April 18, 2025 • 28 mins
Mike Beaulieu shares his journey from starting a painting business during the 2008 recession to selling his $2 million company, crediting his success to email marketing strategies that maintained 40-50% open rates and consistently reactivated past customers.
• Started painting business in 2008 during recession, sold it after growing to over $2 million in annual revenue
• Realized clients forget painting contractors among numerous service providers they hire
• Shifted from discount-oriented emails to valuable content about design trends and color forecasts
• Achieved consistent 40-50% email open rates with click rates between 1-5%
• Spent only 1-1.5% of revenue on marketing through effective customer reactivation
• Clean email lists and compelling subject lines essential for ensuring deliverability
• Business sold successfully because of solid systems and recurring revenue from past clients
• Comprehensive customer experience important from first contact through post-project engagement
• Used combination of employees and subcontractors with clear roles and management structure
Special offer for listeners: Mike is offering a discount on his email newsletter service plus his free guide "8 Things You Must Know Before Hiring a Painting Contractor" for anyone who mentions this podcast when contacting him at PaintersMarketingPro.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Daniel, the founder of Bookkeeping for
Painters.
Welcome to the ProfitablePainter Podcast.
My name is Daniel Honan.
I'm the CPA that worksexclusively with painting
business owners.
I'm super excited today to talkto Mike Bolu out of Michigan.
He has an incredible journey ofrunning his painting business,
(00:21):
scaling it up, developing highconverting emails and working
his customer list to get amassive amount of revenue every
single month, so I'm superexcited to talk about all those
things with him today.
Welcome to the podcast, mike.
How's it going?
It's going well.
Thank you, daniel, absolutelyAll right, let's jump right into
(00:45):
it.
Can you walk us through yourjourney?
How did you get started andwhat led you to where you are
today?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Okay, Well, I started my painting business originally
in 2008, right in the middle ofthat recession, and I started
to try to grow my business atthat time and recently I was
able to sell my business, withus having revenue over $2
(01:16):
million year over year, and wascontinuing to grow that list or
to grow my client base, and thathas really been a big journey
of mine.
We would have been at what isit now 18, 17 years with the
(01:39):
business before I was able to dothat.
But there was definitely someimportant things that I had to
put into place in order to getready to sell my business, and
one of the big things that I didwas my email newsletters, how
they converted, how my pastclients continued to call us
back, how they continued torefer to us and I really put
(02:02):
that down as a big reason thatmy business was sellable at this
time.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Yeah, that's incredible, the fact that you
started in 2008,.
During that huge downturn, Iremember I was coming right out
of college in 2008 and I waslooking for a normal paying job.
I could not find anything.
It was just crazy back then.
I think a lot of people forgetwhat was it like trying to start
a business in 2008?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
around communities passing out flyers, talking to
people, just trying to get myfoot in the door with a lot of
clients, and so that's where Igradually started to build
things.
And then it was about 2011 whenI realized, hey, you know, I'm
starting to build this list ofclients.
I was using a CRM at that timeand so I was able to kind of
(03:10):
track my list and from there Iseen well, well, shoot, what am
I doing?
Because the paradigm withpainters typically is well, if I
go out there and I do a greatjob for my clients and they love
my work and they love me, well,absolutely, they're going to
remember who I am when it comestime to paint again.
(03:32):
But the reality is is we'rejust one service that they're
hiring out of many differentservices.
They're hiring somebody fortheir lawn, they're hiring
people for different projectsaround their home, bug people
you know all different thingsand so we're just one of many
(03:53):
services.
So, as much of a good intentionthat that client may have to
remember your name, the realityis is that a lot of them won't
remember exactly who you are,and what they'll do is they'll
end up at that time was going tothe phone book, or now they'll
end up going to Google andthey'll do a search and they'll
(04:14):
see.
You know, on the first page, isthere a name that they
recognize that rings a bell?
And if not, what they startdoing is they start clicking on
other names.
And so I knew that I had to dosomething different, and so I
started doing email marketing tomy past clients in order for
(04:34):
them to remember me.
Now, that did start off simplewith me just throwing out, hey,
I'm running a discount, or hey,do you need something that you
know serviced or not?
But what I realized withlooking at the open rates of
those is that people, after alittle bit, if they didn't have
(04:56):
a project right in mind, youknow, they just stopped opening
up the emails.
Well, that's not going to doany good for me, and so what I
decided to do was to change myapproach, and so I started to
put together an email newsletterthat talked about the different
decorating trends, the trendsand colors that are coming up
(05:19):
colors of the year and I eventalked about things on types of
countertops and types offlooring and different things
like that, because I thought ifI could get my client to start
thinking about the design trendsand I could start to get them
thinking about changes thatmaybe they should be making in
their home.
(05:40):
Well then, they already have myname, they already have all my
contact information right hereon this newsletter that they're
going to call me in order tomake those changes.
And that's when I started seeingmy open rates consistently run
between 40% to 50% and my clickrates depending on the
(06:00):
newsletters.
Some of them it's a little over1%, other ones are, you know,
three to almost 5% open rates.
And so you know that to meallowed me to start to really
grow a really good past clientbase and the referrals started
coming in even more and it juststarted to be a system that was
(06:25):
just auto generating these pastclients.
I mean, I literally had withinthis last year, just before I
called, clients who were callingme that you know I personally
was painting at their house, youknow, years and years and years
ago, at the very beginning, andthey're still opening up the
newsletter and they're stillreading it, and so it's been
(06:48):
huge.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah, that's huge.
40% to 50% open rates.
That's amazing because it canbe so cost-effective, especially
when you compare it tosomething like Facebook or
direct mail to colder leads.
(07:11):
Like, just staying in touchwith your customers is pretty
inexpensive and it can reallyshow up on your profit and loss.
If you're just sending emails Imean, it doesn't cost much to
send an email virtually free andif you're getting 40 to 50%
open rates and you're staying intouch with your customer,
(07:31):
staying top of mind, so thatwhen they need that, that
painting project, they theythink of you, I mean that's,
that's hugely powerful andthat's really, I'm sure, uh,
keeping your profit margins likesuper high.
(07:52):
Like, is that kind of what youexperienced and how?
I guess my question would belike, how long did it take you
because you started doing this?
In kind of 2011?
, if I'm not mistaken?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
and how long did it first started doing it?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
That's when you first started doing it.
How long did you really figureit out?
How long did it take you toreally kind of nail dial in the
system to figure this out?
It definitely took a couple ofyears to to really kind of nail
dial in the system to figurethis out.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
It definitely took a couple of years to to really
look at the metrics and andstart to dive into what does
clients want to read.
You know, light bulb kind ofwent off for me when I started
thinking, you know these, theseclients that are calling to to
have me do painting.
You know, they, they care aboutthe trends.
(08:35):
When I go out to an estimate,I'd get a lot of questions Well,
what's the color thateverybody's going with right now
?
And they're really interestedin what's happening now.
What are the changes?
What are people doing?
And so I started to gear thearticles that I was pulling
towards that direction andthat's what really started to
(08:58):
notice that click rate.
And then I finally got it to apoint in 2018 where I turned it
into a business where I said youknow what, this really needs to
go out to more painters and, atthat time, really needs to go
(09:19):
out to more painters.
And at that time, there wasonly like one or two companies
that really focused on any sortof email newsletter and the type
of material that they wereputting out wasn't the type of
content that clients were reallyclicking on and reading and
staying engaged.
And so that's where I decided,hey, I'm going to launch this
and start to offer this forother clients.
(09:40):
Now there's other factors thatplay into the email list,
because a lot of people have.
I want to talk about a coupleof misconceptions if I can for a
minute.
So one of the misconceptions iswell, just send the email out
and people are just going toopen it, right, like, just pull
your list and send it out.
(10:01):
And the reality is, is thatyou're one of many, a lot of
times junk mail, quote, unquotethat's coming through.
So how do you get a client toopen up that email?
How do you get a client to openup that email?
And so subject line becomesvery important in terms of is
that something that's going toengage them, that's going to
(10:23):
catch their interest, thatthey're going to want to open it
, that they're going to knowthat it's coming from you?
The other is is you don't justwant to send out an email list
without cleaning that list.
Now, when I talk about cleaningthat list, what you really want
to do is you want to make surethat the majority of the emails
that you're sending are actuallyvalid emails.
(10:45):
What I do for my clients isthat I run it through a scrubber
which actually cleans the list,looks for which ones are live,
which ones are catch-allaccounts because you don't want
to send it there, which onesthey can even have on.
You know, do not email me list.
And if you're sending yourstuff out and you get all these
(11:07):
bounce backs, what happens isthat these internet service
providers that are hosting yourclient's email address looks and
says, hey, everything that'scoming from this guy, people are
rating it as spam, they'rerating it as junk, and so then
it goes out the entire networkthat whenever you're emailing an
(11:29):
at, you know, fill in theblankcom that they're
automatically going to throwyour email into the spam folder
instead of the client's inbox.
So you may be thinking that, hey, I'm sending this all out.
Why am I not getting moreengagement?
Well, that's because youremails are going right to the
trash, they're going right tothe spam folder, and so it's
(11:51):
important that the type of listthat you're sending out is clean
.
So I never recommend um goingto any of these list grabbers or
just grabbing a whole bunch ofnames.
You really want to hit not onlyyour past clients, but you want
to hit everybody who's gotten aquote from you as well, and the
reason why I include that inthe list is because you don't
(12:14):
know the level of service thatthey just received from that
client.
And number two, it's going to beyour name that's going to keep
popping up to them every singlemonth.
So next time that they thinkabout a project well, you know
New Look has that was mypainting company's name.
New Look has some great contentand I love their emails.
(12:36):
Let me give them a call and trythem out, maybe this time so it
sets you up in a moreprofessional level.
More of you're in the know,because you know the trends that
are coming, and so that becomesextremely important.
And so those are just a coupleof the misconceptions.
(12:58):
Now there's some other tweaksthat we do as well to ensure
that your email is going to theinbox, but that's something that
we can have a furtherone-on-one conversation about
with somebody if they'reinterested.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Yeah, I think those misconceptions I think are spot
on and one of the things that Ithink is really important as
well with staying in touch withyour past customers and trying
to get them to buy again, isthat if you can set up that
system and show that you can, ona consistent basis, reactivate
(13:36):
those customers, that is a hugeplus, a huge bump in the value
of your business.
If you can show that you can,on a regular basis, reactivate
your customers, that's recurringrevenue essentially, and that
will really improve the overallvalue of your business.
So if you're ever looking tosell which is something that you
(13:58):
did and I'd love to dive intothis with you is, you know, that
can be a huge plus, you know,on the price that you actually
ended up getting for yourbusiness.
Um, could you talk a little bitabout what that experience of
selling your your paintingbusiness was like?
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, absolutely.
So, just to put it out there,the process takes a while.
Okay, there's a lot that needsto be done in preparation of
selling a business, but what Ihad done is I had met with a
business broker.
It'd be just like a realtor ifyou're looking for a house.
(14:35):
And so I met with a businessbroker and we were able to put
it on the market, so to speak,for other people to look at.
But the things that really madethe business sellable was the
fact of how many of the pastclients so what is the
(14:55):
percentage of the past clientsthat are that are coming back,
um, to you?
Uh, what is the percentage ofreferrals that are coming back?
Because what people are doingwhen they're looking to buy your
company is they're looking tobuy a system.
Um, they're not necessarilyjust looking to buy your name.
Your name is is one aspect ofit, but that name and the
(15:17):
systems you have got to becontinually bringing in work.
And so what I was able to showwas that I had low cost of
advertising, because I didn'tneed to throw, you know, giant
bucks at it in order to get myname out there, because of
(15:39):
systems like my newsletter wasable to bring in a high number
of past clients and referrals,and so you know it really took.
You know, potential buyerlooking at well, what are my
systems?
How do we have this in place?
Are things clean?
Are they organized?
(15:59):
You know what is that producingon a regular basis, and so
would a potential buyer be ableto step in and that system
continue to move forward.
So I've always been big aboutthe systems in place and so that
really played a key role.
(16:21):
And, to be honest with you guys, with the online bookkeeping,
I've used your service for many,many, many, many years and you
know you guys really helped meto see some of those numbers and
to know what types of things Ineeded to kind of systemize a
(16:42):
little bit more in order to getit to this point, to where I
could take a $2 million businessand now sell it to another
client and be able to walk awayfrom it and that system still
produce.
But you guys, things like thenewsletter, those were huge for
(17:05):
the buyer of my companypersonally, Nice.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Yeah, you mentioned low cost of advertising.
Would you mind sharing, like,what was your cost of
advertising?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Oh, I think I only spent about one to one and a
half percent of my total revenue.
You know, I didn't spend moneyon the SEO.
I didn't.
You know there are things thatI did at times, so don't get me
wrong.
There are some advantages tosome of the SEO that I did do at
(17:39):
times, but those were veryminimal.
Was able to get the name intothe contractor's three pack,
which we all see now when we goto a Google search, which we all
see now when we go to a Googlesearch.
So with that and then doing theadvertising I mean with the
newsletter you know I hate tomake it sound like, hey, the
(18:02):
newsletter's all you need,because there's definitely other
ways to you want to add on topof that that you could go even
further than what I did.
I know that if I would havekept the business for a number
more years, I probably wouldhave thrown some more money at
some other types of avenues, butfor what I needed in order to
(18:26):
get the company to that levelthat was the big thing
Consistently posted on Facebookand Instagram level, um, that
was the big thing, consistentlyposted on facebook and instagram
, um, but that, that, that's.
That's about the bulk of it, totell you the truth.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
That's that's incredible.
I mean for a painting businessdoing over two million in
revenue having a cost ofadvertising of one and a half
percent or lower.
I mean that's that's amazing.
I mean because typically you'llsee painting businesses
especially that are trying tohit higher revenues, you know,
somewhere between five and 10%For for marketing costs, and so
(19:03):
you're only spending one and ahalf percent.
I would venture to say probablya big part of that was because
you actually reactivated yourprior customers, cause that's so
much cheaper than trying to getnew customers all the time,
cause I know a lot of folks arefocused on getting new customers
doing door to door and Facebookmarketing, which are fine Not
to say that you shouldn't dothat, but you can if you're.
(19:26):
If you're not doing thecustomer reactivation stuff, you
know you should probably focuson that first, especially if
you've been around for a while.
You got a large list then goingafter the always going after
new customers.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Absolutely.
I mean, in the industry we callit re-engagement and you see
this all the time.
Any business that you shop withonline, what starts to happen
right from there?
You start to get emails fromthem either offering specific
discounts or offering, hey, thisis some other products and you
might not purchase off of thatfirst email, you might not
(20:02):
purchase off that second emailor that third email, but if they
have your attention and you'reat least perusing that, when you
see something, when somethingkind of triggers for you, then
you're going to click on thatlink and you're going to go
ahead and make that purchase.
And so all the big companieshave figured this out.
(20:23):
The thing is, is that smallerbusinesses, and especially
within our trade you know,that's one big thing that I
think hasn't really clickedfully that, hey, my inbox is
flooded all the time.
I look at these emails on aconstant basis.
Why am I not doing this to myclients and engaging them the
(20:44):
exact same way?
Um, and it gives you thatpersonal feel to it.
We know that that's a trend inthe industry is that people want
that personal feel to it.
We know that that's a trend inthe industry is that people want
that personal touch and so ifyou're getting that, that
customized newsletter withcertain articles that you know
interest them, I mean that'sjust adding another layer of a
(21:04):
personal touch.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
One of the other things you mentioned about going
through the process of sellingyour business.
Was you you really the processof selling your business?
Was you you really?
The buyer wants to have systems.
You know when they'repurchasing a business they want
to ensure that they're buying abusiness that has systems set up
.
Could you talk a little bitmore about what was important
for for selling your yourpainting business like?
(21:28):
What systems are you referringto what?
What do you when you systems?
What are we really talkingabout?
Are we talking about thewritten processes?
Are we talking about thesoftware or a combination of
both?
Like, could you kind of justunpack that a little bit further
?
Speaker 2 (21:42):
Yeah, that's a good question.
So it would be a little bit ofboth.
You know, what the businessneeds to be is that I'm not
doing everything.
That's really the big thing,that I have other people in
place and this is how we goabout doing the business as a
(22:02):
whole.
And so within my business I hadmy crew lead, so I had a model
where I was part employees, partsubcontractors.
I had a model where I was partemployees, part subcontractors,
and so my employees, I had mycrew leads for each job, and for
the subcontractors I had mylist of subcontractors that we
(22:23):
used.
I had for the subcontractors Ihad a project manager that would
oversee, get the crew set up ona project and also close down
on the project before it wasever presented to the client.
And then on top of that I hadan operations manager who
(22:44):
oversaw the crews, ordered theproduct, took care of issues
that occurred.
And then I also had my officemanager which kind of helped in
that flow as well in the billing.
And then I had at the end forthe last year I had a
(23:06):
residential estimator, while Ifocused a little bit more on the
commercial estimating end of it, and if I would have gone
further in it.
I would have taken myself backif I hired a commercial
estimator to come in and then Iwould have just kind of oversaw
all the things.
But there was certain softwarethat I used as well to kind of
(23:28):
help with that process, and sosome of the software that I was
using was an important part sothat everyone knew what their
role was and how a projectflowed from beginning to end.
One of the things that I talkedabout that's really important is
what is the customer'sexperience?
So the customer's experiencestarts from that moment that
(23:50):
they pick up the phone or send atext or fill out an online form
till the project is complete,and then further on with that
which, where the newslettercomes at that very end, on how
we continue to reengage.
So what does that client'sexperience look like from that
start to end?
A lot of times, paintingcompanies will focus on just
(24:13):
what the customer experience iswhen they're in the house and
they're actually doing the work.
Well, you know, I think that'sthe wrong time to really focus
on that.
They could already have a badtaste in their mouth, and so you
want to make sure that from thevery beginning, that that
entire experience to them is asmooth transaction and that they
(24:35):
feel that their needs are beingmet, that they're being heard
and that you truly understandwhat they're looking for.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
Makes sense Cool.
Well, this has been an amazingconversation.
I really appreciate you sharingyour journey and your process
with emailing, reactivatingcustomers and going through the
process of selling your business.
Where can folks learn moreabout how you can help them with
(25:04):
developing high convertingemails and reactivating their
list?
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Yeah, so I'll be able to send you over a link for
that.
I'm currently in the process.
When I first started thebusiness, I was looking at doing
some other areas of marketing,and so I have the
paintersmarketingprocom outthere.
I'm currently in the process ofchanging that over to email
(25:30):
newsletters for painters.
Um, because that's the onlything I really want to hone in
on and really focus on is justthat.
Um, so painters marketingprocom would currently get you
to a site that you could set upa uh, an appointment where we
could kind of discuss and see ifwe're going to be the right fit
for you and in the system.
(25:50):
Um, but, uh, that's going to begetting changed here within the
next week or so, and so I'llsend that out to you as well, so
they could reach out throughyou and then I could talk to
them or they could go right tothat website.
One of the things, too, becauseyou know I love your business
(26:12):
so much.
Like I said, you guys have beeninstrumental in helping me grow
to where it's at Anybody whomentions this podcast.
I am running a discount rightnow for them, and then also what
I'm going to be throwing infree, something that's been a
really help in pre-positioningmy company.
(26:33):
I have a guide eight things youmust know before hiring a
painting contractor, and this isabout a 20 page thing that just
kind of goes through everythingabout you know to the client.
You're not just going topurchase a TV to where you know,
you can just go to any storeand the TV is going to be
exactly the same.
Hiring a contractor is atotally different experience and
(26:59):
so there are differentquestions that should be asked,
and so it just tries to help topre-position, put the customer
in the right type of mindset.
So when a client sets up anappointment, I would send out
that guide right away to them,and then also, when I'd send out
the quote, I would send outthat guide right away to them,
and then also, when I'd send outthe quote, I would send them
that guide one more time.
But I'm going to throw that in.
(27:20):
That's something I typicallycharge, but I'm going to throw
that in free for anybody whocontacts me through this link
here and signs up for thenewsletter.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Awesome, that's amazing.
We'll include the link in theshow notes.
If you want to grab ahold ofthat offer, I'd highly recommend
it.
I mean, mike has doneeverything that he's walked the
walk, and so if you don't wantto have to spend years dialing
in your system for reactivatingcustomers, just go with what's
already worked in the past andmake it easy, hit the easy
(27:53):
button and definitely schedule atime to talk with Mike and get
that low cost of leads throughcustomer reactivation.
Cool, I really appreciate yourtime, mike.
Any last thoughts before I letyou go today.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
You know, just, I mean you kind of hit it all.
I mean it is low cost.
You know, one sole job for thatwould basically pay for the
newsletter for the entire yearand then everything after that
would be just profit.
And I do a month by month basisbecause I want to be able to
(28:31):
prove myself consistently thatwhat we're delivering for you
and your clients is something ofvalue.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
So yeah, cool, awesome.
All right With that, we willsee you all next week All right,
thank you.
This is Daniel, the founder of Bookkeeping for
Painters.
Welcome to the ProfitablePainter Podcast.
My name is Daniel Honan.
I'm the CPA that worksexclusively with painting
business owners.
I'm super excited today to talkto Mike Bolu out of Michigan.
He has an incredible journey ofrunning his painting business,
(00:21):
scaling it up, developing highconverting emails and working
his customer list to get amassive amount of revenue every
single month, so I'm superexcited to talk about all those
things with him today.
Welcome to the podcast, mike.
How's it going?
It's going well.
Thank you, daniel, absolutelyAll right, let's jump right into
(00:45):
it.
Can you walk us through yourjourney?
How did you get started andwhat led you to where you are
today?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Okay, Well, I started my painting business originally
in 2008, right in the middle ofthat recession, and I started
to try to grow my business atthat time and recently I was
able to sell my business, withus having revenue over $2
(01:16):
million year over year, and wascontinuing to grow that list or
to grow my client base, and thathas really been a big journey
of mine.
We would have been at what isit now 18, 17 years with the
(01:39):
business before I was able to dothat.
But there was definitely someimportant things that I had to
put into place in order to getready to sell my business, and
one of the big things that I didwas my email newsletters, how
they converted, how my pastclients continued to call us
back, how they continued torefer to us and I really put
(02:02):
that down as a big reason thatmy business was sellable at this
time.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Yeah, that's incredible, the fact that you
started in 2008,.
During that huge downturn, Iremember I was coming right out
of college in 2008 and I waslooking for a normal paying job.
I could not find anything.
It was just crazy back then.
I think a lot of people forgetwhat was it like trying to start
a business in 2008?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
around communities passing out flyers, talking to
people, just trying to get myfoot in the door with a lot of
clients, and so that's where Igradually started to build
things.
And then it was about 2011 whenI realized, hey, you know, I'm
starting to build this list ofclients.
I was using a CRM at that timeand so I was able to kind of
(03:10):
track my list and from there Iseen well, well, shoot, what am
I doing?
Because the paradigm withpainters typically is well, if I
go out there and I do a greatjob for my clients and they love
my work and they love me, well,absolutely, they're going to
remember who I am when it comestime to paint again.
(03:32):
But the reality is is we'rejust one service that they're
hiring out of many differentservices.
They're hiring somebody fortheir lawn, they're hiring
people for different projectsaround their home, bug people
you know all different thingsand so we're just one of many
(03:53):
services.
So, as much of a good intentionthat that client may have to
remember your name, the realityis is that a lot of them won't
remember exactly who you are,and what they'll do is they'll
end up at that time was going tothe phone book, or now they'll
end up going to Google andthey'll do a search and they'll
(04:14):
see.
You know, on the first page, isthere a name that they
recognize that rings a bell?
And if not, what they startdoing is they start clicking on
other names.
And so I knew that I had to dosomething different, and so I
started doing email marketing tomy past clients in order for
(04:34):
them to remember me.
Now, that did start off simplewith me just throwing out, hey,
I'm running a discount, or hey,do you need something that you
know serviced or not?
But what I realized withlooking at the open rates of
those is that people, after alittle bit, if they didn't have
(04:56):
a project right in mind, youknow, they just stopped opening
up the emails.
Well, that's not going to doany good for me, and so what I
decided to do was to change myapproach, and so I started to
put together an email newsletterthat talked about the different
decorating trends, the trendsand colors that are coming up
(05:19):
colors of the year and I eventalked about things on types of
countertops and types offlooring and different things
like that, because I thought ifI could get my client to start
thinking about the design trendsand I could start to get them
thinking about changes thatmaybe they should be making in
their home.
(05:40):
Well then, they already have myname, they already have all my
contact information right hereon this newsletter that they're
going to call me in order tomake those changes.
And that's when I started seeingmy open rates consistently run
between 40% to 50% and my clickrates depending on the
(06:00):
newsletters.
Some of them it's a little over1%, other ones are, you know,
three to almost 5% open rates.
And so you know that to meallowed me to start to really
grow a really good past clientbase and the referrals started
coming in even more and it juststarted to be a system that was
(06:25):
just auto generating these pastclients.
I mean, I literally had withinthis last year, just before I
called, clients who were callingme that you know I personally
was painting at their house, youknow, years and years and years
ago, at the very beginning, andthey're still opening up the
newsletter and they're stillreading it, and so it's been
(06:48):
huge.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Yeah, that's huge.
40% to 50% open rates.
That's amazing because it canbe so cost-effective, especially
when you compare it tosomething like Facebook or
direct mail to colder leads.
(07:11):
Like, just staying in touchwith your customers is pretty
inexpensive and it can reallyshow up on your profit and loss.
If you're just sending emails Imean, it doesn't cost much to
send an email virtually free andif you're getting 40 to 50%
open rates and you're staying intouch with your customer,
(07:31):
staying top of mind, so thatwhen they need that, that
painting project, they theythink of you, I mean that's,
that's hugely powerful andthat's really, I'm sure, uh,
keeping your profit margins likesuper high.
(07:52):
Like, is that kind of what youexperienced and how?
I guess my question would belike, how long did it take you
because you started doing this?
In kind of 2011?
, if I'm not mistaken?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
and how long did it first started doing it?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
That's when you first started doing it.
How long did you really figureit out?
How long did it take you toreally kind of nail dial in the
system to figure this out?
It definitely took a couple ofyears to to really kind of nail
dial in the system to figurethis out.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
It definitely took a couple of years to to really
look at the metrics and andstart to dive into what does
clients want to read.
You know, light bulb kind ofwent off for me when I started
thinking, you know these, theseclients that are calling to to
have me do painting.
You know, they, they care aboutthe trends.
(08:35):
When I go out to an estimate,I'd get a lot of questions Well,
what's the color thateverybody's going with right now
?
And they're really interestedin what's happening now.
What are the changes?
What are people doing?
And so I started to gear thearticles that I was pulling
towards that direction andthat's what really started to
(08:58):
notice that click rate.
And then I finally got it to apoint in 2018 where I turned it
into a business where I said youknow what, this really needs to
go out to more painters and, atthat time, really needs to go
(09:19):
out to more painters.
And at that time, there wasonly like one or two companies
that really focused on any sortof email newsletter and the type
of material that they wereputting out wasn't the type of
content that clients were reallyclicking on and reading and
staying engaged.
And so that's where I decided,hey, I'm going to launch this
and start to offer this forother clients.
(09:40):
Now there's other factors thatplay into the email list,
because a lot of people have.
I want to talk about a coupleof misconceptions if I can for a
minute.
So one of the misconceptions iswell, just send the email out
and people are just going toopen it, right, like, just pull
your list and send it out.
(10:01):
And the reality is, is thatyou're one of many, a lot of
times junk mail, quote, unquotethat's coming through.
So how do you get a client toopen up that email?
How do you get a client to openup that email?
And so subject line becomesvery important in terms of is
that something that's going toengage them, that's going to
(10:23):
catch their interest, thatthey're going to want to open it
, that they're going to knowthat it's coming from you?
The other is is you don't justwant to send out an email list
without cleaning that list.
Now, when I talk about cleaningthat list, what you really want
to do is you want to make surethat the majority of the emails
that you're sending are actuallyvalid emails.
(10:45):
What I do for my clients isthat I run it through a scrubber
which actually cleans the list,looks for which ones are live,
which ones are catch-allaccounts because you don't want
to send it there, which onesthey can even have on.
You know, do not email me list.
And if you're sending yourstuff out and you get all these
(11:07):
bounce backs, what happens isthat these internet service
providers that are hosting yourclient's email address looks and
says, hey, everything that'scoming from this guy, people are
rating it as spam, they'rerating it as junk, and so then
it goes out the entire networkthat whenever you're emailing an
(11:29):
at, you know, fill in theblankcom that they're
automatically going to throwyour email into the spam folder
instead of the client's inbox.
So you may be thinking that, hey, I'm sending this all out.
Why am I not getting moreengagement?
Well, that's because youremails are going right to the
trash, they're going right tothe spam folder, and so it's
(11:51):
important that the type of listthat you're sending out is clean
.
So I never recommend um goingto any of these list grabbers or
just grabbing a whole bunch ofnames.
You really want to hit not onlyyour past clients, but you want
to hit everybody who's gotten aquote from you as well, and the
reason why I include that inthe list is because you don't
(12:14):
know the level of service thatthey just received from that
client.
And number two, it's going to beyour name that's going to keep
popping up to them every singlemonth.
So next time that they thinkabout a project well, you know
New Look has that was mypainting company's name.
New Look has some great contentand I love their emails.
(12:36):
Let me give them a call and trythem out, maybe this time so it
sets you up in a moreprofessional level.
More of you're in the know,because you know the trends that
are coming, and so that becomesextremely important.
And so those are just a coupleof the misconceptions.
(12:58):
Now there's some other tweaksthat we do as well to ensure
that your email is going to theinbox, but that's something that
we can have a furtherone-on-one conversation about
with somebody if they'reinterested.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
Yeah, I think those misconceptions I think are spot
on and one of the things that Ithink is really important as
well with staying in touch withyour past customers and trying
to get them to buy again, isthat if you can set up that
system and show that you can, ona consistent basis, reactivate
(13:36):
those customers, that is a hugeplus, a huge bump in the value
of your business.
If you can show that you can,on a regular basis, reactivate
your customers, that's recurringrevenue essentially, and that
will really improve the overallvalue of your business.
So if you're ever looking tosell which is something that you
(13:58):
did and I'd love to dive intothis with you is, you know, that
can be a huge plus, you know,on the price that you actually
ended up getting for yourbusiness.
Um, could you talk a little bitabout what that experience of
selling your your paintingbusiness was like?
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, absolutely.
So, just to put it out there,the process takes a while.
Okay, there's a lot that needsto be done in preparation of
selling a business, but what Ihad done is I had met with a
business broker.
It'd be just like a realtor ifyou're looking for a house.
(14:35):
And so I met with a businessbroker and we were able to put
it on the market, so to speak,for other people to look at.
But the things that really madethe business sellable was the
fact of how many of the pastclients so what is the
(14:55):
percentage of the past clientsthat are that are coming back,
um, to you?
Uh, what is the percentage ofreferrals that are coming back?
Because what people are doingwhen they're looking to buy your
company is they're looking tobuy a system.
Um, they're not necessarilyjust looking to buy your name.
Your name is is one aspect ofit, but that name and the
(15:17):
systems you have got to becontinually bringing in work.
And so what I was able to showwas that I had low cost of
advertising, because I didn'tneed to throw, you know, giant
bucks at it in order to get myname out there, because of
(15:39):
systems like my newsletter wasable to bring in a high number
of past clients and referrals,and so you know it really took.
You know, potential buyerlooking at well, what are my
systems?
How do we have this in place?
Are things clean?
Are they organized?
(15:59):
You know what is that producingon a regular basis, and so
would a potential buyer be ableto step in and that system
continue to move forward.
So I've always been big aboutthe systems in place and so that
really played a key role.
(16:21):
And, to be honest with you guys, with the online bookkeeping,
I've used your service for many,many, many, many years and you
know you guys really helped meto see some of those numbers and
to know what types of things Ineeded to kind of systemize a
(16:42):
little bit more in order to getit to this point, to where I
could take a $2 million businessand now sell it to another
client and be able to walk awayfrom it and that system still
produce.
But you guys, things like thenewsletter, those were huge for
(17:05):
the buyer of my companypersonally, Nice.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Yeah, you mentioned low cost of advertising.
Would you mind sharing, like,what was your cost of
advertising?
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Oh, I think I only spent about one to one and a
half percent of my total revenue.
You know, I didn't spend moneyon the SEO.
I didn't.
You know there are things thatI did at times, so don't get me
wrong.
There are some advantages tosome of the SEO that I did do at
(17:39):
times, but those were veryminimal.
Was able to get the name intothe contractor's three pack,
which we all see now when we goto a Google search, which we all
see now when we go to a Googlesearch.
So with that and then doing theadvertising I mean with the
newsletter you know I hate tomake it sound like, hey, the
(18:02):
newsletter's all you need,because there's definitely other
ways to you want to add on topof that that you could go even
further than what I did.
I know that if I would havekept the business for a number
more years, I probably wouldhave thrown some more money at
some other types of avenues, butfor what I needed in order to
(18:26):
get the company to that levelthat was the big thing
Consistently posted on Facebookand Instagram level, um, that
was the big thing, consistentlyposted on facebook and instagram
, um, but that, that, that's.
That's about the bulk of it, totell you the truth.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
That's that's incredible.
I mean for a painting businessdoing over two million in
revenue having a cost ofadvertising of one and a half
percent or lower.
I mean that's that's amazing.
I mean because typically you'llsee painting businesses
especially that are trying tohit higher revenues, you know,
somewhere between five and 10%For for marketing costs, and so
(19:03):
you're only spending one and ahalf percent.
I would venture to say probablya big part of that was because
you actually reactivated yourprior customers, cause that's so
much cheaper than trying to getnew customers all the time,
cause I know a lot of folks arefocused on getting new customers
doing door to door and Facebookmarketing, which are fine Not
to say that you shouldn't dothat, but you can if you're.
(19:26):
If you're not doing thecustomer reactivation stuff, you
know you should probably focuson that first, especially if
you've been around for a while.
You got a large list then goingafter the always going after
new customers.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Absolutely.
I mean, in the industry we callit re-engagement and you see
this all the time.
Any business that you shop withonline, what starts to happen
right from there?
You start to get emails fromthem either offering specific
discounts or offering, hey, thisis some other products and you
might not purchase off of thatfirst email, you might not
(20:02):
purchase off that second emailor that third email, but if they
have your attention and you'reat least perusing that, when you
see something, when somethingkind of triggers for you, then
you're going to click on thatlink and you're going to go
ahead and make that purchase.
And so all the big companieshave figured this out.
(20:23):
The thing is, is that smallerbusinesses, and especially
within our trade you know,that's one big thing that I
think hasn't really clickedfully that, hey, my inbox is
flooded all the time.
I look at these emails on aconstant basis.
Why am I not doing this to myclients and engaging them the
(20:44):
exact same way?
Um, and it gives you thatpersonal feel to it.
We know that that's a trend inthe industry is that people want
that personal feel to it.
We know that that's a trend inthe industry is that people want
that personal touch and so ifyou're getting that, that
customized newsletter withcertain articles that you know
interest them, I mean that'sjust adding another layer of a
(21:04):
personal touch.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
One of the other things you mentioned about going
through the process of sellingyour business.
Was you you really the processof selling your business?
Was you you really?
The buyer wants to have systems.
You know when they'repurchasing a business they want
to ensure that they're buying abusiness that has systems set up
.
Could you talk a little bitmore about what was important
for for selling your yourpainting business like?
(21:28):
What systems are you referringto what?
What do you when you systems?
What are we really talkingabout?
Are we talking about thewritten processes?
Are we talking about thesoftware or a combination of
both?
Like, could you kind of justunpack that a little bit further
?
Speaker 2 (21:42):
Yeah, that's a good question.
So it would be a little bit ofboth.
You know, what the businessneeds to be is that I'm not
doing everything.
That's really the big thing,that I have other people in
place and this is how we goabout doing the business as a
(22:02):
whole.
And so within my business I hadmy crew lead, so I had a model
where I was part employees, partsubcontractors.
I had a model where I was partemployees, part subcontractors,
and so my employees, I had mycrew leads for each job, and for
the subcontractors I had mylist of subcontractors that we
(22:23):
used.
I had for the subcontractors Ihad a project manager that would
oversee, get the crew set up ona project and also close down
on the project before it wasever presented to the client.
And then on top of that I hadan operations manager who
(22:44):
oversaw the crews, ordered theproduct, took care of issues
that occurred.
And then I also had my officemanager which kind of helped in
that flow as well in the billing.
And then I had at the end forthe last year I had a
(23:06):
residential estimator, while Ifocused a little bit more on the
commercial estimating end of it, and if I would have gone
further in it.
I would have taken myself backif I hired a commercial
estimator to come in and then Iwould have just kind of oversaw
all the things.
But there was certain softwarethat I used as well to kind of
(23:28):
help with that process, and sosome of the software that I was
using was an important part sothat everyone knew what their
role was and how a projectflowed from beginning to end.
One of the things that I talkedabout that's really important is
what is the customer'sexperience?
So the customer's experiencestarts from that moment that
(23:50):
they pick up the phone or send atext or fill out an online form
till the project is complete,and then further on with that
which, where the newslettercomes at that very end, on how
we continue to reengage.
So what does that client'sexperience look like from that
start to end?
A lot of times, paintingcompanies will focus on just
(24:13):
what the customer experience iswhen they're in the house and
they're actually doing the work.
Well, you know, I think that'sthe wrong time to really focus
on that.
They could already have a badtaste in their mouth, and so you
want to make sure that from thevery beginning, that that
entire experience to them is asmooth transaction and that they
(24:35):
feel that their needs are beingmet, that they're being heard
and that you truly understandwhat they're looking for.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
Makes sense Cool.
Well, this has been an amazingconversation.
I really appreciate you sharingyour journey and your process
with emailing, reactivatingcustomers and going through the
process of selling your business.
Where can folks learn moreabout how you can help them with
(25:04):
developing high convertingemails and reactivating their
list?
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Yeah, so I'll be able to send you over a link for
that.
I'm currently in the process.
When I first started thebusiness, I was looking at doing
some other areas of marketing,and so I have the
paintersmarketingprocom outthere.
I'm currently in the process ofchanging that over to email
(25:30):
newsletters for painters.
Um, because that's the onlything I really want to hone in
on and really focus on is justthat.
Um, so painters marketingprocom would currently get you
to a site that you could set upa uh, an appointment where we
could kind of discuss and see ifwe're going to be the right fit
for you and in the system.
(25:50):
Um, but, uh, that's going to begetting changed here within the
next week or so, and so I'llsend that out to you as well, so
they could reach out throughyou and then I could talk to
them or they could go right tothat website.
One of the things, too, becauseyou know I love your business
(26:12):
so much.
Like I said, you guys have beeninstrumental in helping me grow
to where it's at Anybody whomentions this podcast.
I am running a discount rightnow for them, and then also what
I'm going to be throwing infree, something that's been a
really help in pre-positioningmy company.
(26:33):
I have a guide eight things youmust know before hiring a
painting contractor, and this isabout a 20 page thing that just
kind of goes through everythingabout you know to the client.
You're not just going topurchase a TV to where you know,
you can just go to any storeand the TV is going to be
exactly the same.
Hiring a contractor is atotally different experience and
(26:59):
so there are differentquestions that should be asked,
and so it just tries to help topre-position, put the customer
in the right type of mindset.
So when a client sets up anappointment, I would send out
that guide right away to them,and then also, when I'd send out
the quote, I would send outthat guide right away to them,
and then also, when I'd send outthe quote, I would send them
that guide one more time.
But I'm going to throw that in.
(27:20):
That's something I typicallycharge, but I'm going to throw
that in free for anybody whocontacts me through this link
here and signs up for thenewsletter.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Awesome, that's amazing.
We'll include the link in theshow notes.
If you want to grab ahold ofthat offer, I'd highly recommend
it.
I mean, mike has doneeverything that he's walked the
walk, and so if you don't wantto have to spend years dialing
in your system for reactivatingcustomers, just go with what's
already worked in the past andmake it easy, hit the easy
(27:53):
button and definitely schedule atime to talk with Mike and get
that low cost of leads throughcustomer reactivation.
Cool, I really appreciate yourtime, mike.
Any last thoughts before I letyou go today.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
You know, just, I mean you kind of hit it all.
I mean it is low cost.
You know, one sole job for thatwould basically pay for the
newsletter for the entire yearand then everything after that
would be just profit.
And I do a month by month basisbecause I want to be able to
(28:31):
prove myself consistently thatwhat we're delivering for you
and your clients is something ofvalue.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
So yeah, cool, awesome.
All right With that, we willsee you all next week All right,
thank you.
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