September 18, 2025 • 48 mins
In episode 427 of the Real Life Runners Podcast, we continue our Core Values series with one of the most powerful keys to lasting success in running—and life: commitment.
Motivation comes and goes. Some mornings you’ll wake up ready to run, other days… not so much. That’s why commitment matters more. It’s the steady anchor that carries you through the days when motivation fades.
In this episode, we dive into Core Value #3: Commitment. We share how staying committed—to yourself, the process, your goals, and even the people around you—creates the kind of consistency that builds strong, resilient runners.
Drawing from our own experiences as runners and as high school cross country coaches, we talk about how commitment shows up on the good days and the hard ones, how it shapes your mindset, and how it ultimately fuels your growth on and off the run.
You’ll hear personal stories, practical insights, and a few challenges to help you reflect on your own running journey:
- What does it really mean to commit to yourself?
- How do you keep showing up when motivation is low?
- Where do commitment and recovery meet?
- And how can commitment to others (and even competition) make you stronger?
By the end of this episode, you’ll see why commitment is the foundation for real transformation—and how deepening your own commitment can help you reach your next level as a runner and as a person.
03:07 Commitment vs. Motivation
05:20 Commitment to Yourself
20:09 Commitment to the Process
24:33 Running Routine and Commitment
26:03 Commitment to Goals and Process
27:26 Balancing Commitment and Recovery
29:20 Commitment to Others
30:04 Morning Motivation Story
34:51 Commitment in Competition
39:46 Mental and Physical Discomfort in Racing
Join the 30 Day Running Reset and get a plan that will help you build a strong and injury-proof body by combining running and strength training in a way that actually works for runners like you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Angie (00:00):
So many runners think that they need motivation to be
consistent or they needmotivation to get out the door.
But today we are continuing onwith our core value series that
we've started over the lastcouple of weeks, and we are on
core value number three.
So today we're talking about.
Why commitment is so much morepowerful and important versus
(00:22):
motivation.
So when you have commitment, youdon't actually need motivation.
So if you're someone that hasthought that you need more
motivation, this is exactly theepisode that you need to hear.
So stay tuned.
(00:56):
What's up runners?
Welcome back to the show.
We are excited to continue ourcore value series with you
today, and for those of you thatmight be new, maybe this is the
first episode you're catchingwith us.
Welcome.
We're glad you're here.
This is number three in ourseries.
So we started a series, weactually started it last week
(01:16):
with number two, and I realizedthat I had already done number
one, but we had have these corevalues.
we are high school cross countrycoaches, and so we do core
values with our team every year.
And so this year we thought wewould bring those to the podcast
to talk about how the corevalues from our cross country
team also apply to us as reallife runners.
And what are the similaritiesand differences between.
(01:38):
A high school cross countryteam, and us as real life
runners
Kevin (01:41):
because there is more overlap than I thought there was
going to be.
Like, when you suggested that wedo this and we go through our,
cross country team values, I'mlike, those are great values for
our cross country team.
But then, as we work throughthese podcast episodes, they're
really great values for us asreal life runners.
Like they're really good ones.
There were some that I'm like,I'm not sure how that's gonna
play out, but they were allworking.
Really great.
(02:02):
because they're trust theprocess.
they're really good just valuesto, to go by.
Whether you're working as on across country team or just for
your own personal growth,they're just good values to live
by.
Angie (02:15):
Yeah.
And I think that's really whererunning likes to mimic life and
vice versa.
We always like to talk, on thepodcast.
Those of you who have been withus since the beginning, we are
coming up on our.
Eight year anniversary.
Wow.
This month, which is insane.
At the beginning of our podcastjourney back in 2017, we used to
do this.
'cause when we had the idea forthis podcast, we said, okay,
(02:37):
let's figure out a way to tierunning and real life together
in each episode.
And so we would talk aboutwhatever the topic was.
And then in, in regards torunning and then say, and this
is how it applies to real life.
Kevin (02:50):
It was awesome.
At
Angie (02:51):
the end of every episode, it was like,
Kevin (02:52):
now we've done an episode on hydration and now in your
real life.
And it was like some of themwere so forced and
Angie (02:58):
so obvious too.
Yes.
God bless you guys that have allbeen with us since the
beginning, or those of you thatfound the podcast and then
decided to go back to thebeginning.
I know there's been a lot ofpeople that have messaged us and
said that they did that.
They found us at like episode200 and something and then went
back and started from thebeginning, which that shows a
lot of commitment, which is whatwe're talking about today.
(03:19):
Perfect segue.
Excellent.
Nailed that.
And speaking of commitment, weare very committed to.
The podcast, clearly we've beendoing this for almost eight
years now, and, so I'm actually,we've actually decided to do
something different.
We've never done this before,but we, As you might notice,
whether this is your firstepisode with us or your 427th
(03:42):
episode with us, we don't runads on this podcast.
And so to celebrate our eightyear podcast anniversary, one of
the things that I would love todo is to.
Ask you to support the podcastbecause a lot of people don't
realize all of the time andeffort and finances that go into
(04:02):
running a podcast.
And this podcast is obviouslyout here for free.
So what I've done, and I've donethis because people have asked
in the past about how to supportthe podcast, and so I decided to
set up a donation.
System.
So if you would like to supportthe podcast, you could go over
to real life runners.com/podcastand you can choose any amount to
(04:22):
donate.
You can just go in, type inwhatever amount, maybe it's five
bucks, maybe it's 10 bucks.
whatever you feel called tocontribute to the podcast as
just a way to say thank you forthe content that we create for
you every single week for thepast.
What's eight times 52?
Lots of weeks there.
It's lots of weeks.
Lots of over 400, 427 episodes.
(04:44):
if that is you, if you want tosupport the podcast, we would be
super grateful.
Head over to real liferunners.com/podcast today, to.
Make your donation.
Kevin (04:53):
Yeah.
We've got extra episodes becausewe're, we haven't hit eight
years and eight times 52 isdefinitely less than 427.
'cause it's 417.
Yeah.
there's been,
Angie (05:04):
but there's been episodes or weeks in the past where we've
done more than one episode perweek.
Like I have, I used to releaseguest episodes as like a bonus
episode for the week.
Yeah, I know.
you
Kevin (05:13):
just, when we started, I don't know, things like when we,
September started
Angie (05:15):
September 28th, 2017.
I know.
that was our published date.
Kevin (05:18):
I know your birthday.
Yeah, I know the girl'sbirthday.
I know our anniversary.
Yes.
And that's pretty much, thoseare my big dates.
Angie (05:25):
Podcast anniversary is 9 28 17.
yeah.
All righty.
Let's talk about commitment.
Okay.
So I like to think aboutcommitment as something that I
don't wanna say is the oppositeof motivation, but definitely.
More sustainable than motivationbecause I think motivation is
one of those traps that a lot ofrunners fall into.
There's so many people thatthink that they just need
(05:48):
motivation.
And I do a lot of freetrainings, in addition to this
podcast, which is for free.
I also do like free challenges,free classes, all sorts of
different free trainingsthroughout the year.
And when people come to thosetrainings, a lot of times I'll
ask them some questions,especially for our challenges
ahead of time.
what are you struggling withright now?
Or what do you wish you had moreof right now?
(06:10):
And so many people saymotivation and.
I would love for this podcastto.
Change the way that you look atmotivation, because motivation
is a feeling and all feelings,it is fleeting.
Just like you are not happy allthe time.
You are not sad all the time.
You have different feelings thatyou feel in any given moment, in
(06:31):
any given day, and motivation isa feeling as well.
It's how you feel in the moment.
Moment.
Kevin (06:37):
Yeah.
So like the same way that youdon't feel happy all the time
and it would feel uncomfortableto try to hold onto happiness at
non happy times.
it would feel really forced andyou'd feel awkward inside'cause
you're just, you're like whiteknuckling happiness.
Yeah.
In unhappy situations, it'sdifficult to force motivation in
(06:59):
very unmotivated circumstances.
When the situation around you isgiving you a whole heck of a lot
of lack of motivation, it isdifficult to bring that out of
essentially nowhere.
Angie (07:09):
It is, and I think that, you bring in happiness right now
and that has been a toughemotion for me to find over the
last couple of weeks becauselike we told you all about last.
Week on the podcast.
we lost our dog a couple weeksago, and that is definitely not
a situation that I'm happyabout.
I hate that this happened.
(07:30):
I hate the way that it happened.
I hate that it happened.
I hate everything around thisand.
I am not happy at all.
And to be honest, it's been hardto find happiness, even in other
things that have typically mademe happy because it is this
feeling of sadness and of griefand of disbelief and sometimes a
(07:51):
little bit of denial and angerand like all the stages of grief
that people talk about.
Those have been, more of theemotions and I try to find
gratitude and I try to find someof the other.
Feelings to get me out of thoseicky ones.
I let myself feel the feelings.
'cause that's really importanttoo, because I think that's one
of the ways that we movethrough.
(08:11):
Life is it's important for us tofeel all of the feelings.
Yes.
Even when they don't feel good.
Kevin (08:15):
Yes.
To feel all the feelings.
Yeah.
Don't just shove them away.
And that's, this is goes rightin line with the motivation is
Yeah.
Don't just shove the unwantedfeeling And throw what seems
like a quote unquote betterfeeling on top of it.
Don't ignore the sadness.
Yeah.
And just be like, no, I'mforcing happiness onto this
situation.
Angie (08:31):
and like you said, and when you're feeling unmotivated,
you know when your body is maybesore or when you are tired and
the alarm.
Rings at five o'clock in themorning.
Yep.
Or if it's cold outside orraining outside or really
freaking hot outside.
Like all these things I thinkare barriers to motivation and
people think, oh, if I just hypemyself up, I can willpower and
(08:52):
get through this and like justforce myself to do it.
And again, that is a feeling andsometimes that works okay.
It's not that is a bad thing,it's just not the way to do this
sustainably.
Whereas when we look atcommitment is a decision.
Commitment is like an anchorthat, or even like a lighthouse
(09:13):
that is guiding you in the rightdirection, even when motivation
disappears.
So going back to the example oftrying to get up early at 5:00
AM I literally just set up aFacebook event for my local
running group, my friends thatlike we meet every Tuesday.
At five 30 in the morning and Ijust set up my little Facebook
event and I looked at Kevin andI said, I really don't wanna
(09:35):
wake up at 5:00 AM tomorrow.
So my motivation for this run ispretty low.
My motivation is going to saystay in bed, but my commitment
is I run at 5:30 AM on Tuesday.
I have a group of girls that Irun with every Tuesday, and I'm
committed to them.
And I've been committed to thisrun for almost.
Eight years.
(09:55):
I think I started this run backin 2017 that I've been doing
this run basically every Tuesdayfor over eight years now, or the
past eight years, which is wildto think about, but there are so
many days that I did not want todo that run.
But the commitment is what?
Got me out of bed.
And that is just simply adecision,
Kevin (10:18):
right?
The, you've got your group thatyou run with.
On Tuesdays, I, if I get in amorning run, it's also I get up
around five and go off andgenerally do the same loop.
I love seeing the same people.
I go off and I run by myself,but I always pass the same group
of people.
Almost every single day.
And it's weird when certainpeople are missing.
(10:38):
Yeah.
They're like, I wonder whathappened too.
And I don't know their names.
Yeah.
But it's the guy that I seehere, it's the woman that I run
down this stretch of the road.
I wonder what happened to themthis morning.
did they, are they out of town?
Did they get sick?
did their motivation waneslightly And their commitment
not bring up to where it is.
I miss plenty of days.
Also, like we've talked aboutthis, sometimes there's a
(10:58):
commitment to taking care ofyourself.
there is a time where you needto be committed to your health.
You, we covered this with likeintegrity is you have to be true
to your core value of health.
Not necessarily I have to get upevery single, like you said,
every Tuesday at five.
Yeah.
What if we were up until twoo'clock this morning?
You know what if something didthat, then you're not doing it
Angie (11:20):
well and that.
When we lost our dog on a Mondaynight and I told my friends I
wasn't coming that TU nextTuesday, right?
Like I mentally could not do itphysically.
I just was completely drained inall the ways.
And so that was a decision notto.
Go that day.
And obviously everyone uncompletely understood.
Kevin (11:40):
But you couldn't have overcome that, that didn't
change your commitment to it.
And I don't think there was anynumber of motivational videos
that No.
You could have watched Uhhuh.
There wasn't like, oh, if wejust turn on the Rocky
soundtrack, then we'll be good.
It could No,
Angie (11:53):
because that would be completely ignoring your
emotional experience.
and that's not what motivationis for either.
But I think that some people tryto use motivation for that.
Kevin (12:01):
Yes, exactly.
I think people.
Force the motivation that,that's my biggest issue is
motivation, is the forcedmotivation.
if you put on gonna fly, now Iget really pumped up, dun.
I'm looking for steps to go runup like this.
To me it's very inspirational,but if you put that on.
Every single morning at five,gimme a few weeks, your
Angie (12:23):
family will move out on you.
Yeah.
Kevin (12:25):
but gimme a few weeks and it's not gonna have its effect
anymore either.
Yeah, And there's gonna be dayswhere I'm like, oh man, I'm so
pumped and ready to go.
Eventually that is notmotivating.
And then you have to come upwith some other new thing to
motivate.
And on days where you reallydon't.
Want that thing to motivate youwhere your commitment says, I
probably shouldn't go out andrun.
I should be more committed to myhealth than going out forcing
(12:48):
the motivation of no, we dothis.
We always get up at five and gois not necessarily the healthy
thing.
It's forcing happiness where youshouldn't be happy.
It's forcing motivation whereyou don't necessarily want that.
The commitment one, it lastslonger, it's more anchoring and
two.
I feel like the commitment givesyou the flexibility that
(13:09):
motivation does not alwaysmotivation.
You get an outside thing and itputs you into, I do the thing
now.
Angie (13:15):
and it puts you into an emotional state.
Yes.
And that's really what you'relooking for.
And so motivation can behelpful.
I think at the beginning.
It can help you start thejourney, but commitment is
what's going to help keep youmoving forward.
That's what's actually going tobe the sustainable thing that is
going to lead to the.
Day in, day out, week in, weekout, year, month in, year in,
(13:38):
year out.
that it takes to achieve thegoals that you want to achieve.
Kevin (13:44):
Yeah.
It's when you start listing likethat and you're like, and day
after day motivation does not dothat.
No.
Angie (13:49):
eight years, think about this podcast, like the
commitment to this podcast.
There have been plenty of weeksand days that we did not feel
like recording a podcast.
Kevin (13:58):
There have been plenty that you took solo.
'cause I didn't have a voice,but we were, you have been that
you were committed to gettingthe podcast out.
Angie (14:04):
because I made that commitment eight years ago that
I wanted to release a podcastweekly.
And that doesn't necessarilymean that we have to, I have to
override myself.
It means that I have, in thepast, I've created episodes
ahead of time so that when wedid have those weeks, I had
something to fall back on.
So that's getting to the idea ofcommitting to the.
(14:27):
Outcome also that you want.
I think there's a commitment tothe process and then there's
also a commitment to the outcomethat you want as well.
But let's jump into kind of howwe can break this down for you
and the different areas that wewanna look at.
Commitment.
So the first one is commitmentto yourself.
And this is following through.
On the promises that you make toyourself, it is not about being
(14:52):
perfect, and this is the sameconversation that we had with
integrity and respect as well.
This is not about perfection.
None of these things mean youcan never.
Break a promise to yourself.
You can never do this.
It just means, again, runninghas given you an opportunity to
see where you might be fallingshort of the things that you
(15:14):
want to be doing or of the waysthat you want to be living your
life and.
Give you an opportunity tochange that.
So it's not about being perfector never getting it wrong, it's
about returning to the path whenyou stumble, it's about
returning to that commitmentthat you made to yourself and
honoring yourself in your goalsby showing up even on the messy
(15:35):
days, even on the days that youdon't wanna be there.
And that's really what running.
Gives us another opportunity todo.
Kevin (15:42):
Yeah, it's commitment to getting the job done as best as
you possibly can, and that mayinvolve deviating from a plan
written in front of you that maysay, alright, I got a workout on
Tuesday.
I got another speed workout onFriday.
I got a long run on Sunday, but.
It's not going to happen.
because of the other things.
I don't have enough recoverybuilt into my life between that
(16:03):
Tuesday and Thursday.
I'm not going to be able to getin that speed session.
But that doesn't mean that,alright, if I can't get in that
speed session, I just, I don'tneed to run on that day.
I'm just, if I miss one day.
I might as well just wait untilthe next week and I'll start up
again.
That's not what commitment tothe to yourself says.
That means if I missed a day orI had a bad workout, I had a bad
(16:25):
race, whatever the thing is, youkeep going.
Like it just keeps buildingbecause the growth and
improvement as a runner, whichthen in my opinion really
directly leads to the growth andimprovement as a human.
Is the compounding the day afterday, the year after year.
So having a bad day, having amissed day does not shut things
(16:46):
off.
It just says, alright, we felloff a little bit.
Now get right back to it.
That's where the commitmentcomes in.
Angie (16:51):
Yeah.
And so you might find languagepatterns.
'cause I always like to look atthe power of words and the power
of our language.
Like we are doing a 30 day resetinside of our membership right
now.
Our 30 day running reset.
If you want in on that.
We're starting the next group onMonday so you can check out all
the information that you needover@realliferunners.com slash
(17:13):
reset.
but we are in week three rightnow of the group that's going
through it and it's.
So interesting to, to talk aboutthe way that our brain talks to
us and the sentences that we useand the power of language,
because a big part of the resetand the shifts that we're making
inside of the membership.
(17:35):
Is starting to become aware ofhow our language affects our
actions and how then of course,our actions are going to affect
the results.
So if you don't have the resultsthat you want in your life, you
have to go backwards and say,okay, what am I doing or not
doing?
And how am I thinking aboutthis?
What am I saying to myself?
And so a simple way that thischange in language can present
(17:59):
itself with commitment toyourself is shifting from, I'll
try.
dot.
I'll try to do, I'll try to runtomorrow.
I'll try to get my strengthtraining in, shifting that to I
will get my strength training.
And that shows a decision, thatshows a commitment.
It's not that you're gonna tryto do something, it's that
you're going to do it.
And I think that's a reallypowerful shift to make.
(18:20):
And I think that there's a lotof people that.
Are afraid to make that becausethey think, then what if I don't
do it?
Then I might be lying to myself.
Then I'm breaking the promises.
So they don't make that strongcommitment to it because they're
already afraid that they mightnot follow through.
Kevin (18:34):
And that's where the, it builds to the next thing that
we're covering here is thatcommitment to yourself allows
you the possibility to fail, andthat's okay.
It doesn't mean.
That you are failing at thething.
It means that day didn't workout the way that you had
committed to, and then you comeback the next day.
that's what I'm saying is it'salways, and then you come back
(18:55):
the next day.
Maybe that day worked out great.
You still have to come back thenext day.
Maybe that day went poorly.
You had a bad workout, bad race.
You had no workout like it.
It all just completely fellapart.
You still come back the nextday.
Whatever happens today, the plancontinues the next.
State, you have to keep moving.
You have to keep going forward.
That's where the commitmentcomes from.
I think you're exactly right.
(19:16):
People are totally afraid tosay, I will.
They put this kind of, cautionout in front of it.
Oh, I'll give it a shot.
I'll try my best.
It's no, just go do the thing.
Yeah.
Or.
Or don't do the thing, learnfrom that, and then move forward
and do it again the next day.
Angie (19:31):
it's do the thing and then see what the result is,
right?
Yeah.
Because I think that peoplethink that the outcome, the
result is going to determinewhether or not they did the
thing.
And that's not true necessarily.
It means that you went out thereand you did it, you just might
not have gotten that the exactresult that you wanted to.
So that takes us to the nextpart, which is commitment to the
process.
So commitment to the processlooks like tr trusting the
(19:53):
training plan.
And not chasing quick fixes.
There's, I feel like we are in aworld right now of just,
immediate gratification andpeople that want the tricks and
the hacks and like, how do I getthe result that I want even
faster.
And running is one of thosethings that just doesn't work
that way.
(20:13):
You have to.
Put in the work, you have totrust the process.
And I think that's one of thebeautiful things about running,
especially in the world that wecurrently live in.
There's definitely ways to getresults faster, and a lot of
that is minimizing the backwardssteps, right?
Like it's, I don't think thatyou can necessarily move forward
(20:35):
that much faster, but there's alot of runners that experience a
lot of setbacks and injuries andplateau and things like that.
So by.
Minimizing those things.
Technically we will get aheadfaster, but it still requires
that you put in the work becauserunning is a long-term practice.
It's not like a one seasonfling.
And if you are listening to thisrunning podcast, if you are
(20:57):
someone that is listening to arunning podcast, I don't think
you are a one and done kind ofrunner.
oh, I'm just gonna run amarathon and check it off my
bucket list and then I'm gonnabe done.
that's not how most of us.
Listening to this areapproaching running.
Kevin (21:09):
we've had people that came in, they wanted to run a
marathon.
Yeah.
But they had a fling with amarathon and then they fall back
on what running also meant tothem.
That's also possible.
Yeah.
Like I feel like we've got thoselisteners, but not necessarily
the I came outta nowhere, neverran before.
Train for a marathon.
I did my marathon and I'm out ofair.
Angie (21:27):
That's what I meant when I said that.
Yeah.
Kevin (21:28):
But I, the other side I actually think is totally part
of the whole commitment.
The commitment to the generalgrowth, the commitment to, I
wonder what my body's capable ofdoing.
That sort of aspect of whatwould it involve to train for a
marathon?
What's that going to look like?
that's a whole, that's a hugeprocess to commit to.
Yeah.
and definitely does not justinvolve quick fixes.
(21:49):
I knew.
The whole like in inside of likesocial media running world that
the excitement around zone twotraining was going to fade.
Because zone two training, it istotally effective, is definitely
not a short term fix
Angie (22:03):
and is so not sexy.
it's not exciting, but peopletried to make it very exciting
because so many people talkedabout it for so long.
Kevin (22:11):
Yeah.
But the, but it's
Angie (22:13):
not fast at all.
Kevin (22:14):
It's a very slow process.
It's.
It's pretty effective, but italso ignores that you need the
other zones and it's actually awhole wide training plan is
probably the best thing for you.
But just the excitement of zonetwo is gonna get you there.
I'm like, it'll get you there,but it's not gonna be fun and
it's gonna take so long to doit.
Yeah.
So I'm like the, you
Angie (22:34):
remember when I tried math training for a week?
Kevin (22:36):
Oh God, yes.
Angie (22:37):
It was a little, it was more than a week.
I'm exaggerating, but,
Kevin (22:40):
but I knew that was not gonna be the thing for you
either.
It was not, especially, I thinkI
Angie (22:43):
lasted like three weeks.
Kevin (22:45):
But especially at the time when you tried it.
No, you could conceivably enjoyit more now because I feel like
you enjoy easy running more now.
I
Angie (22:53):
do, I do.
Kevin (22:54):
But at the time you enjoyed the variety of different
paces and that is not what themath method is.
Angie (22:58):
No, definitely not.
going back to our consistent,our commitment to the process.
Consistency is the big thinghere, and I think that this is
one of the things that in a waydeters people from running and
also attracts people fromrunning.
Like I think it attracts thepeople that like this type of
thing, but also can deter a lotof people because.
(23:21):
Improving as a runner is notalways exciting because you have
to run, you have to strengthtrain, you have to do the easy
runs, you have to fuel there.
There's a lot that can possiblygo into it, and a lot of that is
not that exciting.
Kevin said, going out on an easyrun yet again.
I'm just gonna go get my fivemiles in, or my four miles or my
(23:42):
six miles, whatever it might be.
But that consistency and thatcommitment to the process is
what's going to lead to thelong-term results that people
want.
Kevin (23:50):
Yeah.
as I did last year, I've got thetally marks going on my board
again in my classroom, and aftera couple of weeks of school, it
starts building up a decentnumber of tally marks and
eventually one of the kids willask, Hey, Mr.
Brown, what are the tally marks?
Yeah.
Because that's way more than howmany days of school we've had so
far.
And I say, oh, that's how manymiles I've run since school
started.
And then you can see them, theystart counting and then they
(24:13):
keep counting and they get asort of like quizzical look on
their face.
Somebody helps them add themnumbers up, and then they just,
they pause and they're like, howmany miles do you run a day?
Because they figured that I'mtaking off days in there that I
might have missed a day.
They're like, and then usuallythat's followed by.
When do you wake up and becausethese are valid questions.
(24:34):
Yeah.
If I've got that many tick markson the board and I'm like, I get
up around five and I runsomewhere between seven and
eight miles most mornings and.
It seems crazy and they're like,wow, that's nuts.
But to me that is, I just, I goout and I get my, I run the loop
that I run.
It is just the thing that I do.
I get up this morning, I did nothave a lot of motivation to get
(24:56):
up this morning, but the alarmwent off and I got up and I did
the thing, and I just did thesame loop that I do almost every
single morning.
And because I don't have to putthat thought into it.
I can just go out there and doit.
To me, it doesn't need that muchmotivation to other people.
It might get really boringreally quickly, and they're
like, I would need motivation tocontinue to do that thing.
I think that's where thecommitment comes in of I don't,
(25:18):
because the commitment says thisis what I'm going to do, and
making it the same loop almostevery single time helps it just
be a smooth process that has sofew barriers in my head.
Angie (25:30):
yeah, because your commitment is.
Also it's to the process, butit's also to the goals that you
have.
Like you have a bigger, you havea commitment to your goals,
which is then going to make yougo out and run on, even on the
days that you don't feel likerunning, because those goals are
more important to you than.
Not going out and doing thething.
Kevin (25:49):
That's true.
We've got, we have some kids onthe CrossCountry team, and I
will not name any of them, butwe have kids on the CrossCountry
team that they're, they saythey're fully committed to this,
and I'm like, all right, solet's go off.
We're gonna go get like a normaldistance run and that should be
whatever it is for thatparticular person.
That should be four miles foryou.
That should be five miles foryou, whatever the thing is.
And they come back 20 minuteslater and I'm like, how far did
(26:11):
you go?
They're like, oh, I was feelingpretty tired today, so I only
went two.
that's not what we need today.
Like I get that you get, you'retired today and you're gonna
have to slow down a little bit.
You might need a walking breakinto it, but if the commitment
to the process says you gottabasically stick to the plan, not
if you're so tired, not ifyou're so ridiculously hurt and
(26:31):
aching from the day before, notenough, the stress worth.
Through the roof and there'sother things, but if you just
are tired because we had aworkout yesterday or whatever
the thing is, you still have togo get in the mileage.
You can't be like, I know I'msupposed to do five, but I felt
like two today.
That's not commitment to theprocess.
Angie (26:48):
Right.
But at the same time, we have toalso make sure that we're not
using commitment againstourselves because I think that
can happen too, that people.
Don't listen to their body andthey think that they're being
committed by going out on thedays that they feel ex, like
genuinely exhausted, not just alittle bit tired, but their body
is screaming at them that theyneed more recovery.
(27:09):
Maybe they've got like a littleache and pain that just won't go
away.
It's just it's been there, it'sbeen lingering.
Like your body's giving you allthese signs and you're like, no,
I'm committed.
So you can also use commitment.
There's a shadow side ofcommitment sometimes as well.
When you.
go about it the opposite way,don't you think?
Kevin (27:27):
No, a hundred percent.
I think that one is alsoreflected in the amount of
people rolling into the gymaround, I don't know, January,
for the first three weeks it'spacked.
Why?
Because everybody hasmotivation.
They think it's commitment.
In fact, they may even have somuch motivation that they've.
It's brought about, its form ofcommitment, and they're like,
no, this is my New Year'sresolution.
(27:47):
I'm so committed.
This is the year that I becomethe runner and I complete my
half marathon, my marathon,whatever the thing is.
They've brought commitment toit, and they go so big and so
hard for the first couple ofweeks that they're exhausted and
burnt out, and by the time theyhit February, it's not that
motivation is waned, it's thatthey were so committed.
On days where they needed to becommitted to recovery.
(28:09):
Yeah.
They were so committed toworking out every day that they
literally weren't committed tothe process that involves the
working out on the hard days andthe recovery on the easy days,
they were like, I know I'm sore,but I'm committed to doing this,
so I'm gonna go out and push itagain.
Angie (28:24):
They only committed to the hard days and not also to
the whole thing.
Kevin (28:27):
They missed the process.
They just caught the hard days.
And that's not committed to theprocess.
That's not how the whole processworks.
Angie (28:34):
Yeah.
And so I think this is also likea good segue into our next area
of commitment.
'cause we've talked aboutcommitment to yourself,
commitment to the process.
Then there's also a commitmentto others.
And I want you to tell the storythat you told me before we hit
record today, because this was apart of how.
Kevin honored his commitment torun this morning because in on
(28:57):
the cross country team, we talkabout showing up for your
teammates, as a commitment toother, but in real life there's
also commitment to your trainingpartners, like I've already
talked about with my 5:30 AMTuesday group.
There's.
commitment to your family.
There's commitment to yourcommunity.
Maybe you're showing up anddoing a community race.
There's lots of differentthings, but tell them how this
kind of played out for you thismorning.
Kevin (29:19):
Okay, so I did not re, I was not excited to get up and
run this morning.
The alarm went off at five and.
I immediately hit the snooze onmy watch, which is what I always
do.
It does not mean that I snooze,but I hit the snooze button, not
the off button, and I laid therefor a few seconds and I thought
to myself, I don't want to run.
(29:40):
That was my first thought.
Angie (29:41):
Yes, he does think that too, guys, and think that's a
lot of, so many people look atyou like, does he ever feel that
way?
Yes.
Kevin (29:47):
That was my, he does.
That was my first thought.
I hit snooze.
My first thought was, I don'twant to go run.
And then I had this series ofthoughts, oh shoot, I hit the
snooze button, which means mywatch is gonna buzz again in 10
minutes and that's gonna wakeAngie up.
And that's not okay to her.
Or I have to shut the alarm offon my watch.
(30:09):
In order to do that, I have toturn the watch on and make the
watch go all with a big, brightlight in our dark bedroom right
now, and that's gonna wake herup and that's not okay.
I have to, at a minimum, get outof bed, go to a different room
and shut the alarm off, and thenmaybe try to crawl back into bed
without waking her up.
And by that point I was alreadyin other room.
(30:29):
My running clothes were sittingthere and I'm up and going, but
I was committed to not wakingyou up.
That was part of it.
And that was enough.
I don't know, is that motivationto not wake you up, to be kind
to you.
That was part of it, but it wasalso, it was a commitment I had
to Respecting your sleep.
And respecting you as part of mytraining process also.
Angie (30:51):
Yeah.
And I think that's huge andthat's where, a lot of these
core values overlap, right?
Because a lot of the things thatwe're talking about today, like
we're talking about commitmentto the process.
Last week we talked aboutrespect for the process, and so
they are related, but they're,hopefully, you can also see how
they're.
They're different in a way aswell, and that's where
commitment to others comes in.
(31:11):
It does obviously overlap withrespect for others too, but
commitment to others also showsup as like accountability.
being reliable, being there,doing what you say you're gonna
do, which again is alsointegrity.
It's encouragement, it's liftingothers up when their motivation
dips, when they don't feel likeit.
When I.
Push Kevin outta bed somemornings because I know that
(31:32):
he's committed to it.
Or I'll, maybe I'll just ask himlike, are you gonna go run?
And that question enough isenough for him to get outta bed?
Kevin (31:39):
If you ever ask me, are you gonna go run it is usually
from a place of, your alarm hasgone off and it's woken me up.
Okay.
And I, it's not, it never comeswith like anger in your voice,
but in my head.
I interpret it this way and ithelps me get outta bed.
this is absolutely, maybe everyonce in a while, this is what
(31:59):
she's actually feeling.
Yeah.
But in my head it is.
You jerk, your alarm woke me up.
So you better get up and go runnow.
it better be worthwhile.
And that is not that's never,not at all.
That's never how you push me.
No, you're never like grumpywhen you do it.
You just, you honestly check inwith me and you're like, Hey,
are you going to run thismorning?
(32:19):
But if I interpret as I'm stilllaying in bed debating about
whether I would like to get upand do the thing.
Yeah.
If you ask me that, I like togive you that quality and it
helps me be like, oh, if, oh,that's
Angie (32:34):
fun.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You give that quality to me.
Yes.
Okay.
Kevin (32:38):
that's not how you ask it.
yeah.
But I put that on you of I wokeher up so I better go up and do
the damn thing.
that's so funny.
That's, and it really helps meget out of bed.
Angie (32:47):
That's really funny, so I can be the bad guy for you too.
Yeah, like I tell our kids thisall the time, like I tell our
kids, if there's things that youdon't wanna do or like a
situation you don't want to bein, make me the bad guy.
if you, like your friends wannago hang out and you don't wanna
go do that thing, just make methe bad guy.
Tell'em I'm the one that saidyou can't do it.
if you genuinely just don'twanna go, it's fine.
Kevin (33:07):
You've been the bad guy plenty of times.
Yeah.
You are very good at being thegentle, bad guy in the middle of
an ultra race.
You are both incrediblysupportive, but also.
You have to play the bad guybecause I hit incredibly low
points.
And part of that is on you to belike, alright, you are fine.
(33:28):
You are going to go keep doingthe thing now.
Yeah.
And that's a lot to put onto youand I don't it, you've never had
to like.
Force me back out.
But you don't get to be gentle.
You don't get to be like, oh,it's, I know you're hurting.
come sit down over here.
Like it requires some effort onyour part also, to make sure
(33:48):
somewhere in the, that 50 to 70mile that I would, I'm going to
continue on the next loop.
I'm gonna continue down theroad, whatever the thing is.
Yeah.
Because at that point there is,most things in me are saying
this is the appropriate time tostop.
Angie (34:01):
Yeah, and I think that takes us to our final area of
commitment that we wanted totalk about today, which is
either commitment incompetition, or what I like to
think of as commitment to theoutcome.
we've talked about commitment tothe process, but I also think
there needs to be a level ofcommitment to the outcome that
you want, because commitment canbe giving your best effort on
(34:23):
race day, regardless of theoutcome, but you need to have a
commitment.
To that outcome in order to giveyour best effort, if that makes
sense.
Do you think So you, are youfollowing
Kevin (34:35):
me here?
this is how I'm interpretingthat.
I may be off base here.
Yeah.
because you're way smarter thanI am.
So I'm hearing that as if you'vegot an outcome, it helps you
commit to the process along theway to give yourself the best
chance of getting to theoutcome.
But on race day.
On the day itself, you arebeyond the point of controlling
(34:56):
all the things for the outcome.
Yeah.
At that point, you'reessentially putting in your best
effort.
But you've had in mind throughthe whole process what that
outcome is.
Even on race day, you have inmind what you want that outcome
to be.
Yeah.
But sometimes things go south,sometimes things come up and
you're like, Ooh, that outcomeis not reachable anymore.
And then you're leaning into,I'm still going to show up as
(35:18):
best as I possibly can.
Angie (35:19):
Yeah, it's a combination and this is where it's like a
weird paradox in a way, becausethe outcome has to both matter
to you and not matter to you atthe same time.
Yeah.
Like it's about being committedto the outcome that you want and
knowing the effort that it'sgoing to require to.
Achieve that outcome and alsobeing detached from whether or
(35:41):
not you'd achieve the outcome.
because whether or not youachieve the outcome does not
determine if you did a good job.
It does not determine your levelof success, but you have to be
attached to the outcome enough,I think, in order to give the
appropriate effort that isneeded to achieve it.
Does that make sense?
if, but like you can't let theoutcome.
(36:03):
Determine your success, yourworthiness, your effort level.
Like you, you can still put inthe high quality best effort.
And not get the outcome that youwant.
Kevin (36:16):
Yes.
And I, this is where there'slevels of success.
Yeah.
if you have a clear, objective,numeric race outcome and you
don't hit it, you haveobjectively failed.
But that does not mean that racewas a failure.
Yeah, if every marathon I linedup for, I objectively missed the
number that I was going for.
(36:37):
That does not mean that all ofthose races were failures.
Some of them I was not aspleased with how I raced as
others.
Some of them were phenomenalsuccesses and there were
conditions way beyond mycontrol.
Some.
Were emotional breakthroughs forme.
Some of them I'm like, oh, I letmyself off the hook towards the
(36:59):
end of that one and to me, thatpart where I left my, let myself
off the hook where I'm like, therace got away from me.
That was one where I was notcommitted to the competition
because I said, I don't thinkthat I can get to this outcome
anymore.
Because I'm not willing to be inthis much pain any longer.
I think a lot of people do thatin races.
Yeah.
Is that outcome numerically thatnumerical outcome didn't mean
(37:23):
enough to me that day that Idecided that it didn't mean
enough to hurt that much.
and we were talking with thecross country team today.
'cause we just had a race lastweekend and today was like the
go back over the results of therace.
And a few of them were like,'cause you kept asking them,
what kind of lessons did youlearn?
And they were sometimes
Angie (37:42):
talking to high
Kevin (37:42):
school
Angie (37:42):
kids
is
Kevin (37:43):
like pulling teeth.
they were not giving you a lot.
No.
And some of them gave you someinteresting thoughts on pacing.
Yeah.
But a lot of them gave the ideaof I need to try harder.
And that is a very trickyconcept because Almost every
race you finish, even if you'relike dry heaving at the finish
line, if you think back over it,you're like, I probably could
have pushed harder at thatpoint.
(38:04):
Yeah.
Because if you look back, youcan always see a part where
you're like, yeah, that at thatsection I could have done it
because you weren't exhausted atthat section.
You probably think you couldhave gone harder in the first
half mile because you weren'tdying during the first half
mile.
Yeah.
Angie (38:18):
but then we also sometimes forget, if we did go
harder in that first half mile,like how would you have felt in
mile three?
Kevin (38:23):
Where you already were just dragging in mile three
would've.
You would've
Angie (38:27):
been even
Kevin (38:27):
worse.
Exactly.
So it's tricky and that's why.
I learning how to try harder isvery tough because you're living
in this part where you reallywant to go for that numerical
outcome.
And the level of pain thatrequires, I don't think it's
trying harder, I think it'sbecoming more okay with the
(38:48):
level of discomfort that youjust have to sit at.
I think that is the lesson thata lot of people need to learn
when racing is how uncomfortableit's going to be to get the
number that you want.
Yeah.
And it's often a lot moreuncomfortable for a lot longer
than people are willing toaccept, and that's why people
come up short.
I know.
That's why I came up short inevery marathon, except for, I
(39:10):
wanna say maybe two.
Yeah.
That I'm like, yeah, it was 105degrees.
That might have been why Imissed my time on that one day.
Angie (39:17):
Yeah.
But I think that's also.
We as humans, that's shows themental aspect of running, right?
Like it's that willingness to bein that discomfort both
physically and mentally, thatmen mentally accepting the f.
Amount and the level of physicaldiscomfort that you're feeling
and continuing to put yourselfthrough it.
(39:38):
And that's really whereendurance running and the best
endurance athletes tend toshine.
Kevin (39:45):
Yes.
The people that can live in thatlevel of discomfort.
And find a way to just keeppersevering.
Yeah.
And that's why all the differentevents,'cause runners love to
have this debate of what's themost.
Painful race.
It's, they're all painful, allin a different way.
Because the burn of an 800 runat, world class level where like
(40:06):
men's 800 is going in the lowone forties, but it's a minute
and 40 seconds of burning fromthe gun.
Yeah.
Like you are immediately.
In pain, and you're going tohold that for the next minute
and 30 seconds because you're inpain after about 10 seconds on
like when you're moving thatfast.
It's just painful.
(40:27):
The burn that you get in a 5K isdifferent.
Like it's a level of discomfortthat is more sustainable.
It's not literally, I'm going toshove my hand down onto the
burning stove.
It's, I'm gonna hold it justabove, I'm not immediately
blistering, but this isincredibly painful.
Yeah, but you can hold it therefor a little bit longer.
(40:48):
And it's how do I disassociatefrom that pain?
Do I pull into that pain?
And there's so many strategiesof how you race through these
things.
All races are superuncomfortable.
It's just how that, how yourbody perceives it, how you
mentally perceive it.
I, when I got into the.
The first a hundred I ran, I wasnot mentally prepared to cover
that thing because I'm like,this is such a slow pace.
(41:09):
This is, how is this going tobecome so remarkably difficult?
And after you do it for severalhours, you're like, I think
running seems like the worstidea ever.
I have to lay down now.
Yeah.
Is essentially that's the thingis
Angie (41:21):
you have to figure out a way to keep going.
Yes.
Even though it's.
Slower, quote unquote, slow.
It's,
Kevin (41:26):
it seems slow and it's so much slower than I would race
even a marathon, which I'm outthere for a couple of hours.
It's so much slower than that,and yet I can't seem to go any
faster.
And it's the weirdest sensation.
The
Angie (41:39):
Kevin Shuffle is one of my favorite things, like when
that hits the.
Feel the lightning.
that was one of my favoriteclips of, that video still makes
me chuckle.
Kevin (41:49):
I'm glad it does because I was in excruciating pain at
that point.
Angie (41:53):
That was a little inside joke from Kevin's first a
hundred mile attempt.
That was a hundred
Kevin (42:00):
K effort.
Angie (42:01):
Yeah, that was at mile 50 after an extended break that
where he had to sit in the airconditioning.
We tried to refuel and then hedecided he was gonna keep going
and he just looked like an oldman shuffling.
Oh, it was brutal down the road.
Like that
Kevin (42:15):
was so bad.
My knees wouldn't bend.
My hamstrings were screaming.
I'm like, I can't move.
I'm not running at this.
I can't, like my legs aren'tmoving in a normal fashion.
Angie (42:25):
Yeah.
that's what happens.
Your body just forgets how torun when you're doing that for a
hundred miles, right?
There's gotta be some of thatsomewhere.
Kevin (42:33):
I'm so excited to do it again.
Angie (42:35):
You are interesting human.
So there has to be thiscommitment, to competition, to
competing with yourself becausecompetition, and this doesn't
mean you even have to race.
I think that.
We often look at competition asracing, and I think there's a
lot of runners that don't race.
I haven't raced in a while.
I, I guess I, I still do ourschool 5K every year.
(42:59):
So there is that, that I, it's
Kevin (43:00):
commitment to the community
Angie (43:01):
that is c and to the race.
Like this year or last year,when I ran it, I tried to.
Get one of our girls to give mean out so I didn't have to race
it.
Oh
Kevin (43:11):
yeah, you did
Angie (43:12):
was I think that was last year, wasn't it?
So it might've been the yearbefore, but I was like, come on,
I'll just, I'll run with you.
It's fine.
Like we'll run your pace.
Because then I wouldn't have topush myself and I then decided
that I didn't actually want to.
To give myself that out, like Idid want to go out and commit to
the competition, and thatcompetition wasn't against
(43:33):
anybody else in the race.
That competition was againstmyself and all of the voices in
my head like screaming at meduring that.
Race.
Kevin (43:42):
Yeah.
Because there's always thevoices screaming.
I mean that ultimately that'sthe competition.
Yes, there are other people inthe race, but it is so much a
competition between you and allthe voices in your head
screaming slow down.
I also had the competition for,the freshman religion teacher at
our school, between me andeverybody in her classes that
she had offered extra credit toif they beat me in the race.
(44:03):
Yes.
So I had that level ofcompetition also.
She always checks with me now.
Angie (44:06):
Yeah.
She always, so that freshmanreligion teacher offers a
hundred, what'd she offer?
I think it's a free
Kevin (44:12):
hundred test grade.
Angie (44:14):
Yeah.
If they beat Kevin, which hasnever happened before, which is
fantastic.
there, no, there was one year,right?
yes.
Didn't somebody like the day afwhen you They,
Kevin (44:23):
they have to because there's a negative, like it's a
gamble on their part.
Like they have to tell her thatthey're going to go out and beat
me, and if they don't beat me,then there's like a penalty that
they take.
And so one of the kids on ourcross country team knew that I
had when I was running a hundredmiler, and that the 5K was the
next weekend.
Yes.
So he knew that was not going togo well and that he could.
(44:45):
Definitely beat me.
Yeah.
And so he said, I will take thatchallenge.
And she was like, okay, this isgonna be great.
And, not knowing at all that Iwas going to go race a hundred
miler, and then I sent out amessage to all the faculty, oh,
this is what I'm doing thisweekend.
And she goes, no.
I offered everybody extracredit.
You can't, this is not okay.
Angie (45:04):
Sorry.
No, you have to back out.
That's not gonna work for me.
But yeah, so I think thatultimately.
The big takeaways from thisepisode are, commitment is
better and greater thanmotivation because commitment is
going to lead to sustainableresults.
And commitment is a choice thatyou have control over.
(45:24):
Versus commitment is a feelingthat is fleeting that you can
bring in sometimes, but alsohave a hard time bringing in.
Other times,
Kevin (45:31):
commitment is a choice.
Motivation is a feeling.
Did I say opposite?
You said commitment is both.
Angie (45:36):
Oh, I did.
Yes, you did.
thank you for correcting me.
Commitment is a choice.
Motivation is a feeling.
So after listening to this,maybe just think about an area
where you might need to recommitright now.
And maybe the answer is, I'mdoing really great with my
commitment.
I feel very solid with my levelof commitment, to myself, to the
process, to others, tocompetition, whatever that might
(45:56):
be.
and maybe.
See again, opportunity forgrowth.
That's what running is.
Running gives us an opportunityand a lens where we can start to
look at ourselves and look atwhere we are and at different
areas of, in different areas ofour life and.
Decide how we want to grow andimprove on those things as well.
(46:16):
Yeah,
Kevin (46:17):
that's beautiful.
Good.
Good summary.
Angie (46:18):
Good summary.
All right, so join us for ournext episode where we'll be
addressing core value numberfour.
I wonder what it is.
Kevin (46:27):
Me too.
'cause I forget what number fourone is.
I know what number five is.
I forget number four.
Angie (46:32):
Four begins with an R.
Excellent.
All right.
So as always, thanks guys forjoining us.
I would love for you to leave usa review on Apple Podcasts or on
Spotify and share this episodeor this podcast with other
people so that we can help morerunners to feel strong, feel
empowered, and run their life.
And as always, this has been theReal Life Runners podcast,
(46:52):
episode number 427.
Now, get out there and run yourlife.
So many runners think that they need motivation to be
consistent or they needmotivation to get out the door.
But today we are continuing onwith our core value series that
we've started over the lastcouple of weeks, and we are on
core value number three.
So today we're talking about.
Why commitment is so much morepowerful and important versus
(00:22):
motivation.
So when you have commitment, youdon't actually need motivation.
So if you're someone that hasthought that you need more
motivation, this is exactly theepisode that you need to hear.
So stay tuned.
(00:56):
What's up runners?
Welcome back to the show.
We are excited to continue ourcore value series with you
today, and for those of you thatmight be new, maybe this is the
first episode you're catchingwith us.
Welcome.
We're glad you're here.
This is number three in ourseries.
So we started a series, weactually started it last week
(01:16):
with number two, and I realizedthat I had already done number
one, but we had have these corevalues.
we are high school cross countrycoaches, and so we do core
values with our team every year.
And so this year we thought wewould bring those to the podcast
to talk about how the corevalues from our cross country
team also apply to us as reallife runners.
And what are the similaritiesand differences between.
(01:38):
A high school cross countryteam, and us as real life
runners
Kevin (01:41):
because there is more overlap than I thought there was
going to be.
Like, when you suggested that wedo this and we go through our,
cross country team values, I'mlike, those are great values for
our cross country team.
But then, as we work throughthese podcast episodes, they're
really great values for us asreal life runners.
Like they're really good ones.
There were some that I'm like,I'm not sure how that's gonna
play out, but they were allworking.
Really great.
(02:02):
because they're trust theprocess.
they're really good just valuesto, to go by.
Whether you're working as on across country team or just for
your own personal growth,they're just good values to live
by.
Angie (02:15):
Yeah.
And I think that's really whererunning likes to mimic life and
vice versa.
We always like to talk, on thepodcast.
Those of you who have been withus since the beginning, we are
coming up on our.
Eight year anniversary.
Wow.
This month, which is insane.
At the beginning of our podcastjourney back in 2017, we used to
do this.
'cause when we had the idea forthis podcast, we said, okay,
(02:37):
let's figure out a way to tierunning and real life together
in each episode.
And so we would talk aboutwhatever the topic was.
And then in, in regards torunning and then say, and this
is how it applies to real life.
Kevin (02:50):
It was awesome.
At
Angie (02:51):
the end of every episode, it was like,
Kevin (02:52):
now we've done an episode on hydration and now in your
real life.
And it was like some of themwere so forced and
Angie (02:58):
so obvious too.
Yes.
God bless you guys that have allbeen with us since the
beginning, or those of you thatfound the podcast and then
decided to go back to thebeginning.
I know there's been a lot ofpeople that have messaged us and
said that they did that.
They found us at like episode200 and something and then went
back and started from thebeginning, which that shows a
lot of commitment, which is whatwe're talking about today.
(03:19):
Perfect segue.
Excellent.
Nailed that.
And speaking of commitment, weare very committed to.
The podcast, clearly we've beendoing this for almost eight
years now, and, so I'm actually,we've actually decided to do
something different.
We've never done this before,but we, As you might notice,
whether this is your firstepisode with us or your 427th
(03:42):
episode with us, we don't runads on this podcast.
And so to celebrate our eightyear podcast anniversary, one of
the things that I would love todo is to.
Ask you to support the podcastbecause a lot of people don't
realize all of the time andeffort and finances that go into
(04:02):
running a podcast.
And this podcast is obviouslyout here for free.
So what I've done, and I've donethis because people have asked
in the past about how to supportthe podcast, and so I decided to
set up a donation.
System.
So if you would like to supportthe podcast, you could go over
to real life runners.com/podcastand you can choose any amount to
(04:22):
donate.
You can just go in, type inwhatever amount, maybe it's five
bucks, maybe it's 10 bucks.
whatever you feel called tocontribute to the podcast as
just a way to say thank you forthe content that we create for
you every single week for thepast.
What's eight times 52?
Lots of weeks there.
It's lots of weeks.
Lots of over 400, 427 episodes.
(04:44):
if that is you, if you want tosupport the podcast, we would be
super grateful.
Head over to real liferunners.com/podcast today, to.
Make your donation.
Kevin (04:53):
Yeah.
We've got extra episodes becausewe're, we haven't hit eight
years and eight times 52 isdefinitely less than 427.
'cause it's 417.
Yeah.
there's been,
Angie (05:04):
but there's been episodes or weeks in the past where we've
done more than one episode perweek.
Like I have, I used to releaseguest episodes as like a bonus
episode for the week.
Yeah, I know.
you
Kevin (05:13):
just, when we started, I don't know, things like when we,
September started
Angie (05:15):
September 28th, 2017.
I know.
that was our published date.
Kevin (05:18):
I know your birthday.
Yeah, I know the girl'sbirthday.
I know our anniversary.
Yes.
And that's pretty much, thoseare my big dates.
Angie (05:25):
Podcast anniversary is 9 28 17.
yeah.
All righty.
Let's talk about commitment.
Okay.
So I like to think aboutcommitment as something that I
don't wanna say is the oppositeof motivation, but definitely.
More sustainable than motivationbecause I think motivation is
one of those traps that a lot ofrunners fall into.
There's so many people thatthink that they just need
(05:48):
motivation.
And I do a lot of freetrainings, in addition to this
podcast, which is for free.
I also do like free challenges,free classes, all sorts of
different free trainingsthroughout the year.
And when people come to thosetrainings, a lot of times I'll
ask them some questions,especially for our challenges
ahead of time.
what are you struggling withright now?
Or what do you wish you had moreof right now?
(06:10):
And so many people saymotivation and.
I would love for this podcastto.
Change the way that you look atmotivation, because motivation
is a feeling and all feelings,it is fleeting.
Just like you are not happy allthe time.
You are not sad all the time.
You have different feelings thatyou feel in any given moment, in
(06:31):
any given day, and motivation isa feeling as well.
It's how you feel in the moment.
Moment.
Kevin (06:37):
Yeah.
So like the same way that youdon't feel happy all the time
and it would feel uncomfortableto try to hold onto happiness at
non happy times.
it would feel really forced andyou'd feel awkward inside'cause
you're just, you're like whiteknuckling happiness.
Yeah.
In unhappy situations, it'sdifficult to force motivation in
(06:59):
very unmotivated circumstances.
When the situation around you isgiving you a whole heck of a lot
of lack of motivation, it isdifficult to bring that out of
essentially nowhere.
Angie (07:09):
It is, and I think that, you bring in happiness right now
and that has been a toughemotion for me to find over the
last couple of weeks becauselike we told you all about last.
Week on the podcast.
we lost our dog a couple weeksago, and that is definitely not
a situation that I'm happyabout.
I hate that this happened.
(07:30):
I hate the way that it happened.
I hate that it happened.
I hate everything around thisand.
I am not happy at all.
And to be honest, it's been hardto find happiness, even in other
things that have typically mademe happy because it is this
feeling of sadness and of griefand of disbelief and sometimes a
(07:51):
little bit of denial and angerand like all the stages of grief
that people talk about.
Those have been, more of theemotions and I try to find
gratitude and I try to find someof the other.
Feelings to get me out of thoseicky ones.
I let myself feel the feelings.
'cause that's really importanttoo, because I think that's one
of the ways that we movethrough.
(08:11):
Life is it's important for us tofeel all of the feelings.
Yes.
Even when they don't feel good.
Kevin (08:15):
Yes.
To feel all the feelings.
Yeah.
Don't just shove them away.
And that's, this is goes rightin line with the motivation is
Yeah.
Don't just shove the unwantedfeeling And throw what seems
like a quote unquote betterfeeling on top of it.
Don't ignore the sadness.
Yeah.
And just be like, no, I'mforcing happiness onto this
situation.
Angie (08:31):
and like you said, and when you're feeling unmotivated,
you know when your body is maybesore or when you are tired and
the alarm.
Rings at five o'clock in themorning.
Yep.
Or if it's cold outside orraining outside or really
freaking hot outside.
Like all these things I thinkare barriers to motivation and
people think, oh, if I just hypemyself up, I can willpower and
(08:52):
get through this and like justforce myself to do it.
And again, that is a feeling andsometimes that works okay.
It's not that is a bad thing,it's just not the way to do this
sustainably.
Whereas when we look atcommitment is a decision.
Commitment is like an anchorthat, or even like a lighthouse
(09:13):
that is guiding you in the rightdirection, even when motivation
disappears.
So going back to the example oftrying to get up early at 5:00
AM I literally just set up aFacebook event for my local
running group, my friends thatlike we meet every Tuesday.
At five 30 in the morning and Ijust set up my little Facebook
event and I looked at Kevin andI said, I really don't wanna
(09:35):
wake up at 5:00 AM tomorrow.
So my motivation for this run ispretty low.
My motivation is going to saystay in bed, but my commitment
is I run at 5:30 AM on Tuesday.
I have a group of girls that Irun with every Tuesday, and I'm
committed to them.
And I've been committed to thisrun for almost.
Eight years.
(09:55):
I think I started this run backin 2017 that I've been doing
this run basically every Tuesdayfor over eight years now, or the
past eight years, which is wildto think about, but there are so
many days that I did not want todo that run.
But the commitment is what?
Got me out of bed.
And that is just simply adecision,
Kevin (10:18):
right?
The, you've got your group thatyou run with.
On Tuesdays, I, if I get in amorning run, it's also I get up
around five and go off andgenerally do the same loop.
I love seeing the same people.
I go off and I run by myself,but I always pass the same group
of people.
Almost every single day.
And it's weird when certainpeople are missing.
(10:38):
Yeah.
They're like, I wonder whathappened too.
And I don't know their names.
Yeah.
But it's the guy that I seehere, it's the woman that I run
down this stretch of the road.
I wonder what happened to themthis morning.
did they, are they out of town?
Did they get sick?
did their motivation waneslightly And their commitment
not bring up to where it is.
I miss plenty of days.
Also, like we've talked aboutthis, sometimes there's a
(10:58):
commitment to taking care ofyourself.
there is a time where you needto be committed to your health.
You, we covered this with likeintegrity is you have to be true
to your core value of health.
Not necessarily I have to get upevery single, like you said,
every Tuesday at five.
Yeah.
What if we were up until twoo'clock this morning?
You know what if something didthat, then you're not doing it
Angie (11:20):
well and that.
When we lost our dog on a Mondaynight and I told my friends I
wasn't coming that TU nextTuesday, right?
Like I mentally could not do itphysically.
I just was completely drained inall the ways.
And so that was a decision notto.
Go that day.
And obviously everyone uncompletely understood.
Kevin (11:40):
But you couldn't have overcome that, that didn't
change your commitment to it.
And I don't think there was anynumber of motivational videos
that No.
You could have watched Uhhuh.
There wasn't like, oh, if wejust turn on the Rocky
soundtrack, then we'll be good.
It could No,
Angie (11:53):
because that would be completely ignoring your
emotional experience.
and that's not what motivationis for either.
But I think that some people tryto use motivation for that.
Kevin (12:01):
Yes, exactly.
I think people.
Force the motivation that,that's my biggest issue is
motivation, is the forcedmotivation.
if you put on gonna fly, now Iget really pumped up, dun.
I'm looking for steps to go runup like this.
To me it's very inspirational,but if you put that on.
Every single morning at five,gimme a few weeks, your
Angie (12:23):
family will move out on you.
Yeah.
Kevin (12:25):
but gimme a few weeks and it's not gonna have its effect
anymore either.
Yeah, And there's gonna be dayswhere I'm like, oh man, I'm so
pumped and ready to go.
Eventually that is notmotivating.
And then you have to come upwith some other new thing to
motivate.
And on days where you reallydon't.
Want that thing to motivate youwhere your commitment says, I
probably shouldn't go out andrun.
I should be more committed to myhealth than going out forcing
(12:48):
the motivation of no, we dothis.
We always get up at five and gois not necessarily the healthy
thing.
It's forcing happiness where youshouldn't be happy.
It's forcing motivation whereyou don't necessarily want that.
The commitment one, it lastslonger, it's more anchoring and
two.
I feel like the commitment givesyou the flexibility that
(13:09):
motivation does not alwaysmotivation.
You get an outside thing and itputs you into, I do the thing
now.
Angie (13:15):
and it puts you into an emotional state.
Yes.
And that's really what you'relooking for.
And so motivation can behelpful.
I think at the beginning.
It can help you start thejourney, but commitment is
what's going to help keep youmoving forward.
That's what's actually going tobe the sustainable thing that is
going to lead to the.
Day in, day out, week in, weekout, year, month in, year in,
(13:38):
year out.
that it takes to achieve thegoals that you want to achieve.
Kevin (13:44):
Yeah.
It's when you start listing likethat and you're like, and day
after day motivation does not dothat.
No.
Angie (13:49):
eight years, think about this podcast, like the
commitment to this podcast.
There have been plenty of weeksand days that we did not feel
like recording a podcast.
Kevin (13:58):
There have been plenty that you took solo.
'cause I didn't have a voice,but we were, you have been that
you were committed to gettingthe podcast out.
Angie (14:04):
because I made that commitment eight years ago that
I wanted to release a podcastweekly.
And that doesn't necessarilymean that we have to, I have to
override myself.
It means that I have, in thepast, I've created episodes
ahead of time so that when wedid have those weeks, I had
something to fall back on.
So that's getting to the idea ofcommitting to the.
(14:27):
Outcome also that you want.
I think there's a commitment tothe process and then there's
also a commitment to the outcomethat you want as well.
But let's jump into kind of howwe can break this down for you
and the different areas that wewanna look at.
Commitment.
So the first one is commitmentto yourself.
And this is following through.
On the promises that you make toyourself, it is not about being
(14:52):
perfect, and this is the sameconversation that we had with
integrity and respect as well.
This is not about perfection.
None of these things mean youcan never.
Break a promise to yourself.
You can never do this.
It just means, again, runninghas given you an opportunity to
see where you might be fallingshort of the things that you
(15:14):
want to be doing or of the waysthat you want to be living your
life and.
Give you an opportunity tochange that.
So it's not about being perfector never getting it wrong, it's
about returning to the path whenyou stumble, it's about
returning to that commitmentthat you made to yourself and
honoring yourself in your goalsby showing up even on the messy
(15:35):
days, even on the days that youdon't wanna be there.
And that's really what running.
Gives us another opportunity todo.
Kevin (15:42):
Yeah, it's commitment to getting the job done as best as
you possibly can, and that mayinvolve deviating from a plan
written in front of you that maysay, alright, I got a workout on
Tuesday.
I got another speed workout onFriday.
I got a long run on Sunday, but.
It's not going to happen.
because of the other things.
I don't have enough recoverybuilt into my life between that
(16:03):
Tuesday and Thursday.
I'm not going to be able to getin that speed session.
But that doesn't mean that,alright, if I can't get in that
speed session, I just, I don'tneed to run on that day.
I'm just, if I miss one day.
I might as well just wait untilthe next week and I'll start up
again.
That's not what commitment tothe to yourself says.
That means if I missed a day orI had a bad workout, I had a bad
(16:25):
race, whatever the thing is, youkeep going.
Like it just keeps buildingbecause the growth and
improvement as a runner, whichthen in my opinion really
directly leads to the growth andimprovement as a human.
Is the compounding the day afterday, the year after year.
So having a bad day, having amissed day does not shut things
(16:46):
off.
It just says, alright, we felloff a little bit.
Now get right back to it.
That's where the commitmentcomes in.
Angie (16:51):
Yeah.
And so you might find languagepatterns.
'cause I always like to look atthe power of words and the power
of our language.
Like we are doing a 30 day resetinside of our membership right
now.
Our 30 day running reset.
If you want in on that.
We're starting the next group onMonday so you can check out all
the information that you needover@realliferunners.com slash
(17:13):
reset.
but we are in week three rightnow of the group that's going
through it and it's.
So interesting to, to talk aboutthe way that our brain talks to
us and the sentences that we useand the power of language,
because a big part of the resetand the shifts that we're making
inside of the membership.
(17:35):
Is starting to become aware ofhow our language affects our
actions and how then of course,our actions are going to affect
the results.
So if you don't have the resultsthat you want in your life, you
have to go backwards and say,okay, what am I doing or not
doing?
And how am I thinking aboutthis?
What am I saying to myself?
And so a simple way that thischange in language can present
(17:59):
itself with commitment toyourself is shifting from, I'll
try.
dot.
I'll try to do, I'll try to runtomorrow.
I'll try to get my strengthtraining in, shifting that to I
will get my strength training.
And that shows a decision, thatshows a commitment.
It's not that you're gonna tryto do something, it's that
you're going to do it.
And I think that's a reallypowerful shift to make.
(18:20):
And I think that there's a lotof people that.
Are afraid to make that becausethey think, then what if I don't
do it?
Then I might be lying to myself.
Then I'm breaking the promises.
So they don't make that strongcommitment to it because they're
already afraid that they mightnot follow through.
Kevin (18:34):
And that's where the, it builds to the next thing that
we're covering here is thatcommitment to yourself allows
you the possibility to fail, andthat's okay.
It doesn't mean.
That you are failing at thething.
It means that day didn't workout the way that you had
committed to, and then you comeback the next day.
that's what I'm saying is it'salways, and then you come back
(18:55):
the next day.
Maybe that day worked out great.
You still have to come back thenext day.
Maybe that day went poorly.
You had a bad workout, bad race.
You had no workout like it.
It all just completely fellapart.
You still come back the nextday.
Whatever happens today, the plancontinues the next.
State, you have to keep moving.
You have to keep going forward.
That's where the commitmentcomes from.
I think you're exactly right.
(19:16):
People are totally afraid tosay, I will.
They put this kind of, cautionout in front of it.
Oh, I'll give it a shot.
I'll try my best.
It's no, just go do the thing.
Yeah.
Or.
Or don't do the thing, learnfrom that, and then move forward
and do it again the next day.
Angie (19:31):
it's do the thing and then see what the result is,
right?
Yeah.
Because I think that peoplethink that the outcome, the
result is going to determinewhether or not they did the
thing.
And that's not true necessarily.
It means that you went out thereand you did it, you just might
not have gotten that the exactresult that you wanted to.
So that takes us to the nextpart, which is commitment to the
process.
So commitment to the processlooks like tr trusting the
(19:53):
training plan.
And not chasing quick fixes.
There's, I feel like we are in aworld right now of just,
immediate gratification andpeople that want the tricks and
the hacks and like, how do I getthe result that I want even
faster.
And running is one of thosethings that just doesn't work
that way.
(20:13):
You have to.
Put in the work, you have totrust the process.
And I think that's one of thebeautiful things about running,
especially in the world that wecurrently live in.
There's definitely ways to getresults faster, and a lot of
that is minimizing the backwardssteps, right?
Like it's, I don't think thatyou can necessarily move forward
(20:35):
that much faster, but there's alot of runners that experience a
lot of setbacks and injuries andplateau and things like that.
So by.
Minimizing those things.
Technically we will get aheadfaster, but it still requires
that you put in the work becauserunning is a long-term practice.
It's not like a one seasonfling.
And if you are listening to thisrunning podcast, if you are
(20:57):
someone that is listening to arunning podcast, I don't think
you are a one and done kind ofrunner.
oh, I'm just gonna run amarathon and check it off my
bucket list and then I'm gonnabe done.
that's not how most of us.
Listening to this areapproaching running.
Kevin (21:09):
we've had people that came in, they wanted to run a
marathon.
Yeah.
But they had a fling with amarathon and then they fall back
on what running also meant tothem.
That's also possible.
Yeah.
Like I feel like we've got thoselisteners, but not necessarily
the I came outta nowhere, neverran before.
Train for a marathon.
I did my marathon and I'm out ofair.
Angie (21:27):
That's what I meant when I said that.
Yeah.
Kevin (21:28):
But I, the other side I actually think is totally part
of the whole commitment.
The commitment to the generalgrowth, the commitment to, I
wonder what my body's capable ofdoing.
That sort of aspect of whatwould it involve to train for a
marathon?
What's that going to look like?
that's a whole, that's a hugeprocess to commit to.
Yeah.
and definitely does not justinvolve quick fixes.
(21:49):
I knew.
The whole like in inside of likesocial media running world that
the excitement around zone twotraining was going to fade.
Because zone two training, it istotally effective, is definitely
not a short term fix
Angie (22:03):
and is so not sexy.
it's not exciting, but peopletried to make it very exciting
because so many people talkedabout it for so long.
Kevin (22:11):
Yeah.
But the, but it's
Angie (22:13):
not fast at all.
Kevin (22:14):
It's a very slow process.
It's.
It's pretty effective, but italso ignores that you need the
other zones and it's actually awhole wide training plan is
probably the best thing for you.
But just the excitement of zonetwo is gonna get you there.
I'm like, it'll get you there,but it's not gonna be fun and
it's gonna take so long to doit.
Yeah.
So I'm like the, you
Angie (22:34):
remember when I tried math training for a week?
Kevin (22:36):
Oh God, yes.
Angie (22:37):
It was a little, it was more than a week.
I'm exaggerating, but,
Kevin (22:40):
but I knew that was not gonna be the thing for you
either.
It was not, especially, I thinkI
Angie (22:43):
lasted like three weeks.
Kevin (22:45):
But especially at the time when you tried it.
No, you could conceivably enjoyit more now because I feel like
you enjoy easy running more now.
I
Angie (22:53):
do, I do.
Kevin (22:54):
But at the time you enjoyed the variety of different
paces and that is not what themath method is.
Angie (22:58):
No, definitely not.
going back to our consistent,our commitment to the process.
Consistency is the big thinghere, and I think that this is
one of the things that in a waydeters people from running and
also attracts people fromrunning.
Like I think it attracts thepeople that like this type of
thing, but also can deter a lotof people because.
(23:21):
Improving as a runner is notalways exciting because you have
to run, you have to strengthtrain, you have to do the easy
runs, you have to fuel there.
There's a lot that can possiblygo into it, and a lot of that is
not that exciting.
Kevin said, going out on an easyrun yet again.
I'm just gonna go get my fivemiles in, or my four miles or my
(23:42):
six miles, whatever it might be.
But that consistency and thatcommitment to the process is
what's going to lead to thelong-term results that people
want.
Kevin (23:50):
Yeah.
as I did last year, I've got thetally marks going on my board
again in my classroom, and aftera couple of weeks of school, it
starts building up a decentnumber of tally marks and
eventually one of the kids willask, Hey, Mr.
Brown, what are the tally marks?
Yeah.
Because that's way more than howmany days of school we've had so
far.
And I say, oh, that's how manymiles I've run since school
started.
And then you can see them, theystart counting and then they
(24:13):
keep counting and they get asort of like quizzical look on
their face.
Somebody helps them add themnumbers up, and then they just,
they pause and they're like, howmany miles do you run a day?
Because they figured that I'mtaking off days in there that I
might have missed a day.
They're like, and then usuallythat's followed by.
When do you wake up and becausethese are valid questions.
(24:34):
Yeah.
If I've got that many tick markson the board and I'm like, I get
up around five and I runsomewhere between seven and
eight miles most mornings and.
It seems crazy and they're like,wow, that's nuts.
But to me that is, I just, I goout and I get my, I run the loop
that I run.
It is just the thing that I do.
I get up this morning, I did nothave a lot of motivation to get
(24:56):
up this morning, but the alarmwent off and I got up and I did
the thing, and I just did thesame loop that I do almost every
single morning.
And because I don't have to putthat thought into it.
I can just go out there and doit.
To me, it doesn't need that muchmotivation to other people.
It might get really boringreally quickly, and they're
like, I would need motivation tocontinue to do that thing.
I think that's where thecommitment comes in of I don't,
(25:18):
because the commitment says thisis what I'm going to do, and
making it the same loop almostevery single time helps it just
be a smooth process that has sofew barriers in my head.
Angie (25:30):
yeah, because your commitment is.
Also it's to the process, butit's also to the goals that you
have.
Like you have a bigger, you havea commitment to your goals,
which is then going to make yougo out and run on, even on the
days that you don't feel likerunning, because those goals are
more important to you than.
Not going out and doing thething.
Kevin (25:49):
That's true.
We've got, we have some kids onthe CrossCountry team, and I
will not name any of them, butwe have kids on the CrossCountry
team that they're, they saythey're fully committed to this,
and I'm like, all right, solet's go off.
We're gonna go get like a normaldistance run and that should be
whatever it is for thatparticular person.
That should be four miles foryou.
That should be five miles foryou, whatever the thing is.
And they come back 20 minuteslater and I'm like, how far did
(26:11):
you go?
They're like, oh, I was feelingpretty tired today, so I only
went two.
that's not what we need today.
Like I get that you get, you'retired today and you're gonna
have to slow down a little bit.
You might need a walking breakinto it, but if the commitment
to the process says you gottabasically stick to the plan, not
if you're so tired, not ifyou're so ridiculously hurt and
(26:31):
aching from the day before, notenough, the stress worth.
Through the roof and there'sother things, but if you just
are tired because we had aworkout yesterday or whatever
the thing is, you still have togo get in the mileage.
You can't be like, I know I'msupposed to do five, but I felt
like two today.
That's not commitment to theprocess.
Angie (26:48):
Right.
But at the same time, we have toalso make sure that we're not
using commitment againstourselves because I think that
can happen too, that people.
Don't listen to their body andthey think that they're being
committed by going out on thedays that they feel ex, like
genuinely exhausted, not just alittle bit tired, but their body
is screaming at them that theyneed more recovery.
(27:09):
Maybe they've got like a littleache and pain that just won't go
away.
It's just it's been there, it'sbeen lingering.
Like your body's giving you allthese signs and you're like, no,
I'm committed.
So you can also use commitment.
There's a shadow side ofcommitment sometimes as well.
When you.
go about it the opposite way,don't you think?
Kevin (27:27):
No, a hundred percent.
I think that one is alsoreflected in the amount of
people rolling into the gymaround, I don't know, January,
for the first three weeks it'spacked.
Why?
Because everybody hasmotivation.
They think it's commitment.
In fact, they may even have somuch motivation that they've.
It's brought about, its form ofcommitment, and they're like,
no, this is my New Year'sresolution.
(27:47):
I'm so committed.
This is the year that I becomethe runner and I complete my
half marathon, my marathon,whatever the thing is.
They've brought commitment toit, and they go so big and so
hard for the first couple ofweeks that they're exhausted and
burnt out, and by the time theyhit February, it's not that
motivation is waned, it's thatthey were so committed.
On days where they needed to becommitted to recovery.
(28:09):
Yeah.
They were so committed toworking out every day that they
literally weren't committed tothe process that involves the
working out on the hard days andthe recovery on the easy days,
they were like, I know I'm sore,but I'm committed to doing this,
so I'm gonna go out and push itagain.
Angie (28:24):
They only committed to the hard days and not also to
the whole thing.
Kevin (28:27):
They missed the process.
They just caught the hard days.
And that's not committed to theprocess.
That's not how the whole processworks.
Angie (28:34):
Yeah.
And so I think this is also likea good segue into our next area
of commitment.
'cause we've talked aboutcommitment to yourself,
commitment to the process.
Then there's also a commitmentto others.
And I want you to tell the storythat you told me before we hit
record today, because this was apart of how.
Kevin honored his commitment torun this morning because in on
(28:57):
the cross country team, we talkabout showing up for your
teammates, as a commitment toother, but in real life there's
also commitment to your trainingpartners, like I've already
talked about with my 5:30 AMTuesday group.
There's.
commitment to your family.
There's commitment to yourcommunity.
Maybe you're showing up anddoing a community race.
There's lots of differentthings, but tell them how this
kind of played out for you thismorning.
Kevin (29:19):
Okay, so I did not re, I was not excited to get up and
run this morning.
The alarm went off at five and.
I immediately hit the snooze onmy watch, which is what I always
do.
It does not mean that I snooze,but I hit the snooze button, not
the off button, and I laid therefor a few seconds and I thought
to myself, I don't want to run.
(29:40):
That was my first thought.
Angie (29:41):
Yes, he does think that too, guys, and think that's a
lot of, so many people look atyou like, does he ever feel that
way?
Yes.
Kevin (29:47):
That was my, he does.
That was my first thought.
I hit snooze.
My first thought was, I don'twant to go run.
And then I had this series ofthoughts, oh shoot, I hit the
snooze button, which means mywatch is gonna buzz again in 10
minutes and that's gonna wakeAngie up.
And that's not okay to her.
Or I have to shut the alarm offon my watch.
(30:09):
In order to do that, I have toturn the watch on and make the
watch go all with a big, brightlight in our dark bedroom right
now, and that's gonna wake herup and that's not okay.
I have to, at a minimum, get outof bed, go to a different room
and shut the alarm off, and thenmaybe try to crawl back into bed
without waking her up.
And by that point I was alreadyin other room.
(30:29):
My running clothes were sittingthere and I'm up and going, but
I was committed to not wakingyou up.
That was part of it.
And that was enough.
I don't know, is that motivationto not wake you up, to be kind
to you.
That was part of it, but it wasalso, it was a commitment I had
to Respecting your sleep.
And respecting you as part of mytraining process also.
Angie (30:51):
Yeah.
And I think that's huge andthat's where, a lot of these
core values overlap, right?
Because a lot of the things thatwe're talking about today, like
we're talking about commitmentto the process.
Last week we talked aboutrespect for the process, and so
they are related, but they're,hopefully, you can also see how
they're.
They're different in a way aswell, and that's where
commitment to others comes in.
(31:11):
It does obviously overlap withrespect for others too, but
commitment to others also showsup as like accountability.
being reliable, being there,doing what you say you're gonna
do, which again is alsointegrity.
It's encouragement, it's liftingothers up when their motivation
dips, when they don't feel likeit.
When I.
Push Kevin outta bed somemornings because I know that
(31:32):
he's committed to it.
Or I'll, maybe I'll just ask himlike, are you gonna go run?
And that question enough isenough for him to get outta bed?
Kevin (31:39):
If you ever ask me, are you gonna go run it is usually
from a place of, your alarm hasgone off and it's woken me up.
Okay.
And I, it's not, it never comeswith like anger in your voice,
but in my head.
I interpret it this way and ithelps me get outta bed.
this is absolutely, maybe everyonce in a while, this is what
(31:59):
she's actually feeling.
Yeah.
But in my head it is.
You jerk, your alarm woke me up.
So you better get up and go runnow.
it better be worthwhile.
And that is not that's never,not at all.
That's never how you push me.
No, you're never like grumpywhen you do it.
You just, you honestly check inwith me and you're like, Hey,
are you going to run thismorning?
(32:19):
But if I interpret as I'm stilllaying in bed debating about
whether I would like to get upand do the thing.
Yeah.
If you ask me that, I like togive you that quality and it
helps me be like, oh, if, oh,that's
Angie (32:34):
fun.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You give that quality to me.
Yes.
Okay.
Kevin (32:38):
that's not how you ask it.
yeah.
But I put that on you of I wokeher up so I better go up and do
the damn thing.
that's so funny.
That's, and it really helps meget out of bed.
Angie (32:47):
That's really funny, so I can be the bad guy for you too.
Yeah, like I tell our kids thisall the time, like I tell our
kids, if there's things that youdon't wanna do or like a
situation you don't want to bein, make me the bad guy.
if you, like your friends wannago hang out and you don't wanna
go do that thing, just make methe bad guy.
Tell'em I'm the one that saidyou can't do it.
if you genuinely just don'twanna go, it's fine.
Kevin (33:07):
You've been the bad guy plenty of times.
Yeah.
You are very good at being thegentle, bad guy in the middle of
an ultra race.
You are both incrediblysupportive, but also.
You have to play the bad guybecause I hit incredibly low
points.
And part of that is on you to belike, alright, you are fine.
(33:28):
You are going to go keep doingthe thing now.
Yeah.
And that's a lot to put onto youand I don't it, you've never had
to like.
Force me back out.
But you don't get to be gentle.
You don't get to be like, oh,it's, I know you're hurting.
come sit down over here.
Like it requires some effort onyour part also, to make sure
(33:48):
somewhere in the, that 50 to 70mile that I would, I'm going to
continue on the next loop.
I'm gonna continue down theroad, whatever the thing is.
Yeah.
Because at that point there is,most things in me are saying
this is the appropriate time tostop.
Angie (34:01):
Yeah, and I think that takes us to our final area of
commitment that we wanted totalk about today, which is
either commitment incompetition, or what I like to
think of as commitment to theoutcome.
we've talked about commitment tothe process, but I also think
there needs to be a level ofcommitment to the outcome that
you want, because commitment canbe giving your best effort on
(34:23):
race day, regardless of theoutcome, but you need to have a
commitment.
To that outcome in order to giveyour best effort, if that makes
sense.
Do you think So you, are youfollowing
Kevin (34:35):
me here?
this is how I'm interpretingthat.
I may be off base here.
Yeah.
because you're way smarter thanI am.
So I'm hearing that as if you'vegot an outcome, it helps you
commit to the process along theway to give yourself the best
chance of getting to theoutcome.
But on race day.
On the day itself, you arebeyond the point of controlling
(34:56):
all the things for the outcome.
Yeah.
At that point, you'reessentially putting in your best
effort.
But you've had in mind throughthe whole process what that
outcome is.
Even on race day, you have inmind what you want that outcome
to be.
Yeah.
But sometimes things go south,sometimes things come up and
you're like, Ooh, that outcomeis not reachable anymore.
And then you're leaning into,I'm still going to show up as
(35:18):
best as I possibly can.
Angie (35:19):
Yeah, it's a combination and this is where it's like a
weird paradox in a way, becausethe outcome has to both matter
to you and not matter to you atthe same time.
Yeah.
Like it's about being committedto the outcome that you want and
knowing the effort that it'sgoing to require to.
Achieve that outcome and alsobeing detached from whether or
(35:41):
not you'd achieve the outcome.
because whether or not youachieve the outcome does not
determine if you did a good job.
It does not determine your levelof success, but you have to be
attached to the outcome enough,I think, in order to give the
appropriate effort that isneeded to achieve it.
Does that make sense?
if, but like you can't let theoutcome.
(36:03):
Determine your success, yourworthiness, your effort level.
Like you, you can still put inthe high quality best effort.
And not get the outcome that youwant.
Kevin (36:16):
Yes.
And I, this is where there'slevels of success.
Yeah.
if you have a clear, objective,numeric race outcome and you
don't hit it, you haveobjectively failed.
But that does not mean that racewas a failure.
Yeah, if every marathon I linedup for, I objectively missed the
number that I was going for.
(36:37):
That does not mean that all ofthose races were failures.
Some of them I was not aspleased with how I raced as
others.
Some of them were phenomenalsuccesses and there were
conditions way beyond mycontrol.
Some.
Were emotional breakthroughs forme.
Some of them I'm like, oh, I letmyself off the hook towards the
(36:59):
end of that one and to me, thatpart where I left my, let myself
off the hook where I'm like, therace got away from me.
That was one where I was notcommitted to the competition
because I said, I don't thinkthat I can get to this outcome
anymore.
Because I'm not willing to be inthis much pain any longer.
I think a lot of people do thatin races.
Yeah.
Is that outcome numerically thatnumerical outcome didn't mean
(37:23):
enough to me that day that Idecided that it didn't mean
enough to hurt that much.
and we were talking with thecross country team today.
'cause we just had a race lastweekend and today was like the
go back over the results of therace.
And a few of them were like,'cause you kept asking them,
what kind of lessons did youlearn?
And they were sometimes
Angie (37:42):
talking to high
Kevin (37:42):
school
Angie (37:42):
kids
is
Kevin (37:43):
like pulling teeth.
they were not giving you a lot.
No.
And some of them gave you someinteresting thoughts on pacing.
Yeah.
But a lot of them gave the ideaof I need to try harder.
And that is a very trickyconcept because Almost every
race you finish, even if you'relike dry heaving at the finish
line, if you think back over it,you're like, I probably could
have pushed harder at thatpoint.
(38:04):
Yeah.
Because if you look back, youcan always see a part where
you're like, yeah, that at thatsection I could have done it
because you weren't exhausted atthat section.
You probably think you couldhave gone harder in the first
half mile because you weren'tdying during the first half
mile.
Yeah.
Angie (38:18):
but then we also sometimes forget, if we did go
harder in that first half mile,like how would you have felt in
mile three?
Kevin (38:23):
Where you already were just dragging in mile three
would've.
You would've
Angie (38:27):
been even
Kevin (38:27):
worse.
Exactly.
So it's tricky and that's why.
I learning how to try harder isvery tough because you're living
in this part where you reallywant to go for that numerical
outcome.
And the level of pain thatrequires, I don't think it's
trying harder, I think it'sbecoming more okay with the
(38:48):
level of discomfort that youjust have to sit at.
I think that is the lesson thata lot of people need to learn
when racing is how uncomfortableit's going to be to get the
number that you want.
Yeah.
And it's often a lot moreuncomfortable for a lot longer
than people are willing toaccept, and that's why people
come up short.
I know.
That's why I came up short inevery marathon, except for, I
(39:10):
wanna say maybe two.
Yeah.
That I'm like, yeah, it was 105degrees.
That might have been why Imissed my time on that one day.
Angie (39:17):
Yeah.
But I think that's also.
We as humans, that's shows themental aspect of running, right?
Like it's that willingness to bein that discomfort both
physically and mentally, thatmen mentally accepting the f.
Amount and the level of physicaldiscomfort that you're feeling
and continuing to put yourselfthrough it.
(39:38):
And that's really whereendurance running and the best
endurance athletes tend toshine.
Kevin (39:45):
Yes.
The people that can live in thatlevel of discomfort.
And find a way to just keeppersevering.
Yeah.
And that's why all the differentevents,'cause runners love to
have this debate of what's themost.
Painful race.
It's, they're all painful, allin a different way.
Because the burn of an 800 runat, world class level where like
(40:06):
men's 800 is going in the lowone forties, but it's a minute
and 40 seconds of burning fromthe gun.
Yeah.
Like you are immediately.
In pain, and you're going tohold that for the next minute
and 30 seconds because you're inpain after about 10 seconds on
like when you're moving thatfast.
It's just painful.
(40:27):
The burn that you get in a 5K isdifferent.
Like it's a level of discomfortthat is more sustainable.
It's not literally, I'm going toshove my hand down onto the
burning stove.
It's, I'm gonna hold it justabove, I'm not immediately
blistering, but this isincredibly painful.
Yeah, but you can hold it therefor a little bit longer.
(40:48):
And it's how do I disassociatefrom that pain?
Do I pull into that pain?
And there's so many strategiesof how you race through these
things.
All races are superuncomfortable.
It's just how that, how yourbody perceives it, how you
mentally perceive it.
I, when I got into the.
The first a hundred I ran, I wasnot mentally prepared to cover
that thing because I'm like,this is such a slow pace.
(41:09):
This is, how is this going tobecome so remarkably difficult?
And after you do it for severalhours, you're like, I think
running seems like the worstidea ever.
I have to lay down now.
Yeah.
Is essentially that's the thingis
Angie (41:21):
you have to figure out a way to keep going.
Yes.
Even though it's.
Slower, quote unquote, slow.
It's,
Kevin (41:26):
it seems slow and it's so much slower than I would race
even a marathon, which I'm outthere for a couple of hours.
It's so much slower than that,and yet I can't seem to go any
faster.
And it's the weirdest sensation.
The
Angie (41:39):
Kevin Shuffle is one of my favorite things, like when
that hits the.
Feel the lightning.
that was one of my favoriteclips of, that video still makes
me chuckle.
Kevin (41:49):
I'm glad it does because I was in excruciating pain at
that point.
Angie (41:53):
That was a little inside joke from Kevin's first a
hundred mile attempt.
That was a hundred
Kevin (42:00):
K effort.
Angie (42:01):
Yeah, that was at mile 50 after an extended break that
where he had to sit in the airconditioning.
We tried to refuel and then hedecided he was gonna keep going
and he just looked like an oldman shuffling.
Oh, it was brutal down the road.
Like that
Kevin (42:15):
was so bad.
My knees wouldn't bend.
My hamstrings were screaming.
I'm like, I can't move.
I'm not running at this.
I can't, like my legs aren'tmoving in a normal fashion.
Angie (42:25):
Yeah.
that's what happens.
Your body just forgets how torun when you're doing that for a
hundred miles, right?
There's gotta be some of thatsomewhere.
Kevin (42:33):
I'm so excited to do it again.
Angie (42:35):
You are interesting human.
So there has to be thiscommitment, to competition, to
competing with yourself becausecompetition, and this doesn't
mean you even have to race.
I think that.
We often look at competition asracing, and I think there's a
lot of runners that don't race.
I haven't raced in a while.
I, I guess I, I still do ourschool 5K every year.
(42:59):
So there is that, that I, it's
Kevin (43:00):
commitment to the community
Angie (43:01):
that is c and to the race.
Like this year or last year,when I ran it, I tried to.
Get one of our girls to give mean out so I didn't have to race
it.
Oh
Kevin (43:11):
yeah, you did
Angie (43:12):
was I think that was last year, wasn't it?
So it might've been the yearbefore, but I was like, come on,
I'll just, I'll run with you.
It's fine.
Like we'll run your pace.
Because then I wouldn't have topush myself and I then decided
that I didn't actually want to.
To give myself that out, like Idid want to go out and commit to
the competition, and thatcompetition wasn't against
(43:33):
anybody else in the race.
That competition was againstmyself and all of the voices in
my head like screaming at meduring that.
Race.
Kevin (43:42):
Yeah.
Because there's always thevoices screaming.
I mean that ultimately that'sthe competition.
Yes, there are other people inthe race, but it is so much a
competition between you and allthe voices in your head
screaming slow down.
I also had the competition for,the freshman religion teacher at
our school, between me andeverybody in her classes that
she had offered extra credit toif they beat me in the race.
(44:03):
Yes.
So I had that level ofcompetition also.
She always checks with me now.
Angie (44:06):
Yeah.
She always, so that freshmanreligion teacher offers a
hundred, what'd she offer?
I think it's a free
Kevin (44:12):
hundred test grade.
Angie (44:14):
Yeah.
If they beat Kevin, which hasnever happened before, which is
fantastic.
there, no, there was one year,right?
yes.
Didn't somebody like the day afwhen you They,
Kevin (44:23):
they have to because there's a negative, like it's a
gamble on their part.
Like they have to tell her thatthey're going to go out and beat
me, and if they don't beat me,then there's like a penalty that
they take.
And so one of the kids on ourcross country team knew that I
had when I was running a hundredmiler, and that the 5K was the
next weekend.
Yes.
So he knew that was not going togo well and that he could.
(44:45):
Definitely beat me.
Yeah.
And so he said, I will take thatchallenge.
And she was like, okay, this isgonna be great.
And, not knowing at all that Iwas going to go race a hundred
miler, and then I sent out amessage to all the faculty, oh,
this is what I'm doing thisweekend.
And she goes, no.
I offered everybody extracredit.
You can't, this is not okay.
Angie (45:04):
Sorry.
No, you have to back out.
That's not gonna work for me.
But yeah, so I think thatultimately.
The big takeaways from thisepisode are, commitment is
better and greater thanmotivation because commitment is
going to lead to sustainableresults.
And commitment is a choice thatyou have control over.
(45:24):
Versus commitment is a feelingthat is fleeting that you can
bring in sometimes, but alsohave a hard time bringing in.
Other times,
Kevin (45:31):
commitment is a choice.
Motivation is a feeling.
Did I say opposite?
You said commitment is both.
Angie (45:36):
Oh, I did.
Yes, you did.
thank you for correcting me.
Commitment is a choice.
Motivation is a feeling.
So after listening to this,maybe just think about an area
where you might need to recommitright now.
And maybe the answer is, I'mdoing really great with my
commitment.
I feel very solid with my levelof commitment, to myself, to the
process, to others, tocompetition, whatever that might
(45:56):
be.
and maybe.
See again, opportunity forgrowth.
That's what running is.
Running gives us an opportunityand a lens where we can start to
look at ourselves and look atwhere we are and at different
areas of, in different areas ofour life and.
Decide how we want to grow andimprove on those things as well.
(46:16):
Yeah,
Kevin (46:17):
that's beautiful.
Good.
Good summary.
Angie (46:18):
Good summary.
All right, so join us for ournext episode where we'll be
addressing core value numberfour.
I wonder what it is.
Kevin (46:27):
Me too.
'cause I forget what number fourone is.
I know what number five is.
I forget number four.
Angie (46:32):
Four begins with an R.
Excellent.
All right.
So as always, thanks guys forjoining us.
I would love for you to leave usa review on Apple Podcasts or on
Spotify and share this episodeor this podcast with other
people so that we can help morerunners to feel strong, feel
empowered, and run their life.
And as always, this has been theReal Life Runners podcast,
(46:52):
episode number 427.
Now, get out there and run yourlife.
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Cardiac Cowboys
The heart was always off-limits to surgeons. Cutting into it spelled instant death for the patient. That is, until a ragtag group of doctors scattered across the Midwest and Texas decided to throw out the rule book. Working in makeshift laboratories and home garages, using medical devices made from scavenged machine parts and beer tubes, these men and women invented the field of open heart surgery. Odds are, someone you know is alive because of them. So why has history left them behind? Presented by Chris Pine, CARDIAC COWBOYS tells the gripping true story behind the birth of heart surgery, and the young, Greatest Generation doctors who made it happen. For years, they competed and feuded, racing to be the first, the best, and the most prolific. Some appeared on the cover of Time Magazine, operated on kings and advised presidents. Others ended up disgraced, penniless, and convicted of felonies. Together, they ignited a revolution in medicine, and changed the world.