July 2, 2025 • 30 mins
Episode 179. This week, John and Timothy explore another brand profile: Hououbiden from Kobayashi Shuzo in Tochigi Prefecture. How does a brewery go from the edge of bankruptcy to become a coveted cult sake? To quote Huey Lewis, that's the power of love! This brewery is managed by the rare combination of a husband who is the brewery president and a wife who is the Master Brewer/Toji. The sake they make is etherial and elegant. Today's tasting - the Hououbiden "Asahi Mai" Junmai Daiginjo - left Timothy speechless... and John was thrilled - with the sake! Join us as we explore the flavors and compelling story of Hououbiden together! #SakeRevolution
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
John Puma (00:21):
Hello everybody, and welcome to Sake Revolution.
This is America's first sakepodcast.
I am your host, John.
Puma from the Sake Notes.
I'm also the guy who made theInternet Sake Discord, as well
as the lead mod over at Redditsr slash sake community.
I.
Timothy Sullivan (00:41):
And I'm your host, Timothy Sullivan.
I'm a Sake Samurai.
I'm the Director of Education atthe Sake Studies Center, as well
as the founder of the Urban Sakewebsite.
And every week John and I willbe here tasting and chatting
about all things sake and doingour best to make it fun and easy
to understand.
John Puma (01:01):
Well, hello Tim.
How are you doing this week?
Timothy Sullivan (01:05):
I'm doing great.
How about yourself, jp?
John Puma (01:07):
Mm, no complaints.
No complaints at all.
Just, uh, you know, living thedream.
You know, another day, anothersake podcast, another day,
another Sake podcast.
And, the one thing I'm, I'mreally happy about today,'We're
doing a branded episode, Tim.
Timothy Sullivan (01:26):
Yes, we are diving into a brand, kind of
telling the story of the brandand I'm very excited for these
episodes.
They're always a lot of fun.
I.
John Puma (01:38):
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (01:39):
I always say that sake is, I always say that
sake is more than just liquid ina bottle.
It's all about the people whomake it, you know?
John Puma (01:46):
yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (01:47):
these episodes allow us to explore that a
little bit.
John Puma (01:51):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you know, we typically dothese branded episodes when a,
uh, when a new sake that's got,that's kind of got some hype
behind it, shows up on ourshores.
And, uh, as time goes on, it's,it's harder to get those because
it, a lot more sake makes it to,makes it to the United States,
which is wonderful.
Uh, but.
(02:12):
Here's one that, that did catchon really nicely.
Got got a lot of momentum behindit in Japan, and now it is
finally here.
And Tim, you want to tell thegood people at home what brand
we're talking about?
Timothy Sullivan (02:27):
Yes, we are gonna be tasting a Junmai
Daiginjo from Hououbiden, andthat's made by Kobayashi Shuzo,
and they're located in TochigiPrefecture.
I.
So Hououbiden is a well-knownbrand and I think it kind of has
a reputation for being a littlebit hard to get and a very
(02:53):
luxurious style, and they reallyvalue local rice production in
their sake as well.
John Puma (03:00):
Yeah, uh, I had, I, I had heard all of those things
actually.
Um, and it's really nice thatyou know when you have a sake,
that is hard to find in Japan.
It is often.
Trickier to find here when theydo bring it over.
So we're very fortunate that wewere able to get our hands on a
(03:22):
bottle.
Uh, and in full disclosure, thiswas actually, gifted to us for
the show by the importer.
Thank you very much to the folksover at, uh, Sake Suki for, and
we has this bottle ofHououbiden.
Timothy Sullivan (03:36):
I think the brand story is amazing.
The brewery was founded in 1872,and it's been in the Kobayashi
family.
I.
Since then and the most recent,uh, president to take over has
been Masaki Kobayashi, and he'sthe fifth generation of the
(03:59):
family to run this brewery
John Puma (04:01):
All right.
Timothy Sullivan (04:03):
Now.
one thing that is reallyinteresting is that he came back
in like 1995 to take over aspresident.
And from what I've read online,Kobayashi Shuzo was on the verge
of bankruptcy.
John Puma (04:20):
Uh, oh.
Timothy Sullivan (04:21):
They were not in a good way.
They were not in a good way.
John Puma (04:24):
That, that's a story we hear, uh, occasionally where,
The previous generation, uh,they're having a rough time, and
then the next gen comes in and,and they, they're, they're
taking the reins in, in a reallyperilous position.
Uh, so what, so what happenednext to get us to where we're at
now?
Timothy Sullivan (04:42):
Yeah.
Well this story has a veryinteresting twist.
John Puma (04:46):
Ooh.
I like twist endings.
Timothy Sullivan (04:48):
Yes.
And it involves a love story aswell.
So, uh, Mr.
Kobayashi actually met his.
Future wife and she happens tobe involved in the sake brewing
business as well.
She was an instructor at theIwate Prefectural Brewers
(05:13):
Institute, which is the,Technical Institute connected to
the Nanbu Toji.
So the Nanbu Toji is the largestToji group in Japan, and it's
connected to Iwate.
So, he met Mayumi, they fell inlove, and they got married.
So not only was Mr.
Kobayashi running a brewery,but.
(05:34):
The life partner he ended upwith also was an instructor and
had amazing skills in makingsake.
So what happened next was thathe, you know, Mr.
Kobayashi took over the breweryin 1995, and there was already a
Toji there.
The husband was a new presidentand the wife was a brewing
(05:57):
instructor from the Iwate.
Brewers Institute, but they hadso much respect for the existing
Toji that the wife didn't takeon any role at the brewery
immediately.
But after five years, theydecided that, she should become
the Toji.
So she stepped in as Toji andthat's when things at the
(06:20):
brewery shifted dramaticallyand.
The style of their sake becamemore modern.
So she brought in modern brewingtechniques and she brought in
new ways of approaching brewingHououbiden, and that was a huge
shift.
(06:40):
And after that, the sake becamemuch more sought after and
started winning awards andbecame like more of a cult sake
after.
The husband and wife teamstarted working together to make
the sake.
John Puma (06:57):
Nice.
That's awesome.
I, I, it's, I love these storiesof, of these breweries that, you
know, they're, they're on theropes and then they make a
change.
And they're able to just, Makethis like wonderful comeback
story and uh, and now they'vegot this like really Sought
after sake that's being exportedto the U.S.
that's great.
Timothy Sullivan (07:16):
Yeah.
And in 2022 they actually builta new facility to, Make the
modern production methods thatthey're using.
So they still have the old,their main brewery where
traditional sake Brewing iscarried out.
But in 2022, they built theHishogura, which is their modern
brewing facility.
And I think out of thatfacility, a lot of their
(07:38):
award-winning sakes have comeand uh, it's been.
A real turnaround story to gofrom the verge of bankruptcy in
1995 to winning gold medals andbeing a sought after cult sake.
these years later,
John Puma (07:57):
Yeah.
That's awesome.
That's fantastic.
good for them.
I'm so glad to hear that.
Timothy Sullivan (08:02):
I I just wanted to mention one last
thing.
I mean, there are not a lot offemale.
Tojis or master brewers inJapan.
So Mayumi Mayumi is contributinggreatly to the success of this
brand.
And I think it has to beacknowledged that this is a rare
situation where it's a husbandand wife team, the husband is
(08:23):
the president, the wife is themaster brewer, and that's just
not something you see every day.
John Puma (08:30):
No, it's a, it's a feel good idea.
You know, it's a feel goodstory.
Timothy Sullivan (08:34):
but what do you talk about at the dinner
table?
It's like, the, the Moromitemperature was this, that,
blah, blah, blah.
Well, this brand is very soughtafter and we were super lucky to
receive the sake as a sample totaste.
On today's podcast.
I'm thrilled to be featuringthis.
(08:55):
I've never had this particularone before, so we're both gonna
be reacting and, uh, the sakethat we have from Hououbiden is
the Asahi Mai.
It's a Junmai Daiginjo.
G And John, do you, do you wannagive us the stats for this sake?
John Puma (09:11):
Sure.
Now, if, if at home you heard,uh, Asahi Mai and thought, Mai,
that sounds like rice.
Uh, you are absolutely correct.
This is in addition to the nameof the sake.
It's actually the name of therice that's used here.
So I'm gonna jump right intothat and we'll, we'll backtrack
a tiny bit.
This is using, uh.
Asahi Mai from Okayama,apparently Asahi Mai Very, very
(09:35):
difficult to cultivate, not easyto get along with, is this rice.
So, uh, they're putting in a lotof work, a lot of effort to
bring this, uh, to bring this tous.
As Tim mentioned, this is from,uh, Kobayashi Shuzo over in
Tochigi Prefecture.
Lots of good sake coming outTochigi these days, I
Timothy Sullivan (09:56):
Oh yeah.
John Puma (09:57):
Yeah, that Asahi Mai is milled down to 50% of its
original size.
The yeast is listed as houseyeast, so I'm assuming that that
is something proprietary to themor do you think they're doing
something ambient?
Probably proprietary right.
Timothy Sullivan (10:10):
Proprietary.
John Puma (10:11):
Yeah.
that's, that's my thought.
Uh, I don't think, I don't thinkthe, the flavor profile is, uh,
matched up with a ambient yeastfor this one.
Unfortunately we don't have sakemeter value for this.
Ones it's a little under wraps,much like the yeast and, but we
do know that the A BV is 16%'cause that's the law.
They have to tell us that.
Timothy Sullivan (10:32):
All right, so the, the only thing I have to
add is that this, this sake ricecalled Asahi Mai, the only other
thing I know about it.
It is that it is a non crossbredheirloom variety.
like omachi, like omachi beencrossbred and is like an
original heirloom strain.
Uh, I've read that Asahi MaiAsahi Rice is a.
(10:57):
Also a non crossbred heirloomstrain.
And I think that is one of thereasons it's so difficult to
cultivate and to grow, it hasn'tbeen crossbred to facilitate.
Different, um, things to make iteasier to work with as a farmer.
So this is an original heirloomstrain and uh, that's one thing
(11:18):
I read about this particularsake, and I think that's why
they want to feature the rice soprominently in the branding.
I.
John Puma (11:25):
Right.
Yeah.
It's very important to notethat, when people are
cross-breeding and trying tomake new types of rice, it's not
just for flavor.
It's not just to try and, changehow the sake tastes necessarily.
It's also very important formaking it easier to cultivate
because you get larger.
If you get larger yields, you'reable to make more sake at a
lower price.
(11:45):
Uh, this is, you know, whenyou're using the original stuff,
it becomes a little bit moredifficult and more expensive.
Okay.
So Tim, let's take a look atthis label real fast.
so this is, it is dark.
This is a, this is a, like a, avery dark bottle, almost a black
bottle.
And the label is, is black andthe lettering is dark gray.
(12:05):
It is.
Um, it is.
They, they're going for like amood, right.
Timothy Sullivan (12:09):
John.
I think the kids call it a vibe.
John Puma (12:11):
It's a vibe.
Oh,
Timothy Sullivan (12:12):
It's a vibe.
John Puma (12:13):
Sorry kids.
I screwed it up.
The Hououbiden Kanji though is,uh, isn't like silver, which is
very nice.
It's a shiny,
Timothy Sullivan (12:23):
Yeah.
John Puma (12:24):
cool.
I think this, this label mightbe, I.
For the Western market.
It's like a, a one piecewraparound label.
It might be a Western marketlabel.
but I am excited to get this inthe glass.
Timothy Sullivan (12:36):
And there's also, there's also a phoenix on
the label.
John Puma (12:40):
Oh yeah.
Is that what that
Timothy Sullivan (12:41):
there's a bird.
So the phoenix is the, ofcourse, the symbol of rebirth.
And um, I think they use thatphoenix icon or iconography in
all of their branding.
So it must be tied to theirbrand, um, which is very cool.
Yeah.
John Puma (12:58):
Yeah,
Timothy Sullivan (12:59):
All right.
Should we get this open and inthe glass?
John Puma (13:02):
we absolutely should.
Timothy Sullivan (13:03):
Alright.
All right, I've got it in theglass.
Let's give this a smell as weusually do.
Hmm.
John Puma (13:18):
Ooh.
Timothy Sullivan (13:20):
Very subtle,
John Puma (13:22):
Very.
Timothy Sullivan (13:22):
elegant.
This is not showy, is it?
John Puma (13:29):
No.
No, it's not.
It's nice though.
It's got that.
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (13:35):
It's lovely.
John Puma (13:36):
I'm having a really hard time identifying
Timothy Sullivan (13:39):
Hmm.
John Puma (13:40):
this.
What do you think?
What do you get outta this?
Timothy Sullivan (13:45):
Well, I think the aromatics are very subtle,
very clean.
Uh, there's a hint of somethingthat could be a whisper of
fruitiness, but there's almostlike an incense quality to it.
John Puma (14:04):
Yeah, I was gonna say like annise or something like
that.
Timothy Sullivan (14:07):
Hmm,
John Puma (14:08):
I was worried I'd be misusing the word anise.
Something almost, almost mintyon the nose.
I don't know what it is.
But when you said, um, when yousaid incense, that I think that
that's, that might be what I wasdetecting.
Timothy Sullivan (14:23):
Yeah.
And I don't mean like, you know,hardcore Catholic church
incense.
I'm talking like wafting waftingJapanese incense from the tea
house next door house next door.
John Puma (14:38):
Alright.
Timothy Sullivan (14:38):
Hmm.
Yeah.
It's got something verypleasant, but light and, uh, it,
it's a very gentle aroma.
John Puma (14:48):
Extremely.
Alright.
Are you ready for a sip?
Timothy Sullivan (14:51):
let's taste.
Hmm.
So good.
John Puma (14:58):
That's nice.
There's a, the, there's awonderful little like bite of
acidity on the finish there thatI am a big fan of.
Timothy Sullivan (15:10):
I think for me, bite is too strong a
John Puma (15:12):
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (15:13):
This is very silky and it has like a velvety
texture.
It's soft.
And again, it, it's not.
In any way overtly fruity ortropical fruit or any of that?
It's very, um, reserved.
Reserved elegance is like theword that comes to mind.
(15:34):
It's like, um, very silky smoothand hints at, um, maybe apple or
some kind of fruitiness, butvery restrained and very, very
elegant.
It's.
So much about the texture for mehere.
Very velvety and delicious.
(15:55):
Not heavy at all.
Uh, it's 16% alcohol.
There's, it says Genshu.
So there's no water added tothis, even though it's brewed to
a lower alcohol level.
And, I think that this rice, thespecial rice they're using, the
Asahi Mai is contributing tosome of these flavors that we're
having a hard time reallypinning down.
I think this goes back to thatoriginal heirloom, non crossbred
(16:20):
rice.
So it may be that we'rediscovering the flavors of this
Asahi rice.
John Puma (16:25):
I think you're right and I, I think that one of the
things that's the most fun aboutthis, that it is sort of like.
Subverting expectations in away.
You know, you're having thisDaiginjo, you're expecting like,
oh, it's gonna be fruity andblah, blah, blah.
Fruity and light.
And like in this, it's like,it's, there is some sort of a
fruit here.
But it's a very, differentstyle, much like I'm agreeing
(16:46):
with you a hundred percent.
Uh, is that, this is, it's veryunusual and I like it a lot.
It's very challenging.
it's very challenging todescribe the flavor while, um,
while being extremely comfortingfrom a texture standpoint.
Like we've been down the roadwith Silky, wonderfully
textured, sake like this before.
(17:06):
But the, the taste here is justso, Hmm.
It's just so, There's so much toexplore and unpack.
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (17:15):
Yeah, it's interesting, when sakes are
bold.
In your face loud, there's nodisputing like what's going on.
But when you have a sake likethis that is so restrained and
so elegant, and it's not in yourface,
John Puma (17:31):
It's so much more difficult.
Timothy Sullivan (17:34):
It, it's difficult to find the words, to
find the descriptors to, to,give it its justice, you know,
when in a, in describing how itis.
but I think, um, for me, thetexture is so.
Subtle and elegant.
It is not, I think if, if youdescribe it in a way that you
(17:55):
say, oh, it's elegant, it'srestrained.
Some people might think, oh,it's probably too boring for me,
but no way this, there's so muchto explore.
I.
John Puma (18:03):
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (18:04):
And again, I think it's, it's an unknown rice
to us kind of coming through onthe palate and it doesn't taste
rice or grainy at all, so it'snot like a traditional rice
flavor coming across.
But I think that is giving itthe depth of flavor that we're
kind of trying to describe.
I think it's coming from thatAsahi Mai Rice.
John Puma (18:25):
Yeah, I think that, This is really interesting to me
because we've been doing thisshow for a very long time now,
and outside of that, I've beentasting sake with you for even
longer, and I've, I've neverseen you, at a loss for words
for trying to describe whatyou're experiencing when you're
tasting a sake before, not likethis.
And I think that's amazing thatthis sake is here and it's, and
(18:48):
it's able to do that.
you know, you've had things thatyou didn't like that maybe you
didn't wanna describe, but thisis something that you're really
enjoying and really having ahard time with.
I think that's like fascinating.
Timothy Sullivan (19:03):
I.
I think it's good to bechallenged sometimes and try to
dig around and, you know, uh,I'm tasting this for the first
time and it's true sometimeswhen you are evaluating a sake,
you have to go back to it asecond time, a third time
experience it, uh, maybe do afood pairing with it.
(19:26):
So I'm not at all.
Perturbed by, you know, notbeing able to nail down a flavor
or aroma that we're both like,aha.
I think it's fine to, to exploreand, revisit down the road
again.
But it's important to say thatthis is extremely delicious.
Like it is really good.
And sometimes you don't need toknow why something tastes good
(19:50):
as long as you're enjoying it.
Right?
John Puma (19:52):
I think that's absolutely true.
It's just such a hard sake todescribe.
It doesn't, it doesn't fit intothe nice little bubbles and
little compartments that we havein our minds for a lot of sakes,
that tastes like that are ofthis type.
it's a lot of fun to, to delveinto something new.
Timothy Sullivan (20:09):
Yeah, well I do have a tasting note from the
brand.
Should we read that and see whatthey say?
John Puma (20:17):
I am very curious to see what they say.
Yes, absolutely.
Timothy Sullivan (20:21):
So they say the muscat driven Ginjo aroma
introduces a vibrant bouquetthat is beautifully
complimented, by the balancedUmami and refreshing
characteristic of Asahi rice.
The palate offers a rich depthwith a light crisp base, making
it both approachable andversatile.
The flavor remains stable whencooled, ensuring a consistent
(20:44):
and high quality experience inevery glass.
So they don't go into muchdetail.
They gave us musk, they saidmuscat driven aroma.
John Puma (20:54):
No, I'm gonna,
Timothy Sullivan (20:58):
Yeah.
It's not as Muscat grapey as Iwould think, but
John Puma (21:04):
Right.
When I hear Driven, I'm I'mthinking it's, it's, you know,
it's, taking the wheel.
Uh, no, this is, it's subtlythere.
Um, and it's not something Ipicked up on earlier, but, yeah,
I do like how even they avoidedspecific known fruit.
Descriptors that like don'treally apply to this sake.
The sake's different.
It's fun and different.
(21:24):
It's, it is all these thingsthat they described it as though
Timothy Sullivan (21:28):
Yeah.
John Puma (21:29):
really nice.
So, I wanna know, uh, what youthink about food with this since
is this.
Yeah.
So we've got texture, thetexture here.
You got that silky, elegant laaha.
Oh, it's so wonderful.
and then you've got this, this,this really nice, Restrained
crisp sake.
What are you thinking?
Timothy Sullivan (21:47):
Hmm.
Well, my mind immediately goesto lighter, cleaner dishes.
I think that if you were havingsushi or sashimi, this would be
an amazing sake to have with it.
I think that anything from theraw bar, like shrimp cocktail,
oysters on the half shell, crablegs, all my, my standard go-tos
(22:08):
poached fish as well.
I think that seafood would bethe best friend of this sake,
basically.
John Puma (22:14):
Yeah.
I immediately, my mindimmediately went to sushi
usually sushi is so light andthis would be such a great
compliment to, to so much ofthat sushi and sashimi.
Other types of, I, I would lovelike a, like a, like a white
fish with a really mild, sauce.
I think that would be like a,like a broiled, broiled white
fish would be amazing with this.
(22:35):
I think the two of them would gofabulously together.
Let's see.
They recommend.
Let's take a look out.
They recommended sushi andsashimi.
Okay.
Alright.
Uh, steamed vegetables, salads,uh, citrus based dressings.
Oh, okay.
I'm a, I'm a fan of citrus baseddressings.
I can see that going well withthis.
And they recommend this, Chilledin a wine class.
(22:57):
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (22:58):
Yeah.
John Puma (22:59):
Yeah.
We're doing it right, Tim.
Timothy Sullivan (23:01):
All right.
That's good.
Well, I, I think now that I'vethought about it for a little
bit, I think that there areother sakes that I often pair
with sushi and sashimi that areclean, crisp, and they are, dry.
You know, they are a little morebracing.
This has a, a depth of flavor toit that brings more dimension
(23:28):
and.
This one has that, a very subtlerice flavor from the Asahi Mai
that gives it a depth of flavor.
Even though it's so restrainedand elegant, there's a depth
going on.
And I think that, uh, that justbrings a little more to the
party when it comes to layeringflavors with a food pairing.
(23:50):
You know what I mean?
John Puma (23:51):
Yeah, I think I do.
And I agree.
I'm like so excited to try thiswith food now.
Like that's, um, that's my maintakeaway from this is like, you
know, I'm not the pairing guy.
I'm the sit on the couch anddrink the sake guy.
We've talked about this before,but like, this sake makes me so
excited to try it with food.
I am.
(24:12):
I'm gonna do some, I'm gonna dosome experiments for the next
week, I think, and just kind ofevery dish I have, I'm gonna
pour a little bit of this andsee how it goes.
Like, I am really excited to seewhat happens with this.
It just, it, it seems likethere's a lot of fun
possibilities.
Timothy Sullivan (24:27):
Yeah, and I'm intrigued by the subtlety of
this sake.
It's so delicious.
It's a ultra premium JunmaiDaiginjo, but it has this
subtleness to it that makes youwant to look in the glass and
study it.
Like that's what's getting me.
It's like, oh my gosh, thistastes so good.
What's going on?
(24:48):
And it's the combination of thegentle fruitiness with the rice
flavor at a super premium levelthat I think is really grabbing
me.
Yeah, it's really good.
John Puma (24:58):
I agree a hundred percent.
It is, um, it's been a whilesince I've had a sake that was,
uh, so.
so different yet.
So just, I want more, you know,it's, you know what I mean?
It's like, it's such a, it's aunique flavor and a, and a
wonderful combination, of theflavor and the texture and the,
and the Crispness.
And I'm just, I just want toexplore this and, and have so
(25:22):
much of it and try it and seewhat's going on.
Like it's, um, I just feel likeI can get a lot out of this
sake.
Timothy Sullivan (25:28):
Yeah, it's appealing, it's elegant, but I
think it's fair to say that thisis also food friendly for a
Junmai Daiginjo.
John Puma (25:37):
Uh, yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And note, note that my firstinstinct wasn't, I'm taking this
to the couch.
I'll see you later.
This is my first instinct was Ineed to try this with some food.
Timothy Sullivan (25:47):
So, uh, the brand again is Hououbiden.
It's a little difficult to sayHououbiden
John Puma (25:55):
that doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.
Timothy Sullivan (25:57):
Hououbiden
John Puma (25:58):
Hououbiden
Timothy Sullivan (26:00):
Hououbiden.
But I'm really excited to trymore sakes from this brand.
Now what about you?
John Puma (26:07):
Absolutely.
Um, I'm, I would be lying if Isaid I haven't tried another
sake from this brand.
'cause I very much have, andthey are honestly, they're, the
other ones I've had from themhave been wonderful and elegant,
but they were a little easier toput into a box where you're just
like, this is, you know, thisone's very nice and fruity.
It's got a really, you know, awonderful mouth feel, et cetera,
(26:29):
et cetera.
Like there was, they were easierto, for me to just kind of like
go like, okay, this is, this isthis style, this is that style.
Whereas this one for me is justsuch a, just a different style.
It's a new style for me.
Really nice.
Timothy Sullivan (26:46):
Yeah, I think, one thing I didn't mention
earlier is that I think theirwater comes from an underground
source, so, that might mean thattheir water has a bit more
minerality and that might add tosome of the layering in the sake
as well.
That's just, I'm, I'm taking a,a guess here, but I did read
that they're, they use anunderground water source.
(27:08):
And, I think that might play arole in some of the depth of
flavor and layering that we'regetting here.
But I'm excited to try more fromthis brand for sure.
So John, do you know any of theother sakes that, sake Suki is
bringing in from Hououbiden?.
John Puma (27:25):
Yes.
So, um, in addition to this oneis the, uh, Asahi Mai.
They've also got the, uh, sakeMirai, which is that, uh, that
wonderful sake rice that wasoriginally cultivated in, uh, if
I'm not mistaken, in theYamagata.
I think this is a.
Uh, Juyondai's Rice, and thenalso the black Phoenix, which
I've, I've definitely had, uh,in Japan before.
(27:46):
And that is Aiyama.
So Aiyama starting to come into,starting to come into the
States.
I'm very excited.
I am, it's been a long timecoming.
Timothy Sullivan (27:55):
We know you're an Aiyama fanboy
John Puma (27:57):
I am a fan boy.
This is, this is the truth.
I'm not gonna attempt in any wayto disguise that.
I am 100% a fanboy, unabashed.
Timothy Sullivan (28:08):
Alright, well, sounds like we're gonna have to
get that Aiyama sake fromHououbiden on the show at some
point in the future, but thiswas a fun look into this brewery
and a very interesting setupwith a married couple being
president and Toji and anintriguing sake.
(28:28):
So just, uh, really interestingall around.
John Puma (28:32):
Yeah.
Good times, and I'm, and I'm.
Glad to see this one, in theStates.
It's just, it's always, it'salways exciting when new stuff
comes to our shores.
Timothy Sullivan (28:42):
Yeah.
Well thanks to you, John.
Thanks for tasting thisintriguing sake with me.
Special thank you to Sake Sukifor, Providing this sake for us
to taste today, and I wanna saya special hello and thank you to
all of our listeners, butespecially the members of our
Patreon community.
If you're interested insupporting Sake Revolution, we
(29:04):
do have a Patreon.
You can visit us atpatreon.com/sakerevolution and
join our community.
We do a live happy hour.
Every month where you can talkto us and sip sake with us.
So if you'd like to, uh, chatwith us in person, join our
Patreon, and we look forward tomeeting you.
There
John Puma (29:23):
And if you've got a question for Tim and I here, or
maybe a show suggestion, ormaybe we flub something and you
need to correct us, that's veryimportant too.
Timothy Sullivan (29:31):
it, it happens.
John Puma (29:33):
It does happen from time to time.
uh, we wanna hear from youthough.
Uh, reach out to us.
We've got an email address.
It'sfeedback@sakerevolution.com.
The website also has a littleform you can fill out to send us
messages directly.
You can also slide into our dmson Facebook or Instagram.
(29:53):
until next time though, pleaseremember to keep a drinking
sake.
And Kanapi.
Hello everybody, and welcome to Sake Revolution.
This is America's first sakepodcast.
I am your host, John.
Puma from the Sake Notes.
I'm also the guy who made theInternet Sake Discord, as well
as the lead mod over at Redditsr slash sake community.
I.
Timothy Sullivan (00:41):
And I'm your host, Timothy Sullivan.
I'm a Sake Samurai.
I'm the Director of Education atthe Sake Studies Center, as well
as the founder of the Urban Sakewebsite.
And every week John and I willbe here tasting and chatting
about all things sake and doingour best to make it fun and easy
to understand.
John Puma (01:01):
Well, hello Tim.
How are you doing this week?
Timothy Sullivan (01:05):
I'm doing great.
How about yourself, jp?
John Puma (01:07):
Mm, no complaints.
No complaints at all.
Just, uh, you know, living thedream.
You know, another day, anothersake podcast, another day,
another Sake podcast.
And, the one thing I'm, I'mreally happy about today,'We're
doing a branded episode, Tim.
Timothy Sullivan (01:26):
Yes, we are diving into a brand, kind of
telling the story of the brandand I'm very excited for these
episodes.
They're always a lot of fun.
I.
John Puma (01:38):
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (01:39):
I always say that sake is, I always say that
sake is more than just liquid ina bottle.
It's all about the people whomake it, you know?
John Puma (01:46):
yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (01:47):
these episodes allow us to explore that a
little bit.
John Puma (01:51):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you know, we typically dothese branded episodes when a,
uh, when a new sake that's got,that's kind of got some hype
behind it, shows up on ourshores.
And, uh, as time goes on, it's,it's harder to get those because
it, a lot more sake makes it to,makes it to the United States,
which is wonderful.
Uh, but.
(02:12):
Here's one that, that did catchon really nicely.
Got got a lot of momentum behindit in Japan, and now it is
finally here.
And Tim, you want to tell thegood people at home what brand
we're talking about?
Timothy Sullivan (02:27):
Yes, we are gonna be tasting a Junmai
Daiginjo from Hououbiden, andthat's made by Kobayashi Shuzo,
and they're located in TochigiPrefecture.
I.
So Hououbiden is a well-knownbrand and I think it kind of has
a reputation for being a littlebit hard to get and a very
(02:53):
luxurious style, and they reallyvalue local rice production in
their sake as well.
John Puma (03:00):
Yeah, uh, I had, I, I had heard all of those things
actually.
Um, and it's really nice thatyou know when you have a sake,
that is hard to find in Japan.
It is often.
Trickier to find here when theydo bring it over.
So we're very fortunate that wewere able to get our hands on a
(03:22):
bottle.
Uh, and in full disclosure, thiswas actually, gifted to us for
the show by the importer.
Thank you very much to the folksover at, uh, Sake Suki for, and
we has this bottle ofHououbiden.
Timothy Sullivan (03:36):
I think the brand story is amazing.
The brewery was founded in 1872,and it's been in the Kobayashi
family.
I.
Since then and the most recent,uh, president to take over has
been Masaki Kobayashi, and he'sthe fifth generation of the
(03:59):
family to run this brewery
John Puma (04:01):
All right.
Timothy Sullivan (04:03):
Now.
one thing that is reallyinteresting is that he came back
in like 1995 to take over aspresident.
And from what I've read online,Kobayashi Shuzo was on the verge
of bankruptcy.
John Puma (04:20):
Uh, oh.
Timothy Sullivan (04:21):
They were not in a good way.
They were not in a good way.
John Puma (04:24):
That, that's a story we hear, uh, occasionally where,
The previous generation, uh,they're having a rough time, and
then the next gen comes in and,and they, they're, they're
taking the reins in, in a reallyperilous position.
Uh, so what, so what happenednext to get us to where we're at
now?
Timothy Sullivan (04:42):
Yeah.
Well this story has a veryinteresting twist.
John Puma (04:46):
Ooh.
I like twist endings.
Timothy Sullivan (04:48):
Yes.
And it involves a love story aswell.
So, uh, Mr.
Kobayashi actually met his.
Future wife and she happens tobe involved in the sake brewing
business as well.
She was an instructor at theIwate Prefectural Brewers
(05:13):
Institute, which is the,Technical Institute connected to
the Nanbu Toji.
So the Nanbu Toji is the largestToji group in Japan, and it's
connected to Iwate.
So, he met Mayumi, they fell inlove, and they got married.
So not only was Mr.
Kobayashi running a brewery,but.
(05:34):
The life partner he ended upwith also was an instructor and
had amazing skills in makingsake.
So what happened next was thathe, you know, Mr.
Kobayashi took over the breweryin 1995, and there was already a
Toji there.
The husband was a new presidentand the wife was a brewing
(05:57):
instructor from the Iwate.
Brewers Institute, but they hadso much respect for the existing
Toji that the wife didn't takeon any role at the brewery
immediately.
But after five years, theydecided that, she should become
the Toji.
So she stepped in as Toji andthat's when things at the
(06:20):
brewery shifted dramaticallyand.
The style of their sake becamemore modern.
So she brought in modern brewingtechniques and she brought in
new ways of approaching brewingHououbiden, and that was a huge
shift.
(06:40):
And after that, the sake becamemuch more sought after and
started winning awards andbecame like more of a cult sake
after.
The husband and wife teamstarted working together to make
the sake.
John Puma (06:57):
Nice.
That's awesome.
I, I, it's, I love these storiesof, of these breweries that, you
know, they're, they're on theropes and then they make a
change.
And they're able to just, Makethis like wonderful comeback
story and uh, and now they'vegot this like really Sought
after sake that's being exportedto the U.S.
that's great.
Timothy Sullivan (07:16):
Yeah.
And in 2022 they actually builta new facility to, Make the
modern production methods thatthey're using.
So they still have the old,their main brewery where
traditional sake Brewing iscarried out.
But in 2022, they built theHishogura, which is their modern
brewing facility.
And I think out of thatfacility, a lot of their
(07:38):
award-winning sakes have comeand uh, it's been.
A real turnaround story to gofrom the verge of bankruptcy in
1995 to winning gold medals andbeing a sought after cult sake.
these years later,
John Puma (07:57):
Yeah.
That's awesome.
That's fantastic.
good for them.
I'm so glad to hear that.
Timothy Sullivan (08:02):
I I just wanted to mention one last
thing.
I mean, there are not a lot offemale.
Tojis or master brewers inJapan.
So Mayumi Mayumi is contributinggreatly to the success of this
brand.
And I think it has to beacknowledged that this is a rare
situation where it's a husbandand wife team, the husband is
(08:23):
the president, the wife is themaster brewer, and that's just
not something you see every day.
John Puma (08:30):
No, it's a, it's a feel good idea.
You know, it's a feel goodstory.
Timothy Sullivan (08:34):
but what do you talk about at the dinner
table?
It's like, the, the Moromitemperature was this, that,
blah, blah, blah.
Well, this brand is very soughtafter and we were super lucky to
receive the sake as a sample totaste.
On today's podcast.
I'm thrilled to be featuringthis.
(08:55):
I've never had this particularone before, so we're both gonna
be reacting and, uh, the sakethat we have from Hououbiden is
the Asahi Mai.
It's a Junmai Daiginjo.
G And John, do you, do you wannagive us the stats for this sake?
John Puma (09:11):
Sure.
Now, if, if at home you heard,uh, Asahi Mai and thought, Mai,
that sounds like rice.
Uh, you are absolutely correct.
This is in addition to the nameof the sake.
It's actually the name of therice that's used here.
So I'm gonna jump right intothat and we'll, we'll backtrack
a tiny bit.
This is using, uh.
Asahi Mai from Okayama,apparently Asahi Mai Very, very
(09:35):
difficult to cultivate, not easyto get along with, is this rice.
So, uh, they're putting in a lotof work, a lot of effort to
bring this, uh, to bring this tous.
As Tim mentioned, this is from,uh, Kobayashi Shuzo over in
Tochigi Prefecture.
Lots of good sake coming outTochigi these days, I
Timothy Sullivan (09:56):
Oh yeah.
John Puma (09:57):
Yeah, that Asahi Mai is milled down to 50% of its
original size.
The yeast is listed as houseyeast, so I'm assuming that that
is something proprietary to themor do you think they're doing
something ambient?
Probably proprietary right.
Timothy Sullivan (10:10):
Proprietary.
John Puma (10:11):
Yeah.
that's, that's my thought.
Uh, I don't think, I don't thinkthe, the flavor profile is, uh,
matched up with a ambient yeastfor this one.
Unfortunately we don't have sakemeter value for this.
Ones it's a little under wraps,much like the yeast and, but we
do know that the A BV is 16%'cause that's the law.
They have to tell us that.
Timothy Sullivan (10:32):
All right, so the, the only thing I have to
add is that this, this sake ricecalled Asahi Mai, the only other
thing I know about it.
It is that it is a non crossbredheirloom variety.
like omachi, like omachi beencrossbred and is like an
original heirloom strain.
Uh, I've read that Asahi MaiAsahi Rice is a.
(10:57):
Also a non crossbred heirloomstrain.
And I think that is one of thereasons it's so difficult to
cultivate and to grow, it hasn'tbeen crossbred to facilitate.
Different, um, things to make iteasier to work with as a farmer.
So this is an original heirloomstrain and uh, that's one thing
(11:18):
I read about this particularsake, and I think that's why
they want to feature the rice soprominently in the branding.
I.
John Puma (11:25):
Right.
Yeah.
It's very important to notethat, when people are
cross-breeding and trying tomake new types of rice, it's not
just for flavor.
It's not just to try and, changehow the sake tastes necessarily.
It's also very important formaking it easier to cultivate
because you get larger.
If you get larger yields, you'reable to make more sake at a
lower price.
(11:45):
Uh, this is, you know, whenyou're using the original stuff,
it becomes a little bit moredifficult and more expensive.
Okay.
So Tim, let's take a look atthis label real fast.
so this is, it is dark.
This is a, this is a, like a, avery dark bottle, almost a black
bottle.
And the label is, is black andthe lettering is dark gray.
(12:05):
It is.
Um, it is.
They, they're going for like amood, right.
Timothy Sullivan (12:09):
John.
I think the kids call it a vibe.
John Puma (12:11):
It's a vibe.
Oh,
Timothy Sullivan (12:12):
It's a vibe.
John Puma (12:13):
Sorry kids.
I screwed it up.
The Hououbiden Kanji though is,uh, isn't like silver, which is
very nice.
It's a shiny,
Timothy Sullivan (12:23):
Yeah.
John Puma (12:24):
cool.
I think this, this label mightbe, I.
For the Western market.
It's like a, a one piecewraparound label.
It might be a Western marketlabel.
but I am excited to get this inthe glass.
Timothy Sullivan (12:36):
And there's also, there's also a phoenix on
the label.
John Puma (12:40):
Oh yeah.
Is that what that
Timothy Sullivan (12:41):
there's a bird.
So the phoenix is the, ofcourse, the symbol of rebirth.
And um, I think they use thatphoenix icon or iconography in
all of their branding.
So it must be tied to theirbrand, um, which is very cool.
Yeah.
John Puma (12:58):
Yeah,
Timothy Sullivan (12:59):
All right.
Should we get this open and inthe glass?
John Puma (13:02):
we absolutely should.
Timothy Sullivan (13:03):
Alright.
All right, I've got it in theglass.
Let's give this a smell as weusually do.
Hmm.
John Puma (13:18):
Ooh.
Timothy Sullivan (13:20):
Very subtle,
John Puma (13:22):
Very.
Timothy Sullivan (13:22):
elegant.
This is not showy, is it?
John Puma (13:29):
No.
No, it's not.
It's nice though.
It's got that.
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (13:35):
It's lovely.
John Puma (13:36):
I'm having a really hard time identifying
Timothy Sullivan (13:39):
Hmm.
John Puma (13:40):
this.
What do you think?
What do you get outta this?
Timothy Sullivan (13:45):
Well, I think the aromatics are very subtle,
very clean.
Uh, there's a hint of somethingthat could be a whisper of
fruitiness, but there's almostlike an incense quality to it.
John Puma (14:04):
Yeah, I was gonna say like annise or something like
that.
Timothy Sullivan (14:07):
Hmm,
John Puma (14:08):
I was worried I'd be misusing the word anise.
Something almost, almost mintyon the nose.
I don't know what it is.
But when you said, um, when yousaid incense, that I think that
that's, that might be what I wasdetecting.
Timothy Sullivan (14:23):
Yeah.
And I don't mean like, you know,hardcore Catholic church
incense.
I'm talking like wafting waftingJapanese incense from the tea
house next door house next door.
John Puma (14:38):
Alright.
Timothy Sullivan (14:38):
Hmm.
Yeah.
It's got something verypleasant, but light and, uh, it,
it's a very gentle aroma.
John Puma (14:48):
Extremely.
Alright.
Are you ready for a sip?
Timothy Sullivan (14:51):
let's taste.
Hmm.
So good.
John Puma (14:58):
That's nice.
There's a, the, there's awonderful little like bite of
acidity on the finish there thatI am a big fan of.
Timothy Sullivan (15:10):
I think for me, bite is too strong a
John Puma (15:12):
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (15:13):
This is very silky and it has like a velvety
texture.
It's soft.
And again, it, it's not.
In any way overtly fruity ortropical fruit or any of that?
It's very, um, reserved.
Reserved elegance is like theword that comes to mind.
(15:34):
It's like, um, very silky smoothand hints at, um, maybe apple or
some kind of fruitiness, butvery restrained and very, very
elegant.
It's.
So much about the texture for mehere.
Very velvety and delicious.
(15:55):
Not heavy at all.
Uh, it's 16% alcohol.
There's, it says Genshu.
So there's no water added tothis, even though it's brewed to
a lower alcohol level.
And, I think that this rice, thespecial rice they're using, the
Asahi Mai is contributing tosome of these flavors that we're
having a hard time reallypinning down.
I think this goes back to thatoriginal heirloom, non crossbred
(16:20):
rice.
So it may be that we'rediscovering the flavors of this
Asahi rice.
John Puma (16:25):
I think you're right and I, I think that one of the
things that's the most fun aboutthis, that it is sort of like.
Subverting expectations in away.
You know, you're having thisDaiginjo, you're expecting like,
oh, it's gonna be fruity andblah, blah, blah.
Fruity and light.
And like in this, it's like,it's, there is some sort of a
fruit here.
But it's a very, differentstyle, much like I'm agreeing
(16:46):
with you a hundred percent.
Uh, is that, this is, it's veryunusual and I like it a lot.
It's very challenging.
it's very challenging todescribe the flavor while, um,
while being extremely comfortingfrom a texture standpoint.
Like we've been down the roadwith Silky, wonderfully
textured, sake like this before.
(17:06):
But the, the taste here is justso, Hmm.
It's just so, There's so much toexplore and unpack.
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (17:15):
Yeah, it's interesting, when sakes are
bold.
In your face loud, there's nodisputing like what's going on.
But when you have a sake likethis that is so restrained and
so elegant, and it's not in yourface,
John Puma (17:31):
It's so much more difficult.
Timothy Sullivan (17:34):
It, it's difficult to find the words, to
find the descriptors to, to,give it its justice, you know,
when in a, in describing how itis.
but I think, um, for me, thetexture is so.
Subtle and elegant.
It is not, I think if, if youdescribe it in a way that you
(17:55):
say, oh, it's elegant, it'srestrained.
Some people might think, oh,it's probably too boring for me,
but no way this, there's so muchto explore.
I.
John Puma (18:03):
Yeah.
Timothy Sullivan (18:04):
And again, I think it's, it's an unknown rice
to us kind of coming through onthe palate and it doesn't taste
rice or grainy at all, so it'snot like a traditional rice
flavor coming across.
But I think that is giving itthe depth of flavor that we're
kind of trying to describe.
I think it's coming from thatAsahi Mai Rice.
John Puma (18:25):
Yeah, I think that, This is really interesting to me
because we've been doing thisshow for a very long time now,
and outside of that, I've beentasting sake with you for even
longer, and I've, I've neverseen you, at a loss for words
for trying to describe whatyou're experiencing when you're
tasting a sake before, not likethis.
And I think that's amazing thatthis sake is here and it's, and
(18:48):
it's able to do that.
you know, you've had things thatyou didn't like that maybe you
didn't wanna describe, but thisis something that you're really
enjoying and really having ahard time with.
I think that's like fascinating.
Timothy Sullivan (19:03):
I.
I think it's good to bechallenged sometimes and try to
dig around and, you know, uh,I'm tasting this for the first
time and it's true sometimeswhen you are evaluating a sake,
you have to go back to it asecond time, a third time
experience it, uh, maybe do afood pairing with it.
(19:26):
So I'm not at all.
Perturbed by, you know, notbeing able to nail down a flavor
or aroma that we're both like,aha.
I think it's fine to, to exploreand, revisit down the road
again.
But it's important to say thatthis is extremely delicious.
Like it is really good.
And sometimes you don't need toknow why something tastes good
(19:50):
as long as you're enjoying it.
Right?
John Puma (19:52):
I think that's absolutely true.
It's just such a hard sake todescribe.
It doesn't, it doesn't fit intothe nice little bubbles and
little compartments that we havein our minds for a lot of sakes,
that tastes like that are ofthis type.
it's a lot of fun to, to delveinto something new.
Timothy Sullivan (20:09):
Yeah, well I do have a tasting note from the
brand.
Should we read that and see whatthey say?
John Puma (20:17):
I am very curious to see what they say.
Yes, absolutely.
Timothy Sullivan (20:21):
So they say the muscat driven Ginjo aroma
introduces a vibrant bouquetthat is beautifully
complimented, by the balancedUmami and refreshing
characteristic of Asahi rice.
The palate offers a rich depthwith a light crisp base, making
it both approachable andversatile.
The flavor remains stable whencooled, ensuring a consistent
(20:44):
and high quality experience inevery glass.
So they don't go into muchdetail.
They gave us musk, they saidmuscat driven aroma.
John Puma (20:54):
No, I'm gonna,
Timothy Sullivan (20:58):
Yeah.
It's not as Muscat grapey as Iwould think, but
John Puma (21:04):
Right.
When I hear Driven, I'm I'mthinking it's, it's, you know,
it's, taking the wheel.
Uh, no, this is, it's subtlythere.
Um, and it's not something Ipicked up on earlier, but, yeah,
I do like how even they avoidedspecific known fruit.
Descriptors that like don'treally apply to this sake.
The sake's different.
It's fun and different.
(21:24):
It's, it is all these thingsthat they described it as though
Timothy Sullivan (21:28):
Yeah.
John Puma (21:29):
really nice.
So, I wanna know, uh, what youthink about food with this since
is this.
Yeah.
So we've got texture, thetexture here.
You got that silky, elegant laaha.
Oh, it's so wonderful.
and then you've got this, this,this really nice, Restrained
crisp sake.
What are you thinking?
Timothy Sullivan (21:47):
Hmm.
Well, my mind immediately goesto lighter, cleaner dishes.
I think that if you were havingsushi or sashimi, this would be
an amazing sake to have with it.
I think that anything from theraw bar, like shrimp cocktail,
oysters on the half shell, crablegs, all my, my standard go-tos
(22:08):
poached fish as well.
I think that seafood would bethe best friend of this sake,
basically.
John Puma (22:14):
Yeah.
I immediately, my mindimmediately went to sushi
usually sushi is so light andthis would be such a great
compliment to, to so much ofthat sushi and sashimi.
Other types of, I, I would lovelike a, like a, like a white
fish with a really mild, sauce.
I think that would be like a,like a broiled, broiled white
fish would be amazing with this.
(22:35):
I think the two of them would gofabulously together.
Let's see.
They recommend.
Let's take a look out.
They recommended sushi andsashimi.
Okay.
Alright.
Uh, steamed vegetables, salads,uh, citrus based dressings.
Oh, okay.
I'm a, I'm a fan of citrus baseddressings.
I can see that going well withthis.
And they recommend this, Chilledin a wine class.
(22:57):
Hmm.
Timothy Sullivan (22:58):
Yeah.
John Puma (22:59):
Yeah.
We're doing it right, Tim.
Timothy Sullivan (23:01):
All right.
That's good.
Well, I, I think now that I'vethought about it for a little
bit, I think that there areother sakes that I often pair
with sushi and sashimi that areclean, crisp, and they are, dry.
You know, they are a little morebracing.
This has a, a depth of flavor toit that brings more dimension
(23:28):
and.
This one has that, a very subtlerice flavor from the Asahi Mai
that gives it a depth of flavor.
Even though it's so restrainedand elegant, there's a depth
going on.
And I think that, uh, that justbrings a little more to the
party when it comes to layeringflavors with a food pairing.
(23:50):
You know what I mean?
John Puma (23:51):
Yeah, I think I do.
And I agree.
I'm like so excited to try thiswith food now.
Like that's, um, that's my maintakeaway from this is like, you
know, I'm not the pairing guy.
I'm the sit on the couch anddrink the sake guy.
We've talked about this before,but like, this sake makes me so
excited to try it with food.
I am.
(24:12):
I'm gonna do some, I'm gonna dosome experiments for the next
week, I think, and just kind ofevery dish I have, I'm gonna
pour a little bit of this andsee how it goes.
Like, I am really excited to seewhat happens with this.
It just, it, it seems likethere's a lot of fun
possibilities.
Timothy Sullivan (24:27):
Yeah, and I'm intrigued by the subtlety of
this sake.
It's so delicious.
It's a ultra premium JunmaiDaiginjo, but it has this
subtleness to it that makes youwant to look in the glass and
study it.
Like that's what's getting me.
It's like, oh my gosh, thistastes so good.
What's going on?
(24:48):
And it's the combination of thegentle fruitiness with the rice
flavor at a super premium levelthat I think is really grabbing
me.
Yeah, it's really good.
John Puma (24:58):
I agree a hundred percent.
It is, um, it's been a whilesince I've had a sake that was,
uh, so.
so different yet.
So just, I want more, you know,it's, you know what I mean?
It's like, it's such a, it's aunique flavor and a, and a
wonderful combination, of theflavor and the texture and the,
and the Crispness.
And I'm just, I just want toexplore this and, and have so
(25:22):
much of it and try it and seewhat's going on.
Like it's, um, I just feel likeI can get a lot out of this
sake.
Timothy Sullivan (25:28):
Yeah, it's appealing, it's elegant, but I
think it's fair to say that thisis also food friendly for a
Junmai Daiginjo.
John Puma (25:37):
Uh, yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And note, note that my firstinstinct wasn't, I'm taking this
to the couch.
I'll see you later.
This is my first instinct was Ineed to try this with some food.
Timothy Sullivan (25:47):
So, uh, the brand again is Hououbiden.
It's a little difficult to sayHououbiden
John Puma (25:55):
that doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.
Timothy Sullivan (25:57):
Hououbiden
John Puma (25:58):
Hououbiden
Timothy Sullivan (26:00):
Hououbiden.
But I'm really excited to trymore sakes from this brand.
Now what about you?
John Puma (26:07):
Absolutely.
Um, I'm, I would be lying if Isaid I haven't tried another
sake from this brand.
'cause I very much have, andthey are honestly, they're, the
other ones I've had from themhave been wonderful and elegant,
but they were a little easier toput into a box where you're just
like, this is, you know, thisone's very nice and fruity.
It's got a really, you know, awonderful mouth feel, et cetera,
(26:29):
et cetera.
Like there was, they were easierto, for me to just kind of like
go like, okay, this is, this isthis style, this is that style.
Whereas this one for me is justsuch a, just a different style.
It's a new style for me.
Really nice.
Timothy Sullivan (26:46):
Yeah, I think, one thing I didn't mention
earlier is that I think theirwater comes from an underground
source, so, that might mean thattheir water has a bit more
minerality and that might add tosome of the layering in the sake
as well.
That's just, I'm, I'm taking a,a guess here, but I did read
that they're, they use anunderground water source.
(27:08):
And, I think that might play arole in some of the depth of
flavor and layering that we'regetting here.
But I'm excited to try more fromthis brand for sure.
So John, do you know any of theother sakes that, sake Suki is
bringing in from Hououbiden?.
John Puma (27:25):
Yes.
So, um, in addition to this oneis the, uh, Asahi Mai.
They've also got the, uh, sakeMirai, which is that, uh, that
wonderful sake rice that wasoriginally cultivated in, uh, if
I'm not mistaken, in theYamagata.
I think this is a.
Uh, Juyondai's Rice, and thenalso the black Phoenix, which
I've, I've definitely had, uh,in Japan before.
(27:46):
And that is Aiyama.
So Aiyama starting to come into,starting to come into the
States.
I'm very excited.
I am, it's been a long timecoming.
Timothy Sullivan (27:55):
We know you're an Aiyama fanboy
John Puma (27:57):
I am a fan boy.
This is, this is the truth.
I'm not gonna attempt in any wayto disguise that.
I am 100% a fanboy, unabashed.
Timothy Sullivan (28:08):
Alright, well, sounds like we're gonna have to
get that Aiyama sake fromHououbiden on the show at some
point in the future, but thiswas a fun look into this brewery
and a very interesting setupwith a married couple being
president and Toji and anintriguing sake.
(28:28):
So just, uh, really interestingall around.
John Puma (28:32):
Yeah.
Good times, and I'm, and I'm.
Glad to see this one, in theStates.
It's just, it's always, it'salways exciting when new stuff
comes to our shores.
Timothy Sullivan (28:42):
Yeah.
Well thanks to you, John.
Thanks for tasting thisintriguing sake with me.
Special thank you to Sake Sukifor, Providing this sake for us
to taste today, and I wanna saya special hello and thank you to
all of our listeners, butespecially the members of our
Patreon community.
If you're interested insupporting Sake Revolution, we
(29:04):
do have a Patreon.
You can visit us atpatreon.com/sakerevolution and
join our community.
We do a live happy hour.
Every month where you can talkto us and sip sake with us.
So if you'd like to, uh, chatwith us in person, join our
Patreon, and we look forward tomeeting you.
There
John Puma (29:23):
And if you've got a question for Tim and I here, or
maybe a show suggestion, ormaybe we flub something and you
need to correct us, that's veryimportant too.
Timothy Sullivan (29:31):
it, it happens.
John Puma (29:33):
It does happen from time to time.
uh, we wanna hear from youthough.
Uh, reach out to us.
We've got an email address.
It'sfeedback@sakerevolution.com.
The website also has a littleform you can fill out to send us
messages directly.
You can also slide into our dmson Facebook or Instagram.
(29:53):
until next time though, pleaseremember to keep a drinking
sake.
And Kanapi.
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