June 24, 2024 • 39 mins
Can happiness be our default state? Join Dr. Tami and Harold as they challenge this widespread belief and unpack the unrealistic expectations society places on us. Through candid discussions, they reveal how the pursuit of constant happiness can lead to stress and disappointment. Listen as Harold shares a touching moment of joy playing with his son, which highlights the sporadic nature of happiness and how it often appears when least expected. Dr. Tammy explains how true contentment stems from feeling calm and safe, rather than perpetually happy.
Discover the intricate dynamics between pride and happiness in our next segment. Dr. Tammy and Harold delve into how pride in our achievements can stand alone, separate from the fleeting sensation of happiness. They stress the importance of embracing a full spectrum of emotions instead of being fixated on happiness. This nuanced understanding is especially crucial in relationships, where expecting constant happiness can create undue pressure. By navigating various emotions together, couples can foster a healthier, more resilient connection.
In the final part of the episode, we dissect the difference between genuine happiness and temporary euphoria. Dr. Tammy and Harold caution against external means like drugs or alcohol for seeking joy, as these often lead to short-lived highs rather than true fulfillment. They also tackle the evolution of our eating habits, pointing out how modern consumption has shifted from survival to pleasure, which has contributed to addictive behaviors. This discussion sets the stage for future conversations about how these habits impact our overall well-being. Join us for a thought-provoking conversation that aims to reshape your understanding of happiness and the effort required to attain it.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The following is a series of candid conversations.
The content is intended forinformational purposes only and
is not a substitute for seekinghelp from a mental health care
professional.
To learn more info regardingadditional disclaimers, privacy
policies and terms andconditions, please visit
HelloDrTammycom.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Bonjour.
You're listening toPsychologist Say, a podcast
where I talk about thepsychology of everyday living.
I'm your host, dr Tammy, andI'm joined by my production team
, harold.
How are you doing, harold?
Speaker 1 (00:37):
I'm doing wonderful.
How are you, Dr Tammy?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
I'm good, I'm excited .
Today I want to talk about oneword.
What's that word?
Happiness, oh okay.
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yeah, she's happiness .
Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Let's do it Okay.
So I think that's the word thatin my line of work and
everything that I've done andthe people I've worked with,
that is a number one statementthat I hear is I just want to be
(01:14):
happy.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Right.
I imagine most people aroundthe world that's what their, you
know what their goal is.
I suppose just looking forhappiness, and even if you're in
a dark is, I suppose, justlooking for happiness, even if
you're in a dark place, Isuppose.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Right, and so it's.
One of the things that I've hadto tell people is that it's
almost as if it's an entitlementor a guarantee.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Happiness is a guarantee.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
No, I think.
We think that it should be ohright, okay, there you, okay,
okay, yeah.
So it's almost like we shouldbe happy.
That's the default.
So if I'm not happy, I'm broken.
(02:06):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So you know the default yeah, I should always be
happy, I should always be in astate of happiness, that's what
people want.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Because I'm alive, I should be happy.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Yeah, that's not, that sounds impossible.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
And it is.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But that somehow has been the default, the
expectation.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
How did it become?
I mean, I guess that's anunanswerable question, but how
did it become the default?
Why do we expect that?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
That's what I'm curious about.
Yeah, okay, and part of it is Ithink it's part of what we've
been told that just be happy orI'm seeking happiness.
It's just this word happy,happy and it's overused.
(03:10):
There are so many other wordsthat we could probably use in
different moments of our lifethat could help us release that
pressure of I just want to behappy.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
I understand that the goal for most people is to be
happy as much as possible, but,yeah, the idea of it being the
default doesn't yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
I guess I don't understand that part of it
personally, right, yet it'sprobably your default.
I just want to be happy.
I want to do what makes mehappy.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah, I mean I do have those thoughts where it's
like, yeah, I do just want to behappy, I want to be happy as
much as possible, but I mean I'mgoing to go through other
emotions.
I understand that, right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
But that's what the piece of saying.
I just want to be happy, I wantto do what makes me happy.
At the end of the day.
I just want to be happy, and Ithink this is something where in
society we need to address that.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Okay, oh, you're thinking big picture right here.
Yes, big picture, big picture,okay, well, okay.
So I I definitely agree withyou like through um in society
nowadays, like you will hearthat word quite a bit right and
uh, people do expect that.
You know their default would belike just happiness like
(04:43):
they're disappointed, thatthey're not happy.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Because it's an expectation.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Okay, well, I guess what would be your prescription
for that.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Oh, good question.
So I think the prescription forthat is what does it take to be
happy, and I believe it's work.
Yeah.
So it's not the default, it'snot the entitlement, it's not
the natural.
It's natural for us to feelcalm and safe.
(05:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
That's not happiness.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
That doesn't mean emotional happiness.
Yeah, that doesn't meanemotional happiness.
So the default for our nervoussystem is meant to be calm, safe
, secure, versus agitated,hypervigilant, stressed and
anxious.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
But it is natural to be anxious sometimes.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Right, like we've talked, like the public speaking
fight or flight?
Yeah, exactly.
Yet the default is supposed tobe calm, rest, and only anxious,
nervous, fearful, during timesof stress or danger, of stress
(06:17):
or danger, and so that's thatexpectation to say yes, my body
was supposed to be built thisway, versus geez.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Somebody told me I'm supposed to be happy and I'm not
.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
And that could lead to maybe even more unhappiness.
Bingo Okay, yes, okay, thereyou go.
So I'm saying yes, it's okay tosay well, I should feel calm
and safe.
You know, my body was meant, mynervous system was meant, to be
mainly set on calm, unless I'munder extreme stress and danger.
And then it turns on.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
But our body wasn't set emotionally to happy.
We only, we'll only feel that.
You know, now and then.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Yeah, I guess I don't I mean really, and I'll think
about when was the last time youtruly felt a moment of just
utter happiness?
Think right now.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Oh, utter happiness.
Wow, oh, probably yesterday,when I was playing with my son.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Okay, awesome, tell me a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Oh, you know, I just watch him run around.
He'll take his shirt off andgrab the water hose and spray it
all over, and he likes to makerainbows with the shower setting
on our thing, and it's just, Idon't know.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I guess in that moment to yeah, I've been
feeling my happiness, Okay, soin that moment did you know you
were experiencing extremehappiness?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
No, I was just living it.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You were living it Okay, beautiful, and so now,
when you think back, how do youfeel about that moment?
Now, when you think back, howdo you?
Speaker 1 (07:44):
feel about that moment.
I feel good.
I wouldn't say I'm.
I guess it does bring some likea glimmer of happiness.
Okay, within me, sure.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Okay, joy, yeah, joy, yeah, okay.
I mean, these are just otherwords.
I'm thinking of yeah, and sohow long do you think it lasted?
I know you were really in themoment, but Just within that
moment probably.
Within that moment.
Yeah, okay, and this is thetough part, when I explain to
(08:17):
people we have these wonderfulmoments of true happiness, like
wonderful moments of truehappiness, and it's definitely
better to be experiencing themand almost not be aware, because
that means you were so into itthat, uh, you didn't even think
like, oh my gosh, I'm so happyright now yeah and um, but it
(08:40):
was brief and look what it tookto get you there what it took.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yeah, like you just being around the well, the
person I love the most, probably, or definitely, uh, I mean,
that's what it took.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I suppose it took you to be present yes yeah, it is,
and it took your son you to have.
He was there, yep.
You were fully aware of what hewas doing.
You were consumed by it.
He was probably feeling joy,excitement.
It sounds like he was playing.
Oh yeah, he loves that.
(09:28):
Put in to be there with him tobe part of that allowed you to
feel that level of what you said, happiness or goodness whatever
.
So that's where, when I tellpeople happiness takes work, and
I always show a picture of amaze, because we can't just wake
up and say, well, I, I choosehappiness.
Right, I create happiness bymoments okay.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
So I got, I got another example.
I guess one thing I liked, Ienjoyed this doesn't have to do
with family or anything, or likethose really intense, uh, happy
moments.
Uh, it's when, like say, I'mworking on something and I
create something, right?
Uh, you know, maybe I'm likefor a long time I've worked in a
manufacturing facility andwhenever that thing we
(10:17):
manufactured comes out, I justlike taking a step back and
looking at it and in that moment, after I do the work, I just,
you know, in that moment I I dofeel happy, I feel, I guess,
pride, pride.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Okay, yeah, so pride probably more than happiness.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Hmm, that's a good question.
Yeah, maybe it is pride morethan happiness.
I guess I wouldn't Well tell mewhat does pride mean to you?
(11:00):
I guess, like there's twoaspects of it where, say, in
that moment I just described,like there is like a feeling of
happiness and I feel good aboutmyself, but I also know, like
I'm also aware that, like toomuch pride can have a lot of
negative aspects to it.
I guess that's how I, when Ithink of pride, that's kind of a
(11:21):
little bit of a danger zone.
There can.
Oh, there's absolutely a dangerzone.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Okay.
So now that you're thinkingabout it, though, did you feel
pride Because you createdsomething?
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Yeah, I definitely did.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Okay, and is that okay for you to feel that now
that you're beautiful, right?
So this is part of the workwhere maybe all day I wasn't
happy, but, boy, I had thisreally proud moment and I, just
I felt it.
I didn't let it consume me, Ididn't let it.
You know, it was again a momentof pride in what I have
(12:01):
accomplished and what I haveaccomplished.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Yeah, I mean yeah, that's exactly what that feeling
is, I suppose.
So I guess my question for youright now is there's pride and
then there's happiness, and inthat moment we were talking
about how do we differentiatewhat's, what?
Are they combined?
In that moment, am I feelinghappiness or is it just pride?
Speaker 2 (12:27):
I mean, we can feel multiple things.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
But what you're starting to do is realize happy
is not the term for everything.
Yeah.
And so if we can be morerealistic in what we're doing,
sometimes I feel very proud ofwhat I've created and it still
doesn't.
I still don't feel happy inside.
(12:51):
Oh.
So, but I can feel accomplished,I can feel fulfilled, but I
wouldn't describe it as ahappiness.
When I'm, when I'm truly like,um, something has touched me so
deep and all I can feel is somekind of joy.
(13:14):
Okay, and it has nothing to dowith what I created or I
achieved, so that's, uh, like alike that, like sitting and
watching your kids, just laying,you know, relaxing, on the
couch, you know, with my husband, and just feeling a sense of
(13:37):
how I'm happy right now.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
I guess.
Yeah, I'm still having, I guess.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
And there's no right or wrong.
It's this is the goodconversation that we're having
for people to start to say gosh.
That to me does feel like a lotof pressure that I expect to be
happy and when I'm not, I feellike I'm not, I'm doing
something wrong.
Yeah.
Or I'm supposed to be changingit up to to make myself feel
(14:09):
happy when there are so manyother emotions that we can be
creating in a day that are allvery normal and acceptable and
good.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Yeah, and it doesn't have to be, like you said, happy
shouldn't be the default and wecan feel other things and, and
we need to and we need to acceptthem right that's.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
That's part of going, that's part of the reality of
life.
Is that with emotions, we tendto stick to the big ones I'm
happy, I'm sad, I'm what else isthere?
I'm jealous.
Even jealous is one I don'tthink we bring up enough.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
So sad, mad, happy, bored, you know, whatever these
emotions are, there are so manymore, and so when we are focused
on this broad concept of I justwant to be happy, we're really
(15:11):
limiting what we could actuallybe feeling throughout the day
and enjoying just all these realfeelings that are within a day.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
Yeah, embrace it all.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Embracing it, yeah, and really then holding on to
those true moments of happinessand understanding the difference
.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
So as far as like understanding that, you know
happiness shouldn't be thedefault, but society has kind of
pushed that idea on us in a way.
Would you agree with that?
Yes, okay, how do I guess?
Hmm, when was I going with this?
(15:54):
Well, how?
Speaker 2 (15:55):
about the phrase where I said well, happiness
takes work.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely, it definitely
probably does.
I mean.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
So already then it's like that's the way to say okay,
so it's not the default, it'snot expected.
What makes me happy and what amI doing to create this feeling?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
So, okay, I remember where I was going with this.
So, for the people that havethe expectation of happiness and
they don't feel happy all thetime because it's not possible,
could they in some way beputting themselves at risk of
doing things they think willmake them happy because they
(16:40):
want to be happy?
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Yes, okay, yes, and just at risk of feeling worse
because they're not achievingwhat they think is possible.
Happiness, just a word.
I just want to be happy.
And that's where changing thatup a bit to say, well, I want to
(17:01):
have more happy moments.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Oh yeah, that's realistic.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
That's realistic.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I want to have a better day today than I did
yesterday.
Yeah, I want to feel excitementabout something today.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah, it's a little more specific and achievable
rather than.
I just want to be happy, then Ijust want to be.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
It's so vague, right yeah, and I think this can not
happy.
Then I just want to be Right,yeah, and I think this can not
only help individuals, but itcan help anybody who's in a
relationship, because what adifficult pressure cooker if
your goal in your relationshipis just to be happy.
Be happy.
(17:49):
If that's something that wecannot achieve 100% of the time
for ourselves, why would we putthat as our criteria for our
relationship or our marriage?
Speaker 1 (17:54):
or our yeah 100% I just want to be happy in this
marriage or this Yep, just happyall the time, yeah and then,
yeah, we have that expectationof ourselves, but when we start
putting it on other people, itcan be really difficult for
everybody involved.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Because it's again, it's relying on this
relationship to make us make mehappy, make us happy.
That's the type of work thatyou're seeing.
If now I'm having thisconversation and I'm embracing
all of these other emotions,then wouldn't that be the same
(18:33):
in my relationship, that we gothrough emotions together the
same way we go through themindividually?
We're going to have moments ofrage, disappointment, shame,
(18:54):
anger, jealousy.
Love, happiness, excitement,exhilaration.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
You know everything that comes with it yeah and
sometimes you can have all thosein one damn day oh right, oh,
that's a roller coaster, butyeah, yeah, it's nothing
possible.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
And then so, if you are able to see that your
relationship, that's therealistic expectation.
There's no default of let'sjust choose happiness, it's.
Let's make our moments makethem count.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, live in the moment and just live, live, I
guess live in the moment, makemoments count.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Uh, cherish when you're you are having a true
moment of happiness, and you maystart to notice the difference
between.
Well, what's happiness mean tome?
Speaker 1 (19:43):
oh, that yeah.
Happiness could be differentfor everybody.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
I mean it is 100% Like if I would have anybody who
was sitting across from me whenI said, when was your last
happy moment?
It had nothing to do withsociety at large or whatever was
scripted.
You went to your happy momentand it was with watching your
son play outside, right, yeah,so that's, that's happiness,
(20:10):
what?
Whatever our moments are, thatcrew that are created through us
for another dad, they might.
They might have had that samemoment, maybe even yesterday.
It was beautiful out, yep, andmaybe they had a son that was
playing in the, you know, justin the water and the sprinkler,
(20:30):
and they saw it.
They were, yeah, but maybe itwasn't the same.
They didn't stop and have thatmoment of oh boy, I'm really
enjoying watching my son havingfun.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, do you get what I'm saying?
Yeah, I do, but that kind ofmakes me a little sad.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Well, I mean, that's your moment.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah, exactly, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
This person may have said boy, I was really happy
yesterday.
Yeah, my kid was playingoutside, but I was mowing the
grass and I felt good, I couldsmell the, you know.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
And that would be a pride thing kind of.
Well, no, no, Okay, no that'shis happiness.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Oh, that's what.
I'm yeah.
So it's not a like oh, I feelbad for that.
You know that kid or that guy.
Yeah.
It's.
It's that's what made him happythat that moment yeah, he was.
You know, that's.
That was maybe what I get, sorelaxed.
When I'm I'm cutting grass andI can smell the grass, I'm um,
(21:38):
you know, I'm taking care of thelawn, the sun's out, it's kid's
playing, you know, in the waterand the grass.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
He's in his own moment, he's in his own moment.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
There you go.
Okay, so that's how people tryto use the word happiness, as if
it's scripted.
Yeah, that we all have the sameprescription to create
happiness.
Yeah, I think you might haveeven asked me something about
right, how do you prescribe?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
that, or how do you?
Oh yeah, what's theprescription for?
Like, was it the society?
I guess like.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Yeah, how do we start to?
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah, how do we move from just be happy to you know,
enjoy your own happiness when itcomes up, I guess?
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Yes, and that.
I think that's that's the pieceof saying wow, okay, and our
listeners now can say, okay,when was the last time I truly
felt like a level of happiness?
Yeah, how long did it last, youknow?
And okay, so that was my, thatwas a moment.
Gosh, I enjoyed that.
And then we start to see thatlife, you know, mostly we're
(22:45):
living, we're getting through,we're busy, we have some stress,
we have some sadness, we have alot of longing and desires and
unfulfilled things.
So most times I think we'rekind of in anguish, trying to
get somewhere, and so that'swhere we can say well, maybe
that's part of the way it is andI have these moments of
(23:10):
happiness, or where I'm content.
There's another word, content.
I think a lot of people justforget to look for.
Well, I'm content right nowDoesn't mean I'm just happy and
full of joy and energy, but I'mso content I don't want for
anything right in this moment,so correct me if I'm off here.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
But so instead of like, just be happy, it's just
be content.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Well, just Would that be better.
Well.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Or is that not quite right I?
Speaker 2 (23:39):
can take content.
I would I love content If Icould be content.
Yeah, right.
Yeah love content if I could becontent.
Yeah, right, yeah, so that'sthat acceptance of all of these
different emotions and not, andand I'll be all of one.
That's kind of like even thatdichotomy of either or either
I'm happy or then I'm sad.
(23:59):
Yeah, but this is where, um,I'm choosing to identify moments
of happiness and realize that Ican create, I can try to create
more moments, but it has to beby my definition of what's
happiness.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Yeah, your definition yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
And then I want to be more present, to understand all
of the other emotions, so I canappreciate them.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Yeah, so like maybe one day you Satisfied.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
How about the last time you just felt satisfied.
That's not content, justsatisfied.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
There's a whole lot of words for using, like pride,
content, satisfied.
One word that kind of popped inmy head was like euphoria,
which isn't happiness, it's kindof like an.
I think it was like a intense,intense feeling.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Excitement, yeah, excitement, yes, like I guess
well, when's the last time youfelt euphoric?
Speaker 1 (24:58):
oh uh, last weekend we'll say yeah, that.
Okay, I guess, what would you?
We're using all these words.
How would you define happiness?
I know, like I understand,happiness is different for
(25:19):
everybody.
Like, if you could use a fewwords to like describe it, what
would you?
Speaker 2 (25:25):
It's a feeling from the inside.
Okay.
Uh, it's a feeling of bright.
Bright, it's a feeling ofgratitude.
Uh, and remember, this is me.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
Yeah yeah, everyone's definition could be a little
different.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Yep, it's where I could just smile.
I'm smiling and it feels real.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
Feels real.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
It's real Okay, and I'm not wanting for anything,
and it's a feeling that is sointernal, it's almost like in my
stomach or in my gut yeah, okayand it's something I can't
create anytime, any other timeit has to be like a natural, in
(26:16):
a way natural yeah and it feelsso flippin wonderful.
It's not euphoria yeah it is andthat's why it's those rare
beautiful moments when youreally tap into that happiness
feeling and you sit and say whatjust created that for me?
And then you capture it.
You know you, because you wantthat memory.
Those are the good memories.
(26:38):
So when you want, you know,when you want to feel, you want
to pull out those happy memoriesyeah not just positive memories
.
You know right, we want somemoments that we can pull up in
our brain, like the one that youtalked about, and it will
create that feeling of happinessas if we were there Same thing
as a negative memory.
It'll pull it up as if we'rethere.
(26:59):
So why don't we startexchanging these memories to
create a feeling of safehappiness, a gut feeling of I'm
so, I'm happy.
Right now, I really feel thisgenuine happiness inside of me.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Yeah, okay, yeah, okay.
Just this conversation, I, Iwould have to rethink about what
happiness is to me, to you,yeah, to me, yeah, there you go
like, I guess, like the way youdescribed it, there are some
similarities, the way I, I seehappiness for myself, but there
are like some subtle differences.
(27:43):
I guess I would say and isn'tthat the key point of?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
yet we use the term as if it applies the same to
everybody.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
And it does.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
No, and I think then people can achieve happiness on
their own level, once theyunderstand that what moments
truly bring out that internal?
You know, this is something.
You can't fake it, you can't,you know, produce it.
It's happening, it's a reactionto what's going on around you
(28:25):
and it feels so good, like alightness.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
A lightness yeah, I like that.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Yeah, I can agree with that.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
And it's natural, you know, and it's sometimes it's
just like wow, I'm wow.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Yeah, and it doesn't have to be associated with, like
you know, achieving things oryou know like say okay, okay, I
guess where I'm going is there'shappiness and can we, is there
(28:59):
only, can we become only sohappy, or is there like oh, I
believe you can, you can,there's no limit right, there's
no limit no, okay there's nolimit.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
So it's what do I do in my life, or in moments to it,
to create more Mm-hmm?
You just don't get like here'slife and here's this boom.
You get happiness, and withlittle moments of sadness, with
little times of struggle, butmainly you are I'm going to
label you a happy person.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Yeah, yeah, but like we said, that's not.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
That's not you know.
So if most people create,they're creating their happiness
, whether they know they're veryaware of it.
Some people just are naturalwhere they're living more like
that.
They're more internally awareof the things that makes them
happy.
So they do more of those things, just naturally.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, but are they more aware that these things
make them happy than maybe otherpeople are?
But are they more aware thatthese things make them happy?
Speaker 2 (30:15):
than maybe other people are.
Yeah, I think some people havemuch better insight into what's
good for them, what makes themfeel certain ways, and then,
like I think there was aquestion you asked, where could
people be seeking and doingthings that they think will make
them happy, but they'reactually maybe hurting them?
So I think that, yes, I thinkthose people exist, but they
(30:39):
think, yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
So I guess.
So the people that thinkthey're doing something, for
example, okay, let's takesomeone who's in a really bad
spot and they think let's say,drugs makes them happy and maybe
for a brief, well, it may notmake them happy at all because
we talked about, like, say,euphoria, some drugs will make
(31:02):
people feel euphoric.
They're not feeling happy,they're feeling euphoric.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
And they're not, you know.
And then that comes with.
You know all kinds of othertypes of emotion, but happiness
actually isn't one of them, orit might be, but you know, I
guess.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
And that's.
But that's the piece of itwhere that they're maybe adding
something I said.
This kind of this happensnaturally Like you're around,
you do the work, but it'shappening, so you taking a
moment to really watch your sonand just enjoy that moment.
That was work for you.
(31:41):
You had to stop and do that,and so people who are then
seeking and this could be withfood, drugs, smoke, anything
that we want to do.
We think it'll help us behappier or feel happy for a
little bit.
Again, that's like gosh.
(32:03):
Am I able to create thiswithout this?
Yeah.
That's where you start toquestion oh boy, so this is
something that I would have todo this exact thing, and I'm
kind of changing something aboutmy biology to make me feel
happy or euphoric.
Yeah.
(32:23):
So that's where they start tosay, ooh, am I doing a?
I'm trying to force a happinessby putting something that isn't
just, it's not just happening,it's not natural.
Yeah, we're forcing it, I'mforcing it, yeah.
So therefore, what is that?
Is that true?
Is that a feeling of truehappiness, or is it just an
(32:44):
exchange of chemicals?
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah, it definitely.
I guess it isn't happiness atall An exchange of chemicals,
happiness at all in exchange ofchemicals.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
But that's where that's the point of people are
really seeking happiness.
They're seeking relief frompain.
Yeah.
Whatever they're seeking to,maybe not feel at all.
They're seeking a break fromemotion, sometimes, yeah, and so
they don't.
(33:15):
They may not.
They may be very aware that youknow, going out and um,
drinking too much and going on abender does nothing to make
them happy, but it maybe helpsthem not feel for a while and
not pain or whatever's going on.
Yep yeah it.
It can maybe take them awayfrom what's happening in their
(33:38):
life and give them maybe just abreak.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, which might not be bad, but like we're talking
about, you're not reaching truehappiness.
It's something else A breakcontent.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
You're adding something to try to, so it's the
same thing, like with and we're.
The good thing is we're gettinginto a little bit of what we're
going to be talking about thisseason, where we're talking
about substance use or addictivebehaviors.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
Yeah, that'll be, and so, yeah, we're kind of we're.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
We're kind of going into that territory right now,
which is which is good, becausewe'll be able to talk about it
much more, and this is part ofthinking, though, anything that
we are doing to forcefullychange our mood is what I think
(34:30):
you're kind of getting at, andis that true happiness if it's I
think you're kind of getting at, and is that true happiness If
it's something that could be badfor us?
Eating is a huge oh yeah, yes,you know, oh this makes me so
happy.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Yeah.
And maybe I guess for me, youknow, it's like in the moment,
like, say, I get a burger fromfive guys or something, and you
know, while I'm eating it I feel, I guess what would you say
that emotion is?
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Well, you tell me, maybe you haven't examined it.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
I guess I haven't.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
And that's why I love you know.
I hope our listeners, you know,pay attention, because this is
all of us.
Yep.
And we don't know what aboutour behavior is just driving us.
Yeah.
And so does the burger make youhappy.
You just said no, but boy, Ifelt something.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Yeah, in the moment of me eating it, especially the
first bite, if you're reallyhungry, it's like, oh, I needed
this.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Right.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
And I maybe didn't need it, but I really, really
wanted it, wanted it.
Yeah, right, yeah, right yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
And then so there's all kinds of words to say, well,
I wasn't happy, but, boy, I wassatisfied, satisfied.
Hmm, I was.
Yeah, I mean, there's so many,there's so many words, there's
so many.
I keep going to the same ones,but I was fulfilled.
I was, you know, and it is achemical reaction, a change.
(35:57):
When we eat something, you knowthe food and the smell.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
You know, smells go straight to a certain part of
your brain when I'm on a dietand I go to Texas Roadhouse and
they have those little buns, thebun, right?
And it's so hard to not eatthose things, right yeah.
And it's so hard to not eatthose things, right, yeah, and
(36:30):
see many people eat because theywant that temporary high, that
buzz from just that wonderfulsensation of eating smelling
good food.
You know all of this stuff andlike to a degree a lot of.
Speaker 2 (36:36):
That's natural, because we got to eat.
We eat to survive Our ancestors.
Well, we eat to survive, butwhat did we historically eat to
survive?
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Probably berries and roots and things like that.
If we got some meat, we werevery happy.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Right In reality, somewhere along the way with
spice and salt and sugar.
Right.
And now processed foods, yeah,so we didn't naturally eat to
enjoy, we naturally ate tosurvive, yep, and now we're not
eating to survive, we're eatingto enjoy, yeah, yeah, it's a
(37:12):
different thing, it's a wholedifferent thing.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
There you enjoy, yeah , yeah, it's a different thing,
it's a whole different thing.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
There you go.
Yeah, and that's the importanceof saying when am I doing
something to try to produce thisemotion that I desire and it's
actually working against me.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
Yeah, there's like some negative aspects to it.
Yes, like there is a positiveaspect.
We understand that we want to,we need to.
You know eat to survive andstuff, but you know there's the
drawbacks of overeating or bingeeating or whatever.
All of it, yeah, any kind ofaddictive behavior that we think
is bringing us maybe somehappiness and it doesn't have to
(37:51):
be food, it could be all kindsof other things.
Gambling, gambling drugs,alcohol video games even.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Video games.
Yes, I mean so many things.
So that I think is a good wayfor us to start to wrap up this,
because we are definitely goingto have another episode this
season on addictive behaviorsand I bet you our listeners are
getting excited for that,because we gave them a little
(38:18):
teaser of it.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
I'm excited about it.
Yeah, that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
So we'll end our conversation today.
It was basically on one topichappiness.
Now, there's no right or wrongshere, but I did give my
thoughts and I'm sure that therewas a lot of different theories
on this.
Definitely go online, do someresearch, but the most important
(38:43):
research is doing this work onyourself, identifying your
moments, really understandingwhat internally drives you to
feel that happiness, give ityour own definition and be
accepting of all of the otherfeelings that are part of normal
everyday living.
(39:03):
Ps.
Here's to being human.
Here's to more moments ofhappiness.
You.
The following is a series of candid conversations.
The content is intended forinformational purposes only and
is not a substitute for seekinghelp from a mental health care
professional.
To learn more info regardingadditional disclaimers, privacy
policies and terms andconditions, please visit
HelloDrTammycom.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Bonjour.
You're listening toPsychologist Say, a podcast
where I talk about thepsychology of everyday living.
I'm your host, dr Tammy, andI'm joined by my production team
, harold.
How are you doing, harold?
Speaker 1 (00:37):
I'm doing wonderful.
How are you, Dr Tammy?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
I'm good, I'm excited .
Today I want to talk about oneword.
What's that word?
Happiness, oh okay.
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yeah, she's happiness .
Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Let's do it Okay.
So I think that's the word thatin my line of work and
everything that I've done andthe people I've worked with,
that is a number one statementthat I hear is I just want to be
(01:14):
happy.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Right.
I imagine most people aroundthe world that's what their, you
know what their goal is.
I suppose just looking forhappiness, and even if you're in
a dark is, I suppose, justlooking for happiness, even if
you're in a dark place, Isuppose.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Right, and so it's.
One of the things that I've hadto tell people is that it's
almost as if it's an entitlementor a guarantee.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Happiness is a guarantee.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
No, I think.
We think that it should be ohright, okay, there you, okay,
okay, yeah.
So it's almost like we shouldbe happy.
That's the default.
So if I'm not happy, I'm broken.
(02:06):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So you know the default yeah, I should always be
happy, I should always be in astate of happiness, that's what
people want.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Because I'm alive, I should be happy.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Yeah, that's not, that sounds impossible.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
And it is.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
But that somehow has been the default, the
expectation.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
How did it become?
I mean, I guess that's anunanswerable question, but how
did it become the default?
Why do we expect that?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
That's what I'm curious about.
Yeah, okay, and part of it is Ithink it's part of what we've
been told that just be happy orI'm seeking happiness.
It's just this word happy,happy and it's overused.
(03:10):
There are so many other wordsthat we could probably use in
different moments of our lifethat could help us release that
pressure of I just want to behappy.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
I understand that the goal for most people is to be
happy as much as possible, but,yeah, the idea of it being the
default doesn't yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
I guess I don't understand that part of it
personally, right, yet it'sprobably your default.
I just want to be happy.
I want to do what makes mehappy.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah, I mean I do have those thoughts where it's
like, yeah, I do just want to behappy, I want to be happy as
much as possible, but I mean I'mgoing to go through other
emotions.
I understand that, right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
But that's what the piece of saying.
I just want to be happy, I wantto do what makes me happy.
At the end of the day.
I just want to be happy, and Ithink this is something where in
society we need to address that.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Okay, oh, you're thinking big picture right here.
Yes, big picture, big picture,okay, well, okay.
So I I definitely agree withyou like through um in society
nowadays, like you will hearthat word quite a bit right and
uh, people do expect that.
You know their default would belike just happiness like
(04:43):
they're disappointed, thatthey're not happy.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Because it's an expectation.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Okay, well, I guess what would be your prescription
for that.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Oh, good question.
So I think the prescription forthat is what does it take to be
happy, and I believe it's work.
Yeah.
So it's not the default, it'snot the entitlement, it's not
the natural.
It's natural for us to feelcalm and safe.
(05:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
That's not happiness.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
That doesn't mean emotional happiness.
Yeah, that doesn't meanemotional happiness.
So the default for our nervoussystem is meant to be calm, safe
, secure, versus agitated,hypervigilant, stressed and
anxious.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
But it is natural to be anxious sometimes.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Right, like we've talked, like the public speaking
fight or flight?
Yeah, exactly.
Yet the default is supposed tobe calm, rest, and only anxious,
nervous, fearful, during timesof stress or danger, of stress
(06:17):
or danger, and so that's thatexpectation to say yes, my body
was supposed to be built thisway, versus geez.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Somebody told me I'm supposed to be happy and I'm not
.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
And that could lead to maybe even more unhappiness.
Bingo Okay, yes, okay, thereyou go.
So I'm saying yes, it's okay tosay well, I should feel calm
and safe.
You know, my body was meant, mynervous system was meant, to be
mainly set on calm, unless I'munder extreme stress and danger.
And then it turns on.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
But our body wasn't set emotionally to happy.
We only, we'll only feel that.
You know, now and then.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Yeah, I guess I don't I mean really, and I'll think
about when was the last time youtruly felt a moment of just
utter happiness?
Think right now.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Oh, utter happiness.
Wow, oh, probably yesterday,when I was playing with my son.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Okay, awesome, tell me a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Oh, you know, I just watch him run around.
He'll take his shirt off andgrab the water hose and spray it
all over, and he likes to makerainbows with the shower setting
on our thing, and it's just, Idon't know.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I guess in that moment to yeah, I've been
feeling my happiness, Okay, soin that moment did you know you
were experiencing extremehappiness?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
No, I was just living it.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You were living it Okay, beautiful, and so now,
when you think back, how do youfeel about that moment?
Now, when you think back, howdo you?
Speaker 1 (07:44):
feel about that moment.
I feel good.
I wouldn't say I'm.
I guess it does bring some likea glimmer of happiness.
Okay, within me, sure.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Okay, joy, yeah, joy, yeah, okay.
I mean, these are just otherwords.
I'm thinking of yeah, and sohow long do you think it lasted?
I know you were really in themoment, but Just within that
moment probably.
Within that moment.
Yeah, okay, and this is thetough part, when I explain to
(08:17):
people we have these wonderfulmoments of true happiness, like
wonderful moments of truehappiness, and it's definitely
better to be experiencing themand almost not be aware, because
that means you were so into itthat, uh, you didn't even think
like, oh my gosh, I'm so happyright now yeah and um, but it
(08:40):
was brief and look what it tookto get you there what it took.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yeah, like you just being around the well, the
person I love the most, probably, or definitely, uh, I mean,
that's what it took.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
I suppose it took you to be present yes yeah, it is,
and it took your son you to have.
He was there, yep.
You were fully aware of what hewas doing.
You were consumed by it.
He was probably feeling joy,excitement.
It sounds like he was playing.
Oh yeah, he loves that.
(09:28):
Put in to be there with him tobe part of that allowed you to
feel that level of what you said, happiness or goodness whatever
.
So that's where, when I tellpeople happiness takes work, and
I always show a picture of amaze, because we can't just wake
up and say, well, I, I choosehappiness.
Right, I create happiness bymoments okay.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
So I got, I got another example.
I guess one thing I liked, Ienjoyed this doesn't have to do
with family or anything, or likethose really intense, uh, happy
moments.
Uh, it's when, like say, I'mworking on something and I
create something, right?
Uh, you know, maybe I'm likefor a long time I've worked in a
manufacturing facility andwhenever that thing we
(10:17):
manufactured comes out, I justlike taking a step back and
looking at it and in that moment, after I do the work, I just,
you know, in that moment I I dofeel happy, I feel, I guess,
pride, pride.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Okay, yeah, so pride probably more than happiness.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Hmm, that's a good question.
Yeah, maybe it is pride morethan happiness.
I guess I wouldn't Well tell mewhat does pride mean to you?
(11:00):
I guess, like there's twoaspects of it where, say, in
that moment I just described,like there is like a feeling of
happiness and I feel good aboutmyself, but I also know, like
I'm also aware that, like toomuch pride can have a lot of
negative aspects to it.
I guess that's how I, when Ithink of pride, that's kind of a
(11:21):
little bit of a danger zone.
There can.
Oh, there's absolutely a dangerzone.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Okay.
So now that you're thinkingabout it, though, did you feel
pride Because you createdsomething?
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Yeah, I definitely did.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Okay, and is that okay for you to feel that now
that you're beautiful, right?
So this is part of the workwhere maybe all day I wasn't
happy, but, boy, I had thisreally proud moment and I, just
I felt it.
I didn't let it consume me, Ididn't let it.
You know, it was again a momentof pride in what I have
(12:01):
accomplished and what I haveaccomplished.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Yeah, I mean yeah, that's exactly what that feeling
is, I suppose.
So I guess my question for youright now is there's pride and
then there's happiness, and inthat moment we were talking
about how do we differentiatewhat's, what?
Are they combined?
In that moment, am I feelinghappiness or is it just pride?
Speaker 2 (12:27):
I mean, we can feel multiple things.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
But what you're starting to do is realize happy
is not the term for everything.
Yeah.
And so if we can be morerealistic in what we're doing,
sometimes I feel very proud ofwhat I've created and it still
doesn't.
I still don't feel happy inside.
(12:51):
Oh.
So, but I can feel accomplished,I can feel fulfilled, but I
wouldn't describe it as ahappiness.
When I'm, when I'm truly like,um, something has touched me so
deep and all I can feel is somekind of joy.
(13:14):
Okay, and it has nothing to dowith what I created or I
achieved, so that's, uh, like alike that, like sitting and
watching your kids, just laying,you know, relaxing, on the
couch, you know, with my husband, and just feeling a sense of
(13:37):
how I'm happy right now.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
I guess.
Yeah, I'm still having, I guess.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
And there's no right or wrong.
It's this is the goodconversation that we're having
for people to start to say gosh.
That to me does feel like a lotof pressure that I expect to be
happy and when I'm not, I feellike I'm not, I'm doing
something wrong.
Yeah.
Or I'm supposed to be changingit up to to make myself feel
(14:09):
happy when there are so manyother emotions that we can be
creating in a day that are allvery normal and acceptable and
good.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Yeah, and it doesn't have to be, like you said, happy
shouldn't be the default and wecan feel other things and, and
we need to and we need to acceptthem right that's.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
That's part of going, that's part of the reality of
life.
Is that with emotions, we tendto stick to the big ones I'm
happy, I'm sad, I'm what else isthere?
I'm jealous.
Even jealous is one I don'tthink we bring up enough.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
So sad, mad, happy, bored, you know, whatever these
emotions are, there are so manymore, and so when we are focused
on this broad concept of I justwant to be happy, we're really
(15:11):
limiting what we could actuallybe feeling throughout the day
and enjoying just all these realfeelings that are within a day.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
Yeah, embrace it all.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Embracing it, yeah, and really then holding on to
those true moments of happinessand understanding the difference
.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
So as far as like understanding that, you know
happiness shouldn't be thedefault, but society has kind of
pushed that idea on us in a way.
Would you agree with that?
Yes, okay, how do I guess?
Hmm, when was I going with this?
(15:54):
Well, how?
Speaker 2 (15:55):
about the phrase where I said well, happiness
takes work.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely, it definitely
probably does.
I mean.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
So already then it's like that's the way to say okay,
so it's not the default, it'snot expected.
What makes me happy and what amI doing to create this feeling?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
So, okay, I remember where I was going with this.
So, for the people that havethe expectation of happiness and
they don't feel happy all thetime because it's not possible,
could they in some way beputting themselves at risk of
doing things they think willmake them happy because they
(16:40):
want to be happy?
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Yes, okay, yes, and just at risk of feeling worse
because they're not achievingwhat they think is possible.
Happiness, just a word.
I just want to be happy.
And that's where changing thatup a bit to say, well, I want to
(17:01):
have more happy moments.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Oh yeah, that's realistic.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
That's realistic.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I want to have a better day today than I did
yesterday.
Yeah, I want to feel excitementabout something today.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah, it's a little more specific and achievable
rather than.
I just want to be happy, then Ijust want to be.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
It's so vague, right yeah, and I think this can not
happy.
Then I just want to be Right,yeah, and I think this can not
only help individuals, but itcan help anybody who's in a
relationship, because what adifficult pressure cooker if
your goal in your relationshipis just to be happy.
Be happy.
(17:49):
If that's something that wecannot achieve 100% of the time
for ourselves, why would we putthat as our criteria for our
relationship or our marriage?
Speaker 1 (17:54):
or our yeah 100% I just want to be happy in this
marriage or this Yep, just happyall the time, yeah and then,
yeah, we have that expectationof ourselves, but when we start
putting it on other people, itcan be really difficult for
everybody involved.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Because it's again, it's relying on this
relationship to make us make mehappy, make us happy.
That's the type of work thatyou're seeing.
If now I'm having thisconversation and I'm embracing
all of these other emotions,then wouldn't that be the same
(18:33):
in my relationship, that we gothrough emotions together the
same way we go through themindividually?
We're going to have moments ofrage, disappointment, shame,
(18:54):
anger, jealousy.
Love, happiness, excitement,exhilaration.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
You know everything that comes with it yeah and
sometimes you can have all thosein one damn day oh right, oh,
that's a roller coaster, butyeah, yeah, it's nothing
possible.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
And then so, if you are able to see that your
relationship, that's therealistic expectation.
There's no default of let'sjust choose happiness, it's.
Let's make our moments makethem count.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, live in the moment and just live, live, I
guess live in the moment, makemoments count.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Uh, cherish when you're you are having a true
moment of happiness, and you maystart to notice the difference
between.
Well, what's happiness mean tome?
Speaker 1 (19:43):
oh, that yeah.
Happiness could be differentfor everybody.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
I mean it is 100% Like if I would have anybody who
was sitting across from me whenI said, when was your last
happy moment?
It had nothing to do withsociety at large or whatever was
scripted.
You went to your happy momentand it was with watching your
son play outside, right, yeah,so that's, that's happiness,
(20:10):
what?
Whatever our moments are, thatcrew that are created through us
for another dad, they might.
They might have had that samemoment, maybe even yesterday.
It was beautiful out, yep, andmaybe they had a son that was
playing in the, you know, justin the water and the sprinkler,
(20:30):
and they saw it.
They were, yeah, but maybe itwasn't the same.
They didn't stop and have thatmoment of oh boy, I'm really
enjoying watching my son havingfun.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, do you get what I'm saying?
Yeah, I do, but that kind ofmakes me a little sad.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Well, I mean, that's your moment.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah, exactly, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
This person may have said boy, I was really happy
yesterday.
Yeah, my kid was playingoutside, but I was mowing the
grass and I felt good, I couldsmell the, you know.
Speaker 1 (21:08):
And that would be a pride thing kind of.
Well, no, no, Okay, no that'shis happiness.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Oh, that's what.
I'm yeah.
So it's not a like oh, I feelbad for that.
You know that kid or that guy.
Yeah.
It's.
It's that's what made him happythat that moment yeah, he was.
You know, that's.
That was maybe what I get, sorelaxed.
When I'm I'm cutting grass andI can smell the grass, I'm um,
(21:38):
you know, I'm taking care of thelawn, the sun's out, it's kid's
playing, you know, in the waterand the grass.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
He's in his own moment, he's in his own moment.
Speaker 2 (21:49):
There you go.
Okay, so that's how people tryto use the word happiness, as if
it's scripted.
Yeah, that we all have the sameprescription to create
happiness.
Yeah, I think you might haveeven asked me something about
right, how do you prescribe?
Speaker 1 (22:07):
that, or how do you?
Oh yeah, what's theprescription for?
Like, was it the society?
I guess like.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Yeah, how do we start to?
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah, how do we move from just be happy to you know,
enjoy your own happiness when itcomes up, I guess?
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Yes, and that.
I think that's that's the pieceof saying wow, okay, and our
listeners now can say, okay,when was the last time I truly
felt like a level of happiness?
Yeah, how long did it last, youknow?
And okay, so that was my, thatwas a moment.
Gosh, I enjoyed that.
And then we start to see thatlife, you know, mostly we're
(22:45):
living, we're getting through,we're busy, we have some stress,
we have some sadness, we have alot of longing and desires and
unfulfilled things.
So most times I think we'rekind of in anguish, trying to
get somewhere, and so that'swhere we can say well, maybe
that's part of the way it is andI have these moments of
(23:10):
happiness, or where I'm content.
There's another word, content.
I think a lot of people justforget to look for.
Well, I'm content right nowDoesn't mean I'm just happy and
full of joy and energy, but I'mso content I don't want for
anything right in this moment,so correct me if I'm off here.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
But so instead of like, just be happy, it's just
be content.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Well, just Would that be better.
Well.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Or is that not quite right I?
Speaker 2 (23:39):
can take content.
I would I love content If Icould be content.
Yeah, right.
Yeah love content if I could becontent.
Yeah, right, yeah, so that'sthat acceptance of all of these
different emotions and not, andand I'll be all of one.
That's kind of like even thatdichotomy of either or either
I'm happy or then I'm sad.
(23:59):
Yeah, but this is where, um,I'm choosing to identify moments
of happiness and realize that Ican create, I can try to create
more moments, but it has to beby my definition of what's
happiness.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Yeah, your definition yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
And then I want to be more present, to understand all
of the other emotions, so I canappreciate them.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Yeah, so like maybe one day you Satisfied.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
How about the last time you just felt satisfied.
That's not content, justsatisfied.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
There's a whole lot of words for using, like pride,
content, satisfied.
One word that kind of popped inmy head was like euphoria,
which isn't happiness, it's kindof like an.
I think it was like a intense,intense feeling.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
Excitement, yeah, excitement, yes, like I guess
well, when's the last time youfelt euphoric?
Speaker 1 (24:58):
oh uh, last weekend we'll say yeah, that.
Okay, I guess, what would you?
We're using all these words.
How would you define happiness?
I know, like I understand,happiness is different for
(25:19):
everybody.
Like, if you could use a fewwords to like describe it, what
would you?
Speaker 2 (25:25):
It's a feeling from the inside.
Okay.
Uh, it's a feeling of bright.
Bright, it's a feeling ofgratitude.
Uh, and remember, this is me.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
Yeah yeah, everyone's definition could be a little
different.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
Yep, it's where I could just smile.
I'm smiling and it feels real.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
Feels real.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
It's real Okay, and I'm not wanting for anything,
and it's a feeling that is sointernal, it's almost like in my
stomach or in my gut yeah, okayand it's something I can't
create anytime, any other timeit has to be like a natural, in
(26:16):
a way natural yeah and it feelsso flippin wonderful.
It's not euphoria yeah it is andthat's why it's those rare
beautiful moments when youreally tap into that happiness
feeling and you sit and say whatjust created that for me?
And then you capture it.
You know you, because you wantthat memory.
Those are the good memories.
(26:38):
So when you want, you know,when you want to feel, you want
to pull out those happy memoriesyeah not just positive memories
.
You know right, we want somemoments that we can pull up in
our brain, like the one that youtalked about, and it will
create that feeling of happinessas if we were there Same thing
as a negative memory.
It'll pull it up as if we'rethere.
(26:59):
So why don't we startexchanging these memories to
create a feeling of safehappiness, a gut feeling of I'm
so, I'm happy.
Right now, I really feel thisgenuine happiness inside of me.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Yeah, okay, yeah, okay.
Just this conversation, I, Iwould have to rethink about what
happiness is to me, to you,yeah, to me, yeah, there you go
like, I guess, like the way youdescribed it, there are some
similarities, the way I, I seehappiness for myself, but there
are like some subtle differences.
(27:43):
I guess I would say and isn'tthat the key point of?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
yet we use the term as if it applies the same to
everybody.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
And it does.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
No, and I think then people can achieve happiness on
their own level, once theyunderstand that what moments
truly bring out that internal?
You know, this is something.
You can't fake it, you can't,you know, produce it.
It's happening, it's a reactionto what's going on around you
(28:25):
and it feels so good, like alightness.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
A lightness yeah, I like that.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Yeah, I can agree with that.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
And it's natural, you know, and it's sometimes it's
just like wow, I'm wow.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Yeah, and it doesn't have to be associated with, like
you know, achieving things oryou know like say okay, okay, I
guess where I'm going is there'shappiness and can we, is there
(28:59):
only, can we become only sohappy, or is there like oh, I
believe you can, you can,there's no limit right, there's
no limit no, okay there's nolimit.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
So it's what do I do in my life, or in moments to it,
to create more Mm-hmm?
You just don't get like here'slife and here's this boom.
You get happiness, and withlittle moments of sadness, with
little times of struggle, butmainly you are I'm going to
label you a happy person.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
Yeah, yeah, but like we said, that's not.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
That's not you know.
So if most people create,they're creating their happiness
, whether they know they're veryaware of it.
Some people just are naturalwhere they're living more like
that.
They're more internally awareof the things that makes them
happy.
So they do more of those things, just naturally.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, but are they more aware that these things
make them happy than maybe otherpeople are?
But are they more aware thatthese things make them happy?
Speaker 2 (30:15):
than maybe other people are.
Yeah, I think some people havemuch better insight into what's
good for them, what makes themfeel certain ways, and then,
like I think there was aquestion you asked, where could
people be seeking and doingthings that they think will make
them happy, but they'reactually maybe hurting them?
So I think that, yes, I thinkthose people exist, but they
(30:39):
think, yes, yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
So I guess.
So the people that thinkthey're doing something, for
example, okay, let's takesomeone who's in a really bad
spot and they think let's say,drugs makes them happy and maybe
for a brief, well, it may notmake them happy at all because
we talked about, like, say,euphoria, some drugs will make
(31:02):
people feel euphoric.
They're not feeling happy,they're feeling euphoric.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
There you go.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
And they're not, you know.
And then that comes with.
You know all kinds of othertypes of emotion, but happiness
actually isn't one of them, orit might be, but you know, I
guess.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
And that's.
But that's the piece of itwhere that they're maybe adding
something I said.
This kind of this happensnaturally Like you're around,
you do the work, but it'shappening, so you taking a
moment to really watch your sonand just enjoy that moment.
That was work for you.
(31:41):
You had to stop and do that,and so people who are then
seeking and this could be withfood, drugs, smoke, anything
that we want to do.
We think it'll help us behappier or feel happy for a
little bit.
Again, that's like gosh.
(32:03):
Am I able to create thiswithout this?
Yeah.
That's where you start toquestion oh boy, so this is
something that I would have todo this exact thing, and I'm
kind of changing something aboutmy biology to make me feel
happy or euphoric.
Yeah.
(32:23):
So that's where they start tosay, ooh, am I doing a?
I'm trying to force a happinessby putting something that isn't
just, it's not just happening,it's not natural.
Yeah, we're forcing it, I'mforcing it, yeah.
So therefore, what is that?
Is that true?
Is that a feeling of truehappiness, or is it just an
(32:44):
exchange of chemicals?
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah, it definitely.
I guess it isn't happiness atall An exchange of chemicals,
happiness at all in exchange ofchemicals.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
But that's where that's the point of people are
really seeking happiness.
They're seeking relief frompain.
Yeah.
Whatever they're seeking to,maybe not feel at all.
They're seeking a break fromemotion, sometimes, yeah, and so
they don't.
(33:15):
They may not.
They may be very aware that youknow, going out and um,
drinking too much and going on abender does nothing to make
them happy, but it maybe helpsthem not feel for a while and
not pain or whatever's going on.
Yep yeah it.
It can maybe take them awayfrom what's happening in their
(33:38):
life and give them maybe just abreak.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, which might not be bad, but like we're talking
about, you're not reaching truehappiness.
It's something else A breakcontent.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
You're adding something to try to, so it's the
same thing, like with and we're.
The good thing is we're gettinginto a little bit of what we're
going to be talking about thisseason, where we're talking
about substance use or addictivebehaviors.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
Yeah, that'll be, and so, yeah, we're kind of we're.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
We're kind of going into that territory right now,
which is which is good, becausewe'll be able to talk about it
much more, and this is part ofthinking, though, anything that
we are doing to forcefullychange our mood is what I think
(34:30):
you're kind of getting at, andis that true happiness if it's I
think you're kind of getting at, and is that true happiness If
it's something that could be badfor us?
Eating is a huge oh yeah, yes,you know, oh this makes me so
happy.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
Yeah.
And maybe I guess for me, youknow, it's like in the moment,
like, say, I get a burger fromfive guys or something, and you
know, while I'm eating it I feel, I guess what would you say
that emotion is?
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Well, you tell me, maybe you haven't examined it.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
I guess I haven't.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
And that's why I love you know.
I hope our listeners, you know,pay attention, because this is
all of us.
Yep.
And we don't know what aboutour behavior is just driving us.
Yeah.
And so does the burger make youhappy.
You just said no, but boy, Ifelt something.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Yeah, in the moment of me eating it, especially the
first bite, if you're reallyhungry, it's like, oh, I needed
this.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Right.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
And I maybe didn't need it, but I really, really
wanted it, wanted it.
Yeah, right, yeah, right yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
And then so there's all kinds of words to say, well,
I wasn't happy, but, boy, I wassatisfied, satisfied.
Hmm, I was.
Yeah, I mean, there's so many,there's so many words, there's
so many.
I keep going to the same ones,but I was fulfilled.
I was, you know, and it is achemical reaction, a change.
(35:57):
When we eat something, you knowthe food and the smell.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
You know, smells go straight to a certain part of
your brain when I'm on a dietand I go to Texas Roadhouse and
they have those little buns, thebun, right?
And it's so hard to not eatthose things, right yeah.
And it's so hard to not eatthose things, right, yeah, and
(36:30):
see many people eat because theywant that temporary high, that
buzz from just that wonderfulsensation of eating smelling
good food.
You know all of this stuff andlike to a degree a lot of.
Speaker 2 (36:36):
That's natural, because we got to eat.
We eat to survive Our ancestors.
Well, we eat to survive, butwhat did we historically eat to
survive?
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Probably berries and roots and things like that.
If we got some meat, we werevery happy.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Right In reality, somewhere along the way with
spice and salt and sugar.
Right.
And now processed foods, yeah,so we didn't naturally eat to
enjoy, we naturally ate tosurvive, yep, and now we're not
eating to survive, we're eatingto enjoy, yeah, yeah, it's a
(37:12):
different thing, it's a wholedifferent thing.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
There you enjoy, yeah , yeah, it's a different thing,
it's a whole different thing.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
There you go.
Yeah, and that's the importanceof saying when am I doing
something to try to produce thisemotion that I desire and it's
actually working against me.
Speaker 1 (37:29):
Yeah, there's like some negative aspects to it.
Yes, like there is a positiveaspect.
We understand that we want to,we need to.
You know eat to survive andstuff, but you know there's the
drawbacks of overeating or bingeeating or whatever.
All of it, yeah, any kind ofaddictive behavior that we think
is bringing us maybe somehappiness and it doesn't have to
(37:51):
be food, it could be all kindsof other things.
Gambling, gambling drugs,alcohol video games even.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Video games.
Yes, I mean so many things.
So that I think is a good wayfor us to start to wrap up this,
because we are definitely goingto have another episode this
season on addictive behaviorsand I bet you our listeners are
getting excited for that,because we gave them a little
(38:18):
teaser of it.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
I'm excited about it.
Yeah, that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
So we'll end our conversation today.
It was basically on one topichappiness.
Now, there's no right or wrongshere, but I did give my
thoughts and I'm sure that therewas a lot of different theories
on this.
Definitely go online, do someresearch, but the most important
(38:43):
research is doing this work onyourself, identifying your
moments, really understandingwhat internally drives you to
feel that happiness, give ityour own definition and be
accepting of all of the otherfeelings that are part of normal
everyday living.
(39:03):
Ps.
Here's to being human.
Here's to more moments ofhappiness.
You.
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