July 9, 2025 • 37 mins
If you are curious about alternatives to Menopause Hormone Therapy, Dr. Chloe Weber and I dive deep into the world of Traditional Chinese Medicine and how customized herbal formulations can offer powerful support through menopause, whether you're taking MHT or seeking natural alternatives to manage symptoms and support overall wellbeing.
• Chloe explains how Chinese medicine differs from Western approaches by addressing root causes rather than isolated symptoms
• Chinese medicine views menopause as a depletion of "kidney yin" that begins around age 35
• The "five elements" framework connects different organ systems, emotions, and functions that affect hormonal health
• Noxy Herbs offers a modular system with formulas for different phases of the menopause transition
• Chinese herbs can complement hormone replacement therapy by potentiating its effects
• Quality matters—all herbs should be tested for heavy metals, pesticides, and potency
• Self-care becomes especially important during menopause as energy shifts from caretaking to self-nourishment
• Food therapy recommendations include black sesame, goji berries, Chinese yams, and cooling herbs like mint
Find Chloe Weber at noxiherbs.com or listen to her podcast, Radical Remedy. Her book on women's health and Chinese medicine is coming in fall 2025.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everybody and welcome back to the Real Food
Stories podcast.
I am your host, heather Carey.
Today's episode is a rich andeye-opening conversation that I
have been so excited to sharewith you.
I am joined by Chloe Weber, whois a doctor of Chinese medicine
.
She's an herbalist and apassionate advocate for
(00:24):
integrative, holistic healing.
If you're in midlife andnavigating the ups and downs of
perimenopause or postmenopause,especially if hormone therapy is
not an option for you, thisepisode is a must listen.
Chloe and I dive deep into theworld of traditional Chinese
(00:44):
medicine and how customizedherbal formulations can offer
powerful support throughmenopause.
We also talk about somethingreally important.
While hormone replacementtherapy can be incredibly
helpful for many women, it's nota magic bullet all of the time
it doesn't fix everything.
(01:04):
It can fix a lot of things, butit doesn't always fix
everything, and it doesn'talways agree with women as well,
or you might not be a candidatefor hormones.
So what I learned from Chloe isthat, whether you're taking HRT
or not, chinese herbs can, in aroundabout way, fill in the
(01:25):
gaps.
Think, better sleep, fewer hotflashes, more energy and just
overall support for your wholebody, not just your hormones.
It's a whole science and Icould actually have Chloe back
on again just to even talk morein depth about what Chinese
medicine is, but it's a lot toknow and that's why it's good to
(01:48):
have an expert like Chloe.
Now, chloe also introduces usto the five phases of Chinese
medicine, which is a frameworkthat helps us understand not
just our bodies, but also how wenourish ourselves through food.
Eating seasonally and inalignment with nature is one of
the core principles and,honestly, it's something we
(02:09):
could all benefit from embracingmore, because nourishing
yourself with the rhythms of theseasons is absolutely a must
right now.
So let's get into thisbeautiful grounding conversation
I had with Chloe and hope tosee you in the Recipe Club
conversation I had with Chloeand hope to see you in the
Recipe Club.
(02:33):
A doctor of Chinese medicine,chloe Weber is the founder of
Noxy Herbs, a groundbreakingherbal line designed to meet
women where they are in theirhormonal journey.
Noxy's modular system drawsfrom the deep wisdom of
traditional Chinese medicine tooffer personalized,
phase-specific formulas thatevolve with a woman's cycle, age
and needs, bringing ancientprecision to modern hormonal
chaos.
Chloe's mission is clear tocreate a proactive model of
(02:57):
medicine that empowers womenwith real solutions, not
prescriptions.
She is also the host of theRadical Remedy podcast, where
she educates and inspires a newwave of health-conscious women
ready to reclaim their bodiesand their power.
Hi, chloe, I am so happy tohave you on the show because we
are in what I think of as like amenopause revival right now,
(03:21):
and what I mean by that is thatmenopause and hormones are just
having a moment.
On social media with Oprah,everyone's talking about
menopause right now, and thereinlies, I think, so much
confusion.
We know that every woman onthis planet goes through
(03:42):
menopause and the menopausetransition, and we know that
most women experience a lot ofdisruption in their lives due to
menopause physically,emotionally and using hormones
as a solution has been socontroversial, in a way, for
years.
Right, and even though we knownow that hormones are safe for
(04:05):
most women, they're not alwaysthe perfect answer.
Nor do women want to go onhormones.
They want to try to dosomething more natural, and for
this reason, I'm really excitedto have you on and talk about
alternative ways to help withhormones and the whole menopause
transition.
So welcome to the show.
(04:26):
I'm so happy to have you here.
Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It's an honor to be here and I, too, am thrilled
that Women's Health is finallyhaving a moment.
As I like to say, it isfantastic that we are finally
being acknowledged being, as wehave created every single person
on this planet, so it is abouttime that people actually take
our health seriously and Chineseherbs.
I've been really blown awaywith this conversation coming
(04:51):
out and how much information iscoming out and how much focus is
on women's health right now,particularly menopause, and it
shocks me that Chinese medicineis not at the forefront of this
conversation, because Chinesemedicine, particularly Chinese
herbal medicine, does such anincredible job at supporting
women's health and hormones, soI'm really excited to be here to
(05:11):
chat with you about it.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Great.
So jump in and tell me yourstory about how you got into
Chinese medicine, how youcreated your company and how
it's different, I think, thantypical supplements.
We see a lot of wackysupplements out on the internet,
you know, to trying to cater tomenopause symptoms and
(05:34):
menopause health, and so let'sjust jump in, just for the sake
of my audience, who might notknow a lot about traditional
Chinese medicine.
Give us a little background onthat know a lot about
traditional Chinese medicine.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Give us a little background on that.
Totally so.
When I was younger, I reallywanted to study public health
and look into the different waysthat we could support building
health in our society.
When I was 15, I had a raretropical disease called
cutaneous leishmaniasis.
I started learning about howwhat we were doing to our
environment was spreadingdisease and evolving disease
within our societies, and soit's something that I've always
(06:10):
been fascinated with.
I started down the Westernmedical route and then just saw
that a lot of it was justputting band-aids on top of
issues instead of actuallyaddressing the root causes of
disharmony, and so that'sprecisely what Chinese medicine
does.
So instead of just looking atthe symptoms that are presenting
let's say, menopause, so like,say, you're having hot flashes
(06:33):
or headaches or weight gaininstead of just looking at these
symptoms in isolation, we'relooking at the underlying
patterns of disharmony withinyour body.
So we're trying to reallyrestore the ecology of the body
so that your body is functioningbetter.
So Western medicine is reallyreactive medicine.
(06:55):
We're looking at these singularpathways.
So it's like, okay, we'remissing estrogen, great.
But that estrogen is important,but it also ties into the body
in many different ways.
So with Chinese medicine, whenwe're talking about menopause,
we're often talking about yinand yang.
So many people have heard ofyin and yang or yin and yang, so
(07:15):
that's not just like a cutelittle symbol in Chinese
medicine, that's a reallyfoundational aspect of our
medicine.
So yin is the nourishing fluidaspects of the body, whereas
yang is the fire active aspectsof the body.
So as we hit 35, our kidney,yin, which the kidneys are in
charge of our reproductivehealth and store our vital
(07:38):
energy that we're formed withour kidney yin starts to deplete
at 35.
This is where we start seeingthese perimenopausal symptoms
that yin again, the cooling,nourishing aspects of the body,
as that's depleting, we'reseeing signs of dryness, hot
flashes, increased anxiety,heart palpitations.
(07:59):
These things all come upbecause that yin starts to
decline.
So in Chinese medicine what wedo is we really nourish the
kidneys, nourish the yin, and wedo that through lifestyle
acupuncture and acupressure andeven just dietary therapy.
So it's a very different systemthan Western medicine and even
(08:20):
Western herbology, which Westernherbology typically will still
give you sort of like aone-to-one correlation, like
you're normally just taking oneherb.
In Chinese medicine we haveabout 400 different herbs that
we choose from and we createreally dynamic formulas to
address the symptoms and thoseroot causes.
Hopefully that was not tooconfusing and all over the place
.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, no, so it sounds like it's just a more
right taking just hormonereplacement therapy.
I mean estrogen affects a lotfrom like our head to toes right
, but the herbs in Chinesemedicine seem to focus on like a
more holistic Am I.
(09:08):
Am I correct in this?
Speaker 2 (09:10):
So it's a nourishing, but it's also supporting the
other aspects of the body.
So basically, we look at, so wetalk about the five elements a
lot in Chinese medicine.
So we've got wood, fire, earth,metal and water and each of
these elements corresponds withdifferent organ system,
corresponds with differentflavor, a different taste, a
different emotion, right.
(09:32):
And so the ones that are mostdeeply connected to hormone
health in Chinese medicine arethe liver, the kidneys, the
heart and the spleen.
So the spleen is in charge ofprocessing both foods and
emotions, right.
So we see the spleen out ofalignment.
We'll see loose stools,overthinking that monkey mind
(09:52):
before bed.
You might have food allergies,you might feel sort of fatigued
in your muscles, heavy, so thatwe see go out of alignment in
menopause often, right.
So we see women start carryingthat extra weight.
We call that dampness inChinese medicine.
So we want to make sure thatthe spleen is functioning.
But the spleen is on the sameaxis as the liver.
(10:14):
The liver is in charge of thefree flow of qi and blood
throughout the body and isdeeply connected to our cycle
and really impacted by stress.
So the liver, if you're havingPMS symptoms, you're having
irritability, frustration, youhave day of rage, as I lovingly
like to call it, that's theliver chi stagnation.
(10:35):
So Chinese medicine has honoredthe fact that digestion and
stress are on the same axis forthousands of years, and so these
two are always impacted On theflip side, and that's often sort
of younger years of hormonehealth.
When it comes to menopause, thekidneys, as I said, are like the
(10:56):
house of our reproduction andour original chi and that sort
of declines as we age, our jing,as we call it, and then the
heart is really where we storeour spirit, and so that axis is
really important when it comesto menopause, because what
happens is we've had all of thisenergy in our kidneys in terms
(11:17):
of creating new life, in termsof sustaining that life that
we've created, taking care ofeverybody else, and as we go
through menopause, that energyflips to our heart, and so at
that point we're able to reallytruly express ourselves.
I think there's a trend onTikTok, the we Do Not Care Club
for women in menopause andperimenopause, and that is what
(11:39):
is happening we do not carebecause now, finally, instead of
taking care of everybody else'sneeds and catering to everyone
else in our communities, in ourlives, in our homes, we are
finally honoring our true selvesand saying we're tired, we're
fed up and I'm going to takecare of myself for the first
time I'm at life.
So in Chinese medicine, it'sjust a completely different way
(12:03):
of looking at it.
So, yes, we want to support theestrogen and make sure that we
are getting that nourishmentthat we need for our mind and
our body, but it's just such adifferent system and different
way of looking at the body andhonoring you know these dynamic
forces within our body and howthey're interacting with each
other.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Okay, yeah, so it sounds like I mean it's so much.
I mean it sounds like you can'tdo this on your own right.
I mean we would need you to.
Maybe is it very individual howyou prescribe herbs and
different herbs and everything,because I know that you've got
(12:46):
some formulas.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah.
So the gold standard in Chinesemedicine is always going to be
getting a customizable formulafrom a practitioner.
And if you have the means to goand get an acupuncturist, I
highly recommend it.
Acupuncture is amazing forhormone regulation and just
overall support and wellbeing.
Um, so you can look up somebodyin your area, search around.
(13:12):
Not all doctors are the rightfit for you, but search and find
the right one for you.
If you have that ability,highly recommend it.
Cannot recommend it more If youcan't.
You know my goal is reallytrying to use Chinese herbs for
public health intervention.
In China, chinese herbs are thebackbone of the medicine and in
(13:32):
the US we're not really usingthese herbs very much or not to
their full efficacy.
So, as a practitioner, when I'mworking with women, what I
normally do is I'll changeformulas at least once
throughout the course of themonth.
So after you're done bleeding,you're largely depleted.
You've just bled for three toseven days, so you're run down.
(13:54):
So we need to nourish thekidneys, nourish the blood and
build qi back up.
So qi is your energy.
So I have a formula for thatcalled nourish, and then after
that, for most women, what youwant to do is you want to move
the qi and blood.
So in preparation for yourcycle, you want to make sure
(14:18):
that that qi and blood is movingsmoothly.
That'll alleviate those PMSsymptoms.
Help with the irritability andfrustration.
Make sure that you're nothaving cramps.
Help with the irritability andfrustration.
Make sure that you're nothaving cramps as you evolve and
as you start going throughmenopause and perimenopause.
You may want to start focusingmore on the nourish, so
nourishing the kidneys, but youmight want to change from that
(14:40):
liver cheese, stagnation, theregulate, over to our heart
formula, calm.
So Calm is really nourishingthe heart we also have.
So basically, what I createdwas a system where it's largely
a spleen formula, so a digestionformula that I often recommend
for women going throughperimenopause, who are gaining
(15:00):
more weight, and also for womenwho are going through hormonal,
metabolically based hormonaldisorders like PCOS, um.
So that's resolved.
Then we've got regulate, whichis a liver chi formula which is
often used for irritability,frustration, pms symptoms.
But you're also getting thosePMS symptoms and perimenopause,
(15:22):
um, and sometimes significantlymore intensely, um.
And then we've got calm, whichis a heart tonic, which is
really I like to think of it aslike a big hug through the heart
.
It's just really helping calmyour spirit.
It's great for sleep, insomnia,night sweats and then nourishes
the kidney formula.
That's really deeply tonifyingyour body.
(15:42):
So we have a quiz on thewebsite that women can take and
it'll tell you which formulas werecommend and for which times
of the cycle.
If you're in menopause uh,clinically like if you're
already like at that phase ofgoing through menopause I
normally recommend that you'rejust taking nourish during the
day and then calm at night andthat's just a really deeply
(16:05):
tonifying uh care to help yousleep well, to help nourish your
kidneys, help nourish theestrogen and it is going to
support I know you guys beforeit.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
It is going to support with that hrt if you are
taking hrt as well okay, yeah,because I was going to ask you
that is, is this something thatyou can do in conjunction?
Because it sounds, I mean, I'mon hormones, on hormones so, and
I know it like it helps to likesome specific things, but I but
I am the first person to saylike it is no magic bullet it
has helped me in a lot of ways.
(16:37):
I mean, I'm not going off of itany anytime soon if I don't
have to, but it sounds like theherbs sort of fill in like these
gaps, like it.
It like rounds out healing, youknow, or or you know, just the.
Is that correct to say that?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, well, what I?
I mean what the researchindicates and what I've found
clinically, is that the herbsreally potentiate the actions of
the estrogen and helps youbalance your body in a different
way.
So it's like you know, theestrogen is sort of one size
(17:17):
fits all and does so manydynamic things within the body
and brain, as you mentioned,really impacts every aspect of
it.
But we still have theseunderlying patterns of
disharmony from a lifetime ofovergiving, of, you know, not
taking care of ourselves in theway that we need to, of just
(17:39):
getting older.
I mean, like you know,everybody has some level of
imbalance within their body.
You know, I'm a doctor ofChinese medicine.
I live this medicine, I eatfairly immaculately and take
very good care of myself, andyet I still have spleen qi
deficiency.
I still get liver qi stagnation.
(17:59):
I'm still going to getfrustrated.
You know, these imbalances justhappen because we live in this
world which is innatelyincredibly stressful and
challenging, and not to mention,we are also bombarded with
environmental toxins everywhereas well as emotional toxins
everywhere.
So it's helping restore balanceto those underlying patterns so
(18:23):
that the estrogen can also bemore effective in what it's
doing as well, can also be moreeffective in what it's doing as
well.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Is there science behind these herbs and these
formulations?
Because I just always likescience.
I mean, it all sounds great andI'm going to, I want to
experiment with all your herbs.
I'm just curious like is theresome, like you know?
Are there studies behind usingherbs?
Oh, yes, well.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
I think that's why I ended up gravitating to Chinese
herbs instead of being morefocused on acupuncture.
So most people, when yougraduate from a, you know I got
a master's in Chinese medicine,which, I always like to point
out, is, of course, equivalentof two and a half law degrees,
or four and a half master'sdegrees in three years.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
I then went on and got my doctorate.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But so I, you know most people focus on acupuncture
because that's something thatyou know, it's really tangible,
you feel the difference and it'sjust like more known and
understood in the West.
For me, I always gravitated toChinese herbs and I think that
that was because I couldunderstand the Eastern
(19:28):
energetics through the lens ofChinese medicine.
But I could also look at allthe Western pharmacological
actions of these herbs.
So there's so much research onthese herbs, it's pretty
incredible.
So again, I tend to have, Iwant to say, about 12 to 15
herbs in my formulas in each ofthem.
(19:49):
So most of my formulas arecompletely customized and
created by me.
My formula regulate is sort ofan off spin of a classical
Chinese herbal formula calledShaoyao Song, which has been
used for hundreds of years toregulate women's cycles, and
there's a ton of research onthat base formula that we use
(20:09):
for that.
So I was sort of debatingwhether to use classical
formulas because of the researchon the full formula or whether
to modify.
And in the end I wanted tomodify in order to honor sort of
the evolution of where we arein society and how our bodies
are changing, like I feel likeour digestion is not as
(20:29):
effective as it might have beenback in the day when we weren't
eating, you know, glyphosate andall of these various different
toxins daily, no matter howclean we are.
So you know I put in a littlebit more digestive support herbs
in there.
But there's a lot of researchon all of the single herbs, you
(20:52):
know.
Ginseng hushawu reishi, youknow use a lot of medicinal
mushrooms in Chinese medicine.
So it's really fun going downthat rabbit hole.
I highly recommend anybody nerdout on it, and I'll be coming
out with a book on women'shealth and Chinese medicine
Chinese herbs in fall.
I'm just finishing it up, butit has a bunch of research on
(21:15):
specific herbs and how you canstart integrating them into your
diet and into teas that you canmake at home for yourself as
well.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Oh, that's great.
That sounds like it's veryneeded.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Yeah, I'm just like why isn't this out there?
Like I feel, like most of theprojects I work on, like my
first business was well, mysecond business was Radical
Roots, which is CBD and Chineseherbs, and I wanted to make that
to stop.
My son, Remy, has a geneticdisorder because he has seizures
, and I just kept seeing theseone size fits all CBD products
(21:48):
on the market and I was likethis is great, but like if we
use different herbs together topotentiate the actions, it's
going to be so much moreeffective.
And I tried to like pitch theidea to different CBD companies.
I was like I'm a single mom ofa kiddo with special needs.
I don't want to be startinganother business right now.
I know how that goes.
Um, and nobody was interested.
(22:09):
And it was one of those thingswhere you sort of stomp your
feet long enough.
Then you're like damn it, I'lldo it.
And I feel that way withwomen's health Also.
I'm like there arepractitioners out there who have
, you know, been sorevolutionary in Chinese
medicine and women's health.
I don't know why they're notputting this information out on
a bigger scale.
And so finally I was like, okay, well, if they're not going to
(22:33):
do it, then I'm going to do mydamnedest to get this out to as
many women as possible, BecauseI've watched how incredibly safe
and effective it is over mylast 15 years of clinical
practice and I know it changeslives powerfully.
Yeah, that's so interesting.
I mean, I'm so glad that you'redoing it and I know it changes
lives powerfully.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Yeah, that's so interesting.
I mean, I'm so glad that you'redoing it and I'm just wondering
why.
I mean with like, I mean justyour example of the CBD that I
mean CBD I don't know had itsmoment a couple of years ago.
It seemed like it was.
There's pop-up shops in thetown I live in.
There's, I mean, everyone wastaking CBD, and now it just
(23:10):
seems like nobody's taking, ormaybe they are, I don't know.
You just don't see it like that, you know.
And so when you have a veryspecific formula and I wonder
why, like you know, or in theChinese herbs too, that it's not
more effective, top of mind.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I mean I think there is a lot.
There has been traditionally alot of propaganda against China
in our country.
You know, realistically, likeanytime I go off you know not
every time, but most of the timeif I go on social media, I'll
get some level of people tellingme that I killed rhinos, that
(23:49):
you know like, that it's ladenwith pesticides and whatnot you
know like, which can be aconcern.
Every single herb that we getis tested for heavy metals,
pesticides and potency.
So I'm very psychotic aboutthat.
We manufacture it all in theStates, here in Colorado,
through a crazy alchemical,spagyric extraction.
(24:09):
You know like I'm a propermaniac when it comes to the
quality of our products, butthere is a lot of stigma against
things coming from China.
And then also, you know, Ithink a lot of people really
have bought into the belief thatthe Western medical system is
the most effective medicalsystem that there is.
(24:31):
Personally, I believe theresearch which states that
Western medicine is the thirdleading cause of death in our
country and that's properlyprescribed Western medicine.
So to me, I would much preferthat people try and do natural
medicine and traditionalmedicines before you go to
(24:52):
Western medicine.
That's not to say that Westernmedicine doesn't have a place.
I absolutely admire it.
I love the research I nerd outon all of it.
I think it has its place, butto me it's like, okay, what can
we do with lifestyle, you know,are you actually sleeping well?
Are you actually moving everyday?
Are you eating real foods?
Are you taking care of yourselfin these basic ways that we
(25:13):
really, truly need to in orderto build foundational health?
That is number one, and I cantell you that, like 95% of
people out there are not doingthat, you know.
Then it's like okay, so let's,let's look at tweaking your diet
, then maybe herbs oracupuncture, and then for some
instances then you need theWestern, you know,
pharmacological interventions.
(25:35):
But often, if you're on herbsand you're doing the other
things and you need less of theWestern medicines, which do tend
to come with significant sideeffects, which what I see
clinically again is sort ofthose side effects compound, and
then you're on more and morepharmaceuticals, which creates a
snowball effect.
So it's not that I don't likeWestern meds, it's more just
(25:57):
like let's go through the properorder to see if they're
necessary.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Yeah, I think that's such a good point.
We, you know these Chineseherbs sound so good, but we here
in the United States live aWestern lifestyle of like, high
stress, on the move, eating junk, you know, like we're just like
and give it, give us something,give me a quick fix, give me a
pill, give me.
And so I imagine that theseherbs have to be used in
(26:28):
conjunction with improving otherareas of your lifestyle, right,
and?
And that they take.
It's not like a, an immediatehit, right, it's like a.
You probably take them for awhile and it and it right.
Is that, is that correct, or isthat am I?
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Yeah, no, I mean certain things.
You know, like you can takecalm and you'll probably sleep
better.
You know, like that.
You know you can definitely getan immediate bang, got a cold
or flu.
We can knock that out realquick.
You know, like, um, so itdepends on what you're working
with.
You know, when it comes tohormones, hormones, um,
(27:07):
sometimes it takes a couple ofmonths.
You know a lot of women thatI've seen are coming to me with
endometriosis that they've hadfor 10 years, that they've been
to 20 different doctors and it'slike, yeah, this isn't going to
be fixed with two acupuncturetreatments and a month's worth
of herbs that you're taking half, you know, every other day, you
know.
So it's like you do need to beconsistent.
(27:27):
You do need to take some of thelifestyle recommendations.
Need to be consistent.
You do need to take some of thelifestyle recommendations.
You know if you are surroundingyourself with environmental
toxins and emotional toxins andjust thinking that, you know a
Western pill or an herbalmedicine is going to just solve
that, you know it's unfortunate,but it's not.
And it's really important thatwe, especially as women, start
(27:48):
taking proactive care ofourselves mind, body and soul.
And I also get very concernedabout this because I think that
we also have to consider whatare we showing our daughters and
our children when we aresacrificing our health for them?
and for everybody else, and Iknow it's a backwards way to
(28:10):
manipulate women into takingcare of themselves.
But it is how I had to getmyself to take better care of
myself is having, you know,being a single mom, child with
special needs.
I burned myself out so hardthose first couple of years and
then I really had to take a stepback and say what good is it
for him, you know, to get thatnext inch stone of development
(28:32):
if his mom is sick and depressedand exhausted all the time
because she's just pushing sohard, you know?
And I really had to put him inthe forefront in order to get
myself to actually do that.
So, you know, I just think it'sreally important, you know, I
think women are justastoundingly strong and powerful
(28:53):
and inspirational.
I'm so blown away.
It's so much fun stepping intothe space of women's health.
I like bow down to all of thewomen and moms out there.
Like, truly, it's such ahumbling space to hear the
stories of how much women havegone through, to hear the
(29:13):
stories of how much women havegone through and, like I, just I
so believe that if we actuallyreally start taking care of
ourselves, we, we might be ableto be the change we are hoping
and desperately needing in thissociety.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Yeah, taking care of ourselves is something that's
really foreign to so many women,especially moms, who are just
used to outputting right andburning themselves out, and I
think that's such a good pointthat we need to take care of
ourselves first and be in ourbest health before we can take
care of other people and ourchildren and right we and and to
(29:45):
be a good role model.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
Such a good point well and it's, it's a lot more
fun, you know, like I mean, Ithink I think we lose ourselves
in the caretaking of others andit's, like you know, starting to
reclaim those bits of joy andthose bits of our independence,
those bits of excitement, youespecially as a mom, is a
(30:09):
radical act.
And and that radical act likebrings more joy to us, which,
like really shifts the energy inour homes right, and like
really shifts how we're engagingwith the world and each other.
And, like you know, our societyis not set up to support us the
way that it needs to be.
(30:30):
So it's important for us tofind the ways, even the small,
teeny, tiny ways.
I always say something's betterthan nothing.
I don't care what it is,whether it's just taking your
herbs and going outside andbreathing with a cup of coffee
for a minute, I don't care, lockyour kids out, do whatever you
got to do.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
But, like every little step in the direction of
health is an incrediblyimportant one, and it really
does not matter how small.
So when I went to cookingschool many moons ago, my
(31:11):
cooking school was very healthsupportive and we were following
.
We followed very closely thesefive phases to do meal planning
and about, you know, just eatingseasonally.
And what do you recommend asfar as food for menopause?
(31:41):
Are there some certain foodsthat we can be focusing on when
we're going through thismenopause transition that are
more beneficial at this timethat you know to add in?
Speaker 2 (31:53):
I love this question.
I actually fell in love withChinese herbs, primarily because
so many of the herbs are spicesand foods and I'm such a foodie
and I was so deep into likenutritional healing at that
point and I was like, oh my God,this is cardamom and cinnamon
and you know, you know, um.
So I think really, when itcomes to menopause, we want to
(32:15):
look at those nourishing foods,so higher quality fats like ghee
, coconut oil, mct oil um, youwant to look at more.
So the kidneys correlate withlike black and blue foods.
So think black sesames,blackberries, even black chicken
if you can find them in aChinese store.
(32:37):
You know goji berriesphenomenal.
Throw that in everything,that's a phenomenal.
Again, tonic Chinese yams, whichis interesting because that's a
Chinese herb that we use formenopause and that's also
something that promotesprogesterone and has become a
big trend in terms of wildChinese yam cream.
(32:57):
We use that in our herbs, usethat in your diet.
You know rich, leafy greens,but again, mixing that with the
nourishing, cooling fats.
I'm trying to think of othergood tea stuff.
Mint is going to be nice andcooling If you want to add that
to the tea.
Rose petals organic or justorganic roses are great for
(33:20):
building the blood, nourishingthe blood, so doing those two
with goji berries and making anightly tea would be awesome.
But yeah, people can just lookup Chinese dietary therapy for
menopause.
But those are some of thestaples that I would definitely
be incorporating into day to daylife for sure.
(33:43):
Well, I think it's a good pointalso just in terms of you know,
the more we can check in withour bodies and see the symptoms
that our bodies are trying totell us, the more we can
intuitively look towards thesethings.
Like, if you're having hotflashes, start thinking about,
like, what are cooling foods?
You know, like it really iskind of that simple in a lot of
(34:03):
ways.
You know if you're, if you'rehaving difficulty sleeping,
what's going to help calm themind.
So it's, you know, reallystarting to check in with our
bodies instead of just trying topush through all the symptoms
that our bodies are telling us.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
Yeah, great point, yes, and to get right, have some
intuition about it, but also tomaybe do some research on it
too, yeah, which we candefinitely.
Hopefully, yeah, and hopefullyyou'll have it in your book,
your upcoming book.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
You'll talk about foods and everything, and oh,
yeah, yeah, no, it's more likeyou know, it's a bit of a manual
, so it's like an introductionof Chinese medicine, a little
bit about environmental toxins,how they're impacting our
hormones, because I'm kind of amaniac about all of that, it
terrifies me and then sort ofthe you know endometriosis
through the lens of Chinesemedicine, western medicine,
(34:56):
herbs, diet and then all of theother sort of hormonal based
disorders, if you will.
So I'm excited about it.
It's yeah, it's one of thosethings where I'm like why isn't
this out here?
Okay, I'll.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
I'll do it.
Yeah, you were meant to createit.
That's great, good Good for you.
Well, Chloe, how can people getin touch?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
with you and learn more about your herbs and your
formulations so they can go tonoxiherbscom.
So that's n-o-x-i herbscom.
We probably will be renamingthat soon because, as it turns
out, we probably will berenaming that soon because, as
it turns out, um, noxiesometimes gets auto corrected to
Nazi, so that was a funbusiness lesson for me, um, but
the site will redirect you oncewe do that.
(35:41):
But, um, so noxieherbscom, uh,and my podcast is radical remedy
and it is.
We're gearing up for seasonthree, which will hopefully be
coming out pretty soon.
So I love doing that, soanybody can reach out through
any of those websites.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Okay, great.
Well, I will put all thoselinks in the show notes so
people can reach out to you.
Thank you so much.
I've learned a lot today andI'm looking forward to learning
more on your website and andexperimenting with some herbs
Hell yeah Well, thank you somuch.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
It's an honor to be here.
I really appreciate theconversation, great Thanks.
Hello everybody and welcome back to the Real Food
Stories podcast.
I am your host, heather Carey.
Today's episode is a rich andeye-opening conversation that I
have been so excited to sharewith you.
I am joined by Chloe Weber, whois a doctor of Chinese medicine
.
She's an herbalist and apassionate advocate for
(00:24):
integrative, holistic healing.
If you're in midlife andnavigating the ups and downs of
perimenopause or postmenopause,especially if hormone therapy is
not an option for you, thisepisode is a must listen.
Chloe and I dive deep into theworld of traditional Chinese
(00:44):
medicine and how customizedherbal formulations can offer
powerful support throughmenopause.
We also talk about somethingreally important.
While hormone replacementtherapy can be incredibly
helpful for many women, it's nota magic bullet all of the time
it doesn't fix everything.
(01:04):
It can fix a lot of things, butit doesn't always fix
everything, and it doesn'talways agree with women as well,
or you might not be a candidatefor hormones.
So what I learned from Chloe isthat, whether you're taking HRT
or not, chinese herbs can, in aroundabout way, fill in the
(01:25):
gaps.
Think, better sleep, fewer hotflashes, more energy and just
overall support for your wholebody, not just your hormones.
It's a whole science and Icould actually have Chloe back
on again just to even talk morein depth about what Chinese
medicine is, but it's a lot toknow and that's why it's good to
(01:48):
have an expert like Chloe.
Now, chloe also introduces usto the five phases of Chinese
medicine, which is a frameworkthat helps us understand not
just our bodies, but also how wenourish ourselves through food.
Eating seasonally and inalignment with nature is one of
the core principles and,honestly, it's something we
(02:09):
could all benefit from embracingmore, because nourishing
yourself with the rhythms of theseasons is absolutely a must
right now.
So let's get into thisbeautiful grounding conversation
I had with Chloe and hope tosee you in the Recipe Club
conversation I had with Chloeand hope to see you in the
Recipe Club.
(02:33):
A doctor of Chinese medicine,chloe Weber is the founder of
Noxy Herbs, a groundbreakingherbal line designed to meet
women where they are in theirhormonal journey.
Noxy's modular system drawsfrom the deep wisdom of
traditional Chinese medicine tooffer personalized,
phase-specific formulas thatevolve with a woman's cycle, age
and needs, bringing ancientprecision to modern hormonal
chaos.
Chloe's mission is clear tocreate a proactive model of
(02:57):
medicine that empowers womenwith real solutions, not
prescriptions.
She is also the host of theRadical Remedy podcast, where
she educates and inspires a newwave of health-conscious women
ready to reclaim their bodiesand their power.
Hi, chloe, I am so happy tohave you on the show because we
are in what I think of as like amenopause revival right now,
(03:21):
and what I mean by that is thatmenopause and hormones are just
having a moment.
On social media with Oprah,everyone's talking about
menopause right now, and thereinlies, I think, so much
confusion.
We know that every woman onthis planet goes through
(03:42):
menopause and the menopausetransition, and we know that
most women experience a lot ofdisruption in their lives due to
menopause physically,emotionally and using hormones
as a solution has been socontroversial, in a way, for
years.
Right, and even though we knownow that hormones are safe for
(04:05):
most women, they're not alwaysthe perfect answer.
Nor do women want to go onhormones.
They want to try to dosomething more natural, and for
this reason, I'm really excitedto have you on and talk about
alternative ways to help withhormones and the whole menopause
transition.
So welcome to the show.
(04:26):
I'm so happy to have you here.
Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
It's an honor to be here and I, too, am thrilled
that Women's Health is finallyhaving a moment.
As I like to say, it isfantastic that we are finally
being acknowledged being, as wehave created every single person
on this planet, so it is abouttime that people actually take
our health seriously and Chineseherbs.
I've been really blown awaywith this conversation coming
(04:51):
out and how much information iscoming out and how much focus is
on women's health right now,particularly menopause, and it
shocks me that Chinese medicineis not at the forefront of this
conversation, because Chinesemedicine, particularly Chinese
herbal medicine, does such anincredible job at supporting
women's health and hormones, soI'm really excited to be here to
(05:11):
chat with you about it.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Great.
So jump in and tell me yourstory about how you got into
Chinese medicine, how youcreated your company and how
it's different, I think, thantypical supplements.
We see a lot of wackysupplements out on the internet,
you know, to trying to cater tomenopause symptoms and
(05:34):
menopause health, and so let'sjust jump in, just for the sake
of my audience, who might notknow a lot about traditional
Chinese medicine.
Give us a little background onthat know a lot about
traditional Chinese medicine.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Give us a little background on that.
Totally so.
When I was younger, I reallywanted to study public health
and look into the different waysthat we could support building
health in our society.
When I was 15, I had a raretropical disease called
cutaneous leishmaniasis.
I started learning about howwhat we were doing to our
environment was spreadingdisease and evolving disease
within our societies, and soit's something that I've always
(06:10):
been fascinated with.
I started down the Westernmedical route and then just saw
that a lot of it was justputting band-aids on top of
issues instead of actuallyaddressing the root causes of
disharmony, and so that'sprecisely what Chinese medicine
does.
So instead of just looking atthe symptoms that are presenting
let's say, menopause, so like,say, you're having hot flashes
(06:33):
or headaches or weight gaininstead of just looking at these
symptoms in isolation, we'relooking at the underlying
patterns of disharmony withinyour body.
So we're trying to reallyrestore the ecology of the body
so that your body is functioningbetter.
So Western medicine is reallyreactive medicine.
(06:55):
We're looking at these singularpathways.
So it's like, okay, we'remissing estrogen, great.
But that estrogen is important,but it also ties into the body
in many different ways.
So with Chinese medicine, whenwe're talking about menopause,
we're often talking about yinand yang.
So many people have heard ofyin and yang or yin and yang, so
(07:15):
that's not just like a cutelittle symbol in Chinese
medicine, that's a reallyfoundational aspect of our
medicine.
So yin is the nourishing fluidaspects of the body, whereas
yang is the fire active aspectsof the body.
So as we hit 35, our kidney,yin, which the kidneys are in
charge of our reproductivehealth and store our vital
(07:38):
energy that we're formed withour kidney yin starts to deplete
at 35.
This is where we start seeingthese perimenopausal symptoms
that yin again, the cooling,nourishing aspects of the body,
as that's depleting, we'reseeing signs of dryness, hot
flashes, increased anxiety,heart palpitations.
(07:59):
These things all come upbecause that yin starts to
decline.
So in Chinese medicine what wedo is we really nourish the
kidneys, nourish the yin, and wedo that through lifestyle
acupuncture and acupressure andeven just dietary therapy.
So it's a very different systemthan Western medicine and even
(08:20):
Western herbology, which Westernherbology typically will still
give you sort of like aone-to-one correlation, like
you're normally just taking oneherb.
In Chinese medicine we haveabout 400 different herbs that
we choose from and we createreally dynamic formulas to
address the symptoms and thoseroot causes.
Hopefully that was not tooconfusing and all over the place
.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, no, so it sounds like it's just a more
right taking just hormonereplacement therapy.
I mean estrogen affects a lotfrom like our head to toes right
, but the herbs in Chinesemedicine seem to focus on like a
more holistic Am I.
(09:08):
Am I correct in this?
Speaker 2 (09:10):
So it's a nourishing, but it's also supporting the
other aspects of the body.
So basically, we look at, so wetalk about the five elements a
lot in Chinese medicine.
So we've got wood, fire, earth,metal and water and each of
these elements corresponds withdifferent organ system,
corresponds with differentflavor, a different taste, a
different emotion, right.
(09:32):
And so the ones that are mostdeeply connected to hormone
health in Chinese medicine arethe liver, the kidneys, the
heart and the spleen.
So the spleen is in charge ofprocessing both foods and
emotions, right.
So we see the spleen out ofalignment.
We'll see loose stools,overthinking that monkey mind
(09:52):
before bed.
You might have food allergies,you might feel sort of fatigued
in your muscles, heavy, so thatwe see go out of alignment in
menopause often, right.
So we see women start carryingthat extra weight.
We call that dampness inChinese medicine.
So we want to make sure thatthe spleen is functioning.
But the spleen is on the sameaxis as the liver.
(10:14):
The liver is in charge of thefree flow of qi and blood
throughout the body and isdeeply connected to our cycle
and really impacted by stress.
So the liver, if you're havingPMS symptoms, you're having
irritability, frustration, youhave day of rage, as I lovingly
like to call it, that's theliver chi stagnation.
(10:35):
So Chinese medicine has honoredthe fact that digestion and
stress are on the same axis forthousands of years, and so these
two are always impacted On theflip side, and that's often sort
of younger years of hormonehealth.
When it comes to menopause, thekidneys, as I said, are like the
(10:56):
house of our reproduction andour original chi and that sort
of declines as we age, our jing,as we call it, and then the
heart is really where we storeour spirit, and so that axis is
really important when it comesto menopause, because what
happens is we've had all of thisenergy in our kidneys in terms
(11:17):
of creating new life, in termsof sustaining that life that
we've created, taking care ofeverybody else, and as we go
through menopause, that energyflips to our heart, and so at
that point we're able to reallytruly express ourselves.
I think there's a trend onTikTok, the we Do Not Care Club
for women in menopause andperimenopause, and that is what
(11:39):
is happening we do not carebecause now, finally, instead of
taking care of everybody else'sneeds and catering to everyone
else in our communities, in ourlives, in our homes, we are
finally honoring our true selvesand saying we're tired, we're
fed up and I'm going to takecare of myself for the first
time I'm at life.
So in Chinese medicine, it'sjust a completely different way
(12:03):
of looking at it.
So, yes, we want to support theestrogen and make sure that we
are getting that nourishmentthat we need for our mind and
our body, but it's just such adifferent system and different
way of looking at the body andhonoring you know these dynamic
forces within our body and howthey're interacting with each
other.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Okay, yeah, so it sounds like I mean it's so much.
I mean it sounds like you can'tdo this on your own right.
I mean we would need you to.
Maybe is it very individual howyou prescribe herbs and
different herbs and everything,because I know that you've got
(12:46):
some formulas.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah.
So the gold standard in Chinesemedicine is always going to be
getting a customizable formulafrom a practitioner.
And if you have the means to goand get an acupuncturist, I
highly recommend it.
Acupuncture is amazing forhormone regulation and just
overall support and wellbeing.
Um, so you can look up somebodyin your area, search around.
(13:12):
Not all doctors are the rightfit for you, but search and find
the right one for you.
If you have that ability,highly recommend it.
Cannot recommend it more If youcan't.
You know my goal is reallytrying to use Chinese herbs for
public health intervention.
In China, chinese herbs are thebackbone of the medicine and in
(13:32):
the US we're not really usingthese herbs very much or not to
their full efficacy.
So, as a practitioner, when I'mworking with women, what I
normally do is I'll changeformulas at least once
throughout the course of themonth.
So after you're done bleeding,you're largely depleted.
You've just bled for three toseven days, so you're run down.
(13:54):
So we need to nourish thekidneys, nourish the blood and
build qi back up.
So qi is your energy.
So I have a formula for thatcalled nourish, and then after
that, for most women, what youwant to do is you want to move
the qi and blood.
So in preparation for yourcycle, you want to make sure
(14:18):
that that qi and blood is movingsmoothly.
That'll alleviate those PMSsymptoms.
Help with the irritability andfrustration.
Make sure that you're nothaving cramps.
Help with the irritability andfrustration.
Make sure that you're nothaving cramps as you evolve and
as you start going throughmenopause and perimenopause.
You may want to start focusingmore on the nourish, so
nourishing the kidneys, but youmight want to change from that
(14:40):
liver cheese, stagnation, theregulate, over to our heart
formula, calm.
So Calm is really nourishingthe heart we also have.
So basically, what I createdwas a system where it's largely
a spleen formula, so a digestionformula that I often recommend
for women going throughperimenopause, who are gaining
(15:00):
more weight, and also for womenwho are going through hormonal,
metabolically based hormonaldisorders like PCOS, um.
So that's resolved.
Then we've got regulate, whichis a liver chi formula which is
often used for irritability,frustration, pms symptoms.
But you're also getting thosePMS symptoms and perimenopause,
(15:22):
um, and sometimes significantlymore intensely, um.
And then we've got calm, whichis a heart tonic, which is
really I like to think of it aslike a big hug through the heart
.
It's just really helping calmyour spirit.
It's great for sleep, insomnia,night sweats and then nourishes
the kidney formula.
That's really deeply tonifyingyour body.
(15:42):
So we have a quiz on thewebsite that women can take and
it'll tell you which formulas werecommend and for which times
of the cycle.
If you're in menopause uh,clinically like if you're
already like at that phase ofgoing through menopause I
normally recommend that you'rejust taking nourish during the
day and then calm at night andthat's just a really deeply
(16:05):
tonifying uh care to help yousleep well, to help nourish your
kidneys, help nourish theestrogen and it is going to
support I know you guys beforeit.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
It is going to support with that hrt if you are
taking hrt as well okay, yeah,because I was going to ask you
that is, is this something thatyou can do in conjunction?
Because it sounds, I mean, I'mon hormones, on hormones so, and
I know it like it helps to likesome specific things, but I but
I am the first person to saylike it is no magic bullet it
has helped me in a lot of ways.
(16:37):
I mean, I'm not going off of itany anytime soon if I don't
have to, but it sounds like theherbs sort of fill in like these
gaps, like it.
It like rounds out healing, youknow, or or you know, just the.
Is that correct to say that?
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, well, what I?
I mean what the researchindicates and what I've found
clinically, is that the herbsreally potentiate the actions of
the estrogen and helps youbalance your body in a different
way.
So it's like you know, theestrogen is sort of one size
(17:17):
fits all and does so manydynamic things within the body
and brain, as you mentioned,really impacts every aspect of
it.
But we still have theseunderlying patterns of
disharmony from a lifetime ofovergiving, of, you know, not
taking care of ourselves in theway that we need to, of just
(17:39):
getting older.
I mean, like you know,everybody has some level of
imbalance within their body.
You know, I'm a doctor ofChinese medicine.
I live this medicine, I eatfairly immaculately and take
very good care of myself, andyet I still have spleen qi
deficiency.
I still get liver qi stagnation.
(17:59):
I'm still going to getfrustrated.
You know, these imbalances justhappen because we live in this
world which is innatelyincredibly stressful and
challenging, and not to mention,we are also bombarded with
environmental toxins everywhereas well as emotional toxins
everywhere.
So it's helping restore balanceto those underlying patterns so
(18:23):
that the estrogen can also bemore effective in what it's
doing as well, can also be moreeffective in what it's doing as
well.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Is there science behind these herbs and these
formulations?
Because I just always likescience.
I mean, it all sounds great andI'm going to, I want to
experiment with all your herbs.
I'm just curious like is theresome, like you know?
Are there studies behind usingherbs?
Oh, yes, well.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
I think that's why I ended up gravitating to Chinese
herbs instead of being morefocused on acupuncture.
So most people, when yougraduate from a, you know I got
a master's in Chinese medicine,which, I always like to point
out, is, of course, equivalentof two and a half law degrees,
or four and a half master'sdegrees in three years.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
I then went on and got my doctorate.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But so I, you know most people focus on acupuncture
because that's something thatyou know, it's really tangible,
you feel the difference and it'sjust like more known and
understood in the West.
For me, I always gravitated toChinese herbs and I think that
that was because I couldunderstand the Eastern
(19:28):
energetics through the lens ofChinese medicine.
But I could also look at allthe Western pharmacological
actions of these herbs.
So there's so much research onthese herbs, it's pretty
incredible.
So again, I tend to have, Iwant to say, about 12 to 15
herbs in my formulas in each ofthem.
(19:49):
So most of my formulas arecompletely customized and
created by me.
My formula regulate is sort ofan off spin of a classical
Chinese herbal formula calledShaoyao Song, which has been
used for hundreds of years toregulate women's cycles, and
there's a ton of research onthat base formula that we use
(20:09):
for that.
So I was sort of debatingwhether to use classical
formulas because of the researchon the full formula or whether
to modify.
And in the end I wanted tomodify in order to honor sort of
the evolution of where we arein society and how our bodies
are changing, like I feel likeour digestion is not as
(20:29):
effective as it might have beenback in the day when we weren't
eating, you know, glyphosate andall of these various different
toxins daily, no matter howclean we are.
So you know I put in a littlebit more digestive support herbs
in there.
But there's a lot of researchon all of the single herbs, you
(20:52):
know.
Ginseng hushawu reishi, youknow use a lot of medicinal
mushrooms in Chinese medicine.
So it's really fun going downthat rabbit hole.
I highly recommend anybody nerdout on it, and I'll be coming
out with a book on women'shealth and Chinese medicine
Chinese herbs in fall.
I'm just finishing it up, butit has a bunch of research on
(21:15):
specific herbs and how you canstart integrating them into your
diet and into teas that you canmake at home for yourself as
well.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Oh, that's great.
That sounds like it's veryneeded.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Yeah, I'm just like why isn't this out there?
Like I feel, like most of theprojects I work on, like my
first business was well, mysecond business was Radical
Roots, which is CBD and Chineseherbs, and I wanted to make that
to stop.
My son, Remy, has a geneticdisorder because he has seizures
, and I just kept seeing theseone size fits all CBD products
(21:48):
on the market and I was likethis is great, but like if we
use different herbs together topotentiate the actions, it's
going to be so much moreeffective.
And I tried to like pitch theidea to different CBD companies.
I was like I'm a single mom ofa kiddo with special needs.
I don't want to be startinganother business right now.
I know how that goes.
Um, and nobody was interested.
(22:09):
And it was one of those thingswhere you sort of stomp your
feet long enough.
Then you're like damn it, I'lldo it.
And I feel that way withwomen's health Also.
I'm like there arepractitioners out there who have
, you know, been sorevolutionary in Chinese
medicine and women's health.
I don't know why they're notputting this information out on
a bigger scale.
And so finally I was like, okay, well, if they're not going to
(22:33):
do it, then I'm going to do mydamnedest to get this out to as
many women as possible, BecauseI've watched how incredibly safe
and effective it is over mylast 15 years of clinical
practice and I know it changeslives powerfully.
Yeah, that's so interesting.
I mean, I'm so glad that you'redoing it and I know it changes
lives powerfully.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Yeah, that's so interesting.
I mean, I'm so glad that you'redoing it and I'm just wondering
why.
I mean with like, I mean justyour example of the CBD that I
mean CBD I don't know had itsmoment a couple of years ago.
It seemed like it was.
There's pop-up shops in thetown I live in.
There's, I mean, everyone wastaking CBD, and now it just
(23:10):
seems like nobody's taking, ormaybe they are, I don't know.
You just don't see it like that, you know.
And so when you have a veryspecific formula and I wonder
why, like you know, or in theChinese herbs too, that it's not
more effective, top of mind.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I mean I think there is a lot.
There has been traditionally alot of propaganda against China
in our country.
You know, realistically, likeanytime I go off you know not
every time, but most of the timeif I go on social media, I'll
get some level of people tellingme that I killed rhinos, that
(23:49):
you know like, that it's ladenwith pesticides and whatnot you
know like, which can be aconcern.
Every single herb that we getis tested for heavy metals,
pesticides and potency.
So I'm very psychotic aboutthat.
We manufacture it all in theStates, here in Colorado,
through a crazy alchemical,spagyric extraction.
(24:09):
You know like I'm a propermaniac when it comes to the
quality of our products, butthere is a lot of stigma against
things coming from China.
And then also, you know, Ithink a lot of people really
have bought into the belief thatthe Western medical system is
the most effective medicalsystem that there is.
(24:31):
Personally, I believe theresearch which states that
Western medicine is the thirdleading cause of death in our
country and that's properlyprescribed Western medicine.
So to me, I would much preferthat people try and do natural
medicine and traditionalmedicines before you go to
(24:52):
Western medicine.
That's not to say that Westernmedicine doesn't have a place.
I absolutely admire it.
I love the research I nerd outon all of it.
I think it has its place, butto me it's like, okay, what can
we do with lifestyle, you know,are you actually sleeping well?
Are you actually moving everyday?
Are you eating real foods?
Are you taking care of yourselfin these basic ways that we
(25:13):
really, truly need to in orderto build foundational health?
That is number one, and I cantell you that, like 95% of
people out there are not doingthat, you know.
Then it's like okay, so let's,let's look at tweaking your diet
, then maybe herbs oracupuncture, and then for some
instances then you need theWestern, you know,
pharmacological interventions.
(25:35):
But often, if you're on herbsand you're doing the other
things and you need less of theWestern medicines, which do tend
to come with significant sideeffects, which what I see
clinically again is sort ofthose side effects compound, and
then you're on more and morepharmaceuticals, which creates a
snowball effect.
So it's not that I don't likeWestern meds, it's more just
(25:57):
like let's go through the properorder to see if they're
necessary.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Yeah, I think that's such a good point.
We, you know these Chineseherbs sound so good, but we here
in the United States live aWestern lifestyle of like, high
stress, on the move, eating junk, you know, like we're just like
and give it, give us something,give me a quick fix, give me a
pill, give me.
And so I imagine that theseherbs have to be used in
(26:28):
conjunction with improving otherareas of your lifestyle, right,
and?
And that they take.
It's not like a, an immediatehit, right, it's like a.
You probably take them for awhile and it and it right.
Is that, is that correct, or isthat am I?
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Yeah, no, I mean certain things.
You know, like you can takecalm and you'll probably sleep
better.
You know, like that.
You know you can definitely getan immediate bang, got a cold
or flu.
We can knock that out realquick.
You know, like, um, so itdepends on what you're working
with.
You know, when it comes tohormones, hormones, um,
(27:07):
sometimes it takes a couple ofmonths.
You know a lot of women thatI've seen are coming to me with
endometriosis that they've hadfor 10 years, that they've been
to 20 different doctors and it'slike, yeah, this isn't going to
be fixed with two acupuncturetreatments and a month's worth
of herbs that you're taking half, you know, every other day, you
know.
So it's like you do need to beconsistent.
(27:27):
You do need to take some of thelifestyle recommendations.
Need to be consistent.
You do need to take some of thelifestyle recommendations.
You know if you are surroundingyourself with environmental
toxins and emotional toxins andjust thinking that, you know a
Western pill or an herbalmedicine is going to just solve
that, you know it's unfortunate,but it's not.
And it's really important thatwe, especially as women, start
(27:48):
taking proactive care ofourselves mind, body and soul.
And I also get very concernedabout this because I think that
we also have to consider whatare we showing our daughters and
our children when we aresacrificing our health for them?
and for everybody else, and Iknow it's a backwards way to
(28:10):
manipulate women into takingcare of themselves.
But it is how I had to getmyself to take better care of
myself is having, you know,being a single mom, child with
special needs.
I burned myself out so hardthose first couple of years and
then I really had to take a stepback and say what good is it
for him, you know, to get thatnext inch stone of development
(28:32):
if his mom is sick and depressedand exhausted all the time
because she's just pushing sohard, you know?
And I really had to put him inthe forefront in order to get
myself to actually do that.
So, you know, I just think it'sreally important, you know, I
think women are justastoundingly strong and powerful
(28:53):
and inspirational.
I'm so blown away.
It's so much fun stepping intothe space of women's health.
I like bow down to all of thewomen and moms out there.
Like, truly, it's such ahumbling space to hear the
stories of how much women havegone through, to hear the
(29:13):
stories of how much women havegone through and, like I, just I
so believe that if we actuallyreally start taking care of
ourselves, we, we might be ableto be the change we are hoping
and desperately needing in thissociety.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Yeah, taking care of ourselves is something that's
really foreign to so many women,especially moms, who are just
used to outputting right andburning themselves out, and I
think that's such a good pointthat we need to take care of
ourselves first and be in ourbest health before we can take
care of other people and ourchildren and right we and and to
(29:45):
be a good role model.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
Such a good point well and it's, it's a lot more
fun, you know, like I mean, Ithink I think we lose ourselves
in the caretaking of others andit's, like you know, starting to
reclaim those bits of joy andthose bits of our independence,
those bits of excitement, youespecially as a mom, is a
(30:09):
radical act.
And and that radical act likebrings more joy to us, which,
like really shifts the energy inour homes right, and like
really shifts how we're engagingwith the world and each other.
And, like you know, our societyis not set up to support us the
way that it needs to be.
(30:30):
So it's important for us tofind the ways, even the small,
teeny, tiny ways.
I always say something's betterthan nothing.
I don't care what it is,whether it's just taking your
herbs and going outside andbreathing with a cup of coffee
for a minute, I don't care, lockyour kids out, do whatever you
got to do.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
But, like every little step in the direction of
health is an incrediblyimportant one, and it really
does not matter how small.
So when I went to cookingschool many moons ago, my
(31:11):
cooking school was very healthsupportive and we were following
.
We followed very closely thesefive phases to do meal planning
and about, you know, just eatingseasonally.
And what do you recommend asfar as food for menopause?
(31:41):
Are there some certain foodsthat we can be focusing on when
we're going through thismenopause transition that are
more beneficial at this timethat you know to add in?
Speaker 2 (31:53):
I love this question.
I actually fell in love withChinese herbs, primarily because
so many of the herbs are spicesand foods and I'm such a foodie
and I was so deep into likenutritional healing at that
point and I was like, oh my God,this is cardamom and cinnamon
and you know, you know, um.
So I think really, when itcomes to menopause, we want to
(32:15):
look at those nourishing foods,so higher quality fats like ghee
, coconut oil, mct oil um, youwant to look at more.
So the kidneys correlate withlike black and blue foods.
So think black sesames,blackberries, even black chicken
if you can find them in aChinese store.
(32:37):
You know goji berriesphenomenal.
Throw that in everything,that's a phenomenal.
Again, tonic Chinese yams, whichis interesting because that's a
Chinese herb that we use formenopause and that's also
something that promotesprogesterone and has become a
big trend in terms of wildChinese yam cream.
(32:57):
We use that in our herbs, usethat in your diet.
You know rich, leafy greens,but again, mixing that with the
nourishing, cooling fats.
I'm trying to think of othergood tea stuff.
Mint is going to be nice andcooling If you want to add that
to the tea.
Rose petals organic or justorganic roses are great for
(33:20):
building the blood, nourishingthe blood, so doing those two
with goji berries and making anightly tea would be awesome.
But yeah, people can just lookup Chinese dietary therapy for
menopause.
But those are some of thestaples that I would definitely
be incorporating into day to daylife for sure.
(33:43):
Well, I think it's a good pointalso just in terms of you know,
the more we can check in withour bodies and see the symptoms
that our bodies are trying totell us, the more we can
intuitively look towards thesethings.
Like, if you're having hotflashes, start thinking about,
like, what are cooling foods?
You know, like it really iskind of that simple in a lot of
(34:03):
ways.
You know if you're, if you'rehaving difficulty sleeping,
what's going to help calm themind.
So it's, you know, reallystarting to check in with our
bodies instead of just trying topush through all the symptoms
that our bodies are telling us.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
Yeah, great point, yes, and to get right, have some
intuition about it, but also tomaybe do some research on it
too, yeah, which we candefinitely.
Hopefully, yeah, and hopefullyyou'll have it in your book,
your upcoming book.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
You'll talk about foods and everything, and oh,
yeah, yeah, no, it's more likeyou know, it's a bit of a manual
, so it's like an introductionof Chinese medicine, a little
bit about environmental toxins,how they're impacting our
hormones, because I'm kind of amaniac about all of that, it
terrifies me and then sort ofthe you know endometriosis
through the lens of Chinesemedicine, western medicine,
(34:56):
herbs, diet and then all of theother sort of hormonal based
disorders, if you will.
So I'm excited about it.
It's yeah, it's one of thosethings where I'm like why isn't
this out here?
Okay, I'll.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
I'll do it.
Yeah, you were meant to createit.
That's great, good Good for you.
Well, Chloe, how can people getin touch?
Speaker 2 (35:20):
with you and learn more about your herbs and your
formulations so they can go tonoxiherbscom.
So that's n-o-x-i herbscom.
We probably will be renamingthat soon because, as it turns
out, we probably will berenaming that soon because, as
it turns out, um, noxiesometimes gets auto corrected to
Nazi, so that was a funbusiness lesson for me, um, but
the site will redirect you oncewe do that.
(35:41):
But, um, so noxieherbscom, uh,and my podcast is radical remedy
and it is.
We're gearing up for seasonthree, which will hopefully be
coming out pretty soon.
So I love doing that, soanybody can reach out through
any of those websites.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Okay, great.
Well, I will put all thoselinks in the show notes so
people can reach out to you.
Thank you so much.
I've learned a lot today andI'm looking forward to learning
more on your website and andexperimenting with some herbs
Hell yeah Well, thank you somuch.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
It's an honor to be here.
I really appreciate theconversation, great Thanks.
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