August 3, 2024 • 30 mins
Unlock the secrets to transforming educational environments with the Leader in Me system, inspired by the renowned seven habits of highly effective people. Join us for an enlightening conversation with Amanda McGovern, a seasoned educational leader and professional learning officer. She shares her incredible journey from classroom teaching to her impactful role as a coach and consultant for Franklin Covey in Australia and New Zealand. Amanda reveals how the Leader in Me seamlessly integrates with existing school processes to boost academic achievement, leadership skills, and school culture.
Discover how the Leader in Me framework shifts paradigms in education, fostering leadership, a high-trust culture, and self-directed learning among students and staff alike. Amanda provides compelling personal stories about embracing an abundance mindset and initiating change from within. She also shares insights from over 100 independent studies that validate the significant positive impacts of the Leader in Me on school communities, from improved school climates to better student behavior and increased attendance.
Curious about implementing these transformative principles in your school? We delve into the comprehensive support mechanisms available for schools adopting the Leader in Me program, including high-quality professional learning options and personalized coaching. With success stories from over 5,000 schools worldwide, Amanda offers valuable guidance for educational leaders eager to enhance their school culture and leadership development. Tune in to learn how the Leader in Me can create lasting benefits for your entire school community.
Further information about Leader in Me can be found via:
https://www.leaderinme.com/
Links and References:
To view our Professional Learning Offerings, visit:
https://www.nswppa.org.au/professional-learning
To view our latest offerings, visit: https://www.nswppa.org.au/catalogue
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Drew (00:00):
Hello and welcome to Season 2 of the Principal
Learnings Podcast.
If you're a principal oreducational leader looking to
enhance your skills, this is theplace for you, so let's get
into it.
Let's embark on this learningjourney together.
Welcome to today's episode.
We're diving into thetransformative power of the
(00:22):
seven habits of highly effectivepeople and how these principles
are being embraced by thousandsof schools worldwide.
Partnering with us on thisjourney is Franklin Covey, a
global leader in professionaldevelopment.
Through their Leader in Meprogram, they're building
leadership in students,fostering high trust cultures
(00:43):
and boosting academicachievement.
Amanda (00:46):
When you work in Leader in Me school, you work with a
client partner and a coach todevelop your action plan and a
typical implementation cycle isup to three years.
But schools again will work attheir own pace.
Drew (01:03):
Today we're thrilled to have Amanda McGovern with us.
Amanda brings a wealth ofexperience from the Australian
education sector, having startedas a teacher and moved into
playing a pivotal role inprofessional learning and
leadership strategy developmentas a professional learning
officer for the WesternAustralian Primary Principals
Association.
Amanda (01:22):
There's lots of support mechanisms in place for schools
who choose to come on the Leaderin Me journey.
What's really important torecognise is that implementation
is designed to fit eachindividual school.
Leader in Me will already fitwith any existing processes and
practices and programs that arecurrently at your school level.
(01:44):
So that's why, as a system,it's a system framework that
supports you to achieve all theother things that you're already
doing.
It just makes them evenstronger.
Drew (01:53):
Let's explore the incredible impact of Leader and
Me and hear insights from AmandaMcGovern.
Amanda, welcome to our podcast.
Thrilled to have you here.
Amanda (02:04):
Thanks, Drew.
It's wonderful to be speakingwith you today.
Drew (02:08):
Yeah, sure is.
For those who don't know,Amanda, you work in the
professional learning role, ineducational leadership, but
you're able to share for thoselisteners your background and
your role as Franklin Covey'slead of Australia, New Zealand
leader and coach and facilitator.
Amanda (02:29):
Sure, I've worked in a variety of education roles over
the past 25 years and myjourney's been a little bit
different to many.
I found myself in lots ofdifferent roles, a lot of
diverse roles across my career,but I always seem to be drawn to
the professional learning orcoaching roles in any, I guess,
(02:51):
context that I was working in.
So that started way back in mythird and fourth year of
teaching, where I was asked todeliver some professional
learning to other educators,which I guess terrified me at
the time, but it has set me onthis path of professional
learning.
So I worked in schools for acouple of decades and then the
last five to six years of mycareer working at the Department
(03:14):
of Education, wa.
I worked in our LeadershipInstitute, which was the, I
guess, the main professionallearning centre of the WA branch
of the Education Department.
So in that role I worked as acoach, a facilitator,
coordinator and researcher and aconsultant across many both
teaching and leadershipdevelopment professional
(03:36):
learning suites.
And I learned so much duringthat time that I was able to
trial my skills in anothercontext.
And for the last couple of years, prior to coming into this role
, I worked as the Manager ofProfessional Learning at the
Western Australian PrimaryPrincipals Association, where I
got to really broaden my networkand work with people like you,
(03:59):
Drew, over in New South Wales,but also connecting with
colleagues in Queensland andVictoria and in Canada as well,
which has been amazing, andthrough these connections I
decided, after a little while ofsoul searching, what was next
for me.
I started to develop my ownconsulting business and to
(04:20):
partner with some other greatorganisations who share similar
values to me in education, andso when I was chatting to
Michael from Franklin Coveyabout Leader in Me, it was a
perfect fit for me to come in astheir coach and professional
learning consultant across theteam here in Australia and New
Zealand.
Drew (04:38):
Yeah, fantastic, Amanda, In terms of the leadership
development.
Was there a particular momentor influence in your career that
sparked your passion in thisfield?
Amanda (04:52):
It's been a long journey but I've always had a drive, I
guess, to make things better andreally been, I guess,
influenced by people who havethis real ability to think big.
I guess I really aspire tobeing that myself, so I'm always
looking on the out for thosetypes of people.
And so when I was working in asystem role, this idea of being
(05:14):
able to make connections acrossmultiple systems and
organizations and schools and beable to bring that support to a
larger level is what I'vealways been trying to achieve.
This idea of working andincreasing my sphere of
influence has been something Iguess that's driven me and it
fits really well with the Leaderin Me program.
(05:36):
But I guess one of the biggestthings for me in working in the
Leadership Institute was when wewere working in a very small
team with the director, peterGlenn Denning.
At the time we had a team ofabout nine or 10 of us and we
were really trying to cover andoffer an amazing suite of
programs for the entire WAcontext and during this time,
(05:58):
with limited resources andlimited people, we were
delivering some amazing products.
And so when you're working in ateam like that, you get a ball
of energy and you're able toachieve a lot of things together
.
So I think that ability to beable to achieve big when you
have sometimes a small scalereally makes a difference.
So I'm hoping to be able tocontinue to do that in any way
(06:22):
that I get to work in the future.
Drew (06:24):
Yeah, fantastic.
So, Amanda, I'm really curious.
You mentioned about Leader andMe, and in today's conversation
we're really going to startfocusing in on the Leader and Me
discussion.
Are you able to give us anoverview of what the program is,
as well as its core principles?
Amanda (06:41):
Yeah, absolutely.
I guess we call it a program,but it's not really a program,
it's a system.
Leader in Me is atransformational system, and it
brings together three big areasof academics, leadership and
culture, and so, with this ideaof a system in mind, it really
has the ability to transform aschool culture from the inside
(07:04):
out, with leadership being atits core.
Now, our definition ofleadership is the ability to
communicate people's worth andpotential so clearly that
they're inspired to see it inthemselves, and so, with that as
a foundation in place, youreally see a shift at all levels
of the community, from thestudents themselves, the
teachers and families.
(07:25):
And so, working within thissystem of Leader and Me, each
school is able to work at theirown pace and really implement
the key focus areas ofleadership, culture and
academics, and using a wealth ofonline teaching resources and
coaching support to enable themto achieve their own goals.
But it's really a system ofvoice and agency at its core,
(07:48):
with some incredible resourcesto help each school map its own
journey.
Drew (07:54):
Yeah, so that sounds fascinating.
Let's go into that further.
Amanda, how does the Leader andMe system specifically benefit
students and school communities?
Amanda (08:07):
Yeah, thanks, Drew, Leader and Me is based on a
solid theory of change and ourtheory of change is called the
see-do-get cycle.
Rather than basing whole schoolchanges on just trying to shift
behaviors alone, this modelsupports a shift in paradigms.
So paradigms are the way we seeand make sense and interpret
(08:27):
the world, and the Leader in Mesupports a shift at a paradigm
level across five core areas ofleadership potential change,
motivation and education.
And as we support these shiftsin the way people see and think
they're able to implement somekey practices across those three
(08:51):
areas of leadership, cultureand academics to support
transformation.
And so in our See Do Get cyclewe support the see, we provide
some resources for what to do inthat behaviour change.
But what we're looking for, theresults we're hoping to get,
are highly effective studentsand adults who are leaders in
their school and theircommunities.
We're wanting to get a hightrust culture where everyone's
(09:14):
voice is heard and the potentialis affirmed, and we also want
to get in the academic spaceengaged students who are
equipped to achieve andentrusted to lead their own
learning.
So that's really what we'relooking for across the see do
get cycle and with the paradigmchange, behavior change, and
those are the results that we'rehoping to achieve.
(09:34):
It's got a lot of frameworks tosupport that shift even further.
So another wonderful frameworkthat we have in Leader and Me is
the maturity continuum, andpeople who are familiar with the
seven habits of highlyeffective people will be
familiar with this.
But we utilize this frameworkto help students and also staff,
and also parents andcommunities, to be able to lead
(09:58):
self and then to lead others.
So this idea of interpersonalgrowth and then being able to
work with others and reallycollaborate in a truly effective
way is another great frameworkthat we utilise in the program
to support that shift across.
So we talk a lot about wantingto engage student voice and
(10:20):
agency in schools, voice andagency in schools, and it's
really difficult to do thatwithout changing the way we all
think and see and what thepossibilities of education are.
So this quite holistic approachreally supports and gives all
levels of school communities thetools to really support that
change.
Drew (10:42):
Yeah, I mean.
There's so much there, Amanda,to unpack.
You mentioned paradigms.
You also mentioned seven habitsYou've implemented Leader and
Me.
From a personal experience, howhas this framework Leader and
(11:03):
Me influenced your ownleadership style and your
professional growth?
Amanda (11:07):
Yeah, thank you.
That's a great question, Drew.
Within the framework itself andbased on the maturity continuum
and I did mention earlier thatit does have the seven habits of
highly effective people at itscore.
I guess, personally andprofessionally, some of those
key attributes and those keypractices within the seven
(11:28):
habits has had a significanteffect on me both personally and
professionally.
A couple that really I guessspring to mind in my own journey
is one of the ones.
That's one of my favorite in.
Habit four is the abundancemindset and so being able to
(11:49):
curate for yourself an abundancemindset rather than thinking in
a scarcity mindset.
So I often work with leadersacross many schools and this
fundamental change from aparadigm, from going from a
scarcity mindset to an abundancemindset, really makes a
difference about what we canachieve together.
(12:11):
So, rather than thinking incompetition, we're thinking of
how do we work together and whatare the possibilities that are
open to me.
And that one mindset has had amassive change in my own career
professionally.
This idea that change startswith me is also a really key one
.
Rather than waiting for changeto happen out there, I have the
(12:33):
ability, within my own sphere ofinfluence, to change what I'd
like to see out there in theworld.
So it's quite an empoweringparadigm to work from within.
That change starts with me, sothat's another one that's had a
significant impact on me.
And then, finally, this idea ofbeing able to synergize with
others.
We talk about collaboration alot in education, but we often
(12:58):
don't have the tools and the keyunderstandings of what it
really means to trulycollaborate, and in Leader, in
Me, we call that synergize.
When one person's idea plusanother person's idea is more
than just one plus one equalstwo.
It could be one plus one equalsfive or 10 or 100.
This is the idea of reallyunleashing potential in people
(13:21):
when we have the abilities andthe mindsets to be able to work
together effectively.
So, yes, those ones there andmany more have had a really
significant impact on how I amable to work with others, both
personally and professionally.
Drew (13:34):
You could see that passion coming through with that
abundance mindset, thoseparadigms, and you must have so
many positive experiences fromthat and I can really tell
through that synergy and synergywe're having here in terms of
what is possible with Leader andMe.
(13:54):
If we move into now theresearch and impact for people
listening really curious furtherabout Leader and Me, the
research indicates significantbenefits from the Leader in Me
program.
Are you able to delve into someof the findings from recent
studies on the program's impact?
Amanda (14:16):
Oh, absolutely.
Thanks, Drew.
And this one is there's anextensive amount of research in
Leader in Me.
When I'm looking through someof the resources that we have
available on this, we've hadover 100 independent studies
conducted on Leader and Me overthe course of the past decade.
(14:37):
Most of those have beenpeer-reviewed, and a mix of
qualitative and quantitative, Iguess, research has been
conducted.
There's a couple that I mightjust draw your attention to and
there's definitely many outthere, but this one that was
recently conducted in 2023 is ameta-analysis was really able to
(15:01):
identify statisticallysignificant improvements in both
school climate and studentbehaviour as a result of schools
implementing Leader in Me, andwhat it has seen is that at a
whole school community level,there's been quite a significant
shift in school climate andschool culture and a reduction
(15:26):
in high-level student behaviourincidences.
What I find really interestingabout this particular analysis
is that teacher perceptions ofschool climate were the highest,
and that's really significantwhen we think about the
challenges that teachers andprincipals are currently going
(15:47):
through and how challenging alot of our schools are to work
within.
To see that the teachersthemselves rated that the school
climate has had a significantchange really goes to show that
they're going to be able to havea greater impact in everything
they do because the way they'veseen the changes at their school
level is going to enable themto do their work really well.
(16:10):
So that one, I think, is reallysignificant.
Lots of other ones,particularly this other one
recently.
In the last couple of years astudy on attendance Leader in Me
has led to significantincreases in attendance across
schools.
Again, because it goes to thatschool climate, school culture
piece and it gives people thetools to be able to work
(16:34):
together but also reallyunderstand themselves and to, I
guess, becoming a culture whereit's a great place to be.
People want to go to thoseschools, great place to be.
People want to go to thoseschools.
And when I think about thisidea of social-emotional realms,
casel is the world's, I guess,leading foundation on this, the
(16:55):
Collaborative and AcademicSocial and Emotional Learning
Group.
They're the leading authorityin, I guess, social-emotional
learning.
And when you look at what CASELrequires of schools to really
effectively attend to social andemotional learning, leader in
Me is one of the very fewsystems that actually address
(17:18):
all of the aspects of social andemotional learning.
So there's a variety ofresearch out there that supports
that we're making a difference.
Drew (17:25):
So there's a variety of research out there that supports
that we're making a difference.
Yeah, it's in terms of goingback to it's changing the
paradigm, changing that shift,changing that mindset with that
as we went back to earlier inthe conversation really changing
that abundance mindset.
Hence why attendance rates areup because students want to go
(17:49):
to school.
Teachers are enjoying thechange again, changing their
paradigm.
They're really enjoying being ateacher and seeing the success
of the program.
It's really coming through.
Amanda (18:04):
Yeah, Drew, I think with that teacher piece that
teachers always want to go towork and do amazing things.
That's what they all go intothe job for, so it really allows
them to teach kids and that'sreally a significant impact that
we see.
They get to really work withstudents at that social and
(18:24):
emotional level and they can seethe difference they are making
to the lives of their students.
So that really, again, this hasthat really empowering effect.
Drew (18:33):
Yeah sure, sure does Amanda behaviours, as we've said
.
Can you describe some of thelong-term results you've seen or
witnessed in those who havefully embraced this leadership
philosophy?
Amanda (18:53):
Yeah, thank you.
It's really based on thefoundation of Leader in Me.
It is based on the seven habitsof highly effective people and
its principles and its practiceswhen implemented with fidelity,
it can be life-changing.
It's a lifelong journey and ithas the ability to really impact
(19:14):
a life short-term, butdefinitely we're looking for
long term.
Leader in Me is much more than aschool program and the greatest
impacts that I've seen fromprincipals and staff themselves
as they embrace the principlesand practices into their own
life.
I hear from school leadersregularly and overwhelmingly
(19:37):
they see the changes in theirstudents, but they really often
reflect on how those principleshave transformed their own lives
.
They're better parents, they'rebetter partners and they're
better at communicating.
Their leadership skills hasreally developed to that next
level.
They're better listeners andthis flows into their
professional practices.
They get much deepersatisfaction from their work.
(19:59):
So the system itself is aninside out model where, when you
embrace it, you actually do seeimprovements across all aspects
of your life, and so it'sdifficult to really pin down one
particular person that I'veseen change the most, but I've
generally seen many, many peoplereport this back to me
(20:20):
anecdotally over time.
Drew (20:23):
Yeah, how powerful is that in terms of?
It's a professional learningpiece, obviously aimed at school
students, but to hear that,coming through the seven habits
of highly effective peopletransition from into the school
context into people's personallife and the impact that that is
(20:44):
having, how powerful is that?
Amazing to hear In terms ofmoving, shifting into the
resources side of the program,what ongoing support does Leader
in Me provide?
Amanda?
Amanda (21:01):
Yeah, thanks, Drew.
There's lots of supportmechanisms in place for schools
who choose to come on the Leaderin Me journey.
What's really important torecognise is that implementation
is designed to fit eachindividual school.
Leader in Me will already fitwith any existing processes and
practices and programs that arecurrently at your school level.
(21:23):
So that's why, as a system,it's a system framework that
supports you to achieve all theother things that you're already
doing.
It just makes them evenstronger.
When you work in Leader in Meschool, you work in a Leader in
Me school, you work with aclient partner and a coach to
develop your action plan, and atypical implementation cycle is
(21:45):
up to three years.
But schools, again, will work attheir own pace.
Each school will have access tohigh-quality professional
learning.
I think Franklin CoveyProfessional Learning is
probably the highest qualityprofessional learning out there
in the world currently, and youwill have the opportunity to
(22:05):
attend professional learning,whether you want that
face-to-face, online orself-directed online.
And again, we all loveface-to-face, but we know that
we have a challenging timetablesometimes in schools.
But what I do also like to sayhere is that there has been some
(22:26):
pretty bad self-directed onlineprofessional learning over the
years, but this stuff is notthat.
It's really professionallycurated and designed, so it's
quality, whatever direction theschool takes.
Each school will also have anopportunity to work with someone
like me, and most of the timeit is me currently to be able to
(22:46):
set some coaching conversationsthroughout the year.
And again, it's up to theschool how many times they'd
like to work with their coach,but there are some minimum
settings that we will achievetogether across a school year.
So you get lots of coachingsupport.
You've got your ownprofessional client support in
Clare.
You also have an opportunity towork with the Leader of Me
(23:11):
website.
So when I first go into theLeader of Me website and I think
maybe you've seen it, drewthere are thousands upon
thousands of amazing resourceswithin that.
It's just.
If you let the teachers go inthere, they will just have an
incredible feast of lessons andresearch and I guess scope and
(23:33):
sequences available to them.
I guess scope and sequencesavailable to them, and so we
help guide schools through theresources that are available.
But their online websiteresources are just incredible.
You can press, play and stop onsocial and emotional lessons
across any category for any yearlevel, from early childhood all
(23:54):
the way through to high school,and so the actual resources
themselves are just incredibleon the website and the lesson
space.
But also schools can, if theywant to, access Global Direct,
which also allows them toconnect with schools across the
globe, because there arethousands of schools who are
implementing Leader in Me acrossmany continents, and so there's
(24:17):
an opportunity there to connectwith other schools outside of
Australia as well.
So lots of different ways andlots of different resources are
available, but we map yourjourney and you are able to
implement as much or as littleand as quickly or as slowly as
your school needs to.
Drew (24:35):
Yeah, fantastic, I heard that three years, as well as the
word, obviously, Franklin Covey.
Behind the extensive amount ofresearch and Franklin Covey is
just such a world-classorganization for professional
learning.
In your opinion, Amanda, whatsets the Leader in Me program
(24:57):
apart from other leadershipdevelopment programs?
Amanda (25:02):
Oh yeah, that's a great question.
Apart from all the resourcesavailable that I talked about in
my previous answer, I guesswhat it does is it teaches you,
step by step, how to leadyourself, how to become a better
leader of self, to leadyourself how to become a better
leader of self and then alsothen how to lead others and
become very much more skilled inthis interpersonal management.
(25:23):
So I think I previously talkedabout the importance of student
voice and agency and how that isa real key area of interest in
many of our schools.
This is one of the only systemsthat I've seen Leader in.
This is one of the only systemsthat I've seen.
Leader in Me is one of the onlysystems that I've seen that
actually helps support thatshift required to become a
(25:45):
school that agency and voice area priority, and allows changes
at a whole community level toallow that voice and agency to
thrive.
Drew (25:57):
Yeah, there's a lot of research around student voice
and agency and the fact thatthere's a the Leader In Me.
What I'm hearing, Amanda, isthe how, the how of how that
actually works, how studentvoice and agency can literally
transform the culture.
And, going back to theparadigms, shifting the paradigm
(26:24):
within the school setting yeah,so in the context for our New
South Wales PPA members,listening, educational leaders,
principals who are leadingthey're leading all of these
different, diverse communities.
How could the principles of theLeader in Me be applied to
their context?
Amanda?
Amanda (26:43):
Yeah, absolutely, leader in Me works from that
human-centered paradigm, so it'srelevant across any community.
It currently, as I've mentionedpreviously, it's operating in
over 5,000 schools worldwide.
I work with schools inAustralia and New Zealand, but
we have many, many schools inthe US and across Asia, south
(27:05):
America, europe and Africa, andso we know that it works in a
range of diverse cultures andcommunities, cultures and
communities.
Another great feature of beingable to be able to say that we
work worldwide is that ourresources have already been
translated into multiplelanguages, and so diversity is
(27:26):
really at its core and embracedand celebrated in Leader in Me.
Drew (27:32):
Wow, that's so many schools and it shows the the
success of the program and howit speaks across continents into
different dialects.
So again going back to thatuniversal shift of paradigm from
the center out.
Amanda, for those listening, doyou have any advice for
(27:53):
listeners who are interested inimplementing the Leader in Me
program into their own schools?
Amanda (27:58):
Oh, absolutely, we'd love to have a chat.
We'd love you to either callClaire and have a chat with the
team or come along to anyupcoming information session
that we have going.
We've also got a range ofschools in New South Wales and
also Victoria who haveimplemented Leader in Me and
will be very willing to sharetheir journey with you.
(28:21):
So please get in contact witheither Claire or anyone else
across the team.
You don't have anything to loseby starting.
You're giving yourself the gift.
It's an inside-out model, so itstarts with you, the leader
school staff and then across thecommunity.
So the interpersonal trainingthat you receive in your first
(28:41):
part of the Leader in Me systemwill change you and your school
community.
We've also got a great group ofschool leaders, both in New
South Wales and Victoria, whohave implemented Leader in Me
and they'd be willing to have achat with anyone who's
interested in moving forward.
So get in contact and have achat with us and we're happy to
(29:05):
support any direction you'd liketo go in.
Drew (29:07):
Yeah, absolutely Fantastic , Amanda.
It's a privilege to have timewith you today.
Thanks for joining us andsharing valuable insights on the
Letter and Meet program.
It's clear that this frameworkhas the potential to make a
significant positive impact onyour school community.
Thanks for being with us today.
Amanda (29:30):
Thank you, Drew.
It's been wonderful to chat.
Drew (29:33):
A special thanks to Amanda McGovern for sharing her
expertise and experiences fromthe Australian education sector.
Her insights have trulyhighlighted the powerful changes
happening in schools throughthe Leader in Me paradigm shift,
as she explained.
If you're inspired by whatyou've heard today and want to
learn more about the Leader andMe paradigm shift and how that
(29:57):
can benefit your school ororganization, visit the Franklin
Covey website for moreinformation and resources, and
the New South Wales PrimaryPrincipal Association is proud
to be partnering with FranklinCovey on this mission.
Don't forget to subscribe toour podcast for more episodes on
educational leadership andprofessional development and if
(30:18):
you found this episode valuable,please share it with your
colleagues and network.
Thank you for listening.
Until next time, keep strivingfor excellence in education.
Hello and welcome to Season 2 of the Principal
Learnings Podcast.
If you're a principal oreducational leader looking to
enhance your skills, this is theplace for you, so let's get
into it.
Let's embark on this learningjourney together.
Welcome to today's episode.
We're diving into thetransformative power of the
(00:22):
seven habits of highly effectivepeople and how these principles
are being embraced by thousandsof schools worldwide.
Partnering with us on thisjourney is Franklin Covey, a
global leader in professionaldevelopment.
Through their Leader in Meprogram, they're building
leadership in students,fostering high trust cultures
(00:43):
and boosting academicachievement.
Amanda (00:46):
When you work in Leader in Me school, you work with a
client partner and a coach todevelop your action plan and a
typical implementation cycle isup to three years.
But schools again will work attheir own pace.
Drew (01:03):
Today we're thrilled to have Amanda McGovern with us.
Amanda brings a wealth ofexperience from the Australian
education sector, having startedas a teacher and moved into
playing a pivotal role inprofessional learning and
leadership strategy developmentas a professional learning
officer for the WesternAustralian Primary Principals
Association.
Amanda (01:22):
There's lots of support mechanisms in place for schools
who choose to come on the Leaderin Me journey.
What's really important torecognise is that implementation
is designed to fit eachindividual school.
Leader in Me will already fitwith any existing processes and
practices and programs that arecurrently at your school level.
(01:44):
So that's why, as a system,it's a system framework that
supports you to achieve all theother things that you're already
doing.
It just makes them evenstronger.
Drew (01:53):
Let's explore the incredible impact of Leader and
Me and hear insights from AmandaMcGovern.
Amanda, welcome to our podcast.
Thrilled to have you here.
Amanda (02:04):
Thanks, Drew.
It's wonderful to be speakingwith you today.
Drew (02:08):
Yeah, sure is.
For those who don't know,Amanda, you work in the
professional learning role, ineducational leadership, but
you're able to share for thoselisteners your background and
your role as Franklin Covey'slead of Australia, New Zealand
leader and coach and facilitator.
Amanda (02:29):
Sure, I've worked in a variety of education roles over
the past 25 years and myjourney's been a little bit
different to many.
I found myself in lots ofdifferent roles, a lot of
diverse roles across my career,but I always seem to be drawn to
the professional learning orcoaching roles in any, I guess,
(02:51):
context that I was working in.
So that started way back in mythird and fourth year of
teaching, where I was asked todeliver some professional
learning to other educators,which I guess terrified me at
the time, but it has set me onthis path of professional
learning.
So I worked in schools for acouple of decades and then the
last five to six years of mycareer working at the Department
(03:14):
of Education, wa.
I worked in our LeadershipInstitute, which was the, I
guess, the main professionallearning centre of the WA branch
of the Education Department.
So in that role I worked as acoach, a facilitator,
coordinator and researcher and aconsultant across many both
teaching and leadershipdevelopment professional
(03:36):
learning suites.
And I learned so much duringthat time that I was able to
trial my skills in anothercontext.
And for the last couple of years, prior to coming into this role
, I worked as the Manager ofProfessional Learning at the
Western Australian PrimaryPrincipals Association, where I
got to really broaden my networkand work with people like you,
(03:59):
Drew, over in New South Wales,but also connecting with
colleagues in Queensland andVictoria and in Canada as well,
which has been amazing, andthrough these connections I
decided, after a little while ofsoul searching, what was next
for me.
I started to develop my ownconsulting business and to
(04:20):
partner with some other greatorganisations who share similar
values to me in education, andso when I was chatting to
Michael from Franklin Coveyabout Leader in Me, it was a
perfect fit for me to come in astheir coach and professional
learning consultant across theteam here in Australia and New
Zealand.
Drew (04:38):
Yeah, fantastic, Amanda, In terms of the leadership
development.
Was there a particular momentor influence in your career that
sparked your passion in thisfield?
Amanda (04:52):
It's been a long journey but I've always had a drive, I
guess, to make things better andreally been, I guess,
influenced by people who havethis real ability to think big.
I guess I really aspire tobeing that myself, so I'm always
looking on the out for thosetypes of people.
And so when I was working in asystem role, this idea of being
(05:14):
able to make connections acrossmultiple systems and
organizations and schools and beable to bring that support to a
larger level is what I'vealways been trying to achieve.
This idea of working andincreasing my sphere of
influence has been something Iguess that's driven me and it
fits really well with the Leaderin Me program.
(05:36):
But I guess one of the biggestthings for me in working in the
Leadership Institute was when wewere working in a very small
team with the director, peterGlenn Denning.
At the time we had a team ofabout nine or 10 of us and we
were really trying to cover andoffer an amazing suite of
programs for the entire WAcontext and during this time,
(05:58):
with limited resources andlimited people, we were
delivering some amazing products.
And so when you're working in ateam like that, you get a ball
of energy and you're able toachieve a lot of things together
.
So I think that ability to beable to achieve big when you
have sometimes a small scalereally makes a difference.
So I'm hoping to be able tocontinue to do that in any way
(06:22):
that I get to work in the future.
Drew (06:24):
Yeah, fantastic.
So, Amanda, I'm really curious.
You mentioned about Leader andMe, and in today's conversation
we're really going to startfocusing in on the Leader and Me
discussion.
Are you able to give us anoverview of what the program is,
as well as its core principles?
Amanda (06:41):
Yeah, absolutely.
I guess we call it a program,but it's not really a program,
it's a system.
Leader in Me is atransformational system, and it
brings together three big areasof academics, leadership and
culture, and so, with this ideaof a system in mind, it really
has the ability to transform aschool culture from the inside
(07:04):
out, with leadership being atits core.
Now, our definition ofleadership is the ability to
communicate people's worth andpotential so clearly that
they're inspired to see it inthemselves, and so, with that as
a foundation in place, youreally see a shift at all levels
of the community, from thestudents themselves, the
teachers and families.
(07:25):
And so, working within thissystem of Leader and Me, each
school is able to work at theirown pace and really implement
the key focus areas ofleadership, culture and
academics, and using a wealth ofonline teaching resources and
coaching support to enable themto achieve their own goals.
But it's really a system ofvoice and agency at its core,
(07:48):
with some incredible resourcesto help each school map its own
journey.
Drew (07:54):
Yeah, so that sounds fascinating.
Let's go into that further.
Amanda, how does the Leader andMe system specifically benefit
students and school communities?
Amanda (08:07):
Yeah, thanks, Drew, Leader and Me is based on a
solid theory of change and ourtheory of change is called the
see-do-get cycle.
Rather than basing whole schoolchanges on just trying to shift
behaviors alone, this modelsupports a shift in paradigms.
So paradigms are the way we seeand make sense and interpret
(08:27):
the world, and the Leader in Mesupports a shift at a paradigm
level across five core areas ofleadership potential change,
motivation and education.
And as we support these shiftsin the way people see and think
they're able to implement somekey practices across those three
(08:51):
areas of leadership, cultureand academics to support
transformation.
And so in our See Do Get cyclewe support the see, we provide
some resources for what to do inthat behaviour change.
But what we're looking for, theresults we're hoping to get,
are highly effective studentsand adults who are leaders in
their school and theircommunities.
We're wanting to get a hightrust culture where everyone's
(09:14):
voice is heard and the potentialis affirmed, and we also want
to get in the academic spaceengaged students who are
equipped to achieve andentrusted to lead their own
learning.
So that's really what we'relooking for across the see do
get cycle and with the paradigmchange, behavior change, and
those are the results that we'rehoping to achieve.
(09:34):
It's got a lot of frameworks tosupport that shift even further.
So another wonderful frameworkthat we have in Leader and Me is
the maturity continuum, andpeople who are familiar with the
seven habits of highlyeffective people will be
familiar with this.
But we utilize this frameworkto help students and also staff,
and also parents andcommunities, to be able to lead
(09:58):
self and then to lead others.
So this idea of interpersonalgrowth and then being able to
work with others and reallycollaborate in a truly effective
way is another great frameworkthat we utilise in the program
to support that shift across.
So we talk a lot about wantingto engage student voice and
(10:20):
agency in schools, voice andagency in schools, and it's
really difficult to do thatwithout changing the way we all
think and see and what thepossibilities of education are.
So this quite holistic approachreally supports and gives all
levels of school communities thetools to really support that
change.
Drew (10:42):
Yeah, I mean.
There's so much there, Amanda,to unpack.
You mentioned paradigms.
You also mentioned seven habitsYou've implemented Leader and
Me.
From a personal experience, howhas this framework Leader and
(11:03):
Me influenced your ownleadership style and your
professional growth?
Amanda (11:07):
Yeah, thank you.
That's a great question, Drew.
Within the framework itself andbased on the maturity continuum
and I did mention earlier thatit does have the seven habits of
highly effective people at itscore.
I guess, personally andprofessionally, some of those
key attributes and those keypractices within the seven
(11:28):
habits has had a significanteffect on me both personally and
professionally.
A couple that really I guessspring to mind in my own journey
is one of the ones.
That's one of my favorite in.
Habit four is the abundancemindset and so being able to
(11:49):
curate for yourself an abundancemindset rather than thinking in
a scarcity mindset.
So I often work with leadersacross many schools and this
fundamental change from aparadigm, from going from a
scarcity mindset to an abundancemindset, really makes a
difference about what we canachieve together.
(12:11):
So, rather than thinking incompetition, we're thinking of
how do we work together and whatare the possibilities that are
open to me.
And that one mindset has had amassive change in my own career
professionally.
This idea that change startswith me is also a really key one
.
Rather than waiting for changeto happen out there, I have the
(12:33):
ability, within my own sphere ofinfluence, to change what I'd
like to see out there in theworld.
So it's quite an empoweringparadigm to work from within.
That change starts with me, sothat's another one that's had a
significant impact on me.
And then, finally, this idea ofbeing able to synergize with
others.
We talk about collaboration alot in education, but we often
(12:58):
don't have the tools and the keyunderstandings of what it
really means to trulycollaborate, and in Leader, in
Me, we call that synergize.
When one person's idea plusanother person's idea is more
than just one plus one equalstwo.
It could be one plus one equalsfive or 10 or 100.
This is the idea of reallyunleashing potential in people
(13:21):
when we have the abilities andthe mindsets to be able to work
together effectively.
So, yes, those ones there andmany more have had a really
significant impact on how I amable to work with others, both
personally and professionally.
Drew (13:34):
You could see that passion coming through with that
abundance mindset, thoseparadigms, and you must have so
many positive experiences fromthat and I can really tell
through that synergy and synergywe're having here in terms of
what is possible with Leader andMe.
(13:54):
If we move into now theresearch and impact for people
listening really curious furtherabout Leader and Me, the
research indicates significantbenefits from the Leader in Me
program.
Are you able to delve into someof the findings from recent
studies on the program's impact?
Amanda (14:16):
Oh, absolutely.
Thanks, Drew.
And this one is there's anextensive amount of research in
Leader in Me.
When I'm looking through someof the resources that we have
available on this, we've hadover 100 independent studies
conducted on Leader and Me overthe course of the past decade.
(14:37):
Most of those have beenpeer-reviewed, and a mix of
qualitative and quantitative, Iguess, research has been
conducted.
There's a couple that I mightjust draw your attention to and
there's definitely many outthere, but this one that was
recently conducted in 2023 is ameta-analysis was really able to
(15:01):
identify statisticallysignificant improvements in both
school climate and studentbehaviour as a result of schools
implementing Leader in Me, andwhat it has seen is that at a
whole school community level,there's been quite a significant
shift in school climate andschool culture and a reduction
(15:26):
in high-level student behaviourincidences.
What I find really interestingabout this particular analysis
is that teacher perceptions ofschool climate were the highest,
and that's really significantwhen we think about the
challenges that teachers andprincipals are currently going
(15:47):
through and how challenging alot of our schools are to work
within.
To see that the teachersthemselves rated that the school
climate has had a significantchange really goes to show that
they're going to be able to havea greater impact in everything
they do because the way they'veseen the changes at their school
level is going to enable themto do their work really well.
(16:10):
So that one, I think, is reallysignificant.
Lots of other ones,particularly this other one
recently.
In the last couple of years astudy on attendance Leader in Me
has led to significantincreases in attendance across
schools.
Again, because it goes to thatschool climate, school culture
piece and it gives people thetools to be able to work
(16:34):
together but also reallyunderstand themselves and to, I
guess, becoming a culture whereit's a great place to be.
People want to go to thoseschools, great place to be.
People want to go to thoseschools.
And when I think about thisidea of social-emotional realms,
casel is the world's, I guess,leading foundation on this, the
(16:55):
Collaborative and AcademicSocial and Emotional Learning
Group.
They're the leading authorityin, I guess, social-emotional
learning.
And when you look at what CASELrequires of schools to really
effectively attend to social andemotional learning, leader in
Me is one of the very fewsystems that actually address
(17:18):
all of the aspects of social andemotional learning.
So there's a variety ofresearch out there that supports
that we're making a difference.
Drew (17:25):
So there's a variety of research out there that supports
that we're making a difference.
Yeah, it's in terms of goingback to it's changing the
paradigm, changing that shift,changing that mindset with that
as we went back to earlier inthe conversation really changing
that abundance mindset.
Hence why attendance rates areup because students want to go
(17:49):
to school.
Teachers are enjoying thechange again, changing their
paradigm.
They're really enjoying being ateacher and seeing the success
of the program.
It's really coming through.
Amanda (18:04):
Yeah, Drew, I think with that teacher piece that
teachers always want to go towork and do amazing things.
That's what they all go intothe job for, so it really allows
them to teach kids and that'sreally a significant impact that
we see.
They get to really work withstudents at that social and
(18:24):
emotional level and they can seethe difference they are making
to the lives of their students.
So that really, again, this hasthat really empowering effect.
Drew (18:33):
Yeah sure, sure does Amanda behaviours, as we've said
.
Can you describe some of thelong-term results you've seen or
witnessed in those who havefully embraced this leadership
philosophy?
Amanda (18:53):
Yeah, thank you.
It's really based on thefoundation of Leader in Me.
It is based on the seven habitsof highly effective people and
its principles and its practiceswhen implemented with fidelity,
it can be life-changing.
It's a lifelong journey and ithas the ability to really impact
(19:14):
a life short-term, butdefinitely we're looking for
long term.
Leader in Me is much more than aschool program and the greatest
impacts that I've seen fromprincipals and staff themselves
as they embrace the principlesand practices into their own
life.
I hear from school leadersregularly and overwhelmingly
(19:37):
they see the changes in theirstudents, but they really often
reflect on how those principleshave transformed their own lives
.
They're better parents, they'rebetter partners and they're
better at communicating.
Their leadership skills hasreally developed to that next
level.
They're better listeners andthis flows into their
professional practices.
They get much deepersatisfaction from their work.
(19:59):
So the system itself is aninside out model where, when you
embrace it, you actually do seeimprovements across all aspects
of your life, and so it'sdifficult to really pin down one
particular person that I'veseen change the most, but I've
generally seen many, many peoplereport this back to me
(20:20):
anecdotally over time.
Drew (20:23):
Yeah, how powerful is that in terms of?
It's a professional learningpiece, obviously aimed at school
students, but to hear that,coming through the seven habits
of highly effective peopletransition from into the school
context into people's personallife and the impact that that is
(20:44):
having, how powerful is that?
Amazing to hear In terms ofmoving, shifting into the
resources side of the program,what ongoing support does Leader
in Me provide?
Amanda?
Amanda (21:01):
Yeah, thanks, Drew.
There's lots of supportmechanisms in place for schools
who choose to come on the Leaderin Me journey.
What's really important torecognise is that implementation
is designed to fit eachindividual school.
Leader in Me will already fitwith any existing processes and
practices and programs that arecurrently at your school level.
(21:23):
So that's why, as a system,it's a system framework that
supports you to achieve all theother things that you're already
doing.
It just makes them evenstronger.
When you work in Leader in Meschool, you work in a Leader in
Me school, you work with aclient partner and a coach to
develop your action plan, and atypical implementation cycle is
(21:45):
up to three years.
But schools, again, will work attheir own pace.
Each school will have access tohigh-quality professional
learning.
I think Franklin CoveyProfessional Learning is
probably the highest qualityprofessional learning out there
in the world currently, and youwill have the opportunity to
(22:05):
attend professional learning,whether you want that
face-to-face, online orself-directed online.
And again, we all loveface-to-face, but we know that
we have a challenging timetablesometimes in schools.
But what I do also like to sayhere is that there has been some
(22:26):
pretty bad self-directed onlineprofessional learning over the
years, but this stuff is notthat.
It's really professionallycurated and designed, so it's
quality, whatever direction theschool takes.
Each school will also have anopportunity to work with someone
like me, and most of the timeit is me currently to be able to
(22:46):
set some coaching conversationsthroughout the year.
And again, it's up to theschool how many times they'd
like to work with their coach,but there are some minimum
settings that we will achievetogether across a school year.
So you get lots of coachingsupport.
You've got your ownprofessional client support in
Clare.
You also have an opportunity towork with the Leader of Me
(23:11):
website.
So when I first go into theLeader of Me website and I think
maybe you've seen it, drewthere are thousands upon
thousands of amazing resourceswithin that.
It's just.
If you let the teachers go inthere, they will just have an
incredible feast of lessons andresearch and I guess scope and
(23:33):
sequences available to them.
I guess scope and sequencesavailable to them, and so we
help guide schools through theresources that are available.
But their online websiteresources are just incredible.
You can press, play and stop onsocial and emotional lessons
across any category for any yearlevel, from early childhood all
(23:54):
the way through to high school,and so the actual resources
themselves are just incredibleon the website and the lesson
space.
But also schools can, if theywant to, access Global Direct,
which also allows them toconnect with schools across the
globe, because there arethousands of schools who are
implementing Leader in Me acrossmany continents, and so there's
(24:17):
an opportunity there to connectwith other schools outside of
Australia as well.
So lots of different ways andlots of different resources are
available, but we map yourjourney and you are able to
implement as much or as littleand as quickly or as slowly as
your school needs to.
Drew (24:35):
Yeah, fantastic, I heard that three years, as well as the
word, obviously, Franklin Covey.
Behind the extensive amount ofresearch and Franklin Covey is
just such a world-classorganization for professional
learning.
In your opinion, Amanda, whatsets the Leader in Me program
(24:57):
apart from other leadershipdevelopment programs?
Amanda (25:02):
Oh yeah, that's a great question.
Apart from all the resourcesavailable that I talked about in
my previous answer, I guesswhat it does is it teaches you,
step by step, how to leadyourself, how to become a better
leader of self, to leadyourself how to become a better
leader of self and then alsothen how to lead others and
become very much more skilled inthis interpersonal management.
(25:23):
So I think I previously talkedabout the importance of student
voice and agency and how that isa real key area of interest in
many of our schools.
This is one of the only systemsthat I've seen Leader in.
This is one of the only systemsthat I've seen.
Leader in Me is one of the onlysystems that I've seen that
actually helps support thatshift required to become a
(25:45):
school that agency and voice area priority, and allows changes
at a whole community level toallow that voice and agency to
thrive.
Drew (25:57):
Yeah, there's a lot of research around student voice
and agency and the fact thatthere's a the Leader In Me.
What I'm hearing, Amanda, isthe how, the how of how that
actually works, how studentvoice and agency can literally
transform the culture.
And, going back to theparadigms, shifting the paradigm
(26:24):
within the school setting yeah,so in the context for our New
South Wales PPA members,listening, educational leaders,
principals who are leadingthey're leading all of these
different, diverse communities.
How could the principles of theLeader in Me be applied to
their context?
Amanda?
Amanda (26:43):
Yeah, absolutely, leader in Me works from that
human-centered paradigm, so it'srelevant across any community.
It currently, as I've mentionedpreviously, it's operating in
over 5,000 schools worldwide.
I work with schools inAustralia and New Zealand, but
we have many, many schools inthe US and across Asia, south
(27:05):
America, europe and Africa, andso we know that it works in a
range of diverse cultures andcommunities, cultures and
communities.
Another great feature of beingable to be able to say that we
work worldwide is that ourresources have already been
translated into multiplelanguages, and so diversity is
(27:26):
really at its core and embracedand celebrated in Leader in Me.
Drew (27:32):
Wow, that's so many schools and it shows the the
success of the program and howit speaks across continents into
different dialects.
So again going back to thatuniversal shift of paradigm from
the center out.
Amanda, for those listening, doyou have any advice for
(27:53):
listeners who are interested inimplementing the Leader in Me
program into their own schools?
Amanda (27:58):
Oh, absolutely, we'd love to have a chat.
We'd love you to either callClaire and have a chat with the
team or come along to anyupcoming information session
that we have going.
We've also got a range ofschools in New South Wales and
also Victoria who haveimplemented Leader in Me and
will be very willing to sharetheir journey with you.
(28:21):
So please get in contact witheither Claire or anyone else
across the team.
You don't have anything to loseby starting.
You're giving yourself the gift.
It's an inside-out model, so itstarts with you, the leader
school staff and then across thecommunity.
So the interpersonal trainingthat you receive in your first
(28:41):
part of the Leader in Me systemwill change you and your school
community.
We've also got a great group ofschool leaders, both in New
South Wales and Victoria, whohave implemented Leader in Me
and they'd be willing to have achat with anyone who's
interested in moving forward.
So get in contact and have achat with us and we're happy to
(29:05):
support any direction you'd liketo go in.
Drew (29:07):
Yeah, absolutely Fantastic , Amanda.
It's a privilege to have timewith you today.
Thanks for joining us andsharing valuable insights on the
Letter and Meet program.
It's clear that this frameworkhas the potential to make a
significant positive impact onyour school community.
Thanks for being with us today.
Amanda (29:30):
Thank you, Drew.
It's been wonderful to chat.
Drew (29:33):
A special thanks to Amanda McGovern for sharing her
expertise and experiences fromthe Australian education sector.
Her insights have trulyhighlighted the powerful changes
happening in schools throughthe Leader in Me paradigm shift,
as she explained.
If you're inspired by whatyou've heard today and want to
learn more about the Leader andMe paradigm shift and how that
(29:57):
can benefit your school ororganization, visit the Franklin
Covey website for moreinformation and resources, and
the New South Wales PrimaryPrincipal Association is proud
to be partnering with FranklinCovey on this mission.
Don't forget to subscribe toour podcast for more episodes on
educational leadership andprofessional development and if
(30:18):
you found this episode valuable,please share it with your
colleagues and network.
Thank you for listening.
Until next time, keep strivingfor excellence in education.
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