March 25, 2025 • 63 mins
Devonnie and Christina chat with author N. Caceres. Hear all about her latest release, A Debt of Shattered Hope. A dark fantasy romance where the fae are depraved and the female main character can't keep her mouth shut to save her life. Learn all about Caceres's experience writing erotic horror, hear her latest romance recommendations, and all the awe-inspiring future projects yet to come.
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Episode Transcript
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Christina (00:00):
Welcome to Romance Recs.
(00:01):
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Hi guys, I'm Christina and I amcurrently reading Boyfriend
(00:23):
Material by Alexis Hall.
Devonnie (00:24):
Hey guys, it's Dev and I am currently reading an arc of
Left of Forever by Tara DeWitt.
N. Caceres (00:30):
Hi, I'm Anne Caceres.
I am currently rereading one ofmy favorites, which is Black
Sunshine by Karina Halle.
Bye!
Devonnie (00:48):
tell us everything.
So we've got a new book comingout in a little bit.
Tell us what that is and howeverything's going.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (01:01):
those super fans might sound familiar, um, I am
really a little anal intentiveand I decided that instead of
having to pick my publishingdate every year or every book,
that I would publish on the sameday every year all the time.
So every year on March 28th, Iwill put out a full length book.
The first time was ObsidianFeathers, and this time is A
(01:23):
Debt of Shattered Hope.
And A Debt of Shattered Hope is,it's my response to Irish Fae.
Um, it's based very loosely onit.
Because I put in a, pretty muchall Celtic Fae, like the basic
of what Fae are.
Fae were never supposed to bebutterfly winged sweethearts.
(01:45):
They were literally thenightmare demons of Irish
culture and of Gaelic culture.
And some of them were nice ish.
And some of them had nice times.
But most of them were nightmarecreatures, and I feel like we as
fair fairy fuckers haveforgotten that.
(02:06):
Huh.
I feel like we needed to bringthat back.
Christina (02:09):
I love that.
Devonnie (02:10):
Yeah.
And you've definitely done that.
I we were just talking earlierabout how these are not the
cutesy Fae.
Like the Fae in this story arenot the ones you want to like,
Oh, romance.
Like they're very much givingnightmare.
And I was so excited.
I actually forgot to have us doquotes.
So we are going to go back intosome quotes before we dig deep
into the Fae that you'veintroduced.
(02:31):
Well, I think I like thisversion of Fae.
I'm not going to lie.
I really do.
But yeah, so quotes.
I actually have a quote I wantto share that is from your book.
Yeah, a shadow of hope.
So it is in chapter 20 where theBandrewi, is that how I
pronounce that?
The Bandrewi is.
Yeah it's about the Bandrewie,but it says even when tearing
(02:55):
someone to shreds, the Bandrewiewas a sight to behold.
She grew more honeyed, the morepoison she poured upon another.
I feel like this alters me on adeep level because that is the
type of petty I aspire to be.
So petty.
So like scathing that all yousee is a smile and a honeyed
(03:20):
voice where I'm like reading youfor film.
So when I read that, I was like,yes, cheers.
I love that for her.
But that's what, and to be fair,this entire book is super
highlightable.
Like I'm highlighting so manythings, but that's just one I
wanted to share
N. Caceres (03:36):
in peace, your highlighter, because it's a long
look.
I actually got that from me atwork.
So, I work in corporate.
I do high corporate and some ofthe things that high corporate
people will do will piss youright the fuck off to the bone.
But you can't do anything aboutit.
So the nicer I get at work, andlike all of my teammates know
(03:59):
this, the nicer I get, the moreI want to just absolutely
eviscerate the person.
And I was like, I need this tobe in a fae, because it is so
fae of me to just be like,Alright.
Yeah, you know what?
I can absolutely do that foryou.
I know that I sent over thisdocument like four times
already, but give me one second.
(04:20):
Let me link it for you.
I can absolutely do that foryou.
It's in the SharePoint, and iffor some reason you can't find
it on the SharePoint, let meknow.
Maybe you have an access issue.
Yes,
Devonnie (04:34):
email.
Yeah, I love that, like, veryaggressive, but sweet,
N. Caceres (04:41):
sweet.
So they can't ever say she wasbeing unprofessional.
Was she though?
Because that was a recorded calland she just sounds really nice
here.
Devonnie (04:49):
yeah, so sweet.
So concerned about your accessand the receipt of this email
and this document.
N. Caceres (04:58):
That's why I had to put it into somebody.
Devonnie (05:00):
Yeah.
And it was great.
And I love it in this characterspecifically.
I think it's necessary,necessary and it makes sense for
her role.
Christina (05:07):
I love that.
Okay, so I have a quote.
It is actually from a book Ihave not read yet, which is
crazy, but I saw this quote, Isaw this quote on TikTok and it
moved this book right on up myTBR.
Okay, it's a short one, but Ilove it.
It's from Blood of Hercules byJasmine Maas.
It says, A man was speaking, soI stopped listening.
(05:29):
That's all I need, period, rightthere.
Devonnie (05:32):
That, that'll do it for me as well.
Yes.
I too would like to read thisbook now.
I see why you were roped intoit.
N. Caceres (05:39):
Can I get, can I get that delivered to me?
Because that'll take time,
Devonnie (05:43):
Yeah.
Christina (05:44):
Needed on a shirt, needed on a shirt, not
N. Caceres (05:46):
need it on a shirt, I need it on
Devonnie (05:49):
I love that.
I didn't know what quote youwere going to read.
I was like, okay, because whenyou told me it was from a book
you haven't read, I was like,all right, let's hear what this
is going to be, but yeah, I seewhy we've moved that book up.
Thank you so much.
Love that.
Love that for us.
N. Caceres (05:59):
top of the list,
Devonnie (06:00):
Yes,
N. Caceres (06:01):
the correct reaction.
So the quote that I have is fromMarx, Tupac, and my book.
It was originally quoted, or atleast as far as we know, quoted
from Marx in one of hisspeeches, and then Tupac put it
into a rap, which is where Ifirst heard it, and it is
perfect for this book.
And that quote is, I havenothing left to lose but my
(06:23):
chains.
Devonnie (06:25):
Yeah, I feel like that one is super self explanatory as
well.
And the fact that it like justtraveled across time because
mark the marks to book pipelinewith Tupac in the middle, it's
yeah, it's, it is actually alittle diabolical, but it's
also, if you read the story, itis so perfect.
Christina (06:46):
Perfect.
Devonnie (06:47):
That's what we want.
And for Tupac.
Yeah.
I love that for him as well.
Like
N. Caceres (06:52):
I love when I grew up with Tupac and I remember
being absolutely, utterlydevastated when I found out
about him.
Like I wasn't a big fan of musicat the time.
I was like, I don't know, maybe12 or 13 when that happened.
And I just remember thinkingwhat do you mean?
(07:13):
What do you mean?
That is not a thing.
That is a dirty lie.
Devonnie (07:18):
And he's so poetic.
N. Caceres (07:20):
so, to me, I have not found a rapper or any even
musical artist, really, who isas poetic, intelligent, and
observant and introspective asTupac was.
And I feel like that was a hugeloss for the industry.
Christina (07:41):
Yeah, still as important now as he was 30 years
ago.
Devonnie (07:44):
Exactly.
Exactly.
And I, like it would be so coolto see.
What music would sound like ifhe was still alive today you
know, just what, just thecommentary and the observations
of what's going on in the worldin our songs and stuff.
So I agree.
I do.
I do agree with that.
I would love to have Tupac herewith us.
And yeah, that was terrifying.
(08:05):
I mean, I wasn't, I was likestill pretty young when
everything happened, butdefinitely old enough to know
something's wrong.
N. Caceres (08:15):
It blew my brain that a celebrity could die.
I don't know why, but in myyoung mind, I was like, what do
you mean?
Celebrities don't die.
They just go away.
They go off to a celebrity farmor something.
I don't
Devonnie (08:28):
Yeah, they retire.
They don't die.
N. Caceres (08:31):
don't die.
It's
Devonnie (08:38):
you just had a bunch of celebrities like just
Christina (08:41):
With some goats.
Devonnie (08:42):
Yeah, with the goats.
Oh, the goats.
Do you see what I'm saying?
The goats, the celebrity goats.
Greatest of all time.
Okay.
All right.
Moving right along because we'rehere to talk about A Deadest
Shattered Hope.
Yeah.
So again, we talked about theFae and just how not crazy, but
just mean.
They are mean in this book.
Okay.
(09:03):
Some of them, not everyone, butsome.
It's like dark and they're supermean and I'm like super
interested in what inspired theidea for this story, this world.
Did it all come to you at once?
You're like, yep, I have itthere.
I'm going to follow thistradition and mythology and go
that route.
Or was it like piece by piece?
N. Caceres (09:22):
Hey, you want to hear the most hilarious thing
ever?
Christina (09:25):
Yes.
N. Caceres (09:26):
Nobody but my writing circle knows this.
Devonnie (09:29):
okay.
Christina (09:29):
Ooh.
N. Caceres (09:29):
So this book was called, like the WIP title was
Forkin Balls.
Forever.
Because Everybody just starteddying.
Because I built the entireworld, the entire story, and
(09:52):
everything around that Fork inthe Balls scene.
That scene came to me first, andI built the entire world around
it.
Christina (10:02):
I absolutely love that.
And he deserved it.
N. Caceres (10:07):
emotionally shattered.
Devonnie (10:08):
That is so funny.
You wrote one scene and then yousaid, yeah, build the
Christina (10:15):
with it.
Yep.
N. Caceres (10:16):
How do I get How do I get to here?
Devonnie (10:22):
No, that is actually so interesting.
I find that to be so interestingbecause sometimes you hear there
are a lot of authors who likeplot the entire thing and they
will not write a drop or writeanything until they have an
entire story basically plottedout.
But here you wrote this scene.
And then an entire world?
N. Caceres (10:41):
didn't actually write it.
I wrote it in my head.
Devonnie (10:44):
Okay, so you saw the scene.
N. Caceres (10:46):
I saw the scene in my head and I was like, okay,
how do I get to here?
And then I started plotting,like after it, went and
marinated in my head for sixmonths to like, okay, how do I
get here?
Then I went and sat down and Iplotted it all out.
And I do what's called like aliving plot.
Living plot structure.
(11:07):
So basically I'll ploteverything out in like numbers
and then I will just write andtry to hit each one of those
plot points as I'm writing.
And then for instance, this bookoriginally was only plotted for
20 chapters.
That was only 20 beats that Iwanted to hit.
But it's 50 something chaptersbecause you know when you
actually write and break it outinto chapters after you write
(11:31):
Then those chapters becomebigger.
But yeah, it was all It allstarted because I wanted to
figure out how I got to a forkin the balls And everybody
Devonnie (11:47):
That's actually so amazing.
N. Caceres (11:49):
who I've told about that scene is like, How the fuck
did you get there?
And I'm like, listen, it makessense.
It makes sense.
When you get there, it
Devonnie (12:00):
fair, yeah, I can imagine.
Also, you you didn't Okay, forme, I hear Fork and Balls, and
then I'm thinking, okay, is thisfor Play?
Is this a comedy here?
What, how did we get into, firstwe're in Detroit, now we're in
the land of the fat, you know?
I'm just like driving the carlike, huh, This street does not
(12:24):
make any sense, but yeah, veryscenic clearly.
But yeah I love that.
I kind of love that idea ofhaving this one image and then
deciding to build an entireworld that's super rich.
Like this world is super richfor it to have stemmed from this
one little
N. Caceres (12:46):
And it's a scene that is unexpected in a romance
novel, I think.
I think it's pretty unexpectedfor the female main character to
stab the love interest in histesticles with a lunch fork.
Christina (13:04):
Well, when it's this main character, I love her.
And that's my next question,because we're talking about our
cricket.
She's such a spectacularcharacter.
Is she based off anyone in yourlife, or did you kind of just
dream her up, or where did shecome from?
N. Caceres (13:19):
Cricket is a combination of things.
So, I, the way I createcharacters, Whether it be a main
character or a side character ora villain is I take a Small
little nugget a small littlebead of myself and I build that
(13:40):
out into a character and I thinkokay Here is their core.
Here's a little bead.
I've pulled off of myself Here'stheir core build a fully fleshed
out creature Around this if thisis their core What additional
character attributes, whatadditional thought processes,
moral codes do they have thatfeed this core?
(14:03):
So for me, I mean, I grew updirt poor and I grew up around a
lot of people who have a lot ofpoverty trauma.
And I took that poverty traumaand was like, okay.
Here you go.
Now what does that how do I feedthis into a fully fleshed out
character?
(14:24):
And I noticed that a lot ofpeople that I know that stayed
in That same sphere never hadthe ability to or luck or
privilege of breaking out ofpoverty are very bitter about
it.
I'm very hateful about it.
And some of them, not all ofthem, but some of them are very
bitter about it and I built thatbitterness into her that hate
(14:46):
that guardedness, especiallypeople that grew up in the
foster system.
You know, I worked before mycurrent corporate job, I worked
in a non profit and one of theprojects I worked on was
assisting the California fostersystem in aging out programs.
So, I got to interview a lot ofpeople who grew up in the foster
(15:07):
system and a lot of people whoaged out and the bitterness that
comes when you hit 18 andrealize, There is nothing there.
Nothing.
There is no safety net.
There is no one that, that, youknow, if unless your foster
parents want to, there is nosafety net.
There is no love.
(15:28):
There is nothing.
It is just a cold, hard cut.
And a lot of the fosters that Iinterviewed for that project
that I was working on, they gothrough this.
This period in the five yearspost aging out, of really deep
(15:48):
hatred for everyone.
Everyone.
And Cricket never grew out ofthat.
A lot of them do, but Cricketnever did.
Huh.
Devonnie (16:01):
And also I'm not, I'm kind of, I'm not mad at her that
she has that around her becausebabe, life has lifed you very
hard.
So I understand why yourdefenses are all are always up.
I understand why you have allthese rules, which by the way,
her rules are like my favoritethings.
Every time a new rule popped up,I would like highlight, this
yeah, I'm gonna add this to thecollection.
(16:23):
So I love that she has that likeShe has nothing, has no real
ties.
And so she created these rulesto kind of ground herself,
ground her personality, ground,or this is my moral code.
These are the things that I donot compromise about myself.
And I love that.
And yeah, I mean, yeah, justhearing that the Like that bead,
like you said, that you startedher with to kind of direct her
(16:44):
it, you did it.
Cause cricket is like a reallylove.
Yeah.
She's a super lovable character.
Even with all the trauma sheclearly carries around like
that.
I don't know.
There's just something reallyrefreshing about seeing like
you.
You aren't, you don't have to bethe things that happen to you.
You can carry them, they candefine the way you move through
life.
(17:05):
But she still shows upunabashedly herself.
I mean, sometimes do I wish shewould zip them lips?
Absolutely, girl! You are notextending your life expectancy
when you open your mouth somuch! So, I wish that tongue
lock was working, because itwasn't.
N. Caceres (17:22):
times when
Devonnie (17:24):
the I was like, oh my Can somebody fix the magic with
her tongue?
Why does she keep talking?
But still, even that.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (17:33):
her, and there's, because I'm working on the
second book right now, there aretimes when I, when she opens her
mouth and I'm just like, Ma'amplease, I'm not strong enough.
Can you please shut up?
You need to survive this bookand you are not making it easy
for me.
Christina (17:51):
I think everyone around her thinks the same thing
girl, shut up.
Zip it.
Devonnie (17:54):
please.
N. Caceres (17:55):
Especially Violet.
Devonnie (18:00):
Another one of my favorite characters.
I absolutely love Violet.
I just I You describe Violet'svoice so well, like the
porcelain and chinki, and so Ihear this really micey high
character, but then also, in mymind, she also talks like she
smoked, she's 300 years old andsmoked Newports every day of her
life, you know?
So I mix those two in my head.
Violet talks like this, but thenshe also is like real, I don't
(18:22):
know.
I love Violet.
Yeah, very cute.
N. Caceres (18:26):
Violet is one of my favorites too for that exact
reason.
Because it's so hard I see herso clearly in my mind.
But also, it's so hard to hearher because it's Your voice
makes no goddamn sense.
The things that you, that voiceis saying make no goddamn sense.
Devonnie (18:45):
No.
N. Caceres (18:46):
Please, do not
Devonnie (18:48):
yeah dainty and cute and dee.
But also, when she was gettingon Cricket about how she ended
up in this situation, becauseshe didn't know how to give
throat properly, I said, allthis coming from a doll?
I would be livid if a doll toldme it was talking to me.
That whole banter, the back andforth, also, A1.
But I supposed to respect myelders here or do I punch you in
(19:09):
your porcelain face?
Because what's happening?
What do we do here?
N. Caceres (19:15):
the thing I love about Violet, cause you just
like in your head, you'reseeing, I mean, I've got the
character art, And the characterart is literally a Victorian
doll with a ring, spiralringlets,
Christina (19:27):
yeah.
Devonnie (19:27):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (19:28):
And these big anime eyes, And you're just like,
could you imagine that, thatcreature, Talking to you about
how much it misses a goodmorning shit?
Christina (19:39):
I know.
Devonnie (19:43):
Poor Violet.
She don't need to eat.
She don't need to sleep.
She don't need to shit.
She says And I understand whyshe's mad.
I understand why she talks theway she talks, okay?
But yeah, definitely one of myother favorite characters.
Crickets top.
Violet's very close second.
I might Push Violet aboveCricket in certain situations
because Violet stands onbusiness.
She
Christina (20:03):
And she knows when to shut her mouth.
Devonnie (20:05):
That's yes.
N. Caceres (20:06):
in fact, know how to shut her mouth and play the
Devonnie (20:10):
hasn't been alive long enough to have developed that
skill.
N. Caceres (20:15):
No, and Violet also has a healthy fear of the Fae.
And Cricket's just Fuck thesepointy eared fucks.
Devonnie (20:23):
Yeah.
She still doesn't understand theseverity of her situation, even
with how much has been done toher within the first 15 percent
of the book, you know, likeshe's, she still hasn't grasped
just how different life is andhow you have to adapt these
survival skills that you'veacquired.
You need to mold them a littlebit to survive here.
(20:43):
It's very different than thestreets of Detroit.
Like you've got to fix somethingabout yourself.
I'm praying for her
N. Caceres (20:50):
She needs it! She
Christina (20:52):
She doesn't even listen, because they're like,
oh, don't ever enter a bloodoath, and she's yeah, I'm on my
way to do a blood oath.
N. Caceres (21:00):
With my mortal enemy,
Devonnie (21:02):
you know, in my mind I just see her skipping Like,
yeah,
Christina (21:06):
this is a good idea.
Devonnie (21:07):
what to do.
Don't tell me what to do.
Oh, poor cricket.
We love you so much
N. Caceres (21:12):
She is the epitome of that, that meme gif from
South Park of whatever, I dowhat I want.
Devonnie (21:19):
I actually know that.
I
N. Caceres (21:23):
She is the epitome.
Devonnie (21:29):
Oh, I
N. Caceres (21:29):
Actually, it's more like the Floyd Mayweather one.
It's more like the FloydMayweather one where he's I do
what I want, when I want, how Iwant.
That's
Devonnie (21:37):
Oh, yeah when he's getting closer and closer to you
Yeah,
N. Caceres (21:41):
that one.
Devonnie (21:41):
I love that.
I
Christina (21:43):
I see her as, I see her, the meme of her, it's the
girl burning the house behindher, and she's smiling at the
camera.
Devonnie (21:48):
the little yes Little kid the little girl
Christina (21:52):
she's
N. Caceres (21:53):
I mean,
Devonnie (21:53):
like
N. Caceres (21:54):
she does talk about burning shit down quite a lot.
Devonnie (21:57):
quite a bit.
Yeah, she does.
Absolutely.
Oh man.
Wow.
And listeners, that's yourcricket.
That is your FMC in this book.
So if you love what you'rehearing, please mark the release
date of this.
You definitely want to beintroduced to cricket because
she is very fun, but she willmake you want to throttle
something.
(22:17):
But yeah, okay.
It's always her.
You always want to throw her.
You're like, yes, I'm rootingfor you, babe.
Shut
N. Caceres (22:25):
Next page.
Shut the fuck up!
Devonnie (22:30):
And now it is time for or that We're gonna keep you on
your toes.
I know are you ready?
All right.
And there's no deliberation.
There was only hearing thequestion thinking 0.
2 seconds and then sayingsomething.
N. Caceres (22:47):
My body is ready.
Let's go.
Christina (22:48):
Okay, alright, here we go.
Physical book or e book?
N. Caceres (22:53):
Ebook.
Christina (22:54):
Hot or iced drink?
N. Caceres (22:57):
Iced.
Christina (22:59):
Which of the courts would you live in?
And the
N. Caceres (23:02):
None of them.
Absolutely fucking none of them.
Christina (23:06):
Good answer.
Okay, one bed trope or who didthis to you?
N. Caceres (23:14):
It can't be one bad trope because I like my sleep,
so who did this to you?
Christina (23:19):
Fair fair.
Okay, erotic horror or erotica?
N. Caceres (23:24):
RadicHorror.
All day, every day.
Devonnie (23:26):
Well, that's expected.
That should have been expected.
Okay.
Standalone or series.
N. Caceres (23:31):
Standalone.
Devonnie (23:34):
Yeah.
Fated mates or enemies tolovers.
N. Caceres (23:38):
Enemies to Lovers.
Devonnie (23:39):
I mean, yeah, that's fated mates though.
N. Caceres (23:42):
Hurt.
Devonnie (23:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Books that make you cry or booksthat make you laugh.
N. Caceres (23:50):
That Make Me Cry.
See aforementioned I Need ThatShit To Hurt.
Okay,
Devonnie (23:56):
That makes sense.
And then, in no particularorder, name your top three book
boyfriends of all time.
you can deliberate on because Iknow this is hard.
N. Caceres (24:06):
good, because my top number one is from a potentially
problematic author.
I don't know if she'sproblematic or not, but I love
that character.
Devonnie (24:16):
Let us hear
N. Caceres (24:17):
I don't really want to platform that, so.
Okay.
Roman from Feathers That Bleedby Jess Weiskopf.
Not Feathers That Bleed FeathersFrom The Sky.
then we'll go Well, shit.
I thought that was gonna beeasy.
Devonnie (24:36):
There's so many in the world to choose from.
N. Caceres (24:38):
There is.
And I'm so incredibly pickyabout book boyfriends.
I don't give that title easily.
I might like you.
We might vouch for the pages.
If I close that book and I don'teven remember your name, you're
not a book boyfriend.
Devonnie (24:54):
You're not a book boyfriend.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (24:55):
a book boyfriend.
I need to remember your namewhen the night is done.
Devonnie (24:58):
I love that.
N. Caceres (25:01):
from Black Sunshine, obviously.
Devonnie (25:04):
Yeah, I do.
I fear I do love him a littlebit.
N. Caceres (25:08):
Yeah, I hate his name.
Devonnie (25:10):
Me too.
N. Caceres (25:12):
I hate his name.
In my head his name is Abe.
I love Korean, but his name isAbe.
Devonnie (25:17):
that's it.
N. Caceres (25:19):
Fun story.
She pur, she purchased theomnibus for me at stimuli and
I'm 99.9 for sure.
Percent sure that in my signingI,'cause I put Sal's.
Okay, but he's no absalon.
And then I wrote I signed it.
I am 99.9% certain.
I misspelled his name'cause inmy head his name is a, okay,
Devonnie (25:38):
Ape, right, right, yeah.
That's so funny, I love Salthough.
N. Caceres (25:42):
so let's.
Damn okay, Roman hold on, I'vegot books over there on that
couch.
Devonnie (25:47):
Them real quick.
This
N. Caceres (25:49):
ah, shit.
Christina (25:51):
She didn't know there'd be a test.
Devonnie (25:53):
Right, I
N. Caceres (25:54):
I knew that was a good guess.
Devonnie (25:57):
Sorry.
N. Caceres (25:59):
Do I get to pick one of my own?
Devonnie (26:01):
Absolutely.
Okay.
N. Caceres (26:04):
from Obsidian Feathers.
love them.
I, those are my two baby angels.
They will never be maincharacters because I am mean to
my main characters and nothingcan touch them ever.
I love them.
Devonnie (26:17):
Okay.
I will give you that one.
Yes.
Okay.
N. Caceres (26:20):
Yeah, there, we did it.
Devonnie (26:22):
Yeah, we did it.
We got there in the end.
Yeah.
And what was the name of thefirst book?
Cause I don't think I know that
N. Caceres (26:27):
Roman is the main character, or the main love
interest's name, and it'sFeathers from the Sky by Jess
Wisecup.
It is a plus size romancebetween a I'm trying to figure
out how to say this politely.
A death obsessed personal deathobsessed huntress, and a very
(26:47):
angry vampire.
And it is very good.
Devonnie (26:51):
Let me go ahead and write that down.
Yeah, I'm very interested.
I'm
Christina (26:54):
love me a vampire.
N. Caceres (26:56):
Yeah,
Devonnie (26:57):
Period.
Love me a vamp.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (27:00):
I'm kind of in my vampire era right now.
So
Christina (27:02):
I never left.
Devonnie (27:04):
Yeah.
Christina (27:05):
it at 12, never
Devonnie (27:06):
Twilight.
She's addicted to
N. Caceres (27:08):
Vampire vampires were my first Mythological
creature like some people likegot obsessed with unicorns some
people mermaids vampires weremine so I never left either but
i'm in my vampire era becausei'm technically plotting Not the
book that's next but the bookafter that which is a vampire
one
Christina (27:26):
You're thinking one step ahead, and I'm ready for
that.
Devonnie (27:30):
I can't wait.
I love vampires.
And yeah, I mean, you definitelylots of fantasy recs.
So is there a specific authorthat got you hooked on
paranormal or like the fantasygenres?
Do you remember like you readsomeone and you were like, okay,
this is it.
This is.
This is it for me.
Christina (27:47):
Oh yes, I'm a Tolkien girly
N. Caceres (27:52):
So, my very first,
Devonnie (27:54):
will
N. Caceres (27:55):
the very first time I remembered an author's name,
because I've always been aprolific reader, but the very
first time I remembered anauthor's name enough that it
stuck with me was Tolkien.
The next time that reallyhappened for me was Jacqueline
Carey.
(28:16):
And then there's another authorin there that we don't talk
about him anymore.
He's a no, but he was also veryHe helped me understand that
crafting a unique voice as anauthor Where anyone can pick up
your book and flip to whateverpage and read five pages and go
(28:40):
I know the exact author thatwrote this because your voice as
an author is So strong.
He showed that, he showed mewhat that actually looks like.
We don't talk about him.
He's a, he is a no noname personnow, but he was very formative
on me both as a reader and as awriter.
Devonnie (28:59):
Now three, yeah, of your work, you have that I can
tell when I'm reading yourbooks, the way you write the
poetry, the beats thedescriptors, the flow of the
story, just, and how youdescribe scenes and characters,
how you have the charactersdescribed.
You have that where I could flipthrough, we can be like.
(29:20):
Who wrote this?
I know who did this.
Somebody cooked here.
Yeah.
So yeah, totally.
And I love that even though, Idon't know who this author is
and You know, we're not going totalk about him, we're not going
to talk about him, but I do lovethat you took that message
because that's that's somethingyou can apply and really learn
something and grow as an authorwith, just keeping in mind, so.
N. Caceres (29:40):
Yeah, and I'm always trying to refine that and find
more of who I am both as anauthor, but who I want to read
me, who do I want to sit downwith my books and have them
deeply resonate with them Iwelcome all readers, obviously,
but there are some people who Iwant to pick up my book, sit
(30:02):
down, and nearly vibrate withhow much they are seeing
themselves in the characters.
And that's who I write for.
Everybody else is welcome toread it, but that's who I'm
writing for.
Christina (30:14):
amazing.
Devonnie (30:15):
that.
Yeah, that's actually so sweet.
So tender.
N. Caceres (30:20):
You're like, who is this person?
Because that's not who I see onmy pages.
Devonnie (30:24):
Cuz that's not what I read in mine.
N. Caceres (30:28):
Listen, my
Devonnie (30:30):
Mine had me
Christina (30:33):
Shooketh.
Devonnie (30:33):
here.
Yeah here standing up.
I'm reading I'm like somebody inhere like Very much still
torturing myself to finish itand very scared, very concerned
about what I was reading, butalso,
Christina (30:45):
afraid to turn the page.
Devonnie (30:47):
Yeah so, hearing you say that, thank you.
I guess, trying to align thepeople here.
N. Caceres (30:57):
Listen, if Beyonce can have Sasha Fierce, I can
have Rose Reaper.
Devonnie (31:02):
Period.
Rose Reaper is your alter egoand we love her.
We love her.
N. Caceres (31:05):
If you think that, if you thought that the
cannibalism scenes in ObsidianFeathers were too much, don't
even acknowledge Rose Reaperexists.
Don't.
Devonnie (31:18):
Don't.
Because comparatively, thecannibal scenes in Obsidian
Feathers just felt oh, we'rehaving lunch.
Oh, this is a cute littleceremony compared to what you
get in mine.
Mine is what is happening here?
Why are we doing this?
Please stop.
So yeah, stay away from Rose ifthat's not your thing.
N. Caceres (31:38):
yeah, mine was writing mine.
Okay, so mine started becauseJessie, who is exclusive Palm
Beach Living, she actually sentme a link and she was like, Hey,
just being cute, but if you wereinterested in writing erotic
(32:00):
horror, here's this anthologythat's coming up.
Just saying.
And she sent it to me.
And I was like, I mean, I wasn'tplanning on it.
Devonnie (32:10):
Yeah,
N. Caceres (32:11):
Okay.
Sure.
So I read it and she's I wouldlove to see you in this
anthology.
And I was like, good.
Damn it, Jessie!
Devonnie (32:18):
you're right.
Oh,
N. Caceres (32:19):
And I was
Devonnie (32:19):
not peer pressure.
N. Caceres (32:21):
know what, and she can peer pressure me.
She is like one of the few whocan genuinely peer pressure me.
And I sat there and I was like,okay, I read the rules, I was
like, 10k.
I can do that.
Sure, I can do that.
And then I sat down and I waslike, what do I want to do with
this?
And I just fuck it, I'm justgonna start writing.
(32:43):
I'm just gonna start writing andsee where it goes.
And the more I wrote, the more Iwas like.
Oh, this can never leave mycomputer.
This can never leave mycomputer.
I mean, I'm gonna finish itbecause what the fuck am I on
about?
Devonnie (33:01):
yeah,
N. Caceres (33:02):
And I'm, but I'm like this is going in a password
protected file and it's beingburied.
And my dev editor, who is LizzieStrong, who also decided to to
apply for the anthology for,with me was like, we were in,
cause we do sprints together,writing sprints.
So she's you need to show methis.
Cause if you're, if you aredisturbed by this, I need to
(33:23):
read this.
Devonnie (33:24):
right.
N. Caceres (33:25):
And I sent it to her and she's I will break every
last one of your fingers and eatyour shins if you do not publish
this, it
Devonnie (33:33):
I mean, yeah thank God for her because it is horrific.
Okay, but in the best way.
N. Caceres (33:40):
got declined from the anthology, obviously,
because it was.
It was a little too extreme.
Yeah,
Devonnie (33:48):
telling you it's tough, but I'm happy you
released it yourself.
N. Caceres (33:52):
I had to because at that point I was like Okay, I
have something here then if thisanthology of horror writers
turned erotic horror writersCan't handle this And I and I
want to say for those of you whoare listening mine is not
spooky.
It is not spooky jump scare Itis just gruesome It is gruesome
(34:16):
and will make you questionyourself on every page.
Devonnie (34:21):
Yes.
N. Caceres (34:22):
Every single page you flip will make you go, Am I
okay with this?
What the fuck is wrong with me?
Why am I okay with this?
Christina (34:31):
Why can't I
Devonnie (34:31):
I was like, yes, exactly.
That was me.
Hey, target audience here.
That was me.
That was me reading mine becauseit is super gruesome, but like
for me, it's just like the wholetime I was reading, I just feel
what is, like why do I keepreading it?
At any point, I could have said,you know what?
This ain't for me.
This is a little too much.
Maybe this isn't something I canhang with.
But, again, I think that's alsoa testament to your writing.
(34:53):
I was invested in thecharacters.
I wanted to know the lore.
I wanted the backstory.
How did we get here?
Like, why?
Why is this happening, you know?
And for The, first of all,erotic horror itself as a genre
trips me out, cause I'm like,should I be afraid?
Like, when things really,
Christina (35:12):
horny and scared.
Devonnie (35:14):
right?
So, and I think that's where thedeep questioning of myself comes
into play, cause I'm like, I'mscared, but I like it a little
bit.
I like it.
Oh, yeah, that's nice.
Oh, but i'm scared.
So This is just too much soyeah, I don't know.
I think again.
Yeah, it's just your writing theway you write still I want to
(35:34):
read it.
I don't care if i'm scared andhorny like I want to read it I
guess Something.
I love it.
N. Caceres (35:41):
And horny and we'll call it scorny.
We're scorny.
Devonnie (35:44):
Squirny.
We're very squirny.
N. Caceres (35:47):
Very scorny here.
Devonnie (35:48):
squirny.
N. Caceres (35:53):
Yeah, mine I will be honest.
I was genuinely terrified topublish mine.
Genuinely terrified because
Devonnie (36:00):
What has the feedback been?
N. Caceres (36:02):
so I don't read my reviews.
Let me say that.
I don't even Goodreads is thebad place.
I don't even know my password tolog in.
I, we don't know her.
We don't know her.
I don't interact
Christina (36:13):
never heard of her.
Devonnie (36:15):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (36:16):
I am fully okay with the fact that at my grown age, I
cannot.
I can't read that because itaffects my writing.
Not because I want to lash outat that person, but because I
internalize it and it harms mywriting.
So I just, I choose not toengage with it.
So I don't know what thenegative side of it is.
Now my PA will pull positivereviews for me and will make
(36:41):
content for social media for mefrom it.
So a lot of people have said itreminds them of Mary Shelley's
Frankenstein, which
Christina (36:50):
Oh.
N. Caceres (36:50):
am not worthy a lot of
Devonnie (36:52):
It does though.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (36:54):
it does.
A lot of people have said thatit reminds them of Edgar Allen
Poe, which again i'm not
Christina (36:59):
I love that.
Devonnie (37:01):
I love Agra.
I see the connection.
Yes.
Yes.
N. Caceres (37:05):
One person said that it reminded them of the actual
book the fly versus the moviethe fly Which i'm like, okay, I
mean I don't see that, but okay.
But a lot of people have beenreally receptive to the fact
that at first, they are not downwith it.
(37:26):
Because of the whole scene we'redropped into.
Devonnie (37:29):
Right.
Exactly.
N. Caceres (37:30):
But by the time they get to the end, they're like, I
need to reread this because Ineed to see them suffer again.
Devonnie (37:36):
Yes.
That's how I felt at the end aswell.
Yeah.
When you first open it, we'restarting with a bang.
Quite literally.
So you're just no, there's mystomach hurts.
I'm going to vomit.
And yeah, you're right.
By the end of it, I was like,yeah.
They deserved it.
That, that,
N. Caceres (37:53):
that shit again.
We need to
Devonnie (37:54):
Yeah.
Run the tapes.
Yeah.
I love that.
I know.
It just went into a whole deepdive.
N. Caceres (38:02):
But it was scary because it's so not what I've
written before.
And it was training wheels off,balls to the wall, full on I'm
not going to pull any punches.
Because there were plenty ofspots in Obsidian Feathers where
I was like, ooh, I need topolish off that sharp edge.
Because dark romance readers anddark fantasy romance readers are
(38:24):
not going to be okay with that.
Let me polish that down a littlebit.
And I didn't do that at all formine.
I said, okay.
No, you're gonna you're gonnasuck it up if you want the hurt
you're gonna get this hurt
Devonnie (38:35):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (38:36):
And I didn't pull any punches none
Christina (38:39):
so I have a question for you.
Do you have any favorite readsfrom the last year you'd like to
share with us?
N. Caceres (38:45):
My favorite read from last year.
Yes Good morning, darling byazalea corley.
Devonnie (38:50):
know that one.
I'm gonna write that down.
Good morning, darling.
N. Caceres (38:52):
So good morning darling by azalea corley is
azalea corley's books are Shecalls them cozy horror romance,
and yeah, and she does it reallywell, and that's exactly what it
is.
It mixes the coziness of monsterromance with the horror elements
of some of your more paranormalhorror books.
(39:15):
And when I say horror, I mean,interview of the vampire level
horror, not Mine level
Devonnie (39:19):
Mine horror.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (39:22):
Entry level horror.
And all of her books are romancebooks.
So Good Morning Darling is abouta, she's gonna hate this when
she hears this, a Peter Panstyle demon.
And when I say Peter Pan style,I mean him and his shadow
disagree on a lot of things.
And his shadow is an animatecreature.
(39:43):
A sentient creature.
And he falls in love with thedaughter of the owner of a
funeral home that he works for,that he's indebted to,
Devonnie (39:55):
That is
N. Caceres (39:55):
it's
Christina (39:55):
is very
N. Caceres (39:56):
fantastic.
Devonnie (39:57):
Yeah, but it also sounds very cozy.
N. Caceres (39:59):
It is very
Devonnie (40:00):
that sound No, when you take out the other But yeah,
that sounds like the makings ofa cozy romance.
You know, it's always somethingvery close, like a little small
town.
I work here, you work there, werun into each So yeah, that
part, I can see the cozyelement.
N. Caceres (40:13):
so good morning darling.
So, Azalea Crowley is one of myfavorite authors for, I do what
I call is the sweet and sourapproach when I read is, I like
to read something really softand cozy and sweet.
Yeah.
And then turn around and readthe most stank, just absolute,
diabolical, hor horrific Dark
Devonnie (40:34):
That's I was just about to say that's Jordan.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (40:37):
I like to keep the toxicity of Dark Romance toxic,
but if you read too much of it,you get numbed by it.
So I like to balance it with thescreen.
Devonnie (40:49):
Yeah, Jordan always needs a palate cleanser Yeah
N. Caceres (40:54):
my favorite authors for that.
She's about to come out with anew one called I think it's
Wicked Taste?
Something like that.
Which is another demon.
And this one, so, I like to callAzalea Crowley's books hot pink
horror.
Hot pink horror romance, becauseit's if Lisa Frank wrote a
horror novel.
But added romance.
(41:14):
It's fantastic.
I highly recommend the new one.
The new one I haven't read yet.
But i've read the blurb and thenew one looks fantastic and it
is already pre ordered
Devonnie (41:24):
Yeah.
Oh, I love that.
Cool
N. Caceres (41:26):
one of my pre order, of
Devonnie (41:28):
Immediately.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (41:30):
As soon as it's
Devonnie (41:31):
Yeah.
There's something new.
That's mine.
N. Caceres (41:34):
Yeah, it's fine
Devonnie (41:35):
what about any anyone else any other books?
Or do you think we should startwith the Xaeli Foley?
N. Caceres (41:39):
Azalea Crowley let's see Jess Wisecup's coming out
with the second book for thatFeathers Feathers from the Sky
book that I was talking aboutearlier the vampire one.
I really I want to read it.
I haven't bought it yet, but Iwant to read it, is Calista
Neith came out with a succubus,an enemies to lovers succubus
book I think it was.
I would have to remember thename, but it's, looks fantastic.
(42:03):
Looks fantastic.
Christina (42:04):
that sounds so interesting.
I love
N. Caceres (42:06):
So, so Kalista Neith does Invoking the Blood and
Trial of Bone, Lace and Bone, orsomething like that, Bone and
Lace.
Fantastic books.
Vampires, Chef's Kiss.
But she came out with a new bookoutside of the Invoking the
Blood series.
And it's Looks so good.
Devonnie (42:27):
Really?
Yeah.
N. Caceres (42:28):
not whispers in the dark.
It's cruel obsession orsomething like that looks
fantastic It's on her it's onher instagram.
I highly recommend calista'swriting if you like my writing
calista's writing is better it'sfantastic
Devonnie (42:42):
Oh, I love that.
That's so nice.
That's a yeah, that's a good.
Yeah, I'm gonna add all ofthose.
Exactly.
We love a good wreck on the pod.
Callista Neath.
Cool.
Not me adding cozy horror inmore.
Yes.
Yeah.
TBR is a hell at this point.
Alright.
(43:02):
So, at Mine, erotic horror.
Salt Road, erotic horror.
You've written a couple erotichorror stories.
How is the process of writingthose?
Do you ever, I mean, you'vementioned a polishing officer in
things when you get there, buthave you ever gotten to a line
and was like No, that is toomuch.
I cannot do that.
(43:23):
Have you done it anyway?
N. Caceres (43:24):
Yes.
Yeah.
Christina (43:28):
She saw the red flag and walked right past it.
N. Caceres (43:31):
Right back.
Devonnie (43:31):
what a nice shade Yeah
N. Caceres (43:34):
So, mine was that.
Mine was I am not comfortablewriting this.
I'm gonna keep writing it.
That was literally my, thewriting process for mine was I
am very uncomfortable right now.
I am very uncomfortable.
I don't like what is coming offof my fingers.
It's good! Goddammit, it's good!
Devonnie (43:55):
so good.
N. Caceres (43:56):
But I'm not comfortable.
Devonnie (43:58):
Yeah
N. Caceres (43:59):
And the more I was uncomfortable, the more I pushed
through and made it moreuncomfortable for me.
So that was fun and interestingbecause it was very much a
challenge to myself to go, Okay,I see that you're uncomfortable.
And what?
Devonnie (44:12):
right.
N. Caceres (44:14):
Keep moving.
Christina (44:15):
womp.
Devonnie (44:17):
the other side of this discomfort?
N. Caceres (44:18):
Yeah, keep making it more uncomfortable.
And I'm very uncomfortable evenreading that book now.
I'm just like, who allowed me?
Who allowed?
Who allowed me to write thiswith my own fingies?
On purpose?
I'd like to say that mine is thereason why I no longer get
acrylic nails because I'veshamed them.
(44:40):
That was the last book that Iwrote with my acrylic nail.
I can't do these anymore.
I did bad things.
Devonnie (44:48):
The magic is still there.
It might be unleashed if youracrylics touch a keyboard again.
We have to contain it
N. Caceres (44:54):
And then Assault Road was more of guided horror.
So mine was like just I was leftunattended.
And bad things happened.
Christina (45:05):
Someone put a keyboard in front of her.
N. Caceres (45:06):
Somebody put a keyboard in front of me and I
was irresponsible with that.
The Salt Road was more So I hadbeen technically writing The
Salt Road in my head the entiretime I was writing Obsidian
Feathers because Sochi has somuch trauma that I needed to
know what that trauma was andhow that trauma happened.
(45:27):
So I was taking notes the entiretime I was writing Obsidian
Feathers.
So Salt Road was a natural rightfor me because I had already had
those notes.
I already knew what happened.
It was just finding theappropriate framework to show 27
years or 30 years of trauma andhow on those incidents and how
they played out and figuring outthe appropriate framework to, to
(45:48):
show that, cause that's a lot oftime.
So writing the Salt Road wasmore of okay, does this horror,
because I'm very meticulousabout the way I craft my
stories, is does this makesense?
Is this a pur if, does this havea purpose?
If this piece does not makesense and it does not have a
(46:09):
purpose, it does not movesomething along in the plot and
or show something specific aboutthe characters and or show how
we're getting to the ultimateresolution of the plot, it
doesn't stay in my books.
So with the Salt Road, it wasvery much, okay, is this
specific horror just something Iwant, I'm enjoying writing, or
(46:30):
is this particular gruesomething Something that needs to be
in the book in order to furtherthe plot and to further show
what we're trying to do here.
And there were several chaptersthat got carved off because they
weren't serving that purpose.
They were just revenge porn forme.
So, so
Devonnie (46:52):
It's really okay, is this necessary?
No, but at least I wrote it.
N. Caceres (46:55):
I wrote it, it was necessary for me to write at the
time, but it's not necessary forthe book.
So there's I think that a total,there was a total of five
chapters that got taken outsimply because it just, it was
filler and I don't like fillerin my books.
Devonnie (47:12):
Everything is used, like you said, to move something
along or to explain or to shedlight on something.
So I think we appreciate that inyour writing for sure.
Christina (47:20):
That is good, because sometimes you're just reading
and you're like, what is this?
N. Caceres (47:23):
Yeah.
Why do I even
Devonnie (47:24):
Why did we even care about this?
Yeah, that happens a lot inbooks.
So thank you for doing Thank you
Christina (47:29):
Doing the Lord's
Devonnie (47:30):
that out.
Yeah, do it a large work
N. Caceres (47:33):
something I hate
Devonnie (47:34):
me off
N. Caceres (47:34):
as a reader.
It's I hate, I literally justgave you my eyeballs for 50
minutes of bullshit you're not,that never, it doesn't matter.
Devonnie (47:44):
Never will come up again.
N. Caceres (47:45):
You wasted my time.
Devonnie (47:47):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (47:48):
And I hate that as a reader, so I try not to do that
as a writer.
Now, there are a lot of timeswhen, as a writer, I'm just
writing, and that's fluff.
And I, and on the readout, whenI'm, before it goes to my
editor, I'll start just cuttingthose things out.
But I needed to write it at thetime.
Doesn't mean it needs to stay inthe book, though.
Christina (48:10):
So, I have one more question for you.
As an indie author, what hasbeen the hardest part about
getting your stories out intothis world?
Into our world.
Getting your world into ours.
Devonnie (48:21):
Right.
N. Caceres (48:22):
Alright, y'all want secrets?
Deep secrets?
Devonnie (48:24):
Absolutely
Christina (48:27):
Dev loves it.
N. Caceres (48:28):
since it's just us three and nobody else is
Devonnie (48:30):
Right You're among friends.
Jordan's not even here.
N. Caceres (48:35):
Jordan's not even here.
Okay, so I have had anincredibly blessed through
Publishing I have not hit awhole lot of potholes or
obstacles everything that I haveencountered has been Something
that I could navigate around soI cannot say that there was
(48:59):
anything that for me Was toobig.
Everything else, like littleshit.
I have a lot of author friendsand one of the biggest things
that they have told me that istheir biggest problem is the way
(49:20):
they want to present themselves,the way they want to show up and
what their wallet can afford andsupport are three different
things.
They're not even two differentthings.
There are three differentthings.
I'm working on a project withthree of my author friends, and
we are working on puttingtogether a non profit charity in
(49:43):
which, once a year, authors willcome together and we will create
an anthology, and 100 percent ofthe proceeds of that anthology
will go to a debut indie authorwho will apply.
Every author that participateswill give every single debut
author that participates andthat submits feedback to help
(50:05):
them grow their career, whetheror not they win, they'll still
get feedback from a publishedauthor, somebody who already has
experience in the industry andspecifically within the genre
they want to write and publishin.
They'll get feedback from themon the first 10, 000 words of
their manuscript, their finishedmanuscript, and one author We'll
(50:25):
get 100 percent of that pot or100 percent of their publishing
fees from cover to editing, toPR, to everything fully public,
fully funded.
And then if the pot has morethan the next, the second best
author in that we'll get that,you know, it'll keep rolling
down until we completely zeroout the pot.
(50:47):
And then the next year we'll dothe same thing.
So I'm working on that because Iknow how much.
Money really impacts how youshow up as an author, and I feel
like how many indie authors Iknow, still, even after four or
five years of publishing, cannotshow up the way they want to
(51:11):
show up.
In front of readers cannot putout the quality of Art the
quality of covers the quality ofediting the quality of audiobook
or whatever quality That theywant even after four or five
years in the industry because ofmoney and I know how important
that is for a debut
Devonnie (51:30):
Yeah.
Oh my God.
That's such a good secret.
That is so, I mean, honestly,that is something that's so
amazing because as someone whoeventually wants to be a debut
indie author, just knowing thatthere are other authors out
there, even thinking like that,like I haven't even, first of
all, my, my stories are not evenfinished yet.
(51:51):
Like I have not hit the end.
So I have not even taken the twocells of brainpower I have to
think of how much it's going tocost me.
To put this in the world, butjust knowing that there's
someone else, like understandingthat plight, especially when
I've heard many indie authors,so I love supporting indie
authors, but that is a runningtheme that it's really hard.
It's difficult financially.
(52:12):
And you know, you take on allyou want.
These words out there.
But then you have this burden oflike, how do we get there?
How do I get from point A topoint B?
So yeah, I really love thatyou're doing that.
That just, Oh man, that just,that gave me chills.
Like I'm really excited aboutthat.
So thank you for sharing thatwith us.
I can't wait to see as thatdevelops.
Right.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (52:31):
next year will probably be our first year.
We're trying to do it right.
We're trying to do it right.
We're setting up the nonprofit.
We're setting up the business,like the business aspect behind
of it, behind it.
And we're trying to make surethat the things that we can
think of, we know for a factwe're going to make mistakes the
first year.
We know for a fact.
Like we have all come to termswith the fact that there is
going to be a big mistake thefirst year.
(52:52):
It happens.
Devonnie (52:53):
Yeah.
Learning.
N. Caceres (52:54):
of everything.
So, but while we're working ontrying to think through all of
those potentials, we're tryingto make sure that we're setting
up a structure that will allowus to make as little mistakes as
possible.
We're not gonna make the dumbmistakes of Hey, this is a black
author and she wrote a black assstory and it's only being judged
(53:16):
by white ass authors.
We're not making that mistake.
That's a fundamental mistake.
We're not doing
Devonnie (53:22):
That's a mistake.
Yeah.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (53:26):
we're not doing that.
But those nuanced mistakes arethings we can't foresee
happening.
We have a plan on how to dealwith that, but We're trying our
best to like really think thosethings out first.
Devonnie (53:40):
Yeah.
I think the gold and theintention is definitely going to
speak volumes.
There are growing pains with anylarge and new venture, so
hopefully everyone else willgive you guys the grace to
execute this the way that, youknow, you want to and the way
you want to show up for theseindie authors so that they won't
hold you to, I don't know.
N. Caceres (54:00):
Stupid standards.
Yeah.
Devonnie (54:01):
you to, yeah, I'm trying to be nice.
But yeah, because I can, Idefinitely, I think that would
be great.
I think so many people wouldbenefit from it and
Christina (54:09):
Yeah, please keep us updated on that
Devonnie (54:11):
Yeah, I'll definitely be looking out for that for
sure.
N. Caceres (54:13):
You'll see big
Devonnie (54:16):
Things big announcements, rollout, full
thing, red carpet, yeah.
And we'll be sure to share thatwith our readers as well.
And then Anne, is there anythingelse you wanted to share with
us?
Or any tidbit, you know, ifthere's any secrets you want to
spill, we'll take, we'll collectall the secrets.
Any oaths you'd like to sign?
Hehehehehehe
N. Caceres (54:33):
really bad about secrets.
Let's see.
Okay, so we know that I'mwriting the second book for
Devonnie (54:38):
For
N. Caceres (54:39):
That's what I'm working on right now.
You know, do you want to knowwhat the two after that are?
Devonnie (54:44):
Yes.
Immediately, yes.
Spectacular.
Give me 14 of them.
N. Caceres (54:48):
okay.
So the one immediately afterthat, and this is all assuming
that the world of Adosh does notexplode and I'm being shackled
to my computer misery style andforced to write the next book of
that world.
Because that world is so hugeand so deep and so rich that I
could write probably a thousandbooks off of it.
If that doesn't happen.
Devonnie (55:09):
Right.
N. Caceres (55:10):
The next book is about a girl, and this is pure
fantasy, like up until now I'vemostly done we start in the real
world and then we go intofantasyland.
This is pure fantasy, thisstarts in fantasyland.
There's a girl who grew up in afertility temple where all the
priestesses have a ton of kidsand nobody knows who the moms
(55:31):
actually are because they're allmoms.
And in a fit of rebellion.
She pledges to a death god, andthe death god tells her if you
can give me a sacrifice everynight for three years, and the
final sacrifice being you, Iwill marry you and you will be
my bride and we will take overthe world together, okay?
(55:55):
Okay.
Deb?
We're not even there yet.
We're not even there yet, madam.
So the book starts off two and ahalf years into her
accomplishing this.
And
Devonnie (56:09):
Lord!
N. Caceres (56:11):
she's already two and a half years deep.
And she's close to fit to hergoal.
And because of that, HolyPaladins have started roaming
the world.
People are becoming scarcebecause they they're not easy to
find because they're roamingaround in groups or being
escorted by holy paladinsbecause nobody knows what the
hell is going on.
They just know that people arefucking dying and they don't
(56:34):
know why.
An unimaginable amount of peopleare fucking dying and nobody
knows why.
or who the murderer is.
So she falls in with this groupof holy paladins that is looking
for the murderer that keepskilling people and sacrificing
them to the dark god.
The holy paladin leader guyfalls in love with her and is
trying to seduce her.
(56:56):
Meanwhile, she's in love withthe death god and is trying to
seduce the death god whiletrying to escape him.
Christina (57:05):
This is like a Mari episode in the fey realm.
Things are happening, everyone'scoming on stage, and they're
like, now this is happening, andthis is, you don't know what's
happening.
N. Caceres (57:14):
Yes.
So that's the next book.
Devonnie (57:16):
Okay.
Yeah, I'm into it.
I'm into it.
This is gonna be psychotic.
I can't wait.
The games that can be played.
The mind maneuvering.
The stealth.
The stabbiness.
N. Caceres (57:30):
He, the paladin guy, doesn't know he's trying to find
her.
Devonnie (57:37):
right.
N. Caceres (57:37):
He just knows that this cute girl joined his group
and he's escorting her to thenext big city.
And she's super cute and sweet.
She could never be anything butvery much a delicate flower.
She's very easily bruised.
Meanwhile, she's sneaking off atnight murdering fucking people.
And having sex with death godsin dark woods.
(58:00):
Meanwhile, he thinks she's notgiving up the pootang because
she's a virtuous girl who isjust so delicate and virtuous.
Devonnie (58:11):
Yeah.
She's just a flower.
Meanwhile, she's in the woods.
I love that.
Oh, the duality of a woman.
N. Caceres (58:19):
skeletons that she dug up out of the ground.
Devonnie (58:22):
Jesus Christ.
I can't wait to meet her.
Love her already.
Can't wait to meet her.
Yeah.
Right.
N. Caceres (58:28):
then the one after that is the vampire book where
she is she is part of a scribefamily, like their whole purpose
is, their sacred purpose andtheir sacred job is to keep the
records of this, these familiesthat have magic blood, that are
like magical and they're likethe rulers of the aristocracy of
(58:48):
the kingdom.
And for some reason, thisbloodline is starting to get
thin because people keep dying.
And she doesn't like it becauseit's fucking up her records.
Her records say they aresupposed to live another 50
years.
Why is this baby gone?
What?
This is fucking up and
Devonnie (59:07):
Ooh, this is a mystery.
N. Caceres (59:09):
very upset about it.
Turns out vampires who were whobecame addicted to this blood
because They're the thisaristocracy line has a specific
component in their blood thatmakes vampires high.
So they're druggies.
Devonnie (59:22):
Not the druggy vampires.
That's crazy.
You know, I love this.
I'm already seeing things shecould be saying.
She's such a studious person.
She's my, my calculations.
You should be alive.
Where are you?
Now we're on a little quest.
Now I'm on a
N. Caceres (59:34):
had I already had seven Felon books crafted and
placed on your shelf.
You are supposed to fill thesebooks.
What is going on?
You only filled two.
Your quota is not filled.
What why are you missing?
Why are you dead?
It's
Devonnie (59:50):
I love that.
I love that.
N. Caceres (59:53):
Dead, she's upset that her records are being
Devonnie (59:55):
Right, yeah, that's exactly what I mean.
She don't care about thesepeople.
She just want to know why thingsaren't going the way they're
supposed to go.
Wow, I was not expecting thosetwo big secrets.
But now us, and all the peoplelistening, know those secrets,
so thank you so much for sharingthat.
I love that.
(01:00:15):
Yeah,
N. Caceres (01:00:15):
are unhinged
Christina (01:00:17):
This is so exciting.
Cannot
Devonnie (01:00:19):
I know.
I
Christina (01:00:20):
it coming?
No, I'm just kidding.
Devonnie (01:00:21):
know, right?
N. Caceres (01:00:23):
So Aash.
So the next book in Aash, whichis a DA Dance of Broken Shackles
comes out March 28th, 2026.
The Death Fucker who, I don'teven know what the title of that
is yet, She comes out March28th, 2027.
And then the cleric or the clerkor the paper pusher, she comes
(01:00:47):
out on 28th of 2028.
Devonnie (01:00:50):
We love the March 28th.
That's a theme.
So yeah, just, you know,whatever year you're in, just
check what's happening on March28th to see what the vibes are.
N. Caceres (01:00:58):
I will always be putting out a full length book
on March 28th.
Novellas and small shortstories, those happen as I
decide to write them.
you can find me on most socialmedia sites as author ncaceres
so author n c a c e r e s.
You can find me on most socials.
(01:01:18):
I am not on TikTok.
Me and TikTok had a breakup.
I
Devonnie (01:01:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (01:01:23):
I'm not good at social media.
I'm really not.
I'm just not.
If I can't schedule it onMetricool, I'm not there.
I'm not there.
I can't.
I
Devonnie (01:01:31):
love that.
N. Caceres (01:01:33):
can't do it.
I want to.
I wish I had the time and theenergy.
I just can't.
But you can find me on mostsocial medias.
Author ncaceres.
A, author n c a c e r e s.
I predominantly hang out onthreads.
But if you go to any of mysocial media profiles and you
click on the link in my bio,there is also a link to my
(01:01:53):
Discord.
And you can join my Discord.
And I'm a lot more active there.
And you can talk to me directly.
I also have a pretty safe andinclusive and encouraging
community there.
So you're welcome to join thatas well.
But those are the two threadsreally threads and discord are
really the two plus places ifyou want to interact with me,
(01:02:16):
but I'm present on most otherplaces.
Christina (01:02:18):
Awesome.
Devonnie (01:02:19):
sharing.
And to our listeners, thanks forlistening, listening to us
ramble with N.
Caceres about her books.
If you're looking for moreRomance Recs, be sure to follow
us on Instagram and TikTok atRomance Recs Pod.
You can find our favorite bookrecs.
From our episodes as well asbehind the scenes content again,
that's at romance rex pod.
(01:02:40):
So make sure to give us a followand follow our friendly author
here because y'all probablywould have stayed posted on a
couple of things that wereshared.
The current books that are out.
Definitely check them out.
Be warned about mine.
Definitely check out Adosh whenit comes out on the 28th.
But yeah, make sure you'rekeeping up with us on
(01:03:02):
RomanceRecsPod and make sure togive us another follow.
We'll be back in another weekwith another episode.
Christina (01:03:10):
Thank you so much for coming to talk with
N. Caceres (01:03:12):
Thanks, guys.
Thanks.
Welcome to Romance Recs.
(00:01):
We're three romance obsessedbesties sharing book Recs broken
down by genres and tropes, soyou can be sure you're getting
exactly what you want out ofyour next read.
Make sure to follow us onInstagram, Threads, and TikTok
at Romance Recs Pod andsubscribe wherever you listen.
Hi guys, I'm Christina and I amcurrently reading Boyfriend
(00:23):
Material by Alexis Hall.
Devonnie (00:24):
Hey guys, it's Dev and I am currently reading an arc of
Left of Forever by Tara DeWitt.
N. Caceres (00:30):
Hi, I'm Anne Caceres.
I am currently rereading one ofmy favorites, which is Black
Sunshine by Karina Halle.
Bye!
Devonnie (00:48):
tell us everything.
So we've got a new book comingout in a little bit.
Tell us what that is and howeverything's going.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (01:01):
those super fans might sound familiar, um, I am
really a little anal intentiveand I decided that instead of
having to pick my publishingdate every year or every book,
that I would publish on the sameday every year all the time.
So every year on March 28th, Iwill put out a full length book.
The first time was ObsidianFeathers, and this time is A
(01:23):
Debt of Shattered Hope.
And A Debt of Shattered Hope is,it's my response to Irish Fae.
Um, it's based very loosely onit.
Because I put in a, pretty muchall Celtic Fae, like the basic
of what Fae are.
Fae were never supposed to bebutterfly winged sweethearts.
(01:45):
They were literally thenightmare demons of Irish
culture and of Gaelic culture.
And some of them were nice ish.
And some of them had nice times.
But most of them were nightmarecreatures, and I feel like we as
fair fairy fuckers haveforgotten that.
(02:06):
Huh.
I feel like we needed to bringthat back.
Christina (02:09):
I love that.
Devonnie (02:10):
Yeah.
And you've definitely done that.
I we were just talking earlierabout how these are not the
cutesy Fae.
Like the Fae in this story arenot the ones you want to like,
Oh, romance.
Like they're very much givingnightmare.
And I was so excited.
I actually forgot to have us doquotes.
So we are going to go back intosome quotes before we dig deep
into the Fae that you'veintroduced.
(02:31):
Well, I think I like thisversion of Fae.
I'm not going to lie.
I really do.
But yeah, so quotes.
I actually have a quote I wantto share that is from your book.
Yeah, a shadow of hope.
So it is in chapter 20 where theBandrewi, is that how I
pronounce that?
The Bandrewi is.
Yeah it's about the Bandrewie,but it says even when tearing
(02:55):
someone to shreds, the Bandrewiewas a sight to behold.
She grew more honeyed, the morepoison she poured upon another.
I feel like this alters me on adeep level because that is the
type of petty I aspire to be.
So petty.
So like scathing that all yousee is a smile and a honeyed
(03:20):
voice where I'm like reading youfor film.
So when I read that, I was like,yes, cheers.
I love that for her.
But that's what, and to be fair,this entire book is super
highlightable.
Like I'm highlighting so manythings, but that's just one I
wanted to share
N. Caceres (03:36):
in peace, your highlighter, because it's a long
look.
I actually got that from me atwork.
So, I work in corporate.
I do high corporate and some ofthe things that high corporate
people will do will piss youright the fuck off to the bone.
But you can't do anything aboutit.
So the nicer I get at work, andlike all of my teammates know
(03:59):
this, the nicer I get, the moreI want to just absolutely
eviscerate the person.
And I was like, I need this tobe in a fae, because it is so
fae of me to just be like,Alright.
Yeah, you know what?
I can absolutely do that foryou.
I know that I sent over thisdocument like four times
already, but give me one second.
(04:20):
Let me link it for you.
I can absolutely do that foryou.
It's in the SharePoint, and iffor some reason you can't find
it on the SharePoint, let meknow.
Maybe you have an access issue.
Yes,
Devonnie (04:34):
email.
Yeah, I love that, like, veryaggressive, but sweet,
N. Caceres (04:41):
sweet.
So they can't ever say she wasbeing unprofessional.
Was she though?
Because that was a recorded calland she just sounds really nice
here.
Devonnie (04:49):
yeah, so sweet.
So concerned about your accessand the receipt of this email
and this document.
N. Caceres (04:58):
That's why I had to put it into somebody.
Devonnie (05:00):
Yeah.
And it was great.
And I love it in this characterspecifically.
I think it's necessary,necessary and it makes sense for
her role.
Christina (05:07):
I love that.
Okay, so I have a quote.
It is actually from a book Ihave not read yet, which is
crazy, but I saw this quote, Isaw this quote on TikTok and it
moved this book right on up myTBR.
Okay, it's a short one, but Ilove it.
It's from Blood of Hercules byJasmine Maas.
It says, A man was speaking, soI stopped listening.
(05:29):
That's all I need, period, rightthere.
Devonnie (05:32):
That, that'll do it for me as well.
Yes.
I too would like to read thisbook now.
I see why you were roped intoit.
N. Caceres (05:39):
Can I get, can I get that delivered to me?
Because that'll take time,
Devonnie (05:43):
Yeah.
Christina (05:44):
Needed on a shirt, needed on a shirt, not
N. Caceres (05:46):
need it on a shirt, I need it on
Devonnie (05:49):
I love that.
I didn't know what quote youwere going to read.
I was like, okay, because whenyou told me it was from a book
you haven't read, I was like,all right, let's hear what this
is going to be, but yeah, I seewhy we've moved that book up.
Thank you so much.
Love that.
Love that for us.
N. Caceres (05:59):
top of the list,
Devonnie (06:00):
Yes,
N. Caceres (06:01):
the correct reaction.
So the quote that I have is fromMarx, Tupac, and my book.
It was originally quoted, or atleast as far as we know, quoted
from Marx in one of hisspeeches, and then Tupac put it
into a rap, which is where Ifirst heard it, and it is
perfect for this book.
And that quote is, I havenothing left to lose but my
(06:23):
chains.
Devonnie (06:25):
Yeah, I feel like that one is super self explanatory as
well.
And the fact that it like justtraveled across time because
mark the marks to book pipelinewith Tupac in the middle, it's
yeah, it's, it is actually alittle diabolical, but it's
also, if you read the story, itis so perfect.
Christina (06:46):
Perfect.
Devonnie (06:47):
That's what we want.
And for Tupac.
Yeah.
I love that for him as well.
Like
N. Caceres (06:52):
I love when I grew up with Tupac and I remember
being absolutely, utterlydevastated when I found out
about him.
Like I wasn't a big fan of musicat the time.
I was like, I don't know, maybe12 or 13 when that happened.
And I just remember thinkingwhat do you mean?
(07:13):
What do you mean?
That is not a thing.
That is a dirty lie.
Devonnie (07:18):
And he's so poetic.
N. Caceres (07:20):
so, to me, I have not found a rapper or any even
musical artist, really, who isas poetic, intelligent, and
observant and introspective asTupac was.
And I feel like that was a hugeloss for the industry.
Christina (07:41):
Yeah, still as important now as he was 30 years
ago.
Devonnie (07:44):
Exactly.
Exactly.
And I, like it would be so coolto see.
What music would sound like ifhe was still alive today you
know, just what, just thecommentary and the observations
of what's going on in the worldin our songs and stuff.
So I agree.
I do.
I do agree with that.
I would love to have Tupac herewith us.
And yeah, that was terrifying.
(08:05):
I mean, I wasn't, I was likestill pretty young when
everything happened, butdefinitely old enough to know
something's wrong.
N. Caceres (08:15):
It blew my brain that a celebrity could die.
I don't know why, but in myyoung mind, I was like, what do
you mean?
Celebrities don't die.
They just go away.
They go off to a celebrity farmor something.
I don't
Devonnie (08:28):
Yeah, they retire.
They don't die.
N. Caceres (08:31):
don't die.
It's
Devonnie (08:38):
you just had a bunch of celebrities like just
Christina (08:41):
With some goats.
Devonnie (08:42):
Yeah, with the goats.
Oh, the goats.
Do you see what I'm saying?
The goats, the celebrity goats.
Greatest of all time.
Okay.
All right.
Moving right along because we'rehere to talk about A Deadest
Shattered Hope.
Yeah.
So again, we talked about theFae and just how not crazy, but
just mean.
They are mean in this book.
Okay.
(09:03):
Some of them, not everyone, butsome.
It's like dark and they're supermean and I'm like super
interested in what inspired theidea for this story, this world.
Did it all come to you at once?
You're like, yep, I have itthere.
I'm going to follow thistradition and mythology and go
that route.
Or was it like piece by piece?
N. Caceres (09:22):
Hey, you want to hear the most hilarious thing
ever?
Christina (09:25):
Yes.
N. Caceres (09:26):
Nobody but my writing circle knows this.
Devonnie (09:29):
okay.
Christina (09:29):
Ooh.
N. Caceres (09:29):
So this book was called, like the WIP title was
Forkin Balls.
Forever.
Because Everybody just starteddying.
Because I built the entireworld, the entire story, and
(09:52):
everything around that Fork inthe Balls scene.
That scene came to me first, andI built the entire world around
it.
Christina (10:02):
I absolutely love that.
And he deserved it.
N. Caceres (10:07):
emotionally shattered.
Devonnie (10:08):
That is so funny.
You wrote one scene and then yousaid, yeah, build the
Christina (10:15):
with it.
Yep.
N. Caceres (10:16):
How do I get How do I get to here?
Devonnie (10:22):
No, that is actually so interesting.
I find that to be so interestingbecause sometimes you hear there
are a lot of authors who likeplot the entire thing and they
will not write a drop or writeanything until they have an
entire story basically plottedout.
But here you wrote this scene.
And then an entire world?
N. Caceres (10:41):
didn't actually write it.
I wrote it in my head.
Devonnie (10:44):
Okay, so you saw the scene.
N. Caceres (10:46):
I saw the scene in my head and I was like, okay,
how do I get to here?
And then I started plotting,like after it, went and
marinated in my head for sixmonths to like, okay, how do I
get here?
Then I went and sat down and Iplotted it all out.
And I do what's called like aliving plot.
Living plot structure.
(11:07):
So basically I'll ploteverything out in like numbers
and then I will just write andtry to hit each one of those
plot points as I'm writing.
And then for instance, this bookoriginally was only plotted for
20 chapters.
That was only 20 beats that Iwanted to hit.
But it's 50 something chaptersbecause you know when you
actually write and break it outinto chapters after you write
(11:31):
Then those chapters becomebigger.
But yeah, it was all It allstarted because I wanted to
figure out how I got to a forkin the balls And everybody
Devonnie (11:47):
That's actually so amazing.
N. Caceres (11:49):
who I've told about that scene is like, How the fuck
did you get there?
And I'm like, listen, it makessense.
It makes sense.
When you get there, it
Devonnie (12:00):
fair, yeah, I can imagine.
Also, you you didn't Okay, forme, I hear Fork and Balls, and
then I'm thinking, okay, is thisfor Play?
Is this a comedy here?
What, how did we get into, firstwe're in Detroit, now we're in
the land of the fat, you know?
I'm just like driving the carlike, huh, This street does not
(12:24):
make any sense, but yeah, veryscenic clearly.
But yeah I love that.
I kind of love that idea ofhaving this one image and then
deciding to build an entireworld that's super rich.
Like this world is super richfor it to have stemmed from this
one little
N. Caceres (12:46):
And it's a scene that is unexpected in a romance
novel, I think.
I think it's pretty unexpectedfor the female main character to
stab the love interest in histesticles with a lunch fork.
Christina (13:04):
Well, when it's this main character, I love her.
And that's my next question,because we're talking about our
cricket.
She's such a spectacularcharacter.
Is she based off anyone in yourlife, or did you kind of just
dream her up, or where did shecome from?
N. Caceres (13:19):
Cricket is a combination of things.
So, I, the way I createcharacters, Whether it be a main
character or a side character ora villain is I take a Small
little nugget a small littlebead of myself and I build that
(13:40):
out into a character and I thinkokay Here is their core.
Here's a little bead.
I've pulled off of myself Here'stheir core build a fully fleshed
out creature Around this if thisis their core What additional
character attributes, whatadditional thought processes,
moral codes do they have thatfeed this core?
(14:03):
So for me, I mean, I grew updirt poor and I grew up around a
lot of people who have a lot ofpoverty trauma.
And I took that poverty traumaand was like, okay.
Here you go.
Now what does that how do I feedthis into a fully fleshed out
character?
(14:24):
And I noticed that a lot ofpeople that I know that stayed
in That same sphere never hadthe ability to or luck or
privilege of breaking out ofpoverty are very bitter about
it.
I'm very hateful about it.
And some of them, not all ofthem, but some of them are very
bitter about it and I built thatbitterness into her that hate
(14:46):
that guardedness, especiallypeople that grew up in the
foster system.
You know, I worked before mycurrent corporate job, I worked
in a non profit and one of theprojects I worked on was
assisting the California fostersystem in aging out programs.
So, I got to interview a lot ofpeople who grew up in the foster
(15:07):
system and a lot of people whoaged out and the bitterness that
comes when you hit 18 andrealize, There is nothing there.
Nothing.
There is no safety net.
There is no one that, that, youknow, if unless your foster
parents want to, there is nosafety net.
There is no love.
(15:28):
There is nothing.
It is just a cold, hard cut.
And a lot of the fosters that Iinterviewed for that project
that I was working on, they gothrough this.
This period in the five yearspost aging out, of really deep
(15:48):
hatred for everyone.
Everyone.
And Cricket never grew out ofthat.
A lot of them do, but Cricketnever did.
Huh.
Devonnie (16:01):
And also I'm not, I'm kind of, I'm not mad at her that
she has that around her becausebabe, life has lifed you very
hard.
So I understand why yourdefenses are all are always up.
I understand why you have allthese rules, which by the way,
her rules are like my favoritethings.
Every time a new rule popped up,I would like highlight, this
yeah, I'm gonna add this to thecollection.
(16:23):
So I love that she has that likeShe has nothing, has no real
ties.
And so she created these rulesto kind of ground herself,
ground her personality, ground,or this is my moral code.
These are the things that I donot compromise about myself.
And I love that.
And yeah, I mean, yeah, justhearing that the Like that bead,
like you said, that you startedher with to kind of direct her
(16:44):
it, you did it.
Cause cricket is like a reallylove.
Yeah.
She's a super lovable character.
Even with all the trauma sheclearly carries around like
that.
I don't know.
There's just something reallyrefreshing about seeing like
you.
You aren't, you don't have to bethe things that happen to you.
You can carry them, they candefine the way you move through
life.
(17:05):
But she still shows upunabashedly herself.
I mean, sometimes do I wish shewould zip them lips?
Absolutely, girl! You are notextending your life expectancy
when you open your mouth somuch! So, I wish that tongue
lock was working, because itwasn't.
N. Caceres (17:22):
times when
Devonnie (17:24):
the I was like, oh my Can somebody fix the magic with
her tongue?
Why does she keep talking?
But still, even that.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (17:33):
her, and there's, because I'm working on the
second book right now, there aretimes when I, when she opens her
mouth and I'm just like, Ma'amplease, I'm not strong enough.
Can you please shut up?
You need to survive this bookand you are not making it easy
for me.
Christina (17:51):
I think everyone around her thinks the same thing
girl, shut up.
Zip it.
Devonnie (17:54):
please.
N. Caceres (17:55):
Especially Violet.
Devonnie (18:00):
Another one of my favorite characters.
I absolutely love Violet.
I just I You describe Violet'svoice so well, like the
porcelain and chinki, and so Ihear this really micey high
character, but then also, in mymind, she also talks like she
smoked, she's 300 years old andsmoked Newports every day of her
life, you know?
So I mix those two in my head.
Violet talks like this, but thenshe also is like real, I don't
(18:22):
know.
I love Violet.
Yeah, very cute.
N. Caceres (18:26):
Violet is one of my favorites too for that exact
reason.
Because it's so hard I see herso clearly in my mind.
But also, it's so hard to hearher because it's Your voice
makes no goddamn sense.
The things that you, that voiceis saying make no goddamn sense.
Devonnie (18:45):
No.
N. Caceres (18:46):
Please, do not
Devonnie (18:48):
yeah dainty and cute and dee.
But also, when she was gettingon Cricket about how she ended
up in this situation, becauseshe didn't know how to give
throat properly, I said, allthis coming from a doll?
I would be livid if a doll toldme it was talking to me.
That whole banter, the back andforth, also, A1.
But I supposed to respect myelders here or do I punch you in
(19:09):
your porcelain face?
Because what's happening?
What do we do here?
N. Caceres (19:15):
the thing I love about Violet, cause you just
like in your head, you'reseeing, I mean, I've got the
character art, And the characterart is literally a Victorian
doll with a ring, spiralringlets,
Christina (19:27):
yeah.
Devonnie (19:27):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (19:28):
And these big anime eyes, And you're just like,
could you imagine that, thatcreature, Talking to you about
how much it misses a goodmorning shit?
Christina (19:39):
I know.
Devonnie (19:43):
Poor Violet.
She don't need to eat.
She don't need to sleep.
She don't need to shit.
She says And I understand whyshe's mad.
I understand why she talks theway she talks, okay?
But yeah, definitely one of myother favorite characters.
Crickets top.
Violet's very close second.
I might Push Violet aboveCricket in certain situations
because Violet stands onbusiness.
She
Christina (20:03):
And she knows when to shut her mouth.
Devonnie (20:05):
That's yes.
N. Caceres (20:06):
in fact, know how to shut her mouth and play the
Devonnie (20:10):
hasn't been alive long enough to have developed that
skill.
N. Caceres (20:15):
No, and Violet also has a healthy fear of the Fae.
And Cricket's just Fuck thesepointy eared fucks.
Devonnie (20:23):
Yeah.
She still doesn't understand theseverity of her situation, even
with how much has been done toher within the first 15 percent
of the book, you know, likeshe's, she still hasn't grasped
just how different life is andhow you have to adapt these
survival skills that you'veacquired.
You need to mold them a littlebit to survive here.
(20:43):
It's very different than thestreets of Detroit.
Like you've got to fix somethingabout yourself.
I'm praying for her
N. Caceres (20:50):
She needs it! She
Christina (20:52):
She doesn't even listen, because they're like,
oh, don't ever enter a bloodoath, and she's yeah, I'm on my
way to do a blood oath.
N. Caceres (21:00):
With my mortal enemy,
Devonnie (21:02):
you know, in my mind I just see her skipping Like,
yeah,
Christina (21:06):
this is a good idea.
Devonnie (21:07):
what to do.
Don't tell me what to do.
Oh, poor cricket.
We love you so much
N. Caceres (21:12):
She is the epitome of that, that meme gif from
South Park of whatever, I dowhat I want.
Devonnie (21:19):
I actually know that.
I
N. Caceres (21:23):
She is the epitome.
Devonnie (21:29):
Oh, I
N. Caceres (21:29):
Actually, it's more like the Floyd Mayweather one.
It's more like the FloydMayweather one where he's I do
what I want, when I want, how Iwant.
That's
Devonnie (21:37):
Oh, yeah when he's getting closer and closer to you
Yeah,
N. Caceres (21:41):
that one.
Devonnie (21:41):
I love that.
I
Christina (21:43):
I see her as, I see her, the meme of her, it's the
girl burning the house behindher, and she's smiling at the
camera.
Devonnie (21:48):
the little yes Little kid the little girl
Christina (21:52):
she's
N. Caceres (21:53):
I mean,
Devonnie (21:53):
like
N. Caceres (21:54):
she does talk about burning shit down quite a lot.
Devonnie (21:57):
quite a bit.
Yeah, she does.
Absolutely.
Oh man.
Wow.
And listeners, that's yourcricket.
That is your FMC in this book.
So if you love what you'rehearing, please mark the release
date of this.
You definitely want to beintroduced to cricket because
she is very fun, but she willmake you want to throttle
something.
(22:17):
But yeah, okay.
It's always her.
You always want to throw her.
You're like, yes, I'm rootingfor you, babe.
Shut
N. Caceres (22:25):
Next page.
Shut the fuck up!
Devonnie (22:30):
And now it is time for or that We're gonna keep you on
your toes.
I know are you ready?
All right.
And there's no deliberation.
There was only hearing thequestion thinking 0.
2 seconds and then sayingsomething.
N. Caceres (22:47):
My body is ready.
Let's go.
Christina (22:48):
Okay, alright, here we go.
Physical book or e book?
N. Caceres (22:53):
Ebook.
Christina (22:54):
Hot or iced drink?
N. Caceres (22:57):
Iced.
Christina (22:59):
Which of the courts would you live in?
And the
N. Caceres (23:02):
None of them.
Absolutely fucking none of them.
Christina (23:06):
Good answer.
Okay, one bed trope or who didthis to you?
N. Caceres (23:14):
It can't be one bad trope because I like my sleep,
so who did this to you?
Christina (23:19):
Fair fair.
Okay, erotic horror or erotica?
N. Caceres (23:24):
RadicHorror.
All day, every day.
Devonnie (23:26):
Well, that's expected.
That should have been expected.
Okay.
Standalone or series.
N. Caceres (23:31):
Standalone.
Devonnie (23:34):
Yeah.
Fated mates or enemies tolovers.
N. Caceres (23:38):
Enemies to Lovers.
Devonnie (23:39):
I mean, yeah, that's fated mates though.
N. Caceres (23:42):
Hurt.
Devonnie (23:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Books that make you cry or booksthat make you laugh.
N. Caceres (23:50):
That Make Me Cry.
See aforementioned I Need ThatShit To Hurt.
Okay,
Devonnie (23:56):
That makes sense.
And then, in no particularorder, name your top three book
boyfriends of all time.
you can deliberate on because Iknow this is hard.
N. Caceres (24:06):
good, because my top number one is from a potentially
problematic author.
I don't know if she'sproblematic or not, but I love
that character.
Devonnie (24:16):
Let us hear
N. Caceres (24:17):
I don't really want to platform that, so.
Okay.
Roman from Feathers That Bleedby Jess Weiskopf.
Not Feathers That Bleed FeathersFrom The Sky.
then we'll go Well, shit.
I thought that was gonna beeasy.
Devonnie (24:36):
There's so many in the world to choose from.
N. Caceres (24:38):
There is.
And I'm so incredibly pickyabout book boyfriends.
I don't give that title easily.
I might like you.
We might vouch for the pages.
If I close that book and I don'teven remember your name, you're
not a book boyfriend.
Devonnie (24:54):
You're not a book boyfriend.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (24:55):
a book boyfriend.
I need to remember your namewhen the night is done.
Devonnie (24:58):
I love that.
N. Caceres (25:01):
from Black Sunshine, obviously.
Devonnie (25:04):
Yeah, I do.
I fear I do love him a littlebit.
N. Caceres (25:08):
Yeah, I hate his name.
Devonnie (25:10):
Me too.
N. Caceres (25:12):
I hate his name.
In my head his name is Abe.
I love Korean, but his name isAbe.
Devonnie (25:17):
that's it.
N. Caceres (25:19):
Fun story.
She pur, she purchased theomnibus for me at stimuli and
I'm 99.9 for sure.
Percent sure that in my signingI,'cause I put Sal's.
Okay, but he's no absalon.
And then I wrote I signed it.
I am 99.9% certain.
I misspelled his name'cause inmy head his name is a, okay,
Devonnie (25:38):
Ape, right, right, yeah.
That's so funny, I love Salthough.
N. Caceres (25:42):
so let's.
Damn okay, Roman hold on, I'vegot books over there on that
couch.
Devonnie (25:47):
Them real quick.
This
N. Caceres (25:49):
ah, shit.
Christina (25:51):
She didn't know there'd be a test.
Devonnie (25:53):
Right, I
N. Caceres (25:54):
I knew that was a good guess.
Devonnie (25:57):
Sorry.
N. Caceres (25:59):
Do I get to pick one of my own?
Devonnie (26:01):
Absolutely.
Okay.
N. Caceres (26:04):
from Obsidian Feathers.
love them.
I, those are my two baby angels.
They will never be maincharacters because I am mean to
my main characters and nothingcan touch them ever.
I love them.
Devonnie (26:17):
Okay.
I will give you that one.
Yes.
Okay.
N. Caceres (26:20):
Yeah, there, we did it.
Devonnie (26:22):
Yeah, we did it.
We got there in the end.
Yeah.
And what was the name of thefirst book?
Cause I don't think I know that
N. Caceres (26:27):
Roman is the main character, or the main love
interest's name, and it'sFeathers from the Sky by Jess
Wisecup.
It is a plus size romancebetween a I'm trying to figure
out how to say this politely.
A death obsessed personal deathobsessed huntress, and a very
(26:47):
angry vampire.
And it is very good.
Devonnie (26:51):
Let me go ahead and write that down.
Yeah, I'm very interested.
I'm
Christina (26:54):
love me a vampire.
N. Caceres (26:56):
Yeah,
Devonnie (26:57):
Period.
Love me a vamp.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (27:00):
I'm kind of in my vampire era right now.
So
Christina (27:02):
I never left.
Devonnie (27:04):
Yeah.
Christina (27:05):
it at 12, never
Devonnie (27:06):
Twilight.
She's addicted to
N. Caceres (27:08):
Vampire vampires were my first Mythological
creature like some people likegot obsessed with unicorns some
people mermaids vampires weremine so I never left either but
i'm in my vampire era becausei'm technically plotting Not the
book that's next but the bookafter that which is a vampire
one
Christina (27:26):
You're thinking one step ahead, and I'm ready for
that.
Devonnie (27:30):
I can't wait.
I love vampires.
And yeah, I mean, you definitelylots of fantasy recs.
So is there a specific authorthat got you hooked on
paranormal or like the fantasygenres?
Do you remember like you readsomeone and you were like, okay,
this is it.
This is.
This is it for me.
Christina (27:47):
Oh yes, I'm a Tolkien girly
N. Caceres (27:52):
So, my very first,
Devonnie (27:54):
will
N. Caceres (27:55):
the very first time I remembered an author's name,
because I've always been aprolific reader, but the very
first time I remembered anauthor's name enough that it
stuck with me was Tolkien.
The next time that reallyhappened for me was Jacqueline
Carey.
(28:16):
And then there's another authorin there that we don't talk
about him anymore.
He's a no, but he was also veryHe helped me understand that
crafting a unique voice as anauthor Where anyone can pick up
your book and flip to whateverpage and read five pages and go
(28:40):
I know the exact author thatwrote this because your voice as
an author is So strong.
He showed that, he showed mewhat that actually looks like.
We don't talk about him.
He's a, he is a no noname personnow, but he was very formative
on me both as a reader and as awriter.
Devonnie (28:59):
Now three, yeah, of your work, you have that I can
tell when I'm reading yourbooks, the way you write the
poetry, the beats thedescriptors, the flow of the
story, just, and how youdescribe scenes and characters,
how you have the charactersdescribed.
You have that where I could flipthrough, we can be like.
(29:20):
Who wrote this?
I know who did this.
Somebody cooked here.
Yeah.
So yeah, totally.
And I love that even though, Idon't know who this author is
and You know, we're not going totalk about him, we're not going
to talk about him, but I do lovethat you took that message
because that's that's somethingyou can apply and really learn
something and grow as an authorwith, just keeping in mind, so.
N. Caceres (29:40):
Yeah, and I'm always trying to refine that and find
more of who I am both as anauthor, but who I want to read
me, who do I want to sit downwith my books and have them
deeply resonate with them Iwelcome all readers, obviously,
but there are some people who Iwant to pick up my book, sit
(30:02):
down, and nearly vibrate withhow much they are seeing
themselves in the characters.
And that's who I write for.
Everybody else is welcome toread it, but that's who I'm
writing for.
Christina (30:14):
amazing.
Devonnie (30:15):
that.
Yeah, that's actually so sweet.
So tender.
N. Caceres (30:20):
You're like, who is this person?
Because that's not who I see onmy pages.
Devonnie (30:24):
Cuz that's not what I read in mine.
N. Caceres (30:28):
Listen, my
Devonnie (30:30):
Mine had me
Christina (30:33):
Shooketh.
Devonnie (30:33):
here.
Yeah here standing up.
I'm reading I'm like somebody inhere like Very much still
torturing myself to finish itand very scared, very concerned
about what I was reading, butalso,
Christina (30:45):
afraid to turn the page.
Devonnie (30:47):
Yeah so, hearing you say that, thank you.
I guess, trying to align thepeople here.
N. Caceres (30:57):
Listen, if Beyonce can have Sasha Fierce, I can
have Rose Reaper.
Devonnie (31:02):
Period.
Rose Reaper is your alter egoand we love her.
We love her.
N. Caceres (31:05):
If you think that, if you thought that the
cannibalism scenes in ObsidianFeathers were too much, don't
even acknowledge Rose Reaperexists.
Don't.
Devonnie (31:18):
Don't.
Because comparatively, thecannibal scenes in Obsidian
Feathers just felt oh, we'rehaving lunch.
Oh, this is a cute littleceremony compared to what you
get in mine.
Mine is what is happening here?
Why are we doing this?
Please stop.
So yeah, stay away from Rose ifthat's not your thing.
N. Caceres (31:38):
yeah, mine was writing mine.
Okay, so mine started becauseJessie, who is exclusive Palm
Beach Living, she actually sentme a link and she was like, Hey,
just being cute, but if you wereinterested in writing erotic
(32:00):
horror, here's this anthologythat's coming up.
Just saying.
And she sent it to me.
And I was like, I mean, I wasn'tplanning on it.
Devonnie (32:10):
Yeah,
N. Caceres (32:11):
Okay.
Sure.
So I read it and she's I wouldlove to see you in this
anthology.
And I was like, good.
Damn it, Jessie!
Devonnie (32:18):
you're right.
Oh,
N. Caceres (32:19):
And I was
Devonnie (32:19):
not peer pressure.
N. Caceres (32:21):
know what, and she can peer pressure me.
She is like one of the few whocan genuinely peer pressure me.
And I sat there and I was like,okay, I read the rules, I was
like, 10k.
I can do that.
Sure, I can do that.
And then I sat down and I waslike, what do I want to do with
this?
And I just fuck it, I'm justgonna start writing.
(32:43):
I'm just gonna start writing andsee where it goes.
And the more I wrote, the more Iwas like.
Oh, this can never leave mycomputer.
This can never leave mycomputer.
I mean, I'm gonna finish itbecause what the fuck am I on
about?
Devonnie (33:01):
yeah,
N. Caceres (33:02):
And I'm, but I'm like this is going in a password
protected file and it's beingburied.
And my dev editor, who is LizzieStrong, who also decided to to
apply for the anthology for,with me was like, we were in,
cause we do sprints together,writing sprints.
So she's you need to show methis.
Cause if you're, if you aredisturbed by this, I need to
(33:23):
read this.
Devonnie (33:24):
right.
N. Caceres (33:25):
And I sent it to her and she's I will break every
last one of your fingers and eatyour shins if you do not publish
this, it
Devonnie (33:33):
I mean, yeah thank God for her because it is horrific.
Okay, but in the best way.
N. Caceres (33:40):
got declined from the anthology, obviously,
because it was.
It was a little too extreme.
Yeah,
Devonnie (33:48):
telling you it's tough, but I'm happy you
released it yourself.
N. Caceres (33:52):
I had to because at that point I was like Okay, I
have something here then if thisanthology of horror writers
turned erotic horror writersCan't handle this And I and I
want to say for those of you whoare listening mine is not
spooky.
It is not spooky jump scare Itis just gruesome It is gruesome
(34:16):
and will make you questionyourself on every page.
Devonnie (34:21):
Yes.
N. Caceres (34:22):
Every single page you flip will make you go, Am I
okay with this?
What the fuck is wrong with me?
Why am I okay with this?
Christina (34:31):
Why can't I
Devonnie (34:31):
I was like, yes, exactly.
That was me.
Hey, target audience here.
That was me.
That was me reading mine becauseit is super gruesome, but like
for me, it's just like the wholetime I was reading, I just feel
what is, like why do I keepreading it?
At any point, I could have said,you know what?
This ain't for me.
This is a little too much.
Maybe this isn't something I canhang with.
But, again, I think that's alsoa testament to your writing.
(34:53):
I was invested in thecharacters.
I wanted to know the lore.
I wanted the backstory.
How did we get here?
Like, why?
Why is this happening, you know?
And for The, first of all,erotic horror itself as a genre
trips me out, cause I'm like,should I be afraid?
Like, when things really,
Christina (35:12):
horny and scared.
Devonnie (35:14):
right?
So, and I think that's where thedeep questioning of myself comes
into play, cause I'm like, I'mscared, but I like it a little
bit.
I like it.
Oh, yeah, that's nice.
Oh, but i'm scared.
So This is just too much soyeah, I don't know.
I think again.
Yeah, it's just your writing theway you write still I want to
(35:34):
read it.
I don't care if i'm scared andhorny like I want to read it I
guess Something.
I love it.
N. Caceres (35:41):
And horny and we'll call it scorny.
We're scorny.
Devonnie (35:44):
Squirny.
We're very squirny.
N. Caceres (35:47):
Very scorny here.
Devonnie (35:48):
squirny.
N. Caceres (35:53):
Yeah, mine I will be honest.
I was genuinely terrified topublish mine.
Genuinely terrified because
Devonnie (36:00):
What has the feedback been?
N. Caceres (36:02):
so I don't read my reviews.
Let me say that.
I don't even Goodreads is thebad place.
I don't even know my password tolog in.
I, we don't know her.
We don't know her.
I don't interact
Christina (36:13):
never heard of her.
Devonnie (36:15):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (36:16):
I am fully okay with the fact that at my grown age, I
cannot.
I can't read that because itaffects my writing.
Not because I want to lash outat that person, but because I
internalize it and it harms mywriting.
So I just, I choose not toengage with it.
So I don't know what thenegative side of it is.
Now my PA will pull positivereviews for me and will make
(36:41):
content for social media for mefrom it.
So a lot of people have said itreminds them of Mary Shelley's
Frankenstein, which
Christina (36:50):
Oh.
N. Caceres (36:50):
am not worthy a lot of
Devonnie (36:52):
It does though.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (36:54):
it does.
A lot of people have said thatit reminds them of Edgar Allen
Poe, which again i'm not
Christina (36:59):
I love that.
Devonnie (37:01):
I love Agra.
I see the connection.
Yes.
Yes.
N. Caceres (37:05):
One person said that it reminded them of the actual
book the fly versus the moviethe fly Which i'm like, okay, I
mean I don't see that, but okay.
But a lot of people have beenreally receptive to the fact
that at first, they are not downwith it.
(37:26):
Because of the whole scene we'redropped into.
Devonnie (37:29):
Right.
Exactly.
N. Caceres (37:30):
But by the time they get to the end, they're like, I
need to reread this because Ineed to see them suffer again.
Devonnie (37:36):
Yes.
That's how I felt at the end aswell.
Yeah.
When you first open it, we'restarting with a bang.
Quite literally.
So you're just no, there's mystomach hurts.
I'm going to vomit.
And yeah, you're right.
By the end of it, I was like,yeah.
They deserved it.
That, that,
N. Caceres (37:53):
that shit again.
We need to
Devonnie (37:54):
Yeah.
Run the tapes.
Yeah.
I love that.
I know.
It just went into a whole deepdive.
N. Caceres (38:02):
But it was scary because it's so not what I've
written before.
And it was training wheels off,balls to the wall, full on I'm
not going to pull any punches.
Because there were plenty ofspots in Obsidian Feathers where
I was like, ooh, I need topolish off that sharp edge.
Because dark romance readers anddark fantasy romance readers are
(38:24):
not going to be okay with that.
Let me polish that down a littlebit.
And I didn't do that at all formine.
I said, okay.
No, you're gonna you're gonnasuck it up if you want the hurt
you're gonna get this hurt
Devonnie (38:35):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (38:36):
And I didn't pull any punches none
Christina (38:39):
so I have a question for you.
Do you have any favorite readsfrom the last year you'd like to
share with us?
N. Caceres (38:45):
My favorite read from last year.
Yes Good morning, darling byazalea corley.
Devonnie (38:50):
know that one.
I'm gonna write that down.
Good morning, darling.
N. Caceres (38:52):
So good morning darling by azalea corley is
azalea corley's books are Shecalls them cozy horror romance,
and yeah, and she does it reallywell, and that's exactly what it
is.
It mixes the coziness of monsterromance with the horror elements
of some of your more paranormalhorror books.
(39:15):
And when I say horror, I mean,interview of the vampire level
horror, not Mine level
Devonnie (39:19):
Mine horror.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (39:22):
Entry level horror.
And all of her books are romancebooks.
So Good Morning Darling is abouta, she's gonna hate this when
she hears this, a Peter Panstyle demon.
And when I say Peter Pan style,I mean him and his shadow
disagree on a lot of things.
And his shadow is an animatecreature.
(39:43):
A sentient creature.
And he falls in love with thedaughter of the owner of a
funeral home that he works for,that he's indebted to,
Devonnie (39:55):
That is
N. Caceres (39:55):
it's
Christina (39:55):
is very
N. Caceres (39:56):
fantastic.
Devonnie (39:57):
Yeah, but it also sounds very cozy.
N. Caceres (39:59):
It is very
Devonnie (40:00):
that sound No, when you take out the other But yeah,
that sounds like the makings ofa cozy romance.
You know, it's always somethingvery close, like a little small
town.
I work here, you work there, werun into each So yeah, that
part, I can see the cozyelement.
N. Caceres (40:13):
so good morning darling.
So, Azalea Crowley is one of myfavorite authors for, I do what
I call is the sweet and sourapproach when I read is, I like
to read something really softand cozy and sweet.
Yeah.
And then turn around and readthe most stank, just absolute,
diabolical, hor horrific Dark
Devonnie (40:34):
That's I was just about to say that's Jordan.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (40:37):
I like to keep the toxicity of Dark Romance toxic,
but if you read too much of it,you get numbed by it.
So I like to balance it with thescreen.
Devonnie (40:49):
Yeah, Jordan always needs a palate cleanser Yeah
N. Caceres (40:54):
my favorite authors for that.
She's about to come out with anew one called I think it's
Wicked Taste?
Something like that.
Which is another demon.
And this one, so, I like to callAzalea Crowley's books hot pink
horror.
Hot pink horror romance, becauseit's if Lisa Frank wrote a
horror novel.
But added romance.
(41:14):
It's fantastic.
I highly recommend the new one.
The new one I haven't read yet.
But i've read the blurb and thenew one looks fantastic and it
is already pre ordered
Devonnie (41:24):
Yeah.
Oh, I love that.
Cool
N. Caceres (41:26):
one of my pre order, of
Devonnie (41:28):
Immediately.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (41:30):
As soon as it's
Devonnie (41:31):
Yeah.
There's something new.
That's mine.
N. Caceres (41:34):
Yeah, it's fine
Devonnie (41:35):
what about any anyone else any other books?
Or do you think we should startwith the Xaeli Foley?
N. Caceres (41:39):
Azalea Crowley let's see Jess Wisecup's coming out
with the second book for thatFeathers Feathers from the Sky
book that I was talking aboutearlier the vampire one.
I really I want to read it.
I haven't bought it yet, but Iwant to read it, is Calista
Neith came out with a succubus,an enemies to lovers succubus
book I think it was.
I would have to remember thename, but it's, looks fantastic.
(42:03):
Looks fantastic.
Christina (42:04):
that sounds so interesting.
I love
N. Caceres (42:06):
So, so Kalista Neith does Invoking the Blood and
Trial of Bone, Lace and Bone, orsomething like that, Bone and
Lace.
Fantastic books.
Vampires, Chef's Kiss.
But she came out with a new bookoutside of the Invoking the
Blood series.
And it's Looks so good.
Devonnie (42:27):
Really?
Yeah.
N. Caceres (42:28):
not whispers in the dark.
It's cruel obsession orsomething like that looks
fantastic It's on her it's onher instagram.
I highly recommend calista'swriting if you like my writing
calista's writing is better it'sfantastic
Devonnie (42:42):
Oh, I love that.
That's so nice.
That's a yeah, that's a good.
Yeah, I'm gonna add all ofthose.
Exactly.
We love a good wreck on the pod.
Callista Neath.
Cool.
Not me adding cozy horror inmore.
Yes.
Yeah.
TBR is a hell at this point.
Alright.
(43:02):
So, at Mine, erotic horror.
Salt Road, erotic horror.
You've written a couple erotichorror stories.
How is the process of writingthose?
Do you ever, I mean, you'vementioned a polishing officer in
things when you get there, buthave you ever gotten to a line
and was like No, that is toomuch.
I cannot do that.
(43:23):
Have you done it anyway?
N. Caceres (43:24):
Yes.
Yeah.
Christina (43:28):
She saw the red flag and walked right past it.
N. Caceres (43:31):
Right back.
Devonnie (43:31):
what a nice shade Yeah
N. Caceres (43:34):
So, mine was that.
Mine was I am not comfortablewriting this.
I'm gonna keep writing it.
That was literally my, thewriting process for mine was I
am very uncomfortable right now.
I am very uncomfortable.
I don't like what is coming offof my fingers.
It's good! Goddammit, it's good!
Devonnie (43:55):
so good.
N. Caceres (43:56):
But I'm not comfortable.
Devonnie (43:58):
Yeah
N. Caceres (43:59):
And the more I was uncomfortable, the more I pushed
through and made it moreuncomfortable for me.
So that was fun and interestingbecause it was very much a
challenge to myself to go, Okay,I see that you're uncomfortable.
And what?
Devonnie (44:12):
right.
N. Caceres (44:14):
Keep moving.
Christina (44:15):
womp.
Devonnie (44:17):
the other side of this discomfort?
N. Caceres (44:18):
Yeah, keep making it more uncomfortable.
And I'm very uncomfortable evenreading that book now.
I'm just like, who allowed me?
Who allowed?
Who allowed me to write thiswith my own fingies?
On purpose?
I'd like to say that mine is thereason why I no longer get
acrylic nails because I'veshamed them.
(44:40):
That was the last book that Iwrote with my acrylic nail.
I can't do these anymore.
I did bad things.
Devonnie (44:48):
The magic is still there.
It might be unleashed if youracrylics touch a keyboard again.
We have to contain it
N. Caceres (44:54):
And then Assault Road was more of guided horror.
So mine was like just I was leftunattended.
And bad things happened.
Christina (45:05):
Someone put a keyboard in front of her.
N. Caceres (45:06):
Somebody put a keyboard in front of me and I
was irresponsible with that.
The Salt Road was more So I hadbeen technically writing The
Salt Road in my head the entiretime I was writing Obsidian
Feathers because Sochi has somuch trauma that I needed to
know what that trauma was andhow that trauma happened.
(45:27):
So I was taking notes the entiretime I was writing Obsidian
Feathers.
So Salt Road was a natural rightfor me because I had already had
those notes.
I already knew what happened.
It was just finding theappropriate framework to show 27
years or 30 years of trauma andhow on those incidents and how
they played out and figuring outthe appropriate framework to, to
(45:48):
show that, cause that's a lot oftime.
So writing the Salt Road wasmore of okay, does this horror,
because I'm very meticulousabout the way I craft my
stories, is does this makesense?
Is this a pur if, does this havea purpose?
If this piece does not makesense and it does not have a
(46:09):
purpose, it does not movesomething along in the plot and
or show something specific aboutthe characters and or show how
we're getting to the ultimateresolution of the plot, it
doesn't stay in my books.
So with the Salt Road, it wasvery much, okay, is this
specific horror just something Iwant, I'm enjoying writing, or
(46:30):
is this particular gruesomething Something that needs to be
in the book in order to furtherthe plot and to further show
what we're trying to do here.
And there were several chaptersthat got carved off because they
weren't serving that purpose.
They were just revenge porn forme.
So, so
Devonnie (46:52):
It's really okay, is this necessary?
No, but at least I wrote it.
N. Caceres (46:55):
I wrote it, it was necessary for me to write at the
time, but it's not necessary forthe book.
So there's I think that a total,there was a total of five
chapters that got taken outsimply because it just, it was
filler and I don't like fillerin my books.
Devonnie (47:12):
Everything is used, like you said, to move something
along or to explain or to shedlight on something.
So I think we appreciate that inyour writing for sure.
Christina (47:20):
That is good, because sometimes you're just reading
and you're like, what is this?
N. Caceres (47:23):
Yeah.
Why do I even
Devonnie (47:24):
Why did we even care about this?
Yeah, that happens a lot inbooks.
So thank you for doing Thank you
Christina (47:29):
Doing the Lord's
Devonnie (47:30):
that out.
Yeah, do it a large work
N. Caceres (47:33):
something I hate
Devonnie (47:34):
me off
N. Caceres (47:34):
as a reader.
It's I hate, I literally justgave you my eyeballs for 50
minutes of bullshit you're not,that never, it doesn't matter.
Devonnie (47:44):
Never will come up again.
N. Caceres (47:45):
You wasted my time.
Devonnie (47:47):
Yeah.
N. Caceres (47:48):
And I hate that as a reader, so I try not to do that
as a writer.
Now, there are a lot of timeswhen, as a writer, I'm just
writing, and that's fluff.
And I, and on the readout, whenI'm, before it goes to my
editor, I'll start just cuttingthose things out.
But I needed to write it at thetime.
Doesn't mean it needs to stay inthe book, though.
Christina (48:10):
So, I have one more question for you.
As an indie author, what hasbeen the hardest part about
getting your stories out intothis world?
Into our world.
Getting your world into ours.
Devonnie (48:21):
Right.
N. Caceres (48:22):
Alright, y'all want secrets?
Deep secrets?
Devonnie (48:24):
Absolutely
Christina (48:27):
Dev loves it.
N. Caceres (48:28):
since it's just us three and nobody else is
Devonnie (48:30):
Right You're among friends.
Jordan's not even here.
N. Caceres (48:35):
Jordan's not even here.
Okay, so I have had anincredibly blessed through
Publishing I have not hit awhole lot of potholes or
obstacles everything that I haveencountered has been Something
that I could navigate around soI cannot say that there was
(48:59):
anything that for me Was toobig.
Everything else, like littleshit.
I have a lot of author friendsand one of the biggest things
that they have told me that istheir biggest problem is the way
(49:20):
they want to present themselves,the way they want to show up and
what their wallet can afford andsupport are three different
things.
They're not even two differentthings.
There are three differentthings.
I'm working on a project withthree of my author friends, and
we are working on puttingtogether a non profit charity in
(49:43):
which, once a year, authors willcome together and we will create
an anthology, and 100 percent ofthe proceeds of that anthology
will go to a debut indie authorwho will apply.
Every author that participateswill give every single debut
author that participates andthat submits feedback to help
(50:05):
them grow their career, whetheror not they win, they'll still
get feedback from a publishedauthor, somebody who already has
experience in the industry andspecifically within the genre
they want to write and publishin.
They'll get feedback from themon the first 10, 000 words of
their manuscript, their finishedmanuscript, and one author We'll
(50:25):
get 100 percent of that pot or100 percent of their publishing
fees from cover to editing, toPR, to everything fully public,
fully funded.
And then if the pot has morethan the next, the second best
author in that we'll get that,you know, it'll keep rolling
down until we completely zeroout the pot.
(50:47):
And then the next year we'll dothe same thing.
So I'm working on that because Iknow how much.
Money really impacts how youshow up as an author, and I feel
like how many indie authors Iknow, still, even after four or
five years of publishing, cannotshow up the way they want to
(51:11):
show up.
In front of readers cannot putout the quality of Art the
quality of covers the quality ofediting the quality of audiobook
or whatever quality That theywant even after four or five
years in the industry because ofmoney and I know how important
that is for a debut
Devonnie (51:30):
Yeah.
Oh my God.
That's such a good secret.
That is so, I mean, honestly,that is something that's so
amazing because as someone whoeventually wants to be a debut
indie author, just knowing thatthere are other authors out
there, even thinking like that,like I haven't even, first of
all, my, my stories are not evenfinished yet.
(51:51):
Like I have not hit the end.
So I have not even taken the twocells of brainpower I have to
think of how much it's going tocost me.
To put this in the world, butjust knowing that there's
someone else, like understandingthat plight, especially when
I've heard many indie authors,so I love supporting indie
authors, but that is a runningtheme that it's really hard.
It's difficult financially.
(52:12):
And you know, you take on allyou want.
These words out there.
But then you have this burden oflike, how do we get there?
How do I get from point A topoint B?
So yeah, I really love thatyou're doing that.
That just, Oh man, that just,that gave me chills.
Like I'm really excited aboutthat.
So thank you for sharing thatwith us.
I can't wait to see as thatdevelops.
Right.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (52:31):
next year will probably be our first year.
We're trying to do it right.
We're trying to do it right.
We're setting up the nonprofit.
We're setting up the business,like the business aspect behind
of it, behind it.
And we're trying to make surethat the things that we can
think of, we know for a factwe're going to make mistakes the
first year.
We know for a fact.
Like we have all come to termswith the fact that there is
going to be a big mistake thefirst year.
(52:52):
It happens.
Devonnie (52:53):
Yeah.
Learning.
N. Caceres (52:54):
of everything.
So, but while we're working ontrying to think through all of
those potentials, we're tryingto make sure that we're setting
up a structure that will allowus to make as little mistakes as
possible.
We're not gonna make the dumbmistakes of Hey, this is a black
author and she wrote a black assstory and it's only being judged
(53:16):
by white ass authors.
We're not making that mistake.
That's a fundamental mistake.
We're not doing
Devonnie (53:22):
That's a mistake.
Yeah.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (53:26):
we're not doing that.
But those nuanced mistakes arethings we can't foresee
happening.
We have a plan on how to dealwith that, but We're trying our
best to like really think thosethings out first.
Devonnie (53:40):
Yeah.
I think the gold and theintention is definitely going to
speak volumes.
There are growing pains with anylarge and new venture, so
hopefully everyone else willgive you guys the grace to
execute this the way that, youknow, you want to and the way
you want to show up for theseindie authors so that they won't
hold you to, I don't know.
N. Caceres (54:00):
Stupid standards.
Yeah.
Devonnie (54:01):
you to, yeah, I'm trying to be nice.
But yeah, because I can, Idefinitely, I think that would
be great.
I think so many people wouldbenefit from it and
Christina (54:09):
Yeah, please keep us updated on that
Devonnie (54:11):
Yeah, I'll definitely be looking out for that for
sure.
N. Caceres (54:13):
You'll see big
Devonnie (54:16):
Things big announcements, rollout, full
thing, red carpet, yeah.
And we'll be sure to share thatwith our readers as well.
And then Anne, is there anythingelse you wanted to share with
us?
Or any tidbit, you know, ifthere's any secrets you want to
spill, we'll take, we'll collectall the secrets.
Any oaths you'd like to sign?
Hehehehehehe
N. Caceres (54:33):
really bad about secrets.
Let's see.
Okay, so we know that I'mwriting the second book for
Devonnie (54:38):
For
N. Caceres (54:39):
That's what I'm working on right now.
You know, do you want to knowwhat the two after that are?
Devonnie (54:44):
Yes.
Immediately, yes.
Spectacular.
Give me 14 of them.
N. Caceres (54:48):
okay.
So the one immediately afterthat, and this is all assuming
that the world of Adosh does notexplode and I'm being shackled
to my computer misery style andforced to write the next book of
that world.
Because that world is so hugeand so deep and so rich that I
could write probably a thousandbooks off of it.
If that doesn't happen.
Devonnie (55:09):
Right.
N. Caceres (55:10):
The next book is about a girl, and this is pure
fantasy, like up until now I'vemostly done we start in the real
world and then we go intofantasyland.
This is pure fantasy, thisstarts in fantasyland.
There's a girl who grew up in afertility temple where all the
priestesses have a ton of kidsand nobody knows who the moms
(55:31):
actually are because they're allmoms.
And in a fit of rebellion.
She pledges to a death god, andthe death god tells her if you
can give me a sacrifice everynight for three years, and the
final sacrifice being you, Iwill marry you and you will be
my bride and we will take overthe world together, okay?
(55:55):
Okay.
Deb?
We're not even there yet.
We're not even there yet, madam.
So the book starts off two and ahalf years into her
accomplishing this.
And
Devonnie (56:09):
Lord!
N. Caceres (56:11):
she's already two and a half years deep.
And she's close to fit to hergoal.
And because of that, HolyPaladins have started roaming
the world.
People are becoming scarcebecause they they're not easy to
find because they're roamingaround in groups or being
escorted by holy paladinsbecause nobody knows what the
hell is going on.
They just know that people arefucking dying and they don't
(56:34):
know why.
An unimaginable amount of peopleare fucking dying and nobody
knows why.
or who the murderer is.
So she falls in with this groupof holy paladins that is looking
for the murderer that keepskilling people and sacrificing
them to the dark god.
The holy paladin leader guyfalls in love with her and is
trying to seduce her.
(56:56):
Meanwhile, she's in love withthe death god and is trying to
seduce the death god whiletrying to escape him.
Christina (57:05):
This is like a Mari episode in the fey realm.
Things are happening, everyone'scoming on stage, and they're
like, now this is happening, andthis is, you don't know what's
happening.
N. Caceres (57:14):
Yes.
So that's the next book.
Devonnie (57:16):
Okay.
Yeah, I'm into it.
I'm into it.
This is gonna be psychotic.
I can't wait.
The games that can be played.
The mind maneuvering.
The stealth.
The stabbiness.
N. Caceres (57:30):
He, the paladin guy, doesn't know he's trying to find
her.
Devonnie (57:37):
right.
N. Caceres (57:37):
He just knows that this cute girl joined his group
and he's escorting her to thenext big city.
And she's super cute and sweet.
She could never be anything butvery much a delicate flower.
She's very easily bruised.
Meanwhile, she's sneaking off atnight murdering fucking people.
And having sex with death godsin dark woods.
(58:00):
Meanwhile, he thinks she's notgiving up the pootang because
she's a virtuous girl who isjust so delicate and virtuous.
Devonnie (58:11):
Yeah.
She's just a flower.
Meanwhile, she's in the woods.
I love that.
Oh, the duality of a woman.
N. Caceres (58:19):
skeletons that she dug up out of the ground.
Devonnie (58:22):
Jesus Christ.
I can't wait to meet her.
Love her already.
Can't wait to meet her.
Yeah.
Right.
N. Caceres (58:28):
then the one after that is the vampire book where
she is she is part of a scribefamily, like their whole purpose
is, their sacred purpose andtheir sacred job is to keep the
records of this, these familiesthat have magic blood, that are
like magical and they're likethe rulers of the aristocracy of
(58:48):
the kingdom.
And for some reason, thisbloodline is starting to get
thin because people keep dying.
And she doesn't like it becauseit's fucking up her records.
Her records say they aresupposed to live another 50
years.
Why is this baby gone?
What?
This is fucking up and
Devonnie (59:07):
Ooh, this is a mystery.
N. Caceres (59:09):
very upset about it.
Turns out vampires who were whobecame addicted to this blood
because They're the thisaristocracy line has a specific
component in their blood thatmakes vampires high.
So they're druggies.
Devonnie (59:22):
Not the druggy vampires.
That's crazy.
You know, I love this.
I'm already seeing things shecould be saying.
She's such a studious person.
She's my, my calculations.
You should be alive.
Where are you?
Now we're on a little quest.
Now I'm on a
N. Caceres (59:34):
had I already had seven Felon books crafted and
placed on your shelf.
You are supposed to fill thesebooks.
What is going on?
You only filled two.
Your quota is not filled.
What why are you missing?
Why are you dead?
It's
Devonnie (59:50):
I love that.
I love that.
N. Caceres (59:53):
Dead, she's upset that her records are being
Devonnie (59:55):
Right, yeah, that's exactly what I mean.
She don't care about thesepeople.
She just want to know why thingsaren't going the way they're
supposed to go.
Wow, I was not expecting thosetwo big secrets.
But now us, and all the peoplelistening, know those secrets,
so thank you so much for sharingthat.
I love that.
(01:00:15):
Yeah,
N. Caceres (01:00:15):
are unhinged
Christina (01:00:17):
This is so exciting.
Cannot
Devonnie (01:00:19):
I know.
I
Christina (01:00:20):
it coming?
No, I'm just kidding.
Devonnie (01:00:21):
know, right?
N. Caceres (01:00:23):
So Aash.
So the next book in Aash, whichis a DA Dance of Broken Shackles
comes out March 28th, 2026.
The Death Fucker who, I don'teven know what the title of that
is yet, She comes out March28th, 2027.
And then the cleric or the clerkor the paper pusher, she comes
(01:00:47):
out on 28th of 2028.
Devonnie (01:00:50):
We love the March 28th.
That's a theme.
So yeah, just, you know,whatever year you're in, just
check what's happening on March28th to see what the vibes are.
N. Caceres (01:00:58):
I will always be putting out a full length book
on March 28th.
Novellas and small shortstories, those happen as I
decide to write them.
you can find me on most socialmedia sites as author ncaceres
so author n c a c e r e s.
You can find me on most socials.
(01:01:18):
I am not on TikTok.
Me and TikTok had a breakup.
I
Devonnie (01:01:21):
Yeah.
Yeah.
N. Caceres (01:01:23):
I'm not good at social media.
I'm really not.
I'm just not.
If I can't schedule it onMetricool, I'm not there.
I'm not there.
I can't.
I
Devonnie (01:01:31):
love that.
N. Caceres (01:01:33):
can't do it.
I want to.
I wish I had the time and theenergy.
I just can't.
But you can find me on mostsocial medias.
Author ncaceres.
A, author n c a c e r e s.
I predominantly hang out onthreads.
But if you go to any of mysocial media profiles and you
click on the link in my bio,there is also a link to my
(01:01:53):
Discord.
And you can join my Discord.
And I'm a lot more active there.
And you can talk to me directly.
I also have a pretty safe andinclusive and encouraging
community there.
So you're welcome to join thatas well.
But those are the two threadsreally threads and discord are
really the two plus places ifyou want to interact with me,
(01:02:16):
but I'm present on most otherplaces.
Christina (01:02:18):
Awesome.
Devonnie (01:02:19):
sharing.
And to our listeners, thanks forlistening, listening to us
ramble with N.
Caceres about her books.
If you're looking for moreRomance Recs, be sure to follow
us on Instagram and TikTok atRomance Recs Pod.
You can find our favorite bookrecs.
From our episodes as well asbehind the scenes content again,
that's at romance rex pod.
(01:02:40):
So make sure to give us a followand follow our friendly author
here because y'all probablywould have stayed posted on a
couple of things that wereshared.
The current books that are out.
Definitely check them out.
Be warned about mine.
Definitely check out Adosh whenit comes out on the 28th.
But yeah, make sure you'rekeeping up with us on
(01:03:02):
RomanceRecsPod and make sure togive us another follow.
We'll be back in another weekwith another episode.
Christina (01:03:10):
Thank you so much for coming to talk with
N. Caceres (01:03:12):
Thanks, guys.
Thanks.
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