March 12, 2025 • 12 mins
We explore how uncertainty and chaos create both vulnerabilities and opportunities in privacy and security. Amid global turmoil, cybersecurity professionals must adopt a bias toward action to counter increased threats that thrive in chaotic environments.
• Chaos serves as a smoke screen for malicious actors, just as DOS attacks once distracted from network intrusions
• Recent Ghost ransomware attack affected 70 countries but received less attention due to global uncertainty
• Security resource contraction combined with increased noise creates fertile ground for more breaches
• AI may cause job losses primarily in roles created to support the initial AI boom
• States are tightening data breach reporting requirements with class action lawsuits doubling or tripling since 2022
• Some states introducing "safe harbor" laws to shield businesses that implement strict cybersecurity standards
• Elon's Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) faces 11 lawsuits for allegedly violating Privacy Act of 1974
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of
Privacy, please.
I'm Cameron Ivey here with GabeGumbs, and today's show is
about uncertainty.
We're going to talk aboutcreating opportunities in
privacy, security and riskmanagement, gabe.
Okay, in times of chaos, weoften see new ideas emerge.
Okay, but that also presentschallenges around our moral
(00:25):
boundaries.
Anyways, that's today's show.
That's the theme todayuncertainty.
What are your thoughts on that,gabe?
A lot of things going on aroundthe world, a lot of uncertainty
and a lot of chaos.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Let's throw doubt onto that Flyer.
Uncertainty chaos and doubt.
Yeah, there's doubt aboutthings getting better sooner.
There's doubt about whatdirection things might go in.
That's part of the uncertaintyfactor.
The chaos, the chaos is equallytied up in that right.
It's hard to know.
Because of all of thoseuncertainties and doubts, it
does create chaos.
You've got a lot of differentpeople planning for different
(00:59):
things and moving in differentdirections.
And why is that relevant on ashow about cybersecurity and
privacy?
I think one of the primaryreasons it's relevant is chaos
is a fertile breeding ground forbad guys.
Bad guys love a good smokescreen to get busy.
In the old days we'd throwsmoke screens like just good
(01:21):
old-fashioned DOS attacks andwhile you were busy trying to
keep your networks alive andfrom getting drowned in, you
know freaking ICMP echoes, 25years ago we were busy freaking
routing through your network.
That hasn't really changed.
The only thing that's changedis the tactics and maybe some of
the techniques, but ultimatelythe leveraging chaos as a smoke
(01:43):
screen for cybersecurity harmand privacy harm is very real.
It's very, very real.
It's scary and there's a lot ofuncertainty.
You've seen those financialmarkets.
Oh boy, that volatility.
I tell you what.
Don't be looking at your 401k.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Hey Gabe, what do you mean?
What 401k.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
All right, you're talking about those people that
all got laid off and now areSpeaking of.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
I mean, yeah, times have changed.
I remember my dad, my father'sfather.
It was all about working hardand getting to retirement, so
you have retirement.
I mean, I don't even think thatexists for this generation.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It's not going to.
It's hard to see for many it is.
It's extremely hard to see formany.
This kind of uncertainty iscertainly unhelpful, very
unhelpful.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Yeah, and retirement in general doesn't seem exciting
anyways, because if I havenothing to do I'm just going to
be be.
What?
Are you just going to sit thereand travel, I mean, I guess, if
you have the money?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
make you a deal in uh 20, 30, 40 years from now.
If we're still not doinganything, let's record another
show.
Check it, okay let's keeppodcast or whatever podcasting
becomes in 20, 30 years from now.
Now, let's do that, let's dothat.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
I don't even know what it's going to be.
I mean it's I don't know.
I don't know either.
So uncertainty, how does thatpresent opportunity, gabe, when
it comes to all these, there'sso much chaos going on, and even
in the tech world, with layoffs, with ghosts, with Doge, with
ransomware attacks and peoplebeing laid off and all that kind
(03:26):
of thing.
Where's some of thatopportunistic insight that you
can think of that might behelpful for those that might be
dealing with that kind of stuff?
Where do you think theopportunity?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
comes from.
Last week we discussed the FBIwarning about the ghost
ransomware that attacked.
What was it?
70 different countries.
I think that's one clearexample of where cybersecurity
and uncertainty meet in the realworld.
Under other circumstances, 70different nations being hit by
the same ransomware group mightotherwise cause a little bit
(03:59):
more noise in the room.
And those kinds of things arenot causing the same kinds of
noise.
People getting laid off fromcybersecurity positions, both in
the government and in privatesector, are very much
contributing to that.
So you have this contracting ofresources to protect ourselves
and you have this amplificationof noise that is able to mask
other activities and, as Imentioned already, that becomes
(04:21):
a recipe for more breaches.
That becomes a very, veryfertile ground for more breaches
, because I don't just want toget into saber rattling and a
lot of fear mongering.
I do want to be clear, though,that this is a thing to be
worried about, but there isaction here to be taken right
Like.
This is a call to action.
This is a call to all the folksthat are in this line of work
(04:44):
to take it seriously that we maynot necessarily have the luxury
of weeks and months to plan ournext defensive steps.
Have a bias towards actionright now.
Right now, even if they'resmall actions to secure your
data, even if they're smallactions to secure your privacy,
collectively, as organizationsand as individuals, I like that
(05:10):
I don't think what's happeningright now is on anyone's bingo
card about, you know, dealingwith all these layoffs and
things.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I think the main effect would have been around AI
, or at least the worry was.
But we've always talked abouthow AI isn't necessarily a
threat to take people's jobs.
If anything, it's more of anopportunity to create more jobs.
So is there a way that we cankind of look at it the way that
we're going through things nowin a positive light?
Speaker 2 (05:36):
What could possibly be at the end's nothing positive
on the other end of this, but Ithink, in order for us to get
to the positive, it is exactlythat, though.
It's the coming together tosolve these problems together.
(05:57):
Yeah, the real opportunity hereis for all of us to work closer
on those things Again, aspeople and as organizations, as
security professionals, assecurity builders, breakers,
defenders.
That's the real opportunity.
The opportunity is to come outof this stronger, and that is
the positive thing I think I dosee at the other end of this is
I think I do see some positivethings coming out the other end
(06:19):
of this.
I think AI is going to costsome folks some jobs, but I
think what it's going to cost issome jobs that were recently
created to support the big AIboom, and, as the AI boom
contracts, we'll see those jobscontract with it.
I think we'll come out strongeras technologists and countries
(06:41):
and businesses that are heavilyrelying on technology, but that
call to action in order for usto come out to the positive side
that's happening.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
We'll be right back.
No, no, we'll keep it righthere.
I should have said it on thatlonger pause earlier, but uh
I'll take that all right.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
So let's switch gears a tiny bit, but let's stay on
the topic of uncertainty, or atleast maybe where there is more
certainty currently in the world.
At the top of the year wetalked about a lot of data
privacy laws.
There was some uncertaintycoming into the years to where
some of these were going, but Iknow you've got some updates on
where some of the state leveldata privacy stuff is settling
(07:20):
in, and maybe even at thefederal level too.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Yeah, I mean this kind of goes back to our
conversation last week aroundthe FBI and the data breach that
we had mentioned.
So data breach laws right noware definitely tightening and
businesses definitely need tostay on top of that.
You know states likePennsylvania, utah, florida, for
example, they're expandingtheir reporting requirements, so
(07:45):
class action lawsuits aredefinitely taking their I would
say double to tripling from 2022to 2023.
So that surge is continuing torise.
Today Now there are some statesthat are kind of introducing
safe harbor laws shieldingbusinesses from liability,
things like strict, strictcybersecurity standards.
(08:08):
Ohio kind of started that backin 18.
A Tennessee's version takes aneffect this year but, similar to
Florida and West Virginia, theywere vetoed over concerns they
might kind of decrease consumerprotections.
Lots of things going on.
I mean, I think that kind oftells us that states are trying
(08:31):
to keep up, they're trying totighten things as the landscape
of privacy continues to evolveas well with the data breaches
and stuff.
Gabe, what does that tell you?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
tells me, tells me, tells me.
Things aren't just getting heldup, installed, which is great.
I don't know that we'll get toanything at the national level
any sooner, though, but itsounds like there's some, some
clarity that will come through.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
At least this process and conversations, yeah um, and
since we were talking aboutdoge earlier, just to give
everybody an update if they'renot really too into the weeds
with it, so doge again has beenfacing lawsuits over alleged
data privacy violations.
Elon's Department of GovernmentEfficiency is facing 11
(09:18):
lawsuits to today over itsaccess of millions of Americans'
personal data across multiplefederal agencies.
They basically violated thePrivacy Act of 1974 with claims
that it illegally accessedstudent loan records, tax
information, government jobapplications, etc.
The lawsuit is it's a prettyserious privacy risk, as we all
(09:40):
know.
But if you weren't aware ofthat, it's pretty.
I mean 11 lawsuits.
I'm sure there's going to bemore added on to it.
Lots going on in that area.
There's going to be more addedon to it.
Lots going on in that area.
Anyways, gabe, I think thatwraps up today's episode.
So again, thanks for listeningin.
I know this episode was alittle different than usual, but
there's a lot going on in theworld.
We're trying to stay up withthose things and we want to dig
(10:01):
deeper into that stuff.
So hopefully you enjoyed andwe'll catch you guys on the next
one.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of
Privacy, please.
I'm Cameron Ivey here with GabeGumbs, and today's show is
about uncertainty.
We're going to talk aboutcreating opportunities in
privacy, security and riskmanagement, gabe.
Okay, in times of chaos, weoften see new ideas emerge.
Okay, but that also presentschallenges around our moral
(00:25):
boundaries.
Anyways, that's today's show.
That's the theme todayuncertainty.
What are your thoughts on that,gabe?
A lot of things going on aroundthe world, a lot of uncertainty
and a lot of chaos.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Let's throw doubt onto that Flyer.
Uncertainty chaos and doubt.
Yeah, there's doubt aboutthings getting better sooner.
There's doubt about whatdirection things might go in.
That's part of the uncertaintyfactor.
The chaos, the chaos is equallytied up in that right.
It's hard to know.
Because of all of thoseuncertainties and doubts, it
does create chaos.
You've got a lot of differentpeople planning for different
(00:59):
things and moving in differentdirections.
And why is that relevant on ashow about cybersecurity and
privacy?
I think one of the primaryreasons it's relevant is chaos
is a fertile breeding ground forbad guys.
Bad guys love a good smokescreen to get busy.
In the old days we'd throwsmoke screens like just good
(01:21):
old-fashioned DOS attacks andwhile you were busy trying to
keep your networks alive andfrom getting drowned in, you
know freaking ICMP echoes, 25years ago we were busy freaking
routing through your network.
That hasn't really changed.
The only thing that's changedis the tactics and maybe some of
the techniques, but ultimatelythe leveraging chaos as a smoke
(01:43):
screen for cybersecurity harmand privacy harm is very real.
It's very, very real.
It's scary and there's a lot ofuncertainty.
You've seen those financialmarkets.
Oh boy, that volatility.
I tell you what.
Don't be looking at your 401k.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
Hey Gabe, what do you mean?
What 401k.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
All right, you're talking about those people that
all got laid off and now areSpeaking of.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
I mean, yeah, times have changed.
I remember my dad, my father'sfather.
It was all about working hardand getting to retirement, so
you have retirement.
I mean, I don't even think thatexists for this generation.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It's not going to.
It's hard to see for many it is.
It's extremely hard to see formany.
This kind of uncertainty iscertainly unhelpful, very
unhelpful.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Yeah, and retirement in general doesn't seem exciting
anyways, because if I havenothing to do I'm just going to
be be.
What?
Are you just going to sit thereand travel, I mean, I guess, if
you have the money?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
make you a deal in uh 20, 30, 40 years from now.
If we're still not doinganything, let's record another
show.
Check it, okay let's keeppodcast or whatever podcasting
becomes in 20, 30 years from now.
Now, let's do that, let's dothat.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
I don't even know what it's going to be.
I mean it's I don't know.
I don't know either.
So uncertainty, how does thatpresent opportunity, gabe, when
it comes to all these, there'sso much chaos going on, and even
in the tech world, with layoffs, with ghosts, with Doge, with
ransomware attacks and peoplebeing laid off and all that kind
(03:26):
of thing.
Where's some of thatopportunistic insight that you
can think of that might behelpful for those that might be
dealing with that kind of stuff?
Where do you think theopportunity?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
comes from.
Last week we discussed the FBIwarning about the ghost
ransomware that attacked.
What was it?
70 different countries.
I think that's one clearexample of where cybersecurity
and uncertainty meet in the realworld.
Under other circumstances, 70different nations being hit by
the same ransomware group mightotherwise cause a little bit
(03:59):
more noise in the room.
And those kinds of things arenot causing the same kinds of
noise.
People getting laid off fromcybersecurity positions, both in
the government and in privatesector, are very much
contributing to that.
So you have this contracting ofresources to protect ourselves
and you have this amplificationof noise that is able to mask
other activities and, as Imentioned already, that becomes
(04:21):
a recipe for more breaches.
That becomes a very, veryfertile ground for more breaches
, because I don't just want toget into saber rattling and a
lot of fear mongering.
I do want to be clear, though,that this is a thing to be
worried about, but there isaction here to be taken right
Like.
This is a call to action.
This is a call to all the folksthat are in this line of work
(04:44):
to take it seriously that we maynot necessarily have the luxury
of weeks and months to plan ournext defensive steps.
Have a bias towards actionright now.
Right now, even if they'resmall actions to secure your
data, even if they're smallactions to secure your privacy,
collectively, as organizationsand as individuals, I like that
(05:10):
I don't think what's happeningright now is on anyone's bingo
card about, you know, dealingwith all these layoffs and
things.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I think the main effect would have been around AI
, or at least the worry was.
But we've always talked abouthow AI isn't necessarily a
threat to take people's jobs.
If anything, it's more of anopportunity to create more jobs.
So is there a way that we cankind of look at it the way that
we're going through things nowin a positive light?
Speaker 2 (05:36):
What could possibly be at the end's nothing positive
on the other end of this, but Ithink, in order for us to get
to the positive, it is exactlythat, though.
It's the coming together tosolve these problems together.
(05:57):
Yeah, the real opportunity hereis for all of us to work closer
on those things Again, aspeople and as organizations, as
security professionals, assecurity builders, breakers,
defenders.
That's the real opportunity.
The opportunity is to come outof this stronger, and that is
the positive thing I think I dosee at the other end of this is
I think I do see some positivethings coming out the other end
(06:19):
of this.
I think AI is going to costsome folks some jobs, but I
think what it's going to cost issome jobs that were recently
created to support the big AIboom, and, as the AI boom
contracts, we'll see those jobscontract with it.
I think we'll come out strongeras technologists and countries
(06:41):
and businesses that are heavilyrelying on technology, but that
call to action in order for usto come out to the positive side
that's happening.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
We'll be right back.
No, no, we'll keep it righthere.
I should have said it on thatlonger pause earlier, but uh
I'll take that all right.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
So let's switch gears a tiny bit, but let's stay on
the topic of uncertainty, or atleast maybe where there is more
certainty currently in the world.
At the top of the year wetalked about a lot of data
privacy laws.
There was some uncertaintycoming into the years to where
some of these were going, but Iknow you've got some updates on
where some of the state leveldata privacy stuff is settling
(07:20):
in, and maybe even at thefederal level too.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Yeah, I mean this kind of goes back to our
conversation last week aroundthe FBI and the data breach that
we had mentioned.
So data breach laws right noware definitely tightening and
businesses definitely need tostay on top of that.
You know states likePennsylvania, utah, florida, for
example, they're expandingtheir reporting requirements, so
(07:45):
class action lawsuits aredefinitely taking their I would
say double to tripling from 2022to 2023.
So that surge is continuing torise.
Today Now there are some statesthat are kind of introducing
safe harbor laws shieldingbusinesses from liability,
things like strict, strictcybersecurity standards.
(08:08):
Ohio kind of started that backin 18.
A Tennessee's version takes aneffect this year but, similar to
Florida and West Virginia, theywere vetoed over concerns they
might kind of decrease consumerprotections.
Lots of things going on.
I mean, I think that kind oftells us that states are trying
(08:31):
to keep up, they're trying totighten things as the landscape
of privacy continues to evolveas well with the data breaches
and stuff.
Gabe, what does that tell you?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
tells me, tells me, tells me.
Things aren't just getting heldup, installed, which is great.
I don't know that we'll get toanything at the national level
any sooner, though, but itsounds like there's some, some
clarity that will come through.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
At least this process and conversations, yeah um, and
since we were talking aboutdoge earlier, just to give
everybody an update if they'renot really too into the weeds
with it, so doge again has beenfacing lawsuits over alleged
data privacy violations.
Elon's Department of GovernmentEfficiency is facing 11
(09:18):
lawsuits to today over itsaccess of millions of Americans'
personal data across multiplefederal agencies.
They basically violated thePrivacy Act of 1974 with claims
that it illegally accessedstudent loan records, tax
information, government jobapplications, etc.
The lawsuit is it's a prettyserious privacy risk, as we all
(09:40):
know.
But if you weren't aware ofthat, it's pretty.
I mean 11 lawsuits.
I'm sure there's going to bemore added on to it.
Lots going on in that area.
There's going to be more addedon to it.
Lots going on in that area.
Anyways, gabe, I think thatwraps up today's episode.
So again, thanks for listeningin.
I know this episode was alittle different than usual, but
there's a lot going on in theworld.
We're trying to stay up withthose things and we want to dig
(10:01):
deeper into that stuff.
So hopefully you enjoyed andwe'll catch you guys on the next
one.
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