Shocking & Hilarious Stories With a Former DEA: From Wiretaps to Cops pulling Over Cops EP64

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Like my third time getting called to this house and they're
arguing and, and this time, though, I'm like, what was the
problem now? What is the problem now?
Like what? Well, he won't.
He won't let me watch what I wanna watch and he won't give me
the remote to the TV. This is the kind of stuff you're
dealing with in the small town, right?
I said OK, All right. Do you have any extra batteries

(00:21):
in this house? Like, you know, show me where
you keep batteries. You have batteries?
No, we don't have any batteries.If we do, it'll be in a straw.
Alright, come on, open the drawer.
Alright, No batteries. Good.
Give me, give me the remote. Yeah, me remote.
I open up, I take the take the batteries out.
I throw them in the woods. I'm like, close it up.
Here you go. Now figure it out.
If you guys, if I get called here one more time tonight, I'm

(00:42):
locking his boat up. You know what I mean?
You get rid of the batteries, that's the cop job.
Let's go. I got a phone call at my house,
you know, like I was not on call, you know, and I, I had no
obligation to lift to even answer the call, you know, but I
did the Sergeant, I answered phones to Sergeant.
And I'm like, you know what's going on?
You know, well, I got a problem here.

(01:03):
I need help. I I'm not uncool.
Yeah, well, you know, so and so hung up on me.
OK, what do you have? I don't know what I have, what
you need to know, what you have.I I can't explain it.
You got you. You gotta come in.
OK, So I jumped in the car. Now I'm really interested

(01:25):
actually, you know what I mean? It's more, you know, interesting
than anything. So I can't.
But he moves me outside, right? And I'm like, what's up?
Why you meet me outside? He said.
Well, I wanted to brief you. Before.
You. See them?
You know, saying like times walking restaurant season, he
sees and boom, he's gone. He's running.
Ohf shit. You know, this guy's like the

(01:45):
fucking gazelle, you know, I mean, like he's in great shape
and we're so we're chasing him through the whole mall and it's
getting ridiculous and, and finally, like he stops and then
we stop, but we're all out of breath.
Him, us, right. And so my, my partner, Jose,
he's sitting there and he's likebent over, right?

(02:06):
And he's like sucking wind, right?
And he's like, and he reaches back and he fucking grabs his
handcuffs and he tells him put these fucking handcuffs on or
I'll shoot you. Right.
Fucking hairy tales. No, I didn't.
I burst out laughing. I'm like, holy shit, that's
funny. Semi honest surveillance one
day, right? And OK, I said there was a
house. I was watching.
I'm sitting here. I'm sitting here.
Nobody ever came to relieve me. I didn't, you know, just sitting

(02:29):
there. Finally I got a call and it was
from my buddy Jose. He's like, hey, where are you?
I'm like, what do you mean? Where am I'm fucking
surveillance. I'm where you know, you guys
sent me out. He's like, oh shit, we forgot
you. Yeah, yeah, we're, we're in this
bar. Just sell heroin and he was
gonna be the town big shot, right?

(02:51):
Well, that's not gonna fucking happen.
I'm not gonna let you openly sell heroin on a fucking St.
cause then she's gonna break my balls, right?
You know, that's just, that's just not realistic.
You know, one arrest, fucking two arrests, you know, three.
Listen, John, what are you doing?
Like I caught you 3-4 times. Like what are you doing bro?

(03:13):
He was going through the door first.
He's giant, right? And he hits the fucking door and
he said the door opening, he splits it down the middle and he
goes through it, you know, like one of those old like kool-aid
commercials, you know, have you ever seen him when he got the
kool-aid thing comes through thehouse phone, right?
And I'm right behind them now and I come following right on
them. Like I, you know, I mean, I'm

(03:34):
like 2 feet behind him. We're coming fast.
And so I looked to my left and there's the target sitting there
on the couch, like just in disbelief that we're there, like
in the room with this point. But he's got a deck of heroin in
his hand, OK? Get me more incriminating than
that. For example, I locked up one guy

(03:55):
in a small town. I was on patrol once, right now,
I lived in that town. I knew who this guy was, and he
was an asshole. Even when I was a kid, he was an
asshole, right? So I ended up having to deal
with him and he's being an asshole to me.
So I lock him up. Now my Sergeant says, oh, would
you lock up so and so for you know, he's been around forever.

(04:16):
I know he's been an asshole forever.
I promise that nobody ever locked him up.
You know what I mean? So.
I'm trying to make him learn something.
I mean, I'm trying to, I'm trying to break the fucking
cycle here. You know, they end up going on
like the, the New Jersey Turnpike.
And so I'm, we're moving. I'm, I'm doing like 95, you

(04:37):
know, sometimes hitting over 100and, and I'm, I'm can't really
make up a lot of ground on theseguys.
So the first time we, we go screaming this fucking the state
trooper, now he's got his fucking lights on.
He's trying to pull us over. Pulling your.
Yeah, cause I'm in another covercorner, right?
So he doesn't. Know the fuck I am.
So he's just being a crazy guy. Yeah, right.

(05:00):
So now he's trying to pull us over and I slow down enough
where he can come on the side, but I turn my lights on because
I got hidden emergency lights, you know, and that should be
enough. He should fucking figure out
what's going on. Yeah.
No, he wants me to pull over. I'm not.
Fuck. Fuck him.
I'm not pulling over. Alright?
You can't leave that card here. And Jose, he's like, yeah, OK,
no problem. And he runs in and he fucking
comes back out with his fucking ice cream coming out.

(05:20):
Fucking Sergeant OHP, he's fucking pissed, right?
So he comes over, he's fucking yelling at him now and he's
like, let me see your fucking drivers license.
Let me. And Jose, he's like, I'm not
showing you shit. Fuck yeah, right.
Well, mainstream mother fucker. I know he's the guy who's 21,
maybe barely, you know, I'm saying like harmless though, you

(05:40):
know, You know. I can't I can't even imagine the
guy here example blacks out there and all this there and he
just knows that he he encountered cops and he wakes up
home safe the cars in the driveway.
He's like, what the fuck just happened?
He got saved by Gary Pacelli. That's what happened.

(06:38):
So welcome back on the Rumbling Facts podcast, the podcast we
don't shy away from uncomfortable truth and dive
deep into stories that will challenge the way you see the
world. People today we're in for
something really special, something you won't find
anywhere else today. If you ever heard the first time
that we had Gary Pacelli graced the show, you know that this guy

(06:59):
is a walking miracle. A survivor of an attempted
murder as a DEA agent 2 surviving a skydiving accident
that left him paralyzed 1000 feet altitude.
You should go check out the 1st 2 episodes if you did not check
them out. But today, today we're getting
into the different side of of Gary Pacelli's life.
The side filled with humor, camaraderie, and the wild,

(07:22):
unexpected moments that shaped his journey in law enforcement.
It's not every day that we get to sit across from a man who's
not only lived through some of the most intense situation that
you can ever fucking imagine, but also someone whose story is
packed with jaw-dropping momentsthat most people will never
experience or know about. Gary Pacelli is one of those

(07:45):
people. If you heard the two first
podcast that we did, you know that this guy is a fucking
fighter. Former Marine to law enforcement
to finally make it to DEA agent.He survived attempted murder and
came back from the skydiving accident like a true hero that
he is. But today, Gary Garry's back for
round two people. I'm beyond fortunate to now call

(08:08):
him my friend. This time we're peeling back the
curtain on what's really like for the human behind the suit.
The crazy, funny and unexpected moments that we don't often hear
about. Let's welcome back Gary Pesoli
to Rumbling Back podcast. How you doing, Gary?
How you doing? I'm doing great, thanks.
Thanks for having me back I. Appreciate it was such a blast

(08:30):
having you on the first time. It was the longest podcast but I
did so I had to separated. Into.
From that the the first podcast there was like 2 questions that
I wondered. You told me that your your
friend Richie that that slip like cheated.
Well went to sleep with your your girlfriend.

(08:50):
Well, my question on this is like, did you ever re talk to
Richie after all of this? Yeah, I did actually, you know,
cause, you know, being stuck in in boot camp, you know, I had to
just bury it so deep that, you know, I have more important
things to to deal with, right. So I buried it and by the time I

(09:16):
got out of boot camp and, and bythe time I ran into him, I, I
couldn't care less, you know, I,I actually, I had met new
girlfriend at the time is now mywife, you know, So to me it all
worked out, you know. It's like the place.
Yeah, yeah. So, so there's no, there's no

(09:37):
hostility with him anymore. No, they're really there wasn't
actually, you know, everybody though, you know, was expecting
this big yeah drama to happen, you know, And it just didn't
because I didn't care, you know?And, and you said the first
podcast that you were, and I, I we saw in the video that you

(09:58):
were so silent during that skydiving accident.
A question right there. Did you have like a radio
connection with others on the ground or you didn't at all?
No, I, I had no connection to other people except that my, my,
my GoPro was filming and the volume was, was up on it, you
know. So, OK, so we don't have any

(10:19):
communications. OK, so that's why you were like
radio silence. But let's say let's say you
could have reached the ground. Would you have said mayday or
something? I don't think so.
I don't think I. Would have.
I would have been like, I'm gonna crash or get ready for it,
people. I honestly, I don't think I

(10:39):
would have because I knew they wouldn't be able to help me.
And and, you know, that's one ofthe things that like we're
trained like to do really is to,to keep radio discipline, right,
Especially when something bad happens, right?
If you don't have nothing like really relevant to say, you
don't say anything, you know, SoI just, I probably would, you
know, I, I don't think I would have to be.

(11:01):
Honest. A lot of.
People should live with that law.
You have something good to say, just shut up.
Exactly right. You know, I learned that the
hard way, though, you know, Thatdidn't come easy, you know?
So how, how did you start choosing the, the stories from
your book? Cause for sure you talk about
the skydiving accident, but you decided to put, uh, stories of

(11:24):
what happened during your law enforcement.
How did you choose those stories?
And also, from what year to whatyear were you a cop and
detective of these stories were about to hear?
I, I, so I chose the stories well, actually like, so the

(11:45):
stories that I put in the book were actually what I thought
about right when I was in the hospital, right?
Because cause when, when you know, when, when you're
paralyzed and you can't move right?
And you, you have nowhere to escape to except inside your,
your brain, right? So, you know, I chose places to
go in my memories that I was really strong and in control,

(12:10):
right? Because at the time I was really
weak and had no control, right? So I tended to go back to those
times like, and, and you know, most and usually like most of it
was when I was probably a motorcycle cop because that was
like, you know, when I was like really like younger, right?

(12:33):
And, and just more agile and, and carefree, right?
And, but I was strong, you know,and we all were, you know, and,
and that that was a that's probably my, when I look back on
my career in law enforcement, that was the the best, the best
time I had ever had was was on the motorcycles.
You know, it was just freedom. It really was.

(12:55):
It was great so. From what year to what year were
you caught and detective? So I, I started 1990, OK, and I,
I know that I'm getting her and retired in 2004.

(13:15):
But I kept coming back to, you know, because the whole time I
was working as a cop, even when I was in the jail, they had sent
me and trained me to become a drill instructor for a police
Academy. So I would always go and train
the recruits in the morning and then go to work.
It's not my regular shift. It's a hell of a day.
After I got, yeah, it was, it was a long day, but it was, it

(13:39):
was a, you know, it was great for me.
They gave me comp time, right? Time and a half come time,
there's no way we're gonna pay me for it.
But to have all that time when Ineeded it was great, you know,
but it was also still like, you know, they were giving me comp
time to, to work out, right? Like that's great, you know what
I mean? Like so, you know, but I would

(14:00):
always they would call me back to um, from the police Academy
recruit and of it, you know, youknow, there was bosses above me,
obviously, but I would say in charge of all police recruits
and my counterpart was charge ofall corrections recruits, right.

(14:20):
OK, so and, and you know, it wasa, it was a pretty decent job,
you know, but I had kept having to go and then leave for
surgeries and stuff. And it's really political too.
And I got fired a couple times, you know, just because politics,
right somebody. What do you mean?
What did you do for them? Well, not me like so say

(14:44):
somebody's somebody important nephew wanted the job, right?
OK, wow. And it was just like, you know,
you get pulled in and say you gotta go, alright, don't have
the door. You go, you know, you're gonna
fight it, you know, it's just the way it is, you know?
But what happens is though, you always get called back, right?
Because, you know, competency always outweighs, you know,

(15:09):
politics, right? Like, yeah, you could put
anybody in the job, but they have to know what they're doing,
right? Otherwise it doesn't work out.
So it was, it was kind of like arevolving door, which kind of
worked out for me in the long run anyway, you know, because
it's an important job. Like I, I took it really
seriously, Like I didn't like. Well, you took it so seriously

(15:29):
that you were shining your bootsin the morning and everything
before you had this job there. How much dedicated like me, I'm
gonna be the if I'm not the bestone physically, I'm gonna be the
cleanest. And it's that's my task.
Steps like making sure that you were on point.
Yeah, right. And, you know, like I took it
that serious because it it was really serious.

(15:52):
You know, like you wanted these guys to, you know, like it was
twofold, right? It was it was a it was also it
was my job also like to weed people out.
That shouldn't be there, right? Not that I'm playing God, right
and making decisions or I'm not looking to hurt nobody neither

(16:13):
I'm actually looking at it save people, right, exactly.
Because if you're, if you, if you're not mentally or fairly
tough enough to do the job, you're gonna hurt yourself, you
know, and you're going to hurt somebody else.
So what? What seems like a cruel position
to take is really not, you know what I mean?

(16:34):
Because hey, enough for nothing.I don't want one of my friends
getting killed because you can'thandle the job, you know?
Or you're running away from the scene when he's in a shootout.
You're like, no. Right.
And, you know, and I've seen allthose things happen, you know,
like, you know, just a quick example, later on in my career

(16:56):
when I had left the small town and went back to, you know, the
big department, the Sheriff's Department, um, one of the
people that worked in that Division I was in, I don't want
to say their names, but, you know, she was horrible.
She was useless, you know, I trained her in Ecademy.

(17:18):
I I tried to get her. I tried to throw her out.
Then, you know, I just knew how she was gonna be.
But. You know, you know he's got what
you wanted, so. Of course.
Full circle. And, and you know, when I left,
the Sergeant that I had worked for, they walked into a, a
pharmacy to investigate somebodywith like a, a fake

(17:42):
prescription, right? OK.
So the guy ends up punching a Sergeant right in the mouth,
right? And what what is what is the
detective do that's with them? Runs away What?
And doesn't even call on the radio for backup?
Shit Wow. Gets your cell phone and calls
the Police Department for help. I mean, that's like I would, if

(18:06):
I was the chief, I would have fired on a spot, you know?
But he wasn't fired on the spot.No, she wasn't.
She wasn't fired. Well, you know, like, and that's
that's, you know, and that's thereason why we try to, you know,
we're so tough in the Academy, right, for that reason, because
sometimes people are put there, you know, because they know

(18:27):
somebody or they have a connection somewhere, you know,
but that doesn't that doesn't help.
Yet out in the street, nobody cares, you know, so.
And that, that was the, you know, I didn't say a word.
I just, you know, I don't want to sit there say I told you so.
But I think so, right? You know, I'm saying like, so we

(18:48):
took it seriously. And, you know, look, no, I, I
don't wanna hurt nobody, You know what I mean?
Like, I'm not going to take somebody's job away from them.
Absolutely not. Not at all.
But again, on on the flip side, I don't want to see one of my
friends get hurt either, right? So it's a balance that you gotta
strike, you know, and and there's a lot of funny stories
there too, you know, But so tookit seriously, even when I after

(19:13):
I got hurt, right? Like, you know, like some people
come in heavier than they shouldand you know, but that doesn't
matter though, honestly. What do you mean heavier?
Well, so, you know, like usuallyyou have enough notice
beforehand that you're going to the police Academy.
You probably have like, you know, you're going like, at

(19:34):
least a year, right. So you should try to get in
shape, you know? Yeah, you know, And some people
do, some people don't. And some people are so out of
shape that it takes them a long time, right?
And, you know, but it's really not about like whether you're in
shape or not, you know, we're not like, it's not like, you
know, we're looking for people with beach bodies, you know what

(19:57):
I'm saying? Yeah, I'm looking for their like
your heart. What is your heart?
Right. Because I've seen guys that were
out of shape that, you know, they couldn't do anymore
pushups. So with their arms gave out,
right. And they ended up like doing
them with their head. You know what I mean?
That guy's got horror. I I could look at the guy.

(20:17):
I know he's going to graduate. They're about he's done.
That guy's fine, you know. Then you get the guy who's in
shape, you know, and, and you know, like professional
competition bodybuilder or something, and he's got no horn
at all. You know, it's amazing, right?
You know, So it's all about yourheart.

(20:37):
Yeah, heart, Heart is so important.
Like I remember the Montreal Canadiens like a fucking 15
years ago when I was really watching them.
We had maybe a couple skill players, but we had this guy
called Beijing and he had not a lot of skills, but heart there
200%. This guy would throw himself in
front of pucks that were the biggest shooters in the league

(21:01):
and really throw himself in front of him and everybody would
close their eyes because they knew what was coming.
But the guy was ready to do thatevery game and go against like
Shara, that's like 610 and he didn't give a fuck.
And we kept that guy for years and years.
Cause heart there is so beautiful.
Because you can't build heart. You got it or you don't.

(21:22):
And the physical part, you can build it, but somebody has no
heart. You can have all the physical
you want, but if you don't have heart for what you're doing and
the will to do it, man, not not much getting on.
Yeah, I I would take the guy with with heart over the guy
who's in shape any day of the week for sure.
You know, it's, you know, I remember one time and Academy

(21:45):
like, you know, I, I guess, you know, we misread somebody wrong,
right? We thought maybe an attitude.
So we were kind of, you know, trying to work it out of them,
right, You know, and this is thefirst couple days you're out of
me and we're always really tough.
That's when we're our toughest in the beginning and, you know,
so, but I, I, I didn't think it was a major problem with, with,

(22:09):
with the guy, you know, I mean, not at all.
It was just something we needed to iron out, you know?
Yeah, you know, knock on on on the door, you know, like after
like 3 days, I think it was likethe third day.
And you know, we yell, you know,like, you know, enter, you know,
guy walks in and you know, we'reyelling at him, right?

(22:32):
You know, because that's what wedo.
And I mean, I say it here, you know, we right, you know, like,
you know, what the fuck do you want?
You know, what are you doing here?
You know, it's just nasty, you know, it's like, you know.
You just totally. Become married.
You're like that. Exactly.
Yeah, Yeah, right. Sit down, get the fuck up.
You know, like, you know, you'rejust trying to disorient him,

(22:54):
you know, and. That fucking works.
You know, I mean, right, you know, so I, you know, I feel bad
now, but it's not. But it was for a purpose, right?
So it comes down to where, like,you know, he tells us what he
wants and he says, you know, I'mquitting and like what?

(23:16):
Close the door. What do you mean you're
quitting? What the fuck is wrong with you?
Well, I can't take it like whoa,whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
Slow the fuck down because like this is a guy that we could see
like we do this, we've been doing this for a long time.
We can tell who's gonna be a good cop, who's not gonna be a
good cop. And and that one threw me for a

(23:36):
loop. I didn't see this coming, right.
And you know what, What we, whatwe interpreted as attitude was
just that we just had made him do so many damn push-ups that,
you know, and, and that's what he said, he said like, I, I
can't move my arms. I I can't.
I can't. You guys killed?
Me. Fucking you guys should exactly.

(23:56):
You guys are killing me. I can't take six months of this.
And I'm like, whoa, wait a second, this doesn't happen for
six months. And I said, and you're not
fucking quitting. I'm not letting you quit.
You know, I said I'll give you 3days, you'll go back to the
fucking class and I'm gonna callthe dogs off for three fucking
days. That'll give you time to heal

(24:18):
and we'll go from there. But you're not quit.
Fuck that. You know, you can't throw a
career like that away like that,you know?
Because you believed in them, you saw something good.
Yeah. I, I really did.
And, and I really, he really caught me off guard with that,
you know, and so we sent them back out there and, and I called

(24:39):
the, you know, the drill instructors off and said layoff
the guy, lay off, you know. Did they ask why?
Did they ask why? Yeah, I told him, you know,
like, just let's see what happens, you know, but just give
the guy a break, let him heal. You know, weekend was coming up.
So you know what? After the weekend, we forgot all

(25:00):
about it because the guy blendedin and it was, you know, he he
was fine. There was no problem, you know,
But for that moment, he didn't, you know, like, and again, we
talked about this, right? Like when you can't see the
light at the end of the tunnel, remember that that was your
second, right? And well, that's a clear case of

(25:20):
that, right? He didn't see the light.
He just thought it was never going to end.
Right. Yeah, yeah.
So. But The funny thing is though, I
remember they were all from the same town.
There was like 4 of them. And you know, we, we, we put
them all through hell, you know,and you know, but we, we did it
with style though, you know, I mean, it wasn't just torture.

(25:41):
You know what? Style.
What does that mean? I mean, you know, kind of funny,
at least you know what I mean, like at least it was humor
involved with it, right. And you know, so I I got
married. Well, they graduated and I
remember going back to much my truck after graduation and I

(26:03):
leave my car door open. I mean, whatever, you know, but
I opened, I opened the door and there's a bottle of makers mark
on my seat, you know, and it says, you know, don't open till
you retire, you know, and it wasrum in you know, which is pretty
cool, you know, like so he appreciated it and I wasn't
expecting that, but you know what, it was cool.

(26:23):
Then I ended up getting married a couple of years later, and my
wedding was in the same town that all these guys were cops.
OK? I don't know how they found out,
but you know, we're right in themiddle of the wedding, like
reception, right? And you know, I'm whatever, you
know, run around, you know, doing whatever happened,
whatever fun and my wife like a girl, you know, something's

(26:48):
going on. I'm like, why the four cops just
walked in? I'm like, oht man, which one of
my asshole friends did somethingwrong?
You know what I mean? Like.
Your first thought? And then my second thought is,
oh, what did I do? You know what?
You. Know why are they coming to my
wedding? Out of nowhere.

(27:08):
That I do something wrong, you know, and it was, it was them
though, you know, they showed upmy wedding, you know, which is
pretty cool, you know? How did they find out?
Did You Know? But no, I have no idea this day.
I've no idea right now. And The thing is though, like I
trained a lot of cops, hundreds of them, you know what I mean?
Like, and some of them, most of them get it, right.

(27:34):
All the military guys, they understand right off the bat.
They get it, you know? Yeah.
And then like the rest of the people, most of them, they get
it. They understand.
There's always that small numberthat don't get it, never will
get it. And they hate you for the rest
of your life, no matter. What?
They're like, I would have been a cop, but this guy really
drilled me so much. The guys though that actually

(27:57):
were cops that didn't get it, you know, you're like, and
you're like, you just, you shakeyour head and you're like, OK,
you know what? And those are the guys that
usually don't turn out to be really any good cops anyway, you
know what I mean? Like cause you, you just don't
get it. I mean, we're trying to help
you. That's it.
You're supposed to understand this procedure, but if you you

(28:17):
don't get why we're tough like this and being assholes
constantly on your ass, well forsure you're going to see a you
guys as a an enemy when you guysare your best fucking friend
because you're trying to make him discipline.
You know, like I'm trying to getthese guys to, to understand
that, you know, as a cop, like they don't pay you for what you

(28:40):
do. They pay you for what you might
have to do, you know, And, and you know, it's not out on the
street like people. Some people don't care that
you're a cop. They don't care that you have a
badge. You know, they'll, they'll take
that badge and they'll shove it up your ass if they could, you
know, And if you're gonna, if you're going to hide behind your

(29:02):
badge, you're not going to make it, you know, you know, OK, you
know, and again, I wasn't from the city, right?
I was from a rural town, you know, and I was thrown in the
middle of the city to work, you know, and I had to adapt and
overcome, you know. I was fortunate though, though.

(29:28):
My time in the jail really helped me when I, when it was
on, on the street, you know. But even without that though, I
would have made it it's, you know, because I got it, you
know, I understood it, you know,like I didn't hate my drill
instructors when I was in boot camp, you know, I, I respected
them. I thought they were pretty
funny, you know, I mean, some some were worse, though, you

(29:50):
know, like some you were like, he's here today, you know what I
mean? Like, you know, but for the most
part, like you understood, you know, so it's listen, it's like
anything else, right? And it's like people have
equated it to like pledging a fraternity or sorority or, or
being on a football team or a hockey team, you know what I

(30:12):
mean? Like it's the same, it's the
same thing, you know, and, and it's about your, your teammates,
right? And about, you know, that's what
it's mostly about, right? Just, you know, we, we say like,
you know, not to be dramatic, right?
Like we say like, you know, well, you know, we here, you
know, we just wanna make it home.
Well, that that I never liked that saying because that's like,

(30:35):
come on, you know. Having neither, Me neither.
I would have liked that saying either.
Yeah, like that's just lame, youknow?
That that makes me think of a guide in a shop at a Friday is
like I just can't wait to get. Over.
It's like I'm being a pussy. Exactly.
Thank you. Right.
Like God damn it, like, you know, that's one thing too.

(30:55):
Like so we had a job to do so, but we tried to have fun though
while we were doing it because, you know, I was very fortunate
with, with the people I ended upworking with, you know, because
we all had the same like, hey, we're, we're, we're the police,
you know what I mean? Like we could have fun doing
this, you know what I mean? So, and we did, we actually did,

(31:18):
you know, and when I got to the small town, you know, the town
I, I grew up in, you know, the, the chief actually called me in
and he was like, listen, I want you to teach my guys here how to
become, how to be a cop, you know, because they don't
understand it. They don't get it, you know, And

(31:42):
I'm like, what do you, what do you mean?
You know, he's like, oh, you'll see.
And I did. So I saw, you know, like simple,
simple stuff. Like they were afraid to do
their job. Not because they were cowards,
because they weren't. It's just that they didn't know,
not what they could get away with it.
But it's like, you know, I did it differently, put it that way.

(32:04):
Like I wasn't there to take anybody.
Shit, I wasn't gonna, you know what I mean?
Like I treated everybody with respect.
But the second you crossed that line, I smacked you right to
mouth, you know what I mean? Because that made my job easier,
you know, Because once I got thereputation as hell, that guy's
not gonna play with you, you know what I mean?
Like if he tells you to do something, do it.

(32:25):
Very simple, right? So made my job easier, right?
Where these guys would like something as simple as, you
know, people hanging out in front of a certain store, right?
She doesn't want him there. OK, so you you tell me.
They gotta go. You're gonna argue with him.
There's no argument here. They're not gonna debate it.

(32:47):
You know, I'm telling you to leave, Like, come back in an
hour, and you're here. I'm locking you up.
But they didn't want to do that,right?
And and. I never understood why though,
like. I can imagine the conversation
between two criminals and and one of them just been beat up by
you and he's like, I hate that guy who he's like a girl

(33:09):
basically. Oh man, you.
Must have fucked up. Honestly though it's that's what
amazed me too though is this though that they didn't have
conversations like that. The conversations were because
they understood strength. That's the one thing they
understood, right? So they didn't look at you like
you were beating him up. It was like more of, of, yeah,

(33:34):
man, I fucked up. You know, I should have, I
should have listened, you know what I mean?
Like it's, it's kind of bizarre.And, and, and again, I, I tried
to explain this to the other guys where like you, it's OK if
you have to lock somebody up, right?
You just gotta, if you look, we had a saying, if you want to
fight, you gotta right? That's it.

(33:54):
You know, if, if you can't writea report, well, then you're not
going to be able to, to, you know, do your job really, you
know, So, yeah, and I'm certainly not going to go out
there and, and have to argue with somebody over something as
stupid as listen, you can't hangout here.
You gotta, you gotta move, right?

(34:15):
You know what I mean? Like, I got better things to do,
you know, and, and again, but itgets funny too, though, because
you get to a point where like when when you're more
experienced than you, you know, it, it sounds callous though,
but it's, it's, you know, like, and it's on different levels,
right? So when you're working in the
city, it's different, right? But it's the same, but it's a
different level. Yeah, right.

(34:36):
But when you're in a small town and, you know, you see that
underbelly of that town, right? And, you know, like it's a
Friday night and you're getting called to the same house like
3-4 or five times because they're arguing with each other,
right. And they're drunk and, you know,
it's just, oh, man, right. And you don't want to lock

(34:56):
somebody up because they're, so you wanna just try to calm them
down and you know, whatever. But, you know, I remember
getting called. This is funny, you know, but
like my third time getting called to this house and they're
arguing and and this time, though, I'm like, what was the
problem now? What is the problem now?
Like what? Well, he won't.
He won't let me watch what I wanna watch, and he won't give

(35:18):
me the remote to the TV. This is the kind of stuff you're
dealing with in the small town, right?
I said OK, All right. Do you have any extra batteries
in this house? Like, you know, show me where
you keep batteries. You have batteries?
No, we don't have any batteries.If we do, it'll be in a straw.
Alright, come on, open the drawer.
Alright, No batteries. Good.
Give me, give me the remote. Yeah, me remote.
I open up, I take the take the batteries out.

(35:40):
I throw them in the woods. I'm like, close it up.
Here you go. Now figure it out.
If you guys, if I get called here one more time tonight, I'm
locking his boat up. You know what I mean?
You. Get rid of the batteries.
That's the cop job. Let's go.
Right, they never called again. Not when I was working.
They never called, you know, Youget to that point where you're

(36:04):
like enough, This is madness, you know.
So again, and this, it's funny stuff, I mean.
Sometimes that you told me that sometimes you were on call, but
you didn't even know why. How come you didn't know why?
And the two, uh, like what were your restrictions?

(36:24):
Could you like not lead the cityor something like that?
Too. So like something sometimes I
would get called in when I wasn't on call.
OK. And that was because when I
worked in the small town, it wasjust me and my Sergeant, right?
And he was one of those guys that were, you know, my first

(36:46):
day I was on patrol there for eight months.
And then the chief, you know, promoted me to detective.
So my first day working there, Igo into the detective Bureau and
I, you know, whatever. And he gives me the speech, you
know, like you know. You work for.
Me exactly. We don't work together.

(37:08):
You work for me and it's only two of us.
There's only two me and him, right?
Like it just was ridiculous, right.
So that he set the tone with that.
And it wasn't just with me though.
Like he was nasty to everybody in the department, right?
Cause like, he was the most senior guy, you know, and it's

(37:28):
just one of those things. He came from a prominent, you
know, political family in the town.
So he knew that he was gonna eventually be the chief and he
that, that was it, you know, So yeah, yeah.
So when he was on call, they'd call him and he'd be like, no,
I'm not coming in. He just leave him hanging.
They called them cause they needed help.
Yeah. And no, I'm not coming in.

(37:51):
So they ended up, they'd start to call me and I would come in
because like I'm, you know, that's, that's wrong not to come
in. You know, they wouldn't call you
if they didn't need you, you know, So I would end up getting
pulled and, and you know, the one time, though, I got called
in and this leads into, you know, this is a story I put in

(38:15):
my book because I was when I wasin the hospital first couple of
weeks, I had to wear a diaper, right?
And because, you know, just the way it is.
And plus, I now close, you know,so, and that that's that's
sparked like a, you know, triggered a memory of this case
that I had to work where I got aphone call at my house, you

(38:37):
know, like, and I was not on call, you know, and I had no
obligation to lift to even answer the call, you know, but I
did. I lived 10 minutes from from my
headquarters, right? So I'm just, I was sitting,
sitting around just hanging around my wife, whatever.
And the Sergeant, I answered phones to Sergeant, and I'm

(38:59):
like, you know what's going on? You know, well, I got a problem
here. I need help.
I I'm not uncool. Yeah, well, you know, so and so
hung up on me. OK, what do you have?
I don't know what I have, what you need to know, what you have.
I I can't explain it. You got you.

(39:20):
You gotta come in. OK, So I jumped in the car.
Now I'm really interested actually, you know what I mean?
It's more, you know, interestingthan anything.
So I can't. But he moves me outside, right?
And I'm like, what's up? Why, you mean me outside?
He said. Well, I wanted to brief you.
We see them. Like what?

(39:42):
What am I walking into here? Right.
And I'm like, no, no, I'm going in.
I don't want you to leave me outside.
So I walk in, man. And I'm telling you, like it all
came to me, man, you know, like I realized why the Sergeant hung
up on him. I realized why he wanted to like
brief me outside because like. In the squad room, you know

(40:02):
standing in the corner is like this 6 foot 4 dude, like £300
giant right in a diaper. He's wearing a frigging diaper,
right, But it's a dirty diaper. It's disgusting.
It's running down his leg. You know what I mean?
I'm from his horrible right. He's standing on his Thorp and
the smell, right? And you know, listen, this is

(40:24):
this is a long time ago, right? So, you know, things were
different. You know, things weren't handled
much differently. I don't want to say they were
wrong because they weren't. I don't think things we've got
done back then. But you know, my initial
instinct was I wanted to beat the hell out of this guy.
Like, what am I looking at here?You're a grown man wearing a

(40:45):
diaper. Like I I don't even get to your
story yet and I'm about my head is about to explode, right?
Well, is he mentally all there or?
Yeah. Oh yeah.
Wow. OK, that's what made it worse
though. Right.
Yeah, for sure. Really intelligent, you know,
And so I come to find out that, you know, the Burger King in
that town, right? He kept ordering a soda and

(41:11):
going through the drive through.He did this like five times,
right? And, you know, as a teenage girl
working, working the drive through, you know, so this,
this, you know, this, this guy had a creep.
He's a creep. Yeah.
He had a fetish and he had like this like dirty diaper drive

(41:31):
through masturbation fetish. Like what the what is that right
like? Crazy, you know.
Look, OK, whatever, I don't carewhat you do, just don't bother
somebody else and you know that's.
It. Five times through the drive
through with a teenage girl thatyou're bothering, you know, I
mean, like, it's creepy, you know, obviously.
So the patrolman shows up, and you.

(41:52):
Know. And he's like, you're going to
headquarters, but you're not getting in my car.
So you, I'm gonna follow you, you're gonna drive, you know,
you're gonna go right to headquarters cause.
And I don't blame him cause. For sure the guy saw.
Disgusting. You don't want shit in the car.
Yeah, he's gonna spend the next 8 hours smelling it, you know,

(42:12):
So I, I don't blame him at all, you know?
So the guys there and the thing with this guy though, like he
knew as how far he could push, right?
And so I said to this Sergeant like.
Why don't you just? Charge them and send them to the
county jail. What are we?

(42:33):
What are you doing? Like I.
Don't like indecent exposure? Like that's it.
I I just I. Just looked.
I figured there's got to be a law that he broke.
You know I. Mean.
Yeah, for sure. Well, and the Sergeant says,
well, that's the thing. Like I can't find any laws that
he's broken. I'm like, no way.
So we're we sat there hours going through the law books

(42:58):
trying to figure out what we could charge this guy with right
now. He had been arrested in an in
the the county over the next county over, right, because he
was stupid enough to pull the same thing.
But he walked into the County Courthouse like that, right?
And then weren't playing any games with him.
You know, they just locked them up right off the bat charge,
right? So and the only reason why they

(43:19):
got away with that was because it was a they charged him with
interference of a government proceedings or something like
that, right? So, so now he was on probation,
OK. And so I said, alright, you know
what, I don't know what? I can't find something to charge
him with. The Sergeant can't find
something sword to charge him with, so I said alright, sorry,

(43:42):
Look, I'll babysit this guy all night.
I can't. We can't put him in the cell,
right? He's not charged with anything,
you know? And so I'm like, I'll babysit
him all night. You go back on the road these
thing, and in the morning I'll call his probation officer, you
know, and the, the, the Guild violate him and that's it.
They will send him away, right? Well, the probation officer, I

(44:06):
get him on the phone and he's like, yeah, no, I can't violate
him. Like what do you mean he can't
violate him? The guy, the nut job is sitting
here, you know, Nope, can't do it, right.
And that's the thing, like even like when I was talking to this
guy all night, he was extremely intelligent, right?
And he was really, he was enjoying it.
Like he was getting off on it with a like a smug like

(44:29):
attitude, right? Knowing that he knew I couldn't
charge him with. Nothing right?
And he knew. That and and he didn't demand to
be released. He was having a great time.
Right. Yeah, he was getting the
attention he wanted. Exactly.
And and it was, it was really pissing me off.
So I said alright, fine. So I'm like, I'm not giving up.

(44:51):
So I called the prosecutor's office and I, I, I get a, an
assistant prosecutor on the phone and what we go now we're
going back and forth trying to figure something out.
Now this guy, they can't find anything, right?
So I'm like, wait a second, there's something not right.
I started calling all the towns around and the next counties

(45:12):
over, everything. So by 3:00 that afternoon, I had
like, I think it was 52 reports of this, this guy doing the same
thing, right? Wow.
And so now I call up the probation guy and I'm like, hey,
look, you know about all these 52 times.
And he's like, Yep, I got everyone of those reports.
I'm like, I had to let go. I had to just let the guy go.

(45:35):
And I was like, I shook my head and I'm like, there's no way.
That guy, you know, look, I know, I know mental illness,
right? I'm compassionate and all that
stuff. This guy was not mentally ill,
man. He was a predator.
There's no. Doubt.
Exactly. He was in the beginning stages
and, and you know, I solved the problem though, because he never

(45:59):
came back to that town, right? Maybe because I, I intervened
them for too long. I don't know.
But he, he never came back, not,not while I was there anyway.
So I, I guess mission accomplished, right?
You know, but that's the kind ofweirdo stuff that you end up

(46:19):
seeing that. You.
Would never even imagine goes on, you know?
Hmm. But.
It's crazy, you know? And then like in the book, I
also like, you know, I was in a hospital, right?
And I was from New York, you know, we went over in the last
podcast. So I'm from New York, but I was
in North Carolina. So I didn't have any family down

(46:41):
there. And no one would shave me right
or cut my fingernails right. And that's really annoying, you
know, like, after a while, you know?
Yeah, So, and that pissed me off, right?
Because it's like, cause they like they, they felt that it
wasn't their job was my family'sresponsibility, Right.

(47:02):
Well, if you don't have any family, you just not gonna do it
for somebody. Like does it hurt you to take
two minutes to run an electric shaver or somebody's face?
You know, doesn't have to be perfect.
I'm not, you know we're not. And, and I think it's easier to
cut hair and do a nails than a wipe somebody and clean them
because they had to clean you obviously because you were
paralyzed. So the least you could do is

(47:23):
just cut the fucking nails in the in a shade the face there.
Exactly right. There's only 111 nurse that
would do it for me. This male nurse would come in
and do it every now and then when he was working, you know,
and you know, But that that thatbrought me back to one of the
stories in my book where I got acall, just a normal patrol.

(47:47):
I was on patrol for the small town before I made detective.
And it was just, you know, a woman was giving birth, right.
OK, no big deal, right? Ambulance is on the way.
I'm just going to show up, make sure she's breathing.
Just not a big deal, right? Yeah.
Well, that's so. So when I get there, I walk in

(48:08):
and it's, you know, it's night time, whatever, 10:00 maybe, but
I don't know. But.
There's. Blood everywhere, I mean
everywhere, right? I'm like, what the you know, so,
so the woman's on sitting on thefloor in her kitchen, right?
And she had given birth, so she's holding a baby.
OK, well. Now the umbilical cord, so her

(48:30):
placenta never dropped, right. So her umbilical cord, though,
was not attached to the baby anymore.
And it was spitting out blood like a like a, a, like a lawn
sprinkler, you know, I mean, it was going, it was.
So I walked in and and now bloodon a linoleum floor is really
slippery man. It's like it's.

(48:51):
Like, it's like hydraulic fluid,you know?
Yeah. Exactly.
Boom, I go down, right? And now I'm, I'm, I'm in just
covered in blood, you know, because you roll over it.
Yeah, you look like you did a murder.
Yeah, it's everywhere, right? You know, it's like, you know,
no use putting gloves on now, right?

(49:16):
So I grabbed the umbilical cord I, you know, cause I want to
stop the bleeding, you know, andI got it, you know, and, and I
could feel the pulse coming through it, you know, and it's,
that's gross, man. That is pretty.
Sure, that should have been disgusting.
You know what I'm saying, right?But I mean, you could feel her

(49:37):
pulse and it's strong, which is good though, you know, because,
you know, so I got it right. And you know, my Sergeant walks
in, right and. You're filled in blood.
Yeah, yeah, I'm covered in bloodand.
And you know, this guy, he was friends with my brother.
He's older than me, went to highschool with my brother, right.
But I think he's a great guy, you know?

(49:58):
And so here I am, I'm holding this thing and I'm covered in
blood. And he just, he's, so he starts
laughing at me, you know? But for sure.
You know, and I'm like, you knowwhat?
Knock it off. Give me something to clamp off
the cord with, you know? So he reaches in his pocket and
he hands me a a paper clip, right?
I'm like, you know what? Shove that up your ass, you

(50:20):
know, and like, good quote. Roll the paramedics.
She lost a lot of blood, man you.
Know. Yeah, for sure.
So with this, the ambulance corecomes though, you know, and and
I just passed the court off to them, like here you go, you
know, and I'm you know, so I leave.
I gotta go home, take a shower, put in with you in front on, you
know, whatever. But my point is, the whole, the

(50:41):
whole thing was though, like, like, I'm not a doctor or a
paramedic, right? I can't go there and say, oh,
that's not my job, you know, hmm, where's your husband?
You know, compiled the cord. Which you have a neighbor close
yeah, yeah for. Sure.
Yeah. Is there anyone that you know we
can call, right? No, I can't do that right.

(51:04):
And that that that's kind of like my point, you know, like
the we don't have that luxury. So like, I don't understand,
like it goes back to just the the simple, like just decency,
you know what I'm saying, right?And you know, she was fine, the
baby was fine, but man was that nasty though.
I'll never forget that. And I and my, my dad told me a a

(51:27):
story years ago that one of his best friend tried to take his
life and my, my dad went there fucking so fast or so Ray when
he arrived in the place, the kitchen is like almost 1/2 an
inch of blood, the whole kitchenbecause the guy cut himself, the
two wrists and there's blood fucking everywhere.

(51:48):
So the reaction of any best friend would be to run towards
your friend. And that's what my dad did both
forget it right when he touched that blood, he went down and he
hit that cupboard so fast because he's sliding till the
cupboard right beside his heart,because he never would have
thought that it would be slippy like that.
And he managed to stop the bleeding and save his friend.

(52:09):
And his friend is still living today.
But I remember when he told me that story and I was like, my
goodness, for sure. You never expect, you know it to
be a that slippery, but it's like hydraulic exactly like you
said. There, right?
Oh my God. I know that, right?
It was because like, I remember I, when I was in the Marines,

(52:30):
right? So I, I was in the reserves, you
know, but we still traveled a lot, you know, because the way
the Marine Corps Reserve works, it's not like National Guard.
It's different. So my company was attached to
like its sister company, right? OK.
And wherever they were in their training cycle, that's what we

(52:53):
followed. So if they were in, you know,
winter, like mountain combat training, we would do that.
You know, if they were in desert, we would do that, right?
So one of the, the, you know, inthe summers, we, I would go away
for like 3 weeks, you know, for training or whatever.
Sometimes it would be like, you know, like war games, maneuvers,

(53:14):
whatever. It was right.
And I remember I was on a ship. The ship's no longer active.
It was the USS Tripoli. And it was like a, it was like
an aircraft carrier for helicopters, right.
OK. I think it might have been
something like LPH or an LPV. I, I don't know, so long ago,
but so you're on that ship and you're in middle of the ocean

(53:36):
and you know, you, you don't realize how small you are until
you're like in the middle of theocean, right?
And in the middle of the night too.
And you're on that deck of that ship and you're, you're getting
loaded onto a helicopter, right?And there's all hydraulic fluid
everywhere, right? And you're climbing up the ramp
and you're slipping because you got 120 lbs of gear on your back

(53:59):
and a rifle, right? And you're trying not to form
bust your ass cause you'll take three guys out behind you, you
know, but I just remember as youclimbing up that ramp and you
look out onto the ocean, right? And you see the like the the
moon right off the horizon and that glow on the water, right?
Now. Reflecting.
You feel like you're so tiny, man, and you're just gonna fall

(54:22):
off the edge of the Earth, right?
And holy shit. Beautiful but scary, though, you
know what I'm saying? I'm saying somewhere else
slippery that was, you know, you're like, holy shit.
And that's exactly what it was on the blood, you know I'll
never, never forget. That oceans are beautiful and
dangerous at the same time. A lot of people that I saw live
survival stories because of their boat sinking or whatever

(54:44):
to the Knights that they were stuck there with no help.
They're they're, they're like you see something so beautiful,
but but so powerful at the same time that it's a it's incredible
how how you realize you're just that grain of salt in this
fucking immense water, bodies ofwater.
Yeah, it's, it's pretty crazy. I remember funny stuff though,

(55:06):
like, you know, like we were only on the ship for a couple of
days. We were in transit, right?
So we were waiting to get calledin, you know, because there were
war game and stuff out, whatever.
And we're right off the coast ofCalifornia banner towards San
Diego, right? So, OK, you know, but there were
actual Marines that were stationed on that ship like full

(55:31):
time, right, for whatever job they had, you know, a lot of
people security, because Marineswill do security on Navy ships
and stuff, you know, but I remember these, you know, then
all of a sudden you, you have like 300 of us come now.
And then now we're all, you know, locked down in the bottom
of the ship, right? Whereas there's like 8 racks,

(55:52):
you know, high, you know, you know, you got like this much
between each rack, you know, my,but I remember though, like just
the guys that were stationed on the ship and they hated us
because, you know, we uproot their whole world, you know, and
we're only here for a couple of days.
We're just, we're like on vacation.
Really. Yeah, exactly.
So this is. These guys would break our.

(56:12):
Balls, you know, like we'd give it right back to him, you know,
and like they they go work a 12 hour shift or whatever it was
and then they come in and like they're they're sleeping on
their rack and you know, we're like playing fucking cards on
their chest, you know, just to piss them off.
You know what I mean? Like stop doing that.
Shit, you know, like it was so. Much so much fun though, You
know, we just sneak around the street too, like, you know, try

(56:34):
and go places where we're not allowed, you know, And then all
of a sudden you walk into this fucking room and you're like, oh
shit, we're fucked. You know, I mean, cause like you
got all these like high-ranking officers looking down at these
like screens and shit, you know,and it's really dark and shit
there, you know, And it's just like that green glow coming off
this, you know, and they just look at you toom out the fucking

(56:57):
door, you know, man, you get screwed.
I don't want to. End up on a Brig and one of them
fucking chips, you know what I mean?
That's what they do. I'll throw you right in the
bridge, you know. So talk to us.
Fine, don't you ask? About.
Why? Why?
Wiretapping was so expensive back then.
And can you tell us the story about the wiretapping that you

(57:18):
talked to me about? I don't know why they.
Charge as much as they. Did cause it was 5000 a month
That's what you. Said.
That's crazy thousand It was 5000 a.
Line per month. Now at the time I I don't know
what it is. Now, you know, probably less, I
think, I think as a. Technology, I think probably
it's a way I'll Google it and put on the screen at the same

(57:39):
time, but I'm quite sure it should be probably lower now, I
would imagine you know because you know.
You know, back then, like we were, we were one of the first
like group to start doing be a Nextel point to point.
You. Know, you know, everyone,
everyone would say, oh, I got this.

(58:00):
They can't, they can't, you know, you know, monitor that.
Yeah, the hell we can't, you know what I mean?
Like so we had, you know, that like so, yeah, I don't know.
Why it was so expensive but the.Thing is though, like money,
that they don't care about the money, right?
They do, but they're going to get the money back.

(58:21):
Yeah, if the case is solid. Right.
But that's why, you know, you gotta, you build your case
right? And and you, you get it to the
point where, OK, I may have enough to have a judge sign off
on it, but I still got to convince my.
Department to pay for. It right now, if you're with the
DEA, money is no object, OK, Butit's different because it's

(58:46):
harder to get a US attorney to sign off on it, right?
They're more cautious, right. So it's like a give and take.
So sometimes you won't take thatcase to the DEA because you'll
know that you gotta go through, you know, US attorney that's
gonna say no or whatever cause they cause they, they, they

(59:07):
want, they want everything wrapped up in a in it with a bow
on it, right. Yeah, you know, guarantee
everything flawless. Yeah, yeah, you.
Know what I mean so. You know, since sometimes we
like, you know, just take it anddo it on a state level, you
know, but then we have to get our department to pay for it,
which they won't saying like if we're gonna seize $1,000,000 on

(59:29):
30 grand, nothing, you know, Yeah, for sure.
So. But you better.
Be right, you know? Yeah, you better be right.
You know I mean because you. It's a problem if you've come up
empty handed, you know, Which inturn causes a problem because
now you got. Because now your.
Motivations are all different. You know what I'm saying, right?

(59:50):
And, and that usually doesn't end well, right?
So it's like it's just you're always juggling something,
right, You know, so. So that case that that that
you're talking about though I was new to the.
Unit right, it's just. When I I left a small department
and I got assigned to. I went back to the shower

(01:00:12):
spartment and I was assigned to the DEA, but I was a good
detective. But I I had.
Never worked cases at that level.
You know, I did a lot, a lot of drug cases, right.
But there were St. level stuff, you know, with a little bit of
mid level, but nothing in the high level.
Like we, you know, I was assigned to the high level
narcotics unit, like like cartelstuff, you know what I mean?

(01:00:35):
Like a lot of money laundering and a lot of, you know, a lot of
like narcotics when we hit like it was, it was big stuff like,
you know, for example, right when we were bored.
And we are not. Nothing going on you.
Know we would go either like to the the city, you know,

(01:00:55):
Patterson or Newark, any major city and going to like whatever
section. Like, at the time, Hispanic.
Section, but it was really the Dominican section, you know
because they were the ones doingthe money on the rest time right
and we you could sit there in front of any like Western Union,
right and you would just watch and just you watch a guy walk
down the street it it'll happen you know it it may take a couple

(01:01:19):
of days but usually it'll happenGuy walking down with a
suitcase, you know, on wheels right through through, through,
through. He walks into the Western Union.
He comes back out, you know, walks away, you know.
Well, he's probably money laundering, right?
It's called smurfing, right? Couple grand here, couple grand
air. Do that all day and it's easy.
You just moved $100,000, you know?

(01:01:40):
Yeah, so you you could start your own case like that, you
know, just very easy by doing that, you know, just stop the
guy and say, yeah, you know, hey, how you doing?
Like, you know, you mind tellingme what's what's in a suitcase?
And he don't have to tell you anything.
You know you need to go scratch your ass, but they usually.
Don't do that like if that. If it's loaded with money, he's

(01:02:02):
gonna say, yeah, that's not mine, you know, and you know, so
we turn around. Ohhh, it must be mine then, you
know? Yeah, right.
And. There, well, I thank.
You bye bye. Alright, Well then you know so.
You. Go back and forth.
The bottom line is, though, likethey're responsible for that
money, right? Yeah.
There's 100 grand. There's 300 grand in in the

(01:02:23):
suitcase, right? Yeah, Well, any.
Good money. Launderer.
Has 300 grand in the bank because if that gets seized or
robbed, he's still responsible for that money, right?
One way or the other, he's responsible, you know so.
And the thing, too, is like, so if I grab the money, he wants a

(01:02:44):
receipt? No, that.
Hey, don't look. They took it from me.
It wasn't. Yeah, But then in that turns
around and, you know, the cartel's gonna look at that.
They're gonna start their own investigation.
They're gonna wanna know why, Why?
Why did the cops get on you? This is something you did?
Or is there an informant? You know what I mean?
Like. And so like, it's, it's

(01:03:05):
high-tech, man. I'm both ends, you know, You
know my. Sheriff when he retired.
From the the New York City. Police Department he was
assigned. A For a long time, the cartel
tried to hire him to work for them to do investigations when

(01:03:26):
they were when they had seizures, you know, when when
they lost money, right? You know, he, he told to go fuck
themselves, you know what I mean?
But you guys don't come to go fuck themselves because I think
they approached him. They said, look, it was an
attorney there approached him. What was it like some thug off
the off the street and they're like, look, whatever, it's not.
Illegal. You'll be, you'll be an instant

(01:03:49):
millionaire. You know, you know.
You look. Most guys are gonna take that
job. Yeah, a lot of guys will.
Yeah, you know. Because when they say.
It's not illegal. You know, it might not be moral
or right. Yeah, yeah.
So. You know he.
He was a very, you know, straight guy though you.

(01:04:11):
Know what I mean Like. He was a maniac, Kudo.
He really was. You know, he was like
incredible. What he did, though, like, you
gotta be a little nuts. Like he was on the cover of for
years. Like, you know, like really
deep, like doing, like finding. Islands to make airstrips.
On and shit like that, you know,to move the money like he was

(01:04:32):
really you know, so he ended up having like 3 three hits put out
on him like my you know so he hewrote a book and everything he
made a. Movie about him.
You know, he but he was a great guy to work for.
He like you knew that, that, that, that they had your back.
You know, because that's one thing like I, I don't, I didn't

(01:04:53):
mind doing my job. I enjoyed it.
You know, it was dangerous and everything, but I knew that they
had my. Back it made my job.
Easier, right? Yeah.
You're not weren't always. Worried, you know, that if you
do something that they're out toget you, right, You know, But
when I was in the small town though, when I had that other,

(01:05:14):
that Sergeant I worked for, yeah, he was always looking to
burn me no matter what, you know, and so.
And it makes a difference, you know.
But I still did my job only in the small town because the chief
was on my side, right? So I and all.
I'm trying to do is my. Job though, you know, yeah,
that's just how bizarre is that?Though, right?

(01:05:34):
Like I'm just. Trying to do my job.
I'm just trying to do it. But what he should have been
doing the whole time, right? But he, he had other plans,
whatever. But so, so anyway, so I got to
the unit and the chief that was in charge of my unit also worked
with this sheriff guy I was justtelling you about, right.

(01:05:55):
So he retired from New York. Also another great guy, like
just a great, great guy. So he says to me, look, you
know, I don't know you. You're new here.
You know, you have a great reputation, but you're not
experienced when it comes to this level of work.
So I'm gonna send you out for some schools.

(01:06:15):
I'm just like, great, you know, because everything you said was
right. There was nothing he said to me
that wasn't accurate. So, you know, So I got sent to
two schools. One was called Heida.
Heida one. No, Heidi 2, because I already
got the one so high, which stands for High Intensity Drug
Trafficking Area. OK.
And the other school was Top Gun, which was undercover

(01:06:39):
narcotics school, right? OK.
So when I was in the Top Gun portion, you know, I got a call
from my chief saying that there was a guy.
That kept. Calling the sheriff's tips line,
saying that somebody selling drugs, blah, blah, blah.
And he finally got through and actually spoke to the sheriff,

(01:07:02):
right? And the sheriff promised to
look, no problem, someone's gonna take care of it.
So being that nobody wanted to do it because it was a tips line
case, you know, most of these guys were like, that's not going
to lead to nothing. I'm not doing that.
So he called me up and order, you know, not that he didn't
have to order me. I was all over it, You know, why
not? I'll take it for sure.

(01:07:23):
And it's your first big case, right?
There by yourself. You know that.
So I got out at school. I started right away on, on
surveillance, and I found the perfect spot to park my car
where nobody was gonna notice me.
And I was up on a hill. I could see everything, you
know, And I, I was, I could takegreat pictures and it was just

(01:07:44):
perfect. And um, I sat there for a month
just doing surveillance every day, every day, every.
How many hours a day we're talking about?
It depends on how busy it was. You know, OK.
But at least you know 910, right?
And if it was busy, you stay. You're not going anywhere, you
know? Yeah.
You can't move. Yeah.

(01:08:04):
And and the hardest part about that?
Was like fighting the temptationbecause you wanna just go down
there and just, you know, just pull somebody over just to see
what they got in a bag. You know what I mean?
You know, and you know, but you can't, you know, and, and that
that's the thing, like a lot of guys don't like doing like the
kind of work that I did, you know, because they need

(01:08:25):
patience. Patience.
Months. 3-6 months sometimes working on a case right.
You know where these guys are like hell no, I got you know
they they wanna and we tell these guys all the time Look,
just. Don't.
Don't do it. Just give the information to us,
we'll sit on it and when it's time to go, take down everybody.

(01:08:46):
Yeah, exactly. You'll come, you'll it'll be
your job. They couldn't do it, you know,
they just couldn't. So because it wouldn't destroy a
case if you just. Pick up the runner and that's it
because you want the big fish atthe end, the one that's at the
top. So if you just arrest him right
away, one to panic in the criminal group happens and then
you they could change all their numbers move right away.

(01:09:07):
So you don't want that. You want the the whole ever.
Most people one shot at the end though, so you gotta be patient.
Yeah, and and you know, like. And the anti crime guys were the
worst, you know, because they needed it now they want it now.
Numbers, numbers, numbers overdoing.
I'm like, yeah, but you're, you're blowing so much, you
know, you're missing so much that they didn't care.

(01:09:29):
So, you know, you can't change them, you know, but we would
have, we would actually, you know, anything get boring at
times. But I love surveillance.
I always loved surveillance, youknow, because you just sitting
there, you're watching shit or and, you know, like you were
usually with a bunch of guys, right?
And, you know, 1 personal this job, I was doing it this time I

(01:09:51):
was alone. Yeah, yeah.
But when when it's something like that's heated up, you know,
you would have a bunch of guys and, you know, one, one person
will have, you know, we call it the eye, right?
One person has the eye and everybody else is just parked
off somewhere doing, you know, close by, you know, until
somebody relieves that guy, you know, and then they have the
eye, right. So and it's.

(01:10:13):
Fun. You know what I mean?
You sit around for hours at. Times, you know.
And you're just, you know, just just, you know, messing around,
having fun, you know, whatever reading, who's reading the book,
you know, and you know, it's just, it's you know what, my one
partner, Jose, he would just like to eat ice cream all the
time, you know, and I'd be like,you know, we, we start arguing

(01:10:34):
about that like, you know, how many fucking ice cream cones are
you going to eat today? You know what I mean?
Like holy shit, you know, like, so it's just stuff.
Like that you. Know, I mean, just just fun
stuff. But anyway, I was on
surveillance and it was like every day and these guys were
coming out and and they got bagstheir hand and every, every
plate that I would, I wouldn't, you know, take pictures of.
They all came back to to people with drug arrests and, you know,

(01:10:58):
just, it was it was just beautiful, you know, I mean, it
was like everything you wanted and the case, you know, yeah.
And so, yeah, there's. Like 30 days and I went to my
chief. And I got a whole file and look
and said this is what I got. This was going on, you know, And
he's like, that's great, this isgood stuff, he said.
But. I don't want you.
Working alone, I'm gonna hook you up with, you know, some of

(01:11:18):
these guys because at the time he was in charge of my group,
because what had happened was mysheriff and the prosecutor
formed this task force together,right?
And they set up a street level narcotics units, mid level and
then high level, right? And then they asked every town
to send detectives to be assigned to that group, right?

(01:11:43):
So, you know, you figure there's16 towns in the county, you
know, and, and they filled all the all the they stacked all the
groups like that with you know, so you know, he's like, all
right, well, we're going to go, we're going to hit one in the
middle level guys. You know, we're going to
Sergeant from there and you'll work it with that.
I was like, alright, great, that's cool.

(01:12:03):
So we get there and it's this Lieutenant.
He's a maniac. Right.
This guy, he's a. He was a Marine, you know, and I
didn't. I had.
Never met him. And it was another guy, big dude
Frank, Filthy Frank. That's that's my nickname for

(01:12:23):
him. So he had just gotten out of the
DEA for like 10 years. So he worked giant cases.
He was like a wiretap expert, you know?
So he saw that shit for years though.
Years, man, and he was just really good.
At it, man, and and this guy wasanother one He was like 6 foot
like 3 or 4 long hair man, you know like tattoos everywhere.

(01:12:44):
You're like he was just he looked like a you know, I mean a
beast. He looked like what you would
think, right? Yeah.
So. They're.
Like they're trying to steal a case.
From me, you know, they're like,why don't you just give us the
file? We'll take care of it and you go
back to doing what you're doing after a.
Month of me sitting. And.
Working this much? Fuck off.

(01:13:06):
Exactly. Go from the.
Fuck you. You.
Well, we're working at CASE anyway.
I'll let me see your case file, you know?
You don't have one because you're full of shit, you know?
And this is how the conversations going.
We're in a meeting now, you know.
Yeah. Yeah.
With the boss. With the boss just sitting there
going, you know? Yeah, and finally was like.
Alright, that's enough. You know what?
You're gonna work the fucking case together, and that's just

(01:13:27):
the way it is, OK? You know, That's it.
So that title, that was in person?
I mean, it wasn't. Personal, you know I'm.
Saying but they didn't. They just, they had locked these
guys up, you know, prior. So I understand their thought.
They knew actually do it right. Yeah.
Bullshit, you know. What I mean no.
Way and it turned out they were really great guys and I had so

(01:13:48):
much fun with them anyway, you know, and I looked at everything
differently too, like I looked at all the whatever job we were
doing. I I always looked to have fun
with it too, because that's why we're here.
Though honestly, like I could have got a job working in an
office somewhere if I wanted to be bored and miserable, you know

(01:14:08):
what I mean? But now here we are.
We get to play cops and robbers.We have, we've reached the
pinnacle, right? We're we're where we want to be,
right? No ones bothering us.
We're safe, right? There's nobody out to get you
nothing right? Because that happens a lot, so
why not have fun with it, you know?

(01:14:30):
And we usually did. So we started working this case
and it turned out, you know, we got on a wire and these guys
were, you know, they were all over the map and it turned into
an organized crime wire also because they had connections.
To to organized. Crime.

(01:14:50):
But they weren't like made guys or anything like that.
They were wannabees, really, right?
So they were running around. Acting like they show.
Sopranos, right? But there are a bunch of clowns
though. Really.
You know, but it. They were.
They were interesting to say. The least right.
And, you know, we, we'd be on the wiretap and they'd say stuff

(01:15:11):
like, oh man, I just saw the. Twins, you know, cause.
The the twins is my partner Joseand his brother, right.
I just saw the twins. I think they're following us.
We can't talk on the phone no more.
Oh yeah, you're right. No, that's we're not talking on
phone no more. Alright, when you guys get in
that that ketamine, OK, you knowwhat?
I mean like they just. Said it they.

(01:15:32):
Just said they're. Not gonna talk on the phone no
more, right? So you shake your head like holy
shit, you know, like and they dothat shit all the time.
So so back then since none of them.
Were recorded. You had to write everything down
that was incriminating. No, no, it was all recorded.
OK. It was.
Recorded after the. OK.
And you know, we also. Had like, so I didn't actually

(01:15:54):
sit there and monitor the wire, you know, we had people to
monitor it. We just oversaw, you know, what
was said. You know and.
And. It was an organized crime wire,
right? And there was this, this
attorney. Was very.
Prominent in in working for someof the police unions, right?

(01:16:19):
Well, he used. To.
Have all these organized crime guys come to his office to talk
right so like and he ended up getting caught up on our wire,
you know so once that happened the prosecutor shut the wire
down on that end of it No, it's not no more no more organized
crime stuff you know buddy, I guess they.

(01:16:40):
OK, no problem. We got a little too close,
right? You know what I mean?
Wow. So it's so funny.
It's so ridiculous though, right?
But so anyway, we're on, we're on this wiretap and we had
nickname one of the guys the Aardvark, right?
Because he had his giant nose, right?
And so the phone rings and it's the Aardvark calling the main

(01:17:02):
target of our investigation, right in the book.
I call, I call him Caluso. It's not his real name.
But and this guy too, though, this guy was on was like the one
of the top like 30 people on thelist to be hired by the state
police, right? Graduated from Rutgers, you
know, college. Like this guy was like sharp

(01:17:23):
man, you know, but he chose the other way.
He just wanted, you know, and kind of a shame though, you
know, I mean, like, it's ridiculous, but whatever, you
know? So he the artwork.
Calls. Caluso, right?
And he's going on a phone. You know how?
Like, you know, we scored, man. You know, we got tons of bread,

(01:17:48):
man, right. And the guys like, oh man, what
did you hear? What you.
Hear you know he's all. Excited and shit, he's like,
we're rolling in dough, you know, and this the guys like,
what, what, what do you got? Come on, you know what he's
going on and on and what was oneother one like?
I don't remember exactly, but towards that line.
And finally he turns around and says what the fuck did you guys

(01:18:10):
hit, you know? And he says, what?
What do you got? He got the guy goes, well, we
got everything. We got rolls, we got loaves, we
got Fukuchi and guys like, what the fuck are you talking about?
He's like, yeah, we robbed a bread truck in Manhattan and
because we were hungry, so theseguys around fucking throwing

(01:18:30):
rolls at people, hitting people overhead with fucking loaves of
bread and shit, right? That's all.
But thought they were, you know,I'm saying so, you know, it's
just hilarious though, man. Like we laughed so hard with
that one, you know. And it turns out though, like a
couple days later, Boone County sheriffs patrol right they.

(01:18:53):
Were a county. Patrol, right?
So we were county patrol also, but they just had a whole
department of County patrol, right?
They didn't have a jail attachedto them.
It was just you know, they endedup pulling the aardvark.
I think it was your works brother and two other guys that
were in this crew, right? And in the back seat they had
this dude with him who is like, you know, like help me, help me,

(01:19:15):
right? So they locked him up.
And. The story was that, um, the
girlfriend, the ex-girlfriend ofone of the idiots in this group,
right? One of the guys kept a bag of
money at her house, 150 grand hehad stored up in her closet,
right? And her junkie boyfriend at the

(01:19:38):
time found the bag of money, right?
Atlantic City, and he spent 150 grand on fucking hookers and
coke, right? So they went, they went fucking
nuts. They wanna kill him like God for
sure got no. Money.
He spent it all. Every.
Last fucking time he spent so they, they kidnapped them and
they fucking chained them up in the in the gym that they work

(01:19:58):
out in, you know, and they wouldjust beat, they beat the shit
out for like 3 days with dumb bells and shit, you know like
and they were transporting, they're bringing them to New
York for something and that's when they got pulled over.
So they got locked up and saw the guy got saved.
The equipment, the junk you got saved by cops cause he was right
in the back seat there of all this like just save me out of

(01:20:19):
here yeah yeah yeah because you.Know I don't know what would.
Happen to that guy, he I don't, I don't think he would have
fucking made it I guess yeah, meneither me neither because.
They know that that kind of thattype of person won't go get that
150,000 back there. So so it's like you can teach
him a lesson however you want, but you ain't getting it back.
So maybe they would have just finished them.

(01:20:42):
Yeah, I think so too, because. They're gonna get the money.
Back, but yet this guy now has that over their head, right?
Yeah, yeah, you know, they fucked up.
Big time with that one. Though because we knew alright,
we gotta take down. Our end because.
They're gonna start to, you know, it's gonna start crumbling
on them fast. And now we don't know who else
is watching them now too, right?Because you're supposed to index

(01:21:03):
your case, right? Nobody does.
Nobody does that shit. Because the second you do that,
it opens up your case to be stolen from anybody, right?
OK. And that's a big deal.
You know. You work on something for a long
time, and then all of a sudden somebody swipes it out from
underneath you. You're like these motherfuckers,
you know, And it happens more than than put it this way, like

(01:21:24):
when we were in in work and added a Norco office at a DEA in
New Jersey, right, We had federal.
Jurisdiction. We could go all.
Over the country, right But yeah, if I cross that bridge and
go into New York, I have to I'm supposed to notify New York DA
that we're crossing the bridge and we've got to tell them what
we're doing and why we're there.Bullshit.

(01:21:46):
Not doing that because they're going to steal your case.
Bottom line 100% no doubt. They don't call Jersey when they
come over, you know, so. That shit works.
Like, it's so stupid, right? But it's just it's because they
wanted the recognition. Of finishing the the the case or

(01:22:06):
because it's in their town places like you know because.
They want the whatever, you know, everybody's looking for
numbers, right? They gotta keep, they're gonna
justify their existence, right? So if they could steal your
case, they will. It's horrible, but you know, so
we, we said, right, we gotta take this, we gotta take this

(01:22:26):
case down, you know, And so we did all that, you know, bathing,
ready to get it done. And so now, alright, everybody
spreads out. Everybody's gotta target and
they're going to get whoever they get.
And you know, and so it was me, Jose's brother.
Laz. And there's another guy from the
prosecutors office we were goingto get the main target and you

(01:22:49):
know, sort of surveillance guys had them.
They were he was in Bergen County mall, right?
And he was eating dinner with his girlfriend in the
restaurant. So like, all right, he's always
girlfriend perfect. But the reason why we went to
get him because he knew my partner Jose and his brother, so

(01:23:09):
we figured he wouldn't fight, you know, because we don't wanna
fight these guys, man, you know what I'm saying?
Like you don't want nobody get hurt at the.
End. And you know, no matter what
side Yeah, exactly right. So the.
Easier way you can do it, you'regoing to do it, you know.
Damn right, so. You know.
We. We're going as soon.

(01:23:30):
As we walk the restaurant season, he.
Sees and boom, he's got he's running OHP shit.
You know, this guy's like the fucking gazelle, you know, I
mean like he's in great shape and we're so we're chasing him
through the whole mall and it's getting ridiculous and, and
finally, like he stops and then we stop for all out of breath
him, us, right. And so my, my partner, Jose,

(01:23:52):
he's sitting there and he's likebent over, right?
And he's like sucking wind, right?
And he's like, and he reaches back and he fucking grabs his
handcuffs and he tells him put these fucking handcuffs on or
I'll shoot you right. Fucking hairy tales.
No I didn't, I burst out laughing.
I'm like, holy shit, that's funny.
You know, I mean cause that is funny.
You know there's no sure. Handcuff yourself bro.

(01:24:13):
The fucking guy takes the handcuffs.
And he puts them on right. So, you know, the, the guy was a
gentleman, though, you know, I mean, like, he, he, he, he
didn't give us a hard time at all, you know, And so whatever,
you know, whenever we lock somebody up to that wasn't an
asshole, we treated him well, you know, like, yeah, I.
Mean the first. Day like I was working with

(01:24:36):
these guys with the DI got a DEAcase I think it was no.
It was the third day was. When we took down the heroin
mill, right? Yeah, so after, you know, we got
the 18,000 bags of heroin and everything and everything, you
know, we had to transport one ofthe one of the guys to the the.

(01:24:57):
DEA headquarters. In Newark, right?
And didn't speak any English. So I'm in the backseat with him
and it's, you know, Hose and BigLenny.
And there, there, there Jose's talking to him.
You know, I I call it ABBA on him.
He's able on him and so the guy thirsty, right, So so Jose says

(01:25:18):
to big line, you know, pull all these guys over drink.
So they get out. I'm going back with the guy.
You know, they come back now. You understand, like I'm I just
came from the small town right now.
This is all fucking new to me right And I I'm thinking they're
going into the store to come back with water bottles and

(01:25:40):
shit, right? No comes back in with a with a
fucking 6 pack of Mandela right And so you know the fucking
guys. Going to jail 15.
Years, you know, I mean, there'sno doubt, you know.
So they, they hand him a beer, whatever, he's drinking it.
And fucking Jose opens one and I'm like, fucking give me one.

(01:26:00):
Then what the fuck? I'm not gonna sit.
Here without a beer, right? You know, And it was like, no
big deal, right? And that's the difference
though, like you're working at such a high level, you know, no
one's gonna bitch at you for having a beer because you just,
you haven't been home in fuckingthree days, you know what I
mean? Like someone will say something,
you'd be like, shut up. You know, you'll, you'll find

(01:26:22):
like that that idiot Lieutenant that's walking around that has
no idea about anything and he doesn't realize that you haven't
been home in three days, right? And and that's, that's the kind
of guy that will say something, right?
And then all of a sudden now he's offended when somebody
tells him to go fuck himself, right?
Next, you know, he wants to write the guy up, right?

(01:26:42):
You know, but always, there's always a chief somewhere says,
listen, first of all, mind your own fucking business and leave
the guys alone because while youwere home sleeping, they've been
working for fucking three days, you know what I mean?
Like that's always the the when guys make.
Rank they lose their. They they lose their mind, you
know what I mean? Like all of a sudden, like
rules, these rules matter, that they never follow.

(01:27:05):
They never followed these, but now.
Yeah. You know.
Oh, there's a stickler for the. Rules now, right?
You know you can't take guys like that seriously though, uh.
We were on a. Surveillance one day and I get a
call. Well, first of all, one time
they left me out in. Surveillance when I was when I

(01:27:26):
was. New, right?
They sent me out on surveillanceone day, right?
And OK, I said there was a house.
I was watching. I'm sitting here.
I'm sitting here. Nobody ever came to relieve me.
I didn't, you know, just sittingthere.
Finally I got a call. It was from my buddy.
Goes. He's like, hey, where are you?
I'm like, what do you mean wheream.
I'm fucking surveillance. I'm where You know, you guys

(01:27:47):
sent me out. He's like, oh shit, we forgot
you. Yeah, dinner.
We're we're in this bar over on whatever fucking St.
You know we're done. Our day we forgot about.
You forgot about you, you know. I I'm like, OK, I'll be.
Right there. Fuck it, you know.
What I mean like, but you know, you know, I was the new.

(01:28:09):
Guy man, you know, but. It's so funny shit though, you
know when you share real No, go ahead, go.
Ahead. One time we're on surveillance
and. My chief Balls is a Friday
afternoon. He said, hey, you gotta you
gotta meet me in the park. I'm like, yeah, sure, no
problem, Chief. Like what's he doing out here,
you know? But he was a working chief, so

(01:28:29):
that wasn't really unusual to see him out there, you know, And
he's got this, he's in his. Big minivan.
He's like getting back, alright.I opened the door like everybody
sitting in the back of this minivan drinking beer.
He's got, he's got a cooler. I'm like, what the fuck?
How long you guys been sitting here?
It's like, well, about an hour. We're done for today.
I'm like, alright, cool, you know?
But kind of shit though. Like that's why I loved it so

(01:28:52):
much. Because these guys were.
So cool, though, you know, I mean, like they weren't they
weren't. It was just a great job, man.
You know can can you share one of the?
Funny pranks that you and your team pulled during your time in
law enforcement, you know. That stuff usually happened.
When I was on a on a motorcycle squad, I got and we had a

(01:29:14):
Sergeant that hated us. We hated him and he was just.
He was. Just ridiculous you.
Know he had these rules for us like you know we couldn't come
in at the end of the day until we wrote 20 tickets right that's
a lot the guys on regular patrolthey they they only have to
write 20 tickets a month he wanted it a day what a huge

(01:29:35):
difference it's. Huge.
And you know. Like you working in the like the
inner city. So you're going to run across
arrests. You know you're not.
You can't help it when you're pulling that many cars over.
You're going to find drugs. Your guys are going to run on
you. Uh, who's gonna fight you?
You know, I mean, you're gonna, he didn't care.
He still gonna go back out 20 days like it was, it was

(01:29:57):
annoying. It was unbelievable, man.
But here's what it is and you know, whatever.
We had great hours, you know, weekends and holidays off work,
5:50 and you know, and it was worth it, so whatever.
And we did it, but. They hated this guy, right?
The. Whole squad hated this guy.
I was second in command of the unit right, but they and I don't

(01:30:19):
blame him like dude, I hated this guy you know like he was
horrible. So whenever they could they
would fuck with him bad like I walked into the to the
motorcycle garage one day and mypartner at the time was a guy JP
right. We called them right.
Everybody loved this guy. He was just the funniest guy you
know always in a great mood. One of those guys, right?
And I walk in and and. I'm watching them.

(01:30:42):
I see the fuck he's doing. I watch like about a minute for
and what are you doing? Like he's he's he's armor
rolling the sergeants fucking seat and the fucking.
Tire, right? The side, the sides of the tire
too, though, right now you can'tdo that.
You shouldn't do that on a motorcycle because you know
you'll fucking slip. You get chance of hitting a

(01:31:04):
yellow line. Forget about it if it's wet,
right? But with the seat though, I'm
like, why? What are you doing that for?
You know, this way when he hit his brakes he would slide and
ram his. Balls into the.
Seated into the tank of the motorcycle, right?
That's genius, man, You know what I mean?
Like that's fucking. Genius.
That's genius. So I'm like, man, it's creative.

(01:31:26):
And. You know, like.
Another time though, like I listen.
This guy was bad though, like normally I'd stand up but this
guy was just horrible. He ruined so many guys careers,
you know, for for no reason, youknow, just because they didn't
like jump high enough for him. You know he didn't do that like

(01:31:48):
with. Me and hose and.
JP because we, we were, we started that unit with him, you
know, so he couldn't get away with that shit with us, you
know. But there's any new guys that
would come on? Yeah, he would just hammer them.
Yeah, like if they didn't like, you know.
Kiss his ass enough, whatever like then he would get rid of
him and ruin him, you know, and it was it was wrong, you know,

(01:32:11):
and it was but they let him get away with it, which I never
understood why like the the bosses let him get away with.
But you know, it was a differentsheriff at the time than than
that New York City guy, you knowit, it was different.
So but he goes on vacation one time and I walk in and this this
guy Mark big head. So we call the pumpkin head and

(01:32:35):
he's, he's pissing in the sergeant's helmet, right?
So I mean what? What the fuck are you doing?
Like, what are you doing? And first of all, who's helmet
is that? Better not be my fucking helmet,
you know what I mean? He's like, you know, and he's
like, I would never do that to you, you know, I'm like, who's
is it? He's like, oh, it's fucking so.
And so I'm like, I'll fuck him, you know, so And he, he fucking

(01:32:59):
takes, he swishes it around, he leaves it out in the sun and he
lets it bake into the padding onthe helmet and everything and
puts it and hang it back up on arack.
You know, and I'm like. Oh, that's so nasty.
Great. So now though, I didn't think
this went through because, you know, for the rest of my time on
the bikes, like we would do a lot of funeral details, right?

(01:33:19):
And so I'd I'd always have to, you know, stand next to this guy
whenever we're like standing at attention or whatever, you know,
and so I'd be always standing next to him, especially if it
was hot, right? He's like, get this bead of
sweat running down his face, right.
You know, he's, you know, sayinglike you smell piss, I smell
pissed, you smell piss, and I'd be like like, holy shit, no, I

(01:33:40):
don't smell anything storage. Not that I'm like God, right?
But that's the shit though, like.
You gotta be. Careful, you know, like don't
fuck with the wrong people. Exactly.
You know what I'm saying? Like.
Yeah, it's just, it's stupidity,right?
You know another time he we're doing lineup and he.

(01:34:00):
And it's always. With this guy Mark, for some
reason, pumpkin head, you know, and he says to it does lineups,
hands out assignments, whatever.And he he says, ohe Mark, grab,
grab a patrol unit. Now that's a big deal.
Too Cause we're on motorcycles. You know, I mean, now take the
guy who's already got his gear on the bike and he's gonna take

(01:34:22):
all those fucking gear off and put it in a patrol car.
It's a pain in the ass, right? Yeah, your vest, you're shotgun,
all kinds of shit, right? Because now you're a patrol car,
right? So, so you just take control
car, go to my house. I, I, I caught a fucking
Groundhog and one of those humane traps and you drive it
all the way up county up into the like the, the park at the

(01:34:43):
tip of the county and let the fucking thing go.
So Mark's like you. Can tell he's pissed off he's.
Pissed, right? Yeah.
And we're just thinking, you know, like, wow, better you than
me, you know? What I mean like.
So. He does it, couple days go.
By you fucking areas, Sergeant. Again, Mark getting same thing.

(01:35:03):
Get a fucking choke. I caught another Groundhog.
Gotta take it back up there. OK, that's the fucking thing off
cause. Back.
Three days ago by the fucking. So I was like, I can't.
I gotta fucking have this giant family of fucking groundhogs in
my backyard, you know, And you're Mark picked.
OK, so that's it, Mark, what thefuck is going on?

(01:35:24):
I said all right, he's like thatmother fucker.
He said I go to his house every day and I open the fucking trap
of the of the the humane trap. And I kicked the fucking thing
until the Groundhog walks out and I let him go.
He says. I don't fucking take Groundhog
anywhere, you know, So if he's catching the same Groundhog, he

(01:35:45):
said I'll do this everyday till I retire, he said.
Fucking great, you know what I mean?
Like. That.
That's what a. Great way to start your day
though, laughing your ass off like that, right?
Well, and it was, it was just fun.
Some really fun stuff. Well, you tell yourself, you
kick that book a couple. Of times you won't come back,
but you came back, right? You know, you know, and the.

(01:36:09):
Sergeant was such a he was so nasty man, you know, You know,
he had these like the. Problem with him was.
He could have been a good guy, you know, he had potential,
right? But what it was, was he knew
that they were looking to make somebody a captain in charge of
patrol, right? And he knew that they weren't
following the the protocol. Like you didn't have to be

(01:36:32):
Lieutenant to to qualify for it.The sheriff was.
Just gonna pick somebody. And that was it.
Give me all nod and you're fucking captain, right?
So he he figured the more he broke our balls, it would show
whatever, but it backfired on him because.
You. Know half his unit didn't just

(01:36:53):
ask for transfers. We all quit.
You know, I ended up leaving with my partner JP.
We went to the small town that that I grew up in right?
You know, a pumpkin head and, and another guy went to the town
they were living in, you know, because we were, we were good
cops and these small towns wouldlove to have us, you know, cause

(01:37:15):
we, we had, we had experience inall the towns in the county, you
know, and the city, right? We had two cities and the jail.
Right. And the jail we.
Won't we all started? In the jail, right, You're all
all around. Knowing what you're doing, you
know because for example like. The small towns, I don't know

(01:37:35):
about all of them, OK, But I know the one I went to and the
one hope you had went to the sergeants.
Had to write criminal. Complaints, right?
So if the petroleum locked somebody up for whatever, they
they couldn't do the paperwork, the Sergeant had to do it.
Wow, that one good thing about our Sergeant on the bikes, you

(01:37:58):
know, as much as he was an asshole, but he trained us
really good, you know, and it was smart because we were
aggressive. If he had to write all that
paperwork and like he never, he would never be able to leave
headquarters. So we learned how to write all
our criminal complaints and and all the and we knew the the

(01:38:20):
motor vehicle code, like forget about it.
Like we didn't have to look at the book.
You know what I mean by art. So these towns love this, you
know, I remember like when, whenI first got to, you know, where
I went and you know, I had, I made an arrest some guy and it
was like nothing for me cause the guy handed me a fake
driver's license in fake insurance card, right?

(01:38:41):
And I, I looked at it, it was it, I knew it was bullshit.
I knew it was fake. I gave him one chance to tell me
the truth. He lied to me, locking the fuck
up, you know, and because I always.
Gave him the chance like hey. Listen, I know it's bullshit.
Tell me the truth. You know I I may spare you if
your story is good enough. You know what I'm saying?
This. Guy was gonna try to outsmart
me, like alright, fuck you then I'm locking you up.

(01:39:02):
So I brought him in the headquarters and I'm just typing
away. Whatever.
So. So what are you doing?
And I'm doing a chronically why?It's like, how do you know how
to do that? Oht, That's why you know, well,
I'm supposed to do that. You feel free if you want, but
that's crazy, you know? And.

(01:39:23):
That's kind of I think why I made Detective.
Though, you know. I mean, because, I think because
of that arrest, really because they were like, well, how did
you know that was fake? I'm like, cause just look at it.
You know, we were just so used to seeing that all the time, you
know, it was like nothing like we, we end up, we honestly, we
probably had hundreds of arrestsfor that.
Yeah. Just working in the city, you

(01:39:43):
know, and there were, you know. How many of?
Them rolled through that town that they had no idea, right.
So it shows, though, you know, when, when you're you're trained
the right way. Yeah, yeah.
Well, you don't. Need to look.
At all the. Books there all.
Is this a card legit? You're like, oh, I don't know, I
don't know. But when you see it all,

(01:40:05):
especially when you went to the big city, you probably right
then and there seen it all rightthere.
And so you can't fool that guy after, Yeah, I mean, because it
was like, it was so obvious. With the fake ones, because they
were coming out of the same place in, in, in, in the city.
So once you seen one of them, they were all the same.
You know, the paper was wrong. The, the, the, the number, like

(01:40:26):
every insurance carrier has a number assigned to it.
The number didn't match the Carrie was so many different
ways you could figure out it wasthat these guys had no idea, you
know, and I don't blame them. They just didn't, they didn't
deal with it a lot. They weren't in the streets like
you were, so. Right.
You know and. You know, a lot of guys wanted
to learn, which is great. Other guys, you know, they liked

(01:40:48):
it the way it was. You know, that's the thing with
the small town like these guys, A lot of these guys were lazy
man, you know, like, but not allof them.
A lot of them, you know, there was a lot of really good cops
though, too, though that were, you know, I look, I had the
luxury though. The town that I went to work in,
I went to high school and everybody was working there.
You know, some were older, some were younger.

(01:41:09):
You know, I, I didn't like some of them.
I like most of them. But either way, I knew
everybody, you know. Yeah.
And you know, which kind of leads to like a another story
where. I I get I make detective.
Into small town right? And I'm not, I'm not a hard ass,
by no means I'm. Not you.

(01:41:29):
Know I'm a compassionate guy. I don't, I, I'm, you know, I
can't tell you how many. Drunks, I drove home.
You know, just because I felt bad, I mean, that's like a
$10,000 hit, man. You know, I'm saying some of the
drunks I drove home multiple times on multiple weekends.
You know, I mean, like, I ended up becoming like almost like a
taxi service, right? My surgery didn't care though.

(01:41:52):
Like he. Was cool with it.
So it was, you know, it was it was good to work for Sergeant
like that, like when I was on patrol.
He was a a great guy. He ended up becoming the chief
too, which I really was really loved that he became chief.
I used to call him Sling Blade. You see that movie with What's
that Thornton, Billy Bob Thornton?

(01:42:13):
Yeah, the movie called. A sling blade I think.
OK, never heard about it and well.
If you ever see it, you'll know what I'm.
Talking about, you know, exactlyI'm talking about so I used to
call the Sergeant Sling Blade, you know, and because, you know,
he wasn't the smartest guy in the world, but he was he was
great. He was just a good fucking woman
being man, you know what I mean?And he always had your back,

(01:42:35):
which was great. That's all you ask.
Listen, that's all you ask for, you know, like, I'm not asking
you to be like a superhero or nothing.
Just have my back. We're gonna make mistakes, man.
But you know what you know so but I made detective.
And. And again, like I wasn't.
A hard ass though, but I. Wasn't I was trained in a

(01:42:57):
different way than these guys were.
So I was trained where like, youknow, the sheriff would.
Actually come in and say. Like, hey man, if you pull up to
the corner and the drug dealers and the fucking gang bangers, if
they don't run when you pull up,you're not doing your job and
I'm going to replace you. Wow, that's it.

(01:43:19):
He didn't. And.
That's how he wanted it, you know, So that's how we worked,
right? So.
That's that's hard work to get. That kind of like, you know, the
way he looked at it was like, look, my names on the side.
Of that car, you know. What I'm saying like, and I

(01:43:40):
don't care if if the if the citycops pull up and they don't run,
I don't give a shit. But when you pull up the fucking
run it. Yeah, OK.
I. Got it.
You know I'm not. I don't.
I'm not going back to the jail. I don't wanna fucking yeah, you
know, doing. Time.
Exactly. Exactly, you know.
What I mean like you do one thing wrong, you you're handing

(01:44:02):
out baloney sandwiches, you know, by the end of the day in
the fucking jail. I'm no, I did that time.
I'm not doing that again. So anyway, so you know, so I, I
think maybe detected because of that reason.
And plus, I, I kind of knew whatI was doing enough anyway for,
you know, because you know, whenyou, when you're a small town
detective, you, you gotta handleeverything, everything, you

(01:44:24):
know, certain things you don't handle, like arson and stuff
like that, they're supposed to send.
Out an arson investigator. From the county, but they never
do you know, and you got to write the report anyway and it's
you do your best man, you know. But I was good at drug stuff,
you know, cause I liked doing it.

(01:44:45):
So, you know, and I, I. Got my experience.
In a small town, you know, hooked up with a detective from
the next town over, he worked alone.
I worked alone because my Sergeant was useless.
So we would work together and hetaught me a lot, you know?
So we had this guy moving to thetown from the city, Paterson,

(01:45:08):
and he and his mind thought he was gonna move there and just
sell heroin and he was going to be the town big shot, right?
Well, that's not gonna fucking happen.
I'm not gonna let you openly sell heroin on the fucking St.
cause then she's gonna break my balls, right?
You know, that's not just, that's just not realistic.
You know, one arrest, fucking two arrests, you know, 3.

(01:45:34):
The guy's not stopping, you know.
And I, I fucking told him. Listen, John, what are you
doing? Like I caught you. 3-4 times
like what are? You doing, bro?
Yeah, in the book his name is. Brad Alright, so we'll say Brad,
Brad, what? What are you doing like, and I'm
not talking like a detective now, I'm like man the man.
What is your plan here? Because, you know, gonna.

(01:45:58):
Keep catching. You bro.
It's like. Yeah, if it's not me, it's
somebody. Else.
Like, where are you going with this?
Like, it's not gonna end well for you, you know?
I'm giving you the opportunity because I'm talking to you like
a man here, you know? Yeah.
Yeah. You know, and he didn't.
Understand that for some. Reason, you know, he was more of
that confrontational like, you know.
Well, fuck you. OK, alright.

(01:46:18):
I warned you like, I don't know,you know, So every year we do
the, we would do the polar plunge, right?
I don't know if you guys do it up there again or for Special
Olympics, OK, jumping in the cold water.
Yeah, so we raise money all. Year and then at the end of the
year, like February, every February 25th we would do the
polar plunge down the Jersey Shore.

(01:46:42):
You know, everybody would show up all the police departments
throughout the state and you know, whoever rate, you know,
everybody raises money and you know you turn it in and you jump
in the water. You know they shoot the gun,
everybody jumps in the water, but you start drinking it like
6:00 in the morning, you know what I mean?
And you jump in the water like 9you're in bed like 6:00 in the
afternoon you're diamond you fucking goodnight lights out.

(01:47:03):
So, but it's really, it's a really fun time, you know, I
mean, it's, it's so, you know, we're all down there and, you
know, my wife's with me. Everybody's got their wives
order. It's just a good time, right?
And I get a call from the Sergeant that I don't like.
He doesn't like me, but we have to work together.
So we sort of do you know, the best we can, whatever.

(01:47:27):
And so he tells me that Brad. He's running.
Around telling everybody that heknows where I live, where me and
my wife live, and he's gonna kill us, right so.
And he says, but don't you? Worry I got.
It I I'm. Going to take care of it, you
know? And so I told him basically, I

(01:47:48):
don't need you to take care of anything.
Don't bother me with this. Bullshit.
You know, because you gotta see where I'm coming from.
I know this guy. Yeah.
Yeah. He had.
That information probably. For a week.
And he didn't think it was important enough to tell me,
right? Yeah.
When he could have set up that hit.
And that week technically, but he wanted to save.

(01:48:12):
It for when I was out having a good time and he knew I'd be
having a good time with my wife and he wanted to ruin, right?
He's one of those assholes, right?
So I I fucking hung up on him like fuck you.
I don't need you, you know, and I went back to sleep.
Fuck him, you know what I mean? So when I got home on Monday, I
had all kinds of informants, man, You know, like, because I

(01:48:36):
had a thing, and my thing was where the Sergeant, he wouldn't
come in for anybody. My thing was any fucking drug
arrest that's made in this town,there's a big note not can you?
It must fucking call me every single time because I go there

(01:48:56):
before the charges were even written and say you wanna work
cause I'll get these charges anddisappear.
You just all you gotta do is make a couple of phone calls.
You know, I'll protect you. They won't even know it's
fucking you. You know, I'll even we'll even
have you charged today. So they know, you know, it'll
all be bullshit. The county will discuss it.
You know, I mean like, yeah, that's a smart move.

(01:49:17):
That's. A smart move.
You need these people, yeah. When I went back to work for the
Sheriff's Department, I had the same thing.
I, I knew the booking officers into jail and the same thing I
said, listen, anybody comes in with drug charges, please call
me and I would go to the jail and I would fucking you know,
there's like twice I had guys taken out of the jail to work
with me. You know, they don't like doing

(01:49:38):
that, but if it's something worthwhile, they'll do it.
So that's how you build informants and everything,
right? Yeah.
So, you know, and then, like, there was a time where the FBI
was paying informants, right? So I signed one of my informants
up with them and I would take him to see them once a month and

(01:50:03):
I have a report written of everything he gave me for the
month. They just fucking doled out the
cash to him. Boom, you know, perfect for me.
Hmm. Fucking guy.
I loved it, you know? What I mean, it was, yeah.
Yeah, So because you don't get nothing done without
performance. Yeah, exactly.
I don't. It just doesn't work.
You know, there's no superhero cops out there.

(01:50:24):
It doesn't work. Some guys are really good.
But you know what? That's the hard way.
Doing shit, you know, people tell on each other.
That's the way it works. Yeah, exactly.
Money. Money.
It's gonna change their perspective of any criminal.
I mean, the only guy that goes to jail is the guy with no.
Information. You know what I mean?
So, so whatever, right? I had a lot of informants and

(01:50:46):
again, every level you get higher informants as you go up,
you know, but for a small town it the ones I had were perfect,
right? So like I knew when they when
they whenever, because it's you,it's always the same people.
You know what I'm saying? In a small town, it's always the
same people. And we, we didn't have any like

(01:51:06):
master jewel thiefs, you know, Robin fucking houses.
Or anything like. That, you know, it was all the
guys Robin houses to get money to go buy drugs.
It's very simple stuff, you know, and if you want to stop
your burglary problems, just you, you stop your drug
problems, it's very simple, you know, so.
But my Sergeant didn't wanna hear.
Anything like that? OK, whatever.

(01:51:27):
So I got home that Monday and right away I went to work.
My informants went and started buying heroin from this guy,
right? Because the guys a dummy.
He's just a dummy. And so I got a, I got, you know,
my buys, 2 buys. I write my report, I do the
affidavit for a search warrant, I go see the judge and so the.

(01:51:51):
Judge, now I gotta. Get him to sign my stuff, right?
So I call secretaries like, yeah, he wants you to meet him
at this health club on whatever St. in this town.
I'm like, OK, so it's like some country.
Club, right? So I walk in, you know, and I
mean, I look. Like a fucking detective.
Right. Like, you know, I'm wearing the

(01:52:11):
T-shirt, whatever, and jeans and, you know, fucking tattoos.
Whatever you know I mean. Like it's, it is what it is.
And you know, I'm walking to this Country Club and the guys
in the in the locker room, somebody stark ass naked, right?
He's gotta sign my paperwork. Yeah.
Absolutely, but it's hilarious. You know you know he's he's darn

(01:52:32):
baby sign and he signed and he signed you know everything here
true Yes, Sir. OK.
Good luck, you guys. Right, so I got everything
ready. To go but.
I'm like. I gotta lose my Sergeant, you
know I'm. Saying like, cause I, I gotta
take care of this the right way,you know, I'm saying because

(01:52:52):
this guy crossed the line, you know, like there's, there's,
there's, there's lines, you know?
And that's the fucking line. You don't cross, you don't.
That's bullshit, you know so, but my Sergeant was such an.
Asshole that he. He wouldn't be able to fucking
understand anything like that because you know, he's.
One of those guys that got beat up in high school.
And and whatever. And he, he's now out to the only

(01:53:14):
reason why he became a cop was to take shit out on, on people.
You know what I mean? And that's the only time I'll
ever do work is to be vindictive, you know?
You know, where I wasn't like that.
And and this, if I could handle this without making an arrest,
sure. You know.
Well, I couldn't, you know. So I go to the chief and I say,
look, Chief, the chief loved me.He did.
He really did, you know, he's myfootball coach when I was like

(01:53:39):
in wow, like, you know, like 6th.
Grade, you know. What I mean?
Wow, so I remember like. Isn't that a full?
Circle. That's incredible.
That's great, right? I I remember.
Walking up the street one day, Iwas in 8th grade I think, and I
had a wiffle ball bat with me and I had bottle rockets, right?
There's a little hole at the endof the wiffle ball bat the show

(01:53:59):
the bottle rocket in here. You know, you like the fucking
thing. You could aim the bottle rocket,
right? So I light it.
I just, I shoot it at this house, right and.
So I look. Oh shit, there's a cop.
Sitting right there, right? And he he gets me, takes me home
to my father or whatever, you know, that's the chief.

(01:54:20):
That's not cheap, right? So wow, you know, you know, I
mean like so, so I tell. Them to look.
You got you gotta take this guy,my Sergeant, off off the I can't
have. Him there, I gotta take care of
this. He's like, he's like.
I agree. With you, you.
Have to take care of this the way you're going to.

(01:54:42):
But I can't take him off, off the, you know, the execution of
the warrant. I'm like, yeah, but.
He's gonna now write me up. And he's gonna send it up to the
prosecutor's office. It's gonna be out of your hands
and nothing you can do about it.I I said you gotta help me out.
He's got something. He said, alright, I'll give you

(01:55:02):
5 minutes. He said I'm like and and like I
said in the phone call. Like 5 minutes is huge because
people get knocked out in 20 seconds in the UFC.
So that's the UFC round people. So I've been like, thank you,
I'll take that first round. Yeah, you know, God damn bro.
I'm like alright. 5 minutes, Yep, the second you guys break
you the door, I'll start the clock.

(01:55:23):
OK? No problem.
So I'm like, alright, I gotta put my team together now.
So who do? Who do I grab?
Right. So I grab my old partner on a
bikes JP. Of course I gotta take him,
right? Yeah.
So there's 33 sergeants that I grabbed, right?
And again, I went to high schoolwith.
All of them, right? And, you know, 2 or a year

(01:55:44):
older, one of them's two years younger, right?
But they're all solid guys, right?
And so we're figuring out the plan, how we're going to do this
because the house now is tucked back, you know, up along
driveway right now. You're going to be able to see
us coming. And it's not a lot of drugs.

(01:56:06):
We're not talking about a lot ofdrugs, right?
So he's gonna have time to to dump it, right?
So, you know, all right. How are we going to do this?
So, you know, we look at the themap, right?
And we say, alright, we come in the back, it's a half mile walk
through the woods. You know, no way you're gonna
think we're gonna we're there's no way, right?

(01:56:26):
Cops are too lazy for that, you know.
So and that was all snow on the ground too, right.
So soon as the sun goes down, wewe start walking through the
back. You know it's a half mile, but
as. The sun goes down right the
ground. Freezes.
So now every step is like crunch.
Crunch. Sounds like we're walking.

(01:56:47):
On. Fucking Captain Crunch cereal,
right? And it gets so ridiculous.
We get to the point where I'm like, they got it fucking know
we're coming. There's no way they don't hear
us, right? So we're close with their house.
I'm like, you know, fuck it, just let's go, you know, So
Warner, Sergeant Favalaro, he was going through the door
first. He's giant, right?
And he hits the fucking door andhe said of the door opening, he

(01:57:10):
splits it down the. Middle and.
He goes through it, you know, like one of those old like
kool-aid commercials, you know, have you ever seen it when it,
the kool-aid thing comes throughthe house phone, right?
And I'm right behind them now and I come following right on
them like I, you know, I mean, I'm like 2 feet behind him.
We're coming fast and uh. So I looked to my left and.

(01:57:33):
There's the target sitting thereon the couch, like just in this
belief that we're there, like inthe room at this point, but he's
got a deck of heroin in his hand.
OK, You can't be more. Terminating than that.
Yeah, you know I'm saying, right?
And so whatever you know, whatever happens, happens and 5

(01:57:53):
minutes. Go by.
Sorry. Sergeant comes walking and he is
so mad. He's pissed.
He's like looking around like, you know, now at this point
we're we're all done everything,you know, we're scattered, you
know, categorizing evidence, seeing because 5 minutes is
huge. OK.
So, you know, he's like, what the fuck happened to Brad?

(01:58:13):
I'm like Brad, I don't know. I shit, I didn't see that.
Maybe he fell, I don't know, youknow, And he's like, you know,
he knows. I'm fucking lying.
And yeah, he asked everybody andnobody had to lie because it
happened so fast. Nobody and saw it.
Nobody saw anything right now, so.
We get back to. Headquarters.
And he won't stop. He keeps asking me right, What

(01:58:36):
happened? You.
Know. Look, I understand, like, you
know, you could tell me. I'm not gonna do anything.
But what happened? I don't know.
Sorry. Sorry.
I don't know what happened to the guy.
Go ask him. Like, I don't know.
Right. So this is going on now the
chief walks into or, you know, office, right?
Because. We're all looking at, you know,

(01:58:56):
evidence. We're all in there, right?
And so he walks in and he's looking at the Sergeant, but
he's talking to me. And he says, hey, who beat the
shit out of Brad? You know he looks like the
Elephant Man, right? So.
I did, Chief, you because now. It's my opening like I did he he

(01:59:19):
had it coming, right. So the chiefs like, yeah, he did
have it coming. Now he's looking at the
Sergeant. He's like, he had that comment
and we, we don't tolerate that shit in this town.
And he walks out. No, not that.
The fucking Sergeant, he's furious because now he can't do
anything now, you know, cause ifhe does something now, well, now
the chiefs gonna go after him. Yeah, and you don't want that.

(01:59:43):
Right, he don't want. That so but.
He's mad, man. And he storms out, right?
OK, whatever. And we're used to that shit.
So Ricky Dale, what we're doing,and we got a phone call.
It's the dispatcher. So the dispatcher is like, hey,
you got to come down to dispatch.
Like why? What's up?
You just just come down to dispatch.
OK, so we go down to dispatch and the dispatcher has all the

(02:00:04):
fucking cameras, right? And he's like, look, so the
sergeants now in the cell area, right?
And he's talking. You can't see the the guy Brad
in the cell, obviously, but you can see the Sergeant talking to
him and he hands him a piece of paper.
I know what the piece of paper is.
It's an internal affairs complaint form.
I know exactly what it is, right?

(02:00:27):
So we're watching. And 15.
Seconds go by, right? All of a sudden, the fucking
crumpled. Piece of paper comes.
Flying out of the fucking cell hits him right in the head,
fucking goes on the ground right.
We're we're laughing so hard, man, like we're gonna piss
ourselves right. So that that is just hilarious,
right. Even the kernel doesn't wanna
deal with. This bullshit, I wanna deal with
bullshit, right? So it's incredible we go back.

(02:00:49):
You know we hurry. Up back to the.
To the our office, right over there, right?
And we're sitting there we're, you know, making money.
So he walks in fucking fuming, right?
So at this point, the one of thepatrolman has to take this guy
out of his cell and he's bringing him down to the county
jail, right? So he passes our office and the
door is open and he stops and hesays, you know, Detective

(02:01:13):
Bocelli, can I talk to you? I'm like, sure, what's up, Brad?
He says, hey, we're even, right?You know?
He goes, I was out of line for that.
We're cool, right? I said absolutely.
We're we're totally cool. Wow, right.
He turns around. He goes.
I'm gonna say his. Name.

(02:01:34):
But what? What?
What? I'll make up names, yeah.
Tell fucking Bobby. Alright, tell Bobby that ain't
no fucking rat. Yeah, walk away.
I'm like, OK, fucking great. Perfect, right?
But that's how some of these guys are though, right?
You know what I mean? Like And that's the only thing
that respect like. Literally getting him back, like

(02:01:57):
because he knew deep in his heart or in his subconscious
that he was crossing a line, doing a threat to the family of
somebody because you didn't go personal.
Well, now he's going to go personal on your physical body
because you, you, you just threaten his life and his
family. So.
Yeah, right. So it was like it was.
Even like I didn't. Listen, nothing bad happened.
Told me you got lumped up a little bit, but not the end of

(02:02:19):
the world, you know, I mean, buthe had that coming and whatever
and he handled like a man, you know what I mean?
And so you know. It's.
Funny like had one more arrest with him after that cause he
still wouldn't learn. He still he wouldn't fucking
learn. Wow.
This one was funny though, because I had a a warrant and

(02:02:40):
everything typed up for him ready to go.
But he was renting the second floor of a house and it was the
same story. Like he's gonna see me pull in,
I walk up the stairs, he's gonnaget rid of whatever drugs he has
and I'm not gonna like, what's the point?
I'm not gonna waste my time, youknow, but I only have so much
time, you know, I have to execute this warrant, right?

(02:03:02):
So I'm telling this to my. Partner my.
Partner JP in in the detective Bureau and he's like, well, you
know, we got his shit, his girlfriend, they got to domestic
last night and his girlfriend threw him the fuck out and she
came by and dropped the bag of his clothes off here.
I said the clothes are here. He's like, yeah, they're sitting
in the, you know, in the front lobby.

(02:03:24):
Headquarters over. I'm like, oh shit.
OK, listen, this is what I'm gonna do.
So I said you gonna take the. Clothes gonna put it in the.
Back of your patrol car. And you.
I want you to pull up, go to his, you know, ring the bell.
He's not gonna do anything. He sees you.
He's not going to be a big deal.And just tell him, hey, John,
you know what? I got your clothes in the back
of my car and you got one chanceto get him.

(02:03:44):
Throwing him in a fucking dumpster, you know, And that's
what he did. And I said listen, make.
Sure, you put the the clothes onthe other side of the car so
when he comes down to your patrol car, you open the fucking
door and let him reach in and grab him.
So sure shit, that's what happens.
The guy reaches in to grab the fucking kicks him in the ass.
He closes the door. Now he's he's trapped in the

(02:04:05):
back of the patrol car. And then I come rolling down the
road. I knock on a John.
I got a I got a search warrant. Fuck you, Pacelli, you know?
And he says to me, you know, wow.
And I go in, I get his 10 bags of heroin.
Like, OK, here we go again. Like he just wouldn't learn, you
know, and I don't, I don't, I don't understand what he was
thinking because when all those charges fell on his head, you

(02:04:27):
know, he ended up getting like 12 years, man, while like, which
was, I mean, it's. Crazy.
Yeah, it's just that the. Mind boggling cause he could
have just moved to the next townover.
Yeah, a couple of times. He had so many.
Different way outs and he didn'ttake him.
You could or could just. Been smarter.

(02:04:47):
You know. You know.
I guess he didn't realize that by him coming into small town
like that, he was gonna make a lot of enemies, you know?
And that's what he did. He had a lot of enemies and they
were more than glad to fucking get him locked up, you know?
But you know, it's, it's, it's a, you know, we.

(02:05:09):
Could say like tell stories? About like, you know, this job
or that job and they're all the same, you know, it's just it's
it's work, you know, like and even though.
Like we enjoyed it bro. But it was, but it was working
with the bunch of guys that you worked with was what made it,
you know what I mean? It made it.
MMM made it fun, you know? What I mean like because you

(02:05:31):
spent. So much time with him, you know,
And it's like, it's almost. Like your kids again, it's like
it's like you're. Playing cops and robbers.
That's that's that's the best way to the, you know, even
though it's serious, though. Yeah, yeah.
But I'm like we were on a bikes.Though like.
You know we. We had gold wings, OK, And you

(02:05:53):
know. Paterson police had.
Harley Davidsons, yeah. They would always make.
Fun of us. And that's fine, but I know that
my bike, it blew heat when it was cold.
And you know, I had a MFM radio on it, you know, I could put a
tape cassette in it if I wanted to and it didn't rattle.

(02:06:15):
You know, like, holy shit, the vibration where like these guys
bikes, they would rattle so muchthey would blow out the fucking
bulbs in the light bar. You know, our bikes were quiet.
Couldn't even hear him running drive down.
The line. Right in the middle of the road.
You know, when it's traffic, I could just go nice and slow and
just look in everybody's fuckingcar, you know what I mean?

(02:06:36):
Like, yeah. And when they realize it's when
you're. Passing, it's not like ahead of
time out Harley, man. You hear it like 3 cars behind.
So yeah, you hear that low rumble?
Yeah. For sure, for sure It's really.
Cool, you know. But.
I love the Goldwing was great, you know, especially like when
we had we we. Well, I know, maybe.

(02:06:58):
Once every couple of weeks. We'd take the day and go up up
county, right, Nice day in the summer and said I played the new
radar, right, and you know you're so far.
Up county where it's like the. Roads are so like rural, you
know, and it was just to get away from the city, you know,
cause it's hot and we sit there on radar.
And so our, our, our sheriff wasa genius, right?

(02:07:21):
He knew that our Sergeant was breaking our chops about the
tickets, you know, 20 tickets. Why they So he went and had
these warning books printed for us, right?
They were just. Just.
Just like a ticket, but it said warning on it and there was no
record of it, you know, And he told us that every warning

(02:07:42):
counted. As a ticket.
He didn't give a shit if we wrote nothing but warnings.
He didn't not care. He said, you know, he did.
He's like, I don't want you guysgoing out there writing all my
voters tickets. How many are elected?
You know, he said you want to write him warnings, written
warnings great. You know, so we would go up
county like and we run radar andwe'd pull people over.

(02:08:05):
And once they found out that they were getting warnings, man,
they were they loved us. You know, they did at her cars.
Look at the bikes. You know, it was just a lot of
fun. You know what I mean?
Like it was. Yeah, it.
Was cool you. Know cause warnings that didn't
exist. Before and he started it on
there, but in our department we didn't have any way to you.
Know we didn't have noise you know and he just started it and

(02:08:28):
and again like he wasn't gettingthe revenue from us writing the
tickets yeah, for sure wasn't going to him and the only thing
I was doing was hurting him you know so he was smart he's like
just write Warrens. I don't give a shit.
So we wrote about it. You know, I mean, don't get me
wrong, we wrote tickets, but I Ididn't like writing moving

(02:08:49):
violations. Like I didn't like that because
if people is a short, their insurance will go up, you know,
and then what happens is you endup writing the good people bad
tickets, right? That's what happens.
So some guy, um, he can't affordto get his car fixed, right?
So now I'm gonna write him threetickets cause he's got a broken
windshield, He's got a headlightout right And, and maybe a

(02:09:11):
broken mirror, right? Yeah, now you can't if.
He had the money, he would have.Got it fixed.
Doesn't doesn't make any sense. Now I'm gonna give him.
Yeah, you're just putting him deeper.
In the hole. So it's like it, it's a cycle
that's never gonna finish if youkeep choking him when he's
missing air already, right? Because now what happens?
Well. If you can't afford to to get

(02:09:32):
that fixed, he's not able to afford to pay the tickets.
So he's going to have warrants for his arrest.
Yeah, he's in the county bookingjail just that sort of like.
It. Doesn't It never made sense to
me. Yeah, You know, so I love the
warnings, you know what I mean? Like but then you get that guy
who you. Know.
You pull over and he's a total asshole, you know, and I still

(02:09:53):
wouldn't like to. Write a ticket because the guy.
Was an asshole. I'd rather handle it.
You know freshman mean it. Like what the fuck is your
problem? You know?
I mean, like, chill out, you know?
But. But don't get me wrong, there's
a lot of. There's a lot of.
Guys out there that would just pound people with tickets and
tickets and tickets and they think, you know, look, I'm not,

(02:10:15):
I'm not talking bad about anybody.
That's not what I'm doing. But is that really police work?
Is that really what we're supposed to be doing out there?
Like to me, I looked at, I looked at the motor vehicle.
Code. For a as a tool, it was a tool a
tool I could use to. Get into.

(02:10:35):
Somebody's car, you know what I mean?
Like a key. If I was smart enough, I could
use it as a key to unlock that car.
Like if the guys got fucking something in the back truck,
their weapons fucked up. You know then.
I could use. That stuff.
Right. But if you overuse that stuff,
then the judges get pissed off and then now sudden they take it

(02:10:57):
away from you. They take the tool away from
you, you know? But a lot of guys I can
understand that, you know. Especially.
In the small town that right, the small town guys had because
that was their only nothing elsewas going on.
Yeah, you know, so today and that was that was, that was at
least work. You know, yeah.

(02:11:18):
OK. But.
That's not really true that there is nothing else going on.
The problem is that you you don't see it because you you're
so used to seeing it. Like for example I locked up
one. Guy in a small town I was.
On patrol once, right now, I lived in that town.
I knew who this guy was and he was an asshole even when I was a

(02:11:39):
kid, he was an asshole, right? So I ended up having to deal
with him and he's being an asshole to me.
So I lock him up. Now my Sergeant says, oh, would
you lock up so and so for you know, he's been in his town
forever. I know he's been an asshole
forever, probably that nobody ever locked him up.
You know what I mean? So I'm trying to make him learn.

(02:12:00):
Something. I mean, I'm trying to, I'm
trying to break. The fucking cycle here, you
know, like cause now what's gonna happen?
His kids are gonna be assholes and it's gonna go on and on.
It's never gonna get create a family.
Tree of Assholes. You know.
It's thinking about the future, Gary.
That's awesome. Right.

(02:12:21):
You know. So, you know, that's really too
like, what's that? I'm sorry, I was gonna say, can
you tell us a bit? About like the bets that you
were having with some of your partners while you were
following a car. Talk to us about this.
Yeah, so. In the winter, you know, we
would have to, you know, we could ride the bikes.

(02:12:43):
It was too cold, right? So they didn't have enough cars
for us all either, so they woulddouble us up in the car, which
was cool because then I get to ride my board.
Yeah, you gotta keep YEAH board.You'll laugh all night.
It's funny, right? So that they would have really
nothing to do for us except, youknow, alright, go do you know

(02:13:03):
DWI stuff? Go make DWI, sorry, whatever.
So. Again.
Like. Those are really expensive
tickets, man, You know what I mean?
Like, so it's not something I would wanna do lightly or take
lightly, you know what I mean? Like it's a lie.
It's a lot of you know, but you gotta do what you gotta do,
obviously. And like I told you, I told you.

(02:13:25):
The other day you did you do this in Canada once, like at 19.
We'll forget going to US whenever you want.
You need a seven years to pass and then you need to ask for
pardon and most of the time theysay no.
So you're never going to be ableto go to the US like at 55
because at 19 you were drunk andfucked up and immature.
So that doesn't make any sense to me.

(02:13:46):
Exactly. And that's just ridiculous.
You know so. Listen, everybody makes mistakes
too, like, you know, like I, I would see these guys too.
That would you know they. They no matter what.
They make that DWI arrest, you know, but then they're in the
bars having a couple drinks, they fucking driving home, you
know? I mean, wow, that's a bullshit.

(02:14:07):
Like don't be. Hypocritical.
You know, I'm not saying that you.
Never gonna make that arrest. But don't be an asshole, you
know? Yeah, so, so whether.
It was Jose or. JP we would we would make it
like a game alright try to make it as fun as possible you know

(02:14:28):
so you'd get you'd be behind a car and I would always drive
because especially. With.
When it was JP, I, he would never drive.
And because I said why, why, whyI was gonna drive, drive.
I'm I'm the senior guy, why am Idriving, right?
And his response would always bebecause you're such a shitty
driver in a car that I, I like watching you hit shit cause it's

(02:14:52):
fun, you know? Oh my God.
Right. Well, that's.
Fair, I understand. That, you know, and he would
call me fucking Magoo. Remember the cartoon, Mr. Magoo?
And yeah, so he was. Calling him a girl, he said I
couldn't. See shit at night, you know what
I mean? He was right.
But I could ride this. Shit out of a.
Bike though, let me tell you something they couldn't touch me
on a motorcycle, but four wheelsman, I would hit everything that

(02:15:13):
was all fucked up especially when you're you're you're used
to your little. Motorcycle and now you're get
with a bus almost for you is different yeah you know what I
mean like. So.
So I understood his point that it was funny because I and plus
he would never have to write thereports when I smashed the
corner to something, you know, so but so I would always drive
and and we'd get behind a car. And you?

(02:15:36):
Know you, you could tell, right?You know, a guy started to
swerve once, twice, you know, and it depends on what.
Time it is you. Know he could be tired from
work. You don't know.
He's probably drunk, you know what I mean?
Like there comes a point on any night usually, especially on a
weekend that after a certain time the only people on the road
are drunks and cops. That's it, you know, So you

(02:16:00):
know, you see the. Swerve right and.
You're like, yeah, we, we may have something here, you know?
And you follow them a little bitand then all of a sudden they,
they fucking turn right. They turned to the back roads,
right? You're like, OK, here we go.
Let's see where this goes, right?
Because our thing was that if the guy.
That we were. Behind or girl Whoever if the

(02:16:22):
the guy or girl made it. Home before we hit.
Our emergency lights? They win.
They're safe. So when you're.
Following these cars. The they you're waiting on a
crime or see if he's drunk or not.
We're just. We're just.

(02:16:43):
We're deciding whether we. Wanna pull him?
Over because we think he's drunkright yeah yeah yeah cause he
maybe he. Swerved once or twice.
But I'm saying. You drive straight as an arrow,
you know, you could have been fumbling versus who knows, you
know, I mean, so you know, then it gets interesting, though.
So now you wanna see where he's gonna go.
Like where is this guy going? Is he, is he pulling into his
house or is he pulling into his strangers, some person's house

(02:17:05):
that he doesn't even. Yeah, you know, you don't know,
Right. So even if they pull.
Into the house. You can't just drive away.
You gotta stop and say, hey, letme see drivers license because
they they do that, they'll pull yeah, they'll make it there when
they. Don't you know?
And so and and again, we would like bet on it, say, yeah, this
guys drunk. No, he's not drunk.
You know, I bet you lunch whatever you know.

(02:17:29):
Yeah, so. And.
A lot of times. Though like they'd make it man,
and be like, they pull in and fuck, I hit the lights, you
know, and you pull, you know, you get them and they lived
there and you like shit, OK, well, you made it.
You tell them, alright, listen, you fucked up.
Don't do it again. You know, look at this as you're
lucky day, right? And learn from it, right?

(02:17:51):
We all move on. Everybody's fucking happy,
right? But I would also like to do this
thing though. And I and I, I miss it so much
because it's so funny. It's one of the funniest things
I've ever seen in my entire life.
And I don't know if maybe I justhave a warped sense of humor,
which is possible. But when they get out of the
car, they always make believe that they don't know you're
behind them. No.
Yeah, it's they don't know. No idea, right?

(02:18:12):
But Father Time for that's the best.
So. I was I.
Was like Deadly man with the spotlight.
You know, I could move that fucking thing, you know, and I
could get it wherever I wanted and soon as I turned it on, pow,
I was like deadly accurate with it.
So I, I would get it to where when I hit it, it turned it on,

(02:18:33):
it would boom right in the guy'shead, right?
So boom, I hit him with. The spotlight and be like, hey.
Come here at first when you say that too.
They're always like. Me no, they fucking horse you
Who else? There's nobody else here, right?
So, but as they're walking to the car, it's the funniest thing

(02:18:53):
like you could ever see though, you know, and I'd be like
laughing so hard, man, And because it's just so funny, you
know, because like you see the movies where the aliens, you
know, people getting abducted bythe aliens, right, And they
fucking like the the beam is on them, right, And they go towards
the light little by. Little the way their heads down
they're walking. Like they're like.

(02:19:14):
They're hypnotized, right? That's exactly how they are when
they're drunk, you know, And it was so fucking funny, man.
It's man made my night every time it would happen.
Is this so great? You know, and again, we don't we
don't like I didn't like the lock guys up for DWI.
I I didn't, I just even. That's the only thing too.

(02:19:36):
Like a lot of guys. Too like they're cowards too.
And I'm not talking about anybody, but like a lot of a lot
of guys only pull over women andbe like why?
Why you only pulling over women?Are you, are you afraid?
Like what's? The deal with that, I'm the
opposite. I never pull over women ever
because I don't want to get into.
It with them you know what I. Mean like, just not gonna do it,

(02:19:58):
you know, like I don't want. Fuck that, there's too many.
Men out there. That are fucking things up.
I, I, I can, I, I can pick and choose, you know what I mean?
Like it's yeah. So it's 90% of.
Crime. Like in the.
Streets are made by men, right? You know, it's a big part of
why. These guys are.
Pulling women overweight becausethey're like, it's easy for
them, you know? They know they're not get their

(02:20:20):
ass kicked on the side of the road.
You know which I you know, that's when I think about it
Like JP was great, like with that shit because like I would
meet. We were such opposites.
You know, like I was like kind of quick tempered, you know,
nice kind of world though. But I, I would have that temper

(02:20:41):
where JP was always laid back like nothing ever bothered.
And they give a shit, you know, and I end up like fucking
wrestling around with somebody. And he would just stand there
and. Laugh and and.
I like the guy in the control. I'd get him like cuffed up.
I'm like, you're gonna fucking help me.
He's like, no, you had it the whole time.
I was rooting for you, mother fucker, you know what I mean?

(02:21:03):
But I love the man. He was the best guy to work
with, You know, it was just fun.It was just fun.
I'm sure, I'm sure if things would have fell.
Serious during like that wrestling, yeah, I'm sure he
would have came in. But when when he was saying that
he had no weapon and you're justhassling with him, he's like,
oh, I'll let Vin Diesel, Vin Diesel deal with them.

(02:21:24):
You're right. That's exactly what it was like.
Yeah, you had him. Thanks, right.
Would have been easier if you would help me out, but you know,
but you know that it was a things are different though, you
know what I mean? Like for sure they they can't do
that. No more like everything's.
Everything so serious now. You know, like first they got
the body cams. Now you.

(02:21:45):
Know body Cam the the car Cam. The drones now, it's fucking
incredible, yeah. I mean like.
It was a big deal, like when I was working, when they just
started getting GPS on the cars.Yeah, there's a big deal.
Like the unions went crazy. They were nuts.
You can't do that, you know, like you know, the point was

(02:22:08):
like we where. We are we on the.
Cars nice that's violation of rights.
All that was a big deal. You know, now forget about it.
Like like I, I, I I don't know. I don't think I could do it like
yeah, cause now let's say. Because I seen this in the
reports and let's say a cop car is like fucking 5 kilometers
away, like in a road that he's not supposed to be on.

(02:22:30):
Well, they're calling him right away.
Like what are you doing in this road?
And it's incredible. You, you need to be where you
need to be at all times, right? And it wasn't like.
That when I was working no. Not at all, I mean.
Guys just disappeared. Like God, like I haven't seen
him all night. Where's he been?
You know what I mean? Like, I don't know, like.

(02:22:51):
But I guess you know. It's not bad for the guys who
start now because that's all they know, right?
So, but you can take a guy like me and then slap a body Cam on
me. I lose my job in an hour, you
know? Yeah, you know what I was doing?
Anything wrong but it's just. Different, you know?
Yeah, times are changing. You know, and it's just.

(02:23:12):
I have enough for. Me, you know.
Wasn't I remember that they theywere talking one time that they
wanted to put like a. Body cams on detectives.
Or they wanted to get a sensor that if you drew your weapon, it
would alert and headquarters, right?

(02:23:32):
Wow, that's a bad idea. OK, Because all that's going to
do is stop guys from pulling their weapon, you know?
Because you know, the way I was trained, and either way I
trained everybody was You pull your weapon when you think you
want, when you need to, when youfeel like that's up to you.

(02:23:55):
You know what I mean? You may just get a feeling, you
know, something not fucking right.
I don't pull my wife. Yeah, you know, I'm not saying
your point in. Somebody's.
Face. Yeah.
Mouth and nothing. But you know, you can keep it at
your side. Whatever.
Yeah, exactly. You know, for, for.
For. And Anna and Alarm to go off and
headquarters that somebody pulled their weapon.
That's it. That's, you know, you gonna get

(02:24:16):
people killed, man, you know? Yeah.
It's like, yeah. Bobby, why did you?
Take out your gun at 4644 and at812.
But what happened in those two items that you gotta re explain
the whole story? Yeah, exactly right.
And then Sergeant? You know, on your ass about
some, he's gonna use it against you or whatever.
It's just it's wrong. And then when they need to pull

(02:24:37):
their weapon, they're going to pull their weapon.
Yeah, exactly. And they could get.
Yeah, exactly. So you know it's a bad idea.
And you were such a great person.
With the DUI that there was evenone that T boned you, what would
you do with this? But he almost did right and OK
again I was in a small town and I'm driving down the main road

(02:25:00):
and a car pulls out of the side street and he almost fucking
bones me right. So like I pull him over, he's
fucking blasted right now. He just came out of the board.
I was done outside road, right, and I know the owner of the bar,
like he played football with my brother.
The bar has been there since thedepression, right?

(02:25:21):
His father owned it, you know, and it's just always been there.
So I'm like, alright, you know what, I'm going to give this guy
a break for the bar owner. You know what I mean?
Like, and so I said I'd get you going to park the the car right
for the bar right there. It's going to stay there all
night, get a ride home. Very simple, you know, OHP.

(02:25:42):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.OK so I drive down that side Rd.
I make. A I.
Make a left, I make another left, I make a left and get
right back on that main road andI'm coming exactly the way I was
and I almost get T boned again by the same fucking guy.
OK, he couldn't even wait till. I got down the road.

(02:26:05):
To tell the guy can't even wait two hours.
He. Had to try it again, right?
So you know. And then he's begging me to give
him a break. Give you.
Give you. Are you adding your mind?
Give you a break. I won't do it again.
The fuck outta here. You're crazy, you know?
So I mean, you know, that's the thing, Like you, sometimes you

(02:26:25):
try to help people, they won't even let you.
You know, that's the thing that they won't even let you.
There was a couple guys that I would end up driving home like
almost every weekend. You know, it got old, you know,
and whatever you know. The alternative is you lock him
up is. He is.
He. Is that gonna solve anything?

(02:26:46):
No. He's just gonna go get another
car. He's gonna drive now.
He's suspended and drunk, right?Yeah, I don't.
Know it comes through points of times where it's.
Just easier driving home, take the keys.
But you can't do that no more though those days.
That done, yeah. Now you gotta go by the books to
the highest degree, right? And which is a shame though.
Because now and and and this is the thing and this is what a lot

(02:27:10):
of guys. Today.
Don't understand? They don't have any.
Discretion anymore. Right, so when I was a cop, I
had the. Highest level.
Of discretion possible. I could lock you up, I could let
you go. It's up to me, right?
Except for drug offences. I couldn't.

(02:27:30):
I never choice, you know? But stuff like DWI, stuff like
that was all up to me. It was my discretion, right?
The ticket. Don't write the ticket.
It's up to me. They took all of that away.
It's all gone. And what they don't realize
though, is, you know, cause someof the guys now say, well, it
makes our job easier. No, it makes it more cushy.

(02:27:53):
More. Touchy.
I find everything needs to be like a perfect right and, and,
but they they they. Like that structure though, some
of them because they don't have to make any decisions, right?
Yeah, but then. You're gonna start getting.
Paid less and less and less because you could hire a fucking
monkey to do the job. You know what I mean?
If if all your decisions are arelaid out for you.

(02:28:18):
You. Know you don't really.
Have to be that smart to do the fucking.
Job you know you're like OK he did this well we got.
Arrest him a year in prison for this.
So let's just pick it up. It's like you're.
Yeah, yeah. So I I.
I'm so I'm totally against that,you know, like discretion was,
was our power really like, you know, they took it away and I I

(02:28:38):
wouldn't want to do it now and it's like a.
It's like I said the other day, like you could, even if you
would arrest the worst guy in the world, you would go to a
place and there's three dead bodies of children and that guy
would be there. Well, today you need to be
polite to him. Put put put the the handcuffs on

(02:28:59):
and bring him to jail. Like even if you know like but
back then you probably would have got beat him before going
to jail, but now if you do well even everybody would understand
why you would do it well, you would lose your fucking career
forever because you put your hand on somebody when your job
was only to arrest them. It's crazy, you know, that's.

(02:29:22):
The thing too like. You know, so when I was working,
of all the things that they can't do today, we were expected
to do back then because it it solved problems, right?
Like breaking legs. Well.
Yes. You know, as brutal as that

(02:29:45):
sounds, OK. You know, there was one
department that they had that policy that if you ran and got
caught. They were gonna break your.
Leg you walking walk into their holding cell.
At any given time in the summer,you'd see 8 to 12 guys bouncing
around with a full leg cast. You know, I didn't know what

(02:30:06):
that was all about. And I asked the my training
officer at the time because I was new out there.
Why? What?
What's with the cast? Pasco?
OK. Hey, what's with the?
What's with the cast? He says, yeah, I I read OK,
well, but what's with the cast? And then the guy looks at me

(02:30:28):
like I got caught, dumbass. And that's how was his response.
You know what I mean? So.
Compared to. Now.
Compare now. He would have been like, oh
dude, the cops hurt me after andthen and Oh yeah.
Yeah, like. And and the thing was though,
like. They back then, they knew the
the rules of the game, right? So they chose to run when they

(02:30:53):
got caught. They didn't whine about it.
They didn't sue anybody. They took it like a man, you
know what I'm saying? And you know, and.
And some of those? Guys like they knew, sort of
like somebody jump out of frigging windows, get away, you
know? Holy shit, the guy got up, he's
running, he's gone. Fuck it, he made it, you know?

(02:31:18):
Holy shit. You know, like it's.
Superhuman like you know, but itwas different though, like like
even I had I had an informant once right and he fucking lied
to me and that that's that's that's bullshit.
Wow, You know what I mean because now I'm going on
information because you got a beef with somebody and you're
lying to me. You, you're using me now, right?

(02:31:40):
No fucking way, right? So and.
Again, this is the time where you know.
Cell phones were around, but they weren't cameras, You know
what I mean? They were phones.
They had a camera, but nobody used it that way.
It was just a phone, right? Yeah.
Yeah. And.
I pull up. I fell.
Again, the car. OK, he gets in the car.

(02:32:02):
Take it. Did you figure out he was lying
first? Well, cause when I went to
fucking. Make the.
Arrest the guy didn't have any drugs on.
Him, he had nothing. Wow.
And it was total and you could tell them.
When you're when. It's his fucking set up right.
Wow, you know, and you're like just motherfucker, you you just
know, you know what I mean? You know listen, that's another

(02:32:24):
thing I would tell people. Hey, you guys a drug dealer, yes
OK, or he's whatever or he fucking, you know, broke into a.
Fucking. Whatever, he burglarized the a
business after hours, whatever. It doesn't mean he's a liar, OK?
You know a drug dealer tells youlook.

(02:32:45):
I had 100. Grand.
There's only 80 grand. There.
OK, well, he's not gonna lie. I mean, somebody stole 20
fucking grand, you know? I mean, it's simple.
It's it's not, you know what I'msaying, right?
So, like they tell the truth sometimes, most of the time, you
know, so the I get the guy to get in the fucking car, get he
gets in the car. I take him for a ride.

(02:33:06):
I go up, up county right to where you know, and there's a
road though it's a, it's called Clinton Rd. right?
If you could look it up, it's got a famous up there cause it's
all UFO sightings and shit, right.
OK. And I think it's like 14 or 16
miles long, right? So you pull off the highway and
you don't see another fucking house for 16 miles, right?

(02:33:28):
So I drove them halfway and I said just fuck out of your car.
What? Get out.
I fucking. I told you're a fucking lie to
me again. OK.
You know, he got the message. Really.
But. And I left his ass there and
there's no cell service because it didn't work up there.
And it was like fucking 10:00 atnight.
And I didn't give a shit how he made it back.
That's his fucking problem. He'll think twice when he goes

(02:33:51):
to lie to me next time, you knowwhat I mean?
Like, so you could do shit like that, you know?
Yeah, Like and. Again.
You know, like I, I'll give you an example, right?
Driving that fucking road, right?
And what the hell is that? I was on a points at the time.
Like what the? Fuck is you know, detectives saw

(02:34:11):
and so. Whatever, you know, I don't.
Use name, you might get mad. Yeah, like.
What the fuck? Is he doing he he?
He's doing pushups on the fucking on the ground with one
of the biggest drug dealers in Paterson.
They don't push us. I pull over.
What the fuck would we pull overon the bikes?
We'll see what's going on. Fucking done.

(02:34:33):
It never fucking yelling they're.
Going back and forth, the guy fucking beat you, motherfucker.
You know, like I think, Steve, what the hell?
What are you doing? What's going on?
He said. Well, I'm locking up so and so
here, and I made a deal with himthat if he could do more
push-ups than me, I was gonna let him go today.
He was gonna have another coupledays before I got him.
OK. Well, you know who won?

(02:34:53):
He's I fucking won getting the fucking car.
So the fucking drug dealer walked over to car.
He no handcuffs Oht he led him in the fucking car.
He took something bugging. That's pretty cool.
I don't care. The criminal was like, at least
he gave me. Gave me a fair shot to fight
back. Yeah, give me a couple.
More days of freedom, you know what I mean?
Like, that's pretty cool. I don't know.

(02:35:15):
That's how I was. That's how I was brought up in
law enforcement, really, you know what I mean?
Like watching these guys that were like, like, you know, when
I first got on. Patrol.
I had my like. You know my utility belt, right?
And I didn't think I had a lot of equipment.
All I had was my weapon. I had two, you know, ammo

(02:35:35):
magazines, right? Collapsible baton and a
flashlight and my handcuffs, right.
OK, all the old timers are making fun.
Of me. You know, and they're like,
because all, all they had was their weapon, 2 ammo, magazines
and handcuffs. Not, not even in the case, just

(02:35:56):
dangling off their belt, right? You're like, you know, if you
need anything more than your weapon and you're 2 fists, then
you shouldn't be out here. And I'm like, OK, alright, you
know, somebody's taking too muchtestosterone.
But you know what, that that's pretty stupid.
But that's how they were broughtup, you know what I mean?
In law enforcement, you know? So I got a couple extra things,

(02:36:17):
you know, but they were like, they were, they were tough, you
know, I'm saying like they did, you know, But a lot of times
though, there's a lot of them are lazy too, though.
So it's, it's, I guess you don'tneed anything.
You, you know, you're not doing any work, you know, So, but you
know, it was different. I I remember the first day on
patrol. How do you know?

(02:36:38):
Regular patrol after I settled down cause my first day of
actual police work I was in a riot.
My first day, yeah. Yeah, that's what he told us.
Yeah. So you know, first day I.
Settled down and actually got with the training officer.
You know I never forget. It man, it was like.
A Sergeant I was riding with. And I've expected like, you

(02:37:03):
know, like these great words of wisdom that I could live by the
rest of the year, right? And I'm and I'm.
And I'm so. Like.
I'm ready for it, man. I'm just ready to go.
And he looks at me and he says, just remember one thing, kid.
If you never do nothing, you'll never get in trouble.
And I was like, really? That's what you're gonna fucking

(02:37:25):
tell me, You know? I mean, it was like, you know
what I mean, Like. But looking.
Back. He was fucking right, you know?
I mean like it made sense in theretrospect.
Yeah, you know, looking back. Holy shit we saved.
Me a lot of problems, man, you know, but you know it's it we're
our own worst nightmares though,like even like on a motorcycle,

(02:37:47):
it's a job is as great as being on a motorcycle squad like
that's just a great job and I just you know what I mean like
if you're driving. A motorcycle.
Around all day. Like how could you fuck that up?
You know? You just can't.
Right. But there's always 1 though, and
every unit there's always one even like like being.

(02:38:08):
A detective in a small town, right?
How do you fuck that up? You.
Know what I mean? Like you're you're.
I. Mean your boss on you're the.
Fucking you know. You, you got it made.
No, I had a storage that had to fuck that up too, right.
Hmm. So there's always 1 though,
though that's gotta do somethingto to you know, because they're

(02:38:31):
so insecure, you know what I mean?
And for whatever reason, they, they you know, I got thrown off
the bikes for like 6 months now.Four months and just because my
Sergeant. You know, like.
That's, you know, that's what hewould do to everybody.
We used to call it the Wheel of Misfortune.
You know who's on the wheel thismonth, You know, and I got my

(02:38:51):
turn on the fucking wheel. I got over the radio.
I got the call. Report.
To the patrols captains office. I knew, I knew he fucking got
me. No reason why the Troll cabins
called. Me in.
You know, and sure as shit, I pull in, you know, but when I
got the call, I was with this guy, this Sargeant, right?
And when the call came over the radio.

(02:39:14):
I looked at him. He.
Would look at me and I knew I said to.
Well, what you finally got? Me huh?
You piece of shit, I got to the fucking.
Cabins, office and cabins. Like alright, I need the keys to
your motor to the. You know you're on 2nd shift.
Patrol four and two. I don't know why this is

(02:39:35):
happening to you. Don't fucking ask.
You know, I was like, well whatever, you know, it took me 4
months to fucking work my way back, you know?
But that was about this. Guy at the goal.
Rangers guy. Ah, we've got, yeah.
Yeah, but sometimes you pull drunks over and they were they
won't. Either they wanted to fight you
or they were like the happiest guys in the world, you know,

(02:39:55):
just totally oblivious to their to the constructions.
Yeah, you know what I mean, right?
And. I still love those guys.
I don't want to lock those guys.I don't want to lock this guy up
right there. It doesn't serve a purpose, you
know what I mean? So we're you know, we're pulling
up to we're leaving the city, going to like a smaller city

(02:40:19):
right in in our county. And we're same Rd. just going
down the road and there's a a right turn lane and we're at a
red light. We're stopped maybe like 7 cars
back and this car is called Springs right past us right?
Boom, like holy. Shit hit my lights.
I fucking. I pull them over and I woke up

(02:40:40):
to the car and the fucking for example.
Word. Window rolls down and the guy
yells go Rangers OHS like you know until.
I fucking knew you. Know the.
Rangers won the playoff game or some shit like that and I'm like
fuck you, get out of. Car You know what I.
Mean he gets out of car, he tries to hug me.
I'm like, get the fuck off, sit down on the curb.

(02:41:02):
And don't touch any party. Mode total.
You know, I'm saying like just just.
Stay there, don't fucking, you know what I mean?
So I I tell my my fucking. The guy lives around a corner,
man, you know, I mean, he's right.
Like you see his fucking house almost, you know, and I, I said
my partner like, oh, what the fuck we gonna do?
We're like alright, let's see the other guy.
Let's see, we'll let him drive whatever you know.

(02:41:23):
And the fucking. Guys asleep and the passengers
he's not. Fucking driving anywhere, you
know what I mean? Like ohhhhh man.
Alright fuck it, I said. I throw it back with my car.
I tell my partner JP look getting a car, drive the car to
the fucking guy's house and we bang on the fucking door and you
know wake his parents ass up andwe didn't fucking keys.

(02:41:44):
He's your fucking problem. If I see him on the road, we're
locking him up, you know, And they're pissed, you know what I
mean? I don't, you know, too fucking
bad, you know? It's better than locking
yourself. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know what I mean? Fucking.
Hell, he's the guy who's 21, maybe barely.
You know I'm saying like harmless though.
You know you. Know.

(02:42:06):
I can't. I can't even imagine.
The guy here example blacks out there at all this there and he
just knows that he he encountered cops and he wakes up
home safe the cars in the driveway.
He's like what the fuck just happened?
He got saved by Gary Pacelli. That's what happened.
You know it's sad too though, because.

(02:42:27):
Like we pulled one guy over one day like 4:00 in the afternoon
and he's in the fast lane on thehighway and he's doing like 20,
sorry. About that was dangerous.
Yeah, you know, I'm saying like and so.
We pull them over and there mustbe like 30 empty vodka bottles
in the back seat of the car, youknow, like ohhhhh man.
So we're like all you gotta get out of car, you know, you got, I

(02:42:50):
gotta have you walk, you know, whatever.
And he's like, well hold on, canI put my boots on?
Like get no, you can't put your fucking boots on.
What do you have special boots that you put on for DWI fucking
test? He's like, yeah, well I do the
test better in those boots. Get the fuck outta here.
The guys used to doing the. Test as well.
But you know what? So we we.

(02:43:10):
Ended up locking. This guy up and man, like I felt
horrible because he was such a nice fucking guy, you know what
I mean? Like and so we're done doing all
the paperwork. We gotta drive him all the way
up to his house and so, well, where do you live?
You know, he's like, well. You can drop me off right there.
Like that's the fucking bar, dude.
I'm not dropping you off the bar, you know what I mean?

(02:43:31):
Like I gotta take you home. So alright, we get into where he
lives and he's like, you wanna come in for a drink?
No. Well, we gotta work, you know
what I mean? And.
You know we. Saw that core and like he's a
hell, I'm going to McDonald's. You guys want anything?
And I felt so bad, man. I talked to the fucking
prosecutor like we got it. Can you do something for this
guy, please? You know, I mean, like it just

(02:43:53):
kind of a fucking break. Seriously, You know, they did,
you know, the best they could, you know, because you feel bad,
right? You know, but you still, you
still the guy still driving 20 miles an hour at 4:00 during
rush hour on the fucking highway.
So we're going to get killed, you know what I'm saying?
And again, now that was today. No fucking done.

(02:44:13):
You know what I mean? Like yeah, it.
I don't know. I'm glad I'm not doing it today,
I guess. For sure it it's a.
Way, way more restrictions now. And there was a another story
that you told me that at 1:00 AMat the red light and there was
four people butt naked. Can you tell us about this so

(02:44:35):
we're sitting? There and.
At the time we had a red light. But it had just.
Turned and we were about to go and this fucking card of.
Screaming past us. And my partner JP at the time,
he, he blurts out this stupidestthing I ever heard him say.
And he says holy red light runner.

(02:44:56):
And I looked at him and I was like, what the fuck did you just
say? That he's like, what?
I mean, holy red light runner. And we're arguing now.
He's like. Holy.
Whole fucking Batman. You know, like calling Batman.
So pull the car over and now he's not paying attention.
Whatever, he's whatever fuck he's looking at.

(02:45:18):
I don't know. Cause he's like, no, he's on the
other other side of the car. I'm in the driver side and I'm
trying to get his attention overthe hood of the car to look into
the fucking car. And you know, again, he's
whatever you know. So I'm like, you know what,
everybody, let's get out of the car, everybody out of the car.
So Al steps 4 Gogo. Dancers from the Gogo.

(02:45:39):
Bar up the road fucking naked except for flannel shirts,
right? And it's like, so we're like,
OK, who's who's, who's car is it?
Let's start with that. We're gonna start.
Let's just start. Let's start this service
station. With who's car?
Is it? Yeah, something pretty simple,
right? It's like.
You know I mean like the easiestanswer you would think, right?

(02:46:01):
They don't know they have no. Fucking idea whose card is OK?
Great. Does anybody have a driver's
license? Anyone have?
Not just on you. Does anybody actually have one?
Does anybody have the legal authority to fucking drive?
What do you mean? Because no, I know.
You don't have it on. Here.
Where the fuck would you put it?Nobody.

(02:46:22):
Nobody fucking has one of them either.
I'm like holy shit. I opened up a.
Fucking can of worms here, you know, because like, what am I
gonna do with this? Right.
And if I bring them back to fucking.
Headquarters now and, and try tofigure this mess out every cop
on duty, our department and the fucking next department, they're
all gonna end up at our headquarters, right?

(02:46:42):
It's gonna and, and I just had this vision of, of, of my
headquarters turned into like a Gogo bar you didn't see.
It I could just see us all. In fucking eternal affairs,
getting fucking suspended for fucking 60 days each or
something, You know what I mean?Like and I'm like no.
Fucking way I'm. Not doing it I'm.
Doing it. You ladies have a great evening.

(02:47:03):
You know what I mean? I feel like.
Tell JP Get. The fuck, let's go.
We'll get the fuck outta here, you know, And he was the best
though, because he wouldn't evenquestion.
He'd be like, alright, let's go.You know he, you know, like I
love working with him, man. He was the best.
You know, like, it was just awesome.
You know, like it's fucking funny, like the shit that you

(02:47:24):
see though, and, and it's, it amazes.
Me now though, because. Like you would walk in like and
you work at the headquarters andMiller fucking night, right?
And you're like, alright, what the what the fucks going on
here? You know the narcotics fucking
unit at the time? Like they got somebody and
they're like doing fucking like it looks like the WWF fucking

(02:47:47):
wrestling Federation fucking who's jumping off the file
cabinets fucking body slamming aguy you like I'm getting a fuck
outta here, man. You know, like JP, let's go
fucking you know, like, I don't know part of that shit, you know
what I mean? So see you I mean again, but
there's a different fucking. Time.
Man, you know, are there any? Bizarre.

(02:48:10):
Calls or situations that you were, that you heard on the
radio that you were like, are you kidding me?
But we got to go do this. Nothing really.
I mean because the ship. Well, yeah, there's one, but
there's a the. The funniest thing I've heard on
the fucking radio though is somebody calling out a license

(02:48:31):
plate and, uh, the. With the Academy, with the guy
and. We looked at him.
Soup bone, right? Because.
We said he's fucking you know a soup bone is smarter than this
guy, right? OK.
And so he's. Calling his fucking plate.
And he says he's got. You know, you're like, you know.

(02:48:57):
Alpha. You know, yeah.
Baker, Charlie, whatever, right?He ends up saying.
Fucking cue for Cuba, right? Holy fuck everybody.
Goes fucking nuts. And who's listening to the
radio? Because queue for Cuba, you
stupid mother fucker. You know people, are you gonna
fucking radio? You know what I mean?
Like, how great is that though? That's why I love you.

(02:49:19):
Couldn't find a word in his. Head with Q.
Eyes like you, you know, with fucking Cuba starts.
With C, he says. Fucking cue for Cuba you stupid
mother fucker. It's fucking good.
Great. Though I get a call.
Though in a small town, again, there's a fucking swan in the
middle of the road, right? This is the kind of shit, these
are the kind of calls you get when you're in the small town,

(02:49:40):
right? I'm like, I gotta fucking.
So I'm great, Swan. OK.
It's like, I don't know one. O'clock in the afternoon.
Right, no big deal. So I pull the fucking car over
and I woke up to the fucking swan and I'm trying to like shoe
the fucking swan, like get the fuck out of road right thing.

(02:50:00):
It's pissed. And you ever see a fucking?
Swan like, yeah, well, it gets up on its fucking.
Feet. And it fucking.
And it opens up it's fucking wing.
And now I'm looking at this fucking thing is looking at me
eye to eye. Fuck, I'm gonna shoot this
fucking swan. Right.
Right in the middle of the fucking.
Road he's gonna kick my ass, youknow, and this this fucking
thing was nasty. I went back in the car and
pulled out my you know those thethe 12 inch fucking Maglite and

(02:50:24):
Oh my God this mother fucker nowyou know what I mean walk on the
side of the. Road but I almost got.
My ass fucking whooped by Swan on the side.
Yeah, that's fucking. Crazy then.
There's two maniacs up in the fucking park, right?
They get a call for a, a raccoon.
That's like rabbit, it's out in daytime, right?
It's got rabies or some shit like that, right?

(02:50:45):
So they're up there like, alright, well, what are we gonna
do? This fucking raccoon?
We gotta, you know, they call animal control.
Animal control is busy. They can't come.
They're like, ohhhhh, fuck, alright, we gotta, we gotta, we
gotta kill this fucking raccoon.You know, that's always the
thing too. Like nobody wants to shoot the
fucking deer that gets hit by the car because then they got to
write the report because you fired your weapon.

(02:51:05):
It's a nightmare, right? So they don't want to shoot the
raccoon because they gotta writetoo many fucking reports, right?
Yeah. So they're like, well, all
right, well, well, fucking we'llhit it with.
A shovel, right? They hit it with the fucking
shovel in the car, right? It doesn't fucking die.
So they're like, alright, they can back up the fucking car.
They're back in the car up on the raccoon, right, But the
ground soft. So all they're doing is they're

(02:51:26):
pushing the raccoon down, but the thing still fucking alive.
Kill this fucking raccoon. They end up having to shoot at
the end and shoot it anyway, butnow they attracted all the
attention of everybody was in a fucking park and then how they
have cops trying to kill. Regulates mother fucking mothers
with. Their kids like, Oh my God, they
shot the raccoon, you know, likeit's fucking crazy, you know,

(02:51:48):
like it's just funny. Shit.
But you know, there was a lot oflike good stuff that happened
with narcotics and shit though. But, you know, like, they're so
sensitive about their stuff thatyou know for sure, you know?
We did a lot of. Big cases and shit and and it
was you. Know that was.
That was like for real, though, you know, I mean like it was a

(02:52:10):
lot more serious, you know, because like, you know, like my,
my partner at the time, like Jose, like he would do what they
call like money pickups and stuff, right, because they like
again, it's. All.
To help out their informants andstuff they would do, you know a
lot of times like when they do the money transfers right where

(02:52:32):
they're gonna take. Money.
From selling drugs. And they got to give it to the
money launderer. They don't know who that guy is.
They just know a name. They're gonna meet the guy in
the whatever. They're gonna meet him and
they're gonna pass the bag to him.
So it's just as simple as you know.
You, Sam. Yeah, here's the bag.
Walk the fuck away. It's not hard to do, you know, I

(02:52:54):
can't do it because I'm not, youknow, of the right nationality
at the time, you know? Yeah, I could do it for a biker
gang, probably, but I can't do it for fucking, you know, if the
money is going to Dominican Republic's, not going to be able
to do it. That's my buddy Josh could do
it, you know what I mean? So.
And the reason why they would dothat is because they're
protecting the informant #1 they're picking up the money,

(02:53:17):
they're making sure it gets to where it's going.
Because they're, you know, when,when an informant tells on
somebody, they're not gonna go lock that guy up.
It's gonna be two or three people down the fucking chain.
That's how you protecting. Your form it, yeah.
Yeah. I mean, you just go and then
you're so far down the line thatthey're never gonna pin it back

(02:53:39):
to, yeah, you're 2 day format. Yeah.
And it takes a lot of work. But you have to do.
That because they're these guys,they'll actually get killed, you
know what I mean? Yeah, Yeah.
And but they make so much money though.
You know, some of these guys aregetting 20% right off the top.
Whatever the fuck you sees, they're getting 20% walking out
the door with a bag of money, you know, like, wow, that's

(02:54:00):
crazy, you know? Are you talking making
$1,000,000 seizure guys walking with 200 grand tax free?
Yeah, and he's still doing. His and he's not getting.
Arrested for money laundering that he's doing another side
anyway. You know he's kind of
protective, right? MMM.
But. It's a.
It's a. It's a.
It's a dangerous business though, right?
You know, because if you do get caught, you're, you're done.

(02:54:22):
They'll kill your whole fucking family, you know what I mean?
So and normally in those kinds of.
Situations like the informant won't know in advance that they
know him, that they know he's aninformant.
He's going to know when it's toofucking late when they're
picking him up. So it's a really a really

(02:54:42):
stressful and dangerous to the highest degree like when.
Guys get caught. Like they don't wanna fucking,
you know, cause they don't. Have a choice?
Someone don't have a? Choice.
Like, you know, like you're looking at going to jail for
fucking 1520 years, you know, and if.
If. If they have enough trust in
you, they'll work with you, you know?

(02:55:06):
But if they don't, they're not gonna do it.
They'll go to fucking. Jail, you know what I mean?
And, and that's the way, you know, that's the way the fucking
cookie crumbles. Really.
I mean was there a a limit to speeds?
That a car would pass beside youspeeding that you weren't
allowed going after? What do you mean?
Like for safety because. I I don't.

(02:55:26):
Know what was the speed here? But let's say I think it's over
160 or 180 here that the cops don't go after.
They just take the plate and send the plate because it would
be too dangerous doing that chase when I was.
Working No, no. Wow, so any car that would.
Pass speeding you would go afternot speeding.

(02:55:47):
Though, you know. Like.
Are you talking about like a? Guy say like on a motorcycle.
Doing like, fucking zinging pastures.
Yeah, yeah, you know what? Like.
I wouldn't even. Go after.
That because I'm not gonna catchhim.
It's just he's just gonna end upgetting killed or I'm gonna end
up crashing. Exactly.
You know that brings up. A Funny Story I.
Had. Because my.

(02:56:10):
Headquarters is right. On the exit of the major
highway, right. So from my building, because we
were stationed in a bank building, our headquarters was
right. Look out the window, I could see
the highway, right? So I was doing some and I get
back to my headquarters and I get a phone call from my buddy

(02:56:33):
Jose. And he's like, hey, we need you.
We're. On Route 80.
We're going fucking, you know, we're following this guy.
Hurry up and get to us. OK?
So I grabbed the guy I'm with. I'm training some guy and it
just happens to be the undersheriffs son-in-law.
Right? OK, great.

(02:56:55):
Fucking. Guy though, you know what I
mean. Like he was just really cool
guy. So I'm like, Jake, come on, we
gotta go. We jump in the van car.
We're we're going. I had a time.
I was driving a a a grand am OK,and it was a cool car.
And so we're going and I'm fucking screaming down the road,
right? I'm trying to catch these guys.
It's really hard to catch somebody who's got a 20 minute

(02:57:15):
head start on you. You know, they're doing whatever
6570, you know, you, you've got to go really fast to get up to
them. And I'm trying so hard to catch
up with these guys. You know, I end up, they end up
going on like the, the New Jersey Turnpike.
And so I'm, we're moving. I'm, I'm doing like 95, you

(02:57:36):
know, sometimes sitting over 100and, and I'm, I'm can't really
make up a lot of ground on theseguys.
So the first time we, we go screaming this fucking the state
trooper, now he's got his fucking lights on.
He's trying to pull us over, pulling your.
Yeah, cause I'm in another cover.
Corner right So. He doesn't want the fuck I am,
so he's just being a crazy guy. Yeah, right.

(02:57:58):
So now he's trying to pull. Us over and I.
Slow down enough where he can come on the side, but I turn my
lights on because I got hidden emergency lights, you know, and
that should be enough. He should fucking figure out
what's going on. Yeah.
No, he wants me to pull over. I'm.
Not fucking fuck him I'm. Not pulling over.
Wow. So wow.
You know why? Weren't you scared right there
taking that? Decision to keep going that he

(02:58:19):
would pit maneuver you who spendthe car OK.
Not in Jersey to leave. OK, OK.
He was gonna be. Shit.
So he come around inside. Of me you know I let him come
around the side and I'm and I got my badge hanging around my
neck right so and I'm fucking just I'm driving and I'm just
like fucking showing it to righthere right and he.

(02:58:39):
He. Fucking won't.
He won't fucking. He won't let up.
Well, why would me then? So fucking going?
He's he's pissed, you know, and I even fucking called my
headquarters. Say get on the fucking, tell
this asshole to get off. You know he just won't do it.
The fucking. So.
He finally stops, right? So we're going, we're going,

(02:59:01):
we're going. And then what happens now is
there's another state trooper, but he's parked and as I go
screaming past them, I'm like, fuck, now I gotta pull over
because I don't want him trying to catch up that speed and
trying to get me right. So I do really quick pullover.
I jump out of my car. I want to say, look, we're doing
a job. I got to get to these guys.

(02:59:22):
He's like fucking go, go, go seeyou later.
OK, alright, thanks. I I get the fucking car, I go
right. So we're still going down the
road, right? And fucking.
Doing, like I said, 95. 100 miles an hour and we finally,
because I can't hear him on the radio, right?
Yeah. All of a sudden.
I hear. Him talking, I hear him talking

(02:59:43):
to him talking, I don't hear no more.
I fucking passed him. Son of a bitch, right?
So, so now I'm slowing down, trying to let them catch up to
me now, right? So finally get it right before
the fucking toll at the end by the Delaware Memorial Bridge,
right? And we finally boxed this guy
in, right And. We got him.
And he's got. A hidden trap in the fucking

(03:00:04):
car, you know, But we can't get the hydraulics to open up, you
know? So my buddy Jose takes him
outside of car. He, I, I call Abla on him.
He fucking ablaze him a little bit, you know, he fucking chokes
him out a little bit and the guyhits the fucking button and the
fucking man opens up, right? He's got like 4 kilos of coke in
in the back, right? OK, that's a lot of money.

(03:00:27):
The troopers. Come up, never really pissed
off. At us, right?
Because it's their Rd. you know,right.
But once we pull the fucking dildos.
Out, you know. We're like, you know, fuck you.
And yeah, so they leave, you know, so we're coming home.
And the guy having the car, me, he's like, he got one.
Tell you something. I'm like, what's up, Jack?
He's like, you know, when you were.

(03:00:48):
Trying to show that guy. You're badge out the window.
I'm like, yeah, he goes, that wasn't your badge.
I'm like, what are you talking about?
He's like, that was your fuckingkey fob to the fucking to the
office door. You know, the little the the
the. Metal.
I had it underneath my fucking ID and badge I had it was
flipped around the wrong eye so showing him my fucking teapot.

(03:01:08):
Right. Which he was fucking hilarious.
Right, because. I'm thinking this guy such an
asshole, why would he bugging you right now?
Here's the thing. Though, so the next.
Day we're working and now we're driving down the road.
We're going to another job and Iget 4 flat tires.
How? Do I get to the side?
Road 4. Fucking like they melted right

(03:01:31):
off like the the rubber melted on it cause I was going so fast
for so fucking long. So Can you imagine if that would
have happened when I was going like really fast?
I would have been dead down Wow.So and the fight and it was
great too, like I managed to getto the core to the shoulder and
just take the fucking keys, put them in the in the divisor.

(03:01:53):
I jumped in the car in front of me.
You know, big Lenny's truck jumping his truck call the
motorpool said hey, come get thefucking guards on the side of
Rd. on Route 80. Whatever they came with a tow
truck, pulled it away. And you know, we just continued
to wear but you. Know.
It's. Funny shit though man.
And it's all common sense too, though, you know, like really

(03:02:15):
like there's a lot of infightingthough, like stuff like with
the. State police on their highway.
Right. You can't go into New York
unless you tell, you know, it's ridiculous, man.
I mean, it's probably the same way up by you, you know what I
mean? Like, I would imagine it would
be. Yeah, because we got federal and
provincial. Cops and like, for example, like

(03:02:37):
a cop in like my city will they,they can't, they can't cross
like the the, the highway between our city and the city
after they could be on that highway.
But right when you're 3 quartersdown to the other city, you
gotta turn around because it's no more your call.
So often like you're going to see a cop just turn around

(03:02:58):
because he reaches limit. So he needs to call in advance
that he's going to hit the limitto send another cop further to
get him because he he's not in control.
It's crazy. Instead of just having that cop
still follow him. Those rules are allowed to keep
going if we're in pursuit. Of some we can.
Cross. Yeah, that's good, you know, and

(03:03:19):
when I was. You know, with the.
The DA we're federal jurisdiction suing over Fuck.
We want it, Yeah, You know, but the.
Whole everything's changed. Though like you can't pursue
anymore. Like they don't let you do that.
We had a town though, like we look, there's a major city in
the county I worked in, right? And then there's a road that

(03:03:42):
goes right through that city andthen it keeps going and then it
goes through the another city, right?
And that little city stuck in between those two cities was
like they were like in constant siege mode, you know what I
mean? Because they they wanted to keep
everybody out of their town, youknow, they want people coming
in, right? And but they would pursue

(03:04:04):
everybody for anything, you know, they were, they were
great. They were, they were chasing
everybody, you know, and they didn't give a shit.
No, like they were. Wild, you know, but.
That's another thing too though,like you have to be careful
because you know, we would get in pursuits and you know, we're
on a low speed pursuit once the guy wasn't doing over 40, you

(03:04:27):
know, and we're just fucking following him like he won't pull
over. Alright, we're not going to
stop, right. So we call it in like, hey,
we're on a pursuit, whatever, and we called in on a state
police net, you know, spend, youknow, state police emergency
network, whatever and nobody's fucking helping us.
So we're like whatever, you know, it's not a big deal.
The guys really not going anywhere we come over to.

(03:04:50):
The the the highway. Goes up the hill as soon as we
get to the top. Holy shit there.
Must have been like 25. Cars lined up on the entranceway
to the highway, waiting to get in on this pursuit.
The fucking guy sees that and hepulls over, right?
So we're like, holy shit. So we get behind him, but all
these fucking cars are coming now, right you.

(03:05:12):
Know it's hard to control that. Because these guys are fucking
maniacs because they don't have the right to report, you know
what I mean? You know, and, and our, our
fucking guy, he got fucked up because like, they went to town
on him. We're pulling guys off.
I'm like, get off our fucking guy, you know what I mean?
You know, by the time we. Got to the fucking guy.
Like he's all lumped the fuck off and now we gotta spend like

(03:05:34):
4 hours in the hospital with him, you know what I mean?
Like that's sort of a we alreadyfollowed him for two hours,
like. Let we don't wanna go to
hospital with him for four hours.
Give me a fucking break. Like and.
They're gone, though, like once.Like we.
Yeah, it was like you hear? Crickets like.
Where the fuck is everybody? They're gone like, you know, ohe
mother. So now we own it, you know what

(03:05:55):
I mean? That's the thing.
Like so? It's rough, man.
You know, like you gotta be. Careful, you know, did you
taking somebody right? And he comes out with a.
Cell phone in his hand. Some some maniac gonna shoot
him, you know? Did you ever?
Did you ever become friends witha civilian that you met during
your your your career because ofyour interaction?

(03:06:24):
That's a good question. You know, I never really thought
about. That.
Probably not. You know when, not when I worked
in. Like the city, you know what I
mean? Like cause because.
Like you didn't really see. Anybody you know, I mean like it
was a. Because you either really like

(03:06:44):
really busy doing like. Nasty, dirty work, you know what
I mean? And then you would get the fuck
out of there when you were done working and you would go see
normal people, you know, I mean,like, because like the, the, the
city I worked in, like, you know, was part of that city.
Like you drive through it in like August and like, you just
smell like the, you know, there's people living in the

(03:07:06):
fucking shooting up in the Bay, you know, in the abandoned
houses and shit. You know, you don't know if
you're smelling a dead body or people are just going in the
bathroom. It's really disgusting, you
know? I mean, it's like, so you can
drive by like, whoa, man. And you know.
You can go look around. In here if you want, but you
know you're not gonna fucking like what you see and it's not
gonna really do you any good. You know what I mean?

(03:07:27):
Like, so you know, that was one thing like I, I you work like
especially in the summers on thebikes you'd wear, you would wear
that like Rd. grime, you know what I mean?
Like yeah, you have to ride motorcycle or no, no, but.
Motocross, yeah, yeah, OK. You know so but.

(03:07:48):
You're covered in like, just thefucking Rd. you know?
I mean. But I love the smell of it
though. Like this?
The smell of this, this, the, the road itself, you know, like
I just love being, you know, getoff the bike and just, you know,
just being in the middle of the street, you know, it's just
great. It was.
It's a great feeling. You know were there.
Ever moments that. Your your team had to be

(03:08:11):
serious, but you guys couldn't keep it together.
And you guys were laughing to the highest degree.
Yeah, well, you know, and it's. Usually a lot of times it's at
my expense, but because I was like I'll, I'll give.
You this is a. Great story, man, you know,
doing his giant raid, right? And it wasn't our job, but we,

(03:08:33):
we, we said, alright, we're gonna help out.
We'll, we'll, we'll go along andyou know, so this is after we,
we did, you know, couple raids and kicked a couple doors in
whatever. And we hear there's something
going on a couple blocks away and they got, they got everybody
lined up against the fucking wall.
And so we pull up and all right,you know, whatever, these guys

(03:08:54):
are doing their own thing and we're just there to stand by.
And I said, you know, and there was this big dude and I used to
call him a Fifi, right? Cause remember, like the, the,
the giant fee 5 OHD farm. You ever hear that?
Oh yeah, I already heard that, but I don't know.

(03:09:15):
Where it's from the, the Jack and the.
Beanstalk OK, OK. Damn.
So yeah, I didn't know. That.
Alright, so this. Guy was like. 7 foot he was a
fucking job and and he was a little.
Aggressive. You know he was in the gang.
Intelligence unit, you know and so.

(03:09:35):
Like everybody's against the. Wall, right?
And you know he's patting one guy down.
No big deal, right? So all of a sudden he fucking
grabs this dude, right? And now the only reason why
you're gonna do that is is if you're putting this guy down and
you feel a weapon on him, you know what I mean?
To make sure you don't grab it, Yeah.

(03:09:55):
There's no other reason, you know.
So I, I fucking see that and I just fucking, I launch off and I
fucking jumped on a fucking guy,you know what I mean?
But now like, because they're both giants, there's two giants
now fucking wrestling and I'm ontop of them.
And then you're, what, 575? 6 right?
So they they fucking come. Down right.

(03:10:17):
And. And and Jose laughing his ass
off. He says like a fucking tree
falling and I'm on. Top of the fucking.
Tree and they come down and boom, I, my fucking head goes
right into the door of a car, right, And it's like, and it's
February 2. It's called out right And I hit
the fucking bone right And I'm like he said like I was like
fucking out of it for a minute, pulled over, He said.

(03:10:37):
I crawled over and I got on top of the pile.
I started punching the fucking guy right?
He pulls me off. Of and shit, he's like, alright.
You got enough, you know. And the thing was though, but
the. Fucking.
The guy didn't have a weapon. Wow.
The The guys felt a. Bag of drugs?
On him now so but because. He was inexperienced.

(03:10:58):
You know what I mean? So you know me.
I'm fucking punching this poor guy thinking he's got a fucking
gun on him. I'm trying to knock him out for
you. Get it?
You know that's what I'm thinking, right?
Yeah, yeah. Back of weed on.
I'm like, oh man, I said that's it, take, take me.
I'm going to fuck home. I called it a night.
The fucking God, Come on, we're going out.

(03:11:19):
I'm not going out. Going the fuck off.
It's probably stories like that that.
They. Called you men diesel there
because you you don't give a fuck how tall, how big that guy
is. I never did.
You're gonna do your job there. Wow.
Because I never. Like I said, I had two older.
Brothers, man, you know what pain is temporary, You know it
is. It goes the fuck away, you know,
so you know, and. Always shit like that though

(03:11:45):
man, you know? Like, and looking back now, you
gotta you have to understand like, like Jose, right?
This guy can fight, man. You know, I'm saying like he
these guys were no joke. You know, I should just let them
handle it. I don't know why it involved.
You know, I'm saying maybe JP had the right idea saying yeah,
you got you had it. You know what I mean?

(03:12:07):
Hello though. You know I.
Do miss it though, You know, I'msaying like honestly, like I
look back, you know, obviously I'm older and, and it was just
such a great time, you know, andwe did, you know, we did some
good. Stuff, you know, I mean it.
Wasn't all like, you know, like when I was the the detective in
a small. Town I really.
Gave a shit, You know, I'm saying like because I live in

(03:12:28):
that town, I grew up in that town, my wife lives in that
fucking town, you know, And you know what?
Pissed me off though because these.
Mother fuckers that look, I don't want, I don't give a shit.
You wanna go shoot fucking heroin all day?
I don't fucking care. Go for it.
You're gonna, you're gonna drop fucking dead.
That's on you. OK.

(03:12:49):
But you know, but what, when youcross that line and fucking
start robbing houses and shit and you start, you know, I mean,
because now you're affecting thequality of life everybody else
in the fucking town. Exactly.
You're not just destroying. You there?
You're hurting other people, right?
You know and and. Like.
And. I I think I told you story.

(03:13:10):
I may not have, but you know thethe the older lady.
Her husband. Dies.
I think they were married like fucking 60 years or something
like that, you know what I mean?She's at his funeral and they
rob her fucking house. OK, now not only is that just a
shitty thing to do, Absolutely, but you're.

(03:13:30):
Also. Giving.
Me, the giant middle fucking finger.
You're saying that you don't think I'm shit and you're not
worried about the consequences, and now I'm not gonna fucking
have that. You know what I mean?
You didn't meet Gary yet? No.
No, seriously. Because.
Like fuck that. Because.
Now I can't. I'm obviously not doing my job,
you know? Yeah.
So I I. Took that as a declaration of

(03:13:52):
war, you know what I mean? And fuck that.
And and look, I made it so bad for them that like, they, they
would put costumes on to go takethe bus to go buy drugs because
they wouldn't fucking drive. They wouldn't, they wouldn't
have someone give him a ride, you know, because they were
terrified that I, you know, I'vealways lurking, right?
And that's how I wanted to think, you know?
Yeah, exactly. But that.

(03:14:14):
That's bullshit. Though, And again, it it's,
it's, it's always the same people robbing the fucking
houses. You know, they're not going to
go to another town and rob a house because they don't know
the town, you know what I mean? So you know, it's, it's a
homegrown problem and it's, it'sand it's just for drugs.
That's it. You want to solve your
burglaries, you solve the drugs and you and you kill two birds

(03:14:36):
with one stone, you know and youknow you got you got weirdos in
your town too, though, you know like there was one time I wasn't
on call so I didn't get the job till Monday.
Well, for ending that story, you.
Arrested that guy and he he was dressed as what, when you
arrested him? Hasidic Jew, you know, he had
the pearls and everything, right?

(03:14:56):
The fucking hat, you know, I think that's a good costume
because it really. Changes the company I honestly.
I considered letting him go because all the effort he put
into that, like, that was like astellar fucking performance.
What? I mean like, so I was gonna like
but Nah, fuck that, because it was too.
Funny bringing him into headquarters.

(03:15:17):
With the fucking save 2 costume,you know what I mean?
Like for sure I got A2 right here.
You know like like it look like you put a.
Costume on. How great is that?
You know, look, don't, don't tell me I'm not doing my job.
These mother fuckers are puttingcostumes on, you know what I
mean? So, you know, so fucking crazy.
And. Were there any running jokes or?

(03:15:38):
Tradition among your team that newcomers had to learn the hard
way, um. No, but they.
Broke my balls, you know. When I got there, because again,
I was shorter than everybody else, you know, everybody was
like, they're all dying 510. At least at.
Least, at least. At fucking least you know what
I. Mean and I it was kind of like

(03:16:00):
rare. That I was even.
Out on the fucking Rd., you knowwhat I mean?
So when I first got on a. Motorcycle squad.
You know, the, the bikes are alllined up in a garage, you know,
and I had a bike assigned to me and to post right next to to my
bike. They had this big fucking sign
on it and said, you know, you must be this tall to ride this
ride, you know, and it was obviously fucking higher than my

(03:16:22):
head, which I thought was hilarious because that that was
fucking very pretty, you know, like, so, you know, like this
shit like that, you know, I remember.
JP got. On a unit.
I tape fucking like mouse ears on his fucking helmet, you know,

(03:16:43):
because I labeled them a fuckingrat.
As soon as he got there. I'm like, what the fuck up?
Because I know you're a rat. You know, he's like, I, I have
my rat. I'm like, just just go with it.
Just shut the fuck up. You know what I mean?
You're a rat, you know so. But yeah, it was, it was fun
though. Is there a story?
About teamwork, that. Stands out not because it was
heroic, but because it was just plain old funny.

(03:17:07):
Yeah, I remember 1. Time there was a guy, Ray.
Ray Ray was a bodybuilder or another, a lot of bodybuilders
on our units, but so when we rode the bikes.
Right, if you didn't have a. Partner for that day, Yeah, you
know, And you were riding solo on a motorcycle.
Everybody else kept close to you, you know, it's just because
you're alone on a bike, you know, it's just so.

(03:17:30):
And then we had a certain. Way of calling stuff in.
Over the radio and if I deviatedfrom that in any way, there was
a reason for it and which was a signal to anybody else on the
bikes to hate you swing by you know you don't wanna call for
backup because that's like a pussy move you know I mean so
you. So if you, you know, if you
weren't sure what's going on, like, you know, you would

(03:17:51):
whatever call, call it in, you know, and just say something
that you normally don't say, youknow, like say there's like 3
occupants in a car or whatever. Just because I usually.
Don't say. That most of the guys usually
didn't do it, you know, so that would just be like just
something that and people would swing by.
So I was riding solo. And this guy Ray was riding.

(03:18:12):
Solo so Ray called something in and he and he he said something
about the car being occupied whatever and I knew right I
swing by so I get there and raise writing tickets to this
guy and the guy standing at a car which is not a big deal.
That happened a lot especially if we're going to tow the
vehicle you know I mean and Ray was gonna total vehicle this guy

(03:18:33):
to have drivers license nothing he was he was going and so I'm
just sitting here and watching what's going on and you know the
guys like fucking scratching allover the place.
You could tell he's a fucking he's a junkie, you know, And I'm
standing behind him and I'm, I'mjust so my thing inching.
Closer to him. You know, because I could tell

(03:18:54):
he's getting antsy, you know, and he, he fucking, he looks
right, he looks left and and I know what he's doing.
He's looking for gonna run. Yeah, you know.
He's gonna run, so I'm I'm getting I.
Get a little closer, look closerand it comes over a radio that
he, he was 1050 and that's our code, meaning that he's wanted,

(03:19:15):
but they knew our codes on the street.
Soon as that came over radio, I lunged at the fucking guy
because he took off right? But I I went for his waistband
because I'm not, I'm smart enough to know that you go for
the shirt. He's just gonna fucking out of
the shirt. He's gone.
You know, you sit there like an idiot holding his shirt in your
hand. So I had his fucking waistband.

(03:19:36):
He wasn't going anywhere. You know, this guy was maybe
100. And. 20 lbs I'm.
Telling you he was fucking cracked out.
He was fucking, he's dragging medown the fucking Rd. you know
what I mean? So fucking Ray comes over and
fucking we try to, you know, this guy's fighting them and
he's fighting us like you can't believe, you know, I mean, like
he's, he's fucking, we're givingit right back to what?

(03:19:57):
Punching him, fucking kicking him.
You know, we, we go down, he fucking gets off, he shakes his
off him. We fucking tackle him again.
He's like, holy shit, you know what I mean, right?
So. Now with this.
A friend of ours. Is coming up the road there's a
hill right comes up over the hill and he fucking he sees us
getting thrown the fuck around by this little dude right in the

(03:20:18):
middle of right. We used to work at all.
We all work together in a jail, you know, and he's like, what
the. So he fucking comes over and
right before he gets to us, I had enough at this point and I
and I fucking grabbed my Mace and I tell fucking Reg who was
with, I yell, you know, duck. You know, he goes.
No. Well, he should have fucking

(03:20:38):
ducked. Yeah, I fucking blasted him,
right? I blasted him.
I blasted the other guy. I didn't mean to blast him, but
he didn't duck. Yeah, I mean, so they both go
down. Took the fight right out of the
fucking. Guy.
Handcuffed the guy, you know, and so now he's fucking raised
pissed, obviously. But you know, what was I gonna,
you know, fuck it, I'm not gonnahit the guy with my baton

(03:21:00):
because number one, I might hit Ray, and that's going to leave a
mark, you know what I'm saying? And plus the baton, that's a
hospital trip, right? So fuck yeah, I got damn right.
So. The guys crying, he's screaming,
his snot flying, you know, it's like nasty, gross shit, you
know? And so we throw him in this guy
Mel's car. Mel, Mel, Carmelo, Chrishon,

(03:21:22):
Mel, Mel, Mel cushion. I love Mel, but so we get the
fucking guy. But I'm telling you, this guy
was the strongest fucking dude ever, right?
And we got him back to headquarters and of course it
turns out to be one of the nicest fucking guys in the
world, right? You know what I mean?
Like, and he just didn't want togo to fucking jail.
And I, I understand, I wouldn't want to go to fucking jail.

(03:21:43):
I worked in the jail. I don't wanna go back to jail.
So you know what, we cut him a break.
He just had a warrants on him, you know what I mean?
Like a couple more vehicle warrants.
We didn't charge him with assault or any of that bullshit,
you know, I mean, whatever and you know, whatever he.
Went still went to the county. Jail for a couple of days, but
believe it was on motor vehicle violations, you know, because we

(03:22:05):
if you hit him with the fucking assault and shit like that, he's
going he's going for years. You know, so you.
Know. That's probably much pretty much
like teamwork is like, you know?You kind of like.
Solo operators, a lot of. These guys, you know, they get
on, they get into headquarters, they grab their gear, they grab
their assignment and they're on the road.
They go do their own thing, man.And that's why they love, they

(03:22:28):
love it. They used to anyway, because
they can do whatever the fuck they want her to do.
They could go pick up the dry cleaning and they could, you
know what I mean? Like.
And that's why it was. So much better than being in the
jail because you were free, you know.
But then when you, you know, when when you got on like, say,
narcotics, you had more freedom,you know, you had less

(03:22:49):
supervision, you know, So every kind of you get less supervision
because they trust you more, youknow.
Yeah. And, you know, cause very little
supervision when we were under comics.
I mean, yeah, we. Were making decisions.
That you know, captains wouldn'teven make be making, you know,

(03:23:10):
but you have to make them quick and you have to that's it
everything's on the fly. That's why you.
Don't have time to call this kill call that.
No, no, it's Lulu now. Yeah.
And and. And you know what?
They. Could second guess you all they
want, but they weren't there so you know.
Even. When my shooting right guy said
you guys the shit out of me, youweren't there, you know, OHS,

(03:23:30):
you should have double tapped him.
I'm lucky I got one shot off. What are you kidding me?
You think I had all day? I had maybe 3 seconds, you know,
like fucking it's not like that,you know?
But a lot of these guys, you know.
They're used to shooting. Paper targets and they get into
that, you know that mode, you know, like where the SWAT guys

(03:23:51):
are are are are good for that. The guys I worked with anyway,
they, they always like, you know, you know.
Always had. Something to say.
And I'd be like. OK, raise your fucking.
Hand if you ever shot somebody. You know, and nobody.
No. Alright, shut the fuck up.

(03:24:12):
You know that I don't wanna hearit.
I don't hear word, any fucking mouth.
Cause it's not a paper target. It's not the fucking same thing.
And I, I don't, I don't really care, you know, but that's the
way it is. You know, everyone's got.
Something to say, you know, So can you share a moment where?
A paperwork after the case was somehow more ridiculous than the

(03:24:33):
case itself. I read every single DWI.
Every single. One you know.
What I'm saying, you know, because the rest of the
paperwork had a reason to it like, yeah, yeah.
You write these, you know, when you're on narcotics, you write
like these long affidavit for search warrants, you know,

(03:24:55):
they're long and there are detailed and it's a story, you
know, because you're you're explaining everything, you know.
Yeah, but you, you see somebody,these guys reports on patrol
that's like 3 lines. You know, it's like you should
almost written in crayon. It's almost like, you know,
nowadays they all write amount of computer in the cars and
shit, you know. But when I was there, these guys

(03:25:16):
would actually like, you know, hand write a lot of their shit
and you'd be like, holy shit. You know if.
If, if there were two lines in the report, you'd be, you'd be
lucky if they had two complete sentences.
And they bitch about it too. They bitch about having to write
it. I had to write those two.
You know I'm saying like. Yo-yo man.

(03:25:39):
But then those are the same guys.
That that bitch, then they. Don't get promoted or they don't
get put on special units, you know?
Well, why would they put you on a special unit?
You won't even take the fucking time to write a a, a decent
report, Yeah. It doesn't make sense you.
Know. So, and what's the most?
Comical. Misunderstanding or mix up
you've seen between officers andlike in public or or behind.

(03:26:06):
I didn't know you. Were going to ask me this
question. Well, for sure not I, I build.
Those yesterday this this is. Fucking so the day that we did
the arrest with my 18,000 bags of heroin, right?
It's the one on the wall right there right that picture.

(03:26:27):
So I'm new to the unit so they don't have a car.
For me yet. Which I don't care because my
Chiefs, like, ride would pose great.
It's like old times, you know? Yeah.
So we. Know that we're doing our.
Job we don't know that this we don't know that the job is gonna

(03:26:49):
turn into what it turned into you know because you never do
know you know starts out with the you know something simple
like a motor vehicle stop where you follow a car and ended up
into the heroin mill ended up back to the apartment you know I
mean so you don't really know ever know where it's going to
end up but we do know that we'restarting here at point A yeah

(03:27:09):
yeah at. Point A because.
There's supposedly this house isrocking heroin Bill and we don't
know yet we're gonna see right so.
We all in the, we're all in the area.
We're not gonna notify the locals that we're there.
We can't because we don't know who's who, who's doing why.
You don't trust anybody. You just do your thing and stay
the fuck out of the limelight and no one even, you know, but

(03:27:33):
my partner Jose, you know, I call it the great.
Ice cream. War OK, because he had to have a
fucking ice cream cone, right? All the time.
Like we don't have fucking time.We gotta go, OK?
No, fuck that, I'm stopping. I'm like come on, man right?
So he stops. He doesn't.

(03:27:55):
Park the car, right? Right.
Because he's gonna run in and he's gonna run right the fuck
out. And I'm in the car, right?
There's the town that we were in.
There's a Sergeant there directing traffic, right?
And Jose gets out of the fuckingcar.
He goes to run in and the guy starts yelling at him.
He says hey park that fucking. Car right, You can't leave that.
Car there and Jose he's like yeah OK no problem and he runs

(03:28:17):
in and he fucking comes back outwith his fucking nice going yeah
fucking Sergeant ohf he's fucking pissed right.
So he comes over he's fucking yelling at him now and he's like
let me see your fucking drivers license let me.
And Jose he's like I'm not showing you shit.
Fuck yeah right. Well, my sweet mother.
Fucker. Really has it now he's like.
Fuck you, you know. What you don't fucking talk to

(03:28:38):
me like, you know, talk to anybody like that.
And he's like, and he, you know,he told me, he said fuck you
out. You know, I'm on the job.
I'm and that should be enough for you, you know, and no, fuck
that. I wanna see you drive.
I wanna see your credentials. I wanna see your drivers
license. And he's like, I'm not showing
you a fucking thing, right. So I'm like Jose man, just
fucking let's show, show him theguy what he fucking wants.
Let's get the fuck outta here. He's like, no, fuck him, fuck

(03:28:59):
you, Terry tells me. OHS so.
The Sergeant calls her back up. OK.
So I watched you. Guys, they, they pull up behind
us, they're all getting out of the car and they're all putting
on their black fucking gloves, right?
And they're looking at me right now.
Whoa, hold on a second. Because of what?

(03:29:20):
I said. Look.
Let me get my. Black fucking gloves.
I got gloves too. Hold on.
And I pulled my gloves on here. He's like, don't even fucking
tell me you guys are cops. I said, yeah, we're we're
fucking cops. Fucking guy turns around, he
goes, let's go. All the fucking backup course.
So now the fucking Sergeant leftin there like a jerk off, right?
So, and they're still going at it.

(03:29:40):
And so the guy calls for his. Fucking chief.
Well, our chiefs down the. Fucking.
Road too. So now my chief, who's cool as
hell comes fucking rolling down and he says cheap, but I'll do
respect. Can can we send these guys back
to their assignments so they cango do police work and me, you
can work this out. And and the guy, the guys like,

(03:30:02):
yeah, well, that that's a good idea, you know, no shit, you
know what I mean? So, yeah, we get to go do our
thing and they go and the chief tails it with the other chief.
You know, I mean, like, OK, I'lltell my guys are knocked off.
Tell you fucking got to calm down.
Let's see. OK, you know, but that's how bad
shit can go though, right? These guys are ready to lump us
up, you know, I'm saying well, you know, and, and so I got my

(03:30:22):
black loves you. Know it's ridiculous though I.
Think I would have done the sameall.
All they're putting. Their love those I got my two
but fuckers. Going on to fuck it, we'll go,
you know? Fucking crazy, man.
Fucking Jose, have you ever had a funny moment?
With a suspect that caught you off guard, caught everybody off

(03:30:44):
guard. Yeah, I mean, it was.
No big deal though. But he, you know, so I was with
Jose. And we were down.
It was winter, so we were both in a car and we were assigned up
county because our Sergeant was mad at us.
So he sent us up there on A7 at night to three in the morning
shift, right? It's we scored dog watch, right?

(03:31:05):
Because there's nobody out therebut fucking dogs barking, you
know? I mean, yeah.
And there's nobody on the road. There's nothing going on, you
know, And so we're sitting up there just, you know, OK, now
what? You know, you can't even go eat
or nothing. There's no restaurants open.
It's fucking brutal. So we got this car covered up

(03:31:25):
the fucking road, right? And we pull them over for
whatever reason. I don't even know why.
And Jose smells weed. Right.
You know. At the time it was illegal in
Jersey. And so he brings the guy around
the back of the car and he tellsthis guy, he says, look.
If you got shit on, you tell us.Now, because if I find it on

(03:31:48):
you, you know what? You're gonna get fucked.
And you know what? So just if you got something.
You just. Give it to us now and it'll go
easier on you. He didn't expect it to fucking
work. The guy reaches in his fucking
pants. He pulls out like a fucking
quarter pound the fucking weed, right?
It was, you know, he can stick it in his underwear was so
fucking big. Boom.

(03:32:09):
He puts on a fucking hood of carand I'm like holy shit, you have
that in your pants, You know what I mean?
Like. Fucking, you know, Guy was.
Cool, right? But you know, we had to lock him
up unfortunately, you know. But the guy was high as him.
He was fucking high as a kite. And it was fucking another nice
fucking guy though, you know what I mean?
Like put a big old bag of fucking weed.
You know which it goes back the guy you need that artist.

(03:32:31):
Sure. Yeah, I got it.
Yeah, Yeah, I boom right on the trunk.
You know, like, holy shit, you know, fucking great.
You know, it's, it's fucking funny shit.
Is there stories that? You would share at reunions with
your old team that could get everybody laughing still to
Disney. Yeah, I mean the the, you know,

(03:32:58):
my my big. Lenny used to have a thing where
if he started to laugh right, he's I don't know exactly what
what it was, whether his his chest was so fucking big that
his would stifle his neck and itwould close his windpipe or his
neck. Something was fucked up cause
he's such a God damn big like lifter at the time, but he

(03:33:20):
would, it would cut off his oxygen supply and he would pass
the fuck out. Wow, are we nicknamed it the
Huckabee, Right, Because we would watch him, he would and
would go down, you know, and wow.
So it's common. It was fairly common.
Depends. How you know if he was laughing
hard enough? You know, so the, the time, the

(03:33:41):
the story I told you where I jumped out of the van, Yeah.
And they all stepped on you, my ass.
Right, so. Jose was telling that story one
night. Yeah, and he fucking.
End up doing the. Huckabee and he fucking went
down and he fucking hit the cigarette machine, fucking
knocked it over. You know what I mean?
Like, but so that's the shit telling that story would fucking

(03:34:02):
that's every time we see each other, we can't pass up the
Huckabee. You know, I would ask for the
video of this. And there's another.
Almeida like we were at a festival in in the city of
Passaic and it was a I forget what kind of festival.
Maybe Mexican? Something like that.
But so there was a fucking donkey, right?

(03:34:25):
It. Little fucking thing, right?
Whatever. Yeah, it was about and never
breaking my chops. You know, we were on bikes at
the time. We were walking around and
they're like, you, don't you? Know you don't got.
The balls to get on that fuckingthing and try to ride it, I'm
like, don't fucking tell me. Don't jump on that fucking
thing. And they're like, no, no way.
You won't do it. So the fucking Sergeant is like,

(03:34:47):
go ahead, do it, you won't get in trouble.
I I don't think you'll do it. OK, I jump on this fucking thing
and it fucking takes off offer, Sir, OK.
And I don't. Know how to ride this fucking.
Thing and I'm fucking gotta playits neck like holy fuck you know
what I mean like it's going through the fucking crowd and
you know I fucking. Thing finally stopped and
jumped. Off it, you know, but, you know,

(03:35:09):
like, that's, that's good shit right there, you know, But I
can't believe it took off, you know, I can't believe I jumped
on it though, to be honest. Yeah.
But you know, well, I jumped on the pig before.
And I'm telling. You right when you.
Fall on top of it because you'rejumping one shot on it.
Well, it started a run so fast. I hit that fed so fast because

(03:35:32):
he went straight to that fence and the end of everything.
I'm thinking he's gonna go through that fence.
He just turns. And me, I just kept going right
over the feds, hit my two legs, hit the feds, flip on the other
side. Everybody was fucking crying on
the ground and I was like, I knew I could ride this
motherfucker. That's great.
Yeah, camaraderie is such a. Big part of law enforcement.

(03:35:56):
That's what we we've been learning through these two
podcasts with you. Can you tell us a moment when
your your team really came together in an unexpected way?
Um. I mean I.
You know nothing that stands out.
But we were tight though. Like, in a sense, we're like.

(03:36:17):
Yeah, I mean I nothing. I mean nothing.
Crazy really, but we've been hanging out after work too
though, you know, I mean like, and we were always together,
always. Would you guys celebrate your
birthdays? Like together or some stuff like
that. No, I mean like.
But you know, we all live. Close enough together so like
holidays we see each other and shit, you know like so like what

(03:36:38):
would happen though is like, youknow, we would go out a.
Lot you know. We were younger though, you know
what I mean? Like so and and plus like you
know you when you're working. Like in narcotics?
Or whatever. Like you don't, it's not the
same. Like you do a lot of your work
in in a bar, you know, like you're not going to meet in a
format in headquarters. You know you got to meet them or

(03:37:03):
neutral. Yeah.
You know science, so. You know, so we would end up
going out like, you know, journal week and every Friday
night we'd always go out, you know, and early though, you
know, and then make it home. Whatever.
Enough time. Saturdays was always, you know,
you're hanging out with your wife, you know?

(03:37:23):
You know, you want to see these guys, you know?
Yeah, enough of them all fuckingweek.
And they never hurt, you know, so you know.
But we, we, we were with each other all the time though, man,
you know, like and and. I mean fuck, like they knew
everything about you. Too, though, you know, I'm

(03:37:44):
saying like there was nothing, you know?
But I guess it had to be. That way too though you.
Know I mean like I don't think they do that now though.
I don't think it's like that now.
I really don't like look good. I think these guys.
Get in the car. They're getting headquarters,
they have their assignment and they go on the road, they go,
they go do the wrong thing, you know, and, and it's they're
missing a lot, you know. Hmm.
I mean, for example, like the motorcycle squad I was on, we

(03:38:06):
had 10 full time riders. Now that that same department,
like I think they have two full time guys on a motorcycle, OK,
you know, because they're all incars or.
Yeah, they got rid of a lot of the.
Bikes you know they got. Rid of the horses, right?
Because, you know, that was a whole other like, Dang, the
horse guys, you know, yeah, the horses were cool, you know, for

(03:38:27):
sure I wouldn't want to be a horse guy.
And that was a lot of hard work those guys had to do.
You know, there's like 4 hours of prep work just to ride the
horse for like 4 hours, you know, but but those things are
effective, you know, they, they were because.
We patrolled like a. Big, big park, you know, And

(03:38:49):
they used the horses for the trails, you know.
So, yeah. But then again, they took him
out for like, crowd control. Every.
Every. Christmas, they had them around.
The mall. The horses were always around
the mall looking for like guys breaking into cars and shit, you
know? I feel a horse is so like.
Unexpected as well because you you could scare a horse and

(03:39:13):
really a fucking that guy will fly the fuck off Laura.
We had horses we had horses for years.
I at my place and even horses that like would listen to my
mother word for word. I say yes.
And the horse would you? Yeah.
Oh, no, no, no, no. And the horse.
Was amazing. And even if you can push a horse

(03:39:35):
to that level, well, it's still a wild animal like a snake and
like a it's, it's going to stay that forever.
And there was a one time there my mom goes in the in the farm
and my mom was putting hay and Iliterally saw my, my mom fly
like at least 5 6 feet in the air and we fall down.

(03:39:56):
The, the, the horse grabbed her or ponytail and literally picked
her up like this. And when he did on the way up,
she screamed obviously. And he let go right there.
So she just went up and went down.
And when she went out, she got back up, smacked up, got out of
the got out the, the, the, the, the closure and the the whole

(03:40:16):
month after that. Each time my mom was coming in
to give like carrots extra to the horses.
She would look at that was like,you're not getting shit and the
horses. The corner like putting his head
like he didn't want to see my mom anymore.
But that's how like these horseslike it can like like a cat like
it takes 1 little thing and it scares them or they're not sure
or something and they could jumpon your face it's it's so

(03:40:38):
dangerous. So let's say I would be a
criminal and there would be a whore a a cop with a horse and a
woods looking for me. I'm telling you I'm gonna find a
rock and throw it right in his face of that of that horse
because the the humans gonna stay there.
But if you fragile that horse, well he outta here.

(03:40:58):
I remember. Watching the walk guys out of
the woods. Too.
Like, you know, they fucking just like the old days, you
know, with the rope I could fucking hand walking.
Behind a horse you. Know and and they stopped doing
that shit too though, you know, but I don't know starting a
sore. Throat.
Yeah, I got. I got.

(03:41:19):
Four more, if that's OK. Alright, cool.
OK, perfect. What's the?
Most absurd or surreal thing youwitness on the job that made you
think? No one will believe me if I told
this fucking story. Well, the fucking diaper man.
You know what I mean? Like that that like to me, I I
just can't even fucking believe that, you know?
Do you know what? Why?

(03:41:40):
Why he? Wasn't that mind state when you
said like he was quite intelligent?
So it was just the the his per his perv section of his brain.
That was like, yeah, a. 100% andhe.
Thought he thought that he was smarter than everybody, you know
and I guess that day he was I mean, you know, but I, I would

(03:42:02):
love to know what the fuck happened to him.
You know, I have no idea. But you know, and then you go,
you gotta look back and say like, you know, maybe the old,
the old ways were better, you know, You know, because like to
me, like the fucking guy was a predator.
I know, yeah. Absolutely, you know.

(03:42:24):
And to look at him in any. Other way I I don't know.
Yeah, cause it's he's not he. Wasn't mentally ill, didn't know
there was no fucking OK. He was fucking a weirdo.
And yeah, you know, yeah. Now fuck that, you know?
Like. This is out of nowhere.

(03:42:47):
But what do you think about DB Cooper?
Well, I think he's fucking awesome.
Actually, I mean, that's ballsy.I mean, being a skydiver, right?
Like so yeah, for for him to fucking exit the back of that
plane as fast as that plane was going.
I know he had the plane slow down to a certain speed, but it

(03:43:07):
was still way faster than normal.
It's fucking. Sick, you know what I mean?
Like and in pitch darkness, pitch.
Darkness. Really.
I mean, yeah, he had an idea of where he was.
But there's no fucking way. Like, you know what I mean?
Like I do you think it's possible?
To. For him to have landed and
survive since you lived. Yeah, me too.

(03:43:29):
I think you know why. Because I think that.
Sometimes when people are fucking crazy like that shit
works out for him, you know, I mean, and I think he had a whole
plan not. Only the the the plan and the
plan. The plan after he was ready to
go to like he thought about it. And if he.
Survived that jump, then he was golden.
You know. Did You Know?

(03:43:51):
That the real. Name that he gave on that plane
is not DB Cooper. Did you know that?
I learned that last week. His real.
Name was Dan Dan. Cooper but a journalist that did
a mistake when he was writing a story and put DB Cooper when
that had nothing to do. There was no B Nowhere was Dan
Cooper that he gave. Yeah.

(03:44:12):
So after that, all the journalists kept writing that DB
Cooper and it just sounded more badass.
So they they kept it in the end game instead of taking the B
out. That's what they're crazy.
And how and how heavy is 200,000?
It's not, it's not that heavy. So it would be possible to hold

(03:44:34):
on to that. Bag while parachuting.
I don't know if he would be ableto hold on to it.
OK, he had to have said that's. Wrapped to him.
OK. Yeah, yeah, because.
Like. Something that big, the win, you
know? The heat strapped that thing to
him, you know, so and the fact that they never found him, you

(03:44:58):
know, or, or, but they found pieces of money everywhere.
Yeah. But I think though, that that's
a. Little leave a little bread
crumbs somewhere else, you know,that's what I think and I think
we would have found a body if. He would have been dead.
That's what I did. He felt something.
Something. You know, I hope you lived I.
Hope you made it. You know, a lot of a lot of

(03:45:20):
people do like. Even the people that are anti
crime to the highest degree because of what he did, he
didn't still nobody he didn't like like no human being by
himself and he didn't hurt no human being by himself.
He literally stole from the government and ran away with
200,000 without injuring nobody.So a lot of people were seeing

(03:45:42):
him as a hero and it was the first successful hijacking
because back then that that there was many hijacking.
But the guy would when they would land, he would trade the
passengers for something and tryto get out there.
They wouldn't, right? It would have never thought of
people to putting that plane back up, but he did.

(03:46:02):
And so it was fucking amazing ifsomeone were to write a.
Sitcom. Episode based on one day in in
your life. What would the plot be and who
would be the lead character? OHP man.

(03:46:24):
I have no idea man. If if you know if.
If they made my book into a movie and.
Yeah, if I could have somebody play, I definitely fucking what?
Fucking Ben Diesel, Sinclair. Where that's.
His name right something. Sinclair that's that's who I'd

(03:46:48):
have to have. You know, how great would that
be, right? Yeah, that would be awesome
since you were named. Mini diesel, right?
That would be so. Cool.
Yeah, that would. That would be awesome.
So last question. Was there a a moment like when
you were under undercover with criminals around you that like
you had to keep your yourself a character because it was hard,

(03:47:11):
because of a moment that was, I don't know, maybe funny or very
dangerous that but you had to stay in character and stay
undercover. So I did a.
We did a job before I went to the DEA so we were buying a

(03:47:32):
MDMA. Ecstasy, right?
Yeah. And so the guy.
Didn't deliver all the pills. Right.
So I had to stay in fucking my role.
As the guy. Buying the fucking drugs so I
cause I I couldn't burn the foreman.

(03:47:55):
Yeah, yeah, we. All got arrested.
Everybody got. Arrested, right?
So I ended up having to stay in a cell for six hours, right?
Trying to figure out where the fucking guy kept the rest of his
drugs, you know what I mean? And the guy was in the cell with
me, you know? So I was in the fucking cell for
like 6 hours and. We finally found out where.

(03:48:17):
He kept it. And of course, my Sergeant at
the time, the guy that I didn't like, who was useless and didn't
want to ever do anything, you know, after we.
Found it. He want he.
Was done. He wanted to go home.
He's playing golf the next day. So he wrapped up the job.
Let me wrapped the fucking job. We fought.
Yeah. I spent six hours in his cell to
get the information and now you don't want to write the fucking

(03:48:39):
search warrant so we can go get the shit you.
Know so that's ridiculous. And that's like, you know, and I
just. But I wasn't surprised, though,
honestly. I, you know, I just shook my
head like what? What a jerk off.
But not only that, though, but you.
But you, you're you're not letting me do it either, you
know? Yeah, I could just as easily
write. Write it up and get.

(03:48:59):
This shit done and get no, you ordered it all shut down.
So, you know, it's if that's that's ridiculous, man, you
know, so, but whatever it is what it is, you know, so Amen.
Thank you. Gary.
For taking another podcast with me, it was it was amazing
hearing yeah, all those stories.I hope a lot of people got some

(03:49:23):
laughter and understand that these years before is is so
completely different than the years of law enforcement that we
are now. And I, I feel that you were a
true hero in life and, and a true, a true man that literally
went through the, the darkest moments in life and came out
fucking beast. So, um, I want to thank you

(03:49:44):
again for coming on and we'll probably see each other another
time. So hey, listen, I loved it.
Thank you. And let's let's do it again.
Have fun, man. It's great.
Thank you. Perfect.
So take care everybody, and. Have a great weekend.

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