423: How To Enjoy Running More

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How to Enjoy Running More: Overcoming Pain, Letting Go of Judgment, and Finding the Fun in Every Run

In this week’s episode, Kevin and I dive into something every runner wants more of—joy in running. Because let’s be real, not every run feels amazing. Some days are light and fun, and others feel like a grind. But with the right approach, running can be something you actually look forward to.

We share some of our own stories (the good, the tough, and the funny!) and talk through practical ways you can bring more enjoyment into your miles. Here’s a little sneak peek of what we cover:

•  Eliminating pain – Strength training and mobility aren’t just “extras”—they’re the keys to feeling good in your runs.
• Letting go of judgment – You are not “too slow.” You’re a runner, exactly as you are.
• Creating a plan that fits you – Adjusting speed work, long runs, and strength sessions so that training feels sustainable and fun.

At the end of the day, running doesn’t have to feel like punishment—it should build you up, body and mind.

We also share some exciting resources to help you along the way, including our new secret podcast (yep, you heard that right!) and our 30-Day Strong Runner Challenge—a simple way to start combining running and strength so you can enjoy running more, with less pain and more confidence.

👉 Tune in now and let’s make running something you truly love again.

02:25 The Reality of Enjoying Running

05:26 The Inconsistency and Injury Cycle

12:20 The Hamster Wheel of Chasing PRs

20:18 Consistency is Key: Health and Running

27:43 Making Running More Enjoyable

29:45 Understanding Discomfort vs. Pain in Running

30:42 The Importance of Strength Training

32:22 Letting Go of Judgment

37:39 Finding Enjoyment in Running

42:18 Creating a Personalized Running Plan

46:08 The Non-Negotiable Need for Strength Training

50:15 Listening to Your Body's Signals

51:45 Making Running Fun and Enjoyable

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Don't forget: The information on this website is not intended to treat or diagnose any medical condition or to provide medical advice. It is intended for general education in the areas of health and wellness. All information contained in this site is intended to be educational in nature. Nothing should be considered medical advice for your specific situation.

Episode Transcript

Angie (00:00):
What's up, runners?

(00:01):
Today we're talking about how toenjoy running more, and yes, I'm
just gonna go ahead and keepthis in the intro because Kevin
and I are a little loopy.
We're recording this a littlelate at night, so who knows
what's gonna come out in today'sepisode, so stay tuned.

Kevin (00:41):
What's up, runners?

Speaker (00:42):
Oh wow.
You brought it up.
I know it.
What's up, runners?
Welcome back to the show.
Or I don't know what's going onwith us, but let's go with it.

Kevin (00:50):
yeah.
No,'cause it's all about joy andthat's the whole point of the
thing and so yeah, having alittle laugh fest at the
beginning I think is a goodstart.

Angie (00:55):
Yeah, so I was, oh, hold on.
Our daughter's calling us.
Pause.
And we're back.
Okay.
So we are here to talk about howto enjoy running more today.
That's the topic.
And this spawns from spawns?
No, this spawns from a post thatI decided to put up on Instagram

(01:16):
today.
And the question was, I put itup on my Instagram story.
If you're not following us yet,head over to Instagram at real
life runners and hit that followbutton because we're much more
entertaining over there, Ithink, than we are on the
podcast.
But who's to say we're probablyentertaining in both worlds?

Kevin (01:33):
I'm super entertaining on the podcast.

Angie (01:34):
Yeah, obviously that's 'cause you just don't post on
Instagram.

Kevin (01:39):
That's why I'm more entertaining on the podcast.

Angie (01:41):
anywho, I put up a question on my Instagram story
today.
And the question was, which ofthe following is most important
to you right now?
And the options were to runwithout pain, to enjoy running
or to feel better running.
And the majority of people thatanswered, and I had quite like,
I had a lot of people answeredthis poll.

(02:03):
Most of, I think it was morethan 50% last time I ch I looked
was, yeah, it was a majority toenjoy running.

Kevin (02:10):
Yeah.
So we decided, let's do apodcast about it.
How can we help you all enjoyrunning more?
So that's really our topic oftoday.
Excellent.
Which is great.
'cause I love running and I lovetalking about running.
it's just, it's a whole joyexperience to me from all
angles.

Angie (02:25):
Yeah.
And I'm a mix, so like most ofthe time I enjoy running.
I would say I'm just gonna be ahundred percent honest.

Kevin (02:30):
you're over here.
Are I mixed?

Angie (02:32):
You're over here laughing.
I enjoy running.
I would say, for the most part,but there's always those days
where you don't enjoy it.
And I think you have those daystoo.
And I think that maybe that'snot on our outline here, but
that's probably our number onething to take away, is you're
not supposed to enjoy it.
All the time.
all, 100% of the time, every dayon every run.

Kevin (02:50):
I enjoyed most of my run today.
I did not enjoy the alarm goingoff at five to start my run.
I sat on the couch for a, Ithink three to five minutes
debating whether I should justfall asleep on the couch or go
like I just

Speaker (03:04):
did.
Yeah.

Kevin (03:04):
Or go out for a run, like as soon as I was out, not as
soon five minutes into my run, Iwas good.
I was into it and then now I'mrunning.
But yeah, it was a little roughtrying to just tie my shoes.

Angie (03:17):
Yeah.
And I think that we all havethat experience and I think that
needs to be the number one thingthat we remember is that you
don't have to enjoy it 100% ofthe time to still enjoy running.
And I think everyone wouldprobably agree with that.

Kevin (03:29):
you can't enjoy anything 100% of the time.
there's whatever it is, you're.
Favorite meal chocolate you'regonna get.
Yeah, I was gonna say chocolate100%

Angie (03:37):
of the time.
no.

Kevin (03:38):
I was gonna take that to Willy Wonka'cause that big kid
fell into the river and gotsucked up the thing he did
because he loved chocolate toomuch.
That was the issue.
And then you're gonna get suckedup a tube and then the
oompaloompas are gonna come outand sing.
And so you can't enjoy the thing100% of the time.
'cause the oompaloompas willshow up.

Angie (03:53):
But if you eat it in moderation, will you?
Still be able to enjoy it ahundred percent of the time.

Kevin (03:57):
Yes.
Because then, okay, so if youdon't overdo it, as long as you
don't overdo.

Angie (04:00):
Yeah, but I think that running is different, even if
you're doing it in moderationand if you're following a
training plan that's right foryou, there's still going to be
some runs that you might notenjoy all the time.

Kevin (04:10):
Yes.
But in moderation, I think it'smore likely that you're going to
enjoy most of the.
Okay.
I don't agree.
Don't if we're getting to ahundred.
Yeah.
But I feel like if you aren'ttrying to go out there and pound
it every single day, you have agreater chance of a higher
percentage of your runs bringingyou joy.

Angie (04:27):
okay.
So let's jump in here and diginto how to make running, I
don't wanna say more fun, buthow to be able to enjoy it more
funner.
Funner.

Kevin (04:37):
Is that what you wanted to say instead?
No.
Oh, okay.

Angie (04:39):
Did you wanna use real words?
I did.

Kevin (04:41):
Okay, fine.

Angie (04:43):
And all of a sudden my humor is gone.
Dang.
And I'm just like, okay, nowwe're gonna just finish the
episode and be go to bed.

Speaker (04:48):
Alright, fine.
Yeah,

Angie (04:49):
it's funny because I was gonna tell a little story at the
beginning of like, why.
I'm tired and why we're loopyand it's just, I, we just jumped
in.
Instead, you decided

Kevin (04:58):
it was too long to tell the story and so we skipped
right over

Angie (05:01):
it.
No, I just, I was outta townlast week and traveling a lot
and kind of what I went did lastweek was a bit of a draining
type of thing and I feel likeI'm still recovering from all of
that.
And so Kevin, we are gonnarecord the podcast a little bit
earlier in the evening.
And, I went ahead and fellasleep on the couch
accidentally.
Yeah.

Kevin (05:19):
So I went ahead and outlined the podcast.
Yeah.
Perfect.
And now we're good to go.
And

Angie (05:22):
now we're good.
All right.
So how about you start us offtoday, since you're the one that
outlined the podcast today?
Okay.

Kevin (05:26):
So I think that a lot of people get into running for
essentially like healthpurposes.
Like they, they want to get fit,they want to just generally feel
healthy and think that runningis going to be a good means to,
that ends, and then one of thefollowing scenarios.
Plays out.
They start pushing too hard,which leads to this
inconsistency and or injurycycle.

Angie (05:49):
Why do you think they push too hard?

Kevin (05:50):
Because they're not sure how to do it.
And so they're like, I want toexercise.
I want to get in good shape.
I'm going to get in good shapefaster.
And I'm gonna get in bettershape if I just go out and push.
Yeah.
But the pushing constantly leadsto one.
It's not that fun.
Yeah.
Definitely not.
Like sometimes it's fun, butit's rarely fun.
Yeah.
And you get the inconsistencyinjury cycle.

Angie (06:07):
Tell the story about cross country practice today.

Kevin (06:10):
Oh, so we've had kids on the team.
Literally, it was a senior who'sbeen running for us for years.
The number of times that we'vetold the kids that your easy run
should feel comfortable, youshould be able to carry on a
conversation.
You should finish and be like,all right, that was fine.
I could probably go out and domore if I even wanted to.
And we've told that all thetime.

(06:30):
We have a new assistant coach.
She went out and was runningwith the kids on the team, and
she kept being like, why don'tyou just slow down a little bit?
You could, we could all runtogether.
just come and run my pace.
This is gonna be fine.
Just run this pace.
And they finished the run.
They were chatting the wholetime.
And they finished the run.
They were like.
That was weird.
I don't feel exhausted.

(06:51):
I think I've just been pushingjust a little bit every time I
go out.
Yeah, and it's not like theywere pushing so hard every time,
but they just literally neverlet themself be comfortable on a
run.

Angie (07:03):
Yeah, and I think there's a lot of runners that fall into
this trap, like maybe you're oneof them because you listen to
this podcast, you're like, okay,they said that I need to run
easy.
I need to make this feel.
easy, et cetera.
And, it's really hard to dothat.
And I think that this is one ofthe first things that we really
help people with when they jointhe Real Life Runners team also,
is to help them understand whateasy pace actually feels like.

(07:26):
Because I do think that mostrunners, even those ones that
are trying to make it feel easy,push just a little bit over that
because it is.
Uncomfortable in the beginningto, I think, mentally accept
that it's okay to do this right?
Because I don't think, maybe forsome people there is the
physical challenge of slowingdown because for some people.

(07:48):
It can alter your gait pattern alittle bit and it can feel
awkward in your body, so thatcan be a little challenging, but
I think for most people it'smore of a mental barrier that
they have of really buying intothis idea that running easier
and not feeling tired after myruns is actually going to help
me improve as a runner overall.

Kevin (08:10):
there are actual physical benefits that you're gonna get
from running at an easier pacethat you're not going to get
when you strain yourself.
Whether it's what

Angie (08:18):
even It's just a, even if it's just a little bit,

Kevin (08:20):
yes.
Even if you're just pushing justa little bit, you're still
missing out on just

Angie (08:24):
a little bit.
Thank

Kevin (08:25):
you.
Just, you're missing out on someof the benefits.

Angie (08:28):
You said you wanted my voices.
I

Kevin (08:29):
did.
You have so many of them.
I'm sure it, we, everybodyprays.
Brace themselves.
'cause you know she's gonna turnBritish partway through this
podcast.
I hope so.
Oh, it's coming.
I hope we, hopefully we keep upour UK listenership during that
portion.

Angie (08:42):
If I do turn British at some point, you, it's coming.
It's halfway this episode.
Okay.
I just have to preface that bysaying it is out of love and
respect and definitely notmocking.
So I apologize if it's not agreat British accent or if you
don't love it.
But it is.
Truly out of just love andadmiration because I love
British people and the Britishaccent,

Kevin (09:03):
that is entirely true.
Yes.
All of, because I spent

Angie (09:06):
a semester in London and I love it.

Kevin (09:07):
Yes.
All of that is very true.
Yeah.
So yes, there's nothingoffensive by it that it just,
sometimes it comes out.

Angie (09:13):
Yes.

Kevin (09:13):
Alright.

Angie (09:14):
Which is funny because last week at my event I was
hanging out with some people forthe, from the uk and sometimes
my British accent just comes.
Comes out.

Kevin (09:23):
Oh, that's weird.
I'm British also.
no you're not.
You're from Florida.

Speaker (09:27):
And I was like, oh, did they just notice that I did
that?
nobody said anything.
But I definitely caught myselfat one point because sometimes I
just have voices that come outand,

Kevin (09:38):
everybody was saying, bye, you yelled, Cheerio.
And we don't even say that.
What are you talking about?
God.
Alright, let's see what else wegot here.
all right, so

Speaker (09:46):
we were talking about pushing just a little bit more

Kevin (09:48):
Uhhuh, so there's, that's one of the options.
You getting into it for healthreasons and you think to get
more fit.
I'm just gonna push just alittle bit every time I go out
there.
Another option is, trying toread my own English here.

Speaker (10:03):
See, when it's not just me,

Kevin (10:04):
I sometimes my, I read over

Speaker (10:06):
Kevin's outline and I'm like, what are you seeing?
What are these words here?
What is happening?

Kevin (10:10):
So get into running, and you combine.
Your increase of your exerciseload with a decrease of your
food intake.
This is also a recipe for justfeeling miserable all the time
and likely the injury cycle, butalso just feeling miserable all
the time.

Angie (10:28):
So if.
For those of you that need aKevin translation, thank you, of
increased exercise and decreasedfood, it's this idea of dieting
on top of exercise, right?
A lot of people when they getinto running for health reasons,
when you say quote unquotehealth reasons, a lot of people
get into running to lose weight,or improve health markers in
some way.

(10:48):
And a lot of the times that fora lot of people, it means that
they're overweight.
Not always, of course.
But their doctors oftenrecommend that they start
exercise and dieting.
So they do both of these thingssimultaneously.
So if you are both increasingyour exercise level and
restricting your calories, andyou do at a extreme level, maybe

(11:09):
not even what you might think isextreme, but it's a extreme
change for your body.
That can lead to really feelingcrappy a lot of the time, not
just on your runs, but in yourdaily life as well.

Kevin (11:20):
Yeah.
if you're not eating enough,it's going to be really tough to
get yourself out the door to runbecause you're like, I don't
have the energy to go out andrun.

Angie (11:27):
Because food provides energy and I think that this is
one of the things that a lot ofpeople forget because.
We think we've been conditionedby the diet industry to believe
that food leads to weight gain,and if we eat too much food, we
will gain weight, which to anextent there is some truth to
that statement.
However, we also have toremember that food is energy.

(11:47):
And so if we are restricting ourcalorie intake, we are also
restricting the amount ofavailable energy for us.
So then if you're trying toincrease your running, which is
a very.
Energy heavy type of activity.
It's going to be hard for you tofeel good on your runs if you
don't have an energy source thatyou're pulling from.
Excellent.

Kevin (12:07):
Yeah, so everybody's got these thoughts in their head.
Coming from, I don't know, bigdiet culture.
I like to lean into big carbculture and eat something and
then go run.
It's.
It makes the running just allthat much more enjoyable.
Alright, third option.
You get into running for healthreasons and you start seeing
these improvements.
And so you start signing up forraces and then you sign up for a
race.
You have fun with that.

(12:27):
You're like, I should sign upfor another one.
You run faster in the next race,and then you're like, maybe I
should sign up for a longerrace.
And now you're caught on thishamster wheel of chasing the
next pr.
I can always run a little bitfaster than this.
Maybe I could run a longerdistance.
Maybe I can now run that longerdistance a little bit faster,
and it just keeps going, whichcould be fun.
That can even be fun for quite awhile.

(12:49):
But at some point you mightrealize that you're just
endlessly chasing prs.
That in theory, the time canalways get just a little bit
faster and the distance canalways go just a little bit
farther.
It's still, it's just a littlebit, again, I came back.

Angie (13:02):
Just a little.
Okay.
But the thing is that you knowif that is your reason for
running, if you're just outthere to chase prs, and if
you've been in running for awhile, you understand that
progression in running is notlinear, your improvement is not
linear.
So there's going to be a time,especially at the beginning.
Where you do make a lot ofimprovements, and so sometimes

(13:22):
you make really big jumps inimprovement at the beginning,
but at some point that willplateau and sometimes you might
even decline a little bit,especially if you got fell into
the last trap that we justtalked about of restricting your
calories and trying to increaseyour running load, whether
that's trying to run faster ortrying to run longer, that
improvement is gonna start toslow down.

(13:43):
Or you might even go backwardsand so you're gonna hit some
races where.
You don't hit the PR and thenyou feel yucky about it.
You feel crappy about it.
You feel down on yourself orfrustrated or confused, and
you're like, I don't know whatjust happened.
Why am I not improving?
And so if you're on thisconstant hamster wheel.
Of just chasing prs, then thatis going to suck a lot of the

(14:06):
joy out of running because ifyou know you don't hit that pr,
then all of a sudden the mindwants to go to, what was it all
for?

Kevin (14:14):
Yes.
Then I feel like I've wasted thelast however many weeks or
months even, and it.
You're looking back, even if youenjoyed the training, you look
back and you see all thattraining as a negative.

Angie (14:25):
But I think that part of the problem with chasing PRS is
that people aren't necessarilyenjoying the training and the
process.
They're simply looking for theresults.
And if you're only looking forresults and you're not enjoying
the process, that is a supereasy way for that joy for you to
not enjoy running.

Kevin (14:41):
Yeah, because.
You're, you've skipped overprocess.
Like you're just looking for endresults.
So whatever you do day to day isjust the things you have to do.
And it's okay that somewhere inyour training are some things
that you're like, I have to dothis thing.
It's not necessarily my mostfavorite thing.
And we'll get to that later.
But there are things that shouldgo into your training plan, even
if they're not your favoritething.

Angie (15:02):
Yeah.
I don't love waking up at fiveo'clock in the morning and going
to meet my friends at five 30.
I do love meeting my friends.
I don't like that it's at five30 in the morning, but.
That is part of the deal, right?
so there are aspects of it thatI don't love.
I also don't love running in 85degree weather.
It feels like 96, but again,that's part of running in

(15:22):
Florida in the summertime.
So there are going to be theseaspects that we might not enjoy
all of the time, but if we stepback, we can say, yeah, but I
still enjoy.
This thing that I'm doing, and Istill enjoy the process of all
of it.
And if not, then maybe it's atime to step back and
reevaluate, which we're notreally gonna talk about today.
We're gonna focus more on how tohelp you enjoy the running more.

Kevin (15:45):
I feel like we've got podcast, I don't know, somewhere
we do in our thing of, there's a

Angie (15:48):
recent one that we did about burnout.
Yeah.
it's, I would say within thelast probably.
10 to 20 episodes.
So I think this is 4 23, I thinkit's after episode 400.
There's been like, episodes thatwe've done about burnout or if
you've lost your running spark,your spark for running, you know
what you can do about it.
So you can go back and listen tothose if that's how you're
feeling.
But going back to this idea ofthe process and not just

(16:11):
focusing on the results and theprs.
That is going to be the way toenjoy running more, because if
you're just focusing on thatoutcome, it can, again, it's
gonna be hard to enjoy it everysingle day that you have to get
up and go out there and train.
However, if you, so one of thethings that I like to tell our
athletes and the clients that wework with.

(16:32):
Is that your goals arefantastic.
It's fantastic for you to have abig goal, whether whether it's a
PR in time or a PR in distance.
You know the longest distanceyou've ever run, the fastest
time you've ever run.
Goals are great because goalshelp give you direction.
They give you that lighthouseout in the distance.
They help you to figure out howyou wanna challenge yourself,

(16:53):
and the goal determines theplan.
Yeah.
So the goal determines the plan,which is the process that you
are going to follow in order toachieve that goal.
So the key though is, and thisis where a lot of people get
goals wrong and get too attachedto them, when you set a goal.
You use that goal to create theprocess that you're going to

(17:14):
follow.
When you do that, you then haveto release your attachment to
that goal, and then the goal,the new goal, becomes to just
execute the process.
To just follow the plan thatyou've created or that a coach
has created for you to help youachieve that outcome.

(17:34):
Without attachment to the actualgoal itself.
Does that make sense?
Yeah, no.
Or should I phrase thatdifferently?

Kevin (17:40):
No, that makes sense to me.
Okay.
I've heard that a lot of, yeah.
You, so

Angie (17:43):
you set the goal to create the process, and then you
release the goal and the goalbecomes to follow the process.

Kevin (17:49):
Yeah.
Yeah.
the key is making sure thatprocess gets you to the goal.
And

Angie (17:54):
in theory,

Kevin (17:55):
and when you, in theory and when you step back and you
look at the overall process,you're like, that seems like an
enjoyable process.
And that's part of where theenjoyment comes.
Yes.
Is whatever your goal is, thereare, there's a lot more than one
training plan method that willget you there.
you Google it, there's athousand of them.
there are lots of options forhow to get to it.
You need to find one thatactually works for you.

(18:16):
You need to find your enjoyableplan.

Angie (18:18):
And like I think that it sounds like, for example, Kevin
loves running ultra marathons.
He loves running the his newthing, I shouldn't say new'cause
it's been a couple of years now,but it's

Kevin (18:28):
relatively new'cause I've been running forever.
Yeah.

Angie (18:30):
So your current.
love is Ultra Marathon.
Should I that Sure.
Yeah.
Say that.
That's a good way of

Kevin (18:35):
phrasing it.

Angie (18:36):
I think it would be really cool to, like, when I
watch Kevin out there runninglike on the trails and doing
this huge thing, I think tomyself, wow, that would be
really cool to run a hundredmiles.
I.
Maybe I could do it.
And then I think about theprocess that is required in
order to accomplish that goal.

(18:57):
And that sounds awful to me.
So I know that I, at this pointin my life, am not ready to run
an ultra marathon because theprocess does not sound fun to
me.

Kevin (19:08):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So then it just, it basicallywipes the goal.
Off the table, right?
You're like, oh, that goaldoesn't make any sense.

Angie (19:14):
could I do it probably right?
But I, if I'm gonna be miserablethe whole time, why would I do
that to myself?

Kevin (19:19):
Yeah.
you've said the same thing abouta marathon is, what it'd take to
do a marathon?
Yeah.
To get a result that would, thatyou would be satisfied with.
And you're not willing to put inthat work right now.
And so that's not a goal, right?
It's a silly goal.
Yeah.
Like it'd be pointless.

Angie (19:31):
Yeah.
I think I'm just gonna waituntil I'm older to do a
marathon.
That way there's no timeexpectation, because I think
that's one of my biggesthindrances, to be honest with
you, is yes, there's a lot oftime required just to complete a
marathon, but I think that in myhead, I have this time
expectation of.
If I ran that marathon, I wouldwant to do it in under X time.

(19:53):
And quite honestly, I don't, Ican't even tell you what that
time is right now.

Kevin (19:56):
But it's in there somewhere.

Angie (19:57):
But there's something in there.
And so I think that if I'm oldenough, if I just wait until I'm
maybe like 60 or 70 and then Ican just release that time
expectation.
I could release it now, right?
Like I can do whatever I wantyou.

Kevin (20:09):
You could,

Angie (20:09):
But then, then I'm just gonna be like a cool old woman
that ran her first marathon.

Kevin (20:13):
That would also be a fun story.

Angie (20:15):
Heck yeah.

Kevin (20:15):
All right.
So that's good.
Yeah.
all having the goal is good.
We were talking about having agoal be to improve your health,
and if you take races away, ifyour overall picture for why you
do running is simply to improveyour health, then the number one
way to do this is consistency.
if you want to stay healthy,number one move is consistent.

(20:38):
Exercise.
That doesn't mean running everysingle day.
It's not.
You have to go start a runstreak.
That means consistently puttingin the work so that you can
improve your health and.
You go online, you hear allsorts of stuff on social media
about all these little tips andtricks and hacks and oh, are you
making sure that you're doingthis?
And find the zone two, and thenbe in a sauna and a cold plunge

(21:01):
and make sure that you'regetting like the protein within,
five minutes after your run andthese many calories during your
run and all these things, andheat adaptation, all this stuff.
All of that works at the verysmall margins.
That is not like the mostimportant aspect of your running
training.
The most important aspect ofrunning training is getting out

(21:23):
and running.
You have to make sure thatthere's some strength that comes
along with it.
'cause you can't just go out andrun forever.
Your body will break down.
It needs the strength as a,foundation.

Angie (21:31):
Thank you for saying that.
I appreciate it.

Kevin (21:33):
But basically, once you've got enough strength, the
number one thing that's gonnamake you a better runner is
running more.
Not this some magic workout thatexists, not some supplement
stack that's going to, that youneed to take before, not the
exact perfect post recoverydrink, it's just running.
So when you're trying to figureout, oh, I have to do all of

(21:54):
these things, otherwise I'm notpossibly gonna be able to
achieve my plan.
There are so many ways toachieve your plan.
You don't have to add things.
If you're like, I don't reallyfeel like adding that in, then
you probably don't need to doit.
Okay.
Whatever is helping you maintainconsistency, that's the best
thing for you.

Angie (22:12):
Okay.
Wait, go back to what you justsaid.
If you don't feel like addingthe thing and then you probably
don't need to do it.

Kevin (22:19):
So we're talking like extreme things.
So

Angie (22:22):
extreme things.

Kevin (22:23):
Things like popular stuff that I see.
I don't know how much of this ishitting your social media.
Yeah.
But stuff that is currentlyhitting mine Yeah.
Is people do, it's we're inAugust and people are still
doing like heat suit training.
People are finishing their longrun and then going and sitting
in a sauna.
People are talking about tryingto maximize the amount of carbs
that they take in on a long run.

(22:44):
Yeah.
These are things that may behelpful.
Maybe helpful for people who aretrying to win races.

Angie (22:50):
these are the people, that are the looking for the
fractions of the top percentage,right?

Kevin (22:56):
But that doesn't mean that it's pointless.
to have a podcast that everysingle week we come on and we're
just like, Hey, go out and enjoyyour easy run.

Angie (23:04):
No,

Kevin (23:04):
it's just gonna get really boring.

Angie (23:06):
Of course.
But that is the foundation ofall of it.
Yes.
if you're not going out anddoing most of your running at an
easy effort level, then the restof your training doesn't like,
is less important because you'renot building that aerobic base
that you need.

Kevin (23:20):
Like almost everything is simply being able to go out and
just run.
Comfortably and if you just goout and run comfortably, that
covers the vast majority of yourtraining.

Angie (23:31):
It, it does.
And I think that there'sdefinitely, that is a really big
blanket statement and like wedefinitely, I know I

Kevin (23:37):
nailed it.

Angie (23:38):
Need that is your opinion on it.
But I think that we definitelyneed.
Some easy runs.
We definitely need strengthtraining, like you mentioned,
which I appreciate, and wedefinitely need some speed work
in there.
Now.
The speed work is, I guess moreof what we can debate and it
depends on who you are and whatyour goal is.

Kevin (23:56):
I'm excited to debate this.

Angie (23:57):
we don't, I don't think we need to debate it right now,
but I think that's Because ifwomen respond, women, especially
women over 40, there's someresearch that shows that higher
intensity stuff is important andcan help with different
adaptations.
But I think that we can get toowrapped up in some of those
details as well.
it is very important for us tonot forget the fundamentals of
going out and running.

Kevin (24:17):
And that's my point, is you don't necessarily need to
change your training plan everytime a new research paper comes
out.
And you see another video onlineof oh.
this person, this run influencerwas just talking about this new
study that came out and theresults were this.
Okay, do you actually know whatthat study was?
Was that study just like eightparticipants and they saw

(24:39):
improvements of 1%?
what was the actual study?
Because maybe the results soundgreat, but is the study actually
worthwhile?
is the study something that youactually want to change what
you're doing?
Adjust your entire trainingplan.
'cause if you're enjoying yourcurrent training plan, you
probably don't need to adjust itbased off of the data that just
came out yesterday, like youprobably don't if you're

(25:01):
currently enjoying your trainingplan, especially if you're
enjoying and progressing withit.

Angie (25:05):
Yeah, and I think that's really, that last part is key if
you're enjoying it and makingprogress because.
There's a lot of runners thatare making progress, but then
they hear something new and thenthey think, oh, maybe that thing
can help me make progress fasteror make progress easier.
And while that could be true, ifwhat you're doing is currently

(25:27):
working and you're enjoying it,why are you going to make a
change, I think is one of thebiggest questions.
And I think that kind of takesinto account this.
Need that we a lot of peoplehave right now for that instant
gratification.
And I think it's important forus to remember that running just
doesn't work that way.
there really is not a goodinstant gratification when it

(25:50):
comes to long distance endurancerunning.

Kevin (25:53):
No, most of those adaptations come slowly.
Yeah.
Like they, they do.
There's a few things that youcan get over the course of a
couple of weeks, but not, not alot,

Angie (26:02):
but weeks, months, years, yeah.
You're still looking over

Kevin (26:05):
the course of a couple of weeks.

Angie (26:06):
We're not talking about one magic workout.

Kevin (26:08):
No.
that doesn't exist.
If it does, that will be thename of the podcast episode when
we find the magic workout.
I promise the name of theepisode will be, we found the
magic workout.

Angie (26:18):
We found it.

Kevin (26:19):
So we've got it.

Angie (26:21):
Yeah.
So you have on here, so threecauses of consistency and I'll
let you talk about those.
'cause like we're saying here,the.
One of the most important thingsthat if you are running for
health reasons, number one thingis consistency, and there are
three, Kevin has three causes ofconsistency here.
Okay.

Kevin (26:38):
One absolute rigid determination, which means no
matter what is happening, youjust grit your teeth and you're
like, I'm doing it becausethat's, I need to be consistent.
Okay.
I feel like you're eventuallygonna run out of willpower
there.
For sure.
You sure will.
Okay.
Number two is probably thedirection that.
You would direct people towards.
Number three is the point ofthis episode.

(26:59):
Number two is create a habit.
Because then it reduces theamount of like effort you need
before friction.
Yes, thank you.
It reduces the friction to goout and exercise.
Number three is increase theenjoyment and I feel like two
and three could go together.
But I think that one.
Is going to have the leastchance for long-term consistency
because eventually just grid itout and go for it.

(27:21):
You're going to want to stay inbed one day.
Yeah.
it, you're just gonna want to,if you can increase the
enjoyment or if you can put itinto a habit that reduces
friction, that makes it easierfor you to go out and run.
Those are going to be long-termconsistencies.

Angie (27:33):
Yes, I agree.
And I think that, we do have tolook at how can we enjoy it
more.
And that's what we're gonna getinto now because that's what we
have been promising you is thepoint of this episode.
So how can we make running morefun or more enjoyable?
How can you go out and enjoyrunning more so that you will be
more consistent at it?

(27:53):
Because when you're moreconsistent, then you're going to
get better results.
And that's.
Going to probably make you enjoyit more.
So it becomes a wonderful littlecycle that we in instead of,
that we're, we find ourselves ininstead of the vicious cycle of
where you're pushing too hardand then you get injured and
then you have to take time offand then you're, you decline and
you're running, and then youfeel like you're behind.

(28:14):
So then you start pushing toohard and you're running again,
and then you end up in thisvicious cycle of running.
Let's get you in the good cycle,of where you're enjoying it
because you're enjoying it,you're being more consistent,
you're seeing better results,and that's gonna lead you to
even more enjoyment.
So the first thing I wanna talkabout is eliminating pain,
because there's a lot of runnersthat think that pain is just

(28:36):
part of the process.
And while there is somediscomfort that comes along with
running, especially if.
You're trying to challengeyourself and push yourself.
Like sometimes discomfort ispart of the process because it,
they always say, growth happensoutside of your comfort zone.
It requires discomfort in orderfor you to grow and in order for
you to make progress.

(28:57):
That's the whole principle ofprogressive overload.
You have to push yourself.
do more than what you'recurrently capable of, just by a
little bit so that your bodywill build back stronger.
That's how you will improve.
However, there is a differencebetween discomfort and pain, and
it's going to be very hard toenjoy running if it just hurts
all the time.

(29:18):
So this goes back to ourprinciple that we were talking
about before, is slowingyourself down because if.
because running is not supposedto hurt all the time.
And so if running hurts, prettymuch every time you go out and
run, if you think it'suncomfortable, every time you go
out and run, the first thing youwanna do is slow down, okay?
Because slowing down is going tohelp running feel better.

(29:39):
It might change your running alittle bit.
Maybe that will make it morecomfortable, but at least you're
gonna.
Do you know your lungs areprobably gonna feel better.
The burning in your legs isprobably going to feel better
now.
I would consider all of thosethings more discomfort that I
was talking about before versuspain.

Kevin (29:55):
No, that's definitely discomfort.
But some, the whole idea ofprogressive overload works great
in like the gym where you're notdoing the same muscles every
single time you go in.
Like you've got a routine thatyou set me up for that I'm doing
like.
Push type exercises one day anda different day.
I'm doing pole type exercisesand so because I'm doing

(30:16):
different muscle groups, I canprogressive overload on one and
could literally come back thenext day and progressive
overload again,'cause they'redifferent muscles.
When you go out and run, you'rehitting the same muscles.
So if you push just a little bitone day and then you push just a
little bit the next day andagain, just a little bit the
next day, you're progressiveoverload every single time and
you never give your body achance to recover And.

(30:36):
Your discomfort just keeps, justincreasing gradually until it,
it might become pain.

Angie (30:41):
Until it becomes pain.
and then going back to whatKevin mentioned before about
strength training, and I lovewhen he puts those in just
because it's those, just thoselike little love notes to me of
don't worry, an I've got you.
We're gonna talk about strengthtraining as well.
strength training.
if you're having any sort ofpain.
Whether it's foot pain, anklepain, knee pain, hip pain, you
have to strength train.
I would highly recommend goingto see a physical therapist in

(31:05):
your area if you don't have aphysical therapist that you can
see.
I do online runningconsultations, so you can
contact me, you can, reach out.
Let's get you outta pain first,right?
Because again, it's going to behard to enjoy running.
If you're in pain all the time.
So we have to be strengthtraining and working on our
mobility so that our body ismoving better, our running is

(31:25):
more fluid and more efficient sothat we can help to eliminate
pain.
I think that's really thebaseline to help us enjoy
running more is to.
Help it feel better in our body.

Kevin (31:35):
Yeah.
I'll give you that one.
that's a good place to start.
I'm, I'm on board.

Angie (31:38):
You're on board?
Yeah.
All right.
So this, I was gonna

Kevin (31:40):
say fun shorts, but I'll take eliminate pain.

Angie (31:42):
Okay.
Fun shorts is helpful too.
Kevin's got a pair of blueshorts with pink flamingos on
'em.
Fantastic.
Yeah.

Kevin (31:48):
But I don't think that I would enjoy wearing them if.
I still had the pain of ahernia.
No.
maybe eliminating the pain isgood that you started there, but

Speaker (31:57):
I've got my flamingo shorts

Angie (31:58):
instead.
It's all good.
so speaking of that, let go ofthe judgment that you just
placed on Kevin for his flamingoshorts.
Okay.
That's actually number two.

Kevin (32:06):
I don't know.
I believe that was the voice yougave me that I have when I wear
my flamingo shorts.
Was that the impression that youhad?

Angie (32:13):
Oh, I don't think so.
I'm pretty sure, notconsciously.
Okay.
Maybe subconsciously that's justwhat's going on here.
So I don't know.
Maybe I'm judging, without evenrealizing it.
Okay.
number two, way to enjoy runningmore is that you have to let go
of judgment.
So one of the questions againthat I asked on Instagram.

(32:33):
Was, if you are someone thatwants to enjoy running more, why
don't you currently enjoy it?
And one of the answers that Igot, actually, I think this was
multiple answers, said, becauseI'm so slow.
So then my follow up questionis, why does that bother you?
Why does it bother you thatyou're slow and also slow is

(32:55):
relative?
So I'm not going to even say,you know what's slow and what's
not slow, but what are youmaking that mean?
And I think that's really whatwe have to start to examine here
is if you think, I don't likerunning because I'm so slow, is
it because you have judgment outaround yourself?
Is it because you think otherpeople are judging you?

(33:15):
Is it because.
You are trying to get faster andyou haven't been able to, and if
so, what have you been doing todo that?
Have you been consistent withyour running or are you just
judging yourself?
And then when it comes to yourrunning days, you're making
excuses or reasons why?
You shouldn't go out for a run,then it becomes a
self-fulfilling prophecy.
Then it becomes again, we havethis belief, this thought, and

(33:38):
this belief, and I go, I'm,actually go deeper into this
whole idea of mindset and thethoughts, how thoughts and
beliefs affect our results.
In my new secret podcast, whichI'm super excited about, it just
launched this week.
if you haven't.
I listened to that yet, I shouldbe putting the link right in
here, but I don't really knowwhat that link is yet.

(33:59):
So I'll put it in the shownotes.
In the show notes.
Check

Kevin (34:01):
the show notes.
I will

Angie (34:02):
put it in the show notes, and if you're on our email list,
it'll be, I'll be emailing thatout this week as well, so you
don't have to worry about that.
But I have created a new secretpodcast.
Can they

Kevin (34:12):
slide into your dms and get it?

Angie (34:13):
Sure.
Would you like to say, slideinto your DMS again?
Like you're some sort of coolinfluencer.
I nailed that.
Just slide into your dms.
I just really

Kevin (34:21):
wanted to use that phrase,

Speaker (34:24):
so Sure.
You could slide into my dms overon Instagram at real life
runners and just.
Send me the word secret

Angie (34:32):
podcast and I'll send it your way.
How's that?
That's two words.
So send me the words Secretpodcast.
There you go.
What are you, some sort ofgrammar place.

Kevin (34:42):
I ju I was not judging.
All right.
I just, yes, that was two words.

Angie (34:46):
There we go.
Okay.
So anyway, I do go deeper intothis idea.
So if you have these thoughtsabout yourself, if you're
thinking, okay, I'm just a slowrunner.
Or I'm never gonna get better.
I've been working at this for solong and I'm not making any
progress.
Those are all thoughts, andthose are all beliefs, and those
are driving your actions and theresults that you have in your

(35:08):
running.
And so it's really important tostart letting go of judgment and
starting to rewire those.
Thoughts, which is not justthinking positive thoughts.
It's not just about starting totell yourself mantras and be
like, no, I am a fast runner.
I'm a long runner.
I believe in myself.
that's not the way to actuallyrewire your thoughts.

(35:29):
Was that a little like JenniferCoolidge right there?
Did you get that?
I feel like I heard that by thetime you hit the third one.

Kevin (35:34):
Yes.
Yes.
A little bit.

Angie (35:34):
I was a little, yeah.
Yeah.
I didn't even know I had thatimpression.
That was a good one.
We're rocking it tonight, thanksto this fatigue, letting go of
the judgment.
'cause when you're judgingyourself, if you're out on your
run and you're like, oh, I'm soslow.
Ugh, this feels like crap.
ugh, ugh.
All of these, ugh, that what isthat?
That's from like a movie orsomething, right?
Ugh.

Kevin (35:54):
I don't know.
But it opens with, I'm so slow.
So as soon as you tell yourselfI'm so slow, oh, it's the

Angie (35:58):
Saturday Night Live skit.
Ugh.
It's like the Jimmy Fallon.
Sarah.
Sarah that's on Tonight

Kevin (36:04):
Life that was on his show.

Angie (36:05):
Oh, that was on the Night Tonight Show.
Yes, that was on this nightshow.
Oh, I guess I'm just old.

Kevin (36:08):
All righty.
but if you're telling yourself,I am slow, then every time you
look at your watch, regardlessof what the clock says, yeah,
you're going to then interpretthat as slow.
if you then take off and oh, I'mgonna surge this smile, you're
still, if you're saying I'm aslow runner, you're gonna look
down at the watch and be like,oh yeah, that was a slow mile.
whatever the number is, it'sgonna be slow for you.

Angie (36:25):
Yeah.
And so if you had a mean girlthat was running next to you.
Saying that to you, could youimagine how miserable your run
would be if you were literallyrunning next to someone that was
saying that oh, why are you soslow?
I can't believe how slow youare, and just was insulting you
the whole time that you are outon your run.
That's not going to be anenjoyable run, but that is

(36:45):
literally what so many peopleare doing to themselves with
their thoughts in their brain.

Kevin (36:50):
Yeah, if you had a running partner, you would never
actually say those thoughts tothe person that you're running
with, but you say it toyourself.
All the time.
It's the thoughts that gothrough our head.
It's why some people, instead oflistening to the thoughts in
their head, they put on thispodcast or music or something
else that distracts them.
So

Angie (37:05):
we can tell you that you're awesome.

Kevin (37:07):
Yeah, because you are, because you're running.
But instead, people turn thatoff and they're like, oh no.
The thoughts in my head arereally bad.
You've gotta address those.
They're still there.
Even if you turn the volume uploud, those thoughts are still
there.
So it's.
It's beneficial to actuallyaddress those thoughts,

Angie (37:22):
right?
And so by letting go of thatjudgment and starting to address
the mean girl or mean guy inyour head, it's going to start
making you running a lot moreenjoyable.

Kevin (37:32):
Alright then the last section here, big yawn.
I was not, I kinda had toswallow, I think.
Oh.
Oh, I thought

Angie (37:38):
that was a big yawn.

Kevin (37:39):
No, We were talking about this a little bit before, find a
plan that is enjoyable.
Find the aspects of running thatyou enjoy.
And this next line here is gonnabe awkward for a running
podcast.
If you can't find an aspect ofrunning that you enjoy, consider
a different form of exercise.
honestly, like it's.
If there's no aspect of runningthat it's all at all enjoyable,

(38:02):
that might not be your thing foryou.
Okay?
But find what it is that you doenjoy and see if you can figure
out how to maximize that in yourplan.
While minimizing the parts thatyou really don't want to do.
Okay.
Yeah.
Hold on.
Some you can eliminate.
Some you can minimize.

Angie (38:14):
And okay, as a little caveat on your statement there,
which I do agree with, if youthink running is just miserable,
I do think that there's a lot ofother ways that you can get in
shape.
You can get healthy, you can getstrong.
Strength training isnon-negotiable no matter what
you do, whether you're a runneror something else.
But there's lots of other thingsyou can do.
However, if you like the idea ofrain, I know there's a lot of

(38:37):
people that.
Don't necessarily enjoy runningyet, but they really like the
idea of running and they want tolike it.
That, that's where I wouldchallenge you to start to put in
some of the things that we'retalking about here, because when
you start to look at running,like maybe you've just been
doing it in a way that has notbeen enjoyable because you've.

(38:59):
I've been telling yourself, oh,I have to do this in order to be
a good runner, when in realitythat might be an optional thing.

Kevin (39:07):
Yeah.
if you hate running and you'reconstantly telling yourself
you're slow, so you're pushingtoo hard on every single run, I
could see how every aspect ofrunning would be unenjoyable.
Yeah.
Like that in that case.
You might want to try some ofthe things we're suggesting
before you completely give up onit.
If you've tried some of thesethings and you're like,
actually, you know what, runningsucks, then try a different
thing.

Angie (39:26):
Yeah.

Kevin (39:26):
Try something else.
Yeah.
But there are ways to make itfar more enjoyable.

Angie (39:30):
Yeah.
So the, these ways that we'regonna talk about are really ways
for you that if you currentlyenjoy running sometimes and you
wanna enjoy it more, or youreally love the idea of running
and want to enjoy it, like wecan start.
let's talk.
Okay, so let's get on a plan.
Okay.
Every runner we believe shouldbe on a plan, whether that is a

(39:51):
maintenance plan.
if you're doing races and youlike races, get on a race plan.
If there you have other goals,like there's lots of different
types of plans you can be on,but the plan is so helpful
because it just tells you whatto do every day.
You don't have to figure it out,and I'm guessing that.
Most runners want to improve insome ways.

(40:12):
Most people don't want todecline and get slower and
weaker.
I can say that's probably a fairthing to say.

Kevin (40:20):
I'll say that one's fair.
I don't know if necessarilyeverybody, every runner out
there really wants to improve.

Angie (40:24):
Not necessarily.
I think if there's a lot ofpeople that just want to
maintain and I think that'stotally valid.

Kevin (40:29):
Maintain and enjoy the process.
Yes.
Of maintenance.
Yes.
And in that case, that's where

Angie (40:33):
I am.

Kevin (40:34):
There's a whole lot of ways that you can mess with your
training plan.
A lot.

Angie (40:37):
A hundred percent.
And I think, and that'sdefinitely where I like to live.
I like to live in maintenancemode.
do I, I don't really honestlycare about my pace right now.
There was a time and there aphase where I definitely did and
I was trying to get faster.
I was trying to build mileageRight now with my running
journey.
I love what I do every singleweek and going back to enjoying

(40:58):
the process.
I love how many runs I do.
I love that I have a speed runand a longer run and an easy
run.
I like.
Having the flexibility to movethings around.
I like that.
I strength train three times aweek, so I love my routine and
it's okay that I'm not gettingfaster right now.

Kevin (41:17):
Yeah.
and that's this whole sectionhere.
Yeah.
Is figure out what it is thatlike it's enjoyable for you.
Yeah.
It, because it also brings you alevel of satisfaction.
Totally.
Like it is very healthy what youwere doing.
Yeah.
But you're not trying to chaseprs.
At one point you were chasingPRS and it was enjoyable, and
then you kind gotta the hamsterwheel aspect of it.
And it lost the enjoyment.

Angie (41:36):
and then.
COVID happened then too, and all

Kevin (41:39):
races disappeared.

Angie (41:39):
Races went away, and so ster

Kevin (41:41):
wheels just spun wild.
So

Angie (41:42):
then I was ch, I was, doing my own thing and still
challenging myself, which wasfun.
And then I started shiftingfocus more to strength training,
which I really have beenenjoying.

Kevin (41:51):
COVID caused the two of us to go in very different
directions.
you really doubled down onstrength training.
And I was like, a hundred miles,let's do this.

Angie (42:02):
Ultra marathons.
that's when you did your firstUltra Yeah.
Was during 20, like New Year'sEve of 2020.

Kevin (42:09):
Yes.
That was 31 miles.
Yeah.
Loop in the neighborhood, whichI thought was enjoyable.
Yeah, because that's, it was funfor me.

Angie (42:16):
Okay, so let's talk about.
Finding a plan and our processto maximize what you like and
minimize the things that youdon't like, because you don't
need to be putting all thingsinto your training plan,
depending on what your goal is.

Kevin (42:30):
Okay.
So you don't need a long run.
You don't, I'll just, we putthat out there.
You don't have to have a longrun.
If you are training for a halfmarathon or a marathon, a long
run is going to be beneficialfor you.
If you don't have a race on theschedule, there's no running
rule book that says if you don'thave a long run over the
weekend, then you're not a realrunner.

(42:51):
Yeah, okay.
It also, it doesn't have to fitthe weekend.
I've, we've got someone on theteam who does their long run on,
on a Thursday.
Like you can put your long runwherever it fits your schedule
or not have one.
Which takes a whole lot ofpressure off of some people.

Angie (43:05):
Yeah, I agree.
And I think that, again, thecaveat here is that you're not
training for a longer race.
If you are trained for a halfmarathon or above a long run is
very important there.
There's a certain amount ofrunning that you need to do in
order to prepare yourself to dothe thing that you want to be
able to achieve.
But if you're not training for arace right now, like me, you

(43:26):
don't have to have a long run.
Like I have a longer run, but Idon't have a long run that
progresses in mileage everyweek.
I have three to four runs duringmy week.
it's lately it's been more threeand I have like.
Where I do a four mile, a fivemile and a six mile,
essentially.
And that's what I do.
And I like that.
And sometimes I do a little bitless, and sometimes I do a

(43:47):
little bit more.
Sometimes I go up to seven oreight on the weekends.
Sometimes my four turns into athree.
Like it just depends, but I'vegot some flexibility around
that, which I really like.

Kevin (43:56):
But you have four or 5, 6, 1 of'em is longer than the
other one.
I'm saying you could have 5, 5,5.
Totally.
And that is fine.
Yeah.
Like your runs don't have tovary in distance and it's still
going to be fine.
You don't need two speedsessions every week.
that's a classic thing.
I think it came from FrankShorter back in like the
seventies of that.
He was basically like designinga running plan is not that hard.

(44:16):
Put in two hard workouts and onelong run and then fill the rest
in with as much easy mileage asyour body can handle.
Yeah.
That was essentially histraining advice.
You don't have to.
He won the Olympic gold.
Yeah.
You may not be a aiming for thatsame goal.
Okay.
So you don't have to have twospeed sessions because someone
told you that's the best way tooptimize your training.
It might, but if you might be,

Angie (44:37):
but if you like speed sessions, then you can

Kevin (44:40):
Yes.
That's the flip of it is theconverse, if you really enjoy
running fast, you can runstrides.
All the time.
You could put strides ontobasically every run during the
week, and you'd be fine.
I don't think that you shouldnecessarily go out and do these
hard speed sessions every day.
That's too much overload.
We've talked about do pushingtoo hard every time, but you can

(45:02):
put two speed sessions duringthe run.
You're like, oh, I only run fourdays a week.
is two speed sessions too much?
Not if the sessions themselfhave the right amount of volume
inside of it, It might not bebig speed sessions.
There might be a warmup and acool down and a little bit where
you get to play with some funfaster paces.
If that's enjoyable for you.
That should be your trainingplan.
That sounds like a whole heck ofa lot of fun.

(45:22):
Maybe not for me.
You would enjoy that kind of aplan.
That's how I got you intorunning.
Yeah.
You didn't enjoy just going outand running.

Angie (45:28):
No, I did not.

Kevin (45:29):
You didn't, and so I, I've got another one on here.
Every single run you go on couldhave a change of pace to it.
Just because it's an easy rundoes not mean that you can't
change between slightly fasterand slightly slower.
Like you can still go up anddown on every single run.

Angie (45:44):
Yeah.
Which is great.
and I think that this is a lotof things that people don't
realize are quote unquoteallowed, right?
but who's making these runningrules that you're following?
I think that's pretty shorter.
I just said it.
I think that's an importantthing to look at too.
where are you getting some ofthese rules?
Because there are.
Quote unquote best practices fora lot of runners.
But that doesn't mean that's iswhat is right for every single

(46:07):
runner out there.
Okay?
Strength training, I gotta talkabout it.
It's non-negotiable.
You do have to do strengthtraining.
I will say it and I, that is ahill that I am prepared to run
up and down and stand on as longor as hard as I have to.
You have to strength train as arunner.
However, I will admit that thevolume of strength training is

(46:30):
adjustable based on your goalsand your likes or dislikes.
I really like strength training,so I put additional strength
training sessions into my weekthat aren't necessarily aimed at
making me a better runner.
They're just aimed at making mea stronger person, whereas if I
was making a.
Strength program for Kevin.

(46:52):
I'm gonna focus more on thestrength aspects that are going
to really support him in hisrunning, and then ask him if he
wants to do a little bit extra.

Kevin (47:01):
Yeah.
You're not putting any extrastrength into my plan that you
don't think is the requiredstrength for what I want to
accomplish.
Like this, but

Angie (47:10):
also like some of what you want to accomplish is also
just.
Being a strong human.
there's, you've gotta carryboxes like we put inside.
You installed a fence, likethere's a lot of housework and
things that you do too.
And so it's important for you tobe able to be strong without
getting hurt.
So it's not just, it's yes,you're a runner, but you're not
just a runner.
You're also a strong man thatneeds to be strong to.

(47:33):
Pick up our kids that when theyrandomly jump into your arms
without notice, one

Kevin (47:37):
does like to jump on my back all the time.
But

Angie (47:39):
if she did that and you weren't strong enough there,
like you don't wanna throw outyour back, which you know, would
end up actually affecting yourrunning.

Kevin (47:46):
Yeah.
Okay.
So I need enough strength that Ican run as far as fast as I
want.
And catch our kid when she runsfrom across the room and then
just leaps onto me.
Exactly.
Okay.
So I need those two levels ofstrength training.
Exactly.
Which is fine.
And that's why strength isnon-negotiable.
Like you, I was curious if youwere gonna go with my words,
'cause that's what I put down.
Strength is non-negotiable, butthe volume is adjustable.

(48:07):
Yeah.
Completely based off of yourgoals.
Yeah.
What do you need to get out ofstrength?

Angie (48:11):
Yes.
And there is a minimum that isrequired, but I do also strength
that minimum is different foreverybody.

Kevin (48:19):
Yeah.
And I think it's drasticallydependent on.
On your goals and how well andeasily you adjust to strength.

Angie (48:25):
Yes.
And also your injury history andyour bone health and your muscle
health.
And there, there's a lot offactors that, So

Kevin (48:32):
there's a huge factor list that

Angie (48:33):
play into it.
But I would say minimum is twicea week.
And the length of those sessionsis.
variable, but you can get a lotof really good benefits as a
runner with two 30 minutestrength sessions per week.
Like you can probably hit all ofthe muscles that you need to hit
if you, if strength training'snot your favorite thing, and
then add in some like additionalmobility throughout the week as

(48:56):
well, like through some warmupsand some running drills and
things like that.

Kevin (48:59):
If you have an empty gym, you can crank it out in 20,
yeah.
You definitely can.
Yeah.
if you're not waiting foranybody, all the machines are
just available to you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
20 minutes I can knock thisthing out.
Yeah.
I see.
Do I have anything else in here?
You can run almost every day aslong as you're picking
appropriate distances andefforts.
Okay.
Some people love going out andrunning all the time.

(49:21):
We've got people on the teamthat are like, I would like a
planning training plan that hasthree days of running, four days
of running.
We have people that are like,can I run eight days outta the
week?
It's that's a lot of running

Angie (49:29):
eight days a week.
That's my British Beatlesaccent.
That was the perfectopportunity.
That was definitely not British,though.
That was

Kevin (49:36):
not British at all.
No.
but yeah, no, you could've gonethere.
Yeah.
I'm not.
but what I went with is you canrun almost every day.
Okay.

Angie (49:44):
That is Kevin's love language.

Kevin (49:46):
What, running almost every day.
Yes.
But I still, when I feel like mybody needs a recovery day, needs
an off day.
I take it.
And that's, I think, a veryimportant balance.
Yeah.
Because just because I wouldenjoy going out and running
tomorrow does not mean that'snecessarily the best thing for
my long-term health.
So that's the other thing iseven when it's enjoyable

(50:08):
sometimes you need to take theoff day also.
Yeah.
You need to be like, ah, itsounds really fun to do that.
I probably shouldn't.

Angie (50:14):
Yeah, and that's true.
And again, that's knowing yourlimitations and your boundaries
and really understanding yourbody in a way that you can read
your body's signals.
And that's, again, this issomething that we teach inside
of our coaching program, insideof the Running Reconnect method.
We help you reconnect to yourbody and what your body needs
because your body is sendingyou.
Signals all of the time.

(50:36):
And if you ignore those signals,you're just going to end up
fatigued.
You're gonna end up not enjoyingyour runs.
You're gonna end up in pain orillness or being forced to take
time off.
But when you learn how toreconnect to your body and
really then.
Honor it, right?
And actually take those off dayswhen your body is telling you,
Hey bud, we need an off daytoday, or We need some more

(50:57):
mobility work, or We need, yourbody's constantly communicating
with you.
When you learn how to listen toit and actually do those things,
then you don't have to take timeoff.
You can run as far or as long oras often as you.
Really want to.
I would say want is thequestionable word there, right?
Because it's, you might want togo run, it's best for you to
stay in and just sleep.

Kevin (51:19):
Yeah.
But this is the thing is, butyou

Angie (51:21):
want that, right?
Because then that's going tohelp you long term.

Kevin (51:24):
Yeah.
Because the least enjoyableaspect of running is forced
downtime.
Yes.
Forced downtime is the worstaspect of running because it's
the complete.
Opposite of running forceddowntime.
It could that is literally theworst aspect there.
Yeah.
There could be.

Angie (51:39):
Absolutely.
Alright, is there anything elsethat you wanna add in here that
you think people should heartoday?

Kevin (51:45):
literally anything that you can come up with that makes
it fun.
Like new pads, new trails.
Running with people, runningwithout, people running with
music.
Running like whatever.
You're like, that would make itmore enjoyable.
Is that cheating?
No.
Yeah.
Like people are like, oh, youshouldn't run with music all the
time if you find it enjoyable.
Who's stopping you?
Yeah.
There is not running.

(52:06):
There are not, there are norules.
There's not a committee outthere that's nah, that doesn't
count it.
It counts.
Do whatever you find enjoyable.
If you love the various runningoutfits, rock those.
If you enjoy the fun socks I ranwithout a shirt this morning.
That just that made my run.
Honestly, I was consideringtaking a nap, but then I didn't

(52:27):
have a shirt and I was like,actually, this seems like it's
gonna be fun to go out and run.
Yeah.
That was that little thing waspossibly what got me out the
door and not back into bed.

Angie (52:35):
Yeah.
I don't think I've run with ashirt like all summer long
because it's just so hot herethat just having a shirt, even a
lightweight.
Shirt makes running lessenjoyable for me.
Yeah, so fun.
And it used to be the opposite.
So this is the interesting thingtoo.
I just have to add this in here,because running used to be like,
I used to be so self-consciousabout my body, especially my

(52:56):
stomach, that I didn't wannashow it when I, like I was very
self-conscious running, so I.
Was able to get over that andnow it's just so much more
comfortable and enjoyable when Idon't need to wear a shirt.

Kevin (53:06):
I finished like an hour before the sun came up so no one
could see me, so I was fine.

Angie (53:10):
Oh, stop.
Oh, stop.
Alright.
You were gonna, were you gonnaadd something else in here?

Kevin (53:15):
No, just whatever you can come up with that you're like,
actually that sounds really fun.
Then you should do that.

Angie (53:20):
Yeah, exactly.
Alright, so if you guys want to.
Hear more about like how toenjoy running.
We're gonna go, you can checkout episode, I think it was 3 42
and 2 72.
We have a couple other episodesabout like how to bring more joy
into your running.
If you wanna catch my secretpodcast, I will drop that link

(53:40):
in the show notes below thisepisode.
Or again, you can also send methe words, double plural.

Kevin (53:46):
Just slide into those dms.

Angie (53:47):
In the dms at.
At real life runners.
and then if you wanna join our30 day strength strong runner
kickstart, we've got a 30 daychallenge coming up, that is
kicking off September 1st.
You can go over to your runningplan.com and sign up for that 30
day challenge.
Today we're gonna show youexactly how to combine.

(54:08):
Running and strength training ina personalized way that works
for you, because that's reallythe key that you know of.
All of this is yes, you need todo running, you know you need to
do strength training, but howcan I combine both of those
things in a way where theycompliment each other and don't
work against each other because.
Sometimes if you're doing thingsthe wrong way, your running can

(54:29):
work against your strengthtraining.
And your strength training canactually work against your
running.
And we don't want that for you.
We want you guys makingprogress.
We want you feeling good, and wewant you to be able to enjoy
running more.
And that's part of what thischallenge is also gonna give to
you.
It's gonna give you that plan,but it's also going to help you
with the mindset stuff thatwe've been talking about.
Today, it's going to help youwith nutrition and all the other

(54:50):
aspects to help you feel betterand enjoy running more.
So again, you can sign up forthat 30 day challenge
[e-mail].
As always, thanks for joiningus.
This has been The Real LifeRunners Podcast, episode number
423.
Now, get out there and run yourlife.