SE9EP16 - When the Magic Happens

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Ever had one of those days that seemed destined for disaster, only to flip it around with a sudden burst of unexpected joy? In our latest episode, we explore how shifting your mindset from mere wanting to true anticipation can transform your reality. We recount a personal story where a bad day turned into a string of magical moments simply by postulating wondrous things to happen. We delve into the role of self-worth and how even trivial tasks like brushing your teeth can be influenced by your mindset of hope versus knowingness.

We then go deeper into the power of belief and how strong, decisive postulates can shape our experiences. Discover how conflicting goals and problems create a mental mass that can weigh you down, and learn the importance of expecting the universe to respond to your convictions. This episode is packed with insights on harnessing the power of your viewpoint to align your reality with your postulates. Whether you're looking to elevate your day-to-day life or achieve long-term success, our conversation offers valuable strategies to make it happen.

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Episode Transcript

Scientologirl (00:00):
Hey there, independent Scientologists.
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(00:21):
.

Jonathan (00:21):
Hi and welcome to another AOGP Outside of the
Church podcast.
This is season nine, episode 16, episode 108.
I'm here with ScientologistGirl, who had a wonderful idea
for a podcast here on aWednesday morning.
What's your idea?

Scientologirl (00:40):
Okay, so I don't know exactly where this is going
to take us, but you know wealways start and then it gets
pretty interesting.
Yeah, so I was pretty muchhaving a bad day at some point
and I, you know, I I wantedthings to get better, I wanted
my day to be good, but it wasjust one of those days, one day

(01:03):
that you day that you wake upand it seems like everything's
falling to shit really.
And so I decided to trysomething and I sat down and I
just asked.
I was like, and don't worry,this isn't going to get too
metaphysical or spiritual orwhatever.
Well, actually it will getspiritual, but it's not going to

(01:24):
get like too weird.
Anyway, I sat down and I'dasked for something magical to
happen, because at that point intime I also just, you know,
things were kind of solid andfeeling very real and you know
to-do lists, schedules, like allthis physical universe stuff,
and I just wanted that wonder,that joy, because I had

(01:48):
experienced it before,especially with doing
Scientology.
There were certain times in mylife where I was able to bring
good things.
You know we're talking about OTphenomenon, basically from you
know, the theta universephenomenon, basically um, from
you know the theta universe, um,and anyway.

(02:09):
So this day I sat down, I askedfor something and I had found
magic, but it was not in thesense that you might think so,
as I was going about my dayafter this experience.
I I was anticipating magic.
I was anticipating there beingsome sort of supernatural gift
and what ended up happening wasin everything I was able to see

(02:34):
some kind of magic happen,whether it was somebody
messaging me out of the bluethat I haven't heard from in a
while, or some sort of quoteunquote telepathy with me and my
pet to try and make him stoplike meowing before dinner, that
kind of thing, you know, justrandom stuff.
And that got me thinking thatthis is sort of similar to the

(02:57):
way postulates work, becausebeforehand I had started my day
thinking and believing, becauseapostolate the definition one of
is it's a self-created truth.
So I had started my daythinking, oh, everything's going
wrong, everything's going tocontinue to go wrong.

(03:18):
A simple thing.
I had just decided, withoutknowing that I decided, but I
was in this this is the key wordanticipating good things to
come, as if they were alreadythere.
So in that way, it was aself-created truth that good
things were going to happen andI was able to see the joy in

(03:39):
basically everything.
And whether or not that'smagical, as in something theta
outside of myself, or whether Iperceived it to just be, you
know good things happening.
I think it's kind of irrelevant.
It's more to the point that youknow we can create our

(04:00):
realities, whether they'resituational or people, et cetera
.
And I know this is kind of like, well, duh, that's what
postulates are.
But it was just amazing toactually view it on that day
where it was like I hadcompletely just changed.
And I think it's important tomention, because me and my

(04:22):
nephew actually had aconversation about this, because
I told him about it and he hadsaid well, what about on days
where it's kind of justimpossible or something like
that?
And I said well, that's thething, you're wanting, it it.
But the difference isanticipation is different from

(04:44):
wanting, because you can stillwant something but firmly
believe that you're not going toget it.
Versus anticipating.
It is knowingness, it's knowingthat you, as an infinitely
capable being, are able toattract whatever you want.
So it kind of works in two waysreally.
It's the immediate sense ofhappiness and that everything is

(05:09):
working out, which is I can'tsay it enough it is so
incredible for mental health andyour spiritual beingness as
well.
And then obviously there's thelong-term thing, which I think a
lot of people can say well, godworks in mysterious ways.
That's exactly what it is,except, instead of assigning it
to, I guess, a higher power, youcan be assigning it to yourself

(05:35):
and being like I kind of workin mysterious ways and the
universe has a calm leg and wejust need to wait for that thing
to happen.
Need to wait for that thing tohappen.
So, yeah, moral of the story isthere's a big difference
between wantingness andanticipation.
Slash postulates creating thisyeah yeah, well it.

Jonathan (05:58):
It is interesting to note that um and we we did a
podcast quite a while back aboutyou make a postulate that
you're going to brush your teethin the morning and in the
evening before bed, people gothat's a postulate.

Scientologirl (06:13):
Uh-huh, that's a postulate yes and no, it is.
Here's the thing.
It can be, in my opinion, apostulate.
However, if you lack self-worthand you consider you have this,
well, I hope to do that.
Hope is right at the bottom ofthe scale.

Jonathan (06:56):
And therein lies the that sort of thing.

Scientologirl (06:58):
And so now, you what about this?
What about that?

Jonathan (07:01):
You know I've got to be a realist.

Scientologirl (07:03):
all of that Right .

Jonathan (07:03):
What about this?
What about that?
I've got to be a realist, allof that.
Right Now you have a problem,and now it is alter-ised and is
stuck hanging there.

Scientologirl (07:12):
Yeah.

Jonathan (07:17):
Almost in space in a way, because there is a little
mass with it, because it is apostulate-counter-postulate
problem, goals-problems, mass inthe present time.

Scientologirl (07:23):
And that's what was fun about this, this little
well, I wouldn't even say it wasan experiment, because it
didn't start out that way.
I literally wanted magic and Iliterally wanted the universe to
give it to me and and, and itwasn't really hope because I I
had it.
Doesn't really matter who youassign the power to, it, doesn't

(07:44):
really matter who you assignthe power to, except You're
still assigning the power.
Yeah, except it matters.
It matters that you believewith all conviction, like you
know, you anticipate it.

Jonathan (07:56):
It's a decision.
It's a decision, it shall be.

Scientologirl (07:59):
And so I think the reason why this was so
powerful is because, well, withwhat you said.
And so I think the reason whythis was so powerful is because,
well, with what you said.
Like I mean, if you're tryingto go and say, god give me this,
or universe, give me this right, you already think to yourself,
because of everything we'vebeen taught and stuff like that,

(08:20):
that aspect of reality is waymore powerful than you are.
So in that day I was able tooutsource.
I guess, if you will, Well,that's what religion is.

Jonathan (08:34):
Is God, give me the strength.

Scientologirl (08:36):
Right, but in the positive sense.
I mean prayers do work, becausethey still have that
anticipation.

Jonathan (08:44):
It's a little diluted on a via.
Yes, it's a via, but it is,yeah, but it does work.
My still have that anticipation.
It's a little diluted on a via.
Yes, it's a via, but it is.
Yeah, but it does work.
My prayers have been answered.

Scientologirl (08:50):
Right Now.
What I'm simply saying is that,in order to get to that level
where you can actually be likeokay, my postulates are there,
I've made it and this is howit's going to be Exactly yeah,
my postulates are there, I'vemade it and this is how it's
going to be, exactly yeah.

Jonathan (09:10):
And and when I was on ot7, towards the end of it, I
would make postulates and theywould be frighteningly instant
because there wasn't any othermass yeah, there's no other
counter intention going on there.
Postulate, counter postulatefrom the ot case and you, you're
just like Jesus.
Oh my God, there it is.
And that's that is what LRH wasstriving for for over 30 years.

(09:34):
It is that quote, unquote magicwhere you can decide what you
want to be.
Now you have to be careful withthat because even though you
know it's that Spider-Man thing,with great power comes great
responsibility.

Scientologirl (09:48):
Yeah.

Jonathan (09:49):
You can.
If you want, you couldpostulate negative things for
yourself as well.
Exactly, you know it's havingHarry Potter's magic wand, so to
speak.

Scientologirl (10:00):
Yeah, and this is really my whole point what do
you anticipate you will get?
It doesn't matter what you wantor don't want.
Wanting is just okay.
Cool, yeah, cool story, bro,but it's the anticipation.
If you anticipate bad things,uh are gonna happen.

Jonathan (10:21):
Guess what they're gonna happen well, and that
anticipation is a considerationyes that things will be a
certain way a certain way and ifthere's something that is
giving you a consideration on,say on, you're on the the uh ot
levels, something is giving youa consideration that is less

(10:44):
than optimum pro-survivalchances are you need to take a
look, or tell your casesupervisor about it, because
that shouldn't be the case for abeing that is in in good shape
yeah.

Scientologirl (10:57):
so I guess then the question becomes how do you
know you're on the right path?
And I would say that if youhave to look at hope versus
anticipation, it's the feelingit gives off.
So when you're anticipatingsomething, it's the same feeling

(11:19):
that you would get when youalready have it, in my opinion,
like that excitement, because Iwas sitting there and I was like
excited.
I was like when is it going tohappen?
When is it going to happen?
I know it's going to happen.
You know, and that I meanpeople might be thinking that's
a little cuckoo, but that's howyou have to be.
You cannot have dreams withoutbeing a little cuckoo.

(11:41):
So you know, and then you lookat hope it's like.
Oh well, you know, I hope I hopethings just work out and I hope
my prayers get answered.
And I'm so worried and all ofit's it it never turns out
because you, you, you are thenat a lower frequency, assigning

(12:03):
power to something else outsideof you.

Jonathan (12:07):
Well, right, you're to that degree, you're being in
some degree effect, and that iswhy LRH came up with the concept
of tone 40.
Intention and tone 40 is it'sjust boom.

Scientologirl (12:24):
That's how it's going to be.

Jonathan (12:25):
And so this shall be.
So it is thought, so it ispostulated, so it is done yeah
and tone 40.
Intention is is incrediblypowerful and even um a little
little.
Uh, the little backstory isthat original ot7, which is
taken off the church's bridge asof 77, 78, original OT7 was a

(12:51):
set of processes to improve analready.
Well, there's a differencebetween OT and pre-OT.
You're not really OT untilafter OT7, then and new OT7 now,
and then you are an OT.
That's how it's defined.

(13:13):
So as a pre-OT, people werehaving trouble with getting
their intention not necessarilyacross, but getting it, getting
something done.
So he created a bunch ofprocesses.
They're really cool processesand they're done repetitively,
the repetitive processes youknow.
Do birds fly, thank you?

(13:34):
Do birds fly, thank you?
That type thing and they work ongetting your intention focused
on to getting what you need andor want and getting your
postulates to stick.
And it's really cool to do thatbecause some people, um, their
little, their, their wand mightbe a little running low on the

(13:58):
lithium ion battery, so to speak, type of a thing.
And this, this focuses it.
So intention in, like he says,intention is cause and the
definition of an ot is theability to make things go right.
And to make things go right,one has to postulate.
Now to your point.
Sorry, I'm going on here toyour point about what you were

(14:19):
talking about, a feeling.
Right when you were, you wereexplaining to our listeners
about the, the feeling of it.
Yeah, I, I.
It made me think of how youfeel about a particular thing
that happened or a particularperiod yeah in your life you're

(14:41):
in love, you're excited.
In your life, you're in love,you're excited, this type of
thing.
And you look back on it and yougo back to the place where this
wonderful thing happened andyou're like I'm not feeling it.
You know why?
Because it's the same thingthat happens when you're

(15:01):
postulating A thetan createstheir own emotions.
A thetan uses an emotion to geta desired result.
See, you call it chicken skingoosebumps.
Yeah, just talking about it,because it is you, the being,
that creates that feeling.
So you're in love, okay, andthat that you know.

(15:27):
Just the little cupids flyingaround and the hearts, and you
hear the birds singing in thatspring song that they use and
everything.

Scientologirl (15:34):
When you look at me every day, you feel that way,
don't you?
I do?

Jonathan (15:39):
I do.
But see that's and and andthat's, that's that.
But see, that is a factualstatement, my narcissism coming
out.
That is a factual statement,that it is a creation.

Scientologirl (15:51):
Yeah.

Jonathan (15:53):
Okay, and when I say it, excuse me.
You are a creation of apostulate that I made six years
ago that I would have a partner,a wife who was beautiful,

(16:13):
creative, helped with, with,with you know, putting the, the
org presence there andeverything.
And I and I'm I'm not trying toget all mushy to our listeners
or anything like that, I'm justsaying this was a postulate I
made and I said this is how thisis going to feel and this is
what it's going.
Here I am, here I am Now.

(16:51):
I'm not saying I created you oranything like that, and that is
something I think that deservesto be talked about as well is I
didn't create you, you didn'tcreate me.
So how does a postulate work inthat sort of a way?
Go ahead, I can see you.

Scientologirl (17:08):
Well, you know, while you were talking, I was
actually thinking to myself.
Well, let's say, and this wasbefore you mentioned you, so
don't think it was you that Ithought this about when you were
talking about love and rainbowsand unicorns and you were
talking about rainbows andunicorns.
Yeah, and you were talkingabout rainbows and unicorns and
stuff.
I thought to myself like we'veall seen these situations where

(17:31):
it's completely one-sided andthis person is like head over
heels with somebody and justabsolutely delusional.

Jonathan (17:39):
Right.

Scientologirl (17:40):
Thinking.
You know well, I mean somebodyelse could be like you know what
.
I'll just make a postulate tobe with Angelina Jolie.
You know, obviously that'sprobably not going to happen.
So I think in that way you'vegot to remember with postulates
is that like attracts, likeright.

(18:01):
So you can't control beings andtheir self-determinism unless,
as Zola Richa says, you lie tothem.
Now, aside from that which isobviously lies, and they have no
space in the theta universe,postulates and all of that stuff
.
That said, you can postulatesomebody and somebody out there

(18:28):
with a similar postulate thatwants somebody like you.
You know it's going to happen.

Jonathan (18:36):
You're going to draw each other together.
Yeah, that's that physics thingof like electrons attract like
electrons.

Scientologirl (18:40):
Yeah.

Jonathan (18:40):
And that is ARC.
In this sense is ARC, yeah, andthat is.

Scientologirl (18:45):
ARC in this sense is ARC.

Jonathan (18:46):
Yeah, You're attracting that tone level which
you emit.

Scientologirl (18:50):
Yeah.
And that's part of the magic ofa postulate See.

Jonathan (18:58):
See how that worked for us.

Scientologirl (18:59):
Yeah.

Jonathan (19:16):
And you see how that would work for somebody else.
And he talks about this wayback in 1952 on what's now known
as the Root to Infinitylectures, where you put out
there what it is that you want.
I know they have another termfor it, but he mentions it
before it came up in modernsociety, where you're just
you're mocking it up, how it'sgonna look, what it's gonna be
like all of this stuff.
you're putting it there and I, Ido that with anything, yeah,
anything that I that that's bigis a big thing is.

(19:40):
I just start going about thephysical universe and putting
things into place because that'swhat's going to happen.
You are so assured that is tone40 intention.
You're just like, yeah, this isthe slip where the yacht is
going to be.
I need to get this repainted, Ineed to get this.
And people are like what areyou nuts?

(20:02):
You don't even own a boat.

Scientologirl (20:03):
Yeah, yeah, I do, but see, there's.

Jonathan (20:04):
You don't even own a boat.
Yeah, yeah, I do, but seethere's a comm lag in the
physical universe, right?

Scientologirl (20:11):
And I think it would also make sense to include
sanity level with this.

Jonathan (20:17):
Well, like you said, with the Angelina Jolie type of
a thing you know and the peoplein their universe, universe and
this goes back to season 9,episode 15, yesterday's podcast
completely, realities arerelative yeah their universe
says I'm I'm with angelina jolie.
So you could almost say thatthe other two universes would go

(20:41):
like what are you nuts?
You don't even own a boat.
What are you nuts?
You're gonna be married toangelina jolie and all of her
kids right what's brad pittgonna think?
You know yeah maybe nothing, Idon't know.

Scientologirl (20:53):
But so then you gotta, you gotta kind of ask
yourself, like what, whatactually?
What is the defining point onon making our postulates
actually come true?

Jonathan (21:04):
Because sometimes you can be your certainty.

Scientologirl (21:07):
Well, the thing is, you can be delusionally
certain.

Jonathan (21:10):
Well, you can be delusional, you can be
delusionally certain, but let'sdo a case in point.

Scientologirl (21:17):
Okay.

Jonathan (21:19):
One of our favorites here in South Africa, elon Musk.
Where did he start out at?
He was a kid sitting in his momand dad's house.
Programming created PayPal.

Scientologirl (21:32):
Yeah.

Jonathan (21:34):
And now, and he said you know, I love science fiction
and I want to go to the starsand I want robots, all of this
stuff, that we can do this, thisstuff.
Why isn't anybody doing thisstuff?
Right and they said kid, you'renuts.
Yeah, go outside and play, getoff that computer, you see yeah,

(21:57):
or maybe you didn't have thatwell, I'm just know again.
Like we said in yesterday'spodcast, episode 9, season 9,
episode 15,.
One man's delusion is anotherperson's reality.
Reality is a relative.

Scientologirl (22:15):
Okay, but I mean, we've all known these people
though.

Jonathan (22:19):
They're dragging you into their reality.
I guess, is what I'm trying tosay.

Scientologirl (22:22):
I mean these people that you know they're not
too bright and they walk aroundand they say one day they're
going to be a star and that justdoesn't happen.
Because so what?
Why?

Jonathan (22:37):
didn't it.

Scientologirl (22:38):
Exactly.

Jonathan (22:39):
Why didn't it?
Well, intention is cause.

Scientologirl (22:42):
So I guess the question really becomes like
where is the line drawn?
Because, okay, there's allthese ifs, buts and maybes that
we've discussed so far, but Ihonestly feel like we're missing
that one thing that defineswhether a person can do

(23:03):
something or not do something.
Because, okay, let me think so.
Lrh says a thetan always knowsright.

Jonathan (23:14):
Yeah.

Scientologirl (23:15):
And we know that.

Jonathan (23:17):
Inexplicably.

Scientologirl (23:19):
Right, and we know that things like you know,
overridden withholds et cetera,they slow us down and you know
there's all this mass and stufflike that and so areas we don't
touch, et cetera, andopportunities we neglect.
So I guess in that way youcould kind of distinguish that

(23:41):
you are able to do everythingthat you want to do.
No, no, You're doing everythingthat you can do at that point,
anything you anticipate, right.

Jonathan (23:54):
The status quo is where you're at right now.

Scientologirl (23:56):
Right.

Jonathan (23:59):
And I thought about doing a podcast on that a while
back, but I don't know thatpeople can have that, because
what you can have is what yougot and that that is that is can
be insultory to some peoplevery, very, very interesting
yeah and that's that, that's thehaving this thing, that's

(24:21):
that's having, this is what youcan have and and that which you
and why he says complexity andconfronting, you know, in the
complexity and confronting PL.

Scientologirl (24:30):
So no dream is too small, no dream, no dream is
too big.

Jonathan (24:33):
No, dream is too big If there isn't technology.
If there isn't technology inthe physical universe, well then
, by God, you're going to haveto create it.
But the thing is is otherpeople have done it.
Other people have done it.
Look at the Wright brothers,Look at Marconi in the radio, I

(24:56):
mean you know.
Just go on and on, and on andon Steve Jobs.

Scientologirl (25:00):
Now, did these people have something that
ordinary folk don't?

Jonathan (25:05):
They didn't have the consideration that they couldn't
.
Why not?

Scientologirl (25:11):
Yeah.

Jonathan (25:12):
That's the counterintention versus
intention.

Scientologirl (25:15):
So you would say they were….
Okay, so we mentioned insanity,for example, and I think with
with uh, with certain levels ofinsanity you get, you go down,
obviously, the scale and thenyou go to enforced and inhibited
, no refuse, and all of those,and then, and then you bounce
back and then you, you know, you, you, you can kind of be pts

(25:37):
right, because I mean that's,that's generally what happens.
So when you look at it, at it,then it rather becomes a case of
it's not that you're insane,it's not that insanity has an
effect, it's that because ofbeing that way sorry, I hope I'm

(26:01):
making sense, but because ofbeing that way, if you're at
enforced it's not going to cometrue, versus if you're just
flowy and freely.
What I'm basically saying isthat the goal is to be curious.

Jonathan (26:17):
Yeah, because well then the cdei scale yeah and I'm
sorry I have to mention thispodcast after podcast, but it's,
it's just so fundamental andimportant yeah, it is, it's your
it's, it's your attitudetowards life and everything else
right, including postulates.
Right, and it is a distilleddown version of the tone scale.

(26:41):
Really because curious is atstrong interest on the tone
scale.

Scientologirl (26:46):
Yeah, even mild interest.

Jonathan (26:48):
Maybe even mild interest and I'm just riffing
here because it's not mentionedbut it's obvious in the text and
above that is understand andknow.
On the CDEI scale, I don'tremember where CDEI comes in
compared to the tone scale, butI imagine the tone scale if I
remember correctly well, thetone scale was introduced in 51.

(27:11):
So CDEI came after, but it's anabbreviated version of it.
So you, if if one is going topostulate properly where, where
is postulates on the tone scale,there to your right uh 30.0 and
and uh serenity being this is Ineed glasses 40.

Scientologirl (27:36):
40, right.

Jonathan (27:37):
I don't know why I'm talking so long.
It's not far off at all.
The thing is is that when onemakes a postulate, that is okay
and this is why it's called whatit's called Tone 40.
Intention is tone 40 serenityof beingness okay.

(27:58):
Well, that's why tone 40 works.
When, when you make a postulateand you really want it to quote
unquote stick, you're doing itat tone 40, you're not doing it
at curious, maybe it'll work Idon't know maybe it won't work,
I don't know, and here's, here's, here's what I have a problem
with.

Scientologirl (28:16):
That with okay is because obviously already on
the tone scale there ispostulates, right.

Jonathan (28:23):
Postulates is at 30, okay.

Scientologirl (28:27):
So technically it's one down from knowingness,
or rather serenity.
So serenity for me implies noneeds or wants.
Therefore, why would you needto postulate so yeah?

Jonathan (28:45):
Well, that's tone 40 intention.
The thing is to get through.
You're going to put some fruitin the jello.
Let's say the jello is thephysical universe and we've got
a nice big bowl of red raspberryjello Tasty, tasty, tasty but
there's nothing in it.
That's the physical universeand you could put some

(29:09):
raspberries in that raspberryjello or whatever fruit, god
forbid.
I can't stand fruit in my jello.
But if you want to put it inthere and you want it, because
if you disturb the jello, what'sit going to look like?
It's going to be a jumbled mess.
It isn't going to be this clearsurface where you put the fruit

(29:31):
in the jello and it's suspendedand it's like it's just
perfectly there.
That's your postulate.
The fruit is the postulate.
Okay okay so if you you go, goit in forest and you put fruit
in the in the jello the jellobeing the physical universe
what's the jello gonna look like?
all, smashed up all smashed upand it's gonna, it's, it's blown
yeah okay, that is what happensin most situations with the

(29:56):
phaeton in the physical universe.
Okay, so at tone 40 you'reputting it there and you're just
saying, like why?
God jinn said to obi-wan kenobi, a solution will present itself
.
He's at.
No, he doesn't care how this ishow phaetons operate.
You don't get into the minutia.

Scientologirl (30:18):
So then it would be fair to say that the
postulate came first right, andthen maybe you made it happen
through Right.

Jonathan (30:26):
The lie on the whole thing is the time.
That's the thing.

Scientologirl (30:30):
And then you just wait, and that's where serenity
is.

Jonathan (30:33):
That's right, and you've got a calm lag or a delay
in the physical universe.
It can be insufferably long 60years.
I've had postulates I made whenI was two that are just now
showing up.
Now.
Whose fault is that mine?
Do I blame myself?
No, in the end lrh says there'snobody to blame.
You just did or you didn't.

(30:54):
But the thing is, is thatthings manifest?
Just like we were sayingearlier, things manifest, if I
can use that term, to the degreethat you put it there with
intention.

Scientologirl (31:10):
Would you say that that intention is akin to
the anticipation thing?

Jonathan (31:19):
Well, the whole problem, like we just mentioned
and this is the thing that mostpeople overlook is what is the
common underlying lie?
Time, yes.

Scientologirl (31:33):
Okay.

Jonathan (31:33):
Okay, therein lies the problem.
Okay Is you're, you're nottaking into consideration time.
But you shouldn't take intoconsideration time because
you're not of the physicaluniverse.
So you're, you're rerouting theelectricity and saying, well,
it has to go through this, andthen the the, the capacitor, has

(31:55):
to fill up before the flow willbe let through into the rest of
the circuit board, which powersthis boom, whatever it is, and
creates this thing.
You don't have to do that.
One thing doesn't have to comebefore the other.
So the trick is is to say and Iknow this sounds weird and
people are gonna go oh, unicornsand rainbows.

Scientologirl (32:21):
Postulate it early, okay.

Jonathan (32:23):
Say it's already there , and then it'll show up.

Scientologirl (32:26):
Right, that makes sense.

Jonathan (32:28):
Does that make sense?
Mm-hmm?
Because you're already on a viaof a body in the universe that
has this thing called a lie,which is time, and the whole
universe is one big clockwork.
Everything spins aroundeverything else in order to give
it motion, because withoutmotion the universe wouldn't
persist.
Because motion is it moved frompoint a to point b, the sun

(32:48):
goes across the sky, the planetturns, the system turns, the
galaxy turns, the galaxy turnsaround other galaxies is it's
one big clock.

Scientologirl (32:57):
Right.
So what would you say is likethe one thing that could, aside
from time, that kills,postulates, the biggest thing.

Jonathan (33:06):
Time.

Scientologirl (33:07):
Besides time, besides time.

Jonathan (33:09):
Besides time, A lack of intention, A lack of and I'm
going to use a longer word herespecificity.
Remember we were talking aboutwhat LRA says about in Root to
Infinity is, you've got to putit there.
Besides time, failed intention.

Scientologirl (33:32):
Okay, failed intention.

Jonathan (33:33):
Failed intention.

Scientologirl (33:34):
So Failed intention, failed intention, so
what would that look like?

Jonathan (33:43):
Did you put it there?

Scientologirl (33:45):
Right, but that's a postulate.

Jonathan (33:49):
That's the postulate, but the thing is you know how
you were saying earlier that aperson you know well, maybe I
can do this.
We were talking about curiousversus no, so is your.
Was your, like Alarait says,intention or failed intention?
That's all there is to it andthat goes to the way that a

(34:10):
thetan can be wrong is under orover estimation of effort.

Scientologirl (34:19):
Right, right can be wrong is under or over
estimation of effort, right,right.
But I think there's somethingthat kind of naturally happens
when, when you make a postulatebecause and I think that's the
fundamental difference betweenhope and postulates with hope
you kind of just hope with apostulate you know self-created
truth.
So if there's a self-createdtruth.
So if there's a self-createdtruth, you are naturally I'm not
talking about forcing yourselfor anything you're naturally

(34:41):
going to put things in place forthat thing to happen.
So, for example, if you make apostulate, you know what I want
to move into the city and that'show it's going to be.
Well, you're going to startdoing things.
You're going to start lookingfor places that are offering,
you're going to browse, you know, you're going to see what, what

(35:03):
the crime is like or this orthat.
You know.
You.
You're going to start doingthings towards, toward that
direction.
So you know, in that way, it's,it's.
It definitely is different fromhope.
I'm stuck on this hope thingbecause it's so interesting when
you really think about it, andit's funny that Christians use

(35:23):
hope and faith in the same way,because with hope, to me hope
doesn't say anything to do withfaith.
With faith there's this beliefthat well, I mean they even say
faith is belief that something'sgoing to happen.
So in that way, religiously,that can be a postulate, whereas

(35:45):
, you know, hope is kind of like, well, you just, you just hope,
you, you're just wishing forthe best outcome, but there's,
there's nothing that you can do,and hoping is also almost like
saying well, I'm not sure if myGod can figure this out for me,

(36:06):
but let's hope it'll all workout for the best.

Jonathan (36:09):
Well, lrh says in the second advanced clinical course.
He says the definition of hopeis as follows Advanced Clinical
Course.
He says the definition of hopeis as follows the desire that
sometime in the future one willcease to have something which he
no longer wants but, can't seemto get rid of, or that one will

(36:31):
acquire something he wants, andthat's from December of 1953.

Scientologirl (36:35):
Okay, does he have a definition for faith?

Jonathan (36:38):
Well, let's take a look.

Scientologirl (36:40):
I think faith was in the havingness scale, wasn't
it?
Pretty sure, but it definitelywasn't as low.

Jonathan (36:47):
It's in the pre-havingness scale for sure.
Yeah, well, yeah, which isridiculously huge, not in a good
, a bad ridiculous, but in agood ridiculous.
Yeah, let's see F-A-I-L no.

Scientologirl (37:04):
No.

Jonathan (37:04):
It's not in the technical dictionary.
Let me look in.

Scientologirl (37:08):
And I will quickly check Google as well.
I'll look on our.

Jonathan (37:11):
AI platform and see, Well, I'm sure it's, you know.
I mean, obviously it's anEnglish word.

Scientologirl (37:17):
Yeah.

Jonathan (37:18):
But let's see what LRA says.

Scientologirl (37:22):
Yeah, so.
Google I'll just quickly say itcomplete trust or confidence in
someone or something.
That's very different from hope.

Jonathan (37:35):
Yeah, yeah, it is.

Scientologirl (37:36):
Let's see what it is over here.
What hope is A feeling ofexpectation and desire for a
particular thing to happen.

Jonathan (37:48):
I'm loading the hard to find words glossary.

Scientologirl (37:51):
Okay.

Jonathan (37:51):
It takes a minute.
I wrote it.
I've got 20%.

Scientologirl (37:54):
But yeah, for those listening, there's
obviously a very, very bigdifference, and I understand
that our listeners aren'tparticularly one way or the
other, just solely Christian ornot, or whatever.
But basically my understandingis that if you're just hoping
for something to happen, is thatif you're just hoping for

(38:16):
something to happen, if you'resitting around and you have
postulates and dreams and goalsand you're not actively trying
to pursue them or makingpostulates and deciding that
this is going to happen, that'snot a great place to be in,
because you have tofundamentally understand that
you are in complete control ofyour life at this very minute

(38:40):
and you might say well, you knowwhat I'm, I'm with somebody who
suppresses me.
Okay, why are you with thatperson?

Jonathan (38:46):
or who decided to be with that person exactly, but.

Scientologirl (38:49):
But even if you made the decision to to be with
somebody, that there was thatway, you can still unmake that
decision.
You can still decide, you know.
So you've got to get yourpostulates in order, but I
promise you, whatever, whateveryou can think of that you want
to do, it is possible foundfaith okay, great okay.

Jonathan (39:11):
now this is defined as faith in pretty much much the
same thing Noun and this comesfrom Scientology infinity,
infinity to zero, zero toinfinity, or people say eight.
8008 is the name of the book.
It's on our website An inflowof agreement.
Faith in is defined as a noun,an inflow of agreement and the

(39:34):
placing of one's beingness anddoingness under the control of
another.
It brings about the acceptanceof reality other than one's own
and is, in other words, thesacrifice of one's universe.
Boom, mic drop.

Scientologirl (39:54):
It's not a terrible thing, though it is,
but it isn't, and here's why itit can be a via and it can lead
to you, uh, gaining what youwant.
The only problem is confusinghope with faith, because I've
seen a lot of people who havesaid, who have told other people
just have faith, and thesepeople are crying and, you know,

(40:15):
unhappy, and obviously I'veseen it a lot of people who have
told other people just havefaith, and these people are
crying and unhappy, andobviously I've seen it a lot
because of my Christianupbringing and stuff.
But these people are crying andeverything and they're like I
do have faith, but it's just nothappening.
No, what you have is hope.
You've been hoping this entiretime that things will happen and
it's just not happening whenyou have faith, if you truly had

(40:37):
faith faith you'd be jumpingfrom the rooftop saying yes,
it's coming, baby it's a coming.

Jonathan (40:41):
Well, and that's the thing is is on the on on the the
scale of cause slash awareness,faith and hope are down at the
bottom on the grade chart.
On awareness, they're below.
Wait a minute.

Scientologirl (40:58):
Need for change yeah, yeah, look, you know I'm
not saying I'm not, I'm by nomeans saying a vi is a good
thing.
However, it's a lot better thanhope right.

Jonathan (41:10):
I mean, you know something's better than nothing.
But again that goes back to ourpodcast from yesterday, season
nine, episode 15.
Reality is a relative.
That's the tone scale, that'sARC.
And again that brings us to theKRC triangle no control,
k-n-o-w.
No, the word control and theword responsibility.

Scientologirl (41:33):
Right.
And another thing, just to goback a bit.
Another problem with faith,even though it's a great
starting point, is that if youcompletely rely on an other
determinism, long term, I mean,what's going to happen there?

(41:54):
Well, I mean, obviously you'retaking away power from yourself.
And so then you know, you havethis expectation of things
constantly.
But at the same time, if youhave faith, there's something
that's lacking between faith anda postulate, and that thing is

(42:15):
pretty much that you have thepower to change things because,
again, if you believe that yourpostulates are true, can come
true, you're going to walk, towork towards those things.
It's not just going to be likesomething's going to give it to
me, like a gift, you know right?

Jonathan (42:32):
well, it's, it's it's.
It's directly proportional to Ineed to build a house.
I can build it myself or I canhire some contractors to do it
for me.
I don't know how to build ahouse, but I know a guy who

(42:53):
knows some guys that can buildthe house for me, so I have
faith in them and I hope thatthey can build the house for me
that I like and is of goodquality, whereas, opposed to ARC
and KRC with the subject ofhouse building, you could build
your own house far better thananybody else could, because it

(43:15):
would be to the exact standardsand quality, to what you had
postulated in the beginning, andthat is why auditing is so
important.
If a person can't do that withanything.
You look at LRH, you look atElon Musk, you look at I hate to
say this Jeff Bezos, forexample, and it's not because

(43:38):
these guys have money.
Money is a side effect of theseguys taking these things and
going.
I have a great idea.
Nobody else has done.

Scientologirl (43:48):
I think it's important to mention, though,
that, going back to what we weresaying, what is the difference
between like, what is thesurefire way that you'll get
what you want?
I don't think it's necessarilya case of believing only that
it's there.
I think the most importantthing you can do is believe in

(44:11):
your abilities.

Jonathan (44:12):
Well, certainty.

Scientologirl (44:13):
And know that you are able to mean.
This is why I think I think alot of matterhorns are so
successful.
They have this like absolutecertainty that things are going
to work out.
And then you know they do yeah,matter again a matterhorn.

Jonathan (44:28):
Matterhorn is somebody on a our personality test, the
oca, that is constantly rightand is almost impossible to
train and everything and and uh,they're the, the people that
rub you the wrong way becausethey're just so self-certain
that it's beyond irritating, butthey're really not that capable

(44:49):
because, they can't be trainedbeyond where they're at and
you're, you're.
Eventually you'll end up beingsuppressed by them.

Scientologirl (44:55):
Yeah, I mean, and that's the thing, though I have
seen a lot of them who havereally excelled.
But then because, look, lrhsays, if you, in terms of
statistics, if things are notgetting better, they're

(45:16):
definitely getting worse.
So if you're at a baseline,it's not going to stay baseline,
it's going to get worse.
And if you are a Matterhorn,your certainty is basically
staying there and that's whatyou know, right.
So you can excel right up untila certain point, but because you
cannot go any higher, becauseyou refuse to learn, you, you
you can't you plateaued, andthat's where you're gonna stay

(45:38):
exactly yeah, and and then, butthis is the thing, though,
because life doesn't stay thereit's not a static everything
just starts going down, andthat's, that's what I've seen
with actual people in my lifewho, um, they, you know, they
were once at the top andeverything was going great.
Next thing you know, they'reright back to where they started

(46:00):
, and it's, it's sad right.

Jonathan (46:03):
Well, again to your point earlier.
There's two types ofcertainties.
Then there's there's the youyou.
You believe in your own lie.
This can sound really strange.
You believe in your own lie,but you believe in your own lie
either way, because you'reputting something there that

(46:25):
doesn't exist yet in theuniverse.
It is one big lie but this isthe thing though wouldn't it
then make it that that is thetruth you're putting a truth
there, not a lie.
Well, and therein per whatHubbard says, and I agree, is
that the fundamental truth isthe thetan themselves, and this
is where all of this leads to.

Scientologirl (46:48):
Yeah.

Jonathan (46:48):
Yeah, is you are the truth and you create a
self-created truth, which is apostulate, and that is all there
is to it.
On the chessboard of thephysical universe and the theta
universe, if you know you can,you can.
If you know you don't, can youhave faith and you have hope.

(47:11):
And auditing returns thatability to I know I.
It's not just that, I know Ican, it's just I know.
And that also presents itselfand manifests itself as
emotingness or emotion in in thephysical universe and, more
importantly, for yourself,because a Thetan creates their

(47:34):
own emotion.
And to your point on what youwanted to do, this podcast on
that's the magic, that's thatmagical feeling of creativity is
when you feel that way whereyou're on the magic carpet and
you're just flying, you know,over the desert, you know, with
Robin Williams playing the genie, and it's everything's magical

(47:57):
and you know, and that's that'sthe thing is, it's, it's just
like a story, it is a suspensionof disbelief.
You suspend your own disbeliefor you don't.

Scientologirl (48:12):
Well, yeah, yeah.
I guess you could say like ifyou have low self-worth you're
not going to get anywhere.
So if you quote-unquote suspendthe disbelief then you know or
better yet.

Jonathan (48:31):
I mean you're suspending your disbelief.
That's an analog, because ifyou really know, you know.

Scientologirl (48:42):
Right, but in order to get to knowingness I
mean, it is a scale.
You can't just wake up one dayand be like I'm going to know
and I'm going to get everythingI want.

Jonathan (48:50):
Well, sometimes you can push through and you haven't
had any auditing and you getsomewhere.
And this is the conundrum thatpeople run into in Scientology
when they go to the church isthey're like, yeah, I can do
this, and then the church says$100,000, please.

Scientologirl (49:07):
Yeah.

Jonathan (49:08):
Well, how am I supposed to get OT?
I need to be OT to get the$100,000.

Scientologirl (49:14):
Exactly, exactly.

Jonathan (49:19):
And that's therein is the problem.

Scientologirl (49:22):
Here's a's a funny thought, though, and it
has to do with honesty.
So like if, if you, if you I'mtrying to piece it together
because I just now thought of it, but it seems to like my
knowingness tells me that thatit has something to do with this
but like if, if you are a veryhonest person and you try to
have integrity in everything, Ithink chances are your

(49:44):
postulates have a much betterchance of coming true, because
you are essentially being honestwith yourself.

Jonathan (49:52):
Sure, sure.
I mean, that is the only waythat it ever happens.

Scientologirl (49:57):
Right, you know you can lie to yourself and be
like, yeah, I can make it happen, but you know that can't,
really that won't happen.
You can lie about what you are,but again, that's only going to
get you so far.

Jonathan (50:12):
Right.

Scientologirl (50:13):
When I say lie, I mean to yourself.

Jonathan (50:15):
Yeah, you could lie to yourself and say I'm going to
brush my teeth two times a day,in the morning and in the
evening.
Yeah, it Obviously I'm going tobrush my teeth two times a day,
in the morning and in theevening.
It isn't going to happen unlessand we mentioned this in an
earlier podcast, I forget whichone it was in the last couple
weeks it takes doingness tobrush your teeth twice a day.

Scientologirl (50:35):
But even then that doingness, if you've made a
postulate that doingness itisn't that enforced, it's easy.

Jonathan (50:41):
Well, right it is.
Where is it?
On the determinisms Itself.
At a minimum.
At a minimum.
It's not other determined,unless you know you're operating
off of an engram of mom and dadberating you.
You have to brush your teethtwice a day.
If you don't brush your teeth,your teeth are going to fall out

(51:02):
of your head.
I got that, I got.
I mean I got that when I was akid.
Then it's that enforced.
But the thing is is that's whyauditing helps is you have these
false truths that have been putin there, that are in the
reactive mind.
You erase those and make themanalytical, just your own, and
you go yeah, it was funny, theybehaved that way.
That's looking at itanalytically.

(51:22):
And then you make your owndecisions about it, based off of
informing yourself aboutdentists who are reliable
sources, who say this is how youkeep your teeth clean and if
you don't want to have falseteeth by the time you're 60, you
need to do this, this and this.
And you decide okay, I need tobrush my teeth twice a day, and
then you do it.
That's the lineage of that.

Scientologirl (51:45):
The point is, it's actually pretty easy when
you really make a postulate andstuff.
So at what point doesn't it?
Because I noticed that with me.
Obviously people who arelistening to this podcast know

(52:07):
that I don't know what's goingon.
But yeah, I clearly need coffee.
But people that are listening,they obviously know I have ADHD
and the case in point right nowpoint right now.

(52:27):
So I guess my question is whendoes it actually go from being
absolutely certain that this isgoing to happen to like dragging
your feet?
Because obviously with ADHDit's a motivation problem?
Now I understand, you knowpeople are like well, adhd, how
dare you use psychology terms ona or psychiatric terms on a
Scientology podcast?
But it is what it is, sowhatever.
But I struggle sometimes tokeep that motivation, to keep

(52:51):
that postulate alive.
What goes wrong in aScientology sense?

Jonathan (52:56):
Well, Satan can go into agreement with certain
things.

Scientologirl (53:02):
Okay.

Jonathan (53:04):
So one of those things is the company.
You keep the people who you arearound and you selectively give
and you go down the tone scaleand they start going into their
evaluations and validations.
You know you'll never be able tomake it.
You won't.
Okay, that's you know.

(53:29):
You'll never be able to make it, you won't.
That's you know.
I'm just generally speaking andis is that your intention
wasn't there high enough tobegin with.
So maybe you have some overtsin the area that are preventing
you from reaching that thatparticular postulate entirely,
and that, more often than notthat's 90% of the time, that's
what it is there's some sort ofback off in the area.
That's what L11 is about, is ithandles that type of a thing,

(53:51):
and you can do L11 and you canfall down the spiral again, even
and that's just because of one,because when you clear up an
area and then you go commit anover in an area that you cleaned
up, now it seems like an800-pound gorilla because it was
the solution to a problem.

Scientologirl (54:06):
Here's an interesting question though.
So you've said on countlesstimes, and I've even said it
with you, that a clearedcannibal is a cleared cannibal
right.

Jonathan (54:13):
That's what LRH says.

Scientologirl (54:16):
So therefore the cannibalism technically isn't an
overt to that person.

Jonathan (54:21):
Because it's part of the moral codes of the society
within which they live.

Scientologirl (54:24):
We eat people.
That's how we survive.
What's wrong with it?
So then, it would be fair tosay that some people consider
more things as overts than otherpeople.

Jonathan (54:36):
Right.
Ethics is a personal thing.

Scientologirl (54:38):
Right, Right, Ethics is a personal thing,
Right?
So in that way I don't thinkI've ever asked this or known
how to really phrase it.
But how can a person not seeoverts as overts, Because that
would be wonderful If you couldjust walk around.

(55:00):
Obviously you don't want to goand kill people and stuff
because that's aberrated youknow, unless you're a cleared
cannibal, Right.
But how if you've been trainedto think, like in the case of
robotism, that everything you dois a potential overt?
Yeah, I think that's more of acase of they don't know, that

(55:20):
they don't know, or quite a…quite unconscious incompetence,
like like, let's say, forexample, some people, especially
with things like I'm going touse psychological terms and
psychiatric terms but like inthe case with people who are um,
who have ocd, so they're goingalong great and then they have a
stumble with their you knowroutines and to-do lists and to

(55:45):
them that's an overt.
So let's say they were supposedto take, let's say they were
supposed to brush their teethevery morning and then they
forgot one day or something cameup and that was an overt now
for a lot of people because ofthe ocd, like it is difficult to
break out of that again.

(56:06):
It's so how do you stop that inits tracks?

Jonathan (56:10):
well, typically, when you, when you see a person again
starting from the ethics is apersonal thing uh, clear,
cannibal.
They're okay with eating,eating other people or people in
their tribe, whatever is you'relooking at it, where's?
Where is that out on the scaleof determinism?

Scientologirl (56:29):
other determined, self-determined, pan-determined
well, sometimes I think itmight feel a bit other
determined, like there's justthis force that's, that's sort
of controlling you.
And the reason why I think thisis important to to talk about
and that goes with this thing,is because obviously not all of
us are consistent.
So, you know, if what you weresaying is basically that you

(56:52):
know they can be pulled in otherdirections because of overts,
so if they are trying their bestbut then an overt or perceived
overt comes along, there's thisneed for perfection.
It's perfectionism that canreally severely stifle progress.

(57:13):
How do you address that?

Jonathan (57:16):
Well, more often than not, nine times out of ten,
there's some sort of a dianeticincident underlying that that is
causing the line to go off tothe left or to the right instead
of the vector of point A topoint B Nine times out of 10,
there is something there.
Now a person could say, well, aclear wouldn't experience that.

(57:38):
Hang on, because a clear is abeing't experience that.
Hang on because they're you.
A clear is a being who nolonger has their own reactive
mind.
Okay, an ot.
What you're dealing with on theot levels is you're dealing
with other reactive minds okay,that are in your space.
I will leave it at that.
We've talked about this inother podcasts and it goes
beyond the scope of this podcast.

(58:00):
So you can be influenced.
You can be influenced by otherreactive minds in your space and
go why can't I, why can't I andthis goes directly back to what
the podcast is about is you canpostulate it and it happens.

(58:21):
Podcast is about is you canpostulate it and it happens and
happens again, which we'vementioned time and time again.
Quentin and I spent five or sixpodcasts on.
It doesn't necessarily resultin having this, I have this, or
I have that.
Have that, it is b.
So it prevents you from being,and when you are prevented from
being, your postulates arethwarted to a certain degree.

Scientologirl (58:44):
They're slow, yeah, because you pulled in all
these different valences as well.

Jonathan (58:47):
Right, right and a person who is out ethics is out
of valence.

Scientologirl (58:53):
Yeah.

Jonathan (58:53):
You're not in valence.
This is something LRH is veryclear about.
You are not in valence.
You are you, something LRH isvery clear about.
You are not in valence, you areyou.
If you are truly being, youain't got no problems.
And let me define that You'replaying the games you want to

(59:14):
play.
You're not being played by thephysical universe, and that is
the postulate.
Because what is a postulate andwe haven't talked about this
before you and I?
Every postulate is a game.

Scientologirl (59:29):
Yeah, absolutely.

Jonathan (59:32):
Every postulate is a game.
And if you said I want a platewith the best cheeses on the
planet and I'm going to have thebest cheeses on the planet, and
I'm going to have the bestcheeses on the planet, what do
they call that?
We call it a snack plate.

Scientologirl (59:48):
Oh yeah.

Jonathan (59:50):
Platter and a platter.
What happens to somebody thatcan get whatever it is that they
want?

Scientologirl (59:56):
They get bored.

Jonathan (59:56):
They get bored.
Why do they get bored?
Because there's no game.

Scientologirl (59:59):
That's right.
And who isn't postulating yeah,the thetan, get bored they get
bored.

Jonathan (01:00:00):
Yeah, why do they get bored?
Because there's no game.
That's right.
And who isn't postulating?

Scientologirl (01:00:03):
yeah, the thetan the thetan yeah isn't that
interesting.

Jonathan (01:00:08):
Yeah, so that's what it comes down to is.
And when you, you get an ideaand some and it always comes
down this it doesn't matterwhether it's in art or not
Creativity is creativity whenyou're postulating you're being
creative.
This is what a thetan does fora living.

(01:00:29):
This is what a thetan does fora living Whether it's brushing
your teeth twice a day or owninga yacht or creating the first
interplanetary transportationsystem.
It's a create.
And this is something LRAstruggled with for years with
the tech, because people wantedto take his tech and get
creative with it.

Scientologirl (01:00:50):
Right, yeah, and this is one of the reasons why
the church doesn't like us.

Jonathan (01:00:55):
Yeah, and we're not changing it.
We're just saying this is whathe said and so that's our game
is.
We're just keeping up withsomething this guy said and
keeping it the way that he saidto do it.
I mean, so there's creativityinvolved in every postulate and
that is where you go, that surgeyou get.

(01:01:16):
You talked to me about dopamineand all that stuff.
Well, and that's part of it aswell, because that's your reward
in the physical universe Tomove forward.
You're like, yeah, this makesme feel good.
The body goes I'm in agreementwith this surge.
And you're like let's keepgoing, this is fun, that's it.
It doesn't matter whetheryou're creating a work of art or

(01:01:37):
you're creating a business orwhatever, or brushing your teeth
.
You're creating a work of artor you're creating a business or
whatever, or brushing yourteeth, but to the degree that
you can't push through is to thedegree that you've got
something holding you back, andthat's what auditing and
learning the data courses andapplying it gets you through to
where you can make things happenalong your creative lines.

(01:01:58):
Every Phaeton has their owncreative line, whatever it is.

Scientologirl (01:02:04):
And even those at the bottom of the scales and
stuff like, for example, peoplewho feel like victims.
Even that is a form of survival.
That's the thing.
That's the thing that I thinkanybody who's listening, who has
that friend or that loved onewho is a victim, who you so

(01:02:26):
desperately want to help, youknow they have postulated their
own game.

Jonathan (01:02:32):
Right.

Scientologirl (01:02:33):
If they weren't happy with that game, they would
be playing a different game.

Jonathan (01:02:38):
Yeah, it's a level of creativity.
You're like that's the best yougot.

Scientologirl (01:02:43):
Okay, yeah, now nobody wants suffering, but I
think I mean, obviously, if wehave these fixed ideas, we have
basically decided that this iswhat makes life comfortable,

(01:03:04):
Because when you're a victim,well, that's a service facsimile
.

Jonathan (01:03:08):
Right, you're living off the dole and you're getting
a disability, making $1,800 amonth.

Scientologirl (01:03:16):
And you're like, hey, I got a free ride.

Jonathan (01:03:19):
It's tough, but I don't have to work, I'm living
la vida loca.

Scientologirl (01:03:23):
Yeah, while pleading poverty, but that's the
thing, Unfortunately, ethics isa personal thing and the Satan
always knows.
And Satan always keeps scoretoo.

Jonathan (01:03:34):
Right, right, and that's the thing.
The only person holding youback is you.
You keep your own score, nobodyelse.
And to the degree that you do,that is, you are your own judge
and jury.
You are your own lotterywinning congratulator one way or
the other.
And to the degree that you keepyour own personal ethics in,

(01:03:56):
relatively speaking to go backto yesterday's podcast is to the
degree that you will besuccessful in your creative
endeavors.
Creativity is I'm going to worka nine-to-five job.
Creativity is I'm going tocreate the first interplanetary
travel business for people ofEarth, whatever it is.
Or I'm going to create areligious philosophy that frees

(01:04:19):
man from the shackles of Earthand what it represents and
presents to them that.
Those are all different typesof creativity.
Guy that makes desks that'screative, yeah.
A housewife who cleans thehouse and cooks for her family
and raises the kids that'screative.
Some, somebody would argue well, that's not creative.

(01:04:41):
That is, yeah, that's that'screative?

Scientologirl (01:04:42):
Absolutely, Somebody would argue well,
that's not creative.

Jonathan (01:04:44):
That is yeah.
That's your personal ethics,not the housewife's If they're
happy.
Happiness is having your ethicsin.
Yeah, but if that's what youstrive for, that's what you
strive for.

Scientologirl (01:04:56):
That's where LRH comes from with his what is
greatness.
And also, I think it'simportant to to consider the
thing you said earlier on aboutwho's who's not postulating.
So, okay, you, you've gotten.
You've gotten everything thatyou, that you wanted, and you've
created a life that's.
That's that I think most peoplewould be proud of.

(01:05:19):
And all of that.
Then you find yourself unhappy.
Well, the reason why is becausehappiness is not about
acquiring, it's about the game.
If you're playing the game, ifyou have goals and you're
actively working towards themand you're getting them, well,

(01:05:41):
you've got to keep reinventing,you've got to keep putting it
there.
And the reason why is becauseyou're a creative being and
that's something that you've gotto do.
I don't know if folks heardthat, but one of our cats was….

Jonathan (01:05:55):
Having a disagreement with another cat's creation.

Scientologirl (01:05:58):
Yeah, so yeah, that's it.
You just put a create on yourlife.

Jonathan (01:06:06):
That's all.

Scientologirl (01:06:06):
That's right, and and and fully know, know that
you are the creator.

Jonathan (01:06:12):
Yeah, well, you are holding the paintbrush lr8 says,
the joy of creating, splurge onit.
You should always create, youshould do that thing that makes
you go yeah, but the thing is isdon't get too carried away with
yeah and go create, create,create, create.
Because LRA says and I've seenthis time and time again artists

(01:06:34):
that's all Phaetons have areally hard time stopping.
They want to go create, change,change, change, change, change
change.
You see the guy that's buildinga house for 30 years and he's
still working on it because hecouldn't stop building the house
.
We all suffer from that andthat ties up your attention.

Scientologirl (01:06:55):
Yeah, and this doesn't necessarily mean stop
creating.

Jonathan (01:06:58):
That's right.

Scientologirl (01:06:58):
It just means stop creating that one thing
Like you've got to know whenit's done that start change stop
and then start again withsomething else with something
else.

Jonathan (01:07:07):
Build another house, yeah.
Or paint another painting, orstart another business, or, or
you know, whatever it is,whatever floats your boat.
It floats your boat becausewherever you're at on the tone
scale to you is creativity.
That's it, yeah, that is it.
And then you have to look atokay, is it self-determined?

(01:07:28):
Other determined,pan-determined?
The creations that arepan-determined are the most
rewarding yeah you can own?
you can own a, a yacht.
Jeff Bezos can own a yacht andeverything.
Okay, now what?
Yeah, now what?
Okay, how does it feel to havea huge yacht with, with a bunch

(01:07:52):
of people working for you, youand your girlfriend on it?
Now, what are you going to do?
Okay, but what's next?
Type of a thing?
You?
You need to think bigger, andwhen you go from self-determined
to pan-determined, that's whereyou really start seeing even
bigger postulates happening,because there's this interchange
on the flows between otherbeings.

(01:08:13):
That's where the real power isand that's why LRH was was so
successful.
I mean, he's not.
Was never Jeff Bezos successful?
But money is not an index ofsuccess.
It is to the degree that youand other beings are surviving
very, very well and you're,you're giving the space for

(01:08:33):
other beings to do the samething that you're doing.
Otherwise, it's justself-determined and you're going
to hit a wall, a ceiling.

Scientologirl (01:08:41):
Absolutely.

Jonathan (01:08:44):
So how about this podcast, Intelagirl?

Scientologirl (01:08:47):
Yeah, I thought I really enjoyed it, really
enjoyed it.

Jonathan (01:08:51):
Well, we hope you guys listening enjoyed it too, and
I'll get on putting this wholething together and we will get
it out to you and we will seeyou tomorrow with Arthur for
another podcast and the dayafter that another podcast
namaste and we love you.

Scientologirl (01:09:08):
Bye, thank you, thank you.