March 15, 2023 • 17 mins
Often in our culture and especially in the Western church, we tend to describe God in abstract terms and with intangible qualities, and can even find ourselves desiring information about God rather than a testimony about our relationship with Him.
But the Lord is real and moving around us in ways we can know with our senses. He is speaking and revealing Himself to you in a unique way, and there are concrete truths about God that you have a personal witness to.
So today, ask yourself, who has God been to you? What concrete descriptions about God are true and tangible to you? It’s these qualities and truths that unlock the potential for firm foundations in your journey with Jesus and your identity in Him.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Gabrielle Leonard (00:00):
Welcome to the return to joy podcast. I'm
your host, Gabrielle MichelLeonard. Here we're leading
people to cultivate joy throughstorytelling. We hope listening
will reveal pathways tounlocking the healing power of
connection, so that you can seeyour relationships and the world
around you transformed fromfractured into flourishing was
(00:24):
Beloved's. I am really glad tobe with you. And I'm coming
right now just extremelygrateful. I have got to lead out
with that. This episode I wantedto talk about who do you say God
is. But before we get into that,I've got to tell you that I feel
(00:45):
extremely grateful right now. Iearlier today, this morning, I
popped into the very tail end ofa event. And I had the
opportunity to have a very rawand tenderly honest conversation
with the Mayor of the City ofLive Oak. And she shared so much
(01:06):
vulnerable wisdom that I feltdeeply privileged to be on the
receiving end of and I had noclue that the Mayor of the City
of live over the last 12 yearswas a black woman. And one thing
that was really incredible fromthe conversation was, she didn't
even ask me what I did for aliving until the very end of our
(01:29):
conversation, we talked foralmost an hour. And she was just
sharing from her experiences oftriumph and pain. And I'm
soaking it all in tears comingdown my eyes. And I'm like this
This woman is, she doesn't evenrealize how much of an
encouragement she's been to me.
And I just felt very seen, I wasreally struck by the strength
(01:49):
that I saw in her. Because Iknow she's had pushback, I know
that she has experienced peoplesaying blatantly to her face.
And suddenly in the background,you don't belong here. But yet
she walked with this deepreverence this strength that
would that would say the veryopposite of that. I feel like
(02:12):
the reason why she walked andcarried the way herself the way
she did, was because of who herparents were for her. The
stories they told her the thingsthat they said about her and
about what the Word of God saysabout her and who God wants to
be for her life. And I, I sawthat she was standing on a firm
(02:35):
foundation. And I was reallyencouraged by it. And I don't
think it's disconnected fromwhat I'm wanting to talk about
today. Around. Who do you sayGod is? I'm wanting to have a
conversation about like, how doyou describe him? When you sit
back and you're, and you'resilently meditating upon the
(02:57):
Lord, and who he is? What wordscome to mind? What is your soul?
What? What's been etched uponyour soul? See, we often tend to
describe God in very abstractterms. And I'm making a
generality here, this is a broadgeneralities, not everybody, but
there is this very, there canoften be this very abstract way
(03:18):
of describing God right? Withintangible qualities and ideas
or concepts that we can onlytruly know when our intellect I
was reading this article not toolong ago was a little bit of a
while back ThoughtBot wasspeaking to how in the West we
have this obsession withinformation over relationship.
(03:40):
You see, he was saying we want adescription of God, not a
testimony, found only inrelationship, versus the Eastern
lens of describing God inconcrete terms. So tangible
terms, qualities andcharacteristics, things we can
know through our senses. Thingsthat we can observe and touch
(04:03):
and can only claim if we'veexperienced the truth of it.
Abstract descriptions of Godwould be God is love omnipotent,
good. Concrete descriptions ofGod would be things like the
Lord is my shepherd. The Lord ismy is our provider, our
deliverer. But ultimately, whatcaught my intention and inspired
(04:28):
this desire to have aconversation about who do you
say God is is the truth that itdoes matter how we describe God.
It does matter, that we movefrom just descriptions of God,
to a testimony that's found onlyin relationship. I want to spend
the rest of this conversationlooking at some scripture and
then pointing to some practicalexercises. The first one is
(04:51):
Psalms 18, two in the NLTversion. The psalmist says, The
Lord is my rock, man. I fortressand my Savior. My God is my rock
in whom I find protection. He ismy shield the power that saves
me and my place of safety. Anddo you see that my rock, my
(05:13):
fortress, my Savior, these areall things that the Psalm has
could see. These are true thingsexpressed in a vivid picture.
And then you have Psalms 121,five through six and the NLT
version. psalmist says the LordHimself watches over you. The
Lord stands beside you as yourprotective shade. The sun will
(05:37):
not harm you by day, nor themoon at night. The Lord keeps
you from all harm and watchesover your life. The Lord keeps
watch over you as you come andgo both now and forever. I want
to read that one more time itsays the Lord Himself watches
(05:58):
over you. The Lord stands besideyou as your protective shade.
The sun will not harm you byday, nor the moon at night. The
Lord keeps you from all harm andwatches over your life the Lord
keeps watch over you as you comeand go both now and forever. Who
can resonate with this word? TheLord Himself stands beside you
(06:25):
as your protective shade who canresonate with that? Can you
resonate with that truly askyourself that question. Because
I think only those who know whatit feels like to walk through
deserts can truly resonate withthat. They felt the scorn of
heat on their backs. Knowingthat feeling of when you're so
(06:51):
dehydrated, you stop sweating.
And the feeling to stumble uponthe closest bush or tree and
experience the visceral bodilyrelief found in coming to shade.
Think about that this is this iswhat makes exp experiencing the
(07:15):
Word of God. So Rich is goingGod I want to experience you as
my protective shade. I want toknow you intimately as my
protective shade. I want to knowthe truth that you watch over me
not just in my intellect but inmy heart and in my body. Let
that seep in deeper. I want thatto be a testimony I can claim
(07:35):
that I can anchor myself to sothat way no matter what
experience is happening to me inthis earth, no matter what I'm
facing I can testify to that tobe true. I can speak that over
myself. I can pass that storydown to my family. I can pass
(07:58):
down that that truth and thatwisdom of look at who God is for
us look at who God was for meand will be for you. I had this
really funny experience. Like Iresonate with this song because
I had a funny experience inArizona years ago. I was working
(08:19):
for I was doing marketing workfor Chick fil A and I was out in
Phoenix to train some othermarketing directors and I I
really wanted to see cactus likeI really want it I heard you
know you could see cactuses thatare taller than you and I'm like
what where does crazyinstallment I want to see a
cactus that's taller than me.
And so I had finished doing somedifferent trainings. And it was
(08:42):
my last day in Phoenix and I'mgonna go on a walk and I'm a sea
of some cactus. I was a littlecrazy. I realized this now,
Tempe is a beautiful city andwhenever I'm in an environment
where I can actually walk aroundand I don't have to drive around
everywhere. I get excited aboutthat and it's refreshing so like
I'm a walk to go to this, youknow, botanical garden area. I'm
(09:04):
assuming some cactus and so Istarted walking and like I said
I had my water inside of my bag.
It was super cold. I'm thinkingI'm good. Five minutes into the
walk. I reach over grab my waterand it is scorching hot like I'm
talking my water bottle is crazyhot and I'm like I don't even
(09:26):
want to drink this water.
Put it back in my bag. I keepmoving I'm like I'll be fine but
I was wrong. I did not know andprepared me for the dry heat.
That is Arizona. Basically I getto a point to where I cannot
find this Botanical Gardensarea. I should probably call
them Uber but the determinedpart of me the Gabriella does
not feel that will succeed inwhat she set out to do is like
(09:49):
I'm a fine this this BotanicalGardens place but I came to this
little bush and it provided thislike this deep relief reading
Psalms 121. And it talking aboutthe Lord being our shade. This
protective shade of going thePsalm as is trying to speak to
(10:11):
something really real here. He'ssaying something that could be
tangibly felt, that could betangibly witnessed. That
testimony could be given abouthis speaking something that
could be experienced, even inthe body. That feeling you feel.
When you're so hot, there seemsto be no place for shade, there
(10:35):
seems to be no covering, all youfeel is heat, and then to come
to a bush, little bitty tree,that sheltering your body just
enough to where your yoursurface temperature decreased.
And you feel that relief. That'swho the Lord is. That's who
that's who the psalmist isdescribing the Lord to be. Not
(10:58):
too long ago, maybe last year,sometime I was, I remember I was
taking a little walk around ourneighborhood. And I told the
Lord, I wanted to experiencegratitude, not just give it. And
as I was walking and spendingsome time with the Lord and
praying, I, it was really hotoutside at the time, you know, I
(11:20):
guess I have a thing for that.
And I stopped, I just happenedto pass by this tree. And he
recognized until after I passedby it, but I'm walking, and then
all of a sudden, I justexperienced this size of
satisfaction. And then I andthen I recognize, oh, that tree
was given a whole lot of shade.
(11:41):
I think I think it may feel like10 degrees lighter underneath
that tree. And so I went back,and I stood underneath that tree
for a moment. And I thought tomyself, God, right now I'm
experiencing your provision. AndI just sat in that for a moment,
and just experienced gratitudefor the Lord as my provider.
(12:02):
There's countless testimonies Ican give to that finance, about
how he's been that financially.
He's been that in countlessways. But in that moment, I was
realizing, wow, once again, thisis what it's like, this is what
it feels like, for God toprovide when you have a need.
And for the Lord to meet it. Iwalked right through provision.
(12:22):
And I was just grateful forthat. The fact that in that
moment, I knew to return back toit and recognize it as the
Lord's provision and sit therein it for a moment. The Lord is
my comforter is anotherdescription of God that has
mattered greatly to me.
(12:45):
Specifically, in 2021, there wassome back to back deaths in my
family, our hard to navigatethrough and after my god brother
passed, I had this sudden urgeto, you know, redecorate my
bedroom, and specifically waslike, I want new bedsheets. I
(13:05):
want different pictures hangingup around the room. So I went on
this journey around a couple ofdifferent department stores and
places like looking for theperfect comforter. I had a
specific budget of like, okay,this is about how much I want to
spend on a comforter. After Ihad finally purchased the
comforter. I had got everythingset up. And then I reached into
(13:29):
my bag, because I remembered inmy bag, someone, a part of the
community that I fellowship withor worship had put a little bit
of money in my bag. And I justfelt led to to not look at it
just yet. And so after settingup my bedroom, I reached into my
bag to pull out that money. Andto my surprise, I realized what
(13:56):
I had done. And I realized whatGod had just done. For wine, I
realized that I was searchingfor comfort. Very specifically
intangibly in the form of acomforter. I was literally
searching for a comforter. Andas I opened the, as I spread the
(14:20):
money out to count it, Irealized that the body of
Christ, the physical body ofChrist had financed my
comforter. And God was God is sogood. And he had so much desire
and he has so much desire tocomfort me that he gave me a
tangible representation. So thatevery night I would curl up in
(14:44):
this comforter, and I would havethe reminder of the fact that
the Lord truly is my comforter.
I literally I have a literalreminder every day that the Lord
is my comforter There's beenmoments after that season in
2021, of deeply grieving ourdays where I still get in my bed
(15:09):
and I, and I put that comfortover me. And I say, remember,
Gabrielle, this is howintentional God is with you.
These aren't philosophicalterms, these aren't superficial
beliefs or things about God thathave no weight, or no merit to
(15:31):
them. These are concrete truths,that you have a personal witness
and testimony of the Lord isyour comforter. And so now, I
wrap myself in that blanket. AndI'm there and I remember and it
becomes my literal resistanceagainst discouragement, my
(15:58):
literal resistance, so I, Iinvite you to find concrete
descriptions for God that aretrue, intangible for you, and
that are, of course, present inthe Word of God. Our hope for
(16:20):
people that would listen to thispodcast would be that listening
would reveal pathways to unlockgetting the healing power of
connection, so that you can seeyour relationships and the world
around you transformed fromfractured into flourishing. But
that can't happen withoutinviting other people from
(16:41):
different lived experiences, andbackgrounds to the table. So I'm
really excited about the factthat in the future, we're going
to be having more guests on theshow. So stay tuned and be on
the lookout for that. I cannotwait. If you're hearing this
message, you've listened to theentire episode. And for that, I
(17:01):
am deeply grateful. I hope thisepisode resonated with you and
if it did help us out by sharingthis episode, and leaving a
review on Apple podcasts, andSpotify. Most importantly, reach
out to let me know how you'reengaging with this episode, and
what topics you'd like to seecovered in the future. You can
connect with us on social media,or get in touch with me directly
(17:25):
at Gabrielle at returning tojoy.com to share your heart.
I'll see you in two weeks for anew episode.
Welcome to the return to joy podcast. I'm
your host, Gabrielle MichelLeonard. Here we're leading
people to cultivate joy throughstorytelling. We hope listening
will reveal pathways tounlocking the healing power of
connection, so that you can seeyour relationships and the world
around you transformed fromfractured into flourishing was
(00:24):
Beloved's. I am really glad tobe with you. And I'm coming
right now just extremelygrateful. I have got to lead out
with that. This episode I wantedto talk about who do you say God
is. But before we get into that,I've got to tell you that I feel
(00:45):
extremely grateful right now. Iearlier today, this morning, I
popped into the very tail end ofa event. And I had the
opportunity to have a very rawand tenderly honest conversation
with the Mayor of the City ofLive Oak. And she shared so much
(01:06):
vulnerable wisdom that I feltdeeply privileged to be on the
receiving end of and I had noclue that the Mayor of the City
of live over the last 12 yearswas a black woman. And one thing
that was really incredible fromthe conversation was, she didn't
even ask me what I did for aliving until the very end of our
(01:29):
conversation, we talked foralmost an hour. And she was just
sharing from her experiences oftriumph and pain. And I'm
soaking it all in tears comingdown my eyes. And I'm like this
This woman is, she doesn't evenrealize how much of an
encouragement she's been to me.
And I just felt very seen, I wasreally struck by the strength
(01:49):
that I saw in her. Because Iknow she's had pushback, I know
that she has experienced peoplesaying blatantly to her face.
And suddenly in the background,you don't belong here. But yet
she walked with this deepreverence this strength that
would that would say the veryopposite of that. I feel like
(02:12):
the reason why she walked andcarried the way herself the way
she did, was because of who herparents were for her. The
stories they told her the thingsthat they said about her and
about what the Word of God saysabout her and who God wants to
be for her life. And I, I sawthat she was standing on a firm
(02:35):
foundation. And I was reallyencouraged by it. And I don't
think it's disconnected fromwhat I'm wanting to talk about
today. Around. Who do you sayGod is? I'm wanting to have a
conversation about like, how doyou describe him? When you sit
back and you're, and you'resilently meditating upon the
(02:57):
Lord, and who he is? What wordscome to mind? What is your soul?
What? What's been etched uponyour soul? See, we often tend to
describe God in very abstractterms. And I'm making a
generality here, this is a broadgeneralities, not everybody, but
there is this very, there canoften be this very abstract way
(03:18):
of describing God right? Withintangible qualities and ideas
or concepts that we can onlytruly know when our intellect I
was reading this article not toolong ago was a little bit of a
while back ThoughtBot wasspeaking to how in the West we
have this obsession withinformation over relationship.
(03:40):
You see, he was saying we want adescription of God, not a
testimony, found only inrelationship, versus the Eastern
lens of describing God inconcrete terms. So tangible
terms, qualities andcharacteristics, things we can
know through our senses. Thingsthat we can observe and touch
(04:03):
and can only claim if we'veexperienced the truth of it.
Abstract descriptions of Godwould be God is love omnipotent,
good. Concrete descriptions ofGod would be things like the
Lord is my shepherd. The Lord ismy is our provider, our
deliverer. But ultimately, whatcaught my intention and inspired
(04:28):
this desire to have aconversation about who do you
say God is is the truth that itdoes matter how we describe God.
It does matter, that we movefrom just descriptions of God,
to a testimony that's found onlyin relationship. I want to spend
the rest of this conversationlooking at some scripture and
then pointing to some practicalexercises. The first one is
(04:51):
Psalms 18, two in the NLTversion. The psalmist says, The
Lord is my rock, man. I fortressand my Savior. My God is my rock
in whom I find protection. He ismy shield the power that saves
me and my place of safety. Anddo you see that my rock, my
(05:13):
fortress, my Savior, these areall things that the Psalm has
could see. These are true thingsexpressed in a vivid picture.
And then you have Psalms 121,five through six and the NLT
version. psalmist says the LordHimself watches over you. The
Lord stands beside you as yourprotective shade. The sun will
(05:37):
not harm you by day, nor themoon at night. The Lord keeps
you from all harm and watchesover your life. The Lord keeps
watch over you as you come andgo both now and forever. I want
to read that one more time itsays the Lord Himself watches
(05:58):
over you. The Lord stands besideyou as your protective shade.
The sun will not harm you byday, nor the moon at night. The
Lord keeps you from all harm andwatches over your life the Lord
keeps watch over you as you comeand go both now and forever. Who
can resonate with this word? TheLord Himself stands beside you
(06:25):
as your protective shade who canresonate with that? Can you
resonate with that truly askyourself that question. Because
I think only those who know whatit feels like to walk through
deserts can truly resonate withthat. They felt the scorn of
heat on their backs. Knowingthat feeling of when you're so
(06:51):
dehydrated, you stop sweating.
And the feeling to stumble uponthe closest bush or tree and
experience the visceral bodilyrelief found in coming to shade.
Think about that this is this iswhat makes exp experiencing the
(07:15):
Word of God. So Rich is goingGod I want to experience you as
my protective shade. I want toknow you intimately as my
protective shade. I want to knowthe truth that you watch over me
not just in my intellect but inmy heart and in my body. Let
that seep in deeper. I want thatto be a testimony I can claim
(07:35):
that I can anchor myself to sothat way no matter what
experience is happening to me inthis earth, no matter what I'm
facing I can testify to that tobe true. I can speak that over
myself. I can pass that storydown to my family. I can pass
(07:58):
down that that truth and thatwisdom of look at who God is for
us look at who God was for meand will be for you. I had this
really funny experience. Like Iresonate with this song because
I had a funny experience inArizona years ago. I was working
(08:19):
for I was doing marketing workfor Chick fil A and I was out in
Phoenix to train some othermarketing directors and I I
really wanted to see cactus likeI really want it I heard you
know you could see cactuses thatare taller than you and I'm like
what where does crazyinstallment I want to see a
cactus that's taller than me.
And so I had finished doing somedifferent trainings. And it was
(08:42):
my last day in Phoenix and I'mgonna go on a walk and I'm a sea
of some cactus. I was a littlecrazy. I realized this now,
Tempe is a beautiful city andwhenever I'm in an environment
where I can actually walk aroundand I don't have to drive around
everywhere. I get excited aboutthat and it's refreshing so like
I'm a walk to go to this, youknow, botanical garden area. I'm
(09:04):
assuming some cactus and so Istarted walking and like I said
I had my water inside of my bag.
It was super cold. I'm thinkingI'm good. Five minutes into the
walk. I reach over grab my waterand it is scorching hot like I'm
talking my water bottle is crazyhot and I'm like I don't even
(09:26):
want to drink this water.
Put it back in my bag. I keepmoving I'm like I'll be fine but
I was wrong. I did not know andprepared me for the dry heat.
That is Arizona. Basically I getto a point to where I cannot
find this Botanical Gardensarea. I should probably call
them Uber but the determinedpart of me the Gabriella does
not feel that will succeed inwhat she set out to do is like
(09:49):
I'm a fine this this BotanicalGardens place but I came to this
little bush and it provided thislike this deep relief reading
Psalms 121. And it talking aboutthe Lord being our shade. This
protective shade of going thePsalm as is trying to speak to
(10:11):
something really real here. He'ssaying something that could be
tangibly felt, that could betangibly witnessed. That
testimony could be given abouthis speaking something that
could be experienced, even inthe body. That feeling you feel.
When you're so hot, there seemsto be no place for shade, there
(10:35):
seems to be no covering, all youfeel is heat, and then to come
to a bush, little bitty tree,that sheltering your body just
enough to where your yoursurface temperature decreased.
And you feel that relief. That'swho the Lord is. That's who
that's who the psalmist isdescribing the Lord to be. Not
(10:58):
too long ago, maybe last year,sometime I was, I remember I was
taking a little walk around ourneighborhood. And I told the
Lord, I wanted to experiencegratitude, not just give it. And
as I was walking and spendingsome time with the Lord and
praying, I, it was really hotoutside at the time, you know, I
(11:20):
guess I have a thing for that.
And I stopped, I just happenedto pass by this tree. And he
recognized until after I passedby it, but I'm walking, and then
all of a sudden, I justexperienced this size of
satisfaction. And then I andthen I recognize, oh, that tree
was given a whole lot of shade.
(11:41):
I think I think it may feel like10 degrees lighter underneath
that tree. And so I went back,and I stood underneath that tree
for a moment. And I thought tomyself, God, right now I'm
experiencing your provision. AndI just sat in that for a moment,
and just experienced gratitudefor the Lord as my provider.
(12:02):
There's countless testimonies Ican give to that finance, about
how he's been that financially.
He's been that in countlessways. But in that moment, I was
realizing, wow, once again, thisis what it's like, this is what
it feels like, for God toprovide when you have a need.
And for the Lord to meet it. Iwalked right through provision.
(12:22):
And I was just grateful forthat. The fact that in that
moment, I knew to return back toit and recognize it as the
Lord's provision and sit therein it for a moment. The Lord is
my comforter is anotherdescription of God that has
mattered greatly to me.
(12:45):
Specifically, in 2021, there wassome back to back deaths in my
family, our hard to navigatethrough and after my god brother
passed, I had this sudden urgeto, you know, redecorate my
bedroom, and specifically waslike, I want new bedsheets. I
(13:05):
want different pictures hangingup around the room. So I went on
this journey around a couple ofdifferent department stores and
places like looking for theperfect comforter. I had a
specific budget of like, okay,this is about how much I want to
spend on a comforter. After Ihad finally purchased the
comforter. I had got everythingset up. And then I reached into
(13:29):
my bag, because I remembered inmy bag, someone, a part of the
community that I fellowship withor worship had put a little bit
of money in my bag. And I justfelt led to to not look at it
just yet. And so after settingup my bedroom, I reached into my
bag to pull out that money. Andto my surprise, I realized what
(13:56):
I had done. And I realized whatGod had just done. For wine, I
realized that I was searchingfor comfort. Very specifically
intangibly in the form of acomforter. I was literally
searching for a comforter. Andas I opened the, as I spread the
(14:20):
money out to count it, Irealized that the body of
Christ, the physical body ofChrist had financed my
comforter. And God was God is sogood. And he had so much desire
and he has so much desire tocomfort me that he gave me a
tangible representation. So thatevery night I would curl up in
(14:44):
this comforter, and I would havethe reminder of the fact that
the Lord truly is my comforter.
I literally I have a literalreminder every day that the Lord
is my comforter There's beenmoments after that season in
2021, of deeply grieving ourdays where I still get in my bed
(15:09):
and I, and I put that comfortover me. And I say, remember,
Gabrielle, this is howintentional God is with you.
These aren't philosophicalterms, these aren't superficial
beliefs or things about God thathave no weight, or no merit to
(15:31):
them. These are concrete truths,that you have a personal witness
and testimony of the Lord isyour comforter. And so now, I
wrap myself in that blanket. AndI'm there and I remember and it
becomes my literal resistanceagainst discouragement, my
(15:58):
literal resistance, so I, Iinvite you to find concrete
descriptions for God that aretrue, intangible for you, and
that are, of course, present inthe Word of God. Our hope for
(16:20):
people that would listen to thispodcast would be that listening
would reveal pathways to unlockgetting the healing power of
connection, so that you can seeyour relationships and the world
around you transformed fromfractured into flourishing. But
that can't happen withoutinviting other people from
(16:41):
different lived experiences, andbackgrounds to the table. So I'm
really excited about the factthat in the future, we're going
to be having more guests on theshow. So stay tuned and be on
the lookout for that. I cannotwait. If you're hearing this
message, you've listened to theentire episode. And for that, I
(17:01):
am deeply grateful. I hope thisepisode resonated with you and
if it did help us out by sharingthis episode, and leaving a
review on Apple podcasts, andSpotify. Most importantly, reach
out to let me know how you'reengaging with this episode, and
what topics you'd like to seecovered in the future. You can
connect with us on social media,or get in touch with me directly
(17:25):
at Gabrielle at returning tojoy.com to share your heart.
I'll see you in two weeks for anew episode.
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