September 18, 2025 • 25 mins
In this engaging episode of RIA Collective, host Charlie Van Derven sits down with Greg Curry, founder of Pillar Financial in Louisville, Kentucky. With nearly three decades of experience spanning accounting, insurance, and independent advisory, Greg shares his unique journey from CPA and institutional product management to building a successful fee-only RIA.
The conversation dives into the lessons Greg has learned along the way—why simplicity and operational excellence are critical to client success, how a focus on planning over products builds lasting trust, and why clear processes and systems are the backbone of a thriving practice. Greg reflects on early challenges, the importance of owning mistakes and making clients whole, and the power of delivering financial advice that clients can truly understand and act on.
Listeners will gain insights into cash flow–based planning, the use of homegrown tools like Excel alongside specialized software, and Greg’s philosophy that true value lies not in predicting markets but in guiding clients confidently through them.
Tune in for a thoughtful discussion on the intersection of simplicity, transparency, and genuine client care, and how these principles can shape both a successful advisory practice and deeply rewarding client relationships.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Char (00:00):
Welcome to RIA Collective.
My name's Charlie Van Dervinand if you listen to our
podcast in past months, you'llsee that we haven't posted
an episode in a long time.
My company, social Advisorswent through a little
restructuring, and frankly,the podcast got set aside
for about a year and a half.
But it's something I lovedoing and so we're dusting
it off and bringing it back.
(00:20):
And, the purpose forthe podcast is to we're
talking to owners of RIA.
I've worked in financialservices for almost 30 years.
My guest has too, so we'll we'llintroduce him in a second here.
And one of the things that hascome up time and again, is a
lack of trust in the industry.
Advisors selling proprietaryproducts and having to hit
(00:40):
quotas and, maybe servingthemselves and then the company
before they serve a client.
And I truly believe in havingworked in many facets of
the industry that the RIAor the independent channel
creates the purest clientadvisor relationship.
Of course, being a fee onlyadvisor takes a lot of the
bias outta recommendationsand things like that.
In my little world, I liketo interview owners of RIAs
(01:02):
to get to learn about theirexperience, whether they made a
transition out of a wirehouse.
Large large insurance house.
Like our guest today he hadsome background in product
sales at, on the insurancelevel, but he didn't
really make that breakaway.
However, he's got some greatlessons to teach for for some
maybe young advisors thatfind themselves in a big bank
that maybe that's not theright place for him anymore.
(01:23):
Without further ado, letme introduce Greg Curry,
my guest for the day.
Greg is, greg's firm iscalled Pillar Financially.
He's based outta Louisville,Kentucky, and Greg's been
at this 28 years, so he'sgot a lot of wisdom to drop.
Greg, welcome man.
Thank you for being myguest on RA Collective.
Greg Curry (01:39):
Thanks for having me.
I'm excited to sharewhatever I can.
Like I mentioned before, it'sbeen a long time, so memory
might be a little sketchy,a little selective, but.
It's still there.
Haven't lost it
Charlie van Derven (01:51):
yet.
Listen around.
We, we bonded over thingsother than the industry.
We both love punk rock.
You got a couple years onme, Greg just a couple.
Just a couple.
Not too many guitar inthe background there.
I've got one on the wall though.
Your mind has more dust on itthan years does, it looks like.
And he didn't shame me toobad for actually liking the
Grateful Dead too, right?
Yeah.
Greg Curry (02:11):
Like I said, every we all have our flaws.
I'm sure I've got my own.
Charlie van Derven (02:16):
Yeah.
We don't want to bring that up.
Not no.
So good.
Greg, we often interview peoplewho come out that big bank
environment or come out of abig insurance house who, pushing
prop proprietary products.
And some peoplehave, legal issues.
They had to deal withyour situation's a
little bit different.
But, the conversationwe're getting to know
each other really was.
Based around operations.
So I think you bring a lot ofvalue to our conversation today.
(02:38):
Why don't you give usa little background.
How'd how'd you end upstarting your own RIA?
Greg Curry (02:42):
Yeah, so my background is I started as a
CPA, worked in a large Coopersand library, and that'll,
that name will date me whenit was still the Big eight.
And worked therefor three years.
Loved the experience usedthe experience being a CPA.
Back then today, it hasreally carried through
my entire career.
But after about three years,moved to a large Louisville
(03:03):
insurance company whereI spent a little time in
internal audit and then movedover to, a product, but it
wasn't you say product sales.
It wasn't a retail product, itwas an institutional product.
Okay.
So our customers were large 401kplans in the stable value space.
Any, anybody who hashad a 401k plan probably
(03:24):
had a stable value fund.
That was our our niche.
And we, we workedwith large investment.
Advisors because weprovided guarantees.
But I'm getting ahead of myself.
But going through that process,I started on the operation side.
So when I moved over to thatproduct side of the business, I
started in operations doing theadministration for these stable
(03:47):
value contracts until I actuallymoved into product management
and more, I wouldn't call itsales as much as sales support.
Charlie van Derven (03:56):
Okay,
Greg Curry (03:57):
so I was the expert,
Charlie van Derven (03:58):
right?
Yeah.
Greg Curry (03:59):
I had more experience than anybody.
It was a brand newproduct when I started.
Very cool.
Great experience.
Got to work with some ofthe biggest fixed income
managers in the world.
Saw how they worked.
A lot of that actuallyhelped define our
investment philosophy,which is very passive.
In nature, because I heard alot of stories about how great
(04:20):
these investment managerswere, and then at the end
of the day, it didn't come.
It didn't come to fruition.
So
Charlie v (04:28):
yeah, your experience was a little different.
Greg Curry (04:29):
Yeah, it was okay.
They weren't bad.
It was just nobody was reallyadding the value that they,
thought they would regardless.
Having that operationsbackground having that real,
key to being able to serveour clients was being able to
have good systems behind us.
When I did start the theRIA, when I started Pillar
Financial I was comingfrom a different world.
(04:53):
I was coming from theinstitutional world,
not the retail world.
Yeah.
So for me, starting a anRIA a fee only practice.
Only seemed natural becausethat's what I was used to.
Yeah.
There's not an institutionalplay, big institutional player
out there that's gonna paycommissions or pay to play
type things or anything likethat on any ongoing basis.
(05:17):
So to me it was just natural.
Charlie van Derven (05:19):
Cool.
So what what led tothe career change?
What was the mindset changethat led to making this leap?
Greg Curry (05:25):
So I worked for a company.
It was originallyCapital Holding, and
then it was called Pian.
And we were on the block.
We knew it, someone wasgonna buy us, they were
selling the company.
Gotcha.
There were two suitors.
One was Agon.
One was, I believe, Conseco.
If Conseco had boughtus, our business would've
dried up because theircredit ratings weren't.
(05:46):
Good enough.
Yeah.
So my business partner andI decided, hey, if this
happens, we'll take ournice fat severance and we'll
do something on our own.
And I would love to be ableto tell you that on day
one I was like, I'm gonnabe an financial advisor.
I'm gonna work on taxes.
I'm gonna do, thatwasn't the case.
We were gonna be a boutiqueyinvestment management shop.
(06:09):
Okay.
But it didn't take me long tofigure out that the value is
much more on the planning sideand working with people and
digging into their financesand being able to guide them
through anything that comesalong than we're gonna invest.
We invest their we domanage the investments.
(06:30):
I think we do afantastic job doing that.
But the value comes on theplanning side, and I've
learned that over and over.
And I will fight you tothe grave on that one.
Charlie van Derven (06:42):
I complete, I completely
agree with you, right?
If you're investmentmanagement only, right?
You're really subject tooutside forces that you
have little control over.
Where if it's planningbased, regardless of what's
happening with the outsideforces, it just you tweak the
plan to stay on path, right?
Yeah.
And I agree, and I think asthe industry goes, I think
the greatest thing you haveis that planning relationship.
(07:04):
Stress on the relationship.
There's so many fintechs outthere that allow you as a,
allow you access to researchand, it's the relationship of
the advisor that really sticks.
Greg Curry (07:13):
Agreed.
Definitely
Charlie van Derven (07:14):
let, so let's go back to early years.
And we've both been, we'vebeen in this industry about
the same amount of time,and I know my memory's foggy
from 27, 28 years ago too.
As you look back on the earlydays what were some of the
things that you did really wellthat, maybe were a catalyst to
where you find yourself today?
Was there anything in particularthat you did that you were
like, Ooh, we could have donethat differently, that we can
(07:35):
help maybe our listeners avoid?
The same type of mode, sametype of, I won't call it a
mistake 'cause everything'sa learning experience, but,
Greg Curry (07:42):
yeah.
I'll focus on acouple of things.
One, going back to operationshaving good support, even
when it was just myselfbeing able to, build.
If nothing more than a checklistor something like that to
make for sure that when Iwas delivering what we were
delivering to our clients, thatwe could be consistent from
client to client and make forsure that we weren't winging it.
(08:06):
That we were actually, that.
I say we, but at thatpoint it was me that I
was wearing all the hats.
I was a clientservice professional.
I was an investmentmanagement professional.
I was an operationsprofessional.
And building those thoseprocesses over time,
it again, would loveto go back and go, wow.
(08:26):
We had processes down paton day one, not the case.
Obviously, there weretimes where we had
to, I had to wing it.
Yeah.
And sometimes that got.
That got me in trouble.
Not major trouble, not massive,errors or anything, but,
things that would happen.
And my philosophy's alwaysbeen if there's an issue,
(08:47):
one, identify what itis and what caused it.
Fix it.
If it if it made a clientif it costs a client,
you make 'em whole.
There's, and there'sno compromising that.
There's no hiding it, there'sno, oh, it was their fault.
It was this fault.
Own it.
Stand up.
And every time I've donethat, it has done nothing but
solidify the relationship withthe client and then create
(09:11):
a controller process to makesure that doesn't happen again.
Yeah.
Fool me once.
Shame on you, fool metwice, shame on me.
That's how, and that comesfrom my CPA background
and, being so controlled.
Building those processesover time making sure that
you come outta the box.
And again, when Istarted, I had nothing.
There was, there were no books.
(09:32):
There were no, NAPFA wasthere, but they didn't have
their new, new advisor,new company type thing.
There just was nothing, soI was in a lot of cases,
ma not making it up, butcreating it as I went.
Yeah.
So our process now.
Derived from that andhas grown since then.
(09:54):
But you'll see if weget into it, what I use
as planning software.
The tools that we use mightlook a little different from,
someone who's just going outand buying money Guide Pro
or ride capital or one ofthose, one of those things.
I, I have nothing againstthose plan those programs,
but I like digging in.
(10:15):
I like getting my hands dirtywith numbers, and I find that
difficult to do with, blackbox type software and it's, I
know it's not black box, I knowthat there's things behind it,
but we use Excel quite a bit.
We use tools to supplement that.
Okay.
Having all of that, pullingit together as important.
Charlie van Derven (10:33):
So
Greg Curry (10:33):
the second thing I wanted to mention was the
thing that the thing thatI've learned almost throughout
my entire career is thesimpler we get, the better.
I would love to showyou my very first plan.
It is while it certainly servedthe purpose, it is abysmal.
It was a book and it hadgraphs and it had tables
(10:54):
and my poor aunt and unclewho were my first client.
They're like, why areyou showing us this?
We're gonna hire you donor.
Charlie van Derven (11:02):
Yeah.
Greg Curry (11:03):
But every step of the way, as I've simplified
what we del what we actuallydeliver to our clients the
document, the, whatever itis, the simpler we get, the
more the clients buy into it.
Now we can always dig deep,we can always, some I'm
worth an engineer and theywanna see this and that.
No problem whatsoever.
But yeah.
That simplification.
(11:24):
Every time we got rid of areport, every time we made
it more conversational.
It just got more powerful.
The clients bought in.
We knew what our marching ordersare, were when the crap hits,
the fan markets are down 40%.
We always get call.
I'll get one personsay, man, you must be
(11:46):
on the phone all day.
I'm.
No, we've already doing a
Charlie van Derven (11:49):
good job.
We talked about
Greg Curry (11:50):
this when we met.
Yeah.
The first time thatwhen this happens.
Yeah.
We got a plan.
Yeah.
There's the simple way we do it.
Charlie van Derven (11:57):
It's not an if, it's a win.
And always building a planand anticipation of that
win is a big part of it.
I want to key on a couple ofthings because you and I have
had some similar experiences.
Small business, right?
Our businesses are different,but certainly it was me, myself
and I, when, I moved the bedoutta the master bedroom the
first day we went to businessand built a website, moved
a table in, built a website,set up some email addresses,
(12:19):
and away we were going right?
I don't know whatthat looked like.
That's 12 years ago.
So that's evolved a lot.
The simplification, I thinkis a lesson I've learned
over the years too as ayoung professional, whether
that's age or, amount oftime in the profession.
We wanna wow with our,our credibility is how
smart we are and let usdisplay the intelligence
(12:39):
and, frankly, we get hiredbecause people trust us.
At the end of the day, theylike us and they trust us.
And I have learnedthat my clients don't
want all that detail.
Charlie, we trustyou to do this.
If the outcome'sgood, then good.
If the outcome's notgood, then we dive deep
and find out why not.
Yeah, no, definitely.
So now it sounds like Greg,a lot of the, a lot of the
(13:02):
processes and operations youput in place sounds like are
not out of the box, right?
They're not the black boxsoftware that you talked about.
It's things that you guys,whether yourself or an internal
team have modified existingtechnologies to fit your needs.
Let's talk aboutthat a little bit.
What does that look like?
And then do you have anyrecommendations that you
can make for advisors whoare looking at this path?
(13:23):
Tools that theymight be able to use?
Greg Curry (13:26):
Yeah, it's our focus tends to start with cash
flow, the client's cash flow.
Charlie van Derven (13:32):
Okay.
Greg Curry (13:32):
So over the years we've just developed a
methodology for creating a highlevel, pretty accurate cash
flow statement for right now.
Cool.
So a client can really see.
Here's how much we've got comingin, here's where it's going.
Taxes, debt, living expenses,savings, and investments.
(13:54):
I don't really feel the needto go any deeper than that.
I don't need to know how muchyou're spending on groceries
or anything like that.
No budgeting.
Sure.
I'm not good with budgeting.
So if someone comes in with aspending problem, we might not
be the right firm for them.
'Cause my answer is just stop.
Yeah.
Just don't do that anymore.
Spend less.
(14:14):
Yes.
A big part of what we do isthat, that cash flow statement
and how that defines whatyour cash flow is gonna
look like in retirementwhen before you take social
Security and then retirement.
When you take Social Security.
Again, simplification.
We don't need everyyear cash flow.
We don't need.
(14:34):
Super duper accurate budgetsbecause I don't know about you,
but what I'm spending todaylooks nothing like I, I spent
five years ago and I had no wayfive years ago of predicting
what that is, we assume,Hey, if you're comfortable
in this lifestyle, that'swhat we're gonna target to.
And then every year we'regonna look at it and we'll
see if it's drifting andwe'll adjust the plan.
(14:56):
It's a very, it's anongoing fluid process.
It's not a, Hey, here'swhat we're gonna do.
Come see me in five or 10 years.
Excel is a bigpart of what we do.
We used to, we used,we've, I've dabbled in
Monte Carlo simulation.
Okay.
I. I know that it's a powerfultool that a lot of people
like to lean on, but I alsoknow how sensitive the outputs
(15:21):
are to very small changesin the inputs, meaning,
oh, I'm gonna change thestandard deviation or the
correlation between these two.
And you can, I'm notsaying people do it,
but you can manipulate.
The output to meet whatever,if you're an advisor with, bad
intentions or even if you'rejust an advisor that, that, that
(15:43):
doesn't have enough experience,you wanna be able to show,
hey, you've got a 83.4% chanceof your plan working out.
It's wow, really?
Are we sure about that?
That's a pretty precisenumber to be giving to.
A client who's worked inhuman resources, they,
(16:04):
it's, I don't know.
I just find it ridiculous.
Charlie van Derven (16:07):
And there's a lot of variables that are
completely outside of control.
Greg Curry (16:10):
And again, so we know, the things that
we know about the returnsof the capital markets.
Yeah.
We know that atleast historically.
Fixed income is gonnabe inflation plus,
one to 3%, right?
Yeah.
We know that stocks are gonnabe somewhere between inflation
(16:31):
plus, I don't know, pick anumber, six and 8%, five to
7%, but it's gonna be morethan fixed income, right?
Over time.
And it's going to beti, it's just gonna be
more than inflation.
It's gonna be your growth.
Your growth.
So whether.
In the future, we earninflation plus six, or
inflation plus eight.
(16:52):
It's missing the point.
It is getting our clientspositioned so that they
earn the returns that areavailable and they need
to meet their goals, not.
We gotta reach for the sky,not we gotta, oh, we gotta
go invest in this new assetclass because the last 10
years it returned 150% a year.
(17:14):
I'm not gonna mentionwhich asset class it is.
We probably all know what it's,
Charlie van Derven (17:18):
yeah.
Greg Curry (17:18):
It's not our job anyway.
I know I got off track alittle bit, but No, not at all.
The tools we use are pretty,again, simplistic but fluid.
So we wanna make for surethat we're going in the
right direction, especiallyfor younger clients.
It's not about hittinga mark, it's about doing
the right things forthe next 15 to 20 years.
And then as you approachretirement, we can start
(17:40):
fine tuning what we'relooking at in terms of
what is it going to take?
To meet your cash flow needs infive years and are we prepared
for the bear market that mightcome within those five years?
And, do we have a safety net andare we positioned so that we can
manage your taxes in retirement?
'cause we all know that can bethe biggest expense we have.
Charlie van Derven (18:02):
Sure.
Greg Curry (18:02):
We've got some flexibility.
We can, do that.
So the tools we use are excelhomegrown spreadsheets and
projection spreadsheets.
Holistic plan isprobably the best.
I can't believe how gooda tax planning piece
of software that is.
Yeah.
But you gotta know the tax law.
(18:22):
You gotta have somebodythat can really look and
go that doesn't look right.
I can't tell you how many timesthat, one of my team members
brings me something and they'relike, I can't figure this out.
And because I've looked at.
50,000 tax returns,I can, pick it out.
But it's a fantastic tool.
Awesome.
It's one, it's the tool thatwe probably use the most.
Charlie van Derven (18:43):
Very cool.
We're, so we'llplug a list of plan.
They don't pay usor anything, but
Greg Curry (18:46):
Yeah, that's all right.
But yeah, no, greatly you'recheck if you're looking for a
tax planning thing, you needto go look at a list of plan.
Charlie van Derven (18:52):
Operational excellence, let's call it that.
And simplicity.
Those are really thetwo things that I hear
thematically out of youroutta your years of learning
and where you are today.
Greg Curry (19:04):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (19:04):
Greg, you got a great story, man.
And I would imagine some of ourlisteners may wanna reach out,
have some questions thinkingabout transition anyway,
resonate with your message.
Are you okay with that?
And if so, if not, I'll justcut that piece of the podcast,
but if so, I'll leave it in.
What's the best wayfor them to reach you?
Greg Curry (19:22):
The best way would be email.
Okay.
Is it okay to say theemail here or provide it?
Sure, man.
Sure.
Yeah, it's easy.
It's greg@pillar.net.
Cool.
P-I-L-L-A r.net.
And yes, I've I hadsome along the journey.
I had many advisorshelp me along the way.
Of course I needed that.
I didn't have booksand, things like that.
(19:45):
Always felt.
Very strongly aboutpaying that forward.
Helping advisors helping peoplewho are thinking about it.
It's not an easy road.
No.
Let's be clear.
I was not ready tobe a business owner.
I was barely ready to bea business owner after
11 years and being a CPAin the corporate world.
(20:07):
And I still think in someways I was a little early.
But.
It's paid off and it'sgrown into something,
it's not just me.
There are five ofus here right now.
We're probably gonnaexpand into at least one
more in the, in 2026,probably later in the year.
Cool.
It's turned into somethingthat I think can continue
(20:28):
to add value to our currentclients, future clients.
It is I cannot imagine acareer that is more fruitful
for everyone involved me.
Personally, my team,our clients, the CPAs
that we work with.
The whole thing,everything is about value.
(20:48):
And look, finances, personalfinances have the power
to change everything.
I don't wanna be too,too philosophical.
But it's true.
Having, having somethingthat you know is gonna
be there for the rest ofyour life can be freeing.
It's hard for people tomake the transition, but
(21:09):
it can be very freeing.
Yeah.
Charlie van Der (21:11):
That's awesome.
You've got your heart's in theright place, clear clearly.
You lead with, client intentand so ab absolutely love
the work that you're doing.
So anybody wants toreach out with Greg to
Greg greg@pillar.net.
Again, Greg Curry, Louisville,Kentucky, pillar Financial.
Greg's active on LinkedIn too.
I, that's where I ran into him.
All right, Greg, I gotone closing question
(21:33):
off topic a little bit.
Oh.
If you're gonna, if you're gonnarecommend one old punk rock
album to me, which one is it?
Greg Curry (21:40):
Man, that's tough.
I know.
I gotta tell you.
I've been on a huge underundertones kick lately.
Charlie van Derven (21:47):
Cool.
All right.
Greg Curry (21:48):
And the album that I got introduced from,
it's not the first one.
A lot of people would say,listen to the first one.
Listen to teenage cases.
I love hypnotized.
Charlie van Derven (21:56):
Hypnotized.
Greg Curry (21:57):
And there's just something about hypnotized,
and if you get the.
Current deluxe version,whatever that is.
It's got some of the singles.
They okay.
They released along the way.
You got my number stillprobably one of my all time
favorite songs of all time.
Very cool.
So there you go.
Very cool.
And they're still outthere playing without their
original lead singer, but.
A lot of those guys are,I've never seen 'em.
(22:19):
I might end up travelingto Ireland someday to
Charlie v (22:22):
see, go check it out.
Yeah.
I, in the recent years, let'ssee, I, social distortion,
it was, a little thedamned saw the damn play.
That was pretty great.
Dead Kennedy's without Jellobut they sounded awesome.
Outdoor, couplehundred people, venue.
It was very cool.
Yeah.
I love catching upon that old music.
Greg Curry (22:38):
In my younger days, I'd be really militant about it.
I'm not gonna go see a band if.
They don't have allthe original members.
Yeah, I'm just not, soI'll give you another one.
Yeah, punk is my thing,but I grew up on kiss.
I cut my teeth on Kiss.
Very cool.
I saw Kiss more than any otherband or during my lifetime.
And when Ace and Peterleft for the final time,
I said, I'm never gonnasing their cover band.
(23:00):
And then somebody came andsaid, yeah, I got tickets.
Why don't you come see me?
That concert was, mighthave been the best Kiss,
kiss concert with the withEric Singer and Tony Thayer.
Charlie van Derven (23:09):
Very cool.
Anyway, so
Greg Curry (23:10):
I'm gonna give up some of my punk cred
to say that I'm a massive
Charlie va (23:14):
Ah, no, that's good.
I saw him, not too, I saw himin the last five years and
I actually ran into not thatI talked to him or anything
else, but Gene Simmonswas in a local seven 11.
We live at the end of the road.
Kind of beach community inFlorida, which is pretty quiet.
Greg Curry (23:28):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (23:28):
And yeah.
So escaping the publiceye and he was Shannon
Tweed, is that her name?
Greg Curry (23:35):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (23:35):
They were in 7 11 1 day when I
was in there doing whateverin the neighborhood.
I didn't bother him.
Greg Curry (23:40):
I know I'm the same way.
I'm, I have met a couple ofcelebrities that I could not.
A couple of music peoplethat I could not avoid.
Just going, look, I'm sorry.
I know I'm being a fan boy.
Yep.
I gotta say hello.
Thank you.
Love your music,and then move on.
Charlie van (23:55):
Yep, exactly right.
Yeah, exactly right.
I hate to be, yeah, Ihate to be that guy.
But also there's afew out there that.
You have to be that guy.
Exactly.
Greg we got a lotin common, man.
I enjoy you a lot.
I want thank you againfor being a guest on the
revamp of REA collective.
It's been a little while, butthis is our first our first
episode going back out there.
I enjoy doing this stuff.
Gives me an opportunityto meet new people and
(24:17):
yeah, just appreciate yousharing your story and
and being a part of ours.
Greg Curry (24:20):
Yeah.
Next time you're up north,
Charlie van Derven (24:23):
I got a client in Danville.
Greg Curry (24:24):
Come on up.
Charlie (24:25):
I'll come see you man.
We'll show, we'llfind a show somewhere.
We'll find some music.
I'll come see you.
Yeah, I got a client in Danvillethat probably, I probably
owe a visit here pretty soon.
Greg Curry (24:32):
Alright, Danville's not the i, 15 minutes away.
Charlie van Derve (24:35):
There you go.
We'll make it happen.
Alright, thanks Charlie.
Cheers, Greg.
Thank you man.
Appreciate it.
Greg Curry (24:39):
Thanks.
Charlie van Derven (24:40):
And for everybody who spent some time
with me and my new buddy, GregCurry here on REA Collective,
thank you very much forthe time you spent with us.
My name's Charlie Van Dervin.
I'm an easy guy to find, so ifyou've got some questions for me
or somebody I should interview.
Hit me up and of courselike, and subscribe and
all that other stuff thatthe kids tell us to do.
Greg, thanks again.
Thank you.
Take care.
Welcome to RIA Collective.
My name's Charlie Van Dervinand if you listen to our
podcast in past months, you'llsee that we haven't posted
an episode in a long time.
My company, social Advisorswent through a little
restructuring, and frankly,the podcast got set aside
for about a year and a half.
But it's something I lovedoing and so we're dusting
it off and bringing it back.
(00:20):
And, the purpose forthe podcast is to we're
talking to owners of RIA.
I've worked in financialservices for almost 30 years.
My guest has too, so we'll we'llintroduce him in a second here.
And one of the things that hascome up time and again, is a
lack of trust in the industry.
Advisors selling proprietaryproducts and having to hit
(00:40):
quotas and, maybe servingthemselves and then the company
before they serve a client.
And I truly believe in havingworked in many facets of
the industry that the RIAor the independent channel
creates the purest clientadvisor relationship.
Of course, being a fee onlyadvisor takes a lot of the
bias outta recommendationsand things like that.
In my little world, I liketo interview owners of RIAs
(01:02):
to get to learn about theirexperience, whether they made a
transition out of a wirehouse.
Large large insurance house.
Like our guest today he hadsome background in product
sales at, on the insurancelevel, but he didn't
really make that breakaway.
However, he's got some greatlessons to teach for for some
maybe young advisors thatfind themselves in a big bank
that maybe that's not theright place for him anymore.
(01:23):
Without further ado, letme introduce Greg Curry,
my guest for the day.
Greg is, greg's firm iscalled Pillar Financially.
He's based outta Louisville,Kentucky, and Greg's been
at this 28 years, so he'sgot a lot of wisdom to drop.
Greg, welcome man.
Thank you for being myguest on RA Collective.
Greg Curry (01:39):
Thanks for having me.
I'm excited to sharewhatever I can.
Like I mentioned before, it'sbeen a long time, so memory
might be a little sketchy,a little selective, but.
It's still there.
Haven't lost it
Charlie van Derven (01:51):
yet.
Listen around.
We, we bonded over thingsother than the industry.
We both love punk rock.
You got a couple years onme, Greg just a couple.
Just a couple.
Not too many guitar inthe background there.
I've got one on the wall though.
Your mind has more dust on itthan years does, it looks like.
And he didn't shame me toobad for actually liking the
Grateful Dead too, right?
Yeah.
Greg Curry (02:11):
Like I said, every we all have our flaws.
I'm sure I've got my own.
Charlie van Derven (02:16):
Yeah.
We don't want to bring that up.
Not no.
So good.
Greg, we often interview peoplewho come out that big bank
environment or come out of abig insurance house who, pushing
prop proprietary products.
And some peoplehave, legal issues.
They had to deal withyour situation's a
little bit different.
But, the conversationwe're getting to know
each other really was.
Based around operations.
So I think you bring a lot ofvalue to our conversation today.
(02:38):
Why don't you give usa little background.
How'd how'd you end upstarting your own RIA?
Greg Curry (02:42):
Yeah, so my background is I started as a
CPA, worked in a large Coopersand library, and that'll,
that name will date me whenit was still the Big eight.
And worked therefor three years.
Loved the experience usedthe experience being a CPA.
Back then today, it hasreally carried through
my entire career.
But after about three years,moved to a large Louisville
(03:03):
insurance company whereI spent a little time in
internal audit and then movedover to, a product, but it
wasn't you say product sales.
It wasn't a retail product, itwas an institutional product.
Okay.
So our customers were large 401kplans in the stable value space.
Any, anybody who hashad a 401k plan probably
(03:24):
had a stable value fund.
That was our our niche.
And we, we workedwith large investment.
Advisors because weprovided guarantees.
But I'm getting ahead of myself.
But going through that process,I started on the operation side.
So when I moved over to thatproduct side of the business, I
started in operations doing theadministration for these stable
(03:47):
value contracts until I actuallymoved into product management
and more, I wouldn't call itsales as much as sales support.
Charlie van Derven (03:56):
Okay,
Greg Curry (03:57):
so I was the expert,
Charlie van Derven (03:58):
right?
Yeah.
Greg Curry (03:59):
I had more experience than anybody.
It was a brand newproduct when I started.
Very cool.
Great experience.
Got to work with some ofthe biggest fixed income
managers in the world.
Saw how they worked.
A lot of that actuallyhelped define our
investment philosophy,which is very passive.
In nature, because I heard alot of stories about how great
(04:20):
these investment managerswere, and then at the end
of the day, it didn't come.
It didn't come to fruition.
So
Charlie v (04:28):
yeah, your experience was a little different.
Greg Curry (04:29):
Yeah, it was okay.
They weren't bad.
It was just nobody was reallyadding the value that they,
thought they would regardless.
Having that operationsbackground having that real,
key to being able to serveour clients was being able to
have good systems behind us.
When I did start the theRIA, when I started Pillar
Financial I was comingfrom a different world.
(04:53):
I was coming from theinstitutional world,
not the retail world.
Yeah.
So for me, starting a anRIA a fee only practice.
Only seemed natural becausethat's what I was used to.
Yeah.
There's not an institutionalplay, big institutional player
out there that's gonna paycommissions or pay to play
type things or anything likethat on any ongoing basis.
(05:17):
So to me it was just natural.
Charlie van Derven (05:19):
Cool.
So what what led tothe career change?
What was the mindset changethat led to making this leap?
Greg Curry (05:25):
So I worked for a company.
It was originallyCapital Holding, and
then it was called Pian.
And we were on the block.
We knew it, someone wasgonna buy us, they were
selling the company.
Gotcha.
There were two suitors.
One was Agon.
One was, I believe, Conseco.
If Conseco had boughtus, our business would've
dried up because theircredit ratings weren't.
(05:46):
Good enough.
Yeah.
So my business partner andI decided, hey, if this
happens, we'll take ournice fat severance and we'll
do something on our own.
And I would love to be ableto tell you that on day
one I was like, I'm gonnabe an financial advisor.
I'm gonna work on taxes.
I'm gonna do, thatwasn't the case.
We were gonna be a boutiqueyinvestment management shop.
(06:09):
Okay.
But it didn't take me long tofigure out that the value is
much more on the planning sideand working with people and
digging into their financesand being able to guide them
through anything that comesalong than we're gonna invest.
We invest their we domanage the investments.
(06:30):
I think we do afantastic job doing that.
But the value comes on theplanning side, and I've
learned that over and over.
And I will fight you tothe grave on that one.
Charlie van Derven (06:42):
I complete, I completely
agree with you, right?
If you're investmentmanagement only, right?
You're really subject tooutside forces that you
have little control over.
Where if it's planningbased, regardless of what's
happening with the outsideforces, it just you tweak the
plan to stay on path, right?
Yeah.
And I agree, and I think asthe industry goes, I think
the greatest thing you haveis that planning relationship.
(07:04):
Stress on the relationship.
There's so many fintechs outthere that allow you as a,
allow you access to researchand, it's the relationship of
the advisor that really sticks.
Greg Curry (07:13):
Agreed.
Definitely
Charlie van Derven (07:14):
let, so let's go back to early years.
And we've both been, we'vebeen in this industry about
the same amount of time,and I know my memory's foggy
from 27, 28 years ago too.
As you look back on the earlydays what were some of the
things that you did really wellthat, maybe were a catalyst to
where you find yourself today?
Was there anything in particularthat you did that you were
like, Ooh, we could have donethat differently, that we can
(07:35):
help maybe our listeners avoid?
The same type of mode, sametype of, I won't call it a
mistake 'cause everything'sa learning experience, but,
Greg Curry (07:42):
yeah.
I'll focus on acouple of things.
One, going back to operationshaving good support, even
when it was just myselfbeing able to, build.
If nothing more than a checklistor something like that to
make for sure that when Iwas delivering what we were
delivering to our clients, thatwe could be consistent from
client to client and make forsure that we weren't winging it.
(08:06):
That we were actually, that.
I say we, but at thatpoint it was me that I
was wearing all the hats.
I was a clientservice professional.
I was an investmentmanagement professional.
I was an operationsprofessional.
And building those thoseprocesses over time,
it again, would loveto go back and go, wow.
(08:26):
We had processes down paton day one, not the case.
Obviously, there weretimes where we had
to, I had to wing it.
Yeah.
And sometimes that got.
That got me in trouble.
Not major trouble, not massive,errors or anything, but,
things that would happen.
And my philosophy's alwaysbeen if there's an issue,
(08:47):
one, identify what itis and what caused it.
Fix it.
If it if it made a clientif it costs a client,
you make 'em whole.
There's, and there'sno compromising that.
There's no hiding it, there'sno, oh, it was their fault.
It was this fault.
Own it.
Stand up.
And every time I've donethat, it has done nothing but
solidify the relationship withthe client and then create
(09:11):
a controller process to makesure that doesn't happen again.
Yeah.
Fool me once.
Shame on you, fool metwice, shame on me.
That's how, and that comesfrom my CPA background
and, being so controlled.
Building those processesover time making sure that
you come outta the box.
And again, when Istarted, I had nothing.
There was, there were no books.
(09:32):
There were no, NAPFA wasthere, but they didn't have
their new, new advisor,new company type thing.
There just was nothing, soI was in a lot of cases,
ma not making it up, butcreating it as I went.
Yeah.
So our process now.
Derived from that andhas grown since then.
(09:54):
But you'll see if weget into it, what I use
as planning software.
The tools that we use mightlook a little different from,
someone who's just going outand buying money Guide Pro
or ride capital or one ofthose, one of those things.
I, I have nothing againstthose plan those programs,
but I like digging in.
(10:15):
I like getting my hands dirtywith numbers, and I find that
difficult to do with, blackbox type software and it's, I
know it's not black box, I knowthat there's things behind it,
but we use Excel quite a bit.
We use tools to supplement that.
Okay.
Having all of that, pullingit together as important.
Charlie van Derven (10:33):
So
Greg Curry (10:33):
the second thing I wanted to mention was the
thing that the thing thatI've learned almost throughout
my entire career is thesimpler we get, the better.
I would love to showyou my very first plan.
It is while it certainly servedthe purpose, it is abysmal.
It was a book and it hadgraphs and it had tables
(10:54):
and my poor aunt and unclewho were my first client.
They're like, why areyou showing us this?
We're gonna hire you donor.
Charlie van Derven (11:02):
Yeah.
Greg Curry (11:03):
But every step of the way, as I've simplified
what we del what we actuallydeliver to our clients the
document, the, whatever itis, the simpler we get, the
more the clients buy into it.
Now we can always dig deep,we can always, some I'm
worth an engineer and theywanna see this and that.
No problem whatsoever.
But yeah.
That simplification.
(11:24):
Every time we got rid of areport, every time we made
it more conversational.
It just got more powerful.
The clients bought in.
We knew what our marching ordersare, were when the crap hits,
the fan markets are down 40%.
We always get call.
I'll get one personsay, man, you must be
(11:46):
on the phone all day.
I'm.
No, we've already doing a
Charlie van Derven (11:49):
good job.
We talked about
Greg Curry (11:50):
this when we met.
Yeah.
The first time thatwhen this happens.
Yeah.
We got a plan.
Yeah.
There's the simple way we do it.
Charlie van Derven (11:57):
It's not an if, it's a win.
And always building a planand anticipation of that
win is a big part of it.
I want to key on a couple ofthings because you and I have
had some similar experiences.
Small business, right?
Our businesses are different,but certainly it was me, myself
and I, when, I moved the bedoutta the master bedroom the
first day we went to businessand built a website, moved
a table in, built a website,set up some email addresses,
(12:19):
and away we were going right?
I don't know whatthat looked like.
That's 12 years ago.
So that's evolved a lot.
The simplification, I thinkis a lesson I've learned
over the years too as ayoung professional, whether
that's age or, amount oftime in the profession.
We wanna wow with our,our credibility is how
smart we are and let usdisplay the intelligence
(12:39):
and, frankly, we get hiredbecause people trust us.
At the end of the day, theylike us and they trust us.
And I have learnedthat my clients don't
want all that detail.
Charlie, we trustyou to do this.
If the outcome'sgood, then good.
If the outcome's notgood, then we dive deep
and find out why not.
Yeah, no, definitely.
So now it sounds like Greg,a lot of the, a lot of the
(13:02):
processes and operations youput in place sounds like are
not out of the box, right?
They're not the black boxsoftware that you talked about.
It's things that you guys,whether yourself or an internal
team have modified existingtechnologies to fit your needs.
Let's talk aboutthat a little bit.
What does that look like?
And then do you have anyrecommendations that you
can make for advisors whoare looking at this path?
(13:23):
Tools that theymight be able to use?
Greg Curry (13:26):
Yeah, it's our focus tends to start with cash
flow, the client's cash flow.
Charlie van Derven (13:32):
Okay.
Greg Curry (13:32):
So over the years we've just developed a
methodology for creating a highlevel, pretty accurate cash
flow statement for right now.
Cool.
So a client can really see.
Here's how much we've got comingin, here's where it's going.
Taxes, debt, living expenses,savings, and investments.
(13:54):
I don't really feel the needto go any deeper than that.
I don't need to know how muchyou're spending on groceries
or anything like that.
No budgeting.
Sure.
I'm not good with budgeting.
So if someone comes in with aspending problem, we might not
be the right firm for them.
'Cause my answer is just stop.
Yeah.
Just don't do that anymore.
Spend less.
(14:14):
Yes.
A big part of what we do isthat, that cash flow statement
and how that defines whatyour cash flow is gonna
look like in retirementwhen before you take social
Security and then retirement.
When you take Social Security.
Again, simplification.
We don't need everyyear cash flow.
We don't need.
(14:34):
Super duper accurate budgetsbecause I don't know about you,
but what I'm spending todaylooks nothing like I, I spent
five years ago and I had no wayfive years ago of predicting
what that is, we assume,Hey, if you're comfortable
in this lifestyle, that'swhat we're gonna target to.
And then every year we'regonna look at it and we'll
see if it's drifting andwe'll adjust the plan.
(14:56):
It's a very, it's anongoing fluid process.
It's not a, Hey, here'swhat we're gonna do.
Come see me in five or 10 years.
Excel is a bigpart of what we do.
We used to, we used,we've, I've dabbled in
Monte Carlo simulation.
Okay.
I. I know that it's a powerfultool that a lot of people
like to lean on, but I alsoknow how sensitive the outputs
(15:21):
are to very small changesin the inputs, meaning,
oh, I'm gonna change thestandard deviation or the
correlation between these two.
And you can, I'm notsaying people do it,
but you can manipulate.
The output to meet whatever,if you're an advisor with, bad
intentions or even if you'rejust an advisor that, that, that
(15:43):
doesn't have enough experience,you wanna be able to show,
hey, you've got a 83.4% chanceof your plan working out.
It's wow, really?
Are we sure about that?
That's a pretty precisenumber to be giving to.
A client who's worked inhuman resources, they,
(16:04):
it's, I don't know.
I just find it ridiculous.
Charlie van Derven (16:07):
And there's a lot of variables that are
completely outside of control.
Greg Curry (16:10):
And again, so we know, the things that
we know about the returnsof the capital markets.
Yeah.
We know that atleast historically.
Fixed income is gonnabe inflation plus,
one to 3%, right?
Yeah.
We know that stocks are gonnabe somewhere between inflation
(16:31):
plus, I don't know, pick anumber, six and 8%, five to
7%, but it's gonna be morethan fixed income, right?
Over time.
And it's going to beti, it's just gonna be
more than inflation.
It's gonna be your growth.
Your growth.
So whether.
In the future, we earninflation plus six, or
inflation plus eight.
(16:52):
It's missing the point.
It is getting our clientspositioned so that they
earn the returns that areavailable and they need
to meet their goals, not.
We gotta reach for the sky,not we gotta, oh, we gotta
go invest in this new assetclass because the last 10
years it returned 150% a year.
(17:14):
I'm not gonna mentionwhich asset class it is.
We probably all know what it's,
Charlie van Derven (17:18):
yeah.
Greg Curry (17:18):
It's not our job anyway.
I know I got off track alittle bit, but No, not at all.
The tools we use are pretty,again, simplistic but fluid.
So we wanna make for surethat we're going in the
right direction, especiallyfor younger clients.
It's not about hittinga mark, it's about doing
the right things forthe next 15 to 20 years.
And then as you approachretirement, we can start
(17:40):
fine tuning what we'relooking at in terms of
what is it going to take?
To meet your cash flow needs infive years and are we prepared
for the bear market that mightcome within those five years?
And, do we have a safety net andare we positioned so that we can
manage your taxes in retirement?
'cause we all know that can bethe biggest expense we have.
Charlie van Derven (18:02):
Sure.
Greg Curry (18:02):
We've got some flexibility.
We can, do that.
So the tools we use are excelhomegrown spreadsheets and
projection spreadsheets.
Holistic plan isprobably the best.
I can't believe how gooda tax planning piece
of software that is.
Yeah.
But you gotta know the tax law.
(18:22):
You gotta have somebodythat can really look and
go that doesn't look right.
I can't tell you how many timesthat, one of my team members
brings me something and they'relike, I can't figure this out.
And because I've looked at.
50,000 tax returns,I can, pick it out.
But it's a fantastic tool.
Awesome.
It's one, it's the tool thatwe probably use the most.
Charlie van Derven (18:43):
Very cool.
We're, so we'llplug a list of plan.
They don't pay usor anything, but
Greg Curry (18:46):
Yeah, that's all right.
But yeah, no, greatly you'recheck if you're looking for a
tax planning thing, you needto go look at a list of plan.
Charlie van Derven (18:52):
Operational excellence, let's call it that.
And simplicity.
Those are really thetwo things that I hear
thematically out of youroutta your years of learning
and where you are today.
Greg Curry (19:04):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (19:04):
Greg, you got a great story, man.
And I would imagine some of ourlisteners may wanna reach out,
have some questions thinkingabout transition anyway,
resonate with your message.
Are you okay with that?
And if so, if not, I'll justcut that piece of the podcast,
but if so, I'll leave it in.
What's the best wayfor them to reach you?
Greg Curry (19:22):
The best way would be email.
Okay.
Is it okay to say theemail here or provide it?
Sure, man.
Sure.
Yeah, it's easy.
It's greg@pillar.net.
Cool.
P-I-L-L-A r.net.
And yes, I've I hadsome along the journey.
I had many advisorshelp me along the way.
Of course I needed that.
I didn't have booksand, things like that.
(19:45):
Always felt.
Very strongly aboutpaying that forward.
Helping advisors helping peoplewho are thinking about it.
It's not an easy road.
No.
Let's be clear.
I was not ready tobe a business owner.
I was barely ready to bea business owner after
11 years and being a CPAin the corporate world.
(20:07):
And I still think in someways I was a little early.
But.
It's paid off and it'sgrown into something,
it's not just me.
There are five ofus here right now.
We're probably gonnaexpand into at least one
more in the, in 2026,probably later in the year.
Cool.
It's turned into somethingthat I think can continue
(20:28):
to add value to our currentclients, future clients.
It is I cannot imagine acareer that is more fruitful
for everyone involved me.
Personally, my team,our clients, the CPAs
that we work with.
The whole thing,everything is about value.
(20:48):
And look, finances, personalfinances have the power
to change everything.
I don't wanna be too,too philosophical.
But it's true.
Having, having somethingthat you know is gonna
be there for the rest ofyour life can be freeing.
It's hard for people tomake the transition, but
(21:09):
it can be very freeing.
Yeah.
Charlie van Der (21:11):
That's awesome.
You've got your heart's in theright place, clear clearly.
You lead with, client intentand so ab absolutely love
the work that you're doing.
So anybody wants toreach out with Greg to
Greg greg@pillar.net.
Again, Greg Curry, Louisville,Kentucky, pillar Financial.
Greg's active on LinkedIn too.
I, that's where I ran into him.
All right, Greg, I gotone closing question
(21:33):
off topic a little bit.
Oh.
If you're gonna, if you're gonnarecommend one old punk rock
album to me, which one is it?
Greg Curry (21:40):
Man, that's tough.
I know.
I gotta tell you.
I've been on a huge underundertones kick lately.
Charlie van Derven (21:47):
Cool.
All right.
Greg Curry (21:48):
And the album that I got introduced from,
it's not the first one.
A lot of people would say,listen to the first one.
Listen to teenage cases.
I love hypnotized.
Charlie van Derven (21:56):
Hypnotized.
Greg Curry (21:57):
And there's just something about hypnotized,
and if you get the.
Current deluxe version,whatever that is.
It's got some of the singles.
They okay.
They released along the way.
You got my number stillprobably one of my all time
favorite songs of all time.
Very cool.
So there you go.
Very cool.
And they're still outthere playing without their
original lead singer, but.
A lot of those guys are,I've never seen 'em.
(22:19):
I might end up travelingto Ireland someday to
Charlie v (22:22):
see, go check it out.
Yeah.
I, in the recent years, let'ssee, I, social distortion,
it was, a little thedamned saw the damn play.
That was pretty great.
Dead Kennedy's without Jellobut they sounded awesome.
Outdoor, couplehundred people, venue.
It was very cool.
Yeah.
I love catching upon that old music.
Greg Curry (22:38):
In my younger days, I'd be really militant about it.
I'm not gonna go see a band if.
They don't have allthe original members.
Yeah, I'm just not, soI'll give you another one.
Yeah, punk is my thing,but I grew up on kiss.
I cut my teeth on Kiss.
Very cool.
I saw Kiss more than any otherband or during my lifetime.
And when Ace and Peterleft for the final time,
I said, I'm never gonnasing their cover band.
(23:00):
And then somebody came andsaid, yeah, I got tickets.
Why don't you come see me?
That concert was, mighthave been the best Kiss,
kiss concert with the withEric Singer and Tony Thayer.
Charlie van Derven (23:09):
Very cool.
Anyway, so
Greg Curry (23:10):
I'm gonna give up some of my punk cred
to say that I'm a massive
Charlie va (23:14):
Ah, no, that's good.
I saw him, not too, I saw himin the last five years and
I actually ran into not thatI talked to him or anything
else, but Gene Simmonswas in a local seven 11.
We live at the end of the road.
Kind of beach community inFlorida, which is pretty quiet.
Greg Curry (23:28):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (23:28):
And yeah.
So escaping the publiceye and he was Shannon
Tweed, is that her name?
Greg Curry (23:35):
Yeah.
Charlie van Derven (23:35):
They were in 7 11 1 day when I
was in there doing whateverin the neighborhood.
I didn't bother him.
Greg Curry (23:40):
I know I'm the same way.
I'm, I have met a couple ofcelebrities that I could not.
A couple of music peoplethat I could not avoid.
Just going, look, I'm sorry.
I know I'm being a fan boy.
Yep.
I gotta say hello.
Thank you.
Love your music,and then move on.
Charlie van (23:55):
Yep, exactly right.
Yeah, exactly right.
I hate to be, yeah, Ihate to be that guy.
But also there's afew out there that.
You have to be that guy.
Exactly.
Greg we got a lotin common, man.
I enjoy you a lot.
I want thank you againfor being a guest on the
revamp of REA collective.
It's been a little while, butthis is our first our first
episode going back out there.
I enjoy doing this stuff.
Gives me an opportunityto meet new people and
(24:17):
yeah, just appreciate yousharing your story and
and being a part of ours.
Greg Curry (24:20):
Yeah.
Next time you're up north,
Charlie van Derven (24:23):
I got a client in Danville.
Greg Curry (24:24):
Come on up.
Charlie (24:25):
I'll come see you man.
We'll show, we'llfind a show somewhere.
We'll find some music.
I'll come see you.
Yeah, I got a client in Danvillethat probably, I probably
owe a visit here pretty soon.
Greg Curry (24:32):
Alright, Danville's not the i, 15 minutes away.
Charlie van Derve (24:35):
There you go.
We'll make it happen.
Alright, thanks Charlie.
Cheers, Greg.
Thank you man.
Appreciate it.
Greg Curry (24:39):
Thanks.
Charlie van Derven (24:40):
And for everybody who spent some time
with me and my new buddy, GregCurry here on REA Collective,
thank you very much forthe time you spent with us.
My name's Charlie Van Dervin.
I'm an easy guy to find, so ifyou've got some questions for me
or somebody I should interview.
Hit me up and of courselike, and subscribe and
all that other stuff thatthe kids tell us to do.
Greg, thanks again.
Thank you.
Take care.
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