September 8, 2025 • 33 mins
In this episode, I’m on the ground in Ngorongoro with the KopeLion team, and I walk into a situation that just completely blows my mind. I was heading into a Maasai Boma to take a portrait of one of the Ilchokuti (the lion guardians), when I was told I couldn't go in because his wife had literally just given birth inside their tiny home moments before! No doctors, no hospital, just the traditional midwives of the village. I was utterly blown away!
From there, I head off with the team that are treating some injured livestock, and you will not believe what was attacking them and biting their tails clean off - to have as an afternoon snack!
Join me as I spend the day with these incredible guardians, hearing their stories (with the help of my brilliant translator and friend, Kimani), and documenting the vital work they do to protect their communities and the lions they live alongside.
Get in touch via social media:Instagram: @bobbyjosafarisFacebook: Bobby-Jo Safaris
And to explore upcoming safaris: Bobby-Jo Safaris
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Safari Life with Bobby Jo, where you'll get a
front row seat to some of the most breathtaking wildlife
experiences on the planet. Bobby Jo's a wildlife
photographer and safari guide, leading photography tours to
incredible destinations like theSerengeti, Patagonia, India,
Antarctica and beyond. In this podcast, she shares
(00:21):
expert photography tips, behind the scenes stories, and insights
into Wildlife Conservation. If you'd like to learn more
about her tours and workshops, visit bobbyjoesafaris.com.
G'day Honey Badges. It's your chief honey badger.
Here, Bobby Joe this episode. I'm still with the wonderful
(00:43):
Kobe Line team and it's going tobe featuring a lot of the work
that I'm doing with them over the next week, collecting lots
of content for their social media and newsletters, website
documenting their really important work.
So join me whilst I travel around Gordon Goro.
It's a large place meeting all the from IL Chakuti and meeting
locals, helping with preparing boners and treating injured
(01:06):
livestock. It's going to be an incredible
week and I really want to take you on the journey with me.
So please do enjoy all my adventures with Kobe line.
Please note I'm going to be interviewing some of the IL
Chakuti who only speak Maasai. I'm going to have the wonderful
Kimani with me who's going to actually translate their answers
to my questions. So you're going to be hearing
(01:26):
some beautiful, rich dialect from the Ma language, and then
Kamani will present that in English for you all.
So yeah, don't give up on the episode if you're struggling to
understand them. Kamani is going to do all the
translating, so please enjoy that.
OK, we've arrived at Maasai Bomain quite a remote part of sort
of Gurunguru, and we're going tobe treating some goats for
(01:50):
attacks that have happened by baboons.
Baboons have attacked them, so we have to do some wound
treatments. This is going to be quite
interesting. People don't think of baboons
attacking livestock, but that happened.
So yeah, let's see how we go. These animals are so compliant.
They've got this sheep on its side.
It's not fighting and the rest of the sheep are standing
around. It's just it's like it knows
it's they're helping the baboon wound is is quite full on and
(02:14):
I'm just so impressed with theiranimal handling skills.
It's incredible. There's even a dog right here
with them. So we're just putting you say
Dettol. Yeah.
Dettol and hot. Is this hot water or caught
Baridi or? Yeah.
Baridi. Yeah, it's a cold water.
We're going to pop this Dettol onto the wound and clean it, and
then they're going to put like an alamycin spray, which is like
a blue spray used for livestock.So is this from a baboon bite
(02:37):
or. Right?
OK, Ouch. Is this a common thing for
baboons to attack? Yeah, Baboons are nasty.
Is it missing part of the tail or is it just just a wound?
Is that was that what their taillooks like They took The baboon
took off the tail. My word, you guys are doing a
great job of cleaning it. So we're walking into another
(02:59):
bone to treat another goat. Sorry.
Sheep. The sheep here look like goats.
They're fat tailed sheep but they look and sound like goats
to me. I've got a bit confused.
This one has also been bitten bya baboon.
It's much more fresh than the other one.
I'm still surprised that the baboons actually go up and grab
the sheep and then bite through their tail and take it and it's
(03:19):
like a little snack for them in the afternoon.
Like a sheeps tail. The baboons are incredible.
I mean, This is why I am petrified of them.
I have a very healthy respect for them that the one animal out
here that really does other thanBuffalo really does intimidate
me. So to set the scene right now,
I'm walking through very dry, dusty, windy environment.
(03:41):
There are goats and sheep. I think that was a goat.
There's goats and sheep, but definitely a goat.
Goats and sheep everywhere. There's all sorts of manure.
Cow patties, chic patties, goat patties, there's dogs running
around, there's donkeys, there'speople being a Mizungu, which
means white person. I've drawn a crowd.
So it's actually like a crowd ofkids following me and they're
(04:03):
quite fascinated about what I'm doing here.
But I've got my Kobe line shirt on, so I do look the part.
It's just blowing my mind seeingthe challenges they face, but
also for the wildlife, the challenges that they face.
So it's it's incredible space. OK, we're heading into
Endalelia. That's took me a lot to
pronounce that before I jumped on to record this.
And we're heading into his bomer.
(04:24):
He's very proud man. He wants me to take his.
Part of my job here is to take portraits.
He wants me to take portrait of him in his Bomer and we're going
to probably do the portrait inside.
So just a quick photographic tip, extreme ISO and aperture.
So I'm going to be probably shooting at 2.8.
Normally there's a little tiny bit of light that comes through
these really dark homes, and I just have this vision of having
(04:45):
this portrait of him with just this slither of light coming
through, lighting up his COPI line logo on his hoodie.
And yeah, you need probably like4 thousand 6400, ISO 2.8 and a
slow shutter speed, like a 25th of a second and get your subject
not to move. So yeah, stay tuned for the
photo. I'm about to go into the boma
now. It's designed for short people,
so it suits me fine. But yeah, be back with you in a
(05:08):
SEC. OK, So change of plans went to
go into the boma to photograph him.
And then he told me that his wife has just given birth.
So we decided not to go in there.
Of course, she's literally in there, has just given birth in a
tiny little boma with no medicalhelp or anything.
She's fine. And yeah, that has really blown
(05:30):
my mind. Kamani, his wife has just given
birth. Did she give birth here at home
or at the at the hospital? She she gave birth here.
Wow. Yeah.
And they we have midwives here who are traditionally very well
knowledgeable. Were you born in a hospital or
in in like a? I'm born in a bomb.
Wow, my muzungu brain is like crazy, you know, because in my
(05:52):
world it's, we always, you know,there's so much preparation for
birth and you go to hospital andsometimes women are in hospital
for like a long time. So someone's here to help
deliver. Like it's a midwife that helps
deliver the baby. Yes.
And does the husband stay with her or does it happens?
Is it private? It's private, it's mostly women
in the village. They come together, they take
care of the baby and they have the midwife, they have everybody
(06:16):
who helps and, and for a few weeks they help take care of the
baby until the mother is actually.
Wow. It's just crazy that I'm sitting
there taking photos and there's like a newborn baby in there and
a mum that's recovering. I mean, it's a very simple,
crazy, beautiful life that you guys have here.
Absolutely. So I am down in a really
(06:37):
beautiful area. What's the area called again?
Kimani. This is called anarua anarua or
barbal in Gorongoro. OK, it's a beautiful little area
where there's water. It's like a little Oasis and
there's all those sheep and goats and cattle come down here
to drink. And who are we with today?
We're here with Delilah. Hello.
Hello. And who else we got here?
(06:57):
We are here with lap. As well.
Hello. And rumors.
Hello, Rumours is the Joker of the Elchacuti, isn't he?
And the coordinator, coordinatorguys on this one.
OK, so Rumours is a Elchacuti coordinator, Yes.
And these guys here are Elchacuti, Yeah, OK.
And we're just going to ask themsome questions.
So Kimani's going to translate because they speak, most of them
(07:18):
speak Ma and we're going to, yeah, he's going to translate it
back. So I'd like to know how long
have they worked for Kopi line for?
Six years. Six years, OK.
I think I met you in 2019 actually, but you that's before
(07:40):
you. I think you were just starting
to work for Copy Line. OK, And what about rumors?
How long have you worked for Copy Line for?
Eight years. Eight years.
Wow. OK, now I want to know what's
your favorite part of the job is?
(08:10):
I. Says he's happy about being on
the job. Copper Lion has been helping a
(08:31):
lot with him. If he's sick, he gets the right
treatment and he's happy about that.
Also about the equipment that heuses out in the Bush.
OK, so it's changed his life. Yes.
What? About the other guys, how about
(08:53):
you? Luma.
(09:20):
So first of all, he's very happyabout having the ability to
treat wounds with the animals. As you know, these animals are
priced, they are valuable to thecommunity.
And it says that we get respect as a Jokuti.
Yeah, helping. From the community, from
helping, and that he finds that's very meaningful.
(09:41):
OK, Sour. Yeah, the fat tailed sheep that
we treated this morning for the baboon injury, how much would
that sheep be worth if you were to sell?
That. So that's about 120 a 130. 1000
there. Wow.
OK, So yeah, you say you're saving, you're helping people
save money, protect their assets.
Yeah, it's very important. So that must bring you a lot of
(10:03):
yeah respect. Yeah.
Well, and rumors. What is your favorite part about
working for copy line? I.
(11:10):
So rumor says we we started thiswork without really knowing
whether our goals will be met ofcoexisting and now having this
one treatment having reinforcingthe homes, also returning
livestock and generally taking care of livestock in the
(11:32):
community has brought us towardsour goals much closer.
So he's happy about that. Thank you for letting me join
you today and photograph your activities.
I really, I really appreciate it.
Thank you too. Yeah, I understood that.
How are you? So we've just got one more
(11:53):
photographic task for the assignment this morning.
And the noise you're hearing is all the cattle coming in with
their beautiful bells on. It's a sound that I love and I
find very comforting. It takes me straight back to
Gordon Guru. Like when I hear that sound
elsewhere or it's one of my favorite sounds in the world.
So strange, isn't it, that it's cows with their bells on.
(12:14):
But it's a company sound for me.It's the sound of Gordon Guru
and people living with wildlife.So the last shot that I have to
do this morning we've done. But right now I'm looking at
cows, sheep, goats and donkeys and people.
The last shot I have to do this morning is of the guys rounding
up cattle and sheep and herding.I better get cracking actually.
(12:37):
Hi guys, I'm with Mander, Masander again and Kimani and we
are on the Endolen Rd. not far from the crater.
We can see the crater from here and we're just catching up with
Ilchikuti, Mander and Mander. What's your favorite part of
working for Kopi Line? So he says since he started in
(13:09):
2018 he has seen a lot of different things, especially
when he's walking around and hastravelled to many other places.
And what's his zone that he takes care of and what lines are
in that area? What line?
What line was he tracking today where he said there was lions
(13:30):
close to the cattle and he had to move the cattle away, but was
who was the lion? Tell me about that.
So he's following up on with a colored female.
OK, how long has she been colored for?
(13:55):
She has been with the caller forthree months now.
Only three months Has she got herself into any Matata Any
trouble? Yeah, so she has been attacking
livestock, some she steals, somepeople find and actually chase
her away. Is she part of a big pride?
(14:21):
Yeah, so she, she's part of the pride of three sisters and she's
the colored one. And he talks about nasumbat.
Nasumbat, which was a colored female also who had a color
removed by hyenas after. Yes, as hyenas.
(14:45):
Naughty. OK, If you could thank Amanda
for me and for everyone for taking care of lions and keeping
people safe. It's such an important job and
let him know that we're so grateful for his work and
dedication. He's also thankful.
(15:09):
Thank you. Kimani and I are driving back to
headquarters to office on the edge of the crater.
We've had an incredible day. Kimani, are you happy with how
the day went? Yeah.
It was a great day. I met with these guys from
Balban, which is Rumas's zone, and we, yeah, we.
(15:31):
We had a great. Time.
Yeah. And I think we managed to get
like a lot of good photos to cover sort of the activities.
So we did wound treatment on a couple of goats and we did boma
repairs and sort of herding light lost livestock and also
some great portraits. Remember when we went to the
water point? Yeah.
And we had a lot of livestock and the guys were interrupting
(15:53):
with the the herders and we tooksome lovely, lovely portraits of
those guys. Yeah, I hope they're.
Lovely. Yeah, when I get home.
They enjoyed it. I think the the process is
really important that they they showed great interest.
Yeah, and even I've forgotten his name, sorry.
The one that wanted us, he wanted me to take go to his
(16:15):
Bomer and he wanted to be sit. He sat in the entrance the
doorway to his Bomer and really was proud to have his photo
taken with his family at the Bomer.
Yeah, that was Lelia. And Lelia, yeah.
Yeah, the oldest of them, OK. And usually the one the others
tease and play around with is he's a fun guy.
Yeah, this road, this road is sobad.
(16:36):
Yeah, call it Sana for driving on this road all day.
And we actually went into the Malanga Depression, which is a
huge kind of caldera across fromthe main crater, the main
caldera. And I was telling, I was telling
Kimani how years ago I called itaccidentally when I was with my
guests. I was trying to show off in
front of my guests with Feroz, and I accidentally called it the
(16:58):
ganja depression. And ganja is actually marijuana,
for those that don't know. So I'm calling it the Marijuana
depression. And as we were driving through
there today, I could smell this sweet, sweet smell.
As we were driving over the Melunja, I said to Kimani, what
is that? And he said, it's the ganja.
(17:21):
Yeah. It's been a really fun day.
Thanks, Kimani. It's it's been great.
Yeah. Thank you.
And what are we up to tomorrow? What's happening tomorrow?
So tomorrow will be with Lazaro,also checking on some community
work with him. Another one treatment and
possible bomb reinforcement. OK, so it's similar but just
similar but just different landscape.
(17:42):
Yeah, different landscape. Oh cool.
And we, yeah, we'll get to see the missing girl landscape as
well. And that's missing.
Here is where Kimani grew up. Yeah, yeah, the week's.
Gonna we'll have a call up as well with Dennis.
Cool, we're gonna have a call up, so we're gonna try to call
the line in again with Dennis, and it'd be great to get Dennis
chatting on here 'cause he's, I haven't got to talk to him yet,
(18:02):
so it'd be awesome. Yeah.
Alright, well, let's go home andrest.
Yeah. Thank you.
Morning, honey Badges. Kimani and I are out again in
the field. We're just above Masigio.
It's this beautiful lookout. It's one of my favorite spots in
Gordon Guru and where we've El Chikuchi coordinator Lazaro, who
I have actually known since like2017 or 18 I think.
(18:24):
He doesn't realize that though, but that's fine.
He's like one of my favorite Copy line staff members.
So good morning Lazaro. Good morning, Kamani, good
morning. We're going to ask Lazaro some
questions about his job. What is favorite part of your
job of working for Copy? Lion, he says.
(18:47):
I'm very happy about the conflict resolution that Copy
Lion has brought within the community to help people live
with the Lions. And how long has Lazaro been
working for Kopi Line? 11 years. 11 years.
Wow OK. When did he become an A
coordinator of the El Chikuti? He started being a coordinator
(19:11):
in 2017, but also he's a chairman of all the Chikuti.
Wow. Leading them and he started that
in 20. 19 and what are the challenges that he faces what
are. Some of the main challenges with
(19:43):
this role, some of the challenges including the staff,
some especially when following up on performance in work.
It sounds like a worldwide problem, yes.
And and also for some needs thatthey could have that we still
can't provide. Does he have a favorite line or
(20:07):
like collared line that he likesto track?
Like who's the main collared line that he would see?
It says for the past one we had calamus.
Oh yeah, he. Said he was happy about him.
He's a lion that did not cause alot of conflict.
(20:28):
But the present one is Norma Jane, which is a female.
Yep, a coloured female who doesn't also disturb the
livestock that much, so he likesthat.
OK, has Lazaro had direct conflict with Lions in his own
community and his own boma? Has he ever had that problem
before? So
(21:04):
he had issues with the Lions before a lot more in the past.
But also, he says, there's more cooperation with people now
since we, since the Copeland started having incentives,
especially the CIP program, and people started becoming more
(21:25):
cooperative and. Yeah.
And that program has finished now, but is it, are we hoping to
get it back off the ground in the future, the incentive
program? Yeah.
So that that's finished now and we're still, we're still
figuring out ways to do something similar, not
necessarily to that extent, but to have some incentive.
Could you please thank Lazaro for all his hard work and for
(21:46):
also letting me always take his photograph and I'm really
appreciative of all the hard work he does in helping
communities and lines. In Gurunguru.
(22:07):
So right now I'm deep in the Bush.
In what area am I helping you, Dennis?
It is Okuranga. Okuranga, here we go.
Now I've decided that Masai haveno way of telling distance.
They told me it was a 300 metre walk.
I think it was maybe over a kilometre, so I think they
pulled my leg on that one. I think maybe they said 3
(22:28):
kilometres, not 300 metres. So we're removing camera traps
and we have Morrison and Kimani here as well.
So how long we've been doing like a line survey here in in
Gordon Goro. How long has the survey been
going on for? Yeah, it is four months now.
And today is the last day. This is the last day.
OK, so we're collecting the camera traps.
Why did you choose this particular area to put a camera
(22:51):
trap? Yeah, is we chose this area
because of a place actually normal for the Lions.
Actually we have one lion, a colored lion called Langeju, who
actually is most of the time is coming around here.
OK, with two shy females, you'realso sighted sometimes.
OK, not actually getting good for us, but actually we know
(23:13):
that we are able. We have females lions here.
Are we standing in like a dry riverbed?
Is this there's sometimes water here when it rains?
Yeah, yeah, during the rainy season.
OK, so this is, this would be a basically like a way, what would
you call it? Like a a thoroughfare, like a
area where lions would cross through.
It's easier to to move through this area.
Yeah. So the camera trap was looked at
(23:34):
more soon. Checked it four days ago.
What kind of things have we beenfinding on it so far in the past
four months? Someone told me there's been
honey Badgers cited on the camera traps.
What sort of things have been cited on this camera trap?
So many things actually can think to have lion photos, yeah,
but sometimes you can have leopards in these cameras, yeah,
(23:56):
as well as honey badger and monkey for.
Monkeys. Monkeys come right up to the
camera trap. Take selfies.
Yeah, so actually so many animals.
But we've got good line sightings from these traps in
this particular spot. Yes.
Oh, that's great. And So what happens?
We bought all these camera trap footage.
We sent it all back to, is it Line Recovery Fund that's
(24:19):
organising the survey? Yeah.
And is a survey being done just in Tanzania or all over Africa?
Yeah, actually the survey is also I think in Tanzania, it's
done in Raha OK National Park actually also supported by Ryan
Recovery Fund. Yep, we decided to adopt the
model capture capture model, which actually is now like a
(24:41):
well known model for the surveys, not specifically for
lions, but for the Wildlife Service.
OK. And Lengeju's college, so he was
probably pretty easy to see on the on the camera trap.
Have you been in all the areas that there's camera traps in
Gurunguru? Has there been areas that you've
been surprised that there's beenlots of activity?
Many of the places which we replaced the cameras are not
(25:04):
much surprising activities, OK, because many of the activities
we, we, we actually think that we might see this happening in
this area. And you said that livestock have
been coming through here as well, so you're seeing the Masai
and their cattle come through past the camera traps.
Passing through this camera. It'd be really interesting to
see. Imagine like you're looking at
the video footage on the computer, on the laptops and you
(25:26):
see the cattle. The, you know, the cattle come
past and then like 20 minutes later a lion comes past, like
that kind of thing. I guess we'll have a look at the
footage later today. But have you, have you seen a
honey badger on the trap yet? You know I'm obsessed with honey
badges, right? Yeah, I think in, in any camera
traps in OK. Great.
All right, awesome. Well, we're going to walk 300
(25:48):
meters back up the hill now. Yeah, they might have to carry
me, but yeah. OK, cool.
Thank you. Thank you.
They might have to carry me, butyeah.
OK, cool. Thank you.
Thank you. So I'm we've Kimani and Moss on
and we've just removed your camera trap from I think it was
around 2 kilometers maybe. Anyway, so I'm a little bit out
(26:09):
of breath that we're going to talk to Mohsen about his job at
Kopi Lyon. He is an Ilchikuti, is that
correct? Yes.
What makes you proud to be part of Kopi Lyon?
(26:32):
So Mosun is very excited and happy about protecting the lions
and the livestock so that they're not being attacked by
lions. And how long has Mossan worked
for Kopi Lion? Latino when I humid.
Yeah. So he's four to five years, OK.
(26:54):
And he started in 2021. Has Mossan, have you seen many
lions in this area with your owneyes when you've been walking
around and sort of patrolling and looking out?
Yeah, he has seen quite often. And what lions would be in his
area? Yeah, so he has too often
(27:27):
visitors, colored lions and. Right, yeah, I heard like so.
Language was a my word. Yeah, and the third visitor who
frequented this area was lobby, now doesn't have.
(27:47):
The colour, yeah. Lobby's colour dropped back in
February. Yeah.
What does language mean? It.
Has 2 meanings. Yeah.
(28:09):
OK, the name of the place? Yeah, yeah.
And. The.
Other the leg. A leg.
Yeah, it has a big. OK, interesting.
Cool. Yeah.
All right. Well, thank you very much for
all the hard work that you do helping protect people.
And lines. Morning honey badges.
(28:34):
I'm here with Los Syrian and Kimani and we're above Lakey.
I see. You can probably hear the cows
in the background now. Los Syrian is one of my
favourite Jakuti. I know I keep saying that every
time I meet the guys in the field.
Lucerian, how long have you beenworking for Kopi Line?
Four years. And what zone do you take care
of? Yes, Silver.
Are you good at tracking the lines?
Yeah, we saw many. Yeah, were you born here?
(28:56):
I born at Misigio. Misigio, which is beautiful.
That's where Kimani was born. Yeah, yeah.
What is your favorite? What is the best part of your
job? Yeah, he he loves the part of
(29:22):
his job that he takes care of livestock and the lions, and he
sees that having lions and livestock together can benefit
the community. Yeah, absolutely.
That seems to be a common theme of what their what their
favorite parts of their jobs are.
We are also thankful for all thehard work that you do, Lasseri,
(29:42):
And it's very important work. And I think all of us can, yeah,
want to say thank you to you foryour hard, your dedication to
Kopi Lyon. Thank you to you.
Hello again, I am now with Bellas and Sillo down.
Which area are we in? Kimani, sorry.
This is an apoku that which is close to legacy overlooking
legacy. OK.
(30:03):
And lucky I see there is a different tribe of people that
live down there, nomadic de Toga, and I've been lucky enough
to spend time with them and they're also Ilchakutis.
So we have Silo and Balas here now.
How long have you guys been working for Kopi Line?
Balas has about four years now, so now Silo has almost six
(30:27):
years. Wow, Kumbe.
OK. And what's your favorite part of
your job working for Kopi Line? The benefit he gets like
(30:48):
including the equipment that they have to for for their work,
including the clothing, the the boots and everything.
They look very smart in their kopi lion outfits.
OK, what about you Balas? What is your favorite part of?
(31:18):
The job. So Bala says that he the most
important thing he has seen and that he's happy about is Kobe
Lion has brought in the knowledge or the technology to
(31:40):
know where the lions are and forthem as a Djokuti to follow the
lions and mitigate conflict between lions and livestock.
But he also says that they they treat wounds in the community
and that he's very happy about it.
Brings friendship, he says, of people and wildlife.
(32:03):
That's a wonderful, beautiful answer.
Thank you. And you'll notice in this, if
you've been listening to this podcast and noticed a different
dialect that's happening. Kimani has mostly been speaking
and translating in Ma, which is the language of the Maasai.
And today we're actually using Swahili because our lovely De
Toga friends speak a different language.
What's that language called again?
(32:27):
It's called Datoga. Yeah.
So that's DATOGA. So completely different tribe,
but wonderful people. And I'm.
I'm sorry, Kimani. I think they win with the
jewelry. I think their jewelry is much
more. I don't know.
I'm attracted to their jewelry. Let them know.
(32:49):
Thank you for all that you guys do.
Thank you very much for your hard work.
Hey there, honey. Badges.
I. Really hope you enjoyed.
That episode, just as much as I enjoyed being there with those
incredible people in that beautiful landscape, when I'm
with the Kobe Line team, I'm probably at my happiest.
I love connecting with them and I love being able to showcase
their incredible work. Next episode we're going to be
(33:11):
back with the Kobe Line team andyou're invited to attend a very
special meeting that I had the absolute privilege of being at
with the Maasai elders in in Dutu in the Southern Serengeti.
It's quite a controversial meeting, a little bit sensitive,
all about lying, killings and how we can inspire the younger
generation of Maasai to not be involved with them.
So make sure you tune in on the next episode of Safari Life.
(33:32):
With Bobby Jo. If you enjoyed this episode, be
sure to hit the follow button soyou never miss an adventure.
You can keep up with Bobby Jo's wildlife photography and safari
journeys on Instagram and Facebook at Bobby Joe Safaris.
And if you'd love to join one ofher photography tours or
workshops, you can find all the details at bobbyjoesafaris.com.
Welcome to Safari Life with Bobby Jo, where you'll get a
front row seat to some of the most breathtaking wildlife
experiences on the planet. Bobby Jo's a wildlife
photographer and safari guide, leading photography tours to
incredible destinations like theSerengeti, Patagonia, India,
Antarctica and beyond. In this podcast, she shares
(00:21):
expert photography tips, behind the scenes stories, and insights
into Wildlife Conservation. If you'd like to learn more
about her tours and workshops, visit bobbyjoesafaris.com.
G'day Honey Badges. It's your chief honey badger.
Here, Bobby Joe this episode. I'm still with the wonderful
(00:43):
Kobe Line team and it's going tobe featuring a lot of the work
that I'm doing with them over the next week, collecting lots
of content for their social media and newsletters, website
documenting their really important work.
So join me whilst I travel around Gordon Goro.
It's a large place meeting all the from IL Chakuti and meeting
locals, helping with preparing boners and treating injured
(01:06):
livestock. It's going to be an incredible
week and I really want to take you on the journey with me.
So please do enjoy all my adventures with Kobe line.
Please note I'm going to be interviewing some of the IL
Chakuti who only speak Maasai. I'm going to have the wonderful
Kimani with me who's going to actually translate their answers
to my questions. So you're going to be hearing
(01:26):
some beautiful, rich dialect from the Ma language, and then
Kamani will present that in English for you all.
So yeah, don't give up on the episode if you're struggling to
understand them. Kamani is going to do all the
translating, so please enjoy that.
OK, we've arrived at Maasai Bomain quite a remote part of sort
of Gurunguru, and we're going tobe treating some goats for
(01:50):
attacks that have happened by baboons.
Baboons have attacked them, so we have to do some wound
treatments. This is going to be quite
interesting. People don't think of baboons
attacking livestock, but that happened.
So yeah, let's see how we go. These animals are so compliant.
They've got this sheep on its side.
It's not fighting and the rest of the sheep are standing
around. It's just it's like it knows
it's they're helping the baboon wound is is quite full on and
(02:14):
I'm just so impressed with theiranimal handling skills.
It's incredible. There's even a dog right here
with them. So we're just putting you say
Dettol. Yeah.
Dettol and hot. Is this hot water or caught
Baridi or? Yeah.
Baridi. Yeah, it's a cold water.
We're going to pop this Dettol onto the wound and clean it, and
then they're going to put like an alamycin spray, which is like
a blue spray used for livestock.So is this from a baboon bite
(02:37):
or. Right?
OK, Ouch. Is this a common thing for
baboons to attack? Yeah, Baboons are nasty.
Is it missing part of the tail or is it just just a wound?
Is that was that what their taillooks like They took The baboon
took off the tail. My word, you guys are doing a
great job of cleaning it. So we're walking into another
(02:59):
bone to treat another goat. Sorry.
Sheep. The sheep here look like goats.
They're fat tailed sheep but they look and sound like goats
to me. I've got a bit confused.
This one has also been bitten bya baboon.
It's much more fresh than the other one.
I'm still surprised that the baboons actually go up and grab
the sheep and then bite through their tail and take it and it's
(03:19):
like a little snack for them in the afternoon.
Like a sheeps tail. The baboons are incredible.
I mean, This is why I am petrified of them.
I have a very healthy respect for them that the one animal out
here that really does other thanBuffalo really does intimidate
me. So to set the scene right now,
I'm walking through very dry, dusty, windy environment.
(03:41):
There are goats and sheep. I think that was a goat.
There's goats and sheep, but definitely a goat.
Goats and sheep everywhere. There's all sorts of manure.
Cow patties, chic patties, goat patties, there's dogs running
around, there's donkeys, there'speople being a Mizungu, which
means white person. I've drawn a crowd.
So it's actually like a crowd ofkids following me and they're
(04:03):
quite fascinated about what I'm doing here.
But I've got my Kobe line shirt on, so I do look the part.
It's just blowing my mind seeingthe challenges they face, but
also for the wildlife, the challenges that they face.
So it's it's incredible space. OK, we're heading into
Endalelia. That's took me a lot to
pronounce that before I jumped on to record this.
And we're heading into his bomer.
(04:24):
He's very proud man. He wants me to take his.
Part of my job here is to take portraits.
He wants me to take portrait of him in his Bomer and we're going
to probably do the portrait inside.
So just a quick photographic tip, extreme ISO and aperture.
So I'm going to be probably shooting at 2.8.
Normally there's a little tiny bit of light that comes through
these really dark homes, and I just have this vision of having
(04:45):
this portrait of him with just this slither of light coming
through, lighting up his COPI line logo on his hoodie.
And yeah, you need probably like4 thousand 6400, ISO 2.8 and a
slow shutter speed, like a 25th of a second and get your subject
not to move. So yeah, stay tuned for the
photo. I'm about to go into the boma
now. It's designed for short people,
so it suits me fine. But yeah, be back with you in a
(05:08):
SEC. OK, So change of plans went to
go into the boma to photograph him.
And then he told me that his wife has just given birth.
So we decided not to go in there.
Of course, she's literally in there, has just given birth in a
tiny little boma with no medicalhelp or anything.
She's fine. And yeah, that has really blown
(05:30):
my mind. Kamani, his wife has just given
birth. Did she give birth here at home
or at the at the hospital? She she gave birth here.
Wow. Yeah.
And they we have midwives here who are traditionally very well
knowledgeable. Were you born in a hospital or
in in like a? I'm born in a bomb.
Wow, my muzungu brain is like crazy, you know, because in my
(05:52):
world it's, we always, you know,there's so much preparation for
birth and you go to hospital andsometimes women are in hospital
for like a long time. So someone's here to help
deliver. Like it's a midwife that helps
deliver the baby. Yes.
And does the husband stay with her or does it happens?
Is it private? It's private, it's mostly women
in the village. They come together, they take
care of the baby and they have the midwife, they have everybody
(06:16):
who helps and, and for a few weeks they help take care of the
baby until the mother is actually.
Wow. It's just crazy that I'm sitting
there taking photos and there's like a newborn baby in there and
a mum that's recovering. I mean, it's a very simple,
crazy, beautiful life that you guys have here.
Absolutely. So I am down in a really
(06:37):
beautiful area. What's the area called again?
Kimani. This is called anarua anarua or
barbal in Gorongoro. OK, it's a beautiful little area
where there's water. It's like a little Oasis and
there's all those sheep and goats and cattle come down here
to drink. And who are we with today?
We're here with Delilah. Hello.
Hello. And who else we got here?
(06:57):
We are here with lap. As well.
Hello. And rumors.
Hello, Rumours is the Joker of the Elchacuti, isn't he?
And the coordinator, coordinatorguys on this one.
OK, so Rumours is a Elchacuti coordinator, Yes.
And these guys here are Elchacuti, Yeah, OK.
And we're just going to ask themsome questions.
So Kimani's going to translate because they speak, most of them
(07:18):
speak Ma and we're going to, yeah, he's going to translate it
back. So I'd like to know how long
have they worked for Kopi line for?
Six years. Six years, OK.
I think I met you in 2019 actually, but you that's before
(07:40):
you. I think you were just starting
to work for Copy Line. OK, And what about rumors?
How long have you worked for Copy Line for?
Eight years. Eight years.
Wow. OK, now I want to know what's
your favorite part of the job is?
(08:10):
I. Says he's happy about being on
the job. Copper Lion has been helping a
(08:31):
lot with him. If he's sick, he gets the right
treatment and he's happy about that.
Also about the equipment that heuses out in the Bush.
OK, so it's changed his life. Yes.
What? About the other guys, how about
(08:53):
you? Luma.
(09:20):
So first of all, he's very happyabout having the ability to
treat wounds with the animals. As you know, these animals are
priced, they are valuable to thecommunity.
And it says that we get respect as a Jokuti.
Yeah, helping. From the community, from
helping, and that he finds that's very meaningful.
(09:41):
OK, Sour. Yeah, the fat tailed sheep that
we treated this morning for the baboon injury, how much would
that sheep be worth if you were to sell?
That. So that's about 120 a 130. 1000
there. Wow.
OK, So yeah, you say you're saving, you're helping people
save money, protect their assets.
Yeah, it's very important. So that must bring you a lot of
(10:03):
yeah respect. Yeah.
Well, and rumors. What is your favorite part about
working for copy line? I.
(11:10):
So rumor says we we started thiswork without really knowing
whether our goals will be met ofcoexisting and now having this
one treatment having reinforcingthe homes, also returning
livestock and generally taking care of livestock in the
(11:32):
community has brought us towardsour goals much closer.
So he's happy about that. Thank you for letting me join
you today and photograph your activities.
I really, I really appreciate it.
Thank you too. Yeah, I understood that.
How are you? So we've just got one more
(11:53):
photographic task for the assignment this morning.
And the noise you're hearing is all the cattle coming in with
their beautiful bells on. It's a sound that I love and I
find very comforting. It takes me straight back to
Gordon Guru. Like when I hear that sound
elsewhere or it's one of my favorite sounds in the world.
So strange, isn't it, that it's cows with their bells on.
(12:14):
But it's a company sound for me.It's the sound of Gordon Guru
and people living with wildlife.So the last shot that I have to
do this morning we've done. But right now I'm looking at
cows, sheep, goats and donkeys and people.
The last shot I have to do this morning is of the guys rounding
up cattle and sheep and herding.I better get cracking actually.
(12:37):
Hi guys, I'm with Mander, Masander again and Kimani and we
are on the Endolen Rd. not far from the crater.
We can see the crater from here and we're just catching up with
Ilchikuti, Mander and Mander. What's your favorite part of
working for Kopi Line? So he says since he started in
(13:09):
2018 he has seen a lot of different things, especially
when he's walking around and hastravelled to many other places.
And what's his zone that he takes care of and what lines are
in that area? What line?
What line was he tracking today where he said there was lions
(13:30):
close to the cattle and he had to move the cattle away, but was
who was the lion? Tell me about that.
So he's following up on with a colored female.
OK, how long has she been colored for?
(13:55):
She has been with the caller forthree months now.
Only three months Has she got herself into any Matata Any
trouble? Yeah, so she has been attacking
livestock, some she steals, somepeople find and actually chase
her away. Is she part of a big pride?
(14:21):
Yeah, so she, she's part of the pride of three sisters and she's
the colored one. And he talks about nasumbat.
Nasumbat, which was a colored female also who had a color
removed by hyenas after. Yes, as hyenas.
(14:45):
Naughty. OK, If you could thank Amanda
for me and for everyone for taking care of lions and keeping
people safe. It's such an important job and
let him know that we're so grateful for his work and
dedication. He's also thankful.
(15:09):
Thank you. Kimani and I are driving back to
headquarters to office on the edge of the crater.
We've had an incredible day. Kimani, are you happy with how
the day went? Yeah.
It was a great day. I met with these guys from
Balban, which is Rumas's zone, and we, yeah, we.
(15:31):
We had a great. Time.
Yeah. And I think we managed to get
like a lot of good photos to cover sort of the activities.
So we did wound treatment on a couple of goats and we did boma
repairs and sort of herding light lost livestock and also
some great portraits. Remember when we went to the
water point? Yeah.
And we had a lot of livestock and the guys were interrupting
(15:53):
with the the herders and we tooksome lovely, lovely portraits of
those guys. Yeah, I hope they're.
Lovely. Yeah, when I get home.
They enjoyed it. I think the the process is
really important that they they showed great interest.
Yeah, and even I've forgotten his name, sorry.
The one that wanted us, he wanted me to take go to his
(16:15):
Bomer and he wanted to be sit. He sat in the entrance the
doorway to his Bomer and really was proud to have his photo
taken with his family at the Bomer.
Yeah, that was Lelia. And Lelia, yeah.
Yeah, the oldest of them, OK. And usually the one the others
tease and play around with is he's a fun guy.
Yeah, this road, this road is sobad.
(16:36):
Yeah, call it Sana for driving on this road all day.
And we actually went into the Malanga Depression, which is a
huge kind of caldera across fromthe main crater, the main
caldera. And I was telling, I was telling
Kimani how years ago I called itaccidentally when I was with my
guests. I was trying to show off in
front of my guests with Feroz, and I accidentally called it the
(16:58):
ganja depression. And ganja is actually marijuana,
for those that don't know. So I'm calling it the Marijuana
depression. And as we were driving through
there today, I could smell this sweet, sweet smell.
As we were driving over the Melunja, I said to Kimani, what
is that? And he said, it's the ganja.
(17:21):
Yeah. It's been a really fun day.
Thanks, Kimani. It's it's been great.
Yeah. Thank you.
And what are we up to tomorrow? What's happening tomorrow?
So tomorrow will be with Lazaro,also checking on some community
work with him. Another one treatment and
possible bomb reinforcement. OK, so it's similar but just
similar but just different landscape.
(17:42):
Yeah, different landscape. Oh cool.
And we, yeah, we'll get to see the missing girl landscape as
well. And that's missing.
Here is where Kimani grew up. Yeah, yeah, the week's.
Gonna we'll have a call up as well with Dennis.
Cool, we're gonna have a call up, so we're gonna try to call
the line in again with Dennis, and it'd be great to get Dennis
chatting on here 'cause he's, I haven't got to talk to him yet,
(18:02):
so it'd be awesome. Yeah.
Alright, well, let's go home andrest.
Yeah. Thank you.
Morning, honey Badges. Kimani and I are out again in
the field. We're just above Masigio.
It's this beautiful lookout. It's one of my favorite spots in
Gordon Guru and where we've El Chikuchi coordinator Lazaro, who
I have actually known since like2017 or 18 I think.
(18:24):
He doesn't realize that though, but that's fine.
He's like one of my favorite Copy line staff members.
So good morning Lazaro. Good morning, Kamani, good
morning. We're going to ask Lazaro some
questions about his job. What is favorite part of your
job of working for Copy? Lion, he says.
(18:47):
I'm very happy about the conflict resolution that Copy
Lion has brought within the community to help people live
with the Lions. And how long has Lazaro been
working for Kopi Line? 11 years. 11 years.
Wow OK. When did he become an A
coordinator of the El Chikuti? He started being a coordinator
(19:11):
in 2017, but also he's a chairman of all the Chikuti.
Wow. Leading them and he started that
in 20. 19 and what are the challenges that he faces what
are. Some of the main challenges with
(19:43):
this role, some of the challenges including the staff,
some especially when following up on performance in work.
It sounds like a worldwide problem, yes.
And and also for some needs thatthey could have that we still
can't provide. Does he have a favorite line or
(20:07):
like collared line that he likesto track?
Like who's the main collared line that he would see?
It says for the past one we had calamus.
Oh yeah, he. Said he was happy about him.
He's a lion that did not cause alot of conflict.
(20:28):
But the present one is Norma Jane, which is a female.
Yep, a coloured female who doesn't also disturb the
livestock that much, so he likesthat.
OK, has Lazaro had direct conflict with Lions in his own
community and his own boma? Has he ever had that problem
before? So
(21:04):
he had issues with the Lions before a lot more in the past.
But also, he says, there's more cooperation with people now
since we, since the Copeland started having incentives,
especially the CIP program, and people started becoming more
(21:25):
cooperative and. Yeah.
And that program has finished now, but is it, are we hoping to
get it back off the ground in the future, the incentive
program? Yeah.
So that that's finished now and we're still, we're still
figuring out ways to do something similar, not
necessarily to that extent, but to have some incentive.
Could you please thank Lazaro for all his hard work and for
(21:46):
also letting me always take his photograph and I'm really
appreciative of all the hard work he does in helping
communities and lines. In Gurunguru.
(22:07):
So right now I'm deep in the Bush.
In what area am I helping you, Dennis?
It is Okuranga. Okuranga, here we go.
Now I've decided that Masai haveno way of telling distance.
They told me it was a 300 metre walk.
I think it was maybe over a kilometre, so I think they
pulled my leg on that one. I think maybe they said 3
(22:28):
kilometres, not 300 metres. So we're removing camera traps
and we have Morrison and Kimani here as well.
So how long we've been doing like a line survey here in in
Gordon Goro. How long has the survey been
going on for? Yeah, it is four months now.
And today is the last day. This is the last day.
OK, so we're collecting the camera traps.
Why did you choose this particular area to put a camera
(22:51):
trap? Yeah, is we chose this area
because of a place actually normal for the Lions.
Actually we have one lion, a colored lion called Langeju, who
actually is most of the time is coming around here.
OK, with two shy females, you'realso sighted sometimes.
OK, not actually getting good for us, but actually we know
(23:13):
that we are able. We have females lions here.
Are we standing in like a dry riverbed?
Is this there's sometimes water here when it rains?
Yeah, yeah, during the rainy season.
OK, so this is, this would be a basically like a way, what would
you call it? Like a a thoroughfare, like a
area where lions would cross through.
It's easier to to move through this area.
Yeah. So the camera trap was looked at
(23:34):
more soon. Checked it four days ago.
What kind of things have we beenfinding on it so far in the past
four months? Someone told me there's been
honey Badgers cited on the camera traps.
What sort of things have been cited on this camera trap?
So many things actually can think to have lion photos, yeah,
but sometimes you can have leopards in these cameras, yeah,
(23:56):
as well as honey badger and monkey for.
Monkeys. Monkeys come right up to the
camera trap. Take selfies.
Yeah, so actually so many animals.
But we've got good line sightings from these traps in
this particular spot. Yes.
Oh, that's great. And So what happens?
We bought all these camera trap footage.
We sent it all back to, is it Line Recovery Fund that's
(24:19):
organising the survey? Yeah.
And is a survey being done just in Tanzania or all over Africa?
Yeah, actually the survey is also I think in Tanzania, it's
done in Raha OK National Park actually also supported by Ryan
Recovery Fund. Yep, we decided to adopt the
model capture capture model, which actually is now like a
(24:41):
well known model for the surveys, not specifically for
lions, but for the Wildlife Service.
OK. And Lengeju's college, so he was
probably pretty easy to see on the on the camera trap.
Have you been in all the areas that there's camera traps in
Gurunguru? Has there been areas that you've
been surprised that there's beenlots of activity?
Many of the places which we replaced the cameras are not
(25:04):
much surprising activities, OK, because many of the activities
we, we, we actually think that we might see this happening in
this area. And you said that livestock have
been coming through here as well, so you're seeing the Masai
and their cattle come through past the camera traps.
Passing through this camera. It'd be really interesting to
see. Imagine like you're looking at
the video footage on the computer, on the laptops and you
(25:26):
see the cattle. The, you know, the cattle come
past and then like 20 minutes later a lion comes past, like
that kind of thing. I guess we'll have a look at the
footage later today. But have you, have you seen a
honey badger on the trap yet? You know I'm obsessed with honey
badges, right? Yeah, I think in, in any camera
traps in OK. Great.
All right, awesome. Well, we're going to walk 300
(25:48):
meters back up the hill now. Yeah, they might have to carry
me, but yeah. OK, cool.
Thank you. Thank you.
They might have to carry me, butyeah.
OK, cool. Thank you.
Thank you. So I'm we've Kimani and Moss on
and we've just removed your camera trap from I think it was
around 2 kilometers maybe. Anyway, so I'm a little bit out
(26:09):
of breath that we're going to talk to Mohsen about his job at
Kopi Lyon. He is an Ilchikuti, is that
correct? Yes.
What makes you proud to be part of Kopi Lyon?
(26:32):
So Mosun is very excited and happy about protecting the lions
and the livestock so that they're not being attacked by
lions. And how long has Mossan worked
for Kopi Lion? Latino when I humid.
Yeah. So he's four to five years, OK.
(26:54):
And he started in 2021. Has Mossan, have you seen many
lions in this area with your owneyes when you've been walking
around and sort of patrolling and looking out?
Yeah, he has seen quite often. And what lions would be in his
area? Yeah, so he has too often
(27:27):
visitors, colored lions and. Right, yeah, I heard like so.
Language was a my word. Yeah, and the third visitor who
frequented this area was lobby, now doesn't have.
(27:47):
The colour, yeah. Lobby's colour dropped back in
February. Yeah.
What does language mean? It.
Has 2 meanings. Yeah.
(28:09):
OK, the name of the place? Yeah, yeah.
And. The.
Other the leg. A leg.
Yeah, it has a big. OK, interesting.
Cool. Yeah.
All right. Well, thank you very much for
all the hard work that you do helping protect people.
And lines. Morning honey badges.
(28:34):
I'm here with Los Syrian and Kimani and we're above Lakey.
I see. You can probably hear the cows
in the background now. Los Syrian is one of my
favourite Jakuti. I know I keep saying that every
time I meet the guys in the field.
Lucerian, how long have you beenworking for Kopi Line?
Four years. And what zone do you take care
of? Yes, Silver.
Are you good at tracking the lines?
Yeah, we saw many. Yeah, were you born here?
(28:56):
I born at Misigio. Misigio, which is beautiful.
That's where Kimani was born. Yeah, yeah.
What is your favorite? What is the best part of your
job? Yeah, he he loves the part of
(29:22):
his job that he takes care of livestock and the lions, and he
sees that having lions and livestock together can benefit
the community. Yeah, absolutely.
That seems to be a common theme of what their what their
favorite parts of their jobs are.
We are also thankful for all thehard work that you do, Lasseri,
(29:42):
And it's very important work. And I think all of us can, yeah,
want to say thank you to you foryour hard, your dedication to
Kopi Lyon. Thank you to you.
Hello again, I am now with Bellas and Sillo down.
Which area are we in? Kimani, sorry.
This is an apoku that which is close to legacy overlooking
legacy. OK.
(30:03):
And lucky I see there is a different tribe of people that
live down there, nomadic de Toga, and I've been lucky enough
to spend time with them and they're also Ilchakutis.
So we have Silo and Balas here now.
How long have you guys been working for Kopi Line?
Balas has about four years now, so now Silo has almost six
(30:27):
years. Wow, Kumbe.
OK. And what's your favorite part of
your job working for Kopi Line? The benefit he gets like
(30:48):
including the equipment that they have to for for their work,
including the clothing, the the boots and everything.
They look very smart in their kopi lion outfits.
OK, what about you Balas? What is your favorite part of?
(31:18):
The job. So Bala says that he the most
important thing he has seen and that he's happy about is Kobe
Lion has brought in the knowledge or the technology to
(31:40):
know where the lions are and forthem as a Djokuti to follow the
lions and mitigate conflict between lions and livestock.
But he also says that they they treat wounds in the community
and that he's very happy about it.
Brings friendship, he says, of people and wildlife.
(32:03):
That's a wonderful, beautiful answer.
Thank you. And you'll notice in this, if
you've been listening to this podcast and noticed a different
dialect that's happening. Kimani has mostly been speaking
and translating in Ma, which is the language of the Maasai.
And today we're actually using Swahili because our lovely De
Toga friends speak a different language.
What's that language called again?
(32:27):
It's called Datoga. Yeah.
So that's DATOGA. So completely different tribe,
but wonderful people. And I'm.
I'm sorry, Kimani. I think they win with the
jewelry. I think their jewelry is much
more. I don't know.
I'm attracted to their jewelry. Let them know.
(32:49):
Thank you for all that you guys do.
Thank you very much for your hard work.
Hey there, honey. Badges.
I. Really hope you enjoyed.
That episode, just as much as I enjoyed being there with those
incredible people in that beautiful landscape, when I'm
with the Kobe Line team, I'm probably at my happiest.
I love connecting with them and I love being able to showcase
their incredible work. Next episode we're going to be
(33:11):
back with the Kobe Line team andyou're invited to attend a very
special meeting that I had the absolute privilege of being at
with the Maasai elders in in Dutu in the Southern Serengeti.
It's quite a controversial meeting, a little bit sensitive,
all about lying, killings and how we can inspire the younger
generation of Maasai to not be involved with them.
So make sure you tune in on the next episode of Safari Life.
(33:32):
With Bobby Jo. If you enjoyed this episode, be
sure to hit the follow button soyou never miss an adventure.
You can keep up with Bobby Jo's wildlife photography and safari
journeys on Instagram and Facebook at Bobby Joe Safaris.
And if you'd love to join one ofher photography tours or
workshops, you can find all the details at bobbyjoesafaris.com.
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