Discover the power of student-led advocacy as Cameron Samuels and Hayden Cohen, the dynamic co-founders of SEAT (Students Engaged in Advancing Texas), share their inspiring journey. Learn how these young leaders transformed challenges into opportunities, from unblocking LGBTQ websites in Katy ISD schools to fighting against book removals and anti-transgender policies. With personal anecdotes and their evolution from high school activists to influential advocates, Cameron and Hayden provide a compelling look at the vibrant world of youth advocacy in Texas.
Prepare to be inspired by the proactive strategies students are employing to shape education policy. We delve into the creation of a Student Bill of Rights, collaborations with the Transgender Education Network of Texas, and participation in the 100 Good Bills Project. SEAT’s initiatives, such as the peer mentor network and Texas Legislature Changemaker Boot Camp, equip students with essential leadership skills and opportunities to engage directly in policy-making. Cameron shares his personal transformation, fueled by the discrimination he faced, and his drive to ensure students' voices are heard in the halls of power.
And for a unique twist, explore the intersection of advocacy and the arts with Brian Jucha's interdisciplinary theater work. Brian's latest production, "Love Bomb," brings a fresh blend of music and performance to the Houston scene, inspired by the iconic singer-songwriter Melanie. With heartfelt stories and collaborative efforts, this episode captures the essence of long-term social movements and highlights the enduring fight for student and LGBTQ+ rights, making it a must-listen for anyone passionate about change and the transformative power of theater.
Queer Voices airs in Houston Texas on 90.1FM KPFT and is heard as a podcast here. Queer Voices hopes to entertain as well as illuminate LGBTQ issues in Houston and beyond. Check out our socials at:
https://www.facebook.com/QueerVoicesKPFT/ and
https://www.instagram.com/queervoices90.1kpft/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everybody, this is Queer Voices, a podcast and
radio show that's been on theair for several decades as one
of the oldest LGBTQ plus radioshows in the southern United
States.
This week's episode takes usfrom the theater seats to a seat
at the table, starting with theco-founders of Seat Students
Engaged in Advancing Texas, ledby Cameron Samuels and Hayden
(00:23):
Cohen, and their conversationwith producer Deborah
Moncrief-Bell.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
She was founded upon the premise that students
deserve to have a seat at thetable in the decisions that
directly impact us, that ourvoices have power, that we're
the experts of our personalexperiences in school and so we
deserve to have that agency.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Later, brett Cullum speaks with Brian Yuka, producer
of Love Bomb, a show thatrecently premiered at the Match
from Catastrophic running fromnow until December 7th.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
What I do is interdisciplinary dance theater
that has a loose narrative thatcan be interpreted differently
from one audience member to thenext.
Text in my work is not theprimary source of the experience
.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Queer Voices starts now.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
This is Deborah Moncrief-Bell, and I'm talking
with Cameron Samuels and HaydenCohen, co-founders of SEED
Students Engaged in AdvancingTexas.
So let's start with you,cameron.
You were named in 2023 asTransitor Grand Marshal for
Houston Pride and you also wererecognized by the Human Rights
(01:43):
Campaign for your work in theformation of SEED, so explain
what the organization is and howit got started.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Absolutely.
It's a pleasure to share moreabout our student-led effort
that grew in greater Houston andhave had nationwide impacts and
influence for young peopleacross the nation in a time
where we have traditionally beenleft out of the spaces of
(02:14):
education policy and ourgovernment institutions.
The seat was founded upon thepremise that students deserve to
have a seat at the table in thedecisions that directly impact
us, that our voices have power,that we're the experts of our
personal experiences in schooland so we deserve to have that
(02:37):
agency to defend our rights asstudents in school, to not let
others decide for us what we canand cannot learn or do, that we
deserve that dignity and thatour voice matters.
And that's exactly what we'redoing in our entirely
student-led movement, whereyoung people are showing up on
(03:01):
the front lines, where thesedecisions are being made at
school board meetings, in thestate legislature and even in
Congress and the White House.
We have students who aredeveloping transferable skills,
demonstrating youth visibilityin this policymaking.
Because we deserve that seat atthe table.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
Certainly, and wasn't there a particular thing that
happened in Katy ISD that kindof was the catalyst for the
formation?
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Precisely Before SEAT was founded, I was leading
efforts as a senior in Katy ISDat Seven Lakes High School.
I couldn't access LGBTQ websiteson my school Wi-Fi and we led a
movement founded by students tofile legal action with the ACLU
(03:54):
to pack school board meetings,to show up and build these
relationships with school boardmembers and the district
administration.
We got those websites unblockedso now students can access
life-saving resources like theTrevor Project, suicide
Prevention, lifeline.
But since then KDISD hascontinued removing books from
(04:19):
shelves, including even recentlyin this week with a controversy
regarding Native Americanliterature and cultural
competency and trainingeducators to address
controversial issues.
To steer clear of what thiscontroversy is.
We are still facing issues inKDISD with the anti-transgender
(04:43):
policy that was passed in Augustlast year, where we had 400
people show up overwhelmingly inopposition to this policy at
the school board meeting.
But now students are facing thedetriment of this policy where
they are being outed to theirfamilies for being transgender,
(05:05):
that teachers are empowered todeadname and misgender students.
This does not serve studentbody of our great state of Texas
when we can't find safety andcomfort in educational
institutions meant to support us.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Hayden, you came in on this right from the beginning
, I believe.
Speaker 5 (05:27):
Yes, I did, I cannot remember.
I think I met Cameron, I want tosay my senior year of high
school or maybe my freshman yearof college and that was about
the time of the start of theTexas legislative session and we
really started connecting onbills, finding other students
(05:47):
involved who wanted to be vocal,who are already working in the
legislative session, who arealready doing things in their
school districts, and it reallybecame a more formal
organization and a way of givingstudents their voice, providing
a forum for students to usetheir voices realistically.
(06:09):
You know there are a lot offolks within SEAT, including
myself, who are doing a lot ofgood work in our school
districts, in our schools on thestate level.
Before SEAT was officiallyformed, I know I was advocating
for my Gender and SexualityAlliance back in high school and
for Wraparound ServiceCoordinator expansion within my
school district back in highschool and this formal setting
(06:31):
of okay.
Now that we're an actualorganization, we can do some of
this incredible stuff likecoalition building.
We can formally bring in morestudents.
We can bring in more money andresources so that students have
(06:54):
access to be able to advocatefor themselves in schools.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Yeah, has it spread beyond Texas as an organization?
Speaker 5 (07:05):
So we predominantly focus on students' needs and
student advocacy in Texas.
We are 100% Texas-based.
However, we do have coalitionpartners who are outside of
Texas.
We have worked withorganizations outside of Texas
and we also have worked a bit onthe federal level.
(07:26):
We have a wonderful federalpolicy, director Ayan, who has
done stuff at the White House.
We've worked to file a billwith Congressman Maxwell Frost's
office the Stop Book Bans Actand so we have done stuff on the
federal level that would impactmore than just Texas students
(07:46):
and coordinated withorganizations outside of Texas.
But predominantly we're here tohelp Texas students advocate
for themselves and support thework that they're doing in Texas
.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
In a lot of ways, it seems like Texas is ground zero
for a lot of the things that aregoing on.
What sorts of things are youinvolved in other than Seed
Hayden?
I think you have quite theresume.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
I do so.
I do a lot of work in partisanpolitics and I'm going to be
careful what I say because Seedis a 501c3, and so we're here to
advocate for education and notnecessarily Republican or
Democrat.
But I am involved with theHouston LGBTQ Plus Political
(08:32):
Caucus so I screen a lot ofcandidates, I have a lot of
connections through there andthat's been a wonderful group to
really understand LGBTQ issues,especially on a local level.
And then I've worked on somesmaller campaigns.
I've done other nonprofit workin the legislative session.
In the last legislative sessionI was actually working for an
(08:54):
organization with their youthadvocacy program and I ended up
testifying on a few mentalhealth related bills for higher
education.
They focused a lot on, like,younger people, 18 to 35.
So I've been involved in thoseways.
And then I do a lot for voterregistration and education and
(09:14):
advocacy.
So going into high schoolsteaching students about the
importance of voting, hearingthem out, hearing what they, how
they relate to voting, how theyfeel about the Electoral
College and about differentpolitical issues, and then
encouraging them all to getregistered to vote.
And I'd go in and help everyoneget registered.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Thank you for doing that work.
It's just so important and Ithink it's wonderful that people
like you and Cameron arestepping up and, like I say,
you're the ones that are goingto inherit the mess that we're
currently in and hopefully beable to work towards a better
future for everyone.
(09:56):
The legislative session iscoming up again in January here
in Texas.
Are there particular thingsthat you're looking at that
would have an impact that youwant to work for or against?
Speaker 5 (10:10):
So when planning for the legislative session, we had
a few different ways to go aboutit, and what we decided was to
kind of take inspiration fromthe teachers union, from AFT,
and create a student bill ofrights, and this is basically an
outline that can be usedanywhere on local, state or
(10:31):
federal level to basicallyprovide a guideline and an
outline for what we'readvocating for, based on what
students deserve and this wasextremely collaborative with
students of all ages across thestate applicable to high school,
college, elementary school,graduate school, whatever.
And so we created the StudentBill of Rights and that's what
(10:51):
we're going to be basing off ofa lot of our legislative actions
off of and kind of using as anargument for being for or
against bills.
We are working with anorganization currently working
with a transgender educationnetwork of Texas on their 100
good bills project.
So filing is probably going toend up being over 100 positive
(11:13):
LGBTQ plus bills and we're goingto be focusing specifically on
pro LGBTQ plus education bills.
So we Cameron and I and a fewother students have already
started bouncing ideas off offor that and we'll be bringing
those to legislators very soon,and then we're also keeping our
eye on some of the bad billsthat we expect to come out of
(11:33):
the legislative session, thingslike trying to get vouchers
passed again, more censorshipbills, more attempts to ban
gender sexuality, alliances toexpand internet filters, to ban
more books.
Right, we're really being hyperaware and vigilant of the
potential bills we might seecome up in this session and then
(11:55):
strategizing amongst ourselvesand with our coalition partners
and community partners on howwe're going to fight each bill
as they come.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
How does someone find SEAT and get involved?
I?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
can jump in here to say that SEAT is a peer mentor
network where we don'tnecessarily have a centralized,
more organizational branding.
It's very much built upon theefforts of the students who this
movement represents.
A movement relies on bringingpeople in and having
(12:30):
conversations, building thoserelationships and cultivating
personal growth and leadershipdevelopment.
And that's exactly what SEATserves to be.
Where students often come to usbecause they have issues that
are taking place in theirschools or they have that dread
(12:52):
or want to do something aboutthese challenging issues that
our generation is facing, andthey don't necessarily know
where to begin.
But they know that somethingcan be done and we partner with
students across Texas to buildthat confidence, to skill build,
to broker connections with themedia or organizational partners
(13:17):
so they can learn to publicspeak, to represent their school
district and the studentexperience that they embody, to
have these opportunities forpolicy transformation and
cultural shifts in theircommunity.
One recent program that we heldthis fall semester is the Texas
(13:44):
Legislature Changemaker BootCamp, which is a partnership
that we had with the YouthDemocracy Lab in organizing this
boot camp that recentlygraduated 43 students in Texas.
43 students have graduated from10 hours of action-based
(14:05):
learning and, as Haydeneloquently expressed, we are now
shifting gears into authoringstudent-led bills and now as
well, with this program, notonly do students have that
opportunity to write bills oftheir own to actually shape the
(14:26):
Texas legislature in the waythat they want, but they now
also have the opportunity forinternship matching both inside
lawmaker offices in the Capitoland then also with professional
advocacy organizations in theTexas educational political
landscape.
So we are facilitating theseinternships with these partners
(14:51):
and offices where students canbe part of actually changing
these institutions, progressingthem, bringing their expertise
as a student and their careergoals and ambitions to actually
have an internal stake andcapability to transform these
(15:16):
institutions.
So we will have direct liaisonto the Texas Capitol, not only
with the relationships thatwe've already built with
lawmakers, but to actually havehighly trained and highly
competent student leaders whocan imagine really big for what
Texas can look like if we allcome together and advance the
(15:40):
status quo.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
Cameron, you've moved on to college and I assume that
you are involved in otheractivism at the college level.
I'm thinking back to when youvery first started and what that
must have been like.
What gave you the ability to gotalk in front of the school
(16:02):
board and to recruit otherstudents to be involved?
What was going on that led youto that and what did it feel
like?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
That's a really great question, because I've always
been an introvert.
I've been someone who justloves education, I've been the
self-proclaimed nerd and I neverreally felt that confidence to
go up in public and speak mymind.
I didn't have that confidence.
I didn't really know that thiswas something I could do and I
(16:36):
was just accidentally forcedinto this by the discrimination
that I faced in KDISD to jumpinto this whirlwind of movement
building and challengingoppression, working to better
(16:57):
not only my situation as astudent but my peers and
classmates and all those whowould come after me.
It was something I never reallyexpected and it was challenging
at first to go out of thatbubble that I didn't know that
this was something I could do,to be an advocate on the front
(17:20):
lines of change, but I knew thatnot seeing students at the
forefront, that was something Iwanted to change.
I wanted to be a part ofchanging that, to flip the
narrative on its side, thatstudents actually do have the
ability to show up in thesespaces.
That me both adults and mypeers and I knew that we had
(17:56):
momentum growing, not only onthe advocacy side but in terms
of solving this issue wherestudents are not at the table
and I know that now, as acollege student after graduating
high school.
I know that now, as a collegestudent after graduating high
school, I at the helm ofbuilding this movement with
amazing people like Hayden andseeing that we together have
(18:21):
these experiences through thepast few years of doing this
incredible work as Haydenoutlined, and now we have
something to share with thosewho are currently in high school
or even in middle schoolGeneration Z and Gen Alpha and
the come up in middle and highschool and growing as leaders,
(18:50):
where I never wanted any studentto feel alone and isolated like
I did when I stood up to myschool board by myself, the only
student in that room, and justfeeling the chills down my spine
and the trembling in my armsand legs as I was speaking to my
school board and just notreally finding any sort of
(19:15):
support or comfort in that coldroom, and to return with a
movement of students andsupporters to have all of this
support.
I want to make sure that everystudent has that opportunity and
that's why I'm so invested inbuilding this movement of
(19:36):
students, not only to be leadersand to change unjust systems of
oppression, but, in a sense,that I too have become an
educator, have become a mentorwhere I am helping students
(19:56):
thrive, but then learning fromthem in that process.
That this is a learning processfor me to become a better
person, a better leader, abetter educator.
And if we don't see our life asbeing able to take it forward,
to invest in those who comeafter us, then what are we doing
(20:18):
it for?
Is the question that I askedmyself.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
Exactly, and I think you'll find, if you talk to
activists through the years,that many of them will say how
they didn't know they could doit until they did it.
And then you also gain so manyskills and become educated by
doing the work.
(20:41):
So I think that's very exciting, and you just gave a list of
new labels for variousgenerations.
I'm going to have to catch upwith what's going on.
So, hayden, how was it for youwhen you took that first step?
Speaker 5 (21:04):
I shared some of the same feelings as Cameron when I
started advocacy.
One of the big things I startedworking on was the sexual
education curriculum in HISD,because we have TEKS, which is
our standard Texas curriculum,but then HISD, houston
(21:25):
Independent School District,they have their own sort of
guidelines for educators which,yes, you have to include TEEEX,
but these were additional andsome of the guidelines I thought
were kind of messed up for thesexual education curriculum, for
the health curriculum, and Ihad to do a lot of searching.
I had to ask a few teachers andI finally figured out a few
(21:47):
folks to speak to and they toldme I'm the wrong person or they
were the wrong person that Ishould speak to and I need to
speak to.
And they told me I'm the wrongperson or they were the wrong
person that I should speak toand I need to speak to other
people.
And it was a bit.
It was a bit confusing, buteven as a what was I 15, 16
years old, I did figure it out.
I spoke to the right people, wemade some change, and same goes
with the trans restroom policy.
(22:07):
I brought it to a few folks andthey connected me with the
dying student congress that wehad at the time and we all ended
up speaking on that at a schoolboard meeting.
So I didn't speak in front of acrowd starting out alone, but
it was definitely nothing likewhat we have at C where, oh, you
(22:28):
want to speak at a school board?
Okay, well, we'll get five morestudents to show up with you,
so you have some moral support.
It was nothing like that.
And also something that wasdifferent was when I was
starting out in advocacy andpolicy spaces and political
spaces.
It was in the midst of thepandemic and I think advocacy
during that time looked verydifferent than what it looks
(22:48):
like now.
Right, then I was meeting withfolks either in a mask outside
or most of it was virtually.
I had been virtual for a whileand so it looked very different
and a lot of things had changed.
Nowadays it's a lot more inperson.
Everything we can do is a lotmore in person.
(23:10):
Right, we're now paying fortransportation for students to
get to places to testify, andthere's a lot more that goes
into that.
That didn't when I was in highschool, but I still think in
high school I felt like I wasthe only one standing up a bit
because nobody else around mewas thinking about these issues.
(23:31):
Nobody else was bothered thattrans students had to just use
the nurse's restroom but inanother school 10 minutes away
they could use whatever restroomthey felt comfortable using.
It seemed like I was the onlyone recognizing these issues and
trying to advocate for them,and it was funny when I brought
it to my principal.
She was like I don't know whatyou're talking about.
(23:51):
You mean, there's an issue withall of you going to the nurse's
restroom in your five-minutebreak between classes, what?
And so it was definitely alonely fight at the beginning.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
This is Deborah Moncrief-Bell, and we're talking
with Hayden Cohen and CameronSamuels, the co-founders of SEAT
Students Engaged in AdvancingTexas, and they've done a whole
lot of work to do that.
The group was recognizedrecently at the Transgender
Unity Banquet.
I don't remember the name ofthe award that was given.
(24:23):
Can you recall, hayden?
I?
Speaker 5 (24:25):
would have to physically look at the award.
I know it was won for acollective organization.
It was actually specificallyfor an ally organization, which
we kind of laughed about becausesome folks are allies to the
trans.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
You have been aided by other organizations and
gotten training, so that itbecomes easier, because you're
(25:01):
not going in there withoutknowing a little bit.
I think the first time I everlobbied it was in Congress and I
was talking to Bill Archer, whowas at the time the most
conservative voting member ofCongress.
This is many, many years agoand I didn't know I had not
(25:25):
received enough training.
I had gotten a little bit fromthe National Organization for
Women, but essentially we justwent in there and talked to him.
I don't know that we made anydifference, but it let me know
that it was something that Icould do.
What have been the mostimportant lessons that you have
(25:45):
learned?
And, hayden, you can start, andthen we'll ask Cameron.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
I will tell anyone this, and Cameron knows this all
too well If you want to makesome significant change, if you
want to make some longstandingchange, you can't do it alone.
You really have to be workingwith other folks.
And I think SEED's so specialbecause we are learning off of
one another and it, as Karamentioned, it is more of a peer
(26:12):
mentor network, right?
Nobody's in this alone,nobody's testifying alone.
We're, we're watching eachother, we're sending each other
texts of encouragement, you know, and we're all kind of in this
together, as well as with otherorganizations outside of us, um,
actualual, like adult, adultpeople who have done this for
(26:34):
many years, who maybe havedegrees by now.
So I think that's one of themost important things.
And then I think the otherthing is you really have to be
passionate.
That was, I think that's, why Iended up going on for so much
of high school, because thereweren't other people around me
that were that kind of that, hadthat kind of passion.
And with seat when you get tomeet the students a part of seat
(26:56):
you see so much passion withthem.
You see so much we have ahebrew word for it, but like so
much I don't know how to explainit in english, but basically a
lot of passion, um for the workthey're doing right.
These are students who aredirectly affected by these
issues, who have felt theconsequences of these bills or
their policies and feltdisenfranchised by them, felt
(27:21):
like this was affecting theireducation, this was affecting
their livelihood in schoolsevery day, and so they're
fighting to make this change.
They're doing it for themselves,they're doing it for their
peers, they're doing it fortheir siblings.
This change, they're doing itfor themselves, they're doing it
for their peers, they're doingit for their siblings, and it's
something like you've never seenbefore, when students will do
anything and everything to makechange in their communities.
(27:41):
And I think that's one of thebiggest tools we have is our
encouragement of each other, andour passion to keep going is
our encouragement of each otherand our passion to keep going.
I know that there have beenvery long days in the Texas
legislature, days where you'restarting to drive from Houston
at 5 am, you're not getting hometill 1 pm or you're staying
(28:03):
overnight for a day or two, andit's so important that we keep
this passion with us that we'reencouraging each other
throughout this.
Speaker 4 (28:16):
And Cameron.
How about you?
What has been what you havelearned from doing the work?
Speaker 2 (28:21):
How can I follow that ?
Thank you, hayden.
And I could add that movementsdon't happen overnight.
That's one thing I've learned.
Movements take time.
It's a long game.
It's about taking the momentand making a movement out of it
to advance the status quo, tomove the needle, and that can be
(28:44):
accomplished by something likea hashtag, by legislation, by a
lapel pin.
But really it's more aboutwhat's built by the people.
There has to be a person, thereneeds to be people behind those
tactics.
As Hayden expressed, we are amovement of people and I learned
(29:09):
that we will lose.
That does happen.
There will be losses in thislong game, but we can look back
and see that we have madeprogress, that these little
losses over time have beenaccompanied by major wins, that
(29:31):
we are moving the needle and itis difficult to continue on our
way because, being a movementbuilt by people, we need to take
care of ourselves.
We need that healing andrestoration while lawmakers are
passing very cruel policies.
While lawmakers are passingvery cruel policies, cruelty is
(29:53):
their point.
They want to crush us, ourheart and our soul, and that's
where we stick together.
We stand up for one another.
When one person can't speak forthemselves, we work to help
elevate each other.
We are in this together andthat healing will result in
(30:15):
balance, where we aim to makethese policy shifts.
But we also know that we havean audience of the public too,
that if the public is not on ourside, then of course we're
going to see these policies takeplace.
Speaker 4 (30:31):
I'm sorry go ahead.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
I was just going to say the court of public opinion
is something that we mostdefinitely have to keep in mind,
where, if we are only lookingat the wins and losses
politically, then we areforgetting about the public that
is around us in our everydaysituations and those shifts are
(30:54):
just as impactful because thoseare people who can be part of
our movement.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
What you just talked about brings me to my next
question.
And we can't ask for donations.
But other than that, how canthe public, how can we who want
to be allies, have an impact onthe work of SEAT?
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Every person has a role they can play.
Everyone has an individualexpertise, is positioned in a
unique role as an individual, asa part of the workforce, as a
person of their family.
There is there is a unique waythat each person can show up,
and who better to know what thatway is but each of ourselves?
(31:41):
So, listening here today toy'all identify what you can do
to show up.
There's more than just one way,but start with that one way
when you can show up by makingyour voice heard in the circles
around you, or taking it even astep further and posting on
(32:05):
social media, writing an op-edor speaking at your school board
meeting or the statelegislature.
Our voices can have impact andwhen we do it together, then we
are stronger, in a sense thatthis is not just one person
alone, and showing up can meanfinancially, but that's not the
(32:26):
only way toward one objectiveand one goal.
We, with our many differenttactics and contributions, will
ultimately be stronger when weact like a majority.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
And I think I'm sorry , go ahead.
Speaker 5 (32:47):
I did want to answer Bill on this one.
I think for folks who arespecifically looking to get
plugged in and associated withSEED, we do have a lot going on
on social media, so following uson social media, but we also,
on our website,studentsengagedorg, we have a
get involved tab so you can booka meeting with an organizer,
you can email us if you'd liketo get involved.
(33:08):
A lot of folks hear about SEATthrough pieces that we've been a
part of, with publications ortimes that we've spoken at
events, or maybe times thatwe're tabling at events, and so
we have plenty of folks who willjust email us and be like hey,
I'm a student at this place andI'd like to get involved with
y'all, and as students weactually have a Slack, but for
(33:31):
adults we can communicatethrough email or social media,
and those are some great ways tokind of get plugged in to the
work that we're doing and sothat we can also support the
work that students want to do ontheir own.
Well, not on their own, becausewe'll be with them.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
And Hayden, you were a recent recipient of a Gayist
and Greatest Award from that.
Readers of Outsmart magazine Idon't remember what category
that was in readers of outsmartmagazine.
Speaker 5 (33:58):
I I don't remember what category that was in it was
the most prominent or, yeah,most prominent lgbtq plus youth
activist and it was funnybecause I accepted my award and
I had to get the x's written onmy hand because I was under 21
at the club I feel venue.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
I'm sorry you cut out part of that.
Say that sentence again.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
It was the most prominent lgbtq, lgbtq youth
activist, and it was funnybecause at the venue that they
held the awards party at, Iactually had to get massive
black X's drawn on my handbecause I was too young.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
You were underage for drinking alcohol, so they had
to make sure that you weren'tserved anything.
I was the only one with that on, believe me, yeah and there was
a lovely write-up in OutsmartMagazine featuring Hayden, and
that's another good way to learnabout some of the issues that
CD is working on.
Hayden and Cameron, Iappreciate you being with us
(34:50):
here on Queer Voices.
Is there anything else you wantto tell us that we didn't cover
?
Speaker 2 (34:55):
I guess public education is going to be a major
issue in the upcoming statelegislative session.
So there are intersectionsbetween public education.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
Stop, stop, stop.
Start that sentence again,because there was some crosstalk
there.
So say again, starting with theword education.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Public education is going to be a major issue in the
upcoming spring legislativesession in Texas, and there are
great intersections betweenpublic education and LGBTQ
identity.
So it's going to be ourresponsibility to remain
vigilant and show up when thosetimes arise where our rights,
(35:42):
our dignity, is going to be onthe chopping block.
And we're going to do all thatwe can with SEAT and hope that
everyone listening in can joinus in doing so to advance our
rights as queer people andstrengthen the foundation of our
democracy through protectingand defending public education.
Speaker 4 (36:03):
Well, thank you both for being with us on Queer
Voices.
Speaker 7 (36:16):
This is Queer Voices.
Brian Yuka has created originalinterdisciplinary theater works
for decades.
He's an early participant inthe development of Viewpoints
Theory.
He worked with Ann Bogart foryears, culminating in forming
Via Theater, which he took overas artistic director and became
a part of the downtown New YorkCity performance landscape of
(36:37):
the 90s.
And Via Theater produced two tothree original works a year.
It's amazing.
You go back, you look at NewYork Times interviews and their
raves and everybody loves it.
But in Houston we get toexperience Brian's work through
Catastrophic Theater and LoveBomb opens on November 15th at
the Match Facility in Midtownand runs into early December.
(36:58):
This will be his fifthcollaboration with Catastrophic
and its forerunner, infernalBridegroom Productions,
including they Do Not Move,toast Last Rites and we have
Some Planes.
And we have Some Planes has aspecific history to it because
it landed Yuka and theCatastrophic IBP Ensemble on the
cover of American TheatreMagazine, which they still talk
(37:20):
about.
So welcome to Queer Voices,brian Yuka.
Thank you Happy to be here.
I'm excited to have you becauseobviously I mean from this
introduction you've done a lotand you're definitely an artist
of note and you definitely madean impact here on the Houston
scene and Love Bomb, the mostrecent work.
It's touted as a conceptualmusical about taxi dancers, set
(37:44):
to the tunes of Melanie, thegirl from Woodstock who
everybody knows because of thatdang song about roller skates
Love Bomb, obviously.
Now I have been a theatercritic for 10 years and I missed
.
We have Some Planes it wasbefore my tenure of doing that.
For some reason, anotherBroadway role writer took the
assignment for every othercollaboration that you've done
(38:05):
with Catastrophic, so I amcoming in fresh.
What can I expect from?
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Love Ball, oh boy.
Well, what I do isinterdisciplinary dance theater
that has a loose narrative thatcan be interpreted differently
from one audience member to thenext.
Text in my work is not theprimary source of the experience
(38:33):
.
The text is as important as themusic, as the movement, as the
gestures, as the dance, as thesongs, as what is happening
between actors,relationship-wise from one to
the other.
And, as I say, you know thefunny thing about we have Some
(38:53):
Plans.
There were eight companymembers in that and we had some
people come back and see iteight times so they could just
watch each person Because,honestly, if you, you know,
depending on who you lom onto atany given moment, you're
experiencing something different.
So it's not just to be clear,it is not.
(39:15):
It is not site specific, it isnot interactive.
It is not just to be clear, itis not.
It is not size specific, it isnot interactive, it is not
audience participation.
Speaker 7 (39:22):
Melanie is a connection that we probably have
, because I'm a big fan ofMelanie as an artist.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Yeah, I heard that, which I think is crazy.
Speaker 7 (39:30):
It is kind of crazy.
And she is the musical muse forthis show.
What made you want to do apiece exclusively with her music
?
Speaker 3 (39:38):
okay, I was a teenage melanie groupie yeah, I saw
pictures okay, I discovered herwhen I was 10 and I went to see
her in concert for the firsttime when I was 11.
Between the ages of 11 and 20 Iprobably saw her 40 times maybe
.
And then the joke is I thenwent from Melanie to Patti Smith
(40:02):
.
That was my grouping status.
But so I mean I have known herfor ever and for ages.
I have always wanted to do apiece using her songs.
I was planning to do this lastsummer.
I never anticipated that shewould pass away, which she
passed away in January, so Iactually never got around to
(40:25):
asking her if it was okay withher.
I have gotten the approval andthe blessing of her family and
her children and her recordcompany and manager, so, but I
think she would have beenpleased.
You know what I love about herand if you know her stuff, most
people who know of her know herhit and have this conception of
her as this you know, flowerchild, hippie girl.
(40:45):
Her first two albums are very,you know they were very inspired
by Bertolt Brecht and KurtWeill.
They're gems of songs aboutrelationships, you know, and
falling in love and stuff likethat and falling out of love.
Most of what we are using aresongs from her very, very early
career, which were writtenmostly when she was a teenager.
(41:07):
So I've wanted to do this for avery long time and I'm finally
happy to get around to it.
Speaker 7 (41:14):
Apparently since you were 10.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
Happy to get around to it the way, apparently since
you were 10.
Yes, apparently since I was 10,you know.
The way that it's beingstructured is that in our dance
hall the taxi dancers also workas cabaret performers.
So the melanie songs are beingperformed as cabaret songs as
opposed to having a book thatthe songs inform one way or the
other.
So they are informing thecharacters, but they're not
(41:41):
unlike a traditional musical.
The songs are not motivatingthe action of the play.
Speaker 7 (41:46):
It's more like a cabaret presentation and
actually, ironically, the playcabaret sometimes has these
musical numbers that are justpresented as performances, which
is kind of an interestingdichotomy there.
But do you have like a favorite, melanie song?
I just was really curious.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Just I know it's like choosing sophie's choice, but
well, you know, it's really,really weird because I would
have answered that differentlysix weeks ago, but because of
the seven, because of the sevensongs that we are doing, I've
fallen back in love with some ofthe early songs that we are
doing.
I've fallen back in love withsome of the early ones that I
had kind of forgotten about,including I don't even know if I
(42:23):
should name them or not One ofthem was suggested by Melanie's
manager and it has turned out towork out so brilliantly.
The song is called Take Me Home, which I had kind of forgotten
about, and he was like youshould consider Take Me Home and
I was, like you know, went andlistened to it and I was like,
oh my God, that's perfect.
One of my favorite songs isLeftover Emotion, which we are
(42:45):
doing, which was written in herlater years but wasn't really
didn't get the recording duethat it should have gotten when
she was younger.
She did record it several times, you know, in her later years,
but it didn't make it on any ofthe you know big albums in the
70s.
The album photograph is myfavorite.
Speaker 7 (42:59):
I think that that's her work of genius that didn't
get to do it deserved probablyone of my favorite songs is
leftover wine, which I have afeeling probably wouldn't be in
the show, but because it neverhappens and I also really like
Lay Down, yeah, that's not inthe show either you're killing
me and neither is Brand New Keythat I'm fine with.
(43:24):
To me Brand New Key was alwayslike the gateway drug to Melanie
for people I felt like you knowpeople kind of.
It was the hit that you knew,but it really was kind of this
novelty hit kind of thing andshe did some things with her
voice on it and it was a littlebit it wasn't my favorite of
hers, I think it's.
It's a cute kooky song, verycatchy and obviously used a
(43:45):
great effect in film andcommercials and everything else
now and part of our pop culture.
But I do think there are somany more wonderful.
As you said, she's kind of thetaylor swift of her time as far
as like breakup songs and youknow she was, I mean, and
interesting.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
I I mean I honestly do feel like she didn't get her
due, because in 70, 71, 72, shewas, like you know, billboard's
top female vocalist and I meanshe started her own record
company when she had a fallingout with buddha.
So she's the first woman thatdid that started.
I mean mean, imagine a woman in1971, starting her own record
company, like that wascompletely unheard of.
(44:22):
But then, you know, by 78, shewas kind of like gone, you know,
and also she will say, wantedto have children.
So she had three beautifulchildren and that was more
important to her than her career, I think.
Speaker 7 (44:33):
Now you mentioned a term going back to Love Bomb
that some listeners may not befamiliar with taxi dancer.
What exactly is a taxi dancer?
Speaker 3 (44:41):
Well, a taxi dancer is a term for okay.
It was something that happenedin the 30s and 40s, before the,
you know, around the war timeperiod there would be clubs
where and it's largely thoughtthat it's mostly men going to
women, but it also was womengoing to men where you could go
(45:03):
and pay someone to dance withyou and they were called taxi
dancers because then afterwardseverybody would get in their
taxis and go home.
But it's basically what SweetCharity is based on.
Sweet Charity is a taxi dancer.
You look at the number BigSpender.
That is completely about taxidancers.
I first heard it with aninterview with Rudolph Valentino
(45:25):
, because apparently he was ataxi dancer before he was famous
and of course he implied thatit was more than just being a
taxi dancer that led intoprostitution.
I just found it veryinteresting in terms of a dance
hall place that people would goto dance with somebody and pay
(45:45):
them five cents or a nickel fora dance.
So I think it's a great premisefor human interaction.
Speaker 7 (45:53):
You know I would do it now.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
I'm going to be honest.
You would go pay someone for adance.
Sure, absolutely.
Speaker 7 (46:03):
I see nothing wrong.
We should bring this back.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
Maybe we should have a night after the show where we
just taxi dance.
Speaker 7 (46:13):
Genius, let's do it.
Speaker 3 (46:15):
All right.
Speaker 7 (46:15):
So I have heard urban myth, myth, whatever, but that
you often come to houston with aconcept and maybe you have a
beginning, maybe you have an end.
You get together with the cast,the catastrophic artists, you
collaborate and create thiswhole show kind of organically.
Is that tell me a little bitabout your process and how you
kind of differ from somebodythat comes in with a full, fully
(46:38):
realized, like a Michael Marrthat has everything already done
?
Speaker 3 (46:42):
Normally I have themes, I have ideas for things
that will happen.
There might be a structure thatwe play off of, like last Rites
we played off of Rites ofSpring Stravinsky's ballet.
We have some really easybecause it was text from the
morning of September 11th.
So we literally use that as thestructure.
(47:04):
They said the text at the timethat the text was said.
You know, that morning we willdo composition work where the
actors will create originalcharacters.
What they do is what becomesthe basis for what the audience
sees.
We also use something calledviewpoint improv work, which
goes way back, which youmentioned earlier.
(47:25):
But I did study with Ann Bogartand Mary Overly in 78 and 79 at
NYU's Experimental Theater Wing, and also Wendell Beavers, who
was Mary's husband at the time,and so we use the viewpoint
method of improv to reallycreate the human interactions
that happen.
We have pulled found texts fromplaces.
(47:48):
Occasionally we will have thebasis for a text but, like even
with Love Bomb, I tried not tohave a text were a text.
But, like even even with lovebomb, I tried not to have a text
, but I found that to put ittogether in four weeks we needed
something structurally toground it.
I won't say what it is somepeople may recognize it and some
(48:09):
people may not, but it doeshave something to do with serial
killers and so I love youcatastrophic artists Cause you
always come to me with this kindof thing.
Speaker 7 (48:24):
But like go back and listen to my interview with Walt
Zippering about Sarah Gainescleansed he would not tell me.
Speaker 3 (48:31):
Well, you know, part of it is you also want people to
be surprised and you don't wantpeople to come in with a
preconceived notion Toast.
We use the script of Alien, ofthe movie Alien.
Now, if I said that to peoplebefore they came okay, and that
was just one thing, you know,there was a lot of other text
with it If I said to people,we're doing the script of Alien,
(49:01):
well, you would think thatthat's what you would think,
that we were doing helium, whichis not what we were doing.
So that's why I don't want tosay what the justice was,
because it would lead people tothink one thing rather than
experiencing it for themselves.
Speaker 7 (49:05):
This blows my mind because obviously I told you you
know, I've been a theatercritic for 10 years and I've
been an actor for a lot longerand I don't want to admit that
how long I think about this andI'm like, if you wanted to
restage, like we have someplanes, it would be a different
show, wouldn't it?
I mean, even if you cast thesame people, they probably would
come up with different things.
Or I mean what in this process?
Speaker 3 (49:26):
I think it would be interesting and I kind of would
love to restage we have someplans, because so many people
were afraid of it, because wedid that in like march of 2002,
I believe that the actors wouldhave to learn what the actor's
original score was, and thenthey could make changes to some
extent, but you'd still have tohonor what the person originally
(49:49):
did.
So, yeah, I mean my, my,there's only been one piece that
I remounted and it pretty muchwe ended up having two or three
actors replace the original cast, and it was pretty much the
same so you just go through thisprocess once and then, if you
ever do it again, you've gotkind of the basis well, yeah, we
actually we don't have thehistory of that because we
(50:10):
haven't really done it.
Speaker 7 (50:11):
If I do anything again, previously when I talked
with jason, he was saying thatyou kind of work with them
exclusively now or are you stillworking with Via?
Speaker 3 (50:23):
No, Via disbanded.
I mean yeah, via disbanded, youknow in the early aughts.
You know, via Theatre wasoriginally a company that was
created for Anne Bogart toproduce her work in New York and
she wanted to open it up toother directors.
So we did and we were doingthat and I was the first, and
(50:46):
then we all went to Trinity Repfor a year where she was given
the artistic directorship andthen when we came back a lot of
the Trinity Rep performers kindof became the Via Theatre
company.
I kind of took it over becauseAnne was moving in other
directions.
You know and listen, I meanthis is my hats off to
Catastrophic.
(51:06):
The administrative horror showof raising money to do theater
in the United States isincredibly draining in the
United States is incrediblydraining.
So you know, after 15 years ofVia Theater, you know, every
time we did a show we were$10,000 in debt.
The fact that Catastrophic hasbeen doing this for 30 years is
just phenomenal, and phenomenalthat so many of the same people
(51:29):
are there.
You know to think that peoplethat I did the shows with in,
you know, 1997 are still a partof the company is just that's
nuts, you know, or that you knowof the seven people that are
doing Love Bob, six of them havedone other shows with me before
.
You know some of them have donethree or four.
So Tamri Cooper has done allfive.
(51:51):
So you know it's just amazingthat they're.
Because I so strongly believein the concept of company and I
think that what a company ofactors can do, you know there's
a shorthand that just doesn'texist.
I think with you know you haveto like get through that period
with a new group of actors thatwhen you have a company they
just they fall right into somekind of a pattern and pace that
(52:14):
is just genius.
Speaker 7 (52:15):
So well, I've always had the perspective that
catastrophic is definitely oneof the jewels of the houston
theater scene because they dostuff that nobody would touch.
Your larger companies are nevergoing to do it.
They're not going to take achance with experimental theater
, they're going to run away fromit shrieking because they've
got christmas carol and've gotChristmas Carol and they've got
(52:37):
Wicked and they've got Phantomof the Opera.
That's going to make them tonsof money.
So you know, putting on amusical with Melanie songs about
taxi dancers is not on theirbucket list or whatever.
And I love the, the viewpointthat they bring, the fact that
they do have this longevity andthey do have this history.
And you do feel that as aaudience member even you can
(52:58):
feel that connection betweensome of their company and the
through line of coming andseeing them over again and
different iterations ofthemselves and watching them
grow as actors and all of that.
It's it's it's a neat feeling,I think, and it's one that I
think is unique not only toHouston but to Catastrophic
itself.
I mean, I have not seen verymany companies like this around
(53:19):
the country.
So, and so often we get artiststhat can't do business, and
that's one of the problems withour industry is it's hard to
fund these things because we'renot financial people.
Speaker 3 (53:33):
That's why you know the theater system has managing
directors.
Speaker 7 (53:37):
So it's interesting and Houston really embraces
Catastrophic, which I think iswonderful and definitely anytime
that you come to town it'salways a big event.
So there you go.
Speaker 3 (53:47):
And I have moved here .
Have you?
I have moved here?
Yes, yeah, the story of thiswas I had done the first two
shows with Infernal Broadgroomand then Jason was asking me
every year if I would come anddo a show and I kept saying I
wasn't ready.
Plus, my mother was very sickand I was taking care of her and
blah, blah, blah and I had, youknow, getting away from New
(54:07):
York for six and I'm veryunusual because I like to go to
every performance.
So it drives me crazy if I havea show running and I can't go.
So, you know, atypically, Iwould do a show, open it, stay
for a week and then leave fortwo weeks and then come back for
the closing, which drove mecrazy.
(54:30):
With Toast, I had a Nest camerain the theater and I watched it
every night from home.
But no, the idea was, beforeCOVID, I was going to buy, I was
going to look for a place downhere and snowboard COVID and
people working from home andstuff like that, not to mention
as somebody who lives inManhattan trying to find a
property in Manhattan, I mean.
So basically, I found a condoin Houston.
The bedroom is the size of whatI could afford in Manhattan
(54:53):
alone, and I was just like youknow, I don't need to be there
anymore.
Speaker 7 (54:58):
Well welcome to Houston as a resident.
Absolutely yes, and that'sexciting.
Does that mean that we're goingto see more collaborations with
Catastrophic on a more regularbasis?
Speaker 3 (55:08):
Well, we hope.
Speaker 7 (55:08):
All right.
Well, brian Yuka Love Bombopens November 15th at the Match
Facility in Midtown.
It runs into early December.
You guys are in the traditionalspace, match 3, I believe, kind
of the catastrophic home mostof the time.
Sometimes they drift into 4,but I think 3 is typically
theirs and of course you've gotdifferent nights and things like
that.
Are there any special eventswith this one?
(55:29):
I know that.
Is there going to be a talkbackwith you?
Speaker 3 (55:31):
There will be a talkback, there will be an
industry night.
Obviously, we're not doing ashow on Thanksgiving, because
you know we are.
But listen, let me tell you weare the ultimate Christmas
holiday entertainment.
I was thinking Love.
Speaker 7 (55:45):
Bomb yeah.
Speaker 3 (55:47):
We're really not.
Speaker 7 (55:51):
Take the whole family .
Speaker 3 (55:53):
I said to the company last week that we should sing
one of Melanie's Christmas songsas an encore, because her
Christmas stuff is great too.
Speaker 7 (56:03):
Well, one thing that you guys do is you do free beer
Fridays, so every Friday you canenjoy a canned beverage with
the company of Love Bomb andapparently Brian, because it
sounds like you're at everysingle performance.
Speaker 8 (56:15):
So this has been Queer Voices, heard on KPFT
Houston and as a podcastavailable from several
podcasting sources.
Check our Web page Queericesorgfor more information.
(56:38):
Queer Voices executive produceris Brian Levinka, deborah
Moncrief-Bell is co-producer,brett Cullum and David
Mendoza-Druzman are contributors, and Brett is also our
webmaster.
Speaker 6 (56:54):
Some of the material in this program has been edited
to improve clarity and runtime.
This program does not endorseany political views or animal
species Views, opinions andendorsements.
He's also our webmaster, Thankyou.
Hello everybody, this is Queer Voices, a podcast and
radio show that's been on theair for several decades as one
of the oldest LGBTQ plus radioshows in the southern United
States.
This week's episode takes usfrom the theater seats to a seat
at the table, starting with theco-founders of Seat Students
Engaged in Advancing Texas, ledby Cameron Samuels and Hayden
(00:23):
Cohen, and their conversationwith producer Deborah
Moncrief-Bell.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
She was founded upon the premise that students
deserve to have a seat at thetable in the decisions that
directly impact us, that ourvoices have power, that we're
the experts of our personalexperiences in school and so we
deserve to have that agency.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Later, brett Cullum speaks with Brian Yuka, producer
of Love Bomb, a show thatrecently premiered at the Match
from Catastrophic running fromnow until December 7th.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
What I do is interdisciplinary dance theater
that has a loose narrative thatcan be interpreted differently
from one audience member to thenext.
Text in my work is not theprimary source of the experience
.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Queer Voices starts now.
Speaker 4 (01:18):
This is Deborah Moncrief-Bell, and I'm talking
with Cameron Samuels and HaydenCohen, co-founders of SEED
Students Engaged in AdvancingTexas.
So let's start with you,cameron.
You were named in 2023 asTransitor Grand Marshal for
Houston Pride and you also wererecognized by the Human Rights
(01:43):
Campaign for your work in theformation of SEED, so explain
what the organization is and howit got started.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Absolutely.
It's a pleasure to share moreabout our student-led effort
that grew in greater Houston andhave had nationwide impacts and
influence for young peopleacross the nation in a time
where we have traditionally beenleft out of the spaces of
(02:14):
education policy and ourgovernment institutions.
The seat was founded upon thepremise that students deserve to
have a seat at the table in thedecisions that directly impact
us, that our voices have power,that we're the experts of our
personal experiences in schooland so we deserve to have that
(02:37):
agency to defend our rights asstudents in school, to not let
others decide for us what we canand cannot learn or do, that we
deserve that dignity and thatour voice matters.
And that's exactly what we'redoing in our entirely
student-led movement, whereyoung people are showing up on
(03:01):
the front lines, where thesedecisions are being made at
school board meetings, in thestate legislature and even in
Congress and the White House.
We have students who aredeveloping transferable skills,
demonstrating youth visibilityin this policymaking.
Because we deserve that seat atthe table.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
Certainly, and wasn't there a particular thing that
happened in Katy ISD that kindof was the catalyst for the
formation?
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Precisely Before SEAT was founded, I was leading
efforts as a senior in Katy ISDat Seven Lakes High School.
I couldn't access LGBTQ websiteson my school Wi-Fi and we led a
movement founded by students tofile legal action with the ACLU
(03:54):
to pack school board meetings,to show up and build these
relationships with school boardmembers and the district
administration.
We got those websites unblockedso now students can access
life-saving resources like theTrevor Project, suicide
Prevention, lifeline.
But since then KDISD hascontinued removing books from
(04:19):
shelves, including even recentlyin this week with a controversy
regarding Native Americanliterature and cultural
competency and trainingeducators to address
controversial issues.
To steer clear of what thiscontroversy is.
We are still facing issues inKDISD with the anti-transgender
(04:43):
policy that was passed in Augustlast year, where we had 400
people show up overwhelmingly inopposition to this policy at
the school board meeting.
But now students are facing thedetriment of this policy where
they are being outed to theirfamilies for being transgender,
(05:05):
that teachers are empowered todeadname and misgender students.
This does not serve studentbody of our great state of Texas
when we can't find safety andcomfort in educational
institutions meant to support us.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Hayden, you came in on this right from the beginning
, I believe.
Speaker 5 (05:27):
Yes, I did, I cannot remember.
I think I met Cameron, I want tosay my senior year of high
school or maybe my freshman yearof college and that was about
the time of the start of theTexas legislative session and we
really started connecting onbills, finding other students
(05:47):
involved who wanted to be vocal,who are already working in the
legislative session, who arealready doing things in their
school districts, and it reallybecame a more formal
organization and a way of givingstudents their voice, providing
a forum for students to usetheir voices realistically.
(06:09):
You know there are a lot offolks within SEAT, including
myself, who are doing a lot ofgood work in our school
districts, in our schools on thestate level.
Before SEAT was officiallyformed, I know I was advocating
for my Gender and SexualityAlliance back in high school and
for Wraparound ServiceCoordinator expansion within my
school district back in highschool and this formal setting
(06:31):
of okay.
Now that we're an actualorganization, we can do some of
this incredible stuff likecoalition building.
We can formally bring in morestudents.
We can bring in more money andresources so that students have
(06:54):
access to be able to advocatefor themselves in schools.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Yeah, has it spread beyond Texas as an organization?
Speaker 5 (07:05):
So we predominantly focus on students' needs and
student advocacy in Texas.
We are 100% Texas-based.
However, we do have coalitionpartners who are outside of
Texas.
We have worked withorganizations outside of Texas
and we also have worked a bit onthe federal level.
(07:26):
We have a wonderful federalpolicy, director Ayan, who has
done stuff at the White House.
We've worked to file a billwith Congressman Maxwell Frost's
office the Stop Book Bans Actand so we have done stuff on the
federal level that would impactmore than just Texas students
(07:46):
and coordinated withorganizations outside of Texas.
But predominantly we're here tohelp Texas students advocate
for themselves and support thework that they're doing in Texas
.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
In a lot of ways, it seems like Texas is ground zero
for a lot of the things that aregoing on.
What sorts of things are youinvolved in other than Seed
Hayden?
I think you have quite theresume.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
I do so.
I do a lot of work in partisanpolitics and I'm going to be
careful what I say because Seedis a 501c3, and so we're here to
advocate for education and notnecessarily Republican or
Democrat.
But I am involved with theHouston LGBTQ Plus Political
(08:32):
Caucus so I screen a lot ofcandidates, I have a lot of
connections through there andthat's been a wonderful group to
really understand LGBTQ issues,especially on a local level.
And then I've worked on somesmaller campaigns.
I've done other nonprofit workin the legislative session.
In the last legislative sessionI was actually working for an
(08:54):
organization with their youthadvocacy program and I ended up
testifying on a few mentalhealth related bills for higher
education.
They focused a lot on, like,younger people, 18 to 35.
So I've been involved in thoseways.
And then I do a lot for voterregistration and education and
(09:14):
advocacy.
So going into high schoolsteaching students about the
importance of voting, hearingthem out, hearing what they, how
they relate to voting, how theyfeel about the Electoral
College and about differentpolitical issues, and then
encouraging them all to getregistered to vote.
And I'd go in and help everyoneget registered.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
Thank you for doing that work.
It's just so important and Ithink it's wonderful that people
like you and Cameron arestepping up and, like I say,
you're the ones that are goingto inherit the mess that we're
currently in and hopefully beable to work towards a better
future for everyone.
(09:56):
The legislative session iscoming up again in January here
in Texas.
Are there particular thingsthat you're looking at that
would have an impact that youwant to work for or against?
Speaker 5 (10:10):
So when planning for the legislative session, we had
a few different ways to go aboutit, and what we decided was to
kind of take inspiration fromthe teachers union, from AFT,
and create a student bill ofrights, and this is basically an
outline that can be usedanywhere on local, state or
(10:31):
federal level to basicallyprovide a guideline and an
outline for what we'readvocating for, based on what
students deserve and this wasextremely collaborative with
students of all ages across thestate applicable to high school,
college, elementary school,graduate school, whatever.
And so we created the StudentBill of Rights and that's what
(10:51):
we're going to be basing off ofa lot of our legislative actions
off of and kind of using as anargument for being for or
against bills.
We are working with anorganization currently working
with a transgender educationnetwork of Texas on their 100
good bills project.
So filing is probably going toend up being over 100 positive
(11:13):
LGBTQ plus bills and we're goingto be focusing specifically on
pro LGBTQ plus education bills.
So we Cameron and I and a fewother students have already
started bouncing ideas off offor that and we'll be bringing
those to legislators very soon,and then we're also keeping our
eye on some of the bad billsthat we expect to come out of
(11:33):
the legislative session, thingslike trying to get vouchers
passed again, more censorshipbills, more attempts to ban
gender sexuality, alliances toexpand internet filters, to ban
more books.
Right, we're really being hyperaware and vigilant of the
potential bills we might seecome up in this session and then
(11:55):
strategizing amongst ourselvesand with our coalition partners
and community partners on howwe're going to fight each bill
as they come.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
How does someone find SEAT and get involved?
I?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
can jump in here to say that SEAT is a peer mentor
network where we don'tnecessarily have a centralized,
more organizational branding.
It's very much built upon theefforts of the students who this
movement represents.
A movement relies on bringingpeople in and having
(12:30):
conversations, building thoserelationships and cultivating
personal growth and leadershipdevelopment.
And that's exactly what SEATserves to be.
Where students often come to usbecause they have issues that
are taking place in theirschools or they have that dread
(12:52):
or want to do something aboutthese challenging issues that
our generation is facing, andthey don't necessarily know
where to begin.
But they know that somethingcan be done and we partner with
students across Texas to buildthat confidence, to skill build,
to broker connections with themedia or organizational partners
(13:17):
so they can learn to publicspeak, to represent their school
district and the studentexperience that they embody, to
have these opportunities forpolicy transformation and
cultural shifts in theircommunity.
One recent program that we heldthis fall semester is the Texas
(13:44):
Legislature Changemaker BootCamp, which is a partnership
that we had with the YouthDemocracy Lab in organizing this
boot camp that recentlygraduated 43 students in Texas.
43 students have graduated from10 hours of action-based
(14:05):
learning and, as Haydeneloquently expressed, we are now
shifting gears into authoringstudent-led bills and now as
well, with this program, notonly do students have that
opportunity to write bills oftheir own to actually shape the
(14:26):
Texas legislature in the waythat they want, but they now
also have the opportunity forinternship matching both inside
lawmaker offices in the Capitoland then also with professional
advocacy organizations in theTexas educational political
landscape.
So we are facilitating theseinternships with these partners
(14:51):
and offices where students canbe part of actually changing
these institutions, progressingthem, bringing their expertise
as a student and their careergoals and ambitions to actually
have an internal stake andcapability to transform these
(15:16):
institutions.
So we will have direct liaisonto the Texas Capitol, not only
with the relationships thatwe've already built with
lawmakers, but to actually havehighly trained and highly
competent student leaders whocan imagine really big for what
Texas can look like if we allcome together and advance the
(15:40):
status quo.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
Cameron, you've moved on to college and I assume that
you are involved in otheractivism at the college level.
I'm thinking back to when youvery first started and what that
must have been like.
What gave you the ability to gotalk in front of the school
(16:02):
board and to recruit otherstudents to be involved?
What was going on that led youto that and what did it feel
like?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
That's a really great question, because I've always
been an introvert.
I've been someone who justloves education, I've been the
self-proclaimed nerd and I neverreally felt that confidence to
go up in public and speak mymind.
I didn't have that confidence.
I didn't really know that thiswas something I could do and I
(16:36):
was just accidentally forcedinto this by the discrimination
that I faced in KDISD to jumpinto this whirlwind of movement
building and challengingoppression, working to better
(16:57):
not only my situation as astudent but my peers and
classmates and all those whowould come after me.
It was something I never reallyexpected and it was challenging
at first to go out of thatbubble that I didn't know that
this was something I could do,to be an advocate on the front
(17:20):
lines of change, but I knew thatnot seeing students at the
forefront, that was something Iwanted to change.
I wanted to be a part ofchanging that, to flip the
narrative on its side, thatstudents actually do have the
ability to show up in thesespaces.
That me both adults and mypeers and I knew that we had
(17:56):
momentum growing, not only onthe advocacy side but in terms
of solving this issue wherestudents are not at the table
and I know that now, as acollege student after graduating
high school.
I know that now, as a collegestudent after graduating high
school, I at the helm ofbuilding this movement with
amazing people like Hayden andseeing that we together have
(18:21):
these experiences through thepast few years of doing this
incredible work as Haydenoutlined, and now we have
something to share with thosewho are currently in high school
or even in middle schoolGeneration Z and Gen Alpha and
the come up in middle and highschool and growing as leaders,
(18:50):
where I never wanted any studentto feel alone and isolated like
I did when I stood up to myschool board by myself, the only
student in that room, and justfeeling the chills down my spine
and the trembling in my armsand legs as I was speaking to my
school board and just notreally finding any sort of
(19:15):
support or comfort in that coldroom, and to return with a
movement of students andsupporters to have all of this
support.
I want to make sure that everystudent has that opportunity and
that's why I'm so invested inbuilding this movement of
(19:36):
students, not only to be leadersand to change unjust systems of
oppression, but, in a sense,that I too have become an
educator, have become a mentorwhere I am helping students
(19:56):
thrive, but then learning fromthem in that process.
That this is a learning processfor me to become a better
person, a better leader, abetter educator.
And if we don't see our life asbeing able to take it forward,
to invest in those who comeafter us, then what are we doing
(20:18):
it for?
Is the question that I askedmyself.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
Exactly, and I think you'll find, if you talk to
activists through the years,that many of them will say how
they didn't know they could doit until they did it.
And then you also gain so manyskills and become educated by
doing the work.
(20:41):
So I think that's very exciting, and you just gave a list of
new labels for variousgenerations.
I'm going to have to catch upwith what's going on.
So, hayden, how was it for youwhen you took that first step?
Speaker 5 (21:04):
I shared some of the same feelings as Cameron when I
started advocacy.
One of the big things I startedworking on was the sexual
education curriculum in HISD,because we have TEKS, which is
our standard Texas curriculum,but then HISD, houston
(21:25):
Independent School District,they have their own sort of
guidelines for educators which,yes, you have to include TEEEX,
but these were additional andsome of the guidelines I thought
were kind of messed up for thesexual education curriculum, for
the health curriculum, and Ihad to do a lot of searching.
I had to ask a few teachers andI finally figured out a few
(21:47):
folks to speak to and they toldme I'm the wrong person or they
were the wrong person that Ishould speak to and I need to
speak to.
And they told me I'm the wrongperson or they were the wrong
person that I should speak toand I need to speak to other
people.
And it was a bit.
It was a bit confusing, buteven as a what was I 15, 16
years old, I did figure it out.
I spoke to the right people, wemade some change, and same goes
with the trans restroom policy.
(22:07):
I brought it to a few folks andthey connected me with the
dying student congress that wehad at the time and we all ended
up speaking on that at a schoolboard meeting.
So I didn't speak in front of acrowd starting out alone, but
it was definitely nothing likewhat we have at C where, oh, you
(22:28):
want to speak at a school board?
Okay, well, we'll get five morestudents to show up with you,
so you have some moral support.
It was nothing like that.
And also something that wasdifferent was when I was
starting out in advocacy andpolicy spaces and political
spaces.
It was in the midst of thepandemic and I think advocacy
during that time looked verydifferent than what it looks
(22:48):
like now.
Right, then I was meeting withfolks either in a mask outside
or most of it was virtually.
I had been virtual for a whileand so it looked very different
and a lot of things had changed.
Nowadays it's a lot more inperson.
Everything we can do is a lotmore in person.
(23:10):
Right, we're now paying fortransportation for students to
get to places to testify, andthere's a lot more that goes
into that.
That didn't when I was in highschool, but I still think in
high school I felt like I wasthe only one standing up a bit
because nobody else around mewas thinking about these issues.
(23:31):
Nobody else was bothered thattrans students had to just use
the nurse's restroom but inanother school 10 minutes away
they could use whatever restroomthey felt comfortable using.
It seemed like I was the onlyone recognizing these issues and
trying to advocate for them,and it was funny when I brought
it to my principal.
She was like I don't know whatyou're talking about.
(23:51):
You mean, there's an issue withall of you going to the nurse's
restroom in your five-minutebreak between classes, what?
And so it was definitely alonely fight at the beginning.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
This is Deborah Moncrief-Bell, and we're talking
with Hayden Cohen and CameronSamuels, the co-founders of SEAT
Students Engaged in AdvancingTexas, and they've done a whole
lot of work to do that.
The group was recognizedrecently at the Transgender
Unity Banquet.
I don't remember the name ofthe award that was given.
(24:23):
Can you recall, hayden?
I?
Speaker 5 (24:25):
would have to physically look at the award.
I know it was won for acollective organization.
It was actually specificallyfor an ally organization, which
we kind of laughed about becausesome folks are allies to the
trans.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
You have been aided by other organizations and
gotten training, so that itbecomes easier, because you're
(25:01):
not going in there withoutknowing a little bit.
I think the first time I everlobbied it was in Congress and I
was talking to Bill Archer, whowas at the time the most
conservative voting member ofCongress.
This is many, many years agoand I didn't know I had not
(25:25):
received enough training.
I had gotten a little bit fromthe National Organization for
Women, but essentially we justwent in there and talked to him.
I don't know that we made anydifference, but it let me know
that it was something that Icould do.
What have been the mostimportant lessons that you have
(25:45):
learned?
And, hayden, you can start, andthen we'll ask Cameron.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
I will tell anyone this, and Cameron knows this all
too well If you want to makesome significant change, if you
want to make some longstandingchange, you can't do it alone.
You really have to be workingwith other folks.
And I think SEED's so specialbecause we are learning off of
one another and it, as Karamentioned, it is more of a peer
(26:12):
mentor network, right?
Nobody's in this alone,nobody's testifying alone.
We're, we're watching eachother, we're sending each other
texts of encouragement, you know, and we're all kind of in this
together, as well as with otherorganizations outside of us, um,
actualual, like adult, adultpeople who have done this for
(26:34):
many years, who maybe havedegrees by now.
So I think that's one of themost important things.
And then I think the otherthing is you really have to be
passionate.
That was, I think that's, why Iended up going on for so much
of high school, because thereweren't other people around me
that were that kind of that, hadthat kind of passion.
And with seat when you get tomeet the students a part of seat
(26:56):
you see so much passion withthem.
You see so much we have ahebrew word for it, but like so
much I don't know how to explainit in english, but basically a
lot of passion, um for the workthey're doing right.
These are students who aredirectly affected by these
issues, who have felt theconsequences of these bills or
their policies and feltdisenfranchised by them, felt
(27:21):
like this was affecting theireducation, this was affecting
their livelihood in schoolsevery day, and so they're
fighting to make this change.
They're doing it for themselves,they're doing it for their
peers, they're doing it fortheir siblings.
This change, they're doing itfor themselves, they're doing it
for their peers, they're doingit for their siblings, and it's
something like you've never seenbefore, when students will do
anything and everything to makechange in their communities.
(27:41):
And I think that's one of thebiggest tools we have is our
encouragement of each other, andour passion to keep going is
our encouragement of each otherand our passion to keep going.
I know that there have beenvery long days in the Texas
legislature, days where you'restarting to drive from Houston
at 5 am, you're not getting hometill 1 pm or you're staying
(28:03):
overnight for a day or two, andit's so important that we keep
this passion with us that we'reencouraging each other
throughout this.
Speaker 4 (28:16):
And Cameron.
How about you?
What has been what you havelearned from doing the work?
Speaker 2 (28:21):
How can I follow that ?
Thank you, hayden.
And I could add that movementsdon't happen overnight.
That's one thing I've learned.
Movements take time.
It's a long game.
It's about taking the momentand making a movement out of it
to advance the status quo, tomove the needle, and that can be
(28:44):
accomplished by something likea hashtag, by legislation, by a
lapel pin.
But really it's more aboutwhat's built by the people.
There has to be a person, thereneeds to be people behind those
tactics.
As Hayden expressed, we are amovement of people and I learned
(29:09):
that we will lose.
That does happen.
There will be losses in thislong game, but we can look back
and see that we have madeprogress, that these little
losses over time have beenaccompanied by major wins, that
(29:31):
we are moving the needle and itis difficult to continue on our
way because, being a movementbuilt by people, we need to take
care of ourselves.
We need that healing andrestoration while lawmakers are
passing very cruel policies.
While lawmakers are passingvery cruel policies, cruelty is
(29:53):
their point.
They want to crush us, ourheart and our soul, and that's
where we stick together.
We stand up for one another.
When one person can't speak forthemselves, we work to help
elevate each other.
We are in this together andthat healing will result in
(30:15):
balance, where we aim to makethese policy shifts.
But we also know that we havean audience of the public too,
that if the public is not on ourside, then of course we're
going to see these policies takeplace.
Speaker 4 (30:31):
I'm sorry go ahead.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
I was just going to say the court of public opinion
is something that we mostdefinitely have to keep in mind,
where, if we are only lookingat the wins and losses
politically, then we areforgetting about the public that
is around us in our everydaysituations and those shifts are
(30:54):
just as impactful because thoseare people who can be part of
our movement.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
What you just talked about brings me to my next
question.
And we can't ask for donations.
But other than that, how canthe public, how can we who want
to be allies, have an impact onthe work of SEAT?
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Every person has a role they can play.
Everyone has an individualexpertise, is positioned in a
unique role as an individual, asa part of the workforce, as a
person of their family.
There is there is a unique waythat each person can show up,
and who better to know what thatway is but each of ourselves?
(31:41):
So, listening here today toy'all identify what you can do
to show up.
There's more than just one way,but start with that one way
when you can show up by makingyour voice heard in the circles
around you, or taking it even astep further and posting on
(32:05):
social media, writing an op-edor speaking at your school board
meeting or the statelegislature.
Our voices can have impact andwhen we do it together, then we
are stronger, in a sense thatthis is not just one person
alone, and showing up can meanfinancially, but that's not the
(32:26):
only way toward one objectiveand one goal.
We, with our many differenttactics and contributions, will
ultimately be stronger when weact like a majority.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
And I think I'm sorry , go ahead.
Speaker 5 (32:47):
I did want to answer Bill on this one.
I think for folks who arespecifically looking to get
plugged in and associated withSEED, we do have a lot going on
on social media, so following uson social media, but we also,
on our website,studentsengagedorg, we have a
get involved tab so you can booka meeting with an organizer,
you can email us if you'd liketo get involved.
(33:08):
A lot of folks hear about SEATthrough pieces that we've been a
part of, with publications ortimes that we've spoken at
events, or maybe times thatwe're tabling at events, and so
we have plenty of folks who willjust email us and be like hey,
I'm a student at this place andI'd like to get involved with
y'all, and as students weactually have a Slack, but for
(33:31):
adults we can communicatethrough email or social media,
and those are some great ways tokind of get plugged in to the
work that we're doing and sothat we can also support the
work that students want to do ontheir own.
Well, not on their own, becausewe'll be with them.
Speaker 4 (33:45):
And Hayden, you were a recent recipient of a Gayist
and Greatest Award from that.
Readers of Outsmart magazine Idon't remember what category
that was in readers of outsmartmagazine.
Speaker 5 (33:58):
I I don't remember what category that was in it was
the most prominent or, yeah,most prominent lgbtq plus youth
activist and it was funnybecause I accepted my award and
I had to get the x's written onmy hand because I was under 21
at the club I feel venue.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
I'm sorry you cut out part of that.
Say that sentence again.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
It was the most prominent lgbtq, lgbtq youth
activist, and it was funnybecause at the venue that they
held the awards party at, Iactually had to get massive
black X's drawn on my handbecause I was too young.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
You were underage for drinking alcohol, so they had
to make sure that you weren'tserved anything.
I was the only one with that on, believe me, yeah and there was
a lovely write-up in OutsmartMagazine featuring Hayden, and
that's another good way to learnabout some of the issues that
CD is working on.
Hayden and Cameron, Iappreciate you being with us
(34:50):
here on Queer Voices.
Is there anything else you wantto tell us that we didn't cover
?
Speaker 2 (34:55):
I guess public education is going to be a major
issue in the upcoming statelegislative session.
So there are intersectionsbetween public education.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
Stop, stop, stop.
Start that sentence again,because there was some crosstalk
there.
So say again, starting with theword education.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Public education is going to be a major issue in the
upcoming spring legislativesession in Texas, and there are
great intersections betweenpublic education and LGBTQ
identity.
So it's going to be ourresponsibility to remain
vigilant and show up when thosetimes arise where our rights,
(35:42):
our dignity, is going to be onthe chopping block.
And we're going to do all thatwe can with SEAT and hope that
everyone listening in can joinus in doing so to advance our
rights as queer people andstrengthen the foundation of our
democracy through protectingand defending public education.
Speaker 4 (36:03):
Well, thank you both for being with us on Queer
Voices.
Speaker 7 (36:16):
This is Queer Voices.
Brian Yuka has created originalinterdisciplinary theater works
for decades.
He's an early participant inthe development of Viewpoints
Theory.
He worked with Ann Bogart foryears, culminating in forming
Via Theater, which he took overas artistic director and became
a part of the downtown New YorkCity performance landscape of
(36:37):
the 90s.
And Via Theater produced two tothree original works a year.
It's amazing.
You go back, you look at NewYork Times interviews and their
raves and everybody loves it.
But in Houston we get toexperience Brian's work through
Catastrophic Theater and LoveBomb opens on November 15th at
the Match Facility in Midtownand runs into early December.
(36:58):
This will be his fifthcollaboration with Catastrophic
and its forerunner, infernalBridegroom Productions,
including they Do Not Move,toast Last Rites and we have
Some Planes.
And we have Some Planes has aspecific history to it because
it landed Yuka and theCatastrophic IBP Ensemble on the
cover of American TheatreMagazine, which they still talk
(37:20):
about.
So welcome to Queer Voices,brian Yuka.
Thank you Happy to be here.
I'm excited to have you becauseobviously I mean from this
introduction you've done a lotand you're definitely an artist
of note and you definitely madean impact here on the Houston
scene and Love Bomb, the mostrecent work.
It's touted as a conceptualmusical about taxi dancers, set
(37:44):
to the tunes of Melanie, thegirl from Woodstock who
everybody knows because of thatdang song about roller skates
Love Bomb, obviously.
Now I have been a theatercritic for 10 years and I missed
.
We have Some Planes it wasbefore my tenure of doing that.
For some reason, anotherBroadway role writer took the
assignment for every othercollaboration that you've done
(38:05):
with Catastrophic, so I amcoming in fresh.
What can I expect from?
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Love Ball, oh boy.
Well, what I do isinterdisciplinary dance theater
that has a loose narrative thatcan be interpreted differently
from one audience member to thenext.
Text in my work is not theprimary source of the experience
(38:33):
.
The text is as important as themusic, as the movement, as the
gestures, as the dance, as thesongs, as what is happening
between actors,relationship-wise from one to
the other.
And, as I say, you know thefunny thing about we have Some
(38:53):
Plans.
There were eight companymembers in that and we had some
people come back and see iteight times so they could just
watch each person Because,honestly, if you, you know,
depending on who you lom onto atany given moment, you're
experiencing something different.
So it's not just to be clear,it is not.
(39:15):
It is not site specific, it isnot interactive.
It is not just to be clear, itis not.
It is not size specific, it isnot interactive, it is not
audience participation.
Speaker 7 (39:22):
Melanie is a connection that we probably have
, because I'm a big fan ofMelanie as an artist.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Yeah, I heard that, which I think is crazy.
Speaker 7 (39:30):
It is kind of crazy.
And she is the musical muse forthis show.
What made you want to do apiece exclusively with her music
?
Speaker 3 (39:38):
okay, I was a teenage melanie groupie yeah, I saw
pictures okay, I discovered herwhen I was 10 and I went to see
her in concert for the firsttime when I was 11.
Between the ages of 11 and 20 Iprobably saw her 40 times maybe
.
And then the joke is I thenwent from Melanie to Patti Smith
(40:02):
.
That was my grouping status.
But so I mean I have known herfor ever and for ages.
I have always wanted to do apiece using her songs.
I was planning to do this lastsummer.
I never anticipated that shewould pass away, which she
passed away in January, so Iactually never got around to
(40:25):
asking her if it was okay withher.
I have gotten the approval andthe blessing of her family and
her children and her recordcompany and manager, so, but I
think she would have beenpleased.
You know what I love about herand if you know her stuff, most
people who know of her know herhit and have this conception of
her as this you know, flowerchild, hippie girl.
(40:45):
Her first two albums are very,you know they were very inspired
by Bertolt Brecht and KurtWeill.
They're gems of songs aboutrelationships, you know, and
falling in love and stuff likethat and falling out of love.
Most of what we are using aresongs from her very, very early
career, which were writtenmostly when she was a teenager.
(41:07):
So I've wanted to do this for avery long time and I'm finally
happy to get around to it.
Speaker 7 (41:14):
Apparently since you were 10.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
Happy to get around to it the way, apparently since
you were 10.
Yes, apparently since I was 10,you know.
The way that it's beingstructured is that in our dance
hall the taxi dancers also workas cabaret performers.
So the melanie songs are beingperformed as cabaret songs as
opposed to having a book thatthe songs inform one way or the
other.
So they are informing thecharacters, but they're not
(41:41):
unlike a traditional musical.
The songs are not motivatingthe action of the play.
Speaker 7 (41:46):
It's more like a cabaret presentation and
actually, ironically, the playcabaret sometimes has these
musical numbers that are justpresented as performances, which
is kind of an interestingdichotomy there.
But do you have like a favorite, melanie song?
I just was really curious.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Just I know it's like choosing sophie's choice, but
well, you know, it's really,really weird because I would
have answered that differentlysix weeks ago, but because of
the seven, because of the sevensongs that we are doing, I've
fallen back in love with some ofthe early songs that we are
doing.
I've fallen back in love withsome of the early ones that I
had kind of forgotten about,including I don't even know if I
(42:23):
should name them or not One ofthem was suggested by Melanie's
manager and it has turned out towork out so brilliantly.
The song is called Take Me Home, which I had kind of forgotten
about, and he was like youshould consider Take Me Home and
I was, like you know, went andlistened to it and I was like,
oh my God, that's perfect.
One of my favorite songs isLeftover Emotion, which we are
(42:45):
doing, which was written in herlater years but wasn't really
didn't get the recording duethat it should have gotten when
she was younger.
She did record it several times, you know, in her later years,
but it didn't make it on any ofthe you know big albums in the
70s.
The album photograph is myfavorite.
Speaker 7 (42:59):
I think that that's her work of genius that didn't
get to do it deserved probablyone of my favorite songs is
leftover wine, which I have afeeling probably wouldn't be in
the show, but because it neverhappens and I also really like
Lay Down, yeah, that's not inthe show either you're killing
me and neither is Brand New Keythat I'm fine with.
(43:24):
To me Brand New Key was alwayslike the gateway drug to Melanie
for people I felt like you knowpeople kind of.
It was the hit that you knew,but it really was kind of this
novelty hit kind of thing andshe did some things with her
voice on it and it was a littlebit it wasn't my favorite of
hers, I think it's.
It's a cute kooky song, verycatchy and obviously used a
(43:45):
great effect in film andcommercials and everything else
now and part of our pop culture.
But I do think there are somany more wonderful.
As you said, she's kind of thetaylor swift of her time as far
as like breakup songs and youknow she was, I mean, and
interesting.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
I I mean I honestly do feel like she didn't get her
due, because in 70, 71, 72, shewas, like you know, billboard's
top female vocalist and I meanshe started her own record
company when she had a fallingout with buddha.
So she's the first woman thatdid that started.
I mean mean, imagine a woman in1971, starting her own record
company, like that wascompletely unheard of.
(44:22):
But then, you know, by 78, shewas kind of like gone, you know,
and also she will say, wantedto have children.
So she had three beautifulchildren and that was more
important to her than her career, I think.
Speaker 7 (44:33):
Now you mentioned a term going back to Love Bomb
that some listeners may not befamiliar with taxi dancer.
What exactly is a taxi dancer?
Speaker 3 (44:41):
Well, a taxi dancer is a term for okay.
It was something that happenedin the 30s and 40s, before the,
you know, around the war timeperiod there would be clubs
where and it's largely thoughtthat it's mostly men going to
women, but it also was womengoing to men where you could go
(45:03):
and pay someone to dance withyou and they were called taxi
dancers because then afterwardseverybody would get in their
taxis and go home.
But it's basically what SweetCharity is based on.
Sweet Charity is a taxi dancer.
You look at the number BigSpender.
That is completely about taxidancers.
I first heard it with aninterview with Rudolph Valentino
(45:25):
, because apparently he was ataxi dancer before he was famous
and of course he implied thatit was more than just being a
taxi dancer that led intoprostitution.
I just found it veryinteresting in terms of a dance
hall place that people would goto dance with somebody and pay
(45:45):
them five cents or a nickel fora dance.
So I think it's a great premisefor human interaction.
Speaker 7 (45:53):
You know I would do it now.
Speaker 3 (45:55):
I'm going to be honest.
You would go pay someone for adance.
Sure, absolutely.
Speaker 7 (46:03):
I see nothing wrong.
We should bring this back.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
Maybe we should have a night after the show where we
just taxi dance.
Speaker 7 (46:13):
Genius, let's do it.
Speaker 3 (46:15):
All right.
Speaker 7 (46:15):
So I have heard urban myth, myth, whatever, but that
you often come to houston with aconcept and maybe you have a
beginning, maybe you have an end.
You get together with the cast,the catastrophic artists, you
collaborate and create thiswhole show kind of organically.
Is that tell me a little bitabout your process and how you
kind of differ from somebodythat comes in with a full, fully
(46:38):
realized, like a Michael Marrthat has everything already done
?
Speaker 3 (46:42):
Normally I have themes, I have ideas for things
that will happen.
There might be a structure thatwe play off of, like last Rites
we played off of Rites ofSpring Stravinsky's ballet.
We have some really easybecause it was text from the
morning of September 11th.
So we literally use that as thestructure.
(47:04):
They said the text at the timethat the text was said.
You know, that morning we willdo composition work where the
actors will create originalcharacters.
What they do is what becomesthe basis for what the audience
sees.
We also use something calledviewpoint improv work, which
goes way back, which youmentioned earlier.
(47:25):
But I did study with Ann Bogartand Mary Overly in 78 and 79 at
NYU's Experimental Theater Wing, and also Wendell Beavers, who
was Mary's husband at the time,and so we use the viewpoint
method of improv to reallycreate the human interactions
that happen.
We have pulled found texts fromplaces.
(47:48):
Occasionally we will have thebasis for a text but, like even
with Love Bomb, I tried not tohave a text were a text.
But, like even even with lovebomb, I tried not to have a text
, but I found that to put ittogether in four weeks we needed
something structurally toground it.
I won't say what it is somepeople may recognize it and some
(48:09):
people may not, but it doeshave something to do with serial
killers and so I love youcatastrophic artists Cause you
always come to me with this kindof thing.
Speaker 7 (48:24):
But like go back and listen to my interview with Walt
Zippering about Sarah Gainescleansed he would not tell me.
Speaker 3 (48:31):
Well, you know, part of it is you also want people to
be surprised and you don't wantpeople to come in with a
preconceived notion Toast.
We use the script of Alien, ofthe movie Alien.
Now, if I said that to peoplebefore they came okay, and that
was just one thing, you know,there was a lot of other text
with it If I said to people,we're doing the script of Alien,
(49:01):
well, you would think thatthat's what you would think,
that we were doing helium, whichis not what we were doing.
So that's why I don't want tosay what the justice was,
because it would lead people tothink one thing rather than
experiencing it for themselves.
Speaker 7 (49:05):
This blows my mind because obviously I told you you
know, I've been a theatercritic for 10 years and I've
been an actor for a lot longerand I don't want to admit that
how long I think about this andI'm like, if you wanted to
restage, like we have someplanes, it would be a different
show, wouldn't it?
I mean, even if you cast thesame people, they probably would
come up with different things.
Or I mean what in this process?
Speaker 3 (49:26):
I think it would be interesting and I kind of would
love to restage we have someplans, because so many people
were afraid of it, because wedid that in like march of 2002,
I believe that the actors wouldhave to learn what the actor's
original score was, and thenthey could make changes to some
extent, but you'd still have tohonor what the person originally
(49:49):
did.
So, yeah, I mean my, my,there's only been one piece that
I remounted and it pretty muchwe ended up having two or three
actors replace the original cast, and it was pretty much the
same so you just go through thisprocess once and then, if you
ever do it again, you've gotkind of the basis well, yeah, we
actually we don't have thehistory of that because we
(50:10):
haven't really done it.
Speaker 7 (50:11):
If I do anything again, previously when I talked
with jason, he was saying thatyou kind of work with them
exclusively now or are you stillworking with Via?
Speaker 3 (50:23):
No, Via disbanded.
I mean yeah, via disbanded, youknow in the early aughts.
You know, via Theatre wasoriginally a company that was
created for Anne Bogart toproduce her work in New York and
she wanted to open it up toother directors.
So we did and we were doingthat and I was the first, and
(50:46):
then we all went to Trinity Repfor a year where she was given
the artistic directorship andthen when we came back a lot of
the Trinity Rep performers kindof became the Via Theatre
company.
I kind of took it over becauseAnne was moving in other
directions.
You know and listen, I meanthis is my hats off to
Catastrophic.
(51:06):
The administrative horror showof raising money to do theater
in the United States isincredibly draining in the
United States is incrediblydraining.
So you know, after 15 years ofVia Theater, you know, every
time we did a show we were$10,000 in debt.
The fact that Catastrophic hasbeen doing this for 30 years is
just phenomenal, and phenomenalthat so many of the same people
(51:29):
are there.
You know to think that peoplethat I did the shows with in,
you know, 1997 are still a partof the company is just that's
nuts, you know, or that you knowof the seven people that are
doing Love Bob, six of them havedone other shows with me before
.
You know some of them have donethree or four.
So Tamri Cooper has done allfive.
(51:51):
So you know it's just amazingthat they're.
Because I so strongly believein the concept of company and I
think that what a company ofactors can do, you know there's
a shorthand that just doesn'texist.
I think with you know you haveto like get through that period
with a new group of actors thatwhen you have a company they
just they fall right into somekind of a pattern and pace that
(52:14):
is just genius.
Speaker 7 (52:15):
So well, I've always had the perspective that
catastrophic is definitely oneof the jewels of the houston
theater scene because they dostuff that nobody would touch.
Your larger companies are nevergoing to do it.
They're not going to take achance with experimental theater
, they're going to run away fromit shrieking because they've
got christmas carol and've gotChristmas Carol and they've got
(52:37):
Wicked and they've got Phantomof the Opera.
That's going to make them tonsof money.
So you know, putting on amusical with Melanie songs about
taxi dancers is not on theirbucket list or whatever.
And I love the, the viewpointthat they bring, the fact that
they do have this longevity andthey do have this history.
And you do feel that as aaudience member even you can
(52:58):
feel that connection betweensome of their company and the
through line of coming andseeing them over again and
different iterations ofthemselves and watching them
grow as actors and all of that.
It's it's it's a neat feeling,I think, and it's one that I
think is unique not only toHouston but to Catastrophic
itself.
I mean, I have not seen verymany companies like this around
(53:19):
the country.
So, and so often we get artiststhat can't do business, and
that's one of the problems withour industry is it's hard to
fund these things because we'renot financial people.
Speaker 3 (53:33):
That's why you know the theater system has managing
directors.
Speaker 7 (53:37):
So it's interesting and Houston really embraces
Catastrophic, which I think iswonderful and definitely anytime
that you come to town it'salways a big event.
So there you go.
Speaker 3 (53:47):
And I have moved here .
Have you?
I have moved here?
Yes, yeah, the story of thiswas I had done the first two
shows with Infernal Broadgroomand then Jason was asking me
every year if I would come anddo a show and I kept saying I
wasn't ready.
Plus, my mother was very sickand I was taking care of her and
blah, blah, blah and I had, youknow, getting away from New
(54:07):
York for six and I'm veryunusual because I like to go to
every performance.
So it drives me crazy if I havea show running and I can't go.
So, you know, atypically, Iwould do a show, open it, stay
for a week and then leave fortwo weeks and then come back for
the closing, which drove mecrazy.
(54:30):
With Toast, I had a Nest camerain the theater and I watched it
every night from home.
But no, the idea was, beforeCOVID, I was going to buy, I was
going to look for a place downhere and snowboard COVID and
people working from home andstuff like that, not to mention
as somebody who lives inManhattan trying to find a
property in Manhattan, I mean.
So basically, I found a condoin Houston.
The bedroom is the size of whatI could afford in Manhattan
(54:53):
alone, and I was just like youknow, I don't need to be there
anymore.
Speaker 7 (54:58):
Well welcome to Houston as a resident.
Absolutely yes, and that'sexciting.
Does that mean that we're goingto see more collaborations with
Catastrophic on a more regularbasis?
Speaker 3 (55:08):
Well, we hope.
Speaker 7 (55:08):
All right.
Well, brian Yuka Love Bombopens November 15th at the Match
Facility in Midtown.
It runs into early December.
You guys are in the traditionalspace, match 3, I believe, kind
of the catastrophic home mostof the time.
Sometimes they drift into 4,but I think 3 is typically
theirs and of course you've gotdifferent nights and things like
that.
Are there any special eventswith this one?
(55:29):
I know that.
Is there going to be a talkbackwith you?
Speaker 3 (55:31):
There will be a talkback, there will be an
industry night.
Obviously, we're not doing ashow on Thanksgiving, because
you know we are.
But listen, let me tell you weare the ultimate Christmas
holiday entertainment.
I was thinking Love.
Speaker 7 (55:45):
Bomb yeah.
Speaker 3 (55:47):
We're really not.
Speaker 7 (55:51):
Take the whole family .
Speaker 3 (55:53):
I said to the company last week that we should sing
one of Melanie's Christmas songsas an encore, because her
Christmas stuff is great too.
Speaker 7 (56:03):
Well, one thing that you guys do is you do free beer
Fridays, so every Friday you canenjoy a canned beverage with
the company of Love Bomb andapparently Brian, because it
sounds like you're at everysingle performance.
Speaker 8 (56:15):
So this has been Queer Voices, heard on KPFT
Houston and as a podcastavailable from several
podcasting sources.
Check our Web page Queericesorgfor more information.
(56:38):
Queer Voices executive produceris Brian Levinka, deborah
Moncrief-Bell is co-producer,brett Cullum and David
Mendoza-Druzman are contributors, and Brett is also our
webmaster.
Speaker 6 (56:54):
Some of the material in this program has been edited
to improve clarity and runtime.
This program does not endorseany political views or animal
species Views, opinions andendorsements.
He's also our webmaster, Thankyou.
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