May 19, 2025 • 31 mins
Navigating today's communications job market requires strategy, preparation, and insider knowledge. PR recruitment expert Brooke Kruger joins host Peter Woolfolk to pull back the curtain on what makes candidates stand out in a fiercely competitive landscape.
From her unique vantage point as founder and CEO of KC Partners, Kruger reveals the dramatic shift in the communications hiring landscape since 2020. What began as an unprecedented boom through mid-2022 transformed into a challenging market with more candidates competing for fewer positions. Now showing signs of recovery, Kruger offers a roadmap for professionals seeking to advance their careers despite these challenges.
The conversation explores why seemingly minor details can determine which candidate receives an offer when several qualified applicants reach final rounds. From thorough interview preparation and thoughtful follow-up to properly briefing references, Kruger highlights the critical steps many candidates overlook. She also addresses the significant return-to-office trend, with approximately 95% of current searches requiring 3-4 days of in-person work weekly.
Both host Peter Woolfolk and Kruger share how their early political campaign experiences provided exceptional training for communications careers. The pressure-cooker environment of campaigns teaches problem-solving, adaptability, and meticulous attention to detail – skills that transfer perfectly to PR roles. They discuss how continuous learning remains essential in a rapidly evolving field, particularly regarding emerging technologies like AI that complement (rather than replace) human communication expertise.
Whether you're seeking to hire top communications talent or position yourself as a standout candidate, this episode delivers actionable insights from someone who's been successfully matching the right people with the right opportunities for over 18 years. Listen, share with colleagues, and leave a review if you find these insights valuable for navigating your communications career journey.
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Episode Transcript
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Announcer (00:04):
Welcome.
This is the Public RelationsReview Podcast, a program to
discuss the many facets ofpublic relations with seasoned
professionals, educators,authors and others.
Now here is your host, peterWoolfolk.
Peter Woolfolk (00:25):
Welcome to the Public Relations Review Podcast
and to our listeners all acrossAmerica and around the world.
Now, apple has ranked thispodcast among the top 1% of
podcasts worldwide and recentlyFeedspot listed this podcast as
number 13 on its top 70 bestpublic relations podcasts in the
United States.
So thank you to all of ourguests and listeners for your
(00:48):
continued support and if youenjoy the podcast, please leave
a review.
Now question to my audience Isyour firm looking to hire top
public relations talent?
Are you a public relationsprofessional looking to move
higher?
If so, what are firms lookingfor in talent and PR
professionals, and how do yousuccessfully prepare yourself to
(01:11):
be a top-level PR candidate?
Well, my guest today hasanswers for you.
Her public relationsrecruitment firm is small by
design and their entire team hasextensive experience in the
communications industry.
Each candidate search is uniqueand their entire team has
extensive experience in thecommunications industry.
Each candidate search is uniqueand their team has two decades
(01:31):
of expertise in providing toptalent to every client.
They have a unique vantagepoint to evaluate communications
talent, having either one donethe work themselves, or two,
their close collaboration withindividuals in the roles they
are hired to fill.
Or two, their closecollaboration with individuals
in the roles they are hired tofill Now, with over 25 years of
experience in communications andexecutive recruiting, my guest
(01:51):
is a seasoned professional inthis industry.
She began her career in publicaffairs in Washington DC before
relocating to San Francisco.
Later she spent six years attop PR firms, ketchum and Byte
Communications.
She began recruiting in 2005and later founded Casey Partners
in 2009.
(02:11):
She has been placing topcommunications talent for over
18 years.
So I welcome Brooke Kruger,founder and CEO of Casey
Partners, and she joins me todayfrom San Francisco, california.
Brooke, welcome to the podcast.
Brooke Kruger (02:26):
Thank you for having me.
Peter Woolfolk (02:28):
Well, look, let's first ask what made you.
You've been in public relationsfor a long time, so how did you
decide that you would start aPR placement firm?
Brooke Kruger (02:37):
That's a great question.
So I began my career out ofcollege in DC.
I worked on campaigns and inpublic affairs and I moved to
San Francisco and joined a PRagency Ketchum, and then Byte
and there were certain aspectsof PR that I loved client
services, new business, gettingresults but I always felt like
(02:59):
there was something missing andI would look in my background
and what I would layer up to andI would look at my boss's jobs
and think this is not for me.
But I still wanted to be a partof the industry and use my
skill set well and so I kind offell into recruiting in 2005 and
(03:19):
really found my calling ofplacing PR candidates within
companies and I started my ownbusiness in 2009, which is KT
Partners, and we focusexclusively on communication
search.
We place PR and communicationscandidates with agencies,
corporations, startups and VCpartners.
Peter Woolfolk (03:37):
Well, let me say this I'm from Washington DC and
I worked on Capitol Hill.
So when you say public affairs-in.
Washington that means workingfor the government.
So you know, particularly ifyou work on Capitol Hill and I
worked on Congress I mean youwork hard, you learn a lot and
you don't have time to makemistakes.
Or if you do make them, youovercome them very quickly and
(03:59):
you just learn so much more in avery, very short period of time
.
So I certainly salute you ashaving had Washington DC as a
training ground for publicrelations absolutely so now, how
have you go about identifyingclients and how do they find you
?
how does the first of all, howdo you go about a identify?
How have clients found you tosay look, here are some of the
(04:21):
people we'd like to get onto ourstaff?
Brooke Kruger (04:24):
so I I've been doing the same thing for 20
years, which is findingcommunications candidates and
placing them within companiesand really finding a perfect
match for people.
Because I worked in theindustry before and I know the
jobs that I'm hiring for.
Having worked in them or workedwith their bosses or people
managed me, I have a prettystrong network and so I mean I
(04:47):
would say you know, my networkis actually everything.
So a lot of my business comesto me from repeat customers and
through referrals.
So companies come to me and,given my industry expertise and,
having worked and been doingthis for so long, they know that
I can quickly find them theright candidate for their role.
I'm also really able toevaluate, you know, what my
(05:11):
clients are looking for and thenreally connect with candidates
to make sure this is the type ofjob they want to do and they're
doing the work that trulymotivates them.
Peter Woolfolk (05:19):
Well, let's talk about the range of jobs that
you try to fill.
I mean, what are the rangesthere?
Are they starting positions forsomeone maybe right out of
college, or do you have senioropenings where you know?
Let's say, if we're inWashington, you might be the
media public affairs officer formaybe one of these Senate
committees or House committeesup there?
(05:40):
What ranges of jobs do you filland do you have a request for?
Brooke Kruger (05:46):
Another good question.
Well, I've filled all levels ofcomms positions.
My focus is really the seniorposition, so the head of comms,
the CCO, the VP of commspositions.
My focus is really the seniorposition, so the head of comms,
the CCO, the VP of comms,someone who's leading the
communications function or afunction within the
communications org, whether it'sa director of corporate
communications, a director ofemployee comms, product
communications and then we alsodo fill the positions that
(06:09):
support those roles.
Most of our positions landbetween 15 plus years experience
, but we also fill, you know,positions with five plus years
of experience, as they would besupporting those senior comp
leaders.
Peter Woolfolk (06:22):
Now, when the search begins at some point,
you've gotten your marchingorder, so to speak.
Here's the person.
We want you to sign thecontract or whatever, From that
point until the time you showsomebody is hired that you
presented.
How much time goes between thestarting point and the ending
point, if you will?
Brooke Kruger (06:40):
At Casey Partners we like to quickly find our
candidates, quickly find ourclients, the right candidate,
and so when we start a search,we usually send candidates
within one to three days.
And we are able to do that,having worked on so many
different searches and havingsuch a strong network that we
can quickly understand what'sgoing to be the right fit.
Now, once we have candidates inplay, you know it can usually
(07:03):
take between six to eight weeksto close the job.
There are certain marketconditions and things that make
a search take longer, but welike to fill jobs between so how
have you been able to identifycandidates that you might want
to present?
Peter Woolfolk (07:18):
How do you create your pool of candidates
that you have in waiting, so tospeak?
Brooke Kruger (07:23):
At Casey Partners , we're constantly talking to
candidates and trying tounderstand what motivates them,
what they're looking for, whatkind of work is going to bring
them joy, how many people theymanage, what kind of
organization do they thrive in,what size company.
So we're constantly talking tonew candidates and really trying
to understand.
You know what makes them tick.
(07:43):
So then, when we get a search,we always have initial
candidates in mind and we havesimilar searches that we worked
on.
So I never, ever, feel likewhen I get a search I'm starting
from ground zero.
There's always other searches Ican recall and candidates I've
worked with in the past to begina search from.
Peter Woolfolk (08:02):
Now you're located in San Francisco.
How about the clients you serve?
Are they around San Franciscoand beyond?
What's the geographic locationthere?
How is that set up?
Brooke Kruger (08:12):
So I've been based in the San Francisco Bay
Area for 20 plus years and we doa lot of searches within tech.
So many of our searches arelocal to the Bay Area but we
work across the country.
We also have a lot of searchesin New York and LA as well and
other markets.
Obviously, during the pandemic,remote was very, very popular
(08:33):
and candidates were being placedall over.
I will say in the last one totwo years the return to office
is real.
Almost all of our new searchesI would say 95% of them, require
three to four days in theoffice.
Right now, remote is now notthere.
Still are remote searches, butit is not the norm right now.
Most searches do require returnto office, but that could be in
(08:55):
the San Francisco Bay Area, newYork, la, chicago, other
markets as well.
Peter Woolfolk (09:00):
You mentioned the return to office.
What is the major reason thatyou are seeing that companies
are asking people to spend mostof their time in the office,
compared to working remotely?
Brooke Kruger (09:10):
I think that before the pandemic most
employees were in the office,five to working remotely.
I think that before thepandemic most employees were in
the office five days a week.
I think working from home oneday a week was a rarity and the
pandemic changed everything andeveryone was working from home
and it works for some companies.
I work from home every day, soI get it.
But other companies arerealizing that in-person time is
(09:30):
valuable for collaboration andtraining and, you know, with
junior candidates.
I was talking to someone lastnight at a communications event
in San Francisco about how justcritical it is for the junior
people to be in the office andbe learning from others and
learning by osmosis and hearinghow people are doing calls and
reacting, and so I don't thinkcompanies need to go back to
(09:51):
five days a week.
And so I don't think companiesneed to go back to five days a
week.
I'm not saying that at all, butI think most companies feel a
few days in the office is goingto be valuable for their team.
Peter Woolfolk (10:00):
Let me ask you now how are you helping
potential candidates?
What are you seeing from yourviewpoint?
What are some of theshortcomings of some of the
candidates you might be lookingat and what do they need to
improve?
What are some of the majorareas you think that perhaps
some candidates need to improvein before they could make a
solid presentation for a new job?
Brooke Kruger (10:22):
So we are in a very, very tight job market for
the communications industry.
From fall 2020 to May 2022, thecommunications industry boomed.
Every company was hiring, theywere growing huge teams and
there was a lot of opportunityout there.
And then, in maybe the summerof 2022, especially in the tech
(10:42):
industry layoffs started.
They just didn't stop.
Teams were cut, people weretold to do more with less and
there were not as many positionsavailable to be hired for, and
then people weren't leavingtheir jobs if they weren't laid
off.
So there was just inflectionpoint in the industry where
nothing was really moving, andso what happened was more and
more people lost their jobs andthere was a bigger candidate
(11:04):
pool competing for a smalleramount of jobs.
So what I have seen I saw stopsand starts in 2023, and then in
2024, it's really beenconsistent since, I would say,
fall 2024.
And so there still are morejobs out there.
Again, the challenge is there'sa lot of people looking for
jobs, so it's a very competitivemarket, and so what candidates
(11:27):
need to do is really prepare forthe interviews and I know
everybody will say they preparefor an interview.
But I always want to advisecandidates if you're
interviewing for a company, youobviously need to.
Everyone knows go, put yourbest foot forward, go in there.
Understand why you areinterested in the job.
What qualifies you for the job?
Something as simple.
(11:47):
A lot of people read a job spec,apply for a job and then they
probably don't ever look at thejob spec again.
You really need to be lookingat the job spec and matching
your experience and haveexamples of everything they're
asking for.
And I'm finding the people whoare getting the job today are
usually in a final round withtwo to three really highly
qualified candidates.
(12:08):
Sometimes industry expertise iswinning out, sometimes it's
something you can't control, butwhat candidates need to do is
always put their best footforward, be available, be
flexible, be responsive and justreally.
You know everybody does want ajob in this market and they are
trying to do everyone's tryingto do their best that they can.
(12:31):
And you know there's obviouslyother factors when you're
interviewing and you know peopleare in jobs.
But I've seen people lose outon jobs for minor mistakes that
could have been prevented.
Peter Woolfolk (12:41):
And when you say a minor mistake, give some
examples of what were consideredminor mistakes.
Brooke Kruger (12:46):
I knew you were going to say that.
So I think employers want tosee genuine interest and
enthusiasm on why you want thejob, and that can be shown
through interview prep.
So a minor mistake would be orlet's not say minor, just a
mistake would be not fullypreparing for the job.
(13:07):
And now a trend in jobprocesses there's four or five
rounds of interviews, mm-hmm.
I truly believe in a thank younote.
(13:35):
A thank you note does not needto be a novel, but if you meet
with someone for an interview,send them a follow-up and thank
them for their time.
That is again another way toshow interest.
If you are working with arecruiter, you'll follow up
after each interview.
I always say this, but don'tmake people track you down.
My clients will come to me andbe like, okay, we have these
four people, how's everyonefeeling about it?
(13:56):
And if I have a candidate who'snot even responding to me, I
don't know how they're feelingabout it.
So it's a lot of process andthought, but you want to truly
show interest and enthusiasm inthe position.
The other thing I think aboutthat's happening right now is
references are really importantand you need to prep your
(14:16):
references, and that meanstelling your references why
you're interested in the job andwhy you think they'll be a good
fit.
I had a couple of positions inthe last year or so where
references decided on the offerand it wasn't that the person
got a bad reference, just thereference, wasn't fully aware
why they even wanted the job andthat didn't.
(14:38):
That didn't read very wellmm-hmm.
Peter Woolfolk (14:40):
Well, I have been in public race a very, very
long time and one of the thingsthat really helped me was
learning as much as I can aboutpublic relations and things
associated with it.
You know, give you an example Iwas encouraged at one time to
consider doing some radio work,simply because of my voice.
It never came to my attention,so I decided well, what the hell
(15:03):
, let's give it a go.
What I learned more so was notonly being able to handle a
radio station, but also how toproduce on radio, how to edit in
radio and those kinds of things.
I like that.
That led to another thing.
As a matter of fact, it was Ialso ran across an opportunity
in one of my jobs to learn howto uplink and downlink satellite
(15:24):
programs.
So you know, I've got all thesekinds of qualifications and
television, I believe it or not.
I went to the guy who firstmeeting I ever had, like this
was the guy who found it Ididn't know much about it at the
time because it was so long agowho founded Black Entertainment
Television.
Well, he was at a.
We spoke at an event.
(15:45):
I said well, let me come andtalk to you.
I'm talking to him aboutmarketing things.
Brooke Kruger (15:49):
He said well, that's good for you but what I'm
looking for is somebody toproduce the show.
So I said, can I get back toyou?
I mean, I think you make areally good point because we're
talking a lot about getting jobs, but another thread is like how
to keep a job in this market.
You know, we are in a new era.
It's been described as this bigboss era, where there's not
(16:11):
huge culture and people are.
You know there's high demands,and so I always say, like figure
out how to do your job and thejobs around you.
Be available, be flexible, beadaptable.
Sounds like that's what youwere doing.
They I was just saying theywere asking you to do one job
and they said what aboutproducing?
And you figured out how to makethat work.
Peter Woolfolk (16:27):
You know that's a really.
I'm really happy to hear yousay that, because that's that's
the thing of it.
You know, I learned as much asI could about as many things as
I could, because Because one ofthe things that you know having
learned how to produce a TV showand downlink satellite and all
those kinds of things and radiothat when I got on Capitol Hill
I was problem solving Onecongresswoman you know her
(16:50):
normal would set up with a radiostation in Texas, I think,
let's say nine o'clock everyMonday for instance, whatever it
was.
But anyway, when you have acommittee meeting you've got to
go.
So I called the producer aheadof time and said look, can we
just record the show the way wenormally would, maybe Sunday or
whatever else, or Fridayafternoon, and then you'll have
it Monday.
And he said fine, that's great,we'll do it that way.
(17:13):
I had another member of Congresswho was down in Brazil and I
had called for some sort of aclimate control, whatever it
happened to be.
So I called he was from NewYork.
So I called the three big newsstations in New York and asked
him would you be interested intalking to the congressman
directly from Brazil?
They said oh, absolutely.
And I said oh, by the way,we'll pay the bill.
(17:35):
And all of them said absolutely.
So I got him through on threemajor radio stations.
And how we did that, doingthose kinds of things when I was
in the administration.
I was at the Department ofEducation and the assistant
secretary was due to make apresentation somewhere out in
Wisconsin.
Well, the snowstorm preventedflying.
(17:57):
So you know, I knew of asatellite set up at the Labor
Department two blocks away madethat happen.
So you know, we trudged throughthe snow Saturday night and,
boom, got it done.
So it's about solving problemsfor people as well.
You know, doing a job is, yes,but it's problem solved.
Brooke Kruger (18:14):
Absolutely, and I think people always ask like
what are the number?
You know one skills thatcommunicators need today, and I
think number one is being a goodstoryteller, but number two is
being a problem solver.
You have to be able to thinktwo steps ahead, and when your
clients and executives andstakeholders are asking you for
something, it's like what arethey asking for, why, and then
(18:35):
what could happen?
You know, you just always wantto be scenario planning in your
head and the world moves so fastright now.
You really do need to think twosteps ahead.
Peter Woolfolk (18:48):
Well, the other thing that came out of this is
that I started in the Clintoncampaign as handling
communications for him, as acommunications man in the state
of Delaware.
Well, now I'm dealing with thegovernor, I'm dealing with
lieutenant governors and mayorsand so forth and so on.
So these people want thingsdone.
How can we do this?
How can we handle things?
And then, when the vicepresident and first lady came up
, there's detail, working withthe Secret Service and the
(19:09):
communications team.
They want to know every detail,all sorts of things.
So, being prepared, secretService want to know what door
you're coming in, who's sittingwhere, all that sort of stuff.
So you get comfortable nowgetting as many details as you
can to answer all sorts ofproblems.
The other thing I found out is,when you put in the other
(19:30):
project, make sure any andeverybody associated with that
project is at the table at thesame time, because I've seen the
wheels come off.
Okay, we'll find here.
All right, you hand out to joeand tell him this is his part.
Brooke Kruger (19:42):
Well, no for sure .
It's interesting you say thatabout the um, your clinton
campaign work, because I startedmy career working on a
presidential campaign as wellfor senator dole, so we were
probably on opposite sides atthe time on um, I was an intern
in 96.
And it's like the camp I lookback.
That campaign experience is socritical.
(20:03):
You're right in problem solvingin details, in being prepared,
and it's obviously a differentera now.
Peter Woolfolk (20:13):
But I'm grateful for that experience and all
that I learned on the Dole Camp.
Well, you know, and we were,because I mean, that's exactly
what I said, you've got to solveproblems, you because I'm, as a
matter of fact, I think we werein a radio station.
I was in there with thelieutenant governor and
something was.
They were talking about somesomething.
I forget what the details were,but I had to go look that up
right quick so I could slip herthe answer on the sheet of paper
well, but but do you evenremember how we had to look?
Announcer (20:37):
stuff up.
All right On the 96 campaign.
Brooke Kruger (20:39):
we didn't have emails, we couldn't find our
news online.
I remember somebody's job wasto go to the newspaper stands in
the morning at like 4 in themorning and get all the papers
and cut the clip.
Peter Woolfolk (20:53):
You know, here's what's interesting about this
is that I believe personally andas I listen to you, that having
worked in a presidentialcampaign is one of the best
experiences that I had inpreparing me for communications
work.
There's no question about itDetailed deal with senior
officials, getting it done,getting it done right, all you
(21:14):
know.
Don't be bashful about askingpeople for help, whatever that
happens to be.
So I wound up actually doingone of my podcast episodes on
that.
So I reached out to people fromdifferent campaigns and I had.
What did I have?
It was one lady who worked forNewt Gingrich when he ran
president and a fellow down inTexas I forget Ross Perot, I
(21:36):
think it was.
So we had them all on that,talking about the experiences we
had.
How do we get over hurdles?
How do you solve these problems?
All these other kinds of thingsworking with the local police
when they travel, working withthe Secret Service, all of those
kinds of things and that woundup being one of the various
highest rated episodes that I'vehad in six years.
Brooke Kruger (21:59):
Oh, I'm going to listen to that.
Yeah, I'm going to listen tothat.
I mean, I was still in collegewhen I'm from Kansas City and my
aunt lived in DC and she hadsuggested I apply to work for
Senator Dole in the MajorityLeader's Office and I ended up
going to work on the campaignand I just loved it.
But if I think back on myoperating model and how I think
(22:20):
like that was such a formativeexperience and I'm so grateful
that I got to do that,especially at such a young age.
We had to work with such agreat man, senator Dole, who, no
matter what side of the aisleyou're on, he is just a class
act.
Peter Woolfolk (22:32):
Well, and let me say this you know back then I
can say that when I worked forthe chairman of the House
Education and Labor Committee,one of his closest friends was a
Republican guy who was on thecommittee as well, and they
traveled together because youknow members of Congress, they
go around the country.
Brooke Kruger (22:51):
It's very different.
It's a very different climatenow, and I don't we don't want
to talk politics now, right, butbut but it's a very different.
It was very different.
That's all I'll say.
I'm grateful for my experienceand what I learned on the
campaign and I can't wait to goback and listen to that episode.
Peter Woolfolk (23:06):
Well, you know and that's exactly what I tell
people, Having worked in apolitical campaign, you will
learn a lot more in thatcampaign, for whatever number of
months you do, perhaps than youmight get in graduate school,
because it is so intense.
You're working with so manydifferent people.
You know I'm working with thegovernment, all those kind of
folks, and you've got to learndetails because the Secret
(23:27):
Service has a lot of questionsto ask.
They want a lot of information.
So you bring that proclivityfor having details that you
bring into whatever job you haveso you can ask as many
questions as you need to to makesure the job is run right.
Everybody is on the same page,all those other kinds of things.
So the political experience ishugely important.
It was in mine as obviously inyour growth and development.
Brooke Kruger (23:51):
Yes, absolutely absolutely.
Peter Woolfolk (23:54):
Well, let me ask you, Brooke, have we missed
anything?
Because you know I've listenedto that you do a lot of things
for a lot of people, both forthose looking to be hired and
looking, and the company islooking to hire Is know we are
small by design, as youmentioned, and the recruiters
(24:19):
that work at KC Partners.
Brooke Kruger (24:21):
They've all worked in the communications
industry, like myself, so Ithink we are able to quickly
assess what our clients wantagain, but also understand what
candidates want too.
And I think in a down market,it's just as important to figure
out what you want and you wantto do in this market and what
you're good at doing, becauseyou really want to find the
(24:42):
right match.
And you know, my greatest joyis when I place someone in a job
and they're happy and it's agood match and the client's
happy and the candidate's happyLike nothing feels better than
that.
And I think it's so importantfor people to kind of take a
step back and understand what isthe work that they enjoy, what
gives them, what motivates them.
(25:02):
And if I look at myself, like Ilove getting results in working
with candidates and workingwith clients, that's what in the
workforce makes me kick andthrive, and so I feel like I'm
so lucky that I truly found mycalling and I get to run a
business doing what I love everyday.
Peter Woolfolk (25:19):
You know, I think that's very, very
important.
The other thing that I thinkthat we probably touched on a
little bit was learning as muchas you can about the
organizations you're going towork for, and whatever the job
is or project is.
Learn as much as you can fromas many people as you can,
because somewhere along the linethat information is going to
come in handy it truly does andjust what I like.
Brooke Kruger (25:40):
When I take on a new search I really try to go
deep with my client andunderstand the organization, the
culture.
What kind of person is actuallygoing to be successful there?
because, not all people aregoing to be successful in every
company, and that is okay.
You may find that you can'twork at a small startup, or a
big company is too much for you.
I found that I worked at a PRagency and it wasn't for me, and
(26:01):
so I really do want to try tohelp people find the right fit
for them, and immersing in thatcompany and understanding what
makes the company tick is alsoimportant.
Peter Woolfolk (26:09):
Well, I think you know you probably answered
my last question.
That was that if you wanted tosay anything to any potential
candidates and I think you- mayhave hit that nail right on the
head already.
Brooke Kruger (26:21):
Oh, yes, for sure .
Yeah, I mean, it is a toughmarket, it is a tricky market,
but what I would tell candidatesis it is getting better.
If you look on LinkedIn everyMonday, more and more people are
getting jobs, more and morepeople are leaving jobs, which
means that jobs are going to beopen and companies are adding
headcount.
The communications hiringmarket is getting better, but it
(26:44):
is still critical to put yourbest foot forward.
Peter Woolfolk (26:46):
Well, not only that.
I mean keep learning as much asyou can, because it's also
moving very fast, particularlywith artificial intelligence and
all the other platforms thatare out there that you need to
get a handle on that, even ifit's just a basic handle, to
understand how it can work andthe benefits that it brings to
your particular job, and theshortcomings that it might have
as well.
Brooke Kruger (27:07):
Exactly.
I mean, we didn't even touch onAI, but understanding AI is
critical, and understanding howyou use the tools that are going
to help you improve your job iscritical.
And there are certain thingsthat AI won't replace, and I
think human connection andreally kind of trying to
understand what motivates peopleand makes people pick.
But there are AI tools thatwill help people improve their
(27:30):
job as well.
Peter Woolfolk (27:31):
Yeah, and I think people need to understand
that.
You know AI is there to helpyou, so you need to get your
hands around how it works andhow you can use it in real
particular, Absolutely.
I use it quite a bit in theproduction of this podcast.
I mean, it's me talking.
It's going to do the transcriptfor this once I'm done.
Those kinds of things that savetime, so forth and so on.
(27:54):
So I would always say to anyperson learn as much as you can
about any job you're going to gointo.
It really, really does help.
Brooke Kruger (28:02):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Well, it was so great to chatwith you.
Peter Woolfolk (28:05):
Well, brooke, let me say thank you so very,
very much, and let me just sayto my guests that you've been
listening to Brooke Kruger.
She is the founder and CEO ofKC Partners out of San Francisco
, california, and I want tosuggest that you share this
information with some of yourcolleagues about this particular
episode and also listen to thenext edition of the Public
(28:26):
Relations Review, and perhaps wesure would appreciate a review
from you.
So don't forget to listen tothe next edition of the Public
Relations Review podcast.
Thanks again.
Announcer (28:36):
This podcast is produced by Communication
Strategies, an award-winningpublic relations and public
affairs firm headquartered inNashville, Tennessee.
Thank you for joining us.
Welcome.
This is the Public RelationsReview Podcast, a program to
discuss the many facets ofpublic relations with seasoned
professionals, educators,authors and others.
Now here is your host, peterWoolfolk.
Peter Woolfolk (00:25):
Welcome to the Public Relations Review Podcast
and to our listeners all acrossAmerica and around the world.
Now, apple has ranked thispodcast among the top 1% of
podcasts worldwide and recentlyFeedspot listed this podcast as
number 13 on its top 70 bestpublic relations podcasts in the
United States.
So thank you to all of ourguests and listeners for your
(00:48):
continued support and if youenjoy the podcast, please leave
a review.
Now question to my audience Isyour firm looking to hire top
public relations talent?
Are you a public relationsprofessional looking to move
higher?
If so, what are firms lookingfor in talent and PR
professionals, and how do yousuccessfully prepare yourself to
(01:11):
be a top-level PR candidate?
Well, my guest today hasanswers for you.
Her public relationsrecruitment firm is small by
design and their entire team hasextensive experience in the
communications industry.
Each candidate search is uniqueand their entire team has
extensive experience in thecommunications industry.
Each candidate search is uniqueand their team has two decades
(01:31):
of expertise in providing toptalent to every client.
They have a unique vantagepoint to evaluate communications
talent, having either one donethe work themselves, or two,
their close collaboration withindividuals in the roles they
are hired to fill.
Or two, their closecollaboration with individuals
in the roles they are hired tofill Now, with over 25 years of
experience in communications andexecutive recruiting, my guest
(01:51):
is a seasoned professional inthis industry.
She began her career in publicaffairs in Washington DC before
relocating to San Francisco.
Later she spent six years attop PR firms, ketchum and Byte
Communications.
She began recruiting in 2005and later founded Casey Partners
in 2009.
(02:11):
She has been placing topcommunications talent for over
18 years.
So I welcome Brooke Kruger,founder and CEO of Casey
Partners, and she joins me todayfrom San Francisco, california.
Brooke, welcome to the podcast.
Brooke Kruger (02:26):
Thank you for having me.
Peter Woolfolk (02:28):
Well, look, let's first ask what made you.
You've been in public relationsfor a long time, so how did you
decide that you would start aPR placement firm?
Brooke Kruger (02:37):
That's a great question.
So I began my career out ofcollege in DC.
I worked on campaigns and inpublic affairs and I moved to
San Francisco and joined a PRagency Ketchum, and then Byte
and there were certain aspectsof PR that I loved client
services, new business, gettingresults but I always felt like
(02:59):
there was something missing andI would look in my background
and what I would layer up to andI would look at my boss's jobs
and think this is not for me.
But I still wanted to be a partof the industry and use my
skill set well and so I kind offell into recruiting in 2005 and
(03:19):
really found my calling ofplacing PR candidates within
companies and I started my ownbusiness in 2009, which is KT
Partners, and we focusexclusively on communication
search.
We place PR and communicationscandidates with agencies,
corporations, startups and VCpartners.
Peter Woolfolk (03:37):
Well, let me say this I'm from Washington DC and
I worked on Capitol Hill.
So when you say public affairs-in.
Washington that means workingfor the government.
So you know, particularly ifyou work on Capitol Hill and I
worked on Congress I mean youwork hard, you learn a lot and
you don't have time to makemistakes.
Or if you do make them, youovercome them very quickly and
(03:59):
you just learn so much more in avery, very short period of time
.
So I certainly salute you ashaving had Washington DC as a
training ground for publicrelations absolutely so now, how
have you go about identifyingclients and how do they find you
?
how does the first of all, howdo you go about a identify?
How have clients found you tosay look, here are some of the
(04:21):
people we'd like to get onto ourstaff?
Brooke Kruger (04:24):
so I I've been doing the same thing for 20
years, which is findingcommunications candidates and
placing them within companiesand really finding a perfect
match for people.
Because I worked in theindustry before and I know the
jobs that I'm hiring for.
Having worked in them or workedwith their bosses or people
managed me, I have a prettystrong network and so I mean I
(04:47):
would say you know, my networkis actually everything.
So a lot of my business comesto me from repeat customers and
through referrals.
So companies come to me and,given my industry expertise and,
having worked and been doingthis for so long, they know that
I can quickly find them theright candidate for their role.
I'm also really able toevaluate, you know, what my
(05:11):
clients are looking for and thenreally connect with candidates
to make sure this is the type ofjob they want to do and they're
doing the work that trulymotivates them.
Peter Woolfolk (05:19):
Well, let's talk about the range of jobs that
you try to fill.
I mean, what are the rangesthere?
Are they starting positions forsomeone maybe right out of
college, or do you have senioropenings where you know?
Let's say, if we're inWashington, you might be the
media public affairs officer formaybe one of these Senate
committees or House committeesup there?
(05:40):
What ranges of jobs do you filland do you have a request for?
Brooke Kruger (05:46):
Another good question.
Well, I've filled all levels ofcomms positions.
My focus is really the seniorposition, so the head of comms,
the CCO, the VP of commspositions.
My focus is really the seniorposition, so the head of comms,
the CCO, the VP of comms,someone who's leading the
communications function or afunction within the
communications org, whether it'sa director of corporate
communications, a director ofemployee comms, product
communications and then we alsodo fill the positions that
(06:09):
support those roles.
Most of our positions landbetween 15 plus years experience
, but we also fill, you know,positions with five plus years
of experience, as they would besupporting those senior comp
leaders.
Peter Woolfolk (06:22):
Now, when the search begins at some point,
you've gotten your marchingorder, so to speak.
Here's the person.
We want you to sign thecontract or whatever, From that
point until the time you showsomebody is hired that you
presented.
How much time goes between thestarting point and the ending
point, if you will?
Brooke Kruger (06:40):
At Casey Partners we like to quickly find our
candidates, quickly find ourclients, the right candidate,
and so when we start a search,we usually send candidates
within one to three days.
And we are able to do that,having worked on so many
different searches and havingsuch a strong network that we
can quickly understand what'sgoing to be the right fit.
Now, once we have candidates inplay, you know it can usually
(07:03):
take between six to eight weeksto close the job.
There are certain marketconditions and things that make
a search take longer, but welike to fill jobs between so how
have you been able to identifycandidates that you might want
to present?
Peter Woolfolk (07:18):
How do you create your pool of candidates
that you have in waiting, so tospeak?
Brooke Kruger (07:23):
At Casey Partners , we're constantly talking to
candidates and trying tounderstand what motivates them,
what they're looking for, whatkind of work is going to bring
them joy, how many people theymanage, what kind of
organization do they thrive in,what size company.
So we're constantly talking tonew candidates and really trying
to understand.
You know what makes them tick.
(07:43):
So then, when we get a search,we always have initial
candidates in mind and we havesimilar searches that we worked
on.
So I never, ever, feel likewhen I get a search I'm starting
from ground zero.
There's always other searches Ican recall and candidates I've
worked with in the past to begina search from.
Peter Woolfolk (08:02):
Now you're located in San Francisco.
How about the clients you serve?
Are they around San Franciscoand beyond?
What's the geographic locationthere?
How is that set up?
Brooke Kruger (08:12):
So I've been based in the San Francisco Bay
Area for 20 plus years and we doa lot of searches within tech.
So many of our searches arelocal to the Bay Area but we
work across the country.
We also have a lot of searchesin New York and LA as well and
other markets.
Obviously, during the pandemic,remote was very, very popular
(08:33):
and candidates were being placedall over.
I will say in the last one totwo years the return to office
is real.
Almost all of our new searchesI would say 95% of them, require
three to four days in theoffice.
Right now, remote is now notthere.
Still are remote searches, butit is not the norm right now.
Most searches do require returnto office, but that could be in
(08:55):
the San Francisco Bay Area, newYork, la, chicago, other
markets as well.
Peter Woolfolk (09:00):
You mentioned the return to office.
What is the major reason thatyou are seeing that companies
are asking people to spend mostof their time in the office,
compared to working remotely?
Brooke Kruger (09:10):
I think that before the pandemic most
employees were in the office,five to working remotely.
I think that before thepandemic most employees were in
the office five days a week.
I think working from home oneday a week was a rarity and the
pandemic changed everything andeveryone was working from home
and it works for some companies.
I work from home every day, soI get it.
But other companies arerealizing that in-person time is
(09:30):
valuable for collaboration andtraining and, you know, with
junior candidates.
I was talking to someone lastnight at a communications event
in San Francisco about how justcritical it is for the junior
people to be in the office andbe learning from others and
learning by osmosis and hearinghow people are doing calls and
reacting, and so I don't thinkcompanies need to go back to
(09:51):
five days a week.
And so I don't think companiesneed to go back to five days a
week.
I'm not saying that at all, butI think most companies feel a
few days in the office is goingto be valuable for their team.
Peter Woolfolk (10:00):
Let me ask you now how are you helping
potential candidates?
What are you seeing from yourviewpoint?
What are some of theshortcomings of some of the
candidates you might be lookingat and what do they need to
improve?
What are some of the majorareas you think that perhaps
some candidates need to improvein before they could make a
solid presentation for a new job?
Brooke Kruger (10:22):
So we are in a very, very tight job market for
the communications industry.
From fall 2020 to May 2022, thecommunications industry boomed.
Every company was hiring, theywere growing huge teams and
there was a lot of opportunityout there.
And then, in maybe the summerof 2022, especially in the tech
(10:42):
industry layoffs started.
They just didn't stop.
Teams were cut, people weretold to do more with less and
there were not as many positionsavailable to be hired for, and
then people weren't leavingtheir jobs if they weren't laid
off.
So there was just inflectionpoint in the industry where
nothing was really moving, andso what happened was more and
more people lost their jobs andthere was a bigger candidate
(11:04):
pool competing for a smalleramount of jobs.
So what I have seen I saw stopsand starts in 2023, and then in
2024, it's really beenconsistent since, I would say,
fall 2024.
And so there still are morejobs out there.
Again, the challenge is there'sa lot of people looking for
jobs, so it's a very competitivemarket, and so what candidates
(11:27):
need to do is really prepare forthe interviews and I know
everybody will say they preparefor an interview.
But I always want to advisecandidates if you're
interviewing for a company, youobviously need to.
Everyone knows go, put yourbest foot forward, go in there.
Understand why you areinterested in the job.
What qualifies you for the job?
Something as simple.
(11:47):
A lot of people read a job spec,apply for a job and then they
probably don't ever look at thejob spec again.
You really need to be lookingat the job spec and matching
your experience and haveexamples of everything they're
asking for.
And I'm finding the people whoare getting the job today are
usually in a final round withtwo to three really highly
qualified candidates.
(12:08):
Sometimes industry expertise iswinning out, sometimes it's
something you can't control, butwhat candidates need to do is
always put their best footforward, be available, be
flexible, be responsive and justreally.
You know everybody does want ajob in this market and they are
trying to do everyone's tryingto do their best that they can.
(12:31):
And you know there's obviouslyother factors when you're
interviewing and you know peopleare in jobs.
But I've seen people lose outon jobs for minor mistakes that
could have been prevented.
Peter Woolfolk (12:41):
And when you say a minor mistake, give some
examples of what were consideredminor mistakes.
Brooke Kruger (12:46):
I knew you were going to say that.
So I think employers want tosee genuine interest and
enthusiasm on why you want thejob, and that can be shown
through interview prep.
So a minor mistake would be orlet's not say minor, just a
mistake would be not fullypreparing for the job.
(13:07):
And now a trend in jobprocesses there's four or five
rounds of interviews, mm-hmm.
I truly believe in a thank younote.
(13:35):
A thank you note does not needto be a novel, but if you meet
with someone for an interview,send them a follow-up and thank
them for their time.
That is again another way toshow interest.
If you are working with arecruiter, you'll follow up
after each interview.
I always say this, but don'tmake people track you down.
My clients will come to me andbe like, okay, we have these
four people, how's everyonefeeling about it?
(13:56):
And if I have a candidate who'snot even responding to me, I
don't know how they're feelingabout it.
So it's a lot of process andthought, but you want to truly
show interest and enthusiasm inthe position.
The other thing I think aboutthat's happening right now is
references are really importantand you need to prep your
(14:16):
references, and that meanstelling your references why
you're interested in the job andwhy you think they'll be a good
fit.
I had a couple of positions inthe last year or so where
references decided on the offerand it wasn't that the person
got a bad reference, just thereference, wasn't fully aware
why they even wanted the job andthat didn't.
(14:38):
That didn't read very wellmm-hmm.
Peter Woolfolk (14:40):
Well, I have been in public race a very, very
long time and one of the thingsthat really helped me was
learning as much as I can aboutpublic relations and things
associated with it.
You know, give you an example Iwas encouraged at one time to
consider doing some radio work,simply because of my voice.
It never came to my attention,so I decided well, what the hell
(15:03):
, let's give it a go.
What I learned more so was notonly being able to handle a
radio station, but also how toproduce on radio, how to edit in
radio and those kinds of things.
I like that.
That led to another thing.
As a matter of fact, it was Ialso ran across an opportunity
in one of my jobs to learn howto uplink and downlink satellite
(15:24):
programs.
So you know, I've got all thesekinds of qualifications and
television, I believe it or not.
I went to the guy who firstmeeting I ever had, like this
was the guy who found it Ididn't know much about it at the
time because it was so long agowho founded Black Entertainment
Television.
Well, he was at a.
We spoke at an event.
(15:45):
I said well, let me come andtalk to you.
I'm talking to him aboutmarketing things.
Brooke Kruger (15:49):
He said well, that's good for you but what I'm
looking for is somebody toproduce the show.
So I said, can I get back toyou?
I mean, I think you make areally good point because we're
talking a lot about getting jobs, but another thread is like how
to keep a job in this market.
You know, we are in a new era.
It's been described as this bigboss era, where there's not
(16:11):
huge culture and people are.
You know there's high demands,and so I always say, like figure
out how to do your job and thejobs around you.
Be available, be flexible, beadaptable.
Sounds like that's what youwere doing.
They I was just saying theywere asking you to do one job
and they said what aboutproducing?
And you figured out how to makethat work.
Peter Woolfolk (16:27):
You know that's a really.
I'm really happy to hear yousay that, because that's that's
the thing of it.
You know, I learned as much asI could about as many things as
I could, because Because one ofthe things that you know having
learned how to produce a TV showand downlink satellite and all
those kinds of things and radiothat when I got on Capitol Hill
I was problem solving Onecongresswoman you know her
(16:50):
normal would set up with a radiostation in Texas, I think,
let's say nine o'clock everyMonday for instance, whatever it
was.
But anyway, when you have acommittee meeting you've got to
go.
So I called the producer aheadof time and said look, can we
just record the show the way wenormally would, maybe Sunday or
whatever else, or Fridayafternoon, and then you'll have
it Monday.
And he said fine, that's great,we'll do it that way.
(17:13):
I had another member of Congresswho was down in Brazil and I
had called for some sort of aclimate control, whatever it
happened to be.
So I called he was from NewYork.
So I called the three big newsstations in New York and asked
him would you be interested intalking to the congressman
directly from Brazil?
They said oh, absolutely.
And I said oh, by the way,we'll pay the bill.
(17:35):
And all of them said absolutely.
So I got him through on threemajor radio stations.
And how we did that, doingthose kinds of things when I was
in the administration.
I was at the Department ofEducation and the assistant
secretary was due to make apresentation somewhere out in
Wisconsin.
Well, the snowstorm preventedflying.
(17:57):
So you know, I knew of asatellite set up at the Labor
Department two blocks away madethat happen.
So you know, we trudged throughthe snow Saturday night and,
boom, got it done.
So it's about solving problemsfor people as well.
You know, doing a job is, yes,but it's problem solved.
Brooke Kruger (18:14):
Absolutely, and I think people always ask like
what are the number?
You know one skills thatcommunicators need today, and I
think number one is being a goodstoryteller, but number two is
being a problem solver.
You have to be able to thinktwo steps ahead, and when your
clients and executives andstakeholders are asking you for
something, it's like what arethey asking for, why, and then
(18:35):
what could happen?
You know, you just always wantto be scenario planning in your
head and the world moves so fastright now.
You really do need to think twosteps ahead.
Peter Woolfolk (18:48):
Well, the other thing that came out of this is
that I started in the Clintoncampaign as handling
communications for him, as acommunications man in the state
of Delaware.
Well, now I'm dealing with thegovernor, I'm dealing with
lieutenant governors and mayorsand so forth and so on.
So these people want thingsdone.
How can we do this?
How can we handle things?
And then, when the vicepresident and first lady came up
, there's detail, working withthe Secret Service and the
(19:09):
communications team.
They want to know every detail,all sorts of things.
So, being prepared, secretService want to know what door
you're coming in, who's sittingwhere, all that sort of stuff.
So you get comfortable nowgetting as many details as you
can to answer all sorts ofproblems.
The other thing I found out is,when you put in the other
(19:30):
project, make sure any andeverybody associated with that
project is at the table at thesame time, because I've seen the
wheels come off.
Okay, we'll find here.
All right, you hand out to joeand tell him this is his part.
Brooke Kruger (19:42):
Well, no for sure .
It's interesting you say thatabout the um, your clinton
campaign work, because I startedmy career working on a
presidential campaign as wellfor senator dole, so we were
probably on opposite sides atthe time on um, I was an intern
in 96.
And it's like the camp I lookback.
That campaign experience is socritical.
(20:03):
You're right in problem solvingin details, in being prepared,
and it's obviously a differentera now.
Peter Woolfolk (20:13):
But I'm grateful for that experience and all
that I learned on the Dole Camp.
Well, you know, and we were,because I mean, that's exactly
what I said, you've got to solveproblems, you because I'm, as a
matter of fact, I think we werein a radio station.
I was in there with thelieutenant governor and
something was.
They were talking about somesomething.
I forget what the details were,but I had to go look that up
right quick so I could slip herthe answer on the sheet of paper
well, but but do you evenremember how we had to look?
Announcer (20:37):
stuff up.
All right On the 96 campaign.
Brooke Kruger (20:39):
we didn't have emails, we couldn't find our
news online.
I remember somebody's job wasto go to the newspaper stands in
the morning at like 4 in themorning and get all the papers
and cut the clip.
Peter Woolfolk (20:53):
You know, here's what's interesting about this
is that I believe personally andas I listen to you, that having
worked in a presidentialcampaign is one of the best
experiences that I had inpreparing me for communications
work.
There's no question about itDetailed deal with senior
officials, getting it done,getting it done right, all you
(21:14):
know.
Don't be bashful about askingpeople for help, whatever that
happens to be.
So I wound up actually doingone of my podcast episodes on
that.
So I reached out to people fromdifferent campaigns and I had.
What did I have?
It was one lady who worked forNewt Gingrich when he ran
president and a fellow down inTexas I forget Ross Perot, I
(21:36):
think it was.
So we had them all on that,talking about the experiences we
had.
How do we get over hurdles?
How do you solve these problems?
All these other kinds of thingsworking with the local police
when they travel, working withthe Secret Service, all of those
kinds of things and that woundup being one of the various
highest rated episodes that I'vehad in six years.
Brooke Kruger (21:59):
Oh, I'm going to listen to that.
Yeah, I'm going to listen tothat.
I mean, I was still in collegewhen I'm from Kansas City and my
aunt lived in DC and she hadsuggested I apply to work for
Senator Dole in the MajorityLeader's Office and I ended up
going to work on the campaignand I just loved it.
But if I think back on myoperating model and how I think
(22:20):
like that was such a formativeexperience and I'm so grateful
that I got to do that,especially at such a young age.
We had to work with such agreat man, senator Dole, who, no
matter what side of the aisleyou're on, he is just a class
act.
Peter Woolfolk (22:32):
Well, and let me say this you know back then I
can say that when I worked forthe chairman of the House
Education and Labor Committee,one of his closest friends was a
Republican guy who was on thecommittee as well, and they
traveled together because youknow members of Congress, they
go around the country.
Brooke Kruger (22:51):
It's very different.
It's a very different climatenow, and I don't we don't want
to talk politics now, right, butbut but it's a very different.
It was very different.
That's all I'll say.
I'm grateful for my experienceand what I learned on the
campaign and I can't wait to goback and listen to that episode.
Peter Woolfolk (23:06):
Well, you know and that's exactly what I tell
people, Having worked in apolitical campaign, you will
learn a lot more in thatcampaign, for whatever number of
months you do, perhaps than youmight get in graduate school,
because it is so intense.
You're working with so manydifferent people.
You know I'm working with thegovernment, all those kind of
folks, and you've got to learndetails because the Secret
(23:27):
Service has a lot of questionsto ask.
They want a lot of information.
So you bring that proclivityfor having details that you
bring into whatever job you haveso you can ask as many
questions as you need to to makesure the job is run right.
Everybody is on the same page,all those other kinds of things.
So the political experience ishugely important.
It was in mine as obviously inyour growth and development.
Brooke Kruger (23:51):
Yes, absolutely absolutely.
Peter Woolfolk (23:54):
Well, let me ask you, Brooke, have we missed
anything?
Because you know I've listenedto that you do a lot of things
for a lot of people, both forthose looking to be hired and
looking, and the company islooking to hire Is know we are
small by design, as youmentioned, and the recruiters
(24:19):
that work at KC Partners.
Brooke Kruger (24:21):
They've all worked in the communications
industry, like myself, so Ithink we are able to quickly
assess what our clients wantagain, but also understand what
candidates want too.
And I think in a down market,it's just as important to figure
out what you want and you wantto do in this market and what
you're good at doing, becauseyou really want to find the
(24:42):
right match.
And you know, my greatest joyis when I place someone in a job
and they're happy and it's agood match and the client's
happy and the candidate's happyLike nothing feels better than
that.
And I think it's so importantfor people to kind of take a
step back and understand what isthe work that they enjoy, what
gives them, what motivates them.
(25:02):
And if I look at myself, like Ilove getting results in working
with candidates and workingwith clients, that's what in the
workforce makes me kick andthrive, and so I feel like I'm
so lucky that I truly found mycalling and I get to run a
business doing what I love everyday.
Peter Woolfolk (25:19):
You know, I think that's very, very
important.
The other thing that I thinkthat we probably touched on a
little bit was learning as muchas you can about the
organizations you're going towork for, and whatever the job
is or project is.
Learn as much as you can fromas many people as you can,
because somewhere along the linethat information is going to
come in handy it truly does andjust what I like.
Brooke Kruger (25:40):
When I take on a new search I really try to go
deep with my client andunderstand the organization, the
culture.
What kind of person is actuallygoing to be successful there?
because, not all people aregoing to be successful in every
company, and that is okay.
You may find that you can'twork at a small startup, or a
big company is too much for you.
I found that I worked at a PRagency and it wasn't for me, and
(26:01):
so I really do want to try tohelp people find the right fit
for them, and immersing in thatcompany and understanding what
makes the company tick is alsoimportant.
Peter Woolfolk (26:09):
Well, I think you know you probably answered
my last question.
That was that if you wanted tosay anything to any potential
candidates and I think you- mayhave hit that nail right on the
head already.
Brooke Kruger (26:21):
Oh, yes, for sure .
Yeah, I mean, it is a toughmarket, it is a tricky market,
but what I would tell candidatesis it is getting better.
If you look on LinkedIn everyMonday, more and more people are
getting jobs, more and morepeople are leaving jobs, which
means that jobs are going to beopen and companies are adding
headcount.
The communications hiringmarket is getting better, but it
(26:44):
is still critical to put yourbest foot forward.
Peter Woolfolk (26:46):
Well, not only that.
I mean keep learning as much asyou can, because it's also
moving very fast, particularlywith artificial intelligence and
all the other platforms thatare out there that you need to
get a handle on that, even ifit's just a basic handle, to
understand how it can work andthe benefits that it brings to
your particular job, and theshortcomings that it might have
as well.
Brooke Kruger (27:07):
Exactly.
I mean, we didn't even touch onAI, but understanding AI is
critical, and understanding howyou use the tools that are going
to help you improve your job iscritical.
And there are certain thingsthat AI won't replace, and I
think human connection andreally kind of trying to
understand what motivates peopleand makes people pick.
But there are AI tools thatwill help people improve their
(27:30):
job as well.
Peter Woolfolk (27:31):
Yeah, and I think people need to understand
that.
You know AI is there to helpyou, so you need to get your
hands around how it works andhow you can use it in real
particular, Absolutely.
I use it quite a bit in theproduction of this podcast.
I mean, it's me talking.
It's going to do the transcriptfor this once I'm done.
Those kinds of things that savetime, so forth and so on.
(27:54):
So I would always say to anyperson learn as much as you can
about any job you're going to gointo.
It really, really does help.
Brooke Kruger (28:02):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Well, it was so great to chatwith you.
Peter Woolfolk (28:05):
Well, brooke, let me say thank you so very,
very much, and let me just sayto my guests that you've been
listening to Brooke Kruger.
She is the founder and CEO ofKC Partners out of San Francisco
, california, and I want tosuggest that you share this
information with some of yourcolleagues about this particular
episode and also listen to thenext edition of the Public
(28:26):
Relations Review, and perhaps wesure would appreciate a review
from you.
So don't forget to listen tothe next edition of the Public
Relations Review podcast.
Thanks again.
Announcer (28:36):
This podcast is produced by Communication
Strategies, an award-winningpublic relations and public
affairs firm headquartered inNashville, Tennessee.
Thank you for joining us.
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