October 19, 2025 • 34 mins
Hello Cowgirls,
Join us for a conversation all about us, how we met, and what to expect from upcoming episodes. Saddle up or grab your pooper scooper and join us as we introduce ourselves to you!
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Clip plop goes the trail, sun is rising high.
Two gals in the saddle neath thebig Nevada sky, laughing and
chatting as the desert rolls onby.
It's Saddle Talk.
Come along for the ride.
SPEAKER_02 (00:20):
Welcome, listeners, to Saddle Talk with Sandy and
Cara.
Whether you're here to laughwith us, learn, or just ride
along, you're in for a reallygood time.
So go grab your helmet or yourpooper scooper and settle in
with us as we discuss life,horses, of course, and all the
unexpected turns along thetrail.
And hey, whether you're aseasoned cowgirl or you're still
learning, remember we're sharingour own stories and opinions
(00:44):
based on decades of personalexperience.
Always ride safe and check witha professional before trying
anything new.
Now let's go ride.
Welcome to Saddle Talk withSandy and Kara.
We are here to introduceourselves for the first time.
(01:04):
So exciting.
Yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
Okay, so why are we calling it Saddle Talk?
SPEAKER_02 (01:11):
Um, because you and I are uh basically saddle
besties, and we have the mostamazing conversations in the
saddle.
And I am an avid podcaster, andI was just riding.
We were on the trail one dayriding, and I thought, oh my
gosh, we should recordourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (01:30):
Because we have these great random conversations
that are all over the place.
Like I would say, I would say80% of the time we're talking
about what our stupid horses do,um, and how we're always worried
about them dying.
Like, like we heard somebodyelse quote, they wake up with
homicide or suicide on theirmind, and and that's so true,
(01:54):
and we talk about it in thesaddle, and we just have very
poignant conversations.
SPEAKER_02 (01:58):
We do.
And then after I said we shouldstart a podcast, or like we
sounded like podcasters, I justremember every time we would
have a conversation, I wouldthink, oh my gosh, this would be
on the podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (02:11):
Yes, yes, and it's always when we're in the saddle,
so we thought, why not saddletalk?
Why not saddle talk?
So that is why we're calling itsaddle talk.
So welcome to our saddle talk.
And we we're gonna hit thingsfrom A to Z.
A to Z and it's random, andsometimes we might go off on
(02:31):
tangents, and we are who we are,yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (02:33):
Exactly.
We're not gonna hold backbecause I feel like a lot of
people do hold back, and we'rejust we're not.
We're gonna keep it real, realwith Sandy and Karen.
SPEAKER_01 (02:44):
Okay, so I think one of the first things um that
people that were would listenwould want to know, you know,
um, why did we uh why do we likehorses?
I mean, why horses?
Why not dogs?
Why not cats?
I mean, I'm sure there'spodcasts out there for dogs and
cats, but so why horses?
So what a silly question.
(03:05):
So we're going to give eachother the opportunity to ask.
So I'm gonna ask you thatquestion first, yeah, Miss Cara.
Um why horses?
How young were you when yourealized of all the animals that
you love?
And I've I've seen your zoo, soI know you have an eclectic
amount of animals.
(03:25):
Um why horses?
SPEAKER_02 (03:29):
It was it, I think for me it felt genetic.
I think that I didn't have achoice.
SPEAKER_01 (03:35):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (03:36):
Yeah, I clearly remember being about the age of
four.
I could have been three, and Iwas underneath a table, and
there was a movie on, and itcame on, and I could just hear
the hoof beats.
And I think it was the movieBlack Beauty.
Oh, of course, and of course,always black beauty, and I think
it was a scene where there was ahorse running across a beach,
(03:59):
and the rhythm of the hoof beatsjust got in my brain, and I
didn't even watch it, I justheard it.
And then my grandpa got me thisbook, and it was all about
horses, and I used to just stareat the pictures and read the
captions, and so I was justcompletely hooked and captivated
from the sound.
Yeah, and then I think fromthere on I couldn't get enough
(04:20):
information.
Like after he gave me that firstpicture book, and I actually
still have the book, um, andhere I am 48, so that would have
been 44 years ago.
After that first picture book,all I did was consume
information, right?
And this is obviously beforelike the information age,
anything I could get a handleof, whether it was like the
encyclopedia, I would go to thelibrary, magazines.
(04:42):
I used to consume a ton ofmagazines when I was a teenager.
So that's what got me hooked wasthe sound.
And and then how old were you umwhen you first started writing?
So I was lucky enough to have amom and a grandma that I could
pester, and um, I did not stop.
And when I was eight years old,I started taking riding lessons.
(05:04):
Oh, so it was I was prettyyoung, I think.
For I was pretty lucky andpretty young, and then I started
boarding my own horse when I was16, and I became a working
student.
I had a grandma who gave me athousand dollars for your first
horse.
For my first horse, because shewas gonna give me her horse, but
then she found out her horse hadcushions.
SPEAKER_01 (05:24):
So your grandma had horses?
SPEAKER_02 (05:25):
She did.
She was a grandma that I neverreally saw, and she was kind of
a stigmatized grandma.
She married into the family andnobody liked her.
But I think that she saw me in,like she saw her in me.
SPEAKER_01 (05:38):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (05:38):
Horse girl loves a horse girl.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Did you ever go visit her and see her horse?
SPEAKER_02 (05:42):
I did, and I was very kind, and of course, we got
along, and so when she realizedI really was gonna take her
horse, she's like, Oh no, hon,here's a thousand dollars.
So my trainer um took thethousand dollars and she said,
Let's go find you a horse.
And we spent$500 on my firsthorse and$500 for all of my tack
(06:03):
and equipment.
Wow.
Yeah, and it was a pretty gooddeal because I worked, I worked
every weekend, Saturday andSunday, and that's how I at the
barn.
At the barn, yeah, at a ridingstable in Norco.
And that's how I did it.
Norco, California, if you horsetown, USA.
If you haven't been there, I'msure there's other horse towns,
but that place is magical.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
No, Norco's amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (06:21):
It is, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
That's the first place that I ever saw, um, you
know, riding on the street.
Oh, yeah where it was actuallymade for people riding horses
around the neighborhood.
That was really cool.
It was really cool.
SPEAKER_02 (06:33):
So, what about you?
Like, how did where did yourlove of horses spawn from?
unknown (06:38):
Spawn?
SPEAKER_01 (06:39):
Um I well, my first recollection of Loving Horses
was a book, Misty ofShinkatiague.
And I love that book.
And also uh Star, I think it wasdaughter of Misty.
Anyway, Misty gave birth.
Um and then I was amazed to findout that Shinkati and Acetigue
(07:02):
are it's an actual thing.
There's they they do um fromwhat I remember when I was
growing up, they actually um doa roundup and bring the horses
over to the mainland and theyvaccinate them, and then they
I'm sure that they pull some outfor auction or whatever, but so
that was the first thing.
And then I think I was like fiveyears old, and I grew up in
(07:23):
Virginia, and my neighbor, wehad not acre lots, but we had
big lots.
Um, but my neighbor's sisterbrought her horse home.
I didn't even know they had ahorse, and she brought her horse
home and put it in the backyard,and I was just amazed.
And it was this beautifulPalomino.
I don't even know.
(07:44):
I don't know.
I know I don't know if it was uhI don't know what breed.
I I'm gonna guess maybe aquarter horse, but it was just I
don't know, so just amazed.
And I didn't ask for ridinglessons.
Um, my mom and dad bought meeverything horse related.
I had this great wooden barnthat I never like you could take
(08:04):
the roof off and there werestalls inside.
And it was just so cool.
And and I didn't realize whatand I had every briar horse,
which my mom got rid of, which Iunderstand as a mom, like you're
ready to get rid of some toysbecause your kids just but I had
all these briar horses.
My favorite one was a Clyde'sDale, and had the little
braided, the braided hairs andstuff like that, and I just grew
(08:28):
up just just I don't know, Ithink it's a gene.
I think there's somethinginside.
I mean, there's people that havethe same feeling for dogs and
cats, and I think I mean I lovedogs and cats, don't get me
wrong, right?
But I don't know, there's justsomething about horses.
There's this animal that is sobig and strong, and it doesn't
(08:50):
even know its power and itlistens to you.
Like so I never I never tookriding lessons.
Uh we were in Girl Scouts, I wasin Girl Scouts, and there was an
option to go horseback riding,and I did that.
You know, I would always chooseto do a horse thing if there was
ever a choice.
(09:10):
Um, but I never took ridinglessons, I never did anything, I
never thought I'd ever own ahorse.
And then when I had children,one of my kids loved horses, and
I was like, wow, okay, this isgreat.
Um, and then we thought somebodywas gonna give us a horse, uh, a
three-year-old, that boy whohadn't even been cut yet.
(09:34):
I thought it was my onlyopportunity for a free horse,
and Kara and I will absolutelydiscuss free horses on another
podcast because that's a wholesubject.
Free horses aren't free.
Free horses are not free.
So I thought this was my onlyopportunity.
So I said to myself, I'm gonnago and learn about horses.
And we were living in uhSouthern California in Cerritos,
(09:57):
and I went to this barn that hada therapeutic writing program
and met this amazing woman who Iwalked up and I said, Okay,
listen, somebody's giving me afree horse.
It's my only opportunity.
Don't tell me no, just help medo it safely.
And she looked at me like I wasreally crazy, crazy, of course,
because you were.
SPEAKER_02 (10:18):
So you didn't know.
SPEAKER_01 (10:19):
I didn't know.
And um, so I startedvolunteering for her, and then
we learned that that person wasmistaken and I was not getting a
free horse, which was fine,which is good, because me and my
child um volunteered for thistherapeutic writing program, and
we just learned so much, and itwas amazing, and that leads us
(10:44):
right into when you and I met,right?
Because I I was 48, uh, so zeroexperience, zero, and um I can
attest to the zero, not in a badway, I don't take it in a bad
way, yeah.
I will not, I'm not offendedwhatsoever.
(11:05):
Because you're right, you'reright, and I didn't know what I
didn't know.
SPEAKER_02 (11:11):
Yeah, and that's actually I met you and you were
walking past my stall.
Um, you had that Bay Arab, and Icould tell something was super
wrong with it.
Like I knew that it was like inpain, but but there was more
than that.
Right.
And so you were slowly leavingit, and I was like, hey, uh,
(11:32):
there's something wrong withyour horse.
Right, right.
And you're like, oh no, no, it'sfine, it's fine.
I was like, uh, no, really,there's something really wrong
here, honey.
And that I didn't say honey, butlike, I was really wrong, and
and you were like, no, it'll beall right.
And I didn't want to like pushthat boundary because you have
to be careful of barns, barnpolitics, and we were at a
(11:56):
massive barn.
There were so many horses and somany people, right?
Um, and a lot of gossiping.
Yeah, and so I just put it outthere like, hey, there's
something wrong, and then I justretreated because I didn't want
to cause a problem with you.
SPEAKER_01 (12:08):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_02 (12:09):
And then I clearly remember you coming back about a
week later, and you actuallyapologized to me, and you're
like, Yep, there was somethingreally wrong with my horse.
It had laminitis, I think youhad.
And foundered.
And it had foundered, and that'swhat was going on.
Yes.
And so you were actually really,really sweet about it.
Thanks.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (12:26):
Well, you know, I I don't know anything, and I and I
hope I wasn't like bitchy whenyou were trying to tell me.
SPEAKER_02 (12:33):
You were kind.
SPEAKER_01 (12:33):
I was just like, oh no, no, it's an old horse.
I'm sure she's fine.
Thank you very much.
Blah blah blah.
Um, but no, I think it's becauseat first I thought, I'm just
gonna get a horse to ride aroundthe barn a little bit.
Well, I rode her every day.
And then my kids rode her everyday.
And um, she was a 20-year-oldshow horse that had already put
(12:58):
in her time.
Like she should never have beensold.
SPEAKER_02 (13:01):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (13:02):
She should have just been able to live out her life
wherever she was and retired.
Um, but I did, you know, learn alot about how to wrap and soak
and what to look for.
And, you know, it's it's sadthat we learn our best lessons
at the suffering of any animal,not just horses, but anyway
(13:22):
that's when you learn.
Right.
Um, and so I learned a lot, andI actually was able to give her
back to the people that I boughther from.
Oh, that's good.
So I'm hoping I'm sure she's nolonger around on the earth.
SPEAKER_02 (13:33):
But um because we've known each other for years now.
I think about it.
Yeah, it's been a while.
SPEAKER_01 (13:41):
I would say at least I'm doing some math because you
guys can't see this.
Because I can't do the math inmy head.
No mental math for Sandy.
We've known each other for atleast 14 years.
Oh my gosh, no way.
I know that's crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (13:57):
I know.
I think I met you yesterday.
I know, it's crazy.
And after our initial meeting,we didn't even get friendly
after that.
No.
I saw you at the barn because Iwas there almost every day.
Yeah, yeah.
And I would pass by thetherapeutic writing program
almost every day.
SPEAKER_00 (14:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (14:12):
Um, and everybody there was kind to me, but we
just didn't have a connection.
No, no.
SPEAKER_01 (14:17):
I remember I remember one time you you have
an aura about you that I thinkdraws people in, and I felt
that.
Um, and I knew that this wassomebody that I could probably
learn from.
And I remember the one time umyou had shaved Bob.
And I remember you walking down,and I don't know if I was
standing on the the platformwaiting for another ride or
something, but I rememberturning around and looking at
(14:37):
you going, did you get anotherhorse?
Because all of a sudden helooked like a liver.
Yes, you know, and I was like,what a liver colored, an organ,
buddy organ liver.
But it was just like I rememberthat, and then um, so um my
friend helped me get anotherhorse, Autumn, who I still have,
(15:00):
and is that my house now?
And is that your husband?
Yes, but I've had Autumn sinceshe was 12 years old, and she's
now 23, and um um we startedtrailering.
You had this amazing trail, havethis amazing trailer, and you
were so kind, and you were like,Hey, would you like to go trail
riding?
I was like, Oh, yes! I was soexcited.
SPEAKER_02 (15:24):
We and I think you were like walking again, you
were like walking past my myarea, my little barn area, and I
just flippantly put it out therebecause I'd been looking for
months.
I had Bob, who was supposed tobe a show Morgan.
Um, he's actually his real name.
I wanted to rename him, and Inever got to actually officially
rename him because his show namewas Le Prince Chief Skyhawk.
(15:46):
Really?
Yeah, he was a super fancy goingback to Lip It Morgan's, like
just a very typey, gorgeousanimal, right?
Yeah.
So I always kind of figured I'dshow him, but I could tell that
you know stuff just wasn'tworking out.
And he was at that point, he wasan early teenager.
Um, and I knew I wanted totransition to trail riding and
just leisure, yeah.
(16:07):
Because for me, it's all aboutthe horse, right?
Like I've I've gone into theshow world.
Um, but for me, my relationshipwith Bob was just so close, and
I knew he wanted to do somethingelse, and I could not find, I
literally couldn't find anybodyat that barn.
SPEAKER_01 (16:23):
And you had other friends, you had friends there
at the bar.
SPEAKER_02 (16:25):
I had barn friends, yeah, and none of them wanted to
leave the grounds.
SPEAKER_01 (16:28):
I wonder why.
SPEAKER_02 (16:29):
I don't know.
And then you walked past and Isaid something about trailering,
you're like, what?
Yes, let's do it.
SPEAKER_01 (16:35):
Yeah, and we were really good because we were both
early risers, we'd be there at 7a.m.
And and not only did we trailer,but you taught me how to hook up
a trailer, how to be safe, whatyou do.
You know, there's I mean, youdon't have to do everything in a
particular order, but you know,there are in order to make sure
that you do everything,sometimes having a routine and
(16:57):
an order when you teach somebodyum is just the best way.
And and you you were just sokind and and and um um patient,
yeah, patient with me, andreally helped.
And and then you would neverreally take gas money, so I just
started to buy lunch.
And your I was so excited andyou wanted to go.
(17:19):
I know, and your dietary needswere a little unique, so you
know I always wanted to makesure that I got exactly the
right thing, and like I'd go toSubway and get our sandwiches,
and yeah, we went to some reallynice places.
Um, I think I really enjoyedShibaram.
Yeah, because Shabaram had thatgreat arena, and we would put
Bob and Autumn out there to playafter our ride, and then we sit,
(17:40):
they had picnic tables, yeah,and we could sit down and have
our lunch.
SPEAKER_02 (17:43):
And then they would just like hang out and roll in
the dirt, and yeah, that was sofun.
SPEAKER_01 (17:47):
So every once in a while I my memory on Facebook
pops up and shows them out thererunning around.
Okay, that's really cute.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:54):
Well, that was that was some really good times that
we've had, honestly.
SPEAKER_01 (17:57):
Yeah, and and since then.
It was.
SPEAKER_02 (18:00):
It was, and then we had a minor separation, right?
Um, and then major separation.
SPEAKER_01 (18:06):
Because I went to a because I went to another barn.
SPEAKER_02 (18:08):
Yeah, she had to go to another barn, and then I
actually moved out of state andI moved to Nevada to be with
family.
Right.
So when that happened, um, thatwas a huge shift, and we'd
already been apart, I think, forabout a year.
Yeah.
So our trail writing days hadsuper slowed down.
Um they were pretty over.
They were pretty over.
And then I moved here and uhreconnected with you on Facebook
(18:33):
about a horse.
I mean, we were still friendly,but I didn't think our
relationship honestly was gonnago anywhere after that.
I thought, oh this is it.
Facebook friends.
Yeah, Facebook friends.
Like you were this amazingwriting person buddy, but you
were also I mean you were morethan that.
But like that's what we did.
SPEAKER_01 (18:48):
But you don't have to say that, like you don't just
to be nice, because I I felt thesame way.
I thought this is just you knowthe evolution of it.
SPEAKER_02 (18:57):
This is what happens to adults who are friends, sure,
exactly, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (19:00):
Yeah, and because you m moved uh, you know
geographically farther, yeah,you know, what else were we
gonna do?
But you came up here with onehorse, and your one horse was
not happy.
SPEAKER_02 (19:12):
No, Bob could not handle isolation, right?
It was not his jam.
SPEAKER_01 (19:15):
And we're in the high desert now, yes, so he was
freaking out.
He was, there was a lot of openspace, yeah, and no other horses
around.
SPEAKER_02 (19:24):
No, yeah, he had anxiety, and that is not him, he
was like the chillest.
He was actually named Bob afterBob Marley.
SPEAKER_01 (19:31):
Aww.
SPEAKER_02 (19:32):
Because when I got him, he had dreadlocks and he
was super chill.
SPEAKER_01 (19:36):
Perfect, yeah, yeah.
So when I saw on Facebook thatyou were looking for someone to
retire their horse up here, mygirlfriend who has a therapeutic
writing program had some uhretired uh therapy horses, and
so um I was like, hey, what doyou think about this?
And she's like, Yeah.
(19:58):
And then we reached out to youand said, We're up for a road
trip, we'll bring Rex up here.
So that's what we did.
We brought Rex up here.
SPEAKER_02 (20:08):
Yeah, yeah, we had fun because I just needed a
pasture puff.
Yeah, and then you ended upcoming back again with my
husband, because you realize howamazing.
SPEAKER_01 (20:17):
And my other horse.
Yeah, so I had swapped outAutumn for a uh cute little
quarter horse who is kind ofwow, she's an evergreen, she's
an evergreen, that's what I liketo call them.
SPEAKER_02 (20:29):
Yeah, when they never actually get quote unquote
broken or tamed.
Yeah, she just had no likeconsciousness of the human, no,
zero, like she she nailed me.
Did I tell you she like fuckingknocked me down out there?
No, yes, there was one day Ifeel like I was taking off her
fly mask or something stupidbecause she was here for a
(20:49):
little while and she turned andshe spun and literally like ran
into me and I ate it.
Oh my gosh, yeah, and that'swhen I thought to myself, I'm
never getting on that animal.
SPEAKER_01 (20:59):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, her name was is Willow,and she's beautiful, buckskin,
you know, it's not always aboutcolor, people.
It's not always about color.
The flashy ones will get you,but they're usually the crappy
ones.
No, so um, so I went home afterwe dropped off Rex, and I said
to my husband, hey, how wouldyou feel if I went to go visit
(21:22):
Kara and I was gonna and I'lltake I want to take Willow, and
then Kara's gonna show me sometrails.
And I had said, you know, Ithought I was just being nice,
and said, Would you like to go?
thinking he'd say no.
And he called my bluff and hesaid, Hey, I was thinking maybe
we could go back, you know, buthow about we fly and not take
(21:44):
the horse?
And I said, Okay, let's that'sfine.
And then right before we left,he said, you know, if you want
to look at houses while we'rethere, I was like, okay, whoa.
Like, stop right there.
Whoa, whoa.
Because if you get me started, Iwill find us a house.
Like, I will 100% find us ahouse.
(22:05):
So he was serious.
He just, you know, he I met himin California.
Um, he grew up in California, heis just a California guy, and I
moved to California fromVirginia because I wanted to
live in California.
Got my degree, my family, raisedmy kids, you know.
I was fine, but he had reallyjust had enough, and so it just
(22:28):
looked really awesome to him uphere.
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (22:31):
So we uh came up, we looked around at houses, and we
didn't find anything right away,but we found a real estate
agent, and she was amazing.
So she found us this great housethat is literally around the
corner from Kara and herhusband.
Yes, so we are now literallyaround the corner from each
other.
(22:51):
Our horses can hear each other,yeah, call to each other.
So, because a lot of times wewill ride back and forth to each
other's house.
Yeah, and that's where we are.
SPEAKER_02 (23:02):
Lately, I feel like we've just been on fire when it
comes to how you and I operate.
SPEAKER_01 (23:08):
Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:09):
We've we have this special, we've always had a
special relationship, I think,with horses.
And I think as an adult, whenyou when you're an adult and you
get a friend, it's differentthan when you're a kid and you
have a friend.
And I think horses are somethingthat ties women to women.
I mean, obviously men are inthere too, but when I think when
you look at like the wholespectrum of who actually rides,
(23:30):
it's mostly women, right?
Yeah, and I think that itdoesn't matter your age, it's
your passion.
Right.
And so when you came here andyou got your you had your horse
and then multiple horses, andthe same thing happened to me,
we started depending on eachother more and more.
Right.
And now it's almost like it'salmost like we have 10 acres.
I wish we did.
SPEAKER_01 (23:52):
Wouldn't that be nice?
It's so nice.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
But we have houses around the corner from each
other, and you actually boughtthat house I'd have seen, which
I think is hella gutsy.
SPEAKER_01 (24:00):
Uh yeah, well, we you know, in this age, um You
just wanted to be It was duringCOVID.
It was during COVID, and she andthere were videos, and you even
went over and took pictures ofit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
I tried to go inside, I couldn't break in.
Yeah, you can break in.
SPEAKER_01 (24:14):
But you could look over into the back.
I remember you writing me backand going, You have a legit
backyard man.
It was like, oh, cool.
SPEAKER_00 (24:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:22):
Um, but yeah, and our real estate agent went
through with a video and she dida walkthrough for us and things
like that.
And and it's very dated, like itwas totally built in the 70s.
So um, but my husband is anamazing handyman, and he has
done so much work around thathouse.
He does everything I ask him todo with the horses, like he has
(24:44):
changed panels.
He's so tired of changingpanels.
I feel so bad for him, but youknow, you just gotta do it until
it works.
So um, yeah, and so now we helpeach other with our horses.
SPEAKER_02 (24:58):
Yep, and I feel like we are so good together.
It's crazy how good we aretogether.
Like, if I'm being realisticwhen it comes to training, yeah,
I feel like we play off of eachother because you're super great
at and I think honestly, you'vebeen growing in confidence.
Thanks, and I think you're soopen-minded about learning that
your level of horsewomanship hasjust skyrocketed over the last
(25:22):
couple years.
Because I'm up here, yeah, yeah,and we're doing it all the time,
and it's so different to haveyour horses in your backyard
than it is to board.
Yes, and I was a boarder mywhole life, right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:34):
Well, we had to, we had to, we have a choice, yeah.
People are so judgmental atBarnes when you're trying
because I mean I don't know.
I I I just feel like they don'tit's it's I call it like a my
little pony mentality.
It's like so many people getstuck at the my little pony,
(25:58):
like oh, my little pony is socute, and I don't want it to get
hurt, and I don't want it tostep in the mud, and I don't
want it to get dirty.
But then on the other hand, mylittle pony weighs like a
thousand pounds and is going toliterally crush you.
I mean, you you have to breakthat mentality and you don't
(26:20):
want to lose the kindness,right, you know, of that that
feeling, but you have got tostep up, and if you have to, you
know, jiggle that rope, youknow, to get that horse to pay
attention, you know, to you, um,or to stop obsessing over there
(26:42):
and hey, look over here,butthead, you know, right,
right, yeah.
That's it, but in a barn, youknow, I'm not trying to give the
impression that I'm mean.
Like, I'm not gonna be able todo that.
No, you're not.
SPEAKER_02 (26:53):
I think you're you're actually really good at
what you do, and I've seentalent within you from your open
mindset, but I think that barnmentality definitely can inhibit
some women, but like it inhibitsgrowth in a really big way.
Like, I remember when I wasriding Bob and we were
practicing, I want to say wewere practicing second-level
movements, and he was just beinga dick.
(27:16):
He was being so bad.
And so he used to do this thingwhere when I was riding him, he
would cow kick, and it was likeit wasn't a buck, it was just
this little like, no, I don'twant to do that.
And he was only like six, six orseven.
Yeah, yeah.
And so I would literally be outin the arena cussing, and this
woman came around and she'slike, you know, you shouldn't
say that to him.
(27:39):
You know, and when I boardedthere, I didn't have a trainer,
like I was already at trainerlevel.
Like I'd and I had to make thatconscious decision to be a to to
to either go to school andbecome a professional something,
right, or to go and become atrainer.
And I and I chose the workingworld, of course.
So that's how you pay for thehorse.
That's how I pay for the horse.
That's what got me throughcollege.
(28:02):
Like, I'm gonna get a horse, I'mgonna get a horse, I'm gonna get
a horse.
Yes, yeah, but it I think likeliving here in Nevada, I did
miss the social aspect ofbecause the rural life is
different than boarding at abarn, right?
You are by yourself, andhonestly, that's how I got
addicted to podcasting um andjust listening to podcasts
because I was alone all bymyself all the time.
(28:23):
Right.
And I'm out there cleaning,mucking all of the things,
whether it was hot, cold,raining, snowing, oh my gosh,
the wind, I can't even tell you.
Yeah, um, but that's honestlylike that's a really big reason
why I want to do this podcastbecause I feel like there are so
many people who are just like meand just like you, yeah, and we
(28:43):
we we really are alone in thissport in a really big way.
Even if you're at a border barnor whether you're in your
backyard, right, like it reallyis sort of like this
isolationist sport becauseyou're so passionate about it,
but maybe your your spouseisn't, right?
Your best friends aren't, right?
Right?
You don't you don't really havesomeone to talk and to listen to
(29:06):
and to bounce ideas off of, andthere's a lot to be said about
chewing on information.
SPEAKER_01 (29:11):
And I think too, even if um, you know, we're
hoping that a lot of people wantto listen to us.
SPEAKER_02 (29:17):
I hope so.
SPEAKER_01 (29:18):
Um we think that we have a lot of fun things that we
talk about.
Some things that might make yougo, hmm, okay, maybe, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (29:28):
Maybe even some things are kind of cringy.
SPEAKER_01 (29:30):
Yeah, yeah.
Exactly.
Oh, cringy will come.
There will be cringy.
There will be cringy.
Um but you know, even if there'ssomebody at the barn listening
to us while they're cleaningtheir stall or they're writing
in their arena, and if it justgives them insight or
confidence, because you know,you started writing at eight.
(29:53):
I started writing literally atforty eight.
I mean, there's gonna be peoplebetween the two of us.
Right.
And I just hope that uh, youknow, people listening to us
don't see us as these uhprofessional people who have
already gone through everythingand all you're gonna hear is
(30:15):
what we have to say at thehighest level.
SPEAKER_02 (30:18):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (30:18):
You know?
SPEAKER_02 (30:19):
Right.
That's not us.
We we had to figure it out.
SPEAKER_01 (30:21):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (30:22):
I mean, I did have trainers, but in a really big
way.
It was all self-motivated.
Right.
I did stuff that other peopledid not want to do.
SPEAKER_01 (30:29):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (30:29):
Yeah.
And I did it for reasons.
I think when you're in the showworld, um, you have to make a
decision at some point.
Do I move forward knowing thatI'm doing this for like the
detriment of my horse's mentalhealth?
Right.
And my own mental health.
Right.
And I came into the horse worldright about when, so I think I
mean, I was probably I was stilllike a junior rider in the early
(30:54):
90s.
And riding back then, like youhad to have a certain look.
It's kind of like ballet 15years ago, right?
It was like tall, white, skinnygirls did really, really well.
Okay, I've never been tall, andI've never been skinny, right?
So I didn't exactly fit in intothat mold.
Although I was a great rider, Ihave an amazing feel, I have
(31:17):
amazing um connection with thehorse.
I didn't always win um justbecause I didn't have that long
leg.
And I and I couldn't afford thehorse.
Like I couldn't afford thehorse.
Right.
Right?
I was always on these secondhands.
SPEAKER_01 (31:30):
Well, which is another podcast.
Is it the rider or is it thehorse?
No, I mean, is it the rider oris it the horse?
If you can afford the horse,you're gonna look like an
amazing rider.
Right.
Or do you get the horse you canafford and train it and you're
both amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (31:48):
Right.
Which which is what has happenedin my life, right?
And that there was thatdivergence.
Right.
Um, but you're exactly right,and I think that's actually what
turned me off from showing.
Right.
Was I could see that there werethese girls who were beating me
on these horses that theirparents paid for, you know,
$20,000,$30,000, and that wasnever gonna be me.
SPEAKER_01 (32:08):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
And I knew that I was 10 times the writer.
SPEAKER_01 (32:11):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:11):
And we would go to these shows and the judges would
score them above me, and I wouldthink, you literally know
nothing.
Like I work my ass off wayharder.
I'm a I'm way better of awriter, I can handle so much
more.
SPEAKER_01 (32:22):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:22):
And that's actually what spurred me into getting
into dressage.
Because I felt like dressage wasmuch more of an individualized
sport in a way, and I get thatthere's still politics in that
world.
SPEAKER_01 (32:34):
Yeah, everywhere.
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
Everywhere, everywhere there's politics.
But that's how I got intodressage, and then I made the
conscious decision to do whatwas best for my horse.
Yeah, and he did not want to dodressage anymore.
He was like, you know what,let's just have fun.
And I said, Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (32:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (32:48):
And then that was us.
SPEAKER_01 (32:50):
Yes, and then we we got together.
And that's how we got together.
Yeah.
So I really, I really think thatum um people might enjoy our
crazy banter.
Our crazy banter.
And our tangents, because therewill be tangents and we will go
off topic.
Yeah.
Maybe.
SPEAKER_02 (33:09):
And maybe we can help you like walk you through
some of the things that we'vebeen through and some of the
hurdles that we faced and giveyou the confidence to try
something different and new foryou, for your horse, and we'll
just keep you company.
And we'll have a good time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:23):
Yes, we will keep you company while you are out
there mucking your stalls in theweather and trying to soak your
horse's foot because there's anabscess coming through and it
hasn't yet burst.
And you're just trying to standthere.
Yeah, well, we don't call themdamn horses, but we'll save that
for later.
All right.
We'll save that for later on.
SPEAKER_02 (33:41):
Well, thank you, Sandy, for our introduction
chat.
And we hope our listeners loveus.
All right.
Tootles.
Tootles.
Hey friends, that's the end oftoday's ride.
We hope you enjoyed listening.
Don't forget to follow SaddleTalk with Sandy and Cara
wherever you get your podcasts.
Please leave us a review, shareus with a friend, and saddle up
(34:02):
with us next time as we ridethrough more stories, questions,
and our wild tangents.
Till then, friends, keep yourboots dusty and your hard hats
on.
We hope to see you out on thetrail.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Dandy and Kara stir up swinging free, talking about
life and love and mystery.
From coyotes to coffee, they'llcover it all with the sagebrush
blowing and the wild birds call.
So cinch up your boots, we'rehitting the track, saddle talks
on, and we're not looking back.
Clip plop goes the trail, sun is rising high.
Two gals in the saddle neath thebig Nevada sky, laughing and
chatting as the desert rolls onby.
It's Saddle Talk.
Come along for the ride.
SPEAKER_02 (00:20):
Welcome, listeners, to Saddle Talk with Sandy and
Cara.
Whether you're here to laughwith us, learn, or just ride
along, you're in for a reallygood time.
So go grab your helmet or yourpooper scooper and settle in
with us as we discuss life,horses, of course, and all the
unexpected turns along thetrail.
And hey, whether you're aseasoned cowgirl or you're still
learning, remember we're sharingour own stories and opinions
(00:44):
based on decades of personalexperience.
Always ride safe and check witha professional before trying
anything new.
Now let's go ride.
Welcome to Saddle Talk withSandy and Kara.
We are here to introduceourselves for the first time.
(01:04):
So exciting.
Yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
Okay, so why are we calling it Saddle Talk?
SPEAKER_02 (01:11):
Um, because you and I are uh basically saddle
besties, and we have the mostamazing conversations in the
saddle.
And I am an avid podcaster, andI was just riding.
We were on the trail one dayriding, and I thought, oh my
gosh, we should recordourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (01:30):
Because we have these great random conversations
that are all over the place.
Like I would say, I would say80% of the time we're talking
about what our stupid horses do,um, and how we're always worried
about them dying.
Like, like we heard somebodyelse quote, they wake up with
homicide or suicide on theirmind, and and that's so true,
(01:54):
and we talk about it in thesaddle, and we just have very
poignant conversations.
SPEAKER_02 (01:58):
We do.
And then after I said we shouldstart a podcast, or like we
sounded like podcasters, I justremember every time we would
have a conversation, I wouldthink, oh my gosh, this would be
on the podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (02:11):
Yes, yes, and it's always when we're in the saddle,
so we thought, why not saddletalk?
Why not saddle talk?
So that is why we're calling itsaddle talk.
So welcome to our saddle talk.
And we we're gonna hit thingsfrom A to Z.
A to Z and it's random, andsometimes we might go off on
(02:31):
tangents, and we are who we are,yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (02:33):
Exactly.
We're not gonna hold backbecause I feel like a lot of
people do hold back, and we'rejust we're not.
We're gonna keep it real, realwith Sandy and Karen.
SPEAKER_01 (02:44):
Okay, so I think one of the first things um that
people that were would listenwould want to know, you know,
um, why did we uh why do we likehorses?
I mean, why horses?
Why not dogs?
Why not cats?
I mean, I'm sure there'spodcasts out there for dogs and
cats, but so why horses?
So what a silly question.
(03:05):
So we're going to give eachother the opportunity to ask.
So I'm gonna ask you thatquestion first, yeah, Miss Cara.
Um why horses?
How young were you when yourealized of all the animals that
you love?
And I've I've seen your zoo, soI know you have an eclectic
amount of animals.
(03:25):
Um why horses?
SPEAKER_02 (03:29):
It was it, I think for me it felt genetic.
I think that I didn't have achoice.
SPEAKER_01 (03:35):
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (03:36):
Yeah, I clearly remember being about the age of
four.
I could have been three, and Iwas underneath a table, and
there was a movie on, and itcame on, and I could just hear
the hoof beats.
And I think it was the movieBlack Beauty.
Oh, of course, and of course,always black beauty, and I think
it was a scene where there was ahorse running across a beach,
(03:59):
and the rhythm of the hoof beatsjust got in my brain, and I
didn't even watch it, I justheard it.
And then my grandpa got me thisbook, and it was all about
horses, and I used to just stareat the pictures and read the
captions, and so I was justcompletely hooked and captivated
from the sound.
Yeah, and then I think fromthere on I couldn't get enough
(04:20):
information.
Like after he gave me that firstpicture book, and I actually
still have the book, um, andhere I am 48, so that would have
been 44 years ago.
After that first picture book,all I did was consume
information, right?
And this is obviously beforelike the information age,
anything I could get a handleof, whether it was like the
encyclopedia, I would go to thelibrary, magazines.
(04:42):
I used to consume a ton ofmagazines when I was a teenager.
So that's what got me hooked wasthe sound.
And and then how old were you umwhen you first started writing?
So I was lucky enough to have amom and a grandma that I could
pester, and um, I did not stop.
And when I was eight years old,I started taking riding lessons.
(05:04):
Oh, so it was I was prettyyoung, I think.
For I was pretty lucky andpretty young, and then I started
boarding my own horse when I was16, and I became a working
student.
I had a grandma who gave me athousand dollars for your first
horse.
For my first horse, because shewas gonna give me her horse, but
then she found out her horse hadcushions.
SPEAKER_01 (05:24):
So your grandma had horses?
SPEAKER_02 (05:25):
She did.
She was a grandma that I neverreally saw, and she was kind of
a stigmatized grandma.
She married into the family andnobody liked her.
But I think that she saw me in,like she saw her in me.
SPEAKER_01 (05:38):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (05:38):
Horse girl loves a horse girl.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Did you ever go visit her and see her horse?
SPEAKER_02 (05:42):
I did, and I was very kind, and of course, we got
along, and so when she realizedI really was gonna take her
horse, she's like, Oh no, hon,here's a thousand dollars.
So my trainer um took thethousand dollars and she said,
Let's go find you a horse.
And we spent$500 on my firsthorse and$500 for all of my tack
(06:03):
and equipment.
Wow.
Yeah, and it was a pretty gooddeal because I worked, I worked
every weekend, Saturday andSunday, and that's how I at the
barn.
At the barn, yeah, at a ridingstable in Norco.
And that's how I did it.
Norco, California, if you horsetown, USA.
If you haven't been there, I'msure there's other horse towns,
but that place is magical.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
No, Norco's amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (06:21):
It is, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
That's the first place that I ever saw, um, you
know, riding on the street.
Oh, yeah where it was actuallymade for people riding horses
around the neighborhood.
That was really cool.
It was really cool.
SPEAKER_02 (06:33):
So, what about you?
Like, how did where did yourlove of horses spawn from?
unknown (06:38):
Spawn?
SPEAKER_01 (06:39):
Um I well, my first recollection of Loving Horses
was a book, Misty ofShinkatiague.
And I love that book.
And also uh Star, I think it wasdaughter of Misty.
Anyway, Misty gave birth.
Um and then I was amazed to findout that Shinkati and Acetigue
(07:02):
are it's an actual thing.
There's they they do um fromwhat I remember when I was
growing up, they actually um doa roundup and bring the horses
over to the mainland and theyvaccinate them, and then they
I'm sure that they pull some outfor auction or whatever, but so
that was the first thing.
And then I think I was like fiveyears old, and I grew up in
(07:23):
Virginia, and my neighbor, wehad not acre lots, but we had
big lots.
Um, but my neighbor's sisterbrought her horse home.
I didn't even know they had ahorse, and she brought her horse
home and put it in the backyard,and I was just amazed.
And it was this beautifulPalomino.
I don't even know.
(07:44):
I don't know.
I know I don't know if it was uhI don't know what breed.
I I'm gonna guess maybe aquarter horse, but it was just I
don't know, so just amazed.
And I didn't ask for ridinglessons.
Um, my mom and dad bought meeverything horse related.
I had this great wooden barnthat I never like you could take
(08:04):
the roof off and there werestalls inside.
And it was just so cool.
And and I didn't realize whatand I had every briar horse,
which my mom got rid of, which Iunderstand as a mom, like you're
ready to get rid of some toysbecause your kids just but I had
all these briar horses.
My favorite one was a Clyde'sDale, and had the little
braided, the braided hairs andstuff like that, and I just grew
(08:28):
up just just I don't know, Ithink it's a gene.
I think there's somethinginside.
I mean, there's people that havethe same feeling for dogs and
cats, and I think I mean I lovedogs and cats, don't get me
wrong, right?
But I don't know, there's justsomething about horses.
There's this animal that is sobig and strong, and it doesn't
(08:50):
even know its power and itlistens to you.
Like so I never I never tookriding lessons.
Uh we were in Girl Scouts, I wasin Girl Scouts, and there was an
option to go horseback riding,and I did that.
You know, I would always chooseto do a horse thing if there was
ever a choice.
(09:10):
Um, but I never took ridinglessons, I never did anything, I
never thought I'd ever own ahorse.
And then when I had children,one of my kids loved horses, and
I was like, wow, okay, this isgreat.
Um, and then we thought somebodywas gonna give us a horse, uh, a
three-year-old, that boy whohadn't even been cut yet.
(09:34):
I thought it was my onlyopportunity for a free horse,
and Kara and I will absolutelydiscuss free horses on another
podcast because that's a wholesubject.
Free horses aren't free.
Free horses are not free.
So I thought this was my onlyopportunity.
So I said to myself, I'm gonnago and learn about horses.
And we were living in uhSouthern California in Cerritos,
(09:57):
and I went to this barn that hada therapeutic writing program
and met this amazing woman who Iwalked up and I said, Okay,
listen, somebody's giving me afree horse.
It's my only opportunity.
Don't tell me no, just help medo it safely.
And she looked at me like I wasreally crazy, crazy, of course,
because you were.
SPEAKER_02 (10:18):
So you didn't know.
SPEAKER_01 (10:19):
I didn't know.
And um, so I startedvolunteering for her, and then
we learned that that person wasmistaken and I was not getting a
free horse, which was fine,which is good, because me and my
child um volunteered for thistherapeutic writing program, and
we just learned so much, and itwas amazing, and that leads us
(10:44):
right into when you and I met,right?
Because I I was 48, uh, so zeroexperience, zero, and um I can
attest to the zero, not in a badway, I don't take it in a bad
way, yeah.
I will not, I'm not offendedwhatsoever.
(11:05):
Because you're right, you'reright, and I didn't know what I
didn't know.
SPEAKER_02 (11:11):
Yeah, and that's actually I met you and you were
walking past my stall.
Um, you had that Bay Arab, and Icould tell something was super
wrong with it.
Like I knew that it was like inpain, but but there was more
than that.
Right.
And so you were slowly leavingit, and I was like, hey, uh,
(11:32):
there's something wrong withyour horse.
Right, right.
And you're like, oh no, no, it'sfine, it's fine.
I was like, uh, no, really,there's something really wrong
here, honey.
And that I didn't say honey, butlike, I was really wrong, and
and you were like, no, it'll beall right.
And I didn't want to like pushthat boundary because you have
to be careful of barns, barnpolitics, and we were at a
(11:56):
massive barn.
There were so many horses and somany people, right?
Um, and a lot of gossiping.
Yeah, and so I just put it outthere like, hey, there's
something wrong, and then I justretreated because I didn't want
to cause a problem with you.
SPEAKER_01 (12:08):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_02 (12:09):
And then I clearly remember you coming back about a
week later, and you actuallyapologized to me, and you're
like, Yep, there was somethingreally wrong with my horse.
It had laminitis, I think youhad.
And foundered.
And it had foundered, and that'swhat was going on.
Yes.
And so you were actually really,really sweet about it.
Thanks.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (12:26):
Well, you know, I I don't know anything, and I and I
hope I wasn't like bitchy whenyou were trying to tell me.
SPEAKER_02 (12:33):
You were kind.
SPEAKER_01 (12:33):
I was just like, oh no, no, it's an old horse.
I'm sure she's fine.
Thank you very much.
Blah blah blah.
Um, but no, I think it's becauseat first I thought, I'm just
gonna get a horse to ride aroundthe barn a little bit.
Well, I rode her every day.
And then my kids rode her everyday.
And um, she was a 20-year-oldshow horse that had already put
(12:58):
in her time.
Like she should never have beensold.
SPEAKER_02 (13:01):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (13:02):
She should have just been able to live out her life
wherever she was and retired.
Um, but I did, you know, learn alot about how to wrap and soak
and what to look for.
And, you know, it's it's sadthat we learn our best lessons
at the suffering of any animal,not just horses, but anyway
(13:22):
that's when you learn.
Right.
Um, and so I learned a lot, andI actually was able to give her
back to the people that I boughther from.
Oh, that's good.
So I'm hoping I'm sure she's nolonger around on the earth.
SPEAKER_02 (13:33):
But um because we've known each other for years now.
I think about it.
Yeah, it's been a while.
SPEAKER_01 (13:41):
I would say at least I'm doing some math because you
guys can't see this.
Because I can't do the math inmy head.
No mental math for Sandy.
We've known each other for atleast 14 years.
Oh my gosh, no way.
I know that's crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (13:57):
I know.
I think I met you yesterday.
I know, it's crazy.
And after our initial meeting,we didn't even get friendly
after that.
No.
I saw you at the barn because Iwas there almost every day.
Yeah, yeah.
And I would pass by thetherapeutic writing program
almost every day.
SPEAKER_00 (14:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (14:12):
Um, and everybody there was kind to me, but we
just didn't have a connection.
No, no.
SPEAKER_01 (14:17):
I remember I remember one time you you have
an aura about you that I thinkdraws people in, and I felt
that.
Um, and I knew that this wassomebody that I could probably
learn from.
And I remember the one time umyou had shaved Bob.
And I remember you walking down,and I don't know if I was
standing on the the platformwaiting for another ride or
something, but I rememberturning around and looking at
(14:37):
you going, did you get anotherhorse?
Because all of a sudden helooked like a liver.
Yes, you know, and I was like,what a liver colored, an organ,
buddy organ liver.
But it was just like I rememberthat, and then um, so um my
friend helped me get anotherhorse, Autumn, who I still have,
(15:00):
and is that my house now?
And is that your husband?
Yes, but I've had Autumn sinceshe was 12 years old, and she's
now 23, and um um we startedtrailering.
You had this amazing trail, havethis amazing trailer, and you
were so kind, and you were like,Hey, would you like to go trail
riding?
I was like, Oh, yes! I was soexcited.
SPEAKER_02 (15:24):
We and I think you were like walking again, you
were like walking past my myarea, my little barn area, and I
just flippantly put it out therebecause I'd been looking for
months.
I had Bob, who was supposed tobe a show Morgan.
Um, he's actually his real name.
I wanted to rename him, and Inever got to actually officially
rename him because his show namewas Le Prince Chief Skyhawk.
(15:46):
Really?
Yeah, he was a super fancy goingback to Lip It Morgan's, like
just a very typey, gorgeousanimal, right?
Yeah.
So I always kind of figured I'dshow him, but I could tell that
you know stuff just wasn'tworking out.
And he was at that point, he wasan early teenager.
Um, and I knew I wanted totransition to trail riding and
just leisure, yeah.
(16:07):
Because for me, it's all aboutthe horse, right?
Like I've I've gone into theshow world.
Um, but for me, my relationshipwith Bob was just so close, and
I knew he wanted to do somethingelse, and I could not find, I
literally couldn't find anybodyat that barn.
SPEAKER_01 (16:23):
And you had other friends, you had friends there
at the bar.
SPEAKER_02 (16:25):
I had barn friends, yeah, and none of them wanted to
leave the grounds.
SPEAKER_01 (16:28):
I wonder why.
SPEAKER_02 (16:29):
I don't know.
And then you walked past and Isaid something about trailering,
you're like, what?
Yes, let's do it.
SPEAKER_01 (16:35):
Yeah, and we were really good because we were both
early risers, we'd be there at 7a.m.
And and not only did we trailer,but you taught me how to hook up
a trailer, how to be safe, whatyou do.
You know, there's I mean, youdon't have to do everything in a
particular order, but you know,there are in order to make sure
that you do everything,sometimes having a routine and
(16:57):
an order when you teach somebodyum is just the best way.
And and you you were just sokind and and and um um patient,
yeah, patient with me, andreally helped.
And and then you would neverreally take gas money, so I just
started to buy lunch.
And your I was so excited andyou wanted to go.
(17:19):
I know, and your dietary needswere a little unique, so you
know I always wanted to makesure that I got exactly the
right thing, and like I'd go toSubway and get our sandwiches,
and yeah, we went to some reallynice places.
Um, I think I really enjoyedShibaram.
Yeah, because Shabaram had thatgreat arena, and we would put
Bob and Autumn out there to playafter our ride, and then we sit,
(17:40):
they had picnic tables, yeah,and we could sit down and have
our lunch.
SPEAKER_02 (17:43):
And then they would just like hang out and roll in
the dirt, and yeah, that was sofun.
SPEAKER_01 (17:47):
So every once in a while I my memory on Facebook
pops up and shows them out thererunning around.
Okay, that's really cute.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:54):
Well, that was that was some really good times that
we've had, honestly.
SPEAKER_01 (17:57):
Yeah, and and since then.
It was.
SPEAKER_02 (18:00):
It was, and then we had a minor separation, right?
Um, and then major separation.
SPEAKER_01 (18:06):
Because I went to a because I went to another barn.
SPEAKER_02 (18:08):
Yeah, she had to go to another barn, and then I
actually moved out of state andI moved to Nevada to be with
family.
Right.
So when that happened, um, thatwas a huge shift, and we'd
already been apart, I think, forabout a year.
Yeah.
So our trail writing days hadsuper slowed down.
Um they were pretty over.
They were pretty over.
And then I moved here and uhreconnected with you on Facebook
(18:33):
about a horse.
I mean, we were still friendly,but I didn't think our
relationship honestly was gonnago anywhere after that.
I thought, oh this is it.
Facebook friends.
Yeah, Facebook friends.
Like you were this amazingwriting person buddy, but you
were also I mean you were morethan that.
But like that's what we did.
SPEAKER_01 (18:48):
But you don't have to say that, like you don't just
to be nice, because I I felt thesame way.
I thought this is just you knowthe evolution of it.
SPEAKER_02 (18:57):
This is what happens to adults who are friends, sure,
exactly, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (19:00):
Yeah, and because you m moved uh, you know
geographically farther, yeah,you know, what else were we
gonna do?
But you came up here with onehorse, and your one horse was
not happy.
SPEAKER_02 (19:12):
No, Bob could not handle isolation, right?
It was not his jam.
SPEAKER_01 (19:15):
And we're in the high desert now, yes, so he was
freaking out.
He was, there was a lot of openspace, yeah, and no other horses
around.
SPEAKER_02 (19:24):
No, yeah, he had anxiety, and that is not him, he
was like the chillest.
He was actually named Bob afterBob Marley.
SPEAKER_01 (19:31):
Aww.
SPEAKER_02 (19:32):
Because when I got him, he had dreadlocks and he
was super chill.
SPEAKER_01 (19:36):
Perfect, yeah, yeah.
So when I saw on Facebook thatyou were looking for someone to
retire their horse up here, mygirlfriend who has a therapeutic
writing program had some uhretired uh therapy horses, and
so um I was like, hey, what doyou think about this?
And she's like, Yeah.
(19:58):
And then we reached out to youand said, We're up for a road
trip, we'll bring Rex up here.
So that's what we did.
We brought Rex up here.
SPEAKER_02 (20:08):
Yeah, yeah, we had fun because I just needed a
pasture puff.
Yeah, and then you ended upcoming back again with my
husband, because you realize howamazing.
SPEAKER_01 (20:17):
And my other horse.
Yeah, so I had swapped outAutumn for a uh cute little
quarter horse who is kind ofwow, she's an evergreen, she's
an evergreen, that's what I liketo call them.
SPEAKER_02 (20:29):
Yeah, when they never actually get quote unquote
broken or tamed.
Yeah, she just had no likeconsciousness of the human, no,
zero, like she she nailed me.
Did I tell you she like fuckingknocked me down out there?
No, yes, there was one day Ifeel like I was taking off her
fly mask or something stupidbecause she was here for a
(20:49):
little while and she turned andshe spun and literally like ran
into me and I ate it.
Oh my gosh, yeah, and that'swhen I thought to myself, I'm
never getting on that animal.
SPEAKER_01 (20:59):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, her name was is Willow,and she's beautiful, buckskin,
you know, it's not always aboutcolor, people.
It's not always about color.
The flashy ones will get you,but they're usually the crappy
ones.
No, so um, so I went home afterwe dropped off Rex, and I said
to my husband, hey, how wouldyou feel if I went to go visit
(21:22):
Kara and I was gonna and I'lltake I want to take Willow, and
then Kara's gonna show me sometrails.
And I had said, you know, Ithought I was just being nice,
and said, Would you like to go?
thinking he'd say no.
And he called my bluff and hesaid, Hey, I was thinking maybe
we could go back, you know, buthow about we fly and not take
(21:44):
the horse?
And I said, Okay, let's that'sfine.
And then right before we left,he said, you know, if you want
to look at houses while we'rethere, I was like, okay, whoa.
Like, stop right there.
Whoa, whoa.
Because if you get me started, Iwill find us a house.
Like, I will 100% find us ahouse.
(22:05):
So he was serious.
He just, you know, he I met himin California.
Um, he grew up in California, heis just a California guy, and I
moved to California fromVirginia because I wanted to
live in California.
Got my degree, my family, raisedmy kids, you know.
I was fine, but he had reallyjust had enough, and so it just
(22:28):
looked really awesome to him uphere.
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (22:31):
So we uh came up, we looked around at houses, and we
didn't find anything right away,but we found a real estate
agent, and she was amazing.
So she found us this great housethat is literally around the
corner from Kara and herhusband.
Yes, so we are now literallyaround the corner from each
other.
(22:51):
Our horses can hear each other,yeah, call to each other.
So, because a lot of times wewill ride back and forth to each
other's house.
Yeah, and that's where we are.
SPEAKER_02 (23:02):
Lately, I feel like we've just been on fire when it
comes to how you and I operate.
SPEAKER_01 (23:08):
Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:09):
We've we have this special, we've always had a
special relationship, I think,with horses.
And I think as an adult, whenyou when you're an adult and you
get a friend, it's differentthan when you're a kid and you
have a friend.
And I think horses are somethingthat ties women to women.
I mean, obviously men are inthere too, but when I think when
you look at like the wholespectrum of who actually rides,
(23:30):
it's mostly women, right?
Yeah, and I think that itdoesn't matter your age, it's
your passion.
Right.
And so when you came here andyou got your you had your horse
and then multiple horses, andthe same thing happened to me,
we started depending on eachother more and more.
Right.
And now it's almost like it'salmost like we have 10 acres.
I wish we did.
SPEAKER_01 (23:52):
Wouldn't that be nice?
It's so nice.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
But we have houses around the corner from each
other, and you actually boughtthat house I'd have seen, which
I think is hella gutsy.
SPEAKER_01 (24:00):
Uh yeah, well, we you know, in this age, um You
just wanted to be It was duringCOVID.
It was during COVID, and she andthere were videos, and you even
went over and took pictures ofit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
I tried to go inside, I couldn't break in.
Yeah, you can break in.
SPEAKER_01 (24:14):
But you could look over into the back.
I remember you writing me backand going, You have a legit
backyard man.
It was like, oh, cool.
SPEAKER_00 (24:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:22):
Um, but yeah, and our real estate agent went
through with a video and she dida walkthrough for us and things
like that.
And and it's very dated, like itwas totally built in the 70s.
So um, but my husband is anamazing handyman, and he has
done so much work around thathouse.
He does everything I ask him todo with the horses, like he has
(24:44):
changed panels.
He's so tired of changingpanels.
I feel so bad for him, but youknow, you just gotta do it until
it works.
So um, yeah, and so now we helpeach other with our horses.
SPEAKER_02 (24:58):
Yep, and I feel like we are so good together.
It's crazy how good we aretogether.
Like, if I'm being realisticwhen it comes to training, yeah,
I feel like we play off of eachother because you're super great
at and I think honestly, you'vebeen growing in confidence.
Thanks, and I think you're soopen-minded about learning that
your level of horsewomanship hasjust skyrocketed over the last
(25:22):
couple years.
Because I'm up here, yeah, yeah,and we're doing it all the time,
and it's so different to haveyour horses in your backyard
than it is to board.
Yes, and I was a boarder mywhole life, right?
SPEAKER_01 (25:34):
Well, we had to, we had to, we have a choice, yeah.
People are so judgmental atBarnes when you're trying
because I mean I don't know.
I I I just feel like they don'tit's it's I call it like a my
little pony mentality.
It's like so many people getstuck at the my little pony,
(25:58):
like oh, my little pony is socute, and I don't want it to get
hurt, and I don't want it tostep in the mud, and I don't
want it to get dirty.
But then on the other hand, mylittle pony weighs like a
thousand pounds and is going toliterally crush you.
I mean, you you have to breakthat mentality and you don't
(26:20):
want to lose the kindness,right, you know, of that that
feeling, but you have got tostep up, and if you have to, you
know, jiggle that rope, youknow, to get that horse to pay
attention, you know, to you, um,or to stop obsessing over there
(26:42):
and hey, look over here,butthead, you know, right,
right, yeah.
That's it, but in a barn, youknow, I'm not trying to give the
impression that I'm mean.
Like, I'm not gonna be able todo that.
No, you're not.
SPEAKER_02 (26:53):
I think you're you're actually really good at
what you do, and I've seentalent within you from your open
mindset, but I think that barnmentality definitely can inhibit
some women, but like it inhibitsgrowth in a really big way.
Like, I remember when I wasriding Bob and we were
practicing, I want to say wewere practicing second-level
movements, and he was just beinga dick.
(27:16):
He was being so bad.
And so he used to do this thingwhere when I was riding him, he
would cow kick, and it was likeit wasn't a buck, it was just
this little like, no, I don'twant to do that.
And he was only like six, six orseven.
Yeah, yeah.
And so I would literally be outin the arena cussing, and this
woman came around and she'slike, you know, you shouldn't
say that to him.
(27:39):
You know, and when I boardedthere, I didn't have a trainer,
like I was already at trainerlevel.
Like I'd and I had to make thatconscious decision to be a to to
to either go to school andbecome a professional something,
right, or to go and become atrainer.
And I and I chose the workingworld, of course.
So that's how you pay for thehorse.
That's how I pay for the horse.
That's what got me throughcollege.
(28:02):
Like, I'm gonna get a horse, I'mgonna get a horse, I'm gonna get
a horse.
Yes, yeah, but it I think likeliving here in Nevada, I did
miss the social aspect ofbecause the rural life is
different than boarding at abarn, right?
You are by yourself, andhonestly, that's how I got
addicted to podcasting um andjust listening to podcasts
because I was alone all bymyself all the time.
(28:23):
Right.
And I'm out there cleaning,mucking all of the things,
whether it was hot, cold,raining, snowing, oh my gosh,
the wind, I can't even tell you.
Yeah, um, but that's honestlylike that's a really big reason
why I want to do this podcastbecause I feel like there are so
many people who are just like meand just like you, yeah, and we
(28:43):
we we really are alone in thissport in a really big way.
Even if you're at a border barnor whether you're in your
backyard, right, like it reallyis sort of like this
isolationist sport becauseyou're so passionate about it,
but maybe your your spouseisn't, right?
Your best friends aren't, right?
Right?
You don't you don't really havesomeone to talk and to listen to
(29:06):
and to bounce ideas off of, andthere's a lot to be said about
chewing on information.
SPEAKER_01 (29:11):
And I think too, even if um, you know, we're
hoping that a lot of people wantto listen to us.
SPEAKER_02 (29:17):
I hope so.
SPEAKER_01 (29:18):
Um we think that we have a lot of fun things that we
talk about.
Some things that might make yougo, hmm, okay, maybe, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (29:28):
Maybe even some things are kind of cringy.
SPEAKER_01 (29:30):
Yeah, yeah.
Exactly.
Oh, cringy will come.
There will be cringy.
There will be cringy.
Um but you know, even if there'ssomebody at the barn listening
to us while they're cleaningtheir stall or they're writing
in their arena, and if it justgives them insight or
confidence, because you know,you started writing at eight.
(29:53):
I started writing literally atforty eight.
I mean, there's gonna be peoplebetween the two of us.
Right.
And I just hope that uh, youknow, people listening to us
don't see us as these uhprofessional people who have
already gone through everythingand all you're gonna hear is
(30:15):
what we have to say at thehighest level.
SPEAKER_02 (30:18):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (30:18):
You know?
SPEAKER_02 (30:19):
Right.
That's not us.
We we had to figure it out.
SPEAKER_01 (30:21):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (30:22):
I mean, I did have trainers, but in a really big
way.
It was all self-motivated.
Right.
I did stuff that other peopledid not want to do.
SPEAKER_01 (30:29):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (30:29):
Yeah.
And I did it for reasons.
I think when you're in the showworld, um, you have to make a
decision at some point.
Do I move forward knowing thatI'm doing this for like the
detriment of my horse's mentalhealth?
Right.
And my own mental health.
Right.
And I came into the horse worldright about when, so I think I
mean, I was probably I was stilllike a junior rider in the early
(30:54):
90s.
And riding back then, like youhad to have a certain look.
It's kind of like ballet 15years ago, right?
It was like tall, white, skinnygirls did really, really well.
Okay, I've never been tall, andI've never been skinny, right?
So I didn't exactly fit in intothat mold.
Although I was a great rider, Ihave an amazing feel, I have
(31:17):
amazing um connection with thehorse.
I didn't always win um justbecause I didn't have that long
leg.
And I and I couldn't afford thehorse.
Like I couldn't afford thehorse.
Right.
Right?
I was always on these secondhands.
SPEAKER_01 (31:30):
Well, which is another podcast.
Is it the rider or is it thehorse?
No, I mean, is it the rider oris it the horse?
If you can afford the horse,you're gonna look like an
amazing rider.
Right.
Or do you get the horse you canafford and train it and you're
both amazing.
SPEAKER_02 (31:48):
Right.
Which which is what has happenedin my life, right?
And that there was thatdivergence.
Right.
Um, but you're exactly right,and I think that's actually what
turned me off from showing.
Right.
Was I could see that there werethese girls who were beating me
on these horses that theirparents paid for, you know,
$20,000,$30,000, and that wasnever gonna be me.
SPEAKER_01 (32:08):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:09):
And I knew that I was 10 times the writer.
SPEAKER_01 (32:11):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:11):
And we would go to these shows and the judges would
score them above me, and I wouldthink, you literally know
nothing.
Like I work my ass off wayharder.
I'm a I'm way better of awriter, I can handle so much
more.
SPEAKER_01 (32:22):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (32:22):
And that's actually what spurred me into getting
into dressage.
Because I felt like dressage wasmuch more of an individualized
sport in a way, and I get thatthere's still politics in that
world.
SPEAKER_01 (32:34):
Yeah, everywhere.
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
Everywhere, everywhere there's politics.
But that's how I got intodressage, and then I made the
conscious decision to do whatwas best for my horse.
Yeah, and he did not want to dodressage anymore.
He was like, you know what,let's just have fun.
And I said, Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (32:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (32:48):
And then that was us.
SPEAKER_01 (32:50):
Yes, and then we we got together.
And that's how we got together.
Yeah.
So I really, I really think thatum um people might enjoy our
crazy banter.
Our crazy banter.
And our tangents, because therewill be tangents and we will go
off topic.
Yeah.
Maybe.
SPEAKER_02 (33:09):
And maybe we can help you like walk you through
some of the things that we'vebeen through and some of the
hurdles that we faced and giveyou the confidence to try
something different and new foryou, for your horse, and we'll
just keep you company.
And we'll have a good time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:23):
Yes, we will keep you company while you are out
there mucking your stalls in theweather and trying to soak your
horse's foot because there's anabscess coming through and it
hasn't yet burst.
And you're just trying to standthere.
Yeah, well, we don't call themdamn horses, but we'll save that
for later.
All right.
We'll save that for later on.
SPEAKER_02 (33:41):
Well, thank you, Sandy, for our introduction
chat.
And we hope our listeners loveus.
All right.
Tootles.
Tootles.
Hey friends, that's the end oftoday's ride.
We hope you enjoyed listening.
Don't forget to follow SaddleTalk with Sandy and Cara
wherever you get your podcasts.
Please leave us a review, shareus with a friend, and saddle up
(34:02):
with us next time as we ridethrough more stories, questions,
and our wild tangents.
Till then, friends, keep yourboots dusty and your hard hats
on.
We hope to see you out on thetrail.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Dandy and Kara stir up swinging free, talking about
life and love and mystery.
From coyotes to coffee, they'llcover it all with the sagebrush
blowing and the wild birds call.
So cinch up your boots, we'rehitting the track, saddle talks
on, and we're not looking back.
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