August 3, 2020 • 45 mins
In part 2 of the Scarlet True Crime Podcast about Dennis Rader, the BTK killer, the Ladies of Scarlet discuss the 9th and final victim of Dennis Rader, his time in hibernation and ultimate capture.
Dennis Rader, community man, family man, church leader, loving father, and one of America's foremost serial killers. By the monicker Bind Torture Kill, BTK committed his final, and probably laziest murder in 1991. Then, for 13 years Dennis Rader went underground and put a halt to his killing spree, or so it seems, until his tremendous hubris was his final undoing. Listen to the finale of Scarlet TCP, BTK Killer | Dennis Rader everywhere podcasts are available.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Brittney Sherman (00:40):
Hey, Scarlett autos.
We are back for part two ofDennis Rader, the BTK killer,
and you are joining us now.
Thanks for listening, but we highlyrecommend you go back and listen
to part one to hear about DennisRaider's early life and his peak as
(01:02):
the BTK killer Sonia, you want to get.
A little preview of what some of ourlisteners may have missed in part
Sonia Meza-Leon (01:10):
one.
Uh, well, we talkedabout all of the murder.
Uh, essentially that happened,uh, prior to murder number
nine, which is Vicky Weatherly.
Now I'm sure you guys knowDennis Rader was BTK or sort of
pronounced himself BTK, which isthe acronym for bind, torture kill.
(01:32):
He killed 10 people between 1974 and 1991.
So current day where we left off, wewere talking about Vicki Lynn Weatherly.
And this was a murder thatoccurred on September 16th, 1986.
And Vicki when Julie was 28 years old, not
Brittney Sherman (01:53):
only was she 28, like many of his victims, tragically,
she was also a mother of two.
And, um, it was.
Her beauty and her attention toher kids that first caught Dennis
his eye as he began to stalk her.
Like he did most of his victims beforeattacking almost like I kept imagining in
(02:19):
my head and it's a terrible imagination,but like a Viper sucking its victim
before it lashes out at attacks.
Sonia Meza-Leon (02:28):
So
Brittney Sherman (02:29):
he.
As emo has shown us so far on September16th, he posed as a telephone repair man.
Like we have seen many times beforethat was a very popular thing for the
Boston strangler to do, go check out thatepisode and he cut the telephone wires.
(02:50):
Like he had done many, many times.
You want to take it from here on thistragic events, leading up to Vicky.
Sonia Meza-Leon (03:00):
Well, let's talk a little bit about his trolling as he called it.
And then he stocking that ensuedwhen he plans on, on, on his, you
know, essentially what he calledhis project, his projects and Vicky
wedge, really in particularly hereferred to her as the PJ project.
Apparently, as you said, Vickyreally caught Dennis Raiders.
(03:22):
I.
He said that he would walk byher house during the day to
listen to her, play the piano
Brittney Sherman (03:30):
in a weird way.
That's kind of a sweet, creepyit's disturbing, but it's kind of
Sonia Meza-Leon (03:36):
sweet.
I would not be playing thepiano in the day anymore.
I mean, think about like, justsort of step out of that bat
out of that for a second sort ofstep out of that for a second.
C an innocent situation where you havepeople walking by your house, you know,
maybe they hear you play music andmaybe they're like, oh, that's lovely.
(03:57):
But to think that there's a serialkiller walking right outside of
your house, listening to your musicthat you're playing and becoming
infatuated before you, you are.
Yeah, no, no, of
course
Brittney Sherman (04:07):
that's terrible.
He's a serial killer.
But like, if it was just like a normalperson that enjoyed listening to
someone, like my neighbor plays the PM.
Sometimes better than other times,but when he's playing it, well,
I quite enjoy listening to it.
It's
Sonia Meza-Leon (04:23):
nice respite.
Yeah, no, I get it in the normal world.
That would be lovely.
But in my brain with,in serial killer world,
Brittney Sherman (04:33):
what we feel about him.
Sonia Meza-Leon (04:36):
Well, but doesn't, I mean, to me, this makes me question
everyone, you know, unfortunately, becausethere are so many criminals out there
in the world and we talk about them sofrequently, you know, you start to get a
little, you know, sort of curious aboutpeople who may or may not be around
you all the time, who you think are.
Incapable of crimes likethese, that clearly are.
(04:57):
So I guess that's what I wassaying is the most disturbing part.
It's disturbing to thinkhow close he was to her, how
frequently he was close to her.
And how, I mean, he obviouslystudied this for quite a while.
So as you said, you know, hedressed up as a telephone repairman.
He went to her door.
He.
He, he, he kind of likestyled this situation.
(05:18):
Like he was walking from one houseto another checking on all of them.
Um, and so that's what the impressionwas that he gave her was that he
was checking everyone's lines.
So, you know, again, at gunpoint, hegoes into the bedroom, he ties her up,
um, you know, She guess fought withhim, causing him scratches and cuts.
(05:40):
You know, what's really interesting too,is I'd be wondering if Dennis Raiders kids
ever wondered why he had scratches andcuts if this happened on occasion, because
I think there was another occasion in oneof these murders where someone had also
scratched him naturally or maybe got him.
So he gets a rope, you know, andhe starts choking her to death.
Um, again, He starts, he took photos ofher in the different positions, you know,
(06:05):
sort of similar to what he had done.
Yeah.
Similar what he'd done beforewith the, the bondage positions,
here's where it gets crappy.
Or this woman has a husband and she'sgot a toddler in the other room.
He toddlers too.
So of course this is ours,you know, later I'm sure.
(06:28):
Um, but what's real, you know, DennisRader wynand it looks like Dennis
Rader went into the house at 10:00 AM.
Sounds like the husband wascoming home hours later.
Um, and this is what's crazy.
Oh, go ahead.
Go ahead.
Brittney Sherman (06:41):
Well, it was, I actually don't think it was that much
later because Dennis actually stoleVicki's car in her husband, saw the
car driving in the opposite direction.
Sonia Meza-Leon (06:55):
Exactly.
But that all depends on if I'mwhen time bill, bill wedge, really,
essentially the husband was driving home.
So there was time between when he, shewas there alone with a toddler, right.
It sound like some time has passed becausehe walks into the house and he's like,
you know, obviously, depending uponwhere she was, how long was she gone?
And then how long this toddler been alone.
(07:16):
So it was like, what the heck?
And it sounds like you took a littletime to figure out where the, where
the, where the toddler was as well.
So pretty terrifying.
Um, he what's really sad about thesituation is, as you said, you know, he
sees Dennis Rader who apparently lookslike every other white dude drive by.
And, um, he, I think that he seesDennis driving his wife's car.
(07:38):
Yeah.
That's what I
Brittney Sherman (07:38):
mean, he saw, again, it's driving his wife's car
going in the opposite direction,
Sonia Meza-Leon (07:43):
but don't you think that's kind of weird though that,
uh, you know, like, wouldn't you be.
I mean, who's that guy,you know, if you don't see
the
Brittney Sherman (07:51):
person driving, he might just be like, oh my wife's going out to
get groceries, but then you get home andyou see at the toddler and the wife's
gone, then you know, something's up.
Sonia Meza-Leon (07:59):
But he said, he saw Dennis sitting in the seat and driving.
He said he saw it.
He's the new he saw, oh,
Brittney Sherman (08:04):
that's this?
Oh, I didn't realize that
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:06):
part.
That's terrible.
I saw a tall man in that seat.
And by the way, I'm going to correctmyself because he says a tall man.
And I guess, I don't know.
I don't remember how tallDennis Rader was, but he wasn't.
Brittney Sherman (08:16):
I think the guy.
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:18):
Well, he, he calls him a tall man, and, but he couldn't have been
that tall because I always heard that hewas between like five, eight and five.
Maybe he was, he was describedbetween five, eight and five 10.
Brittney Sherman (08:28):
I think that I, I thought I heard at one
point, someone described him asbeing six foot, but I mean, sure.
If you see from a distance or something,you don't notice 5, 10, 6 foot, not a big
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:37):
difference.
But difference between five,eight and six, six foot.
Definitely.
Yeah.
No.
So perplexing, um, cause most people whowere over sort of five, 10, you there's
distinguishable because the averagewas much shorter than that, but yeah,
essentially bill saw his wiping drivenaway by her murder and um, then later.
(08:58):
He's accused of it because he can't,you know, I mean the tests for where
he was during her murder, because ithappened, you know, probably not so long.
What, what we don't know is how longDennis spends with his people, with his
murder, his victims, because he spenttime with her taking photos of her.
So if, if he went to her house at 10:00AM, however long it took to murder
(09:19):
her and then take all these photos.
We don't know what was crazy aboutthis situation is I feel like that
this is when this is the murderwhere Dennis starts getting sloppy.
Um, maybe he's not planted out asmuch, even though we, we, it says
clearly that he or he says he did.
But maybe it's just a simply thearrogance, but he leaves to me at least
(09:41):
too much to chance, you know, he wasn't,he totally, how would he, how does he
not know that his, her, you know, thehusband's coming home, like everybody
knows everybody's schedule and I'm in, ifI'm not mistaken, Vicky is telling you.
You know, my husband is coming home.
My husband is coming home and he realizeshe doesn't have much time, but he takes
him that he has enough time to takephotos of her in bondage positions,
(10:01):
you know, just defiling her is awful.
So yeah, that's ultimately theVicky Wagerly situation and.
Again, for a number of years,her poor husband not only had to
deal with the death of her, buthe was accused of her murder.
And I think it was almost 20 yearslater that they, that BTK finally
(10:23):
wrote a letter to the police orto the newspaper telling them.
And here's what they did.
Here's what he didbecause he's such a Dick.
He sent her for her driver's license, acopy of her driver's license and a picture
of her drawn in the position that he hadleft her, which was of course me clearly
that he was the person, the perpetrator,because no one else would have had that
(10:46):
information, but that was 20 years.
Almost 20 years later, this poorguy would go under this terrible.
I mean, that's that's yeah.
Um, so no, I know, sidenote, a side note for that.
Um, but yeah, that was, uh, Vicki Wagerly.
She was 28 when she died and she wasanother victim that was strangled.
(11:06):
So now we've got BTK back on theprowl, you know, he he's out there.
He's previous murder, April27th, 1985 Marine hedge.
And now, you know what,almost Raleigh a year later, a
little more than a year later.
Brittney Sherman (11:23):
Isn't it like six months or so later.
It's not that long.
I didn't think
Sonia Meza-Leon (11:27):
it's April 27th was a, for 85 was Marine hedge and he
didn't kill again until September
Brittney Sherman (11:33):
16th.
You're right.
You're right.
You're right.
So it was like a year and a half year.
I was thinking that Marinewas later in the year.
Yep.
Sonia Meza-Leon (11:39):
Yep.
So, so that's our numbernine victim individually, and
Brittney Sherman (11:44):
Vicki is going to be a key watershed victim
for BTK because at this point.
There was no previous to this.
I should say there wasno collection of DNA.
No one knew what it was forany of his previous victims.
In 1986, it's started to comeout and he certainly left DNA.
(12:08):
It could not be tracedto him or anyone else.
And in fact, over 1300 samples ofDNA were taken to try and Pintu.
Uh, Vicky Weatherly, but none would bepositive until almost 20 years later.
Sonia Meza-Leon (12:25):
So Britney, who was our last victim?
Brittney Sherman (12:28):
Victim number 10, 19 91.
Again, a gap of, uh, coming up on fiveyears, uh, between murders, Dolores Davis.
Uh, Dolores is 62 years old.
So again, uh, he is attackingolder women at this time.
(12:52):
Uh, Dennis is 45, 46 years old.
Uh, Vicky was younger, butwe saw Marine was, uh, 53.
Now Delores is 62 and heparticularly targeted Dolores
because she, uh, lived alone.
She was a little bit older and.
(13:14):
If I'm not mistaken, shewas a critical neighbor.
Sonia Meza-Leon (13:19):
Yeah.
She lived a mile and a half away.
Yeah.
Brittney Sherman (13:21):
So, uh, it was, he found it to be a pretty easy target.
Sonia Meza-Leon (13:27):
I feel like he's getting lazy.
Yeah.
I kind of agree.
I mean, he's like, ah, you know, Ithink by this time, because this is
1991, by this time, I think, I feellike he really wants to get caught or
he's frustrated with the police becausenobody's paying attention to him.
This is when he starts throwing downthe gauntlet with information to.
Is heavily communicating with thepolice and the newspapers and the news.
(13:51):
Like this is me, this is me.
I mean, he sends photographs ofhimself, you know, in, in hanging,
you know, and these autoeroticpositions, you know, cross dressing.
I mean, One way out ofhis way to get attention.
So it's so crazy that they can'twrap their heads around this.
And remember, you know, now I thinkwe're, we're into DNA old, right?
(14:12):
If I'm not mistaken, BTK was one of thevery first DNA test that they ever did.
Brittney Sherman (14:19):
Let's listen to mean like in 1986, when
he was, he was not tested.
Uh, but Vicky Wagerly, theDNA that was left was tested.
That was one of the earliest ones.
So the.
Database look for a DNA at thetime would have been very, very
small because you're right.
This was one of the earliestcases that tried to use DNA.
Sonia Meza-Leon (14:41):
So back to Dolores, you know, here's a poor woman again,
um, he, uh, going, you know, with theboy Scouts or the Cub Scouts, um, he
skipped, you know, slipped away again.
He drove his car.
Yeah, he does car to his parents' house.
Four minutes hit close.
(15:03):
I mean, this guy, he's such a douche bag.
He's like, really he'sreally playing this part.
Like he's so freaking cool.
He's not whole, he's not cool.
All you know, and I think that hethought he was not cool at all.
Brittney Sherman (15:13):
He's like, but he's also not evolving anything.
It's just the same routine.
Like you said, he's getting
Sonia Meza-Leon (15:18):
it doesn't have to evolve.
He just is like, I'mjust going to do well.
He's proven over and over again,and they're not going to catch him.
You know, my God, he went inwith Dolores, same situation.
He needed money blah-blah-blah hetied her up in the bedroom and then he
strangled her, you know, this poor 62year old, a woman living by herself.
He takes the car, you know, thebody and puts it in the trunk.
(15:43):
He.
It's so crazy.
He, it sounds to me like he drivesthe body, drops it off somewhere, um,
goes back to her house and wipes itall down and then goes to the church.
Yeah.
But then I think he loses his gun.
So he has to go back thereand research for his gun.
(16:05):
And then he goes, oh, Idon't remember that part.
He's like, oh shit.
You know, and he drops hisgun and then he goes back.
So he goes back, hegoes back to the church.
Um, and then he went backto where the body was.
He put it back in the trunk and hewent and dropped it off at her under
a bridge, like, oh my God, how manytimes guys move in these bodies?
And nobody seems to notice, well,he's leaving evidence everywhere.
(16:28):
I don't recall if you leftany DNA evidence with Dolores.
Um, but I think by this time he waslike scattered and freaking out and.
You know.
Oh, and here's, what's interesting Rader.
Then I am reading this directly fromWikipedia Rader, then went somewhere
to change back and do a scoutuniform and returned back to camp.
(16:48):
The following evening, he wentback to where he left the body
and took photographs of it.
So he goes back to where hedrops it off and takes pictures.
Like he, I mean, are you kidding me?
Like, there's some dudes standing theretaking pictures of a dead body and
nobody notices what is happening here.
And nobody notices, I don't believe it.
I just think it's so crazy.
(17:10):
So this is the end of a BTK.
Now remember everybody right around thistime, you know, D D this is where BTK
is escalating with all of his paperwork,his drawings, um, all his nonsense.
You know, I, I I'm unaware of any specificincident that caused him to sort of
reinvigorate something happened between1986 and 1981 or 91 that, you know,
(17:35):
caused him to sort of stop who knows?
Oh, You know, but at the end of the day,I think what we know to be true about
how Dennis Rader slash BTK was caughtwas that he had been communicating with
an investigator on the, at the police.
And, uh, he, he apparently he thoughthe developed a lovely relationship
(17:56):
with this guy and, uh, Ken, one of thedetectives, any ask Ken, if he could
send them a floppy disc, um, of somephotos and things that he wanted to send
him, if he would, if he would trace it.
And well, the police says, no, thepolice say no, uh, you know, of
course good for them for lying.
And then he, they getthis floppy disk and.
(18:20):
Fairly easy to see exactlywho authored this file.
And I guess BTK, wasn't aware of,you know, how forensic it forensics
work, but he clearly didn't,didn't protect himself in that
Brittney Sherman (18:34):
way.
Okay.
So let let's, let's back up alittle bit though, and talk about
the events that led up to this.
So from 91 to 2004, BTK,Dennis, Laid dormant.
He didn't commit any othercrimes to, you know, per se.
Uh, he at least was not tied to any otherconfirmed victims, but coming up on the
(18:59):
30th anniversary of when the first murdershappened, the Otero murders happened.
An article was published from abiography about the BTK killer.
And Dennis read thisarticle in the newspaper.
Wait, wait, this isn't accurate.
He's not telling it right.
(19:21):
And he's trying to takecredit for my own story.
If anyone's going to getcredit for telling my story,
I'm going to tell my story.
He was provoked again because hethought someone else was going
to get credit for his work.
Not necessarily, they're going totake credit for the, for, for the
murders, but they're going to getthe notoriety for writing about him.
So that goes against his ego,his hubris that gets him caught.
(19:43):
So.
No, he starts sending letters againand pictures, uh, copies of pictures.
Cause like you said before,he never sent the originals.
He always made copies of letters andpictures and sent the photocopies
and he left like a box thatshowed that had a Barbie doll
posed in, I think the way that.
(20:07):
Violent way that Vicki Weatherlywas found, I believe it's.
Sonia Meza-Leon (20:12):
And he did, he, he sent them more than one Barbie
doll posed as one of his victims.
And, um, he would send this tolike big box stores or some store.
And, um, the, the second one, uh, well,I know there are at least two, the
other one that I knew of was posed likeJosephine hanging from, uh, Oh, see then,
Brittney Sherman (20:31):
and that goes back to what I said in part one, listen to that.
It's terrible.
Uh, but Josephine is an 11 year old girl.
And you just said it was found hangingfrom PVC pipe, which is just awful.
He, he even posted picturesaround town, behind street signs.
His victims, he fancied himself an artist.
(20:53):
He was a terrible artist.
Um, but I want to also quickly talkabout that floppy disk like that,
that you discussed, because the waythat the investigators communicated
with him was really clever.
I don't know if you read about this.
He was communicating with this detectiveand asked, as you said, can you trace a
(21:18):
floppy disc back to its original ownerand instead of a yes or no conversation
communication, they actually agreedupon putting something in the crossword
puzzle of the, uh, local newspaper.
(21:40):
And if there were like certain lettersin there or numbers, or however it worked
that was going to give him the answer.
It was really, I thought
Sonia Meza-Leon (21:49):
it was very clever, but what was the, well, the answer
was he going to get yes or no?
Brittney Sherman (21:53):
Yes or no, but it wasn't going to say yes or no.
It was going to be like, if it'sthese three letters in a row or,
or the answer to this clue issuch and such, that's already.
Oh,
Sonia Meza-Leon (22:04):
this guy he's such a jerk.
So I here's where I want to step backtoo, because you know, we're down.
We're, we're, we're atour 10 murder victims.
We know that he's killed 10 people.
I, I personally don't believe hewas dormant and he actually has
written a lot about all of the timesthat he tried to commit the same
(22:27):
crime and he wasn't successful.
I just think he got one.
I think there got lazy.
There was a person he had planned tomurder and he, it didn't actually happen.
And then there was another woman, Ithink it was her name, Anne Williams,
where he went over to her house and, youknow, she didn't show up or something,
but he said that happened quite a lot.
That wasn't the first timeI've been, it wouldn't be.
(22:50):
He said he
Brittney Sherman (22:50):
got bored waiting.
So decided not to go throughwith it, like, come on.
Are you like, wow, I be so you're right.
When, when I say supposedly whendormant, we don't know for sure.
Uh,
Sonia Meza-Leon (23:04):
yeah.
I think those, I think that those are hisunsuccessful times, to be honest with you.
I don't think he ever went dormant.
He may say.
And I think that part of that was the two.
I do believe that he did.
Well, here's what the, you know, a lotof people, oh, well, he, he didn't, you
know, sort of confess to other murders.
Were there other murders happening?
Like how could they not tie him to them?
You know, if it was the samesituation and there was likely
(23:25):
DNA, why couldn't they be tied?
Like, how are people unaware ofother murders happening around them?
Brittney Sherman (23:30):
No, totally.
Uh, so the, the floppy disc, they wereable to track the metadata from Microsoft
word, which is really easy to check.
If anyone knows how to.
Basic things about Microsoft word.
And so they didn't find that it washim specifically, but they found that
it was a guy named Dennis and thatthe Microsoft word was registered to
(23:53):
the church that Dennis Rader attended.
So now they narrowed it down to anyonenamed Dennis at this particular church.
And keep in mind they had hisDNA from 1986, but they didn't
have any current DNA to match it.
So they got really clever.
(24:13):
The detectives knew his daughterattended Kansas state university.
So went to the campus universityhealth center and collected DNA,
which I think is really crazyfrom a pap smear that she had.
I have to say, when I heard this,I thought, what about HIPAA laws?
I don't understand how they coulddo that and get away with it, but
(24:36):
it actually worked out for the bestbecause they were able to compare her
DNA to the DNA, found at the crimescene of Vicki Wagerly and they were
able to tie of course, to Dennis rater.
Sonia Meza-Leon (24:50):
Yeah.
And what's interesting is I watcheda, um, uh, some video on YouTube.
I can't remember the name of it.
Sorry guys.
But.
Interviewed and she describesthe situation herself.
She says that exact thingthat they got the DNA from.
They got that.
What she said was they felt theygot they, what did they say?
She is?
So they associated my father'sDNA with DNA, from my pap smear.
(25:14):
And I was just like in a reallyconnected it, you know, because
here's a woman sitting there sayingthat this is my father and they use
me to prove it really, really crazy.
I mean, and I think that.
Uh, uh, there were, uh, there wereother, there were other murders.
I don't think that they had tied to himuntil also, you know, when his daughter
was being interviewed, she told them, Ithink that they didn't tie the Marine,
(25:36):
their neighbor nor Dolores to Dennis Raderuntil, um, I think maybe his daughter
had mentioned it because she knew them.
Brittney Sherman (25:44):
Yeah, they were neighbors.
There were.
Yeah.
Uh, he, um, so afterthe confirmed the DNA.
Yeah, it was academic from there.
He was pulled over for a routine stop.
He was arrested.
He knew exactly why he was being arrested.
He had been waiting 30 years to getcaught and he finally got the notoriety
(26:09):
that he had been hoping for and heopenly confessed to all of his crimes.
So that way it, his namewould become famous.
Sonia Meza-Leon (26:19):
So here's some other crazy things about Dennis Rader.
I just wanted to sort of wrap it up withthis because obviously he confessed no
death penalty in Kansas at the time.
So he got 10 consecutive life terms.
He knows he's not getting out by theway, he's in solitary confinement.
He doesn't get to be aroundany of the other inmates.
So just so that.
And I feel like it alsolets them off the hook.
(26:40):
Also, it sounds like people are prettypissed off the victims in particular,
because he can buy stuff with the money hemakes or earns or gets in jail and he has
a TV and other stuff, so he can sit in hislittle solitary confinement and, you know,
whatever, but it's really discussing.
It's frustrating.
I don't think that's fair.
Um, you know, but the other thing I wantto mention is, you know, he, oh, Dennis.
(27:07):
When he's being interviewed,he's still like kind of
disconnected from what he did.
He's talking to these guys likethey're his buddies and he, when
the police, he asked the policewhere he talks to police about the
floppy, he gets offended that they.
Uh, you know, he askedthem, you know, yeah.
He, they lied to him and that, thatwas how, why would you lie to me?
(27:31):
I mean, that's so crazy, but, um,other than things that he said during
the interview that I thought wasreally weird, was that how yeah.
They asked, he asked how longhe was going to be there.
Um, you know, because he had otherthings to do and you know, he's like,
am I going to be here for like, yeah,you'll probably be here for a while.
The other thing that he said right afterthat, that I thought was so flipping
(27:52):
gross was he asked if he could writeBTK on his coffee mug in the, you
know, when he was being interviewed.
So it wouldn't get mixed upwith anybody else's oh my God.
That's the Sherri.
That's the cherry on the top for meright there that tells me that this
guy doesn't never, he's never cared.
He doesn't care.
He never will care about what hedid to be so flippant and to be so
(28:17):
obsessed with taking responsibilityfor these horrendous crimes and to
say something so freaking stupid.
Oh, I think also when he was beingarrested, he asked for them to
tell his wife that he's going tobe late for lunch or something.
I mean, just.
Stupid.
Like, are you kidding me?
Um, but you know, I, I didn't find toomany conversations like videos with that
(28:38):
interviewed dinner's Raider directly.
Um, but they most certainly sure that.
Brittney Sherman (28:43):
Well, I, I, well, I'm sure that all the detectives and
officers do, I don't want to see, Idon't want to see interviews with him.
I don't want him to have notoriety he'sD he was the, the talk of 2005 for sure.
And years later, it's 15 years later.
Now his name has.
(29:03):
Fallen out of the headlines, hisfamily has dropped all communication.
His, his wife filed for anemergency divorce and it was
granted right after he confessed.
His kids do not communicate with him.
Uh, and his kids feel really badand guilty because they feel like.
(29:24):
I should've seen this.
I should've seen the, the,the patterns and the evidence.
He left clues that they're recognized.
They thought, never thought it couldbe possible because it's their dad
and who wouldn't think that, but nowthey live with this guilt and say,
had they put two and two together.
They absolutely would have turned him in.
(29:46):
They, they do not feel anycloseness or Alliance with them.
And they agree with the rest of theworld that he is a disgusting, horrible
human being who deserves to rut in.
Sonia Meza-Leon (29:58):
Yep.
Um, a couple of other things tonote, um, you know, I just want to
talk a little bit about all of the.
The, uh, things that the BTK killerhad, Dennis Rader inspired and, uh,
co uh, many, many things in the media.
I mentioned that he had writtenhis, a book confession of a serial
(30:19):
killer, um, with Catherine Ramzan,I guess she's a forensic psychic.
This was a guided autobiography.
She says, and it sounds like thatthe proceeds of that went to the
victims, but that was certainlyto, you know, stroke Raider's ego.
He wasn't doing it for them.
You know, he might not get themoney for it, but who cares now?
(30:40):
Also mentioned that his daughterwas, um, you know, writing a book
about surviving demonstrator.
So you know, that talking about, youknow, how they found out and things
like that, I'm on the fence about that.
I don't know.
I would kind of justlet it go in my opinion.
I don't know how, you knowwhat I mean, like yeah.
Uh, I don't, I don't want to bestill want to seem opportunistic
(31:01):
in a moment like that.
Right.
Cause I, I mean her kids,his kids definitely see
themselves as victim number 11.
They totally, that, thatthey've said that, you know?
Yeah.
And, and I agree.
The other things that you'll see in themedia that was there or inspired by BTK
was a, I guess, a novella written byStephen King called a good marriage.
And then a film.
(31:22):
I did not see the film, butI love seeing me king I'm
Brittney Sherman (31:25):
also on Amazon prime, but I
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:27):
didn't have time.
I'm gonna watch it.
Yeah, it sounds well, I don't know.
Sometimes Stephen King movies.
Aren't so good.
Brittney Sherman (31:36):
I'm just saying, that's why I
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:37):
decided to know.
I'm not sure.
Well, so sidebar, what Stephen King moviewould you say would be a good movie?
I mean, there's only one I couldthink of maybe two shining and
be the shining Salem's lot.
It was a great, I haven't
Brittney Sherman (31:53):
seen, um, I think the,
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:56):
I liked pet cemetery, but it was kinda cheesy.
Brittney Sherman (31:58):
I, um, I really like the remake of it.
I haven't seen part two, but partone or chapter one, I think is.
Surprised the heck out of me, howmuch, how good I thought that.
Sonia Meza-Leon (32:09):
Yeah, it's good.
It's just not like, I mean,to me, the book and the movies
are completely different.
It's crazy.
But I love seeing the king isone of my favorite writers.
I started reading him whenhe was, when I was 10.
Um, the other things that have inspiredby Raider are, which I did not know was
that Thomas Harris who wrote red dragon.
And then of course the lambs, right.
(32:30):
He said that he based Francis dollarhides character on him in red dragon,
which I was like, Hmm, I guess Idid not even really associate that.
Then there was the hunt for watching that.
Yeah, no, totally a hunt for the BTKkiller, which is what I watched it was.
And I got a lot of my informationfrom it was really interesting.
Um, I also listened to generation Y andtheir podcast episode about, uh, dentist.
(32:53):
And it was interesting as well,as well as serial killers.
I listened to serial class.
That was really good.
It was, I liked their take on stuff.
Last, but not least.
I would like to remind all of us thatthe BTK killer was featured in mine,
hunter, uh, seasons one and two, whichI'm hopeful that there'll be coming back.
(33:17):
But, um, I would love to see theirportrayal of Dennis Rader, um, you
know, completed and to see his, um,you know, his crimes come to fruition.
So that's a lot out there.
I mean, I, I, like Isaid, I hate this guy.
I mean, I can't think of a better, anyother way, like a slow, painful death.
(33:39):
Somebody really knows what they're doing.
Like, I would say Dexter'sperfect for this guy.
Like, let somebody kill him, who wouldkeep him alive and let him be a pain,
like tear him apart, limb from limb,throw him in an ant bed, whatever.
I mean, I don't know.
There's not enough to, to.
I mean, he just did such terriblethings and he just appears
to not give a shit about it.
(34:00):
He doesn't care about anybody else.
He doesn't care about his own family.
It's just so crazy.
And to see pictures of him and hisfamily, um, you know, I really feel
for them, but, and of course, certainlywe all we feel for the victims to
cause the things that they've gonethrough as the guy who survived.
Holy crap.
I mean, that's just, Ugh.
And then the guy, the guy who had towatch his mom be murdered, I mean, it
(34:20):
was a path of devastation and it's,it's, we're glad that it's over, but.
I have to say, I'm sad that it tookthem so long to figure that out.
And that's
Brittney Sherman (34:28):
the part that is, is really tragic because
they had their opportunities.
We've seen this before.
We've read about other cases.
We've watched other examples.
It's just really sad becausehe had, he wanted to be caught
because he wanted that fame andnotoriety and he was begging for it.
(34:50):
And it wasn't until.
He kind of was like, screw it.
I'm done.
I'm he practically just gave himself.
Sonia Meza-Leon (34:59):
Kind of, yeah.
I want to go back for a minute and talk alittle bit about all the jobs that he had,
because to me I'm like the trail of, youknow, the jobs really sort of spoke to me.
He worked, uh, like you said,he was in the air force.
Um, apparently he was a butcher at onepoint in some, some market, he worked
at an outdoor supply company, fancythat cords ropes, things like that.
(35:22):
And that's how he also knewhow to, he knew how to.
Actually, uh, create a lotof different kinds of knots.
Cause he was a Cub scout boy scout guy.
Um, he also was the ADT security systemsrepresentative, which is holy racy.
He was a census field operations person.
(35:42):
So he got to go to every single person'shouse that asked them who lived there,
how old they were and what they did.
So talk about invasive.
The sky was taken, uh, making hislist, you know, I'm sure he figured out
people that he wanted to target doing.
And then he was a dog catcherand a compliance officer.
And here's what threw me over the edge.
Again.
I was like, are you freaking kidding me?
(36:04):
He, as a compliance officer getsto go visit the field office
where they've got their BTK, youknow, sort of task force underway.
He gets to walk in there and see all ofthis work happening, searching for him.
Like I'm sure.
I floated his boat.
And I think this is around the timewhere, you know, people were getting
frustrated with him and he people thataren't really, he wasn't a nice guy.
(36:27):
You know, he like had a dog euthanized.
He was really horrible to people.
Um, from the compliance standpoint,when he wasn't, he was a
total asshole, everyone hates.
Yeah.
And I mean, she filed arestraining order on him.
So they had a restraining ordersituation on this guy too.
He said some terrible things to people.
He told one woman that hewas stopped bothering her.
If she got rid of herboy, I mean, it's crazy.
(36:50):
So, you know, again, we're to the end ofthe story, I think at the end of every
story, we always have this conversationabout how we're so surprised that
nobody could figure it out sooner.
Um, this one, you know, I just, I I'mlike you, I feel like he just kind of
gave it up himself at the very end.
He wanted to get.
Brittney Sherman (37:09):
Yeah, he totally did.
I in a, he wanted to get it caught muchearlier something I forgot to mention,
but wanted to, you know, we talked abouthow Dolores was a neighbor that he knew.
He actually comforted, comfortedher family during the Memorial
and the days after her death.
So that was just a little something Imeant to mention earlier and I forgot
(37:29):
about, and it was very reminiscentto me as well as the way that he was
caught and confessed of aerial cat.
Sonia Meza-Leon (37:36):
I know I was just gonna say that totally because Ariel
Castro's like, he's, you know, sortof creating this connection between
these people, a false connection,because it's something that can sort
of instigated, but he's now workinghis way in horrendous Dennis Rader.
For me, he's my number one, you know,hate, hate, hated serial killer.
(37:58):
I.
'cause he just, I can't believe.
I mean, I'm sure more people havekilled or people have killed more
people than he has Def, but the waythat he did it and starting with
the children, that was the nurse.
And what else was weird about it?
To me, this case, I think the worstmurders happened at the beginning
and he deescalated, I agree.
Brittney Sherman (38:18):
That's.
Sonia Meza-Leon (38:20):
Yeah.
That's not common thoughfor serial killer.
So there were a lot of things that werePlex perplexing about him, but, um, he's
still alive and well sitting, watchingcable and El Dorado correctional facility.
So if you wanted to send hima note, you probably could.
I guess he got in trouble, like right.
For like some kind of male thing.
Um, some, some kind of male issues he got,he's been a, he's been a great whatever.
(38:43):
You know what, whatever you are whenyou're in jail, a prisoner, um, he
hasn't except for some kind of jail,a mail thing, because he's either
sent something or he got somethingthat he wasn't supposed to get.
I don't think those guys should get anymail by the way, screw them, but I'm
sure he's often married to somebody else.
Brittney Sherman (38:58):
All right.
Uh, so Sonia, you mentioneda lot of your sources.
I want to give credit to biography.
Uh, Wikipedia naturally.
Uh, I actually read an original newsarticle from the, uh, from, uh, uh, the
Wichita Eagle where, uh, that BTK sentletters to, and it was an article about,
uh, one of the letters where he claimedto kill seven, uh, then, uh, Murderpedia.
(39:24):
All that's interesting.com and youjust turned me on to surviving BTK,
which was a really fascinating website.
And I'm glad you turned thaton to me because there's a
ton of good information here.
Sonia Meza-Leon (39:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
They really did their research andthey've got a lot of good videos.
So that's a really great website.
Check it out.
You guys surviving btk.weebly.com.
And they've got a lot of really goodinformation and we, you know, we count
on all of these different sources.
For our information and we're happy togive them credit, you know, where credit
is due because they've done so much
Brittney Sherman (39:57):
legwork of new information from us.
We're not discovering anything new.
Sonia Meza-Leon (40:01):
Yeah, definitely.
But I think we're compiling in, in a waythat hopefully is interesting for people.
Um, you know, I mean that, that'sour, that's our mission is to give you
guys some entertainment while we'regiving you details about true crime.
So that is up and let us knowhow we're doing and vote for.
Yay.
Brittney Sherman (40:18):
Yeah.
So, uh, check us out for the 2020podcast awards in the people's
choice and, uh, society, podcasts,society, and culture podcast section.
Um, we were shocked and surprisedand happy to be nominated.
So please check us out and vote.
Um, we're, we're thrilled and dropus a line on all of our social media
(40:41):
channels on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook.
I think those are all the big ones.
Sonia Meza-Leon (40:48):
Yep.
And follow us at our, you can alsosubscribe to us on Patrion, which we love.
We have a couple of patriotic folksthese days, and we're going to be doing
some giveaways for our Patrion peeps toshow them some recognition because we
sure do appreciate their subscriptions.
Also, when I give a shout out to a coupleof fellow podcasters out there, We've
got music city, nine 11 coming out ofNashville with Brandon Hall and folks,
(41:11):
they do a great job over there andyou'll hear their premiere at the end
of the episode, as well as meanwhile,at the studio, which is a little studio
in winter Haven, Florida, my hometown.
That's trying to try to make it to thebig time and I want to support them.
So I'll be sharing their promo as well.
All
Brittney Sherman (41:30):
right.
It's Carlitos love haven'tyou listened to us.
Like share, subscribe, follow, enjoy.
Well, any final word, Sonia?
Sonia Meza-Leon (41:41):
Nope.
Hit us up.
Let us know how we're doing.
Let us know if you have any suggestionsfor episodes or we're all yours.
Brittney Sherman (41:47):
Stick around for few promos.
After the show, we arethe ladies of Scarlet.
Keep
Sonia Meza-Leon (41:54):
killing it.
Brittney Sherman (42:04):
Now check out a couple other podcasters that support us, and we
Sonia Meza-Leon (42:09):
want to give them some support.
Hey, fellow Scarlet, true crime listeners.
I'm CC the host of a new true crimepodcast, sooner state, true crime
as a born and bred Oki I'll covercases based in my wonderful home
state of Oklahoma, the term sooneractually refers to tutors in the land.
(42:33):
My state's very first true crime.
New episodes are released twice amonth and apple podcasts and most
podcasts apps or visit our website,anchor.fm/crime state to listen now.
So come away with me to my crime stateon the sooner state true crime podcast.
And please stay sooner safe out there.
(42:53):
Y'all.
Hi everyone.
I'm Ariel Cooksey, host of malice.
When violent acts occur, we tend tothink the predators are monsters.
Surely no human could do suchthings, but if we're honest, only
humans commit malicious crime.
(43:15):
And if you're like me, youwant to know why to find out.
Join me at malice, whereveryou listen to podcasts by.
Hey, y'all I'm Brandon Hall.
I'm one of the hosts of music city,nine 11, a podcast about the good,
the bad, and the dark side of nine 11.
Dispatching me and my co-hostsare 9 1 1 dispatchers.
(43:39):
With over 60 years of experience.
Join us as we play 9 1 1calls and discuss them.
Oh, did I mention that we get.
9 1 1.
What's your emergency?
(44:13):
And they stopped my daughter-in-law
You can find us on Facebook, Twitter, andInstagram at music city nine 11, and we're
downloadable on every podcast platform.
Brittney Sherman (44:33):
We want to give a shout out to the pod all
the time podcast network that weScarlet TCP are proud members of
Sonia Meza-Leon (44:42):
other members of the pod.
All the time podcast network, our creativeintuitive, another digital citizen history
of a haunting round and round the podcast.
Real AKA truth podcast, ruck uppodcast, random unnamed podcast bourbon.
Three PS in the podcast, Ross sex podcast.
(45:05):
I think we're doing it podcast.
Brittney Sherman (45:08):
So if you like what you're hearing from Scarlet TCP, check
out these other shows that members ofthe pod all the time podcast network.
Hey, Scarlett autos.
We are back for part two ofDennis Rader, the BTK killer,
and you are joining us now.
Thanks for listening, but we highlyrecommend you go back and listen
to part one to hear about DennisRaider's early life and his peak as
(01:02):
the BTK killer Sonia, you want to get.
A little preview of what some of ourlisteners may have missed in part
Sonia Meza-Leon (01:10):
one.
Uh, well, we talkedabout all of the murder.
Uh, essentially that happened,uh, prior to murder number
nine, which is Vicky Weatherly.
Now I'm sure you guys knowDennis Rader was BTK or sort of
pronounced himself BTK, which isthe acronym for bind, torture kill.
(01:32):
He killed 10 people between 1974 and 1991.
So current day where we left off, wewere talking about Vicki Lynn Weatherly.
And this was a murder thatoccurred on September 16th, 1986.
And Vicki when Julie was 28 years old, not
Brittney Sherman (01:53):
only was she 28, like many of his victims, tragically,
she was also a mother of two.
And, um, it was.
Her beauty and her attention toher kids that first caught Dennis
his eye as he began to stalk her.
Like he did most of his victims beforeattacking almost like I kept imagining in
(02:19):
my head and it's a terrible imagination,but like a Viper sucking its victim
before it lashes out at attacks.
Sonia Meza-Leon (02:28):
So
Brittney Sherman (02:29):
he.
As emo has shown us so far on September16th, he posed as a telephone repair man.
Like we have seen many times beforethat was a very popular thing for the
Boston strangler to do, go check out thatepisode and he cut the telephone wires.
(02:50):
Like he had done many, many times.
You want to take it from here on thistragic events, leading up to Vicky.
Sonia Meza-Leon (03:00):
Well, let's talk a little bit about his trolling as he called it.
And then he stocking that ensuedwhen he plans on, on, on his, you
know, essentially what he calledhis project, his projects and Vicky
wedge, really in particularly hereferred to her as the PJ project.
Apparently, as you said, Vickyreally caught Dennis Raiders.
(03:22):
I.
He said that he would walk byher house during the day to
listen to her, play the piano
Brittney Sherman (03:30):
in a weird way.
That's kind of a sweet, creepyit's disturbing, but it's kind of
Sonia Meza-Leon (03:36):
sweet.
I would not be playing thepiano in the day anymore.
I mean, think about like, justsort of step out of that bat
out of that for a second sort ofstep out of that for a second.
C an innocent situation where you havepeople walking by your house, you know,
maybe they hear you play music andmaybe they're like, oh, that's lovely.
(03:57):
But to think that there's a serialkiller walking right outside of
your house, listening to your musicthat you're playing and becoming
infatuated before you, you are.
Yeah, no, no, of
course
Brittney Sherman (04:07):
that's terrible.
He's a serial killer.
But like, if it was just like a normalperson that enjoyed listening to
someone, like my neighbor plays the PM.
Sometimes better than other times,but when he's playing it, well,
I quite enjoy listening to it.
It's
Sonia Meza-Leon (04:23):
nice respite.
Yeah, no, I get it in the normal world.
That would be lovely.
But in my brain with,in serial killer world,
Brittney Sherman (04:33):
what we feel about him.
Sonia Meza-Leon (04:36):
Well, but doesn't, I mean, to me, this makes me question
everyone, you know, unfortunately, becausethere are so many criminals out there
in the world and we talk about them sofrequently, you know, you start to get a
little, you know, sort of curious aboutpeople who may or may not be around
you all the time, who you think are.
Incapable of crimes likethese, that clearly are.
(04:57):
So I guess that's what I wassaying is the most disturbing part.
It's disturbing to thinkhow close he was to her, how
frequently he was close to her.
And how, I mean, he obviouslystudied this for quite a while.
So as you said, you know, hedressed up as a telephone repairman.
He went to her door.
He.
He, he, he kind of likestyled this situation.
(05:18):
Like he was walking from one houseto another checking on all of them.
Um, and so that's what the impressionwas that he gave her was that he
was checking everyone's lines.
So, you know, again, at gunpoint, hegoes into the bedroom, he ties her up,
um, you know, She guess fought withhim, causing him scratches and cuts.
(05:40):
You know, what's really interesting too,is I'd be wondering if Dennis Raiders kids
ever wondered why he had scratches andcuts if this happened on occasion, because
I think there was another occasion in oneof these murders where someone had also
scratched him naturally or maybe got him.
So he gets a rope, you know, andhe starts choking her to death.
Um, again, He starts, he took photos ofher in the different positions, you know,
(06:05):
sort of similar to what he had done.
Yeah.
Similar what he'd done beforewith the, the bondage positions,
here's where it gets crappy.
Or this woman has a husband and she'sgot a toddler in the other room.
He toddlers too.
So of course this is ours,you know, later I'm sure.
(06:28):
Um, but what's real, you know, DennisRader wynand it looks like Dennis
Rader went into the house at 10:00 AM.
Sounds like the husband wascoming home hours later.
Um, and this is what's crazy.
Oh, go ahead.
Go ahead.
Brittney Sherman (06:41):
Well, it was, I actually don't think it was that much
later because Dennis actually stoleVicki's car in her husband, saw the
car driving in the opposite direction.
Sonia Meza-Leon (06:55):
Exactly.
But that all depends on if I'mwhen time bill, bill wedge, really,
essentially the husband was driving home.
So there was time between when he, shewas there alone with a toddler, right.
It sound like some time has passed becausehe walks into the house and he's like,
you know, obviously, depending uponwhere she was, how long was she gone?
And then how long this toddler been alone.
(07:16):
So it was like, what the heck?
And it sounds like you took a littletime to figure out where the, where
the, where the toddler was as well.
So pretty terrifying.
Um, he what's really sad about thesituation is, as you said, you know, he
sees Dennis Rader who apparently lookslike every other white dude drive by.
And, um, he, I think that he seesDennis driving his wife's car.
(07:38):
Yeah.
That's what I
Brittney Sherman (07:38):
mean, he saw, again, it's driving his wife's car
going in the opposite direction,
Sonia Meza-Leon (07:43):
but don't you think that's kind of weird though that,
uh, you know, like, wouldn't you be.
I mean, who's that guy,you know, if you don't see
the
Brittney Sherman (07:51):
person driving, he might just be like, oh my wife's going out to
get groceries, but then you get home andyou see at the toddler and the wife's
gone, then you know, something's up.
Sonia Meza-Leon (07:59):
But he said, he saw Dennis sitting in the seat and driving.
He said he saw it.
He's the new he saw, oh,
Brittney Sherman (08:04):
that's this?
Oh, I didn't realize that
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:06):
part.
That's terrible.
I saw a tall man in that seat.
And by the way, I'm going to correctmyself because he says a tall man.
And I guess, I don't know.
I don't remember how tallDennis Rader was, but he wasn't.
Brittney Sherman (08:16):
I think the guy.
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:18):
Well, he, he calls him a tall man, and, but he couldn't have been
that tall because I always heard that hewas between like five, eight and five.
Maybe he was, he was describedbetween five, eight and five 10.
Brittney Sherman (08:28):
I think that I, I thought I heard at one
point, someone described him asbeing six foot, but I mean, sure.
If you see from a distance or something,you don't notice 5, 10, 6 foot, not a big
Sonia Meza-Leon (08:37):
difference.
But difference between five,eight and six, six foot.
Definitely.
Yeah.
No.
So perplexing, um, cause most people whowere over sort of five, 10, you there's
distinguishable because the averagewas much shorter than that, but yeah,
essentially bill saw his wiping drivenaway by her murder and um, then later.
(08:58):
He's accused of it because he can't,you know, I mean the tests for where
he was during her murder, because ithappened, you know, probably not so long.
What, what we don't know is how longDennis spends with his people, with his
murder, his victims, because he spenttime with her taking photos of her.
So if, if he went to her house at 10:00AM, however long it took to murder
(09:19):
her and then take all these photos.
We don't know what was crazy aboutthis situation is I feel like that
this is when this is the murderwhere Dennis starts getting sloppy.
Um, maybe he's not planted out asmuch, even though we, we, it says
clearly that he or he says he did.
But maybe it's just a simply thearrogance, but he leaves to me at least
(09:41):
too much to chance, you know, he wasn't,he totally, how would he, how does he
not know that his, her, you know, thehusband's coming home, like everybody
knows everybody's schedule and I'm in, ifI'm not mistaken, Vicky is telling you.
You know, my husband is coming home.
My husband is coming home and he realizeshe doesn't have much time, but he takes
him that he has enough time to takephotos of her in bondage positions,
(10:01):
you know, just defiling her is awful.
So yeah, that's ultimately theVicky Wagerly situation and.
Again, for a number of years,her poor husband not only had to
deal with the death of her, buthe was accused of her murder.
And I think it was almost 20 yearslater that they, that BTK finally
(10:23):
wrote a letter to the police orto the newspaper telling them.
And here's what they did.
Here's what he didbecause he's such a Dick.
He sent her for her driver's license, acopy of her driver's license and a picture
of her drawn in the position that he hadleft her, which was of course me clearly
that he was the person, the perpetrator,because no one else would have had that
(10:46):
information, but that was 20 years.
Almost 20 years later, this poorguy would go under this terrible.
I mean, that's that's yeah.
Um, so no, I know, sidenote, a side note for that.
Um, but yeah, that was, uh, Vicki Wagerly.
She was 28 when she died and she wasanother victim that was strangled.
(11:06):
So now we've got BTK back on theprowl, you know, he he's out there.
He's previous murder, April27th, 1985 Marine hedge.
And now, you know what,almost Raleigh a year later, a
little more than a year later.
Brittney Sherman (11:23):
Isn't it like six months or so later.
It's not that long.
I didn't think
Sonia Meza-Leon (11:27):
it's April 27th was a, for 85 was Marine hedge and he
didn't kill again until September
Brittney Sherman (11:33):
16th.
You're right.
You're right.
You're right.
So it was like a year and a half year.
I was thinking that Marinewas later in the year.
Yep.
Sonia Meza-Leon (11:39):
Yep.
So, so that's our numbernine victim individually, and
Brittney Sherman (11:44):
Vicki is going to be a key watershed victim
for BTK because at this point.
There was no previous to this.
I should say there wasno collection of DNA.
No one knew what it was forany of his previous victims.
In 1986, it's started to comeout and he certainly left DNA.
(12:08):
It could not be tracedto him or anyone else.
And in fact, over 1300 samples ofDNA were taken to try and Pintu.
Uh, Vicky Weatherly, but none would bepositive until almost 20 years later.
Sonia Meza-Leon (12:25):
So Britney, who was our last victim?
Brittney Sherman (12:28):
Victim number 10, 19 91.
Again, a gap of, uh, coming up on fiveyears, uh, between murders, Dolores Davis.
Uh, Dolores is 62 years old.
So again, uh, he is attackingolder women at this time.
(12:52):
Uh, Dennis is 45, 46 years old.
Uh, Vicky was younger, butwe saw Marine was, uh, 53.
Now Delores is 62 and heparticularly targeted Dolores
because she, uh, lived alone.
She was a little bit older and.
(13:14):
If I'm not mistaken, shewas a critical neighbor.
Sonia Meza-Leon (13:19):
Yeah.
She lived a mile and a half away.
Yeah.
Brittney Sherman (13:21):
So, uh, it was, he found it to be a pretty easy target.
Sonia Meza-Leon (13:27):
I feel like he's getting lazy.
Yeah.
I kind of agree.
I mean, he's like, ah, you know, Ithink by this time, because this is
1991, by this time, I think, I feellike he really wants to get caught or
he's frustrated with the police becausenobody's paying attention to him.
This is when he starts throwing downthe gauntlet with information to.
Is heavily communicating with thepolice and the newspapers and the news.
(13:51):
Like this is me, this is me.
I mean, he sends photographs ofhimself, you know, in, in hanging,
you know, and these autoeroticpositions, you know, cross dressing.
I mean, One way out ofhis way to get attention.
So it's so crazy that they can'twrap their heads around this.
And remember, you know, now I thinkwe're, we're into DNA old, right?
(14:12):
If I'm not mistaken, BTK was one of thevery first DNA test that they ever did.
Brittney Sherman (14:19):
Let's listen to mean like in 1986, when
he was, he was not tested.
Uh, but Vicky Wagerly, theDNA that was left was tested.
That was one of the earliest ones.
So the.
Database look for a DNA at thetime would have been very, very
small because you're right.
This was one of the earliestcases that tried to use DNA.
Sonia Meza-Leon (14:41):
So back to Dolores, you know, here's a poor woman again,
um, he, uh, going, you know, with theboy Scouts or the Cub Scouts, um, he
skipped, you know, slipped away again.
He drove his car.
Yeah, he does car to his parents' house.
Four minutes hit close.
(15:03):
I mean, this guy, he's such a douche bag.
He's like, really he'sreally playing this part.
Like he's so freaking cool.
He's not whole, he's not cool.
All you know, and I think that hethought he was not cool at all.
Brittney Sherman (15:13):
He's like, but he's also not evolving anything.
It's just the same routine.
Like you said, he's getting
Sonia Meza-Leon (15:18):
it doesn't have to evolve.
He just is like, I'mjust going to do well.
He's proven over and over again,and they're not going to catch him.
You know, my God, he went inwith Dolores, same situation.
He needed money blah-blah-blah hetied her up in the bedroom and then he
strangled her, you know, this poor 62year old, a woman living by herself.
He takes the car, you know, thebody and puts it in the trunk.
(15:43):
He.
It's so crazy.
He, it sounds to me like he drivesthe body, drops it off somewhere, um,
goes back to her house and wipes itall down and then goes to the church.
Yeah.
But then I think he loses his gun.
So he has to go back thereand research for his gun.
(16:05):
And then he goes, oh, Idon't remember that part.
He's like, oh shit.
You know, and he drops hisgun and then he goes back.
So he goes back, hegoes back to the church.
Um, and then he went backto where the body was.
He put it back in the trunk and hewent and dropped it off at her under
a bridge, like, oh my God, how manytimes guys move in these bodies?
And nobody seems to notice, well,he's leaving evidence everywhere.
(16:28):
I don't recall if you leftany DNA evidence with Dolores.
Um, but I think by this time he waslike scattered and freaking out and.
You know.
Oh, and here's, what's interesting Rader.
Then I am reading this directly fromWikipedia Rader, then went somewhere
to change back and do a scoutuniform and returned back to camp.
(16:48):
The following evening, he wentback to where he left the body
and took photographs of it.
So he goes back to where hedrops it off and takes pictures.
Like he, I mean, are you kidding me?
Like, there's some dudes standing theretaking pictures of a dead body and
nobody notices what is happening here.
And nobody notices, I don't believe it.
I just think it's so crazy.
(17:10):
So this is the end of a BTK.
Now remember everybody right around thistime, you know, D D this is where BTK
is escalating with all of his paperwork,his drawings, um, all his nonsense.
You know, I, I I'm unaware of any specificincident that caused him to sort of
reinvigorate something happened between1986 and 1981 or 91 that, you know,
(17:35):
caused him to sort of stop who knows?
Oh, You know, but at the end of the day,I think what we know to be true about
how Dennis Rader slash BTK was caughtwas that he had been communicating with
an investigator on the, at the police.
And, uh, he, he apparently he thoughthe developed a lovely relationship
(17:56):
with this guy and, uh, Ken, one of thedetectives, any ask Ken, if he could
send them a floppy disc, um, of somephotos and things that he wanted to send
him, if he would, if he would trace it.
And well, the police says, no, thepolice say no, uh, you know, of
course good for them for lying.
And then he, they getthis floppy disk and.
(18:20):
Fairly easy to see exactlywho authored this file.
And I guess BTK, wasn't aware of,you know, how forensic it forensics
work, but he clearly didn't,didn't protect himself in that
Brittney Sherman (18:34):
way.
Okay.
So let let's, let's back up alittle bit though, and talk about
the events that led up to this.
So from 91 to 2004, BTK,Dennis, Laid dormant.
He didn't commit any othercrimes to, you know, per se.
Uh, he at least was not tied to any otherconfirmed victims, but coming up on the
(18:59):
30th anniversary of when the first murdershappened, the Otero murders happened.
An article was published from abiography about the BTK killer.
And Dennis read thisarticle in the newspaper.
Wait, wait, this isn't accurate.
He's not telling it right.
(19:21):
And he's trying to takecredit for my own story.
If anyone's going to getcredit for telling my story,
I'm going to tell my story.
He was provoked again because hethought someone else was going
to get credit for his work.
Not necessarily, they're going totake credit for the, for, for the
murders, but they're going to getthe notoriety for writing about him.
So that goes against his ego,his hubris that gets him caught.
(19:43):
So.
No, he starts sending letters againand pictures, uh, copies of pictures.
Cause like you said before,he never sent the originals.
He always made copies of letters andpictures and sent the photocopies
and he left like a box thatshowed that had a Barbie doll
posed in, I think the way that.
(20:07):
Violent way that Vicki Weatherlywas found, I believe it's.
Sonia Meza-Leon (20:12):
And he did, he, he sent them more than one Barbie
doll posed as one of his victims.
And, um, he would send this tolike big box stores or some store.
And, um, the, the second one, uh, well,I know there are at least two, the
other one that I knew of was posed likeJosephine hanging from, uh, Oh, see then,
Brittney Sherman (20:31):
and that goes back to what I said in part one, listen to that.
It's terrible.
Uh, but Josephine is an 11 year old girl.
And you just said it was found hangingfrom PVC pipe, which is just awful.
He, he even posted picturesaround town, behind street signs.
His victims, he fancied himself an artist.
(20:53):
He was a terrible artist.
Um, but I want to also quickly talkabout that floppy disk like that,
that you discussed, because the waythat the investigators communicated
with him was really clever.
I don't know if you read about this.
He was communicating with this detectiveand asked, as you said, can you trace a
(21:18):
floppy disc back to its original ownerand instead of a yes or no conversation
communication, they actually agreedupon putting something in the crossword
puzzle of the, uh, local newspaper.
(21:40):
And if there were like certain lettersin there or numbers, or however it worked
that was going to give him the answer.
It was really, I thought
Sonia Meza-Leon (21:49):
it was very clever, but what was the, well, the answer
was he going to get yes or no?
Brittney Sherman (21:53):
Yes or no, but it wasn't going to say yes or no.
It was going to be like, if it'sthese three letters in a row or,
or the answer to this clue issuch and such, that's already.
Oh,
Sonia Meza-Leon (22:04):
this guy he's such a jerk.
So I here's where I want to step backtoo, because you know, we're down.
We're, we're, we're atour 10 murder victims.
We know that he's killed 10 people.
I, I personally don't believe hewas dormant and he actually has
written a lot about all of the timesthat he tried to commit the same
(22:27):
crime and he wasn't successful.
I just think he got one.
I think there got lazy.
There was a person he had planned tomurder and he, it didn't actually happen.
And then there was another woman, Ithink it was her name, Anne Williams,
where he went over to her house and, youknow, she didn't show up or something,
but he said that happened quite a lot.
That wasn't the first timeI've been, it wouldn't be.
(22:50):
He said he
Brittney Sherman (22:50):
got bored waiting.
So decided not to go throughwith it, like, come on.
Are you like, wow, I be so you're right.
When, when I say supposedly whendormant, we don't know for sure.
Uh,
Sonia Meza-Leon (23:04):
yeah.
I think those, I think that those are hisunsuccessful times, to be honest with you.
I don't think he ever went dormant.
He may say.
And I think that part of that was the two.
I do believe that he did.
Well, here's what the, you know, a lotof people, oh, well, he, he didn't, you
know, sort of confess to other murders.
Were there other murders happening?
Like how could they not tie him to them?
You know, if it was the samesituation and there was likely
(23:25):
DNA, why couldn't they be tied?
Like, how are people unaware ofother murders happening around them?
Brittney Sherman (23:30):
No, totally.
Uh, so the, the floppy disc, they wereable to track the metadata from Microsoft
word, which is really easy to check.
If anyone knows how to.
Basic things about Microsoft word.
And so they didn't find that it washim specifically, but they found that
it was a guy named Dennis and thatthe Microsoft word was registered to
(23:53):
the church that Dennis Rader attended.
So now they narrowed it down to anyonenamed Dennis at this particular church.
And keep in mind they had hisDNA from 1986, but they didn't
have any current DNA to match it.
So they got really clever.
(24:13):
The detectives knew his daughterattended Kansas state university.
So went to the campus universityhealth center and collected DNA,
which I think is really crazyfrom a pap smear that she had.
I have to say, when I heard this,I thought, what about HIPAA laws?
I don't understand how they coulddo that and get away with it, but
(24:36):
it actually worked out for the bestbecause they were able to compare her
DNA to the DNA, found at the crimescene of Vicki Wagerly and they were
able to tie of course, to Dennis rater.
Sonia Meza-Leon (24:50):
Yeah.
And what's interesting is I watcheda, um, uh, some video on YouTube.
I can't remember the name of it.
Sorry guys.
But.
Interviewed and she describesthe situation herself.
She says that exact thingthat they got the DNA from.
They got that.
What she said was they felt theygot they, what did they say?
She is?
So they associated my father'sDNA with DNA, from my pap smear.
(25:14):
And I was just like in a reallyconnected it, you know, because
here's a woman sitting there sayingthat this is my father and they use
me to prove it really, really crazy.
I mean, and I think that.
Uh, uh, there were, uh, there wereother, there were other murders.
I don't think that they had tied to himuntil also, you know, when his daughter
was being interviewed, she told them, Ithink that they didn't tie the Marine,
(25:36):
their neighbor nor Dolores to Dennis Raderuntil, um, I think maybe his daughter
had mentioned it because she knew them.
Brittney Sherman (25:44):
Yeah, they were neighbors.
There were.
Yeah.
Uh, he, um, so afterthe confirmed the DNA.
Yeah, it was academic from there.
He was pulled over for a routine stop.
He was arrested.
He knew exactly why he was being arrested.
He had been waiting 30 years to getcaught and he finally got the notoriety
(26:09):
that he had been hoping for and heopenly confessed to all of his crimes.
So that way it, his namewould become famous.
Sonia Meza-Leon (26:19):
So here's some other crazy things about Dennis Rader.
I just wanted to sort of wrap it up withthis because obviously he confessed no
death penalty in Kansas at the time.
So he got 10 consecutive life terms.
He knows he's not getting out by theway, he's in solitary confinement.
He doesn't get to be aroundany of the other inmates.
So just so that.
And I feel like it alsolets them off the hook.
(26:40):
Also, it sounds like people are prettypissed off the victims in particular,
because he can buy stuff with the money hemakes or earns or gets in jail and he has
a TV and other stuff, so he can sit in hislittle solitary confinement and, you know,
whatever, but it's really discussing.
It's frustrating.
I don't think that's fair.
Um, you know, but the other thing I wantto mention is, you know, he, oh, Dennis.
(27:07):
When he's being interviewed,he's still like kind of
disconnected from what he did.
He's talking to these guys likethey're his buddies and he, when
the police, he asked the policewhere he talks to police about the
floppy, he gets offended that they.
Uh, you know, he askedthem, you know, yeah.
He, they lied to him and that, thatwas how, why would you lie to me?
(27:31):
I mean, that's so crazy, but, um,other than things that he said during
the interview that I thought wasreally weird, was that how yeah.
They asked, he asked how longhe was going to be there.
Um, you know, because he had otherthings to do and you know, he's like,
am I going to be here for like, yeah,you'll probably be here for a while.
The other thing that he said right afterthat, that I thought was so flipping
(27:52):
gross was he asked if he could writeBTK on his coffee mug in the, you
know, when he was being interviewed.
So it wouldn't get mixed upwith anybody else's oh my God.
That's the Sherri.
That's the cherry on the top for meright there that tells me that this
guy doesn't never, he's never cared.
He doesn't care.
He never will care about what hedid to be so flippant and to be so
(28:17):
obsessed with taking responsibilityfor these horrendous crimes and to
say something so freaking stupid.
Oh, I think also when he was beingarrested, he asked for them to
tell his wife that he's going tobe late for lunch or something.
I mean, just.
Stupid.
Like, are you kidding me?
Um, but you know, I, I didn't find toomany conversations like videos with that
(28:38):
interviewed dinner's Raider directly.
Um, but they most certainly sure that.
Brittney Sherman (28:43):
Well, I, I, well, I'm sure that all the detectives and
officers do, I don't want to see, Idon't want to see interviews with him.
I don't want him to have notoriety he'sD he was the, the talk of 2005 for sure.
And years later, it's 15 years later.
Now his name has.
(29:03):
Fallen out of the headlines, hisfamily has dropped all communication.
His, his wife filed for anemergency divorce and it was
granted right after he confessed.
His kids do not communicate with him.
Uh, and his kids feel really badand guilty because they feel like.
(29:24):
I should've seen this.
I should've seen the, the,the patterns and the evidence.
He left clues that they're recognized.
They thought, never thought it couldbe possible because it's their dad
and who wouldn't think that, but nowthey live with this guilt and say,
had they put two and two together.
They absolutely would have turned him in.
(29:46):
They, they do not feel anycloseness or Alliance with them.
And they agree with the rest of theworld that he is a disgusting, horrible
human being who deserves to rut in.
Sonia Meza-Leon (29:58):
Yep.
Um, a couple of other things tonote, um, you know, I just want to
talk a little bit about all of the.
The, uh, things that the BTK killerhad, Dennis Rader inspired and, uh,
co uh, many, many things in the media.
I mentioned that he had writtenhis, a book confession of a serial
(30:19):
killer, um, with Catherine Ramzan,I guess she's a forensic psychic.
This was a guided autobiography.
She says, and it sounds like thatthe proceeds of that went to the
victims, but that was certainlyto, you know, stroke Raider's ego.
He wasn't doing it for them.
You know, he might not get themoney for it, but who cares now?
(30:40):
Also mentioned that his daughterwas, um, you know, writing a book
about surviving demonstrator.
So you know, that talking about, youknow, how they found out and things
like that, I'm on the fence about that.
I don't know.
I would kind of justlet it go in my opinion.
I don't know how, you knowwhat I mean, like yeah.
Uh, I don't, I don't want to bestill want to seem opportunistic
(31:01):
in a moment like that.
Right.
Cause I, I mean her kids,his kids definitely see
themselves as victim number 11.
They totally, that, thatthey've said that, you know?
Yeah.
And, and I agree.
The other things that you'll see in themedia that was there or inspired by BTK
was a, I guess, a novella written byStephen King called a good marriage.
And then a film.
(31:22):
I did not see the film, butI love seeing me king I'm
Brittney Sherman (31:25):
also on Amazon prime, but I
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:27):
didn't have time.
I'm gonna watch it.
Yeah, it sounds well, I don't know.
Sometimes Stephen King movies.
Aren't so good.
Brittney Sherman (31:36):
I'm just saying, that's why I
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:37):
decided to know.
I'm not sure.
Well, so sidebar, what Stephen King moviewould you say would be a good movie?
I mean, there's only one I couldthink of maybe two shining and
be the shining Salem's lot.
It was a great, I haven't
Brittney Sherman (31:53):
seen, um, I think the,
Sonia Meza-Leon (31:56):
I liked pet cemetery, but it was kinda cheesy.
Brittney Sherman (31:58):
I, um, I really like the remake of it.
I haven't seen part two, but partone or chapter one, I think is.
Surprised the heck out of me, howmuch, how good I thought that.
Sonia Meza-Leon (32:09):
Yeah, it's good.
It's just not like, I mean,to me, the book and the movies
are completely different.
It's crazy.
But I love seeing the king isone of my favorite writers.
I started reading him whenhe was, when I was 10.
Um, the other things that have inspiredby Raider are, which I did not know was
that Thomas Harris who wrote red dragon.
And then of course the lambs, right.
(32:30):
He said that he based Francis dollarhides character on him in red dragon,
which I was like, Hmm, I guess Idid not even really associate that.
Then there was the hunt for watching that.
Yeah, no, totally a hunt for the BTKkiller, which is what I watched it was.
And I got a lot of my informationfrom it was really interesting.
Um, I also listened to generation Y andtheir podcast episode about, uh, dentist.
(32:53):
And it was interesting as well,as well as serial killers.
I listened to serial class.
That was really good.
It was, I liked their take on stuff.
Last, but not least.
I would like to remind all of us thatthe BTK killer was featured in mine,
hunter, uh, seasons one and two, whichI'm hopeful that there'll be coming back.
(33:17):
But, um, I would love to see theirportrayal of Dennis Rader, um, you
know, completed and to see his, um,you know, his crimes come to fruition.
So that's a lot out there.
I mean, I, I, like Isaid, I hate this guy.
I mean, I can't think of a better, anyother way, like a slow, painful death.
(33:39):
Somebody really knows what they're doing.
Like, I would say Dexter'sperfect for this guy.
Like, let somebody kill him, who wouldkeep him alive and let him be a pain,
like tear him apart, limb from limb,throw him in an ant bed, whatever.
I mean, I don't know.
There's not enough to, to.
I mean, he just did such terriblethings and he just appears
to not give a shit about it.
(34:00):
He doesn't care about anybody else.
He doesn't care about his own family.
It's just so crazy.
And to see pictures of him and hisfamily, um, you know, I really feel
for them, but, and of course, certainlywe all we feel for the victims to
cause the things that they've gonethrough as the guy who survived.
Holy crap.
I mean, that's just, Ugh.
And then the guy, the guy who had towatch his mom be murdered, I mean, it
(34:20):
was a path of devastation and it's,it's, we're glad that it's over, but.
I have to say, I'm sad that it tookthem so long to figure that out.
And that's
Brittney Sherman (34:28):
the part that is, is really tragic because
they had their opportunities.
We've seen this before.
We've read about other cases.
We've watched other examples.
It's just really sad becausehe had, he wanted to be caught
because he wanted that fame andnotoriety and he was begging for it.
(34:50):
And it wasn't until.
He kind of was like, screw it.
I'm done.
I'm he practically just gave himself.
Sonia Meza-Leon (34:59):
Kind of, yeah.
I want to go back for a minute and talk alittle bit about all the jobs that he had,
because to me I'm like the trail of, youknow, the jobs really sort of spoke to me.
He worked, uh, like you said,he was in the air force.
Um, apparently he was a butcher at onepoint in some, some market, he worked
at an outdoor supply company, fancythat cords ropes, things like that.
(35:22):
And that's how he also knewhow to, he knew how to.
Actually, uh, create a lotof different kinds of knots.
Cause he was a Cub scout boy scout guy.
Um, he also was the ADT security systemsrepresentative, which is holy racy.
He was a census field operations person.
(35:42):
So he got to go to every single person'shouse that asked them who lived there,
how old they were and what they did.
So talk about invasive.
The sky was taken, uh, making hislist, you know, I'm sure he figured out
people that he wanted to target doing.
And then he was a dog catcherand a compliance officer.
And here's what threw me over the edge.
Again.
I was like, are you freaking kidding me?
(36:04):
He, as a compliance officer getsto go visit the field office
where they've got their BTK, youknow, sort of task force underway.
He gets to walk in there and see all ofthis work happening, searching for him.
Like I'm sure.
I floated his boat.
And I think this is around the timewhere, you know, people were getting
frustrated with him and he people thataren't really, he wasn't a nice guy.
(36:27):
You know, he like had a dog euthanized.
He was really horrible to people.
Um, from the compliance standpoint,when he wasn't, he was a
total asshole, everyone hates.
Yeah.
And I mean, she filed arestraining order on him.
So they had a restraining ordersituation on this guy too.
He said some terrible things to people.
He told one woman that hewas stopped bothering her.
If she got rid of herboy, I mean, it's crazy.
(36:50):
So, you know, again, we're to the end ofthe story, I think at the end of every
story, we always have this conversationabout how we're so surprised that
nobody could figure it out sooner.
Um, this one, you know, I just, I I'mlike you, I feel like he just kind of
gave it up himself at the very end.
He wanted to get.
Brittney Sherman (37:09):
Yeah, he totally did.
I in a, he wanted to get it caught muchearlier something I forgot to mention,
but wanted to, you know, we talked abouthow Dolores was a neighbor that he knew.
He actually comforted, comfortedher family during the Memorial
and the days after her death.
So that was just a little something Imeant to mention earlier and I forgot
(37:29):
about, and it was very reminiscentto me as well as the way that he was
caught and confessed of aerial cat.
Sonia Meza-Leon (37:36):
I know I was just gonna say that totally because Ariel
Castro's like, he's, you know, sortof creating this connection between
these people, a false connection,because it's something that can sort
of instigated, but he's now workinghis way in horrendous Dennis Rader.
For me, he's my number one, you know,hate, hate, hated serial killer.
(37:58):
I.
'cause he just, I can't believe.
I mean, I'm sure more people havekilled or people have killed more
people than he has Def, but the waythat he did it and starting with
the children, that was the nurse.
And what else was weird about it?
To me, this case, I think the worstmurders happened at the beginning
and he deescalated, I agree.
Brittney Sherman (38:18):
That's.
Sonia Meza-Leon (38:20):
Yeah.
That's not common thoughfor serial killer.
So there were a lot of things that werePlex perplexing about him, but, um, he's
still alive and well sitting, watchingcable and El Dorado correctional facility.
So if you wanted to send hima note, you probably could.
I guess he got in trouble, like right.
For like some kind of male thing.
Um, some, some kind of male issues he got,he's been a, he's been a great whatever.
(38:43):
You know what, whatever you are whenyou're in jail, a prisoner, um, he
hasn't except for some kind of jail,a mail thing, because he's either
sent something or he got somethingthat he wasn't supposed to get.
I don't think those guys should get anymail by the way, screw them, but I'm
sure he's often married to somebody else.
Brittney Sherman (38:58):
All right.
Uh, so Sonia, you mentioneda lot of your sources.
I want to give credit to biography.
Uh, Wikipedia naturally.
Uh, I actually read an original newsarticle from the, uh, from, uh, uh, the
Wichita Eagle where, uh, that BTK sentletters to, and it was an article about,
uh, one of the letters where he claimedto kill seven, uh, then, uh, Murderpedia.
(39:24):
All that's interesting.com and youjust turned me on to surviving BTK,
which was a really fascinating website.
And I'm glad you turned thaton to me because there's a
ton of good information here.
Sonia Meza-Leon (39:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
They really did their research andthey've got a lot of good videos.
So that's a really great website.
Check it out.
You guys surviving btk.weebly.com.
And they've got a lot of really goodinformation and we, you know, we count
on all of these different sources.
For our information and we're happy togive them credit, you know, where credit
is due because they've done so much
Brittney Sherman (39:57):
legwork of new information from us.
We're not discovering anything new.
Sonia Meza-Leon (40:01):
Yeah, definitely.
But I think we're compiling in, in a waythat hopefully is interesting for people.
Um, you know, I mean that, that'sour, that's our mission is to give you
guys some entertainment while we'regiving you details about true crime.
So that is up and let us knowhow we're doing and vote for.
Yay.
Brittney Sherman (40:18):
Yeah.
So, uh, check us out for the 2020podcast awards in the people's
choice and, uh, society, podcasts,society, and culture podcast section.
Um, we were shocked and surprisedand happy to be nominated.
So please check us out and vote.
Um, we're, we're thrilled and dropus a line on all of our social media
(40:41):
channels on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook.
I think those are all the big ones.
Sonia Meza-Leon (40:48):
Yep.
And follow us at our, you can alsosubscribe to us on Patrion, which we love.
We have a couple of patriotic folksthese days, and we're going to be doing
some giveaways for our Patrion peeps toshow them some recognition because we
sure do appreciate their subscriptions.
Also, when I give a shout out to a coupleof fellow podcasters out there, We've
got music city, nine 11 coming out ofNashville with Brandon Hall and folks,
(41:11):
they do a great job over there andyou'll hear their premiere at the end
of the episode, as well as meanwhile,at the studio, which is a little studio
in winter Haven, Florida, my hometown.
That's trying to try to make it to thebig time and I want to support them.
So I'll be sharing their promo as well.
All
Brittney Sherman (41:30):
right.
It's Carlitos love haven'tyou listened to us.
Like share, subscribe, follow, enjoy.
Well, any final word, Sonia?
Sonia Meza-Leon (41:41):
Nope.
Hit us up.
Let us know how we're doing.
Let us know if you have any suggestionsfor episodes or we're all yours.
Brittney Sherman (41:47):
Stick around for few promos.
After the show, we arethe ladies of Scarlet.
Keep
Sonia Meza-Leon (41:54):
killing it.
Brittney Sherman (42:04):
Now check out a couple other podcasters that support us, and we
Sonia Meza-Leon (42:09):
want to give them some support.
Hey, fellow Scarlet, true crime listeners.
I'm CC the host of a new true crimepodcast, sooner state, true crime
as a born and bred Oki I'll covercases based in my wonderful home
state of Oklahoma, the term sooneractually refers to tutors in the land.
(42:33):
My state's very first true crime.
New episodes are released twice amonth and apple podcasts and most
podcasts apps or visit our website,anchor.fm/crime state to listen now.
So come away with me to my crime stateon the sooner state true crime podcast.
And please stay sooner safe out there.
(42:53):
Y'all.
Hi everyone.
I'm Ariel Cooksey, host of malice.
When violent acts occur, we tend tothink the predators are monsters.
Surely no human could do suchthings, but if we're honest, only
humans commit malicious crime.
(43:15):
And if you're like me, youwant to know why to find out.
Join me at malice, whereveryou listen to podcasts by.
Hey, y'all I'm Brandon Hall.
I'm one of the hosts of music city,nine 11, a podcast about the good,
the bad, and the dark side of nine 11.
Dispatching me and my co-hostsare 9 1 1 dispatchers.
(43:39):
With over 60 years of experience.
Join us as we play 9 1 1calls and discuss them.
Oh, did I mention that we get.
9 1 1.
What's your emergency?
(44:13):
And they stopped my daughter-in-law
You can find us on Facebook, Twitter, andInstagram at music city nine 11, and we're
downloadable on every podcast platform.
Brittney Sherman (44:33):
We want to give a shout out to the pod all
the time podcast network that weScarlet TCP are proud members of
Sonia Meza-Leon (44:42):
other members of the pod.
All the time podcast network, our creativeintuitive, another digital citizen history
of a haunting round and round the podcast.
Real AKA truth podcast, ruck uppodcast, random unnamed podcast bourbon.
Three PS in the podcast, Ross sex podcast.
(45:05):
I think we're doing it podcast.
Brittney Sherman (45:08):
So if you like what you're hearing from Scarlet TCP, check
out these other shows that members ofthe pod all the time podcast network.
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