June 30, 2025 • 26 mins
Have you ever wondered why so many marketing research tools fail to capture what customers truly want? James Warren, CEO and founder of Share More Stories, talking with host Peter Woolfolk, has dedicated his career to solving this problem through an innovative approach that combines storytelling with artificial intelligence to reveal the "why" behind customer and employee behavior.
Warren introduces us to the SEEQ platform (Stories to Engage, Explore and Question), which takes a fundamentally different approach from traditional surveys and focus groups. While conventional research tools excel at identifying who, what, when, and where, they often miss the crucial question of why people make the decisions they do. By inviting participants to share personal stories rather than just answer predetermined questions, SEEQ creates a safe space for authentic expression that yields remarkably rich insights.
What makes this methodology particularly powerful is how it transforms qualitative experiences into measurable emotional data. The platform analyzes 55 different emotions, needs, values, and attitudes to create an "emotional map" that helps organizations understand not just what people experienced, but why it mattered and how it made them feel. For communications professionals, this represents invaluable intelligence for crafting messages that genuinely resonate.
Warren shares compelling success stories, including how Virginia Tourism Corporation used story-based insights to reimagine their approach to reaching Black travelers. By deeply understanding these travelers' experiences and then creating a campaign that authentically reflected those stories, they achieved remarkable results, increasing Black tourism to Virginia while earning industry recognition.
The interview highlights what's missing in most corporate communications today: authentic voice. Too often, PR messages are developed from the company's perspective rather than centering the voices of customers or employees. By incorporating authentic stories and emotional insights into communications strategy, brands can dramatically shorten the distance between message and audience, creating that elusive "ring of truth" that drives engagement and loyalty. Ready to make a bigger impact in your organization? Start by truly listening.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Announcer (00:04):
Welcome.
This is the Public RelationsReview Podcast, a program to
discuss the many facets ofpublic relations with seasoned
professionals, educators,authors and others.
Now here is your host, peterWoolfolk.
Peter Woolfolk (00:25):
Welcome to the Public Relations Review Podcast
and to our listeners all acrossAmerica and around the world.
Now, apple has ranked thispodcast among the top 1% of
podcasts worldwide and recentlyFeedspot listed this podcast as
number 13 on its top 70 bestpublic relations podcasts in the
United States.
So thank you to all of ourguests and listeners for your
(00:48):
continued support and, if youenjoy the podcast, please leave
a review.
Question are today's marketresearch solutions providing the
ample data that tells businessleaders what they really need to
know?
Because a lot of the datamisses the customer's voice and
experience.
Businesses miss opportunitiesto create significant value.
(01:10):
My guest today has developed aprogram that produces rich,
actionable insights into theneeds and values of an
underserved consumer segment,identified core experience
drivers and creates campaignsthat continues to exceed
expectations.
Experienced drivers and createscampaigns that continues to
exceed expectations, drivesconversion and builds loyalty
(01:30):
through better experiences.
Now they say that if you wantto create incredible experiences
for your employees and yourcustomers, you have to better
understand them first, and thatbegins with listening.
So joining me today fromRichmond, virginia, is James
Warren.
He is the CEO and founder ofShare More Stories and the SEEQ
program.
So, james, welcome to thepodcast.
James Warren (01:53):
Thank you so much for having me, Peter.
I'm glad to be here.
Peter Woolfolk (01:56):
Well, let's begin by talking about exactly
what is Share More Stories, whatdo you do?
And then we'll get into what isyour SEEQ program more stories.
James Warren (02:11):
Sure thing.
Well, share More Stories is awe call it a human experience
insights company.
That means we do research intoemployee experience, customer
experience.
Sometimes we're doing communityvoice or stakeholder
perspectives, but really thecommonality in all of that is
our desire to really help ourclients perspectives, but really
the commonality in all of thatis our desire to really help our
clients understand not just theopinions and beliefs and
(02:31):
attitudes of the people thatthey're trying to serve, either
as employees or customers, butreally understand their
experiences and what's drivingthem, as you already said.
And so that's become a really,really big focus for us, and
what we found was our uniquemethodology of storytelling and
AI was perfectly suited for thegrowing field of employee
(02:52):
experience, customer experience,work, and so for communication
professionals, for leaders,organizational business leaders,
brand leaders, it's becoming anew tool in their research
toolkit when they really want togo a little bit deeper and
understand the why behindpeople's decisions, behavior, et
cetera.
Peter Woolfolk (03:11):
You know, the first question that comes to
mind as I listen to you talkabout this is how did you
recognize that other companieswere making mistakes, at least
in this storytelling process?
Because you know, one of thethings we said is that
storytelling maybe does notallow customers to respond, or
you get the feelings or thoughtfrom them, or what it is they're
(03:32):
actually looking for or missing.
So how do you discover thatdifference or that missing
component?
James Warren (03:39):
Yeah, great question.
I think there's two parts of it.
One is what we saw happening inthe market and you know that
was somewhat informed by our owncore experiences when we were,
as we say, on the other side ofthe table, when we were leading
brands or communicationsdepartments or large
organizations, and what we weremissing in the tools and in the
(04:00):
research that we were gettingfrom our partners.
And then the other piece iswhat's unique about our method
itself, and you referenced itbefore.
It's the SEEK platform, whichis an acronym S-E-E-Q.
It stands for Stories to Engage, explore and Question.
And so when we started thecompany, when I started the
company over 11 years ago, Ireally I've always had a deep
(04:22):
belief in the power of storiesto help people connect and learn
and also develop betterunderstanding of themselves.
And so for me, what was reallyunique in the opportunity space
was to say how are we?
In all of our hyper-attentionaldigital marketing, everybody was
going shorter, shorterattention span, shorter content,
(04:43):
shorter message.
I felt like we were starting tomiss the opportunity to connect
and engage on a deeper level.
I felt that as a consumer andas an organizational leader, and
I also could see that and hearthat in some of the company
leaders we were talking to thatthey were starting to signal,
yeah, we need to go a little bitdeeper, or we're engaging our
(05:03):
employees but it doesn't seem tobe having the desired outcome.
Or we're seeing, you know,maybe a softening of share on
our brand in the marketplace orour message just isn't getting
through, and that's because itwas such a cluttered marketplace
that messages that weren'tauthentic weren't really
engaging.
Of course they're going tostruggle to get through.
So that was kind of the bigpicture.
(05:23):
You know, driver behind startingthe company and starting the
platform.
And then what we saw morespecifically when we launched
Seek is that you know a lot ofthe current research tools.
Surveys are great foridentifying who, what, when and
where, and focus groups andother qualitative research is
really good at going deeper intothat and understanding how.
(05:44):
But none of those tools reallydo a great job of explaining why
.
And I think, as a marketer orcommunications leader or
organizational leader, if youreally want to make an impact
and make a difference in themindset and in the behaviors of
your audiences and yourconstituents, you got to
understand why they do what theydo in the first place.
(06:05):
If you don't understand why Ithink you run the risk of
shooting with your eyes closed.
Peter Woolfolk (06:11):
You know one of the things that years ago I was
in sales with Xerox.
I mean, obviously we didn't gointo the depth that you're going
in here now, but one of thethings that they said at Xerox
is, if you really want to knowwhat somebody wants, ask them
and they will actually tell you.
One of the things that theysaid at Xerox is, if you really
want to know what somebody wants, ask them and they will
(06:31):
actually tell you.
And I think that's in thebeginning where a lot of
salespeople miss it.
They're selling what theirproduct is, how nice and fuzzy
and shiny it's going to be, howmuch you're going to like it,
but they didn't take the time toask them.
This is what you really want.
So I think the carmanufacturers have done a great
deal of that and they tellpeople now that we listen to you
and that's how we designcertain things.
James Warren (06:54):
Well, you know, peter, what you're saying is so
crucial because it's like theneeds ladder right.
So many companies.
They have their product, theyunderstand a little bit about
how people use their product,but it's a natural tendency for
most of us to want to explain.
They have their product, theyunderstand a little bit about
how people use their product,but it's a natural tendency for
most of us to want to explainhow the product works, to want
to explain the features.
Some marketers and sales peoplerealize, no, I've really got to
(07:15):
sell benefits.
But, even that is still somewhatsurface level.
That's what we know, that'swhat we can sell, that's what we
can message, but what we'rereally trying to do is connect
those benefits to the needs thatthose customers and those
employees have, because that'swhen you get real alignment.
Real satisfaction is when hey,it's not just I see this product
(07:40):
has a benefit, it's, thisbenefit meets my needs.
And I think that's wheresometimes we miss going that
extra step, and I think that'sfor all of you because the tools
we've had don't do a great jobof helping us understand
people's needs.
And so I think that's whereSEEK is starting to gain some
relevance and traction, andthat's what I care about.
(08:00):
You know, as a leader, I reallywant to help people meet needs.
I don't just want to.
You know, we don't need moreproducts that don't do anything.
We need products that solveproblems.
We need things that makepeople's lives better.
We need products that solveproblems.
We need things that makepeople's lives better.
We need things that increaseimpact, and so that's the
mission to be honest with you isreally helping companies and
company leaders deliver greaterimpact, and that starts with
(08:21):
understanding those needs.
Peter Woolfolk (08:22):
Let's talk a little bit more, then, about
your SEEQ program exactly.
How does it drill down, if youwill, to find out exactly about
what the needs are, howimportant they are, and that
sort of information Give us anoverview of how that actually
works.
James Warren (08:39):
Absolutely, and I'm going to go with our
shorthand version.
We just call it SEEK.
Okay, and when I talk aboutSEEK, it really starts with
what's the question that youknow that you want to ask, like
you said, if you want to knowwhat people think, ask them.
So we talk about that as beinga prompt.
You know a storytelling promptand it's in our platform.
(08:59):
It's a web-based app that youset up, a project that's focused
on what you want to learn moreabout.
Now here's where one of thefirst big distinctions comes in
from, because most of the timedistinctions comes in from
Because most of the timeexecutives and leaders are
really focused on askingquestions that kind of validate
what they know, you know what Imean.
(09:19):
We say things and ask thingsthat are you know, even if
there's a little bit of we wantto learn something, it's very
rooted and grounded in what wewant to know more about.
What SEEK does is kind of flipthe script and say there are
people out there who, if you askthem to tell you what they're
really thinking and what they'rereally feeling, they will.
But you got to ask them and yougot to make it easy for them to
say it, and it's probably not a30 or 50 point questionnaire.
(09:42):
It's probably a way that theycan express themselves where
they feel open and free to saywhat's really on their minds.
And so that's the premisebehind doing it as a personal
story.
And so we might write a promptaround if we're working with a
travel brand, to that brand, tothat company's either hotels or
airline or destination, or itmight be more general it might
(10:03):
say tell me about your mostmemorable travel experience, and
so consumers of that brand andeven their competitors will come
into the platform and they willrespond to that prompt with a
written story.
We're adding other means likevoice and video, but you'd be
surprised at how much people'sapproach to sharing their story
shifts when they start worryingabout what they look like on
(10:25):
camera.
So we focus on the written storyand voice, because it's a lot
easier to just have them focuson their experience.
But we ask them things likewill you remember tasting or
smelling or touching or hearing?
Because the senses really helpthem recall their story and
their experience with a lot moredetail.
So after they write it, theysubmit it in the platform, they
(10:46):
might answer just a fewquestions about their experience
and then the participant's jobis done.
You know, like if we were doingthe research, then they'd be
done On the back end.
What we're doing is we turn eachof those stories into emotional
data.
So we measure 55 differentemotions, needs, values,
attitudes, all different waysthat help you paint sort of an
(11:07):
emotional map.
So now you not only are hearingwhat people are experiencing,
they're telling you why itmatters to them and we're
showing you how it makes themfeel.
And particularly for folks whoare, say, communicators, right,
this is like gold, because now Ican really tune my messaging to
the tone, to the attitude, toeven be like how do I hit this
(11:29):
emotion?
If that's the emotion I want toachieve, these folks are loving
their experience and this iswhat those emotions look like.
Well, I want to match that, Iwant to meet them where they're
at, and if these are folks whoare struggling in their
experience with our brand, well,I need to move them from where
they're at to this more positiveplace.
What does my language need tosay?
What does it need to feel like?
What does the message or theproduct experience need to
(11:51):
deliver?
So it becomes really a powerfultoolkit in the hands of a
leader or a decision maker or acommunicator, in addition to all
the other things we give our,we talk a lot about how do you
take action on this?
How do you engage this audienceor this constituent, these
employees and so forth?
And often what it really pointsback is what do you need to do
(12:13):
differently as a leader to besuccessful in engaging these
employees or these customers orthese stakeholders?
So that's how the SEEK platformworks.
In a nutshell.
We call it engage, analyze andact, because the first act of
the leader saying I want to hearyour stories and active
engagement, and then theanalysis is what happens in the
platform and then the action iswhat the leader is able to do
(12:35):
with the insights that we'vedelivered them.
Peter Woolfolk (12:38):
You know, not too long ago I spoke to another
person and they had come up witha unique way of getting
supporters, and that was turningactual customers into
supporters.
Because, you know, rather thanhiring a spokespeople or
influencers, why not get peoplewho actually use the product or
(12:58):
service?
Because, I mean, they're muchmore authentic as compared to
paying somebody to say what youwant them to say.
There's a huge difference there.
Have you considered anythingsimilar to that?
James Warren (13:09):
You know that's not necessarily our focus, but
that is definitely one of theuses that has come out of this
platform.
You know we do a lot of work intravel and tourism.
We do some in financialservices, we do some in energy
and utility.
We also do some in health andwellness, right Large industries
(13:29):
that, frankly, are prettymature and in some cases there's
a lot of opportunity to makethings better and one of those
things is, when you deliver agreat experience, how do you
help that customer or employeebecome an ambassador or a
spokesperson for the brand?
And so sometimes one of ourcustomers in travel they ask us
(13:50):
if we would ask participants fortheir permission to share their
stories.
And you know we have to kind ofwalk a fine line there because
we want participants to feellike the platform is highly
trustworthy, private, they canbe anonymous after they register
, so their data is confidential.
So we really save that questionuntil the end and we ask them
(14:14):
hey, are you willing to hearfrom so-and-so company about
your experience?
Can they contact you or wouldyou be willing to let them, to
give them permission to shareyour story in communications?
And that is usually.
That's as far as we go.
And if they say yes, then we'reable to put participants who
raise their hand in touch withthe client and we've seen some
(14:35):
of our clients turn that intoreally, really actionable
marketing and sort ofstorytelling.
One of those was Virginia's forLovers.
They did that very thing wherethey did the research over
several waves to understandcritical travel experiences
among black travelers and othertravelers who were often
underrepresented, not only inthe marketing, but even in, like
(14:58):
the travel experience and afterlearning deeply about those
experiences.
They didn't necessarily takethose exact stories, but they
revamped the whole messagingdirection for the brand, for
those audiences.
And they developed a campaignthat was focused specifically on
letting black travelers telltheir stories on the company's
(15:19):
Instagram page.
The campaign took off, blew upand won some awards, met all
their business objectives andreally increased black travel
and visitation into intoVirginia.
Peter Woolfolk (15:29):
as a result, black travel and visitation into
Virginia as a result.
You know that brings up anotherquestion, and I think about you
know, perhaps the mostdifficult problem you had, let's
say, in times of maybestorytelling or getting people
to say what it is that theyreally wanted from this product
or service.
What, perhaps, was your mostdifficult one, and how did you
go about resolving that?
James Warren (15:51):
That's a great question one.
One of the ones we've had a fewwe've had a few that were
challenging either in terms oflike the project, execution or
or what the client was trying tolearn was a very hard or
specific question.
I'll tell you one and thenmaybe another if we have time,
but one I remember is a beforewe had the web-based platform,
(16:14):
the SEEK platform, we were doingSEEK primarily in person, like
workshops.
So with COVID we started doingthose sessions online.
And then, but we had one wherewe were traveling to a client's
sites, plants, offices aroundthe country.
We were doing, I think, a totalof 10 sessions with 10 to 20
(16:34):
people each.
So you know, a very large kindof qualitative research effort,
if you will.
And we walked into one place inreally a rural part of the
country big manufacturingfacility and walked in to
conduct a seek session.
And you know we have a kind ofa facilitation approach, right,
it's a workshop.
(16:54):
So you know you want to getpeople warmed up, you want to
tell them what you're going todo, you want to walk them
through the exercises, all ofthat.
Well, we were doing theworkshop in a manufacturing
plant, right?
So that particular day we weregoing to talk to mainly
manufacturing employees and theystart streaming and at the end
of their shift.
And so the first thing I wasthinking is man, you know,
getting folks at the end oftheir shift, I wonder how that's
(17:16):
going to work, because theyprobably want to go home and I
don't know if they really wantto be here.
And one guy comes in and we hada very, at that time, very basic
version of Seek.
It was a website, but it wasvery basic.
It wasn't nowhere near asrobust as it is today and we,
you know, kind of guide peoplethrough how to use it.
(17:39):
So he comes in and sits down inthe back of the room and just
jumps on the computer and startstyping.
And so at first I was like Iwonder if he's doing other stuff
.
Then I was like, well, he's notreally engaged in the workshop.
So this is like awkward,because I'm trying to facilitate
, he's not even participating.
He's just back there justtyping away.
And I'm thinking what is hedoing?
So finally I was like, you know, he's like no, I started
writing and I was like, well,okay, but we haven't even gotten
(18:02):
to that part yet.
He's like, no, I'm good and I'mthinking, but we haven't told
him exactly what we're doing orwhy.
And he came in and he told meafterward he got up about
halfway through the workshop.
He's like all right.
Announcer (18:13):
I'm done.
James Warren (18:13):
I'm heading out and I'm thinking, wow, that's
not cool.
You know, he didn't really wantto participate.
And then I look he had sat downin an hour and written almost
2000 words.
He was on a mission.
(18:35):
He has so much he needed to saythat he wanted to get out, that
he had never been able to sayin all of his years working in
that company.
And while that was hard becausesome of the things we heard in
those stories and in otherstories are really really
difficult and painful and youhave to have a little bit of you
have to have empathy and youalso have to put on your, your
(18:57):
sort of researcher's mind so youcan analyze with empathy.
That one, that one was toughbecause it it it sort of
stressed me in a sense that Iwas like you know what are we
doing here?
But then on the flip side, thelearning was extraordinary and
in fact it changed how westarted facilitating workshops
(19:18):
after that, both because ofCOVID and because of that
person's experience.
It was so rich and deep and itreally stuck with me.
So that was one.
I've got others for sure, butthat's definitely one that was
just challenging but ultimatelyreally, really insightful and
beneficial.
Peter Woolfolk (19:31):
Well, we all know that storytelling is an
important part of publicrelations in terms of getting
people to buy in and understandwhat the product and or services
are.
And you know we're addressingyour needs.
We're addressing your needs.
How about talking briefly abouthow what might be missing in
most storytelling, that PRpeople might be missing when
(19:51):
they're trying to convince?
Others that this is what wereally do here.
James Warren (19:56):
Yeah, I think it's .
I think it's voice, voice ofemployee, voice of customer.
I think so often you know, whenwe're developing the
communications of the messagingor you're delivering it, you're
the PR person, you're thecorporate comms person.
I think so often we develop ourcommunication strategy and our
messaging from the perspectiveof this is the company's
(20:17):
positions, this is the brand,this is the story we're trying
to tell and therefore this iswhat our messaging looks like
coming out of that and all ofthat makes logical sense.
But if we haven't, in thatprocess, centered the voice of
if it's customer, if it'smarketplace driven, centered the
voice of the customer, then Iwould even question the brand
strategy in the first place.
(20:38):
Because brand strategies thatdon't really really resonate the
voice of the customer,especially if they're new or
they're a shift or it's a legacybrand that you're reinventing
it's really hard to tell thatstory in a way that says to
people this is relevant to me,this makes sense to me, you seem
to know me.
Otherwise, it comes across aslike the brand is somebody who's
(20:59):
distant, not related to me,doesn't understand and is just
talking at me.
So the voice of the customer inthe messaging, in the story or
the narrative is so huge formaking that brand come across as
authentic but also aspirational.
If the company's navigatingcrisis, to be able to say, look,
we've engaged our community andour stakeholders, and not just
(21:24):
here's what they told us, butreflecting those learnings in
the messaging, in the keytalking points, in the
storytelling, you don't evenhave to say this is what they
told us, you just say it and ithas the impact of really drawing
people in because it has thering of truth.
They say, oh, I could totallyrelate to that, because you're
actually talking to them in theway that people are talking
(21:45):
about their own experiences.
And so that's what we when ourclient is a communications
focused client or their desiredoutcome is to take these
insights of these stories andhelp them develop a better
communication strategy, a betterPR strategy.
That's what we really try tohelp them focus in on is what's
the missing part of this?
Whose story are you telling?
(22:06):
Whose story do you need to betelling and how do you tell it
in a way that really amplifiesand resonates the voices of your
target audience?
Peter Woolfolk (22:14):
that's what will shorten the distance between
them hearing and responding tothat message well, let me say
this, james I mean this has beenvery, very enlightening and I'm
sure that our listeners willfully appreciate exactly what it
is you do and how you go aboutit and maybe try to transfer
some of these techniques, if youwill, over to what it is that
(22:36):
they do as a matter of fact.
If you want to get in touchwith James as I said, he is the
CEO and founder of Share MoreStories and the founder of the
SEEQ program have been ourspecial guest today.
Any closing remarks you mighthave for the audience.
James Warren (22:53):
Well, thank you so much for this opportunity to
share some of what we've learnedwith your listeners and your
audience.
I really appreciate that and,you know, I would just say to
anybody who is listening if youwant to make a bigger impact in
your organization, in yourmarketplace, in your community,
it really does start withlistening.
Whether you're using thesetypes of tools or not,
everything we're talking aboutis really about one human
(23:15):
interacting with another humanin a much deeper, more authentic
way.
And start there.
I guarantee you'll see betterresults.
Peter Woolfolk (23:23):
Well, james.
Once again, thank you so much.
My guest today has been JamesWarren.
He is the CEO and founder ofShare More Stories and the
creator of the SEEQ program.
If you have more questions,just look James up and give him
a ring and I'm sure things willgo well.
If you've enjoyed the podcast,we'd certainly like to get a
review from you, and also don'tforget to tell your friends
(23:45):
about the Public RelationsReview Podcast.
Thank you, and we'll see you onthe next edition.
Announcer (23:52):
This podcast is produced by Communication
Strategies, an award-winningpublic relations and public
affairs firm headquartered inNashville, Tennessee.
Thank you for joining us.
Welcome.
This is the Public RelationsReview Podcast, a program to
discuss the many facets ofpublic relations with seasoned
professionals, educators,authors and others.
Now here is your host, peterWoolfolk.
Peter Woolfolk (00:25):
Welcome to the Public Relations Review Podcast
and to our listeners all acrossAmerica and around the world.
Now, apple has ranked thispodcast among the top 1% of
podcasts worldwide and recentlyFeedspot listed this podcast as
number 13 on its top 70 bestpublic relations podcasts in the
United States.
So thank you to all of ourguests and listeners for your
(00:48):
continued support and, if youenjoy the podcast, please leave
a review.
Question are today's marketresearch solutions providing the
ample data that tells businessleaders what they really need to
know?
Because a lot of the datamisses the customer's voice and
experience.
Businesses miss opportunitiesto create significant value.
(01:10):
My guest today has developed aprogram that produces rich,
actionable insights into theneeds and values of an
underserved consumer segment,identified core experience
drivers and creates campaignsthat continues to exceed
expectations.
Experienced drivers and createscampaigns that continues to
exceed expectations, drivesconversion and builds loyalty
(01:30):
through better experiences.
Now they say that if you wantto create incredible experiences
for your employees and yourcustomers, you have to better
understand them first, and thatbegins with listening.
So joining me today fromRichmond, virginia, is James
Warren.
He is the CEO and founder ofShare More Stories and the SEEQ
program.
So, james, welcome to thepodcast.
James Warren (01:53):
Thank you so much for having me, Peter.
I'm glad to be here.
Peter Woolfolk (01:56):
Well, let's begin by talking about exactly
what is Share More Stories, whatdo you do?
And then we'll get into what isyour SEEQ program more stories.
James Warren (02:11):
Sure thing.
Well, share More Stories is awe call it a human experience
insights company.
That means we do research intoemployee experience, customer
experience.
Sometimes we're doing communityvoice or stakeholder
perspectives, but really thecommonality in all of that is
our desire to really help ourclients perspectives, but really
the commonality in all of thatis our desire to really help our
clients understand not just theopinions and beliefs and
(02:31):
attitudes of the people thatthey're trying to serve, either
as employees or customers, butreally understand their
experiences and what's drivingthem, as you already said.
And so that's become a really,really big focus for us, and
what we found was our uniquemethodology of storytelling and
AI was perfectly suited for thegrowing field of employee
(02:52):
experience, customer experience,work, and so for communication
professionals, for leaders,organizational business leaders,
brand leaders, it's becoming anew tool in their research
toolkit when they really want togo a little bit deeper and
understand the why behindpeople's decisions, behavior, et
cetera.
Peter Woolfolk (03:11):
You know, the first question that comes to
mind as I listen to you talkabout this is how did you
recognize that other companieswere making mistakes, at least
in this storytelling process?
Because you know, one of thethings we said is that
storytelling maybe does notallow customers to respond, or
you get the feelings or thoughtfrom them, or what it is they're
(03:32):
actually looking for or missing.
So how do you discover thatdifference or that missing
component?
James Warren (03:39):
Yeah, great question.
I think there's two parts of it.
One is what we saw happening inthe market and you know that
was somewhat informed by our owncore experiences when we were,
as we say, on the other side ofthe table, when we were leading
brands or communicationsdepartments or large
organizations, and what we weremissing in the tools and in the
(04:00):
research that we were gettingfrom our partners.
And then the other piece iswhat's unique about our method
itself, and you referenced itbefore.
It's the SEEK platform, whichis an acronym S-E-E-Q.
It stands for Stories to Engage, explore and Question.
And so when we started thecompany, when I started the
company over 11 years ago, Ireally I've always had a deep
(04:22):
belief in the power of storiesto help people connect and learn
and also develop betterunderstanding of themselves.
And so for me, what was reallyunique in the opportunity space
was to say how are we?
In all of our hyper-attentionaldigital marketing, everybody was
going shorter, shorterattention span, shorter content,
(04:43):
shorter message.
I felt like we were starting tomiss the opportunity to connect
and engage on a deeper level.
I felt that as a consumer andas an organizational leader, and
I also could see that and hearthat in some of the company
leaders we were talking to thatthey were starting to signal,
yeah, we need to go a little bitdeeper, or we're engaging our
(05:03):
employees but it doesn't seem tobe having the desired outcome.
Or we're seeing, you know,maybe a softening of share on
our brand in the marketplace orour message just isn't getting
through, and that's because itwas such a cluttered marketplace
that messages that weren'tauthentic weren't really
engaging.
Of course they're going tostruggle to get through.
So that was kind of the bigpicture.
(05:23):
You know, driver behind startingthe company and starting the
platform.
And then what we saw morespecifically when we launched
Seek is that you know a lot ofthe current research tools.
Surveys are great foridentifying who, what, when and
where, and focus groups andother qualitative research is
really good at going deeper intothat and understanding how.
(05:44):
But none of those tools reallydo a great job of explaining why
.
And I think, as a marketer orcommunications leader or
organizational leader, if youreally want to make an impact
and make a difference in themindset and in the behaviors of
your audiences and yourconstituents, you got to
understand why they do what theydo in the first place.
(06:05):
If you don't understand why Ithink you run the risk of
shooting with your eyes closed.
Peter Woolfolk (06:11):
You know one of the things that years ago I was
in sales with Xerox.
I mean, obviously we didn't gointo the depth that you're going
in here now, but one of thethings that they said at Xerox
is, if you really want to knowwhat somebody wants, ask them
and they will actually tell you.
One of the things that theysaid at Xerox is, if you really
want to know what somebody wants, ask them and they will
(06:31):
actually tell you.
And I think that's in thebeginning where a lot of
salespeople miss it.
They're selling what theirproduct is, how nice and fuzzy
and shiny it's going to be, howmuch you're going to like it,
but they didn't take the time toask them.
This is what you really want.
So I think the carmanufacturers have done a great
deal of that and they tellpeople now that we listen to you
and that's how we designcertain things.
James Warren (06:54):
Well, you know, peter, what you're saying is so
crucial because it's like theneeds ladder right.
So many companies.
They have their product, theyunderstand a little bit about
how people use their product,but it's a natural tendency for
most of us to want to explain.
They have their product, theyunderstand a little bit about
how people use their product,but it's a natural tendency for
most of us to want to explainhow the product works, to want
to explain the features.
Some marketers and sales peoplerealize, no, I've really got to
(07:15):
sell benefits.
But, even that is still somewhatsurface level.
That's what we know, that'swhat we can sell, that's what we
can message, but what we'rereally trying to do is connect
those benefits to the needs thatthose customers and those
employees have, because that'swhen you get real alignment.
Real satisfaction is when hey,it's not just I see this product
(07:40):
has a benefit, it's, thisbenefit meets my needs.
And I think that's wheresometimes we miss going that
extra step, and I think that'sfor all of you because the tools
we've had don't do a great jobof helping us understand
people's needs.
And so I think that's whereSEEK is starting to gain some
relevance and traction, andthat's what I care about.
(08:00):
You know, as a leader, I reallywant to help people meet needs.
I don't just want to.
You know, we don't need moreproducts that don't do anything.
We need products that solveproblems.
We need things that makepeople's lives better.
We need products that solveproblems.
We need things that makepeople's lives better.
We need things that increaseimpact, and so that's the
mission to be honest with you isreally helping companies and
company leaders deliver greaterimpact, and that starts with
(08:21):
understanding those needs.
Peter Woolfolk (08:22):
Let's talk a little bit more, then, about
your SEEQ program exactly.
How does it drill down, if youwill, to find out exactly about
what the needs are, howimportant they are, and that
sort of information Give us anoverview of how that actually
works.
James Warren (08:39):
Absolutely, and I'm going to go with our
shorthand version.
We just call it SEEK.
Okay, and when I talk aboutSEEK, it really starts with
what's the question that youknow that you want to ask, like
you said, if you want to knowwhat people think, ask them.
So we talk about that as beinga prompt.
You know a storytelling promptand it's in our platform.
(08:59):
It's a web-based app that youset up, a project that's focused
on what you want to learn moreabout.
Now here's where one of thefirst big distinctions comes in
from, because most of the timedistinctions comes in from
Because most of the timeexecutives and leaders are
really focused on askingquestions that kind of validate
what they know, you know what Imean.
(09:19):
We say things and ask thingsthat are you know, even if
there's a little bit of we wantto learn something, it's very
rooted and grounded in what wewant to know more about.
What SEEK does is kind of flipthe script and say there are
people out there who, if you askthem to tell you what they're
really thinking and what they'rereally feeling, they will.
But you got to ask them and yougot to make it easy for them to
say it, and it's probably not a30 or 50 point questionnaire.
(09:42):
It's probably a way that theycan express themselves where
they feel open and free to saywhat's really on their minds.
And so that's the premisebehind doing it as a personal
story.
And so we might write a promptaround if we're working with a
travel brand, to that brand, tothat company's either hotels or
airline or destination, or itmight be more general it might
(10:03):
say tell me about your mostmemorable travel experience, and
so consumers of that brand andeven their competitors will come
into the platform and they willrespond to that prompt with a
written story.
We're adding other means likevoice and video, but you'd be
surprised at how much people'sapproach to sharing their story
shifts when they start worryingabout what they look like on
(10:25):
camera.
So we focus on the written storyand voice, because it's a lot
easier to just have them focuson their experience.
But we ask them things likewill you remember tasting or
smelling or touching or hearing?
Because the senses really helpthem recall their story and
their experience with a lot moredetail.
So after they write it, theysubmit it in the platform, they
(10:46):
might answer just a fewquestions about their experience
and then the participant's jobis done.
You know, like if we were doingthe research, then they'd be
done On the back end.
What we're doing is we turn eachof those stories into emotional
data.
So we measure 55 differentemotions, needs, values,
attitudes, all different waysthat help you paint sort of an
(11:07):
emotional map.
So now you not only are hearingwhat people are experiencing,
they're telling you why itmatters to them and we're
showing you how it makes themfeel.
And particularly for folks whoare, say, communicators, right,
this is like gold, because now Ican really tune my messaging to
the tone, to the attitude, toeven be like how do I hit this
(11:29):
emotion?
If that's the emotion I want toachieve, these folks are loving
their experience and this iswhat those emotions look like.
Well, I want to match that, Iwant to meet them where they're
at, and if these are folks whoare struggling in their
experience with our brand, well,I need to move them from where
they're at to this more positiveplace.
What does my language need tosay?
What does it need to feel like?
What does the message or theproduct experience need to
(11:51):
deliver?
So it becomes really a powerfultoolkit in the hands of a
leader or a decision maker or acommunicator, in addition to all
the other things we give our,we talk a lot about how do you
take action on this?
How do you engage this audienceor this constituent, these
employees and so forth?
And often what it really pointsback is what do you need to do
(12:13):
differently as a leader to besuccessful in engaging these
employees or these customers orthese stakeholders?
So that's how the SEEK platformworks.
In a nutshell.
We call it engage, analyze andact, because the first act of
the leader saying I want to hearyour stories and active
engagement, and then theanalysis is what happens in the
platform and then the action iswhat the leader is able to do
(12:35):
with the insights that we'vedelivered them.
Peter Woolfolk (12:38):
You know, not too long ago I spoke to another
person and they had come up witha unique way of getting
supporters, and that was turningactual customers into
supporters.
Because, you know, rather thanhiring a spokespeople or
influencers, why not get peoplewho actually use the product or
(12:58):
service?
Because, I mean, they're muchmore authentic as compared to
paying somebody to say what youwant them to say.
There's a huge difference there.
Have you considered anythingsimilar to that?
James Warren (13:09):
You know that's not necessarily our focus, but
that is definitely one of theuses that has come out of this
platform.
You know we do a lot of work intravel and tourism.
We do some in financialservices, we do some in energy
and utility.
We also do some in health andwellness, right Large industries
(13:29):
that, frankly, are prettymature and in some cases there's
a lot of opportunity to makethings better and one of those
things is, when you deliver agreat experience, how do you
help that customer or employeebecome an ambassador or a
spokesperson for the brand?
And so sometimes one of ourcustomers in travel they ask us
(13:50):
if we would ask participants fortheir permission to share their
stories.
And you know we have to kind ofwalk a fine line there because
we want participants to feellike the platform is highly
trustworthy, private, they canbe anonymous after they register
, so their data is confidential.
So we really save that questionuntil the end and we ask them
(14:14):
hey, are you willing to hearfrom so-and-so company about
your experience?
Can they contact you or wouldyou be willing to let them, to
give them permission to shareyour story in communications?
And that is usually.
That's as far as we go.
And if they say yes, then we'reable to put participants who
raise their hand in touch withthe client and we've seen some
(14:35):
of our clients turn that intoreally, really actionable
marketing and sort ofstorytelling.
One of those was Virginia's forLovers.
They did that very thing wherethey did the research over
several waves to understandcritical travel experiences
among black travelers and othertravelers who were often
underrepresented, not only inthe marketing, but even in, like
(14:58):
the travel experience and afterlearning deeply about those
experiences.
They didn't necessarily takethose exact stories, but they
revamped the whole messagingdirection for the brand, for
those audiences.
And they developed a campaignthat was focused specifically on
letting black travelers telltheir stories on the company's
(15:19):
Instagram page.
The campaign took off, blew upand won some awards, met all
their business objectives andreally increased black travel
and visitation into intoVirginia.
Peter Woolfolk (15:29):
as a result, black travel and visitation into
Virginia as a result.
You know that brings up anotherquestion, and I think about you
know, perhaps the mostdifficult problem you had, let's
say, in times of maybestorytelling or getting people
to say what it is that theyreally wanted from this product
or service.
What, perhaps, was your mostdifficult one, and how did you
go about resolving that?
James Warren (15:51):
That's a great question one.
One of the ones we've had a fewwe've had a few that were
challenging either in terms oflike the project, execution or
or what the client was trying tolearn was a very hard or
specific question.
I'll tell you one and thenmaybe another if we have time,
but one I remember is a beforewe had the web-based platform,
(16:14):
the SEEK platform, we were doingSEEK primarily in person, like
workshops.
So with COVID we started doingthose sessions online.
And then, but we had one wherewe were traveling to a client's
sites, plants, offices aroundthe country.
We were doing, I think, a totalof 10 sessions with 10 to 20
(16:34):
people each.
So you know, a very large kindof qualitative research effort,
if you will.
And we walked into one place inreally a rural part of the
country big manufacturingfacility and walked in to
conduct a seek session.
And you know we have a kind ofa facilitation approach, right,
it's a workshop.
(16:54):
So you know you want to getpeople warmed up, you want to
tell them what you're going todo, you want to walk them
through the exercises, all ofthat.
Well, we were doing theworkshop in a manufacturing
plant, right?
So that particular day we weregoing to talk to mainly
manufacturing employees and theystart streaming and at the end
of their shift.
And so the first thing I wasthinking is man, you know,
getting folks at the end oftheir shift, I wonder how that's
(17:16):
going to work, because theyprobably want to go home and I
don't know if they really wantto be here.
And one guy comes in and we hada very, at that time, very basic
version of Seek.
It was a website, but it wasvery basic.
It wasn't nowhere near asrobust as it is today and we,
you know, kind of guide peoplethrough how to use it.
(17:39):
So he comes in and sits down inthe back of the room and just
jumps on the computer and startstyping.
And so at first I was like Iwonder if he's doing other stuff
.
Then I was like, well, he's notreally engaged in the workshop.
So this is like awkward,because I'm trying to facilitate
, he's not even participating.
He's just back there justtyping away.
And I'm thinking what is hedoing?
So finally I was like, you know, he's like no, I started
writing and I was like, well,okay, but we haven't even gotten
(18:02):
to that part yet.
He's like, no, I'm good and I'mthinking, but we haven't told
him exactly what we're doing orwhy.
And he came in and he told meafterward he got up about
halfway through the workshop.
He's like all right.
Announcer (18:13):
I'm done.
James Warren (18:13):
I'm heading out and I'm thinking, wow, that's
not cool.
You know, he didn't really wantto participate.
And then I look he had sat downin an hour and written almost
2000 words.
He was on a mission.
(18:35):
He has so much he needed to saythat he wanted to get out, that
he had never been able to sayin all of his years working in
that company.
And while that was hard becausesome of the things we heard in
those stories and in otherstories are really really
difficult and painful and youhave to have a little bit of you
have to have empathy and youalso have to put on your, your
(18:57):
sort of researcher's mind so youcan analyze with empathy.
That one, that one was toughbecause it it it sort of
stressed me in a sense that Iwas like you know what are we
doing here?
But then on the flip side, thelearning was extraordinary and
in fact it changed how westarted facilitating workshops
(19:18):
after that, both because ofCOVID and because of that
person's experience.
It was so rich and deep and itreally stuck with me.
So that was one.
I've got others for sure, butthat's definitely one that was
just challenging but ultimatelyreally, really insightful and
beneficial.
Peter Woolfolk (19:31):
Well, we all know that storytelling is an
important part of publicrelations in terms of getting
people to buy in and understandwhat the product and or services
are.
And you know we're addressingyour needs.
We're addressing your needs.
How about talking briefly abouthow what might be missing in
most storytelling, that PRpeople might be missing when
(19:51):
they're trying to convince?
Others that this is what wereally do here.
James Warren (19:56):
Yeah, I think it's .
I think it's voice, voice ofemployee, voice of customer.
I think so often you know, whenwe're developing the
communications of the messagingor you're delivering it, you're
the PR person, you're thecorporate comms person.
I think so often we develop ourcommunication strategy and our
messaging from the perspectiveof this is the company's
(20:17):
positions, this is the brand,this is the story we're trying
to tell and therefore this iswhat our messaging looks like
coming out of that and all ofthat makes logical sense.
But if we haven't, in thatprocess, centered the voice of
if it's customer, if it'smarketplace driven, centered the
voice of the customer, then Iwould even question the brand
strategy in the first place.
(20:38):
Because brand strategies thatdon't really really resonate the
voice of the customer,especially if they're new or
they're a shift or it's a legacybrand that you're reinventing
it's really hard to tell thatstory in a way that says to
people this is relevant to me,this makes sense to me, you seem
to know me.
Otherwise, it comes across aslike the brand is somebody who's
(20:59):
distant, not related to me,doesn't understand and is just
talking at me.
So the voice of the customer inthe messaging, in the story or
the narrative is so huge formaking that brand come across as
authentic but also aspirational.
If the company's navigatingcrisis, to be able to say, look,
we've engaged our community andour stakeholders, and not just
(21:24):
here's what they told us, butreflecting those learnings in
the messaging, in the keytalking points, in the
storytelling, you don't evenhave to say this is what they
told us, you just say it and ithas the impact of really drawing
people in because it has thering of truth.
They say, oh, I could totallyrelate to that, because you're
actually talking to them in theway that people are talking
(21:45):
about their own experiences.
And so that's what we when ourclient is a communications
focused client or their desiredoutcome is to take these
insights of these stories andhelp them develop a better
communication strategy, a betterPR strategy.
That's what we really try tohelp them focus in on is what's
the missing part of this?
Whose story are you telling?
(22:06):
Whose story do you need to betelling and how do you tell it
in a way that really amplifiesand resonates the voices of your
target audience?
Peter Woolfolk (22:14):
that's what will shorten the distance between
them hearing and responding tothat message well, let me say
this, james I mean this has beenvery, very enlightening and I'm
sure that our listeners willfully appreciate exactly what it
is you do and how you go aboutit and maybe try to transfer
some of these techniques, if youwill, over to what it is that
(22:36):
they do as a matter of fact.
If you want to get in touchwith James as I said, he is the
CEO and founder of Share MoreStories and the founder of the
SEEQ program have been ourspecial guest today.
Any closing remarks you mighthave for the audience.
James Warren (22:53):
Well, thank you so much for this opportunity to
share some of what we've learnedwith your listeners and your
audience.
I really appreciate that and,you know, I would just say to
anybody who is listening if youwant to make a bigger impact in
your organization, in yourmarketplace, in your community,
it really does start withlistening.
Whether you're using thesetypes of tools or not,
everything we're talking aboutis really about one human
(23:15):
interacting with another humanin a much deeper, more authentic
way.
And start there.
I guarantee you'll see betterresults.
Peter Woolfolk (23:23):
Well, james.
Once again, thank you so much.
My guest today has been JamesWarren.
He is the CEO and founder ofShare More Stories and the
creator of the SEEQ program.
If you have more questions,just look James up and give him
a ring and I'm sure things willgo well.
If you've enjoyed the podcast,we'd certainly like to get a
review from you, and also don'tforget to tell your friends
(23:45):
about the Public RelationsReview Podcast.
Thank you, and we'll see you onthe next edition.
Announcer (23:52):
This podcast is produced by Communication
Strategies, an award-winningpublic relations and public
affairs firm headquartered inNashville, Tennessee.
Thank you for joining us.
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