Ep. 79 The Man Who Runs Toward Ghosts: Chris Mac

Send your favorite Co-Ghosts a message!

Have you ever wondered what kind of person runs toward a ghost instead of away? Meet Chris Mac, a paranormal researcher from the Pocono Mountains whose fearless approach to spirit encounters began at the tender age of five when he chased after an apparition in his home, thinking it was his grandmother.

Chris takes us on a dark journey through abandoned asylums and forgotten institutions, focusing particularly on Pennhurst Asylum in Pennsylvania. When he discusses the facility's disturbing history of mistreating patients—some as young as five years old—there's a personal edge to his research. "If I would have been put in there with my autism, I would not be here right now," he reflects, creating a poignant connection between past injustices and present understanding.

The conversation reveals Chris's unique claim to sense energies remotely, allowing him to feel connections to haunted locations before physically visiting them. His assertion that the 1771 Enfield House is cursed comes from this sensitivity, describing "heavy, thick, massive energy" that he can perceive even through researching from a distance. Whether discussing the entity known as "Skippy" who throws wrenches at Pennhurst or the unexplained scratches he received after investigating Ledgworth Village, Chris maintains an enthusiastic curiosity rather than fear.

Perhaps most intriguing is his defense of controversial ghost hunting apps like Spirit Talker, sharing a compelling story where the app seemingly provided verifiable historical information about a deceased nurse—details he later confirmed through newspaper archives. "You have to figure out when it works," he insists, challenging conventional skepticism.

Ready to experience the paranormal through the eyes of someone who chases ghosts instead of running from them? Listen now and decide for yourself if some places truly hold energies that linger long after the living have gone.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
Thanks for watching what's going on.

(00:31):
This is hilarious.
I am john olsen and with me, asalways, is dw, the dark old
whodunit serene there it isToday's.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
uh no, I can't say that we are sponsored by Cider
Boys, because we're not actually.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
But hey.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
I'm just cracking open my Cider Boys.
Strawberry Magic, which soundsa little bit like a stripper
name, Can you imagine?
If you're like, please welcometo the stage.
Strawberry Magic.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
Can you imagine if he was like, please?

Speaker 2 (01:10):
welcome to the stage.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
Strawberry Magic.
It's pretty good.
That's what they said too.
Alright, ready.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
For what?

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Diet Coke Yep.
Diet Coke today.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Alright, going back to the your roots.
Yeah, kinda I right, going backto your roots.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
Yeah, kind of.
I mean in a way, maybe DW hassome exciting news to tell you
Okay, yeah.
And anybody who cares out there.
So, based on our listeners twoweeks ago, not many.
But to be fair, whatever I'mabout ready to go into that too,

(01:49):
and Lord help me.
This might cause some backlash,but it's okay, dw, I am now in
the mid 220s, so I am 225.5.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Thank, you all right yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:07):
So not only did I completely and utterly pass that
229 threshold, I am now 225 andum 225, and feeling alive.
When's the last time you'vebeen 225?
2018, maybe Wow.

(02:28):
So this is like legitimately,as you are looking at me right
now through this Zoom camera,even though nobody else can, I
am the skinniest you have everseen me.

Speaker 2 (02:41):
Crazy yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
Yeah, me crazy.
Yeah, yeah, and I just have.
I have 15 more pounds to go towhere I'm at, like my uh, not my
goal weight, but like if I getthere, I'll be okay, you know
what I mean.
Yeah, like I'll be all right ifI go below it.
Hey, that's badass.

(03:03):
If to my goal, which is 200,that'd be even more amazing.
But 210, give or take a couplepounds, I think.
I'll be okay, I mean it's rightabout my playing weight for
football.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
I was going to say you're doing a lot of football
playing these days.

Speaker 1 (03:24):
No, no, no.
I can't even walk up the stairswithout.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
I know that's what would make it so funny if you
did play.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, I was thinking of a joke, you know, basically.
you know, every time I get up inthe morning it's like a bowl of
Rice krispies and you know,snap crackle pop except for with
mine, it's ouch, fuck, thathurt soon and that's why it's

(03:53):
not a joke yep yeah, yeah, so,um, so yeah, dw, I want to talk
a little bit about, uh, anepisode that we had a couple
weeks ago with uh somebody withwith tarot cards, and I just

(04:14):
want to say this uh, we did thatshow just like me, and you
always do the show.
Uh, we treated our guests thatweek just like we treat every
other guest we ever have, andfor some reason, that one, just
I don't know, there was somefeelings maybe that we weren't

(04:38):
exactly kind, which is strange.
Kind, which is strange, uh.
well, I mean, not not strange inthe overall aspect, but strange
in the fact that, like you knowit, like I said, everybody else
and everybody else seems tothink like we do an amazing job.
At least that's what I've heard.

(04:59):
Nobody's ever had any othercomplaints and it's been pretty
cool.

Speaker 2 (05:03):
Uh, that one just seemed to uh I don't know was
what's our numbers for thatepisode.
Is it like more or less thanusual in terms of listeners?

Speaker 1 (05:17):
uh, it's less, but I, I don't know um, I just I feel
there's some negative jujuaround it and I'm not going to
apologize for anything becausewe didn't do anything wrong.

Speaker 2 (05:33):
One thing I will clarify and actually our
listeners may not even realizethis because they didn't hear
anything but one of the issueswas that at one point during the
the episode, I got up and leftfor my little studio and came
back and it was, uh,misinterpreted as, I think, you

(06:00):
saying something that, like,offended me so much I had to
leave, or something like thatyeah, but in reality, what
happened is, again, the houndsof serene manor was going nuts.
Uh, because of the neighbor dog.
If the neighbor dog and ourdogs are out there at the same
time, they go ballistic and uh,that's what was happening and I

(06:25):
needed to run out there to getthe to uh, uh, herd the dogs
back into the house so theywould stop going nuts.
So that's what it was just atthat moment and I did not say I
didn't want to interrupt anyone,but I didn't say sorry, I'll be
right back hanging on, you knowwhatever.
Um, but anyway, I think thatmay have been uh misunderstood,

(06:50):
because I didn't actuallyclarify what I was doing I think
, I feel like, um it.
That hasn't happened muchthough, um, but I was wondering
if I maybe, like need to have asign or something that says dogs
barking, I'll be right back, orsomething like that it was me.

Speaker 1 (07:08):
I, I mentioned it, I was like oh he's walking away
look at him ah, you know myvince mcmahon voice ah, get out
of here.
Uh, he was I.
I just you know, I don't know,I maybe upplayed it, uh too much
and and probably made it soundlike you were like I'm out and
which I don't get offendedeasily, you know I, I mean you

(07:30):
work with me, buddy.

Speaker 2 (07:31):
I was gonna say you can't do what we do and get
offended easily.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
So yeah, uh, and no, it's so I don't know.
It was a weird vibe around itand, to be honest, the real fun
stuff happened after and that'son our Under the Table segment,

(07:58):
that's on Buzzsprout.
You guys can check it out.
If you want to become asubscriber to Scalarius, you can
.
You can hear all about it, butit did.
I remember specifically sayingduring that part of the the show
or broadcast or whatever I saidand I was like where was this

(08:20):
the whole entire time?
So I mean, it's a 10 minutelittle thing called under the
table and uh you should, uh, youshould check it out.
Uh, it's funny stuff.
Dw was surprised, she wassurprised, we were yeah yeah it
was, it was good um anythinggoing on over there.

(08:43):
First, let's look, I I feellike we should.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
We should say that good old dubs will not be here
for a couple weeks yeah, so, um,I'll just leave it, as may is a
very busy month for us and andso there's a lot going on and
the next two recordings.
I am unavailable, so we'regoing to try a first which well,

(09:22):
no, I won't elaborate on that,but we are going to try a first
which is we're bringing in aguest host or guest co-host.
I should say, yep, he's.
Should we leave it as asurprise, or do we want to say
his name?

Speaker 1 (09:36):
No, I'll just say this Okay, that's what I'm going
to say, that for all you peoplethat I've been telling for I
don't know almost two years now,to contact us, to get involved
with us, to have fun with us andeverything you know reach, give
us, throw us a line, you'llsend us a message, do that, and

(09:59):
you don't, you don't do it.
Well, guess what he does.
Do it, he did.
And guess what he does, do it,he did.
And guess what.
He's gonna be the guestco-ghost for the next two weeks.
So I'm just saying that's,that's on you guys.
You could, somebody else couldhave been a co-ghost just for
temporarily.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
But no, you, you didn't, you didn't want to do
that and but so well and toelaborate a little bit more, he,
uh, he listened to the show,but also our paths crossed and
we were doing a show that he wasa part of.
He's a fellow comedian turnsout.
He's really funny, he's.
He uh uh, he did a.
He did a great job.

(10:39):
So I, you know, I'm optimisticthat it's going to be a good
show.
But yeah, so you're in capablehands because it'll be the
hilarious part of Scalarius.
But yeah, so John will takecare of as usual.
John will take care of thescary part and hopefully our

(11:01):
co-host will take care of thefunny part.

Speaker 1 (11:03):
There we go.

Speaker 2 (11:04):
That's how it it always works uh, in two weeks,
either I'll be uh, uh, kickedoff the show, um, or I I don't
know what the alternative iswell, hey, if it goes well, then
I'll uh uh, take a vacation andbe like hey well who's gonna
reply to me then what?

Speaker 1 (11:25):
what if it goes well, and he's the co-ghost for you
and I take a vacation.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
If you take a vacation.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
It's not happening.
Yeah, no.

Speaker 2 (11:37):
Because I don't know how to, I'm not going to I'll
record it, and then I won't knowhow to upload it, and so it'll
just be in limbo yeah, it'll beall right.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
So you know how I was talking earlier about, you know
, people trying to, like youknow, get a hold of us and
whatever right you know anddoing that, and then they could
be a part of the show, right?

Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well that.
Or if they just wanted to senda message and say which of us is
funnier?
Or if they just wanted to sayJohn's mean, what are you doing?
Type of thing.
They wanted to see where we'redoing shows, or something like
that, whatever.
Or if they just want to send amessage saying, hey, I like you

(12:26):
guys, whatever I mean they've.

Speaker 1 (12:28):
I think I've actually had a john's mean one before.
It didn't, and it's fine, itworks out.
But you know, if you wanted todo that, you can.
And this is how you can find dw.
Dw3 comedian on facebook.
You find me at john olsoncomedian 2.0 on facebook.
You can find us both together.
Serene Comedian on Facebook.
You can find me at John OlsonComedian 2.0 on Facebook.
You can find us both together.

Speaker 2 (12:47):
But we're not a couple.

Speaker 1 (12:50):
No, but you can find us on our Facebook page Also.
We do have a TikTok.
It's called Scalarius8.
And an Instagram called guesswhat?

Speaker 2 (13:01):
Scalarius.

Speaker 1 (13:03):
Scalarius Yep, that's it.
And if you wanted to email us,you could do that at
scolariuspod, at gmailcom, andif, and only if, I'm not trying
to make you guys do anything youdon't want to do, because if I
I mean if I was trying to makeyou do things you don't want to

(13:23):
do, I'd be telling you tocontact us all the time, so
maybe you could be part of thefreaking show.
But whatever, I'm not trying tomake you do anything you don't
want to do.
But if you want to, you couldgo back and listen to every
single episode that we have atsclerospodbuzzsproutcom.

(13:44):
And you know, if you reallywanted to support us here at the
old Scolarius the two co-ghostshere you could do a couple of
things.
One of them is you couldsubscribe to Scolarius on
Buzzsprout for $3 a month.

(14:05):
You get the extra content whichis it's coming out, guys under
the tables, what it's called.
Don't don't ask why it's calledunder the table, it's just
called under the table.
Uh, that's, that's coming out.
There might be some other stufftoo there.
There might be some live showsthat we're going to do that
we'll put on there.
There might be, I don't know,like maybe me dw are going to go
to, uh, the haunted strip clubagain and maybe when we're there

(14:28):
, like you know, we will do aninvestigation or something.
We'll record that.
We'll put that on there.
Um, there's so much other stuffand if you become a subscriber
you're going to get a shout outon the next show.
Okay that you are now part ofthe scolariverse.

(14:48):
Let's see what I did there.
Scolarius and universe.
Scolarius has been scary andhilarious, but now I combine
like three different words.
All right, but anyway, youcould do that.
Or you could go to crowdmadecomand just search up sclarry's
pod and you can find a whole lotof really cool merch.

(15:10):
Uh, my favorite is the oldcripers t-shirt.
That that's.
That's just amazing.
That's what dw says.
He gets upset and he's like oh,cripers.
And then, like, when you'rewearing this, people are gonna
be like what does that mean?
And then, uh, you have toexplain it.
And then flip them a card andhave them go listen to scolarius

(15:31):
, and then they can buy an oldcriber shirt, I don't know, or
you can get.
I mean it's, it's out of hoodieseason, for the love of god.
I'm wearing a tank top, butit's like out of hoodie season.
But you can get hoodies and gett-shirts and you can get that
stuff.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
That has things on there that maybe me and DW say
or how we feel, or don't say,because I don't say Kripers like
ever.

Speaker 1 (15:59):
Well, whatever, or how we feel, but we have a whole
line of hoodies, t-shirts, wehave pet bowls.
Yeah, we have leashes andcollars for your pets or for
your significant other, I guess,if you wanted to do it that way
.
But you, we have all that andwe have hats and all sorts of

(16:22):
stuff.
So go to crowdmatecom, searchup it's hilarious and get some
stuff like everything's 30 orless.
It's pretty affordable.
And yeah, so dubs, uh, this isyour last show for two weeks.

(16:43):
A couple things I want to askbefore we get into our guest.
Number one is do do you want meto continue on?
Like you're not here, like youknow?
Like, say like, like you'repassed on, right, we have to
continue on, we have to keepmoving on forward, and things
like that.
So do we want to continue onlike you're not here, meaning

(17:04):
like you know that or that youare here.
You know what I'm saying Like,do we do this or that?
You know, do we?

Speaker 2 (17:14):
Yeah, you'd still do this or that, do I tell?

Speaker 1 (17:17):
them where they can find them, or tell them where
they can still find you and them.

Speaker 2 (17:21):
See, I don't know what I'm going to do find you
and them see like I don't knowwhat I'm gonna do.
I think you know, as a uh uh uh, in lieu of pay, you should
tell everyone where they canfind our guest co-hosts for all
of us for a long time, but youknow, but anyway, you say where

(17:43):
you can find us, but I won't bethere.
So I think it'd be fair to saywhere you can find our guest
co-host, and then so do, andthen also, I think, since it
this will be a couple ofepisodes, you should give him
the chance to at least once, dolead this or that if he wants to
, yeah, that would be.

Speaker 1 (18:03):
That would be pretty cool.
See, like this week is yourturn, so next week would be my
turn, right?
So I'm not 100 sure.
If I want to do like have himlead next week and then have you
, you know what I mean, thenit'd be my turn, then you'll be
back you know you might, youmight want to be ready for next
week and then that way you cansay, hey, the week after it'll

(18:26):
be you so yeah, it's a goodcouple shows coming up too, uh,
but you know, honestly, weshould probably get to this one.
What do you?
Think yes yeah, enough talk,enough talk between me and you.

Speaker 2 (18:41):
Between us.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Yeah, we still have a guest.
You know, this is a very coolthing.
Again, we go back to thebeginning of this very episode
where I said it's important forpeople to reach out to us, right
?
Yep, because the guest that wehave today wouldn't be here

(19:04):
today if he didn't reach out tous and proposed a pretty cool
theory.
So I invited him up.
He is a paranormal enthusiastand researcher.
He's a one-man band, he does itall on his own own.

(19:25):
He's from the Poconos mountainsof Pennsylvania again,
paranormal researcher andenthusiast, chris Mack.
Chris, how are you today?
Good, that's good.
Cold um warm now oh yeah, I hearyou again tired of winter.

(19:50):
Well, that's good we are toowe're.
We're in minnesota, so, trustme, it's like 82 degrees today.
Tomorrow it could be likesnowing six inches.
It could happen, because youknow, I think it was, uh, 30
years ago, whatever there waslike a big snowstorm on may 10th

(20:10):
or whatever like oh, yeah, yeahbut yeah, it was.
It was before you were born,chris.
All right, so I figure we mightas well get right into this.
So, chris, you reached out tome and you reached out to me.
Okay, let me backpedal for justone more.

(20:31):
Okay, a few weeks back we did ashow on the Enfield 1771 house.
Yep, okay, and it was prettyinteresting.
We got a lot of stuff, a lot ofinformation, and with all the
information we got we reallydidn't get too far into the

(20:53):
actual hauntings of it.
So we might do another showwith Jay and Mackenzie and
everybody in the near future.
But you had reached out and yousaid the 1771 infield house is
cursed yeah so, chris, if youcould, we'll start with this.

(21:18):
If you could, can you explainwhy you feel that is cursed um?

Speaker 3 (21:24):
I believe it or not, I think it's cursed is because,
um, I believe there is a witchthat happened on the land.
Why I don't know how, but I canfeel it.
It's there, there.
But they, I keep telling, whenI keep asking them, even I'm

(21:49):
being when I ask them are yousure this house is cursed?
I keep asking them and askingand asking them for some reason,
I don't know why.
I keep asking them that becauseit's there, I can feel it, but
it just comes to me.
I can feel the energy.
It's there, I can feel it, butit just comes to me.
I can feel the energy in thathouse.
I can feel everything Heavy,thick, massive energy.

(22:15):
It's like up and down, you know.

Speaker 1 (22:19):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
So why would you?

Speaker 1 (22:24):
think it's a witch, though what's the difference in
the energies that you're feelinglike, yeah, there's dark and
things like that.
Is there a specific energy thata quote unquote witch would
send off?

Speaker 3 (22:34):
hmm, it's, it's a little here and there.
I can't really say because I'mnot there.
I just feel it, because I canfeel things on the screen, I can

(22:55):
feel energy, I can pinpointsometimes but and guess.
But I can feel a lot.
In that house there's just abunch of sadness, suicides and
and oh, you said you know, jayhad mentioned that there had
been how many dw?

Speaker 1 (23:15):
do you remember how many deaths there were in the
enfield house?
Wasn't it like 27?

Speaker 3 (23:21):
27 to, I think, 32, I think I read online.

Speaker 2 (23:29):
Wow, it was yeah, something like that.
It was a lot.

Speaker 3 (23:34):
I'm still doing research on it and I can't
really say much because, yeah, Iget it.
They're private.
So they told me not to.
I actually told them I'm notgoing to say anything because
they keep their research private.
So but you know, but you getwhat I'm saying, yeah, I do.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
So.
I just, you know, when youreached out and you said it's
cursed, I didn't really ask muchof it.
I kind of like, ok, we're goingto go behind the curtain a
little bit.
If somebody has somethinginteresting that they're telling
me or saying or whatever,immediately I think, oh, the
future guest.
So I don't want to know.

(24:23):
At that point I don't want toknow.
I really don't want to know awhole lot, because if I do, then
we're going to go in here andit's not going to be very
surprising.
So, as you know, I didn'treally ask you a whole lot about
what you were saying.
So you said you feel it, I canfeel it, yes, and you've
approached the apples on itbefore.

(24:44):
I mean, have you?

Speaker 3 (24:46):
I actually felt something Like what do I feel?
Like is there something darkeror more sinister, or something
that is attached to the land, orif it could be Native Americans
, or I just feel there's there'ssomething else okay so you, but

(25:14):
you talked to Jay about thisyes.

Speaker 1 (25:16):
I have Okay, and then what was?
What was his response?

Speaker 3 (25:22):
His response Um, it's been.
Um, this was way back when Ifirst real when, when I was in
the community.
We're not going to talk aboutWell.
I'm going to say, well, what itwas in the community I was in

(25:43):
the, uh, ghost hunting community.
I was in.
When that first popped up onthat website I, um, I merely
came attached to the house, likelike that.
I said I gotta get in at ahouse because some is calling to
me like something wants methere, something wants me to go

(26:06):
there, something you know, rightit if I can feel it wants me to
go there.
And it, even even when I'm I'maway, it keeps pulling there,
like pulling me there.
It keeps calling and calling,calling, calling.
Like why, I don't know why.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
So how many times have you physically been on the
property?

Speaker 3 (26:33):
I actually haven't been on the property, property
yet I'm this summer, I'm goingthere.
So I just feel energy.
That's all I can feel Heaviness, sad, anger, you know.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
So all right, so you've done research on that.
Yep, okay, what other placeshave you done research on?

Speaker 3 (27:01):
Pennhurst, ledgworth Village, a lot of mental
institutions and asylums.

Speaker 1 (27:10):
Okay, let's start with.
What did you say?
Edgeworth, ledgworth, new York,ledgworth.
All right, let's start withLedgworth.
Mm-hmm, what happens there?

Speaker 3 (27:23):
Well, it's the same, almost the same as Pennhurst,
but they did different things.
Ledgworth did.
Well, it's the same.
Pennhurst did this level.
Sorry, you're okay, tonguetwister, it's they, penn.

(27:43):
Pennhurst did the same as likeLedgworth.
Ledgworth did the same.
I can't sorry, I keep getting.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
So Pennhurst and Ledgworth are.
They're both the same.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Okay, but Ledgworth did differently because they
actually I actually found outthey actually sprayed the, they
actually sprayed the childrenwith cold water.
Pennhurst didn't do that, whichis very, very weird.

(28:20):
Yeah, very yeah.
Do that, which is very, veryweird.
Yeah, very yeah, I didn't.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
I didn't know any of that until somebody told me that
so so they kind of torturedthem.

Speaker 3 (28:33):
Yeah, they tortured them, they did a lot of garbage
to them, but when I went there Ifelt there's there's been a lot
of stuff at ledgeworth, theenergy is thick and and just a
bunch of like sinister stuff inthere.

(28:58):
I don't know what it is, butthere's something dark.

Speaker 1 (29:02):
But it okay.
So I'm not 100% familiar withLedgworth.
Is Ledgworth a?
I mean, is it known to behaunted?
Do people?
Okay, alright, and you saidthat's Ledgworth, new York.

Speaker 3 (29:17):
Yep Alright Ledgworth Village, New York.
Yep Alright Ledgerwood Village,New York.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
Alright, so you did stuff on there and you went back
.
So tell us about the hauntingsthere at Ledgerwood.

Speaker 3 (29:34):
Well, I caught my second time or third time.
I caught an EVP on my recorder.
It was like a breath, like this.
It was in the hospital, the bighospital in the back where
Ghost Wrenters were, and Icaught an EVP and it was like I

(29:56):
was talking and I heard like abreath in the background.
So and I heard footsteps.
I heard.
It's just very thick energy andit's hard to pinpoint what goes

(30:17):
on there.
There's just a lot of sadness.
But I can tell you this one ofmy friends one of my friends
actually went there to do apermanent investigation and in
the in the back there was achildren hospital.

(30:39):
It's part of Ledgworth, it'sabandoned and they went back
there.
They actually saw guys withcloaks, like they do, like a lot
of people did satanic ritualsthere.
Ooh, yeah, yeah.
That's why I found out um,satanic, um, um, devil

(31:06):
worshippers go there, um,witchcraft, all that, and it's
hard pinpoint what's real,what's actually going on so I
can feel energy, sadness, butyeah.
So I mean, if you can feel,energy, that sadness, but yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
So I mean, if you can feel energy that makes you kind
of, I'm not going to say, isthat psychic or empathetic?

Speaker 3 (31:34):
A little bit here in both, but I can feel what's
around me.
But what's weird?
What's weird is that when Iwent now let's can I say about
Pennhurst, yeah, go ahead.
When I went to Pennhurst thevery first time I went there I
did a permanent investigation.
I did just an investigation ofa trial type until 1 o'clock and

(32:05):
I went back home and I I toldmy mom and my stepdad, I said to
them I got to help to them.
I got help and all of a suddenI started getting a whole bunch
of documents and records that Ididn't even expect.

(32:26):
I'm pretty sure some type ofspirit latched onto me and
started helping me find theserecords on Pennhurst.
Like it's weird, it'sunexpected.
I'm like I said, oh boy boy, Ishould not be finding any of

(32:50):
these.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
Um, but it did.
It's so weird you thought, likea spirit attached.

Speaker 3 (32:53):
I mean attached to me like in it's weird, because I
felt tired when I was atPennhurst.
I felt when I was at PennhurstI was sitting on the ground, I
felt tired, I felt and like allof a sudden I just felt

(33:15):
completely drained.
And then, like I said, when Icame back home, all of a sudden
I started finding records.
I'm like, okay, I should behelping oh I'll be that.

Speaker 1 (33:32):
so yeah, you sent me some articles and and things
like that on pennhurst, um, butwhat, what sort of things did
you find?
I mean, obviously, besides thearticles you sent me?

Speaker 3 (33:44):
I actually found patients, patient documents,
patient records.

Speaker 2 (33:51):
Oh cool.

Speaker 3 (33:52):
Yeah, which I cannot show, obviously I can't, right I
would.
But it'd be very private, rightI would.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
But it'd be very private, right, and these
patients were.

Speaker 1 (34:07):
I mean, were they there to be treated?
I'm assuming, okay, pennhurstwas a, it was a mental
institution, right?
Yep, the asylum, all right.
So these patients that they hadprobably were.
It was a lot of things right.
First of all, go back and doyou know the history of
Pennhurst, like when?
When did it start?

(34:29):
like when it opened 1908 yepokay, and Pennhurst is where at
it's, in Pennsylvania.
I know, know that, right,correct, spring city,
pennsylvania.
Okay, and then what do you?
Geographically, where is that?
Um, so, if you're, if you're anovice, a complete novice of,

(34:51):
like, uh, pennsylvania, you havePittsburgh on one end, you have
Philadelphia on the other.
Right, where's, where'd you say, springfield?

Speaker 3 (34:59):
Yeah, okay, where's that at spring spring city, I
mean, oh, spring city?
Yeah, yeah, that's um actuallyright next to philadelphia,
outside of philadelphia allright it's on the eastern side
of pennsylvania.

Speaker 1 (35:13):
Okay, yeah, cool, um, all right.
So pennhurst is right byPhiladelphia.
So I'm assuming thatPhiladelphia residents, or
whatever, were being.
That's where they would go,yeah, okay.

Speaker 3 (35:30):
Like me, because I have autism.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (35:38):
If I would have been put in there, I would not be
here right now.

Speaker 2 (35:42):
Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 (35:45):
Let's talk about that .

Speaker 2 (35:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
You brought up autism .
There you have it.
So what you're saying isbecause we're going to hit a
touchy, freaking subject here, Iguarantee you.
But what you're saying is aperson that has autism is that
if this were the 1900s, 1920s,1930s, whatever you'd be put in

(36:14):
there and you'd be like likethey kill you or like just be
institutionalized, the rest ofyour life tortured and being
beat up, abused basically theywill think you're crazy, right
yeah, yeah and people in thatplace will think you're crazy or

(36:39):
mentally ill or it's just.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
You know, I read all the records that were there.
I'm like how can anybody dothis?
How can one man, can anybody dosuch a thing to these poor kids
?
You know right?

Speaker 1 (37:02):
and was it mostly kids like okay, so let's talk
about penthouse?
Obviously it was a institutionfor adults and everybody, so
down all the way down the line.
So how young were the youngest?

Speaker 3 (37:17):
okay, you're going gonna be talking about
five-year-olds, okay so five,yeah, at five, really.
And then how do?

Speaker 1 (37:26):
you diagnose somebody with a mental illness at five.
Five years old, I mean reallyit's I don't know.

Speaker 3 (37:34):
It's sad.
It's one of the most saddestthings I could read.
But was I upset?
No, because I'm strong, becauseI knew what they had been
through and I knew how they felt.
But I wasn't really sad aboutit.

(37:55):
But I just feel they neededhelp.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
For sure yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:00):
Alright so Pennhurst, they had kids in there, adults.
So is there a burial ground onPennhurst?
Is there a cemetery there?
Yeah, there is actually okay.
Are they all accounted for?
I mean, do you know?

(38:21):
I mean how many people roughlyare buried.

Speaker 3 (38:26):
They were, they were, they're actually.
There is a cemetery there, butit's actually closed off because
it's actually behind a.
The houses, surrounded thehouses, surrounded the houses.

Speaker 2 (38:44):
Oh, okay.

Speaker 3 (38:48):
Oh, okay.

Speaker 1 (38:50):
But yeah, wow, they build houses.
Well, I mean, it's better thanthe poltergeist thing, yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:56):
True, but that's what they told me.
I just know because they toldme not to go back there, so I
couldn't.
I tried to look for it when Iwas there.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
It can't be breaking and entering.

Speaker 3 (39:09):
Yeah, it's all houses , yeah, or standing through
their yards, you know?

Speaker 1 (39:13):
Yeah, all right, so I might as well talk about
Pennhurst for a little bit here.
So it's known to be haunted.
I'm assuming Very, very Okay soI know there's a Paracon going
there shortly, or within thenext couple of months, I think.

(39:36):
But how many entities would yousay are in Pennhurst?
How many do you know?
Is there a number of ghoststhat supposedly haunt it?

Speaker 3 (39:54):
Well, I can tell you, there is an entity in the
Quaker building that is not verynice, not very pleasant.
It's a janitor.
They call him Skippy basically,but I haven't found the name,
so nobody knows his real, actualname.
And the ghost hunters call himSkippy.

(40:15):
So and they say he, they say heum, they say he um, plays with
the girl's hairs, and um and he,um, he actually threw a wrench

(40:37):
onto the ceiling one time.
That's where I found out.
Wait, he threw meaning like whenhe was alive or no, a spirit.
He actually threw a wrench likea, a tool, hit the light and
actually shattered wow, that'scrazy yeah and it's and I um, I

(41:01):
said wow and then yeah, and Isaid wow and then one of the
staff people I was talking toabout him he actually threw a
wrench at one of the staffpeople.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (41:14):
Yeah, and that staff person is still waiting for more
.
Wow.

Speaker 1 (41:23):
So that's in the Quaker building.
I'm assuming there's otherbuildings.
Yeah, mayflower, okay.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Anything there?
Yeah, there is A lot of stuffthey say.
They say there's this littlegirl named Emily.
Um, I to me that little girl Idon't know, I'm not gonna, I'm
not gonna.
I find there's.

(41:58):
I don't want to say it, butthere was a patient named Mary.
She was 16 years old and shewas at Pennhurst.

(42:19):
But it was actually a person Iwas talking to.
I went to some research all theway back to 2006 when Ghost
Adventures was there.
So I was talking to a person onFacebook her name, I'm not
going to give out the name so Istarted talking to her and I
said to her that do you have anyrecords or documents?

(42:40):
She actually gave me documentsand order forms and all sorts of
stuff about penthouse and umand I, and then she actually
came out and told me that it wasactually giving which was named

(43:01):
emily.
It was actually giving whichwas named Emily.
It was actually giving.
Oh, which is weird, but I'm not,I don't want to, I don't want
to get people pissed off, so butyou know, but yeah, it was
giving, but I'm not.

(43:21):
I said, okay, I just go with it, you know.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
Absolutely Did so.
How many buildings in Toller atPennhurst?

Speaker 3 (43:36):
I.
There was a lot, I forgot howmany.
Okay, okay.

Speaker 1 (43:41):
So several.
I'm assuming a big big forgothow many.
Okay, so several.
I'm assuming a big big plot ofland.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
Yeah, there was stuff up up on the hill too.

Speaker 1 (43:50):
Okay.
So I said it's known to behaunted.
You said very.
So tell me, I'm assuming.
When you say like that, thatmeans that there's like a whole
shit ton of things that happen.
You gave us a couple, or arethere any more things that like
paranormal wise that havehappened to you or that you know

(44:12):
of?

Speaker 3 (44:18):
Not much because I think they know who I am
recently because I was therebefore.
Um, I just know they know me orknow some me, but they they
haven't done anything to harm meor like scratch me or anything,

(44:40):
which is weird well, it's good,it wouldn't be scratched unless
it's a good one.
It'd get my shoulder yeah, butwhen I was at Ledgworth I got
scratched really like arm backwhat?

(45:00):
When I got home, I actually gotscratched on the arm and then I
looked, I looked up on mystomach.
I actually got scratched on mystomach out of nowhere and then
when I came home I startedbleeding out of nowhere.
I'm like From a scratch, no,like out of nowhere.

(45:22):
Like I started bleeding out ofmy nose, like how am I bleeding?
It's weird Dry air capillariesbreak.

Speaker 1 (45:33):
You know I mean that stuff happens.
You know I don't want to be theskeptic or anything.
If it is dry air or whateveryou are going to get it.

Speaker 3 (45:47):
I actually like Ledgworth.
It's one of my main go-to.
Well, Pennhurst is my maingo-to, but Ledgworth is a very
trainable place to doinvestigations very trainable

(46:09):
place to do investigations, sovery cool.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
So let's let's talk a little bit about you yourself.
I feel this would be so.
When did you start getting intothe paranormal?
How old were you?

Speaker 3 (46:17):
I was actually like five, okay, five or four.
I think Okay.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
What got you into it, like what made you decide you
liked it, so I was.

Speaker 3 (46:38):
I lived in an apartment one time.
I lived in an apartment onetime and when I was very young I
actually saw.
I thought it was my grandma.
I actually saw a woman walkingup and down the hallway, Then
actually ran in my mom's roomand then ran in the closet and
disappeared.

(46:58):
I chased it what the hell?
And disappeared I chased it.

Speaker 1 (47:02):
What the hell.

Speaker 3 (47:03):
Okay.
I chased because I wanted toknow what happened, what the
heck.
And then all of a sudden, thenext, I think the next day, my
mom actually got a phone callLike down the street.
Got a phone call right down thestreet.

(47:24):
A woman died in a car accident.
Is it that weird?

Speaker 1 (47:30):
that is yeah you actually saw her yeah yeah, oh,
wow, it's weird.
Right, it is weird.
Yeah, okay, so you're in anapartment, you're a
four-year-old, you know who seesghosts.
I think that's, that's a commontheme in about everybody who's
into the paranormal.

(47:50):
Um it, it starts at a hauntedhouse.
See the reason why dw isn't abig fan of the paranormal.
He's becoming one.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
He's becoming one though is he becoming one though
?

Speaker 1 (48:01):
Is he?

Speaker 2 (48:02):
skeptical, yeah for sure.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
That's what makes him one.
But he didn't grow up in ahaunted house.
See me, I did.
I've seen all this stuff.
It happened, dw.
No, he had a foot ghost, thatwas it, but there was like
nothing really happened to him.
He doesn't have the basis towant to believe.
You know what I mean.
But what I noticed is basicallyanybody who's been a guest,

(48:28):
that's been in paranormal, thatgrew up in a haunted house or
had hauntings happen in theirhome and that started with you
too that's pretty cool.
So you were four.
What did you continue on?
I mean?

Speaker 3 (48:40):
if you're.
And then I got and then afterthat we moved out of the
apartment.
We moved to madam morris,pennsylvania okay and this house
was actually haunted too, andthis, this was a family.
Um, it was a family.

(49:01):
It was a family.
It was people.
My mom told me that my roomwhere I sleep, a woman died in
there, and I'm like what?

Speaker 1 (49:15):
the hell.
I mean, does she Okay?
Did she tell you in your 20s,or did she tell you when you
were?
When I got older, she told meSee, that makes sense.
My mom, just out of fun wouldbe like.
Johnny, you know, someone diedthere, right before you go to
bed, good night.

(49:35):
Good night, someone died inyour room.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
And then we got another spirit.
It was a man.
I forgot his name, but a manactually was in the living room
and he was an alcoholicbasically, and I think an
alcoholic or I don't know, buthe actually was sitting in the

(50:03):
living room and he actually shothimself in the head, then died,
and then he shot himself in thestomach, died, came to his
suicide.
Yeah, isn't that weird.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Yes and wait, hold on In your house.

Speaker 3 (50:27):
It was in Matamoros, pennsylvania.
Okay, wow, yeah, and my momstarted Seeing Things and
hearing things and startedseeing Shadow figures and in the
house and um, and then in myroom my mom heard like a big

(50:53):
boom hit the floor in my room Iwas sleeping and and I'm like
this was just.
She was just telling me this,like when I got a little bit
older, you know.

Speaker 1 (51:09):
Right.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
Once we got out of the house.
But yeah, there was stuff goingon in that house.
And then when I was playing theWii with my brother, all right,
yeah, and you remember the Wii,everybody knows, knows the we
the video game um my kids yeah.

(51:30):
So I was playing the wii and Iwas on my ds.
Um.
I said, um, matthew, turn thatdown for a sec.
I said turn that tv down for asec, turn it down for a sec.
I hear somebody crying out ofthe blue all the way in the

(51:50):
dining room.
Like I hear it.
I said turn that down.
And then my brother startinghere whining, like crying, and
then they start up again when wego tell my mom, and then start
up again, I'm like, and thenwhen I got closer I started

(52:11):
going towards it.
I said, and then it got louder,and then louder and louder and
stopped I'm like you.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
Okay, chris, we need to talk about how you you got
that dog in, you dog All right.
So no, for real, like you.
This is pretty awesome.
You hear a lot of people I knowthey, you know see ghosts and
things like that, but you, whenyou see one, you run and chase

(52:42):
after it.
That's two times.
You told us this now.
When you see one, you run andchase after it.
That's two times.
You told us this now.
So how are you not, especiallyas a?
Okay, let's go back to when youwere four or five.
How would you not be afraid ofthat?

Speaker 3 (52:56):
I don't know.
I just feel because I want toexperience.
It's about exploring.
It's about what do you want tosee and what do you want to tell
people?
What do you want to tell?
That you're how, you're notscared, or you want to tell that

(53:16):
you're like a chicken?
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
Well, I mean I know I'm not scared of it.
I know well, I mean, no, I'mnot like, I know, I'm just, I
know I, you know I talk to themand things like that and stuff
happens and and you know I'veseen it.
Whatever I mean, does itstartle you?
Yeah, it's creepy, but never inmy life.
I'm just this is I'm trying toget to really get you to hear

(53:44):
this never in my life have Iever heard anyone say I seen a
ghost and I chased after it,like all right, right, like
running behind it, chasing it.
Yeah, like, usually nine timesout of ten people see a ghost.
They're like what the hell wasthat?
Yeah, and then like, and thenthey'll creep up towards it or

(54:05):
whatever else.

Speaker 3 (54:06):
I mean you don't see very many guys it was because,
it was actually because, if Ithought it was my grandma,
because oh yeah yeah, because itwould.
It looked like a figure on mygrandma.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Because you know, I'm not gonna lie, chris, you just,
I mean, you took the magic outof it, right yeah?
And because, like, if it, ifyou were just being like because
I wanted to see the ghost andwhatever, but no, you said you
thought it was your grandma.
So now it makes it look likeyou didn't intentionally run
after a ghost.
So you see what I mean there.

(54:39):
Probably just should have leftthat part out.

Speaker 3 (54:42):
Yeah, um, because I thought, because I I ran after
it because I thought it was mygrandma Probably just shouldn't
have left that part out.
Yeah, Because I thought,because I ran after it, because
I thought it was my grandma.
But you know, he got one.

Speaker 1 (54:51):
So yes, so the the question I really have for you
is this if you see a ghostthat's you don't think is your
grandma, are you still runningafter it?

Speaker 3 (55:02):
I probably would, even though it's not there you
go because you're there you'rethere.
You're there to experience,you're not.
You're there to do history onit.
You're there to not be achicken about it, or you're

(55:24):
there to document people whythey died.
You know and you get what I'msaying, because it's all about
finding the truth why they'restill here.
That's pretty awesome if youdid.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
Well, okay, so I kind of want to go back a little bit
and then we're going to shootforward as fast as we can.
So, um, when so you're four orfive years old, you see this,
you, you're gonna you move andyou see something else.
So at that point, I'm assumingyou're really into the
paranormal you're like so whatare you going to seek?

(56:03):
What are you looking for?
Assuming you're really into theparanormal, you're like so what
are you going to seek?
What are you looking for Ifyou're, I'm not going to say
you're under 30.
So I'm assuming, like theinternet when you were a kid,
well, I.

Speaker 3 (56:15):
I actually I actually stopped doing it before because
I had to focus on school andstuff and I said I just want to
get it done and over with.
And then I come, I completelyforgot about I like the
paranormal and so I um.
Once I got done, I starteddoing like um.

(56:41):
I started doing like um goingto abandoned places.
My first abandoned location wasin New Jersey, overbrook,
overbrook Asylum.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (56:56):
And that was my first place I went to.
That's when I was like 12 yearsold.

Speaker 1 (57:05):
Okay, so you go in there and explore it, just to
see no, I.

Speaker 3 (57:11):
I couldn't go in there because there was cameras,
so so I just stuck my head inthe window, sat there for a sec,
see what will happen, you know.
And and all of a sudden I heardsomething like like like going,
like like chasing, like tryingto scare me, and I said what the

(57:34):
heck was that?
And then a friend of mine tolda friend of mine told me that it
was a creeper.
So I'm like what the heck is acreeper?
yes, I'd like to know yeah, I, Ididn't know what it was.
So, yeah, everybody want toknow what a creeper is but yeah,

(58:11):
well, okay, so that stuffstarted happening.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
You know you're in this place and all that I'm
trying to get to like, so whathappened then?
From there on like what did youdo next?
What?
Yeah, like other buildings uhother research.

Speaker 3 (58:25):
Well, I, I I'm not other buildings, like I just
went to the overbrook asylum sojust to do documenting, just uh,
get the feel of it before theydemolish it, you know.
And so they demolished that andthat's gone.

(58:46):
I, I really wanted to doinvestigation in there.
So bad and but it's alldemolished.

Speaker 1 (58:54):
Well, you got the research in in the land.
You know, the building doesn'tmean that the land could be
haunted too.
So, yeah, you had the researchand all that.
And, uh, tell us just briefly,how many places have you
researched fully?

Speaker 3 (59:12):
Um, probably, like I don't know.
I'll say like I'll say aboutfive.
Okay, all right, I stick on onelocation before I go to the

(59:39):
next.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
Right that makes sense.
So you're on, so I know ofthree.
You said Pennhurst, Yep.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
Enfield.
Um, that's my next location.

Speaker 1 (59:53):
Enfield Diebenhaus.
Okay, all right, very cool.
So what are the other two?

Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
was I actually I actually did.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
I actually went to new york and I went inside
abandoned nursing home.

Speaker 3 (01:00:13):
I never I never been inside a nursing home.
Be honest, I'm being honestuntil I went to one.
That was an interesting place,but, um, I am, I experienced
what I experienced in there.
I actually been touching thebutt.

Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
So wait at the nursing home, yeah, I actually
been touched there.

Speaker 3 (01:00:44):
Yeah, I had said we're in the basement, me and my
friends, and we're doing theinvestigation.
We were in the basement andwe're doing investigation.
The lights were off andeverything.
My two K2 meters were going offat the same time one on shelf

(01:01:06):
and one on the table and all ofa sudden something touched me in
the butt.
I'm like who touched me?
I turned around and nobody'sthere.

Speaker 1 (01:01:14):
That's pretty good, I thought in Ghost World.
No butt stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:01:23):
Well, I don't know, I don't want to offend anyone if
I won't say it.
What.

Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
But we experienced a lot of stuff in that place.
We experienced banging,knocking footsteps.
We actually heard you're goingto be creeped out of this.
We actually heard talkingoutside the building like real

(01:01:58):
human being talking, but therewas nobody outside.
There was nobody there.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
I've had that happen a couple times, but there was
nobody outside.
There was nobody there.

Speaker 3 (01:02:09):
Yeah, it's happened, I've had that happen a couple
times there was nobody there.
And then we started hearingbanging downstairs and then
we're actually communicatingback and forth with the spirit,
with the banging, and it wasweird.
I'm like there's another bangand then, um, and this gets

(01:02:32):
weirder I said the rempod wasactually next to me, right, and
all of a sudden I asked it.
Um, I asked it, I said is therea demon in this building?
And right next to me, itactually went off.
When I asked it, I said isthere a demon?

(01:02:55):
And then, like that went off.
I'm like what the heck?

Speaker 1 (01:03:02):
Well, I was just saying it was a demon.

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
Is there a demon in there?
I don't think so.
Well, I don't believe in demons, to be honest.
But if the enfield demon housecan prove to me there's a demon,
have.
But I have a hard timebelieving demons, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:03:26):
Well, I mean, I feel demons exist.
I just like I believeeverything is demonic, like
people.
People are assholes, humanbeings are assholes, and human
beings can be dirt downright,methodical and straight evil
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:03:47):
Like Zach and downright methodical and
straight evil right like zachbagans, and that's I, I trust me
, I, I, I love, I like the guy,but he gets beats too much.
But I still watch his shows.
I love his shows and he does agood job on them, right, right.
There are times that he gets tobe too much and then people

(01:04:11):
stop watching him.
Saying everything is a demon.
Demonic, that's a demon, noteverything is a demon.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
What are you talking about?
That's what I was saying.
Human beings, straight up, areassholes and they do horrible
things and everything else.
So, like it's hard to say thateverything is a demon, because
human beings are, you know,alive or dead, can be fuckers.
So you know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:04:45):
yes, yeah I, I try the same way from drama, because
much as possible, because, um,if you say something wrong, all
hell will break loose.
I mean, you know, but who cares?
I't care, Let them say whatthey want to say, I don't care,

(01:05:06):
but fight with them.
But you know, but you know.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
I'm you know like what technology?

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
commenting on a link about technology like spare
talker I have right or thenecrophonic I love the
necrophonic, by the way um, um,by the way, it's a necrophonic,
not neck.
Okay, yes, okay yeah, um, thespare talker I like, but some

(01:05:46):
person told me that they're nota real app thing.
Okay, I know you said Iactually only use it to do
research or anything.

(01:06:07):
You know Right, like it'scompared to eyes, I I understand
, but what if a spirit isactually talking to you that you
don't, that you don't evenexpect to say you know Right.
And I actually, like I said, Iactually went to Ledgworth with

(01:06:31):
my stepdad and first time and Iactually used the spare talker
and I was carrying around thespare talker around and we were
by the bathrooms, like a littledoorway over here right and

(01:06:52):
there was um, um, there was umlike a glass on the floor.
It said.
It actually said mirror on thefloor, shattered mirror on the
floor, shattered mirror on thefloor.
And then all of a sudden I was,I had my phone right by me and

(01:07:19):
then all of a sudden there waslike metal on the shelf and
actually said metal.

Speaker 1 (01:07:26):
Wow, wow.
Yeah, it's pretty cool.
Sometimes I think it's kind ofweird.
What people?

Speaker 3 (01:07:31):
don't understand you people don't understand.
It works.
You just have to know when itworks.
You cannot just say it doesn'twork.
You have to figure it out.

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
I don't know, See like I.
I know people are skepticalwith apps like that, but I'm not
going to sit there and say it'snot good for entertainment and
things like that, because therecould be entertainment, Like I
think there was one time I wasusing it and we were like doing
a spirit talking thing and itsaid pigeon nipple, I'm like

(01:08:04):
what the hell?
okay, that's weird, like whywould that even come up?
So I I'm kind of skeptical onon the spirit talker, and and
why?
Because it doesn't say anythingof of value.
But I'm not saying that itdoesn't in in real situations
either.
So if you're there and it could, you might actually pick up on

(01:08:27):
something that's actually thereyou want to know something.

Speaker 3 (01:08:33):
When I was inside the nursing home With my dad this
is in New York and I was usingthe spirit talker, they say this
nurse Is evil.
And they said I asked it whatcan you tell me about this evil
nurse?
And as a matter of fact, itsaid cops.

(01:08:56):
And then it said bridge.
And then it said and then whenI came home I did some research
on the newspaper article and itsaid Rose married.
About Rose, she actually gotshot and there was police there

(01:09:22):
on a bridge yeah, she got shotby a criminal on the bridge.
Actually, everything showed upon the Spirit Talker.
I said what can you tell meabout her?
They actually gave me all theinformation about what happened

(01:09:43):
to her.
I'm like are you kidding me?
And I looked on the newspaperarticle and everything was like
on a dot about it.
I'm like what are you kidding?

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
me that's pretty awesome, hey.
So, chris, I'm assuming like'regoing to do more research on a
lot more different things, andI'm looking forward to hearing
from you.
So if people want to talk toyou, where would they find you?

Speaker 3 (01:10:19):
You can actually, they can actually text me.
Find me on Facebook.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
Okay, and message me Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Yeah, anything, I will put them in my group
committee.
Ghost Exterminator I built theGhost Exterminator.
It's like an archive.
I built and so people can dothey have to ask permission If
they want to use my material.

(01:10:48):
I'm not going to.
I built and so people can dolike they have to ask permission
if they want to use my material.
I'm not going to if I seesomething.
If they don't, if people don'task for my permission, I'll
actually kick them out becauseI'm not going to, because I
worked really hard finding allthose records and I want to keep

(01:11:09):
them there, but you have to askpermission.
if you're doing like a projector anything, ask permission by
me.
You know Absolutely, becausethey're real documented material
, what actually happened in thearea.

Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
Yep, gotcha, it's Chris Mack.
On Facebook you have your group.
If they want to join, they canlook up some stuff.
They don't have to askpermission.
That's cool.
We're starting to wrap up.
Before we wrap up, we do thisthing at the end of every show

(01:11:49):
called this or that.
Basically, what happens iswe're just asking you a couple
questions and give you twoanswers and you just pick one.
Chris, are you down for this orthat?
All right, Awesome.
One more question, dw.

(01:12:11):
Yep, this is yours.
This is my, my turn.
Yep, all right.
So there you go.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
Fire away, my friend all right, chris, let's start
with.
Do you prefer to fly or drive?

Speaker 3 (01:12:22):
Wait a minute Drive.

Speaker 2 (01:12:27):
Okay, what Wait a minute?
What what?

Speaker 3 (01:12:31):
What is it.

Speaker 2 (01:12:32):
I'm scared of heights , so oh, okay, so in the car,
would you?

Speaker 3 (01:12:40):
rather listen to Mozart or Zeppelin Zeppelin All
right, led Zeppelin, yep.

Speaker 2 (01:12:47):
Clue or.

Speaker 3 (01:12:48):
Monopoly, zeppelin, all right, led zeppelin, yep,
clue or monopoly.
Now you call me off guard.

Speaker 1 (01:12:53):
What the heck um, um, clue all right that was very
thoughtful, I mean hey, yes,yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
Would you rather be ghost hunting with the
ghostbusters or scooby-doo inthe gang?

Speaker 3 (01:13:19):
ghostbusters.
Who can't say no to them?

Speaker 2 (01:13:23):
you know it's hard to say no to a dog, though that's.
That's why people pick hey billmurray bill murray.
That's true, yeah, right, okay,um, you perfected your time
machine.
Do you want to go to 1825 or2225?

Speaker 3 (01:13:38):
1825 all right I'll be interesting, actually to be
honest.

Speaker 2 (01:13:46):
Yeah, yeah, all right .
Elephant-sized squirrel orsquirrel-sized elephant.

Speaker 3 (01:13:54):
Squirrel-sized elephant.

Speaker 2 (01:13:57):
I think that'd be adorable.
All right, are you going tolisten to your music on vinyl
records or streaming?

Speaker 3 (01:14:05):
Streaming.

Speaker 2 (01:14:06):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:14:08):
That makes sense.

Speaker 3 (01:14:10):
I'm actually a diehard country fan.

Speaker 2 (01:14:14):
Oh, okay.

Speaker 3 (01:14:15):
I'm a big fan of Garth Brooks.

Speaker 1 (01:14:17):
Hell yeah, that's the only country I listen to right
there, a little big Garth Brooksright there.

Speaker 3 (01:14:23):
I actually have his cowboy hat.
Oh really.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Yeah, actually a cowboy hat.

Speaker 3 (01:14:28):
Oh really.

Speaker 2 (01:14:30):
Yeah, that's cool.

Speaker 3 (01:14:32):
I actually have his flannels.

Speaker 1 (01:14:38):
Why don't we wait until the end of the show?

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
I am going to move on because I'm not a Garth Brooks
fan.
We'll switch gears to chickenpox or poison ivy.

Speaker 3 (01:14:54):
Oh boy.

Speaker 2 (01:14:55):
Right Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:15:00):
Chicken pox, because I am actually highly allergic to
poison ivy.
Oh, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
Alright.
Does the toilet paper roll goover the roll or under Over?

Speaker 3 (01:15:16):
It goes over.

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
Alright, I feel like that's the right answer.
Okay, last one.
Here's the kicker John Olsen orTimothy McVeigh.

Speaker 3 (01:15:28):
I never heard of these people.
Hmm, to be honest, I neverheard of these people.
Johnny McVeigh.

Speaker 2 (01:15:45):
Combine the two.
Timothy McAlson.
Yeah, that should be here.

Speaker 1 (01:15:59):
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
That's our next shirt , timothy McAlson.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
John McVeelson.
Yeah, john McVay, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:16:12):
That's a great way for me to I know.

Speaker 1 (01:16:16):
DW's parting way.
That's perfect.
Somebody's not a Garth fan.
He's not a Garth, I don't knowwhy.
Why are you not a fan of GarthBrooks?
Dw?

Speaker 2 (01:16:27):
I'm not a country person.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
Not even Garth Brooks .

Speaker 2 (01:16:30):
Garth Brooks isn't country, that's country.
Garth Brooks is country and Idon't like country.
I admit he's talented, andmusically no, we do.
Oh my gosh Of all theimpressions in the world, we do
not need a Garth Brooksimpression from you.
No, mute him, Mute John.

(01:16:51):
How do you mute John?

Speaker 3 (01:16:54):
I actually I can tell you a few artists right now I
like.

Speaker 1 (01:17:03):
Let's not do that to DW.

Speaker 2 (01:17:06):
It's's gonna be all people I don't like and involved
I don't, to be honest, not justcountry I don't like.

Speaker 3 (01:17:13):
I like irish music oh , there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:17:16):
I mean, that's pretty cool I like.

Speaker 3 (01:17:18):
I like irish pop, hip-hop, rock, all music except
for rap and r&b I like some.

Speaker 2 (01:17:27):
But okay, but I mean we I well, and here's the thing,
I feel like I don't know, Ifeel like rap kind of like
there's classic rock, there'sclassic rap that I feel like we
haven't been able to toreplicate in recent years I

(01:17:49):
agree I agree, well right now.

Speaker 3 (01:17:54):
Right now I'm on the hunt, looking for old music I
used to listen to yeah, I getyou it um pretty easy to get.

Speaker 1 (01:18:03):
Go to Amazon and get some CDs or Spotify.

Speaker 3 (01:18:07):
I actually have Amazon Music.

Speaker 1 (01:18:09):
Yeah, let's see All right, Chris, you know what it's
been fun.
Thank you for reaching out tous and sharing with all your
research and the cool ghostchasing that you do Appreciate

(01:18:29):
every bit of that.
Thanks for coming on, man.
It was good.
Yep, you're welcome.
So, DW, you know what this?
Oh, poor DW.

Speaker 2 (01:18:40):
It's not going to be that long, I'll make it.

Speaker 1 (01:18:43):
Come on, man, all right, but this is the last time
we can, because oh, it's notgoing to be that long, I know
I'll make it.
Come on, man, all right, butthis is the last time we can,
because.

Speaker 2 (01:18:52):
Oh, dw, I have a question Like sincere, okay,
okay.

Speaker 1 (01:18:55):
So, since you don't listen to Scalarius because your
own voice is not, is you know?
You don't.

Speaker 2 (01:19:05):
Oh, am I going to listen to the next two weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
Are you going to listen to the next two weeks?

Speaker 2 (01:19:09):
Ah, that's a good question, because the thing is,
I'm just not in the habit oflistening to it.
I mean, I've got it like savedon my phone.
I just never listened to theepisodes, but that's's.
You know, I I kind oh, here'sthe thing I almost feel like I

(01:19:34):
have to, for the same reasonthat I feel like I have to
listen to the comic before mewhen I'm on stage, when I'm
going to perform, right, I feellike I have to listen to the
comic before me because I feellike the audience just see it,
just saw it.
So I feel like I have to be onthe same page as them and so if

(01:19:57):
you know the first comic, didyou know 10 minutes on such and
such subject?
I can't get up there and do thesame subject because they just
did, you know.
I feel like I have toacknowledge what just happened.
So I do feel like I'll have to.
For research purposes I'llactually have to listen, but

(01:20:18):
I'll be off because I won't beable to listen to the one that
just happened until like a weekand a half later yeah.
That's going to be tricky.

Speaker 1 (01:20:31):
I know, but it's okay because you know the guy who
has the files.

Speaker 2 (01:20:36):
So I suppose yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:40):
See, you can get like a preview before anybody else
does, and then I'll just add itto the Spotify account.
Not a problem?
No big deal, no big deal.

Speaker 2 (01:20:50):
But hey, that's a good question.

Speaker 1 (01:20:52):
Well, I figured I'd ask it because I was getting to
this.
It just took a long time to gethere.
This is what I was getting to.
If you were listening to it,you know like maybe you'd hear
what I'm about to say.
Otherwise, if you're not, thenthis is going to be the last

(01:21:13):
time you're going to hear thisfor a few weeks.
So I just thought if you hadanything to say on on my um next
, uh, you know statement thatI'm about to make you.
You know the statement dw.

Speaker 2 (01:21:28):
Oh yeah yeah, no, I, I I'll leave it to you.

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
That's your statement okay, all right.
Well, you know, chris, again,thank you very much, it was fun.
I appreciate you coming on.
You, uh man, you, you deliveredsome, some stuff and I
appreciate that all right.
Well, you know what that means.
It means that you guys havebeen amazing, we have been

(01:21:58):
scolarius and we are out Later.