September 15, 2021 • 39 mins
Rafael Davila was found in the gutters of a back alley street in Washington D.C., by his two young children. He had hit rock bottom, didn't have the balls to take his own life, didn't want to feel anymore, hoping for an accidental overdose. He had lost his father years prior, and now his mother was dying of cancer. Rafael lays it all out for America's Podcaster, Kurt Caceres, and shares his rollercoaster ride through addiction and to recovery. Some say addiction is genetic, but his twin brother never fell into it. Others say it's all about environment, but they were raised by a loving mother in an affluent middle class suburb. Rafael tells us without hesitation, the main reason people fall into drug and alcohol abuse and addiction. It's a simple emotion that we all have to cope with and deal at points in our lives. But why does it take some, when others find a way to break free? This is the true story of a man who saw the end of his life, was ready to no longer feel, but then found the light and now is a daily servant to help others be saved from their own demons.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Ladies and gentlemen, please take yourseats. The show is a bounce to
begin. Yes, you know whereyou're at. This is role called the
(00:24):
podcast and this is the one andonly America's podcaster Kirkus Saris coming at you
as usual. This is Part twowith my guests Raphael Dabulah. If you're
here you heard part one. Thisman is an inspiration and motivation. I
left it on the air for twoweeks before I released part two because we
were getting so many messages, somany emails, people being brought to tears,
(00:47):
people sending the episode to people theyknew that they loved to try to
help them, motivate them, inspirethem, because that's what we do on
the show. We're here to helpyou. We're here to teach you about
what's out there in the world,to give you information, to hear guess
stories from their life so that wemay make this world a better place.
(01:08):
Raphael d'avola was once on the streetsin the gutter. He was once an
auto himself, but through many trialsand tribulations, he found his way out
and now he's trying to help others. Join me and my co host Josan
Murdy Tony Frost. Right now,as we'll go about to take you to
part two, we'll call the podcastRafael Davola. Let's do this. So
(01:34):
I spiral, I like, Idecided yolo. I don't know. Yeah,
anybody can die any moment. Yeah, I'm in an unhappy marriage,
I'm not happy with work and wheremy life is going. I'm just gonna
go do me and I did,and it got bad really really quick,
you know. And this isn't DC, This isn't DC. Yeah yeah.
(01:57):
So then let's tell thank you forsharing that. It's amazing. So let's
tell about what was you testing itearlier? Your daughter found you or your
kids found you. Well, Iwas going through this. It's a lifelong
thing. So I go through thisperiod where I crash. I called my
twin brother at one point he's livingin Tampa at the time. I say,
(02:21):
if I don't get out of DCin the next twenty four hours,
I don't know what's gonna happen.And I was having a suicide idea.
It's just a lot of people inthat position. Oh yeah, yeah.
So I'm just really dealing with depression, anxiety and my addiction and just wanting
to give up. Bills are pilingup and I'm losing control, and so
he flies me down to Tampa andI'm living with him. That goes for
(02:42):
a little bit. I decide I'mgonna try to get back with my family.
I moved back to DC to tryto do the right thing. Lo
and behold, I relapsed over sometime, come back down to Florida,
living with my brother. He's takingcare of my ass. My mother gets
cancer, she dies, and Ijust start I'm just struggling. I'm trying
to do the right thing. ButI'm just struggling, you know. And
(03:07):
finally, for the last time,I fucked up, and my brother's like,
get the fuck out of my house. I don't know where you're gonna
go, but you need to getout of here. Kick me out.
But he didn't. He loved me. So I started, you know,
getting a little bit of help.I got the idea I'm gonna try to
get back with my wife again.Moved back to DC, try to do
that. This time, I wentlike super Christian, super religious to try
(03:29):
to like handle it, and Idid for like three or four years.
But I was testing the water.So this is how sneaky this thing is.
And so during that three or fouryears, I was sober, but
six months I had a little drinkthat was good. So I went another
year and then a smoke a jointand I was good, and I go
a little and before you know it, about four years of doing that,
(03:51):
I'm at the gym and we're kindof telling jokes about coke or something like
that, and i see somebody tapsomebody on the side and I'm like,
oh shit, that's the that's theplug right there. Yeah, and I
was just unhappy enough and uncomfortable.I remember it's about being comfortable, like
some coke would feel good, thatwuld pick me up and off to the
races. And so I'm supposed topick up my daughter from getting their braces
(04:14):
and I'm disappeared for two or threedays or something, and my ex wife
is calling me my brother. I'mjust like, now, I'm when you
realize just so much guilt and shame. I'm really screwed up again. And
I'm thinking I'm just gonna keep gettinghigh until I just maybe i'll overdose or
I don't know, and just Iwon't have enough guts to kill myself.
But yeah, but you didn't wantto feel anymore. I didn't want to
(04:35):
feel. So somehow my ex wifeis driving around DC. They find me,
how old are your kids? Atthis point, I guess ten and
eleven young? Pick me up.My ex wife tells me my twin bets
on his way from Detroit. He'sgonna come get me and picks my ass
(04:56):
up. I'm just in the basementjust you could just feel weight of just
all that self pity, you know, guilt and shame. Takes me back
to Detroit and he's like, well, you want to go to rehab,
and I'm like at that point,I'm like I'll do whatever. Yeah,
Well you want to go to California. I'm like, yeah, whatever.
And so the plan was just forme to come to California for thirty or
forty days, and I did prettymuch convinced I was gonna keep getting high
(05:23):
the rest of my life. Andthen I'm like I just had like I
didn't want to have anything to dowith step work or God. My brothers
like, shut the funk up,get on the plane, you're going,
you know, yeah, But I'msitting in Detox. I'm thirty seven years
old with a suitcase. I'm like, who am I to argue with anybody
about anything? And it just humbledme. I just opened up a little
(05:43):
bit. He talks in California,yeah, wearing California him it. I
don't want to talk shit, butpeople do. I was like, where
am I him? And They're like, you're in the armpit of California.
Yeah, well that's one of them. Yeah, but the center was in
him. But then I'm like,in this beautiful house in Marietta where I
live at Yeah, and so I'mstarting to have a little bit of hope.
(06:08):
Maybe I can actually do this,Maybe I can actually make something out
of my life. But still I'mthinking, I'm just gonna go back and
live with my brother in Detroit whenI'm done with my thirty days. And
then they're like, well, youcan go for another thirty or sixty or
ninety days out by the beach.Your insurance is good for it. So
I did that, and then Isaw a little bit more hope, and
I'm like, well, maybe I'llbecome a personal trainer. I'm in Orange
(06:30):
County. Yeah, I want tobe happy. Let me do that.
And so next thing you know,I'm in treatment for a year, get
certified to be a personal trainer andnot wanting to work in treatment, but
series of events, I started doingthese groups and it just kind of caught
on and perfect segue. So that'sthat's where that's nice, that's where we're
at right now. So now heis and it's like, I can't it's
(06:56):
this, this, this got mein the day. Him and I I
don't know if we texted. Wasa phone caller? Attacks, yeah,
and yet had a long day AndI'm like, and I can only imagine
if you're having to deal with groupafter group after group throughout the day,
these people with all this weight,what it does to accounter's mental and physical
and psyche like, it's got tobe so draining. Well are you are
(07:17):
all you guys actors? Um?No, no, No, Well she
she's many things. I mean,she's well ted talker, author, okay,
spoke her books right here on thetable, okay, Josh okay.
So yeah, some of my guestshave come up, so you know what
(07:38):
it's like to stress about coming upwith content for performance or for speech,
right, yeah, and how muchyou would think about that and then also
to get to the speech and thenthe audience is just kind of right,
and then you know, I alreadydescribed like my diction. A lot of
(07:59):
it has to do with me wantingto feel accepted or whatever. So now
I'm like in this environment, it'slike and they're just looking at you like
and then you're trying to find away to get accepted this group. So
I'm like, you know, doingmy like cap Dan, trying to like
pull something. Come on, talkto me, talk to you know what
I'm saying. And so I dothat, but I do that six or
seven times a day. You knowwhat I'm saying, Monday, do Friday,
(08:22):
and then you got to go anddo something. But then you all
still gotta hear there do they getto talk and they shared. That's gotta
be draining hearing all these different storiesand the stories are crazy, because go
ahead. My question is how doyou deal? How do you deal?
(08:43):
Let's do that? How do youdeal with that? Like what is your
well? I can't get high right, So a lot of people do.
Like the relapse rate for people whowork in treatment really oh yeah, because
talking about you're just immersed in sicknessand these you know, yeah, And
(09:05):
so I wish there was something likewhen I talked to my clientses, we're
t I wish there was some magicpill or formula, but we don't get
to use that magic pill anymore.Yeah, it's yoga, it's working out.
You have yeah, outlet I haveto or otherwise. I mean the
anxiety that when I really started doingthis full time because it was a process.
(09:31):
Yeah, um, but the anxietyI started the experience, Oh my
god. So just to be ableto cope, Yeah, I started doing
breathing techniques. Yeah, like youhear about Joe Rogan wim Hof nice man.
I looked that up and then andso then a lot of my groups
or stuff that I'm actually using formyself just to help them out. Like
(09:54):
I was talking about the adult attachmenttheory. Yeah, and so that like
is really like a big part ofrelapse for a lot of attics's relationships.
Yeah, you know, the anxietyin relationships, that feeling of like,
if it's not anxiety, that beingavoided and shut off, emotionally cold and
(10:15):
failed relationship after relationship that'll send somebodyfor a fucking drink. You know,
my life failed, off to fail, left to fail parties, bro,
They've never even been married. FailedAnd it always it always sends me to
the drink. The real trip iswhen it's second, third, fourth person,
but it's the same person. Sothe pattern goes because you have to
(10:41):
you have to overcome something before itpasses on. Otherwise it just keeps showing
up in absolutely, absolutely, butthat worked to overcome that. WHOA Well.
Now, on a different level,do you build like really type personal
relationships with some of these people thatyou work with? Um, do you
get close to them or do youkeep an arms length or a wall up?
(11:03):
You keep a arms left from client? Yeah, the people that you
work with. I mean it's sucha mix. It's crazy. Because I
have a story real briefly and thereason why I'm glad you asked that question
because I remember an amazing pastor whoovercame heroin for twenty years. Hum.
(11:26):
I mean, God just used himmightily in just people's lives, even to
help them overcome at some level.And he started traveling. He started just
going a lot of different places,you know, to preach and teach,
and his schedule just became really packed. And then he had a facility where
(11:46):
he would invite people who were homeless, whether they're alcoholic, drug addicts or
not. But just homeless and tohelp them get their lives back together.
And he invited two people, acouple who was heron addicted, to try
to help them. Long story short, those two people became his downfall.
(12:07):
By helping them, they started usingheroin, and I guess he got to
a stress level and the temptation camein and now these two people were running
to get him. The drag tookhim down. This is why THEE is
(12:28):
here and why instantly I knew whenI heard what you do, I admired
them. Man like that is you'reone of those people in this world,
like the mother Teresa level. Imean, I know there's no no seriously,
because you're giving so much of yourselfon a daily basis to try to
help people. Well, let mekeep it real. There's a lot of
(12:50):
people. There's a lot of peoplehelping and they're doing it for free.
I get paid, yeah, butI'm not that much a Mother Teresa.
You know what I'm saying. Butpeople who just do this just in order
for them to say sober and tohelp out right. So, but I
think deep down inside I could tellyou you as a person, Yeah,
you're getting paid, but you seemany type of persons still wants to help.
(13:11):
I want to have a reward inlife. Yeah, I want to
have purpose. Also, I feellike I don't think I'm being cocky by
saying this. I feel like Ihave some natural talent and ability that applies
directly with what I do. Yes, now you ask me, do I
get very close? No, Likewhen you're in counseling and stuff like,
(13:31):
you have to keep separation because it'san ethics issue. You know, with
clients for sure, but then sometimesclients become staff, they start working at
the places you get to know themwhatnot. Honestly, my life is so
busy. I'm doing probably twenty fourto twenty five groups a week, which
I didn't realize this, and myanxiety was so crazy. But when therapists
(13:52):
here that, they're like what,so what My question is, then,
what advice would you give someone whowas in similar situation like yourself or even
not, who overcame any form ofaddiction that distance as you talk about,
like, what advice would you give? Because I think that's very important to
(14:13):
the recovery process and to maintain thatsuch a because at the same time that
recovery, I feel like it's connectionand addiction is disconnection. You're trying to
stay plugged in and connected to something, whether it's helping other alcoholics and addicts
and whatever way that looks like,or whether it's church, or maybe it's
(14:37):
in the yoga or like, you'retrying to stay plugged into other human beings.
Yeah, and you're trying to figureout ways to deal with life and
the stress of life. And Ikeep talking about that discomfort of just dealing
with life without a substance. Yeah, no, different than anybody else.
(14:58):
But it's just I can't the substancemakes it easy, because life is hard
for everybody. And I can saythat single. I mean Tony and I.
He's we lived together, He's myroommate, and all twenty twenty was
rough. We would wake up everymorning and meet in the kitchen and be
like, what's I mean? Halfthe time we pop a drink in the
(15:20):
morning during twenty twenty. And that'sthe thing is is like, do you
go to the substance? Even thestrongest person or the normies, no one
is immune to like having to findyea, we as human beings need things
to not feel, to numb,to cover it up, to to to
(15:43):
ignore something. No one's immune tothat, So that that's that's what's admirable,
is that you're forget to pay andforget that it's a job you are.
You're a servant to these people.Your energy, I know, I
know how that is. I'm likea spiritual flavor flavor flavor flav And you,
(16:07):
well you said earlier, you said, I don't want to meet a
cocky but no, I agree withthat. You're very charismatic. You know
how to talk, You have agreat energy, you know how to hold
court in the room. You youwere engaging. You look some people in
the eye. See, that's whatI loved about you was when we first
met, because when I meet aman, there's a certain thing as a
guy that to me is admirable.And you have all those qualities. Confident,
(16:32):
But you weren't too cocky. Cockyis fine. You weren't too cocky,
you weren't too egotistical. You lookedme in the eye. We connected,
you shook my hand, We hada conversation. Addicts people with overblown
ego simultaneously with a like huge inferiority. They're both fighting each other. I
(16:56):
just wanted to tell you too,Kurt, like, because you asked me,
like, do I get close withanybody? The truth is I'm so
busy. Yeah, there's my fianceand me at work, and when I
can, I get away and seemy kids. You know what I'm saying.
Yeah, But I have a lotof acquaintances. I have very few,
like close close friends. But whenI met you, I was like,
Yo, this is a cool guythat met Tony. We didn't talk
(17:18):
that much that night, you know, it was night, but I was
like, you know, this isa cool group of men that like it'd
be cool to like connect with,you know what I'm saying. And your
fiance is amazing. Now you guyshave been together at how long? Let's
see two years and some chance soand and this is one thing I wanted
to say was you would not havemet her if you wouldn't have gone down
(17:40):
the path of recovery. And she'sso amazing. I met her and she
met me. She seems like you'reI watched. I was very observant.
She seems like you're rock like sheshe's strong, she's very stoic. Yeah,
she's very um, laid back.Yeah, doesn't get flu Yeah.
(18:00):
Where I am like, I stayin the world sometimes just her touch.
You needed that in your life.I mean like she was sent to you,
like that was the final thing youneeded. It's crazy. First day
she I was still riding a bicycleeverywhere. They didn't have a car yet.
It was a candid I was clippedin, but it was still a
(18:25):
bag. She was just tired ofgetting screwed over by dudes in Orange County
and stuff, and so she gaveme a shot, you know. And
at the time, I was Ithink maybe I postponed our first date because
I was like, I gotta waittill paid it because I got like ten
dollars in my bank account right now, you know. But we just kind
of kept going and she believed inme, and she's watched you know,
this process, you know, nomeans of our route, Like I'm still
(18:48):
trying to figure this shit out,you know. But but you but she
how she's helping you. She's thatthat I saw that You guys have a
good I'm sure you give her towhat she needs as well. Yeah,
I like to be got like softenher up a little bit because she's tough
sometimes, you know what I mean. I missed her heart and passion and
you know, I got it's apretty good You know, this is why
(19:11):
you're good at what you do though, because you have passion and love and
you've got a light you have andthat is, whether you know it or
not, you're out there helping thesepeople. And I don't wish like I
when I go in, like I'mabout to go later on and do a
couple more groups. And like Isaid, sometimes like they're sitting there,
(19:33):
it's like, am I talking toa wall right now? Like it like
is that drool coming down their mouthright now? You know? But I'm
just hoping that somebody something up.Yeah, but you gotta remember the first
time you went to rehab or somethingwhere you the guy with the drool and
just sitting there like kind of likewe'll see. I was thirty seven,
(19:53):
Yeah, you're a little older,and I was like, I don't know
how many more shots I got atthis. So I was trying. I
was trying to pay attention. Youknow, I was woke up. But
I can think about pastimes where Iwas trying to like get a grip and
things. People told me that atthe moment I wasn't ready to hear.
But it wasn't until later down theroad, I was ready to receive and
(20:14):
so I'm just hoping I'm planning somesiege. So then let's talk about that,
because you said you're thirty seven nowyeah, forty two now, well,
I mean when you started. Somy final one of my I'm ending
with, like the statistical cause ofaddiction. Now, in your opinion,
what's one of the greatest factors andmost common reasons people qui people fall?
(20:34):
Like your opinion? Now, thisis this is actually just from you dealing
with it and being around it.What do you see is the biggest factor
that connection life, connection to lifeto something bigger so you three or something
bigger than just me? Yeah,right, that camaraderie, you have that
(20:57):
belief in the idea of come.You know, you know what I'm saying.
Whatever that thing is that makes youin uh shit, Tony and Josan
Madi and Joseanne, whatever it makesa laws you gouts survived, that's something
bigger than just me. And soover time, if I lose connection with
(21:17):
that whatever that is, they mightbe Buddha or Jesus or Muhammad or Shivah
or I mean, I don't knowwhatever it is. But when you lose
connection with that then when life startsencroaching on you so much that you can't
get keep that connection. And doyou night are you seeing it with the
younger generation now? More and moreis it happening to younger people than it
(21:41):
used to be? But like thedemographic is there like an age and gender,
it's definitely young. I mean theamount of like the hell that some
of the eighteen year old in thenineteen year olds go. I mean,
you guys, you know you livein LA I have a questions. We'll
have two questions. And one ofmy questions because you talk about your kids
(22:03):
and I think you know obviously kidssee and they learn from parents, right
like how so my first question ishow does someone how do you explain to
your kids at a young age oreven now at the age that they are
the things that has happened. Wherehow do you explain that to me?
(22:26):
Well, when my kids were tenand eleven, I was first coming to
rehab, I I just said,daddy's sick and he needs to get some
help. So daddy is sick andhe's gonna stay out here for a little
bit longer while he gets better.And that's how I explained it. You
know. Now my kids are sixteenand fifteen, about to be seventeen,
and it's like, I can justkeep it real, you know, yeah
(22:49):
I can. I told my daughterthis is crash though, but I was
like, baby, pussy makes theworld go around. You got something very
special protected. It's powerful, youknow what I mean? Like I just
I could talk to my kids now, you know. So it's like,
look like sixteen and fifteen. Okay, So it's like, look like your
(23:11):
dad and your dad's mom and dadstruggle with substances and you need to be
careful. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, just watch out. I'm
not telling you what to do.Yeah, all right, but you know,
so we can just talk about it, you know. Yeah. The
reason I asked you about what youthink the demographic is because there are actual
statistics. And sometimes I don't believein science when it comes to stuff like
(23:34):
this. Science has its place inlike some areas, but when it comes
to mental I think that a lotof its subjective, Like for example,
they say a lot of it comesfrom genetics. Like so when we were
talking about earlier, there's the normansand the not so the normans don't have
the gene. That's like you knowsaying there's a twenty twenty one. We
(23:56):
know a lot more about addiction andthe causes of addiction. And there is
something too. I think the ideathat genetically there's something different that predisposes somebody
to handle things differently and it'd bemore prone to some type of addiction.
(24:17):
I think there's something there. Ithink there's people like godbor mate who really
understand now because we are understand alot more about trauma than we did,
yes three nine to eleven true,so that trauma plays a lot bigger role
into addiction than we've given it credit. And so there's it makes But the
(24:37):
truth is even today we really don'tknow. Thank you. And that's what
I'm saying. It's like because theysay, like I honestly, are they
gonna find they say, well,soon says this gene, they're forty to
sixty percent more liable to fall toan addiction. I mean, really,
they're gonna say, you have thegene. You don't you do you don't
that? I don't know? Thatto me doesn't doesn't translate well to me,
(24:57):
do you think to some level becausewe see patterns of generational things,
right, so we see patterns ofgenerational trauma, right, So addiction can
be passed down to your well,for instance, my twin brother, he
didn't struggle, doesn't and that's justcrazy with twins too. You think that
(25:18):
you both have the same genes,so you could probably find you know,
nowadays you can find facts and statistics. Yeah, back up whatever argument you
want. Yeah, but um,I think it's a blend into something.
Yes, you know, I wouldtell my kids to watch out, so
be careful. So so thank you. That's what I was gonna ask you.
(25:38):
So what would you tell if athis is this is I'm going to
close it up right now. Ifone of your kids came up to you
right now and said, Dad,I trust you and I feel like i'm
talking to you about this, andthey're right at that age too. I'm
struggling right now. It's it's I'mfeeling I'm in a dark place. I'm
(26:00):
happy. I started doing a lotof this and this and this. I
don't know what to do. I'mhere for you. I know what you're
going through. I've been there andI can help. Yeah, and when
you're ready, I'm here. Yeah, you know, I'm not gonna try
to force anything on you. Butwhen you're ready, I'm here. You
(26:21):
give them that open door. Right, you can't force, but you let
them know. Sponsor one time,tell me though, because I was talking
to a friend and really wanted tohelp him. Yeah, but he wasn't
ready and he said, pray thatGod destroys him but spares his life.
Jesus. Yeah, no pun intended, but Jesus. Sometimes that's what we're
(26:44):
dealing with. So even let's sayit's not like type of thing, right,
guess, but it's just more like, unfortunately for most of us,
pain is what allows me to openup to some people. Yeah, and
it's until I experience enough pain andhurt that is true. Yeah, you
know what I'm saying. And solike, let's let's flip it a little
(27:07):
bit. Let's say my kids,I'm seeing things, but they haven't said
anything to me. I might havea kind of saying, hey, listen,
I'm seeing some stuff that I've beenthere and it concerns me. And
when you're ready, if you shouldever be ready, I'm here for you.
And then I gotta let that.Absolutely. That gets into codependency and
all kinds of other stuff. Whereit's like, I can't be captain save
(27:30):
a hole for everybody, do youknow what I'm saying? And sometimes that's
like I gotta let you, Igotta I can't steal your bottom. That's
the true All we can do whenwe're helping is open the door and say
hey, that's what he is.There anything else that you want to just
questions? Okay, Well, oneof the things you said right now about
(27:52):
the captain save you know, isI think a lot of times people we've
gone hurt. Yeah, a lotof times when you've gone through extreme trauma
in any situation in life, whetherit's drug, whether it's abused alcohol,
(28:15):
whatever, a heartbreak, what happensis a lot of times you end up
being because you know that you havethe empathy of what you've been through,
you become you fall into this placeof savior and sometimes that can go too
much where you start to really backfireson you. Why you start to really
(28:36):
hurt your own self in the processof trying to save somebody else. So
I think it's, you know,going back to what you said, it's
important to find the healthy balance ofnot creating codependency and not fall into therapists
talk about creating a force feel youcan choose that certain people to come in
(28:57):
and you can choose when you know. I don't know why I'm thinking about
jar Jar binks. Do you knowit's I love Star Wars so much,
but ice Field my instant thing.I thought Star Wars, Yeah, and
then you said jar Jar like,but I have to keep totally. But
(29:21):
the last my question that I wantedto ask is at what point do you
know someone has recovered? H Imean time, but I don't know.
You talked about that light in somebody'seyes, and just as easily as somebody
(29:41):
has recovered, there's a debate inthe community talks about do people ever fully
recover or right or you are inthe process of being recovered. It's like
the difference between being saved or amI being saved or whatever? It's whatever.
But you talked about that light andsometimes that like can come on,
and sometimes I can see people thatare losing that light, you know what
(30:02):
I'm saying. And to me,it's just about like I said before,
connection, Yes, if somebody connectedto something right, and are they staying
connected? And then yeah, andare you not getting the rested or getting
there's so many forty plus people ofrolling around on bikes that I see when
(30:25):
I drive, and I'm like,you must be a recovery. You must
have too many d us. Youcan't God blessing. That was me.
Really, I'd be on there pumpingit, you know what I mean?
Hey, but you know what thatwas sometimes that was some of the best
time in my life. Like sometimesnow, like Biggie said, more money,
more problems. Yeah, like lifeis so much better than it was
(30:47):
five years ago, four and ahalf years ago, three and a half
years ago. But sometimes I misseda simplicity. Life was whatever started simple
and silver rated. We try,we always want more and more and more
and more more than when we getit. We're like you knows, so
grateful for my botty yah because itlike it gives me something, Yeah,
(31:08):
a lot more ahead. They can'tstop. I do like I wanted just
to keep it on on like acomedy or or bring it back to something
more fun. Talk about you showedup to the nines mostly because, like
you said, you put a haton right, it looks great. That's
a that's a hot, that's asexy. So the question is are you
(31:33):
balding or did you just shave yourhead? He just shaved like like that
forehead is very very like way backthere. That's funny. When I first
came out here, I guess Iwas trying to still be young. I
don't know. I had like afoe hawk. It looked like the poop
(31:56):
emoji. Yeah, but I couldn'thave full mohawk because ain't shit working back
here in this little bag. Iguess like in the last year or so,
I was like, I could justI could graduate from ball caps,
like, well, this is thething, well is you have here like
some people like you can't see it. The thing is like when people start
(32:19):
seeing your hair grow in or theylike, oh shit, he's not really
bald, and then they treat youdifferent. I'll say this, I definitely
h I definitely uh have had toum. I wore his hat like because
it's kind of like my alter ego, you know what I'm saying. Yeah,
(32:43):
I was a little nervous about comingand do you oh he did.
I didn't think. I thought,I don't remember that since I met you
where, I was like, youknow, I could step my game.
I can rocket for door here andwhatever. That's that's the look. You.
I went out one time, soI'm gonna treat me and my girl
doesn't really like this happen, butyou know it beautiful, so let's let's
(33:09):
let's close it out there. SoI'm want to ask you what are what
is if you're having the hardest day, stressful, everything's happening. Instead of
going to the old go tos,what's the first thing you're going to,
whether it's yoga, a workout,what's the first what's your breath? You're
breathing, the breathing, full breathing. That's the easiest and most successible thing
(33:32):
in the moment to help people withthat. Isn't there like a certain pattern,
Like there's different ones. There's differentones, but like you didn't get
on Google start playing around, Yeah, I I as well do the same
thing. So that breath, feeling, that oxygen, that deep breath and
it's a real that's science. Feelingthat breath come into my stomach allows me
(33:54):
and it's subtle sometimes you know whatI mean, But it allows me to
start using like more of the likecognit him abilities and to get out of
that fight or flight mode. Yes, and then I start realizing it's not
that bad I can get. Thankyou. That's so good for everybody listening.
And then I had a prayer theother day too. We just got
will you let me laugh again?And just have some fun And so sometimes
(34:16):
it's just being able to be inthe bed with my girl and the cats
and good time Netflix. Yeah,you know what I'm saying. And just
speaking of Netflix, what's the lastthing that you guys were addicted to?
What what show will get? Well? We went ahead during the pandemic and
started grazing out of mere good workthrough those first six or seven seasons.
(34:37):
Man that I've kind of lost it. We're just doing it now to finish
it and blacklist. Yeah, butyou know what, my girl hates the
show, but I got into it. Yeah, The Crown. I really
got into The Crown. Everyone lovesthat show. Everyone loves having Yeah.
Now, what's the one you're oneyour favorite band or musical artists that if
(34:59):
you're working out and you need thatone last push to get away. Wow,
it's funny because I told you Iwas a chameleon. I didn't start
listening to hip hop again until Icame out to rehab because before that I
was doing the mister Christian thing totrap music, hip hop, you know
all that kind of stuff. LikeI like to work out to that.
Yes, you know what I'm saying. But my favorite band Tool, Oh
(35:21):
there, that's that's what I workout the Tool all the time. I
don't work out to it as muchnow, you know. I go through
these phases because I love them somuch. Like I'll play it out in
my head something that's probably well,you can't. You can't keep working out
to him because you play it outand then I'll come back to it.
Is there songs of fifteen minutes long, and they're like, they're like a
story and if I'm in a musicit's like progressive metal. But but that's
(35:46):
what it's called metal for smart people, you know what I'm saying. Maynard
James Keenan. They're artistic. Yeah, there their lyrics and their storytelling,
it's poetry. The musicianship forty sixand two to me is recovery that song.
And then you know, of coursea couple of other songs Ladder Rallis
(36:08):
and yeah, they're gona go checkthem out. They're on a different level.
It's not just like it's not justlike oh no, no, it's
it's metal, but it's brilliant,it's smart. It's a different level.
Those guys came to this planet totake us to a different level. That's
a guy. I love it.Great call. The last one thing is
(36:29):
if you can go back for twominutes and you kneel down and you face
your third or fourth grade self,what would you tell him? You have
two minutes, I tell him you'regood. People love you, people accept
you. You don't have to worryabout being accepted, right, you can
(36:51):
just be you. Go ahead,just be you and joy with It's okay
that you're sensitive. That's your superpower. You don't have to try to hide
that, you know. Yeah,absolutely, Yeah, thank you baby,
Raphael dude, thank you so much. We got Tony Frost. We have
Jason Marie The America Podcast to KirkSaras a roll call the podcast. Raphael
(37:15):
Man, thank you so much forreally making the truck up here. It's
not an easy truck for those ofyou that don't live in southern California.
He came from Orange County. It'sit's so different world. It's a whole
different travel and he's got to goback. Yeah, that's probably got to
get him out of here. Butdo thank you for coming here, sharing
your story, opening up and givingus your time. I can't be more
(37:37):
grateful. I know these guys enjoywhat you had to tell us, and
we got to hook up. Man, absolutely, you know you, like
you said, you only surround yourselfwith this many people. Hey, I
want some potato chips, I'll justrock out or something like that, exactly
exactly, Well, well we canhave. You know, we'll have some
potato chips, sit down and justtalk. But there's a reason why we
(37:58):
connected, and we're here and we'vewe've built a relationship and we're gonna we'll
grow from here. You're a good, good human being. Hup, thank
you for being here, and goodnight everybody. Thank you guys. Alexa continue music
Ladies and gentlemen, please take yourseats. The show is a bounce to
begin. Yes, you know whereyou're at. This is role called the
(00:24):
podcast and this is the one andonly America's podcaster Kirkus Saris coming at you
as usual. This is Part twowith my guests Raphael Dabulah. If you're
here you heard part one. Thisman is an inspiration and motivation. I
left it on the air for twoweeks before I released part two because we
were getting so many messages, somany emails, people being brought to tears,
(00:47):
people sending the episode to people theyknew that they loved to try to
help them, motivate them, inspirethem, because that's what we do on
the show. We're here to helpyou. We're here to teach you about
what's out there in the world,to give you information, to hear guess
stories from their life so that wemay make this world a better place.
(01:08):
Raphael d'avola was once on the streetsin the gutter. He was once an
auto himself, but through many trialsand tribulations, he found his way out
and now he's trying to help others. Join me and my co host Josan
Murdy Tony Frost. Right now,as we'll go about to take you to
part two, we'll call the podcastRafael Davola. Let's do this. So
(01:34):
I spiral, I like, Idecided yolo. I don't know. Yeah,
anybody can die any moment. Yeah, I'm in an unhappy marriage,
I'm not happy with work and wheremy life is going. I'm just gonna
go do me and I did,and it got bad really really quick,
you know. And this isn't DC, This isn't DC. Yeah yeah.
(01:57):
So then let's tell thank you forsharing that. It's amazing. So let's
tell about what was you testing itearlier? Your daughter found you or your
kids found you. Well, Iwas going through this. It's a lifelong
thing. So I go through thisperiod where I crash. I called my
twin brother at one point he's livingin Tampa at the time. I say,
(02:21):
if I don't get out of DCin the next twenty four hours,
I don't know what's gonna happen.And I was having a suicide idea.
It's just a lot of people inthat position. Oh yeah, yeah.
So I'm just really dealing with depression, anxiety and my addiction and just wanting
to give up. Bills are pilingup and I'm losing control, and so
he flies me down to Tampa andI'm living with him. That goes for
(02:42):
a little bit. I decide I'mgonna try to get back with my family.
I moved back to DC to tryto do the right thing. Lo
and behold, I relapsed over sometime, come back down to Florida,
living with my brother. He's takingcare of my ass. My mother gets
cancer, she dies, and Ijust start I'm just struggling. I'm trying
to do the right thing. ButI'm just struggling, you know. And
(03:07):
finally, for the last time,I fucked up, and my brother's like,
get the fuck out of my house. I don't know where you're gonna
go, but you need to getout of here. Kick me out.
But he didn't. He loved me. So I started, you know,
getting a little bit of help.I got the idea I'm gonna try to
get back with my wife again.Moved back to DC, try to do
that. This time, I wentlike super Christian, super religious to try
(03:29):
to like handle it, and Idid for like three or four years.
But I was testing the water.So this is how sneaky this thing is.
And so during that three or fouryears, I was sober, but
six months I had a little drinkthat was good. So I went another
year and then a smoke a jointand I was good, and I go
a little and before you know it, about four years of doing that,
(03:51):
I'm at the gym and we're kindof telling jokes about coke or something like
that, and i see somebody tapsomebody on the side and I'm like,
oh shit, that's the that's theplug right there. Yeah, and I
was just unhappy enough and uncomfortable.I remember it's about being comfortable, like
some coke would feel good, thatwuld pick me up and off to the
races. And so I'm supposed topick up my daughter from getting their braces
(04:14):
and I'm disappeared for two or threedays or something, and my ex wife
is calling me my brother. I'mjust like, now, I'm when you
realize just so much guilt and shame. I'm really screwed up again. And
I'm thinking I'm just gonna keep gettinghigh until I just maybe i'll overdose or
I don't know, and just Iwon't have enough guts to kill myself.
But yeah, but you didn't wantto feel anymore. I didn't want to
(04:35):
feel. So somehow my ex wifeis driving around DC. They find me,
how old are your kids? Atthis point, I guess ten and
eleven young? Pick me up.My ex wife tells me my twin bets
on his way from Detroit. He'sgonna come get me and picks my ass
(04:56):
up. I'm just in the basementjust you could just feel weight of just
all that self pity, you know, guilt and shame. Takes me back
to Detroit and he's like, well, you want to go to rehab,
and I'm like at that point,I'm like I'll do whatever. Yeah,
Well you want to go to California. I'm like, yeah, whatever.
And so the plan was just forme to come to California for thirty or
forty days, and I did prettymuch convinced I was gonna keep getting high
(05:23):
the rest of my life. Andthen I'm like I just had like I
didn't want to have anything to dowith step work or God. My brothers
like, shut the funk up,get on the plane, you're going,
you know, yeah, But I'msitting in Detox. I'm thirty seven years
old with a suitcase. I'm like, who am I to argue with anybody
about anything? And it just humbledme. I just opened up a little
(05:43):
bit. He talks in California,yeah, wearing California him it. I
don't want to talk shit, butpeople do. I was like, where
am I him? And They're like, you're in the armpit of California.
Yeah, well that's one of them. Yeah, but the center was in
him. But then I'm like,in this beautiful house in Marietta where I
live at Yeah, and so I'mstarting to have a little bit of hope.
(06:08):
Maybe I can actually do this,Maybe I can actually make something out
of my life. But still I'mthinking, I'm just gonna go back and
live with my brother in Detroit whenI'm done with my thirty days. And
then they're like, well, youcan go for another thirty or sixty or
ninety days out by the beach.Your insurance is good for it. So
I did that, and then Isaw a little bit more hope, and
I'm like, well, maybe I'llbecome a personal trainer. I'm in Orange
(06:30):
County. Yeah, I want tobe happy. Let me do that.
And so next thing you know,I'm in treatment for a year, get
certified to be a personal trainer andnot wanting to work in treatment, but
series of events, I started doingthese groups and it just kind of caught
on and perfect segue. So that'sthat's where that's nice, that's where we're
at right now. So now heis and it's like, I can't it's
(06:56):
this, this, this got mein the day. Him and I I
don't know if we texted. Wasa phone caller? Attacks, yeah,
and yet had a long day AndI'm like, and I can only imagine
if you're having to deal with groupafter group after group throughout the day,
these people with all this weight,what it does to accounter's mental and physical
and psyche like, it's got tobe so draining. Well are you are
(07:17):
all you guys actors? Um?No, no, No, Well she
she's many things. I mean,she's well ted talker, author, okay,
spoke her books right here on thetable, okay, Josh okay.
So yeah, some of my guestshave come up, so you know what
(07:38):
it's like to stress about coming upwith content for performance or for speech,
right, yeah, and how muchyou would think about that and then also
to get to the speech and thenthe audience is just kind of right,
and then you know, I alreadydescribed like my diction. A lot of
(07:59):
it has to do with me wantingto feel accepted or whatever. So now
I'm like in this environment, it'slike and they're just looking at you like
and then you're trying to find away to get accepted this group. So
I'm like, you know, doingmy like cap Dan, trying to like
pull something. Come on, talkto me, talk to you know what
I'm saying. And so I dothat, but I do that six or
seven times a day. You knowwhat I'm saying, Monday, do Friday,
(08:22):
and then you got to go anddo something. But then you all
still gotta hear there do they getto talk and they shared. That's gotta
be draining hearing all these different storiesand the stories are crazy, because go
ahead. My question is how doyou deal? How do you deal?
(08:43):
Let's do that? How do youdeal with that? Like what is your
well? I can't get high right, So a lot of people do.
Like the relapse rate for people whowork in treatment really oh yeah, because
talking about you're just immersed in sicknessand these you know, yeah, And
(09:05):
so I wish there was something likewhen I talked to my clientses, we're
t I wish there was some magicpill or formula, but we don't get
to use that magic pill anymore.Yeah, it's yoga, it's working out.
You have yeah, outlet I haveto or otherwise. I mean the
anxiety that when I really started doingthis full time because it was a process.
(09:31):
Yeah, um, but the anxietyI started the experience, Oh my
god. So just to be ableto cope, Yeah, I started doing
breathing techniques. Yeah, like youhear about Joe Rogan wim Hof nice man.
I looked that up and then andso then a lot of my groups
or stuff that I'm actually using formyself just to help them out. Like
(09:54):
I was talking about the adult attachmenttheory. Yeah, and so that like
is really like a big part ofrelapse for a lot of attics's relationships.
Yeah, you know, the anxietyin relationships, that feeling of like,
if it's not anxiety, that beingavoided and shut off, emotionally cold and
(10:15):
failed relationship after relationship that'll send somebodyfor a fucking drink. You know,
my life failed, off to fail, left to fail parties, bro,
They've never even been married. FailedAnd it always it always sends me to
the drink. The real trip iswhen it's second, third, fourth person,
but it's the same person. Sothe pattern goes because you have to
(10:41):
you have to overcome something before itpasses on. Otherwise it just keeps showing
up in absolutely, absolutely, butthat worked to overcome that. WHOA Well.
Now, on a different level,do you build like really type personal
relationships with some of these people thatyou work with? Um, do you
get close to them or do youkeep an arms length or a wall up?
(11:03):
You keep a arms left from client? Yeah, the people that you
work with. I mean it's sucha mix. It's crazy. Because I
have a story real briefly and thereason why I'm glad you asked that question
because I remember an amazing pastor whoovercame heroin for twenty years. Hum.
(11:26):
I mean, God just used himmightily in just people's lives, even to
help them overcome at some level.And he started traveling. He started just
going a lot of different places,you know, to preach and teach,
and his schedule just became really packed. And then he had a facility where
(11:46):
he would invite people who were homeless, whether they're alcoholic, drug addicts or
not. But just homeless and tohelp them get their lives back together.
And he invited two people, acouple who was heron addicted, to try
to help them. Long story short, those two people became his downfall.
(12:07):
By helping them, they started usingheroin, and I guess he got to
a stress level and the temptation camein and now these two people were running
to get him. The drag tookhim down. This is why THEE is
(12:28):
here and why instantly I knew whenI heard what you do, I admired
them. Man like that is you'reone of those people in this world,
like the mother Teresa level. Imean, I know there's no no seriously,
because you're giving so much of yourselfon a daily basis to try to
help people. Well, let mekeep it real. There's a lot of
(12:50):
people. There's a lot of peoplehelping and they're doing it for free.
I get paid, yeah, butI'm not that much a Mother Teresa.
You know what I'm saying. Butpeople who just do this just in order
for them to say sober and tohelp out right. So, but I
think deep down inside I could tellyou you as a person, Yeah,
you're getting paid, but you seemany type of persons still wants to help.
(13:11):
I want to have a reward inlife. Yeah, I want to
have purpose. Also, I feellike I don't think I'm being cocky by
saying this. I feel like Ihave some natural talent and ability that applies
directly with what I do. Yes, now you ask me, do I
get very close? No, Likewhen you're in counseling and stuff like,
(13:31):
you have to keep separation because it'san ethics issue. You know, with
clients for sure, but then sometimesclients become staff, they start working at
the places you get to know themwhatnot. Honestly, my life is so
busy. I'm doing probably twenty fourto twenty five groups a week, which
I didn't realize this, and myanxiety was so crazy. But when therapists
(13:52):
here that, they're like what,so what My question is, then,
what advice would you give someone whowas in similar situation like yourself or even
not, who overcame any form ofaddiction that distance as you talk about,
like, what advice would you give? Because I think that's very important to
(14:13):
the recovery process and to maintain thatsuch a because at the same time that
recovery, I feel like it's connectionand addiction is disconnection. You're trying to
stay plugged in and connected to something, whether it's helping other alcoholics and addicts
and whatever way that looks like,or whether it's church, or maybe it's
(14:37):
in the yoga or like, you'retrying to stay plugged into other human beings.
Yeah, and you're trying to figureout ways to deal with life and
the stress of life. And Ikeep talking about that discomfort of just dealing
with life without a substance. Yeah, no, different than anybody else.
(14:58):
But it's just I can't the substancemakes it easy, because life is hard
for everybody. And I can saythat single. I mean Tony and I.
He's we lived together, He's myroommate, and all twenty twenty was
rough. We would wake up everymorning and meet in the kitchen and be
like, what's I mean? Halfthe time we pop a drink in the
(15:20):
morning during twenty twenty. And that'sthe thing is is like, do you
go to the substance? Even thestrongest person or the normies, no one
is immune to like having to findyea, we as human beings need things
to not feel, to numb,to cover it up, to to to
(15:43):
ignore something. No one's immune tothat, So that that's that's what's admirable,
is that you're forget to pay andforget that it's a job you are.
You're a servant to these people.Your energy, I know, I
know how that is. I'm likea spiritual flavor flavor flavor flav And you,
(16:07):
well you said earlier, you said, I don't want to meet a
cocky but no, I agree withthat. You're very charismatic. You know
how to talk, You have agreat energy, you know how to hold
court in the room. You youwere engaging. You look some people in
the eye. See, that's whatI loved about you was when we first
met, because when I meet aman, there's a certain thing as a
guy that to me is admirable.And you have all those qualities. Confident,
(16:32):
But you weren't too cocky. Cockyis fine. You weren't too cocky,
you weren't too egotistical. You lookedme in the eye. We connected,
you shook my hand, We hada conversation. Addicts people with overblown
ego simultaneously with a like huge inferiority. They're both fighting each other. I
(16:56):
just wanted to tell you too,Kurt, like, because you asked me,
like, do I get close withanybody? The truth is I'm so
busy. Yeah, there's my fianceand me at work, and when I
can, I get away and seemy kids. You know what I'm saying.
Yeah, But I have a lotof acquaintances. I have very few,
like close close friends. But whenI met you, I was like,
Yo, this is a cool guythat met Tony. We didn't talk
(17:18):
that much that night, you know, it was night, but I was
like, you know, this isa cool group of men that like it'd
be cool to like connect with,you know what I'm saying. And your
fiance is amazing. Now you guyshave been together at how long? Let's
see two years and some chance soand and this is one thing I wanted
to say was you would not havemet her if you wouldn't have gone down
(17:40):
the path of recovery. And she'sso amazing. I met her and she
met me. She seems like you'reI watched. I was very observant.
She seems like you're rock like sheshe's strong, she's very stoic. Yeah,
she's very um, laid back.Yeah, doesn't get flu Yeah.
(18:00):
Where I am like, I stayin the world sometimes just her touch.
You needed that in your life.I mean like she was sent to you,
like that was the final thing youneeded. It's crazy. First day
she I was still riding a bicycleeverywhere. They didn't have a car yet.
It was a candid I was clippedin, but it was still a
(18:25):
bag. She was just tired ofgetting screwed over by dudes in Orange County
and stuff, and so she gaveme a shot, you know. And
at the time, I was Ithink maybe I postponed our first date because
I was like, I gotta waittill paid it because I got like ten
dollars in my bank account right now, you know. But we just kind
of kept going and she believed inme, and she's watched you know,
this process, you know, nomeans of our route, Like I'm still
(18:48):
trying to figure this shit out,you know. But but you but she
how she's helping you. She's thatthat I saw that You guys have a
good I'm sure you give her towhat she needs as well. Yeah,
I like to be got like softenher up a little bit because she's tough
sometimes, you know what I mean. I missed her heart and passion and
you know, I got it's apretty good You know, this is why
(19:11):
you're good at what you do though, because you have passion and love and
you've got a light you have andthat is, whether you know it or
not, you're out there helping thesepeople. And I don't wish like I
when I go in, like I'mabout to go later on and do a
couple more groups. And like Isaid, sometimes like they're sitting there,
(19:33):
it's like, am I talking toa wall right now? Like it like
is that drool coming down their mouthright now? You know? But I'm
just hoping that somebody something up.Yeah, but you gotta remember the first
time you went to rehab or somethingwhere you the guy with the drool and
just sitting there like kind of likewe'll see. I was thirty seven,
(19:53):
Yeah, you're a little older,and I was like, I don't know
how many more shots I got atthis. So I was trying. I
was trying to pay attention. Youknow, I was woke up. But
I can think about pastimes where Iwas trying to like get a grip and
things. People told me that atthe moment I wasn't ready to hear.
But it wasn't until later down theroad, I was ready to receive and
(20:14):
so I'm just hoping I'm planning somesiege. So then let's talk about that,
because you said you're thirty seven nowyeah, forty two now, well,
I mean when you started. Somy final one of my I'm ending
with, like the statistical cause ofaddiction. Now, in your opinion,
what's one of the greatest factors andmost common reasons people qui people fall?
(20:34):
Like your opinion? Now, thisis this is actually just from you dealing
with it and being around it.What do you see is the biggest factor
that connection life, connection to lifeto something bigger so you three or something
bigger than just me? Yeah,right, that camaraderie, you have that
(20:57):
belief in the idea of come.You know, you know what I'm saying.
Whatever that thing is that makes youin uh shit, Tony and Josan
Madi and Joseanne, whatever it makesa laws you gouts survived, that's something
bigger than just me. And soover time, if I lose connection with
(21:17):
that whatever that is, they mightbe Buddha or Jesus or Muhammad or Shivah
or I mean, I don't knowwhatever it is. But when you lose
connection with that then when life startsencroaching on you so much that you can't
get keep that connection. And doyou night are you seeing it with the
younger generation now? More and moreis it happening to younger people than it
(21:41):
used to be? But like thedemographic is there like an age and gender,
it's definitely young. I mean theamount of like the hell that some
of the eighteen year old in thenineteen year olds go. I mean,
you guys, you know you livein LA I have a questions. We'll
have two questions. And one ofmy questions because you talk about your kids
(22:03):
and I think you know obviously kidssee and they learn from parents, right
like how so my first question ishow does someone how do you explain to
your kids at a young age oreven now at the age that they are
the things that has happened. Wherehow do you explain that to me?
(22:26):
Well, when my kids were tenand eleven, I was first coming to
rehab, I I just said,daddy's sick and he needs to get some
help. So daddy is sick andhe's gonna stay out here for a little
bit longer while he gets better.And that's how I explained it. You
know. Now my kids are sixteenand fifteen, about to be seventeen,
and it's like, I can justkeep it real, you know, yeah
(22:49):
I can. I told my daughterthis is crash though, but I was
like, baby, pussy makes theworld go around. You got something very
special protected. It's powerful, youknow what I mean? Like I just
I could talk to my kids now, you know. So it's like,
look like sixteen and fifteen. Okay, So it's like, look like your
(23:11):
dad and your dad's mom and dadstruggle with substances and you need to be
careful. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, just watch out. I'm
not telling you what to do.Yeah, all right, but you know,
so we can just talk about it, you know. Yeah. The
reason I asked you about what youthink the demographic is because there are actual
statistics. And sometimes I don't believein science when it comes to stuff like
(23:34):
this. Science has its place inlike some areas, but when it comes
to mental I think that a lotof its subjective, Like for example,
they say a lot of it comesfrom genetics. Like so when we were
talking about earlier, there's the normansand the not so the normans don't have
the gene. That's like you knowsaying there's a twenty twenty one. We
(23:56):
know a lot more about addiction andthe causes of addiction. And there is
something too. I think the ideathat genetically there's something different that predisposes somebody
to handle things differently and it'd bemore prone to some type of addiction.
(24:17):
I think there's something there. Ithink there's people like godbor mate who really
understand now because we are understand alot more about trauma than we did,
yes three nine to eleven true,so that trauma plays a lot bigger role
into addiction than we've given it credit. And so there's it makes But the
(24:37):
truth is even today we really don'tknow. Thank you. And that's what
I'm saying. It's like because theysay, like I honestly, are they
gonna find they say, well,soon says this gene, they're forty to
sixty percent more liable to fall toan addiction. I mean, really,
they're gonna say, you have thegene. You don't you do you don't
that? I don't know? Thatto me doesn't doesn't translate well to me,
(24:57):
do you think to some level becausewe see patterns of generational things,
right, so we see patterns ofgenerational trauma, right, So addiction can
be passed down to your well,for instance, my twin brother, he
didn't struggle, doesn't and that's justcrazy with twins too. You think that
(25:18):
you both have the same genes,so you could probably find you know,
nowadays you can find facts and statistics. Yeah, back up whatever argument you
want. Yeah, but um,I think it's a blend into something.
Yes, you know, I wouldtell my kids to watch out, so
be careful. So so thank you. That's what I was gonna ask you.
(25:38):
So what would you tell if athis is this is I'm going to
close it up right now. Ifone of your kids came up to you
right now and said, Dad,I trust you and I feel like i'm
talking to you about this, andthey're right at that age too. I'm
struggling right now. It's it's I'mfeeling I'm in a dark place. I'm
(26:00):
happy. I started doing a lotof this and this and this. I
don't know what to do. I'mhere for you. I know what you're
going through. I've been there andI can help. Yeah, and when
you're ready, I'm here. Yeah, you know, I'm not gonna try
to force anything on you. Butwhen you're ready, I'm here. You
(26:21):
give them that open door. Right, you can't force, but you let
them know. Sponsor one time,tell me though, because I was talking
to a friend and really wanted tohelp him. Yeah, but he wasn't
ready and he said, pray thatGod destroys him but spares his life.
Jesus. Yeah, no pun intended, but Jesus. Sometimes that's what we're
(26:44):
dealing with. So even let's sayit's not like type of thing, right,
guess, but it's just more like, unfortunately for most of us,
pain is what allows me to openup to some people. Yeah, and
it's until I experience enough pain andhurt that is true. Yeah, you
know what I'm saying. And solike, let's let's flip it a little
(27:07):
bit. Let's say my kids,I'm seeing things, but they haven't said
anything to me. I might havea kind of saying, hey, listen,
I'm seeing some stuff that I've beenthere and it concerns me. And
when you're ready, if you shouldever be ready, I'm here for you.
And then I gotta let that.Absolutely. That gets into codependency and
all kinds of other stuff. Whereit's like, I can't be captain save
(27:30):
a hole for everybody, do youknow what I'm saying? And sometimes that's
like I gotta let you, Igotta I can't steal your bottom. That's
the true All we can do whenwe're helping is open the door and say
hey, that's what he is.There anything else that you want to just
questions? Okay, Well, oneof the things you said right now about
(27:52):
the captain save you know, isI think a lot of times people we've
gone hurt. Yeah, a lotof times when you've gone through extreme trauma
in any situation in life, whetherit's drug, whether it's abused alcohol,
(28:15):
whatever, a heartbreak, what happensis a lot of times you end up
being because you know that you havethe empathy of what you've been through,
you become you fall into this placeof savior and sometimes that can go too
much where you start to really backfireson you. Why you start to really
(28:36):
hurt your own self in the processof trying to save somebody else. So
I think it's, you know,going back to what you said, it's
important to find the healthy balance ofnot creating codependency and not fall into therapists
talk about creating a force feel youcan choose that certain people to come in
(28:57):
and you can choose when you know. I don't know why I'm thinking about
jar Jar binks. Do you knowit's I love Star Wars so much,
but ice Field my instant thing.I thought Star Wars, Yeah, and
then you said jar Jar like,but I have to keep totally. But
(29:21):
the last my question that I wantedto ask is at what point do you
know someone has recovered? H Imean time, but I don't know.
You talked about that light in somebody'seyes, and just as easily as somebody
(29:41):
has recovered, there's a debate inthe community talks about do people ever fully
recover or right or you are inthe process of being recovered. It's like
the difference between being saved or amI being saved or whatever? It's whatever.
But you talked about that light andsometimes that like can come on,
and sometimes I can see people thatare losing that light, you know what
(30:02):
I'm saying. And to me,it's just about like I said before,
connection, Yes, if somebody connectedto something right, and are they staying
connected? And then yeah, andare you not getting the rested or getting
there's so many forty plus people ofrolling around on bikes that I see when
(30:25):
I drive, and I'm like,you must be a recovery. You must
have too many d us. Youcan't God blessing. That was me.
Really, I'd be on there pumpingit, you know what I mean?
Hey, but you know what thatwas sometimes that was some of the best
time in my life. Like sometimesnow, like Biggie said, more money,
more problems. Yeah, like lifeis so much better than it was
(30:47):
five years ago, four and ahalf years ago, three and a half
years ago. But sometimes I misseda simplicity. Life was whatever started simple
and silver rated. We try,we always want more and more and more
and more more than when we getit. We're like you knows, so
grateful for my botty yah because itlike it gives me something, Yeah,
(31:08):
a lot more ahead. They can'tstop. I do like I wanted just
to keep it on on like acomedy or or bring it back to something
more fun. Talk about you showedup to the nines mostly because, like
you said, you put a haton right, it looks great. That's
a that's a hot, that's asexy. So the question is are you
(31:33):
balding or did you just shave yourhead? He just shaved like like that
forehead is very very like way backthere. That's funny. When I first
came out here, I guess Iwas trying to still be young. I
don't know. I had like afoe hawk. It looked like the poop
(31:56):
emoji. Yeah, but I couldn'thave full mohawk because ain't shit working back
here in this little bag. Iguess like in the last year or so,
I was like, I could justI could graduate from ball caps,
like, well, this is thething, well is you have here like
some people like you can't see it. The thing is like when people start
(32:19):
seeing your hair grow in or theylike, oh shit, he's not really
bald, and then they treat youdifferent. I'll say this, I definitely
h I definitely uh have had toum. I wore his hat like because
it's kind of like my alter ego, you know what I'm saying. Yeah,
(32:43):
I was a little nervous about comingand do you oh he did.
I didn't think. I thought,I don't remember that since I met you
where, I was like, youknow, I could step my game.
I can rocket for door here andwhatever. That's that's the look. You.
I went out one time, soI'm gonna treat me and my girl
doesn't really like this happen, butyou know it beautiful, so let's let's
(33:09):
let's close it out there. SoI'm want to ask you what are what
is if you're having the hardest day, stressful, everything's happening. Instead of
going to the old go tos,what's the first thing you're going to,
whether it's yoga, a workout,what's the first what's your breath? You're
breathing, the breathing, full breathing. That's the easiest and most successible thing
(33:32):
in the moment to help people withthat. Isn't there like a certain pattern,
Like there's different ones. There's differentones, but like you didn't get
on Google start playing around, Yeah, I I as well do the same
thing. So that breath, feeling, that oxygen, that deep breath and
it's a real that's science. Feelingthat breath come into my stomach allows me
(33:54):
and it's subtle sometimes you know whatI mean, But it allows me to
start using like more of the likecognit him abilities and to get out of
that fight or flight mode. Yes, and then I start realizing it's not
that bad I can get. Thankyou. That's so good for everybody listening.
And then I had a prayer theother day too. We just got
will you let me laugh again?And just have some fun And so sometimes
(34:16):
it's just being able to be inthe bed with my girl and the cats
and good time Netflix. Yeah,you know what I'm saying. And just
speaking of Netflix, what's the lastthing that you guys were addicted to?
What what show will get? Well? We went ahead during the pandemic and
started grazing out of mere good workthrough those first six or seven seasons.
(34:37):
Man that I've kind of lost it. We're just doing it now to finish
it and blacklist. Yeah, butyou know what, my girl hates the
show, but I got into it. Yeah, The Crown. I really
got into The Crown. Everyone lovesthat show. Everyone loves having Yeah.
Now, what's the one you're oneyour favorite band or musical artists that if
(34:59):
you're working out and you need thatone last push to get away. Wow,
it's funny because I told you Iwas a chameleon. I didn't start
listening to hip hop again until Icame out to rehab because before that I
was doing the mister Christian thing totrap music, hip hop, you know
all that kind of stuff. LikeI like to work out to that.
Yes, you know what I'm saying. But my favorite band Tool, Oh
(35:21):
there, that's that's what I workout the Tool all the time. I
don't work out to it as muchnow, you know. I go through
these phases because I love them somuch. Like I'll play it out in
my head something that's probably well,you can't. You can't keep working out
to him because you play it outand then I'll come back to it.
Is there songs of fifteen minutes long, and they're like, they're like a
story and if I'm in a musicit's like progressive metal. But but that's
(35:46):
what it's called metal for smart people, you know what I'm saying. Maynard
James Keenan. They're artistic. Yeah, there their lyrics and their storytelling,
it's poetry. The musicianship forty sixand two to me is recovery that song.
And then you know, of coursea couple of other songs Ladder Rallis
(36:08):
and yeah, they're gona go checkthem out. They're on a different level.
It's not just like it's not justlike oh no, no, it's
it's metal, but it's brilliant,it's smart. It's a different level.
Those guys came to this planet totake us to a different level. That's
a guy. I love it.Great call. The last one thing is
(36:29):
if you can go back for twominutes and you kneel down and you face
your third or fourth grade self,what would you tell him? You have
two minutes, I tell him you'regood. People love you, people accept
you. You don't have to worryabout being accepted, right, you can
(36:51):
just be you. Go ahead,just be you and joy with It's okay
that you're sensitive. That's your superpower. You don't have to try to hide
that, you know. Yeah,absolutely, Yeah, thank you baby,
Raphael dude, thank you so much. We got Tony Frost. We have
Jason Marie The America Podcast to KirkSaras a roll call the podcast. Raphael
(37:15):
Man, thank you so much forreally making the truck up here. It's
not an easy truck for those ofyou that don't live in southern California.
He came from Orange County. It'sit's so different world. It's a whole
different travel and he's got to goback. Yeah, that's probably got to
get him out of here. Butdo thank you for coming here, sharing
your story, opening up and givingus your time. I can't be more
(37:37):
grateful. I know these guys enjoywhat you had to tell us, and
we got to hook up. Man, absolutely, you know you, like
you said, you only surround yourselfwith this many people. Hey, I
want some potato chips, I'll justrock out or something like that, exactly
exactly, Well, well we canhave. You know, we'll have some
potato chips, sit down and justtalk. But there's a reason why we
(37:58):
connected, and we're here and we'vewe've built a relationship and we're gonna we'll
grow from here. You're a good, good human being. Hup, thank
you for being here, and goodnight everybody. Thank you guys. Alexa continue music
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