July 20, 2023 • 44 mins
What is a service animal? What about an ESA? Or therapy dog? Learn the differences and the frustration and confusion that surrounds this issue- especially when people are seeking a dog to perform one of these duties.
Original music by Matt Setter and friend Sean!
Original content by Matt Setter and friend, Sean!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Hi, I'm Jme And I'm Pate.
And this is, oh wait.
We are Motley Zoo Animal Rescue,and this is our podcast Rescue
Chef.
We're a bit rusty because it'sbeen a few weeks since we've
recorded, so It's been aminute...
(00:22):
Although, I screw it up everytime, so there's really no
excuse for me.
Okay.
Today we are going to talkabout...
Controversy.
Yeah.
Service dogs and what reallythey are, what kinds of, I don't
(00:46):
know, jobs they do, andbasically a lot of
misunderstandings that peoplehave about them.
Right.
So it's basically like servicedog versus emotional support
animal, because a lot of peopleget.
Them confused and they feel thatthey can interchange those
titles.
And they're two totallydifferent types of dogs
(01:06):
actually.
I mean...
Well, and then we have therapydogs, which is a different kind
of dog so there's a lot ofconfusion when people tell us
that's what they want.
One we have to clarify, and two,we always try to steer them in
the right direction.
Right, But do they ever listen?
Mm.
I would say 99.9% of the timethey do not.
(01:30):
No, they don't.
Because they know better.
They know the best.
They do.
They know everything.
Especially the people on NextDoor.
Oh my God.
They know better than me.
They know better than and yeah,they like to argue.
Well, those statistics are notactually, or something about...
I think they get on next doorjust to argue.
They're like, I'm having ashitty day.
Yeah.
Let me get on next door andargue with my neighbor.
(01:52):
Like, why?
Well, and someone was like,those statistics, and I like,
she was basically saying heropinion was more valid than
statistics.
And I was like, block you.
Okay.
So what is a service dog?
An actual service dog?
An actual service dog is a dogthat performs tasks for a
(02:15):
certain disability per theAmerican Disabilities Act.
You are not allowed to ask aperson with a dog who says that
this is their service dog.
You're not allowed to ask themwhat their disability is and if
that is actually a service dog.
But what you can ask them iswhat tasks does that?
(02:42):
That was my throat.
No, my God.
I'm like, are you hungry?
No.
Yeah.
What tasks can that dog performfor you.
So this would be like a guidedog for the blind?
Yep.
It would be a dog that detectsseizures.
Yeah.
Seizure Alert dog.
It would be a mobilityCompanion.
(03:04):
Correct.
Those are the typical thingsthat you think of with a service
dog.
And, and then some other dogs,such as the seizure alert dog.
That person may not look quoteunquote disabled, but they can
have seizures and that dog canalert them.
The dog can use pressure whenthey're having a seizure, things
(03:28):
like that to help them.
You can also have diabetic alertdogs who know when your blood
sugar is low.
You've got, dogs for the deafwho can let their owners know
when the phone's ringing or.
Well, I mean, does anyone havehouse phones anymore?
(03:48):
Someone's at the door.
Yeah.
Someone's at...
The house phone.
I know.
Back in the day.
Mm-hmm.
That's what they did.
They're like, here, let me getthis phone for you.
But, and then also, did I, didI, did I say diabetic dogs?
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
There's something else.
Oh.
ptsd.
Oh.
So, you've got the, um, psych,that one's kind of psychiatric,
(04:12):
not psych.
They're not psychiatric.
What's the term?
Emotional.
No, but they're not emotional.
I know, but that's, that's whereit starts to get Like the fine
line between an emotionalsupport animal(mm-hmm) and a
service dog.
A service dog is registeredspecifically as...
There's no such thing as aregistry for service dogs.
(04:33):
No.
You can't even get certified.
There's no such thing as acertification.
So we need to let you know thatif someone says that they can
certify your emotional supportanimal or your service dog, that
is totally a complete fallacy.
(04:54):
Well, what would you say thedifference then between the
service dog for PTSD and anemotional support animal are?
Well, an emotional supportanimal, cannot...
it doesn't perform tasks foryou, right?
So it can...
Neither does the I don't I,okay.
They can actually, if someone ishaving a panic attack or,
(05:15):
having, some like out ofcontrol, anxiety.
You can actually have a servicedog for that who will, pretty
much, either like, make you sit,do pressure points on you.
Not pressure points, but like aweighted blanket until you calm
down.
So it, it is performing a task.
(05:36):
And that's the difference, isthat these dogs are trained.
Mm-hmm.
It is not little like fluffygoing into, you can't even,
don't even tell me that thislittle chihuahua is your service
dog because I, you know what?
That's, that's, that's not true.
True.
That's not true.
Because I was gonna say, theother thing is most of them are
(05:59):
trained, but dogs like MatthewBroderick that we adopted out
sense the woman's seizures.
Mm-hmm.
And he will never be a servicedog because he's a jerk.
Right.
I love you, Matthew.
But he tells her when she'sgoing to have a seizure,
Leisha's dog tells her whenshe's going to have a seizure
(06:20):
also.
Not trained to do that.
Just happens to do that.
Right.
But they're not, that doesn'tmake them a service dog because
you have to be able to be in thepublic.
You have to be trained.
Correct.
No, I understand that.
And, and Weenie is.
Mm-hmm.
But what I was gonna say is thatwhen we were in Florida,
(06:42):
apparently it's a rampantproblem there to fake service
animals.
Yes.
And we went to this restaurantwhere there was a big like
sandwich board sign, and it saidfaking service animals is a
crime and blah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
But Leisha is walking in with awalker.
Mm-hmm.
She could barely walk.
(07:02):
Her eye is closed from a strokethat she can't see out of one
eye.
(Mm-hmm) And the guy came up allup in arms like puffy and like
in our face and he's like, Idon't know.
He's like, no dog's in here.
I'm like, it's a service animal.
Mm-hmm.
And he was like, what task doesit perform?
Exactly.
(07:22):
Which they can ask.
And I was like, detect seizures.
And he was like, okay.
But I.
Technically it should have threetasks.
But why would you attack theperson...
Who obviously...
Who's walking with a walker?
Yeah.
And has one eye open.
Like I can understand if you seesomeone perfectly normal and
(07:45):
they, they're like, oh, it's myservice dog.
But...
So yeah, but you, you havepeople that are like, go to...
I get that, but...
Like Walmart or whatever.
Look at her.
Look at her.
Yeah.
And then we sat down and theydidn't have a lick of vegetarian
food.
Mm-hmm.
So except a salad.
So...
That's cuz you're in a redstate.
(08:06):
Well, I...
I went there, I totally wentthere.
But, but we, so we sat there fora few minutes and then we got up
and the guy came over likeworried.
I think he thought we were, youknow, I don't know, going to do
something or say something.
And he's like, is everythingokay?
Are you okay?
Do you need something?
And I was like, no.
I was like, we just we'revegetarian and we can't eat
(08:29):
here.
And he's like, oh, okay.
So we left, but.
And then when, later when wewere on the beach, I had Weenie
in my arms, but I was, standingnext to the walker and this guy
that we'd seen him riding by andkind of heckling people and just
(08:49):
being a dick, he, he saidsomething about, like, no, you
know, no dogs on the beach.
So during this time I sawnumerous dogs running around on
the beach.
Yeah.
Not wearing service vests, notacting appropriately, not in
control, clearly not servicedogs, just people making it up.
(09:12):
Right?
Here I am standing next to afucking walker and he yells
something at me.
And by that time I just abouthad it.
There had been a few differentinstances of how like the
disabled are not treated well.
Yeah.
And how difficult it was.
Like there was one place wherewe couldn't could, I couldn't
(09:34):
open the bathroom door becauseit was so tight.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so she got stuck in thebathroom.
Oh my god.
And so had Weenie been there,she, she...
I just about had it and I yelledat the guy, I'm like, mind your
own fucking business asshole.
I'm like, it's a service dog.
And, and he said something else.
(09:57):
And I, I don't even rememberwhat I said.
I.
But I, I went off and Bryan waswalking over at the same time
and he's like, what happened?
The dude called the police onme.
Nice.
And and he thought he was gonnabe smart, but honestly, the
police don't care and so we'renow Leisha's back from the water
(10:18):
with Bryan and we're sitting onthe blanket and Weenie's in, in
the basket in her walker.
Mm-hmm.
So like under the seat.
So her head sticks out the sideand all you can see is her head
and the police go by and they,they look at us and they keep
going.
And I turn...
Because she's in a walker.
Cause she's got a fuckingwalker.
Yeah.
And I was like, oh my God, I wasso mad.
(10:40):
Yeah.
And the lady at the hotel toldher she couldn't come in and get
breakfast because her walkerwould be in the way.
Nice.
And Bryan lost it.
Oh my gosh.
And for Bryan to lose it.
That's huge.
Bryan never gets upset.
No.
And he goes, that is reallyrude.
And he goes and inappropriate.
(11:01):
She has every right to come inand get her breakfast.
And he's like, get out of ourway.
Oh my God, go, Bryian damn.
And yeah, he never like loseshis temper.
No, but he's like, that is sorude and inappropriate.
It is.
And I, but like I said, so bythe time we'd had multiple
things happen.
Yeah.
I was just like, what is wrongwith people that they would
(11:24):
treat someone who's clearlysuffering...
Right.
In such a horrible way.
I mean, nevermind the dog part,but just...
Right, right.
Just in general.
So yeah, that was, that was anexperience.
Well, I'm sure, but you know, Imean, I, I kind of, I don't get
it, but I, I do find it annoyingwhen people bring their dogs
(11:45):
into, like the grocery store andit's obviously not a service
animal.
I get that.
Because it is not trained.
Yeah.
Or, or they're like, some chickcomes in and I totally
interjected, but she was withher husband and she had a
service dog in training with herpuppy.
(12:08):
In the grocery store and thepuppy is nosing and smelling all
the veggies and everything likethat.
And she's getting mad at him.
And then I kind of looked at herand, and the husband was like,
he's in training.
And I was like, then you need tobe in training because you're
not doing a good job.
That is not how you fuckingtrain.
(12:30):
And I was like, that is not howyou train a service dog.
And I don't know what tasks thatyou are having him perform, but
you are not even doing the rightfoundation for basic training.
Right.
And this is not socializing him,having you yell at him in a
fucking store.
Yeah.
And then they just were, I thinkthey were shocked because you
(12:53):
know, no one else is sayinganything.
And I'm like, first off, the dogneeds to fucking heel and it's a
puppy.
So you need to make sure that hestays with you.
Well and puppies aren't wellbehaved.
You can't take a puppy into agrocery store and know that it's
not gonna poop or pee on theground or do something terribly
embarrassing least of all...
(13:15):
Go to fucking Lowe's.
Well...
You know, if you want tosocialize your dog to like a
store environment.
But don't, yeah, that's not theappropriate place to work on
training for your puppy that maynever...
And then if you're gettingfrustrated...
May never want to be a servicedog.
Oh my God.
Oh, remember that woman that hadthe Doberman Pincher puppy?
(13:37):
Oh, yeah.
She bought a Doberman Pincherpuppy bought her, so...
She bought two.
Oh God.
The, the siblings.
Oh, Jesus.
No, but I just remember the one,it was black and tan and she
wanted it as a mobility dog.
And then, you know, to be aservice dog and...
Oh, that lady guy.
Yeah.
Different.
And then, yeah, and then I we'relike he does not have the right
(13:59):
temperament.
No.
Because...
He was not a good dog for that.
He was.
He was.
He was huge.
And he was aggressive.
So he was a huge, no, he was achicken shit.
Oh.
Remember?
He wouldn't even cross thethreshold to the door.
You're right.
It was that one.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And she was told, do not get apuppy.
You know, get someone who's alittle bit more established,
someone who's already strong,someone whose personality is
(14:22):
already there because she didnot want to purchase a service
dog because service dogs can beupwards of like, what,$10,000 or
something?
Because they're highly trained,right?
Right.
So people think it's a deal toget a$5,000 dog.
As a puppy...
And train it themselves.
And train it themselves.
But what this is the, thereally, the crux of why we are
(14:44):
making this episode is that thedogs are barking at something.
And they're not service as dogs.
They're not happy.
So the real reason I wanted tomake this episode specifically
now is because everyone thinksthat you need to buy a purebred
(15:07):
puppy to train it to be aservice animal.
But the problem is that's likegetting a human baby and telling
and applying their job ofastronaut from the minute you
meet them and from every minuteyou meet them, they're going to
be an astronaut, not just anengineer, an astronaut.
(15:28):
They can't just be a scientist,they're gonna be an astronaut
because being a service dog is ahighly specialized thing.
It's not just being a good dog,it's, but you're putting a job
on a baby.
Mm-hmm.
And you don't know that thatpuppy is going to have the
personality that it takes to bea service dog.
(15:50):
Right, because I mean, you haveto think about all the dogs that
go through the, the Guide Dogproject, right?
That they have a specific breedlabs from a specific breeder who
supposedly these dogs have theright temperament because
they're bred to do a job.
Right.
And it doesn't...
And you know what?
Even when they're bred to do thejob, like nine outta 10, they
(16:11):
don't even make it.
Well, and it doesn't mean thatyou have to get that dog, that
kind of dog as a service dog.
But they are used as servicedogs because they have been bred
for so long to have thequalities and temperament in
general.
But that does not mean theywill.
Exactly.
That's why nine out of 10 of'emcannot be a sight dog and then a
(16:34):
guide dog is a lot morestringent because obviously they
cannot be distracted becausethey could lead someone into the
road or, you know, they could bedistracted and chase a squirrel
and, I mean, and then take theirblind person down or, you know,
right.
They, they step on a curb wrong,you know.
(16:54):
So, so this, the reason thatthis bothers me so much is
because people don't- every timewe tell them, you need to get an
adult dog that has thepersonality and then train it to
do the tasks.
Right.
Because that is possible.
If you find a dog with the rightpersonality(mm-hmm) you can
train it.
(17:15):
But no matter how well you traina dog with the wrong
personality, it will never bewhat you need it to be.
And it's not just a personality,it's their endurance too,
because if you have a dog whocannot work all damn day, then
there's no point because theyhave to have the endurance to,
(17:36):
to, to be with you all the time.
And well, and we had a dog likethat.
Wants to have a job.
We had a dog that failed as abedbug dog because he got tired.
He would sniff the dog, he wouldsniff the bedbugs, and he did a
good job.
But he would lose interestpartway through the day.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So he did it.
He was trained and he had theright personality, but he didn't
have the endurance.
(17:56):
Yeah, he, yeah, he, he didn'thave the drive.
He's like, whatever.
But you don't know that a dog isgonna have that...
A puppy.
Endurance and that personalityuntil they're older.
So people are like, but you needto train them as a puppy.
Right.
You take 10 dogs as an agencyand you train them, and if
you're lucky, five would gothrough and become service dogs.
(18:19):
No.
I'm saying if you're lucky.
If you're lucky, the other fiveare only going to be pets.
Well trained pets.
Extremely well-trained pets.
But if you are lucky, 50%.
And this is what the girl onNext Door was trying to argue
with me about, and she's like,but you have to get a puppy and-
she got a Maltese for a mobilitydog.
(18:41):
Oh.
And I was just like...
Okay.
And I was trying to help her bysaying, look, I know you love
your dog.
Probably not the right dog forwhat you're trying to do, and
here's the reasons why.
Maybe we can help you find theright dog right now.
Mm-hmm.
So that you can have what youneed right now.
And not have to wait till thispuppy grows up and isn't gonna
(19:03):
be what you want anyways.
Yeah.
I mean, a Maltese is not amobility dog.
I mean, well, and then anothergirl got on my case and she's
like, dogs are bred to be like,I'm like, no one's breeding
Maltese for mobility dogs.
No one's breeding Maltese forservice animals.
Okay.
Yeah, and I'd like to say thatthere is a breeder, who doodle,
(19:27):
right?
They, they, they make doodleswith these perfect temperaments
and they can be a wonderfulemotional support animals and
service dogs and therapy dogs.
And, and I'm like, okay, soyou're inbreeding basically.
So, to get a certain temperamentand, and then you don't even
(19:48):
want your crazy dog bck.
Well, and you're selling a lie.
Yeah, you are.
They may grow up to be a servicedog, but they may not.
They are selling lies.
Yeah.
Breeders are selling people liesfor thousands of dollars.
Yeah.
And then, yes, they won't...
They don't want it back.
They won't take them back whenthey're not what they think they
(20:12):
are.
They don't want an aggressivebiting puppy because that is not
what they're selling.
And then they end up in theshelter and...
Or with us.
And we need to now take care ofthis problem.
Meanwhile, we're trying to teachpeople not to fall for the lie,
and they so want to believe thelie they will argue anything,
(20:35):
including statistics and I wascalled an ableist because I said
an emotional support animal isthere for psychiatric, issues
and, and disorders.
Yeah.
Psychiatric means problem withthe mind.
I'm not making a judgment.
I'm just, I'm just saying if youhave to...
It's called medical terminologypeople.
(20:56):
Exactly.
She's arguing medicalterminology with me.
You need to be diagnosed...
Yes.
With a medical problem tolegitimately have an emotional
problem.
You have to, yeah, you have tohave a medical disorder.
A psychiatric disorder,depression, adhd, although I
(21:17):
don't know anyone with ADHD whowants a, an ESA.
ESA is emotional support animal.
So she was basically telling meI was ableist because I was
pigeonholing people with mentaldisorders and that people can
have emotional support animalsfor a lot of reasons.
Mm-hmm.
I'm like, that's called a pet.
Exactly.
That's, yeah.
That's just, just because thepet lowers your blood pressure
(21:38):
(yeah) Doesn't make it anemotional support animal.
No.
So isn't the most ablest thingyou could be doing is taking
away the designation that givespeople with disabilities a, a
privilege or a right thatsomeone else doesn't have, and
you're trying to take that awayby saying that everyone should
have that right?
Yes.
(21:58):
To have an, like, you don't needto have a diagnosis to have an
emotional support animal.
Well, and and that's the thingis that this, this, we see this
a lot.
Can you tell It bothers me?
I know.
No, it bothers me too.
Especially when I see them inthe stores and they're ill
behaved and I was like, You knowwhat?
(22:19):
No.
Train your damn dog.
I don't care if it's a servicedog.
It's not a service dog becauseit would be trained, or an
emotional support animal.
And your emotional supportanimal should be fucking
trained.
It's no excuse not to train youranimal.
But the thing is, is that likewe get so many applications that
we get so many, and I'm notsaying it's a bad thing, but...
(22:40):
We want to help.
Everyone wants...
Help.
Yeah.
Everyone wants, they're like, Ineed an emotional support...
But they want puppies and, andthen they don't listen when we
try and tell them, that is nothow you get what you want.
You're rolling the dice.
Whereas we could instead findyou an adult dog that will do
exactly as you want.
Mm-hmm.
Because it has the rightpersonality and you just need to
(23:02):
train it.
Right.
Why do you want to gamble with apuppy when you are less likely
to get what you want?
Right.
And I mean, and then you know,puppies go through different
reactionary periods, like a fearstage or reactionary stage.
And if you have an emotionalsupport animal and you're trying
to walk down the road and youhaven't trained him and he's
(23:24):
yapping and barking at otherpeople, other dogs, that's not,
that's, that's gonna cause youmore anxiety than anything, you
know?
But yeah, I mean, we get a lotof people that want emotional
support animals, and I'm like,okay, where's your letter, your
prescription from your doctorthat says that you have a
disability that requires anemotional support animal.
(23:48):
I mean, that's the definition ofan emotional support animal.
And the girl, the girl's tryingto, one just rile everybody up.
I did not take the bait and Ibasically was like, oh, great,
maybe you can help this personthen.
Yeah, you didn't take the baitand now you're like bitching
about it over podcast.
Because I'm so mad.
I am so tired of people tryingto get puppies.
(24:12):
And why do they keep believingthe lies that breeders are
telling them?
It is killing animals.
It is killing animals in thethousands, in the tens of
thousands, and we are trying tostop it.
And no one gives a shit what wesay.
Well, and, and what what'sannoying is that they're like,
oh, well, getting a puppy from arescue is so hard.
(24:33):
I'm just gonna go buy one.
And then what happens when youbuy one and you and the
landlord's like, where's yourletter.
You know your ESA letter and younever got one.
So, I mean, because the breedersdon't care.
I mean, I shouldn't say allbreeders, but the majority of
your Craigslist breeders...
Just breeders.
(24:54):
Most of the breeders, they'renot reputable.
That's the problem.
Everyone wants to say they'rebreeder's reputable, but they're
not.
If they were, we wouldn't havethis problem.
Yeah, that's the bottom line.
If your breeder's not showingand it's not working.
So when we say breeders, we mean99% of the breeders that cause
the problems that we're dealingwith.
Mm-hmm.
And, so yeah, you need to knowthat if you have an emotional
(25:19):
support animal, that doesn'tmean that you can take your ESA
into the store.
All an ESA allows you to do islive in, like whatever housing
you're in, you are allowed tohave that dog or cat in that
housing, that apartment, thathouse that you're renting, et
cetera.
(25:40):
And then yes, you might be ableto take it on a plane, but the
more people that abuse this,you're not gonna be able to take
your ESA on a plane if you, ifyou cannot train your ESA...
Like the emotional supportpeacock that got kicked off of
flight.
No, about the ESA dog that bita, a steward.
Oh.
Wait, yeah.
Are they called stewards or...
(26:01):
No, flight attendants.
God, I can't keep up with theterminology.
Just ask me about animals.
But can I tell you that thereason that I even responded to
this girl is because she hadbeen, she had been asking for
help.
Yeah, she bought this puppy andthen she's like, I'm struggling
to train it.
Yeah.
Basically I need, I need freetraining is what kind of what it
(26:24):
seemed like she was going for.
And she really is disabled.
Right.
But, but no one was, no one wasoffering free training.
Right.
Because who does that?
Right.
And then secondly, then she wassaying her, her caretaker is
tired of trying to help hertrain her puppy.
So that's when I was like, okay,look, I've seen your posts, I've
seen that you need, you seemoverwhelmed(right) here.
(26:45):
Here's what I can tell you.
Here's what I can offer you.
I'm trying to help.
And at first, you know,obviously she, that's not what
she wanted to hear is(mm-hmm)get rid of your dog and we'll
give you a different one thatworks better.
Well, that I can actually like,maybe pull something...
Can do the job that you neededto do.
And and I just, I immediatelywas like, okay, nope, you, you
(27:07):
seems like you got it undercontrol then, because she was
like, I don't need helptraining.
And I'm like, okay, that'sjust...
But you just said that yourcaregiver, that's just what...
I know.
That's just what she said.
And she's like, no, I basicallyneed a treat and train thing,
which is like a camera with atreat dispenser, and...
How is that gonna train your dogto do the tasks?
So at this...
Mobility tasks.
(27:27):
For you, at this point I'm like,this girl seems like she's just
playing the disability card,because then I remembered I had
seen her asking for freesupplies.
Mm.
So let's say she paid$3,000 forthis Maltese, let's just say...
Okay.
Then she wants the community togive her all free stuff.
Free training and, and then, youknow, and nevermind it doesn't
(27:51):
matter! You can train the dogall you want.
It's not gonna do what youneeded to do.
Right.
Yeah.
And so, so then I was like,well, I'm, you know, I'm really
sorry.
I'm sorry you're struggling.
And I was being really niceabout it, and I was like, okay.
Done.
And then that girl, other girljumped in and was like, you're
an ableist, and blah, blah,blah.
And I was like, oh, maybe youguys can, maybe she, she can
help you.
Because clearly she knows morethan I do.
(28:13):
Yeah.
Like, and I said as a rescuer, Ihave, I've had 1500 dogs through
my home.
Many of them, because of thissituation that they have not
become the dog that peopleneeded them to, and they gave
them up.
So I'm not full of shit.
I didn't dedicate...
It's pot-a- potty day.
(28:35):
Okay.
Okay.
Now that our porta potty isdelivered, but seriously, I, I,
I get that you have an opinion.
That's great.
Everyone's entitled to anopinion.
Yes.
But why?
You're not the expert.
I'm the expert.
I've dedicated my life to this.
Why are you arguing with thewhole like point of why I even
(28:58):
do this work?
You don't know.
You can't make up statistics.
You can't make up medicalterminology.
You can't just, just saying itdoesn't make it true.
But it's the science.
It's always.
Well, the science says, and youknow what, the science used to
say that Brontosaurus existed.
(29:18):
That's all I gotta say.
Oh, and Christopher Columbusdiscovered America.
That Raper and Pillager.
Um, yeah, actually I read astory about him and he was real
horrible person, and no oneliked him.
Actually, the whole, the queenof Spain, like banished him.
Well, she was trying to get ridof him.
She was hoping he was probablygonna die on one of his quests.
And then he came back and she'slike, dammit.
(29:40):
Yeah, no, he was a horrible,horrible person.
Yeah, he was way more than I Iever knew.
And he never set foot in theUnited States.
That is correct.
Mm-hmm.
Jerk Face.
So anyway, this subject really,really, really bothers me
especially because people willdo anything they can to justify
this big lie that breeders areselling people.
(30:02):
Let's get back to thedifferences.
Okay.
Between, okay, so a service,service, service, analyst
service...
They perform tasks.
They perform specific tasks tohelp you with your disability.
Whatever those tasks are, theyhave to be able to do at least
three tasks.
All right.
(30:23):
Actually, you know what?
Double check that cuz shitchanges all the time.
Well.
Yeah, I mean, I don't know aboutthree specific things, but No,
no, that's what I read thistime.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
But that's what I'm saying.
Double check that cuz things,things change.
But, before it was at leastthree tasks, right?
And then emotional supportanimal is just there to help
you, with whatever psychotropicpsychotropic.
(30:48):
What is that?
Psychedelic.
So mental or emotional issue?
Right.
Well, I mean, it's a disorderbecause it's, it's a medical.
You're being able to...
It's a medical condition.
Okay.
Whatever medical condition youhave where the doctor prescribes
you an emotional support animal.
So you have to have a doctor'sprescription for an animal to
(31:11):
help you.
Yes.
That is an ESA.
It will be in your record.
Exactly.
It'll be in your medical record.
And that is why you...
And the insurance company willknow.
Yes.
And that is why you probablydon't wanna fake it, because
once you have a mental disorderin your record, that...
That stays on your record.
That's there forever.
(31:32):
Yeah.
Insurance companies eat that up.
Yep.
So, This is another reason whythis girl's just being like, you
don't need to have a emotionaldisorder or whatever.
Yes, you do.
Yes, you do.
Okay.
And then, and then the other onewould be a therapy dog.
So a therapy dog it's trained,it, it has to do, actually, it
(31:56):
has to do more training than anESA because ESAs are not yet
required to be trained.
Right.
They don't have to behave acertain way.
The job they're the quoteunquote...
That's my pet peeve, right, isthey don't have to be treated.
I know, but the quote unquotejob they're doing is comforting
you as a person that owns them.
Just being there.
In a therapy situation, your dogis there to comfort other
(32:18):
people.
Mm-hmm.
Children in a hospital, elderlypeople in a senior citizen's
home, things like that.
So that dog has to be like sowell trained because it can't
wanna bite strangers.
It can't be hyper It, it cannotlike, most of the therapy dogs
that I know have to pass theCanine Good Citizen
(32:41):
certification.
Yes.
Because they have to sit, theycannot jump on you.
They cannot lick you, or theyshould not give you kisses.
Mm-hmm.
Just to give you kisses.
And therapy dogs, you are, youare allowed to touch them.
You're supposed to touch them.
Emotional support animals, whoknows if you can touch them
because they might love theperson that they're comforting,
(33:02):
but they might be...
They might rip your face off.
Cujo with you.
Yeah.
And then you're not supposed totouch service dogs because that
is distracting to them and keepsthem from doing their job.
Their job, right?
Yeah.
And therapy dogs, their job isto be there for people.
So, my last baji that I'vehad...
I heard you like them.
I, I love basenjis so much.
(33:22):
Did I tell you that I wasdriving and there was a light in
the car in front of me.
It was a red light and there wasa car in front of me, and I was
like, huh.
It's like, is that a basenji?
And my heart just like droppedand then a little basenji had
poked out and then anotherbasenji had poked out.
(33:43):
And then I was like, that sucks.
I'm gonna like ram this car.
I'm gonna steal her dogs.
Yeah, if only I could have abasenji anyway.
So my basenji Maxwell was notyour typical basenji so.
He did not, like to bite people,for no reason.
He did not run away.
(34:04):
He was well trained.
He did agility.
I have pictures to prove it.
And he did therapy with myhusband, who's an occupational
therapist, and he was workingwith stroke patients.
So he would bring Max to workwith him.
And, because basenjis arehypoallergenic supposedly, and
(34:25):
they're, they're clean.
They're like a cat.
And he also did not lick peoplebecause basenjis can be aloof.
He was the perfect, therapy dog.
Helping people actually.
I mean, he wasn't just there forthem to pet, but he would help
them with their stroke exercisesjust by, I mean, allowing them
(34:48):
to pet.
They could work on their hands,they could throw the ball for
him, work on dexterity, thingslike that.
Because when you have a stroke,sometimes you lose function.
Yeah, except...
Functionality.
Except Leisha's had like eightand somehow she's still
pretty...
You know what?
Okay.
No, no.
She's just, no, she's just likesome medical anomaly.
(35:09):
We cannot even compare thingswith her.
I can't even understand how she,how they haven't put her in a
bubble.
Tried to study.
Don't give'em ideas.
No.
This is my, one of my bestfriends from Elementary school,
and she's had cancer for manyyears and somehow...
Just outta control.
She just keeps.
Going and it really is shocking.
(35:30):
No one understands how herdoctors don't understand.
She is that stubborn.
Mm-hmm.
That she is, wants to be therefor her kids.
She's that stubborn.
She literally has out stubborneddeath.
I think she has.
She has.
Yeah.
So I was.
Looking up whether or not youneed three...
(35:51):
Tasks.
Tasks, but I find a lot ofservice dog registries.
Okay?
And remember what I said.
They're a fallacy.
Do not pay them money.
It is not required.
You do not need to certify youranimal and you do not need to
register your animal cuz there'sno national registry and there's
(36:12):
no national certificationprocess to have an ESA.
Okay, here's the ADA..
So the real ADA.
Okay.
How a service animal serviceanimal is defined.
Defined as dogs that areindividually trained to do work
or perform tasks.
Examples include guiding peoplewho are blind, alerting people
(36:33):
who are deaf, pulling awheelchair, alerting and
protecting a person who's havinga seizure, reminding a person
with mental illness to takeprescribed medications, calming
a person with post-traumaticstress disorder during an
anxiety attack, or performingother duties.
They are working animals, notpets.
The work or task a dog has beentrained to provide must be
directly related to the person'sdisability.
(36:56):
Dogs whose sole function is toprovide comfort or emotional
support do not qualify asservice animals under the ADA
because that's an emotionalsupport animal.
Let's see.
Service animals are allowed,service animals must be under
control of the handler.
(37:17):
That means training.
Okay.
What is that?
Oh, that was weird.
Yeah.
So again, on the ADA site, areservice animals in training
(37:40):
considered service animals bythe ada?
And the answer is no.
So that because they're nottrained right.
That lady was wrong.
I mean, not we knew that, butyeah, I'm just saying like,
yeah, you, it's not the public'sjob to deal with your untrained
service dog because you hope itcan be a service dog later
(38:02):
because you think you can trainit and obviously you can't
because I saw you unable totrain your dog doing basic
things much less Any, any TAspecific disability tasks.
You know?
Yeah, so, so I can't findanything about how many tasks
really, I don't think there's aqualification for that.
(38:23):
I think as long as it'sperforming a task that that is
a.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, I'm gonna look it up.
So, here's one too.
(38:44):
Does the ADA require thatservice animals be certified?
So, No, cover covered entitiesmay not require documentation
such as proof of the animalbeing certified.
There are, however, individualsand organizations that sell
service, animal certification orregistration.
These documents do not conveyany rights under the ADA and the
(39:04):
Department of Justice does notrecognize them as proof that a
dog is a service animal.
See, don't pay for that shit.
Don't.
Mm-hmm.
Buy a lie on top of a lie whenyou already bought the lie in
the first place.
Don't buy another one.
But why?
Why are we the last people thatpeople ever listen to?
(39:25):
They'll listen to their vet.
They'll listen to their breeder.
Everyone else is like, theirword is God and ours is never
important or valid.
I don't know.
My breeder told me to do this.
Oh yeah.
I don't, well fuck yourcontract.
I don't care about your adoptioncontract.
That doesn't mean anything tome.
(39:46):
Right.
But you know the contract withthe breeder...
But the breeder, I'm going togive my dog back to the breeder
and let the breeder breed it andkeep it for nine months.
What the fuck?
Yeah.
The people have actually told usthat.
Yeah.
Why would you give your dogback?
For, to put it in danger.
Like, like, and people thinkthat's normal.
(40:09):
People think that's cool.
Like it's just like an egostroke.
All of it is an ego stroke.
Well, yeah.
I mean, cuz you have to have a,you know, you're, you're into a
certain breed or, or a certainlook or whatever.
A lot of it is, I mean, thinkabout it, the like dogs.
A lot of our dogs were bred forcertain jobs, right?
(40:29):
But then all these companiontype of dogs, we have companion
dogs, like the companion, thetoy breed.
They, they like, dude, seriouslythere, there's no work that they
do.
That Toy breeds works.
Ratters.
They're not toy breeds.
Toy Fox Terriers.
Do they.
Do they hunt Toy foxes?
(40:50):
They do the little mini ones,but yeah...
Toy Fox exteriors are myfavorite.
I know, but there's no purposeto them.
Oh, you know, it's a look.
It is a look.
They can hunt rats, althoughmine never did.
Jasmine was afraid of.
Exactly.
She was a rat terrier, but she'sstill afraid of of little
(41:10):
creatures.
We need a rat terrier.
Can I have the Jughead?
Can I have my Archie's back?
I want all three of'em to do thejob here.
Gouda will.
Oh no she did not.
Well, maybe...
She sucked.
She was defective.
No, she's not.
(41:31):
So that today's episode wasbased on Jme's pet peeve, and so
hopefully you know thedifference between service
animals, those who are trainedto perform a task versus
emotional support animals, thosethat require a doctor's
prescription to support thosewith mental diagnoses.
(41:53):
And therapy dogs, those who aretrained to provide comfort to
people.
To other people.
To other people.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
In hospitals or nursing homes,et cetera.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I'm sorry.
I got really angry because, I,I, I just don't understand.
(42:16):
I don't know why people don'tlisten.
But anyway, it is a pet peeve ofmine.
That's probably the mostirritated I've ever been in this
whole podcast.
But yeah, I'm not on next dooranymore.
When I...
Damn that social media.
When I told Leisha about it andI said something about next
door, and I went on to tell her,she goes, I was gonna just tell
you right when you started, likethe, the being on next door is
(42:40):
the thing that you did wrong.
Like no matter what you said, itwas just gonna go sideways,
which is true.
I don't even know why I'm onthere because I shouldn't be.
I know.
Yeah.
No, no.
But yeah.
Anyway, so this is Pate.
And I'm Jme.
This is, Motley zoo...
You screwed up this time..
I know.
I'm like, was it, how's ourending go?
(43:01):
Rock on.
No, that wasn't it.
Yes.
Okay.
Fine.
Rock on Rescue On.
We should trademark that beforesomeone takes it.
Hi, I'm Jme And I'm Pate.
And this is, oh wait.
We are Motley Zoo Animal Rescue,and this is our podcast Rescue
Chef.
We're a bit rusty because it'sbeen a few weeks since we've
recorded, so It's been aminute...
(00:22):
Although, I screw it up everytime, so there's really no
excuse for me.
Okay.
Today we are going to talkabout...
Controversy.
Yeah.
Service dogs and what reallythey are, what kinds of, I don't
(00:46):
know, jobs they do, andbasically a lot of
misunderstandings that peoplehave about them.
Right.
So it's basically like servicedog versus emotional support
animal, because a lot of peopleget.
Them confused and they feel thatthey can interchange those
titles.
And they're two totallydifferent types of dogs
(01:06):
actually.
I mean...
Well, and then we have therapydogs, which is a different kind
of dog so there's a lot ofconfusion when people tell us
that's what they want.
One we have to clarify, and two,we always try to steer them in
the right direction.
Right, But do they ever listen?
Mm.
I would say 99.9% of the timethey do not.
(01:30):
No, they don't.
Because they know better.
They know the best.
They do.
They know everything.
Especially the people on NextDoor.
Oh my God.
They know better than me.
They know better than and yeah,they like to argue.
Well, those statistics are notactually, or something about...
I think they get on next doorjust to argue.
They're like, I'm having ashitty day.
Yeah.
Let me get on next door andargue with my neighbor.
(01:52):
Like, why?
Well, and someone was like,those statistics, and I like,
she was basically saying heropinion was more valid than
statistics.
And I was like, block you.
Okay.
So what is a service dog?
An actual service dog?
An actual service dog is a dogthat performs tasks for a
(02:15):
certain disability per theAmerican Disabilities Act.
You are not allowed to ask aperson with a dog who says that
this is their service dog.
You're not allowed to ask themwhat their disability is and if
that is actually a service dog.
But what you can ask them iswhat tasks does that?
(02:42):
That was my throat.
No, my God.
I'm like, are you hungry?
No.
Yeah.
What tasks can that dog performfor you.
So this would be like a guidedog for the blind?
Yep.
It would be a dog that detectsseizures.
Yeah.
Seizure Alert dog.
It would be a mobilityCompanion.
(03:04):
Correct.
Those are the typical thingsthat you think of with a service
dog.
And, and then some other dogs,such as the seizure alert dog.
That person may not look quoteunquote disabled, but they can
have seizures and that dog canalert them.
The dog can use pressure whenthey're having a seizure, things
(03:28):
like that to help them.
You can also have diabetic alertdogs who know when your blood
sugar is low.
You've got, dogs for the deafwho can let their owners know
when the phone's ringing or.
Well, I mean, does anyone havehouse phones anymore?
(03:48):
Someone's at the door.
Yeah.
Someone's at...
The house phone.
I know.
Back in the day.
Mm-hmm.
That's what they did.
They're like, here, let me getthis phone for you.
But, and then also, did I, didI, did I say diabetic dogs?
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
There's something else.
Oh.
ptsd.
Oh.
So, you've got the, um, psych,that one's kind of psychiatric,
(04:12):
not psych.
They're not psychiatric.
What's the term?
Emotional.
No, but they're not emotional.
I know, but that's, that's whereit starts to get Like the fine
line between an emotionalsupport animal(mm-hmm) and a
service dog.
A service dog is registeredspecifically as...
There's no such thing as aregistry for service dogs.
(04:33):
No.
You can't even get certified.
There's no such thing as acertification.
So we need to let you know thatif someone says that they can
certify your emotional supportanimal or your service dog, that
is totally a complete fallacy.
(04:54):
Well, what would you say thedifference then between the
service dog for PTSD and anemotional support animal are?
Well, an emotional supportanimal, cannot...
it doesn't perform tasks foryou, right?
So it can...
Neither does the I don't I,okay.
They can actually, if someone ishaving a panic attack or,
(05:15):
having, some like out ofcontrol, anxiety.
You can actually have a servicedog for that who will, pretty
much, either like, make you sit,do pressure points on you.
Not pressure points, but like aweighted blanket until you calm
down.
So it, it is performing a task.
(05:36):
And that's the difference, isthat these dogs are trained.
Mm-hmm.
It is not little like fluffygoing into, you can't even,
don't even tell me that thislittle chihuahua is your service
dog because I, you know what?
That's, that's, that's not true.
True.
That's not true.
Because I was gonna say, theother thing is most of them are
(05:59):
trained, but dogs like MatthewBroderick that we adopted out
sense the woman's seizures.
Mm-hmm.
And he will never be a servicedog because he's a jerk.
Right.
I love you, Matthew.
But he tells her when she'sgoing to have a seizure,
Leisha's dog tells her whenshe's going to have a seizure
(06:20):
also.
Not trained to do that.
Just happens to do that.
Right.
But they're not, that doesn'tmake them a service dog because
you have to be able to be in thepublic.
You have to be trained.
Correct.
No, I understand that.
And, and Weenie is.
Mm-hmm.
But what I was gonna say is thatwhen we were in Florida,
(06:42):
apparently it's a rampantproblem there to fake service
animals.
Yes.
And we went to this restaurantwhere there was a big like
sandwich board sign, and it saidfaking service animals is a
crime and blah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
But Leisha is walking in with awalker.
Mm-hmm.
She could barely walk.
(07:02):
Her eye is closed from a strokethat she can't see out of one
eye.
(Mm-hmm) And the guy came up allup in arms like puffy and like
in our face and he's like, Idon't know.
He's like, no dog's in here.
I'm like, it's a service animal.
Mm-hmm.
And he was like, what task doesit perform?
Exactly.
(07:22):
Which they can ask.
And I was like, detect seizures.
And he was like, okay.
But I.
Technically it should have threetasks.
But why would you attack theperson...
Who obviously...
Who's walking with a walker?
Yeah.
And has one eye open.
Like I can understand if you seesomeone perfectly normal and
(07:45):
they, they're like, oh, it's myservice dog.
But...
So yeah, but you, you havepeople that are like, go to...
I get that, but...
Like Walmart or whatever.
Look at her.
Look at her.
Yeah.
And then we sat down and theydidn't have a lick of vegetarian
food.
Mm-hmm.
So except a salad.
So...
That's cuz you're in a redstate.
(08:06):
Well, I...
I went there, I totally wentthere.
But, but we, so we sat there fora few minutes and then we got up
and the guy came over likeworried.
I think he thought we were, youknow, I don't know, going to do
something or say something.
And he's like, is everythingokay?
Are you okay?
Do you need something?
And I was like, no.
I was like, we just we'revegetarian and we can't eat
(08:29):
here.
And he's like, oh, okay.
So we left, but.
And then when, later when wewere on the beach, I had Weenie
in my arms, but I was, standingnext to the walker and this guy
that we'd seen him riding by andkind of heckling people and just
(08:49):
being a dick, he, he saidsomething about, like, no, you
know, no dogs on the beach.
So during this time I sawnumerous dogs running around on
the beach.
Yeah.
Not wearing service vests, notacting appropriately, not in
control, clearly not servicedogs, just people making it up.
(09:12):
Right?
Here I am standing next to afucking walker and he yells
something at me.
And by that time I just abouthad it.
There had been a few differentinstances of how like the
disabled are not treated well.
Yeah.
And how difficult it was.
Like there was one place wherewe couldn't could, I couldn't
(09:34):
open the bathroom door becauseit was so tight.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so she got stuck in thebathroom.
Oh my god.
And so had Weenie been there,she, she...
I just about had it and I yelledat the guy, I'm like, mind your
own fucking business asshole.
I'm like, it's a service dog.
And, and he said something else.
(09:57):
And I, I don't even rememberwhat I said.
I.
But I, I went off and Bryan waswalking over at the same time
and he's like, what happened?
The dude called the police onme.
Nice.
And and he thought he was gonnabe smart, but honestly, the
police don't care and so we'renow Leisha's back from the water
(10:18):
with Bryan and we're sitting onthe blanket and Weenie's in, in
the basket in her walker.
Mm-hmm.
So like under the seat.
So her head sticks out the sideand all you can see is her head
and the police go by and they,they look at us and they keep
going.
And I turn...
Because she's in a walker.
Cause she's got a fuckingwalker.
Yeah.
And I was like, oh my God, I wasso mad.
(10:40):
Yeah.
And the lady at the hotel toldher she couldn't come in and get
breakfast because her walkerwould be in the way.
Nice.
And Bryan lost it.
Oh my gosh.
And for Bryan to lose it.
That's huge.
Bryan never gets upset.
No.
And he goes, that is reallyrude.
And he goes and inappropriate.
(11:01):
She has every right to come inand get her breakfast.
And he's like, get out of ourway.
Oh my God, go, Bryian damn.
And yeah, he never like loseshis temper.
No, but he's like, that is sorude and inappropriate.
It is.
And I, but like I said, so bythe time we'd had multiple
things happen.
Yeah.
I was just like, what is wrongwith people that they would
(11:24):
treat someone who's clearlysuffering...
Right.
In such a horrible way.
I mean, nevermind the dog part,but just...
Right, right.
Just in general.
So yeah, that was, that was anexperience.
Well, I'm sure, but you know, Imean, I, I kind of, I don't get
it, but I, I do find it annoyingwhen people bring their dogs
(11:45):
into, like the grocery store andit's obviously not a service
animal.
I get that.
Because it is not trained.
Yeah.
Or, or they're like, some chickcomes in and I totally
interjected, but she was withher husband and she had a
service dog in training with herpuppy.
(12:08):
In the grocery store and thepuppy is nosing and smelling all
the veggies and everything likethat.
And she's getting mad at him.
And then I kind of looked at herand, and the husband was like,
he's in training.
And I was like, then you need tobe in training because you're
not doing a good job.
That is not how you fuckingtrain.
(12:30):
And I was like, that is not howyou train a service dog.
And I don't know what tasks thatyou are having him perform, but
you are not even doing the rightfoundation for basic training.
Right.
And this is not socializing him,having you yell at him in a
fucking store.
Yeah.
And then they just were, I thinkthey were shocked because you
(12:53):
know, no one else is sayinganything.
And I'm like, first off, the dogneeds to fucking heel and it's a
puppy.
So you need to make sure that hestays with you.
Well and puppies aren't wellbehaved.
You can't take a puppy into agrocery store and know that it's
not gonna poop or pee on theground or do something terribly
embarrassing least of all...
(13:15):
Go to fucking Lowe's.
Well...
You know, if you want tosocialize your dog to like a
store environment.
But don't, yeah, that's not theappropriate place to work on
training for your puppy that maynever...
And then if you're gettingfrustrated...
May never want to be a servicedog.
Oh my God.
Oh, remember that woman that hadthe Doberman Pincher puppy?
(13:37):
Oh, yeah.
She bought a Doberman Pincherpuppy bought her, so...
She bought two.
Oh God.
The, the siblings.
Oh, Jesus.
No, but I just remember the one,it was black and tan and she
wanted it as a mobility dog.
And then, you know, to be aservice dog and...
Oh, that lady guy.
Yeah.
Different.
And then, yeah, and then I we'relike he does not have the right
(13:59):
temperament.
No.
Because...
He was not a good dog for that.
He was.
He was.
He was huge.
And he was aggressive.
So he was a huge, no, he was achicken shit.
Oh.
Remember?
He wouldn't even cross thethreshold to the door.
You're right.
It was that one.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And she was told, do not get apuppy.
You know, get someone who's alittle bit more established,
someone who's already strong,someone whose personality is
(14:22):
already there because she didnot want to purchase a service
dog because service dogs can beupwards of like, what,$10,000 or
something?
Because they're highly trained,right?
Right.
So people think it's a deal toget a$5,000 dog.
As a puppy...
And train it themselves.
And train it themselves.
But what this is the, thereally, the crux of why we are
(14:44):
making this episode is that thedogs are barking at something.
And they're not service as dogs.
They're not happy.
So the real reason I wanted tomake this episode specifically
now is because everyone thinksthat you need to buy a purebred
(15:07):
puppy to train it to be aservice animal.
But the problem is that's likegetting a human baby and telling
and applying their job ofastronaut from the minute you
meet them and from every minuteyou meet them, they're going to
be an astronaut, not just anengineer, an astronaut.
(15:28):
They can't just be a scientist,they're gonna be an astronaut
because being a service dog is ahighly specialized thing.
It's not just being a good dog,it's, but you're putting a job
on a baby.
Mm-hmm.
And you don't know that thatpuppy is going to have the
personality that it takes to bea service dog.
(15:50):
Right, because I mean, you haveto think about all the dogs that
go through the, the Guide Dogproject, right?
That they have a specific breedlabs from a specific breeder who
supposedly these dogs have theright temperament because
they're bred to do a job.
Right.
And it doesn't...
And you know what?
Even when they're bred to do thejob, like nine outta 10, they
(16:11):
don't even make it.
Well, and it doesn't mean thatyou have to get that dog, that
kind of dog as a service dog.
But they are used as servicedogs because they have been bred
for so long to have thequalities and temperament in
general.
But that does not mean theywill.
Exactly.
That's why nine out of 10 of'emcannot be a sight dog and then a
(16:34):
guide dog is a lot morestringent because obviously they
cannot be distracted becausethey could lead someone into the
road or, you know, they could bedistracted and chase a squirrel
and, I mean, and then take theirblind person down or, you know,
right.
They, they step on a curb wrong,you know.
(16:54):
So, so this, the reason thatthis bothers me so much is
because people don't- every timewe tell them, you need to get an
adult dog that has thepersonality and then train it to
do the tasks.
Right.
Because that is possible.
If you find a dog with the rightpersonality(mm-hmm) you can
train it.
(17:15):
But no matter how well you traina dog with the wrong
personality, it will never bewhat you need it to be.
And it's not just a personality,it's their endurance too,
because if you have a dog whocannot work all damn day, then
there's no point because theyhave to have the endurance to,
(17:36):
to, to be with you all the time.
And well, and we had a dog likethat.
Wants to have a job.
We had a dog that failed as abedbug dog because he got tired.
He would sniff the dog, he wouldsniff the bedbugs, and he did a
good job.
But he would lose interestpartway through the day.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So he did it.
He was trained and he had theright personality, but he didn't
have the endurance.
(17:56):
Yeah, he, yeah, he, he didn'thave the drive.
He's like, whatever.
But you don't know that a dog isgonna have that...
A puppy.
Endurance and that personalityuntil they're older.
So people are like, but you needto train them as a puppy.
Right.
You take 10 dogs as an agencyand you train them, and if
you're lucky, five would gothrough and become service dogs.
(18:19):
No.
I'm saying if you're lucky.
If you're lucky, the other fiveare only going to be pets.
Well trained pets.
Extremely well-trained pets.
But if you are lucky, 50%.
And this is what the girl onNext Door was trying to argue
with me about, and she's like,but you have to get a puppy and-
she got a Maltese for a mobilitydog.
(18:41):
Oh.
And I was just like...
Okay.
And I was trying to help her bysaying, look, I know you love
your dog.
Probably not the right dog forwhat you're trying to do, and
here's the reasons why.
Maybe we can help you find theright dog right now.
Mm-hmm.
So that you can have what youneed right now.
And not have to wait till thispuppy grows up and isn't gonna
(19:03):
be what you want anyways.
Yeah.
I mean, a Maltese is not amobility dog.
I mean, well, and then anothergirl got on my case and she's
like, dogs are bred to be like,I'm like, no one's breeding
Maltese for mobility dogs.
No one's breeding Maltese forservice animals.
Okay.
Yeah, and I'd like to say thatthere is a breeder, who doodle,
(19:27):
right?
They, they, they make doodleswith these perfect temperaments
and they can be a wonderfulemotional support animals and
service dogs and therapy dogs.
And, and I'm like, okay, soyou're inbreeding basically.
So, to get a certain temperamentand, and then you don't even
(19:48):
want your crazy dog bck.
Well, and you're selling a lie.
Yeah, you are.
They may grow up to be a servicedog, but they may not.
They are selling lies.
Yeah.
Breeders are selling people liesfor thousands of dollars.
Yeah.
And then, yes, they won't...
They don't want it back.
They won't take them back whenthey're not what they think they
(20:12):
are.
They don't want an aggressivebiting puppy because that is not
what they're selling.
And then they end up in theshelter and...
Or with us.
And we need to now take care ofthis problem.
Meanwhile, we're trying to teachpeople not to fall for the lie,
and they so want to believe thelie they will argue anything,
(20:35):
including statistics and I wascalled an ableist because I said
an emotional support animal isthere for psychiatric, issues
and, and disorders.
Yeah.
Psychiatric means problem withthe mind.
I'm not making a judgment.
I'm just, I'm just saying if youhave to...
It's called medical terminologypeople.
(20:56):
Exactly.
She's arguing medicalterminology with me.
You need to be diagnosed...
Yes.
With a medical problem tolegitimately have an emotional
problem.
You have to, yeah, you have tohave a medical disorder.
A psychiatric disorder,depression, adhd, although I
(21:17):
don't know anyone with ADHD whowants a, an ESA.
ESA is emotional support animal.
So she was basically telling meI was ableist because I was
pigeonholing people with mentaldisorders and that people can
have emotional support animalsfor a lot of reasons.
Mm-hmm.
I'm like, that's called a pet.
Exactly.
That's, yeah.
That's just, just because thepet lowers your blood pressure
(21:38):
(yeah) Doesn't make it anemotional support animal.
No.
So isn't the most ablest thingyou could be doing is taking
away the designation that givespeople with disabilities a, a
privilege or a right thatsomeone else doesn't have, and
you're trying to take that awayby saying that everyone should
have that right?
Yes.
(21:58):
To have an, like, you don't needto have a diagnosis to have an
emotional support animal.
Well, and and that's the thingis that this, this, we see this
a lot.
Can you tell It bothers me?
I know.
No, it bothers me too.
Especially when I see them inthe stores and they're ill
behaved and I was like, You knowwhat?
(22:19):
No.
Train your damn dog.
I don't care if it's a servicedog.
It's not a service dog becauseit would be trained, or an
emotional support animal.
And your emotional supportanimal should be fucking
trained.
It's no excuse not to train youranimal.
But the thing is, is that likewe get so many applications that
we get so many, and I'm notsaying it's a bad thing, but...
(22:40):
We want to help.
Everyone wants...
Help.
Yeah.
Everyone wants, they're like, Ineed an emotional support...
But they want puppies and, andthen they don't listen when we
try and tell them, that is nothow you get what you want.
You're rolling the dice.
Whereas we could instead findyou an adult dog that will do
exactly as you want.
Mm-hmm.
Because it has the rightpersonality and you just need to
(23:02):
train it.
Right.
Why do you want to gamble with apuppy when you are less likely
to get what you want?
Right.
And I mean, and then you know,puppies go through different
reactionary periods, like a fearstage or reactionary stage.
And if you have an emotionalsupport animal and you're trying
to walk down the road and youhaven't trained him and he's
(23:24):
yapping and barking at otherpeople, other dogs, that's not,
that's, that's gonna cause youmore anxiety than anything, you
know?
But yeah, I mean, we get a lotof people that want emotional
support animals, and I'm like,okay, where's your letter, your
prescription from your doctorthat says that you have a
disability that requires anemotional support animal.
(23:48):
I mean, that's the definition ofan emotional support animal.
And the girl, the girl's tryingto, one just rile everybody up.
I did not take the bait and Ibasically was like, oh, great,
maybe you can help this personthen.
Yeah, you didn't take the baitand now you're like bitching
about it over podcast.
Because I'm so mad.
I am so tired of people tryingto get puppies.
(24:12):
And why do they keep believingthe lies that breeders are
telling them?
It is killing animals.
It is killing animals in thethousands, in the tens of
thousands, and we are trying tostop it.
And no one gives a shit what wesay.
Well, and, and what what'sannoying is that they're like,
oh, well, getting a puppy from arescue is so hard.
(24:33):
I'm just gonna go buy one.
And then what happens when youbuy one and you and the
landlord's like, where's yourletter.
You know your ESA letter and younever got one.
So, I mean, because the breedersdon't care.
I mean, I shouldn't say allbreeders, but the majority of
your Craigslist breeders...
Just breeders.
(24:54):
Most of the breeders, they'renot reputable.
That's the problem.
Everyone wants to say they'rebreeder's reputable, but they're
not.
If they were, we wouldn't havethis problem.
Yeah, that's the bottom line.
If your breeder's not showingand it's not working.
So when we say breeders, we mean99% of the breeders that cause
the problems that we're dealingwith.
Mm-hmm.
And, so yeah, you need to knowthat if you have an emotional
(25:19):
support animal, that doesn'tmean that you can take your ESA
into the store.
All an ESA allows you to do islive in, like whatever housing
you're in, you are allowed tohave that dog or cat in that
housing, that apartment, thathouse that you're renting, et
cetera.
(25:40):
And then yes, you might be ableto take it on a plane, but the
more people that abuse this,you're not gonna be able to take
your ESA on a plane if you, ifyou cannot train your ESA...
Like the emotional supportpeacock that got kicked off of
flight.
No, about the ESA dog that bita, a steward.
Oh.
Wait, yeah.
Are they called stewards or...
(26:01):
No, flight attendants.
God, I can't keep up with theterminology.
Just ask me about animals.
But can I tell you that thereason that I even responded to
this girl is because she hadbeen, she had been asking for
help.
Yeah, she bought this puppy andthen she's like, I'm struggling
to train it.
Yeah.
Basically I need, I need freetraining is what kind of what it
(26:24):
seemed like she was going for.
And she really is disabled.
Right.
But, but no one was, no one wasoffering free training.
Right.
Because who does that?
Right.
And then secondly, then she wassaying her, her caretaker is
tired of trying to help hertrain her puppy.
So that's when I was like, okay,look, I've seen your posts, I've
seen that you need, you seemoverwhelmed(right) here.
(26:45):
Here's what I can tell you.
Here's what I can offer you.
I'm trying to help.
And at first, you know,obviously she, that's not what
she wanted to hear is(mm-hmm)get rid of your dog and we'll
give you a different one thatworks better.
Well, that I can actually like,maybe pull something...
Can do the job that you neededto do.
And and I just, I immediatelywas like, okay, nope, you, you
(27:07):
seems like you got it undercontrol then, because she was
like, I don't need helptraining.
And I'm like, okay, that'sjust...
But you just said that yourcaregiver, that's just what...
I know.
That's just what she said.
And she's like, no, I basicallyneed a treat and train thing,
which is like a camera with atreat dispenser, and...
How is that gonna train your dogto do the tasks?
So at this...
Mobility tasks.
(27:27):
For you, at this point I'm like,this girl seems like she's just
playing the disability card,because then I remembered I had
seen her asking for freesupplies.
Mm.
So let's say she paid$3,000 forthis Maltese, let's just say...
Okay.
Then she wants the community togive her all free stuff.
Free training and, and then, youknow, and nevermind it doesn't
(27:51):
matter! You can train the dogall you want.
It's not gonna do what youneeded to do.
Right.
Yeah.
And so, so then I was like,well, I'm, you know, I'm really
sorry.
I'm sorry you're struggling.
And I was being really niceabout it, and I was like, okay.
Done.
And then that girl, other girljumped in and was like, you're
an ableist, and blah, blah,blah.
And I was like, oh, maybe youguys can, maybe she, she can
help you.
Because clearly she knows morethan I do.
(28:13):
Yeah.
Like, and I said as a rescuer, Ihave, I've had 1500 dogs through
my home.
Many of them, because of thissituation that they have not
become the dog that peopleneeded them to, and they gave
them up.
So I'm not full of shit.
I didn't dedicate...
It's pot-a- potty day.
(28:35):
Okay.
Okay.
Now that our porta potty isdelivered, but seriously, I, I,
I get that you have an opinion.
That's great.
Everyone's entitled to anopinion.
Yes.
But why?
You're not the expert.
I'm the expert.
I've dedicated my life to this.
Why are you arguing with thewhole like point of why I even
(28:58):
do this work?
You don't know.
You can't make up statistics.
You can't make up medicalterminology.
You can't just, just saying itdoesn't make it true.
But it's the science.
It's always.
Well, the science says, and youknow what, the science used to
say that Brontosaurus existed.
(29:18):
That's all I gotta say.
Oh, and Christopher Columbusdiscovered America.
That Raper and Pillager.
Um, yeah, actually I read astory about him and he was real
horrible person, and no oneliked him.
Actually, the whole, the queenof Spain, like banished him.
Well, she was trying to get ridof him.
She was hoping he was probablygonna die on one of his quests.
And then he came back and she'slike, dammit.
(29:40):
Yeah, no, he was a horrible,horrible person.
Yeah, he was way more than I Iever knew.
And he never set foot in theUnited States.
That is correct.
Mm-hmm.
Jerk Face.
So anyway, this subject really,really, really bothers me
especially because people willdo anything they can to justify
this big lie that breeders areselling people.
(30:02):
Let's get back to thedifferences.
Okay.
Between, okay, so a service,service, service, analyst
service...
They perform tasks.
They perform specific tasks tohelp you with your disability.
Whatever those tasks are, theyhave to be able to do at least
three tasks.
All right.
(30:23):
Actually, you know what?
Double check that cuz shitchanges all the time.
Well.
Yeah, I mean, I don't know aboutthree specific things, but No,
no, that's what I read thistime.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
But that's what I'm saying.
Double check that cuz things,things change.
But, before it was at leastthree tasks, right?
And then emotional supportanimal is just there to help
you, with whatever psychotropicpsychotropic.
(30:48):
What is that?
Psychedelic.
So mental or emotional issue?
Right.
Well, I mean, it's a disorderbecause it's, it's a medical.
You're being able to...
It's a medical condition.
Okay.
Whatever medical condition youhave where the doctor prescribes
you an emotional support animal.
So you have to have a doctor'sprescription for an animal to
(31:11):
help you.
Yes.
That is an ESA.
It will be in your record.
Exactly.
It'll be in your medical record.
And that is why you...
And the insurance company willknow.
Yes.
And that is why you probablydon't wanna fake it, because
once you have a mental disorderin your record, that...
That stays on your record.
That's there forever.
(31:32):
Yeah.
Insurance companies eat that up.
Yep.
So, This is another reason whythis girl's just being like, you
don't need to have a emotionaldisorder or whatever.
Yes, you do.
Yes, you do.
Okay.
And then, and then the other onewould be a therapy dog.
So a therapy dog it's trained,it, it has to do, actually, it
(31:56):
has to do more training than anESA because ESAs are not yet
required to be trained.
Right.
They don't have to behave acertain way.
The job they're the quoteunquote...
That's my pet peeve, right, isthey don't have to be treated.
I know, but the quote unquotejob they're doing is comforting
you as a person that owns them.
Just being there.
In a therapy situation, your dogis there to comfort other
(32:18):
people.
Mm-hmm.
Children in a hospital, elderlypeople in a senior citizen's
home, things like that.
So that dog has to be like sowell trained because it can't
wanna bite strangers.
It can't be hyper It, it cannotlike, most of the therapy dogs
that I know have to pass theCanine Good Citizen
(32:41):
certification.
Yes.
Because they have to sit, theycannot jump on you.
They cannot lick you, or theyshould not give you kisses.
Mm-hmm.
Just to give you kisses.
And therapy dogs, you are, youare allowed to touch them.
You're supposed to touch them.
Emotional support animals, whoknows if you can touch them
because they might love theperson that they're comforting,
(33:02):
but they might be...
They might rip your face off.
Cujo with you.
Yeah.
And then you're not supposed totouch service dogs because that
is distracting to them and keepsthem from doing their job.
Their job, right?
Yeah.
And therapy dogs, their job isto be there for people.
So, my last baji that I'vehad...
I heard you like them.
I, I love basenjis so much.
(33:22):
Did I tell you that I wasdriving and there was a light in
the car in front of me.
It was a red light and there wasa car in front of me, and I was
like, huh.
It's like, is that a basenji?
And my heart just like droppedand then a little basenji had
poked out and then anotherbasenji had poked out.
(33:43):
And then I was like, that sucks.
I'm gonna like ram this car.
I'm gonna steal her dogs.
Yeah, if only I could have abasenji anyway.
So my basenji Maxwell was notyour typical basenji so.
He did not, like to bite people,for no reason.
He did not run away.
(34:04):
He was well trained.
He did agility.
I have pictures to prove it.
And he did therapy with myhusband, who's an occupational
therapist, and he was workingwith stroke patients.
So he would bring Max to workwith him.
And, because basenjis arehypoallergenic supposedly, and
(34:25):
they're, they're clean.
They're like a cat.
And he also did not lick peoplebecause basenjis can be aloof.
He was the perfect, therapy dog.
Helping people actually.
I mean, he wasn't just there forthem to pet, but he would help
them with their stroke exercisesjust by, I mean, allowing them
(34:48):
to pet.
They could work on their hands,they could throw the ball for
him, work on dexterity, thingslike that.
Because when you have a stroke,sometimes you lose function.
Yeah, except...
Functionality.
Except Leisha's had like eightand somehow she's still
pretty...
You know what?
Okay.
No, no.
She's just, no, she's just likesome medical anomaly.
(35:09):
We cannot even compare thingswith her.
I can't even understand how she,how they haven't put her in a
bubble.
Tried to study.
Don't give'em ideas.
No.
This is my, one of my bestfriends from Elementary school,
and she's had cancer for manyyears and somehow...
Just outta control.
She just keeps.
Going and it really is shocking.
(35:30):
No one understands how herdoctors don't understand.
She is that stubborn.
Mm-hmm.
That she is, wants to be therefor her kids.
She's that stubborn.
She literally has out stubborneddeath.
I think she has.
She has.
Yeah.
So I was.
Looking up whether or not youneed three...
(35:51):
Tasks.
Tasks, but I find a lot ofservice dog registries.
Okay?
And remember what I said.
They're a fallacy.
Do not pay them money.
It is not required.
You do not need to certify youranimal and you do not need to
register your animal cuz there'sno national registry and there's
(36:12):
no national certificationprocess to have an ESA.
Okay, here's the ADA..
So the real ADA.
Okay.
How a service animal serviceanimal is defined.
Defined as dogs that areindividually trained to do work
or perform tasks.
Examples include guiding peoplewho are blind, alerting people
(36:33):
who are deaf, pulling awheelchair, alerting and
protecting a person who's havinga seizure, reminding a person
with mental illness to takeprescribed medications, calming
a person with post-traumaticstress disorder during an
anxiety attack, or performingother duties.
They are working animals, notpets.
The work or task a dog has beentrained to provide must be
directly related to the person'sdisability.
(36:56):
Dogs whose sole function is toprovide comfort or emotional
support do not qualify asservice animals under the ADA
because that's an emotionalsupport animal.
Let's see.
Service animals are allowed,service animals must be under
control of the handler.
(37:17):
That means training.
Okay.
What is that?
Oh, that was weird.
Yeah.
So again, on the ADA site, areservice animals in training
(37:40):
considered service animals bythe ada?
And the answer is no.
So that because they're nottrained right.
That lady was wrong.
I mean, not we knew that, butyeah, I'm just saying like,
yeah, you, it's not the public'sjob to deal with your untrained
service dog because you hope itcan be a service dog later
(38:02):
because you think you can trainit and obviously you can't
because I saw you unable totrain your dog doing basic
things much less Any, any TAspecific disability tasks.
You know?
Yeah, so, so I can't findanything about how many tasks
really, I don't think there's aqualification for that.
(38:23):
I think as long as it'sperforming a task that that is
a.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, I'm gonna look it up.
So, here's one too.
(38:44):
Does the ADA require thatservice animals be certified?
So, No, cover covered entitiesmay not require documentation
such as proof of the animalbeing certified.
There are, however, individualsand organizations that sell
service, animal certification orregistration.
These documents do not conveyany rights under the ADA and the
(39:04):
Department of Justice does notrecognize them as proof that a
dog is a service animal.
See, don't pay for that shit.
Don't.
Mm-hmm.
Buy a lie on top of a lie whenyou already bought the lie in
the first place.
Don't buy another one.
But why?
Why are we the last people thatpeople ever listen to?
(39:25):
They'll listen to their vet.
They'll listen to their breeder.
Everyone else is like, theirword is God and ours is never
important or valid.
I don't know.
My breeder told me to do this.
Oh yeah.
I don't, well fuck yourcontract.
I don't care about your adoptioncontract.
That doesn't mean anything tome.
(39:46):
Right.
But you know the contract withthe breeder...
But the breeder, I'm going togive my dog back to the breeder
and let the breeder breed it andkeep it for nine months.
What the fuck?
Yeah.
The people have actually told usthat.
Yeah.
Why would you give your dogback?
For, to put it in danger.
Like, like, and people thinkthat's normal.
(40:09):
People think that's cool.
Like it's just like an egostroke.
All of it is an ego stroke.
Well, yeah.
I mean, cuz you have to have a,you know, you're, you're into a
certain breed or, or a certainlook or whatever.
A lot of it is, I mean, thinkabout it, the like dogs.
A lot of our dogs were bred forcertain jobs, right?
(40:29):
But then all these companiontype of dogs, we have companion
dogs, like the companion, thetoy breed.
They, they like, dude, seriouslythere, there's no work that they
do.
That Toy breeds works.
Ratters.
They're not toy breeds.
Toy Fox Terriers.
Do they.
Do they hunt Toy foxes?
(40:50):
They do the little mini ones,but yeah...
Toy Fox exteriors are myfavorite.
I know, but there's no purposeto them.
Oh, you know, it's a look.
It is a look.
They can hunt rats, althoughmine never did.
Jasmine was afraid of.
Exactly.
She was a rat terrier, but she'sstill afraid of of little
(41:10):
creatures.
We need a rat terrier.
Can I have the Jughead?
Can I have my Archie's back?
I want all three of'em to do thejob here.
Gouda will.
Oh no she did not.
Well, maybe...
She sucked.
She was defective.
No, she's not.
(41:31):
So that today's episode wasbased on Jme's pet peeve, and so
hopefully you know thedifference between service
animals, those who are trainedto perform a task versus
emotional support animals, thosethat require a doctor's
prescription to support thosewith mental diagnoses.
(41:53):
And therapy dogs, those who aretrained to provide comfort to
people.
To other people.
To other people.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
In hospitals or nursing homes,et cetera.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I'm sorry.
I got really angry because, I,I, I just don't understand.
(42:16):
I don't know why people don'tlisten.
But anyway, it is a pet peeve ofmine.
That's probably the mostirritated I've ever been in this
whole podcast.
But yeah, I'm not on next dooranymore.
When I...
Damn that social media.
When I told Leisha about it andI said something about next
door, and I went on to tell her,she goes, I was gonna just tell
you right when you started, likethe, the being on next door is
(42:40):
the thing that you did wrong.
Like no matter what you said, itwas just gonna go sideways,
which is true.
I don't even know why I'm onthere because I shouldn't be.
I know.
Yeah.
No, no.
But yeah.
Anyway, so this is Pate.
And I'm Jme.
This is, Motley zoo...
You screwed up this time..
I know.
I'm like, was it, how's ourending go?
(43:01):
Rock on.
No, that wasn't it.
Yes.
Okay.
Fine.
Rock on Rescue On.
We should trademark that beforesomeone takes it.
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