March 4, 2025 • 26 mins
A deep dive into the meaning of Jesus as the Good Shepherd and our identity as His sheep. We explore the contrast between a Good Shepherd and a hired hand, unpacking layers of love, relationship, and protection.
• Discussion on the perceptions of sheep as 'dumb' animals
• Insights into sheep intelligence and social behavior
• Breaking down Jesus' role as the Good Shepherd
• Differences between a hired hand and a true shepherd
• The significance of belonging to one flock
• Encouragement for individuals in finding solace in Christ
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello friends, and welcome back to another episode
of the Rooted and Groundedpodcast.
Mr Miller, how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Oh, look boy we're elevating.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Middle age.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Uh-huh, yeah, I'm about to get there.
You're close, I'm close.
What do you think Anothercouple of years?
A couple of years?
We were talking what is middleage 40, 45?
You think 50?
Older than me.
What you think another coupleyears, couple years?
We were talking what is middleage 40, 45?
You think 50 older than me.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah, I'll agree.
I agree about his age, aboutour age, yeah, yeah about our
age middle age, yeah, so um allright, uh let me know what uh
discounts a aarp gives you.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
They are some yeah, that's it I do kind of get that
senior discount at mcdonald'sfor the coffee oh yeah I mean, I
just tried it and they're.
They didn't turn it down.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So you don't look at, I don't know what that's me I
might just want to pay thatextra 20 cents point of pride
like regular, not not senior.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah all right.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
So, uh, quick, quick game for us as we start off
today.
Um opened up the google machinegetting ready for this episode
and just thought I would put inwhat are the dumbest animals, oh
and so from the article top 20dumbest animals what are some
that you think would be on thelist?
Now, some of these were obscure, random animals, but, like
(01:28):
common animals that everyonewould know, what are you putting
on the list of the top 20dumbest animals?
Possum?
Speaker 3 (01:40):
No, wow, they're smart.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Well, it never said they were smart.
They're not the dumbest.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I know some have been .
I've seen them on the roadArmadillo Cousin.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Goat?
No, they should be.
They should be number one.
I'm anti.
Are you anti-goat?
My father-in-law has goats.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
And so by default.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
We have goats.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
There's a reason of all the animals in creation.
Jesus says the people going tohell are goats.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Let's just leave it at that.
You understand that.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I feel that in a way this year that I've never felt
before but I get it now andhopefully he doesn't listen to
this episode.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, you make sure he's out of town where he can't
figure it out.
They should be number one, butno, they were not on the list.
They didn't make the top 20?
Speaker 1 (02:34):
No, they didn't Any other guesses.
Sheep, sheep, no Wow.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Come on, what's number one?
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Number one and and this was on multiple articles
the ostrich is number one.
Okay, I can say that yeah umwhich I think they should be one
or two.
I had an experience at safaripark another episode um I, I
don't like ostriches, don't likegoats.
Really I'm not a big animalperson.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Like I like my animals.
That's about it and that's it.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Flamingo Wow.
Panda A panda I would havenever guessed that to be on the
list.
Turkeys sloth koala and giraffe.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Giraffe.
I would have never figuredgiraffe Sloth.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I could see, but those are kind of consensus.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Were you surprised that sheep wasn't on me?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
I was, and so that led me to my second google.
Um, are sheep dumb?
And the answer is not as dumbas we think, and so here are
some facts about sheep love it,uh, and intelligence so they can
recognize up to 50 differentfaces, human faces they can
distinguish between.
They can solve problems likemazes to find food, they form
(03:51):
social bonds and can exhibitgrief when some of their fellow
sheep die.
And they can exhibit complexbehaviors and they each have
individual personalities.
That's right Now.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
I would guess that one.
Yeah, it makes sense about themaze.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I hadn't thought about that yeah, but but
bringing all that up to say likewe often think of sheep as dumb
, and I don't think anyone'saccusing them of being the
smartest animals right but as wethink about jesus being the
good shepherd today, by defaultthat makes us think of ourselves
as sheep, and so, yes, we're'redumb in a lot of ways and a lot
(04:28):
of times, but we're not as dumbas what we think or what other
people think.
Yeah, and so, just like sheep,they can recognize the shepherd,
they can solve problems, theyhave emotions, they have
personalities.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
We do too.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
And so, with that in mind, that just kind of sets the
scene for us as we look atJesus being the good shepherd
from John, chapter 10.
And so last episode we looked atJohn 10 of Jesus being the door
and so let's kind of carry thisthought on and look in John,
chapter 10, and let's readverses seven through 18.
I know a little bit of a longerpassage, but it really sets the
(05:03):
scene.
So listen to these words ofJesus.
Truly, truly, I say to you I amthe door of the sheep.
All who came before me arethieves and robbers, but the
sheep did not listen to them.
I am the door.
If anyone enters by me, he willbe saved and will go in and out
and find pasture.
The thief comes only to stealand kill and destroy.
(05:25):
I came that they may have lifeand have it abundantly.
I am the good shepherd.
The good shepherd lays down hislife for his sheep.
He, who is a hired hand and nota shepherd who does not own the
sheep, sees the wolf coming andleaves and the sheep leaves the
sheep and flees, and the wolfsnatches them and scatters them.
He flees because he is a hiredhand and cares nothing for the
(05:47):
sheep.
I am the good shepherd.
I know my own and my sheep knowme, just as the father knows me
and I know the father.
And I laid down my life for thesheep and I have other sheep
that are not of this fold.
I must bring them also, andthey will listen to my voice.
So there will be one flock, oneshepherd for one shepherd.
For this reason the Fatherloves me, because I lay down my
(06:08):
life that I may take it up again.
No one takes it from me, but Ilay it down in my own accord.
I have authority to lay it downand I have authority to take it
up again.
This charge I have receivedfrom my Father, and so this
passage mentions multiple timesthat Jesus will lay down his
(06:29):
life for his sheep, in verses 11, 15, 17, and 18.
So, wayne, talk to us aboutJesus's willingness to lay down
his life for his sheep and then,kind of second part of this, I
want you to touch on verse 12that talks about the hired hand
compared to the good shepherd.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
So, uh, talk to us about those two things.
Well, when you look at theseverses 11 through 18, it all
begins in a in a such abeautiful way I am the good
shepherd.
No, I think it's important,it's not just a shepherd, he is
the good shepherd.
And I find it interesting whenwe say the and good, okay, and
(07:05):
then he contrasts that in verse12, the fact that he was laying
down his life.
I mean, we don't have time totalk, you guys know this.
We don't have to talk aboutwhat God was willing to do with
the Son and then what Jesus waswilling to do to be a doer of
the will of God.
Okay, he gave up the glories ofheaven, gave up that and came to
this earth, took on the form ofa servant paul said in
(07:26):
philippians too and not onlyjust take a form of servant.
Then he died, uh, as as insomeone who'd committed sin,
who'd never committed sin, okay.
So when you think about himgiving up his life and all
that's behind that, even fromthe father above, uh, the good
shepherd really takes on a newmeaning when you think about it
(07:46):
in that light.
In the last part, he laid downhis life when he could have done
differently according to verse17.
You know I lay it down on myown accord.
I'm doing this for you, yeahokay I don't even have
Speaker 3 (07:57):
to do.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I don't have to do this, but for you to have
salvation and for you to betaken care of as a sheep, then I
need to do this.
I got to do this, okay.
But then these contrasts verse12 is interesting, hired hand
and as I thought about that, youknow, as I would sum it up, one
of the major differencesbetween the shepherd and a hired
(08:17):
hand is relationship, becausehe, the shepherd, loved the,
knew the sheep by name.
We talked about that.
He protects them, he gives themsecurity, he gives them food
and he takes them to pastures,et cetera.
And a shepherd knows a sheepand he's known by his sheep
(08:41):
Hired hand.
That's simply what he is.
I got a job and you know why I'mdoing this.
It's not because relationshipwith sheep is, don't that I?
I don't own them, I don'treally care for them.
It's a job.
I'm doing this because you knowwhat I get paid and at the end
of the day, they're going togive me this much money and I'm
out of here.
But he says also you can see,there's no relationship because
(09:03):
verse 12, he's not willing totake a risk.
You know, it's like.
He says also you can see,there's no relationship because
verse 12, he's not willing totake a risk.
You know, it's like he says heleaves a sheep.
If a wolf come, he leaves asheep and flees.
He's like Si he gone.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
He gone.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
He's out of here.
There's danger.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
I'm out of here, man.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
You think I'm going to risk my life for what we
might say?
You know, you've beenenlightened to me how smart
sheep are, but he's not going tosay that and say let's see my
life possibly.
Or sheep you gone, sheep I'mnot going to.
Why Doesn't mean anything to me?
There's no relationship, I'msimply doing this as a job.
(09:42):
So when there's an attack, whenthere's a risk, he's not going
to give his life because lack ofrelationship and a lack of
desire to protect them and givethem what's best.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
You were talking about right there in verse 17,
where he says I lay down my lifeon my own account, on my own
accord, I'm deciding to do this.
So he's willing to take aresponsibility that I mean.
Think about what he's acceptingto do.
(10:13):
He's accepting to care for thesheep, take them around.
You know what is the job ofthat shepherd?
I mean, you could potentiallylose sheep, you could
potentially have an attack onthe sheep.
You know like, and I'm sayingI'm going to hang with it all
the way through, but he doesn'teven have to do that, like he
(10:37):
doesn't even have to do it.
I think that may be one of themost amazing things for me is he
doesn't even have to do this,but he wants to do it.
And not only does he.
Just, you know, some people say, yeah, I'll take that job on.
And then they get in there andthey're like, oh, I really
didn't want to do this, right,he, not only does he step into
(10:59):
it, he excels in it and we kindof know the attitude of a hired
servant.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
You know, sometimes we hear somebody say on a job
where they ask me to do this andI say you don't pay me enough
to do that, don't expect me todo that.
That's right, you know.
And that's kind of like thehired hand here.
You don't pay me enough to riskmy life.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
I mean, I don't care about them sheep and would say
it, yeah, would make that likethese aren't my sheep, this
isn't my pasture.
I mean I'm just here becauseI'm getting a check, exactly.
I mean there's no vestedinterest in those sheep.
And jesus is saying not only amI the shepherd, but I'm the
good shepherd.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
That he is vested Yep Because he did his own accord.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Well, and right before that, in verse 10, and we
talked last episode he's givingthe sheep an abundant life.
Exactly.
And now he's outlining how he'sgoing to do it Exactly.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Yeah, and he does.
He not only outlines, but thenhe do it Exactly.
Yeah, and he and he does.
You know, I don't outline, butthen he does it, yeah, and he
continues to do it for us today,you know.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Right.
So, matt, there, there's twoother parts of this passage that
I want you to touch on, so talk.
First talk to us about verse 14and what it means for Jesus to
know his sheep and to know hissheep, and then talk to us about
verse 16, when Jesus talksabout these other sheep that
need to be joined to create oneflock.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
Yeah, I I think that what we're talking about, I
think, still kind of carriesover into this conversation,
because he knows the sheep, he Ican't help but think about
David when I think about this,and it's not ironic that that's
(12:38):
his kinfolk you know like davidis that type of that shepherd
and you know, me and wayne werejust kind of getting tickled
about this.
But when we're talking aboutdavid and goliath, and david
goes up to saul and I'mparaphrasing this, but he's
saying don't worry about it, youknow, I got this, I'm gonna,
(13:01):
I'm gonna help you out with thisand saul's he grabbed the
lion's goatee.
I mean, he grabs the lion'sgoatee.
(13:21):
That is unbelievable to me.
A hired hand ain't doing that.
That hired hand is out of here.
Even if I wasn't a hired handI'm not exactly that's what I'm
saying like why would you wantto take that job on for the
potential of what's coming?
But not only does he do it.
I always use theseillustrations because it's just
(13:43):
my world and I can relate tothis.
I got four calves right now.
Every one of them have adifferent personality.
I got one.
She comes from a cow we call 45, and she's an older cow.
She's a good cow, but her babywas the littlest one and I was
(14:03):
worried about her and we madethis calf feeder for them and
she goes in there and she willpush everybody out of the way
and she's just growing andgrowing, and growing.
I'm learning her.
I'm getting to the point where,as soon as I come in there, I
say, all right, that's enough.
She turns and looks at me andmakes sure that I'm serious.
(14:25):
Then if she sees I'm reallystanding there, she turns and
then she exits out.
Well, I'm not really going togo lay with them and hang out
with them, I'm just doing thatquickly.
And then she exits out.
Well, I'm not really going togo lay with them and hang out
with them, and I mean I'm justdoing that quickly and then I'm
out.
This guy is not only going tosay, hey, come on, we need to go
out this way, he's going to beout there with them.
That's unbelievable to me.
(14:45):
Just the beauty of that.
And you know, talking aboutthat second part, we know that
this is like a beginning thoughtof what the church is going to
look like.
And back to the door, whosoeverwill can be a part of this fold
, whoever wants to be a part ofthis.
And I think that that's ashocker for even the Pharisees,
(15:09):
because, you know, right therein verse 19, it says and there
was division again amongst theJews because of this saying, and
they said this guy's got ademon, he's talking crazy.
Like what is he talking about?
They just couldn't see it, theycouldn't hear it or even
visualize the power and thestatus that he's putting himself
(15:30):
on in that moment.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
And you know and you said whosoever will that he
talked, putting himself on inthat moment, and you know, and
you said whosoever will that hetalked about earlier in john 7.
But you should see itmaterializing, see it coming
effect in acts 2.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
Yeah, oh yeah, you know in acts 2, 38 through 47.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
You know when he says it's for you and for all those
where far off.
That's right, jew and gentile.
That's right, every blood andevery language.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
I think about the parables, of the Good Samaritan,
and then the lost sheep that.
Jesus is using to set up, andit's like I'm going to go out
and find the ones that are lost,whether they're of the tribe
already or whether they're onesthat have to be brought in.
Or you show love when you do itto the least of these or to the
one that's injured.
(16:17):
And so I think that's just a lotof foreshadowing of what is to
come and really encouraging forus who obviously were not Jews
and have never been part of thateither family line or tradition
or faith but for us that we getto be part of Christ because he
came for all.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I think one of the coolest things for me in that
verse is there there will be oneflock and one shepherd.
That that For them to even, Imean of course, because there's
one door Exactly.
But the thing about these guysin this and I got to give it to
them, I got to be able to givethem a little bit of sympathy in
(16:56):
the fact that they have no ideathat he's talking about this
culmination of Gentile Jew intothis family and they don't get
that.
Yet they're just hearing himtalking about him being the good
shepherd and this door, and youknow he just healed this blind
(17:16):
man because you know, they sayin verse 21 others said there
are not.
These are not the words of onewho has a demon.
Can a demon open the eyes ofthe blind?
Like there is something aboutthis guy, like he's not just
talking to talk, he's walkingthe walk.
And so I think that one of themost encouraging things to me,
(17:39):
like 2020 vision, looking intothat is there's one flock and
it's his it's his flock and heis the one who's going to
ultimately take care of you inand out, past your protection.
I mean, we've talked about itand we've we've, you know, kind
of went down these differentangles on who the shepherd is
(18:00):
and what he represents, what thedoor is, what the bread of life
is.
You know, you start talkingabout and compiling all this
information about who Jesus sayshe is.
Now, all of a sudden, it's likeI want you to hear about this
guy, like you need to hear aboutthis Jesus.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
When I think about Jesus shepherd, you know you go
back and study in the OldTestament and the book of
Ezekiel and you know David andall the shepherds.
There's some qualities that ashepherd really needed and I'm
grateful that the good shepherd,Jesus, has these qualities
because I, as a sheep, I needhim to have these qualities in
(18:39):
my life and I've just thoughtabout qualities like I think a
shepherd would have to be reallypatient and I think they're
going to have to be courageous.
Jesus demonstrated that.
I'm giving my life on record.
That's pretty courageous guys.
It takes a lot of courage tosay you know what?
I've got the power to dosomething different here and he
(18:59):
did right.
He had the power to dosomething different, but he
chose for our benefit and forour salvation and security that
he did that.
I think he has to becompassionate Because you know
you pointed out at the beginning, matt that the sheep have
different personalities, havedifferent emotions.
All of us as sheep of God in theone flock of Christ, we all
(19:21):
have all different emotions anddifferent, and you know what
that requires.
I need God, I need Jesus to bepatient with me and
understanding, and I need him tohave compassion toward me and I
needed him to be courageous.
And the amazing thing about ashepherd not Christ the shepherd
, but a shepherd they had carefor each sheep individually.
(19:44):
And you know what?
It is so encouraging and it'sso enriching to life and such a
blessing to know that JesusChrist cares for each one of his
sheep personally, individually,with all their flaws and all
their faults and all theirmistakes.
He just continues todemonstrate that.
(20:06):
So when I think about ashepherd in jesus being the good
shepherd, what a blessing it isfor us individually.
This is like a a side shift.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
but you think about first peter five and you know
peter says as a fellow elder, Iwant you guys to understand that
you need to elder or shepherd,like the great shepherd and
every quality that we see, hereis Jesus in as you move on into
(20:37):
the development of the church.
and how is it going to besuccessful to have shepherds
keep the flock where it needs tobe at, and all of the qualities
that we just talked aboutcompassion, patient.
I mean, you think about firstTimothy three, and I'm not
trying to get off in that, but,but I am saying that there is
this establishment of anunderstanding of what a shepherd
(21:00):
truly looks like and the carethat they should have for the
sheep.
Well then, as you take it thestep further, they're they're
qualified men that have thisresponsibility.
But remember, don't lord overbecause you're not taking care
of your personal sheep.
You're taking care of theshepherd sheep and he's giving
(21:23):
you the responsibility to beable to do it.
No doubt that you do have someownership in that.
But when we think about the bigpicture one flock, one shepherd
man there is layers to this.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
A beautiful thought.
So I know a lot of this toucheson the identity of the good
shepherd, but what other piecesdo we want to add to that to
kind of round out this image ofthe good shepherd?
I know what I've been thinking,as you all have been talking, is
when Jesus says greater lovehas no one than this than to lay
down his life for his sheep andwe know that's what he does and
(22:04):
I just think that is a powerfullove for us that it's easy for
us to forget or become used toin a way, especially for
Christians who are at church allthe time and just around church
, it's a great gift, but it'sone that's easy to overlook
sometimes and one I think it'simportant for us to remember.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
For me, just thinking about the shepherd that he
knows his sheep Wayne was kindof hitting on that.
I mean he personally knows mystruggles.
He personally knows thetemptations that I'm faced with,
and it's no wonder that he's mygreat high priest who knows all
(22:48):
of those things and lives tomake intercession for me.
Who does that?
I mean I love y'all brothers,but I don't really want to know
all your business and fix allyour problems and listen to all
your things all the time.
I mean it's exhausting, right,that's just the way that we do
Not, that I don't try or I wantto, but Jesus says no, I want to
listen to it all as many timesas you want to talk about it.
(23:09):
I care enough about you tolisten to all that the 24-7.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
24-7.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
Yeah, I mean, he never grows tired of it.
He lives to make intercession.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Well, and something else I think about going to the
Sermon on the Mount when he sayssays if I will clothe the
flowers of the field I'll takecare of you.
That's right and and one thingthat I really like, um are
wildflowers.
Um, don't know why, but but Ido, and like being able to
identify them, and you can tellwhat month it is or what season
(23:42):
you're in by the wildflowersthat are available.
Um, and I know my wife.
She had a big flower garden thisyear, and so flowers are a big
part of our life and they arebeautiful in so many ways and I
mean, I know you can't compare aflower to a person, but like,
flowers are really, reallypretty and there's such variety
and they're so beautiful andit's like if God will take care
(24:03):
of a flower that a deer is goingto come by and eat.
He's going to take care of you.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
And each one of those flowers are unique.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Yeah, he knows the number of hairs on your head.
Zero.
I'll take the joke for youthere.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Yeah, but, what about beard?
No, just hair there, just it.
Okay, yeah, not in his safeplace.
Sorry about that, sorry aboutthat.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
But if he knows the number of hairs that we have if
he will take care of the birds.
If he'll take care of theflowers, he will take care of
his sheep.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
He's got us, hasn't he?
Yeah, what did we say in thelast episode?
The sheep of his hand.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Oh man, His hand All right.
So, guys, let's work onwrapping it up.
Wayne, make it real for us.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Oh, I was just looking here as you guys were
talking there about Hebrews 2,that it was fitting for him.
For whom are all things?
Talking about Christ, throughwhom are all things and bring
many sons to glory, to perfect,as the captain of our salvation.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Yeah, the captain Just kind of tagging with that
Ephesians 3, 19,.
To know the love of Christwhich passes knowledge that you
may be filled with all thefullness of God the captain the
leader is trying to fill you upabundantly, to the point where
(25:29):
it overflows.
You don't want in on that.
What, what yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Well, and I think for me is and we've been talking
about this some, but we're morethan just another person to
Jesus.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
That's right and so.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
I think when the world forgets you, when there's
threats on every side, it's theshepherd that calls us home.
And if we're too far away tohear the shepherd or too hard of
hearing to listen, he's goingto come find you.
And so when he says he's thegood shepherd, he's saying that
we are his, that he knows us andthat he will take care of us.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
That's a blessing.
Beautiful stuff, guys, alwaysis.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
I enjoy doing it with both of you and hopefully,
everyone who listens willbenefit to your faith and we'll
do it again in a couple of weeks.
You
Hello friends, and welcome back to another episode
of the Rooted and Groundedpodcast.
Mr Miller, how are you doing?
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Oh, look boy we're elevating.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Middle age.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Uh-huh, yeah, I'm about to get there.
You're close, I'm close.
What do you think Anothercouple of years?
A couple of years?
We were talking what is middleage 40, 45?
You think 50?
Older than me.
What you think another coupleyears, couple years?
We were talking what is middleage 40, 45?
You think 50 older than me.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Yeah, I'll agree.
I agree about his age, aboutour age, yeah, yeah about our
age middle age, yeah, so um allright, uh let me know what uh
discounts a aarp gives you.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
They are some yeah, that's it I do kind of get that
senior discount at mcdonald'sfor the coffee oh yeah I mean, I
just tried it and they're.
They didn't turn it down.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So you don't look at, I don't know what that's me I
might just want to pay thatextra 20 cents point of pride
like regular, not not senior.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah all right.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
So, uh, quick, quick game for us as we start off
today.
Um opened up the google machinegetting ready for this episode
and just thought I would put inwhat are the dumbest animals, oh
and so from the article top 20dumbest animals what are some
that you think would be on thelist?
Now, some of these were obscure, random animals, but, like
(01:28):
common animals that everyonewould know, what are you putting
on the list of the top 20dumbest animals?
Possum?
Speaker 3 (01:40):
No, wow, they're smart.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Well, it never said they were smart.
They're not the dumbest.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I know some have been .
I've seen them on the roadArmadillo Cousin.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Goat?
No, they should be.
They should be number one.
I'm anti.
Are you anti-goat?
My father-in-law has goats.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
And so by default.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
We have goats.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
There's a reason of all the animals in creation.
Jesus says the people going tohell are goats.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Let's just leave it at that.
You understand that.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I feel that in a way this year that I've never felt
before but I get it now andhopefully he doesn't listen to
this episode.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, you make sure he's out of town where he can't
figure it out.
They should be number one, butno, they were not on the list.
They didn't make the top 20?
Speaker 1 (02:34):
No, they didn't Any other guesses.
Sheep, sheep, no Wow.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Come on, what's number one?
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Number one and and this was on multiple articles
the ostrich is number one.
Okay, I can say that yeah umwhich I think they should be one
or two.
I had an experience at safaripark another episode um I, I
don't like ostriches, don't likegoats.
Really I'm not a big animalperson.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Like I like my animals.
That's about it and that's it.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Flamingo Wow.
Panda A panda I would havenever guessed that to be on the
list.
Turkeys sloth koala and giraffe.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Giraffe.
I would have never figuredgiraffe Sloth.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I could see, but those are kind of consensus.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Were you surprised that sheep wasn't on me?
Speaker 1 (03:26):
I was, and so that led me to my second google.
Um, are sheep dumb?
And the answer is not as dumbas we think, and so here are
some facts about sheep love it,uh, and intelligence so they can
recognize up to 50 differentfaces, human faces they can
distinguish between.
They can solve problems likemazes to find food, they form
(03:51):
social bonds and can exhibitgrief when some of their fellow
sheep die.
And they can exhibit complexbehaviors and they each have
individual personalities.
That's right Now.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
I would guess that one.
Yeah, it makes sense about themaze.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I hadn't thought about that yeah, but but
bringing all that up to say likewe often think of sheep as dumb
, and I don't think anyone'saccusing them of being the
smartest animals right but as wethink about jesus being the
good shepherd today, by defaultthat makes us think of ourselves
as sheep, and so, yes, we're'redumb in a lot of ways and a lot
(04:28):
of times, but we're not as dumbas what we think or what other
people think.
Yeah, and so, just like sheep,they can recognize the shepherd,
they can solve problems, theyhave emotions, they have
personalities.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
We do too.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
And so, with that in mind, that just kind of sets the
scene for us as we look atJesus being the good shepherd
from John, chapter 10.
And so last episode we looked atJohn 10 of Jesus being the door
and so let's kind of carry thisthought on and look in John,
chapter 10, and let's readverses seven through 18.
I know a little bit of a longerpassage, but it really sets the
(05:03):
scene.
So listen to these words ofJesus.
Truly, truly, I say to you I amthe door of the sheep.
All who came before me arethieves and robbers, but the
sheep did not listen to them.
I am the door.
If anyone enters by me, he willbe saved and will go in and out
and find pasture.
The thief comes only to stealand kill and destroy.
(05:25):
I came that they may have lifeand have it abundantly.
I am the good shepherd.
The good shepherd lays down hislife for his sheep.
He, who is a hired hand and nota shepherd who does not own the
sheep, sees the wolf coming andleaves and the sheep leaves the
sheep and flees, and the wolfsnatches them and scatters them.
He flees because he is a hiredhand and cares nothing for the
(05:47):
sheep.
I am the good shepherd.
I know my own and my sheep knowme, just as the father knows me
and I know the father.
And I laid down my life for thesheep and I have other sheep
that are not of this fold.
I must bring them also, andthey will listen to my voice.
So there will be one flock, oneshepherd for one shepherd.
For this reason the Fatherloves me, because I lay down my
(06:08):
life that I may take it up again.
No one takes it from me, but Ilay it down in my own accord.
I have authority to lay it downand I have authority to take it
up again.
This charge I have receivedfrom my Father, and so this
passage mentions multiple timesthat Jesus will lay down his
(06:29):
life for his sheep, in verses 11, 15, 17, and 18.
So, wayne, talk to us aboutJesus's willingness to lay down
his life for his sheep and then,kind of second part of this, I
want you to touch on verse 12that talks about the hired hand
compared to the good shepherd.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
So, uh, talk to us about those two things.
Well, when you look at theseverses 11 through 18, it all
begins in a in a such abeautiful way I am the good
shepherd.
No, I think it's important,it's not just a shepherd, he is
the good shepherd.
And I find it interesting whenwe say the and good, okay, and
(07:05):
then he contrasts that in verse12, the fact that he was laying
down his life.
I mean, we don't have time totalk, you guys know this.
We don't have to talk aboutwhat God was willing to do with
the Son and then what Jesus waswilling to do to be a doer of
the will of God.
Okay, he gave up the glories ofheaven, gave up that and came to
this earth, took on the form ofa servant paul said in
(07:26):
philippians too and not onlyjust take a form of servant.
Then he died, uh, as as insomeone who'd committed sin,
who'd never committed sin, okay.
So when you think about himgiving up his life and all
that's behind that, even fromthe father above, uh, the good
shepherd really takes on a newmeaning when you think about it
(07:46):
in that light.
In the last part, he laid downhis life when he could have done
differently according to verse17.
You know I lay it down on myown accord.
I'm doing this for you, yeahokay I don't even have
Speaker 3 (07:57):
to do.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
I don't have to do this, but for you to have
salvation and for you to betaken care of as a sheep, then I
need to do this.
I got to do this, okay.
But then these contrasts verse12 is interesting, hired hand
and as I thought about that, youknow, as I would sum it up, one
of the major differencesbetween the shepherd and a hired
(08:17):
hand is relationship, becausehe, the shepherd, loved the,
knew the sheep by name.
We talked about that.
He protects them, he gives themsecurity, he gives them food
and he takes them to pastures,et cetera.
And a shepherd knows a sheepand he's known by his sheep
(08:41):
Hired hand.
That's simply what he is.
I got a job and you know why I'mdoing this.
It's not because relationshipwith sheep is, don't that I?
I don't own them, I don'treally care for them.
It's a job.
I'm doing this because you knowwhat I get paid and at the end
of the day, they're going togive me this much money and I'm
out of here.
But he says also you can see,there's no relationship because
(09:03):
verse 12, he's not willing totake a risk.
You know, it's like.
He says also you can see,there's no relationship because
verse 12, he's not willing totake a risk.
You know, it's like he says heleaves a sheep.
If a wolf come, he leaves asheep and flees.
He's like Si he gone.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
He gone.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
He's out of here.
There's danger.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
I'm out of here, man.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
You think I'm going to risk my life for what we
might say?
You know, you've beenenlightened to me how smart
sheep are, but he's not going tosay that and say let's see my
life possibly.
Or sheep you gone, sheep I'mnot going to.
Why Doesn't mean anything to me?
There's no relationship, I'msimply doing this as a job.
(09:42):
So when there's an attack, whenthere's a risk, he's not going
to give his life because lack ofrelationship and a lack of
desire to protect them and givethem what's best.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
You were talking about right there in verse 17,
where he says I lay down my lifeon my own account, on my own
accord, I'm deciding to do this.
So he's willing to take aresponsibility that I mean.
Think about what he's acceptingto do.
(10:13):
He's accepting to care for thesheep, take them around.
You know what is the job ofthat shepherd?
I mean, you could potentiallylose sheep, you could
potentially have an attack onthe sheep.
You know like, and I'm sayingI'm going to hang with it all
the way through, but he doesn'teven have to do that, like he
(10:37):
doesn't even have to do it.
I think that may be one of themost amazing things for me is he
doesn't even have to do this,but he wants to do it.
And not only does he.
Just, you know, some people say, yeah, I'll take that job on.
And then they get in there andthey're like, oh, I really
didn't want to do this, right,he, not only does he step into
(10:59):
it, he excels in it and we kindof know the attitude of a hired
servant.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
You know, sometimes we hear somebody say on a job
where they ask me to do this andI say you don't pay me enough
to do that, don't expect me todo that.
That's right, you know.
And that's kind of like thehired hand here.
You don't pay me enough to riskmy life.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
I mean, I don't care about them sheep and would say
it, yeah, would make that likethese aren't my sheep, this
isn't my pasture.
I mean I'm just here becauseI'm getting a check, exactly.
I mean there's no vestedinterest in those sheep.
And jesus is saying not only amI the shepherd, but I'm the
good shepherd.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
That he is vested Yep Because he did his own accord.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Well, and right before that, in verse 10, and we
talked last episode he's givingthe sheep an abundant life.
Exactly.
And now he's outlining how he'sgoing to do it Exactly.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
Yeah, and he does.
He not only outlines, but thenhe do it Exactly.
Yeah, and he and he does.
You know, I don't outline, butthen he does it, yeah, and he
continues to do it for us today,you know.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Right.
So, matt, there, there's twoother parts of this passage that
I want you to touch on, so talk.
First talk to us about verse 14and what it means for Jesus to
know his sheep and to know hissheep, and then talk to us about
verse 16, when Jesus talksabout these other sheep that
need to be joined to create oneflock.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
Yeah, I I think that what we're talking about, I
think, still kind of carriesover into this conversation,
because he knows the sheep, he Ican't help but think about
David when I think about this,and it's not ironic that that's
(12:38):
his kinfolk you know like davidis that type of that shepherd
and you know, me and wayne werejust kind of getting tickled
about this.
But when we're talking aboutdavid and goliath, and david
goes up to saul and I'mparaphrasing this, but he's
saying don't worry about it, youknow, I got this, I'm gonna,
(13:01):
I'm gonna help you out with thisand saul's he grabbed the
lion's goatee.
I mean, he grabs the lion'sgoatee.
(13:21):
That is unbelievable to me.
A hired hand ain't doing that.
That hired hand is out of here.
Even if I wasn't a hired handI'm not exactly that's what I'm
saying like why would you wantto take that job on for the
potential of what's coming?
But not only does he do it.
I always use theseillustrations because it's just
(13:43):
my world and I can relate tothis.
I got four calves right now.
Every one of them have adifferent personality.
I got one.
She comes from a cow we call 45, and she's an older cow.
She's a good cow, but her babywas the littlest one and I was
(14:03):
worried about her and we madethis calf feeder for them and
she goes in there and she willpush everybody out of the way
and she's just growing andgrowing, and growing.
I'm learning her.
I'm getting to the point where,as soon as I come in there, I
say, all right, that's enough.
She turns and looks at me andmakes sure that I'm serious.
(14:25):
Then if she sees I'm reallystanding there, she turns and
then she exits out.
Well, I'm not really going togo lay with them and hang out
with them, I'm just doing thatquickly.
And then she exits out.
Well, I'm not really going togo lay with them and hang out
with them, and I mean I'm justdoing that quickly and then I'm
out.
This guy is not only going tosay, hey, come on, we need to go
out this way, he's going to beout there with them.
That's unbelievable to me.
(14:45):
Just the beauty of that.
And you know, talking aboutthat second part, we know that
this is like a beginning thoughtof what the church is going to
look like.
And back to the door, whosoeverwill can be a part of this fold
, whoever wants to be a part ofthis.
And I think that that's ashocker for even the Pharisees,
(15:09):
because, you know, right therein verse 19, it says and there
was division again amongst theJews because of this saying, and
they said this guy's got ademon, he's talking crazy.
Like what is he talking about?
They just couldn't see it, theycouldn't hear it or even
visualize the power and thestatus that he's putting himself
(15:30):
on in that moment.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
And you know and you said whosoever will that he
talked, putting himself on inthat moment, and you know, and
you said whosoever will that hetalked about earlier in john 7.
But you should see itmaterializing, see it coming
effect in acts 2.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
Yeah, oh yeah, you know in acts 2, 38 through 47.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
You know when he says it's for you and for all those
where far off.
That's right, jew and gentile.
That's right, every blood andevery language.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
I think about the parables, of the Good Samaritan,
and then the lost sheep that.
Jesus is using to set up, andit's like I'm going to go out
and find the ones that are lost,whether they're of the tribe
already or whether they're onesthat have to be brought in.
Or you show love when you do itto the least of these or to the
one that's injured.
(16:17):
And so I think that's just a lotof foreshadowing of what is to
come and really encouraging forus who obviously were not Jews
and have never been part of thateither family line or tradition
or faith but for us that we getto be part of Christ because he
came for all.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I think one of the coolest things for me in that
verse is there there will be oneflock and one shepherd.
That that For them to even, Imean of course, because there's
one door Exactly.
But the thing about these guysin this and I got to give it to
them, I got to be able to givethem a little bit of sympathy in
(16:56):
the fact that they have no ideathat he's talking about this
culmination of Gentile Jew intothis family and they don't get
that.
Yet they're just hearing himtalking about him being the good
shepherd and this door, and youknow he just healed this blind
(17:16):
man because you know, they sayin verse 21 others said there
are not.
These are not the words of onewho has a demon.
Can a demon open the eyes ofthe blind?
Like there is something aboutthis guy, like he's not just
talking to talk, he's walkingthe walk.
And so I think that one of themost encouraging things to me,
(17:39):
like 2020 vision, looking intothat is there's one flock and
it's his it's his flock and heis the one who's going to
ultimately take care of you inand out, past your protection.
I mean, we've talked about itand we've we've, you know, kind
of went down these differentangles on who the shepherd is
(18:00):
and what he represents, what thedoor is, what the bread of life
is.
You know, you start talkingabout and compiling all this
information about who Jesus sayshe is.
Now, all of a sudden, it's likeI want you to hear about this
guy, like you need to hear aboutthis Jesus.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
When I think about Jesus shepherd, you know you go
back and study in the OldTestament and the book of
Ezekiel and you know David andall the shepherds.
There's some qualities that ashepherd really needed and I'm
grateful that the good shepherd,Jesus, has these qualities
because I, as a sheep, I needhim to have these qualities in
(18:39):
my life and I've just thoughtabout qualities like I think a
shepherd would have to be reallypatient and I think they're
going to have to be courageous.
Jesus demonstrated that.
I'm giving my life on record.
That's pretty courageous guys.
It takes a lot of courage tosay you know what?
I've got the power to dosomething different here and he
(18:59):
did right.
He had the power to dosomething different, but he
chose for our benefit and forour salvation and security that
he did that.
I think he has to becompassionate Because you know
you pointed out at the beginning, matt that the sheep have
different personalities, havedifferent emotions.
All of us as sheep of God in theone flock of Christ, we all
(19:21):
have all different emotions anddifferent, and you know what
that requires.
I need God, I need Jesus to bepatient with me and
understanding, and I need him tohave compassion toward me and I
needed him to be courageous.
And the amazing thing about ashepherd not Christ the shepherd
, but a shepherd they had carefor each sheep individually.
(19:44):
And you know what?
It is so encouraging and it'sso enriching to life and such a
blessing to know that JesusChrist cares for each one of his
sheep personally, individually,with all their flaws and all
their faults and all theirmistakes.
He just continues todemonstrate that.
(20:06):
So when I think about ashepherd in jesus being the good
shepherd, what a blessing it isfor us individually.
This is like a a side shift.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
but you think about first peter five and you know
peter says as a fellow elder, Iwant you guys to understand that
you need to elder or shepherd,like the great shepherd and
every quality that we see, hereis Jesus in as you move on into
(20:37):
the development of the church.
and how is it going to besuccessful to have shepherds
keep the flock where it needs tobe at, and all of the qualities
that we just talked aboutcompassion, patient.
I mean, you think about firstTimothy three, and I'm not
trying to get off in that, but,but I am saying that there is
this establishment of anunderstanding of what a shepherd
(21:00):
truly looks like and the carethat they should have for the
sheep.
Well then, as you take it thestep further, they're they're
qualified men that have thisresponsibility.
But remember, don't lord overbecause you're not taking care
of your personal sheep.
You're taking care of theshepherd sheep and he's giving
(21:23):
you the responsibility to beable to do it.
No doubt that you do have someownership in that.
But when we think about the bigpicture one flock, one shepherd
man there is layers to this.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
A beautiful thought.
So I know a lot of this toucheson the identity of the good
shepherd, but what other piecesdo we want to add to that to
kind of round out this image ofthe good shepherd?
I know what I've been thinking,as you all have been talking, is
when Jesus says greater lovehas no one than this than to lay
down his life for his sheep andwe know that's what he does and
(22:04):
I just think that is a powerfullove for us that it's easy for
us to forget or become used toin a way, especially for
Christians who are at church allthe time and just around church
, it's a great gift, but it'sone that's easy to overlook
sometimes and one I think it'simportant for us to remember.
Speaker 3 (22:24):
For me, just thinking about the shepherd that he
knows his sheep Wayne was kindof hitting on that.
I mean he personally knows mystruggles.
He personally knows thetemptations that I'm faced with,
and it's no wonder that he's mygreat high priest who knows all
(22:48):
of those things and lives tomake intercession for me.
Who does that?
I mean I love y'all brothers,but I don't really want to know
all your business and fix allyour problems and listen to all
your things all the time.
I mean it's exhausting, right,that's just the way that we do
Not, that I don't try or I wantto, but Jesus says no, I want to
listen to it all as many timesas you want to talk about it.
(23:09):
I care enough about you tolisten to all that the 24-7.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
24-7.
Speaker 3 (23:15):
Yeah, I mean, he never grows tired of it.
He lives to make intercession.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Well, and something else I think about going to the
Sermon on the Mount when he sayssays if I will clothe the
flowers of the field I'll takecare of you.
That's right and and one thingthat I really like, um are
wildflowers.
Um, don't know why, but but Ido, and like being able to
identify them, and you can tellwhat month it is or what season
(23:42):
you're in by the wildflowersthat are available.
Um, and I know my wife.
She had a big flower garden thisyear, and so flowers are a big
part of our life and they arebeautiful in so many ways and I
mean, I know you can't compare aflower to a person, but like,
flowers are really, reallypretty and there's such variety
and they're so beautiful andit's like if God will take care
(24:03):
of a flower that a deer is goingto come by and eat.
He's going to take care of you.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
And each one of those flowers are unique.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Yeah, he knows the number of hairs on your head.
Zero.
I'll take the joke for youthere.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Yeah, but, what about beard?
No, just hair there, just it.
Okay, yeah, not in his safeplace.
Sorry about that, sorry aboutthat.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
But if he knows the number of hairs that we have if
he will take care of the birds.
If he'll take care of theflowers, he will take care of
his sheep.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
He's got us, hasn't he?
Yeah, what did we say in thelast episode?
The sheep of his hand.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
Oh man, His hand All right.
So, guys, let's work onwrapping it up.
Wayne, make it real for us.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Oh, I was just looking here as you guys were
talking there about Hebrews 2,that it was fitting for him.
For whom are all things?
Talking about Christ, throughwhom are all things and bring
many sons to glory, to perfect,as the captain of our salvation.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Yeah, the captain Just kind of tagging with that
Ephesians 3, 19,.
To know the love of Christwhich passes knowledge that you
may be filled with all thefullness of God the captain the
leader is trying to fill you upabundantly, to the point where
(25:29):
it overflows.
You don't want in on that.
What, what yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Well, and I think for me is and we've been talking
about this some, but we're morethan just another person to
Jesus.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
That's right and so.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
I think when the world forgets you, when there's
threats on every side, it's theshepherd that calls us home.
And if we're too far away tohear the shepherd or too hard of
hearing to listen, he's goingto come find you.
And so when he says he's thegood shepherd, he's saying that
we are his, that he knows us andthat he will take care of us.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
That's a blessing.
Beautiful stuff, guys, alwaysis.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
I enjoy doing it with both of you and hopefully,
everyone who listens willbenefit to your faith and we'll
do it again in a couple of weeks.
You
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.