October 6, 2025 • 28 mins
Through our conversation with Donald Noland, Operations Manager for Project Controls at Performance Energy Services (a Danos Company), listen as we uncover the three essential pillars that form the foundation of effective project management: planning, scheduling, and cost controls.
Learn more about PES and Danos by visiting pesllc.com and danos.com.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome everyone.
Thank you for joining us today.
I'm Samantha McGee, your hostfor today's Producing Confidence
podcast, and joining me isDonald Nolan.
Donald is Operations Managerfor Project Controls at
Performance Energy Services atDanos Company.
Donald joined the Danos Groupin January 2024 and has over 20
years of industry experience,with over 15 years dedicated to
(00:22):
planning and scheduling.
Welcome Donald.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thanks for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Glad to have you here .
So, for someone who's notfamiliar, tell us what exactly
is Project Controls and why isit so critical.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Project Controls is somewhat interesting the way
that the term controls.
We actually don't controlanything in what we do in the
organization, but we're really adiagnostic in explaining where
we've been in the past, where weare in the present and where
we're going in the future oneach individual project.
And it's going to be threepieces to that it's the planning
(00:59):
, it's the scheduling and thenit's the cost controls.
And those three items combinedare what make project controls.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Got it.
So how does project controlsand our team support our clients
behind the scenes?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
So what we're able to do is we're able to give our
client a look into what's goingwell or what did not go well in
their projects and they can makechanges in the present.
They can look at past issuesthat they've had, make those
corrections in real time.
(01:36):
So what we the value we reallyoffer to the client is giving
them the ability to be able toimprove each individual project
and their bottom line associatedwith it.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Got it.
So if someone calls you at thebeginning of a project, how
would that play out?
What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
So it really starts with planning.
Like that's where everythingbegins, and very much like a
computer program or anything.
It's only as good as the datathat you put into the beginning.
So planning is where we wouldstart.
We would sit down with theclient, really discuss like
(02:18):
their front end loading, likewhat needs to be done on the
project.
Is planning complete or not?
If it's not complete, we couldoffer that service to them as
planners.
And then it kind of moves inafter the planning into the
scheduling phase.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Gotcha, and so can you talk about how the
scheduling and cost trackingreally keeps the projects
aligned with the clientexpectations and implementing
that value of service that weprovide and implementing?
Speaker 2 (02:43):
that value of service that we provide.
Yeah, so scheduling and costcontrols work hand-in-hand with
one another.
So scheduling, we're talkingabout time, how time elapses
throughout the project, the flowof work happening in that space
, and then cost controls aregoing to be layered over the top
(03:06):
of the schedule to let you knowhow much money is being spent
in that time.
Obviously, time is money in ourbusinesses, in all businesses,
and cost increase can happen dueto a number of different
reasons.
Number one is duration.
Duration increasing and havingthe same workload.
(03:27):
So what schedule is able to do?
We're able to look at the cost,talk to the client and find out
ways that we can reduce thatduration while still giving them
the end value of having acompleted project.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Got it, and so we're talking about, you know, a lot
of money, as you mentioned, alot of time, a lot of moving
pieces.
What are some of the biggestchallenges that come up with
project controls?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
You know, I wouldn't think that project controls
would exist in a perfect world.
That is, that is what we do.
We are continually able to makechanges on the fly.
And give you a good example ofthat hurricanes.
I mean, that's something thatwe deal with here in South
(04:18):
Louisiana and it's absolutelymakes a great impact on work
that's being done, especially ifyou have a condensed timeline
that you're working, such as aturnaround or a major project,
and then you have a hurricanethat shuts you down for could be
anywhere from five days tothree weeks, how do you get the
(04:41):
client back up and running in atimely fashion?
So project controls we're thatdiagnostic where they can go in.
We can evaluate the scope ofwork that's remaining, and
there's a couple different waysthat you can decrease that
duration.
One is we could add more peopleif density will allow us to do
(05:03):
that add more people if densitywill allow us to do that.
And the second way is we can gowith the client and we can do a
scope evaluation like whatitems are of the highest risk,
and we can go through those riskrankings with the planners and
actually reduce some of thatwork scope for them that we
(05:23):
could be doing at a later date.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
So I imagine working down here in South Louisiana
you've run into a hurricane ortwo.
Is there anything else thatsticks out?
You know how you were able tohelp a customer in that
situation or what that lookslike.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Yeah.
So I think the last one that Ireally remember that sticks out
in my mind was Katrina, andGustav Devastated us as a state
and a lot of these, the plantsand facilities that we were
working in, I mean completelyshut them down.
(06:01):
So Gustav probably I meanKatrina was just a, it was a
game ender for for a lot offacilities, but Gustav sticks
out probably as the one that hadthe greatest impact on Tom.
Uh, we were working for afacility working two large
(06:21):
heaters and Gustav took placeand we were shut down for about
seven days.
I don't exactly remember theexact dollar amount that it cost
for that plant to be down, butI'm pretty sure it was six
digits or greater per day forthem being down.
Yeah, so we went in, sat downwith their team, we somewhat did
(06:47):
a little triage on what wastaking place and we went in and
we actually did a scope reviewand we were able to break out a
piece of risk management thatthey had that they needed to
work on and move it to a laterdate where we could still get
everything done inside of theirwindows so they could get back
up and running.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
I'm sure that was a lot of sweat and a lot of brain
power, manpower going into allthat.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Again, it's quality planning on the front end their
facility worked reallyhand-in-hand with us at that
time and the quality of yourplan.
If you don't have a qualityplan going in, there's no way of
(07:40):
you knowing what you can remove, what you can't remove, the
durations knowing exactdurations on when things are
going to take place and wherethey're going to take place
inside the schedule.
So I really can't speak enoughabout planning and how important
it is on the front end.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Yeah, so really important to not just call
someone when you've got theseproblems, but to get ahead of it
so you can plan the projectfrom the beginning.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Absolutely.
Yeah, proactive is you have tobe.
But I'll tell you this, ourindustry, we're very reactive
sometimes because we just don'thave any other choice.
So again I got to you know,beat that horse of planning.
You have to have the rightpeople in the right positions
(08:20):
and that's the only way that youcan handle these reactive
issues.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Got it.
So let's talk about scalability.
You know these project controlsand planning logistics.
It's not just for these huge,you know facilities.
When hurricanes happen, what'sthat look like for a smaller
customer?
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Well, that's the beauty of project controls and
what we do Depending on howlarge that your project, that
you're working.
And whenever we talk about size, a lot of times it's not just
dollar figures, it could just bethe scope of work in and of
itself.
Like, how big is the scope ofwork?
Uh, depending?
(09:02):
I mean you could.
You could have a project thatjust has one, one person that's
that's running your schedule, um, also doing your, your cost
tracking.
But I really think that it'sscalable because of the system
that we use, having thatframework of planning schedule,
(09:28):
cost and our people, havingpeople that are cross-trained,
that are able to do thosedifferent items.
That adds value to the clientbecause instead of having three
people, now that we can do itwith one.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
So when you talk about the system, are you
talking specifically about thatprocess that you mentioned,
those three steps?
Are you speaking about aspecific technology or just the
way that our team runs it?
Speaker 2 (09:50):
It's our process, it's our team, the way our team
runs it.
I would love to say that I comeup with it, but I did not.
It's an industry standard.
I come up with it, but I didnot.
It's an industry standard.
I think of a good analogy.
I mean everyone cooks ajambalaya a little differently,
you know, but how do you getthere and how consistent are you
(10:11):
in it?
And again, I mean I can't sayenough about our people.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
It really all Some of the best jambalaya right,
that's it.
That's it Got it.
So how does our team, theproject control team, work
alongside operations and safetyand engineering?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
The more years that I have in the industry, the more
I'm learning and I'm growingit's very interesting of how
important that a schedule is forsafety.
So, first and foremost,whenever I think safety and I'm
thinking about a client, I'mthinking process safety.
(10:52):
And from a process safetystandpoint, when are we coming
down?
When are we shutting down what?
What valving is going to beblocked in?
Uh, what needs to be blinded,that blind structure?
Uh, all of that is going to.
The schedule is going to lay itout in individual hours and
days and when those thingshappen.
(11:14):
So the value it really adds itallows you to sit down and have
a discussion with the operationsfolks and we can actually talk
about what's happening when, uh,we can talk about criticality
of of what's the most importantitem that we're blocking in,
what's the most dangerous, uh.
So, from a process safetystandpoint, working closely with
(11:37):
operations, I'm kind of puttingtwo together right there very,
very critical in a turnaroundschedule, especially from a
safety standpoint.
One of the things that I liketo do is I like to do a overall
risk review of individual workitems and what we've done in the
(12:00):
past is we will actually codeinside of our schedule what we
call them, we call them stickywith PES, the industry, we would
call it life-saving rules andwhat we'll have is like working
from heights, blunt force trauma, heights, blunt force trauma,
(12:25):
the vehicles or heavy equipmentand a safety person's able to go
in and look at that scheduleand they're able to filter out
by what is my highest risk itemsI really need to be paying
attention to for the next threeshifts.
So I really think that's wherethat probably comes into play.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
And you talked about breaking down the schedule down
to the day, down to the hour.
I'm sure things change, thingshappen.
What does it look like whenyour team has to go in and
reevaluate, reassess?
Does that happen often?
What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (12:51):
So again we go back to the hurricane discussion
discussion we would call it awhat-if scenario is probably the
most common item in those.
So what would happen is,whenever you have an issue or
(13:16):
you think you have an impendingissue that's going to be coming
in the next 12 hours shift,however you're looking at it,
we're able to go in and we'reable to build a what-if schedule
that tells the client what ifthis happens?
What changes, how is that goingto affect the end goal?
So your cost is going to beoverlaid in that what if
(13:40):
schedule.
But building what if schedules,discussing with the client in
real time about what's going topotentially happen in the future
or what is currently happeningin the present, that's going to
have an impact on it.
That's how we're able to addvalue.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
And what role does technology play, particularly
how you're able to communicatethat to the customers.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
How we deliver the data.
So Primavera software isindustry standard.
It is, since I think I've beenoperating in Primavera since
1999, 2000.
So over 25 years the softwarehas been in use.
(14:24):
But the way that you explainthat, how that data is delivered
to the client I mean, if youlook at a Primavera schedule,
sometimes it just looks like aforeign language for those that
haven't seen it it really is.
It's tough.
Even for people that workinside of the program every day.
(14:45):
It can be a little daunting totry to get data out of it.
So our scheduler is one of thethings that we do.
Not only do we teach them howto operate inside of the system,
but we also have a system onthe back end of how we deliver
the data to the client.
We clean it up, we make it mucheasier to understand and read.
We're able to do those reviewswith the client.
(15:09):
Ai is probably the next well, no, it is the next frontier in
what we do do.
One of the things I see as thebig value add from AI is us
being able to analyze data andgive the client an answer much
(15:30):
faster.
Are we there yet?
No, this is something thatwe're looking into and trying to
understand where do we fit inthis AI world.
But I see the future for usbeing able to analyze data and
give client feedback much morequickly than humans are able to
do it with AI.
I don't think we'll ever replacethe human element and that's
(15:55):
not me selfishly saying thatbecause we have people and
people are our most importantresource here but I don't think
we'll ever replace people whenit comes actually to the
scheduling and the planning.
Just because you're talkingabout time, you're talking about
geographic locations, you'reactually having to look and make
(16:16):
assessments on the ground.
But I do think there is a spacefor us for being able to
analyze that data on the backend, even reporting I mean,
that's some Power BI mixed withAI and us being able to give the
client just a much more quickerand cleaned up, more concise
(16:38):
reporting structure with it.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
So when we talk about , I guess, what you see for the
future of your group evolvingwith that technology and taking
on more complex projects whatdoes that look like?
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It is interesting to see the journey that every
client is on and where they'reat, and project controls.
Some of our clients are at alevel one and some of our
clients are at a level 10.
In between the two, it is thetechnology that is consistently
(17:19):
evolving and I really think thatwe just have to stay on top of
these new innovations.
I talked about clients being ata 1 and at a 10.
It's because whenever you askme that question, some people
are not even beginning to starttrack calls finding out where
they're at on projects.
(17:39):
To start track calls findingout where they're at on projects
.
Prior to my working with Danosand with PES, that is one of the
things that I would do.
Working in my current job is Iwould go to different sites and
actually explain to them and letthem understand how easy it is
just to manage your projectsmore effectively and how much
(18:02):
money it saves you on the backend.
So I was blessed to be able tolearn that the technology piece
it's continuously changing.
The technology piece it'scontinuously changing.
Primavera, I think, has wentthrough 10 to 12 different
variations of it since 19.
I was in it in 98.
(18:22):
I think it was around 92 or 93when the software started
Microsoft Excel, I mean, one ofthe most powerful tools that we
use.
We use that for all of ourreporting.
Excel today is a much differentbeast than it was whenever I
(18:43):
dealt with it when I learnedthis industry 18 years ago.
So we just really try to stayon top of that technology.
The clients push us A lot oftimes.
They'll be changing to a newversion of Primavera which
forces us to be able to go andlearn the new ways.
It's managing change withtechnology.
(19:05):
That's probably the toughestthing we do in our industry.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
I'm sure the technology is constantly
evolving.
Going back to what you saidabout how you know when you got
started, how it was different,how Primavera's changed and how
also just Primavera's reading adifferent language to people who
don't know about it, if someonewas interested in getting into
project controls, what routewould they take or what would
(19:30):
that look like?
Speaker 2 (19:31):
This is my favorite conversation.
So in today's time, you know, alot of the folks that we're
picking up and bringing into theorganization are that
demographic of the 24 to 35.
(19:52):
They're coming out of college,they're having a construction
management degree and they'recoming in and then we're
training them the field so theyunderstand what's happening in
the field.
My passion is finding peoplefrom the field and teaching them
the project management and theproject control piece.
(20:14):
I think there's a lot of valuein our men and women, craftsmen,
that are working in the field.
They have a lot of years, theyhave a lot of knowledge, a lot
of understanding of what's goingon, and you must capture that
value and there's two waysyou're going to do it.
You're either going to try tohave a conversation with those
(20:34):
folks and extract informationout of them, or you can bring
them on the team, teach them ourprocess and our technology that
we use, and then we get toextract that value out of them
that they have that someone inthe field to get into this if
(20:57):
they're interested in it.
Is they really need to getMicrosoft Excel in their toolbox
?
That's really it.
That's where it all begins,primavera, if you look at the
(21:21):
system and how it works.
It is bits and pieces ofMicrosoft Excel that has been
tailor fit into just buildingthe schedule.
So I really think going andgetting some Excel classes for
those men and women craftsmenthat are working in the field,
if they want to be able to getinto this world, I think
Microsoft Excel is a great start.
Primavera.
(21:43):
It's not something I usuallytell folks to just go out there
and take this class and try tolearn it.
It would be the equivalent ofsomeone teaching me open heart
surgery without me knowinganything or the other pieces of
it.
I can do it, but I'm probablynot going to be as effective as
I could be, and so I thinkMicrosoft Excel for beginners,
(22:03):
that's what's done.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
And there's a lot of online courses for just
Microsoft.
Excel that anyone could take.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Absolutely.
And again I mean we love ourpeople.
I really love to see peopletake that initiative and go
learn it and say, hey, I've gotthis in my toolbox.
I've also got five to ten yearsexperience in the field.
Can you help me?
Can we like learn this together?
(22:28):
And it's a lot of value incapturing that knowledge.
A lot of value in capturingthat knowledge.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, a lot of experience that you're not going
to get anywhere else other thanjust working out in the field.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
That's it.
You got to have a few sunburnsand a few blisters.
And you know, I'll give you agood example, a great example.
I can teach someone to plan.
We can show someone how to plan.
They can understand how muchtime it's going to take to fit a
(23:02):
12-inch pipe, how much timeit's going to take to do a weld.
But what you don't know is howdoes heat affect you in doing
those items?
And until you've been out therein the field, heat affect you
in doing those items and untilyou've been out there in the
field, I can't tell you how manyconversations and little
battles that I've had to mediatein between folks that
understand how much time ittakes but don't understand.
(23:26):
It's not about that.
You could double the durationof a task working in a 103
degree heat index, cold weather.
I went and worked up north infreezing temperatures, which is
something that I had never donebefore, and I had to go back to
(23:49):
school.
I had to learn.
A steam leak here really meansnothing to us.
I mean local plants andfacilities around us.
Whenever you have a steam leak,it's just you know another day,
no big issue, it gets fixedover time.
It usually is ranked extremelylow on their priority task, but
(24:10):
a steam leak in New Jersey cancause a ice block as big as a
Volkswagen.
It's a safety hazard.
It's an issue.
The added weight that's addedfrom that.
You can't teach that in school.
Those are things that you gotto see yourself.
So I hope I was able to answerthat Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yes, thank you.
And so for employees andcustomers who may not interact
directly with Project Controls,what's one thing you want them
to know about the value thatyour team brings?
Speaker 2 (24:45):
I'm going to say we can let you see the future, we
can correct your issues from thepast and we can help you work
inside of the present moreeffectively.
How wonderful is it to be ableto have a crystal ball, to be
able to know where you're goingwith a certain level of accuracy
(25:07):
one month out, one day out,half a shift out.
That is the value that we add,and then, on top of that, we're
able to work with the customerand show them what's that going
to do to the bottom line of theproject.
(25:28):
How is that going to affectcost?
If we decide to make thischange, is it going to cost us
more money?
Is it going to cost us lessmoney?
Where does that fall out at?
In large organizations that arespending hundreds of thousands
of dollars a month?
It allows them to be morerateable with their cost.
(25:48):
A lot of times they're dealingwith shareholders and they have
to understand where they'regoing to be at a minute's notice
with their financials, andproject controls gives them that
value on their projects.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
So your team is offering a lot of value.
Clearly, you've helped meunderstand a lot about project
controls, something that Ididn't know a lot about before,
so thank you so much for joiningus.
Is there anything else youwanted to add?
Speaker 2 (26:14):
I think the last thing is probably just people.
I mean, you can have thegreatest of tools, you can have
the greatest of process, butwhat I value about this company
and what I value the most in myorganization is our people, and
(26:36):
it's one of our core values atDanos and at PES, and it's
something that I strive toimprove on.
Not only are we deliveringthese projects on time, ahead of
schedule or behind schedule Godforbid if something happens
we're also developing people,and I think if you are not
(26:58):
putting that at the top of yourlist in an organization, you're
missing the boat, so to speak.
So people I think that's themost important thing to end with
.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
Yeah, absolutely, Thank you.
You really helped me tie thatup together, throwing our
purpose in there.
Honor God.
Develop great people to solvebig challenges for our customers
and communities.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
Thank you so much, donald, appreciate you being
here.
Welcome everyone.
Thank you for joining us today.
I'm Samantha McGee, your hostfor today's Producing Confidence
podcast, and joining me isDonald Nolan.
Donald is Operations Managerfor Project Controls at
Performance Energy Services atDanos Company.
Donald joined the Danos Groupin January 2024 and has over 20
years of industry experience,with over 15 years dedicated to
(00:22):
planning and scheduling.
Welcome Donald.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thanks for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Glad to have you here .
So, for someone who's notfamiliar, tell us what exactly
is Project Controls and why isit so critical.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Project Controls is somewhat interesting the way
that the term controls.
We actually don't controlanything in what we do in the
organization, but we're really adiagnostic in explaining where
we've been in the past, where weare in the present and where
we're going in the future oneach individual project.
And it's going to be threepieces to that it's the planning
(00:59):
, it's the scheduling and thenit's the cost controls.
And those three items combinedare what make project controls.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Got it.
So how does project controlsand our team support our clients
behind the scenes?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
So what we're able to do is we're able to give our
client a look into what's goingwell or what did not go well in
their projects and they can makechanges in the present.
They can look at past issuesthat they've had, make those
corrections in real time.
(01:36):
So what we the value we reallyoffer to the client is giving
them the ability to be able toimprove each individual project
and their bottom line associatedwith it.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Got it.
So if someone calls you at thebeginning of a project, how
would that play out?
What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
So it really starts with planning.
Like that's where everythingbegins, and very much like a
computer program or anything.
It's only as good as the datathat you put into the beginning.
So planning is where we wouldstart.
We would sit down with theclient, really discuss like
(02:18):
their front end loading, likewhat needs to be done on the
project.
Is planning complete or not?
If it's not complete, we couldoffer that service to them as
planners.
And then it kind of moves inafter the planning into the
scheduling phase.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Gotcha, and so can you talk about how the
scheduling and cost trackingreally keeps the projects
aligned with the clientexpectations and implementing
that value of service that weprovide and implementing?
Speaker 2 (02:43):
that value of service that we provide.
Yeah, so scheduling and costcontrols work hand-in-hand with
one another.
So scheduling, we're talkingabout time, how time elapses
throughout the project, the flowof work happening in that space
, and then cost controls aregoing to be layered over the top
(03:06):
of the schedule to let you knowhow much money is being spent
in that time.
Obviously, time is money in ourbusinesses, in all businesses,
and cost increase can happen dueto a number of different
reasons.
Number one is duration.
Duration increasing and havingthe same workload.
(03:27):
So what schedule is able to do?
We're able to look at the cost,talk to the client and find out
ways that we can reduce thatduration while still giving them
the end value of having acompleted project.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Got it, and so we're talking about, you know, a lot
of money, as you mentioned, alot of time, a lot of moving
pieces.
What are some of the biggestchallenges that come up with
project controls?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
You know, I wouldn't think that project controls
would exist in a perfect world.
That is, that is what we do.
We are continually able to makechanges on the fly.
And give you a good example ofthat hurricanes.
I mean, that's something thatwe deal with here in South
(04:18):
Louisiana and it's absolutelymakes a great impact on work
that's being done, especially ifyou have a condensed timeline
that you're working, such as aturnaround or a major project,
and then you have a hurricanethat shuts you down for could be
anywhere from five days tothree weeks, how do you get the
(04:41):
client back up and running in atimely fashion?
So project controls we're thatdiagnostic where they can go in.
We can evaluate the scope ofwork that's remaining, and
there's a couple different waysthat you can decrease that
duration.
One is we could add more peopleif density will allow us to do
(05:03):
that add more people if densitywill allow us to do that.
And the second way is we can gowith the client and we can do a
scope evaluation like whatitems are of the highest risk,
and we can go through those riskrankings with the planners and
actually reduce some of thatwork scope for them that we
(05:23):
could be doing at a later date.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
So I imagine working down here in South Louisiana
you've run into a hurricane ortwo.
Is there anything else thatsticks out?
You know how you were able tohelp a customer in that
situation or what that lookslike.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Yeah.
So I think the last one that Ireally remember that sticks out
in my mind was Katrina, andGustav Devastated us as a state
and a lot of these, the plantsand facilities that we were
working in, I mean completelyshut them down.
(06:01):
So Gustav probably I meanKatrina was just a, it was a
game ender for for a lot offacilities, but Gustav sticks
out probably as the one that hadthe greatest impact on Tom.
Uh, we were working for afacility working two large
(06:21):
heaters and Gustav took placeand we were shut down for about
seven days.
I don't exactly remember theexact dollar amount that it cost
for that plant to be down, butI'm pretty sure it was six
digits or greater per day forthem being down.
Yeah, so we went in, sat downwith their team, we somewhat did
(06:47):
a little triage on what wastaking place and we went in and
we actually did a scope reviewand we were able to break out a
piece of risk management thatthey had that they needed to
work on and move it to a laterdate where we could still get
everything done inside of theirwindows so they could get back
up and running.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
I'm sure that was a lot of sweat and a lot of brain
power, manpower going into allthat.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Again, it's quality planning on the front end their
facility worked reallyhand-in-hand with us at that
time and the quality of yourplan.
If you don't have a qualityplan going in, there's no way of
(07:40):
you knowing what you can remove, what you can't remove, the
durations knowing exactdurations on when things are
going to take place and wherethey're going to take place
inside the schedule.
So I really can't speak enoughabout planning and how important
it is on the front end.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Yeah, so really important to not just call
someone when you've got theseproblems, but to get ahead of it
so you can plan the projectfrom the beginning.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Absolutely.
Yeah, proactive is you have tobe.
But I'll tell you this, ourindustry, we're very reactive
sometimes because we just don'thave any other choice.
So again I got to you know,beat that horse of planning.
You have to have the rightpeople in the right positions
(08:20):
and that's the only way that youcan handle these reactive
issues.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Got it.
So let's talk about scalability.
You know these project controlsand planning logistics.
It's not just for these huge,you know facilities.
When hurricanes happen, what'sthat look like for a smaller
customer?
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Well, that's the beauty of project controls and
what we do Depending on howlarge that your project, that
you're working.
And whenever we talk about size, a lot of times it's not just
dollar figures, it could just bethe scope of work in and of
itself.
Like, how big is the scope ofwork?
Uh, depending?
(09:02):
I mean you could.
You could have a project thatjust has one, one person that's
that's running your schedule, um, also doing your, your cost
tracking.
But I really think that it'sscalable because of the system
that we use, having thatframework of planning schedule,
(09:28):
cost and our people, havingpeople that are cross-trained,
that are able to do thosedifferent items.
That adds value to the clientbecause instead of having three
people, now that we can do itwith one.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
So when you talk about the system, are you
talking specifically about thatprocess that you mentioned,
those three steps?
Are you speaking about aspecific technology or just the
way that our team runs it?
Speaker 2 (09:50):
It's our process, it's our team, the way our team
runs it.
I would love to say that I comeup with it, but I did not.
It's an industry standard.
I come up with it, but I didnot.
It's an industry standard.
I think of a good analogy.
I mean everyone cooks ajambalaya a little differently,
you know, but how do you getthere and how consistent are you
(10:11):
in it?
And again, I mean I can't sayenough about our people.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
It really all Some of the best jambalaya right,
that's it.
That's it Got it.
So how does our team, theproject control team, work
alongside operations and safetyand engineering?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
The more years that I have in the industry, the more
I'm learning and I'm growingit's very interesting of how
important that a schedule is forsafety.
So, first and foremost,whenever I think safety and I'm
thinking about a client, I'mthinking process safety.
(10:52):
And from a process safetystandpoint, when are we coming
down?
When are we shutting down what?
What valving is going to beblocked in?
Uh, what needs to be blinded,that blind structure?
Uh, all of that is going to.
The schedule is going to lay itout in individual hours and
days and when those thingshappen.
(11:14):
So the value it really adds itallows you to sit down and have
a discussion with the operationsfolks and we can actually talk
about what's happening when, uh,we can talk about criticality
of of what's the most importantitem that we're blocking in,
what's the most dangerous, uh.
So, from a process safetystandpoint, working closely with
(11:37):
operations, I'm kind of puttingtwo together right there very,
very critical in a turnaroundschedule, especially from a
safety standpoint.
One of the things that I liketo do is I like to do a overall
risk review of individual workitems and what we've done in the
(12:00):
past is we will actually codeinside of our schedule what we
call them, we call them stickywith PES, the industry, we would
call it life-saving rules andwhat we'll have is like working
from heights, blunt force trauma, heights, blunt force trauma,
(12:25):
the vehicles or heavy equipmentand a safety person's able to go
in and look at that scheduleand they're able to filter out
by what is my highest risk itemsI really need to be paying
attention to for the next threeshifts.
So I really think that's wherethat probably comes into play.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
And you talked about breaking down the schedule down
to the day, down to the hour.
I'm sure things change, thingshappen.
What does it look like whenyour team has to go in and
reevaluate, reassess?
Does that happen often?
What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (12:51):
So again we go back to the hurricane discussion
discussion we would call it awhat-if scenario is probably the
most common item in those.
So what would happen is,whenever you have an issue or
(13:16):
you think you have an impendingissue that's going to be coming
in the next 12 hours shift,however you're looking at it,
we're able to go in and we'reable to build a what-if schedule
that tells the client what ifthis happens?
What changes, how is that goingto affect the end goal?
So your cost is going to beoverlaid in that what if
(13:40):
schedule.
But building what if schedules,discussing with the client in
real time about what's going topotentially happen in the future
or what is currently happeningin the present, that's going to
have an impact on it.
That's how we're able to addvalue.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
And what role does technology play, particularly
how you're able to communicatethat to the customers.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
How we deliver the data.
So Primavera software isindustry standard.
It is, since I think I've beenoperating in Primavera since
1999, 2000.
So over 25 years the softwarehas been in use.
(14:24):
But the way that you explainthat, how that data is delivered
to the client I mean, if youlook at a Primavera schedule,
sometimes it just looks like aforeign language for those that
haven't seen it it really is.
It's tough.
Even for people that workinside of the program every day.
(14:45):
It can be a little daunting totry to get data out of it.
So our scheduler is one of thethings that we do.
Not only do we teach them howto operate inside of the system,
but we also have a system onthe back end of how we deliver
the data to the client.
We clean it up, we make it mucheasier to understand and read.
We're able to do those reviewswith the client.
(15:09):
Ai is probably the next well, no, it is the next frontier in
what we do do.
One of the things I see as thebig value add from AI is us
being able to analyze data andgive the client an answer much
(15:30):
faster.
Are we there yet?
No, this is something thatwe're looking into and trying to
understand where do we fit inthis AI world.
But I see the future for usbeing able to analyze data and
give client feedback much morequickly than humans are able to
do it with AI.
I don't think we'll ever replacethe human element and that's
(15:55):
not me selfishly saying thatbecause we have people and
people are our most importantresource here but I don't think
we'll ever replace people whenit comes actually to the
scheduling and the planning.
Just because you're talkingabout time, you're talking about
geographic locations, you'reactually having to look and make
(16:16):
assessments on the ground.
But I do think there is a spacefor us for being able to
analyze that data on the backend, even reporting I mean,
that's some Power BI mixed withAI and us being able to give the
client just a much more quickerand cleaned up, more concise
(16:38):
reporting structure with it.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
So when we talk about , I guess, what you see for the
future of your group evolvingwith that technology and taking
on more complex projects whatdoes that look like?
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It is interesting to see the journey that every
client is on and where they'reat, and project controls.
Some of our clients are at alevel one and some of our
clients are at a level 10.
In between the two, it is thetechnology that is consistently
(17:19):
evolving and I really think thatwe just have to stay on top of
these new innovations.
I talked about clients being ata 1 and at a 10.
It's because whenever you askme that question, some people
are not even beginning to starttrack calls finding out where
they're at on projects.
(17:39):
To start track calls findingout where they're at on projects
.
Prior to my working with Danosand with PES, that is one of the
things that I would do.
Working in my current job is Iwould go to different sites and
actually explain to them and letthem understand how easy it is
just to manage your projectsmore effectively and how much
(18:02):
money it saves you on the backend.
So I was blessed to be able tolearn that the technology piece
it's continuously changing.
The technology piece it'scontinuously changing.
Primavera, I think, has wentthrough 10 to 12 different
variations of it since 19.
I was in it in 98.
(18:22):
I think it was around 92 or 93when the software started
Microsoft Excel, I mean, one ofthe most powerful tools that we
use.
We use that for all of ourreporting.
Excel today is a much differentbeast than it was whenever I
(18:43):
dealt with it when I learnedthis industry 18 years ago.
So we just really try to stayon top of that technology.
The clients push us A lot oftimes.
They'll be changing to a newversion of Primavera which
forces us to be able to go andlearn the new ways.
It's managing change withtechnology.
(19:05):
That's probably the toughestthing we do in our industry.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
I'm sure the technology is constantly
evolving.
Going back to what you saidabout how you know when you got
started, how it was different,how Primavera's changed and how
also just Primavera's reading adifferent language to people who
don't know about it, if someonewas interested in getting into
project controls, what routewould they take or what would
(19:30):
that look like?
Speaker 2 (19:31):
This is my favorite conversation.
So in today's time, you know, alot of the folks that we're
picking up and bringing into theorganization are that
demographic of the 24 to 35.
(19:52):
They're coming out of college,they're having a construction
management degree and they'recoming in and then we're
training them the field so theyunderstand what's happening in
the field.
My passion is finding peoplefrom the field and teaching them
the project management and theproject control piece.
(20:14):
I think there's a lot of valuein our men and women, craftsmen,
that are working in the field.
They have a lot of years, theyhave a lot of knowledge, a lot
of understanding of what's goingon, and you must capture that
value and there's two waysyou're going to do it.
You're either going to try tohave a conversation with those
(20:34):
folks and extract informationout of them, or you can bring
them on the team, teach them ourprocess and our technology that
we use, and then we get toextract that value out of them
that they have that someone inthe field to get into this if
(20:57):
they're interested in it.
Is they really need to getMicrosoft Excel in their toolbox
?
That's really it.
That's where it all begins,primavera, if you look at the
(21:21):
system and how it works.
It is bits and pieces ofMicrosoft Excel that has been
tailor fit into just buildingthe schedule.
So I really think going andgetting some Excel classes for
those men and women craftsmenthat are working in the field,
if they want to be able to getinto this world, I think
Microsoft Excel is a great start.
Primavera.
(21:43):
It's not something I usuallytell folks to just go out there
and take this class and try tolearn it.
It would be the equivalent ofsomeone teaching me open heart
surgery without me knowinganything or the other pieces of
it.
I can do it, but I'm probablynot going to be as effective as
I could be, and so I thinkMicrosoft Excel for beginners,
(22:03):
that's what's done.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
And there's a lot of online courses for just
Microsoft.
Excel that anyone could take.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Absolutely.
And again I mean we love ourpeople.
I really love to see peopletake that initiative and go
learn it and say, hey, I've gotthis in my toolbox.
I've also got five to ten yearsexperience in the field.
Can you help me?
Can we like learn this together?
(22:28):
And it's a lot of value incapturing that knowledge.
A lot of value in capturingthat knowledge.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Yeah, a lot of experience that you're not going
to get anywhere else other thanjust working out in the field.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
That's it.
You got to have a few sunburnsand a few blisters.
And you know, I'll give you agood example, a great example.
I can teach someone to plan.
We can show someone how to plan.
They can understand how muchtime it's going to take to fit a
(23:02):
12-inch pipe, how much timeit's going to take to do a weld.
But what you don't know is howdoes heat affect you in doing
those items?
And until you've been out therein the field, heat affect you
in doing those items and untilyou've been out there in the
field, I can't tell you how manyconversations and little
battles that I've had to mediatein between folks that
understand how much time ittakes but don't understand.
(23:26):
It's not about that.
You could double the durationof a task working in a 103
degree heat index, cold weather.
I went and worked up north infreezing temperatures, which is
something that I had never donebefore, and I had to go back to
(23:49):
school.
I had to learn.
A steam leak here really meansnothing to us.
I mean local plants andfacilities around us.
Whenever you have a steam leak,it's just you know another day,
no big issue, it gets fixedover time.
It usually is ranked extremelylow on their priority task, but
(24:10):
a steam leak in New Jersey cancause a ice block as big as a
Volkswagen.
It's a safety hazard.
It's an issue.
The added weight that's addedfrom that.
You can't teach that in school.
Those are things that you gotto see yourself.
So I hope I was able to answerthat Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yes, thank you.
And so for employees andcustomers who may not interact
directly with Project Controls,what's one thing you want them
to know about the value thatyour team brings?
Speaker 2 (24:45):
I'm going to say we can let you see the future, we
can correct your issues from thepast and we can help you work
inside of the present moreeffectively.
How wonderful is it to be ableto have a crystal ball, to be
able to know where you're goingwith a certain level of accuracy
(25:07):
one month out, one day out,half a shift out.
That is the value that we add,and then, on top of that, we're
able to work with the customerand show them what's that going
to do to the bottom line of theproject.
(25:28):
How is that going to affectcost?
If we decide to make thischange, is it going to cost us
more money?
Is it going to cost us lessmoney?
Where does that fall out at?
In large organizations that arespending hundreds of thousands
of dollars a month?
It allows them to be morerateable with their cost.
(25:48):
A lot of times they're dealingwith shareholders and they have
to understand where they'regoing to be at a minute's notice
with their financials, andproject controls gives them that
value on their projects.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
So your team is offering a lot of value.
Clearly, you've helped meunderstand a lot about project
controls, something that Ididn't know a lot about before,
so thank you so much for joiningus.
Is there anything else youwanted to add?
Speaker 2 (26:14):
I think the last thing is probably just people.
I mean, you can have thegreatest of tools, you can have
the greatest of process, butwhat I value about this company
and what I value the most in myorganization is our people, and
(26:36):
it's one of our core values atDanos and at PES, and it's
something that I strive toimprove on.
Not only are we deliveringthese projects on time, ahead of
schedule or behind schedule Godforbid if something happens
we're also developing people,and I think if you are not
(26:58):
putting that at the top of yourlist in an organization, you're
missing the boat, so to speak.
So people I think that's themost important thing to end with
.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
Yeah, absolutely, Thank you.
You really helped me tie thatup together, throwing our
purpose in there.
Honor God.
Develop great people to solvebig challenges for our customers
and communities.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
Thank you so much, donald, appreciate you being
here.
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