Ep 72 The Real Story Behind the Life of John Mark: Scribe of the Gospel

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Imran (00:05):
Hello and welcome to Real Bible Stories.
Join us as we deep dive intothe historic, religious,
cultural, political andemotional context surrounding
the real lives of real people inthe Bible and the stories we've
all grown to love.
Hello and welcome back to RealBible Stories.

(00:26):
I am your host, emron Ward, andwe are joined by my wife Selena
.
Hello, and for this nextupcoming series, we are joined
by Pastor David Squires.

David (00:34):
Hello, I'm so happy to be here.
Yeah, we'll be back.

Selena (00:37):
Yeah.

Imran (00:37):
It's been about a year now.

David (00:39):
No, I don't think so.

Imran (00:40):
I think it was around.
No, it was on January.
It was January.
Yeah, there you are on it, so alittle bit under a year since
we've had Pastor David Squireson the on the podcast here.
But for those that are justtuning in or haven't met you
before, pastor David is the headpastor at Palms Church, who
we're partnered with to kind ofproduce this broadcast, and
Pastor Ryan Brown, who is thetypical teacher on it.

(01:03):
He is also one of the pastorsat the church, so while Ryan is
teaching Bible study during thekind of weekly Bible study that
we do at the church now, pastorDavid is going to teach a couple
lessons over here on thepodcast.

David (01:16):
It's so fun.
He and I just trade off and soI'll teach Bible study for a
while and he'll do the podcastand we just get to trade.
I'm so excited about thisupcoming series because it's
literally when we talk aboutstories of the Bible, we're
doing stories behind the story.

Imran (01:31):
Yeah, so one of our big mission points of the real Bible
stories podcast is to hit atthe kind of background, history,
context, cultural relevance ofthe Bible in it in the day and
how that plays into kind of howwe live our lives today.
So this next series we're goingto be doing with Pastor David,
which is the story behind.

(01:52):
The story is really deep,diving into the some of the
specific characters that welearn about in the gospel and
looking at some of their history, some of how they, how they
grew up with the context they'regoing through at the time that
the scripture was being writtenabout them.

David (02:07):
We should go be like we're going to be really deep
and the truth is we're going tohave so much fun and we're going
to be really deep, yeah, likethis is the stuff that just
feeds you in Bible study.

Imran (02:16):
Exactly, and I always think that this is the context
that makes the Bible like, makessense.
Yeah, because, like, if youread the Bible on its own,
you're like, okay, that was agreat story, but how do I know
it's true and it's like, well,diving into this, these types of
like story behind the story,the history, the context, helps
legitimize the story that weknow to be true, or the book
that we know to be true, whichis the Bible.

David (02:37):
What we want to do, is, chase some stories that you, if
we chase these through the Bible, you'll see it kind of woven
together, but you don't just getone passage that puts this
whole thing together.
Yeah, and so we'll look at,like Aquila and Priscilla, or at
John Mark or the apostle John,what happened to John, where
we're where, who was thecommunity John was connected to,
and all these little behind thescenes things that end up in

(02:59):
our New Testament.
So we're just going to chasethe story behind the story.

Imran (03:02):
Yeah, and I'm super excited and I love everything
about that, because this is thisis going to be a series that is
perfectly in line with, like,what real Bible stories is about
.
I'm fired up, all right, so whois our first kind of character
or person that we're going to bediving into?

David (03:15):
today we are looking at a young man named John Mark.
John Mark and how we got thegospel of Mark.
Where did this thing come?

Imran (03:22):
from.
I was going to ask are wetalking about the gospel mark or
the gospel of John?

David (03:25):
Yeah, I guess John Mark, because he's got two names you
could you could go wait.
Which one is it?
This is going to be Mark, andthen a little bit later on,
we'll do John Okay.
So I think when you think aboutsomebody like John Mark, you're
really looking at somebody whois young.
He starts out young in theBible and the stories that we

(03:46):
encounter him.
I like it because so often theBible talks about how young
people are used and we don'tthink about that often Think
about David.
He was 17 when he went to fightGoliath.
Samuel was just a boy when hewas called by God.

Imran (04:00):
Yeah, we talked about Mary.

David (04:01):
Mary was probably a teenager, right so many people.
Jeremiah was young when Godcalled him.

Imran (04:07):
Yeah, Even most of the disciples.
In general they were prettyyoung, right it's like, wasn't
Peter the oldest?

David (04:12):
He was good.
Well, we know he was, cause hewas married.
But we tend to think of thedisciples as these old guys with
bald spots that's how theypaint them.
The disciples were probablyolder teenagers.
So they would have completedtheir work with Hebrew school,
their your work as children, andthen what we call college.
They would have attachedthemselves to a rabbi.
So some of them had alreadyattached themselves to John the

(04:32):
Baptist.
Then they switched over toJesus.
Think of Jesus like graduateschool.
But these are young men.
It's before you're fullyemployed.
You go and you attach yourselfto a rabbi and you learn.
So it makes sense.
Now, some of the fights theyhad, who are the greatest?
They're just young man fights,they're they're.
They're not men in their 30s,they're they're young.

Imran (04:52):
The greatest among us is like of course, that's what like
a teenager it is arguing aboutwith the, with the son of God?
Of course they would be.

David (04:58):
And they're embarrassed when Jesus acts.
Asks them what?
What are you guys arguing about?
We might have been arguing whowas greater than who.

Imran (05:05):
Yeah, I think I've 16.
I would have loved them andcalled the son of thunder Right
Primo the nickname given to meby Jesus Christ.
That'd be sick.

David (05:13):
So our young man that we're looking at tonight is
named John Mark and give you alittle bit of tradition about
him, his family probably comesfrom Serene, and there's other
people in the Bible that comefrom there.

Imran (05:26):
It's in.

David (05:26):
North Africa.

Imran (05:27):
Okay.

David (05:28):
It's probably.
It's what the Bible says.
It's where the man who carriedJesus cross came from, also
Simon Serene.
So there was a.
There's a Jewish, a Jewish areain that that area.

Imran (05:39):
So Jewish community in Northern Africa called Serene,
uh-huh Okay.

David (05:44):
So John Mark's father?
Traditionally we understandthat he was a Greek, he married
a Hebrew girl and his mother'sname was Mary, but not that Mary
.

Imran (05:53):
Oh yeah, that happens a lot.

David (05:55):
Yeah, it's apparently everybody in Bible times and New
Testament times was named Johnand Mary.

Imran (06:02):
Everybody's named John and Mary, that's right.
That's actually hilarious.
I wonder what are the two likego to names of right now.

David (06:08):
He would.
So when he married her, shewould have gone by her Hebrew
name, not Mary, but Miriam.

Imran (06:14):
Miriam, that's what Miriam, oh man.
So Miriam is the.

David (06:17):
Hebrew form of Mary.
So I named a daughter Miriam,because it was so popular.
To everybody's name Mary.

Imran (06:23):
I was like well hey, I'll be the Hebrew version of that.
Yeah, I'll beat the system.

David (06:26):
There you go.

Imran (06:28):
They named their son Did she respond to Mary, if you
called her Mary?

David (06:30):
No, she would not.
No, this man marries fromSerene.
He marries a Hebrew woman namedMary Miriam, and they named
their son a very Hebrew name,and so his Hebrew name is
Johannon John.

(06:51):
But they give him a Greekmiddle name and the middle name
is Marcus, and so we would sayJohn Mark.

Imran (06:57):
And you can see it.
Johannon Marcus, yeah.

David (07:00):
And this kid is named John Mark.
During that time, though,serene is under Roman control,
and the population is always anuprising against the Romans.
They're always fighting withthem.
The Romans cannot control thesepeople, so you can imagine what
a family is going to do.
What would you do Like ifthere's constant turmoil in the

(07:22):
streets?
The Romans can't keep control.
There's always a rebellion.
Eventually, this fairly wealthyfamily they not only have a
home in Serene, she has a homeout toward Jerusalem.

Imran (07:33):
Okay, so we know John Mark comes from a relatively
wealthy family.

David (07:37):
Absolutely yeah, so this family has multiple homes, they
have a business.
Well, eventually they just pickup from Serene and we don't
know exactly why, but they leavethere and they go to Jerusalem
and they live now in herhometown of Jerusalem and his
mom's hometown.
Yeah, and it seems that by thetime that Jesus comes along, the
father has died and this motheris now living with her son in

(07:59):
this home in Jerusalem.

Imran (08:02):
That's really important.
Where do we get some of thishistory in general about where
John came from?
Is it from the Apocrypha, is itfrom other just like scripts
that were written at the time wedo?
Where did it typically come?

David (08:17):
from.
Well, one Christian traditionwill give us a lot.
You can find stuff.
In a lot of times you findlarge historical movements and
characters in the writings ofJosephus.
Okay, In places like that, giveus those those background.
Church Fathers often gave usthe behind the scenes details of
what it was that was going on.

Imran (08:37):
Church Fathers, what do you mean by church?

David (08:39):
Historians, tritilian, just people that Christianity
has always been a writing peopleand so we've been writing and
so we have the scriptures.
But we also had people tellingus what was going on behind the
scenes.

Imran (08:51):
but you've got to read them to kind of know who some of
these people are so just likefamous, not even just famous,
but like writing from the churchleaders of the day about the
disciples, about their families.
They were writing all thisstuff down Exactly.
That makes sense, okay, and wehave all that, or at least we
have most of it we have a lot.

David (09:08):
What you always look for is the earliest person that
writes on something, becauseover time, tradition changes,
and so you always want to findthe earliest accounts of what it
is that.

Imran (09:17):
I also love that about Christianity is that we always
try and go back to what's theoldest, most and the oldest form
of what was written.

David (09:23):
Exactly.

Imran (09:25):
It's the most accurate.
So we're not just like changingover time.

David (09:27):
Yeah, yeah, we know that this family.
They own this house inJerusalem.
Show you something cool.
They probably owned the homewhere Jesus ate Passover.
So Mary owns the house and thischurch meets in the house all
the time.
It's probably the same housewhere Jesus ate the Passover,
the last meal Jesus would havewashed the disciples feet.

(09:48):
John Mark, can you imagine thisteenage boy and the rabbi is
there and he's peeking in asthese disciples are eating
Passover, as they're talkingwith each other?

Imran (09:59):
So was John Mark not one of the disciples?

David (10:01):
No, he was not one of the disciples.
He would have been really tooyoung.

Imran (10:04):
So the Mark.
So Mark that wrote the book ofMark was Same guy.
Was young in Jesus's day wouldhave observed everything that
took place, but wasn't one ofthe 12.

David (10:15):
Exactly, just imagine a boy tagging along 13, 14, I
don't know how old he is, but hejust, you know, he lives with
his mom and his mom is hostingthis Jewish rabbi.
Imagine that they're havingPassover and this kid keeps
peeking in.
He keeps peeking in.
What's going on?
Well, eventually they go out tothe garden.

(10:36):
Jesus takes his disciples tothe garden.
We have a reason to think thatJohn Mark followed them to the
garden.
Okay, so you know the G?
Y in the gospel of Mark.
So Mark is the one, of course,that wrote the gospel of Mark.
There's a weird verse that sothey go to arrest Jesus.
And you see it, selena, thiswonderful verse over here in

(10:56):
Mark 1451.

Selena (10:59):
And a young man followed him with nothing but a linen
cloth about his body and theyseized him, but he left the
linen cloth and ran away naked.

David (11:09):
Is that your favorite verse?
Is that?

Selena (11:10):
anybody's favorite.

David (11:13):
No, why is that in there?
Uh, they go to grab that.
Is it a wonderful and not goingto a little crazy something?
That's not in Matthew andthat's not not in Luke, it's
only in Mark.
But we usually believe thatMark was written first.
It's called the priority ofMark, so Mark is written first
and it's the shortest.
Matthew and Luke had each hadaccess to Mark and they copied

(11:35):
off of him, but they added theirown things.
That means that about about 85to 90% of Mark is repeated in
Matthew and Luke.
Every now and then.
We get really interested whenMatthew or Luke don't include
something from Mark, when theyskip it.
Yeah and the reason is that itwould be something only Mark's
hearers would be interested in.
Like it was, it was unique toMark.

(11:56):
For instance, Mark includesSimon of Serenity who, um the
the church there that Mark waswriting to would have known
about.
The other authors don't mention, uh, the exact person who
carried the cross, but Mark'slike oh, we know that guy, we
know, uh, why would Mark mentionthis guy who's in a garden?
He's in a lint, like he's inhis underwear, they grab him and
he shimmies out naked.

(12:16):
This is what we think is.
It's there because it'sautobiographical.
That was Mark.
That was Mark.
So, Mark sneaks out followingthe disciples.
He watches them in the gardenwhen everybody's getting
arrested.
They grab him and he just goesrunning.
He's like Joseph out of hiscoat.
He runs and he runs out oftheir naked.
When he writes his gospel, hejust puts himself as the
streaker in the Bible.
Um out, this kid goes runningthrough the.

Imran (12:39):
You didn't know there was in your Bible.
Yeah, right there.
There you go, that's what we'vegot to teach you.
You know, um today, I was todayyears old when I learned crazy
party.
I read the entire book of Markwhile on duty one night, Cause I
was always told, this is notlong.

David (12:53):
Yes, not long.

Imran (12:54):
It's the C Jesus, C Jesus run gospel.
It is the entire thing on likea duty one night, and uh I don't
remember reading that line.
I was like why didn't Iremember that that's hilarious
Cause there wouldn't be a reasonfor it to stand out.
Unless you had the context.
Yeah, yeah, you'd be readingpretty slow.

David (13:11):
Later, after Jesus dies, um rises again, ascends into
heaven, the early church ismeeting and one of the places we
know they met, remember theygot kicked out of the temple, so
they're meeting in homes andthere is there any large home in
Jerusalem they can meet at?
Well, they probably are meetingagain at Mary's house, also
John Mark's house, so his momand this kid are hosting the

(13:31):
early church.
Okay, and we know that becausethere's another scene and this
is just putting the story behindthe story together.
Yeah, um Acts, chapter 12,peter is arrested, he's thrown
in prison.
It says that he's sleeping andan angel came down and struck
him.
The church is um at the houseand they're praying.
I love the scene that the angelhits Peter Bam.
Yeah, you know, like I think,when God said, hey, I need

(13:53):
somebody to hit Peter, a bunchof angels said me, me, me, me,
me first.

Imran (13:57):
I'm currently outside his door.
Can I kick him?

David (13:59):
No, I just need you to hit him.
Um, the angel strikes Peter andPeter wakes up and says you
know, he just starts followingthe angel.
It's, it's perfect Halloweenstuff, because the doors of the
prison just start opening andthey're walking out.
They're just walking out ofthere.
They get down to the street andPeter realizes oh, this isn't a
dream, I thought I was dreaming.
So he walks to where his churchis meeting, check out where it

(14:23):
is that they're meeting in umActs, chapter 12, verse 12.

Selena (14:27):
He went to the house of Mary, the mother of John, whose
other name was Mark, where manywere gathered together and we're
praying, isn't that?

David (14:35):
cool.
So he goes there.
He's knocking on the door andit tells us whose house they're
meeting at is John Mark'smother's house.
Uh, mary, oh, wow, yeah.
By the way, just a cool littlenote on John Mark.
Um, in the intro to the Vulgate, the Vulgate is the Latin
translation of the Bible.
Okay, so Jerome translated theBible into Latin.

Imran (14:54):
Uh, when, when, what time period would that have been?

David (14:58):
I don't know.
Okay, I don't remember, that'sfine, um, but I know this.
I know that Hippolytus, when he, when he was writing the intro
to the Vulgate, um, he said hewas just one of the little notes
that he had.
So talk about where do we tracestuff down to Hippolytus?
Hippolytus said that Mark was,um, mark had a nickname and his
nickname was stubby fingers, andone reason they called him

(15:19):
stubby fingers was, according tohim, um, mark had made, as a
young man, had maimed hisfingers to keep himself from
having to be forced in.
This is like avoiding a draftso that he would not be forced
into becoming a priest.
And so they they called himstubby fingers because he had
done something to his his hand.
Whether or not that's true,that's church church church,

(15:40):
yeah, yeah, but Hippolytus isthe one offering the, the Yaya,
yeah, but I just love that sceneof the early church meeting in
this family's home, maybe thevery home where the Lord supper
was it took place?

Imran (15:52):
Yeah, yeah, and so this is all happening in Jerusalem?
Okay, yeah, um, so Peter wasimprisoned in Jerusalem and then
he was, uh, awakened by anangel broken out set free Um and
then walked to where his churchwas meeting.

David (16:07):
So excited isn't.
It which is a home.
They're just because they'vebeen thrown out of the temple.
Okay, yeah, uh, mark not onlyhas a mom named Mary, there's
another family member that'sreally important to this story,
and this guy's name is Barnabas,and Barnabas is super important
to the early church.
Okay, um, his name means son ofencouragement, and that was his
gift.
Was he just encouraged people?

(16:29):
He was a, um, he was a discipleof Jesus?
Uh, in fact he may have been.
You know, he was, I think, onthe roster of maybe we should
choose him to be an apostle.
They chose someone else, oh,right, it was like.
to replace um Judas, yeah, andso he's really really important.
What happened is that there waspersecution in Jerusalem so

(16:49):
early on in the faith,christianity was a Jerusalem
faith meaning it mostly just wasan Israel, it was the movement
in Jerusalem.
It didn't really spread muchfurther.
Yeah, it was pretty stuck whereit was.
Persecution came and the churchstarted scattering.
Well, as people went, they haveto leave their homes.
They're talking about Jesus.

(17:10):
Everywhere they go, they'retalking about Jesus.
Well, it says that when some ofthe Jews who believed in Jesus
came to Antioch, some of themstarted talking to Gentiles and
they started telling Gentilesabout Jesus and the Gentiles, to
everybody's surprise, startgetting saved.
Yeah, well, the early churchare like wait a minute, what's
going on over in Antioch?
People are getting saved overthe can, can people?

Imran (17:33):
even be saved.
Yeah, yeah, which is likeexactly what we discussed in
Galatians for the last few weeks.

David (17:38):
Can a Gentile get saved?
What are the rules for theGentiles?
It's all the stuff you guysjust talked about.
Yeah, that's what was going on.
Was these people?
And the church in Jerusalem isreally suspicious of them.
Like well, how do we know thatthey're they're really saved?
You know, in fact, selena, doyou see that there in Acts 1121?
What does it say about thesepeople, these Gentiles?

Selena (17:57):
And the hand of the Lord was with them, and a great
number who believed turned tothe Lord.

David (18:03):
Well, the church in Jerusalem is super suspicious
because they're Jewish andthey're like I don't know, Can
these people really get saved?
So what they did to go check itout is they need.
They're like we need a spy, weneed somebody to just go see if
this is real.
So who's the most trustworthyperson in our church that we
could send?
They send the Son ofEncouragement, Like you think in
our church.
Who's an encourager?

(18:23):
Ryan?

Imran (18:24):
Brown.

David (18:25):
Grover right.

Imran (18:27):
More than Ryan Brown they they, they don't.

David (18:30):
I hope he hears this they don't, they don't have Grover,
they don't have Ryan, but theyhave a guy named Barnabas, and
so they send Barnabas to thechurch to check it out.
What's going on down there?
Well, it says when he got therein.
Antioch.
He's like whoa, this thing isreal, these people are really
following Jesus.
It says that he saw the graceof God.
He encouraged them.

(18:50):
But as he sees all theseGentiles getting saved, he goes
wait a minute, I need some helpbecause I can't do this on my
own.
I can't be the pastor alone tothis giant church that's forming
Among the Gentiles.
Yeah, I need some help.
Well, he starts thinking whocould I get the help me that
wouldn't judge these Gentiles?
And he goes wait a minute, whathappened to that guy that was

(19:10):
on the road and he was going to?
He was going to persecuteChristians and then he got hit
with light.
He goes.
You know he's not doinganything important, is he?
In fact?
Paul says he spent three yearsjust communing with Jesus.
He wasn't really that deeplyconnected to the church because
everybody was scared of him.
Barnabas goes I'm going to putthat guy to work.
We'll make him my associatepastor.
Barnabas goes to Tarsus, whereSaul is at, and he gets Saul to

(19:34):
become his associate.
And Saul and Barnabas becausenow, now, can you imagine this
ends up being Paul, paul andBarnabas.
Can you imagine a betterministry team?
Barnabas is your pastor.
Your other pastor is theapostle Paul yeah, um, these
guys will start pastoring thefirst real Gentile church and
making disciples of Jesus alongwith them, so I love that.

Imran (19:58):
That ties back to like our first or maybe second
Galatians episode where it talksabout how uh, pete, not Peter,
sorry Paul saw himself as thedisciple up to the Gentiles,
where Peter was the pillar ofthe disciples to the Jews and
that they were needed to be onthe same page and that's like
kind of the whole first openingchapter of our relations.
Exactly.

Selena (20:17):
It all ties together.
Who would have thought?

Imran (20:19):
I've all actually ties together and make sense.

David (20:23):
Well, to tie that together.
Barnabas and Paul are power Ourpastor in this church.
Who do you think comes alongwith Barnabas to help him start
this, check everything out andhelp him with this church?
But his little cousin, johnMark.

Selena (20:36):
So John.

David (20:36):
Mark is there with uncle Barnabas or his cousin.
They're not uncle, but he'sthere with his cousin Barnabas,
and they are.
He's just part of the start ofthis, this church.
One day, the early church inAntioch, they are worshiping God
and the Holy Spirit.
In the middle of their worshipservice it just says the Holy
Spirit started speaking.

(20:56):
I don't know how that worked.
It probably a prophet got upand just gave voice to the Holy
Spirit.
But the Holy Spirit said setapart for me Barnabas and Saul.
And so what they did was thatcan you imagine?
If you're in church and you'retwo best leaders, the Holy
Spirit says send them on, makethem missionaries.
And so now the church is notgoing to have their leaders.
They've gotten strong enough.

(21:17):
Now they need to go bemissionaries.
This is the first missionsmovement of the early church.
So it's Gentiles sendingmissionaries out to reach
Gentiles.
So get it.
It went from the Jerusalemchurch, the Jews, out to the
Gentiles.
Now the Gentiles are going tobe reached by a Gentile church.
They're going to send out Pauland Barnabas and John Mark.

(21:37):
Well, what they do is they fast, they pray, they lay hands on
them and out they go Out, theygo to go share the gospel of
Jesus in the crazy.
This is like the Indiana Jonespart of the book of Acts.
Off they go, yeah, um, thefirst place they land is a place
called Cyprus, which you wouldlove.

(21:58):
It's like the Hawaii of theancient world.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah right, you're in, right,emron.
Sure, as long as I don't haveto get in the water, but it's,
it's beautiful.
It says in Acts 13, verse five,that Mark, that Mark, was
helping them.

Selena (22:12):
And so it's.

David (22:14):
Paul, barnabas, john, mark, they're all on mission
together and it's wonderful.
They're preaching all over theisland.
As you can imagine, people aregetting saved.
The Roman procounsel there, theguy that kind of runs the city.
You imagine him like a governoror a mayor.

Selena (22:28):
Yeah.

David (22:29):
He hears what's going on and he calls them in.
He says what's what's going on?
They're opposed by a magician,and I'm not kidding.
The magician's name is barJesus.
Bar Jesus, bar Jesus.
What verse is this?
This is in Acts, chapter 13.
Acts, chapter 13.
All right, he opposes them infront of the procounsel, and so
they're arguing with this guywho's who's awful?

(22:51):
And Saul turns around and hesays to bar Jesus, he says
you're a son of the devil.
And right there on the spot,this guy is struck blind.
Oh wow.
Well, obviously the procounselis like I think I believe.
Yeah, I eat.
Just an interesting note, jeromein the who's you know,
important to church history,jerome in the fourth century

(23:13):
suggested that when Saul changedhis name to to be a little more
Gentile um reaching out to theGentiles.

Imran (23:20):
Yeah.

David (23:20):
When he chose the name Paul, he chose it after this guy
, Sergius Paulus, who was one ofthe first people he won to
Christianity.
Oh as this procounsel, thisRoman procounsel.

Imran (23:31):
That's cool I like that.

David (23:32):
As they travel, they not only go to Cyprus, but John Mark
and and Paul and um Barnabas,they go to Panphilia and
something incredible happensthere that's important to our
story and that is that John Markleaves the team and it's going
to scar.
It scars your new, it's like ascar in your new testimony, like
whoa, whoa, something badhappened there.

Imran (23:53):
Oh really.

David (23:53):
Yeah, in fact acts 1313.
So they're in Panphilia, whichis modern Turkey.
Um, you see that, selena,what's it?
What's it?
Tell us happened?

Selena (24:03):
And John left them and returned to Jerusalem.

David (24:06):
Yeah, so we're kind of like whoa, why did John?
Here was this kid.
He was so fired up for Jesus.
Um, he's out on the missionfield.
He sees people struck blind heas they're traveling.
Something happened on thatmission trip that caused this
kid to go.
Oh no, I'm out of here.

Imran (24:24):
Oh wow, right, no, yeah, um, I, I just wrote down, you
know.

David (24:28):
I don't know.
What do you guys think?
Why would he leave?

Imran (24:33):
I'm trying to remember what happened in the beginning
of Galatians because I feel Iremember correctly, paul
referenced that when he waswriting back to Peter and like I
think it was because, like John, mark didn't, didn't agree with
the circumcision thing.

David (24:46):
No, they were dealing with it is possible that John
Mark was part of thecircumcision group.
I I kind of go with somepractical stuff, not just so
that is a political well, thatis a suggestion is that John
Mark disagreed with Paul's viewson accepting the Gentiles in
without circumcision.
Yeah but we're pretty early inthe missionary journeys there.

Imran (25:08):
And so I just this man, if he's much younger than them
as well.
That's like.

David (25:12):
I think the reality wrong you to have the realities of
missionary life are pretty hardon a young person.
So you can idealistically say,yeah, I mean, mark grew up in a
rich home.
His mom owned a house, multiplehomes.
Yeah, they own multiple homes.
He knows what it is to be fed.
He then his big move is just togo help them.
Pastor this church in Antioch,and now they're out on the Wild.

Imran (25:33):
West.
That also Kind of ties intowhat Paul does actually talk
about in the beginning ofGalatians when he highlights how
he was in prison.
Be in stone To spring thegospel and spread it like it was
not going smoothly.
This was not like yeah, it'slike oh well, you know, it's
like Jesus and everyone believed.
No, it's like there was a lotof persecution, there was a lot
of Assault and and and stuff,trauma they had to deal with.

(25:57):
That Perfectly said, imran is.

David (25:59):
Christianity did not go out smoothly.
It was a bumpy road.
Yeah literally it is over ofthe people being stoned and
killed and I think that JohnMark, just the realities of
missionary life might have beenharder than he thought it was
gonna be.
Yeah, it's one thing when youguys are sitting around, you're
talking at church and the HolySpirit said go and like I'll go
with you, guys, I want to go tothe Hawaii, I want to go to

(26:21):
share Jesus.
It's a different thing, actuallyget out there and people are
getting hit, blind, and you'reopposed and they were headed and
you might be attacked.

Imran (26:29):
It's like the look at mitten and street today people
going out to Um the Middle Eastgoing out to China going, trying
to go out to like places likeNorth Korea when it's like you
will be killed.
You would be attacked in prisonif you.
I think he just got scared.

David (26:42):
Remember what happened on the night Jesus was arrested?
He got scared and ran.
I think he just gets scared,and some people suggest that he
got sick.
But I want to suggest just onemore.
Maybe along with so he's scared, it's possible that he's
struggling with Paul's doctrinethat you Don't have to
circumcise.
He misses home.
But I think there's one morething that nobody ever puts on a
list of why mark may have left,and it's this, and I hope

(27:05):
people don't tune out as soon asI say this Are you ready?

Imran (27:08):
brace yourself, I'm gonna guess he fell in love.

Selena (27:12):
It was for a woman that would have been wonderful.

David (27:15):
No, I think Paul was sometimes hard to get along with
.
I think Paul is a type Apersonality and there was only
one apostle, paul, ever born onplanet earth.
In all time he didn't have apersonality, he had the
strongest.
He is a strong cup of coffee.
Yeah, and if you notice, we'redrinking coffee as we say this.

(27:36):
If you notice, paul's missionaryteam is always changing and I
think one reason is it is hardto be attached for a long time
to a strong leader, type Apersonality, completely sold out
to a cause.
Yeah, so Paul's attitude is ifwe get stoned, we get stoned.
God will raise us from the deadif he wants to.
If we get whipped, we getwhipped.
I am ready.
In fact, they said that whenPaul was executed, he ran to the

(27:58):
chopping block to have his headcut off.
Yeah, that's how.
And I would just say, whenyou're a young man Just stepping
into Christianity and you'renear a personality, that's that
on fire for God, and God usedthe apostle Paul to set the
ancient world on fire for Jesus.
Yeah, but man, when you getthat close, like whoa, Is this
guy?

Imran (28:15):
It's like uh, there's just plenty of places, places in
the New Testament where theHoly Spirit is referred to as
fire.

Selena (28:20):
Yeah, and it's like Paul is like the embodiment of that
fire.

Imran (28:23):
You get close to it and you're getting burned.
Can you imagine?

David (28:27):
John mark may have been like man.
My mom was a Christian, but shewasn't like this.
This guy, he's gonna get uskilled.
Yeah maybe so whatever happened, whether it was sickness, it
was doctrinal disagreement, itwas just Paul's personality.
Something bad happened on thattrip and John mark went home, do
we not?

Selena (28:45):
know, like what he did back in Jerusalem.

David (28:47):
Uh, we've got some hints on what happened when we get
over there.
And so the difficult thing andthis is my transition, selena,
like that, that's great.
The the reason this is thestory behind the story is we now
have to piece together whathappened to John mark, because
the story typically follows Paul, but so if it branches off, we
go.
What happened to, um, john mark?

(29:08):
You know, where did he?
Where did he go?
Well, this is what happened inacts 15.
Paul says to Barnabas hey,let's go visit some of the
places that we went and weshared the gospel.
And Barnabas is like yes, let'sgo, let's share Jesus and mark,
and, and.
And Barnabas says you know, Iwould love to go with you, paul.

(29:31):
And they're so excited they'retalking about.
He goes, oh, and, and, I can'twait, we'll get out there.
Well, I imagine they're packingthe ship or something's
happening.
Paul comes out with his luggagefor the ship and he looks and
John mark is on the boat withBarnabas.
Oh man and I'm just imagining itthis way.
But but could you imagine, paullooks up and he's like what's
he doing here?
And Barnabas is like he's goingwith us, and and Paul goes, he

(29:55):
ain't going with us, oh man.
And and Barnabas says he'sgoing and they have this little,
I don't know this, thisargument About whether or not he
can.
Where is this taking place?
Yeah, this is acts 15 Goes 39in fact.
Selena, do you see it?

Selena (30:11):
There arose a sharp disagreement.

David (30:14):
Yeah, in fact it was such a sharp disagreement they went
two different directions.
So Saul goes off on man.

Imran (30:20):
Yeah, so they separated ways from each other.
Barnabas took mark with him andsailed away to Cyprus, but Paul
chose Silas and departed,having been commended by the
brothers of grace of the lord.

David (30:32):
So the grace of the lord Paul goes off to Syria and
that's where the story follows.
The story behind the story isthat mark and Barnabas go to
Cyprus.
Yeah, so what happened?
A tradition suggests, traditionoutside the bible suggests that
for a little while he may havelost his faith, but he had some
help.
Here's what happened and wethis is just piecing it together

(30:52):
we know that mark was mentoredby the apostle Peter, so he goes
home.
Remember Peter's in Jerusalem?
Yeah, he's home.
He may have had some questionsabout his faith, but pretty soon
he starts popping up again inChristianity.
The story behind the story,where he's popping up, is with
the apostle Peter, and so thisis first, first Peter, chapter 5

(31:13):
, verse 13 Yep yep, yep.

Selena (31:15):
She, who is that?
Babylon, who is likewise chosen, sends you greetings and so
does mark my son.

David (31:22):
So Peter says, hey, she who's in Babylon, that's
christianity.
Um sends greetings, but then hemakes mention someone else is
with him.
Who's with him?
Um, the person with him.
Babylon, by the way, would havebeen um rome.
So Peter's riding from Rome.
Yeah and so he's probably he mayeven be in prison in Rome.
He's got somebody with him.

(31:44):
The somebody he has with him iskind of exciting.
It's a young man named mark.
This is what it means is atsome point, mark connected up
with the apostle Peter and Peterbegan to mentor John mark, and
so they're talking everywherethat they go, peter is bringing
this young man with him, a youngman that got kicked off of

(32:06):
Paul's missionary team, but he'sso eager yeah, can, and Peter's
the perfect one to mentor him,because Paul's a little hard on
failure, but Peter knows what itis to fail, so can you imagine?
if John, if John mark says man,I can't believe it.
I failed the Lord so bad I leftthe missions team and Peter
would go.
Son, I know what it is to fail.

(32:26):
I denied the Lord three times.
In fact, the very night you rannaked through the garden.
I stood at a fire and I deniedJesus.
Is there a better person torestore John mark than the
apostle Peter?

Imran (32:37):
Yeah, I love that um.

David (32:39):
So he attaches himself to Peter and pretty soon,
everywhere Peter goes, thisyoung man, we assume, is going
with him.
What tradition tells us is thatJohn mark, the way his faith
was deepened and discipled Washe would go around with Peter
and he would listen to Peterpreach and he would write down
sermon notes as he went.
He was just and what wouldPeter preach?
Peter's just preaching Jesus.

Imran (33:00):
Everywhere he goes, he's telling about what he's just
preaching the gospel yeah he wasthere and so it's not that he
has to say hey.
That's true, because Paul's thethe one who's like very socratic
, very well studied, very,because, like Peter was a
fisherman, you got it.
He's just preaching what he saw, you got it.
But Paul's the one that wentand did all the the dirty work
of like figuring out how Judaismties into modern Christianity,

(33:21):
ties into the law, ties intolike all that post Um, post
death stuff that we, I guess,consider our kind of tradition.
Now, that was most of that wasfigured out by Paul when his
studies.

David (33:32):
Paul and Peter got used in two different ways.
So Paul's our writer.
Paul writes letters and they'represerved forever for
Christians to draw from.
Peter's the great preacher ofthe early church.
He preached Pentecost, he.
He preached all over theancient world.
So he would go, people wouldfill houses, they would fill a
city to hear him preach becausehe had seen Jesus.
Yeah, he was there when thesethings happened.

(33:54):
Tagging along with him is thiskid who's listening, listening
listening to the story.

Imran (33:58):
I love that there's two.
There are two sides, peter andPaul, two sides of absolutely
critical coin and you can't takeit, you know you can't have him
out.

David (34:07):
Yeah, you need falls apart.

Imran (34:08):
You need Peter's witness and you need Paul's
understanding.

David (34:11):
Yeah, to really put the christianity together, If you in
the ancient world wanted tohear a sermon, you would go hear
Peter, not Paul.
If you want to read a letter,you would read Paul, not Peter.
Yeah, you know, because Paul isjust the better writer.
One time Paul was preaching anda guy fell out a window and
died, and so that's kind ofrough.
No, that's kind of rough.

(34:32):
Paul was a great preacher, butI just think the gift of
preaching really fell on Peterthe orating.
Yeah, we know that places thatthey would have gone.
Peter and John mark would havegone to Jerusalem, rome, galatia
, capedosha, bethenia.
They're just going all over theplace and think of I don't know
, just think of some of thestories that Peter would have

(34:53):
seen and talked about.
He said, hey, there was a timeI was fishing and Jesus was
walking down the the path.

Selena (35:00):
And he called me, or.

David (35:01):
I don't know what.
What do you think?
What are some stories thatPeter would have told?

Imran (35:04):
I just think Of kind of Peter's journey as a man while
he was walking with Jesus,because there were several
points where he was.
He talks about how he expectedJesus to rise up in army and
take over Rome and he's like,hey, hey, lord, when are you
going to rise up in army andtake over Rome and all this
stuff?
And um, and then Jesus kepttelling him like the son of man
has to die, blah, blah, blah.
And um, he just kept and it'slike, and he didn't understand

(35:27):
and that's right, it's like the.
This it says over and over againthe disciples didn't understand
.
That's right.
You know, that's what I thinkwhen I think of Peter is his
journey and then theunderstanding that happens, like
when Jesus dies and comes back,and it's just like lord, lord,
you know that those early.

David (35:39):
Imagine he would have been there.
He would have talked aboutwalking on water, not, and they
got in the boat.
He would have said we've got inthe boat and we were out at sea
and we were.
It's all first person, as Petershares it, sitting there taking
notes as John mark this is whatwe believe happened.
The notes that John mark tooklistening to Peter preach.
He put them together into asingle volume of what happened.

(36:01):
That volume becomes the gospelof mark.
Yeah, and so the gospel of markis based on the preaching of
Peter, or we would say thefoundation of the apostles.
So we say that we, the church,is based on the apostles
teaching.
It's important that the gospelsthemselves are eyewitnesses.
The eyewitnesses Peter, he sawthese things happened and he's
out there preaching.
And mark is the writer, he'swriting these things down and

(36:23):
god's going to use this youngman To, uh, to share the gospel
to preserve the gospel.
Yeah, yeah yeah, a couple couplequotes.
I just wanted us to to grab, uh, one from papias and one from
ucbs that described the, theformation of the um gospel of
mark and how he was aneyewitness from Peter.

(36:44):
So what do we have first?
We have papias first, or ucbs.

Selena (36:49):
Let's do papias.

David (36:50):
All right.

Selena (36:52):
So this is the first quote.
Mark, having become theinterpreter of peter, wrote down
accurately whatsoever heremembered.
It was not, however, an exactorder that he related the
sayings or deeds of christ, forhe neither heard the lord nor
accompanied him, but afterwards,as I said, he accompanied peter
, who accommodated hisinstructions to the necessities

(37:15):
of his hearers, but with nointention of giving a regular
narrative of the lord sayingswherever.
Wherefore mark made no mistakein thus writing some things as
he remembered them.
For one thing, he took specialcare not to admit anything he
had heard and not to putanything fictitious into the

(37:37):
statements.

David (37:38):
So he listens to peter preach and he's putting these
things together.
And then there was a.
There's a also Just the church.
Father ucbs also helps us andhe has a little note, a story
behind the story.

Imran (37:50):
I do.
I did want to kind of give acomment on on what you just read
as well.
Uh, because it reminds me ofkind of how I, how I teach,
because, um, a lot of Of what I,when I'm teaching my students,
I use a lot of the same examplesand I I've taught basically the
same classes for two years andwhen I would teach the students
it's like we may be goingthrough networking, we may be

(38:11):
going through C2 applications,we may be going through the
Marine Corps planning process orsomething like that.
I use almost always the samekind of examples or similar
examples from my time in thefleet, but I definitely didn't
recall them all exactly the sameway every time.
I brought out the points inthat memory that were relevant

(38:35):
to whatever the topic I wastalking about, what are the
point I was trying to make inthe moment.
So the events were allconsistent.
The events were all true asthey happened, but the details
that were necessary to explainat certain points with a
specific student, depending onthe audience, right, we had
different classes over a fewyears, that would change.
Like the necessary detail mayhave changed over time, it

(38:56):
doesn't.
It's just interesting, causepeople will bring up like the
gospel is like oh well, there'slike inconsistencies in it and
it's like well, just in thatquote you read, it's like Mark
was writing down what Peter saidover a period of time.
But Peter brought up whatneeded to be brought up to make
his point in the moment, basedoff of what Jesus did.
But it may not have been in thesame order or every time, cause

(39:18):
he wasn't like he was giving a,like a testimony to testimony's
wrong word, or like a statementto a to an officer or something
like that where he needed to gotimeline order.
He was trying to explain thepoint.

David (39:27):
Yeah, he was preaching sermons.
Yeah, he's preaching, and sosomebody has to sit down
together on a timeline.
I think that's what Mark givesis.
You know?
I don't know if it was behindthe scenes of all.
Right, Peter, give me someorder to these stories.
How did these?
Cause?
I heard you talk about water,Was that before he called you?
Oh no, he called me first, andthen now, what about?
I think that they sat togetherand worked out what order to
these stories from, becausePeter wouldn't have always

(39:48):
preached every story, right inorder.

Imran (39:50):
Yeah exactly.

David (39:51):
But the gospel puts it together in a in a clean fashion
for us.
What do we have from you, CBS?

Selena (39:57):
A great light of religion shown on the minds of
the hearers of Peter, so thatthey were not satisfied with a
single hearing or with theunwritten teaching of the divine
proclamation, but with everykind of exhortation.
They entreated Mark, seeingthat he was Peter's follower, to
leave them a written statementof the teaching, giving them

(40:18):
verbally.
Nor did they cease until theyhad persuaded him and so became
the cause of the scripture,called the gospel, according to
Mark.

Imran (40:27):
So that's most doctoral sounding statement.

Selena (40:30):
Is that great?

Imran (40:31):
That's a big brain way of writing.
That was like oh, he's like asyou were reading, I was like oh,
that's hard to understand, mygoodness.

David (40:37):
Well the thing about it is awesome that says, as the
people are hearing Peter preach,they're like we do not want to
trust our memory to this.
And they look at Mark andthey're like you got to write
this down, you got to write thisstuff down.
And it says they begged him,they entreated him.
Please write it down.
Don't just leave this to ourmemories.
Don't, in fact, don't let Peterdie with these stories in him.
We got to get this preservedfor the next generation of

(40:57):
Christianity.
What if the Lord tarries?
What if he doesn't come back inthis first generation?
How will we tell futuregenerations about what Jesus did
if we don't write it down?

Imran (41:05):
I think something else is fascinating about the Bible is
that when the Hebrew one notHebrew, but like when Jews began
, like when Abraham was giventhe promise and then Moses was
given the law, written languageas we understand it today like
didn't exist, like the Egyptianshad, like hieroglyphics.
The Hebrews had not establisheda written language by this

(41:28):
point and Jesus waited until wehad, like, a written language
that could preserve what he did,so that it could be preserved
accurately and clearly for thefuture, because if he had come
before that time it would havebeen a lot.
We wouldn't have such clear,accurate testimony from the time
.

David (41:48):
You know, the book of Galatians says at just the right
time God sent his son, born ofa woman, born under the law.
But just think about the wordsat just the right time when
Jesus came.
If he'd come earlier, therewould not have been roads to
carry the gospel out of thatarea.
But the Romans came, they builtroads, they gave laws.
There was a common currency, sothere was travel was possible.

(42:11):
And the entire known world atthat time was connected because
Rome had taken over and and theywere connected by language too,
because the Greeks had justcome before them and given the
whole ancient world the Greeklanguage, and so the New
Testament was able to be writtenin a language that everybody
could read and it could rapidlyexpand, so it just gave way to
this.
Yeah, it's like the whole thingwas planned by the Holy Spirit.

Imran (42:31):
It only makes sense.
That's crazy, Isn't thatexciting?
Wait, God had a plan, oh snapthat's crazy, that's so cool.

David (42:39):
Mark wrote down the first gospel.
We call that the priority ofMark, Mark first.
Even though in your Bible theorder is Matthew, Mark, Luke,
John, the writing of it wouldhave been Mark, Matthew or Luke,
and the last written would havebeen John.
But the priority of Mark isthat he was the first one and
that the others copied off ofhim and added their own unique

(43:00):
details.
That's important.
So this primary gospel iscoming out from Peter and the
synoptic gospels are Matthew,Mark and Luke same.
So same optics, same.
The gospels that all sound kindof the same are coming from a
similar source with uniquedetails each, and so Luke would

(43:22):
have had some unique details.
He has the story of Jesus'birth because he interviewed
Mary.
He's got unique stuff,information that he adds.
Matthew has unique information,but they're all drawing out of
Mark and so we call that thepriority of Mark.

Imran (43:36):
Yeah.

David (43:37):
And it's just.
Mark is just action packed.
It's not as refined as Matthewand definitely not, as clean as.
Luke.
Luke really cleans things up.
He gives them medical terms,things like that.
Mark just uses its actionpacked.
His favorite word isimmediately and immediately.
Jesus got out of the boat andimmediately.
A man came at him immediatelyand you're just going bam bam,

(43:59):
bam bam.

Imran (44:00):
Thing after thing is happening in the gospel which,
based off how you described hislife up to that point, of a man
who, as a boy, saw Jesus asJesus was kind of doing his
thing, saw him be arrested a fewyears past and he joins up with
Paul and Barnabas and he'straveling around with them and
then he leaves from Paul andBarnabas and he joins with Peter

(44:21):
and then he's going around withPeter for a while and then he
almost goes back with Paul andthen ends up not and he's going
off with Barnabas for a while aswell and it's like that is, he
didn't slow down.
He didn't, there wasn't it'slike, and he took a break to go
to formal Hebrew school to learnhow to write well.
Like he was just with Peter andPaul and Barnabas the whole
time, getting all of thisinformation.

David (44:42):
Who better to choose that would God choose, or put the
gospel together than this youngman that saw these things, heard
all this preaching, was movingin the circles of the early
church and God chooses this kidto write the gospel.
Want to show you somethingwonderful, and that is that Mark
was restored to Paul.
What happened?
Because there's another littlestory behind the story, isn't
there, guys?

(45:03):
That something happened.

Imran (45:05):
Yeah, the split between Mark and.

David (45:06):
Paul.
Yeah, what happened?
Did they ever reconcile?
We know that Paul commended theColossian church to welcome
Mark and so at some pointthey're back together.
So Colossians, chapter four,verse 10, Paul says hey, welcome
, welcome Mark.
He like wait, wait, whathappened?
We also know that a little bitlater he's with Paul when he's

(45:27):
in prison, when the book ofPhilemon is written, and so Mark
is mentioned at the very end ofhis life.
The last letter the apostlewrote is second Timothy and
second Timothy.
You see it down there, Selena.
Verse Chapter four Chapter fourverse 11 of second, Timothy
mentions this guy, and so Paul'sin prison now he's probably

(45:49):
waiting for the final end and hemakes a request of Timothy that
he wants to see someone watchwhat happens.

Selena (45:56):
Luke alone is with me.
Get Mark and bring him with you, for he is very useful to me
for ministry.

David (46:03):
That is beautiful.
Earlier Mark was not useful toPaul for ministry.
Paul was like you can't doministry with me, you got to go
to another church man you can'tkeep up.
You got to keep up man Like youmight leave the team.
You broke it.
Whatever happened broke backthere.
What's beautiful are these twomen have restored with one
another Interesting?
And so John Mark is once againwith the apostle, with the

(46:29):
apostle Paul, and at the end ofhis life Paul says to Timothy
hey, would you send me John Mark?
And I love the line he sayshe's useful to me in ministry
and I just agree with that line.
To me, john Mark is useful tome Because there's not a day
that goes by that I don't readsomething Mark wrote because he
wrote about Jesus.
And every day I read somethingMark wrote to me about Jesus.

(46:52):
You know.

Imran (46:53):
That's absolutely awesome .

David (46:54):
It is, isn't it?
Well, what happened?
What happened to John Mark?
Just tell you a little bit ofwhat we know happened at the end
of his life.
We know that he ended up.
He gave everything for Jesus.
So, peter, it is taught.
Peter asked him to go andpreach in Alexandria, which is
in North Africa, and Markthere's a whole tradition in

(47:17):
North Africa about what happenedto Mark.
He traveled all over NorthAfrica.
He was preaching about Jesus.
Mark was.
He went to Alexandria and therein Alexandria he really found a
congregation of people thatbelieved in Jesus.
They built a church and thechurch they built is called the
cattle pasture.
So we go to Palm's Baptist,they went to the cattle pasture.

(47:39):
I like that.
That's the name of their church.
That's pretty good, isn't it?
Yeah, and it just had this hugeinfluence on Coptic
Christianity.
Coptic Christianity is there inEgypt.
In that area of Christianity,it was called Coptic
Christianity.
It had already been influencedby Jesus because, if you
remember, jesus and his familyfled to that area when they were

(48:01):
hiding from Herod.

Selena (48:02):
Now missionaries.

Imran (48:03):
And so now, missionaries, come and they're sharing this
is while he was young, rightBefore he went back to Jerusalem
on purpose.

David (48:10):
Yeah, Before he was baptized by John Baptist Exactly
, jesus was raised in Nazareth,but when he was a baby, they hid
him outside of Israel for thereason.
But now imagine the gospel goesto Alexandria, it goes to North
Africa and he's preaching.
What we're told by Christianhistory is that unbelievers

(48:32):
became angry because people wereturning from the pagan gods and
they were hearing the messageof Jesus.
One day, mark was preaching inhis church and a mob just forced
its way in.
They put a rope around his neckand they were shouting drag him
into the fields where the cowsgraze which is an interesting
line.
He passed us the church of thecattle pasture.
They're like let him die, lethim die out in the cattle

(48:53):
pasture.
Then they bound his feet up andthey dragged him through the
fields.
That night they threw him inprison, bleeding and half dead,
because he'd been dragged allday through the fields.
The next day again they took ananimal, a beast of burden, and
they just dragged him throughthe fields.
Again they wanted to burn him,but he died before they could

(49:14):
burn him, and so they haddragged him to death.
What's?

Imran (49:18):
interesting this was in North Africa in that church.

David (49:21):
Yeah, that was around where he was born too, it was
actually a similar area, sothere's a sense that he's home
preaching the gospel and theyjust hate him.
What's interesting is, when hedied, those that were there then
testified that it began to rainand, as if you're not gonna
burn this guy, god just allowedhim a peaceful death.

Selena (49:43):
So this is how?
Wait, I'm confused.
Is this how John Mark died?
It is Okay.

David (49:48):
Yeah.
So John Mark was preaching inhis church, the mob broke in,
they dragged him and they weregonna burn him, but they
couldn't burn him.
He died, and then it juststarted raining.

Selena (50:00):
Wow.

Imran (50:00):
It's phenomenal.
So how you wanna go out pasthere, drag that up your church
and I wasn't shooting thatdirection, but I mean if we have
to we'll do it.

David (50:11):
Is that where America's headed?
I don't know, honestly at thispoint.

Imran (50:14):
Right, that's rough.
It's a crazy time to be here.

David (50:18):
I just wanted to think about a young man like Mark and
if I could, I don't know howmany.
There's so many young peoplethat are committed to
Christianity in a great way.

Imran (50:29):
Yeah, I tell Selene all the time that our young adults
ministry at the church is likethe most I think the most
powerful in terms of likewitness.

David (50:38):
I love them so much.
I love pastoring a young church, even though you guys have
ideas that are young and freshand I'm like what we're doing,
what we're just too fast.

Selena (50:48):
Too much.

David (50:49):
I would say that while I hear other pastors complained
about young people inChristianity, I'm so encouraged
by the young people.
I think Christianity has agreat generation stepping
forward and I just maybe, at theend of the I just wanted to-.

Imran (51:02):
The one part is it must it must for all time until Jesus
returns have a great youngadults group.
If it doesn't, then it diesAmen.

Selena (51:12):
And they're very active.
Like they got a hike coming upthis Saturday, that's right,
absolutely Like little thingslike that, let's meet.

David (51:18):
They did a breakfast a week or two ago and it was good.
I saw pictures of you cooking.
Oh yeah, they got it.

Imran (51:24):
Yeah, burning sausages, it was great.

David (51:25):
I wanted to just offer some, maybe just some things to
young people.
Can I just say this to youngpeople?
So I'm not young anymore, I'mturning 50.
You guys are young.

Imran (51:37):
Aw.

David (51:37):
So I'll just look at you when I say it.

Imran (51:39):
I appreciate it.

David (51:40):
I would say this with all my heart I just want this
generation to run hard towardJesus.
Run hard, and it's what I seeyou guys doing.
I see you you step into a newmilitary base.
You jumped into your church andeverywhere there was to serve
that you could serve, to serveyour church, even sacrificially.
You've done it To me.
You're a model of what peopleshould be doing in their church

(52:01):
is serving the Lord, because Ithink you would agree with this
the gospel is the most importantthing on earth.
It's more important than ourcareers, it's more important
than this military base.
The gospel is the mostimportant thing and God is
moving his gospel forward.
I would also say, just to youngpeople, that the mission of
Jesus is worth your youth.

(52:23):
And sometimes people are sayinglook, when I get older I'm gonna
commit to Jesus, when at somepoint and you know what?
You don't know how long you'vegot and it's worth it.
It's worth it to serve Jesuswhile you're young.
You're not gonna look back andsay oh, you know people that
think something.
To serve Jesus is not like theylook back and go.
I'm so glad I spent those yearsdrinking.
I'm so glad I spent those yearsat the party.

(52:43):
But people that serve Jesus,they look back and they're like
I'm so glad Remember those greattimes we had serving the Lord.

Imran (52:49):
Something that I always not always, but I do think about
often from Jordan Peterson's onmarriage series and we're all
just how you feel about JordanPeterson he does have some
incredible writings of kind ofjust like what's an effective
way to live.
Well, one of the things hetalks about is how is that you
should be living?

(53:10):
With your future self in mind?

David (53:12):
You should be living in service to your future self.

Imran (53:15):
So if you are, living and you look at yourself as one who
is not selfish.
Like to be selfish is to justbe focused on right here and
right now.
It's actually extremely selfishto not consider your future
self, because everything you donow has impact on your future
self.
So if you're living with yourfuture self in mind, you should
be thinking about what am Idoing today, that when I am old

(53:39):
and age, am I gonna look backand be appreciative?
What am I doing to make surethat I'm surrounded by those
that I love, with a family thatloves me, with people that care
for me, and so I can look backand know that I live the life
worth living.
And if you're not doing thingsnow that are in service to that
future self that you want, thenyou're ultimately gonna be.

(53:59):
You're ultimately actuallytruly selfish, like that is true
selfishness.
It's even a betrayal ofyourself.

David (54:04):
And let's step forward one more step.
Someday, you'll stand beforeJesus and he'll ask you what did
you bring me?
What did you do for me?
How did you serve me?

Imran (54:12):
Yeah.

David (54:13):
And the greatest thing that he can say is well done,
good and faithful yeah.

Imran (54:17):
I would say the highest honor you can receive is to be a
good and faithful servant.
Yeah, the highest honor, thoseare all your rewards are tied to
that.

David (54:28):
That he would say you did good.
I also want young people toknow this You're gonna mess up.
You're gonna mess up.
John Mark messed up.
He left the mission field, heblew it.
And I think it's important toknow that that, hey, you're not
gonna hit, you're not gonna justhit constant home runs.
I've messed up.
I messed up at Palm's Baptist.
I've made mistakes, I mean, andyet you can be defeated by

(54:50):
those mistakes and say, ooh, Ijust shouldn't be.
Or you can say, hey, I'm gonnalearn from this and grow from
this.

Imran (54:56):
The other big thing I just want young people to know
it's like you can give up or youcan be under grace.

David (55:00):
Which is what your culture is, galations.

Imran (55:03):
Yeah, I'm sorry.
I'm about hyped up on Galations.
You are, it's oozy.

David (55:06):
If you saw the goo just oozing out, it says Galations.

Imran (55:09):
It's all G Galations.

David (55:11):
It's oozing out.
One more thing I want youngpeople to know.

Imran (55:13):
It's not a bad thing.

David (55:14):
I want you guys to know you need mentors, and so I worry
about churches.
Look, I love Jesus church.
I worry about churches thathave a target.
We're gonna reach old people,we're gonna reach young people.
We're gonna reach thisdemographic.
The church of Jesus has nodemographics.

Selena (55:29):
Breathing our demographic.

David (55:31):
And a church needs to have some young people that are
kind of rocking the boat and itneeds to have some old people
that give us some stability, thegrovers that you just mentioned
.
There's gotta be some peoplementoring you and young people
bring energy to a church.

Imran (55:45):
I learned recently about Pastor Grover that he was an
airman in the Air Force and heworked on B-52 bombers before he
ended up becoming a pastorafter getting out of the Marine
Corps, and I'm like.
This man is the coolest personI've ever met and I had no idea.

David (56:03):
Not only that, he was the coolest person ever.
He worked construction foryears and his job was moving
houses and so they would loadthem onto these trucks and move
them across town.
And so he's the.
What if?
He says you've gotta go, look,and you'll be looking at a
bridge, Like, can the house gointo that bridge?
What's the other route?
What if Will the Pope?
What about those telephonelines?
Are we about to bump those?
All that was stuff that Groverwould think about.

Imran (56:22):
That man it I.
It's like I've met him as apastor and you only know what
you know.
So I assumed he had always beena pastor, all right, but like
to just learn a little bit abouthis history.
And literally a five minuteconversation outside I was like
this man is clearly the mostinteresting person I've ever met
and I had no idea.
Like do not, do not, do notlook at the old among you and

(56:47):
think that they are less thanlike they have lived an entire
life.
What does that mean?
It means that they have decadesof experience, decades of
wisdom that you can learn from.

David (56:57):
So one of the reasons we broke our church up a little
different a lot of churches doSunday school, where they have
age graded.
So it doesn't make sense to me.
You take all the old people andyou put them in a room, so all
the wisdoms in one room.
They take all the young peopleand put them over here, and and
instead of what we do is, hey,let's have a marriage group,
let's have a young adults group,but we're not separating them
out.
We want there to be moremixture in the church than some
churches experience, and sowe're just trying.

(57:19):
Sometimes, in a marriage group,you need some old married
people, some young marriedpeople.
In a men's group, you need someold guys and some young guys.
In a women's group, you needsome older ladies and some
younger ladies.
And so we broke the church upin Bible study groups a little
differently.

Imran (57:30):
So that age is in the factor.
We tried not.

David (57:32):
So we do have a young adults group because they're
going to go out and do hikes andstuff like that, but it was
never our intention to as deeply, but still it's a broad age
range.

Imran (57:40):
It's 18 to 32.
Like, that's a good range ofpeople that have lived life Like
to be I would argue that to bein your late 20s and 30s.
You've lived life a little bitcompared to the 18 year olds,
and I know for a fact that the18 year olds that I teach now in
entry level training they lookat me and they're like, sir, you
are so old.
And I'm like, please, please,oh gosh, don't just hit me like

(58:04):
that.
That's crazy.

David (58:06):
Oh, I'm gritting ear to ear.

Imran (58:08):
Like oh, I'm only 28.

Selena (58:10):
I'm like, oh God, but that's 10 years.
Yeah, Captain Trapp was like wedon't call that anymore.

David (58:15):
I was younger than you when I came to pass for this
church.

Imran (58:18):
Oh, my gosh.
Yeah, isn't that cool?
Yeah, and here I am trying tofigure myself out.

David (58:25):
You shave your head so we can't see if you have any gray
hair.
Well, why do you think I shavedmy head?

Imran (58:30):
It's true, I had a tiny, tiny little.
It's not even a bald spot, it'sjust an area where the hair
started to thin slightly and Iwas like I'm done with hair.

David (58:39):
Wait, wait, turn.
Let me see the back of yourhead.
You can't see it.

Imran (58:41):
You literally can't see it.
It's just an area where thehair grows slightly slower than
the rest of my head.
It's not actually bald, it'sjust grows slower.

David (58:50):
Yeah.

Imran (58:51):
And I'm just like I'm done.
I look good with a beard and inmy head shape.
So when I get on Marine Corps,that's going to be my thing,
like Terry Crews.
Yeah, Just bald head with awith trying to be a big black
dude with beard and the shavedhead.
Some if.

David (59:04):
I could summarize Mark this way just the big picture.
Here's a young man who startedout just following Jesus,
chasing behind the disciples.
He was early in the church.
He was there when they went outon the first missionary
journeys.
He left and he messed up.
But the person that discipledhim was the apostle Peter.
And out of that mistake hegoofed, he left the missionary

(59:26):
team.
God took him, discipled himthrough Peter, and out of that
we get the gospel of Mark.
Yeah, how beautiful, and Idon't know when.
The last time you were justfilled with passion for God.
I think the gospel of Mark is apassionate gospel.

Imran (59:38):
I think the man that is Mark is just like an incredible
journey of a human being.

David (59:44):
Here's a man that died for his faith.
He was dragged for his faithand you were like, hey, what was
you said?
Is that what you're going to do, Like I?

Imran (59:51):
hope not.

David (59:52):
But I respect that so much and we are all supposed to
be willing for that.

Imran (59:55):
I always think back at one the persecution, as, like
all the persecution that you seein Acts, like Christianity did
not just expand outward easily.
It was the disciples, it wasearly church leaders that were
doing the hard, gritty work tospread the faith.
And it's like, why were theydoing that?

(01:00:15):
Because they believed it,because it's easy when it's true
.

David (01:00:19):
That's right.

Imran (01:00:19):
It's so easy when it's true Brian talked about.
He asked, like one of the like,chat GPT, is Christianity real?
And chat GPT's response to himwas that I don't know if it's
true, but when you look at allof the resources that I have

(01:00:39):
available, it's very unusualthat something like that took
place and nothing like that hastaken place since, and that it's
the only religion that spreadfrom a point and didn't come
after a point.
So it's like Jesus dying iswhere Christianity started and
it grew immediately from thatpoint.

(01:01:01):
It wasn't something that wasestablished later based off the
life of someone X, Y, Z it waslike the moment Jesus was raised
from the dead.
It was.

Selena (01:01:11):
Christianity was born and how quickly it spread.

Imran (01:01:14):
And also the rapidness of it, how quickly it spread.
It's important, it's unique,extremely unique to Christianity
.
No other religion was like that.

David (01:01:20):
It's important that these things happened in generation
one, so Christianity isn't 200years and then people started
following someone that was dead.
It needed to happen in thelifetime of the eyewitnesses.
Peter saw Jesus crucified.
He saw Jesus raised again andhe would give testimony to his
death.
John Mark would have known ifit was all a lie, and yet he

(01:01:40):
gave testimony to his death thatthese things were true.

Imran (01:01:43):
And almost all of the disciples did, I think.
Who's the only one that died ofold age?
John, yeah, john, the apostle,john, and they boiled him and
threw him up.

David (01:01:50):
I mean, it wasn't really a get rich quick scheme.
You know, but that's important.
It's important to our story andour faith.
That happened from generationone.
We didn't make up a tale as itwent.
But we always reach back thedeepest we can to the original
sources.
Yeah, exactly.

Imran (01:02:07):
I truly appreciate that, and oh, this was only the first
one.

David (01:02:11):
And we're going to have so much fun.

Imran (01:02:13):
We're going right into all the things I truly love
about real Bible stories Me too.

David (01:02:17):
This is fun.

Imran (01:02:18):
Yeah, it's a good time, so I hope that you really
enjoyed this episode and we'vegot what might be like five or
six more that we're going to doover the course of the next
couple of weeks, but this is it.
This is the bread and butter ofreal Bible stories.
We finished up our deepdiscussion into the history
surrounding Galatians, thecontext around how Paul wrote

(01:02:39):
and why he wrote it the way thathe did, and now we're going to
learn about the biographies,about some of the people that we
know to be in the Bible.
You've just scratched thesurface and, oh man, what a
scratch.
I love it.

David (01:02:54):
I love it.

Imran (01:02:54):
This is great.
So thank you so much, PastorDavid, for coming on this week.

David (01:02:58):
I had so much fun just seeing you.
I love hanging out with youguys.

Imran (01:03:00):
Yeah, and now you have to go pick up your kids from.

David (01:03:02):
O'Wana.
I do, I got to go to O'Wana.

Imran (01:03:03):
Yeah, and I guess we'll tie in there that if you're in
the 29 Palms area 29 Palms,california, the Joshua Tree area
and you're looking for a homechurch, you're looking for a
church that has a strong youthministry, a strong young adult's
ministry, we've got PalmsBaptist Church as a home for you
, for your family.
If you're on the base out here,come check us out.

(01:03:26):
We want to love on you, we wantto share God with you.
But, um, this is just what Ilove right here.
Can I tell you just I knowwe're wrapping up.

David (01:03:35):
Tell you something about church I think it's important.
Somebody said what's the mostimportant thing we as a church
give the military?
It's not look, we wanna have adeployed ministry, we wanna have
.
The most important thing Palmsgives the community and the
Marine Corps is it's a realchurch.
So we're not a service, we're areal church with real problems.
And so they come and militarycome and they involve themselves

(01:03:57):
in a real church.
There's real ministry happening, there's real problems on the
ground and for some young peoplethis is the first church
they've served in since theyouth group.
They're walking from youthgroup to boot camp to into Palms
Baptist and this is the firstchurch where they were treated
as adults and they're not givena service.

Imran (01:04:13):
And a church that consistently has needs because
of kind of its rotating nature.
It's I've talked to Ryan aboutthis that there is a kind of a
peak point that Palms can get tobecause of.
Pcs season because of almostthe corner of the church rotates
every year.
We're going to put you to work.
And so you come in and therewas a women's ministry director

(01:04:34):
probably needed at that time.
There's a men's ministrydirector probably needed.

David (01:04:37):
So one of our gifts to the community Young adults is
probably needed.
Our gift is that it's a needychurch.
Hey, we need people, Exactly weneed people giving to the
church financially.
We need people.
You're looking for a place toserve.
Oh man Serving yeah.

Imran (01:04:48):
Serve, serve, serve, because there's always something
that can be done and within thetalents that you've been given,
whether that's the ability tosing, play an instrument, work
sound, build bulletins.
We even work on the church sign, even drive a bus Like those
are all needs that the churchhas.

David (01:05:06):
In your little short time here at 29 Palms, what are some
of the stuff you guys haveinvolved yourself in, because
it's big.
I always wanted to count thisdown with you a little bit.

Imran (01:05:13):
Oh goodness.
So, dave, I guess you can gofirst, elena, sure?

Selena (01:05:17):
Oh, we're doing both of each.

Imran (01:05:19):
Yeah, you go through, go ahead.

Selena (01:05:21):
Okay, so started off with the video.

Imran (01:05:23):
With Becca right.

Selena (01:05:24):
Yeah, yeah and actually yeah the video testimonies.
And then graphics just doinggraphics because I enjoyed doing
that.
So social media stuff, thepodcast.

Imran (01:05:37):
Yeah, photography as well .
Do you remember you were doing?

David (01:05:40):
we were doing social media posts and they were kind
of just these generic things.
And you're, you're, you'realigned to me was we got this
pastor and I just thoughtthey've got it.
They've got it, it's theirchurch, I'm going to let them
have it and it's been beautiful.

Selena (01:05:54):
Yeah, I mean we just it was more like just showing what
the church was already doing.
That's it Just capturing thatand putting it out there.

Imran (01:06:01):
Yeah, and I guess for me my big thing I walked in.
I I'm a big sound guy I hopeyou can tell by the production
of this podcast that I've triedto make it sound very nice.
But I walked in, I didn't likehow things sounded and I and I
immediately it's like same sameservice, like if you had a
service went over and was likeAshley hi, my name is Ken, can I
please help with this?
And I appreciate the trust thatshe put in me because she gave

(01:06:24):
me like the codes to thebuilding, like the same day, and
I spent every night there forabout her text to me that Sunday
was.

David (01:06:30):
I think I'm in love with this couple.
She said they just came in andthey're ready to serve.
I can tell they just love theLord.

Selena (01:06:35):
What Aw?

David (01:06:37):
Yeah, and that was the story behind the story Selena,
yeah, yeah, the first time I'mhearing that.

Imran (01:06:42):
It's like wait, she likes this.
That's crazy, but I spent likeevery night for the first seven
days.
They're just trying to get to aplace that I felt that it was
stable and try to understandwhat was going on as well.
And then it went into the soundtreatment plan, which took
about two years to kind of getall the across the finish line,
but we got it done.
The lights we read it all thelights inside the church that
took about a year or so to getdone and we got that done.

(01:07:04):
The podcast that we started upthere's like dozens of like a
smaller, smaller things, likejust being a part of the
couple's ministry.

Selena (01:07:13):
Well, don't forget those different events.

Imran (01:07:15):
Oh this, yeah.
So Selena's big thing was thatshe she basically rebranded like
the church was trying tomodernize kind of like how it
presented itself and its brand,and Selena built this huge
design for the church sign andnow that's the church sign that
you see up on the campus andthat's the logo she came up with
.
So good is that.
You know it's a good logobecause you see it on everything

(01:07:35):
.
You know that your logo is goodif people use it without you
asking you know, here's what'sneat.

David (01:07:42):
Here's a military couple comes into their church and you
guys just jumped in andeverywhere, instead of saying
we're looking for a perfectchurch, you're like, ooh, you
guys have a problem with yoursound.
Let me help you.
Hey you guys and each placethat there was a problem.
You said here's a community ofbelievers I can walk with.
It's not that they're perfect.
They need help and I'm here tobe part of that.

Imran (01:08:00):
Yeah, and that's been my, I guess, my thing ever since
I've.
Actually there was a pointwhere I was like I think it was
like, right after you finished,the sound I was like is that it?
It's like, have I culminated,have I done all the things that
I wanted to do at Palms and nowit's time for me to move on to
another church?
I don't know, and I was alsoaround the time that I said it's
like I think it's time for meto get out of the Marine Corps

(01:08:21):
as well.
So I don't know, I don't know,but I'm every I'm trying to
continue to do everything Buy ahouse just buy a house out here.
I tried.
It's too expensive.
We looked and we're like thisplace is expensive.

David (01:08:38):
All right, I love you guys so much.

Imran (01:08:39):
All right, yeah, we love you too, pastor.
This has been great.
That was a little peek behindthe curtain of kind of we
haven't done a life update in awhile, but I'm I know I'm
tearing up over here.
Oh we're still here, yeah he'salso getting like probably a
thousand text messages from hisdaughters at this point.
But until next week we hope youenjoy this, that enjoyed this
episode of real Bible stories.

(01:09:00):
I hope you're on fire forlearning the story behind the
story as we kind of go throughthis series with pastor David.
All right, and we'll see younext week.

Selena (01:09:10):
Thank you for tuning in to real Bible stories.
If you enjoyed this podcast, besure to leave a review, share
and subscribe to be notifiedeach week when we upload new
episodes.
Real Bible Stories is producedin partnership with Palm's
Church in 29 Palms, California.
If you would like moreinformation or want to check out
archive sermons and Biblestudies, please check out the

(01:09:33):
church website atpalmsbaptistchurchcom, or check
them out on Facebook, Instagramor YouTube.
Real Bible Stories can be foundwherever podcasts are found.
Thank you again and we will seeyou next week.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep 72 The Real Story Behind the Life of John Mark: Scribe of the Gospel

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Ep 72 The Real Story Behind the Life of John Mark: Scribe of the Gospel

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