April 16, 2024 • 59 mins
Welcome to Rediscovering Connection!
In this episode I speak to Aarti Palmer, a brand strategist, who spent 10 years in Malaysia before returning to the UK, and finding her ikigai.
We navigate topics of authenticity vs AI, our online/offline personality, and getting used to local customs, even when they go against our natural impulse!
Aarti shares valuable insights on creating the foundations of your personal brand, and the importance of only sharing what feels comfortable on social media.
Tune in for an engaging discussion on connecting with and through our personal brand.
Get in touch with Aarti:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/aartiparmar/
www.aartiparmar.com
Aarti Parmar is an award-winning Certified Brand Strategist and Qualified Coach who loves to educate and activate aspiring legacy leaders to mindfully define their brand to use it with intent, joy, and impact.
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I hope our conversation inspires you to rediscover connection in your personal or professional life.
Subscribe now and let the magic unfold.
Love & sparkles,
✨Shelley
About Your Host
Hello you, I’m Shelley Doyle, founder of The Communiverse.
Through our 90-day program, The Social Wealth Roadmap, we empower remote and relocated leaders, founders, and creators build real-world social wealth—so they feel connected, trusted, and supported, both online and offline, no matter where they are in the world.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Why do you want to build a personal brand?
How does that one benefit you?
How does that two benefit thepeople that are going to
experience you?
Because I always kind of say apersonal brand is the stamp of
value that you deliver to others.
There's this misconception.
It's all about your wholepersonal life and, yes, there
(00:23):
are elements of your personallife.
That's why it's called personalbrand, but it doesn't have to
be your private life.
I know lots of brilliantLinkedIn content creators.
I don't even know what theirpartners, kids you know what
anyone looks like, but they, Ifeel like I do know them a bit
(00:45):
more on a personal level in thatsense, because of how they
share things.
And that's connected to comingback to your own purpose,
mission, vision, what you know.
What's my objective here?
What do I want to achieve bybuilding my personal brand?
Who do I want to influence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
You know who do I want toinfluence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
(01:05):
You know who do I want toattract to me?
Who do I want to be the obviouschoice for?
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Good morning from beautiful British Columbia.
My name is Shelley Keridwen andyou're listening to
Rediscovering Connection.
If this is your first timelistening to one of my podcasts,
then welcome.
If this is your first timelistening to one of my podcasts,
then welcome.
This podcast has been such anamazing journey for me.
This is episode 21 with ArtiePalmer and all of the episodes
(01:33):
have been extremely differentand I've really been finding my
voice as I've been going throughthis journey, figuring out what
topic really is in my heart andmy soul.
And rediscovering connection issomething that I have been
doing in my own life for thelast two years, reconnecting
with beautiful individualswho've been part of my life,
(01:53):
getting some recommendationsfrom some friends of mine on who
I should have on my podcast anda few people who I didn't know
at all, and I've kind of justdipped my toe in the water to
connect with these new beautifulsouls who are doing some great
work in this world.
So essentially, it's all aboutrediscovering connection with
ourselves, with each other, andI'm speaking to researchers,
(02:15):
facilitators, community builderswho have found ways to
rediscover connection.
That's very different, that'snew, that's innovative and
hopefully you shall learn athing or two.
So this episode is with an oldfriend of mine, business
networking colleague from our StAlbans day, artie Palmer.
She is a personal brandingspecialist.
(02:37):
So we really go deep in thisepisode to talk about how our
personal brand is kind of anexternal representation of who
we feel inside and how to makethat an authentic representation
and how we can help ourpersonal brand to feel good on
us.
I really hope you enjoy this.
Artie was very generous withher insights, really opening up
(03:01):
the curtain and letting us seethe work that she does with her
clients to help them to find thepersonal brand that they feel
proud and excited about showingto the world.
So welcome, enjoy and I'll seeyou on the other side.
Welcome, artie, how are you?
Speaker 1 (03:18):
I am wonderful, and it's just so lovely to reconnect
again, and this is this alone,is the power of personal brand
right?
How, how many years ago weconnected, stay connected, sort
of you know, seeing each other'sbeing on each other's radar on
linkedin.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
and then here we are beautiful, yes indeed, and
linkedin has really been where Ihave seen you and your personal
brand shine through, and you'reone of only a handful of
individuals whose posts I alwayssee and like a little bit
envious, in all honesty, becausethey're just always so like a
(03:55):
beautiful representation of you,like they feel good to receive,
without kind of ickiness ofsales.
It's kind of just very natural.
You do this well, oh appreciatethat.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Thank you that.
That that means a lot really,like intentional time and effort
does go into those posts, so itmeans a lot to to get those
encouraging words back.
Thank you so how?
Speaker 2 (04:20):
how has your journey been really to find your
personal brand?
Because when I first met you, Ithink you were involved in your
parents' business, theBangalore Olofsson business and
then since then you kind ofweaved your own business out.
So how is that journey to?
I guess it's once you find yourown personal brand.
(04:41):
Then you're like wow, this issomething I'm really passionate
about and this is something thatI know that I can serve for
other people.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, that's it, and that's quite a big question.
How has it been?
I think it's been, honestly,it's an introspective journey.
That's that's probably where itreally really starts.
And you know, it's really what?
Probably in the last seven toten years, maybe seven years or
(05:10):
so, since you know you'regetting more awareness around
personal brand and definitely inthe last two years, you know
it's become more and more andmore of a thing, and I remember
a few years ago where peoplewere like, oh so what do you
think it's going to be the trendfor brand and you know business
and stuff, and it was alwaysthis thing like, really
important, build your personalbrand, build your personal brand
, your personal profile.
(05:30):
It's going to be equally asimportant or, if not, you know,
more important than alsobuilding your business brand,
because they are sointerconnected.
But coming back to yourquestion, gosh, you know I don't
think there is a thing of well,today I'm going to start my
(05:50):
personal brand journey.
It's been going on.
It's more of how have I becomemore aware that I am a brand and
what am I going to do about it?
I am a brand and what am I goingto do about it?
Because I've often had businessowners saying, oh, you know,
should I start my personal brandor I don't want to?
(06:11):
And my answer is always like,you already are a personal brand
.
It's now about how are yougoing to get really intentional
about getting known for what itis you actually want to be known
for?
So we've all, always have, beenpersonal brands.
You know we already arerepresenting something I love.
(06:34):
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Let's just dive deeper into that.
How you're already a personalbrand.
How do you want to startbecoming known for what you are?
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Yep, yep, you know, there's always that.
There's that very famous sayingby Jeff Bezos your brand is
what other people say about youwhen you're not in the room, and
what I like to do is take thata combination of created
perceptions, and it is thoseperceptions that form
(07:09):
associations and emotionalconnections to your brand.
So we, what we really need todo, is start thinking about what
beliefs are we forming inpeople's minds, so, when we are
out of that room, that they aresaying what we want them to say
about us, and that's probably agood place to start.
(07:31):
So, when people are out of thatroom, are they actually saying
what we want them to say aboutus?
And it comes from us, right?
Whatever we put out there iswhat people are going to know
and believe about us.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Beautiful, beautiful put out there is what people are
going to know and believe aboutus beautiful, beautiful.
And this just touches on so muchof the work that I do to help
people reconnect with themselves.
Because if we don't know kind ofthe pivotal stories that have
really shaped our worldview, ifwe don't know what stories are
really alive for us that we wantto be sharing, if we haven't
done that kind of the work, thenwhen we're in company those
(08:11):
stories are not going to benaturally flowing.
And I guess that's when that'swhen people just start becoming
passive, kind of passivelyinvolved in conversations and
they're not proactivelyexpressing themselves in a way
(08:31):
that they want to be seen.
And this is so important forpeople who move location, who
the people in their lives do notknow them, they haven't got
that background of them.
So we need to really bereconnecting with ourselves so
that, so that people can get toknow the real essence of you, so
(08:53):
important, so important.
So I'd love to just get alittle bit of a sneak preview
behind the scenes of, like, howyou would work with clients who
are unsure of what theirpersonal brand is.
Maybe they've been in businessa few years and they're
realizing that actually they aretheir spokesperson, like how?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
do you?
get under the skin of it andreally help them to to get out
of themselves what theirpersonal brand might look or
feel like yeah, yeah, no, andit's a really good question
because I can tell you, majorityof the time when people come to
me, um, you know, inquiry call,networking, that kind of thing,
or you know, do you know what,artie?
I just, you know, I just don'tknow how to show up on social
(09:35):
media, I don't know what to sayabout my business, I'm not
articulating it very well, youknow, I don't know what kind of
content to put out there.
So nobody really actually comesto me saying, artie, I need
brand strategy.
Ever, it's always these otherthings.
And what that actually means isthat, in essence, they don't
(09:58):
have clarity around their own.
Well, their brand narrative andthat brand narrative is
actually a combination of theirbusiness and personal brand.
They, they aren't two separate,separate things because, you
know, especially if we'reservice-based businesses as well
, right, because if there'ssomebody who's delivering that
(10:18):
service, it's going to beconnected to, to, to the brand
in in in that sense.
So, in terms of when I'm workingwith somebody, first and
foremost, what I do and helpthem understand is what brand is
.
There's so many differentdefinitions, so many different
thoughts about branding.
You know, I've been on callswhere, like I'm really, you know
(10:40):
, I'm so stressed about my logoand my color palette and, you
know, for me I'm like it's thelast thing you need to be
stressed about.
What you really want to bethinking about is what are your
brand fundamentals?
You know, what do you stand for, what's your essence, what's
your personality, all of thesethings, because then it's the
brand that will inform thebranding which is the whole sort
(11:01):
of you know, logo messaging,logo messaging visuals, graphics
and color palette andtypography and that side of
things.
So, coming back to so, my firststep is actually helping them to
understand brand and the roleit plays in your business,
because what you may want foryour business and what a
competitor may want, it's twocompletely different things.
(11:24):
Everyone's got their owndifferent journeys, values,
beliefs, stories, experiences,expertise that they bring to the
table, even if they are abusiness that is delivering
similar outcomes.
So, first and foremost, we needto understand who are you?
Well, what is a brand?
And then, who are you?
(11:45):
Well, what is a brand?
And then who are you as a brand?
I always say you know, thebusiness sells a product and
service and the brand is theidentity that attracts people to
the business you know, I lovethat word, I love that word
attract as well because this isthe whole thing with, I guess,
soul aligned businesses.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
We're not looking to sell, we're looking to attract
people into our energy, peoplethat are aligned clients so
we're not.
We're not selling, we areserving exactly I guess in that
way, as a personal brand, it's a, it's a way for you to show
yourself, to attract those idealclients into your orbit,
(12:28):
absolutely and in a way thatfeels really good for everybody.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Yeah, and it's a form of expression, isn't it In that
sense?
And coming back to attract,what then that also does?
It doesn't feel like such a oh,this is so hard.
You know that kind of thing.
When you're in that energy ofattract because you're pulling
people towards you, as opposedto push, push, push, push, push,
(12:57):
push, it's hard work, isn't it?
Whereas when you reallyunderstand who you are for, who
you're serving, why you'reserving them, why you, in that
sense, you then start to alsoeliminate who you're not for,
therefore giving more space forattraction beautiful, beautiful,
(13:22):
which is why niching is soimportant.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
I was um.
I was part of a hackathon a fewweeks ago um, for it's for
island health here on VancouverIsland and it was the.
I.
I put a challenge into it whichwas how to combat loneliness on
Vancouver Island, which wasselected by island health as a
wild card, which is amazing.
So it's a huge opportunity.
I got to pitch my idea, I builta team and over the course of
(13:49):
48 hours we came up with asolution which we did.
We did reach the finals, whichwe then presented to a room of
like 300 people.
We didn't get any further, butI was really, really stoked to
have got that far because itgave me brilliant practice in
front of a good number of peopleand great networking
opportunity.
But one of the really big takesI got from that was how
(14:14):
challenging it is to create asolution for the general public,
because that's what it, that'swhat it was, and they wanted you
to be as inclusive with yoursolution as you possibly could.
And I went away from there witha lot of reflection.
I've spent weeks reflecting onit and just thinking, gosh, I
(14:36):
feel blessed that I can now kindof go back to my niche.
It is really like expats,repatriate people who move
people that I really understandthe problems that they're facing
um and I and I think down theline I will definitely be
looking to expand this out toencompass and be accessible to a
(14:59):
lot more people.
But niching just makes our lifeeasier because we can really
become masters within that niche.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Exactly, and it makes your audience's life easier.
You know if they are lookingfor something specific and
they're going into Google andstuff and they've got you know
eight, ten different options andthen they've got the one that
is actually really niched downto what it is that they really
want.
It's just an easier pick, isn'tit?
(15:31):
You're helping them save time,and we know how time poor we all
are anyway.
So when you're already you knoweliminating and you're out
maneuvering your competitionthrough and I say ethically
outmaneuvering your competition,you know, through your own
niche and through your ownstrengths and stuff like that,
at the end of the day, we'rehere to serve our audience, so
(15:52):
if we make their journey to useasier, then they're gonna love
us even more and I guess,thinking about that journey and
thinking about making it easy.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
there's so many tools out there where we can express
our personal brand spreadingourselves too thinly, Like maybe
(16:27):
when we've got virtualassistants and they can be
publishing on our behalf andresponding on our behalf.
The game might change.
But when we are solopreneurs,actually having too many
different platforms can consumeso much of our energy.
Do you work with your clientsin that way to decide which
platforms are actually the rightfit for their personal brand?
Speaker 1 (16:47):
yeah, yeah.
So, coming back to how I workwith with my clients, so I've
created a proven brand maximizerframework that I take
businesses through, whether it'sthe one person business or and
I only mainly work with ownermanaged businesses, so I'm not
in the corporate space and stufflike that, but regardless of
(17:08):
what size they are.
So some of the people mainlywork with owner-managed
businesses, so I'm not in thecorporate space and stuff like
that, but regardless of whatsize they are.
So some of the people I workwith they've got a team of 150,
300 people.
Some of them are the one-personbusiness.
But what is the key thing behindall of this?
Whether you are managing yourplatforms and stuff, as I'm
taking them through the platform, it is about getting deeper
into understanding thefundamentals.
So the internal strategicsaround the purpose, mission,
(17:30):
vision, values, all of thosekind of things.
And then we've got the externalaround the positioning,
customer identity, tone of voiceand USPs and all of those other
external things.
Once these things are piecedtogether, this is what I then
call is a brand narrative startscoming together.
Once you have that and thatunderstanding, that will then
(17:54):
start dictating.
Oh, that's where my audienceare.
They're not on TikTok, they'reactually on LinkedIn and I've
had clients who've got a bit ofpresence on TikTok.
They're actually on LinkedInand I've had clients who've got
a bit of presence on TikTok andit's almost like what are you
doing there, you know kind ofthing.
When, actually, when we'velooked at their sort of all
different audience clusters andthat's the other thing, you know
, we don't just only have oneaudience profile Majority.
(18:20):
A lot of us businesses also havewhat I would call audience,
different audience clusters andit's okay to talk to them
separately in different places,in different places, and you
know I've had clients that butbut I've only and I'm like no,
it's okay, you can even createlanding pages for your different
audience profiles, but you knowthe overall brand and what you
(18:44):
stand for, why you're doing whatyou're doing.
The mission, purpose, visiondoesn't change, but who you're
serving for, for for thisparticular, this product or this
product or this service, thatcan change, that's okay, that's
fine and it will.
You know, in a business cycle,this will change.
So, therefore, understandingthat customer identity will help
to then dictate where you needto spend your time and effort
(19:08):
and money and energy accordingto your vision of your short,
medium and long term goals.
Because some of this workdoesn't get done with business
owners.
It feels like I'm all over theplace, I'm hitting a brick wall.
You, you know, my competitorsare just running circles around
us, that kind of thing.
It's this deeper work, thesethese fundamentals that need to
(19:31):
be looked into.
Um, and it will start drawingout a picture beautiful,
beautiful.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, what's coming up for me there is just thinking
about my personal um brand andvisibility and on Instagram, for
example, I very much speak tomy, my individual clients, kind
of the expats, repatriates,location, independent
entrepreneurs.
And then on LinkedIn, I'm morespeaking to corporates and HR
(20:01):
leaders to bring me in todeliver workshops to their
globally mobile workforce soyeah, I, unintentionally I'm
doing this a little bit.
I can definitely get better,yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
And the beautiful thing is, when you've got a
brand um, you've got that clear,distinctive brand voice and you
know what you stand for, thatthen, beautifully, will weave
into everything else that you do.
So, even if you are aiming forthe individuals on instagram or
you know the corporates onlinkedin, that that should you
(20:35):
know and will then weave intothe messaging and stuff.
So there is this sort of uhlike an over overarching purpose
mission vision.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
That that links to that and I I honestly, since
working in PR agencies for otherbrands for myself, I've never
got into scheduling um, whichdoes mean that social media can
then become quite time consumingum but I think I think my issue
(21:10):
with scheduling a little bit isI do like um, being more
authentic and like when I getsome inspiration, just like
creating something, putting itout there, try not to think too
desperately hard about it, butthen it can really be a bit more
time consuming.
So I wonder if you've got anyguidance for other people who
(21:31):
are finding that polaritybetween authenticity and
scheduling and how that playsout.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Oh, I've got a confession to make I don't
schedule.
I actually don't, simplybecause, like you, I'm very much
like, when I'm feeling in flowand inspired, saying that, um,
but I I am consistent with it.
So I know I am going to beposting three to five times a
week on linkedin on um, specifictopics and stuff like that,
(22:02):
because if I know I'm about tolaunch something, there's a lead
up to what I want to bebringing to other people's
awareness about this, and youknow how I've got into it, the
story, you know, because youcan't put everything in one post
either, um, so that's not tosay that you know there is some
background work going on.
So, even like I'm even the tubeand and I get, I'll get ideas
(22:24):
at the most random time, like,really like, oh, my God, that's
an amazing thing to kind of say,or whatever.
So if I'm on the tube, it willstart going into my notes and
then, when I've come home, youknow I've gone for a coffee I'm
like, oh, that's enough, itstarts getting pieced together.
And then I'm like, right, okay,I know this will be a good day
to put this out, this out, thisout.
So, yeah, I don't have this bigplan of scheduling.
(22:45):
However, however, I do work withclients and you know they do
have a team and all of thosekinds of things.
So we do look at sort of brandpillars, content pillars, things
like that.
So then their team can actuallyhave a bit of a structure of
like, right, what do we, youknow how, what do we want to be
known for and how do we nowexecute what we want to be known
for?
So you know, that takes a bitof planning.
(23:07):
So then their team because, youknow, for some social media
posts there's a lot of well, fora lot of social, there's a lot
of education that needs tohappen.
So when there are sort of moreeducational things some of it a
little bit more generic but inyour obviously in your own tone
and stuff and personality andessence, those kinds of things
(23:30):
can be scheduled, because thatdoesn't matter if it goes out in
a January or a March or youknow that kind of thing.
So there are things that, yes,definitely can do about planning
, schedule, schedule that in.
But then for me, and in thekind of space that I'm in and
the kind of work that I do, Iget inspired, you know, from my
clients, from something I'vewatched on tv, an experience
(23:53):
that I've had with a brand, andI'll talk about it.
I get inspired just from goingfrom a walk and something comes
up you know, totally mostly froma walk in nature.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Totally I hear you and I guess one really big thing
is about how noisy everythingis.
Like we go online and there'sjust, it's just noise.
Um, and I wonder, I wonder ifyou've got any advice for people
(24:25):
who they want to be authenticto their own personal brand but
they also want to kind of breakthrough some of that noise.
Is there any real nugget thatyou found that you're like this
really can work to help you cutthrough?
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Yeah, yeah and yeah, you're right, it it's.
It's so noisy and it is aboutsort of thinking.
Firstly, why does this actuallymatter to me?
Because you know we've beenconstantly told you need to
build a personal brand.
You need to be build a personalbrand.
If you yourself aren'tconnected to why you want to
(25:03):
build a personal brand, that'sgoing to be one an issue,
because you know what it's likewhen somebody just tells you to
do something.
You might do it for a littlewhile and be like, okay, I'm
disconnected, don't really care,don't know why I'm really doing
this.
(25:27):
Why do you want to build apersonal brand?
How does that one benefit you?
How does that two benefit thepeople that are going to
experience you?
You know, because I always kindof say you know, a personal
brand is the stamp of value thatyou deliver to others.
There's this misconception it'sall about your whole personal
life and you know it's.
Yes, there are elements of yourpersonal life.
That's why it's called personalbrand, but it doesn't have to
(25:47):
be your private life.
I know lots of brilliantLinkedIn content creators.
I don't even know what theirpartners, kids.
You know what anyone looks like, but they, I feel like I do
know them a bit more on apersonal level in that sense,
because of how they share things, and that's connected to coming
(26:11):
back to your own purpose,mission, vision, what you know.
What's my objective here?
What do I want to achieve bybuilding my personal brand?
Who do I want to influence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
You know who do I want toinfluence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense, you know?
Who do I want to attract to me?
Who do I want to be the obviouschoice for?
Speaker 2 (26:33):
and I love what you you mentioned there for about
how.
How do you want people toexperience you?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
yeah, exactly.
So then, in terms of cuttingthrough the noise, you don't
even then have to try and cutthrough the noise, because when
you start piecing these thingstogether, it becomes an
extension of you.
On social media, I've often hadclients who, should I be online
and offline?
(27:02):
I'm like be the same person,same person, you know, because
there are going to be timeswhere someone's going to
experience you online andthey're going to be like oh, can
we jump on a call?
Or they'll meet you at anetworking event.
I mean, this has happened to meso many times recently.
What was that?
An in-person networking event?
And they're like, oh, you'reArtie Palmer, aren't you you?
And I'm like, yeah, I am had noidea who they were, but it just
(27:28):
felt she was just like.
I just feel like I know you andlike you know I love your post
and what you're putting outthere and stuff.
At the same time, I didn't feellike, oh, violated or whatever,
because I've chosen to put outwhat I've put out intentionally
to create perceptions around.
You know, brand building, brandvisibility, personal branding,
brand mindful branding, all ofthose kinds of things.
(27:50):
So it's all been in my control,you know, in that sense.
So when it starts to actuallyfeel like, actually, I don't
mind if I say this online,offline, that kind of thing.
You then start creating your ownvoice, your own distinctive
style and personality and thatkind of thing, and it's not
(28:11):
going to just happen overnight.
It takes time for people to geta sense of your style and your
essence and what you talk about,how you talk about it.
There's a dime a dozen brandstrategists out there, loads of
them.
But I know you know what, whatmakes mine different, what makes
me different, and I I've got noqualms.
(28:32):
In fact, I'm like it's greatthat there are some if they are,
you know, brilliant brandstrategists out there, because
if we're all on that same pagearound helping people with their
mission and purpose, and thatwe're just creating more of an
impactful world, I can't serveeight billion people by myself,
yeah, you know.
So I'm quite happy there's allthese other brand strategists,
(28:53):
um out there, but it is aboutfinding your own and that's
going to take a bit of time aswell.
You know you may end up bit oftrial and error and that kind of
thing.
One of the things that I feltworked really well, and I still
do this.
If it's new stuff and whatever.
I'll go and observe what othersare doing and seeing how it's
(29:13):
landing.
How are they presenting it,what words are they using?
And that's not for me to go andcopy their words, I'm just kind
of observing and then see howit makes me feel seeing it
written that way, the imagerythat they would I feel
comfortable using a, um, a bold,vibrant background.
(29:34):
No, I wouldn't, that's not me,you know.
So it's also about feeling intowhat is you, what isn't you?
Speaker 2 (29:41):
you know it's reminding me of, like PR days,
doing competitor audits.
Yeah, I love that for personalbrand.
And something else you saidthat really struck me was
mindful mindful branding yes,let's talk AI, and I have
(30:06):
definitely seen a uplift incontent since the emergence of
AI.
How do you feel about AIcontent?
Can it help us, can it hinderus?
Can it help us, can it hinderus, and do you have any ideas of
(30:26):
how it's going to play out aswe shift forward and it becomes
more and more adopted?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Well, personally I can spot it a mile off,
especially as you know it's.
It's kind of come in and thenyou've seen that person's post
before and then suddenly it'slike you're like yeah, that's
not them, that's not their voice, that's not what they've talked
about before in that way.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
So how does it make you feel then, when you see that
it's clearly AI?
Does that change yourperception about that person a
little bit?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Part of me makes me feel cringe.
You know, part of me feels like, was that a bit lazy of them?
You know, because it's abrilliant tool, right, it's
great you can go in there andput this, but then just talking
about cutting through the noise,now you're getting even more
generic.
I see so many generic thingsand I'm like you're now not
(31:35):
helping your brand, you'rehurting your brand.
I think it is a brilliant tool,but it's about also knowing how
to use it to enhance your brand, about also knowing how to use
it to enhance your brand, but inorder to enhance it, it still
comes back to knowing what areyour brand fundamentals, who are
you as a brand, as an identity?
So you can maybe use it as atool, as an extension of, you
(31:59):
know, to refine a message, thatkind of thing.
I've, I've used it.
I, I do use it because I'llthen, you know, put in what it
is that I want to say in my way.
And then you know, I've askedit for a couple of prompts, and
that's the other thing is aboutgiving it effective prompts.
It is about, you know, sort ofmastering that I haven't
(32:19):
mastered it from what, thelittle sort of trial and errors
that I've done with it.
When you get really clear onthe prompts, it really is great
for guidance to acceleratesomething quickly.
You know, we may spend likehours and hours thinking about
something, but you can use it,you know, to help create and
brainstorm even ideas and stufflike that.
(32:41):
So I think it's like I said.
Said I think it's a brillianttool used well, when it's used
well.
I had a conversation withsomebody last week actually we
met up in a cafe, we went forbrunch and was telling me about
his new uh oh, that was a, didyou?
Speaker 2 (32:59):
see that.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Yeah, yeah, I generated thumbs down yeah,
exactly didn't like what I wassaying about AI.
Um, so we went for brunch andhe was telling me about his new,
new business idea and he wasjust oh, you know, I've got,
I've got my you know purpose andmission.
And I said I'd love to see it,you know.
So he pulled out his phone,showed me his website and I
(33:21):
could see the statement and Iwas reading them and he was
waiting for my.
What my reaction was?
First thing I said to him wasjust like you've got this from
AI, you've got this from chatGPT, haven't you?
And he looks at me, goes yeah,how did you know?
I was just like, just the threeminutes before that, how you
were talking to me about yourbrand, your business and the
(33:45):
personality, the enthusiasmbehind it.
It's not expressed in thesewords here at all.
There's quite a disconnect, andthat's because the work hasn't
been done.
He's got some thoughts in hismind about OK, this is what.
And then he's probably writtenwrite me a purpose statement.
But AI is going to do that.
(34:08):
It can write you beautiful, youknow.
It can write you lots ofpurpose statements and stuff
like that.
But what AI won't do is delveinto your why and be able to
challenge your beliefs and probeinto that and you know,
understand your story of whyyou're doing what you're doing,
what has brought you to thisspecific journey.
(34:29):
It's not going to delve intoall of that.
Therefore, it's going to giveyou this very surface that the
other five million people canalso have access to whereas when
you yeah the tone, the tone isjust, it's just different, isn't
it?
Speaker 2 (34:47):
it's not a personal edge to the tone exactly,
exactly, exactly um.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
And when you already have an existing um online
presence, and not even justonline presence, you're already
meeting people offline and stuffand then suddenly you know that
that tone changes because ofyour.
You know, because you're usingAI in just a very generic way.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
It gets noticed, it gets noticed and I wonder, like
I wrote an article recently fora magazine called island parent
all about um looking after yoursocial needs as a, as a working
parent and I felt compelled.
After I'd spent time writingthis article, I actually put on
the top of it this was notgenerated by AI, they didn't
(35:35):
print that but, sharing it withthe editor, I felt compelled to
write it.
And I do wonder going into thefuture, do you think people are
going to have to be transparentabout their AI usage in?
Speaker 1 (35:48):
a way?
I hope so, because it takestime, doesn't it to, to piece
something like that togetherwith emotion, with personality.
Um, yeah, who knows, it's goingto be an interesting time with,
or for, publications, beyondall of these kind of things.
It's going to be an interestingtime with full publications,
beyond all of these kind ofthings.
It's going to be just so easilyaccessible and it's going to
(36:09):
get better exactly, exactly likeum.
Speaker 2 (36:12):
Last year I was involved in a tedx and one of
the speakers, peter scott.
He was talking all about ai andit was actually before it
became mainstream because it waslast year, mainstream because
it was last year.
And um, he, he does speak atquite a few TEDx's like he's a,
he's a, he's a recurring TEDxspeaker.
One of the things he says is hedoesn't use AI to generate his
(36:39):
talks and he's like I know thatmy talks could be better if I
did, but I've kind of said thisnow so I can't really get back
on it.
Kind of made a stand, whilstacknowledging that he could
probably find words easier usingAI.
If writing isn't necessarilyhis thing and I guess, coming
(37:02):
from a communications background, I have no excuse.
Like I can write.
I you know I'm blessed thatI've had that um background,
whereas I guess for a lot ofpeople where writing doesn't
come as easily, then they mightbe let off for leaning on ai
(37:24):
some more and I guess in thatrespect it um balances the
playing field for for everybodyyeah, yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
That is a good point, and I guess it still comes back
to getting the essence of the,the, the brand, back in, even if
you are using it.
And you know writing isn't yournumber one top skill which
probably isn't for most of us,right but if you don't want to
get lost in the noise, it has tocome from a place of
(37:57):
authenticity, your own values,your own journey, your own
expertise, knowledge.
You know stories, stories.
Ai is never going, never gonnawell, and let me not say never.
But you know ai isn't gonnaknow your story.
It doesn't, it's not gonnapiece that together.
You're still gonna have to dothat and then use the platform
(38:18):
to enhance or refine, in thatsense.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
And I'm just thinking about another of the TEDx
speakers from last year, candice, who I have had on my podcast
actually Candice Neveu and shewas invited to speak at that
TEDx.
She did still have to audition.
So leading up to the auditionshe was thinking about her
(38:44):
speech and then early onemorning she just woke up with
inspiration and wrote it.
And I guess, in a way, ai ismaybe encouraging us not to, you
(39:04):
know, have that kind of oh God,I know I need to do that, I
know I need to do that and thentrust that we will find the
words.
Once we know what we need to do, we will find those words for
what we want to do, and maybe itwill be that you sit down in
one session and you just writeit out and that's your first
draft.
I don't know that this is aleading question, but that's
(39:26):
just what's coming up for me.
Like, are we and I have aspiritual mentor we spoke about
when we connected last time and,um, he, he had some real
concerns with ai, because whenit first came, I was like, oh my
goodness, bill, this is soexciting, you can ask it
anything.
And and I was really excited.
And he's like but what about ifyou ask yourself and just allow
(39:49):
the response to come?
Speaker 1 (39:51):
how like challenging that I'm like good point, that's
so wise yeah, yeah, and this isI guess that's the bit I get a
little bit concerned, becauseobviously there are pros and
cons, right, um, will it makepeople just more lazy?
Will it just make people lazy?
You know what's going to happento people writing books.
(40:12):
You know people would writebooks with so much passion and
so much like right, and I wantto put this out into the world
and I'll pour their heart andsoul into it.
And now you can go into AI andsay write me a book on, you know
, but obviously, again, it's notgoing to have your personal
story in there, you know, fromfrom just just one prompt.
(40:34):
In that sense, yes, you canmaybe write it and then put it
in there and it may refine it,but yeah, it does.
You know, I've had thosethoughts like what, what happens
to that, that, that sort of thebook industry in that sense as
well and I guess again thatcomes back to your personal
brand.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
If you've built yourself a brand that is
attracting a real niche and thenyou publish a book because
people want more of you, that'sit.
Books aren't going to just sellthemselves anymore because it's
going to get flooded.
Everybody's going to have abook, aren't they?
If we can, everybody could havea book.
(41:12):
So people then buy theindividual and then that
individual serves, sells thebook exactly.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And, and you know, nowadays I don't think it's just
about, oh, you know, being apublished author.
I've got a book.
It's about how does that sit inthe strategy of your bigger
picture, that mission, thatvision, purpose?
You know inquiry calls wherethey're like, yeah, I just want
to.
You know, I want to launch abook or I want to create a
(41:48):
membership program.
Okay, good, what kind ofpresence, audience do you have
around you community?
And she was just like no, Idon't really.
Actually, I just wanted to,because, you know, I've been
told that I need membershipgroups, I can make passive
income.
And or, you know, you know justbeen told that I need
membership groups, I can makepassive income.
And or, you know, you know,just make different kind of
income rather than theone-to-one um and or, if I've
(42:11):
got a book, then I'll get a lotmore exposure and visibility.
I'm like, okay, who's going tobe buying your book?
For?
What do they know you for?
And she was just like, yeah,that's a good point, they don't
really know me for this, butthis is what my book's going to
be about.
And you know, sometimes peopleare doing it around something
(42:31):
that matters to them, thatthey're passionate about they.
You know that they're reallypurposeful about and people are
buying into that purpose andmission.
(42:53):
You know, we see it all thetime and I do.
I, I advocate brands I don'teven buy from, but because I'm
just like what an amazing brand,I'll go and put them in front
of other people.
Um, maybe it's just not rightfor me, for whatever reason, you
know um, but however, I'dadvocate them because I'm buying
into their purpose, theirmission and and that that's the
(43:15):
power of brand.
So, if you're, then if youthey're not an individual that
you know has a strong um, youknow you're advocating a certain
really positive change in theworld for something or other.
That's what people are buyinginto.
And then you know that then getsgranular into products and
services and stuff like that.
But then when you've gotsomething like that, that's
(43:37):
where then really beautifulcollaborations happen, that's
where then you have that naturaljourney.
Do you know what?
Actually, I'm going to write abook now, because I know I can
bring so much knowledge and wecan, you know, create more of an
impact by putting these wordsout there and educating,
teaching people through my bookor whatever it is in that sense,
membership, that kind of thing.
So now people actually have gotmore of a buy-in and it helps.
(44:00):
It gives them a bit of anidentity as well.
You know, like you've got thebrand like Patagonia you wear,
that you already feel likeyou're a certain type of person.
It already gives you a certainkind of identity.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
I love the brand Patagonia.
Um, yeah, just such apurposeful brand and, yeah, just
sounds like one of the bestplaces to work.
You're all just surfing atlunchtime, aren't they very cool
?
Um, something that was comingup for me then, just thinking
about individuals publishingbooks.
(44:36):
I know, not, neither of us arenecessarily in this space, but
something that I keep seeingrecently is people having a
chapter of a book and, like I'vebeen involved in summits.
So for a summit, you are one ofmany guest speakers and then
you obviously promote that toyour, to your audience, and then
(44:59):
you've got maybe 12 or 20speakers who are all promoting
the summit for their audiences.
So, I guess, in the same way,publishing a book where you just
own a chapter of it, and thenyou're standing side by side,
all of these other experts intheir field also then you're all
public, you're all sharing that.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
Yeah, this, this is an intriguing strategy yeah,
yeah, collaborations right, Imean you're, then you're tapping
into various audiences all atthe same time.
You know you've got a widerreach um, if it's just me alone,
whereas when you've got 10different authors in that same
book and everyone's got theirown followers and following and
(45:42):
you, you know it's got some sortof you know force for good.
It's a great way to reach morepeople and make more impact.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
I saw a beautiful post yesterday and it said at
the top it's all aboutcooperation, not competition.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Absolutely, and it does.
Does it does make sense, youknow, if we can, if you are
inclined in that way to be amission-led, purpose-driven,
purpose-centered business, andyou've got other people who are
on a similar kind of path andyou can both impact collectively
(46:25):
, why not?
Why not right?
Speaker 2 (46:31):
arty just thinking about.
We are coming towards the endof our conversation.
Is there any kind of keytakeaway that you think for
solopreneurs or people withmaybe small to medium-sized
teams that haven't really put alot of thought into their own
personal brand strategy?
What, where, where could theystart?
(46:53):
What's like the number onepiece that you think with the
weekend coming up like, justthink about this as you're
walking around the lake for yourweekend hike.
What should they be thinkingabout?
Speaker 1 (47:05):
Sure, sure, I mean.
I always like to say you know,if your brand isn't clear on the
inside, it won't be clear onthe outside.
So it is about going inwardlyand I'll just leave you with my
brand journey wheel.
So I'll just quickly share whatthat is in three steps.
So the first one is step one isclarify.
(47:26):
Step two is create and stepthree is communicate.
A lot of business owners gostraight to communicate because
they're thinking I want topromote and grow and get sales
and make money and all of thatkind of thing, but what they
haven't done is done.
The step one, which is clarify,so that is the discover and
define.
Discover and define who you areas a brand.
(47:48):
Honestly, this step isinvaluable when I've worked with
clients what it's done and howit's accelerated, not only their
journey, what it's done fortheir own energy, their
enthusiasm, the clarity it'sbrought in terms of to get
focused and have that direction.
The clarity it's brought interms of to get focused and have
that direction.
(48:08):
It's one of the best things youcan do for yourself, because
what comes out of that will thenhelp you to really determine
where am I heading from here.
And we all like a bit of wheream I heading from here?
We don't want to keep hittingbrick walls.
So, you know, clarify, discoverand define internal strategic
fundamentals, external.
So, like I said, those, thosefundamentals purpose, mission,
(48:30):
vision, values plays a massive,massive role in, you know,
determining your actions andbehaviors.
Really, really important,understanding what do we stand
for as a brand, what are ourvalues, what determines our
actions and behaviors.
In that sense, moving intocreate, once you've got that
(48:52):
clarity, you've clarified all ofthis, that will then help to
create, create your visualidentity, the logo, colors,
typography or you know, fontsand that kind of thing, and it
will also help to create thekind of services that you
actually, that your audienceactually needs.
Sometimes there's a very sortof right, let's just put this
(49:13):
service and product out there,but where has any research
actually been done?
Do we know that the audience,the market, needs this?
So, getting that into the sortof actually, even as a business,
you need to do that researchanyway, right, you need to have
that mvp and, uh, that kind ofthing.
So, knowing that there is somesort of need for the product or
(49:34):
service, um, in that, createspace, then that will help to
create.
You know all of that side ofthing product services, visual
identity system and then alsoidentity, your social media,
your website because now, like Isay, it's the brand that will
then inform the branding andthen the branding will help to
inform the marketing.
So this is where you thencommunicate.
(49:55):
You then communicateauthentically, you communicate
in a very precise way andconcise way to the audience that
you actually want to attractand work with.
Or it may not even and I sayaudience clusters, that's just
not, that's not always like yourend client.
That could also be othercollaborators, influencers,
(50:19):
communities, networks, that kindof thing, networks, that kind
of thing.
So you know, it's about thengetting really precise about
what it is that you want, whoyou want to attract, and
communicating that in a verysort of intentional way.
And this is why I say mindfulbranding, because now you're
making really conscious choicesabout how you're showing up,
(50:42):
what you're saying who to, whyshould they care?
All of these kind of things.
So you know you're not justcoming from a oh, let me just
guess.
You know, let me just put somecontent out, because I've been
told to post three times a week.
It's getting making reallyconscious choices about the
business, the brand yourself,how you want to be known all of
(51:02):
that kind of thing, and that allcomes from clarify.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
I'm just about to start a sub stack, so I've
parked my original newsletter uh, kind of rethought what that
wants to look like.
So I think with this new substack, I'm going to be really
introducing the topic of socialwell-being and social connection
(51:26):
, and the importance of reallyfocusing on this is individuals.
Um, have you got anyrecommendations for me or
anybody who may be in my shoes?
That's about to really like.
I've done the work to definewho my audience is and now I
want to speak to them.
Speaker 1 (51:42):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly that, you know.
Speak to your audience.
It's that emotional connection.
It goes beyond.
You know, obviously, thedemographics, but really what
are they feeling?
What do they want?
What's going on in their dailylife?
Really take that time tounderstand that, not assume.
(52:06):
Have conversations with thepeople that you actually want to
attract, work with, collaboratewith, you know, understand
what's going on for them and andyou know that that's that's
such a beautiful connectionpiece, because then you can
start bringing that into yourcontent and then what that
starts doing, it startspositioning you as the person
(52:28):
who knows, because who knows howthey're feeling, what's going
on for them, and when you startaddressing that side of things
rather than I, I, I, I when youstart addressing that side of
things, it's about them andagain it comes, you're pulling
them in to then say, right, okay, how can I serve you?
This is, or this is how I canserve you.
(52:49):
You know we've.
It's helping them to feel andeverything's very much about how
we make other people feel right.
It's helping them to feel like,look, I see you, I understand
you, I care for you, I want to,I want to help you from where
you are now to where you want toget to, this is what I'm
training or this is how I'vehelped other clients.
(53:09):
So evidencing that social proofis also important.
A lot of business owners arelike, oh, I don't want to blow
my own trumpet and I'm like youneed to blow your own trumpet.
People need to know that youare, you know you can evidence
your expertise, your knowledge,you know your results.
So when somebody gives you atestimonial, put it on your
social media.
(53:29):
It's a great thing to hear.
Why wouldn't you?
That's all your hard work andwhat that then does.
It then evidences in otherpeople's mind.
Okay, she can provide from youknow, pain point to solution, to
transformation.
That's what we want.
All of us want transformation.
So it is really understandingthe transformations people want
(53:50):
and the pain points that theyare experiencing and you being
that vehicle I like to say abrand is a vehicle to serve,
grow and impact and you beingthe vehicle that's going to take
them from pain point totransformation, from pinpoint to
transformation, because whenthey have the transformation,
they become generally, maybe youknow better people.
(54:11):
You know more loving, more kind, more caring.
You know they put more clarity.
Therefore they're not feelinglow and down and all of those
kind of things, and thereforewe're creating more of a
positive energy.
Speaker 2 (54:21):
And would you imagine kind of one person on the other
side?
So you're writing and you kindof see that individual person,
you're literally writing to you.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's really important actually
to do that, because you know itcan be quite easy to get lost in
like, okay, I'm starting towrite for this person, and then
you know, and then you're likethat's when it starts getting
generic, whereas when you, whenyou've done the customer
identity piece, and we know,okay, it's this, this, this is
(54:55):
the person I'm writing for today, or this month, that kind of
thing.
It just makes it so much more,so much more easier, because now
you've got them in mind, youknow what kind of pain points,
challenges, what's not happeningin their life that they would
actually desire.
You can then take them on thatjourney through your content,
(55:16):
through your website, throughdialogue when you're at
networking events.
You know the number of times Ican go into a networking event
and share a story.
Story and storytelling andnarrative is another really,
really key part of being able tohave dialogue around something
that's that's relatable andrelevant to to these people as
(55:39):
well.
You know in in that sense,because if you just go out and
like I just do brand strategyand I can sell you my brand
strategy package, I'll be like,yeah, don't get it, whatever,
but it's about making itunderstandable.
Relatable, you know, helpingthem feel understood.
And you know always say brandis an energy, it is felt, and
when you're saying it with suchauthentic, that genuine, I know
(56:00):
where I'm coming from, I knowthe kind of change I want to see
in this world, I know what Ican do for you.
All of this, you know, buildsconfidence in people and builds
that ultimately, people buy fromtrust and when they feel that
transference of trust going onand that might not just happen
in the one meeting you have, butover time, from your social
(56:23):
posts and there's thatconsistency and congruency and
everything that transference oftrust happens.
And for some people they need abit more transference of trust.
Some people will be like, oh,I've been seeing your post for
three months, I want to workwith you.
Some people it's been two years, but it's important to have
that.
You know, that's what we'reultimately where.
That's when people ultimatelybuy, when they have that
(56:43):
emotional connection.
I trust this person, I trustthis brand, I trust this
business.
Speaker 2 (56:50):
Thank you so much for all of your sharings.
I do feel like I just want totouch on one final point from
our conversation that we had acouple of weeks ago and we were
talking about the the transitionof a repatriate, the the
transition of a repatriate, andwe touched on your experience
(57:12):
moving back to the UK afterliving in Malaysia for a while
and years and the getting usedto the way that people operate
yeah, oh gosh, I I still do missthat where you could just pick
up the phone and say finish yourwork seven, eight o'clock,
let's meet, you know.
Speaker 1 (57:28):
Um, yeah, that that was quite a bit of a big shocker
in terms of what's helped meand stuff.
It is just probably gettingthose dates put in in advance.
Whoever you want to see, whoyou really really want to see,
just make it happen.
Speaker 2 (57:43):
You know, even if it is two weeks, one month, three
months, uh down the line, andlike maybe just getting into the
flow of the local norms forpeople, for expats who are
moving around.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
I guess it's trying to understand what those local
norms and customs are yeah, yeah, because the other thing I used
to do is just call peoplestraight, you know, just be like
off the bat, call people when Ifelt like talking to them, kind
of thing.
Yeah, that's also a bit ofmessaging first what time is
good for you, that kind of thing.
So, yeah, it is probably justand you know, there's different
(58:20):
groups of friends and family aswell, right, and you've got sort
of the acquaintances and thenyou've got your inner circle
where, yeah, they don't care andI don't care what time they
pick up the phone, and thenyou've got your inner circle
where, yeah, they don't care andI don't care what time they
pick, pick up the phone and callyou, and that kind of thing.
Um, yeah, it's probably evenjust asking each other is it
okay for me to buzz you or wouldyou prefer we, you know,
whatsapp or whatever, that thatkind of thing, and that that
kind of communication isprobably key as well, isn't it
(58:41):
in that sense?
Speaker 2 (58:43):
yeah, especially with new, with new connections, when
you've been moving, when you'vemoved somewhere or you've moved
back from somewhere.
Yeah, understanding that whereyou've come from is quite
different.
So thank you for that just lastpiece.
I just felt like that was anugget really worth sharing,
because I know I reallyresonated with that experience
myself.
I thank you and appreciate youfor your time.
(59:05):
Where is the place where youmost spend your time, that that
you think, um, people come findme here, because this is really
where you see, see, the most ofme yeah, linkedin, linkedin
definitely.
Speaker 1 (59:17):
I'm consistently posting over there brand tips
and all sorts, all sorts bit ofmindset, bit of spirituality,
bit of everything from mypersonal, from my brand in that
sense.
Speaker 2 (59:28):
Beautiful and a beautiful brand.
It is Artie Palmer.
Thank you so much for your time.
It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (59:33):
Yes, yeah, absolute pleasure, thank you.
Thank you for having me.
Why do you want to build a personal brand?
How does that one benefit you?
How does that two benefit thepeople that are going to
experience you?
Because I always kind of say apersonal brand is the stamp of
value that you deliver to others.
There's this misconception.
It's all about your wholepersonal life and, yes, there
(00:23):
are elements of your personallife.
That's why it's called personalbrand, but it doesn't have to
be your private life.
I know lots of brilliantLinkedIn content creators.
I don't even know what theirpartners, kids you know what
anyone looks like, but they, Ifeel like I do know them a bit
(00:45):
more on a personal level in thatsense, because of how they
share things.
And that's connected to comingback to your own purpose,
mission, vision, what you know.
What's my objective here?
What do I want to achieve bybuilding my personal brand?
Who do I want to influence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
You know who do I want toinfluence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
(01:05):
You know who do I want toattract to me?
Who do I want to be the obviouschoice for?
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Good morning from beautiful British Columbia.
My name is Shelley Keridwen andyou're listening to
Rediscovering Connection.
If this is your first timelistening to one of my podcasts,
then welcome.
If this is your first timelistening to one of my podcasts,
then welcome.
This podcast has been such anamazing journey for me.
This is episode 21 with ArtiePalmer and all of the episodes
(01:33):
have been extremely differentand I've really been finding my
voice as I've been going throughthis journey, figuring out what
topic really is in my heart andmy soul.
And rediscovering connection issomething that I have been
doing in my own life for thelast two years, reconnecting
with beautiful individualswho've been part of my life,
(01:53):
getting some recommendationsfrom some friends of mine on who
I should have on my podcast anda few people who I didn't know
at all, and I've kind of justdipped my toe in the water to
connect with these new beautifulsouls who are doing some great
work in this world.
So essentially, it's all aboutrediscovering connection with
ourselves, with each other, andI'm speaking to researchers,
(02:15):
facilitators, community builderswho have found ways to
rediscover connection.
That's very different, that'snew, that's innovative and
hopefully you shall learn athing or two.
So this episode is with an oldfriend of mine, business
networking colleague from our StAlbans day, artie Palmer.
She is a personal brandingspecialist.
(02:37):
So we really go deep in thisepisode to talk about how our
personal brand is kind of anexternal representation of who
we feel inside and how to makethat an authentic representation
and how we can help ourpersonal brand to feel good on
us.
I really hope you enjoy this.
Artie was very generous withher insights, really opening up
(03:01):
the curtain and letting us seethe work that she does with her
clients to help them to find thepersonal brand that they feel
proud and excited about showingto the world.
So welcome, enjoy and I'll seeyou on the other side.
Welcome, artie, how are you?
Speaker 1 (03:18):
I am wonderful, and it's just so lovely to reconnect
again, and this is this alone,is the power of personal brand
right?
How, how many years ago weconnected, stay connected, sort
of you know, seeing each other'sbeing on each other's radar on
linkedin.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
and then here we are beautiful, yes indeed, and
linkedin has really been where Ihave seen you and your personal
brand shine through, and you'reone of only a handful of
individuals whose posts I alwayssee and like a little bit
envious, in all honesty, becausethey're just always so like a
(03:55):
beautiful representation of you,like they feel good to receive,
without kind of ickiness ofsales.
It's kind of just very natural.
You do this well, oh appreciatethat.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Thank you that.
That that means a lot really,like intentional time and effort
does go into those posts, so itmeans a lot to to get those
encouraging words back.
Thank you so how?
Speaker 2 (04:20):
how has your journey been really to find your
personal brand?
Because when I first met you, Ithink you were involved in your
parents' business, theBangalore Olofsson business and
then since then you kind ofweaved your own business out.
So how is that journey to?
I guess it's once you find yourown personal brand.
(04:41):
Then you're like wow, this issomething I'm really passionate
about and this is something thatI know that I can serve for
other people.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, that's it, and that's quite a big question.
How has it been?
I think it's been, honestly,it's an introspective journey.
That's that's probably where itreally really starts.
And you know, it's really what?
Probably in the last seven toten years, maybe seven years or
(05:10):
so, since you know you'regetting more awareness around
personal brand and definitely inthe last two years, you know
it's become more and more andmore of a thing, and I remember
a few years ago where peoplewere like, oh so what do you
think it's going to be the trendfor brand and you know business
and stuff, and it was alwaysthis thing like, really
important, build your personalbrand, build your personal brand
, your personal profile.
(05:30):
It's going to be equally asimportant or, if not, you know,
more important than alsobuilding your business brand,
because they are sointerconnected.
But coming back to yourquestion, gosh, you know I don't
think there is a thing of well,today I'm going to start my
(05:50):
personal brand journey.
It's been going on.
It's more of how have I becomemore aware that I am a brand and
what am I going to do about it?
I am a brand and what am I goingto do about it?
Because I've often had businessowners saying, oh, you know,
should I start my personal brandor I don't want to?
(06:11):
And my answer is always like,you already are a personal brand
.
It's now about how are yougoing to get really intentional
about getting known for what itis you actually want to be known
for?
So we've all, always have, beenpersonal brands.
You know we already arerepresenting something I love.
(06:34):
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Let's just dive deeper into that.
How you're already a personalbrand.
How do you want to startbecoming known for what you are?
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Yep, yep, you know, there's always that.
There's that very famous sayingby Jeff Bezos your brand is
what other people say about youwhen you're not in the room, and
what I like to do is take thata combination of created
perceptions, and it is thoseperceptions that form
(07:09):
associations and emotionalconnections to your brand.
So we, what we really need todo, is start thinking about what
beliefs are we forming inpeople's minds, so, when we are
out of that room, that they aresaying what we want them to say
about us, and that's probably agood place to start.
(07:31):
So, when people are out of thatroom, are they actually saying
what we want them to say aboutus?
And it comes from us, right?
Whatever we put out there iswhat people are going to know
and believe about us.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Beautiful, beautiful put out there is what people are
going to know and believe aboutus beautiful, beautiful.
And this just touches on so muchof the work that I do to help
people reconnect with themselves.
Because if we don't know kind ofthe pivotal stories that have
really shaped our worldview, ifwe don't know what stories are
really alive for us that we wantto be sharing, if we haven't
done that kind of the work, thenwhen we're in company those
(08:11):
stories are not going to benaturally flowing.
And I guess that's when that'swhen people just start becoming
passive, kind of passivelyinvolved in conversations and
they're not proactivelyexpressing themselves in a way
(08:31):
that they want to be seen.
And this is so important forpeople who move location, who
the people in their lives do notknow them, they haven't got
that background of them.
So we need to really bereconnecting with ourselves so
that, so that people can get toknow the real essence of you, so
(08:53):
important, so important.
So I'd love to just get alittle bit of a sneak preview
behind the scenes of, like, howyou would work with clients who
are unsure of what theirpersonal brand is.
Maybe they've been in businessa few years and they're
realizing that actually they aretheir spokesperson, like how?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
do you?
get under the skin of it andreally help them to to get out
of themselves what theirpersonal brand might look or
feel like yeah, yeah, no, andit's a really good question
because I can tell you, majorityof the time when people come to
me, um, you know, inquiry call,networking, that kind of thing,
or you know, do you know what,artie?
I just, you know, I just don'tknow how to show up on social
(09:35):
media, I don't know what to sayabout my business, I'm not
articulating it very well, youknow, I don't know what kind of
content to put out there.
So nobody really actually comesto me saying, artie, I need
brand strategy.
Ever, it's always these otherthings.
And what that actually means isthat, in essence, they don't
(09:58):
have clarity around their own.
Well, their brand narrative andthat brand narrative is
actually a combination of theirbusiness and personal brand.
They, they aren't two separate,separate things because, you
know, especially if we'reservice-based businesses as well
, right, because if there'ssomebody who's delivering that
(10:18):
service, it's going to beconnected to, to, to the brand
in in in that sense.
So, in terms of when I'm workingwith somebody, first and
foremost, what I do and helpthem understand is what brand is
.
There's so many differentdefinitions, so many different
thoughts about branding.
You know, I've been on callswhere, like I'm really, you know
(10:40):
, I'm so stressed about my logoand my color palette and, you
know, for me I'm like it's thelast thing you need to be
stressed about.
What you really want to bethinking about is what are your
brand fundamentals?
You know, what do you stand for, what's your essence, what's
your personality, all of thesethings, because then it's the
brand that will inform thebranding which is the whole sort
(11:01):
of you know, logo messaging,logo messaging visuals, graphics
and color palette andtypography and that side of
things.
So, coming back to so, my firststep is actually helping them to
understand brand and the roleit plays in your business,
because what you may want foryour business and what a
competitor may want, it's twocompletely different things.
(11:24):
Everyone's got their owndifferent journeys, values,
beliefs, stories, experiences,expertise that they bring to the
table, even if they are abusiness that is delivering
similar outcomes.
So, first and foremost, we needto understand who are you?
Well, what is a brand?
And then, who are you?
(11:45):
Well, what is a brand?
And then who are you as a brand?
I always say you know, thebusiness sells a product and
service and the brand is theidentity that attracts people to
the business you know, I lovethat word, I love that word
attract as well because this isthe whole thing with, I guess,
soul aligned businesses.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
We're not looking to sell, we're looking to attract
people into our energy, peoplethat are aligned clients so
we're not.
We're not selling, we areserving exactly I guess in that
way, as a personal brand, it's a, it's a way for you to show
yourself, to attract those idealclients into your orbit,
(12:28):
absolutely and in a way thatfeels really good for everybody.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Yeah, and it's a form of expression, isn't it In that
sense?
And coming back to attract,what then that also does?
It doesn't feel like such a oh,this is so hard.
You know that kind of thing.
When you're in that energy ofattract because you're pulling
people towards you, as opposedto push, push, push, push, push,
(12:57):
push, it's hard work, isn't it?
Whereas when you reallyunderstand who you are for, who
you're serving, why you'reserving them, why you, in that
sense, you then start to alsoeliminate who you're not for,
therefore giving more space forattraction beautiful, beautiful,
(13:22):
which is why niching is soimportant.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
I was um.
I was part of a hackathon a fewweeks ago um, for it's for
island health here on VancouverIsland and it was the.
I.
I put a challenge into it whichwas how to combat loneliness on
Vancouver Island, which wasselected by island health as a
wild card, which is amazing.
So it's a huge opportunity.
I got to pitch my idea, I builta team and over the course of
(13:49):
48 hours we came up with asolution which we did.
We did reach the finals, whichwe then presented to a room of
like 300 people.
We didn't get any further, butI was really, really stoked to
have got that far because itgave me brilliant practice in
front of a good number of peopleand great networking
opportunity.
But one of the really big takesI got from that was how
(14:14):
challenging it is to create asolution for the general public,
because that's what it, that'swhat it was, and they wanted you
to be as inclusive with yoursolution as you possibly could.
And I went away from there witha lot of reflection.
I've spent weeks reflecting onit and just thinking, gosh, I
(14:36):
feel blessed that I can now kindof go back to my niche.
It is really like expats,repatriate people who move
people that I really understandthe problems that they're facing
um and I and I think down theline I will definitely be
looking to expand this out toencompass and be accessible to a
(14:59):
lot more people.
But niching just makes our lifeeasier because we can really
become masters within that niche.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Exactly, and it makes your audience's life easier.
You know if they are lookingfor something specific and
they're going into Google andstuff and they've got you know
eight, ten different options andthen they've got the one that
is actually really niched downto what it is that they really
want.
It's just an easier pick, isn'tit?
(15:31):
You're helping them save time,and we know how time poor we all
are anyway.
So when you're already you knoweliminating and you're out
maneuvering your competitionthrough and I say ethically
outmaneuvering your competition,you know, through your own
niche and through your ownstrengths and stuff like that,
at the end of the day, we'rehere to serve our audience, so
(15:52):
if we make their journey to useasier, then they're gonna love
us even more and I guess,thinking about that journey and
thinking about making it easy.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
there's so many tools out there where we can express
our personal brand spreadingourselves too thinly, Like maybe
(16:27):
when we've got virtualassistants and they can be
publishing on our behalf andresponding on our behalf.
The game might change.
But when we are solopreneurs,actually having too many
different platforms can consumeso much of our energy.
Do you work with your clientsin that way to decide which
platforms are actually the rightfit for their personal brand?
Speaker 1 (16:47):
yeah, yeah.
So, coming back to how I workwith with my clients, so I've
created a proven brand maximizerframework that I take
businesses through, whether it'sthe one person business or and
I only mainly work with ownermanaged businesses, so I'm not
in the corporate space and stufflike that, but regardless of
(17:08):
what size they are.
So some of the people mainlywork with owner-managed
businesses, so I'm not in thecorporate space and stuff like
that, but regardless of whatsize they are.
So some of the people I workwith they've got a team of 150,
300 people.
Some of them are the one-personbusiness.
But what is the key thing behindall of this?
Whether you are managing yourplatforms and stuff, as I'm
taking them through the platform, it is about getting deeper
into understanding thefundamentals.
So the internal strategicsaround the purpose, mission,
(17:30):
vision, values, all of thosekind of things.
And then we've got the externalaround the positioning,
customer identity, tone of voiceand USPs and all of those other
external things.
Once these things are piecedtogether, this is what I then
call is a brand narrative startscoming together.
Once you have that and thatunderstanding, that will then
(17:54):
start dictating.
Oh, that's where my audienceare.
They're not on TikTok, they'reactually on LinkedIn and I've
had clients who've got a bit ofpresence on TikTok.
They're actually on LinkedInand I've had clients who've got
a bit of presence on TikTok andit's almost like what are you
doing there, you know kind ofthing.
When, actually, when we'velooked at their sort of all
different audience clusters andthat's the other thing, you know
, we don't just only have oneaudience profile Majority.
(18:20):
A lot of us businesses also havewhat I would call audience,
different audience clusters andit's okay to talk to them
separately in different places,in different places, and you
know I've had clients that butbut I've only and I'm like no,
it's okay, you can even createlanding pages for your different
audience profiles, but you knowthe overall brand and what you
(18:44):
stand for, why you're doing whatyou're doing.
The mission, purpose, visiondoesn't change, but who you're
serving for, for for thisparticular, this product or this
product or this service, thatcan change, that's okay, that's
fine and it will.
You know, in a business cycle,this will change.
So, therefore, understandingthat customer identity will help
to then dictate where you needto spend your time and effort
(19:08):
and money and energy accordingto your vision of your short,
medium and long term goals.
Because some of this workdoesn't get done with business
owners.
It feels like I'm all over theplace, I'm hitting a brick wall.
You, you know, my competitorsare just running circles around
us, that kind of thing.
It's this deeper work, thesethese fundamentals that need to
(19:31):
be looked into.
Um, and it will start drawingout a picture beautiful,
beautiful.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, what's coming up for me there is just thinking
about my personal um brand andvisibility and on Instagram, for
example, I very much speak tomy, my individual clients, kind
of the expats, repatriates,location, independent
entrepreneurs.
And then on LinkedIn, I'm morespeaking to corporates and HR
(20:01):
leaders to bring me in todeliver workshops to their
globally mobile workforce soyeah, I, unintentionally I'm
doing this a little bit.
I can definitely get better,yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
And the beautiful thing is, when you've got a
brand um, you've got that clear,distinctive brand voice and you
know what you stand for, thatthen, beautifully, will weave
into everything else that you do.
So, even if you are aiming forthe individuals on instagram or
you know the corporates onlinkedin, that that should you
(20:35):
know and will then weave intothe messaging and stuff.
So there is this sort of uhlike an over overarching purpose
mission vision.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
That that links to that and I I honestly, since
working in PR agencies for otherbrands for myself, I've never
got into scheduling um, whichdoes mean that social media can
then become quite time consumingum but I think I think my issue
(21:10):
with scheduling a little bit isI do like um, being more
authentic and like when I getsome inspiration, just like
creating something, putting itout there, try not to think too
desperately hard about it, butthen it can really be a bit more
time consuming.
So I wonder if you've got anyguidance for other people who
(21:31):
are finding that polaritybetween authenticity and
scheduling and how that playsout.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Oh, I've got a confession to make I don't
schedule.
I actually don't, simplybecause, like you, I'm very much
like, when I'm feeling in flowand inspired, saying that, um,
but I I am consistent with it.
So I know I am going to beposting three to five times a
week on linkedin on um, specifictopics and stuff like that,
(22:02):
because if I know I'm about tolaunch something, there's a lead
up to what I want to bebringing to other people's
awareness about this, and youknow how I've got into it, the
story, you know, because youcan't put everything in one post
either, um, so that's not tosay that you know there is some
background work going on.
So, even like I'm even the tubeand and I get, I'll get ideas
(22:24):
at the most random time, like,really like, oh, my God, that's
an amazing thing to kind of say,or whatever.
So if I'm on the tube, it willstart going into my notes and
then, when I've come home, youknow I've gone for a coffee I'm
like, oh, that's enough, itstarts getting pieced together.
And then I'm like, right, okay,I know this will be a good day
to put this out, this out, thisout.
So, yeah, I don't have this bigplan of scheduling.
(22:45):
However, however, I do work withclients and you know they do
have a team and all of thosekinds of things.
So we do look at sort of brandpillars, content pillars, things
like that.
So then their team can actuallyhave a bit of a structure of
like, right, what do we, youknow how, what do we want to be
known for and how do we nowexecute what we want to be known
for?
So you know, that takes a bitof planning.
(23:07):
So then their team because, youknow, for some social media
posts there's a lot of well, fora lot of social, there's a lot
of education that needs tohappen.
So when there are sort of moreeducational things some of it a
little bit more generic but inyour obviously in your own tone
and stuff and personality andessence, those kinds of things
(23:30):
can be scheduled, because thatdoesn't matter if it goes out in
a January or a March or youknow that kind of thing.
So there are things that, yes,definitely can do about planning
, schedule, schedule that in.
But then for me, and in thekind of space that I'm in and
the kind of work that I do, Iget inspired, you know, from my
clients, from something I'vewatched on tv, an experience
(23:53):
that I've had with a brand, andI'll talk about it.
I get inspired just from goingfrom a walk and something comes
up you know, totally mostly froma walk in nature.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Totally I hear you and I guess one really big thing
is about how noisy everythingis.
Like we go online and there'sjust, it's just noise.
Um, and I wonder, I wonder ifyou've got any advice for people
(24:25):
who they want to be authenticto their own personal brand but
they also want to kind of breakthrough some of that noise.
Is there any real nugget thatyou found that you're like this
really can work to help you cutthrough?
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Yeah, yeah and yeah, you're right, it it's.
It's so noisy and it is aboutsort of thinking.
Firstly, why does this actuallymatter to me?
Because you know we've beenconstantly told you need to
build a personal brand.
You need to be build a personalbrand.
If you yourself aren'tconnected to why you want to
(25:03):
build a personal brand, that'sgoing to be one an issue,
because you know what it's likewhen somebody just tells you to
do something.
You might do it for a littlewhile and be like, okay, I'm
disconnected, don't really care,don't know why I'm really doing
this.
(25:27):
Why do you want to build apersonal brand?
How does that one benefit you?
How does that two benefit thepeople that are going to
experience you?
You know, because I always kindof say you know, a personal
brand is the stamp of value thatyou deliver to others.
There's this misconception it'sall about your whole personal
life and you know it's.
Yes, there are elements of yourpersonal life.
That's why it's called personalbrand, but it doesn't have to
(25:47):
be your private life.
I know lots of brilliantLinkedIn content creators.
I don't even know what theirpartners, kids.
You know what anyone looks like, but they, I feel like I do
know them a bit more on apersonal level in that sense,
because of how they share things, and that's connected to coming
(26:11):
back to your own purpose,mission, vision, what you know.
What's my objective here?
What do I want to achieve bybuilding my personal brand?
Who do I want to influence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense?
You know who do I want toinfluence?
Who do I want to impact in thatsense, you know?
Who do I want to attract to me?
Who do I want to be the obviouschoice for?
Speaker 2 (26:33):
and I love what you you mentioned there for about
how.
How do you want people toexperience you?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
yeah, exactly.
So then, in terms of cuttingthrough the noise, you don't
even then have to try and cutthrough the noise, because when
you start piecing these thingstogether, it becomes an
extension of you.
On social media, I've often hadclients who, should I be online
and offline?
(27:02):
I'm like be the same person,same person, you know, because
there are going to be timeswhere someone's going to
experience you online andthey're going to be like oh, can
we jump on a call?
Or they'll meet you at anetworking event.
I mean, this has happened to meso many times recently.
What was that?
An in-person networking event?
And they're like, oh, you'reArtie Palmer, aren't you you?
And I'm like, yeah, I am had noidea who they were, but it just
(27:28):
felt she was just like.
I just feel like I know you andlike you know I love your post
and what you're putting outthere and stuff.
At the same time, I didn't feellike, oh, violated or whatever,
because I've chosen to put outwhat I've put out intentionally
to create perceptions around.
You know, brand building, brandvisibility, personal branding,
brand mindful branding, all ofthose kinds of things.
(27:50):
So it's all been in my control,you know, in that sense.
So when it starts to actuallyfeel like, actually, I don't
mind if I say this online,offline, that kind of thing.
You then start creating your ownvoice, your own distinctive
style and personality and thatkind of thing, and it's not
(28:11):
going to just happen overnight.
It takes time for people to geta sense of your style and your
essence and what you talk about,how you talk about it.
There's a dime a dozen brandstrategists out there, loads of
them.
But I know you know what, whatmakes mine different, what makes
me different, and I I've got noqualms.
(28:32):
In fact, I'm like it's greatthat there are some if they are,
you know, brilliant brandstrategists out there, because
if we're all on that same pagearound helping people with their
mission and purpose, and thatwe're just creating more of an
impactful world, I can't serveeight billion people by myself,
yeah, you know.
So I'm quite happy there's allthese other brand strategists,
(28:53):
um out there, but it is aboutfinding your own and that's
going to take a bit of time aswell.
You know you may end up bit oftrial and error and that kind of
thing.
One of the things that I feltworked really well, and I still
do this.
If it's new stuff and whatever.
I'll go and observe what othersare doing and seeing how it's
(29:13):
landing.
How are they presenting it,what words are they using?
And that's not for me to go andcopy their words, I'm just kind
of observing and then see howit makes me feel seeing it
written that way, the imagerythat they would I feel
comfortable using a, um, a bold,vibrant background.
(29:34):
No, I wouldn't, that's not me,you know.
So it's also about feeling intowhat is you, what isn't you?
Speaker 2 (29:41):
you know it's reminding me of, like PR days,
doing competitor audits.
Yeah, I love that for personalbrand.
And something else you saidthat really struck me was
mindful mindful branding yes,let's talk AI, and I have
(30:06):
definitely seen a uplift incontent since the emergence of
AI.
How do you feel about AIcontent?
Can it help us, can it hinderus?
Can it help us, can it hinderus, and do you have any ideas of
(30:26):
how it's going to play out aswe shift forward and it becomes
more and more adopted?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Well, personally I can spot it a mile off,
especially as you know it's.
It's kind of come in and thenyou've seen that person's post
before and then suddenly it'slike you're like yeah, that's
not them, that's not their voice, that's not what they've talked
about before in that way.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
So how does it make you feel then, when you see that
it's clearly AI?
Does that change yourperception about that person a
little bit?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Part of me makes me feel cringe.
You know, part of me feels like, was that a bit lazy of them?
You know, because it's abrilliant tool, right, it's
great you can go in there andput this, but then just talking
about cutting through the noise,now you're getting even more
generic.
I see so many generic thingsand I'm like you're now not
(31:35):
helping your brand, you'rehurting your brand.
I think it is a brilliant tool,but it's about also knowing how
to use it to enhance your brand, about also knowing how to use
it to enhance your brand, but inorder to enhance it, it still
comes back to knowing what areyour brand fundamentals, who are
you as a brand, as an identity?
So you can maybe use it as atool, as an extension of, you
(31:59):
know, to refine a message, thatkind of thing.
I've, I've used it.
I, I do use it because I'llthen, you know, put in what it
is that I want to say in my way.
And then you know, I've askedit for a couple of prompts, and
that's the other thing is aboutgiving it effective prompts.
It is about, you know, sort ofmastering that I haven't
(32:19):
mastered it from what, thelittle sort of trial and errors
that I've done with it.
When you get really clear onthe prompts, it really is great
for guidance to acceleratesomething quickly.
You know, we may spend likehours and hours thinking about
something, but you can use it,you know, to help create and
brainstorm even ideas and stufflike that.
(32:41):
So I think it's like I said.
Said I think it's a brillianttool used well, when it's used
well.
I had a conversation withsomebody last week actually we
met up in a cafe, we went forbrunch and was telling me about
his new uh oh, that was a, didyou?
Speaker 2 (32:59):
see that.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Yeah, yeah, I generated thumbs down yeah,
exactly didn't like what I wassaying about AI.
Um, so we went for brunch andhe was telling me about his new,
new business idea and he wasjust oh, you know, I've got,
I've got my you know purpose andmission.
And I said I'd love to see it,you know.
So he pulled out his phone,showed me his website and I
(33:21):
could see the statement and Iwas reading them and he was
waiting for my.
What my reaction was?
First thing I said to him wasjust like you've got this from
AI, you've got this from chatGPT, haven't you?
And he looks at me, goes yeah,how did you know?
I was just like, just the threeminutes before that, how you
were talking to me about yourbrand, your business and the
(33:45):
personality, the enthusiasmbehind it.
It's not expressed in thesewords here at all.
There's quite a disconnect, andthat's because the work hasn't
been done.
He's got some thoughts in hismind about OK, this is what.
And then he's probably writtenwrite me a purpose statement.
But AI is going to do that.
(34:08):
It can write you beautiful, youknow.
It can write you lots ofpurpose statements and stuff
like that.
But what AI won't do is delveinto your why and be able to
challenge your beliefs and probeinto that and you know,
understand your story of whyyou're doing what you're doing,
what has brought you to thisspecific journey.
(34:29):
It's not going to delve intoall of that.
Therefore, it's going to giveyou this very surface that the
other five million people canalso have access to whereas when
you yeah the tone, the tone isjust, it's just different, isn't
it?
Speaker 2 (34:47):
it's not a personal edge to the tone exactly,
exactly, exactly um.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
And when you already have an existing um online
presence, and not even justonline presence, you're already
meeting people offline and stuffand then suddenly you know that
that tone changes because ofyour.
You know, because you're usingAI in just a very generic way.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
It gets noticed, it gets noticed and I wonder, like
I wrote an article recently fora magazine called island parent
all about um looking after yoursocial needs as a, as a working
parent and I felt compelled.
After I'd spent time writingthis article, I actually put on
the top of it this was notgenerated by AI, they didn't
(35:35):
print that but, sharing it withthe editor, I felt compelled to
write it.
And I do wonder going into thefuture, do you think people are
going to have to be transparentabout their AI usage in?
Speaker 1 (35:48):
a way?
I hope so, because it takestime, doesn't it to, to piece
something like that togetherwith emotion, with personality.
Um, yeah, who knows, it's goingto be an interesting time with,
or for, publications, beyondall of these kind of things.
It's going to be an interestingtime with full publications,
beyond all of these kind ofthings.
It's going to be just so easilyaccessible and it's going to
(36:09):
get better exactly, exactly likeum.
Speaker 2 (36:12):
Last year I was involved in a tedx and one of
the speakers, peter scott.
He was talking all about ai andit was actually before it
became mainstream because it waslast year, mainstream because
it was last year.
And um, he, he does speak atquite a few TEDx's like he's a,
he's a, he's a recurring TEDxspeaker.
One of the things he says is hedoesn't use AI to generate his
(36:39):
talks and he's like I know thatmy talks could be better if I
did, but I've kind of said thisnow so I can't really get back
on it.
Kind of made a stand, whilstacknowledging that he could
probably find words easier usingAI.
If writing isn't necessarilyhis thing and I guess, coming
(37:02):
from a communications background, I have no excuse.
Like I can write.
I you know I'm blessed thatI've had that um background,
whereas I guess for a lot ofpeople where writing doesn't
come as easily, then they mightbe let off for leaning on ai
(37:24):
some more and I guess in thatrespect it um balances the
playing field for for everybodyyeah, yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
That is a good point, and I guess it still comes back
to getting the essence of the,the, the brand, back in, even if
you are using it.
And you know writing isn't yournumber one top skill which
probably isn't for most of us,right but if you don't want to
get lost in the noise, it has tocome from a place of
(37:57):
authenticity, your own values,your own journey, your own
expertise, knowledge.
You know stories, stories.
Ai is never going, never gonnawell, and let me not say never.
But you know ai isn't gonnaknow your story.
It doesn't, it's not gonnapiece that together.
You're still gonna have to dothat and then use the platform
(38:18):
to enhance or refine, in thatsense.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
And I'm just thinking about another of the TEDx
speakers from last year, candice, who I have had on my podcast
actually Candice Neveu and shewas invited to speak at that
TEDx.
She did still have to audition.
So leading up to the auditionshe was thinking about her
(38:44):
speech and then early onemorning she just woke up with
inspiration and wrote it.
And I guess, in a way, ai ismaybe encouraging us not to, you
(39:04):
know, have that kind of oh God,I know I need to do that, I
know I need to do that and thentrust that we will find the
words.
Once we know what we need to do, we will find those words for
what we want to do, and maybe itwill be that you sit down in
one session and you just writeit out and that's your first
draft.
I don't know that this is aleading question, but that's
(39:26):
just what's coming up for me.
Like, are we and I have aspiritual mentor we spoke about
when we connected last time and,um, he, he had some real
concerns with ai, because whenit first came, I was like, oh my
goodness, bill, this is soexciting, you can ask it
anything.
And and I was really excited.
And he's like but what about ifyou ask yourself and just allow
(39:49):
the response to come?
Speaker 1 (39:51):
how like challenging that I'm like good point, that's
so wise yeah, yeah, and this isI guess that's the bit I get a
little bit concerned, becauseobviously there are pros and
cons, right, um, will it makepeople just more lazy?
Will it just make people lazy?
You know what's going to happento people writing books.
(40:12):
You know people would writebooks with so much passion and
so much like right, and I wantto put this out into the world
and I'll pour their heart andsoul into it.
And now you can go into AI andsay write me a book on, you know
, but obviously, again, it's notgoing to have your personal
story in there, you know, fromfrom just just one prompt.
(40:34):
In that sense, yes, you canmaybe write it and then put it
in there and it may refine it,but yeah, it does.
You know, I've had thosethoughts like what, what happens
to that, that, that sort of thebook industry in that sense as
well and I guess again thatcomes back to your personal
brand.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
If you've built yourself a brand that is
attracting a real niche and thenyou publish a book because
people want more of you, that'sit.
Books aren't going to just sellthemselves anymore because it's
going to get flooded.
Everybody's going to have abook, aren't they?
If we can, everybody could havea book.
(41:12):
So people then buy theindividual and then that
individual serves, sells thebook exactly.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And, and you know, nowadays I don't think it's just
about, oh, you know, being apublished author.
I've got a book.
It's about how does that sit inthe strategy of your bigger
picture, that mission, thatvision, purpose?
You know inquiry calls wherethey're like, yeah, I just want
to.
You know, I want to launch abook or I want to create a
(41:48):
membership program.
Okay, good, what kind ofpresence, audience do you have
around you community?
And she was just like no, Idon't really.
Actually, I just wanted to,because, you know, I've been
told that I need membershipgroups, I can make passive
income.
And or, you know, you know justbeen told that I need
membership groups, I can makepassive income.
And or, you know, you know,just make different kind of
income rather than theone-to-one um and or, if I've
(42:11):
got a book, then I'll get a lotmore exposure and visibility.
I'm like, okay, who's going tobe buying your book?
For?
What do they know you for?
And she was just like, yeah,that's a good point, they don't
really know me for this, butthis is what my book's going to
be about.
And you know, sometimes peopleare doing it around something
(42:31):
that matters to them, thatthey're passionate about they.
You know that they're reallypurposeful about and people are
buying into that purpose andmission.
(42:53):
You know, we see it all thetime and I do.
I, I advocate brands I don'teven buy from, but because I'm
just like what an amazing brand,I'll go and put them in front
of other people.
Um, maybe it's just not rightfor me, for whatever reason, you
know um, but however, I'dadvocate them because I'm buying
into their purpose, theirmission and and that that's the
(43:15):
power of brand.
So, if you're, then if youthey're not an individual that
you know has a strong um, youknow you're advocating a certain
really positive change in theworld for something or other.
That's what people are buyinginto.
And then you know that then getsgranular into products and
services and stuff like that.
But then when you've gotsomething like that, that's
(43:37):
where then really beautifulcollaborations happen, that's
where then you have that naturaljourney.
Do you know what?
Actually, I'm going to write abook now, because I know I can
bring so much knowledge and wecan, you know, create more of an
impact by putting these wordsout there and educating,
teaching people through my bookor whatever it is in that sense,
membership, that kind of thing.
So now people actually have gotmore of a buy-in and it helps.
(44:00):
It gives them a bit of anidentity as well.
You know, like you've got thebrand like Patagonia you wear,
that you already feel likeyou're a certain type of person.
It already gives you a certainkind of identity.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
I love the brand Patagonia.
Um, yeah, just such apurposeful brand and, yeah, just
sounds like one of the bestplaces to work.
You're all just surfing atlunchtime, aren't they very cool
?
Um, something that was comingup for me then, just thinking
about individuals publishingbooks.
(44:36):
I know, not, neither of us arenecessarily in this space, but
something that I keep seeingrecently is people having a
chapter of a book and, like I'vebeen involved in summits.
So for a summit, you are one ofmany guest speakers and then
you obviously promote that toyour, to your audience, and then
(44:59):
you've got maybe 12 or 20speakers who are all promoting
the summit for their audiences.
So, I guess, in the same way,publishing a book where you just
own a chapter of it, and thenyou're standing side by side,
all of these other experts intheir field also then you're all
public, you're all sharing that.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
Yeah, this, this is an intriguing strategy yeah,
yeah, collaborations right, Imean you're, then you're tapping
into various audiences all atthe same time.
You know you've got a widerreach um, if it's just me alone,
whereas when you've got 10different authors in that same
book and everyone's got theirown followers and following and
(45:42):
you, you know it's got some sortof you know force for good.
It's a great way to reach morepeople and make more impact.
Speaker 2 (45:54):
I saw a beautiful post yesterday and it said at
the top it's all aboutcooperation, not competition.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Absolutely, and it does.
Does it does make sense, youknow, if we can, if you are
inclined in that way to be amission-led, purpose-driven,
purpose-centered business, andyou've got other people who are
on a similar kind of path andyou can both impact collectively
(46:25):
, why not?
Why not right?
Speaker 2 (46:31):
arty just thinking about.
We are coming towards the endof our conversation.
Is there any kind of keytakeaway that you think for
solopreneurs or people withmaybe small to medium-sized
teams that haven't really put alot of thought into their own
personal brand strategy?
What, where, where could theystart?
(46:53):
What's like the number onepiece that you think with the
weekend coming up like, justthink about this as you're
walking around the lake for yourweekend hike.
What should they be thinkingabout?
Speaker 1 (47:05):
Sure, sure, I mean.
I always like to say you know,if your brand isn't clear on the
inside, it won't be clear onthe outside.
So it is about going inwardlyand I'll just leave you with my
brand journey wheel.
So I'll just quickly share whatthat is in three steps.
So the first one is step one isclarify.
(47:26):
Step two is create and stepthree is communicate.
A lot of business owners gostraight to communicate because
they're thinking I want topromote and grow and get sales
and make money and all of thatkind of thing, but what they
haven't done is done.
The step one, which is clarify,so that is the discover and
define.
Discover and define who you areas a brand.
(47:48):
Honestly, this step isinvaluable when I've worked with
clients what it's done and howit's accelerated, not only their
journey, what it's done fortheir own energy, their
enthusiasm, the clarity it'sbrought in terms of to get
focused and have that direction.
The clarity it's brought interms of to get focused and have
that direction.
(48:08):
It's one of the best things youcan do for yourself, because
what comes out of that will thenhelp you to really determine
where am I heading from here.
And we all like a bit of wheream I heading from here?
We don't want to keep hittingbrick walls.
So, you know, clarify, discoverand define internal strategic
fundamentals, external.
So, like I said, those, thosefundamentals purpose, mission,
(48:30):
vision, values plays a massive,massive role in, you know,
determining your actions andbehaviors.
Really, really important,understanding what do we stand
for as a brand, what are ourvalues, what determines our
actions and behaviors.
In that sense, moving intocreate, once you've got that
(48:52):
clarity, you've clarified all ofthis, that will then help to
create, create your visualidentity, the logo, colors,
typography or you know, fontsand that kind of thing, and it
will also help to create thekind of services that you
actually, that your audienceactually needs.
Sometimes there's a very sortof right, let's just put this
(49:13):
service and product out there,but where has any research
actually been done?
Do we know that the audience,the market, needs this?
So, getting that into the sortof actually, even as a business,
you need to do that researchanyway, right, you need to have
that mvp and, uh, that kind ofthing.
So, knowing that there is somesort of need for the product or
(49:34):
service, um, in that, createspace, then that will help to
create.
You know all of that side ofthing product services, visual
identity system and then alsoidentity, your social media,
your website because now, like Isay, it's the brand that will
then inform the branding andthen the branding will help to
inform the marketing.
So this is where you thencommunicate.
(49:55):
You then communicateauthentically, you communicate
in a very precise way andconcise way to the audience that
you actually want to attractand work with.
Or it may not even and I sayaudience clusters, that's just
not, that's not always like yourend client.
That could also be othercollaborators, influencers,
(50:19):
communities, networks, that kindof thing, networks, that kind
of thing.
So you know, it's about thengetting really precise about
what it is that you want, whoyou want to attract, and
communicating that in a verysort of intentional way.
And this is why I say mindfulbranding, because now you're
making really conscious choicesabout how you're showing up,
(50:42):
what you're saying who to, whyshould they care?
All of these kind of things.
So you know you're not justcoming from a oh, let me just
guess.
You know, let me just put somecontent out, because I've been
told to post three times a week.
It's getting making reallyconscious choices about the
business, the brand yourself,how you want to be known all of
(51:02):
that kind of thing, and that allcomes from clarify.
Speaker 2 (51:06):
I'm just about to start a sub stack, so I've
parked my original newsletter uh, kind of rethought what that
wants to look like.
So I think with this new substack, I'm going to be really
introducing the topic of socialwell-being and social connection
(51:26):
, and the importance of reallyfocusing on this is individuals.
Um, have you got anyrecommendations for me or
anybody who may be in my shoes?
That's about to really like.
I've done the work to definewho my audience is and now I
want to speak to them.
Speaker 1 (51:42):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly that, you know.
Speak to your audience.
It's that emotional connection.
It goes beyond.
You know, obviously, thedemographics, but really what
are they feeling?
What do they want?
What's going on in their dailylife?
Really take that time tounderstand that, not assume.
(52:06):
Have conversations with thepeople that you actually want to
attract, work with, collaboratewith, you know, understand
what's going on for them and andyou know that that's that's
such a beautiful connectionpiece, because then you can
start bringing that into yourcontent and then what that
starts doing, it startspositioning you as the person
(52:28):
who knows, because who knows howthey're feeling, what's going
on for them, and when you startaddressing that side of things
rather than I, I, I, I when youstart addressing that side of
things, it's about them andagain it comes, you're pulling
them in to then say, right, okay, how can I serve you?
This is, or this is how I canserve you.
(52:49):
You know we've.
It's helping them to feel andeverything's very much about how
we make other people feel right.
It's helping them to feel like,look, I see you, I understand
you, I care for you, I want to,I want to help you from where
you are now to where you want toget to, this is what I'm
training or this is how I'vehelped other clients.
(53:09):
So evidencing that social proofis also important.
A lot of business owners arelike, oh, I don't want to blow
my own trumpet and I'm like youneed to blow your own trumpet.
People need to know that youare, you know you can evidence
your expertise, your knowledge,you know your results.
So when somebody gives you atestimonial, put it on your
social media.
(53:29):
It's a great thing to hear.
Why wouldn't you?
That's all your hard work andwhat that then does.
It then evidences in otherpeople's mind.
Okay, she can provide from youknow, pain point to solution, to
transformation.
That's what we want.
All of us want transformation.
So it is really understandingthe transformations people want
(53:50):
and the pain points that theyare experiencing and you being
that vehicle I like to say abrand is a vehicle to serve,
grow and impact and you beingthe vehicle that's going to take
them from pain point totransformation, from pinpoint to
transformation, because whenthey have the transformation,
they become generally, maybe youknow better people.
(54:11):
You know more loving, more kind, more caring.
You know they put more clarity.
Therefore they're not feelinglow and down and all of those
kind of things, and thereforewe're creating more of a
positive energy.
Speaker 2 (54:21):
And would you imagine kind of one person on the other
side?
So you're writing and you kindof see that individual person,
you're literally writing to you.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's really important actually
to do that, because you know itcan be quite easy to get lost in
like, okay, I'm starting towrite for this person, and then
you know, and then you're likethat's when it starts getting
generic, whereas when you, whenyou've done the customer
identity piece, and we know,okay, it's this, this, this is
(54:55):
the person I'm writing for today, or this month, that kind of
thing.
It just makes it so much more,so much more easier, because now
you've got them in mind, youknow what kind of pain points,
challenges, what's not happeningin their life that they would
actually desire.
You can then take them on thatjourney through your content,
(55:16):
through your website, throughdialogue when you're at
networking events.
You know the number of times Ican go into a networking event
and share a story.
Story and storytelling andnarrative is another really,
really key part of being able tohave dialogue around something
that's that's relatable andrelevant to to these people as
(55:39):
well.
You know in in that sense,because if you just go out and
like I just do brand strategyand I can sell you my brand
strategy package, I'll be like,yeah, don't get it, whatever,
but it's about making itunderstandable.
Relatable, you know, helpingthem feel understood.
And you know always say brandis an energy, it is felt, and
when you're saying it with suchauthentic, that genuine, I know
(56:00):
where I'm coming from, I knowthe kind of change I want to see
in this world, I know what Ican do for you.
All of this, you know, buildsconfidence in people and builds
that ultimately, people buy fromtrust and when they feel that
transference of trust going onand that might not just happen
in the one meeting you have, butover time, from your social
(56:23):
posts and there's thatconsistency and congruency and
everything that transference oftrust happens.
And for some people they need abit more transference of trust.
Some people will be like, oh,I've been seeing your post for
three months, I want to workwith you.
Some people it's been two years, but it's important to have
that.
You know, that's what we'reultimately where.
That's when people ultimatelybuy, when they have that
(56:43):
emotional connection.
I trust this person, I trustthis brand, I trust this
business.
Speaker 2 (56:50):
Thank you so much for all of your sharings.
I do feel like I just want totouch on one final point from
our conversation that we had acouple of weeks ago and we were
talking about the the transitionof a repatriate, the the
transition of a repatriate, andwe touched on your experience
(57:12):
moving back to the UK afterliving in Malaysia for a while
and years and the getting usedto the way that people operate
yeah, oh gosh, I I still do missthat where you could just pick
up the phone and say finish yourwork seven, eight o'clock,
let's meet, you know.
Speaker 1 (57:28):
Um, yeah, that that was quite a bit of a big shocker
in terms of what's helped meand stuff.
It is just probably gettingthose dates put in in advance.
Whoever you want to see, whoyou really really want to see,
just make it happen.
Speaker 2 (57:43):
You know, even if it is two weeks, one month, three
months, uh down the line, andlike maybe just getting into the
flow of the local norms forpeople, for expats who are
moving around.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
I guess it's trying to understand what those local
norms and customs are yeah, yeah, because the other thing I used
to do is just call peoplestraight, you know, just be like
off the bat, call people when Ifelt like talking to them, kind
of thing.
Yeah, that's also a bit ofmessaging first what time is
good for you, that kind of thing.
So, yeah, it is probably justand you know, there's different
(58:20):
groups of friends and family aswell, right, and you've got sort
of the acquaintances and thenyou've got your inner circle
where, yeah, they don't care andI don't care what time they
pick up the phone, and thenyou've got your inner circle
where, yeah, they don't care andI don't care what time they
pick, pick up the phone and callyou, and that kind of thing.
Um, yeah, it's probably evenjust asking each other is it
okay for me to buzz you or wouldyou prefer we, you know,
whatsapp or whatever, that thatkind of thing, and that that
kind of communication isprobably key as well, isn't it
(58:41):
in that sense?
Speaker 2 (58:43):
yeah, especially with new, with new connections, when
you've been moving, when you'vemoved somewhere or you've moved
back from somewhere.
Yeah, understanding that whereyou've come from is quite
different.
So thank you for that just lastpiece.
I just felt like that was anugget really worth sharing,
because I know I reallyresonated with that experience
myself.
I thank you and appreciate youfor your time.
(59:05):
Where is the place where youmost spend your time, that that
you think, um, people come findme here, because this is really
where you see, see, the most ofme yeah, linkedin, linkedin
definitely.
Speaker 1 (59:17):
I'm consistently posting over there brand tips
and all sorts, all sorts bit ofmindset, bit of spirituality,
bit of everything from mypersonal, from my brand in that
sense.
Speaker 2 (59:28):
Beautiful and a beautiful brand.
It is Artie Palmer.
Thank you so much for your time.
It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (59:33):
Yes, yeah, absolute pleasure, thank you.
Thank you for having me.
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