September 27, 2023 • 49 mins
Hello and welcome to another episode of Rad Mom Radio!
This week my guest is Lindsey Rowe Parker. Lindsey is the author of the award-winning book about sensory differences, Wiggles, Stomps and Squeezes Calm My Jitters Down. A mom with a home full of neurodivergent minds, she is embracing the next phase of parenting while learning to navigate and advocate for her autistic daughter. With a recent adult diagnosis of ADHD, and a new deeper understanding of her own sensory experiences, she has begun to delve into the neurodiversity community learning all she can from neurodivergent voices.
Lindsey is also the creator of the #SensoryStories campaign that brings together authors, illustrators, educators, and advocates to raise awareness of sensory differences during Sensory Awareness Month this October. The aim is to increase mainstream understanding of the importance of sensory integration and processing.
You can learn all about Lindsey and her work on her website - www.wigglesstompsandsqueezes.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Natalie (00:06):
Hello and welcome to rad mom radio a podcast
dedicated to moms and all theirfavorite topics My name is
natalie and i'm your host Helloand welcome back for another
(00:29):
episode of rad mom radio thisweek.
My guest is lindsey roe parkerLindsay is an author based in
Bakersfield, California, whichis actually just two hours south
of where I live, so it waspretty cool to make that
connection.
Lindsay is a mom to two kids,her daughter is diagnosed with
(00:50):
autism, and Lindsay herself hasan adult diagnosis of ADHD.
Lindsay is the author of theaward winning book about sensory
differences.
It's called Wiggles, Stomps, andSqueezes Call My Jitters Down.
Lindsey is also the creator ofthe hashtag Sensory Stories
Campaign that brings togetherauthors, illustrators,
(01:14):
educators, and advocates toraise awareness of sensory
differences during SensoryAwareness Month in October.
This aim is to increasemainstream understanding of the
importance of sensoryintegration and processing.
So if you go to Lindsay'swebsite, it's
wigglestompsandsqueezes.
com, you'll find a sectiontitled, Hashtag Sensory Stories
(01:39):
List, and it'll give you a listof over 20 kids books about
sensory differences.
Her website is really fantastic.
It has all kinds of stuff on it.
You'll also find under the ReadAloud Voices tab, three
different YouTube videos of thebook being read aloud.
So there's one of Lindsayreading the book in English, and
(02:01):
then there's her...
So Lindsay hired someone to...
Translate the book into Spanish.
So you'll find a video of herreading the book in Spanish.
And then there's also a video ofthe book in American Sign
Language.
So it's very accessible, whichis really cool.
(02:22):
So definitely check out.
Lindsey's website.
There's all kinds of stuff tolook at there and you can also
find out on the website where tograb your own copy of Wiggles,
Stomps, and Squeezes.
In this episode, Lindsey and Italked a lot about her book and
we went a bit into thebackground of What inspired her
to write this book and whatthings were important for her to
(02:45):
include in the book.
Lindsay's very passionate aboutlike representation and, you
know, learning from autisticadults, her.
Illustrator is autistic, whichis really cool, and the
illustrations are just really, Idon't know, they're very lively
and engaging.
(03:06):
So I really love theillustrations, and I love that
it's translated into Spanish.
I think that's so cool.
And we really talked a lotabout, like, the nature of
sensory differences, and theneven about our own sensory
issues as adult women with ADHD.
And kind of like what thatprocess is to learn about your
(03:27):
own sensory issues after youhave a child that's diagnosed
with autism, which comes alongwith sensory issues.
So this was a really, really funconversation.
I enjoyed it so much justgetting to know Lindsay and.
Just getting to chat with her.
I really hope that you love theepisode.
Also.
(03:47):
This is my interview withLindsey Rowe Parker Hi Lindsey,
welcome to rad mom radio.
Hi.
Thanks for having me Yeah.
Thank you for joining me todayfrom Bakersfield.
(04:08):
Yes! It's sunny, sunnyBakersfield.
I know.
Yeah.
So I think you're my firstperson that like I've, because
sometimes I find guests locally,I'll find guests, you know,
online.
And I think you're my firstperson that I found online that
just happened to be inBakersfield, which is like.
Barely two hours away fromFresno.
(04:29):
So I thought that was reallyfunny.
I know.
So I don't need to, sometimes Ilike to ask like, you know,
what's it like there?
I don't need to ask you that.
Cause I already know.
So, but I do have someicebreaker questions for you.
And they are kind of related towhat we're going to be talking
about today.
(04:50):
And you know, what you do forwork, which is writing your
children's book author.
So I always like to know likepeople's favorites, you know,
when it comes to movies, shows,books what is one of your
favorite books?
Lindsey (05:10):
So, I have so many favorite books as far as
children's books, mm-hmm.
you know, some of the classicones.
I think one of my favorite onesas a kid was the, the one with.
Grover.
It's like the monster.
I love them.
But since becoming an authormyself, I have, you know, gotten
so much further into the kid litcommunity, which is children's
(05:34):
literature.
And I've discovered so many newthings.
And so it really has expanded mykind of awareness of all the
different types of books thatthere are out there for kids.
It's not just those classic onesthat you know of.
There's so many more.
And one of the reallyinteresting things that I have
noticed over the last couple ofyears is the amount of, you
(05:55):
know, neurodivergent charactersin books.
When I first started writingWiggles, Thumps, and Squeezes
Calm My Jitters Down a couple ofyears ago, there weren't that
many.
And in the last few years, the,the increase in neurodivergent
characters and autistic creatorsand just the accessibility of
(06:16):
those storylines has been, Soexciting.
I know this is a very longwinded way of telling you what
my favorite books are, but Ihave a whole list now that I
keep of all sensory, you know,books that deal with sensory
differences for children.
And so I love getting newrecommendations and adding to
those lists.
(06:36):
And so I don't know if I couldpick one right now but.
I'm always on the lookout fornew ones and we're, I feel like
we're really lucky in the factthat there's so many, you know,
autistic and nerd virgincreators out there that are able
to then get their stories intothe hands of kids and make them
feel less alone.
Natalie (06:58):
Are you a big reader, would you say?
Lindsey (07:01):
I feel like I'm reading less now that I have like five
jobs and kids.
Someday I would like to maybe goback to that, but I'm honestly
right now, I'm kind of drowninga little bit but in all good
things.
So no, not right now.
Yeah.
I'm reading
Natalie (07:20):
kids books.
Yeah.
So you have, so your book,Wiggles, Stomps and Squeezes,
Calm My Jitters Down, is thatyour only book or do you have
other books that you've
Lindsey (07:31):
authored?
That was the first one that wasreleased in 2020.
The reception was really, reallygood.
And exciting.
So we decided to make a seriesout of it.
So the second one we'll bereleasing here shortly, Wiggle
Stomps and Squeezes, Calming MyJitters at School.
It is the same character kind ofthe same format of the book.
(07:55):
But it's in a differentlocation.
Obviously it's school.
And I'm really excited aboutthat one.
We're going to do, you know,Wiggle Stomps and Squeezes,
Calming My Jitters at theDentist, Calming My Jitters at
the Holidays.
We're going to, Those haven'tbeen written yet, but that's
kind of the path that we'regoing on to kind of take those,
those moments that can sometimesbe challenging and kind of
(08:18):
explore them a little bit andnot necessarily explore them in
that.
Because I don't necessarily needto add drama to anyone's life,
but more of like examples ofchallenges with supportive
adults and supportivestrategies.
If that makes sense, I am.
(08:40):
I have been told by some.
Publishers that my stories aretoo quiet.
And I, I don't necessarilyagree.
And I don't know if you alwaysneed to just like jam a story
full of drama.
There's enough drama in ourlives anyway.
So I feel like having a loving,quiet.
(09:01):
Story about real stuff is justas impactful as, you know, a
full blown drama.
Yeah.
Natalie (09:09):
Yeah.
I want, I mean, it sounds like,are they wanting like that story
arc or there's like that, youknow, like something blows up,
like, you know, the child goesto an event and they have a
sensory, you know, overloadexperience.
And then, I mean, I could seethat, but also that's kind of
(09:30):
like.
Puts the focus on the, likeyou're saying, like on the drama
instead of like the person, youknow, learning about the other
elements, like, Oh, I do havesupport and I can learn how to
cope with these things.
And that's interesting.
And there
Lindsey (09:50):
are, I mean, there's definitely a challenge in each
of the books.
But it's, it doesn't get blownso far out of proportion that
it's uncomfortable for thereader, you know, it's, it's
more of a, Oh, there's a kid.
Hi.
It's, it's more of like, Oh,I've.
I've felt that.
I understand that.
That's me too.
(10:10):
I've been in that position.
It's more of that kind of youknow, challenge.
I
Natalie (10:15):
think, yeah, I mean, I, I could see why they would want
that because maybe they feellike that's what like attracts
readers, but I also know so manymoms who would just love
something to be able to helptheir kids understand, you know,
like as moms of autistic kids,you know, social stories are a
big thing.
So a lot of times you're like,Oh, we're going to have this new
(10:37):
experience.
Does anyone have a social storyfor it?
So like having a set of booksthat you could just like have at
home, like that's the perfectsocial story.
Holidays are huge.
So I think that's so exciting.
I, I think that would be such agreat book because holidays are
such a pain in the butt.
(10:58):
Anyways, and then when youinvolve, you know, having to
teach the whole family, how tohonor somebody's need for, you
know, timeouts and foods andlike smells and how long are we
going to stay and all thesethings.
So that's, that's really cool.
And I agree that like, justhaving a nice quiet story that's
(11:22):
more focused on teaching andless on like turmoil, see that,
that'd be pretty cool.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, I guess maybe people whohaven't experienced it wouldn't
understand, like you reallydon't need all the hype.
There's enough hype.
Like when you, when you bring akid to a Thanksgiving that will
(11:45):
only eat chicken nuggets, likeyou've got enough to work with
there, you know, withoutanything else, you know.
And
Lindsey (11:52):
another thing that we really wanted to do in this
book, and I say, we, I mean,myself and my illustrator, who
is absolutely incredible.
Oh,
Natalie (12:01):
I saw that not to interrupt you on your website.
I love that.
So your illustrator is autistic.
Yes.
Lindsey (12:07):
Yeah.
And we really wanted to makesure that the.
The parental figures or theadults in these stories and the
child's life were positiverepresentations of support.
And so it's not, you know,there's not going to be a whole
lot of weird, crazy things thatare happening.
It's a reaction to a sensorystimulus and really great
(12:31):
parental and adult support onhow to get that child through
that.
experience.
So it's not super blatant, Idon't think, but when you step
back and look at it from, youknow, an adult's perspective,
you're like, Oh, okay.
Yeah.
This that's kind of modeling alittle bit also.
And we wanted to make sure thatthat was positive
(12:53):
representation.
Natalie (12:56):
That's really cool.
Is that something that you andyour illustrator, I can't
remember their name, but is thatsomething that the two of you
sort of discussed and kind offigured out how you wanted to
display that or demonstratethat?
Lindsey (13:12):
I don't think we actually discussed it.
I think it just kind oforganically came about with the
way that we wanted to representStories of, of neurodivergent
people they themselves areautistic.
It's Rebecca Burgess.
And so their approach to thesetypes of stories is just, it's
so authentic and it comes from aplace of vulnerability.
(13:35):
And I mean, they took the wordsthat I wrote on a page.
And just brought everything tolife.
And I, I, it was more than Icould have ever imagined or
expected.
And so I always tell Bex thatthere, Bex is the nickname for
Rebecca Burgess.
(13:56):
They're my hero for that, youknow, completely took what I
wrote and made magic from it.
Something that I could not havedone myself.
Natalie (14:06):
Yeah.
I, I thought your website andthe illustrations are really
beautiful and very expressive.
So they did a great job.
With that.
And then I also saw that, or Ialso saw that you had someone
translated to Spanish, which Ithought was really cool too.
Lindsey (14:23):
That actually that's Laura Fuentes Lopez, she was our
speech language pathologist.
Mm-hmm.
And so she was like a personalfamily friend and, you know,
our, our speech therapist whilewe were going through kind of
all this learning process and soshe got to see the whole process
(14:46):
of, of, you know, writing thebook.
I let her and our occupationaltherapist read it at different
stages.
And then once we published it, Iwas like, I really want this.
Like accessibility is a veryimportant thing to me.
And I realized that I, I havethe ability to, to kind of
increase that accessibility.
And so I just asked her if shewould be willing to translate it
(15:09):
and she did.
And it was such a fun process.
And just to have that personalrelationship with her and our
occupational therapist throughthat process was just super,
super cool.
It was a great experience.
Natalie (15:22):
Yeah.
I will say like, from looking atyour website, I could tell that.
Inclusivity and representationwere very important to you and
the people that you worked withwhen you were.
developing your book, which Ijust thought was really cool.
Even the characters themselves,I, I noticed they seemed like it
was more I guess a broaderrepresentation of people in
(15:43):
general.
So I thought that was reallycool.
Is it hard to, to do that?
Like, is it hard to, like, whenyou're writing or?
Doing something creative thatyou want that you want to sort
of put out there, is it hard tohave those things where you're
like, this is very important tome in my work?
(16:04):
Is it hard, like, cause I knowyou were saying like, you didn't
want it to be super dramatic andthey kind of pushed back.
Is it hard to have those thingswhere you're like, this is
important to me to, to put outthere?
Do you get a lot of resistanceand stuff like that?
Lindsey (16:21):
From my personal experience, yes.
I think I shopped around themanuscript for at least a year
before anybody bit on it.
And I think part of that wasbecause it was a quiet story.
I think part of it also was veryniche.
And Without the illustrations,it didn't make a whole lot of
(16:44):
sense if you've neverexperienced you know, sensory
differences or had, you know,neurodivergent loved ones that
you've seen them experience iteither.
So I think there was kind of alittle bit of like, Oh, that's
cute, but I don't know what itis.
When I finally found mypublisher.
And this again was before we hadillustrations she has an
(17:06):
autistic grandchild.
And so when she read it, and Ididn't know this at the time,
but when she read it, sheconnected with the story
immediately and was like, thisis my grandchild.
This is, we experienced this.
Yes.
I want to do this.
And the really exciting partabout working with the publisher
that I'm with, which is BQB.
I got to choose my illustrator,which was like, that was so key
(17:30):
in this whole puzzle.
And so I went onto Twitter.
This was like, you know, 20,2019, maybe 2018, something like
that.
I went onto Twitter and Istarted looking up autistic and
neurodivergent illustrators andartists, and I found Beck's and
they had done.
(17:51):
This really beautiful and simpleto understand comic about
understanding the spectrum.
And I don't know if you've seenthat before, but it's basically
takes the spectrum, which a lotof people look at as linear and
put that circle.
And just reading through that, Iwas like, Oh, this is the
person.
(18:11):
This is the person that I want.
And so I sent them a message andI was like, Hey, I'm thinking
about doing this book here.
Here's the manuscript.
Would you consider partnering ona project?
And you know, they said yes.
And I did like a dance all bymyself in my office.
And cause it just, it meant thatthe like nugget of an idea that
(18:33):
I had was.
It was resonating with peoplewith that actual lived
experience.
And so that was such a hugemoment in this whole process.
And since then, I mean, we neverspoke on the phone.
I think the first time we evertalked to each other, other than
email was when we did aninterview together.
(18:54):
And it might've been, I said, wewere on NPR together and we'd
never spoken on the phone.
It was pretty funny.
It might've been one beforethat, but yeah, we just work
really, really well together.
So I'm very thankful for, forBEX and everything they bring to
the table.
Natalie (19:11):
So, like we said earlier, your book is called
Wiggles, Stomps, and Squeezes,Calm My Jitters Down.
So what would you say, like,what is the story about, and
what inspired you to write thestory?
Lindsey (19:24):
So the story follows a young child, just through a
normal day.
They get dressed, they go to thepark, they, you know, have a
meal.
And it's kind of touches onthose sensory experiences that
everybody has, but most of thetime you don't even notice them
because they're, you know,they're processed normally.
You're not overly sensitive orunder sensitive to any of them.
(19:46):
And so you just don't, itdoesn't register.
And so for this child, they,Feel things very acutely and
some things they love and somethings are really a challenge
for them.
And so we kind of followed themthrough their day, some of the
strategies that they have and.
It's a challenge that theyovercome, which is when they're
(20:08):
in the sandbox and they get sandall over themselves and they
can't get it off.
And so, but the underpinning ofthe entire story is that that
child is never asked to changewho they are and that they are
loved and cherished just howthey are and how they live.
And they're the parents in thestory.
(20:31):
Somebody asked me if.
Mom in the story was me.
And I was like, no mom in thestory is who I hope to be.
Like she is an aspirational momwho just is incredibly
supportive.
And some days, you know, somedays we are all like that.
Right.
And then other days we kind offall short.
And so that is not me.
It is who I hope to be.
(20:51):
And what I strive to be for mykids to be, you know, supportive
in their experience.
Natalie (20:59):
And what would you say, like, inspired you to write a
story like this?
Lindsey (21:04):
I did not.
Set out to write a story aboutsensory differences.
It was not the plan.
I was writing a bunch ofstories.
I think I've written like eightother ones that just, you know,
are in various stages of, of notcomplete.
And just, just for fun.
And I, when I started writingthis one, I was writing just
(21:25):
about little vignettes of thingsthat happened with my little
girl.
My little boy was a little tooyoung at that point, but just
like little, little snippets,little vignettes on the swings,
us at the park, you know, eatingdinner and.
They just kind of morphed over afew months of writing into a
(21:47):
sensory differences story.
So that wasn't the intention tostart out.
But once I had it all laid out,I was like, Oh, that's what this
is.
So it's been I think I said thisearlier when we were chatting
before we started recording thatlike.
You plan stuff and mosteverything in my life has
(22:08):
actually not gone to plan.
None of these things wereplanned.
They just have happened.
Great opportunities have comethrough.
Some of them I've missed, someof them I've grabbed, and I feel
like this was one of those thatjust was able to grab it.
And it's been really excitingand people are responding to it.
And I'm.
(22:28):
Super lucky to have, you know, apublisher that also sees that
and was like, okay, let's makemore.
Because people are, they can seethemselves in the story.
Yeah.
I
Natalie (22:41):
don't think sometimes we realize how much sensory
input has such a huge impact onour lives, like pretty much all
day long.
Yeah, I think, yeah, we don'treally think about it, but
there's, there's so much.
That goes into just regulatingyourself when it comes to like
all the input in yourenvironment, like buzzing
(23:02):
noises, the temperature, likesomething you touch, like those
things have such a huge impacton your ability to function,
which is especially for peoplewho have sensitivities.
But yeah, I don't, I don't thinkwe really spend a lot of time
like acknowledging.
What a big deal that is.
Lindsey (23:20):
It is.
It is.
And, and there are, I have tosay the eight senses.
Do you know about all eight ofthem?
Natalie (23:27):
I actually just talked to a mom recently and I, I can't
remember she said seven.
So maybe you're going to teachme a new one.
Lindsey (23:34):
So I think there's, I mean, If you really dig into the
science part of it, which I, Idon't because I am not, you
know, trained in that area, butI think there's many within
those eight but they havesimplified it down into these
eight, which are, you know, theones that we know, which are,
you know, sight, smell, sound,touch taste, and then there's.
(23:56):
three others.
One of them is inproprioception, which that one
took me forever to figure outhow to say.
That's like your body in space,right?
That's where you are in relationto other things.
And then the other one isvestibular, which is like, if
you think of swinging on a swingor your balance.
That's that kind of feeling.
(24:16):
And then interoception, which isthe feelings inside your body.
So you don't have to go to thebathroom or you are hungry or
thirsty, like being able to, toidentify and differentiate those
types of things.
And so they're, it's not likethey're nuisances.
We all feel them every singleday, but.
(24:37):
Learning that they exist waslike a game changer for me
because so many of the thingsthat I felt as a kid that I
thought were weird or strangeor, you know, all those labels
that you put on things when youdon't understand them you know,
going through this process withmy child through occupational
therapy and just learning aboutour brains and our bodies.
(24:58):
I was like, Oh, Oh.
Oh, that makes more sense.
Like, I'm not weird.
This is just, you know, how mybrain and body function.
And I'm a little more sensitiveto some of the stimuli than some
of my peers were.
And so finally understandingthat at, you know, 38 I think
(25:23):
helped me give a lot more graceto myself.
And then in turn that makes megive a lot more grace to other
people when they're experiencingthat kind of stuff.
So it's kind of like that, youknow, got a parent, parent
yourself first and regulateyourself first.
And I spend a lot of time inlike mom groups and things and I
(25:44):
see a lot of like, how do I, howdo I help my child do this?
How do I help my child do that?
And my first go to always is.
Have you regulated yourselffirst?
Yeah.
Like, where are you?
How are you?
Check in with you first becauseyou will always be able to
support other people better.
(26:05):
You check in and regulateyourself first.
And it sounds like so woo woo,but it's not.
It's not.
It's not.
Cause I, I parent better when Iregulate myself.
Natalie (26:21):
It's actually something that.
You know, it has come up so manytimes in podcasting.
So like, I think at this pointI've talked to like, maybe
somewhere around like 70 momsand you know, like it's
something that doesn't seem likeit, it seems like it should
already be obvious that commonsense, so many moms bring up and
(26:42):
kind of make this connectionbetween like how hard it is to
help your child regulateemotionally when you yourself.
We're never taught how toregulate your own emotions.
And I don't know if it's justlike this generational thing,
you know, that we're all kind oflike in this similar space where
(27:03):
we're parenting children withoutreally having been parented the
way that we needed to beparented.
To parent our childreneffectively.
And so that comes up all thetime.
It's definitely not woo woo.
Like when you're freaking outinternally, and I think as
women, a lot of it's internal.
(27:25):
It's, it's a huge like sidetrack, but have you ever watched
the show Seinfeld?
Did you ever see the episodewhere Elaine's in the subway and
she's freaking out because thesubway shuts down, but she
doesn't say anything out loud.
No.
Ugh, there's this episode whereshe's like, I feel like she's
trying to get to some kind ofevent.
(27:45):
And she's in the subway, itstops, there's people all around
her, she has, there's likesomething she's smelling, but
she's freaking out, like in hermind you hear her, her thoughts,
she's screaming, she's raging,she's freaking out.
Having a full blown meltdown inher head, but externally you see
nothing.
And I feel like, I feel likethat's, as women especially,
(28:09):
that's what we do.
Like, you don't see a lot of it.
95 percent of it is probablyinternal, you know, so, like you
don't.
You don't see us struggling, butwe are.
And so I think, like, when itcomes to trying to teach your
kids how to regulate, like yousaid, like, how are you going to
(28:32):
help anyone regulate when you'refreaking out?
You just can't.
So, it's, I think it's such ahuge thing that, that I think a
lot of us are learning is, howdo we give our kids something
they so desperately need when wedon't really have the tools, you
know?
Lindsey (28:49):
So, yeah, and it, yeah.
So much about the continuallylearning.
And, and I mean, I feel likethat's my, one of my most
important priorities as a mom isto continually learn about,
about parenting, parenting, youknow, and.
(29:11):
Just learn about how my brainand body work and then sharing
that information then with mykids.
So we talk about it all thetime.
Do I have all the answers?
Absolutely not.
I'm never gonna have all theanswers, but we talk about it.
So it's like an awareness thingand we're, we talk about the
feelings in our bodies.
We talk about the things thatare happening outside of us.
(29:31):
We talk about all that stuff sothat they know.
That there's nothing wrong withthem.
We might not know how to addressit at that moment, but we'll
figure it out together.
And that nothing they're feelingor experiencing is wrong.
And so that's kind of how weapproach it.
Cause we're, we're alwayslearning.
Natalie (29:53):
So kind of like, it sounds like some of the, like
the inspiration for your bookcame from like just everyday
situations with your daughter,Hazel, who's diagnosed with
autism.
Yeah.
And Hazel is eight years old.
Lindsey (30:08):
She is she's seven,
Natalie (30:10):
seven.
I'm sorry.
Okay.
Seven.
She's seven years old.
Was that kind of like when youstarted to learn more about like
sensory issues was just in, youknow, working with Hazel.
Lindsey (30:20):
Yes, absolutely.
So it was my occupationaltherapist.
So when we got her diagnosis,she was like a day after her
second birthday.
I mean, she was very little.
And.
You know, like, like manyparents, I went down a Google
rabbit hole immediately and waslike, Oh, what can I do?
(30:41):
What can I do?
I need to, you know, learn allthese things and support her.
And of course we were told to doa whole lot of therapies.
Some of them I found superbeneficial to us.
Some we chose not to continue.
And I'd say the one that wasmost impactful was occupational
therapy for us.
And that is you know, not onlydid it teach me how to help her
(31:05):
and support her, but it taughtme so much about me and.
You know, kind of looking backacross my entire life and then
not long after I got into a caraccident, had a bunch of
neuropsych testing and thenfound out that I had ADHD and I
was neurodivergent.
It's like, this is all kind ofcoming together now, you know,
(31:27):
it's, it's starting to make alot of sense.
And I, I told my parents youknow, that I had been diagnosed
and they were like, oh yeah.
And I was like, what, basicallyit was kind of like everybody
around me knew that I was ADHD,but me, and I was like, well,
(31:49):
that could have been beneficial,but yeah, so it, there was a,
you know, a stigma attached toit and I, I feel like we're
moving farther away from thatnow which is wonderful, but
there was, there was a stigmaattached to it and so it was
kind of like, well, we're justgonna, but.
Not talk about it or not tellher about it to protect me, I
(32:11):
guess.
But that is not the, that's notthe approach that we've taken.
You know, we talk about our, howour brains work every day.
And Hazel knows that she'sautistic and she's excited about
talking about it.
And you know, talk about ourneurodivergence.
Yeah, yeah.
Natalie (32:30):
Do you have the inattentive type of ADHD?
Yes.
Yeah, I think it's interestinglike adult women with ADHD, I
feel like it's talked about solittle that it almost like
catches you by surprise.
Well, not anymore.
Now it feels like a lot of womenare being diagnosed.
But I remember when I firstwould hear someone has ADHD,
(32:53):
like as an adult female.
Yeah.
Come from a psychologybackground and they don't really
talk about that very much.
It's like adult ADD, but it'snot talked about that much.
And if it is, it's more talkedabout like with men, you know,
not so much with women.
So, but that's reallyinteresting that you got a
diagnosis through a car
Lindsey (33:14):
accident.
Yes.
Yeah.
I had I mean, I basically, I wasjust having sensory meltdown.
And my neuropsychologist told mebasically that I had been
masking really well, you know,for the first 30 something
years, but then I also got in acar accident, had a concussion
(33:36):
and had some babies that I hadto, to take care of.
And all of that piled on top ofeach other was just kind of like
a perfect storm of not beingable to function.
And so, I mean, at the.
At the time I was terrifiedbecause I thought I had brain
damage of some sort.
And so I kept going back and youknow, I had anxiety and
depression on top of it and PTSDand all of these things plus
(33:59):
ADHD.
And once we kind of identifiedthose things and I was, you
know, medicated for the anxietyand depression and got those
under control, then I could thenturn my, turn my sights to the
ADHD.
And I was like, and I mean, itall makes sense now.
But it was a, it was a rough wayto figure it out.
(34:21):
But I'm also super grateful thatI did because it kind of changed
the trajectory of, of my lifeand how I.
How I view myself and how I, youknow, give grace to myself and
to my kids.
So it was a blessing indisguise, I guess you could say.
And it was, it was brutal, butI'm happy that it happened.
Natalie (34:44):
Yeah.
So I've been like interviewing alot of moms lately that have
like an adult ADHD diagnosis andI, myself.
I have one too, like I wasrecently diagnosed with ADHD and
something that I've noticed thatyou've kind of brought up a
little bit was the learning howto have grace for yourself.
(35:04):
Because I don't know about you,but like, I've always grown up
just thinking I was weird.
Like there's something wrongwith me.
I'm weird.
Why can't you get over that,Natalie?
Like you make a big deal abouteverything, you're so dramatic.
And it's not just my voice, likeI was kind of told that a lot.
You know, by like, mostly mymother and so like her voice
(35:25):
still, you know, in my head,like, oh, you're so dramatic.
Like, just get over it.
Ignore it.
And there's like always been alot of shame around why is
everything such a big deal foryou?
Why can't you just get over it?
And I think learning that I haveADHD completely.
(35:45):
Reframes everything because duh,that's why it's hard It's like
that's why it's hard like I'mreally not that weird It's just
that like these things that arehard for me There's a whole like
framework for why it makes sensethat it's hard.
And so that's been really nicebecause then That has helped me
(36:10):
still very much in the beginningof it, but to start to learn how
to stop shaming myself forgetting angry when I'm hot.
I hate being hot.
And I live in the, you know, youknow what it's like here in
Central Valley of California.
I feel very angry when I get hotand now I don't have to feel
like a jerk for that.
(36:31):
It's just like, I, now I cankind of like implement
strategies, figure out how do Ideal with that.
And then.
Yeah, so I can definitely relateto that part.
Have there been like differentsensory things for you that have
kind of like Now, with thatframework that you have ADHD,
(36:52):
like you can kind of learn howto cope with it better.
Lindsey (36:58):
Yes, I can identify when things are starting to
shift now.
Instead of just before, youknow, like pushing against
whatever that wave is that'scoming.
And be like, no, now I can kindof ride it and I can identify
it.
And that has helped that that'swith anxiety and depression and
all of those things puttogether.
(37:19):
And ADHD is like.
Once you can name it andidentify it and see it and
understand it, then you can, youknow, help yourself through
whatever that is or change,change direction, change your
environment, whatever that is.
And so you know, I used to besuper impulsive, which I still
(37:40):
am, but now instead of like, Oh,I'm going to quit my job and
change my whole life and movesomewhere.
Which is probably not a greatidea to do when, you know, you
have a family and a mortgage andall those things now I can just
say, okay, I can see what I'mmissing and lacking, and I'm
looking for something.
So instead, I'm going to paint awall instead, you know, looking
(38:01):
for that kind of new I don'tknow, maybe it's a dopamine hit,
I don't know, but it, it keepsme from doing things that are, I
wouldn't say detrimental, butjust the, the ramifications.
Don't have to be as big as Iwould be looking to make them
every time.
And so it's you know, I can seeit coming now.
I'm like, okay, well, let's, youknow, let's go foster a dog.
(38:23):
Let's paint a wall.
Let's rearrange the furnitureand maybe you don't have to
upend your whole life.
If that makes sense.
Natalie (38:28):
Yeah.
No, totally.
I do wish there were easier waysto get those dopamine hits,
like, you know, I've always hadthis thing where like, when it
comes to accumulating things,I've always had this thing where
I don't like to have a lot ofstuff because I love the idea of
just being able to.
(38:49):
To just go, you know?
And I think that fits in withthat, like, just wanting to have
the freedom to, like, like yousaid, upend your whole life.
Not that I've ever done that,but, but yeah, it's like, it's,
it is this, like, I read that wehave this need for novelty.
But then once, like, I don'tknow if you do this, but we're
(39:13):
both creative.
So it's like, you know, you wantto, to learn how to do something
new.
So I've bought so many kits,like I have a freaking basket
weaving kit sitting on my floor.
I researched and researched.
I was on Pinterest for hours,Etsy for hours.
I felt like I had to have itright now.
Bought it and guess what it'sdoing?
(39:34):
It's literally sitting on thefloor collecting dust.
I have not.
I opened it and I looked at allthe things.
I was like, oh, that's cool.
That was like two months ago.
I have not, not woven anything.
Lindsey (39:48):
It's so true.
Natalie (39:49):
Yeah.
And I'm trying to learn how tostop shaming myself for that
too.
It's like.
You know, now that now I getthat.
Okay.
So like you said, where, how canwe find, how can we meet that
need for novelty without buyingsomething that's just going to
sit there?
Painting a wall is a great idea.
(40:11):
So you could do that in a coupleof days.
Lindsey (40:13):
Yeah.
Whenever I get my paint, I havethis big box of paints.
Whenever I get it out, myhusband's like, oh.
Yeah.
Here she goes.
Yeah.
It's hard.
Stay out of my way while I'mpainting something.
Oh my gosh.
That's
Natalie (40:27):
another one too, is like, when you finally are able
to initiate a task, it's like,Don't talk to me.
Don't come near me.
Don't ask me to do anything.
There's just so much to learnabout, about being
neurodivergent, you know?
There's so much, and thankfullyonce you learn it, it's like,
(40:48):
oh, okay, that makes sense.
How can I work with that?
You know, so have you, like inlearning about your own ADHD,
have you learned how to advocatefor your own sensory needs
through that
Lindsey (41:06):
actually just did at work and I, I have not, and I
don't know if I haven't done itbefore or if this one just
really stood out in my mindcause I intentionally did it.
But we were doing someinterviews for.
that we were hiring for and Iwas going to be leading them.
And you might not believe this,but I get really nervous talking
(41:29):
to people.
And so I was like, Oh my God, Ihave to do these interviews
where I'm leading and I'm goingto be, you know, Asking the
questions and so what I asked ofthe team, I was like, instead of
doing the normal you know, justhop on the phone and start
firing questions at thiscandidate, I was like, can we do
a written version?
(41:50):
And then we can use that writtenstrategy or whatever it was, and
we were not asking for free workor anything like that, but you
know, it was kind of like a, aprompt and.
They agreed to do, you know,reformat kind of the, the
discussion and we had them do aprompt and then we walked
through the prompt together andit was so much more clear for, I
(42:14):
believe, everybody that was onthe call we had, you know, Clear
path to, to ask questions andthey felt comfortable sharing
their ideas.
And it was just, it was so nice.
And I was like, Oh my God.
Okay.
So that's, that's how you can doit.
You know, it wasn'tconfrontational.
They didn't have any issues withme doing that or asking for that
(42:36):
change.
And it made everything easierfor the folks that were on the
phone.
So it doesn't seem like a bigdeal, but it felt like such a
big deal.
That's not the typical structureof, you know, an interview.
And so and that just happenedthis past week.
So I was pretty proud of that.
When I texted my sisterimmediately, I'm like, I
(42:56):
advocated for myself.
So it was, it was cool.
Weird to be, you know, now I'min my forties.
That's weird to just finally nowbe learning that.
So I'm hoping, you know, that Ican kind of help my kids.
Start that process sooner than Idid.
Mm hmm, totally.
Natalie (43:16):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I wonder if that's like justpart of.
Life.
I remember when I was like ateenager, I remember my mom
saying something about like, notcaring what people thought of
her.
And I remember thinking like,well, how do you do that?
Like, first of all, that'saudacious.
Like, how do you not care aboutwhat people think?
(43:36):
And then kind of like, secretlylike You know, I would love to
not care what people think, butthen she said that that didn't
really start to happen untilabout her forties.
And so I remember thinking like,well, I don't want to wait till
my forties to not care whatpeople think, because that's
like, you know, half your lifethat now you don't get to have
that freedom of not caring, butthen here I am like approaching
(44:00):
40 and I'm still working throughlike all these things.
So I wonder if that's just likepart of like.
Being a human and, and just whatwe evolve through is, you do
learn these things later andmaybe that's okay.
Like, we can help our kids maybelearn them sooner, but.
I don't know.
Maybe that's just how life is,is that you learn some of these
(44:23):
bigger things later on.
I don't
Lindsey (44:24):
know.
I think some of that also has todo with being confident in your
decisions too, right?
So I know I was not confident inmany of my decisions growing up
and in my early young adultlife.
And now.
I do feel confident when I makea choice.
(44:45):
It's not because I don't knowwhen I just chose something
I've, I've really put in theeffort to understand you know,
what the options were and I hadmade an educated decision.
And so that feels better, youknow, and it makes it easier to.
So then kind of stand yourground a little bit and what
you've chosen.
We've talked a little bit about,you know, generational changes
(45:07):
in parenting.
And, you know, that happens allthe time when my parents are
witnessing me parent differentlythan they did.
And, you know, they, they raisedtheir concerns and I have not
chosen this path lightly.
You know, I, I appreciate, youknow, the parenting that you
(45:27):
have done for me but I'mchoosing a different path.
And it's, it's hard to say thatto them, but at the same time,
I'm, I feel very confident in mydecisions.
Even when they're like pullingtheir hair out, going, what are
you doing?
I'm like, well, come along forthe ride because this is what
I'm doing.
Natalie (45:45):
So, you know, when it comes to like your book and what
you're trying to communicate toyour audience, what would you
say is like the most importantmessage that you want readers to
get from this book?
Lindsey (45:59):
That they're, they're not broken.
All the things that they'refeeling are completely normal.
I mean, the human experience isgoing to be different for
everyone.
But there, you know, sensorydifferences are a very normal
part of life.
And it doesn't mean that.
They're broken or they're wrongor there's something, you know,
(46:21):
weird and that they don't haveto change their strategies and
supports that they can, youknow, find or, or implement that
will help.
But their, their value is justin who they are, just as they
are.
And I think that's probably, Imean, again, that sounds kind of
woo woo, but it's, it is true.
(46:43):
That's it.
Like you're, you're valuablejust as you are not.
Not if you just change a couplethings.
Just as you are.
I love that.
Natalie (46:54):
So where can we, like, find out more about what you do?
Like, what's your website?
How can we find you on socialmedia?
Where can people grab your book?
Lindsey (47:03):
My website is Wiggles, Stomps and Squeezes dot com.
It will have the links to thatgreat list that I told you about
with all the sensory differencesbooks.
It will have links to my WiggleStomps and Squeezes Calm My
Jitters Down in English andSpanish.
The new book is already for presale, Wiggle Stomps and Squeezes
(47:24):
Calming My Jitters at School.
And then I also have an activitybook that kind of goes with any
of the books in the series.
And it has a bunch of sensoryactivities that you can do in a
classroom or at home.
We have made it a point to, tomake the copyright on that one.
So that anybody can copy pagesand use it and in any kind of
(47:44):
institutional or educationalsetting I was very, very clear
with my publisher that I waslike, I want people and teachers
and, and families to be able tocopy this thing and use it
however they want to, and not,you know, have to buy multiple
copies to use something.
So that is a resource availableand it's all, everything is on
(48:05):
Amazon, but then.
Basically, any of those any ofthose online booksellers, so
like Barnes and Noble or Books aMillion Target, Walmart, they're
all on their online websites.
Not a whole lot in physicalbrick and mortar stores but
online there's a lot.
Okay.
Cool.
And you can order it throughyour library.
(48:26):
Hmm.
Okay.
Thank you.
Natalie (48:28):
Awesome.
What did your, what did Hazelthink about
Lindsey (48:31):
the book?
Oh, she loves it.
She loves it.
She'll just be like, Oh, it'syour new book.
They did get to read the secondone.
I'm just on my computer cause wehaven't, you know, got any
printed copies yet.
And they can see little.
Little vignettes of their, youknow, their life.
And again, it's not us, it's notthem, but there are things that
(48:53):
have happened to them that arerepresented in the story.
And so they really, they likethat.
And it's pretty cute.
That's
Natalie (49:00):
cool.
It's fun.
Well, thank you so much forcoming on and chatting with me.
I really enjoyed getting to talkto you and learn about you.
And yeah, just thank you so muchfor making the time for me.
Yeah.
Thank you for having me.
Thank you so much for joining methis week for another episode.
I hope that you enjoyed it.
(49:20):
If you'd like to get in contactwith me, you can send me an
email.
My email address is radmomradioat gmail.
com.
You can also find me onInstagram at radmomradio.
Have a great week and I'll talkto you soon.
Bye!
Hello and welcome to rad mom radio a podcast
dedicated to moms and all theirfavorite topics My name is
natalie and i'm your host Helloand welcome back for another
(00:29):
episode of rad mom radio thisweek.
My guest is lindsey roe parkerLindsay is an author based in
Bakersfield, California, whichis actually just two hours south
of where I live, so it waspretty cool to make that
connection.
Lindsay is a mom to two kids,her daughter is diagnosed with
(00:50):
autism, and Lindsay herself hasan adult diagnosis of ADHD.
Lindsay is the author of theaward winning book about sensory
differences.
It's called Wiggles, Stomps, andSqueezes Call My Jitters Down.
Lindsey is also the creator ofthe hashtag Sensory Stories
Campaign that brings togetherauthors, illustrators,
(01:14):
educators, and advocates toraise awareness of sensory
differences during SensoryAwareness Month in October.
This aim is to increasemainstream understanding of the
importance of sensoryintegration and processing.
So if you go to Lindsay'swebsite, it's
wigglestompsandsqueezes.
com, you'll find a sectiontitled, Hashtag Sensory Stories
(01:39):
List, and it'll give you a listof over 20 kids books about
sensory differences.
Her website is really fantastic.
It has all kinds of stuff on it.
You'll also find under the ReadAloud Voices tab, three
different YouTube videos of thebook being read aloud.
So there's one of Lindsayreading the book in English, and
(02:01):
then there's her...
So Lindsay hired someone to...
Translate the book into Spanish.
So you'll find a video of herreading the book in Spanish.
And then there's also a video ofthe book in American Sign
Language.
So it's very accessible, whichis really cool.
(02:22):
So definitely check out.
Lindsey's website.
There's all kinds of stuff tolook at there and you can also
find out on the website where tograb your own copy of Wiggles,
Stomps, and Squeezes.
In this episode, Lindsey and Italked a lot about her book and
we went a bit into thebackground of What inspired her
to write this book and whatthings were important for her to
(02:45):
include in the book.
Lindsay's very passionate aboutlike representation and, you
know, learning from autisticadults, her.
Illustrator is autistic, whichis really cool, and the
illustrations are just really, Idon't know, they're very lively
and engaging.
(03:06):
So I really love theillustrations, and I love that
it's translated into Spanish.
I think that's so cool.
And we really talked a lotabout, like, the nature of
sensory differences, and theneven about our own sensory
issues as adult women with ADHD.
And kind of like what thatprocess is to learn about your
(03:27):
own sensory issues after youhave a child that's diagnosed
with autism, which comes alongwith sensory issues.
So this was a really, really funconversation.
I enjoyed it so much justgetting to know Lindsay and.
Just getting to chat with her.
I really hope that you love theepisode.
Also.
(03:47):
This is my interview withLindsey Rowe Parker Hi Lindsey,
welcome to rad mom radio.
Hi.
Thanks for having me Yeah.
Thank you for joining me todayfrom Bakersfield.
(04:08):
Yes! It's sunny, sunnyBakersfield.
I know.
Yeah.
So I think you're my firstperson that like I've, because
sometimes I find guests locally,I'll find guests, you know,
online.
And I think you're my firstperson that I found online that
just happened to be inBakersfield, which is like.
Barely two hours away fromFresno.
(04:29):
So I thought that was reallyfunny.
I know.
So I don't need to, sometimes Ilike to ask like, you know,
what's it like there?
I don't need to ask you that.
Cause I already know.
So, but I do have someicebreaker questions for you.
And they are kind of related towhat we're going to be talking
about today.
(04:50):
And you know, what you do forwork, which is writing your
children's book author.
So I always like to know likepeople's favorites, you know,
when it comes to movies, shows,books what is one of your
favorite books?
Lindsey (05:10):
So, I have so many favorite books as far as
children's books, mm-hmm.
you know, some of the classicones.
I think one of my favorite onesas a kid was the, the one with.
Grover.
It's like the monster.
I love them.
But since becoming an authormyself, I have, you know, gotten
so much further into the kid litcommunity, which is children's
(05:34):
literature.
And I've discovered so many newthings.
And so it really has expanded mykind of awareness of all the
different types of books thatthere are out there for kids.
It's not just those classic onesthat you know of.
There's so many more.
And one of the reallyinteresting things that I have
noticed over the last couple ofyears is the amount of, you
(05:55):
know, neurodivergent charactersin books.
When I first started writingWiggles, Thumps, and Squeezes
Calm My Jitters Down a couple ofyears ago, there weren't that
many.
And in the last few years, the,the increase in neurodivergent
characters and autistic creatorsand just the accessibility of
(06:16):
those storylines has been, Soexciting.
I know this is a very longwinded way of telling you what
my favorite books are, but Ihave a whole list now that I
keep of all sensory, you know,books that deal with sensory
differences for children.
And so I love getting newrecommendations and adding to
those lists.
(06:36):
And so I don't know if I couldpick one right now but.
I'm always on the lookout fornew ones and we're, I feel like
we're really lucky in the factthat there's so many, you know,
autistic and nerd virgincreators out there that are able
to then get their stories intothe hands of kids and make them
feel less alone.
Natalie (06:58):
Are you a big reader, would you say?
Lindsey (07:01):
I feel like I'm reading less now that I have like five
jobs and kids.
Someday I would like to maybe goback to that, but I'm honestly
right now, I'm kind of drowninga little bit but in all good
things.
So no, not right now.
Yeah.
I'm reading
Natalie (07:20):
kids books.
Yeah.
So you have, so your book,Wiggles, Stomps and Squeezes,
Calm My Jitters Down, is thatyour only book or do you have
other books that you've
Lindsey (07:31):
authored?
That was the first one that wasreleased in 2020.
The reception was really, reallygood.
And exciting.
So we decided to make a seriesout of it.
So the second one we'll bereleasing here shortly, Wiggle
Stomps and Squeezes, Calming MyJitters at School.
It is the same character kind ofthe same format of the book.
(07:55):
But it's in a differentlocation.
Obviously it's school.
And I'm really excited aboutthat one.
We're going to do, you know,Wiggle Stomps and Squeezes,
Calming My Jitters at theDentist, Calming My Jitters at
the Holidays.
We're going to, Those haven'tbeen written yet, but that's
kind of the path that we'regoing on to kind of take those,
those moments that can sometimesbe challenging and kind of
(08:18):
explore them a little bit andnot necessarily explore them in
that.
Because I don't necessarily needto add drama to anyone's life,
but more of like examples ofchallenges with supportive
adults and supportivestrategies.
If that makes sense, I am.
(08:40):
I have been told by some.
Publishers that my stories aretoo quiet.
And I, I don't necessarilyagree.
And I don't know if you alwaysneed to just like jam a story
full of drama.
There's enough drama in ourlives anyway.
So I feel like having a loving,quiet.
(09:01):
Story about real stuff is justas impactful as, you know, a
full blown drama.
Yeah.
Natalie (09:09):
Yeah.
I want, I mean, it sounds like,are they wanting like that story
arc or there's like that, youknow, like something blows up,
like, you know, the child goesto an event and they have a
sensory, you know, overloadexperience.
And then, I mean, I could seethat, but also that's kind of
(09:30):
like.
Puts the focus on the, likeyou're saying, like on the drama
instead of like the person, youknow, learning about the other
elements, like, Oh, I do havesupport and I can learn how to
cope with these things.
And that's interesting.
And there
Lindsey (09:50):
are, I mean, there's definitely a challenge in each
of the books.
But it's, it doesn't get blownso far out of proportion that
it's uncomfortable for thereader, you know, it's, it's
more of a, Oh, there's a kid.
Hi.
It's, it's more of like, Oh,I've.
I've felt that.
I understand that.
That's me too.
(10:10):
I've been in that position.
It's more of that kind of youknow, challenge.
I
Natalie (10:15):
think, yeah, I mean, I, I could see why they would want
that because maybe they feellike that's what like attracts
readers, but I also know so manymoms who would just love
something to be able to helptheir kids understand, you know,
like as moms of autistic kids,you know, social stories are a
big thing.
So a lot of times you're like,Oh, we're going to have this new
(10:37):
experience.
Does anyone have a social storyfor it?
So like having a set of booksthat you could just like have at
home, like that's the perfectsocial story.
Holidays are huge.
So I think that's so exciting.
I, I think that would be such agreat book because holidays are
such a pain in the butt.
(10:58):
Anyways, and then when youinvolve, you know, having to
teach the whole family, how tohonor somebody's need for, you
know, timeouts and foods andlike smells and how long are we
going to stay and all thesethings.
So that's, that's really cool.
And I agree that like, justhaving a nice quiet story that's
(11:22):
more focused on teaching andless on like turmoil, see that,
that'd be pretty cool.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, I guess maybe people whohaven't experienced it wouldn't
understand, like you reallydon't need all the hype.
There's enough hype.
Like when you, when you bring akid to a Thanksgiving that will
(11:45):
only eat chicken nuggets, likeyou've got enough to work with
there, you know, withoutanything else, you know.
And
Lindsey (11:52):
another thing that we really wanted to do in this
book, and I say, we, I mean,myself and my illustrator, who
is absolutely incredible.
Oh,
Natalie (12:01):
I saw that not to interrupt you on your website.
I love that.
So your illustrator is autistic.
Yes.
Lindsey (12:07):
Yeah.
And we really wanted to makesure that the.
The parental figures or theadults in these stories and the
child's life were positiverepresentations of support.
And so it's not, you know,there's not going to be a whole
lot of weird, crazy things thatare happening.
It's a reaction to a sensorystimulus and really great
(12:31):
parental and adult support onhow to get that child through
that.
experience.
So it's not super blatant, Idon't think, but when you step
back and look at it from, youknow, an adult's perspective,
you're like, Oh, okay.
Yeah.
This that's kind of modeling alittle bit also.
And we wanted to make sure thatthat was positive
(12:53):
representation.
Natalie (12:56):
That's really cool.
Is that something that you andyour illustrator, I can't
remember their name, but is thatsomething that the two of you
sort of discussed and kind offigured out how you wanted to
display that or demonstratethat?
Lindsey (13:12):
I don't think we actually discussed it.
I think it just kind oforganically came about with the
way that we wanted to representStories of, of neurodivergent
people they themselves areautistic.
It's Rebecca Burgess.
And so their approach to thesetypes of stories is just, it's
so authentic and it comes from aplace of vulnerability.
(13:35):
And I mean, they took the wordsthat I wrote on a page.
And just brought everything tolife.
And I, I, it was more than Icould have ever imagined or
expected.
And so I always tell Bex thatthere, Bex is the nickname for
Rebecca Burgess.
(13:56):
They're my hero for that, youknow, completely took what I
wrote and made magic from it.
Something that I could not havedone myself.
Natalie (14:06):
Yeah.
I, I thought your website andthe illustrations are really
beautiful and very expressive.
So they did a great job.
With that.
And then I also saw that, or Ialso saw that you had someone
translated to Spanish, which Ithought was really cool too.
Lindsey (14:23):
That actually that's Laura Fuentes Lopez, she was our
speech language pathologist.
Mm-hmm.
And so she was like a personalfamily friend and, you know,
our, our speech therapist whilewe were going through kind of
all this learning process and soshe got to see the whole process
(14:46):
of, of, you know, writing thebook.
I let her and our occupationaltherapist read it at different
stages.
And then once we published it, Iwas like, I really want this.
Like accessibility is a veryimportant thing to me.
And I realized that I, I havethe ability to, to kind of
increase that accessibility.
And so I just asked her if shewould be willing to translate it
(15:09):
and she did.
And it was such a fun process.
And just to have that personalrelationship with her and our
occupational therapist throughthat process was just super,
super cool.
It was a great experience.
Natalie (15:22):
Yeah.
I will say like, from looking atyour website, I could tell that.
Inclusivity and representationwere very important to you and
the people that you worked withwhen you were.
developing your book, which Ijust thought was really cool.
Even the characters themselves,I, I noticed they seemed like it
was more I guess a broaderrepresentation of people in
(15:43):
general.
So I thought that was reallycool.
Is it hard to, to do that?
Like, is it hard to, like, whenyou're writing or?
Doing something creative thatyou want that you want to sort
of put out there, is it hard tohave those things where you're
like, this is very important tome in my work?
(16:04):
Is it hard, like, cause I knowyou were saying like, you didn't
want it to be super dramatic andthey kind of pushed back.
Is it hard to have those thingswhere you're like, this is
important to me to, to put outthere?
Do you get a lot of resistanceand stuff like that?
Lindsey (16:21):
From my personal experience, yes.
I think I shopped around themanuscript for at least a year
before anybody bit on it.
And I think part of that wasbecause it was a quiet story.
I think part of it also was veryniche.
And Without the illustrations,it didn't make a whole lot of
(16:44):
sense if you've neverexperienced you know, sensory
differences or had, you know,neurodivergent loved ones that
you've seen them experience iteither.
So I think there was kind of alittle bit of like, Oh, that's
cute, but I don't know what itis.
When I finally found mypublisher.
And this again was before we hadillustrations she has an
(17:06):
autistic grandchild.
And so when she read it, and Ididn't know this at the time,
but when she read it, sheconnected with the story
immediately and was like, thisis my grandchild.
This is, we experienced this.
Yes.
I want to do this.
And the really exciting partabout working with the publisher
that I'm with, which is BQB.
I got to choose my illustrator,which was like, that was so key
(17:30):
in this whole puzzle.
And so I went onto Twitter.
This was like, you know, 20,2019, maybe 2018, something like
that.
I went onto Twitter and Istarted looking up autistic and
neurodivergent illustrators andartists, and I found Beck's and
they had done.
(17:51):
This really beautiful and simpleto understand comic about
understanding the spectrum.
And I don't know if you've seenthat before, but it's basically
takes the spectrum, which a lotof people look at as linear and
put that circle.
And just reading through that, Iwas like, Oh, this is the
person.
(18:11):
This is the person that I want.
And so I sent them a message andI was like, Hey, I'm thinking
about doing this book here.
Here's the manuscript.
Would you consider partnering ona project?
And you know, they said yes.
And I did like a dance all bymyself in my office.
And cause it just, it meant thatthe like nugget of an idea that
(18:33):
I had was.
It was resonating with peoplewith that actual lived
experience.
And so that was such a hugemoment in this whole process.
And since then, I mean, we neverspoke on the phone.
I think the first time we evertalked to each other, other than
email was when we did aninterview together.
(18:54):
And it might've been, I said, wewere on NPR together and we'd
never spoken on the phone.
It was pretty funny.
It might've been one beforethat, but yeah, we just work
really, really well together.
So I'm very thankful for, forBEX and everything they bring to
the table.
Natalie (19:11):
So, like we said earlier, your book is called
Wiggles, Stomps, and Squeezes,Calm My Jitters Down.
So what would you say, like,what is the story about, and
what inspired you to write thestory?
Lindsey (19:24):
So the story follows a young child, just through a
normal day.
They get dressed, they go to thepark, they, you know, have a
meal.
And it's kind of touches onthose sensory experiences that
everybody has, but most of thetime you don't even notice them
because they're, you know,they're processed normally.
You're not overly sensitive orunder sensitive to any of them.
(19:46):
And so you just don't, itdoesn't register.
And so for this child, they,Feel things very acutely and
some things they love and somethings are really a challenge
for them.
And so we kind of followed themthrough their day, some of the
strategies that they have and.
It's a challenge that theyovercome, which is when they're
(20:08):
in the sandbox and they get sandall over themselves and they
can't get it off.
And so, but the underpinning ofthe entire story is that that
child is never asked to changewho they are and that they are
loved and cherished just howthey are and how they live.
And they're the parents in thestory.
(20:31):
Somebody asked me if.
Mom in the story was me.
And I was like, no mom in thestory is who I hope to be.
Like she is an aspirational momwho just is incredibly
supportive.
And some days, you know, somedays we are all like that.
Right.
And then other days we kind offall short.
And so that is not me.
It is who I hope to be.
(20:51):
And what I strive to be for mykids to be, you know, supportive
in their experience.
Natalie (20:59):
And what would you say, like, inspired you to write a
story like this?
Lindsey (21:04):
I did not.
Set out to write a story aboutsensory differences.
It was not the plan.
I was writing a bunch ofstories.
I think I've written like eightother ones that just, you know,
are in various stages of, of notcomplete.
And just, just for fun.
And I, when I started writingthis one, I was writing just
(21:25):
about little vignettes of thingsthat happened with my little
girl.
My little boy was a little tooyoung at that point, but just
like little, little snippets,little vignettes on the swings,
us at the park, you know, eatingdinner and.
They just kind of morphed over afew months of writing into a
(21:47):
sensory differences story.
So that wasn't the intention tostart out.
But once I had it all laid out,I was like, Oh, that's what this
is.
So it's been I think I said thisearlier when we were chatting
before we started recording thatlike.
You plan stuff and mosteverything in my life has
(22:08):
actually not gone to plan.
None of these things wereplanned.
They just have happened.
Great opportunities have comethrough.
Some of them I've missed, someof them I've grabbed, and I feel
like this was one of those thatjust was able to grab it.
And it's been really excitingand people are responding to it.
And I'm.
(22:28):
Super lucky to have, you know, apublisher that also sees that
and was like, okay, let's makemore.
Because people are, they can seethemselves in the story.
Yeah.
I
Natalie (22:41):
don't think sometimes we realize how much sensory
input has such a huge impact onour lives, like pretty much all
day long.
Yeah, I think, yeah, we don'treally think about it, but
there's, there's so much.
That goes into just regulatingyourself when it comes to like
all the input in yourenvironment, like buzzing
(23:02):
noises, the temperature, likesomething you touch, like those
things have such a huge impacton your ability to function,
which is especially for peoplewho have sensitivities.
But yeah, I don't, I don't thinkwe really spend a lot of time
like acknowledging.
What a big deal that is.
Lindsey (23:20):
It is.
It is.
And, and there are, I have tosay the eight senses.
Do you know about all eight ofthem?
Natalie (23:27):
I actually just talked to a mom recently and I, I can't
remember she said seven.
So maybe you're going to teachme a new one.
Lindsey (23:34):
So I think there's, I mean, If you really dig into the
science part of it, which I, Idon't because I am not, you
know, trained in that area, butI think there's many within
those eight but they havesimplified it down into these
eight, which are, you know, theones that we know, which are,
you know, sight, smell, sound,touch taste, and then there's.
(23:56):
three others.
One of them is inproprioception, which that one
took me forever to figure outhow to say.
That's like your body in space,right?
That's where you are in relationto other things.
And then the other one isvestibular, which is like, if
you think of swinging on a swingor your balance.
That's that kind of feeling.
(24:16):
And then interoception, which isthe feelings inside your body.
So you don't have to go to thebathroom or you are hungry or
thirsty, like being able to, toidentify and differentiate those
types of things.
And so they're, it's not likethey're nuisances.
We all feel them every singleday, but.
(24:37):
Learning that they exist waslike a game changer for me
because so many of the thingsthat I felt as a kid that I
thought were weird or strangeor, you know, all those labels
that you put on things when youdon't understand them you know,
going through this process withmy child through occupational
therapy and just learning aboutour brains and our bodies.
(24:58):
I was like, Oh, Oh.
Oh, that makes more sense.
Like, I'm not weird.
This is just, you know, how mybrain and body function.
And I'm a little more sensitiveto some of the stimuli than some
of my peers were.
And so finally understandingthat at, you know, 38 I think
(25:23):
helped me give a lot more graceto myself.
And then in turn that makes megive a lot more grace to other
people when they're experiencingthat kind of stuff.
So it's kind of like that, youknow, got a parent, parent
yourself first and regulateyourself first.
And I spend a lot of time inlike mom groups and things and I
(25:44):
see a lot of like, how do I, howdo I help my child do this?
How do I help my child do that?
And my first go to always is.
Have you regulated yourselffirst?
Yeah.
Like, where are you?
How are you?
Check in with you first becauseyou will always be able to
support other people better.
(26:05):
You check in and regulateyourself first.
And it sounds like so woo woo,but it's not.
It's not.
It's not.
Cause I, I parent better when Iregulate myself.
Natalie (26:21):
It's actually something that.
You know, it has come up so manytimes in podcasting.
So like, I think at this pointI've talked to like, maybe
somewhere around like 70 momsand you know, like it's
something that doesn't seem likeit, it seems like it should
already be obvious that commonsense, so many moms bring up and
(26:42):
kind of make this connectionbetween like how hard it is to
help your child regulateemotionally when you yourself.
We're never taught how toregulate your own emotions.
And I don't know if it's justlike this generational thing,
you know, that we're all kind oflike in this similar space where
(27:03):
we're parenting children withoutreally having been parented the
way that we needed to beparented.
To parent our childreneffectively.
And so that comes up all thetime.
It's definitely not woo woo.
Like when you're freaking outinternally, and I think as
women, a lot of it's internal.
(27:25):
It's, it's a huge like sidetrack, but have you ever watched
the show Seinfeld?
Did you ever see the episodewhere Elaine's in the subway and
she's freaking out because thesubway shuts down, but she
doesn't say anything out loud.
No.
Ugh, there's this episode whereshe's like, I feel like she's
trying to get to some kind ofevent.
(27:45):
And she's in the subway, itstops, there's people all around
her, she has, there's likesomething she's smelling, but
she's freaking out, like in hermind you hear her, her thoughts,
she's screaming, she's raging,she's freaking out.
Having a full blown meltdown inher head, but externally you see
nothing.
And I feel like, I feel likethat's, as women especially,
(28:09):
that's what we do.
Like, you don't see a lot of it.
95 percent of it is probablyinternal, you know, so, like you
don't.
You don't see us struggling, butwe are.
And so I think, like, when itcomes to trying to teach your
kids how to regulate, like yousaid, like, how are you going to
(28:32):
help anyone regulate when you'refreaking out?
You just can't.
So, it's, I think it's such ahuge thing that, that I think a
lot of us are learning is, howdo we give our kids something
they so desperately need when wedon't really have the tools, you
know?
Lindsey (28:49):
So, yeah, and it, yeah.
So much about the continuallylearning.
And, and I mean, I feel likethat's my, one of my most
important priorities as a mom isto continually learn about,
about parenting, parenting, youknow, and.
(29:11):
Just learn about how my brainand body work and then sharing
that information then with mykids.
So we talk about it all thetime.
Do I have all the answers?
Absolutely not.
I'm never gonna have all theanswers, but we talk about it.
So it's like an awareness thingand we're, we talk about the
feelings in our bodies.
We talk about the things thatare happening outside of us.
(29:31):
We talk about all that stuff sothat they know.
That there's nothing wrong withthem.
We might not know how to addressit at that moment, but we'll
figure it out together.
And that nothing they're feelingor experiencing is wrong.
And so that's kind of how weapproach it.
Cause we're, we're alwayslearning.
Natalie (29:53):
So kind of like, it sounds like some of the, like
the inspiration for your bookcame from like just everyday
situations with your daughter,Hazel, who's diagnosed with
autism.
Yeah.
And Hazel is eight years old.
Lindsey (30:08):
She is she's seven,
Natalie (30:10):
seven.
I'm sorry.
Okay.
Seven.
She's seven years old.
Was that kind of like when youstarted to learn more about like
sensory issues was just in, youknow, working with Hazel.
Lindsey (30:20):
Yes, absolutely.
So it was my occupationaltherapist.
So when we got her diagnosis,she was like a day after her
second birthday.
I mean, she was very little.
And.
You know, like, like manyparents, I went down a Google
rabbit hole immediately and waslike, Oh, what can I do?
(30:41):
What can I do?
I need to, you know, learn allthese things and support her.
And of course we were told to doa whole lot of therapies.
Some of them I found superbeneficial to us.
Some we chose not to continue.
And I'd say the one that wasmost impactful was occupational
therapy for us.
And that is you know, not onlydid it teach me how to help her
(31:05):
and support her, but it taughtme so much about me and.
You know, kind of looking backacross my entire life and then
not long after I got into a caraccident, had a bunch of
neuropsych testing and thenfound out that I had ADHD and I
was neurodivergent.
It's like, this is all kind ofcoming together now, you know,
(31:27):
it's, it's starting to make alot of sense.
And I, I told my parents youknow, that I had been diagnosed
and they were like, oh yeah.
And I was like, what, basicallyit was kind of like everybody
around me knew that I was ADHD,but me, and I was like, well,
(31:49):
that could have been beneficial,but yeah, so it, there was a,
you know, a stigma attached toit and I, I feel like we're
moving farther away from thatnow which is wonderful, but
there was, there was a stigmaattached to it and so it was
kind of like, well, we're justgonna, but.
Not talk about it or not tellher about it to protect me, I
(32:11):
guess.
But that is not the, that's notthe approach that we've taken.
You know, we talk about our, howour brains work every day.
And Hazel knows that she'sautistic and she's excited about
talking about it.
And you know, talk about ourneurodivergence.
Yeah, yeah.
Natalie (32:30):
Do you have the inattentive type of ADHD?
Yes.
Yeah, I think it's interestinglike adult women with ADHD, I
feel like it's talked about solittle that it almost like
catches you by surprise.
Well, not anymore.
Now it feels like a lot of womenare being diagnosed.
But I remember when I firstwould hear someone has ADHD,
(32:53):
like as an adult female.
Yeah.
Come from a psychologybackground and they don't really
talk about that very much.
It's like adult ADD, but it'snot talked about that much.
And if it is, it's more talkedabout like with men, you know,
not so much with women.
So, but that's reallyinteresting that you got a
diagnosis through a car
Lindsey (33:14):
accident.
Yes.
Yeah.
I had I mean, I basically, I wasjust having sensory meltdown.
And my neuropsychologist told mebasically that I had been
masking really well, you know,for the first 30 something
years, but then I also got in acar accident, had a concussion
(33:36):
and had some babies that I hadto, to take care of.
And all of that piled on top ofeach other was just kind of like
a perfect storm of not beingable to function.
And so, I mean, at the.
At the time I was terrifiedbecause I thought I had brain
damage of some sort.
And so I kept going back and youknow, I had anxiety and
depression on top of it and PTSDand all of these things plus
(33:59):
ADHD.
And once we kind of identifiedthose things and I was, you
know, medicated for the anxietyand depression and got those
under control, then I could thenturn my, turn my sights to the
ADHD.
And I was like, and I mean, itall makes sense now.
But it was a, it was a rough wayto figure it out.
(34:21):
But I'm also super grateful thatI did because it kind of changed
the trajectory of, of my lifeand how I.
How I view myself and how I, youknow, give grace to myself and
to my kids.
So it was a blessing indisguise, I guess you could say.
And it was, it was brutal, butI'm happy that it happened.
Natalie (34:44):
Yeah.
So I've been like interviewing alot of moms lately that have
like an adult ADHD diagnosis andI, myself.
I have one too, like I wasrecently diagnosed with ADHD and
something that I've noticed thatyou've kind of brought up a
little bit was the learning howto have grace for yourself.
(35:04):
Because I don't know about you,but like, I've always grown up
just thinking I was weird.
Like there's something wrongwith me.
I'm weird.
Why can't you get over that,Natalie?
Like you make a big deal abouteverything, you're so dramatic.
And it's not just my voice, likeI was kind of told that a lot.
You know, by like, mostly mymother and so like her voice
(35:25):
still, you know, in my head,like, oh, you're so dramatic.
Like, just get over it.
Ignore it.
And there's like always been alot of shame around why is
everything such a big deal foryou?
Why can't you just get over it?
And I think learning that I haveADHD completely.
(35:45):
Reframes everything because duh,that's why it's hard It's like
that's why it's hard like I'mreally not that weird It's just
that like these things that arehard for me There's a whole like
framework for why it makes sensethat it's hard.
And so that's been really nicebecause then That has helped me
(36:10):
still very much in the beginningof it, but to start to learn how
to stop shaming myself forgetting angry when I'm hot.
I hate being hot.
And I live in the, you know, youknow what it's like here in
Central Valley of California.
I feel very angry when I get hotand now I don't have to feel
like a jerk for that.
(36:31):
It's just like, I, now I cankind of like implement
strategies, figure out how do Ideal with that.
And then.
Yeah, so I can definitely relateto that part.
Have there been like differentsensory things for you that have
kind of like Now, with thatframework that you have ADHD,
(36:52):
like you can kind of learn howto cope with it better.
Lindsey (36:58):
Yes, I can identify when things are starting to
shift now.
Instead of just before, youknow, like pushing against
whatever that wave is that'scoming.
And be like, no, now I can kindof ride it and I can identify
it.
And that has helped that that'swith anxiety and depression and
all of those things puttogether.
(37:19):
And ADHD is like.
Once you can name it andidentify it and see it and
understand it, then you can, youknow, help yourself through
whatever that is or change,change direction, change your
environment, whatever that is.
And so you know, I used to besuper impulsive, which I still
(37:40):
am, but now instead of like, Oh,I'm going to quit my job and
change my whole life and movesomewhere.
Which is probably not a greatidea to do when, you know, you
have a family and a mortgage andall those things now I can just
say, okay, I can see what I'mmissing and lacking, and I'm
looking for something.
So instead, I'm going to paint awall instead, you know, looking
(38:01):
for that kind of new I don'tknow, maybe it's a dopamine hit,
I don't know, but it, it keepsme from doing things that are, I
wouldn't say detrimental, butjust the, the ramifications.
Don't have to be as big as Iwould be looking to make them
every time.
And so it's you know, I can seeit coming now.
I'm like, okay, well, let's, youknow, let's go foster a dog.
(38:23):
Let's paint a wall.
Let's rearrange the furnitureand maybe you don't have to
upend your whole life.
If that makes sense.
Natalie (38:28):
Yeah.
No, totally.
I do wish there were easier waysto get those dopamine hits,
like, you know, I've always hadthis thing where like, when it
comes to accumulating things,I've always had this thing where
I don't like to have a lot ofstuff because I love the idea of
just being able to.
(38:49):
To just go, you know?
And I think that fits in withthat, like, just wanting to have
the freedom to, like, like yousaid, upend your whole life.
Not that I've ever done that,but, but yeah, it's like, it's,
it is this, like, I read that wehave this need for novelty.
But then once, like, I don'tknow if you do this, but we're
(39:13):
both creative.
So it's like, you know, you wantto, to learn how to do something
new.
So I've bought so many kits,like I have a freaking basket
weaving kit sitting on my floor.
I researched and researched.
I was on Pinterest for hours,Etsy for hours.
I felt like I had to have itright now.
Bought it and guess what it'sdoing?
(39:34):
It's literally sitting on thefloor collecting dust.
I have not.
I opened it and I looked at allthe things.
I was like, oh, that's cool.
That was like two months ago.
I have not, not woven anything.
Lindsey (39:48):
It's so true.
Natalie (39:49):
Yeah.
And I'm trying to learn how tostop shaming myself for that
too.
It's like.
You know, now that now I getthat.
Okay.
So like you said, where, how canwe find, how can we meet that
need for novelty without buyingsomething that's just going to
sit there?
Painting a wall is a great idea.
(40:11):
So you could do that in a coupleof days.
Lindsey (40:13):
Yeah.
Whenever I get my paint, I havethis big box of paints.
Whenever I get it out, myhusband's like, oh.
Yeah.
Here she goes.
Yeah.
It's hard.
Stay out of my way while I'mpainting something.
Oh my gosh.
That's
Natalie (40:27):
another one too, is like, when you finally are able
to initiate a task, it's like,Don't talk to me.
Don't come near me.
Don't ask me to do anything.
There's just so much to learnabout, about being
neurodivergent, you know?
There's so much, and thankfullyonce you learn it, it's like,
(40:48):
oh, okay, that makes sense.
How can I work with that?
You know, so have you, like inlearning about your own ADHD,
have you learned how to advocatefor your own sensory needs
through that
Lindsey (41:06):
actually just did at work and I, I have not, and I
don't know if I haven't done itbefore or if this one just
really stood out in my mindcause I intentionally did it.
But we were doing someinterviews for.
that we were hiring for and Iwas going to be leading them.
And you might not believe this,but I get really nervous talking
(41:29):
to people.
And so I was like, Oh my God, Ihave to do these interviews
where I'm leading and I'm goingto be, you know, Asking the
questions and so what I asked ofthe team, I was like, instead of
doing the normal you know, justhop on the phone and start
firing questions at thiscandidate, I was like, can we do
a written version?
(41:50):
And then we can use that writtenstrategy or whatever it was, and
we were not asking for free workor anything like that, but you
know, it was kind of like a, aprompt and.
They agreed to do, you know,reformat kind of the, the
discussion and we had them do aprompt and then we walked
through the prompt together andit was so much more clear for, I
(42:14):
believe, everybody that was onthe call we had, you know, Clear
path to, to ask questions andthey felt comfortable sharing
their ideas.
And it was just, it was so nice.
And I was like, Oh my God.
Okay.
So that's, that's how you can doit.
You know, it wasn'tconfrontational.
They didn't have any issues withme doing that or asking for that
(42:36):
change.
And it made everything easierfor the folks that were on the
phone.
So it doesn't seem like a bigdeal, but it felt like such a
big deal.
That's not the typical structureof, you know, an interview.
And so and that just happenedthis past week.
So I was pretty proud of that.
When I texted my sisterimmediately, I'm like, I
(42:56):
advocated for myself.
So it was, it was cool.
Weird to be, you know, now I'min my forties.
That's weird to just finally nowbe learning that.
So I'm hoping, you know, that Ican kind of help my kids.
Start that process sooner than Idid.
Mm hmm, totally.
Natalie (43:16):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I wonder if that's like justpart of.
Life.
I remember when I was like ateenager, I remember my mom
saying something about like, notcaring what people thought of
her.
And I remember thinking like,well, how do you do that?
Like, first of all, that'saudacious.
Like, how do you not care aboutwhat people think?
(43:36):
And then kind of like, secretlylike You know, I would love to
not care what people think, butthen she said that that didn't
really start to happen untilabout her forties.
And so I remember thinking like,well, I don't want to wait till
my forties to not care whatpeople think, because that's
like, you know, half your lifethat now you don't get to have
that freedom of not caring, butthen here I am like approaching
(44:00):
40 and I'm still working throughlike all these things.
So I wonder if that's just likepart of like.
Being a human and, and just whatwe evolve through is, you do
learn these things later andmaybe that's okay.
Like, we can help our kids maybelearn them sooner, but.
I don't know.
Maybe that's just how life is,is that you learn some of these
(44:23):
bigger things later on.
I don't
Lindsey (44:24):
know.
I think some of that also has todo with being confident in your
decisions too, right?
So I know I was not confident inmany of my decisions growing up
and in my early young adultlife.
And now.
I do feel confident when I makea choice.
(44:45):
It's not because I don't knowwhen I just chose something
I've, I've really put in theeffort to understand you know,
what the options were and I hadmade an educated decision.
And so that feels better, youknow, and it makes it easier to.
So then kind of stand yourground a little bit and what
you've chosen.
We've talked a little bit about,you know, generational changes
(45:07):
in parenting.
And, you know, that happens allthe time when my parents are
witnessing me parent differentlythan they did.
And, you know, they, they raisedtheir concerns and I have not
chosen this path lightly.
You know, I, I appreciate, youknow, the parenting that you
(45:27):
have done for me but I'mchoosing a different path.
And it's, it's hard to say thatto them, but at the same time,
I'm, I feel very confident in mydecisions.
Even when they're like pullingtheir hair out, going, what are
you doing?
I'm like, well, come along forthe ride because this is what
I'm doing.
Natalie (45:45):
So, you know, when it comes to like your book and what
you're trying to communicate toyour audience, what would you
say is like the most importantmessage that you want readers to
get from this book?
Lindsey (45:59):
That they're, they're not broken.
All the things that they'refeeling are completely normal.
I mean, the human experience isgoing to be different for
everyone.
But there, you know, sensorydifferences are a very normal
part of life.
And it doesn't mean that.
They're broken or they're wrongor there's something, you know,
(46:21):
weird and that they don't haveto change their strategies and
supports that they can, youknow, find or, or implement that
will help.
But their, their value is justin who they are, just as they
are.
And I think that's probably, Imean, again, that sounds kind of
woo woo, but it's, it is true.
(46:43):
That's it.
Like you're, you're valuablejust as you are not.
Not if you just change a couplethings.
Just as you are.
I love that.
Natalie (46:54):
So where can we, like, find out more about what you do?
Like, what's your website?
How can we find you on socialmedia?
Where can people grab your book?
Lindsey (47:03):
My website is Wiggles, Stomps and Squeezes dot com.
It will have the links to thatgreat list that I told you about
with all the sensory differencesbooks.
It will have links to my WiggleStomps and Squeezes Calm My
Jitters Down in English andSpanish.
The new book is already for presale, Wiggle Stomps and Squeezes
(47:24):
Calming My Jitters at School.
And then I also have an activitybook that kind of goes with any
of the books in the series.
And it has a bunch of sensoryactivities that you can do in a
classroom or at home.
We have made it a point to, tomake the copyright on that one.
So that anybody can copy pagesand use it and in any kind of
(47:44):
institutional or educationalsetting I was very, very clear
with my publisher that I waslike, I want people and teachers
and, and families to be able tocopy this thing and use it
however they want to, and not,you know, have to buy multiple
copies to use something.
So that is a resource availableand it's all, everything is on
(48:05):
Amazon, but then.
Basically, any of those any ofthose online booksellers, so
like Barnes and Noble or Books aMillion Target, Walmart, they're
all on their online websites.
Not a whole lot in physicalbrick and mortar stores but
online there's a lot.
Okay.
Cool.
And you can order it throughyour library.
(48:26):
Hmm.
Okay.
Thank you.
Natalie (48:28):
Awesome.
What did your, what did Hazelthink about
Lindsey (48:31):
the book?
Oh, she loves it.
She loves it.
She'll just be like, Oh, it'syour new book.
They did get to read the secondone.
I'm just on my computer cause wehaven't, you know, got any
printed copies yet.
And they can see little.
Little vignettes of their, youknow, their life.
And again, it's not us, it's notthem, but there are things that
(48:53):
have happened to them that arerepresented in the story.
And so they really, they likethat.
And it's pretty cute.
That's
Natalie (49:00):
cool.
It's fun.
Well, thank you so much forcoming on and chatting with me.
I really enjoyed getting to talkto you and learn about you.
And yeah, just thank you so muchfor making the time for me.
Yeah.
Thank you for having me.
Thank you so much for joining methis week for another episode.
I hope that you enjoyed it.
(49:20):
If you'd like to get in contactwith me, you can send me an
email.
My email address is radmomradioat gmail.
com.
You can also find me onInstagram at radmomradio.
Have a great week and I'll talkto you soon.
Bye!
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