November 24, 2025 • 30 mins
Step into the pulse of the early ‘80s, as “Caribbean Kings: The Other British Invasion” peels back the breakthrough journey of Black British men whose Caribbean roots powered a musical movement that influenced the global music landscape. From reggae to pop and R&B, hosts DJ Sir Daniel and Jay Ray explore how artists descended from the Windrush generation reshaped the US soundscape, blending cultures and genres in unforgettable ways.
This episode dives into:
- The pivotal influence of the Windrush generation and the Caribbean diaspora on British music
- How Bob Marley opened the door for Black men to become international pop superstars
- Musical Youth’s historic MTV debut, predating Michael Jackson, and rewriting what was possible for Black artists
- Billy Ocean’s chart-topping anthems, from R&B gems to global pop ballads, and the story behind “European Queen?”
- The legacy of Eddy Grant, Junior, Maxi Priest, and Shabba Ranks in changing the game for UK-to-US crossover hits
Hit play, share with fellow music lovers, and let Queue Points drop the needle on the untold stories behind the songs that changed history!
Chapter Markers
00:00 Intro Theme
00:16 Introduction and Host Greetings
01:16 The Windrush Generation and Caribbean Influence
02:37 Bob Marley: The Gateway to Caribbean Music
06:37 The Rise of Caribbean Kings in the 1980s
09:05 Billy Ocean and the Caribbean Pop Explosion
21:42 Maxi Priest, Shabba Ranks, and the 90s Caribbean Wave
29:43 Outro Theme
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Sir Daniel (00:16):
Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast.
I am DJ Sir Daniel
Jay Ray (00:22):
And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government as
Johnnie Ray Kornegay III and Sir Danielin the early 1980s, you could not tell
me that it having a British accent as aBlack man wasn't the coolest thing ever.
It was a whole mood.
Sir Daniel (00:39):
It certainly was.
We are about to talk about the otherBritish invasion, but not just the British
invasion, a Caribbean, British invasion.
Jay Ray, we talking about CaribbeanKings on this episode and um, oh, I
just, I've left a great opportunityto start singing there on the table,
but we're not gonna do that because Iknow we wanna get to the conversation.
(01:03):
But Jay Ray, I think.
What this generation is missingis the smooth tones of a
Caribbean, um, born singer.
So Jay Ray, You and I. Benefited fromthe fruits of the Windrush generation
as kids growing up in the eighties.
(01:25):
And if you're not familiar, we talkedabout the Windrush generation on this, um,
podcast before, but they are a generationof Caribbean immigrants that landed in
England, London, England starting in 1948.
There was an influx of people fromJamaica, trinidad and Tobago, Barbados,
(01:46):
Guyana, uh, Grenada all over that wentover to England like most immigrants.
Jay Ray (01:53):
Mm-hmm.
Sir Daniel (01:53):
To go to this country, to, um, better their lives seeking
employment, seeking, um, other freedoms,but mostly to make money and to become,
you know, to gain employment and tosend money back home, of course, to
their families that couldn't make it.
But Jay Ray.
What we got from this Windrushgeneration was an amazing, amazing
(02:18):
history of Black music that I don'tthink anybody really taps in or
talks about in this music atmosphere.
And Key Points is the only show doing it.
So take that everybody.
Um, and so we're gonna start, we can't.
Not talk about the Caribbean Kings.
And there's um, there's four in particularthat we want to highlight, but we can't
(02:43):
start without talking about Bob Marleywho debuted in 1965, uh, with the Whalers
as a, in a group, but then he became aninternational superstar and one of his
stops, of course, was London, England.
Jay Ray (03:00):
Yeah.
So, uh, I do think, uh, BobMarley is kind of the gateway
to opening the door for, uh.
Popular culture.
And when I'm saying popular culture,in this case, I do mean white folks
to be exposed to, um, in Bob Marley'scase, reggae, but more expansively,
(03:21):
uh, music of the Caribbean because Ifeel like, um, reggae is just kind of
this, this box, but I feel like whatBob Marley and, and Bob Marley and the
Whalers were doing was a little bit ofrock and roll, a little bit of soul.
With the reggae, uh, uh, uh, foundation.
But yeah, Bob Marley is,is kind of the gateway.
And so when Bob Marley goes solo, hebecomes an international superstar.
(03:48):
And when I was growing up, so man.
There was, um, a moment, and Ithink I talked about this on our
Bob, uh, our Bob Marley show, whereyou would see a Bob Marley concert.
Like they would air it on tv 'cause Iwasn't as familiar, I think, and I was
super young 'cause I think he, uh, he diedin like 1981, but they showed this Bob
(04:12):
Marley concert and it was packed to thegills with people and he was performing
this music that I was at that point.
Unfamiliar with, but the sizeof the crowd was amazing.
But what I think Bob Marley did wasit gave a way to the possibility
(04:33):
of Black men being pop superstarson the international stage.
And that's what I think, uh,Bob Marley was able to do for,
for this, for this group of men.
I think he really didopen the door for that
possibility.
Sir Daniel (04:47):
He absolutely did and what he did, so if you remember, um, at their
inception, so in 1965, we're still on.
You know, as far as stylists concerned,we're still coming off the tail
end of the fifties where a lot ofmusicians are, are suited and booted.
They're, you know, in well tailored suits.
Um, hairs cut.
(05:08):
Everybody is coiffed and looks verymainstream and palatable for various
audience, different, different audiences.
So if, when you fast forward to theend of the sixties, um, they went
from, they went from, um, that.
Um, buttoned up style.
Then they went to mod themod style of dressing.
(05:30):
Then we get into the hippie era.
And so what you find though is thatBob Marley, um, delves into his,
the, the Rastafari culture and growsout his hair, grows out the locks.
Then the Rastafari, um, culture literally.
Takes over London like a lot ofthose British kids, even the,
(05:52):
the, the white kids that were intothe, into hippie culture, and they
gravitated to that, to that raafum, culture, the way of dressing.
And if, you know, and there is a line JayRay, and that's a, this is a whole nother
topic, but there is a line between, um,Rastafarian Jamaican culture and um, sky.
Jay Ray (06:15):
Scott Punk.
Sir Daniel (06:17):
punk and also to the skinheads, which is really
Jay Ray (06:22):
is really wild, but you are right.
Sir Daniel (06:25):
There's a through line there.
Yes.
Jay Ray (06:27):
There's a through line there.
And so that's so interesting that youdo draw this line because I do think,
uh, for the, for the, uh, gentlementhat we're about to talk about, right?
So as we get into, uh, the mid tolate 1970s, and I love that you
called it at the top, the, theother British invasion because.
(06:48):
What we find in kind of the, the, the,I think the first big breakout, uh, uh,
star of this group who actually become,takes over the 1980s as well, um, is.
Billy Ocean kind of starts onthe r and b side of things.
You know, Knights Baby Funkyr and b Knights is still just
like an amazingly funky track.
(07:11):
And, but then, you know, as the1980s move, as the 1980s move
on, you know, pivots into likethis pop superstardom, but.
There's Black artists that come,came from the uk, ended up on the r
and b charts in the US and it justkind of became this phenomenon.
(07:35):
But it's a phenomenon that thatoftentimes we just kind of overlook.
But it was really important tohow Black artists in the US even
began to make music later on.
So these, these men arelike really pivotal.
Sir Daniel (07:49):
They're very pivotal and important.
Um, but I just wanted a little footnote.
I don't want to forgetmusical youth because
Jay Ray (07:56):
Oh, can we talk about them please?
Sir Daniel (07:58):
Who, who like, uh, uh, literally a boy
band out of London, England.
Um, huge.
I mean, and when I sayboys, I literally mean
Jay Ray (08:11):
boys.
They were boys.
These are the children.
Sir Daniel (08:12):
These are children, um, who saw stardom at a very early age
and what, like, became so huge to thepoint that it, um, you know, their,
their careers, it affected them.
You know, clearly.
Um, but they are part of that, uh, whatthat imagination, what America could
(08:33):
see as with Black men becoming thefront men of these huge international
bands and even solo artists.
So they are part of that foundationbecause if you don't have Bob Marley and
the Whalers, you don't have musical youth.
And if you don't havemusical, then you don't have.
(08:54):
Your Billy Oceans and your juniorGriscoms that were all, you know, that
all came along and became huge pop starsin the mid eighties, the early eighties.
Jay Ray (09:04):
The early eighties.
So fun fact, I I I, I, we giveMichael Jackson a lot of love for
how he kind of kicked to open thedoor on like the MTV side of things.
So I think there's just somethingthat I wanna make sure we bring
into the conversation too.
Um, music video madeit easy for this trans.
(09:27):
Made it easy for thistransition to happen, right?
Because first of all, musicvideo in Europe and in the UK in
particular was kind of a medium thatfolks were really familiar with.
Um, because bands, if we think backto Bohemian Rhapsody, like Queen did a
music video in like 19 74, 75, right?
So it was something thatpeople were familiar with.
(09:47):
So it made it easy to kind of likehave this visual to go musical youth.
Actually predated Michael Jackson on MTV.
So when we talk about Black artistsbeing played on MTV, which was Rock and
Roll centered musical youth, predatedMichael Jackson by several months.
(10:09):
Uh, they, so musical youth is actuallythe first Black artist that MTV played.
It wasn't, we give Michael Jackson a lotof, a lot of love 'cause it was huge.
But it was actually musicalyouth that cracked open
that door.
Sir Daniel (10:22):
And see, once again, nobody's talking about this, this
British invasion, um, that happened.
You know, Billy Ocean is, um,most of everybody knows everybody.
Most of these groups areJamaican from Jamaica.
Billy Ocean is Trinidadian and, um,which is, which was huge at the time.
(10:43):
And like you were saying, his,the music was super r and b.
Like you see Knights is rightbehind me and stay the night.
Those are like major r and b, bigr and b records that you can play.
In any cool eighties RB set tothis day, I mentioned Junior
Griscom Griscom, who I found out.
(11:04):
So he's, he's British, born and raised,but of course he has Jamaican parents and
we all know Junior from, um, mama usedto say, which was a huge, huge record.
Jay Ray (11:16):
can hear it right now on classic r and b radio, somewhere in this country.
Sir Daniel (11:20):
absolutely it's, um, sampled, been sampled.
In positive case.
I got a man.
Um.
So much to say about junior gifts and Idon't think he gets a lot of love that,
the love that he should, but again, he'ssomeone that pushed that pop envelope so
that you can get, so that room can be madefor an Eddy Grant who is out of Guyana.
(11:46):
Which is, I, I have torepresent for Guyana.
That's where my, um, my mother is fromand our family and is from Guyana.
And I didn't even know that until I becamean adult that Eddy Grant was Guyanese.
And that's such a huge deal becausethere aren't, there aren't any.
Any other major, major popstars from Guyana that you can
(12:06):
pop, that you can point at?
I mean, there's lots of different,um, bands and whatnot, and there
are people of Guyanese descent.
There's some MCs that are of Guyanesedescent, but, uh, we're talking
Eddy Grant, if you don't remember,rocked us down to Electric Avenue.
That song is still tothis day, is a monster.
(12:29):
Is a monster jam.
It marries rock.
It is marries punk.
It marries, ska.
Um,
Jay Ray (12:36):
wave.
It's all in there.
Sir Daniel (12:39):
all in there and he continues that Rastafarian, um.
He brought that Rastafarian culturewith him as well because he was very, he
represented in the music videos of funny.
Jay Ray was telling me a very funny storyabout how that that video freaked him
Jay Ray (12:57):
freaked Electric Avenue.
So I was a MTV kid.
Um, and so I remember when ElectricAvenue was playing on MTV, I was
fortunate in that we had cable early.
I. I remember when Electric Avenuewas playing on MTV as like a new
song, and it was something aboutthe colors, the, the, the, the
(13:20):
amalgamation of sounds and there waslike a water theme that freaked me out.
'cause he like falls into the waterand then ends up on the beach.
I don't know why that video scared meso much, but as a kid it really did.
But I wanna lift up something that.
You mentioned going back tothat amalgamation of sounds.
(13:40):
First of all two things Eddy Grantproduced, wrote, and produced that record.
Sir Daniel (13:45):
That whole
Jay Ray (13:46):
And Guyana like, so, like this is like squarely, I think in Guyana.
Don't quote me on that.
Y'all let me, let us know in thecon in the, in the, the chat.
But I really do think he like went backto Guyana and like did this record.
So it's really kind of, uh,uh, a self, it's self produced.
Self written, which is great for Eddy.
Grant, you got a huge hit off that bro.
(14:08):
I want, I hope you're still collectingyour checks, but it married.
All of these things thatwere kind of like catnip.
So those striking keyboards, the, the,the, the, the, the big guitar, the,
Sir Daniel (14:25):
Mm-hmm.
Jay Ray (14:25):
what I'm saying of for rock and roll, and then you get the
little, the little whispers of the,the reggae happening, um, as well.
So it's, it was literally catnipand that particular song became
just like it was everywhere.
Now he did have, um.
Which you, which you reminded me of,romancing the Stone, which was apparently
(14:48):
supposed to be closely associatedwith the film, ended up not happening.
So there's like a song RomancingThe Stone by Eddy Grant that was
supposed to be attached to thefilm, romancing the Stone, but they
ended up somehow getting separated.
But Eddy Grant in the, the, the early1980s in the US was one of those
(15:08):
artists that came out of this canon.
Who, uh, was groundbreaking?
Sir Daniel (15:13):
So speaking of romancing the stone, shout out to Billy Ocean again,
who also had a major hit with the gowhen the going gets tough for the, which
appeared on the sequel of Romancing theStone, which is jewel of the N. Correct.
Jay Ray (15:30):
Yep.
Yep.
Sir Daniel (15:31):
So, uh, that to have for both of these gentlemen to have songs
associated with these major motionpictures, still huge moves, and, and
pushing the pa, pushing the envelope.
For more men of Caribbean descent tocome on the scene and, you know, we can't
(15:52):
get away from Billy Ocean's hits though.
Like we talk about the pop standards.
We, you talked about, we hadthe RB standards that he came
out with that were super funky.
Then he, he went into this pop directionthat we could not escape from Caribbean
Queen, first of all, on a, on a,on a musical side, Caribbean Queen.
(16:15):
Um, blends in with, um, MichaelJackson's, Billie Jean Marvelously.
So all you DJs out there, that's for you.
You're welcome.
Um, Caribbean Queen and Billie Jean,they rhyme and they sound good when you
blend them together, but that song wason the charts forever, so we had that.
But can we, we talk about the ballads.
(16:38):
He had that Ballad rivals anything thatLion Lionel Richie had on the radio
at the time suddenly was everywhere.
Jay Ray (16:46):
everywhere it, so I think the thing, and this is something that Quincy
Jones used to talk about a lot, um.
Is ear candy
Sir Daniel (16:56):
Mm-hmm.
Jay Ray (16:57):
Caribbean queen, and suddenly were like ear candy.
They had like these repeatable singsongy, uh, things that you just
couldn't get outta your head, likeliterally Caribbean queen to this day.
It plays in my head, it looksand sounds like summer of 1984.
(17:21):
Like it look like when I hear it,it's like I'm suddenly, uh, uh, seven.
I'm suddenly seven.
And um, oh, real quick, sir. Daniel, andthis is a tangent, but I'm gonna go here.
I love how we say Caribbean and Caribbean.
I don't know what.
Sir Daniel (17:38):
Oh,
Jay Ray (17:40):
but no, I'm saying that it depends on where you, and that's
what I was, had to get in my head.
I'm like, oh, it dependson where you from.
It is how you say it.
But I always thought that was funny.
I'm like, I don't know which way to do it.
Right.
And I'm guess like they're both right.
Sir Daniel (17:53):
say both.
Yeah, they're interchangeable.
And this is somebody whois of Caribbean descent.
Like I've heard it all, both, all my life.
Caribbean and Caribbean.
It just depends on who's sayingit to you, but shout out to, um,
Keith Vincent who produced thatsong also from Trinidad and Tobago.
So this is, this whole thing was in-house.
All of these hits were in-house, um, made.
(18:16):
Um, there was somethingelse I was going to make.
Oh, speaking of Caribbean Queen,Jay Ray, we discovered and I
actually saw the record myself.
Jay Ray (18:24):
this is hilarious.
Sir Daniel (18:25):
once.
Did you all know that Caribbeanqueen was such a major hit that, Hmm?
That the record labels insisted
Jay Ray (18:36):
Consistent.
Sir Daniel (18:36):
that Billy Ocean created, um, different versions for different
countries or different, um, continents.
So there is in fact aversion called European
Jay Ray (18:47):
There is a European queen.
Sir Daniel (18:51):
Is so in this kind, in this climate that we're living in today
is very telling and, and problematic.
Um, but we're not gonna, this is a funshow, we're not gonna delve into that,
but there's a reason why they probablyinsisted that he make a Caribbean Queen
Jay Ray (19:07):
oh yeah.
Sir Daniel (19:08):
and I'm Sure
Jay Ray (19:09):
it.
Sir Daniel (19:10):
Go ahead.
Jay Ray (19:11):
No, no, no.
I'm like, oh, you know, they were sittingthere like, okay, so Billy, but you
know this, so there's a, a, a Europeanqueen, and I didn't know this either
until I was getting ready for this show,but there's an African queen too, but
it's specifically for South Africa.
So South Africa needed their onlytheir own version of Caribbean Queen.
Sir Daniel (19:30):
which South Africans, but go
Jay Ray (19:31):
know, you know exactly which South Africans that was for, 'cause we
were still in apartheid at that point.
Sir Daniel (19:37):
Hmm.
Jay Ray (19:39):
And yeah, so,
Sir Daniel (19:42):
But anyway,
Jay Ray (19:42):
right.
So that song, um, it was, it was set upto be an international crossover success.
So they set that song up and Billy Ocean.
So I have this up, sir Daniel, because.
I didn't know this.
Uh, this is according to the Wikipedia,but uh, Billy Ocean won the ASCAP Pop
(20:10):
Awards seven times between 1986 and 1989.
Seven Caribbean Queen Lover Boy suddenly.
There'll be sad songs to make you cry.
Listen, that is like a classicsixties, like, oh my God, when the
going gets tough, the tough get going.
Love is forever, and Ithink his last big pop hit.
(20:34):
Get Outta My Dreams.
Sir Daniel (20:36):
and get into my car,
Jay Ray (20:38):
that was a hilarious title.
Sir Daniel (20:40):
my dream.
And of course, you know, that madethat, made it to, um, wall Street and
was in car commercials and everything.
So y'all, we know Billy Ocean isthat man like Billy OSHA pretty.
If we gonna think about it, BillyOcean gave all the brothers here in
the eighties a run for their money.
(21:00):
I'm telling you, Lionel Richie,Stevie Wonder, Michael Jackson,
uh, Billy Ocean was giving thema run for the money big time.
And Jay Ray, we don't if we, so likeyou said, um, what year was that?
That, um, get out of my
Jay Ray (21:15):
Get
outta my dreams.
Get into my car.
Let me see when that was released.
That was released in 1988and produced by Mutt Lang.
I'm sorry, written by Oh yeah.
Produced by Mutt Lang.
Written by Billy
Ocean and Mutt Lang.
Sir Daniel (21:30):
Hmm.
So fast forward, so 88.
So it took about a good fouryears before we had another.
Jay Ray (21:41):
Another British
Sir Daniel (21:42):
Another British invasion of Caribbean descent with Maxi Priest.
Jay Ray (21:49):
Yes.
Sir Daniel (21:50):
and Maxi Priest literally came along and was like, when he
came, when he came through with closeto you, it, it felt so familiar.
It was like, it, it literally,it, it felt like Billy Ocean
was still singing on this.
Like, we can hear BillyOcean, we can hear, um.
(22:11):
Uh, Bob Marley and those, and then theway Maxi Priest presented Rastafari Eye.
Super long locks.
But this song was so tender and sobeautifully produced, um, that gave us
that, that nice, um, I call it the Soulto soul groove, the Nelly Hooper kind
of groove behind it, which made it verypalatable to us here in the United States.
Jay Ray (22:35):
So close to you for me once again.
Um, much like, uh, uh, Caribbean Queen.
Smells and feels like 1990,like it's a summertime.
It's a song that reminds meof a specific period of time.
I don't know if the memory thatI'm about to share is true, but
it's the memory that I feel themost when I, when I hear that song.
(22:59):
So by then I am 12 or 13.
So the way I would go to sleep.
Is I would play the radio, so Ialways had like a, the radio next to
my bed and so I would play the radioand typically overnight on, uh, uh,
radio At the time it would be SoulJams, miss pretty much, and relaxing
(23:21):
music all night long during the week.
And I remember on like the QuietStorm, on Power 99, first hearing
this song and it was just like.
This, what is this?
This is beautiful.
It just felt so soothing in a time whenhip hop was taking over everything.
(23:46):
You had this song kind of sneak inand had this beautiful melody and,
um, and, and still that hook to thisday just kind of sends me to a place.
It is an absolute gorgeous song.
Sir Daniel (24:02):
It is.
And again, because when you write a songlike that, when you produce a song in
that nature, that way it's timeless.
That like I, I, I can play that song.
It came out in 1990.
I can play that song todayin a new Jacks swing set.
(24:23):
Uh, uh, a slow jam set and itgoes off people still and it
still resonates with people.
It's beautiful.
And so shout out to Maxi Priest, um,who I believe also did a duet with
the last brother that we're gonnatalk about, which is Shaa ranks,
Jay Ray (24:41):
Yes.
Sir Daniel (24:43):
I think she ranks might have been the last.
Might have been thelast Caribbean invasion.
Caribbean super mega superstar.
That we saw.
I mean, we had, you know, you had yourboogies and whatnot o over that, but I
think Shaba ranks had an impact in theUnited States that was unlike anybody
(25:06):
else, because in the, in nine, thatperiod between 90 to 93, 94 sha ranks
was on fire when tingling came out.
There was people that hadnever been to Jamaica, had
never even had a Jamaican beef.
Patty were singing that song,tingling Like it was this.
(25:26):
I mean, it was a fantastic song,but Shaba Ranks had also had mega
crossover appeal with ballads.
This, y'all need to, y'allgotta put some ballots out guys.
The ballots are what will take you overand will give you longevity, but Mr.
Lover Man.
Jay Ray (25:44):
Yeah.
Sir Daniel (25:45):
Was Shabba.
I mean, it also made, it also gaveus comedy gold because they lampoon
that on, um, in living color.
But yeah, so Shaba Ranks camearound and lemme tell you something,
when Shaba performs today crazy,the response is still just as
crazy as it was in the nineties.
Jay Ray (26:08):
yeah.
You know?
I'm so glad we get a chance to justkind of lift up, uh, Shaaba ranks
because yeah, he um, he took all of thisstuff that had come before and mixed
in the dance hall piece 'cause we wereby now in that, that moment in time.
Um, so it still felt familiar, butit also felt like really new and.
(26:33):
Shopper ranks spawned the then,uh, uh, uh, American need to
have like a reggae rhyme on likeevery album in the early 1990s.
So you were either doing, you eitherhad a reggae influenced song, or you
were doing a rap, or somebody wasdoing a rap that kind of reminded
(26:57):
you of what Shabba Ranks was doing.
Um, he had a huge, huge impact.
On the moment.
Sir Daniel (27:04):
Huge impact.
Kick down the doors and then like youwere saying, then you got, you open
the door, then we can get a SuperCAT,we get a ou, we get a red rat.
We get all these people that, likeyou said, show up on these remixes,
especially a lot of hip hop remixes.
Then you have everybodydoing hybrids, mad Lion.
Jay Ray (27:23):
Yep.
Sir Daniel (27:24):
Um, and then you get re reggae remixes of hip hop songs, and then you
get reggae remixes of, uh, r and b songs.
So again, these brothers came in andchanged the game in their own lanes.
So as we wrap up, um, we don't wanna.
I know you're probably thinking like,how can you not talk about loose ends?
(27:44):
We can't.
We haven't.
We didn't forget about CarlMcIntosh from Loose Ends.
I couldn't con, I couldn't, um,confirm his descent, but I'm
willing to bet dollars to donuts.
There's some Caribbeanconnection in there.
There's some Caribbean bloodclanking around in those veins.
But shout out to Carl McIntosh.
And the, um, loose ends crew whois still doing his thing in the uk.
(28:07):
Um, again, another impactful group on,uh, r and b and here in the United States.
So, so that was your, um, lesson,kids on the British, the Caribbean,
British invasion of the earlyeighties into the nineties.
Jay Ray (28:23):
yeah.
Go back and play these songs,y'all, all of them be bopping.
So, uh, in fact, we should put outa playlist so that y'all can, uh,
check out, uh, some of the joints.
Um, but
Sir Daniel (28:36):
the going gets tough.
Jay Ray (28:38):
duh, when is, listen, Billy OSHA was killing the game, so, um.
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You could do a wholebunch of stuff over there.
(28:58):
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Excuse me.
We appreciate y'all.
(29:19):
We love y'all.
Thanks for
hanging out with us,
Sir Daniel (29:21):
We certainly do, and as I say in every episode
in this life, you have a choice.
You can either pick up the needleor you can let the record play.
I'm DJ Sir Daniel.
Jay Ray (29:29):
and my name is Jay Ray.
Sir Daniel (29:31):
And this has been Queue Points podcast, dropping
the needle on Black music history.
We will see you on thenext go round, Shaba.
Jay Ray (29:40):
Peace.
Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast.
I am DJ Sir Daniel
Jay Ray (00:22):
And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government as
Johnnie Ray Kornegay III and Sir Danielin the early 1980s, you could not tell
me that it having a British accent as aBlack man wasn't the coolest thing ever.
It was a whole mood.
Sir Daniel (00:39):
It certainly was.
We are about to talk about the otherBritish invasion, but not just the British
invasion, a Caribbean, British invasion.
Jay Ray, we talking about CaribbeanKings on this episode and um, oh, I
just, I've left a great opportunityto start singing there on the table,
but we're not gonna do that because Iknow we wanna get to the conversation.
(01:03):
But Jay Ray, I think.
What this generation is missingis the smooth tones of a
Caribbean, um, born singer.
So Jay Ray, You and I. Benefited fromthe fruits of the Windrush generation
as kids growing up in the eighties.
(01:25):
And if you're not familiar, we talkedabout the Windrush generation on this, um,
podcast before, but they are a generationof Caribbean immigrants that landed in
England, London, England starting in 1948.
There was an influx of people fromJamaica, trinidad and Tobago, Barbados,
(01:46):
Guyana, uh, Grenada all over that wentover to England like most immigrants.
Jay Ray (01:53):
Mm-hmm.
Sir Daniel (01:53):
To go to this country, to, um, better their lives seeking
employment, seeking, um, other freedoms,but mostly to make money and to become,
you know, to gain employment and tosend money back home, of course, to
their families that couldn't make it.
But Jay Ray.
What we got from this Windrushgeneration was an amazing, amazing
(02:18):
history of Black music that I don'tthink anybody really taps in or
talks about in this music atmosphere.
And Key Points is the only show doing it.
So take that everybody.
Um, and so we're gonna start, we can't.
Not talk about the Caribbean Kings.
And there's um, there's four in particularthat we want to highlight, but we can't
(02:43):
start without talking about Bob Marleywho debuted in 1965, uh, with the Whalers
as a, in a group, but then he became aninternational superstar and one of his
stops, of course, was London, England.
Jay Ray (03:00):
Yeah.
So, uh, I do think, uh, BobMarley is kind of the gateway
to opening the door for, uh.
Popular culture.
And when I'm saying popular culture,in this case, I do mean white folks
to be exposed to, um, in Bob Marley'scase, reggae, but more expansively,
(03:21):
uh, music of the Caribbean because Ifeel like, um, reggae is just kind of
this, this box, but I feel like whatBob Marley and, and Bob Marley and the
Whalers were doing was a little bit ofrock and roll, a little bit of soul.
With the reggae, uh, uh, uh, foundation.
But yeah, Bob Marley is,is kind of the gateway.
And so when Bob Marley goes solo, hebecomes an international superstar.
(03:48):
And when I was growing up, so man.
There was, um, a moment, and Ithink I talked about this on our
Bob, uh, our Bob Marley show, whereyou would see a Bob Marley concert.
Like they would air it on tv 'cause Iwasn't as familiar, I think, and I was
super young 'cause I think he, uh, he diedin like 1981, but they showed this Bob
(04:12):
Marley concert and it was packed to thegills with people and he was performing
this music that I was at that point.
Unfamiliar with, but the sizeof the crowd was amazing.
But what I think Bob Marley did wasit gave a way to the possibility
(04:33):
of Black men being pop superstarson the international stage.
And that's what I think, uh,Bob Marley was able to do for,
for this, for this group of men.
I think he really didopen the door for that
possibility.
Sir Daniel (04:47):
He absolutely did and what he did, so if you remember, um, at their
inception, so in 1965, we're still on.
You know, as far as stylists concerned,we're still coming off the tail
end of the fifties where a lot ofmusicians are, are suited and booted.
They're, you know, in well tailored suits.
Um, hairs cut.
(05:08):
Everybody is coiffed and looks verymainstream and palatable for various
audience, different, different audiences.
So if, when you fast forward to theend of the sixties, um, they went
from, they went from, um, that.
Um, buttoned up style.
Then they went to mod themod style of dressing.
(05:30):
Then we get into the hippie era.
And so what you find though is thatBob Marley, um, delves into his,
the, the Rastafari culture and growsout his hair, grows out the locks.
Then the Rastafari, um, culture literally.
Takes over London like a lot ofthose British kids, even the,
(05:52):
the, the white kids that were intothe, into hippie culture, and they
gravitated to that, to that raafum, culture, the way of dressing.
And if, you know, and there is a line JayRay, and that's a, this is a whole nother
topic, but there is a line between, um,Rastafarian Jamaican culture and um, sky.
Jay Ray (06:15):
Scott Punk.
Sir Daniel (06:17):
punk and also to the skinheads, which is really
Jay Ray (06:22):
is really wild, but you are right.
Sir Daniel (06:25):
There's a through line there.
Yes.
Jay Ray (06:27):
There's a through line there.
And so that's so interesting that youdo draw this line because I do think,
uh, for the, for the, uh, gentlementhat we're about to talk about, right?
So as we get into, uh, the mid tolate 1970s, and I love that you
called it at the top, the, theother British invasion because.
(06:48):
What we find in kind of the, the, the,I think the first big breakout, uh, uh,
star of this group who actually become,takes over the 1980s as well, um, is.
Billy Ocean kind of starts onthe r and b side of things.
You know, Knights Baby Funkyr and b Knights is still just
like an amazingly funky track.
(07:11):
And, but then, you know, as the1980s move, as the 1980s move
on, you know, pivots into likethis pop superstardom, but.
There's Black artists that come,came from the uk, ended up on the r
and b charts in the US and it justkind of became this phenomenon.
(07:35):
But it's a phenomenon that thatoftentimes we just kind of overlook.
But it was really important tohow Black artists in the US even
began to make music later on.
So these, these men arelike really pivotal.
Sir Daniel (07:49):
They're very pivotal and important.
Um, but I just wanted a little footnote.
I don't want to forgetmusical youth because
Jay Ray (07:56):
Oh, can we talk about them please?
Sir Daniel (07:58):
Who, who like, uh, uh, literally a boy
band out of London, England.
Um, huge.
I mean, and when I sayboys, I literally mean
Jay Ray (08:11):
boys.
They were boys.
These are the children.
Sir Daniel (08:12):
These are children, um, who saw stardom at a very early age
and what, like, became so huge to thepoint that it, um, you know, their,
their careers, it affected them.
You know, clearly.
Um, but they are part of that, uh, whatthat imagination, what America could
(08:33):
see as with Black men becoming thefront men of these huge international
bands and even solo artists.
So they are part of that foundationbecause if you don't have Bob Marley and
the Whalers, you don't have musical youth.
And if you don't havemusical, then you don't have.
(08:54):
Your Billy Oceans and your juniorGriscoms that were all, you know, that
all came along and became huge pop starsin the mid eighties, the early eighties.
Jay Ray (09:04):
The early eighties.
So fun fact, I I I, I, we giveMichael Jackson a lot of love for
how he kind of kicked to open thedoor on like the MTV side of things.
So I think there's just somethingthat I wanna make sure we bring
into the conversation too.
Um, music video madeit easy for this trans.
(09:27):
Made it easy for thistransition to happen, right?
Because first of all, musicvideo in Europe and in the UK in
particular was kind of a medium thatfolks were really familiar with.
Um, because bands, if we think backto Bohemian Rhapsody, like Queen did a
music video in like 19 74, 75, right?
So it was something thatpeople were familiar with.
(09:47):
So it made it easy to kind of likehave this visual to go musical youth.
Actually predated Michael Jackson on MTV.
So when we talk about Black artistsbeing played on MTV, which was Rock and
Roll centered musical youth, predatedMichael Jackson by several months.
(10:09):
Uh, they, so musical youth is actuallythe first Black artist that MTV played.
It wasn't, we give Michael Jackson a lotof, a lot of love 'cause it was huge.
But it was actually musicalyouth that cracked open
that door.
Sir Daniel (10:22):
And see, once again, nobody's talking about this, this
British invasion, um, that happened.
You know, Billy Ocean is, um,most of everybody knows everybody.
Most of these groups areJamaican from Jamaica.
Billy Ocean is Trinidadian and, um,which is, which was huge at the time.
(10:43):
And like you were saying, his,the music was super r and b.
Like you see Knights is rightbehind me and stay the night.
Those are like major r and b, bigr and b records that you can play.
In any cool eighties RB set tothis day, I mentioned Junior
Griscom Griscom, who I found out.
(11:04):
So he's, he's British, born and raised,but of course he has Jamaican parents and
we all know Junior from, um, mama usedto say, which was a huge, huge record.
Jay Ray (11:16):
can hear it right now on classic r and b radio, somewhere in this country.
Sir Daniel (11:20):
absolutely it's, um, sampled, been sampled.
In positive case.
I got a man.
Um.
So much to say about junior gifts and Idon't think he gets a lot of love that,
the love that he should, but again, he'ssomeone that pushed that pop envelope so
that you can get, so that room can be madefor an Eddy Grant who is out of Guyana.
(11:46):
Which is, I, I have torepresent for Guyana.
That's where my, um, my mother is fromand our family and is from Guyana.
And I didn't even know that until I becamean adult that Eddy Grant was Guyanese.
And that's such a huge deal becausethere aren't, there aren't any.
Any other major, major popstars from Guyana that you can
(12:06):
pop, that you can point at?
I mean, there's lots of different,um, bands and whatnot, and there
are people of Guyanese descent.
There's some MCs that are of Guyanesedescent, but, uh, we're talking
Eddy Grant, if you don't remember,rocked us down to Electric Avenue.
That song is still tothis day, is a monster.
(12:29):
Is a monster jam.
It marries rock.
It is marries punk.
It marries, ska.
Um,
Jay Ray (12:36):
wave.
It's all in there.
Sir Daniel (12:39):
all in there and he continues that Rastafarian, um.
He brought that Rastafarian culturewith him as well because he was very, he
represented in the music videos of funny.
Jay Ray was telling me a very funny storyabout how that that video freaked him
Jay Ray (12:57):
freaked Electric Avenue.
So I was a MTV kid.
Um, and so I remember when ElectricAvenue was playing on MTV, I was
fortunate in that we had cable early.
I. I remember when Electric Avenuewas playing on MTV as like a new
song, and it was something aboutthe colors, the, the, the, the
(13:20):
amalgamation of sounds and there waslike a water theme that freaked me out.
'cause he like falls into the waterand then ends up on the beach.
I don't know why that video scared meso much, but as a kid it really did.
But I wanna lift up something that.
You mentioned going back tothat amalgamation of sounds.
(13:40):
First of all two things Eddy Grantproduced, wrote, and produced that record.
Sir Daniel (13:45):
That whole
Jay Ray (13:46):
And Guyana like, so, like this is like squarely, I think in Guyana.
Don't quote me on that.
Y'all let me, let us know in thecon in the, in the, the chat.
But I really do think he like went backto Guyana and like did this record.
So it's really kind of, uh,uh, a self, it's self produced.
Self written, which is great for Eddy.
Grant, you got a huge hit off that bro.
(14:08):
I want, I hope you're still collectingyour checks, but it married.
All of these things thatwere kind of like catnip.
So those striking keyboards, the, the,the, the, the, the big guitar, the,
Sir Daniel (14:25):
Mm-hmm.
Jay Ray (14:25):
what I'm saying of for rock and roll, and then you get the
little, the little whispers of the,the reggae happening, um, as well.
So it's, it was literally catnipand that particular song became
just like it was everywhere.
Now he did have, um.
Which you, which you reminded me of,romancing the Stone, which was apparently
(14:48):
supposed to be closely associatedwith the film, ended up not happening.
So there's like a song RomancingThe Stone by Eddy Grant that was
supposed to be attached to thefilm, romancing the Stone, but they
ended up somehow getting separated.
But Eddy Grant in the, the, the early1980s in the US was one of those
(15:08):
artists that came out of this canon.
Who, uh, was groundbreaking?
Sir Daniel (15:13):
So speaking of romancing the stone, shout out to Billy Ocean again,
who also had a major hit with the gowhen the going gets tough for the, which
appeared on the sequel of Romancing theStone, which is jewel of the N. Correct.
Jay Ray (15:30):
Yep.
Yep.
Sir Daniel (15:31):
So, uh, that to have for both of these gentlemen to have songs
associated with these major motionpictures, still huge moves, and, and
pushing the pa, pushing the envelope.
For more men of Caribbean descent tocome on the scene and, you know, we can't
(15:52):
get away from Billy Ocean's hits though.
Like we talk about the pop standards.
We, you talked about, we hadthe RB standards that he came
out with that were super funky.
Then he, he went into this pop directionthat we could not escape from Caribbean
Queen, first of all, on a, on a,on a musical side, Caribbean Queen.
(16:15):
Um, blends in with, um, MichaelJackson's, Billie Jean Marvelously.
So all you DJs out there, that's for you.
You're welcome.
Um, Caribbean Queen and Billie Jean,they rhyme and they sound good when you
blend them together, but that song wason the charts forever, so we had that.
But can we, we talk about the ballads.
(16:38):
He had that Ballad rivals anything thatLion Lionel Richie had on the radio
at the time suddenly was everywhere.
Jay Ray (16:46):
everywhere it, so I think the thing, and this is something that Quincy
Jones used to talk about a lot, um.
Is ear candy
Sir Daniel (16:56):
Mm-hmm.
Jay Ray (16:57):
Caribbean queen, and suddenly were like ear candy.
They had like these repeatable singsongy, uh, things that you just
couldn't get outta your head, likeliterally Caribbean queen to this day.
It plays in my head, it looksand sounds like summer of 1984.
(17:21):
Like it look like when I hear it,it's like I'm suddenly, uh, uh, seven.
I'm suddenly seven.
And um, oh, real quick, sir. Daniel, andthis is a tangent, but I'm gonna go here.
I love how we say Caribbean and Caribbean.
I don't know what.
Sir Daniel (17:38):
Oh,
Jay Ray (17:40):
but no, I'm saying that it depends on where you, and that's
what I was, had to get in my head.
I'm like, oh, it dependson where you from.
It is how you say it.
But I always thought that was funny.
I'm like, I don't know which way to do it.
Right.
And I'm guess like they're both right.
Sir Daniel (17:53):
say both.
Yeah, they're interchangeable.
And this is somebody whois of Caribbean descent.
Like I've heard it all, both, all my life.
Caribbean and Caribbean.
It just depends on who's sayingit to you, but shout out to, um,
Keith Vincent who produced thatsong also from Trinidad and Tobago.
So this is, this whole thing was in-house.
All of these hits were in-house, um, made.
(18:16):
Um, there was somethingelse I was going to make.
Oh, speaking of Caribbean Queen,Jay Ray, we discovered and I
actually saw the record myself.
Jay Ray (18:24):
this is hilarious.
Sir Daniel (18:25):
once.
Did you all know that Caribbeanqueen was such a major hit that, Hmm?
That the record labels insisted
Jay Ray (18:36):
Consistent.
Sir Daniel (18:36):
that Billy Ocean created, um, different versions for different
countries or different, um, continents.
So there is in fact aversion called European
Jay Ray (18:47):
There is a European queen.
Sir Daniel (18:51):
Is so in this kind, in this climate that we're living in today
is very telling and, and problematic.
Um, but we're not gonna, this is a funshow, we're not gonna delve into that,
but there's a reason why they probablyinsisted that he make a Caribbean Queen
Jay Ray (19:07):
oh yeah.
Sir Daniel (19:08):
and I'm Sure
Jay Ray (19:09):
it.
Sir Daniel (19:10):
Go ahead.
Jay Ray (19:11):
No, no, no.
I'm like, oh, you know, they were sittingthere like, okay, so Billy, but you
know this, so there's a, a, a Europeanqueen, and I didn't know this either
until I was getting ready for this show,but there's an African queen too, but
it's specifically for South Africa.
So South Africa needed their onlytheir own version of Caribbean Queen.
Sir Daniel (19:30):
which South Africans, but go
Jay Ray (19:31):
know, you know exactly which South Africans that was for, 'cause we
were still in apartheid at that point.
Sir Daniel (19:37):
Hmm.
Jay Ray (19:39):
And yeah, so,
Sir Daniel (19:42):
But anyway,
Jay Ray (19:42):
right.
So that song, um, it was, it was set upto be an international crossover success.
So they set that song up and Billy Ocean.
So I have this up, sir Daniel, because.
I didn't know this.
Uh, this is according to the Wikipedia,but uh, Billy Ocean won the ASCAP Pop
(20:10):
Awards seven times between 1986 and 1989.
Seven Caribbean Queen Lover Boy suddenly.
There'll be sad songs to make you cry.
Listen, that is like a classicsixties, like, oh my God, when the
going gets tough, the tough get going.
Love is forever, and Ithink his last big pop hit.
(20:34):
Get Outta My Dreams.
Sir Daniel (20:36):
and get into my car,
Jay Ray (20:38):
that was a hilarious title.
Sir Daniel (20:40):
my dream.
And of course, you know, that madethat, made it to, um, wall Street and
was in car commercials and everything.
So y'all, we know Billy Ocean isthat man like Billy OSHA pretty.
If we gonna think about it, BillyOcean gave all the brothers here in
the eighties a run for their money.
(21:00):
I'm telling you, Lionel Richie,Stevie Wonder, Michael Jackson,
uh, Billy Ocean was giving thema run for the money big time.
And Jay Ray, we don't if we, so likeyou said, um, what year was that?
That, um, get out of my
Jay Ray (21:15):
Get
outta my dreams.
Get into my car.
Let me see when that was released.
That was released in 1988and produced by Mutt Lang.
I'm sorry, written by Oh yeah.
Produced by Mutt Lang.
Written by Billy
Ocean and Mutt Lang.
Sir Daniel (21:30):
Hmm.
So fast forward, so 88.
So it took about a good fouryears before we had another.
Jay Ray (21:41):
Another British
Sir Daniel (21:42):
Another British invasion of Caribbean descent with Maxi Priest.
Jay Ray (21:49):
Yes.
Sir Daniel (21:50):
and Maxi Priest literally came along and was like, when he
came, when he came through with closeto you, it, it felt so familiar.
It was like, it, it literally,it, it felt like Billy Ocean
was still singing on this.
Like, we can hear BillyOcean, we can hear, um.
(22:11):
Uh, Bob Marley and those, and then theway Maxi Priest presented Rastafari Eye.
Super long locks.
But this song was so tender and sobeautifully produced, um, that gave us
that, that nice, um, I call it the Soulto soul groove, the Nelly Hooper kind
of groove behind it, which made it verypalatable to us here in the United States.
Jay Ray (22:35):
So close to you for me once again.
Um, much like, uh, uh, Caribbean Queen.
Smells and feels like 1990,like it's a summertime.
It's a song that reminds meof a specific period of time.
I don't know if the memory thatI'm about to share is true, but
it's the memory that I feel themost when I, when I hear that song.
(22:59):
So by then I am 12 or 13.
So the way I would go to sleep.
Is I would play the radio, so Ialways had like a, the radio next to
my bed and so I would play the radioand typically overnight on, uh, uh,
radio At the time it would be SoulJams, miss pretty much, and relaxing
(23:21):
music all night long during the week.
And I remember on like the QuietStorm, on Power 99, first hearing
this song and it was just like.
This, what is this?
This is beautiful.
It just felt so soothing in a time whenhip hop was taking over everything.
(23:46):
You had this song kind of sneak inand had this beautiful melody and,
um, and, and still that hook to thisday just kind of sends me to a place.
It is an absolute gorgeous song.
Sir Daniel (24:02):
It is.
And again, because when you write a songlike that, when you produce a song in
that nature, that way it's timeless.
That like I, I, I can play that song.
It came out in 1990.
I can play that song todayin a new Jacks swing set.
(24:23):
Uh, uh, a slow jam set and itgoes off people still and it
still resonates with people.
It's beautiful.
And so shout out to Maxi Priest, um,who I believe also did a duet with
the last brother that we're gonnatalk about, which is Shaa ranks,
Jay Ray (24:41):
Yes.
Sir Daniel (24:43):
I think she ranks might have been the last.
Might have been thelast Caribbean invasion.
Caribbean super mega superstar.
That we saw.
I mean, we had, you know, you had yourboogies and whatnot o over that, but I
think Shaba ranks had an impact in theUnited States that was unlike anybody
(25:06):
else, because in the, in nine, thatperiod between 90 to 93, 94 sha ranks
was on fire when tingling came out.
There was people that hadnever been to Jamaica, had
never even had a Jamaican beef.
Patty were singing that song,tingling Like it was this.
(25:26):
I mean, it was a fantastic song,but Shaba Ranks had also had mega
crossover appeal with ballads.
This, y'all need to, y'allgotta put some ballots out guys.
The ballots are what will take you overand will give you longevity, but Mr.
Lover Man.
Jay Ray (25:44):
Yeah.
Sir Daniel (25:45):
Was Shabba.
I mean, it also made, it also gaveus comedy gold because they lampoon
that on, um, in living color.
But yeah, so Shaba Ranks camearound and lemme tell you something,
when Shaba performs today crazy,the response is still just as
crazy as it was in the nineties.
Jay Ray (26:08):
yeah.
You know?
I'm so glad we get a chance to justkind of lift up, uh, Shaaba ranks
because yeah, he um, he took all of thisstuff that had come before and mixed
in the dance hall piece 'cause we wereby now in that, that moment in time.
Um, so it still felt familiar, butit also felt like really new and.
(26:33):
Shopper ranks spawned the then,uh, uh, uh, American need to
have like a reggae rhyme on likeevery album in the early 1990s.
So you were either doing, you eitherhad a reggae influenced song, or you
were doing a rap, or somebody wasdoing a rap that kind of reminded
(26:57):
you of what Shabba Ranks was doing.
Um, he had a huge, huge impact.
On the moment.
Sir Daniel (27:04):
Huge impact.
Kick down the doors and then like youwere saying, then you got, you open
the door, then we can get a SuperCAT,we get a ou, we get a red rat.
We get all these people that, likeyou said, show up on these remixes,
especially a lot of hip hop remixes.
Then you have everybodydoing hybrids, mad Lion.
Jay Ray (27:23):
Yep.
Sir Daniel (27:24):
Um, and then you get re reggae remixes of hip hop songs, and then you
get reggae remixes of, uh, r and b songs.
So again, these brothers came in andchanged the game in their own lanes.
So as we wrap up, um, we don't wanna.
I know you're probably thinking like,how can you not talk about loose ends?
(27:44):
We can't.
We haven't.
We didn't forget about CarlMcIntosh from Loose Ends.
I couldn't con, I couldn't, um,confirm his descent, but I'm
willing to bet dollars to donuts.
There's some Caribbeanconnection in there.
There's some Caribbean bloodclanking around in those veins.
But shout out to Carl McIntosh.
And the, um, loose ends crew whois still doing his thing in the uk.
(28:07):
Um, again, another impactful group on,uh, r and b and here in the United States.
So, so that was your, um, lesson,kids on the British, the Caribbean,
British invasion of the earlyeighties into the nineties.
Jay Ray (28:23):
yeah.
Go back and play these songs,y'all, all of them be bopping.
So, uh, in fact, we should put outa playlist so that y'all can, uh,
check out, uh, some of the joints.
Um, but
Sir Daniel (28:36):
the going gets tough.
Jay Ray (28:38):
duh, when is, listen, Billy OSHA was killing the game, so, um.
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(28:58):
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You could get over to our substackbecause we have a whole bunch of
stuff over on our Substack as well.
You can become a member.
If you wanna do, you cando all the things, do them.
All right.
Also, you could shop ourstore@store.queuepoints.com.
Excuse me.
We appreciate y'all.
(29:19):
We love y'all.
Thanks for
hanging out with us,
Sir Daniel (29:21):
We certainly do, and as I say in every episode
in this life, you have a choice.
You can either pick up the needleor you can let the record play.
I'm DJ Sir Daniel.
Jay Ray (29:29):
and my name is Jay Ray.
Sir Daniel (29:31):
And this has been Queue Points podcast, dropping
the needle on Black music history.
We will see you on thenext go round, Shaba.
Jay Ray (29:40):
Peace.
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