September 9, 2025 • 33 mins
I so enjoyed this conversation with Mayor Skip Henderson of Columbus, GA! This episode and the conclusion episode next week will dive deep into the bigger picture of homelessness and the many challenges that are so often connected with it (mental illness, substance abuse, etc.). We'll talk about the impact of homelessness on crime and the economy, the role of city government, the role of private citizens, and so much more!
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Episode Transcript
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Skip (00:00):
I personally think that the homelessness issue, because
it's so diverse and sowidespread It is a community
issue and it impacts everybodyin the community.
The entire community needs toget involved.
And I'll tell you, I've told mypastor too, I mean, there are
300 plus churches in Columbus,Georgia.
If we could get everybody on thesame page, all the clergy, all
(00:22):
the different religions, I don'tcare if you're Muslim, Jewish,
you know, Christian, whatever itis if you really are here to
serve God's children, theneverybody needs to work on that.
Phil Shuler (00:35):
HellO, and welcome to Renew, Restore, Rejoice, the
Safe House Ministries podcast,where we share stories of the
power of God to change livesthrough Safe House Ministries.
Safe House Ministries is basedout of Columbus, Georgia, and we
are a ministry that exists tolove and serve people who have
been affected by addiction,homelessness, and incarceration.
I'm your host, Phil Shuler, theDirector of Development for Safe
(00:57):
House Ministries here inColumbus, Georgia.
Safe House serves over 1, 100people each month as they
transition back into ourcommunity.
Safe House provides an abundanceof services including 213 beds
for homeless individuals andfamilies, case management for
obtaining job skills and longterm employment.
Over 300 hot meals every day,free clothing, and so much more.
(01:18):
One of the most incredibleservices that Safe House
provides is our free 9 12 monthintensive outpatient substance
abuse program, which is statelicensed, CARF accredited, and
has no wait list.
Almost 100 percent ofindividuals staying in our
shelters who follow our threephase program become fully
employed within a few months.
And 68 percent of individualswho stay at least one night with
(01:39):
us End up finding work andmoving into their own home.
Thank you for being with ustoday and listening to our
podcast.
We hope you enjoy this week'sepisode.
Man, I so enjoyed talking withMayor Skip Henderson in this
episode this week and part two,which will be next week.
It's gonna be a two partepisode.
these two episodes this week andnext week.
(02:00):
Are going to be some really,really good episodes to help
give you a better understandingof the big picture, the
complicated nature of reallywhat it takes to help people go
from being homeless to being intheir own homes.
The challenges of the jobs.
Force situation, the challengesof getting them some employment,
(02:23):
the challenges of affordablehousing and trying to find
affordable housing.
The challenges of dealing withmental health issues, dealing
with substance abuse issues.
So many things, how homelessnessaffects.
Crime and how it affects theeconomy in the city.
mayor Henderson really does agreat job of really explaining
(02:43):
the big picture so enjoy theseepisodes.
They are amazing and very, veryeducational.
Phil (02:51):
Hello and welcome to today's Safe House Ministries
podcast.
Today is gonna be a littledifferent than usual and I'm
really looking forward to today.
Today we have a special guest,mayor Skip Henderson, who is
with us.
So thank you for being here.
Skip (03:05):
Oh, Phil, my pleasure.
Appreciate it.
Appreciate the opportunity.
Phil (03:08):
So kicking off, I usually ask, uh, my guests, uh, if there
was one word that might bestdescribe you, what do you think
that word would be?
Skip (03:17):
Ooh.
Listen the older I get, the morethat word changes.
Uh, right now I think it'd bepatience because there's a lot
of great things going on in thecommunity, but there's a lot of
challenges.
And, uh, in order to collaboratewith the right people, you have
to be patient.
You have to be consistent.
And I think, I think my wifewould disagree with this when I
say patience, but I'll go withthat.
Phil (03:38):
That's a good word.
Uh, that's that's somethingthat, uh, is hard to learn
sometimes.
Skip (03:42):
Yeah, it is.
And, and you know, I I tell you,there's so many when you, I've
never been asked to come up withjust one word.
the other word I think that popsto mind is blessed.
You know, we just have beenKaren and I, uh, and our family
and, and the opportunity to workwith so many incredible people
in this community like yourself.
It's just, I, I try not to takethat for granted because not a
(04:03):
lot of people get thatopportunity.
Phil (04:04):
Yeah.
Amen.
The blessing of the Lord is awonderful thing.
Oh, man.
Yes.
And speaking of patience, uh,that's a perfect word because in
the, the work of ministry thatSafe House does, safe House
Ministries, just trying to helpdealing with people who are,
have been affected byhomelessness and addiction.
Patience is something that isgreatly required.
Skip (04:26):
Well, it is, and, and for a lot of reasons.
And there's one I think that mayeven be a lot of folks don't
think about.
But, um, but you know, you haveto be careful in how you react
to the issues because the, the,my impulse, probably yours, is
to just go fix it.
I, I've, I see this oneindividual, this one family.
Let's just go fix it.
And in reality, it doesn't workthat way.
(04:47):
You really have to be thoughtfuland you have to be methodical,
in my opinion, about puttingtogether a plan and finding the
right people who help toimplement that plan in order to
try to impact people who areunhoused in our community.
Phil (05:01):
Yeah.
There are several issues thatintertwine when you think about
homelessness, addiction,substance abuse issues, mental
health issues just so manythings that are so often all
tied together.
I would love to ask in yourpersonal life, what are the
experiences that you have hadthat really have shaped the way
(05:25):
you think about homelessness?
Skip (05:27):
Oh wow.
Yeah.
I think there's, it's not one,one thing I, I'll give you a
couple of answers, but the firstone is, is not really an an
instant or a period of time thatI've gone through.
I was raised in a militaryfamily, and so we were expected
to serve, right?
We were, we were, it, it'skinda, Calvin Smiley says often
that you know, service to othersis the rent you are due for
(05:51):
living this life, right?
Yeah.
God doesn't put us here just tokind of float through life.
You're supposed to try to returnsome of the goodness that comes
to you.
So I think, I think living in anenvironment, pardon me with, um,
my mom and my dad.
Growing up as a kid, we saw themwork to try to improve the lives
of other people.
So I think that has gone a longway towards shaping me.
(06:13):
But I think you and I weretalking just before we came on
my term as mayor started almostthe same time that COVID came
came across the, the pond andlanded in, uh, in the United
States.
And that was just a, that was areally interesting period to try
to lead anything, lead a family,lead a classroom, lead a church
(06:37):
or lead a city.
Phil (06:38):
Yeah, no doubt.
What are a couple of the keylessons maybe that you learned
through that challenging time?
Just about leadership or justhow to handle and navigate
leading people?
Skip (06:49):
Yeah.
You know, I think we all knowthat you, we've all heard you
can't please all the people allthe time.
And I think where people fallinto a real negative situation
is when they try you, you justcan't.
Phil (07:02):
Yeah.
Skip (07:03):
But I think one of the most critical aspects of any
leader is to listen.
I may not agree with you all thetime, but, um, I owe you the
respect of listening to yourthoughts.
And then once we gathered allthe information, then you have
to make the best availabledecision at that time.
And uh, and it's interestingbecause during that time period,
I, for example, I may have made,if it was just me and my family,
(07:26):
I may have made one decision.
But when you're making adecision that impacts over
205,000 people.
It changes your perspective alittle bit.
So much.
Yeah.
Phil (07:36):
Yeah.
I love that answer too.
Listening.
Uh, I was reading a biography ofWinston Churchill, and one of
the things that the authorpulled out was how he would go
even to the front lines of theNavy personnel and just ask them
questions and listen to themjust to get that, the
understanding.
Skip (07:54):
We, we used to call that leading by walking around, you
know?
Yeah.
Just walk through the halls ofthe, uh, of the organization
that you lead.
And, and I'm telling you, I,I'm, I'm a firm believer in that
everybody is, people say, areleaders born or they made?
I say yes, because everybody isborn with a capacity and a, an
obligation to lead.
(08:14):
Now, some work at cultivatingthat a little harder than others
do, but I mean, you if you're aparent, you're a leader, you
know?
Yeah.
And if, if you're a kindergartenteacher, you're a leader because
you are, you are helping toorder the steps.
Of those that are gonna fallbehind you.
Yeah.
And I, I love the, the, thequote that, uh, you know, we
(08:34):
need to be planting seeds fortrees under which we'll never
probably sit in their shade.
Yeah.
So
Phil (08:41):
That's so
Skip (08:42):
true.
It's, uh, it's, yeah, it's, it'skind of, it's, it's kind of an
interesting, interesting, uh,commitment to try to lead in
some fashion.
Phil (08:50):
Yeah.
So diving back into homelessnessI believe that the 2025 point in
time count was about 303.
I think that's right.
That which were recorded inshelters and out of shelters.
I know it's a challenge and.
There's no way to really be ableto find everybody in all the
hiding places.
(09:10):
Yeah.
So how much higher do you maybethink that the actual number
might be?
Well, and,
Skip (09:15):
and the short answer is, I don't know.
Yeah.
Uh, you know, because when, whenwe hear the numbers, uh, and
then when I drive through thecommunity in different areas I
see people on the streets,different people.
It's not like you see the samefolks transient from one section
of the community to the other.
But, but I'm told by, uh, onething that came outta the point
(09:36):
in time count this time is weare about equal with where we
were in 2016.
But that's not, that's notnecessarily a good thing because
we had actually reduced over athat period of time the number
of folks that we could identifyas being unhoused.
So it really means we've sort ofmade a bell curve and we're,
we're back up to where we were.
(09:57):
And I'll, I wanna mention, I.
So much respect for you, whatyou said coming in about how all
these, there's differentcomponents.
There's dots are connecting allthese different symptoms or
aspects of homelessness.
And I think that's one of thehardest thing to deal with.
'cause when you do what you doand what what I do and we're
(10:18):
trying to identify ways to helpas many people as possible get,
get shelter there areconstituencies in that group
that, that have unique issuesthat, um, cause them to perhaps
not want to change theircircumstances right now.
Yeah.
And uh, we go back to thatpatience thing.
(10:38):
You know, you just gotta beconsistent.
You gotta be patient, you gottacontinue to try to urge them
into a situation where they canfind the kinda resources.
Yeah.
And are willing to undertakethat at that first step.
Um.
It's, uh, yeah, it's, it's kindof a challenge.
Phil (10:54):
Yeah.
So I'm a thinker and I, and Ilove really kind of thinking
through things.
Um, and I would love to pose abigger or deeper question for
you to think about.
Obviously there's a great burdenupon a city, just a society to,
when it comes to homelessness,substance abuse, all of these
(11:16):
things, there are costs that aregoing to have to be paid however
you decide to either deal withit or not deal with it.
Jails, those cost money, guardscost money, uh, housing costs,
money, like so many think crime,the judicial system, there's,
there's money that's gonna haveto be paid.
Thinking about, I guess the, theway to approach the root issues
(11:41):
when it comes to homelessnessand addiction.
What do you feel like is therole specifically for city or
local government in reallytrying to address and just deal
with those kinds of things?
Skip (11:54):
Yeah, you know, it's, it is such a, it's such a hard
issue to kinda wrap your armsaround because as you just
pointed out, there are so manydifferent aspects and different
pieces of this, this challenge.
And, uh, you know, you, youtouched on a lot of things.
You touched on the mental,mental health.
You touched on, uh, substanceabuse drug dependency, uh,
(12:16):
crime.
Uh, all of those things have acost.
And I'll tell you now if, ifyour entire focus is on
enforcement, you're in a lot oftrouble because you can't just.
Take the attitude.
We'll, we'll build bigger jails.
One is the cost.
Yeah.
And the other is just not theright approach.
(12:37):
You know it, if you think aboutit being housing first, you
know, get'em.
Shelter.
I, I'll give you an example.
We've worked, uh, through ourMuskogee County prison.
Uh, we have a tremendous leaderthere uh, warden Walker and, um,
and, uh, he has, we are grad,he's graduated more prisoners
through programs in his facilitythan anybody else in the state
(13:01):
of Georgia.
Wow.
I went to a a graduation about amonth ago and there were 66 of
his inmates that either got acertificate in welding
janitorial services, GED,because we understand and he
gets it.
He understands that if whenthese men get out of his prison.
If they don't have access towork and a place to stay,
(13:24):
they're gonna end up right backthrough recidivism into his, in
his facility.
Yeah.
Phil (13:29):
Yeah.
Thinking about the, the, themoney piece you know, you're,
you're gonna spend money, itmight be on the back end, it
could be on the front end.
How do you feel aboutpreventative money?
Maybe just, do you, what do youfeel is the role of the city
maybe in, in helping just withinitiatives organizations who
are kind of trying to head itoff on the front end to help
(13:53):
those get off the streets intohousing, deal with their
addiction issues, get clean.
And maybe prevent them fromgoing back into the cycle of the
prison system and others.
Skip (14:02):
And I think the city's the government's responsibility is
to create partnerships withother organizations and
resources.
We do have a program that we areputting together where we're
identifying the funding sources,and we plan on launching it,
hopefully by the first of theyear.
And it will be a, uh, vehiclethat will have a police officer,
(14:25):
a licensed clinician a mentalhealth clinician and a
paramedic.
And so the hope is, is so manyof, of Indi, the individuals in
the jails and the jail's aholding facility, the jail's not
a penal institution.
So when somebody stays in there,200 days.
That's not good.
Um, but, uh, but if we, um, ifwe're able to, to identify some
(14:49):
of the individuals who are goingthrough a emotional or mental
distress or some type ofdisorder then we can respond
with that group and keep'em outof the jail.
That's not where they belong.
Phil (15:02):
Yeah.
They
Skip (15:02):
don't belong in general population in a jail.
So that is costing the citymoney.
We are, we are working on that.
I personally think that thehomelessness issue, because it's
so diverse and so widespreadgovernment can't do it.
Organizations like Home for Goodcan't do it.
It is a community issue and itimpacts everybody in the
(15:24):
community.
The entire community needs toget involved.
And I'll tell you, I've told mypastor too, I mean, there are
300 plus churches in Columbus,Georgia.
If we could get everybody on thesame page, all the clergy, all
the different religions, I don'tcare if you're Muslim, Jewish,
you know, Christian, whatever itis if you really are here to
serve God's children, theneverybody needs to work on that.
(15:48):
I mean, I, and, and a lot ofpeople think they're doing a, a,
a really kind thing for folksand you know, sometimes you step
back and you look at it andassess it very frankly.
And maybe there's a better thingthat, something else that could
be doing to try to help cure orfix some of these dependency
issues.
I, I saw a church, it wasletting an encampment live on
(16:08):
their, on their property and onthe surface.
That's, that's a good thing.
If you dig a little deeperthere, the, the folks in that
organization might even tell youthat they're unintentionally
enabling folks to continue tolive in an environment that is
not gonna improve unless we canput them together with some of
these resources.
Phil (16:27):
Yeah.
You bring up an interestingthought.
I think in Columbus, Georgia, I,and I feel certain that I could
say that I know there are a lotof people that have a heart that
want to help others.
There just really are.
And I think sometimes maybe wejust don't know the, the best
way to do that.
And, you can walk around thestreets or go in different
(16:49):
places of city and you can seehomeless people and there's no
way that I could go to my wifeand say, Hey, can I bring 10
fellas into the home and youjust make'em dinner tonight?
It's just not practical, right?
I mean, I got seven kids tobegin with, so I, we, I can't
add that many people in myhouse.
Or I can't just say, oh, hey,come stay in, you know, stay in
my house.
And, but what I could do just asa citizen and individual is
(17:11):
partner with an organizationlike Safe House Ministries, who,
who really is working ineffective structure and is
giving, showing great results ofhelping people.
I can say, you know what, maybeI can't bring'em in and feed
them, but I can give 15, 30bucks a month and be a partner
with a ministry like Safe Houseto help them.
And I think just from a businesspragmatic viewpoint, the results
(17:37):
are gonna be a lot more, a lotmore effective, you know, like
you mentioned.
Yeah.
You know, instead of, instead ofmaybe being an enabler or, or
just helping them one nightpartnering with a ministry that
can help them for more than onenight to, and it may take six
months, it may take 12 months,but getting them into that
program.
To deal with the root issuesthat are, have caused their
(17:59):
circumstances and then reallyhelping them to get out.
And the goal would be to helpthem to get on their feet and
stay that way.
Skip (18:06):
Oh, absolutely.
Absolutely.
And be a contributing member ofour, so our society, uh, you
know, I, I went, I guess abouttwo weeks ago, I rode, I rode
with our community policingunit.
And, uh, these are the onesthat, they don't have a specific
beat.
They just, they'll go intoneighborhoods.
They introduce themselves to thepeople that live in
neighborhoods, just creatingthat connection with police and
(18:30):
with citizen.
Uh, but they also respond or gocheck on known homeless
encampments.
And so we went and visited, Ithink three or four that day.
And one of'em had nobody there,but the others, we had a chance
to interact with the individualsthat were there.
And it was a, in, it was verymuch an eyeopening experience
for me.
(18:50):
I mean, I, I knew what Iexpected.
And so one gentleman, theycalled him up'cause he's sort of
the leader of that small group.
And he came up and I just Ijust, he kept looking at me and
he said, do I know you?
I said, I don't think so.
And he, but he finally, I I,somebody told him that I was the
mayor of Columbus and he was soapologetic for not having a
(19:12):
shirt on, not having shoes on.
I said, no, no, no, you're,you're, you're, you're, you're
good.
Don't worry about that.
But I use that as an opportunityto start engaging him in
conversation.
Phil (19:20):
Yeah.
Skip (19:21):
And I won't use his name, but, uh, but I, I told him, I
said, listen, you don't have toanswer me.
If I ask you a question, I'llgive you, I'll give you complete
license to tell me it's none ofmy business.
I said, but you, you don't seemlike you're exceptionally happy.
I said, would it, would you feelbetter in a, in a.
In a, a shelter or somewheretrying to get some treatment.
(19:43):
And he, he said, you know, I'mtired.
I think I would.
And so I said, well, this is thelady with home for good.
I said, you talked to her, she'sgonna get your information and
they'll get you to one of thesefacilities.
So I walked over to one of thepolice officers, I said, what do
you think the odds are?
'cause they were gonna wait tilltomorrow.
He said, I can't do it today.
He had to take care of his dogs.
He said, but I'll, I'll be heretomorrow.
(20:04):
And I asked the police officer,I said, what do you think the
odds are?
He said, probably less than 25%that he'll be back.
Well, flash forward the next dayhe came back and he's in Freedom
house.
Or, or he was, yeah.
And I felt like I, you know,it's football season scored the
winning touchdown on last secondplay.
Uh, but it's, it's, that's theobjective in my mind.
(20:26):
Yeah.
The objective is to makecontact, to treat'em, uh, the
individuals you're dealing with.
It.
Like the human being they are.
And then try to get them to viewdifferent options.
Yeah.
To take a lot of courage.
I mean, face it, if alcoholism,drug dependency, that's a
disease.
And so trying to get them to getinvolved in a situation where
(20:48):
they know they're gonna gothrough a lot of pain to get to
where they want to
Phil (20:52):
go.
Yeah.
Skip (20:53):
Um, but it was, it, it was an eyeopening experience because
then the other folks we saw atthe encampments, they were the
other end of the spectrum.
They we're good.
We're good.
I don't, we don't need anything.
Nope.
I've been here two years.
I just, we're good.
Yeah.
So, um, we got, we just gottakeep pushing.
The idea that there's anotherway.
Phil (21:13):
Yeah.
Skip (21:13):
And the only way you can do that, we go back to that
patience and consistency.
Phil (21:17):
So true.
And that's
Skip (21:18):
what has to happen.
Phil (21:18):
Yeah.
I, I find, as I, as I do thepodcast every week, the stories
that individuals share of theirjourney through homelessness,
dealing with addiction, so oftenit takes them coming to that one
fellow described it as fallingso far down to the, to rock
bottom that he found himself onthe rock at the bottom, which is
(21:42):
Jesus.
And the only way he could getback up.
And, you know, I just, thingsthat I've never slept out on the
ground a single night in mylife, ex, except for, unless I
was purposefully camping in thewoods or something.
Right.
And so there are things that Ithink most of us, we don't even
think about.
There was a fellow that shared.
One experience he had in themiddle of the night.
(22:03):
He was, had been in the woods, Ithink just homeless for about a
year.
And one night he hadn't eatenfor days and he said he was
starving.
So he left his tent to go, founda dumpster, dove in the
dumpster, got some donuts, thenate some of those donuts.
And he got back in the woods andhe said he couldn't find his
tent.
So he was just wandering lostand he was panicking a little
(22:24):
bit.
He said finally he found histent unzipped.
The door went in and he said hewas so tired, he just collapsed.
And a couple hours later in thewe hours of the morning, he
wakes up with fire ants all overhim because some of those donuts
had gotten on the ground and,and just getting bit.
And, and then he said he isrunning through the woods trying
to tear off his clothes.
Finally, he finds a gas stationand there was someone that was,
(22:46):
pressure washing or something.
And so he gets the hose and justhoses himself off.
But experiences like that, Imean, that's.
I, I don't even think aboutthings like that and what it
would be like living just withnothing.
Skip (23:00):
Well, and, and what, what's really, to me, what's
really sad about that is, is theodds are that this individual,
you're, you're describing hasbeen offered other options in
his mind, at least up to thatday.
The alternative has been easy,an easier choice for him.
And I talked I've got a friendof mine that owns a business and
(23:20):
he tells me about the folks.
He'll send me pictures that aretrying to get some shelter and,
um, here's, here's the otherpart of homelessness though,
that makes it so extremelydifficult in this particular
point in time.
That is the cost of housing hasgotten so outrageous.
I used to be able to go tosomebody on the street and say,
listen, I'll get you withsomebody right now who will get
(23:43):
you in some job training, whowill get you temporary housing,
and we'll get you a voucher andget you into an apartment.
Can't say that anymore.
The vouchers don't even reallycover the cost of the apartment.
When you figure that the averagetwo bedroom apartment in
Columbus is probably somewherearound 1200 bucks a month, these
people, if they're working, youknow, an hourly wage job at, at,
you know, McDonald's or, or oneof the fast food places they're
(24:06):
not gonna be able to affordthat.
So now you've got an even biggerchallenge because you can't
really, you can get them intothe shelters, but Right.
But now the stays are gonna belonger.
You know, we've talked abouttransitional housing.
The city could partner withorganizations to create an
environment where we offertransitional housing.
Well, right now.
Because of the cost to move intopermanent housing.
(24:27):
It's just a really, it's just areally difficult jump.
It's, at least from myperspective, the people I've
talked to, it seems a, a longerjump than it was just five years
ago.
Phil (24:39):
Yeah.
So you think affordable housingreally is one of the biggest
hurdles to, to making thattransition and helping people
to,
Skip (24:45):
I think when you get to that stage, it is, yeah.
You know, once you've acceptedthat I need a little bit of
help, I need some, I need to beable to develop some skills so
that I can get a job, I cansupport myself.
Because so many people in thiscommunity and communities across
the state of Georgia and evenacross the country, they're one
missed paycheck from beinghomeless.
Phil (25:05):
Yeah.
Skip (25:06):
Yeah.
And I, and they're not, andthey're not all these the
individuals that people talkabout living in tents in woods,
uh, there was a guy that, uh,lived just in off in some woods
with his wife and child.
And he'd get up every morning,put on a shirt, he was going to
work, but he had been sick andhe'd missed a couple of weeks,
lost that income'cause it'shourly income.
(25:28):
And, um, he ended up, now thefire department saw him and met
him and got him into, uh, sometransitional housing.
So he was able to, able to findpermanent housing.
But it's so many times theydon't really even know what
their options are.
Phil (25:41):
Yeah, you're right.
And that, that's, uh, aninteresting consideration too.
A lot of times we think ofhomeless individuals just like
just a man by himself in thewoods, but there are families
that are going through reallyhard times.
Skip (25:55):
Pat Frey, uh, with Home For Good, indicated that the
biggest jump in people this lastpoint in time ca count was, uh,
women with children.
Yeah.
So there were more kids.
That are finding themselves aspart of a family that doesn't
have permanent housing.
Phil (26:13):
Yeah.
And one of the things that isunique that I really appreciate
about Safe House Ministries is,um, most shelters are either
kind of a women's shelter or amen's shelter.
And with the women's shelter,you can have kids up to a
certain age, but boys can't bebeyond a certain age.
But one of the things that SafeHouse Ministries is able to
offer is apartments for familiesthat the family can actually
(26:36):
stay together going through thattime of, of transition, which is
hard enough on its own, letalone to think if you had to go
through that, if split yourfamily up.
Skip (26:44):
Yeah.
You know, and, and I always tellpeople it sounds heartless, but
I urge'em, and I, I don't givefolks that are homeless or out
asking for funds.
I, I don't give them money, butI'll put'em in a car and take'em
and give'em something to eat,and then I'll give'em the number
for 2 1 1.
I said, there are shelters outthere.
You call this number, it's notgonna solve every issue that
(27:06):
you've got, but it will get youout of the cold.
It'll get you out of this heat.
Yeah.
Uh, and um, and, and that's,that's, that's sometimes hard to
do because if, unfortunately, ifthere, if they're suffering from
addiction, and it is, it is asufferance it's too easy for
them to stay in that lane if yougive them money.
Yeah.
So I, and this is a personalviewpoint, this is not, this is
(27:30):
not necessarily supported bySafe House.
I know, but, uh, but I, I, Ijust feel like the value of
giving them money for a meal orI've, I've taken people to
shelters.
Uh, there was a, uh, a privateshelter years ago that they, for
$8 a night, they would let themstay.
And so I, we, young lady, we sawon Second Avenue, my wife was
(27:52):
with me, we took her down, gother something to eat, and then
took her to that shelter.
Wow.
It's, but.
Going back to your intro whenyou talked about how many people
in Columbus look foropportunities to help people
like that, I just think theyjust don't necessarily know the
best way to do it.
Phil (28:07):
Yeah.
Which I, I really do believe, Imean, obviously I'm biased
because I work in the ministryof Safe House Ministries, but,
um, but I think partnering withan organization like Safe House
and just being a monthly partnerfinancially is one of the most
effective ways.
The Safe House ministry's budgetsince, probably since, I don't
(28:28):
know if, if post COVID is a termthat could be said, but if you,
if you can say it, post COVID,our, the ministry budget has
just grown, almost tripled.
Doubled for sure.
In closer approaching tripling,just with the.
The burden.
I mean, there were, there wereorganizations that were just
(28:49):
meeting various needs and someof those organizations had to
discontinue services or maybeeven fold up entirely.
And, and just, so it seems likethe, the burden is growing.
But you mentioned 2 1 1 and Ithink, um, that's a great system
of entry to help.
But with that good system,obviously there's more that's
(29:10):
getting funneled efficiently tothe, the places like Safe House
that can help them, but it'staxing the resource.
It's just taxing the limits ofability.
Skip (29:18):
Well, I think and we know this just from talking to
organizations like Safe Houseand, and the, uh, salvation Army
and Valley rescue and home forGood, that these shelters are
busting at the seams.
Uh, there, there seems to bemore people, maybe trying to get
off the streets than there wereyears ago.
(29:40):
Because I, I know anecdotallythe, the individuals like
yourself that we speak with,talk of, um, talk of a bigger
challenge.
Phil (29:49):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, thinking about the, theresults that have been able to
been, to be accomplished of thepast 18 months, safe House
Ministries have been able tohelp almost 300 people go from
being on the streets to nowbeing in their, their own
housing.
That's a big number, but there'sstill so many more.
Skip (30:08):
There are.
And, uh, and I think that, um,one of the things we have, have,
I believe we need to do is weneed to update our resource, our
resources in our toolbox, right?
So, I think I've talked withsome individuals with United Way
and some others, and they're.
Kinda reconvening.
Uh, years ago, about 10 yearsago, there was a, uh, 10 year
(30:32):
plan to end homelessness.
Well, we knew that was agrandiose plan and it was very
likely to fail if that was yourtrue goal, but it really wasn't.
The idea was just to get peoplefocused on Yeah.
On the, on the issue.
And I, I, right now, there's anorganization of folks that are
pulling together and have a verysmall working task force, and
(30:52):
then they have sort of ancillarygroups that are feeding into
these individuals and givingthem some, uh, real life stories
of what's going on in thecommunity.
So I think as, as you pointedout, whether it's post COVID or
whether it's just a shift in theeconomy, a lack of affordable
housing the scope and the shapeof the issue has changed, and I
(31:15):
think it makes really good senseto go back and reevaluate and
see, all right, are we stilldoing the things that are making
positive change?
300 people, getting them intohousing is incredible.
The scary thing is there's stilla lot of people out.
There's a lot, a lot of vouchersthat are available through these
organizations through the CHAColumbus Housing Authority with
(31:36):
these individuals andorganizations being the conduit,
there's so many availablebecause there's, it's not enough
to, to take care of the cost ofthe housing.
Yeah.
So, but it, it's all connected.
We, we, we haven't talked aboutjobs, we haven't talked about
some of the training.
We haven't talked abouteducation.
We haven't talked aboutdelinquency.
We, all of those things feedinto this because if you don't,
(31:57):
if you don't develop, if youdon't develop the skills that
are gonna put you in a positionwhere you can be employed then
it's gonna be really hard.
Thank you for being here with usthis week.
It's been so great.
Talking with Skip.
Next week is gonna be just asgood if not even better.
We're gonna talk about someadditional things.
We're gonna dive deeper intomental health and the challenges
there.
We're gonna talk more aboutcrime.
(32:18):
We're gonna talk about somethings that business owners are
doing that are just really,really helpful and good, and so
much more.
We look forward to being backwith you again next week.
If you liked this podcast, ifyou thought it was helpful,
insightful, please share it withothers.
Please give us a five starreview on whatever platform
(32:39):
you're listening to this podcaston.
Maybe even write some positivecomments.
We would love to hear what youthink.
Thanks again for being with usand have a great week.
Phil Shuler (32:47):
We look forward to being with you again next week
as we share another testimonyabout the power and the goodness
of God to change lives throughSafe House Ministries.
if you are someone listening tothis podcast that loves to hear
these stories of the greatthings that God is doing in
changing people's lives for thebetter, and if you would like to
be a part of that work, pleasereach out to us You can reach us
(33:10):
at 2101 Hamilton Road, Columbus,Georgia, 31,904.
You can call us at seven oh sixthree two two.
3 7, 7 3, or you can email us atinfo@safehouse-ministries.com.
Microphone (Samson Q2U Mi (33:26):
Thank you so much for being with us
this week for the renew restoreand rejoice podcast of safe
house ministries, we pray thatGod will bless you this week.
And we look forward to havingyou back with us again next week
for a new episode.
I personally think that the homelessness issue, because
it's so diverse and sowidespread It is a community
issue and it impacts everybodyin the community.
The entire community needs toget involved.
And I'll tell you, I've told mypastor too, I mean, there are
300 plus churches in Columbus,Georgia.
If we could get everybody on thesame page, all the clergy, all
(00:22):
the different religions, I don'tcare if you're Muslim, Jewish,
you know, Christian, whatever itis if you really are here to
serve God's children, theneverybody needs to work on that.
Phil Shuler (00:35):
HellO, and welcome to Renew, Restore, Rejoice, the
Safe House Ministries podcast,where we share stories of the
power of God to change livesthrough Safe House Ministries.
Safe House Ministries is basedout of Columbus, Georgia, and we
are a ministry that exists tolove and serve people who have
been affected by addiction,homelessness, and incarceration.
I'm your host, Phil Shuler, theDirector of Development for Safe
(00:57):
House Ministries here inColumbus, Georgia.
Safe House serves over 1, 100people each month as they
transition back into ourcommunity.
Safe House provides an abundanceof services including 213 beds
for homeless individuals andfamilies, case management for
obtaining job skills and longterm employment.
Over 300 hot meals every day,free clothing, and so much more.
(01:18):
One of the most incredibleservices that Safe House
provides is our free 9 12 monthintensive outpatient substance
abuse program, which is statelicensed, CARF accredited, and
has no wait list.
Almost 100 percent ofindividuals staying in our
shelters who follow our threephase program become fully
employed within a few months.
And 68 percent of individualswho stay at least one night with
(01:39):
us End up finding work andmoving into their own home.
Thank you for being with ustoday and listening to our
podcast.
We hope you enjoy this week'sepisode.
Man, I so enjoyed talking withMayor Skip Henderson in this
episode this week and part two,which will be next week.
It's gonna be a two partepisode.
these two episodes this week andnext week.
(02:00):
Are going to be some really,really good episodes to help
give you a better understandingof the big picture, the
complicated nature of reallywhat it takes to help people go
from being homeless to being intheir own homes.
The challenges of the jobs.
Force situation, the challengesof getting them some employment,
(02:23):
the challenges of affordablehousing and trying to find
affordable housing.
The challenges of dealing withmental health issues, dealing
with substance abuse issues.
So many things, how homelessnessaffects.
Crime and how it affects theeconomy in the city.
mayor Henderson really does agreat job of really explaining
(02:43):
the big picture so enjoy theseepisodes.
They are amazing and very, veryeducational.
Phil (02:51):
Hello and welcome to today's Safe House Ministries
podcast.
Today is gonna be a littledifferent than usual and I'm
really looking forward to today.
Today we have a special guest,mayor Skip Henderson, who is
with us.
So thank you for being here.
Skip (03:05):
Oh, Phil, my pleasure.
Appreciate it.
Appreciate the opportunity.
Phil (03:08):
So kicking off, I usually ask, uh, my guests, uh, if there
was one word that might bestdescribe you, what do you think
that word would be?
Skip (03:17):
Ooh.
Listen the older I get, the morethat word changes.
Uh, right now I think it'd bepatience because there's a lot
of great things going on in thecommunity, but there's a lot of
challenges.
And, uh, in order to collaboratewith the right people, you have
to be patient.
You have to be consistent.
And I think, I think my wifewould disagree with this when I
say patience, but I'll go withthat.
Phil (03:38):
That's a good word.
Uh, that's that's somethingthat, uh, is hard to learn
sometimes.
Skip (03:42):
Yeah, it is.
And, and you know, I I tell you,there's so many when you, I've
never been asked to come up withjust one word.
the other word I think that popsto mind is blessed.
You know, we just have beenKaren and I, uh, and our family
and, and the opportunity to workwith so many incredible people
in this community like yourself.
It's just, I, I try not to takethat for granted because not a
(04:03):
lot of people get thatopportunity.
Phil (04:04):
Yeah.
Amen.
The blessing of the Lord is awonderful thing.
Oh, man.
Yes.
And speaking of patience, uh,that's a perfect word because in
the, the work of ministry thatSafe House does, safe House
Ministries, just trying to helpdealing with people who are,
have been affected byhomelessness and addiction.
Patience is something that isgreatly required.
Skip (04:26):
Well, it is, and, and for a lot of reasons.
And there's one I think that mayeven be a lot of folks don't
think about.
But, um, but you know, you haveto be careful in how you react
to the issues because the, the,my impulse, probably yours, is
to just go fix it.
I, I've, I see this oneindividual, this one family.
Let's just go fix it.
And in reality, it doesn't workthat way.
(04:47):
You really have to be thoughtfuland you have to be methodical,
in my opinion, about puttingtogether a plan and finding the
right people who help toimplement that plan in order to
try to impact people who areunhoused in our community.
Phil (05:01):
Yeah.
There are several issues thatintertwine when you think about
homelessness, addiction,substance abuse issues, mental
health issues just so manythings that are so often all
tied together.
I would love to ask in yourpersonal life, what are the
experiences that you have hadthat really have shaped the way
(05:25):
you think about homelessness?
Skip (05:27):
Oh wow.
Yeah.
I think there's, it's not one,one thing I, I'll give you a
couple of answers, but the firstone is, is not really an an
instant or a period of time thatI've gone through.
I was raised in a militaryfamily, and so we were expected
to serve, right?
We were, we were, it, it'skinda, Calvin Smiley says often
that you know, service to othersis the rent you are due for
(05:51):
living this life, right?
Yeah.
God doesn't put us here just tokind of float through life.
You're supposed to try to returnsome of the goodness that comes
to you.
So I think, I think living in anenvironment, pardon me with, um,
my mom and my dad.
Growing up as a kid, we saw themwork to try to improve the lives
of other people.
So I think that has gone a longway towards shaping me.
(06:13):
But I think you and I weretalking just before we came on
my term as mayor started almostthe same time that COVID came
came across the, the pond andlanded in, uh, in the United
States.
And that was just a, that was areally interesting period to try
to lead anything, lead a family,lead a classroom, lead a church
(06:37):
or lead a city.
Phil (06:38):
Yeah, no doubt.
What are a couple of the keylessons maybe that you learned
through that challenging time?
Just about leadership or justhow to handle and navigate
leading people?
Skip (06:49):
Yeah.
You know, I think we all knowthat you, we've all heard you
can't please all the people allthe time.
And I think where people fallinto a real negative situation
is when they try you, you justcan't.
Phil (07:02):
Yeah.
Skip (07:03):
But I think one of the most critical aspects of any
leader is to listen.
I may not agree with you all thetime, but, um, I owe you the
respect of listening to yourthoughts.
And then once we gathered allthe information, then you have
to make the best availabledecision at that time.
And uh, and it's interestingbecause during that time period,
I, for example, I may have made,if it was just me and my family,
(07:26):
I may have made one decision.
But when you're making adecision that impacts over
205,000 people.
It changes your perspective alittle bit.
So much.
Yeah.
Phil (07:36):
Yeah.
I love that answer too.
Listening.
Uh, I was reading a biography ofWinston Churchill, and one of
the things that the authorpulled out was how he would go
even to the front lines of theNavy personnel and just ask them
questions and listen to themjust to get that, the
understanding.
Skip (07:54):
We, we used to call that leading by walking around, you
know?
Yeah.
Just walk through the halls ofthe, uh, of the organization
that you lead.
And, and I'm telling you, I,I'm, I'm a firm believer in that
everybody is, people say, areleaders born or they made?
I say yes, because everybody isborn with a capacity and a, an
obligation to lead.
(08:14):
Now, some work at cultivatingthat a little harder than others
do, but I mean, you if you're aparent, you're a leader, you
know?
Yeah.
And if, if you're a kindergartenteacher, you're a leader because
you are, you are helping toorder the steps.
Of those that are gonna fallbehind you.
Yeah.
And I, I love the, the, thequote that, uh, you know, we
(08:34):
need to be planting seeds fortrees under which we'll never
probably sit in their shade.
Yeah.
So
Phil (08:41):
That's so
Skip (08:42):
true.
It's, uh, it's, yeah, it's, it'skind of, it's, it's kind of an
interesting, interesting, uh,commitment to try to lead in
some fashion.
Phil (08:50):
Yeah.
So diving back into homelessnessI believe that the 2025 point in
time count was about 303.
I think that's right.
That which were recorded inshelters and out of shelters.
I know it's a challenge and.
There's no way to really be ableto find everybody in all the
hiding places.
(09:10):
Yeah.
So how much higher do you maybethink that the actual number
might be?
Well, and,
Skip (09:15):
and the short answer is, I don't know.
Yeah.
Uh, you know, because when, whenwe hear the numbers, uh, and
then when I drive through thecommunity in different areas I
see people on the streets,different people.
It's not like you see the samefolks transient from one section
of the community to the other.
But, but I'm told by, uh, onething that came outta the point
(09:36):
in time count this time is weare about equal with where we
were in 2016.
But that's not, that's notnecessarily a good thing because
we had actually reduced over athat period of time the number
of folks that we could identifyas being unhoused.
So it really means we've sort ofmade a bell curve and we're,
we're back up to where we were.
(09:57):
And I'll, I wanna mention, I.
So much respect for you, whatyou said coming in about how all
these, there's differentcomponents.
There's dots are connecting allthese different symptoms or
aspects of homelessness.
And I think that's one of thehardest thing to deal with.
'cause when you do what you doand what what I do and we're
(10:18):
trying to identify ways to helpas many people as possible get,
get shelter there areconstituencies in that group
that, that have unique issuesthat, um, cause them to perhaps
not want to change theircircumstances right now.
Yeah.
And uh, we go back to thatpatience thing.
(10:38):
You know, you just gotta beconsistent.
You gotta be patient, you gottacontinue to try to urge them
into a situation where they canfind the kinda resources.
Yeah.
And are willing to undertakethat at that first step.
Um.
It's, uh, yeah, it's, it's kindof a challenge.
Phil (10:54):
Yeah.
So I'm a thinker and I, and Ilove really kind of thinking
through things.
Um, and I would love to pose abigger or deeper question for
you to think about.
Obviously there's a great burdenupon a city, just a society to,
when it comes to homelessness,substance abuse, all of these
(11:16):
things, there are costs that aregoing to have to be paid however
you decide to either deal withit or not deal with it.
Jails, those cost money, guardscost money, uh, housing costs,
money, like so many think crime,the judicial system, there's,
there's money that's gonna haveto be paid.
Thinking about, I guess the, theway to approach the root issues
(11:41):
when it comes to homelessnessand addiction.
What do you feel like is therole specifically for city or
local government in reallytrying to address and just deal
with those kinds of things?
Skip (11:54):
Yeah, you know, it's, it is such a, it's such a hard
issue to kinda wrap your armsaround because as you just
pointed out, there are so manydifferent aspects and different
pieces of this, this challenge.
And, uh, you know, you, youtouched on a lot of things.
You touched on the mental,mental health.
You touched on, uh, substanceabuse drug dependency, uh,
(12:16):
crime.
Uh, all of those things have acost.
And I'll tell you now if, ifyour entire focus is on
enforcement, you're in a lot oftrouble because you can't just.
Take the attitude.
We'll, we'll build bigger jails.
One is the cost.
Yeah.
And the other is just not theright approach.
(12:37):
You know it, if you think aboutit being housing first, you
know, get'em.
Shelter.
I, I'll give you an example.
We've worked, uh, through ourMuskogee County prison.
Uh, we have a tremendous leaderthere uh, warden Walker and, um,
and, uh, he has, we are grad,he's graduated more prisoners
through programs in his facilitythan anybody else in the state
(13:01):
of Georgia.
Wow.
I went to a a graduation about amonth ago and there were 66 of
his inmates that either got acertificate in welding
janitorial services, GED,because we understand and he
gets it.
He understands that if whenthese men get out of his prison.
If they don't have access towork and a place to stay,
(13:24):
they're gonna end up right backthrough recidivism into his, in
his facility.
Yeah.
Phil (13:29):
Yeah.
Thinking about the, the, themoney piece you know, you're,
you're gonna spend money, itmight be on the back end, it
could be on the front end.
How do you feel aboutpreventative money?
Maybe just, do you, what do youfeel is the role of the city
maybe in, in helping just withinitiatives organizations who
are kind of trying to head itoff on the front end to help
(13:53):
those get off the streets intohousing, deal with their
addiction issues, get clean.
And maybe prevent them fromgoing back into the cycle of the
prison system and others.
Skip (14:02):
And I think the city's the government's responsibility is
to create partnerships withother organizations and
resources.
We do have a program that we areputting together where we're
identifying the funding sources,and we plan on launching it,
hopefully by the first of theyear.
And it will be a, uh, vehiclethat will have a police officer,
(14:25):
a licensed clinician a mentalhealth clinician and a
paramedic.
And so the hope is, is so manyof, of Indi, the individuals in
the jails and the jail's aholding facility, the jail's not
a penal institution.
So when somebody stays in there,200 days.
That's not good.
Um, but, uh, but if we, um, ifwe're able to, to identify some
(14:49):
of the individuals who are goingthrough a emotional or mental
distress or some type ofdisorder then we can respond
with that group and keep'em outof the jail.
That's not where they belong.
Phil (15:02):
Yeah.
They
Skip (15:02):
don't belong in general population in a jail.
So that is costing the citymoney.
We are, we are working on that.
I personally think that thehomelessness issue, because it's
so diverse and so widespreadgovernment can't do it.
Organizations like Home for Goodcan't do it.
It is a community issue and itimpacts everybody in the
(15:24):
community.
The entire community needs toget involved.
And I'll tell you, I've told mypastor too, I mean, there are
300 plus churches in Columbus,Georgia.
If we could get everybody on thesame page, all the clergy, all
the different religions, I don'tcare if you're Muslim, Jewish,
you know, Christian, whatever itis if you really are here to
serve God's children, theneverybody needs to work on that.
(15:48):
I mean, I, and, and a lot ofpeople think they're doing a, a,
a really kind thing for folksand you know, sometimes you step
back and you look at it andassess it very frankly.
And maybe there's a better thingthat, something else that could
be doing to try to help cure orfix some of these dependency
issues.
I, I saw a church, it wasletting an encampment live on
(16:08):
their, on their property and onthe surface.
That's, that's a good thing.
If you dig a little deeperthere, the, the folks in that
organization might even tell youthat they're unintentionally
enabling folks to continue tolive in an environment that is
not gonna improve unless we canput them together with some of
these resources.
Phil (16:27):
Yeah.
You bring up an interestingthought.
I think in Columbus, Georgia, I,and I feel certain that I could
say that I know there are a lotof people that have a heart that
want to help others.
There just really are.
And I think sometimes maybe wejust don't know the, the best
way to do that.
And, you can walk around thestreets or go in different
(16:49):
places of city and you can seehomeless people and there's no
way that I could go to my wifeand say, Hey, can I bring 10
fellas into the home and youjust make'em dinner tonight?
It's just not practical, right?
I mean, I got seven kids tobegin with, so I, we, I can't
add that many people in myhouse.
Or I can't just say, oh, hey,come stay in, you know, stay in
my house.
And, but what I could do just asa citizen and individual is
(17:11):
partner with an organizationlike Safe House Ministries, who,
who really is working ineffective structure and is
giving, showing great results ofhelping people.
I can say, you know what, maybeI can't bring'em in and feed
them, but I can give 15, 30bucks a month and be a partner
with a ministry like Safe Houseto help them.
And I think just from a businesspragmatic viewpoint, the results
(17:37):
are gonna be a lot more, a lotmore effective, you know, like
you mentioned.
Yeah.
You know, instead of, instead ofmaybe being an enabler or, or
just helping them one nightpartnering with a ministry that
can help them for more than onenight to, and it may take six
months, it may take 12 months,but getting them into that
program.
To deal with the root issuesthat are, have caused their
(17:59):
circumstances and then reallyhelping them to get out.
And the goal would be to helpthem to get on their feet and
stay that way.
Skip (18:06):
Oh, absolutely.
Absolutely.
And be a contributing member ofour, so our society, uh, you
know, I, I went, I guess abouttwo weeks ago, I rode, I rode
with our community policingunit.
And, uh, these are the onesthat, they don't have a specific
beat.
They just, they'll go intoneighborhoods.
They introduce themselves to thepeople that live in
neighborhoods, just creatingthat connection with police and
(18:30):
with citizen.
Uh, but they also respond or gocheck on known homeless
encampments.
And so we went and visited, Ithink three or four that day.
And one of'em had nobody there,but the others, we had a chance
to interact with the individualsthat were there.
And it was a, in, it was verymuch an eyeopening experience
for me.
(18:50):
I mean, I, I knew what Iexpected.
And so one gentleman, theycalled him up'cause he's sort of
the leader of that small group.
And he came up and I just Ijust, he kept looking at me and
he said, do I know you?
I said, I don't think so.
And he, but he finally, I I,somebody told him that I was the
mayor of Columbus and he was soapologetic for not having a
(19:12):
shirt on, not having shoes on.
I said, no, no, no, you're,you're, you're, you're, you're
good.
Don't worry about that.
But I use that as an opportunityto start engaging him in
conversation.
Phil (19:20):
Yeah.
Skip (19:21):
And I won't use his name, but, uh, but I, I told him, I
said, listen, you don't have toanswer me.
If I ask you a question, I'llgive you, I'll give you complete
license to tell me it's none ofmy business.
I said, but you, you don't seemlike you're exceptionally happy.
I said, would it, would you feelbetter in a, in a.
In a, a shelter or somewheretrying to get some treatment.
(19:43):
And he, he said, you know, I'mtired.
I think I would.
And so I said, well, this is thelady with home for good.
I said, you talked to her, she'sgonna get your information and
they'll get you to one of thesefacilities.
So I walked over to one of thepolice officers, I said, what do
you think the odds are?
'cause they were gonna wait tilltomorrow.
He said, I can't do it today.
He had to take care of his dogs.
He said, but I'll, I'll be heretomorrow.
(20:04):
And I asked the police officer,I said, what do you think the
odds are?
He said, probably less than 25%that he'll be back.
Well, flash forward the next dayhe came back and he's in Freedom
house.
Or, or he was, yeah.
And I felt like I, you know,it's football season scored the
winning touchdown on last secondplay.
Uh, but it's, it's, that's theobjective in my mind.
(20:26):
Yeah.
The objective is to makecontact, to treat'em, uh, the
individuals you're dealing with.
It.
Like the human being they are.
And then try to get them to viewdifferent options.
Yeah.
To take a lot of courage.
I mean, face it, if alcoholism,drug dependency, that's a
disease.
And so trying to get them to getinvolved in a situation where
(20:48):
they know they're gonna gothrough a lot of pain to get to
where they want to
Phil (20:52):
go.
Yeah.
Skip (20:53):
Um, but it was, it, it was an eyeopening experience because
then the other folks we saw atthe encampments, they were the
other end of the spectrum.
They we're good.
We're good.
I don't, we don't need anything.
Nope.
I've been here two years.
I just, we're good.
Yeah.
So, um, we got, we just gottakeep pushing.
The idea that there's anotherway.
Phil (21:13):
Yeah.
Skip (21:13):
And the only way you can do that, we go back to that
patience and consistency.
Phil (21:17):
So true.
And that's
Skip (21:18):
what has to happen.
Phil (21:18):
Yeah.
I, I find, as I, as I do thepodcast every week, the stories
that individuals share of theirjourney through homelessness,
dealing with addiction, so oftenit takes them coming to that one
fellow described it as fallingso far down to the, to rock
bottom that he found himself onthe rock at the bottom, which is
(21:42):
Jesus.
And the only way he could getback up.
And, you know, I just, thingsthat I've never slept out on the
ground a single night in mylife, ex, except for, unless I
was purposefully camping in thewoods or something.
Right.
And so there are things that Ithink most of us, we don't even
think about.
There was a fellow that shared.
One experience he had in themiddle of the night.
(22:03):
He was, had been in the woods, Ithink just homeless for about a
year.
And one night he hadn't eatenfor days and he said he was
starving.
So he left his tent to go, founda dumpster, dove in the
dumpster, got some donuts, thenate some of those donuts.
And he got back in the woods andhe said he couldn't find his
tent.
So he was just wandering lostand he was panicking a little
(22:24):
bit.
He said finally he found histent unzipped.
The door went in and he said hewas so tired, he just collapsed.
And a couple hours later in thewe hours of the morning, he
wakes up with fire ants all overhim because some of those donuts
had gotten on the ground and,and just getting bit.
And, and then he said he isrunning through the woods trying
to tear off his clothes.
Finally, he finds a gas stationand there was someone that was,
(22:46):
pressure washing or something.
And so he gets the hose and justhoses himself off.
But experiences like that, Imean, that's.
I, I don't even think aboutthings like that and what it
would be like living just withnothing.
Skip (23:00):
Well, and, and what, what's really, to me, what's
really sad about that is, is theodds are that this individual,
you're, you're describing hasbeen offered other options in
his mind, at least up to thatday.
The alternative has been easy,an easier choice for him.
And I talked I've got a friendof mine that owns a business and
(23:20):
he tells me about the folks.
He'll send me pictures that aretrying to get some shelter and,
um, here's, here's the otherpart of homelessness though,
that makes it so extremelydifficult in this particular
point in time.
That is the cost of housing hasgotten so outrageous.
I used to be able to go tosomebody on the street and say,
listen, I'll get you withsomebody right now who will get
(23:43):
you in some job training, whowill get you temporary housing,
and we'll get you a voucher andget you into an apartment.
Can't say that anymore.
The vouchers don't even reallycover the cost of the apartment.
When you figure that the averagetwo bedroom apartment in
Columbus is probably somewherearound 1200 bucks a month, these
people, if they're working, youknow, an hourly wage job at, at,
you know, McDonald's or, or oneof the fast food places they're
(24:06):
not gonna be able to affordthat.
So now you've got an even biggerchallenge because you can't
really, you can get them intothe shelters, but Right.
But now the stays are gonna belonger.
You know, we've talked abouttransitional housing.
The city could partner withorganizations to create an
environment where we offertransitional housing.
Well, right now.
Because of the cost to move intopermanent housing.
(24:27):
It's just a really, it's just areally difficult jump.
It's, at least from myperspective, the people I've
talked to, it seems a, a longerjump than it was just five years
ago.
Phil (24:39):
Yeah.
So you think affordable housingreally is one of the biggest
hurdles to, to making thattransition and helping people
to,
Skip (24:45):
I think when you get to that stage, it is, yeah.
You know, once you've acceptedthat I need a little bit of
help, I need some, I need to beable to develop some skills so
that I can get a job, I cansupport myself.
Because so many people in thiscommunity and communities across
the state of Georgia and evenacross the country, they're one
missed paycheck from beinghomeless.
Phil (25:05):
Yeah.
Skip (25:06):
Yeah.
And I, and they're not, andthey're not all these the
individuals that people talkabout living in tents in woods,
uh, there was a guy that, uh,lived just in off in some woods
with his wife and child.
And he'd get up every morning,put on a shirt, he was going to
work, but he had been sick andhe'd missed a couple of weeks,
lost that income'cause it'shourly income.
(25:28):
And, um, he ended up, now thefire department saw him and met
him and got him into, uh, sometransitional housing.
So he was able to, able to findpermanent housing.
But it's so many times theydon't really even know what
their options are.
Phil (25:41):
Yeah, you're right.
And that, that's, uh, aninteresting consideration too.
A lot of times we think ofhomeless individuals just like
just a man by himself in thewoods, but there are families
that are going through reallyhard times.
Skip (25:55):
Pat Frey, uh, with Home For Good, indicated that the
biggest jump in people this lastpoint in time ca count was, uh,
women with children.
Yeah.
So there were more kids.
That are finding themselves aspart of a family that doesn't
have permanent housing.
Phil (26:13):
Yeah.
And one of the things that isunique that I really appreciate
about Safe House Ministries is,um, most shelters are either
kind of a women's shelter or amen's shelter.
And with the women's shelter,you can have kids up to a
certain age, but boys can't bebeyond a certain age.
But one of the things that SafeHouse Ministries is able to
offer is apartments for familiesthat the family can actually
(26:36):
stay together going through thattime of, of transition, which is
hard enough on its own, letalone to think if you had to go
through that, if split yourfamily up.
Skip (26:44):
Yeah.
You know, and, and I always tellpeople it sounds heartless, but
I urge'em, and I, I don't givefolks that are homeless or out
asking for funds.
I, I don't give them money, butI'll put'em in a car and take'em
and give'em something to eat,and then I'll give'em the number
for 2 1 1.
I said, there are shelters outthere.
You call this number, it's notgonna solve every issue that
(27:06):
you've got, but it will get youout of the cold.
It'll get you out of this heat.
Yeah.
Uh, and um, and, and that's,that's, that's sometimes hard to
do because if, unfortunately, ifthere, if they're suffering from
addiction, and it is, it is asufferance it's too easy for
them to stay in that lane if yougive them money.
Yeah.
So I, and this is a personalviewpoint, this is not, this is
(27:30):
not necessarily supported bySafe House.
I know, but, uh, but I, I, Ijust feel like the value of
giving them money for a meal orI've, I've taken people to
shelters.
Uh, there was a, uh, a privateshelter years ago that they, for
$8 a night, they would let themstay.
And so I, we, young lady, we sawon Second Avenue, my wife was
(27:52):
with me, we took her down, gother something to eat, and then
took her to that shelter.
Wow.
It's, but.
Going back to your intro whenyou talked about how many people
in Columbus look foropportunities to help people
like that, I just think theyjust don't necessarily know the
best way to do it.
Phil (28:07):
Yeah.
Which I, I really do believe, Imean, obviously I'm biased
because I work in the ministryof Safe House Ministries, but,
um, but I think partnering withan organization like Safe House
and just being a monthly partnerfinancially is one of the most
effective ways.
The Safe House ministry's budgetsince, probably since, I don't
(28:28):
know if, if post COVID is a termthat could be said, but if you,
if you can say it, post COVID,our, the ministry budget has
just grown, almost tripled.
Doubled for sure.
In closer approaching tripling,just with the.
The burden.
I mean, there were, there wereorganizations that were just
(28:49):
meeting various needs and someof those organizations had to
discontinue services or maybeeven fold up entirely.
And, and just, so it seems likethe, the burden is growing.
But you mentioned 2 1 1 and Ithink, um, that's a great system
of entry to help.
But with that good system,obviously there's more that's
(29:10):
getting funneled efficiently tothe, the places like Safe House
that can help them, but it'staxing the resource.
It's just taxing the limits ofability.
Skip (29:18):
Well, I think and we know this just from talking to
organizations like Safe Houseand, and the, uh, salvation Army
and Valley rescue and home forGood, that these shelters are
busting at the seams.
Uh, there, there seems to bemore people, maybe trying to get
off the streets than there wereyears ago.
(29:40):
Because I, I know anecdotallythe, the individuals like
yourself that we speak with,talk of, um, talk of a bigger
challenge.
Phil (29:49):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, thinking about the, theresults that have been able to
been, to be accomplished of thepast 18 months, safe House
Ministries have been able tohelp almost 300 people go from
being on the streets to nowbeing in their, their own
housing.
That's a big number, but there'sstill so many more.
Skip (30:08):
There are.
And, uh, and I think that, um,one of the things we have, have,
I believe we need to do is weneed to update our resource, our
resources in our toolbox, right?
So, I think I've talked withsome individuals with United Way
and some others, and they're.
Kinda reconvening.
Uh, years ago, about 10 yearsago, there was a, uh, 10 year
(30:32):
plan to end homelessness.
Well, we knew that was agrandiose plan and it was very
likely to fail if that was yourtrue goal, but it really wasn't.
The idea was just to get peoplefocused on Yeah.
On the, on the issue.
And I, I, right now, there's anorganization of folks that are
pulling together and have a verysmall working task force, and
(30:52):
then they have sort of ancillarygroups that are feeding into
these individuals and givingthem some, uh, real life stories
of what's going on in thecommunity.
So I think as, as you pointedout, whether it's post COVID or
whether it's just a shift in theeconomy, a lack of affordable
housing the scope and the shapeof the issue has changed, and I
(31:15):
think it makes really good senseto go back and reevaluate and
see, all right, are we stilldoing the things that are making
positive change?
300 people, getting them intohousing is incredible.
The scary thing is there's stilla lot of people out.
There's a lot, a lot of vouchersthat are available through these
organizations through the CHAColumbus Housing Authority with
(31:36):
these individuals andorganizations being the conduit,
there's so many availablebecause there's, it's not enough
to, to take care of the cost ofthe housing.
Yeah.
So, but it, it's all connected.
We, we, we haven't talked aboutjobs, we haven't talked about
some of the training.
We haven't talked abouteducation.
We haven't talked aboutdelinquency.
We, all of those things feedinto this because if you don't,
(31:57):
if you don't develop, if youdon't develop the skills that
are gonna put you in a positionwhere you can be employed then
it's gonna be really hard.
Thank you for being here with usthis week.
It's been so great.
Talking with Skip.
Next week is gonna be just asgood if not even better.
We're gonna talk about someadditional things.
We're gonna dive deeper intomental health and the challenges
there.
We're gonna talk more aboutcrime.
(32:18):
We're gonna talk about somethings that business owners are
doing that are just really,really helpful and good, and so
much more.
We look forward to being backwith you again next week.
If you liked this podcast, ifyou thought it was helpful,
insightful, please share it withothers.
Please give us a five starreview on whatever platform
(32:39):
you're listening to this podcaston.
Maybe even write some positivecomments.
We would love to hear what youthink.
Thanks again for being with usand have a great week.
Phil Shuler (32:47):
We look forward to being with you again next week
as we share another testimonyabout the power and the goodness
of God to change lives throughSafe House Ministries.
if you are someone listening tothis podcast that loves to hear
these stories of the greatthings that God is doing in
changing people's lives for thebetter, and if you would like to
be a part of that work, pleasereach out to us You can reach us
(33:10):
at 2101 Hamilton Road, Columbus,Georgia, 31,904.
You can call us at seven oh sixthree two two.
3 7, 7 3, or you can email us atinfo@safehouse-ministries.com.
Microphone (Samson Q2U Mi (33:26):
Thank you so much for being with us
this week for the renew restoreand rejoice podcast of safe
house ministries, we pray thatGod will bless you this week.
And we look forward to havingyou back with us again next week
for a new episode.
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