Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yeah, hither Detroits Wheels.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Hey, it's Kerry Gary Kraft, the Rock and Roll Insider.
Thanks for checking in, Gary, Congratulations on another new book.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Yeah to it. Somewhere along the line, it felt like
it would be a good idea to do two back
to back. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Not too long ago. You put out that book of
the nineties, So here we go.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Yeah, in November. Okay, the five hundred one Essential Albums
in the nineties came out, and now we have the
five hundred one Essential of the eighties. Yes, they are
of a piece.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Let me pick up this heavy old book.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Yeah. Yeah. We try to help you build your muscles,
ors open and kill small animals if you need to.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Well, one thing's for sure.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
This is the definitive guide of what was probably the
most popular albums in the eighties, and it's it's not
only essential to anybody who wants to know what that
music is like, but it's got just about everything in here.
One thing about the eighties, right, Gary, We had it
(01:09):
all back then. I mean there was so many different
you know, genres of music, and it was all good.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah. I mean the one thing, you know, we actually
asked on the back cover, we asked the greatest music
decade ever, and I think he really can make a
case for it for so many reasons. Like you said, tons,
you know, all sorts of genres were firing. I mean,
you know, hip hop was really coming into its own country,
was having a resurgence. Rock and pop of course, were
(01:41):
exploding because of all these other factors that were going
on in the world. Starting really dug with the Sony
Wachman and then the boomboxes. I mean, we suddenly had
really easily portable music, so we could have music with
us seven and music became part of our lives every
(02:04):
second of the day. And then we had MTV where
we can watch music, you know, whenever we wanted, and
add a whole new dimension to it. And then the
CDs came along and we started buying music we already
owned again, yes, to replace to replace it in our collections.
So there were so many things going on with music.
(02:26):
And then and then the real integration of popular music
even more than in the seventies in the movie soundtracks
into sports stadiums. I mean, you think you can't touch this.
With the Detroit Pistons during the Bad Boys, us Hughey
was in the news the Sports album. You know, you
(02:47):
just had. You know, music was so intertwined and so
much a constant within the culture that you couldn't escape it.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Boy, that is a really great point you make about
the portableness of the music and the generation that got
to do that first. Because when I think of the
greatest music decade ever, I probably think of the late
sixties early seventies, when you know, just the incredible of
(03:19):
incredible bands were coming out like Hendricks and Beatles and
Stones and The Who and Santana and Joe Cocker. But
you make a great point that that music you listen
to at home, in the privacy of your own life,
and this you took everywhere with you.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
And that is a that is an excellent point.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
I'm looking just at the year nineteen eighty Gary, because
I love the way it's broken down into years. And
one of the first one of the first pictures that
caught my eye were Detroit's own Romantics. They made an
impact in nineteen eighty they're still making an impact today
(04:02):
with this, with this album right here.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Very much that that for you know, that first album.
I remember I was in college at the time, and
I remember when my review copy of The Romantics first
album came in and you looked at it and it
was like, what the hell are these guys doing, you know,
with the red suits and all shiny and everything. And
then and then you put it on, and and just
(04:26):
the energy that you got, not only and not only
was the rock and roll energy, that was the great
pop sensibility going on there too. Was at a time
when there was such a divide really between what was
rock and what was pop. Here was a band that
you could say, oh, wait, you can have both at
(04:48):
the same time, yep, and not feel like you're being
unfaithful to rock and roll by liking the you know,
a band like the Romantics because they were rock and roll. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
In the eighties, we we were lucky enough to get,
especially here in Detroit, but not just here, but especially here,
a lot of local music that got national attention and
regional attention. But you also had, you know, the hair bands,
and the punk rock was still was still reverberating. But
(05:20):
I'm just scanning the eighties here and you've got Genesis
with Duke, You've got British Steel with Judas Priest, and
then you've got nine to five and odd jobs with
Dolly parton The Pretenders. I'll tell you one of my favorites,
Prince Dirty Mind, that first album. People look back at
(05:42):
this decade and they'll go wow. I mean, yeah, on
one page you've got rock Pile. The other page you've
got Bruce Springsteen with The River maybe one of his
you know, I don't know, what would you say, his
deepest albums that he ever put out, you know what
I mean?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So certainly most ambitious. I think, Doug one of the
things we really saw happened in the eighties. And I
was mentioning before there was this divide between genres. You know,
if you were a rock fan, you weren't an R
and B fan, and you know, an artist like Prince
in I don't know, nineteen seventy five wasn't fathomable. And
(06:25):
for some people it was because you understood Funkadelic and
you understood where there was crossover. But I think I
think really when we got MTV, we got our MTV right,
and that was really the point where it democratized the music.
Like you could watch in a half hour. You'd get
(06:45):
your Judas Priest and you'd get your Prince, you get
your romantics, you know, you might get you know, you'd
get Springsteen, and then and then maybe a Michael Jackson
pops up in a David Bowie and people became music fans,
not just rock fans, not just funk fans. But it
(07:06):
was all laid out for us to become just music
fans for a minute there, and I think that made
that made a huge difference. We certainly saw it in
the album sales when we saw you know, skyrocketing. You know,
every number just about every number one album in the
eighties was selling it a clip of like half a
(07:27):
million to a million copies a week. Okay, they don't
do that in their lifetimes right now, No, but it was.
But but you know, if something popped out and was
number one on Billboard, it probably sold five hundred eight
hundred thousand copies that first week of release alone. And
then that's because of how many people were just listening
(07:49):
to so much music and so many different kinds of
music at the same time.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah, I was definitely one that was influenced by MTV.
There were a lot of artists that I just was
not familiar with. Let's just start with video number one
of the Buggles. You know what I mean, and I
just seen bands like that.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
That I'd never played on the radio.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I you know, really hadn't been uh you know, in
touch with a lot of different rock music. And the eighties, Boy,
that that opened the door, no question about it, to
a wide variety of music, even on the rock playlist
back then.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You know, it really did.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Oh absolutely, And you know we we, like I was saying,
you know, we we had the opportunity for a minute there,
you know what had happened, and you know, you live
you lived it as well. But things became very segmented
for a while. And then in the eighties it just
felt like it opened up and it was it was
(08:53):
a little more democratic, you know, whether it was MTV,
whether it was some of these music sound movies, sound
tracks that went across the board. We really, I think
it's music fans. We were open to just about anything
at any given time, where before we might have helped
a little more segmented or even a little more closed
(09:14):
off because it looked weird or sounded weird or didn't
didn't sound like what we thought were our favorite bands.
And that was that really really was a nice moment.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Yeah, I mean, you're playing Joan Armor Trading, you're playing
Men at Work, You're playing Van Halen. I mean, it
really was a wide variety of music, not only on
radio playlist, but like you said, MTV and at the
record stores. So I'm going through the book and I'm
I just happened to glance at contributors and I'm thinking, boy,
(09:45):
there probably isn't one name in here I would recognize.
And then I see our old buddy Jeff Corey in there,
and of course your friend and mine, Stacy Sherman, and
I saw a couple of contributors there that that have
Detroit roots. Tell me about who helped contribute to this
book and and and what what were their their duties.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Yeah, that was I'll tell you that that was the
best part of doing this book in the nineties. Book
was to work with friends and colleagues from around the country,
but especially you know, people people from around here, like
you know you mentioned Stacy and Jeff Corey. Adam Graham
from the Detroit News was part of this. Charlie Hunt
handled our our jazz stuff. Gary Klecinski, who was one
(10:34):
of the founders of the Polish Muslims I was part
of the book. Rob Saint Mary who you know, who
was a Detroit writer for a long time now living
out in the Southwest. And then but then you've got
some you know, some of my colleagues from Billboard who
wrote for it, in colleagues from all the m classic rock,
San Dirkols from Saint Louis who who I've written I've
(10:57):
done a few books with. So you know, we were
it really was, I guess, a team effort, and I
guess in this scenario, I'm the general manager. So we
all contributed to what was a spreadsheet of twenty five
hundred albums to consider, and then there were there's a
(11:17):
lot of email and there were zooms, and conference called them.
The funniest thing that happened on both this and the
nineties book was several of us would be at the
same concept, you know, reviewing it, you know, doing our
day to day duties, and in between acts or before
things started, we would get to talking about the book
(11:39):
and the list and what was going to be in
the books, and you know, I'll use discussion as a euphemism,
but discussing to the point and the volume to where
you know, people sitting around us were calling security, like
you know, you better talk to each better. Chill these
people out. They're going to start swinging at each other.
So really, you know, so the contribut you contributed on
(12:01):
the prime as well as in the writing, you know,
they helped, they helped select the books. In the end,
it comes down to me, you know, to make the
final choices. And so you know, some listen, some are
going to be obvious, right. I would say out of
five hundred and one, half were pretty obvious, and then
the rest were the part of those euphemistic discussions I
(12:24):
mentioned where we batted them around a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Well, yeah, I mean, you put a lot of work
into this because not only does it just list the
album in the artist, but it also has you know
a bit of a review in a and in a
bio to each band.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
And I mean when you come up on.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
The Soft Boys Underwater Moonlight, I'm not so sure i'd
be able to help you with that one, you know
what I mean?
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So and I do so obviously, I do try to
recruit a you know, a varied group of writers. You know,
a lot of the jazz stuff that Charlie Hunt takes on,
I don't know how well I would be with them. Yeah, yeah,
myself but you know he knows and Mike Himes, who
used Stone the record time chain here and oh yeah,
(13:09):
one of the great record chains. So he's very you know,
he was there for the birth of electronic music, and
that's very important, you know, a very important part of
the story. And so it's great to have him be
there to make sure we had we had the right
albums in the book and to make sure they were
written properly. But I look at it, that's half the battle. Yeah,
(13:33):
that's half the battle is getting the right people to
do it.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I don't doubt it because it is really well done.
But I'm just glancing now at the next year. In
nineteen eighty one, the world becomes a.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Little more eclectic.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Just a year later you see some changes going on.
I love the way it's set up. You can really
kind of follow along with history. So tell me about
Detroit music that made it. In here, we talked about
the romantics. I see Bob Seekers against the Wind album
(14:07):
in here.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
So in there We've got, Yeah, We've got was not
was born to laugh at tornadoes? Whoa is in here?
You know, we felt a very important album. A lot
of a lot of electronic artists from Detroit because you
know that eighties was when what we you know, what
we now know is electronic dance music was being created.
(14:30):
It was being created here in Detroit. So we we
got we got a good amount of that stuff in there.
The you know, the Detroit rap explosion really didn't happen
until the nineties, right, so that was well represented in
the nineties book. And you know that. You also, it's
interesting because this is a book that has to These
are books that have to take into account everything you
(14:54):
know you'd make you'd make your list of Detroit albums,
but then yeah, but then have to put them up
against the rest of the world and ask that hard
question like, okay, it's and it's not just how they
stacked up. If an album is not in here, doesn't
mean it's a bad album or a lesser album. But
in the mission of what are the essential the five
(15:15):
hundred one essential albums of the decade? Are they essential?
And you really have to define what what what does
essential mean? And does that album fits as they must
have essential type of album. So you know a lot
of your personal favorites go by the wayside.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
As eventual we do have Anita Baker and here, Diana
Ross is in here, Marita Franklin's in here, some Motown's represented.
So yeah, I'm comfortable that we give the motor City
it to do. You could make a five hundred one essential,
you know, Detroit album given decade's.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Certainly i'd help you work on that book. Have you
ever to do it?
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Oh? That would be that would be fun to do.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
That would be fun to do.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So I see, I see you've done at least six
official or five official books.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
This would be your sixth. You've worked on others. I
would imagine what is It's.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
Like your twelfth Now, yeah, this is this is my well,
this is my twelfth is a book book? Wow? And
then if you had if you had another, I think
there's another dozen or fifteen that I've been a contributor for,
but not the editor or the primary writer. Right.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
Well, you had to see your book, Alice Cooper book.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
People needs to People need to go out and look
these up if they haven't done so yet, or if
they haven't heard us talk about these other books. But
the nineties, like you mentioned, just came out in November.
Now is their plans to do the.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Seventies because that would be a big decade of music.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
So I have the spreadsheet going already. Oh no, the seventies,
just waiting for the green lights from the publisher.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
And so what would that be the five thousand and
one albums?
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Now we go, you know, we go five hundred and
one and we we do it. We do it the
hard way. It is fascinating because this happened in the
eighties more than in the nineties, and certainly more in
the seventies. You had very significant bands releasing very significant
albums almost every freaking year. And how do you you
(17:35):
know in the eighties we had it with Ram and
Talking Heads and Elvis Costello. You know, in the seventies
we're already looking at it with the Stones and led Zeppelin.
And you know there's that period from the middle decade
on with Bob Seeger and you know you have Stix
and and all of these bands that had had these
(17:57):
great runs and because of the nature of the indie
music industry at the time, they were putting out albums
every year. Some of them were putting out two albums
a year. This will happen if we get to do
the sixties too, So it'll be it'll be an even
harder grample. The only the only thing that saves it
a bit in the seventies is you really didn't have
(18:18):
hip hop happening, and you know, so you'll you and
pop was kind of you know, there were pop albums,
but you know, not necessarily do the same extent as
we had in some of these other decades.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Yeah, they kind of right off the cliff when in
those eras when new music came in, the old music
kind of went away. You didn't hear any more Pat
Boone after the Beatles hit the radio, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
And there was a point in the seventies where you know,
the Osmond's will you know you you lose the Osmond's.
The Jackson five had a follow period before they before
My came back with Off the Wall, So you know,
so that opens that and there are won't as many soundtracks,
you know, key soundtrack albums as there were during the
(19:10):
eighties or nineties. So that's going to open up some room.
But you know, but you sit there looking at seven
Led Zeppelin albums and what do you leave that? What
do you leave out? But do you have rooms? Well
that Zeppelin may.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Be a hard maybe Codada off the list.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Yeah, you know, and Coda at least was in the
eighties and it's not on our list. But you know,
even like what you might consider a weaker album like
Him Through the Outdoor, pretty significant album, you know. So
that'll be forward to the Yeah, yeah, yes, I'm looking
forward to the chance, hopefully getting the chance.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yeah, that's a challenge more than a chance.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
But then yeah, yeah, I'm lucky the Beatles only really
had two albums in the seventies. In the seventies to include,
otherwise that would be a whole other challenge.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Yeah, because they had like four or five I think
just in nineteen sixty four alone.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
So oh yeah, no, that'll be that'll be sixties will
be ridiculous as well, but in a different way. But hopefully,
you know, if all the good people listening go out
and copies of the eighties and books will get a
shot at those at the seventies and sixties.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Well, if you were into the hair, if you were
into the punk, if you were into rock, disco, whatever,
I mean, it's here in the eighties and you've got it.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
You've got it laid out beautifully.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Five hundred and one Essential Albums of the Eighties and
music fans Definitive Guide. Gary Graff, congratulations on yet another
outstanding project and book and very well priced and it's beautiful.
So it sits right there nicely on the coffee table,
and people need to get out there and pick it
(20:57):
up and not only support local, but hey, if you need,
if you need a Definitive Guide, it's sitting right here.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Congratulations.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Oh, I appreciate it, and uh yeah, everybody go get it. Uh,
wherever you get your books, I always put in a
plug for your local independent bookseller. We love them. And
you know, if you see me tolling around, it's probably
in the trunk of my car. So beep beep and
I'll pull beef and I'll pull over and you'll get
(21:26):
a copy.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
All right.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Well, Gary Graff, thanks so much, contributor to the Drew
Lane Show, of course, the Rock and Roll Insider for
many many years.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
And uh and author, I salute you, my friend.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Well, thank you very much, and I'm about to rock
all right, Gary, you take care.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
All right, thanks for rocking with wheels today.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
By but
Yeah, hither Detroits Wheels.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Hey, it's Kerry Gary Kraft, the Rock and Roll Insider.
Thanks for checking in, Gary, Congratulations on another new book.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Yeah to it. Somewhere along the line, it felt like
it would be a good idea to do two back
to back. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Not too long ago. You put out that book of
the nineties, So here we go.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Yeah, in November. Okay, the five hundred one Essential Albums
in the nineties came out, and now we have the
five hundred one Essential of the eighties. Yes, they are
of a piece.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Let me pick up this heavy old book.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Yeah. Yeah. We try to help you build your muscles,
ors open and kill small animals if you need to.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
Well, one thing's for sure.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
This is the definitive guide of what was probably the
most popular albums in the eighties, and it's it's not
only essential to anybody who wants to know what that
music is like, but it's got just about everything in here.
One thing about the eighties, right, Gary, We had it
(01:09):
all back then. I mean there was so many different
you know, genres of music, and it was all good.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah. I mean the one thing, you know, we actually
asked on the back cover, we asked the greatest music
decade ever, and I think he really can make a
case for it for so many reasons. Like you said, tons,
you know, all sorts of genres were firing. I mean,
you know, hip hop was really coming into its own country,
was having a resurgence. Rock and pop of course, were
(01:41):
exploding because of all these other factors that were going
on in the world. Starting really dug with the Sony
Wachman and then the boomboxes. I mean, we suddenly had
really easily portable music, so we could have music with
us seven and music became part of our lives every
(02:04):
second of the day. And then we had MTV where
we can watch music, you know, whenever we wanted, and
add a whole new dimension to it. And then the
CDs came along and we started buying music we already
owned again, yes, to replace to replace it in our collections.
So there were so many things going on with music.
(02:26):
And then and then the real integration of popular music
even more than in the seventies in the movie soundtracks
into sports stadiums. I mean, you think you can't touch this.
With the Detroit Pistons during the Bad Boys, us Hughey
was in the news the Sports album. You know, you
(02:47):
just had. You know, music was so intertwined and so
much a constant within the culture that you couldn't escape it.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Boy, that is a really great point you make about
the portableness of the music and the generation that got
to do that first. Because when I think of the
greatest music decade ever, I probably think of the late
sixties early seventies, when you know, just the incredible of
(03:19):
incredible bands were coming out like Hendricks and Beatles and
Stones and The Who and Santana and Joe Cocker. But
you make a great point that that music you listen
to at home, in the privacy of your own life,
and this you took everywhere with you.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
And that is a that is an excellent point.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
I'm looking just at the year nineteen eighty Gary, because
I love the way it's broken down into years. And
one of the first one of the first pictures that
caught my eye were Detroit's own Romantics. They made an
impact in nineteen eighty they're still making an impact today
(04:02):
with this, with this album right here.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Very much that that for you know, that first album.
I remember I was in college at the time, and
I remember when my review copy of The Romantics first
album came in and you looked at it and it
was like, what the hell are these guys doing, you know,
with the red suits and all shiny and everything. And
then and then you put it on, and and just
(04:26):
the energy that you got, not only and not only
was the rock and roll energy, that was the great
pop sensibility going on there too. Was at a time
when there was such a divide really between what was
rock and what was pop. Here was a band that
you could say, oh, wait, you can have both at
(04:48):
the same time, yep, and not feel like you're being
unfaithful to rock and roll by liking the you know,
a band like the Romantics because they were rock and roll. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
In the eighties, we we were lucky enough to get,
especially here in Detroit, but not just here, but especially here,
a lot of local music that got national attention and
regional attention. But you also had, you know, the hair bands,
and the punk rock was still was still reverberating. But
(05:20):
I'm just scanning the eighties here and you've got Genesis
with Duke, You've got British Steel with Judas Priest, and
then you've got nine to five and odd jobs with
Dolly parton The Pretenders. I'll tell you one of my favorites,
Prince Dirty Mind, that first album. People look back at
(05:42):
this decade and they'll go wow. I mean, yeah, on
one page you've got rock Pile. The other page you've
got Bruce Springsteen with The River maybe one of his
you know, I don't know, what would you say, his
deepest albums that he ever put out, you know what
I mean?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
So certainly most ambitious. I think, Doug one of the
things we really saw happened in the eighties. And I
was mentioning before there was this divide between genres. You know,
if you were a rock fan, you weren't an R
and B fan, and you know, an artist like Prince
in I don't know, nineteen seventy five wasn't fathomable. And
(06:25):
for some people it was because you understood Funkadelic and
you understood where there was crossover. But I think I
think really when we got MTV, we got our MTV right,
and that was really the point where it democratized the music.
Like you could watch in a half hour. You'd get
(06:45):
your Judas Priest and you'd get your Prince, you get
your romantics, you know, you might get you know, you'd
get Springsteen, and then and then maybe a Michael Jackson
pops up in a David Bowie and people became music fans,
not just rock fans, not just funk fans. But it
(07:06):
was all laid out for us to become just music
fans for a minute there, and I think that made
that made a huge difference. We certainly saw it in
the album sales when we saw you know, skyrocketing. You know,
every number just about every number one album in the
eighties was selling it a clip of like half a
(07:27):
million to a million copies a week. Okay, they don't
do that in their lifetimes right now, No, but it was.
But but you know, if something popped out and was
number one on Billboard, it probably sold five hundred eight
hundred thousand copies that first week of release alone. And
then that's because of how many people were just listening
(07:49):
to so much music and so many different kinds of
music at the same time.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yeah, I was definitely one that was influenced by MTV.
There were a lot of artists that I just was
not familiar with. Let's just start with video number one
of the Buggles. You know what I mean, and I
just seen bands like that.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
That I'd never played on the radio.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I you know, really hadn't been uh you know, in
touch with a lot of different rock music. And the eighties, Boy,
that that opened the door, no question about it, to
a wide variety of music, even on the rock playlist
back then.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
You know, it really did.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Oh absolutely, And you know we we, like I was saying,
you know, we we had the opportunity for a minute there,
you know what had happened, and you know, you live
you lived it as well. But things became very segmented
for a while. And then in the eighties it just
felt like it opened up and it was it was
(08:53):
a little more democratic, you know, whether it was MTV,
whether it was some of these music sound movies, sound
tracks that went across the board. We really, I think
it's music fans. We were open to just about anything
at any given time, where before we might have helped
a little more segmented or even a little more closed
(09:14):
off because it looked weird or sounded weird or didn't
didn't sound like what we thought were our favorite bands.
And that was that really really was a nice moment.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Yeah, I mean, you're playing Joan Armor Trading, you're playing
Men at Work, You're playing Van Halen. I mean, it
really was a wide variety of music, not only on
radio playlist, but like you said, MTV and at the
record stores. So I'm going through the book and I'm
I just happened to glance at contributors and I'm thinking, boy,
(09:45):
there probably isn't one name in here I would recognize.
And then I see our old buddy Jeff Corey in there,
and of course your friend and mine, Stacy Sherman, and
I saw a couple of contributors there that that have
Detroit roots. Tell me about who helped contribute to this
book and and and what what were their their duties.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Yeah, that was I'll tell you that that was the
best part of doing this book in the nineties. Book
was to work with friends and colleagues from around the country,
but especially you know, people people from around here, like
you know you mentioned Stacy and Jeff Corey. Adam Graham
from the Detroit News was part of this. Charlie Hunt
handled our our jazz stuff. Gary Klecinski, who was one
(10:34):
of the founders of the Polish Muslims I was part
of the book. Rob Saint Mary who you know, who
was a Detroit writer for a long time now living
out in the Southwest. And then but then you've got
some you know, some of my colleagues from Billboard who
wrote for it, in colleagues from all the m classic rock,
San Dirkols from Saint Louis who who I've written I've
(10:57):
done a few books with. So you know, we were
it really was, I guess, a team effort, and I
guess in this scenario, I'm the general manager. So we
all contributed to what was a spreadsheet of twenty five
hundred albums to consider, and then there were there's a
(11:17):
lot of email and there were zooms, and conference called them.
The funniest thing that happened on both this and the
nineties book was several of us would be at the
same concept, you know, reviewing it, you know, doing our
day to day duties, and in between acts or before
things started, we would get to talking about the book
(11:39):
and the list and what was going to be in
the books, and you know, I'll use discussion as a euphemism,
but discussing to the point and the volume to where
you know, people sitting around us were calling security, like
you know, you better talk to each better. Chill these
people out. They're going to start swinging at each other.
So really, you know, so the contribut you contributed on
(12:01):
the prime as well as in the writing, you know,
they helped, they helped select the books. In the end,
it comes down to me, you know, to make the
final choices. And so you know, some listen, some are
going to be obvious, right. I would say out of
five hundred and one, half were pretty obvious, and then
the rest were the part of those euphemistic discussions I
(12:24):
mentioned where we batted them around a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Well, yeah, I mean, you put a lot of work
into this because not only does it just list the
album in the artist, but it also has you know
a bit of a review in a and in a
bio to each band.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
And I mean when you come up on.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
The Soft Boys Underwater Moonlight, I'm not so sure i'd
be able to help you with that one, you know
what I mean?
Speaker 3 (12:47):
So and I do so obviously, I do try to
recruit a you know, a varied group of writers. You know,
a lot of the jazz stuff that Charlie Hunt takes on,
I don't know how well I would be with them. Yeah, yeah,
myself but you know he knows and Mike Himes, who
used Stone the record time chain here and oh yeah,
(13:09):
one of the great record chains. So he's very you know,
he was there for the birth of electronic music, and
that's very important, you know, a very important part of
the story. And so it's great to have him be
there to make sure we had we had the right
albums in the book and to make sure they were
written properly. But I look at it, that's half the battle. Yeah,
(13:33):
that's half the battle is getting the right people to
do it.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I don't doubt it because it is really well done.
But I'm just glancing now at the next year. In
nineteen eighty one, the world becomes a.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Little more eclectic.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Just a year later you see some changes going on.
I love the way it's set up. You can really
kind of follow along with history. So tell me about
Detroit music that made it. In here, we talked about
the romantics. I see Bob Seekers against the Wind album
(14:07):
in here.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
So in there We've got, Yeah, We've got was not
was born to laugh at tornadoes? Whoa is in here?
You know, we felt a very important album. A lot
of a lot of electronic artists from Detroit because you
know that eighties was when what we you know, what
we now know is electronic dance music was being created.
(14:30):
It was being created here in Detroit. So we we
got we got a good amount of that stuff in there.
The you know, the Detroit rap explosion really didn't happen
until the nineties, right, so that was well represented in
the nineties book. And you know that. You also, it's
interesting because this is a book that has to These
are books that have to take into account everything you
(14:54):
know you'd make you'd make your list of Detroit albums,
but then yeah, but then have to put them up
against the rest of the world and ask that hard
question like, okay, it's and it's not just how they
stacked up. If an album is not in here, doesn't
mean it's a bad album or a lesser album. But
in the mission of what are the essential the five
(15:15):
hundred one essential albums of the decade? Are they essential?
And you really have to define what what what does
essential mean? And does that album fits as they must
have essential type of album. So you know a lot
of your personal favorites go by the wayside.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
As eventual we do have Anita Baker and here, Diana
Ross is in here, Marita Franklin's in here, some Motown's represented.
So yeah, I'm comfortable that we give the motor City
it to do. You could make a five hundred one essential,
you know, Detroit album given decade's.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Certainly i'd help you work on that book. Have you
ever to do it?
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Oh? That would be that would be fun to do.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
That would be fun to do.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So I see, I see you've done at least six
official or five official books.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
This would be your sixth. You've worked on others. I
would imagine what is It's.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
Like your twelfth Now, yeah, this is this is my well,
this is my twelfth is a book book? Wow? And
then if you had if you had another, I think
there's another dozen or fifteen that I've been a contributor for,
but not the editor or the primary writer. Right.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
Well, you had to see your book, Alice Cooper book.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
People needs to People need to go out and look
these up if they haven't done so yet, or if
they haven't heard us talk about these other books. But
the nineties, like you mentioned, just came out in November.
Now is their plans to do the.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Seventies because that would be a big decade of music.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
So I have the spreadsheet going already. Oh no, the seventies,
just waiting for the green lights from the publisher.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
And so what would that be the five thousand and
one albums?
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Now we go, you know, we go five hundred and
one and we we do it. We do it the
hard way. It is fascinating because this happened in the
eighties more than in the nineties, and certainly more in
the seventies. You had very significant bands releasing very significant
albums almost every freaking year. And how do you you
(17:35):
know in the eighties we had it with Ram and
Talking Heads and Elvis Costello. You know, in the seventies
we're already looking at it with the Stones and led Zeppelin.
And you know there's that period from the middle decade
on with Bob Seeger and you know you have Stix
and and all of these bands that had had these
(17:57):
great runs and because of the nature of the indie
music industry at the time, they were putting out albums
every year. Some of them were putting out two albums
a year. This will happen if we get to do
the sixties too, So it'll be it'll be an even
harder grample. The only the only thing that saves it
a bit in the seventies is you really didn't have
(18:18):
hip hop happening, and you know, so you'll you and
pop was kind of you know, there were pop albums,
but you know, not necessarily do the same extent as
we had in some of these other decades.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Yeah, they kind of right off the cliff when in
those eras when new music came in, the old music
kind of went away. You didn't hear any more Pat
Boone after the Beatles hit the radio, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
And there was a point in the seventies where you know,
the Osmond's will you know you you lose the Osmond's.
The Jackson five had a follow period before they before
My came back with Off the Wall, So you know,
so that opens that and there are won't as many soundtracks,
you know, key soundtrack albums as there were during the
(19:10):
eighties or nineties. So that's going to open up some room.
But you know, but you sit there looking at seven
Led Zeppelin albums and what do you leave that? What
do you leave out? But do you have rooms? Well
that Zeppelin may.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Be a hard maybe Codada off the list.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Yeah, you know, and Coda at least was in the
eighties and it's not on our list. But you know,
even like what you might consider a weaker album like
Him Through the Outdoor, pretty significant album, you know. So
that'll be forward to the Yeah, yeah, yes, I'm looking
forward to the chance, hopefully getting the chance.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yeah, that's a challenge more than a chance.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
But then yeah, yeah, I'm lucky the Beatles only really
had two albums in the seventies. In the seventies to include,
otherwise that would be a whole other challenge.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Yeah, because they had like four or five I think
just in nineteen sixty four alone.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
So oh yeah, no, that'll be that'll be sixties will
be ridiculous as well, but in a different way. But hopefully,
you know, if all the good people listening go out
and copies of the eighties and books will get a
shot at those at the seventies and sixties.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Well, if you were into the hair, if you were
into the punk, if you were into rock, disco, whatever,
I mean, it's here in the eighties and you've got it.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
You've got it laid out beautifully.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Five hundred and one Essential Albums of the Eighties and
music fans Definitive Guide. Gary Graff, congratulations on yet another
outstanding project and book and very well priced and it's beautiful.
So it sits right there nicely on the coffee table,
and people need to get out there and pick it
(20:57):
up and not only support local, but hey, if you need,
if you need a Definitive Guide, it's sitting right here.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
Congratulations.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Oh, I appreciate it, and uh yeah, everybody go get it. Uh,
wherever you get your books, I always put in a
plug for your local independent bookseller. We love them. And
you know, if you see me tolling around, it's probably
in the trunk of my car. So beep beep and
I'll pull beef and I'll pull over and you'll get
(21:26):
a copy.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
All right.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Well, Gary Graff, thanks so much, contributor to the Drew
Lane Show, of course, the Rock and Roll Insider for
many many years.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
And uh and author, I salute you, my friend.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Well, thank you very much, and I'm about to rock
all right, Gary, you take care.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
All right, thanks for rocking with wheels today.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
By but
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