Star Wars - Marry, Sex, Kill: Picking the Best & Worst Films of the Skywalker Saga - Quantum Recast: Your Favorite Films, Recast In Different Years

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
1977.
The force is with you, youngSkywalker, but you are not a
Jedi yet.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Welcome to another episode of Quasim recast.
I'm your host, corey, and withme is the lovely Allison Dale,
hello, and the handsome NickGrohl.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Oh, wow so flattering .

Speaker 3 (00:46):
I have to start high on this episode it really goes
downhill from here.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
Listen, I'm just starting some compliments out.
This one could get rough.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Corey, you're looking quite swole today.
I will say Thank you, You'vebeen into the gym.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
We're just going to compliment each other, because
it could end with guns drawn bythe end Because we are entering
the most toxic fandom of allStar Wars.
For this episode, we're goingto play a little game we like to
play on this podcast every oncein a while Marry sex kill.
Despite some comments, it's notthe characters.
We're not that nerdy and weird.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
Yeah, that would be pretty weird, that's odd.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
We don't want to marry sex or kill any fictional
characters.
We do it with franchises.
Yes, we do it with films, youknow, because every franchise
has those movies that you loveand the ones you hate and the
ones you just like.
I like this one, but I don'treally want to tell my friends,
you know, this is my littlesecret.
And we're going to do that withStar Wars.
Yes, this episode Now we'rekeeping it within the three
trilogies, no standalone Solo.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Yeah, those are out.
Clone War, all the TV shows.
Mandalorian, another timeperhaps.

Speaker 2 (01:48):
So we're just taking the OG trilogy, the prequel
trilogy and the I don't evenknow what they call the new
trilogy, sequel trilogy, it'sthe sequel or the Disney trilogy
.
Often, what it's referred toSequel's what I hear more often
than not.
They need a cooler name theMillennial Trilogy, the
Millennial Trilogy's great.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
So the millennial trilogy, the millennial trilogy
is great.
The let's just not have a planfor this trilogy.
Millennial works, it's formillennials in the millennial
faculty.
It's all in it, the millenniumfalcons, just all through it so
you're right, you're right okayit's there, so all right.

Speaker 2 (02:13):
Well, uh, we need to talk about the star wars
franchise, do we yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:19):
well, for the uninitiated is that.
Is that what we're going for?
If you've clicked on this andyou have never seen Star Wars,
congratulations.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
You know what, honestly, I kind of envy you.
It's impressive.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
That's kind of where I'm at now, when I meet someone.
That's like you know, I'venever actually watched any of
the Star Wars movies and I'mjust like oh wow, don't.
You're so pure.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Great movies, but, man, you're going to be in a lot
of stupid conversations for therest of your life.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
So give a quick rundown, I guess.
The original Star Warsobviously dropped in May 25th
1977.
And we had the original trilogythat ran all the way through to
1983.
Then we had the prequel trilogy.
When George came back, saidStar Wars all over again, we
were excited.
And then Phantom Menace droppedon May 19th 1999.

(03:01):
And that's really where thetoxicity began, my friends.

Speaker 3 (03:06):
Little guy named jar jar, little smaller guy named
anakin little child jake lloyd,and then, uh, it's that and the
internet in the internet.

Speaker 2 (03:13):
The internet came in right when this happened.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
Yeah, the internet shows up and and you know, I
feel like and we'll get intothat discussion, but he kind of
figures it out, kind of doesn't,and then he sells it to disney.
Years later, after thinkingabout making a sequel trilogy,
he hands it to disney and disneydoes what disney does in in the
modern context.
Uh, some people were fine withit.
A lot of people weren't I.

Speaker 2 (03:35):
I'm fine with it, but uh, yeah that that's.

Speaker 1 (03:39):
That's star wars in a nutshell.
I would say it.
It changed cinema as we know itfrom 1977 on.
Everything is compared andprobably an effect has happened
because of star wars and uh yeah, and we we've been trying to
replicate that magic ever sinceyeah, yeah just a big breath

(04:00):
here, for we tell you, I'll givesome quick, I'll give some
quick rundowns if you, you will.
We'll list the nine movies thatwe are going to be pulling from
Again Rogue One and Solo we'renot including those or the
animated Clone Wars movie thatwas released oh yeah, you're
right about that.
All the Expanded Universe stuff.
Star Wars, a New Hope May 25th1977.
Rotten Tomatoes score 93.
Critic 96 audience.

(04:21):
Pretty high standards there.
Yeah, empire Strikes Back.
May 21st 1980.
95 critic score.
97 audience score.
Return of the Jedi May 25th1983.
83 critic score.
94 audience score I was aboutto say yeah.
Phantom Menace dropped in 99.
It had a 52 critic score and a59 audience score.
That's the lowest so far.

(04:41):
Attack of the Clones Attack ofthe Clones 2002, 65 critic score
.
Rotten Tomatoes fan score of 56.
Revenge of the Sith 79 RottenTomatoes critic score.
66 fan score that one droppedin 2005.
10 years later, force Awakenscomes out with a 93 critic and
85 fan score.
Last Jedi comes out with a 91critic score, a 42 fan score.

(05:04):
Probably the biggest divide,maybe?
Yeah, because Rise of Skywalkerin 2019, a 51 critic score, a
86 fan score.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
That's wild.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
It's very wild, it's a weird flip.

Speaker 3 (05:18):
Yes, and that's a major flip too.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
That's a major flip.
So critics like Last Jedi hateRise of Skywalker.
Yes, Fans reversed it.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
For the most part, yes, yeah, okay.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
But there was like a weird retroactive Star Wars fan
that says no, I always likedLast Jedi a couple years ago.

Speaker 3 (05:35):
Was there.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
I think so.
I think it was a lot of peoplekind of coming back and saying,
no, I liked it.
I think it was when Rise ofSkywalker happened.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
Okay, everybody quickly came back around.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on.
Yeah, they're like oh.

Speaker 2 (05:44):
Because they crapped hard on Last Jedi.
They did, and then they cameout and Rise of Skywalker
happened and those people hatedit.

Speaker 3 (05:49):
Maybe we were too harsh.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah, they were like yeah they hated it when I was
just like.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
I like both.

Speaker 1 (05:59):
I like Pepsi and Coke with the new trilogy.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
I enjoyed seeing all three movies.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
I think it also has a lot to do with your.
You like Kylo Ren as thecharacter, a lot like his story
and how they treated him.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
Totally valid too, first hot take coming.
I think the new trilogy is thestrongest trilogy of the
franchise.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
Oh, that is From first to third movie.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
It's just the strongest trilogy in my opinion.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
That's a strong yeah, that's an opinion.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
I would trilogy.
In my opinion, that's a strong,yeah, strong, uh.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
I would watch that trilogy like front to end before
I'd watch either of the othertwo.
Front to end and this isinteresting because an audience
and ally, because I've alwaysviewed cory as a original
trilogy guy.
Yeah, I thought so too.
I thought you were I'm.

Speaker 2 (06:37):
I like the original trilogy a lot, but I just think
like the story the new trilogytold was just the most engaging
and I liked it the most and Ithink think Kylo Ren's the best
character that's ever beencreated by Star Wars.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
See, I could see that .
I could agree with that,because Kylo Ren really did have
an incredible character arc.
Yes, and he's phenomenal.
Yeah, he's.
I mean, adam Driver just did anexcellent job with Kylo Ren.
There's no doubt about that.
I would not, yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:58):
And I, like Rey and Finn, thought the casting was
just really good, wholeheartedlysure yeah, I think the only
misstep, which everything'sgonna have.
Missteps is, uh, they, you know, good gosh.
Star wars could never get bobafett right and they could never
replicate him, despite multipletries no yeah and the new
trilogy boba fett, which was thecaptain, phasma, phantasma.

(07:18):
Well, that was the thing is.
Is that?

Speaker 1 (07:20):
star wars itself.
What's the it's's if it wasn'tthe creation of a trope?
It was definitely like the onethat cemented it.
Like Boba Fett is themysterious character in the
background that everyone thinksis really cool and you want the
backstory about them.
So then every major franchisewas like we need a Boba Fett.

Speaker 2 (07:44):
Like it's interesting .
I've also seen like a newretroactive nerd thing where
they're all saying Boba Fett'snot that cool and we never
thought he was that cool.
Yeah, I've seen that and it'sjust like and that's that
contrarian attitude that makesthis fandom toxic.
It's just what weird thing canI say on the Internet?
Oh you know and so um, but likeand I would say that's the only

(08:08):
miscasting that I don't love inthe new one is like.
I thought that was a weird like.
It's like it felt like theywere trying to create a new
bobafett with this eight foottall silver right, yeah, played
by gwendolyn christie, I thinkof, uh, the game of thrones yeah
and it just didn't work and,like luckily, the directors, I
think, saw it didn't work rightaway and they just didn't go on
with the character yeah and soum, but that's just.
I don't know that's.
That's just.
I just bought something on yourlex how dare you?

(08:32):
Probably a captain phasmaaction figure captain phasma,
funko pop.
Okay, I'll say this so starwars like here's I think here's
the best way to put it star warsbecame a license to sell merch
yes it's the, it's the rock band.
Kiss of sci-fi.
It's just what can we slap ourname on and sell?
And george lucas loved thatmoney and we all saw that.
It's like when the prequelscame, he was writing to sell
merch, which is why jar, jarbinks is a thing, but I think

(08:55):
with every single star warsmovie, you, you, you can go in a
toy aisle and remember whatdidn't sell yeah yeah, and
phasmas were everywhere, no onebought them.
They were like this is gonna bethe new Boba Fett.
We're like no, it's not.

Speaker 1 (09:06):
Tr8r was right there that was your new Boba Fett,
especially for a series.
That was like I've written mystory.
Now you write your story likeyou tell me why didn't Rian
Johnson go?
Oh, that's your 8R guy's prettycool yeah, everybody really
likes him, we'll be going forhim.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
you know, like let's, let's swap this out real quick,
and so we get that guy back.
And so I think like, but to mypoint, I think, like I really
think the cast of the first Idon't know.
I think the newest trilogy isthe strongest trilogy.
That's my hot take.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
Okay, and we'll definitely be diving into that
more.
I think once we reveal our Marysex and kills, yeah.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Allie, are there any hot takes you going to come out
when we do our Mary Six Kill?

Speaker 1 (09:45):
Okay, the only thing I will say, just to jump off of
what Corey's talking about, isthat, yes, star Wars is
interesting because you have aguy who is an auteur filmmaker.
You could argue we have a lotof auteur, pretentious type of
cinephile types now, and GeorgeLucas was kind of that before
that, like his THX movie, wastrying to like make all this
high concept stuff he reallydidn't have a major interest in

(10:06):
like blockbuster cinema, he wasjust recreating things of his
childhood basically, which Iguess is just what franchises
are.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
He was john carpenter .
Yeah, the same thing, like heactually created something that
got away from him.

Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah, yeah, that's fair and and so the his entire
watching a lot of like the stuffand reading about it.
You see that he's this guy thatwants control of his story and
which is something he learnedearly on was like the studio is
going to take that away from me.
So once star wars itself 77 wasa success, he did everything in
his power to make sure empire.
He did it as an independentfilmmaker and he almost had to

(10:36):
go to the studio and get moneyto finish it, but luckily it
finished.
It was successful.

Speaker 2 (10:40):
He made the third one but he got a different director
and it got a different director.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Yeah, yeah and to cory's point, that's about when
it started shifting to oh, Ineed to start thinking more in
the mindset of what's going tosell that's a buttload of action
figures like the fact that thatwas half the deal was like.
He was like I get the rights tothe toys and they're like sure,
whatever, yeah man and he ownsall the rights to it.
So that's why he's makingboo-coos of money, or did make

(11:04):
boo-coos of money.
But then you see, when theprequel trilogy comes out, it's
a man that basically has, yes,men around him, and it's people
gone.
Gone are the people that heworked with in the 70s and 80s
that said that's a bad idea.
George, maybe you shouldn't dothat to a bunch of people that
treat him like a god basically,yeah, yeah, I would agree with
that.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah, well, it's, it's the.
There's books and documentaries, essentially on people that
were there and they're like, oh,you just didn't tell him no.

Speaker 1 (11:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
It's like dude.
I'm working with George Lucason the new Star Wars.

Speaker 1 (11:27):
Right.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
Like I'm not going to get fired over him saying
something stupid.

Speaker 1 (11:30):
Like.

Speaker 2 (11:31):
Jar Jar Binks is going to be the next Boba Fett.
This guy's going to be huge.

Speaker 1 (11:34):
It's a very smiling it's a very like what's that
kind.
I don't know what the properterm is, you have to remind me,
because he is a man that wentfrom trying to be an auteur, do
it himself to eventually givingin to the tropes of big money
and trying to appease audiencesand stuff, so much so that he
sold it to the company that nowis all about pleasing

(11:54):
demographics, selling toys,selling theme park tickets.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
It's crazy.
Well, it's just.
He became Darth Vader is thething everyone always says.
He became what he hated.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
You know type of.
Thing.

Speaker 2 (12:05):
But yeah no, I think that's pretty apt Cool.

Speaker 3 (12:12):
I know we're not ready to do this, but are we
ready to do this?
Yeah, been looking forward tothis.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
What do we want to start with Corey Dealer's?

Speaker 1 (12:20):
choice.
You tell me what to do.
I'm going to say we should easeinto this and start with our
sex, because I feel like, whilethere may be hot takes, it's a
grain of salt, because with yoursex it's your guilty pleasure,
it's just the one that you'relike.
I enjoy this.

Speaker 2 (12:30):
Yeah, up top, I forgot to say, mary, sex Kills.
That Game you played when youwere a juvenile.
You know usually about, likeyou usually did it with stupid
stuff like Scooby-Doo characters.

Speaker 3 (12:39):
And you're like.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Now Mary Shaggy.
Yeah, you know I'm going to sexDaphne, it's what it's that.
You know it's just goofy thing,but we're doing with movie
franchises, and so Mary ispretty much our desert island.

Speaker 1 (12:49):
This is the one we will watch and take to our grave
what we think is the best movie.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
What we think is the best, the one we love the most.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
Sex is the one that's like, doesn't belong and should
not exist in this franchise.
Right, because usually we do.
We've started this series ofminisodes with horror movies and
your theory always is thatthere's a horror.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
Oh, there's always one that shouldn't exist, right,
it's like non-canonical, almostit's like some director just
said.
I want to be different.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
And it's like okay, why?
And it's a little differentwith Star Wars and everything,
especially with the nine movies,but we're going to have fun
with it and we're going to stayfriends after this and we're
going to be friends afterwards,corey, that backwards hat looks
so great on you.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
Let's just preface this by saying we're all a
little on edge because, again,the toxicity of this franchise
is just so insane, but we'repretty level-headed people.

Speaker 1 (13:39):
We try to be.

Speaker 3 (13:41):
I don't know that any of us claim Star Wars is their
thing try to be, yeah, like Idon't know that any of us claim
star wars is like their thing.
No, I mean, I really enjoy it.
Yeah, we love it, I reallyenjoy it I'll rewatch you.
Like jurassic park more thanstar wars, right, and then like
more of your thing, yeah, but Iwouldn't say that I like the
series you just want to sex.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
John williams, that's your thing, right that's fair,
guys.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
I have an idea like mary sex kill john williams
scores, scores.

Speaker 2 (14:02):
Oh man, that would be controversial probably and it's
not like your thing.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
I mean you like it but I like it.
I think the thing is that it'salways been existent in my life
and it's weirdly been a part ofmy life just being so tied into
movies and I can get more intoit as we get into this, but but,
but I do it's not the thing,but I think it's an important
thing for any film goer reallyokay, yeah, I mean it is, it's
important to cinema, but, like I, just, we are a level-headed

(14:27):
audience right we're a littlenervous about what we're about
to say but, like mainly, I'mworried about what the audience
is going to say when they hearthis, because some there's some
toxic star war fans that listento this listen, if we get likes
and dislikes some peoplereporting about us, that's,
that's news, baby all right.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
So, nick, let's start off.
Who do you want to go firsthere?

Speaker 1 (14:46):
not it not it wow, thanks guys.

Speaker 3 (14:49):
All right, you know what yeah?

Speaker 2 (14:50):
which movie is your one night stand, alley?

Speaker 3 (14:51):
yeah, all right guys.
So, um, this has been one of myfavorite, uh, obviously one of
my favorites.
It has its flaws, but it issomething that's near and dear
to my heart okay I had a reallyum interesting experience the
first time I watched it.
I watched it with one of myolder brothers.
Both my brothers are massivestar wars fans like I'm talking
reading the extended universe,like they know, like if I have a
question about star wars.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
I go to my brothers, do not tell them to listen to
this well thankfully, they'relevel-headed too they're not.
They're not toxic.

Speaker 3 (15:16):
They understand that the world doesn't revolve around
star wars.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
It'll be like a knock on my door one day and then,
like your brother, just punchesme in the stomach and walks off.

Speaker 3 (15:26):
No, so my, we're doing sex first right, yes, yes,
yes.
Revenge of the Sith, episodethree.
I love Revenge of the Sith.
General Grievous is one of myabsolute favorite villains in
all of Star Wars.
I think he's such a badass.
I love Anakin's entire arc orentire, you know.
Turn to the dark side.
I think the entire scene ofmustafar is just fantastic, even

(15:47):
even the the speech that goeson between anakin and obi-wan.
I I love it.
I eat it up every single timeit's.
I could watch it over and overand over.
It has its flaws, it's notperfect, but I love it so much
well it came at the end.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
It's the third one in the prequels, obviously, but I
think, strangely like, whatpeople were saying at the time
when it came out, I remember,was like oh, george finally got
it.
Yeah, because like he wastrying to go for that
Shakespearean tragedy kind ofmindset with the prequels.
But he was also it's thatcatering with the kids.
Like the first one had Jar Jarand everybody was kind of miffed
about that.
The second one had the wholeromance thing.
That just felt stilted andproblematic.
But this one, like he finallyfound some form of a balance

(16:23):
with it.
But it was also like here's allthe good stuff, like he's going
to become darth vader, he'sgoing to turn to the dark side.
The emperor is going to finallylike reveal himself, even
though everyone's like I wonderwho the emperor is.

Speaker 2 (16:33):
He could be any one of us yeah, well, ali, as
someone who has positive thingsto say about this movie, um, how
did you feel about I mean, it'sthe controversial thing, right,
the the no that darth vader'soh yeah okay, so here's the deal
, all right, and let me just forsome context, this is the first
star wars movie that I actuallyvividly remember watching in
theaters.

Speaker 3 (16:53):
I know I saw phantom menace.
I think we watched it for mybrother's birthday, because you
mentioned may 19th those.
Yeah, it's my brother'sbirthday, so I'm sure we watched
it.
Did not see attack of theclones in theaters, don't regret
that.
And revenge of the sith I didsee in theaters and I and I.
It was just a reallyinteresting experience with my
brother, so I was.
It came out what 2005, 2005.
I was almost 13 when it cameout and I didn't see anything
wrong with it at the time.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
I it from revenge of the sith.
You know what?

Speaker 3 (17:16):
yeah, yeah the no at the end yeah, got it for me it
was kind of impact.
I teared up as a 12 year oldalmost 13 year old
watching-year-old watching it.

Speaker 2 (17:24):
but as I've gotten older that is so interesting to
me.

Speaker 3 (17:26):
Yeah, I'm glad you say it.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
I really wanted your opinion on it because you like
this movie and I really do thinkthere's this weird line in Star
Wars fans.
But you have to just accept asthere.
That would honestly solve like90% of the arguments that Star
Wars that's what they watch.

(17:48):
When they were, that's theirfirst thing Me, I knew what
Darth Vader was before, so theno was like oh, that seemed out
of character.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
I would agree on that page with you.
I think I'm I'm in between youand Ali and age wise, but also
like have the same general ideaof like.
I grew up watching theoriginals and then star wars.
The prequels were kind of likewhat I watched from the end of
like childhood into my teenageyears and stuff, and so the no
did kind of hit me awkwardly,and re-watching it even the
other night, uh, I was stilllike I wish, I just wish that

(18:17):
had gone a different way.
Like I liked the frankenstein,like nods and stuff and like him
breaking everything with theforce.
I think it also highlightsgeorge's reliance on the cgi at
the time.
Like that scene could hit somuch harder if all that stuff is
practical and it breaks and itshatters around him.
The no, because up to thatpoint we don't really have like
a vocally uh angry darth vader.

(18:40):
Like he has lines where he'svery aggressive in the original
trilogy and stuff and this isthe first time where he's really
like it's a scream, like younever heard Darth Vader scream,
so like I'm sure that's likewell, what does he do in this
moment?

Speaker 2 (18:50):
kind of thing so my thing, I guess my point, is like
you just have to accept thatlike I can totally get someone
who's first experience with StarWars was the prequels and being
completely fine with the no butI'll also say this I think I've
come to just be okay with itanytime.
I've seen it like in the in therecent past it's just like.
It's just like the death of thehumanity, it's like the last

(19:11):
death groan of anakin for sureand then it's done yeah and now
he's a half robot and so right.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
I think.
For me it was definitelygrowing up and maybe you've
experienced that as well.
At the same time and it mighthave been a little early for you
, ali, but growing up, duringthe prequels coming out, the
first phantom menace comes outand you're generally like, as a
kid, you're like that's fine andthen slowly, like we talked
about, the internet kind ofpushes out the idea of like jar
jar sucks jake lloyd's.
A piece of shit like this isthis is wrong and it's the

(19:40):
nitpicking cinema sins of theworld that has been birthed, I
think during the process ofthese movies being made to the
point that that's when we getbecome very critical of them.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
You know, and it is what it is like you get to an
age where you realize like youhave to like.
It's like even like we like prowrestling yeah you know, and if
you watch wwe, you have toaccept the fact that, like they
really want to cater to 13 yearolds, yeah, they want to sell
action figures, they want tothings, but they do a decent job
.
Also, like we also want tocater to the 30 year old that
has the disposable income to buya $500 replica belt.
Yeah, you know like it's likethey wave that line where it's

(20:10):
like star Wars, the prequelseemed to just say F you to the
original fans, a little bit Likethey just kind of said like we
just don't get like we just needpeople to.
The internet was new and theydidn't recognize the fact that
like the 30 year old nerd was athing and was going to be a
thing and that they were goingto.
I was, like you know, in middleschool when the Phantom Menace

(20:30):
came out.
Like I was eighth grade, goingto ninth grade.
I couldn't find a Darth Maulaction figure to save my life.
I couldn't find the stupidlightsaber toy that had both
ends, because 30 year olds werebuying them in mass and selling
them on this new thing calledeBay.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
I mean honestly, it's probably between them and maybe
the Trekkies and even maybeyour Kiss fans.
That's the first time you'reexperiencing adult fans that are
buying memorabilia and toys.
The horror fans are doing thesame thing at this time, so I'm
sure nobody saw that coming of,going like, oh, we're making
this for the kids and theparents will take the kids to
the movies, and you didn't think, oh no, the parents are going

(21:03):
to be the ones that are going towatch this I just think the
prequels like that's a flaw.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
It's like it's the timing's bad and maybe it is a
little bit of like a directorwho just doesn't want to let go
of his thing he wants the.
It is.
It's vince mcmahon in wrestlingit's like you have to like go.
I'm a little antiquated.
What's cool?
Now someone tell me what themarket looks like, you know,
instead of just thinking youknow everything, because they
could have like done enoughresearch to say, like well, I

(21:27):
just watched the documentaryTrekkies and there's a lot of
nerdy adults out there.

Speaker 3 (21:31):
Just dropping money on this crap.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
So maybe we can go a little hard in the paint here
you know, maybe we can like tonegritty this up a little bit.

Speaker 3 (21:40):
That's what's it, that's, what's it, that's what's
so, just to piggyback off ofwhat, what we're talking about
and ali's choice of revenge, ofthe sith, my, my, uh, my sex
choice.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
My guilty pleasure is phantom menace.
Okay, totally fair, and I thinka lot of it does play into some
of that nostalgia a little bitlike because, if you remember,
like like we're talking aboutright now, after this prequels
came out, there was this periodof time where everybody shunned
them and then, even when forceawakens came out, it was
designed as an apology letter tofans of like.
We're sorry that happened.
We're making this like starwars, like you remember again
yeah, yeah but obviously we've.

(22:12):
There's been some time haspassed and suddenly shown like,
oh wait, no, there are things toenjoy about these movies, for
sure, and that one is a weirdhodgepodge of things because
it's him getting introduced to alot of cgi but he's still using
a lot of practical sets andeffects and stuff.
So there's still some of thatoriginal Star Wars going on.
But you're getting that influxof.
We've got to make Jar Jarreally funny to sell the kids

(22:32):
it's the Ewok blown on steroids.
Basically because for every JarJar quip there is, there's the
Padre sequence, which is reallywell put together.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
It's well put together, but I okay, go ahead.
No, no, no, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (22:45):
There's the podcast sequence, the duel at the end,
you know the design of DarthMaul just being a badass hot
take.
They shouldn't have killed him.

Speaker 2 (22:57):
Obviously he in the in the lore.
That's not a hot take, that'sjust universally agreed we?

Speaker 1 (23:00):
This is where somebody should have said you
really shouldn't kill himbecause he's kind of cool.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
This is your Boba Fett.
Yeah, this is the guy.
This is your.

Speaker 1 (23:06):
Darth Vader for the next three movies.

Speaker 3 (23:07):
Also Liam Neeson, as Qui-Gon Jinn was also fantastic.

Speaker 1 (23:11):
Like there's a lot of groundwork that you have to do
in that first movie to get thesethree movies to even work and
between Qui-Gon Jinn and thecasting of Obi-Wan place,
because, because even McGregor'sObi-Wan is the unsung hero of
that entire trilogy, like he isthe most consistent through all
three movies and kind of carriesthat movie on his shoulders for
the most part.

Speaker 3 (23:31):
Also the Phantom Menace had that really neat
poster to Jake Lloyd like kindof walking in the shadow is
Darth Vader.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
My, my personal history with Phantom Menace was
this was late childhood era ofNick, where we were just
starting to get to watch adultslash live action movies.
I'd watch star wars movies.
I'd grown up watchingfranchises like that, but for
some reason uh, darth maullooking like the devil.
I was not allowed to watchphantom menace when it came out
in theaters.
Had to wait till it came out onvhs.
Sat down and watched it asfamily.
Oh, turns out it's fine fran, Iknow I know.

(24:00):
But it was so much so that Ibought like a scholastic
novelization of the book.
In between the time and when Iread that darth maul dies, I was
like I was in denial.
I was like there's no he, nothey.
They had some, he's fine he'she's, he's gonna be, he's.
This dude's too cool.
But it's a lot of nostalgia forme.
But and that's, I think, whyit's it's the guilty pleasure
just because, like there is forall the like what we would

(24:20):
consider like these the trash,the bad, the out of context
jokes and stuff.
Like there is a lot of fun,really good sci-fi stuff hidden
in there I think also with thephantom menace.

Speaker 3 (24:29):
For, like me personally, because I 99, I was
seven, um, I, my brothers,watched star wars growing up,
but me being the little sisterwho just wanted to re-watch
beauty and the beast in jurassicpark over and over again, I
never had an interest in it.
But I will say when this isreally silly.
But when Weird Al came out withthe saga begins, that actually
made me want to go watch StarWars.
Yeah.
Like I remember us watching themusic video.
I don't know why my dad lovesthat song.
He thinks, even though my daddoesn't like Star Wars.

(24:51):
My mom's the Star Wars, but hey, yeah, that was one that that
got me into Phantom Menace.
And here I am today.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
Thanks Weird Al.
Good job.
Al yeah banger uh star warssongs.
There's also yoda in the styleof lola.

Speaker 2 (25:10):
Oh, that's right, I forgot about that one.
That's a good one as well.
Cory, your thoughts on phantommenace.

Speaker 1 (25:13):
You were ready, but you gave me time and I
appreciate it.
Well, phantom menace is also mysex really really hey, hey
different reasons.

Speaker 2 (25:18):
Okay, okay, okay, I'm not a nostalgia person, got it
I am very much of the theorythat nostalgia is not based and
you think something from thepast is good.
You just miss the past.

Speaker 3 (25:26):
You just miss being 10, which is what you miss.

Speaker 2 (25:29):
And now, don't get me wrong, we can watch things like
Little Giants and still enjoyit, but it's still just more
like it's really just I likedbeing 10.

Speaker 3 (25:36):
Right.

Speaker 2 (25:37):
That was great.

Speaker 3 (25:39):
Life was awesome.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
No idea what was going on around me no
responsibilities and noresponsibilities and there were
two adults with money that justgot me things and so but I pick
Fate of Menace solely.
I actually hate Liam Neeson asQui-Gon Jinn.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
I think it's sucky.

Speaker 2 (25:55):
I don't even know that he knew he was in a Star
Wars movie.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
But isn't that what makes it?

Speaker 2 (26:00):
better.
I think Natalie Portman was ahorrendous casting choice.
I hate all of it.
So what do you?

Speaker 1 (26:06):
love about that.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
And Jake Lloyd.
That's nothing new, that'snothing new.

Speaker 1 (26:10):
No, no, no.

Speaker 2 (26:10):
And like I don't mind bashing, because I think he
made one of the best Christmasmovies of all time, so I praise
Jake Lloyd for that, for JingleAll the Way.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
He should have stuck to his lane.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
No, yeah, it's just.
He literally plays the samecharacter, it's just.
Yeah, he does I get?
Lucas is probably saying wehave to show this kid as an
antithesis of what Darth Vaderis.
But I'm like, no, no, just castthe moody kid.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
He had the chance.
We've seen the footage.
We've talked about this.

Speaker 3 (26:45):
There's literally test footage of the three
finalists for Anakin and likeit's to play in Sky High.
Mike, oh, I know who you'retalking about.
He was incredible.
He got the assignment.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
He nailed it.
He is playing like there issomething dead inside of me.
And it's just like I love it.
I hate that Boba Fett wasoriginally apparently in the
script.

Speaker 1 (26:57):
Oh really.

Speaker 2 (26:58):
Or they were going to canonize them eventually, as
they share the same mom.

Speaker 1 (27:02):
Yeah, like half brothers.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
Yeah, jango was supposedly because they tried
the immaculate conception.

Speaker 1 (27:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah , he's pure midichlorian and I
don't even know if he stuck withthe canon of midichlorians yeah
.

Speaker 2 (27:14):
But there was like an original idea that Jango Fett
is the father of Darth Vader,that he came to that planet, is
the father moved on, which wouldmake Boba Fett and Darth Vader
half-brothers.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
Got it right which?

Speaker 2 (27:22):
would explain why people think Boba Fett is
Force-sensitive.

Speaker 1 (27:26):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (27:26):
In the same way that people think Han Solo is
Force-sensitive.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
Listen, we were just watching Return of the Jedi and
the fact that Lando is flyingthrough a Death Star at
breakneck speed and not crashing.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
It's so cool he's got to have some Force
sensibilities going on there.
I liked the idea.
Seeds that Darth Vader and BobaFett have a lot of past.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
He focuses on Boba Fett, on all the conversations.
There's clearly past there.

Speaker 1 (27:46):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
But George said nope, I would rather it be Anakin
build C-3PO.
That was the rewrite, as legendgoes, because they needed to
connect to the original trilogy.
And he said I would rather itbe that Darth Vader built the
robot.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
So before you go into what you like about Phantom,
Menace.

Speaker 2 (28:04):
I think Phantom Menace is great for no other
reason than Darth Maul, and it'sthe best lightsaber fight in
all nine movies you're not wrongall nine movies.
It is the greatest.
It is just for the last 20minutes alone.
Like why we're having plotsabout trade federations and like
this kind of politics is beyondme while we're trying to sell
toys.
But like that lightsaber fightis the coolest thing and Duel of

(28:29):
Fates is stupid.
Hot take.
It's the best thing that cameout of Star Wars musically.
I got real nervous there for asecond Corey.

Speaker 3 (28:36):
When you said it's stupid, I was about to.
No, it's stupid.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
good Duel of Fates is the best number from Star Wars,
Even better than the Whateverthe opening thing.

Speaker 1 (28:43):
The opening fanfare Imperial March Duel of Fates
gets you pumped.
It hits it's a workout song.
There's a reason it's playedbefore sporting events.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
The chorus and everything behind.
Oh, it's so good, it's so solid.

Speaker 1 (28:54):
I will say this about the Duel of Fates lightsaber
duel itself Is that and there'ssomething that Freddie Prince Jr
pointed out after working underall the star wars guys, was
that that fight is so integralas well story-wise, because
whoever wins decides the literalfate of anakin.
Yeah, you know, if qui-gonlives, he's, there's a potential
, he knows how to train anakin,being this outsider, being this

(29:15):
guy who's not just so, uh, afundamentalist of jedi mindset,
that he's able to go like, yeah,you got some anger, we got to
work through that, versus nowyou have young Obi-Wan trying to
grow up but also be like I gotthis kid brother, basically that
I have to make sure he's goingto go crazy.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
I never thought of that.
He's putting a role of power toit soon, that's what the
literal Duel of Fates is.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
It's the fate of Anakin.
I never put that together.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
Yeah, the Clone Wars and everything I also really
suck at picking up on stuff likethat.
I'll be completely honest, I'mreally terrible about that.

Speaker 1 (29:46):
You're watching a sci-fi adventure movie and
there's a lot of thought thatgoes into these type of things.
But it's not until the secondor third time, or having
conversations with friends, thatyou're like oh yeah, that is
true.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
That's a really big point.
As a seven-year-old, I'm ineighth grade, going to ninth
grade, and Freddie Prinze Jr isthe hottest man on the planet.
You can't go out with girlsyour own age because they're all
crushing on Freddie Prinze.

Speaker 3 (30:08):
Jr.

Speaker 2 (30:08):
And she's all.
That's the best movie of alltime.
And you know what girls he grewup to be me he grew up to be us
.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
He likes pro wrestling and he loves Star Wars
.
He trained under George Lucasand Dave Filoni.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
I don't even know if he played high school sports.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
It just seems like he's really into D&D.
Please come on the podcast.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
Freddie, we enjoy it.
You're one of us, one of us.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
But no, but that's the thing is like a lot of
people want to be like, oh, it'sjust a bunch of flips and stuff
.
There's not like a lot ofpeople want to go back on, but
it's more about the mythology ofit all versus like the
choreography and everything thatlightsaber fight is just
ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (30:48):
It's the three-way fight and, like ray park, is
perfectly yeah so killing darthmaul and yes, it is a grave.
I don't even I think killingdarth maul is worse than what
they did to boba fett and returnof jedi.
It's like he could have beenjust a trilogy villain yeah the,
the last fight on, you know,mustafar, or whatever should

(31:08):
have been a three-way fightthat's what I was gonna say.

Speaker 1 (31:11):
You literally have darth maul trying to prove
himself all trilogy long tosidious, being like I'm your guy
not this punk kid.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
And if you say, tell john williams, give us a duel of
fates to a new song that's justas hype but calls back to the
first one and you've got theback.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
You've got you've got obi-wan and mark dar.
Darth Maul, the blood feud forkilling his master, and Obi-Wan
struggling with that.
You've got Maul trying to fightoff Anakin being like I'm not
going to be replaced.

Speaker 2 (31:32):
This dude isn't on my level, it's the rule of two.
If Anakin takes the dark side,it's now.
I have to kill Darth Maul or bekilled by Darth.

Speaker 1 (31:38):
Maul.
It's the rule of two, and I getthe of hinting at the future of
Anakin in their own sort of way, but Darth Maul was too good
for this Earth.
Oh my gosh, it's so cool.

Speaker 3 (31:50):
Plus, the pacing in that scene is really cool too,
when the shields come down.
It's so good, it's so good.

Speaker 2 (31:55):
It's more than a sword fight.
It's just awesome.

Speaker 3 (31:57):
Yeah, you're just waiting.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
You're anticipating and it's also this it's like, I
think, in terms of a lightsaberbattle, it's the one time you're
, like the villain's literallythe best person here.
Yeah, he's literally the mostdangerous person.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
This is like the kung fu

Speaker 2 (32:14):
fight and Bruce Lee's waiting on the other side of
that thing pacing back and forth, and you're like, this guy's
going to kick my ass.
This sucks yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
You know, but he pulls out lost technically.
Yeah, yeah, it's him and vaderand empire I would say both of
them.
It's like because vader istoying with luke at that point,
really, because he knows he'slike this is my son, I'm not
gonna kill him, but I I'm kindof got to.
So, yeah, I'm glad we're allkind of on a similar page with
phantom I mean there's someappreciate that movie, but the
ending is did you, were you inthe room with us when we watched
the phantom?
Edit?

Speaker 2 (32:46):
maybe I.
I was in a house for a lot ofweird star wars things like.

Speaker 1 (32:49):
I remember the machete order, yeah, well, this,
this might predate the time welived together, but we watched
the phantom edit, which is a aeditor in hollywood has made it
put it together.
He took out all the yippies, hetook out a lot of jar jar antics
, took out a lot of the politictalk and it feels so good to
watch.
Like the first time.
You're expecting that Jar Jarthing and it doesn't happen and
it just.
We're just moving right alongand Jar Jar's still there.

(33:09):
It's not like he erased him,it's just that he's now
Chewbacca.
Yeah, oh, okay.
And you're like wow, this is somuch better.
And the most interesting thingbut not to get too caught on the
tangent is that by taking outthe yippies and stuff, he also
edits in the way that makesAnakin as a child less of like.
Oh shucks, I'm gonna.
We'll just see what happens.
I'm pushing buttons here too.
He's honing into the force.
When he gets into thestarfighter to take off, it's

(33:31):
like he suddenly goes wait, okay, yes, click, click, boom.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
And you're like oh, he's already figuring it out.
It's a call back to luke notlooking through the visor and
just taking the shot.
Yep, you know man and so, yeah,it's, it's, it's, it's that
stuff.
But like, oh the way, just thelast thing before we move on to
Marry or Kill or whatever, butthe pod racing.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
I get.
It's beloved To me.
It's like a whole episode ofsomething crammed into the
middle of a movie.

Speaker 1 (33:53):
That's fair.

Speaker 2 (33:54):
It's just like, wow, we really stuck with this whole
pod racing thing for a good 40minutes is, take it a minute,
all right.

Speaker 1 (34:09):
This is we put a fast and furious.
A lot of time was spent, yeah,on the tatooine sand.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
We can't get away from tatooine guys, I will give
you that, growing up in thedesert, that was the worst part
of watching.
That movie was just all thesand everywhere.

Speaker 1 (34:16):
I hated it it's coarse and it gets everywhere.
Well, speaking of things youhate, it's time to talk about
the kill are we going back inorder, are we?

Speaker 2 (34:26):
I don't care whoever wants to take, I'll go first
because I think I have a prettyuninspired answer.
Okay, take episode two or three.
I could care less.
I one or the other, they'reboth bad to me.
I don't love them and I don'thave any like new takes.
I hate them for the same reason.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
Everyone hates, or the people that hate them, hate
them yeah, yeah, which is peoplemy age you know for the most
people of the age yeah, um thatjust the prequels kind of just
fail.

Speaker 2 (34:48):
I think phantom menace was all right and I think
they just got worse as theywent, yeah, um I don't like
hayden christensen.
I'm pumped that he's gettinghis second shot, sure, at
redemption and I like that.
I think that's a bit more of alike.
I love that for the fandom liketo say let's give him another
shot it's more of an apologythan it is like a redemption, to
be honest and it's just.
He was fine.

(35:08):
And to me again, I think.
Sometimes I look at theprequels as pro wrestling.
It's like the performers justshow up and vince mcmahon tells
them what to do right and theydo what they can.

Speaker 1 (35:17):
George lucas wrote the stilted lines.
He gave the stilted blocking aperformance.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
They did the christians has proven to be a
perfectly capable actor, youknow.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
And so it's just like it's not his fault.

Speaker 2 (35:26):
No, it just sucks you know that like that's what he
got.
I don't think him and NataliePortman really had any chemistry
, but I just don't think NataliePortman has chemistry period in
any movie she's in.

Speaker 3 (35:35):
Hot take.
I'm not a fan.
That is a real hot take.

Speaker 2 (35:37):
Personally she's fine , it's whatever.
I just don't like those twomovies and the only original
thing I might say is they justdon't feel like Star Wars,
because, again, I'm an originaltrilogy kid.
I you know.
I was at that age when thatstupid gold VHS box set came out

(35:58):
that I think was in everybody'shome.

Speaker 3 (35:59):
That was the Darth Vader helmet.

Speaker 2 (36:01):
So we saw the original trilogy a few years
before this came out.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
And Star.

Speaker 2 (36:09):
Wars.
It's dirty space, it's likespace that's been lived in for a
long time.
Yeah, use future the.
The two new ones are like.
Episode two and three felt liketoo shiny.
It felt like it hadn't beenlived in that long everything
felt sleek and sexy, it felt Ididn't like it.
What was the cgi?
Yeah, it's the cgi.
Yeah, that's valid everything'stoo.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
They didn't learn how to put dirt on stuff it's a
little uncanny valley, yeah,type of thing.

Speaker 2 (36:28):
I feel like I'm in the worst, the worst offender of
those is attack the clones likelike it, it's fully.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
It's him fully doing mostly cgi stuff and that's a
burden on the actors who are notused to that and it's a burden
on just like the aesthetic likeyou're talking about with the
star wars universe and I lovethe man.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
I just don't know why the hell Samuel L Jackson's in
Star Wars movies.

Speaker 1 (36:48):
Cause he's Samuel L Jackson.
He's in everything.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
That took me out Like it's like.
That is mother effing Samuel LJackson sitting at the jet.
No, and he's just, and he'sSamuel L Jackson.
He's not putting on an accent,he's just.
I don't.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
I don't love it, I hate.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Mace Windu as a character and I don't like the
casting.

Speaker 1 (37:07):
I'm going to partially disagree.
And in this conversation therealso comes the idea of
representation, obviously, andstuff, and I think having a
strong Jedi character on theforefront that's played by a
popular actor.
If you had Denzel in that samespot, you might have the same
argument of like I can't removeDenzel, I can't remove denzel, I
can't remove will smith?

Speaker 2 (37:26):
from it.
Just give me the guy that playsjar jar and give him something
that's not so insulting that'sfair.
That's a dual role the thing,and then I'm not out of it and
then years later I'm like it'sthe same guy and that's fun so
instead it's just, he also got aredemptive moment he did.

Speaker 3 (37:38):
I heard that, yeah, that's cool, that's cool apology
tours I guess for me, eventhough, like I said, I did not
watch attack.
Honestly I think I've seenattack of the clones, maybe
twice, because I disliked it somuch the first time.
It's like it's just, if I'mgonna re-watch the, the entire
saga, I'm leaving out two movieslike hands down, I will not
re-watch them.
But so, but for me, I guess,with mace windu and just sam l

(37:58):
jackson, I didn't see any moviesthat he was in until I was
older, so for me it didn't bringme out of the moment at all.
I didn't think, oh, oh, wow,this is, that's Sam Jackson.
I mean I'd have to look throughhis filmography, but I can't
think of one movie I watchedbefore before the prequels oh
Jurassic Park, oh Jurassic.
Park Damn.

Speaker 2 (38:16):
I forgot he's in Jurassic Park.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
He is the only black man in Jurassic Park, that's so
embarrassing.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
Oh star wars, hey lando carissian's there lando
okay.
So so, other than jurassic park, I don't think god, here I am
calling myself a fan I don't, Ijust I, I don't, I don't know, I
just those two movies didn'tclick with me.
They felt like I felt likephantom menace was more star
wars than two and three.
I'll agree with that, I think.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
I think it hits when we talk about star wars, the
spirit of star wars, phantommenace still has it.
And then Attack of the Clones.
It slips up a lot, I think.
I personally think Revenge getsback on track a bit.
Attack of the Clones biggestissue to me is that everything
with Obi-Wan is interesting andengaging, but anything with the
romance between Padme and Anakinjust does not work because
they're so brutal and I I'vetold this to people before like,

(39:02):
had you given them action tolike develop their relationship
with each other.
Like, they're on the like abounty hunters chasing them.
They're on the run.
They have to go hide out inTatooine again for some reason,
because no one seems to lookthere, but I think that would
have been more engaging.
It's the outer rim, nick.
All right, I guess nothing'sout there.
Tatooine Jakku, where thebounty?

Speaker 3 (39:21):
hunters go, man, it's all the desert plan because no
one wants them.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
That's true, you know , the spice must flow, the only
time the Empire goes there'sbecause they just know there's
two droids there and you cantell those.
Why is it always you two?
And you can tell it's like thestormtroopers are just like.
I hate this assignment.

Speaker 3 (39:40):
It's like the whole combing the desert and space
balls.
Exactly, they're like thissucks.

Speaker 2 (39:47):
Like 1-8-8 and 2-4-7.
You're going to Tantrum.

Speaker 3 (39:50):
Ah, damn it we have found shit.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
I'm going to request you go next for your kill no,
nick's got something to say.

Speaker 3 (40:01):
I'm killing.
Rise of Skywalker hands down noquestions asked.
That's without a doubt, becausehere's the deal.
So Attack of the Clones was myleast favorite one.
Like I said, I have onlywatched it maybe two or three
times since it came out intheaters.
Rise of skywalker okay, rise ofskywalker was, oh, I don't even
know like where to start withit was, or it's plugging his

(40:24):
ears I'm so sorry.
Here's the deal.
First off, if you enjoyed thefilm, like sit, like genuinely,
I'm happy for you, like I, Idon't I don't want it to seem
like I'm just crapping on it,but I it backtracked so many
things that had been establishedin the previous two movies, and
that is something that I, Idon't know.
It felt like a slap in the faceto those of us who did enjoy
the last jedi.

(40:44):
Um, I know it.
It felt like the researchwasn't done.
It felt like Disney was like ohno, we did something that
people don't like and so we'regoing to need to bring JJ Abrams
back and figure this out, andit just oh man Reaction yeah.
It was an overreaction.
It didn't feel like.
Jj is not the greatest atcoming up with endings, it just

(41:04):
I.
I can't stand it.
I have seen it once.
It was in the theaters and Ihave not seen it yet since, like
even just preparing for this, Iwas trying to think do I
actually want to re-watch it?
And instead I just read theWikipedia synopsis because I
have no interest in re-watchingit, plus the fact that JJ I mean
at one point they do the whole,they've lied now and they even
say like I mean they have flownbefore it.

(41:25):
Just, it just just felt likethere wasn't enough research
done, there wasn't enough loveby JJ Abrams.
I don't know, I don't know,that's just yeah.
Rise of Skywalker, I'm killingthat.
All right, now make your turn.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
Sorry.
I didn't know you were bothgoing to do this, but fun.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
So, Corey, I'm just going to straight up be like I
apologize, Like last.

Speaker 2 (41:46):
I mean, the attack of the clones is a movie.
Guys Like we, y'all can kill it, please.
How is the attack of the clonesnot going to be on this damn
list?

Speaker 1 (41:53):
The thing about attack of the clones Corey.
Is that it's bad, but itfollows a plan.
Yes, I guess, and it there'sthere's an intention there, it's
it's being consistent in someform of telling the story with
the rest of the movies of thattrilogy.
There's a lot that can beforgiven, especially after
watching the last movie.

(42:14):
So before I really say what Igotta say, go for I'm gonna
fully admit and first offapologize to cory.
I did not mean for him to sit inthis chair, just have to take
this um, and I'm gonna admit youknow when, when this movie came
out, it was a tumultuous periodof my life.
I'm not gonna dive too far intothat, but it's there and even
after five years, with more timeto kind of sit and process it.

(42:35):
This is just my honest,subjective opinion.
That episode nine, rise ofskywalker, is, in my very humble
personal opinion, everythingwrong with modern franchise
filmmaking.
It's a rush production, anoverreaction to the divisive
nature of last jedi, like aliwas talking about.
I feel like they played it safeand catered to the worst parts

(42:55):
of the fan base that we'vetouched upon.
Ouch, um, cool again.
Again, I, I I'm excluding coryfrom this because your take is
different than most people'stakes, because a lot of people
either love last jedi or theyhate it, and there's this schism
that occurred and those samepeople flipped.
They loved rise of skywalker orthey and they hated last jedi,
kind of thing.

(43:15):
But where, with the last jedi,I felt like it was trying to
challenge its audience and movethe franchise and the genre
forward, rise of skywalker, just, it just relied on nostalgia
fan service and it just triedand failed to please as many
demographics at once.
Like all that aside it's, it'salso just a failure of
storytelling to me, like thestakes are non-existent.
Multiple times characters arekilled off, just to come back

(43:37):
minutes later mcguffins justdon't make sense to me, like
they come out of nowhere, orlike the logic and time frame of
them don't come together.
Plot twist and characterchanges or about faces are just
there for shock value.
It feels like, and without anyconsideration to the story and
characters themselves, and a lotof new characters introduced
just to sell toys, which I get.
I get that this is a sci-fiadventure series for all ages,

(43:59):
like we talked about with theprequels.
It's generally geared to kids.
They're going to sell the toysand pleasing every Star Wars fan
is impossible, but it's justthe way that this film, in my
opinion, almost makes everywrong choice possible and
intentionally tears down all thepossibilities and the new
ground that Last Jedi laid outbefore.
It is as incredible as it isheartbreaking for me.

(44:22):
You asked me earlier how closeis this series to me.
I think I would be lying if Ididn't say there was a part of
me that is a star wars kid, thatit's very integrated into me
and I think now you're trying tofor me now, like I was the
franchise kid, back to thefuture indiana jones, star wars,
all of the above pirates,matrix, lord, rings after it.
I was a franchise guy and thiswas a point in my life where

(44:42):
basically, like the best way Ican explain it is like the last
shoti was fresh.
It made me feel like a kidagain, like there's.
It felt like star wars, as Iremembered as a child, and rise
of skywalker kind of just rippedmy heart out, stomped on it and
said you're gonna like yourregurgitated steroid ripoff of
return of the jedi and like it.
Apologies to you, cory, I'm sosorry that's fair okay that's

(45:06):
fair so I know that ali was like.
I'm sorry to all the fans thatlike it everyone except cory.
I have no apologies for you ohwell okay, all right because I
know you have a different takefrom it I'll get to and we get
to marry okay, very cool, verycool.
So are we done with our killsat this point in time?
I I think we've coveredEverybody's said theirs, right,

(45:27):
you said the two Episode, two orthree we said those Okay, yeah
so let's try to move positivelyin this direction.

Speaker 2 (45:34):
Which one's our favorite?
Which one's the best?
Yeah, which one's the best?
I haven't gone first.
Should I go first?

Speaker 1 (45:39):
You went first last time.
I went first first.
I'm very torn and that's myproblem with my mary um.
It's between.
It's between like being likeold school and wanting to say
empire and wanting, and but thenpart of me also tugging at the
heartstrings of last jedi.
I'm torn between the two of themand I think that they're both
like the top tier of of this ofthe series yeah empire I think

(46:02):
is the most consistent frombeginning to end and I think
that it nails the entire idea ofa sci-fi fantasy like because
before this you have buck,rogers, flash gordon and it's
george lucas trying to bring it.
It's kind of it does what lordof the rings did for fantasy
movies to me it's almost likesequels are fucking good.

Speaker 2 (46:20):
It's almost like why do people think I'm weird for
loving sequels?
It's like and thinking themiddle movie of every franchise
is awesome well it.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
It highlights all the points that you always make in
our defense of the sequels.
These episodes you should watchand listen to.
Um is that once you get thefirst movie out of the way, the
world building, you're allowedto play in the sandbox.
The characters are established,the world is established and
now it's all about character anddevelopment but I think and
that's, but that's why everyonealways says this is the empire,

(46:49):
strikes back of the of theseries.
This is the the godfather to thecity, like they're always
hearkening back to this one.
Because it does, it's it.
It heightens the genre, itmakes it something serious to be
taken seriously and it allowsfor us to move forward beyond
what the normal happenstances of.
What came before you had yourflash.
Gordon's planet of the apes,for all its benefit, was a bunch
of dudes in like some very notso aged well masks, ape masks,

(47:12):
basically.
Like you can't.
It's hard to watch those andreally remove your brain from it
a lot of the time.
But with with the original starwars and especially empire
strikes back, you're like you'rein it, you're in the world.
They have nailed the aesthetic,they have nailed the characters
and they and this also allowedthem to expand on the mythology
and the religion of the jedi andthe force.
So you're just getting all thebest pieces of star wars, I
think now are you being apolygamist and trying to marry

(47:33):
both?
carmy wants to.
But that's.
But that's the car.
It's like it does everythingright and last jedi is so bold
and what it's trying to do it'sit's also it's taking the steps
from empire and everything thatcomes after it and trying to go
okay, we've done this song anddance.
Let's go in a differentdirection.
Let's talk, let's move.
Let's introduce a lot ofdifferent themes and ideas to

(47:54):
our Star Wars, to our sciencefiction beyond, just like
spaceships and stuff andmythology building and heroes
journey aspects.
With Last Jedi you're talking.
The theme generally is aboutfailure and learning to grow
from that and our mistakes ofthe past.
Empire is a lot about sacrifice.
Han solo sacrifices himselftwice at the beginning to save
luke in the in this in thewinter storm and then to turn

(48:15):
himself in the carbonite andthen the friends sacrifice
themselves to get han back withthe problem with last jedi.
I think it's a great film,obviously with my take on uh
rise of skywalker standing.
I think that, like cory talkedabout um with Phantom Menace,
with the pod racing, I think thethe casino world canto bite.
I think it's issue is that it'sthat piece.

(48:36):
It's like this feels like anepisode of a thing.
Corey put it best Like.
It feels like an episode fromsome outlier thing that could
happen, yeah, I appreciate thata B story for Finn and like his
arc that was going on becausethe Enforce Awakens.
He's very much like just therunaway.
He just wants to get away andthe only reason he comes back is
to save his friends and LastJedi.
It truly affirms his status asa rebel leader and resistance

(48:57):
member because he was alreadytrying to run away just to save
Rey or go find her and it'sthrough that process of his B
story that we get him finallycommitting to the cause.
But that's everything elseabout that movie is pitch
perfect nails it.
I don't care what your takesare on Force abilities and stuff
or the fact that they kill offthird-tier characters like
Admiral Ackbar.
He's a fun alien creature.

(49:18):
He's not Han Solo, guys, I'msorry.
He's not even Boba Fett.

Speaker 3 (49:22):
Were people actually upset about that.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
People were online being like I can't believe they
killed off Admiral Ackbar justlike that.
He literally has one line inthe original trilogy he's a fun
meme, guys.
He's a fun meme.

Speaker 2 (49:30):
He has the line in the original trilogy.

Speaker 1 (49:33):
Okay, okay.

Speaker 2 (49:35):
First of all, next to I am your father.
It's a trap, is it?

Speaker 3 (49:39):
That's going to be.
The one thing that people comeafter me for is just that one.

Speaker 1 (49:42):
How dare you disrespect the Lord and Savior?

Speaker 2 (49:43):
respect their lord and savior admiral akbar, I just
I'm no, I think like I don'tknow why I didn't know people
were mad about admiral.
I feel like it's more of anexample of like you go down like
a g man, yeah it's more of anexample of just like what do we
need anything credit celebrating?

Speaker 1 (49:55):
no, it goes down my issues my issues with rise of
skywalker really come down tostorytelling elements versus
like x wings can't do that.

Speaker 3 (50:03):
You know what I mean yeah, well, I'm yeah, yeah,
because again, we're talkingabout a fictional story in space
yeah where planes shouldn't bedoing this anyway.
Yes, exactly so you're supposedto suspend your belief and just
?

Speaker 2 (50:15):
have fun and I get about space wizards, people,
right.
Thank you, yeah, yeah exactly,I mean and I get that.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
There's a world building where you're like
you've established rules withinyour world, but there's, if
anything, the last jedi and evenrise of skywalker.
I will say there is pieces ofit that continue to expand on
powers of the force, yeah, andthings of that nature, and
that's okay.
It's okay every people do.
In phantom menace, they weredoing flips.
They never did in the originaltrilogy because we didn't have
the technology to do it, youknow.

(50:41):
So if I'm gonna, I will play, Iwill play the old school person
and I will stick with empire.
So I leave you two to play fromthere.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
Allie, would you like to go next?
Would you like to go last?
It's up to you.

Speaker 3 (50:55):
Mine is pretty much just piggybacking off of Nick,
so it's whatever.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
So it is Empire.
So, it's Empire.

Speaker 3 (51:03):
No, it's not Empire.
I was kind of struggling withthe same thing which hot take?
I prefer Return of the Jediover Empire, but I was trying to
decide between that and LastJedi.
And you know what?
The Last Jedi is morerewatchable for me.
Now, I'm not saying it's aperfect movie, and I know that's
kind of the whole point aboutMary is that it's your favorite
of the entire series.
I don't think it's the bestmovie out of the entire saga.

(51:25):
I'll be fully honest about that.
However, I enjoy it the most.
It is so good.
It has some of my favoritescenes wars, the entire scene of
of luke and yoda I'm gettingchills just thinking about it
where you know, talking aboutthe, the sacred texts and all of
that kind of stuff.
It's such a beautiful momentwith and, and and.
It was also the puppet, wasn'tit?

Speaker 1 (51:43):
I just watched it last night.
I should remember this.

Speaker 3 (51:44):
Yeah, they went practical, which I thought was
awesome.
It also has some of my favoriteshots of all time, like when um
, oh, is it general hoda's?
Is laura dern's character?
Is that?

Speaker 1 (51:53):
her Holdo Okay.

Speaker 3 (51:55):
I'm also really terrible with names, so y'all
please forgive me, but when shedoes, when she goes into
hyperspeed, and destroys theship it's so freaking cool, Like
it's just.
The shots are really neat, theplanets are really cool.
The ending with Kylo Ren andLuke Skywalker projecting him
which, by the way, an hour inspoiler alert, but um, no, it

(52:15):
just I I enjoy it a lot now,granted, it does have its flaws
and I'm more than willing totalk about that.
The whole casino sequence I'mnot a fan of.
I also feel like ryan johnsonum, kind of messed up finn's
storyline because in in this inthe force awakens.
He is this runaway, you know,he's this self-aware runaway
stormtrooper and I thought thatwould be really interesting to
to try and expand on and heended up not really going

(52:38):
anywhere.
Same with phasma that wasanother, because she's killed.
Snoke was another one, althoughthat scene in the red room is
pretty freaking cool yeah I meanit's got.
It's got its issues.
It's not perfect, but I I it'sthe one I rewatched the most
yeah, finn is.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
Finn is definitely as great as the kylo ren storyline
is.
In those trilogies I think finnis probably the biggest ball
drop yes, of that trilogy I'dagree especially considering
where they were gonna go with itwith the original script and
stuff before they.
Before jj took over um, whereit was really gonna hype, bring
it all full circle, where he isbasically leading a resistance
of stormtroopers, it all comesback around.

(53:13):
But yeah, I I agree with you onall those points.

Speaker 2 (53:16):
I don't think it's like a perfect movie by any
means, but there's so many highsthat are so great about it yeah
cory so I'm like going to marryempire, like empire's, the
movie, it's, it's, it's just,it's the perfect star wars movie
, yeah, um, so there's no newground there, like to say.
But I'll say this I think it'stied with the rise of skywalker

(53:37):
for me, in terms of just movies.

Speaker 1 (53:39):
I enjoy star wars movies I really I out of pure
curiosity.
I want you to expand on that.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
So yeah, I would like a chance to just at least say
why I like the rise of skywalker.
Um, and I again, I just likethe whole trilogy yeah I was a
very like unicorn of a star warsfan, I feel like when this
trilogy was happening, because Ileft the theater happy three
times yeah and I feel like I wasthe only one and um and so I
left force awakens and it was uh, it was just showers of well.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
They just remade new hope and it's like, yeah, but
it's cool the thing about forceawakens was that we it was again
like we talked about, it wasresetting the table palette,
cleanser, going, and we all kindof had this agreement walking
out going.
Yes, we're aware it's a newhope all over again, but with
the promise that there's goingto be new stuff with these new
characters exactly I liked itand then I left last jedi and I
feel like everyone was crappingon it.

Speaker 2 (54:26):
You know, I don't I'm not saying y'all did, I just
feel like I remember a lot ofnegativity around last yeah,
there was because in my opinion,a lot of the reasons you see
guys seem to hate rise ofSkywalker is because it went on
its own path.
After last Jedi, I felt likeeverybody hated last Jedi
because it did not follow.
Force awakens in any trajectory.
Ryan Johnson, in my opinion,made an incredible standalone

(54:47):
star Wars movies that does notfit the trilogy.
It's diehard two, in my opinion, diehard one and three.
They're connected.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
And diehard two is 2 is a standalone movie that I
still love and think it's great,because it's still Die Hard and
I feel like Last Jedi is itsown thing.
Again, the only thread I seemto really think that they got
right through the whole thing isKylo Ren.
Kylo Ren's the thread thatkeeps a trilogy that kind of
goes here, then it goes way offtrack, then it tries to come
back on a track and so it'sreally jumbled.

(55:17):
But kylo ren's the thing thatlike holds it together.
It seems like every othercharacter got, rewritten, got
they didn't know where to gowith it.
It's like I don't know if it'sbecause oscar isaacs became a
bigger deal while these movieswere being made that they said
let's move away from finn andlike, really give oscar a thing
you know more screen time.
I really don't know yeah um I.

Speaker 1 (55:34):
Apparently he was supposed to be killed off, like
when he crashes in Force Awakens, like that was supposed to be
it, like it was going to be aone-off thing.

Speaker 2 (55:40):
But it seems like he's the guy that leads the
rebellion.
Yeah, you know and maybe tookFinn's spot in that story, and a
lot of people a lot of peoplewant to place him as like their,
their, attempt at Hanick of TopGun.
Yeah, he's Maverick, he's notHan Solo.
No, I don't think the movietried to replicate Han Solo,

(56:02):
which I thought was a good move.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
No, it's like that's smart that is, I would say the
secret ingredient to theoriginal trilogy is Han Solo,
because without his irreverent,cynical, rogue, kind of acting
as the audience surrogate, youknow, because luke's supposed to
be the everyman but he goesthrough this growth and process
but you needed someone with allthis self-serious mythology, the
hero's journey stuff and theworld building, someone that

(56:23):
just is more relatable to a 70saudience to go.
Yeah, this is all kind of dumb.
Can we just shoot our way out?

Speaker 2 (56:28):
yeah, and I'll say this rise of skywalker, everyone
hates the emperor thing yeaheveryone hate the second, the
music hit and the dead lives andthe voice from I heard a
collective groan in the theatereverybody's like what the hell,
is this you?
know, and I'm just like clearlythey didn't play fortnite, just
like I'm, I'm, I'm gonna rollwith this, all right, and uh,

(56:50):
and maybe what it is is.
It's like kind of like you guyslike the whole darth vader
scene and revenge of the sith,all these nods to Frankenstein.
That's why I like everythingwith the Emperor here.
It is some of the coolest shots, I feel like.
I feel like Exegol's probablythe coolest set piece in the
newest trilogy.
It's dark, it looks like ahorror movie.
Every time you're in that roomit's just gritty and gross and I
love it.
I like the lightning, also oneof the coolest shots in Star

(57:11):
Wars, and it's like, yeah, itdid, they hit a weird reset, and
I don't necessarily know whythey hit a weird reset on it.
I just like all three movies,but I think Last Jedi is the one
that like doesn't fit.
It's just a really great movieon its own.
So, but because Kylo Ren's inall three, I think they connect
enough that I'm happy with it.
Yeah but it's like yeah, I don'tknow, I really like them.

(57:35):
I also to me.
When people talk aboutnostalgia, I get confused
sometimes.
I'm not a nostalgia guy, butsome people are really into it.
They're like well, I hated Riseof Skywalker because it's just
fan service and it's justnostalgia.
Then those same people sayStranger Things is great because
I love the 80s.
It's like I'd pick a lane.
I don't know, I hate StrangerThings because it's just too fan

(57:55):
.
Pick a lane, I don't know.
I hate stranger things becauseit's just.

Speaker 1 (57:57):
It is too.
It is a heightened 80 like yeahbecause it's like when we had
an 80s dance in college and allthe people wearing the miami
vice stuff and then the strangerthings look, but then, like you
and I think your friend ethancox, showed up in crop tops and
and jeans and stuff and somebodythat was from the 80s went.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
You guys are actually off, oh yeah we were, yeah, we
were Like just ripped jeans andIron Maiden shirts.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
And Brandon Brister, who was in high school in the
80s, was like you guys actuallylook like the metal shop kids
from the 80s.

Speaker 1 (58:20):
Yeah right, yeah, we're like yeah, no to kind of I
going to come after our heroesand then they went for the whole

(58:41):
slow chase, kind of pulled bythe string idea.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
The Knights of Ren is .
I think it's a.
I think it's probably one ofthe biggest miscues.
Yeah, the original trilogy,because they're very, very like.
Again, that's possibly yourBoba Fett right there.

Speaker 1 (58:53):
Right, like they're seriously want more.
Like.
Why are they not just sent on apath?
Why is there not a spinoff ofthe Knights of Ren?
Yeah, exactly Like.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
why are they just not sent.
Yeah, you know like.

Speaker 1 (59:02):
And you could have even used them, like in the Red
Throne room scene.
I was watching that last night,going like why are these red
guys?

Speaker 3 (59:10):
Why not just the?

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Knights.
I think we've talked about JJ'smystery box of storytelling,
where he likes to present a lotof questions and then allow
someone else to fill in theblanks, and that's what he did
with Lost Generally what he'sdone with most of his creative
projects.

Speaker 2 (59:22):
Well, I always said he's not good with endings.
He likes to build something andthen kind of walk away from it.
Yeah, he kind of struggles withthat and like hey, I think
Cloverfield is one of thegreatest things I've ever seen.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:32):
Cloverfield Lane was weird and it's supposed to
connect the Cloverfield Paradoxor whatever they did.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
Oh, I forgot about that one.

Speaker 2 (59:37):
That's horrible, that's garbage.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
That's because they just bought it and put
Cloverfield on it, and that'sthe thing, though I'm just
saying it's like he doesn't havea great track record.
It's weird that they went withhim for the third movie.

Speaker 2 (59:50):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
And I get the mentality like well, force
awakens was a two billion dollarmovie and people hated last
jedi, so let's go back to whatworks.
It's just a studio, yeah, yeahbut if you're, but from a
storytelling, filmmaking mindset, you're like who can we?
As we've learned, completingtrilogies is a very hard task.

Speaker 3 (01:00:08):
Yeah, it's hard, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
But like, but in in hindsight's 2020 peter jackson
ended up by giving me eightendings.
I was ready to go home.
Now hold on.

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
But my point is why do you go for the guy that
clearly the only thing he'sfinished is Felicity?

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
I think the new trilogy suffers also from two
things.
Star Wars fans like to befantasy bookers because we've
done it with all three trilogiesso far.
Darth Maul should have lived,boba Fett should have been more
of a thing in the originaltrilogy, blah, blah, blah.
And then I think, once thesenew trilogies hit dude, we are
deep in the internet and we'rejust not going to be satisfied.
We're all going to think we cando it better.
And again, if you had kept TR8R alive, if you had just gone

(01:00:46):
with the whole internet thingand fan-serviced that, that
gives Finn a villain and it feltvillain because they were bros,
you know, and one is sold outto the First Order and the other
one's leading the rebellion.
Like that's way better thancashing in on this Game of
Thrones kind of tie-in.
Let's get this actress in andnever show her face.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
It just shows again like the lack of planning from
one to three.
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
It is that.
But I'll also say this itsuffers because for some reason,
the same company's made a 10year, 22 film, perfect franchise
for the most part, and theycouldn't get Star Wars like
between three movies, like ascohesive.
And I think it suffers from that.
Just from comparison, Like it'sjust, I think people were like

(01:01:29):
oh man, like just let KevinFeige over here in Star Wars
world and let him he Star Warsworld and let him.
He seems to think big, whereaswith Star Wars they're kind of
like just director whoeverwhoever wants it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
It was a weird concept.
Go ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
Oh, I was just gonna say that's a really interesting
point too.
I never thought about thatbecause Endgame came out in 2019
, didn't it?
Yeah, yeah.
So I mean, you've got a reallyvalid point there.
I had never really thoughtabout that yeah, we're getting
like a satisfying ending, yeah,which was, I mean, one of the
greatest?
I mean, I would argue, one ofthe greatest endings to, I mean,
it's endgame is it's got it.
Well, I'm not gonna go there,but I never, I never thought
about rise of skywalker andendgame coming out in the same

(01:02:00):
year.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
You also think about that.
They promoted the rise ofskywalker as not just the end of
the new trilogy but, the end ofthe entire thing without
acknowledging the prequeltrilogy which again it was still
in that kind of we hate theprequel trilogy mindset and then
.
But my thing to really touch, Idon't, I don't, I don't like to
get into the nitty-gritty likelore type stuff.
But I will say one thing aboutthe emperor part is that him

(01:02:23):
coming back in my opinionnegates a lot of original
trilogy stuff in the sense thatluke and vader were the ones to
kind of establish balance in theforce.
My hope for the new trilogy wasthat we were.
It was going to be anaffirmation.
A lot of times they talk aboutrevolutions in historical
context and oftentimes it takestwo revolutions for permanent
change to happen yeah and so,rather than like a physical

(01:02:45):
manifestation of that, it wasmore like a balance in the force
where ray represents it of no,the jedi and the sith are both
extremes and there's a, there'sa balance of that philosophy
yeah, and I and I, I, I like,accept that, I think it's, it's,
it's you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
You could argue that, yeah, it feels like it undoes,
like the gratification return ofthe jedi on some degree, um,
but at the same time I alwaysjust kind of go back like what
else would it would have theyhad done if they had just done?
Ray is another jedi going backand forth between the dark and
the light side.
We would have just been likedude, we've seen this, we've
seen it twice now like it's ohso it's like they tried
something yeah you know my, youknow it's for me it's like also,

(01:03:23):
and like I should say that thisis a really important thing
also in this conversation isthat I'm at this table probably
the least of the Star Warspeople.
I like Star Wars movies, but Idon't.
They're not my thing.
Like it's like I don't they'renot my thing Like it's not like.
I don't like.
I grew up with them but I nevergot into like an over fandom of
it I just think they're good.
They're great, it's funstorytelling.
I think they tell a cool story.
So like you, you two, that like, maybe, like as children, like

(01:03:44):
really grasp onto it.
To me it's just another thingyou know Like and I.
It's just like I had a lot offun in that movie.
It's like I'm not as connectedto like the lore and the
storytelling as much as justlike.

Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
This is a lot of fun.
You know what your problem,cory, is.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
You have too much of a healthy look on filmmaking in
star wars, but it's just howdare you and I my favorite
moment, I think in all threemovies, is when the, the ship,
show up at the end.
Like that's a feel good momentfor me.
I'm like this is great.
And Wedge Antilles is there.
Man, wedge Antilles, he's there, he's like 80 and he's, he's
fighting.
And I'm like this is great.
This is the best connectionI've seen to the original

(01:04:28):
trilogy in a franchise thatkeeps trying to reconnect is one
shot of wedge antilles showingup at the end.
He is still flying an x-wingand he's still kicking ass.

Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
That's ali, do you have any?
I I feel like we're taking overthe conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:04:41):
No, no, you're perfectly fine.
It's like I said, I've onlyseen it once, so I'm trying to
remember everything.
But yeah, yeah, I mean, andyour and your opinions are
totally valid too, just like Iknow that you mentioned that for
us don't say that ali don'tpatronize, listen, I know nick
not going to be on.
For me, your feelings are valid,because here's the deal is that
it's a movie that you reallyenjoy.
It's a movie that that you knowhas its issues, you're aware of

(01:05:01):
its issues and you know you'reallowed to enjoy what you enjoy
for the most part, which shouldbe our PSA to all Star Wars fans
.
Just enjoy it, just try toenjoy it have fun with it.

Speaker 2 (01:05:12):
I hate Rogue One, and that's like that became one of
the most beloved Star Warsmovies.

Speaker 3 (01:05:16):
I hate it.
I hate every second of it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:18):
You know what, though , I take back?

Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
about opinions, but guess what?
It's the best representation ofDarth Vader than any other
movie.
I will agree with that.
That movie got Darth.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
Vader in 15 seconds better than any other movie.
So good, he's a monster.

Speaker 1 (01:05:31):
Here's the thing, too , about that is from a from a
fanboys perspective, from ayoung kid growing up loving it.
Prequels felt like they took alot of the venom out of the
Darth Vader character.
With Rogue One getting to seethat, that was me being giddy
again.
Taron and everyone that went towatch it will be like.
Nick looked like a crazy personbecause he was excited that
Darth Vader was murdering peopleyou got to see him in his prime

(01:05:52):
.

Speaker 3 (01:05:53):
You got to see why he's so he's so like, why people
are so terrified of him and whyhe has such a reputation.
It's great.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
The last kind of note generally I want to lead into,
like, my stance on Star Wars.
Now, like now we've had thislegacy, sequels, series come out
and we've had all thesespinoffs and stuff, and we see
that replicated through thingslike Ghostbusters like Jurassic
Park.
See that replicated throughthings like Ghostbusters like
Jurassic Park.
It's become very watered downto me, like to see it's no
longer exciting to see MichaelKeaton in the bat suit, to see

(01:06:22):
Bill Murray in the Ghostbustersoutfit and they keep trying to
be like, give that literally theGhostbusters new movies trailer
is just the Force Awakenstrailer, the music, the tone and
everything's like remember thisit's like guys, they're,
they're comedians that werefighting ghosts in New York City
.
Guys like yeah, but guys,they're comedians that were
fighting ghosts in New York City.
Guys.
But now with Star Wars, where Isit with it, I try to enjoy it.
I do the last movie removed alot of times with these spinoffs

(01:06:43):
with Mandalorian I've toldAllie and I think I've told you
this before I have to treat itlike it's a Saturday morning
cartoon In the sense that I'menjoying it.
I'm not trying to think toodeeply with it so that when
there are episodes that aregreat and just like some in
ahsoka or like that, you getamando and stuff, or or like the
series, or kenobi or the uh,the other series, my brain's
andor I haven't seen that oneyet basically so when it, when

(01:07:06):
it, when it hits those momentswith me that connect, I'm like
this is really great, it's great.
But when it's modern star wars,I'm not upset about it as much
so I have have to, I'm just likewell, it's just fun.

Speaker 3 (01:07:16):
And that's generally how.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
I have to try to look at it.

Speaker 3 (01:07:17):
Yeah, and a lot of it is for kids.
That's the other thing, too,that I think that a lot of
people tend to forget is thatyou know, especially the
prequels, like those, are forkids.

Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
Like you know, it's kind of like wasn are different,
whereas there's a whole new.

Speaker 3 (01:07:36):
I mean, I'm fairly certain my nephews love the
sequel trilogy.
I'm never, ever going to tellthem you're wrong, Right.
You know nothing like that, andyou know that's going to be
their prequels.

Speaker 1 (01:07:45):
you know, and then you know We'll wait until
they're 20, and then we can letthem down slowly.

Speaker 3 (01:07:49):
Yeah, not going to crush their dreams.

Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
I mean, you're right, we're in franchise fatigue,
which is why we do this very sexkill episode is because we get
to talk.
There's franchises with nineplus movies and ten and it's
just like all right, let's talkabout it.
It's like once upon a time,only porn in horror had like
anything that went past threeyou know like and so, and now
we're at this age where it'slike dude, we're on the 30th
marvel movie yeah, that's beenbeing the same story being told

(01:08:15):
since 2008.
It's weird.
Why is Indiana Jones still athing?
I don't know.
But then again, I didn't likehim in the 80s, so I don't like
him as an 80-year-old.

Speaker 1 (01:08:28):
I think there's the legacy idea of trying to
integrate all those formercharacters into the story, but
you're not recasting them.
And Jeff Goldblum, bill Murray,they're all 70 and 80 now.
Characters into the story, yeah, but you're not recasting them.
And jeff goldblum, bill murray,they're all 70 and 80 now yeah
and you can't do a lot with anine, almost 90 year old
harrison ford yeah, that's, yeah, I go ahead, I was gonna bring
up.

Speaker 3 (01:08:45):
No, that's the.
That's the problem with thejurassic world series.
Without like getting too intoit, is that the last.
You know, the last movie, whichI'm not gonna get super into.
But I mean, they brought backsam neill, laura dern and jeff
goldblum, but then they tried tointegrate them and tried to
write this script that wasgeared towards a younger
audience, but it just didn'twork.
It didn't work with theircharacters.
Yeah it, the movie didn't work,in my opinion and that's I.

Speaker 1 (01:09:04):
You know, it's that whole franchise there's also
like this idea of like treatingthose characters with such
reverence and a fear of actuallykilling them off yeah they do
kill han solo, luke and Leia inthe new trilogy, but a lot of
times, like in those otherfranchises, they just won't.

Speaker 3 (01:09:19):
And you end up with nine characters or like stranger
things.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
At the end there's 20 people and it's like how did
you all survive this?
There's dinosaurs and literalthings from another dimension.

Speaker 2 (01:09:26):
Yeah, exactly, and I think we're just in an age where
it's like they still like thepop you know Like it's Stone,
stone cold, glass breaking andyou want the people and like
there for a while.
It's like that was a thing it'slike when a character showed up
.
It's like you lost your mind.
Now it's not shocking anymorewhen like luke skywalker, comes
in at the end of one of themando seasons it's like it's not
exciting.

Speaker 1 (01:09:45):
It's like oh okay, it's luke skywalker but I will
say a lot of it is also itspresentation.
Yeah, you're forcing yeah,you're forcing mark hamill into
it.
Yeah, so, instead of givingSebastian Stan or just a new no
name face like, this is our newLuke Skywalker.
We're going to ride with himbecause he's a great actor.
It's.
It's giving less opportunitiesfor new stories, for new actors,
for new ideas to be presentedwhen we keep relying on the same

(01:10:05):
franchises that we've loved.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
But we need to let them be where they are thing,
you know, and I think they canstill get it right.
You know, at times it's weird.
We all went to the newspider-man knowing, knowing that
andrew garfield and tobymcguire were going to show up,
right, yeah it's still a special, like I don't know how I did.
It's still special.
It was still cool seeing itright again.

(01:10:27):
It's the only time I've likedtoby mcguire.
Spider-man is literally in thismovie I didn't like it in the
first one, but this one feltspecial and it felt like, oh my
gosh, he's like actually gettingto like he's got meat in this
role in this one and it's, it'sawesome and so I think it's yeah
, it's just about execution,yeah absolutely.
You know I it is what it is starwars is like.
It's now in that phase where,for sure, the fan base is never
going to be happy because,they're having to create new

(01:10:49):
stories and new stuff why can'tthey be more like you're?
Gonna have to go away liketrackies, love it all yeah no
matter what bullcrap nonsensethey throw at the wall they
enjoy it unanimously.
They, just they.
And I tried watching the nextgeneration like during
quarantine and that is a weird,effing show.
It made no sense we're gonnaupset the star wars fans and the

(01:11:10):
trackies of the same everybodymy thing is like that's great
that people love it, but I waslike what is happening, like
this, I have no idea what wasgoing on.
Just three episodes in it'slike it jumped the shark eight
times and this goes on for likenine seasons and I was like what
is happening.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
If there's anything all Star Wars fans can agree on,
it's their hate for Star Trek.

Speaker 2 (01:11:27):
Right, but I mean, it is what it is.

Speaker 1 (01:11:39):
And I think at this point you just have to accept
like you're gonna, like you wantmore stories in this universe,
or just stop watching and enjoywhat you like.
That's already exists.
Exactly the best point someonemade uh, patrick williams,
youtube guy that I like to watcha lot of he's.
He uh uses comic books as ametaphor.
He's like when he watches amovie that he doesn't like in
the star wars thing, he justgoes.
It's kind of like when hewatches a run of spider-man or
something just goes.
That's just not canon in myhead.
I'm just choosing not to acceptthat.

Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
So Boba Fett is Darth Vader's half-brother.
When I watch Empire StrikesBack, that's canon in my head.
It makes those scenes more good.

Speaker 3 (01:12:04):
I've never heard that before.

Speaker 2 (01:12:05):
I'm gonna have to rewatch it with that mindset.
It's like weird Star Warsmythology and again.

Speaker 3 (01:12:09):
I've never gotten into the ideas.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
that just never got through all the way, and my
thing is I watched like thefirst two seasons of Mando and I
liked it I, but at the sametime I just never sat down and
watched three because I just Ididn't even watch Book of Boba
Fett and I've been a proponentof that guy being brought back
to life.

Speaker 1 (01:12:30):
Corey's the biggest Boba Fett.
Yeah, like forever, but it'sjust like I'm not interested in.
I watched the first episode, Ithink.

Speaker 2 (01:12:34):
And stuff like that, and I think that's why I watched
Mando, because they had thehelmet show up with Timmy
Olyphant's character.

Speaker 1 (01:12:39):
The episode with him and Robert Rodriguez directed.
It is probably all you needed.
I was in it.

Speaker 2 (01:12:44):
And then, once Boba Fett came back, I feel like that
was closure for me with StarWars.

Speaker 1 (01:12:47):
That's fair.

Speaker 3 (01:12:52):
I'm like I'm done now .
This is fine and I think peopleneed to consume everything that
comes out, all the spinoffs andeverything.
If you just watch half of itand you feel like resolved or
whatever man, go for it.

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
That's how I feel.
At least Allie can keepwatching Jurassic Park 3, the
best Jurassic Park.
She doesn't have to watchJurassic World.

Speaker 3 (01:13:08):
I like, yeah, I like Jurassic Park 3.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
Jurassic Park 3 is so good, it's the best one, thank
you.
Lost World is garbage.

Speaker 3 (01:13:13):
yeah, that one was bad thank you, okay, I feel so
vindicated right now.

Speaker 1 (01:13:17):
Another time, another episode so let's okay.

Speaker 2 (01:13:21):
So Mary Sex killed Jurassic Park.
Yeah, I'm not kidding, I'm in,yeah, so but yeah, for sure,
this was a fun conversation.
We're all still friends, thankgoodness.
Hopefully Star Wars fanslistened to this and saw an
adult conversation.
It can happen.
It can happen.

Speaker 3 (01:13:34):
It can happen.
You can just like what you like, yeah, and just respectfully
disagree.

Speaker 1 (01:13:40):
We definitely don't have guns pointed at each other
right now.
We're good, I'm going to gohome and watch Rise of Skywalker
probably, and be like I don'tget their hate for this.

Speaker 3 (01:13:48):
Maybe I need to re-watch it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:50):
Corey's really hiding it.
He's going to go have a tearand cry.

Speaker 2 (01:13:54):
Again, I think it just has more to do with I don't
know.
It's not precious to me that'sfair, you know type of thing.
I mean same thing with lord ofthe rings it's not precious to
me that I think the second one'sthe best and that's precious to
you, oh we got okay all right,all right.
Well, okay, that was merry sexkill.
Star wars um, by all means,we're on social media, tell us

(01:14:16):
your merry sex kill for starwars like I'm interested.
Yeah, like go find us at quantumrecast on your social media
choice yeah, whatever.
Um, I don't know if we evercheck x I'm we do I'm not going
there, we do, okay.
Well, nick goes down thatcesspool and looks around, so um
, but yeah, tell us yourthoughts on a our um, I mean,
don't tell me your thoughts onmine.

(01:14:37):
I just feel like I have anunpopular.
I feel like I have unpopularopinions, but tell us what you
think and tell us what yours are, because we are curious.
If someone says Attack on theClones, though, as you're Mary,
we're going to unfollow you.

Speaker 3 (01:14:49):
We're going to block you.

Speaker 2 (01:14:51):
No, we're kidding, we're kidding, but thanks for
listening.
We'll be back with a futureMary Sex Kill at some point,
with some franchise.
That'll be a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
maybe Jurassic Park that would be fantastic we'll
figure it out.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
We gotta go to the board, but thanks for listening.
Say goodnight Nick.
Goodnight Nick.

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Star Wars - Marry, Sex, Kill: Picking the Best & Worst Films of the Skywalker Saga

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Star Wars - Marry, Sex, Kill: Picking the Best & Worst Films of the Skywalker Saga