January 15, 2025 • 63 mins
Back with another absolutely heart-warming (yet filled with moments of laughter and comedy) queer love story! This week I chat with Travis and James, an absolutely amazing couple whom I photographed their small wedding in August of 2024. T + J share themes of love, queer wedding planning tips in rural areas, and sharing about what it's like to navigate family not coming to your wedding. Give it a listen and go check out their wedding gallery to put a visual to all the words <3
https://gallery.wildlyconnectedphotography.com/travisandjamesgetmarried/
The intro and all instrumentals were written, sung and recorded by @JaynaDavisMusic
Queerly Beloved, I'm so glad you joined!
Please keep the community going by checking me out on instagram @wildlyconnectedphoto and come say hi! I'd love to hear from you! :)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Okay, Curly Beloved, welcomeback to this week's episode.
I'm super excited to have thisamazing couple with me here
today.
Um, I photographed their weddingback in August and it was
probably one of the mostbeautiful days I've ever seen
and they are just chef's kissthe absolute best.
So without further ado, wouldyou two introduce yourselves,
(00:23):
your pronouns, and anyidentities you want to share?
Sure.
Hi, my name is Travis.
My pronouns are he, him.
Um, I was born in Brazil.
I was adopted as an infant, andI grew up in rural northern
Minnesota, and I'm married toJames.
And I am James.
Uh, my pronouns are he, him aswell.
Uh, also from Minnesota.
(00:44):
Um, although we've moved a lot,uh, also from Minnesota, um,
kind of born and raised in, inthe southern suburbs, uh, of the
state and, um, yeah, I guess, Iguess that that's me.
Yeah, awesome.
Well, I mean, spoiler alert.
(01:04):
You guys are married before wejump into that.
Um, I was curious if, if both ofyou could kind of share as much
or as little as you want, justkind of about your each
respective coming out journeys.
Yeah, sure.
So my coming out journey wasdeeply intertwined with my
(01:27):
identity as a former Baptist.
Growing up, I wrestled, um,wrestled with the message I was
receiving about who I should beversus who I truly was.
Moving to Minneapolis and goingto a private Christian college
really was a dark time for mebecause I wanted to serve the
God that I believe was full oflove.
(01:48):
But I knew I needed to be trueto myself.
And I was being taught, and myfaith didn't align at that time.
I ended up coming out to mymother three times.
Once in high school, when shefound my copy of Queer As Folk
under my bed.
She watched two episodes, and Iwas absolutely mortified.
Once in college when I wasattending, um, an ex gay
(02:10):
conversion group, and then thethird time, um, to both my
parents when I had been asked toleave that private Christian
college, and I, um, had gottenmy first, um, apartment to loan.
Um, it was met with a littleshock, which I always found
interesting, because my motherhad already known, um, but we
moved, um, past that and thenstarted to heal from there.
(02:31):
And now we are kind of in aplace where they love James as
my partner.
Um, they still struggle with it.
On a face, um, side of it, butwe are all family.
So it's beautiful.
Yeah.
I'm really grateful to have, Ithink, as good of a relationship
as I could possibly ever hopefor with his parents and with
(02:53):
his family.
Um, obviously I know where theystand religiously.
And with their belief system,and it's really difficult for
them to acknowledge even ourrelationship and conversation
or, uh, you know, definitely ourmarriage in particular, um, is a
tricky one because, you know,the way that they view marriage
is very much as a sacrament tiedto the religion.
(03:13):
Um, so it is, you know.
A little bit more even of apinpoint even beyond us just
being in a relationship.
Although I think that whetherthey acknowledge it outright or
not, they're both there.
Everyone is aware like everyoneat this point.
They know that we're married.
They know that we're in arelationship and they love me
and welcome me into their homeinto Thanksgiving gatherings and
(03:35):
those other thing kind ofmoments as well.
Um, but I don't think that, youknow, I don't know that they're
going to get to a place, atleast not anytime soon.
I don't want to, I don't want toput it on them and say never,
um, but I think it would be verychallenging for them to get to a
place where they acknowledge ourmarriage.
Um, but acknowledging thatTravis loves me, that I love
(03:56):
him, um, that I make him happyand that I'm a good person.
I think that, you know, thatthat was something that I don't
think that.
Maybe we expected, um, but maybenot.
Maybe it's something that theydidn't expect was to be able to
see me as a good person.
Um, but they do.
Uh, and, and so I think thatthat getting to that place alone
(04:16):
is, is reward enough.
And as, as much as I could everask for, I'm very, very grateful
for that.
Um, as far as me, um, my comingout story, I think is not as
intense.
I guess I w I would say it'snot, I, I definitely was raised
in a conservative community.
It was a conservative, you know.
(04:39):
Christian suburb.
Uh, and so and I was raised, youknow, in a catholic church, went
to catholic school.
My family was catholic.
Um, so there were thosechallenges, of course, that come
along with all of those things.
Um, and really coming to thatrecognition of, of loving that
part of me did take some time, Ithink, particularly with my mom
(04:59):
and dad.
They've always Honestly, comefrom a place of love.
Uh, even when I was little, youknow, they recognized that my
interests were different.
They, they, they, they supportedme when I wanted to be a theater
kid and a choir kid and aperforming artist.
They, they bought me a Barbiedoll, right?
(05:19):
Stereotype, but it's there itis.
If I wanted a Barbie, they gotme a Barbie.
Um, so they, they did support methrough that.
The whole coming out process,you know, I, I had my, my
boyfriends were secretboyfriends for quite a long time
where that wasn't something thatI could share with them or felt
like I could share with themand, and in that kind of
realizing process of, oh, I amgay, um, kind of over my high
(05:43):
school years, that was astruggle for them.
That was definitely a challenge.
They just, they didn't want thatfor me is kind of where the
place that they were comingfrom.
They felt it was going to makemy life harder and that it was
going to put me, you know, addchallenges to my life and add
risk to my life.
And you know what, some of thatis true, but, um, I think all
for the better.
Right.
And I think that, um, as queerpeople, we can all acknowledge
(06:04):
that, you know, even thoughthere are all those challenges
that come with being.
Different than everybody else.
Um, they really do turn intostrengths.
And I, I think that they gave meenough space to allow that to be
true and not for it to be aburden.
And they've really come around.
Um, we are now at a completelyopposite end of the spectrum of
(06:25):
any type of challenge.
We are loving, welcoming family.
Um, and, and they, they, theycouldn't be more wonderful.
Absolutely.
My mom and dad and my, my, mybrothers and sisters, all of my
family are just, um, loving,welcoming, accepting.
Wonderful people.
And it's really wonderful.
Yeah, I like to think I had alittle part of that.
(06:47):
Just, you know, by having thatbe the, you know, the thing that
popped up, it helped, helpedeveryone to ask some questions
about what is important.
And I think that, you know, loveand family came down to being
the most important.
And so that hopefully changedsome minds, opinions and got us
to where we are now.
(07:07):
Yeah, yeah, it's reallybeautiful.
And yes, I, I loved talking toyour parents at the wedding too.
They were so, they were so fun.
And your mom was out therebusting a move at some point in
the wedding.
They absolutely will do that.
They will swing dance anyopportunity that they are given
to show off those skills.
At some point in time they tooklessons together.
(07:28):
Um, and they do, they do love tobust a move on the dance floor
if given the opportunity.
And the photos that you capturedat that moment were so few.
Oh my gosh, we just, we treasurethem.
We actually got a photo album.
Um, not to teach your horn toomuch, but we definitely will
because it was a big importantpart of our wedding.
Um, and one of the bigpriorities for us was
photography.
(07:49):
So we got a photo album.
Of a bunch of their favoritepictures, um, that they printed
off for us.
And so, um, we got that for asone of our Christmas gifts this
year.
It was really lovely.
So it sits on our console tablenow, like right by our sofa as
people come in, uh, to ourapartment.
Yeah.
And now that we've recentlymoved into kind of our, you
(08:11):
know, our more permanent homehere in Chicago, we are fingers
crossed.
We're gonna order some more too,because we want to get some on
our walls and in the office.
So we're excited to get that aswell.
We want to get some more prints.
So we're very excited.
We're very, very happy.
Yeah.
Oh my gosh, yay.
I love to hear that.
Well, if you ever want to, like,show me them hanging up, like, I
(08:32):
don't know, I think it's just sointeresting and fun to see which
ones, like, you guys love andwhere you put them and
everything.
So, yeah, I'd love to hear that.
Before we like jump fully intoyour relationship, which I'm
super excited about, thank youso much for sharing about your,
your coming out.
(08:52):
It sounds like there was, youknow, good parts and bad parts
in both and, and ultimatelyyou're, you're better for it.
But, I'm curious, it sounds likeThere's a little bit of a common
theme of kind of having thatrough spot and then, um,
obviously, I know maybe yourparents are in different places
now, but I'm curious just likehow much you had to kind of
(09:17):
wrestle with that to get to thepoint you're at now.
And is it ever still hard?
I can jump in on this one.
Um, I, I mean, I was prettycomfortable with myself pretty
early on.
Um, I mean, I, I founded likethe Gay Straight Alliance at my
high school.
I think that was my likesophomore or junior year.
(09:38):
Um, and so I was pretty aware,right?
Um, I wasn't necessarily sharingeverything with my family, but I
was pretty aware and prettycomfortable early on.
So that, that little bit oflike, yeah.
My family, you know, getting,getting comfortable with the
idea, you know, there were,there were definitely ups and
downs with that, um, but I'vebeen pretty comfortable from,
(10:01):
from the beginning, like, Iwould say for me, anyway.
Yeah.
For me, I think it was a littlebit harder.
I think that the notion of, youknow, in the queer community, we
use the term chosen family alot.
And I think that with me beingadopted, the notion of chosen
family was something I was veryaware of from a young age.
(10:23):
So that was something that Iremember being in high school.
And once I got my driver'slicense, and I lived about four
and a half hours away from likea bigger metropolitan area, and
then coming down with my friendsfrom high school, who at the
time, who my best friend was alesbian, and we would come and
we met, you know, some of ourclosest queer friends, and that
was kind of our chosen family atthe time, and then kind of being
(10:46):
introduced to the To the biggerqueer community in Minneapolis.
And then kind of, you know, Iwas came down and I remember
being like, yeah, I'm abisexual.
And like, I remember Raven beinglike, no honey, you're a gay
boy, but whatever you need to,whatever, whatever you are, you
can do, but we'll see how thatturns out in the next decade or
(11:08):
so.
And she was right.
And I love her for that.
She's still one of my, I callher my sister.
She's one of my closest anddearest friends.
Um, But it, yeah, it was a lot,it was met with a lot of
personal struggle, a lot ofdepression, a lot of, you know,
um, those issues, especiallyduring college.
And, you know, I went throughgay conversion therapy, which,
(11:30):
you know, was kind of one of themore darker times in my life.
But I'm grateful for all of thatbecause, you know, it made me
stronger.
It truly showed me who I was andshowed my character.
And I do not regret any of that.
Anything that I went through, Ido not wish that upon anyone
else.
And I wish that any, anyone outthere will be able to realize
(11:53):
that you don't need that.
Just listen to who you are fromyour inner self and trust your
inner self because that is yourtruth.
Um, but if you have to go onthat journey, then go on that
journey.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, let's hope that soon.
Conversion therapy will betotally banned across the board
(12:16):
everywhere.
Yeah, I can't imagine, but thankyou again both for sharing that.
Um, and I'm so glad that youguys found, found yourselves and
found each other.
And speaking of finding eachother, let's talk about how you
guys met.
Because I think it's such a funstory.
(12:37):
Yeah, I'll start on this one.
I, uh, we'd kind of, um, been inthe same circles.
It seemed like for quite a longtime.
Um, we'd attended a lot of thesame events.
We just kind of crossed pathsand were passively aware of each
other.
Um, and, you know, had it.
Interacted at various points.
(12:58):
Um, in time, I remember one timewe were like at the same event.
We had like rented like thesebooths right next to each other.
Um, and we didn't even talk orinteract.
I don't think that night, but Iremember us being like, right,
right next to each other.
Um, and there were also thosemoments during that time where I
was with my.
My ex husband, you were withsomebody at the time.
(13:20):
And so we were never necessarilyboth mutually available.
Um, and so it was just kind of aships passing in the night kind
of thing.
Uh, and then there was oneinstance, um, back in the day,
back in the day, uh, back in theday.
What an expression.
But back in the day, that's whenyou know you've reached a
(13:41):
certain age.
When back in the day makessense.
Um, but back in the day, I was adrag performer at this one club
in Minneapolis.
And, uh, I, it was a Halloweenshow and Trav, I, I was
performing this mix that juststruck Travis, I guess.
Yeah.
How much did you tip me?
I don't know.
Was it 100?
(14:02):
I think he took me a 100 bill ifI'm, if I remember right.
And so he really loved it.
I went down to the dressing roomand I was like, drinks on me
everybody.
Um, but it's funny cause wedidn't even realize when we had
started dating that I was thatperson.
He was that person.
Um, I, I think it was weird justtelling a story one time of
like, Oh yeah, this, I can'tremember if it was me telling it
(14:22):
or Oh yeah, one time I think itwas the song.
Yeah.
The song came on and I was like,Oh yeah, I performed to this
song one time.
And he was like, I tippedsomebody 100 for performing this
song one time, and we realizedthat that was each other.
So, um, truly ships passing inthe night.
We, we had so many of those oddCoincidences where it's like,
(14:45):
Oh, we, maybe we're supposed tomeet at this time.
Maybe we're supposed to meet atthis time.
But of course, that's not theway the universe works.
Right?
You're supposed to things happenthe way that they're supposed
to.
And, and we met exactly when wewere supposed to.
Uh, so one, one fateful night.
And this was, you know,basically right after I had
gotten out of my previousmarriage and that kind of had
(15:06):
ended a little bit prior, Travishad just gotten out of a
relationship as well.
And.
We had both separately again,taken separate vows to be like,
you know what, no, I'm going tobe single for a while.
I've already gone through likethe relationship thing.
Look, we've tried it, honey.
(15:26):
We need to do something else.
We need to get out there andsample the wares.
You know what I mean?
Whatever that means, it's timeto be the next couple of months.
You're the town bicycle.
Everybody gets a ride and you'regoing to find your favorite
partner.
So that was the that was thephilosophy that we're both kind
of going into.
And it's funny because it'spartly Because of that
(15:46):
philosophy that we found eachother that night, because of
course, we're on a particularapp.
Um, and, uh, that shall not benamed because frankly, it's a
toxic environment.
Um, you know, you got to do whatyou got to do out there.
If you're young and having fun,go for it.
But boy, be safe, be safe.
(16:08):
Anyways.
So, uh, we're on a particularapp and it happened and it was
Travis.
And so we, um, we started to, tochat there and I was like, you
know what?
Um, come on over, like, comeover, let's hang out.
Right.
Oh, with the worst bicycle withthe worst of intentions with the
(16:31):
with the naughtiest ofintentions.
I was like, Hey, come over.
Um, and he was like, Oh yeah.
Do you, you know, you haveanything to drink?
And I was like, you know, Idon't.
Um, but the liquor stores areabout to close if you wanted to
stop and grab something.
And he was like, well, what'syour favorite?
And I told him and I was like,but don't try and get that.
It's all the way on the otherside of town.
(16:52):
There's just this one liquorstore in the whole city that
sells it.
That's silly.
Just grab whatever and comeover.
Well, I don't know how fast hedrove, but he managed to make it
to that liquor store in time,uh, make it to that liquor store
in time and grab my favorite.
And so then he shows up at mydoor holding this bottle and
maybe it was the bottle or maybeit was his eyes, but it was love
(17:14):
at first sight.
And I, I saw him and Iimmediately was like, Oh, my
first thought was both thiscombination of joy and
excitement, but also this, Oh,no, because it was like, Oh, no,
I'm in love.
I'm not supposed to be in lovewhen it was truly the same on me
(17:36):
too, because like walking up tothe door, I remember.
feeling like this energy oflike, something is bringing me
forward.
Right.
And like, it was truly like whenhe opened the door, it was like
everything else justdisappeared.
And again, it was this, Oh no,what did I just do?
This isn't the plan.
This was not the plan.
(17:57):
And we never looked back and I'mso grateful.
Yeah, we, we ended up.
You know, we got around to thetour to France eventually, but
for a while that we, we actuallysat down, we talked for hours,
hours, hours.
And I think it was about hourtwo or three that I told him I
(18:17):
loved him.
This is some lesbian energyright here.
It is.
It should have been a red flag.
It should have been.
Okay.
He's crazy.
I need to leave.
But since he was feeling thesame thing and we have that kind
of shared energy anyway, um, uh,Yeah, it just was.
(18:41):
It just was love at first sight.
I literally didn't.
It wasn't just I love you.
It was I love you and I thinkwe're going to spend the rest of
our lives together.
Yeah.
So get into that drama andplease keep in mind too.
I didn't live in Minneapolis atthe time.
I was living in northernMinnesota 4.
5 hours away.
Yeah.
And so we maybe we can get intothe logistics of that because
(19:03):
even that Well, it was the nextday, though.
You took me down.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So we drove 45 minutes south andwe went to see his sister.
Well, his chosen sister.
So Travis definitely in theprocess, like he was saying
earlier, developed that chosenfamily.
Um, and so we went to see hischosen family sister, uh, and
(19:23):
that she was having a bonfireand he like introduced me and
like this whole thing, um, allwithin 48 hours.
So it was.
Mhm.
24 hours.
Yeah, it was pretty, pretty fastand crazy.
But then Travis had to go back,right?
Travis had his job and his homeso far away.
(19:44):
Um, but he made constant, like,I don't know how you did this
because I didn't have a car atthe time.
So he would drive once or twicea week down to see me in
Minneapolis, which is just.
Ludicrous, crazy.
I mean, I remember I would callhim on the road and, and just
(20:05):
talk to him because I was like,you're going to fall asleep,
you're on the road so much.
And he would, he would leaveright after he got off work and
then he would leave in justenough time to get back for his
next shift.
Um, but I mean, it was love.
And so eventually, you know, inthe next little bit, we were
able to get an apartmenttogether and he moved down to
(20:26):
the cities and yeah.
And then COVID hit, and thenCOVID hit.
This is a serious, like, lesbiantimeline, like, incredible.
Wow, wow.
Well, we were pretty depressedat that point, because it's
like, COVID hit, and we wereliterally, like, I feel like we
(20:46):
had a, a 20 year relationshipcompacted down into that year,
two years, where we were justwith each other.
100 percent of the time.
We did.
We did the math the other day.
How many in how many years we'vebeen together?
5.
5 5.
5 years.
In those 5.
5 years we have spent less than20 days apart.
(21:08):
Wow.
So like total and I'm nottalking like a stretch.
I'm saying 20 total days in thelast 5.
5 years are a day that we didn'tsee each other.
Oh my gosh.
So yeah, we just never Neverparted.
Oh my gosh.
I mean, I know that I've heardthis story before, but I just, I
(21:29):
could cry listening to it allover again.
Cause it's just so like, Iremember you guys kind of
talking about like, like fateand all of that stuff too.
And when we met and I, yeah,those are definitely the vibes.
Um, Travis, I am curious, whenJames said, I love you at hour
two, what was your response?
(21:50):
My response was, I was flooredbecause I was feeling the same.
And as someone who, I'm a, asfar as Zodiac, I'm a Cancer, and
so I often lead with myfeelings.
feelings.
And so I often, as I meetsomeone new, I tend to, you
know, keep those to myself.
But like because I was feelingthe same thing, it was like, Oh,
(22:13):
and because I felt that walkingup to the door to it kind of
like solidified what I wasfeeling.
And yeah, I was like, Oh, thisis fast.
But it was like Again, thiswasn't the plan, but I love him
too.
So it's all okay.
I think what he did was heslipped a think in there.
He's like, I think I love youtoo.
Did I?
(22:33):
Which is a very clever way ofplaying it cool.
Right?
Like I'm not committing, but I'malso not going to leave you
hanging here.
Wow.
Wow.
That's so beautiful.
And so at what point, you guyssaid you've been together for
five and a half years.
(22:55):
When did you guys get engaged?
How far in were we?
Let's think about this.
Okay.
Was it two, two years?
Two and a half years?
Not, it was about a year.
Let's.
Think about this might take aminute.
(23:15):
I know it was during Covid.
I know it was during Covid.
I know it was like, and that wasa blur.
So who can remember whathappened during that time?
Right.
So it was during the pandemicthat could have been, can't say
covid.
Um, we can't say covid pandemic.
So during the pandemic, uh, andit was, it was some at 20, 20
minutes felt.
20 years.
So who knows?
But sometime in there, uh,sometime in there we got engaged
(23:38):
and it was the worst when, whenwe got engaged, we had been
doing the door dash at the time.
We w we had been doing a lot ofother odd jobs together.
I had to make extra money duringthe pandemic because everything
that we were doing at the timewas so dependent upon personal
(23:58):
interaction.
I, I had been doing likeentertainment and gig economy
and that died completely.
So I went from having a decentincome to nothing.
Uh, so DoorDash was a lifesaver,but at the same time.
We had one vehicle at the time,which is, we're actually back to
one vehicle.
(24:18):
But that's just'cause we're inChicago and two vehicles is
crazy.
Um, but at the time, we, youknow, that's what we, that our
means were one vehicle and so wewould deliver DoorDash together.
Mm-hmm And so we literally wouldspend hours in the car, just me
and him and look, we love eachother and like I said, we have
(24:39):
only been apart for what, acouple.
Maybe, maybe, maybe a dozendays, right?
But boy, that was a test, right?
You really do find a way to geton each other's absolute last
nerve.
And it was, it was the firstyear, like it's the first year
of like discovering who eachother are, it's discovering how
(24:59):
each other.
Right.
It's discovering what, uh, Oh,this triggers you.
And I don't necessarilyunderstand why, but now I know.
And all of those things figuringout, um, you know, how the other
person, you might love theirenergy, right?
You might love them heart andsoul, but you don't necessarily
know how they tick, right?
You don't know all of theirhistory yet.
(25:21):
You don't know.
who the details in the minutiaof who they are as a person.
Um, and so in the process offiguring that out, you step on
each other's toes and you bumpheads and you know, there is
static, there is electricity,there is thundershock, there is
thunderstorm.
Um, and this was, uh, this was athunderstorm day.
(25:42):
It was just awful.
Like we, we had had a true F youfight, where we were just
genuinely mad at each other.
And I remember there was thismoment after where it had kind
of resolved.
We were still like, we're still,but it had like kind of settled
(26:04):
and resolved.
And I knew, and, and, and I was,I looked at him and I was like,
even though I am as mad at youas I can imagine.
I still love you, right?
I still love you so much.
I love you more than I couldpossibly love any other human
being.
And at that moment, and I knewhe felt the same way.
It was like a moment ofconnection.
(26:24):
We knew because we were holdingeach other and I think there
were tears.
Yeah, we were like holding eachother crying.
Yeah.
And it was coming down.
Like we were so upset with eachother, but we knew it was, we
knew we were going to get pastthat moment.
Yep.
And we knew that we still lovedeach other.
It's kind of where I was at thatsame.
And so I was just holding himcrying and I was like, you want
(26:45):
to marry me?
And I was like, yeah, it soundslike it wasn't planned.
We didn't have a ring oranything like that.
And it wasn't, um, you know,didn't get down on one knee.
It just, it was that moment ofknowing that like.
If we can survive today, we cansurvive anything and we truly
(27:06):
are going to be togetherforever.
Like, if today didn't break usand, and we can get to that
place and still end up at theend of the day, loving each
other, it's forever.
Yeah.
Yeah, that, that truly must belike one of the most magical
proposals ever because Yeah, youwere like, I, I've seen you at
(27:29):
your lowest and I still like,love you so much and, and want
to be with you and know that wecan do it.
That's, oh my gosh, I just gotchills.
Wow.
And it, it, and it's, it's awonderful feeling too, because
some people, you know, I, and I,I love those people who have
those like, extravagant,wonderful engagements.
That's wonderful.
But like the security that Ifelt in our, in that moment.
(27:52):
Is like, I wouldn't trade it foranything in the world.
Yeah.
Oh my gosh.
Oh my guys.
Wow.
That's so beautiful., so you gotengaged and then you started
planning just the most amazing,wonderful wedding.
So I'm curious if you could kindof share, obviously I know it
(28:14):
was.
It's such an important day, butshare kind of like a condensed
version of your wedding and thenkind of in that if you have any
like tips for maybe other queercouples who are also planning.
Well, we, um, we sure didn'tstart planning.
We sure did not do thatactually.
We waited and we postponed andwe couldn't figure out when
(28:38):
would be the right time or whenit would make sense.
And we, with our jobs.
As you know, constantly moving,hopefully now settled for a
little bit, but constantlymoving.
And so, uh, it just was never,it never felt right.
It always felt like, oh, I gotthis other things, other things,
other things are important rightnow.
But eventually it was just like,you know what now, I don't know
what it was, but somethingclicked and now is the time and
(28:59):
a little bit prior to that.
I think the dream is important.
So we, we had, uh, we woke up inthe morning one morning and we
had both had this incrediblyvivid dream and we didn't want
to share it right away becauseit was so important.
So we kind of like looked overat each other.
It was like, Hey, I had a dreamlast night.
(29:19):
And Oh, I had a dream too.
The thing with us too is that weboth know when we're not telling
each other something too.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So like we both woke up and likelooked at each other and it's
like, you're not sayingyourself, right.
Yeah.
Like, what's up?
Yeah.
Like what are you not talkingabout?
Um, yeah.
So there was a lot of thatenergy, but um, basically we,
long story short, we, we had hadthe same dream the same night.
(29:44):
Um, of our wedding or somevision of it.
Um, and you know, we knew thatit was going to, basically the
dream was, um, we were gettingmarried, we knew that there were
these rows of white chairs, itwas by a body of water, there
were like rocks by the water,uh, and we saw these buildings
(30:05):
behind us, there were kind ofthese two story buildings with
white frames around the windows,and, um, So we're like, oh,
that's that's cool.
Like we didn't we didn't take itnecessarily as, oh, this is the
place, you know, where we'regoing to get married or it's
going to look exactly like that.
But we're like, I mean, it wassomething right?
I mean, you don't have the sameand it was eerie.
(30:27):
Like, who has the same dream thesame night?
Like, come on.
Like, I don't even know thatthat has ever happened to me.
To me, that certainly has nothappened to me ever at any other
point in my life.
I don't think I mean, I'veridden somewhere.
Oh, great.
Well, anyway, at least we'regonna adopt if we ever have
kids.
(30:48):
But anyway, so, uh, we had thesame dream.
And so part of the planningreally did revolve around
finding This location, eventhough it was this dream, like I
really did not expect to findit.
But I was in the office one dayand, um, we manage properties as
(31:08):
that's what we do.
Um, and one of my residents cameinto the office and, you know,
she said, Oh, you know, when itwhen When are you guys going to
get married?
And I kind of explained like,Oh, just never had the time.
And she's like, well, you gotta,you gotta.
And I told her about the dreamand she's like, got to find this
place.
You got to do it.
You got to do it right now.
And so she literally sat downwith me and we started to look
(31:28):
for venues together.
My office and she, um, she wasinsisted like she would not, she
would not leave until we foundsomething and I, we knew, well,
I, I didn't really at firstthink of it this way.
I wasn't sure if it was like bythe ocean or where, but in my
head, I was like, I know myfamily is going to come and I'm
(31:50):
sure we'll talk about this alittle bit too.
Um, but I, we didn't know ifTravis family would come or not,
but I knew that it was importantthat if yeah.
They were going to choose tocome that they have the option
and that it is just as easy forthem to attend as it is for my
family and the other people wewere going to invite.
(32:11):
So I kind of was like, well,Lake Superior's halfway kind of
in between where my family livesand where his family lives.
So let's look on the Northshore.
And as I just kind of went a bitliterally venue by venue up the
North Shore, I opened thewebsite for where we got
married, um, which is a placecalled Larsmont Cottages.
(32:32):
If you happen to be looking fora place, they're absolutely
lovely.
They did a wonderful job and,um, it was perfect.
It was like, it was like thedream had come to life and, um,
yeah, absolutely.
So we, we decided to have our,have our wedding there.
And I think that once we hadnarrowed down those venues and
we could narrow down the dates.
(32:52):
And that is really what, uh,helped.
We, we had, we had found thosevenues and then we spend
Thanksgiving with my family andthen we spend Christmas with
his.
And it so happened that like wewere going to head up in a
couple of weeks to go see, um,the, um, To go up for
Thanksgiving to see my familyand then we went and saw our
(33:15):
wedding venue and it wasgorgeous So we went inside we
were able to then book it andthen we started to plan the rest
of the wedding Which is thenwhen we found you well, and we
really started with ping pointsbecause There are so many, and
this, this worked its way, sometraditions that we didn't even
expect worked their way inbecause weddings are by their
(33:38):
nature, somewhat traditional,right?
We're pulling out all of these,these social traditions to
create these events, but at thesame time, like, Again, as part
of the Alphabet Mafia, you growup knowing things are a little
bit different for you, right?
So, so things can be a littlebit different.
These traditions can be a littlebit different.
(33:58):
You don't have to do all ofthese things.
Um, even as we were writing ourceremony together, my dad tried
to work in some of thoseCatholic marriage ceremony ping
points, because he's like, it'snot a marriage if you don't.
I did not know that.
That's Yeah, there's definitelysome stuff that worked its way
into that ceremony.
I'm struggling to remember themnow.
But yeah, he definitely workedin some, some like Catholic
(34:20):
wedding language, which ishilarious.
Uh, but, but we started theplanning process of what are,
what about this event is goingto be important to us?
And I think that people, um, youknow, and even my sister right
now is planning her wedding andevery couple approaches.
They're wedding so differentlyfor us.
(34:41):
It was really about what?
What we knew that it had to besomething that we would enjoy,
obviously, I think everybody hasthat as as a core of their
wedding planning.
But then also we wanted it to besomething everyone who is
attending would enjoy.
Right?
This is we thought about it.
Yes, it's our day.
Yes, it's for us, but it's alsoa celebration that we want
everybody to participate in andenjoy and be a part of and that
(35:03):
will just raise the vibration ofeverything.
So, um, also because we areinviting so many people.
from different walks of our lifeto especially I said, because
again, we weren't sure if myfamily was going to come.
So I had invited people frommultiple walks of my life and
they were all coming to enjoy,you know, one of the most
(35:24):
wonderful days of my life.
And with me coming from thisreligious back, I mean, we both
came from the religiousbackground.
I didn't want a lot of, um,religious backgrounds.
A religion, um, rooted in it,unless it was personal to me,
because that was reallyimportant to me because I didn't
want it to feel, you know, likeI was calling back to that, um,
(35:47):
to that trauma that I didn'tidentify with anymore.
There's nothing wrong with it.
If that's what you identify withit for me personally, I just
didn't need that in my.
day.
And so that's why we chose thethings that we did.
And we really sat down and wereally, you know, thought about
it.
And it was really to make surethat it was really personal to
us.
And listen to your podcast wasreally something that I did
(36:10):
actually, he listened to thispodcast.
To really like, you know, takethe, to take everything that
people were, you know, sayingand to make sure that this is
really personal and as a memberof the queer community, you
know, we are, we have theprivilege of kind of carving out
our own lane and doing it ourway because, you know, it's our
(36:31):
love and, you know, we don'thave to do it this traditional
way.
Yeah.
I mean, I know it started, itstarted with.
Like, I wanted there to be greatfood.
I wanted it to be thisexperience that, again, it was
kind of over a weekend.
So there was a multiple day,people would arrive the day
before, stay in the cabins,enjoy good food, hang out, and
(36:51):
just kind of have that moreleisurely.
experience to it where peoplecould come and go have a little
bit of freedom and just kind ofthe whole weekend was meant to
be the wedding, not just theceremony.
We wanted to have really goodfood.
We were lucky to have an amazingrestaurant that was right there
on site that was catering, whichwas great.
And It ended up being so mucheasier than I even imagined.
(37:15):
Actually, we were very lucky.
They did so much of it for us,um, that, like, it was, it was
very easy.
Um, and, um, you know, we got toreally select some amazing food.
And, um, I, I, I think it wasgreat.
I was very, very happy withthat.
The decor was really easy.
And, and we talked about, like,oh, well, maybe we'll want to
(37:37):
add on this or that.
But what the venue is able toprovide us was so perfect that
it just didn't need anythingextra.
Um, and it was like, well, maybewe should do flowers.
Uh, we didn't end up doing anyextra flowers, although we did
buy those, those, those trees.
They were also okay with usbringing in our own things.
So we had our own, um,centerpiece.
We had our own centerpieces,which, um.
(37:59):
His mom and family put together,which was amazing, which added
like a per, uh, personal touch,which I really, really
appreciate.
Yeah, that was really nice tohave that.
Yeah, my family was reallyhelpful in putting together all
of those other elements too,like, uh, so, I don't know.
It would not have been the samewithout, without all of their
help.
No, absolutely.
I mean, they put together likethe The gift box for the cards
(38:22):
and they put together the guestbook and they put together all
the centerpieces andarrangements and, um, yeah,
everybody was just justincredibly.
Incredibly helpful, but we werereally lucky.
I think in and maybe again, itall comes down to that, that
destiny of choosing the rightlocation.
And maybe that's why it was allin the dream and everything,
(38:43):
because everything was socontained, um, everybody got to
show up at this 1 location.
They got to stay and like, sleepthe nights there, right?
I'm on site.
The ceremony was right there onsite at the lake.
Um, and, uh, we were able tobring in.
And we did, we wrote our ownceremony.
Um, Travis wrote most of it andthen I came in and did the first
(39:07):
edit.
Uh, and then my mom and dad camein and tweaked a couple of
things here and there when wewere at their, at their place
one time and, um, yeah, that's,that's where a couple of pieces
of the Catholic ceremony, Ican't remember what it was, it's
like, I take the something kindof with this ring.
(39:28):
With this ring, blah, blah,blah.
And so that language got addedin, which is perfectly fine.
Yeah.
He's like, it's not, it's not,it's like, I can't remember his
words.
It was like, it's not a weddingor it's a, it doesn't make
sense.
You have to have it.
Uh, it was great.
Yeah.
And we, we had incorporated justkind of different stuff from
(39:48):
different cultures that we hadfound into the ceremony that
struck a chord with us.
We did a hand tithing, get it?
Struck a chord.
Anyway, no, like we have, we dida hand washing at the beginning
of the ceremony.
Um, we did a hand kind oftithing, um, for, for that kind
(40:08):
of end of the ceremony.
Um, and then we wrote a prettyextensive.
tear inducing vows.
Yes.
I cried.
I sobbed through my, I sobbedthrough my vows.
I think everybody did, but itwas a pretty, it was a pretty
teary.
According to the pictures,everyone was crying.
(40:30):
Everyone was crying.
That's for sure.
And my mother, my goodness,your, your mother performed
wonderful, like He coming homeand like it's always been a
lovely poem.
I've always thought it wasgreat, but when I tell you she
breathed life into it that Icould not even imagine and just
everybody was so moved andtouched by it.
(40:51):
It really was a lovely momentand to have your niece there to
be a part of it and to give youyour rope for the hand tithing.
My dad gave me my rope for thehand tithing.
It was just, it was all veryperfect.
It was perfect.
It was lovely.
Um, But yeah, that was kind ofour ceremony, our planning
process.
I mean, man, boy, I wish that Ihad more, um, complications with
(41:16):
it, but ours was so delightfullysimple.
We really relied on otherpeople, and I think that that's,
you know, important.
But we didn't have a weddingplanner or anything.
We just had the one that camewith the venue and we had you.
Oh, gosh.
Yeah, let's let's take a minutebecause honestly, I know you did
not invite us here to, uh, getyour horn or anything like that.
(41:41):
fully.
But man, were you such animportant part of it?
Pictures having wonderfulphotography on our wedding was
one of the most important pinkpoints for us.
It was something.
Look, we're doing this.
It is for us.
It is for them.
It is for everyone.
It is going to be a moment thatwe want to remember, and we want
to be able to take away somebeautiful images.
We want images that we're ableto share with friends and
(42:02):
family, even the ones that maybearen't able to attend and and to
have that.
And so it was so, so importantto us.
I can't tell you.
We looked through, I don't knowhow many instagrams of different
wedding photographers and, um,it, it, we did talk about it a
lot and it ended up being reallyimportant to us to have somebody
(42:23):
that understands our experienceand our story and, you know, is
able to relate to that.
And, and, and we didn't likeTravis was saying, we didn't
know whether or not His familywould choose to come.
Um, and while his niece was ableto attend, the rest of his
family chose that to come.
Right.
Um, but had they chosen to come,what a difficult, what a
(42:47):
difficult social situation to,to have to negotiate, um, and it
would have been a situation thatI know if it would have happened
that you would have been able tonavigate with grace and, you
know, professionalism that I'mnot sure if, I mean, I'm sure
there would be some otherpeople, but like you, you were,
Um, you are, uh, especiallyqualified to handle.
(43:10):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
There's, there's no doubt in mymind, um, that it would have
been okay.
Yeah.
It would have been a challenge,my goodness, but it would have
been okay.
Yeah.
And even my family, my gosh,them alone, I mean, they're
opening, loving, and accepting,but I, I distinctly remember
you, um, accepting someconfessions from, from some of
(43:32):
my family at length.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
Probably deeply wine induced,um, maybe even jobs of tequila
induced, um, and, and handlingthat with such incredible grace.
And some of the lovely, likelittle captures, the aside
captures, because we hadspecifically asked, we want.
Candid moments, right?
These, those things that mightbe the embarrassing moments.
(43:54):
Uh, the shot that you got withthe salt on my sister's wrist,
um, as they were on piercing wasso lovely and it ended up being
so much more than that.
You know, not just anembarrassing photo to pull out
at Christmas.
It wasn't that at all.
It, it was this moment of.
Um, my, my sisters and my niecesand, and Travis's niece all
(44:16):
bonding and, and Travis's niecereally finding that love and
connection with another familyand realizing that she had this
extended family.
Now it was this whole moment,uh, of, of realization for her
that this, this wedding was somuch.
More that it was now she hasthis extended family that loves
her and and has thisunconditional love for her
(44:38):
because she's now family too.
Uh, so it ended up being reallyimportant in all those moments.
We, we treasure them.
Yes, absolutely.
Wow.
Wow.
Thank you guys so much.
Oh my gosh.
I feel like I need to pay younow.
No, no, no.
This is a non sponsored, uh, nosponsorship.
This is not a paid partnership.
(44:59):
No, wow.
That, that's really means.
And it was such an honor to bethere.
Um, yeah, it was seriously sucha perfect day.
You guys did amazing.
And, I do have, just two quickfollow up questions.
So, James, maybe you can touchon, I'm curious.
So for those listening who arenot familiar with Minnesota, as
(45:21):
we mentioned, they got marriedon the North Shore, um, which is
about, yeah, two and a half,three hours away from
Minneapolis, like city life, allof that.
And so I have found that it iskind of like, okay, once you
start to get further and furtheraway, it can be a little bit
questionable with vendors.
And so, um.
I would love for you to chatkind of about even reaching out
(45:43):
to the venue, like if they hadrepresentation or like what that
was like.
And then, Travis, I would loveif you could talk about, it's
something that again, you'realways more than welcome to say
no.
Um, but I know that my familywill not be at my wedding
either.
And it's something that.
(46:05):
I don't know.
I still find hard and I knowthat a lot of listeners also
have family like that.
And so, um, just wonderinganything you're willing to share
to kind of talk about that andhow you kind of dealt with that
too.
I'll start with the easy onewhile you ruminate on that for a
moment.
Yeah.
So yeah, I we definitely didmost of everything through the
(46:28):
venue.
The venue provided our food, thevenue provided everything.
So in that sense, um, vendorswas pretty easy they did have
their preferred list of vendorsfor stuff that we could, um, you
know, reach out to as well.
But I mean, it was more limited,right?
Uh, it was more limited in termsof vendors up there.
And we did have to, you know, ifwe were going to go beyond
(46:51):
anything that we did reallythink about.
All of that.
Um, and it was either going tobe, you know, particularly when
we were looking at consideringdoing flowers and stuff, we had
looked at florists in the areaand it was like, well, we kind
of like this one kind of likethis one.
But then we go on instagram andfind something that we liked
way, way more, but they don'treally service that area.
(47:14):
Or if they do, there's a big upcharge to it.
Um, so for us, I mean, thelocation was so key and so
important and so vital that wedidn't even consider moving it
to accommodate that.
It was, it was just the rightdistance from everybody, right?
So what I heard you ask.
(47:35):
So something that I noticedabout that particular vendor.
So when calling back to when hewas in his office and his Um,
and his resident came in andthey started looking at vendors.
The first thing that I did whenhe sent me those vendors is I
immediately went into reviewsand I did search for queer
people who were like, Oh, I hadmy wedding here or I went on to
(47:59):
their Instagram to see if therewere any pictures of queer or.
Um, gay weddings, because thatwas the first thing as someone
who grew up north that I washyper conscious of because I
wanted to make sure that that issomething that would be okay.
And I called Lars, or I calledthe venue and I was, and I was
like, Hey, I'm thinking abouthaving my wedding here.
(48:21):
My My fiance or my husband and Ithink I said my husband and I
are thinking about having ourwedding here to see what the
reaction was.
I'm like, is that something thatyou would be open to?
And she's like, Oh, absolutely.
We blah, blah, blah.
I, you know, we had a weddinghere for a same sex couple here
last year and it was absolutelywonderful.
And that is something that.
(48:42):
Encouraged me to move forwardbecause whenever there was, you
know, whenever that was sent tome and it was anything past, you
know, Kern Rapids, Minnesota,which is, you know, 20 minutes
north of Minneapolis.
I'm like, I need to call to makesure that this is a safe space
because that was something thatI needed to make sure was that
it was going to be a safe spacefor my family and my friends to
(49:04):
celebrate the important day.
That is so interesting.
Travis.
Nailed it.
Um, and it's funny because myexperience and Travis's
experience.
So different, right?
Like I hear when you ask thatquestion the way that I heard it
and Travis immediately hears itthat other way, right?
And I think you both have ashared experience here.
Are you from northern Minnesotaor central Minnesota now?
(49:26):
No, I'm from Twin Cities.
Yeah.
Okay.
In any case, Travis, you know,hears that, um, and he did do
that.
He went, he checked theInstagrams, he checked for
reviews, um, and, and called tomake sure it would be a safe
space.
It's not even something andmaybe I'm naive.
It's not even something thatcrossed my mind.
Um, and you know, he did for himand he made sure, made sure that
(49:49):
was the case.
I mean, that's great.
I like I wish like that's thegoal is for us all to hopefully
be at that mental space safelyone day.
So, um, but yeah, I just knowthat the North Shore seems so
hit or miss still like it's itjust feels crazy.
Sometimes when I travel up thereor networking with people up
(50:11):
there, it just feels like youreally never know what you're
going to get.
Like some people are Yeah.
You know, great and awesome andamazing.
And some people are like veryoutspoken and you're like, that
should have been an insidethought.
So, um, yeah, no, but thank youfor, for sharing both sides.
I think it's funny too, becauselike, as you are, you know,
(50:31):
maybe like a career businessowner, it's like, I can see to
where it's just like, you, youalmost have to lead with that
because you want to, you need tosee how they're going to react,
but it's, it's.
It's an interesting experienceas someone who has, you know,
has been, as someone who is aminority, um, both ethnically
(50:52):
and, um, and a gay man, it'ssomething that I am hyper aware
of.
Even it's funny because evenmoving to Chicago in the past
year, it's like, Oh, moving to anew region, working with new
coworkers, is this going to beokay?
And as someone who is in my latethirties, that.
You know, it was always in theback of my mind, and I, you
know, I hope for the day that itdoesn't have to be, um, and
(51:16):
we'll see where we, you know,move forward in the next couple
of years, but, um, it, it is,it's something, and again, like,
James and I are very opposite,but I think that's also why we
are able to complement eachother, and it's truly wonderful,
so.
Yep thank you for that.
Dive in on family.
Yes.
(51:36):
So I think that the main thingin order for me to leading up to
the wedding, um, there were, um,Leading up to the wedding, I
needed to be forgiving both tomy family, to myself and just
(51:58):
the whole situation as whole torealize that it's, that this is
going to be the way that it is.
James and I were luckily able tohave a conversation with my
mother, um, and then I was ableto have a conversation with my
sister separately to where I letthem know about the wedding.
(52:20):
Um, I let them know that theywere absolutely invited, but I
also understood if they were notable to come, they politely
declined, and then we movedforward.
Um, I, it was hard.
There was one moment on thewedding day that I was thinking
(52:41):
about them, and you know, it wassad that they couldn't be there
and celebrate with me.
But then I also.
Had to come to the place of, ifthis wasn't going to be as
joyous for them as it was forme, then I truly didn't need
(53:01):
them there.
Everyone who was there who feltthe joy that I did was there and
that's enough for me.
Um, and that's, it was truly theperfect day and I still love
them.
They're my family, but I reallyhad to like, Let that go and
forgive them for that, andthey're, you know, and we were
(53:22):
up there for Thanksgiving thispast year, and there was no Like
animosity towards them, like itwas all, nothing has changed.
And that was something that Ireally drove home with them is
that nothing on James or I'spart is going to change.
We're just going to be marriedand nothing for them appeared to
(53:43):
really have changed either.
The one funny thing I will sayis that they wouldn't like
acknowledge our wedding rings.
But they kept trying to liketake sneaky peeks at them, but
then they like, wouldn't likeask to see them.
Even my mom was like, Oh, can Isee your watch?
Which is on my left hand.
Like, your watch is so nice.
(54:04):
Can I see it?
You've seen my watch.
You don't need to see my watch.
I'm like, yeah, very, very nice.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We know what we're talkingabout, but it's something that
like I'm, I had to truly.
like sit with myself and, youknow, not necessarily meditate
(54:26):
on, but just be okay with.
And I know that's easier saidthan done because it is, it is
hard.
Um, but just kind of come at itwith a forgiving energy and
really just realize that.
They are still your family, youstill have love for them, but
(54:48):
the person that will be standingnext to you is now your family,
and that's going to be the mostperson, the most important
person in your life now, andthat is how you're going to move
forward into the next chapter.
I think just on, on my end, whenI met Travis's family, even for
the first time, I knew that thiswas going to be a challenge.
(55:09):
Uh, you know, even before awedding was, was in the picture,
I knew that it was going to be achallenge.
And so I, I know that there areother people out there who might
be dealing with similardynamics.
And all I can say is beforgiving, approach this from a
place of love always.
(55:30):
And only with love.
It, it, it serves no one to goin and expect them to change
overnight or to, you know,challenge their belief systems
or force, force anything onthem.
It doesn't help, right?
Just be a good person.
Approach them with love.
Um, be in their space if they'llallow you to be.
(55:51):
Uh, I know that sometimes youdon't even get that far, but
even in, even in conversationsthere, hopefully can sense the
love that you have.
for their family.
Um, and always keep bringingthat love, bringing that love,
bringing that love because lovealways wins.
It will win out eventually.
Um, it might not be everythingthat you want overnight.
(56:13):
You might not have your familycoming to your wedding tomorrow
as a result.
But maybe, just maybe, they'll,they'll invite you up for the
weekend, or they'll invite youto Thanksgiving, or they'll
welcome you into their home, orthat very first time that they
say, I love you, or that veryfirst time that they give you a
hug and say, I'm going to missyou when you leave.
Those things are priceless, andthey say everything that needs
(56:35):
to be said.
So even if you don't get tochange their opinions overnight,
even if they're not going to bethere for that moment, because
just mentally, they just can'tget there yet, they, the love
will always win.
So as long as you're bringingthat to the table, um, I think
you're doing the right thing andyou're doing everything that you
can and it, it was sad for me tohis family couldn't be there.
(56:57):
I, I, I, it, it didn't hurt mebecause I knew where they were
coming from and I've alwaysaccepted where they were coming
from.
But it was sad.
There was a moment.
Um, you know, there was a momentfor me that day.
I remember of when I saw Emmathere alone when I saw his niece
(57:17):
there alone.
And, and, you know, she was hisonly kind of family
representation other than hischosen family other than friends
and other people who were there,but it, it, it hurt that moment.
It did.
Um, I think that that'sunavoidable, but you gotta, you
gotta acknowledge it and just goback to love.
(57:38):
Go back to love, go back to themoment, go back to the person
who's now going to be the mostimportant or is and remains and
will continue to be the mostimportant person in your life
and, and go back to feeling thejoy of that moment and
celebrating with the people whoare there to celebrate.
Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you for sharing that.
And I know you kind of both didtouch on it, but also,
(57:58):
obviously, just with the caveatof like, all of that within the
means of your own, like,personal safety and health and
mental well being and all ofthat too.
Um, yeah, super appreciate you.
Both sharing your perspectives.
Okay, kind of just wrap thingsup, um, as a fun little bonus
(58:21):
question.
Let's end with talking aboutlike, what are some of each of
your favorite things about eachother, your relationship?
Either both.
That's too long of a pause.
do you want me to start?
One of, one of the favoritethings about our relationship is
(58:42):
that we are so opposite becauseyou, you see those couples that
are so opposite and it's not agood thing.
And that's, that's not how weare.
We are, we learn from each otherand we really compliment each
other.
And I really value that in ourrelationship because we, we can
see things from, I mean, we hadan example earlier and we can
(59:05):
really learn from each other.
And I really value that.
And he always makes me smile andhe's so fucking funny and sexy
and I absolutely love it.
Uh, I, I, what's not to loveabout Travis?
He's such a warm, kind soul, um,and you know, I, we obviously
(59:26):
didn't touch on all of the lifeat Year, I'm sure, just a little
bit of, of, of um, Talking thatwe did today, you get a little
bit of his life experience andand everything that he's gone
through in his life and how thathas shaped him to be just this
incredible man.
It's incredibly intelligentperson.
It's incredibly emotionally andspiritually intelligent person
(59:49):
as well.
It's just incredible.
Uh, and I, I will alwaysappreciate how supportive he is.
Um, I think that we both pusheach other to do more, to be
better, to, to learn, to grow,to experience new things.
That's why we keep on moving.
Um, but we, we push each otherin the best way possible.
(01:00:12):
We are always there to supporteach other no matter what.
At the end of the day, I alwayshave his back, he's always got
mine and, um, it allows us to,you know, achieve whatever we
want in life and in ourrelationship and, um, trust.
I mean, I can't, the way that weare able to trust each other, I
(01:00:37):
don't know, I don't know.
It's just, it's, it's, um,something that you can't
replicate.
So I don't, I don't know, I lovethose things.
Wonderful things.
Wow, that is so incrediblysweet.
Yeah, you guys.
You, you two are just the bestand have the best vibes.
And I just, I wish nothing buthappiness for, for all your
(01:01:01):
years to come.
So all the good vibes in the25s.
Yes.
Oh my gosh.
Wow.
And I know that people listeningare going to get so much out of
this, but hopefully like thisepisode for as long, the
internet will allow it to be.
(01:01:22):
Alive and live, you guys canrevisit it any other time that a
thunderstorm approaches and ofhow great your love is.
So not very many thunderstormsthese days, maybe a little,
maybe a little static, butthat's it.
Yeah.
We've already worked through thebad weather.
(01:01:44):
Oh my gosh.
Awesome.
Well, thank you guys so, somuch.
This was wow.
So amazing.
Any last things you want to saybefore we end this episode?
I don't think so.
I don't know, but thankseverybody for listening to our
story.
I hope you found some of itmeaningful, impactful,
(01:02:05):
entertaining, entertaining, and,uh, yeah, all love, all love,
and, um, mwah.
Okay, Curly Beloved, welcomeback to this week's episode.
I'm super excited to have thisamazing couple with me here
today.
Um, I photographed their weddingback in August and it was
probably one of the mostbeautiful days I've ever seen
and they are just chef's kissthe absolute best.
So without further ado, wouldyou two introduce yourselves,
(00:23):
your pronouns, and anyidentities you want to share?
Sure.
Hi, my name is Travis.
My pronouns are he, him.
Um, I was born in Brazil.
I was adopted as an infant, andI grew up in rural northern
Minnesota, and I'm married toJames.
And I am James.
Uh, my pronouns are he, him aswell.
Uh, also from Minnesota.
(00:44):
Um, although we've moved a lot,uh, also from Minnesota, um,
kind of born and raised in, inthe southern suburbs, uh, of the
state and, um, yeah, I guess, Iguess that that's me.
Yeah, awesome.
Well, I mean, spoiler alert.
(01:04):
You guys are married before wejump into that.
Um, I was curious if, if both ofyou could kind of share as much
or as little as you want, justkind of about your each
respective coming out journeys.
Yeah, sure.
So my coming out journey wasdeeply intertwined with my
(01:27):
identity as a former Baptist.
Growing up, I wrestled, um,wrestled with the message I was
receiving about who I should beversus who I truly was.
Moving to Minneapolis and goingto a private Christian college
really was a dark time for mebecause I wanted to serve the
God that I believe was full oflove.
(01:48):
But I knew I needed to be trueto myself.
And I was being taught, and myfaith didn't align at that time.
I ended up coming out to mymother three times.
Once in high school, when shefound my copy of Queer As Folk
under my bed.
She watched two episodes, and Iwas absolutely mortified.
Once in college when I wasattending, um, an ex gay
(02:10):
conversion group, and then thethird time, um, to both my
parents when I had been asked toleave that private Christian
college, and I, um, had gottenmy first, um, apartment to loan.
Um, it was met with a littleshock, which I always found
interesting, because my motherhad already known, um, but we
moved, um, past that and thenstarted to heal from there.
(02:31):
And now we are kind of in aplace where they love James as
my partner.
Um, they still struggle with it.
On a face, um, side of it, butwe are all family.
So it's beautiful.
Yeah.
I'm really grateful to have, Ithink, as good of a relationship
as I could possibly ever hopefor with his parents and with
(02:53):
his family.
Um, obviously I know where theystand religiously.
And with their belief system,and it's really difficult for
them to acknowledge even ourrelationship and conversation
or, uh, you know, definitely ourmarriage in particular, um, is a
tricky one because, you know,the way that they view marriage
is very much as a sacrament tiedto the religion.
(03:13):
Um, so it is, you know.
A little bit more even of apinpoint even beyond us just
being in a relationship.
Although I think that whetherthey acknowledge it outright or
not, they're both there.
Everyone is aware like everyoneat this point.
They know that we're married.
They know that we're in arelationship and they love me
and welcome me into their homeinto Thanksgiving gatherings and
(03:35):
those other thing kind ofmoments as well.
Um, but I don't think that, youknow, I don't know that they're
going to get to a place, atleast not anytime soon.
I don't want to, I don't want toput it on them and say never,
um, but I think it would be verychallenging for them to get to a
place where they acknowledge ourmarriage.
Um, but acknowledging thatTravis loves me, that I love
(03:56):
him, um, that I make him happyand that I'm a good person.
I think that, you know, thatthat was something that I don't
think that.
Maybe we expected, um, but maybenot.
Maybe it's something that theydidn't expect was to be able to
see me as a good person.
Um, but they do.
Uh, and, and so I think thatthat getting to that place alone
(04:16):
is, is reward enough.
And as, as much as I could everask for, I'm very, very grateful
for that.
Um, as far as me, um, my comingout story, I think is not as
intense.
I guess I w I would say it'snot, I, I definitely was raised
in a conservative community.
It was a conservative, you know.
(04:39):
Christian suburb.
Uh, and so and I was raised, youknow, in a catholic church, went
to catholic school.
My family was catholic.
Um, so there were thosechallenges, of course, that come
along with all of those things.
Um, and really coming to thatrecognition of, of loving that
part of me did take some time, Ithink, particularly with my mom
(04:59):
and dad.
They've always Honestly, comefrom a place of love.
Uh, even when I was little, youknow, they recognized that my
interests were different.
They, they, they, they supportedme when I wanted to be a theater
kid and a choir kid and aperforming artist.
They, they bought me a Barbiedoll, right?
(05:19):
Stereotype, but it's there itis.
If I wanted a Barbie, they gotme a Barbie.
Um, so they, they did support methrough that.
The whole coming out process,you know, I, I had my, my
boyfriends were secretboyfriends for quite a long time
where that wasn't something thatI could share with them or felt
like I could share with themand, and in that kind of
realizing process of, oh, I amgay, um, kind of over my high
(05:43):
school years, that was astruggle for them.
That was definitely a challenge.
They just, they didn't want thatfor me is kind of where the
place that they were comingfrom.
They felt it was going to makemy life harder and that it was
going to put me, you know, addchallenges to my life and add
risk to my life.
And you know what, some of thatis true, but, um, I think all
for the better.
Right.
And I think that, um, as queerpeople, we can all acknowledge
(06:04):
that, you know, even thoughthere are all those challenges
that come with being.
Different than everybody else.
Um, they really do turn intostrengths.
And I, I think that they gave meenough space to allow that to be
true and not for it to be aburden.
And they've really come around.
Um, we are now at a completelyopposite end of the spectrum of
(06:25):
any type of challenge.
We are loving, welcoming family.
Um, and, and they, they, theycouldn't be more wonderful.
Absolutely.
My mom and dad and my, my, mybrothers and sisters, all of my
family are just, um, loving,welcoming, accepting.
Wonderful people.
And it's really wonderful.
Yeah, I like to think I had alittle part of that.
(06:47):
Just, you know, by having thatbe the, you know, the thing that
popped up, it helped, helpedeveryone to ask some questions
about what is important.
And I think that, you know, loveand family came down to being
the most important.
And so that hopefully changedsome minds, opinions and got us
to where we are now.
(07:07):
Yeah, yeah, it's reallybeautiful.
And yes, I, I loved talking toyour parents at the wedding too.
They were so, they were so fun.
And your mom was out therebusting a move at some point in
the wedding.
They absolutely will do that.
They will swing dance anyopportunity that they are given
to show off those skills.
At some point in time they tooklessons together.
(07:28):
Um, and they do, they do love tobust a move on the dance floor
if given the opportunity.
And the photos that you capturedat that moment were so few.
Oh my gosh, we just, we treasurethem.
We actually got a photo album.
Um, not to teach your horn toomuch, but we definitely will
because it was a big importantpart of our wedding.
Um, and one of the bigpriorities for us was
photography.
(07:49):
So we got a photo album.
Of a bunch of their favoritepictures, um, that they printed
off for us.
And so, um, we got that for asone of our Christmas gifts this
year.
It was really lovely.
So it sits on our console tablenow, like right by our sofa as
people come in, uh, to ourapartment.
Yeah.
And now that we've recentlymoved into kind of our, you
(08:11):
know, our more permanent homehere in Chicago, we are fingers
crossed.
We're gonna order some more too,because we want to get some on
our walls and in the office.
So we're excited to get that aswell.
We want to get some more prints.
So we're very excited.
We're very, very happy.
Yeah.
Oh my gosh, yay.
I love to hear that.
Well, if you ever want to, like,show me them hanging up, like, I
(08:32):
don't know, I think it's just sointeresting and fun to see which
ones, like, you guys love andwhere you put them and
everything.
So, yeah, I'd love to hear that.
Before we like jump fully intoyour relationship, which I'm
super excited about, thank youso much for sharing about your,
your coming out.
(08:52):
It sounds like there was, youknow, good parts and bad parts
in both and, and ultimatelyyou're, you're better for it.
But, I'm curious, it sounds likeThere's a little bit of a common
theme of kind of having thatrough spot and then, um,
obviously, I know maybe yourparents are in different places
now, but I'm curious just likehow much you had to kind of
(09:17):
wrestle with that to get to thepoint you're at now.
And is it ever still hard?
I can jump in on this one.
Um, I, I mean, I was prettycomfortable with myself pretty
early on.
Um, I mean, I, I founded likethe Gay Straight Alliance at my
high school.
I think that was my likesophomore or junior year.
(09:38):
Um, and so I was pretty aware,right?
Um, I wasn't necessarily sharingeverything with my family, but I
was pretty aware and prettycomfortable early on.
So that, that little bit oflike, yeah.
My family, you know, getting,getting comfortable with the
idea, you know, there were,there were definitely ups and
downs with that, um, but I'vebeen pretty comfortable from,
(10:01):
from the beginning, like, Iwould say for me, anyway.
Yeah.
For me, I think it was a littlebit harder.
I think that the notion of, youknow, in the queer community, we
use the term chosen family alot.
And I think that with me beingadopted, the notion of chosen
family was something I was veryaware of from a young age.
(10:23):
So that was something that Iremember being in high school.
And once I got my driver'slicense, and I lived about four
and a half hours away from likea bigger metropolitan area, and
then coming down with my friendsfrom high school, who at the
time, who my best friend was alesbian, and we would come and
we met, you know, some of ourclosest queer friends, and that
was kind of our chosen family atthe time, and then kind of being
(10:46):
introduced to the To the biggerqueer community in Minneapolis.
And then kind of, you know, Iwas came down and I remember
being like, yeah, I'm abisexual.
And like, I remember Raven beinglike, no honey, you're a gay
boy, but whatever you need to,whatever, whatever you are, you
can do, but we'll see how thatturns out in the next decade or
(11:08):
so.
And she was right.
And I love her for that.
She's still one of my, I callher my sister.
She's one of my closest anddearest friends.
Um, But it, yeah, it was a lot,it was met with a lot of
personal struggle, a lot ofdepression, a lot of, you know,
um, those issues, especiallyduring college.
And, you know, I went throughgay conversion therapy, which,
(11:30):
you know, was kind of one of themore darker times in my life.
But I'm grateful for all of thatbecause, you know, it made me
stronger.
It truly showed me who I was andshowed my character.
And I do not regret any of that.
Anything that I went through, Ido not wish that upon anyone
else.
And I wish that any, anyone outthere will be able to realize
(11:53):
that you don't need that.
Just listen to who you are fromyour inner self and trust your
inner self because that is yourtruth.
Um, but if you have to go onthat journey, then go on that
journey.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, let's hope that soon.
Conversion therapy will betotally banned across the board
(12:16):
everywhere.
Yeah, I can't imagine, but thankyou again both for sharing that.
Um, and I'm so glad that youguys found, found yourselves and
found each other.
And speaking of finding eachother, let's talk about how you
guys met.
Because I think it's such a funstory.
(12:37):
Yeah, I'll start on this one.
I, uh, we'd kind of, um, been inthe same circles.
It seemed like for quite a longtime.
Um, we'd attended a lot of thesame events.
We just kind of crossed pathsand were passively aware of each
other.
Um, and, you know, had it.
Interacted at various points.
(12:58):
Um, in time, I remember one timewe were like at the same event.
We had like rented like thesebooths right next to each other.
Um, and we didn't even talk orinteract.
I don't think that night, but Iremember us being like, right,
right next to each other.
Um, and there were also thosemoments during that time where I
was with my.
My ex husband, you were withsomebody at the time.
(13:20):
And so we were never necessarilyboth mutually available.
Um, and so it was just kind of aships passing in the night kind
of thing.
Uh, and then there was oneinstance, um, back in the day,
back in the day, uh, back in theday.
What an expression.
But back in the day, that's whenyou know you've reached a
(13:41):
certain age.
When back in the day makessense.
Um, but back in the day, I was adrag performer at this one club
in Minneapolis.
And, uh, I, it was a Halloweenshow and Trav, I, I was
performing this mix that juststruck Travis, I guess.
Yeah.
How much did you tip me?
I don't know.
Was it 100?
(14:02):
I think he took me a 100 bill ifI'm, if I remember right.
And so he really loved it.
I went down to the dressing roomand I was like, drinks on me
everybody.
Um, but it's funny cause wedidn't even realize when we had
started dating that I was thatperson.
He was that person.
Um, I, I think it was weird justtelling a story one time of
like, Oh yeah, this, I can'tremember if it was me telling it
(14:22):
or Oh yeah, one time I think itwas the song.
Yeah.
The song came on and I was like,Oh yeah, I performed to this
song one time.
And he was like, I tippedsomebody 100 for performing this
song one time, and we realizedthat that was each other.
So, um, truly ships passing inthe night.
We, we had so many of those oddCoincidences where it's like,
(14:45):
Oh, we, maybe we're supposed tomeet at this time.
Maybe we're supposed to meet atthis time.
But of course, that's not theway the universe works.
Right?
You're supposed to things happenthe way that they're supposed
to.
And, and we met exactly when wewere supposed to.
Uh, so one, one fateful night.
And this was, you know,basically right after I had
gotten out of my previousmarriage and that kind of had
(15:06):
ended a little bit prior, Travishad just gotten out of a
relationship as well.
And.
We had both separately again,taken separate vows to be like,
you know what, no, I'm going tobe single for a while.
I've already gone through likethe relationship thing.
Look, we've tried it, honey.
(15:26):
We need to do something else.
We need to get out there andsample the wares.
You know what I mean?
Whatever that means, it's timeto be the next couple of months.
You're the town bicycle.
Everybody gets a ride and you'regoing to find your favorite
partner.
So that was the that was thephilosophy that we're both kind
of going into.
And it's funny because it'spartly Because of that
(15:46):
philosophy that we found eachother that night, because of
course, we're on a particularapp.
Um, and, uh, that shall not benamed because frankly, it's a
toxic environment.
Um, you know, you got to do whatyou got to do out there.
If you're young and having fun,go for it.
But boy, be safe, be safe.
(16:08):
Anyways.
So, uh, we're on a particularapp and it happened and it was
Travis.
And so we, um, we started to, tochat there and I was like, you
know what?
Um, come on over, like, comeover, let's hang out.
Right.
Oh, with the worst bicycle withthe worst of intentions with the
(16:31):
with the naughtiest ofintentions.
I was like, Hey, come over.
Um, and he was like, Oh yeah.
Do you, you know, you haveanything to drink?
And I was like, you know, Idon't.
Um, but the liquor stores areabout to close if you wanted to
stop and grab something.
And he was like, well, what'syour favorite?
And I told him and I was like,but don't try and get that.
It's all the way on the otherside of town.
(16:52):
There's just this one liquorstore in the whole city that
sells it.
That's silly.
Just grab whatever and comeover.
Well, I don't know how fast hedrove, but he managed to make it
to that liquor store in time,uh, make it to that liquor store
in time and grab my favorite.
And so then he shows up at mydoor holding this bottle and
maybe it was the bottle or maybeit was his eyes, but it was love
(17:14):
at first sight.
And I, I saw him and Iimmediately was like, Oh, my
first thought was both thiscombination of joy and
excitement, but also this, Oh,no, because it was like, Oh, no,
I'm in love.
I'm not supposed to be in lovewhen it was truly the same on me
(17:36):
too, because like walking up tothe door, I remember.
feeling like this energy oflike, something is bringing me
forward.
Right.
And like, it was truly like whenhe opened the door, it was like
everything else justdisappeared.
And again, it was this, Oh no,what did I just do?
This isn't the plan.
This was not the plan.
(17:57):
And we never looked back and I'mso grateful.
Yeah, we, we ended up.
You know, we got around to thetour to France eventually, but
for a while that we, we actuallysat down, we talked for hours,
hours, hours.
And I think it was about hourtwo or three that I told him I
(18:17):
loved him.
This is some lesbian energyright here.
It is.
It should have been a red flag.
It should have been.
Okay.
He's crazy.
I need to leave.
But since he was feeling thesame thing and we have that kind
of shared energy anyway, um, uh,Yeah, it just was.
(18:41):
It just was love at first sight.
I literally didn't.
It wasn't just I love you.
It was I love you and I thinkwe're going to spend the rest of
our lives together.
Yeah.
So get into that drama andplease keep in mind too.
I didn't live in Minneapolis atthe time.
I was living in northernMinnesota 4.
5 hours away.
Yeah.
And so we maybe we can get intothe logistics of that because
(19:03):
even that Well, it was the nextday, though.
You took me down.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So we drove 45 minutes south andwe went to see his sister.
Well, his chosen sister.
So Travis definitely in theprocess, like he was saying
earlier, developed that chosenfamily.
Um, and so we went to see hischosen family sister, uh, and
(19:23):
that she was having a bonfireand he like introduced me and
like this whole thing, um, allwithin 48 hours.
So it was.
Mhm.
24 hours.
Yeah, it was pretty, pretty fastand crazy.
But then Travis had to go back,right?
Travis had his job and his homeso far away.
(19:44):
Um, but he made constant, like,I don't know how you did this
because I didn't have a car atthe time.
So he would drive once or twicea week down to see me in
Minneapolis, which is just.
Ludicrous, crazy.
I mean, I remember I would callhim on the road and, and just
(20:05):
talk to him because I was like,you're going to fall asleep,
you're on the road so much.
And he would, he would leaveright after he got off work and
then he would leave in justenough time to get back for his
next shift.
Um, but I mean, it was love.
And so eventually, you know, inthe next little bit, we were
able to get an apartmenttogether and he moved down to
(20:26):
the cities and yeah.
And then COVID hit, and thenCOVID hit.
This is a serious, like, lesbiantimeline, like, incredible.
Wow, wow.
Well, we were pretty depressedat that point, because it's
like, COVID hit, and we wereliterally, like, I feel like we
(20:46):
had a, a 20 year relationshipcompacted down into that year,
two years, where we were justwith each other.
100 percent of the time.
We did.
We did the math the other day.
How many in how many years we'vebeen together?
5.
5 5.
5 years.
In those 5.
5 years we have spent less than20 days apart.
(21:08):
Wow.
So like total and I'm nottalking like a stretch.
I'm saying 20 total days in thelast 5.
5 years are a day that we didn'tsee each other.
Oh my gosh.
So yeah, we just never Neverparted.
Oh my gosh.
I mean, I know that I've heardthis story before, but I just, I
(21:29):
could cry listening to it allover again.
Cause it's just so like, Iremember you guys kind of
talking about like, like fateand all of that stuff too.
And when we met and I, yeah,those are definitely the vibes.
Um, Travis, I am curious, whenJames said, I love you at hour
two, what was your response?
(21:50):
My response was, I was flooredbecause I was feeling the same.
And as someone who, I'm a, asfar as Zodiac, I'm a Cancer, and
so I often lead with myfeelings.
feelings.
And so I often, as I meetsomeone new, I tend to, you
know, keep those to myself.
But like because I was feelingthe same thing, it was like, Oh,
(22:13):
and because I felt that walkingup to the door to it kind of
like solidified what I wasfeeling.
And yeah, I was like, Oh, thisis fast.
But it was like Again, thiswasn't the plan, but I love him
too.
So it's all okay.
I think what he did was heslipped a think in there.
He's like, I think I love youtoo.
Did I?
(22:33):
Which is a very clever way ofplaying it cool.
Right?
Like I'm not committing, but I'malso not going to leave you
hanging here.
Wow.
Wow.
That's so beautiful.
And so at what point, you guyssaid you've been together for
five and a half years.
(22:55):
When did you guys get engaged?
How far in were we?
Let's think about this.
Okay.
Was it two, two years?
Two and a half years?
Not, it was about a year.
Let's.
Think about this might take aminute.
(23:15):
I know it was during Covid.
I know it was during Covid.
I know it was like, and that wasa blur.
So who can remember whathappened during that time?
Right.
So it was during the pandemicthat could have been, can't say
covid.
Um, we can't say covid pandemic.
So during the pandemic, uh, andit was, it was some at 20, 20
minutes felt.
20 years.
So who knows?
But sometime in there, uh,sometime in there we got engaged
(23:38):
and it was the worst when, whenwe got engaged, we had been
doing the door dash at the time.
We w we had been doing a lot ofother odd jobs together.
I had to make extra money duringthe pandemic because everything
that we were doing at the timewas so dependent upon personal
(23:58):
interaction.
I, I had been doing likeentertainment and gig economy
and that died completely.
So I went from having a decentincome to nothing.
Uh, so DoorDash was a lifesaver,but at the same time.
We had one vehicle at the time,which is, we're actually back to
one vehicle.
(24:18):
But that's just'cause we're inChicago and two vehicles is
crazy.
Um, but at the time, we, youknow, that's what we, that our
means were one vehicle and so wewould deliver DoorDash together.
Mm-hmm And so we literally wouldspend hours in the car, just me
and him and look, we love eachother and like I said, we have
(24:39):
only been apart for what, acouple.
Maybe, maybe, maybe a dozendays, right?
But boy, that was a test, right?
You really do find a way to geton each other's absolute last
nerve.
And it was, it was the firstyear, like it's the first year
of like discovering who eachother are, it's discovering how
(24:59):
each other.
Right.
It's discovering what, uh, Oh,this triggers you.
And I don't necessarilyunderstand why, but now I know.
And all of those things figuringout, um, you know, how the other
person, you might love theirenergy, right?
You might love them heart andsoul, but you don't necessarily
know how they tick, right?
You don't know all of theirhistory yet.
(25:21):
You don't know.
who the details in the minutiaof who they are as a person.
Um, and so in the process offiguring that out, you step on
each other's toes and you bumpheads and you know, there is
static, there is electricity,there is thundershock, there is
thunderstorm.
Um, and this was, uh, this was athunderstorm day.
(25:42):
It was just awful.
Like we, we had had a true F youfight, where we were just
genuinely mad at each other.
And I remember there was thismoment after where it had kind
of resolved.
We were still like, we're still,but it had like kind of settled
(26:04):
and resolved.
And I knew, and, and, and I was,I looked at him and I was like,
even though I am as mad at youas I can imagine.
I still love you, right?
I still love you so much.
I love you more than I couldpossibly love any other human
being.
And at that moment, and I knewhe felt the same way.
It was like a moment ofconnection.
(26:24):
We knew because we were holdingeach other and I think there
were tears.
Yeah, we were like holding eachother crying.
Yeah.
And it was coming down.
Like we were so upset with eachother, but we knew it was, we
knew we were going to get pastthat moment.
Yep.
And we knew that we still lovedeach other.
It's kind of where I was at thatsame.
And so I was just holding himcrying and I was like, you want
(26:45):
to marry me?
And I was like, yeah, it soundslike it wasn't planned.
We didn't have a ring oranything like that.
And it wasn't, um, you know,didn't get down on one knee.
It just, it was that moment ofknowing that like.
If we can survive today, we cansurvive anything and we truly
(27:06):
are going to be togetherforever.
Like, if today didn't break usand, and we can get to that
place and still end up at theend of the day, loving each
other, it's forever.
Yeah.
Yeah, that, that truly must belike one of the most magical
proposals ever because Yeah, youwere like, I, I've seen you at
(27:29):
your lowest and I still like,love you so much and, and want
to be with you and know that wecan do it.
That's, oh my gosh, I just gotchills.
Wow.
And it, it, and it's, it's awonderful feeling too, because
some people, you know, I, and I,I love those people who have
those like, extravagant,wonderful engagements.
That's wonderful.
But like the security that Ifelt in our, in that moment.
(27:52):
Is like, I wouldn't trade it foranything in the world.
Yeah.
Oh my gosh.
Oh my guys.
Wow.
That's so beautiful., so you gotengaged and then you started
planning just the most amazing,wonderful wedding.
So I'm curious if you could kindof share, obviously I know it
(28:14):
was.
It's such an important day, butshare kind of like a condensed
version of your wedding and thenkind of in that if you have any
like tips for maybe other queercouples who are also planning.
Well, we, um, we sure didn'tstart planning.
We sure did not do thatactually.
We waited and we postponed andwe couldn't figure out when
(28:38):
would be the right time or whenit would make sense.
And we, with our jobs.
As you know, constantly moving,hopefully now settled for a
little bit, but constantlymoving.
And so, uh, it just was never,it never felt right.
It always felt like, oh, I gotthis other things, other things,
other things are important rightnow.
But eventually it was just like,you know what now, I don't know
what it was, but somethingclicked and now is the time and
(28:59):
a little bit prior to that.
I think the dream is important.
So we, we had, uh, we woke up inthe morning one morning and we
had both had this incrediblyvivid dream and we didn't want
to share it right away becauseit was so important.
So we kind of like looked overat each other.
It was like, Hey, I had a dreamlast night.
(29:19):
And Oh, I had a dream too.
The thing with us too is that weboth know when we're not telling
each other something too.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So like we both woke up and likelooked at each other and it's
like, you're not sayingyourself, right.
Yeah.
Like, what's up?
Yeah.
Like what are you not talkingabout?
Um, yeah.
So there was a lot of thatenergy, but um, basically we,
long story short, we, we had hadthe same dream the same night.
(29:44):
Um, of our wedding or somevision of it.
Um, and you know, we knew thatit was going to, basically the
dream was, um, we were gettingmarried, we knew that there were
these rows of white chairs, itwas by a body of water, there
were like rocks by the water,uh, and we saw these buildings
(30:05):
behind us, there were kind ofthese two story buildings with
white frames around the windows,and, um, So we're like, oh,
that's that's cool.
Like we didn't we didn't take itnecessarily as, oh, this is the
place, you know, where we'regoing to get married or it's
going to look exactly like that.
But we're like, I mean, it wassomething right?
I mean, you don't have the sameand it was eerie.
(30:27):
Like, who has the same dream thesame night?
Like, come on.
Like, I don't even know thatthat has ever happened to me.
To me, that certainly has nothappened to me ever at any other
point in my life.
I don't think I mean, I'veridden somewhere.
Oh, great.
Well, anyway, at least we'regonna adopt if we ever have
kids.
(30:48):
But anyway, so, uh, we had thesame dream.
And so part of the planningreally did revolve around
finding This location, eventhough it was this dream, like I
really did not expect to findit.
But I was in the office one dayand, um, we manage properties as
(31:08):
that's what we do.
Um, and one of my residents cameinto the office and, you know,
she said, Oh, you know, when itwhen When are you guys going to
get married?
And I kind of explained like,Oh, just never had the time.
And she's like, well, you gotta,you gotta.
And I told her about the dreamand she's like, got to find this
place.
You got to do it.
You got to do it right now.
And so she literally sat downwith me and we started to look
(31:28):
for venues together.
My office and she, um, she wasinsisted like she would not, she
would not leave until we foundsomething and I, we knew, well,
I, I didn't really at firstthink of it this way.
I wasn't sure if it was like bythe ocean or where, but in my
head, I was like, I know myfamily is going to come and I'm
(31:50):
sure we'll talk about this alittle bit too.
Um, but I, we didn't know ifTravis family would come or not,
but I knew that it was importantthat if yeah.
They were going to choose tocome that they have the option
and that it is just as easy forthem to attend as it is for my
family and the other people wewere going to invite.
(32:11):
So I kind of was like, well,Lake Superior's halfway kind of
in between where my family livesand where his family lives.
So let's look on the Northshore.
And as I just kind of went a bitliterally venue by venue up the
North Shore, I opened thewebsite for where we got
married, um, which is a placecalled Larsmont Cottages.
(32:32):
If you happen to be looking fora place, they're absolutely
lovely.
They did a wonderful job and,um, it was perfect.
It was like, it was like thedream had come to life and, um,
yeah, absolutely.
So we, we decided to have our,have our wedding there.
And I think that once we hadnarrowed down those venues and
we could narrow down the dates.
(32:52):
And that is really what, uh,helped.
We, we had, we had found thosevenues and then we spend
Thanksgiving with my family andthen we spend Christmas with
his.
And it so happened that like wewere going to head up in a
couple of weeks to go see, um,the, um, To go up for
Thanksgiving to see my familyand then we went and saw our
(33:15):
wedding venue and it wasgorgeous So we went inside we
were able to then book it andthen we started to plan the rest
of the wedding Which is thenwhen we found you well, and we
really started with ping pointsbecause There are so many, and
this, this worked its way, sometraditions that we didn't even
expect worked their way inbecause weddings are by their
(33:38):
nature, somewhat traditional,right?
We're pulling out all of these,these social traditions to
create these events, but at thesame time, like, Again, as part
of the Alphabet Mafia, you growup knowing things are a little
bit different for you, right?
So, so things can be a littlebit different.
These traditions can be a littlebit different.
(33:58):
You don't have to do all ofthese things.
Um, even as we were writing ourceremony together, my dad tried
to work in some of thoseCatholic marriage ceremony ping
points, because he's like, it'snot a marriage if you don't.
I did not know that.
That's Yeah, there's definitelysome stuff that worked its way
into that ceremony.
I'm struggling to remember themnow.
But yeah, he definitely workedin some, some like Catholic
(34:20):
wedding language, which ishilarious.
Uh, but, but we started theplanning process of what are,
what about this event is goingto be important to us?
And I think that people, um, youknow, and even my sister right
now is planning her wedding andevery couple approaches.
They're wedding so differentlyfor us.
(34:41):
It was really about what?
What we knew that it had to besomething that we would enjoy,
obviously, I think everybody hasthat as as a core of their
wedding planning.
But then also we wanted it to besomething everyone who is
attending would enjoy.
Right?
This is we thought about it.
Yes, it's our day.
Yes, it's for us, but it's alsoa celebration that we want
everybody to participate in andenjoy and be a part of and that
(35:03):
will just raise the vibration ofeverything.
So, um, also because we areinviting so many people.
from different walks of our lifeto especially I said, because
again, we weren't sure if myfamily was going to come.
So I had invited people frommultiple walks of my life and
they were all coming to enjoy,you know, one of the most
(35:24):
wonderful days of my life.
And with me coming from thisreligious back, I mean, we both
came from the religiousbackground.
I didn't want a lot of, um,religious backgrounds.
A religion, um, rooted in it,unless it was personal to me,
because that was reallyimportant to me because I didn't
want it to feel, you know, likeI was calling back to that, um,
(35:47):
to that trauma that I didn'tidentify with anymore.
There's nothing wrong with it.
If that's what you identify withit for me personally, I just
didn't need that in my.
day.
And so that's why we chose thethings that we did.
And we really sat down and wereally, you know, thought about
it.
And it was really to make surethat it was really personal to
us.
And listen to your podcast wasreally something that I did
(36:10):
actually, he listened to thispodcast.
To really like, you know, takethe, to take everything that
people were, you know, sayingand to make sure that this is
really personal and as a memberof the queer community, you
know, we are, we have theprivilege of kind of carving out
our own lane and doing it ourway because, you know, it's our
(36:31):
love and, you know, we don'thave to do it this traditional
way.
Yeah.
I mean, I know it started, itstarted with.
Like, I wanted there to be greatfood.
I wanted it to be thisexperience that, again, it was
kind of over a weekend.
So there was a multiple day,people would arrive the day
before, stay in the cabins,enjoy good food, hang out, and
(36:51):
just kind of have that moreleisurely.
experience to it where peoplecould come and go have a little
bit of freedom and just kind ofthe whole weekend was meant to
be the wedding, not just theceremony.
We wanted to have really goodfood.
We were lucky to have an amazingrestaurant that was right there
on site that was catering, whichwas great.
And It ended up being so mucheasier than I even imagined.
(37:15):
Actually, we were very lucky.
They did so much of it for us,um, that, like, it was, it was
very easy.
Um, and, um, you know, we got toreally select some amazing food.
And, um, I, I, I think it wasgreat.
I was very, very happy withthat.
The decor was really easy.
And, and we talked about, like,oh, well, maybe we'll want to
(37:37):
add on this or that.
But what the venue is able toprovide us was so perfect that
it just didn't need anythingextra.
Um, and it was like, well, maybewe should do flowers.
Uh, we didn't end up doing anyextra flowers, although we did
buy those, those, those trees.
They were also okay with usbringing in our own things.
So we had our own, um,centerpiece.
We had our own centerpieces,which, um.
(37:59):
His mom and family put together,which was amazing, which added
like a per, uh, personal touch,which I really, really
appreciate.
Yeah, that was really nice tohave that.
Yeah, my family was reallyhelpful in putting together all
of those other elements too,like, uh, so, I don't know.
It would not have been the samewithout, without all of their
help.
No, absolutely.
I mean, they put together likethe The gift box for the cards
(38:22):
and they put together the guestbook and they put together all
the centerpieces andarrangements and, um, yeah,
everybody was just justincredibly.
Incredibly helpful, but we werereally lucky.
I think in and maybe again, itall comes down to that, that
destiny of choosing the rightlocation.
And maybe that's why it was allin the dream and everything,
(38:43):
because everything was socontained, um, everybody got to
show up at this 1 location.
They got to stay and like, sleepthe nights there, right?
I'm on site.
The ceremony was right there onsite at the lake.
Um, and, uh, we were able tobring in.
And we did, we wrote our ownceremony.
Um, Travis wrote most of it andthen I came in and did the first
(39:07):
edit.
Uh, and then my mom and dad camein and tweaked a couple of
things here and there when wewere at their, at their place
one time and, um, yeah, that's,that's where a couple of pieces
of the Catholic ceremony, Ican't remember what it was, it's
like, I take the something kindof with this ring.
(39:28):
With this ring, blah, blah,blah.
And so that language got addedin, which is perfectly fine.
Yeah.
He's like, it's not, it's not,it's like, I can't remember his
words.
It was like, it's not a weddingor it's a, it doesn't make
sense.
You have to have it.
Uh, it was great.
Yeah.
And we, we had incorporated justkind of different stuff from
(39:48):
different cultures that we hadfound into the ceremony that
struck a chord with us.
We did a hand tithing, get it?
Struck a chord.
Anyway, no, like we have, we dida hand washing at the beginning
of the ceremony.
Um, we did a hand kind oftithing, um, for, for that kind
(40:08):
of end of the ceremony.
Um, and then we wrote a prettyextensive.
tear inducing vows.
Yes.
I cried.
I sobbed through my, I sobbedthrough my vows.
I think everybody did, but itwas a pretty, it was a pretty
teary.
According to the pictures,everyone was crying.
(40:30):
Everyone was crying.
That's for sure.
And my mother, my goodness,your, your mother performed
wonderful, like He coming homeand like it's always been a
lovely poem.
I've always thought it wasgreat, but when I tell you she
breathed life into it that Icould not even imagine and just
everybody was so moved andtouched by it.
(40:51):
It really was a lovely momentand to have your niece there to
be a part of it and to give youyour rope for the hand tithing.
My dad gave me my rope for thehand tithing.
It was just, it was all veryperfect.
It was perfect.
It was lovely.
Um, But yeah, that was kind ofour ceremony, our planning
process.
I mean, man, boy, I wish that Ihad more, um, complications with
(41:16):
it, but ours was so delightfullysimple.
We really relied on otherpeople, and I think that that's,
you know, important.
But we didn't have a weddingplanner or anything.
We just had the one that camewith the venue and we had you.
Oh, gosh.
Yeah, let's let's take a minutebecause honestly, I know you did
not invite us here to, uh, getyour horn or anything like that.
(41:41):
fully.
But man, were you such animportant part of it?
Pictures having wonderfulphotography on our wedding was
one of the most important pinkpoints for us.
It was something.
Look, we're doing this.
It is for us.
It is for them.
It is for everyone.
It is going to be a moment thatwe want to remember, and we want
to be able to take away somebeautiful images.
We want images that we're ableto share with friends and
(42:02):
family, even the ones that maybearen't able to attend and and to
have that.
And so it was so, so importantto us.
I can't tell you.
We looked through, I don't knowhow many instagrams of different
wedding photographers and, um,it, it, we did talk about it a
lot and it ended up being reallyimportant to us to have somebody
(42:23):
that understands our experienceand our story and, you know, is
able to relate to that.
And, and, and we didn't likeTravis was saying, we didn't
know whether or not His familywould choose to come.
Um, and while his niece was ableto attend, the rest of his
family chose that to come.
Right.
Um, but had they chosen to come,what a difficult, what a
(42:47):
difficult social situation to,to have to negotiate, um, and it
would have been a situation thatI know if it would have happened
that you would have been able tonavigate with grace and, you
know, professionalism that I'mnot sure if, I mean, I'm sure
there would be some otherpeople, but like you, you were,
Um, you are, uh, especiallyqualified to handle.
(43:10):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
There's, there's no doubt in mymind, um, that it would have
been okay.
Yeah.
It would have been a challenge,my goodness, but it would have
been okay.
Yeah.
And even my family, my gosh,them alone, I mean, they're
opening, loving, and accepting,but I, I distinctly remember
you, um, accepting someconfessions from, from some of
(43:32):
my family at length.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
Probably deeply wine induced,um, maybe even jobs of tequila
induced, um, and, and handlingthat with such incredible grace.
And some of the lovely, likelittle captures, the aside
captures, because we hadspecifically asked, we want.
Candid moments, right?
These, those things that mightbe the embarrassing moments.
(43:54):
Uh, the shot that you got withthe salt on my sister's wrist,
um, as they were on piercing wasso lovely and it ended up being
so much more than that.
You know, not just anembarrassing photo to pull out
at Christmas.
It wasn't that at all.
It, it was this moment of.
Um, my, my sisters and my niecesand, and Travis's niece all
(44:16):
bonding and, and Travis's niecereally finding that love and
connection with another familyand realizing that she had this
extended family.
Now it was this whole moment,uh, of, of realization for her
that this, this wedding was somuch.
More that it was now she hasthis extended family that loves
her and and has thisunconditional love for her
(44:38):
because she's now family too.
Uh, so it ended up being reallyimportant in all those moments.
We, we treasure them.
Yes, absolutely.
Wow.
Wow.
Thank you guys so much.
Oh my gosh.
I feel like I need to pay younow.
No, no, no.
This is a non sponsored, uh, nosponsorship.
This is not a paid partnership.
(44:59):
No, wow.
That, that's really means.
And it was such an honor to bethere.
Um, yeah, it was seriously sucha perfect day.
You guys did amazing.
And, I do have, just two quickfollow up questions.
So, James, maybe you can touchon, I'm curious.
So for those listening who arenot familiar with Minnesota, as
(45:21):
we mentioned, they got marriedon the North Shore, um, which is
about, yeah, two and a half,three hours away from
Minneapolis, like city life, allof that.
And so I have found that it iskind of like, okay, once you
start to get further and furtheraway, it can be a little bit
questionable with vendors.
And so, um.
I would love for you to chatkind of about even reaching out
(45:43):
to the venue, like if they hadrepresentation or like what that
was like.
And then, Travis, I would loveif you could talk about, it's
something that again, you'realways more than welcome to say
no.
Um, but I know that my familywill not be at my wedding
either.
And it's something that.
(46:05):
I don't know.
I still find hard and I knowthat a lot of listeners also
have family like that.
And so, um, just wonderinganything you're willing to share
to kind of talk about that andhow you kind of dealt with that
too.
I'll start with the easy onewhile you ruminate on that for a
moment.
Yeah.
So yeah, I we definitely didmost of everything through the
(46:28):
venue.
The venue provided our food, thevenue provided everything.
So in that sense, um, vendorswas pretty easy they did have
their preferred list of vendorsfor stuff that we could, um, you
know, reach out to as well.
But I mean, it was more limited,right?
Uh, it was more limited in termsof vendors up there.
And we did have to, you know, ifwe were going to go beyond
(46:51):
anything that we did reallythink about.
All of that.
Um, and it was either going tobe, you know, particularly when
we were looking at consideringdoing flowers and stuff, we had
looked at florists in the areaand it was like, well, we kind
of like this one kind of likethis one.
But then we go on instagram andfind something that we liked
way, way more, but they don'treally service that area.
(47:14):
Or if they do, there's a big upcharge to it.
Um, so for us, I mean, thelocation was so key and so
important and so vital that wedidn't even consider moving it
to accommodate that.
It was, it was just the rightdistance from everybody, right?
So what I heard you ask.
(47:35):
So something that I noticedabout that particular vendor.
So when calling back to when hewas in his office and his Um,
and his resident came in andthey started looking at vendors.
The first thing that I did whenhe sent me those vendors is I
immediately went into reviewsand I did search for queer
people who were like, Oh, I hadmy wedding here or I went on to
(47:59):
their Instagram to see if therewere any pictures of queer or.
Um, gay weddings, because thatwas the first thing as someone
who grew up north that I washyper conscious of because I
wanted to make sure that that issomething that would be okay.
And I called Lars, or I calledthe venue and I was, and I was
like, Hey, I'm thinking abouthaving my wedding here.
(48:21):
My My fiance or my husband and Ithink I said my husband and I
are thinking about having ourwedding here to see what the
reaction was.
I'm like, is that something thatyou would be open to?
And she's like, Oh, absolutely.
We blah, blah, blah.
I, you know, we had a weddinghere for a same sex couple here
last year and it was absolutelywonderful.
And that is something that.
(48:42):
Encouraged me to move forwardbecause whenever there was, you
know, whenever that was sent tome and it was anything past, you
know, Kern Rapids, Minnesota,which is, you know, 20 minutes
north of Minneapolis.
I'm like, I need to call to makesure that this is a safe space
because that was something thatI needed to make sure was that
it was going to be a safe spacefor my family and my friends to
(49:04):
celebrate the important day.
That is so interesting.
Travis.
Nailed it.
Um, and it's funny because myexperience and Travis's
experience.
So different, right?
Like I hear when you ask thatquestion the way that I heard it
and Travis immediately hears itthat other way, right?
And I think you both have ashared experience here.
Are you from northern Minnesotaor central Minnesota now?
(49:26):
No, I'm from Twin Cities.
Yeah.
Okay.
In any case, Travis, you know,hears that, um, and he did do
that.
He went, he checked theInstagrams, he checked for
reviews, um, and, and called tomake sure it would be a safe
space.
It's not even something andmaybe I'm naive.
It's not even something thatcrossed my mind.
Um, and you know, he did for himand he made sure, made sure that
(49:49):
was the case.
I mean, that's great.
I like I wish like that's thegoal is for us all to hopefully
be at that mental space safelyone day.
So, um, but yeah, I just knowthat the North Shore seems so
hit or miss still like it's itjust feels crazy.
Sometimes when I travel up thereor networking with people up
(50:11):
there, it just feels like youreally never know what you're
going to get.
Like some people are Yeah.
You know, great and awesome andamazing.
And some people are like veryoutspoken and you're like, that
should have been an insidethought.
So, um, yeah, no, but thank youfor, for sharing both sides.
I think it's funny too, becauselike, as you are, you know,
(50:31):
maybe like a career businessowner, it's like, I can see to
where it's just like, you, youalmost have to lead with that
because you want to, you need tosee how they're going to react,
but it's, it's.
It's an interesting experienceas someone who has, you know,
has been, as someone who is aminority, um, both ethnically
(50:52):
and, um, and a gay man, it'ssomething that I am hyper aware
of.
Even it's funny because evenmoving to Chicago in the past
year, it's like, Oh, moving to anew region, working with new
coworkers, is this going to beokay?
And as someone who is in my latethirties, that.
You know, it was always in theback of my mind, and I, you
know, I hope for the day that itdoesn't have to be, um, and
(51:16):
we'll see where we, you know,move forward in the next couple
of years, but, um, it, it is,it's something, and again, like,
James and I are very opposite,but I think that's also why we
are able to complement eachother, and it's truly wonderful,
so.
Yep thank you for that.
Dive in on family.
Yes.
(51:36):
So I think that the main thingin order for me to leading up to
the wedding, um, there were, um,Leading up to the wedding, I
needed to be forgiving both tomy family, to myself and just
(51:58):
the whole situation as whole torealize that it's, that this is
going to be the way that it is.
James and I were luckily able tohave a conversation with my
mother, um, and then I was ableto have a conversation with my
sister separately to where I letthem know about the wedding.
(52:20):
Um, I let them know that theywere absolutely invited, but I
also understood if they were notable to come, they politely
declined, and then we movedforward.
Um, I, it was hard.
There was one moment on thewedding day that I was thinking
(52:41):
about them, and you know, it wassad that they couldn't be there
and celebrate with me.
But then I also.
Had to come to the place of, ifthis wasn't going to be as
joyous for them as it was forme, then I truly didn't need
(53:01):
them there.
Everyone who was there who feltthe joy that I did was there and
that's enough for me.
Um, and that's, it was truly theperfect day and I still love
them.
They're my family, but I reallyhad to like, Let that go and
forgive them for that, andthey're, you know, and we were
(53:22):
up there for Thanksgiving thispast year, and there was no Like
animosity towards them, like itwas all, nothing has changed.
And that was something that Ireally drove home with them is
that nothing on James or I'spart is going to change.
We're just going to be marriedand nothing for them appeared to
(53:43):
really have changed either.
The one funny thing I will sayis that they wouldn't like
acknowledge our wedding rings.
But they kept trying to liketake sneaky peeks at them, but
then they like, wouldn't likeask to see them.
Even my mom was like, Oh, can Isee your watch?
Which is on my left hand.
Like, your watch is so nice.
(54:04):
Can I see it?
You've seen my watch.
You don't need to see my watch.
I'm like, yeah, very, very nice.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We know what we're talkingabout, but it's something that
like I'm, I had to truly.
like sit with myself and, youknow, not necessarily meditate
(54:26):
on, but just be okay with.
And I know that's easier saidthan done because it is, it is
hard.
Um, but just kind of come at itwith a forgiving energy and
really just realize that.
They are still your family, youstill have love for them, but
(54:48):
the person that will be standingnext to you is now your family,
and that's going to be the mostperson, the most important
person in your life now, andthat is how you're going to move
forward into the next chapter.
I think just on, on my end, whenI met Travis's family, even for
the first time, I knew that thiswas going to be a challenge.
(55:09):
Uh, you know, even before awedding was, was in the picture,
I knew that it was going to be achallenge.
And so I, I know that there areother people out there who might
be dealing with similardynamics.
And all I can say is beforgiving, approach this from a
place of love always.
(55:30):
And only with love.
It, it, it serves no one to goin and expect them to change
overnight or to, you know,challenge their belief systems
or force, force anything onthem.
It doesn't help, right?
Just be a good person.
Approach them with love.
Um, be in their space if they'llallow you to be.
(55:51):
Uh, I know that sometimes youdon't even get that far, but
even in, even in conversationsthere, hopefully can sense the
love that you have.
for their family.
Um, and always keep bringingthat love, bringing that love,
bringing that love because lovealways wins.
It will win out eventually.
Um, it might not be everythingthat you want overnight.
(56:13):
You might not have your familycoming to your wedding tomorrow
as a result.
But maybe, just maybe, they'll,they'll invite you up for the
weekend, or they'll invite youto Thanksgiving, or they'll
welcome you into their home, orthat very first time that they
say, I love you, or that veryfirst time that they give you a
hug and say, I'm going to missyou when you leave.
Those things are priceless, andthey say everything that needs
(56:35):
to be said.
So even if you don't get tochange their opinions overnight,
even if they're not going to bethere for that moment, because
just mentally, they just can'tget there yet, they, the love
will always win.
So as long as you're bringingthat to the table, um, I think
you're doing the right thing andyou're doing everything that you
can and it, it was sad for me tohis family couldn't be there.
(56:57):
I, I, I, it, it didn't hurt mebecause I knew where they were
coming from and I've alwaysaccepted where they were coming
from.
But it was sad.
There was a moment.
Um, you know, there was a momentfor me that day.
I remember of when I saw Emmathere alone when I saw his niece
(57:17):
there alone.
And, and, you know, she was hisonly kind of family
representation other than hischosen family other than friends
and other people who were there,but it, it, it hurt that moment.
It did.
Um, I think that that'sunavoidable, but you gotta, you
gotta acknowledge it and just goback to love.
(57:38):
Go back to love, go back to themoment, go back to the person
who's now going to be the mostimportant or is and remains and
will continue to be the mostimportant person in your life
and, and go back to feeling thejoy of that moment and
celebrating with the people whoare there to celebrate.
Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you for sharing that.
And I know you kind of both didtouch on it, but also,
(57:58):
obviously, just with the caveatof like, all of that within the
means of your own, like,personal safety and health and
mental well being and all ofthat too.
Um, yeah, super appreciate you.
Both sharing your perspectives.
Okay, kind of just wrap thingsup, um, as a fun little bonus
(58:21):
question.
Let's end with talking aboutlike, what are some of each of
your favorite things about eachother, your relationship?
Either both.
That's too long of a pause.
do you want me to start?
One of, one of the favoritethings about our relationship is
(58:42):
that we are so opposite becauseyou, you see those couples that
are so opposite and it's not agood thing.
And that's, that's not how weare.
We are, we learn from each otherand we really compliment each
other.
And I really value that in ourrelationship because we, we can
see things from, I mean, we hadan example earlier and we can
(59:05):
really learn from each other.
And I really value that.
And he always makes me smile andhe's so fucking funny and sexy
and I absolutely love it.
Uh, I, I, what's not to loveabout Travis?
He's such a warm, kind soul, um,and you know, I, we obviously
(59:26):
didn't touch on all of the lifeat Year, I'm sure, just a little
bit of, of, of um, Talking thatwe did today, you get a little
bit of his life experience andand everything that he's gone
through in his life and how thathas shaped him to be just this
incredible man.
It's incredibly intelligentperson.
It's incredibly emotionally andspiritually intelligent person
(59:49):
as well.
It's just incredible.
Uh, and I, I will alwaysappreciate how supportive he is.
Um, I think that we both pusheach other to do more, to be
better, to, to learn, to grow,to experience new things.
That's why we keep on moving.
Um, but we, we push each otherin the best way possible.
(01:00:12):
We are always there to supporteach other no matter what.
At the end of the day, I alwayshave his back, he's always got
mine and, um, it allows us to,you know, achieve whatever we
want in life and in ourrelationship and, um, trust.
I mean, I can't, the way that weare able to trust each other, I
(01:00:37):
don't know, I don't know.
It's just, it's, it's, um,something that you can't
replicate.
So I don't, I don't know, I lovethose things.
Wonderful things.
Wow, that is so incrediblysweet.
Yeah, you guys.
You, you two are just the bestand have the best vibes.
And I just, I wish nothing buthappiness for, for all your
(01:01:01):
years to come.
So all the good vibes in the25s.
Yes.
Oh my gosh.
Wow.
And I know that people listeningare going to get so much out of
this, but hopefully like thisepisode for as long, the
internet will allow it to be.
(01:01:22):
Alive and live, you guys canrevisit it any other time that a
thunderstorm approaches and ofhow great your love is.
So not very many thunderstormsthese days, maybe a little,
maybe a little static, butthat's it.
Yeah.
We've already worked through thebad weather.
(01:01:44):
Oh my gosh.
Awesome.
Well, thank you guys so, somuch.
This was wow.
So amazing.
Any last things you want to saybefore we end this episode?
I don't think so.
I don't know, but thankseverybody for listening to our
story.
I hope you found some of itmeaningful, impactful,
(01:02:05):
entertaining, entertaining, and,uh, yeah, all love, all love,
and, um, mwah.
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