Ep 69 Decoding Galatians 5:19-21: A Comprehensive Deep Dive into Works of the Flesh

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hello and welcome to Real Bible Stories.
Join us as we deep dive intothe historic, religious,
cultural, political andemotional context surrounding
the real lives of real people inthe Bible and the stories we've
all run to life.
Hello and welcome back to RealBible Stories.

(00:25):
I'm your host, emron Ward, andwe are joined by Pastor Ryan
Brown.
Hello, and now freshly backfrom Spain, my wife Selena Cruz.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
Hello, how was it?
It was good, I enjoyed beingwith family.

Speaker 1 (00:39):
What was the biggest difference between Spain and the
United States?

Speaker 2 (00:43):
Customer service.
Oh yeah, I've heard about thatlike for so many years and to
experience it I was like oh,this is so worse.

Speaker 3 (00:51):
Was it better?
I'm not sure it gets much worse.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
No, oh my gosh, you live in a country where people
are expected to smile and takecare of themselves.
No, I'm just saying customerservice and business has been
since COVID.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
It's like everything's COVID's fault.

Speaker 1 (01:03):
You know like what does that?

Speaker 3 (01:04):
have to do with you keeping me on hold for two hours
.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
Oh no, you're talking about like the service in, like
restaurant service and stuff.
Yeah, what was it like?

Speaker 2 (01:12):
So like like here you're trained to like really
smile at people and like haveyour day and like be all nice,
upfront and stuff like that.
Versus in Spain, it's like whatdo?

Speaker 1 (01:25):
you want.
We don't serve that here.

Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:29):
They don't go to bar, did you?

Speaker 2 (01:30):
come here for my food or for my smile.
What do you want?
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
What do you want?
I remember telling me about.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
She was at a bar or club with your cousins and you
were like, oh, can I get thisdrink?
And they were like, we don'tserve that here.
This is what we serve.
These three things, pick one.
Yeah, there was no like, oh,what's in it?
I can try and make something.
They don't care.
They don't care, I love that.
I'm glad that that's what youbrought up.
So I told her beforehand.
You know it's like, be ready,I'm going to ask you a question.

(01:55):
And she didn't know what thequestion was going to be.
So nice, off the cuff answer.

Speaker 2 (01:59):
Nice to be back, though, yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
It's nice to have that third party.
I was wondering we're doing it,just the two of us?
I was like man, when do I saystuff?
If I say something stupid, I'llhave Selena to giggle and make
me seem like I'm smarter than Iam, or something.
It's just silence, Silence,yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:18):
And Randall can over me with his eyes.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
I'm not your wife and I'm not going to give you any
affirmation.
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 (02:27):
And it's like, oh, I'll Google for you, ryan,
that's why, alrighty, but we areback in our Galician study.
We are a few months into it nowand we're getting close and
closer to the end, but we dohave a few more weeks in us here
, right?
So I've said this every week inNew York, I'm going to say it

(02:47):
to you all again in cases yourfirst time tuning in.
This is a very, very deep andwell structured Bible study that
we've been going through, sowe're going to be bringing up
concepts and topics here thatwe've kind of explored in depth
in other subjects Tonight'sactually going to be pretty,
pretty simple.

Speaker 3 (03:06):
You're going to miss, I guess maybe contextually
where why this sits where itsits.
But really today's going to bejust one big heart check.
That's good, that's good.

Speaker 1 (03:18):
But as always, I recommend you start at the
beginning of this year.

Speaker 3 (03:23):
I recommend that as well.

Speaker 1 (03:24):
Yes, Because if this is going to be a heart check,
it'll be even more so when youunderstand a little bit more
about how Paul writes the waythat he does and the church in
Galatian, what's unique aboutthem and how that all ties
together.
So this podcast is for thosethat are looking for that deeper
, more in depth understanding oftheir faith and not just

(03:44):
getting Ryan's perspective on it.
But what Ryan's doing is tryingto really tease out well, what
was Paul thinking at the time inthat day, what was going on
culturally at the time in thatday, and why was the Bible
written the way that it was atthe time?
And then, how does that carryforward into how we should be
living and orienting our livestoday?
So that's the goal of ourpodcast here and with that let's

(04:10):
jump into it.

Speaker 3 (04:11):
Sure.
So we spend a lot of weeks andwrite the proper way to think.
Here's the way to think aboutcoming into Abraham's family,
the way circumcision is requiredfor you.
You are part of Abraham'sfamily mainly because you have
received the Holy Spirit.
That is your guarantee right.

(04:33):
And Paul asked earlier did youreceive the Spirit before or
after circumcision?
Did you see great works amongyou before or after you got
circumcised?
So the first portion of that ishow to think really about the
problem.
He's gotten past that.
He's led them to what he wantsthem to do, which is kick those
teachers really out of theircongregation and say they don't

(04:54):
need to be with you.
So now he's moving into, though,the practical living portion of
living in the Spirit.
Now to go again back to lastweek right, the danger is that,
well, if Torah was acting as aguardrail, the training wheels
to keep us from falling over toomuch into sin, and you remove

(05:14):
that, what keeps you fromfalling over deep into sin?

Speaker 1 (05:17):
if the guardrails aren't there, or really what
defines what is sin anymore?
Because if sin is being outsideof God's intent or God's rules,
but then you say, the law thatwas given doesn't apply anymore,
well, that's actually what.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Paul's going to answer tonight.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
So that's a great segue.
We didn't rehearse this, Ipromise.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
So that's exactly what he's going to hit tonight,
because these are the naturalquestions that you ask, right?
And it's no different in Paul'sday, right?
So he says you remove theguardrails, how do you combat
sin, then, without babysitter?

Speaker 1 (05:47):
How do I still get the strike?

Speaker 3 (05:49):
You walk in the Spirit.
Well, what does that mean?
So he's talking we're leadinginto all these things of what
walking in the Spirit is andwhat it isn't.
So, to kind of give an analogy,this whole study has been
structured around who belongs toAbraham's family.
Are the Gentiles part ofAbraham's family or not?
So if you think about cominginto somebody's family, right,

(06:10):
Like growing up in my family, wedid foster care.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
So we had a lot of different foster kids who would
come in oh yeah, I remember you.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
Some would be with us for years.
A couple would be with us justa couple months.

Speaker 1 (06:24):
Is that how your parents ended up adopting your
brother?

Speaker 3 (06:26):
That's right, yeah, so we picked him up when he was
two days old and obviously hadhim ever son, so he had always
been with us.
But there was a few foster kidsthat we would have come into
the family and part of our kindof goal as a family was they are
not our family, but we wantedthem to feel as much a part of

(06:49):
our family as possible right,yeah, definitely.
So part of that is that you'dget them and you'd make them
feel comfortable and they wouldstart, you know, over time
realizing, like you know, I'mbrought in, I'm a part of this
family, at least for the timethat I'm here.
But part of that is that whenyou're being brought in and into
a new family, right, just asthe Gentiles are being brought
into this new family of Abraham,there's also house rules.

(07:11):
Right, you don't get to play bythe same rules of the
environment you came from.
You are playing by the familyrules.
Right, there's rules of thehome and everybody has different
rules for their home, right?
Some people, you know you takeyour shoes off when you walk in.
You know, other people, it'sfine to be jumping around on the
couch.
Others are like you, the couchis for sitting and sitting only,

(07:32):
right.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
Yeah, every family has a different.
Or you don't use the couch andit's covered in plastic.

Speaker 3 (07:35):
Right yeah.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
Is it the couch you're looking at?
Yeah, that's decoration.
That's not practical thing,right?

Speaker 3 (07:40):
So every house, you know, every family has its own
house rules, and essentiallywhat Paul is going to lay down
here is that all right, I'veestablished that you are
legitimately a part of thisfamily.
You've been brought in.
It is made known to you by thefact that you've received the
spirit.
So now you go walk in thespirit.
And walking in the spirit meansplaying by certain rules, and

(08:02):
if you want to be a part of thisfamily and you want to be for
the kingdom, then there arerules that you need to live by,
right?
So, he to your you know, earlier, though, is that he's also
addressing.
Then, well, okay, well, the lawkind of defined what sin was
for us Gentiles.
Don't have that context, andhe's like, okay, well, if you're

(08:23):
walking in the spirit, it'sobvious and that's what.
That's one of the first pointshe's making.
Actually I would say, if youwere to like, you could probably
just title, you know, thisentire study stating the obvious
.

Speaker 1 (08:37):
This is also interesting too, because you
know, jesus talks about howthose that are under grace go
above and beyond the law.
This is like an example of that.
It's like you're no longerunder the law, but in order to
really be in line with thesefruits and to not be falling
into the acts of the flesh, likewe talked about last week
you're going to have to do somuch more than just what the law

(08:59):
required.
It's going to be so much moreof an expectation than what the
law required.

Speaker 3 (09:05):
So grace always demands more right Exactly so
it's a whole.

Speaker 1 (09:09):
It's another example of that that same logic, which
is huge.
You know.

Speaker 3 (09:12):
The law said don't commit adultery.
Jesus said do not lust.

Speaker 1 (09:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (09:16):
Right, the law says do not murder.
Jesus says do not be angry.
Right, because, of course, ifI'm loving my neighbor as myself
, is there any room for hate,anger, murder.
Can you even get to that point?
Exactly, right.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
So there's not going to be any theft if you're loving
your neighbor as yourself.
There's not going to be any ofthose things.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
That's why that's why the conclusion of last week's
that was the highest command,right?

Speaker 1 (09:43):
He said love your God and then love your neighbor as
yourself.
Exactly.

Speaker 3 (09:47):
And Jesus says the highest command.
And that's where we left offlast week, right when he left it
with a positive.
It's not about what you don'tdo, it's about what you need to
do, and what you need to do towalk in the spirit is to serve
people, go, love people.
It's a positive thing, as acorrection, as a remedy to some
of those battles, right?
So what we're going to get intotoday, then, is really I just

(10:07):
like to call it like a massiveheart check, because I had a
hard to swallow pill drink.

Speaker 1 (10:11):
service today with being careful with your mouth.
Oh yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (10:16):
And this is going to be a little bit more addition to
that, because he's going toessentially list out a series of
acts of the flesh right but toyour point like well, what's sin
?
Then right?
And if you're walking in thespirit, how do you know right
and that's?

Speaker 1 (10:30):
kind of answering that question.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
So it acts as like a heart check in a certain regard.
It just kind of it bringscertain things, I think, that
are sin to the forefront of ourmind to remind us right.
A lot of it is like nothing new.
People will probably hurt a lot.
You know, they're aware of this, but they haven't thought about
it for a long time.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
They're like ah I forgot.

Speaker 3 (10:50):
That is not the way I should be living, right.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
Yeah, so they don't think about the impacts of their
sin.
It's like, oh well, it's likepeople with porn.
They'll be like well, I'm nothurting anybody.
And it's like, well, you'resupporting an industry that is
hurting people, so, by proxy,you are hurting people, so think
about it the larger picture.

Speaker 3 (11:05):
Yeah, and I think the other thing this list is going
to do too, it's going to remindus of the things that mar
Christian identity right so oneof the things that Jesus came to
do was to completely reshapeand reform our identity, and
we're going in this actually inour youth on Sundays.
Right now, we're breaking itdown one a week.
There's different identityfactors that make up one's

(11:27):
identity, all working kind of incohesion and synthesis with
each other.

Speaker 1 (11:34):
That's inside out.
Those are emotions.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
Yeah, I know we're talking, but the idea, though,
being is that you know, when wetalk about that, the image of
God, that we were image bearersand was marred in sin.
Part of that image that'smarred is our identity.
Our identity was marred, and wehave we derive our identity
from so many wrong places, right?
Yeah, and here to correct it toreally say who you think you

(11:57):
are is not who you are.
So where you find your identityis not where your identity
comes from right.

Speaker 1 (12:03):
Much of.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
Jesus' ministry is about that.
So it's going to remind us ofthe things that restrict and mar
, are distinctive, or ouridentity in Christ.
But I would also say, on thepositive end, it can also show
as a list, if you want to thinkof this more positively.
Right, here's a list of thingsthat walking in the spirit can
defeat.
Right, because there's certainbattles I think people are in

(12:25):
where, like I just can't, Ican't win or.
I feel like I'm so deep into itthat I can't ever beat this
right.
And this gives us a list of no.
But if you walk in the spirit,here's what you can find
victories over right Like youcan almost even act as like
signposts or reminders for somepeople of like I forgot that
that used to be my battle andI've defeated that battle by

(12:46):
walking in the spirit.
Right Like you know, like whenwe leave base, right you see all
the signs of all the MarineCorps battles right.

Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (12:53):
And it has, you know, going all the way back to you
know Bellawood and you knowOkinawa, and then you get to
Fallujah you know right?
Yeah, definitely, and it hasall these signs kind of
commemorating, you know, thesefamous battles that the Marine
Corps had fought in and werevictorious in right.
You can almost look at it asthat as well.
Where it's?
Hey, here's a list of things,maybe for the more mature

(13:13):
believer too.
Don't forget the things thatyou've actually overcome by
walking in the spirit.
Remember these things that youused to be enslaved to.
Are you still enslaved to themanymore?
You're like man.
I used to be enslaved to that,but I've actually had victory,
you know.
You think about the fact andthink about some of the
victories you've had right.
So it plays multiple differentroles.
I think, if anything, it is avery clear cut list of what sin

(13:39):
is right A little bit.
So with that, I guess, if wewant to go ahead and what, what?

Speaker 1 (13:45):
what version of the Bible are you reading from
Selena?

Speaker 2 (13:48):
English standard version.

Speaker 1 (13:50):
Yeah, I think, yeah, yeah, I see it on the back ESV,
all right.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
And again we're in Galatians, chapter five.
We're going through verses 19,19 to 21.
Now the works of the flesh areevident Sexual immorality,
impurity, sensuality, idolatry,sorcery, enmity, strife,
jealousy, fits of anger,vibraries, dissensions,

(14:15):
divisions, envy, drunkenness,orgies and things like these.
I warn you, as I warned youbefore, and those who do such
things will not inherit thekingdom of God.

Speaker 3 (14:30):
So what we're really going to be doing is, for the
majority of this, is kind ofjust doing one big word study
for each one of those, each oneof those words in Greek have
certain connotations with them,right, that are a little bit
deeper than what our Englishkind of translates it as.
But the first thing, and ifthere's nothing else to get from
this little piece of text here,get this one thing, okay.

(14:52):
Notice how he says that theacts of the flesh are what
Clearly evident.
Obvious right.

Speaker 1 (14:58):
Yeah, everything In an amplified Bible.
It says clearly, evident,clearly evident.
And it's italicized Like.
So like when he said it he was,like it's clearly evident, yes,
and I love that.
No confusion here, obviousright, so what?

Speaker 3 (15:11):
we're talking about are things that for particularly
the believer who possesses thespirit, these things are obvious
.
It's not like he's clearing upa debate Like hey, is adultery
really bad or is premarital sexreally bad?
He's not like trying to clearup a debate.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
It doesn't even really tie it back to like if
you have the spirit.

Speaker 3 (15:34):
Well, not yet, because this goes into pairing
with the fruit of the spirit.
So you first hit the acts ofthe flesh, but we'll do.
Next is the fruits of thespirit.

Speaker 1 (15:43):
But oh no, I guess, sorry, literally the verse
before he says but if you areguided and led by the spirit,
you are not subject to the law.
Now, the practice of the sinful?
Yeah, he does tie back thespirit, literally one verse
before.

Speaker 3 (15:50):
This is right in that set, yeah, so but the biggest
thing to get, though, is thatwhat he's about to talk about.
They should be obvious, right,and the question is for some, if
it's not obvious, why Right?
Because if you're living in thespirit and you're living for
the spirit, right, you'rewalking with the spirit, then

(16:11):
why aren't maybe some of theseso obvious?
And the truth is is, I think, alot of it.
It used to be obvious andyou've deceived yourself because
you didn't like it.
You didn't like what the spiritwas telling you that, hey, that
you know that's not honoringChrist, but I really like doing
it.
So what we do, is we like to dothis relative ethics right,
like we say, nice, I don't like.

(16:33):
You know the fact that this issaying that.
So I'm going to find some weirdway to twist and twist theology
, or twist what the text issaying.

Speaker 1 (16:42):
I've affectionately heard it called as putting God
in a box.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
Yeah, you put it but you twist things to mean
something that they're not right.
That is not as obvious as it is, like Paul clearly states here.
This is obvious.
In fact, the sense he gives islike guys, acts of the flesh is
so obvious Do I really need totell you what they are?
Yeah, so this is just goesthrough an example.
Right At the end of this heactually says he gives a whole

(17:06):
list and he says and the like.

Speaker 1 (17:09):
So this isn't like an example, et cetera, et cetera,
et cetera.
This isn't like the allexhaustive list of what sin is?

Speaker 3 (17:16):
He's saying here?
Just a bunch of examples rightOf.
They're obvious.
Right, and the like, right.
So there's more to this thanwhat's included here.
His whole point is that acts ofthe flesh are very, very
obvious to people.
If they're not obvious, thenyou're deceiving yourself.
Some of it may be you'resomewhat new in the faith and

(17:38):
the spirit just hasn't come toaddress that with you yet.
Right, like it, god paces.
Right, and he's like, hey, I'mgoing to deal with you and your
mess and I'm going to.
He prioritizes it in a way thatis for our best benefit, right?
So some people they're, likeyou know, pretty like immature
believers.
Right, like you hear themcussing.

(17:59):
You know, like you know moremature believers like, hey, you
shouldn't be cussing.
Right, but behind the scenesyou're not realizing the fact
that this person has had anongoing affair.
They just got saved and now thespirits really working on them
of how to end the affair and getback into a biblically honoring
marriage.
Right, so you don't see thatbattle.
All you hear is them cuss rightand then people come in like,

(18:21):
no, you need to.
In all the while there's, likethis massive, monumental hill,
they're fighting Right.
So the spirit again walkingwith the spirit being led by the
spirit, they address things indue time, right, but just don't
cross over the fact that it isobvious.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
It's also not our place to just judge others.
That's leave that judgment upto God.
You teach, you advise, youguide, especially when asked.
You know just running people'slives and be like you should
live this way when they're notasking you that question.
But yeah, you should supportand be there.

Speaker 3 (18:53):
No, I'm saying, though there's a real thing
about accountability though.

Speaker 1 (18:57):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (18:58):
If you hear something like hey, you know, we
represent the same Lord and youshouldn't be speaking that way,
because the way you speak alsorepresents me, right, Like.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
So there's a natural thing of like, hey, we're doing,
but not from a I would say froma Lording over someone
perspective.
It has to be from that place oflove, like you're giving a
loving correction I mean, we hada whole episode on that a
loving correction on the book ofit's a dude.
Finally, man, thank you.

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Yeah, well, and then when we get curious on how to
effectively give a correction.
There's an episode on that, butwe'll get it next week the
fruit of the spirit to win sayslove, kindness, patience for
parents, right Like there's awhole.
So we'll get that next week.
But the other thing I wanted topoint out here, kind of as a
preamble, is notice how he callsit acts of the flesh.
So Paul kind of falls in linewith what Jesus did when it came

(19:49):
to sin, as he didn't identifypeople by their sin.
Right, so you are not anadulterer, but you have sinned
with adultery.
Right, there's the act ofadultery.
You are committing acts ofadultery, but you are not an
adulterer.
That is not your identity, thatis not who you are.
Right, so he falls in line withlike these are acts of the

(20:13):
flesh, but you are not definedby that flesh anymore, you are
not defined by the spirit.
You rest safely under the graceof Jesus Christ.
Right.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
Have we talked in one of the private?
So it's about the results ofsin, like the results of the
acts, and I feel like we did.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
We talk about a lot.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
I think I mean yeah, Okay, I'm like oh man, this is
going through like a list of theacts of the flesh, but it's
like the reason why their sinsis because of the ramifications
of those actions and the effectthat it has on your
relationships with people aroundyou, and all that and how it
dishonors your relationship withGod too, which is a whole

(20:51):
deeper conversation of itself.
Right.

Speaker 3 (20:54):
So the other thing in verse 21 it says I warn you, as
I did before, that those wholive like this will not inherit
the kingdom of God.
So one just noticed that Paulgave a warning before.
This isn't his first timegiving them this warning.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
Right Now we don't know if that was verbal, if it
was another letter, but he hadgiven them this warning before.
Like he's, like this isn't thefirst time you're hearing this
Interesting we already had sex.
We already had this talk wealready had this talk, right,
but let me remind you of thattalk right.
But the set, the tense in whichthe Greek tense that Paul uses
here is one of continuation.
So it's not.

(21:28):
He's not saying that if you'vedone one of these things, you're
out.
You will not inherit thekingdom of God.
What he says is that if youcontinue to do these things,
being aware that it's wrong andrejecting and essentially you
suppressing the Holy Spirit inyour life, then you won't
inherit the kingdom of God.
Right?
That means that your heart isnot for the kingdom, your

(21:51):
heart's for the world, right?

Speaker 1 (21:53):
So what do you say to the person?
Then was like but but I'm saved.

Speaker 3 (21:58):
Saved to what.

Speaker 1 (21:59):
Oh, it's saved.
I know I was saved, though.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
Saved to what?
That's what I would say.
What are you saved to?

Speaker 1 (22:06):
I'm saved from my sin , so why is it a such a problem?

Speaker 3 (22:10):
Are you saved from your sin If you continue and are
enslaved by the sin?
And are you saved from your sinIf you are still having a heart
of wanting to go conduct thatsame sin?
Right?
There's a difference betweenfalling into sin like I, I like
I try not to do this and thenyou know I fall short sometimes,
right.
That's one thing, but you're inactive combat against it, right,

(22:34):
that's one thing.
There's another thing where youjust essentially hand over,
surrender yourself over to a sin, saying, yeah, this is just too
hard or I like it too much,right, so I'm going to indulge
in this sin, not really combatit or fight it.
That's what he's talking abouta continuation of a heart
towards that sin, knowing thefact that it's in, right.

(22:54):
I would say another way likethis is essentially explaining
what the kingdom of heaven isnot right.
So if you are now a citizen ofheaven, again, house rules,
you're part of Abraham's family,here's, here's the rules of the
family, right?
And you're like, yeah, I don'twant to really live by those

(23:15):
rules.
It's like, well then, you don'treally want to be a part of
this family.
You don't want to be a part of,like there's certain things
that We'll get to it in a bit,but if it bothers you, this list

(23:36):
is essentially a list of whatis not going to be in Jesus's
reign.
When Jesus comes back andheaven and earth are united
together, the wicked aredestroyed.
What is that world?

Speaker 1 (23:49):
going to look like?
What are the rules?

Speaker 3 (23:51):
What is the system of how Jesus?

Speaker 1 (23:54):
will reign.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
The question is is that if I tell like, for example
, there's not going to be pornin the kingdom of heaven?

Speaker 1 (24:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
Now, does that excite you or disappoint you?
Right Like.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
I would say the excitement is more like not
having the desire to even wantit.
That's more what I'm excitedfor I think I talked about that
in a prior episode of like nothaving my sinful desire is what
I'm passionately looking forwardto.

Speaker 3 (24:23):
I guess what I'm saying, though, is that for some
people, though or if I were tosay, hey, there's not going to
be drunken revelry in thekingdom of heaven For some
people they're like well, that'swhat I look forward to on a
Friday night.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
Right.
Is it disappointing?
I've got that in the budgetRight.

Speaker 3 (24:38):
Does that disappoint you, that that's not what's
going to happen, right?
And if the answer is like no,I'm very disappointed, I don't
like that, then what that isexposing to you within yourself,
where your heart is right, andso the idea is that then you,
you're not going to inherit thekingdom of God because simply
you don't want it.
Right?
If, if it makes you upset oryou don't like the fact that

(25:01):
those things won't be there,then you don't really want the
kingdom of heaven, you want theworldly kingdom that you're a
part of now.

Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:08):
So if you don't want it, you're not going to inherit
it, right, you know?
To put it plainly, right, no, Ilike that.

Speaker 1 (25:14):
Because then you can go through every single one of
these and and check yourselfessentially Well that's what
we're about to do.

Speaker 3 (25:19):
So he, from here he starts giving us a big list,
right, and these are kind ofsplit into four different
categories.
He kind of has this list ofsensual sins, he has a list of
religious sins, he has a list of, like relational or social sins
.
So he kind of breaks this outright and puts them in these
different categories so we'llhit the sensual first, because

(25:40):
that's what he hits.
So he says sexual immorality,impurity and debauchery, Um, I
think modern right today we seea lot of the sexual sin as kind
of even more obvious than Ithink they did.
Um, and what I mean is is thatin Paul's day, the way they
viewed a lot of the sexual sinwasn't really a sin, it was just

(26:04):
a deviancy, Right.
So it was something that it waslike this isn't necessarily
normal or this isn't necessarilysomething proper, but it's not
wrong.
It's just it's a deviancy,right, they looked at most
things sex that way, right?
So sex outside of marriage orpolygamy or, um, homosexuality
or anything the thing like thatthat they viewed that as a

(26:26):
deviancy, but not necessarilywrong.
So one thing Paul's doing righthere um you know if this if this
list is going to make peoplefeel uncomfortable now, I could
promise you that, to theGentiles at least, who were
coming out of that culture, thislist is a huge gut check to
them, because they're like,because the where the culture

(26:47):
they came from, this stuff wasacceptable it wasn't even
frowned upon, right.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Why is that?
Cause they had that.
They had in the law to not dothose things.

Speaker 3 (26:55):
The Gentiles didn't.

Speaker 1 (26:56):
Oh, you're talking about the Gentiles.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (26:58):
The Gentile believers who were coming in from that
culture.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
Yeah, so like, even for like an unbeliever, now
right, like if you're in amarriage.
And I came back and I told mywife that and she's like hey, so
what did you and the boys do?
Like, oh, you know, we went toa brothel and we all hired a
bunch of guys.
We had hookers and you know,had a great night.
Yeah, you know what I mean.
Like even the unbeliever nowwould say that is wrong.

(27:20):
Right and their day it wasn'tnecessarily so.
Um, there there was.
It was like hey, that's notnormal, but it's not right.
There was like certain rulesaround certain things.
It was kind of weird, right.
So what I want to do that'skind of hit, do it a.
It's what you'd call etymologyFor some of these, which is what
is like kind of the history ofa word of language and how it

(27:43):
progresses.
what did that word mean to Paulon his day?
And what is he communicating,right?
Oh, wow.
So the first thing, umtranslated at least in the
English for me, is sexualimmorality.
So the word there, this is thisis hilarious, by the way.
People always say well, it'sporn, really bad.
I mean, the Bible doesn't talkabout porn, right?
First off, again to Paul'spoint.

(28:03):
The acts of the flesh areobvious.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
Yeah, right, so that's the only thing that
you're asking the question thatyou already don't take Would you
watch?

Speaker 3 (28:10):
porn in front of Jesus.
Could you ever imagine Jesuswatching?

Speaker 1 (28:13):
porn.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
Right, it's obvious, right.
But the second thing here, ifit was funny, is that the very
word porn that comes from theGreek fear for sexual immorality
is the Greek word pornia.
Right, that's the, even thoughI would say what the current
acts of like watching porn is,but actually fall in a different
category, which we'll get to ina second.
But so pornia, you know, it'sto Jews, right?

(28:38):
You cannot separate pornia frommarriage.
Anything that was sexualoutside of marriage was adultery
.
That's the way the Jewishpeople viewed it, right?
Yeah, the Roman Greek mindsetwas a little different.
So here he's using, you know, aGreek loaded concept from their

(28:59):
mindset, and it speaks to moreof like sexual misconduct in a
very broad sense, right?
So I'm talking about premaritalsex.
It includes adultery, you know,acts of bestiality.
I know that seems kind of reallyweird, but in their day there
was a cult of a Dianatris andthe sadders.

Speaker 1 (29:22):
The sadders.

Speaker 3 (29:22):
Yeah, so this was another.
You know we've talked aboutthis before.
We talked about the, the galleypriests right.

Speaker 1 (29:28):
It's like they take it some act that's out of the
ordinary and they associate aGod to it.
Exactly.

Speaker 3 (29:34):
So in this particular case, how do you worship?

Speaker 2 (29:37):
that God.

Speaker 1 (29:37):
Bestiality Right, so sexual acts of bestiality right,
so really like worshiping sexin the weirdest ways.

Speaker 3 (29:45):
That's a pedophilia, homosexuality, those things all
under the the Roman Greekunderstanding of pornia existed
in that category.
Yeah Right, so again to themthese were you know deviancies,
but not necessarily wrong.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
So pornia is the the Greek word that means sexual
immorality in this translationtoday.

Speaker 3 (30:11):
So pornia is not an equivocal to porn in the way
that like it's more, it's moresex to sexual acts, but yeah the
acts of sexual immorality as weunderstand them today sex
outside of marriage under thisword pornea in the Greek.
Exactly yeah, so that would fallunder the pornea right, yeah.
But the next one?
It says impurity.
So you got sexual immorality orpornia, now you got impurity.

(30:36):
Now, I've said this before.
I'm horrible at pronouncingGreek, so I will do my best, but
this one is a cartharcia, and acartharcia that is translated
as impurity.
Here that means the opposite ofpurity, or uncleannliness, or,
if I put it this way, we'retalking about sexually impure

(30:57):
acts that don't involveintercourse.
So, porn would fall under this.

Speaker 1 (31:03):
Oh, okay, so you're not having.
So sexual morality waseverything you brought up was
specifically tied to somethingrelated to penetration.
Actual intercourse, right,actual intercourse, yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:13):
This is referring to things that is not actual
intercourse, but it's obviouslysexually impure, right?

Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:19):
And this is actually an interesting one in the sense
that, well, I'm just gonna kindof give you examples, right?
So we're talking about porn.
What would fall under this isvulgar or suggestive language,
what you could I mean.
I guess you could say cussing,but it's more like sexually
vulgar right it's like sexuallyvulgar jokes, right?
That that is impurity, that'simpure stuff, right?

(31:39):
That would fall under there.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
It's like you wouldn't really expect Jesus to
make a lewd comment.
You know, so I would Right.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
So I think it was under this category, not
considered sexual intercourse.
But it's sexually impure, right, it is an impure sexual act.
Masturbation that falls underthis as well.
And what's?
I think many, particularlyyoung believers, I think, kind
of fall into this mindset of all, right, I'm gonna do all I can

(32:09):
to keep my.
They'll use the word purity.
Right, I'm gonna remain avirgin until I'm married.
But then they do all theseother acts kind of as like
fillers until you get thereright.
Like foreplay and then thingslike that, to say that they're
saving their purity.
But by biblical, in this Greekdefinition, you can actually

(32:32):
hold to your virginity but stillbe impure sexually if you've
done these acts of impurity,right that.

Speaker 1 (32:38):
Well, I guess.
But culturally with that, let'ssee, like they talked about
when, when the woman was broughtbefore Jesus like this one, was
caught in adultery and all thisstuff like caught in the very
act, would, if a woman outsideof marriage has never been
married or anything like that,was, was or man was caught doing
something impure, would thathave the same ramifications like

(33:03):
under the law where you knowyou got stoned?
Is that your impure?
But you're still a virgin?

Speaker 3 (33:09):
so I'm trying to think, when you go back to
Leviticus, it does address someof those impure actions and
there are, I think, differentrecourses for each one and I
don't I don't know what thoseare for each one of these.
Okay, so I was wondering I wantto be able to give you a
specific answer on that one.
That's a good question, but butlike the kind of point, though,

(33:30):
is that I think, again, manyyounger Christians though,
they'll keep their chastityuntil marriage, but they won't
keep their purity until marriage.

Speaker 1 (33:40):
It's interesting, we're describing it.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
And the just to be clear that the biblical
expectation is that you keepboth right.

Speaker 1 (33:48):
I've never heard purity and chastity separated
like that, though If you thought, just maintaining chastity was
really difficult in this cultureas a Christian well it just up
the ante a bit.
Yep, like I said, under grace,the standard is higher because
then you even take it a stepfurther and then, like lust,
there's not even a physicalcontact at all.
It associated with lust.
But then you're still.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
But the reason why Jesus addresses lust, because
lust is what leads to each oneof these.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Exactly, yeah, you can have one without the other.
Yeah, so at least you can havethe latter without the former.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
Next one debauchery or lewdness.
This is the Greek word acelgia,and it essentially means ready
to sin at any time.
It's like over the top,outrageous.
It's acting without restraint.
It is something that isentirely indulgent on the flesh

(34:41):
right.
So think about, you know acontext of, maybe, if you've
never been a part of it or atleast witnessed it.
But when somebody or a group ofpeople drink so heavily that,
like in their minds, anythinggoes, and then they just go over
the top.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
It's like when people talk about like drinking Jaeger
, that's what comes to mind.
Like you're on, jaeger is justoh yeah, like the term.

Speaker 3 (35:08):
Yeah, yeah, it's like you're essentially flaunting
your immorality.
Yeah, you see this with Marinesall the time, right like you
gotta be very careful because,as a believer right within the
Marine Corps culture, becauseyou go out with the boys in
Vegas and you start off withjust having dinner and a few
drinks, well, that turns intoeverybody getting hammered,

(35:29):
which turns into everybody thengoing to the strip club, which
then turns into right strip clubgoing under, probably the
impurity.
So it's almost like putting thisis an act of the flesh is, and
when you put yourself in aposition to sin like
intentionally not acts of well,debauchery and lewdness, but the
word of style GIA here meansliterally, means like ready to

(35:52):
sin at any time, but yeah soit's like getting yourself in a
state or in a position whereyou're ready to sin at any time.

Speaker 1 (35:58):
Right, it's just like any given time, like you know
or being in that state, becausesome people are just in that
state.
Hey, everyone, go to the barwith me.

Speaker 3 (36:05):
I'm down.
When are we going?
Let's go, yeah, yeah, I'm gonnaget you know crunk tonight
right, like you're like manready at any time right.
So, and I think one of thethings with like lewdness,
interesting debauchery is tofind a style.
Style GIA right is that it canalmost form an identity for a
lot of people right you're thefun person to go drink with,

(36:27):
right.
Because, yeah, why is he so fun?
Because he's lewd.
He leads the debauchery, thelife of the party we call him
right.
Yeah, well, really we were justtalking about as somebody who
is so over the top and ready tosin at any time that you know
they quote-unquote make it funright yeah, that's what you're
talking about.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
You're talking about just over the top.
I have a question about theword lewd.
So I've heard the word lewdspecifically associated to like
types of clothing.
So is can it be tied to yourappearance as well that you're
making yourself in a way thatyou appear ready to sin?

Speaker 3 (37:01):
So it's actually really funny.
I just taught this this morningto youth for the identity
factors.
Yeah, and we said in the titleyou are your body and the idea
is that your body is anextension, it's the
manifestation of your internalcollective identity.

Speaker 1 (37:17):
Right, so your whole identity is not just your body,
but you can do nothing separatedfrom your body there are very
few ways that we can expressourselves externally and it's
kind of pastor actually talkedabout the mouth, right- so the
mouth is one of the obvious ones, if you pour out, pouring of
the heart.
It comes from your mouth, yourbody is another way you can
display your internal thoughts,feelings and right and how you

(37:40):
dress and how you carry yourselfand like that's interesting and
what I had told them is.
You know, a lot of people lookat what has your priests on
similar things, even tattoos for?

Speaker 3 (37:48):
example.
You know, culturally orgenerationally at least, tattoos
were always viewed in a certainlight, right, if you had a
tattoo.
Depending where you are in theworld, they still are.
Yeah, that's true, but it'sjust like in our culture, right,
like the West.
You know, for the longest timeif you had a tattoo, you know
people kind of made certainjudgments or made certain leaps

(38:09):
about you right, and that'sbecause you know it's different
from generation to generation,but your body has an extension
of your identity.
You know people aren't judgingyou when they, when you come,
you know walking in and yourbooty shorts right and people
like oh that stay away from thatgirl, right?
like I tell my sons, you stayaway from that girl, right?
Like, oh well, why is he beingso judgy?

(38:31):
You're not judgy, you're notmaking a judgment on them.
What is all I'm doing isinterpreting what you are
communicating, because your bodyis what you use primarily to
communicate to the world yeah,and communicate your identity to
the world, right.
So in terms of dressing, lewd,right, that's dressing in a way
that you are communicating tosomething about what's going on

(38:51):
inside of your head, not just ofyour identity, but what you're
about right you're saying hey,I'm dressed this way for a
reason, right?
if you look at a prostituteright on the street corner,
they're dressed woodly, they'reready to sin at any time.
You come up, you pay in themoney, they're ready to go sin
with you, right?
That's lewdness, that'sdebauchery.
I say debauchery, lewdnessthat's fascinating, just.
I have to make this because Iforgot I have it separated here.

(39:13):
Different translations will saysomething different.
Here one will say debauchery,the other one will say lewdness.
That's why I separated themabout that sensuality yours is
what sensuality, that'sinteresting, but the word
there's acelgia, right, oracelgia which is ready to sin at
any time.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
So I'm sorry, go ahead oh, I was gonna give a
brief example about kind of theramifications of your, of your
how you carry yourself and howyou present your body.
So we had a marine.
So I teach the schoolhouse.
I moved from just teaching thelieutenants and now I'm kind of
over a large swath of kind ofthe enlisted training as well.

(39:53):
It's one of the Marines thatwas in the enlisted training
side.
She ended up getting a sleevetattoo that had a lot of
graphically sexual content onthe tattoo, and so we do have a
new tattoo policy in the MarineCorps where you can have the
sleeve tattoos but they're stillguidelines for what you can
have in the tattoo.
So she, I guess in the form ofself identity right, had these

(40:17):
kind of graphic in appropriatethings on this like tattoo.
But because now her identitywas in conflict, the way she had
her body presented was now inconflict with the Marine Corps
identity, she actually gotprocessed out of the.
Marine Corps.
She was kicked out because youknow you got this crazy tattoo.
It's like you can't be inuniform and also be displaying

(40:38):
this stuff.
You can't be in PT gear and wesee this stuff on your arm.
You are now incompatible withthe Marine Corps identity and
she was removed from the MarineCorps.

Speaker 3 (40:48):
Yeah, so interesting well, you think about how much
more so the expectation is fromChrist and what I told them was
one question right with this isthe way you dress, the way you
present yourself physically withyour body.
What message are you sendingthe world?
And, primarily, with how youdress and all that, are you

(41:08):
glorifying yourself?
Are you trying to glorify yourbody?
Are you trying to glorifyChrist?
Are you speaking a message ofthe gospel in the way you?
You dress, right?
Or you speaking a differentmessage, a different invitation?
Right, and that's ludeness,right.
That's just saying I am readyto sin, I'm down whenever you
are right, and it's really moretalking to the, I guess, the

(41:30):
more probably seductive.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Yeah, way of dressing right, but because the body is
one aspect of this overallconcept, because you're talking
about the.

Speaker 3 (41:37):
This is why we're taking two months state.

Speaker 1 (41:40):
But I think that that's awesome, that that's a, I
think, a better way of havingthat conversation or at least
helps back up some of the claims, because they've heard in the
past.
You know people say it's like,oh, you know, mind how you dress
on all the stuff.
It's like, well, why does Godcare how I dress X, y and C?
It's like well, it's how youare presenting yourself as a
citizen of the kingdom is thatsomething that Jesus would wear?

(42:00):
Do you expect that to Jesus?
If you?
knew that you were going to geta new suit, so we move on to.
That was the first category.

Speaker 3 (42:15):
Right so your sensual or sexual sin, right so, pretty
much within that you gotpernita, which is your sexual
acts.
You got impurity, which are notnot actual sexual acts, but
well, they're impure sexual actswithout they're actually being

(42:38):
so we're not looking for thepenetration or the sexual, the
sex itself, intercourse.
There we go, I'm thinking yeah,but then you got the botry of
ludeness, which is alsocommunicating your willingness
to participate in either one ofthose, right, yeah.
So now we move on to the nextcategory, religious sins, and
this is verse 20, first one thatstates is idolatry.

(42:59):
So this one's prettyself-explanatory, right.
The Greek word idol or Latria.
It means to worship, theworship of things or images.
Right, we've talked about thismany times in this podcast, so
I'm not gonna try to reteach allthat, right.
But just kind of ties back tothat concept idolatry idols, is

(43:21):
anything that removes orreplaces God's rifle place in
your life, god's design, god'spurpose or God's identity for
you, right?
So anything that exists thatyou serps God's rifle place that
you know we're talking about.
Identity, right that?
The problem with the currentculture, in this whole idea of

(43:41):
how do you self identify?
There's a couple problems withthat, because identity, you know
, a lot of identity is given,right so you are given an
identity that you had no choicein, a matter I didn't get.
I did not choose my skin color,I did not choose my eye color,
right, I didn't choose, you know, those physical characteristics
, characteristics that identitywas given to me and then choose
my gender, unlike what manythink.

(44:03):
Now, right, I didn't choose that.
There are things that are givenand those identities that were
given to us by our creator, ouridentities that we are meant to
mature into right so yeah, whenmy son was born, I'm holding him
.
It's not just I had this burdenas a father that have to take
care of this human being.
I have this responsibility toturn this little baby boy into a

(44:26):
godly man yeah there's anidentity that he was given and
assigned that I have to help himmature into right.
Yeah, so the one.
The problem with self identityis that it allows no room for
growth, because if that'sinteresting, because if I just
identify, as this is who I am,this how I identify.
Well, what are you maturinginto there's?

Speaker 1 (44:42):
no expectation to grow to move into right.

Speaker 3 (44:45):
So that's one piece.
But the second part of youridentity is chosen, right.
You choose your clothes.
You choose.
You know there's things aboutyour idea, you do choose, but
the second piece the moreoffense.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
It's also, people will be like, well, that's just
who I am.
And it's like, well, now youcan't move forward, you can't
grow.
You know, I'm just a drunk, I'mjust a XYZ.

Speaker 3 (45:04):
Moses at the burning bush asked who, should I say,
sent me?
God says I am who I am.
God is the only one who's beenable to self identify.
Because he is the only one,because he's the definition of
all things.
Right, yeah, the rest of uswere created, we were defined,
it was defined for us, right?
God says I am who I am.
You are not who you are.

(45:24):
You can change.
Right?
God's the unchanging,everlasting one, right?
So, but, and that kind of goesinto this next point here is
that the other thing about thatwhole self identify, your gender
kind of nonsense is that italso usurps God's rifle role in
defining you so you're not just,you're not just robbing God of

(45:46):
his identity as your creator,you're ultimately robbing
yourself of the identity hecreated you to right and, in a
sense, that now becomes an idol.
And it's very interesting to methat identity has always.
Satan has always attackedidentity.
Right, you go all the way backto the garden.
Why did Satan go after even notAdam?

(46:08):
You know, and a veryinteresting piece of that is
that Adam was named by God.
Adam was given a name, given adefinition by God.
Before the fall right, what wecall the fall Genesis 3, eve was
given her identity by Adam.
He typed, he named her woman,for she came out of man right.

(46:30):
So I Eve, had a very weakidentity.
Her identity was really tied toAdam's identity.
Does?

Speaker 2 (46:37):
that make sense.

Speaker 3 (46:38):
Saint went after Eve.
It's not until after right, godcomes in, he gives the curse,
but also the promise to Eve aswe've been there before right,
that the seed, the promised seed, yeah, it's gonna come out of
you.
Then she is renamed to, given anew identity to Eve, which
means the mother of all theliving.
Oh right, so she's.

(46:59):
I did not notice that, yeah.
So my point with this is thatEve had a very weak identity,
weeding in.
That's who saint went after, itwas after, and then God gives
her a promise, and that's whenAdam says you have your own
unique identity, right so she'sgiven a for itself based off of
what someone is saying, that youare, then that is a weak
identity.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
You need to figure out how.

Speaker 3 (47:20):
God says you are, you got as you are promise and said
Eve would be, is the mother ofall the living.
Now, that's so interestingbecause you.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
I want to even expand it slightly further because
with the youth to like, kidswill pursue stuff because their
parents say so.
Kids will be like why just wantto make mom proud, I just want
to make dad proud, and that canend up like destroying you as a
person.

Speaker 3 (47:40):
Well, everybody finds I mean so you only get identity
in relation to other peopleright.
I don't want to make this athing about identity.
It's just it's on the forefrontof my mind, obviously, but it's
also a good element, right,because what I was gonna say is
that what I find identity hasalways been an issue.
Saint has always attacked thosewith weak identity if you have a
weak identity in Christ,satan's gonna wreak havoc with

(48:01):
you right and part of theChristian problem right now in
the West, of all the things thatmake up Christian identity,
most only identified to one ofthose factors, which is what we
call future destiny, that Christsaved me from hell.
I get, I have everlasting life.

(48:22):
Right, my destiny is set withGod right the future and that's
a very important thing, and formany believers that's been
enough to completely reformulatea lot of their decisions and
behaviors in life.
But there's, like nine, otherfactors that form identity that
they don't even identify to inthe Christian sense.
So they're looking to the worldto define that for that a

(48:42):
knowledge problem like aimmaturity problem.
I would say it's the way we'vestructured it.
We've just we've reducedChristianity down to just this
one form of identity.
And just imagine if Christiansdove in and really submitted
every one of those forms ofidentity over to Christ.
If you feel like your life isblessed and full now with that

(49:06):
one identity and one of thosefactors, yeah, imagine if you
brought all the other nine in.
Imagine if you submitted yourcommitments over you, submitted
your body over you, submittedyour mind over you, submitted
your boundaries over you knowI'm saying so identity has
always been a problem.
Saints always attacked it.
What's interesting about what'sgoing on in the culture right
now, though because it ties backto the idolatry here is that it

(49:28):
almost seems that gender nowhas been is playing a proxy idol
.
It's very yeah, odd to me,because now it's essentially
saying what used to always andwe've always accepted, has been
defined gender right something Ididn't choose.
You didn't choose.
God chose right.
But now that's even beingchallenged and it's saying no,

(49:49):
no, no, no.
God doesn't define who you are,even the things that were
always defined for you.
No, no, no, god doesn't definethat for you.
You define that for yourself.
God doesn't decide who you are.
You get to decide who you arebecause you're the God of your
own life.

Speaker 1 (50:01):
That's another.
That's another idol now, butthat's another version of the
same problem that any what kindof guy who looked at himself in
the mirror and just like things.
A p-word, just so absorbed withyourself and that's it.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
Like narcissism.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Narcissism.
It's not a P word, unlessanyway, but yeah.
But it's like it's another formof that same kind of argument
where you're putting yourselfabove others, like it doesn't
matter what God says I am, itdoesn't matter what Christ has
blessed me with, it's like itonly matters what I say I am.
It doesn't matter what Selenasays I am, what Ryan says I am,
or what my parents say I am, oranything about the world.

(50:44):
It's like all that matters iswhat I think, period above all.
And it's like it kind of goesback to where you say that kind
of limits your growth anddevelopment If you're not open
to growing, you're idolizingyourself.
To say that my self identity ismore important than what society
, what my faith, what Christ,what God says that I am, then

(51:04):
you're just epitome ofnarcissism right there, which is
idolatry right, it's idolatry.
Yeah, it's also impropermisplaced worship, but other
things besides gender, have likefed that same thing, and that's
what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (51:16):
Anything misplaced worship is idolatry right.
It's not that money itself isbad right.
It's the love of money, it's theworship of money that is bad
Because ultimately, we becomelike whatever we worship, like
that is a reality, right?
So if I'm not worshiping God,I'm not going to become like God
.
If I'm worshiping money, I'mgoing to become like the

(51:40):
peddlers of money.
Right, and whatever it takes,right, it's going to be my
supreme value.
I could be in terms of certainconvictions of oh, I want to be
nice to people, I want to takecare of people, but not at the
expense of costing me money.
Right, because that is thething I worship and that's what
I'm becoming more like.
You know the Bible's very clear.

(52:00):
You know going back to, youknow Exodus, when God makes it
very clear with the TenCommandments.
I am a jealous God, right, if Icould just maybe do a couple
lists here that I had, I justpinned some down.
But God cares that you cannotgo anywhere without your phone,
but you're perfectly contentshowing up at church on Sunday

(52:21):
without your Bible.
He cares, yeah, right, why isyour phone such a non-detachable
part of you?
You wouldn't show up to churchwithout your phone, but you have
no problem showing up to churchwithout your Bible.
Now, granted, I understand manypeople have their Bibles on
their phones.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
I would take that one step further.
You may you're going to go anentire church service without
opening your phone.
Probably not, but you might goan entire church service without
opening your Bible, even if youphysically had it, or a week,
or a week or a month, yeah, or ayear.

Speaker 3 (52:50):
Right, God cares that .
The first thing you do when youwake up in the morning, instead
of praying and thanking Him foranother gracious day of life,
the first thing you check isInstagram.

Speaker 1 (53:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (53:04):
Are you?

Speaker 1 (53:04):
going to say check your phone, and I was so ready
to be like, well, I have to turnthe alarm off before I, you
know, give my prayer and thanksto God.

Speaker 3 (53:08):
No but you get on social media right.
You spend the first wakinghours, your first morning breath
of this life that God has givenyou and you use that time to go
on social media right.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
Is Instagram and itself wrong?
Just put yourself in a badmental state because no one ever
comes off of social media.

Speaker 2 (53:24):
It's like I feel so rejuvenated after sitting on
Instagram and swiping but butyeah, it's not like that, Like
social media is wrong in itselfright.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
But if that's the first thing, right, that's the
thing right.
Yeah, he cares that you willspend hours surfing Pinterest.
Right, you will spend hours.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
That's so funny.
You know, going over homedesign, I'm going to wake up and
not give thanks for what I have.
I'm going to wake upimmediately, swipe through
things that I may buy eventuallyand it's like well.

Speaker 3 (53:51):
I'm just saying like people will go through Pinterest
getting all these ideas of howcan I design my home different
and not pay two thoughts to howblog is designing his kingdom
and how you get to participate.
That today, yeah Right, hecares.
He cares that you possess morepassion and emotion to call of

(54:13):
duty or your you know sportsteam.
Right, Football just startedthis week.
I haven't been able to watch asingle football game.
right, Because we've been doingministry and it's been driving
me crazy, but I have prioritiesright, but he cares, though,
that you carry more passion andemotion to call of duty than you
do for things of God.
Imagine if, on a given Sundaymorning, people celebrated a

(54:36):
baptism the way they celebrate atouchdown later in the day.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Oh, I love that, I love that.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
Right.
Why is you know?

Speaker 1 (54:44):
Patrick, the hall is throwing it and hollering,
jumping out of your seat withall that passion and emotion
right.

Speaker 3 (54:51):
But then somebody gets saved for eternity and we
do the little golf clap.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
You know, the first time that I saw that level of
energy coming out of a Christianman was the Midos motorcycle
group.
Set free.

Speaker 2 (55:03):
Oh, that was cool yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:05):
So I hope they listen to our podcast.
I hope they interact with usmore as a church.
But there.
So in 29 Palms here or in theMorongo Valley area, there's
this motorcycle group called setfree.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
In Wonder Valley.

Speaker 1 (55:17):
In Wonder Valley and their, their, their whole thing
is that they're a Christ based,godly motorcycle group.
They've got a pastor and allthat and they do these rides out
and they'll do.
They'll ride out to someplace,they'll set up a tent and
they'll, they'll worship Christand then you ride back and
that's kind of their.
One of the big things that theydo as their motorcycle
organization, but also one ofthe things that they're known

(55:39):
for, is their zeal and theirvigorous worship of Christ.
They just crying out, youscream in the name of Christ
with the same energy as thatpeople, that people got at those
football games.
That's what you want to see.
And they're falling over eachother getting to the altar to
confess, to ask for forgiveness,and it's the most amazing thing

(55:59):
.
It's not beautiful in the waythat like oh man, it's so lovely
to like, like when Jamie singson Sunday, it's like that's a
beautiful thing.
When they're up there, it'slike that's awesome.
That is the childlike faiththat Christ talks about and I
love it.

Speaker 3 (56:12):
And they're looking and seeing in and worshiping
with man, how great is God.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
Right Like and God.

Speaker 3 (56:18):
I think that's pleasing to God, right, but he
also is looking at those whodon't have that and he's like I
care.
I am a jealous God, right.
Or here's another one for you,Imran.
Are you as disciplined withyour spiritual disciplines of
Bible study, reading your Biblepraying, as you are with your
gym discipline?

Speaker 1 (56:39):
That's about the same right now, right Because.

Speaker 2 (56:41):
I've been spending so much time at church that my gym
life sucks, but you know whatI'm saying, though it hurts.

Speaker 3 (56:46):
God cares that you are more disciplined.

Speaker 1 (56:48):
You just punched him in the stomach, right yeah, I
was like oh, God, I literally,oh my God, that week, that first
week, selena was gone.
I didn't go to the gym becauseI spent every night at church
prepping for the worship night.
But you know, in generaldefinitely.

Speaker 3 (57:02):
And the gym is good.
Right Like you need goodholistic.

Speaker 1 (57:05):
You know all through college all through a lot of my
time in the Marine Corps as well, and something I realized once
I started kind of reevaluatingmy life is that a lot of my
purpose was tied into how Iphysically presented myself and
I worked out not just for me ornot just for Selena from family,
but like so that others wouldsee me.
And so basically with thatconviction where I was kind of

(57:32):
holding the narcissism,essentially I was holding myself
up to that level.
Once that was gone, I found itvery difficult to like well now,
why do I work out?
You know, and I do still want towork out, but I don't have the
same like driving factor of likewell, I'm working out, so other
people can see me, and sothat's something I've actually
been praying about too is liketo get that renewed motivation

(57:53):
to actually like work out theway to be healthy, right, and
that's like the thing is notlike working out wrong, right.
But it was the same thing.

Speaker 3 (58:02):
You better have worship.

Speaker 1 (58:03):
Like I would be asking to go on stage to perform
so that people could be likeman, you played the drums, real
nice, and it's like, and it tooka long time, like to get back,
to get to a place where itdidn't matter, right, and it's
not for them, it's for Christ,because it's idolatry, right
yeah it is idolatry, anythingcould become an idol, even if it
may be good in itself right.

Speaker 3 (58:23):
Yeah, so moving on though, to the next one, it's
depending on your translation.
We'll see either witchcraft orsorcery.
What is yours, selena?

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Sorcery, sorcery.

Speaker 3 (58:34):
Thanks for saying it for me too.
So here's the Greek word forthis one ready, and you're going
to hear what we're reallytalking about.
Because isn't this a little odd, right?
People are like, well, why isthat under the religious sin
category, right?
So, here's the word, the Greekword.
You're going to hear whatwitchcraft and sorcery was
actually referring to.
But the Greek word is pharmakea, pharmaceuticals, like drugs.

(58:57):
There you go.
So whenever you see witchcraftand sorcery, it's really
referring to drugs, doing drugs.
And here's why Because you knowlike when I hear witchcraft,
sorcery, I'm thinking HarryPotter, hocus Pocus you know,
because you have those peopletoo, like I can tell you the
future.

Speaker 2 (59:13):
Sign here yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:14):
Find out how you die.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
Yeah, your song $500 to find out how you die, how you
die.

Speaker 3 (59:18):
Right, well, so what it's really referring to
biblically?
And again it gets back to Romancults, right?
And religious practices.
But if I am worshiping a bunchof gods that don't exist, how do
I create spiritual experiencesto gods that don't exist?
And that's why the priests andthe priestesses that were

(59:42):
committed to each god would havetheir sorcery and their
witchcraft right.
They would essentially, youknow, know, like if I take
different natural elementsgenerally associated to some god
, mix them together in thisconcoction in a certain way,
like pharmaceuticals do withdrugs, that I put them together
in a certain way, you drink it,you know, you ride the lightning
and you enjoy that high, butit's not a high, it is you're

(01:00:06):
having a spiritual experiencewith that God right Wow.
So when you're seeing that it'sreally drug use on the basic
level, but it's, it's, but itwas always tied to the worship
of you know paganism right.

Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
So if you're, if you're doing, if you're doing
drugs for the experience of likean I guess, a connection with a
idolatry of some sort, becauseit doesn't have to be associated
to some God, it's like the Godis whatever you're idolizing.
So if you're doing, or maybeyou're idolizing the drugs
themselves, and that's what it'sreally tying back to, because

(01:00:43):
there's people that it's notmedicine, we're not talking
about medication, we're talkingabout, like psychedelics we're
talking about.

Speaker 3 (01:00:51):
I mean, so there was really three major categories
that they would use witchcraftfor right and you read this like
an axe emphasis was a was likethis massive hub for witchcraft,
like they had like the biglibrary of all the potions,
essentially when you hear potion, right Of the ingredients, the,

(01:01:14):
the recipes for a lot of thisstuff.
That's why it's later.
I want to say it's axe chapter.
I want to say 20, maybe alittle bit of no, 18.
I think it's actually 18.
But there's a story where abunch of the witches and
sorcerers essentially get savedand they take all their scrolls

(01:01:34):
right, cause this was a hub forit.
They took all their scrolls,put it in the middle of the
street and burned it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
They say we belong to Christ.
Now we don't need these anymore.
And they burned the scrolls.
They said it was worth about50,000 drachma, which is a lot
of money You're talking likemany people's year's worth of
salary, of what these scrollswere worth right.
Cause what it's tied to, butthe three main things was having
a spiritual experience with theGod.

(01:02:01):
It was also to ward off evilspirits, so you would get high
to ward off the evil spirits.
And the third was just to helpwith chronic illness, right?
So, like you know, just again,like I'm, I'm in pain, so give
me some, some potion to help mewith my chronic illness, right?
So the thing with it is thatwhich is the whole opioid

(01:02:24):
epidemic.
Now, when you fast forward,that's something that we're
struggling with now, wherepeople are like well, I'm open
ended.

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
I'm in pain with no underlying disease or cause and
people prescribe pain medicationand that become a dependency as
well.

Speaker 3 (01:02:37):
Pharmachea, pharmaceuticals.
Yeah, he say acts of the fleshare obvious.
Satan has always used drugs andpeople go oh, you know, the
Bible doesn't talk about drugs.
It sure does Anytime you see,witchcraft, sorcery, that's what
it's referring to is drug useright?
So those are really your tworeligious sins that he list Next
category.

Speaker 1 (01:02:55):
We're getting into the relational Okay, that's what
it's like so funny, becauseit's like well, you're telling
me, christ doesn't like streetmagicians, it's like no dog,
that's not what we're talkingabout.
Yeah, yeah, talk about drugs.

Speaker 3 (01:03:05):
I always had this conviction as a child, because I
would watch like you know,Chris Angel and like you know
some of the magicians andthey're like you think the whole
spirit's behind you justwagging its finger.

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:15):
Like I'm, I'm, I shouldn't be doing this.
That is a really cool trick,right?
Yeah, yeah, Um, but you know,to that point though, there are
certain, I guess, magicians thatwill associate their illusions
to darker powers, or you knowwhat I'm saying yeah, as opposed
to just like.
They're giving glory to darkelements and forces of the world

(01:03:36):
.
To where well now, I mean thatfalls into the same acts of the
flesh or obvious right yeah.
If you are doing something andmaking a show and glorifying um
what is not Christ, then it'sobvious that's an act of the
flesh.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
Yeah, don't indulge in it.

Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
But um, all right.
Next, relational sins.
Next, Hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition
, uh, dissension and factions.
Okay, so these are what you'dcall relational sins, because
they all deal with you and otherpeople, and I want you just to
note how many are listed therefor relational.
This just shows how importantthe relationship element is to

(01:04:11):
God.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
So you said hostility , so I guess an implied this is
hostility, strife, jealousy,fits of anger, disputes,
dissensions and factions.
Well, let's take each one ofthem.

Speaker 3 (01:04:22):
Ready, All right.
Hatred or an uh enmity, GoshHatred.
We'll just go with hatred.

Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
But that's the Greek word.
Hostility is what they've gotin an amplified Bible.

Speaker 3 (01:04:32):
Okay, so hostility Greek is extra Uh, it means to
be hostile or aggressive to thepoint of alienation or the
removal of fellowship.
He said it's extra.
Extra, extra.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
Extra, but with an X man you're being so extra.
Oh my gosh, I'm using thatforever.
That's hatred right.

Speaker 3 (01:04:50):
But the idea, though, is that it's not just like oh,
I don't like that person, right,it is.
I don't like them to the pointthat I'm going to alienate them
and remove myself fromfellowship with them, right?
So when you?
That's why we talk about racism, for example is extra, right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:09):
Why is it extra?

Speaker 3 (01:05:10):
Because you're saying um or or, you know, Jim Crow
era segregation, that was hatred.
Why?
Because you're literally sayingbecause of the color of this
other person's skin, I will notmaintain fellowship with them,
I'm going to alienate, we'regoing to alienate ourselves from
each other Because of thatfactor.
That's me.
That, that, that's extra Right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:30):
So everybody was extra that is acts of the flesh.

Speaker 3 (01:05:34):
Obviously, we all know hatred is the opposite of
love, right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:38):
So I always I was not always, but more recently heard
that a hatred, true hatred, canonly come from a place of love,
like there has to be someoffense to, either to the person
that you love or to somethingthat you love or something like
that.
You can't just have like hatredon its own.
This has to be tied back tosomething.

Speaker 2 (01:05:57):
That can also be learned.

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
What do you mean?
Because I how do you tie anemotion to it?
Like because hate takes effort,he takes real effort.

Speaker 3 (01:06:08):
I think there, there, there is a racism can be
learned as a just.
This is a comment like yeah, weall believe this right, no, oh
no, no, kidding, yeah, no, thatnot it, right, but it's not out
of the hatred of themselves,it's just something that they
were taught.
Right, you got.
You know you can haveinstitutional, systemic racism
which is like, hey, there arecertain things that are in place

(01:06:29):
, or at least have a history ofbeing brought into that, because
of racism.
Right, but you're having second,third or effects of that.
But then there's like racism,racism which is hatred.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
Right, like I, I, I, you string somebody up and hang
them like that's a whole.

Speaker 3 (01:06:44):
Yeah, I do not like you because of the color of your
skin, yeah, and in fact, Ican't even be in the same room
with you.
We're not using the same toilet, right, that is extra.
Right, that is hatred.
And again, that's an act of theflesh, the opposite of this
being obviously fruit of thespirit.
Love, right, and you cannot bewalking in the spirit and then

(01:07:05):
be walking in extra at the sametime.

Speaker 1 (01:07:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
Right, if you're living life in extra, then
you're not walking in the spirit, right, if?
If there's something thatyou're like, I am alienating
myself from you, and I thinkpeople try to tend to be very
forgiving and gentle onthemselves with this.
That's what it is Human nature,Because there's people that I

(01:07:28):
know that they're like oh, Ican't hang out with them because
they're a Democrat.

Speaker 1 (01:07:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
Oh, really.
So you're going to, you'regoing to ruin Thanksgiving for
this, you're going to cut offfellowship with this human being
, somebody who was created inGod's image.
Right, you're going to removeyourself from fellowship with
them because they're politicalaffiliation.
That's hatred.

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
That's extra.
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no,no, no, that's literally extra.

Speaker 3 (01:07:51):
But but but that's not.
You know, I'm not, that's notlike Ku Klux Klan hatred, that's
just.
I don't like liberals.
You know the oh, the libtards,right?
No, that's that's extra.
You are removing fellowshipwith somebody because of that
Right.
That's extra.
You're not walking in thespirit with that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:08:05):
So we tend to be very kind of ourselves.
But I think if you actuallystart looking at, who have I
removed fellowship from andwe're not talking about specific
situations where there's thisproven toxicity of no, when I,
when I've engaged in that person, like it's just you know what I
mean it's unproductive, it isdangerous, it is whatever.

(01:08:27):
We're just talking generalityof that group of people or
persons, simply by this onething Nothing personally they've
done to me, just theirassociation.
Right, that's extra, yeah, orextra Right.
I think it's kind of funny isbecause modern culture tries to
make hatred illegal.
Right the.
The nonsense of cancel cultureis like you will love or we're

(01:08:51):
going to cancel you.

Speaker 1 (01:08:52):
It's just like yeah, but that's a form of hatred,
because they're quickly runningto hating someone before there's
even who's not loving what theylove Right.
That was the CVV Ant-Man and theWasp Quantamania, the bad guy
that was on there.
He basically he almost lost hisjob with Disney because his
girlfriend accused him ofphysically assaulting him and he

(01:09:16):
was able to.
He presented a bunch ofevidence to the contrary.
But there was a few monthsthere, even up to yesterday,
when I was talking to to one ofour other sound techs, where
he's like man, I really likethis guy, but he abuses women
and it's like, well, you'rejumping to conclusions here.
He actually presented a bunchof evidence to the contrary and
he probably didn't do that.

Speaker 3 (01:09:35):
The case is still upcoming, but it's like you just
jumped straight to hate him.
The Johnny Depp stories.

Speaker 1 (01:09:40):
Yeah, exactly Johnny Depp.
They dragged his career throughthe mud for three years before
it all went on on TV.
And then Amber Heard got foundbasically to be probably insane,
honestly, at this point.
But but we jumped to hate, wedestroyed his career, we
canceled right Right, withoutactually going through the
judicial process.
That's why we have a judicialprocess, so this is not supposed

(01:10:02):
to happen.

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
But, but I think the larger point, though, is that
you can't regulate love andhatred in society.
You can't arrest somebody'sheart.

Speaker 1 (01:10:10):
You can't cancel.
What a cute sentence.
You cannot.
You cannot cancel somebody'sheart.
Yeah Right, you can't arrest myheart.

Speaker 3 (01:10:17):
Right, you can't, you can.
You can maybe cancel meprofessionally, but you cannot
cancel my heart.

Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:10:23):
So you could try to make everybody walk around
acting a certain way, but thatdoesn't.
That's not a true reflectionnecessarily who they are Right.
So next one Discord.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
This is Eris.
I gotta remember to put that indescription description
somewhere.
Can't cancel you, can't cancelmy heart, yeah.
You can't arrest my heart.
That's what it was.
That sounds like a 1980s lovesong.
Yeah, it does.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
You can't arrest my heart baby.

Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
It's just like that that BC Audi Colt.

Speaker 1 (01:10:49):
That, oh my gosh.
That sounds like the name oflike some you know rock band,
Rock band from the 80s?
Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 3 (01:10:56):
Anyways, all right.
Next one Discord Greek wordEris.
It means being contentious,coralsome or always in the
middle of fights.
Okay, it literally means to bein love with fighting or arguing
.
So you, you know, we all know,I literally have said that
before that I really enjoyarguing.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
I haven't said it recently, but that was literally
something that I used to say.
That is an act of the fleshthere I totally get it.

Speaker 3 (01:11:21):
You're creating discord within and remember the
whole.
I guess larger concept ofGalatians here is Paul's vastly
concerned of unity, Whoa, Unityin the church, right, Unity in
the church.
If you are somebody who's anact of discord, how is that
helping unity in the church Ifyou're always wanting to argue,
debate, oppose, challenge anyand everything?

(01:11:45):
That's ever right?
Yeah, You'll notice this inchurch and I've noticed this too
.
It's a very interesting concept.
We were talking Darrell Lackeyhe is the president of the
Inland Empire missions forCalifornia and we had a problem
with somebody in the church thatperson or personality who was

(01:12:08):
essentially discord, alwaysfighting, always fighting right,
and we were having this problem, we were getting his wisdom on
it.
He's like well, one thing you'regoing to notice about scripture
and I thought this was amazinginsight he said because he was
putting on some conference.
I don't know if it was like amarriage conference, I don't
know what it was but he wasessentially saying there's no
really such thing as conflictresolution in the Bible.

(01:12:29):
There is how to deal withconflict to people, how to deal
with people in discord.
He said, one of the thingsyou'll notice is that, and all
the little arguments and fightsyou have in church, there's
generally always one constantthere's somebody who's always at
the center, right, so you mayhave four personalities in any

(01:12:50):
given argument or fight, butgenerally one of those people is
going to be the same personfrom fight to fight to fight.
And the discord people dragpeople into their fights, drag
people into their arguing andyou're like man, you're right,
and he says but the scripturedeals with is how to handle
those people, Because if youremoved the discord from that
person, those other three peoplewho are involved in this fight

(01:13:11):
probably wouldn't be fighting.
There wouldn't be disunity here.
Discord is a big deal,especially for like church unity
, right.
But for those who are in lovewith fighting, he's saying the
spirit is not in love withfighting and arguing.
The spirit is one of unity,right.
So you can't be walking in thespirit, then you're walking in
discord at the same time.

Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
Yeah, so I know I mentioned at the beginning of
Ryan's point with this, this wasdefinitely something that I
didn't even know.
I was struggling with that, andstruggling is like a strong
term because, like it's one ofthose like oh man, I didn't even
know, that was like something Iwasn't should have been doing
All right, like I was someonewho lived for arguments, who
lived, and Selena knows it.

(01:13:49):
Like what you'd Selena like, I'mmarried to a boy where Selena's
like I don't even care what youchoose, Just make a decision.
And I would just be like, no,but I love this discussion and I
would, and it's like, but wewere just like arguing for the
sake of argument.
I loved arguing for the sake ofarguing.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
Yeah, and I was like I wouldn't even bring things up
to you, because whenever I wouldjust start a conversation, you
wanted to be like but this iswhat I think.

Speaker 1 (01:14:14):
Yeah, it's like, it's like honey, I just want you to
listen and.
I didn't have that as like aconcept in my head yet.
Like it took like a yearcounseling where I just enjoyed
arguing with the counselorbefore I started listening to
her too.

Speaker 3 (01:14:24):
It was a whole point we talked about, you know,
discord for church unity, butyeah, marriage discord in a
marriage just for the sake of itand it's exhausting, but yeah
so.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
But what I was thinking was that and I mean
Selena, you might say that youcompletely disagree, but I feel
like I've grown since then thatI haven't really argued for the
sake of arguing.

Speaker 2 (01:14:46):
And I talked about like I'm arguing for the sake of
arguing and then you just kindof like suck the energy out of
people like me.
Yeah, but I didn't really thinkabout it that way, but now it's
like.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
it's almost like it went away as I've tried to point
more towards Christ.

Speaker 3 (01:15:04):
It's one of the things that I've been like we
said in the beginning about thesigns, as you're weaving base
right.
This is a a victory or a battlethat you're like oh.

Speaker 1 (01:15:13):
I didn't even know I was hurting people like that.
That was me, but now it's notme.

Speaker 3 (01:15:17):
And yeah, I have victory Like walking in the
spirit.
I have victory here now.

Speaker 1 (01:15:20):
It's like it's an identity.
I had that I.
I was straight up.
I was like Christ, that was aGod thing, cause I didn't even
really work to solve thatspecific thing.
Christ just made it happen sothat I could do other things.

Speaker 3 (01:15:32):
So remember again this is a good example of when
we talked about last week.
We're Paul.
Paul talks in the positive.
Well, how do I not live in theflesh and live in?
He says, go live in the spirit,right.
Because if you're living in thespirit, then you're not going
right, Gosh right, and you don'teven realize.
That's why he's saying it.
It's a positive thing that youneed to start doing this instead

(01:15:52):
of just instead of just sayingokay, I need to stop being, you
know, so argumentative withpeople, so we make the negative
right.
I'm going to stop doing this andyou don't stop doing it.
That's why Paul says it's notabout what you stop doing, it's
what you need to start doing.

Speaker 1 (01:16:07):
The acts of the flesh are already incompatible with
the spirit.
So if you are pursuing spirit,then it's boom.

Speaker 3 (01:16:14):
Yeah, m ran is already compatible with the acts
of the flesh.
Ryan's already compatible withthe acts of the flesh, but but
what he's saying is that so ifyou want to get over the acts of
the flesh, you start walking inthe spirit and being more
compatible with the spirit asyou walk and grow with the
spirit, or that becomes moreabout what you're compatible
with.
You're less compatible withthat right, because you can't

(01:16:34):
have both.

Speaker 1 (01:16:35):
You literally can't, so that's that's, that's awesome
.
That's a thank you for sharingthat, because that's.
I think that's a good personalexample right, Like yeah, I'm
here just like fireworks goingoff, so like holy moly.

Speaker 3 (01:16:47):
So we got more.
We still got plenty.
We got.
We were able to poke Imran'sright, his surprise.

Speaker 1 (01:16:52):
We're going to get to .

Speaker 3 (01:16:53):
Selena yeah, that's what I'm wondering.
So, the next one here isjealousy, or zeal, depending on
your translation.
The Greek word is literallyzealous.
It means like literally.

Speaker 1 (01:17:03):
That's a better way of saying that Why'd we zealous?
Zealous sounds cooler thanzealous Such an awesome language
.

Speaker 3 (01:17:10):
So anyways zealous, what we would call zeal.
Well, what is the whole?
Because you hear people hey,he's really zealous, you know,
for Christ, or Paul says that hewas zealous for the law, Like
what do?
we mean by zealous?
Well, the etymology of the wordit means to literally boil over
.
So if I'm saying that I'mzealous for Jesus, what it means

(01:17:31):
is that the love and thepassion and the you know, all
those things that I have forChrist, I just can't contain
within me.
It boils out from me.
I have a zeal for scripture,meaning there's a lot of people,
I think, who are able to readtheir Bible and have some really
cool takeaways that help anddisciple them right and they

(01:17:52):
keep it to themselves.
I'm a guy when I learnsomething cool, I'm calling
somebody.

Speaker 1 (01:17:58):
I like that Pastor talks about some people like
that and his yeah, I mean, I goback and forth all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:18:02):
It's like hey, want to know what I just learned,
right, Like I can't hold it, andmaybe for a Bible study or, you
know, a sermon.
I'm like I cannot wait to sharethis.
I can't keep this to myselfuntil then.
Right, Selena talks about thaton Thursdays.

Speaker 1 (01:18:18):
It's fast, You'll be like you know what I just
learned, and like we'll pull heraway from like working on the
programs and stuff to like walkher through something.

Speaker 2 (01:18:24):
Yeah, I know, I know he's going to preach in like
three weeks out.

Speaker 1 (01:18:29):
Yeah, because he's like super ahead of schedule
with planning his sermons andSelena's like all right.
So in like a month past he'sgoing to talk about this and
that he just cannot contain it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:36):
Yeah, it's a zeal right you have this zeal for
scripture.

Speaker 3 (01:18:39):
So the word here is zeal.
So what Paul is using is it'snot that zeal.
Zeal is bad in itself.
The context makes it negativeor positive.
What he's talking about in anegative sense is when we have a
zeal for things that are reallyjust a zeal for idols, right?
Or you have this.

(01:19:00):
The reason why he says jealousyis the sense of I see somebody
else with something I don't haveand I have a zeal for that
thing or that person or whatever, but I can't contain that
within me.
It boils over right and topursuing it Like.
You could almost put even youknow lust in a sense into that

(01:19:22):
same category of it's not justthat you like, oh, I find that
person attractive, but there's azeal.
It starts boiling over torestart pursuing that person
Right, because you have a zealfor that thing.
That is not of the spirit,right.

Speaker 2 (01:19:38):
I like that word better than my translation,
which has jealousy, because whenI think of the definition of
jealousy, I think of likesomething that is rightfully
yours, which is why we say Godis a jealous God, because we
belong to him.

Speaker 3 (01:19:53):
So but this is this is more saying.

Speaker 1 (01:19:57):
I don't think that that's not what I get from
jealousy at all.

Speaker 3 (01:19:59):
What he's saying is that God is zealous for you, god
has a passion for you, that hisaffection for you boils over,
right?
It's almost like the affectionGod has for us boils over within
his own character, out to us,right.

Speaker 1 (01:20:15):
You know, man I have something you know how you say.
You don't like that song.
Reckless love because of theword reckless.

Speaker 3 (01:20:20):
I never said.
I said I would have probablychose a different word, but I
like the song, but when they soI listened to a commentary on
the song.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
This is recently when the artist who wrote the song
describes why he called itreckless love.
He describes it with zealous,because God's love for us is
zealous.
He's pursuing us, even when wedon't want him, even when it
doesn't make any sense.
It's pouring over, boiling overhimself, right, exactly,
boiling pot of water that starts, and so us looking at God, do

(01:20:50):
that, we would look at that andcall it reckless is why he
called the song with love.

Speaker 3 (01:20:55):
But yeah so, and then that's a positive sense, right,
that's a positive zeal.
Where he's talking about thenative, it's probably more a
good way to say it If you willget somebody like, say, who
holds grudges, they can't letthings go, but they try to hold
it in and it just boils overwithin them, right, kind of like
you know, pastor David waspreaching on a day about your

(01:21:17):
words right, when you holdthings, in like it has to have
an outlet.
It's what do you call it?
A weakie heart.

Speaker 1 (01:21:23):
He actually used that phrase today.

Speaker 3 (01:21:25):
Yeah, as I'm saying that's what he's so a weakie
heart.
It's like I keeping these stuff, this stuff in unaddressed and
it starts leaking out in mymouth right, eventually, that's
essentially what Paul was sayinghere the weakie heart.
It is a negative zeal.
It is you're keeping things andit boils over outside of you in
an improper way, right, so zeal.

(01:21:47):
Next one fits of rage, right,this is easy, straight forward,
right?
Boom, it's thumos that's agreat word.
Like so, like thanos, right,but thumos, nice.
It means fits of rage,outbursts of wrath or passion,
right, literally means losingyour temper.
Yeah, so I don't think I haveto spend a whole lot of time on

(01:22:09):
this one, other than saying thatthis idea is the inverse of
being in control of emotion.
So, to fit of rage or losingyour temper.
It's not just simply that likeoh, he's angry, it's that.
The bigger deal behind that isthat you do not have control
over your emotion.
You have not mastered andthat's another one that's coming

(01:22:33):
up here is mastery, but youhaven't mastered self.
You have not been able to bringyour body, your words, your
eyes, your ears, all that stuff,under control.
So, it's still just kind of freeflowing and you have these fits
of outward outspilling emotion.
That's wrong, right,particularly, as applied to

(01:22:54):
anger, so that one's prettyself-explanatory, right, yeah.
Next one selfish ambition.
So this Greek word is erythiaand it literally the most
literal meaning of that word oflike.
What it translates to is aself-seeking mercenary.
If you think about what amercenary is right there.
I do anything for money, right?

(01:23:17):
So?
you want that person dead Upunto death Right, you want that
person dead, I'll go.
Oh yeah, I'll take it as longas it's money right.
It's the idea that there is nohigher ideal than self, right.
It's narcissism.
It is I am the center of thisworld.

Speaker 1 (01:23:31):
That's almost the reverse.
So if porneia is that theimpurity where you're pursuing
that stuff, I actually would saythat something like that would
be like the only fans side whereyou're putting yourself out
there in these inappropriateways, ultimately for money, and
you're doing more and moredramatic and inappropriate
things to try and get money.

(01:23:53):
So it's like, it's like theultimate there, I would say,
like this one would be likemercenaries and something where,
like this one would be the samekind of it's like a very common
thing.

Speaker 3 (01:24:02):
That you are doing in pure acts, sexual sin with this
selfish ambition.
Social sin, right or not socialsin, I'm sorry, relational sin.
So I'm not just doing somethingsexually impure, I'm doing it
for selfish ambition.

Speaker 1 (01:24:17):
Yeah, self is what makes me think of like only fans
.
It's kind of yeah, that's agood example, right, but not the
use of only fans.
The actual person is puttingthings up there on only fans.

Speaker 3 (01:24:27):
Exactly.
Yeah, it's just the idea thatsomeone who pursues themselves
on that other cost what division, what strife, how many people I
hurt?
As long as I am serving selfand I'm leveling up myself,
that's all that matters.

Speaker 1 (01:24:40):
And I guess I hope that there's no one that's like
on here thinking that like onlyfans was not a sin.

Speaker 3 (01:24:45):
But okay, that's a lot of acts of the flesh are
obvious, people.

Speaker 1 (01:24:50):
I would say a good chance.

Speaker 3 (01:24:52):
Used in that way, I guess which is the most common
way to be used a way, though Ithink selfish ambition can
manifest itself in church,because church is a interesting
thing to navigate, because,particularly people who've been
in church for a while or grew upin the church, they know all
the right things to say.
Right, they know the verbiagethat they came and twist.
You know, if they're biblicallyliterate, they can twist
certain things to where, forsome people, they're like he's

(01:25:14):
saying that this is okay by theBible.
I don't think it is, but Ican't really debate them on it.
Right, like people can be verydangerous that way.
But you know, you see peoplesometimes where yeah, I like to
use this example a lot, but Ithink it's just when I see a lot
.
But you, know, are you servingin that ministry?
Because you're serving Christin the kingdom.
Are you serving in thatministry, because that's where

(01:25:36):
the pretty girl is.
Yeah, or you're serving thatministry for the accolades right
, or the accolades, or yeah, Igo feed the hungry for food for
life on Saturday, but but that'sreally just so I can get my
community service certificatefor my college scholarship, or
you know what I mean.
That's selfish ambition, justbecause you're doing good things
, the heart by which you do itmatters right.

(01:25:58):
Christ hits that like that's oneof the big central themes of
the gospel of Matthew.
Christ is hitting at theintention of the heart, the
intention right.
And if your intention is notfor him, then it is selfish
ambition right.

Speaker 1 (01:26:11):
I want to bring up Erythia.
I want to bring up somethingthat happened today in service
when I was sitting therelistening to Pastor Sermon, and
his sermon was on the that yourmouth is the outpouring of your
heart.
So if your mouth extends theintention of your heart, right
Kind of we talked a little bitabout it before and as he was
bringing up what the damage, thedamage that can be done by you

(01:26:35):
not having control over yourwords, there was a lot of
silence in the room, you know,as people were listening to this
, this message, but in thatsilence I don't know the couple
that was sitting behind me, butit was a I believe it was a
husband and wife that weresitting behind us and I heard
the like.
I heard the wife lean over toher husband and just say like
I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:26:57):
Oh, I didn't hear that.

Speaker 1 (01:26:58):
Yeah, and her husband said something back to her.
I don't remember.
I didn't hear exactly what hesaid, but she was just like.
I just wanted to tell you.
I'm so sorry.

Speaker 3 (01:27:07):
Oh, that's great.

Speaker 1 (01:27:08):
And then after the message, when pastor said you
know you can come up to thealtar, blah, blah, blah blah.
I was in the.
I went up to play the drums,looking out to the audience, and
they had come up to the altarand she was just laying it out
on the altar and he had his handon her.

Speaker 3 (01:27:24):
I was like see, this is how Ron I am when when he
gave his example of how he wouldcarry around a list a list of
everything with Rebecca, so whenshe was driving him crazy he
would read the list and begrateful for her, so right to
check his heart right before hewould blow up on her.
I went and grabbed a pencil andI handed it to my wife and I
start writing a list.

Speaker 2 (01:27:49):
All right, that's how , ron, I am All right.

Speaker 3 (01:27:51):
Moving on to the next one Descension.
This is Dicos Tasia.
Now, dicos Tasia is literallymeans a division that is wrongly
, that wrongly separates orplaces people into pointless
groups or factions.
Okay, so this is.
You're creating groups andfactions of people plantlessly.

(01:28:13):
It doesn't need to be that way,but you're doing it and really
this is which one Descension,and that's where that whole word
like you're creating dissension.
You're making dissension amongpeople.
Well, how are you doing that?
Well, I'm putting people indifferent groups that don't need
to be there, right.
So racism, right that, like webrought up, earlier was hatred

(01:28:33):
right, but racism is a isdissension right.
You are putting people by right, right, I guess every is every
every is.

Speaker 1 (01:28:41):
that's why is there is because you're creating a
distinction and a separationRight.

Speaker 3 (01:28:46):
That is dissension, that that is identity politics
is dissension.
That is a corporate collective.
You know execution ofdissension across a nation.
That's fascinating Right.
Classism is dissension, Sexismis dissension, Ageism is
dissension.
All that you know when I heardrecently ableism like yeah,

(01:29:08):
ableism is a dissent.

Speaker 1 (01:29:09):
Having a dissent against people that are
handicapped.

Speaker 3 (01:29:11):
for those that haven't heard that word before
All of that stuff is, you'reessentially creating dissent
among people pointlessly byputting them in groups.
That that's why in earlier inGalatians, right, there's
neither Juno, gentile, miller,female free nor slave, for we
are all one in Christ Jesus, yep, right.
So unity means being one wherehe's like to get rid of those

(01:29:32):
pointless dissensions, as Iapplies to the faith, right.
Then we come back and startputting people back in those
little categories.
He's like that's dissensionshouldn't exist in the church.
It speaks to communities whowork more to divide themselves
than unite, right, yeah, and I'mjust saying this politically on

(01:29:52):
both ends.
Do you see people work harderto keep people divided in those
isms or working harder to unitepeople from them?

Speaker 1 (01:30:03):
Hey man, depends on the time of year.

Speaker 3 (01:30:04):
You're saying no, this is pretty much where we're
always trying to keep themseparated.
That's dissension.
Yeah, government is activelyworking dissension.
Right and I know that I don'tsound like you know some Alex
Jones far right winger, but I'mjust saying by biblical
definition it's like.
But also the far right.

Speaker 1 (01:30:22):
The far right and the far left are trying to dissent
against each other instead ofany sort of meeting in the
middle or trying to figuresomething out.
But and that's even if yourideals are different Jesus never
sent or separated himself fromlike.
Jesus was amongst the sinners,teaching them and mentoring to
them and and trying to earn themto his side as well, and it's.

(01:30:47):
But it's like the opposite withpolitics instead of trying to
go to the other side, meet andtry to share ideals and
understanding and grow the,they're actually trying to do
the opposite.
They're saying you must stayaway from the other side because
X, y, z, you must isolateyourself, and now you kind of
put yourself in this like bubbleand then that creates that

(01:31:07):
dissension like you talked about.
So it's like I feel that withsome of the people in my family
where they're not even willingto have a discussion about
another perspective, becausethey're so Well.

Speaker 3 (01:31:21):
that goes into the very next one I slated, because
this next one's kind of verymuch related to it, which my
translation says factions.
But what's interesting is the.
Greek word, there is heresis,which is the Greek word for
heresy oh, interesting.
But here it's placed as arelational sin, right?
And how do we get heresy orfactions from heresy, right?

Speaker 2 (01:31:46):
What's heresy?

Speaker 3 (01:31:47):
So generally, when we need to talk about someone
who's a heretic or you're inheresy, generally what we think
of is, oh, these are wrongfulteachings, wrong ideas.

Speaker 1 (01:31:56):
So you remember, pastor brought up that Marine
who was saying that he washaving visions and from God.
But then, when he actually wasexplaining like, well, what did
God tell you?
None of that stuff was in linewith the Bible.

Speaker 2 (01:32:08):
And he was cussing while he was describing all that
, but the Marine didn't believeit was heresy.
So how do you know?

Speaker 1 (01:32:16):
Well, that's how you know that you're being a heretic
, you guys are jumping far ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:32:19):
I wasn't able to finish.
I'm sorry.
That's generally what we thinkof heresy is wrongful ideas
right.
If you look at or somebody likesomebody who adds something
onto Gnosticism, we would alwayssay, oh, that's heresy, because
they're twisting the gospel tobe something else.
Right, Most Christians holdMormonism to be heresy because

(01:32:40):
they're adding on to therevelation of Christ,
essentially saying that Christ'srevelation as displayed in the
gospels was incomplete andneeded a new revelation of
Joseph Smith right.

Speaker 1 (01:32:51):
You could argue that that's also like the Muslim
issue as well.

Speaker 3 (01:32:53):
Mohammed same thing.
So that's generally what wethink of when we talk about
heretics or heresy right.
But the actual etymology andmeaning of the word and the
Greek here isn't just it's awrongful idea, it's more
speaking to having a hardenedposition over a disagreement to
the point that you divideyourself from that person, right

(01:33:17):
.
So it's divisively making achoice, or the wrongful dividing
over opinions right thewrongful dividing over.

Speaker 1 (01:33:24):
That's interesting, because earlier in Galatians he
said that you must separateyourself from those teachers,
because that means that there'sa rightful dividing that can
take place.

Speaker 3 (01:33:32):
Well, I would say this is actually Well, yes, he
makes that point like you needto kick them out, right?
What he's talking about iswhat's earlier spoken about
Angolations, about Peter whowould break bread with the
Gentiles.
Then, when these teachers fromJerusalem show up with their
gospel, circumcision it saysthat he broke away his

(01:33:54):
fellowship from them.
That's essentially factionism.
He's saying I'm going to be onthe factions of the circumcision
party, right, these teachersthat are doing a gospel,
circumcision to the point thatI'm dividing myself away from
you and fellowship right.

Speaker 1 (01:34:08):
Because it's that wrongful, it's that wrongful
part that's important.

Speaker 3 (01:34:10):
It's almost like yeah , I mean, it's almost like
saying I'm choosing atheological camp, right.

Speaker 1 (01:34:18):
You hear?

Speaker 3 (01:34:19):
a lot of.
I'm a Calvinist, I'm a Arminian.

Speaker 1 (01:34:21):
Yeah.
So if you're that to the pointwhere you're not even willing to
commune and fellowship withother Christians, then that
would be factionism.

Speaker 3 (01:34:28):
Right, I can't go to this church because the pastor's
Calvinist or not Calvinist orwhatever.
Right To bad factionism.
That's factionism that createsthis unity, that's interesting,
and that is what here is reallycalled heresy.

Speaker 1 (01:34:44):
Yeah, heresy.
You know, from one of my buddiesthat just started going to
Palms and I asked him, like youknow, this was like a couple of
few Sundays ago.
He asked him like well, how didyou enjoy the service?
And he was like, how well thechurch that came came from, the
production for the worship wasjust like so much more, so much
grander, and I was just like, oh, that's cool, but how do you
like the sermon?

(01:35:04):
It's like, oh, I love thesermon.
It's like, well, that's what'simportant, you know, and we
talked a little bit more aboutlike the worship and all that.
But I kept tying it back tolike, yeah, but the sermon was
like clear, concise, Did it makesense?
He's like, oh, yeah, I love thepastor, love the pastor, love
the sermon.
It was really good.

Speaker 3 (01:35:18):
And the problem with that guy isn't.
It's not about the sermoneither.

Speaker 1 (01:35:22):
Well, hold on so fast .
Forward a week he comes back.
I'm like, oh, you're back.
And he's like, oh well, youknow, I really enjoyed the
teaching.
And it's like, oh, the worshipisn't what we're used to.
But I second, I like the church, I like the people here, and
then fast for another week andhe comes back again, comes back
with his wife sorry, hisgirlfriend and his girlfriend's
mother as well, who's in townand, and it's so it's

(01:35:45):
interesting to see that hedidn't allow that different
opinion about, like well, how weconduct our service, a little
bit different than what he'sused to, to separate him from us
you know that's good, so youend up falling into that.
Yeah right, exactly, yeah,that's, that's a good.

Speaker 3 (01:36:00):
So with that we're getting into our last class here
.
These are what we'd call socialsins.
Okay, these are things that youwould do out socially.
Verse 21, envy Okay.
So this is Pithonos.
This is bitterness that othershave what we don't.
Okay, that's what to pin.
To envy somebody is to havebitterness that people have

(01:36:22):
something that we don't.

Speaker 1 (01:36:24):
So it's a little bit more than it's like jealousy,
but from a different angle.

Speaker 3 (01:36:28):
Yeah, this is the, so the Stoics would call it.
Grief over someone else is good.

Speaker 1 (01:36:34):
So it's not.

Speaker 3 (01:36:36):
So it's oh man, um Emron, you got a promotion.
Or oh man, you got promoted amajor like being happy for you.
Right Envy is that man like?
It seems like Emron is like I'msad that he's he's doing well
in life and he's leveling up andhe's getting promoted and I'm

(01:36:56):
not like and and well you know,screw Emron right.
Why does he get all theblessing?
Why does he get?
Right, and it's being bitterover the fact that someone else
is doing well, yeah, or hassomething that you don't, or
you're right, but but I feelsome of that yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:37:12):
I feel some of that.
It's something that Idefinitely know that I struggle
with personally and also like Ithink I've definitely grown a
lot over the last couple yearsand kind of identified hey, I
have this as an issue and it'sand it is making me bitter, it's
making me very frustrated.
And then now it's like I haveone of my co-workers he's
awesome, absolutely incredible,um, a guy like when it comes to

(01:37:36):
being a Marine, you know, andbecause everyone has their
personal struggles and he hashis but like when it comes to
like doing the job that we'recalled to do as Marines, well,
like he is exceptionally good atit, and I used to harbor some
bitterness and jealousy for himbecause of how like much I in
some ways like look up to him inthis, in this job.

Speaker 3 (01:37:58):
But now I'm still growing, but it's like I have
mature minds, like so.
There's difference betweenadmiration, though, and envy.
No, no, no, it was envy, it wasan admiration.

Speaker 1 (01:38:07):
You were bitter towards him because of this,
yeah, and we're we're we'refriends and we're like
co-working as good stuff.
As I wouldn't I wouldn'tpublicly hold this against him
or anything like that but it'ssomething that I knew I was
harboring in my heart, butthat's been that's been breaking
down over the last few monthsof of just continuing to work
with him and interact with him,and I would definitely attribute

(01:38:28):
it to me growing more in myfaith too, of like well, he
rightfully so is in that placeand I'm glad he's in that place
because I can now I can lean onhim for advice, I can lean on
him for his maturity in this, inthis work, because he does this
so well and he has, on morethan one occasion since I've
kind of made that transition,he's helped me.

(01:38:49):
He didn't he doesn't know thiswhen I ask him the question, but
he helped me kind of like leadbetter in some other areas with
some of my other Marines,because I'll just like present
some situation to him and he'llgive me some really fantastic
advice.
But I wouldn't ask a questionbefore because of my frustration
?

Speaker 3 (01:39:03):
Yeah, exactly, and I would say another way to look at
this too it's not just it's,it's not simply that you're
grieved over someone else's good, it's also being glad at
somebody else's misfortune.
That that is a form of envybecause it's about the heart.
Towards that right they havesomething I don't.

(01:39:25):
So when they do well, thatmakes me sad.
When they do bad, that makes mehappy.
Yeah.
Because, like remember theGameStop run, remember when they
uh oh the GameStop.

Speaker 1 (01:39:36):
Yeah, when their, when the stock just shot up,
when everyone shorted it, allthe billionaires shorted the
stock and everybody's like youknow what.

Speaker 3 (01:39:41):
They all started buying it out and just cost
billions towards thebillionaires.
Yeah, people were doing thatand look, I understand one of
the greatest wealthredistributions we've had in
recent memory.
I understand like making apoint as a protest, which I
think is really a protest whichI kind of dig right.
That's actually like a very tome a very American rebellious
spirit right Like yeah, yeah,Like there's something wrong

(01:40:03):
with this system.
But at the same time, peoplewere taking a lot of joy in the
fact that they were able to costpeople billions of dollars.
Yeah, why were they so joyfulthat they cost billionaires, uh,
billions of dollars?
Because they're envious thatthey have it and they don't.

Speaker 1 (01:40:21):
Yeah, right.
You go ask anybody who willhear people will go all the way
and be like they deserve it.
They deserve to lose that money.

Speaker 3 (01:40:28):
It's like, oh my gosh people were honest If you were
to ask them who here hatesmillionaires or billionaires.
Raise their hand right, andthen you probably ask the same
people who here wants to be amillionaire or billionaire?

Speaker 2 (01:40:40):
if they're honest right.

Speaker 3 (01:40:41):
That that's envy, that that's, that's an envious
spirit.

Speaker 1 (01:40:44):
Um next, I love it.

Speaker 3 (01:40:46):
Um, this one's pretty self explanatory.
But drunkenness, that's methane.

Speaker 1 (01:40:49):
Methane what.

Speaker 3 (01:40:51):
Methane.
But it means what it means.
Right, it's drinking intoimpairment.
But, um, paul calls this alsoin Ephesians, chapter five.
Um, was it first 18?
He calls drunkennesswastefulness.
So so let me kind of explainthis, uh, because it's an
interesting way of looking at it.
Right, in Paul's day, alcoholactually had a positive health
benefit.
Water wasn't as clean.

(01:41:12):
You know, the cooking, you knowthose things weren't as it's.
A lot of bacteria would kind ofclean water it's hard to get to
you Right, and the way food wasprepared, right, yeah, so a lot
of bacteria would get in yourgut, right.
So a healthy dose of wine andalcohol would help in terms of,
like, essentially, your immuneand keeping you healthy, right.
So that's why he actuallyencourages them, like, hey, be

(01:41:34):
drinking wine, like be takingcare of your body right, um so
there's health benefits withalcohol in his day, but, but you
don't need to get hammered toaccomplish that, yeah, right.
So his point is this is to getdrunk.
There's a few ways that this iswasteful One you're wasting
wine, right?
Something that plays a positiverole of health, particularly in

(01:41:55):
his culture and society.
Yeah, some of that is positiverole.
You're just wasting it, likeall that wine you're drinking
that could be helping insustaining you for longer.
You're just completely wastingit, right, it's wastefulness.
Um, so, in a practical sense,he me, I you know he's speaking
to that.
It's also a waste of money, it'sa waste of time and, more

(01:42:17):
importantly, I think, is a wasteof your mind, right?
So let's, let's go back to theidea.
Oh man the identity discussiondiscussion again right, one of
the the factors of identity isyou are your mind, how you think
, um, but you commit your yourmind to right.
So if your mind plays a keyrole in your identity, when you
get, you know, slosh drunk, youlose your mind.

(01:42:40):
Yeah, right, you are notliterally, right Like so
literally.
You are literally marring theidentity that God has given you
for that time that you're drunk.

Speaker 2 (01:42:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:42:50):
Right.
So that part of it is likethat's why people do things that
they otherwise would not dowhen they're drunk.
Yeah, you are not who you arewhen you are drunk.
Yeah, that is not your identity.
You're essentially escapingidentity and being something
you're completely not, and hesays that's a waste.
You're wasting your mind,you're wasting the time, you're
wasting money, you're wastingthe wine itself, but overall,

(01:43:14):
like overall though you're,you're living into an identity
that you are not something,something, uh, an interesting
kind of point on that of, like,your identity changing when
you're intoxicated and, uh, andhow that impacts, um, your walk.

Speaker 1 (01:43:28):
When Selena was in Spain, um, that was probably the
longest time I've ever gonewithout alcohol, right In in a
while.
In a while, obviously, I went18, 20, 21 years of alcohol.
I didn't drink before I, uh,turned 21 because I was very
afraid of losing my scholarship,but, um, that's a whole other
separate thing.
But, uh, the 10 days of Selenawas in Spain, I didn't, I didn't
drink.
There was no alcohol in thehouse.

(01:43:50):
I was very tempted to drink, Iwas very bored at home and I
also tried to be out of thehouse, but I knew that, like, if
, if I drank, I'm just I'm, I'malready struggling.
So why would I give myselfanother excuse?
Why would I take my ability tocontrol myself away?
Cause that's really whatalcohol does and being in
drunkenness that does is thatthose walls that you erect,

(01:44:13):
those barriers that you erect,you're basically knocking them
down by remembering thatinhibition, I don't need to give
Satan another opportunity toExactly.
It's like so, um, but that's oneof those know thyself things,
and it's like I am so afraid ofdamaging my spiritual walk right

(01:44:34):
now that, furthest, furthesttime, I'm not even going to
drink, cause it's not worth therisk.

Speaker 3 (01:44:40):
And some people will say, well cause, that's not a
waste of time, like that's whatI prefer to do, that's how I
want to use my time.
It's like, no, you want to useyour time being conscious of
yourself time, because you couldotherwise spend that time
glorifying God in some way,serving somebody, loving
somebody right, reading rightInstead of getting growing
maturing yourself out of yourmind.
You could be reading somethingthat enhances your mind, right?

(01:45:04):
But besides, the point is,because of time, this last one,
which is orgies, and that thatis the Greek word comos.
Now, this isn't orgies like wethink, right.

Speaker 1 (01:45:16):
Yeah, cause we already covered it More and
earlier.

Speaker 3 (01:45:19):
This is, remember, we're kind of in the, the realm
of social acts of the fleshright, so essentially, what an
orgy is, and this in thiscontext, is like essentially
uncontrolled partying.
Like you, you it's somethingyou do socially with people,
it's not me, yeah, just gettingdrunk on you know, by myself,
like you were saying, like, ohyou know, if Selena was gone I

(01:45:40):
could you know, if I wanted toget hammered at home by myself.
You know, that's not.
That's not an orgy, right.

Speaker 1 (01:45:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:45:47):
The orgy is a communal thing where we are all
partying relentlessly, which inthe context of Rome would
include like a sexual orgy incertain contexts and certainly
in certain temples, right, butit is a much more broader term
within.

Speaker 1 (01:46:07):
like Roman Greek, yeah, it kind of ties back to
the debauchery as well, ordebauchery and the other and
lewdness as well.
It's that you're, if you'regetting in this drunken or orgy
state now you've put yourself ina position where you're set up
to sin as well.

Speaker 3 (01:46:24):
Debauchery speaks to the you personally as an
individual right.
Orgy speaks to you doing thiscommunally?
So, yeah, these social sins.
Right Is essentially him sayingthese are things that you
generally do socially and youneed to stop so when you look at
envy, you're like well, how isenvy a social thing?
Right Because it manifestsitself socially right.

(01:46:48):
Orgy is obviously unfetteredpartying.
It's debauchery, except in acollective sense, drunkenness
right Same.

Speaker 2 (01:46:55):
Thing.

Speaker 3 (01:46:55):
So but yeah, so that's it right, we went down
the list.
If I could just, you know, sayI'm pretty confident that at
least one of those hit somebodyat least one.

Speaker 1 (01:47:08):
At least one hits everybody Right.
And if none of them hit any ofyou, then narcissist is the one.
So go back to that one.
There you go.
Yeah, you're the selfishambition category.
Just go ahead and go rewindabout 45 minutes when we're
talking about you for that onenow.
Yeah, yeah, start over.

Speaker 3 (01:47:25):
You fall in that category if you think none of
these apply to you.
But again, just to reiterate atthe very beginning, though,
notice how, here, in verse 21,.
How does Paul finish it out?
Right, so he says and envy,drunkenness, orgies, and how
does he finish?
And the like yeah, right,there's things beyond this right
he brought up like only fansand like all these specific

(01:47:48):
things that people are like.
Well, what about this right?
Is it wrong to look at aplayboy?
I mean, is that reallypornography?
Can you see Jesus looking at aplayboy?
It is obvious, right, acts ofthe flesh are obvious.
There's more than just what'slisted here, right, I think
there's like 18 that we justwent through, but there's more
than just that.
He's just giving you a bunch ofexamples.

(01:48:08):
These are acts of the flesh.
Is what I'm talking about?
This is what's obvious.
So, we're going to pause there,because this is in tandem
pairing with the fruits of thespirit, right?
So one way to look at these islike okay, well, what is the
opposite of all these things?
What's the opposite of envy?
What's the opposite ofdebauchery?

Speaker 1 (01:48:27):
What is?

Speaker 3 (01:48:27):
the opposite of hate.
What's the opposite of?

Speaker 2 (01:48:32):
drunkenness right.

Speaker 3 (01:48:33):
Now you're going to start getting at the fruits of
the spirit, right?

Speaker 1 (01:48:36):
This is like.
This is like fruits of thespirit.
Part one works of the flesh.

Speaker 3 (01:48:41):
Yeah, be the title, yeah, but, like I said, stating
the obvious, like that's allPaul is doing.
He's.
I'm stating the obvious.
Yeah, I just want to providesome of the word context behind
it, because there's a little bitmore loaded behind some of
those words that I think wegenerally associate and the same
thing is going to go for thefruits of the spirit.
There's more loaded behind,like when he says kindness.

(01:49:02):
Well, there's a certain kind ofkindness he's referring to.
Yeah, it has certainimplications, Not just being
being friendzone nice withpeople.

Speaker 1 (01:49:10):
It's a little more complex than that, but we'll get
to that next week.
So, all right, this has beenawesome.
I'm not even going to give asuper long closeout because
we're already like closing ontwo hours, all right.
But thank you, ryan.
So much for the message today.
Selena, thanks for yourparticipation as well, and shout
out to listening to the endcard.

(01:49:30):
But we've got our social mediapages.
We've got a lot of good postsout there and we always
appreciate you all jumping in,sending us messages, asking
questions so we can jump in andand have a conversation with you
all, because this process isrelational.
This, this, this environment,this, not this environment, but
this time that we spend togetherto learn more about our God.

(01:49:54):
We're not going to answer everyquestion here, so we'll always
enjoy the opportunity to engagewith you, all right.
So that's our time.
This is part one of two.
Food to the spirit is finallycoming up.
I've been waiting months forthis.
I've literally been waitingmonths for this.
So join us next week as Ifinally get to hear the Food to

(01:50:17):
the Spirit episode.
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:50:23):
Thank you for tuning in to Real Bible Stories.
If you enjoyed this podcast, besure to leave a review, share
and subscribe to be notifiedeach week when we upload new
episodes.
Real Bible Stories is producedin partnership with Palm Church
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If you would like moreinformation or want to check out
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(01:50:46):
church website atpalmsbaptistchurchcom or check
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Real Bible Stories can be foundwherever podcasts are found.
Thank you again and we will seeyou next week.

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Ep 69 Decoding Galatians 5:19-21: A Comprehensive Deep Dive into Works of the Flesh

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