August 12, 2025 • 64 mins
He put the wrong roof on. Yep—wrong color. Wrong shingle. Whole thing had to come off.
But instead of hiding it or blaming someone else… Brett Tesson OWNED it. Replaced the entire roof. No excuses.
And what happened next? That mistake became the best marketing moment his company ever had.
In this episode, Brett shares how Tesson Roofing became one of the most trusted roofing companies in the region—not by being perfect, but by doing the right thing when it’s hard.
You’ll learn:
- Why extreme ownership builds loyal customers (and crews)
- How Brett scaled by serving people—not just “selling”
- What to do when your crew messes up (and how to turn it into a win)
- Why frozen Snickers & Gatorade can win you more jobs than business cards
- The real secret to supplier loyalty (it’s not about price)
If you care about building a company rooted in service, honesty, and long-term partnerships—this is a must-watch.
Links:
https://tessonroofing.com
https://www.facebook.com/TessonRoofing
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What do you do when your team puts the wrong roof on
a customer's house?
If you're Brett Tessin, you ownit, fix it and turn it into
your biggest marketing win.
In this episode, we'reunpacking the power of extreme
ownership, true service andbuilding partnerships that last
(00:20):
Brett shares how Tessin Roofingscaled by focusing not on
shortcuts but on relationshipswith customers, crews and
suppliers.
Brett Tessin is the founder ofTessin Roofing in St Louis,
missouri.
Starting during the 2008recession, he grew from cutting
lawns to building one of themost respected roofing companies
(00:42):
in the region, all whilepioneering a W-2 sales team
before.
It was cool.
Brett's approach is deeplypersonal.
He serves his crews, gatoradeand Frozen Snickers, meets with
his suppliers to alignexpectations and leads a company
where doing the right thing isthe business model.
He's built a loyalty fromsecond grade friendships to his
(01:05):
entire staff by being someoneworth following.
If you believe in building abusiness rooted in service,
accountability and long-termimpact, this episode will show
you how it's done.
Let's jump in with Brett Tessonof Tesson Roofing.
Welcome to the Roofing SuccessPodcast.
I'm Jim Alleyne and I'm here tobring you insights from top
(01:25):
leaders in the roofing industryto help you grow and scale your
roofing business Brett Tessin.
How are you today, man?
Wow, my friend, how are you,good man Tessin, roofing St
Louis, missouri, missouri,missouri, missouri.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Yeah, I'm the Missourian, that's right,
missouri.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
All right, did I get that?
You can't go wrong.
No, and yeah, I got to know you.
I've been getting to know you alittle bit over in the Roofing
and Solar Reform Alliance andyou know, just for the audience,
this is a story that I toldAdam this to the other day.
I was like man, I remember whenI think I told you this too, I
was like I remember the firstcall you were on and I was like,
(02:09):
oh yeah, that guy's different.
Yep, he's, he.
He's thought about his businessa lot and he's put a lot of
effort into it and he's he'sreally executing on a high level
.
Um, I could tell it from theyou know what, as soon as you
open your mouth, like, oh yep,that's someone who's been doing
(02:31):
it.
So I'm excited to have you on,man, you guys have built a
fantastic business there.
And, yeah, tell everyone alittle bit about your story how
you got into roofing, how Tessinwas was born.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
Well, it's a startling company.
Back when I was 25 years oldI'm 41 now it was like a long
time ago.
Well, I mean, it was basicallyI owned a little long-haired
company, landscaping companythat I started when I was in
junior college and I enjoyed it.
You know, I was 19 years oldand I had a buddy that was in
(03:02):
the roofing industry and he'dbeen doing a little while and I
said, hey, man, I'd love to getin front of your sales manager
and just talk and visit withthem.
What you do sounds, sounds fun,you know.
And so, uh, after like sixweeks of just harassing my buddy
, derek, and going over to hisapartment with my resume resume,
(03:23):
knocking on his door, I'm likeman, derek, you're making it
hard on me, you know.
So he finally put me in frontof his sales manager, kevin, and
kind of laid it out, and it wasstraight 1099, straight
commission.
And I said, well, I would loveto learn it, as you guys do.
(03:43):
So from like 7 o'clock to 4o'clock I learned the exterior
contracting business and then Iwould go home, grab my trailer
and just go out and cut grassall evening and then cut grass
on the weekends and any type oflittle landscaping projects.
I couldn't handle mall shops,small walls and stuff.
(04:03):
I had another buddy, nick, thatwas doing it and we worked the
deal and he took care of it.
So I did that for another abouta year or so, year and a half,
and then I was able to step outto the theater contracting side
completely.
I keep it.
(04:31):
And then about two years or soafter that, I went off on my own
right there in 2008, 2009.
You know, the economy wasbooming.
Everybody was unique times, youknow.
But I didn't try it better andI felt as if I I had to put you
know, shed some light on it.
I thought, you know, I am verylow overhead in comparison to a
lot of these guys that havebuilt something up and have gone
(04:54):
through these really good timesbefore the bottoms fell out,
you know.
And so I just looked at it likeI had an advantage because I
didn't have that kind ofoverhead, and so that's how it
all started back in 2009.
Um and uh.
Yeah, it's been a fun journey,challenging, fun journey.
(05:16):
But adam is right, roofingsales is personal development in
disguise.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
in disguise disguise man, for sure, for sure.
That's a heck of a time tostart a business.
Yeah, you know that's a.
You know, one of the nicethings was labor was really
available at the time.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
It was, it was.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Yeah, we would do that.
There was no shortage of labor,for sure People were happy to
sell you material too, anything.
That's right.
Anything Like please, please,work with us.
But there wasn't as much, youknow, but that was a good
realization from a businessperspective, is you know, and
(06:03):
maybe that's an idea?
Do you feel like you're anoptimist?
Right, because you foundsomething to me.
I, what I heard is you foundsomething like an advantage.
That advantage you had like, oh, I have this advantage over
these guys like I'm, and I seeit here.
I may not have the experience,I may have only been in this for
a couple of years and you knowI was cutting lawns full time
(06:25):
and doing this part time, andyou know, but you saw this
advantage.
What do you think that was inyou, that that that noticed that
Like, is that something thatwas learned or innate, or just
in you?
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I like to consider myself a pretty positive guy.
You know I try to look at thepositive side of things and put
in what I want to get out.
And yeah, you know I had to.
I had to look at the brightside, which was I was off on my
own.
It was really scary.
(07:00):
I didn't know exactly what Iwas doing because in the lawn
care business I was not runningit like it.
You know, my personal account,my business account all in one,
and you know it was just thisbig mess.
But you know I thought, hey, aslong as I have money and you
know I'm able to pay the one ortwo guys I was working with me,
(07:23):
it was fine.
But when I got off into thisside of things a couple of years
later, that's when we realized,okay, we really need to be
diligent on how we account forthings.
And everybody back then had afull page in the yellow pages,
(07:46):
in the phone book, right, likeyou weren't really a good
version company unless you had afull page.
Now, if you were maybe twopages next to one, another right
, and that was like a gazilliondollars to me.
It's like there's no way Icould participate at that level
of full page, like I'm lookingfor, like this little guy here,
(08:08):
you know, like, and so, uh, yeah, I didn't just go out and
create it, but yeah, yeah, itwas my look back now I'm yeah,
would it be this different?
I would do that different.
But you know, I'll get to those, that's that you know we'll get
to those.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
That's that's great hindsight.
We'll get to some of that.
Those are lessons for others.
How did you get it started?
I mean, the economy wasn'tgreat.
The you know everything was,you know, kind of slow.
What, what was the?
What were those initial yearslike?
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Well, they were a little challenging and you know,
I talked to my mom at the timeher and I, you know really close
.
I grew up a single familyhousehold, just her and I and I
told her, you know, look, I justdon't like what I'm seeing and
the way people are being treated, because what I saw that was
(09:00):
going on in the industry was thecustomers weren't being taken
care of at the level theydeserved to be taken care of,
and a lot of that was out of mycontrol, because once you get it
turned over to anotherdepartment, if they don't take
care of things the way that youpresent them, then it makes you
out to look like a liar, right,and I don't want to be a liar.
(09:22):
So I had some customer servicechallenges there.
There were crews that weren'tnecessarily getting paid or, if
they were, then weren'tnecessarily getting paid
correctly, and so I felt like,you know, I believe I can serve
the clients better, I believe Ican bring more fairness to the
(09:44):
crews and if I just focus onworking hard for people, serving
them at a high level, um, andnot try to get too fancy, stick
with what I know, not get toofar outside of my comfort zone,
which is really easy to do whenyou need revenue.
(10:06):
Right, you need revenue.
Now you're, you know, you knowroofing, siding gutters.
You don't know anything aboutfencing.
You don't know anything aboutfencing.
But there's a $4,000 fencethere, you know.
It's like, well, all right,maybe scale it back a little bit
and focus on what you know.
So that was challenging, had tolearn that, and yeah, so just
(10:32):
really focused on service,whether that would be servicing
the client or servicing thepartnerships that I had with the
crews and the suppliers.
And that's how I view thosethings.
I view all three of thosethings as partnerships.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
I love that.
Let's go into a little bit moredetail on that, because that's
what everyone says they want todo, right?
It's a very good expressionthat comes out.
It comes out in words, but alot of times it doesn't get
executed in practice.
So let's start with that.
Customer partnership what?
Speaker 3 (11:20):
you know what were the things that you implemented
early on and then, have you know, have one of those things
evolved into over the over theyears?
One of the things was so weused to run everything off of
Manila folder paper system.
Right, that's what you know.
Roofs were red, siding wasgreen, we had it color
coordinated and it worked, butit wasn't something that I
(11:47):
thought was going to be able tobe scalable at the level that I
wanted it to be.
But most importantly is beingable to communicate with the
customer and making sure thattheir wants, needs and desires
are met and they're met in atimely manner.
So that was something, um, thatI learned early.
You know, coming from the lastcompany that I had worked for.
We had a CRM system.
It was extremely robust,extremely detailed, and you know
(12:10):
I'm not an extremely detailedguy, I'm a salesman at heart,
right.
So you know, bringing that in, Iwas fortunate enough to have
Guy Sack that 30 days in tostarting the business.
Um, I convinced him to come,come on board and work with me,
and he's a smart guy, he's got agood computer background and he
(12:34):
really complimented in theareas that I left, and so, uh,
we learned that, yeah, we had toservice the customer, answer
our phones, and one thing that'sgreat about this business is
like, if you answer your phone,when you do what you say you're
gonna do.
When you say you're gonna do it, I mean it's Gallup, top 5%,
(13:00):
top 10% the clouds open up, likethe sun starts shining it's
like, wow, I just repeat thismodel.
You know, and you straightpeople, the way you want to be
treated.
But yeah, I mean, from anexecution standpoint it was, you
(13:26):
know, really helpful to have asystem and a CRM system rather
early into it, you know.
But there was a cost associatedwith that and we didn't have,
you know, we didn't have muchmoney.
I had people that owed me money.
You know, leaving previousemployer.
You know how does that work outfor most sales reps when they
(13:49):
leave their previous employer inthis industry generally not
well right.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
That's one thing I thought needed improvement too
they usually get a bonus, likeif the money comes in with a
little extra just to top it off.
Hey, have a nice yeah exactly,exactly.
Yeah, okay, that to me it makesa lot of sense and that's the
(14:15):
foundation, right.
But it's easy when you're small, yeah, or maybe easier because
you're you're so close toeverything, um, what, I don't
know if we talked about this atall, but, like, how many roofs
did you guys build last year?
How many reps do you have now?
(14:36):
Like, you guys are at at scalenow, right, yeah, um, and then
how do you, how do you carrythat into a team the size of
yours?
Yeah, before we carry on withthe episode, let's give a shout
out to one of our sponsors.
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(14:57):
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How many roofs did you guysbuild last year.
(15:41):
How many reps do you have now?
Like you guys are at at scalenow, right, yeah, um, and then
how do you?
How do you carry that into ateam the size of yours?
Speaker 3 (15:54):
yeah, so we have 40 people here in the office and
sales, uh side of things,outside of the subcontracted
crews and really you just got todo it one person at a time and
let you know when you sit downwith someone.
(16:14):
You know we want people withservant hearts, right.
We want to know that you careabout the end result, you care
(16:48):
about the things that we'vebuilt this business on it's
honesty, integrity, doing theright thing.
You know it's easy to say hey,you know I want to do this or
this is who we are.
But what it boils down to, Ithink, really is do you own your
shortcomings?
When you make a mistake, do youown it?
Do you try to pawn it off?
Because sometimes with mistakescome pain, and a lot of times
that pain is money.
Are you willing to pay to dowhat's right?
(17:10):
I mean, if you're not, ifyou're not willing to step up
and own something you know,extreme ownership is one of my
favorite books, right?
I'm, I'm sure a lot of youlistening but like, if you're
not willing to step up and payto make something right, then
are those?
(17:31):
Do you really believe in thevalues that you say you believe
in?
You know, earlier this morning.
Uh, I've had a sales manager andone sales reps come in and sit
down with me and um in and sitdown with me and um, the sales
rep.
We put the wrong color roof onthe person's house.
(17:52):
They picked a tan roof and thentexted him later and said, hey,
we want to go, maury black,right, and and so really it's a
breakdown of communication onour end.
And the lady, what her desirewas either A you give me all my
money back or you change therules file, and so we're
(18:14):
changing the rules file and thatsucks.
But you know what I mean.
That's who we are, right, yes,and that's who we want to be.
That's who we want to be knownas a company that does what they
(18:37):
say they're going to do, and Ithink that is really part of the
execution.
Stop being up when it's hard.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Yeah, that's a big one to step up on, but you have
to right.
And now what can come out ofthat on the other end is a
customer that has much morerespect for your company, that
(19:08):
has much more respect for yourcompany.
They will never say you know,my goodness, they look they made
a mistake internally and theycame out and replaced my roof
with the right color.
Like how much, what?
What kind of story then I thinkabout that?
Like what kind of story getstold about your company outside
of your, your interactions withwith that person, right with
(19:29):
that homeowner?
And it's the right thing to do,it's the right thing to do,
it's the right thing to do overthere replacing this brand new
roof and the neighbors are likewhat are they doing?
Speaker 3 (19:43):
well, they put the wrong color shingle on, but they
came back out and they'remaking it right.
So you know that, oh my god.
That right there, I think,speaks volume, because ruch
aren't cheap.
Right, and for the consumer,you want to know, if you're
going to part ways with a lot ofmoney, that the company you're
(20:04):
giving it to is going to do theright thing.
And that's what reallyseparates a lot of companies is
do you do the right thing?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
What other things stand out to you that in that,
in that customer relationship,that customer partnership, the
customer journey that you guyshave done over the years, that
has made a difference with thecustomer, maybe also with your
team.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
I think generosity is extremely important.
I think when people know thatmoney is not what motivates your
day-to-day everybody look, wegot to make money and we should
(20:55):
make a lot of money.
And I think Adam says it rightMoney is the thank you note.
That's how you can tell whetheror not you're doing well.
Um, but when people know thatyou're willing to listen, to
hear them out, and decisions arebeing made not solely based
(21:20):
around the cost of the decision,based around what is the right
decision in this particularsituation and you know it
doesn't you don't always walkaway feeling financially well
about it, but you try tominimize those.
(21:41):
And the good thing about it isyou learn a lot really quick
when you lose money or you paymoney.
I always try to look at thebright side of things and so,
yeah, make decisions based uponwhat's right, not what's
(22:04):
motivated by money.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
And when you are that person and people know that
that's who you are they knowthat when things are don't
always go right, that you'regoing to stay there as you were
saying that, as soon as you saidthe word generosity when you
started that conversation, whatit made me think of is how good
(22:29):
your team must feel knowing thatyou guys are doing that or are
willing to do that.
It's not a conversation of allright guys.
We've got to figure out how tohide this one.
Of all right guys.
We've got to figure out how tohide this one.
Yeah, that's a, you know, likenow you're putting them in an
ethical dilemma.
(22:50):
You know right, when they cometo work, you know, you know, all
of a sudden they're in anethical dilemma, like, oh man, I
got to lie to this homeownerbecause we screwed up and I
don't want to, we can't, youknow, we don't want to take
ownership of it because we'regoing to lose money on it.
And you know, boy, I could seethat in the like how that would
(23:12):
have a huge impact on the team.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
uh, when people believe in the company they
believe and the people that leadat the company, I think it
gives them a lot of peace ofmind and confidence when they're
in front of the consumer right,because they know that they
have a support group behind themthat is going to step up if
something happens.
(23:36):
We're in roofing.
It's a high risk business.
I mean, at the end of the dayand my guys hear me say it all
the time I say we're riskmanagers.
That's what we do Every singleday.
We're risk managers in theroofing exterior contracting
arena.
Our first job is to manage riskand it's very risky business.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
It is.
I don't think I mean everyonelooks at it for the opportunity
that's in front of them, like,oh, there's a lot of money,
there's a lot of this, there's alot of that.
But if you, if you think aboutthat like that's what you're
doing on a day-to-day basis, howdo you manage your partnerships
(24:25):
?
What are the partnerships thatyou have with your
subcontractors?
In those relationships, they'refantastic.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
A lot of guys have worked with us for many years.
They're very loyal to us.
They appreciate the partnership.
I mean.
We constantly my projectsupport.
Guys are constantly buying thecruise launches.
(24:54):
We're, you know, dropping offgatorades, ice or you know all
the things that you should bedoing, really right.
Uh, you should be doing that,bringing frozen snickers out in
the afternoon.
Give the guys a second round ofenergy.
Show them that you care, likewhen you show people you care
when you act like a human being,um, and you treat people the
(25:17):
way that they should be treatedand not treated as a commodity.
We treat materials as acommodity, not humans, right?
So we do those things and weinstill that in our guys to to
want to make sure that thosepeople are happy that we do
business with, whether it's oursuppliers.
(25:39):
How do we make our supplierslife easy?
Well, we, we get out in frontof what it is we need from them.
We sit down and we setexpectations.
I sit down with every singleone of my suppliers at the
beginning of the year and I saywhat, what are you putting down
on your card?
(25:59):
Your sales report for me, likeI want to make sure that we're
both on the same page so thatyou don't go make this
unrealistic number and expectsomething out of me that you're
not going to get.
I want you to be rewarded andtaken care of, but I want to
(26:22):
make sure, because what we dowith them affects their overall
goal.
So if we can sit down, get onthe same page, that's really
important.
And then do what's expected ofus really well Send over orders
in advance.
We usually book our jobs outthree to five weeks in advance
(26:43):
and that makes it really easyfor the suppliers to do business
with us.
And some of the byproduct ofthat is when they sit down and
talk about pricing, they knowthat we're going to make it easy
to do business.
They know that we're going topay them on time.
Those are ways that you becomegood partners with your
(27:10):
suppliers, with yoursubcontractors, right.
You hold everybody Well.
You hold yourself accountableto that same level.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
So that's the there's .
It's amazing how, how manyadversarial relationship
dynamics are usually created inthese relationships.
Like, if that's a, those areprobably a whole lot of jumbled
words to say about it.
But like, like you're thinkingof how do I win versus how do I
(27:47):
win it with my, with my supplier, distributor, Like, how do I
win, how do I get more?
How do I?
And then and then, same thingwith your subs and same thing,
with that mindset of alwayswinning.
It's like an adversarialrelationship.
What I love what you just saidis man, let's go sit down.
I want to see the metric youhave for me.
Like, let's make sure we're onthe same page.
(28:09):
We have a budget, we have ourgoals and our expectations, our
KPIs that we're trying to hit.
Do they match up?
Do they align?
Is this something you know?
Because it all comes down toexpectations, Absolutely Right.
And with customers, with subs,with your distributors, if they
(28:37):
have an expectation that you'regoing to buy X amount and all of
a sudden you're not buying thatamount and they're, and what's
going on over here, how comethey're not buying from us or
what?
You know that?
That that's insightful.
What, what, what has come outof some of those conversations.
What have been some of the bigthings that have helped your
(29:01):
business get to where it isbecause of that type of thought
process and intentionalityaround those partnerships.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
Well, people, you become a desirable partner,
right?
People want to do business withyou.
They know what they're gettingwhen they do do business with
you.
There's a peace of mind factorthere and really I mean, if you
got someone that's easy to dobusiness with, that's going to
(29:33):
pay you on time, you're probablygoing to give that person some
pretty aggressive pricing,probably going to give that
person some high level service,right, yeah, if I see delivery
drivers out and about, let's sayat a gas station, if I see one
of the delivery trucks in a gasstation, I will intentionally
(29:54):
pull in that gas station, figureout how many guys are on that
truck and give them each moneyto say, hey, thank you for what
it is you do, thank you fordoing what you do day in and day
out, risking, sweating, doingeverything you do for our
company.
I need you to know that.
We appreciate it and werecognize it.
Right, let triplesples downwhen they pull up to your job
(30:18):
site and they see that it's atest on route.
Okay, and it's maybe it's afriday afternoon, it's the last
drop.
They, they treat that delivery.
I think, from what I can telland I tell by the fact that we
don't have the problems thatsome of my other contractor
friends have.
(30:39):
You, just when you showappreciation, um, it goes a long
way and it doesn't cost much,If anything can show your
appreciation to people and begenuine about it, and so I think
that what we get out of it, Ithink the byproduct of that, is
(31:00):
people work hard to serve andmake sure that we're happy
because we know that we're doingthe same in return for that.
Like we'll send lunch to asupply house, right?
I mean, launch brings peopletogether.
I mean look at me, I know I,but it does.
(31:23):
It brings people together andand and that's just there's one
way.
As we show our appreciation andI think, in turn, people, um,
take care of us.
They just take care of us.
That's what I say.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Yeah, If you were to give advice to someone who
wanted to build a businessrooted in this type of service
and partnership mindset, whatwould what would be some
principles that you would, thatyou would say that they should
follow to do that?
(31:58):
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If you were to give advice tosomeone who wanted to build a
business rooted in in this typeof service and partnership
(33:02):
mindset, what would?
What would be some principlesthat you would that you would
say that they should follow todo that?
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Well, first and foremost, be honest.
Right, Be honest even when it'snot easy to be honest or you
have to make those difficultsign calls.
That is so important.
I can deal with issues, a lotof issues, but if someone starts
(33:34):
to lie or become dishonest, butif someone starts to lie or
become dishonest man, it reallyit's hard to do business with
that person.
If someone comes in and theylie to me, that discredits a lot
and I question whether or not Iwant to continue to do business
(33:54):
with them.
It's probably going to be no.
Want to continue to do businesswith them?
It's probably going to be no.
And that's whether you, youknow, be honest with your crews,
be honest with your suppliers.
So honesty, obviously the bigdeal, right.
I would say make sure you havethe desire to serve right,
(34:19):
You've got to have that desire.
If you don't have that desire,you may want to reconsider what
it is you do, um in thisindustry.
So that desire.
But humility, this, thishumility, is a big one.
I think when guys start tobecome, they start to get to a
(34:47):
certain success level.
They can change who they are.
They can, they can start, they.
Sometimes they forget wherethey came from, you know, and
because they've been, you know,handsomely rewarded financially.
(35:22):
Loyalty, being loyal is veryimportant.
Those are the three things Ithink I would really want to
make sure that we're at the top.
The humility.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
One is a that that's a big one because, um, boy
things, yeah, a lot of people, Idon't know if they say they say
it a couple of different waysright, like I mean, the money
changes you or is it justamplifies who you really were?
Right, Like you know.
So, if you're kind of analready you know, you know, get
(36:03):
a little money, um, you know,you know.
So I mean that that that's abig one to focus on, and and
that, being grounded in whereyou came from, and and and do
that you, you've become veryteam focused also, right, and
the, the service in the serviceof your team.
(36:25):
Do you feel that that has keptyou home, kept kept you humble
in ways, or is that just your,your, your that that you love to
serve?
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Yeah, yeah, I do love to serve.
Yeah, yeah, I do love to serve.
I have a mom that comes intwice a week.
She always makes sure that I'mhumble.
I love my mom.
She's great.
We call her Mama T here at theoffice.
She's with this infamous Mama Tand supported some contractors.
(37:00):
No, yeah, being able to servepeople.
It brings me a lot of joy and Isurround myself with
like-minded people that havethat, and some people you know,
some guys you have to have theconversation with, especially
(37:21):
when they start making a lot ofmoney.
I've had to have thoseconversations before and, um,
they're not always the easiestconversations to have but, um,
sometimes they're warranted andthey're and they're really
needed, really needed.
And, um, you know one thing, Ithink when you get to a certain
level in life, you have anobligation to give back right,
(37:45):
and giving back can be a greatway to bring some humility to
what it is you do and to knowthat it's way bigger than you.
What you do is way biggerthere's, there's, it's much
bigger out there than you do.
So be humble, be thankful.
(38:06):
Yeah, you know, it's simple.
I'm thankful every day when Ican come into a place of
business, that I get to workwith some of the most amazing
people and, yeah, it's stressful, but I get to do it with people
that I truly love and careabout and that care about me and
(38:29):
the business in return.
So that's one.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
I remember you.
I remember you telling me Imean some of the people that you
, that you work with, you'veknown since elementary school.
Yeah Right, like you know,what's it like building
something with people that haveyou know, that knew you, you
know, as a fourth grader, youknow, or as a you know, yeah,
that new fourth grade Brett, youknow new fourth grade brett,
(39:00):
you know.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
So, um, actually, the guy derrick that I was
referring to earlier, uh, andthe sales manager, kevin, uh,
that, like those guys, got meinto the industry.
Both of them work here now.
They do great, fantastic guys.
But I mean, yeah, it can bechallenging when you know, I
have guys that I've been friendswith since second grade.
But you know, one of the thingsyou know, I mentioned loyalty.
(39:21):
These guys are loyal, they'revery loyal to me, they protect
the organization, right, um, andand that I mean, how do you put
a value on that?
So, yeah, you know, the dynamiccan be there and some of these
(39:47):
guys are like your brothers, butat the end of the day, they
know that I'm the one that hasto make the hard decisions.
When the hard decisions getmade and when we win, it's
generally a reflection of whatthey've done, you know, and and
so, yeah, it's rewarding.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
Challenging, yeah for sure the question that came up
in my mind around that is youknow well, I think loyalty is
earned.
How have you continued to earntheir loyalty and the rest of
your team's loyalty?
Speaker 3 (40:19):
they get to see how I respond in the difficult
situations that are presented,and those are generally the
situations where that's when therubber meets the road who, who
are you?
Are you actually who you sayyou are, and and.
(40:43):
And.
They get to see that andthey're part of that, and I
think they know, when there'sissues, whether they need help.
I need help.
They know that that I'm thereand it's important.
(41:04):
That really breeds loyalty.
They know I care, they knowI'll do whatever I have to do
for them, and so I don't know,if you can't be loyal to a guy
like that, then it ain't.
Speaker 1 (41:20):
No, yeah, so be someone, who, who, who you can
be loyal to Right, or people canbe loyal to earn their loyalty.
You know, you've, you've talkedabout like you're one of your,
your role in your company andkind of what you do on a
day-to-day basis.
(41:40):
A lot is painting a vision andmotivating people.
Can you unpack what that lookslike inside your company more on
a day-to-day basis?
Speaker 3 (41:50):
Yeah, well, you paint the vision starts with the
vision, um, and really servingpeople is the vision.
Right, you do you want to behappy with where you're at and
where you're going in life, andif you do, um, if you truly care
(42:16):
, you know people.
People want to be appreciated,people want to know that they're
making a difference, peoplewant purpose, right, and so when
you can show people this iswhat we do, this is the purpose
(42:41):
behind it and the byproduct isthis, right, and when you, when
you paint that vision for themand they can become part of
something that's bigger thanthem, that attracts the right
people, right, they have to buyinto it.
(43:01):
Nothing's given.
We don't give anyone anything.
You earn it.
Right, we set you up forsuccess, absolutely, we set you
up for success.
We invest in people.
That's what I do.
I invest in the stock market.
If I'm willing to take moneyand put it into a company that
I'm not even on a day-to-daybasis, but I'm not willing to
(43:25):
take money and put that intosomeone that I believe can be
part of improving the vision,you know what am I doing?
I do believe in investing inpeople, heavily investing in
people, and they know that, andI proved that right up front,
(43:47):
and so when they see that theyare, generally, they'll buy into
the vision.
They'll follow your lead andlead, and you have to hold them
accountable.
We have a lot of young guyshere, a lot of people in their
early 20s, uh, and you know,they want to make a difference,
(44:08):
they want to feel like they'remaking a difference and they
want purpose.
Right, I think that's humannature.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
Definitely.
What is what is investing inpeople?
Look like, what is you know?
I mean building people up.
Is it, is it the training thatyou're bringing to them?
Is it like, what are the?
What are the tangible thingsthat you're investing in and
you're for your people?
Speaker 3 (44:34):
Yeah, so all of my people are w2 people, so they
all get paid a salary, right,even the sales reps.
Um, all of my people getcompany vehicles, company gas
cards.
Um, they're all my vehicles arenice, they're newer vehicles
(44:57):
and they get all of the gear.
They need the safety, they needeverything.
So, right off the bat, they see, wow, you know, a lot of people
in this industry are just 1099.
And, and there's nothing wrongwith that.
That's how I started off too.
There's nothing wrong with that, right, it really helps from an
(45:19):
overhead.
You know, we can unpack that asa million ways, yeah, but but
making that initial investmentin there and showing that, look,
this is what we're going to doto help see you succeed, this is
what we expect in return, andwe're going to put the time into
(45:40):
it, we're going to put theresources into it and we're
going to make sure that you havethe personnel in place to help
support you.
It costs a lot of money to doall of that, and I think when
people realize that you trulycare about their success, you
(46:02):
know, my number one job here isto be the lead servant.
My number one job here is to bethe lead servant, to serve
people at a high level so theycan go out and service the end
customer.
And when they see that and theysee the financial commitment,
the time commitment, we usuallyknow pretty quick whether or not
(46:26):
they're going to last.
We don't hire big bulks ofpeople at one time.
I have a lot of friends that dothat and they have some success
with it and whatnot.
It's a different model but forus we sit down on a one-to-one
(46:47):
basis and we let people knowwhat we bring to the table what?
Speaker 1 (46:53):
uh, when?
When looking at your journeyfrom you know, from 2008, 2009,
as you were, as you were going,what was the journey of this
investment?
Because, because I you know,it's tough in the beginning,
right Like there isn't a lot toinvest.
So for someone that's buildingto this level, when does it make
(47:21):
sense to make those kind ofinvestments?
Or and then, on the other sideof that, what can you do when
you're not able to?
Or or maybe something like that.
I know you're enjoying theepisode, but let's give a shout
out to another one of oursponsors.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
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Speaker 1 (48:11):
when does it make sense to make those, to make
those kind of investments?
Or?
And then, on the other side ofthat, what can you do when
you're not able to?
Yeah, or or maybe maybesomething like that.
No, that's a good question.
Speaker 3 (48:22):
Um, one thing that I see, um from a lot of
contractors that are startingoff that are new, is they don't
write a business plan, right,they don't have a real roadmap
on where they're going and howthey're going to get there.
(48:45):
A lot of them were just reallygood salespeople and they know
that if they can just showpeople how they do what they do,
then they too can be successful.
And that's how I started offright, and that's how I got a
(49:06):
lot of friends that work here.
I said this is what I do do,this is how we do it, um, and
these are the end results whenthey get it this way.
Um, so you got to figure outwhat your business model looks
like, right, because in thisbusiness there's two lines,
there's 1099 and there's w2,right, and so each of them have
(49:27):
different, uh, conversationpieces to them.
Uh, and you have to figure outwhat the cost is.
You know, with the with thebusiness plan, comes the
budgeting.
So that's one thing that it'snot always, especially for
salespeople.
We're not always superinterested in sitting down and
(49:49):
creating budgets and figuringout what things are gonna talk.
What I like to do with peopleis is reverse engineer the
results and figure out wheretheir income, where they want
their income to be, and thenwork backwards from there.
Adam's got an awesome incometracker, um, that people put
(50:09):
together.
But there are two separatelengths and each of them have
different answers to them.
But I think at the end of theday, you gotta figure out your
roadmap and your road map andit's important to keep your
blinders on.
(50:30):
It's very easy to look over andsee what someone else is doing
and think that you have to dothat right.
You have to think of it likeyou're in the Kentucky Derby and
you're the horse running therace.
You can't look over.
There's blinders on thosehorses and they just look at
(50:52):
what's in front of them.
They know that they've put inthe training, they've done what
they needed to do to get there.
Now run your race, stay focused.
Don't worry about the otherguys.
You need to know what it isthat they're doing, how they're
operating, to an extent, butstay focused and run your race.
Speaker 1 (51:16):
Yeah, there's that.
One of my favorite memes is thepicture of Michael Phelps
swimming and the other guys inthe lane next to him about a,
about a, about a whole bodylength behind him, like looking
over at him while he's swimming.
You know, um, and that that's agood.
That that's that that's a good.
That's good advice, also,because everyone's journey is
(51:41):
going to be different.
Everyone starts in a differentplace.
Everyone, you know everyone hasa slightly different vision on
how they want to execute intheir business, how they want to
take care of their peopleversus another company taking
care of their people, how youwant to take care of your
customers versus how someoneelse takes care of their
customers.
What was that?
(52:05):
What was?
I'm assuming that you made aswitch to w2 when did?
Did you do that more in recenttime, when the, when the laws
started changing, or did you dothat early on?
Speaker 3 (52:16):
no, I did.
It probably was like six yearsinto the business, I guess seven
, eight years something,something like that it was.
It was about eight years ago.
Speaker 1 (52:28):
So you were.
So you were W2 before.
W2 was cool yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:36):
I was 32 before W2.
I made the switch when Irealized that, you know, I had
created a culture that wasdesigned around making money in
the beginning.
Right, it was designed aroundmaking money.
(52:58):
It wasn't designed necessarilyto help your fellow teammate,
mom, and you know what part ofthe challenge that you face is
is there's a variety ofchallenges.
I I basically broke my businessback down because when I
stepped back and looked at mybusiness, I wasn't extremely
(53:22):
happy with what I saw, nor did Ithink that I had a business
that was going to be, that wasgoing to provide me the lives
that I wanted to live and thequality of life to do it.
I wasn't.
I didn't like what I saw, so Ihad to make a change and that
(53:48):
was a monumental time for me.
I learned so much about myself.
I can tell you these thingsbecause I made these mistakes
right.
Like, as I'm saying, we arewhere we are because of the
mistakes that I've made, andthey've been big mistakes at
(54:09):
times, you know.
But, uh, you know, we switchedto duck from 1099 to w2 and, at
the same time, we switched fromdoing insurance proceeds
agreement to writing twoats andselling things.
So it I lost people right.
(54:32):
I had to revisit the commissionstructure to do this and I had
to try some things out.
Um, we didn't go straight from1099 into the business model
that we're in now.
There was some trials andtribulations between, between
(54:53):
those two phases, um, but youfind out who you are when you're
back into the corner.
My revenue took a huge hit,huge hit, and it it wasn't ideal
, but I knew that if I reallywanted to get out of my business
what I thought we were capableof, then I had to make a change
(55:19):
and it took 18 to 24 months forme to finally realize that, yeah
, it was the right thing to do.
And now I look back and I'mlike thank God, thank God, you
know that we did that, that wemade that transition, and a lot
of those people they're nolonger with the organization.
Speaker 1 (55:42):
So the organization had to change, the team had to
change.
There was an evolution in it,in that transition is what I'm
hearing.
Absolutely, there was.
Yeah, what were you know?
There's a big, you know.
I mean this was like, you know,like I joked around your W2
before, w2 was cool.
Who was doing W2 10 years ago?
(56:05):
Nobody, and few of us, right,yeah, people must have thought
you were nuts.
They did.
They still might.
Yeah, they might yeah.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
Well, you know it's.
I think it goes back to theinvesting in people thing.
Outside of like, hey look, Iwant to be.
You know, I want to do what.
I want to stay within theconfines of the law, right?
Yes, that that's important, butit goes down.
You know it goes back to, andyou really think, investing in
(56:38):
people wanting to do things theright way, knowing that there's
going to be, there's going to bemore of a cost associated with
it.
But we can attract good,talented people.
And you know, in this business,when you do straight commission
, or in any business for thatmatter, it takes a little while
(56:59):
to ramp things up right andthose can be really stressful
times when you leave a job foryou know making money to going
into something that you're notmaking money and you're expected
to learn a ton of thingsquickly.
(57:20):
It's not easy.
What we do is not easy and youknow people need a lot of help
and guidance throughout thatprocess and to come in and put
in the hours that really areneeded, to put in and not
(57:41):
receive anything for potentiallymonths on end, it shrinks your
talent pool best for sure.
Speaker 1 (57:50):
Yeah, I bet.
What's your take on the futureof the roofing industry?
A lot of things have changedsince 2008, 2009.
Where do you see this going?
Speaker 3 (58:03):
Well, I see it becoming more and more of a
retail market.
Well, I see it becoming moreand more of a retail market,
given the way the insurancecompanies are operating, which I
(58:24):
don't necessarily think thatthat's a bad thing it's.
I think AI is playing a hugerole, as you know.
I mean, you're like at theforefront.
I love talking to you aboutwhat you had to go.
I hear a couple guys.
They're like listen to whatjim's got going, and so that's
awesome.
Uh, you know, I look at when Ifirst started off, we hand
(58:46):
measured everything right,something as simple as hand
measuring.
We pull hundreds of Eagle Viewreports every month.
We and it integrates with ourCRM system and it moves over and
the estimates are created andthings are so much more
(59:14):
streamlined now than ever beforeand I can only imagine what
that's going to look like inthree years in five years, and
what the technology is going todo for our industry, you know
how, how do you, how do we?
Speaker 1 (59:26):
because you're a real , you know I how, how do you,
how do we?
Because you're a real, you knowI mean you're.
You're very committed to yourteam and loyal to your team.
Have you thought about how wenavigate this with the team?
Speaker 3 (59:41):
Yeah, First thing I do is I call you and I surround
myself with guys like you thatknow AI, right, but yeah, so we
do, you've got, we have donethings just in the last six
(01:00:06):
months and bringing in thatsupport for for people, um, that
I guess wasn't really available, um, yeah, but I all I'm I keep
an open mind to everything.
I want to hear what's out thereand what's available, because
there's things in the past thatI listened to that I thought, no
(01:00:29):
, that that's not, it's not aright shit right now.
But now I look at it and I go,yeah, that plugs in nicely,
right, um, so there's a lot ofthat that's eye open, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
Yeah, all right, if you had to give, if you had to
give uh, people listening, youknow your best advice, what you
know on how to be successfulwith their roofing company, what
would it be?
Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
well, do what you say you're gonna do.
When you say you're gonna do it, that's for sure.
Uh, answer your phone.
I know these aren't fancythings, I don't really have a
lot of fancy stuff to give you.
You know, like, wake up early.
Uh, you know, take care of yourpeople, look for opportunities
(01:01:25):
to help, whether that's in yourcommunity, whether that's the
person in front of you.
Right, we try to really beJared's people.
I'm a Christian.
I believe I put my faith in Godand my finances I put that in
God's hands.
And when I did that, thatchanged everything for me too.
(01:01:49):
Like you know, I talked topeople and they have, you know,
a Christian belief.
And I asked him I said do youdo you tie?
Do you tie 10% of your egg?
And they looked at me like I'mcrazy.
And they look at me like I'mcrazy and like they say you give
10%, like, wow, how come, youknow?
(01:02:16):
And I tell people I say, look,once you start tithing, you
can't afford not to tithe,because you see the benefits
that come along with it and andit's remarkable, uh, so you know
(01:02:37):
, and and I pray, uh, big, boldprayers, uh, for what I want in
my business.
Um, I pray that god brings theright people in and removes the
wrong people that aren'tsupposed to be here.
And I'm just telling you itworks.
I'm sure if you can walkthrough my office and see the
(01:03:00):
high quality people that arehere and it's not because I ran
some ads or it's just it's youknow, I'm living proof of that.
But, yeah, just do the rightthing.
Help people out.
Don't make everything aboutmoney.
Money is truly a byproduct ofhow well you serve people.
(01:03:23):
It really is.
I love when Adam said you know,it's just like.
It's like a thank you note.
It's so true, it really is.
Yeah, don't be afraid to spendmoney on on investments
investing in your company,investing in your people.
It will pay dividends if you doit right.
Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
It will, man Awesome, appreciate your time.
This has been another episodeof the Roofing Success Podcast.
You too.
Thank you for tuning into theRoofing Success Podcast For more
valuable content, visitroofingsuccesspodcastcom While
there, check out our sponsorsfor exclusive offers, shop for
merchandise and sign up for ournewsletter for industry updates
(01:04:05):
and tips.
Also join the Roofing SuccessFacebook group to connect with
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Your support helps us continueto bring you top industry
insights.
The website link is in thedescription.
Thanks for listening.
What do you do when your team puts the wrong roof on
a customer's house?
If you're Brett Tessin, you ownit, fix it and turn it into
your biggest marketing win.
In this episode, we'reunpacking the power of extreme
ownership, true service andbuilding partnerships that last
(00:20):
Brett shares how Tessin Roofingscaled by focusing not on
shortcuts but on relationshipswith customers, crews and
suppliers.
Brett Tessin is the founder ofTessin Roofing in St Louis,
missouri.
Starting during the 2008recession, he grew from cutting
lawns to building one of themost respected roofing companies
(00:42):
in the region, all whilepioneering a W-2 sales team
before.
It was cool.
Brett's approach is deeplypersonal.
He serves his crews, gatoradeand Frozen Snickers, meets with
his suppliers to alignexpectations and leads a company
where doing the right thing isthe business model.
He's built a loyalty fromsecond grade friendships to his
(01:05):
entire staff by being someoneworth following.
If you believe in building abusiness rooted in service,
accountability and long-termimpact, this episode will show
you how it's done.
Let's jump in with Brett Tessonof Tesson Roofing.
Welcome to the Roofing SuccessPodcast.
I'm Jim Alleyne and I'm here tobring you insights from top
(01:25):
leaders in the roofing industryto help you grow and scale your
roofing business Brett Tessin.
How are you today, man?
Wow, my friend, how are you,good man Tessin, roofing St
Louis, missouri, missouri,missouri, missouri.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Yeah, I'm the Missourian, that's right,
missouri.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
All right, did I get that?
You can't go wrong.
No, and yeah, I got to know you.
I've been getting to know you alittle bit over in the Roofing
and Solar Reform Alliance andyou know, just for the audience,
this is a story that I toldAdam this to the other day.
I was like man, I remember whenI think I told you this too, I
was like I remember the firstcall you were on and I was like,
(02:09):
oh yeah, that guy's different.
Yep, he's, he.
He's thought about his businessa lot and he's put a lot of
effort into it and he's he'sreally executing on a high level
.
Um, I could tell it from theyou know what, as soon as you
open your mouth, like, oh yep,that's someone who's been doing
(02:31):
it.
So I'm excited to have you on,man, you guys have built a
fantastic business there.
And, yeah, tell everyone alittle bit about your story how
you got into roofing, how Tessinwas was born.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
Well, it's a startling company.
Back when I was 25 years oldI'm 41 now it was like a long
time ago.
Well, I mean, it was basicallyI owned a little long-haired
company, landscaping companythat I started when I was in
junior college and I enjoyed it.
You know, I was 19 years oldand I had a buddy that was in
(03:02):
the roofing industry and he'dbeen doing a little while and I
said, hey, man, I'd love to getin front of your sales manager
and just talk and visit withthem.
What you do sounds, sounds fun,you know.
And so, uh, after like sixweeks of just harassing my buddy
, derek, and going over to hisapartment with my resume resume,
(03:23):
knocking on his door, I'm likeman, derek, you're making it
hard on me, you know.
So he finally put me in frontof his sales manager, kevin, and
kind of laid it out, and it wasstraight 1099, straight
commission.
And I said, well, I would loveto learn it, as you guys do.
(03:43):
So from like 7 o'clock to 4o'clock I learned the exterior
contracting business and then Iwould go home, grab my trailer
and just go out and cut grassall evening and then cut grass
on the weekends and any type oflittle landscaping projects.
I couldn't handle mall shops,small walls and stuff.
(04:03):
I had another buddy, nick, thatwas doing it and we worked the
deal and he took care of it.
So I did that for another abouta year or so, year and a half,
and then I was able to step outto the theater contracting side
completely.
I keep it.
(04:31):
And then about two years or soafter that, I went off on my own
right there in 2008, 2009.
You know, the economy wasbooming.
Everybody was unique times, youknow.
But I didn't try it better andI felt as if I I had to put you
know, shed some light on it.
I thought, you know, I am verylow overhead in comparison to a
lot of these guys that havebuilt something up and have gone
(04:54):
through these really good timesbefore the bottoms fell out,
you know.
And so I just looked at it likeI had an advantage because I
didn't have that kind ofoverhead, and so that's how it
all started back in 2009.
Um and uh.
Yeah, it's been a fun journey,challenging, fun journey.
(05:16):
But adam is right, roofingsales is personal development in
disguise.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
in disguise disguise man, for sure, for sure.
That's a heck of a time tostart a business.
Yeah, you know that's a.
You know, one of the nicethings was labor was really
available at the time.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
It was, it was.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Yeah, we would do that.
There was no shortage of labor,for sure People were happy to
sell you material too, anything.
That's right.
Anything Like please, please,work with us.
But there wasn't as much, youknow, but that was a good
realization from a businessperspective, is you know, and
(06:03):
maybe that's an idea?
Do you feel like you're anoptimist?
Right, because you foundsomething to me.
I, what I heard is you foundsomething like an advantage.
That advantage you had like, oh, I have this advantage over
these guys like I'm, and I seeit here.
I may not have the experience,I may have only been in this for
a couple of years and you knowI was cutting lawns full time
(06:25):
and doing this part time, andyou know, but you saw this
advantage.
What do you think that was inyou, that that that noticed that
Like, is that something thatwas learned or innate, or just
in you?
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I like to consider myself a pretty positive guy.
You know I try to look at thepositive side of things and put
in what I want to get out.
And yeah, you know I had to.
I had to look at the brightside, which was I was off on my
own.
It was really scary.
(07:00):
I didn't know exactly what Iwas doing because in the lawn
care business I was not runningit like it.
You know, my personal account,my business account all in one,
and you know it was just thisbig mess.
But you know I thought, hey, aslong as I have money and you
know I'm able to pay the one ortwo guys I was working with me,
(07:23):
it was fine.
But when I got off into thisside of things a couple of years
later, that's when we realized,okay, we really need to be
diligent on how we account forthings.
And everybody back then had afull page in the yellow pages,
(07:46):
in the phone book, right, likeyou weren't really a good
version company unless you had afull page.
Now, if you were maybe twopages next to one, another right
, and that was like a gazilliondollars to me.
It's like there's no way Icould participate at that level
of full page, like I'm lookingfor, like this little guy here,
(08:08):
you know, like, and so, uh, yeah, I didn't just go out and
create it, but yeah, yeah, itwas my look back now I'm yeah,
would it be this different?
I would do that different.
But you know, I'll get to those, that's that you know we'll get
to those.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
That's that's great hindsight.
We'll get to some of that.
Those are lessons for others.
How did you get it started?
I mean, the economy wasn'tgreat.
The you know everything was,you know, kind of slow.
What, what was the?
What were those initial yearslike?
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Well, they were a little challenging and you know,
I talked to my mom at the timeher and I, you know really close
.
I grew up a single familyhousehold, just her and I and I
told her, you know, look, I justdon't like what I'm seeing and
the way people are being treated, because what I saw that was
(09:00):
going on in the industry was thecustomers weren't being taken
care of at the level theydeserved to be taken care of,
and a lot of that was out of mycontrol, because once you get it
turned over to anotherdepartment, if they don't take
care of things the way that youpresent them, then it makes you
out to look like a liar, right,and I don't want to be a liar.
(09:22):
So I had some customer servicechallenges there.
There were crews that weren'tnecessarily getting paid or, if
they were, then weren'tnecessarily getting paid
correctly, and so I felt like,you know, I believe I can serve
the clients better, I believe Ican bring more fairness to the
(09:44):
crews and if I just focus onworking hard for people, serving
them at a high level, um, andnot try to get too fancy, stick
with what I know, not get toofar outside of my comfort zone,
which is really easy to do whenyou need revenue.
(10:06):
Right, you need revenue.
Now you're, you know, you knowroofing, siding gutters.
You don't know anything aboutfencing.
You don't know anything aboutfencing.
But there's a $4,000 fencethere, you know.
It's like, well, all right,maybe scale it back a little bit
and focus on what you know.
So that was challenging, had tolearn that, and yeah, so just
(10:32):
really focused on service,whether that would be servicing
the client or servicing thepartnerships that I had with the
crews and the suppliers.
And that's how I view thosethings.
I view all three of thosethings as partnerships.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
I love that.
Let's go into a little bit moredetail on that, because that's
what everyone says they want todo, right?
It's a very good expressionthat comes out.
It comes out in words, but alot of times it doesn't get
executed in practice.
So let's start with that.
Customer partnership what?
Speaker 3 (11:20):
you know what were the things that you implemented
early on and then, have you know, have one of those things
evolved into over the over theyears?
One of the things was so weused to run everything off of
Manila folder paper system.
Right, that's what you know.
Roofs were red, siding wasgreen, we had it color
coordinated and it worked, butit wasn't something that I
(11:47):
thought was going to be able tobe scalable at the level that I
wanted it to be.
But most importantly is beingable to communicate with the
customer and making sure thattheir wants, needs and desires
are met and they're met in atimely manner.
So that was something, um, thatI learned early.
You know, coming from the lastcompany that I had worked for.
We had a CRM system.
It was extremely robust,extremely detailed, and you know
(12:10):
I'm not an extremely detailedguy, I'm a salesman at heart,
right.
So you know, bringing that in, Iwas fortunate enough to have
Guy Sack that 30 days in tostarting the business.
Um, I convinced him to come,come on board and work with me,
and he's a smart guy, he's got agood computer background and he
(12:34):
really complimented in theareas that I left, and so, uh,
we learned that, yeah, we had toservice the customer, answer
our phones, and one thing that'sgreat about this business is
like, if you answer your phone,when you do what you say you're
gonna do.
When you say you're gonna do it, I mean it's Gallup, top 5%,
(13:00):
top 10% the clouds open up, likethe sun starts shining it's
like, wow, I just repeat thismodel.
You know, and you straightpeople, the way you want to be
treated.
But yeah, I mean, from anexecution standpoint it was, you
(13:26):
know, really helpful to have asystem and a CRM system rather
early into it, you know.
But there was a cost associatedwith that and we didn't have,
you know, we didn't have muchmoney.
I had people that owed me money.
You know, leaving previousemployer.
You know how does that work outfor most sales reps when they
(13:49):
leave their previous employer inthis industry generally not
well right.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
That's one thing I thought needed improvement too
they usually get a bonus, likeif the money comes in with a
little extra just to top it off.
Hey, have a nice yeah exactly,exactly.
Yeah, okay, that to me it makesa lot of sense and that's the
(14:15):
foundation, right.
But it's easy when you're small, yeah, or maybe easier because
you're you're so close toeverything, um, what, I don't
know if we talked about this atall, but, like, how many roofs
did you guys build last year?
How many reps do you have now?
(14:36):
Like, you guys are at at scalenow, right, yeah, um, and then
how do you, how do you carrythat into a team the size of
yours?
Yeah, before we carry on withthe episode, let's give a shout
out to one of our sponsors.
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(14:57):
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How many roofs did you guysbuild last year.
(15:41):
How many reps do you have now?
Like you guys are at at scalenow, right, yeah, um, and then
how do you?
How do you carry that into ateam the size of yours?
Speaker 3 (15:54):
yeah, so we have 40 people here in the office and
sales, uh side of things,outside of the subcontracted
crews and really you just got todo it one person at a time and
let you know when you sit downwith someone.
(16:14):
You know we want people withservant hearts, right.
We want to know that you careabout the end result, you care
(16:48):
about the things that we'vebuilt this business on it's
honesty, integrity, doing theright thing.
You know it's easy to say hey,you know I want to do this or
this is who we are.
But what it boils down to, Ithink, really is do you own your
shortcomings?
When you make a mistake, do youown it?
Do you try to pawn it off?
Because sometimes with mistakescome pain, and a lot of times
that pain is money.
Are you willing to pay to dowhat's right?
(17:10):
I mean, if you're not, ifyou're not willing to step up
and own something you know,extreme ownership is one of my
favorite books, right?
I'm, I'm sure a lot of youlistening but like, if you're
not willing to step up and payto make something right, then
are those?
(17:31):
Do you really believe in thevalues that you say you believe
in?
You know, earlier this morning.
Uh, I've had a sales manager andone sales reps come in and sit
down with me and um in and sitdown with me and um, the sales
rep.
We put the wrong color roof onthe person's house.
(17:52):
They picked a tan roof and thentexted him later and said, hey,
we want to go, maury black,right, and and so really it's a
breakdown of communication onour end.
And the lady, what her desirewas either A you give me all my
money back or you change therules file, and so we're
(18:14):
changing the rules file and thatsucks.
But you know what I mean.
That's who we are, right, yes,and that's who we want to be.
That's who we want to be knownas a company that does what they
(18:37):
say they're going to do, and Ithink that is really part of the
execution.
Stop being up when it's hard.
Speaker 1 (18:47):
Yeah, that's a big one to step up on, but you have
to right.
And now what can come out ofthat on the other end is a
customer that has much morerespect for your company, that
(19:08):
has much more respect for yourcompany.
They will never say you know,my goodness, they look they made
a mistake internally and theycame out and replaced my roof
with the right color.
Like how much, what?
What kind of story then I thinkabout that?
Like what kind of story getstold about your company outside
of your, your interactions withwith that person, right with
(19:29):
that homeowner?
And it's the right thing to do,it's the right thing to do,
it's the right thing to do overthere replacing this brand new
roof and the neighbors are likewhat are they doing?
Speaker 3 (19:43):
well, they put the wrong color shingle on, but they
came back out and they'remaking it right.
So you know that, oh my god.
That right there, I think,speaks volume, because ruch
aren't cheap.
Right, and for the consumer,you want to know, if you're
going to part ways with a lot ofmoney, that the company you're
(20:04):
giving it to is going to do theright thing.
And that's what reallyseparates a lot of companies is
do you do the right thing?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
What other things stand out to you that in that,
in that customer relationship,that customer partnership, the
customer journey that you guyshave done over the years, that
has made a difference with thecustomer, maybe also with your
team.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
I think generosity is extremely important.
I think when people know thatmoney is not what motivates your
day-to-day everybody look, wegot to make money and we should
(20:55):
make a lot of money.
And I think Adam says it rightMoney is the thank you note.
That's how you can tell whetheror not you're doing well.
Um, but when people know thatyou're willing to listen, to
hear them out, and decisions arebeing made not solely based
(21:20):
around the cost of the decision,based around what is the right
decision in this particularsituation and you know it
doesn't you don't always walkaway feeling financially well
about it, but you try tominimize those.
(21:41):
And the good thing about it isyou learn a lot really quick
when you lose money or you paymoney.
I always try to look at thebright side of things and so,
yeah, make decisions based uponwhat's right, not what's
(22:04):
motivated by money.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
And when you are that person and people know that
that's who you are they knowthat when things are don't
always go right, that you'regoing to stay there as you were
saying that, as soon as you saidthe word generosity when you
started that conversation, whatit made me think of is how good
(22:29):
your team must feel knowing thatyou guys are doing that or are
willing to do that.
It's not a conversation of allright guys.
We've got to figure out how tohide this one.
Of all right guys.
We've got to figure out how tohide this one.
Yeah, that's a, you know, likenow you're putting them in an
ethical dilemma.
(22:50):
You know right, when they cometo work, you know, you know, all
of a sudden they're in anethical dilemma, like, oh man, I
got to lie to this homeownerbecause we screwed up and I
don't want to, we can't, youknow, we don't want to take
ownership of it because we'regoing to lose money on it.
And you know, boy, I could seethat in the like how that would
(23:12):
have a huge impact on the team.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
uh, when people believe in the company they
believe and the people that leadat the company, I think it
gives them a lot of peace ofmind and confidence when they're
in front of the consumer right,because they know that they
have a support group behind themthat is going to step up if
something happens.
(23:36):
We're in roofing.
It's a high risk business.
I mean, at the end of the dayand my guys hear me say it all
the time I say we're riskmanagers.
That's what we do Every singleday.
We're risk managers in theroofing exterior contracting
arena.
Our first job is to manage riskand it's very risky business.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
It is.
I don't think I mean everyonelooks at it for the opportunity
that's in front of them, like,oh, there's a lot of money,
there's a lot of this, there's alot of that.
But if you, if you think aboutthat like that's what you're
doing on a day-to-day basis, howdo you manage your partnerships
(24:25):
?
What are the partnerships thatyou have with your
subcontractors?
In those relationships, they'refantastic.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
A lot of guys have worked with us for many years.
They're very loyal to us.
They appreciate the partnership.
I mean.
We constantly my projectsupport.
Guys are constantly buying thecruise launches.
(24:54):
We're, you know, dropping offgatorades, ice or you know all
the things that you should bedoing, really right.
Uh, you should be doing that,bringing frozen snickers out in
the afternoon.
Give the guys a second round ofenergy.
Show them that you care, likewhen you show people you care
when you act like a human being,um, and you treat people the
(25:17):
way that they should be treatedand not treated as a commodity.
We treat materials as acommodity, not humans, right?
So we do those things and weinstill that in our guys to to
want to make sure that thosepeople are happy that we do
business with, whether it's oursuppliers.
(25:39):
How do we make our supplierslife easy?
Well, we, we get out in frontof what it is we need from them.
We sit down and we setexpectations.
I sit down with every singleone of my suppliers at the
beginning of the year and I saywhat, what are you putting down
on your card?
(25:59):
Your sales report for me, likeI want to make sure that we're
both on the same page so thatyou don't go make this
unrealistic number and expectsomething out of me that you're
not going to get.
I want you to be rewarded andtaken care of, but I want to
(26:22):
make sure, because what we dowith them affects their overall
goal.
So if we can sit down, get onthe same page, that's really
important.
And then do what's expected ofus really well Send over orders
in advance.
We usually book our jobs outthree to five weeks in advance
(26:43):
and that makes it really easyfor the suppliers to do business
with us.
And some of the byproduct ofthat is when they sit down and
talk about pricing, they knowthat we're going to make it easy
to do business.
They know that we're going topay them on time.
Those are ways that you becomegood partners with your
(27:10):
suppliers, with yoursubcontractors, right.
You hold everybody Well.
You hold yourself accountableto that same level.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
So that's the there's .
It's amazing how, how manyadversarial relationship
dynamics are usually created inthese relationships.
Like, if that's a, those areprobably a whole lot of jumbled
words to say about it.
But like, like you're thinkingof how do I win versus how do I
(27:47):
win it with my, with my supplier, distributor, Like, how do I
win, how do I get more?
How do I?
And then and then, same thingwith your subs and same thing,
with that mindset of alwayswinning.
It's like an adversarialrelationship.
What I love what you just saidis man, let's go sit down.
I want to see the metric youhave for me.
Like, let's make sure we're onthe same page.
(28:09):
We have a budget, we have ourgoals and our expectations, our
KPIs that we're trying to hit.
Do they match up?
Do they align?
Is this something you know?
Because it all comes down toexpectations, Absolutely Right.
And with customers, with subs,with your distributors, if they
(28:37):
have an expectation that you'regoing to buy X amount and all of
a sudden you're not buying thatamount and they're, and what's
going on over here, how comethey're not buying from us or
what?
You know that?
That that's insightful.
What, what, what has come outof some of those conversations.
What have been some of the bigthings that have helped your
(29:01):
business get to where it isbecause of that type of thought
process and intentionalityaround those partnerships.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
Well, people, you become a desirable partner,
right?
People want to do business withyou.
They know what they're gettingwhen they do do business with
you.
There's a peace of mind factorthere and really I mean, if you
got someone that's easy to dobusiness with, that's going to
(29:33):
pay you on time, you're probablygoing to give that person some
pretty aggressive pricing,probably going to give that
person some high level service,right, yeah, if I see delivery
drivers out and about, let's sayat a gas station, if I see one
of the delivery trucks in a gasstation, I will intentionally
(29:54):
pull in that gas station, figureout how many guys are on that
truck and give them each moneyto say, hey, thank you for what
it is you do, thank you fordoing what you do day in and day
out, risking, sweating, doingeverything you do for our
company.
I need you to know that.
We appreciate it and werecognize it.
Right, let triplesples downwhen they pull up to your job
(30:18):
site and they see that it's atest on route.
Okay, and it's maybe it's afriday afternoon, it's the last
drop.
They, they treat that delivery.
I think, from what I can telland I tell by the fact that we
don't have the problems thatsome of my other contractor
friends have.
(30:39):
You, just when you showappreciation, um, it goes a long
way and it doesn't cost much,If anything can show your
appreciation to people and begenuine about it, and so I think
that what we get out of it, Ithink the byproduct of that, is
(31:00):
people work hard to serve andmake sure that we're happy
because we know that we're doingthe same in return for that.
Like we'll send lunch to asupply house, right?
I mean, launch brings peopletogether.
I mean look at me, I know I,but it does.
(31:23):
It brings people together andand and that's just there's one
way.
As we show our appreciation andI think, in turn, people, um,
take care of us.
They just take care of us.
That's what I say.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Yeah, If you were to give advice to someone who
wanted to build a businessrooted in this type of service
and partnership mindset, whatwould what would be some
principles that you would, thatyou would say that they should
follow to do that?
(31:58):
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If you were to give advice tosomeone who wanted to build a
business rooted in in this typeof service and partnership
(33:02):
mindset, what would?
What would be some principlesthat you would that you would
say that they should follow todo that?
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Well, first and foremost, be honest.
Right, Be honest even when it'snot easy to be honest or you
have to make those difficultsign calls.
That is so important.
I can deal with issues, a lotof issues, but if someone starts
(33:34):
to lie or become dishonest, butif someone starts to lie or
become dishonest man, it reallyit's hard to do business with
that person.
If someone comes in and theylie to me, that discredits a lot
and I question whether or not Iwant to continue to do business
(33:54):
with them.
It's probably going to be no.
Want to continue to do businesswith them?
It's probably going to be no.
And that's whether you, youknow, be honest with your crews,
be honest with your suppliers.
So honesty, obviously the bigdeal, right.
I would say make sure you havethe desire to serve right,
(34:19):
You've got to have that desire.
If you don't have that desire,you may want to reconsider what
it is you do, um in thisindustry.
So that desire.
But humility, this, thishumility, is a big one.
I think when guys start tobecome, they start to get to a
(34:47):
certain success level.
They can change who they are.
They can, they can start, they.
Sometimes they forget wherethey came from, you know, and
because they've been, you know,handsomely rewarded financially.
(35:22):
Loyalty, being loyal is veryimportant.
Those are the three things Ithink I would really want to
make sure that we're at the top.
The humility.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
One is a that that's a big one because, um, boy
things, yeah, a lot of people, Idon't know if they say they say
it a couple of different waysright, like I mean, the money
changes you or is it justamplifies who you really were?
Right, Like you know.
So, if you're kind of analready you know, you know, get
(36:03):
a little money, um, you know,you know.
So I mean that that that's abig one to focus on, and and
that, being grounded in whereyou came from, and and and do
that you, you've become veryteam focused also, right, and
the, the service in the serviceof your team.
(36:25):
Do you feel that that has keptyou home, kept kept you humble
in ways, or is that just your,your, your that that you love to
serve?
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Yeah, yeah, I do love to serve.
Yeah, yeah, I do love to serve.
I have a mom that comes intwice a week.
She always makes sure that I'mhumble.
I love my mom.
She's great.
We call her Mama T here at theoffice.
She's with this infamous Mama Tand supported some contractors.
(37:00):
No, yeah, being able to servepeople.
It brings me a lot of joy and Isurround myself with
like-minded people that havethat, and some people you know,
some guys you have to have theconversation with, especially
(37:21):
when they start making a lot ofmoney.
I've had to have thoseconversations before and, um,
they're not always the easiestconversations to have but, um,
sometimes they're warranted andthey're and they're really
needed, really needed.
And, um, you know one thing, Ithink when you get to a certain
level in life, you have anobligation to give back right,
(37:45):
and giving back can be a greatway to bring some humility to
what it is you do and to knowthat it's way bigger than you.
What you do is way biggerthere's, there's, it's much
bigger out there than you do.
So be humble, be thankful.
(38:06):
Yeah, you know, it's simple.
I'm thankful every day when Ican come into a place of
business, that I get to workwith some of the most amazing
people and, yeah, it's stressful, but I get to do it with people
that I truly love and careabout and that care about me and
(38:29):
the business in return.
So that's one.
Speaker 1 (38:33):
I remember you.
I remember you telling me Imean some of the people that you
, that you work with, you'veknown since elementary school.
Yeah Right, like you know,what's it like building
something with people that haveyou know, that knew you, you
know, as a fourth grader, youknow, or as a you know, yeah,
that new fourth grade Brett, youknow new fourth grade brett,
(39:00):
you know.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
So, um, actually, the guy derrick that I was
referring to earlier, uh, andthe sales manager, kevin, uh,
that, like those guys, got meinto the industry.
Both of them work here now.
They do great, fantastic guys.
But I mean, yeah, it can bechallenging when you know, I
have guys that I've been friendswith since second grade.
But you know, one of the thingsyou know, I mentioned loyalty.
(39:21):
These guys are loyal, they'revery loyal to me, they protect
the organization, right, um, andand that I mean, how do you put
a value on that?
So, yeah, you know, the dynamiccan be there and some of these
(39:47):
guys are like your brothers, butat the end of the day, they
know that I'm the one that hasto make the hard decisions.
When the hard decisions getmade and when we win, it's
generally a reflection of whatthey've done, you know, and and
so, yeah, it's rewarding.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
Challenging, yeah for sure the question that came up
in my mind around that is youknow well, I think loyalty is
earned.
How have you continued to earntheir loyalty and the rest of
your team's loyalty?
Speaker 3 (40:19):
they get to see how I respond in the difficult
situations that are presented,and those are generally the
situations where that's when therubber meets the road who, who
are you?
Are you actually who you sayyou are, and and.
(40:43):
And.
They get to see that andthey're part of that, and I
think they know, when there'sissues, whether they need help.
I need help.
They know that that I'm thereand it's important.
(41:04):
That really breeds loyalty.
They know I care, they knowI'll do whatever I have to do
for them, and so I don't know,if you can't be loyal to a guy
like that, then it ain't.
Speaker 1 (41:20):
No, yeah, so be someone, who, who, who you can
be loyal to Right, or people canbe loyal to earn their loyalty.
You know, you've, you've talkedabout like you're one of your,
your role in your company andkind of what you do on a
day-to-day basis.
(41:40):
A lot is painting a vision andmotivating people.
Can you unpack what that lookslike inside your company more on
a day-to-day basis?
Speaker 3 (41:50):
Yeah, well, you paint the vision starts with the
vision, um, and really servingpeople is the vision.
Right, you do you want to behappy with where you're at and
where you're going in life, andif you do, um, if you truly care
(42:16):
, you know people.
People want to be appreciated,people want to know that they're
making a difference, peoplewant purpose, right, and so when
you can show people this iswhat we do, this is the purpose
(42:41):
behind it and the byproduct isthis, right, and when you, when
you paint that vision for themand they can become part of
something that's bigger thanthem, that attracts the right
people, right, they have to buyinto it.
(43:01):
Nothing's given.
We don't give anyone anything.
You earn it.
Right, we set you up forsuccess, absolutely, we set you
up for success.
We invest in people.
That's what I do.
I invest in the stock market.
If I'm willing to take moneyand put it into a company that
I'm not even on a day-to-daybasis, but I'm not willing to
(43:25):
take money and put that intosomeone that I believe can be
part of improving the vision,you know what am I doing?
I do believe in investing inpeople, heavily investing in
people, and they know that, andI proved that right up front,
(43:47):
and so when they see that theyare, generally, they'll buy into
the vision.
They'll follow your lead andlead, and you have to hold them
accountable.
We have a lot of young guyshere, a lot of people in their
early 20s, uh, and you know,they want to make a difference,
(44:08):
they want to feel like they'remaking a difference and they
want purpose.
Right, I think that's humannature.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
Definitely.
What is what is investing inpeople?
Look like, what is you know?
I mean building people up.
Is it, is it the training thatyou're bringing to them?
Is it like, what are the?
What are the tangible thingsthat you're investing in and
you're for your people?
Speaker 3 (44:34):
Yeah, so all of my people are w2 people, so they
all get paid a salary, right,even the sales reps.
Um, all of my people getcompany vehicles, company gas
cards.
Um, they're all my vehicles arenice, they're newer vehicles
(44:57):
and they get all of the gear.
They need the safety, they needeverything.
So, right off the bat, they see, wow, you know, a lot of people
in this industry are just 1099.
And, and there's nothing wrongwith that.
That's how I started off too.
There's nothing wrong with that, right, it really helps from an
(45:19):
overhead.
You know, we can unpack that asa million ways, yeah, but but
making that initial investmentin there and showing that, look,
this is what we're going to doto help see you succeed, this is
what we expect in return, andwe're going to put the time into
(45:40):
it, we're going to put theresources into it and we're
going to make sure that you havethe personnel in place to help
support you.
It costs a lot of money to doall of that, and I think when
people realize that you trulycare about their success, you
(46:02):
know, my number one job here isto be the lead servant.
My number one job here is to bethe lead servant, to serve
people at a high level so theycan go out and service the end
customer.
And when they see that and theysee the financial commitment,
the time commitment, we usuallyknow pretty quick whether or not
(46:26):
they're going to last.
We don't hire big bulks ofpeople at one time.
I have a lot of friends that dothat and they have some success
with it and whatnot.
It's a different model but forus we sit down on a one-to-one
(46:47):
basis and we let people knowwhat we bring to the table what?
Speaker 1 (46:53):
uh, when?
When looking at your journeyfrom you know, from 2008, 2009,
as you were, as you were going,what was the journey of this
investment?
Because, because I you know,it's tough in the beginning,
right Like there isn't a lot toinvest.
So for someone that's buildingto this level, when does it make
(47:21):
sense to make those kind ofinvestments?
Or and then, on the other sideof that, what can you do when
you're not able to?
Or or maybe something like that.
I know you're enjoying theepisode, but let's give a shout
out to another one of oursponsors.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
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Speaker 1 (48:11):
when does it make sense to make those, to make
those kind of investments?
Or?
And then, on the other side ofthat, what can you do when
you're not able to?
Yeah, or or maybe maybesomething like that.
No, that's a good question.
Speaker 3 (48:22):
Um, one thing that I see, um from a lot of
contractors that are startingoff that are new, is they don't
write a business plan, right,they don't have a real roadmap
on where they're going and howthey're going to get there.
(48:45):
A lot of them were just reallygood salespeople and they know
that if they can just showpeople how they do what they do,
then they too can be successful.
And that's how I started offright, and that's how I got a
(49:06):
lot of friends that work here.
I said this is what I do do,this is how we do it, um, and
these are the end results whenthey get it this way.
Um, so you got to figure outwhat your business model looks
like, right, because in thisbusiness there's two lines,
there's 1099 and there's w2,right, and so each of them have
(49:27):
different, uh, conversationpieces to them.
Uh, and you have to figure outwhat the cost is.
You know, with the with thebusiness plan, comes the
budgeting.
So that's one thing that it'snot always, especially for
salespeople.
We're not always superinterested in sitting down and
(49:49):
creating budgets and figuringout what things are gonna talk.
What I like to do with peopleis is reverse engineer the
results and figure out wheretheir income, where they want
their income to be, and thenwork backwards from there.
Adam's got an awesome incometracker, um, that people put
(50:09):
together.
But there are two separatelengths and each of them have
different answers to them.
But I think at the end of theday, you gotta figure out your
roadmap and your road map andit's important to keep your
blinders on.
(50:30):
It's very easy to look over andsee what someone else is doing
and think that you have to dothat right.
You have to think of it likeyou're in the Kentucky Derby and
you're the horse running therace.
You can't look over.
There's blinders on thosehorses and they just look at
(50:52):
what's in front of them.
They know that they've put inthe training, they've done what
they needed to do to get there.
Now run your race, stay focused.
Don't worry about the otherguys.
You need to know what it isthat they're doing, how they're
operating, to an extent, butstay focused and run your race.
Speaker 1 (51:16):
Yeah, there's that.
One of my favorite memes is thepicture of Michael Phelps
swimming and the other guys inthe lane next to him about a,
about a, about a whole bodylength behind him, like looking
over at him while he's swimming.
You know, um, and that that's agood.
That that's that that's a good.
That's good advice, also,because everyone's journey is
(51:41):
going to be different.
Everyone starts in a differentplace.
Everyone, you know everyone hasa slightly different vision on
how they want to execute intheir business, how they want to
take care of their peopleversus another company taking
care of their people, how youwant to take care of your
customers versus how someoneelse takes care of their
customers.
What was that?
(52:05):
What was?
I'm assuming that you made aswitch to w2 when did?
Did you do that more in recenttime, when the, when the laws
started changing, or did you dothat early on?
Speaker 3 (52:16):
no, I did.
It probably was like six yearsinto the business, I guess seven
, eight years something,something like that it was.
It was about eight years ago.
Speaker 1 (52:28):
So you were.
So you were W2 before.
W2 was cool yeah.
Speaker 3 (52:36):
I was 32 before W2.
I made the switch when Irealized that, you know, I had
created a culture that wasdesigned around making money in
the beginning.
Right, it was designed aroundmaking money.
(52:58):
It wasn't designed necessarilyto help your fellow teammate,
mom, and you know what part ofthe challenge that you face is
is there's a variety ofchallenges.
I I basically broke my businessback down because when I
stepped back and looked at mybusiness, I wasn't extremely
(53:22):
happy with what I saw, nor did Ithink that I had a business
that was going to be, that wasgoing to provide me the lives
that I wanted to live and thequality of life to do it.
I wasn't.
I didn't like what I saw, so Ihad to make a change and that
(53:48):
was a monumental time for me.
I learned so much about myself.
I can tell you these thingsbecause I made these mistakes
right.
Like, as I'm saying, we arewhere we are because of the
mistakes that I've made, andthey've been big mistakes at
(54:09):
times, you know.
But, uh, you know, we switchedto duck from 1099 to w2 and, at
the same time, we switched fromdoing insurance proceeds
agreement to writing twoats andselling things.
So it I lost people right.
(54:32):
I had to revisit the commissionstructure to do this and I had
to try some things out.
Um, we didn't go straight from1099 into the business model
that we're in now.
There was some trials andtribulations between, between
(54:53):
those two phases, um, but youfind out who you are when you're
back into the corner.
My revenue took a huge hit,huge hit, and it it wasn't ideal
, but I knew that if I reallywanted to get out of my business
what I thought we were capableof, then I had to make a change
(55:19):
and it took 18 to 24 months forme to finally realize that, yeah
, it was the right thing to do.
And now I look back and I'mlike thank God, thank God, you
know that we did that, that wemade that transition, and a lot
of those people they're nolonger with the organization.
Speaker 1 (55:42):
So the organization had to change, the team had to
change.
There was an evolution in it,in that transition is what I'm
hearing.
Absolutely, there was.
Yeah, what were you know?
There's a big, you know.
I mean this was like, you know,like I joked around your W2
before, w2 was cool.
Who was doing W2 10 years ago?
(56:05):
Nobody, and few of us, right,yeah, people must have thought
you were nuts.
They did.
They still might.
Yeah, they might yeah.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
Well, you know it's.
I think it goes back to theinvesting in people thing.
Outside of like, hey look, Iwant to be.
You know, I want to do what.
I want to stay within theconfines of the law, right?
Yes, that that's important, butit goes down.
You know it goes back to, andyou really think, investing in
(56:38):
people wanting to do things theright way, knowing that there's
going to be, there's going to bemore of a cost associated with
it.
But we can attract good,talented people.
And you know, in this business,when you do straight commission
, or in any business for thatmatter, it takes a little while
(56:59):
to ramp things up right andthose can be really stressful
times when you leave a job foryou know making money to going
into something that you're notmaking money and you're expected
to learn a ton of thingsquickly.
(57:20):
It's not easy.
What we do is not easy and youknow people need a lot of help
and guidance throughout thatprocess and to come in and put
in the hours that really areneeded, to put in and not
(57:41):
receive anything for potentiallymonths on end, it shrinks your
talent pool best for sure.
Speaker 1 (57:50):
Yeah, I bet.
What's your take on the futureof the roofing industry?
A lot of things have changedsince 2008, 2009.
Where do you see this going?
Speaker 3 (58:03):
Well, I see it becoming more and more of a
retail market.
Well, I see it becoming moreand more of a retail market,
given the way the insurancecompanies are operating, which I
(58:24):
don't necessarily think thatthat's a bad thing it's.
I think AI is playing a hugerole, as you know.
I mean, you're like at theforefront.
I love talking to you aboutwhat you had to go.
I hear a couple guys.
They're like listen to whatjim's got going, and so that's
awesome.
Uh, you know, I look at when Ifirst started off, we hand
(58:46):
measured everything right,something as simple as hand
measuring.
We pull hundreds of Eagle Viewreports every month.
We and it integrates with ourCRM system and it moves over and
the estimates are created andthings are so much more
(59:14):
streamlined now than ever beforeand I can only imagine what
that's going to look like inthree years in five years, and
what the technology is going todo for our industry, you know
how, how do you, how do we?
Speaker 1 (59:26):
because you're a real , you know I how, how do you,
how do we?
Because you're a real, you knowI mean you're.
You're very committed to yourteam and loyal to your team.
Have you thought about how wenavigate this with the team?
Speaker 3 (59:41):
Yeah, First thing I do is I call you and I surround
myself with guys like you thatknow AI, right, but yeah, so we
do, you've got, we have donethings just in the last six
(01:00:06):
months and bringing in thatsupport for for people, um, that
I guess wasn't really available, um, yeah, but I all I'm I keep
an open mind to everything.
I want to hear what's out thereand what's available, because
there's things in the past thatI listened to that I thought, no
(01:00:29):
, that that's not, it's not aright shit right now.
But now I look at it and I go,yeah, that plugs in nicely,
right, um, so there's a lot ofthat that's eye open, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
Yeah, all right, if you had to give, if you had to
give uh, people listening, youknow your best advice, what you
know on how to be successfulwith their roofing company, what
would it be?
Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
well, do what you say you're gonna do.
When you say you're gonna do it, that's for sure.
Uh, answer your phone.
I know these aren't fancythings, I don't really have a
lot of fancy stuff to give you.
You know, like, wake up early.
Uh, you know, take care of yourpeople, look for opportunities
(01:01:25):
to help, whether that's in yourcommunity, whether that's the
person in front of you.
Right, we try to really beJared's people.
I'm a Christian.
I believe I put my faith in Godand my finances I put that in
God's hands.
And when I did that, thatchanged everything for me too.
(01:01:49):
Like you know, I talked topeople and they have, you know,
a Christian belief.
And I asked him I said do youdo you tie?
Do you tie 10% of your egg?
And they looked at me like I'mcrazy.
And they look at me like I'mcrazy and like they say you give
10%, like, wow, how come, youknow?
(01:02:16):
And I tell people I say, look,once you start tithing, you
can't afford not to tithe,because you see the benefits
that come along with it and andit's remarkable, uh, so you know
(01:02:37):
, and and I pray, uh, big, boldprayers, uh, for what I want in
my business.
Um, I pray that god brings theright people in and removes the
wrong people that aren'tsupposed to be here.
And I'm just telling you itworks.
I'm sure if you can walkthrough my office and see the
(01:03:00):
high quality people that arehere and it's not because I ran
some ads or it's just it's youknow, I'm living proof of that.
But, yeah, just do the rightthing.
Help people out.
Don't make everything aboutmoney.
Money is truly a byproduct ofhow well you serve people.
(01:03:23):
It really is.
I love when Adam said you know,it's just like.
It's like a thank you note.
It's so true, it really is.
Yeah, don't be afraid to spendmoney on on investments
investing in your company,investing in your people.
It will pay dividends if you doit right.
Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
It will, man Awesome, appreciate your time.
This has been another episodeof the Roofing Success Podcast.
You too.
Thank you for tuning into theRoofing Success Podcast For more
valuable content, visitroofingsuccesspodcastcom While
there, check out our sponsorsfor exclusive offers, shop for
merchandise and sign up for ournewsletter for industry updates
(01:04:05):
and tips.
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