 3 (01:04:53):
Yeah, I think there was a lot. Like you said,
I think she just had gotten tired of the road.
I mean I remember there were, you know, rumors of it.
Maybe she's gonna, you know, having a child, or she
was you know, pregnant or something like that. But I
think that it was just, you know, after a long stretch.
You know, they'd been you know, at it for a

(01:05:14):
long time, and that that life is really tough, and
I think she just needed a break. There may have
been cracks in that relationship going on, so I just
think there was a lot happening. But that's I think
that's really what it just came down to us. She
just needed to, you know, get off the road and
just chill and just be able to you know, have

(01:05:37):
some kind of a life, a normal life.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
Yeah, this is the eighth match.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
Though, but as you could see, she couldn't stay away though,
you know. I mean, I don't think that that was
something that somebody shoved her in front of the truck
there to go back at it. I think that after
a while, okay, she was ready to do something again.

Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
What's crazy, though, is in the w w F though
she like disappears, then she hasn't come back and till
rest meing to seven to reunite with Macha Man. She
returns back in early ninety two to set up other
naked pictures of her at Wrestleminia eight, when she joins
abc W in ninety five, she's on Nitro every week
with Rick Flayer and the Macho Man, Like, I just
wonder why that she was removed from WWF television, but

(01:06:14):
yet in PCW it was like, she's here every week
on Nitro on the shows like it just felt why
disappear now when you're one of the hottest characters there was,
especially because Sherry's not wearing it TBT teeny Weeny Yellow
Poke and Doc Bikinis. We brought it before Liz just
in a bathing seal on a poster sold like crazy.

(01:06:34):
I don't know why dipswo was around, not in WWF.
Either way, Sapphire did pick.

Speaker 3 (01:06:40):
So she had to make a living at that point.
She was on her own basically, and so she right,
she had to make a living prior to that, and
the money was really good early on there and with
with Randy, but after that, you know, as we there's
many tales of a lot of times it doesn't go

(01:07:01):
so far. So I think probably when it came down
to and I certainly don't know, but I imagine that
she had to make a living too at that point.

Speaker 2 (01:07:09):
That makes sense, you know, somewhere on the show I
don't have it written down, but we'll talk about right now.
Rhythmend Blues have a concert with Diamond Dallas Page driving
down and a pink Cadillac. The Rushwackers interrupt this as well.
This is all before when you talked about you interviewing
Mary Tyler Moore how she was going to be excited
for this Rhythmen Blues song Honk of Honk of Honk

(01:07:30):
of Love. Yeah, boy, you talk about crashing and burning
on live television. Dude, this is horrible and maybe someone
thinks it's hilarious and it's fun. I'm sorry you're wrong.
Because Honky Tonk Man is sort of singing. You have
the Honk Cats doing the real part of the Honk
of Honk a bud and then it's time for Greg

(01:07:52):
the Hammer Valentine with his Jet black care to sing
and he forgot every word you love? What the hell
was there no practicing, There was no rehearsal, Like.

Speaker 1 (01:08:06):
What are we doing here with Greg Hammer Valentine?

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
Yeah? Yeah, that was not a great moment in music,
was it? No side note here though? The Diamonds Diamond
Dallas Page was his WrestleMania debut, and yeah, and he
tells the story. You know, that was his that was
his cadillac. That's how he got involved. Somebody said, hey, yeah,
we need a Cadillac, and they said, hey, we know

(01:08:30):
this guy.

Speaker 1 (01:08:31):
And he also worked for a strip club. That's why
they knew him.

Speaker 3 (01:08:35):
No, he was a man. Well, yeah, it was a
club that they went to. I only it was a
strip club. It was just club popular. Yeah, it was
a popular nightclub that he managed and a lot of
the guys would go in there. That's how he got
into it. That's a whole other episode. But he had
this cadillac and he tells the story. I think it
was Pat Patterson called him and said, you know what
you're luck. Can you come up We'll get you through

(01:08:57):
your cadillac? Uh and uh Dallas is like yeah, And
they said, well what do you want for and he said,
just you pay to get it up there and let
me drive it. I don't think he didn't get any
other money to do that. But you know, Dallas is
just uh, you know, he's yeah, but the way his

(01:09:19):
mind works, you know, he was thinking, you know, and
and because the way he interacts with people, that it
was just an opportunity. Another opportunity to get in the door,
and you know, they don't pay me anything, just just
bring me up there, and you know, just laid another
track for him on that journey that he was taking.

(01:09:39):
But I just thought that that was so typical Dallas
that he, you know, just seized an opportunity. So anyway,
but you're right about the the You would have thought
that somebody would have said, let's see what he sounds like,
or let's do a rehearsal, you know, that's where you
do it before I've at Hope. I honestly, I don't

(01:10:06):
I don't think so. I think uh uh, I don't know.
Or maybe he just totally blew the lines. But I
don't remember hearing anything backstage of them warming up. That's
all I can tell you. So maybe they were off
somewhere else.

Speaker 2 (01:10:20):
Me me, me, me, Yeah, it was the Honkats who
carried that performance, and the Bushwackers show up and they
just they destroyed the guitars. And yes, the body of
Ventura is very upset that they interrupted one of the
greatest performances of all time. I think Jesse might have
been on that little drunk with Steve Allen.

Speaker 3 (01:10:37):
Well and I was a huge fan of Honkey talk Man.
He could Uh. He was made me laugh every time
I saw him because he had that you know, this
bad Elvis but he pulled it off and you know,
the moves and everything, and he had that guitar would
be totally out of tune. He did not play that thing.
You know great, Yeah, I love the Yeah, yeah, Greg.

(01:11:00):
They could have just kept in the background. I don't
know what the heck they were thinking.

Speaker 2 (01:11:04):
Yeah, I don't either, But it's it seems like this
whole entire event, there's like a match.

Speaker 1 (01:11:09):
People want to see the match. People are.

Speaker 3 (01:11:12):
It's Shenanigans there, But like Steve, there's Steve Fall, there's
the Shenanigans. Why why we have so many shenanigans going on?

Speaker 2 (01:11:21):
What is that coffee? We're on to match number nine?
There's fourteen Irish whiskey.

Speaker 3 (01:11:26):
That's what's in here, Lad.

Speaker 1 (01:11:28):
Jesus Lady, starting early for mister Mooney.

Speaker 2 (01:11:31):
Here the Rockers are up neck taking on the Orient Express,
a name you can't use in today's world or any Express.
Win the match via counter after Fuji throws salt in
Jenny's eyes. It's a great match in the Rockers would
fight the Orient Express again. I think it's runnableed ninetety one,
and it's a great match.

Speaker 1 (01:11:50):
It's unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (01:11:50):
But it's still like there's a there's a pattern to
this resuming where it's like people wanted to see this.
People didn't want to care about this. People wanted to
see this. All right, go to the bathroom by merch.
All right, you want to see this because up next
Million Dollar Man versus Jake to Snake Roberts.

Speaker 1 (01:12:03):
Of course you want to see this matter. I wanted
to see that these two are.

Speaker 2 (01:12:06):
The greatest in the Golden Era, especially around this time.

Speaker 1 (01:12:09):
Now. The storyline they play you a video package.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
It's very weird because they show you, like eight months
ago the Million Dollar Man took Jake the Snake Roberts out.
He doesn't return for another like seven months after that.
The real backstory to that is Jake had a problem
with substance abuse, so they have to get him off
television somehow and Million Dollar Man taking him out. But's
a long time though for a very popular wrestler to

(01:12:33):
removed from television and not really feeling the burn of
missing one of these characters. What was it like seeing
a wrestler like this, Jake the Snake Roberts, who clearly
all these wrestlers are doing something backstage that aren't legal,
But Jake the Snake, he's one of those stories that
you hear more than others.

Speaker 3 (01:12:51):
Why is that the case, Well, somebody you know, and
you know have known people throughout your life too, that
you know they call people like social drinkers that can
do that kind of thing. You could say. At the time,
everybody was doing something. Yeah, there was a lot of
all kinds of stuff happening on the road, and these

(01:13:14):
guys doing what they had to do to get into
that ring, to get into the square circle. Others were
just better at dealing with it. There were a few
exceptions that took it more seriously and stayed away from
things like that, and you know, but that was pretty
much the exception. And Jake was not one of those people.

(01:13:37):
He just it just got the best of them. And
as we saw, it happened with many others. So yeah,
and then when it gets to a point where it
is impacting what you can do, you know, Fortunately the
company was I I don't want to say compassionate, because

(01:13:57):
it was all about business. You needed these guys. Jake
was somebody who was a money maker for them and
they want they needed him healthy, so him stepping away
and uh, you know, getting cleaned up was was necessary.
I'm glad that in a situation, that's the way it was, because,
like I said, it was business and not that they

(01:14:20):
didn't take of low take care of low level guys
as well, but not with the same fervor, I will
tell you. And Jake was an earner, so they needed
him back and they and that was something that was
very important to them. But it just kind of made
it clear at that point that he had some serious

(01:14:40):
problems and they had to do something about it.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
And again, when you see Jake Sank backstage with me
and Gene Cutness promo talking about greed and talking about
how he's going to make million Dollar Man get on
his knees, He's watched Millionela Man make other people get
on their knees and ask her money. Well, he's going
to make million Dollar Man grovel here at Rustlemania six.
And I thought that was great because the storyline kind
of is like, oh, well, Jake stole the million Dollar

(01:15:03):
Championship from him, because Mandela Man takes things.

Speaker 1 (01:15:06):
From other people the Robin Hood storyline here.

Speaker 2 (01:15:09):
It was a nice touch because Jake the Snake Roberts,
you know we talked about before Golden Era. I have
come to the conclusion that he has the greatest storylines
in the Golden Era, next to Hulk Hogan, Like there's
no way you can touch him. And when he's been
working with Andre, he's been working with Warrior Hogan, million
dollar man, macho man. He slaps Liz like he turns

(01:15:30):
Warrior almost he like, there's a lot to Jake the
Snake Roberts. But here another count out Teddybiassi wins by
count out.

Speaker 1 (01:15:38):
We just saw a match with count Out Raby for.

Speaker 3 (01:15:40):
Then Yeah, yeah, I don't know that. You know, you
could do so much with these guys, and that's how
we end it, you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:47):
Know, continue the storyline, I guess, yeah, But I do
want to.

Speaker 3 (01:15:51):
Mention here, you know, you talk about all these great
storylines with Jake and and don't think for a second,
you know he just got lucky or he was his
character was so you know, easy to to plan storylines with.
That's not necessarily the case. And as I've mentioned before
that you know, Jake was really good at understanding his

(01:16:11):
character and being creative of what you know, you could
do with him. And so he was as much a
part of a lot of the things that he got
involved in on his own. You know that he would say,
you know, hey, what about this, Let's try this, you know,
and you know what, and he was just really good
at that. I think that he would have made a

(01:16:32):
great booker if given the opportunity, And he thought that
that's kind of where he was going to go with
the company, and Vince basically shut that down when when
Pat came back. But I thought that he could have
been a great benefit to the company with that, with
that part of his his repertoire. But I think, you know,

(01:16:54):
you need to give him a lot of credit. He
did have some great storylines, but he had a lot
to do with that.

Speaker 2 (01:17:00):
He again, he's one of the greatest promos of all time.
People get give people give Piper a lot of credit,
people give the Rock a lot of credit. But Jake
the Snake, Robert, it's like this dude, he'd always say.
I remember interviewing him and he's like, I would talk
even softer and softer. So you have to get closer
to the television to hear me because instead of Warrior,

(01:17:20):
and again nothing against Warrior, his technique was screaming and yelling.

Speaker 1 (01:17:23):
That was his thing. A lot of guys and.

Speaker 3 (01:17:26):
The intensity and you know, quiet and quiet and quiet.

Speaker 2 (01:17:32):
I don't know what he's saying, but he's gonna he's
freaking me out many.

Speaker 3 (01:17:35):
I call it a slow burn. I always say it's
a slow burning. Yeah, I know what you're thinking. Yeah, damn.
You know. Jack Tunney taught me a lot of things.
You know, and you'll be like, awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:17:52):
It's so funny.

Speaker 3 (01:17:52):
Man.

Speaker 2 (01:17:53):
The moon in the mirror recently.

Speaker 3 (01:17:58):
Come on. Being around those guys for so long, it
kind of sticks in your brain.

Speaker 2 (01:18:02):
Next time I see nobody, Bruce, No, no, no. They
had that show on the network. He tried to make
his his due impressions, but he held a mask over
his face because he didn't want to insult JR. By
doing a closed eye and his mouth twisted like this,
and uh, he didn't want to do that.

Speaker 1 (01:18:18):
So I don't get canceled again.

Speaker 2 (01:18:19):
So moving on, Big Boston Brus is a chem The
Twin Towers have broken up. Big Boston recently turned baby Face,
so we're just kind of wrapping up the Twin Tower storyline.
Here Big Bosston actually gives a king his boss Man
slam with one arm, and that is damn impressive. But
this is kind of the end of a chem you know,
we don't really see him do much after this Big

(01:18:39):
boss Man huge push. He goes off to work with Hogan.
He goes off to be part of one of my
favorite surbarvar serious teams of all time with Hogan. So
there's a lot going on there. But keem, it's the end?
Why Why the end for a keem?

Speaker 3 (01:18:54):
Well?

Speaker 1 (01:18:55):
How long can you juke and jive? As the act
I was.

Speaker 3 (01:18:58):
To say that, and you know I'm telling right, And
I think he became disenchanted and a lot of it,
as in many cases he felt that he wasn't earning
enough and even says, you know, it was at some
point where it was costing me to do this, whether
or not that was true, but yeah, he became disenchanted

(01:19:22):
and that had another opportunity to go earned some money
and took it. But the Big boss Man at this
point was on a great trajectory moving up to the ranks,
and deservedly so. And I've mentioned many times how much
I really loved boss Man. I just thought all the
way around he was he was the whole package and

(01:19:46):
worked really hard at it because initially he wasn't as
great doing you know, the promos, and but he grew
into that where he was just phenomenal and the whole
package with the night stick and the way and what.
He never gets enough credit to me on just how

(01:20:07):
athletic he was. I mean he could do the splits,
I mean he you know, and he'd get up on
the ropes and he just did a lot of moves
that I don't think people really recognize just how difficult
that is for an exceptionally large human to do. So deservedly,
so he got a big push and really I had

(01:20:30):
a great run.

Speaker 2 (01:20:31):
Well also, you think about it, the Twin Towers a
Keem in Big boss Man really helped build to wrest
many of five with the megapowers. Explode was out their
involvement with Hogan and Savage, there wouldn't have been these
two men Akeem in Big Boston were beaten down Savage
while like Hoga's backstages, Liz trying to get her help.
All this shit is involved with these two wrestlers. So

(01:20:52):
without them doing their job. And also look at a
picture of Big Bossman in nineteen eighty nine, then look
at a picture of him in nineteen then ninety one.
I don't know how he's doing it, but he lost
a significant amount of weight from just two years from
now and being on the road that much. I don't
even know how someone can lose that mass because he's

(01:21:13):
busy every day, but he must have been at the
gym twenty four hours a day to lose all that weight,
Like he looked amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:21:19):
He used a slide underneath the bottom.

Speaker 2 (01:21:22):
Rope, come around and pop you in the face, Like
who else is doing that at two hundred three hundred
pounds plus?

Speaker 3 (01:21:28):
Yeah, and and and I think that he saw that
his agility and being healthy at least as healthy as
you could be with the life that they were living,
was helping him. You know, he was moving better, he
you know, could do more and saw that. But that
takes a tremendous commitment, as you just mentioned that, you know,

(01:21:51):
these guys are on the road. We've said many times,
like how many days of the year that they're out
there and you're going to these towns and and the
more committed ones were, you know, trying to get some
the most sleap they could get up, get to a gym,
you gotta eat, and you gotta get to an arena,
and you got to perform. And and I think that

(01:22:14):
Bubba recognized at the time that this was his moment,
this was his time, and he was going to you know,
not let any of it slip away, and you know,
did what he had to do to you know, take
the most out of it. And I think he certainly
accomplished that because you know, as you just said, he

(01:22:36):
you know had a great, you know stretch in there
where he was at the top of the card, he
really was, and making a lot of money and at
the top of his profession.

Speaker 2 (01:22:48):
Yeah, he was one of the best. I'm now we're
going to match number twelve. It's Rick rud versus super
Fly Jimmy Snook. Rick Rude wins is clear to get
Rick Rud more wins uneath his belt to set it
up him versus Warrior at SummerSlam nineteen ninety, which wuld
be the next pay per view.

Speaker 1 (01:23:05):
So there's really no talking points here.

Speaker 2 (01:23:07):
It's just more of like Rick Rude was the Icy champion,
hasn't really been doing that much he wins here. Next up, though,
is talking about your old podcast partner, Hacksaw Jim Duggan.
Now we're in Canada, yep, can't now Hacksaw Jem Duggin
comes down the aisle with a giant American flag. He's saying,

(01:23:27):
on Dino Bravo, who is from Canada. Yeah, the crowd
is very confused.

Speaker 1 (01:23:34):
They don't know. You can see other faces like do
I boo Hacksaw, do I cheer Dina?

Speaker 2 (01:23:38):
There was Hacksaw very aware the situation of showing up
because even when he tries to do a USA chant,
they're like, no, we're not doing that. We're not doing
that here, like we're not cheering the USA.

Speaker 3 (01:23:48):
Well, but at the time this was he was doing
the patriotic gimmick. What do you do? You keep that
in the trunk? He can't know he's gonna come out
with just that that the two by four, So you
know what, And it is kind of interesting though, you know,
I mean, you can see okay, America, Russia or Iraq,
you know, but US, Canada, what we're gonna maybe today? Yeah, yeah,

(01:24:14):
maybe today, but uh no, not back then. So that
that's a hard cell and and uh so I think
it was what, you know what, one of those things
where we uh, let's not get the countries involved here, folks,
let's just, you know, have these two guys not like
each other today. So yeah, that was that was a
that was an interesting selling like us.

Speaker 2 (01:24:36):
I remember it was so funny because he stomps on
the ground and us when he stomps on the ground,
he does one of these and everyone's like you gets
everyone clapping for you, said they.

Speaker 3 (01:24:42):
Went Canada came out with the Steelers. I don't think
Din was gonna sing. Yeah, that wasn't gonna work either.

Speaker 1 (01:24:49):
So no, no, And Earthquake is out there as well.

Speaker 2 (01:24:54):
Hackstard gem dug and wins the two by four shot
to Dino Bravo. So we got baby faces cheating again,
which is fine, We're okay with that in today's world.
And Earthquake at the end though takes out Hacksaw gives
him the earthquake splash with his.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
Just smoshes him in the ring.

Speaker 2 (01:25:09):
And yeah, but I love I love the commentary because
Jesse the Ventura is like Gorilla Grilla, You're okay with
this two by four shot, Like you're okay with this
and Gorilla goes quiet for a minute, and he goes, well,
all the bad things Dino has done in the past,
this is karma for him.

Speaker 3 (01:25:25):
Yeah, Jesse's like, come on, yeah, And I love that
when Jesse would do that, he was you know, he
would go, uh yeah, you're all good with all this
stuff until you guys are cheating, you know, because he
was he was the heel announcer and and you know,
and and there were times you're like, he's got a point,
you know, he is like Bobby wouldn't if Bobby did that,

(01:25:46):
he was still wrong. But Jesse would make you think, uh,
bad point. Yeah, I guess you're kind of right there.
You're okay with the you know, him doing that, but
he takes the two by four and cheats, and it's
still okay, you know, like come on, like say, you know,
oh no, I think he screwed up this time. No,
he's got got you gotta stay there.

Speaker 1 (01:26:04):
Nah, it's karma, Yeah, it's karma.

Speaker 3 (01:26:06):
Yeah, but yeah, I I really did. I like that
Jesse could walk that line of where uh, you know,
of course he was a heel, but he would make
points that you know, you know, bring it into where
it was common sense, and you know, really and you
couldn't really disagree with them. I guess, yeah, you do

(01:26:26):
kind of have a point there, but uh, all right,
let's move on.

Speaker 1 (01:26:29):
Yeah, yeah, I disagree with you, but uh, let's keep going.

Speaker 2 (01:26:32):
Now we've reached the fourteenth match of the evening, and
this pay per view is about three hours and forty
minutes long. It's the Ultimate Challenge. It's title for a title.
It's Hot Cogan versus the Eltmate Warrior.

Speaker 1 (01:26:46):
Now title for title underneath this. I believe if Ho.

Speaker 2 (01:26:50):
Cogan Pinn Ultimate Warrior, he would also be the Inner Coin.

Speaker 1 (01:26:53):
Champion, Right, that's what you would think.

Speaker 3 (01:26:56):
It was title for title.

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
Even hard Finkel says it's title for title.

Speaker 2 (01:26:59):
But yet as years would go on, Bruce would say,
it was never for the Intercontinental title. And I'm thinking
to myself, you say it's never for the Intercontinental title,
but why do you keep saying title for title?

Speaker 3 (01:27:15):
Well? Also, why not? Why would you say?

Speaker 1 (01:27:20):
Is it below Hogan to be champion?

Speaker 3 (01:27:23):
Yeah? No, and we knew how it was going to end,
So why not?

Speaker 1 (01:27:28):
What were you told when you were building this up on?

Speaker 3 (01:27:30):
Uh? I was titled for title. I always thought that
that's that's news to me that Bruce would say that
it was always just for the heavyweight world championship, right, that's.

Speaker 1 (01:27:41):
What That's what he was saying. But yet they always
say I.

Speaker 3 (01:27:44):
Liked the angle of that. How awesome would that be?
Do you know? A double title holder? For as long
as it would happened before President Tunney would do something
about it, of course, because he was he was the word.

Speaker 1 (01:27:57):
Well, yeah, he the man. Don't screw a Tonny because
he'll screw with you. Though. When Warrior first comes out,
the audience is cheering.

Speaker 2 (01:28:06):
But when I watched this on the Vault last night
on YouTube, you don't really hear a pop.

Speaker 1 (01:28:12):
You just hear noise.

Speaker 2 (01:28:14):
When Hulk Hogan comes out, Holy shit, Like I can
hear the crowd through Gorilla and through Jesse's microphone. Like
there's no way that they thought, oh shit could go
wrong because everyone's cheering Hogan. Some people are cheering Warrior.
What were you thinking going into this? Did you think
that the audience would be split or you thought, I

(01:28:35):
think we're gonna choose one or the other and we're
gonna have a problem here.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
No, I wasn't surprised by that, because you know, you know,
Canada had a very rich history of professional wrestling across
the country, and Hulk Hogan was you know, it was
hulk Mania. Uh and we're not that deep into the

(01:28:59):
existence of the w w F at the time, and
uh so you had a lot of devotees, shall we say,
like these these people were you know, they they they loved,
you know, decades and decades of professional wrestling, and they
appreciated what Hulk Hogan had done for professional wrestling. So

(01:29:22):
I don't think it was that surprising to me. And
uh you know, Hulk had been there many times throughout
his career and so you know, the warrior he certainly,
I mean, we can't say that people weren't.

Speaker 1 (01:29:34):
Cheering, like very different, very popular.

Speaker 3 (01:29:37):
But I think it wasn't. It wasn't just so much
that you know, Hulk Hogan's in this Magic Ultimate or
it was Hulk Hogan is here, if that makes sense,
that because he represented what professional wrestling had become at
that point to that crowd, and they it was more
I think they were showing that appreciation. Now that's that's
my that was my thinking. And I do remember that Pop.

(01:30:01):
I've said that there's been a there were a couple
of times in my career where I would be on
the arena floor and the roar of a crowd wasn't
just it wasn't just this audio pop going through my head,
It went through your body. And that was one of those.
And there were, you know, a couple other times, but
that was one of them. And so it's when you

(01:30:24):
mentioned that, I was saying, yeah, I remember that that,
That's that's what it was like. And I really just
felt like these people were just so glad that Hulk
Hogan was here in Toronto in their stadium and he
represented the reason they were there, that you know, that
that had become this gigantic spectacle.

Speaker 2 (01:30:45):
I love that how you said that, because you know,
I think some people confuse Hulk Cogan for his real
life persona versus his wrestling persona and not realizing that
as a generation of fans who look at Hulk Cogan
as their childhood hero. So seeing this moment play out,
as you said, sixty five thousand fans, I'm not gonna
disparage anyone, but I am highly doubting that. I'm like, oh, daddy, pay,

(01:31:08):
let's go see the Rockers rest of Order Express.

Speaker 1 (01:31:10):
They're saying, Daddy, I want to go see hul Cogan.

Speaker 3 (01:31:13):
Good. Yeah, and the people here right, whether or not
what they thought of the Warrior whatever, but that was
that was a big match. Okay, you're getting both of
these guys in the ring. So that was kind of
the uh, you know the Flair Hogan. You always wanted
to see that level. It was. You know, we always
talk about how you know, you got to be able

(01:31:33):
to stand toe to toe. This was one of those matches.

Speaker 2 (01:31:37):
And you know, people always say Warrior were savage at
wrestling in the seven is Warriors Gris match.

Speaker 1 (01:31:41):
I disagree.

Speaker 2 (01:31:42):
I believe this is Warriors greatest match, possibly even hold
Cogan's because the crowd is going, as GIRLA would say,
bananas the entire time. There's no lull, there's no oh,
I think I'm going to the bathroom really quick and
I can come back. People are standing and people always
say oh standing roomoteing. No, No, people are standing the
whole time. Even in the crowd edge rated at a superstar edge.

(01:32:05):
Is there as a child watching this event, yeah, you
know there's these little moments of people here enjoying this moment,
and I think it's just one of those forgotten arts
where you realize, look at the fun people are having.
Stop looking for the negative, stop looking for the problems,
enjoy the moment, because Warrior I have the I have
the brochure right here. The Warrior versus Hogan moment is

(01:32:28):
one of those Rock versus Austin moments where you're never
gonna get this again. And this is something you should
appreciate and love. And I think it's the best match.

Speaker 1 (01:32:36):
So for you, you told me, were you on the
floor for this match?

Speaker 3 (01:32:41):
Yeah? You know, when I didn't have to do interviews,
I would love to. I would just go outside the curtain.
I always like to feel it. And because that was
a whole different experience. Yeah, and and uh, this was
this was right up there. And I think, as you said,
you know this is you thought this was one of
the Warrior's greatest matches. I think Jim would would agree
with you that despite his you know, it was business,

(01:33:06):
it was just me doing my job. Uh. I think
that he felt this was definitely one of his one
of his greatest matches. And I told you about that
interview where he says that you know, that day, everything worked,
and I think for a professional athlete somebody who's experienced that,

(01:33:26):
or even whatever level you're at. But you have those
days where, you know, I guess you'd call it in
the zone. You're just there and everything you do works.
And I think this was one of those days where
not only for Jim Elwig, but for also for Terry
Belea that day that everything just just worked the way

(01:33:47):
the match worked out. And and uh so I think
that you know Warrior would agree with you, and I'm
sure that you know Hulk Cogan felt the same way. Uh.
The big, the big tell on this is how the
crowd reacts to it, and uh, you know, being on
that floor and and uh seeing that where they're reacting

(01:34:09):
to everything everything for a moment, for the moment it
started from the their entrances to the to when it
was over, it all works. And so you know, for
me it is it's one of the one of the
best WrestleMania matches ever. And and and as always what
I tell you, it's always, it's not always it's it's
of course the wrestling is, but I take it all

(01:34:31):
in and with the audience and where these two are
and uh, you know that's that's that's what makes it. Uh,
and and they and in that day it had it.

Speaker 2 (01:34:44):
All and Warrior wins, the match, comes championed, and he
has both championships, the great image of him holding them
both up and his Warrior on the cart walking going away.

Speaker 1 (01:34:56):
But the thing is, people harp on these pieces to
this match.

Speaker 2 (01:35:00):
One is Warrior before this has a promo weeks before
this where he's gonna steal Hate Cogan's airplane and he's
gonna drive it into a mountain, killing the pilots.

Speaker 1 (01:35:10):
The sacrifices for the Warriors. Weird shit, but yet people.

Speaker 3 (01:35:15):
Always were, They always were weird.

Speaker 2 (01:35:17):
He said he was going to steal his plane and
then fly into a mountain, and the pilot has made
the sacrifice for the Warrior to become champion. Like, I'm sorry,
Yes there are crazy promos, but I don't remember him
ever saying he was going to steal someone's airplane and
throw it into a mountain.

Speaker 1 (01:35:35):
Yeah that's me, that's me.

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
But yet in this how do you think Hate Coogan
was feeling going into this, Because, as Brett HoTT would
say in his book That Warrior, Hogan went up to
Brett and was like, yeah, well I lost, but you
know they're gonna call me back because they're gonna need me,
which you know eventually they did, and we've talked about
it multiple times. Whe Hogan always has this plan in
the back of his head where like, well, if I
leave them in business goes down, they'll always call me

(01:36:02):
back because they'll think it's the reason the BIS went
down because I left.

Speaker 1 (01:36:06):
And it's a great it's a great plan to stay
on top forever. I get it. But how do you
think Hogan was feeling about going into this event losing.

Speaker 3 (01:36:14):
Well, I think it was all part of the grand
plan that uh, you know, you have these these storylines
that go on. They can't go on forever. Hulka Mania
couldn't just go on forever. At some point you need
some drama. You need to as I always kind of uh,
I always kind of call the behind the music analogy.

(01:36:34):
Remember that show Behind It? I love that show, right,
and it was always you know, starting out struggling, great fame, ah,
they screw up, crashing and then redemption, ah, beginning middle end.
You've got to have a story. It can't always be
on the trajectory here. It can't always have this you know, ascension.

(01:36:59):
And so I think that that Hulk was looking at
it that way that you know, how can I miss
you if you don't go away? And and so and
the best of both worlds. Because I think deep down
the Haulkster knew they're gonna they're gonna need me. He
could tell. He'd been in this business long enough he

(01:37:19):
could he knew that that the warrior, you know, Jim
was not gonna be able to handle this. He couldn't
sustain it. He didn't have there weren't the horses behind
the warriors. It just wasn't Hulkamania had all of this.
And so I think deep down he had that confidence
that yeah, this is it's this ain't over, and it's

(01:37:42):
gonna give me a nice break here and and they
need to see what it's like not having me here.
So I think that he was fine, fine with it,
and uh, uh you know, did what he had to do,
sold it, put him over and uh and knew that
I'll be back.

Speaker 2 (01:38:02):
Yeah, they'll call me, They'll they'll call me again, and
they did, and he came back, and then he got
taken up by earthquake, and then the double main event
of Summer Slam nineteen ninety occurred grilm On soon though
on commentary suggests that Hulk Hogan is no longer just
a wrestler, He's immortal. That's where the immortal Hulk Cogan
line comes into play, because Warrior wins the championship, according

(01:38:24):
to again the rumors and the lore that Hogan was
not supposed to do this. He grabs the world championship,
He's the one who hands it to Warrior, gets on
the little golf.

Speaker 1 (01:38:33):
Cart ring goes.

Speaker 2 (01:38:35):
He's looking sad, like he's crying and it's over and
it's never gonna be better. But the camera stays on
Hogan instead of focusing on Warrior more. And that's when
Gorilla drops that line about immortality and Hult Cogan. And
so Hogan suggests that he planted the seed of well,
now you're focusing on me, Like, what's next for Hogan?
Where's Hogan going? Why is he so sad versus man?

(01:38:55):
Look at Warrior, He's a champion, he's so strong. We
can't wait to see what he does next. There's a
lot of you can pick and choose what you want
from that sentence, but like, do you think Hogan's so smart?
He realizes, like if I look sad people. Ben toned
about me, not about him.

Speaker 3 (01:39:09):
Yeah, he'd made a career out of reading audiences and
the whole psychology behind it. And as they say, Hogan
must pose and posts and yeah in his own way,
that's yeah, brilliant.

Speaker 2 (01:39:23):
It was good and I again, restman Is six is
one of my favorite events because again it's almost goes
four hours long, and usually.

Speaker 3 (01:39:29):
These events didn't do that like this podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:39:31):
No two hours almost. We've talked about it all folks.

Speaker 2 (01:39:35):
We talked about it Steve Allen and poopy jokes to
Warry becoming champion, to Sweet Sapphi or wrestling in a
ring which you shouldn't have probably have been. But in reality,
mooney is that's one of your favorites. And before we
wrap this up, uh.

Speaker 3 (01:39:48):
This may be one of my favorite podcasts, so folks,
don't you miss it. You got to wait a minute.
The end.

Speaker 2 (01:39:53):
This is this is the end, guys, guys, you gotta
watch you, guys, gotta watch this.

Speaker 1 (01:39:59):
I really enjoy this wrestling what's called it called wrestling? Mary? Mary?
Are you okay? I'm doing great?

Speaker 3 (01:40:05):
I got both tell it's a eyebrowser up touching the
hairline there.

Speaker 2 (01:40:12):
But final thoughts on this paper be before I wrap
this up after thirty four hour podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:40:18):
Absolutely one one of my faves. And as we've mentioned
over the last whatever, it's been that it was for
a number of reasons, and and Steve, you know, to me,
it's I always take it, you know. I look at
it as this grand picture and and all the stuff
that was involved in this, and uh, you know, better
or worse, I mean it was. It was a lot

(01:40:39):
of entertainment to take in. So uh this this remains
I'm right up there on the top of my list.
And so I'm glad we had a chance to really
go through the whole thing. I know we've done it
in parts before, but to really talk about the whole
event was awesome. Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:40:56):
Now I'm gonna after we end this, I'm gonna go
ask Alexa to play me a hunk a honk a
love free Honkers with Valentine.

Speaker 3 (01:41:03):
Skip that one, just use the one with you.

Speaker 2 (01:41:05):
Know what I'm gonna I'm just gonna sing it myself
because I don't want to hear Valentine trying to sing.

Speaker 1 (01:41:08):
But thank you everyone for tuning in to us.

Speaker 2 (01:41:10):
How about wrestling in the six here in The Golden
Inner Podcast with Sean Mooney. I'm ce fall He Sean Mooney,
who have a great day and we'll see you next time.

Speaker 1 (01:41:17):
Bye bye