The Prince of Egypt (1998)

Send us a text

Stepping back into ancient Egypt, we explore DreamWorks Animation's biblical epic "The Prince of Egypt" (1998) – a film that masterfully blends breathtaking animation with powerful storytelling to bring the Exodus narrative to life.

This cinematic journey through Moses' story features a truly remarkable voice cast that surprised even our hosts. Val Kilmer pulls double duty as both Moses and God (creating a fascinating dynamic during the burning bush scene), while stars like Ralph Fiennes, Jeff Goldblum, Patrick Stewart, Sandra Bullock, Helen Mirren, and the comedy duo of Steve Martin and Martin Short bring depth and personality to this ancient tale. The revelation of who voiced which character had our hosts pausing the movie in amazement!

What truly sets this film apart is its visual artistry. Twenty-five years later, the animation still captivates with its blend of traditional 2D techniques and subtle 3D elements. From the haunting sequence of baby Moses floating down the Nile to the spectacular parting of the Red Sea, the film's artistic vision creates moments of genuine awe. We discuss how specific scenes – like the transformation of water to blood that spares Moses himself – demonstrate the filmmakers' exceptional attention to detail and creative interpretation of biblical miracles.

While the film takes creative liberties with its source material (Moses was supposedly 80 years old during the Exodus!), we explore how these changes serve the narrative while maintaining the spiritual essence of the story. We even delve into fascinating historical theories about which actual Egyptian pharaoh might have ruled during these events – was it really Ramesses II as depicted, or perhaps the mysterious Dudimose whose reign coincided with Egypt's decline?

Have you revisited this animated masterpiece recently? We'd love to hear your thoughts! Leave us a five-star review or join the conversation about biblical adaptations, animation techniques, or which scene still gives you chills decades later.

Twitter handles:
Project Geekology: https://twitter.com/pgeekology
Anthony's Twitter: https://twitter.com/odysseyswow
Dakota's Twitter: https://twitter.com/geekritique_dak

Instagram:
https://instagram.com/projectgeekology?igshid=1v0sits7ipq9y

YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@projectgeekology

Geekritique (Dakota):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBwciIqOoHwIx_uXtYTSEbA

Twitch (Anthony):
https://www.twitch.tv/odysseywow

Support the show

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to episode 116 of Project Geekology.
And here we are once again inancient Egypt.
We are approaching the pharaohof all podcasts and just asking
him to let our podcasts go.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
I am one half of your host, anthony, and joining me,
as always, is dakota and youguys are playing with the big
boys now, um, we are also joinedwith a third co-host, rich.

Speaker 3 (00:33):
Say hello hey guys, pretty excited here, I think.
I think this episode is goingto get a lot of juicy reviews.
You think so why?

Speaker 2 (00:41):
do you say that?

Speaker 3 (00:41):
I mean just to offset the dryness of Egypt.
But no, I think we're going tohave scorching hot takes in the
sands of time.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
I love it.
Speaking of juicy reviews,we've been trying to incorporate
the idea of you guys shouldreview our podcast, Five Stars
Juicy, and we use the term juicyjust because it's it's fun and
it it caught on somewhere downthe line.
The only thing I could findthat was like remotely juicy in
this movie is like there'sthere's a scene where moses has

(01:13):
like a bunch of figs in his hand.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
I'm like that looks juicy, so oh yeah.
So the funny thing is is that Iwent over that whole spiel and
we talked and we didn't even saywhat movie we were covering,
which is gonna be dreamworksmovie in 1998 the prince of
egypt was it eight or 1999, Ithought uh, no, no, it was 98 oh

(01:36):
okay, so all right, so I I havea correction to make to you
both.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
I texted you that you , you know, the mummy and this
movie, the Prince of Egypt, tookplace in, or were released in,
the same year, but I guess I wasa year off or like six months
off or something like that butit does share some similarities
in terms of, you know, just likecertain aspects of the of the

(02:01):
two movies.
Like we spoke about, some ofthe characters that exist in the
mummy that you know actuallyexisted in real life, one of
those being Seti I, the pharaoh,that's the pharaoh that's
killed in the beginning of themummy.
That person, seti I, is in thismovie depicted as the pharaoh
that exists while Moses is still, you know, in Egypt, before he

(02:26):
leaves and goes into thewilderness.
But yeah, so there's someconnections there and both films
are also very liberal withtheir interpretations and they
make a lot of creative liberties, I should say, and it works for
both movies and I think itworks for this one.
So I'm excited to talk aboutsome of that.

(02:48):
And yeah, I'll try not to be tooEgyptology-ish, that's not a
word.
I'm trying not to go crazy withthe Egyptology stuff, this
podcast, because I couldprobably talk for like 30
minutes about it, but yeah,we're discussing Prince of Egypt
, guys.
Before we do any of that,though, let's jump into what

(03:09):
we've been up to this past week.
Rich, I'm going to hand it offto you.
What have you been up to?

Speaker 3 (03:14):
Well, let's see, Work-wise things kind of heat up
.
I don't know if it's kind ofalways lines up.
This year April 20th is my bigdeadline at work.
I have to make sure that thereare a lot of things taken care
of, submitted, shared.
I have to manage over like 12different people and 200
something students and make surethat everyone meets deadlines.
So kind of in the middle ofthat that's been taking up a lot

(03:36):
of my energy.
But also can't forget that theNew York Metropolitans have
returned home and I returnedhome, I went to opening day and
then I went to the next day,which was bitterly cold oh my
god man and stayed two days agoit was like so cold.

Speaker 2 (03:56):
I don't know how you were, or that was that yesterday
.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
So that was the fourth game which I did not.
Yeah, I went to friday,saturday, sunday, and then I
took a day off, not a day off.
It was so cold up here thatthey actually moved the time
from 7 10 to 4 10 and I've neverseen it moved because of just
the cold, but it was windy andcold so they moved it.
It was brutal anthony.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
Like it, like this past week in new york, like last
week, was nice, it's beautiful,almost t-shirt weather, and
then this week, like last night,it was in the 20s.
It was in the 20 degrees lastnight.
I don't know what is going onwith the weather up here.

Speaker 1 (04:32):
So yeah, hey man, you know, we were in a nice crisp
like 70 degrees Today.
It dropped a little bit to,like you know, the morning it
was like in the like the upper60s.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
So it was pretty good rough times for you, sir, but I
know it's hey, florida, that's,that's like, that's like parka
weather but all in all it wasnice to get back in the swing,
nice to go to the games, and myson likes to score the games so
we score it together, so it'sjust and honestly, the best part
about it is I'm technicallyoutdoors so I'm.

(05:05):
When my wife basically wants meto touch grass, that's what I
do it.
I touch it at the baseballfield.
So what have you been up to?
Dakota?

Speaker 2 (05:12):
nice man, before we jump over to me, are you, uh,
still actively playing mlb theshow like how's that going,
how's that going?

Speaker 3 (05:19):
I'm not gonna lie to you.
I I've been feeling really goodabout my playing, all right.
I've been feeling I'mcollecting lots of the cards.
I've been feeling really goodabout my playing, all right.
I've been feeling I'mcollecting lots of the cards.
I've been closing outcollections.
They're still I think it's fourdays left in the season.
I've gotten almost everything Ineed for the next.
It's called the second inning,which will be kind of like the
career, the reward path that I'mreally excited that I I maxed

(05:42):
out the first one.
I've got some kind of voucherthat I earned for the second one
, so I'm looking forward to that.
And then I went to the med gamewith my friend and apparently
he is somehow more of adegenerate player than I am.
So you have to get to a certainlevel to get a special card for
each team and that is going tobe like a pack, revealed on

(06:07):
april 24th, I believe.
So you need to get 15 out of 30mlb teams.
It's quite a lot of xp.
To earn very specific things.
You have to pitch withdifferent pitchers.
I've been winning games withlots of low, low, low name, low
level, no name guys, becausethat's all I have available for
that team and I got 15 of themalmost and I'm so proud of that.

(06:29):
And this guy goes well.
I got all 30 teams.
Listen to me when I tell youthat there's always a bigger
digit I, I.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
I think they say that in phantom it's just I.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
I was sitting there.
You don't understand.
We're both teachers, right?
We both have families, and Ijust was like I don't know,
aside from using uppers to stayup and never go to sleep, I
don't even know how I could playmore MLB.
But I found out that one of thebig mistakes I'm making is I
should be playing in Colorado,because I like to play at Citi

(07:06):
Field.
The conditions are theconditions in Queens, but if you
play in Colorado, every game itis the high altitude will
actually drive the ball out moreoften.
So I could be getting more homeruns if I just played in Denver
, that's bizarre, bizarre,that's okay.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
It's bizarre that the game uses real world altitude
physics in its like programming.
That's.
I'm actually impressed by that.
So if there were any way tolike get me into that, if the
collecting cards aspect wouldn'twork, that actually might, you
know, push me over the top.

Speaker 3 (07:43):
That's kind of cool.
I do want to mention I was alittle late to sign on today
because you said cards.
Charlie, my son started playingthe pokemon pocket card trading
game and like we just ripped 10packs before we got down, like
he was like wait, I have enoughto open 10 packs.
Dad and I was like let's go.
So it was uh, he got a.

(08:05):
He got aidgeotto EX, which wewere pretty excited about.

Speaker 2 (08:09):
Excellent, I love that.
All right, I'll take it backfrom you.
Let's see.
What have I been up to?
I think mostly I've beenwatching.
Well, the finale, the seasonfinale of White Lotus, season 3,
happened this past weekend andthat was nuts Like.
That was a crazy ending to thatshow.
There's nothing I can say thatisn't a spoiler, especially you

(08:31):
know.
I know Anthony is watching thefirst season.
I don't know if you finishedthe first season yet, anthony,
and yeah, I don't want to spoilit for anyone who is listening
and potentially wants to watchthat show, but very, very good
show, very worth worth it.
And now I am in the middle ofseason two of severance.
So severance is an apple tvseries where it's like a serious

(08:55):
, like mind-melting show in avery literal sense.
So there is this idea, thisconcept.
It's like a parallel world toours, but in this world there's
a sci fi concept that's almostBlack Mirror ish, where they
introduce this concept ofseverance where when you go to

(09:17):
work and clock in, there's achip in your brain that
basically like resets.
So you have no idea who you areon the outside.
You only have an idea of likewho you are on the inside.
So if you've only been workingat this company for a month.
Technically, that individualwho you are as a worker has only
existed for a month.
So you kind of grow into thisrole.

(09:39):
I mean, they're not babies.
They understand english andeverything, but they have no
concept of the outside world andthe people on the outside have
no concept of what's happeningon the inside world of you know.
A severance like work, workflow, whatever.
So it's a really crazy systemand as the show goes on, you
realize that this company thatthese severed individuals are
working for, lumen, is not whatit seems.

(10:03):
It almost like like extremecult, like has an extreme cult
like following and all that andit's just super freaky stuff.
So I'm really enjoying severance.
It's a really cool concept and,yeah, the the lines between you
know the any, the person who'slike the inside you who's
working, versus the outsideperson who's just living their

(10:25):
day-to-day life starts to blendand it's just, it's just chaos.
Really, really good show.
But I think that is all for methis week.
Yeah, anthony, what have youbeen up to?
Have you finished white lotusseason one?

Speaker 1 (10:38):
no, no, no, I haven't finished that yet.
I don't really have much thatI've had going on, except for
I'm a week and a half in my newjob role, so I've been, you know
, doing a lot of learning, a lotof brain dumping.
There's definitely a lot thatI'm not going to know when I
start this role, and it's not ashow long is the period where

(11:01):
you are, you know training.
It's two weeks.
Two weeks of training, yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:07):
That's a pretty long training session, yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
Well, I mean, with this job role, there's a lot
that goes into it.
I could be doing anything fromhelping somebody reset their
password to going into theirfiles and helping them with like
program stuff, you know.
So there, yeah, yeah, there'sdefinitely a lot that I won't

(11:31):
know.
And the thing is, is that, like, there's only so much that the
trainers can go over, becausenot every scenario happens all
the time.

Speaker 2 (11:41):
So yeah, I worked in an it job for a little bit.
This was back in like 2011 2012.
My least favorite thing to dowas reset the drivers for
printers because for some reason, printers reset all the time.
They just break down constantlyand you have to like reset them

(12:02):
.
I feel like I reset the sameprinters.
You know in that year and ahalf that I worked there so many
times.
Yeah, so that that's my leastfavorite part of that job, but
you know there was some coolstuff in there, but yeah yeah,
yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:15):
So the thing about like our stuff is that a lot of
it is like kind of in network soyou can access a lot of like
printers because they are in thenetwork and you know we can go
as far as to like logging into,like the individual, like
printer, not just the drivers ona computer but, like you know,

(12:36):
getting the printer pinging,pinging the printer to make sure
that it's connecting to thenetwork.
You know just different stufflike that.
But the thing is is thatthere's only so much that they
can kind of go over.
And I mean the cool thing aboutthe trainer is that he is doing
like live calls and like kindof like showing us and like live
tickets and stuff and you knowjust to like show us like the

(13:00):
different scenarios and then howto like kind of like annotate,
like tickets and stuff.
You know, I do believe that likeI will be busy, but I don't
think I'm going to be anywhereas busy as I was working at a
branch and that sounds insanebecause I'm going to be helping
all of the branches.
But the thing is is that I'vebeen to other branches and a lot

(13:21):
of the branches are really slowdude, like the one that I was
at was like a main hub and likewe were just crazy busy all the
time.
I mean, there are times in aday where it gets a little busy,
like I suspect that like Icould probably help, you know,
maybe anywhere from.
You know 15 to 30 like max, youknow on a day, and then like,

(13:42):
maybe the busier days a littlebit more than that.
You know on a day and then likemaybe the busier days a little
bit more than that, whereas,like when I was in a branch, I
was helping a lot more peopleand doing like a lot more
transactions.
You know, like so I'm I'mpretty used to like high volume
and like this doesn't seem ashigh volume.
It will, though, once we gothrough our next merger, so
it'll probably pick up a littlebit.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
No, it will pick up a little bit dang sounds like you
are the perfect candidate for aseverance I do.

Speaker 1 (14:13):
I do forget about my, you know, outside life, when I
clock into, uh, I clock intowork, but but yeah, no man.
So you know, it's been, it'sbeen good, been good.
I do like working from home.
I don't think I ever want towork in a building again, dude.

Speaker 2 (14:30):
I totally get that.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
But yeah, man.
So yeah, the biggest thing forme is just work, and you know
not much.
I mean, you know we're stillwatching through One Piece.
I didn't watch any episodes.
I I think like in a week and ahalf I watched some today.
So but but yeah, man, nothing,crazy man.

(14:52):
I mean I don't know if you guyshave anything else that you
needed to add to what you'vebeen up to, but I think it's
safe to say we can hop into thetopic I think this is a rare
podcast where we actually starttalking about the topic at hand
prior to the 20 minute mark.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
So you know, pat ourselves in the back a little
bit.
There guys, we are here to talkabout the Prince of Egypt.
This is an adaptation of theExodus story, the story of how
you know in the Bible or theTorah, how Moses led the Hebrew
slaves out of captivity frombasically a very tyrannical and

(15:35):
cruel ruler who is an unnamedPharaoh in the Bible.
So, yeah, I think this moviedoes a really good job of taking
what is there in the Bible andjust wrapping a motivational
children's story.
You know, it is very spiritualand I think it gets the spirit

(15:55):
of the story mostly right, eventhough it does take a lot of
creative liberties.
But we'll talk more about thatin a little bit.
Anthony, you said you hadn'twatched this movie since you
were a kid.
Yeah, man, how do you feelgoing back to it?

Speaker 1 (16:07):
it was crazy.
It really did bring me back towhen I was a kid.
I I remember seeing.
So I do remember seeing this intheaters and this was like back
in 98.
I, I know I wasn't even 10 yetat that point.
So, yeah, I was, I was young.
Um, I do remember it seeing it,like you know, a few more times
after that, my parents gettingthat movie.

(16:28):
So I remember seeing it, notjust once.
I saw it a bunch of times whenI was a kid, but after a while I
just never saw it again.
I mean, it always popped up inmy mind and I always see it pop
up online and I'd be like man,yeah, I remember that movie and
I remember just how I thoughtthe art was really cool and I

(16:49):
kind of remembered some of thesongs a little bit and yeah, man
, it was wild.
Going back to this movie, howabout?

Speaker 2 (16:55):
you what was awesome.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
You've seen this.

Speaker 2 (16:57):
I watched it with my wife, jen.
She had never seen it so I wasjust like, oh, oh, let's throw
it on.
It might have been five, six,seven years ago or something
like that.
You know, it was not super longago, so I I I do have this more
fresh in my mind than you do,but prior to that it had been a
very long time.
Like you, I also I don't thinkI saw it in the movie theater,

(17:20):
but I did have the dvd and itwas one of my favorite dvds
because it had, like a there wasa special feature.
That was when, like you know,when dvds first came out, the
special features.
Like you needed to watch thespecial features because it was
the coolest concept, like you,just get extra movie yeah, yeah

(17:42):
and a lot of background stuff,man, I loved.

Speaker 1 (17:45):
I love the, the special features and like extra
stuff and like the dvd versionsof, like the extended editions
of, the lord of the rings ohyeah, you know so and all that,
yeah, so yeah no, no, you'reright.
Like that was that time, yeah,like we had definitely got extra
and and the the specialfeatures I feel like nobody
cares with the blu-rays oranything like that like there's.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
If you ever go into like the special features for
stuff like that, it's prettybare, there's not much there.
They'll show you like.
This is the teaser trailer.
This is the regular trailer.
This is an interview with thedirector oh, yeah, you know, but
there was a really cool specialfeature on this particular
movie that was a rendition ofwhen you Believe.

(18:28):
It's the big emotional songwhen they're leaving Egypt and
it's a multi-language version,so it's the same exact clip of
them.
You know, like Miriam andZipporah singing.
You know the song when youBelieve, but every five to 10
seconds it switches to adifferent language and it's

(18:50):
really well woven and it's like25, 30 something languages like
throughout the course of thesong and it's a really beautiful
piece.
You can find it on YouTube,even though nobody like has
uploaded a clear version in avery long time, like the.
The newest version that you canfind online, at least on
youtube, is 17 years old.

(19:10):
It looks like it was recordedon a potato, but it's really.
It's a really beautiful sceneand if you have the dvd, that
would be the ideal way to watchthat.
But yeah, I do not have thatanymore yeah, yeah, I know same
here it's.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, it's been lost over the years.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
But lost a time.
It is now ancient history, butyou know we have someone on the
podcast who had never seen thismovie before.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
It's like you guys, I don't know how you found the
recesses, dark recesses of mymind for things that either I've
stayed away from on purpose youknow purposely stay away from
or things that I just okay.
Well, you said that Val Kilmerwas the voice of God.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
And Moses, right yeah and Moses.

Speaker 3 (19:54):
Well, that's the best part.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
No, he's not the voice of Moses.
No, he's not.
I think he's literally just God.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
No, no, I think he has multiple voices.
I think he's two voices, doeshe?
Yeah, I'm pretty sure he hastwo voices.

Speaker 3 (20:07):
He might be like Ralph Fiennes.

Speaker 2 (20:11):
Yeah, that's Ralph Fiennes.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
That's Voldemort.

Speaker 2 (20:19):
Isn, that's voldemort , isn't more val kilmer.
Am I?
Am I wrong?
Moses?
And god, yeah, val kilmer wasmoses.
Oh snap, okay, so I was.
I was confusing, because Ilistened to the, I listened to
the music, oh yeah, so thismakes it okay.

Speaker 3 (20:28):
So that makes it hilarious, because I did not
even know this was an animatedmovie.
I there's like this movie.
I didn't know anything about it, right, I thought it was gonna
be like ben-hur, right, and thatval kilmer was playing the
voice of god.
So when I saw that it wasanimated I was like whoa what?

(20:49):
So I was already supersurprised going into it, because
I can't explain to you why Ilike dreamworks movies.
I've seen many other dreamworksmovies.
I don't remember this existing.
I've never seen the movie, thecover, the poster.
I don't remember seeing acommercial.
I couldn't believe how manypeople were in the movie that I

(21:13):
know I was like it's a massivecast jeff goldblum.
Before goldblum like I mean, yes, it, it's craig martin short,
it's his buddy, that stevemartin, steve martin, right,
sandra bullock's in it.
I was like whoa, helen mirren,helen mirren patrick stewart,
michelle pfeiffer what I heardwas actually, this was actually

(21:34):
like a stacked.
This movie was stacked.

Speaker 1 (21:37):
I heard Patrick.

Speaker 3 (21:38):
Stewart's voice and I paused the movie and I went who
the, you know, pardon, myFrench is in this movie and I,
you know, went ahead and waslike oh man, this is nuts.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
I had this.
I think it was the exact samemoment where I heard a voice
that I recognized.
I was just like I can't picturewho this is in my head, but I
recognized that voice so welland I looked it up.
Yeah, and that's.
That's also when I saw the cast.
So the reason I, the reason Iwas so convinced that val kilmer
wasn't the voice of moses, isbecause he doesn't do the

(22:14):
singing yeah, yeah, oh, yeah,that's that's, that's what threw
me off there.
But, like, ralph fines does dothe singing role, so he plays
ramses and dude I love.
First of all, the music in thismovie is just so incredible.
The, the song let my people gowhere it's like a it's it
doubles with moses singing.
Why won't you let my people go?

(22:34):
And he goes.
I will not let my people, yourpeople go.
It's such a great duet andwhenever I hear ralph fines I
cannot not picture voldemort.
So I'm just picturing voldemortsinging.
So if you ever listen to what'sthe name of this song I want to
like, actually it is called, oh, it's called the plagues.

(22:56):
Yeah, that's, that's the nameof the song.
It's ralph fines and amic byram, who I thought was the voice of
moses.
Yeah, yeah, it sounds likevoldemort.
If you, if you listen to thatwith the lens of this, is
voldemort singing.

Speaker 1 (23:11):
It's so much funnier I know that we decided to cover
this movie.
You, you know it.
We thought it would be fun tolike stay in Egypt.
But also, you know Val Kilmer.
He does a couple of voices inthis movie like you know two
major like characters and I waswondering what he got top
billing.

Speaker 2 (23:31):
I kept looking at it.
I was just like man.
He only has a couple of lines.
I don't know why he's like thetop build actor on this, but
that changes the way I see themovie.
Yeah, I don't know how I didn'trealize that, but all right
cool.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
But yeah, man, we, we lost them a couple weeks ago,
man or was it?
Last week, it was last lastweek, yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, man, going back, youknow, watching it.

Speaker 2 (23:52):
As an adult like you have much more of an
appreciation for like theartwork of of stuff and like the
artwork and this is like sogood man, I'm like this was 1998
it's 98 it's so creative, likethe way that the backgrounds are
just like the really brightpastel colors and like the
really fluid motion of, like theanime, the animated characters,

(24:14):
and it blends that likecartoony vibe that is so typical
of dreamworks and disney atthat time, like the facial
expressions that characters make, the sinister grins that, like
the evil dudes have.
It blends all of that so welland it really takes a lot of
like creative license with, youknow, incorporating egyptian

(24:36):
iconography and stuff into it.
Like you know, like last weekon, while we were talking about
the mummy, I kept saying likewhenever it's a egypt movie,
they have to put the pyramids inthe background.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
They just can't help themselves.

Speaker 2 (24:50):
They did that in this one too this doesn't take place
anywhere near that, but heythey're right there, hey man.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
Look, we have to let people know that it's in egypt.
Yes, I know, one of the one ofthe things that I really liked
about you know, and kind of likegoing back a little bit to the
artwork, is that like it's 2danimation but they give it like
dimension, like it looks almost3d but it's 2d yeah, they did

(25:18):
the same thing that, like earlyavatar did, where they it is a
2d show or in this case it's 2dmovie.

Speaker 2 (25:26):
But they do incorporate slight cgi elements
that you will notice of like, ifyou like are paying attention,
like the scene where mosesmother sends him into the, the
river, with, you know, in the inthe basket.
The basket is cgi yeah but it'slike a flat cgi so it blends in
with the 2d animation.
It's it's really really clever.

Speaker 3 (25:48):
Yeah, I like it a lot yeah, I thought, I thought that
that really held up, likebecause you know I'm thinking,
oh, it's a 1999 movie, what'sthe animation going to be like?
But I thought it definitely is,in that you know, like
Mulan-ish kind of style it'sdefinitely crisper than you know
, like, of course I'm going toreference another kind of well,

(26:10):
middle Eastern Aladdin.
I loved that movie and Iwatched it a couple years ago
and it doesn't.
The animation's just a bitbehind this.

Speaker 2 (26:20):
so yeah, it's.
It's like around the time oflike lion king and all that.
It's like the early 90s disneymovies had.
They weren't as I don't want tosay, they weren't as creative,
but it was a different art yeahyou know, that doesn't
necessarily hold up today,because it's not incorporated at
all today.

Speaker 3 (26:38):
So that's why this to me, I was pleasantly surprised
for a 25 or more year old movie27, that's older than my
students.
That's crazy.
It looks better than Minecraft.
Sorry, had to take a shot.
Minecraft was purposeful.
Though it's crazy, you knowit's actually.
It looks better than Minecraft,sorry, I had to take a shot.

(26:59):
Minecraft was purposeful though, I know, but let's not get into
that.
That could be.
That's a whole other episode,gentlemen.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
That could be but you know, have you guys seen the
Minecraft movie, or a Minecraftmovie, whatever?

Speaker 3 (27:10):
it's called.
I'm politically opposed.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
I actually did, I actually did.

Speaker 3 (27:21):
Oh boy, I actually did.
Oh boy, you didn't bring it up.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
I forgot, we don't have to say anything else, guys.
We don't have to say anythingmore.
Well, honestly, tell you truth,like I mean you might not like
it, but like Dakota and I werelike really big into it before
it blew up actually yeah, we, wewere playing the beta before.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
It was like a.

Speaker 1 (27:37):
Yeah, Like.
I would say like I think what?
2012, 2013?
, like around there is, when itblew up, we were playing this
like back in, like 2010.
I'm going to put it this wayyeah, that was.

Speaker 3 (27:49):
Did you guys grow up with Polaroid cameras?

Speaker 1 (27:52):
Yeah, they were around, yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:53):
Like people would use them.
Yes, but they weren't popular.

Speaker 3 (27:56):
They they're around, yeah, like people, yes, but they
weren't popular they weren't,so they were very I'm a little
bit older.
They were very popular, right,my grandfather, I mean, that's
all we used, basically, allright, I was gonna say I'm
pretty sure it's older than you,yeah, it's older than me, but
that was that was our prime,like like photography method,
and I, you know, when I gotsomething better, I was like wow
, this is so much like I wouldnever, why would I ever go back?

(28:18):
and now my students walk in withpolaroids, you know, and
they're like oh, isn't this socool?
And they're waving it and thequality is terrible, you know,
like because they've got theseterrible ones, and that's kind
of.
Oh yeah, it's just like thefive dollar polaroid cameras,
yeah, and that's kind of how Ifeel and I don't want to insult
more.
But that's how I feel aboutMinecraft, because for me the
style harkens back to what.

(28:38):
I didn't have a choice, so Idon't want to return to the
choice.

Speaker 1 (28:41):
So for me it's like okay, you know, playing Atari
was was rough man there'sactually some really good, you
know, and I'm and I'm gonnaleave it at this because we got
to get back to the movie butthere's some really good indie
video games that like tap intothat retro vibe that like you're
completely missing out on.
If you don't like that vibe,I'm telling you there's a lot of

(29:03):
really good ones, like cuphead,cuphead, dude.
Cuphead's really good.
Well, there's cuphead.
You also have octopath traveler, which is really good.

Speaker 3 (29:13):
There's a lot stardew yeah, stardew, stardew is
really good just like the thingis hollow night, the just how
sticks said you know, and mrroboto, my dude, I believe the
line is I am the modern man andthat's all I've got.
But uh, you know, speaking ofof going back in time and using
things like papyrus, I don'tknow, I thought the beginning of
the movie kind of threw me offa little bit.

(29:35):
It actually made me pause andgo to like go and read websites,
because there was no mention.
Before moses is sent down theriver, you see the soldiers
moving in the background oh, butfor a formative movie right for
a children's movie right.
there was no like decree, likeheard like firstborn.

(29:57):
You know, son, you know Hebrewboys will be killed because yes,
I sat there and I went why isshe sending them away?
And, like I know, I was kind ofnaive in the moment, but I was
like her two other kids are fine, why is she only sending this
one away?
I was really kind of thrown offfor a second because I
remembered it in my head that Iknew the announcement was made,

(30:19):
so that's why they did thisright, or that's why she had to
make this decision right.
And then it doesn't get.
You know, we find out later,obviously, but in the moment,
especially because that's themost screen time the mom gets,
you figure, it's just like I'm,all I see is her running away
and then just sending one of herkids down the river and that's
it.
So I, you know, I went tocatholic school and everything

(30:41):
growing up, so I was wait aminute, I'm like I've heard this
story before like this isn'tright, you know, and I think the
liberties they took were justdifficult for me because I,
because you know the story.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
So well and yeah, I, I'm also in the same boat where
the account is very clear Aftershe, you know, sends him into
the river and is found byPharaoh's daughter.
She's raised by Pharaoh'sdaughter, but Miriam Moses's
sister kind of tricks Pharaoh'sdaughter into you know, calling
for you know, like a wet nurse.

(31:14):
And that wet nurse nurse, quoteunquote is actually moses's
real mother.
So moses's real mother raisesmoses as the son of the daughter
of pharaoh.

Speaker 3 (31:24):
so she should have been in the movie more, yeah
yeah, and that kind of thatthrew me off because it gave me
this.
I was just like why is she, youknow, doing all this?
And then that's it, and then wedon't see her ever, and that
was a little.
And then that also creates themoment later in the movie where

(31:44):
Moses had completely no idea andhe ran.
And it just look.
I'm going to say this about anytime I read a book before I
watch a movie.
The way I saw it in my head isthe way it's.
That's the canon, all right,and if you change it.
I'm going to be disgruntled.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
I like that.
I like that a lot and I feelthe same way.
Actually, I think, because Iwasn't so critical of the
adaptive qualities when I was akid I look over everything like
that.
But you know, as an adult whohas you know, like over
everything like that, but youknow, as an adult who has, you

(32:22):
know, like, obviously, read thisaccount, it's, it's a little
bit harder to swallow and, yeah,it's, it's not up there with
the most like faithful biblicaladaptations out there.
But like, for instance, he findsout, like it they said they set
this all into motion so that hecan have this dramatic reveal
that he isn't actually Egyptianbut one of the Hebrews, one of

(32:44):
the slaves, and that sets him ona path that eventually leads
him to, you know, killing one ofthe enforcers who's whipping a
Hebrew slave In the movie.
That makes sense.
Slave in the movie, that makessense.
But in the reality of the, thestory that's told in exodus, he
knew he was a hebrew growing upit says that he was, you know,

(33:05):
sympathetic to the cause of theslaves.
Like that was part of hispersonality, you know.
But yeah, if we're gonna belike really critical about every
single thing that they changed.
We'd be talking for like twohours, but yeah yeah man,
anthony, what a good old yourthoughts on?
what are your thoughts on thelike changes like that?

(33:26):
Do you mind as much?

Speaker 1 (33:28):
I mean you don't like you know growing up and and
reading the and and like knowingthe story you know, yeah, it
hits you with, hey, that's notright, but from an entertainment
perspective not all the changeswere bad.
I mean, I guess depending onwho you ask, it can be bad, but

(33:54):
I guess for the movie purposesit wasn't bad.

Speaker 3 (33:59):
It gets most of the beats right, right, that's what
that's.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
That's where I kind of fall with it.
Like, at the end of the day,moses does get the people out of
egypt, like that's right, right, right.

Speaker 1 (34:10):
I think, like some of the like major things that
happen, you know, like theburning bush.
Yeah, you know, the brush isactually that's a fantastic
scene yeah, it gives me chillsevery time I watch it.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
You know, take your sandals off, you're standing on
holy ground.
That's so good.
And now that I know that valkilmer was talking to himself in
that scene, it just kind ofelevates that performance even
more.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
He's in a sound booth doing both parts and that he's
like all right he had two.
He had two mics and he had tolike run back and forth one had
a little bit more reverb so yeah

Speaker 3 (34:46):
like what I?
I just, and I'm sure there'sthere's a way to find out right,
but you have so many differentactors like big name actors for
this movie and val kilmer getstwo roles like I, I, somebody
else, it could have been a nicelittle easter egg.
Or I mean like maybe mr feeneyyou know he had, just he wasn't

(35:08):
mr feeney yet you know he hadfinished night writer.
Uh, that would have been, Idon't know, I just it's a weird,
unless like that was in thecontract, why would he get both?

Speaker 2 (35:18):
Maybe he really liked this story.
I don't know, maybe he was justlike I got to get.
Maybe he signed on for Mosesand you know, while in the
recording booth you know he likedid a couple lines and they're
like, oh, I kind of like thatit's also, it's not really
uncommon for somebody to getmultiple roles in an animation.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
And the thing is is, is that like so, something that
dakota said earlier?
Why would you hire this wholeother person to speak a few
lines in a movie?
You know so, like they alreadyhad like a cast set.
I mean, it could have beensomebody else within the cast,
yeah, of course, but theydecided to go with val kilmer.
But yeah, like I, I, I don'tthink that you know they're

(36:03):
somebody.
Getting a double role in themovie was was a bad thing.
I mean, I see it all the time.
Video games do it.
Anime, definitely.
Yeah, anime, oh my gosh, dude,anime.
If you look at some of thesecredits in an anime, like you
know some of the people they'llhave credit for voicing like
five people, dude, it's crazy.
But dude, you knew that thevoice of God was Val Kilmer, but

(36:26):
you didn't know that it wasMoses, so he did a good enough
performance to separate himself.

Speaker 2 (36:32):
They're definitely separate.

Speaker 1 (36:33):
Yeah, exactly, exactly so.
I think he did a great job.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yeah, no, he killed it Exactly, so.
So I mean, I think he did agreat job.

Speaker 1 (36:40):
Yeah, no, he he killed it.

Speaker 2 (36:40):
Absolutely yeah, and I think Moses is uh.
What's what's funny, like if,if they had chosen to go like a
more biblically accurate route,I don't think they would have
chosen Jeff Goldblum for Aaronthey would have chosen Jeff

(37:03):
Goldblum for Aaron dude you canhear that it's him.

Speaker 1 (37:04):
Oh, it's very much so his voice.
It's crazy.
I remember like hearing that Iwas like wait.
I said is that who I think itis.
And then I looked it up and Iwas like, yep, that's absolutely
him yep, yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:14):
So so the actual account whenever Moses is
speaking to Pharaoh, it's neveractually Moses speaking to
Pharaoh, because Moses claimedthat he had a speech impediment.
So at the burning bush scene inthe Bible, he's just like but
I'm not very articulate, I don'tspeak.
Well, god's like I'm bringingAaron over and he's going to,

(37:34):
but I'm not very articulate, I Idon't speak.
Well, god's like I'm bringingaaron over and he's gonna be
your mouthpiece, basically.
So he's actually the one whospeaks to pharaoh every time.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
So having jeff goldblum be like, yeah, you're,
you're gonna let let the peoplego um, probably wouldn't have
worked, dude that like he waslike the most like, like he
stuck out like a sore thumb,like as far as voices dude oh
yeah, he never sounds not likejeff goldblum, like it's the

(38:05):
most distinct voice like, but itwas good to it was.
It's always fun to like hearhim like patrick stewart did
well enough to not sound likehimself at least to me.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
I don't think I picked it up until I recognized,
I recognized the voice, I justcould not oh he, I, I don't know
, I, I absolutely love him.

Speaker 3 (38:26):
I mean, I've heard his voice in so many different
roles that that's what he wasthe guy.
He was the impetus for me tostop and check out the voice
cast, because once I heard myman, patrick stewart, I was like
, okay, that's my captain,jean-luc Picard.
I mean, I watched a lot of NextGeneration.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
Yeah, there was one scene that's Spaceballs right,
what that's?

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Spaceballs right.

Speaker 3 (38:51):
Oh, you're pulling my leg.
You're pulling my leg.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
You guys are listening.
Oh man, you should have seenRich's face, guys.
He was looking at the cameralike are you kidding me?

Speaker 3 (39:00):
I didn't know what I was going to do.

Speaker 1 (39:01):
He was looking like he needed somebody to snap a
Muslim gym.

Speaker 2 (39:05):
Yeah we should actually do Spaceballs at some
point.
That's actually a really funmovie.
Yeah, it is.

Speaker 1 (39:10):
It was actually one of the decent parodies, yeah,
but yeah, man, this there was afair bit of musical numbers, but
it wasn't over the top where itfelt like it was a straight up
musical.
I felt like the musical numberswere well placed and they

(39:34):
really drove.
Some of them were lightheartedand some of them were very
dramatic and I felt like theywere great.
The musical numbers were alllike really good well, that's
the thing too.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Like with the, with the musical numbers, they drove
the plot forward.
Yeah, whenever, whenever it wasa musical scene, they express a
jump in the story, they kind ofbridge gaps, except for the
scene where they're leavingegypt, like that was, you know,
like very intentionally, like inthe moment yeah, but most of
the musical scenes that happenshowcase time moving on you know

(40:10):
, like there's there's.
There's a song the plagues thathappened over a long period of
time, you know in the actualbook of exodus, but in the movie
that's a five or like a fourminute scene.
You know like they kind ofencapsulate that into like four
minutes through song and evenlike the beginning where, like
rich, you were saying that youwere having trouble following or

(40:30):
you didn't understand thedecree, they do, like you said,
you have the soldiers running inthe background in that scene,
you know, like trying to findyoung hebrew boys, basically.
But you know, if you you'rerewatching that with you know
like looking for those things,you'll find it.
You'll find that kind of stuffhidden in that song number,

(40:51):
basically, and it does inch youinto the story.
But, like, if you take othermovies, like, I think, frozen,
when it's a musical number inFrozen, I'm thinking like let it
go, they pause the movie sothat Elsa can sing, let it go.
Like it breaks the movie up.
You know it's not a narrativesong that moves the story

(41:12):
forward, it's a pause in themovie so that Elsa can sing,
versus this movie which is allnarrative, driven like songs,
and I think that works so welland it makes it not feel like a
musical.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Right, right, right, like so you're.
You were talking about plaguesand how.
That is like showcasingsomething that happens over a
period of time and I think thatthey do well in showing that it.
It is something that'shappening over time, just like
you know, condensed for the song, like you know the drought and
the famine, and it showed, likeyou, you know, you can tell,

(41:45):
especially like watching it waslike yeah, this is something
that's happening over time.
This isn't something that'shappening, you know, in the span
of a day or a couple days, youknow, and so there's that.
And then, like the wholedevelopment of his relationship
with his wife, you know, moses,you know from the from, from

(42:06):
like the start up until they getmarried.
That drives the narrative ofyou know them establishing that
relationship up to the point towhere they get married.
You're right, they do such agood job at picking really good

(42:26):
songs and really doing a lotwithin those songs.

Speaker 2 (42:29):
While I was looking for where to stream this movie,
I discovered that there's asecond movie in this vein that I
had never even heard of.
It was like a direct-to-DVDsequel, but it's actually a
prequel, because it's aboutjoseph.

Speaker 1 (42:43):
It's called joseph something, something dreams oh
yeah, I've never heard of it.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
I seen it long time ago long time ago yeah, anyway,
I was just like so surprisedthat that movie even existed.
And yeah, just a short aside,speaking about the plagues, the
first plague where he turns thewater into blood.
What a great scene oh my god,like that's so.
It's just such a powerfulmoment, like just the staff

(43:11):
going into the water and the waythat they visualize the slow,
you know, spread of right itturning into blood and how that
affects the egyptians in thewater.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
Super cool the way they did that and it looks like
actual, like, you know, like ifyou were like blood in the water
.
It looked exactly like thatreal effect.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
It spreads like that yeah if you go back to that
scene when moses is standing inthe river, you can see that
there's like a ring around himof like normal water, yep, and
then after that point it it'sred.
That's such a cool littledetail.
It's such a cool detail becauseit didn't affect the Hebrews.
This plague didn't affect theHebrews, so they had regular

(43:52):
drinking water.
The Egyptians did not.
Thinking about that, that iscool.
When they do stuff like that inthis movie or other movies like
it, this is a detail that youdon't need to have for the story
to continue, but it just makesit so much cooler.
I don't know yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:10):
Another scene that like, really, like you know,
really blew me away too was theum parting of the red sea.
That was insane, dude, and likeyou know, like how massive both
sides looked, you know, yeah um, like a super stylized like

(44:32):
wave, almost that doesn't crash.

Speaker 2 (44:35):
Really, really cool rich.
What do you think of that scene?

Speaker 3 (44:37):
that scene was the second time that I paused the
movie so that I could.
I wanted to do a littleresearch, you know, and I was
like, oh, okay, just delvinginto different weird uh stuff.
Just uh, you know, like theinterpretation that it was maybe
sea of reeds and that you knowthat isn't a yeah, so that's a
possible you know.
So that it's like because Ialways like kind of

(45:00):
recontextualizing stuff in thatway to kind of digest it
differently, I would say, thanwhen I was a younger, when I was
a wee lad listening to thestories in school and at Sunday
Mass in Spanish, which was thatmuch harder to suss out what I
was really understanding.
I'd be like wait a minute, didthat guy do this?

(45:21):
And the grandfather's like yep,his, did that guy do this?
And like grandfather's like yep, his name's Job, we'll talk
about him later.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
So I uh for, for the, for those listening who don't,
who aren't following, with thesea of reeds.
There's a belief out there thatthe red sea is a misnomer or
mistranslation that has occurredover the course of years and
that it's the sea of reeds thatis most likely or you know that

(45:48):
some people believe is mostlikely to be the location where
that could have happened orwould have happened.
But yeah, it's a theory.
I don't want to say yes or no,or I don't know, I have no idea.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
I've read one article about it.

Speaker 2 (45:59):
Yeah, when I was watching the movie and I went
back to it.

Speaker 3 (46:02):
You you know.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
It is a cool theory and, like you said, it's cool to
recontextualize certain things.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
But obviously I'm glad the movie did not go with
that kind of line of thinkingbecause the wall of water, and I
mean it just, and then you know, even with the visual play it
had, with the fire blocking theEgyptians, you know that was a
really, you know it was cool,because I think it's really easy

(46:26):
to mess that scene up, becauseeverybody watching I would
assume almost everybody watchingthis in my opinion knows that
part right, like that's the partthat like if when I watched the
ridley scott movie exodus, godsand kings, and the sea just
like dries up because it's justlike the low tide or whatever,

(46:47):
that was the most disappointedmoment I think I've ever been in
a movie theater.

Speaker 2 (46:50):
I was just like, oh come on.
That's so lame.
Yeah, show me the magic, showme the miracles, dude, but yeah,
this movie.

Speaker 3 (47:00):
Yeah, and it just just gives you.
Because I got lulled into allright, they're leaving, and I
was like I guess they're justgoing to hit the impasse, but
then he's going to split it, sowe're good.
And then you have the Egyptianscoming over the hill.
You see, Ramsey's head kind ofpokes up.
And that's when you're like, ohwhat?

(47:23):
And that's why, like, the firewas great too.
Because then you're like, oh,wait a minute, there's no way
they're going to get throughthat fast.
So they, they kind of thoughtof everything there to really
heighten the drama and then kindof, you know, make everything
believable in the world they hadalready built.
Right, there was nothing therethat was extraordinary or

(47:45):
unbelievable for what we'vealready accepted can happen in
this world totally yeah yeah,that pillar of fire was.

Speaker 1 (47:52):
That was actually really cool they.

Speaker 2 (47:54):
They did a really cool job with that.
Yeah for sure.
Speaking aboutrecontextualizing, you know
common knowledge, or like whatwe perceive to know, about these
stories.
A common thing for you know,for people who want to, whether
you believe in this story or not, you know like there are

(48:14):
certain things in history thatcould tie this story to reality.
And a common thing that, likeatheists and certain scholars,
will try to suggest that,because the Bible says that the
Hebrews lived in the city ofRamesses, this must mean that

(48:35):
it's suggesting that theyexisted during the reign of
Ramesses II.
Ramesses the Great, basically,who's like the most praised, or
like most?
He's the most popular pharaohin Egypt in terms of like the
works that he created.
So it's actually an anachronism.
So how do I explain thiswithout like stumbling over

(48:55):
myself?
So Ramesses he existed in the19th dynasty.
The story of Exodus dates itselfmuch earlier, a couple hundred
years earlier, and thatobviously doesn't line up
chronology-wise.
So if you're looking for proofthat the Israelites were a
people that existed in Ramesses,like Ramesses the Great's Egypt

(49:16):
, you're not going to find that,so you'd have to look elsewhere
.
It would have to be quite a bitbefore Ramesses.
So, like there are certaintheories as to like what
pharaohs actually existed,because the pharaoh itself isn't
named in that account.
But we know that when it termthe city of Ramesses 400 years

(49:46):
earlier in Joseph's time, so hecan't have existed back then as
well, you know.
So most likely in the course ofhundreds of years of translating
, it became known that that areaof the world became known as
Pyramuses, so they would justsay the city of Ramesses in
translations of the Bible, sothat people would know where

(50:08):
exactly the Israelites were atthe time when they were in Egypt
.
So yeah, that idea thatRamesses the Great is the
pharaoh of the book of Exodus isjust a complete misreading of
the text.
But there are a couple pharaohsout there that if you
contextualize their story withwhat happens in or after the

(50:32):
book of exodus, it does match uppretty cool.
I don't know if you guys wantme to tell about those or or not
, but we can continue talkingabout the Prince of Egypt.

Speaker 1 (50:40):
No, no, no, yeah.
Now I mean you can, you can,you can like put it down because
I mean it's all like relevant,because it ties back to the
story that this movie is basedoff of.

Speaker 3 (50:52):
Okay, I feel like you should do timeline so like this
.
You know you, you really kindof.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
I might, I might might have a timeline.
I think you have a knack forthis, okay, all right.
All right, so we'll start.
My two favorite theories arepharaoh akhenaten of the 18th
dynasty and dudamos of the 14thdynasty or 13th 13th dynasty.
Yeah, so let's start withakhenaten, so it's a little bit

(51:21):
closer to Ramesses' time period.
His father or actually it wouldbe Amenhotep III would be the
pharaoh of Egypt in this telling, basically.
So Amenhotep III exists, thestory of Exodus happens and then
something strange happens inthe next pharaoh's run, where
Amenhotep IV changes his name toAkhenaten and decides we're

(51:45):
only worshiping one god now, notthe 300 gods that we've had for
all of Egyptian history, butwe're going to serve a
monotheistic god now.
So the idea there is that therewas such religious and cultural
upheaval because of whathappened to the Egyptians at the
time that the next pharaoh wasjust like no, we got to worship

(52:07):
that god instead, and he's theonly pharaoh in all of Egyptian
history that is a monotheist.
But it's not necessarily theHebrew god he's worshiping.
He's worshiping the Egyptiansun, god Aten, as the one and
only god.
So that's a theory I don't knowif I buy it the one that makes
the most sense to me is Deutemos, so for him this one's pretty

(52:32):
cool.
There's a Jewish historian thatexisted around the time of
Jesus' day who quoted anEgyptian historian from a couple
hundred years earlier namedManethos.
So Josephus is the Jewishhistorian he quotes, manethos.
Manethos is a historian ofEgypt and he basically said that
in Deutermos' reign, pharaohDeutermos or he called him

(52:54):
Thutmose.
He says in Thutmose's rule, godsmote him or God blasted him
and sent him into ruin.
And then, after that point,other nations raided egypt
because there was a power vacuumand that basically started.
That was the end of the middlekingdom and the start of the

(53:14):
second inter intermediate,something like that.
Yeah, the second intermediateperiod where basically, like,
there was a period of time where, like, egypt was broken, they
were just completely broke for,you know, a short period of time
where, like, egypt was broken,they were just completely broke
for a short period of timebefore the new kingdom popped up
and Egypt got on its feet again.
So the theory there is that thatquote from the Egyptian

(53:34):
historian Manathos is basicallysaying that you know, this
singular God brought Egypt downin this guy's reign and
afterwards other nationsbasically raided Egypt because
they were very easy to raid.
At that point they had noworkforce.
So it's a cool theory.

(53:56):
It lines up better, like thatwould be the closest
chronologically to what theBible says, or what Exodus says,
is the timeline of that event,and I think it's only like 50 or
60 years off the mark, maybe alittle more than that.
So it's a possibility.
But anyway, I'm going to stoptalking now because I'm going
crazy here.
But yeah, were you guys able tokeep up with that?

(54:19):
I don't know if that made anysense.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
No, no, no, like, keep up with that.
I don't know if that made anysense.
Totally no, no, no.
Yeah, like I understood thatthat, like you were, you know
that there's a lot of liketheories out there and that you
know one kind of lines up withthe other.
You know that that's the crazything about like things that are
not, I guess, like heavilydocumented, so like a lot of

(54:41):
it's just speculation at thispoint correct.

Speaker 2 (54:44):
Yeah, and like dudamos, the one that I believe
is closest to the pharaoh of theegyptian, or like the exodus
account, very little is knownabout his reign outside of what
that egyptian historian,manethos, from like 2 bce, had
to say about him.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
That's such a cool name, though, dudamos dudamos
d-u-d-i-m-o-s-e yeah, man he's.

Speaker 2 (55:07):
He was a dude he was a dude who did not let people go
.
Maybe all right, let's jumpback into the movie.
Did you guys have any otherthoughts about anything?

Speaker 3 (55:18):
I thought it was going to be more like disney.
I guess I was expecting alittle bit more jazzy numbers at
first, so like they, werereally well done and powerful.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
There is a jazzy number.

Speaker 3 (55:31):
Yeah, there's one, but I was, you know.
Look, I, growing up, I watcheda lot of the Disney movies over
and over again, because that wasalways like.
You know, I have a sister who'sa year younger than me, so she
you know we would have to tradeoff.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
Like you know, I have a sister who's a year younger
than me.

Speaker 3 (55:45):
So she, you know we would, oh yeah, we would have to
trade off, you know.
So I wanted to watch batman 89but I had to go watch, you know,
lion king again, or littlemermaid or whatever.
So you know, aladdin is one ofmy favorites and part of it is
that the music was fun, you know, I guess like fun to follow,
and I did.
There is a point where earlieryou guys mentioned how it moves
the plot, right.

(56:05):
Well, my brain, from like asmall child, was trained that
the way I could get through themovies that I didn't want to
watch was to kind of like blockout the songs a little bit,
right, which is crazy, and Iknow this is crazy because all
those movies have songs.
So my first watch of the moviebecause you guys know I always
watch it twice I kind of zonedout during the song, right, and
then the songs would end and I'mgoing, oh, whoa, scene change

(56:28):
something.
Like something happened right.
So I had to.
I found myself two or threetimes going back because I
listened to the melody andeverything you know.
But I just don't, like I'm notprocessing because, like you
said, like with elsa singing,you know, like I'm just I'm kind
of ready to, you know, I Ialmost kind of consider a break
time for my brain, you know youclock.

(56:48):
Yeah, you know just it's a hunakumitada man.
You know just a wonderfulphrase.
You know it's just, you know nobig deal.
And I think that that's the onething that I'm not used to a
lot.
I I guess I'm used to moremusical numbers being the
performance piece and not anarrative piece.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
Well, DreamWorks isn't really like that, though
DreamWorks is like nothing, likeDisney.
A lot of the musical numbers intheir movies and I'm not saying
that every movie is like that,but a lot of them drive the
narrative Like even with what doyou call it?
Like Shrek.
Shrek had those musical numberswere just silly ones, but there
was a lot that was happening inthose musical numbers, you know

(57:26):
.
You know, like the developmentof the relationship between, you
know, shrek and fiona.
Yeah, so, like you know.
Yeah, dreamworks is very muchso like their music.
It may be silly in some movies,but they're trying to drive the
story along and not pause themovie I never thought about it
that way, yeah yeah, so yeah,dude, I guess I didn't see it

(57:49):
because trick had the trick had.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
Like you know, it's a hero for hire or whatever.
I need a hero in that kind ofsequence, right since they had
some of the popular tunes that Iknew growing up from like 80s
movies.
It made it.
I think it made it moreaccessible in some ways, and a
lot of those were like a montageset to like a an awesome 80s

(58:11):
song yeah, it's mostly montagesyou know, like those I can pay
attention, you know I can.
That's like a little bit, Idon't know.
I don't know.
It's just made the way my brainworks.
I think I hear music guys.
I'm just like expecting likesome mindless tune and it
tricked me so uh that I I didhave to go back and then I was
more appreciative of it.
You know, because since I hadit really kind of caught it the

(58:34):
first time, my second watchthrough, I was expecting it more
and I knew some of the lyricsof the songs.
So it was definitely a moreenjoyable second watch.
And part of that was alsobecause I didn't even know I was
about to watch an animatedmovie.
I had no idea that I was goingto be singing, so like my
expectations were completelyflipped.
So the second watch was kind ofa little bit, I think, more

(58:56):
informative.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
Would you say that after the second watch you were
delivered?

Speaker 3 (59:05):
Yeah, I didn't want to let go.
You know, I was like I'm notgonna let go and then it was
like no, you'll let go.
And I was like I won't let go,and it was like you'll let go.

Speaker 1 (59:11):
And eventually I found myself letting go, like
for me it was a, it was a greatrewatch know, kind of going back
to a movie of my youth that youknow I remember seeing way back
and I remember seeing a lot ofit when I was younger.
But yeah, man, it was fun.

(59:32):
I forgot how much I enjoyedthat movie.

Speaker 2 (59:36):
It's a good comparison that you made Rich to
Disney movies, especially likeclassic disney movies, because
when there is musical numbersthere's occasionally a pretty
significant villain musicalnumber.
You know, in little mermaid youhave poor, unfortunate souls.
Sung by ursula, we have scarssong.

(59:58):
Scars song I forget is the thename of scars song but it's
basically like almost like anazi march I think it's be
prepared be prepared.
Yeah, oh, such a good, good one.
As soon as you say be prepared,like I just you hear be
prepared, I'm thinking of others, mother's mother knows best.

Speaker 3 (01:00:15):
In entangled mother gothel's song there's tons of
them, but anyway, in this movie,one of my favorite villain
songs of all time is playingwith the big boys oh, that was
good, it's just yeah, the snakescene with with steve martin and
martin short oh my gosh, that'swhat made me think like I was
like that scene right, likethat's what I was waiting for

(01:00:39):
more of you know, know, likethat, I'm kind of used to that
stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
Yeah, I got you yeah, where it that?
I will say that that probablydidn't move the story along as
much, but it is an importantscene in the narrative of the
actual story because it'sbasically the first time you
know God tells Moses to performa miracle in front of Pharaoh.
But the way that they do it,where the magic practicing
priests decide that they're justgoing to show off all their

(01:01:04):
gods, is so good because it justgoes way harder than it needs
to.

Speaker 3 (01:01:09):
Basically it's a good time that scene, yeah, that one
was really fun and that's kindof a little bit the style I, you
know.
Like I look the songs that Iliked most in the disney movies.
You know, we're like, if we'retalking about aladdin, I like
street rat, where it's a kind oflike fast-paced, like jokey
kind of going on, whereas, likeyou know, I was definitely
rolling my eyes when a whole newworld was coming on when I was

(01:01:32):
a kid I was like oh, not thisone again, you know so it was
part of me being like also.
I think it's like when I watch amovie like this, I'm kind of
like a 12 year old boy again,you know, going like all right,
well, I could watch some ofthese, you know, but like, don't
tell my friends and I don'tlike that one and that one, but
I that one's okay, you knowwatching Aladdin as an adult is

(01:01:54):
interesting because a whole newworld has an entirely different
meaning.

Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
It's, it's a, it's a massive innuendo.
Like there's no way, it isn't,there's no way.
Like every single line in thatisn't it?
It's, it has to be.
Like there's and and and.

Speaker 3 (01:02:10):
Jafar is way creepier you know when you now you're
like that's like the sultan'sfriend, right like you, dudes
are the same age.
Like whoa, what whoa.
What is happening here?

Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
Speaking about age, that's another thing that this
movie takes liberty with.
Moses was 80 years old when heliberated Egypt.

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
Yeah, I mean, I know it's a kid's movie and he looked
like 30, 40.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
Yeah, maybe in his 40s mid-40s, I know that I look.

Speaker 3 (01:02:43):
I know that you want to end on a nice note.
All right, I found myself bingewatched all the planet of the
apes movies, all right, oh mygoodness.
Oh my goodness, but there is akind of well, what I thought was
I was going to see, I thought Iwas going to see the similar
scene because you know that'sthe story, right, and it's okay

(01:03:03):
to kind of end with abittersweet moment, right?
So I'm waiting for I'm like,what are they going to do here?
I'm like tapping the screengoing.
How are they, uh, how are theygoing to show the?

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
golden.
What are you doing?
You know?

Speaker 3 (01:03:16):
and I, and I kind of thought you're going to get that
moment like in the planet ofthe apes, where you know he
leads them to the promised landbut it dies right there, as
he'll never be oh yeah, no, theyweren't gonna go another 40
years yeah, yeah, yeah, no.

Speaker 1 (01:03:32):
No, this was just like the story of of exodus,
like this isn't yeah this wasn'tgonna like go into all that.
But yet, gentlemen, we aregetting super deep and kind of
like going off on tangents.
I think it is time to wrap thisone up like a mummy are we
ready?

Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
we have to let it go let our podcast go.

Speaker 1 (01:03:56):
I need to be delivered.

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
Anthony is ready to get severed yeah, a long commute
home yeah, that long commutehome for Anthony, oh man,
alright, guys, thank you so muchfor listening to us here for
our 116th episode of ProjectEcology.
If you haven't checked outPrince of Egypt, I personally
recommend it, just because Ithink that they did a really

(01:04:20):
good job of using their creativelicense to tell a unique take
on a very classic story.
I'm guessing from thediscussion our co hosts also
believe the same.
What do you guys think?

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
I agree.

Speaker 2 (01:04:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:04:35):
I really like.
I mean, like I'm always the guywho's gonna be like where's Tom
Bombadil?
So that's always gonna give mea problem, but once I can get
over that, I think it was reallywell done excellent.

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
All right guys.
So you heard it here.
Check out prince of egypt ifyou haven't already.
And yeah, if you haven'tdecided to, you know, check out
and review our page.
We're always looking for goodreviews, specifically juicy ones
.
Anthony, how many?
How many stars is a juicyreview?

Speaker 1 (01:05:01):
we need five flame broiled juicy stars man make
sure they're sizzling guys.

Speaker 2 (01:05:08):
All right, have a good one.
Goodbye y'all.
You're no longer playing withthe big boys.
Bye guys.