August 13, 2025 • 53 mins
Ever catch yourself taking the long way around to happiness? This fascinating exploration begins with a light-hearted debate about crab legs and lamb chops before diving into something much deeper—how we often complicate our lives unnecessarily.
What starts as a conversation about food evolves into a profound discussion about efficiency—accomplishing your goals while using the least amount of energy, time, and resources. Through the lens of Independent Scientology principles and Dianetic axioms, we examine why so many of us create complex, exhausting paths when simpler routes exist.
The heart of our conversation revolves around the counter-efforts we face in life and how we process them. When challenges come our way, we either integrate them wisely for future growth or become aberrated by them, creating unusual solutions that require exponentially more effort than addressing root causes directly. This pattern repeats across careers, relationships, personal growth, and even day-to-day activities.
We share insights about self-determinism, the importance of understanding which agreements you enter into, and how the mind processes both pro-survival and contra-survival experiences. One particularly illuminating moment comes through a personal story about clay demonstrations in training—revealing how resistance to initial effort often prevents the change that would eliminate countless future difficulties.
Whether you're feeling overwhelmed by life's complexities or simply interested in working smarter rather than harder, this episode offers practical wisdom for reducing unnecessary cycles of action while increasing happiness and effectiveness. Join us to discover how the simple pleasures—like laughter, joy, and even the perfect bite of crab—might require far less effort than you think.
Ready to experience more by doing less? Subscribe to our podcast, visit gporg.org, or explore the College of Independent Scientology's online platform to continue your journey toward greater efficiency and happiness.
Website: ao-gp.org
Be social and join US!: collegeofindependentscientology.com
Take our personality test and get a free evaluation: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/RHJQ6DY
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
All right, welcome to another Scientology Outside of
the Church podcast.
This is season 11, episode 21.
I got the episode right thistime after two mistakes in the
last two podcasts.
Apologies to our listeners.
Sometimes you lose track whenyou do this many podcasts in a
week.
We're still shooting foranother three this week,
hopefully like we did last week.
(00:22):
And the title of this one.
Oh and the podcast is broughtto you by gporg, our main site
for the delivery of independentScientology.
This is a podcast, always aboutindependent Scientology.
We are not affiliated with thecorporate church of Scientology
whatsoever, nor do we want to be, and the College of Independent
(00:45):
Scientology, which is ouronline social media platform and
online course room.
I'm here with Arthur Mudakis,who's been struggling to get his
internet situated andeverything, and we think we've
got it in place, and theomnipresent Quentin Stroud.
How are you guys this afternoonthere in Malaysia?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Very good, yeah, we're both here now.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, it's really nice here too, even though we're
towards the latter part ofwinter.
We're going to do a podcast onyou're doing too much.
This is going to be.
This will be a fun one.
We've already been gigglingabout it before we started.
So you're doing too much.
(01:32):
So, quentin, do you want totake the lead on this one,
because you might be able to doit better than I can, but I'd be
happy to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
It's your call talk to them about how you guys kind
of fell into this conversationwell it it.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
it occurred over some food and I thought it was lamb
and I thought, okay, that's anawful lot of effort for what you
get out of a lamb chop.
So and then I thought, crap,that's like crab legs.
Crab legs is the effort putinto the crab legs does not
equal the amount of caloriesthat you get out, because
(02:12):
there's not a lot of calories incrab.
So I thought that'd be aninteresting podcast, because
life is very much like that andwe'll get into the cycles of
action and the correctestimation of effort and all of
that.
But there's a lot more to thisthan it sounds like.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
So Well, you know, first of all, I just want to
start off by saying lamb chopsare delicious and crab is the
bomb.
Yes, and so.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
Yes.
And I don't eat crab legs and Idon't eat crab legs.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
I don't eat crab legs for the caloric intake.
I eat crab legs because youdipped them in nice garlic
butter with some Obey seasoningand, baby, you got something
going on for yourself.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
And I'm happy to spend a whole day roasting a leg
of lamb on a low heat just forthat final product.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Well, that's good leg of lamb is leg of lamb is.
You know it's there's.
There's a better payoff therethan there is lamb chops,
because you got this fat andthis gristle and you know just
uh and I just cut that off andand I just, you know, just go,
just go for the primary proteinthere.
But that's just me.
But it's also like anotherthing and you guys, especially
(03:36):
being in the, I can't use.
I won't say it.
You guys are in the Orient.
Is that politically correct?
Quentin, can I use that term?
We're in Southeast Asia, you'rein the orient.
Is that politically correct?
Quentin, can I use that term?
We're in southeast asia, you'rein, you're in the orient.
And my, my biggest beef withoriental food is when, when I
order oriental takeout is 20minutes later.
(03:59):
I'm hungry because there's this, it's rice, you know, it's
carbs and all of that stuff andso, and and granted, it's cheap,
but this is, this is.
This podcast is about your lifeand the, the roi, the return of
investment, of effort that youput in, if you know, and, and
(04:21):
that comes down to a lot ofthings in life where you get
what you pay for.
But we're not looking at itnecessarily from a monetary
standpoint alone.
We're looking at it from thedecisions you make in life and
the, the, the effort that youput in to life because you've
heard the expression worksmarter, not harder.
And that is you're, when youpick up a body and you're born,
(04:48):
an infant and everything likethat.
You have an allotted amount oftime and what is it that?
And this could come down totime management.
But it's not just timemanagement, it's the decisions,
the amount of effort that youput in the pro-survival actions
you take, as opposed to thecounter-survival actions that
(05:09):
you take.
I've been working with a new PCin Las Vegas going over the
axioms, and every time I go overthe axioms I have like five
podcasts I think of that wehaven't done before, and we're
always talking about thescientology and dianetic axioms
anyway.
So quentin over to you, that'sthe preamble for the whole thing
(05:32):
and how this whole thing gotstarted, and then we'll bounce
it off of each other andeverything.
It'll probably be a lot of funso.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
So you and I come from a very different background
and for me, I've never reallybeen one to eat for.
To be full Like that's not.
That's like even when I wasyounger.
I would always eat, like even Iremember back in college I
would eat half now and halflater.
I would always save half amillion.
I think you and I talked aboutthis at one point when we went
(06:01):
to the Indian restaurant.
I would always eat half now andhalf later.
And so I hear you when you say,oh, I'll eat a nice Asian dish
and I'll be even hungry twohours later.
Yep, that kind of happens, butI kind of prepare for that.
What I'll say is that when wetalk about doing too much, we're
really looking at what am Iputting into anything that I'm
(06:24):
doing?
Right?
It could be a work effort, itcould be a familial you know
kind of situation it could be.
You know, obviously, what we'retalking about when it comes to
mental health and spiritualprogress.
What am I doing to get a gainfrom this?
And what I'll say is is that inmy journey and my experience
(06:46):
there's these simple pleasuresthat I tend to kind of gravitate
towards right, like a nice,like being able to break the
crab leg open and pull out thewhole piece of meat Like that's
a simple pleasure for me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
It doesn't happen every time.
It doesn't happen every time.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
It doesn't happen every time.
Sometimes you got to dig up inthere, but just being able to
crack it open and put the wholepiece, that's how simple and I
feel, I feel like I won theuniverse, the game of the
universe, when I put that pieceof crap out Right.
But also, but also in life,like the ability just to be able
to laugh, like laughter, is tome a simple pleasure.
(07:27):
Mirth, joy.
These are simple pleasures andit's oftentimes we feel like we
got to do a lot to get to thatplace.
We got to do a lot to get like.
I want to just be able to behappy again, and there's this
idea that I have to do a lot toget there.
And it might not necessarily betrue.
You know, sometimes people putso much effort into like trying
(07:53):
to figure this whole thing out,and it doesn't have to take that
much in my opinion right, and Ithink a lot of that is is
taught behavior too, becausewe're taught that you have to.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
You know, the only way to get ahead is to work
really, really hard.
So already you're alreadydefeated in in some sense,
because if you're one thatdoesn't want to work super,
duper hard, um, then you're notgoing to work hard, but then do
you have to work hard, andthat's that's the funny thing
about it, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (08:21):
yeah, and, and that is in the dianetic axioms.
Uh, I'm trying to find the the,the correct one here, let's see
if I've got it.
I have it pulled up here bearwith me um here it is.
(08:43):
Let's see here.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Well, before you read it, I just had a small little
realization.
I think that, um, I think thething that makes it hard is the
lack of understanding towardsyour future potential goal.
So if you don't understand whatyour goal is is, then of course
it's going to be hard becauseyou need to learn.
You need to, for example.
(09:10):
Like, let's say, let's say youare cooking lamb cutlets, for
example.
It's an easy goal.
It might have a little bit oftime attached to it, but it's an
easy goal and you know how todo it.
So therefore, you're willing togive it that time because you
understand the process ofcooking a lamb cutlet.
Now let's say you want tosucceed in life in another area
(09:31):
that you're not quiteunderstanding or well versed at.
That's probably where adifferent kind of effort occurs
a mental effort plus physicaleffort and and I found it, and
it's axiom 113 of the dianeticsaxioms.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Reality is the agreement upon perceptions and
data in the physical universe.
The subtext below it is allthat we can be sure is real is
that on which we have agreed isreal.
Agreement is the essence ofreality.
And then there's also the axiomwhere he talks about there are
(10:10):
three universes there's mine,yours and the agreed-upon
universe that you agree withothers on.
So when you're looking at theamount of time because this goes
directly to your point, artiethat one puts in to something,
(10:32):
it's taught that you have towork hard as opposed to smart,
yeah, pretty much.
So.
If you look at something, theway, the amount of cycles of
action you do when you'reyounger and you have a body
that's able and capable and canstay up until four in the
(10:55):
morning and doesn't feel it, anddo two hours of sleep and
you're bulletproof, and all ofthat they say that youth is
wasted on the young kind ofthing and as the body starts to
slow down, you start to think Ineed to work smarter, not harder
(11:16):
, in order to get something done, but you have to be able to
have the comparable magnitudesin order to do that, which is
personal policy that you'velearned, usually from your
mistakes, because policy is whatyou're working off of, of
comparable magnitudes, both withthe analytical mind you as a
(11:37):
thetan and what the reactivemind has, the fixed attention
and the resistance that you haveof being pushed off a position
in space.
And I must do this, I must dothis, I can't do this, I'm not
going to change because thishappened to, that happened or
whatever.
(11:57):
And so now you're off course toa certain degree, from going
straight.
Now you're going to the rightor to the left.
So if you're working harder,you're going to the right or to
the left.
So if you're working harder,you're not correctly estimating
the amount of effort that youhave to put in to something.
Go ahead, Glenn, I see you wantto say something.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
That's right, and I think that Art kind of gave the
cheat code a little bit becausehe was like yeah, but if you see
the vision right, if you seethe end goal, the end phenomenon
, if you know what you'repursuing, your goal, then it
(12:37):
seems to be easier towardsmoving towards that.
How many of us in life whetherit be a job or whatever how many
of us in life we don't reallyknow our end goal?
So we just get up and we do, wedo things every day, we go
almost on automatic, almost likea routine.
That this is life.
And it seems to get harder andharder and harder because you're
(12:59):
not kind of going at an endgoal.
You know when I work with moneyand where I work with my clients
when it comes to money, Ialways start at the end what are
you trying to accomplish here?
What are you trying toaccomplish with your finances?
What are you trying toaccomplish with your goals?
And then let's start makingdecisions and some of those
decisions might feel like a, youknow, feel a little difficult,
(13:20):
like I got to cut out this orcut out that, I gotta turn off
the cable, I do whatever,whatever.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
But if we know the goal, per what archer said, if
we know the goal and what we'regoing after, it seems to be a
lot easier to make those stepstowards getting to that goal
right, but and you're willing toput the time into it as well,
and that's what's even moreinteresting about it like, once
you know what the goal is,you're willing to invest extra
(13:47):
time or give up other things tocreate that time.
Once you know, and and you'renot, you're not just going in
constant cycles, like agroundhog day, where you just
wake up doing the same thingover and over and over, hoping
that you know your stats aregoing to move up when they're
just flatlining.
They're just sitting.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Still it's not going anywhere right and that that
gets us to axiom 116 in thedianetic axioms.
A self-determined effort isthat counter effort which has
been received into the organismin the past and integrated into
(14:27):
the organism for its conscioususe.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
So that makes future use as well.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, Exactly.
It's a counter effort, acounter intention or whatever
that you hit, run into and youdon't let it destroy you.
Right?
That which doesn't kill youmake you stronger.
You don't let it destroy you,you integrate it.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
Read that again.
A self-determined effort isthat counter effort which has
been received.
Now, let's stop there.
This is a counter effort thatyou've received, uh, I give.
I give you an example.
I used to sell tennis shoes onthe street corner for years, did
really well with it 200 boxesof tennis shoes, all different
(15:12):
sizes, eight thousand dollardays gross income.
Okay, but who I was orderingfrom?
I was ordering from people, uh,a couple of them.
What would happen is they wouldorder from some company in
China and they would get acontainer, one of those long
(15:33):
40-foot containers that you seeon the ships.
They'd get a container oftennis shoes and inside it would
be stuff they didn't ask for.
Right, so they pay.
You have to pay for it beforethey ship the container to the
united states.
You get it and the surprise,the surprise in the crackerjack
box, is you got 300 out of 800cases of shoe styles that are
(15:57):
just fugly.
What are you going to do?
You got to sell them.
So you, you, you, you sell themto your customers and you do
the same thing that yourwholesaler did to you, and they
would give us shoes that didn'tsell that we paid our wholesale
price for Now, what am I goingto do with them?
So after a while I started torealize there were certain
(16:20):
people I could deal with andcertain people that I couldn't,
who were dishonest in selling mestuff I didn't want, which ties
up my money, which disallows meto make and this podcast isn't
about money but in this example,that is the counter effort
which had been received, andthis also applies to, right off
(16:41):
the bat, quentin.
What ethics condition in thatsituation, to a counter effort
would you be applying?
What condition do you thinkthat would be?
Or Arthur, really, liability?
Well, that's true, it could beDanger.
Yeah, there you go.
Danger.
What's danger?
(17:01):
Adopt a firm policy to makesure that this doesn't happen
again.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
I was thinking that wholesaler's a liability.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Well, we are the wholesalers, that's right.
You have to assign them aliability, but you also, at the
same, you assign them acondition of liability and put
yourself in a danger condition.
Part of what you're doing isbypass habits and normal
routines, which would be okay,mr wholesaler.
Uh, my habits and normalroutines are.
I'm going to assign you acondition of liability.
(17:33):
You need to make up the damages, and there were times where I
sent them all the shoes backwithout asking.
He said I sent you the stuffback that I didn't ask for,
credit me with it and send methe shoes that I asked for.
So, so in that situation, aself-determined effort is that
counter effort which has beenreceived into the organism in
the past getting shoes I didn'task for and paying for them.
(17:56):
And now what do I do with themas a, as a retailer and
integrated into the organism forits conscious use.
Now you know what happened andyou can learn from it, because
my whole point on this is cyclesof action.
How many cycles of action start, change, stop, create, survive,
(18:18):
persist, destroy do you want todo in the allotted time that
you have in your lifetime?
The more cycles of action youhave to do, that takes up more
of your time is contra-survivalto your dianetic purpose, which
is survive, see, so I can do10,000 cycles of action, or I
(18:43):
can do 1,000 cycles of action,cycles of action, or I can do a
thousand cycles of action.
How much?
And again, we're not putting,we're not using, a monetary
value on purpose for the podcast.
But if you did put a monetaryvalue on it, if I could make 10
times what I make in thatthousand versus that 10,000,
which one would you ratherchoose?
(19:04):
Does that make sense?
So what's your return on it?
Yeah, you're right.
Your return of investment on athousand cycles of action versus
10,000 obviously is the betterinvestment in your life, but you
have to be able to integratethat for your conscious use.
Now go ahead, quentin, I cansee you want to say something.
(19:25):
I can't see Artie, but Artiejump in whenever.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Well, I was going to say that I've always talked
about.
I remember this.
When I was a kid, I used totalk about being efficient and
the word efficiency.
It means to accomplish adesired goal using the least
resources possible, and so thatone of those resources could be
your energy, it could be yourtime, it could be your money, it
(19:50):
could be your effort right, andso, accomplishing a desired
goal using the least resourcespossible to do so, right, that's
an efficient.
Whatever process or whateverthe thing is right, it's you
being efficient.
And so, when we talk about youdoing too much, is there a way
(20:10):
to accomplish the goal ofhappiness using the least
resources possible?
Right?
Is there a way to get to aplace where before you might
have been crying or upset aboutsomething?
Is there a way to get tolaughter about it using the
(20:30):
least resources possible?
Right, and so what I love aboutbeing an independent
Scientologist is the ability tohave an efficient way to
happiness, an efficient way tobring laughter to a situation
that might before been very direand detrimental to you like
(20:53):
changing things and I love howthat axiom you just read about
taking a received counter.
Was it counter effort, is that?
Speaker 1 (21:07):
counter that counter effort which has been received
into the organism in the past,integrated into the organism for
its conscious use.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Right, and so we call that shadow work right Other
spiritual modalities call itshadow work that you received a
counter effort and you receiveit into the organism, integrated
it for conscious use.
And now I can think beyond.
Hear me, I can think beyondthis.
(21:38):
I can think beyond, not thatproblems don't occur in your
life anymore, but with auditingI now understand when something
is coming at me.
It no longer has an effect onme anymore.
I was reading here in Hamburgfor Pre-Clares.
It says the total function of I, in quotations the total
(22:01):
function of I is the estimationof effort.
It thinks and plans andresolves the problems of future
effort.
When I has estimated a need foreffort and puts it into action,
its impulse is impinged againstthe glandular system
(22:22):
switchboard and it then talksabout how it turns emotional
impulse into action.
And so your whole function ofthe I, the I that you are right
the whole function of you is theestimation of effort and taking
that and planning and resolvingfor future efforts.
(22:43):
What am I going to do now withthis?
This has happened to me, thishas shown up in my life.
I had this incident, I had thismoment, I had this counter
effort.
What am I going to do with thatto make better choices, better
ways of thinking, better plansand better resolves.
Re-solve, which means, if itcomes up again, it's already
(23:04):
been solved, it's re-solved.
Re-solve, which means, if itcomes up again, it's already
been solved, it's re-solved,it's solved already, right.
So if I have a situation in mylife and it comes up again in my
life, if I've already committedto a resolve around it, I don't
have to worry about it anymore.
Why are we still talking aboutthis?
It's already resolved.
I already know my policy.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
I already know how I'm gonna deal with that yeah,
well, and in order for you toget to that point, you would
have had to have put time andeffort to have that which in the
future, will save you anenormous amount of time and
effort.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
So you had to put an initial time and effort to
understand that in order toreduce future potential time and
efforts in similar situationsright, right and this, and, and
just as a as a little side railhere, when you, when you're
looking at the components ofsomething, the greatest
(24:02):
component that you have, thegreatest resource that you have,
the greatest resource that youhave by far is yourself.
It isn't flour, it isn't sugar,it isn't water, it isn't eggs,
it is yourself, because and boy,we've covered this I don't know
how many times, but it bearsrepeating that is beingness.
(24:22):
You need to be your greatestresource and I highly recommend
um.
It's one of the coen brothersfilms.
It's called burn.
After reading, it's got bradpitt and george clooney in it
and, uh, uh, the cast is justspectacular and it's it's, it's
(24:44):
basically it really comes downto.
There's misinformation that isgiven and the CIA has a guy that
works for him I forget theactor's name and he gets fired
from the CIA for the wrongreasons, and then hilarity
(25:07):
ensues and all of these peoplehave their own desires and their
own agendas and they all getcrossed over and at the end of
the movie, after all is said anddone, the guys are in the CIA
office and I forget what theguy's name the actor who played
(25:27):
Jonah Jameson in the originalSpider-Man is the head officer
and he's like what are welearning from all of this?
And the agent that's on the casegoes shit.
If I know, after two hours ofwatching all this, this person
(25:48):
is dead.
That other person has gottentheir facelift that they wanted
and they got it out of the CIAbecause they just wanted to shut
her up, and they don't knowwhat in the hell this train
wreck was that happened.
What do we learn from all ofthis?
Those are all of these cyclesof action that you choose the
wrong people, you choose thewrong clients, you choose the
(26:12):
wrong this, and you have allthese extra extra thousands and
thousands and thousands ofcycles of action.
At the end you go well, whatdid we get out of this?
Well, those are those counterefforts.
And that brings us to axiom 117.
The components ofself-determinism are affinity,
(26:32):
communication and reality.
Arc, which equals understanding.
Self-determinism is manifestedalong each dynamic.
Along each dynamic.
Now, this is where this comesin.
Even better, at 118, anorganism cannot become aberrated
(26:53):
unless it has agreed upon thataberration, has been in
communication with a source ofaberration burn after reading is
a prime example of that and hashad affinity for the aberrator.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So if Look Quentin that and has had affinity for
the aberrator, so if look, lookquentin go ahead, keep talking,
keep talking because I will saysomething.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
Okay.
119 agreement with any source,contra or pro survival.
So contra survival or prosurvival postulates a new
reality for the organism.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
It doesn't discriminate.
It's weighing good or bad, itdoesn't care Right.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
And 120 non-survival courses.
Thoughts and actions wouldrequire non-optimum effort.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Yeah, you know, it's so interesting because this is
such an amazing, amazingspiritual journey, because it's
like you get to a place whereyou start to see it all just
make sense and it all just cometogether.
And the way LRH breaks down theaxioms and understanding
certain things, like it justclicks.
Think about this so in orderfor one to be aberrated, one
(28:13):
must agree to be aberrated onthat thing, right?
Am I saying that correctly?
That's right, okay.
And then because I'm notlooking at it, but I'm just
trying to remember what you saidand then it says that in order
to be aberrated, one has to havea source of aberration,
affinity beyond communicationwith a source of aberration, and
(28:33):
then have to have some kind ofaffinity for that aberrative
source.
Y'all know, y'all know me.
I tell people I like who like me, I like who like me.
If you don't like who like me,I like who like me.
If you don't like me, no more,I don't like you, no more, my
affinity is completely.
I suck it back, I suck it, Isuck it in, because as soon as I
(28:57):
start getting the fact that youdon't All right, as soon as I
start getting the thought thatyou don't like me, you
immediately become an aberrativesource.
You immediately suck it up.
I got my affinity back BecauseI'm not going to be going crazy
(29:18):
because of you, trust andbelieve.
If I go crazy because of me,that's on me, that's my own
stuff.
But if I go crazy because ofyou, that's on you.
What they say.
Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
That's my own stuff.
But if I go crazy because ofyou that's on you what they say.
fool me once, shame on you, foolme twice, shame on me right?
Yeah, no, sir, re, bob, and so,and so I I think this, I think
is really important and even yousaid it too, art that the
agreement don't care whetherit's a pro-survival or country
(29:41):
survival agreement.
As soon as you, as soon as yougo to agreement with that thing
or that person or that scenarioor that function or whatever, as
soon as you go into agreementabout it, that then becomes a
potential source of aberration,and so you got to be very
mindful of what you put yourattention and what you put your
(30:01):
agreements on.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you, no.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Well, how many times do you make a decision that you
think is a great decision andthen it turns out really bad,
really really bad, right how?
Speaker 1 (30:18):
often does that happen?
And that comes to Axiom 121,which is the next one.
Speaker 3 (30:25):
Every thought has been preceded by physical action
every thought has been precededby physical action, right?
So so does that mean the inputlike?
There's some informationrequired in order for you to
(30:46):
make future decisions.
So something has to occurbefore you can make a future
decision right because you thinkwell, wait a minute.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
The last time I ordered tennis shoes I got a
hundred cases of shoes Icouldn't do anything with.
They wouldn't sell and nobodywanted.
I can't even sell them at costand make my money back.
Speaker 3 (31:08):
So at that point you could stop buying tennis shoes
or reframe it and get the tennisshoes you're actually after.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Right Now.
The point of this is in theDianetic Axioms is from the
viewpoint of you've paintedyourself into a corner because I
did that.
I was wrong and grim, okay, andyou had 100 squares on the
floor and you painted one squareblue on the floor and after a
while, you've painted 98 squareson the floor.
The floor is wet and now you'rein the corner and you don't
(31:36):
know which way to go, because Ican't do this.
That was an engram, I can't dothis.
That was an engram, I can't dothis.
So you get into these unusualsolutions in order to achieve a
particular result, which meanssquillions of extra cycles of
action in order to get somethingdone, because it's a dangerous
(31:59):
environment.
What have you?
And now you're like, okay, okay.
So auditing, which is what wedo.
Auditing gets you to changeyour mind about these things
that you made a postulate on atthe bottom of an Ngram chain.
I can't do this anymore.
I can't do this businessanymore because it was so
(32:20):
painful, it was agonizing.
I lost all the money that I puton credit to get this business
off the ground.
75% of all businesses failed inthe first two years, as an
example.
But again, it's not about money, but if you look at this on the
tapestry of life, it's all thesame way.
Go ahead, arthur.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
At that kind of point , because I'm kind of stuck on
the painting yourself into asquare, because I'm kind of
stuck on the painting yourselfinto a square, then you could
start making really far outdecisions and really altering
your own dynamic and your ownsituation.
In a situation like that, likeusing the tiles as an example
you might say to yourself geez,I wish I could fly, geez, I wish
(33:02):
I had a better way out.
You might start altering thereality you're in as well,
altering your situations.
Um, making really really poordecisions exactly, or making
really really poor fantasiesthat are not going to help you
at all.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
That's and that's a that's a really good point too.
Like we said and I know itdon't know, it was a couple of
podcasts ago.
I'll just win the lottery.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
Yes, it's a fantasy.
It has a chance, it has apossibility, but the possibility
is minute Right.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
And so that's a no solution.
But you, you, you do this inlife and you might, out of that,
a hundred squares in the room,you might have two or three that
haven't been painted, and it'slike jumping on rocks across a
river.
I can't make that jump from onerock to the other.
How do I get to the other side?
Because you're boxed in by allof these considerations to where
(34:01):
you have to go way out of yourway.
Well, I'll just start anotherbusiness.
I can't start my owncoffeehouse business because
this, this, this, this and this,I failed on these things, which
is every thought, has beenpreceded by physical action.
Now, 122 dianetic axioms.
The mind does with thought asit has done with entities in the
(34:24):
physical universe.
That comes down to that, comesdown to the people you choose to
have in your life.
What's their tone level?
Were they aberrative, were theypro survival?
That includes yourself as well.
Go ahead.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
Arthur.
What's the saying?
You're the sum of the fivepeople closest to you.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yep.
So that comes down to peoplethat are surpassing you and say,
oh, you can never be a writer,or you can never be a rap star,
or you don't have what it takesto be a rap star, or you this
star, or you know you don't havewhat it takes to be a rap star
or you this and, and that goesdown to that agreement which
(35:10):
causes you to come up with well,I can't do this because
so-and-so said I can't do this,but that's because you chose to
be around that person whichmakes you do these unusual
solutions.
Well, I'll just go work forpeanuts and earn a meager living
and I never, ever, get toachieve my, my postulates
(35:31):
because I bought into theagreement of other people's
postulates of what they thoughtI could do.
You buy into the lie.
The altar is.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
And that's why yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So, so axiom 123, all effort is concerned excuse me,
all effort concerned with law isconcerned with loss.
Organisms hold pain and engramsto them as a latent effort to
prevent loss of some portion ofthe organism.
That's all those boxes that youpainted on the floor.
(36:07):
All loss is a loss of motion.
I can't do this.
I can't do this.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
That's the loss of motion.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
Stuck, stuck, stuck.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Right.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Stuck, stuck, stuck, stuck, stuck.
So lastly, and then we'll stepaway from the axioms, the amount
of counter effort, axiom 124,the amount of counter effort the
organism can overcome and thisis the point of this podcast is
proportional to the thetaendowment of the organism,
(36:38):
modified by the physique of thatorganism.
Excessive counter-effort, toomuch pushback from terminals and
the physical universe, forexample, excessive
counter-effort to the effort ofa life organism, produces
unconsciousness.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Unconsciousness Could we say in a simpler way that
there's a lot ofmisunderstanding going on, a lot
of misunderstoods.
Well, in order for the prepareto propel itself forward, right
in the background from its pastexperiences is an enormous
amount of misunderstood yeah,and it says the corollary,
(37:23):
unconsciousness, gives thesuppression of an organism's
control center by counter effort.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
So unusual solutions equals lots and lots and lots of
you're doing too much.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Unusual solutions equals lots and lots of you
doing too much.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Could you say that once more, please?
Speaker 1 (37:52):
Unusual solutions based off of the suppression
that you're receiving.
Excessive counter-effort to theeffort of a life organism you
and your body, you plus yourbody produces unconsciousness.
Therefore, you're unaware ofall of these unusual solutions
that you're doing.
Unconsciousness gives thesuppression of an organism's
(38:14):
control center by counter-effort.
Therefore, you're not makingthe right decisions, the right
postulates, the right policy,because you're on your own and
you never got an owner's manualto know what you needed to do.
And that owner's manual isauditing and training.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Well, and and you feel it, and when one can feel
it in their body, they can feelit in their nervous system, they
can feel it in their life whereit's like it.
And when he saysunconsciousness here, it doesn't
necessarily mean that you blackout all the time.
Some people might not black out, but they might.
They might go into a valence,they might go into something
else where it's like wait, whoare you, who am I dealing with
(38:57):
here?
And so the person whom you love, they get hit.
They've been hit with so muchexcessive counter effort in
their life that it producesunconsciousness in this person.
And when that stuff gets turnedon, when that unconsciousness
hits, they go into a whole othervalence and the person starts
(39:18):
acting weird.
Like what is up with you,that's right.
Like what is this?
And that's an excellent point Goahead, right, and then what
ends up happening is that you'renow not dealing with the
individual, but you're dealingwith what they think is a
solution to this counter effort.
So we get into an argument, weget into an argument, and this
(39:39):
person becomes a raging maniac,right, raging maniac.
And you were like, hold on asecond, who do you think you're
talking to?
You know?
And so you get into this wholething, but it's like they think
they're winning.
They think that that's thesolution to this camera, to this
kind of effort.
Right, and it's not.
It's an unusual solution.
(40:01):
You went crazy for a second, butthat ain't the solution to this
.
You know, we do the same thingwith alcohol, we do the same
thing with drugs, we do the samething with sex, we do the same
thing with overeating.
We think that's a solution towhat you're feeling, but it's
not Right and so, so, so.
So when we talk about you doingtoo much, this is a catch all
(40:22):
kind of phrase and we kind ofsay that like, well, you know,
ha ha, ha.
But the truth of the matter is,when you look around life,
people are doing too much.
They're just doing too much.
It's way too much for you tohave to go through all these
mechanisms and mechanizationstrying to get happy when there's
a way that could make anefficient way go back to that
(40:43):
word efficient, it's one of ourfavorite words an efficient way
to produce happiness in yourexperience, if you were willing
to put in that solution, to putthat solution into play.
(41:06):
And so I just think it's such aninteresting way to look at it
that we started this thingtalking about lamb chops and
crab legs.
But it's like but I hearkenback to where do you find the
simplest of pleasures?
Where do you find the simplestof solutions, of answers in your
life?
Is it about real answers?
Is it, you know, druggingyourself into a stupor and you
can no longer function properly?
(41:26):
Or is it sitting down andreally dealing with some of this
counter effort that you'veexperienced in your past, that's
painted you into this box thatyou now have to do all these
weird things in order to try toget out of it?
No, let's put some stuff inplace that's going to really
work.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Right, and that's that's that's putting order into
disorder, whether it's abusiness, whether it's your,
your, your case, your reactivemind, uh, it's your case, your
reactive mind, the compositecase on the OT levels, and
handling that and dealing withall of those counter efforts
that produce unconsciousness.
And it could be said thatunconsciousness is a reduction
(42:07):
of awareness, like we weretalking about in the podcast the
other day, as far asoverthinking and just knowing in
the podcast the other day, asfar as overthinking and just
knowing.
And the way to do that isthrough processing and
retrieving, recovering.
Let's say, you have a hundredattention units uh, that's,
that's, that's just from theviewpoint of like a hundred
(42:27):
percent and before, beforeyou're born, and you might
possess 75 attention units and25 are all of the stuff that's
in your reactive mind, your case, and all that stuff, if you're
lucky, the composite being, thegenetic entities that are
(42:54):
running your body, thesuppression you've received,
that you've stored as facsimilesin the reactive mind, in your
case that tell you thou shaltnot do this again, because, at
the end of the day, what thereactive mind is doing is it's a
policy recorder, but it alwaysrecords the negative policies
and says, okay, I won't do this.
I won't do that.
I can't do this.
(43:15):
I shall be this, like Quentinsaid, where you're taking on
somebody else's valence, theirbehavior, the way they go about
things, and you're using that toultimately solve a problem, and
that problem is alwaysultimately survival.
Yes, so if you're doing thatand you're being somebody else,
(43:39):
and to the degree that you'rehappy which also comes to Arthur
and Quentin's point to thedegree that you're happy is to
the degree that your ethics arein and it could be said go ahead
.
Finish what you said said goahead, no finish what you're
saying, yeah, yeah, keep goingTo the degree it could be said
(44:10):
that to the degree that you arebeing yourself, body, however
many times, or along the wholetrack, or whatever and you had
to just throw something on thewall and see what stuck, and
then that didn't work, so youdecided to be somebody else.
So you're, if you're keepingyour, you know that being
yourself is the solution tohandling counter efforts, as
opposed to being somebody else.
(44:31):
Now you're at a point where,okay, you're unhappy and you're
going to do thousands, and Imean millions, of cycles of
action in this allotment of 75,90 years or whatever that you
didn't have to do, and you'regoing to get to the end of it
and go.
What did we learn from all this?
Speaker 3 (44:52):
well, even even at the moment, while I'm doing the
proteas course, like I'm on asection where I've got to do
nine clay demos in a row.
I mean, john, how many of howmany of those have I been stuck
on four or five times?
Speaker 1 (45:05):
oh, before I've, before I'm almost yeah, almost
almost all of them, and and sothat and that's a that's a great
analogy is, if you understandsomething, you can put it into a
clay demo, and and then I go goahead.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Yep, and that's that's where it's been
interesting, because it's mademe realize if I can't put it
into clay, then I'mmisunderstanding.
I still have misunderstoodaround it, right and and
initially I've gone throughdifferent phases of emotions.
No, the first one is you know,screw this I want to go have a
(45:42):
coffee and a cigarette.
Speaker 2 (45:44):
This can wait this is too much effort.
Speaker 3 (45:48):
Well, and it's.
It's the nature of themisunderstood, isn't it?
It's like, oh my god, this istoo hard.
But then that?
Then there's the other part aswell.
It's like, okay, what am Idoing wrong?
And then going, going back overthe data, going back over what
is the intention for thisparticular clay demo?
Um, and then it's like, oh,okay, I missed that.
(46:09):
Oh, I missed that as well.
Oh, I also missed that.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
And then the clay demo reveals itself right,
because now you understand itand you know what you need to do
in order to present that thing,and and that's right.
And how is that?
As you look back over thematerials and you look, and you
know, you send me the picturesand I go well, I'm not seeing
this in the clay.
And at your end you're probablyto a certain degree going you
(46:37):
know, fuck that guy, he doesn'tsee it, I see it right there.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
I've never thought that, John.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
And that's the same way with the universe, with the
physical universe and the actsof the laws.
Yeah, is you're like, well, youknow, screw that I'm not going
to do that because this, this isjust too hard.
And instead of finishing thatclay demo in the physical
universe whether it's a claydemo or it's something in your
life you're going to go to thisunusual solution instead, and
(47:10):
and then you try again, and youtry again.
I don't see it in the clay,arthur, I don't see it in the
clay.
Show me this, show me.
And then you finally go bingo.
And now you've got it.
Yes, same thing applies what'sinteresting.
Speaker 3 (47:22):
But what's interesting?
The end phenomena that occurswith that.
Now it becomes no wing to thecore, wordless, yeah, wordless.
It becomes like, like the axiomtalking about, um, you know,
changing your cells.
My cells have changed with thatend phenomena.
I cannot be the same, once I'vereached that point, producing a
(47:47):
clay demonstration because it'sto the cell, which means in
future, which means in future aswell around my, because I mean
the proteas is all aboutcommunication and it's a very,
it's a very big course justbased on communication.
Like, how can I not now applywhat I know?
It's impossible to not apply?
(48:09):
It's it's impossible for me tonot communicate the same way I
did before.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
You have a conceptual understanding.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
And that effort that it took you and this happens
when we work out our bodies ordo whatever, the effort that it
took you to get to that goal, tothat win it now is integrated
into the organism, right?
It's, like you said, cellularlevel, like I know that, I know
that, I know that, I know, andyou think with it, you think
(48:42):
along these lines on a continualbasis, and so that's the beauty
of training, that's the beautyof going on to the college and
signing up for a course anddoing the steps that LRA's laid
out.
That's the beauty of auditingthat you take all the counter
effort of your life and you faceit and you deal with it and
(49:02):
then you integrate it and thenyou think beyond it to a point
where now it's like that nolonger affects you and you can
live a happy life because ofthat.
It's such a beautiful, simple,efficient way of being.
I love it.
Speaker 3 (49:16):
Yeah, it's incredible and it does take a little bit
of time now to save an enormousamount of time later, because
without going through thisprocess, nothing in me would
change.
Yeah.
Yeah, and that's the I'd stillbe I'd be producing the same
cells.
I'd be stuck with the samemisunderstoods.
I'd still be.
I'd be producing the same cells.
I'd be stuck with the samemisunderstoods.
I'd still be Arthur yesterdayas opposed to Arthur today.
(49:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
Right.
So that's the whole point ofthis podcast is you could be
doing a lot less in order to geta lot further, working smarter,
not harder, if you choose theright data to work with, and you
choose, and that that data the,the, the, what you get from
auditing, what you get fromtraining, and this isn't, this
(50:01):
isn't just, uh, proprietary toscientology concepts, but it, it
covers everything in your life.
That's's the point is, if youunderstand these basics and you
can apply them to your existenceacross your eight dynamics,
those different areas of lifeyou yourself, your relationship,
(50:24):
your sexual relationship, yourgroup, the planet at large,
animals and plants, the physicaluniverse, all that stuff it
carries over, and so you have alot less counter effort to what
it is that you're doing in thefuture.
Postulates that you make andyou've changed your mind about I
can't do this, I can't do this,oh, I could never do that, I
(50:46):
could never talk to this person,and so now you multiply the
amount of cycles of action thatyou have to do and you spend so
much time doing things you don'thave to, and you can be happy
if you're being yourself.
So I hope this has gotten acrossto our listeners and we really
(51:08):
tried to reduce it down to itsbuilding blocks, which can be a
little tricky to understand, butwe've tried to analogize it as
much as we can for our listenersand take this information, look
at the Dianetic axioms, look atthe Scientology axioms and get
on course, get in session andstart saving yourself a
(51:28):
tremendous amount of time sothat you can be productive, thus
be happy being yourself and youcan help others along the way.
So for question, arthur andmyself, namaste, and we love you
, bye, bye, peace, peace, thankyou.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
Thank you.
Thanks for watching.
All right, welcome to another Scientology Outside of
the Church podcast.
This is season 11, episode 21.
I got the episode right thistime after two mistakes in the
last two podcasts.
Apologies to our listeners.
Sometimes you lose track whenyou do this many podcasts in a
week.
We're still shooting foranother three this week,
hopefully like we did last week.
(00:22):
And the title of this one.
Oh and the podcast is broughtto you by gporg, our main site
for the delivery of independentScientology.
This is a podcast, always aboutindependent Scientology.
We are not affiliated with thecorporate church of Scientology
whatsoever, nor do we want to be, and the College of Independent
(00:45):
Scientology, which is ouronline social media platform and
online course room.
I'm here with Arthur Mudakis,who's been struggling to get his
internet situated andeverything, and we think we've
got it in place, and theomnipresent Quentin Stroud.
How are you guys this afternoonthere in Malaysia?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Very good, yeah, we're both here now.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, it's really nice here too, even though we're
towards the latter part ofwinter.
We're going to do a podcast onyou're doing too much.
This is going to be.
This will be a fun one.
We've already been gigglingabout it before we started.
So you're doing too much.
(01:32):
So, quentin, do you want totake the lead on this one,
because you might be able to doit better than I can, but I'd be
happy to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
It's your call talk to them about how you guys kind
of fell into this conversationwell it it.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
it occurred over some food and I thought it was lamb
and I thought, okay, that's anawful lot of effort for what you
get out of a lamb chop.
So and then I thought, crap,that's like crab legs.
Crab legs is the effort putinto the crab legs does not
equal the amount of caloriesthat you get out, because
(02:12):
there's not a lot of calories incrab.
So I thought that'd be aninteresting podcast, because
life is very much like that andwe'll get into the cycles of
action and the correctestimation of effort and all of
that.
But there's a lot more to thisthan it sounds like.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
So Well, you know, first of all, I just want to
start off by saying lamb chopsare delicious and crab is the
bomb.
Yes, and so.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
Yes.
And I don't eat crab legs and Idon't eat crab legs.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
I don't eat crab legs for the caloric intake.
I eat crab legs because youdipped them in nice garlic
butter with some Obey seasoningand, baby, you got something
going on for yourself.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
And I'm happy to spend a whole day roasting a leg
of lamb on a low heat just forthat final product.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Well, that's good leg of lamb is leg of lamb is.
You know it's there's.
There's a better payoff therethan there is lamb chops,
because you got this fat andthis gristle and you know just
uh and I just cut that off andand I just, you know, just go,
just go for the primary proteinthere.
But that's just me.
But it's also like anotherthing and you guys, especially
(03:36):
being in the, I can't use.
I won't say it.
You guys are in the Orient.
Is that politically correct?
Quentin, can I use that term?
We're in Southeast Asia, you'rein the orient.
Is that politically correct?
Quentin, can I use that term?
We're in southeast asia, you'rein, you're in the orient.
And my, my biggest beef withoriental food is when, when I
order oriental takeout is 20minutes later.
(03:59):
I'm hungry because there's this, it's rice, you know, it's
carbs and all of that stuff andso, and and granted, it's cheap,
but this is, this is.
This podcast is about your lifeand the, the roi, the return of
investment, of effort that youput in, if you know, and, and
(04:21):
that comes down to a lot ofthings in life where you get
what you pay for.
But we're not looking at itnecessarily from a monetary
standpoint alone.
We're looking at it from thedecisions you make in life and
the, the, the effort that youput in to life because you've
heard the expression worksmarter, not harder.
And that is you're, when youpick up a body and you're born,
(04:48):
an infant and everything likethat.
You have an allotted amount oftime and what is it that?
And this could come down totime management.
But it's not just timemanagement, it's the decisions,
the amount of effort that youput in the pro-survival actions
you take, as opposed to thecounter-survival actions that
(05:09):
you take.
I've been working with a new PCin Las Vegas going over the
axioms, and every time I go overthe axioms I have like five
podcasts I think of that wehaven't done before, and we're
always talking about thescientology and dianetic axioms
anyway.
So quentin over to you, that'sthe preamble for the whole thing
(05:32):
and how this whole thing gotstarted, and then we'll bounce
it off of each other andeverything.
It'll probably be a lot of funso.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
So you and I come from a very different background
and for me, I've never reallybeen one to eat for.
To be full Like that's not.
That's like even when I wasyounger.
I would always eat, like even Iremember back in college I
would eat half now and halflater.
I would always save half amillion.
I think you and I talked aboutthis at one point when we went
(06:01):
to the Indian restaurant.
I would always eat half now andhalf later.
And so I hear you when you say,oh, I'll eat a nice Asian dish
and I'll be even hungry twohours later.
Yep, that kind of happens, butI kind of prepare for that.
What I'll say is that when wetalk about doing too much, we're
really looking at what am Iputting into anything that I'm
(06:24):
doing?
Right?
It could be a work effort, itcould be a familial you know
kind of situation it could be.
You know, obviously, what we'retalking about when it comes to
mental health and spiritualprogress.
What am I doing to get a gainfrom this?
And what I'll say is is that inmy journey and my experience
(06:46):
there's these simple pleasuresthat I tend to kind of gravitate
towards right, like a nice,like being able to break the
crab leg open and pull out thewhole piece of meat Like that's
a simple pleasure for me.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
It doesn't happen every time.
It doesn't happen every time.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
It doesn't happen every time.
Sometimes you got to dig up inthere, but just being able to
crack it open and put the wholepiece, that's how simple and I
feel, I feel like I won theuniverse, the game of the
universe, when I put that pieceof crap out Right.
But also, but also in life,like the ability just to be able
to laugh, like laughter, is tome a simple pleasure.
(07:27):
Mirth, joy.
These are simple pleasures andit's oftentimes we feel like we
got to do a lot to get to thatplace.
We got to do a lot to get like.
I want to just be able to behappy again, and there's this
idea that I have to do a lot toget there.
And it might not necessarily betrue.
You know, sometimes people putso much effort into like trying
(07:53):
to figure this whole thing out,and it doesn't have to take that
much in my opinion right, and Ithink a lot of that is is
taught behavior too, becausewe're taught that you have to.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
You know, the only way to get ahead is to work
really, really hard.
So already you're alreadydefeated in in some sense,
because if you're one thatdoesn't want to work super,
duper hard, um, then you're notgoing to work hard, but then do
you have to work hard, andthat's that's the funny thing
about it, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (08:21):
yeah, and, and that is in the dianetic axioms.
Uh, I'm trying to find the the,the correct one here, let's see
if I've got it.
I have it pulled up here bearwith me um here it is.
(08:43):
Let's see here.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Well, before you read it, I just had a small little
realization.
I think that, um, I think thething that makes it hard is the
lack of understanding towardsyour future potential goal.
So if you don't understand whatyour goal is is, then of course
it's going to be hard becauseyou need to learn.
You need to, for example.
(09:10):
Like, let's say, let's say youare cooking lamb cutlets, for
example.
It's an easy goal.
It might have a little bit oftime attached to it, but it's an
easy goal and you know how todo it.
So therefore, you're willing togive it that time because you
understand the process ofcooking a lamb cutlet.
Now let's say you want tosucceed in life in another area
(09:31):
that you're not quiteunderstanding or well versed at.
That's probably where adifferent kind of effort occurs
a mental effort plus physicaleffort and and I found it, and
it's axiom 113 of the dianeticsaxioms.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Reality is the agreement upon perceptions and
data in the physical universe.
The subtext below it is allthat we can be sure is real is
that on which we have agreed isreal.
Agreement is the essence ofreality.
And then there's also the axiomwhere he talks about there are
(10:10):
three universes there's mine,yours and the agreed-upon
universe that you agree withothers on.
So when you're looking at theamount of time because this goes
directly to your point, artiethat one puts in to something,
(10:32):
it's taught that you have towork hard as opposed to smart,
yeah, pretty much.
So.
If you look at something, theway, the amount of cycles of
action you do when you'reyounger and you have a body
that's able and capable and canstay up until four in the
(10:55):
morning and doesn't feel it, anddo two hours of sleep and
you're bulletproof, and all ofthat they say that youth is
wasted on the young kind ofthing and as the body starts to
slow down, you start to think Ineed to work smarter, not harder
(11:16):
, in order to get something done, but you have to be able to
have the comparable magnitudesin order to do that, which is
personal policy that you'velearned, usually from your
mistakes, because policy is whatyou're working off of, of
comparable magnitudes, both withthe analytical mind you as a
(11:37):
thetan and what the reactivemind has, the fixed attention
and the resistance that you haveof being pushed off a position
in space.
And I must do this, I must dothis, I can't do this, I'm not
going to change because thishappened to, that happened or
whatever.
(11:57):
And so now you're off course toa certain degree, from going
straight.
Now you're going to the rightor to the left.
So if you're working harder,you're going to the right or to
the left.
So if you're working harder,you're not correctly estimating
the amount of effort that youhave to put in to something.
Go ahead, Glenn, I see you wantto say something.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
That's right, and I think that Art kind of gave the
cheat code a little bit becausehe was like yeah, but if you see
the vision right, if you seethe end goal, the end phenomenon
, if you know what you'repursuing, your goal, then it
(12:37):
seems to be easier towardsmoving towards that.
How many of us in life whetherit be a job or whatever how many
of us in life we don't reallyknow our end goal?
So we just get up and we do, wedo things every day, we go
almost on automatic, almost likea routine.
That this is life.
And it seems to get harder andharder and harder because you're
(12:59):
not kind of going at an endgoal.
You know when I work with moneyand where I work with my clients
when it comes to money, Ialways start at the end what are
you trying to accomplish here?
What are you trying toaccomplish with your finances?
What are you trying toaccomplish with your goals?
And then let's start makingdecisions and some of those
decisions might feel like a, youknow, feel a little difficult,
(13:20):
like I got to cut out this orcut out that, I gotta turn off
the cable, I do whatever,whatever.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
But if we know the goal, per what archer said, if
we know the goal and what we'regoing after, it seems to be a
lot easier to make those stepstowards getting to that goal
right, but and you're willing toput the time into it as well,
and that's what's even moreinteresting about it like, once
you know what the goal is,you're willing to invest extra
(13:47):
time or give up other things tocreate that time.
Once you know, and and you'renot, you're not just going in
constant cycles, like agroundhog day, where you just
wake up doing the same thingover and over and over, hoping
that you know your stats aregoing to move up when they're
just flatlining.
They're just sitting.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Still it's not going anywhere right and that that
gets us to axiom 116 in thedianetic axioms.
A self-determined effort isthat counter effort which has
been received into the organismin the past and integrated into
(14:27):
the organism for its conscioususe.
Speaker 3 (14:31):
So that makes future use as well.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, Exactly.
It's a counter effort, acounter intention or whatever
that you hit, run into and youdon't let it destroy you.
Right?
That which doesn't kill youmake you stronger.
You don't let it destroy you,you integrate it.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
Read that again.
A self-determined effort isthat counter effort which has
been received.
Now, let's stop there.
This is a counter effort thatyou've received, uh, I give.
I give you an example.
I used to sell tennis shoes onthe street corner for years, did
really well with it 200 boxesof tennis shoes, all different
(15:12):
sizes, eight thousand dollardays gross income.
Okay, but who I was orderingfrom?
I was ordering from people, uh,a couple of them.
What would happen is they wouldorder from some company in
China and they would get acontainer, one of those long
(15:33):
40-foot containers that you seeon the ships.
They'd get a container oftennis shoes and inside it would
be stuff they didn't ask for.
Right, so they pay.
You have to pay for it beforethey ship the container to the
united states.
You get it and the surprise,the surprise in the crackerjack
box, is you got 300 out of 800cases of shoe styles that are
(15:57):
just fugly.
What are you going to do?
You got to sell them.
So you, you, you, you sell themto your customers and you do
the same thing that yourwholesaler did to you, and they
would give us shoes that didn'tsell that we paid our wholesale
price for Now, what am I goingto do with them?
So after a while I started torealize there were certain
(16:20):
people I could deal with andcertain people that I couldn't,
who were dishonest in selling mestuff I didn't want, which ties
up my money, which disallows meto make and this podcast isn't
about money but in this example,that is the counter effort
which had been received, andthis also applies to, right off
(16:41):
the bat, quentin.
What ethics condition in thatsituation, to a counter effort
would you be applying?
What condition do you thinkthat would be?
Or Arthur, really, liability?
Well, that's true, it could beDanger.
Yeah, there you go.
Danger.
What's danger?
(17:01):
Adopt a firm policy to makesure that this doesn't happen
again.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
I was thinking that wholesaler's a liability.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Well, we are the wholesalers, that's right.
You have to assign them aliability, but you also, at the
same, you assign them acondition of liability and put
yourself in a danger condition.
Part of what you're doing isbypass habits and normal
routines, which would be okay,mr wholesaler.
Uh, my habits and normalroutines are.
I'm going to assign you acondition of liability.
(17:33):
You need to make up the damages, and there were times where I
sent them all the shoes backwithout asking.
He said I sent you the stuffback that I didn't ask for,
credit me with it and send methe shoes that I asked for.
So, so in that situation, aself-determined effort is that
counter effort which has beenreceived into the organism in
the past getting shoes I didn'task for and paying for them.
(17:56):
And now what do I do with themas a, as a retailer and
integrated into the organism forits conscious use.
Now you know what happened andyou can learn from it, because
my whole point on this is cyclesof action.
How many cycles of action start, change, stop, create, survive,
(18:18):
persist, destroy do you want todo in the allotted time that
you have in your lifetime?
The more cycles of action youhave to do, that takes up more
of your time is contra-survivalto your dianetic purpose, which
is survive, see, so I can do10,000 cycles of action, or I
(18:43):
can do 1,000 cycles of action,cycles of action, or I can do a
thousand cycles of action.
How much?
And again, we're not putting,we're not using, a monetary
value on purpose for the podcast.
But if you did put a monetaryvalue on it, if I could make 10
times what I make in thatthousand versus that 10,000,
which one would you ratherchoose?
(19:04):
Does that make sense?
So what's your return on it?
Yeah, you're right.
Your return of investment on athousand cycles of action versus
10,000 obviously is the betterinvestment in your life, but you
have to be able to integratethat for your conscious use.
Now go ahead, quentin, I cansee you want to say something.
(19:25):
I can't see Artie, but Artiejump in whenever.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Well, I was going to say that I've always talked
about.
I remember this.
When I was a kid, I used totalk about being efficient and
the word efficiency.
It means to accomplish adesired goal using the least
resources possible, and so thatone of those resources could be
your energy, it could be yourtime, it could be your money, it
(19:50):
could be your effort right, andso, accomplishing a desired
goal using the least resourcespossible to do so, right, that's
an efficient.
Whatever process or whateverthe thing is right, it's you
being efficient.
And so, when we talk about youdoing too much, is there a way
(20:10):
to accomplish the goal ofhappiness using the least
resources possible?
Right?
Is there a way to get to aplace where before you might
have been crying or upset aboutsomething?
Is there a way to get tolaughter about it using the
(20:30):
least resources possible?
Right, and so what I love aboutbeing an independent
Scientologist is the ability tohave an efficient way to
happiness, an efficient way tobring laughter to a situation
that might before been very direand detrimental to you like
(20:53):
changing things and I love howthat axiom you just read about
taking a received counter.
Was it counter effort, is that?
Speaker 1 (21:07):
counter that counter effort which has been received
into the organism in the past,integrated into the organism for
its conscious use.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Right, and so we call that shadow work right Other
spiritual modalities call itshadow work that you received a
counter effort and you receiveit into the organism, integrated
it for conscious use.
And now I can think beyond.
Hear me, I can think beyondthis.
(21:38):
I can think beyond, not thatproblems don't occur in your
life anymore, but with auditingI now understand when something
is coming at me.
It no longer has an effect onme anymore.
I was reading here in Hamburgfor Pre-Clares.
It says the total function of I, in quotations the total
(22:01):
function of I is the estimationof effort.
It thinks and plans andresolves the problems of future
effort.
When I has estimated a need foreffort and puts it into action,
its impulse is impinged againstthe glandular system
(22:22):
switchboard and it then talksabout how it turns emotional
impulse into action.
And so your whole function ofthe I, the I that you are right
the whole function of you is theestimation of effort and taking
that and planning and resolvingfor future efforts.
(22:43):
What am I going to do now withthis?
This has happened to me, thishas shown up in my life.
I had this incident, I had thismoment, I had this counter
effort.
What am I going to do with thatto make better choices, better
ways of thinking, better plansand better resolves.
Re-solve, which means, if itcomes up again, it's already
(23:04):
been solved, it's re-solved.
Re-solve, which means, if itcomes up again, it's already
been solved, it's re-solved,it's solved already, right.
So if I have a situation in mylife and it comes up again in my
life, if I've already committedto a resolve around it, I don't
have to worry about it anymore.
Why are we still talking aboutthis?
It's already resolved.
I already know my policy.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
I already know how I'm gonna deal with that yeah,
well, and in order for you toget to that point, you would
have had to have put time andeffort to have that which in the
future, will save you anenormous amount of time and
effort.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
So you had to put an initial time and effort to
understand that in order toreduce future potential time and
efforts in similar situationsright, right and this, and, and
just as a as a little side railhere, when you, when you're
looking at the components ofsomething, the greatest
(24:02):
component that you have, thegreatest resource that you have,
the greatest resource that youhave by far is yourself.
It isn't flour, it isn't sugar,it isn't water, it isn't eggs,
it is yourself, because and boy,we've covered this I don't know
how many times, but it bearsrepeating that is beingness.
(24:22):
You need to be your greatestresource and I highly recommend
um.
It's one of the coen brothersfilms.
It's called burn.
After reading, it's got bradpitt and george clooney in it
and, uh, uh, the cast is justspectacular and it's it's, it's
(24:44):
basically it really comes downto.
There's misinformation that isgiven and the CIA has a guy that
works for him I forget theactor's name and he gets fired
from the CIA for the wrongreasons, and then hilarity
(25:07):
ensues and all of these peoplehave their own desires and their
own agendas and they all getcrossed over and at the end of
the movie, after all is said anddone, the guys are in the CIA
office and I forget what theguy's name the actor who played
(25:27):
Jonah Jameson in the originalSpider-Man is the head officer
and he's like what are welearning from all of this?
And the agent that's on the casegoes shit.
If I know, after two hours ofwatching all this, this person
(25:48):
is dead.
That other person has gottentheir facelift that they wanted
and they got it out of the CIAbecause they just wanted to shut
her up, and they don't knowwhat in the hell this train
wreck was that happened.
What do we learn from all ofthis?
Those are all of these cyclesof action that you choose the
wrong people, you choose thewrong clients, you choose the
(26:12):
wrong this, and you have allthese extra extra thousands and
thousands and thousands ofcycles of action.
At the end you go well, whatdid we get out of this?
Well, those are those counterefforts.
And that brings us to axiom 117.
The components ofself-determinism are affinity,
(26:32):
communication and reality.
Arc, which equals understanding.
Self-determinism is manifestedalong each dynamic.
Along each dynamic.
Now, this is where this comesin.
Even better, at 118, anorganism cannot become aberrated
(26:53):
unless it has agreed upon thataberration, has been in
communication with a source ofaberration burn after reading is
a prime example of that and hashad affinity for the aberrator.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
So if Look Quentin that and has had affinity for
the aberrator, so if look, lookquentin go ahead, keep talking,
keep talking because I will saysomething.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
Okay.
119 agreement with any source,contra or pro survival.
So contra survival or prosurvival postulates a new
reality for the organism.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
It doesn't discriminate.
It's weighing good or bad, itdoesn't care Right.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
And 120 non-survival courses.
Thoughts and actions wouldrequire non-optimum effort.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Yeah, you know, it's so interesting because this is
such an amazing, amazingspiritual journey, because it's
like you get to a place whereyou start to see it all just
make sense and it all just cometogether.
And the way LRH breaks down theaxioms and understanding
certain things, like it justclicks.
Think about this so in orderfor one to be aberrated, one
(28:13):
must agree to be aberrated onthat thing, right?
Am I saying that correctly?
That's right, okay.
And then because I'm notlooking at it, but I'm just
trying to remember what you saidand then it says that in order
to be aberrated, one has to havea source of aberration,
affinity beyond communicationwith a source of aberration, and
(28:33):
then have to have some kind ofaffinity for that aberrative
source.
Y'all know, y'all know me.
I tell people I like who like me, I like who like me.
If you don't like who like me,I like who like me.
If you don't like me, no more,I don't like you, no more, my
affinity is completely.
I suck it back, I suck it, Isuck it in, because as soon as I
(28:57):
start getting the fact that youdon't All right, as soon as I
start getting the thought thatyou don't like me, you
immediately become an aberrativesource.
You immediately suck it up.
I got my affinity back BecauseI'm not going to be going crazy
(29:18):
because of you, trust andbelieve.
If I go crazy because of me,that's on me, that's my own
stuff.
But if I go crazy because ofyou, that's on you.
What they say.
Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
That's my own stuff.
But if I go crazy because ofyou that's on you what they say.
fool me once, shame on you, foolme twice, shame on me right?
Yeah, no, sir, re, bob, and so,and so I I think this, I think
is really important and even yousaid it too, art that the
agreement don't care whetherit's a pro-survival or country
(29:41):
survival agreement.
As soon as you, as soon as yougo to agreement with that thing
or that person or that scenarioor that function or whatever, as
soon as you go into agreementabout it, that then becomes a
potential source of aberration,and so you got to be very
mindful of what you put yourattention and what you put your
(30:01):
agreements on.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you.
I don't agree to be crazybecause of you, no.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Well, how many times do you make a decision that you
think is a great decision andthen it turns out really bad,
really really bad, right how?
Speaker 1 (30:18):
often does that happen?
And that comes to Axiom 121,which is the next one.
Speaker 3 (30:25):
Every thought has been preceded by physical action
every thought has been precededby physical action, right?
So so does that mean the inputlike?
There's some informationrequired in order for you to
(30:46):
make future decisions.
So something has to occurbefore you can make a future
decision right because you thinkwell, wait a minute.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
The last time I ordered tennis shoes I got a
hundred cases of shoes Icouldn't do anything with.
They wouldn't sell and nobodywanted.
I can't even sell them at costand make my money back.
Speaker 3 (31:08):
So at that point you could stop buying tennis shoes
or reframe it and get the tennisshoes you're actually after.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Right Now.
The point of this is in theDianetic Axioms is from the
viewpoint of you've paintedyourself into a corner because I
did that.
I was wrong and grim, okay, andyou had 100 squares on the
floor and you painted one squareblue on the floor and after a
while, you've painted 98 squareson the floor.
The floor is wet and now you'rein the corner and you don't
(31:36):
know which way to go, because Ican't do this.
That was an engram, I can't dothis.
That was an engram, I can't dothis.
So you get into these unusualsolutions in order to achieve a
particular result, which meanssquillions of extra cycles of
action in order to get somethingdone, because it's a dangerous
(31:59):
environment.
What have you?
And now you're like, okay, okay.
So auditing, which is what wedo.
Auditing gets you to changeyour mind about these things
that you made a postulate on atthe bottom of an Ngram chain.
I can't do this anymore.
I can't do this businessanymore because it was so
(32:20):
painful, it was agonizing.
I lost all the money that I puton credit to get this business
off the ground.
75% of all businesses failed inthe first two years, as an
example.
But again, it's not about money, but if you look at this on the
tapestry of life, it's all thesame way.
Go ahead, arthur.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
At that kind of point , because I'm kind of stuck on
the painting yourself into asquare, because I'm kind of
stuck on the painting yourselfinto a square, then you could
start making really far outdecisions and really altering
your own dynamic and your ownsituation.
In a situation like that, likeusing the tiles as an example
you might say to yourself geez,I wish I could fly, geez, I wish
(33:02):
I had a better way out.
You might start altering thereality you're in as well,
altering your situations.
Um, making really really poordecisions exactly, or making
really really poor fantasiesthat are not going to help you
at all.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
That's and that's a that's a really good point too.
Like we said and I know itdon't know, it was a couple of
podcasts ago.
I'll just win the lottery.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
Yes, it's a fantasy.
It has a chance, it has apossibility, but the possibility
is minute Right.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
And so that's a no solution.
But you, you, you do this inlife and you might, out of that,
a hundred squares in the room,you might have two or three that
haven't been painted, and it'slike jumping on rocks across a
river.
I can't make that jump from onerock to the other.
How do I get to the other side?
Because you're boxed in by allof these considerations to where
(34:01):
you have to go way out of yourway.
Well, I'll just start anotherbusiness.
I can't start my owncoffeehouse business because
this, this, this, this and this,I failed on these things, which
is every thought, has beenpreceded by physical action.
Now, 122 dianetic axioms.
The mind does with thought asit has done with entities in the
(34:24):
physical universe.
That comes down to that, comesdown to the people you choose to
have in your life.
What's their tone level?
Were they aberrative, were theypro survival?
That includes yourself as well.
Go ahead.
Speaker 3 (34:44):
Arthur.
What's the saying?
You're the sum of the fivepeople closest to you.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yep.
So that comes down to peoplethat are surpassing you and say,
oh, you can never be a writer,or you can never be a rap star,
or you don't have what it takesto be a rap star, or you this
star, or you know you don't havewhat it takes to be a rap star
or you this and, and that goesdown to that agreement which
(35:10):
causes you to come up with well,I can't do this because
so-and-so said I can't do this,but that's because you chose to
be around that person whichmakes you do these unusual
solutions.
Well, I'll just go work forpeanuts and earn a meager living
and I never, ever, get toachieve my, my postulates
(35:31):
because I bought into theagreement of other people's
postulates of what they thoughtI could do.
You buy into the lie.
The altar is.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
And that's why yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:46):
So, so axiom 123, all effort is concerned excuse me,
all effort concerned with law isconcerned with loss.
Organisms hold pain and engramsto them as a latent effort to
prevent loss of some portion ofthe organism.
That's all those boxes that youpainted on the floor.
(36:07):
All loss is a loss of motion.
I can't do this.
I can't do this.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
That's the loss of motion.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
Stuck, stuck, stuck.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Right.
Speaker 1 (36:17):
Stuck, stuck, stuck, stuck, stuck.
So lastly, and then we'll stepaway from the axioms, the amount
of counter effort, axiom 124,the amount of counter effort the
organism can overcome and thisis the point of this podcast is
proportional to the thetaendowment of the organism,
(36:38):
modified by the physique of thatorganism.
Excessive counter-effort, toomuch pushback from terminals and
the physical universe, forexample, excessive
counter-effort to the effort ofa life organism, produces
unconsciousness.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Unconsciousness Could we say in a simpler way that
there's a lot ofmisunderstanding going on, a lot
of misunderstoods.
Well, in order for the prepareto propel itself forward, right
in the background from its pastexperiences is an enormous
amount of misunderstood yeah,and it says the corollary,
(37:23):
unconsciousness, gives thesuppression of an organism's
control center by counter effort.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
So unusual solutions equals lots and lots and lots of
you're doing too much.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Unusual solutions equals lots and lots of you
doing too much.
Speaker 3 (37:49):
Could you say that once more, please?
Speaker 1 (37:52):
Unusual solutions based off of the suppression
that you're receiving.
Excessive counter-effort to theeffort of a life organism you
and your body, you plus yourbody produces unconsciousness.
Therefore, you're unaware ofall of these unusual solutions
that you're doing.
Unconsciousness gives thesuppression of an organism's
(38:14):
control center by counter-effort.
Therefore, you're not makingthe right decisions, the right
postulates, the right policy,because you're on your own and
you never got an owner's manualto know what you needed to do.
And that owner's manual isauditing and training.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Well, and and you feel it, and when one can feel
it in their body, they can feelit in their nervous system, they
can feel it in their life whereit's like it.
And when he saysunconsciousness here, it doesn't
necessarily mean that you blackout all the time.
Some people might not black out, but they might.
They might go into a valence,they might go into something
else where it's like wait, whoare you, who am I dealing with
(38:57):
here?
And so the person whom you love, they get hit.
They've been hit with so muchexcessive counter effort in
their life that it producesunconsciousness in this person.
And when that stuff gets turnedon, when that unconsciousness
hits, they go into a whole othervalence and the person starts
(39:18):
acting weird.
Like what is up with you,that's right.
Like what is this?
And that's an excellent point Goahead, right, and then what
ends up happening is that you'renow not dealing with the
individual, but you're dealingwith what they think is a
solution to this counter effort.
So we get into an argument, weget into an argument, and this
(39:39):
person becomes a raging maniac,right, raging maniac.
And you were like, hold on asecond, who do you think you're
talking to?
You know?
And so you get into this wholething, but it's like they think
they're winning.
They think that that's thesolution to this camera, to this
kind of effort.
Right, and it's not.
It's an unusual solution.
(40:01):
You went crazy for a second, butthat ain't the solution to this
.
You know, we do the same thingwith alcohol, we do the same
thing with drugs, we do the samething with sex, we do the same
thing with overeating.
We think that's a solution towhat you're feeling, but it's
not Right and so, so, so.
So when we talk about you doingtoo much, this is a catch all
(40:22):
kind of phrase and we kind ofsay that like, well, you know,
ha ha, ha.
But the truth of the matter is,when you look around life,
people are doing too much.
They're just doing too much.
It's way too much for you tohave to go through all these
mechanisms and mechanizationstrying to get happy when there's
a way that could make anefficient way go back to that
(40:43):
word efficient, it's one of ourfavorite words an efficient way
to produce happiness in yourexperience, if you were willing
to put in that solution, to putthat solution into play.
(41:06):
And so I just think it's such aninteresting way to look at it
that we started this thingtalking about lamb chops and
crab legs.
But it's like but I hearkenback to where do you find the
simplest of pleasures?
Where do you find the simplestof solutions, of answers in your
life?
Is it about real answers?
Is it, you know, druggingyourself into a stupor and you
can no longer function properly?
(41:26):
Or is it sitting down andreally dealing with some of this
counter effort that you'veexperienced in your past, that's
painted you into this box thatyou now have to do all these
weird things in order to try toget out of it?
No, let's put some stuff inplace that's going to really
work.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Right, and that's that's that's putting order into
disorder, whether it's abusiness, whether it's your,
your, your case, your reactivemind, uh, it's your case, your
reactive mind, the compositecase on the OT levels, and
handling that and dealing withall of those counter efforts
that produce unconsciousness.
And it could be said thatunconsciousness is a reduction
(42:07):
of awareness, like we weretalking about in the podcast the
other day, as far asoverthinking and just knowing in
the podcast the other day, asfar as overthinking and just
knowing.
And the way to do that isthrough processing and
retrieving, recovering.
Let's say, you have a hundredattention units uh, that's,
that's, that's just from theviewpoint of like a hundred
(42:27):
percent and before, beforeyou're born, and you might
possess 75 attention units and25 are all of the stuff that's
in your reactive mind, your case, and all that stuff, if you're
lucky, the composite being, thegenetic entities that are
(42:54):
running your body, thesuppression you've received,
that you've stored as facsimilesin the reactive mind, in your
case that tell you thou shaltnot do this again, because, at
the end of the day, what thereactive mind is doing is it's a
policy recorder, but it alwaysrecords the negative policies
and says, okay, I won't do this.
I won't do that.
I can't do this.
(43:15):
I shall be this, like Quentinsaid, where you're taking on
somebody else's valence, theirbehavior, the way they go about
things, and you're using that toultimately solve a problem, and
that problem is alwaysultimately survival.
Yes, so if you're doing thatand you're being somebody else,
(43:39):
and to the degree that you'rehappy which also comes to Arthur
and Quentin's point to thedegree that you're happy is to
the degree that your ethics arein and it could be said go ahead
.
Finish what you said said goahead, no finish what you're
saying, yeah, yeah, keep goingTo the degree it could be said
(44:10):
that to the degree that you arebeing yourself, body, however
many times, or along the wholetrack, or whatever and you had
to just throw something on thewall and see what stuck, and
then that didn't work, so youdecided to be somebody else.
So you're, if you're keepingyour, you know that being
yourself is the solution tohandling counter efforts, as
opposed to being somebody else.
(44:31):
Now you're at a point where,okay, you're unhappy and you're
going to do thousands, and Imean millions, of cycles of
action in this allotment of 75,90 years or whatever that you
didn't have to do, and you'regoing to get to the end of it
and go.
What did we learn from all this?
Speaker 3 (44:52):
well, even even at the moment, while I'm doing the
proteas course, like I'm on asection where I've got to do
nine clay demos in a row.
I mean, john, how many of howmany of those have I been stuck
on four or five times?
Speaker 1 (45:05):
oh, before I've, before I'm almost yeah, almost
almost all of them, and and sothat and that's a that's a great
analogy is, if you understandsomething, you can put it into a
clay demo, and and then I go goahead.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Yep, and that's that's where it's been
interesting, because it's mademe realize if I can't put it
into clay, then I'mmisunderstanding.
I still have misunderstoodaround it, right and and
initially I've gone throughdifferent phases of emotions.
No, the first one is you know,screw this I want to go have a
(45:42):
coffee and a cigarette.
Speaker 2 (45:44):
This can wait this is too much effort.
Speaker 3 (45:48):
Well, and it's.
It's the nature of themisunderstood, isn't it?
It's like, oh my god, this istoo hard.
But then that?
Then there's the other part aswell.
It's like, okay, what am Idoing wrong?
And then going, going back overthe data, going back over what
is the intention for thisparticular clay demo?
Um, and then it's like, oh,okay, I missed that.
(46:09):
Oh, I missed that as well.
Oh, I also missed that.
Speaker 1 (46:14):
And then the clay demo reveals itself right,
because now you understand itand you know what you need to do
in order to present that thing,and and that's right.
And how is that?
As you look back over thematerials and you look, and you
know, you send me the picturesand I go well, I'm not seeing
this in the clay.
And at your end you're probablyto a certain degree going you
(46:37):
know, fuck that guy, he doesn'tsee it, I see it right there.
Speaker 3 (46:41):
I've never thought that, John.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
And that's the same way with the universe, with the
physical universe and the actsof the laws.
Yeah, is you're like, well, youknow, screw that I'm not going
to do that because this, this isjust too hard.
And instead of finishing thatclay demo in the physical
universe whether it's a claydemo or it's something in your
life you're going to go to thisunusual solution instead, and
(47:10):
and then you try again, and youtry again.
I don't see it in the clay,arthur, I don't see it in the
clay.
Show me this, show me.
And then you finally go bingo.
And now you've got it.
Yes, same thing applies what'sinteresting.
Speaker 3 (47:22):
But what's interesting?
The end phenomena that occurswith that.
Now it becomes no wing to thecore, wordless, yeah, wordless.
It becomes like, like the axiomtalking about, um, you know,
changing your cells.
My cells have changed with thatend phenomena.
I cannot be the same, once I'vereached that point, producing a
(47:47):
clay demonstration because it'sto the cell, which means in
future, which means in future aswell around my, because I mean
the proteas is all aboutcommunication and it's a very,
it's a very big course justbased on communication.
Like, how can I not now applywhat I know?
It's impossible to not apply?
(48:09):
It's it's impossible for me tonot communicate the same way I
did before.
Speaker 1 (48:16):
You have a conceptual understanding.
Speaker 2 (48:21):
And that effort that it took you and this happens
when we work out our bodies ordo whatever, the effort that it
took you to get to that goal, tothat win it now is integrated
into the organism, right?
It's, like you said, cellularlevel, like I know that, I know
that, I know that, I know, andyou think with it, you think
(48:42):
along these lines on a continualbasis, and so that's the beauty
of training, that's the beautyof going on to the college and
signing up for a course anddoing the steps that LRA's laid
out.
That's the beauty of auditingthat you take all the counter
effort of your life and you faceit and you deal with it and
(49:02):
then you integrate it and thenyou think beyond it to a point
where now it's like that nolonger affects you and you can
live a happy life because ofthat.
It's such a beautiful, simple,efficient way of being.
I love it.
Speaker 3 (49:16):
Yeah, it's incredible and it does take a little bit
of time now to save an enormousamount of time later, because
without going through thisprocess, nothing in me would
change.
Yeah.
Yeah, and that's the I'd stillbe I'd be producing the same
cells.
I'd be stuck with the samemisunderstoods.
I'd still be.
I'd be producing the same cells.
I'd be stuck with the samemisunderstoods.
I'd still be Arthur yesterdayas opposed to Arthur today.
(49:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
Right.
So that's the whole point ofthis podcast is you could be
doing a lot less in order to geta lot further, working smarter,
not harder, if you choose theright data to work with, and you
choose, and that that data the,the, the, what you get from
auditing, what you get fromtraining, and this isn't, this
(50:01):
isn't just, uh, proprietary toscientology concepts, but it, it
covers everything in your life.
That's's the point is, if youunderstand these basics and you
can apply them to your existenceacross your eight dynamics,
those different areas of lifeyou yourself, your relationship,
(50:24):
your sexual relationship, yourgroup, the planet at large,
animals and plants, the physicaluniverse, all that stuff it
carries over, and so you have alot less counter effort to what
it is that you're doing in thefuture.
Postulates that you make andyou've changed your mind about I
can't do this, I can't do this,oh, I could never do that, I
(50:46):
could never talk to this person,and so now you multiply the
amount of cycles of action thatyou have to do and you spend so
much time doing things you don'thave to, and you can be happy
if you're being yourself.
So I hope this has gotten acrossto our listeners and we really
(51:08):
tried to reduce it down to itsbuilding blocks, which can be a
little tricky to understand, butwe've tried to analogize it as
much as we can for our listenersand take this information, look
at the Dianetic axioms, look atthe Scientology axioms and get
on course, get in session andstart saving yourself a
(51:28):
tremendous amount of time sothat you can be productive, thus
be happy being yourself and youcan help others along the way.
So for question, arthur andmyself, namaste, and we love you
, bye, bye, peace, peace, thankyou.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
Thank you.
Thanks for watching.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton tackle the biggest stories in news, politics and current events with intelligence and humor. From the border crisis, to the madness of cancel culture and far-left missteps, Clay and Buck guide listeners through the latest headlines and hot topics with fun and entertaining conversations and opinions.