July 3, 2024 • 59 mins
What happens when you awaken to the fact that your marriage isn’t even legally binding? Cocoa Brown opens up about her journey through a turbulent relationship, marked by her partner’s insecurities and controlling behavior, which she initially ignored. Listen as Cocoa recounts the strain this put on her family life, leading her to seek a healthier environment for her son and the shocking discovery that made her separation easier. This episode underscores the crucial need for healthy relationships and the red flags that shouldn't be overlooked.
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Opposing experiences, a single woman and a married man, Chanel Scott, and Josh Powell, create a powerful and empathetic team, offering valuable insights and advice on navigating the complexities of romantic relationships and promoting healthier, more fulfilling connections.
Join Chanel and Josh as they unlock the secrets of successful relationships one conversation at a time.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I ignored a lot of signs, a lot of signs.
Some of that stuff was reallyin my face and I ignored it.
You know his insecurities andyou know he had a problem with
me working Like brother.
I could have never worked withyou.
He just saw you and be like no,he want to get with you.
No, because you're a handsomeguy, and he literally would
cancel.
He wanted to be my manager.
(00:22):
So I let him be my manager,trying to let my man be a part
of my life and my career.
Come to find out he was turningdown shows because the promoter
was too fine.
You know he didn't like the waythe promoter looked.
You know it was that it was allthese things.
But I saw them in the beginningbut I was ignoring them because
I just was on this tunnelvision of get married, have a
baby, get married, have a baby,have a family.
(00:43):
Once we got in, the marriagebecame borderline, abusive.
You know a lot of gaslighting,narcissism, you know, and it
took me having my son for me towake up and realize I didn't
want my son to grow up and thinkthis was normal, that a man
doesn't work and a womanprovides for him and he gets to
(01:03):
sit around and reap the benefits.
A man who constantly belittlesa woman and makes her feel less
than because he doesn't feelgood about himself.
A man who, if he can't do whathe wants to do, he just gives up
.
There were so many aspects thatI saw, and having this little
boy made me go.
I don't want my son growing upthinking this is normal, this is
how you treat a woman and it'sokay.
(01:29):
And that was one of the maincatalysts that I walked away
when my child was seven monthsold and during the course of me
going to seek, you know, adivorce lawyer is how I found
out.
It was so funny, you know.
She was like well, girl, youknow, you're probably going to
end up having to give him alimchild.
You got it social.
I said, yeah, of course I do.
So she did some research.
She called me into her officeone day and she said I got good
news and I got bad news and Isaid well, what's up?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
She said what you want?
First I said just give me thegood news.
She goes you ain't married.
Welcome to Relationships Matter.
I'm Chanel Scott.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
And I am Josh Powell.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
We have an amazing guest here with us today, Ms
Coco Brown.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm good, I'm good.
How are you guys doing?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Doing well.
I know that's right.
We're so excited to have you.
Thank you, and so you know, thetopic of the show is
Relationships Matter.
So we're just going to kickthis conversation off and I'm
going to ask you why dorelationships matter to you?
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Well, first of all, I'm in the industry and being in
the TV and film industry, theentertainment industry as a
whole relationships matter a lot.
You know it gets to a pointthat you want to just be called
and offered something because ofyour relationship with somebody
Planting those seeds that comeback to you tenfold.
Because you've impactedsomebody.
You know in a way that theywant to help you, they want to
(03:07):
open a door for you.
More than ever in recent monthsfor me, my relationships
mattering to me really cameforefront when I lost my home in
a fire and the people that cameto my aid from Tyler Perry,
marlon Wayans, tiffany Haddish,chris Tucker I mean it was just
a floodgate and it was based onthose relationships that I had
(03:28):
made throughout the years withall these people that whatever I
did to impact them, to movethem, they felt compelled to
help me and I know that that wasbecause of the relationships I
had made with them.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
Speaking on those relationships and being in the
industry.
How, how easy or difficult isit to remain you?
Because I know I know a littlebit about you, know the industry
, so you know, and obviouslywith all of the news that we
hear on a daily basis, nothingin particular that we hear on a
(04:03):
daily basis, nothing inparticular.
But you know the success orlack thereof it depends on what
you do, how you sway.
You know you name some heavyhitters, so you know how has
that journey been for you toremain Ms Brown.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Honestly, it has been a journey of discovering who I
was.
I am very transparent when Itell people I became Coco Brown
because I thought Farrah Brownwasn't good enough.
I didn't come into thisindustry because I knew I had
this gift.
That came later.
It really came in that I wastrying to recreate myself
because in my mind I thought Iwasn't good enough.
That's when I saw myrelationships change, where the
(04:42):
superficial ones fell off andthey became very evident that
they were only attached to mefor who they thought I was, and
those who begin to know me andwho I was were the ones that
stayed put.
So over the course of mefinding out who I was, I became
very comfortable in the skin Iwas given and not trying to
cover it up.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
How are you with you now?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh, I love me I love you.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Answer me, honey, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
I am me 24, seven.
Would love it or leave it baby.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
So, coco, how do you balance your career in the
industry with your romanticrelationship?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
You know, um, you gotta definitely find somebody
who understands.
I was busy, you know, and whenI make time for you, that is
significant, you know, becausenot only am I in an industry
that's very demanding, there wasone point in my life I was on
five TV shows at the same time.
So I was between LA, newOrleans, north Carolina, new
York, atlanta, just going, andin the midst of that my free
(05:36):
time was dedicated to me being amother and then trying to have
a relationship in that I cannotbe with someone who does not
have a life outside of that,that does not have their own
goals, their own ambitions.
You know, because when we cometogether, we cherish that time.
You know, I can't be withsomeone needy.
Right, you know, we need eachother, but we can't be needy.
You know what I'm saying?
Absolutely.
(05:56):
So having someone who has alife and goals and ambitions of
their own, it works out, becausethe time we do spend together
we cherish a lot more.
You know, because we know thatwe have these other things more
in our lives.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
What do you learn about yourself in the different
dynamics of relationship?
You know a successful woman youtalked about being a mother,
you know.
And then being in arelationship and I know you got
family, you got friends.
Like, how do you balance?
You know, making time for thosethings or those people that are
, you know, important to you?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
One I am very big on a calendar.
Don't expect me to remembernothing.
You know my assistants havelearned that quickly that don't
tell Ms Brown something andthink she gonna remember 20
minutes later.
Also, a lot of accountabilitypartners in my life, people who
remind me what about thisresponsibility?
Oh girl, you committed to thisor you said you were coming and
(06:48):
then for me, I just have thismantra of I don't think about it
, I just do.
There was a period in the lastfour years that I was taking
care of both of my parents whowere ailing very sickly and they
ended up passing away a fewyears ago and I took care of
them.
I became a caregiver in themidst of everything else I had
going on and I look back on itand I'm like how did I balance
(07:09):
taking care of two, six parentstaking care of their affairs?
You know all of that, you knownurses, you know doctor's
appointments, then being amother being present for my
child, then being all these TVshows at the same time, and I
realized I went into autopilotand it was a matter of just
doing and not thinking about it,but being cognitive of how I
did it at the same time and itwasn't like an over thought out
(07:33):
process, it just was done, andso it proved to me that I can do
a very good balancing act, andthose who understand what I'm up
against and what I'm you know,the responsibilities I have they
stay put and they wait for meto reach out.
They wait, they understand thatwhen I do reach out, that's
pretty special because I've gotso much going on.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
So I had an opportunity to spend some time
with you.
Yep, enjoy my cooking.
Girl Dip the collard greens.
Listen.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
I've had two requests to make those greens this week.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Yes, I mean the collard greens, all of it was
amazing Like, but the collardgreens and the yams, oh, thank
you.
And the cornbread.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
That's Nellie's recipe.
Look at the ham Nellie's recipe.
To my grandma it was amazing.
I had to cook it before I couldwalk.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
It was amazing.
So I learned a little bit aboutyour backstory.
Right, You've been marriedbefore right, and this
relationship took place whileyou were in the industry and you
kind of gave me some contextabout that marriage.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I met my ex-husband through a friend and it was a
whirlwind romance.
We were engaged in four months,married nine months later and
it's so funny because he wasn'tthe ideal image of the man I
thought I'd marry.
Okay, and you know, I like agood ball player, but I, you
(08:53):
know, I'd never been with alinebacker.
Okay, because you know, it'slike you know how are we going
to do this.
At the time, I was much larger,but he just won my heart.
It was like you know, it's likeyou know how are we going to do
this.
At the time, I was much larger,but he just won my heart.
It was like you know, it'sbeing swept off my feet.
We were married and then, assoon as we got married and I
mean when I say as soon as wegot married stuff started coming
(09:15):
out that had been hidden fromme.
One was that this woman that heclaimed was his ex-wife was
really his wife.
Wow, and of course, he and hismother were like no, no, no,
she's lying, she's crazy.
We got you, you know, we'llhandle it.
I'm like, okay, I let it go.
Uh, three years later and achild I found out that really is
(09:36):
his wife.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Now you say you guys, how long did you date?
Speaker 1 (09:39):
before.
We dated for four months beforewe were engaged and nine months
later we were married.
Wow.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yeah.
So if you had to do that allover again, what would that
process look like?
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Oh, a background check immediately.
I do background checks just forfun, but I also had to really
sit back and do some inner workon me because I saw a lot of
signs and I realized that Imarried my ex in desperation.
I was 48 years old.
(10:08):
I desperately wanted to be amother.
I promised my grandmother onher deathbed that I would be the
one grandchild that did itright and got married first,
then had a baby.
Um, I knew he wasn't the idealguy that I wanted, but he was
the guy giving me attention.
At that moment I realized my exhusband could have been anybody
at that time in my life, in theframe of mind I was in of get
(10:28):
married, have a baby, have afamily, you know.
And I ignored a lot of signs, alot of signs.
Some of that stuff was reallyin my face and I ignored it.
You know his insecurities andyou know he had a problem with
me working like brother.
I could have never worked withyou.
He just saw you and be like no,he want to get with you.
No, because you're a handsomeguy, and he literally would
(10:52):
cancel.
He wanted to be my manager.
So I let him be my manager,trying to let my man be a part
of my life in my career, come tofind out he was turning down
shows because promoter was toofine.
You know he didn't like the waythe promoter looked.
You know it was all thesethings but I saw them in the
beginning but I was ignoringthem because I just was on this
tunnel vision of get married,have a baby, get married, have a
(11:13):
baby, have a family.
So I couldn't blame him totallyfor the deception.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
How did you interpret that behavior, though at the
time he just loved?
Speaker 1 (11:21):
me.
Okay, that's not, though.
At the time he just loved me.
Okay, he just loved me.
You know he wanted to protectme.
He, my big old bear, you know I, I really gave myself, you know
, excuses for the behavior that,uh, once we got in the marriage
became borderline abusive.
You know, a lot of gaslightingnarcissism, you know, and it
(11:42):
took me having my son for me towake up and realize I didn't
want my son to grow up and thinkthis was normal, that a man
doesn't work and a womanprovides for him and he gets to
sit around and reap the benefits.
A man who constantly belittlesa woman and makes her feel less
than because he doesn't feelgood about himself.
A man who, if he can't do whathe wants to do, he just gives up
(12:04):
, like it was so many aspectsthat I saw and having this
little boy made me go.
I don't want my son growing upthinking this is normal, this is
how you treat a woman, this isand it's okay, and that was one
of the main catalysts that Iwalked away when my child was
seven months old and during thecourse of me going to seek, you
know, a divorce lawyer is how Ifound out.
It was so funny, you know.
She was like well, girl, youknow you're probably going to
(12:26):
end up having to give himalimony.
This is California and I'm likeI can't believe I got to pay
for this man.
Okay, what's the deal?
She said well, most ballplayerslove to hide some money.
Child, you got to social.
I said yeah, of course I dono-transcript that marriage I
(12:50):
said what could be the bad news?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
she goes you ain't married we're gonna have to put
a pin there.
When we come back, we're gonnacontinue this story with miss
coco brown.
Relationships matter, cocoBrown, relationships Matter.
Welcome back to RelationshipsMatter.
So before we went to break,coco just said she found out she
(13:14):
was not married.
She's not married.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Yeah, I mean, she was like you're not married.
And I said what are you talkingabout?
And she said, sweetie, he has awhole wife and child in Las
Vegas, nevada.
And I said, excuse me.
And then, when she said thename, I said he's been telling
me, and his entire family hasbeen telling me since we've been
married, that that's his ex.
She said, oh no, baby, there'sno divorce.
She goes, you, you're about toget everything.
(13:38):
And I just remember sittingthere in shock, like half of me
is like praise, praise, god.
I don't have to write this mana check, but I'm like what?
Like you sat there and watchedmy parents plan a sixty thousand
dollar wedding.
You watched my parents give memy dream wedding.
You sat there, your family,everything, and this whole time
you knew I'm.
This wasn't even legit, thiswasn't even real.
(13:59):
And I'm thinking to myself well, if you was trying to come up,
brother, your game is weakbecause you should have been
treating me like a queen, so Iwould never find out Right, and
otherwise you treat me like doodoo.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
You know supporting cast with the family, knowing
the whole family knew.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
And what's crazy is I found this out later that a
friend of mine who was one of mybridesmaids was at the
reception and one of his familymembers literally said this and
they tried to play it off.
But she knows, she heard it andshe said girl, we all about to
come up off this B?
Yeah.
And she heard her say it andshe said what did you say?
None, and she kind of scurriedoff.
(14:33):
Well, Wow.
Isn't that crazy.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I know, brother, I'm going to start with
accountability.
Yeah, and for me, I get reallyfrustrated as a man to hear men
behave in a way and this is notme judging him or his family,
because I'm always about beingfair and that's not on my spirit
to do it Because I spoiled hisfamily, so I set it up.
(15:02):
It's just as a man, as a, as aleader, as a protector, a
provider, a nurturer, a lover,all of these different things
that we are supposed to be.
It just really bothers me, youknow, to hear that people are
moving in such a way, men orwomen, but especially like
because I'm a man.
So I wanted to address you knowwhat I mean, that first.
But then I wanted to jump intothis question because it is huge
(15:26):
, and then I want, you know,chanel, to, you know, to take a
deeper dive on this family thing, because people got to
understand the rules.
That's going on and how thisgame is being played.
Um, aside from ouraccountability on what we do or
don't do, a lot of women, thatsame moment that you had of I'm
(15:47):
in this space, I want to do itright.
I'm gonna force the situationlike what can we do to get away
from that?
Because I'm not saying I don'tunderstand where a woman is
coming from.
You know what I mean.
I don't understand where awoman is coming from.
You know what I mean.
I don't think anything is wrongwith wanting love.
(16:09):
I don't think anything is wrongwith wanting a family.
I don't think anything is wrongwith this vision, but the fact
that so many women will eitherrush it right or they'll mark it
off the checklist Because it'skind of like a part of their
identity not yours, but in othersituations where it's like,
(16:31):
well, yeah, I done been married,I done had kids, so now it's
like, now that I've, you know,marked that off, we on to the
next thing.
But what it's doing is it'scausing a lot of damage, because
now, for the man and for thewoman, depending on the amount
of pain and what's going on then, when you bring children into
that, right, you seem like asolid woman.
(16:53):
You know, I'm getting to knowyou throughout this conversation
, but there there aren't womenwho move like you.
Right, I don't know how you areas a mom, but I'm just feeling
like your spirit right, but I'mjust just going off of your
spirit in the conversation,right, um.
But there are a lot of women andmen, but for what I'm saying,
right now, there are a lot ofwomen who are moving away, where
(17:15):
they get to what they want, andthen it's like havoc after that
well, women having children aspurses.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
That's what I like to say let me have.
Women having children andtreating them like purses.
I've seen that with my own eyes.
The women who want the purse,the trinket, the showpiece, they
want the marriage as ashowpiece.
When I was reading up on someof the statistics of marriage,
especially in this city, and tofind out the amount of women who
(17:42):
marry gay men just for thefacade, say what yeah, brother.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
In this city and to find out the amount of women who
marry gay men just for thefacade.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
Say what In this city ?
Yes, sir, they will marry a man.
They know what made you lookthat up.
That's a stat.
I'm nosy and I like.
That's how I get my material.
I'm always researching andlooking up stuff.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
I wouldn't think they marry gay men.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
I stumbled across it that women are marrying gay men
and they're letting them stillhave their lifestyle as long as
he provides the facade of thefamily.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
I'm about to throw my mic.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, yeah.
And it's not just here, it'sacross the board.
And that comes with me becauseI research a lot, you know, for
my material.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
You just gave me like so much confirmation because in
some things like I act greenintentionally.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
But I know a lot.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
And it's like, when you see how people move, it's
like I ain't going to go there,I'm going to leave that alone,
especially because in certaincommunities it's like it's
untouchable, but to know thatpeople are moving in that way,
you know Anyway.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I'll go back to your initial question.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Yeah, Cause I want to .
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I want to see how we can.
How?
Speaker 3 (18:50):
can we bless people, cause that's that's about to
take me somewhere else.
But how can we bless people,like, from what you know?
Now let me propose, let mepropose the question correctly,
so, with what you know now, withyour experience, how do we grow
as men and women?
But how do we make betterdecision making in the dating
field and not put ourselves inproblematic relationships or
(19:15):
create even worse dynamicsbecause we're not patient or
because we're looking for thewrong thing?
Speaker 1 (19:24):
So, yeah, I can't speak for anybody else, but I
can tell you my journey Um.
I was raised very traditionallySouthern.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Okay, I had a two parent household.
Mom was a teacher, dad was apipe fitter.
You know, uh, my mother camefrom what could be considered
the wrong side of the tracks.
My dad came from long blackmoney.
My father came from very highyellow people that the tracks.
My dad came from long blackboule money.
My father came from very highyellow people that could pass.
My mother came from hardworkingblue collar.
You know maids and and and andand and you know carpenters,
(19:55):
things like that.
And my parents met married andyou know I I credit my parents
that they both gave me bothsides of the tracks.
I spent half my summer in teeswith Jack and Jill and half my
summers running through theprojects getting an icy cup with
jellies on.
Ok, I got to see both sides ofthe world.
So that gave me the ability tofloat wherever I can, you know,
and be comfortable.
(20:15):
But it also gave me thesituation where I was told.
Basically, when I told myparents I was going to become a
comic, they looked at me like Iwas crazy.
Basically, when I told myparents I was going to become a
comic, they looked at me like Iwas crazy because my job was to
go to college, get a degree,meet a great man, get married,
have babies and come to myparents for house after church
so our women are receiving thatinformation well, I can't speak
(20:38):
for women now, because I thinkit's a different breed of women
out here now that's fair, but Ithink it also kills the
narrative too, because a lot, of, a lot of people especially
when you look on social mediathey want to say anything
outside of what we look like.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
They're being told a whole different thing and here
you are confirming like no.
When I was brought up, my mom,my dad, gave me the game on I'm
supposed to get married have akid, do this, do that and see.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
But my mom also realized that she used to always
say you know, I raised you tobe a wife and a mother, but I
also raised you to be tooindependent.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Too independent.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
She said and I should have taught you how to balance
the two, because she could seeit in a lot of my relationships.
I was the boss, fair, I ran it.
I ran it.
But she realized she taught methat that's fair.
You know, I'm saying cuz, eventhough she made my father.
He was the king of the castle,he was head of the household.
My father was one of those menthat came home from the shipyard
, handed my mom his hurts youknow his check and she wrote all
(21:33):
the bills Right.
And so I watched my mother runa household and I didn't realize
that in the midst of herrunning that household she also
was pressing this man's uniform.
She was also making sure he hada hot meal.
When he came home, like she wasbalancing the two, I just saw a
woman handling everything.
So I had the theory kind oftwisted.
(21:55):
So it took me to actually getmarried and then also realize
that I don't like this positionof being the man of the house.
Yeah, I don't like thisposition of being the provider.
I don't like this position ofbeing the man of the house.
Yeah, I don't like thisposition of being the provider.
I don't like this position.
It should be evenly yoked.
I shouldn't be doing this allmyself and he's sitting around.
This doesn't feel right.
This doesn't feel right.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
I'm so glad yeah, well, we're going to cut the
break in a minute, but I'm soglad you said it because I just
want to acknowledge before Iknow Chanel wants to go into the
balance piece but I just thinkit's important for people to
hear that because we don't,especially people that look like
us.
We don't never hear that side ofthings and to have that level
(22:36):
of understanding right, becausetypically it's villainized when
you hear a lot of, you know,black women, um, or women of
color you know, talk about theirupbringing or why they are the
way that they are, and then onour side it's like, well, we
don't want to deal with that andit's that in the third and I'm
not saying that either party isright or wrong, but
understanding is so powerful.
(22:56):
So, to hear you and how youarticulated that, I hope that
men, when they watch this, canget a chance to and get a sense
of OK, I need to show a littlebit more grace.
Maybe there are some questionsor some things that I can ask,
because we're passing over goodwomen because of their
upbringing Right now.
That doesn't excuse otherbehaviors, but at least it gives
(23:20):
context to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Why can't she be submissive?
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Why can't she?
Speaker 1 (23:26):
let me lead.
Um, I know for me.
I said I watched my mother runthe household and, mind you, my
dad was the king of the castle.
You know what I'm saying.
He was the disciplinarian.
You know my father took care ofthe yard, anything broken, that
house, I mean, he was very mucha man's man, you know, and I
remember times that you know mydad would have my brother out
(23:46):
there and he'd call me.
So I'm out there learning how tochange brake pads, change a
headlight, put in fluids, checkyour oil pressure, and my mom
would say she don't need to knowall that, some man going to do
it for her.
And my dad would literally say,just in case he don't, she do,
and she's going to make her tooindependent, he's like, well, so
it's like I literally would gointo relationships and With, and
(24:09):
I had to watch the damsels indistress.
I have friends who I considerpillow princesses.
They don't do nothing butbreathe with their man.
Nothing but breathe, he doeseverything.
And I used to think that was soodd, like I couldn't understand.
Like you don't do nothing, youjust get up and get dressed,
like you know, because I watchedtwo people have their dynamic,
(24:32):
and then also to how I wasraised, where, even though I
cook and I clean, I take care ofmy man.
I raised my children, I'm alsohandling this household, I'm
paying the bills, I'm makingsure my man is good.
I grew up with something verytraditional, if you want to call
it traditional and then to getinto relationships.
I didn't know how to sit backand be that damsel in distress.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
So when we get back I know Chanel wants to ask you
about balance, but maybe we candive into the damsel
Relationships matter,Relationships matter.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Welcome back to Relationships Matter.
So before we went to break wewere talking.
Something you said stuck out tome in terms of not wanting to
be the provider but also beingoverly independent, and that's
something that I struggle with.
I don't want to be the provider, but how do you balance not
being overly independent orwanting to, like you say you run
(25:29):
the relationship independent,or wanting to, like you say you
run the relationship?
Most times in situations whereI've been in situations like
that, I'll give the person anopportunity to step up and do,
but then if I don't think you'redoing, then I'm one of those
type of people that'll just havethe takeover spirit.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
The hardest part is being an independent woman who
handles hers, because I've beenon my own since I was 20 years
old.
I had my first apartment.
I've just always been builtthat way.
I was 20 years old, had myfirst apartment.
I've just always been builtthat way.
My mother used to always say,you know, she said my son came
home and I couldn't get him out,my child left, my daughter left
and never looked back, you know, and she knew that she had
raised me that way.
They raised me that way.
(26:06):
I hate to say it, but it'salmost like playing a game of
chess with a man.
I've noticed just in this townyou can't be too.
I think we had thisconversation at the house.
You can't be too successfullooking, because that black male
ego, that black male pride,honey, is fragile.
They've got to feel needed.
They've got to feel likethey're saving you to some
(26:27):
degree.
And if you're rolling up likeeverything is straight in your
life and he can't save you, theylike, oh, what can I bring to
the table for what can I do?
And I tell men all the timehoney, what I need from you
don't cost no money.
You know what I'm saying.
If you, I need emotionalsupport.
I need you to pray with me,brother.
I need you to make me feel likeI matter to you, I'm special to
(26:48):
you, that you'll fight for me.
I said all that ain't got noprice tag on it.
Now, if you just want to buy mepurses, flew me out and all
that, then I'm not the woman foryou.
I'll take it for a couple ofmonths, but then I'm gonna move
on.
I'll keep it 100.
I'll take it for a fewmonthsall complain about women
(27:09):
not knowing how to cook or cleanor do nothing.
I said but y'all created thismonster.
I said in my daddy's era therewas a certain requirement for a
woman to be even considered yourwoman or your wife.
There were requirements.
There was a bar.
I said when y'all lowered thatbar to just the size of a
woman's booty, she ain't got tobe nothing else.
(27:30):
The size of a woman's booty,she ain't got to be nothing else
as long as she can get the DRand get booty shots.
When y'all lowered thatstandard that she ain't got to
be nothing but a showpiece and afat booty.
You get what you get.
She ain't got to be nothingelse.
But I come from an era that aman might play with you, but,
wife you, you had to havecertain qualities, you had to
have certain things.
It was a bar and y'all loweredthat bar when you made it just
(27:56):
the physical.
And then you look at a woman whohas become successful.
I'm successful, I'm.
I've got money, I'm good.
You know what I'm saying.
I don't need a man to bail meout, pay for my business.
I'm good.
You know, even with the fire, Ihaven't even touched the
donation money.
I don't need to.
That's going to go to my housewhen I build it, you know.
But men need to feel needed andif they see a woman that's got
too much, especially if he's aman that has not reached his
(28:18):
full potential and he feels likehe's less than in terms of what
he's accomplished in his lifeand he meets a woman that's on
some boss level, that's animmediate red flag for him.
Red flag for him.
I can't save her, not knowingthat you could, brother, if you
knew how to tap into that heart,if you knew how to feed her
soul.
It ain't about writing a check,bro.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
And you made a lot of great points, so I want to
acknowledge that first.
But also, in fairness, I wantto speak up for men.
I don't think this way butbecause I've had to do a lot of
work on my own for my ownreasons my, my childhood and all
of that.
But a lot of men are brother Iappreciate it, I'm still on it,
but a lot of men are onlypraised for the performance.
(29:00):
So the the same.
And and this is where gracekicks in, because what you said
earlier was powerful, because itspoke to history, what you're
being taught, cultures and allof that.
But flip it, because it's nodifferent for men, right, you
have men who are being overlycoddled by their mothers or
(29:22):
whatever that is, or there's noman in the house, right?
And we're talking about our eratoo.
They're not seeing the exampleenough, you know.
And then there's the otherexamples on what this looks like
and what is acceptable.
You know what I mean.
So we're looking at history andthe damage from it, because a
(29:42):
lot of people don't come fromlike your situation to be able
to see that.
You know what I mean From bothsides and what's also powerful.
What you said, too, is, eventhough you were taught what you
were taught, you still took itin a way that it wasn't
necessarily meant to be taken,so you had to learn that on your
(30:03):
own.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
I had to unlearn it.
I had to unlearn some stuff Idid, for example, like with your
mom right.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
So you were like, my parents did a hell of a job in
how they raised me and all thethings that they gave me, but
then watching them go back andforth about well, she don't need
to learn that.
Well, yes, she do.
Just, you know what I'm saying.
So it's like for us men if wedon't have that proper to this
and I'm not trying to make anexcuse, but it's just an
(30:27):
understanding and if we can havethat grace, because just like
when, when a woman does comeacross a man who's on that type
of time and then she's not ready, so then the man has to be that
person to say, all right, thisis what I need to do, because I
value this relationship and it'sthe same for a woman.
So I just wanted to point thatout because it's very powerful.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
You're saying a lot of great things and just with
the questions, and all of that,what you said about, um, when a
woman is not ready because todayif a woman is not ready, he's
not taking time with you at all,he's moving on.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
They'll take time for what they want.
That's why I tell women all thetime and I say this in my
standard, because I I do a lotof therapy on my stand-up
because I just speak about mytruths and what I've learned and
through my healing in mystand-up I just have the gift to
make it funny but I tell womenyou've got to see what you see.
(31:21):
If this man is not choosing you, boo, he don't want you and
ain't nothing you can do.
Because the one thing I knowabout men and I've only had more
experiences with black men whenhe wants you, it ain't nothing
he will not do.
He could be the goofiest,stupidest man you ever met.
That just don't get it.
But if you're what he wants, hewill fight in a way that you
will know I am the chosen one.
(31:41):
If he's not doing that, youain't it which is which is where
I was.
Speaker 3 (31:46):
You know you've already answered it, but you
know that that's the other pointtoo, because in these types of
conversations it but you knowthat that's the other point too,
because in these types ofconversations it's not to
confuse that message.
There I thoroughly believethere are some people that have
no business being in arelationship, oh god, yes, there
are some people that don't needto be married, some people that
don't need to be parents, likebruh.
But that pocket of people I'mgonna move to the side.
The pocket of people that'splaying games I'm gonna move to
(32:07):
the side.
Like one thing I do know topiggyback off of what you said.
Like if a man wants you, hegonna go through hell and hot
water to to make sure that heshows you the effort he gonna
fight.
And now if if she isappreciative of that or not,
that's another conversation.
But we're definitely gonna goabove, above and beyond.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yeah, because you think about it.
You ever seen a dude that isjust going above and beyond for
a woman and she treats him liketotal crap?
Absolutely Because she's chosen.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
But look, my point is this is that, on the one hand,
a man will say you're tooindependent or you have this
together or you got this right.
And so then they feel likethere's nothing they can do,
because they're minus a dollarsign Right.
But then on the flip side ofthings, if you're not there yet,
then it's not enough, thenyou're not where I want you to
(32:54):
be, so then I'm moving on.
So then it's like what do youwant?
I ain't met them.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
I ain't met them.
Now it depends on the kind ofman you're dealing with, because
I know guys who aremultimillionaires, I know a
couple of billionaires, and theylove women that ain't got a pot
to piss in or one of the throwit out.
They love having to provideevery single need and want.
They love that control.
They love their pillowprincesses.
(33:18):
All she do is breathe.
I know a lot of men who aresuper successful.
They don't want a supersuccessful counterpart because
then it makes them have toconstantly keep their game up
and they like to do it in theirown way, their own pace.
You're reminding him when youmake accomplishments.
I got to step my game up.
Well, maybe he don't want to doit that week, that month, that
(33:39):
year.
So it's a double-edged sword.
You've got to.
I guess that's why I always sayyou've got to find someone
you're evenly yoked with.
And a lot of us cast that asidebecause it sounds biblical or
old school.
But it's so crucial that youhave to find someone you're
evenly yoked with thatunderstands that maybe there may
be times I'm up and you're hereand vice versa, and even then
(34:00):
we're still here, subconsciously, emotionally, no matter what's
going on.
There's no intimidation,there's no jealousy, there's no
envy.
You know we want each otherother to win, but a lot of
people, because of their owninsecurities that they haven't
accomplished this or whatever'sgoing on with them, their
childhoods, whatever they can'tmeet on that level because it's
a competition out the gate.
Speaker 3 (34:21):
I don't want no man, I'm competing with you know it's
, and it's so powerful and, andas we go to break, one thing I
want to mention, but I want to,I don't want to forget this
question because when we comeback, I want to ask you about,
like, trust and the importanceof that, but as we're going into
break, um, it's, it's powerful.
You say that because we've hadthree very powerful segments,
(34:41):
right, and we've been talkingabout relationships the whole
time.
We haven't spoken to love, likewe've lost.
In my opinion, the actualpurpose of a relationship is,
you know, partnership, love,trust, like having somebody that
you know, you're willing to dothe ins and outs with.
And it's so funny how this iswhy I feel the relationship
(35:04):
conversation there's such adisconnect, because everything
is about what you're doing forme, what I'm doing for you.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
The foundation of most of these relationships have
a price tag on them.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Thank you, they do, they do, and when we get back
more with Ms Brown,relationships matter.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Welcome back to Relationships Matter.
So I got to get in yourbusiness.
Come on, get in there Witheverything that we've discussed
about just being successful andindependent.
So now you're here, right, newrelationship.
How do you balance all of thatand still be submissive with
(35:45):
your man?
Speaker 1 (35:46):
I let a man be a man.
When you're trying to let a manbe a man and lead and you see
him about to take you all off aman.
When you're trying to let a manbe a man and lead and you see
him about to take y'all off acliff and you want to jump in
and do what you know you can do.
Right, it is the hardest thing,but you have to do it.
You have to sometimes let y'allfall off the cliff.
You have to let him see thatyou did that.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
Thank you for saying that.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
I'm serious, it's hard, it's so hard.
But sometimes you really haveto, because I said that that
black male ego, that pride, is amother and the minute you shake
it and rattle it or make himdoubt it, girl, you don't know
what monster you're going to getfrom that.
And it's like you have tosometimes let him lead you off
that cliff as much as it may,because you know how you can fix
(36:29):
it, you know how you can handleit.
Um, there are times that youknow, I let you know my new man.
Just figure it out, and I knowthe solution.
I'll be knowing the answer.
It be here just behind my teethdoing this and that's me on the
phone like, well, yeah, just dowhat you're gonna do, because
you gotta let him do it.
It's almost like how I raisedmy son.
I can see my son about to dosome crazy crap and I have to
(36:50):
step back and say, okay, let himdo it, then he'll learn,
because if I jump in and savehim, he'll never know how to
solve that on his own what's anexample because I think this is
good for for men to even heartoo like what's an example of
when it's good on both sides,but what's what's one of your
examples of?
Speaker 3 (37:08):
I know we about to drive off this cliff and I'm
going to shut my mouth Because Ithink it's good to have context
to it.
You know we have theseconversations.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
OK, so I'll keep it 100.
Me and my man was driving theother day to Florida.
We love to play 20 questionsbecause that's how we get to
know each other, because somethings you just don't reveal
unless you ask this crazyquestion.
That's how we get to know eachother, because some things you
just don't reveal unless you askthis crazy question.
So I kept it real.
You know what I'm saying,because I know how close you
guys are and he knows that Ihave male friends as well.
(37:38):
And I said, babe.
I said, do you think thereshould be boundaries when it
comes to relationships andfriendships outside of our
relationship of the opposite sex?
And he was like, what do youmean?
And I said, well, I'm justsaying boo, like, would there
ever be a situation where you'dbe like, hey, you and Marcus,
that's looking a little funny.
Or would I be in a situationwhere I'd be like, hey, dude,
(37:59):
what's up with you and Chanel,you know?
And he could not understand.
And I saw, oh God, he don't getit, he don't get it.
And I said, let's reel it in.
I said, okay, what's yourfavorite color?
I had to, I had to divertbecause he wasn't.
He thought I had an issue, butI didn't.
I just wanted to know hisopinion because I have a gang of
(38:20):
male friends.
I'm in a male dominatedbusiness.
The majority of people who callmy phone in this business are
dudes and I want to make surehe's secure, knowing that you
understand the insecurities thatcome with that.
You know exactly.
And then for me, I'm never thatchick.
You know what I'm saying.
I've had, you know, men withfemale friends and very close I
don't trip.
Like I said, the only time I'mgoing to say something is I see
(38:41):
some Funny business.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
That's the only time I'm going to be like oh bro,
that look crazy, crazy.
Um, okay for you, for me, yeah,if I ever feel that I am
dismissed and that person is putahead of me and it's not in a
dire life or death situation.
Once okay, twice okay, morethan that what's going on here?
(39:07):
Because I should never bepushed aside for anybody else.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
If I'm your woman, you know what I'm saying, if a
woman really respects becausefor your relationship, like I
tell him as a woman, oh, you hadhis back because he went as a
matter of fact, he almost wentoff a cliff last week.
Yeah, as a woman I'm like uh-uh.
And you saved him.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
I said you got to call her back right now Because
you almost got cussed out,because you ain't going to get
it.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
She ain't going to answer you in another hour.
You got to get her back on thephone right now Because, as a
woman, I know my effects.
Speaker 1 (39:38):
You knew how that looked and it's all about
perception.
It's all about perception.
It could be nothing, it couldbe totally innocent.
But where men sometimes get alittle goofy and oblivious, see
women, our heads on a swivel,brother.
Especially when another woman'sin our presence, around our man
, it could be our best friend,our homegirls.
Our heads on a swivel, that'sjust women.
That women gut, that womentuition we don't play that Men.
(40:01):
Y'all can be a little goofy,y'all can be a little goofy.
I got a friend right nowDealing with that where he was
loaning his friend money behindhis wife's back and he thought
it was nothing wrong with that.
Did you take your money out themutual pot to give to another
woman?
And he really couldn'tunderstand how that was wrong.
But you ain't telling your wife.
It's the perception of how thatlooks.
Speaker 3 (40:21):
Don't do us all like that now.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
But it's the perception of how it looks.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
You see my face over here every time you say
something, because I don't know,he don't do that brother-sister
type stuff, right, josh don't.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
I'm not tripping about it either.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
I'm where you at.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
But it's perception you may be completely innocent
in your actions, but it's theperception.
But giving your homeboy's girlmoney, that's wild Right and he
really stood ten toes down.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
I ain't doing nothing wrong.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
I'm just helping out a friend and if you want your
friend you want your friend tobe happy he's sliding me, I'm on
that type of time, ain't no wayyou giving somebody some money
behind your.
Come on man.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
And another woman at that.
It's not your homeboy, it'sanother woman.
Speaker 3 (41:04):
You got something going on that ain't even right.
That's what.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
I'm saying it's the perception.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
See, see, a man gets it.
It's the perception, nobodydoing that.
It's the perception.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
You know I'm saying out of pocket bitch dog.
I understand that there aredifferent dynamics to
friendships and all of thatbecause I have friends.
You know, one of my bestfriends is a guy.
We've been friends since we hadbaby teeth.
We've been through marriagesand divorces together.
We've cried on each other'sshoulders, we've loaned each
other money.
We've been out that adviceperson at 3 in the morning
because we're going through it.
We, you've been that persontalking each other off the ledge
(41:33):
.
But I also know that I setboundaries with all my male
friends a long time ago.
They want a man.
Come up here Unless I summonfor you, don't come up in here.
That's women unless.
I summon for you no coming inmessing with.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
We talk about the boundaries real quick.
I wanted to share like we canget to.
Let me just just dealing withcory.
Yeah, I will be yeah, becausewhen you talk about boundaries.
It's important that you do that, because we are extremely close
, like brother and sister,absolutely but but and and I
love him and he loved me but youunderstand, I would never have
(42:12):
a conversation with you, right?
Speaker 1 (42:14):
with him because his job is to control that
perception in that narrative.
That's his job, right we have.
Speaker 2 (42:19):
We had a situation, though, where you have to set
boundaries, as you know, becausewe, you know you close.
We at josh's book signing and Igo run to the bathroom because
I'm washing my hands.
The door is still open, so soI'm not using the restroom, I'm
just washing my hands.
Now, me and Corey, we're close.
We're really like brother andsister.
We don't share blood, butthat's my family.
I don't have much family here.
He comes in the bathroom.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
I'm like Corey why are you in the bathroom, he
goofy?
Speaker 2 (42:43):
You see, all them men out there, you're blocking he
good.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
He like what, stop, stop, stop.
Which way did he go Get out mypoor baby's so good?
Yes, so you got it.
Like, because I'd have beenthere, I'd have been like what
you doing?
Yeah, but he thinks sometimesfrom his heart, yes, and
sometimes he don't really lookat it.
(43:09):
That's why I think it's veryimportant for single men to have
married men friends.
Yeah, I think that's soimportant that single men have
married men friends, because amarried man who is sole purpose
in life is to keep peace in hishouse, understands the dynamics
of what to do and what not to do, right, right, you know that
can tick his woman off and causea lot of discord in his home.
(43:31):
Single men ain't going to getit.
He doing what his own, he doinghis own thing,
whoop-de-whoop-de-whoop.
But a married man like when I'mgoing through things in my
relationships, I don't call mysingle friends, I call my girl
and her husband, I call Sam andmy married friends because I
know I'm going to get how tomake this relationship work.
Not, girl, you can do betterthan him and go ahead in your
(43:52):
body.
No, I know I'm going to getpeople who are making a
relationship work.
Daily I'm getting proper advice.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
So can I speak to that real?
Speaker 1 (44:00):
quick Sure baby.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Because I don't disagree, I think what you're
saying is definitely powerful,but I want to take it a step
further, because I believe thatyou just have to find the mature
people that are on the samewavelength, because the way I've
grown up in the company thatI've kept and I moved a certain
way at one point in time likejust because you're married
(44:22):
don't mean nothing.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
That's true, so just out of fairness.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Yeah, discernment is key, but what you're saying is
absolutely powerful because you,you need those counterparts,
you need that type ofaccountability and, and you know
, people that are gonna hold youto a certain standard and make
sure that you're not behaving ordoing anything that's out of
pocket, what y'all were talkingabout before.
I had to sit that one out.
Why you say that?
Yeah, I had to sit down.
(44:47):
Why I don't want no pause today?
Speaker 1 (44:48):
No, it's a strange dynamic, you know, because I you
know.
I know how close you are.
You know what I'm saying.
I knew more about her and I'msure she knows about me.
You know that's his bestie.
And if I was the kind of womanthat was insecure, threatened,
it might be an issue.
But it might be an issue.
But I'm also the kind of womanthat I'm not.
(45:09):
I'm not.
I'm very secure in who I am,what I possess, what I bring to
the table.
You know, I fear no one.
Terrence Howard told me 25years ago you fear nothing, keep
that.
And I do.
But I'm also the kind of woman,too, that I'm very big on
respect.
I'm very big on respect and I'malso the kind of woman that I'm
gonna tell you once, maybetwice, that something bothers me
.
If I gotta go a third time,that third time is gonna be a
(45:31):
block.
That third time is gonna be youain't gonna be able to reach me
because life is too short.
You get what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
You're just choosing not to that's why these
conversations are so needed yougotta have the ogs on deck you
gotta respectfully becauseyou're, you know, just us having
these types of matureconversations.
Even for our age group oranybody younger, it's just
important to hear, because whenyou start removing these things,
you start talking abouthealthier relationships and
(45:58):
healthier dynamics but then,look, you have this situation
where you meet someone new andyou guys have dated before.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Yeah this is not in our first school and you'll meet
someone who they've beenfriends.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
a female male dynamic , and these women come across as
being territorial.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Oh, yes, disrespectful, I've seen them,
yes.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Me because I want the best for my friend.
That's why I make it a point tocome and meet you myself and
let you know.
Are you thinking of people?
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I'm 100.
That's because I know for meI'm the only me and my friend
Nikki are the only single onesin our entire crew.
Everybody else is married.
We were there a lot of whenthey met their husbands and
their husbands now have becomelike our brothers.
But I got boys who have gottenmarried and I went out of my way
(46:44):
to make sure that that womanknew that I understood my
position.
I love your husband like abrother.
He's been there for me throughthick and thin.
I could call him for anything.
But I also know now you are thequeen, absolutely so I don't
even call them directly if Ineed them.
A lot of times I will call heror text her and say, hey girl,
(47:04):
is Rico around?
I need to ask him something outof respect.
But I'm not.
I understand the boundary here.
You're the queen.
You know I was his, I'm hissister, right, but you're the
queen.
I'm not going to have you everthinking for a hot second,
that's right, that I would beshady or sneaky or, you know,
manipulate him or do anything.
No, right, you know it's so.
(47:25):
It's so crazy that I've been inmy friends' homes.
They are still at work.
I'm in the house with theirhusbands because they know I
don't play that game.
I don't play that, that's right.
And I don't trust no woman thatcomes around me and claims
she's friends with my man.
But you don't try to get toknow me.
Help her with your angle,absolutely.
You better get to know me.
Speaker 3 (47:48):
Hey man, free game Boy.
Speaker 2 (47:49):
I need more relationships matter you feel
welcome back to relationshipsmatter.
So, josh, what is this?
This question about trust?
Speaker 3 (48:01):
yeah, I mean, I just overall wanted to know what does
that look like for you, givenyour background, given the
industry you work in?
Now you're in the place thatyou're in with, you know, with
your relationship and stuff likeis that easy, because you've
already been burned once?
Speaker 1 (48:17):
I've been burned many times or many times and not in
the literal sense, but I was.
Speaker 3 (48:23):
He was thinking I'm walking around here dirty so I
was, I was saying from when Isaid that once, basically
because you took that to youknow the next level like being
married, you had a child.
So I'm just saying, like, howdoes that look for you in order
to trust at this stage of yourlife?
Speaker 1 (48:43):
Honestly.
You know God bless my greataunt, my aunt Florine.
She was just a wealth of wisdom.
You know, god bless my greataunt, my aunt Florine.
She was just a wealth of wisdom.
And I remember she telling mebaby, you give a man all the
trust in the world out the gate.
It's up to him if he keeps it.
Listen to your gut.
You know when a man don't comein.
You got to ask my trust becauseit's hard to earn Thank you.
(49:06):
It's hard to earn thank you.
It's hard to earn trust.
You know you've got to come inand say I am trusting you to be
the man you say you are, thewoman you say you are, I am
trusting you.
Speaker 2 (49:17):
It's up to you well, how do you tie that in with
expectations, though?
Because then they say whatexpectations?
So you know you have certainexpectations of anybody that you
engage in in terms ofrelationships why, like, if you
say you're gonna call me back,call, call me back.
Speaker 1 (49:29):
Well, yeah, but see, that's something you established
very much in the beginning.
Right, you've got to let a manshow you who he is.
You can't come in.
I'm going to tell you, theworst thing you can do is give a
man your playbook.
Speaker 3 (49:39):
I heard somebody say mm-hmm in the room.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Thing you can do is give a man your playbook,
because that's how he can playyou.
You walk in saying I want this,I expect this, and you're going
to do this.
You're giving him a playbook.
No, you sit back and see whathe does.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
How he moves In terms of expectations.
I have learned, when I come inexpecting all this, that I get
disappointed.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
Expecting.
What Is he showing you?
He does that, does he do thatout the gate, like just are you
coming in expecting it withouttelling him or you're just
assuming he's going to know?
I don't tell him anything butwhen you assume he's going to
know, I expect a certain levelof respect.
But you got to take respect andexpectations.
That's.
That's contradictory, becauseif you're coming in expecting
(50:25):
him to do all these things andhe don't know you from a can of
paint, you don't know where hecome from.
I'll give you a prime example.
First time Corey and I dated, hehad no idea he was supposed to
open my doors.
Walk on the right side of thestreet when a car slams on
brakes, throw your hand up.
Baby, even though you may notkeep me from going through that
windshield, it's the gesture.
When you walk with me, walkahead of me without behind you.
(50:47):
He didn't know these thingsbecause no one had taught him
this, and it bothered me becauseI had a father that was on a
walker and was still opening mymother's doors.
I remember my dad come snatchingme off a date as I'm walking
out, and the man got in the carand didn't open my door.
My father flew out that houseand said bring your ass in the
house.
You ain't going nowhere.
And, young man, until you learnmy daughter, don't touch no
(51:08):
doors, don't come back here.
That's how I grew up, so I hadto.
At first I got mad Like hedon't respect me, he don't
respect me.
And then it's like he don'tknow no better.
And then you know, when he'slike, well, I ain't never had a
woman demand that, I said, ohhoney then this is a new breed
(51:33):
over here, honey, because Idon't know who the hell you
dated before, but over him, overhim.
And now.
I don't touch no doves, becausehe had to learn.
He had to learn and you have torealize that jonas suma man
knows your love language.
He knows your respectboundaries.
You've got to let him show youwho he is and then, if you have
to redirect, teach like I always.
Baby, I'm not trying to changeyou, I'm just trying to teach
you how to love me.
I put it back on me.
(51:54):
I'm teaching you how to love me, that's it.
I'm not trying to change you,baby, I'm just teaching you how
to love me, and that makes it somuch easier for them to conform
.
But you can't expect a man todo everything inside your head.
These men are built different,honey.
You've got to train some ofthese Negroes and you've got to
be willing to if he's worth it.
Speaker 3 (52:11):
I think the teaching to that point that you're making
somebody giggling.
You said what Somebody giggling, I said, but I think it's fair,
we're going to pass the platelater.
That plate.
That ain't been in motion.
But I think what's good and Ifeel like to touch on this
because I don't want to losewhat you're saying is so
(52:33):
powerful is the fact that, evenin relationships, both sides are
going to be taught.
There's going to be learningthroughout the entire, however
long y'all.
Speaker 1 (52:43):
Unless you're going to stay the exact same person
for the rest of your life.
Speaker 3 (52:46):
We change daily, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (52:47):
How do you?
Speaker 2 (52:48):
answer that into a conversation though.
Speaker 1 (52:49):
What's that?
Speaker 2 (52:50):
Like the door opening , for instance.
That's just a simple.
Speaker 1 (52:53):
If he doesn't do it, you just say, baby, I know you
may not realize this about me,but you know I'm kind of a girl.
Could you open my doors for me?
It just makes me feel specialtoo.
That ain't the man for you.
I got thugs who, straight drugdealers, opened my door.
(53:13):
That ain't had no home training.
It's how you say it.
I mean, it's the age old cliche.
It's not what you say, it's howyou say it.
And you have to learn your man'slove language.
You have to get to know him.
You can't come in with allthese expectations because
you're going to be disappointed.
End of discussion.
This man is a piece of clay.
When he comes to you, there'ssomething about him that's
(53:34):
attracted to you is the color,the shape, what you can do with
it.
And then you have to understand.
You've got to mold him, baby.
You can't expect him to know.
He can't read your mind, hecan't know what you expect or
want.
But you have to teach him ifhe's worth it.
You know, if you use your gutand you use your women's
intuition, if this man issomeone that's teachable,
learnable that he wants to proveto you that I can be everything
(53:55):
you need me to be baby, or he'sthat butthole that just is in
here for a purpose that don'tserve you, you'll know.
But you can't come in becauseyou're going to get disappointed
With expectations you're goingto get.
Let him show you who he is lethim show you who he is.
Speaker 2 (54:11):
You put a time frame on it.
Yes, see, that's the thing, theexpectations and the the trust,
because a lot I mean for me.
These are certain things thatyou expect automatically because
this is what you're accustomedto.
And then just the idea,especially when you get older,
you're like you don't know howto do.
You don't know how to do that,so then automatically it's how
you say it.
Yeah, it's like you interpret itas disrespect, but they really
don't know.
So then that puts a differentspin on it, because in my mind I
(54:34):
just lower what I would sayexpectations in terms of what to
expect, and then then I justyou have to understand your deal
breaker chanel.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
What are your deal breakers?
Was it a deal breaker that myman didn't open my door, kind of
well, but then I was like well,now I'm being petty okay you
know, okay.
Well, because, because I know me, I'm so used to be by myself,
I'm reaching for the door.
I have to literally catchmyself sometimes when I'm out
with court because I'll reachthe door and he'll go.
I'm like my bad, my bad, my bad, you know I'm saying.
(55:03):
But you know, I like a man thattakes control and reminds me of
the demand I gave him yes,check me, baby.
But no, but it's how you do it,just like I had an instance.
One time I was with a guy and wehad a flat tire.
We were in Maryland and I knowhow to change a tire.
My daddy taught me how tochange a tire when I was 11.
Okay, and he said, oh, shoot, Ifeel embarrassed.
(55:25):
He was embarrassed because hedid not know how to change,
because I said, well, baby, yougot to spare.
You know whatever.
He said, I don't know how to.
I said, oh, you don't know.
I said, baby, you know I gotAAA, baby.
I did that to protect his pridewhen I could have easily gotten
out and changed that dang tireor walked him through it.
But I had to learn that becausethe old me was like you can't
change, I got this Now I done.
(55:47):
Made this man's pride, justshrink His ego, just shrink.
Speaker 3 (55:50):
But even if you were to walk him through it, it's
still powerful that for one yourecognized it, but for two again
to your point how you wentabout doing it, it's how you do
it.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You got to stand.
These men's egos are fragile.
They're black men.
They're out there in thesestreets being belittled and
beaten down every day, andbeaten down every day.
When they come home they needto feel like a king.
Now don't get me wrong.
Everybody don't deserve theirking treatment.
And that's where your women'sintuition and your gut instinct
and your pure common sense andself-worth come into play.
You know when a man is justfalling short because he's
(56:21):
beaten up and he needs you tocomfort him.
And you know when a dude isjust a butthole and doesn't know
how to treat you right.
You know and you gotta trustthat.
And I think that was the hardestthing for me, because I am a
nurturer and maternal by nature.
I realized I have babied andmothered a lot of men.
Yeah, I want to coddle you, mypoor baby, would you?
(56:43):
Would you?
Would you?
And I realized that handicappedthem, but it also made them
lose respect for me because theywere like, well, shoot, I can
do anything and she gonna kissmy boo-boo.
You gotta draw that boundary ofI'm your woman and I'm gonna
lift you up and breathe lifeinto you and make you feel like
a king, but you gotta act likeone first boo-boo, Real talk.
(57:05):
I ain't treating you like noking.
You acting like a pauper.
Speaker 3 (57:08):
That's so good.
So much jewelry, the collectionplate, as we talked about, I
feel like we done built a wholenother church.
We got some snickers, some girl.
We had all kind of commentaryin this room today.
Speaker 1 (57:26):
Get it live girl, my girls, be calling me.
Speaker 3 (57:28):
I want to make sure for me, because obviously y'all
know each other.
Speaker 1 (57:33):
I'll give you my number sugar, Just call me.
Speaker 3 (57:36):
I want to be able to take time to, because of
everything that you do just pourinto you.
I do think that it's been abeautiful conversation.
I don't have no skin in thegame, Obviously.
I'm just meeting you and havingthis lovely conversation, but
you have a brother in me.
Just want to extend my love foryou and appreciation for you as
(57:56):
a solid woman and your story andall that you've overcome and
the game that you've been ableto give, and I'm glad that you
know Chanel has you as a as afriend too, and I think it's,
you know, beautiful with yourrelationship.
Now, salute toute to my brother, and I just think it's
beautiful because a lot of thethings that you said, you know,
are so needed and it's sometimesthe conversations people don't
(58:19):
want to touch them becausethey're hard, and the fact that
you have the way that you viewit and how you can articulate
that was very, very refreshingfor me.
You know what I mean and thisis.
This was a really amazingconversation and enjoyed it from
the time you cut it on to thebreaks and everything else, but
(58:42):
I just you know, I think wedon't, we don't hear that enough
.
You know what I mean and, likeI said, it's important because I
don't know you, but I see you.
Thank you so.
Speaker 1 (58:52):
I want to make sure that you know that.
Speaker 3 (58:53):
You know what I'm saying.
So I'm going to do my part.
You know what I mean andtelling you that and you know,
thank, thank, whoever made thishappen.
You know Chanel as well, butI'm always blessed to be in the
room and to have this type ofdialogue.
So, thank you, queen, thank you, brother, have this type of
dialogue.
So thank you, queen, thank you,brother.
I don't know if you gotanything, but thank you, brother
.
We're going to close this thingman, relationships matter.
I ignored a lot of signs, a lot of signs.
Some of that stuff was reallyin my face and I ignored it.
You know his insecurities andyou know he had a problem with
me working Like brother.
I could have never worked withyou.
He just saw you and be like no,he want to get with you.
No, because you're a handsomeguy, and he literally would
cancel.
He wanted to be my manager.
(00:22):
So I let him be my manager,trying to let my man be a part
of my life and my career.
Come to find out he was turningdown shows because the promoter
was too fine.
You know he didn't like the waythe promoter looked.
You know it was that it was allthese things.
But I saw them in the beginningbut I was ignoring them because
I just was on this tunnelvision of get married, have a
baby, get married, have a baby,have a family.
(00:43):
Once we got in, the marriagebecame borderline, abusive.
You know a lot of gaslighting,narcissism, you know, and it
took me having my son for me towake up and realize I didn't
want my son to grow up and thinkthis was normal, that a man
doesn't work and a womanprovides for him and he gets to
(01:03):
sit around and reap the benefits.
A man who constantly belittlesa woman and makes her feel less
than because he doesn't feelgood about himself.
A man who, if he can't do whathe wants to do, he just gives up
.
There were so many aspects thatI saw, and having this little
boy made me go.
I don't want my son growing upthinking this is normal, this is
how you treat a woman and it'sokay.
(01:29):
And that was one of the maincatalysts that I walked away
when my child was seven monthsold and during the course of me
going to seek, you know, adivorce lawyer is how I found
out.
It was so funny, you know.
She was like well, girl, youknow, you're probably going to
end up having to give him alimchild.
You got it social.
I said, yeah, of course I do.
So she did some research.
She called me into her officeone day and she said I got good
news and I got bad news and Isaid well, what's up?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
She said what you want?
First I said just give me thegood news.
She goes you ain't married.
Welcome to Relationships Matter.
I'm Chanel Scott.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
And I am Josh Powell.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
We have an amazing guest here with us today, Ms
Coco Brown.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm good, I'm good.
How are you guys doing?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Doing well.
I know that's right.
We're so excited to have you.
Thank you, and so you know, thetopic of the show is
Relationships Matter.
So we're just going to kickthis conversation off and I'm
going to ask you why dorelationships matter to you?
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Well, first of all, I'm in the industry and being in
the TV and film industry, theentertainment industry as a
whole relationships matter a lot.
You know it gets to a pointthat you want to just be called
and offered something because ofyour relationship with somebody
Planting those seeds that comeback to you tenfold.
Because you've impactedsomebody.
You know in a way that theywant to help you, they want to
(03:07):
open a door for you.
More than ever in recent monthsfor me, my relationships
mattering to me really cameforefront when I lost my home in
a fire and the people that cameto my aid from Tyler Perry,
marlon Wayans, tiffany Haddish,chris Tucker I mean it was just
a floodgate and it was based onthose relationships that I had
(03:28):
made throughout the years withall these people that whatever I
did to impact them, to movethem, they felt compelled to
help me and I know that that wasbecause of the relationships I
had made with them.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Right.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
Speaking on those relationships and being in the
industry.
How, how easy or difficult isit to remain you?
Because I know I know a littlebit about you, know the industry
, so you know, and obviouslywith all of the news that we
hear on a daily basis, nothingin particular that we hear on a
(04:03):
daily basis, nothing inparticular.
But you know the success orlack thereof it depends on what
you do, how you sway.
You know you name some heavyhitters, so you know how has
that journey been for you toremain Ms Brown.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Honestly, it has been a journey of discovering who I
was.
I am very transparent when Itell people I became Coco Brown
because I thought Farrah Brownwasn't good enough.
I didn't come into thisindustry because I knew I had
this gift.
That came later.
It really came in that I wastrying to recreate myself
because in my mind I thought Iwasn't good enough.
That's when I saw myrelationships change, where the
(04:42):
superficial ones fell off andthey became very evident that
they were only attached to mefor who they thought I was, and
those who begin to know me andwho I was were the ones that
stayed put.
So over the course of mefinding out who I was, I became
very comfortable in the skin Iwas given and not trying to
cover it up.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
How are you with you now?
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh, I love me I love you.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Answer me, honey, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
I am me 24, seven.
Would love it or leave it baby.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
So, coco, how do you balance your career in the
industry with your romanticrelationship?
Speaker 1 (05:14):
You know, um, you gotta definitely find somebody
who understands.
I was busy, you know, and whenI make time for you, that is
significant, you know, becausenot only am I in an industry
that's very demanding, there wasone point in my life I was on
five TV shows at the same time.
So I was between LA, newOrleans, north Carolina, new
York, atlanta, just going, andin the midst of that my free
(05:36):
time was dedicated to me being amother and then trying to have
a relationship in that I cannotbe with someone who does not
have a life outside of that,that does not have their own
goals, their own ambitions.
You know, because when we cometogether, we cherish that time.
You know, I can't be withsomeone needy.
Right, you know, we need eachother, but we can't be needy.
You know what I'm saying?
Absolutely.
(05:56):
So having someone who has alife and goals and ambitions of
their own, it works out, becausethe time we do spend together
we cherish a lot more.
You know, because we know thatwe have these other things more
in our lives.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
What do you learn about yourself in the different
dynamics of relationship?
You know a successful woman youtalked about being a mother,
you know.
And then being in arelationship and I know you got
family, you got friends.
Like, how do you balance?
You know, making time for thosethings or those people that are
, you know, important to you?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
One I am very big on a calendar.
Don't expect me to remembernothing.
You know my assistants havelearned that quickly that don't
tell Ms Brown something andthink she gonna remember 20
minutes later.
Also, a lot of accountabilitypartners in my life, people who
remind me what about thisresponsibility?
Oh girl, you committed to thisor you said you were coming and
(06:48):
then for me, I just have thismantra of I don't think about it
, I just do.
There was a period in the lastfour years that I was taking
care of both of my parents whowere ailing very sickly and they
ended up passing away a fewyears ago and I took care of
them.
I became a caregiver in themidst of everything else I had
going on and I look back on itand I'm like how did I balance
(07:09):
taking care of two, six parentstaking care of their affairs?
You know all of that, you knownurses, you know doctor's
appointments, then being amother being present for my
child, then being all these TVshows at the same time, and I
realized I went into autopilotand it was a matter of just
doing and not thinking about it,but being cognitive of how I
did it at the same time and itwasn't like an over thought out
(07:33):
process, it just was done, andso it proved to me that I can do
a very good balancing act, andthose who understand what I'm up
against and what I'm you know,the responsibilities I have they
stay put and they wait for meto reach out.
They wait, they understand thatwhen I do reach out, that's
pretty special because I've gotso much going on.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
So I had an opportunity to spend some time
with you.
Yep, enjoy my cooking.
Girl Dip the collard greens.
Listen.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
I've had two requests to make those greens this week.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Yes, I mean the collard greens, all of it was
amazing Like, but the collardgreens and the yams, oh, thank
you.
And the cornbread.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
That's Nellie's recipe.
Look at the ham Nellie's recipe.
To my grandma it was amazing.
I had to cook it before I couldwalk.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
It was amazing.
So I learned a little bit aboutyour backstory.
Right, You've been marriedbefore right, and this
relationship took place whileyou were in the industry and you
kind of gave me some contextabout that marriage.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Speaker 1 (08:32):
I met my ex-husband through a friend and it was a
whirlwind romance.
We were engaged in four months,married nine months later and
it's so funny because he wasn'tthe ideal image of the man I
thought I'd marry.
Okay, and you know, I like agood ball player, but I, you
(08:53):
know, I'd never been with alinebacker.
Okay, because you know, it'slike you know how are we going
to do this.
At the time, I was much larger,but he just won my heart.
It was like you know, it's likeyou know how are we going to do
this.
At the time, I was much larger,but he just won my heart.
It was like you know, it'sbeing swept off my feet.
We were married and then, assoon as we got married and I
mean when I say as soon as wegot married stuff started coming
(09:15):
out that had been hidden fromme.
One was that this woman that heclaimed was his ex-wife was
really his wife.
Wow, and of course, he and hismother were like no, no, no,
she's lying, she's crazy.
We got you, you know, we'llhandle it.
I'm like, okay, I let it go.
Uh, three years later and achild I found out that really is
(09:36):
his wife.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Now you say you guys, how long did you date?
Speaker 1 (09:39):
before.
We dated for four months beforewe were engaged and nine months
later we were married.
Wow.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Yeah.
So if you had to do that allover again, what would that
process look like?
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Oh, a background check immediately.
I do background checks just forfun, but I also had to really
sit back and do some inner workon me because I saw a lot of
signs and I realized that Imarried my ex in desperation.
I was 48 years old.
(10:08):
I desperately wanted to be amother.
I promised my grandmother onher deathbed that I would be the
one grandchild that did itright and got married first,
then had a baby.
Um, I knew he wasn't the idealguy that I wanted, but he was
the guy giving me attention.
At that moment I realized my exhusband could have been anybody
at that time in my life, in theframe of mind I was in of get
(10:28):
married, have a baby, have afamily, you know.
And I ignored a lot of signs, alot of signs.
Some of that stuff was reallyin my face and I ignored it.
You know his insecurities andyou know he had a problem with
me working like brother.
I could have never worked withyou.
He just saw you and be like no,he want to get with you.
No, because you're a handsomeguy, and he literally would
(10:52):
cancel.
He wanted to be my manager.
So I let him be my manager,trying to let my man be a part
of my life in my career, come tofind out he was turning down
shows because promoter was toofine.
You know he didn't like the waythe promoter looked.
You know it was all thesethings but I saw them in the
beginning but I was ignoringthem because I just was on this
tunnel vision of get married,have a baby, get married, have a
(11:13):
baby, have a family.
So I couldn't blame him totallyfor the deception.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
How did you interpret that behavior, though at the
time he just loved?
Speaker 1 (11:21):
me.
Okay, that's not, though.
At the time he just loved me.
Okay, he just loved me.
You know he wanted to protectme.
He, my big old bear, you know I, I really gave myself, you know
, excuses for the behavior that,uh, once we got in the marriage
became borderline abusive.
You know, a lot of gaslightingnarcissism, you know, and it
(11:42):
took me having my son for me towake up and realize I didn't
want my son to grow up and thinkthis was normal, that a man
doesn't work and a womanprovides for him and he gets to
sit around and reap the benefits.
A man who constantly belittlesa woman and makes her feel less
than because he doesn't feelgood about himself.
A man who, if he can't do whathe wants to do, he just gives up
(12:04):
, like it was so many aspectsthat I saw and having this
little boy made me go.
I don't want my son growing upthinking this is normal, this is
how you treat a woman, this isand it's okay, and that was one
of the main catalysts that Iwalked away when my child was
seven months old and during thecourse of me going to seek, you
know, a divorce lawyer is how Ifound out.
It was so funny, you know.
She was like well, girl, youknow you're probably going to
(12:26):
end up having to give himalimony.
This is California and I'm likeI can't believe I got to pay
for this man.
Okay, what's the deal?
She said well, most ballplayerslove to hide some money.
Child, you got to social.
I said yeah, of course I dono-transcript that marriage I
(12:50):
said what could be the bad news?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
she goes you ain't married we're gonna have to put
a pin there.
When we come back, we're gonnacontinue this story with miss
coco brown.
Relationships matter, cocoBrown, relationships Matter.
Welcome back to RelationshipsMatter.
So before we went to break,coco just said she found out she
(13:14):
was not married.
She's not married.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Yeah, I mean, she was like you're not married.
And I said what are you talkingabout?
And she said, sweetie, he has awhole wife and child in Las
Vegas, nevada.
And I said, excuse me.
And then, when she said thename, I said he's been telling
me, and his entire family hasbeen telling me since we've been
married, that that's his ex.
She said, oh no, baby, there'sno divorce.
She goes, you, you're about toget everything.
(13:38):
And I just remember sittingthere in shock, like half of me
is like praise, praise, god.
I don't have to write this mana check, but I'm like what?
Like you sat there and watchedmy parents plan a sixty thousand
dollar wedding.
You watched my parents give memy dream wedding.
You sat there, your family,everything, and this whole time
you knew I'm.
This wasn't even legit, thiswasn't even real.
(13:59):
And I'm thinking to myself well, if you was trying to come up,
brother, your game is weakbecause you should have been
treating me like a queen, so Iwould never find out Right, and
otherwise you treat me like doodoo.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
You know supporting cast with the family, knowing
the whole family knew.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
And what's crazy is I found this out later that a
friend of mine who was one of mybridesmaids was at the
reception and one of his familymembers literally said this and
they tried to play it off.
But she knows, she heard it andshe said girl, we all about to
come up off this B?
Yeah.
And she heard her say it andshe said what did you say?
None, and she kind of scurriedoff.
(14:33):
Well, Wow.
Isn't that crazy.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I know, brother, I'm going to start with
accountability.
Yeah, and for me, I get reallyfrustrated as a man to hear men
behave in a way and this is notme judging him or his family,
because I'm always about beingfair and that's not on my spirit
to do it Because I spoiled hisfamily, so I set it up.
(15:02):
It's just as a man, as a, as aleader, as a protector, a
provider, a nurturer, a lover,all of these different things
that we are supposed to be.
It just really bothers me, youknow, to hear that people are
moving in such a way, men orwomen, but especially like
because I'm a man.
So I wanted to address you knowwhat I mean, that first.
But then I wanted to jump intothis question because it is huge
(15:26):
, and then I want, you know,chanel, to, you know, to take a
deeper dive on this family thing, because people got to
understand the rules.
That's going on and how thisgame is being played.
Um, aside from ouraccountability on what we do or
don't do, a lot of women, thatsame moment that you had of I'm
(15:47):
in this space, I want to do itright.
I'm gonna force the situationlike what can we do to get away
from that?
Because I'm not saying I don'tunderstand where a woman is
coming from.
You know what I mean.
I don't understand where awoman is coming from.
You know what I mean.
I don't think anything is wrongwith wanting love.
(16:09):
I don't think anything is wrongwith wanting a family.
I don't think anything is wrongwith this vision, but the fact
that so many women will eitherrush it right or they'll mark it
off the checklist Because it'skind of like a part of their
identity not yours, but in othersituations where it's like,
(16:31):
well, yeah, I done been married,I done had kids, so now it's
like, now that I've, you know,marked that off, we on to the
next thing.
But what it's doing is it'scausing a lot of damage, because
now, for the man and for thewoman, depending on the amount
of pain and what's going on then, when you bring children into
that, right, you seem like asolid woman.
(16:53):
You know, I'm getting to knowyou throughout this conversation
, but there there aren't womenwho move like you.
Right, I don't know how you areas a mom, but I'm just feeling
like your spirit right, but I'mjust just going off of your
spirit in the conversation,right, um.
But there are a lot of women andmen, but for what I'm saying,
right now, there are a lot ofwomen who are moving away, where
(17:15):
they get to what they want, andthen it's like havoc after that
well, women having children aspurses.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
That's what I like to say let me have.
Women having children andtreating them like purses.
I've seen that with my own eyes.
The women who want the purse,the trinket, the showpiece, they
want the marriage as ashowpiece.
When I was reading up on someof the statistics of marriage,
especially in this city, and tofind out the amount of women who
(17:42):
marry gay men just for thefacade, say what yeah, brother.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
In this city and to find out the amount of women who
marry gay men just for thefacade.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
Say what In this city ?
Yes, sir, they will marry a man.
They know what made you lookthat up.
That's a stat.
I'm nosy and I like.
That's how I get my material.
I'm always researching andlooking up stuff.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
I wouldn't think they marry gay men.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
I stumbled across it that women are marrying gay men
and they're letting them stillhave their lifestyle as long as
he provides the facade of thefamily.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
I'm about to throw my mic.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, yeah.
And it's not just here, it'sacross the board.
And that comes with me becauseI research a lot, you know, for
my material.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
You just gave me like so much confirmation because in
some things like I act greenintentionally.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
But I know a lot.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
And it's like, when you see how people move, it's
like I ain't going to go there,I'm going to leave that alone,
especially because in certaincommunities it's like it's
untouchable, but to know thatpeople are moving in that way,
you know Anyway.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I'll go back to your initial question.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Yeah, Cause I want to .
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I want to see how we can.
How?
Speaker 3 (18:50):
can we bless people, cause that's that's about to
take me somewhere else.
But how can we bless people,like, from what you know?
Now let me propose, let mepropose the question correctly,
so, with what you know now, withyour experience, how do we grow
as men and women?
But how do we make betterdecision making in the dating
field and not put ourselves inproblematic relationships or
(19:15):
create even worse dynamicsbecause we're not patient or
because we're looking for thewrong thing?
Speaker 1 (19:24):
So, yeah, I can't speak for anybody else, but I
can tell you my journey Um.
I was raised very traditionallySouthern.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Okay, I had a two parent household.
Mom was a teacher, dad was apipe fitter.
You know, uh, my mother camefrom what could be considered
the wrong side of the tracks.
My dad came from long blackmoney.
My father came from very highyellow people that the tracks.
My dad came from long blackboule money.
My father came from very highyellow people that could pass.
My mother came from hardworkingblue collar.
You know maids and and and andand and you know carpenters,
(19:55):
things like that.
And my parents met married andyou know I I credit my parents
that they both gave me bothsides of the tracks.
I spent half my summer in teeswith Jack and Jill and half my
summers running through theprojects getting an icy cup with
jellies on.
Ok, I got to see both sides ofthe world.
So that gave me the ability tofloat wherever I can, you know,
and be comfortable.
(20:15):
But it also gave me thesituation where I was told.
Basically, when I told myparents I was going to become a
comic, they looked at me like Iwas crazy.
Basically, when I told myparents I was going to become a
comic, they looked at me like Iwas crazy because my job was to
go to college, get a degree,meet a great man, get married,
have babies and come to myparents for house after church
so our women are receiving thatinformation well, I can't speak
(20:38):
for women now, because I thinkit's a different breed of women
out here now that's fair, but Ithink it also kills the
narrative too, because a lot, of, a lot of people especially
when you look on social mediathey want to say anything
outside of what we look like.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
They're being told a whole different thing and here
you are confirming like no.
When I was brought up, my mom,my dad, gave me the game on I'm
supposed to get married have akid, do this, do that and see.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
But my mom also realized that she used to always
say you know, I raised you tobe a wife and a mother, but I
also raised you to be tooindependent.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Too independent.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
She said and I should have taught you how to balance
the two, because she could seeit in a lot of my relationships.
I was the boss, fair, I ran it.
I ran it.
But she realized she taught methat that's fair.
You know, I'm saying cuz, eventhough she made my father.
He was the king of the castle,he was head of the household.
My father was one of those menthat came home from the shipyard
, handed my mom his hurts youknow his check and she wrote all
(21:33):
the bills Right.
And so I watched my mother runa household and I didn't realize
that in the midst of herrunning that household she also
was pressing this man's uniform.
She was also making sure he hada hot meal.
When he came home, like she wasbalancing the two, I just saw a
woman handling everything.
So I had the theory kind oftwisted.
(21:55):
So it took me to actually getmarried and then also realize
that I don't like this positionof being the man of the house.
Yeah, I don't like thisposition of being the provider.
I don't like this position ofbeing the man of the house.
Yeah, I don't like thisposition of being the provider.
I don't like this position.
It should be evenly yoked.
I shouldn't be doing this allmyself and he's sitting around.
This doesn't feel right.
This doesn't feel right.
Speaker 3 (22:15):
I'm so glad yeah, well, we're going to cut the
break in a minute, but I'm soglad you said it because I just
want to acknowledge before Iknow Chanel wants to go into the
balance piece but I just thinkit's important for people to
hear that because we don't,especially people that look like
us.
We don't never hear that side ofthings and to have that level
(22:36):
of understanding right, becausetypically it's villainized when
you hear a lot of, you know,black women, um, or women of
color you know, talk about theirupbringing or why they are the
way that they are, and then onour side it's like, well, we
don't want to deal with that andit's that in the third and I'm
not saying that either party isright or wrong, but
understanding is so powerful.
(22:56):
So, to hear you and how youarticulated that, I hope that
men, when they watch this, canget a chance to and get a sense
of OK, I need to show a littlebit more grace.
Maybe there are some questionsor some things that I can ask,
because we're passing over goodwomen because of their
upbringing Right now.
That doesn't excuse otherbehaviors, but at least it gives
(23:20):
context to the conversation.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Why can't she be submissive?
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Why can't she?
Speaker 1 (23:26):
let me lead.
Um, I know for me.
I said I watched my mother runthe household and, mind you, my
dad was the king of the castle.
You know what I'm saying.
He was the disciplinarian.
You know my father took care ofthe yard, anything broken, that
house, I mean, he was very mucha man's man, you know, and I
remember times that you know mydad would have my brother out
(23:46):
there and he'd call me.
So I'm out there learning how tochange brake pads, change a
headlight, put in fluids, checkyour oil pressure, and my mom
would say she don't need to knowall that, some man going to do
it for her.
And my dad would literally say,just in case he don't, she do,
and she's going to make her tooindependent, he's like, well, so
it's like I literally would gointo relationships and With, and
(24:09):
I had to watch the damsels indistress.
I have friends who I considerpillow princesses.
They don't do nothing butbreathe with their man.
Nothing but breathe, he doeseverything.
And I used to think that was soodd, like I couldn't understand.
Like you don't do nothing, youjust get up and get dressed,
like you know, because I watchedtwo people have their dynamic,
(24:32):
and then also to how I wasraised, where, even though I
cook and I clean, I take care ofmy man.
I raised my children, I'm alsohandling this household, I'm
paying the bills, I'm makingsure my man is good.
I grew up with something verytraditional, if you want to call
it traditional and then to getinto relationships.
I didn't know how to sit backand be that damsel in distress.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
So when we get back I know Chanel wants to ask you
about balance, but maybe we candive into the damsel
Relationships matter,Relationships matter.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Welcome back to Relationships Matter.
So before we went to break wewere talking.
Something you said stuck out tome in terms of not wanting to
be the provider but also beingoverly independent, and that's
something that I struggle with.
I don't want to be the provider, but how do you balance not
being overly independent orwanting to, like you say you run
(25:29):
the relationship independent,or wanting to, like you say you
run the relationship?
Most times in situations whereI've been in situations like
that, I'll give the person anopportunity to step up and do,
but then if I don't think you'redoing, then I'm one of those
type of people that'll just havethe takeover spirit.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
The hardest part is being an independent woman who
handles hers, because I've beenon my own since I was 20 years
old.
I had my first apartment.
I've just always been builtthat way.
I was 20 years old, had myfirst apartment.
I've just always been builtthat way.
My mother used to always say,you know, she said my son came
home and I couldn't get him out,my child left, my daughter left
and never looked back, you know, and she knew that she had
raised me that way.
They raised me that way.
(26:06):
I hate to say it, but it'salmost like playing a game of
chess with a man.
I've noticed just in this townyou can't be too.
I think we had thisconversation at the house.
You can't be too successfullooking, because that black male
ego, that black male pride,honey, is fragile.
They've got to feel needed.
They've got to feel likethey're saving you to some
(26:27):
degree.
And if you're rolling up likeeverything is straight in your
life and he can't save you, theylike, oh, what can I bring to
the table for what can I do?
And I tell men all the timehoney, what I need from you
don't cost no money.
You know what I'm saying.
If you, I need emotionalsupport.
I need you to pray with me,brother.
I need you to make me feel likeI matter to you, I'm special to
(26:48):
you, that you'll fight for me.
I said all that ain't got noprice tag on it.
Now, if you just want to buy mepurses, flew me out and all
that, then I'm not the woman foryou.
I'll take it for a couple ofmonths, but then I'm gonna move
on.
I'll keep it 100.
I'll take it for a fewmonthsall complain about women
(27:09):
not knowing how to cook or cleanor do nothing.
I said but y'all created thismonster.
I said in my daddy's era therewas a certain requirement for a
woman to be even considered yourwoman or your wife.
There were requirements.
There was a bar.
I said when y'all lowered thatbar to just the size of a
woman's booty, she ain't got tobe nothing else.
(27:30):
The size of a woman's booty,she ain't got to be nothing else
as long as she can get the DRand get booty shots.
When y'all lowered thatstandard that she ain't got to
be nothing but a showpiece and afat booty.
You get what you get.
She ain't got to be nothingelse.
But I come from an era that aman might play with you, but,
wife you, you had to havecertain qualities, you had to
have certain things.
It was a bar and y'all loweredthat bar when you made it just
(27:56):
the physical.
And then you look at a woman whohas become successful.
I'm successful, I'm.
I've got money, I'm good.
You know what I'm saying.
I don't need a man to bail meout, pay for my business.
I'm good.
You know, even with the fire, Ihaven't even touched the
donation money.
I don't need to.
That's going to go to my housewhen I build it, you know.
But men need to feel needed andif they see a woman that's got
too much, especially if he's aman that has not reached his
(28:18):
full potential and he feels likehe's less than in terms of what
he's accomplished in his lifeand he meets a woman that's on
some boss level, that's animmediate red flag for him.
Red flag for him.
I can't save her, not knowingthat you could, brother, if you
knew how to tap into that heart,if you knew how to feed her
soul.
It ain't about writing a check,bro.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
And you made a lot of great points, so I want to
acknowledge that first.
But also, in fairness, I wantto speak up for men.
I don't think this way butbecause I've had to do a lot of
work on my own for my ownreasons my, my childhood and all
of that.
But a lot of men are brother Iappreciate it, I'm still on it,
but a lot of men are onlypraised for the performance.
(29:00):
So the the same.
And and this is where gracekicks in, because what you said
earlier was powerful, because itspoke to history, what you're
being taught, cultures and allof that.
But flip it, because it's nodifferent for men, right, you
have men who are being overlycoddled by their mothers or
(29:22):
whatever that is, or there's noman in the house, right?
And we're talking about our eratoo.
They're not seeing the exampleenough, you know.
And then there's the otherexamples on what this looks like
and what is acceptable.
You know what I mean.
So we're looking at history andthe damage from it, because a
(29:42):
lot of people don't come fromlike your situation to be able
to see that.
You know what I mean From bothsides and what's also powerful.
What you said, too, is, eventhough you were taught what you
were taught, you still took itin a way that it wasn't
necessarily meant to be taken,so you had to learn that on your
(30:03):
own.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
I had to unlearn it.
I had to unlearn some stuff Idid, for example, like with your
mom right.
Speaker 3 (30:06):
So you were like, my parents did a hell of a job in
how they raised me and all thethings that they gave me, but
then watching them go back andforth about well, she don't need
to learn that.
Well, yes, she do.
Just, you know what I'm saying.
So it's like for us men if wedon't have that proper to this
and I'm not trying to make anexcuse, but it's just an
(30:27):
understanding and if we can havethat grace, because just like
when, when a woman does comeacross a man who's on that type
of time and then she's not ready, so then the man has to be that
person to say, all right, thisis what I need to do, because I
value this relationship and it'sthe same for a woman.
So I just wanted to point thatout because it's very powerful.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
You're saying a lot of great things and just with
the questions, and all of that,what you said about, um, when a
woman is not ready because todayif a woman is not ready, he's
not taking time with you at all,he's moving on.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
They'll take time for what they want.
That's why I tell women all thetime and I say this in my
standard, because I I do a lotof therapy on my stand-up
because I just speak about mytruths and what I've learned and
through my healing in mystand-up I just have the gift to
make it funny but I tell womenyou've got to see what you see.
(31:21):
If this man is not choosing you, boo, he don't want you and
ain't nothing you can do.
Because the one thing I knowabout men and I've only had more
experiences with black men whenhe wants you, it ain't nothing
he will not do.
He could be the goofiest,stupidest man you ever met.
That just don't get it.
But if you're what he wants, hewill fight in a way that you
will know I am the chosen one.
(31:41):
If he's not doing that, youain't it which is which is where
I was.
Speaker 3 (31:46):
You know you've already answered it, but you
know that that's the other pointtoo, because in these types of
conversations it but you knowthat that's the other point too,
because in these types ofconversations it's not to
confuse that message.
There I thoroughly believethere are some people that have
no business being in arelationship, oh god, yes, there
are some people that don't needto be married, some people that
don't need to be parents, likebruh.
But that pocket of people I'mgonna move to the side.
The pocket of people that'splaying games I'm gonna move to
(32:07):
the side.
Like one thing I do know topiggyback off of what you said.
Like if a man wants you, hegonna go through hell and hot
water to to make sure that heshows you the effort he gonna
fight.
And now if if she isappreciative of that or not,
that's another conversation.
But we're definitely gonna goabove, above and beyond.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yeah, because you think about it.
You ever seen a dude that isjust going above and beyond for
a woman and she treats him liketotal crap?
Absolutely Because she's chosen.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
But look, my point is this is that, on the one hand,
a man will say you're tooindependent or you have this
together or you got this right.
And so then they feel likethere's nothing they can do,
because they're minus a dollarsign Right.
But then on the flip side ofthings, if you're not there yet,
then it's not enough, thenyou're not where I want you to
(32:54):
be, so then I'm moving on.
So then it's like what do youwant?
I ain't met them.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
I ain't met them.
Now it depends on the kind ofman you're dealing with, because
I know guys who aremultimillionaires, I know a
couple of billionaires, and theylove women that ain't got a pot
to piss in or one of the throwit out.
They love having to provideevery single need and want.
They love that control.
They love their pillowprincesses.
(33:18):
All she do is breathe.
I know a lot of men who aresuper successful.
They don't want a supersuccessful counterpart because
then it makes them have toconstantly keep their game up
and they like to do it in theirown way, their own pace.
You're reminding him when youmake accomplishments.
I got to step my game up.
Well, maybe he don't want to doit that week, that month, that
(33:39):
year.
So it's a double-edged sword.
You've got to.
I guess that's why I always sayyou've got to find someone
you're evenly yoked with.
And a lot of us cast that asidebecause it sounds biblical or
old school.
But it's so crucial that youhave to find someone you're
evenly yoked with thatunderstands that maybe there may
be times I'm up and you're hereand vice versa, and even then
(34:00):
we're still here, subconsciously, emotionally, no matter what's
going on.
There's no intimidation,there's no jealousy, there's no
envy.
You know we want each otherother to win, but a lot of
people, because of their owninsecurities that they haven't
accomplished this or whatever'sgoing on with them, their
childhoods, whatever they can'tmeet on that level because it's
a competition out the gate.
Speaker 3 (34:21):
I don't want no man, I'm competing with you know it's
, and it's so powerful and, andas we go to break, one thing I
want to mention, but I want to,I don't want to forget this
question because when we comeback, I want to ask you about,
like, trust and the importanceof that, but as we're going into
break, um, it's, it's powerful.
You say that because we've hadthree very powerful segments,
(34:41):
right, and we've been talkingabout relationships the whole
time.
We haven't spoken to love, likewe've lost.
In my opinion, the actualpurpose of a relationship is,
you know, partnership, love,trust, like having somebody that
you know, you're willing to dothe ins and outs with.
And it's so funny how this iswhy I feel the relationship
(35:04):
conversation there's such adisconnect, because everything
is about what you're doing forme, what I'm doing for you.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
The foundation of most of these relationships have
a price tag on them.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Thank you, they do, they do, and when we get back
more with Ms Brown,relationships matter.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Welcome back to Relationships Matter.
So I got to get in yourbusiness.
Come on, get in there Witheverything that we've discussed
about just being successful andindependent.
So now you're here, right, newrelationship.
How do you balance all of thatand still be submissive with
(35:45):
your man?
Speaker 1 (35:46):
I let a man be a man.
When you're trying to let a manbe a man and lead and you see
him about to take you all off aman.
When you're trying to let a manbe a man and lead and you see
him about to take y'all off acliff and you want to jump in
and do what you know you can do.
Right, it is the hardest thing,but you have to do it.
You have to sometimes let y'allfall off the cliff.
You have to let him see thatyou did that.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
Thank you for saying that.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
I'm serious, it's hard, it's so hard.
But sometimes you really haveto, because I said that that
black male ego, that pride, is amother and the minute you shake
it and rattle it or make himdoubt it, girl, you don't know
what monster you're going to getfrom that.
And it's like you have tosometimes let him lead you off
that cliff as much as it may,because you know how you can fix
(36:29):
it, you know how you can handleit.
Um, there are times that youknow, I let you know my new man.
Just figure it out, and I knowthe solution.
I'll be knowing the answer.
It be here just behind my teethdoing this and that's me on the
phone like, well, yeah, just dowhat you're gonna do, because
you gotta let him do it.
It's almost like how I raisedmy son.
I can see my son about to dosome crazy crap and I have to
(36:50):
step back and say, okay, let himdo it, then he'll learn,
because if I jump in and savehim, he'll never know how to
solve that on his own what's anexample because I think this is
good for for men to even heartoo like what's an example of
when it's good on both sides,but what's what's one of your
examples of?
Speaker 3 (37:08):
I know we about to drive off this cliff and I'm
going to shut my mouth Because Ithink it's good to have context
to it.
You know we have theseconversations.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
OK, so I'll keep it 100.
Me and my man was driving theother day to Florida.
We love to play 20 questionsbecause that's how we get to
know each other, because somethings you just don't reveal
unless you ask this crazyquestion.
That's how we get to know eachother, because some things you
just don't reveal unless you askthis crazy question.
So I kept it real.
You know what I'm saying,because I know how close you
guys are and he knows that Ihave male friends as well.
(37:38):
And I said, babe.
I said, do you think thereshould be boundaries when it
comes to relationships andfriendships outside of our
relationship of the opposite sex?
And he was like, what do youmean?
And I said, well, I'm justsaying boo, like, would there
ever be a situation where you'dbe like, hey, you and Marcus,
that's looking a little funny.
Or would I be in a situationwhere I'd be like, hey, dude,
(37:59):
what's up with you and Chanel,you know?
And he could not understand.
And I saw, oh God, he don't getit, he don't get it.
And I said, let's reel it in.
I said, okay, what's yourfavorite color?
I had to, I had to divertbecause he wasn't.
He thought I had an issue, butI didn't.
I just wanted to know hisopinion because I have a gang of
(38:20):
male friends.
I'm in a male dominatedbusiness.
The majority of people who callmy phone in this business are
dudes and I want to make surehe's secure, knowing that you
understand the insecurities thatcome with that.
You know exactly.
And then for me, I'm never thatchick.
You know what I'm saying.
I've had, you know, men withfemale friends and very close I
don't trip.
Like I said, the only time I'mgoing to say something is I see
(38:41):
some Funny business.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
That's the only time I'm going to be like oh bro,
that look crazy, crazy.
Um, okay for you, for me, yeah,if I ever feel that I am
dismissed and that person is putahead of me and it's not in a
dire life or death situation.
Once okay, twice okay, morethan that what's going on here?
(39:07):
Because I should never bepushed aside for anybody else.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
If I'm your woman, you know what I'm saying, if a
woman really respects becausefor your relationship, like I
tell him as a woman, oh, you hadhis back because he went as a
matter of fact, he almost wentoff a cliff last week.
Yeah, as a woman I'm like uh-uh.
And you saved him.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
I said you got to call her back right now Because
you almost got cussed out,because you ain't going to get
it.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
She ain't going to answer you in another hour.
You got to get her back on thephone right now Because, as a
woman, I know my effects.
Speaker 1 (39:38):
You knew how that looked and it's all about
perception.
It's all about perception.
It could be nothing, it couldbe totally innocent.
But where men sometimes get alittle goofy and oblivious, see
women, our heads on a swivel,brother.
Especially when another woman'sin our presence, around our man
, it could be our best friend,our homegirls.
Our heads on a swivel, that'sjust women.
That women gut, that womentuition we don't play that Men.
(40:01):
Y'all can be a little goofy,y'all can be a little goofy.
I got a friend right nowDealing with that where he was
loaning his friend money behindhis wife's back and he thought
it was nothing wrong with that.
Did you take your money out themutual pot to give to another
woman?
And he really couldn'tunderstand how that was wrong.
But you ain't telling your wife.
It's the perception of how thatlooks.
Speaker 3 (40:21):
Don't do us all like that now.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
But it's the perception of how it looks.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
You see my face over here every time you say
something, because I don't know,he don't do that brother-sister
type stuff, right, josh don't.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
I'm not tripping about it either.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
I'm where you at.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
But it's perception you may be completely innocent
in your actions, but it's theperception.
But giving your homeboy's girlmoney, that's wild Right and he
really stood ten toes down.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
I ain't doing nothing wrong.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
I'm just helping out a friend and if you want your
friend you want your friend tobe happy he's sliding me, I'm on
that type of time, ain't no wayyou giving somebody some money
behind your.
Come on man.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
And another woman at that.
It's not your homeboy, it'sanother woman.
Speaker 3 (41:04):
You got something going on that ain't even right.
That's what.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
I'm saying it's the perception.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
See, see, a man gets it.
It's the perception, nobodydoing that.
It's the perception.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
You know I'm saying out of pocket bitch dog.
I understand that there aredifferent dynamics to
friendships and all of thatbecause I have friends.
You know, one of my bestfriends is a guy.
We've been friends since we hadbaby teeth.
We've been through marriagesand divorces together.
We've cried on each other'sshoulders, we've loaned each
other money.
We've been out that adviceperson at 3 in the morning
because we're going through it.
We, you've been that persontalking each other off the ledge
(41:33):
.
But I also know that I setboundaries with all my male
friends a long time ago.
They want a man.
Come up here Unless I summonfor you, don't come up in here.
That's women unless.
I summon for you no coming inmessing with.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
We talk about the boundaries real quick.
I wanted to share like we canget to.
Let me just just dealing withcory.
Yeah, I will be yeah, becausewhen you talk about boundaries.
It's important that you do that, because we are extremely close
, like brother and sister,absolutely but but and and I
love him and he loved me but youunderstand, I would never have
(42:12):
a conversation with you, right?
Speaker 1 (42:14):
with him because his job is to control that
perception in that narrative.
That's his job, right we have.
Speaker 2 (42:19):
We had a situation, though, where you have to set
boundaries, as you know, becausewe, you know you close.
We at josh's book signing and Igo run to the bathroom because
I'm washing my hands.
The door is still open, so soI'm not using the restroom, I'm
just washing my hands.
Now, me and Corey, we're close.
We're really like brother andsister.
We don't share blood, butthat's my family.
I don't have much family here.
He comes in the bathroom.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
I'm like Corey why are you in the bathroom, he
goofy?
Speaker 2 (42:43):
You see, all them men out there, you're blocking he
good.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
He like what, stop, stop, stop.
Which way did he go Get out mypoor baby's so good?
Yes, so you got it.
Like, because I'd have beenthere, I'd have been like what
you doing?
Yeah, but he thinks sometimesfrom his heart, yes, and
sometimes he don't really lookat it.
(43:09):
That's why I think it's veryimportant for single men to have
married men friends.
Yeah, I think that's soimportant that single men have
married men friends, because amarried man who is sole purpose
in life is to keep peace in hishouse, understands the dynamics
of what to do and what not to do, right, right, you know that
can tick his woman off and causea lot of discord in his home.
(43:31):
Single men ain't going to getit.
He doing what his own, he doinghis own thing,
whoop-de-whoop-de-whoop.
But a married man like when I'mgoing through things in my
relationships, I don't call mysingle friends, I call my girl
and her husband, I call Sam andmy married friends because I
know I'm going to get how tomake this relationship work.
Not, girl, you can do betterthan him and go ahead in your
(43:52):
body.
No, I know I'm going to getpeople who are making a
relationship work.
Daily I'm getting proper advice.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
So can I speak to that real?
Speaker 1 (44:00):
quick Sure baby.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Because I don't disagree, I think what you're
saying is definitely powerful,but I want to take it a step
further, because I believe thatyou just have to find the mature
people that are on the samewavelength, because the way I've
grown up in the company thatI've kept and I moved a certain
way at one point in time likejust because you're married
(44:22):
don't mean nothing.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
That's true, so just out of fairness.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Yeah, discernment is key, but what you're saying is
absolutely powerful because you,you need those counterparts,
you need that type ofaccountability and, and you know
, people that are gonna hold youto a certain standard and make
sure that you're not behaving ordoing anything that's out of
pocket, what y'all were talkingabout before.
I had to sit that one out.
Why you say that?
Yeah, I had to sit down.
(44:47):
Why I don't want no pause today?
Speaker 1 (44:48):
No, it's a strange dynamic, you know, because I you
know.
I know how close you are.
You know what I'm saying.
I knew more about her and I'msure she knows about me.
You know that's his bestie.
And if I was the kind of womanthat was insecure, threatened,
it might be an issue.
But it might be an issue.
But I'm also the kind of womanthat I'm not.
(45:09):
I'm not.
I'm very secure in who I am,what I possess, what I bring to
the table.
You know, I fear no one.
Terrence Howard told me 25years ago you fear nothing, keep
that.
And I do.
But I'm also the kind of woman,too, that I'm very big on
respect.
I'm very big on respect and I'malso the kind of woman that I'm
gonna tell you once, maybetwice, that something bothers me
.
If I gotta go a third time,that third time is gonna be a
(45:31):
block.
That third time is gonna be youain't gonna be able to reach me
because life is too short.
You get what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
You're just choosing not to that's why these
conversations are so needed yougotta have the ogs on deck you
gotta respectfully becauseyou're, you know, just us having
these types of matureconversations.
Even for our age group oranybody younger, it's just
important to hear, because whenyou start removing these things,
you start talking abouthealthier relationships and
(45:58):
healthier dynamics but then,look, you have this situation
where you meet someone new andyou guys have dated before.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
Yeah this is not in our first school and you'll meet
someone who they've beenfriends.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
a female male dynamic , and these women come across as
being territorial.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Oh, yes, disrespectful, I've seen them,
yes.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Me because I want the best for my friend.
That's why I make it a point tocome and meet you myself and
let you know.
Are you thinking of people?
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I'm 100.
That's because I know for meI'm the only me and my friend
Nikki are the only single onesin our entire crew.
Everybody else is married.
We were there a lot of whenthey met their husbands and
their husbands now have becomelike our brothers.
But I got boys who have gottenmarried and I went out of my way
(46:44):
to make sure that that womanknew that I understood my
position.
I love your husband like abrother.
He's been there for me throughthick and thin.
I could call him for anything.
But I also know now you are thequeen, absolutely so I don't
even call them directly if Ineed them.
A lot of times I will call heror text her and say, hey girl,
(47:04):
is Rico around?
I need to ask him something outof respect.
But I'm not.
I understand the boundary here.
You're the queen.
You know I was his, I'm hissister, right, but you're the
queen.
I'm not going to have you everthinking for a hot second,
that's right, that I would beshady or sneaky or, you know,
manipulate him or do anything.
No, right, you know it's so.
(47:25):
It's so crazy that I've been inmy friends' homes.
They are still at work.
I'm in the house with theirhusbands because they know I
don't play that game.
I don't play that, that's right.
And I don't trust no woman thatcomes around me and claims
she's friends with my man.
But you don't try to get toknow me.
Help her with your angle,absolutely.
You better get to know me.
Speaker 3 (47:48):
Hey man, free game Boy.
Speaker 2 (47:49):
I need more relationships matter you feel
welcome back to relationshipsmatter.
So, josh, what is this?
This question about trust?
Speaker 3 (48:01):
yeah, I mean, I just overall wanted to know what does
that look like for you, givenyour background, given the
industry you work in?
Now you're in the place thatyou're in with, you know, with
your relationship and stuff likeis that easy, because you've
already been burned once?
Speaker 1 (48:17):
I've been burned many times or many times and not in
the literal sense, but I was.
Speaker 3 (48:23):
He was thinking I'm walking around here dirty so I
was, I was saying from when Isaid that once, basically
because you took that to youknow the next level like being
married, you had a child.
So I'm just saying, like, howdoes that look for you in order
to trust at this stage of yourlife?
Speaker 1 (48:43):
Honestly.
You know God bless my greataunt, my aunt Florine.
She was just a wealth of wisdom.
You know, god bless my greataunt, my aunt Florine.
She was just a wealth of wisdom.
And I remember she telling mebaby, you give a man all the
trust in the world out the gate.
It's up to him if he keeps it.
Listen to your gut.
You know when a man don't comein.
You got to ask my trust becauseit's hard to earn Thank you.
(49:06):
It's hard to earn thank you.
It's hard to earn trust.
You know you've got to come inand say I am trusting you to be
the man you say you are, thewoman you say you are, I am
trusting you.
Speaker 2 (49:17):
It's up to you well, how do you tie that in with
expectations, though?
Because then they say whatexpectations?
So you know you have certainexpectations of anybody that you
engage in in terms ofrelationships why, like, if you
say you're gonna call me back,call, call me back.
Speaker 1 (49:29):
Well, yeah, but see, that's something you established
very much in the beginning.
Right, you've got to let a manshow you who he is.
You can't come in.
I'm going to tell you, theworst thing you can do is give a
man your playbook.
Speaker 3 (49:39):
I heard somebody say mm-hmm in the room.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Thing you can do is give a man your playbook,
because that's how he can playyou.
You walk in saying I want this,I expect this, and you're going
to do this.
You're giving him a playbook.
No, you sit back and see whathe does.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
How he moves In terms of expectations.
I have learned, when I come inexpecting all this, that I get
disappointed.
Speaker 1 (50:05):
Expecting.
What Is he showing you?
He does that, does he do thatout the gate, like just are you
coming in expecting it withouttelling him or you're just
assuming he's going to know?
I don't tell him anything butwhen you assume he's going to
know, I expect a certain levelof respect.
But you got to take respect andexpectations.
That's.
That's contradictory, becauseif you're coming in expecting
(50:25):
him to do all these things andhe don't know you from a can of
paint, you don't know where hecome from.
I'll give you a prime example.
First time Corey and I dated, hehad no idea he was supposed to
open my doors.
Walk on the right side of thestreet when a car slams on
brakes, throw your hand up.
Baby, even though you may notkeep me from going through that
windshield, it's the gesture.
When you walk with me, walkahead of me without behind you.
(50:47):
He didn't know these thingsbecause no one had taught him
this, and it bothered me becauseI had a father that was on a
walker and was still opening mymother's doors.
I remember my dad come snatchingme off a date as I'm walking
out, and the man got in the carand didn't open my door.
My father flew out that houseand said bring your ass in the
house.
You ain't going nowhere.
And, young man, until you learnmy daughter, don't touch no
(51:08):
doors, don't come back here.
That's how I grew up, so I hadto.
At first I got mad Like hedon't respect me, he don't
respect me.
And then it's like he don'tknow no better.
And then you know, when he'slike, well, I ain't never had a
woman demand that, I said, ohhoney then this is a new breed
(51:33):
over here, honey, because Idon't know who the hell you
dated before, but over him, overhim.
And now.
I don't touch no doves, becausehe had to learn.
He had to learn and you have torealize that jonas suma man
knows your love language.
He knows your respectboundaries.
You've got to let him show youwho he is and then, if you have
to redirect, teach like I always.
Baby, I'm not trying to changeyou, I'm just trying to teach
you how to love me.
I put it back on me.
(51:54):
I'm teaching you how to love me, that's it.
I'm not trying to change you,baby, I'm just teaching you how
to love me, and that makes it somuch easier for them to conform
.
But you can't expect a man todo everything inside your head.
These men are built different,honey.
You've got to train some ofthese Negroes and you've got to
be willing to if he's worth it.
Speaker 3 (52:11):
I think the teaching to that point that you're making
somebody giggling.
You said what Somebody giggling, I said, but I think it's fair,
we're going to pass the platelater.
That plate.
That ain't been in motion.
But I think what's good and Ifeel like to touch on this
because I don't want to losewhat you're saying is so
(52:33):
powerful is the fact that, evenin relationships, both sides are
going to be taught.
There's going to be learningthroughout the entire, however
long y'all.
Speaker 1 (52:43):
Unless you're going to stay the exact same person
for the rest of your life.
Speaker 3 (52:46):
We change daily, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (52:47):
How do you?
Speaker 2 (52:48):
answer that into a conversation though.
Speaker 1 (52:49):
What's that?
Speaker 2 (52:50):
Like the door opening , for instance.
That's just a simple.
Speaker 1 (52:53):
If he doesn't do it, you just say, baby, I know you
may not realize this about me,but you know I'm kind of a girl.
Could you open my doors for me?
It just makes me feel specialtoo.
That ain't the man for you.
I got thugs who, straight drugdealers, opened my door.
(53:13):
That ain't had no home training.
It's how you say it.
I mean, it's the age old cliche.
It's not what you say, it's howyou say it.
And you have to learn your man'slove language.
You have to get to know him.
You can't come in with allthese expectations because
you're going to be disappointed.
End of discussion.
This man is a piece of clay.
When he comes to you, there'ssomething about him that's
(53:34):
attracted to you is the color,the shape, what you can do with
it.
And then you have to understand.
You've got to mold him, baby.
You can't expect him to know.
He can't read your mind, hecan't know what you expect or
want.
But you have to teach him ifhe's worth it.
You know, if you use your gutand you use your women's
intuition, if this man issomeone that's teachable,
learnable that he wants to proveto you that I can be everything
(53:55):
you need me to be baby, or he'sthat butthole that just is in
here for a purpose that don'tserve you, you'll know.
But you can't come in becauseyou're going to get disappointed
With expectations you're goingto get.
Let him show you who he is lethim show you who he is.
Speaker 2 (54:11):
You put a time frame on it.
Yes, see, that's the thing, theexpectations and the the trust,
because a lot I mean for me.
These are certain things thatyou expect automatically because
this is what you're accustomedto.
And then just the idea,especially when you get older,
you're like you don't know howto do.
You don't know how to do that,so then automatically it's how
you say it.
Yeah, it's like you interpret itas disrespect, but they really
don't know.
So then that puts a differentspin on it, because in my mind I
(54:34):
just lower what I would sayexpectations in terms of what to
expect, and then then I justyou have to understand your deal
breaker chanel.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
What are your deal breakers?
Was it a deal breaker that myman didn't open my door, kind of
well, but then I was like well,now I'm being petty okay you
know, okay.
Well, because, because I know me, I'm so used to be by myself,
I'm reaching for the door.
I have to literally catchmyself sometimes when I'm out
with court because I'll reachthe door and he'll go.
I'm like my bad, my bad, my bad, you know I'm saying.
(55:03):
But you know, I like a man thattakes control and reminds me of
the demand I gave him yes,check me, baby.
But no, but it's how you do it,just like I had an instance.
One time I was with a guy and wehad a flat tire.
We were in Maryland and I knowhow to change a tire.
My daddy taught me how tochange a tire when I was 11.
Okay, and he said, oh, shoot, Ifeel embarrassed.
(55:25):
He was embarrassed because hedid not know how to change,
because I said, well, baby, yougot to spare.
You know whatever.
He said, I don't know how to.
I said, oh, you don't know.
I said, baby, you know I gotAAA, baby.
I did that to protect his pridewhen I could have easily gotten
out and changed that dang tireor walked him through it.
But I had to learn that becausethe old me was like you can't
change, I got this Now I done.
(55:47):
Made this man's pride, justshrink His ego, just shrink.
Speaker 3 (55:50):
But even if you were to walk him through it, it's
still powerful that for one yourecognized it, but for two again
to your point how you wentabout doing it, it's how you do
it.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You got to stand.
These men's egos are fragile.
They're black men.
They're out there in thesestreets being belittled and
beaten down every day, andbeaten down every day.
When they come home they needto feel like a king.
Now don't get me wrong.
Everybody don't deserve theirking treatment.
And that's where your women'sintuition and your gut instinct
and your pure common sense andself-worth come into play.
You know when a man is justfalling short because he's
(56:21):
beaten up and he needs you tocomfort him.
And you know when a dude isjust a butthole and doesn't know
how to treat you right.
You know and you gotta trustthat.
And I think that was the hardestthing for me, because I am a
nurturer and maternal by nature.
I realized I have babied andmothered a lot of men.
Yeah, I want to coddle you, mypoor baby, would you?
(56:43):
Would you?
Would you?
And I realized that handicappedthem, but it also made them
lose respect for me because theywere like, well, shoot, I can
do anything and she gonna kissmy boo-boo.
You gotta draw that boundary ofI'm your woman and I'm gonna
lift you up and breathe lifeinto you and make you feel like
a king, but you gotta act likeone first boo-boo, Real talk.
(57:05):
I ain't treating you like noking.
You acting like a pauper.
Speaker 3 (57:08):
That's so good.
So much jewelry, the collectionplate, as we talked about, I
feel like we done built a wholenother church.
We got some snickers, some girl.
We had all kind of commentaryin this room today.
Speaker 1 (57:26):
Get it live girl, my girls, be calling me.
Speaker 3 (57:28):
I want to make sure for me, because obviously y'all
know each other.
Speaker 1 (57:33):
I'll give you my number sugar, Just call me.
Speaker 3 (57:36):
I want to be able to take time to, because of
everything that you do just pourinto you.
I do think that it's been abeautiful conversation.
I don't have no skin in thegame, Obviously.
I'm just meeting you and havingthis lovely conversation, but
you have a brother in me.
Just want to extend my love foryou and appreciation for you as
(57:56):
a solid woman and your story andall that you've overcome and
the game that you've been ableto give, and I'm glad that you
know Chanel has you as a as afriend too, and I think it's,
you know, beautiful with yourrelationship.
Now, salute toute to my brother, and I just think it's
beautiful because a lot of thethings that you said, you know,
are so needed and it's sometimesthe conversations people don't
(58:19):
want to touch them becausethey're hard, and the fact that
you have the way that you viewit and how you can articulate
that was very, very refreshingfor me.
You know what I mean and thisis.
This was a really amazingconversation and enjoyed it from
the time you cut it on to thebreaks and everything else, but
(58:42):
I just you know, I think wedon't, we don't hear that enough
.
You know what I mean and, likeI said, it's important because I
don't know you, but I see you.
Thank you so.
Speaker 1 (58:52):
I want to make sure that you know that.
Speaker 3 (58:53):
You know what I'm saying.
So I'm going to do my part.
You know what I mean andtelling you that and you know,
thank, thank, whoever made thishappen.
You know Chanel as well, butI'm always blessed to be in the
room and to have this type ofdialogue.
So, thank you, queen, thank you, brother, have this type of
dialogue.
So thank you, queen, thank you,brother.
I don't know if you gotanything, but thank you, brother
.
We're going to close this thingman, relationships matter.
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