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July 29, 2025 23 mins
Every Tuesday, Landon Mueller, host of Review-Pop, breaks down the latest episode of Six Minutes: Out of Time.

In today's episode, Landon is joined by Tom Casiello, one of the head writers of Six Minutes.

In this week's episode of Six Minutes, Adelaide arrives just in time to help Cyrus. Meanwhile, River and Sam explain their situation to Cam.

Credits:

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Six Minutes: Out of Time (Season 4)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ -⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Episode 45⁠⁠⁠ by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Gen-Z Media
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Six Minutes: Out of Time (Season 4)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Theme Music by⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Gen-Z Media
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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, listeners, it's lending here. I just wanted to let
you all know that the following recording was made in
a different room than I usually recorded, so if you're
wearing headphones, you might notice a slight reverb. But I
hope you enjoy this episode. There are kids in this

(00:27):
world who are different, special special specials. There are these
kids out there somewhere you're.

Speaker 2 (00:37):
Why is it always six minus?

Speaker 1 (00:49):
In this episode, I'll be breaking down the latest episode,
a six minute season four piece, five piece. Well, hello
review pop listeners, it's your cinema now. We are here
todaying to talk about episode forty five of Six Minutes,

(01:11):
season four, called checking it Out Neverland, and we are
joined here by one of the head writers of Six Minutes,
who has put together countless outlines for episodes, Tom Cassielo.
Hey Tom, how are you doing.

Speaker 2 (01:24):
I'm doing well.

Speaker 1 (01:24):
How are you awesome? Yeah, I'm doing great. It's so
great to have you on the show. And this is
an interview that I've wanted to do for a really
long time, you know, and you really made the show
what it is, so I think it's so great.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
Oh, thank you, I'm hunted. I'm flattered.

Speaker 3 (01:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:42):
Six minutes is very near and dear to my heart.
I had no idea when we started that it was
going to turn to this, not a clue, So it's
pretty it's pretty.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
Amazing to watch.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
I don't think anyone could have ever imagined that it
become you know what it has.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, it's funny.

Speaker 4 (01:57):
When David and I first started, I remember very early
on in the process, we were still trying figure out
who the characters were and how many siblings there were.
I mean, we were talking like nothing was really done yet,
and I remember Dave saying to me that the thing
about podcasts is that most of them don't find an
audience until after they're over. So, you know, he prepared me.
He said, you know, listen, just so you know, chances

(02:18):
are not many people are going to have heard of
this when it comes out, and we probably won't hear
about it until it's all over and people start talking
about it, and so there was this real delayed reaction,
you know, and in people kind of discovering it and
jumping on board. So it was it was really cool.
I think we had just finished, we had just finished writing.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
The first podcast, the first series.

Speaker 4 (02:40):
When school started to pick up on it and teachers
started to use it, and that was that was really
just mind blowing to witness, you know, three years after
we had started, you know, writing it.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
I think that's awesome for sure. And well, I mean
I think you know, it picked up you know a
good amount of traction at the start, but you know,
things really blew up that for sure, right because I
remember it was like, I think number one on Apple podcasts,
you know, for fiction when it first came out, But
it's gone so far beyond that, and I think it's

(03:11):
just great.

Speaker 4 (03:11):
Yeah, it's it's it's just been really humbling and really
awesome just to see and everybody who.

Speaker 2 (03:17):
Worked on it on that first series.

Speaker 4 (03:18):
You know, it's such a great group of people and
such a great vibe among that cast.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
And I think you probably talked about this with Dave
when you interviewed him.

Speaker 4 (03:27):
But like part of the joy of six Minutes was
that we recorded with the Anders family all in person,
all at the same time, so like you know, James, Monica, Cyrus, Brindley.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
Holliday, they were all in the studio.

Speaker 4 (03:39):
Together, playing off of each other, and that, like I
think made all the difference Because you listen to those
early family scenes, and they're so there's such a great
vibe between them.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
You know, you can just you can you can feel
the connection between them.

Speaker 1 (03:52):
Yeah, so, you know, we have some questions today before
we get into the episode. And you know, my first
question is really I'm wondering how you got, you know,
interested in working on Six Minutes and you kind of
touched on that, but you have, of course, you know,
worked on many kinds of projects.

Speaker 4 (04:11):
You know.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
I thought it was so cool to hear about, you know,
how you worked on Apex Legends, which is something that
you know, I you know, used to play, and so
I thought that was so cool, and you know, you
work in a lot of awesome spaces. But what sparked
your interest in in, you know, in six Minutes and
working on that project.

Speaker 4 (04:29):
So I started my career writing soap operas, and that's
where I first met Dave.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
And Dave and I worked on sister shows.

Speaker 4 (04:36):
I worked on As the World Turns, He worked on
Gutting Late and they were both on by Proctor and Gamble.

Speaker 2 (04:40):
So we would have like our Christmas parties together and whatnot.
And so I knew Dave. I never worked with them,
but I knew him.

Speaker 4 (04:47):
We got along great, and then years later, when I
became a writer at WWE, Dave ended up.

Speaker 2 (04:54):
Randomly being hired there about I.

Speaker 4 (04:57):
Was there for six years, and in my fourth year year,
I believe Dave was hired as head writer and it.

Speaker 2 (05:02):
Were just great because I knew him from soaps and
so like.

Speaker 4 (05:04):
When I left WWE, I moved from New York to
Los Angeles. I wanted to get out of CV and
I was looking for work. This is before APEX. I
was looking for work and I wasn't sure what I
was going to do yet for work, and I didn't
know what I wanted to do. And Dave contacted me
about a month after I got to Los Angeles and
he said, you know, I'm starting this company.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
We're going to do podcasts. We're a new kids podcasts.
I really want to do like an.

Speaker 4 (05:29):
Ongoing one where we do two episodes a week and
it's ongoing kind of serialized form. And he said, you know,
I thought of you immediately, and I knew you were
looking for work. And I said, okay, well what's it about.
And he said, well, I don't really know totally what
it's about. He goes, I know that it's going to
start with finding this girl in the water, and that
you have like.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
An organization that's chasing her. And I think I know
what her secret is, and yeah, that's about all I have.
And I said, okay, well, you.

Speaker 4 (05:58):
Know, I wasn't working at the time and I needed money,
and I thought, well, why not, I'll give this a shot.
Out nerve written for podcasts before, but this could be interesting,
and so Dave and I started.

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Working on outlines.

Speaker 4 (06:08):
We got two scriptwriters who also worked in soaps, and
so we hired Marla and Nitti.

Speaker 2 (06:15):
And I think we had.

Speaker 4 (06:17):
Written the first hundred episodes before we even recorded one.
We had gotten all the way through the introduction of
Whittier Corp. And the flash card stuff and science fare,
and we had just burned down the house and the
family was on the run and like, and I thought,
we haven't even recorded an episode yet, Like, I have
no idea if this is good or bad or what like,
but we're gonna see how it goes. And so we

(06:39):
recorded the first twenty and I don't know what I.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Expected, but it wasn't that I was blown away.

Speaker 4 (06:48):
I had no idea this that, that, the that Chris
and this sound quality was going to be so incredibly strong,
Like it was so real, it was so immersive. I
remember like crying in those first twenty episodes because I
was so like, I can't believe how real this is,
Like I can't believe how how solid this is, and
how I don't miss images like it's it's I'm so

(07:09):
used to watching TV and I don't miss it at all,
Like this is great.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Yeah, you know, you tell such a big story and
you know it's impacted so many people, and you know
a way that's that's almost hard to describe because, uh,
it's it's a one of a kind show and I
don't think there will ever be anything, you know, quite
like six minutes and I think it's really just so great.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
For sure, Thanks, thank you so much for saying that
it's it's I feel the same way.

Speaker 1 (07:34):
Yeah, for sure. I think that's awesome. Yeah. Well, the
next question I've asked to everyone who's been on the show,
what was the first radio drama or audio drama you
listen to? Right when I had David Kresman on the podcast, uh,
he mentioned that the first audio drama he really worked
on was for an anniversary episode of Guiding Light you know,

(07:55):
which originally started off as you know, our radio drama,
so you know, I thought was really interesting.

Speaker 4 (08:01):
Yeah, he did an episode, a special episode of Gunny
Light where he kind of went back and kind of
revisited those characters.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
What was the first one? I mean, I remember as.

Speaker 4 (08:09):
A kid, my dad who was really into like he
was really into old radio dramas from like the fifties,
like the Green Hornet and the Shadow.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
And there was another one.

Speaker 4 (08:21):
There was a comedy one. He would play those in
the car and I would listen to them. I don't
think I listened to another one again until until Dave
called me and said, do you.

Speaker 2 (08:31):
Want to do this? And at that time, there was
a podcast.

Speaker 4 (08:34):
Out called I'm not gonna remember the name of it.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
It was a spooky podcast.

Speaker 4 (08:40):
It was called it was really popular and I'm trying
to remember the name of it. I listened to a
few episodes of that to kind of get a feel
for what it is Dave was looking for. But yeah,
other than that, I can't think of any other ones
that I listened to.

Speaker 1 (08:53):
When Six Minutes and even going back to Marshpattel started,
there wasn't a lot of you know, audio dramas out there,
and since then it's it's definitely blown up.

Speaker 4 (09:03):
I still feel like when I tell people that I'm
I'm the head writer for six minutes, and they're like, oh,
what's six minutes?

Speaker 2 (09:08):
And I try to explain it to them, there's still
a bit of confusion, like, wait, what do you mean
you write podcasts, Like like you write the interview questions.
I'm like, no, it's not an interview. It's a story.
Like it's all it's all scripted. It it's fiction.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
Yeah, all right, Well, next question. When I had Dave
on the podcast back in May, he noted that, you know,
six minutes is sort of a short soap opera, and
you know, I bring that up because, you know, I'm
curious if there are any aspects of you know, writing
soaps that you use on six minutes, right, would you
say it's pretty similar? And in what ways is writing

(09:45):
six minutes different?

Speaker 2 (09:46):
In soaps?

Speaker 4 (09:47):
There's two different writing teams. There's an outline team and
there's a there's a dialogue script team. And when we
started this, we just thought, well, we're used to the
soap format, so we might as well just do the
soap format. So I would write all the outlines and
then once David Pru done, then we send them to
the to Nidia and Marletta to be scriptwriters and to
turn it into scripts.

Speaker 2 (10:04):
And so we kind of kept to that process and
it still works.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
You know, I'm curious about, you know, your writing for
season four and you know maybe also season three. How
has that writing been different from you know, previous seasons.
You you know, kind of touched about that, but you
know the next part, right, you know, the story arcs
are a lot different between you know, or from you know,
seasons one and two.

Speaker 4 (10:29):
It is much more so than the first series. The
first series, I would turn in an outline to the
scriptwriters a completed outline, and nine times out of ten
it was exactly what ended up going into the podcast episode.
Like I would listen to the podcast episode two months
later when it came out, and it was exactly what

(10:50):
was in my outline. This series, the sequel, has been
a constantly changing, constantly evolving process because well, numerous reasons.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
Like we are dealing with people's schedules.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
Who are They're all adults now, they all have like
crazy schedules, they all live in different parts of the country,
they can't record at certain times because of that, and
because schedules have been so wonky, there have been times
where we can't get a character for an episode, and
Dave at the last minute, on his own, we'll have
to rewrite the whole episode from scratch and come up
with a different episode where that doesn't involve this character
or that character, you know, which changes everything and every

(11:27):
episode after that, and so like I'll get these emails
from Dave going just so you know, I had to
rewrite these four episodes and they're completely different now, and like,
definitely go back and read them because they're not what
you had in the outlines. It's I've really had to
stay on top of things and be like, Okay, what
are we.

Speaker 2 (11:41):
End up going with here? Where are we like?

Speaker 1 (11:43):
What you know?

Speaker 2 (11:44):
And Dave's great.

Speaker 4 (11:45):
I love working with Dave because he's he's with any
other producer slash co head writer. He it could be disastrous,
but Dave always keeps me up to speed on the
changes and he always like comes through and explains to
me why things change and it's not because the story's
not good.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
Of scheduling and went on.

Speaker 4 (12:01):
So I've had to stay on my toes with this
series a lot more than I did.

Speaker 2 (12:04):
In the first one.

Speaker 1 (12:05):
Yeah for sure. All right, Uh, now we're gonna get
into the clips from the episode. Yeah, here we go
with the first clip.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
Why it's would this would be the key to saving
your life? Maybe I don't want to be saved like this?
You can't dream people this way? What kind of person
are you? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (12:35):
I mean the thing I loved about always writing Doctor
Whittier is this is a man who ruined countless lives.
I mean, he has his his He's done so much
damage to so many people, and.

Speaker 2 (12:49):
It's all because he loves his daughter too much. Like
this is my favorite kind of villain. My favorite kind
of villain is the kind of villain that.

Speaker 4 (12:55):
Like that, like, isn't a bad person necessarily, it's just
they're doing all of the wrong things for the right reasons.
And it was really important to us, if we were
going back to the eighties, it was really important to
us to kind of introduce Adelaide as a real character
because she is so important to this story.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
But she really is just a story that's told in
the first podcast.

Speaker 4 (13:17):
You know, we don't meet her, we don't know anything
about her other than she she died young.

Speaker 2 (13:21):
And that's all we know.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
Yeah, I think I think that's definitely It was such
a you know, big part of the story. And I remember,
you know, thinking about you know, for like kind of
almost you know a little bit during like Cyrus the
Las tapes. I remember me, both me and like fans
thinking all right, maybe this is Adelaide.

Speaker 2 (13:40):
That was kind of intentional. We were kind of hoping
people would think she was Adelaide.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeah, and I love the character of angel and I
think that was like something that you know, I think
both me and like so many fans have been happy
with the fact that we'll get to like revisit Angelica
Graves in like a different sort of way.

Speaker 5 (14:00):
I don't feel, yes, you know, there's there there's a
big question mark here because you know, Monica's working really

(14:22):
hard to save this girl's life, but that comes with consequences, and.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
I think it'll be really interesting to see how doctor,
what are your handles this? Also, I love how Monica
comes to Adeloid's aid, right, She's always trying to you know,
help others before herself.

Speaker 4 (14:39):
You know, I don't want I don't want to spoil anything,
but like, you know, there's there's things that are happening
right now that you don't even realize are happening, that
are going to like come back and haunt people later,
which I think is a lot of fun and and
really great. It's one of the fun things about time
travel you can do is you can mess with things.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
So we're not regular humans.

Speaker 2 (14:59):
With kids sidebot you brought Wick kids here? No, No,
just run of the middle time travelers.

Speaker 4 (15:05):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (15:06):
Good point is we don't have a home.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
I think it's interesting that that Cam still holds a
grudge against Wit kids, even after you know, getting in
an Ocasey. Of course, for a time Casey was forced
to be a person she wasn't. She didn't get to
make her own choices, So I think Cam relates to that.
But you know, she still considers never lying to be
you know, the Bots Island. You know, I'm curious, why

(15:34):
did you know? Was it kind of hard to do?
Like kind of like a long build up like this,
because I think there's been a build up since like
an episode in like the twenties range.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
Yeah, and it's it's this is all building to the finale.

Speaker 1 (15:48):
I think it's only six or seven episodes left.

Speaker 4 (15:51):
I think, yeah, we're almost there and and kind of
getting everybody into one place was definitely, like, I'll be
honest with you, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (16:01):
Even sure how some of it got pulled off.

Speaker 4 (16:03):
I know Dave had to do some last bone rewrites,
but like, like trying to get this entire cast of
characters to all end up in the same location, it
was a logistical nightmare, especially because most of them are
in Alaska, which is about as far away from Neverland
as you can get. Trying to like make this all
happening and have everybody converge in the same location. Yeah,
it has been a real Yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
Did someone say Alexa Academy? You know it? Who's this? Hi?

Speaker 1 (16:32):
Sorry, I'm Mila.

Speaker 2 (16:34):
You guys were at Alexa Academy.

Speaker 1 (16:36):
We shut up after it was already gone. Why do
you happen to know someone named Katie? And you know,
it's kind of funny because I was talking about Cam
ninety seven, you know, aka Meela in the last episode,
and you know, so I think that you know now
that she's back, you know, asking about Katie is a

(16:59):
good sign because it shows that she still cares about
Katie and you know, hopes to see her again. Yeah,
And so that's like another thing that I'm sure you
guys work to wrap up for this season, like getting
you know, them to see each other once again, because
that was kind of a big part of the end
of last season.

Speaker 2 (17:18):
Yeah, it was.

Speaker 4 (17:19):
And it's the moment that I feel humanizes Katie the
most in the first season, and and and second, like
it's what makes you root for her, really's antagonist for
so long, and much like Brittley in the first series,
we needed something to kind of anchor Katie, you know,
down to make her seem more three dimensional and less
always you know, the pain in the butt that she

(17:41):
is and and somebody you're rooting for and that you
want to see succeed in life.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
And and Mila was kind of the way in with that.

Speaker 4 (17:48):
And and she's been hurt, and she's been she's been
abandoned and by many people in her life.

Speaker 3 (17:59):
I was wondering if if I could get you some
more Hakoku, you still look kind of cold.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
Oh sorry, yes.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (18:17):
I think there's a lot you can take from that.
And I love their awkwardness. I mean, you know, it's great.
Most of the time they've resorted to fighting or making
fun of each other. But we're seeing a real shift.
I think a while back, you know, I was talking
about older Joe and you know, in the beginning he
was kind of seen as you know, just being one person, right,
being you know, that country guy. And he's a lot

(18:39):
more than that, right, He's he's very loving.

Speaker 4 (18:42):
Yeah, I mean, we really it's so interesting because from
Key's perspective, like what do you do when you know
your whole future is or you think you know your
whole future is and then you like meet the guy
that you're gonna marry. Like I think she played the
awkwardness beautifully, like the it's a weird situation and she
knows it's weird, and youah, same thing with with River
and Sam and kind of and.

Speaker 1 (19:03):
It's hard to think about knowing that their whole life
is laid out for them.

Speaker 3 (19:10):
No one knows better than me that biology isn't what
makes your parents your parents, I know, but do you
I mean, one of my daughters isn't even human.

Speaker 1 (19:28):
We're seeing such a great relationship between James and Brinley
and and I mean it's kind of similar to like
when you know, Holiday found out that she was made
of Cyrus's blood. But James said, you know, we've always
been a family, and we don't need blood to prove that.

Speaker 4 (19:44):
Yeah, And that was really like important to us to
kind of make clear we didn't we didn't want to.
I remember we debated that beat a lot in the
first first series with Cyrus, the reveal that it was
Cyrus's blood, and because we didn't want to send the
message that like, oh, well, holiday, you know, is it
really adopted? Because she came from Cyrus and so therefore
she is biologically connected to them, and so, you know,

(20:05):
something that's really important to all of us as writers.
One of us writers has an adopted daughter and like,
and it was really important to her to play this
stuff and to keep it as true to life as
possible and like and and to not send any wrong
messages here. And I applaud her for writing these episodes
and for keeping that so alive because it's it's so
important to the story.

Speaker 2 (20:28):
You want even from nineteen eighty.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
Nine, I am treating your daughter.

Speaker 4 (20:32):
Is this really a good time to discuss.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
That Cyrus is your son? Doctor Ands?

Speaker 1 (20:41):
This kind of changes everything, does Doctor Wood. You're still
trust Cyrus enough to, you know, let them cure Adelaide,
let them help at least, And yeah, i'd imagine so,
because right after this clip, doctor Woodier said that Cyrus
won't be safe unless you know, Adelaide is cured. And
that's kind of I mean, that's a really big.

Speaker 2 (20:58):
Thing, it is.

Speaker 4 (20:59):
And I think, you know, I guess I was saying
before about you know, the through line of the Wittier character,
like this Whittier, this version of Whittyear is all about
his daughter.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
And I think that's the really.

Speaker 4 (21:07):
Interesting thing about playing Jude and Doctor Whittier at the
same time in the series, because you have a man
who is all about his little girl and all about
protecting her at all costs and using anybody and everybody
you know to make sure that she is safe.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
And then you have the doctor Whittier before he had
a daughter.

Speaker 4 (21:25):
He has a very different set of priorities and a
very different set of rules that he plays by because
he hasn't been he hasn't had that life changing experience
of having a kid.

Speaker 2 (21:36):
What's happening? Time for a rescue?

Speaker 4 (21:39):
Well then and coming with you, Oh no, not now
in a.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Moment for Cyrus.

Speaker 1 (21:51):
Yeah, I mean I love how like little Brin kept
coming back. I think at first, I was like, Okay,
you know, maybe she'll be in a couple episodes, but
you know, it's it's definitely turned into a bigger thing,
and and I think it's great. Hey, well, thank you
so much for joining me on the podcast. Thank you
so much, you know, for you know, taking the time
to you know, answer these questions. And I love how

(22:14):
involved you've been with the show, and you know, you've
really been such a big part of the show and
making it you know what it is. And so I
thank you so much. It was so it was so
awesome you.

Speaker 2 (22:25):
I thank you all the fans.

Speaker 4 (22:26):
I hope we don't disappoint as in the rest of
the season four and and the season five.

Speaker 2 (22:33):
I think you're in for a heck of a ride.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
And yeah, please until next time, this is Lene and
sang Peace, Love and Time Travel

Speaker 2 (23:00):
The mot to COSI
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