July 3, 2025 • 45 mins
In today’s episode, I’m joined by the incredible Holly Bertone — a former FBI Chief of Staff turned certified holistic health coach — who now helps midlife women break free from emotional eating and step into their power.
Holly shares her deeply personal journey, from leading high-stakes intelligence operations to uncovering the root causes of her own struggles with food. With a unique blend of counterintelligence tactics and brain science, she teaches how to identify emotional triggers, interrupt destructive patterns, and rewire your brain for long-term freedom — all without relying on willpower or restrictive diets.
Together, we dive into the lies we’ve been told by the diet industry, why food feels so emotionally loaded (hello, childhood conditioning and clean plate club!), and how to create lasting change through awareness, forgiveness, and self-compassion.
Holly also walks us through her signature 3-step process — See It, Stop It, Shift It — and shares a powerful tool to help you reclaim your relationship with food.
Whether emotional eating has been a quiet companion or a daily struggle, this episode will help you feel seen, understood, and empowered with tools that truly work.
🎁 PLUS: Don’t miss Holly’s free Emotional Eating Tactical Blueprint — available exclusively to our listeners!
00:13 – Meet Holly: From FBI to holistic health coach
02:00 – Her personal journey and struggles with food
12:57 – Exposing the lies of the diet industry
18:48 – Why we turn to food for comfort
23:56 – Food, emotions, and celebrations
26:18 – The Clean Plate Club and early conditioning
27:08 – Holly’s 3-step process: See It, Stop It, Shift It
36:48 – The power of rewriting your food story
42:23 – How to get Holly’s Emotional Eating Blueprint
Ready to feel more in control and at peace with food? Let’s crack the code together.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
If you've ever struggled withemotional eating or figuring out
why you just can't crack thecode, why you keep going back to
those same old eating patternsthat you don't really want to
do.
Today's episode is for you.
I am talking to Holly Bertone,who is a former FBI chief of
staff for counterintelligenceturned certified holistic health
(00:21):
coach.
After spending 20 years in highstakes government roles where
she managed major operations andnavigated intense pressure,
Holly understands.
What it's like to battle yourown food monsters and deal with
emotional eating.
And she realized that crackingthe code on her emotional eating
was the same thing as trackingspies, identifying the pattern,
(00:45):
and then neutralizing thethreat.
And so now she takes all of herknowledge and experience in
that.
World of FBI counterintelligenceand applies it to eating and
helping high achieving midlife.
Women break free from emotionaleating, rebel against diet
culture, and prioritize theirhealth.
(01:06):
Without relying on restrictivediets or willpower through her
science-backed approach.
She's been featured on majorplatforms and top podcasts,
including this one, and I'm soexcited to introduce you to
Holly today.
You are gonna gain so much fromthis conversation, so let's jump
in.
Angie (01:47):
All right, everyone, welcome to the show today.
I am so excited to have HollyBertone on the show.
What's up, Holly?
How are you?
Hey Angie.
Thanks so much for having me onthe show, and I'm so excited to
be here.
I am super excited for ourconversation today.
Holly has a very unique storyand I'm gonna let her tell it to
you.
So Holly, tell us who you areand
Holly (02:06):
who do you help.
Yeah, absolutely.
So I'm Holly Bertone and I helpwomen in midlife break free from
emotional eating so that theycan achieve a healthy and
sustainable weight without thecount, counting the calories and
without the crazy diets.
I.
That
Angie (02:20):
sounds perfect.
Let's talk more about that.
So emotional eating is one ofthese topics that I think people
know about but don't reallyunderstand.
So I'm excited to dig into thata little bit further with you.
But I know you have a veryinteresting story of like how
you got to this place.
So can you give us a littlebackground of like how, why are
you a health coach now?
(02:40):
What did you do before this?
Holly (02:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
And before I get into my story,I really just wanna say, Angie,
how much I love your podcast.
Aw, thanks.
'cause I, so I used to be acompetitive triathlete, so my
running was a means to an end.
I didn't run because I loved it.
I run, I ran because.
Of, I wanted to do another raceand same with field hockey.
(03:03):
So it's been 15 years and I amjust now getting back into
running after a long hiatus.
Now I would sprint,'causesprint's, obviously.
So good for your metabolichealth.
Yeah, but I just didn't run.
I was like, I can walk.
I don't need to run.
I am getting back into runningand I love this resource and I
love how it's just, it's fornormal women.
I feel like I fit in.
(03:24):
Like I, I know there's a lot of,resources out there, and I just
feel as just a normal midlifewoman who's getting back into
running, who's getting ready torun her first 5K in.
15 years, like this is such avaluable resource.
So I just wanted to say thankyou for having this resource for
everyone and to all of yourlisteners because of that,
(03:46):
because of this resource,because of how excited I am to
be on this show and.
for the resource that Angie hasfor all of you, I would love for
you to give her a five storerating and review, because that
is gonna help this podcast reachso many more people.
It would mean a lot to me as aguest, and I left a rating and
review this morning, and I justreally want your listeners to,
(04:06):
to be able to do that too.
Angie (04:07):
thank you for that plug.
That was wonderful then, andcompletely unexpected.
So I'm, I love to hear,'causesome of the guests that come on
don't always, aren't regularlisteners to the podcast and so
to know that you listen and havegained value from it means the
world to me.
'cause that's the whole goal ofwhy I do this.
Yeah,
Holly (04:25):
so anyway, so let me jump in.
you talked about first from theperspective of emotional eating
and what is it, and, and someonelistening, they may have said to
yourself at one point, like, howis it that I could be smart and
successful and high achievingand, healthy, like I'm a runner
and, being that woman in midlifewho does it all because of the
(04:45):
things like the habits and thediscipline.
But those same strategies don'twork when it comes to either
losing weight Or having these,just this constant
uncontrollable food noise.
And it ends up becoming theseobsessive cravings and just the
snacking that's mindless.
Like you start and you just losetrack of time.
(05:06):
You don't even know that you'vefinished.
and the reason that I'm doingthis is because I'm a recovered
emotional eater of over 40years.
I, I was an emotional eater whenI was 150 pounds.
When I was overweight.
I was an emotional eater at 110pounds when I was a competitive
triathlete.
And I literally would eat myemotions on a daily basis.
(05:27):
And my goal is to really justbreak that stigma.
I.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah.
Holly (05:31):
That it doesn't matter your weight, it doesn't matter
how quote unquote healthy youare.
if that, that, that food noise,if it's there, let's have this
conversation.
let's, this is, I think wheremenopause was 10 or 15 years
ago, is having this conversationaround emotional eating.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah.
Holly (05:46):
and I'll give you a perfect example of this.
so I used to work at the FBI andwhen I was there, I would dump a
family sized bag of m and ms.
On the desk and, protein ofcourse.
'cause we gotta get our proteinin, the peanut m and ms for the
protein peanut m ms, the peanutm and ms for the protein.
And so I would speed eat the mand ms with my left hand and I
(06:07):
would crank out the PowerPointdeck with my right hand.
So I am literally working asfast as I can and eating as fast
as I can.
But then fast forward, and thisis really where things came to a
head.
I had already resigned.
I resigned from the FBI in 2017or so.
And I had already become ahealth coach, and every Thursday
I would start obsessing aboutFriday afternoon because as a
(06:30):
health coach, I was disciplinedall week long, ate super
healthy, and then I would treatmyself on the weekend.
someone listening may havethink, maybe thinking oh yeah,
I've been, pulled in a millionDrexels with the career and
family and comfort food is justthat one place where it's quiet.
I'm gonna reward myself for ahard day at work, or I'm gonna
reward myself for going on along run.
my reward, so I'm a Pennsylvaniagirl and my reward was salted
(06:55):
caramel ice cream.
I just, I love the sweet, saltycombination.
What I told myself on Thursdayor on Friday, I was like, I'm
gonna divide it into thirds.
So I would have a third of thepint on Friday, a third on
Saturday, a third on Sunday.
In my head, that's how it wentdown, because we're told
everything in moderation.
I would put my spoon in thecontainer.
This happened every singleweekend.
(07:17):
You think I know better.
So I put my spoon in thecontainer and savor the first
bite, savor the second bite, thewhole mindful eating thing.
And then.
The container.
So that was every Friday.
And then what I would do onSaturday is I would get another
pint, eat the other pint.
I get another pint on Sundayeat.
(07:37):
So it was a pint on Friday, pinton Saturday, pint on Sunday.
Every weekend it was the samething.
And then I go back to eatinghealthy on Monday, but there was
this one Sunday and I'mfinishing that third pint of ice
cream that thir three pints ofone weekend.
And, my spoon is in that groovetrying to get that last little
bit of ice cream and chocolate.
(08:12):
So this Sunday my spoon was at.
The bottom of the container andit was in that groove in the
bottom of the container tryingto get that last little bit of
ice cream and chocolate out.
And I'm staring at the bottom ofanother pint of ice cream on
another sundae.
And I was like, Holly Bartone,what are you?
(08:33):
Doing, like, why can't you justeat like a normal person?
Why do you have to inhale theentire thing?
And I don't even remember eatingit.
I just inhaled it and I'm like,I was literally scraping the
bottom because I just wantedmore.
And I felt this shame that wasjust suffocating because I a
health coach and I should knowbetter.
(08:55):
I didn't wanna face that truthbecause I kept justifying it.
I'm a healthy weight.
I worked all hard all week.
I, I was super disciplined withhow I ate and, you might have
thinking like, I don't know,maybe there's been a time in
your life where you're justputting on these appearances.
You've got it all together onthe outside, but behind closed
doors, like I was this hotnessexpress and I didn't want anyone
(09:19):
to find out.
I didn't want anyone to know mysecret.
Angie, I went upstairs, I wentto my walk-in closet and I just
did a 360 and I looked at all myclothes.
I love my clothes, and I waslike, I'm not wearing most of
them, because they were just alittle bit too small.
Not to the point where I neededto get a different size, but
(09:41):
they were just tight anduncomfortable.
Yeah.
And I was remembering back towhat it was like when I was 40
pounds overweight.
When I hated how I looked, andeven back to when I was going
through breast cancer andautoimmune disease and how much
those diseases, like what damagethey did to my body.
And I vowed that I am not gonnago back to that place again.
(10:03):
That this food has way too muchcontrol over me.
And I made a decision thatsomething needs to change.
And it was difficult to.
Have that conversation withmyself to say, okay, it doesn't
matter that I'm a healthy weightor how much I weigh, like I am
(10:25):
struggling with emotionaleating.
And I realize like when that,when you have that emotional
eating, like that food noise isalways gonna win.
And I realize it wasn't just methat there's so many women in
midlife.
Who are battling the same andthey're, they've got these,
demanding jobs and careers andthen this lifestyle and all of
the stress, and then they'rereaching for the food and then
(10:47):
they've got this shame andthat's when I just, I put the
FBI pat back on and I was like,I am going to investigate this.
And I uncovered what the weightloss industry doesn't want us to
know.
And because they want us tothink that it's all about the
calories and the cardio and theweight and the food.
It's actually about addressingthose root cause triggers, those
(11:07):
automatic eating patterns,because that is what's driving
our behavior.
That's what's driving theeverything.
these patterns controleverything.
So in order for things tochange, we actually need to
rewire those patterns to work inour favor.
And when I realized that, that'swhen everything changed, not
just for me, but for the womenwho I coach.
(11:28):
And I think it's important too,to say that.
I have the pieces of paper onthe wall that say I'm certified
to coach, but the way that Icoach, the way that I, you know,
share and sharing today with youand your audience, everything
was built from those foodmonsters that I overcame
personally.
(11:49):
Combined with my skills in FBIcounterintelligence the
analyzing the patterns andcountering the threats, and then
combining that with the brainscience of neuroplasticity, and
that's when we strike gold.
Angie (12:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
And I couldn't agree more witheverything that you just talked
about.
I know that I also have gonethrough my own eating journey,
of, I wouldn't ever say that Ihad an eating disorder, but I
definitely have had disorderedeating patterns in the past.
And I think that a lot of us inhealth and fitness, whether
(12:24):
you're a coach or not, if youare a woman that is concerned
about your health.
A lot of women have disorderedeating and don't even realize it
because the messages out thereare so mixed.
We are constantly.
Confused because that is whatthe diet industry wants, right?
They want us to be confused.
(12:46):
They want us to think we justhaven't found the solution yet,
or we just haven't found theright diet yet, or, all these
lies that we are fed.
And I would love to go into alittle bit more.
Of that, of, you said that youreally uncovered a lot of these
lies.
What are some of the most commonlies that you think that we are
(13:06):
encountered with on a dailybasis
Holly (13:08):
as women?
Oh my goodness.
Yeah, that is such a greatquestion.
And when you're talking aboutthe diet industry, I'd love to
throw out a few facts and thenI'll get into the lies.
Is that, The diet industry inthe United States alone is
somewhere between 70 and$90billion a year.
Angie (13:23):
That's with a B?
Holly (13:24):
With a B.
Billion.
Billion.
Yeah.
And I actually, I've seen otherstatistics that one's a little
bit conservative, believe it ornot.
Exactly.
It's a little bit low, and twothirds of women age 40 to 60 are
clinically overweight.
Diets have a 92% failure rate,This is an industry that wants
us to fail.
Yeah.
(13:45):
So the question is, why do theywant us to fail?
What are these, you talk aboutthe lies, like what are the lies
that are, that we're fed andthen what are the 8% doing
differently That, that aregetting them to succeed.
And I like to think of, I liketo think of, how we
traditionally view diets.
As the check the self-checkoutline at the grocery store.
(14:08):
Because you wanna get in andout.
You want that quick fix andthat's what we've been fed.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Yeah.
Holly (14:13):
And you've got one line in the regular.
the regular checkout that'sopen, there's five or six people
you know, and you're going inand you're like scan.
And then the next thing is likeunexpected item in bagging area.
you got the little light goingand you know you're looking for
the lady and a team member is onhis way.
A team member.
Yeah, exactly.
And then she goes to the personbeside you and you're like, wait
a second, my light was flashingfirst.
(14:36):
And then what makes it worse isthat I don't, and I don't know
if you've ever done this before.
Maybe it's just me, maybe I'mjust a little competitive.
But, you know how when you're inline and then you've got the
people in the regular checkoutline and you like eyeing them
up, say, okay, who is parallelto me?
And you're like, I'm gonna beatthem out the store, right?
Yeah.
This is okay.
and then the next thing youknow, like that person is.
(14:58):
Leaving the store and you'restill there, bagging your
groceries.
You're like, oh, this, that isexactly what diet industry is
doing to us.
Okay.
it's causing us to look at thisfrom a quick fix to be
competitive with everyone else,and then just feel like, oh,
what did I do wrong?
Yeah.
it's our fault, or somethinglike that.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Yeah.
Holly (15:17):
but the three, three of really the lies that we are
told, and I'm gonna lump all ofthem into one.
Okay.
Is the everything a moderation.
The mindful eating or intuitiveeating, and then the willpower.
I just need willpower and Iwanna caveat it before everyone
(15:37):
comes at me, which, whatever.
I wanna caveat,
Angie (15:40):
I'm like, you're like, I've, I'm in the, I've been in
the FBII can take it.
Come on, let's go.
Bring it on.
Holly (15:46):
Yeah.
let's tango.
Yeah.
So I will say they do work.
Okay.
And I actually.
Incorporate them.
Okay.
Personally, but think about itfrom this perspective.
If you struggle with emotionaleating Have any of these ever
worked in the past?
And the answer is probably no.
(16:09):
And that's what I want us toreally think about and get past
is, okay, these work on theother side.
They're not going to work if youare struggling with that food
noise.
and I can explain why.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yeah.
Holly (16:24):
So we think of willpower.
That's the biggest one, becausewe think, oh, I just need to be
strong.
And it's mind over matter.
And I like to say willpower isthe equivalent of a SWAT team
being armed with a cabbage patchkid.
it's co like you've got thisforce and then it's completely
useless.
Angie (16:40):
Okay.
Holly (16:41):
So research is at MIT.
They actually, found that whenthose cravings hit, your brain
has already made a decision inless than half of a second that
you are going to eat the food.
Okay?
So this decision is made in ourbrain in less than half of a
second.
Now we're gonna introducedopamine.
(17:03):
You think?
Dopamine, you think, okay,that's the reward chemical.
I'm around a baby or a puppy andyay, I feel happy.
That's dopamine.
Okay?
Yeah.
Dopamine is actually theanticipation chemical because
it's released in anticipation ofeating the food.
And that's why these cravingsare so automatic and obsessive.
(17:23):
Because your brain has alreadystarted this reward process.
So you've got ha less than halfof a second, and then the
dopamine is kicked in rightbefore the food even touches
your lips.
Okay.
And then let's add on top ofthat.
And again, we're looking at allthree mindful eating, into like
mindful slash intuitive eating,willpower in everything in
(17:43):
moderation, because they allkind of fall under the same
bucket.
And then, so we've got this, andthen on top of that we're gonna
add balmeister ego depletiontheory.
And I want you to think about itfrom this perspective.
First thing in the morning youwake up are you like face in
that bag of chips?
Probably not.
Yeah, but what about at nineo'clock at night after a hard
(18:05):
day watching Netflix, right?
That's when those cravings arethe worst.
And the most almost obsessive,right?
I just can't stop eating.
what they found is that the moredecisions that we make during
the day.
The weaker our ability to resistthose cravings.
So I think, from just a naturalhunger cycle from, the way that
(18:27):
our hormones are, and I thinkalso from that place of making a
million different decisionsduring the day We are just so
depleted at that moment in time.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Yeah.
Holly (18:36):
That we're just going to eat.
And that's, I just, I lovepoking holes in this because.
No one talks about it.
Angie (18:43):
what do you think leads a lot of women to choosing eating
at like when they feel that way?
you talk a little bit about thefood noise, and I would love for
you to just expand on that alittle bit of why do we turn to
food when we just feel depleted,stressed, have some of these
uncomfortable emotions that wewant to deal with.
I shouldn't say that we want todeal with, but that we just want
(19:05):
to bury, right?
we don't wanna deal with them.
we wanna bury them.
Holly (19:10):
a lot of people, a lot of people just like to just and I
say lazily po point the fingerat trauma.
And trauma is big and I'm nottrying to undermine trauma.
Trauma is very big andimportant.
Yeah.
But.
It's decades of these patternson top of patterns, on top of
beliefs.
So let's say that, so I'll justgive my own personal example.
(19:32):
So I was brought up that if Iget good a's I'm make good girl.
So I was brought up that smartequals I have value.
If I am smart, then I havevalue.
If I get straight A's, then Ihave value.
Yes.
Okay.
So being smart, When I am smart,then I have value.
And then, oh, let's say I getstraight A's, I get taken out
(19:53):
for ice cream.
So we're brought up with thesepatterns.
And then when those patternsdon't manifest themselves, so
when we aren't feeling valued,when we aren't feeling like our
voice is heard, when we aren'tfeeling worthy, we are seeking
that comfort in some way, shape,or form.
Oh yeah.
(20:14):
And we, the easiest way is foodbecause somewhere along the way
we learned that food equalscomfort.
Angie (20:21):
When
Holly (20:22):
I'm feeling down, and especially as a child, we don't
have, we've got big emotions,but we don't know what to do
with, and we don't know how topackage them.
Yeah.
And process them.
So somewhere along the way we'velearned food equals comfort.
So maybe there was trauma, maybethere wasn't.
But there's always gonna bethese patterns along the way.
And then it is basically, theneurons in your brain that wire
(20:45):
together fire together, andthey're creating a, I can get
into this in a few minutes, butthey're creating basically this
path in the woods.
And this is the only path thatwe know.
This is the only system that weknow.
And then we think about it fromthe perspective.
and I think especially becausewomen view this as a failure.
Like I go on a diet and then Iquit the diet or it doesn't
(21:06):
work, or I gain the weight backor whatever.
Therefore I'm a failure.
Because we equate diet with theonly system that we know is when
you practice, you get better.
So we all learned to drive a carthat when we first started
driving a car, we did not knowhow to drive a car.
You were very hesitant andnervous and, All of that.
We get back now, we can like,drive with one hand and, throw
(21:28):
stuff in the backseat and getunder the seat and drink
something and all the things.
Probably take our sports bra,all the things.
While we're driving a car, likethat's how good we are.
Same with running.
Like you start running, you'relike, oh, this is painful.
This hurts, this is, I can't, Ican only run for a minute and
then I gotta stop and walk.
And the next thing you're doinga 5K, then a 10 K and all the
things.
Yeah.
We have learned that when wepractice, we get better.
(21:48):
But dieting doesn't follow that.
So I know there's a bunch ofdifferent, I think a bunch of
different perspectives I broughthopefully to answer that
question because I don't thinkthere's necessarily one.
Specific answer to that.
I think it's a lot of differentfactors that just pile up on
each other.
Angie (22:04):
Yeah, and I wanna go back to what you said here'cause I
just had this aha moment whenyou were talking that I, and
never really made thatconnection because Yes, of
course I know that food equalscomfort.
We know that.
Food releases.
Some of these chemicals,especially the food that we tend
to go to when we are in thatemotional eating, stressed out
(22:25):
state, we tend to go to thethose high reward foods, whether
it's the salty or the sweet orthe sugary, whatever it might
be.
But what you just said abouthow.
Sometimes a lot of us wereconditioned to be rewarded with
food because of something goodthat we did.
We got straight A's on ourreport card, so we got to go out
(22:45):
for ice cream.
So our brain associated food,the ice cream as the reward.
So when we don't, even, when wedon't have that accomplishment,
we still know that will bringback that good feeling.
So we've wired that.
Food and that experience withfeeling good, feeling
accomplished, feeling havingsomeone be proud of us even.
(23:10):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that I've never seen thatconnection until you just said
it right now, and it just makesme.
It makes so much sense.
And also as a mom of two girls,I'm like, oh no, what am I doing
here?
Because we literally just wentout for ice cream the other
night after my daughter's schoolplay because she's can we go out
for ice cream?
And I said, yeah, of course.
(23:31):
And so how do we navigate that,right?
Because we wanna have thesespecial times and that we
shouldn't use food as a rewardor we should, right?
So there's that whole idea too.
What do you say to that?
Because there's there's food isfuel, right?
Yeah.
We can use food to, to fuel ourbodies.
And food is also celebration andconnection.
(23:53):
Yeah.
And community.
Like we can use food in thatway.
so I'm not really sure what, myquestion here is to be honest
with you, but just what are yourthoughts on that?
Holly (24:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and even thinking back to,whether it's.
the Bible or, they're Jewishfaith or Muslim.
And thinking back to, thosetimes and everyone was brought
up with food as a part of theircelebrations.
Yeah.
So this is a part of us.
Angie (24:18):
Right.
Holly (24:18):
and it's basically being able to, separate and say like
you just said, like that food isfuel.
Angie (24:24):
And
Holly (24:25):
really learning that food is fuel.
Food does not have to equalcomfort.
Yes, it can taste good.
Yes, I can be there for thecelebration.
But am I there because I want toeat the food, for the food to
feel good, or am I there to be apart of.
That time with everyone.
all the holidays revolve aroundfood and like you said, like all
(24:45):
the events and you go out andall the things like that.
So it is possible to be able to,to participate in these events
and to think of it from thatperspective of, I'm being
present With everyone here andI'm being present for the
celebration.
Food is just food and it's theability to really separate it.
Angie (25:03):
But do you think that we need to separate it?
Because I, I think that it canbe both, right?
Like I think that food can beboth part of the celebration and
that it can, there can beemotional attachments to food
because I don't reallypersonally see anything wrong
with that, as long as it doesn'tlead to that mindless eating.
But maybe I'm off base here.
(25:24):
I don't know.
What do you think?
Holly (25:26):
and yes and yeah.
yes and right.
Yes, it, no, but that's where wewanna be, is we wanna be able to
be in that place where we canenjoy it.
But for so many women that Iwork with, they, I.
It is just so obsessive, likethey worry about the food every
time they go out to eat, or,yeah.
Every time they're going tosomeone's house.
what if they ask, what if theywanna try to put seconds on my
(25:47):
plate?
Or what if the dessert platecomes out and just, all of these
worries and all of these, Whatifs And not being able to
control themselves.
To say I can't just have one.
Bite, I've got to eat the wholething.
Yeah.
When I just want one bite.
Or I'm not stopping when I'mfull.
I'm stopping when it's gone.
So I think there's a distinctionbetween looking at it from the
(26:10):
perspective of, I need to have ahealthy relationship around
food.
And I wanna be a part of thecelebration.
Does that make
Angie (26:17):
sense?
Absolutely.
And to add onto that as well,that whole idea of.
Cleaning your plate, the CleanPlate Club that so many of us
were conditioned.
With as children.
Like I know that's how it was inmy family.
Like I was not allowed to leavethe table until my plate was
clear and my mom would literallytake the food sometimes if we
(26:38):
didn't finish our food.
And God bless my mom, no, noshame or anything to towards
her.
but she would put the plate inthe refrigerator and if we then
asked for dessert, she'd bringthat back out and say, you have
to finish your dinner first.
that was how we were conditionedto not waste food because,
things were tough or whatever itmight be.
That, that was how we werebrought up.
(26:58):
And then we don't realize thatthose patterns are still
continuing in adulthood, runningvery subconsciously.
So what do we do about that?
Holly (27:07):
Yeah.
So can we get into the threestep process?
'cause this is really thesolution.
Teach us what you,
Angie (27:13):
what you know.
Holly (27:14):
Yeah.
I use neuroplasticity and Icombine it with FBI
counterintelligence tactics.
So love it.
You're thinking like, oh mygoodness, what's going on here?
So I like to think ofneuroplasticity as your brain is
a path in the woods, and Italked about those patterns
before, and it's this well-wornpath.
Your brain only wants to go downthat path.
It's the only path that knowsit's comfortable, it's safe.
Your brain loves that path.
what we need to do is we need tocreate a new path for your brain
(27:37):
to go down.
So the first step is called seeit.
It's a three step process.
So the first step is called seeit.
So this is where we actually useFBI inspired pattern analysis.
We're going to look for hiddenpatterns and triggers.
To so that you actually canunderstand that why behind
reaching for the food when thestress hits.
So we are literally getting outgloves and work boots, like it's
(27:58):
gonna be a minute.
It's gonna be some hard work.
Like it's, it's not an overnightprocess and we need to
understand that, hey, I need tobuild a new path in the woods.
Angie (28:08):
You
Holly (28:08):
know, how did this get here?
And again, not just the trauma,but these decades of patterns.
Angie (28:11):
Right.
Holly (28:13):
And a perfect example of this, last year I spoke at MIT
and my flight was delayed threehours.
So I'm sitting in thepsychology, A major in me was
just going crazy.
I'm sitting in the airportwatching everyone React to this
delay.
And you've got the people,they're going to the Dunkin
Donuts and they've got thedonuts and the bagels, and then
you've got the people that aregoing to the bar at eight
(28:34):
o'clock in the morning anddrinking.
that's a See it perspective.
Only you would do it.
To yourself.
But that was me watching otherpeople, right?
That was me seeing it, seeingthese patterns.
I am stressed and then I need tograb the food.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
So
Holly (28:45):
that's step one.
See it?
So step two is stop it andthat's where we are going to
learn those FBI inspired tacticsto actually interrupt the cycle.
Real time to stop thosecravings.
Okay.
Now remember when I talked aboutthe half a second and the
dopamine?
This is when we are at a fork.
So we've got a, this path in thewoods and we're at that fork.
So the new path is still we'restill creating the new path.
(29:08):
It's got, thorns and snakes andspiders, and we're still making
it a new path.
So we're coming into that forkand our brain is oh, I wanna go
down the old path.
'cause that's the path that Ilike.
Angie (29:17):
Yeah.
Holly (29:18):
But what we're doing at this point is in that moment of
that V that fork in the road,we're like, Hey, brain.
Go down the new path.
We're still gonna, it's still awork in progress, but we're
gonna go down that new path.
And what we use are calledcountermeasures.
And these are basically, they'regoing to prevent the threat
before it happens.
Angie (29:34):
Okay.
Holly (29:35):
So in the context of emotional eating, so we use them
in counterintelligence.
So in the context of emotionaleating, these are basically just
tactical interventions.
They're going to intercept thatcraving right at that fork in
the road Right before yourbrain's I'm gonna go down the
old path.
You're like, whoa.
Time out.
We're gonna go down the newpath.
The easiest way to explain thisis if you've ever had, if you've
ever had a puppy.
So we get a puppy, a pug, duringthe pandemic, he was a pandemic
(29:57):
puppy.
And, so I potty trained him.
That's exactly what we're doingwith our brain.
We are potty training our brain.
We're telling our brain, don'tyou know, don't go to the
bathroom.
Don't go poopy on the carpet.
You're gonna go outside.
Yeah, that's exactly what we'redoing with our brain.
Angie (30:13):
Okay.
and,
Holly (30:13):
and we're working with these big emotions and patterns
that have been ingrained foryears.
Yeah.
so step one is see it, step twois stop it.
And then step three is shift it.
And this is where we actuallyrewire those automatic responses
because we want our brain tochoose the new path.
We want it to be automatic.
We want it to be effortless.
(30:34):
So when our brain comes to thatfork in the way, so we see it,
we stop it, and then a brain'soh, I'm gonna go down the new
path.
The new path is shiny andsparkly and I like the new path.
Yeah.
And the way that I like this isprobably a really good example,
'cause I know this has happenedto me and I'm sure it's probably
happened to some of yourlisteners too.
(30:54):
So let's say that you're on adiet.
You tell your spouse, your kidsdon't bring home any junk food
because I'm on a diet.
Okay.
So you have a hard day at work.
You get home late, and yourspouse brought home cupcakes.
So there's now cupcakes sittingon the counter, and what do you
do?
You get mad.
(31:17):
First of all, you eat thecupcake because you had a hard
day.
Your brain is looking, yourbrain is laser focused on what
is going to give me comfort.
And those cupcakes are rightthere just like a laser beam.
It's like I'm going to eat.
So you have one or two or threecupcakes, and then what do you
do?
You feel the guilt, you feel theshame.
So you're gonna get mad.
(31:38):
Because you're mad at yourself.
What do you do?
You yell at your spouse?
Get in here.
Yeah.
Like running into the kitchen.
I told you, don't bring thisinto the house.
I wanna, and you yell and youlose it and it's okay.
I was the one that ate thecupcakes, that I'm the one
getting mad.
So this is where we wanna be instep three is those cupcakes can
(32:01):
be on the counter and they'rejust cupcakes.
So you can be around thecupcakes and you have absolutely
no desire to eat them.
Or maybe you have a few bites oryou eat one and if it's a small
or something like that and youput it down and it does not have
(32:21):
any control over you.
And that's exactly where wewanna be.
And there was a study, are youfamiliar with the karaoke study?
It's actually cool.
I don't think so.
So it's Alison Woodbrook andshe's at a Harvard Business
School.
And she had, three groups ofher, the people in this study.
And what they did is they sang,don't Stop Believing Into a
(32:43):
Karaoke Machine.
Excellent.
I know, right?
Best thought.
The choice, like standing on thetable, s singing at the top of
my lump was me.
Yep.
yes.
Totally.
okay.
So the first group just sangnormal.
Okay.
The second group, before theysang, they said, I'm nervous.
And they repeated that tothemselves a few times.
Okay.
Then the third group before theysang, they said, I'm excited.
(33:03):
And they repeated that a fewtimes.
So the Just Singing group sangat 69% accuracy.
Okay.
The I'm Nervous group sang at53% accuracy.
The I'm Excited group sang it,80% accuracy.
Cool.
What's interesting is that, thispart of the brain, this is the
(33:24):
prefrontal cortex, this isimpulse control, decision
making, self-regulation.
and this is the part of thebrain that you want in control
around food.
Yeah.
Because this is going to be thelogical part of your brain.
And what this study proves isthat even just small things,
like even just between sayingI'm nervous or I'm excited
Change that part of the brain.
(33:46):
For accuracy in singing thissong.
And the way that I really liketo think about what this can
bring you, like when you're onthis side of the see it, stop
it, shift it when you're on thisside of the process.
So my stepson's 22 now, I raisedhim since he was five.
And when he was a little guy, hehated to brush his teeth.
(34:10):
It was like.
A constant battle every singleday and night.
And it was like, yeah, step mom,I brushed my teeth and he'd give
me the toothbrush and it waswet.
what he did was he put it underthe water.
Trying to trick me.
I was like, no, like your breathsmells.
Go brush your teeth.
Now we're adults.
We don't have, post-it notes ofaffirmations on our bathroom
(34:30):
saying, I'm a wonderful person.
I brushed my teeth.
like we just brush our teeth,
Angie (34:35):
right?
Holly (34:36):
But even more so than that, you can think about it
from the perspective when, okay,so let's say it's just one of
those mornings you're runninglate, you can't find your keys,
you can't find your glasses, gotin an argument with your spouse,
your dog pooped on the carpet.
whatever.
It's one of those mornings.
It doesn't matter what is goingon in your life, there is
(34:56):
probably a 100% chance that youare leaving your house with your
teeth brush and that coffee inhand, and that's when we can
look at it from thatperspective.
Of it doesn't matter what goeson in your world.
That those habits are soingrained that those pathways in
your brain are so ingrained thatit just becomes a part of you.
Angie (35:16):
To add onto that karaoke study.
The very cool thing about that,and this is one of the things
that we often talk to ourathletes about, both on like in
our real life runners, members,and we also, my husband and I
also coach a high school crosscountry team.
And I know that you're workingwith like the girl, a girls
running club too, right?
Yeah.
Which is cool.
(35:36):
we always tell our athletes thatnervousness.
Like the anxiety that you feeland excitement are literally the
same hormone.
It's neuro neurotransmitter inthe body, right?
It's just epinephrine that'sbeing released.
So neurologically, it's the samething that's happening in the
brain.
It's literally just the storythat you're telling yourself
(35:58):
about what that feeling is.
That's so powerful because thatis proof of what exactly what
you said, the prefrontal cortex,our decision making part of our
brain.
We get to decide when we feelthis sensation because that
there is an actual physicalsensation that we feel, whether
it's, nerves, anxiety, excited.
(36:19):
We can tell ourselves what thatsensation actually is.
And what that study showed thatwas so super cool was that will
then affect how you perform soyou can.
Relate that to anything you canrelate it to, running, work,
whatever.
Holly (36:33):
Yeah.
I love that study.
It is so much fun.
it's karaoke, it's don't stopbelieving like it doesn't get
any better.
I like studies that are sexy.
Angie (36:41):
There you go.
But I think it's just sopowerful, right?
Because it really is all aboutthe story that we are telling
ourselves.
And so is that really how we canstart to shift these beliefs and
these old patterns?
Like first we have to find thepatterns, then we have to stop
them in their track, and then wehave to shift them, which is
really just rewriting your storyaround food and that kind of
(37:03):
thing.
Is that part of it?
Holly (37:05):
Absolutely.
it's a lot of forgiveness.
It's a lot of, so a lot of thewomen that I work with in self
included carry a lot of shame.
Yeah.
From the, from things in thepast.
And then the eating shame on topof it.
And carrying a lot of secrets ontop of the shame.
Yeah.
So it's, there's a lot offorgiveness that's involved, a
lot of exercises that I doaround forgiveness because when
(37:27):
we can release that, it helps toget us to that place of viewing
life in general.
From a neutrality perspective.
Speaker 3 (37:35):
Yeah.
Holly (37:35):
And that then helps us to get to that place where we can,
our body feels safe to rewirethose patterns.
Angie (37:42):
Yeah.
And that's so powerful.
And that really shows you thepower of our nervous system in
this whole arena as well, whichis really the.
Not just that affects our foodchoices and the way that our
body processes food, but alsoour, the rest of our health
choices and our running choicesand our fitness choices and all
these things because so manyrunners suffer from this in
(38:03):
other areas as well.
I know that there's a lot ofrunners that have dysfunctional
or disordered eating habits.
Because all these things getlumped together.
A lot of times people startrunning because they wanna lose
weight and they're then they'retrying to diet and restrict on
top of it, which just throwsyour hormones, especially if
you're a woman in midlife.
It just throws your hormonesinto even more chaos when you're
restricting and working out andthinking you need to push harder
(38:26):
and doing all the things, whichwe haven't even gotten into,
but.
It's really that being safe inyour own body again, and it all
comes back to that and allowingyour body and your nervous
system to feel safe and thatwill actually allow you to have
more control over what, how yourbody responds to food and to
exercise.
Holly (38:47):
100% and going back to the cupcakes on the counter, and
you think about it from a safetyperspective.
When you've had that hard dayand you walk into that house and
even though you've had a hardday and you feel safe in your
body, your nervous systemregulated, you're gonna be like,
okay, the cupcakes are justcupcakes.
They're just neutral.
They're just there.
(39:07):
And your body isn't looking forthat release.
It's not, it's sometimes it'salmost like a, what was that?
The Yellowstone with the geyser,right?
Angie (39:14):
And,
Holly (39:15):
and our body needs a release for this stuff.
So when we're, the moreregulated we are The easier it
is to have, releases likerunning and yoga, and stretching
and walking and, all.
Talking to friends and hangingout, all of these things.
Yeah.
Versus everything just beingpent up, and then exploding.
Angie (39:32):
Absolutely.
So this has been wonderful,Holly, I, if you had to give our
listeners kind of one thing totake away, or if there's
anything that we haven't talkedabout yet that you wanna
mention, what would that be?
Holly (39:45):
Oh my goodness.
I love to say the win is in theawareness.
Because so often we put so muchmorality on.
the numbers, the, the caloriesor the scale or whether we ate
or we didn't ate, or whether thefood is bad or not bad.
And it's this win-loss.
And I like to say the win is inthe awareness.
So when you can be aware, whenyou can actually just stop, take
(40:08):
a step back, see the bigpicture, go into that logical
part of the brain and say,what's going on here?
What am I aware of?
What am I aware of in myenvironment?
What am I aware of in my body?
And after that, whether you eatthe thing or not, the awareness
is the win.
And I really encourage everyonelistening to celebrate that
perspective, that the awarenessis the win.
Angie (40:29):
Yeah.
I love that so much because thenwhen you have the awareness, you
can, it's easier for you to makea choice.
And if your choices that youstill want to eat the food, then
you're making that choice.
But the goal, I think would beto stop that mindless, habitual
pattern loop that we ha have nocontrol over, because there's
nothing wrong inherently withthe food itself.
(40:51):
I.
Eat ice cream, you can eatchips.
And I think hopefully as ahealth coach you would agree
with that as well.
And that kind of goes back tothose three things that you were
talking about, like withmoderation.
Everything in moderation,mindful eating or intuitive
eating and willpower.
Once you have the awareness andyou learn how to stop and shift
it.
(41:11):
Those things actually startworking.
Is that kind of what you'resaying?
A hundred percent.
Those three things don't workwhen you're still in the, in
this dysfunctional cycle, butonce you start to shift it, then
those things can actually, I.
And it, and
Holly (41:23):
it goes from, I need to devour the entire bag.
Yeah.
To, okay, this is, this is atreat.
I'm gonna have a bite or two andI'm good to go.
Yeah.
I know there's other foods thatare gonna fuel my body better
and I want to feel better.
Yeah.
So I'm gonna have a bite or two,I'm gonna enjoy it.
And that's good.
That's enough.
That's all I need.
That is, that's a huge night andday difference, and that is such
(41:45):
a powerful place to be.
Angie (41:46):
Yeah.
And that whole process is reallyjust learning how to reconnect
to your body again, right?
'cause we are just taught todisconnect and to just push
through stress, eat.
all these like habitual patternsthat we've gotten into are just
ways for us to disconnect fromour body from what's happening.
And when we really reconnect toour signals, to our hunger cues,
(42:07):
to really understanding what ourbody needs and doesn't need,
then we get all of our powerback.
Yes, 100%.
I love that so much.
So Holly, thank you so much forbeing here today.
Where can our runners connectwith you if they wanna learn
more from you?
Holly (42:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
So thank you again Angie, andbecause your listeners stayed
till the end, I wanna dosomething really special for
them.
So this is something that I onlyhave for my paying clients.
You can't find it anywhere else.
And this is for you if you are awoman in midlife and I.
the things that I talked abouttoday resonated with you, like
you're not in control around thefood.
You've got the stress eating,the mindless snacking, and just
(42:44):
really hijacked by those, thefood cravings and the noise.
Speaker 3 (42:47):
Yeah.
Holly (42:48):
And the bundle that I have, it's called the Emotional
Eating Tactical Blueprint, andit's got two things.
So the first gift is, actuallyis on my website.
You can get that for free.
It's a personality and it's apsychological analysis.
It's actually a quiz, but it'sdesigned as a psychological
analysis.
You're gonna uncover the numberone emotional and stress eating
trigger so you can actuallyfinally understand what those
(43:09):
triggers are so you don't feellike.
A victim to them.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Yeah.
Cool.
And then
Holly (43:13):
the second thing in the bundle is the, is something that
is only behind the paywall.
And I'm gonna give it to yourlisteners totally free.
Thank you.
And this is really cool.
It's called the Crime SceneFiles Emotional Eating Edition.
So this is where you're gonna gofrom understanding the patterns
you're gonna actually get.
The tactical tools to interceptthose triggers and the
behaviors.
And I designed this True Crimepodcast style.
(43:35):
So if you get geeked out aboutthe True Crime Podcast or the
Law and Order, CSI TV shows,yeah, you are gonna love this
'cause that's exactly what thisis.
So that's awesome.
yeah, so if you want theemotional Eating tactical
blueprint, again totally free.
As my thanks for listening, goto my Instagram and it's at
Holly dot Bertone,B-E-R-T-O-N-E.
And that's, DM me the wordBlueprint.
(43:57):
Blueprint and I will send itover to you.
Awesome.
So yeah, so it's the emotionaleating tactical blueprint.
Go to my Instagram, Holly dotBertone, B-E-R-T-O-N-E, and DME,
the word blueprint.
Angie (44:09):
Perfect.
And we'll put those, that linkin the show notes as well.
So if you are.
Listening to this on yourfavorite podcast player, just
hit pause, go to the show notesand that link will be there
waiting for you and you can justDM Holly to get that tactical
blueprint.
That sounds so cool.
I love how you integrate likeyour FBI counterintelligence
with that health coaching it.
(44:30):
It's so cool.
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, it is.
It's a lot of fun.
I love it.
All right Holly, thank you somuch for being here and I hope
that you guys will definitelytake her up on that offer and
grab that blueprint, over onInstagram today.
So thanks so much, Holly.
We'll talk to you soon.
Alright, thanks.
If you've ever struggled withemotional eating or figuring out
why you just can't crack thecode, why you keep going back to
those same old eating patternsthat you don't really want to
do.
Today's episode is for you.
I am talking to Holly Bertone,who is a former FBI chief of
staff for counterintelligenceturned certified holistic health
(00:21):
coach.
After spending 20 years in highstakes government roles where
she managed major operations andnavigated intense pressure,
Holly understands.
What it's like to battle yourown food monsters and deal with
emotional eating.
And she realized that crackingthe code on her emotional eating
was the same thing as trackingspies, identifying the pattern,
(00:45):
and then neutralizing thethreat.
And so now she takes all of herknowledge and experience in
that.
World of FBI counterintelligenceand applies it to eating and
helping high achieving midlife.
Women break free from emotionaleating, rebel against diet
culture, and prioritize theirhealth.
(01:06):
Without relying on restrictivediets or willpower through her
science-backed approach.
She's been featured on majorplatforms and top podcasts,
including this one, and I'm soexcited to introduce you to
Holly today.
You are gonna gain so much fromthis conversation, so let's jump
in.
Angie (01:47):
All right, everyone, welcome to the show today.
I am so excited to have HollyBertone on the show.
What's up, Holly?
How are you?
Hey Angie.
Thanks so much for having me onthe show, and I'm so excited to
be here.
I am super excited for ourconversation today.
Holly has a very unique storyand I'm gonna let her tell it to
you.
So Holly, tell us who you areand
Holly (02:06):
who do you help.
Yeah, absolutely.
So I'm Holly Bertone and I helpwomen in midlife break free from
emotional eating so that theycan achieve a healthy and
sustainable weight without thecount, counting the calories and
without the crazy diets.
I.
That
Angie (02:20):
sounds perfect.
Let's talk more about that.
So emotional eating is one ofthese topics that I think people
know about but don't reallyunderstand.
So I'm excited to dig into thata little bit further with you.
But I know you have a veryinteresting story of like how
you got to this place.
So can you give us a littlebackground of like how, why are
you a health coach now?
(02:40):
What did you do before this?
Holly (02:42):
Yeah, absolutely.
And before I get into my story,I really just wanna say, Angie,
how much I love your podcast.
Aw, thanks.
'cause I, so I used to be acompetitive triathlete, so my
running was a means to an end.
I didn't run because I loved it.
I run, I ran because.
Of, I wanted to do another raceand same with field hockey.
(03:03):
So it's been 15 years and I amjust now getting back into
running after a long hiatus.
Now I would sprint,'causesprint's, obviously.
So good for your metabolichealth.
Yeah, but I just didn't run.
I was like, I can walk.
I don't need to run.
I am getting back into runningand I love this resource and I
love how it's just, it's fornormal women.
I feel like I fit in.
(03:24):
Like I, I know there's a lot of,resources out there, and I just
feel as just a normal midlifewoman who's getting back into
running, who's getting ready torun her first 5K in.
15 years, like this is such avaluable resource.
So I just wanted to say thankyou for having this resource for
everyone and to all of yourlisteners because of that,
(03:46):
because of this resource,because of how excited I am to
be on this show and.
for the resource that Angie hasfor all of you, I would love for
you to give her a five storerating and review, because that
is gonna help this podcast reachso many more people.
It would mean a lot to me as aguest, and I left a rating and
review this morning, and I justreally want your listeners to,
(04:06):
to be able to do that too.
Angie (04:07):
thank you for that plug.
That was wonderful then, andcompletely unexpected.
So I'm, I love to hear,'causesome of the guests that come on
don't always, aren't regularlisteners to the podcast and so
to know that you listen and havegained value from it means the
world to me.
'cause that's the whole goal ofwhy I do this.
Yeah,
Holly (04:25):
so anyway, so let me jump in.
you talked about first from theperspective of emotional eating
and what is it, and, and someonelistening, they may have said to
yourself at one point, like, howis it that I could be smart and
successful and high achievingand, healthy, like I'm a runner
and, being that woman in midlifewho does it all because of the
(04:45):
things like the habits and thediscipline.
But those same strategies don'twork when it comes to either
losing weight Or having these,just this constant
uncontrollable food noise.
And it ends up becoming theseobsessive cravings and just the
snacking that's mindless.
Like you start and you just losetrack of time.
(05:06):
You don't even know that you'vefinished.
and the reason that I'm doingthis is because I'm a recovered
emotional eater of over 40years.
I, I was an emotional eater whenI was 150 pounds.
When I was overweight.
I was an emotional eater at 110pounds when I was a competitive
triathlete.
And I literally would eat myemotions on a daily basis.
(05:27):
And my goal is to really justbreak that stigma.
I.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah.
Holly (05:31):
That it doesn't matter your weight, it doesn't matter
how quote unquote healthy youare.
if that, that, that food noise,if it's there, let's have this
conversation.
let's, this is, I think wheremenopause was 10 or 15 years
ago, is having this conversationaround emotional eating.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah.
Holly (05:46):
and I'll give you a perfect example of this.
so I used to work at the FBI andwhen I was there, I would dump a
family sized bag of m and ms.
On the desk and, protein ofcourse.
'cause we gotta get our proteinin, the peanut m and ms for the
protein peanut m ms, the peanutm and ms for the protein.
And so I would speed eat the mand ms with my left hand and I
(06:07):
would crank out the PowerPointdeck with my right hand.
So I am literally working asfast as I can and eating as fast
as I can.
But then fast forward, and thisis really where things came to a
head.
I had already resigned.
I resigned from the FBI in 2017or so.
And I had already become ahealth coach, and every Thursday
I would start obsessing aboutFriday afternoon because as a
(06:30):
health coach, I was disciplinedall week long, ate super
healthy, and then I would treatmyself on the weekend.
someone listening may havethink, maybe thinking oh yeah,
I've been, pulled in a millionDrexels with the career and
family and comfort food is justthat one place where it's quiet.
I'm gonna reward myself for ahard day at work, or I'm gonna
reward myself for going on along run.
my reward, so I'm a Pennsylvaniagirl and my reward was salted
(06:55):
caramel ice cream.
I just, I love the sweet, saltycombination.
What I told myself on Thursdayor on Friday, I was like, I'm
gonna divide it into thirds.
So I would have a third of thepint on Friday, a third on
Saturday, a third on Sunday.
In my head, that's how it wentdown, because we're told
everything in moderation.
I would put my spoon in thecontainer.
This happened every singleweekend.
(07:17):
You think I know better.
So I put my spoon in thecontainer and savor the first
bite, savor the second bite, thewhole mindful eating thing.
And then.
The container.
So that was every Friday.
And then what I would do onSaturday is I would get another
pint, eat the other pint.
I get another pint on Sundayeat.
(07:37):
So it was a pint on Friday, pinton Saturday, pint on Sunday.
Every weekend it was the samething.
And then I go back to eatinghealthy on Monday, but there was
this one Sunday and I'mfinishing that third pint of ice
cream that thir three pints ofone weekend.
And, my spoon is in that groovetrying to get that last little
bit of ice cream and chocolate.
(08:12):
So this Sunday my spoon was at.
The bottom of the container andit was in that groove in the
bottom of the container tryingto get that last little bit of
ice cream and chocolate out.
And I'm staring at the bottom ofanother pint of ice cream on
another sundae.
And I was like, Holly Bartone,what are you?
(08:33):
Doing, like, why can't you justeat like a normal person?
Why do you have to inhale theentire thing?
And I don't even remember eatingit.
I just inhaled it and I'm like,I was literally scraping the
bottom because I just wantedmore.
And I felt this shame that wasjust suffocating because I a
health coach and I should knowbetter.
(08:55):
I didn't wanna face that truthbecause I kept justifying it.
I'm a healthy weight.
I worked all hard all week.
I, I was super disciplined withhow I ate and, you might have
thinking like, I don't know,maybe there's been a time in
your life where you're justputting on these appearances.
You've got it all together onthe outside, but behind closed
doors, like I was this hotnessexpress and I didn't want anyone
(09:19):
to find out.
I didn't want anyone to know mysecret.
Angie, I went upstairs, I wentto my walk-in closet and I just
did a 360 and I looked at all myclothes.
I love my clothes, and I waslike, I'm not wearing most of
them, because they were just alittle bit too small.
Not to the point where I neededto get a different size, but
(09:41):
they were just tight anduncomfortable.
Yeah.
And I was remembering back towhat it was like when I was 40
pounds overweight.
When I hated how I looked, andeven back to when I was going
through breast cancer andautoimmune disease and how much
those diseases, like what damagethey did to my body.
And I vowed that I am not gonnago back to that place again.
(10:03):
That this food has way too muchcontrol over me.
And I made a decision thatsomething needs to change.
And it was difficult to.
Have that conversation withmyself to say, okay, it doesn't
matter that I'm a healthy weightor how much I weigh, like I am
(10:25):
struggling with emotionaleating.
And I realize like when that,when you have that emotional
eating, like that food noise isalways gonna win.
And I realize it wasn't just methat there's so many women in
midlife.
Who are battling the same andthey're, they've got these,
demanding jobs and careers andthen this lifestyle and all of
the stress, and then they'rereaching for the food and then
(10:47):
they've got this shame andthat's when I just, I put the
FBI pat back on and I was like,I am going to investigate this.
And I uncovered what the weightloss industry doesn't want us to
know.
And because they want us tothink that it's all about the
calories and the cardio and theweight and the food.
It's actually about addressingthose root cause triggers, those
(11:07):
automatic eating patterns,because that is what's driving
our behavior.
That's what's driving theeverything.
these patterns controleverything.
So in order for things tochange, we actually need to
rewire those patterns to work inour favor.
And when I realized that, that'swhen everything changed, not
just for me, but for the womenwho I coach.
(11:28):
And I think it's important too,to say that.
I have the pieces of paper onthe wall that say I'm certified
to coach, but the way that Icoach, the way that I, you know,
share and sharing today with youand your audience, everything
was built from those foodmonsters that I overcame
personally.
(11:49):
Combined with my skills in FBIcounterintelligence the
analyzing the patterns andcountering the threats, and then
combining that with the brainscience of neuroplasticity, and
that's when we strike gold.
Angie (12:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
And I couldn't agree more witheverything that you just talked
about.
I know that I also have gonethrough my own eating journey,
of, I wouldn't ever say that Ihad an eating disorder, but I
definitely have had disorderedeating patterns in the past.
And I think that a lot of us inhealth and fitness, whether
(12:24):
you're a coach or not, if youare a woman that is concerned
about your health.
A lot of women have disorderedeating and don't even realize it
because the messages out thereare so mixed.
We are constantly.
Confused because that is whatthe diet industry wants, right?
They want us to be confused.
(12:46):
They want us to think we justhaven't found the solution yet,
or we just haven't found theright diet yet, or, all these
lies that we are fed.
And I would love to go into alittle bit more.
Of that, of, you said that youreally uncovered a lot of these
lies.
What are some of the most commonlies that you think that we are
(13:06):
encountered with on a dailybasis
Holly (13:08):
as women?
Oh my goodness.
Yeah, that is such a greatquestion.
And when you're talking aboutthe diet industry, I'd love to
throw out a few facts and thenI'll get into the lies.
Is that, The diet industry inthe United States alone is
somewhere between 70 and$90billion a year.
Angie (13:23):
That's with a B?
Holly (13:24):
With a B.
Billion.
Billion.
Yeah.
And I actually, I've seen otherstatistics that one's a little
bit conservative, believe it ornot.
Exactly.
It's a little bit low, and twothirds of women age 40 to 60 are
clinically overweight.
Diets have a 92% failure rate,This is an industry that wants
us to fail.
Yeah.
(13:45):
So the question is, why do theywant us to fail?
What are these, you talk aboutthe lies, like what are the lies
that are, that we're fed andthen what are the 8% doing
differently That, that aregetting them to succeed.
And I like to think of, I liketo think of, how we
traditionally view diets.
As the check the self-checkoutline at the grocery store.
(14:08):
Because you wanna get in andout.
You want that quick fix andthat's what we've been fed.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Yeah.
Holly (14:13):
And you've got one line in the regular.
the regular checkout that'sopen, there's five or six people
you know, and you're going inand you're like scan.
And then the next thing is likeunexpected item in bagging area.
you got the little light goingand you know you're looking for
the lady and a team member is onhis way.
A team member.
Yeah, exactly.
And then she goes to the personbeside you and you're like, wait
a second, my light was flashingfirst.
(14:36):
And then what makes it worse isthat I don't, and I don't know
if you've ever done this before.
Maybe it's just me, maybe I'mjust a little competitive.
But, you know how when you're inline and then you've got the
people in the regular checkoutline and you like eyeing them
up, say, okay, who is parallelto me?
And you're like, I'm gonna beatthem out the store, right?
Yeah.
This is okay.
and then the next thing youknow, like that person is.
(14:58):
Leaving the store and you'restill there, bagging your
groceries.
You're like, oh, this, that isexactly what diet industry is
doing to us.
Okay.
it's causing us to look at thisfrom a quick fix to be
competitive with everyone else,and then just feel like, oh,
what did I do wrong?
Yeah.
it's our fault, or somethinglike that.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
Yeah.
Holly (15:17):
but the three, three of really the lies that we are
told, and I'm gonna lump all ofthem into one.
Okay.
Is the everything a moderation.
The mindful eating or intuitiveeating, and then the willpower.
I just need willpower and Iwanna caveat it before everyone
(15:37):
comes at me, which, whatever.
I wanna caveat,
Angie (15:40):
I'm like, you're like, I've, I'm in the, I've been in
the FBII can take it.
Come on, let's go.
Bring it on.
Holly (15:46):
Yeah.
let's tango.
Yeah.
So I will say they do work.
Okay.
And I actually.
Incorporate them.
Okay.
Personally, but think about itfrom this perspective.
If you struggle with emotionaleating Have any of these ever
worked in the past?
And the answer is probably no.
(16:09):
And that's what I want us toreally think about and get past
is, okay, these work on theother side.
They're not going to work if youare struggling with that food
noise.
and I can explain why.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yeah.
Holly (16:24):
So we think of willpower.
That's the biggest one, becausewe think, oh, I just need to be
strong.
And it's mind over matter.
And I like to say willpower isthe equivalent of a SWAT team
being armed with a cabbage patchkid.
it's co like you've got thisforce and then it's completely
useless.
Angie (16:40):
Okay.
Holly (16:41):
So research is at MIT.
They actually, found that whenthose cravings hit, your brain
has already made a decision inless than half of a second that
you are going to eat the food.
Okay?
So this decision is made in ourbrain in less than half of a
second.
Now we're gonna introducedopamine.
(17:03):
You think?
Dopamine, you think, okay,that's the reward chemical.
I'm around a baby or a puppy andyay, I feel happy.
That's dopamine.
Okay?
Yeah.
Dopamine is actually theanticipation chemical because
it's released in anticipation ofeating the food.
And that's why these cravingsare so automatic and obsessive.
(17:23):
Because your brain has alreadystarted this reward process.
So you've got ha less than halfof a second, and then the
dopamine is kicked in rightbefore the food even touches
your lips.
Okay.
And then let's add on top ofthat.
And again, we're looking at allthree mindful eating, into like
mindful slash intuitive eating,willpower in everything in
(17:43):
moderation, because they allkind of fall under the same
bucket.
And then, so we've got this, andthen on top of that we're gonna
add balmeister ego depletiontheory.
And I want you to think about itfrom this perspective.
First thing in the morning youwake up are you like face in
that bag of chips?
Probably not.
Yeah, but what about at nineo'clock at night after a hard
(18:05):
day watching Netflix, right?
That's when those cravings arethe worst.
And the most almost obsessive,right?
I just can't stop eating.
what they found is that the moredecisions that we make during
the day.
The weaker our ability to resistthose cravings.
So I think, from just a naturalhunger cycle from, the way that
(18:27):
our hormones are, and I thinkalso from that place of making a
million different decisionsduring the day We are just so
depleted at that moment in time.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Yeah.
Holly (18:36):
That we're just going to eat.
And that's, I just, I lovepoking holes in this because.
No one talks about it.
Angie (18:43):
what do you think leads a lot of women to choosing eating
at like when they feel that way?
you talk a little bit about thefood noise, and I would love for
you to just expand on that alittle bit of why do we turn to
food when we just feel depleted,stressed, have some of these
uncomfortable emotions that wewant to deal with.
I shouldn't say that we want todeal with, but that we just want
(19:05):
to bury, right?
we don't wanna deal with them.
we wanna bury them.
Holly (19:10):
a lot of people, a lot of people just like to just and I
say lazily po point the fingerat trauma.
And trauma is big and I'm nottrying to undermine trauma.
Trauma is very big andimportant.
Yeah.
But.
It's decades of these patternson top of patterns, on top of
beliefs.
So let's say that, so I'll justgive my own personal example.
(19:32):
So I was brought up that if Iget good a's I'm make good girl.
So I was brought up that smartequals I have value.
If I am smart, then I havevalue.
If I get straight A's, then Ihave value.
Yes.
Okay.
So being smart, When I am smart,then I have value.
And then, oh, let's say I getstraight A's, I get taken out
(19:53):
for ice cream.
So we're brought up with thesepatterns.
And then when those patternsdon't manifest themselves, so
when we aren't feeling valued,when we aren't feeling like our
voice is heard, when we aren'tfeeling worthy, we are seeking
that comfort in some way, shape,or form.
Oh yeah.
(20:14):
And we, the easiest way is foodbecause somewhere along the way
we learned that food equalscomfort.
Angie (20:21):
When
Holly (20:22):
I'm feeling down, and especially as a child, we don't
have, we've got big emotions,but we don't know what to do
with, and we don't know how topackage them.
Yeah.
And process them.
So somewhere along the way we'velearned food equals comfort.
So maybe there was trauma, maybethere wasn't.
But there's always gonna bethese patterns along the way.
And then it is basically, theneurons in your brain that wire
(20:45):
together fire together, andthey're creating a, I can get
into this in a few minutes, butthey're creating basically this
path in the woods.
And this is the only path thatwe know.
This is the only system that weknow.
And then we think about it fromthe perspective.
and I think especially becausewomen view this as a failure.
Like I go on a diet and then Iquit the diet or it doesn't
(21:06):
work, or I gain the weight backor whatever.
Therefore I'm a failure.
Because we equate diet with theonly system that we know is when
you practice, you get better.
So we all learned to drive a carthat when we first started
driving a car, we did not knowhow to drive a car.
You were very hesitant andnervous and, All of that.
We get back now, we can like,drive with one hand and, throw
(21:28):
stuff in the backseat and getunder the seat and drink
something and all the things.
Probably take our sports bra,all the things.
While we're driving a car, likethat's how good we are.
Same with running.
Like you start running, you'relike, oh, this is painful.
This hurts, this is, I can't, Ican only run for a minute and
then I gotta stop and walk.
And the next thing you're doinga 5K, then a 10 K and all the
things.
Yeah.
We have learned that when wepractice, we get better.
(21:48):
But dieting doesn't follow that.
So I know there's a bunch ofdifferent, I think a bunch of
different perspectives I broughthopefully to answer that
question because I don't thinkthere's necessarily one.
Specific answer to that.
I think it's a lot of differentfactors that just pile up on
each other.
Angie (22:04):
Yeah, and I wanna go back to what you said here'cause I
just had this aha moment whenyou were talking that I, and
never really made thatconnection because Yes, of
course I know that food equalscomfort.
We know that.
Food releases.
Some of these chemicals,especially the food that we tend
to go to when we are in thatemotional eating, stressed out
(22:25):
state, we tend to go to thethose high reward foods, whether
it's the salty or the sweet orthe sugary, whatever it might
be.
But what you just said abouthow.
Sometimes a lot of us wereconditioned to be rewarded with
food because of something goodthat we did.
We got straight A's on ourreport card, so we got to go out
(22:45):
for ice cream.
So our brain associated food,the ice cream as the reward.
So when we don't, even, when wedon't have that accomplishment,
we still know that will bringback that good feeling.
So we've wired that.
Food and that experience withfeeling good, feeling
accomplished, feeling havingsomeone be proud of us even.
(23:10):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that I've never seen thatconnection until you just said
it right now, and it just makesme.
It makes so much sense.
And also as a mom of two girls,I'm like, oh no, what am I doing
here?
Because we literally just wentout for ice cream the other
night after my daughter's schoolplay because she's can we go out
for ice cream?
And I said, yeah, of course.
(23:31):
And so how do we navigate that,right?
Because we wanna have thesespecial times and that we
shouldn't use food as a rewardor we should, right?
So there's that whole idea too.
What do you say to that?
Because there's there's food isfuel, right?
Yeah.
We can use food to, to fuel ourbodies.
And food is also celebration andconnection.
(23:53):
Yeah.
And community.
Like we can use food in thatway.
so I'm not really sure what, myquestion here is to be honest
with you, but just what are yourthoughts on that?
Holly (24:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and even thinking back to,whether it's.
the Bible or, they're Jewishfaith or Muslim.
And thinking back to, thosetimes and everyone was brought
up with food as a part of theircelebrations.
Yeah.
So this is a part of us.
Angie (24:18):
Right.
Holly (24:18):
and it's basically being able to, separate and say like
you just said, like that food isfuel.
Angie (24:24):
And
Holly (24:25):
really learning that food is fuel.
Food does not have to equalcomfort.
Yes, it can taste good.
Yes, I can be there for thecelebration.
But am I there because I want toeat the food, for the food to
feel good, or am I there to be apart of.
That time with everyone.
all the holidays revolve aroundfood and like you said, like all
(24:45):
the events and you go out andall the things like that.
So it is possible to be able to,to participate in these events
and to think of it from thatperspective of, I'm being
present With everyone here andI'm being present for the
celebration.
Food is just food and it's theability to really separate it.
Angie (25:03):
But do you think that we need to separate it?
Because I, I think that it canbe both, right?
Like I think that food can beboth part of the celebration and
that it can, there can beemotional attachments to food
because I don't reallypersonally see anything wrong
with that, as long as it doesn'tlead to that mindless eating.
But maybe I'm off base here.
(25:24):
I don't know.
What do you think?
Holly (25:26):
and yes and yeah.
yes and right.
Yes, it, no, but that's where wewanna be, is we wanna be able to
be in that place where we canenjoy it.
But for so many women that Iwork with, they, I.
It is just so obsessive, likethey worry about the food every
time they go out to eat, or,yeah.
Every time they're going tosomeone's house.
what if they ask, what if theywanna try to put seconds on my
(25:47):
plate?
Or what if the dessert platecomes out and just, all of these
worries and all of these, Whatifs And not being able to
control themselves.
To say I can't just have one.
Bite, I've got to eat the wholething.
Yeah.
When I just want one bite.
Or I'm not stopping when I'mfull.
I'm stopping when it's gone.
So I think there's a distinctionbetween looking at it from the
(26:10):
perspective of, I need to have ahealthy relationship around
food.
And I wanna be a part of thecelebration.
Does that make
Angie (26:17):
sense?
Absolutely.
And to add onto that as well,that whole idea of.
Cleaning your plate, the CleanPlate Club that so many of us
were conditioned.
With as children.
Like I know that's how it was inmy family.
Like I was not allowed to leavethe table until my plate was
clear and my mom would literallytake the food sometimes if we
(26:38):
didn't finish our food.
And God bless my mom, no, noshame or anything to towards
her.
but she would put the plate inthe refrigerator and if we then
asked for dessert, she'd bringthat back out and say, you have
to finish your dinner first.
that was how we were conditionedto not waste food because,
things were tough or whatever itmight be.
That, that was how we werebrought up.
(26:58):
And then we don't realize thatthose patterns are still
continuing in adulthood, runningvery subconsciously.
So what do we do about that?
Holly (27:07):
Yeah.
So can we get into the threestep process?
'cause this is really thesolution.
Teach us what you,
Angie (27:13):
what you know.
Holly (27:14):
Yeah.
I use neuroplasticity and Icombine it with FBI
counterintelligence tactics.
So love it.
You're thinking like, oh mygoodness, what's going on here?
So I like to think ofneuroplasticity as your brain is
a path in the woods, and Italked about those patterns
before, and it's this well-wornpath.
Your brain only wants to go downthat path.
It's the only path that knowsit's comfortable, it's safe.
Your brain loves that path.
what we need to do is we need tocreate a new path for your brain
(27:37):
to go down.
So the first step is called seeit.
It's a three step process.
So the first step is called seeit.
So this is where we actually useFBI inspired pattern analysis.
We're going to look for hiddenpatterns and triggers.
To so that you actually canunderstand that why behind
reaching for the food when thestress hits.
So we are literally getting outgloves and work boots, like it's
(27:58):
gonna be a minute.
It's gonna be some hard work.
Like it's, it's not an overnightprocess and we need to
understand that, hey, I need tobuild a new path in the woods.
Angie (28:08):
You
Holly (28:08):
know, how did this get here?
And again, not just the trauma,but these decades of patterns.
Angie (28:11):
Right.
Holly (28:13):
And a perfect example of this, last year I spoke at MIT
and my flight was delayed threehours.
So I'm sitting in thepsychology, A major in me was
just going crazy.
I'm sitting in the airportwatching everyone React to this
delay.
And you've got the people,they're going to the Dunkin
Donuts and they've got thedonuts and the bagels, and then
you've got the people that aregoing to the bar at eight
(28:34):
o'clock in the morning anddrinking.
that's a See it perspective.
Only you would do it.
To yourself.
But that was me watching otherpeople, right?
That was me seeing it, seeingthese patterns.
I am stressed and then I need tograb the food.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
So
Holly (28:45):
that's step one.
See it?
So step two is stop it andthat's where we are going to
learn those FBI inspired tacticsto actually interrupt the cycle.
Real time to stop thosecravings.
Okay.
Now remember when I talked aboutthe half a second and the
dopamine?
This is when we are at a fork.
So we've got a, this path in thewoods and we're at that fork.
So the new path is still we'restill creating the new path.
(29:08):
It's got, thorns and snakes andspiders, and we're still making
it a new path.
So we're coming into that forkand our brain is oh, I wanna go
down the old path.
'cause that's the path that Ilike.
Angie (29:17):
Yeah.
Holly (29:18):
But what we're doing at this point is in that moment of
that V that fork in the road,we're like, Hey, brain.
Go down the new path.
We're still gonna, it's still awork in progress, but we're
gonna go down that new path.
And what we use are calledcountermeasures.
And these are basically, they'regoing to prevent the threat
before it happens.
Angie (29:34):
Okay.
Holly (29:35):
So in the context of emotional eating, so we use them
in counterintelligence.
So in the context of emotionaleating, these are basically just
tactical interventions.
They're going to intercept thatcraving right at that fork in
the road Right before yourbrain's I'm gonna go down the
old path.
You're like, whoa.
Time out.
We're gonna go down the newpath.
The easiest way to explain thisis if you've ever had, if you've
ever had a puppy.
So we get a puppy, a pug, duringthe pandemic, he was a pandemic
(29:57):
puppy.
And, so I potty trained him.
That's exactly what we're doingwith our brain.
We are potty training our brain.
We're telling our brain, don'tyou know, don't go to the
bathroom.
Don't go poopy on the carpet.
You're gonna go outside.
Yeah, that's exactly what we'redoing with our brain.
Angie (30:13):
Okay.
and,
Holly (30:13):
and we're working with these big emotions and patterns
that have been ingrained foryears.
Yeah.
so step one is see it, step twois stop it.
And then step three is shift it.
And this is where we actuallyrewire those automatic responses
because we want our brain tochoose the new path.
We want it to be automatic.
We want it to be effortless.
(30:34):
So when our brain comes to thatfork in the way, so we see it,
we stop it, and then a brain'soh, I'm gonna go down the new
path.
The new path is shiny andsparkly and I like the new path.
Yeah.
And the way that I like this isprobably a really good example,
'cause I know this has happenedto me and I'm sure it's probably
happened to some of yourlisteners too.
(30:54):
So let's say that you're on adiet.
You tell your spouse, your kidsdon't bring home any junk food
because I'm on a diet.
Okay.
So you have a hard day at work.
You get home late, and yourspouse brought home cupcakes.
So there's now cupcakes sittingon the counter, and what do you
do?
You get mad.
(31:17):
First of all, you eat thecupcake because you had a hard
day.
Your brain is looking, yourbrain is laser focused on what
is going to give me comfort.
And those cupcakes are rightthere just like a laser beam.
It's like I'm going to eat.
So you have one or two or threecupcakes, and then what do you
do?
You feel the guilt, you feel theshame.
So you're gonna get mad.
(31:38):
Because you're mad at yourself.
What do you do?
You yell at your spouse?
Get in here.
Yeah.
Like running into the kitchen.
I told you, don't bring thisinto the house.
I wanna, and you yell and youlose it and it's okay.
I was the one that ate thecupcakes, that I'm the one
getting mad.
So this is where we wanna be instep three is those cupcakes can
(32:01):
be on the counter and they'rejust cupcakes.
So you can be around thecupcakes and you have absolutely
no desire to eat them.
Or maybe you have a few bites oryou eat one and if it's a small
or something like that and youput it down and it does not have
(32:21):
any control over you.
And that's exactly where wewanna be.
And there was a study, are youfamiliar with the karaoke study?
It's actually cool.
I don't think so.
So it's Alison Woodbrook andshe's at a Harvard Business
School.
And she had, three groups ofher, the people in this study.
And what they did is they sang,don't Stop Believing Into a
(32:43):
Karaoke Machine.
Excellent.
I know, right?
Best thought.
The choice, like standing on thetable, s singing at the top of
my lump was me.
Yep.
yes.
Totally.
okay.
So the first group just sangnormal.
Okay.
The second group, before theysang, they said, I'm nervous.
And they repeated that tothemselves a few times.
Okay.
Then the third group before theysang, they said, I'm excited.
(33:03):
And they repeated that a fewtimes.
So the Just Singing group sangat 69% accuracy.
Okay.
The I'm Nervous group sang at53% accuracy.
The I'm Excited group sang it,80% accuracy.
Cool.
What's interesting is that, thispart of the brain, this is the
(33:24):
prefrontal cortex, this isimpulse control, decision
making, self-regulation.
and this is the part of thebrain that you want in control
around food.
Yeah.
Because this is going to be thelogical part of your brain.
And what this study proves isthat even just small things,
like even just between sayingI'm nervous or I'm excited
Change that part of the brain.
(33:46):
For accuracy in singing thissong.
And the way that I really liketo think about what this can
bring you, like when you're onthis side of the see it, stop
it, shift it when you're on thisside of the process.
So my stepson's 22 now, I raisedhim since he was five.
And when he was a little guy, hehated to brush his teeth.
(34:10):
It was like.
A constant battle every singleday and night.
And it was like, yeah, step mom,I brushed my teeth and he'd give
me the toothbrush and it waswet.
what he did was he put it underthe water.
Trying to trick me.
I was like, no, like your breathsmells.
Go brush your teeth.
Now we're adults.
We don't have, post-it notes ofaffirmations on our bathroom
(34:30):
saying, I'm a wonderful person.
I brushed my teeth.
like we just brush our teeth,
Angie (34:35):
right?
Holly (34:36):
But even more so than that, you can think about it
from the perspective when, okay,so let's say it's just one of
those mornings you're runninglate, you can't find your keys,
you can't find your glasses, gotin an argument with your spouse,
your dog pooped on the carpet.
whatever.
It's one of those mornings.
It doesn't matter what is goingon in your life, there is
(34:56):
probably a 100% chance that youare leaving your house with your
teeth brush and that coffee inhand, and that's when we can
look at it from thatperspective.
Of it doesn't matter what goeson in your world.
That those habits are soingrained that those pathways in
your brain are so ingrained thatit just becomes a part of you.
Angie (35:16):
To add onto that karaoke study.
The very cool thing about that,and this is one of the things
that we often talk to ourathletes about, both on like in
our real life runners, members,and we also, my husband and I
also coach a high school crosscountry team.
And I know that you're workingwith like the girl, a girls
running club too, right?
Yeah.
Which is cool.
(35:36):
we always tell our athletes thatnervousness.
Like the anxiety that you feeland excitement are literally the
same hormone.
It's neuro neurotransmitter inthe body, right?
It's just epinephrine that'sbeing released.
So neurologically, it's the samething that's happening in the
brain.
It's literally just the storythat you're telling yourself
(35:58):
about what that feeling is.
That's so powerful because thatis proof of what exactly what
you said, the prefrontal cortex,our decision making part of our
brain.
We get to decide when we feelthis sensation because that
there is an actual physicalsensation that we feel, whether
it's, nerves, anxiety, excited.
(36:19):
We can tell ourselves what thatsensation actually is.
And what that study showed thatwas so super cool was that will
then affect how you perform soyou can.
Relate that to anything you canrelate it to, running, work,
whatever.
Holly (36:33):
Yeah.
I love that study.
It is so much fun.
it's karaoke, it's don't stopbelieving like it doesn't get
any better.
I like studies that are sexy.
Angie (36:41):
There you go.
But I think it's just sopowerful, right?
Because it really is all aboutthe story that we are telling
ourselves.
And so is that really how we canstart to shift these beliefs and
these old patterns?
Like first we have to find thepatterns, then we have to stop
them in their track, and then wehave to shift them, which is
really just rewriting your storyaround food and that kind of
(37:03):
thing.
Is that part of it?
Holly (37:05):
Absolutely.
it's a lot of forgiveness.
It's a lot of, so a lot of thewomen that I work with in self
included carry a lot of shame.
Yeah.
From the, from things in thepast.
And then the eating shame on topof it.
And carrying a lot of secrets ontop of the shame.
Yeah.
So it's, there's a lot offorgiveness that's involved, a
lot of exercises that I doaround forgiveness because when
(37:27):
we can release that, it helps toget us to that place of viewing
life in general.
From a neutrality perspective.
Speaker 3 (37:35):
Yeah.
Holly (37:35):
And that then helps us to get to that place where we can,
our body feels safe to rewirethose patterns.
Angie (37:42):
Yeah.
And that's so powerful.
And that really shows you thepower of our nervous system in
this whole arena as well, whichis really the.
Not just that affects our foodchoices and the way that our
body processes food, but alsoour, the rest of our health
choices and our running choicesand our fitness choices and all
these things because so manyrunners suffer from this in
(38:03):
other areas as well.
I know that there's a lot ofrunners that have dysfunctional
or disordered eating habits.
Because all these things getlumped together.
A lot of times people startrunning because they wanna lose
weight and they're then they'retrying to diet and restrict on
top of it, which just throwsyour hormones, especially if
you're a woman in midlife.
It just throws your hormonesinto even more chaos when you're
restricting and working out andthinking you need to push harder
(38:26):
and doing all the things, whichwe haven't even gotten into,
but.
It's really that being safe inyour own body again, and it all
comes back to that and allowingyour body and your nervous
system to feel safe and thatwill actually allow you to have
more control over what, how yourbody responds to food and to
exercise.
Holly (38:47):
100% and going back to the cupcakes on the counter, and
you think about it from a safetyperspective.
When you've had that hard dayand you walk into that house and
even though you've had a hardday and you feel safe in your
body, your nervous systemregulated, you're gonna be like,
okay, the cupcakes are justcupcakes.
They're just neutral.
They're just there.
(39:07):
And your body isn't looking forthat release.
It's not, it's sometimes it'salmost like a, what was that?
The Yellowstone with the geyser,right?
Angie (39:14):
And,
Holly (39:15):
and our body needs a release for this stuff.
So when we're, the moreregulated we are The easier it
is to have, releases likerunning and yoga, and stretching
and walking and, all.
Talking to friends and hangingout, all of these things.
Yeah.
Versus everything just beingpent up, and then exploding.
Angie (39:32):
Absolutely.
So this has been wonderful,Holly, I, if you had to give our
listeners kind of one thing totake away, or if there's
anything that we haven't talkedabout yet that you wanna
mention, what would that be?
Holly (39:45):
Oh my goodness.
I love to say the win is in theawareness.
Because so often we put so muchmorality on.
the numbers, the, the caloriesor the scale or whether we ate
or we didn't ate, or whether thefood is bad or not bad.
And it's this win-loss.
And I like to say the win is inthe awareness.
So when you can be aware, whenyou can actually just stop, take
(40:08):
a step back, see the bigpicture, go into that logical
part of the brain and say,what's going on here?
What am I aware of?
What am I aware of in myenvironment?
What am I aware of in my body?
And after that, whether you eatthe thing or not, the awareness
is the win.
And I really encourage everyonelistening to celebrate that
perspective, that the awarenessis the win.
Angie (40:29):
Yeah.
I love that so much because thenwhen you have the awareness, you
can, it's easier for you to makea choice.
And if your choices that youstill want to eat the food, then
you're making that choice.
But the goal, I think would beto stop that mindless, habitual
pattern loop that we ha have nocontrol over, because there's
nothing wrong inherently withthe food itself.
(40:51):
I.
Eat ice cream, you can eatchips.
And I think hopefully as ahealth coach you would agree
with that as well.
And that kind of goes back tothose three things that you were
talking about, like withmoderation.
Everything in moderation,mindful eating or intuitive
eating and willpower.
Once you have the awareness andyou learn how to stop and shift
it.
(41:11):
Those things actually startworking.
Is that kind of what you'resaying?
A hundred percent.
Those three things don't workwhen you're still in the, in
this dysfunctional cycle, butonce you start to shift it, then
those things can actually, I.
And it, and
Holly (41:23):
it goes from, I need to devour the entire bag.
Yeah.
To, okay, this is, this is atreat.
I'm gonna have a bite or two andI'm good to go.
Yeah.
I know there's other foods thatare gonna fuel my body better
and I want to feel better.
Yeah.
So I'm gonna have a bite or two,I'm gonna enjoy it.
And that's good.
That's enough.
That's all I need.
That is, that's a huge night andday difference, and that is such
(41:45):
a powerful place to be.
Angie (41:46):
Yeah.
And that whole process is reallyjust learning how to reconnect
to your body again, right?
'cause we are just taught todisconnect and to just push
through stress, eat.
all these like habitual patternsthat we've gotten into are just
ways for us to disconnect fromour body from what's happening.
And when we really reconnect toour signals, to our hunger cues,
(42:07):
to really understanding what ourbody needs and doesn't need,
then we get all of our powerback.
Yes, 100%.
I love that so much.
So Holly, thank you so much forbeing here today.
Where can our runners connectwith you if they wanna learn
more from you?
Holly (42:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
So thank you again Angie, andbecause your listeners stayed
till the end, I wanna dosomething really special for
them.
So this is something that I onlyhave for my paying clients.
You can't find it anywhere else.
And this is for you if you are awoman in midlife and I.
the things that I talked abouttoday resonated with you, like
you're not in control around thefood.
You've got the stress eating,the mindless snacking, and just
(42:44):
really hijacked by those, thefood cravings and the noise.
Speaker 3 (42:47):
Yeah.
Holly (42:48):
And the bundle that I have, it's called the Emotional
Eating Tactical Blueprint, andit's got two things.
So the first gift is, actuallyis on my website.
You can get that for free.
It's a personality and it's apsychological analysis.
It's actually a quiz, but it'sdesigned as a psychological
analysis.
You're gonna uncover the numberone emotional and stress eating
trigger so you can actuallyfinally understand what those
(43:09):
triggers are so you don't feellike.
A victim to them.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Yeah.
Cool.
And then
Holly (43:13):
the second thing in the bundle is the, is something that
is only behind the paywall.
And I'm gonna give it to yourlisteners totally free.
Thank you.
And this is really cool.
It's called the Crime SceneFiles Emotional Eating Edition.
So this is where you're gonna gofrom understanding the patterns
you're gonna actually get.
The tactical tools to interceptthose triggers and the
behaviors.
And I designed this True Crimepodcast style.
(43:35):
So if you get geeked out aboutthe True Crime Podcast or the
Law and Order, CSI TV shows,yeah, you are gonna love this
'cause that's exactly what thisis.
So that's awesome.
yeah, so if you want theemotional Eating tactical
blueprint, again totally free.
As my thanks for listening, goto my Instagram and it's at
Holly dot Bertone,B-E-R-T-O-N-E.
And that's, DM me the wordBlueprint.
(43:57):
Blueprint and I will send itover to you.
Awesome.
So yeah, so it's the emotionaleating tactical blueprint.
Go to my Instagram, Holly dotBertone, B-E-R-T-O-N-E, and DME,
the word blueprint.
Angie (44:09):
Perfect.
And we'll put those, that linkin the show notes as well.
So if you are.
Listening to this on yourfavorite podcast player, just
hit pause, go to the show notesand that link will be there
waiting for you and you can justDM Holly to get that tactical
blueprint.
That sounds so cool.
I love how you integrate likeyour FBI counterintelligence
with that health coaching it.
(44:30):
It's so cool.
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, it is.
It's a lot of fun.
I love it.
All right Holly, thank you somuch for being here and I hope
that you guys will definitelytake her up on that offer and
grab that blueprint, over onInstagram today.
So thanks so much, Holly.
We'll talk to you soon.
Alright, thanks.
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