RealPropPro Ep 14 - Mark Dolfini | June 26, 2025

Summary
In this conversation, Mark Dolfini shares a pivotal moment in his life when a nurse's candid words forced him to confront his lifestyle choices and health. This wake-up call served as a catalyst for personal growth and self-reflection, emphasizing the importance of taking charge of one's life and well-being.
Takeaways
A single moment can change your perspective on life.
Honest feedback can be a powerful motivator.
Health should be a priority in life decisions.
Self-reflection is crucial for personal growth.
Sometimes, tough love is necessary for change.
Listening to others can provide valuable insights.
Life is too short to ignore health warnings.
Awareness of one's situation is the first step to change.
Taking action is essential after realizing the truth.
Change often starts with a wake-up call.
Sound Bites
"You need to take a really good look at your life."
"That was probably the biggest kick in the shin."
"You need to stop because you're literally killing yourself."
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Real Estate and Coaching
02:37 Mark Dolfini's Early Life and Education
06:20 Military Service and Its Impact on Career
10:40 First Steps into Real Estate Investing
14:32 Challenges in Building a Real Estate Portfolio
18:13 The Consequences of Overworking
24:28 Rebuilding After Financial Collapse
30:08 Implementing Systems for Success
34:31 The Time Wealthy Advantage and Its Core Messages
39:21 Finding Direction in Business Ideas
42:41 The Importance of Personal vs. Business Vision
49:21 Guides for Business Success
54:40 Bookshelf Battle: Lightning Round
01:05:15 Final Thoughts on Time Wealth
01:06:39 Outro

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
And then right before she walkedout, she said something to me I
never, ever forgot. She turned and looked at me.
And she says, you know, and now keep in mind, at the time, I'm
in my late 30s and I'm in prettygood health.
She turned to me and she says, you know, I have to say
something. People who look like you don't
lay in hospital beds like this. She goes, you need to take a

(00:20):
really good look at your life about what's going on.
And with that, she turned and she left.
And that was probably the biggest kick in the shin I ever
had in my life. I mean, but it was said in love
and it was said, you know, it wasn't kind of like this, you
know, I was kind of expecting, oh, wow, you poor guy.
No, she was like, look, you idiot, whatever you're doing,

(00:42):
you need to stop because you're,you're literally killing
yourself. Welcome to the Real Prop Pro
podcast, where strategy, innovation, and wealth converge
to redefine real estate investing.

(01:03):
Hello and welcome to the Real Prop Pro podcast.
I'm your host Ian Detler, Sacramento based investor that
focuses on fix and flips. I have started this podcast to
have real conversations with thepeople who are actually doing
the work and building lives of freedom through real estate.

(01:25):
At Realprop Pro, we train investors in all kinds of
strategies from fix and flips, short term rentals, creative
financing, tax deed and tax lieninvesting, and so much more.
Whether you're new or scaling up, we've got tools and training
to help you succeed. Check out realproppro.com.

(01:48):
Today. I am joined by Mark Dolphini, an
investor, business coach, and author of several books,
including his latest, The Time Wealthy Advantage.
Mark helps real estate investorsnot just make money, but design
lives where their time is protected and their systems work

(02:08):
for them. We'll talk about how he got
started, how he coaches others, and the philosophy behind his
books. Mark, welcome to the show.
Thanks for the glowing warm up there.
I appreciate it, Ian. It's good to be here.
Yeah, Thank you so much for taking the time to come on the

(02:30):
show. We really appreciate all your
knowledge and experience that you've, you know, learned and
lived throughout all these years.
So, so glad to have you on. Can't wait to talk about the
book. I absolutely love the book.
So we'll get into that a little bit later.
But first, let's start from the beginning.
And where did you grow up and what was life like for you

(02:50):
growing up? I I grew up in a teeny tiny
little town in upstate New York.And that it's kind of funny
because when I say that I grew up on the top of a mountain, it
was literally on the top of a mountain.
And I'm like, that is not, that's not a clever metaphor.
We were, we lived on a road called Mountain Rd. and

(03:14):
literally we were at the peak, like we were one of the few
houses that was at the very peakof the, of it.
And we were on the, on the, on the side of it a little bit.
So we got that. We got an amazing view growing
up as kids, but it was not a lotof kids around to play with.
So I had to get real creative with my imagination and, and,

(03:37):
and yeah, it it was. It was a good place to grow up
as a kid for sure. Nice.
What? What was life like, you know,
going through high school and stuff as, as, as a kid in a
smaller town. What was that like for you?
Well, the town, it's kind of funny, you know, we well hear
the grandfather stories of you know, I had to walk uphill both
ways and three feet of snow. That actually was me.

(04:01):
That is really true. There was we I had to walk
uphill. It was a pretty deep driveway to
get up and usually in the in thesnow because it had snowed
overnight. But all right, my bus ride to
school was about an hour just toby, by the time I got on the
bus, which was, I don't even remember somewhere around 6:30,

(04:23):
if I remember right. And by the time we got to school
was around 7:30 or so. So I was on the bus for a
little. I was one of the first kids on
the bus. And so Needless to say, in high
school, that kind of sucked because all my friends lived in
civilization where so, you know,they had the the cool stuff
like, you know, cable televisionand, and things like that where

(04:46):
cable didn't even run where we lived just because we were so
far in the middle of nowhere. But because we were on the edge
of space, literally on the edge on the top of a mountain, we
had, we were able to pick up TV signals from states all around,
you know, all over the place. We could pick up the signals
from Connecticut and Massachusetts and, you know,

(05:06):
just just different, different areas.
So it was kind of neat from thatperspective.
But you know, when you were definitely want to be more
social as a kid in high school, that was that.
It definitely sucked though, because you, you couldn't give
directions. That was again, pre GPS, pre
cell phones. So trying to give directions to
for anybody to find our house was impossible.

(05:27):
So, you know, we just, we didn'thave any, we didn't have much
company. We had to go that we had to go
visit them. What did life look like for you
after high school? Did you go to college or did you
go into service? You know what was what was life
like after high school? So I pretty much graduated at
the at the top 98th percentile of my class, which if you do the

(05:52):
math, that's the bottom 2%. So I literally graduated at.
So there was like 360 students. I think I graduated 300 and 58th
and so I was at the dead bottom of the class.
I, I barely, barely made it through, but I really didn't
didn't pay much attention in school.
I was one of those smart kids who figured out how to do the

(06:14):
bare minimum and absolutely nothing more.
So the best, best choice I ever had after that was was Community
College. And there was a decent Community
College nearby. But, but really, that's not
really where I stepped into any sort of any sort of limelight at

(06:35):
all. It was really more about when I
joined the Marine Corps. And that's really when life
started to take off for me. It's because, you know, at for
the first time, it wasn't about my my charisma or anything else.
It was, I mean, I had to perform.
I had to, and I had to perform in in ways that I never really
was expected to before. And it wasn't just physical, it
was mental. And that was really good because

(06:57):
when I went in the Marine Corps and because the Marine Corps is
so small and reactionary, we really don't have no, I mean, at
the time the Marines were 300,000 total Marines, including
the reserves. Right now, I think they're, the
numbers are at 200,000. So it's, it's getting even
smaller. But back then we still didn't
have, you know, they're not going to waste talent.

(07:17):
So when I went and sat down for the ASVAB, I got into the 93rd
percentile, which was absolutelyamazing because I, you know,
because I reference that againsthow poorly I did in school.
But I actually did OK on the ASVAB.
So they were like, OK, well, what job do you want?
I'm like, what job do you have? And they're like, well, really
don't have much. Well, let's put you in as open
contract and we'll see where youland.

(07:40):
So keep in mind that could mean I could be an infantry guy or I
could be a cook. But my recruiter assured me and
I and I and it did make sense and it actually did work out
this way that if you put, if youwould, those kind of scores, you
go in open contract, you could pretty much they're going to put
you in something decent. And they did.
They made me a navigator on C1 thirties.

(08:01):
So I was a celestial navigator. And again, this is the days
when, you know, GPS really wasn't all that common.
I mean, they had like garments were not very common common yet,
but they certainly didn't have them in the airplanes.
So we were shooting celestial lines of position using a
Sexton, you know, to fly across the, you know, the Atlantic

(08:21):
Ocean, Pacific Ocean, things like that.
So it was a great job. It really was a wonderful job.
Did that for four years. And, and you know, after a while
I was like, yeah, you know what?I I'm, I do want to get out.
I want to get, I want to, I wantto take my education seriously
this time. So while I was in, while I was
in the Marine Corps, I decided Iwas going to go out, go to
Purdue. And that's what I did.

(08:41):
I, I had applied to Purdue, I had to take my SA TS because I
didn't even take those when I was in high school.
So imagine being three years outof high school and sitting down
for your SA TS, especially with the stellar grades that I had.
So I had to relearn basically everything I was supposed to
learn in high school. I had to learn in about 3
months. And I was like, man, this would
have been a lot easier if I'd just done this the first time
around. But you know, I tend to do

(09:04):
things the hard way and not, notproud of that, but it definitely
slowed me down. But, but I, I did, I got good
enough grades to get into or good enough score around my SAT
to get into accepted at Purdue. And that's that's where I went
to school. Nice.
What kind of studies did you do at Purdue?
I, I originally had gotten accepted to their hotel

(09:25):
management program, their hospitality program, and that's
what the direction I thought I wanted to go in.
But the more I got into that program, I realized that that
program really wasn't as challenging as I was hoping for.
So I actually changed into accounting and I went to the
School of Management. So I got out of the hospitality

(09:45):
and tourism school and went intothe School of Management.
At the time was called Craner and it was it was good.
I'm I'm really glad I went into that program.
I worked in the field of accounting after a while after I
got out of school, but I didn't really I and I really like the
background in accounting becauseit certainly helped me out in my
own business and certainly helped me with the people who I

(10:08):
coach and consult for now. But it's it's definitely not a
not a job that I was well suitedfor.
I'm just way too social. Get back to your desk.
Yeah. So it sounds like you didn't
become ACPA, right? That that wasn't the, that
wasn't really the the goal at that point, was it?
No, I so I chose to go the, the corporate route and that's

(10:31):
generally the, the 2 routes you can go either the public route
with this, you know, you become ACPA or the, or you go the
corporate route. And I went the corporate route.
So I worked for the Marriott fora few years and that was a
wonderful company to work for. I really enjoyed my time at the
Marriott, but I recognized that,you know, all during that time
and while I was in college, I had started buying some rental

(10:54):
properties. So I had figured out how the
banks underwrote their loans. And I was like, OK, you know,
going to apply for the loan. They're like, well, you know, I
was like, well, you know what, what, what kind of financials do
you have? I'm like, well, what kind of
financials do you need? You know, that sort of thing.
You know, ask me no questions. I'll tell you no lies, but they,

(11:14):
yeah, I figured that out. And then I was able to start
getting into rental properties. And I had, I had done fairly
well, I had about a half $1,000,000 worth of real estate
acquired by the time I graduatedfrom Purdue.
So most of it with no money down, none of them were cash
flowing hardly at all. And really it was just a, a job
I created for myself. But it was a way of getting into

(11:35):
the, into the mix and figuring out how to do it.
So. Very nice that that was going to
lead me into my next question, which was what first exposed you
to real estate, How did you get that first deal and like what
made you interested in that first deal?
So technically my first real estate that I purchased was in

(11:55):
93. No, it was later than that 95
because I got in the Marine Corps in 93.
So I purchased my first piece ofreal estate in 95, which was
about 50 acres of bare land in Arizona.
And at the time it was selling for like $250 an acre, so super,
super cheap. And, you know, and the, the

(12:19):
taxes were ungodly low. So I just thought, well, heck,
I'll just buy this. And, and, and I did, I bought it
and sat on it for a while. And that was my first piece of
real estate. But I didn't buy anything cash
flowing until I got out of the, you know, got out of the Marine
Corps. And it was my first year at
Purdue. And I'd always been interested
in real estate just because of the, I mean, initially because

(12:40):
of the money of it, right? That's what attracts a lot of
people. But then I got really, but kept
me in it was the, the challengesfrom all different aspects.
You know, you've got the obviously finding decent deals
and negotiating the deals. And then the financing side of
it is a whole other deal. I mean, you can have a great
deal that gets ruined by horrible financing, you know,

(13:02):
and, and, and good financing canmake an otherwise horrible deal.
OK, right, not not great, seldomwill it make it great.
But you know, usually if you getdecent financing, you can get,
you can make a terrible deal, you know, palatable.
And then you got the human component, you got the human
side of the business, which is the management of the human
beings and doing that well and not then being being a nice

(13:24):
enough person, but also not so nice where you get backed over
and run over. So I really enjoyed all of the
components that that that side of the business really commanded
and it was a lot of fun and and I and I got pretty darn good at
it. Yeah, it sounds to me like you

(13:45):
get to kind of use both sides ofyour brain on this.
You get to use your analytical side and a little bit of
creative side to make these deals happen or find ways to
make deals happen. You know, it's not just, Oh no,
I can't do this deal. It's more of a how can I do this
deal type of thing. So sounds like you got to get a
little bit creative and still use some of that accounting

(14:06):
stuff to, to start to build a portfolio.
So what did it look like kind ofbuilding the portfolio?
Did it go smoothly or like was it not so smooth?
Like how did how did build? How did the scaling side of
things go for you? Well, it, it went quickly, but
it shouldn't have because I was buying a lot of properties I
shouldn't have purchased. But again, at the time I didn't,

(14:30):
I didn't know what I didn't know.
And a lot of times I could get into deals with no money down.
But the problem was the cash flow was so poor.
I never, there was deals I nevershould have agreed to.
And you know, I would think, oh,if I'm making, you know, the
time 100 or, you know, $200 overthe PITI, the, you know, the

(14:51):
mortgage payment, I was doing great.
And the problem was I didn't budget for all those jobs.
I was creating for myself. You know, I create a management
job, I created a leasing job, I created a mowing job at times,
you know, I created all these little jobs for myself.
And the problem is that for each, for each line item that

(15:11):
you don't budget for becomes a job you create for yourself.
So if you don't budget for someone else to do the
management, you have now and forever baked in the cake a
management job for yourself or aleasing job for yourself or a,
you know, a maintenance job, youknow, already snow shoveling
job, you know, whatever it is. So that's the problem.

(15:34):
Not too much snow shoveling going on now, but you know, it's
a, it's about 100° outside rightnow in Indiana.
But The thing is like all of that stuff, all these different
individual, individual little jobs and turns, you know, where
you're painting and cleaning andall the stuff.
You, if you don't budget for that in your pro forma, in your
projections that those are jobs that you create for yourself,
because where else is the money going to come from?

(15:55):
It's, it's either going to come from your labor or you're going
to have to get a job and pay someone else so they can work
for you. And that kind of defeats the
purpose. So it, I, I was growing probably
at that point in time, 1 to 2 units a year.
And you know, not all of them were turds, but a lot of them
were. And looking back, I probably

(16:15):
shouldn't have bought a good chunk of them, most of them.
And, and I never really, I neverreally looked at deleveraging
the way that I should have deleveraged.
So that's a whole other conversation.
But the, the, I mean, the, I know a lot of people who, you
know, listen to shows like yoursand a lot of people get into
real estate, they, they're so concerned with scale before they

(16:39):
even have a business. And you, you, the only way that
you can really scale is if you have enough margin and not just
profit margin percentage, but enough margin in dollars.
So, and if you don't, you got tohave enough, you have to have
cash to offset that risk. And in that case, I didn't have
either, I didn't have margin andI certainly didn't have cash

(17:03):
sitting in the bank. So that became a big problem.
You know, in your book you kind of talk about some of the some
of the rough times that you wentthrough.
I know there was, you know, I know there's a point where
you're just working, working, working, working and just
driving yourself into the ground.
Can you kind of talk about how how how you got into that

(17:25):
position and then what was the result of just working yourself
almost to death? Yeah, yeah.
And that's not AI mean just for your listeners.
That's not a just a a play on words.
I actually almost did die. I almost worked myself to death.
I so at this point in time, I had purchased again through a

(17:48):
variety of creative means and Wheeling and dealing I had
created. I got, I had 92 rental units all
together. And you know, some of them were
a small apartment buildings or duplexes, but most of them are
single family homes and my cash.Yeah, well, they were all in one

(18:10):
town. The thing was like, it was a
typical 8020 problem and it's, you know, it wouldn't have, it
wouldn't have mattered even if Ihad one, even if they were all,
you know, it was one apartment building.
It wouldn't have mattered because it would, it was just,
it wasn't the driving around that was the problem.
It was, it was everything else. I mean, the driving around was
ancillary to all the other, you know, dumb things that I did,

(18:32):
but certainly exasperated the problem.
But most of my, most of my, I mean, the town I live in is
pretty small. I mean, it's maybe 1020 minutes
across town at the most. So it really is not that big of
a deal. But yeah, when I had the 92
rental units and I was, and I was bringing in about $65,000 a
month in in rental revenues. So by most people's measures of

(18:56):
success, I was crushing it, you know, and you know, I had the
big house and I had the fancy car and and none of, and all of
it was on borrowed money and borrowed time.
So when things started to go sideways in 2008, it's kind of
funny because people talk about the Great Recession in 2009.

(19:16):
I'm like, man, it had been bad for a while before people really
started go, oh, wow, it's reallystarting to get bad out there.
I'm like, where have you been? Like, like it's, you know, it's
like someone says, oh, is it going to rain outside?
Meanwhile, you've been walking 5miles in the rain, you know,
like you got a fish in your shoeand you're like, what are you
talking about? Like it's been pouring.
So anyway, it, it, it was horrible for a while.

(19:40):
And by the time I turned around and, and, you know, I started,
you know, I started defaulting on a lot of mortgages.
It was, you know, I was probably, you know, four or five
months into, you know, when people started saying it was
really, really bad, I was about four or five months already, you
know, into that. And so I was working as many

(20:01):
hours as I possibly could. And many people are getting laid
off. And, you know, I had people
that, that were in units that hadn't paid rent in months.
And I was like, well, I'd ratheryou just stay there.
And not, I mean, and not have the vacancy, but it didn't
matter. I had vacancies, but I didn't, I
couldn't afford to pay anybody because of the way I had set up
this business. It was all, it was all driven by
me. So I mean, I was literally

(20:23):
working, you know, and, and not not being coy here, but I was
probably working about 18 to 19 hours a day.
And I would catch cat naps like in the, you know, in the parking
lot of Lowe's or, you know, at red lights, you know, whatever.
I could some sometimes in the bank drive through, you know,

(20:45):
But all kidding aside, I was exhausted and I ended up getting
a cold. And I, it's rare that I actually
did the right thing. I actually went to the doctor
and they gave me, they said, Yep, take this medicine, go get
some rest. So I took the medicine.
I went right back to work and about four days later I got down

(21:07):
to a point where I was the only way that I could actually
breathe was if I could put if I leaned over the front of a chair
or the back of a chair and put pressure against my chest,
something just wasn't right. So went back to the hospital and
they brought in this hospital was just newly built.
So they brought me into this hospital and I'm laying.

(21:27):
They, they brought me into this triage room and they said, oh,
well, sounds like you need a breathing treatment of some
sort. You know, we'll get, we'll get
that ordered and we'll have someone come down.
Well, they shut that door and they left me alone.
And, and I'm sitting there and I'm, as I'm laying down, I'm,

(21:48):
I'm not able to get up. Like, I'm getting less and less
oxygen. And I couldn't really get up
because I was, I was so deprivedfrom oxygen.
And then all of a sudden, my, my, my vision at the edges,
we're starting to get real fuzzy.
And it started to descend into this just this tiny pinpoint of
light, just like way off in the distance.

(22:09):
And I remember thinking, holy crap, this is how I'm going to
die. And it was amazing because I
wasn't freaked out. I was actually, well, this is
what they call hypoxic hypoxia. I got euphoric.
I was like, oh, OK. Like I was surprisingly calm,
even though I'm kind of mouthingfor air like a fish out of
water. And I resigned myself to my

(22:33):
fate. I thought, OK, this is it.
This is how I'm going to go and close my eyes for what I thought
would be the last time. And a few minutes later, I was
kind of brought around to someone fitting a mask over my
face and, you know, getting getting me the oxygen that I
needed, you know, and in the breathing treatment that I
needed. But but that was it.

(22:54):
So they admitted me to the hospital and I was feeling much,
much better because I got the treatment that I needed.
And the, I, I referenced this section in the book when the,
the hospitalist came in and saidto me, you know, introduced
herself as a hospitalist. And she had put her hands in the
front of her lab coat with her stethoscope around her neck and

(23:18):
explained to me that you're exactly where you need to be.
And that, you know, she, she must have sensed my eagerness to
get out of the hospital. And she said, you know, if you
think you're going to check yourself out of this hospital
and, and not stay here for the next few days, she's like,

(23:38):
you're, she goes, if you make itback, she goes, you're going to
be in a much, much worse place. So this is exactly where you
need to be for the next few days.
So really couldn't do much except nod because she knew
clearly what my intention was. And then she kind of explained a
few other things. And then right before she walked
out, she said something to me I never, ever forgot.

(24:02):
And she turned and looked at me.And she says, you know, and now
keep in mind, at the time, I'm in my late 30s, and I'm in
pretty good health. I mean, other than the fact that
I, you know, other than the pneumonia thing that I actually
had going on. But she turned to me and she
says, you know, I have to say something.

(24:23):
People who look like you don't lay in hospital beds like this.
She goes, you need to take a really good look at your life
about what's going on. And with that, she turned and
she left. And that was probably the
biggest kick in the shin I ever had in my life.
I mean, but it was said in love and it was said, you know, it

(24:45):
wasn't kind of like this. You know, I was kind of
expecting, oh, wow, you poor guy.
No, she was like, look, you idiot, whatever you're doing,
you need to stop because you're,you're literally killing
yourself. And for the next three days,
that's really what had happened.I just had this moment of
resignation where I was like, OK, something has to be
different. Something has to change.

(25:05):
I can't keep doing what I'm doing because this is a
nightmare. And and that's really where
things started to change for me,where, you know, things were
going to happen regardless of what it was.
And I I couldn't stop that trainat that point in time.
I was going to lose a bunch of properties and over the next
few, you know, roughly the next year, probably the next eight

(25:28):
months or so, I had lost out of my six and a half million dollar
portfolio, I lost about $5,000,000 in about 8 months.
So I still had about 1,000,005 to maintain.
But yeah, everything that was that I had built the previous
ten years was just smoking wreckage at that point.
Wow, thank you for sharing that story.
You know, reading it in your book was very touching, and I

(25:52):
hope it helps people realize that we can't just work
ourselves to death. We can't just, you know, keep
grinding. Keep grinding.
I mean, we still have to take care of ourselves.
We still need to take care of our mental health and our bodies
and, you know, take rest when weneed.
So I hope that message resonateswith our listeners here today.

(26:14):
So where did you go from there? I mean, like, you had a global
financial meltdown. You had your body just about
shutting down, portfolio shut down kind of what was the
rebuild process? What did what did life look like
after all of that stuff happened?

(26:35):
Well, I was at the bottom of this hole and the thing I had to
do was just start filling it in.And that's exactly what I did.
So I got on the phone with all my creditors and figured out who
was going to work with me and who wasn't going to work with
me. Some were absolutely amazing.

(26:57):
I mean, the folks at American Express, I can never ever repay
them for the, for the, what theyhad done.
I know they're a massive company, but I absolutely
anytime I can give props to them.
They, they did it the right way.They really did.
They, they recognize the, the, the, the what it was that was
going down. They didn't, they didn't, they

(27:18):
offered me payments. But the really interesting thing
was they said, look, we're not going to offer you a, a
settlement, but we, but if you pay us in full, we're not, we're
going to shut the interest off. You pay us in full, we're going
to give you a card back. And I was like, what?
Why would you do that? And, and I even asked them, I
said, why would you give me a card back?
Like I have literally got no reason why you should give me a

(27:39):
card. They said, if you pay us back,
that tells us that you're serious about your credit with
us. That's why we're not going to
accept the settlement. I was like, OK.
And I, I only owed them like, I don't even know, it's like 1000
or 1500 bucks. It may as well have been a
million. I didn't have it right.
So I paid them like $20.00 a month.
I mean, I didn't, I had nothing.So they just said make some

(28:03):
payments, you know, sometimes itwas 10, sometimes 20, sometimes
it's 50, you know, but whatever I had at the end of a month, I,
I could pay them and establish areally good payment report with
them. Again, it got down to 800 and
700 and 400 and 200. And eventually I was able to
actually stroke that one, you know, final check for like $175
and get them paid in full. And they said, OK, here's your

(28:24):
card. And I never forgot that, never
forgot that. And I have been a customer of
theirs forever. So, you know, I just, I just,
and that's, and that's how you do it.
And keep in mind, this is, this is a time when the government
was not stepping in to help small business owners.
The government was stepping in with TARP loans to help all the
major auto manufacturers and allthe major banks.

(28:47):
And they didn't, they weren't helping little guys like us,
right? That's why, you know, and, and
during COVID-19 when, you know, I mean, the government did it
the right way that time. You know, Trump, he gets it.
You know, he understood what it was like being the small
business owner. Granted, I think it was a little
bit over, over excess. I knew the inflation thing was

(29:08):
definitely going to happen, but but it, it had to and they
helped the right people. So I'm not necessarily in his
camp, but I, he definitely did did the right thing.
So anyway, so rebuilding this, Igot in touch with my creditors
and just got whatever terms I could.
Those who didn't work with me ordidn't want to work with me or

(29:30):
couldn't work with me because they were they again, they're,
they, they have bank examiners to answer to.
So they, they may have had theirhands tied.
So if they said, Nope, we, we can't work with you, They're the
only workout is you pay us in full and we won't foreclose.
Like, OK, well, that's not any sort of deal.
Like that's, that's a terrible workout plan.
But I think I need to describe to you what a workout plan

(29:52):
actually looks like. But they, they did, they
couldn't work with me. So I just kind of, you know,
siphoned as much rent as I couldoff those properties until they
fully foreclosed and played the hand I was dealt.
And so everybody who got in line, they got paid those.
And then of course the deficiency judgments come in
after the fact, after they foreclose and they sell the
property for less than what whatit's owed.

(30:12):
So now I owed another half, $1,000,000 in deficiency
judgments or however much that was.
So I got them paid off. But little just started digging
and filling it back in shovelfulby shovelful worked my tail off.
But I had boundaries. I took Sundays off and, and I,
and I learned and I started deleveraging my cash flow by

(30:33):
bringing in other sources of revenue like, you know, getting
my broker's license so I could do property management in the
state of Indiana and, and different things so I could
deleverage my cash flow. But it was a long, long, long
grind. And had I declared bankruptcy,
it might have gone a little bit faster for me, but I was just
opposed to that. I knew I could get out of it and
I was going to get out of it without declaring bankruptcy.

(30:54):
And I'm glad I did. Nice.
Another another book of yours I was reading to kind of talks
about how to set up systems for rental companies.
Is that when you started to kindof set up systems to be able to
get out of those jobs? Yeah.

(31:18):
Because I knew at that point in time that my leverage was my
leverage was whatever it was. And now that the banks showed
their cards and in terms of what, you know, who was going to
work with me and who wasn't, I just said, OK, now, now I know
what I'm working with. And there was a period of time

(31:39):
that it allowed me to buy whatever I needed to buy, like
property management software andyou know, a decent website and
all the different things becausethose, you know, there were so
many people who talk about processes.
And at the time I was really into Michael Gerber's book, The
E Myth, which really talks aboutthis, you know, creating like a
franchise model, whether you plan to franchise or not, it's

(32:03):
about making it systematic so itcould be replicated even if you
don't have any have any interestin replicating or franchising.
But that model works because it's so consistent and
consistency really needs to be your product more than any other
thing. So when you're shooting for
consistency, you know, one of the things I feel like I, I

(32:26):
think Michael Gerber got it a little bit backwards.
And again, I'm not here to, you know, say he was wrong.
But there's no point in setting up a system or a process rather
without having the infrastructure.
You have to have the infrastructure.
So in the time Wealthy Investor 2 point OI wrote about the VIP
method vision infrastructure process because without the

(32:48):
vision of where you want to go and then the infrastructure to,
to, to, to be in alignment with that vision for the future, that
infrastructure is what your processes are going to run on.
So if you have all these processes, you know, people talk
about systems and processes, youhave to have the infrastructure
that that process is going to run on.
Otherwise you're bringing peopleinto an inefficient

(33:10):
organization. And when you hire people and you
bring people into an inefficientorganization, it magnifies the
inefficiencies. However, when you have an
efficient organization because you have good infrastructure,
because you have already delineated processes, but when
you have good infrastructure andyou hire people in, now you are
bringing people into an efficient organization and that

(33:32):
will magnify the efficiencies. Yeah, wonderful stuff.
Really appreciate you kind of teaching the listeners just a
little sample of, you know, what's possible and what to to
look for and what to learn from.Like to shift gears and talk
about your latest book, The timeWealthy Advantage.
We got it here. Got personal signed copy.

(33:54):
Thank you very much for this. Appreciate it.
Just absolutely could not stop reading this great book.
I recommend it to everybody. Can you kind of talk about what
some of the core messages are inthe book?
I know there's a Viper method and a couple of things about,
you know, time blocking, stuff like that.
Can you kind of talk about what's the the main stuff in in

(34:17):
your new book? Yeah, the the so the original
book because they're similar titles and I don't want to get
people confused. So the time wealthy investor 2
point O is specifically for rental property investors and
it's really about the managementof them.
So it's really not about buying or you know, you know, do
anything like that, but it is about managing them correctly.

(34:39):
The time wealthy advantage, which is the one that I just
wrote that is really more for the business owner, operator,
entrepreneur, you know, people who are in who are in businesses
for themselves could be real estate, but maybe not because I
certainly as a as a strategist, I work for a lot of different
business owners and they are, they tend to be in the service
industry, but not always, but I know many contractors and so

(35:01):
forth. But the time wealthy advantage
when I talk about time wealth, Iknow or when you, when you write
a book that's you know, around time and the title, you know,
it's time wealthy or time, you know, whatever it is.
People often confuse me for a time management expert and you,
you can't manage time and you really shouldn't even try.

(35:24):
It's not like you can get 20 units of time in a jar and bury
it in your backyard and use that20 units of time later on,
right? It just doesn't work that way.
So you really can't manage your time, but you can manage
yourself, you can manage your energy.
And you know, so really it's about managing you and your best
energy during the time that we're allotted.

(35:45):
So that's really what this is about.
And the whole premise of being time wealthy is being able to
control your calendar, to do what you want, when you want,
for as long as you want to do it.
And of course, that does take a component of financial wealth as
well, but being time wealthy is a lot nicer when you do have
some financial wealth. But it's, it's, it's critical

(36:08):
when you don't have to be the one that has to do all the
rowing in your boat to get to where you want to go.
So it's, it really is about setting up systems, you know,
using the, so the VIP method that I wrote about in the time
wealthy investor 2 point O is expanded into the Viper method,
which is the time wealthy advantage, which it's still

(36:28):
vision, infrastructure and process, except for the
entrepreneur I put on the E and the R, which is execution and
reporting. And the reason for those two
additions is because it really, you know, I think from, from the
aspect of a business owner that tends to be where a lot of
things do fall apart, you know, whether you're in real estate or

(36:50):
otherwise. But you know, as I've evolved
the Viper method or into the Viper method, the execution
piece, that's, that's when you're taking look, and you
built this battleship, you builtthis warship, Now you want to
take it out of the harbor, You have to actually go do
something. You know, part of that process
is not just the, the day-to-day stuff that you do, you know, in

(37:10):
the, in the, in the process, butit's the strategic planning,
right? And it's the people that you
need in the strategic plan. It's the, it's the purpose of
the strategic plan. Where are you going?
Are you trying to get market share?
Are you trying to get more customers or you, you know what,
whatever it is, right? And then of course, there's the
promotion piece, right? So that people purpose and
promotion is really what encompasses the strategic plan.

(37:31):
And that's why E is so important, the execution,
because most, most people, and especially for business owners,
they're just that that's where it falls apart.
You can have these best amazing plans, but they fall apart in
execution. So you have to have an execution
piece and you really need to know and delineate what, what
things you're going to do every single day that are going to be

(37:52):
your needle movers towards making sure that you're getting
closer and closer to your strategic plan.
So, and then the at the R at theend of the Viper method is the
reporting piece. And that's where you track your
numbers, you track your metrics and you're tracking your lead
metrics, which are your activities and you're tracking
your lag metrics were the results of those activities.
So if you're not anywhere you need to be, it's actually quite

(38:13):
simple. You just need to look at your
inputs and you just need to lookat your, at your, your
execution. You just need to look at your
activities and adjust from there.
Yeah. I'm so glad you added those to
that because I also agree with you in that execution is
typically where a lot of people fall off.
Can you maybe theorize or maybe elaborate on why you think a lot

(38:36):
of people fall off on that execution stage?
Is it fear or is it is it not knowing what to do?
What would you say it is? How, how long, how long do we
have? There's a ton of reasons, right?
There's, I mean, there's, there's many, many reasons.
A lot of it is fear You, you, you were right on that.

(38:57):
And, and some of it is imposter syndrome.
They feel like they're, they're actually not worthy of success,
even though they say that they want it and they're doing all
these, you know, all these things.
But realistically, they're not working on their mindset.
They're not working on the interior part, which is really
they're going to, they're going to find ways to sabotage
themselves. You've got all this fear and

(39:20):
self sabotaging behavior going on.
Many business owners are tend tobe ADHD prone, which, you know,
I, I, I, I get it, I understand,but they have, as a result, they
have this shiny object syndrome where they're, where they're
really love. They, you know, they, they never
met an idea they didn't love until the next idea, right?

(39:40):
And they, you know, every time they go in the shower, they come
out with three more business ideas, right?
And, and I get that, I understand it, but they're, they
don't, they never stop long enough to get traction in any
One Direction. And as a result, you just kind
of vibrate in place. You're kind of like a molecule
just, you know, vibrating in place, never really getting
anywhere. And and that's and that's a

(40:02):
shame because when you when you really can get momentum and
going in One Direction and stay in that One Direction rather
than, and I'm not, I'm not talking about pivoting.
I'm not talking about, you know,like a line, like a linebacker,
you know, some or, or, or fullback, right?
He takes the ball. He doesn't go straight into the
end zone. He like he would love to, but
no, he has to zigzag right. He has to go left and right and
left right, But he's always going.

(40:22):
He's always going. You know, north-south, he's not,
he's not running left and right too much because he knows the
end of the field is the goal. So that's where he's trying to
get to. And that's where I feel like a
lot of business owners lose sight of that because they're
not clear on their vision or they're doing things that
they're not well suited for. You know, I, I read, so I read

(40:44):
this book. It's actually sitting on my
desk. I just finished it a little bit
ago yesterday, but it's a book called the four Agreements and
colleague of ours, Walter Amarillo, he was, he'd been
telling me about this book for awhile.
And if you've not read the four agreements, I'm not going to
spoil it, but you know, the, the, the 4th agreement is to

(41:05):
always do your best. And this one really hit me
really hard. He's like, it's, it's very easy
to always do your best when you enjoy what it is that you do.
And I was like, holy crap, man. Like, like there's times where
I'm not doing my best because I don't enjoy the activity that
I'm doing. And it's really hard for anyone

(41:26):
to do their best over over a long period of time when they're
just doing it for money or when they're just doing it for, you
know, for some magical, hey, I want $10 million in the bank or
$30 million or 50 rental units or whatever that whatever.
The thing is that doesn't have anything to do with what they
are really good at. And they say that they love real

(41:48):
estate and they love this. I'm like, really like, you don't
love anything else, right? Like I, I like, I love the
challenge of it too. But I also love hanging out with
our two year old right now, who,you know, when we say, Hey, it's
time to go to bed, all she does is, you know, she, you know, she
blows raspberries at us and she runs away, which is hilarious,
right? But it's so fun because we just
really enjoy that time with, with, you know, raising her.

(42:11):
We have a 19 year old, We have a17 year old and you know, we
have this 2 year old daughter and it's so fun being a parent
now. You know, I'm in my early 50s
and I just really, really enjoy that.
And I wouldn't be able to do that if I was constantly
obsessed about the next deal or the next thing.
And I'm like, this isn't about playing small, but it's about
being able to pull other things into neutral and be intentional

(42:33):
and be where I'm at and not 1000miles away when I'm, when I'm
supposed to be sitting and relaxing and, and, and doing
those things. So you ask, you asked a really
good question. Why does it fall apart in
execution? I think it's a lot of reasons
and most of it is around mindset, most of it around what
what is going on in the interiorof our heads.
And that's the piece of real estate that most people forget

(42:54):
to work on, to work on. Very good point.
I'd also like to talk about another part of the book that
really, I mean, almost the wholebook really opened my eyes to a
lot of stuff. But one thing that I'd like to
talk about a little bit more is the whole idea of a personal
vision versus a business vision,because I've always mixed those

(43:17):
two together. And after reading your book and
seeing that you also have some supplemental material, maybe you
can talk about that. But yeah, I always, just always
had the vision together, right? Like you go to work, you're
going to get to travel and all that stuff is all in one, but
you like to talk about it's how important it is to delineate

(43:40):
those two and have one personal vision and one business vision.
Can you talk about that and how your supplemental books will
help people write it down and and and get it clear in their
head? Yeah.
So the the we'll, I'll come backto the guides here in a second.
But the, but the, the personal vision and the business vision I

(44:02):
had to get like in the early days, it was all, all I had was
a business vision. And when I started talking to
more and more real estate investors and business owners,
they didn't have a personal vision.
You know, they're like, yeah, let me let me make 50 or 100
grand a month and then I'll worry about this personal vision
thing. And meanwhile, their life is

(44:24):
passing them by and you know, all these life events are
happening and they're not able to do it because they're chasing
this, this business vision that they have.
So it's just really interesting that you know, when, and that's
exactly what I had back in 2000 and eight, 2009 is I had this

(44:45):
business vision and where did itget me?
It, it landed me in the hospital.
I, I, I missed out on major lifeevents.
I had a really, really close friend who passed away and there
was no way in the world I could get, get away long enough to go
to his darn funeral. And like, I never forgot that.
And I so all of these life events were happening and

(45:08):
meanwhile I'm just toiling on and on and on.
And, you know, I had a relationship that was circling
the bowl at that point in time. And so that kind of went away
and all these different things. And so when I got really, really
clear about what I wanted in my personal vision, and I will tell
you, it was really a lot harder than I had anticipated because I

(45:30):
had such a such a hit to myself worth and and and my my own
internal head trash. You know, it's kind of funny.
I tell people the story that, you know, I had, you know, I had
my hand like I was sat down to write a personal vision in terms
of what I wanted, what I wanted my life, my life to look like
and relationships and, you know,and all these things.

(45:52):
And my hand trembled at the thought of writing something
down. And I was like, what is going on
with me? And I remembered the only way I
was able to actually write it down, I was I was so in my
apartment, I had a small apartment and I was sitting in a
whiteboard and I shut the door and I had I had an eraser next

(46:16):
to the whiteboard as I'm writingit.
So that way in case someone camein and shot me in the head, I
could at least like wipe it down.
Like I wasn't, oh, I was just kidding.
Didn't really want that right asthe only way I could really do
that. And I was like, bam, what is
what is going on in my head? And it wasn't until years later
I decided I discovered this, allthis limiting, limiting beliefs

(46:37):
that I was carrying around with me and thinking that I was just
going to power through it. But I really was just, it was I
was running uphill on a, on a pile of ball bearings.
It just wasn't going to work. So it wasn't until I did that
inner work and it's really started to figure out and how
to, and how to reprogram that and how to, and how to
recondition my mind around my approach to money, around my
approach to time. You know, I mentioned earlier

(46:58):
about, about people who have ADHD tend to flock to, to
entrepreneurship. And it's kind of funny because
when I started researching that I realized that there are, you
know, there is the, the, the, the watch of the ADHD person.
There's two settings. There's now and there's not now.

(47:21):
So if you came in and said, hey Mark, we need to leave in 5
minutes, I interpret that as great, we don't have to leave
now. So I'm going to get 17 more
things done before we have to leave in 5 minutes.
Of course, in 5 minutes time. That means when that's when I
get up and get my shoes on and oh wait, I got to get that thing

(47:42):
and now, now we're 10 minutes late for leaving even though you
told me 5 minutes ago, hey, we're leaving in 5 minutes,
right. So that's, that's that
relationship with time that happens.
And you know, even even that hasgotten better once I've learned
how to recondition this, you know, wonderfully broken machine
that I have inside my head. So you know that, that the whole

(48:04):
concept about creating the personal vision 1st and then
then in, in this particular case, back in 2009, 2010, when I
was rebuilding, I was creating abusiness vision that was in
alignment with my personal vision.
So I'm not just saying that everything was in direct, you
know, it, it, it direct linear path life is very seldom that

(48:25):
convenient. But you know, when you have a
business vision or, or when you,when you have a business vision
and you haven't really thought of a personal vision, you end up
creating a life that exists to serve the business.
And again, when you have that business vision and no personal
vision, your business vision becomes your personal vision

(48:46):
because you have nothing else tofocus on.
So this is about, you know, whatdo you want your marriage to
look like? What do you want your
relationship with your kids to look like?
What do you want your relationship with your friends
to look like? What do you want your faith to
look like? You know, what do you, what kind
of things do you want, right? Like it's cool to have cool
stuff, but what kind of person do you want to be?
You know, do you want to be known as a philanthropist?

(49:06):
Do you want to be known as someone who is funny?
So, you know, quick with a joke,you know, like whatever it is,
you know, what kind of person you want to be and, and, and
what, what kind of things do youwant to do?
So it's not always about the thing that you want to have.
And then using a calendar to find what that what that
personal vision would be. So it really is a passion of
mine to make sure that people are focusing on the right

(49:28):
things, focusing on their personal vision and everything
that they create is in support of that, of that main circuit
breaker. Everything that they build from
their business vision down to their infrastructure, their
process, their execution, reporting, everything supports
that personal vision. I love that.
Can you? I haven't had a chance to get my
hands on your guides yet. I, I can't wait for them to come

(49:50):
in the mail. I, I know you're still kind of
waiting on a couple to come out.Can you kind of maybe give us a
sneak peek of of what to expect?Is there one geared towards the
vision? I I believe there was.
So in the in the time wealthy advantage, there is there's a
support website which has the personal vision road map and it

(50:13):
kind of walks people through that whole thing.
So if you get the book, you don't necessarily need the
guides for the personal vision. However, the guides are really
important in a bunch of other ways.
So in the book I talked about the four core functions of
business, which are lead generation, sales, operations
and accounting, 4 core functions, lead Gen. sales
operations, accounting. And so one of those things which

(50:35):
actually does support kind of what you're talking about in
terms of your personal vision, it's actually the strategic 1
sheets. It's actually the supplement #4
out of all four of them, we'll tell your listeners how they can
get the book. And all four, please don't go
and buy them on Amazon. They're way more expensive and I
don't have control. And you wouldn't mean I'd be
able to sign them actually, if you're able to buy them through

(50:58):
my website, but we'll give you the link for your listeners
here. But the, the, the really cool
thing though, about the four court, the, the four guides is
there is one on lead generation and it's, it's certain aspects
of lead generation that I reallycouldn't write about in the book
because they would have made thebook was already almost 300
pages. So I pulled different elements

(51:19):
out of that and you know, for the lead generation, but then I
did something a little bit different with sales and there's
certain checklist items in there.
There's certain things in there that are that'll help you with
mindset that you can carry around that guide when you are
going into a selling conversation, you know, and, and
walk you through sometimes just when you, when you have a bad
sale, you know, when you get your nose bloodied, you know,

(51:39):
that happens from time to time. But also from the accounting
side, there's also the main guides in accounting where
there's just certain things thatyou just need to know.
And as a business owner, a lot of times we're thinking, well,
shoot, like you know, you hear aphrase like EBITDA and you're
like, well, what's EBITDA? Right?
Well, it's earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation
and amortization. Well, you're like, great, what

(52:02):
is EBITDA, right? Well, it, it's a, it's a
financial measure, right? But, but again, I don't want to
make you into an accountant. I just want to make you someone
who is fluent and understanding enough.
So when someone says, oh, let's take a look at your balance
sheet, you know what a balance sheet is and what it represents
and what it looks like and what it should look like, right?
When you have an income statement or P&L or profit and

(52:22):
loss, yes, all three of those things are exactly the same
thing. An income statement and AP and L
and a profit and loss are the same thing.
It's just people using differentverbiage for the same thing.
I'm an accounting background purist so I usually use the word
income statement, but again, they're all the same thing, you
know? Should you care about what a
general Ledger is? Should you care what a statement

(52:43):
of cash flows is? You know, so all these different
things that people talk about when, when they're referencing,
you know, things like general Ledger and all these different,
these different financial terms.That is what we talked about in
the accounting guide. And just, it's just meant to be
a guide against something that you can have and flip through
and, and, and get convenient with.
So these are all about 40 pages long.

(53:05):
They're not super duper long. They're not meant to be super
long. They're meant to be good, just
guides to help you out through your day and that things that
you can carry around and work and and have them with you as
references so you don't have to flip through a 300 page book to
find these, these these these individual things.
All right, well, sounds good. Can you tell the listeners where
to get buy some copies of your book and then we'll also put a

(53:28):
link in the in the comments. Yeah, it's, it's pretty
straightforward. It's
strategicboardroom.com/RPPfor for your podcast here.
But just go there and there's, there's a, there's a neat offer
that I'm I'm able to do this foryour listeners and I'm going to

(53:48):
keep it up there as long as I can it.
But keep in mind if I get too busy, I may have to change the
offer. But for right now, it'll be the
book offer. And that is you'll get a copy of
the book plus A, a 60 minute session with me.
It'll be a 60 minute, 1 to one session solely with me.
We can talk about whatever it isyou want to talk about.

(54:10):
And then then there if you want to buy the four guides in
addition to that, you can get them for a special price there
on the website as well. So again, way cheaper that way
to get them than going through Amazon.
And and I can also sign it, signthe book and address it to you
if you like. Wow, thank you for that and

(54:30):
thank you for that offer for ourlisteners.
We really appreciate it and I highly encourage you guys to get
in the book. It's a great read.
Mark is a a wonderful author. He's got great stories going
throughout the whole thing. So it's not just all business
and boring stuff, it's it's reallife stuff.
It's there's a real life story that blends through the entire

(54:50):
book. So so it's a good read.
I highly recommend it. All right, let's shift gears
here for a second. We're going to try something
brand new on this episode. We're going to do a lightning
round that we call the BookshelfBattle.
I know Mark loves to read books.He's always reading new books

(55:11):
all the time. So what we're going to do is
we're going to do we're going todo a lightning round where I'll
throw out five different topics and both Mark and I will each
throw out one book that we recommend for that topic.
So could be investing mindset, anything that fits.
So let's see how this goes. And if you have the book, grab

(55:34):
it. I got a couple here I could grab
too. So the first topic is what is
your best book just in real estate in general?
Well, Mark finds that book. I'll go first.
My my number one just in generalreal estate book is got to be
the real estate millionaire investor.

(55:54):
That one's by Gary Keller. So now Mark, which one?
What's your number? One real estate so the so this
is the this is a book I read back in college.
So if if I look at the copyrighton this book now, I don't know
if you can see how yellow the pages are, but the pages are so
yellow in this book, but it's it's very timeless.
But the copyright on this book is 1997 by Prentice Hill.

(56:20):
So I Yep, that's a that's a that's a salty 1.
So that but that is the that that one is a probably one of my
better real estate books. I like that one.
OK. Productivity or time management?
The one that's jumping out at mein terms of time management is
probably The Four Hour Work Weekby Tim Ferriss.

(56:40):
I didn't really love that book, but it's right here.
But it was the thing that I liked about it from time
management perspective is that he just said basically when it
comes to time management, forgetall about it.
And I, I remember him, you know,saying that in the book.
And it was, again, this one's quite salty too.
And you can see how yellow some of these pages are.

(57:02):
But he talked about that in terms of, of, of time
management. But there was, I think that one
was probably on time management if you're looking at
productivity. Oh, I know the the 12 week year
was actually quite good. That one.
Brian Moran, the 12 week year. This actually is where I kind of

(57:25):
came up with the idea. I, I, I called them something
different, but terms of lead metrics and lag metrics.
But this is one that I actually referenced in the the time
wealthy advantage and this is a really, really good book in
terms of productivity. I really like this one.
Nice. I'll also go with the four hour
work work week. That was one of my favorite.
You know, Tim Ferriss, I thought, wrote it pretty well.

(57:47):
I know a lot of people really like that one topic #3 mindset
and personal growth. Mindset and personal growth and
that's such a broad area, but once that one of the ones that I
that I tell people about is JackCanfield's the success
principles. I really, really like this one.

(58:10):
It kind of just lays it out intoI think there's 67 different
principles that he has in here. This is probably one of my go to
is when people ask me for books on just personal development to
start with. I really like Jack Canfield's
The Success Principles. I think that's a really good
place for most people to start. Nice.
I'm going to go with a classic. You can tell this is an old copy

(58:32):
to think and grow rich here. I think that's a great book to
to change the way that your mindthinks.
And it's kind of like put your thoughts out into the universe
and, and, and those wishes will will come to you.
So I'm really big on that type of stuff.
I know it can be a little bit like metaphysical or like a

(58:53):
little bit out there, but I think it's really good to to at
least have that vision and put it out there in the universe
because I do feel like the universe does give it back in
some way. So I like that for mindset.
I added this topic on here because I know which one I like
and most people like, but you have another one that you like

(59:14):
and I, I hope that you know you can share it with us.
Book on negotiation. So a lot.
Of people. Yeah, a lot of people go with
the one I'm going to go with, soI'm going to take it first.
But I know that you have anotherone that you like.
I like never split the difference.
That's by Chris Voss. Yeah.
So that's one of my favorite on negotiation, but you have
another one. What's what's the one that you

(59:36):
like? Yeah.
So this one here, this is by an author and his name is Doctor
Mark Golston. Just listen.
Yeah. So Chris Boss, I think wrote a
wrote a fine book. I think this one's better.
I think this one is far better in terms of actual practicality.

(59:58):
And I I I don't know why. I mean, it was just the book was
just marketed better. I read it and I was like, OK.
And then I read this book not knowing really what Just Listen
was just about. And he has got the same pedigree
as Chris Boss. He was AFBI negotiator and
negotiated all these different things.

(01:00:19):
And he but he's much more clinical in terms of what to
actually listen for when people are there in fight or flight.
And he does such an amazing job of, of, of, of knowing when
someone starts to break out of fight or flight and into their
limbic brain and you're not ableto negotiate with them yet, but

(01:00:40):
you're trying to get them to cognitive when people are
yelling at you, calm down. Right?
Like that's not going to work, right?
It's saying, Hey, what's got youso pissed?
And they're like, man, I'm, you're right, I'm pissed.
I'm so mad. You're like, oh, you're mad
right now. They've labeled it.
Now you're, you're not out of the woods, but now you're,
you're getting them to you because they put a label on it.
Now you're able they're you're using higher level of cognition

(01:01:03):
and you're getting them out of fight or flight out of that that
reptilian brain into the limbic brain and further the journey
towards the cognitive thinking brain.
So he does such a great job of actually referencing how to do
that in this book. In my opinion, I think this is
this is the one that you should read whenever it's remember just
around human negotiation or human interaction.

(01:01:24):
Fantastic read. Just listened by Mark Goldston.
Nice. Thanks for that last one.
Entrepreneurship. I'm, I mean, we got E myth,
right? That's kind of to me usually the
number one that's kind of one ofthe best one is the E myth.
There's a bunch of different other E myths too.
I have a couple of them up here,Awaken the Entrepreneur within,

(01:01:48):
E myth mastery, E myth real estate investor edition.
There's all sorts of different editions.
So there's a huge selection of Emyth books.
Yeah, I, I, I think realistically when you're, when
you're looking, man, that's so good.

(01:02:10):
One of the things that I feel like when with entrepreneurs,
one of the things that they, they, they try to do is they,
they, they focus too much on thesystems upfront when really what
they need to be doing is focusing on lead generation.
So that's why I'm, I'm struggling with this when I
think about it, entrepreneurship, like if
they're literally just starting out, like you're literally have
an idea. I'm kind of leaning more towards

(01:02:34):
Dan Kennedy's books. And Dan Kennedy wrote, I mean,
he, he's a, he's written probably more than two dozen
books at this point and he has this whole no BS series, you
know, no BS selling to the affluent, no BS direct direct
sales, you know, all these different, these different
books. I would say probably the, the no

(01:02:57):
BS direct sale. I actually don't have that book
here. I think I was using it to
reference somewhere. But I think that's probably what
I would recommend just because it's, it tease the people up.
So it's actually called no direct, no BS direct sales.
That's it. Direct marketing.

(01:03:17):
Yep, that's it. That's the one.
Fantastic one. You will.
It is probably one of the best books he's ever written and I've
read almost everything he's got and and some of them were
really, really good. Probably his no no BS selling to
the Apple 1 is probably his bestbook.

(01:03:40):
But I will tell you his audible on that book is different than
the than that one selling to theapple.
Yep. So there's that one that that
one is different than the audible and I've because I've
done both and the book is way better than the audible.
It's not the same, not the same book.
So anyway, I think. Those two books, have you had a

(01:04:02):
chance to read that one? It's on my stack of shame, but I
have not read that one yet. Maybe this is a good one for
that topic for time management. It, it could be that he wrote
one that was no, no BS, no, it was no BS management or direct

(01:04:25):
management or what did he say? I can't I'm, I'm, I'm having a
brain cramp, but that was a green cover.
But he did that one. Those are all sitting in my, my
conference room. But because I do reference those
books actually quite a bit. And that one was kind of like,
like it was, it was, it was pretty, pretty brutal about time

(01:04:47):
management there, but especiallyfor entrepreneurs.
So I have not read that specific1 though.
It's but it's. It's in my stack of shame.
All right. Well, thank you for being a part
of the first First Lightning Round bookshelf.
Battle. This was fun.
So on our show, we also give away a free book each week to
our listeners. So some of the ones we have to

(01:05:09):
give away for free. So we got a couple.
There we go. We're also giving away time
Wealthy advantages to 1 Lucky winner.
So to enter, all you have to do is like the episode and leave a
comment on which book you'd liketo receive and we'll ship it to
your house for free. You must enter within five days,
five days of the air date. Mark Delfini's message is

(01:05:34):
simple, but powerful. Real estate isn't just about
money. It's about time.
The goal of real estate isn't tobuild a business that traps you,
it's to design one that gives you freedom.
In the Time Wealthy Advantage, Mark shows how to shift focus
from chasing income to creating systems that protect your time,

(01:05:58):
your peace, and your priorities.If your business owns your
calendar, you don't own your life.
So step back, build with intention, and remember,
financial freedom is hollow without time freedom.
Live by design, not by default. Mark, thanks for joining us on

(01:06:20):
the Real Prop Pro podcast. We really appreciate it.
It was you made a lot of fun. It was really good to be here
and I hope your listeners got a lot of a lot of use and
implement. Make sure you execute and thanks
so much for the time. I do appreciate it.
All right, everyone else, thanksfor tuning in and we'll catch
you next time.