October 29, 2025 • 34 mins
Sandy and Cara discuss the steps you can take to get your mount ready for the adventures of ponying on the trail. They also discuss how to make sure the horse being ponied is equally ready. There are many strategies you can use to prep both animals and they suggest a few resources for anyone wanting to take the next steps towards trail training.
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Speaker (00:00):
Clip clop goes the trail sun is rising high two
gals in the saddle neath the bigNevada sky laughing and
chatting as the desert rolls onby it's saddle talk come along
for the ride Welcome listenersto Saddle Talk with Sandy and
(00:24):
Cara.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Whether you're here to laugh with us, learn, or just
ride along, you're in for areally good time.
So go grab your helmet or yourpooper scooper and settle in
with us as we discuss life,horses, of course, and all the
unexpected turns along thetrail.
And hey, whether you're aseasoned cowgirl or you're still
learning, remember we'resharing our own stories and
opinions based on decades ofpersonal experience.
(00:46):
Always ride safe and check witha professional before trying
anything new.
Now let's go ride.
Speaker 4 (00:55):
Well, hello, listeners.
Hello, Cara.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Hello.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
So we had a really good day today.
Yes.
We did Yeah, we did someriding.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
And if anybody saw the video that I posted prior
to, I was ponying shooter.
I was not ponying Max.
I have to say that right now.
But it's a good lead-in becausetoday we want to discuss
ponying part two.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Pony part two.
We need to continue ourdiscussion on how to actually
get your horses ready forponying.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Right.
The first time we discussed howdo you build your confidence as
that rider, getting yourselfready to feel comfortable doing
the actual pony and being safe.
Right.
So now we want to discuss howdo you prep the horses.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
I think that one of the most important things you
need to have in a horse,obviously, is an animal that
just gives to pressure.
And if you don't have an animalthat's able to give to
pressure, then you can't pony.
So there are a couple thingsthat you can do to get an animal
that isn't giving to pressureready.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Well, can I interrupt?
Yeah, of course.
Okay, so what if we start offwith the like the three
sections?
So you have to have the horsethat's going to pony, right?
So you have to prepare thathorse.
And then you have to prep thehorse that's being ponied, and
then the third part would bebringing those two together.
(02:22):
So let's start with the horsethat's being ponied, which is
what you were just about to talkabout.
Sorry, yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So I'm glad you tracked me back.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
So, but anyway, so that way we have this in
section, so then everybody canput it together.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
So we'll discuss first the horse that's actually
being ponied, depending on theage and experience of that
animal, is really gonna dictatehow you handle the actual pony.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
And the equipment you use.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
And the equipment you use.
That's a really good point.
Yeah.
So if you have a baby horse,that baby horse is gonna follow
its mama wherever.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
As long as you you're you have the mama.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Good point.
As long as you have the mom,the baby will follow anywhere.
And I don't even know if that'show the term ponying came
about, but I think it must have.
It has to be something to dowith that.
It has to have something to dowith that.
Yeah.
So if you have the baby horse,the baby horse will absolutely
follow the mom.
And then you just have to makesure that you're in a safe
environment because everyone'senvironment's different.
(03:18):
If you're gonna have a babyhorse loose with the mom, that's
you know, you have to make sureyour your barn owner's okay
with baby.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
Because you wouldn't be using a halter and rope and
things like that.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Technically could run.
Yes.
Yes, yeah.
So there's that situation, andso as you would halter brake the
horses, you could then put thehalters on them, and then it
would be a lot easier toactually pony with a halter.
Yes.
I took ponying classes at CalPoly.(https://www.cpp.edu/agri/clubs-organizations/intercollegiate-equestrian-team/index.shtml)
Did you know that you can takea halter braking class?
unknown (03:47):
No.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I did not.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Yeah, I took it my first year in college.
I did not ever have experienceworking with baby Arabians.
And they teach they literallyhow to pony teach you how to
halter brake baby horses.
Okay.
And then from there you canjust keep going through their
equine program.
Speaker 4 (04:07):
And what kind of halters would they use?
Speaker 3 (04:09):
Oh, it was cool.
It was back in the day day, sowe hadn't had they didn't have
all the Clinton Anderson ropeholes.
Nope, no Parelli.
Like Parelli hadn't hit yet.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
So we just used regular halters.
But the thing is, is whensomething's that small, it just
does what you tell it.
Which is why I understandpeople get babies.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Yeah, now that I've been in this for 10 years now, I
know that's not the rightchoice to make.
But that's a different episode.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
But yeah, so you can actually learn how to halt or
break baby horses at differentEquine colleges.
And the Equine courses that youcan take at the agricultural
colleges are amazing.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
But most of the people listening to us are not
gonna go to Cornwall and learnhow to pony a horse.
No.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
So so I think And you're most of your people, all
most of our listeners aren'tgonna have baby horses to break
to pony.
Right.
But I just wanted to put thatout there.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
Oh, yeah, of course.
That's what this is for.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
Because there might be somebody out there with a
baby horse.
Like, that's okay.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
That's the whole person.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Accidents happen.
Okay, can I tell you a secretdesire?
Sure.
I legit wished that I had ahorse that accidentally got
pregnant so I could name thebaby Tinder.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
Why Tinder?
Because Tinder the app.
Swipe left, swipe right.
I have no what is that?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
What?
What?
Did I miss a book or a movie?
Dude, you miss society for likethe last 15 years.
Are you kidding me right now?
No.
Shut the front door.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
What are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Tinder?
unknown (05:37):
That's the hookup app.
Oh!
Speaker 4 (05:40):
No, I know what Tinder is.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Could you imagine?
Speaker 4 (05:43):
What does that have to do with a baby horse?
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I secretly wish that some of those horses that we got
were accidentally pregnant sothat I could name a baby Tinder.
Isn't that the perfectaccidental baby horse name?
Listeners, if any of youaccidentally have a baby, can
you please name it Tinder?
And you have to tell us.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
You're insane.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
No, I'm not.
That is the perfect horse babyname.
Okay.
Okay.
So, anyways.
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Okay.
So I think what most of thetimes what's gonna happen is
somebody's gonna buy a companionhorse for a single horse, and
then they're gonna want to ponythat new horse with their
current horse.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
100%.
Speaker 4 (06:22):
Right.
So in that case, how would youprep the horse?
Well, you take the horse beingponied and you took the phone.
I will take the horse thatyou're using to pony.
Okay.
Because Max is so amazing, Ifeel like I could speak to it a
little bit.
Yeah.
And then at the end, we'll talkabout how to break it together.
So if somebody has a new horse,what would you do to prep that
(06:46):
buddy horse?
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Right.
So halter braking is the numberone most important thing
because even though it's notgoing to be the human walking
next to the horse, it is goingto be the horse walking next to
the horse.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Right.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
And the horse walking next to the horse is going to
have to put up with that horsebeing ponied.
And so you need to have ananimal.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
He was ponying Armani and he was having a meltdown.
He was.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
He he was having insecurity, major insecurities,
and he was, you know, nipping atpoor little Maxie's bottom.
But a lot of that stemmed fromhim just not having good manners
and not being taught.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
Sure.
So let's say somebody bringshome a companion horse.
Like Armani.
Or just a second horse.
It doesn't even have to be acompanion, but just a second
horse.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
You'll literally be able to tell by standing next to
that horse.
You're going to be able to tellwhether or not that horse is
rude or not rude.
If that's a horse that invadesyour space and nips you and is
kind of a jerk, he's going to dothe same thing.
He's not ready.
Yeah.
And he's going to do it.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Any same thing to another horse.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
To another horse and worse.
So you'll be able to tell byhow that horse handles, like we
were saying, how that horsehandles being next to a human if
they're going to be rude,right?
If they have manners next to ahuman, that's a really good sign
that they're going to havemanners next to another horse.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Right.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
And if they don't have manners, I think it's
really like a litmus test.
And if they don't have mannerswith a human.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
And for some people that don't know what a litmus
test is, what is a litmus test?
Speaker 3 (08:11):
A litmus test is just it's black or white.
Well, it's really acid or base.
But like it's for layman'sterms, it's a black or white
test of for what?
For acid or base.
Like the piece of paper thattells you something is an acid
or a base.
You didn't know that?
Speaker 4 (08:24):
I have no idea what you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Litmus paper?
Speaker 4 (08:27):
That sounds familiar.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
I feel so science?
Is it science class?
Science nerd status.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Is that a science class?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
It's like a full-on science.
Yeah, you take it in highschool and I don't know.
That's right.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
I went through high school in the 80s.
Okay.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
I was in the 90s.
We were always testing for acidand base.
Okay.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
We were dropping acid for testing.
I didn't do that.
I just had to say it ishappening.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
It's okay.
It's cute.
So anyway.
Anyways, if the horse is beingnaughty with you, they're gonna
be naughty with the other horseand they're gonna they're gonna
amp up that naughty because theycan.
So you need to halt or breakyour own horse.
And there are a lot ofdifferent ways to do that.
And I think time consistency isthe number one thing.
So even if you just go outthere, and I'm not exaggerating,
(09:17):
if you go out there for 15minutes a day, 15 minutes a day
will make a difference.
You don't and do what is justwork with your animal, be near
your animal, and correct thatanimal.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
So, like put the halter on them and maybe walk
them around an area that is openand and correct them if they
get out of line.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Right.
And you can practice things.
Um, you can set up fakeobstacle courses for yourself so
that you have a goal.
So you could say to yourself,okay, we're gonna go from here
to that tree, and we're gonnasee if they get into my space.
And we're gonna count how manytimes that happens, and we're
gonna correct it every time, andyou're gonna try to get better
every time you do it.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Yeah, and I think that Clinton Anderson and
Parelli both have a really goodtechnique for backing up a
horse.
Yes.
Because one of the things whenyou're when you're being when
you're the person on the ponyhorse, sometimes they want that
other horse, you know, out oftheir space.
And wiggling the rope, givingthem that cue to back off a
(10:19):
little, is really important.
So I know that you've beenworking with a Parelli trainer.
Right.
have you guys worked on any ofthat yet?
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Yeah, and I've had a lot of success with this horse
with the Parelli naturalhorsemanship.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
And this is the first time that I've actually drank
the Kool-Aid of the naturalhorsemanship world.
And I was at wits end withArmani.
And so we're we're makingreally fast strides with him.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I've never had to go down this route.
So if anyone's trained thetraditional methods, I grew up
hunter-jumper barn and showing,just showing a lot.
And so when you grow up in thatshow world, I think it's
different than the naturalParelli horsemanship world.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
Yeah, because I don't do they even teach you any
ground stuff.
Speaker 3 (11:05):
Yeah, I mean that when I was in college, that's
what I did.
I learned how to walk a babyhorse.
Yeah, we halter broke babyhorses, but that's not
everyone's reality, right?
You get this hot mess of ahorse that, like Armani, you get
a hot mess of an animal thatknows how big he is.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
And he knows that he can end you.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
So I was scared of him for two months straight when
I first got him.
Legitimately.
I felt that fear for my life.
I felt that you thought thatway.
Yeah.
And I honestly thought tomyself, who does this?
How am I gonna do this?
Like, how is this gonna playout?
Number one.
And who the hell am I that Ithink that I can train this
animal?
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Well, because you train Bob so well, yes.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Well, and then I said to myself, Oh, it's people like
me.
I'm the kind of person thattakes on a horse that's a hot
mess like that and actuallymakes it through because I've
got all of this experience.
I mean, I am a horse trainer,just not professionally, and and
I have time.
I think that's one of the bestthings that I don't have to
(12:07):
worry about.
And this is probably what a lotof other women who are not
trainers but who are amazinghorse women, we feel is we don't
have to be bound by anyone'stime.
If I was a trainer, I would bebound by someone else's
timeline.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Right, because it they want their horse on.
Yeah, and I don't give a and Ithink that's another thing too,
not to cut you off mid-cursewords, but I think the other
thing too is a lot of peoplerush.
So one of the things I knowthat I've rushed into is I've
always been advised, whateveryou want to do out on the trail,
practice in your arena, andit's like, well, that's boring.
(12:43):
Of course they're gonna be goodin the arena.
Yeah, but it's important.
I think what I do is I did alittle bit of it.
Right.
Okay, I'm gonna go out to thetrail now.
But that's just becausesometimes stupidity is
confidence, and I can be stupid.
You know, I think we were moreconfident than smart when we
(13:07):
took our money out and poniedhim that first time.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Right.
Speaker 4 (13:10):
He wasn't ready.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
He wasn't ready.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
The only one ready was Max, and Max had a limit,
right?
Right.
And he let me know when wereached it.
You know, everything was safe.
We recognized the signs early,and everything was perfect,
everything was great.
But that's what I mean becauseon the way home from that
situation, he really did invademy space.
(13:33):
He never bit me, but he wasunconfident, sort of like
nipping me and just nervous, andhe didn't know where to put his
feet, and he was kind offreaking out.
Now, was everything okay?
Yeah, because you had twohorses and I was following you,
right?
And he's just gonna follow theherd, right?
Right?
They're herd animals.
Yeah, so I wasn't scared for mylife, but I was nervous for our
(13:55):
safety, and then that was themoment when Max was like, Oh,
hell no, I don't want to do thisanymore.
And he showed us thatphysically, he let us know
physically he was finished.
And we are smart enough to readour animals' body language.
Yes, tune in, tune into yourbody's language horse's body
language.
That's the only way to fly,right?
So we tuned in and he said hewas finished, and so we
(14:16):
listened, and I got off of thehorse I was riding because Sandy
was in front of me ponying, andshe ponied my horse, and I
walked jackass all the way home.
And so please take that momentfor yourself.
If you are in a fear factorsort of situation, take a buddy
and stop when you're done.
If you are emotionally done,physically done, don't go past
(14:37):
that limit when you're tryingsomething new.
Okay.
Now, other than us posting avideo of training a horse or
Armani, which I guess we could,but there's a lot of videos
already out there.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Yeah, there's so many resources.
Right.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
I mean, like Parelli has free.
You can go on YouTube and lookup Parelli.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
You know, he just had a whole thing on Amazon.
He has like a whole show onAmazon that you can watch if you
have most of us have AmazonPrime.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
And Clinton Anderson has one on YouTube where he got
a rescue horse and he took itthrough all of his fundamental
program, and at the end,somebody won the horse.
Oh, that's cool.
The name was Cider.
Oh, yeah.
And it was it's really goodbecause there is a section in
there where he teaches backingup and responding to the wiggle
of the rope.
unknown (15:25):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (15:25):
And I know Parelli has a wiggle of the rope lesson
as well.
So we certainly can't sit hereand tell people how to do that,
right?
Right.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I mean, there's so much there's so much out there.
Speaker 4 (15:36):
Yeah, so definitely look those things up.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
I really like Josh Nichols, (https://joshnichol.com/)
if anyone's interested.
Josh Nichols is pretty amazing.
Yeah.
And if you haven't heard of it,there's a it's like a a
learning masterclass, basicallythis archive, and you can sign
up for it.
And I want to say it's NoelleFloyd
Plus.(www.noellefloydplus.com)
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Noelle Floyd.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Noelle Floyd, yeah.
If you haven't heard of her,she's this amazing equestrian.
She's world-class topequestrian, but then she got
into vlogging and blogging, andthen she started a magazine, and
basically she built thisempire.
She started a couple differentpodcasts over the years, and
then she also built this hugearchive.
Part of her media empire shehas built is she's taken
(16:21):
professionals from all differentdisciplines and she puts their
training up online.
And so, if you're somebodywho's not super into you know,
any of the people we'vementioned, like Clinton
Anderson, sure, probably, youcan go learn from people who are
specialists in your discipline.
So if you want to learn fromthe Western Masters, if you want
to learn from people who arecross-country specialists, you
(16:44):
can go onto this archive andthey have anything you can think
of.
They have amazing resources.
They have riding videos thatyou can listen and ride to.
They have training videos youcan watch.
It's just it's an outstandingresource for anyone who's
looking for help.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
So I guess once you once you feel that your horse is
prepared to go out and beponied, the next step is to make
sure that the horse you'reusing to pony that horse is also
prepared.
Because not every horse likesanother horse in their bubble or
their space.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
On that booty.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
And I have to say, the three horses I have, Autumn
and Shooter and Max, I can ponyoff of all three of them.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:34):
But their tolerance levels, they're all different.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:38):
And Max has the best tolerance level.
So when I first got Max, he didnot like a rope on his butt.
He did not like a rope underhis tail.
If I patted him on the buttwhen we were out in trail, he
would do a little bunny hop, youknow.
Right.
I remember.
Yes, he hated it.
I don't really know where ithappened or when it happened,
(17:59):
that all of a sudden he was okaywith it.
I think it was consistency andtime, like you've said before.
So I do feel like that's whatit was because I don't remember
a defining moment when all of asudden he was good.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
Yeah, sure, fine, let's do it.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Exactly.
And I know that you and I havediscussed that, you know, one of
the things you could do is onthe ground, work with that horse
and take a long lead rope,throw it around their butt, put
it up underneath their tail, seehow they react.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
See how they feel about that.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
Desensitizing, basically.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Exactly.
But what did what did yourParelli teacher call
desensitizing?
Oh.
I love the what I love the termthat she used.
I don't remember.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
I can't.
I'm so old, girl.
It's not gonna happen rightnow.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
Well, we'll have we'll have her on as a special
guest.
I mean, and we will have heruse all her new terms.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
Yeah, perimenopause got me in his grip right now.
There's no way I'm gonnaremember.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
Postmenopause has got me.
unknown (18:56):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Yeah, we're on both spectrums.
Um, I did use Max.
I did Max in the arena first.
I think I ponied, I think thefirst one I ponied was Autumn.
I think the first one I poniedwas.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
So you did practice.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
I did practice.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
In an enclosed environment.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
I did in an enclosed environment.
And maybe not as long as Ishould have, maybe not as many
times.
But you know, everyone's gonnahave their own time limit.
One of the things I needed tomake sure of though when I
ponied is that if the otherhorse got too close, that I
could wiggle the rope and getthat horse to back off.
And all of my horses understandwhat that means.
(19:35):
So that really worked well forme.
And I did practice on him withthe rope on his butt, with the
rope under his tail.
Autumn doesn't really like therope under her tail because when
you pony jewel and that ropegot under their shoe, I'm very
happy.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
No, and what they'll do is when it starts to get
underneath their tail, they'llactually get afraid and their
tail will clamp down and gettighter.
And it'll get, yeah, it'll getworse, and then they get even
more freaked out, and thenyou're on a horse that's
spinning around, right?
Feeling like it's getting itsass bit by a lion.
So you have to really make surethat your horse that's actually
(20:10):
doing the ponying and gettingridden can handle that rope in
every crevice.
And I love what you said aboutyour horses backing off because
they need to be able to respond.
So whether you use Parelli oryou use Clinton or you use Josh
or whoever, whatever yourresource is.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
To wiggle the rope however way you want to.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
Yeah, whichever way that you can get that animal to
be responsive to pressure inevery single direction, that's
gonna be your clue that theanimal is ready to be ponied.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
Because when you flip that rope, you're gonna have
the rope in your hand, or if youdecide to tie it to your
saddle, which I just don't likedoing.
I like to hold the rope.
But if you decide to hold it inyour hand or whether it's tied
to your horn, you can flip upthat piece of rope and that
horse will move away from you.
Right.
You need that spacing in orderto be safe.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Right.
Yeah.
And so you bring up a goodpoint holding the rope versus
dallying.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Dallying the rope.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
Is that what it is?
It's a dally, it's a dally.
You can do a single dally or adouble dally.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
You go, girl.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
Thank you.
I learned that from my friend,Darlene.
So I think the hardest partabout ponying is getting used to
that damn rope.
What am I gonna do with thisrope?
Because I think I'm using a25-foot No, you're using a 14.
It's a 14, thank you.
Okay, thanks.
A 14-foot, I use ClintonAnderson equipment.
(21:35):
So I use his rope halter and Iuse his 14-foot lead rope.
And so you have a lot of ropein your hand and it's really
awkward.
And that's the hardest part tome, is figuring out what to do
with that rope.
I worry about doing even asingle dally because, first of
all, you still have a lot ofrope hanging on the other side,
(21:56):
which you could if you drag itand the other and your horse
steps on it, then you'rescrewed.
So then you double dally, butthen that's a little tighter.
So if the horse you're ponyingstops and rears or pulls back,
it's pulling against yoursaddle.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
Right.
Speaker 4 (22:12):
Then I've also had it in my lap, and I and and that,
if you're not paying attention,it can slip out, and now it's
really dragging.
Or one of the things that Ifound that I was so impressed
with myself was I have a saddlebag, so I just took the other
end of the rope and stuffed itin my saddlebag on the opposite
side of me.
That really does work well, butI always forget to do it.
(22:34):
But it does work really well.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
I think that I when you do that, I never see the
rope dragging.
Exactly.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
But see, now I'm using my saddlebag for treats on
a phone, so right.
Anyway, I have to figure thatpart out.
But that I really did stuff itin your saddlebag.
Because then it just feeds out,right?
You know, and you don't have toworry too much about it.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Like dental floss.
Right, exactly.
Speaker 4 (22:54):
That works really well.
And the other thing too is mysuggestion is when you're ready,
go out with somebody.
That way, if your horse thatyou're using to pony gets tired,
you can hand off to the otherperson.
And then they can pony untilyour horse regroups and then
(23:15):
take the rope back.
I think provided that yourbuddy's horse knows how to pony
a horse as well.
Like it's all right, it's a bigcircle.
And learn to recognize yourhorse.
When we had Armani, I knew thatMax was over it.
Yeah, you know, and and he gothe was getting a little tired
because of the just the anticsof a baby, of a young horse.
He's a baby.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I know he's a baby hand.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
He's a baby.
Yeah, so there you go.
I I hope that we have, I mean,we'll move on to the third step,
but if there's any questions,comments, anybody else has any
other ideas, tips, tips, tricks,tips, tricks, yeah, please post
them.
We're happy to share.
Like, we know we're not the endall.
We know that.
(23:58):
And we're telling you we'renot.
We know we're not, and we'retelling you we're not.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
So I think when you go to finally officially pony,
right?
Speaker 4 (24:09):
That is do it in the arena first.
Yeah, do it in the arena first.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Uh like Sandy was saying, do it in the arena first
or in a closed area.
If you have, you know, twoacres and it has a fence.
Yeah.
Cool, start there.
For sure, that's the best placeto start.
And then I would love foreveryone to have a buddy on the
ground, like you were saying.
And I think there's a lot ofnervousness and there's a lot of
anxiety surrounding somethinglike this.
(24:34):
And it's crazy because it's oneof the most relaxing things
that you can do for your animalsis just to take them on a walk.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Because when you pony, you're not gonna go
trotting and cantering.
That's not what this is.
Ponying is you're going on achill walk.
We like to call it a family.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
A family outing.
Yeah, family outing.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
So when we have our family outings, for me, it's one
of the most relaxing thingsthat we do together.
And I think that when youfinally go to marry those two
horses together after youpractice in the arena, please
just baby step it, baby step itto success.
Yeah.
And you can even have two smallmini lessons in a day.
(25:12):
Yeah.
Because I think those short,sweet mini lessons for a horse's
brain, they are so much moreeffective than trying to work a
horse for an hour.
You can get locked into tryingso hard for an hour and the
horse just gets frustrated.
Yeah.
But if you do like a minilesson and you're a success,
okay, cool, come back later inthe afternoon, do another
(25:33):
10-minute session.
You know, and then the next daydo a 15-minute session.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
And we actually have a friend who is asking us to
help her with a new horse thatshe got, and we're gonna record
it.
Actually, what we're recordingis the horse that she's going to
use to pony her new horsebecause that horse is a spoiled
brat.
Yeah, and and she's gonna needsome help.
She needs a little guide.
Speaker 3 (25:57):
She's getting used to a rope around her.
Yeah.
So we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
She's her bubble is very small, and she doesn't like
other horses in her bubble.
We're gonna work on that.
So we will do some recording ofthat and post that.
Hopefully.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
I think she's gonna end up having to ride her and
then just take a rope, not justdo it on the ground, like
desensitizing with the rope onthe ground.
She's gonna need to desensitizethe horse when she's gonna be.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
We could be the horse and then she can hold the rope,
and we could be back theremessing with the rope around as
the horse.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
Her back end.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
Because I've never seen Emma kick.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
So I don't think she'd kick us.
And I but I do think that wecould be far enough away with
that rope and just practice withEmma.
Because I think that's whatshe's gonna need.
Because the horse she's ponyingis old and doesn't give a crap.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
So I'm I think that we should start her on we should
just have her tied up and justsee how comfortable she is with
the rope.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Of course.
Yeah, no, no, no.
That's the first step.
I'm saying when we get pastthat, right, when we get past
that, then put put her on thehorse and then walk beside her
with that rope, she can hold it.
We can pretend to be the horsewhere we're going from side to
side.
Obviously, I wouldn't get intoher bubble because I I say I've
never seen her kick, but thatdoesn't matter.
(27:23):
So I think that'll be a good Ithink that'll be a good video.
Did we cover everything?
Speaker 3 (27:30):
So one of the other things you might want to
consider before you even do allof this is make sure that both
the animals that you're workingwith don't need dental care,
that there's no pain in theirmouth, or pain in their legs, or
pain in their legs, that theyare fully physically able.
And I I'm just putting this inthere as not a disclaimer, but
(27:54):
it is a disclaimer.
Sure it is.
We've come across so many olderhorses that we've gotten, and
even horses of our own that wedidn't realize weren't up to
snuff physically before you putthem back into work.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
Right.
Speaker 3 (28:08):
And if you just have them looked at by a vet and have
your teeth checked, I mean,think of horses we've met, they
had awful teeth, and I wouldn'twant a halter on me with those
awful teeth.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
No, or pain or arthritis in their hawks or
they're anywhere else, and nowyou're trying to pony them up a
hill.
Yeah.
And they're they're gonnafollow you, but they're in pain.
So make sure that both horses,because your other horse might
also the one that you're usingto pony may not be in the best
of health.
You know, pain pain radiates,like the energy it radiates
(28:42):
could cause a lot of otherissues, and you think it's oh my
horse doesn't like this when ithas nothing to do with that.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
It has nothing to do with that.
Yeah, and it will throw off thehorse that's doing the ponying.
Like when I remember ponyingJewel, she was older Mustang
that we had.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
And her f and she needed boots.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
She needed boots, and I was riding Autumn, and Autumn
was not happy that Jewel was soslow, and so I think that was
the last time I ponied Jewel.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
Because we were just like, oh, okay, she she doesn't
she doesn't need this in herlife anymore.
Wait a minute.
Speaker 4 (29:14):
Let me let me another caveat.
Yeah, make sure the horses areequally matched.
Autumn is a foxtrotter, right?
All right, very forward, veryfast.
Joel was old.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
She was short, she had little tiny feet.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Yep.
And and it was it was not fairto pony her on autumn.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
Autumn just got frustrated because I had to keep
holding her back.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Well, but I mean, even before you, like when I was
doing it.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
Like when I would pony her, I because I would take
autumn out too and pony Joel.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
And I felt like I was dragging Joel.
Even when I ponied Max off ofAutumn, I felt like I was
dragging Max.
Yeah.
Because autumn is so forward.
So make sure that your horsesare equally matched.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Equally matched.
And pain-free.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
And pain free.
Yes.
I think that was.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
I think those that would probably would be a really
good place to actually start.
Yes.
Yep.
And then you can sort of lookat rope handling for yourself,
rope handling with the horses,halters.
Halter, giving to pressure, andjust being able to scoot that
pony horse back if you need to.
Because I think on the trail,when you're ponying, this one of
(30:24):
the scariest things is justcoming up across unexpected
things like dogs or deer orwhatever it is.
And when the horse gets scaredand it's got the pony rope on,
and that's why I don't like toput it on the saddle.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
Is because if that horse pulls back, I don't want
that horse to move my saddle.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Right.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
So I prefer to hold the rope in my hand.
And then that way I can justdrop it or move it to the other
hand, the other side.
For me, that's what I prefer.
100%.
Speaker 4 (30:52):
And depending on the horse, I I follow both.
Like I was ponying shootertoday, he's so lethargic.
I I probably didn't even need arope.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
It's so true.
It's so true.
Speaker 4 (31:03):
But I don't have a problem doing a little dally on
with him.
But when I started out ponyingAspen, I held the rope.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Absolutely.
Yep.
Speaker 4 (31:12):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No.
I you're absolutely right.
And that goes to show there'snot one way.
It's just because I say onething doesn't mean that's the
way that I'm saying, oh, Ishould be done that way.
No.
It's so black and white.
And and the problem is though,when you start out, in horses in
general, you learn a certainway, and you kind of get this
(31:34):
feeling like that's the onlyway.
And then you have a hard timeopening up your mind.
I'm like, well, I can't learnfrom somebody else.
What does she know?
Like, what it is.
Like, you know what I'm saying?
Yeah.
That's like, Sandy, you'rebeing stupid.
I mean, like, you can and youneed to pull all these likes out
that I keep saying.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
I can't.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Okay.
Well, sorry, everybody.
I swear I'm not a valley girl.
I swear I'm not 12 years old.
I just use the word like toomuch.
But you know, sometimes I lookat certain things and I think to
myself, well, what do theyknow?
Like, what's their you knowqualification?
Right.
That's mine.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
But what's yours?
I have zero.
Oh, don't say that.
You have so much experience.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
Well, yes.
And I'm not putting myselfdown.
But in the scheme of things, Iknow.
Other people.
So whatever.
Anyway, I I really hope people,you know, can get a lot out of
this.
I I know that I I get a lot outof the talks that we have just
because it kind of reinforceswhat we're doing, or things that
(32:36):
you might see that I do thatmaybe you feel like I could do
differently, and I I hear it.
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
I might not do it, but I hear it.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
When I talk to you, I think it helps me process.
And I think one of the thingsI've learned as I've gotten
older is that nobody reallyknows what they're doing.
No.
And everyone's kind of wingingit.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
And so if you stay safe and you wing it, and you're
kind.
And you're kind, you're halfyou're more than halfway there.
If you can kind of check offthe boxes of is my horse halter
broke?
Speaker 2 (33:08):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
Is it okay with a rope on its ass?
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
What'll happen if it gets clamped under its tail?
If you can practice clampingthat rope underneath the tail
before it ever actually getsclamped underneath its tail on
the trail, your horse isn'tgonna get scared when it gets
clamped underneath on the trailbecause you already did it 17
times on the ground.
On the ground when you werestanding next to it and told it
it was a good horse and itdidn't care, and you rubbed its
(33:32):
butt and said it didn't die.
Good horse.
Yeah.
And you gave it a treat and alove pat.
For me, if you can just be safeand have all those check boxes,
there's nothing really holdingyou back from that next step,
especially if you have a friendor you have a very experienced
animal that you trust.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
So I think we've done that one.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I think so too.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
So until next time.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Until next time.
Yeah.
Toodles.
Toodles.
Hey friends.
That's the end of today's ride.
We hope you enjoyed listening.
Don't forget to follow SaddleTalk with Sandy and Cara
wherever you get your podcasts.
Please leave us a review, shareus with a friend, and saddle up
with us next time as we ridethrough more stories, questions,
(34:15):
and our wild tangents.
Till then, friends, keep yourboots dusty and your hard hats
on.
We hope to see you out on thetrail.
Speaker (34:24):
Dandy and Kara stir up swinging free, talking about
life and love and mystery.
From coyotes to coffee, they'llcover it all with a sagebrush
blowing and the wild birds call.
So cinch up your boots.
We're hitting the track.
Saddle talks on, and we're notlooking back.
Clip clop goes the trail sun is rising high two
gals in the saddle neath the bigNevada sky laughing and
chatting as the desert rolls onby it's saddle talk come along
for the ride Welcome listenersto Saddle Talk with Sandy and
(00:24):
Cara.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Whether you're here to laugh with us, learn, or just
ride along, you're in for areally good time.
So go grab your helmet or yourpooper scooper and settle in
with us as we discuss life,horses, of course, and all the
unexpected turns along thetrail.
And hey, whether you're aseasoned cowgirl or you're still
learning, remember we'resharing our own stories and
opinions based on decades ofpersonal experience.
(00:46):
Always ride safe and check witha professional before trying
anything new.
Now let's go ride.
Speaker 4 (00:55):
Well, hello, listeners.
Hello, Cara.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Hello.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
So we had a really good day today.
Yes.
We did Yeah, we did someriding.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
And if anybody saw the video that I posted prior
to, I was ponying shooter.
I was not ponying Max.
I have to say that right now.
But it's a good lead-in becausetoday we want to discuss
ponying part two.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Pony part two.
We need to continue ourdiscussion on how to actually
get your horses ready forponying.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Right.
The first time we discussed howdo you build your confidence as
that rider, getting yourselfready to feel comfortable doing
the actual pony and being safe.
Right.
So now we want to discuss howdo you prep the horses.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
I think that one of the most important things you
need to have in a horse,obviously, is an animal that
just gives to pressure.
And if you don't have an animalthat's able to give to
pressure, then you can't pony.
So there are a couple thingsthat you can do to get an animal
that isn't giving to pressureready.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Well, can I interrupt?
Yeah, of course.
Okay, so what if we start offwith the like the three
sections?
So you have to have the horsethat's going to pony, right?
So you have to prepare thathorse.
And then you have to prep thehorse that's being ponied, and
then the third part would bebringing those two together.
(02:22):
So let's start with the horsethat's being ponied, which is
what you were just about to talkabout.
Sorry, yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So I'm glad you tracked me back.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
So, but anyway, so that way we have this in
section, so then everybody canput it together.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
So we'll discuss first the horse that's actually
being ponied, depending on theage and experience of that
animal, is really gonna dictatehow you handle the actual pony.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
And the equipment you use.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
And the equipment you use.
That's a really good point.
Yeah.
So if you have a baby horse,that baby horse is gonna follow
its mama wherever.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
As long as you you're you have the mama.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Good point.
As long as you have the mom,the baby will follow anywhere.
And I don't even know if that'show the term ponying came
about, but I think it must have.
It has to be something to dowith that.
It has to have something to dowith that.
Yeah.
So if you have the baby horse,the baby horse will absolutely
follow the mom.
And then you just have to makesure that you're in a safe
environment because everyone'senvironment's different.
(03:18):
If you're gonna have a babyhorse loose with the mom, that's
you know, you have to make sureyour your barn owner's okay
with baby.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
Because you wouldn't be using a halter and rope and
things like that.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Technically could run.
Yes.
Yes, yeah.
So there's that situation, andso as you would halter brake the
horses, you could then put thehalters on them, and then it
would be a lot easier toactually pony with a halter.
Yes.
I took ponying classes at CalPoly.(https://www.cpp.edu/agri/clubs-organizations/intercollegiate-equestrian-team/index.shtml)
Did you know that you can takea halter braking class?
unknown (03:47):
No.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I did not.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Yeah, I took it my first year in college.
I did not ever have experienceworking with baby Arabians.
And they teach they literallyhow to pony teach you how to
halter brake baby horses.
Okay.
And then from there you canjust keep going through their
equine program.
Speaker 4 (04:07):
And what kind of halters would they use?
Speaker 3 (04:09):
Oh, it was cool.
It was back in the day day, sowe hadn't had they didn't have
all the Clinton Anderson ropeholes.
Nope, no Parelli.
Like Parelli hadn't hit yet.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
So we just used regular halters.
But the thing is, is whensomething's that small, it just
does what you tell it.
Which is why I understandpeople get babies.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Yeah, now that I've been in this for 10 years now, I
know that's not the rightchoice to make.
But that's a different episode.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
But yeah, so you can actually learn how to halt or
break baby horses at differentEquine colleges.
And the Equine courses that youcan take at the agricultural
colleges are amazing.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
But most of the people listening to us are not
gonna go to Cornwall and learnhow to pony a horse.
No.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
So so I think And you're most of your people, all
most of our listeners aren'tgonna have baby horses to break
to pony.
Right.
But I just wanted to put thatout there.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
Oh, yeah, of course.
That's what this is for.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
Because there might be somebody out there with a
baby horse.
Like, that's okay.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
That's the whole person.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Accidents happen.
Okay, can I tell you a secretdesire?
Sure.
I legit wished that I had ahorse that accidentally got
pregnant so I could name thebaby Tinder.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
Why Tinder?
Because Tinder the app.
Swipe left, swipe right.
I have no what is that?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
What?
What?
Did I miss a book or a movie?
Dude, you miss society for likethe last 15 years.
Are you kidding me right now?
No.
Shut the front door.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
What are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Tinder?
unknown (05:37):
That's the hookup app.
Oh!
Speaker 4 (05:40):
No, I know what Tinder is.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Could you imagine?
Speaker 4 (05:43):
What does that have to do with a baby horse?
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I secretly wish that some of those horses that we got
were accidentally pregnant sothat I could name a baby Tinder.
Isn't that the perfectaccidental baby horse name?
Listeners, if any of youaccidentally have a baby, can
you please name it Tinder?
And you have to tell us.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
You're insane.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
No, I'm not.
That is the perfect horse babyname.
Okay.
Okay.
So, anyways.
Speaker 4 (06:07):
Okay.
So I think what most of thetimes what's gonna happen is
somebody's gonna buy a companionhorse for a single horse, and
then they're gonna want to ponythat new horse with their
current horse.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
100%.
Speaker 4 (06:22):
Right.
So in that case, how would youprep the horse?
Well, you take the horse beingponied and you took the phone.
I will take the horse thatyou're using to pony.
Okay.
Because Max is so amazing, Ifeel like I could speak to it a
little bit.
Yeah.
And then at the end, we'll talkabout how to break it together.
So if somebody has a new horse,what would you do to prep that
(06:46):
buddy horse?
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Right.
So halter braking is the numberone most important thing
because even though it's notgoing to be the human walking
next to the horse, it is goingto be the horse walking next to
the horse.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Right.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
And the horse walking next to the horse is going to
have to put up with that horsebeing ponied.
And so you need to have ananimal.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
He was ponying Armani and he was having a meltdown.
He was.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
He he was having insecurity, major insecurities,
and he was, you know, nipping atpoor little Maxie's bottom.
But a lot of that stemmed fromhim just not having good manners
and not being taught.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
Sure.
So let's say somebody bringshome a companion horse.
Like Armani.
Or just a second horse.
It doesn't even have to be acompanion, but just a second
horse.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
You'll literally be able to tell by standing next to
that horse.
You're going to be able to tellwhether or not that horse is
rude or not rude.
If that's a horse that invadesyour space and nips you and is
kind of a jerk, he's going to dothe same thing.
He's not ready.
Yeah.
And he's going to do it.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Any same thing to another horse.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
To another horse and worse.
So you'll be able to tell byhow that horse handles, like we
were saying, how that horsehandles being next to a human if
they're going to be rude,right?
If they have manners next to ahuman, that's a really good sign
that they're going to havemanners next to another horse.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Right.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
And if they don't have manners, I think it's
really like a litmus test.
And if they don't have mannerswith a human.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
And for some people that don't know what a litmus
test is, what is a litmus test?
Speaker 3 (08:11):
A litmus test is just it's black or white.
Well, it's really acid or base.
But like it's for layman'sterms, it's a black or white
test of for what?
For acid or base.
Like the piece of paper thattells you something is an acid
or a base.
You didn't know that?
Speaker 4 (08:24):
I have no idea what you're talking about.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Litmus paper?
Speaker 4 (08:27):
That sounds familiar.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
I feel so science?
Is it science class?
Science nerd status.
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Is that a science class?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
It's like a full-on science.
Yeah, you take it in highschool and I don't know.
That's right.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
I went through high school in the 80s.
Okay.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
I was in the 90s.
We were always testing for acidand base.
Okay.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
We were dropping acid for testing.
I didn't do that.
I just had to say it ishappening.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
It's okay.
It's cute.
So anyway.
Anyways, if the horse is beingnaughty with you, they're gonna
be naughty with the other horseand they're gonna they're gonna
amp up that naughty because theycan.
So you need to halt or breakyour own horse.
And there are a lot ofdifferent ways to do that.
And I think time consistency isthe number one thing.
So even if you just go outthere, and I'm not exaggerating,
(09:17):
if you go out there for 15minutes a day, 15 minutes a day
will make a difference.
You don't and do what is justwork with your animal, be near
your animal, and correct thatanimal.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
So, like put the halter on them and maybe walk
them around an area that is openand and correct them if they
get out of line.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Right.
And you can practice things.
Um, you can set up fakeobstacle courses for yourself so
that you have a goal.
So you could say to yourself,okay, we're gonna go from here
to that tree, and we're gonnasee if they get into my space.
And we're gonna count how manytimes that happens, and we're
gonna correct it every time, andyou're gonna try to get better
every time you do it.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Yeah, and I think that Clinton Anderson and
Parelli both have a really goodtechnique for backing up a
horse.
Yes.
Because one of the things whenyou're when you're being when
you're the person on the ponyhorse, sometimes they want that
other horse, you know, out oftheir space.
And wiggling the rope, givingthem that cue to back off a
(10:19):
little, is really important.
So I know that you've beenworking with a Parelli trainer.
Right.
have you guys worked on any ofthat yet?
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Yeah, and I've had a lot of success with this horse
with the Parelli naturalhorsemanship.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
And this is the first time that I've actually drank
the Kool-Aid of the naturalhorsemanship world.
And I was at wits end withArmani.
And so we're we're makingreally fast strides with him.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I've never had to go down this route.
So if anyone's trained thetraditional methods, I grew up
hunter-jumper barn and showing,just showing a lot.
And so when you grow up in thatshow world, I think it's
different than the naturalParelli horsemanship world.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
Yeah, because I don't do they even teach you any
ground stuff.
Speaker 3 (11:05):
Yeah, I mean that when I was in college, that's
what I did.
I learned how to walk a babyhorse.
Yeah, we halter broke babyhorses, but that's not
everyone's reality, right?
You get this hot mess of ahorse that, like Armani, you get
a hot mess of an animal thatknows how big he is.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
And he knows that he can end you.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
So I was scared of him for two months straight when
I first got him.
Legitimately.
I felt that fear for my life.
I felt that you thought thatway.
Yeah.
And I honestly thought tomyself, who does this?
How am I gonna do this?
Like, how is this gonna playout?
Number one.
And who the hell am I that Ithink that I can train this
animal?
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Well, because you train Bob so well, yes.
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Well, and then I said to myself, Oh, it's people like
me.
I'm the kind of person thattakes on a horse that's a hot
mess like that and actuallymakes it through because I've
got all of this experience.
I mean, I am a horse trainer,just not professionally, and and
I have time.
I think that's one of the bestthings that I don't have to
(12:07):
worry about.
And this is probably what a lotof other women who are not
trainers but who are amazinghorse women, we feel is we don't
have to be bound by anyone'stime.
If I was a trainer, I would bebound by someone else's
timeline.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Right, because it they want their horse on.
Yeah, and I don't give a and Ithink that's another thing too,
not to cut you off mid-cursewords, but I think the other
thing too is a lot of peoplerush.
So one of the things I knowthat I've rushed into is I've
always been advised, whateveryou want to do out on the trail,
practice in your arena, andit's like, well, that's boring.
(12:43):
Of course they're gonna be goodin the arena.
Yeah, but it's important.
I think what I do is I did alittle bit of it.
Right.
Okay, I'm gonna go out to thetrail now.
But that's just becausesometimes stupidity is
confidence, and I can be stupid.
You know, I think we were moreconfident than smart when we
(13:07):
took our money out and poniedhim that first time.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Right.
Speaker 4 (13:10):
He wasn't ready.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
He wasn't ready.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
The only one ready was Max, and Max had a limit,
right?
Right.
And he let me know when wereached it.
You know, everything was safe.
We recognized the signs early,and everything was perfect,
everything was great.
But that's what I mean becauseon the way home from that
situation, he really did invademy space.
(13:33):
He never bit me, but he wasunconfident, sort of like
nipping me and just nervous, andhe didn't know where to put his
feet, and he was kind offreaking out.
Now, was everything okay?
Yeah, because you had twohorses and I was following you,
right?
And he's just gonna follow theherd, right?
Right?
They're herd animals.
Yeah, so I wasn't scared for mylife, but I was nervous for our
(13:55):
safety, and then that was themoment when Max was like, Oh,
hell no, I don't want to do thisanymore.
And he showed us thatphysically, he let us know
physically he was finished.
And we are smart enough to readour animals' body language.
Yes, tune in, tune into yourbody's language horse's body
language.
That's the only way to fly,right?
So we tuned in and he said hewas finished, and so we
(14:16):
listened, and I got off of thehorse I was riding because Sandy
was in front of me ponying, andshe ponied my horse, and I
walked jackass all the way home.
And so please take that momentfor yourself.
If you are in a fear factorsort of situation, take a buddy
and stop when you're done.
If you are emotionally done,physically done, don't go past
(14:37):
that limit when you're tryingsomething new.
Okay.
Now, other than us posting avideo of training a horse or
Armani, which I guess we could,but there's a lot of videos
already out there.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Yeah, there's so many resources.
Right.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
I mean, like Parelli has free.
You can go on YouTube and lookup Parelli.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
You know, he just had a whole thing on Amazon.
He has like a whole show onAmazon that you can watch if you
have most of us have AmazonPrime.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
And Clinton Anderson has one on YouTube where he got
a rescue horse and he took itthrough all of his fundamental
program, and at the end,somebody won the horse.
Oh, that's cool.
The name was Cider.
Oh, yeah.
And it was it's really goodbecause there is a section in
there where he teaches backingup and responding to the wiggle
of the rope.
unknown (15:25):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (15:25):
And I know Parelli has a wiggle of the rope lesson
as well.
So we certainly can't sit hereand tell people how to do that,
right?
Right.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I mean, there's so much there's so much out there.
Speaker 4 (15:36):
Yeah, so definitely look those things up.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
I really like Josh Nichols, (https://joshnichol.com/)
if anyone's interested.
Josh Nichols is pretty amazing.
Yeah.
And if you haven't heard of it,there's a it's like a a
learning masterclass, basicallythis archive, and you can sign
up for it.
And I want to say it's NoelleFloyd
Plus.(www.noellefloydplus.com)
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Noelle Floyd.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Noelle Floyd, yeah.
If you haven't heard of her,she's this amazing equestrian.
She's world-class topequestrian, but then she got
into vlogging and blogging, andthen she started a magazine, and
basically she built thisempire.
She started a couple differentpodcasts over the years, and
then she also built this hugearchive.
Part of her media empire shehas built is she's taken
(16:21):
professionals from all differentdisciplines and she puts their
training up online.
And so, if you're somebodywho's not super into you know,
any of the people we'vementioned, like Clinton
Anderson, sure, probably, youcan go learn from people who are
specialists in your discipline.
So if you want to learn fromthe Western Masters, if you want
to learn from people who arecross-country specialists, you
(16:44):
can go onto this archive andthey have anything you can think
of.
They have amazing resources.
They have riding videos thatyou can listen and ride to.
They have training videos youcan watch.
It's just it's an outstandingresource for anyone who's
looking for help.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
So I guess once you once you feel that your horse is
prepared to go out and beponied, the next step is to make
sure that the horse you'reusing to pony that horse is also
prepared.
Because not every horse likesanother horse in their bubble or
their space.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
On that booty.
Speaker 4 (17:25):
And I have to say, the three horses I have, Autumn
and Shooter and Max, I can ponyoff of all three of them.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:34):
But their tolerance levels, they're all different.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:38):
And Max has the best tolerance level.
So when I first got Max, he didnot like a rope on his butt.
He did not like a rope underhis tail.
If I patted him on the buttwhen we were out in trail, he
would do a little bunny hop, youknow.
Right.
I remember.
Yes, he hated it.
I don't really know where ithappened or when it happened,
(17:59):
that all of a sudden he was okaywith it.
I think it was consistency andtime, like you've said before.
So I do feel like that's whatit was because I don't remember
a defining moment when all of asudden he was good.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
Yeah, sure, fine, let's do it.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Exactly.
And I know that you and I havediscussed that, you know, one of
the things you could do is onthe ground, work with that horse
and take a long lead rope,throw it around their butt, put
it up underneath their tail, seehow they react.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
See how they feel about that.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
Desensitizing, basically.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Exactly.
But what did what did yourParelli teacher call
desensitizing?
Oh.
I love the what I love the termthat she used.
I don't remember.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
I can't.
I'm so old, girl.
It's not gonna happen rightnow.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
Well, we'll have we'll have her on as a special
guest.
I mean, and we will have heruse all her new terms.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
Yeah, perimenopause got me in his grip right now.
There's no way I'm gonnaremember.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
Postmenopause has got me.
unknown (18:56):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Yeah, we're on both spectrums.
Um, I did use Max.
I did Max in the arena first.
I think I ponied, I think thefirst one I ponied was Autumn.
I think the first one I poniedwas.
Speaker 3 (19:09):
So you did practice.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
I did practice.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
In an enclosed environment.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
I did in an enclosed environment.
And maybe not as long as Ishould have, maybe not as many
times.
But you know, everyone's gonnahave their own time limit.
One of the things I needed tomake sure of though when I
ponied is that if the otherhorse got too close, that I
could wiggle the rope and getthat horse to back off.
And all of my horses understandwhat that means.
(19:35):
So that really worked well forme.
And I did practice on him withthe rope on his butt, with the
rope under his tail.
Autumn doesn't really like therope under her tail because when
you pony jewel and that ropegot under their shoe, I'm very
happy.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
No, and what they'll do is when it starts to get
underneath their tail, they'llactually get afraid and their
tail will clamp down and gettighter.
And it'll get, yeah, it'll getworse, and then they get even
more freaked out, and thenyou're on a horse that's
spinning around, right?
Feeling like it's getting itsass bit by a lion.
So you have to really make surethat your horse that's actually
(20:10):
doing the ponying and gettingridden can handle that rope in
every crevice.
And I love what you said aboutyour horses backing off because
they need to be able to respond.
So whether you use Parelli oryou use Clinton or you use Josh
or whoever, whatever yourresource is.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
To wiggle the rope however way you want to.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
Yeah, whichever way that you can get that animal to
be responsive to pressure inevery single direction, that's
gonna be your clue that theanimal is ready to be ponied.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
Because when you flip that rope, you're gonna have
the rope in your hand, or if youdecide to tie it to your
saddle, which I just don't likedoing.
I like to hold the rope.
But if you decide to hold it inyour hand or whether it's tied
to your horn, you can flip upthat piece of rope and that
horse will move away from you.
Right.
You need that spacing in orderto be safe.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Right.
Yeah.
And so you bring up a goodpoint holding the rope versus
dallying.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Dallying the rope.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
Is that what it is?
It's a dally, it's a dally.
You can do a single dally or adouble dally.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
You go, girl.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
Thank you.
I learned that from my friend,Darlene.
So I think the hardest partabout ponying is getting used to
that damn rope.
What am I gonna do with thisrope?
Because I think I'm using a25-foot No, you're using a 14.
It's a 14, thank you.
Okay, thanks.
A 14-foot, I use ClintonAnderson equipment.
(21:35):
So I use his rope halter and Iuse his 14-foot lead rope.
And so you have a lot of ropein your hand and it's really
awkward.
And that's the hardest part tome, is figuring out what to do
with that rope.
I worry about doing even asingle dally because, first of
all, you still have a lot ofrope hanging on the other side,
(21:56):
which you could if you drag itand the other and your horse
steps on it, then you'rescrewed.
So then you double dally, butthen that's a little tighter.
So if the horse you're ponyingstops and rears or pulls back,
it's pulling against yoursaddle.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
Right.
Speaker 4 (22:12):
Then I've also had it in my lap, and I and and that,
if you're not paying attention,it can slip out, and now it's
really dragging.
Or one of the things that Ifound that I was so impressed
with myself was I have a saddlebag, so I just took the other
end of the rope and stuffed itin my saddlebag on the opposite
side of me.
That really does work well, butI always forget to do it.
(22:34):
But it does work really well.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
I think that I when you do that, I never see the
rope dragging.
Exactly.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
But see, now I'm using my saddlebag for treats on
a phone, so right.
Anyway, I have to figure thatpart out.
But that I really did stuff itin your saddlebag.
Because then it just feeds out,right?
You know, and you don't have toworry too much about it.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Like dental floss.
Right, exactly.
Speaker 4 (22:54):
That works really well.
And the other thing too is mysuggestion is when you're ready,
go out with somebody.
That way, if your horse thatyou're using to pony gets tired,
you can hand off to the otherperson.
And then they can pony untilyour horse regroups and then
(23:15):
take the rope back.
I think provided that yourbuddy's horse knows how to pony
a horse as well.
Like it's all right, it's a bigcircle.
And learn to recognize yourhorse.
When we had Armani, I knew thatMax was over it.
Yeah, you know, and and he gothe was getting a little tired
because of the just the anticsof a baby, of a young horse.
He's a baby.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I know he's a baby hand.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
He's a baby.
Yeah, so there you go.
I I hope that we have, I mean,we'll move on to the third step,
but if there's any questions,comments, anybody else has any
other ideas, tips, tips, tricks,tips, tricks, yeah, please post
them.
We're happy to share.
Like, we know we're not the endall.
We know that.
(23:58):
And we're telling you we'renot.
We know we're not, and we'retelling you we're not.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
So I think when you go to finally officially pony,
right?
Speaker 4 (24:09):
That is do it in the arena first.
Yeah, do it in the arena first.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Uh like Sandy was saying, do it in the arena first
or in a closed area.
If you have, you know, twoacres and it has a fence.
Yeah.
Cool, start there.
For sure, that's the best placeto start.
And then I would love foreveryone to have a buddy on the
ground, like you were saying.
And I think there's a lot ofnervousness and there's a lot of
anxiety surrounding somethinglike this.
(24:34):
And it's crazy because it's oneof the most relaxing things
that you can do for your animalsis just to take them on a walk.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Because when you pony, you're not gonna go
trotting and cantering.
That's not what this is.
Ponying is you're going on achill walk.
We like to call it a family.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
A family outing.
Yeah, family outing.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
So when we have our family outings, for me, it's one
of the most relaxing thingsthat we do together.
And I think that when youfinally go to marry those two
horses together after youpractice in the arena, please
just baby step it, baby step itto success.
Yeah.
And you can even have two smallmini lessons in a day.
(25:12):
Yeah.
Because I think those short,sweet mini lessons for a horse's
brain, they are so much moreeffective than trying to work a
horse for an hour.
You can get locked into tryingso hard for an hour and the
horse just gets frustrated.
Yeah.
But if you do like a minilesson and you're a success,
okay, cool, come back later inthe afternoon, do another
(25:33):
10-minute session.
You know, and then the next daydo a 15-minute session.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
And we actually have a friend who is asking us to
help her with a new horse thatshe got, and we're gonna record
it.
Actually, what we're recordingis the horse that she's going to
use to pony her new horsebecause that horse is a spoiled
brat.
Yeah, and and she's gonna needsome help.
She needs a little guide.
Speaker 3 (25:57):
She's getting used to a rope around her.
Yeah.
So we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
She's her bubble is very small, and she doesn't like
other horses in her bubble.
We're gonna work on that.
So we will do some recording ofthat and post that.
Hopefully.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
I think she's gonna end up having to ride her and
then just take a rope, not justdo it on the ground, like
desensitizing with the rope onthe ground.
She's gonna need to desensitizethe horse when she's gonna be.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
We could be the horse and then she can hold the rope,
and we could be back theremessing with the rope around as
the horse.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
Her back end.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
Because I've never seen Emma kick.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
So I don't think she'd kick us.
And I but I do think that wecould be far enough away with
that rope and just practice withEmma.
Because I think that's whatshe's gonna need.
Because the horse she's ponyingis old and doesn't give a crap.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
So I'm I think that we should start her on we should
just have her tied up and justsee how comfortable she is with
the rope.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Of course.
Yeah, no, no, no.
That's the first step.
I'm saying when we get pastthat, right, when we get past
that, then put put her on thehorse and then walk beside her
with that rope, she can hold it.
We can pretend to be the horsewhere we're going from side to
side.
Obviously, I wouldn't get intoher bubble because I I say I've
never seen her kick, but thatdoesn't matter.
(27:23):
So I think that'll be a good Ithink that'll be a good video.
Did we cover everything?
Speaker 3 (27:30):
So one of the other things you might want to
consider before you even do allof this is make sure that both
the animals that you're workingwith don't need dental care,
that there's no pain in theirmouth, or pain in their legs, or
pain in their legs, that theyare fully physically able.
And I I'm just putting this inthere as not a disclaimer, but
(27:54):
it is a disclaimer.
Sure it is.
We've come across so many olderhorses that we've gotten, and
even horses of our own that wedidn't realize weren't up to
snuff physically before you putthem back into work.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
Right.
Speaker 3 (28:08):
And if you just have them looked at by a vet and have
your teeth checked, I mean,think of horses we've met, they
had awful teeth, and I wouldn'twant a halter on me with those
awful teeth.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
No, or pain or arthritis in their hawks or
they're anywhere else, and nowyou're trying to pony them up a
hill.
Yeah.
And they're they're gonnafollow you, but they're in pain.
So make sure that both horses,because your other horse might
also the one that you're usingto pony may not be in the best
of health.
You know, pain pain radiates,like the energy it radiates
(28:42):
could cause a lot of otherissues, and you think it's oh my
horse doesn't like this when ithas nothing to do with that.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
It has nothing to do with that.
Yeah, and it will throw off thehorse that's doing the ponying.
Like when I remember ponyingJewel, she was older Mustang
that we had.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
And her f and she needed boots.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
She needed boots, and I was riding Autumn, and Autumn
was not happy that Jewel was soslow, and so I think that was
the last time I ponied Jewel.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
Because we were just like, oh, okay, she she doesn't
she doesn't need this in herlife anymore.
Wait a minute.
Speaker 4 (29:14):
Let me let me another caveat.
Yeah, make sure the horses areequally matched.
Autumn is a foxtrotter, right?
All right, very forward, veryfast.
Joel was old.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
She was short, she had little tiny feet.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Yep.
And and it was it was not fairto pony her on autumn.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
Autumn just got frustrated because I had to keep
holding her back.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Well, but I mean, even before you, like when I was
doing it.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
Like when I would pony her, I because I would take
autumn out too and pony Joel.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
And I felt like I was dragging Joel.
Even when I ponied Max off ofAutumn, I felt like I was
dragging Max.
Yeah.
Because autumn is so forward.
So make sure that your horsesare equally matched.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Equally matched.
And pain-free.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
And pain free.
Yes.
I think that was.
Speaker 3 (30:03):
I think those that would probably would be a really
good place to actually start.
Yes.
Yep.
And then you can sort of lookat rope handling for yourself,
rope handling with the horses,halters.
Halter, giving to pressure, andjust being able to scoot that
pony horse back if you need to.
Because I think on the trail,when you're ponying, this one of
(30:24):
the scariest things is justcoming up across unexpected
things like dogs or deer orwhatever it is.
And when the horse gets scaredand it's got the pony rope on,
and that's why I don't like toput it on the saddle.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
Is because if that horse pulls back, I don't want
that horse to move my saddle.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Right.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
So I prefer to hold the rope in my hand.
And then that way I can justdrop it or move it to the other
hand, the other side.
For me, that's what I prefer.
100%.
Speaker 4 (30:52):
And depending on the horse, I I follow both.
Like I was ponying shootertoday, he's so lethargic.
I I probably didn't even need arope.
Speaker 3 (31:02):
It's so true.
It's so true.
Speaker 4 (31:03):
But I don't have a problem doing a little dally on
with him.
But when I started out ponyingAspen, I held the rope.
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Absolutely.
Yep.
Speaker 4 (31:12):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No.
I you're absolutely right.
And that goes to show there'snot one way.
It's just because I say onething doesn't mean that's the
way that I'm saying, oh, Ishould be done that way.
No.
It's so black and white.
And and the problem is though,when you start out, in horses in
general, you learn a certainway, and you kind of get this
(31:34):
feeling like that's the onlyway.
And then you have a hard timeopening up your mind.
I'm like, well, I can't learnfrom somebody else.
What does she know?
Like, what it is.
Like, you know what I'm saying?
Yeah.
That's like, Sandy, you'rebeing stupid.
I mean, like, you can and youneed to pull all these likes out
that I keep saying.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
I can't.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Okay.
Well, sorry, everybody.
I swear I'm not a valley girl.
I swear I'm not 12 years old.
I just use the word like toomuch.
But you know, sometimes I lookat certain things and I think to
myself, well, what do theyknow?
Like, what's their you knowqualification?
Right.
That's mine.
Speaker 3 (32:11):
But what's yours?
I have zero.
Oh, don't say that.
You have so much experience.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
Well, yes.
And I'm not putting myselfdown.
But in the scheme of things, Iknow.
Other people.
So whatever.
Anyway, I I really hope people,you know, can get a lot out of
this.
I I know that I I get a lot outof the talks that we have just
because it kind of reinforceswhat we're doing, or things that
(32:36):
you might see that I do thatmaybe you feel like I could do
differently, and I I hear it.
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
I might not do it, but I hear it.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
When I talk to you, I think it helps me process.
And I think one of the thingsI've learned as I've gotten
older is that nobody reallyknows what they're doing.
No.
And everyone's kind of wingingit.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
And so if you stay safe and you wing it, and you're
kind.
And you're kind, you're halfyou're more than halfway there.
If you can kind of check offthe boxes of is my horse halter
broke?
Speaker 2 (33:08):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
Is it okay with a rope on its ass?
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
What'll happen if it gets clamped under its tail?
If you can practice clampingthat rope underneath the tail
before it ever actually getsclamped underneath its tail on
the trail, your horse isn'tgonna get scared when it gets
clamped underneath on the trailbecause you already did it 17
times on the ground.
On the ground when you werestanding next to it and told it
it was a good horse and itdidn't care, and you rubbed its
(33:32):
butt and said it didn't die.
Good horse.
Yeah.
And you gave it a treat and alove pat.
For me, if you can just be safeand have all those check boxes,
there's nothing really holdingyou back from that next step,
especially if you have a friendor you have a very experienced
animal that you trust.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
So I think we've done that one.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I think so too.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
So until next time.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
Until next time.
Yeah.
Toodles.
Toodles.
Hey friends.
That's the end of today's ride.
We hope you enjoyed listening.
Don't forget to follow SaddleTalk with Sandy and Cara
wherever you get your podcasts.
Please leave us a review, shareus with a friend, and saddle up
with us next time as we ridethrough more stories, questions,
(34:15):
and our wild tangents.
Till then, friends, keep yourboots dusty and your hard hats
on.
We hope to see you out on thetrail.
Speaker (34:24):
Dandy and Kara stir up swinging free, talking about
life and love and mystery.
From coyotes to coffee, they'llcover it all with a sagebrush
blowing and the wild birds call.
So cinch up your boots.
We're hitting the track.
Saddle talks on, and we're notlooking back.
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