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Boredom is not a problem to solve but an essential skill children must develop for emotional regulation and creative thinking. When parents constantly entertain their children or rescue them from boredom, they unintentionally prevent crucial developmental growth. In today's replay episode (this is the second most downloaded episode of our podcast!) I chat with Susie Allison, founder of Busy Toddler with over 2 MILLION followers.
• Boredom is where creativity, problem-solving, and intrinsic motivation are born
• Children as young as babies can practice independent play when parents allow them space
• "Boredom busters" should be avoided - instead, honor the emotion but don't rush to fix it
• Screen time should be a predictable, scheduled tool for parents, not a boredom solution for kids
• Play shouldn't always involve adults - independent, unstructured play is where deep learning happens
• Start small with independent play - use a visual timer for young children to understand timeframes
• Creating the right environment with fewer, more intentional toys helps children engage independently
• Neurodivergent children may need different approaches to handling boredom
• Child-led play means letting children determine how they use toys without adult interference
• Expensive toys aren't necessarily better - simple household items often make the best play materials
Try the Reflective Parent Club for free for seven days to build emotion regulation skills and join our supportive community. Visit CuriousNeuron.com to access resources and learn more about supporting your child's emotional development.
Learn more from Susie on Instagram
https://busytoddler.com/
is going, and we are becomingreflective parents.
We are learning that we have tobuild strong emotion regulation
skills and support our child'semotional development by
(00:21):
modeling what this looks likefor them.
Many of us didn't learn how toregulate our emotions, and so if
you are new here and wonderingif this podcast is for you, you
might not even know if you knowhow to regulate emotions.
This is what one of the parentstold me recently inside our
club called the ReflectiveParent Club, and I think this is
why what the work I do is soimportant.
(00:42):
I try to share the science andreach out to people that will
help us understand what emotionregulation looks like, what's
emotional intelligence and whatcontributes to us not regulating
our emotions as well as we'dlike to.
It's not about digging intoyour past.
It's really about buildingawareness, so that
self-awareness is a big piece ofwhat we do here at Curious
Neuron and for this podcast, andso if you're new here, and this
(01:06):
is something you are looking todo you want to express your
emotions a little bit more.
You want to communicate them alittle bit better.
You want to stop being reactive.
Or maybe you suppress emotionsand you don't speak up when you
feel like you should inretrospect, and say I should
have said something to mypartner, or I could have said
something to my boss who spoketo me.
That way, then you are at theright place.
(01:27):
I want to make sure that thisis not, you know, another one of
those parenting podcasts.
There are lots, and there aregreat ones, but I don't need to
tell you how to parent yourchild.
I want you to become moreattuned with yourself and I want
you to become more attuned withyour child and to build the
confidence and the skills thatyou need to do that, not only
(01:47):
today, but in 10, 15 years.
If we can focus on that, whichis through becoming a reflective
parent, then things might feela little bit less stressful and
might feel a little bit easier,and that's what we do.
So today we are revisiting oneof our top three podcast
episodes that we've played.
So today we are revisiting oneof our top three podcast
episodes that we've played.
We're on season eight right now, and this episode about boredom
(02:10):
with Susie Allison is one ofthe top three episodes, and so,
you know, if you have a childwho really struggles with
boredom, it's an emotionregulation skill.
It's something that we need tosupport our child with,
co-regulate with scaffold andbuild small ways for them to
learn how to do this.
It's not about, you know, kindof stopping the boredom or
(02:34):
creating a way for them to, youknow, get busy all of a sudden.
We want them to be bored, andso if you struggle with this
with your child, this episode isfor you.
I've said many times, theeducation piece is only the
first part, and so if youstruggle with this with your
child, this episode is for you.
I've said many times, theeducation piece is only the
first part.
So on CuriousNeuroncom which, bythe way, if you have not
visited it, is a brand newwebsite you can save articles
(02:56):
now.
You can create your account forfree, save some of the blogs
that we're posting, and we'reputting up new ones every week.
You could also revisit all ofthe podcast episodes.
We've created a search bar soyou can search for an episode.
Let's say, if you said oh,bruce Perry's episode, I haven't
listened to it yet, but I can'tfind it on Apple Podcast or
(03:17):
Spotify.
Go to kirstenroncom, click onpodcasts and in the search bar
you can write Bruce Perry.
It'll bring you to that episodeand so you can listen to it.
That way, I want to make surethat you find an easy way to
keep educating yourself.
But, like I said, that's notenough.
We've been doing this for yearshere at Curse Neuron, helping
(03:37):
you build that self-awareness.
But once you realize okay, I amaware now that I'm not
regulating in the way that I'dlike to, and this is leading to
me not being the kind of parentthat I've always wanted to be
for my child.
I want to show up better formyself and I want to show up
better for my child.
Then click the link in the shownotes to try out the Reflective
Parent Club for free for sevendays.
(04:00):
Come to one of our weeklymeetings, if you come.
Let me just check the calendar.
So if you join next week or atthe end of this week, you're
going to be part of our nextweek.
We have our weekly not ourweekly our monthly Q&A, our live
Q&A with a neuroscientist,stephanie Zito, who is the
(04:21):
author of a new book called SlowDown, enjoy Life.
So she's coming to talk abouthow to keep self-care simple as
parents.
And then on Saturday, april26th, at 11 am Eastern time,
it's our monthly family meeting,where you bring your kids to
the Zoom call and we are goingto be talking about how emotions
(04:43):
can feel like they get biggerand bigger and bigger and we're
going to do a drawing activityaround that, and I want to talk
to kids about the importance ofsharing and talking about our
emotions that are inside ourhead, because sometimes, when we
keep them in, it feels likethey're getting bigger and
bigger and bigger and stronger.
And so that is what you get asa Reflective Parent Club member.
(05:04):
You join for a dollar a day andyou get to meet with me for an
hour every week where you cantalk about struggles that you
are having.
I post PDFs in terms of whatyou can do with your child, what
you can do with yourself.
I help you reflect on asituation that you've been
through, and we have a coursethat you work through.
(05:25):
You talk, you look at yourvalues, you learn how to build
emotion regulation skills andconflict resolution skills All
of that for three months, forless for a dollar a day, which,
for three months, is less thanone session with the therapist,
and so it really helps you getthat community and that support
you need to build the emotionregulation skills.
(05:47):
So that's why I've built thatclub is because I knew that
learning and education was notenough, and so we need a space
where we can practice andreflect and have a community and
somebody a facilitator, whichis me to support you.
Facilitator, which is me tosupport you.
Miss, next week, come join usand see what it looks like when
we have our monthly calls withour kids and our monthly calls
(06:09):
with a Q&A a live Q&A and joinone of our weekly meetings next
Tuesday.
You can join at 12 pm Easternor at 8 pm Eastern.
Let's dive into this episode.
First, I'd like to thank theTannenbaum Open Science
Institute for supporting theCurious Norm podcast, as well as
the McConnell Foundation.
Without these two organizations, this podcast would not be
possible, and there's a specialsomebody that I would like to
(06:31):
thank.
I tell you, guys, when you sendme a screenshot of your review,
I send you a free PDF calledMeltdown Mountain, which is a.
I have my own beside me.
It's a visual that you can usewith your child to help them
understand what this regulationlooks like in the brain and how
(06:53):
to support them.
At least you get the language.
You could print it, put it upon your fridge and talk about it
with them, not when they'rehaving a tantrum, after or
before, but it really helps thembuild emotion regulation skills
and it gives you that languagethat you might need.
There's a booklet that comeswith it, so you learn about that
.
You can get it for free or youcan go on CuriousNoroncom and
(07:14):
click on shop and purchase it ifyou'd like.
But you can get it for free ifyou send me an email with a
screenshot of your review atinfo at CuriousNoroncom.
But I'd like to thank Carly myWest Coast friend she said,
which I love for taking the timeto send me such a beautiful
email telling me how she listensto the podcast in the car while
(07:35):
one of her kids is napping.
And it really means a lot to meto see these emails, because
you don't see it.
But right now I'm in mybasement recording this intro
and I'm by myself and I don'tsee you.
I see numbers and metrics, butI like to know who Carly is or
who Michelle is or who Tanya is.
(07:56):
Names matter and they'reimportant.
It makes me feel like I amspeaking to all of you, and so
if you do have a moment, pleaseleave a rating and send an email
and I will send you that freePDF as a thank you.
So thank you, carly.
Today I'm interviewing somebodywho I've been following for a
long time now, and if you don'tknow the word busy toddler, if
(08:21):
you don't know who this personis, then you need to jump onto
Instagram or her website Becausethis person is.
Then you need to jump ontoInstagram or her website because
this person is somebody thatwill help you come up with
really easy activities for yourkid, and it's kind of ironic
that we're going to talk aboutboredom.
But before we begin, please letme introduce you to our guest
today, susie Allison, who is thecreator of Busy Toddler.
She has more than 1.7 millionfollowers on Instagram.
(08:44):
She's also a formerkindergarten and first grade
teacher with a master's in earlychildhood education.
Susie shares ideas and tips onplaying, learning and parenting
that she's developed throughyears of experience as a teacher
and a parent.
I could not be more excited tospeak with her today, and the
topic of boredom is somethingthat has blown up on my personal
(09:07):
account on Curious Neuron Everytime I post about this.
Everybody has tons of questionswhen do I begin?
How do I do this?
What if my child doesn't likebeing bored?
And they whine and they cry andthey're uncomfortable, and that
makes me uncomfortable.
So we're going to make surethat we cover all of this today
in our conversation.
Enjoy the interview.
I'll see you on the other side.
(09:27):
Hi, susie, hi how are you?
I'm good.
I've been excited to speak withyou for a long time now and I
love that we connected on thetopic of boredom because you
know you're a busy toddler andyou've taught me how to keep my
kids busy and I teach parentshow to.
You know use play to help theirchild with.
(09:48):
You know support theirdevelopment.
So it's kind of interestingthat we're both talking about
boredom today, but it's a reallyimportant topic.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
No, it is, and the
irony is not lost on me.
I'm so here for this.
I love it.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Perfect.
First, I introduced you at thebeginning, but I just wanted to
say thank you on behalf ofeverybody.
You know.
I put this little question boxand said what questions you have
around boredom, and there werea few questions, but most of
them were can you please tellSusie?
I love her and all heractivities have have helped me
so much.
So I needed to say that,because there were at least like
30 something of those messages,so I needed to tell you.
(10:21):
Um, but you have helped so manyof us, including myself with
the three kids, and you make iteasy, and I'm one of those moms
now that had always, always hadone like or two sheets of those
dot stickers wherever I went andthey saved me.
So thank you for the work thatyou do.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Oh, it's all my
pleasure.
It really is.
What I get to do is such a joyand it just fills my spirit so
much, and then just getting tohear back from people about it
really is the icing on the cake.
Speaker 1 (10:47):
I love that.
So let's get into this topic ofboredom First.
What are your thoughts onboredom?
Because, like I said at thebeginning, you have taught us to
keep our kids busy.
So do you believe in boredomand how do you balance that?
Speaker 2 (11:02):
I sure do believe in
boredom.
You know, one of the things Ilike to joke about is that while
I do post these activities, theactivities are more for parents
, not necessarily as boredombusters and actually boredom
busters is one of my most hatedterms.
So, like other people, it'slike moist, or my sister hates
the word complimentary, for meit's boredom buster.
I hate the phrase boredombuster because I don't want to
(11:22):
bust their boredom, because inboredom, as you know, lies the
secret to so much goodness inchildhood that I don't ever want
to take that away.
So while I am the activitiesqueen you know that's what I've
been told you are yeah, I useactivities not to help my kids,
not to be bored.
(11:42):
I use them as tools when I needhelp.
If the kids are fighting or play, maybe is it going well, or I'm
desperate to drink my coffee,or I need to hit the reset
button on our day, that's when Ireach for an activity.
I don't reach for an activity,and I consciously don't reach
for an activity.
If I hear my child say I'mbored, I don't and I make a very
clear definition that I'm notgoing to do that with my kids.
(12:05):
I'm not here to rescue you outof boredom, and I know we're
going to talk a lot about that,but I'm not here to be their
boredom savior.
I'm here to help keep our shiprunning smoothly and help fill
them with all sorts of amazingskills and strategies to develop
in their lives, and learning tocope with boredom is one of the
(12:25):
most important skills that wecan give to our kids.
Life is inherently boring.
There are parts of life thatare just inherently boring, and
if we try to kind of bowl overthat with our kids or avoid that
with them, we end up causingactual problems in the long run
that they're going to run into,and you know that as well as
(12:47):
anyone.
So yeah, while I might have allthese activities at my disposal
, it doesn't mean I'm using themever for the dreaded boredom
buster.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
And I think that
that's a really big
misconception around all this,because there have been a lot of
parents throughout the past fewyears that I've been doing this
that come to me and ask me, youknow, or have guilt around the
fact that sometimes they're notenjoying certain activities that
they're doing with their child,or they don't like play
necessarily with young kids, orthey tell me that they run out
of ideas, you know, throughoutthe day.
(13:17):
And that's where I tell themyou need to include, you know, a
balance of playing with yourchild or stepping away or
creating activities like youhave taught us.
You know, with the sensory bins, it's not about filling up the
entire day, so it's not like 10o'clock is a sensory bin, 1030
is you know another activity, 11o'clock, whatever it is.
But I think there's a reallybig misconception around all
(13:37):
this and it places a lot ofstress on new parents.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Oh, I couldn't agree
more.
I think the role of thefacilitator of the child's life
is something that we haveglommed onto in this parenting
generation that didn't happen inthe previous generations.
They didn't see themselves asentertainment facilitators.
The way that we see ourselvesis that and I'm not 100% sure
where that came from or how wekind of shifted and maybe it is
(14:03):
just because we were one of thefirst generations to really
choose to get to have childrenand at what time, and all these
other you know reallyinteresting cultural factors
about parenting in ourgeneration.
But it is very interesting thatwe have chosen to walk down
this road of being theseentertainment facilitators and
really by doing that we've takenaway the ability for our
(14:24):
children then later in life tobe their own entertainment
facilitators or their own, youknow, guides in life and to
build their resilience and allthese deep cognitive skills that
we want them to develop.
We end up accidentallydeveloping, removing by taking
on that role.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Yeah, and I think
also we like to fill in these
moments of boredom or thesevoids of something where you
know it's either during the carride or waiting at a doctor's
office or you know justdifferent situations where we
can become uncomfortable becauseour child is uncomfortable, and
we're able to fill that in nowwith screen time and I don't
(14:59):
want to like put screen timedown because there are moments
where we need to step back as aparent and take a breath.
But I think that those periods,those dull periods, we become
uncomfortable as well.
And I think back to my ownchildhood.
I was raised like at mygrandparents' house and my
grandmother was alone with meand she would basically throw me
outside and say I'll see you atlunchtime and I mean it was
(15:22):
like 8am and it was like comeback at 11 when it's lunchtime
and I would be in the backyardby myself most of the time and,
had you know, I'd have to figureout what to do.
And we've kind of removed thata little bit from or actually a
lot.
We've removed that a lot fromkids because we're also
scheduling scheduling a lot ofactivities in terms of like
sports and instruments orwhatever it is.
So their days are not what theyused to be when we were younger
(15:44):
.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Yeah, we've gone from
kind of every previous
generation growing up in a verychild led childhood into now we
have this very parent ledchildhood where we want to be
responsible for their enrichmentand their engagement and their
future happiness and theirsuccesses.
And we do all that by adding inall these extra bits because we
(16:05):
want their life to bequantified.
We want to make sure that wecan see the data and if the data
says that we've done X, y and Zto get them to this final
outcome, then we've been quoteunquote successful as parents.
But if we go back to that childled idea where we can let kids
learn naturally and learnthrough play and learn through
their own experiences, that putsus in the back seat and that
(16:28):
becomes a really uncomfortableposition for a lot of parents,
because we want to make surethat we're guiding, molding and
driving our kids into the rightpaths, but what we accidentally
do is we're pushing them maybeinto a path that isn't the best
for their development and thatthat child led one would have
been or could have been the muchbetter path.
(16:50):
And, like you said we do we endup scheduling and
overscheduling all of their timeto where they lose the ability
to self-entertain and to findtheir own way, lose the ability
to self-entertain and to findtheir own way.
And when a child becomes veryoverscheduled and their life is
very scripted, then that's whereI feel like we see those kids
particularly getting the mostbored, because they haven't had
(17:12):
that ability to learn the skillsthat they would have otherwise
learned for the moments whenthey are free and they are in
free time.
Then they come back and saywell, I need something to do,
because I'm used to you givingme the answer, I'm used to
having an adult telling me whatto do.
I'm used to this verystructured time.
So then the idea of anunstructured time becomes very
(17:33):
scary and very stressful forthose children.
And we don't.
We don't want to see that andwe don't need to see that.
Kids know what they should.
They know inherently how toplay and entertain.
We just have to allow that toblossom.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
How did that look
like in your home?
Let's start off with the firstchild when they were babies,
because one of the commonquestions I had received today
was you know, when do we startthis?
How do we introduce boredom?
So how did the day look like inyour home with your first child
?
Speaker 2 (18:00):
With my first child.
I was very lucky very early onto recognize that he was
self-entertaining all the timeand that this was something I
wanted for him.
And so I would watch him on hisplaymat and I would see that he
was staring up at the littleplaymat mirror and I go, oh,
that's so cute.
I'm not going to interrupt that, because just like an adult
doesn't want to be interruptedin a conversation, a child
(18:20):
doesn't want to be interruptedwhen they're in the middle of
whatever it is that they're veryengaged and focused on.
So I would watch him on his matand I would watch him with like
a little block or a rattle orsomething, and I would just be
quiet and I would let him bethere in that moment by himself.
And and like you said, I thinkthat that's something that
people think thatself-entertaining and
independent play and being alonewith your thoughts is something
(18:44):
that develops much later inlife.
But really it starts the daythey come home from the hospital
.
You can let them be at one withthe world and with themselves.
They can sit and look in amirror, they can look out the
window.
If you see them beingthoughtful on the changing table
, just you know you don't needto ask them what they're doing.
You can just let them breatheand let them be and let them
(19:05):
look and engage.
And so often we want to again,we want to interject ourselves
and give ourselves something todo and make sure that we're
doing everything possible whenreally, by not doing anything,
you're doing maybe the bestthing you could be doing in that
moment.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
And you know it's
interesting, the way that we're
kind of programmed now is thatthe more we do, the more
productive we are, the better itis for us, right as adults, and
something I had learned with mykids by the time I had my
second one and we would go outand take walks and they would
stop and, you know, pull somegrass or, you know, find a
little dandelion or pick up arock, and my brain was almost
programmed to say let's go,let's continue, let's move on
(19:46):
through our walk.
We need to get home.
And then I had to stop myselfand say, no, there's, I have
nothing to do when I get home,it's just a walk.
Why am I rushing them?
And and I was almostuncomfortable with that moment
of just being there and waitingand being present, but they're
comfortable with it, they'regood at this, this is what they
do, they explore and you'reright, we have to step back a
little bit and get comfortablewith that.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
And their brains need
time to explore.
You know, our brains move muchfaster than theirs and theirs
needs a second.
It needs, you know, and theteacher world and education
where we call it wait time.
They need wait time.
They need time to process itand think.
Whereas we recognizeimmediately it's a dandelion and
I'm good to go, they need acouple of seconds to take that
in, to imprint that, to make themark, to touch it, to feel it,
(20:27):
to experience it, and thenthey're ready to go.
And it isn't going to be on ourtimeline.
And that again goes back to thiskind of child led lifestyle
that we have to slow down.
We are in such a rush and itisn't to, you know, to put us
down and to say, oh, you knowwe're, we're ruining them, but.
But it is to say we, we canlearn from them to experience
(20:48):
things a lot slower and a lotmore deeply, and then we can
also give them the gift of thiskind of time to make their mark
and make their impressions anddo whatever their brain needed
to do in that moment.
And then we can look for thecues that they're ready to go.
You know, I would look for cueson the play mat then that my
son was starting to maybe fussor move and I say, oh, he's, you
know he's done.
And now it's time for me to toscooch a little closer so he
(21:11):
knows that I'm right there withhim, and then him and I can
engage and have our little babybabble conversations and then,
when you know, when the nexttime comes and I notice he's
engaged, I can scoot back againand let him have those minutes.
So I think there's a lot about,like you said, just noticing
those cues in kids and thencultivating that it's good to
stop, it's good to sit, it'sgood to just be.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
I'm putting myself in
the shoes of a parent who's
listening, and perhaps they havea child who's a toddler at this
point and they maybe thisparent didn't realize that they
had to notice those cues andthey were filling in those voids
and those gaps.
Now they have a toddler who isuncomfortable, perhaps being
alone and in that boredom, whatcan a parent do at this point to
kind of reintroduce it orsupport them to develop this?
Speaker 2 (21:54):
I think one of the
best things you can do is to
frame it around independent playand to really just start small
with with their growth inindependent play, because
independent play is essentiallyin itself the child finding a
way out of boredom, becausethey're finding something to do
with their time.
And what I would recommenddoing from toddler age on, is to
(22:14):
get yourself a visual timer,kind of like an oven clock,
where you can turn that timerand say, hey, you're going to
play for the next five minutes.
But you need to show them whatfive minutes looks like, because
to a toddler that might as wellbe five years.
Show them what that looks likeon this little timer and then
ask them to play by themselves.
While you do something, makeyourself busy.
You're doing the laundry,you're unloading a dishwasher,
(22:37):
you're making dinner, so thatyou're occupied in a job and
they're occupied in a job.
You can still see each other.
Maybe you're in the same roomtogether, maybe you move the
blocks in the kitchen, butyou're building this five
minutes at a time.
Because I think, especially inthe toddler years, we want to
bite off then a lot more than wecan chew and we say, well,
we've got to do this.
So I'm going to you know we'regoing to go for an hour tomorrow
(22:58):
and it's like, well, no, no,we're not no, but truly, if you
can start with five minuteincrements of having the child
play without you entertainingthem and being involved in the
play, that's your road togetting the child to find their
way out of boredom and to live amuch more self-entertained
child led life.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
And I've learned
along the years that sometimes
taking the two extra minutes orfive extra minutes yourself as a
parent to sit down with themand get them started on
something, sometimes it helpsbecause you've started pretend
play and they're continuingsomething or whatever it is with
the sensory bin.
But it does help to kind ofguide them sometimes if they do
need it, almost like a pre toyour five minutes and just being
(23:39):
there with them.
But I think also the activitiesthat you offer are really great
because they're something new,right, something novel is
exciting for a child, so theywant to explore different things
and you don't necessarily wantto have a million toys in your
house either.
So your activities, including asensory bin, that helped my
kids a lot because the sensorybins allowed me to step back and
my child was like Ooh, what'sthis?
(24:00):
And then that's when I was ableto, like you know, run a load
of laundry or wash some dishes,because they were curious about
it.
So does it matter what's intheir environment, in your
opinion?
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Yeah, I think it does
matter what's in the
environment.
So my third born is my childthat was born with really
without the ability to playindependently, and though I
structured my home and he hadgreat models and his older
siblings who are phenomenal atplaying by himself, this is
something that did not comeeasily to him and this was
something that we had to reallywork on.
And things that I noticed thathelped him back in the early
years, as we were really tryingto grow this skill and grow it
(24:33):
intentionally was he was veryoverwhelmed by the number of
toys that he was seeing.
And when he would getoverwhelmed by the number of
toys, then it was too manychoices, he was overstimulated
and no, he's not going to play.
Then Then he's just kind ofgiven up on this idea because I
can't find anything to play,there's too many ideas, and now
I'm going to walk away from it.
And then he'd show up and sayI'm bored and it's like, well,
(25:03):
you're not bored, you've justhad a hard time finding a choice
of what to do.
But sure, okay.
And so what I ended up having todo for him was to really pare
down the toys that wereavailable in his room
environment and really limitwhat he had available and I had.
That was not something that I'dever had to do with my other
kids.
They could find what theyneeded and be on their merry way
.
He needed limited choices.
He also needed choices that hecould absolutely do on his own.
If there was something in hisroom that he needed an adult or
(25:25):
an older child's help on,guarantee, that's what he was
going to pick and then he wasgoing to come find one of us to
make it work for him.
So we had to really eliminateall of those from his
environment and we took away thetoys that were.
Maybe they were too old or tooyoung for him and we'd been
saving them because he's thebaby.
So we just everything ended upin his room.
Or they were toys that were waytoo developmentally old for him
(25:47):
, or they had missing parts, orthey just weren't working quite
right, and we really pared downfor him.
There is no right answer orwrong answer for how many toys
you have with your child.
This was a great example of it'svery personal to each child
what each child can handle, andso for him it was about paring
down, about making sure hewasn't overwhelmed by his
(26:07):
choices, that he could find hischoices, because if I had
something in a bin like one ofthose Target bins that they then
can't see what's inside of it,that toy might as well not exist
to him.
If it was not out on a shelfwhere he could see it, then he
would just walk right past it.
And again, then he's walkedright past it.
I have nothing to play with,I'm bored.
(26:27):
You just need to open up thisbin.
So then I learned I have tomove these kinds of toys around
and leave them out or have clearbins or different ways that he
can really see and and find hisplay in a very specific way.
Again, that I didn't have to dowith my other kids.
And then going back to thesensory bin conversation for him
, that was the key toindependent play when he was
(26:48):
little, from about 12 months oldon, I really worked with him on
sensory bins and there wassomething about that being this
very limited choice of somethingto do that he could do.
And then he knew he wassuccessful at it, he knew he was
happy doing it, it was engagingto him and, frankly, he, it was
in our kitchen.
So he, I was always withineyesight of him and I think that
(27:08):
that a lot of times when wethink about independent play
with children, we imagineourselves in a completely
different space in the house andthat will work for some kids
and it won't work for others andit never worked for him.
His umbilical cord does notstretch that far, so him being
kind of in my kitchen area, hecould kind of spin around and
(27:29):
see me anywhere that I wasworking at and that was
comforting to him and thatallowed him to stay safe and to
continue playing then on his ownand to build those skills to
where now he's five and we'rebetter much better.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
I've noticed that the
similarity with what you said
with babies, though, in terms ofnoticing.
So it doesn't matter if yourchild is two months old or five
years old.
You have to notice, you knowwhat works for them and what
doesn't work for them, and andyou really, every child is
different.
So the advice that you'regiving today, like you said, we
really have to look at the childand see what works best.
If they need to be in our room,if you know, some might be
better at all of this that we'retalking about, right, so it's
(28:02):
really important that we takethe time to discover what's best
for our own child.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Yeah, and I think
sometimes we want to put a one
size fits all especially inchild development on something
and say, well, this is you know,this is best practice, so this
is it, this is where all kidsshould be.
And that's not true and that'snot going to be true.
Kids have such a variety ofneeds that we must be willing to
look at it as just kind of abaseline and then work our way
(28:27):
up, down, left and right, to fiteach child in our family.
If you have multiple kids to beable to look and say this
worked for this kid, it does notwork, and then that's okay.
If it doesn't work, it reallyis okay.
It's not a condemnation on thatkid because it didn't work for
them or they need something alittle bit different.
It's just they need it a littlebit different and it is what it
(28:49):
is.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
What would you say to
a parent who has a child who's
a little bit older, maybebetween five and seven who
struggles with that boredom andas a parent, perhaps they've
been using screen time to kindof fill that void?
How do we step back from thatand reintroduce this new world
now of I want you to be bored?
How does a parent do that?
Speaker 2 (29:09):
I think first you
have to reframe your use of
screen time and I think you haveto reclaim it, because when a
child ends up using screen timeto fill their boredom, that
means the child owns the screentime and they're using it as a
tool to help themselves.
And what I preach and what Ipractice at my house is that
screens are a tool for parentsand they're a tool for us to use
(29:31):
when we need help.
They're not a decision for thechild to decide when the child
needs or wants screen timebecause, frankly, they might
choose it the entire day and wereally we really lost control.
So instead, what I would lookat doing is starting screen time
to be a predictable schedule,that these are the times of day
when it is absolutely available.
It will always be available,you can count on this like
(29:54):
clockwork.
It will be available in myhouse for my kids that's around
breakfast time, when I'm cookingbreakfast and trying to start
our morning and like reprogrammy day.
They get their 30 minutes thenand then in the late afternoon,
kind of after that, nap time,rest time, quiet time my kids
get another dose of it in theafternoon and again, it's a very
predictable schedule.
They know when it's coming,they don't have to worry it's
(30:16):
not going to come, because I'vebuilt that trust with them that
they know it will absolutelycome at those two times and
because of that then they don'tfeel the need to ask for it
throughout the day because theyknow the answer will be no and
they also know when the routineis.
They know when to expect it.
So if that is something thatyou're struggling with at your
(30:37):
house and your child is comingto you constantly throughout the
day, can I just do screen timenow?
I'm bored.
I would really encourage you toset that boundary to start today
, find your time or timesthroughout the day that you do
need screen time, and it will becomfortable for you and it is
something you can give yourchild and then pull it away at
(30:57):
the other times.
They need a predictable routine.
They need to know when it'sgoing to start and when it's
going to stop and that they cancount on that, because they need
to also then know that it's nota fallback option later in the
day, that this is not somethingthat I can decide around
lunchtime.
I'm suddenly.
I'm really bored.
I just would like to have mytablet back.
Well, no, it's not availableright now, and we look at it the
(31:19):
same way.
Maybe we would look at, youknow, if they asked to eat bread
all day or if they wanted toeat candy all day.
It's the same kind of thing.
We have no problem putting alimitation around it in a lot of
other things in parenting, andso we can do the same thing with
screen time.
And, you know, play begets play,and so the more a child can
(31:42):
play and the more that they canget used to that play and used
to the fact that the tabletisn't going to come rescue you
and take away this feeling thatyou're having right now, the
better.
Because really, especially asthey get older, they need to
learn to be able to sit withthat boredom because, frankly,
as we know, there's a lot ofboring times at school and when
we get into that school age,they have to have that skill,
(32:04):
they have to have that abilityto handle and sit with boredom.
They have to be able to.
It becomes very crucial totheir existence in the
elementary, middle and highschool life.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
This is exactly what
led to my posts on boredom.
I was listening to the audiobookof Atomic Habits and near the
end of the book he talks aboutintrinsic motivation and how,
you know, I think they werecomparing athletes and the ones
that did well were the ones thatwere able to motivate
themselves past that boredom ofthat plateau, like I'm not
getting any better, but you knowI need to keep and keep, you
(32:36):
know, running every day orwhatever it is.
But they were talking about thatand that made me think of
school, where we have to kind of, you know, push through the
boring subjects or the boringmoments, and I'm so happy that
you brought that up because wedon't think about the impact
that this could have, includingintrinsic motivation.
So when I had, when I've dealtwith parents who have
school-aged children, they'llsay, like, how do I get them to
(32:59):
be motivated, right, without theexternal factors?
But it starts very young andwhen you're bored and a child is
sitting there and seessomething and says, oh, I wonder
, I wonder what that would do ifI kind of built a tower, if I
put those two things together.
It's child-led an idea andthey've, you know, done whatever
they thought of and createdsomething, and that's internal
motivation.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Yeah, and that's
really what we want to get kids
at, because as they get olderand school gets more challenging
, they have to be able to keepthemselves motivated.
Something that parents end updoing a lot of times is we
equate boredom with intelligenceand we say well, my child's
bored in school because I thinkthat school is really easy for
them.
And I think what we need tounderstand a little bit more is
(33:40):
that boredom happens on bothsides of the coin.
You can be bored when somethingis too easy and you can be
bored when something is too hard, and that boredom isn't
necessarily caused by the levelthat the child is at.
It might just be the level thatthe activity is at.
And as kids understand boredomwhen they're younger and they
(34:02):
bring that into the school time,they really are able to handle
that and either get their needsmet by saying, hey, this is too
easy or hey, this is too hard.
I have a lot of questionsbecause I'm not able to do this.
And again that becomes thatintrinsic motivation.
Do they want to get better?
Do they want to betterthemselves?
Do they want to solve thisproblem, whether the problem is
(34:23):
too easy or too hard, but itreally does all go back to this
understanding that it's okay tobe bored, that bored is a fine
emotion to have and we have tosee it as an opportunity to
start something new and startsomething exciting and to work
within ourselves to cope, tocope with it.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
I think back to when
my kids were young and we were
sitting at the doctor's officeand we had a lot of parents
around us that had their babiesand we're like looking at
screens and you know, I guesssometimes you know you don't
want your child to cry, you'rein a public area, but we would
walk around and look at eitherif they had paintings on the
wall or we would sit there andpeople watch.
Now I don't know if peoplewatching is something I like to
(35:04):
do, because my husband's Italianand you know they just people.
They people watch all day, likewhen we visited Italy.
It's so fun.
You're bored, you're not doinganything, there's no purpose to
what you're doing, but you know,having that child in that
situation is really nice becausenow they're able to just sit
there.
And of course now they'regetting older and sometimes
(35:24):
they'll say you know I'm boredin the car ride.
But then I'll say what can youdo with that boredom?
Can you play Simon Saystogether?
Can you play I Spy?
I wonder if you know givingthem the ideas.
Is that something you wouldrecommend?
Or do you just tell them like,deal with it?
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Well, first of all, I
love the way you phrase that.
What can you do with thatboredom?
Because that just makes itsound so empowering.
Like, you're right, you arebored.
What are you going to do withthat?
Like, where do we go from here?
For me, if my kids come to meand say they're bored, instead
of dismissing the emotionbecause it is, it's frustrating
to be bored.
Nobody likes the feeling ofbored.
I was in an orthodontistappointment with my son the
other day.
I didn't remember a book.
(36:02):
There's no magazines in thewaiting room.
It started to go on longer thanI expected.
My phone internet wasn'tworking and all I could do is
text.
And I texted my best friend andI said I'm at the orthodontist
and I'm bored, entertain me.
And she wrote back no, you haveto sit with it.
And I just laugh because youknow it's kind of like what
we'll say to kids yeah, but sowhat I like to do with my kids
if they come to me and say I'mbored, I honor that emotion.
(36:25):
Wow, you're bored, okay.
Okay, let me help you reallyquick to find what we can do.
And I think the key is reallyquick because I'm not going to
make attention seeking part ofthe answer to boredom.
I'm going to really quicklytoss out a couple of ideas and
then go right back to what I'mdoing.
Oh wow, you're bored.
You are welcome to go outside.
You're welcome to color rightnow.
(36:47):
You're welcome to do the disheswith me.
Maybe someone will keep me upon that.
You know, you're welcome to dothe dishes with me.
Maybe someone will keep me upon that.
You're welcome to head to thesensory bin.
Let me know what you choose.
And then I turn around and Ialways end it with that Let me
know what you choose and I justkind of walk away and I leave it
at that.
And sometimes what they'llchoose at a young age is maybe
(37:07):
to just sit on the floor andstare at you.
All right, well, that's whatyou chose to do.
I'm going to go back to doingthe dishes, which you said no to
helping.
But my goal always with that isagain to just remind them, give
a few quick ideas, not getsucked into the trap of where
I'm trying to like overlyentertain them or give them all
(37:28):
this attention based on thewords I'm bored, because I don't
want them to then be like well,I'm bored, I'm going to go talk
to mom and now she'll give melike a 20 minute conversation
and that'll satisfy me.
I just want to give them a fewquick ideas to help them
redirect, and I'm going to sayit's 50, 50 on when they'll take
one of the suggestions or theyjust walk away from me and go do
something else because I didnot give them anything they were
(37:49):
interested in.
They always go and findsomething else and that also
just has to do with the cultureof our family and this idea that
there's plenty to do.
You have stuff to do.
You're just maybe a little lostor a little confused on what to
do.
I'm happy to help you to.
You know, spin around the housereally quick and take a quick
inventory of what we have.
Something's going to spark yourinterest.
(38:10):
Worst case case scenario sit onthe floor and watch me finish
the dishes, or help.
Speaker 1 (38:15):
Yeah, please help,
please exactly so many kids so
many dishes.
My dishwasher broke the otherday and I was like, no, no, no,
this can't happen no no, youknow, I I am.
I'm thinking of some emailsI've received from parents who
are single parents and they haveguilt around the fact that they
might tell their child go play,or it's okay to be bored.
(38:37):
Have you experienced the samething and what would you give
them as advice?
Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah, and I think the
same thing happens with parents
with an only child.
We get very wrapped up inmaking sure that the parent is
the playmaker, the play friend,and it is always okay and and it
is always great for a child toplay independently and it is
always good Whether the childhas siblings, doesn't have
siblings, has a parent, has twoparents.
(39:02):
Children need alone time.
They need to play independently.
We know this from countlessyears and millions of studies on
child development that theyneed play without adults.
So we have to get into a pointwith our lives that we can kind
of release that guilt.
It is okay if you are a singleparent.
(39:23):
It is okay if your child is anonly child for them to go play
alone or to be bored or tofigure something out, no matter
if that child has two parents orhas a sibling or not.
That child has work they needto do, playing, and you have
work you need to do as theirparent caregiver and we can't
(39:43):
have you taking the burden oftheir play onto your already
unbelievably full plate.
So that is something that youcan push off of it.
Let them handle play and thencome back together for what I
call connection time, activities, puzzles, board games, walks
around the block, cookingtogether, having deep
conversations but play really issomething that all parents from
(40:07):
all walks of households can say.
It is okay for me to say no toplaying with you right now.
I have things I have to do.
Your job is to play, my job is500 other things to make this
family and our life run smoothly, and we'll come together when
we're both done with our jobs,and I just think it is.
(40:27):
It is really such a fallacythat parents have to take on
that role of of play friend withtheir, with their kids, when we
just we know through every bitof research that kids thrive in
situations where they're playingindependently and it really is
just one of those.
I know, I know it is so hardand it is so much easier for me
(40:48):
to sit here and say it to youthan it is to put it in practice
.
But the next time you have tosay no to your child for play,
take a deep breath and say I'msaying no to play because it is
what's best for them and what'sbest for me right now, and that
is okay.
That is beyond okay.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
And we could schedule
it in the same way that we can
schedule the screen time right,and it doesn't have to be an
hour, it could be 10 minutesafter dinner or 10 minutes
before dinner if you want thattime to step away.
But just planning that I findmakes a really big difference
because your child feels moreconnected to you and I love that
you use that word and then itmakes it a little bit easier to
step away in that moment and youdon't have guilt either.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
Yeah, and I think
having play is a routine time.
You know, if you have playevery day after breakfast and
every day after dinner while I'mdoing the dishes, is your 15,
20 minutes of play by yourselftime.
I think that's awesome and thatalso helps the child to get
into a habit of after dinner.
Each night my parent goes to dothe dishes and I go to my room
to play and it's this littlebreak time and then you come
(41:49):
back together and have yourconnection time and and beauty
in that.
There's such beauty in routinewith children.
There's so much goodness inthere alone that I think we can
really apply it to their play.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
There was a study
that I mentioned last week and I
thought it was interesting tolook at neurodivergent children.
The one that I looked at Ithink it was with autistic
children, I think, or ADHD,actually, I forget.
I'll have the link in the biofor everybody who's listening.
But the study mentioned thatthese children might look for
risky behaviors or somesensory-seeking behavior if
(42:23):
they're bored.
This reminded me that not everychild will deal with boredom
the same way.
How can a parent navigate that?
Speaker 2 (42:29):
Yeah, I loved that
when you added that into that
post and actually that was on mylist of things this weekend to
look back through.
Was that that study?
Speaker 1 (42:38):
I thought that was so
fascinating and such a great
reminder to parents again goingback to what we talked about
that this is not a one size fitsall, it's whatever size fits
your child, yeah, and I thinkit's really important to mention
that because I know, again, itcomes back to some parents
feeling like they might havefailed at parenting or they're
doing something wrong becausetheir child is not thriving, for
, you know, when it comes toboredom and they're not, it's
(43:02):
more than whining.
They're looking to, you know,fill this void through risky
things.
So I just want to make surethat we've mentioned that.
I'd love to continue or endthis conversation and talk a
little bit more about play,since that's your area and I
think, with what we were talkingabout in boredom, play comes
into it.
You started our conversationwith child led and perhaps there
are some parents who don'tunderstand what this means and
have this understanding thatplay means we have to sit there
(43:23):
with them or you know they haveto be filled with toys, you know
, around them.
So what is child led play andhow does a parent do this?
Speaker 2 (43:31):
So child led play,
what we think about in education
?
We talk about unstructured,independent free play.
It's such a mouthfulunstructured, independent free
play.
And that means that it is playof the child's own will,
independent of adults andunstructured, with no
predetermined outcome.
We're letting the childcompletely decide what they want
to do.
If I come to my child with mypost-it note activity and I've
(43:54):
got everything written on thewall and I say here you go,
here's some post-it notes,you're going to match it up to
these letters, that's astructured play activity.
It's great, it has lots ofvalue, but it's a structured
play activity.
If I put down a bin of blocksin front of my child and say I'm
going to go unload thedishwasher, have a great time
with these blocks, and then theystart building and making
castles and all these things,that's unstructured independent
(44:15):
free time, free play.
And that really is where themagic happens in childhood is
this idea that kids do better,they learn more and they learn
more deeply If an adult isn'tplaying with them.
We know that adults, though withthe best of intentions, we
accidentally change play, wemake it less intrinsic, we take
(44:38):
away a little bit of the child'sfree will because they might
not feel as comfortable endingthe play because they don't want
to hurt our feelings.
And those little tiny tweaksthat happen in play.
They lean on us for problemsolving, they wait for us to
rotate the puzzle piece.
Those little tiny tweaks thatwe accidentally make to play.
They really do have an impactwhen we combine them over long
periods of time and we talkabout that.
(44:59):
This is how every single playmoment happens for this child.
So instead, what we want to dois we want to breed this culture
in our family that we value achild's unstructured and
independent free play, that wevalue what the child can do and
how the child can leadthemselves into their own way as
adults.
It means hanging back.
I always call it sitter-vising.
(45:19):
We can sit and supervise from aseated position and watch the
magic unfold.
And when you're sitting oryou're working or you're doing
chores and you're seeing yourchild play, I hope you know that
that is the most significantand important work that your
child can be doing at thatmoment.
And again, going back to thisguilt that we often feel when we
(45:39):
remove ourselves from ourchildren's play, we don't need
to feel that.
Instead, we can look and go ohmy gosh, look at what they're
learning.
Oh, look what they're doing.
Their brain is working so hardright now as we're unloading the
dishwasher.
What they're doing.
Their brain is working so hardright now as we're unloading the
dishwasher, folding the laundryor answering a work email.
There is so much beauty and somuch goodness that comes out of
(46:00):
a child leading their own play,activity that just can't be
replicated when adults areplaying with.
So as you can and as you growthis skill, the more that you
can back yourself out of play.
Please know you are doing somuch good for the child.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
I'm sure a bunch of
parents listening to this right
now just kind of like exhaledand, like you, just like let all
that guilt, like leave them,because I do know that lots of
parents have this guilt.
I also think you know I had meta friend of mine who she had
bought all these toys and thenher tuyo wasn't playing with
them the way that she wassupposed to, which is how she
(46:35):
worded it and I thought that wasinteresting because I said,
well, how is there a right orwrong way to play if that's the
way the child wants to play withit, right?
So I think it was a board gamefor two or three year olds and
the child was removing thepieces and playing with the
little figurines and but wasentertained for 20 minutes doing
the wrong thing, according tothe parent.
Do you, how do you approachthat?
I don't know if you receivethose emails as well or speak to
(46:56):
those parents, but that's myanswer is there's how is there a
wrong way to play?
Speaker 2 (47:00):
but it might not be
the way that we want them to and
it comes back to what you weresaying in terms of us kind of
taking control without realizingyeah, and I think it also goes
back to the very beginning, whenwe were talking that as parents
, we want to, we want to be thedrivers, and in play, we really
not even.
We don't, we can't, we don'teven need to be the co -drivers,
we need to be in the backseatlike way, maybe even off the
vehicle, we just watch them,which is really hard.
(47:23):
It's really hard in parenting.
We, we want to make surethey're eating the right foods
and that they're, you know,listening to the right stories
and that they're, you know,having the right experiences.
And then, when it comes to play, we really have to say well,
here are your tools, go for it.
And and we have to let go, wehave to.
(47:46):
I think it's very important thatwe do recognize that toys are
the tools for play and that weare the gatekeepers of those
toys and those tools, and tothink thoughtfully about what we
bring in our home.
Thinking thoughtfully abouttoys doesn't mean expensive.
A toy's value is not determinedby its cost.
It's determined by whether ornot the child likes it and
(48:09):
whether or not the child canfind value in it.
My kids have this horrible toythat I can't even tell you how
much I hate this toy.
It kind of talks and grows andit makes weird noises and they
scratch it, but I can't evendescribe this.
My brother gave it to them.
They love this toy and the joyand the play that that toy has
(48:30):
brought them in the last threeyears.
I wanted to vomit when that toycame into my home and I began
immediately thinking about howdo I get that toy out of my home
.
And here we are, three yearslater, and the other day it
really did look like it hadfinally broken and my husband
looked at me.
He goes I'm really sad.
And I said I'm really sad too.
Someone needs to fix this.
(48:50):
And we got it fixed and it'sback to working.
But it just really goes to showthat we can't decide what the
children are going to like toplay with and we can't decide
how they're going to play withit.
What we want to make sure isthat they have tools for their
play, they have opportunities toplay, and that we're standing
back and letting it happen.
(49:11):
No, if it drives us a bunker ornot, as long as they're safe.
Speaker 1 (49:18):
Yes, exactly, we're
good, I'm so happy you brought
that up.
You know, something I try totell parents is try to avoid
battery operated toys as much asyou can.
But then there's an asteriskaround you know, under that and
it's.
If your child enjoys it, thenit's fine.
You know you don't want to andfor me it's just to have around.
You know, under that and it's.
If your child enjoys it, thenit's fine.
You know you don't want to andfor me it's just to have.
You know for parents tounderstand that you want to have
a lot of open-ended toys andnot just toys that you press
(49:39):
buttons.
But, like you said, there'snever like a one rule for
everything and a child.
We have this caterpillar thatyou press the button and it does
all these weird things and goesto the left and goes to the
right.
And my toddler loves it.
He does.
And I hate the sound, the noise, the songs, every beep, beep,
beep, beep, that I don't likethem, I just don't.
But he loves it.
And what can we do?
(49:59):
We can't change it.
Um, so these?
There aren't any rules when itcomes to play and I think also
because of marketing and society, again, like we've kind of
become accustomed to the ideathat the more expensive the toy
is, perhaps the better it is fora child.
But they're gonna hate us,they're gonna hate me.
But it's not true.
I always tell parents the besttoys are probably what you
(50:21):
already have within your home.
You know, you know a bowl and awooden spoon and some dried
beans.
There you go, you're done.
You have it all a measuring cupand you're done, which is what
I is the way you rememberplaying with.
Speaker 2 (50:31):
They are yeah, and I
think marketers have done such a
great job preying on the fearsof parents.
They slap the word learning,they slap the word educational.
They tell you you need this toyor your child is going to fail
to succeed and fail to thrive,and that becomes very scary for
us.
I mean, they're very good atwhat they do.
We have to be smarter than that.
We have to look at that and goyeah, because they're trying to
(50:53):
sell it to me.
Of course they're going to tellme that.
Have you ever seen a set ofwooden blocks?
Have to tell anybody that howgreat they are?
No, we know how great woodenblocks are.
Speaker 1 (51:03):
We all have them in
our childhood.
Speaker 2 (51:04):
We know how great
wooden trains are, or you know
Lego duplos.
We know how great these toys arebecause we grew up with them
and they're the toys from ourmemories.
And the toys from our memoriesare a lot of the best toys for
our kids because they were thesame toys our parents had.
These are the toys that havestood the test of time.
I think it's just marketers andthese companies.
(51:24):
They do such a great job ofpreying on our fears that our
kids are going to fail and thatif we're not again driving their
learning and driving theireducation and driving the way
that they play, that they're notgoing to drive it in the right
direction.
And it's actually really farfrom the truth, because they're
just trying to take advantage ofus and take advantage of our
money and they're trying to giveus toys that really aren't
(51:44):
going to last for very long orare going to have a really short
shelf life in your home andshelf life in your home.
And then you're back a coupleof months later trying to buy a
new toy, to do the same thingthat maybe could have been
accomplished for years and yearsand years with a really simple,
simple toy that you rememberfrom when you were a kid.
Speaker 1 (52:01):
Another group of
parents that just exhaled out
now, knowing that they don'thave to buy all these expensive
toys.
But it's true.
You know, and I think what'simportant is so for those of you
who are listening, there was aprevious episode for this
podcast on educational toys andI summarized this study in the
Journal of Pediatrics that thisdefines an educational toy and
mentions that I think it waslike 80% of toys, or even more
(52:23):
than that, don't meet the actualdefinition of an educational
toy, which is an object or itemthat increases the interaction
between the parent and the child.
And you know, then I see allthese like these companies and
they press a button and they'relike it sings and it flashes red
, blue and whatever color, andthat's the educational part.
(52:43):
I'm like, no, that's not it atall.
But this whole idea of play andI'm so happy we're having this
conversation because, like yousaid, like I just I learned so
much about play through you andthen I would look into the
research and say like, oh, thisit fits, everything that Susie's
doing fits, it makes sense, andwe have to learn to step back
and that's where the boredom isgoing to come in, that's where
(53:06):
all the growing and the learningwill happen and I just
absolutely loved ourconversation.
Can we end off our conversation?
I always like to kind ofsummarize things for parents so
that they have a game plan.
What would you say to a parentwho's you know, who listened to
this episode and they're like,oh okay, hold on a second.
I need to, I need to likerethink how I'm doing this in my
home, regardless of the child'sage.
(53:27):
How can what's the game planright now that they can start
off with?
Speaker 2 (53:31):
I think one of the
big game plans would be to look
at your daily schedule and seehow much time the child has to
just be free.
How much free time does thechild have and where could you
schedule that free?
It's kind of an oxymoron tohave scheduling free play.
Where could you schedule freetime into their daily routine?
Where could you make andnormalize this idea that you're
going to play without theadult's intervention?
(53:53):
And then the next thing wouldbe again what I just said make
sure that you're letting themplay without your intervention
and that you're taking a deepbreath and remembering that
that's actually a good thing.
They don't need to be playingwith you all the time and
frankly, they shouldn't beplaying with you the whole time
and it really is okay to takethat step back.
And then to when a child comesto you and says they're bored.
(54:15):
Look at it as an opportunity.
Ask them what they're going todo with that boredom and maybe
give them three to four ideas ofwhat they could do and then
quickly go back to what you'redoing so that you're not stuck
in that boredom trap with them.
And then the other piece wouldbe to really consider the screen
time piece of it?
And where is screen timefitting in?
(54:37):
And all this?
Is screen time become whatwe're using as a boredom buster
my most hated term but is itbecome that?
And if it has, let's pull backa little.
Let's make screen time back toa parenting tool, not a child
tool, and let's put it into apredictable schedule so the
child knows when they're goingto expect it.
And then they are not using itas something to overcome boredom
, but instead they're usingtheir own sense of resilience
and problem solving and theirown beautiful mind and to give
(55:02):
themselves so many opportunities.
Speaker 1 (55:04):
So many.
What a wonderful way to endthis conversation.
Thank you, susie, for takingthis moment to chat with me, and
you could visit her onInstagram at Busy Toddler
B-U-S-Y-T-O-D-D-L-E-R.
And visit her websiteBusyToddlercom.
Right now she has her summeractivity list for toddlers that
you could download for free.
I've used it past summers andit really helps because you
(55:28):
don't have to do the thinkingpart, you could just download it
and there are your activitiesset out for the day or the week.
Thank you to everybody who waslistening.
If you would like to leave arating interview for the podcast
, please do so and you can joinus next Monday for a new episode
.
Thank you so much, susie, ofcourse.
Thank you.