March 18, 2025 • 32 mins
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ed Mathews (00:00):
Greetings and salutations Real Estate
Undergrounders.
It is Ed Mathews with the RealEstate Underground.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
As we have discussed in the veryrecent past, multifamily is
certainly one asset and flippinghouses is another and certainly
near and dear to my heart.
But one of the other things thatI'm always looking for is
opportunities to learn about newasset classes and, as you've
(00:22):
listened to the last severalepisodes and thank you for that,
by the way if you've beenhearing us talk about contractor
yards and land and a wholebunch of other storage and a
whole bunch of otheropportunities out in the real
estate space.
And today I'm joined byactually a really unique
(00:42):
offering and it's something thatI've looked into and it's
something that my partner, mikeMeyer, and I have dabbled in a
little bit and we're starting toget really into it, and that is
Timberland and land.
And with me today is JohnBrenard and Terry Myers from
Southview Timberland Investmentsand they are based down in
Georgia and are looking, theyare raising a fund and going and
(01:05):
buying a whole bunch of landand we're going to talk about
that and a whole bunch of otherstuff.
So, guys, welcome to the show.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
John Brenard (01:12):
Thank you, it's so great to be with you.
Looking forward to hearing aboutthis topic and why we love the
asset clash and talking aboutour backgrounds.
And you got Terry on the phoneas well and Terry say hello.
Terry Myers (01:25):
Hello, thank you for having me.
Ed Mathews (01:26):
Yeah, truly my pleasure.
Guys, yeah, for those folksthat haven't discovered you yet,
why don't we talk a little bitabout your backgrounds and what
Southview Timberland's all about?
John Brenard (01:34):
Yeah, sure, I'll go first, John Brenard.
I'm the managing director andfounder, one of the co-founders
of Southview TimberlandInvestments.
15 plus years in finance andstartup, worked for some of the
biggest wealth managementcompanies JP Morgan, smith,
Arnie, wells Fargo Advisors.
I was a key member of a startup.
After the wealth managementcareer, we built that company
(01:56):
and sold it to a publicly tradedcompany, so that was a great
thing.
So, really, I built twosuccessful businesses in my
career.
One was the wealth managementbusiness scaled that from zero
to over $100 million in asset,and then the second one was a
startup that we built and thensold to a publicly traded
company.
I'm a Timberland investor withbackground in the financial
(02:16):
markets, really focused onexpanding access to Timberland
investing.
You may wonder hey, this guywas involved in wealth
management and startups.
How did he get involved inTimberland?
It all started back in 2008,2009, when my family bought a
Timberland investment propertyand switched me on to it.
But we can talk more about thatorigin story in a little bit.
(02:37):
But, Terry, you wanted to givea little bit on your background.
Terry Myers (02:41):
Yes, I'm Terry Myers.
I've lived in Georgia all mylife and I've basically grown
the farm and being access totimberland and the different
opportunities that it presenteditself in different times.
And I just started outtimberland and selling
timberland, acquiring my owndifferent means of methods of
keeping it and over the past 30,35 years to build a network of
(03:05):
around 12 000 acres of justhaving connections with meals
and stuff and friendships andpeople.
That in the general area of joyhere which is the high timber
in the UEDIS now and I'm up withJohn's folks, they bought a
piece and he and I got totalking.
He says, hey, you know what youcan buy this thing to a bigger
(03:27):
tier.
I said that seems like a goodidea.
So here we are.
Ed Mathews (03:34):
Yeah, and another tier is, to say the least, right
, and you guys have built oneheck of a business, and so
congratulations on that.
The asset class John youmentioned, and Terry, you've got
a sounds like a pretty deep andbroad experience set with
regard to these types ofproperties.
But, John, I know your familybought Timberland.
What about it is so attractive.
I'll throw that out to both youguys.
What about the investment is soattractive and superior to some
(03:55):
of the other asset classes thatyou can invest in.
John Brenard (03:57):
So happy to talk about this, I really talk all
day about it.
But really the biggest thingreally two biggest things I love
about it is it's a real asset.
It's something you can put yourfingers and toes into right.
It's something that I reallyfeel comfortable presenting this
investment to any family, anyfriends, because their dollars
(04:17):
are going into something that'sa hard asset.
The number two thing is thelevel of control you have with
this investment.
So all the other strategiesthat are offered to a lot of
investors.
You're at the winds of thepublic markets right.
You can have a very diversifiedportfolio of stock.
If it goes down 30%, right,there's not a whole lot you can
(04:40):
do.
You can hold on and wait for itto recover right.
But with us and Timberland,biological growth is always
taking over with those trees.
As you and I are sitting heretalking, those trees are growing
right, and so our product isbecoming more valuable every
single day, regardless of what'sgoing on in the stock market or
(05:00):
with interest rates orinflation.
And to me, I just love that,love that control.
And the way that we buyproperty is typically with all
equity, right.
We typically buy the propertiesoutright, we don't take on a
lot of debt and so we're reallynot beholden to anybody.
So those are two big reasons.
I could talk about other onesas well, but I'll let Terry tell
you why he loves the assetclass as well.
Terry Myers (05:22):
Number one like John said, it's an asset that's
tangible, that you can lay yourhands on, you can live on.
You also can recreation on itfor outdoor use.
But there's so many differentavenues.
You can go this day and timewith Pine Timberland and not
only are we focusing in Georgia,mainly because that's where
mainly the most of the meals are, but covering the whole
(05:43):
Southeast.
Yeah.
But what we like about Georgiaso much right now is the growth
pattern that's going on in theSavannah area with the ports and
stuff and it's just reallycreative.
You have multiple fields withland.
You may buy it as a timberlandand you know somebody interested
in HBU.
They see a different use boardor whatever and along comes with
(06:03):
that.
We've been implementing pinestraw.
That's come with that.
We've been for many timesproblem.
That's a great venture we'vetaken on that.
It's using for mulch aroundhouses and just different to me.
And the hunting leases andstuff says hunting is going
crazy or just simply just mylease of people, probably not so
much for hunting but justtaking a family out and enjoying
just having a campsite on.
So we could all kind ofmultiple vendors, probably
(06:25):
ourselves.
A lot of people aren't doingthat.
We could any way to extractvalue for our investors?
Ed Mathews (06:32):
Yeah, so let's break that down, terry, because
that's an interesting point thatyou make.
Actually, there's a couple ofdifferent points that I'd like
to explore, but let's talk aboutthe usage first.
When we talk about timberland,what we're talking about here is
you growing pine to then sendto the mills, to then sell to
lumberyards and the Home Depotsand Lowe's of the world?
(06:52):
yes?
Terry Myers (06:53):
yes, that's very true.
And most timber funds that'sstrictly all they do is
concentrate on the timber growthitself.
So we've added these otheravenues so we can create more
cashflow with the property.
So, yes, the basic Timberlandinvestment is the tree itself.
Ed Mathews (07:12):
Selling board feet.
Right?
Terry Myers (07:13):
Yes, Sir
Ed Mathews (07:14):
All right.
So yeah, and actually you hitupon exactly what I wanted to
explore.
We've had guests on that havetalked about RV parks and mobile
home parks and farmland andland where they are hunting
lands, as well as any number ofother things, and you've touched
upon a thing that I'm curiousabout, and that is how do you
(07:37):
track the folks that are on yourproperty?
12,000 acres is a lot of landand I know that's not even your
corporate portfolio, that's justTerry's portfolio.
Are you giving access to, say,hunters or hikers or campers?
Are you setting up the specificareas where you're allowing
this and then somehowgatekeeping access to the land?
(07:57):
Like, how does that work?
Terry Myers (07:58):
So pretty much each tract of land is in different
areas or whatever.
My history for the past 30, 35years with different people.
It just brings on.
I've got more customers than Ido have products, it's just.
And so occasionally whathappens is you'll sell off a
piece or in the middle of theboat you know they'll have to go
(08:18):
where the hunt or whatever, putthem back on the list when you
do acquire.
A list of hunters is longerthan the list of what I've got
product for and it just keepsclimbing as far as that, because
that just seems to be a bigrecreation.
And then also, like I said, somepeople might not hunt, they
might just want to come and justhave a place that they can
(08:39):
lease and set a camper up on,just enjoy it outdoors.
You know, I mean, it's just,it's really took on a broad
spectrum people wanting to getout on these vast lands in rural
Georgia or rural Alabama orwherever in the southeast.
So it's really been and there'sso many more avenues to go and
have interest at differentlevels.
(09:00):
You mentioned something aboutall the bee parks.
That's another thing.
Our camper zone just just veryrecently didn't have water.
We've set some camper spots upthat they leased these year
round.
There's just a lot of avenuesthere to create revenue from
this.
Ed Mathews (09:16):
Yeah, it's fascinating, and so you're
setting these up as localbusinesses.
Or are folks finding you on anapp like on X or like how are
they figuring out?
Hey, I would love, there's ahuge property that I want to go
hike and how do they?
Terry Myers (09:32):
Mainly it's just word of mouth from previous
customers.
They might have a guest thatcomes with them.
There's no formal advertising.
But I have the product likethat because right now I'll
reach other properties from ajoint landowner and tie into
that.
But it's mainly word of mouthand just customer from past
customer service.
John Brenard (09:53):
Fascinating.
Yeah, I just want to add towhat Terry said.
And we've really set up ourfund to be a four plus
timberland strategy.
So really, at the core ofeverything we do, the land that
we buy has to be a goodtimberland investment.
And in learning this businessthrough Terry over the last I
think last time we checked howlong we've known each other,
(10:14):
it's been going on 18 years.
Really number one is you got topay attention to the soils, you
got to pay attention to themill infrastructure.
So those are really the two keythings that we look for and
Terry had some other things hecan add too.
But that has to be the landthat we buy has to be good
timberland investment.
Then we typically have two orthree of these other activities
(10:34):
that we can offer to createadditional income, like the
recreational leases like we'retalking about.
Our fund also allows forfarmland leases.
So what often happens is we buya thousand acres 700 acres is
timberland and maybe 300 acresis farmland.
We'll be sent out to aprofessional farmer and get the
cash rent from that farmlandlease.
(10:56):
We've done svelte bone towers.
We've done the pine strawharvesting, which we can talk
more about how that works.
Of course, timber harvesting,pre-development, highest and
best used opportunistic landsales.
So it's really we've donemineral rights, so really we do
all the different activities.
The core is that it has to be agood timberland investment
right.
That's the number one thing,and then we usually get these
(11:19):
other two or three activities tocreate income from.
So just wanted to just makethat point as well,
Ed Mathews (11:24):
And it's a great point.
I'm glad you did, because meand my partner, Mike, have just
gotten into development andwe're working on a smaller, much
smaller parcel I think it'slike 58 acres but looking at it
from a highest and best useperspective, there's so many
different things you can do interms of, for instance, with
this particular project it'sprobably going to end up being a
(11:46):
single family or a townhousedevelopment or work with the
local government to figure outwhat they'll approve.
So far they're pretty amenable.
But the other thing that isinteresting and you mentioned a
couple of different uniqueassets, cell phone towers, I
think is what you mentioned issolar fields.
So here in the Northeast Idon't know what the market is
down by you guys, but here inthe Northeast there's a pretty
(12:08):
significant push to utilize landthat you can connect to
tri-phase electricalinfrastructure, and what I mean
by that is wires on the mainroads with transformers and
whatnot.
The ground leases for thosedeals are quite lucrative and I
(12:28):
know cell towers is very similar.
John Brenard (12:30):
Yeah, and we're not incorporating solar panels
in our strategy right now, butwe're not saying that's off the
table.
Really, the most productive useof our land right now is
timberland, because of howstrong of a market that we're in
.
There are some encumbrancesthat come with those solar panel
leases.
I mean, Terry's been in thisbusiness long enough that he's
(12:50):
seen these projects and they getsold over and over again to
different investment companiesMaybe Luce who owns that lease
and then those solar panelsbecome obsolete and then you
have an EPA issue cleaning upthose solar panels.
There's risks with everyactivity that you do.
For now we're going to stick toour core method that has worked
(13:11):
for Terry for 30 plus years andfor me for the better part of
the last 10 years.
But we're keeping a close eyeon those kind of peripheral
strategies to maybe put somecorners of our portfolio into
those methods.
It's a great point, yeah.
Ed Mathews (13:24):
And the point is that you guys are getting real
creative with how you areleveraging the value opportunity
within each of these properties, and it varies, I assume, from
every property to property right, right.
John Brenard (13:35):
And that's the differentiator of Southview
versus some of these bigger TMOsor the publicly traded timber
reaches.
These guys are managingmillions of acres, right.
It's just very hard for them tomonetize those properties the
way that we can.
It's just very hard for them tomonetize those properties the
way that we can.
So our niche is really focusingon the mid-sized properties 500
acres to, say, 2,500 acres andwe're just able to be a lot more
(13:57):
hands-on to rate that outsizedreturns for this asset class,
whereas some of those biggertimber reed they're doing that
four to six percent return.
We're doing at least doublethat on most of the deals that
we do.
Ed Mathews (14:10):
Wow, nice, yeah, and it's mainly because it's too
many cats to herd, right?
It's when you're dealing inmillions of acres or hundreds of
thousands of acres.
It's you've got to stick toyour knitting and do one thing
well, because if you try to dotoo many things, you're going to
get buried.
That's awesome In terms of howyou acquire.
(14:31):
You mentioned equity.
Now I believe you guys areraising a fund.
You don't do syndications.
Can you walk me through thethought process of how you
approach that?
John Brenard (14:39):
Yeah, I'll take the operating why we've chosen
the fund route and then Terrycan talk about the acquisition
process because he really runsTimberland Acquisitions and
Operations.
But we're raising a fund rightnow.
We're raising a $50 millionfund to pursue this strategy and
the reason we've done thatroute because we've done some
indications.
We've been doing friends andfamily deals for a long time and
(15:02):
those are great.
That fund really allows us tohave that cash on hand to just
move a lot quicker.
Because that's really that'sthe differentiator with us
versus some of these othergroups is just being able to do
that due diligence in a time weget to the closing table,
because that makes a differencewith the sellers too.
You can get more advantageousterms if you can get to that
(15:25):
closing table a lot quicker.
So, having that cash on handwith the fund, it just makes a
lot of sense for our kind ofstrategy.
But, Terry, if you want to talkmore about how we source deals
and about our network in theregion and and so forth.
Terry Myers (15:38):
So, being in the business 35 years, I bought,
sold some land attractionlandings as high as three times.
So a lot of times, peoplegetting older, people going a
different direction or peoplesimply just wanting to get out
of that track maybe it's aboutif there were a small one there,
they'll call me and say, hey,I'm interested in some of this.
Do you have anything else?
(15:58):
That's one way of locatingproperty.
And the second is knowing thesegroups, other groups that
you've asked.
Sometimes I can reach in therebecause I've got a purple
relationship for most of them.
And cherry pick, I'll try it,it's in my network.
And then the third opportunityis a lot of time is just simply
family estates coming to an end,where you know they've been
(16:21):
divided up, and those families alot of times say, hey, we've
not been there and we don't wantthat asset.
And the more we agree onsomething.
I bought several differentproperties in that way, so it's
always just the 35 yearsexperience with knowledge,
different managers.
that's managing other people'sproperty that I got a
relationship with.
So that brings a lot ofattraction to the buying table
John Brenard (16:42):
And to replicate if they were a first-time
Timberland investor and that'swhat we're providing at
Southview is we're eliminatingthat, that learning curve.
If you can make the decisionthat, hey, I'm interested in
investing in timberland in areal asset, that's a great
inflation hedge, that'suncorrelated you say, hey, I
want to invest in the assetclass there's really, you know,
(17:04):
you have the publicly tradedREITs which you get the
volatility with those and youdon't get the same returns.
Or you have to go work with theTIBO, where you have these
Timberland Investment ManagementOrganizations.
You typically need $50 million,$100 million.
You need to be an institutionto go work with them, have them
build you a portfolio, and whatwe're offering with Southview is
(17:26):
, at a very reasonable minimumto get that boots on the ground
experienced operators in theasset class.
There's no learning curve,right?
This is not a concept thatwe're trying to prove right.
This is a method that has beenperfected over decades and we're
going to get you involved inour network from day one and
access to these unique dealsthat we find.
Ed Mathews (17:47):
Okay, that's fantastic, and so tell me about
the typical investor.
Is this an investment that isfor accredited investors, or how
do you guys operate that way.
John Brenard (17:56):
So our offering is a Regulation D 506C offering.
Anybody who comes into our fundhas to be an accredited
investor.
The minimum is a hundredthousand for the fund.
But our investors that we have.
We work with registeredinvestment advisors.
We've been onboarded to theCharles Schwab Alternative
Investments Platform.
You have to be invited to getonto that platform and some RIAs
(18:20):
who like what we're doing andsee it as an alternative for
their practice and adifferentiator, asked us to get
onboarded to that platform.
We're getting a lot of tractionin the RIA channel and then also
just high net worth creditedinvestors.
We have a list of accreditedinvestors who are just
interested in a unique assetclass, unique real estate asset
(18:41):
class, like Timberland, andthey'd come into the fund.
So really those two groups werebeginning to speak with family
offices.
Family offices are a little bitof a different animal, right?
They don't.
Sometimes their structures area little bit.
You have to fall into theirtiming in order to get things
done.
So we keep in touch with ahandful of them and we'll
probably see some family officescome into the fund at some
(19:02):
point here soon.
But Dave and accreditedinvestors are really our best
clients.
Ed Mathews (19:06):
Excellent, excellent , all right, all right guys.
Our best clients Excellent,excellent, all right, all right
guys.
So we've been talking.
I can I could talk days aboutthe for days about this stuff.
I'm fascinated by your businessmodel and congratulations again
on a great business that you'vebuilt.
I'd like to get into ourlightning round the final five.
We let's work it this way Sincewe got two guys answering, you
guys can decide who answerswhich question, and and then
we'll just go from there.
So first question is I reallywant to know about what gets you
(19:29):
out of bed on Monday morningand goes to work.
Right, you're alreadysuccessful, I imagine.
The college pay, the collegetuitions are paid and the
mortgages are paid off and thecars are on free and clear and
everything.
So it's not necessarily aboutmoney.
What gets you out of bed andshowing up to work on Monday
morning?
John Brenard (19:46):
I'll take this one and, Terry, you'd probably take
this one too.
For me, it's just really justsucceeding and living to my
highest potential.
You look at, you look out at agraveyard right and it's filled
with people and wasted potentialand I just really my intention
is not to be one of those peopleand just get the most out of
the hundred years that I've beengiven.
Yeah, that's really my purpose,
Ed Mathews (20:05):
All right.
Terry?
Terry Myers (20:06):
I love going out and meeting new people and in
this business it allows me tomeet a new person every time I
venture out on a piece of realestate and it's always something
good that comes out of that.
And it might not even be realestate, it's always about hey,
most of the time it's like thesepeople are reaching out for
help, so at some point in theway it's just hey, give them
back and help them out.
Ed Mathews (20:27):
Love that.
That's great, all right, guys.
Obviously, as successful as youboth are, you've had help along
the way, without a doubt,everybody has, and so I'm
curious about your mentors andthe advice they gave you.
What's the best advice you'veever gotten, and who gave it to
you?
John Brenard (20:42):
I'll take this one to start, but I'll just I'll
take this about Terry.
Terry was, before we went intobusiness together, was a mentor
to me, right, teaching me aboutthis asset class, right,
teaching me how to find deals,allowing me to come in right
when I was still building in mycareer, to contribute what I
could to a deal, and that wasjust very generous of him to
(21:02):
allow me to do that.
But he says something thatsticks with me.
I think a lot of people you knowsome people these days they sit
around feeling sorry forthemselves, right, there's a lot
of self-reflection of maybethey're feeling depressed and
the number one remedy for thatis really just to go get busy,
right.
And Terry just says a lot moresimple than I do, but you just
(21:24):
said go out and wash your car.
And I think that's just reallygood advice is, if you're
feeling sorry for yourself,right, just go out and get busy
and just get started doingsomething.
And I don't have a lot of timefor self-reflection building
this business right now, butthat has been helpful to me at
certain periods just to keepbusy and keep moving forward
when things are a little bitdifficult.
(21:44):
So that's been helpful.
Ed Mathews (21:45):
Terry?
Terry Myers (21:46):
I'd have to say it would be my dad.
My dad was always.
Actually I got two.
As far as my dad laid coreprinciples down my life and one
of them was always do what yousay you do and mean what you do
and always have no excuses.
If you do have some defects orfaults, hey, stand up and take
face of them.
Just learn from that, from yourfailure.
As far as real estate, it wouldhave to be John Dixon.
(22:09):
John Dixon was a very mentor,friend of mine, great guy.
He's in the Marietta area.
He's in the auction business.
He took me under his wingprobably in 1995, 1996.
He was straight from differentparts of the world and
introduced me to things likeKing 31, conservation easements.
(22:31):
I pretty well have a guy likehim.
He was just a great mentor inthe real estate business.
But those two guys right there,and God's people too, so that
would be my two men of grace.
John Brenard (22:43):
Yeah, and I'd be remiss if I didn't mention my
folks too.
I have two of the best parentsin the world, and I see them as
my something to aspire to aswell.
Just wanted to add that, yeah.
Ed Mathews (22:53):
Thank you.
I always learn.
You learn a lot from yourmentors, but you also learn a
lot from stubbing your toe, andso I'm curious about a mistake,
professional mistake, that youguys have made over the years
that you made a decision.
You're like boy.
I'd like to have that one backand what'd you do to recover?
John Brenard (23:08):
Gary?
why don't you, why don't youtake this one off?
Hold on a second.
Terry Myers (23:10):
Yeah, I can hold on to that.
So a lot of times you'retalking and you're trying to
trade on a piece of property andyou don't be as aggressive.
Sometimes you think you need tobe and sometimes you don't.
I think always the aggressionis the better part for me,
because if there's something yousee is key that worked for you,
there's one particular time Ikind of grubbed my foot on
(23:32):
something not so much pricing,but I didn't feel like I was
putting pressure on the peopleabout buying it.
Well, I give it about a weekafter talking with them and come
back and say, hey, we justentered in a contract two days
ago and I look like and it wasfor less money than what I
offered, but for whatever reason, they didn't take it the deal
serious because I wasn't pushinghard enough and that's probably
(23:53):
not always accurate.
But I would say, hey, stickwith it.
Do you do?
Hey, you either get it or theysay, hey, we just don't want to
fail it.
Ed Mathews (24:00):
Dog on a bone
Terry Myers (24:00):
Yeah.
John Brenard (24:01):
Yeah, for me it's really just early in my career
is just spreading myself toothin on too many, too many ideas
and too many side projects, andthat was kind of my side hustle
.
Could compete with a guy who isall in on the thing that I'm
calling my side hustle, then aguy's going to beat you every
time if he's all in and I'm allin on Southview, right, because
(24:23):
the only thing that I'm workingon and 100% focused on this and
you just look back at the mostsuccessful entrepreneurs in
history right, I mean, theyreally did one.
At the most successfulentrepreneurs in history right,
I mean, they really did onething very well.
There are exceptions, right,there are people who have
multiple businesses, but moreoften than not, they typically
do one thing really well.
Right, Rockefeller did oil,like Carnegie did steel, and I'd
(24:46):
say Terry and I are working onTimberland, yeah, all right.
Ed Mathews (24:49):
You're the next.
You're the JP Morgan andRockefeller of Timberland.
I love it.
John Brenard (24:53):
Hey, we'll take it
Ed Mathews (24:54):
You said typically when you get to your level and
how you get to your level isthrough continuous learning
right, and so I'm curious abouthow you consume information,
whether that's through books oraudio books or podcasts or
whatever, and who you paidattention to these days.
Who's helping you out?
John Brenard (25:10):
Podcast is one.
There's a couple of podcasts Ilisten to.
One's called Real EstateUnderground with Ed Mathews, but
yeah, also Founders Podcast isa great one.
They're typically less than anhour.
Just gives you a greatbackground on some of the most
successful entrepreneurs inhistory, and not just current
entrepreneurs.
The lessons that are learned inhistory are still relevant
(25:31):
today and they do a great jobwith that one.
But I'm also just payingattention to these days, this
early innings that were inalternative investments and
private markets, because that'sreally where our strategy sits,
about how RIAs family officesaccredited across the spectrum
are looking for thesealternative investments, and so
(25:53):
that's a theme that I'm justpaying attention to because
there's just a lot of tailwindsfor strategies like ours to
benefit from that.
Yeah, it's something I'm payingattention to these days.
Ed Mathews (26:04):
Excellent.
How about you, Terry?
Terry Myers (26:06):
Pretty much I've stayed in the same pattern that
I've been in because it's beenworking for me, but also along
the way I just noticed the youngcomers that come along.
It's got different ideas,especially with social media,
how they project sales fromtimber to land sales to even
just acquiring different methodsalso.
(26:27):
And then, most importantly, Ilisten to the elder, the head of
me, sticking with hey, you needto stick with the same roots.
So I mix it up between theyoung and the old.
I'm right in the middle of theroad, so that's how I stay real
close to, as far as the meal,the demand for wood.
We just had a big hurricanecome through here and, hey,
lumber price is pretty goodright now but I'm sure the
(26:49):
demand for lumber will be realbig.
And even in California, withthe fire, this Georgia Southern
Pine that we grow, theYellowleaf Pine, it's the
strongest timber breed.
They're winning all the codesnow, especially in Florida.
So I just try to take on what'sgoing on in the industry and go
into different places with theForestry, the Georgia Forestry
Association.
Ed Mathews (27:10):
Yeah, right on that's yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting, it's itwas something that we should
certainly talk about, maybe onanother show is how the changing
weather patterns are affectingyour business good, or to the
positive, or as a negative, butwe can talk about that another
time because I'd love to haveyou back on the show.
So let's talk about success.
How do you guys define successin your own lives?
John Brenard (27:31):
You go ahead, Terry.
Yeah, go ahead.
Terry Myers (27:33):
I've defined it as number one.
You're successful Number onewith your community, your family
and your business and just inthe whole general area, trying
to keep that whole thingbalanced out all the way around,
which is very difficult.
I've been so dedicated to thisbusiness for so long Sometimes
you may slip over here I've gota son that he's coming back into
(27:55):
the business.
He went out and been workingfor a major company now for
eight years, so easing him backinto the business.
So that's, I think, beingsuccessful through your kids and
raising them to do right andjust appreciate what we do have
in this country and what it'sbuilt for, what it's meant for,
what it meant for.
I think that's a true meaningto success for me and for me.
John Brenard (28:16):
Success to me is freedom, and really that doesn't
mean not working hard orplaying golf every day, because
that sounds really boring to me.
It's really just having thefoundation to say no to things.
Early in my career you have tosay yes to everything, right.
You go to every meeting, youmeet with every client, every
prospect right.
And I've just gainedperspective through that.
(28:37):
Not everyone or everyopportunity is the right fit,
and that's okay.
It takes time to get to thatpoint.
Right, you have to do thosethings for the first, whatever
that timeframe is, the firstreally decade plus of your
career.
But to reach that stage nowwhere I can just be a lot more
selective and that's come withsome success.
Ed Mathews (28:55):
Yeah, learning to say no is a valuable skill.
Agreed A lot, as a mentor ofmine used to say that sometimes
the deal you don't do is just asimportant as the deal you get.
Hey guys, I've really enjoyedthis conversation.
I'm curious about your non-realestate lives.
So when you're not talkingabout real estate, what else do
you like to do for fun?
John Brenard (29:14):
Yeah, so many things for me really enjoy
fishing, skeet shooting,acoustic guitar playing some
pool, staying in shape, doingsome traveling motorcycle trips.
I'm really never bored.
I got a lot of different thingsI'm interested in, but I'm with
friends and family.
There's a drill down on thosethings but I stay pretty busy.
I stay pretty busy with South T.
That's most of my time, butwhen I do have an hour here or
(29:37):
there I like to do one of thosethings.
Ed Mathews (29:39):
Right on.
How about you, Terry?
Terry Myers (29:41):
For me it's muscle cars.
It's the 60s and late 60s andearly 70s muscle cars, the
Chevelles and this I love toplay with those, collect those.
That's me pretty much it's anantique car.
Ed Mathews (29:56):
Yeah, I'm a Ford guy myself.
My uncle restores Shelbys andmy first car was a 65 Fastback
Mustang and I regret every daythat I sold that but way in, I
was 18 and stupid.
So, guys, I've really enjoyedthis conversation.
I think you, like I saidearlier, I think you've built a
whopper of a business andcongratulations on that.
If people want to learn moreabout you, or Southview
(30:20):
Timberland.
What's the best way to get intouch?
John Brenard (30:22):
Best way is to go to our website and it's easy
southviewtimber.
com right, you can go there.
There's a contact us form andyou can just submit through the
contact us form to meet withsomebody from our team.
You can also just feel free toemail me directly.
It's just John J-O-H-N atSouthview Timber dot com and we
(30:43):
look forward to meeting with anyof your listeners and educating
them more about the asset classand seeing if there's a fit for
us to work together.
Ed Mathews (30:50):
Fantastic Well congratulations and continued
good success.
John Brenard and Terry Myers,thank you for joining us today.
It was really a pleasure tohave a conversation with you.
Terry Myers (30:59):
Thank you for having us.
Greetings and salutations Real Estate
Undergrounders.
It is Ed Mathews with the RealEstate Underground.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
As we have discussed in the veryrecent past, multifamily is
certainly one asset and flippinghouses is another and certainly
near and dear to my heart.
But one of the other things thatI'm always looking for is
opportunities to learn about newasset classes and, as you've
(00:22):
listened to the last severalepisodes and thank you for that,
by the way if you've beenhearing us talk about contractor
yards and land and a wholebunch of other storage and a
whole bunch of otheropportunities out in the real
estate space.
And today I'm joined byactually a really unique
(00:42):
offering and it's something thatI've looked into and it's
something that my partner, mikeMeyer, and I have dabbled in a
little bit and we're starting toget really into it, and that is
Timberland and land.
And with me today is JohnBrenard and Terry Myers from
Southview Timberland Investmentsand they are based down in
Georgia and are looking, theyare raising a fund and going and
(01:05):
buying a whole bunch of landand we're going to talk about
that and a whole bunch of otherstuff.
So, guys, welcome to the show.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
John Brenard (01:12):
Thank you, it's so great to be with you.
Looking forward to hearing aboutthis topic and why we love the
asset clash and talking aboutour backgrounds.
And you got Terry on the phoneas well and Terry say hello.
Terry Myers (01:25):
Hello, thank you for having me.
Ed Mathews (01:26):
Yeah, truly my pleasure.
Guys, yeah, for those folksthat haven't discovered you yet,
why don't we talk a little bitabout your backgrounds and what
Southview Timberland's all about?
John Brenard (01:34):
Yeah, sure, I'll go first, John Brenard.
I'm the managing director andfounder, one of the co-founders
of Southview TimberlandInvestments.
15 plus years in finance andstartup, worked for some of the
biggest wealth managementcompanies JP Morgan, smith,
Arnie, wells Fargo Advisors.
I was a key member of a startup.
After the wealth managementcareer, we built that company
(01:56):
and sold it to a publicly tradedcompany, so that was a great
thing.
So, really, I built twosuccessful businesses in my
career.
One was the wealth managementbusiness scaled that from zero
to over $100 million in asset,and then the second one was a
startup that we built and thensold to a publicly traded
company.
I'm a Timberland investor withbackground in the financial
(02:16):
markets, really focused onexpanding access to Timberland
investing.
You may wonder hey, this guywas involved in wealth
management and startups.
How did he get involved inTimberland?
It all started back in 2008,2009, when my family bought a
Timberland investment propertyand switched me on to it.
But we can talk more about thatorigin story in a little bit.
(02:37):
But, Terry, you wanted to givea little bit on your background.
Terry Myers (02:41):
Yes, I'm Terry Myers.
I've lived in Georgia all mylife and I've basically grown
the farm and being access totimberland and the different
opportunities that it presenteditself in different times.
And I just started outtimberland and selling
timberland, acquiring my owndifferent means of methods of
keeping it and over the past 30,35 years to build a network of
(03:05):
around 12 000 acres of justhaving connections with meals
and stuff and friendships andpeople.
That in the general area of joyhere which is the high timber
in the UEDIS now and I'm up withJohn's folks, they bought a
piece and he and I got totalking.
He says, hey, you know what youcan buy this thing to a bigger
(03:27):
tier.
I said that seems like a goodidea.
So here we are.
Ed Mathews (03:34):
Yeah, and another tier is, to say the least, right
, and you guys have built oneheck of a business, and so
congratulations on that.
The asset class John youmentioned, and Terry, you've got
a sounds like a pretty deep andbroad experience set with
regard to these types ofproperties.
But, John, I know your familybought Timberland.
What about it is so attractive.
I'll throw that out to both youguys.
What about the investment is soattractive and superior to some
(03:55):
of the other asset classes thatyou can invest in.
John Brenard (03:57):
So happy to talk about this, I really talk all
day about it.
But really the biggest thingreally two biggest things I love
about it is it's a real asset.
It's something you can put yourfingers and toes into right.
It's something that I reallyfeel comfortable presenting this
investment to any family, anyfriends, because their dollars
(04:17):
are going into something that'sa hard asset.
The number two thing is thelevel of control you have with
this investment.
So all the other strategiesthat are offered to a lot of
investors.
You're at the winds of thepublic markets right.
You can have a very diversifiedportfolio of stock.
If it goes down 30%, right,there's not a whole lot you can
(04:40):
do.
You can hold on and wait for itto recover right.
But with us and Timberland,biological growth is always
taking over with those trees.
As you and I are sitting heretalking, those trees are growing
right, and so our product isbecoming more valuable every
single day, regardless of what'sgoing on in the stock market or
(05:00):
with interest rates orinflation.
And to me, I just love that,love that control.
And the way that we buyproperty is typically with all
equity, right.
We typically buy the propertiesoutright, we don't take on a
lot of debt and so we're reallynot beholden to anybody.
So those are two big reasons.
I could talk about other onesas well, but I'll let Terry tell
you why he loves the assetclass as well.
Terry Myers (05:22):
Number one like John said, it's an asset that's
tangible, that you can lay yourhands on, you can live on.
You also can recreation on itfor outdoor use.
But there's so many differentavenues.
You can go this day and timewith Pine Timberland and not
only are we focusing in Georgia,mainly because that's where
mainly the most of the meals are, but covering the whole
(05:43):
Southeast.
Yeah.
But what we like about Georgiaso much right now is the growth
pattern that's going on in theSavannah area with the ports and
stuff and it's just reallycreative.
You have multiple fields withland.
You may buy it as a timberlandand you know somebody interested
in HBU.
They see a different use boardor whatever and along comes with
(06:03):
that.
We've been implementing pinestraw.
That's come with that.
We've been for many timesproblem.
That's a great venture we'vetaken on that.
It's using for mulch aroundhouses and just different to me.
And the hunting leases andstuff says hunting is going
crazy or just simply just mylease of people, probably not so
much for hunting but justtaking a family out and enjoying
just having a campsite on.
So we could all kind ofmultiple vendors, probably
(06:25):
ourselves.
A lot of people aren't doingthat.
We could any way to extractvalue for our investors?
Ed Mathews (06:32):
Yeah, so let's break that down, terry, because
that's an interesting point thatyou make.
Actually, there's a couple ofdifferent points that I'd like
to explore, but let's talk aboutthe usage first.
When we talk about timberland,what we're talking about here is
you growing pine to then sendto the mills, to then sell to
lumberyards and the Home Depotsand Lowe's of the world?
(06:52):
yes?
Terry Myers (06:53):
yes, that's very true.
And most timber funds that'sstrictly all they do is
concentrate on the timber growthitself.
So we've added these otheravenues so we can create more
cashflow with the property.
So, yes, the basic Timberlandinvestment is the tree itself.
Ed Mathews (07:12):
Selling board feet.
Right?
Terry Myers (07:13):
Yes, Sir
Ed Mathews (07:14):
All right.
So yeah, and actually you hitupon exactly what I wanted to
explore.
We've had guests on that havetalked about RV parks and mobile
home parks and farmland andland where they are hunting
lands, as well as any number ofother things, and you've touched
upon a thing that I'm curiousabout, and that is how do you
(07:37):
track the folks that are on yourproperty?
12,000 acres is a lot of landand I know that's not even your
corporate portfolio, that's justTerry's portfolio.
Are you giving access to, say,hunters or hikers or campers?
Are you setting up the specificareas where you're allowing
this and then somehowgatekeeping access to the land?
(07:57):
Like, how does that work?
Terry Myers (07:58):
So pretty much each tract of land is in different
areas or whatever.
My history for the past 30, 35years with different people.
It just brings on.
I've got more customers than Ido have products, it's just.
And so occasionally whathappens is you'll sell off a
piece or in the middle of theboat you know they'll have to go
(08:18):
where the hunt or whatever, putthem back on the list when you
do acquire.
A list of hunters is longerthan the list of what I've got
product for and it just keepsclimbing as far as that, because
that just seems to be a bigrecreation.
And then also, like I said, somepeople might not hunt, they
might just want to come and justhave a place that they can
(08:39):
lease and set a camper up on,just enjoy it outdoors.
You know, I mean, it's just,it's really took on a broad
spectrum people wanting to getout on these vast lands in rural
Georgia or rural Alabama orwherever in the southeast.
So it's really been and there'sso many more avenues to go and
have interest at differentlevels.
(09:00):
You mentioned something aboutall the bee parks.
That's another thing.
Our camper zone just just veryrecently didn't have water.
We've set some camper spots upthat they leased these year
round.
There's just a lot of avenuesthere to create revenue from
this.
Ed Mathews (09:16):
Yeah, it's fascinating, and so you're
setting these up as localbusinesses.
Or are folks finding you on anapp like on X or like how are
they figuring out?
Hey, I would love, there's ahuge property that I want to go
hike and how do they?
Terry Myers (09:32):
Mainly it's just word of mouth from previous
customers.
They might have a guest thatcomes with them.
There's no formal advertising.
But I have the product likethat because right now I'll
reach other properties from ajoint landowner and tie into
that.
But it's mainly word of mouthand just customer from past
customer service.
John Brenard (09:53):
Fascinating.
Yeah, I just want to add towhat Terry said.
And we've really set up ourfund to be a four plus
timberland strategy.
So really, at the core ofeverything we do, the land that
we buy has to be a goodtimberland investment.
And in learning this businessthrough Terry over the last I
think last time we checked howlong we've known each other,
(10:14):
it's been going on 18 years.
Really number one is you got topay attention to the soils, you
got to pay attention to themill infrastructure.
So those are really the two keythings that we look for and
Terry had some other things hecan add too.
But that has to be the landthat we buy has to be good
timberland investment.
Then we typically have two orthree of these other activities
(10:34):
that we can offer to createadditional income, like the
recreational leases like we'retalking about.
Our fund also allows forfarmland leases.
So what often happens is we buya thousand acres 700 acres is
timberland and maybe 300 acresis farmland.
We'll be sent out to aprofessional farmer and get the
cash rent from that farmlandlease.
(10:56):
We've done svelte bone towers.
We've done the pine strawharvesting, which we can talk
more about how that works.
Of course, timber harvesting,pre-development, highest and
best used opportunistic landsales.
So it's really we've donemineral rights, so really we do
all the different activities.
The core is that it has to be agood timberland investment
right.
That's the number one thing,and then we usually get these
(11:19):
other two or three activities tocreate income from.
So just wanted to just makethat point as well,
Ed Mathews (11:24):
And it's a great point.
I'm glad you did, because meand my partner, Mike, have just
gotten into development andwe're working on a smaller, much
smaller parcel I think it'slike 58 acres but looking at it
from a highest and best useperspective, there's so many
different things you can do interms of, for instance, with
this particular project it'sprobably going to end up being a
(11:46):
single family or a townhousedevelopment or work with the
local government to figure outwhat they'll approve.
So far they're pretty amenable.
But the other thing that isinteresting and you mentioned a
couple of different uniqueassets, cell phone towers, I
think is what you mentioned issolar fields.
So here in the Northeast Idon't know what the market is
down by you guys, but here inthe Northeast there's a pretty
(12:08):
significant push to utilize landthat you can connect to
tri-phase electricalinfrastructure, and what I mean
by that is wires on the mainroads with transformers and
whatnot.
The ground leases for thosedeals are quite lucrative and I
(12:28):
know cell towers is very similar.
John Brenard (12:30):
Yeah, and we're not incorporating solar panels
in our strategy right now, butwe're not saying that's off the
table.
Really, the most productive useof our land right now is
timberland, because of howstrong of a market that we're in
.
There are some encumbrancesthat come with those solar panel
leases.
I mean, Terry's been in thisbusiness long enough that he's
(12:50):
seen these projects and they getsold over and over again to
different investment companiesMaybe Luce who owns that lease
and then those solar panelsbecome obsolete and then you
have an EPA issue cleaning upthose solar panels.
There's risks with everyactivity that you do.
For now we're going to stick toour core method that has worked
(13:11):
for Terry for 30 plus years andfor me for the better part of
the last 10 years.
But we're keeping a close eyeon those kind of peripheral
strategies to maybe put somecorners of our portfolio into
those methods.
It's a great point, yeah.
Ed Mathews (13:24):
And the point is that you guys are getting real
creative with how you areleveraging the value opportunity
within each of these properties, and it varies, I assume, from
every property to property right, right.
John Brenard (13:35):
And that's the differentiator of Southview
versus some of these bigger TMOsor the publicly traded timber
reaches.
These guys are managingmillions of acres, right.
It's just very hard for them tomonetize those properties the
way that we can.
It's just very hard for them tomonetize those properties the
way that we can.
So our niche is really focusingon the mid-sized properties 500
acres to, say, 2,500 acres andwe're just able to be a lot more
(13:57):
hands-on to rate that outsizedreturns for this asset class,
whereas some of those biggertimber reed they're doing that
four to six percent return.
We're doing at least doublethat on most of the deals that
we do.
Ed Mathews (14:10):
Wow, nice, yeah, and it's mainly because it's too
many cats to herd, right?
It's when you're dealing inmillions of acres or hundreds of
thousands of acres.
It's you've got to stick toyour knitting and do one thing
well, because if you try to dotoo many things, you're going to
get buried.
That's awesome In terms of howyou acquire.
(14:31):
You mentioned equity.
Now I believe you guys areraising a fund.
You don't do syndications.
Can you walk me through thethought process of how you
approach that?
John Brenard (14:39):
Yeah, I'll take the operating why we've chosen
the fund route and then Terrycan talk about the acquisition
process because he really runsTimberland Acquisitions and
Operations.
But we're raising a fund rightnow.
We're raising a $50 millionfund to pursue this strategy and
the reason we've done thatroute because we've done some
indications.
We've been doing friends andfamily deals for a long time and
(15:02):
those are great.
That fund really allows us tohave that cash on hand to just
move a lot quicker.
Because that's really that'sthe differentiator with us
versus some of these othergroups is just being able to do
that due diligence in a time weget to the closing table,
because that makes a differencewith the sellers too.
You can get more advantageousterms if you can get to that
(15:25):
closing table a lot quicker.
So, having that cash on handwith the fund, it just makes a
lot of sense for our kind ofstrategy.
But, Terry, if you want to talkmore about how we source deals
and about our network in theregion and and so forth.
Terry Myers (15:38):
So, being in the business 35 years, I bought,
sold some land attractionlandings as high as three times.
So a lot of times, peoplegetting older, people going a
different direction or peoplesimply just wanting to get out
of that track maybe it's aboutif there were a small one there,
they'll call me and say, hey,I'm interested in some of this.
Do you have anything else?
(15:58):
That's one way of locatingproperty.
And the second is knowing thesegroups, other groups that
you've asked.
Sometimes I can reach in therebecause I've got a purple
relationship for most of them.
And cherry pick, I'll try it,it's in my network.
And then the third opportunityis a lot of time is just simply
family estates coming to an end,where you know they've been
(16:21):
divided up, and those families alot of times say, hey, we've
not been there and we don't wantthat asset.
And the more we agree onsomething.
I bought several differentproperties in that way, so it's
always just the 35 yearsexperience with knowledge,
different managers.
that's managing other people'sproperty that I got a
relationship with.
So that brings a lot ofattraction to the buying table
John Brenard (16:42):
And to replicate if they were a first-time
Timberland investor and that'swhat we're providing at
Southview is we're eliminatingthat, that learning curve.
If you can make the decisionthat, hey, I'm interested in
investing in timberland in areal asset, that's a great
inflation hedge, that'suncorrelated you say, hey, I
want to invest in the assetclass there's really, you know,
(17:04):
you have the publicly tradedREITs which you get the
volatility with those and youdon't get the same returns.
Or you have to go work with theTIBO, where you have these
Timberland Investment ManagementOrganizations.
You typically need $50 million,$100 million.
You need to be an institutionto go work with them, have them
build you a portfolio, and whatwe're offering with Southview is
(17:26):
, at a very reasonable minimumto get that boots on the ground
experienced operators in theasset class.
There's no learning curve,right?
This is not a concept thatwe're trying to prove right.
This is a method that has beenperfected over decades and we're
going to get you involved inour network from day one and
access to these unique dealsthat we find.
Ed Mathews (17:47):
Okay, that's fantastic, and so tell me about
the typical investor.
Is this an investment that isfor accredited investors, or how
do you guys operate that way.
John Brenard (17:56):
So our offering is a Regulation D 506C offering.
Anybody who comes into our fundhas to be an accredited
investor.
The minimum is a hundredthousand for the fund.
But our investors that we have.
We work with registeredinvestment advisors.
We've been onboarded to theCharles Schwab Alternative
Investments Platform.
You have to be invited to getonto that platform and some RIAs
(18:20):
who like what we're doing andsee it as an alternative for
their practice and adifferentiator, asked us to get
onboarded to that platform.
We're getting a lot of tractionin the RIA channel and then also
just high net worth creditedinvestors.
We have a list of accreditedinvestors who are just
interested in a unique assetclass, unique real estate asset
(18:41):
class, like Timberland, andthey'd come into the fund.
So really those two groups werebeginning to speak with family
offices.
Family offices are a little bitof a different animal, right?
They don't.
Sometimes their structures area little bit.
You have to fall into theirtiming in order to get things
done.
So we keep in touch with ahandful of them and we'll
probably see some family officescome into the fund at some
(19:02):
point here soon.
But Dave and accreditedinvestors are really our best
clients.
Ed Mathews (19:06):
Excellent, excellent , all right, all right guys.
Our best clients Excellent,excellent, all right, all right
guys.
So we've been talking.
I can I could talk days aboutthe for days about this stuff.
I'm fascinated by your businessmodel and congratulations again
on a great business that you'vebuilt.
I'd like to get into ourlightning round the final five.
We let's work it this way Sincewe got two guys answering, you
guys can decide who answerswhich question, and and then
we'll just go from there.
So first question is I reallywant to know about what gets you
(19:29):
out of bed on Monday morningand goes to work.
Right, you're alreadysuccessful, I imagine.
The college pay, the collegetuitions are paid and the
mortgages are paid off and thecars are on free and clear and
everything.
So it's not necessarily aboutmoney.
What gets you out of bed andshowing up to work on Monday
morning?
John Brenard (19:46):
I'll take this one and, Terry, you'd probably take
this one too.
For me, it's just really justsucceeding and living to my
highest potential.
You look at, you look out at agraveyard right and it's filled
with people and wasted potentialand I just really my intention
is not to be one of those peopleand just get the most out of
the hundred years that I've beengiven.
Yeah, that's really my purpose,
Ed Mathews (20:05):
All right.
Terry?
Terry Myers (20:06):
I love going out and meeting new people and in
this business it allows me tomeet a new person every time I
venture out on a piece of realestate and it's always something
good that comes out of that.
And it might not even be realestate, it's always about hey,
most of the time it's like thesepeople are reaching out for
help, so at some point in theway it's just hey, give them
back and help them out.
Ed Mathews (20:27):
Love that.
That's great, all right, guys.
Obviously, as successful as youboth are, you've had help along
the way, without a doubt,everybody has, and so I'm
curious about your mentors andthe advice they gave you.
What's the best advice you'veever gotten, and who gave it to
you?
John Brenard (20:42):
I'll take this one to start, but I'll just I'll
take this about Terry.
Terry was, before we went intobusiness together, was a mentor
to me, right, teaching me aboutthis asset class, right,
teaching me how to find deals,allowing me to come in right
when I was still building in mycareer, to contribute what I
could to a deal, and that wasjust very generous of him to
(21:02):
allow me to do that.
But he says something thatsticks with me.
I think a lot of people you knowsome people these days they sit
around feeling sorry forthemselves, right, there's a lot
of self-reflection of maybethey're feeling depressed and
the number one remedy for thatis really just to go get busy,
right.
And Terry just says a lot moresimple than I do, but you just
(21:24):
said go out and wash your car.
And I think that's just reallygood advice is, if you're
feeling sorry for yourself,right, just go out and get busy
and just get started doingsomething.
And I don't have a lot of timefor self-reflection building
this business right now, butthat has been helpful to me at
certain periods just to keepbusy and keep moving forward
when things are a little bitdifficult.
(21:44):
So that's been helpful.
Ed Mathews (21:45):
Terry?
Terry Myers (21:46):
I'd have to say it would be my dad.
My dad was always.
Actually I got two.
As far as my dad laid coreprinciples down my life and one
of them was always do what yousay you do and mean what you do
and always have no excuses.
If you do have some defects orfaults, hey, stand up and take
face of them.
Just learn from that, from yourfailure.
As far as real estate, it wouldhave to be John Dixon.
(22:09):
John Dixon was a very mentor,friend of mine, great guy.
He's in the Marietta area.
He's in the auction business.
He took me under his wingprobably in 1995, 1996.
He was straight from differentparts of the world and
introduced me to things likeKing 31, conservation easements.
(22:31):
I pretty well have a guy likehim.
He was just a great mentor inthe real estate business.
But those two guys right there,and God's people too, so that
would be my two men of grace.
John Brenard (22:43):
Yeah, and I'd be remiss if I didn't mention my
folks too.
I have two of the best parentsin the world, and I see them as
my something to aspire to aswell.
Just wanted to add that, yeah.
Ed Mathews (22:53):
Thank you.
I always learn.
You learn a lot from yourmentors, but you also learn a
lot from stubbing your toe, andso I'm curious about a mistake,
professional mistake, that youguys have made over the years
that you made a decision.
You're like boy.
I'd like to have that one backand what'd you do to recover?
John Brenard (23:08):
Gary?
why don't you, why don't youtake this one off?
Hold on a second.
Terry Myers (23:10):
Yeah, I can hold on to that.
So a lot of times you'retalking and you're trying to
trade on a piece of property andyou don't be as aggressive.
Sometimes you think you need tobe and sometimes you don't.
I think always the aggressionis the better part for me,
because if there's something yousee is key that worked for you,
there's one particular time Ikind of grubbed my foot on
(23:32):
something not so much pricing,but I didn't feel like I was
putting pressure on the peopleabout buying it.
Well, I give it about a weekafter talking with them and come
back and say, hey, we justentered in a contract two days
ago and I look like and it wasfor less money than what I
offered, but for whatever reason, they didn't take it the deal
serious because I wasn't pushinghard enough and that's probably
(23:53):
not always accurate.
But I would say, hey, stickwith it.
Do you do?
Hey, you either get it or theysay, hey, we just don't want to
fail it.
Ed Mathews (24:00):
Dog on a bone
Terry Myers (24:00):
Yeah.
John Brenard (24:01):
Yeah, for me it's really just early in my career
is just spreading myself toothin on too many, too many ideas
and too many side projects, andthat was kind of my side hustle
.
Could compete with a guy who isall in on the thing that I'm
calling my side hustle, then aguy's going to beat you every
time if he's all in and I'm allin on Southview, right, because
(24:23):
the only thing that I'm workingon and 100% focused on this and
you just look back at the mostsuccessful entrepreneurs in
history right, I mean, theyreally did one.
At the most successfulentrepreneurs in history right,
I mean, they really did onething very well.
There are exceptions, right,there are people who have
multiple businesses, but moreoften than not, they typically
do one thing really well.
Right, Rockefeller did oil,like Carnegie did steel, and I'd
(24:46):
say Terry and I are working onTimberland, yeah, all right.
Ed Mathews (24:49):
You're the next.
You're the JP Morgan andRockefeller of Timberland.
I love it.
John Brenard (24:53):
Hey, we'll take it
Ed Mathews (24:54):
You said typically when you get to your level and
how you get to your level isthrough continuous learning
right, and so I'm curious abouthow you consume information,
whether that's through books oraudio books or podcasts or
whatever, and who you paidattention to these days.
Who's helping you out?
John Brenard (25:10):
Podcast is one.
There's a couple of podcasts Ilisten to.
One's called Real EstateUnderground with Ed Mathews, but
yeah, also Founders Podcast isa great one.
They're typically less than anhour.
Just gives you a greatbackground on some of the most
successful entrepreneurs inhistory, and not just current
entrepreneurs.
The lessons that are learned inhistory are still relevant
(25:31):
today and they do a great jobwith that one.
But I'm also just payingattention to these days, this
early innings that were inalternative investments and
private markets, because that'sreally where our strategy sits,
about how RIAs family officesaccredited across the spectrum
are looking for thesealternative investments, and so
(25:53):
that's a theme that I'm justpaying attention to because
there's just a lot of tailwindsfor strategies like ours to
benefit from that.
Yeah, it's something I'm payingattention to these days.
Ed Mathews (26:04):
Excellent.
How about you, Terry?
Terry Myers (26:06):
Pretty much I've stayed in the same pattern that
I've been in because it's beenworking for me, but also along
the way I just noticed the youngcomers that come along.
It's got different ideas,especially with social media,
how they project sales fromtimber to land sales to even
just acquiring different methodsalso.
(26:27):
And then, most importantly, Ilisten to the elder, the head of
me, sticking with hey, you needto stick with the same roots.
So I mix it up between theyoung and the old.
I'm right in the middle of theroad, so that's how I stay real
close to, as far as the meal,the demand for wood.
We just had a big hurricanecome through here and, hey,
lumber price is pretty goodright now but I'm sure the
(26:49):
demand for lumber will be realbig.
And even in California, withthe fire, this Georgia Southern
Pine that we grow, theYellowleaf Pine, it's the
strongest timber breed.
They're winning all the codesnow, especially in Florida.
So I just try to take on what'sgoing on in the industry and go
into different places with theForestry, the Georgia Forestry
Association.
Ed Mathews (27:10):
Yeah, right on that's yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting, it's itwas something that we should
certainly talk about, maybe onanother show is how the changing
weather patterns are affectingyour business good, or to the
positive, or as a negative, butwe can talk about that another
time because I'd love to haveyou back on the show.
So let's talk about success.
How do you guys define successin your own lives?
John Brenard (27:31):
You go ahead, Terry.
Yeah, go ahead.
Terry Myers (27:33):
I've defined it as number one.
You're successful Number onewith your community, your family
and your business and just inthe whole general area, trying
to keep that whole thingbalanced out all the way around,
which is very difficult.
I've been so dedicated to thisbusiness for so long Sometimes
you may slip over here I've gota son that he's coming back into
(27:55):
the business.
He went out and been workingfor a major company now for
eight years, so easing him backinto the business.
So that's, I think, beingsuccessful through your kids and
raising them to do right andjust appreciate what we do have
in this country and what it'sbuilt for, what it's meant for,
what it meant for.
I think that's a true meaningto success for me and for me.
John Brenard (28:16):
Success to me is freedom, and really that doesn't
mean not working hard orplaying golf every day, because
that sounds really boring to me.
It's really just having thefoundation to say no to things.
Early in my career you have tosay yes to everything, right.
You go to every meeting, youmeet with every client, every
prospect right.
And I've just gainedperspective through that.
(28:37):
Not everyone or everyopportunity is the right fit,
and that's okay.
It takes time to get to thatpoint.
Right, you have to do thosethings for the first, whatever
that timeframe is, the firstreally decade plus of your
career.
But to reach that stage nowwhere I can just be a lot more
selective and that's come withsome success.
Ed Mathews (28:55):
Yeah, learning to say no is a valuable skill.
Agreed A lot, as a mentor ofmine used to say that sometimes
the deal you don't do is just asimportant as the deal you get.
Hey guys, I've really enjoyedthis conversation.
I'm curious about your non-realestate lives.
So when you're not talkingabout real estate, what else do
you like to do for fun?
John Brenard (29:14):
Yeah, so many things for me really enjoy
fishing, skeet shooting,acoustic guitar playing some
pool, staying in shape, doingsome traveling motorcycle trips.
I'm really never bored.
I got a lot of different thingsI'm interested in, but I'm with
friends and family.
There's a drill down on thosethings but I stay pretty busy.
I stay pretty busy with South T.
That's most of my time, butwhen I do have an hour here or
(29:37):
there I like to do one of thosethings.
Ed Mathews (29:39):
Right on.
How about you, Terry?
Terry Myers (29:41):
For me it's muscle cars.
It's the 60s and late 60s andearly 70s muscle cars, the
Chevelles and this I love toplay with those, collect those.
That's me pretty much it's anantique car.
Ed Mathews (29:56):
Yeah, I'm a Ford guy myself.
My uncle restores Shelbys andmy first car was a 65 Fastback
Mustang and I regret every daythat I sold that but way in, I
was 18 and stupid.
So, guys, I've really enjoyedthis conversation.
I think you, like I saidearlier, I think you've built a
whopper of a business andcongratulations on that.
If people want to learn moreabout you, or Southview
(30:20):
Timberland.
What's the best way to get intouch?
John Brenard (30:22):
Best way is to go to our website and it's easy
southviewtimber.
com right, you can go there.
There's a contact us form andyou can just submit through the
contact us form to meet withsomebody from our team.
You can also just feel free toemail me directly.
It's just John J-O-H-N atSouthview Timber dot com and we
(30:43):
look forward to meeting with anyof your listeners and educating
them more about the asset classand seeing if there's a fit for
us to work together.
Ed Mathews (30:50):
Fantastic Well congratulations and continued
good success.
John Brenard and Terry Myers,thank you for joining us today.
It was really a pleasure tohave a conversation with you.
Terry Myers (30:59):
Thank you for having us.
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