October 8, 2025 • 57 mins
On this episode, QUEER VOICES looks at politics, history, and business. We begin by having Davis Mendoza Darusman speak with Molly Cook, a member of the Texas State Senate. Molly doesn't sugarcoat all of the challenges facing our community today inside Texas politics. Next, author and historian R. Lee Ingalls interviews Richard Watson about his life growing up and coming out decades back in Mississippi, New Orleans, and here in Houston. Richard talks about the challenges of being gay before it was legal or even accepted, and offers advice for us living in the here and now. Finally, Brett Cullum talks with Tammi Wallace about the GREATER HOUSTON LGBTQ+ CHAMBER OF COMMERCE. She focuses on women in business, but the conversation encompasses a wide range of topics for queer Houston.
Queer Voices airs in Houston Texas on 90.1FM KPFT and is heard as a podcast here. Queer Voices hopes to entertain as well as illuminate LGBTQ issues in Houston and beyond. Check out our socials at:
https://www.facebook.com/QueerVoicesKPFT/ and
https://www.instagram.com/queervoices90.1kpft/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_05 (00:02):
This is KPFT 90.1 FM Houston, 89.5 FM Galveston, 91.9
FM Huntsville, and worldwide onthe internet at KPFT.org.
SPEAKER_02 (00:21):
Welcome to Queer Voices, a radio show that has
been on KPFT for over fivedecades.
We're also a podcast, so howeveryou found us, we are glad you
are here.
Tonight we will look at LGBTQIAplus voices from three
perspectives politics, history,and business.
First up, we have Molly Cook.
She is an American registerednurse and politician who is a
(00:42):
member of the Texas Senate forthe 15th District.
She's a Democrat who was electedin a May special election to
fill the vacancy from JohnWhitmire's resignation to become
mayor of Houston.
Then we have author R.
Lee Ingalls, who interviewsRichard Watson as part of a
series discussing gay historywith people.
Richard tells us what it waslike for him growing up in rural
(01:03):
Mississippi and then discoveringour community in New Orleans.
Finally, I get to talk to TammyWallace about women and the
greater Houston LGBTIQ PlusChamber of Commerce.
Queer Voices start now.
SPEAKER_03 (01:43):
Excited to introduce and be speaking with our guest,
State Senator Molly Cook,Democrat for Texas Senate
District 15, which includes aportion of Houston in Harris
County.
Senator Cook was sworn in in May2024 after winning a special
election to fill the seatvacated by now Mayor John
Whitmire.
Molly Cook is a registered nursewith dual graduate degrees in
nursing and public health fromJohn Hopkins University and is
(02:06):
not only the youngest sittingstate senator in Texas, but also
the first openly LGBTQ personelected to the Texas Senate.
Senator Molly Cook.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Thank you so much, David.
So good to be back.
SPEAKER_03 (02:19):
Absolutely.
Now there's a lot to get intobecause as we know and have
covered on Queer Voices, queervoices as a community are being
silenced and our people areunder attack.
But that's at least myassessment.
What would you say is yourlandscape analysis on the state
of being LGBTQ in Texas thisyear?
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
I can't sugarcoat it.
It is, it's just unbelievablytough.
It really is, especially whenwe're looking at our triance
brothers, sisters, and siblings,anybody who is at any kind of
intersection at all of otherforms of oppression.
Um, things are really hard andyou can feel it out in the
community.
But I always want to include thefact that I have a lot of hope.
I see some paths forward.
(03:01):
And there even were a couple ofhighlights from the 89th regular
session here in Texas.
It's uh it's mostly a painfulpicture, but uh it's just still
a joy.
They can't take away queer joy.
I'm so thankful to be in acommunity, and I've got a lot of
hope for us, and and we'reworking on making it better.
SPEAKER_03 (03:17):
Definitely want to start with some of the victories
before we get into some of thethe struggles and the fights
that we have ongoing.
Because, you know, being thefirst openly LGBTQ plus Texas
senator, what are some of thebiggest challenges you faced in
this role, but also thevictories that you see to be
most meaningful so far thissession?
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Of course, just watching the trans community
experience more violence andscapegoating and and just a lot
of unfairness was very painful.
Um, that was the toughest partof session.
It's just so clear that thepowers that be and the
Republican Party are willing touse human beings as wedge issues
to accomplish political goalsand gain power.
(03:57):
And it's wrong, it's horrible,um, and we've got to work to
stop it.
So just being, you know,powerless to change the number
of votes on some of these billsis very difficult.
But as we know, there's a lot ofways to work on these issues and
love our communities that aren'tjust voting yes or no on a bill.
SPEAKER_03 (04:15):
Yeah, I I'm curious how you build coalitions and
push forward progressive policyor really any policy that
doesn't demonize and dehumanizeLGBTQ plus population and a
largely Republican legislature.
SPEAKER_00 (04:30):
I kind of so the Texas Senate is an interesting
place, and I've talked aboutthis with some folks.
There's less opportunity in theTexas Senate for some coalition
building that I was hoping forin what we all think of as like
these horseshoe theory momentswhere somebody is so far left
and somebody is so far rightthat they end up actually
sometimes agreeing on certainthings.
(04:51):
There's a libertarian angle toliving and letting live that
allows for um a little moretolerance of homosexuality in
general or any kind of, youknow, expression that's not
mainstream.
So in the house, I was really,really proud and impressed to
watch my colleague, uhRepresentative Benton Jones get
his bill across the finish linein the house, which would
(05:14):
decriminalize homosexuality.
Currently on the books, it isstill says that it's illegal for
two men to have sex with eachother, right?
And so we know that that's neverreally prosecuted right now, but
it's still scary to have thosewords on the books and they're
not right.
And so we need them repealed.
And so his bill repealed thatlanguage and got all the way
through the house for the firsttime ever.
It did not receive a hearing inthe Texas Senate because of the
(05:36):
the culture and the flavor ofthe Texas Senate doesn't allow
for that kind of coalitionbuilding.
But what is exciting is thehouse is more reflective of the
population of Texas.
And so there are folks out therewho are on the right who do have
some tolerance for people beingable to make their own private
decisions and enjoy their ownprivate lives.
Um, and so that was reallyexciting to get to see him work
(06:00):
that kind of coalitiondevelopment with success.
SPEAKER_03 (06:03):
That's that's really great to hear.
Thank you for sharing that.
And you know, I'm gonna behonest with you, I I want to
hear some more good news if youhave any.
Please share with us, thelisteners, any more good news
that we have before we get intosome of the bills that passed
and were signed by GovernorAbbott, such as Senate Bill
Eight just last night.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
I felt pretty strongly after, you know, Vice
President Harris's loss, thatthere was real risk that a lot
of folks were going to reach forthe closest thing and and blame
that.
Like for instance, uh, there's acouple different issues, but one
of them is did we go too far?
Are we too woke on LGBTQ plusissues?
Um, is that the reason that welost?
(06:43):
And you hear some of thatrhetoric, you see it online, you
heard a little bit of it in thebuilding, but really what I saw
once session got started and thelaws were being written again
and the people reacting in realtime, it's just so obvious that
these bills are hateful, thatthey are not rooted in science,
that we have indeed not gone toofar at all in protecting the
LGBTQ ⁇ community.
And in fact, there's a whole lotfurther to go.
(07:05):
Um, and that our our rights andour experiences are just
intertwined and linked in a waythat's inextricable.
So if we're telling somebody youcan't dress or look a certain
way, that puts absolutelyeverybody at risk.
If we're telling people, youknow, you should use
vigilanteism to to kick eachother out of the bathrooms, that
puts absolutely everybody atrisk, whether you're getting
(07:26):
straight, transist, it doesn'tmatter.
Everybody is at risk whenthere's a culture of
vigilanteism in Texas.
And I really saw fromconversations around the Capitol
and the district that peoplereally feel that in their bones.
I almost felt like the alliesgrew more fervent as the as the
horrifying bills were beingwritten.
(07:47):
Um, and so some of what we sawas disappointments, failures,
you know, bad bills passinginside the Capitol, outside of
the Capitol, people understandthat it's authoritarianism, that
it is fascist, that it is acomplete violation of the
constitution, and that it meansall of us are at risk for more
violence.
There's just a real feeling ofpeople are like, what do we do?
(08:08):
How do we protect our neighborswho are gender non-binary, who
are communities, who are out,who are, you know, not just
citizens straight, basically.
And people are reaching forwhat's our options.
And I do think right now,unfortunately, because of where
we're at, some of the optionsinclude things like don't let
people go to the bathroom alone,you know, or make sure that when
you're hiring, you're going intothe community to find out who
(08:29):
needs work right now, who isexperiencing job loss because of
discrimination or these chillfactors and things like that.
So inside the Capitol, thingsfeel pretty terrible.
But as soon as I walk outside,there's just a hunger to love
each other, to support eachother, to weather this storm and
to keep each other safe until wecan um elect folks who care
about public health, who careabout our community, and who are
(08:52):
willing to repeal these laws.
My hope, as always, is in thepeople and in the organizing.
Um, and our district just ourdistrict is pretty dang out and
proud, and it feels good to behome.
SPEAKER_03 (09:04):
I love that.
And wanting to kind of buildupon this this landscape
analysis, you know, on the stateof being LGBTQ in Texas this
year.
I'm curious about the issuesthat you're hearing from your
constituents in your districtthat are specific to the LGBTQ
plus community.
What's what's being raised?
What's what's being talked aboutwhenever people call in or visit
(09:25):
you?
SPEAKER_00 (09:26):
People are really worried about how these laws are
supposed to work.
So, you know, there's one thatsays that your government
documents now must reflect whatyour birth certificate says.
So if you've gone and had agender marker changed for any
reason, now that's in flux andthat's in, you know, it's being
it's being threatened andattacked, and people will have
(09:46):
to go back and change things.
And the attorney general is, youknow, keeping lists of folks and
that sort of thing.
So people are very, very, veryconcerned about how is this
actually supposed to work.
Same thing with the bathroombill.
It's like, well, what you know,the the bill changed shape so
many times because it'sterrible.
It's an awful, painful, sloppypolicy.
So you couldn't get it passed,couldn't get it passed, it
(10:08):
changed shape multiple times.
So now the final version of thebathroom bill is just that
government buildings, anythingthat's kind of government owned
and run, has to have a policy inplace that requires you to use
the bathroom that matches thegender marker on your birth
certificate.
That is such a far, far cry fromwhat it originally started as.
(10:28):
Um, and so people are wondering,you know, it relies on the
report, again, vigilanteism onreporting on your neighbors.
So, like, how is this supposedto work?
What does an adequate policyreally mean?
Is there a way to put a policyin place, but still just kind
of, you know, let people do whatmakes sense and what feels
right?
Um, and then of course, I'veheard from from several just
(10:49):
members of our community who arelike, no one wants me using the
bathroom that matches the gendermarker on my birth certificate.
Nobody wants me in thatbathroom.
So there's just a lot of fearand trepidation around how
exactly this is all supposed towork.
People are want help keepingtrack of, of course, what
lawsuits have been filed, wherethings are at in the court
system.
Of course, in Texas, we we feelthat chaotic flip-flop all the
(11:12):
time about issues that arereally near and dear to us,
whether it's our community orimmigration.
One day a law is on the books,the next day it's a challenge,
and it is again.
Sometimes we have better answersthan others.
I think for a lot of thesepolicies, they're purposely not
thought out.
They're campaign moments, right?
And so it's not actuallyimportant policy to anyone.
And so the fear and the chaos isthe goal.
(11:34):
And so then you, of course, haveto take that mutual aid angle
again.
Like while this is happening,until we can elect the right
people on the ground, how are wekeeping each other safe?
Like physically in and out, youknow, every single day, checking
on our neighbors, being acommunity, and really keeping
each other safe and watchingeach other's backs.
SPEAKER_03 (11:52):
Yeah, that that's really helpful.
And and wanting to stay on thetopic of the bathroom bill,
Senate Bill Eight, I can shareuh personally, as the
co-president of the Universityof Houston's LGBTQ Plus alumni
network, we are working with theUniversity of Houston to
actually compile a map of samegender single stall, all gender
(12:13):
restrooms so that we canactually pinpoint on a map and
support LGBTQ plus studentsidentify exactly where on campus
they can be without fear ofharassment.
And we're also wanting to doknow your rights trainings for
students because you mentionedgovernment buildings, University
of Houston, state funds fromTexas.
(12:34):
And so, what are some otherkinds of ways that you can
imagine supporting LGBTQstudents and individuals who
just want to use the restroomand really just want to exist
amidst this bill?
SPEAKER_00 (12:47):
I know, and it's just so it's so painful because
um, you know, it feels like thatscene in hidden figures is just
like we have done this before,we've been here before, this is
wrong.
Everybody knows it.
So the the one thing I will saybeyond doing what y'all are
doing, which is, you know,proactively going in and saying,
hey, you know, as the affectedcommunity, we'd love to help
(13:07):
craft this policy or we'd loveto help, you know, create
resources for folks andeverything like that.
You know, just trying to do yourbest to reduce harm and um
create some safe spaces andthings like that.
Um I think you know, it'simportant for folks to know too.
This passed in I can't rememberif it was North Dakota or South
Dakota.
It's one of the Dakotas.
Um, it was struck down almostinstantly by a federal judge.
And her opinion that she wrotewas just fantastic.
(13:30):
And there is nothing about thisthat is constitutional.
It encourages discrimination, itencourages violence, it's
absolutely unenforceable withoutcommitting a crime against
somebody else.
There are so many instanceswhere even just
masculine-looking non-transwomen have been attacked in a
restroom as a result of eventhese conversations and laws.
(13:50):
And here in Texas as well, inthe city of Odessa, they had a
lame duck city council.
So they were on their way out,they they couldn't be
re-elected, and and the mayorand they had a bathroom bill in
Odessa, which is not SanFrancisco, it's Odessa, Texas.
Conservative place.
And the new city council andmayor came in and immediately
repealed it.
And they said it was justdiscriminatory, it didn't make
(14:12):
sense, it's unenforceable.
And so I think we need to tellthat story as well.
Of course, you know, don't letsomebody harass your friend in
the bathroom, don't let peoplego alone, like keep each other
safe, et cetera.
But also, like, you know, feelcomfortable telling the story
that there have been very, veryconservative places that have
put these laws into action andthen immediately taken them back
(14:35):
out of action because they don'twork, they don't make sense, and
they cause a lot of harm.
Um, and also we can tell thestory of the fact that, you
know, I had the conversation onthe Senate floor with the author
of this bill, and there werefamily violence shelters who
asked for language changes, whoasked for amendments to allow
them to safely provide care, andthose were turned down.
(14:57):
And so, as you know, the theright tries to shape this
narrative of protecting women,they are literally making the
jobs of family violence sheltersharder to do.
And they don't know what they'retalking about.
They're not involved withaffected communities of
violence.
And so we have to feel reallystrong and confident in our our
facts and being able to tell thestory that this makes all of us
(15:20):
less safe.
It's not enforceable, it'sfoolish policy, it's it's
wasting time, precious time insession where we should be using
this to make groceries andhousing more affordable for
Texans.
All of that resonates withfolks, and we need to just
permeate our culture with thetruth because it will literally
keep us safer and hopefullybring about change faster rather
(15:41):
than slower.
SPEAKER_03 (15:42):
What keeps you emotivated to continue this work
amidst everything that's goingon and everything that your
colleagues are pushing?
What gives you hope for thefuture of LGBTQ plus Texans?
SPEAKER_00 (15:53):
I love this question.
I mean, a lot of my hope is Ican't even tell you, leaving
Austin, leaving the specialsession, which was just so
unpleasant to say the least.
It's like as we drove home andit got more humid, and I was
back on Harris County soil andyou know, seeing all of my hope
is in us.
It's in our community, righthere, here in Harris County or
(16:14):
wherever you're sitting, butbeing out, being proud, loving
yourself, loving your neighbors,that's where all of my hope is.
And I don't think that what'sgoing to save Texas is the
Texans.
I really do.
And so, you know, people, it'stempting to look up toward
powers that be.
But I look side to side, andthat's where my hope is.
My hope is also in my team.
I don't ever do work alone.
(16:35):
I've never done work alone.
Everybody should be in acommunity, in a team, you know,
seek that out, soak up the loveand the help from it, pour out
your own love and help, and itmakes all of us stronger and all
of us better people.
And then the last thing I'llsay, which is not specific to
the LGBTQ community, but it'svery exciting to me.
After I got elected, Iimmediately founded a pack
(16:56):
called Organize to Win Pact.
So it's a political actioncommittee, you know, it takes in
just donations, we run a prettytight ship.
And the whole purpose of thisorganization existing is to go
out and talk to people who havenot shown up and voted very much
early, get to them early so thatwe can first offer something
before we ask for something, andthen actually build trust.
(17:18):
And so when I've been out doorknocking, which I try to make a
regular practice, especially nowthat I'm elected, I'm talking to
folks who are, you know, sittingbehind their front doors in
their homes worried aboutfederal cuts, they're worried
about school vouchers, they'reworried about redistricting all
these wildly unpopular policiesthat are coming from the right
right now.
They're worried about theauthoritarianism and things feel
(17:39):
like they're destabilizing.
And they also usually have somesort of problem that we can help
with.
Something as simple as replacinga trash can, but they often also
don't have a party affiliationand they don't know who who
represents and serves them.
And so, to me, again, nottotally specific to like a queer
community, but when we'rethinking about what is the left
(18:00):
doing to increase capacity, toincrease power, to build back
trust with voters, I thinkthere's a lot of opportunity
that we aren't even necessarilytaking advantage of.
And it's as simple as going out,knocking on somebody's door and
saying, You've probably neverheard of me, but I serve you.
And I'm not here to ask for yourvote.
I'm not here to ask for adonation, I'm not here to ask
(18:21):
you for anything.
I'm here for you to tell me whatis something in your life that I
can try to help you with, that Ican try to take off of your
plate, because that's howgovernment should work anyway.
And we leave little flyersbehind with a QR code, with a
survey where people can submittheir issues if they didn't open
the door.
And we feed a lot of thoseconstituent issues from the PAC
(18:42):
to the office.
And then the office takes itfrom there.
Um, and what's exciting is theoffice phone has been ringing
off the hook.
We have had an increase of theconstituent services uptake
since the PAC has gone out andstarted talking to folks.
So I just want people to know,you know, if you live in our
area, follow on social media atMollyford, Texas.
We have volunteer opportunitiescoming up.
(19:02):
If you don't live in our area,send us a DM and ask us how
we're doing it so you can do itin your, you know, where you
live in Texas or wherever youlive.
But there is opportunity forpower building on the left that
is, you know, it's just notrocket science.
It's just exactly what we shouldbe doing.
Put one foot in front of theother, do the right work the
right way for the right reasons,and we are already seeing it
make a difference in ourdistrict.
SPEAKER_03 (19:22):
What message do you have for our haters, the people
who want to keep us down?
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
Don't hate us.
You're just hating yourself,man.
A world where people are free tolove themselves and others, to
know themselves and others, to,you know, to understand who God
is, what the earth is.
Like one of us is free.
We can all be free.
So I just wish that our haterscould look in the mirror and
(19:49):
realize that if you're hating onus, it's because you're hating
on something inside yourself.
And when you can learn to lovethat about yourself and truly
accept yourself, the way thatthe LGBTQ plus community models
for the rest of the world, thiswould be a lot healthier, safer
of a place.
Everybody's cortisol levelscould go down and we could all
have a lot more fun.
So I encourage all of our hatersto look inward and just see if
(20:13):
maybe, maybe it's coming from,you know, calls coming from
inside the house and actuallyour community is really, really
good about being authentic,truthful, and loving.
SPEAKER_03 (20:22):
I love that so much.
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
This has been our guest, StateSenator Molly Cook, Democrat for
Texas Senator Senate District15, not only the youngest
sitting state senator in Texas,but also the first openly LGBTQ
person elected to the TexasSenate.
Thank you so, so much, SenatorMolly Cook.
SPEAKER_00 (20:40):
Thank you, TMS.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
Thank you, Molly Cook and David, for discussing
Texas politics with us.
Well, now we're gonna move on toan interview conducted by author
and historian R.
Lee Ingalls.
He sits down with RichardWatson, who is a man who has
been a part of the HoustonLGBTQIA Plus community for
several decades.
Richard has been involved innumerous nonprofits, including
(21:05):
the crew of Olympus and themystery and fantasy Mardi Gras
Party.
This is the first of an ongoingseries where we feature queer
voices who can share theirperspective and history within
our own community.
SPEAKER_04 (21:19):
Hi everyone, this is R.
Lee Ingalls, and I am joinedtoday by longtime Houston
resident Richard Watson.
Richard has been part of ourcommunity for the past several
decades, and we're going to talkabout what growing up gay was
like for his generation and someof the impacts of significant
events in our community.
Richard, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER_07 (21:38):
Thank you, Lee.
I appreciate you having me.
SPEAKER_04 (21:41):
Yeah, yeah.
So we've known each other for along time.
We've really never had this kindof a discussion.
And I think it's important forus to talk about how our lives
were different when we wereyounger than what they are
today.
So for you, you grew up inMississippi?
SPEAKER_07 (21:55):
I did, small town in Mississippi, yes.
SPEAKER_04 (21:57):
Yeah, so what was it like being gay in that
environment?
SPEAKER_07 (22:00):
Well, actually, I can't answer that because there
weren't any gay people.
That was a period now we'retalking about 70 or 80 years
ago.
And that was a time when theydidn't have gay people.
You had a few queers, but theyweren't the same context at all.
So that never came up in mylifetime.
SPEAKER_04 (22:20):
So those people that were identified or called queer
by the other parts of thecommunity, you never saw
yourself as part of that groupthen.
Well, it wasn't necessarilysexual.
It was just characteristics,etc.
Yeah.
And you didn't identify asthose.
SPEAKER_07 (22:33):
No.
SPEAKER_04 (22:33):
At what point did you realize that you were gay,
even though gay might not havebeen a term at that point?
SPEAKER_07 (22:39):
I think that was a turning point when I was in my
preteens.
Like I say, we lived in a smallcommunity.
My dad had a Friday large form.
And Christmas rolled around, andI came down Christmas morning,
and it was a saddle, smallsaddle, and a donkey out in the
garage.
And a dollhouse.
My mother had misunderstood alinehill train system.
(22:59):
I was trying to find houses forthe train system, not a
dollhouse.
Anyway, I got the dollhouse, andwhat did I do?
I went to the dollhouseimmediately.
The donkey and saddle sat forquite a while.
So I think that was uh shouldhave been uh a light coming on.
It didn't.
It should have been.
SPEAKER_04 (23:16):
Wow.
Okay.
Okay, so going up then, did youhave any role models at all?
No.
No one else.
No.
Yeah.
Well, and and that was fairlycommon at that time.
At that time.
So at some point you did realizethat you were gay, and how did
the family did they know?
How was it accepted?
SPEAKER_07 (23:37):
Well, I was uh when I was in college, I was married,
and I was not gay.
I didn't know I was gay.
And my wife was in an accident,and she lost her life.
SPEAKER_04 (23:47):
Oh my.
SPEAKER_07 (23:48):
And I uh did not remarry, didn't get engaged
later on, but that lasted aboutsix months.
I moved to uh Jackson,Mississippi.
Or a friend of mine had a friendthat lived on the Gulf Coast,
and we went down to visit thetwo of us dead, and this guy was
really nice.
I went back a few times.
Well, he was gay.
And through him is when Irealized that, yeah, that was my
(24:10):
calling.
And when I finally realized thatit wasn't a matter of opening
the door, the door flew off thehinges.
I never really confronted ortold it wasn't anybody's
business but mine.
I never talked to my familyabout it, and they never brought
it up.
Years later, I was living in NewOrleans, and I had broken my
leg, and my mom had decided sheneeded to come down and visit.
(24:32):
Well, that was fine, except Ihad a boyfriend.
So the three of us were stayingin a small apartment down in the
French corner.
And as she was leaving, shelooked at me one time and she
said, You and Warren, that washis name.
You don't blame me or yourfather.
And I said, Blame me for what?
Well, your lifestyle.
I said, my lifestyle was mychoice, not yours.
(24:54):
And if you're accepting it,that's great.
If you don't, that's yourbusiness.
And that's how it all came out.
SPEAKER_04 (24:59):
Unusual.
So were they then accepting ofit, or did it take a little time
to adjust?
SPEAKER_07 (25:04):
Yeah, I've always heard that's your mom knows way
before you do anyway.
Right.
So I don't think that was a bigshock.
And I still had my little vacuumcleaner from my dollhouse.
SPEAKER_04 (25:15):
Okay, so I'm talking about relationships,
sustainability of relationships.
Well, how do you find that inour community versus what you
see in the heterosexualcommunity or other communities?
SPEAKER_07 (25:26):
Yeah, I think that the secret to that, firstly, you
have to be honest with yourselfand you have to be honest with
others.
And that's kind of the attitudethat I take at this work so far.
SPEAKER_04 (25:42):
Well, and and talking about the gay
relationships, of course, youhave a husband, Robert, and
knowing the two of you, we havewhat I view, and I think others
view as a very successfulrelationship.
SPEAKER_07 (25:55):
We've been together about 27 years, and we've been
married since 2014.
SPEAKER_04 (26:00):
Right.
SPEAKER_07 (26:00):
So yeah, I think we have a pretty successful
relationship.
Robert, we take advantage ofrelationships, we take advantage
of each other, and sometimesthat becomes a problem.
But when I stop and think abouthow it would be without Robert,
as such an eye opener, Iconsider myself very fortunate.
And yeah, we work at it.
Any relationship you have towork at.
(26:21):
And it works if you're willingto put the time in.
SPEAKER_04 (26:23):
Well, kind of looking back to an earlier time
in your life before we could getmarried, how did you look at
your relationships or therelations ability to have a
relationship at that time?
Did you see that as viable or orno?
SPEAKER_07 (26:39):
Yeah, I did.
Oh, you tell it to people.
Right.
So you know, at that time it wasyour partner or your special
friend or this kind ofrelationship.
I never thought I would ever seegay marriage.
And when that happened, I waselighted.
But as far as my relationshipwith Robert, it was as though it
was a marriage.
SPEAKER_04 (27:03):
Well, do you did you kind of parallel the design of
your relationship after aheterosexual relationship, or
did you see it differently?
SPEAKER_07 (27:10):
It was obviously different.
At least our relationship, I Ithink there was some
codependency.
And the heterosexualrelationship seemed to be one
way.
And as a result, I think that uhyou have to be very
knowledgeable of someone else'sfeelings and their attitudes to
uh and to appreciate them forwhat they are.
So no, I think there is adifference there.
(27:31):
It's uh mutual type thing.
SPEAKER_04 (27:33):
I would I would agree.
And like I said, the two of youhave an extraordinary
relationship.
Okay, and then it's going pastthat then, the you know, the
partnership or or togethernessrelationship to friendships in
general.
I know that for you and I, wehave friends that go back more
than 30 years, and you even morethan that.
So do you think that that'sunique to our community, or how
(27:56):
do you see that?
SPEAKER_07 (27:57):
I think it might be unique to our community and the
I don't know, sexual community.
Friends, long-term relationshipsseem to be more family-oriented.
We don't have that in ourrelationships and in our
community.
So I think that's kind of uhdifferent for the gay community.
We have a lot of things thatgays do in common that a lot of
(28:17):
strikes don't.
We've been through a lot, we'vefaced a lot, we've challenged a
lot.
And I think that in itself is abinder to keep a community
together.
SPEAKER_04 (28:26):
Taking going back again in time to your teens and
twenties, how is the communitydifferent now than what it was
then?
What differences are you seeing?
SPEAKER_07 (28:36):
Much more open and much more accepting.
It's not a word that doesn'texist.
People use it now, people arenot afraid to live in a shadow.
And I think that's a verytelling point because there's so
many people in my generationthat had they not had this, and
I call it a burden problem abouttrying to quote unquote be
(28:58):
straight, would have been a lothappier and a lot more
productive.
I think that that's veryimportant today, that the teens
and twenties, even into the 30s,this is very important.
You are accepted, you can make alife for yourself, and you can
benefit others.
SPEAKER_04 (29:14):
Yeah, yeah, no, I totally agree.
So back when we were young inour twenties, etc., there was no
internet.
To meet people for mygeneration, the option was to go
to a gay bar, a bar that wasconsidered gay.
What did you experience?
SPEAKER_07 (29:30):
Well, when I did finally come out, I'd never been
to a bar, and I was living inJackson, Mississippi.
Well, I accepted a job in NewOrleans.
So I moved down to New Orleans.
So I went, I thought, okay, I'vegot to try a gay bar.
Didn't know anything about gaybars, gay bars, anything like
that.
So I walked into this bar onBourbon Street, as it turned out
it was a drag bar, and I wastotally freaked out.
(29:53):
I thought, oh my god, does thatmean to be gay you have to be
running around and drag all thetime?
And I was just I wastraumatized.
I had a nice time and I talkedto some nice people, but I just
could not accept this.
And I wouldn't go back to a barfor a long time.
And finally, some friends thatwould come on and we went, and
it was a different kind of baraltogether.
That was fine.
I don't have any problem withthat.
(30:14):
So no, my first experience wassort of an eye opener to say the
least.
SPEAKER_04 (30:18):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I remember my first dragshow as well.
And I it was actually somebodythat I worked with also during
the day that did drag at night,and I found it unusual, just as
you did.
But I was prepared for it.
I knew what was coming.
So I I was just mesmerized byit.
I had never even back then theycalled it uh female
(30:39):
illusionists, is what they were,is how we characterized it.
Okay, some of the major eventsthat took place then during our
our time on this earth.
Stonewall.
SPEAKER_07 (30:49):
Stonewall actually happened in the early, early,
early part of my adult years.
I don't like I still wasn't anadult, but it was a long time
ago.
It didn't I didn't reallyunderstand exactly what it was
when it happened.
Well, I didn't know now.
Certain, certainly, that was aturning point.
Stonewall was, I think thebiggest impact on me personally
(31:12):
was the AIDS crisis.
I had a large circle of friendsback in our 30s, about then,
30s, early 40s.
Big circle of friends.
I would say probably 15 or 20.
We ran around together a lot,partying a lot.
Only one other one survived.
He and I survived.
And it got to the point where wewere going to funerals multiple
(31:32):
times a month.
We were losing friends left andright.
Parents were not accepting this.
They were denying thesechildren, these sons and
daughters.
It was a really traumaticexperience for me.
And I have often wondered, as Idiscussed with my friend that
survived, why were we spared?
We don't know.
SPEAKER_04 (31:49):
I think there's a lot of people of our generation
that feel the same way.
There are precious few of us.
They didn't make it throughthat.
I think all of us have that samequestion.
Why, why was I why did I comethrough it?
Yeah.
And I saw entire circles ofpeople disappear.
Yes.
Disappear.
Well, one of the things that Ifound happened common during
(32:10):
that time period is when someonebecame ill.
I mean, you there was kind of afew things that were telling
what was going on, but theneventually they moved away.
Did you experience that samething?
SPEAKER_07 (32:21):
No, because a lot of them didn't have any place to
move to.
Again, I guess their parents gotinvolved and they rejected them.
Most of them that I knew stayedwith friends in our group.
Most of them died in theirhomes.
So no, they did not move away.
In a way, I think that was goodbecause it gave us the
opportunity to at least stay intouch with them and not let them
(32:41):
know that they were cared for.
SPEAKER_04 (32:42):
Yeah, I would have to agree with that.
And I was part of the earlyyears Omega House when it was
being put together.
Eleanor Munger worked veryclosely with her uh during those
early years.
So yeah, it it was a very sadtime in our community.
Moving forward a little bit intime for early 2000s and
marriage equality, when thatfirst started coming on the
(33:05):
scene, when did you think, youknow, go from marriage is not an
option for us to thinking, youknow what, maybe this will
happen.
What was when was that and whatwas that like?
SPEAKER_07 (33:17):
When s well, when some states, particularly on the
northeast, started allowingmarriage, gay marriage, I
thought maybe there's hope.
I never thought Texas would.
Consequently, I was thrilledwith the prospect of actually
making this relationship I hadwith Robin something more
permanent in a legal sense.
So we went to Minnesota and gotmarried.
(33:37):
And it was after that, ofcourse, that Texas also followed
suit.
That I think was a turning pointin the gay world anyway.
Uh, when you had the opportunityto marry and express your love
for another person that was ofthe same gender.
SPEAKER_04 (33:51):
Brett and I this year are celebrating 20 years
together.
When we first met, there was nomarriage equality.
It wasn't even in either one ofour minds that it's someday that
we would actually be able tolegally get married.
And I know Texas still has onthe books that they it is not
legal.
However, my understanding is theSupreme Court ruling, parts of
that ruling were codified.
(34:13):
And one of those pieces thatwere codified is that every
state will recognize themarriage from another state.
And like you, we were married inMinnesota the year before the
Supreme Court made their ruling.
So we were married in a statethat that allowed it.
Even it's even should thatchange, God forbid, that should
(34:34):
change.
In Texas, our marriage wouldstill be recognized because of
that, how they codified at leastportions of it.
Yeah, we both got married in2014, two months apart.
The oddest thing for me isRobert, your husband, and I
share so much in common in ourpast.
SPEAKER_07 (34:50):
You do, yes.
SPEAKER_04 (34:51):
A few months apart in age, we grew up in a very
very close to each other, ourearly careers very much look
like each other.
Yeah, so that certainly has hashelped the friendship between
the four of us.
And then you both married twowonderful men.
You know, yes, I agree with thatwholeheartedly.
Okay.
So looking forward in time, andpart of what our responsibility
(35:15):
is, is helping the nextgeneration, you know, pick up
where we left off and taking ourcommunity forward.
What advice would you have forsomeone who's young now,
struggling with coming out, andand put them on a path where
they can then be as successfulas we were?
SPEAKER_07 (35:32):
Respect yourself, have confidence in yourself, and
be honest.
If you manage those three thingsand you'll do fine, don't let
people put you down, balk youdown, make you feel inferior.
You're not.
But be honest, be honest withyour friends.
And I think if you follow that,you'll have success in whatever
you do.
Well, you know, I I've been veryfortunate.
(35:52):
I've been fortunate in myprofession, in my friends.
I've been involved in a lot oforganizations that are
charitable based.
I've enjoyed that, and I stilldo that.
You can't, even though I'mretired and I've been for ten
years now, you can't just hideyourself somewhere.
You've got to stay active.
And I think the best way to stayactive is to try to do that in a
(36:13):
community-based thing, somethingthat you out of the community
with.
I think that's been my approachof at least if not success, for
comfort.
SPEAKER_04 (36:21):
Yeah, well, you've done a lot of work for the
community over the years.
So, yes, thank you.
Thank you for that.
SPEAKER_07 (36:27):
I've been involved in a lot of things, and that
really is neither here northere.
I would just like for people I'mgonna backtrack a little bit.
I had a relative of mine, ayoung man, and he was married
twice, divorced twice, tried tocommit suicide three times.
We were close, and so the lasttime he tried to commit suicide,
it was by medication.
I talked to him and I said,Okay, I'm gonna ask you a
(36:50):
question.
If you answer, fine, if youdon't, that's fine.
I said, Are you gay?
And there was a long hesitation,and he says, Yeah, Uncle, I am.
I said, When you get out of thehospital, you'll have a ticket
waiting for you, and I'm flyingyou down to New Orleans, and
we're going to go to bars andyou're gonna see what gay life
can be, and not hiding in backalleys and things like that.
(37:12):
He did.
He came down, he went back toMississippi, he packed up his
bags and moved to Texas.
I was in Texas by this time, andmoved to Texas, and he had an
entirely different life.
He's married now to a man.
They have a good life, a goodhome, he's had a good
(37:32):
profession.
And it goes back to this thingabout acceptance,
acknowledgement, and how youfeel about yourself.
He could have very easily beenunder the ground then.
So that is, I guess, if I saidif there's something I did that
I think was beneficial, so thatwas my part in getting him
straight and he didn't.
SPEAKER_04 (37:51):
It's something that we see a lot of, and you bring
up an interesting point to onethat I meant to ask about
earlier.
When I first came out, one ofthe more common circumstances
that I saw was an older gay manthat had in his early life
gotten married, in some caseshad kids, tried to fight the
urges and eventually decided,yes, I I'm gay, and they left
(38:14):
their wife and their family andpursued life as a gay man.
Uh, and the first time, thefirst few times, I saw the
struggle in their face and theirlives and that they had.
Do you see that as well, firstof all, did you experience that
as you were growing up, a youngman?
And do you see that as much now?
SPEAKER_07 (38:33):
No, because like I say, when I came out, I didn't
have any children.
And my wife was dead.
So I didn't have any familyrelations.
So the one that I had to uh dealwith was myself.
I can see how that could be aterrible burden on someone
because you're pulled in so manydirections.
And I have seen I'm kind oftelling on myself a little bit
(38:56):
here.
I had a relationship with a guy,and I really cared for him.
And we had seen each other foroh close to a year.
And finally, there was in thesummertime he said, I want you
to come out and uh we're gonnahave a barbecue.
I want you to come and meet someof my friends and all.
So I went.
Well, I got there.
I met his wife and threechildren.
(39:16):
I had no idea this man wasmarried.
I had no idea this man hadchildren, and our relationship
stopped.
Yeah, of course.
But no, that's the kind of thingthat I don't.
SPEAKER_04 (39:32):
Thank you for joining me today.
Uh, your history is isfascinating, and I appreciate
your sharing it with us.
SPEAKER_07 (39:39):
Well, thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_02 (39:51):
Tammy Wallace is a co-founder and the president and
CEO of the Greater Houston LGBTQplus Chamber of Commerce.
For more than 20 years, Tammy'sbeen a leading voice for LGBTQIA
plus business advocacy inHouston.
She owns her own small business,and today we're gonna talk about
women, particularly lesbians whoown businesses in our community.
(40:12):
How can we help them?
What are they facing?
So, Tammy, thank you for talkingto me today.
SPEAKER_01 (40:16):
Yeah, Brett, thank you.
I'm honored.
I really, really appreciate uhthe opportunity to share more
about women-owned businesses.
SPEAKER_02 (40:23):
Yeah, it's a great topic.
So tell me a little bit aboutwomen in business in our
community.
I mean, do you know somepercentages or some demographic
information about women,especially in the LGBTQ spaces?
SPEAKER_01 (40:35):
Yeah, I mean, you know, according to the Federal
Reserve, their small businesscredit survey, they anticipate
34% of businesses are LGBTQ plusowned.
But if you want to get down,really drill down into Houston
or more broadly the region, wedon't have that information.
And that's something that we'relooking at as part of our growth
plan.
How do we capture thatinformation, right?
(40:57):
Because it's valuable, valuableinformation as we look to
support LGBTQ plus ownedbusinesses.
SPEAKER_02 (41:02):
President of the Greater Houston LGBTQ Chamber of
Commerce.
What kind of businesses are youseeing in your membership that
are women-owned?
SPEAKER_01 (41:09):
So it's we're so we're a regional chamber.
Sometimes we'll get questionsabout just in general, about our
membership.
People assume there's a certaintype of business, and actually
there's not.
Because we're regional, we havenot only LGBTQ plus owned
businesses, all light-ownedbusinesses, it really does run
the gamut.
But certainly some of ourbusinesses we see are in
(41:32):
hospitality experience spaces.
I think of Kathy Podell withHouston, Asia Town Tours, right?
Giving giving tours in in AsiaTown.
But then Julie Mabrie comes tomind with Pearl Bar.
She's been an incredible leaderand longtime business in the
community.
And then Black Flops.
Rika and Tasha run a businesswhere you can go in and make
(41:53):
your own candles, create yourown scent, both perfume and you
know, candles.
Bring your team in, bring thefamily in, date night.
So it really does run the gamutin other businesses that are
like working with some of ourlarge companies, right?
Through through supply chain.
But that's that's the beauty.
It really speaks to the beautyof our community, right?
(42:14):
We are the whole of thecommunity.
SPEAKER_02 (42:16):
What do you think are some of the challenges for
small businesses?
SPEAKER_01 (42:19):
Right at the top of the list when I answer this
question, particularly in theenvironment we're in, is
uncertainty.
I mean, there is so muchuncertainty.
And what is creating thatuncertainty, right?
Tariffs, what that means interms of driving cost of
business up, expenses, talentrecruitment, just being able to
attract and and retain employeesis incredibly, incredibly
(42:40):
challenging.
And more specifically for LGBTQplus owned businesses,
women-owned businesses, is, youknow, trying to differentiate
themselves in despite thechallenges that they've
historically faced is, you know,that's where we come in at the
chamber, right?
Helping to elevate thesebusinesses, highlight that they
are part of our community.
(43:01):
If they're allied-ownedbusinesses, supportive of the
community, it's such a great wayto differentiate your your
business.
And our community is alsolooking, and we asked our
community to be intentionalabout their spending, right?
Go to our chamber directory,find businesses that not only
align with you, you know, in ourcommunity, but support you 365
(43:21):
days a year.
SPEAKER_02 (43:22):
I always encourage people to do that.
I always try to know who I'mdoing business with, what
factors they play in ourcommunity or in the overall
larger impact of the communityand things like that.
I always try to patronize peoplethat I know are part of our
community or at least an ally oran advocate for us and not
working against us.
I think it's so important, justfor your own peace of mind of
(43:42):
like, I am helping my communityrather than working against my
community.
SPEAKER_01 (43:47):
I love hearing you say that, Brett, because when in
this day and age right now,people are like, what can I do?
How can I help?
How can I, you know, I'm gonnafight what's going on?
The first step is your owndollars, how you spend those is
your choice, right?
And by being intentional andspending those with inclusive
supportive supporter businesses,not only helps, you know, signal
(44:09):
and send a message, but it helpsdrive economic opportunity,
right, for our community.
SPEAKER_02 (44:15):
You know, I remember a time I used to work in
corporate America or anythingpublic facing.
You basically went into thecloset for your work in your
career.
You basically said, All right,my identity is gone.
And now it seems like we'realmost entering an era where
people are almost getting backto that.
I mean, do you think that that'schanged?
I mean, I remember there wasdefinitely a time when we didn't
(44:35):
have to do that.
SPEAKER_01 (44:36):
Yeah.
No, I think I think people arescared and rightfully so right
now.
We've seen so at the chamber, wework with a lot of large
companies, specifically theirLGBTQ and allied employee
resource groups or ERGs, wherethey're nervous about what's
happening.
In other cases, they're reallystrong advocates inside of the
company to try to maintainsupport and engagement with the
(44:58):
chamber.
But earlier this year, wethinking about a small business
came came to us and said, Look,we do we do federal contracting.
And so we still support thechamber.
We want to be in involved, butcan you take our name off the
public facing directory?
And of course we said yes.
So people are very scared rightnow.
And and what does that fear do?
(45:20):
It actually doesn't help oureconomy.
It doesn't help people grow andthrive, which is really in this
country, particularly with smallbusinesses or you know, in
companies, in order to increaseproductivity, et cetera.
We need people to thrive and beable to be bring their authentic
sales to the table.
All of that drives, you know,economic opportunity and drives
(45:44):
our economy to be much moresuccessful, meaningful, and
also, you know, the returns thatwe get.
So it's so contradictory interms of what is what is
happening right now with thisfear-based approach because it
really is impacting businesses,it's impacting employees and
even, you know, nonprofits thatare in our ecosystem.
SPEAKER_02 (46:05):
One of the things that I'm hearing rumblings about
just within the community issecurity.
A lot of people are talkingabout if you're a business that
is out in public, part of thechamber, you know, whatever, am
I going to be a target?
Do I need to step up mysecurity?
Do you feel like there's a worryabout that as well?
SPEAKER_01 (46:21):
Yes, there's definitely a worry.
There's a worry for us as anorganization.
We've had some threats and we'vehad to engage local, uh, local
law authorities, agencies.
Constable Rosen, I have to givehim credit, but precinct one has
been a great supporter inhelping us through some of those
challenges.
And so that does go for ourbusinesses.
You want to talk about theultimate statement of courage,
(46:44):
and that is businesses thatstill encourage and support the
community.
They're very visible aboutsupporting the community,
whether they're LGBTU owned orallied owned.
That's courage.
That you can point to that todayin terms of courage.
We've had one of our businessescoffee shop in the woodlands had
someone just flung open theirdoors, started yelling
(47:06):
exploites, telling them to taketheir pride flag down.
So it it is real.
But this is also why as acommunity we need to make sure
that we're showing up, thatwe're supporting them.
SPEAKER_02 (47:18):
And let's get a little bit more granular because
we're here to talk about womenspecifically.
So, what are the what are thechallenges that you face as a
woman owning a small business?
And what are the differencesthere?
SPEAKER_01 (47:30):
Yeah, I mean, for women in particular, there's
obviously still the pay equitygap that we see that plays
through for businesses as well.
We've had businesses that getready to to contract and they're
asking me advice.
And I'm I'm like, why are youonly charging this much, right?
Because I know other businessesthat are doing the same thing,
(47:52):
particularly when they wanted toengage with government or
putting in an RFP, they'reunder, they're underselling
themselves, they're undervaluingthemselves because they want to
get the business.
So it's an educational processto understand your worth.
The other piece of that is whenyou think about women
entrepreneurs, so many of themalso are raising families,
right?
Have children.
And so that's an that that's anadded layer.
(48:13):
But also the statistics, I don'tknow the exact number, but that
are single parents.
So they're single parents tryingto raise children, trying to run
a business, which quite frankly,being an entrepreneur is not for
the faint of heart.
It is is hard work andparticularly under the
conditions what we first talkedabout with the uncertainty, et
cetera.
Those are some of the uniquechallenges that women face.
(48:35):
Sometimes it's access tocapital, particularly if
they're, you know, just justgetting started as a business.
So those are the types of thingswe try to help help businesses
connect with lenders that areworking, working with us and
working with our community, andalso pairing them with you know
supportive resources likementors or role models.
(48:56):
Because again, sometimes it'sthat self-worth that women come
at life in general because ofour life experiences.
And uh that bleeds intoentrepreneurship, that bleeds
into business ownership as well.
SPEAKER_02 (49:08):
You know, the city at one point I think had a
mandate to do business withwomen-owned businesses and
minority-owned businesses.
Is that still something that yousee?
SPEAKER_01 (49:18):
Yes, that is still something.
The city still does have theirwhat's called an MWBE program.
They do recognize there's acertification for LGBTQ plus
owned businesses and LGBTBE orbusiness enterprise
certification.
We worked with Mayor Turner toactually get the certification
recognized by the city.
And to his credit, he signed anexecutive order in 2020.
(49:40):
So it's not counted towards thespecific spend that is outlined
in city ordinance.
But the program is stillongoing.
And there are many programs ingovernment, Harris County, etc.,
that are still focused onengaging small, diverse owned
businesses because our electedleaders understand diverse owned
businesses, underservedbusinesses deserve a shot, a
(50:03):
seat at the table, but alsoshould be getting some of that
business.
And that's what those programsdo.
They require what's calledprimes to really seek out
qualified small, diverse ownedbusinesses, including
women-owned businesses, toengage with them.
SPEAKER_02 (50:19):
And that's very comforting to hear because I you
just have this image of thediversity and commitment to this
kind of thing is is being ekedaway at.
(51:37):
Yeah.
No, absolutely.
And it's important work.
I mean, tell me a little bitabout the chamber if I'm
interested in it.
How can I find out more?
Where do I go?
Who do I network?
Yeah, how do I do that?
SPEAKER_01 (51:48):
So we uh so people sometimes when you hear the word
chamber, you think, oh, smallbusinesses.
Our ecosystem actually doesconsist of those large companies
I mentioned.
Of course, our small businesses.
We have professionals, we haveyoung professionals, and we have
nonprofits.
And so all you have to do isvisit Houston LGBTQchamber.com
and you can see our variousmembership levels.
(52:10):
We do about 140 events a year.
It's crazy, but we do reallyencourage people to come out to
our monthly third Thursdaybreakfast.
We get it between 100 and 150people every month.
And it is a fantastic way tostart your morning and being in
community.
People love this breakfast.
And I'll say this, Brett, whenwe first started the chamber,
people would tell come up toGary and I and they'd be like,
(52:32):
wow, I love this chamber.
And it, you know, as we wereabout a year in, and so we Gary
and I were like, okay, well,we're obviously doing something
right, but what is it?
And so we started asking peoplein comparison to other chambers,
and then I figured out, and Ifigured out what the magic is.
When you walk in the doors ofthe chamber, that armor that we
have to wear as LGBTQ pluspeople, it falls.
(52:53):
You don't have to wear it.
You can come in and you canfocus on your business, or if
you're a job seeker, or ifyou're a nonprofit trying to,
you know, bring more visibilityto the important work you're
doing.
You don't have to worry aboutwho you are, vetting your words,
you know, who you love.
You just come in and you focuson being in community and doing
what you're doing.
SPEAKER_02 (53:14):
I just love the idea of that if you're a woman-owned
business and you need some help,some resources and things like
that, this is definitely aplace, a channel for you to get
that.
And then navigate all of thosethings, like you talked about,
the certifications and thedifferent programs you could
take advantage of.
And there's a a room full ofpeople that know how to navigate
(53:34):
this for you.
And that can take away some ofthat challenge.
SPEAKER_01 (53:37):
And we have programming throughout the year
for our small businesses, uh,women-owned businesses too, more
specifically.
But uh, we have a Thrive SmallBusiness Summit that we do every
January that is geared aday-long summit to help our
small businesses, both withcontent, educational content,
but we're literally doing amatchmaker where we're
connecting them to somebody thatmay be seeking their services,
(53:57):
whether it's somebody insupplier inclusion or an
employee resource group, we'rehelping them raise their
visibility and create connectionand relationships in what we
call this ecosystem.
SPEAKER_02 (54:09):
Well, thank you so much.
I am fascinated by this topic,and I'm sorry I have gone all
over the map on this.
And I know that, you know, Iguess if you had any advice for
a woman that wanted to start abusiness in our community, let's
say she's a part of ourcommunity and she wants to start
a business, what would be themost crucial piece of advice
that you would give to her?
SPEAKER_01 (54:29):
Find resource and resources and support, and
there's tons of them.
Not just here at the chamber,but we have other collaboration
partners as well.
Was talking on the phone withone today about some work we're
gonna do collaborativelytogether next year.
There's all kinds of resourcesin this city to support women
entrepreneurs.
Everything from capability, capcapacity building programming.
(54:52):
We did a program last year withCommissioner Adrian Garcia that
was a six six-week-long program.
Find those resources becauselaying the foundation is gonna
ensure your success over thenext three to five years.
Five years is that pivotalnumber.
So the more you can do to alignand align with resources and
supportive, excuse me,individuals, the better.
SPEAKER_02 (55:15):
Yeah, no, and I think anybody that's facing that
that's got you feel alone, Ithink, when you start a small
business.
I think you you really do.
It's like I I'm really going outthere on my own, but you have to
realize there are people thathave done it and done it
successfully, and they can helpyou.
And especially for women too.
SPEAKER_01 (55:31):
And chambers are the best place to find to find that
support, whether it's ours.
There's tons of diverse chambersin the in the city, and we
always encourage people to joinjoin one, join five where it
aligns with what you're tryingto accomplish.
Most importantly, get thesupport, but don't go it alone,
especially these days.
(55:52):
Find those resources, find thatsupport.
SPEAKER_02 (55:54):
Well, you definitely have to.
You got to be careful about thepolitical environment and
everything else that's going on.
You need those resources.
SPEAKER_01 (55:59):
So absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (56:00):
Thank you for being here for leading in business and
leading the Greater HoustonLGBTQ plus chamber of commerce.
I know you've got tons ofexciting events.
That breakfast, as youmentioned, is super popular.
I think you have a couple oflectures and things like that
coming up.
Uh the Kinder Institute is gonnapresent.
SPEAKER_01 (56:18):
Yes, that's gonna be a great luncheon, our community
conversations luncheon.
SPEAKER_02 (56:21):
Yes.
So I'm excited, and I'm excitedthat you are deciding to throw a
spotlight on women in ourcommunity that own businesses.
So thank you.
SPEAKER_01 (56:29):
Well, thank you, and thank you for highlighting the
importance of our ourbusinesses, particularly women
and the challenges they face.
SPEAKER_05 (56:45):
Heard on APFT Houston and as a podcast
available from severalpodcasting sources.
Check our webpagequeervoices.org for more
information.
Queer Voices executive produceris Brian Levinka.
Deborah Moncrief Bell isco-producer, Brett Cullum and
(57:06):
David Mendoza Druisman arecontributors.
This is KPFT 90.1 FM Houston, 89.5 FM Galveston, 91.9
FM Huntsville, and worldwide onthe internet at KPFT.org.
SPEAKER_02 (00:21):
Welcome to Queer Voices, a radio show that has
been on KPFT for over fivedecades.
We're also a podcast, so howeveryou found us, we are glad you
are here.
Tonight we will look at LGBTQIAplus voices from three
perspectives politics, history,and business.
First up, we have Molly Cook.
She is an American registerednurse and politician who is a
(00:42):
member of the Texas Senate forthe 15th District.
She's a Democrat who was electedin a May special election to
fill the vacancy from JohnWhitmire's resignation to become
mayor of Houston.
Then we have author R.
Lee Ingalls, who interviewsRichard Watson as part of a
series discussing gay historywith people.
Richard tells us what it waslike for him growing up in rural
(01:03):
Mississippi and then discoveringour community in New Orleans.
Finally, I get to talk to TammyWallace about women and the
greater Houston LGBTIQ PlusChamber of Commerce.
Queer Voices start now.
SPEAKER_03 (01:43):
Excited to introduce and be speaking with our guest,
State Senator Molly Cook,Democrat for Texas Senate
District 15, which includes aportion of Houston in Harris
County.
Senator Cook was sworn in in May2024 after winning a special
election to fill the seatvacated by now Mayor John
Whitmire.
Molly Cook is a registered nursewith dual graduate degrees in
nursing and public health fromJohn Hopkins University and is
(02:06):
not only the youngest sittingstate senator in Texas, but also
the first openly LGBTQ personelected to the Texas Senate.
Senator Molly Cook.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Thank you so much, David.
So good to be back.
SPEAKER_03 (02:19):
Absolutely.
Now there's a lot to get intobecause as we know and have
covered on Queer Voices, queervoices as a community are being
silenced and our people areunder attack.
But that's at least myassessment.
What would you say is yourlandscape analysis on the state
of being LGBTQ in Texas thisyear?
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
I can't sugarcoat it.
It is, it's just unbelievablytough.
It really is, especially whenwe're looking at our triance
brothers, sisters, and siblings,anybody who is at any kind of
intersection at all of otherforms of oppression.
Um, things are really hard andyou can feel it out in the
community.
But I always want to include thefact that I have a lot of hope.
I see some paths forward.
(03:01):
And there even were a couple ofhighlights from the 89th regular
session here in Texas.
It's uh it's mostly a painfulpicture, but uh it's just still
a joy.
They can't take away queer joy.
I'm so thankful to be in acommunity, and I've got a lot of
hope for us, and and we'reworking on making it better.
SPEAKER_03 (03:17):
Definitely want to start with some of the victories
before we get into some of thethe struggles and the fights
that we have ongoing.
Because, you know, being thefirst openly LGBTQ plus Texas
senator, what are some of thebiggest challenges you faced in
this role, but also thevictories that you see to be
most meaningful so far thissession?
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Of course, just watching the trans community
experience more violence andscapegoating and and just a lot
of unfairness was very painful.
Um, that was the toughest partof session.
It's just so clear that thepowers that be and the
Republican Party are willing touse human beings as wedge issues
to accomplish political goalsand gain power.
(03:57):
And it's wrong, it's horrible,um, and we've got to work to
stop it.
So just being, you know,powerless to change the number
of votes on some of these billsis very difficult.
But as we know, there's a lot ofways to work on these issues and
love our communities that aren'tjust voting yes or no on a bill.
SPEAKER_03 (04:15):
Yeah, I I'm curious how you build coalitions and
push forward progressive policyor really any policy that
doesn't demonize and dehumanizeLGBTQ plus population and a
largely Republican legislature.
SPEAKER_00 (04:30):
I kind of so the Texas Senate is an interesting
place, and I've talked aboutthis with some folks.
There's less opportunity in theTexas Senate for some coalition
building that I was hoping forin what we all think of as like
these horseshoe theory momentswhere somebody is so far left
and somebody is so far rightthat they end up actually
sometimes agreeing on certainthings.
(04:51):
There's a libertarian angle toliving and letting live that
allows for um a little moretolerance of homosexuality in
general or any kind of, youknow, expression that's not
mainstream.
So in the house, I was really,really proud and impressed to
watch my colleague, uhRepresentative Benton Jones get
his bill across the finish linein the house, which would
(05:14):
decriminalize homosexuality.
Currently on the books, it isstill says that it's illegal for
two men to have sex with eachother, right?
And so we know that that's neverreally prosecuted right now, but
it's still scary to have thosewords on the books and they're
not right.
And so we need them repealed.
And so his bill repealed thatlanguage and got all the way
through the house for the firsttime ever.
It did not receive a hearing inthe Texas Senate because of the
(05:36):
the culture and the flavor ofthe Texas Senate doesn't allow
for that kind of coalitionbuilding.
But what is exciting is thehouse is more reflective of the
population of Texas.
And so there are folks out therewho are on the right who do have
some tolerance for people beingable to make their own private
decisions and enjoy their ownprivate lives.
Um, and so that was reallyexciting to get to see him work
(06:00):
that kind of coalitiondevelopment with success.
SPEAKER_03 (06:03):
That's that's really great to hear.
Thank you for sharing that.
And you know, I'm gonna behonest with you, I I want to
hear some more good news if youhave any.
Please share with us, thelisteners, any more good news
that we have before we get intosome of the bills that passed
and were signed by GovernorAbbott, such as Senate Bill
Eight just last night.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
I felt pretty strongly after, you know, Vice
President Harris's loss, thatthere was real risk that a lot
of folks were going to reach forthe closest thing and and blame
that.
Like for instance, uh, there's acouple different issues, but one
of them is did we go too far?
Are we too woke on LGBTQ plusissues?
Um, is that the reason that welost?
(06:43):
And you hear some of thatrhetoric, you see it online, you
heard a little bit of it in thebuilding, but really what I saw
once session got started and thelaws were being written again
and the people reacting in realtime, it's just so obvious that
these bills are hateful, thatthey are not rooted in science,
that we have indeed not gone toofar at all in protecting the
LGBTQ ⁇ community.
And in fact, there's a whole lotfurther to go.
(07:05):
Um, and that our our rights andour experiences are just
intertwined and linked in a waythat's inextricable.
So if we're telling somebody youcan't dress or look a certain
way, that puts absolutelyeverybody at risk.
If we're telling people, youknow, you should use
vigilanteism to to kick eachother out of the bathrooms, that
puts absolutely everybody atrisk, whether you're getting
(07:26):
straight, transist, it doesn'tmatter.
Everybody is at risk whenthere's a culture of
vigilanteism in Texas.
And I really saw fromconversations around the Capitol
and the district that peoplereally feel that in their bones.
I almost felt like the alliesgrew more fervent as the as the
horrifying bills were beingwritten.
(07:47):
Um, and so some of what we sawas disappointments, failures,
you know, bad bills passinginside the Capitol, outside of
the Capitol, people understandthat it's authoritarianism, that
it is fascist, that it is acomplete violation of the
constitution, and that it meansall of us are at risk for more
violence.
There's just a real feeling ofpeople are like, what do we do?
(08:08):
How do we protect our neighborswho are gender non-binary, who
are communities, who are out,who are, you know, not just
citizens straight, basically.
And people are reaching forwhat's our options.
And I do think right now,unfortunately, because of where
we're at, some of the optionsinclude things like don't let
people go to the bathroom alone,you know, or make sure that when
you're hiring, you're going intothe community to find out who
(08:29):
needs work right now, who isexperiencing job loss because of
discrimination or these chillfactors and things like that.
So inside the Capitol, thingsfeel pretty terrible.
But as soon as I walk outside,there's just a hunger to love
each other, to support eachother, to weather this storm and
to keep each other safe until wecan um elect folks who care
about public health, who careabout our community, and who are
(08:52):
willing to repeal these laws.
My hope, as always, is in thepeople and in the organizing.
Um, and our district just ourdistrict is pretty dang out and
proud, and it feels good to behome.
SPEAKER_03 (09:04):
I love that.
And wanting to kind of buildupon this this landscape
analysis, you know, on the stateof being LGBTQ in Texas this
year.
I'm curious about the issuesthat you're hearing from your
constituents in your districtthat are specific to the LGBTQ
plus community.
What's what's being raised?
What's what's being talked aboutwhenever people call in or visit
(09:25):
you?
SPEAKER_00 (09:26):
People are really worried about how these laws are
supposed to work.
So, you know, there's one thatsays that your government
documents now must reflect whatyour birth certificate says.
So if you've gone and had agender marker changed for any
reason, now that's in flux andthat's in, you know, it's being
it's being threatened andattacked, and people will have
(09:46):
to go back and change things.
And the attorney general is, youknow, keeping lists of folks and
that sort of thing.
So people are very, very, veryconcerned about how is this
actually supposed to work.
Same thing with the bathroombill.
It's like, well, what you know,the the bill changed shape so
many times because it'sterrible.
It's an awful, painful, sloppypolicy.
So you couldn't get it passed,couldn't get it passed, it
(10:08):
changed shape multiple times.
So now the final version of thebathroom bill is just that
government buildings, anythingthat's kind of government owned
and run, has to have a policy inplace that requires you to use
the bathroom that matches thegender marker on your birth
certificate.
That is such a far, far cry fromwhat it originally started as.
(10:28):
Um, and so people are wondering,you know, it relies on the
report, again, vigilanteism onreporting on your neighbors.
So, like, how is this supposedto work?
What does an adequate policyreally mean?
Is there a way to put a policyin place, but still just kind
of, you know, let people do whatmakes sense and what feels
right?
Um, and then of course, I'veheard from from several just
(10:49):
members of our community who arelike, no one wants me using the
bathroom that matches the gendermarker on my birth certificate.
Nobody wants me in thatbathroom.
So there's just a lot of fearand trepidation around how
exactly this is all supposed towork.
People are want help keepingtrack of, of course, what
lawsuits have been filed, wherethings are at in the court
system.
Of course, in Texas, we we feelthat chaotic flip-flop all the
(11:12):
time about issues that arereally near and dear to us,
whether it's our community orimmigration.
One day a law is on the books,the next day it's a challenge,
and it is again.
Sometimes we have better answersthan others.
I think for a lot of thesepolicies, they're purposely not
thought out.
They're campaign moments, right?
And so it's not actuallyimportant policy to anyone.
And so the fear and the chaos isthe goal.
(11:34):
And so then you, of course, haveto take that mutual aid angle
again.
Like while this is happening,until we can elect the right
people on the ground, how are wekeeping each other safe?
Like physically in and out, youknow, every single day, checking
on our neighbors, being acommunity, and really keeping
each other safe and watchingeach other's backs.
SPEAKER_03 (11:52):
Yeah, that that's really helpful.
And and wanting to stay on thetopic of the bathroom bill,
Senate Bill Eight, I can shareuh personally, as the
co-president of the Universityof Houston's LGBTQ Plus alumni
network, we are working with theUniversity of Houston to
actually compile a map of samegender single stall, all gender
(12:13):
restrooms so that we canactually pinpoint on a map and
support LGBTQ plus studentsidentify exactly where on campus
they can be without fear ofharassment.
And we're also wanting to doknow your rights trainings for
students because you mentionedgovernment buildings, University
of Houston, state funds fromTexas.
(12:34):
And so, what are some otherkinds of ways that you can
imagine supporting LGBTQstudents and individuals who
just want to use the restroomand really just want to exist
amidst this bill?
SPEAKER_00 (12:47):
I know, and it's just so it's so painful because
um, you know, it feels like thatscene in hidden figures is just
like we have done this before,we've been here before, this is
wrong.
Everybody knows it.
So the the one thing I will saybeyond doing what y'all are
doing, which is, you know,proactively going in and saying,
hey, you know, as the affectedcommunity, we'd love to help
(13:07):
craft this policy or we'd loveto help, you know, create
resources for folks andeverything like that.
You know, just trying to do yourbest to reduce harm and um
create some safe spaces andthings like that.
Um I think you know, it'simportant for folks to know too.
This passed in I can't rememberif it was North Dakota or South
Dakota.
It's one of the Dakotas.
Um, it was struck down almostinstantly by a federal judge.
And her opinion that she wrotewas just fantastic.
(13:30):
And there is nothing about thisthat is constitutional.
It encourages discrimination, itencourages violence, it's
absolutely unenforceable withoutcommitting a crime against
somebody else.
There are so many instanceswhere even just
masculine-looking non-transwomen have been attacked in a
restroom as a result of eventhese conversations and laws.
(13:50):
And here in Texas as well, inthe city of Odessa, they had a
lame duck city council.
So they were on their way out,they they couldn't be
re-elected, and and the mayorand they had a bathroom bill in
Odessa, which is not SanFrancisco, it's Odessa, Texas.
Conservative place.
And the new city council andmayor came in and immediately
repealed it.
And they said it was justdiscriminatory, it didn't make
(14:12):
sense, it's unenforceable.
And so I think we need to tellthat story as well.
Of course, you know, don't letsomebody harass your friend in
the bathroom, don't let peoplego alone, like keep each other
safe, et cetera.
But also, like, you know, feelcomfortable telling the story
that there have been very, veryconservative places that have
put these laws into action andthen immediately taken them back
(14:35):
out of action because they don'twork, they don't make sense, and
they cause a lot of harm.
Um, and also we can tell thestory of the fact that, you
know, I had the conversation onthe Senate floor with the author
of this bill, and there werefamily violence shelters who
asked for language changes, whoasked for amendments to allow
them to safely provide care, andthose were turned down.
(14:57):
And so, as you know, the theright tries to shape this
narrative of protecting women,they are literally making the
jobs of family violence sheltersharder to do.
And they don't know what they'retalking about.
They're not involved withaffected communities of
violence.
And so we have to feel reallystrong and confident in our our
facts and being able to tell thestory that this makes all of us
(15:20):
less safe.
It's not enforceable, it'sfoolish policy, it's it's
wasting time, precious time insession where we should be using
this to make groceries andhousing more affordable for
Texans.
All of that resonates withfolks, and we need to just
permeate our culture with thetruth because it will literally
keep us safer and hopefullybring about change faster rather
(15:41):
than slower.
SPEAKER_03 (15:42):
What keeps you emotivated to continue this work
amidst everything that's goingon and everything that your
colleagues are pushing?
What gives you hope for thefuture of LGBTQ plus Texans?
SPEAKER_00 (15:53):
I love this question.
I mean, a lot of my hope is Ican't even tell you, leaving
Austin, leaving the specialsession, which was just so
unpleasant to say the least.
It's like as we drove home andit got more humid, and I was
back on Harris County soil andyou know, seeing all of my hope
is in us.
It's in our community, righthere, here in Harris County or
(16:14):
wherever you're sitting, butbeing out, being proud, loving
yourself, loving your neighbors,that's where all of my hope is.
And I don't think that what'sgoing to save Texas is the
Texans.
I really do.
And so, you know, people, it'stempting to look up toward
powers that be.
But I look side to side, andthat's where my hope is.
My hope is also in my team.
I don't ever do work alone.
(16:35):
I've never done work alone.
Everybody should be in acommunity, in a team, you know,
seek that out, soak up the loveand the help from it, pour out
your own love and help, and itmakes all of us stronger and all
of us better people.
And then the last thing I'llsay, which is not specific to
the LGBTQ community, but it'svery exciting to me.
After I got elected, Iimmediately founded a pack
(16:56):
called Organize to Win Pact.
So it's a political actioncommittee, you know, it takes in
just donations, we run a prettytight ship.
And the whole purpose of thisorganization existing is to go
out and talk to people who havenot shown up and voted very much
early, get to them early so thatwe can first offer something
before we ask for something, andthen actually build trust.
(17:18):
And so when I've been out doorknocking, which I try to make a
regular practice, especially nowthat I'm elected, I'm talking to
folks who are, you know, sittingbehind their front doors in
their homes worried aboutfederal cuts, they're worried
about school vouchers, they'reworried about redistricting all
these wildly unpopular policiesthat are coming from the right
right now.
They're worried about theauthoritarianism and things feel
(17:39):
like they're destabilizing.
And they also usually have somesort of problem that we can help
with.
Something as simple as replacinga trash can, but they often also
don't have a party affiliationand they don't know who who
represents and serves them.
And so, to me, again, nottotally specific to like a queer
community, but when we'rethinking about what is the left
(18:00):
doing to increase capacity, toincrease power, to build back
trust with voters, I thinkthere's a lot of opportunity
that we aren't even necessarilytaking advantage of.
And it's as simple as going out,knocking on somebody's door and
saying, You've probably neverheard of me, but I serve you.
And I'm not here to ask for yourvote.
I'm not here to ask for adonation, I'm not here to ask
(18:21):
you for anything.
I'm here for you to tell me whatis something in your life that I
can try to help you with, that Ican try to take off of your
plate, because that's howgovernment should work anyway.
And we leave little flyersbehind with a QR code, with a
survey where people can submittheir issues if they didn't open
the door.
And we feed a lot of thoseconstituent issues from the PAC
(18:42):
to the office.
And then the office takes itfrom there.
Um, and what's exciting is theoffice phone has been ringing
off the hook.
We have had an increase of theconstituent services uptake
since the PAC has gone out andstarted talking to folks.
So I just want people to know,you know, if you live in our
area, follow on social media atMollyford, Texas.
We have volunteer opportunitiescoming up.
(19:02):
If you don't live in our area,send us a DM and ask us how
we're doing it so you can do itin your, you know, where you
live in Texas or wherever youlive.
But there is opportunity forpower building on the left that
is, you know, it's just notrocket science.
It's just exactly what we shouldbe doing.
Put one foot in front of theother, do the right work the
right way for the right reasons,and we are already seeing it
make a difference in ourdistrict.
SPEAKER_03 (19:22):
What message do you have for our haters, the people
who want to keep us down?
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
Don't hate us.
You're just hating yourself,man.
A world where people are free tolove themselves and others, to
know themselves and others, to,you know, to understand who God
is, what the earth is.
Like one of us is free.
We can all be free.
So I just wish that our haterscould look in the mirror and
(19:49):
realize that if you're hating onus, it's because you're hating
on something inside yourself.
And when you can learn to lovethat about yourself and truly
accept yourself, the way thatthe LGBTQ plus community models
for the rest of the world, thiswould be a lot healthier, safer
of a place.
Everybody's cortisol levelscould go down and we could all
have a lot more fun.
So I encourage all of our hatersto look inward and just see if
(20:13):
maybe, maybe it's coming from,you know, calls coming from
inside the house and actuallyour community is really, really
good about being authentic,truthful, and loving.
SPEAKER_03 (20:22):
I love that so much.
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
This has been our guest, StateSenator Molly Cook, Democrat for
Texas Senator Senate District15, not only the youngest
sitting state senator in Texas,but also the first openly LGBTQ
person elected to the TexasSenate.
Thank you so, so much, SenatorMolly Cook.
SPEAKER_00 (20:40):
Thank you, TMS.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
Thank you, Molly Cook and David, for discussing
Texas politics with us.
Well, now we're gonna move on toan interview conducted by author
and historian R.
Lee Ingalls.
He sits down with RichardWatson, who is a man who has
been a part of the HoustonLGBTQIA Plus community for
several decades.
Richard has been involved innumerous nonprofits, including
(21:05):
the crew of Olympus and themystery and fantasy Mardi Gras
Party.
This is the first of an ongoingseries where we feature queer
voices who can share theirperspective and history within
our own community.
SPEAKER_04 (21:19):
Hi everyone, this is R.
Lee Ingalls, and I am joinedtoday by longtime Houston
resident Richard Watson.
Richard has been part of ourcommunity for the past several
decades, and we're going to talkabout what growing up gay was
like for his generation and someof the impacts of significant
events in our community.
Richard, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER_07 (21:38):
Thank you, Lee.
I appreciate you having me.
SPEAKER_04 (21:41):
Yeah, yeah.
So we've known each other for along time.
We've really never had this kindof a discussion.
And I think it's important forus to talk about how our lives
were different when we wereyounger than what they are
today.
So for you, you grew up inMississippi?
SPEAKER_07 (21:55):
I did, small town in Mississippi, yes.
SPEAKER_04 (21:57):
Yeah, so what was it like being gay in that
environment?
SPEAKER_07 (22:00):
Well, actually, I can't answer that because there
weren't any gay people.
That was a period now we'retalking about 70 or 80 years
ago.
And that was a time when theydidn't have gay people.
You had a few queers, but theyweren't the same context at all.
So that never came up in mylifetime.
SPEAKER_04 (22:20):
So those people that were identified or called queer
by the other parts of thecommunity, you never saw
yourself as part of that groupthen.
Well, it wasn't necessarilysexual.
It was just characteristics,etc.
Yeah.
And you didn't identify asthose.
SPEAKER_07 (22:33):
No.
SPEAKER_04 (22:33):
At what point did you realize that you were gay,
even though gay might not havebeen a term at that point?
SPEAKER_07 (22:39):
I think that was a turning point when I was in my
preteens.
Like I say, we lived in a smallcommunity.
My dad had a Friday large form.
And Christmas rolled around, andI came down Christmas morning,
and it was a saddle, smallsaddle, and a donkey out in the
garage.
And a dollhouse.
My mother had misunderstood alinehill train system.
(22:59):
I was trying to find houses forthe train system, not a
dollhouse.
Anyway, I got the dollhouse, andwhat did I do?
I went to the dollhouseimmediately.
The donkey and saddle sat forquite a while.
So I think that was uh shouldhave been uh a light coming on.
It didn't.
It should have been.
SPEAKER_04 (23:16):
Wow.
Okay.
Okay, so going up then, did youhave any role models at all?
No.
No one else.
No.
Yeah.
Well, and and that was fairlycommon at that time.
At that time.
So at some point you did realizethat you were gay, and how did
the family did they know?
How was it accepted?
SPEAKER_07 (23:37):
Well, I was uh when I was in college, I was married,
and I was not gay.
I didn't know I was gay.
And my wife was in an accident,and she lost her life.
SPEAKER_04 (23:47):
Oh my.
SPEAKER_07 (23:48):
And I uh did not remarry, didn't get engaged
later on, but that lasted aboutsix months.
I moved to uh Jackson,Mississippi.
Or a friend of mine had a friendthat lived on the Gulf Coast,
and we went down to visit thetwo of us dead, and this guy was
really nice.
I went back a few times.
Well, he was gay.
And through him is when Irealized that, yeah, that was my
(24:10):
calling.
And when I finally realized thatit wasn't a matter of opening
the door, the door flew off thehinges.
I never really confronted ortold it wasn't anybody's
business but mine.
I never talked to my familyabout it, and they never brought
it up.
Years later, I was living in NewOrleans, and I had broken my
leg, and my mom had decided sheneeded to come down and visit.
(24:32):
Well, that was fine, except Ihad a boyfriend.
So the three of us were stayingin a small apartment down in the
French corner.
And as she was leaving, shelooked at me one time and she
said, You and Warren, that washis name.
You don't blame me or yourfather.
And I said, Blame me for what?
Well, your lifestyle.
I said, my lifestyle was mychoice, not yours.
(24:54):
And if you're accepting it,that's great.
If you don't, that's yourbusiness.
And that's how it all came out.
SPEAKER_04 (24:59):
Unusual.
So were they then accepting ofit, or did it take a little time
to adjust?
SPEAKER_07 (25:04):
Yeah, I've always heard that's your mom knows way
before you do anyway.
Right.
So I don't think that was a bigshock.
And I still had my little vacuumcleaner from my dollhouse.
SPEAKER_04 (25:15):
Okay, so I'm talking about relationships,
sustainability of relationships.
Well, how do you find that inour community versus what you
see in the heterosexualcommunity or other communities?
SPEAKER_07 (25:26):
Yeah, I think that the secret to that, firstly, you
have to be honest with yourselfand you have to be honest with
others.
And that's kind of the attitudethat I take at this work so far.
SPEAKER_04 (25:42):
Well, and and talking about the gay
relationships, of course, youhave a husband, Robert, and
knowing the two of you, we havewhat I view, and I think others
view as a very successfulrelationship.
SPEAKER_07 (25:55):
We've been together about 27 years, and we've been
married since 2014.
SPEAKER_04 (26:00):
Right.
SPEAKER_07 (26:00):
So yeah, I think we have a pretty successful
relationship.
Robert, we take advantage ofrelationships, we take advantage
of each other, and sometimesthat becomes a problem.
But when I stop and think abouthow it would be without Robert,
as such an eye opener, Iconsider myself very fortunate.
And yeah, we work at it.
Any relationship you have towork at.
(26:21):
And it works if you're willingto put the time in.
SPEAKER_04 (26:23):
Well, kind of looking back to an earlier time
in your life before we could getmarried, how did you look at
your relationships or therelations ability to have a
relationship at that time?
Did you see that as viable or orno?
SPEAKER_07 (26:39):
Yeah, I did.
Oh, you tell it to people.
Right.
So you know, at that time it wasyour partner or your special
friend or this kind ofrelationship.
I never thought I would ever seegay marriage.
And when that happened, I waselighted.
But as far as my relationshipwith Robert, it was as though it
was a marriage.
SPEAKER_04 (27:03):
Well, do you did you kind of parallel the design of
your relationship after aheterosexual relationship, or
did you see it differently?
SPEAKER_07 (27:10):
It was obviously different.
At least our relationship, I Ithink there was some
codependency.
And the heterosexualrelationship seemed to be one
way.
And as a result, I think that uhyou have to be very
knowledgeable of someone else'sfeelings and their attitudes to
uh and to appreciate them forwhat they are.
So no, I think there is adifference there.
(27:31):
It's uh mutual type thing.
SPEAKER_04 (27:33):
I would I would agree.
And like I said, the two of youhave an extraordinary
relationship.
Okay, and then it's going pastthat then, the you know, the
partnership or or togethernessrelationship to friendships in
general.
I know that for you and I, wehave friends that go back more
than 30 years, and you even morethan that.
So do you think that that'sunique to our community, or how
(27:56):
do you see that?
SPEAKER_07 (27:57):
I think it might be unique to our community and the
I don't know, sexual community.
Friends, long-term relationshipsseem to be more family-oriented.
We don't have that in ourrelationships and in our
community.
So I think that's kind of uhdifferent for the gay community.
We have a lot of things thatgays do in common that a lot of
(28:17):
strikes don't.
We've been through a lot, we'vefaced a lot, we've challenged a
lot.
And I think that in itself is abinder to keep a community
together.
SPEAKER_04 (28:26):
Taking going back again in time to your teens and
twenties, how is the communitydifferent now than what it was
then?
What differences are you seeing?
SPEAKER_07 (28:36):
Much more open and much more accepting.
It's not a word that doesn'texist.
People use it now, people arenot afraid to live in a shadow.
And I think that's a verytelling point because there's so
many people in my generationthat had they not had this, and
I call it a burden problem abouttrying to quote unquote be
(28:58):
straight, would have been a lothappier and a lot more
productive.
I think that that's veryimportant today, that the teens
and twenties, even into the 30s,this is very important.
You are accepted, you can make alife for yourself, and you can
benefit others.
SPEAKER_04 (29:14):
Yeah, yeah, no, I totally agree.
So back when we were young inour twenties, etc., there was no
internet.
To meet people for mygeneration, the option was to go
to a gay bar, a bar that wasconsidered gay.
What did you experience?
SPEAKER_07 (29:30):
Well, when I did finally come out, I'd never been
to a bar, and I was living inJackson, Mississippi.
Well, I accepted a job in NewOrleans.
So I moved down to New Orleans.
So I went, I thought, okay, I'vegot to try a gay bar.
Didn't know anything about gaybars, gay bars, anything like
that.
So I walked into this bar onBourbon Street, as it turned out
it was a drag bar, and I wastotally freaked out.
(29:53):
I thought, oh my god, does thatmean to be gay you have to be
running around and drag all thetime?
And I was just I wastraumatized.
I had a nice time and I talkedto some nice people, but I just
could not accept this.
And I wouldn't go back to a barfor a long time.
And finally, some friends thatwould come on and we went, and
it was a different kind of baraltogether.
That was fine.
I don't have any problem withthat.
(30:14):
So no, my first experience wassort of an eye opener to say the
least.
SPEAKER_04 (30:18):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I remember my first dragshow as well.
And I it was actually somebodythat I worked with also during
the day that did drag at night,and I found it unusual, just as
you did.
But I was prepared for it.
I knew what was coming.
So I I was just mesmerized byit.
I had never even back then theycalled it uh female
(30:39):
illusionists, is what they were,is how we characterized it.
Okay, some of the major eventsthat took place then during our
our time on this earth.
Stonewall.
SPEAKER_07 (30:49):
Stonewall actually happened in the early, early,
early part of my adult years.
I don't like I still wasn't anadult, but it was a long time
ago.
It didn't I didn't reallyunderstand exactly what it was
when it happened.
Well, I didn't know now.
Certain, certainly, that was aturning point.
Stonewall was, I think thebiggest impact on me personally
(31:12):
was the AIDS crisis.
I had a large circle of friendsback in our 30s, about then,
30s, early 40s.
Big circle of friends.
I would say probably 15 or 20.
We ran around together a lot,partying a lot.
Only one other one survived.
He and I survived.
And it got to the point where wewere going to funerals multiple
(31:32):
times a month.
We were losing friends left andright.
Parents were not accepting this.
They were denying thesechildren, these sons and
daughters.
It was a really traumaticexperience for me.
And I have often wondered, as Idiscussed with my friend that
survived, why were we spared?
We don't know.
SPEAKER_04 (31:49):
I think there's a lot of people of our generation
that feel the same way.
There are precious few of us.
They didn't make it throughthat.
I think all of us have that samequestion.
Why, why was I why did I comethrough it?
Yeah.
And I saw entire circles ofpeople disappear.
Yes.
Disappear.
Well, one of the things that Ifound happened common during
(32:10):
that time period is when someonebecame ill.
I mean, you there was kind of afew things that were telling
what was going on, but theneventually they moved away.
Did you experience that samething?
SPEAKER_07 (32:21):
No, because a lot of them didn't have any place to
move to.
Again, I guess their parents gotinvolved and they rejected them.
Most of them that I knew stayedwith friends in our group.
Most of them died in theirhomes.
So no, they did not move away.
In a way, I think that was goodbecause it gave us the
opportunity to at least stay intouch with them and not let them
(32:41):
know that they were cared for.
SPEAKER_04 (32:42):
Yeah, I would have to agree with that.
And I was part of the earlyyears Omega House when it was
being put together.
Eleanor Munger worked veryclosely with her uh during those
early years.
So yeah, it it was a very sadtime in our community.
Moving forward a little bit intime for early 2000s and
marriage equality, when thatfirst started coming on the
(33:05):
scene, when did you think, youknow, go from marriage is not an
option for us to thinking, youknow what, maybe this will
happen.
What was when was that and whatwas that like?
SPEAKER_07 (33:17):
When s well, when some states, particularly on the
northeast, started allowingmarriage, gay marriage, I
thought maybe there's hope.
I never thought Texas would.
Consequently, I was thrilledwith the prospect of actually
making this relationship I hadwith Robin something more
permanent in a legal sense.
So we went to Minnesota and gotmarried.
(33:37):
And it was after that, ofcourse, that Texas also followed
suit.
That I think was a turning pointin the gay world anyway.
Uh, when you had the opportunityto marry and express your love
for another person that was ofthe same gender.
SPEAKER_04 (33:51):
Brett and I this year are celebrating 20 years
together.
When we first met, there was nomarriage equality.
It wasn't even in either one ofour minds that it's someday that
we would actually be able tolegally get married.
And I know Texas still has onthe books that they it is not
legal.
However, my understanding is theSupreme Court ruling, parts of
that ruling were codified.
(34:13):
And one of those pieces thatwere codified is that every
state will recognize themarriage from another state.
And like you, we were married inMinnesota the year before the
Supreme Court made their ruling.
So we were married in a statethat that allowed it.
Even it's even should thatchange, God forbid, that should
(34:34):
change.
In Texas, our marriage wouldstill be recognized because of
that, how they codified at leastportions of it.
Yeah, we both got married in2014, two months apart.
The oddest thing for me isRobert, your husband, and I
share so much in common in ourpast.
SPEAKER_07 (34:50):
You do, yes.
SPEAKER_04 (34:51):
A few months apart in age, we grew up in a very
very close to each other, ourearly careers very much look
like each other.
Yeah, so that certainly has hashelped the friendship between
the four of us.
And then you both married twowonderful men.
You know, yes, I agree with thatwholeheartedly.
Okay.
So looking forward in time, andpart of what our responsibility
(35:15):
is, is helping the nextgeneration, you know, pick up
where we left off and taking ourcommunity forward.
What advice would you have forsomeone who's young now,
struggling with coming out, andand put them on a path where
they can then be as successfulas we were?
SPEAKER_07 (35:32):
Respect yourself, have confidence in yourself, and
be honest.
If you manage those three thingsand you'll do fine, don't let
people put you down, balk youdown, make you feel inferior.
You're not.
But be honest, be honest withyour friends.
And I think if you follow that,you'll have success in whatever
you do.
Well, you know, I I've been veryfortunate.
(35:52):
I've been fortunate in myprofession, in my friends.
I've been involved in a lot oforganizations that are
charitable based.
I've enjoyed that, and I stilldo that.
You can't, even though I'mretired and I've been for ten
years now, you can't just hideyourself somewhere.
You've got to stay active.
And I think the best way to stayactive is to try to do that in a
(36:13):
community-based thing, somethingthat you out of the community
with.
I think that's been my approachof at least if not success, for
comfort.
SPEAKER_04 (36:21):
Yeah, well, you've done a lot of work for the
community over the years.
So, yes, thank you.
Thank you for that.
SPEAKER_07 (36:27):
I've been involved in a lot of things, and that
really is neither here northere.
I would just like for people I'mgonna backtrack a little bit.
I had a relative of mine, ayoung man, and he was married
twice, divorced twice, tried tocommit suicide three times.
We were close, and so the lasttime he tried to commit suicide,
it was by medication.
I talked to him and I said,Okay, I'm gonna ask you a
(36:50):
question.
If you answer, fine, if youdon't, that's fine.
I said, Are you gay?
And there was a long hesitation,and he says, Yeah, Uncle, I am.
I said, When you get out of thehospital, you'll have a ticket
waiting for you, and I'm flyingyou down to New Orleans, and
we're going to go to bars andyou're gonna see what gay life
can be, and not hiding in backalleys and things like that.
(37:12):
He did.
He came down, he went back toMississippi, he packed up his
bags and moved to Texas.
I was in Texas by this time, andmoved to Texas, and he had an
entirely different life.
He's married now to a man.
They have a good life, a goodhome, he's had a good
(37:32):
profession.
And it goes back to this thingabout acceptance,
acknowledgement, and how youfeel about yourself.
He could have very easily beenunder the ground then.
So that is, I guess, if I saidif there's something I did that
I think was beneficial, so thatwas my part in getting him
straight and he didn't.
SPEAKER_04 (37:51):
It's something that we see a lot of, and you bring
up an interesting point to onethat I meant to ask about
earlier.
When I first came out, one ofthe more common circumstances
that I saw was an older gay manthat had in his early life
gotten married, in some caseshad kids, tried to fight the
urges and eventually decided,yes, I I'm gay, and they left
(38:14):
their wife and their family andpursued life as a gay man.
Uh, and the first time, thefirst few times, I saw the
struggle in their face and theirlives and that they had.
Do you see that as well, firstof all, did you experience that
as you were growing up, a youngman?
And do you see that as much now?
SPEAKER_07 (38:33):
No, because like I say, when I came out, I didn't
have any children.
And my wife was dead.
So I didn't have any familyrelations.
So the one that I had to uh dealwith was myself.
I can see how that could be aterrible burden on someone
because you're pulled in so manydirections.
And I have seen I'm kind oftelling on myself a little bit
(38:56):
here.
I had a relationship with a guy,and I really cared for him.
And we had seen each other foroh close to a year.
And finally, there was in thesummertime he said, I want you
to come out and uh we're gonnahave a barbecue.
I want you to come and meet someof my friends and all.
So I went.
Well, I got there.
I met his wife and threechildren.
(39:16):
I had no idea this man wasmarried.
I had no idea this man hadchildren, and our relationship
stopped.
Yeah, of course.
But no, that's the kind of thingthat I don't.
SPEAKER_04 (39:32):
Thank you for joining me today.
Uh, your history is isfascinating, and I appreciate
your sharing it with us.
SPEAKER_07 (39:39):
Well, thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_02 (39:51):
Tammy Wallace is a co-founder and the president and
CEO of the Greater Houston LGBTQplus Chamber of Commerce.
For more than 20 years, Tammy'sbeen a leading voice for LGBTQIA
plus business advocacy inHouston.
She owns her own small business,and today we're gonna talk about
women, particularly lesbians whoown businesses in our community.
(40:12):
How can we help them?
What are they facing?
So, Tammy, thank you for talkingto me today.
SPEAKER_01 (40:16):
Yeah, Brett, thank you.
I'm honored.
I really, really appreciate uhthe opportunity to share more
about women-owned businesses.
SPEAKER_02 (40:23):
Yeah, it's a great topic.
So tell me a little bit aboutwomen in business in our
community.
I mean, do you know somepercentages or some demographic
information about women,especially in the LGBTQ spaces?
SPEAKER_01 (40:35):
Yeah, I mean, you know, according to the Federal
Reserve, their small businesscredit survey, they anticipate
34% of businesses are LGBTQ plusowned.
But if you want to get down,really drill down into Houston
or more broadly the region, wedon't have that information.
And that's something that we'relooking at as part of our growth
plan.
How do we capture thatinformation, right?
(40:57):
Because it's valuable, valuableinformation as we look to
support LGBTQ plus ownedbusinesses.
SPEAKER_02 (41:02):
President of the Greater Houston LGBTQ Chamber of
Commerce.
What kind of businesses are youseeing in your membership that
are women-owned?
SPEAKER_01 (41:09):
So it's we're so we're a regional chamber.
Sometimes we'll get questionsabout just in general, about our
membership.
People assume there's a certaintype of business, and actually
there's not.
Because we're regional, we havenot only LGBTQ plus owned
businesses, all light-ownedbusinesses, it really does run
the gamut.
But certainly some of ourbusinesses we see are in
(41:32):
hospitality experience spaces.
I think of Kathy Podell withHouston, Asia Town Tours, right?
Giving giving tours in in AsiaTown.
But then Julie Mabrie comes tomind with Pearl Bar.
She's been an incredible leaderand longtime business in the
community.
And then Black Flops.
Rika and Tasha run a businesswhere you can go in and make
(41:53):
your own candles, create yourown scent, both perfume and you
know, candles.
Bring your team in, bring thefamily in, date night.
So it really does run the gamutin other businesses that are
like working with some of ourlarge companies, right?
Through through supply chain.
But that's that's the beauty.
It really speaks to the beautyof our community, right?
(42:14):
We are the whole of thecommunity.
SPEAKER_02 (42:16):
What do you think are some of the challenges for
small businesses?
SPEAKER_01 (42:19):
Right at the top of the list when I answer this
question, particularly in theenvironment we're in, is
uncertainty.
I mean, there is so muchuncertainty.
And what is creating thatuncertainty, right?
Tariffs, what that means interms of driving cost of
business up, expenses, talentrecruitment, just being able to
attract and and retain employeesis incredibly, incredibly
(42:40):
challenging.
And more specifically for LGBTQplus owned businesses,
women-owned businesses, is, youknow, trying to differentiate
themselves in despite thechallenges that they've
historically faced is, you know,that's where we come in at the
chamber, right?
Helping to elevate thesebusinesses, highlight that they
are part of our community.
(43:01):
If they're allied-ownedbusinesses, supportive of the
community, it's such a great wayto differentiate your your
business.
And our community is alsolooking, and we asked our
community to be intentionalabout their spending, right?
Go to our chamber directory,find businesses that not only
align with you, you know, in ourcommunity, but support you 365
(43:21):
days a year.
SPEAKER_02 (43:22):
I always encourage people to do that.
I always try to know who I'mdoing business with, what
factors they play in ourcommunity or in the overall
larger impact of the communityand things like that.
I always try to patronize peoplethat I know are part of our
community or at least an ally oran advocate for us and not
working against us.
I think it's so important, justfor your own peace of mind of
(43:42):
like, I am helping my communityrather than working against my
community.
SPEAKER_01 (43:47):
I love hearing you say that, Brett, because when in
this day and age right now,people are like, what can I do?
How can I help?
How can I, you know, I'm gonnafight what's going on?
The first step is your owndollars, how you spend those is
your choice, right?
And by being intentional andspending those with inclusive
supportive supporter businesses,not only helps, you know, signal
(44:09):
and send a message, but it helpsdrive economic opportunity,
right, for our community.
SPEAKER_02 (44:15):
You know, I remember a time I used to work in
corporate America or anythingpublic facing.
You basically went into thecloset for your work in your
career.
You basically said, All right,my identity is gone.
And now it seems like we'realmost entering an era where
people are almost getting backto that.
I mean, do you think that that'schanged?
I mean, I remember there wasdefinitely a time when we didn't
(44:35):
have to do that.
SPEAKER_01 (44:36):
Yeah.
No, I think I think people arescared and rightfully so right
now.
We've seen so at the chamber, wework with a lot of large
companies, specifically theirLGBTQ and allied employee
resource groups or ERGs, wherethey're nervous about what's
happening.
In other cases, they're reallystrong advocates inside of the
company to try to maintainsupport and engagement with the
(44:58):
chamber.
But earlier this year, wethinking about a small business
came came to us and said, Look,we do we do federal contracting.
And so we still support thechamber.
We want to be in involved, butcan you take our name off the
public facing directory?
And of course we said yes.
So people are very scared rightnow.
And and what does that fear do?
(45:20):
It actually doesn't help oureconomy.
It doesn't help people grow andthrive, which is really in this
country, particularly with smallbusinesses or you know, in
companies, in order to increaseproductivity, et cetera.
We need people to thrive and beable to be bring their authentic
sales to the table.
All of that drives, you know,economic opportunity and drives
(45:44):
our economy to be much moresuccessful, meaningful, and
also, you know, the returns thatwe get.
So it's so contradictory interms of what is what is
happening right now with thisfear-based approach because it
really is impacting businesses,it's impacting employees and
even, you know, nonprofits thatare in our ecosystem.
SPEAKER_02 (46:05):
One of the things that I'm hearing rumblings about
just within the community issecurity.
A lot of people are talkingabout if you're a business that
is out in public, part of thechamber, you know, whatever, am
I going to be a target?
Do I need to step up mysecurity?
Do you feel like there's a worryabout that as well?
SPEAKER_01 (46:21):
Yes, there's definitely a worry.
There's a worry for us as anorganization.
We've had some threats and we'vehad to engage local, uh, local
law authorities, agencies.
Constable Rosen, I have to givehim credit, but precinct one has
been a great supporter inhelping us through some of those
challenges.
And so that does go for ourbusinesses.
You want to talk about theultimate statement of courage,
(46:44):
and that is businesses thatstill encourage and support the
community.
They're very visible aboutsupporting the community,
whether they're LGBTU owned orallied owned.
That's courage.
That you can point to that todayin terms of courage.
We've had one of our businessescoffee shop in the woodlands had
someone just flung open theirdoors, started yelling
(47:06):
exploites, telling them to taketheir pride flag down.
So it it is real.
But this is also why as acommunity we need to make sure
that we're showing up, thatwe're supporting them.
SPEAKER_02 (47:18):
And let's get a little bit more granular because
we're here to talk about womenspecifically.
So, what are the what are thechallenges that you face as a
woman owning a small business?
And what are the differencesthere?
SPEAKER_01 (47:30):
Yeah, I mean, for women in particular, there's
obviously still the pay equitygap that we see that plays
through for businesses as well.
We've had businesses that getready to to contract and they're
asking me advice.
And I'm I'm like, why are youonly charging this much, right?
Because I know other businessesthat are doing the same thing,
(47:52):
particularly when they wanted toengage with government or
putting in an RFP, they'reunder, they're underselling
themselves, they're undervaluingthemselves because they want to
get the business.
So it's an educational processto understand your worth.
The other piece of that is whenyou think about women
entrepreneurs, so many of themalso are raising families,
right?
Have children.
And so that's an that that's anadded layer.
(48:13):
But also the statistics, I don'tknow the exact number, but that
are single parents.
So they're single parents tryingto raise children, trying to run
a business, which quite frankly,being an entrepreneur is not for
the faint of heart.
It is is hard work andparticularly under the
conditions what we first talkedabout with the uncertainty, et
cetera.
Those are some of the uniquechallenges that women face.
(48:35):
Sometimes it's access tocapital, particularly if
they're, you know, just justgetting started as a business.
So those are the types of thingswe try to help help businesses
connect with lenders that areworking, working with us and
working with our community, andalso pairing them with you know
supportive resources likementors or role models.
(48:56):
Because again, sometimes it'sthat self-worth that women come
at life in general because ofour life experiences.
And uh that bleeds intoentrepreneurship, that bleeds
into business ownership as well.
SPEAKER_02 (49:08):
You know, the city at one point I think had a
mandate to do business withwomen-owned businesses and
minority-owned businesses.
Is that still something that yousee?
SPEAKER_01 (49:18):
Yes, that is still something.
The city still does have theirwhat's called an MWBE program.
They do recognize there's acertification for LGBTQ plus
owned businesses and LGBTBE orbusiness enterprise
certification.
We worked with Mayor Turner toactually get the certification
recognized by the city.
And to his credit, he signed anexecutive order in 2020.
(49:40):
So it's not counted towards thespecific spend that is outlined
in city ordinance.
But the program is stillongoing.
And there are many programs ingovernment, Harris County, etc.,
that are still focused onengaging small, diverse owned
businesses because our electedleaders understand diverse owned
businesses, underservedbusinesses deserve a shot, a
(50:03):
seat at the table, but alsoshould be getting some of that
business.
And that's what those programsdo.
They require what's calledprimes to really seek out
qualified small, diverse ownedbusinesses, including
women-owned businesses, toengage with them.
SPEAKER_02 (50:19):
And that's very comforting to hear because I you
just have this image of thediversity and commitment to this
kind of thing is is being ekedaway at.
(51:37):
Yeah.
No, absolutely.
And it's important work.
I mean, tell me a little bitabout the chamber if I'm
interested in it.
How can I find out more?
Where do I go?
Who do I network?
Yeah, how do I do that?
SPEAKER_01 (51:48):
So we uh so people sometimes when you hear the word
chamber, you think, oh, smallbusinesses.
Our ecosystem actually doesconsist of those large companies
I mentioned.
Of course, our small businesses.
We have professionals, we haveyoung professionals, and we have
nonprofits.
And so all you have to do isvisit Houston LGBTQchamber.com
and you can see our variousmembership levels.
(52:10):
We do about 140 events a year.
It's crazy, but we do reallyencourage people to come out to
our monthly third Thursdaybreakfast.
We get it between 100 and 150people every month.
And it is a fantastic way tostart your morning and being in
community.
People love this breakfast.
And I'll say this, Brett, whenwe first started the chamber,
people would tell come up toGary and I and they'd be like,
(52:32):
wow, I love this chamber.
And it, you know, as we wereabout a year in, and so we Gary
and I were like, okay, well,we're obviously doing something
right, but what is it?
And so we started asking peoplein comparison to other chambers,
and then I figured out, and Ifigured out what the magic is.
When you walk in the doors ofthe chamber, that armor that we
have to wear as LGBTQ pluspeople, it falls.
(52:53):
You don't have to wear it.
You can come in and you canfocus on your business, or if
you're a job seeker, or ifyou're a nonprofit trying to,
you know, bring more visibilityto the important work you're
doing.
You don't have to worry aboutwho you are, vetting your words,
you know, who you love.
You just come in and you focuson being in community and doing
what you're doing.
SPEAKER_02 (53:14):
I just love the idea of that if you're a woman-owned
business and you need some help,some resources and things like
that, this is definitely aplace, a channel for you to get
that.
And then navigate all of thosethings, like you talked about,
the certifications and thedifferent programs you could
take advantage of.
And there's a a room full ofpeople that know how to navigate
(53:34):
this for you.
And that can take away some ofthat challenge.
SPEAKER_01 (53:37):
And we have programming throughout the year
for our small businesses, uh,women-owned businesses too, more
specifically.
But uh, we have a Thrive SmallBusiness Summit that we do every
January that is geared aday-long summit to help our
small businesses, both withcontent, educational content,
but we're literally doing amatchmaker where we're
connecting them to somebody thatmay be seeking their services,
(53:57):
whether it's somebody insupplier inclusion or an
employee resource group, we'rehelping them raise their
visibility and create connectionand relationships in what we
call this ecosystem.
SPEAKER_02 (54:09):
Well, thank you so much.
I am fascinated by this topic,and I'm sorry I have gone all
over the map on this.
And I know that, you know, Iguess if you had any advice for
a woman that wanted to start abusiness in our community, let's
say she's a part of ourcommunity and she wants to start
a business, what would be themost crucial piece of advice
that you would give to her?
SPEAKER_01 (54:29):
Find resource and resources and support, and
there's tons of them.
Not just here at the chamber,but we have other collaboration
partners as well.
Was talking on the phone withone today about some work we're
gonna do collaborativelytogether next year.
There's all kinds of resourcesin this city to support women
entrepreneurs.
Everything from capability, capcapacity building programming.
(54:52):
We did a program last year withCommissioner Adrian Garcia that
was a six six-week-long program.
Find those resources becauselaying the foundation is gonna
ensure your success over thenext three to five years.
Five years is that pivotalnumber.
So the more you can do to alignand align with resources and
supportive, excuse me,individuals, the better.
SPEAKER_02 (55:15):
Yeah, no, and I think anybody that's facing that
that's got you feel alone, Ithink, when you start a small
business.
I think you you really do.
It's like I I'm really going outthere on my own, but you have to
realize there are people thathave done it and done it
successfully, and they can helpyou.
And especially for women too.
SPEAKER_01 (55:31):
And chambers are the best place to find to find that
support, whether it's ours.
There's tons of diverse chambersin the in the city, and we
always encourage people to joinjoin one, join five where it
aligns with what you're tryingto accomplish.
Most importantly, get thesupport, but don't go it alone,
especially these days.
(55:52):
Find those resources, find thatsupport.
SPEAKER_02 (55:54):
Well, you definitely have to.
You got to be careful about thepolitical environment and
everything else that's going on.
You need those resources.
SPEAKER_01 (55:59):
So absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (56:00):
Thank you for being here for leading in business and
leading the Greater HoustonLGBTQ plus chamber of commerce.
I know you've got tons ofexciting events.
That breakfast, as youmentioned, is super popular.
I think you have a couple oflectures and things like that
coming up.
Uh the Kinder Institute is gonnapresent.
SPEAKER_01 (56:18):
Yes, that's gonna be a great luncheon, our community
conversations luncheon.
SPEAKER_02 (56:21):
Yes.
So I'm excited, and I'm excitedthat you are deciding to throw a
spotlight on women in ourcommunity that own businesses.
So thank you.
SPEAKER_01 (56:29):
Well, thank you, and thank you for highlighting the
importance of our ourbusinesses, particularly women
and the challenges they face.
SPEAKER_05 (56:45):
Heard on APFT Houston and as a podcast
available from severalpodcasting sources.
Check our webpagequeervoices.org for more
information.
Queer Voices executive produceris Brian Levinka.
Deborah Moncrief Bell isco-producer, Brett Cullum and
(57:06):
David Mendoza Druisman arecontributors.
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