December 26, 2025 • 37 mins
If you’ve ever felt trapped between the brush and the books, this conversation will feel like a map out of the maze. We sit down with Cui of Paramo Painting in San Antonio to trace his path from chaotic early days to a focused, people-first business powered by servant leadership, job costing, and simple, repeatable processes. The turning point wasn’t a hack—it was humility. Honest feedback pushed him to stop muscling through and start building a company that serves both customers and the crew.
We dig into the guts of operations: how job costing exposes hidden leaks in labor and materials, why clear work orders reduce rework, and how a tight sales-to-production handoff sets crews up to win. Cui shares how he defined core values, set standards for behavior and appearance on site, and used those standards to hire and part ways—because culture is what you tolerate. Delegation emerges as the hardest skill for a craftsman-founder to learn. Handing “the baby” to someone else is scary, but Cui shows how to give trust early, offer a roadmap, and coach through feedback loops so the team can handle repeat clients without founder dependency.
Education and community accelerated the climb. From PCA events and PCA Español to audiobooks and frameworks like StoryBrand, Cui built a learning habit that shifted instincts from reaction to design. We explore when it’s right to stay small by choice, and what it takes to scale with intention: consistent job costing, clear scopes, values-driven hiring, and scheduled time to mentor your leaders. Problems don’t go away; they move upstream as you solve them—so treat each one as a chance to make the business stronger and more profitable.
Ready to run a company, not just a crew? Press play, grab a notebook, and pick one system to build this week. If this helped, follow the show, share it with a contractor friend, and leave a quick review so more painters can profit from their work.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:03):
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast, the
show where painting contractorslearn how to boost profits, cut
taxes, and build a business thatworks for them.
I'm your host, Daniel Honan,CPA, former painting business
owner, and your guide tomastering the numbers that drive
success.
So let's dive in and make yourbusiness more profitable one
episode at a time.
Super excited today to speakwith Kui from Paramo Painting
(00:28):
out of Texas.
Super excited.
How's it going, Kui?
SPEAKER_00 (00:31):
Pretty good, man.
Very excited to be here withyou.
Thank you for the opportunity.
SPEAKER_01 (00:35):
Absolutely.
Glad to glad to talk, man.
I I see I feel like I see youlike so much at the different
events.
We we were just on uh SanAntonio.
Well, I was just in San Antonio.
You're always in that area, butum, and we were at the PCA
Espanol event, so it's cool touh to jump on a podcast with
you.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
Thank you, man.
Uh yeah, my backyard was washosting all those nice events.
Hope everybody get getssomething good to apply in their
company.
SPEAKER_01 (01:05):
So yes, sir.
Yeah, it's definitely a lot Iknow a lot of folks feel like
it's drinking out of a fire hosegoing to like a PCA event
because there's so many, so muchgood information, it's almost
hard to know where to startbecause there's so many things
to improve, so many things toimplement, and it's just kind of
overload for for a few daystrying to figure out okay, what
(01:27):
do I start with?
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
Yeah, especially if you're going like not knowing
what to spec.
I mean, I mean, I thinksometimes when you're used to
this event, now you have a goal.
You know, today I'm going afterthis and and so forth.
SPEAKER_01 (01:41):
Yes, sir.
Well, for folks that don't knowyou, and I know you're pretty
well known in the in theindustry because you're you're
always at the events and uhsupporting the PCA.
But for those that don't knowyou, could you let folks know
how did you get started in thepainting industry and what have
been some major milestones alongthe way?
SPEAKER_00 (02:02):
Well, uh my name is uh Kui Peramo.
Um I'm the founder of ParamoPainting, uh located here in San
Antonio, Texas.
And uh how we started business,I think like like everybody, you
know, like you want to be arocket science, you you aim for
that since you're five yearsold.
No, I mean like everybody.
We you're here for for need, youknow.
(02:23):
We need to uh provide to to ourfamilies, to ourselves.
So and then uh then we decide toto start doing it on our own.
And and I just realized thatit's not not easy.
So that's why I started goinginto this kind of events.
So to you know, like to to findpeople like-minded, uh dealing
(02:46):
with the uh the same problemsthat I do.
Probably they fix their problemsalready so I can learn from them
or try to help in this case,people uh uh doing uh dealing
with what I was dealing with.
So milestones, it's I want tosay I have now I have friendship
(03:07):
with a lot of people.
Uh I have like I can tell yougood friendship.
Good uh I've been uh now I havethe uh opportunity to have
others, which I didn't know it'ssomething that I really like to
do.
And of course, um I mean uh havemy company to be more uh I don't
(03:28):
know if we should use the theword successful, but let's be to
have a company not to be aheadache, you know, like
learning how to do processes,learning how to if if you really
have a profitable comp uhcompany or not, you know.
So I think I think that's themain thing, you know, to know
(03:49):
where you're stepping on.
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:53):
And so how long have you been in the industry at this
point?
Uh the industry as a painter,uh, I mean, like almost 20
years, but uh being on on thisside of the of the field, it's
uh it's been almost like sevenseven years.
SPEAKER_01 (04:11):
Okay, so 20 years overall, 14 or six.
I'm sorry.
Yeah, like 13 or 14 as apainter, and then seven or so as
a as a business owner.
SPEAKER_00 (04:24):
Yes, sir.
SPEAKER_01 (04:25):
Okay, awesome.
And uh I know one of the thingsthat you had started, you felt
like in the beginning, first,and this is pretty much
everybody, I think, that startsa business, it was kind of
chaotic in the beginning.
When you first start, you don'thave processes, you don't have
clarity on your numbers, and andthen over time you you sound
(04:48):
like you linked up withlike-minded people, started
going to the PCA events, andstarted like learning on what
things you could implement,improve your processes.
Um at what point, what was likethe the thing that made you
reach out for help?
Because it sounded like for afew a couple of years there, you
(05:09):
might have been strugglingpretty you know significantly,
which most people do, uhstarting out in the in as a
painting business owner.
What point did you actuallystart reaching out, getting
help, and like making bigreforms in your business?
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Uh when what happened is uh uh a certain
point I start uh paintingmyself, and then I start having
uh too much time to spare.
And and I said, What can I do tobe better for my guys?
You know, like I've been verycommitted with it, uh, my
(05:49):
people.
Like I I think it's if not themost important, one of the most
important uh uh assets of thecompany, you know, uh, or
people.
And and I start trying to learnhow to be a better leader.
Because uh honestly, as a uhtechnician, you don't think like
(06:11):
you can um help people, youknow, you just think like people
is there for for uh screw you.
Unfortunately, we think likethat.
Uh and um and I said, what can Ido to get better, right?
Start looking into uh into Ialways like to read books, but
(06:31):
since uh work uh I just learneduh even you can listen to a good
book, and then uh I got hookedup with the podcast of um um PCA
uh Paintet on Spotify.
And uh and I started listeningto all these people, you know.
I mean, I don't remember whoreally listened the most, but uh
(06:55):
I used to like uh listen tostories that real people, the
real people that talk uh uhpaint works, uh words.
So uh then I started what is PCAabout, and then happened to be
on a San Antonio residentialforum.
So um and uh and I I went there,I met a lot of people.
(07:15):
I don't think if you were there,uh, but a lot of people that
I've been bumping each other'sheads on uh on on other events,
I met him in uh in San Antonio.
Like is it crazy?
Yeah.
Then I start going to expo, Istarted meeting new people, and
then we start this uh this newwave about uh PCA in espanhol.
(07:39):
Um, and uh I'm happy to to helpwith that.
SPEAKER_01 (07:43):
So nice.
So I guess you know you you youmentioned you're you had you
know painters working for youand you wanted to be a better
leader.
What kind of spurred that?
What was the thing that made yourealize, man, I really need to
step up my game as a leader?
SPEAKER_00 (08:05):
When you realize that you're not you're not
right, you know, like um Ialways get to be the one who
said the last word.
Uh never had an input into ituntil somebody hit me hard
saying, like, um I'm I'm not agood person, you know?
And I'm like, I feel like I'm agood person, like I just
(08:28):
realized that I'm not a goodleader.
So it was we're we as thetechnicians, Daniel, we're like
until something happened to us,we kind of start doing things,
right?
Like put up with a fire.
And then when I jump into thisworld, uh, it's not just about
pain, it's about uh it's aboutbeing uh like like the entire
(08:54):
entire body of being a businessowner and and not just to be the
business owner.
It's uh being a leader, being uhum being a uh a good person on
and uh um on the eyes of thesociety, like even the small
town where we are right now, welike to to be part of it, you
(09:14):
know, like not just the leaderof my house.
I want to be the leader of ofmore people.
I want to serve.
I'm I'm looking for that.
That's the word I was lookingfor.
I like to serve people.
So then that hit me hard whensomebody told me that I'm an
evil person.
So I started doing somethingabout it.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (09:35):
So you you got some harsh words, and you basically
dedicated to serving servingyour team, and instead of just
being focused on like puttingout fires and trying to do
things yourself, like try toserve your team, set them up for
success, and and be more of aleader.
Is that how you approachleadership?
(09:57):
Is more of like a servant role?
Has to be, man.
Has to be.
SPEAKER_00 (10:02):
Yeah.
Uh you cannot just come and tellsomebody, well, if you're in the
army, I don't know if you serve,but uh you you have to do what
you you've been told to do, youknow.
Uh and uh probably I'm wrongsaying it, but I'd rather have
people happy working.
(10:22):
It's the numbers don't lie upand on that matter, you know,
when you have somebodycomfortable coming to work uh
instead of saying, like, oh mygoodness, I have to go to work,
you know.
Like um, because also thathappened to me.
I mean, uh one time, like Isaid, being a uh a bat leader,
uh I have a person a personworking on my company, the my
(10:45):
the main guy was afraid to firehim.
Uh, but I was feelingcomfortable going to the job
site in my own company.
So so uh that's why anotherthing that's far like what can I
do to avoid all that, you know.
So um, and I I have to say it,yeah, you have to serve uh uh to
be a good leader, I think.
SPEAKER_01 (11:07):
That makes sense.
You say you you were in themilitary?
SPEAKER_00 (11:10):
No, no, no, no, no.
Oh I I think they I mean youhave to do something that they
they told you to, so not in notin uh not in a in a painting
company, you know what I'msaying?
Okay, gotcha, gotcha.
SPEAKER_01 (11:28):
Okay, I was about to say it's like uh because I was
in the military, so I was like,oh, okay.
Because that is kind of theapproach in the military, is
like uh when I served, um thatwas kind of the mentality as
leaders in the military that youkind of served your team or your
(11:48):
your platoon or your company,whatever.
You can because they're the oneson the front line, they're doing
the hard work.
And as a leader, you have tomake sure that they have they
have the logistics, right?
They have the the bullets andthe and the beans and the rice,
and they have the food and theammo and they're uh also the
(12:11):
training that they need.
And it's your job as a leader tokind of make sure that they're
set up with all those thingsthat they need so that they're
successful in the battlefield.
And so I think what you saidmakes sense.
Where as a leader, it's reallyabout being a servant to your
team to make sure they get allthe things that they need to be
(12:32):
successful.
So, like you said, training,make sure that they have the
right tools, make sure they havethe right the work order, right?
The clear instructions on thatwork order so that they know
what the expectations are, whatthey need to do, that they have
a good handoff, you know, fromfrom sales to production
management, all those things sothat they can do their job and
(12:57):
be successful at it.
Uh is that would you agree?
Yeah, man, 100%.
Yeah.
So what what things changed inthe way you b behaved or how you
did things in your company whenyou made that mindset change uh
(13:21):
from being a just on paper, likein charge of the company, to
trying to be more of a servantleader.
SPEAKER_00 (13:30):
Well, the uh here's the thing.
Back in back then, there's no umjob costing, there's no uh um
work orders, there's nothing.
It's just this is the house,this is what we're gonna do, and
that's it.
Get it done, right?
(13:51):
Because you're a painter, youknow what to do.
So uh then I started gettingdeep into okay, what is uh what
is job costing?
I started doing job costing.
Okay, we're using too much uhmaterial, you know.
You're using we're spending toomuch time on on um
whatchamacallit on labor.
Why on labor?
Because uh the the the crewleader was getting there late
(14:15):
and everybody was clocking inlike two hours before they start
actually working, and littledetails like that that you
cannot address uh when you don'thave the data.
So then those things startchanging.
I feel more confident on whatwhat we're doing.
Um, if I'm charging right, or ifI'm chort charging, uh I made a
(14:38):
mistake, uh uh making anestimate of this project, so and
so.
And at the end of the day, thenumbers were telling me, you're
right, you're wrong, uh, andthis is where you're failing at.
So there's there's no way aroundwhen you put numbers down.
And uh, and of course, it gaveme more time uh to um
whatchamacallit to assess whatit's it hurting the company.
(15:02):
Because eventually we we grew toup to 12 people from three
people to 12 people, and he it'salways you get the this this
phrase that I love it like it,the growing pain.
You know, when you don't havethe system in place, you're just
gonna have people runningrunning like crazy around, you
know, jealousy, gossip.
(15:24):
There's no uh there's no actualbones on something.
So what he changed is little bylittle, uh on on any transition,
any transition, even in yourbody, you lose weight, you get
you have to get rid of clothesthat you you won't uh it won't
fit on you anymore, right?
Um I have to uh say bye to a lotof people that used to be my
(15:51):
co-workers, and another workingfor somebody else, but since
they they're good painters, theyI I wasn't aware that they bad
fit for our company, what wewere achieving, like like uh you
know, like smoking on asomebody's home.
Now we start getting into whatis the core values, what how
we're gonna look in in front ofpeople.
(16:12):
We're gonna be wearing uh uhuniform or at least uh uh uh a
t-shirt that's gonna representthe company.
So that changed in a good way.
Okay, in a good way.
I'm not saying that thathappened and everything is is
now on wheels, right?
You know, even you and yourcompany, you bump into several
(16:35):
issues once in a while, right?
And especially you deal with alot of painters and on the being
the CPA of them, you know, it'shard to keep the well, it's not
hard.
I mean, just to keep thefinances on track, it's
something, right?
So that's what we have to do tobe able to make a decision.
So that's what it changed in agood way.
(17:00):
So and we're keep improvingbecause uh we're not down yet.
SPEAKER_01 (17:05):
Yeah, that's all you can do.
I mean, there's I I think WarrenBuffett said that business is
problems.
Like if you if you're inbusiness, you gotta expect
problems.
Problem that's that's the wholething.
So if you're if you have abusiness right now and you are
(17:26):
surprised when problems arise,you're you probably should do
something else because it's youshould just expect problems to
happen.
If there were no problems, thenpeople wouldn't hire you because
that's the whole reason whythey're hiring you because they
have a problem.
So you gotta you gotta be readyand expecting problems every
day.
(17:47):
So yeah, I totally get it.
And yeah, for sure.
We we're always facing differentproblems, and solving them is
our job, and that's that's allthe only thing you can do is uh
be open to problems.
And uh, I think it was actuallyJeff Bezos.
Um, and one of his biographies,there's a one of the people that
(18:10):
he worked with said thatwhenever Jeff Bezos would find a
problem, when someone wouldbring him a problem, he he
actually got excited.
He's like excited about thatproblem because he felt it was
like an opportunity to improvethe business and you know make
it more valuable or make it moreprofitable.
(18:30):
Because if there was an issue,uh, like if there was a process
issue or whatever, if they fixedit, theoretically it could make
it more efficient and then makeAmazon more profitable.
So so instead of, you know,because I think the the natural
tendency, especially for myself,when when a problem is coming
your way, you're like, oh geez,you know, what what we got now?
(18:54):
You know, there's some someissue, and you like you're kind
of get that uh that feeling inyour gut, like, all right,
what's there's some sort ofissue going on, okay.
But uh he actually had thecomplete 180 feeling.
He he actually got excited,okay, cool.
We have a problem, we can figurethis out once we solve it, then
it's gonna make the businessmore valuable or more profitable
(19:15):
or something.
So I think you know it's uh kindof a mindset shift, and it and
it's also true.
Like if you can the moreproblems you solve in your
business, especially related toprocesses and people, it's gonna
make the business better.
And a better business for theowner is is gonna be is gonna be
(19:35):
good, it's gonna be moreprofitable, more efficient.
And so it's it's all good whenyou're solving solving those
problems.
SPEAKER_00 (19:42):
Yeah, for sure, man.
100% agree.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:46):
So what have been some big the biggest changes?
You said you you grew frombasically having three people in
the team to 12 people in theteam.
What were some of the biggestgrowing pains or challenges for?
from to go from three to twelve.
SPEAKER_00 (20:02):
Yeah.
Uh delegation.
And I mean, uh, like I said,still with the uh technician
mindset, delegation and alsobeing the the owner or the
founder of this uh smallbusiness, it's it's uh
whatchamacallit?
It's painful to to it's notpainful.
(20:23):
It's it's uh it's hard to giveaway your baby, right?
Somebody else take care of yourbaby, especially a uh uh for
example, a customer that I'vebeen I I've been uh having a
customer for since I started mybusiness.
They're calling me back.
And I they have they create thisum vicious uh attachment to me
(20:50):
like if I'm not there they'regonna look for somebody else you
know and then I have this on theback of my head.
So I need to delegate and it'sit's it it is it is a little bit
of a headache when you havesomebody else to do in a uh
going to do um an an estimate uhif this person gonna do it right
or not.
(21:11):
Uh uh what else um thefinancials you know that's the
first thing I want to get rid ofit that's why we have somebody
help us with that.
So I think the legation it'ssomething that I I want to say
(21:31):
probably because I you I knowyou know a lot of people in the
industry that they're neverbeing painters and uh it's easy
for them just to tell somebodywhat to do right um you're gonna
do sales you're gonna do uhadmin you're gonna do project
managing you wanna be in chargeof the production and it's less
(21:51):
painful to to delegate for themand all it I don't I don't know
if you have a number on the thestatistics but the um probably
the sort of people who is doingbetter quicker than than a
technician uh with the brush onthe hand you know so um that's
that's one of the things thatit's uh it's uh it's it's been
(22:16):
harsh it's not it's not aproblem now you know because I I
believe I'm a true believer ofwhen you hire somebody after you
do the the proper uh homeworkwhen you ask the right questions
where you've been working at areyou being uh managing projects
so and so and this is this isn'ta project manager uh manager uh
(22:38):
uh point the uh and then you youstart with the trust over here i
mean i give people trust rightaway high because uh instead of
uh micromanaging with the truston the very low end because at
the end of the day trust is hardto keep you know and if I want
(22:59):
to trust somebody I want toclose my eyes and and this is
your responsibilities here's thethe roadmap because also I
cannot just tell them hey you'regonna do this and you figure out
right because I used to do thatDaniel a lot you know with my
first project manager it waslike hey go to do this you know
and okay what colors go wherelike uh ask the client you know
(23:21):
like it was like that bad so andnow we're we we we're pretty
good at it but it was was uh andon me on me the um the what you
my calling the the the trust thedelegation yeah yeah yeah I feel
like delegation is almost like aa muscle you have to train it's
(23:44):
you know it especially if youare like you said you're you you
are you know how to paint you'regood at it and you have you know
it's in me you know I'm a CPAobviously I work in a CPA firm
so I can do all the things uh sothe tendency is to well I can
(24:07):
just do this really quick totake care of it instead of
working my team delegating it tomy team having them do it having
them have the reps on it getmore confident with it and be
able to take it over for thefuture so it's almost like a um
kind of a crutch almost for forfor you know you as the
(24:28):
craftsman to jump in or you knowyou have the skill jump in and
it's kind of a short term fixlike you're in the short term it
might be better like because yougot it done right then and there
really quick but in the themedium term the long term it's
not good because you're you'rebasically robbing your team of
the opportunity to get theexperience and the training to
(24:51):
be able to do it the next timeand and from that point forward.
SPEAKER_01 (24:55):
So uh I don't have the exact metrics statistics on
what you're saying in terms oflike do folks that don't have
they don't know how to paint dothey grow faster um but I would
agree that that they do not havethat um temptation to want to
(25:18):
jump in when they you know theydon't have the skills so they
are pretty much reliant on theirteam to to execute and so it
just kind of it uh allows you tofocus on growing the business
and the systems and not have toworry about doing the painting
because you don't you don't knowhow to paint.
(25:38):
So it it is an additionalchallenge.
SPEAKER_00 (25:40):
I think you're right for for folks that are that know
the craft that are really goodat it to kind of like you said
uh give your baby away let letsomeone else take take control
and uh and execute that isdefinitely a challenge and that
(26:00):
I know as well um and I know alot of people uh struggle with
that too do you have any tipsfor someone that's trying to you
know get off the brush or youknow get well get their hands
yeah yes I I've been I've beentelling a lot of people lately
(26:21):
like you go to this events andeverybody tell you write down
what are you looking for what isyour your your what is your goal
your your your dream in lifewhere you want to be at you know
and start writing down thingsbecause if uh I I I listened to
that like for five years I neverdone it until I start doing it
(26:42):
and things start going differentwhy I don't know I don't know
it's a magical thing I don'tknow it's like you know I can
give you my my um my loss andprofit out of my mouth then
you're gonna be like dude I needto see it in paper you know so
the uh first figure out what youwant because there's a lot of
(27:05):
people who are doing great justbeing a solo painter with a
helper and you add talks to themand they're they sound so happy
that you I mean I mean that'sthe main thing looking for
happiness or looking forstability looking for something
that you really want to enjoyyou know and uh and they
recognize that they're notpretty good managing people.
(27:27):
That's it.
And uh and I just noticed to meif I don't have people working
with me uh I I I can do okay butI I'm a I'm a people person you
know you heard about the thoseuh um the uh the personality
assessments and all that I'm anI so I I tend to be I want to be
(27:50):
surrounded by people you know umand I like to help people I like
to bless people and I like to dothe right thing for people so I
can tell you if you're okaybeing by yourself go keep doing
it get just just uh look lookfor happiness if you really want
to grow your company you need tostart educating yourself because
(28:15):
uh you cannot just start doingthings out of will you know so
you need to educate yourself youneed to how to how to manage
people how to manage uh yourfinances how to manage your your
uh productions how to manageyour clients how are you gonna
bring more clients how are yougonna take care of your existing
(28:35):
clients you know so that that'sthat's not just like I want to
be a painter I'm gonna uh berich I wanna I just want to uh
uh not clock in clock out I wantto just have freedom because
those are things the uh thatnobody tells you you know the
(28:58):
the the the the problem so ifyou're real you're a problem
solver you're more than welcometo start growing your company
but yes if you don't learn howto delegate you start um uh like
come calming down your feelingsuh you know Nick Slavic managed
that a lot the um feelings plusdata right so you you guys have
(29:22):
to um have to learn how to howto educate yourself because even
I I have a lot of friends thatnever grab a book in their lives
and now we talk about booksright why because they have to
they have to have theperspective of of different
people who've been doing thisfor for over time.
SPEAKER_01 (29:44):
So yeah that's I think there's that saying
leaders are readers so that Ithink that's a helpful a helpful
uh reminder that if you want tolead you got to read and there's
uh there's a lot of great booksout there that business
(30:05):
management but also just likebiographies or memoirs
autobiographies that are superhelpful and just understanding
you know what what uh what youshould do in different
situations and um I know for mebiographies and autobiographies
are really helpful because it'sespecially the more successful
(30:26):
the the the successful businessentrepreneurs but even not quite
uh entrepreneurs like forexample you know Arnold
Schwarzenegger he he he was notquite an he he kind of was an
entrepreneur in some ways likehe did start a country
construction company when he wasyounger and stuff but just his
(30:47):
his uh his mentality on how hehandles things really and and
the how big goals he set forhimself uh he wasn't afraid of
setting big goals but there'sdifferent things you can learn
from people and just theirmindset and way they thought
about things that are verysuccessful.
And uh you know there's alsothat thing where it's you're the
(31:07):
average of the the the fivepeople you spend the most time
with.
And so I think spending timewith like a really successful
person not necessarily in personbut if you're you're reading
their autobiography or theirbiography you're essentially
kind of getting in their headyou're spending time with time
with them.
And if you're always doing thatif you're always reading
(31:29):
autobiographies biographies ofthe most successful people
you're kind of some of thatmindset ideas are gonna rub off
on you you'll get good good waysof thinking about things um I
know at least I have with withhiring managing people leading
people uh it's like you said youknow if if you want to grow your
(31:54):
business beyond yourself whichnot if you don't that's fine
like you said it it's all up toyou and what you want in your
business.
But I think if you if you dowant to grow your business
beyond yourself you do have todefinitely learn and be ready to
continue to learn and be astudent of leadership.
And uh not that you'll ever be aperfect leader or know it all in
(32:18):
terms of leadership but you atleast at least be a student of
it so you can continue toimprove upon where you are now.
It is um cool well I reallyappreciate your time today you
know I'd like to give you anopportunity to you know give any
(32:38):
last thoughts to paintingbusiness owners that are are
maybe uh trying to become betterleaders or get better at
delegating or grow theirbusiness to the next level do
you have any final thoughts onhow they should do that or what
resources are available thatmaybe folks aren't aware of or
(32:59):
anything that uh you'd like toask the audience yeah um you
just said it uh um you gottastart if you can now hang out
with these people people thatyou think are gonna be
beneficial for your life startyou know following them start
listening to them um books I wasif you're not a a book reader
(33:28):
that's fine I mean we as uhwhenever we go to do an estimate
we're driving all the time getan audiobook you know start
listening to it something thatyou feel gonna even if it's uh
like you just said it to Daniellike I like biographies and if
somebody wants to read somethingelse they're gonna feel into it
(33:48):
is that you you you're you'reready um exercising your muscle
and the muscle gonna gonna gonnastart getting into more stuff
you know like then how how tomanage people you know what is
the what can I do about how tomanage my finances how to
delegate there's a lot of goodbooks out there and uh and like
(34:10):
the one I always I always uh Iwant to listen it two three
times uh probably a month is theuh Donald Miller uh building a
story brand it I feel like everytime I listen to it it's I catch
something new so um it really uhit really tells you how to
(34:32):
picture your company what is itwhy you want right uh you
because we're on this um whatyou my calling we're in the
service industry right where uhJason Jason Phillips said a lot
that we're in the peoplebusiness but on the both sides
people working for us people whowe are serving right and how do
(34:53):
you want that people to look atyou to look at your company what
what is it what you want whatwhat is it what you really you
really um are looking for that'sI think sometimes we get lost
into uh what is it what we wantright uh the basic answers
you're gonna get into a newentrepreneur is I want freedom I
(35:14):
want money I want you name iteverything is it's uh um it's uh
it's superficial until you startfinding things like you want
freedom to what to enjoy withyour family or to what to just
leave and get up late because atthe end of the day once once you
(35:35):
find your really uh your reallyuh a goal in life or whatever
you want to do you're gonna getdeeper and deeper and and that's
that's not bad and and the letme tell you uh whoever is going
to this transition uh there's alot of people gonna fall out of
(35:57):
your train because uh yourmindset is gonna start changing
and people gonna think thatyou're not the sand you used to
and something is changing youand you're evil person so so be
prepared for that especiallyfamily it could be could be
painful so start creating thatthe that skin at the end of the
(36:21):
day if that's what you want ifnot I'll see you around and and
we're good we're colleagues nonothing happened so no pasta
nada yeah uh awesome Iappreciate uh those thoughts and
definitely agree I I uh reallyappreciate you sharing your
journey and your thoughts ondelegation and leadership super
(36:44):
important conversation I thinkthat needs to be continue to be
had with painting businessowners uh so really appreciate
you jump on the podcast sharingyour thoughts on the on those
topics and for the audience withthat we will see you next week
Welcome to the Profitable Painter Podcast, the
show where painting contractorslearn how to boost profits, cut
taxes, and build a business thatworks for them.
I'm your host, Daniel Honan,CPA, former painting business
owner, and your guide tomastering the numbers that drive
success.
So let's dive in and make yourbusiness more profitable one
episode at a time.
Super excited today to speakwith Kui from Paramo Painting
(00:28):
out of Texas.
Super excited.
How's it going, Kui?
SPEAKER_00 (00:31):
Pretty good, man.
Very excited to be here withyou.
Thank you for the opportunity.
SPEAKER_01 (00:35):
Absolutely.
Glad to glad to talk, man.
I I see I feel like I see youlike so much at the different
events.
We we were just on uh SanAntonio.
Well, I was just in San Antonio.
You're always in that area, butum, and we were at the PCA
Espanol event, so it's cool touh to jump on a podcast with
you.
SPEAKER_00 (00:55):
Thank you, man.
Uh yeah, my backyard was washosting all those nice events.
Hope everybody get getssomething good to apply in their
company.
SPEAKER_01 (01:05):
So yes, sir.
Yeah, it's definitely a lot Iknow a lot of folks feel like
it's drinking out of a fire hosegoing to like a PCA event
because there's so many, so muchgood information, it's almost
hard to know where to startbecause there's so many things
to improve, so many things toimplement, and it's just kind of
overload for for a few daystrying to figure out okay, what
(01:27):
do I start with?
SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
Yeah, especially if you're going like not knowing
what to spec.
I mean, I mean, I thinksometimes when you're used to
this event, now you have a goal.
You know, today I'm going afterthis and and so forth.
SPEAKER_01 (01:41):
Yes, sir.
Well, for folks that don't knowyou, and I know you're pretty
well known in the in theindustry because you're you're
always at the events and uhsupporting the PCA.
But for those that don't knowyou, could you let folks know
how did you get started in thepainting industry and what have
been some major milestones alongthe way?
SPEAKER_00 (02:02):
Well, uh my name is uh Kui Peramo.
Um I'm the founder of ParamoPainting, uh located here in San
Antonio, Texas.
And uh how we started business,I think like like everybody, you
know, like you want to be arocket science, you you aim for
that since you're five yearsold.
No, I mean like everybody.
We you're here for for need, youknow.
(02:23):
We need to uh provide to to ourfamilies, to ourselves.
So and then uh then we decide toto start doing it on our own.
And and I just realized thatit's not not easy.
So that's why I started goinginto this kind of events.
So to you know, like to to findpeople like-minded, uh dealing
(02:46):
with the uh the same problemsthat I do.
Probably they fix their problemsalready so I can learn from them
or try to help in this case,people uh uh doing uh dealing
with what I was dealing with.
So milestones, it's I want tosay I have now I have friendship
(03:07):
with a lot of people.
Uh I have like I can tell yougood friendship.
Good uh I've been uh now I havethe uh opportunity to have
others, which I didn't know it'ssomething that I really like to
do.
And of course, um I mean uh havemy company to be more uh I don't
(03:28):
know if we should use the theword successful, but let's be to
have a company not to be aheadache, you know, like
learning how to do processes,learning how to if if you really
have a profitable comp uhcompany or not, you know.
So I think I think that's themain thing, you know, to know
(03:49):
where you're stepping on.
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:53):
And so how long have you been in the industry at this
point?
Uh the industry as a painter,uh, I mean, like almost 20
years, but uh being on on thisside of the of the field, it's
uh it's been almost like sevenseven years.
SPEAKER_01 (04:11):
Okay, so 20 years overall, 14 or six.
I'm sorry.
Yeah, like 13 or 14 as apainter, and then seven or so as
a as a business owner.
SPEAKER_00 (04:24):
Yes, sir.
SPEAKER_01 (04:25):
Okay, awesome.
And uh I know one of the thingsthat you had started, you felt
like in the beginning, first,and this is pretty much
everybody, I think, that startsa business, it was kind of
chaotic in the beginning.
When you first start, you don'thave processes, you don't have
clarity on your numbers, and andthen over time you you sound
(04:48):
like you linked up withlike-minded people, started
going to the PCA events, andstarted like learning on what
things you could implement,improve your processes.
Um at what point, what was likethe the thing that made you
reach out for help?
Because it sounded like for afew a couple of years there, you
(05:09):
might have been strugglingpretty you know significantly,
which most people do, uhstarting out in the in as a
painting business owner.
What point did you actuallystart reaching out, getting
help, and like making bigreforms in your business?
SPEAKER_00 (05:26):
Uh when what happened is uh uh a certain
point I start uh paintingmyself, and then I start having
uh too much time to spare.
And and I said, What can I do tobe better for my guys?
You know, like I've been verycommitted with it, uh, my
(05:49):
people.
Like I I think it's if not themost important, one of the most
important uh uh assets of thecompany, you know, uh, or
people.
And and I start trying to learnhow to be a better leader.
Because uh honestly, as a uhtechnician, you don't think like
(06:11):
you can um help people, youknow, you just think like people
is there for for uh screw you.
Unfortunately, we think likethat.
Uh and um and I said, what can Ido to get better, right?
Start looking into uh into Ialways like to read books, but
(06:31):
since uh work uh I just learneduh even you can listen to a good
book, and then uh I got hookedup with the podcast of um um PCA
uh Paintet on Spotify.
And uh and I started listeningto all these people, you know.
I mean, I don't remember whoreally listened the most, but uh
(06:55):
I used to like uh listen tostories that real people, the
real people that talk uh uhpaint works, uh words.
So uh then I started what is PCAabout, and then happened to be
on a San Antonio residentialforum.
So um and uh and I I went there,I met a lot of people.
(07:15):
I don't think if you were there,uh, but a lot of people that
I've been bumping each other'sheads on uh on on other events,
I met him in uh in San Antonio.
Like is it crazy?
Yeah.
Then I start going to expo, Istarted meeting new people, and
then we start this uh this newwave about uh PCA in espanhol.
(07:39):
Um, and uh I'm happy to to helpwith that.
SPEAKER_01 (07:43):
So nice.
So I guess you know you you youmentioned you're you had you
know painters working for youand you wanted to be a better
leader.
What kind of spurred that?
What was the thing that made yourealize, man, I really need to
step up my game as a leader?
SPEAKER_00 (08:05):
When you realize that you're not you're not
right, you know, like um Ialways get to be the one who
said the last word.
Uh never had an input into ituntil somebody hit me hard
saying, like, um I'm I'm not agood person, you know?
And I'm like, I feel like I'm agood person, like I just
(08:28):
realized that I'm not a goodleader.
So it was we're we as thetechnicians, Daniel, we're like
until something happened to us,we kind of start doing things,
right?
Like put up with a fire.
And then when I jump into thisworld, uh, it's not just about
pain, it's about uh it's aboutbeing uh like like the entire
(08:54):
entire body of being a businessowner and and not just to be the
business owner.
It's uh being a leader, being uhum being a uh a good person on
and uh um on the eyes of thesociety, like even the small
town where we are right now, welike to to be part of it, you
(09:14):
know, like not just the leaderof my house.
I want to be the leader of ofmore people.
I want to serve.
I'm I'm looking for that.
That's the word I was lookingfor.
I like to serve people.
So then that hit me hard whensomebody told me that I'm an
evil person.
So I started doing somethingabout it.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (09:35):
So you you got some harsh words, and you basically
dedicated to serving servingyour team, and instead of just
being focused on like puttingout fires and trying to do
things yourself, like try toserve your team, set them up for
success, and and be more of aleader.
Is that how you approachleadership?
(09:57):
Is more of like a servant role?
Has to be, man.
Has to be.
SPEAKER_00 (10:02):
Yeah.
Uh you cannot just come and tellsomebody, well, if you're in the
army, I don't know if you serve,but uh you you have to do what
you you've been told to do, youknow.
Uh and uh probably I'm wrongsaying it, but I'd rather have
people happy working.
(10:22):
It's the numbers don't lie upand on that matter, you know,
when you have somebodycomfortable coming to work uh
instead of saying, like, oh mygoodness, I have to go to work,
you know.
Like um, because also thathappened to me.
I mean, uh one time, like Isaid, being a uh a bat leader,
uh I have a person a personworking on my company, the my
(10:45):
the main guy was afraid to firehim.
Uh, but I was feelingcomfortable going to the job
site in my own company.
So so uh that's why anotherthing that's far like what can I
do to avoid all that, you know.
So um, and I I have to say it,yeah, you have to serve uh uh to
be a good leader, I think.
SPEAKER_01 (11:07):
That makes sense.
You say you you were in themilitary?
SPEAKER_00 (11:10):
No, no, no, no, no.
Oh I I think they I mean youhave to do something that they
they told you to, so not in notin uh not in a in a painting
company, you know what I'msaying?
Okay, gotcha, gotcha.
SPEAKER_01 (11:28):
Okay, I was about to say it's like uh because I was
in the military, so I was like,oh, okay.
Because that is kind of theapproach in the military, is
like uh when I served, um thatwas kind of the mentality as
leaders in the military that youkind of served your team or your
(11:48):
your platoon or your company,whatever.
You can because they're the oneson the front line, they're doing
the hard work.
And as a leader, you have tomake sure that they have they
have the logistics, right?
They have the the bullets andthe and the beans and the rice,
and they have the food and theammo and they're uh also the
(12:11):
training that they need.
And it's your job as a leader tokind of make sure that they're
set up with all those thingsthat they need so that they're
successful in the battlefield.
And so I think what you saidmakes sense.
Where as a leader, it's reallyabout being a servant to your
team to make sure they get allthe things that they need to be
(12:32):
successful.
So, like you said, training,make sure that they have the
right tools, make sure they havethe right the work order, right?
The clear instructions on thatwork order so that they know
what the expectations are, whatthey need to do, that they have
a good handoff, you know, fromfrom sales to production
management, all those things sothat they can do their job and
(12:57):
be successful at it.
Uh is that would you agree?
Yeah, man, 100%.
Yeah.
So what what things changed inthe way you b behaved or how you
did things in your company whenyou made that mindset change uh
(13:21):
from being a just on paper, likein charge of the company, to
trying to be more of a servantleader.
SPEAKER_00 (13:30):
Well, the uh here's the thing.
Back in back then, there's no umjob costing, there's no uh um
work orders, there's nothing.
It's just this is the house,this is what we're gonna do, and
that's it.
Get it done, right?
(13:51):
Because you're a painter, youknow what to do.
So uh then I started gettingdeep into okay, what is uh what
is job costing?
I started doing job costing.
Okay, we're using too much uhmaterial, you know.
You're using we're spending toomuch time on on um
whatchamacallit on labor.
Why on labor?
Because uh the the the crewleader was getting there late
(14:15):
and everybody was clocking inlike two hours before they start
actually working, and littledetails like that that you
cannot address uh when you don'thave the data.
So then those things startchanging.
I feel more confident on whatwhat we're doing.
Um, if I'm charging right, or ifI'm chort charging, uh I made a
(14:38):
mistake, uh uh making anestimate of this project, so and
so.
And at the end of the day, thenumbers were telling me, you're
right, you're wrong, uh, andthis is where you're failing at.
So there's there's no way aroundwhen you put numbers down.
And uh, and of course, it gaveme more time uh to um
whatchamacallit to assess whatit's it hurting the company.
(15:02):
Because eventually we we grew toup to 12 people from three
people to 12 people, and he it'salways you get the this this
phrase that I love it like it,the growing pain.
You know, when you don't havethe system in place, you're just
gonna have people runningrunning like crazy around, you
know, jealousy, gossip.
(15:24):
There's no uh there's no actualbones on something.
So what he changed is little bylittle, uh on on any transition,
any transition, even in yourbody, you lose weight, you get
you have to get rid of clothesthat you you won't uh it won't
fit on you anymore, right?
Um I have to uh say bye to a lotof people that used to be my
(15:51):
co-workers, and another workingfor somebody else, but since
they they're good painters, theyI I wasn't aware that they bad
fit for our company, what wewere achieving, like like uh you
know, like smoking on asomebody's home.
Now we start getting into whatis the core values, what how
we're gonna look in in front ofpeople.
(16:12):
We're gonna be wearing uh uhuniform or at least uh uh uh a
t-shirt that's gonna representthe company.
So that changed in a good way.
Okay, in a good way.
I'm not saying that thathappened and everything is is
now on wheels, right?
You know, even you and yourcompany, you bump into several
(16:35):
issues once in a while, right?
And especially you deal with alot of painters and on the being
the CPA of them, you know, it'shard to keep the well, it's not
hard.
I mean, just to keep thefinances on track, it's
something, right?
So that's what we have to do tobe able to make a decision.
So that's what it changed in agood way.
(17:00):
So and we're keep improvingbecause uh we're not down yet.
SPEAKER_01 (17:05):
Yeah, that's all you can do.
I mean, there's I I think WarrenBuffett said that business is
problems.
Like if you if you're inbusiness, you gotta expect
problems.
Problem that's that's the wholething.
So if you're if you have abusiness right now and you are
(17:26):
surprised when problems arise,you're you probably should do
something else because it's youshould just expect problems to
happen.
If there were no problems, thenpeople wouldn't hire you because
that's the whole reason whythey're hiring you because they
have a problem.
So you gotta you gotta be readyand expecting problems every
day.
(17:47):
So yeah, I totally get it.
And yeah, for sure.
We we're always facing differentproblems, and solving them is
our job, and that's that's allthe only thing you can do is uh
be open to problems.
And uh, I think it was actuallyJeff Bezos.
Um, and one of his biographies,there's a one of the people that
(18:10):
he worked with said thatwhenever Jeff Bezos would find a
problem, when someone wouldbring him a problem, he he
actually got excited.
He's like excited about thatproblem because he felt it was
like an opportunity to improvethe business and you know make
it more valuable or make it moreprofitable.
(18:30):
Because if there was an issue,uh, like if there was a process
issue or whatever, if they fixedit, theoretically it could make
it more efficient and then makeAmazon more profitable.
So so instead of, you know,because I think the the natural
tendency, especially for myself,when when a problem is coming
your way, you're like, oh geez,you know, what what we got now?
(18:54):
You know, there's some someissue, and you like you're kind
of get that uh that feeling inyour gut, like, all right,
what's there's some sort ofissue going on, okay.
But uh he actually had thecomplete 180 feeling.
He he actually got excited,okay, cool.
We have a problem, we can figurethis out once we solve it, then
it's gonna make the businessmore valuable or more profitable
(19:15):
or something.
So I think you know it's uh kindof a mindset shift, and it and
it's also true.
Like if you can the moreproblems you solve in your
business, especially related toprocesses and people, it's gonna
make the business better.
And a better business for theowner is is gonna be is gonna be
(19:35):
good, it's gonna be moreprofitable, more efficient.
And so it's it's all good whenyou're solving solving those
problems.
SPEAKER_00 (19:42):
Yeah, for sure, man.
100% agree.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:46):
So what have been some big the biggest changes?
You said you you grew frombasically having three people in
the team to 12 people in theteam.
What were some of the biggestgrowing pains or challenges for?
from to go from three to twelve.
SPEAKER_00 (20:02):
Yeah.
Uh delegation.
And I mean, uh, like I said,still with the uh technician
mindset, delegation and alsobeing the the owner or the
founder of this uh smallbusiness, it's it's uh
whatchamacallit?
It's painful to to it's notpainful.
(20:23):
It's it's uh it's hard to giveaway your baby, right?
Somebody else take care of yourbaby, especially a uh uh for
example, a customer that I'vebeen I I've been uh having a
customer for since I started mybusiness.
They're calling me back.
And I they have they create thisum vicious uh attachment to me
(20:50):
like if I'm not there they'regonna look for somebody else you
know and then I have this on theback of my head.
So I need to delegate and it'sit's it it is it is a little bit
of a headache when you havesomebody else to do in a uh
going to do um an an estimate uhif this person gonna do it right
or not.
(21:11):
Uh uh what else um thefinancials you know that's the
first thing I want to get rid ofit that's why we have somebody
help us with that.
So I think the legation it'ssomething that I I want to say
(21:31):
probably because I you I knowyou know a lot of people in the
industry that they're neverbeing painters and uh it's easy
for them just to tell somebodywhat to do right um you're gonna
do sales you're gonna do uhadmin you're gonna do project
managing you wanna be in chargeof the production and it's less
(21:51):
painful to to delegate for themand all it I don't I don't know
if you have a number on the thestatistics but the um probably
the sort of people who is doingbetter quicker than than a
technician uh with the brush onthe hand you know so um that's
that's one of the things thatit's uh it's uh it's it's been
(22:16):
harsh it's not it's not aproblem now you know because I I
believe I'm a true believer ofwhen you hire somebody after you
do the the proper uh homeworkwhen you ask the right questions
where you've been working at areyou being uh managing projects
so and so and this is this isn'ta project manager uh manager uh
(22:38):
uh point the uh and then you youstart with the trust over here i
mean i give people trust rightaway high because uh instead of
uh micromanaging with the truston the very low end because at
the end of the day trust is hardto keep you know and if I want
(22:59):
to trust somebody I want toclose my eyes and and this is
your responsibilities here's thethe roadmap because also I
cannot just tell them hey you'regonna do this and you figure out
right because I used to do thatDaniel a lot you know with my
first project manager it waslike hey go to do this you know
and okay what colors go wherelike uh ask the client you know
(23:21):
like it was like that bad so andnow we're we we we're pretty
good at it but it was was uh andon me on me the um the what you
my calling the the the trust thedelegation yeah yeah yeah I feel
like delegation is almost like aa muscle you have to train it's
(23:44):
you know it especially if youare like you said you're you you
are you know how to paint you'regood at it and you have you know
it's in me you know I'm a CPAobviously I work in a CPA firm
so I can do all the things uh sothe tendency is to well I can
(24:07):
just do this really quick totake care of it instead of
working my team delegating it tomy team having them do it having
them have the reps on it getmore confident with it and be
able to take it over for thefuture so it's almost like a um
kind of a crutch almost for forfor you know you as the
(24:28):
craftsman to jump in or you knowyou have the skill jump in and
it's kind of a short term fixlike you're in the short term it
might be better like because yougot it done right then and there
really quick but in the themedium term the long term it's
not good because you're you'rebasically robbing your team of
the opportunity to get theexperience and the training to
(24:51):
be able to do it the next timeand and from that point forward.
SPEAKER_01 (24:55):
So uh I don't have the exact metrics statistics on
what you're saying in terms oflike do folks that don't have
they don't know how to paint dothey grow faster um but I would
agree that that they do not havethat um temptation to want to
(25:18):
jump in when they you know theydon't have the skills so they
are pretty much reliant on theirteam to to execute and so it
just kind of it uh allows you tofocus on growing the business
and the systems and not have toworry about doing the painting
because you don't you don't knowhow to paint.
(25:38):
So it it is an additionalchallenge.
SPEAKER_00 (25:40):
I think you're right for for folks that are that know
the craft that are really goodat it to kind of like you said
uh give your baby away let letsomeone else take take control
and uh and execute that isdefinitely a challenge and that
(26:00):
I know as well um and I know alot of people uh struggle with
that too do you have any tipsfor someone that's trying to you
know get off the brush or youknow get well get their hands
yeah yes I I've been I've beentelling a lot of people lately
(26:21):
like you go to this events andeverybody tell you write down
what are you looking for what isyour your your what is your goal
your your your dream in lifewhere you want to be at you know
and start writing down thingsbecause if uh I I I listened to
that like for five years I neverdone it until I start doing it
(26:42):
and things start going differentwhy I don't know I don't know
it's a magical thing I don'tknow it's like you know I can
give you my my um my loss andprofit out of my mouth then
you're gonna be like dude I needto see it in paper you know so
the uh first figure out what youwant because there's a lot of
(27:05):
people who are doing great justbeing a solo painter with a
helper and you add talks to themand they're they sound so happy
that you I mean I mean that'sthe main thing looking for
happiness or looking forstability looking for something
that you really want to enjoyyou know and uh and they
recognize that they're notpretty good managing people.
(27:27):
That's it.
And uh and I just noticed to meif I don't have people working
with me uh I I I can do okay butI I'm a I'm a people person you
know you heard about the thoseuh um the uh the personality
assessments and all that I'm anI so I I tend to be I want to be
(27:50):
surrounded by people you know umand I like to help people I like
to bless people and I like to dothe right thing for people so I
can tell you if you're okaybeing by yourself go keep doing
it get just just uh look lookfor happiness if you really want
to grow your company you need tostart educating yourself because
(28:15):
uh you cannot just start doingthings out of will you know so
you need to educate yourself youneed to how to how to manage
people how to manage uh yourfinances how to manage your your
uh productions how to manageyour clients how are you gonna
bring more clients how are yougonna take care of your existing
(28:35):
clients you know so that that'sthat's not just like I want to
be a painter I'm gonna uh berich I wanna I just want to uh
uh not clock in clock out I wantto just have freedom because
those are things the uh thatnobody tells you you know the
(28:58):
the the the the problem so ifyou're real you're a problem
solver you're more than welcometo start growing your company
but yes if you don't learn howto delegate you start um uh like
come calming down your feelingsuh you know Nick Slavic managed
that a lot the um feelings plusdata right so you you guys have
(29:22):
to um have to learn how to howto educate yourself because even
I I have a lot of friends thatnever grab a book in their lives
and now we talk about booksright why because they have to
they have to have theperspective of of different
people who've been doing thisfor for over time.
SPEAKER_01 (29:44):
So yeah that's I think there's that saying
leaders are readers so that Ithink that's a helpful a helpful
uh reminder that if you want tolead you got to read and there's
uh there's a lot of great booksout there that business
(30:05):
management but also just likebiographies or memoirs
autobiographies that are superhelpful and just understanding
you know what what uh what youshould do in different
situations and um I know for mebiographies and autobiographies
are really helpful because it'sespecially the more successful
(30:26):
the the the successful businessentrepreneurs but even not quite
uh entrepreneurs like forexample you know Arnold
Schwarzenegger he he he was notquite an he he kind of was an
entrepreneur in some ways likehe did start a country
construction company when he wasyounger and stuff but just his
(30:47):
his uh his mentality on how hehandles things really and and
the how big goals he set forhimself uh he wasn't afraid of
setting big goals but there'sdifferent things you can learn
from people and just theirmindset and way they thought
about things that are verysuccessful.
And uh you know there's alsothat thing where it's you're the
(31:07):
average of the the the fivepeople you spend the most time
with.
And so I think spending timewith like a really successful
person not necessarily in personbut if you're you're reading
their autobiography or theirbiography you're essentially
kind of getting in their headyou're spending time with time
with them.
And if you're always doing thatif you're always reading
(31:29):
autobiographies biographies ofthe most successful people
you're kind of some of thatmindset ideas are gonna rub off
on you you'll get good good waysof thinking about things um I
know at least I have with withhiring managing people leading
people uh it's like you said youknow if if you want to grow your
(31:54):
business beyond yourself whichnot if you don't that's fine
like you said it it's all up toyou and what you want in your
business.
But I think if you if you dowant to grow your business
beyond yourself you do have todefinitely learn and be ready to
continue to learn and be astudent of leadership.
And uh not that you'll ever be aperfect leader or know it all in
(32:18):
terms of leadership but you atleast at least be a student of
it so you can continue toimprove upon where you are now.
It is um cool well I reallyappreciate your time today you
know I'd like to give you anopportunity to you know give any
(32:38):
last thoughts to paintingbusiness owners that are are
maybe uh trying to become betterleaders or get better at
delegating or grow theirbusiness to the next level do
you have any final thoughts onhow they should do that or what
resources are available thatmaybe folks aren't aware of or
(32:59):
anything that uh you'd like toask the audience yeah um you
just said it uh um you gottastart if you can now hang out
with these people people thatyou think are gonna be
beneficial for your life startyou know following them start
listening to them um books I wasif you're not a a book reader
(33:28):
that's fine I mean we as uhwhenever we go to do an estimate
we're driving all the time getan audiobook you know start
listening to it something thatyou feel gonna even if it's uh
like you just said it to Daniellike I like biographies and if
somebody wants to read somethingelse they're gonna feel into it
(33:48):
is that you you you're you'reready um exercising your muscle
and the muscle gonna gonna gonnastart getting into more stuff
you know like then how how tomanage people you know what is
the what can I do about how tomanage my finances how to
delegate there's a lot of goodbooks out there and uh and like
(34:10):
the one I always I always uh Iwant to listen it two three
times uh probably a month is theuh Donald Miller uh building a
story brand it I feel like everytime I listen to it it's I catch
something new so um it really uhit really tells you how to
(34:32):
picture your company what is itwhy you want right uh you
because we're on this um whatyou my calling we're in the
service industry right where uhJason Jason Phillips said a lot
that we're in the peoplebusiness but on the both sides
people working for us people whowe are serving right and how do
(34:53):
you want that people to look atyou to look at your company what
what is it what you want whatwhat is it what you really you
really um are looking for that'sI think sometimes we get lost
into uh what is it what we wantright uh the basic answers
you're gonna get into a newentrepreneur is I want freedom I
(35:14):
want money I want you name iteverything is it's uh um it's uh
it's superficial until you startfinding things like you want
freedom to what to enjoy withyour family or to what to just
leave and get up late because atthe end of the day once once you
(35:35):
find your really uh your reallyuh a goal in life or whatever
you want to do you're gonna getdeeper and deeper and and that's
that's not bad and and the letme tell you uh whoever is going
to this transition uh there's alot of people gonna fall out of
(35:57):
your train because uh yourmindset is gonna start changing
and people gonna think thatyou're not the sand you used to
and something is changing youand you're evil person so so be
prepared for that especiallyfamily it could be could be
painful so start creating thatthe that skin at the end of the
(36:21):
day if that's what you want ifnot I'll see you around and and
we're good we're colleagues nonothing happened so no pasta
nada yeah uh awesome Iappreciate uh those thoughts and
definitely agree I I uh reallyappreciate you sharing your
journey and your thoughts ondelegation and leadership super
(36:44):
important conversation I thinkthat needs to be continue to be
had with painting businessowners uh so really appreciate
you jump on the podcast sharingyour thoughts on the on those
topics and for the audience withthat we will see you next week
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